Fake jobs in Europe? How about fake jobs in the US? All government jobs are by definition fake jobs, since the jobs are paid not from production, but private sector taxes. Don't get me wrong. I like America, but the fact is most jobs in America are government fake jobs. Worse yet, about half of the other half are receiving welfare in one form or another. It's so pathetic you have to laugh at it all to avoid apopleplectic seizure..
1
Okay, why do you think privately owned production is more real than government owned production? They are paid exactly the same way, how the money flows is just a technicality. Schools, firemen, legal system, police, building and maintaining infrastructure etc. are so important REAL jobs that they cannot be left to private sector. You wouldn't have your "real" job without these government jobs.
6
What specific agencies are fake jobs?? Are police and teachers fake jobs even though they provide a real service and pay real employees??
6
Wow! Really serious efforts to reduce unemployment? Obviously in Northern Europe the political classes do not have a component like our Democratic party, that is intent on growing (nothing done to stop US teen pregnancy epidemic) and mass immigrating-importing millions of functionally illiterate people so their "tolerant" party brand of redistribution to the desperate poor can purchase their votes with welfare crumbs.
2
The reasons for growing unemployment is rooted into globalization and export of industrial jobs. The existing unemployment was generated by the corporations that closed their plants in the West to send the technology and jobs to Asia, unfortunately without any government interference. So called "Free trade" agreements were made to increase the profitability of the same corporations allowing them to by low and sell in the West cheap Asian products while fewer Western products were exported.
The hi-tech industry in the West becomes short living as was the heavy and light industrial manufacturing that provided millions of jobs of all type of skills. Without changing the situation, unemployment and continuous drop in income will stay with us.
The hi-tech industry in the West becomes short living as was the heavy and light industrial manufacturing that provided millions of jobs of all type of skills. Without changing the situation, unemployment and continuous drop in income will stay with us.
4
Since the recession my work load as a freelancer has been cut in half, leaving me an abundance of time albeit, with a lack of income. To fill that time I started volunteering to teach ESL and discovered I loved it, far more than the cut throat high paying profession I had spent my life working at.
After four years of experience I feel qualified to get paid doing it. Unfortunately, living in NYC does not permit me to gain sufficient income as an ESL teacher to live here so I will be moving to Barcelona, where English speaking ESL teachers are in demand, even more so in Asian countries.
Volunteering is a great way to find a new career and feel productive, not a fake job.
After four years of experience I feel qualified to get paid doing it. Unfortunately, living in NYC does not permit me to gain sufficient income as an ESL teacher to live here so I will be moving to Barcelona, where English speaking ESL teachers are in demand, even more so in Asian countries.
Volunteering is a great way to find a new career and feel productive, not a fake job.
4
@bocheball: "After four years of experience I feel qualified to get paid doing it [teaching ESL]."
Why did you decide to volunteer teaching ESL instead of going to college in those four years?
Why did you decide to volunteer teaching ESL instead of going to college in those four years?
I think education and training are invaluable. But there is a huge presumption in the programs described in the article; that the training is valuable to potential employers. The US has a similar problem with certification programs and degrees which do not result in meaningful employment. The lack of interaction with potential employers in both systems is telling - which is a big problem with these programs, they TELL the trainees what they need to learn rather than ASK the employer when they need.
Perhaps these education and training specialists should look to employers for input into it is actually needed in the workforce and change the training to what is needed. It probably require more meaningful changes then adding pythons to your sales mix. It would require taking in some honest feedback about the adequacy of the training programs. Making these kind of changes can be challenging, perhaps that's why they call it work
Perhaps these education and training specialists should look to employers for input into it is actually needed in the workforce and change the training to what is needed. It probably require more meaningful changes then adding pythons to your sales mix. It would require taking in some honest feedback about the adequacy of the training programs. Making these kind of changes can be challenging, perhaps that's why they call it work
1
Talk about irony.
A long term unemployed person working in a fictional company and then finding a real occupation in a unemployment office.
A long term unemployed person working in a fictional company and then finding a real occupation in a unemployment office.
2
This is carrying European socialism to a new extreme! Having lived and worked in the South of France for many years, I came to understand the system a little better than many Americans. It has its good points, but it also has enormous failures.
Every European is connected to society through their job. In France, this is particularly so, because, without a job you are nothing, and you have nothing. So, the inability to have a job is devastating.
The real problem in France is that, as government continues to put more burdens on employers to provide benefits of all sorts, it becomes increasingly difficult for employers to remain vital. When you add a severe economic downturn on top of that, it becomes almost impossible for many employers. Hence the current situation.
Every European is connected to society through their job. In France, this is particularly so, because, without a job you are nothing, and you have nothing. So, the inability to have a job is devastating.
The real problem in France is that, as government continues to put more burdens on employers to provide benefits of all sorts, it becomes increasingly difficult for employers to remain vital. When you add a severe economic downturn on top of that, it becomes almost impossible for many employers. Hence the current situation.
1
I lived in Germany for eight years. Another socialist country. They are the envy of many nations, capitalist, socialist, or any other flavor. China is a socialist society yet they have many billionaires.
These titles that describe a form of government are nothing but names. France, Spain and Greece will all be fine. They have been around much longer than we have. Germany has beer companies older than our country.
These titles that describe a form of government are nothing but names. France, Spain and Greece will all be fine. They have been around much longer than we have. Germany has beer companies older than our country.
2
Otherwise I agree with you, but Germany is not a socialistic country.
It has relatively high tax burden and in US terms generous social safety nets, but that's not socialism. German companies and means of production are not owned by the state, they are either privately owned or exchange listed as the companies in the US are.
It has relatively high tax burden and in US terms generous social safety nets, but that's not socialism. German companies and means of production are not owned by the state, they are either privately owned or exchange listed as the companies in the US are.
4
Get rid of Austerity which never ever has worked is another thing they can do.
