They're certainly winning in Memphis, where headlines listing little kids killed in random shootings run in parallel with full page ads for local gun dealers. No plans for more kid-friendly Glocks in schools at this point, but the state leg says parents will soon be able to pack some heat at little league games no matter what the city or county says about it. The only place they won't let you carry your six gun in Tennessee is in the state capitol building. Thank god we're keeping those guys safe.
14
There is ONLY one reason that the sale of weapons and ammunition continues to rise...we have a black president. Period!
I have a brother-in-law who has doubled his AKs and ARs and has 100,000 rounds of ammunition is his survivalist bunker in Alabama. He and the rest of these redneck chickenhawks HATE the Obamas--not just Barack but also Michelle, Malia, Sasha, and Michelle's mother.
There is no reasoning with them. They hear the constant drumbeat of Fox News, Limbaugh, Beck and worse. "Obama's gonna take our gunz 'way!!"
They are terrified. Lost your job? Obama. Blacks gettin' killed? They deserved it...they were breakin' the law. Secession, secession.
Militia groups have tripled. They watch "Sons of Anarchy" and Duck Dynasty where Phil Robertson--the head "duck" talked at a prayer breakfast about his bloody, violent fantasy of killing an atheist family and their atheist kids!
CNN and other 24 hr cable show continuous loops of Walter Scott getting gunned down while running away...just running away from a traffic stop. A 73 y/o "depity" kills a black guy then says "I'm sorry!" That won't bring him back.
I can't keep up with the shootings...it's every day! A naked mentally ill man is shot dead in front of his apt building in Atlanta.
We have gutless legislators. Period.
I have a brother-in-law who has doubled his AKs and ARs and has 100,000 rounds of ammunition is his survivalist bunker in Alabama. He and the rest of these redneck chickenhawks HATE the Obamas--not just Barack but also Michelle, Malia, Sasha, and Michelle's mother.
There is no reasoning with them. They hear the constant drumbeat of Fox News, Limbaugh, Beck and worse. "Obama's gonna take our gunz 'way!!"
They are terrified. Lost your job? Obama. Blacks gettin' killed? They deserved it...they were breakin' the law. Secession, secession.
Militia groups have tripled. They watch "Sons of Anarchy" and Duck Dynasty where Phil Robertson--the head "duck" talked at a prayer breakfast about his bloody, violent fantasy of killing an atheist family and their atheist kids!
CNN and other 24 hr cable show continuous loops of Walter Scott getting gunned down while running away...just running away from a traffic stop. A 73 y/o "depity" kills a black guy then says "I'm sorry!" That won't bring him back.
I can't keep up with the shootings...it's every day! A naked mentally ill man is shot dead in front of his apt building in Atlanta.
We have gutless legislators. Period.
35
To truly protect your home: Go the local SPCA or Humane Society and adopt a large mutt. Much safer than buying a gun. You can't accidently shoot a loved one with a dog.
22
Two repeated myths:
1. All by itself, a gun will protect you. In fact, no other means of self-defense exists. No, I'm not talking about martial arts: I'm talking about things like civilization, common sense, and awareness of one's surroundings, the best self-defense measures human ebings ever invented.
2. Because our government is evil, guns are essential for a small band of lonely patriots to Fight back Against Tyranny.
Here're the problems with that one: a) if you think THIS gov is oppressive, try the Massachusetts Bay Colony or Civil War America; b) if you get to the point where you have to Red Dawn it, you have already lost America, and you won't get her back.
This last science-fictional fantasy is all over the place, these days. And judging by the kinds of yahoos who yell it the loudest, the best you'll end up with after years of war and many, many dead is a right-wing theocracy run by white guys.
I'm all in favor of gun ownership--responsible gun ownership, which is what the vast majority of gun owners believe in. But the fantasy stuff...
1. All by itself, a gun will protect you. In fact, no other means of self-defense exists. No, I'm not talking about martial arts: I'm talking about things like civilization, common sense, and awareness of one's surroundings, the best self-defense measures human ebings ever invented.
2. Because our government is evil, guns are essential for a small band of lonely patriots to Fight back Against Tyranny.
Here're the problems with that one: a) if you think THIS gov is oppressive, try the Massachusetts Bay Colony or Civil War America; b) if you get to the point where you have to Red Dawn it, you have already lost America, and you won't get her back.
This last science-fictional fantasy is all over the place, these days. And judging by the kinds of yahoos who yell it the loudest, the best you'll end up with after years of war and many, many dead is a right-wing theocracy run by white guys.
I'm all in favor of gun ownership--responsible gun ownership, which is what the vast majority of gun owners believe in. But the fantasy stuff...
8
Yet another example of how ignorant Americans are and how adept the right wing is in taking advantage of that ignorance.
21
I would like to see how the following questions would poll:
Should everyone, including terrorists, violent felons, domestic abusers, and mentally/emotionally disturbed persons be able to buy and carry guns?
Can those people above now legally purchase a firearm?
Do you want your child's teacher to carry a loaded firearm in the classroom?
Should drones be weaponized for hunting and personal protection purposes?
Should there be any limit to the firepower available to a civilian?
Would you feel safer everyone, including yourself, carried a firearm?
I don't know what the answers would be, but they would give more insight than "are protecting gun rights more important then controlling gun ownership." Just the phrasing alone of that question makes me want to protect rights. If the answers all turn out to be yes, then we know gun control is over.
Should everyone, including terrorists, violent felons, domestic abusers, and mentally/emotionally disturbed persons be able to buy and carry guns?
Can those people above now legally purchase a firearm?
Do you want your child's teacher to carry a loaded firearm in the classroom?
Should drones be weaponized for hunting and personal protection purposes?
Should there be any limit to the firepower available to a civilian?
Would you feel safer everyone, including yourself, carried a firearm?
I don't know what the answers would be, but they would give more insight than "are protecting gun rights more important then controlling gun ownership." Just the phrasing alone of that question makes me want to protect rights. If the answers all turn out to be yes, then we know gun control is over.
8
Statistics is your friend:
http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/2015/03/09/us/politics/ap-us-poll-gun-ow...
http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/2015/03/09/us/politics/ap-us-poll-gun-ow...
.......and maybe people are more favorable to guns now that they believe they
might need to use them to protect themselves from an out-of-control police mentality. I have long been personally opposed to handguns and automatic weapons ( guns for sport shooting and hunting are just fine ), but as I see
more and more of these police shootings on TV, I am really losing faith in the competency and mentality of a significant element within our police departments.
might need to use them to protect themselves from an out-of-control police mentality. I have long been personally opposed to handguns and automatic weapons ( guns for sport shooting and hunting are just fine ), but as I see
more and more of these police shootings on TV, I am really losing faith in the competency and mentality of a significant element within our police departments.
5
Mr. Blow,
It would seem that the debate on gun ownership has progressed from the right to have and hold guns for sporting and hunting. Then it was for protection from criminal assault, first in the home and then anywhere in public and finally as a means to thwart a tyrannical government.
Does this not sound like a collective case of increasing paranoid schizophrenia?
It would seem that the debate on gun ownership has progressed from the right to have and hold guns for sporting and hunting. Then it was for protection from criminal assault, first in the home and then anywhere in public and finally as a means to thwart a tyrannical government.
Does this not sound like a collective case of increasing paranoid schizophrenia?
9
If your tank is constantly springing leaks, the sensible solution has two-parts:
1. Use a lot of corks, for the short-term.
2. Analyze your tank's construction, for a long-term solution.
When it comes to societal agression, I never hear the NRA talking about #2.
1. Use a lot of corks, for the short-term.
2. Analyze your tank's construction, for a long-term solution.
When it comes to societal agression, I never hear the NRA talking about #2.
1
>
Yes they are the winners, and the losers are the innocent people that will be killed by their actions.
The American people have lost any commonsense that they may have once processed. Stupidity is now a virtue, moreover, the problem goes beyond guns.
Yes they are the winners, and the losers are the innocent people that will be killed by their actions.
The American people have lost any commonsense that they may have once processed. Stupidity is now a virtue, moreover, the problem goes beyond guns.
12
One of the arguments I always hear from rabid gun rights advocate is that we don't need new gun laws; we need to enforce the laws already on the books. Which laws are they talking about? Is it really an enforcement issue?
4
"Those proposals, including expanded background checks (which were characterized as “misguided” by the N.R.A.’s Chris Cox) and a ban on some semiautomatic weapons, were roundly defeated in the Senate, although polls showed about 90 percent public approval for expanded background checks."
Be honest Charles. Only some semi-automatic weapons? It was at least 150 and included the most popular rifle in America, the AR-15 that has 4-5 million owners. I wouldn't consider that in the ballpark of only some firearms.
http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2013/01/24/assault-weapons-b...
Be honest Charles. Only some semi-automatic weapons? It was at least 150 and included the most popular rifle in America, the AR-15 that has 4-5 million owners. I wouldn't consider that in the ballpark of only some firearms.
http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2013/01/24/assault-weapons-b...
5
While sharing my liberal views toward more reasonable firearms control before a conservative group, I was assailed by their chairwoman who proclaimed, “When they come for me with 30 rounds in their ammo clips, by God, I want 30 rounds to answer back!” To which I responded, “First, in all liklyhood ‘they’ won’t be coming for you, they’ll be coming for me - and you’ll be among them.” Which raises this dystopian vision pertinent to Mr. Blow’s column. Should the day come when an uber-conservative administration and congress come rule the USA, in the run-up to the same and after, I see the NRA, its swelling membership and their vast, homegrown network of existing “rod and gun,” “sportsmen” and like gun enthusiast clubs and veterans organizations becoming not only a driving force but a key, operational arm in carrying out and solidifying such an administration’s policies and power. They’ll be easily recognized by their para-military structure and, of course, their brown shirts.
20
Well of course people think crime is on the rise. TV and web news outlets relentlessly hammer on death and destruction and disaster every single day. It's hard not to assume that all of that is coming to your street SOON! But that's not why people buy guns.
Gun sales spike because existing gun owners go out and buy another one. They are not for protection as much as they give the gun enthusiast a warm and powerful feeling and when you have one, why stop there? Revolver? How about a Glock to go with that? Long gun? You're not complete without a shot gun or a look alike assault rifle in the cabinet. The NRA has been successful in beating back regulation, not the desire of gun owners. Guns are not in more and more hands. More and more guns are in the hands of fewer and fewer people.
Gun sales spike because existing gun owners go out and buy another one. They are not for protection as much as they give the gun enthusiast a warm and powerful feeling and when you have one, why stop there? Revolver? How about a Glock to go with that? Long gun? You're not complete without a shot gun or a look alike assault rifle in the cabinet. The NRA has been successful in beating back regulation, not the desire of gun owners. Guns are not in more and more hands. More and more guns are in the hands of fewer and fewer people.
7
"...the N.R.A. appears to be winning this round."
Thoughts:
This is a very visible tip of a conservative/reactionary surge in America traceable back to Nixon's "Law'n'Order" that has become a Republican political staple.
Americans have learned to create their own facts and history to justify their own bigotries and sense of powerlessness.
Thoughts:
This is a very visible tip of a conservative/reactionary surge in America traceable back to Nixon's "Law'n'Order" that has become a Republican political staple.
Americans have learned to create their own facts and history to justify their own bigotries and sense of powerlessness.
10
As far as I'm concerned, between the allowance of the assault weapons ban to lapse (as it happened, during Dubya's first term , but I digress); 9/11; the Tea Party; all those gun owners who cherry-pick the interpretation of the Second Amendment in justifying their rights; and the likes of Wayne LaPierre, whose financed pandering of paranoia to all uninformed/misinformed/ill-informed gun owners (the latter, no thanks to FOX News and the rest of the right-wing media) are what's wrong, here.
It's not gun ownership rights I personally have a priblem with; it's the mentality behind it all, as well as the beltway's fear of the gunbelt.
It's not gun ownership rights I personally have a priblem with; it's the mentality behind it all, as well as the beltway's fear of the gunbelt.
5
The NRA has convinced much of the country that gun ownership and patriotism are the same thing. Anyone who favors gun control can't be "one of us" and isn't a real American. The NRA doesn't want you to think about the high number of accidental shootings or that fact that a perfectly sane person who is safe with a firearm can become enraged and a danger to others or depressed and a danger to themselves in the right circumstances.
9
Good article; interesting comments.
In my mind the number of people saved by guns has yet to reach even a miniscule percentage of the people killed by guns - is that just my biased assessment?
In my mind the number of people saved by guns has yet to reach even a miniscule percentage of the people killed by guns - is that just my biased assessment?
13
The NRA can always find more to scare people with and to be "outraged" about, and can always find people who will be scared and "outraged", so, there is no end to this. Don't make the mistake that it's just about selling more guns and ammo, it's also about votes and kickbacks to the NRA, all in the name of "freedom" and "liberty".
4
The NRA is our figurehead. The people won, if it was ever a game or war. The 2nd Amendment is real and dutiful to the people. For many years many people were lackadaisical about it because it was just 'there'. Now it is being voraciously attacked and we do not want to lose it.
7
Thank you for a spot-on description of how the polarization of this issue keeps renewing itself.
A media riot starts over a shooting. The anti-gun crowd (whose eyes start counter-rotating at the mention of the word "gun" -- witness most comments here -- take to the barricades). Gun owners (the vast vast majority of whom would never, ever handle a gun in a dangerous manner) respond by going to the mattresses.
The problem is this: There is no middle ground for the reasonable people to occupy. It doesn't exist.
Look: I collect and shoot old guns. I'm a retired cop. I go to the range at least once a week. Yet, I am a liberal (some say socialist) and the ACLU is my only charity. I support background checks of all gun buyers. I support mandatory safety training for all gun owners. I even support licensing of guns and gun owners (without prohibitions for those who qualify).
Wayne LaPierre and his NRA are far too radical for my tastes. But so is Diane Feinstein who wants to ban any gun with a pistol and a bayonet mount (is there an outbreak of bayonet attacks I haven't heard about?).
There is no place for a moderate on this topic to go without being scorned and stoned by extremists on either side.
Pity.
A media riot starts over a shooting. The anti-gun crowd (whose eyes start counter-rotating at the mention of the word "gun" -- witness most comments here -- take to the barricades). Gun owners (the vast vast majority of whom would never, ever handle a gun in a dangerous manner) respond by going to the mattresses.
The problem is this: There is no middle ground for the reasonable people to occupy. It doesn't exist.
Look: I collect and shoot old guns. I'm a retired cop. I go to the range at least once a week. Yet, I am a liberal (some say socialist) and the ACLU is my only charity. I support background checks of all gun buyers. I support mandatory safety training for all gun owners. I even support licensing of guns and gun owners (without prohibitions for those who qualify).
Wayne LaPierre and his NRA are far too radical for my tastes. But so is Diane Feinstein who wants to ban any gun with a pistol and a bayonet mount (is there an outbreak of bayonet attacks I haven't heard about?).
There is no place for a moderate on this topic to go without being scorned and stoned by extremists on either side.
Pity.
43
Cities with the highest crime rates are those with the strictest gun laws. An inconvenient fact.
10
Of course the NRA has won! Money, gobs and gobs of it, always wins. I grew up with guns. Every person in our home knew how to use and was comfortable with guns. Today, having grown up and older and wiser, I do not permit forearms on my premises. By anyone. No matter what the 'gunners' say, a gun has only one purpose: to kill. That is what they are designed, sold, bought, and used for: killing, mostly living things. Intentionally or accidentally. They are not multi-purpose tools we would keep in our closet or our garage - you cannot mow the lawn, paint a wall, or fix a flat with a gun. One Purpose Only - TO KILL. But, the battle is lost. There are more than 300 MILLION privately-owned firearms in this country, and growing. It will not be long until the battles start. I am glad I am old.......
2
When will the public learn that the only point of the NRA is to encourage people to buy guns to help the bottom line of gun manufacturers.
12
The probability that we devise a test that can predict who might go "crazy" and pull the trigger=0%.
The probability that a gun will kill=99%.
Which should we control?
The probability that a gun will kill=99%.
Which should we control?
4
So, People aren't responsible for murders. It's the guns..... Or could it be possible that there is a societal/cultural problem??? Irresponsible people that have become increasingly dependent on government handouts. Mom's with kids without fathers?? NO, it must be the guns. So says Mr. Charles Blow.
2
As I get older, I find it increasingly difficult to lug a gun around all the time, especially an AK-47 with hundreds of rounds. Why doesn't the NRA have a program, as with CitiBank bicycles, where they provide a stack of guns at each street corner? Then, when we need to use a gun, we can just go to the nearest stack and pick one up. If they will do that, I'll bet they get a million new members within a week. The only downside I can see is that half the new members might be dead the following week.
8
I can see you Americans are behind the times. When our right wing government in Canada was confronted with the fact that crime was in decline they claimed that it was because of unreported crimes. Our right wingers are so dim witted that when even right wing Americans are admitting their tough on crime agenda is mindlessly filling prisons for no benefit with associated costs, the Canadian variety are busy passing laws to increased jail time. Typical conservatives never let facts get in the road of opinions.
7
One way to offset the undue influence of the NRA is to consider how we talk about guns. The phrase "gun control" evokes fear and loathing of a "gubmint coming to take your guns!" while who in their right mind could argue against "gun safety?" Of course even such a benign phrase such as "gun safety" will be challenged by the folks who demand the right to blow their gonads off while kneeling in church.
But as some have stated previously with people from the ever shrinking middle class being thrown out of work into despair and anger, it may be that the have become "bitter and cling to their guns and religion..."
But as some have stated previously with people from the ever shrinking middle class being thrown out of work into despair and anger, it may be that the have become "bitter and cling to their guns and religion..."
4
Seems to me that people who rightly get bent out of shape over Obama’s disregard for the Fourth Amendment have no problem advocating for disregard of the Second Amendment, which like it or not is of equal force and effect in this country.
A good citizen needs to embrace or at least respect all of the Constitution
as amended, not just those parts that conform to one’s politics. Without a Constitutional amendment, which can always be pursued and would be the only way to change things, owning guns will remain literally as American as apple pie.
Trashing people who are exercising a right explicitly protected in the Constitution has never felt right to me. And as our oligarchy races towards its fascist nirvana, who knows, those gun owners and their guns just might come in handy.
A good citizen needs to embrace or at least respect all of the Constitution
as amended, not just those parts that conform to one’s politics. Without a Constitutional amendment, which can always be pursued and would be the only way to change things, owning guns will remain literally as American as apple pie.
Trashing people who are exercising a right explicitly protected in the Constitution has never felt right to me. And as our oligarchy races towards its fascist nirvana, who knows, those gun owners and their guns just might come in handy.
6
Blame the NRA. Blame Citizen's United. Blame Fox News. Blame white males. All I see in many of the posts in this forum is finger pointing. Blame everything and everyone except one thing: the fact that the gun control lobby is one of the most inept lobbies I've ever seen.
If the gun control lobby had any intelligence, it would have used tactics to drive a wedge between law-abiding gun owners - most of whom aren't crazy and paranoid, by the way - and the NRA. Instead, all I've seen from the gun control lobby and supporters is mockery and even vilification of law-abiding gun owners, making them NRA sympathizers.
So, keep it up gun control lobby. Blame everyone and everything except yourselves. After all, you've done such a great job up until now. Keep up the good work...and keep losing.
If the gun control lobby had any intelligence, it would have used tactics to drive a wedge between law-abiding gun owners - most of whom aren't crazy and paranoid, by the way - and the NRA. Instead, all I've seen from the gun control lobby and supporters is mockery and even vilification of law-abiding gun owners, making them NRA sympathizers.
So, keep it up gun control lobby. Blame everyone and everything except yourselves. After all, you've done such a great job up until now. Keep up the good work...and keep losing.
29
Charles, you've missed the point about the N.R.A. and its ultimate political utility.
It used to be that the N.R.A. would be the front organization that took the brunt of bad P.R. for the gun lobby after mass shootings gave them a black eye. Yet now the N.R.A.'s function is to turn mass shooting events into recruiting initiatives that seek to inculcate poor, disconnected and paranoid rural voters into a form or radicalism that supports plutocratic political initiatives.
Was it P.T. Barnum who said there was a sucker born every minute?
It used to be that the N.R.A. would be the front organization that took the brunt of bad P.R. for the gun lobby after mass shootings gave them a black eye. Yet now the N.R.A.'s function is to turn mass shooting events into recruiting initiatives that seek to inculcate poor, disconnected and paranoid rural voters into a form or radicalism that supports plutocratic political initiatives.
Was it P.T. Barnum who said there was a sucker born every minute?
2
For years the NRA has had its way with our elected officials, pouring money into their election campaigns in return for favorable gun laws, some written themselves by the NRA, whose Chief Legal Officer has a murder conviction of a woman with a gun. For years the only organization of any scope that opposed them was headed by Sarah and Jim Brady, who both recently passed away within a short time span of each, Jim first, and then Sarah. Only recently have several new organizations been started to counter the NRA, and they are quickly gaining grassroots support. Whether this will overcome the NRA's years-long lead is open to question, but education is key. Once the American public know and understand the truth, and not what they see on FOX (I went to high school with Bill O'Reilly) they will poll and vote accordingly. There are some new movies coming out which will help this, and I have given to them both. One is 91, for the % of Americans who believe in Background checks for gun sales, and the other is about the Real NRA.
1
I don't like it, but the fact is that the NRA has won! The Democrats needs to drop gun controls as an issue, especially on the State level, where Democrats really need to concentrate on winning back legislatures and governorships..
21
"A majority of Americans (63 percent) said in a Gallup survey last year that crime was on the rise, despite crime statistics holding near 20-year lows.”
Statistics. Those lying eyes. Who are you going to believe? Statistics? Or FOX News? Where it's all crime, disaster, incompetence. 24/7. All the fault of a feckless government that can't protect you. But wants to take away your freedom and leave you defenceless at the same time. Statistics? Bahh. I know the truth...... So I'll continue to watch FOX News from my panic room, locked and loaded.
Statistics. Those lying eyes. Who are you going to believe? Statistics? Or FOX News? Where it's all crime, disaster, incompetence. 24/7. All the fault of a feckless government that can't protect you. But wants to take away your freedom and leave you defenceless at the same time. Statistics? Bahh. I know the truth...... So I'll continue to watch FOX News from my panic room, locked and loaded.
4
Here's an argument I haven't yet heard, but which seems plain to me: there is no law requiring weapons training prior to ownership because that would lead to "registration." And registration would lead to confiscation. Which is bad because...the government can come take the gun away, to prevent a revolution? Have I got that right?
That's the part that makes no sense. The Constitution makes no provision for its' own overthrow. As Justice Holmes said, it isn't a suicide pact. It authorizes Congress to call up militia to enforce laws, repel invasions, and suppress insurrections. That's it. George Washington called it up to suppress an insurrection. Lincoln called it up to suppress an attempt to leave the Union. It's established: you don't get to revolt against your country, and you don't get to take a chunk of it off and call it something else. The issue was settled in 1865 at a cost of 650,000 lives.
Therefore, the government can tell you lots of things about your gun: what type you can have, what caliber, where you can keep it, and what proficiency you are required to have to operate it. And if it would just do that, we'd all be a lot safer.
That's the part that makes no sense. The Constitution makes no provision for its' own overthrow. As Justice Holmes said, it isn't a suicide pact. It authorizes Congress to call up militia to enforce laws, repel invasions, and suppress insurrections. That's it. George Washington called it up to suppress an insurrection. Lincoln called it up to suppress an attempt to leave the Union. It's established: you don't get to revolt against your country, and you don't get to take a chunk of it off and call it something else. The issue was settled in 1865 at a cost of 650,000 lives.