2
Forty years ago almost all companies did some sort of on the job training, the US had the best workforce in the world.
Then the rich decided that they would do no training of any sort and complain that they could not find trained workers and would rather move to third world countries and dodge taxes or exploit the visa system and still dodge taxes.
The cost of training has been completely put on the shoulders of the workers and no one is being trained for special industries.
Today someone in America invents 'Widget Z', something that has never existed before today but in less than a week the inventor will advertise for someone who not only has a college degree in making 'Widget Z', they will also require 10 years of experience making 'Widget Z'!
When he doesn't find these magical time traveling workers, he will say Americans are just stupid and lazy and actually want to be PAID! Imagine that! When they should be begging to do the job for free because 'job creators' and stuff.
At least France is training the workers who will be exploited by their rich instead of just blaming them for not knowing which jobs they would need to be trained for 40 years in the future. *smh*
Then the rich decided that they would do no training of any sort and complain that they could not find trained workers and would rather move to third world countries and dodge taxes or exploit the visa system and still dodge taxes.
The cost of training has been completely put on the shoulders of the workers and no one is being trained for special industries.
Today someone in America invents 'Widget Z', something that has never existed before today but in less than a week the inventor will advertise for someone who not only has a college degree in making 'Widget Z', they will also require 10 years of experience making 'Widget Z'!
When he doesn't find these magical time traveling workers, he will say Americans are just stupid and lazy and actually want to be PAID! Imagine that! When they should be begging to do the job for free because 'job creators' and stuff.
At least France is training the workers who will be exploited by their rich instead of just blaming them for not knowing which jobs they would need to be trained for 40 years in the future. *smh*
8
In the U.S. we pop them full of welfare benefits and call it success.
2
The Euro will survive and European states need to make a change in the tax burden can help job creation in European states because the main culprit is the vicious cycle that continues to repeat until the economic growth is frozen and high unemployment we need more europe
1
There is one problem with ersatz businesses. While everything can be simulated in ways to produce behavioral and emotional learning, what cannot be simulated is a "paying customer."
Getting one of those requires the real skill. Ask any red blooded American business owner. Every other skill is superfluous if this skill related to humility, dealing with rejection, coming back with a better widget, is not developed.
This should make every American investor salivate. Why bother with the Middle East and Asia, we should colonize and own these chumps.
Why will this be easy?
A. Because France's thinking is tethered to their colonial, imperial model. I.e., own natives, own their resources, dump your manufactured goods on them, never learn how to compete, produce a welfare state of entitlements, get cheap labor from former colonies and concentrate them in ghettos to feed the Ponzi scheme, and disenfranchise any attempt by former denizens of colonies to integrate (merely point to the fact that NOW they don't want to assimilate). They think they can simulate a business!
B. Because the population is weak; the brightest graduates from French universities want to work for the government (the one organization that does not need to sell anything, or compete, and is endowed the power to get its way in everything). They don't want the inconvenience of finding real customers!
I hear they make good wine and cheese, let's get there and take over.
Kalidan
Getting one of those requires the real skill. Ask any red blooded American business owner. Every other skill is superfluous if this skill related to humility, dealing with rejection, coming back with a better widget, is not developed.
This should make every American investor salivate. Why bother with the Middle East and Asia, we should colonize and own these chumps.
Why will this be easy?
A. Because France's thinking is tethered to their colonial, imperial model. I.e., own natives, own their resources, dump your manufactured goods on them, never learn how to compete, produce a welfare state of entitlements, get cheap labor from former colonies and concentrate them in ghettos to feed the Ponzi scheme, and disenfranchise any attempt by former denizens of colonies to integrate (merely point to the fact that NOW they don't want to assimilate). They think they can simulate a business!
B. Because the population is weak; the brightest graduates from French universities want to work for the government (the one organization that does not need to sell anything, or compete, and is endowed the power to get its way in everything). They don't want the inconvenience of finding real customers!
I hear they make good wine and cheese, let's get there and take over.
Kalidan
1
@Kalidan: "I hear they make good wine and cheese, let's get there and take over."
They also make good weapons systems[1], and "we" have already taken over with Disneyland[2] and McDonald's[3].
[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Defence_companies_of_France
[2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Disneyland_Paris
[3] https://www.mcdonalds.fr/
They also make good weapons systems[1], and "we" have already taken over with Disneyland[2] and McDonald's[3].
[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Defence_companies_of_France
[2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Disneyland_Paris
[3] https://www.mcdonalds.fr/
1
@Kalidan: 'While everything can be simulated in ways to produce behavioral and emotional learning, what cannot be simulated is a "paying customer."'
The article is vague on numerous points, and one is whether these practice firms train executives.
The article is vague on numerous points, and one is whether these practice firms train executives.
Is this a Saturday Night Live skit?
4
The article doesn't do a very good job of explaining how these practice businesses are actually administered, but they certainly have a serious intent. If you can read French, there is more info at the Euro Ent’Ent web site:
https://www.euroentent.net/
https://www.euroentent.net/
3
The common element worldwide is that we have economies where you have the odd combination of massive waste of time and money on the part of wealthy combined with the starvation conditions for the unemployed.
There's something wrong with this ridiculous economic system.
There's something wrong with this ridiculous economic system.
5
.
If someone sticks you with a knife, you pull out the knife and apply a bandage.
If someone sticks your economy with Euro insanity, you pull out of the Euro and stop the bleeding.
Require elaboration?
.
If someone sticks you with a knife, you pull out the knife and apply a bandage.
If someone sticks your economy with Euro insanity, you pull out of the Euro and stop the bleeding.
Require elaboration?
.
5
Except for Britain and Denmark the euro is compulsory. France and others can't just "pull out" of the euro. So yes, your comment does require elaboration.
2
@AJD: "... you pull out of the Euro and stop the bleeding."
I don't understand your point, but would you recommend that the state of New York "pull out" of the dollar?
I don't understand your point, but would you recommend that the state of New York "pull out" of the dollar?
1
Imagine you had been working diligently at a company for 5-10 years, working you way up the managment ladder and then, suddenly, you discover the whole thing hade been totally fake! (The Matrix was right--we asre all living in a dream.)
6
The main culprit behind the chronic unemployment in France is the welfare state:
http://www.devilsdictionaries.com/blog/french-economic-troubles-in-one-c...
High government expenditure requires high tax rates, which makes labour force expensive; thus lower demand for the expensive labour. This, in turn, requires more government expenditure and higher taxes. The vicious circle keeps repeating until the economic growth is frozen and high unemployment becomes the normal state of affairs. That's Europe now and the US in a couple of years.
http://www.devilsdictionaries.com/blog/french-economic-troubles-in-one-c...
High government expenditure requires high tax rates, which makes labour force expensive; thus lower demand for the expensive labour. This, in turn, requires more government expenditure and higher taxes. The vicious circle keeps repeating until the economic growth is frozen and high unemployment becomes the normal state of affairs. That's Europe now and the US in a couple of years.
6
Talk to Kansas if you hate taxes. They cut them to the bone, and now the state is broke.
7
Capitalism, as it is currently practiced, cannot provide employment to all the people on the planet who want/need employment. Frankly, current capitalistic practices depend on the maintenance of a huge under-class that keeps wages down and the middle-income frightened.
Do we have to go to the opposite extreme? No, we need to look at the work that needs to be done all over the planet. Not all of it is glamorous, nor will it make you wealthy beyond your dreams but it needs to be done and it should be honorable to do it and be paid a reasonable wage and have some dignity.
While the majority of human history has had an ultra-wealthy minority ruling over the rest of humanity and holding concentrated wealth and power it does not have to be that way forever. What we lack is the humanity to change the system so that the sociopathic concentrations of wealth and power are no longer the norm and that all humans are treated with dignity and respect.
Do we have to go to the opposite extreme? No, we need to look at the work that needs to be done all over the planet. Not all of it is glamorous, nor will it make you wealthy beyond your dreams but it needs to be done and it should be honorable to do it and be paid a reasonable wage and have some dignity.
While the majority of human history has had an ultra-wealthy minority ruling over the rest of humanity and holding concentrated wealth and power it does not have to be that way forever. What we lack is the humanity to change the system so that the sociopathic concentrations of wealth and power are no longer the norm and that all humans are treated with dignity and respect.
20
We did have that: it was called post-WWII America.
2
Fifty years from now, fake jobs will be the norm as societies world-wide struggle with how to deal with the rampant unemployment caused by robotic algorithms running the everyday world, right down to the news we read and the food we consume, much of which will also be fake, like the protein shakes the Silicon Valley programmers eat while typing away at their laptops.
I predict governments will use digital economic-chit programs for their citizens, assigned at birth, with varying levels of income depending on where the person was born, how many in his or her family, and who they know in their society. Just like now, actually, but even more cut-and-dried. Guaranteed incomes will be the norm, but these will be subsistence incomes for all except those who know those in power, or pull the levers of power themselves. If you both know something and know someone important, you might have a chance at upward mobility in these future societies, but only if you produce something of value to those in power.
7
It seems to me all this amazing manpower could be put to use in charitable causes--helping poor, homeless, etc. Maybe helping with the refugee crisis and immigration detention centers? Then they would get real experience that is actually helpful for social problems.
15
They are part of the social problems. What is needed is job creation. Social problems are important, but how can they be funded when countries are on the verge of collapse? When people cannot find work?
3
When John Lindsay was Mayor of New York City in 1968, he questioned why 30,000 social workers/case workers/supervisors/etc. were needed to send out welfare checks. He got rid of the welfare department and just sent out the checks. Was he a genius or not?
There is already a lot of fake work going on where people are paid real money. Don't make it worse by inventing fake work and paying fake workers in fake money. Just send out the real checks.
There is already a lot of fake work going on where people are paid real money. Don't make it worse by inventing fake work and paying fake workers in fake money. Just send out the real checks.
7
Many posters here say 'why not address this social issue or that'. Skigurl for example suggests revamping K-12 education, solving the water crises, and universal healthcare.
Those problems involve lack of resources--they are not continuing problems due to people setting up training companies.
When I created and ran companies, I would have been delighted to have these 'phantom companies' around to better prepare people for work.
Those problems involve lack of resources--they are not continuing problems due to people setting up training companies.
When I created and ran companies, I would have been delighted to have these 'phantom companies' around to better prepare people for work.
1
Interesting, but futile; Why not a Junior Achievement style program to fund the start up production and marketing of real products?
Oh, but especially in this country, no one wants to make anything or pay workers a living wage.
I visited my bank this afternoon (Friday and End of the Month), two tellers with a line out the door. "Oh, we are hiring right now."
Good customer service would have a couple of extra "bank officers" working five days a week, even if Monday thru Thursday they took two hour lunches and called it thirty minutes, and spend afternoons playing solitaire on their computers, so you would have bodies to do the work on Friday.
But no one wants to pay workers so you have a surge capacity.
Oh, but especially in this country, no one wants to make anything or pay workers a living wage.
I visited my bank this afternoon (Friday and End of the Month), two tellers with a line out the door. "Oh, we are hiring right now."
Good customer service would have a couple of extra "bank officers" working five days a week, even if Monday thru Thursday they took two hour lunches and called it thirty minutes, and spend afternoons playing solitaire on their computers, so you would have bodies to do the work on Friday.
But no one wants to pay workers so you have a surge capacity.
12
Wasting 4 days a week and working on Friday sounds like torture. Dante might have written about professional solitaire players.
2
Why does anyone go into a bank today? You want banks to give employment to people for jobs that shouldn't even exist.