Therefore, the government can tell you lots of things about your gun: what type you can have, what caliber, where you can keep it, and what proficiency you are required to have to operate it. And if it would just do that, we'd all be a lot safer.
8
I really love some of these comments. Full of ignorance and your own form of head in the sand mentality. The NRA is not an evil greedy corporation. It's a very large group of American Citizens who want to protect their 2nd Amendment Rights. The people tell the NRA what is important to them and the NRA moves in that direction. There's over 4 million American members so think about that with the NRA. Their you neighbors, coworkers and in many cases your friends. Lets then look at conceal carry. There are millions of American who do so and as it's meaning points out, concealed means concealed. You don't know who is and who isn't. Are you going to be paranoid all of your life? I always like how people always point out the mass murders as the only thing that happens when people own guns. Pull your head out of the sand and Google statistics on crime stopped by a lawful gun owner. Notice how the left leaning news media doesn't really mention this, but the number of lives saved vastly outweigh lives lost. Just because it doesn't happen in your neighborhood doesn't mean it doesn't happen at all. As an example of that let me ask you this. Shortly after the movie theater shooting there was a guy down south who walked into a mall with a shotgun looking to kill people. He was shot down by lawful gun owners with the only life lost being the bad guy. Didn't hear about that one did you? Hummm, I wonder why......
5
Does anybody know when the "black helicopters" will arrive? I do not own a gun, and I don't how I can defend my home when the storm troopers arrive. Can I buy a gun now, or is it too late? Do I have to go to a gun show first? Do I need some kind of permit to shoot at black helicopters? Help Me!!!!
6
How many Americans have died due to gun violence in the country since 9/11? How many trillions of dollars was spent fighting wars in the middle east as revenge for 9/11? What has been done to stop the deaths in the US- Nothing. The NRA is the biggest terrorist threat we have in this country because of the money they spend buying our "elected" politcians and by striking fear into the rest of us who oppose them. Look at the outrage targeted at country singer Tim McGraw as he supports the Snady Hook group, all spawned by the madmen at the NRA. Their interpretation of the Second Amendment is based on the outlook of a 18th century man facing the great wilderness and is not applicable to the modern world.
4
We should stop calling it gun control and call it for what it is, weapons control. The weapons of war are now available to all. A little ole hand gun seems sane compared to an AK-47 that can fire many rounds of deadly bullets. It is just insane. Fear has ruled this land since 9/11 and this fear has been constantly stoked for political advantage ever since and it has worked wonderfully for the right wingers of this country. Yes the NRA has won. I will not live long enough to see any change. Note: I came across a glossy magazine in NC titled "Gardens and Guns" the soul of the south. What does Ma plant her garden while Dad shoots varmints in the back yard so a nice stew can be made for supper? Or maybe shoot the neighbor if he enters the yard unannounced. Where am I? Please wake me up and tell me this is just a nightmare dream.
1
The NRA is doing well because they've convinced lots of American of the following:
1. Crime is rising, particularly crime by Them.
2. The government is coming to take all your guns.
3. Just having a gun will protect you.
4. Guns are the only possible way to protect yourself and what you care about.
1. Crime is rising, particularly crime by Them.
2. The government is coming to take all your guns.
3. Just having a gun will protect you.
4. Guns are the only possible way to protect yourself and what you care about.
4
The two self-styled musketeers of the GOP, Boehner and McConnell, are putty in the hands of the powerful gun lobby, particularly the NRA. Even now in the wake of the increasing occurrence of ugly wholesale gun massacres, they trot out the same lame arguments that existing guns laws need to be enforced, not changed or strengthened. They have the gall to say these things even as gun laws are being relaxed with their consent.
5
Of course it has. But the only reason it has done so is that millions of people agree with it
2
It doesn't help that the National Institute of Health is forbidden to research the impact of gun ownership on health.
10
No different than the abortion debate. Any restrictions on a woman's right to choose (a Supreme Court decision) is met with hysterical reaction. Mostly because supporters of abortion believe that any infringement will lead to greater infringement. And they may be correct. 2nd Amendment supporters believe the same - and they are probably correct.
The 2nd Amendment as an individual right is no different than the right to an abortion. Both were decided by the SC. If you support the logic that Roe v Wade is a law of the land, then you probably need to support the SC decision that the 2nd Amendment is an individual right.
But liberals won't do that will they. Because, of course, they want abortion rights and do not agree with the 2nd Amendment. It all just depends on what agenda you have.
The 2nd Amendment as an individual right is no different than the right to an abortion. Both were decided by the SC. If you support the logic that Roe v Wade is a law of the land, then you probably need to support the SC decision that the 2nd Amendment is an individual right.
But liberals won't do that will they. Because, of course, they want abortion rights and do not agree with the 2nd Amendment. It all just depends on what agenda you have.
3
"News coverage, reality TV, and political rhetoric" as causes of the advancement of the gun culture's agenda in the USA? Especially the blurring of lines between these, so that many apparently think reality TV IS reality and also news. And of course the blatant disinformation in hostile political rhetoric and Faux News
2
The United States of America. Government of the NRA, by the NRA and or the NRA.
1
The NRA has not 'won'. It seems to prevail now in a climate of right wing propaganda ignited by the vast and exceedingly well funded FOX NEWS empire of Rupert Murdoch who rides astride the beast of economic domination by the few and well connected. We are losing in our battle to preserve a one man one vote democracy with liberty and justice for all thanks to SCOTUS and 'citizens united'. One facet of that domination is to ignite fear of the 'other'. Moreover, they distort the intent of the framers of the constitution. They also set aside the prerogatives of democratic rule in which the majority can choose to restrict commerce and establish laws that protect the many with legal mandates that govern the sale, distribution, use and licensing of firearms. Let us not forget that lady liberty may be easily lost and requires eternal vigilance on the part of her citizens to restrain the forces of discord and destruction in the hands of the selfish outlaws who would take the law and its rules into their own hands to decide the fate of those they intimidate. The safety of our children is at stake. The rule of law has been challenged. The use of unlimited campaign funding threatens to steal our democracy. We must NEVER give up the fight to preserve our union. NEVER should we submit to the bullies who would rule us with their intimidation and their threats while they distort the truth through the goliath of FOX NEWS and its handmaidens including the antidemocratic leader of the NRA.
1
how sure are we that each NRA membership is equal to one person? It would be quite simple for an unnecessarily-rich gun-toting patriot to buy memberships at a whim. I'm not sure the rise in memberships is indicative of an NRA win.
As for public perception, I would imagine the media's rapid shift to the right lean hasn't hurt the NRA's cause any. In addition to a concentrated effort to "be fair" to guns and gun owners, the media is running scared. When a shooting happens, you folks don't cover it. It appears to be a question of "how many"? But, you aren't asking about the number of shots fired but about the number of people hurt. These days, how many people have to die in any one incident before it's newsworthy? Because in that one death is equal to one person.
As for public perception, I would imagine the media's rapid shift to the right lean hasn't hurt the NRA's cause any. In addition to a concentrated effort to "be fair" to guns and gun owners, the media is running scared. When a shooting happens, you folks don't cover it. It appears to be a question of "how many"? But, you aren't asking about the number of shots fired but about the number of people hurt. These days, how many people have to die in any one incident before it's newsworthy? Because in that one death is equal to one person.
The same PEW Foundation whose report statistics Blow references here also has published a report showing that a majority of African Americans support their 2nd Amendment right to own a firearm. Too bad Times readers never see a column on that popular opinion.
3
It is not the NRA that has won, it's all of America that has won. The second Amendment stands and once again defeated those that would supress the rights of ALL Americans. It amazes me how many people pick and chose which rights they want others to have and not have.
4
Really, are we still having this conversation, the NRA isn't just winning, it's game over, a casual glance at the statistics of gun ownership following the massacre of little children is all you need to know on the topic. Hats off to them for their satanic skills at fear mongering, twisted logic, and moronic interpretation of the Second Amendment. Here's the deal folks: Live with it. Don't get your hopes up over gun control legislation, it will be crushed by big money and well orchestrated public relations. Bottom line, either buy a gun yourself, as the NRA would like you to do, or remain gun free, and hope another murderous yahoo doesn't come your way.
4
The NRA has won. It is impossible to get the guns away from the owners, many will just hide them, or say they were stolen. They will evade laws. We can't, after trying for many years, get guns away from criminals, so why should we expect to get them away from law abiding citizens? Are we to make them criminals?
A fact that has been ignore here is the fears following the recent riots, burnings in Ferguson, etc. People fear "others" as well as the feeling that we are losing control of our lived.
A fact that has been ignore here is the fears following the recent riots, burnings in Ferguson, etc. People fear "others" as well as the feeling that we are losing control of our lived.
2
It starts with the news, doesn't it? "If it bleeds, it leads." The perceptions of crime are a reflection of the fact that although crime per capita is down, overall crime is not. If we have a limited number of new sources, then the crime per news source increases. Think about a town of 25,000 and one newspaper in 1970. One murder in one year is big news. If the same town is 50,000 and one newspaper in 2015, two murders in one year is bigger news, even though the murder rate is unchanged.
The NRA will have achieved total victory when the only newsworthy events in the USA are those which don't involve a shooting.
The skulduggery perpetrated by the NRA to stymie the ATF in it´s gun control mandate is reprehensible and borders on the criminal. It's size, budget, and operations have all been hamstrung. The agency has been barred, by law, from inspecting gun dealers more than once a year (even for previous law-breakers) and some violations were reduced to misdemeanors. The ATF is also barred by law from maintaining gun trace records in a computer database, meaning that, even today, gun traces must be done by hand from paper records. Further, the law does not require gun dealers to take inventory. For the last six years, the ATF has operated without a permanent head of the agency, thanks to the obstruction of NRA-backed senators.
2
Guns have been the bane of our country - both inside and outside our borders!
America is a military state at all levels. The NRA bears some responsibility for good advertising, but no one forces Americans to buy guns. Although the opinion polls are presumably correct, I believe it is also true that fewer Americans than ever, as a proportion of the population, own guns. Fewer Americans own more guns per person. With crime rates declining, perplexing, isn't it?
But, America is still a military state. When WWII ended seventy years ago, we continued our state of war and it has never stopped. America has to be at war with someone at all times, don't we? We are a world empire and any threat anywhere is some obscure part of the war endangers our empire, doesn't it? We can and do kill anyone anywhere on the globe anytime we want to maintain our empire.
Americans are also at war with each other. We fear people who are not like ourselves. We shoot people who are black, who are young, who play their music too loudly, who show up at our front doors unannounced seeking help, who are old and confused. We shoot these people with impunity, with the support of the laws.
American police are at war with the citizens whom they are supposed to protect. They shoot anyone for any reason and get away with it.
Americans are self righteous, afraid, and armed. This is a dangerous combination, isn't it? And there is no end in sight.
But, America is still a military state. When WWII ended seventy years ago, we continued our state of war and it has never stopped. America has to be at war with someone at all times, don't we? We are a world empire and any threat anywhere is some obscure part of the war endangers our empire, doesn't it? We can and do kill anyone anywhere on the globe anytime we want to maintain our empire.
Americans are also at war with each other. We fear people who are not like ourselves. We shoot people who are black, who are young, who play their music too loudly, who show up at our front doors unannounced seeking help, who are old and confused. We shoot these people with impunity, with the support of the laws.
American police are at war with the citizens whom they are supposed to protect. They shoot anyone for any reason and get away with it.
Americans are self righteous, afraid, and armed. This is a dangerous combination, isn't it? And there is no end in sight.
1
Until gun makers, sellers and owners are held liable for negligence related to gun crimes / murders, nothing will change.
History is replete with examples of victims laid low by neighbors & strangers alike! The constant shrill call for personal disarmament (guns or clubs) by spokesmen of a people group wrested from their homeland to be enslaved first in northern regions and of late western continents simple boggles the mind!
1
Why is the question "Has the NRA won?" The way I see it the people have won. What current law or proposed law will stop violent crime? The fact is criminals do not follow the law anyway. In my State there is already background checks and registration for handguns but it hasn't stopped violent crime. See Detroit, Flint, or Benton Harbor. There are plenty of Federal firearm laws on the books now. Why not enforce what you have instead of piling on even more?
Just my 2 cents.
Just my 2 cents.
3
Besides clinging to their guns and religion, Americans cling to misinformation. Crime is rising, the deficit is rising, Obama's a Kenyan Muslim, etc, etc. Anyone who thinks propaganda only happens in communist countries best think again, and take a good look at themselves and their own communities.
3
It is a sad period for our country when fear is greater than common sense.
3
Let's face it. The nation has a very serious gun control problem, and the NRA is the epitome of corporate enabling of gun-running and is truly a merchant of pain and suffering for so many. We have the spectacle of nearly 10,000 gun dealers found along the border between the U.S. and Mexico constituting a largely unregulated arms bazaar for Mexican drug gangs. More ominously NRA sponsored laws create a shield for illegal conduct (eg: The Protection of Lawful Commerce in Arms Act in 2005), and currently ALEC/NRA is attempting to introduce laws to criminalize legitimate investigative reporting of the gun industry.
3
There is one absolute fact that we can learn from these polls, that many of them who respond are idiots. Crime is down and has been down for a decade and yet these polltakers say that it is up. Pure stupidity.
1
All this 'the solution to a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun' tripe makes me think of the old TV series "All in the Family" starring Carroll Connor as Archie Bunker, a blue collar bigot - and played for comedy. There were airplane hijackings happening at the time and Archie had an easy solution; give everyone a loaded gun as they boarded the aircraft.
1
Since the US is not the only country where guns are made what would stop illegal guns from coming across the border just as illegal drugs do now if guns were banned in the US?
1
The NRA won't even advocate for safety features on guns. They can make guns that only will fire with the owner's handprint on it but the NRA blocks that idea. Can't they even care about children mistakenly getting a gun and firing it?
The NRA hasn't won this round. They have won. Period.
That's not to say that their work is finished. Before long there will be no background check requirements whatsoever and carrying any weapon, concealed or not, without a permit.
I never thought that Sandy Hook would result in meaningful legislation in this area. Call me a cynic, but they won years ago. Time to move on to something that's doable. Anyone up for reigning in political fund raising?
That's not to say that their work is finished. Before long there will be no background check requirements whatsoever and carrying any weapon, concealed or not, without a permit.
I never thought that Sandy Hook would result in meaningful legislation in this area. Call me a cynic, but they won years ago. Time to move on to something that's doable. Anyone up for reigning in political fund raising?
1
I’m continually amazed that the NRA (1.5 % of the US population) has such a large voice. More guns equals more gun deaths and how can that statistic make people feel safer? Background checks and registration for every gun sold would go a long way to curbing gun use in crime.
The NRA, which represents gun and firearms manufacturers, not 'Joe citizen,' seems to control the political debate when they darn well please. Remember when George W. Bush was elected in 2000, the NRA said that they will be virtually working out of the President's office.
The NRA has also become quite adept in the past 15 years or so of using the fear mongering debate, which is mainly meant towards 'those' people and those coming to get our guns, meaning the Obama Administration. (When I hear a helicopter hovering around our neighborhood, I chuckle and think that it is the black helicopters {of the UN}, filled with gurka troops, planning to land and come into our neighborhoods and take all of our guns.)
The NRA has also become quite adept in the past 15 years or so of using the fear mongering debate, which is mainly meant towards 'those' people and those coming to get our guns, meaning the Obama Administration. (When I hear a helicopter hovering around our neighborhood, I chuckle and think that it is the black helicopters {of the UN}, filled with gurka troops, planning to land and come into our neighborhoods and take all of our guns.)
The NRA is flailing, no question. It´s as convincing an indicator as any that they know this issue isn´t going away this time. It´s more than just writing on the wall. A grassroots movement is getting into gear. US firearm homicide rates 50 times higher* than most industrialized nations with gun control is intolerable.
* Office on Drugs and Crime (UNODC)/Mortality [email protected].
* Office on Drugs and Crime (UNODC)/Mortality [email protected].
1
When the marching orders of news outlets (print, TV, cable, online) are "if it bleeds it leads" there is no doubt that people think the crime rate is on the rise.
Not much can be done regarding sensible gun sale processes when the media environment is designed to show, reshow, and reshow again every instance of bleeding. Sure we have crime and any crime can be targeted for steps to minimize or eliminate the instances of it being repeated. But if paranoia is your objective the NRA gets straight A's.
Not much can be done regarding sensible gun sale processes when the media environment is designed to show, reshow, and reshow again every instance of bleeding. Sure we have crime and any crime can be targeted for steps to minimize or eliminate the instances of it being repeated. But if paranoia is your objective the NRA gets straight A's.
1
This Supreme Court has ruled that Americans have the right to own guns. End of story until we get a new Court.
1
I think that they have lost. They have lost their sense of security because of their irrational fears and think that guns are the answer. It is mirage. How sad!
Yes, the NRA has succeeded in corrupting venal, conservative politicians who lack integrity--and it has succeeded in persuading low-information Americans (of which there are many) that criminals are lurking outside their doors and that only a gun will protect them, mostly by throwing out COMPLETELY fraudulent statistics about supposed crimes stopped by gun-toting Americans. The NRA has been making up numbers for years. A GOP lawmaker in the Virginia legislature got up on floor of the House of Delegates two years ago and told a story about some elderly woman in southwest Virginia who chased off an intruder insider her house with her gun. The lawmaker claimed that the intruder later tried to sue the homeowner for shooting at him or somesuch. When he got done with his tale, the Republicans gave their colleague a standing ovation. When reporters asked the lawmaker for details about the incident--name of homeowner, location, case, etc., he was completely uncooperative--offered no supporting information. Why? Because the story was made up.
The NRA is winning by creating a self-fulling prophecy. That is, make society violent to the point that yes, everyone would end up having to carry guns. It is good for business to make guns as necessary as oxygen so everyone NEEDS to carry at least one. But where is our right as citizens to live in a safe environment without constant life annihilating threats?
For too long carrying a gun has been macho. We need to promote the view that gun carriers are cowards. The brave walk freely without guns.
1
Democrats are in such denial about the last six years and the effect it has had on the American people. Laws enacted based solely on lies, "pen and phone" legislation, and totally ignoring the will and votes of our Republic. Democrats are not trusted with our freedoms, and our guns. Throw "NRA" around all you like. They are barely part of the equation.
2
You only have to look at what is happening with Tim McGraw and the Sandy Hook Promise concert to realize that the NRA gun nuts are totally in control. Until everyday Americans get a backbone and refuse to cower before them, this nation will continue to shrug as gun violence claims more and more lives
It's time to change strategy. If you can't beat them, join them. Let's encourage every person of color to join the NRA. I'd like to see La Pierre's face when lots of black and Latino members show up at the next convention. Maybe that shifts the tone, but if not, it at least creates some internal turmoil within the NRA. $35 well spent!
Maybe Bloomberg could give memberships as gifts to folks who can't afford it.
Maybe Bloomberg could give memberships as gifts to folks who can't afford it.
5
We may not be able to stop the proliferation of guns. It seems that that particular horse has left the barn. What we need to do is to hold those who misuse or improperly secure their treasured weapons accountable. Let us say that your grandchild finds grandpa's handgun and shoots and kills his little sister. Grandpa should go to prison. Some would say that grandpa has "...suffered enough...". Not true. Grandpa is a lazy and sloppy gun owner and should not get a free pass. And what of the fellow who shoots and kills someone that he perceives as a mortal threat and it turns out that this unfortunate fellow's only crime was walking through a white neighborhood while black? A good prison sentence would go a long way toward making gun owners think twice before doing something stupid.
1
"Has the N.R.A. Won?", you ask. No, Mr. Blow, the Constitution is winning, namely, the entire section known as the Second Amendment. Apparently, some Americans still value the ideals of the Constitution and have decided that they appreciate the natural right to defend themselves against imminent threats and/or government tyranny. Luckily, we live in a great nation with a Constitution that undergirds our nature rights to defend ourselves against threats both foreign and domestic. The Constitution makes most liberals uncomfortable. Don't feel alone...
2
I've been reading "A Struggle for Power" by T. Draper, a finely detailed book on the minutiae of US - Brit relations leading up to our separation 240 years ago. Yesterday being the anniversary of Lexington & Concord, it's appropriate to reference the work in a post.
It's clear from the reading that having arms as a matter of normal life was key to our freedom. It properly reflected & fitted the spirit of the colonials by giving them a sense of empowerment along with the means. The law mandated every man be armed, have ammo, etc. The British tried to prevent their use by blockading weapons and powder, Americans responded by making their own and smuggling. It was key to our freedom. I don't believe it's key to our freedom today, but the resonance of the tradition cannot be overstated.
I don't care for guns myself. But I do care about those things valuably American, and I learn much about what those things are by reading history. I'd have to say that although it surprises me, gun ownership is as traditionally American as improving the land or speaking out for what you believe. For that reason I have to support people who wish to be armed.
Yes I understand the downside. Yes I know guns are dangerous. Read the book and think on how basically fitted gun ownership is to America.
It's clear from the reading that having arms as a matter of normal life was key to our freedom. It properly reflected & fitted the spirit of the colonials by giving them a sense of empowerment along with the means. The law mandated every man be armed, have ammo, etc. The British tried to prevent their use by blockading weapons and powder, Americans responded by making their own and smuggling. It was key to our freedom. I don't believe it's key to our freedom today, but the resonance of the tradition cannot be overstated.
I don't care for guns myself. But I do care about those things valuably American, and I learn much about what those things are by reading history. I'd have to say that although it surprises me, gun ownership is as traditionally American as improving the land or speaking out for what you believe. For that reason I have to support people who wish to be armed.
Yes I understand the downside. Yes I know guns are dangerous. Read the book and think on how basically fitted gun ownership is to America.
2
The truth is that there never was a gun debate in this country. The Second Amendment gives citizens the right to own guns. Period. End of story. What you saw was an attempt by liberals to deflect attention away from mental unstable people and towards a piece of metal. Most people see right through this attempt to restrict out inalienable rights. That's why there never was a debate. If there is an actual attempt to change the Second Amendment ... that's when the debate will have started. Until then, there wasn't even a battle. Nobody is willing to abdicate the other nine rights in the Bill of Rights ... why this one?
2
The NRA approach to gun control is like climate change denial that has worked. The statistics are clear: the more guns you have around, the more people get shot. Most shootings are accidental, a lot are suicides, some involve individuals with low control, every now and then a justifiable act of self defense, etc., but the linear relationship between having guns and the likelihood of getting shot is undeniable. I used to think that the Democratic Party should just give up and let us shoot ourselves and each other because the political hit for any attempt at gun control was just too great. Now I am rethinking that position. In the last election in Arkansas,the NRA ran ads against two Democratic candidates (both lost) who have never voted for any sort of gun control in their careers. Turns out the NRA and Republicans are attached, and Democrats are taking the hit without any regard to their actual behavior. Might as well fight for common sense.
1
This article betrays just a glimmer ofhow the anti-gun cause has shot itself in the foot (Ha!) by beating to drum on what they like to call "gun violence."
Incessant bleating about "gun violence" serves to get the average person thinking that he or she were best advised to have a care to personal safety, which for many people, means getting one's own gun.
Then of course the anti-gun side puts the frosting on the cake, by talking up the prospect of new laws making guns harder to get, and even banning some kinds of guns altogether. What does this accomplish? We now know. Many of the people who had been thinking of perhaps picking up a gun when they got around to it now decide, "Wow! I'd better get that gun RIGHT NOW!"
We are in the midst of a true mass movement, the Great Twenty-First Century Gun Bonanza. It is truly remarkable, and there is no turning back from it. The numbers of guns in private hands are astronomical, and the numbers are cumulative.
It is past time to ask if we can reverse this, now the goal is to keep as safe and peaceful as possible. Stop fighting the gun culture and embrace it. Teach gun safety in schools. Make it part of everyone's basic education. Run TV ads, billboards, signs on busses, with movie stars and sports heroes asking: "Have YOU safely stored your guns today?"