2
I love the idea of training/practice firms. I would not call them "fake." However, I'm disappointed that the article didn't highlight any that transformed themselves into real, productive enterprises. Perhaps existing employers would balk at subsidized competition? I'd like that too, as turnarounds fair play - what with offshoring and H1-B's.
8
The people at The Onion are furious about getting scooped by the NY Times.
20
This is just depressing.. "training" or not, it's no longer realistic to expect everyone to have jobs like this.
Give people an Unconditional Basic Income, and allow them to find their own ways to be productive, rather than giving them "fake"/training traditional jobs, where they wont produce anything real.. And they probably wont be able to get a real job doing the same things.. They're not contributing to society, with jobs like this.
Automation and technological unemployment are the real issue that we need to address.. Fake jobs are not the answer, neither is training people for jobs that are going away. We should be FREEING people, now that automation is taking over, not sticking them into a new unproductive slavery, under the guise of "traditional" jobs.
Give people an Unconditional Basic Income, and allow them to find their own ways to be productive, rather than giving them "fake"/training traditional jobs, where they wont produce anything real.. And they probably wont be able to get a real job doing the same things.. They're not contributing to society, with jobs like this.
Automation and technological unemployment are the real issue that we need to address.. Fake jobs are not the answer, neither is training people for jobs that are going away. We should be FREEING people, now that automation is taking over, not sticking them into a new unproductive slavery, under the guise of "traditional" jobs.
21
I agree. We are going to have to radically change how we work, and make our livings in the coming decades, as robotics take our jobs... But most people are no more ready to wrap their minds around things like a guaranteed minimum, than they are to sprout wings and fly.
3
Better yet, let them all sign on with the thousands of U.S. Sociology departments as associate TA's. Three days a week each one could line up before a bored class of malcontents whose only goal is an easy A in one more gut course and deliver a line or two of post-modern blather.
1
What a strange concept--expending valuable human labor on fake work tasks.
How about creating jobs to solve real-life problems, such as the ones we have now, instead?
1. Create cost-effective desalination and water-recycling solutions to solve the drought problems in the western U.S.
2. Create cost-effective solar power for homes, cars, and everything else that uses electricity or gas so we don't have to frack this country into the ground and continue polluting the environment.
3. Improve Medicare so that we can use it as a long-term, affordable, high-quality health-care system for all Americans.
4. Create a new division in the Department of Health and Human Services devoted to developing crucial but ignored drugs (for example, antibiotics and non-addicting pain medications).
5. Figure out a way to ensure that all Americans have basics at all times--food, clothing, and shelter.
6. Revamp the public education system so that all children get a free, high-quality education.
7. Figure out a way to reduce the costs of a college education so that all kids who want one can get one.
8. Find a way to reduce the cost of medical school so we don't run out of primary-care physicians.
I'm sure we can come up with dozens of other real problems that people can solve for real money.
How about creating jobs to solve real-life problems, such as the ones we have now, instead?
1. Create cost-effective desalination and water-recycling solutions to solve the drought problems in the western U.S.
2. Create cost-effective solar power for homes, cars, and everything else that uses electricity or gas so we don't have to frack this country into the ground and continue polluting the environment.
3. Improve Medicare so that we can use it as a long-term, affordable, high-quality health-care system for all Americans.
4. Create a new division in the Department of Health and Human Services devoted to developing crucial but ignored drugs (for example, antibiotics and non-addicting pain medications).
5. Figure out a way to ensure that all Americans have basics at all times--food, clothing, and shelter.
6. Revamp the public education system so that all children get a free, high-quality education.
7. Figure out a way to reduce the costs of a college education so that all kids who want one can get one.
8. Find a way to reduce the cost of medical school so we don't run out of primary-care physicians.
I'm sure we can come up with dozens of other real problems that people can solve for real money.
26
These are all good ideas. To your question of why not create jobs to solve real-life problems? Real jobs require wages, health care, benefits, and withholding taxes. These fake jobs don't.
There is plenty of work to be done. There's just nobody that's willing to pay for the work to be done.
There is plenty of work to be done. There's just nobody that's willing to pay for the work to be done.
8
The story is set in France. I'm not sure how the folks there would be able to deal with the issues you raised.
Taxes.
3
We must give higher priority to the creation of real jobs for real people who live in the USA.
5
Europe is already the world capital of day-dream-believers and wishful thinking. The sorry results of that thinking are an important warning light in the distance telling the U.S. what not to do.
6
@A. Stanton: "Europe is already the world capital of day-dream-believers and wishful thinking."
There are a lot of countries in Europe, so you will need to be more specific. And it would have been absurd to call Margaret Thatcher a "day-dream-believer[] and wishful think[er]".
There are a lot of countries in Europe, so you will need to be more specific. And it would have been absurd to call Margaret Thatcher a "day-dream-believer[] and wishful think[er]".
3
Really? Is the U.S. doing that well. I guess you didn't get the notice about our 1st quarter GDP numbers.
This has been in vogue since 2001, in India. Many IT training institutes give valid Job Experience certificates to people, who can pay them. Such candidates dot the Indian IT companies in hoards. During the 2008 recession, though companies tried to clean up such people by laying them off. But, I don't think the industry was successfully able to clean up the mess. Post 2008 recession, with most of organizations resorting to Contract hiring, this has grown to monstrous proportion, with contract firms selling experience to needed candidates to fill up their gap in employment.
5
To call training jobs "fake jobs" makes for good copy, but misrepresents the effort of Frances socialistic government.
Besides not all of Europe is the same.
The long term unemployment rate in France is 4.6% or about 45% of the total unemployment rate of 10.6%.
But Outre-Rhin, als the French say, on the other side of the Rhine, the total unemployment rate is 4.60%, (and less than that of the US).
But as we all know, Germany's economy, run by a austerity obsessed government, (it spends less than it takes in !) - can not work.
Besides not all of Europe is the same.
The long term unemployment rate in France is 4.6% or about 45% of the total unemployment rate of 10.6%.