The very idea of gun control is SO Twentieth Century. Now, let us make it better
.
Incessant bleating about "gun violence" serves to get the average person thinking that he or she were best advised to have a care to personal safety, which for many people, means getting one's own gun.
Then of course the anti-gun side puts the frosting on the cake, by talking up the prospect of new laws making guns harder to get, and even banning some kinds of guns altogether. What does this accomplish? We now know. Many of the people who had been thinking of perhaps picking up a gun when they got around to it now decide, "Wow! I'd better get that gun RIGHT NOW!"
We are in the midst of a true mass movement, the Great Twenty-First Century Gun Bonanza. It is truly remarkable, and there is no turning back from it. The numbers of guns in private hands are astronomical, and the numbers are cumulative.
It is past time to ask if we can reverse this, now the goal is to keep as safe and peaceful as possible. Stop fighting the gun culture and embrace it. Teach gun safety in schools. Make it part of everyone's basic education. Run TV ads, billboards, signs on busses, with movie stars and sports heroes asking: "Have YOU safely stored your guns today?"
The very idea of gun control is SO Twentieth Century. Now, let us make it better
.
2
Handguns are fun, like shooting pool or bowling, except that the things you hit blow up into little pieces. Very exciting. I've shot handguns twice in my life, and I enjoyed it.
BUT I would never buy or own a handgun in America. I support laws that would make it impossible for me to buy a handgun and would greatly restrict ownership of long guns.
Huge numbers of Americans get killed and maimed by guns every year. Who is so monstrously selfish as to think that their little hobby is worth this horrendous amount of bloodshed, fear, and slaughter?
BUT I would never buy or own a handgun in America. I support laws that would make it impossible for me to buy a handgun and would greatly restrict ownership of long guns.
Huge numbers of Americans get killed and maimed by guns every year. Who is so monstrously selfish as to think that their little hobby is worth this horrendous amount of bloodshed, fear, and slaughter?
4
The NRA has found its groove via smart marketing to gullible/fearful Americans, preying on them with two powerful narratives: there are a bunch of bad guys out there plotting to get you, and there is an increasingly oppressive government getting ready to overtake you. It doesn’t matter that the US is a democracy, or that 30,000 Americans die every year from gun violence mostly by friends, family members or themselves. Facts don’t matter to the vulnerable. Emotions do. They react by buying and accumulating guns, ammunition, etc. so that they can be ready "when the time comes.”
An issue is that the NRA’s marketing partners (e.g., Fox News) keep misleading susceptible consumers to keep fear levels high and drive gun sales. The hope is that those scared gun-buying types eventually come to their senses.
An issue is that the NRA’s marketing partners (e.g., Fox News) keep misleading susceptible consumers to keep fear levels high and drive gun sales. The hope is that those scared gun-buying types eventually come to their senses.
3
Consider too that rightwing extremists, fueled by NRA propaganda, are far and away the biggests killers of police officers. See the ADL article "Officers Down" at blog.adl.org. with its two eye-popping graphs. Thanks to the NRA police have to live in a gun-drenched dangerous culture, and they appear to be taking it out on minorities.
1
So, the only thing that I'm sure of is that this is a complicated issue. Rather than expend emotion, resources, and political capital on trying to reshape what is permitted by the second amendment (clearly some types of firearms are not permitted - e.g., machine guns), why don't we concentrate on why we have so much violence in the US? Why would someone WANT to shoot someone else? Maybe we should pay a whole bunch of attention to this question???
2
Sadly, they've won. And they began this process, or their fellow travelers began this process, in the 1970's when money began to sponsor efforts to sway public opinion and revise history. It was subtle at first but we now can see the madness behind the method. The only question is not whether the NRA and its acolytes have won how far will they push the pendulum.
"One of the reasons cited was Americans’ inverse understanding of the reality and perception of crime in this country."
That fits those who becry gun violence and mayhem and insist that gun control is our only hope, but are apparently oblivious to the fact that US murder rates are approaching 100 year lows. More guns = less murder? Enough to make liberal heads explode!
That fits those who becry gun violence and mayhem and insist that gun control is our only hope, but are apparently oblivious to the fact that US murder rates are approaching 100 year lows. More guns = less murder? Enough to make liberal heads explode!
5
If these mass shooting incidents didn't occur naturally, the weapons industry might be tempted to go out and cause them, they are so good for business. Every time something occurs, the gun huggers run out and buy buy buy. They have gotten quite predictable, so much so that it is easy to see how they could easily be manipulated.
1
The NRA has not won. The fact is that their opponents have only barely begun to fight. Those opposed to the NRA's insanity have not yet figured out how to organize or pressure politicians effectively.
Again, a small but very vocal and well organized minority, with their insane and completely false rhetoric, is controlling the conversation.
The voices of sanity need a bigger megaphone.
Again, a small but very vocal and well organized minority, with their insane and completely false rhetoric, is controlling the conversation.
The voices of sanity need a bigger megaphone.
The issue is responsible ownership. Guns are tools. They aren't inherently evil objects.
Put any tool into the hands of someone who is not properly trained with it or who wishes to do someone harm and it becomes dangerous.
There are about 253 million cars on the road and about 1.3 million annual deaths caused by auto accidents.3287 per day. An estimated 310 million guns caused 8855 deaths in 2012.(per the FBI). 6371 of those were caused by handguns, not long guns or "assault rifles". Anyone want to ban cars?
If you are opposed to guns, it's your right not to own one.
With an average police response time of between 9 and 11 minutes, I will keep mine.
Put any tool into the hands of someone who is not properly trained with it or who wishes to do someone harm and it becomes dangerous.
There are about 253 million cars on the road and about 1.3 million annual deaths caused by auto accidents.3287 per day. An estimated 310 million guns caused 8855 deaths in 2012.(per the FBI). 6371 of those were caused by handguns, not long guns or "assault rifles". Anyone want to ban cars?
If you are opposed to guns, it's your right not to own one.
With an average police response time of between 9 and 11 minutes, I will keep mine.
4
Gun control proponents also have a misapprehension of reality.
They have irrational & unfounded fears about an "epidemic" of gun violence. When, in fact, incidents of gun violence of all sorts are down , even accidental deaths from guns are down. And both have been trending down for quite a while.
Maybe it's common sense has that has actually "won".
They have irrational & unfounded fears about an "epidemic" of gun violence. When, in fact, incidents of gun violence of all sorts are down , even accidental deaths from guns are down. And both have been trending down for quite a while.
Maybe it's common sense has that has actually "won".
5
Actually a great evil won out over a small, healthy gun safety (rifle) org. A few decades ago. Not sure how/why this happened but it became allied with rightist issues and with big $ driving the propaganda it has become an incredibly successful nightmare for America.
1
The more I read things like this the more I realize that the 2nd amendment needs to be repealed. While everyone is realistic about the prospects for this happening within our lifetimes, we must start somewhere. We must destroy forever the idea that owning a deadly weapon is somehow equivalent to peaceably speaking one's mind. It is not and anyone who is the least bit honest with themselves knows it.
3
They're winning because they have a stranglehold on how we talk about gun ownership in this country. I cannot emphasize enough the critical importance of framing the gun ownership issue as one of responsibility, not control.
Beginning with Lee Atwater and carrying forward with Karl Rove and Frank Luntz, for decades the Right have clearly understood the impact language has on the human brain's decision-making process. And in all that time, Democrats have failed to understand it while falling prey to their tactics themselves, adopting their language to argue back with them -- and losing every single time.
If we don't take control of the narrative and start using language that works for the end result we want, we will continue to lose on this front and we may as well pack it in.
How To Talk About Gun Legislation — It's 'Responsibility' Not 'Control'
http://www.winningwordsproject.com/how_to_talk_about_gun_legislation_so_...
Beginning with Lee Atwater and carrying forward with Karl Rove and Frank Luntz, for decades the Right have clearly understood the impact language has on the human brain's decision-making process. And in all that time, Democrats have failed to understand it while falling prey to their tactics themselves, adopting their language to argue back with them -- and losing every single time.
If we don't take control of the narrative and start using language that works for the end result we want, we will continue to lose on this front and we may as well pack it in.
How To Talk About Gun Legislation — It's 'Responsibility' Not 'Control'
http://www.winningwordsproject.com/how_to_talk_about_gun_legislation_so_...
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For the moment, yes. But notice that most gun deaths occur amongst the owners of guns and their relatives. Thus the gun question will eventually be resolved through evolution as the gun nut genes kill themselves off.
Republican voters and gun owners seem afflicted by the same refusal to "hear" truth and facts. To fuel their ignorance our local Arizona news channels almost invariably lead with news of shootings, home invasions and murder--probably paid for by the NRA. There is no attempt to analyze these killings or how they compare to similar events in other cities--it's scare tactics all the way, and the NRA can take it to the bank.
If we are to salvage any kind of civilized living, progressives must put the pervasive news of violence into context. If nothing is done, all of us are at risk from imbecilic gun owners.
If we are to salvage any kind of civilized living, progressives must put the pervasive news of violence into context. If nothing is done, all of us are at risk from imbecilic gun owners.
1
What's the outcome of this 'social experiment'? American civil war 2.0? This reminds me of the story of the build up to 1860. A distinct group of states in a specific area, seeing their way of life in jeopardy held the rest of America to ransom. More guns lead to civil disorder, never the opposite.
2
The NRA has been winning for decades now, they have a simple message which is easily reinforced by appealing to subtle racism. (Next year it will be less subtle sexism, I've already heard that 'Hillary will take our guns'). Our policy is backed by emotions not logic and data. We need to be willing to look at how others do it, instead, but we aren't.
1
Maybe people have finally figured out that any attempt to take away guns would result in the death of many law enforcement personnel attempting to remove guns from individuals.
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The main argument with 2nd amendment absolutists is that guns make a person safer. With 90 guns for every 100 people, the US should therefore be the safest nation on earth.
Right?
Right?
When will the Leftist media simply accept that the NRA is a teeny, tiny factor in this equation? The truth is that when Clinton declared war on the 2nd Amendment with the Brady Bill, the American public took notice and took action. It simply takes time to see those results in the statistics.
Firearms are a part of American history and folklore, giving credit to the mass growth in firearms purchases, registration (post-Brady) and usage to the NRA is like giving credit to Ronald McDonald for Americans consuming more hamburgers each year.
Firearms are a part of American history and folklore, giving credit to the mass growth in firearms purchases, registration (post-Brady) and usage to the NRA is like giving credit to Ronald McDonald for Americans consuming more hamburgers each year.
3
Dan Ackroyd recently summed up our culture succinctly when he stated that "America is flat out gun crazy". What other time in history did a nation so enthusiastically arm itself against undesirable elements both inside and outside of its territory? Germany in the 1930's comes to mind, before the anschluss. Our WWII history has us believe this is when the German people became collectively loony, when they went after ethnic minorities and invaded other countries.
A similar lunacy was evident the past couple days when a veterinarian who shot a cat dead with a bow and arrow was summarily vilified in the media and fired from her job and may also be facing criminal charges, whereas unarmed American citizens, a.k.a. fellow human beings, are shot and killed on a weekly basis by American municipalities with little media coverage and with the killers almost always being acquitted by local grand juries. Killing a cat with a bow and arrow is bad behavior, Americans killing other American citizens for petty infractions or for showing symptoms of mental illness is less of an offense than killing a cat? One could excuse foreigners like Dan Ackroyd for thinking America suffers from a cultural and social pathology?
A correction to a prior post of mine, the sanctimonious Puritans in New England primarily hung their “witches”, not burned them. So municipal (Salem etc.) sanctioned lynching of social outcasts has a 300+ year long history in our white Christian culture, even in New England.
A similar lunacy was evident the past couple days when a veterinarian who shot a cat dead with a bow and arrow was summarily vilified in the media and fired from her job and may also be facing criminal charges, whereas unarmed American citizens, a.k.a. fellow human beings, are shot and killed on a weekly basis by American municipalities with little media coverage and with the killers almost always being acquitted by local grand juries. Killing a cat with a bow and arrow is bad behavior, Americans killing other American citizens for petty infractions or for showing symptoms of mental illness is less of an offense than killing a cat? One could excuse foreigners like Dan Ackroyd for thinking America suffers from a cultural and social pathology?
A correction to a prior post of mine, the sanctimonious Puritans in New England primarily hung their “witches”, not burned them. So municipal (Salem etc.) sanctioned lynching of social outcasts has a 300+ year long history in our white Christian culture, even in New England.
1
Violent crime rates continue to drop nationwide while the President continues to see law abiding gun owners as a serious problem. It's no wonder people are buying more firearms. They're more afraid of what government will do to their rights than what a criminal might do to them. Making the NRA a boogeyman just adds fuel to the fire. And firearms laws are everywhere. Background checks are a way of life for gun purchasers. I've filled out plenty. The recent attempts to limit the availability of ammo belies the real motivations of this President and his minions. They don't want you to have a gun.
5
Right there in your commentary is the answer: close to 90% are for background checks and no doubt large majorities are for normal gun licensing and training type laws that make sure everyone who has a gun knows how to use and store it properly.
The NRA takes an advanced approach to politics and is able to use a voting block large enough to swing elections to advance its purpose. If other groups follow their lead, they could also advance a political agenda supported by a minority of voters. It's the voting block that matters and you don't need 50% support to have a block large enough to make sure people running for office think twice before they risk being put on a blacklist.
The NRA takes an advanced approach to politics and is able to use a voting block large enough to swing elections to advance its purpose. If other groups follow their lead, they could also advance a political agenda supported by a minority of voters. It's the voting block that matters and you don't need 50% support to have a block large enough to make sure people running for office think twice before they risk being put on a blacklist.
In Texas, our state legislature has made it possible for guns to be carried almost anywhere except in the capitol building where they themselves work. I think they should be willing to have guns in the capitol where they work, since they have made it okay for guns to be carried into places where other people work. Perhaps we need to have a referendum to make this happen during the next election cycle.
1
I am required to be tested on my ability to drive safely and obey traffic laws, periodically renew my license and register my car, something that is designed to transport me from location to location. I can go to a gun shop and with a basic background check, or to a gun show or personal seller and without any check, purchase a lethal weapon with no testing, no training and no further checks to see that I have that weapon and maintain it in a safe condition.
What is wrong with this picture?
What is wrong with this picture?
2
Free speech? Or free salesmanship?
It's the gun lobby. Representatives who are paid handsomely to promote gun ownership and the lifting of restrictions. They pressure their political constituents. And they advertise like crazy, convincing Americans that it's your solemn right and DUTY to own a gun.
The lobby was intended to promote fair representation. But it has been abused to the utmost these days, in so many areas (not just the unrestricted right to bear arms). The clever and powerful figured it out and have gamed the system. However, those who we have elected into office to prevent this kind of corruption have allowed themselves to be seduced and go along for the ride.
Where is the bastion of sensibility in this country? I'm waiting for 60 Minutes to do an expose on US government lobbying. It would be telling, I'm sure.
It's the gun lobby. Representatives who are paid handsomely to promote gun ownership and the lifting of restrictions. They pressure their political constituents. And they advertise like crazy, convincing Americans that it's your solemn right and DUTY to own a gun.
The lobby was intended to promote fair representation. But it has been abused to the utmost these days, in so many areas (not just the unrestricted right to bear arms). The clever and powerful figured it out and have gamed the system. However, those who we have elected into office to prevent this kind of corruption have allowed themselves to be seduced and go along for the ride.
Where is the bastion of sensibility in this country? I'm waiting for 60 Minutes to do an expose on US government lobbying. It would be telling, I'm sure.
Nobody has "won" by allowing almost anyone, including children, the mentally ill, and criminals who have no felony convictions, to own use guns. In fact, the almost unlimited right to own a gun constitutes a de facto right to commit, at least, one murder since no one can lose her or his rights to gun ownership unless he or she is convicted of a felony. And since most states refuses to cooperate with other states to keep guns out of the hands of convicted felons, even the ban on gun ownership by felons is meaningless. Thanks to the NRA, the best friends organized crime and terrorists ever had, we are ALL losers.
Most gun deaths are suicides. Most gun homicides are bad guys shooting other bad guys. Though the numbers are terribly high, most Americans are not directly affected by gun deaths. Even the suicides don't result in knee-jerk response of blaming the firearm.
The current American zeitgeist does not lean towards wider gun control laws and attempts to introduce them will fail with or without the NRA. If that attittude changes in the future the NRA will be helpless to prevent it. In the meanwhile, it is not on the table of American concerns.
The current American zeitgeist does not lean towards wider gun control laws and attempts to introduce them will fail with or without the NRA. If that attittude changes in the future the NRA will be helpless to prevent it. In the meanwhile, it is not on the table of American concerns.
2
Frustratingly and maddeningly the short answer is yes. The NRA won this era of the gun debate. We may be at least a generation away from a constructive solution oriented approach including legislation. They have been wickedly effective at framing the debate on their terms and driving legislation that supports only their view. The rest of us who disagree with the gun madness have been unable to move the needle.
2
Regardless of your opinion of the 2nd Amendment and gun ownership by law abiding citizens.... the NRA has not won anything.
It's the vast majority of Americans who are rational enough to not let a handful of tragic incidents, and the constant, never-ending exploitation of those tragedies by the Media to influence their judgment that have won.
One has to wonder what is wrong with this country when the 2nd Amendment of the Constitution, that guarantees the fundamental right of self defense, and provides a means to ward off tyranny by the Government, has become (to some) a contest of good and evil, or right and wrong.
The United States is still a democratic republic and the will of the vast majority is to honor, and not attempt to limit the 2nd Amendment, not bow to the will of the minority who feel that they know whats best for everyone if they like it or not.
It's the vast majority of Americans who are rational enough to not let a handful of tragic incidents, and the constant, never-ending exploitation of those tragedies by the Media to influence their judgment that have won.
One has to wonder what is wrong with this country when the 2nd Amendment of the Constitution, that guarantees the fundamental right of self defense, and provides a means to ward off tyranny by the Government, has become (to some) a contest of good and evil, or right and wrong.
The United States is still a democratic republic and the will of the vast majority is to honor, and not attempt to limit the 2nd Amendment, not bow to the will of the minority who feel that they know whats best for everyone if they like it or not.
3
If it were remotely possible to completely eliminate private ownership of guns in America, I would be for it. (Sorry honest hunters and recreational shooters, you too. You gotta take one for the team here.)
But if we ban guns, the last remaining weapons will inevitably (almost by definition) be in the hands of criminals. We will have made the problem infinitely worse.
The genie is out of the bottle. We are a gun nation. We should recognize the fact and seek to make ourselves a safe gun nation.
But if we ban guns, the last remaining weapons will inevitably (almost by definition) be in the hands of criminals. We will have made the problem infinitely worse.
The genie is out of the bottle. We are a gun nation. We should recognize the fact and seek to make ourselves a safe gun nation.
1
What no one is willing to admit is all of the recent mass shootings have been committed by people who are mentally ill. We do not have a gun problem in the U.S. but a mental health problem that no one is willing to acknowledge. None of the recent proposed legislation would have stopped any of the recent mass shootings. If you want to stop gun violence in cities do a search for
"project exile" it worked and was the only program lauded by the Brady gun control group and the NRA.
"project exile" it worked and was the only program lauded by the Brady gun control group and the NRA.
3
We Americans are not very brave and choose to live in fear whether it is fear of crime or fear of loosing something even if its a gun. When guns are allowed to be brought into the Halls of Congress we will see gun restrictions enacted. Until then the rest of us will have to live with the prospect of them in our midst and play roulette with our lives.
“In the week after the shooting, Fox News reported that the N.R.A. was claiming an average of 8,000 new members a day. High-profile mass shootings are often followed by periods of increased interest in the N.R.A., but representatives said this rate was higher than usual.”
Are we really going to accept this as fact, given Fox's love affair with "facts"? Maybe the NRA's membership did increase, but I seriously doubt it was by this much, given the source of the information. Secondly, is it known for sure that the increase in weapons sales was for new gun owners, or was it people who already owned guns buying more because, you know, the gummiint is going to take them all away from us and we need to beef up our supplies?
Or maybe I'm just so depressed by this column that I'm trying to make up some good news about the increase in gun sales. It makes me sad all over again.
Are we really going to accept this as fact, given Fox's love affair with "facts"? Maybe the NRA's membership did increase, but I seriously doubt it was by this much, given the source of the information. Secondly, is it known for sure that the increase in weapons sales was for new gun owners, or was it people who already owned guns buying more because, you know, the gummiint is going to take them all away from us and we need to beef up our supplies?
Or maybe I'm just so depressed by this column that I'm trying to make up some good news about the increase in gun sales. It makes me sad all over again.
Ignorance and irrationality are certainly part of the problem, as is the climate of fear whipped up hourly by Fox News and its friends. But someday someone will be bold enough to point out the connection between sexual insecurity and anxiety and the need to own a phallic symbol so big you have to hold it with both hands.
1
Patriarchy and gun ownership are closely linked. White men's increasing fear of losing their dominance will result in more gun ownership.
2
It seems that, at least in urban areas, the main gun buyers are paranoids, cowards and criminals.
1
You don't get to pick and choose which of the Bill of Rights we get and which we don't based on your personal opinion.
And quit tarring decent people who own guns with the NRA. Its not all looney out there.
And quit tarring decent people who own guns with the NRA. Its not all looney out there.
3
I wonder if there are any comments opposing more restriction on guns.
It might be helpful when there are so many if NYT divided them, pro & con.
Has anyone said ---we need our own gun for protection from crime inasmuch as the police seem unable to protect us adequately?
Just curious.
It might be helpful when there are so many if NYT divided them, pro & con.
Has anyone said ---we need our own gun for protection from crime inasmuch as the police seem unable to protect us adequately?
Just curious.
1
Not so fast on proclaiming the NRA a winner. What often goes unreported, and what the NRA will never advertise, is that gun ownership per household has dropped significantly from the 1970s, from 50% to around 32% in 2014, according to a GSS survey (www.norc.org/Research/Projects/Pages/general-social-survey.aspx. What this means is that fewer people own more and more guns. The decline of the household gun is what has led the NRA to heighten its rhetoric about the fear of criminal behavior, which leads to a surge of gun purchases---but only by a minority. Yet this minority is so vocal, and has such strong lobbyists---all of them connected to gun manufacturers---that they are able to sway politicians away from any kind of gun control. The NRA is winning with PR, but not with gun ownership per household.
Charles Blow has great difficulty comprehending complicated phrases such as " shall not be infringed"
3
An example of the irrational politics of Fear.
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Most gun owners worry about crime only and not accidents or suicides that are more likely to be completed in the presence of guns. But the steady onslaught of gun death stories creates a vicious cycle. It is the very presence of guns that correlates with gun deaths and at the same time increases the perception that one needs a gun for self defense. When is the NRA going to get it that yes, there are lots of shootings to "protect" oneself against, but those shootings are a self fulfilling prophecy...a product of rampant gun ownership itself?
4
Don't forget the popularity of the TV show Walking Dead. Have sales of compound bows increased as well?
It is darn near impossible to break fools from the chains they revere. Households have lost loved ones, in many cases more than one, households had have people's lives changed forever by gun injuries, fortunes have been lost in wages and in medical expenses and yet they still must not only have their guns, but have their little kids running around firing them in the air in proof of how safe they are--just toys they tell us.
Forget about the fact that you are more likely to be hit by lightening than you are to have a gun in your hand on that day, which for 99.9% of all gun owners never comes, when you are face to face with a criminal and fear for your life.
The much more likely scenario is that of a gun accident and from what I understand if there is no gun in the home there can be no gun accident in the home...
Forget about the fact that you are more likely to be hit by lightening than you are to have a gun in your hand on that day, which for 99.9% of all gun owners never comes, when you are face to face with a criminal and fear for your life.
The much more likely scenario is that of a gun accident and from what I understand if there is no gun in the home there can be no gun accident in the home...
3
This won't get past the censor, but I'll try anyhow, 'cause it's the truth
For all the anti-gunners who would like to see all guns confiscated, just be patient. The imposition of Martial law is in your future. It's only a matter of when, not if. A short reading of history will bear this out. Many own guns in anticipation of this. It remains to be seen how they react to tyrannical seizure efforts. I'm hopeful that many of them have read Patrick Henry.
For all the anti-gunners who would like to see all guns confiscated, just be patient. The imposition of Martial law is in your future. It's only a matter of when, not if. A short reading of history will bear this out. Many own guns in anticipation of this. It remains to be seen how they react to tyrannical seizure efforts. I'm hopeful that many of them have read Patrick Henry.
3
America is awash in soft drugs -hard drugs -psychoactive stimulents - booze - child poverty - underemployed and growing inequality!
Apocalyptic themes are ubiquitous in our culture and for good reason.
Folks don't want to be the ones left without self protection when the sociopaths are running around looting and pillaging and the feds are just standing around scared like they were with Bundy in Texas.
Apocalyptic themes are ubiquitous in our culture and for good reason.
Folks don't want to be the ones left without self protection when the sociopaths are running around looting and pillaging and the feds are just standing around scared like they were with Bundy in Texas.
1
Perhaps we're going about this the wrong way. Maybe the majority of us who favor gun control should all take out memberships in the NRA. We've had no success fighting them from the outside - maybe we could subvert them within.
5
Emotion, not reason. Emotional reactions are new in our history. What's new is the 24/7 constant drumbeat of media concentration on shootings. Reason would conclude that something is amiss. However, Barney Frank quotes Adlai Stevenson about reason. A voter told Adlai that he would get the votes of all 'thinking' people. Adlai replied that was nice but he really needed to get a majority.
Sad, isn't it? In the meantime, the NRA is protecting your 2nd Amendment right to be shot by a gun-totin' idiot!
Sad, isn't it? In the meantime, the NRA is protecting your 2nd Amendment right to be shot by a gun-totin' idiot!
1
Thank you NRA for turning America into Beirut; their Republican enablers are doing all they can to complete the transformation by getting rid of health care, social security, minimum wage, etc. etc.
2
The worst crimes are committed by white middle class kids whose families own guns and obviously don't store them safely. Does the NRA proudly advocate lack of responsibility on gun owners? Next comes the illegally obtained guns, often bought at gun shows and passed to those who cannot buy them. Does the NRA not know this basic loophole? Then comes the accidents caused by children handling loaded guns, and remember that women whose toddler pulled one out of her purse? Back to the first question.
If the 2nd amendment requires a revision, go for it.
If the 2nd amendment requires a revision, go for it.
1
Sadly, who we are as a nation is who we are and it will probably be our demise.
3
In this country, you'll never outlaw gun ownership. It's time to make the punishment for using a gun in a crime more severe. How about 'Life without parole," for any crime committed using a gun? That should stop them in their tracks!!!
So, mass murder is good for the NRA? Got it. Americans seem to react counterintuitively to many things. The best way to get teenagers to smoke? Tell them they can't. The best way to get people not to vote? Tell them they should. The best way to get people to buy more gas guzzlers? Tell them we have an energy crisis. Etc. Etc.
3
Blow speaks of the NRA as if it were some soulless entity with a mind and goal of its own.
It's not. It's people, organized to prevent the erosion of what our Constitution declares a fundamental right. It's the people who have won.
If you want to change the Constitution then campaign for that goal. Campaigning against some mythic monolithic entity labelled "NRA" is polarizing per se and actually strengthens that organization, as those who favor gun rights see your attack as potentially limiting those rights, and join the NRA because they see that as the most effective approach to preventing that.
It's not. It's people, organized to prevent the erosion of what our Constitution declares a fundamental right. It's the people who have won.
If you want to change the Constitution then campaign for that goal. Campaigning against some mythic monolithic entity labelled "NRA" is polarizing per se and actually strengthens that organization, as those who favor gun rights see your attack as potentially limiting those rights, and join the NRA because they see that as the most effective approach to preventing that.
27
Gambling legal, Marijuana about to be legalized nation wide to raise revenue.
Advanced semi automatic and many arms now legal even though we have high murder rates and gun crimes. Why not legalize cocaine and heroin through government programs ? Anyone with an addiction could get treatment instead of buying from drug dealers? Place a tax on the product sold to pay for their treatment. Would crime fall if drug addicts could get their fix from the government instead of committing crimes? How would gangs survive?
Currently there are guns all over the country, crime and random shootings occur daily mostly in low income areas with high drug sales. Get to the root of the problem , get rid of illegal drug sales through legalization. and the demand for guns will fall.
Advanced semi automatic and many arms now legal even though we have high murder rates and gun crimes. Why not legalize cocaine and heroin through government programs ? Anyone with an addiction could get treatment instead of buying from drug dealers? Place a tax on the product sold to pay for their treatment. Would crime fall if drug addicts could get their fix from the government instead of committing crimes? How would gangs survive?
Currently there are guns all over the country, crime and random shootings occur daily mostly in low income areas with high drug sales. Get to the root of the problem , get rid of illegal drug sales through legalization. and the demand for guns will fall.
1
There's another opinion I haven't heard voiced. It's too late for gun control. It's a moot argument. There are (reportedly) between 270 million to 310 million guns in America. I say reportedly because guns can't even be counted to the nearest 10 million. Comparisons to other nations are irrelevant - they implemented gun control laws decades ago. Gun control in America is about 50 years and 200 million guns too late. The toothpaste is out of the tube; the ship has sailed; the barn door was left open too long.
2
The problem is one of perception versus reality. Clearly the NRA has the edge here on creating a nation full of fear. So, why aren't the rest of us doing exactly the opposite? In addition to blocking NRA-backed legislation we should, at the same time, be delivering messages with the truth about crime, college campus safety, actual misuse of guns versus their defensive uses, etc. Where are the PSAs about safe handling of guns (as in safe driving, drinking responsibly, non-smoking, etc.)? This is the all-out campaign that is sorely needed.
2
"Furthermore, it used to be that the people most worried about crime favored stricter gun control, but now, they tend to desire keeping the laws as they are or loosening gun control."
Could this be because the "people" have finally realized that stricter gun "control" has absolutely no effect upon criminal action?
That criminals are going to get firearms despite any laws to the contrary is a given in every country, even those which have total civilian firearms bans, is a given. To see this, one need only look to the country to our immediate South, Mexico. There the drug cartels get fully automatic weapons from disaffected members of the Mexican military, or smuggle them in from out of country. Just as would occur here in the US if a total ban, the dream of all anti-gun groups, were allowed to be enacted.
So, I don't know it the NRA has won, but as long as it and its members are active in defending the Second Amendment the Nation will win.
Could this be because the "people" have finally realized that stricter gun "control" has absolutely no effect upon criminal action?
That criminals are going to get firearms despite any laws to the contrary is a given in every country, even those which have total civilian firearms bans, is a given. To see this, one need only look to the country to our immediate South, Mexico. There the drug cartels get fully automatic weapons from disaffected members of the Mexican military, or smuggle them in from out of country. Just as would occur here in the US if a total ban, the dream of all anti-gun groups, were allowed to be enacted.
So, I don't know it the NRA has won, but as long as it and its members are active in defending the Second Amendment the Nation will win.
3
Does any organization track what proportion of gun crime and gun accidents are caused by guns registered to those who have permits to own or carry? I seldom see that particular piece of information in news coverage of intentional or accidental shootings carried out by non-police shooters. If this information is not being regularly tracked and analyzed, then we are losing a lot of leverage to argue against wholesale gun and ammunition availability. I never thought I would say this, but if gun owners/carriers are truly law-abiding and their duly permitted guns are never involved in gun violence, perhaps they have a point. If that is not the case, where are the banner headlines screaming with those numbers?
1
The NRA argues that guns are necessary for our self defense. Gun control people argue that legal gun ownership is the cause of our violent gun culture. Both sides are a little bit right. But mostly, gun violence is caused by violent criminals and can only be effectively addressed by effective law enforcement and effective social reform. Guns, on the whole, don't cause crimes and making them illegal doesn't end crime. It's far more important to deal with the criminals, than the guns.
3
Constitutional rights and freedom generally win, unless liberals totally control the media. In this case, the NRA is such a large, well financed organization that the media have been unable to control the sole content that Americans consider. Unfortunately on many other issues there are not yet powerful organizations willing to fight for freedom, and on those issues the liberals still predominate.
2
It is the media. I follow the news in my old home town of St Louis, Mo. Nearly every day there's a prominently featured story in the Post Dispatch of a shooting or of a bullet riddled body found in an alley or vacant lot. What's missing in these stories is a comparison of the murder rate in 2015 with, say, 1990. So it's not surprising that people feel like they should carry a concealed weapon when any activity takes them into the city.
2
appreciate that Mr. Blow is writing about the reality of the situation, i.e. from the data, that more occurrence/reporting of gun atrocities is leading to more purchase of guns and a continuing high rate of gun related deaths in the U.S., and on a daily basis. Also reported here is that the unrestricted campaign finance laws we now have further leverages the gun industries' influence to sell more guns. They can buy more and bigger lies in political campaigns on behalf of their candidates, which they apparently own.
1
The core of the opposition's argument is that "the people" means the government. It doesn't. In every other place where the words, "the people" appear in the Bill of Rights, it means individuals, not the government.
From there forward, the gun rights crowd has all the better arguments.
If the mayor wants to violate the constitution and do something about guns, then he can conduct an illegal, home-to-home shake down of the whole city. None of the evidence can be used in prosecutions because the searches would all be illegal, but none of the guns and other contraband would be returned.
From there forward, the gun rights crowd has all the better arguments.
If the mayor wants to violate the constitution and do something about guns, then he can conduct an illegal, home-to-home shake down of the whole city. None of the evidence can be used in prosecutions because the searches would all be illegal, but none of the guns and other contraband would be returned.
2
It's my right to put my family and my guests at risk from an loaded and unsecured firearm at my house.
If someone dies, "oops, it's my bad".
Such ideas may have suited primitive societies, and are today still held by primitive minds.
If someone dies, "oops, it's my bad".
Such ideas may have suited primitive societies, and are today still held by primitive minds.
3
Yet another instance of the 24 hour news cycle amplifying and sensationalizing our problems with mass shootings, bringing on fear, and in turn, creating a more than ever misinformed public. Politicians can scare people and use hyperbolic statements to induce belief that we will always be in personal, physical danger if we don't carry a firearm. I worry more about the idiot that doesn't know how to use their gun confidently making a mistake like the "deputy for a day" that thought his taser was a gun. Misinformation sways elections. How disappointing that our fellow citizens can be persuaded so easily without doing their homework.
4
We do not need gun control. We need Mental Illness Control. We also need to do away with repeat offenders using guns to commit crimes. We need to start educating them the first time they are convicted on how to live in society and the rules they and we must follow. On their nest conviction we just execute them because they have proven they can not live by societies rules and are proven to be a harm to mandkind.
1
Let us not forget that our lax gun laws are allowing many of these delusional nuts to build basement arsenals, which they imagine will one day be used to fight the "overreaching" federal government. This is the rhetoric pushed incessantly by right-wing media and the NRA, and we can safely expect that someday it will lead to something terrible. When it does, these organizations, which have relentlessly stoked paranoia and fear of the government, will claim that they are not responsible for the monster they created.
3
Our "progressives" make up rights that don't exist in the Constitution i.e. gay marriage, health care for all paid by me, minimum wage, etc. They then oppose rights that are specifically protected by the constitution, free speech, freedom of religion, and the right to own guns. It is obvious to me that "progressives" simply do not like the Constitution.
4
The thing about gun related violence is that it's so much broader than just murder. It also encompasses muggings, robberies, rape, burglaries and assault. And then you have the costs which come with the backlash against these typically gun enabled crimes, which often involve the overuse of force by police, stand your ground type killings, and more often than not cases where people who bought a gun for defense against a criminal either kill or are killed by a family member in a fit of irrational anger.
If you trace the problem back to its root then, the problem isn't law abiding citizens who buy guns for defense. It's criminals who use guns to carry out their crimes. And despite the total drop in the murder rate, gun related crimes, particularly property related crimes, are on the rise. And when gun enabled property crime increasingly hits the citizens of gentrifying cities and diversifying burbs, you can be certain the residents will arm up and support the NRA even more.
So why not go after criminals who use guns to commit crimes? Many of them use unlicensed or stolen weapons. Why not make penalties extremely severe when they do this? Similar to how stiff mandatory minimums quashed the repeat offender and crack cocaine driven crime spike of the late 80s and 90s, I imagine tougher laws against gun-crime will drive down all crime even farther. And this will result in people feeling safer, and will result in fewer people feeling the need to own a gun.
If you trace the problem back to its root then, the problem isn't law abiding citizens who buy guns for defense. It's criminals who use guns to carry out their crimes. And despite the total drop in the murder rate, gun related crimes, particularly property related crimes, are on the rise. And when gun enabled property crime increasingly hits the citizens of gentrifying cities and diversifying burbs, you can be certain the residents will arm up and support the NRA even more.
So why not go after criminals who use guns to commit crimes? Many of them use unlicensed or stolen weapons. Why not make penalties extremely severe when they do this? Similar to how stiff mandatory minimums quashed the repeat offender and crack cocaine driven crime spike of the late 80s and 90s, I imagine tougher laws against gun-crime will drive down all crime even farther. And this will result in people feeling safer, and will result in fewer people feeling the need to own a gun.
2
I am a gun owner. Over the last several years, nothing I have received from the NRA has indicated that violence is on the rise. On the contrary, the NRA consistently has reported that violence is at an all time low.
The media on the other hand has stepped up it's reporting of crime, especially gun related crime. For example, JOE NOCERA was running a daily column showing all the gun related deaths. Mainstream media reporting has got people thinking that gun violence is on the rise.
Most gun owners I know think that violence has been going down in this country. Their biggest worry is that the govt will pass laws prohibiting gun ownership.
Non-gun owners are the ones who think gun violence is going up. The poll referred to indicated that "63 percent of Americans". That includes bother gun owners and non-gun owners. And the vast majority of Americans are not gun owners. Charles Blow and most of the commenters I have read are inferring that it is gun owners that believe that violence is rising instead of falling.
Politicians who want gun control constantly emphasize gun violence. If mainstream media and Politicians talked about how gun violence is way down, then there would be far less support for gun control. If the problem is going down without new gun laws, then why do we need more gun laws?
Even though violence is falling in this country, I believe that it is way to high. But I believe that solving this problem requires a different strategy than just more gun laws.
The media on the other hand has stepped up it's reporting of crime, especially gun related crime. For example, JOE NOCERA was running a daily column showing all the gun related deaths. Mainstream media reporting has got people thinking that gun violence is on the rise.
Most gun owners I know think that violence has been going down in this country. Their biggest worry is that the govt will pass laws prohibiting gun ownership.
Non-gun owners are the ones who think gun violence is going up. The poll referred to indicated that "63 percent of Americans". That includes bother gun owners and non-gun owners. And the vast majority of Americans are not gun owners. Charles Blow and most of the commenters I have read are inferring that it is gun owners that believe that violence is rising instead of falling.
Politicians who want gun control constantly emphasize gun violence. If mainstream media and Politicians talked about how gun violence is way down, then there would be far less support for gun control. If the problem is going down without new gun laws, then why do we need more gun laws?
Even though violence is falling in this country, I believe that it is way to high. But I believe that solving this problem requires a different strategy than just more gun laws.
7
And if you are not a lover of guns, here’s a truly scary statistic. Only 35% of US households own guns. In 2014, there were about 123.2 million households in the United States. The lowest estimate of the number of privately owned guns in the US is 270 million. That means that about 43 million households in the US have a at least one gun present, but the total averages out to about 6 guns per household. Since we know most homes have only one gun present, this means there are many household that are virtual armories, with thousands of guns present. This is a pathology, a true illness.
4
Dim witted, jittery, FOX devotee, gun zealots - the characterizations are simple and convenient, but far from exclusively correct.
I was a homeowner in the liberal enclave of Princeton for many years, a professor of mathematics, and I share many values those things tend to represent, I express those values through my (almost exclusively democratic) vote.
Though I see the NRA a bit like the "Franklin Mint" of fear, I am a member and I support them regularly, and I am not an outlier.
Until people understand why, I believe the NRA will continue to 'win'.
I was a homeowner in the liberal enclave of Princeton for many years, a professor of mathematics, and I share many values those things tend to represent, I express those values through my (almost exclusively democratic) vote.
Though I see the NRA a bit like the "Franklin Mint" of fear, I am a member and I support them regularly, and I am not an outlier.
Until people understand why, I believe the NRA will continue to 'win'.
17
We are becoming an increasingly aggressive and angry society in how we go about our lives in the most subtle and often not so subtle ways. To often on the go, to overly stimulated (a dependency on our devices, TV's on everywhere ... ) and now with weaponry so readily available it is quite troublesome to know the potential so many people have to cross the line from having aggressive behavior to acting in a disastrously violent way. I hope this gun mania is just part of larger shift, sometimes in life we have to go backwards a little before heading forth in the right direction. Otherwise we are just proving that as americans we are foolish, destructive and irresponsible, and further adding to our national decline.
4
It seems those who end up with gun conflicts fit one of three scenarios: 1.) They already own a gun and they get into some sort of fracas where those involved feel the only alternative is a violent response (this includes shooting a burglar) 2). The individuals are hanging out late at night or with groups of other people carrying guns, or 3.) they are an innocent bystander or African American being stopped by a police officer The only category that hits the individual not carrying a gun is the third. Interestingly, my neighborhood has had one burglary in the 20 years we've lived there. Guess what was stolen?
1
The title of this article could have been "Have the Special Interests won?" The NRA does not represent gun owners, it represents gun manufacturers who profit every time a gun is sold. The NRA is particularly egregious because they resort to fear, intimidation, dishonesty and racism to make a profit, but in terms of the big picture they are no different than the coal, oil, agriculture industries and Wall Street. They profit at the expense of the rest of us. The US government is a wholly owned subsidiary of big business and our elected officials are too cowardly to do anything about it.
2
Okay, we get it. All these comments about how gun control works in other countries. Fine, we are not "other countries", we are who we are, and this is the reality we now must confront. As C.B. notes, and we all know, shootings only exacerbate the situation - one can only imagine that if someone plugged LaPierre sales would be even more stratospheric!
No, like any psychological issue, the answer lies within - within each of us as individuals, and within our society. Guns represent what too many Americans lack, namely control. Fewer and fewer of us have long-term confidence in much of anything, especially since the Great Recession. With job insecurity, financial insecurity, and sensational media bombardment of all kinds comes emotional insecurity. "And by god, if it's the last thing I do, I'm gonna show 'them' "!
The rise in gun ownership lies in ever-increasing insecurity. And that stems from the on-going bifurcation of our society - the technologically skilled versus the unskilled, the haves versus the have-nots, hell, even the "makers" versus the "takers".
We need balance in this country. Things like Citizens United do not help. This is not a Darwinian world. The weak are not going to just die off. No, they're going with guns blazing.
No, like any psychological issue, the answer lies within - within each of us as individuals, and within our society. Guns represent what too many Americans lack, namely control. Fewer and fewer of us have long-term confidence in much of anything, especially since the Great Recession. With job insecurity, financial insecurity, and sensational media bombardment of all kinds comes emotional insecurity. "And by god, if it's the last thing I do, I'm gonna show 'them' "!
The rise in gun ownership lies in ever-increasing insecurity. And that stems from the on-going bifurcation of our society - the technologically skilled versus the unskilled, the haves versus the have-nots, hell, even the "makers" versus the "takers".
We need balance in this country. Things like Citizens United do not help. This is not a Darwinian world. The weak are not going to just die off. No, they're going with guns blazing.
1
I live on 20 acres is rural Florida. On all four sides of my property I hear gun fire from neighbors doing 'target' practice. This is most prevalent on weekends but also sometimes during the week. I have two deputy sheriffs that live directly to my North. I had to threaten a lawsuit to stop off duty police use of a 'target' practice with newly acquired military caliber weapons. Their 'target' was set up about 30 feet from my fence line and was aimed at the West third of my property. A 15 degree misfire would have sent bullets through my french glass doors. It was terrifying. The NRA and GOP has succeeded in convincing Floridians they need to be armed and at the ready at all times. The NRA has written most of the gun laws in Florida over the past 10 years beginning with the Stand Your Ground Law. Don't vacation in Florida, it's too dangerous!
3
Mr. Blow:
While I support reasonable gun control, I see the major impediment to such legislation is on the part of those who want it. Gun control advocates always approach this issue as a fight between good and evil, reason against ignorance, maturity against childishness. The adversarial bitterness is very much like the struggle over abortion rights.
This will continue until people who are actually thoughoughly familar with guns and the gun culture are involved in the legislative process. Gun control laws are usually written by advocates who are wholly ignorant of guns. The legislation is often rightfully ridiculed by gun supporters.
It may seem stupidly irrelevant to control advocates that they do not know the difference between a "clip" and a "magazine", but, such ignorance inspires no confidence that such ignorance can write sensible laws. Gun owners use this lack of knowledge to mock and ridicule all gun laws.
It is akin to the fundamentalist Christian right's position on a woman's right to choose: woman shouldn't have those rights because they are the problem. No one wants to say it, but, the gun control movement has many hysterical nervous nellies who don't know or care to know anything about guns. Their counterparts in the gun culture, like them, are just as ignorant and hysterical. This is not a recipe for mutual understanding and compromise.
While I support reasonable gun control, I see the major impediment to such legislation is on the part of those who want it. Gun control advocates always approach this issue as a fight between good and evil, reason against ignorance, maturity against childishness. The adversarial bitterness is very much like the struggle over abortion rights.
This will continue until people who are actually thoughoughly familar with guns and the gun culture are involved in the legislative process. Gun control laws are usually written by advocates who are wholly ignorant of guns. The legislation is often rightfully ridiculed by gun supporters.
It may seem stupidly irrelevant to control advocates that they do not know the difference between a "clip" and a "magazine", but, such ignorance inspires no confidence that such ignorance can write sensible laws. Gun owners use this lack of knowledge to mock and ridicule all gun laws.
It is akin to the fundamentalist Christian right's position on a woman's right to choose: woman shouldn't have those rights because they are the problem. No one wants to say it, but, the gun control movement has many hysterical nervous nellies who don't know or care to know anything about guns. Their counterparts in the gun culture, like them, are just as ignorant and hysterical. This is not a recipe for mutual understanding and compromise.
2
The NRA enjoys massive influence on gun laws and their enforcement, easing restrictions on firearms and in curtailing gov´t´s gun control capability. This influence is appallingly widespread and all pervasive at all levels be it federal, state, or municipal. Examples include:
- allowing concealed weapons in parks, bars, and churches
- restricting doctors from counselling patients in gun safety
- barring fees for background checks
- overturning Amtrak´s ban on carrying weapons
- shielding gun makers, dealers, and trade assocations from liability
lawsuits involving guns used in crime
- exempting guns from Consumer Product Safety Commission safety regulation (the only US product not subject to this federal oversight)
- blocking Obama´s director appointment to the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives (ATF) that regulates the gun industry (unfilled for 8 yrs) and restricting funding
to the bureau that hasn´t budged since 1973!