But Outre-Rhin, als the French say, on the other side of the Rhine, the total unemployment rate is 4.60%, (and less than that of the US).
But as we all know, Germany's economy, run by a austerity obsessed government, (it spends less than it takes in !) - can not work.
3
That's one way to describe Germany.
Another is a high-tax socialist country where the government is not afraid to tax to balance its budget.
At the same time, that government provides universal health care and universal education - college for those qualified and trade schools for the rest.
You will not find people in Germany working two part-time minimum wage jobs below the poverty line and with no health care.
Another is a high-tax socialist country where the government is not afraid to tax to balance its budget.
At the same time, that government provides universal health care and universal education - college for those qualified and trade schools for the rest.
You will not find people in Germany working two part-time minimum wage jobs below the poverty line and with no health care.
27
But, DGA, Germany has--- prepare yourself, this is shocking-- high participation in powerful labor unions. Surely this is not compatible with a functioning business community...is it?
4
The difference between the U.S. and Europe is that in Europe unions and businesses work together to produce solutions. In the U.S., businesses (especially the large ones) make unilateral decisions and then shove them down everyone's throats (including by lobbying the government).
This is a deeply dysfunctional way to run a country. And, it shows in the numerous social and economic problems we have compared to other countries.
While the Germans are more conservative than the other major Euro economies, they are still more progressive than Democrats in the U.S. The U.S. is far right on the political spectrum from around the world and it has not worked that well. The U.S. does not have spending problem; it has a revenue collection problem.
This is a deeply dysfunctional way to run a country. And, it shows in the numerous social and economic problems we have compared to other countries.
While the Germans are more conservative than the other major Euro economies, they are still more progressive than Democrats in the U.S. The U.S. is far right on the political spectrum from around the world and it has not worked that well. The U.S. does not have spending problem; it has a revenue collection problem.
1
I thought that this article was rather heartwarming. People WANT to work. They want to do a good job. These training programs sound like just the thing that we should be "importing" to the States, to help long-term unemployed individuals stay motivated.
22
If I were doing real work, giving real time and thought, to solve problems or create projects with absolutely no real value or use, it would not motivate me to do much but bang my head on a wall. It's the height of insult, in my view, in a time in which public needs and goods could be served by a program like the old WPA, which left a legacy of very real goods, from dams to roads to stunning works of art and literature--and so much in between. Grown people don't need to waste their talents or time in pretend work, for God's sake. Even while training, and certainly in latter stages of training, people could and should be engaged in real and useful activities.
6
On the Appalachian Trail here in the Great Smoky Mountains NP, the work of the CCC is still providing practical and aesthetic benefits to the community. This training program sounds like something cooked up by well-intentioned "fake" government employees (not teachers, fireman, etc...) at the labor department (Isn't that the one Perry wanted to eliminate?)
Permanent workers in France, Spain, Italy, Greece and other European countries enjoy very generous benefits and rights. Those benefits and rights are so costly to employers, that those employers create as few permanent positions as possible, and rely on temps to remain solvent. (There is much, much less income inequality in Europe, so it is not a case of fat cat owners hoarding all the cash; rather it is simple survival - commit to too many employees with 8-10 weeks of paid vacation, that you cannot ever let go, and you are bust). For this reason, structural long term unemployment rates across most of Europe are 2x to 4x or higher than US unemployment rates. The exception is Germany, but Germany's low unemployment is driven by the Euro's low price relative to Germany's former currency; that price advantage is what allows Germany to be an export powerhouse. Without that price advantage, all the worker training, management-labor cooperation etc. that characterize German industry would not save the country from similarly high unemployment rates.
If Europe wants to produce more real, and fewer pretend, jobs, they need to level the playing field between employee rights and employer rights (to make enough profit to make staying in business sensible). There is no shortcut or third way. European business and government leaders know this, but are simply too dependent on support from the lucky permanent workers.
If Europe wants to produce more real, and fewer pretend, jobs, they need to level the playing field between employee rights and employer rights (to make enough profit to make staying in business sensible). There is no shortcut or third way. European business and government leaders know this, but are simply too dependent on support from the lucky permanent workers.
26
Meanwhile in the US, where workers have no power and employers have it all, we are making low wage positions with no benefits, that one can be laid off from at a moments notice as well... not so different from Europe (but they get gov't Healthcare). So its only the ownership classes who are better off here.
9
Germany competes on quality, not on price .
Have a look at the price of German machine tools against Chinese .
The Germans learned to make stuff the world wants even if more expensive.
One look at the price of an S 550 that sells well in the US shows that your claim that this is all, in the end, merely a currency effect is not held up by fact.
Have a look at the price of German machine tools against Chinese .
The Germans learned to make stuff the world wants even if more expensive.
One look at the price of an S 550 that sells well in the US shows that your claim that this is all, in the end, merely a currency effect is not held up by fact.
3
Classic logic failure.
If A is true then B being the opposite is false. And, vice versa. Mathematically not true despite the fact that most people believe it to be the case.
Just because the Europeans have things such that they have gone too far down one direction does NOT mean that the U.S. is Eden. In fact, the U.S. goes too far in the OTHER direction and it is just as dysfunctional. It is just dysfunctional in a different way.
If A is true then B being the opposite is false. And, vice versa. Mathematically not true despite the fact that most people believe it to be the case.
Just because the Europeans have things such that they have gone too far down one direction does NOT mean that the U.S. is Eden. In fact, the U.S. goes too far in the OTHER direction and it is just as dysfunctional. It is just dysfunctional in a different way.
3
Fakery is not reality and if we are going to need more jobs for our citizens it is up to the economy to quit sending jobs abroad or turning them over to robots. There are immense educational and infrastructure needs that have been allowed to go unmet and it is a responsibility of the government and its leaders to get busy on putting citizens to work on meeting these vital needs. Fake businesses with fake wages are a delusion and will never be a substitute for a real economy that is geared to all citizens needs rather than to only the 1% who profit from robots and exploiting cheap foreign labor. Apparently we will all have to eat fake meals and wear fake clothes before our leaders wake up to the need to provide for all our people not just those who happen to have grabbed a billionaire ring as they went around on the economic merry-go-round.
11
The point of the article is that these people are learning real-life skills, the skills that employers say people don't have and that is why they hire form other countries. This type of work apprenticeship puts the lie to that message. People have skills, they want to work, and what they need is an opportunity to prove their worth. That is what we are not offering in the USA--it is cheaper to offshore and the rich just want to get richer.
It is up to the people to start making demands of businesses and not trying to force the government to create something which it is not capable of doing, other than things like the WPA or CCC. We could do those things too, but we need more than those temporary situations.
It is up to the people to start making demands of businesses and not trying to force the government to create something which it is not capable of doing, other than things like the WPA or CCC. We could do those things too, but we need more than those temporary situations.
6
What good are the "real life skill" if the job itself is going to be exported? What is the good of training European workers and then turning around and hiring cheaper migrant labor?
11
There are so many things that need to be done in America and more than enough unemployed people that we could get these things done using their skills. We need to improve public spaces, clean up roadsides, rehabilitate old buildings, put up new ones, replace people who can afford to retire, upgrade our roads, bridges, railways, airports, you name it. Companies have money to waste on blocking regulations but no money to spend on hiring people to help them comply with regulations. They can afford to pay CEOs hundreds of millions of dollars but not hire a person to help a lower level employee have a reasonable work week? Something's wrong with this picture.
While we're at it we do have 535 people who seem to do very little for more money than most of us will ever see. At least 51% of them spend their time in a non-stop tantrum saying, "No, we don't want to do this". Why not take their pay and their jobs and give them to people who really want to work, want to improve the country. Let that 51% live on nothing for awhile and see how much fun it is to get no responses to resumes, watch a nest egg dwindle, see a home repossessed. It's easy, all you have to do is lose your job and not find another.
While we're at it we do have 535 people who seem to do very little for more money than most of us will ever see. At least 51% of them spend their time in a non-stop tantrum saying, "No, we don't want to do this". Why not take their pay and their jobs and give them to people who really want to work, want to improve the country. Let that 51% live on nothing for awhile and see how much fun it is to get no responses to resumes, watch a nest egg dwindle, see a home repossessed. It's easy, all you have to do is lose your job and not find another.
40
Because they represent me, and they are supposed to protect me from people "who want to do that" without thinking? Yeah, that's why!
I think "fake" is the wrong word. It implies that the intention is to mislead others about the true activity, as in "fraud". "Simulated" would be a better word for what's being described here.
64
Only a politician, a columnist, or an economist would believe that a low demand for labor caused by an oversupply can be fixed by...wait for it...even more labor.
9
@NM: "Only a politician, a columnist, or an economist ..."
Please name an economist who would make such a recommendation.
Please name an economist who would make such a recommendation.
1
European "job training" and ersatz companies such as these have the main purpose of helping the government fake its unemployment statistics because those in these programs for one reason or another, do not show up as unemployed.
Another instance of lying with statistics.
Another instance of lying with statistics.
2
Actually, that's not true.
The OECD measures unemployment by counting everyone that CAN work within a specific working age range and compares that to the ones who actually are employed. These training jobs are gov't programs and do not count.
The U.S. employment rate that everyone hears is DIFFERENT. It only counts those who are LOOKING for work. But the U.S. DOES have a method of calculating unemployment closer to the one used by the OECD: the U-6 rate. It includes all of the people who have given up looking (but are not disabled) or are under-employed. That rate is above 9% in the U.S. (not that far from the 11% in Europe).
The OECD measures unemployment by counting everyone that CAN work within a specific working age range and compares that to the ones who actually are employed. These training jobs are gov't programs and do not count.
The U.S. employment rate that everyone hears is DIFFERENT. It only counts those who are LOOKING for work. But the U.S. DOES have a method of calculating unemployment closer to the one used by the OECD: the U-6 rate. It includes all of the people who have given up looking (but are not disabled) or are under-employed. That rate is above 9% in the U.S. (not that far from the 11% in Europe).
I thought I had heard everything, but now I know that I really have heard everything. Fake jobs for fake companies. Only in socialist Europe.
4
Paul: Placingg the blame on "socialist Europe" for a situation created by capitalism in a capitalist society is a truly amazing claim. Please explain how the "socialist" element is responsible for any of this.
5
Remember where the Great Recession and the Financial Crisis that triggered it started: the U.S.
People who live in glass houses should not throw rocks.
People who live in glass houses should not throw rocks.
1
I suppose that, if Louis XVI had kept his subjects busy with make-believe jobs and pastries, he would have kept his head. Much better to have the unemployed in permanent training programs, than out on the street, reading about revolution and eyeing the pitchforks...
15
I did note with surprise the strike training taking place in the simulated firms. No way that would ever fly here in America!
4
Better to have them make real pastries, for God's sake. Then they could work and people could eat. A permanent training program sounds like its own weird hell, where you learn the same thing over and over, and never graduate. Or do anything worth a hoot. It makes a pitchfork look downright useful.
2
The writer says that Europe is enduring a "long economic crisis". Meanwhile, stock market indexes like the DAX are at or near all time highs. So the economy looks to be in pretty good shape, if turning a profit is the main indication of health. It just isn't creating many jobs in the process.
13
This whole trend of 'short term contracts' may be recent - post-GFC - in Europe. But it is absolutely an embedded part of the US corporate business model.