The "stand your ground" laws are just the latest salvo in a non-stop offensive being waged by the NRA to give every white supremacist the right to carry guns and shoot innocents on sight, without consequence. It's yet another disgusting and disgraceful example of how low the GOP has sunk. I find it amazing that Americans are stupid enough to put up with stuff like this.
- allowing concealed weapons in parks, bars, and churches
- restricting doctors from counselling patients in gun safety
- barring fees for background checks
- overturning Amtrak´s ban on carrying weapons
- shielding gun makers, dealers, and trade assocations from liability
lawsuits involving guns used in crime
- exempting guns from Consumer Product Safety Commission safety regulation (the only US product not subject to this federal oversight)
- blocking Obama´s director appointment to the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives (ATF) that regulates the gun industry (unfilled for 8 yrs) and restricting funding
to the bureau that hasn´t budged since 1973!
The "stand your ground" laws are just the latest salvo in a non-stop offensive being waged by the NRA to give every white supremacist the right to carry guns and shoot innocents on sight, without consequence. It's yet another disgusting and disgraceful example of how low the GOP has sunk. I find it amazing that Americans are stupid enough to put up with stuff like this.
2
Yesterday, a pastor in Seattle reported via Facebook that her front door porch window was shattered and a slug was embedded in the outside wall of their house - on the other side of which slept her eight year old daughter. They called the Seattle police department who came to investigatge. They characterized it as a random drive by shooting. A house several blocks away also suffered a similar incident on the same night. I believe our country has far, far too many guns in private ownership. These guns do NOT make us safe. In this case, no one was physically hurt, but this family was nevertheless traumatized by the violence. Their buying their own gun would not help at all - it would only add to the violence potential. While at one time the Second
Amendment served a good purpose, at this point, I believe it is the already germinated seed for destruction of this once great nation. I mourn its loss.
Amendment served a good purpose, at this point, I believe it is the already germinated seed for destruction of this once great nation. I mourn its loss.
1
We have become a culture inured to the truth and moved only by the easily understood mis-truth. The country has never been safer from a crime standpoint, but most American live in deathly fear of random crime. Some point to the downturn in crime and attribute it to the increase in private gun ownership as the reason for the decline, which is so untrue as to be laughable. Most private guns involved in a shooting incident are used on an acquaintance of the gun owner or the gun owner themselves. Many more accidental shootings and deaths occur than legitimate self-defense cases. The drop in crime is attributable to better forensic science, cameras everywhere, long prison sentences, and an aging population. The rise in gun ownership is attributable to an amazing marketing campaign by the gun manufactures and a bought and paid for legislative body at both the state and federal government levels. Add to that almost every show on TV has a scene where there is a gun pointed right at the screen, fueling a toxic love affair with guns and violence in the US. At this point, all we can hope for is that enough accidental and stupid gun deaths will occur to break the fever and allow a return to some level of sanity when it comes to gun ownership in this country. I’m not holding my breath.
The NRA's response to the Newtown massacre was an epiphany like the moment in the movie Independence Day when President Whitmore mindmelds with an invader and instantly understands just how evil they are. We can no more afford psychopaths running the arms industry than we can afford psychopaths running the police or the military, and it is necessary to take steps to disqualify psychopaths from these positions. The gun industry crossed the moral Rubicon when they used their lobbyists to eliminate research into gun violence. Their crowning evil is the law they promote to jail doctors for daring to mention gun safety to patients and the parents of child patients.
3
When the NRA wins, we all lose. We lose the sense of security that creates and sustains a community where guns are unnecessary, where trust abounds. It results in small children being confined in schools that more closely resemble prisons than playgrounds.
How does that effect children's basic sense of safety? How do you produce self-confident, trusting children when they are reminded every time they walk through the doors of their schools that they have entered a danger zone?
We are afraid, not of the threat from afar, but from the threat next to us. The mentally unstable neighbor who has a gun scares us; the teen contemplating suicide and deciding to take others with him scares us. The gun we keep to protect ourselves from these scenes in our heads become toys to the children who find them, loaded, in daddy's nightstand. The "bump" in the night causes daddy to shoot in the dark, killing his wife who got out of bed a few minutes earlier. The number of guns in the hands of citizens scares the police in to shooting at anything that moves.
Each killing scares more of us until it becomes a truly vicious cycle: killing, buy guns, repeat. Never was the "wild" west as bad as this. The rest of the world can save themselves the bother of attacking us. We are doing a great job all by ourselves.
Time for the NRA to allow loaded weapons in their offices and for Congress and the Supreme Court to do the same. Why should they be safer than we are?
How does that effect children's basic sense of safety? How do you produce self-confident, trusting children when they are reminded every time they walk through the doors of their schools that they have entered a danger zone?
We are afraid, not of the threat from afar, but from the threat next to us. The mentally unstable neighbor who has a gun scares us; the teen contemplating suicide and deciding to take others with him scares us. The gun we keep to protect ourselves from these scenes in our heads become toys to the children who find them, loaded, in daddy's nightstand. The "bump" in the night causes daddy to shoot in the dark, killing his wife who got out of bed a few minutes earlier. The number of guns in the hands of citizens scares the police in to shooting at anything that moves.
Each killing scares more of us until it becomes a truly vicious cycle: killing, buy guns, repeat. Never was the "wild" west as bad as this. The rest of the world can save themselves the bother of attacking us. We are doing a great job all by ourselves.
Time for the NRA to allow loaded weapons in their offices and for Congress and the Supreme Court to do the same. Why should they be safer than we are?
2
Let's talk about the unmentioned in Mr. Blow's column.
It's not the mass shootings that have finally driven our two-person household, reluctantly, to enroll in a concealed-weapons-permit seminar with the thought of purchasing a handgun. The driving force is the fear engendered by situations like the mob reaction in Ferguson, Mo. in which the forces of law and order are either overwhelmed or cowered into failing to protect law-abiding citizens and/or their property.
If we cannot rely on the police to defend us, we are left with few choices.
It's not the mass shootings that have finally driven our two-person household, reluctantly, to enroll in a concealed-weapons-permit seminar with the thought of purchasing a handgun. The driving force is the fear engendered by situations like the mob reaction in Ferguson, Mo. in which the forces of law and order are either overwhelmed or cowered into failing to protect law-abiding citizens and/or their property.
If we cannot rely on the police to defend us, we are left with few choices.
2
There are about 10,000 homicides per year attributed to guns. However, the annual number of suicides attributed to guns is about 20,000 with an 80% success rate. For a country that considers suicide a mortal sin and puts people in jail for assisting in a suicide, it is strange that gun sellers are not considered as assisting in this context, and that the mental state of gun purchasers is not fully taken into account.
2
There are many areas in our culture and economy that don't sense. We pay twice as much for healthcare to keep the insurance industry seated atop healthcare. There isn't a single earth science institution in the world that supports the idea that human's are not driving global warming. We buy tons of over-the-counter natural vitamins and minerals that are often not in those bottles and don't do anything for us even if they were there. And guns "protecting us" is no different.
I think advocates for this nonsense make a great deal of money and the public relations industry can sell the anything that they are paid to sell, and we buy it. Even it can kills us, make us obese, poison our air, elects poor leaders, or robs us of our living.
I think advocates for this nonsense make a great deal of money and the public relations industry can sell the anything that they are paid to sell, and we buy it. Even it can kills us, make us obese, poison our air, elects poor leaders, or robs us of our living.
2
I was naive enough to think that the tragedy in Connecticut was a turning point on this issue. Little did I know that it would end up being a turning point in favor of even looser controls! I could write on an on about this in so many different dimensions, and the "cynical" part of me just wants to throw up my hands and give up the struggle. The "hopeful" part of me looks forward to an eventual migration in public opinion similar to what's happened in recent years on the subjects of gay marriage and capital punishment. I travel a lot abroad and have a tough time answering the frequent questions I get on the subject. Whatever the eventual outcome of all of this, the status quo is a national disgrace and embarrassment.
3
I'm not a gun nut. I am not a member of the NRA. I have not fired a weapon since Vietnam. However, there is a crime wave going on in this country regardless of what Mr. Blow says (read the papers in some areas) and it scares a lot of people, including me. While I think that a weapon is absolutely necessary for home defense, I do not believe that anyone should be permitted to carry them around. This is not the Wild, Wild, West. And, I think anyone or someone in the home, for that matter, that is mentally unstable should be not permitted a weapon. As far as comparing us to Europe, that is a bit disingenuous. I have been partying all over London, Paris and Rome at all hours without a problem, something I would not dare do in any major American city. I last time I was in an American big city at night, over ten teenagers with knives attempted to mug me. I believe in strict enforcement and background checks but don't disarm me in the midst of illegally armed criminals.
2
The NRA has dominated the debate and policy at the federal level and in most states, but here in WA state we are working hard to implement sensible legislation that can protect lives. For instance, last Nov. we passed a referendum requiring background checks for gun shows and online sales, and the legislature passed a law requiring local law enforcement to inform someone who had a restraining order against an abuser when confiscated guns are returned to that person. We are hoping to pass in the next session a law that makes it easier for a judge to confiscate guns from a person with serious mental illness issues. We have financial backing and many committed volunteers, who are sick and tired of all the gun violence.
1
The baby boom generation was supposed to be different, supposed to be for peace, love and understanding. They were the generation of protesting for human and civil rights, for being against the US getting involved in unjust wars, for more educational opportunities for everyone, for helping the environment, for helping the poor, for fighting against all forms of discrimination, for sensible gun control, for working for the greater good. Instead the baby boomers put all that aside and are now for money, power, control and most of all inaction. Meet the new boss, same as the old boss.
2
If we followed Australia and simply removed all semi-automatics from civilian hands, we'd have a lot less killing, maiming, and death. But, remember what happened to Al Gore in 2000? He was warned about his anti-gun stance which he refused to change and consequently he lost the presidency as a result. This lesson has not been lost on the Democratic Party nationally either.
Is there any common ground? Are you either a 'gun grabber' or not?
A more enlightened position might be to realize that guns in untrained hands are more dangerous. Therefore, gun owners might be open to a national right to carry if it were coupled with appropriate training and oversight.
Additionally, smart guns should be introduced to our civilian police forces. Police often used 'he grabbed my gun' as justification for killing the suspect. This would go away with smart guns, as the gun could not be fired if taken from the police officer.
Smart guns would also reduce to zero the number of deaths resulting from children playing with firearms.
Is there any common ground? Are you either a 'gun grabber' or not?
A more enlightened position might be to realize that guns in untrained hands are more dangerous. Therefore, gun owners might be open to a national right to carry if it were coupled with appropriate training and oversight.
Additionally, smart guns should be introduced to our civilian police forces. Police often used 'he grabbed my gun' as justification for killing the suspect. This would go away with smart guns, as the gun could not be fired if taken from the police officer.
Smart guns would also reduce to zero the number of deaths resulting from children playing with firearms.
1
No doubt I am treading in questionable territory here, but this is not so much my opinion as a suggestion in regard to this issue. I am not against guns, given the use is for recreation and sport. I am sincerely grateful for our police force and the higher percentage of those who serve under split second decision circumstances. However, I am old enough to remember (before TV even) that the thought among many was that guns were needed in the event that our police force got out of control, and took over our government and militarizing it. There were many biases and prejudices out there in my youth. Yet, I see some persist to this day. Indeed, many have lost respect and trust in the current condition of our government. I cannot but speculate that some of this gun ownership has some deep rooted distrust in government. Again, this is not a criticism, but an opportunity for dialog that is needed to go forward with a balance.
There is temptation to be cynical about this, however we need to understand that the real problem here, as has been mentioned in some other posts, is one of ignorance, as well as a play upon people's fears. Propagandists of all types are intrinsically very good at the latter, and the NRA and its political supporters are no different. They play to an unaware, and ignorant electorate.
Americans are by no means particularly dumb. The matter at hand is that most people simply accept majority opinion on most matters, a rule of thumb "norm", if you will. That is why what many call "common sense" is merely a heuristic. Ever wonder why the GOP make reference to "common" sense so often in their rhetoric? They know most people want to be associated with making a "common sense" choice. The propaganda works.
People are NOT primarily rational creatures. We think with our intuitive mind first, then rational, (if we deem necessary), afterword. Within the US context, "gun control" has a negative connotation for many. Intuitively they see it as a bad thing. Rationally, they are wrong. We cannot change human personalities, and we can only modify behaviors with limited means.
Those who have suggested a compromise approach on this, (such as stricter gun laws on university campuses, other public places, etc.), have a better chance of appealing to the average person's "common" sense heuristic within the American context. No matter how rational, absolute gun control advocacy will not work.
Americans are by no means particularly dumb. The matter at hand is that most people simply accept majority opinion on most matters, a rule of thumb "norm", if you will. That is why what many call "common sense" is merely a heuristic. Ever wonder why the GOP make reference to "common" sense so often in their rhetoric? They know most people want to be associated with making a "common sense" choice. The propaganda works.
People are NOT primarily rational creatures. We think with our intuitive mind first, then rational, (if we deem necessary), afterword. Within the US context, "gun control" has a negative connotation for many. Intuitively they see it as a bad thing. Rationally, they are wrong. We cannot change human personalities, and we can only modify behaviors with limited means.
Those who have suggested a compromise approach on this, (such as stricter gun laws on university campuses, other public places, etc.), have a better chance of appealing to the average person's "common" sense heuristic within the American context. No matter how rational, absolute gun control advocacy will not work.
1
The thing that seems to be missing from the whole discussion of the U.S. gun culture, is that the problem in the U.S. is not primarily the mass shootings. It is the thousands of fatal and debilitating shootings of family members, mostly the result of hand guns kept in the home for "personal protection." I grew up in, and now live in areas not known for violent crime, but I have known 3 people who were shot to death as the result of domestic quarrels, and in one case, a friend shot to death in a road rage incident. This doesn't happen in other "developed" countries in the, world. Somehow, partly, or mostly the result of the NRA owning most legislative branches, it is considered "normal" to keep loaded handguns around the home, and carry them in vehicles. What a sick mentality we have among a large segment of the population.
3
As someone already pointed out, this may be a waste of political capital for progressives. Not only is the issue politically intractable, we probably lose more lives to lack of access to health care, economic stress, etc., than to firearms. A large fraction of firearm deaths are suicides, many due to untreated depression or PTSD, neither of which we are addressing adequately.
Realize that the country is already saturated with firearms. and that no realistic course of action will change this.
Ask yourself if any realistic legal proposal wound have prevented the Newtown massacre; the killer's dead mother could probably have met all the requirements of background check, etc., and the slaughter could have been done with anyone's deer rifle.
Realize that the country is already saturated with firearms. and that no realistic course of action will change this.
Ask yourself if any realistic legal proposal wound have prevented the Newtown massacre; the killer's dead mother could probably have met all the requirements of background check, etc., and the slaughter could have been done with anyone's deer rifle.
3
Several commenters have MIS-quoted George Washington, as follows:
"A free people ought not only to be armed and disciplined, but they should have sufficient arms and ammunition to maintain a status of independence from any who might attempt to abuse them, which would include their own government."
The correct quote is:
"A free people ought not only to be armed but disciplined; to which end a uniform and well digested plan is requisite: And their safety and interest require that they should promote such manufactories, as tend to render them independent on others, for essential, particularly for military supplies."
And he was speaking of our country, not our individual citizens.
(http://foundersquotes.com/quotes/a-free-people-ought-not-only-to-be-arme...
"A free people ought not only to be armed and disciplined, but they should have sufficient arms and ammunition to maintain a status of independence from any who might attempt to abuse them, which would include their own government."
The correct quote is:
"A free people ought not only to be armed but disciplined; to which end a uniform and well digested plan is requisite: And their safety and interest require that they should promote such manufactories, as tend to render them independent on others, for essential, particularly for military supplies."
And he was speaking of our country, not our individual citizens.
(http://foundersquotes.com/quotes/a-free-people-ought-not-only-to-be-arme...
1
As with most, if not all, discussions on policy in this country, we can't discuss the gun issue without first considering the undue influence of campaign cash on our elected officials. It's what renders all such discussions mute.
Yes, the NRA/gun manufactures have won because they've spent the necessary amount of money and have applied the necessary amount of pressure on our legislators. It's no different than with our healthcare industries or our fossil fuel industries, or any entity that has enough money to offer a politician in return for laws that they can benefit from. THIS is the issue, not whether or not gun control laws are effective or if guns make us safe. We can busy ourselves debating those issues, but until we decide to insist on changing how we fund political campaigns and demand actual representation in our government, these discussions are just clown exercises for the futile.
Campaign finance reform is the issue of our times. It needs to be tackled. Nothing will be done for the American public until we get serious campaign finance reform.
Yes, the NRA/gun manufactures have won because they've spent the necessary amount of money and have applied the necessary amount of pressure on our legislators. It's no different than with our healthcare industries or our fossil fuel industries, or any entity that has enough money to offer a politician in return for laws that they can benefit from. THIS is the issue, not whether or not gun control laws are effective or if guns make us safe. We can busy ourselves debating those issues, but until we decide to insist on changing how we fund political campaigns and demand actual representation in our government, these discussions are just clown exercises for the futile.
Campaign finance reform is the issue of our times. It needs to be tackled. Nothing will be done for the American public until we get serious campaign finance reform.
2
"The NRA is the best friend the killer's instinct ever had. It's an enabler of death, paranoid, delusional and as venomous as a scorpion."-- Bill Moyers.
Thus, if the N.R.A. is the winner in our national gun-toting competition, we are in big trouble.
Attempts through the years to isolate the factors that push some to murder their fellow citizens has, according to some reports, boiled down to people feeling safe and secure in their own environment; their own community; their own country. And that requires social activism--a willingness on the part of us all to get politically involved; to vote; to contribute to the common good, including the production and maintenance of a safe and secure society.
For example, it's been shown in a handfull of small communities where law enforcement has become friends of residents rather than adversaries, disruptions and violence drastically declined becoming for the most part non existent. Consider this example on a much broader scale encompassing more than just law-enforcement.
The question is, with an overall sense of safety and security, how many lone and deranged gunman, quietly secluded from the world, could have been redirected to take a different path if there had been a community/country that made them feel secure.
Our species is uniquely qualified to engage in activities that promote the public good. Let's just say yes to moving forward in that direction. And unlike the NRA if peace came to pass, we've nothing to lose.
Thus, if the N.R.A. is the winner in our national gun-toting competition, we are in big trouble.
Attempts through the years to isolate the factors that push some to murder their fellow citizens has, according to some reports, boiled down to people feeling safe and secure in their own environment; their own community; their own country. And that requires social activism--a willingness on the part of us all to get politically involved; to vote; to contribute to the common good, including the production and maintenance of a safe and secure society.
For example, it's been shown in a handfull of small communities where law enforcement has become friends of residents rather than adversaries, disruptions and violence drastically declined becoming for the most part non existent. Consider this example on a much broader scale encompassing more than just law-enforcement.
The question is, with an overall sense of safety and security, how many lone and deranged gunman, quietly secluded from the world, could have been redirected to take a different path if there had been a community/country that made them feel secure.
Our species is uniquely qualified to engage in activities that promote the public good. Let's just say yes to moving forward in that direction. And unlike the NRA if peace came to pass, we've nothing to lose.
2
A perfect reason why laws should not be passed by virtue of popularity alone. The "common man" does not always act with common sense. The common man does not always know the difference between perception and reality. The common man believes in and acts on fear. We should be able to count on our leaders to provide a measure of sanity, reality and optimism -- something positive and strong. Sadly they too are very common all too often, operating only to get re-elected and operating only to please the "common man" (not to mention their donators). Money talks. Money votes. But if that is the case, then why isn't the money from the "other side" being used to deliver truthful statistics and positive messages versus always being used to chase the NRA's idiotic legislative ideas?
These opinion sways show symptoms reflecting general population trends. It shows probably a lower level of education of our population that results in less sensitivity to human suffering. The power of money in politics and news networks are providing a simplistic view of the world that is being accepted by the easily influenced masses. There is no countermovement that is united in an effort to elevate the discourse and defeat the business and politics of guns and their propaganda machine.
People don't need these guns, people want the guns for the image, the romance, the culture, the machismo, the community they bring, and the sense of security they bring. America was founded on guns. It's hard to reverse that culture. It's part of our heritage.
But a new culture has formed. This new culture abuses the old, romantic culture, sells that image--the cowboy, the hunter, the soldier. But, the reality is not that romantic. It's become this sort of bunker paranoia, doomsday hoarding, ammunition gobbling, gun fair swarming, semi-automatic salivating--a gun culture on steroids, not the BB gun of yesteryear, or the family rifle.
And the political wink of "let's take back our country" feeds a sort of xenophobic paranoia that we are heading for a civil war, us verses them, not from my cold dead hand, and all that.
This culture needs to be countered with a PR spin from the left that sells an equally potent American heritage where community is built from sharing, not hoarding; from including, not wall-building; from openness, not hiding. The current gun culture feeds on our worst fears. Let's counter that culture with one that feeds on our spirit of innovation and togetherness. More trust, less suspicion.
The NRA may have won the battle, but the war is just beginning. Counter it with a positive, creative American message--less Gun Day, more Earth Day-- so that generation coming up will hopefully want to hoard solar panels, not weapons.
But a new culture has formed. This new culture abuses the old, romantic culture, sells that image--the cowboy, the hunter, the soldier. But, the reality is not that romantic. It's become this sort of bunker paranoia, doomsday hoarding, ammunition gobbling, gun fair swarming, semi-automatic salivating--a gun culture on steroids, not the BB gun of yesteryear, or the family rifle.
And the political wink of "let's take back our country" feeds a sort of xenophobic paranoia that we are heading for a civil war, us verses them, not from my cold dead hand, and all that.
This culture needs to be countered with a PR spin from the left that sells an equally potent American heritage where community is built from sharing, not hoarding; from including, not wall-building; from openness, not hiding. The current gun culture feeds on our worst fears. Let's counter that culture with one that feeds on our spirit of innovation and togetherness. More trust, less suspicion.
The NRA may have won the battle, but the war is just beginning. Counter it with a positive, creative American message--less Gun Day, more Earth Day-- so that generation coming up will hopefully want to hoard solar panels, not weapons.
1
Mr. Blow has a flawed assumption. He assumes that increased gun control reduces crime and therefore increased gun control is good. He is wrong.
Violent crime rate and gun control laws are not correlated. That is because the vast majority of criminals obtain their guns illegally. Chicago has had strict laws and St Louis liberal ones. They both have high crime (parts of Chicago are safe, and parts are dangerous).
Yes, crime is decreasing. There are two correlating factors: Increased incarceration, gun ownership, and concealed carry.
What is most correlated with crime between jurisdictions is the percent of blacks. The more blacks, the greater the crime. This is not a comfortable statistic, but it is true. To reduce crime, we need to figure out why that is. Failed schools? Failed families? Lack of work ethic? Lack of skills? High chemical dependency? It is a combination. If Mr. Blow wishes to reduce crime, then find out what is it about having a concentration of black people that causes crime to go up. It isn't lawfully possessed guns.
We know the government forces kids in poor areas to attend bad schools. This can be fixed with vouchers for every child. We know that the majority of black children grow up without a father in the home, and that leads to delinquency. Fixing families and work ethic is harder.
In the meantime, the best defense against a criminal is for the would-be victim to have a gun and be trained on how to use it.
Violent crime rate and gun control laws are not correlated. That is because the vast majority of criminals obtain their guns illegally. Chicago has had strict laws and St Louis liberal ones. They both have high crime (parts of Chicago are safe, and parts are dangerous).
Yes, crime is decreasing. There are two correlating factors: Increased incarceration, gun ownership, and concealed carry.