This whole "get rich and make a million a year on Wall Street' idea is largely an invention of TV. YES, the top 1% or 2% of financial service employees, perhaps no more than a 2-3 thousand at the largest global banks - make a killing. But the largest banks have also by far the largest proportion of perma-temps. These are not just cafeteria servers and janitors, the latter of which are actually unionized and well paid. In IT, product control, risk management, research (yes Dorthy, even research), the majority of head count are actually hourly paid consultants. No benefits. No paid time off - even holidays. Certainly no pension. (Whatever you pay into a retirement account comes 100% directly out of your salary.) For an average perma-temp in risk management or IT, employment could end, and often does, with 1 hour's notice.
Job creation in corporate America, at least in financial services, has been primarily new perma-tem roles. And for grads with the much valued degree in computer science? There is a nice perma-temp spot waiting for $22 to $35 an hour. That may seem like a LOT for workers at Taco Bell in Arizona. But in NYC, subtracting for student loan, rent, health care, and possibly supporting aging parents, $30 ph = living paycheck to paycheck.
And the last paycheck could be tomorrow.
This whole "get rich and make a million a year on Wall Street' idea is largely an invention of TV. YES, the top 1% or 2% of financial service employees, perhaps no more than a 2-3 thousand at the largest global banks - make a killing. But the largest banks have also by far the largest proportion of perma-temps. These are not just cafeteria servers and janitors, the latter of which are actually unionized and well paid. In IT, product control, risk management, research (yes Dorthy, even research), the majority of head count are actually hourly paid consultants. No benefits. No paid time off - even holidays. Certainly no pension. (Whatever you pay into a retirement account comes 100% directly out of your salary.) For an average perma-temp in risk management or IT, employment could end, and often does, with 1 hour's notice.
Job creation in corporate America, at least in financial services, has been primarily new perma-tem roles. And for grads with the much valued degree in computer science? There is a nice perma-temp spot waiting for $22 to $35 an hour. That may seem like a LOT for workers at Taco Bell in Arizona. But in NYC, subtracting for student loan, rent, health care, and possibly supporting aging parents, $30 ph = living paycheck to paycheck.
And the last paycheck could be tomorrow.
22
This sadly is the new reality. Ask me how I know?
5
Anita,
Because you're living it or someone you know is living it. Too many are living it while others think that it's our fault. They are the ones who have not yet lived through the heartbreak and agitation that goes with losing or being unable to find a job. Any day can be the last day you work at a company and the last time you'll ever work again. Furthermore, after the second or third unwarranted downsizing and extended bout of unemployment, you begin to doubt your worth, your value, your life. For me, this last bout of unemployment broke something inside. Even though I did find a job I feel marginalized, worthless, and doubt every decision I make. I don't feel like I'm part of my country and I know my country doesn't care, nor do my former friends or coworkers. Once you aren't making money in America, you are nobody and nothing. Even the government doesn't want to help and if family can't help that's where the government should be stepping in. Families can't do everything. That's why we pay taxes. Unfortunately our tax dollars are being wasted on a Congress that says NO to spite us for voting Obama into office.
Because you're living it or someone you know is living it. Too many are living it while others think that it's our fault. They are the ones who have not yet lived through the heartbreak and agitation that goes with losing or being unable to find a job. Any day can be the last day you work at a company and the last time you'll ever work again. Furthermore, after the second or third unwarranted downsizing and extended bout of unemployment, you begin to doubt your worth, your value, your life. For me, this last bout of unemployment broke something inside. Even though I did find a job I feel marginalized, worthless, and doubt every decision I make. I don't feel like I'm part of my country and I know my country doesn't care, nor do my former friends or coworkers. Once you aren't making money in America, you are nobody and nothing. Even the government doesn't want to help and if family can't help that's where the government should be stepping in. Families can't do everything. That's why we pay taxes. Unfortunately our tax dollars are being wasted on a Congress that says NO to spite us for voting Obama into office.
10
Are you sure your numbers are correct? Most of the contract programmers and Unix sysadmins I know have a billing rate of $60-100 an hour. That is for the 8-hour professional day, of course, so no overtime is paid unless more than 10 hours are worked.
I would agree that the title is confusing. I would also posit that it is possible to elaborate on a solution - one that might potentially involve a highly efficient, globally accessible mechanism (LinkedIn) whereby one might be able to become "visible" and "relevant" to the global economy (read - employers) - and provide an opportunity for both employers (companies) and skilled workers (candidates) to fully realize the opportunity for a truly global collaborative workforce. It's already being done, it's only a matter of educating both companies and the population at large to imprint the true implications of this kind of free system.
In North America we have organizations where people don't do real work and don't pay bills. Sometimes bills are paid with imaginary cheques. The 2009 financial crisis was all about these kind of companies. It took a lot of taxpayer money to clean-up after them. Europe is simply conducting business schools that actually resemble a business. It's something to think about.
8
The Europeans should take lessons from the Chinese. They could learn how to take their fake companies public, and rake in billions of dollars from naive investors.
Then they wouldn't need to work....
Then they wouldn't need to work....
3
In the U.S., using a fake company on a resume would be grounds for dismissal, even in states that are not "at will" employment. Wouldn't it be better if employers realized that finding a job in a difficult economy is simply difficult - and not penalize the potential employee on that basis? Having been a hiring manager, I do understand an employer's perspective -- why is this person having so much trouble finding a job? However, I would hope that a hiring manager would also recognize market forces that make finding a good job difficult; in some cases finding any job.
8
Not sure that a fake company looks bad on the resume. It worked great for many at AIG, Enron, and the like --companies that certainly relied on make-believe for solvency, and in the largesse of the government to flourish (along with chicanery and fraud, of course).
7
Companies do not care. Once you lose a job, no matter what the reason is you are considered an incompetent fool unless you are on the executive level and have a golden parachute to help out. From an employee's perspective being fired after doing a good job and getting good evaluations is demoralizing. Being told by various people that you have to amp up your resume, sell yourself like you are a product that is always good, always running, always happy, is discouraging. We can't say that we know how to learn, know how to work and do a good job. We have to exaggerate. We have to be cookie cutter personalities, not ourselves at all.
Here's the reality in America and probably in Europe: employers do not want to pay people good money. They don't want them to have the security of a good job even though everything else in life depends on that. It's easier to fire an experienced employee to save money and hire a young one. Wash and repeat 10 years later. So, when you see a discouraged interviewee, it's because they've been through the wringer a few times more than necessary. They know the lies. They understand that no matter how hard the work or how well they do the work it doesn't matter. If an employer can save money by firing them they will. And that's how you make a bad employee.
Here's the reality in America and probably in Europe: employers do not want to pay people good money. They don't want them to have the security of a good job even though everything else in life depends on that. It's easier to fire an experienced employee to save money and hire a young one. Wash and repeat 10 years later. So, when you see a discouraged interviewee, it's because they've been through the wringer a few times more than necessary. They know the lies. They understand that no matter how hard the work or how well they do the work it doesn't matter. If an employer can save money by firing them they will. And that's how you make a bad employee.
34
It seems to me that one would put the "fake company" on one's resume under the heading of training or additional education or some such. Then it is up to the employer to decide what weight to give it. But surely it would be seen as better than a period of unemployment.
9
The title of this article sounds sarcastic, and I totally expected it to be a report on some elaborate Ponzi scheme or something to that effect. What I never got to know is - are these operations actually legal? If they are, and if they are legit training operations, why "fake" strewn all across the item? If they are not, why not say so in plain English?
17
"... are these operations actually legal?"
Good question. The article never says how these operations are actually financed. Who pays for the office equipment and supplies?
Good question. The article never says how these operations are actually financed. Who pays for the office equipment and supplies?
2
@Steve: "The article never says how these operations are actually financed."
Correcting myself: I reread the article more carefully and found one sentence that says the "practice firms" are "supported by government funds". That must mean they are taxpayer-funded. How much do these practice firms cost to operate? Is tuition ever charged?
The article says "12 new centers have sprung up since 2013". Who makes those decisions and by what process? (The article mentions Euro Ent’Ent, but doesn't explain how it operates.)
2015-05-30 00:30:42 UTC
Correcting myself: I reread the article more carefully and found one sentence that says the "practice firms" are "supported by government funds". That must mean they are taxpayer-funded. How much do these practice firms cost to operate? Is tuition ever charged?
The article says "12 new centers have sprung up since 2013". Who makes those decisions and by what process? (The article mentions Euro Ent’Ent, but doesn't explain how it operates.)
2015-05-30 00:30:42 UTC
1
So Bernie Sanders gets ridiculed by the mainstream press for supporting a jobs program that would rebuild our infrastructure and create millions of actual jobs, basic income is still an ivory tower pipe dream, but fake jobs at fake companies with no benefits are treated as a serious training idea by the Times business section? This idea belongs in a sketch comedy, Sander's ideas have already worked in the real world.
55
Having a fake strike for a fake job all while collecting unemployment benefits? Seems like a poor use of time and resources. This reads as the adult version of playing house. Setting up a fake company that specializes in pet weddings? I understand they are attempting to give unemployed workers a chance to learn on the job skills, but this seems like an exercise in futility.
6
Right-wingers tell us the European economy is booming and has thrived under globalization. This article tells a very different story.
8
@bnc: "Right-wingers tell us ..."
What "Right-wingers"? Please be specific.
What "Right-wingers"? Please be specific.
2
The simulation of real life conditions are invaluable for traning employees and building skills. When I went to law school, barristers union and moot court exercises served the same purposes. However, at the end of the training exercise, there have to be jobs. When I graduated, law school graduates found jobs. Today, one out of three does not. What is the problem. Lack of skills has nothing to do with it. It is the lack of jobs produced by the economy. Europe is in even worse shape than the U.S. Unless governments start spending to pick up the slack created by diminished consumer demand, I see no end in sight.
31
Exacerbating the shortage of law jobs (or oversupply of newer lawyers), are the predations of the law schools on their own students. They use the promise of a bright career (based on fraudulent statistics and blatantly false marketing) to sell non-dischargeable student loans. Its one thing to not get your dream job, or any job in your field at first. Its another to start off drowning in debt, with crippling payments that prevent retirement savings, and a damaged credit score keeping you from homeownership.
5
I don't believe the true long-term unemployed figures are that much lower in the US than in Europe. The difference is in the much shorter term unemployment benefits and that many long term unemployed are simply no longer counted in the US workforce: out of sight, out of mind.
23
Unemployment statistics have nothing to do with receiving unemployment benefits. Otherwise, new entrants to the workforce would not be counted.
Instead, the BLS uses a survey of 60,000 households across all census blocks. This survey is highly accurate and statistically valid. If you are an adult, you are looking for work, and you did not work this week, then you are unemployed and counted as such.
Read more here:
http://www.bls.gov/cps/faq.htm
Instead, the BLS uses a survey of 60,000 households across all census blocks. This survey is highly accurate and statistically valid. If you are an adult, you are looking for work, and you did not work this week, then you are unemployed and counted as such.
Read more here:
http://www.bls.gov/cps/faq.htm
@Jonathan, that is not exactly correct. Difference between accuracy and precision. The BLS survey is widely acknowledged to not include many working age, non-disabled adults who are not considered to be in the workforce because they are not working and not collecting unemployment benefits.
2
Let us not forget the amazing boom in the "disabled," the numbers of whom would make you think we had the worst health care on Earth. The truly disabled find what work they can, and we should demand that employers provide them with lawful accommodations. The growth is in those whom we are removing from the workforce in exchange for a small welfare check.
1
This reads like something the John Birch Society said would be caused by Socialism.
5
While the American economy looks more and more like what Marx predicted
18
In case you haven't noticed, SSecurity, Medicare, VA benefits etc etc are all programs of US versions of socialism. And so they should be.
6
Ironic, huh?
2