What is most correlated with crime between jurisdictions is the percent of blacks. The more blacks, the greater the crime. This is not a comfortable statistic, but it is true. To reduce crime, we need to figure out why that is. Failed schools? Failed families? Lack of work ethic? Lack of skills? High chemical dependency? It is a combination. If Mr. Blow wishes to reduce crime, then find out what is it about having a concentration of black people that causes crime to go up. It isn't lawfully possessed guns.
We know the government forces kids in poor areas to attend bad schools. This can be fixed with vouchers for every child. We know that the majority of black children grow up without a father in the home, and that leads to delinquency. Fixing families and work ethic is harder.
In the meantime, the best defense against a criminal is for the would-be victim to have a gun and be trained on how to use it.
2
The Kansas legislature has passed (and Gov. Brownback signed) two bills this year that perfectly illustrate the idiocy of America on these points. One bill eliminates any training or permit requirements for carrying of concealed guns - they stopped short of requiring everyone to carry. Saving that one for next year. The other bill imposed nasty and mean spirited restriction on how persons receiving state assistance (mostly the working poor) may spend their paltry support payments from the state. No movies, no swimming pools for the kids and a limit of $25 a day withdrawals from ATMs -which is effectively $20 since most ATMs don't issue in $5 increments. No restrictions were imposed on the ability to spend state funded assistance to purchase a gun.
People are mostly stupid and the oligarchs want to keep it that way - helps profits.
People are mostly stupid and the oligarchs want to keep it that way - helps profits.
If Charles were genuine about curbing gun related violence, he would advocate for stronger criminal penalties for those who use guns to commit their crimes. But a la Chicago, when a thug commits a crime with a gun - usually one that's unlicensed or stolen - he goes through a revolving door of a justice system. The result is an extremely high murder rate in that one city, and more generally an epidemic of approximately 6,000 murdered black men a year in the U.S. But addressing this epidemic with tougher criminal penalties would only exacerbate the incarceration of black men, another epidemic of sorts, so Charles would rather focus on highly anomalous mass shootings. Too bad most readers are too smart for this bad argument.
And with regard to the decline in crime and an increase in gun ownership, the two are related. Urban crime is down in part because of a population shift, but it's also down because urban poverty is becoming more dissipated as cities gentrify and turn whiter and wealthier. The thing about these whiter and wealthier residents is that they have less tolerance, and more of a voice, when urban crime is considered. And so they arm themselves and agitate for safer cities, just like the plains pioneers armed themselves and lobbied for Federal safety measures. And as displaced urban crime spreads to the burbs as a result, law abiding people out there need to arm themselves too.
If we want to curb gun related violence, we need to go after criminals. Not guns.
And with regard to the decline in crime and an increase in gun ownership, the two are related. Urban crime is down in part because of a population shift, but it's also down because urban poverty is becoming more dissipated as cities gentrify and turn whiter and wealthier. The thing about these whiter and wealthier residents is that they have less tolerance, and more of a voice, when urban crime is considered. And so they arm themselves and agitate for safer cities, just like the plains pioneers armed themselves and lobbied for Federal safety measures. And as displaced urban crime spreads to the burbs as a result, law abiding people out there need to arm themselves too.
If we want to curb gun related violence, we need to go after criminals. Not guns.
2
Of course the NRA has won not just this round. The change in public attitudes towards guns simply reflects the rising ignorance of Americans to the actual facts of gun ownership and its costs (see the latest issue of Mother Jones for what those costs are in monetary terms).
It also has to be realized that Americans are virtually alone among citizens of advanced nations in their embrace of firearms (and those countries that allow private ownership of guns regulate ownership far more closely) and their quaint notion that it makes them safer to have a gun in the house despite all the evidence to the contrary. Everybody else knows better (and to be fair, so too do many Americans - not all have drunk the NRA Koolaid).
It's pretty simple really. If more guns equated to greater safety, America would be head and shoulders the safest country with the lowest rates of murder and gun violence in the industrialized world. Instead we have by far the highest rates of both. And although tougher state laws can only do so much in the face of weak national laws, states which have them (and have had them for some time) on average have lower rates of gun violence and murder.
But on this issue Americans as a whole are simply not rational and that is pretty sad given the steep price we pay as a consequence.
It also has to be realized that Americans are virtually alone among citizens of advanced nations in their embrace of firearms (and those countries that allow private ownership of guns regulate ownership far more closely) and their quaint notion that it makes them safer to have a gun in the house despite all the evidence to the contrary. Everybody else knows better (and to be fair, so too do many Americans - not all have drunk the NRA Koolaid).
It's pretty simple really. If more guns equated to greater safety, America would be head and shoulders the safest country with the lowest rates of murder and gun violence in the industrialized world. Instead we have by far the highest rates of both. And although tougher state laws can only do so much in the face of weak national laws, states which have them (and have had them for some time) on average have lower rates of gun violence and murder.
But on this issue Americans as a whole are simply not rational and that is pretty sad given the steep price we pay as a consequence.
I guess we should just give up and acknowledge that this country has somehow gone from simply enthusiastically stupid to just plain insane; maybe it always was, and I just bought the cultural propaganda. There is so little common sense, good will, generosity, compassion, or empathy among my fellow Americans. I expect the captured political prostitutes in our what passes for government in DC to fall into line behind the NRA's money and clout, but I don't understand the people contributing to this poll.
Okay, so great. There will be more guns and more blood in our once peaceful neighborhoods. The police must surely fear the phenomenon of no more unarmed police shooting victims. Texan professors who give low marks can fear retaliation by zealous students carrying concealed weapons. Anybody who feels slighted for any or no reason can simply stand his ground and fear for his life and make target practice on living human beings a part of any night out.
Maybe this nightmare of America's gun obsession and violence will end when the number of shooting victims exceeds and surely includes the members and frothing supporters of the NRA and unrestricted gun rights. Until then, let's rush out and buy stock in companies which make bullet proof everything. Let's put those 1950's bomb shelters back on the market! A whole new industry! What a country. Sob.
Okay, so great. There will be more guns and more blood in our once peaceful neighborhoods. The police must surely fear the phenomenon of no more unarmed police shooting victims. Texan professors who give low marks can fear retaliation by zealous students carrying concealed weapons. Anybody who feels slighted for any or no reason can simply stand his ground and fear for his life and make target practice on living human beings a part of any night out.
Maybe this nightmare of America's gun obsession and violence will end when the number of shooting victims exceeds and surely includes the members and frothing supporters of the NRA and unrestricted gun rights. Until then, let's rush out and buy stock in companies which make bullet proof everything. Let's put those 1950's bomb shelters back on the market! A whole new industry! What a country. Sob.
The fact that the Democrats, and liberals in general, fixate on a few people having black plastic handles on their rifles is clear evidence that they are the easiest people to fool, even though they think they are so smart, so smart that they can tell everyone else how to live and how to think.
Of the 30K firearm deaths in America each year, two thirds are suicides. Of course, we can argue whether this is something we'd rather avoid, but at some level, people probably ought to be able to do with their bodies as they please.
Two thirds of the remaining deaths involve criminals engaged in other crimes, such as robbery and drug dealing. Two thirds of the remaining 3,000 are incident to arguments in which someone is drunk or on drugs. That leaves 1,000 deaths, including police executions, accidents, cold blooded killing, and massacres, by otherwise law abiding citizens.
Very few of this 1,000 involve rifles, and only a fraction involve rifles with black plastic handles. Yet this is the one thing Liberals hyper-ventilate over. The almost completely irrelevant. Something dwarfed in seriousness by breast cancer, car accidents, smoking, etc.
At least 30M people own firearms in America. A lot of these people have political views sympathetic to ideals advanced by the Democrats. Yet the Democrats deliberately push these people away over something which makes no real difference.
So I ask: Are the Democrats truly interested in winning elections and governing this country?
Of the 30K firearm deaths in America each year, two thirds are suicides. Of course, we can argue whether this is something we'd rather avoid, but at some level, people probably ought to be able to do with their bodies as they please.
Two thirds of the remaining deaths involve criminals engaged in other crimes, such as robbery and drug dealing. Two thirds of the remaining 3,000 are incident to arguments in which someone is drunk or on drugs. That leaves 1,000 deaths, including police executions, accidents, cold blooded killing, and massacres, by otherwise law abiding citizens.
Very few of this 1,000 involve rifles, and only a fraction involve rifles with black plastic handles. Yet this is the one thing Liberals hyper-ventilate over. The almost completely irrelevant. Something dwarfed in seriousness by breast cancer, car accidents, smoking, etc.
At least 30M people own firearms in America. A lot of these people have political views sympathetic to ideals advanced by the Democrats. Yet the Democrats deliberately push these people away over something which makes no real difference.
So I ask: Are the Democrats truly interested in winning elections and governing this country?
2
If the NRA had its way, every man, woman, and child in this country would tote a gun. Unfortunately, it seems that they're narrowing in on that goal. Scare people into thinking that they need a firearm for protection, and then sell them one (or in some cases several), is the NRA game plan. The NRA has a powerful lobby in Washington that makes sure Congress doesn't pass firearms control, and it has been successful in unseating those in Congress who did support control. So the status quo will continue. We'll continue to have mass shootings like Columbine, and people will continue to buy guns after each such shooting.
Casualties from firearms may have declined over recent decades, but with the ever increasing proliferation of gun ownership that trend is apt to be reversed. Many of those weapons are eventually used, on oneself (about 50 percent of all gun-related deaths) or on others. When the U.S, is compared with nations that have strict gun control, the difference is startling. There are more gun fatalities in a week here than there are in an entire year in the U.K., say.
Casualties from firearms may have declined over recent decades, but with the ever increasing proliferation of gun ownership that trend is apt to be reversed. Many of those weapons are eventually used, on oneself (about 50 percent of all gun-related deaths) or on others. When the U.S, is compared with nations that have strict gun control, the difference is startling. There are more gun fatalities in a week here than there are in an entire year in the U.K., say.
1
One thing Mr. Blow doesn't address directly is the fact that crime rates (especially violent crime rates) have plummeted even as gun ownership has held steady or grown. So-called gun rights advocates never tire of saying that this disproves the link between the prevalence of guns in this country and our crime rate. This is a bit of logical legerdemain that needs to be countered.
As a non-gun-owning urban Northeast liberal, I have tried hard, in various forums, to engage with gun owners in a civil conversation with a hope of finding some common ground. It is exceptionally hard to do. I know that there are reasonable gun advocates out there, who believe in reasonable limits on both the kind of weapons we allow people to own and the situations in which we want them to have them. But such reasonable gun owners are few and far between -- and they are overwhelmed by a seeming large majority that respond with invective, anger, insult, demagoguery, and at times naked aggression. I never feel more like a stranger in my own country than when I'm on the receiving end of their ill will.
As a non-gun-owning urban Northeast liberal, I have tried hard, in various forums, to engage with gun owners in a civil conversation with a hope of finding some common ground. It is exceptionally hard to do. I know that there are reasonable gun advocates out there, who believe in reasonable limits on both the kind of weapons we allow people to own and the situations in which we want them to have them. But such reasonable gun owners are few and far between -- and they are overwhelmed by a seeming large majority that respond with invective, anger, insult, demagoguery, and at times naked aggression. I never feel more like a stranger in my own country than when I'm on the receiving end of their ill will.
What an extraordinarily successful marketing strategy!
In malevolent concert with the politic supported by a mix of propaganda and disinformation the USSR would have envied, a national psychosis to the advantage of the gun industry has gone viral at their industrial level like a successful tweet might at the bit level.
Every chord of the violin has been used building on our cultural insularity and lack of objective information which allows the exacerbated notion not only of American exceptional-ism, but a notion of superiority that comforts the blind righteousness of many.
The most worrying result of this agressive cultural bend, beyond the ability to bully ourselves into another war in the middle east for example, is the cultural barriers growing between urban and rural America.
For the politic to look the other way to not say be accomplice to this must demonstrate why we have the best politicians money can buy.
In malevolent concert with the politic supported by a mix of propaganda and disinformation the USSR would have envied, a national psychosis to the advantage of the gun industry has gone viral at their industrial level like a successful tweet might at the bit level.
Every chord of the violin has been used building on our cultural insularity and lack of objective information which allows the exacerbated notion not only of American exceptional-ism, but a notion of superiority that comforts the blind righteousness of many.
The most worrying result of this agressive cultural bend, beyond the ability to bully ourselves into another war in the middle east for example, is the cultural barriers growing between urban and rural America.
For the politic to look the other way to not say be accomplice to this must demonstrate why we have the best politicians money can buy.
The fact that so many Americans believe that the government is evil, that taxes is legal theft, that democrats are takers and only republicans believe in personal responsibility, that any gun law infringes on liberty, is it any wonder that guns outweigh common sense?
37
The most fascinating statistic--not mentioned in this article--is that the number of households owning guns has declined in the past 20 years:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/wp/2015/03/05/america-has-m...
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/wp/2015/04/08/nearly-1-in-1...
Thus, fewer homes have more and more guns. In other words, what we've created is small militias all over the country. In concert with this startling finding, "...the researchers also found that people with lots of guns -- six or more -- are more likely to carry their guns in public and to have a history of anger issues. And people with more than 11 were significantly more likely to say that they lose their temper and get into fights than members of any other gun ownership group." …is it any wonder that gun violence is so prevalent in this country?
Once you understand that the NRA is a lobbying front for gun manufacturers, first and foremost, it all makes sense. That they pander to peoples' fear and paranoia to boost gun sales merely shows that they've mastered the psychology of this minority of multi-gun owners to help sell them their 10th, 20th, or 30th weapon.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/wp/2015/03/05/america-has-m...
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/wp/2015/04/08/nearly-1-in-1...
Thus, fewer homes have more and more guns. In other words, what we've created is small militias all over the country. In concert with this startling finding, "...the researchers also found that people with lots of guns -- six or more -- are more likely to carry their guns in public and to have a history of anger issues. And people with more than 11 were significantly more likely to say that they lose their temper and get into fights than members of any other gun ownership group." …is it any wonder that gun violence is so prevalent in this country?
Once you understand that the NRA is a lobbying front for gun manufacturers, first and foremost, it all makes sense. That they pander to peoples' fear and paranoia to boost gun sales merely shows that they've mastered the psychology of this minority of multi-gun owners to help sell them their 10th, 20th, or 30th weapon.
47
30? That is not a lot of guns.
1
1) It shows total ignorance to say that the NRA is a front for gun manufacturers, which isn't even that big an industry. The gun manufacturer lobby is the NSSF. The NRA represents millions of people who care deeply about gun rights and vote on the issue. That's why it's powerful. You may njot like it, but nattering about the "gun manufacturer lobby" isn't helping your case.
2) Polls show households owning guns rising (http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/article/2541876). Perhaps more importantly, many people won't answer polls truthfully nowadays. Between knowing the desperate desire for gun confiscation of the so-called gun safety lobby, and the intrusion of the government exposed by Snowden, it doesn't take a paranoid to not want to be recorded as owning guns. I would certainly lie if asked in a survey.
2) Polls show households owning guns rising (http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/article/2541876). Perhaps more importantly, many people won't answer polls truthfully nowadays. Between knowing the desperate desire for gun confiscation of the so-called gun safety lobby, and the intrusion of the government exposed by Snowden, it doesn't take a paranoid to not want to be recorded as owning guns. I would certainly lie if asked in a survey.
That's actually a myth, based on a single survey which is at odds with industry polls and statistics. It also ignores several realities, a major one being the influx of immigrants over the past 20 years. Even with a growing number of new gun owners, the uptick is overwhelmed by the millions of new arrivals. Also, when it comes to firearms, there is valid concerns about how honestly some respondents may have answered. Given the sales statistics and NICS checks and the estimates that said survey places on existing gun owners, they would've had to have purchased an impossibly high number of guns each in order for this myth to hold any water. Do the math; it doesn't work.
Also, the NRA lobbying for "gun manufacturers" is also a myth. The NSSF is the actual "gun lobby," and SAAMI is a lobby for ammunition manufacturers. The NRA is a gun RIGHTS lobby. Most all of their money comes from dues and private contributions (mostly fundraisers, such as the "Friends of NRA" dinners), and NOT the "gun industry."
Also, the NRA lobbying for "gun manufacturers" is also a myth. The NSSF is the actual "gun lobby," and SAAMI is a lobby for ammunition manufacturers. The NRA is a gun RIGHTS lobby. Most all of their money comes from dues and private contributions (mostly fundraisers, such as the "Friends of NRA" dinners), and NOT the "gun industry."
"We know that the White Man does not understand our way of life. To him, one piece of land is much like the other. He is a stranger coming in the night taking from the land what he needs. The earth is not his brother but his enemy and when he has conquered it, he moves on. He cares nothing for the land, he forgets his father’s grave and his children’s heritage. He treats his mother the Earth and his brother the Sky like merchandise. His hunger will eat the earth bare and leave only a desert. I do not understand - our ways are different from yours.... All things are bound together...." I believe the Native American chief who spoke these words was expressingg, sadly, a disrespect, irreverence, for all creation. His words are haunting as he speaks of our forgetting the dead and ignoring our children's future. Congress rather than leading and promoting the best human values has become an expression of our callous indifference to our country as we trash water, land, and one another. Not surprising that disrespect for earth leads to lack of compassion for each other.
26
Beyond sickening that the NRA "appears to be winning this round", as you say, Charles Blow. It is terrifying that talk of gun control causes more people to buy guns. "High profile crimes" are caused by people with guns. People massacring innocent people. Gun ownership doesn't make people safer, it makes gun-dealers and gun lobbyists richer by far. Protecting gun ownership means further crimes - mass shootings - by demented people who own those weapons and ammunition. Our era on this hinge of American history will be marked by racial inequality, injustice to all minorities, inequality of income, lack of education for the educable, and gun ownership run amok. Gabrielle Giffords and Mark Kelly have done their utmost to bring gun control to Americans with their Political Action Committee, "Americans for Responsible Solutions". How many more attempted assassinations will occur in these parlous times?
20
THINK! An analogue to your statement: Child pornography is caused by people with cameras. People photographing innocent children.
Yes, it IS the same thing. It's always been far more important WHOSE HANDS guns are in, rather than guns being "controlled." Drugs are tightly controlled, too. How's that working out?
The NRA is winning because they have popular support; disarming innocent people makes nobody safer. Let's join together to enact CRIMINAL CONTROL, instead of futile "gun control" schemes that have failed time and time again.
Yes, it IS the same thing. It's always been far more important WHOSE HANDS guns are in, rather than guns being "controlled." Drugs are tightly controlled, too. How's that working out?
The NRA is winning because they have popular support; disarming innocent people makes nobody safer. Let's join together to enact CRIMINAL CONTROL, instead of futile "gun control" schemes that have failed time and time again.
Probably, it is necessary to bring up the NRA and maybe the editors say it is wise, but I still wonder why you bother. I have vented about and lamented the over abundance of fire arms but to no avail and that is exactly what will continue.
Charles, I suspect you have many better ideas about which to write. Gun control is an absolute waste of time. No one hears.
Charles, I suspect you have many better ideas about which to write. Gun control is an absolute waste of time. No one hears.
8
Perhaps, with the ever shrinking middle-class more people are thrown out of work into despair, into anger, and the prospect ultimately resorting to criminal strategies of coping and survival. A neo-Hobbesian world inhabited by a sea of color-blind post-Ellison invisible men & women.
8
I for one, am one of those folks that purchased a gun and joined the NRA shortly after one of the sensationalized shootings a few years ago. I had always thought that the NRA had seemed a bit nutty but after reading a particularly dishonest and slanted hit piece in this publication, I clicked straight over to the NRA website and signed up for two years.
26
Well, I sure hope you at least did some firearms training, and practice regularly: otherwise, you're not only violating the spirit of the second Amendment, you're actively dangerous to have owning a gun.
I'm a gun-owning and gun-using Texan. I would NEVER join the NRA or any other gun rights advocacy group in the United States. Wayne LaPierre and his ilk are the worst kind of citizens, but they are great loud-mouthed, bully-pulpit, win-at-any-cost politicians. It isn't possible to have a conversation with those who choose swaying the mob as their job.
38
Another day, another liberal/progressive whining session about our Second Amendment.
Get a new cause. We're not giving them up. Ever.
Get a new cause. We're not giving them up. Ever.
27
If only YOUR Second Amendment were the same as the one that's in the Constitution.
1
I am with you brother! They cannot have mine either.
Disgusting. Shame on you. What if it was your child at Sandy Hook?
1
One of the ironies is that sensible gun control regulations have no effect on hunting and little, if any, effect on people's rights to defend their homes.
11
The part you are missing is that any Federal background check is a back door registration program. Sensible gun control is getting them out of the hands of the felons, teens and the mentally ill. All the laws in the world will not accomplish that.
The NRA should admit that it believes guns are more important than lives and that gun rights are more important than any other rights. If the organization and its members did so, then at least they would be honest. That is, they would be honest about their beliefs and priorities. It would not be an acknowledgement of reality, which is not a requirement of membership. By the way, I am a former NRA member.
15
True guns ARE more important than some lives...
You've got it a bit backward! The NRA believes that saving lives is paramount, and that guns SAVE lives. That's the whole point! It's not about duck hunting. They may indeed believe that gun rights are primary, only because, without the ability to enforce your legal rights by force, the rest are just words on paper. This is evident in many other countries where local or even national governments dispense with any rights and do as they will, since their citizens can offer no real resistance. Outright genocide here in the U.S. would be near impossible today.
That is the honest summary. If you're smart, you'd renew your membership. :)
That is the honest summary. If you're smart, you'd renew your membership. :)
The NRA is winning because they have the backing of all the commercial interests involved with making, distributing, and retailing guns. The NRA is a trade association disguised as a champion for Constitutional rights. They have successfully used the Constitutional smokescreen to hide their real agenda - keep the market for guns open and lucrative - Period.
41
The NRA has over 6,000,000 dues paying members. These are individuals and not corporate interests. I suggest you learn more about the NRA.
45 years ago i handed my m-16 to the armorer and have never been armed again. i appreciated that it was far more likely that having a weapon made my life more dangerous rather than more secure. having a child find the weapon and shoot himself or his friend, turning to it as a way to end despair, killing the cable guy mistaking him for burglar. all these are more likely to occur than using the weapon for self protection. of course not all of my friends have shared this view. one fellow, a fireman, was an avid sportsman and responsible gun owner until the day he shot his wife and then himself. he was the last guy one would expect to be irresponsible with his weapons, he's dead.
37
For the life of me, I cannot figure out the herd mentality in this country. Sad to say, it is groups like the NRA that are leading us off the cliff (so to speak).
I, for the time, live in Kansas (or brownbackistan, as we call it) - a place where all common sense goes to die. The governor signed a law that allows concealed carry without a permit. Even though the police organizations were against it. Imagine that - before you had to attend classes on concealed carry - most of which dealt with the legal side of the situation. No longer!
He also signed a law that restricts what people on public assistance can buy. True. You cannot get a beer or fingernail polish. But guess what you can buy? If you said a gun, you were correct.
It appears that the inmates are running the asylum. Thanks NRA!
I, for the time, live in Kansas (or brownbackistan, as we call it) - a place where all common sense goes to die. The governor signed a law that allows concealed carry without a permit. Even though the police organizations were against it. Imagine that - before you had to attend classes on concealed carry - most of which dealt with the legal side of the situation. No longer!
He also signed a law that restricts what people on public assistance can buy. True. You cannot get a beer or fingernail polish. But guess what you can buy? If you said a gun, you were correct.
It appears that the inmates are running the asylum. Thanks NRA!
14
This is the result of 50 years of the politics of fear. It is not the NRA that has won, it is those who would have us live in fear. The NRA is but the front man for fear mongers.
2
Of course they have won. How could they not in a nation obsessed with war and weapons and marketing mayhem around the world while donating the excess to police departments full of uneducated oafs in armor.
6
The changing attitudes on guns are a reflection of an increasingly scared society. One in which the media stoked the fear, and the NRA took advantage of it. Sad to see the changes that are happening.
2
The most fascinating statistic--not mentioned in this article--is that the number of households owning guns has declined in the past 20 years:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/wp/2015/03/05/america-has-m...
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/wp/2015/04/08/nearly-1-in-1...
Thus, fewer homes have more and more guns. In other words, what we've created is small militias all over the country. In concert with this startling finding, "...the researchers also found that people with lots of guns -- six or more -- are more likely to carry their guns in public and to have a history of anger issues. And people with more than 11 were significantly more likely to say that they lose their temper and get into fights than members of any other gun ownership group." …is it any wonder that gun violence is so prevalent in this country?
Once you understand that the NRA is a lobbying front for gun manufacturers, first and foremost, it all makes sense. That they pander to peoples' fear and paranoia to boost gun sales merely shows that they've
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/wp/2015/03/05/america-has-m...
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/wp/2015/04/08/nearly-1-in-1...
Thus, fewer homes have more and more guns. In other words, what we've created is small militias all over the country. In concert with this startling finding, "...the researchers also found that people with lots of guns -- six or more -- are more likely to carry their guns in public and to have a history of anger issues. And people with more than 11 were significantly more likely to say that they lose their temper and get into fights than members of any other gun ownership group." …is it any wonder that gun violence is so prevalent in this country?
Once you understand that the NRA is a lobbying front for gun manufacturers, first and foremost, it all makes sense. That they pander to peoples' fear and paranoia to boost gun sales merely shows that they've
8
I am a liberal who can reason. And if crime rates are at staying at historic lows, while gun ownership continues to rise, shouldn't we at least reconsider the claim that more guns cause more crime?
21
When are you libs going to wake up and realize that there are so many guns out there already that you will NEVER win the killing wars by trying to take guns away.
Mores and morals have been destroyed in this once great country of ours. Guess who's to blame for that? It's not those who try to protect life. It's those who can choose whether another life matters. All life matters.
Mores and morals have been destroyed in this once great country of ours. Guess who's to blame for that? It's not those who try to protect life. It's those who can choose whether another life matters. All life matters.
7
When an interest group holds sway in Government it usually costs citizens money. In the case of the NRA the cost is 30,000 lives per year. We cannot give up the fight.
11
"Appears to be winning...." No, Wayne LaPierre and the NRA have clearly won, stomping out any rational deliberation on this subject and they are dancing on the cold dead corpse of even modest proposals (background checks; magazine limits).
The American gun fetish is one (but only one) of the things the rest of the worlds looks at and shakes its head in befuddlement. They must wonder what makes us such a fearful people who need unfettered access to hand guns and automatic weapons in order to feel sage. Is it the same fear that drives us as a nation to spend more on defense than the next dozen countries put together?
That spike in gun sales following mass murder events is a stupid and ugly thing.
The American gun fetish is one (but only one) of the things the rest of the worlds looks at and shakes its head in befuddlement. They must wonder what makes us such a fearful people who need unfettered access to hand guns and automatic weapons in order to feel sage. Is it the same fear that drives us as a nation to spend more on defense than the next dozen countries put together?
That spike in gun sales following mass murder events is a stupid and ugly thing.
16
Automatic weapons in the US are highly fettered. They fall under the National Firearms Act of 1932. In order to buy an automatic weapon you must get an LEO fill out a form 3 and submit your finger prints, your CLEO's signature, two passport photos and a check for the $200 tax. Then you wait 9 months while the ATF checks everything out and then you can buy an automatic weapon that is registered to you and only you. Also, in the 1980's the US government banned the making or importing of new machine guns for civilian use. Which means you can only buy grandfathered ones which of course has risen the price dramatically. An automatic M-16 or AK-47 will cost well over $20,000. I would not call all of that to be "unfettered access."
Sadly I think you are correct that the NRA has won.
I have always hated guns, never owned one and never wanted to own one. But even among my friends who agree with me on most things, many own guns.
My latest idea is putting aside money to buy a small vacation home in Canada, where sanity still exists, and spend half the year there when I retire in a few years.
I have always hated guns, never owned one and never wanted to own one. But even among my friends who agree with me on most things, many own guns.
My latest idea is putting aside money to buy a small vacation home in Canada, where sanity still exists, and spend half the year there when I retire in a few years.
17
Not just "this round", the NRA has won the match. The final round was a federal trial ruling that Chicago's gun laws were unconstiturional and a violation of civil rights, forcing Chicago to pay the NRA over half a million dollars in legal fees. See McCormick v. Chicago and Heller v. D.C.
Aslo, it is not criminals that drive gun poltics but the federal government. Many prominent U.S. Senators have argued for outlawing the private ownership of guns. So have many appointees in Democrat administrations. There is the specter of "Homeland Security" with its secret list of "enemies of the state" (No Fly) and Star Chamber (Foreign Intellegnece Surveillance Court) along with the grossly unconstitutional 4th Amendment violantions revealed by Snowden.
Lastly, there is the specter of Ruby Ridge and Waco where BATFE agents, U.S. Marshalls, and FBI agents got away with killing many innocent people. A U.S. Marshall actually got a commendation for shooting to death 9 year old Sammy Weaver and his little dog in the initial assault on the Weaver cabin at Ruby Ridge.
Aslo, it is not criminals that drive gun poltics but the federal government. Many prominent U.S. Senators have argued for outlawing the private ownership of guns. So have many appointees in Democrat administrations. There is the specter of "Homeland Security" with its secret list of "enemies of the state" (No Fly) and Star Chamber (Foreign Intellegnece Surveillance Court) along with the grossly unconstitutional 4th Amendment violantions revealed by Snowden.
Lastly, there is the specter of Ruby Ridge and Waco where BATFE agents, U.S. Marshalls, and FBI agents got away with killing many innocent people. A U.S. Marshall actually got a commendation for shooting to death 9 year old Sammy Weaver and his little dog in the initial assault on the Weaver cabin at Ruby Ridge.
11
Mr. Blow asks with wonder, why are people buying guns and joining the NRA if crime is falling. Perhaps it is because gun ownership is at an all time high? Perhaps it is because in 1986 there were sixteen states (including Texas and many in the South) that did not allow concealed carry, while today some form of concealed carry is allowed in all fifty states? Perhaps it is because that since 1950 all mass shootings except one have occurred in "gun free zones" where the victims were all sitting ducks.
Also, consider this: New York City has some of the toughest gun control laws in the country. After Sandy Hook, Governor Cuomo rammed through tougher laws in the form of the SAFE Act. New York City used to have "Stop, Question, and Frisk" that took thousands of illegal guns off the street. That practice has been stopped and the murder rate in New York City is up 24%.
Connect the dots Mr. Blow.
Also, consider this: New York City has some of the toughest gun control laws in the country. After Sandy Hook, Governor Cuomo rammed through tougher laws in the form of the SAFE Act. New York City used to have "Stop, Question, and Frisk" that took thousands of illegal guns off the street. That practice has been stopped and the murder rate in New York City is up 24%.
Connect the dots Mr. Blow.
17
Mr. Blow misses a key point.
Whatever the reality, many white males feel under siege. Power is shifting in daily life, due to changing values, less economic opportunity and the leveling effect of the Internet. White males are no longer the default leaders of family and community. Women and people of color now also claim that role.
Among white males, especially those with limited opportunity, there has been an intense reaction, one that been deftly exploited by right-wing commentators, and by Tea Party Republicans and their donors.
We cannot fully judge the intensity of this reaction unless we appreciate the enduring influence of MALE DOMINANCE and FEAR OF OTHERS (those who are different), two primal instincts that served our species well over millions of years of evolution, but are dysfunctional and disruptive in today's society. These potent, atavistic drives energize otherwise mundane grievances of everyday life.
This male-plus-xenophobic reaction has arisen not only in this country, but worldwide, leading to an upsurge of religious fundamentalism, and terrorist violence. What these movements – of whatever faith – have in common is subjugation of women and hostility toward nonbelievers.
Liberals don't seem to want to understand this trend. It affronts something (which I don’t understand) in their belief system. Just watch the replies to this comment. But that is why liberals keep losing election after election, and it is why the NRA keeps gaining power and influence.
Whatever the reality, many white males feel under siege. Power is shifting in daily life, due to changing values, less economic opportunity and the leveling effect of the Internet. White males are no longer the default leaders of family and community. Women and people of color now also claim that role.
Among white males, especially those with limited opportunity, there has been an intense reaction, one that been deftly exploited by right-wing commentators, and by Tea Party Republicans and their donors.
We cannot fully judge the intensity of this reaction unless we appreciate the enduring influence of MALE DOMINANCE and FEAR OF OTHERS (those who are different), two primal instincts that served our species well over millions of years of evolution, but are dysfunctional and disruptive in today's society. These potent, atavistic drives energize otherwise mundane grievances of everyday life.
This male-plus-xenophobic reaction has arisen not only in this country, but worldwide, leading to an upsurge of religious fundamentalism, and terrorist violence. What these movements – of whatever faith – have in common is subjugation of women and hostility toward nonbelievers.
Liberals don't seem to want to understand this trend. It affronts something (which I don’t understand) in their belief system. Just watch the replies to this comment. But that is why liberals keep losing election after election, and it is why the NRA keeps gaining power and influence.
10
Here is another way to measure who should be leader of our country.
"The role of the politician is to lead human nature in the right direction and not to take advantage of it."
"The role of the politician is to lead human nature in the right direction and not to take advantage of it."
1
Great quote .. sadly politics and politicians now have to bow to moneyed interests before doing anything, and the majority of those with the fiscal power are showing that they thrive on taking advantage of human nature. And most americans buy it hook, line and sinker. Think FOX news and who's invested in it.
The NRA is nothing more than the political lobbying arm of the gun industrial complex. To say the NRA is winning is really to say another group of corporations has successfully bought the ability to control government. Where do they get the money? Sadly, from so many people working for low wages, barely able to feed their families who believe that if one gun makes them safer, six guns will make them six times safer. Only education and information can break this cycle.
8
The Second Amendment addresses the need for a well trained militia, not the right of everyone to own fire arms. If the those who support the NRA love guns so much, then all they have to do is join the National Guard.
4
Both the 1st and 2nd amendments are being interpreted by a court that apparently doesn't know the difference between a period and a comma.
Crime pays. But what really pays is the perception of crime. Just ask America's gun and ammo manufacturers and its sales organization -- the NRA.
3
The growth of conservative ideology baffles me. The lies they tell are transparent enough. Yet FOX News is the most watched. We've gone backwards into the wild west days and the world would laugh at us if we didn't scare them so.
5
so the senate overwhelmingly did not represent the people's will to institute background checks? not surprised.
I'm curious about the demographics where gun sales come from after the high profile murders. ?
I'm curious about the demographics where gun sales come from after the high profile murders. ?
1
"And so it goes", as Kurt Vonnegut once wrote.
A massacre like Sandy Hook occurs. Gun control advocates try to ignite massive public outrage against the NRA and push for more gun control legislation. Celebrities and many in the media jump on the bandwagon. And, in the end, the NRA pushes back and law-abiding gun owners - feeling persecuted - support them. The gun control efforts fail, and gun control advocates blame the NRA.
Perhaps it's time for gun control advocates to stop blaming the NRA for a while and engage in some reflection. Why do we keep failing? What are we doing wrong? But people who are self-righteous - like many gun control advocates - are incapable of this kind of reflection. And they will continue to fail in their efforts until they do so.
Some suggestions for gun control advocates. First, stop vilifying law-abiding gun owners. Don't try to print their names in newspapers, as a newspaper in New York State did. Second, try to build trust to law-abiding gun owners. This means giving them specific assurances that their right to hunt, target shoot and protect their homes will not be taken away, and that the goal is to get the most dangerous weapons off the street. Third, stop making idiotic statements like "people don't need to hunt any more." As someone who is familiar with impoverished rural areas of upstate New York, I can tell you that people still hunt (and fish) to put food on the table (and in food banks).
Time to re-think. Try it.
A massacre like Sandy Hook occurs. Gun control advocates try to ignite massive public outrage against the NRA and push for more gun control legislation. Celebrities and many in the media jump on the bandwagon. And, in the end, the NRA pushes back and law-abiding gun owners - feeling persecuted - support them. The gun control efforts fail, and gun control advocates blame the NRA.
Perhaps it's time for gun control advocates to stop blaming the NRA for a while and engage in some reflection. Why do we keep failing? What are we doing wrong? But people who are self-righteous - like many gun control advocates - are incapable of this kind of reflection. And they will continue to fail in their efforts until they do so.
Some suggestions for gun control advocates. First, stop vilifying law-abiding gun owners. Don't try to print their names in newspapers, as a newspaper in New York State did. Second, try to build trust to law-abiding gun owners. This means giving them specific assurances that their right to hunt, target shoot and protect their homes will not be taken away, and that the goal is to get the most dangerous weapons off the street. Third, stop making idiotic statements like "people don't need to hunt any more." As someone who is familiar with impoverished rural areas of upstate New York, I can tell you that people still hunt (and fish) to put food on the table (and in food banks).
Time to re-think. Try it.
10
The NRA's ongoing and intensifying threats of insurrection obviously do have the legislators of the US cowering down in their bunkers.
6
America has clearly lost to the National Rogue Association. Why?
First, of the 30,000 Americans who die from gun shot every year about 20,000 or 2/3rds are suicides. There is no good guy with a gun nor any crime involved. Second, unarmed Black African American boys and men are routinely shot to death by armed white male civilians and cops.
Third, armed white men engaged in threatening or criminal activity are not arrested or are arrested alive and well. Fourth, America has 2.3 million people in prison or 25% of the world total with only 5% of the planets people.
Fifth, according to the Supreme Court corporations are people and money is speech. Sixth, Americans have a hunger for illegal drugs and a gun fetish.
Seventh, neither the British, Spanish, French, Natives nor slaves are coming.
Eighth, there are no threatening wild animals and we do not hunt to eat.
First, of the 30,000 Americans who die from gun shot every year about 20,000 or 2/3rds are suicides. There is no good guy with a gun nor any crime involved. Second, unarmed Black African American boys and men are routinely shot to death by armed white male civilians and cops.
Third, armed white men engaged in threatening or criminal activity are not arrested or are arrested alive and well. Fourth, America has 2.3 million people in prison or 25% of the world total with only 5% of the planets people.
Fifth, according to the Supreme Court corporations are people and money is speech. Sixth, Americans have a hunger for illegal drugs and a gun fetish.
Seventh, neither the British, Spanish, French, Natives nor slaves are coming.
Eighth, there are no threatening wild animals and we do not hunt to eat.
10
The NRA loves it when politicians call for gun control. Nothing boosts gun sales more than the risk that future sales may be curtailed. The best way to reduce the power of the NRA is to ignore them and eliminate gun control proposals (which don't seem to make any difference anyway.)
3
I think it is a good idea for fly fishermen to carry a powerful handgun when fishing in territory that has a presence of wild hogs, wolves and/or bears.
Now, that does imply home ownership of a gun that is hopefully well secured. It does not imply caual carry of guns in cars: that's a separate step, and a much more dangerous step to society.
I had a nice conversation once with an officer about guns and knives. He said that, in close quarters, a knife is often more dangerous than a gun. The rationale being you need to draw your gun while someone is charging you with a knife. It makes sense.
A few years back, when I lived in Houston, I had someone try to break into my apartment while I was there. I happened to be meditating and heard the subtle sound of someone touching my door knob of the apartment.
I greeted him -- a man wearing military camaflouge -- with a nine inch combat knife that I possessed, classified as a collectors item. He was schocked, said he was sorry, and left. I did not call the police, and never saw him again.
I think possession of AR 15s is a sign of a societal mental problem. Most, if not all, burglaries are not commited by a large group. They should be banned.
Now, that does imply home ownership of a gun that is hopefully well secured. It does not imply caual carry of guns in cars: that's a separate step, and a much more dangerous step to society.
I had a nice conversation once with an officer about guns and knives. He said that, in close quarters, a knife is often more dangerous than a gun. The rationale being you need to draw your gun while someone is charging you with a knife. It makes sense.
A few years back, when I lived in Houston, I had someone try to break into my apartment while I was there. I happened to be meditating and heard the subtle sound of someone touching my door knob of the apartment.
I greeted him -- a man wearing military camaflouge -- with a nine inch combat knife that I possessed, classified as a collectors item. He was schocked, said he was sorry, and left. I did not call the police, and never saw him again.
I think possession of AR 15s is a sign of a societal mental problem. Most, if not all, burglaries are not commited by a large group. They should be banned.
2
It must be a horrible existence to think you need a gun in church, on a college campus, and under your pillow. But this wide swath of NRA paranoia has a cumulative effect on our entire society. Too many women are killed by their ex,
kids kill their little sisters,vets kill themselves, teenagers kill for small-minded revenge and then we here that accidents happen.
The NRA states that..Guns don't kill people, people kill people."
The reality is "Gun ownership kills people".
I am not opposed to hunting. Here in northwest NJ we have a tremendous amount of black bears. We had one last summer in the garage and I see them crossing my garden going down to the creek on a regular basis. Hunters need to belong to clubs that house guns in a safe place away from angry spouses, foolish teenagers and innocent kids. Tomorrow more people will die because the NRA is funded to sell delusion to people.
kids kill their little sisters,vets kill themselves, teenagers kill for small-minded revenge and then we here that accidents happen.
The NRA states that..Guns don't kill people, people kill people."
The reality is "Gun ownership kills people".
I am not opposed to hunting. Here in northwest NJ we have a tremendous amount of black bears. We had one last summer in the garage and I see them crossing my garden going down to the creek on a regular basis. Hunters need to belong to clubs that house guns in a safe place away from angry spouses, foolish teenagers and innocent kids. Tomorrow more people will die because the NRA is funded to sell delusion to people.
128
The Second Amendment is the best example of an outdated constitution. The misguided interpretation of the amendment by SCOTUS only made matters worse. The original intent of the amendment was to provide for an armed militia, nothing more.
10
Yes, outdated, sure. And, the first amendment only applies to print media, and the 4th amendment does not apply to cells phones, right?
P.S. You are obviously not a good lawyer. The 1791 militia act defines the militia as everyone 18-45. And, it mandated that everyone own a rifle and musket.
P.S. You are obviously not a good lawyer. The 1791 militia act defines the militia as everyone 18-45. And, it mandated that everyone own a rifle and musket.
1
dab: Everyone. That included slaves and women and Indians too? I doubt it!
There were 1,160,000 violent crimes in the U.S. in 2013,including 14,196 murders according to FBI statistics.
That is more than enough to make law abiding citizens concerned.
Combine that epidemic of crime with the media assault on the police and law and order is endangered.
If law and order is undermined,then individual citizens must protect themselves.
That is more than enough to make law abiding citizens concerned.
Combine that epidemic of crime with the media assault on the police and law and order is endangered.
If law and order is undermined,then individual citizens must protect themselves.
5
The NRA use to be for background checks and no guns at schools but then Wayne LaPierre and other delusional leaders at the NRA- like Ted Nugent got tied to the gun manufacturers- and starting receiving huge checks from them to promote fear. Fear sells and they make a lot of money. Just by reading these comments there are people who truly believe that their guns are going to be taken away. How sad. They don't even read about what background checks mean. But the facts remain that having a gun at home increases the risk of fatalities within that home, either by domestic abuse, accidents or suicide. Another disturbing tactic by the NRA is their fear mongering against the government. They are growing a new breed of insurrectionists and I think the NRA is promoting domestic terrorism. In light of the recent anniversary of the bombing in Oklahoma- I find this to be disgraceful and they should be held accountable.
11
I'm 81 years old. Am I too old to join a "well regulated militia" so I could own a musket? Do I need special sponsorship?
5
At 81 you wouldn't have been considered "capable of bearing arms" under what George Washington called "a well regulated Militia Law."
The NRA has won because the majority of the members of the SOTUS involuntary or purposely is not able to understand a little line written in 18th century writing style, a time when punctuation rules didn't exist.
The Founders established a 'well regulated' militia, a people's army existing of men to protect the newly founded country from invasions, and were utterly opposed to establish a mighty military akin to one that they just defeated.
Now every Tom, Dick and occasional Harriet is supposedly a member of a militia to protect their homestead from the black helicopters and big, bad government with the most formidable military having its back.
But then, corporations are people too according to our learned justices from the right. I am just wondering on which few words in the Constitution they based that decision on. Is it the line that says the 'right of the corporations to buy themselves a government?
Only in America.....but I repeat myself.
The Founders established a 'well regulated' militia, a people's army existing of men to protect the newly founded country from invasions, and were utterly opposed to establish a mighty military akin to one that they just defeated.
Now every Tom, Dick and occasional Harriet is supposedly a member of a militia to protect their homestead from the black helicopters and big, bad government with the most formidable military having its back.
But then, corporations are people too according to our learned justices from the right. I am just wondering on which few words in the Constitution they based that decision on. Is it the line that says the 'right of the corporations to buy themselves a government?
Only in America.....but I repeat myself.
5
After each shooting, I have searched in vain to see if the shooter is a memeber of the NRA. Would not this be important information to be known and understood by readers? I ask reporters to include that information with all gun incidents.
4
The NRA has indeed "won". I have friends whose only political interest is protecting gun rights. They greatest certainty is that "democrats will take away their guns". It's a wonder that they have any guns left after sixteen years of Clinton and Obama. Of course they get pretty ticked at me when I mention this little annoying detail.
5
If more guns meant more safety, a battlefield would be the safest place on earth.
13
Increased gun sales are a sad measurement of our fear and our smallness which has overtaken the American spirit.
107
Having lived in the UK now for 4 years, and looking at the headlines in the USA, it's like looking into some sort of crazy alternate universe devoid of logic. I can't remember the last time there was a shooting reported here in the UK, but it seems like there's another one every day in the USA. Gun control is tight here, and we all seem to be the better for it. People can still hunt and shoot for sport; I have a friend who is a gun collector here in the UK and runs a (legal) shooting range, and he has no problem with the licensing and storage rules in part because it keeps his young daughter and her friends safe. I can't help but wonder if American police would be a bit less trigger-happy if they weren't worried that every soul they encountered was armed to the teeth (police in the UK are actually normally unarmed -can you believe it?- because their odds of encountering an armed person are so low). I wonder when America will wake up and realize how it's destroying itself with this gun-happy rhetoric.
241
People cannot shoot and hunt in the UK. Shooting is a very restricted, and controlled event that is not open to the vast majority of the population. I have lived in the UK and often wished that I had a gun. Street crime is out of control in the UK, as it is in the USA. Street crime is committed by a certain type of irresponsible, uncaring, person (criminal). The huge difference is that people in the USA have the means to defend themselves at all times, but not at all in the UK.
Cumbria in 2010 ring a bell? I believe. 12 killed, 11 shot and wounded before the gunman killed himself. Proof enough that guns laws don't stop the killing.
Gun Murders in England, Scotland and Wales 2011/12
There were 640 Murders / Homicides in Britain (England, Scotland and Wales) in 2011/12 (10.43 per million population)
Of these 640 Murders / Homicides, 44 involved a gun or firearm as the main weapon. Gun murders in Britain in 2011/12 represent 6% of the murder cases, (0.72 gun homicides per million population).
Gun Murders in England, Scotland and Wales 2011/12
There were 640 Murders / Homicides in Britain (England, Scotland and Wales) in 2011/12 (10.43 per million population)
Of these 640 Murders / Homicides, 44 involved a gun or firearm as the main weapon. Gun murders in Britain in 2011/12 represent 6% of the murder cases, (0.72 gun homicides per million population).
If the majority of Americans favor background checks, a ban on assault rifles and other common sense approaches , then we know what is wrong. Even when a colleague in the House of Representatives was shot, there was no response. When children were murdered in Newtown ,Massachusetts, there was no response. Congress is held hostage by NRA money. This is true cowardice.
14
The NRA has Not won, however we will continue to fight for our rights. With the Liberal way of thinking makes me more determined and donated more then just my membership and will continue to purchase more 60 round magazines for my AR-15 and handgun so I can open carry and conceal carry.
4
Nice grammar, in line with your "thought" process, but I digress. Open carry is a great idea: in addition to scaring a lot of law abiding citizens, who don't know whether you're a "good guy" or "bad guy", the "bad guys" know who to shoot first; for gun shops, it's also a great way to sell more guns, to protect ourselves from the open carry or not so subtle concealed carriers.
I wonder if guns everywhere won't have economic downturns for America. If I was a tourist from another country, I wouldn't want to visit a place where everyone carries a gun. If I wanted to build a factory, I wouldn't want to build it where my employees carried guns into the business. Instead of the land of the free and the home of the brave, we're looking like the land of the insane to the world.
53
A lot of people come here and rent guns, it's called "2nd amendment tourism" and you see it in a lot of places like Orlando.
People are moving to south for low taxes and a cheap cost of living. Turns out, freedom and liberty is pretty inexpensive and that's where people want to live.
Anti-gun Baltimore and Chicago should be so lucky as to have Dallas's crime and homicide rate.
People are moving to south for low taxes and a cheap cost of living. Turns out, freedom and liberty is pretty inexpensive and that's where people want to live.
Anti-gun Baltimore and Chicago should be so lucky as to have Dallas's crime and homicide rate.
7
dwb,
I lived Chicago and a number of other cities and one of the books that was required reading was how to lie with statistics.Some cities like Dallas or Calgary have sparsely populated cores and everybody lives in bedroom communities that is not Chicago or Montreal. Houston has twice the crime rate of Dallas. The USA and Canada have the same crime rate. The violent crime rate of the USA is more than twice the violent crime rate of Canada. Does this mean that Canada's white collar crime rate is vastly higher than that of the US or does it mean that the USA looks to arrest mostly low hanging fruit.
I would suggest US society likes he convenience of arresting and locking up those who are most defenseless much more than a reflection of the efficacy of guns.
I lived Chicago and a number of other cities and one of the books that was required reading was how to lie with statistics.Some cities like Dallas or Calgary have sparsely populated cores and everybody lives in bedroom communities that is not Chicago or Montreal. Houston has twice the crime rate of Dallas. The USA and Canada have the same crime rate. The violent crime rate of the USA is more than twice the violent crime rate of Canada. Does this mean that Canada's white collar crime rate is vastly higher than that of the US or does it mean that the USA looks to arrest mostly low hanging fruit.
I would suggest US society likes he convenience of arresting and locking up those who are most defenseless much more than a reflection of the efficacy of guns.
dwb: people can use or own guns in most countries, so I don't really know why people would travel to the U.S. just to shoot a gun. As for the rest, you're just being politically defensive.
The reason I have given up being a "gun control advocate" is that I begin to lose sight of the desired outcome for a progressive like myself. I used to look at domestic gun violence through the same prism as psychopathic slaughter in a crowded theater. Reducing domestic violence is a worthy goal that surely demands a multilevel approach. Mass murder may have nothing in common except for death from guns. One must get goals, tactics and strategies right in order to be effective. Reducing everything to "if we just had strict gun laws like in Europe, Asia, etc ...", calls for some serious magical thinking. There is only so much progressive energy to spread around. Opposing concealed weapons is a wasted fight in our state. Blocking guns in our schools is good goal with a specific strategy. Finally, even Quixote tired of his impossible campaigns, and grew cynical. Let's do what we have even small hopes for success.
6
if you want to be successful then dont try to leave our children as free targets to criminals....
Mr. Blow has clearly laid out the link between mass shootings at Sandy Hook Elementary, the movie theater melee in Aurora, Colorado, the shootings of Gabrielle Giffords and her supporters in Tucson, Arizona and the uptick in sales of guns. Individuals have a choice when confronted with such horrific & needless tragedies, either to become a supporter of gun control, purchase a gun or to be apathetic and do nothing.
Those who buy guns and are ardent NRA members argue that guns don't kill people, people kill people. This may be true, although what would the mentally ill individuals do if they didn't have access to guns? These poor confused souls were obviously paranoid schizophrenia and deeply troubled. Even though all of them were unstable, they were able to purchase guns legally.
It seems as though paranoia and fear are the driving force behind those that distrust the government and these primal emotions are exploited by the Republican party which shrewdly reinforces their fears in their speeches and frenzied support for the NRA. Timothy McVeigh, the Oklahoma city bomber, also distrusted the federal government & decided to take the law into his own hands by destroying the federal building. Unfortunately, the GOP's fervent mainstream messages reinforce gun owners fear & paranoia. These messages of war hawkishness, criticism of big government & support for the NRA is a toxic witches brew for paranoid people.
Those who buy guns and are ardent NRA members argue that guns don't kill people, people kill people. This may be true, although what would the mentally ill individuals do if they didn't have access to guns? These poor confused souls were obviously paranoid schizophrenia and deeply troubled. Even though all of them were unstable, they were able to purchase guns legally.
It seems as though paranoia and fear are the driving force behind those that distrust the government and these primal emotions are exploited by the Republican party which shrewdly reinforces their fears in their speeches and frenzied support for the NRA. Timothy McVeigh, the Oklahoma city bomber, also distrusted the federal government & decided to take the law into his own hands by destroying the federal building. Unfortunately, the GOP's fervent mainstream messages reinforce gun owners fear & paranoia. These messages of war hawkishness, criticism of big government & support for the NRA is a toxic witches brew for paranoid people.
61
I could draw the conclusion that the upswing in gun ownership is the cause for the decreasing rates of violent crime that Mr. Blow states.
As for the question of what the mentally ill individuals would do if they didn't have access to guns, I don't know, maybe fill a rental truck up with ANFO and park it in front of a building as was done in OKC. Maybe go on a mass stabbing spree as was done in China. Maybe cut someone's head off as was done in Moore, OK, maybe wield a hatchet as was done in Jamaica, NY.
An overwhelming majority of legal gun owners in this country recognize the responsibility they have to be safe and live their entire lives without encounter and without infringing on your way of life. Enacting laws that make it more difficult to legally own weapons does nothing to deter those that would use them violently, it just takes weapons out of the hands of a population that might make the criminal take pause if their mental state still allows them to make those risk calculations, and if they are no longer capable of making the risk calculation, then God willing there is a licensed gun owner in the vicinity that can limit the catastrophe they reign down on others around them.
As for the question of what the mentally ill individuals would do if they didn't have access to guns, I don't know, maybe fill a rental truck up with ANFO and park it in front of a building as was done in OKC. Maybe go on a mass stabbing spree as was done in China. Maybe cut someone's head off as was done in Moore, OK, maybe wield a hatchet as was done in Jamaica, NY.
An overwhelming majority of legal gun owners in this country recognize the responsibility they have to be safe and live their entire lives without encounter and without infringing on your way of life. Enacting laws that make it more difficult to legally own weapons does nothing to deter those that would use them violently, it just takes weapons out of the hands of a population that might make the criminal take pause if their mental state still allows them to make those risk calculations, and if they are no longer capable of making the risk calculation, then God willing there is a licensed gun owner in the vicinity that can limit the catastrophe they reign down on others around them.
Primal emotions, and the example of the Founding Fathers logical genius, are just two reasons for distrusting the Government. The Government's own behavior is another.
Why are people like you so against organizations that wish to defend the 2nd Amendment? I am not an NRA member or support BUT, I will defend anyone that supports the Constitution and that includes the 2nd Amendment. I myself, do not even own a firearm but, I will not ever supress the rights of others to own a firearm. Our founding fathers were bright enough not only to add it to our Constitution but, they added it up near the very top of our rights because they knew that a populas that cannot defend itself is one that will find itself supressed and no longer a free nation. From the evil of men and the evil of government. The GOP and the NRA do not instill fear or paranoia as you claim, they both reinforce what is already written into our rights as Americans. How can you support a party or person that does not defend our Constitution? ALL of our Constitution, not just parts. Once we allow parts to be eroded, then we will stand by and watch all of it be taken away.
Because the consumer product safety commission is legally barred from regulating firearms (thank to NRA enacted legislation), faulty gunlocks are being sold to unwitting gun buyers by unscrupulous gun dealers.
13
gunlocks are not firearms
Re-read your statement carefully.
The consumer product safety commission is absolutely NOT barred from regulating trigger locks, because they are not classified as firearms!
The consumer product safety commission is also not barred from overseeing build quality and proper function. The legislation out there which bars punitive and frivolous litigation against firearm manufacturers does NOT protect said manufacturers from liability stemming from faulty design or build quality. Remington has had to recall THOUSANDS of pistols over the past two years because the design was inherently DANGEROUS.
Know who pointed out the safety hazards? Gun owners.
The consumer product safety commission is absolutely NOT barred from regulating trigger locks, because they are not classified as firearms!
The consumer product safety commission is also not barred from overseeing build quality and proper function. The legislation out there which bars punitive and frivolous litigation against firearm manufacturers does NOT protect said manufacturers from liability stemming from faulty design or build quality. Remington has had to recall THOUSANDS of pistols over the past two years because the design was inherently DANGEROUS.
Know who pointed out the safety hazards? Gun owners.
John - Your statement is completely false. Gun locks are not firearms and therefore are not barred from the CPSC. Also the only reason the CPSC doesn't cover firearms is because they are already covered by another government agency called the AFT.
As an official act of surrender to the NRA, the next time a demented gun owner snuffs out the lives of a dozen or more 3 year old children (apparently, 6 year old lives won't do it) Congress should pass the AGA or Affordable Gun Act ,which would provide subsidies for gun sales to those who can't afford one and which includes a mandate to buy a firearm even if you don't want one. That way all American citizens will be able to settle any dispute, solve any real or imagined problem with fatal finality and may the last
person standing his ground shut off the lights.
person standing his ground shut off the lights.
43
Just because someone owns a gun does not mean that person has to use it. Guns serve a purpose. If we didn't have guns we would have to revert to swords, daggers, battle-axes, spears, archery etc. to defend ourselves, wage war, or anything else that ALL of our ancestors used in their lives.
But increasing State funding for greater public mental health services is too much to ask for?
In Vermont, we have recently succeeded in getting limited new regulations through both houses of the legislature and have high hopes Gov. Shumlin will sign the legislation. Advocates for the restrictions have kept them narrowly targeted and have not made irrational claims for how much safer they will make Vermonters -- we have simply embraced small, calm steps in what Vermonters widely agree is a reasonable balancing of regulation and freedom. Polls show the overwhelming number of Vermont gun-owners support the bill. The vehement opposition of the NRA-backed groups campaigning to scare politicians into voting against the will of their constituents contains all the usual mischaracterization and fevered rhetoric but, for now, it isn't working as well as usual. The bill has been narrowed as it progressed but it has survived.
23
Rev. Barnaby, the state legislature was bought and paid for by Bloomberg supported group(s) in the last election cycle. Gun sense Vermont (or whatever the name) is also Bloomberg supported, although they will not admit it. The laws you are enamored with are unneeded in Vermont. I, for one, am opposed to these "feel good" and unnecessary laws. What is being seen here is the impact of one party control in state politics. The legislature is no longer attuned to the residents, but to political ideology.
Meanwhile without the bill, Vermont has the lowest rate of homicide in the Nation.
It took a huge amount of untiring and focused lobbying to persuade our legislators that common-sense gun-safety measures will be good for all of us; it remains to be seen what our governor, who has been stubbornly unwilling to support any guns-safety legislation, will do in the face of solid action from our legislature.
In Florida, there's a bit of pushback. No one seems to want open carry, which would scare tourists. A bill in the legislature to force universities to allow concealed carry has been taken off the Senate agenda.
The fatal shooting of a high school kid in Jacksonville by an evidently panicked visitor from Satellite Beach (who was convicted of murder), as well as a movie theater shooting, may have given some people second thoughts about "self protection."
Meanwhile, family shootings and the incredibly high rates of shootings in certain poor neighborhoods continue.
The fatal shooting of a high school kid in Jacksonville by an evidently panicked visitor from Satellite Beach (who was convicted of murder), as well as a movie theater shooting, may have given some people second thoughts about "self protection."
Meanwhile, family shootings and the incredibly high rates of shootings in certain poor neighborhoods continue.
17
Open carry would scare not just tourists but also ordinary citizens, no?
However the FL legislature still feels it is okay to have a gag order that prevents physicians (and pediatricians like myself who just want children to be safe) from discussing safety measures to families who own guns?
1
While gun control is a good starting point, the root of the problem is ignorance. It requires hard work and suppression of old habits to learn how to think rationally, and it is especially hard when most Americans are told (by organizations like Fox News and the NRA) to not even consider thinking rationally about issues such as guns.
Many people like to talk about generational poverty, while poverty is an issue worthy of discussion, and a key role in American Ignorance, it is time to talk about generational ignorance and how to fight irrationality.
Many people like to talk about generational poverty, while poverty is an issue worthy of discussion, and a key role in American Ignorance, it is time to talk about generational ignorance and how to fight irrationality.
41
Ok, lets begin about thinking rationally. Places that are not safe, Chicago, DC, Oakland, Newark etc have strict gun control, places that are safe Vermont and most of the US.
Crime, gun crime and homicides have gone down as gun ownership has gone up.
Gun control doesn't help and guns don't cause crime.
Crime, gun crime and homicides have gone down as gun ownership has gone up.
Gun control doesn't help and guns don't cause crime.
You mean irrationality in the form of looking at an AR and pitching a fit? Irrationality in the form of utter refusal to understand that it is mechanically no different from granddad's WWII-surplus M1? You mean irrationality in the form of trying to arbitrarily categorizing certain firearms based solely on external features which have precisely NOTHING to do with how the firearm functions?
You mean irrationality in the form of repeatedly making claims about certain types of firearms which time and time again have been proven false by people who bothered to do a little research?
THAT kind of irrationality? Frankly, sir, your measure of irrationality is about as far from the established definition of the word as it is possible to get.
Gun control advocates THRIVE on the irrational behavior of the mob that is the American people. Leading advocates, such as Josh Sugarman and Dianne Feinstein, survive by preying on the general public's lack of knowledge about firearms and how they work. Without fail, they attempt to ramrod knee-jerk legislation through state and local organizations while avoiding ANY meaningful public debate because the KNOW that once folks with a technical background (I have a degree in engineering) get involved, their arguments start falling flat on their face.
You mean irrationality in the form of repeatedly making claims about certain types of firearms which time and time again have been proven false by people who bothered to do a little research?
THAT kind of irrationality? Frankly, sir, your measure of irrationality is about as far from the established definition of the word as it is possible to get.
Gun control advocates THRIVE on the irrational behavior of the mob that is the American people. Leading advocates, such as Josh Sugarman and Dianne Feinstein, survive by preying on the general public's lack of knowledge about firearms and how they work. Without fail, they attempt to ramrod knee-jerk legislation through state and local organizations while avoiding ANY meaningful public debate because the KNOW that once folks with a technical background (I have a degree in engineering) get involved, their arguments start falling flat on their face.
1
" It requires hard work and suppression of old habits to learn how to think rationally, and it is especially hard when most Americans are told (by organizations like Fox News and the NRA) to not even consider thinking rationally about issues such as guns." Wrong. You are living proof: unemployment numbers are down, because you've been told, even though there are no jobs, not a smidgen of corruption, irs rat loislearner did nothing wrong, so says fast'nfuriousericholder, Benghazi was caused by a video, not a dime to the deficit, keep your doctor, period, keep your plan, health insurance went down $2500, and blowjobbill's wife deleted only wedding and funeral plans. "... it is time to talk about generational ignorance and how to fight irrationality.". Wrong. It's a waste of time dealing with your ignorance and irrationality.
Common sense has won. The NRA were along for the ride.
17
I hope they are winning! Otherwise, we all lose.
17
When the NRA wins, people lose their lives, limbs, and loved ones.
59
HDNY, where is your proof? You have non, when the gun control advocates win just as many people die, they just die in different ways. This has been proven in both Europe and Australia. Look into Kennesaw GA. Look at the law that they have and then look at the crime rates.
The NRA has long been a supporter of Civil Rights fighting for the rights of blacks to arm themselves against the Ku Klux Klan. So, I guess that the NRA winning in the area of Civil Rights is a bad thing in your eyes?
Mr Blow asks "Has the NRA Won"? Yes, it has. This debate is over. Everyone who wants to own guns owns as many as they desire, including assault weapons of every type. This is not the primary issue but rather that we cannot even hope to guns out of the hands of mentally ill citizens.
An acquaintance of mine had a mental breakdown and was self-committed to an institution. This person owned dozens of weapons and had a concealed carry permit. I approached local law enforcement to determine what action they needed to take to protect the community from this individual and protect this individual from themselves. This person had talked delusionally about "already being dead" and family and friends (including me) being "already dead" as well. Law enforcement said I could pursue it if I wanted but they felt certain that no action would be taken. Instead of the institutionalization of this individual being a reason to disarm them, their release from the institution would be proof that their mental illness was behind them.
I don't particularly fear Joe Citizen owning a gun. But our unwillingness as a society to fund a functioning mental health system, combined with our unwillingness to legitimately and aggressively screen prospective gun owners for mental illness, insures the "price of freedom" will continue to be the dozens killed in shootings such as Aurora, Newtown, and Blacksburg, to name but a few.
An acquaintance of mine had a mental breakdown and was self-committed to an institution. This person owned dozens of weapons and had a concealed carry permit. I approached local law enforcement to determine what action they needed to take to protect the community from this individual and protect this individual from themselves. This person had talked delusionally about "already being dead" and family and friends (including me) being "already dead" as well. Law enforcement said I could pursue it if I wanted but they felt certain that no action would be taken. Instead of the institutionalization of this individual being a reason to disarm them, their release from the institution would be proof that their mental illness was behind them.
I don't particularly fear Joe Citizen owning a gun. But our unwillingness as a society to fund a functioning mental health system, combined with our unwillingness to legitimately and aggressively screen prospective gun owners for mental illness, insures the "price of freedom" will continue to be the dozens killed in shootings such as Aurora, Newtown, and Blacksburg, to name but a few.
51
Lee N, what is the percentage of gun violence in America that involved assault-type weapons? How much did the rate of gun violence in America decline during the time period when their sale was restricted? Do you know the answers to these questions? I do.
I loathe guns, of all types, and wish that people did not love them so much (although I also know that people who own them legally generally - overwhelmingly - do not use them in a manner which harms others).
However, I also feel that the issue of gun violence in America involves factors which we on the Left are refusing to confront, to the terrible detriment of the very communities on behalf of whom we imagine we are acting.
I loathe guns, of all types, and wish that people did not love them so much (although I also know that people who own them legally generally - overwhelmingly - do not use them in a manner which harms others).
However, I also feel that the issue of gun violence in America involves factors which we on the Left are refusing to confront, to the terrible detriment of the very communities on behalf of whom we imagine we are acting.
1
Has this person been determined to be a threat to self or others? Merely self admitting for treatment is not disqualifying in itself. You seem to imply that 'any' mental illness should be automatically disqualifying but this is imprecise and unnecessary.
1
Liberal society at large has eliminate virtually all the large State Mental Hospitals.
And the Blacksburg, VA shooter had been adjudicated as seriously mentally ill, and therefore ineligible to possess firearms in VA, but the State record keeping system failed. And he passed his background check.
And the Blacksburg, VA shooter had been adjudicated as seriously mentally ill, and therefore ineligible to possess firearms in VA, but the State record keeping system failed. And he passed his background check.
1
Gun ownership correlates with homicides and accidental deaths.
-Living in countries with strict laws limiting gun ownership is very safe.
-Living in countries with gun proliferation is very dangerous.
-NRA is a gun lobby pandering to a powerful industry whose sole interest is to increase gun ownership. Framing gun ownership as a constitutional issue and frightening individuals into purchasing weapons is corrupting
-Gone--our 'constitutional right' to not be surrounded by individuals with concealed or unconcealed weapon-s who have acquired these weapons without adequate background checks and who put me at risk?
-Every gun sold and carried outside the home that is not a hunting weapon puts me and everyone else at greater risk.
-The NRA has compounded the idiocy by supporting Federal restrictions on even studying these issues as if knowledge was also an abridgement of Constitutional rights. Guns are a major health issue. Epidemic.
-The few statistics on "stand your ground" demonstrate that guns are wrongly used to injure and kill---one of the fatalities being the collection of homicide data.
-Guns kill. NRA kills. Politicians in lockstep with NRA kill by ignorance and inaction.
-Living in countries with strict laws limiting gun ownership is very safe.
-Living in countries with gun proliferation is very dangerous.
-NRA is a gun lobby pandering to a powerful industry whose sole interest is to increase gun ownership. Framing gun ownership as a constitutional issue and frightening individuals into purchasing weapons is corrupting
-Gone--our 'constitutional right' to not be surrounded by individuals with concealed or unconcealed weapon-s who have acquired these weapons without adequate background checks and who put me at risk?
-Every gun sold and carried outside the home that is not a hunting weapon puts me and everyone else at greater risk.
-The NRA has compounded the idiocy by supporting Federal restrictions on even studying these issues as if knowledge was also an abridgement of Constitutional rights. Guns are a major health issue. Epidemic.
-The few statistics on "stand your ground" demonstrate that guns are wrongly used to injure and kill---one of the fatalities being the collection of homicide data.
-Guns kill. NRA kills. Politicians in lockstep with NRA kill by ignorance and inaction.
67
100% right on! BUT if you think reason will mitigate the need for so many defective american males to validate themselves with their "Cowboy Dreams" you are sadly mistaken.
Lousy jobs -lousy marriages - lousy outlook BUT a closet full of guns and ammo and the pipe dreams of being a real hero!
Lousy jobs -lousy marriages - lousy outlook BUT a closet full of guns and ammo and the pipe dreams of being a real hero!
Show me in the constitution were it says you have the right to not be surrounded by individuals with concealed or unconcealed weapons?
Every gun sold and carried legally outside the home that is not a hunting weapon makes you and everyone else safer. They can defend you way before any police officer could show up.
Every gun sold and carried legally outside the home that is not a hunting weapon makes you and everyone else safer. They can defend you way before any police officer could show up.
1
Wow completely wrong, just look at Mexico that has very strict gun control and its homicide rate
1
This article also leaves out that as legal gun ownership has risen crime has gone down, homicides have gone down. The narrative that gun ownership leads to crime or homicide is simply false.
18
The Harvard Journal of Law & Public Policy published a review article
'Would Banning Firearms Reduce Murder and Suicide?
A review of International and Some Domestic Evidence'
http://www.law.harvard.edu/students/orgs/jlpp/Vol30_No2_KatesMauseronlin...
Several commonly held and incorrect beliefs are addressed.
'Would Banning Firearms Reduce Murder and Suicide?
A review of International and Some Domestic Evidence'
http://www.law.harvard.edu/students/orgs/jlpp/Vol30_No2_KatesMauseronlin...
Several commonly held and incorrect beliefs are addressed.
3
Because in your mind correlation surely implies causation -- at least if it's correlation in the direction you favor.
1
And the planet has warmed up, too, which proves that guns cause global warming.
seriously: you haven't any evidence at all that more guns means more safety. there is, however, good evidence that guns increase the number of accidental deaths, suicides, and family killing family.
i'm certainly in favor of Second Amendment rights, which I take to be the rights to own and use arms in a reasonably-regulated fashion. I'd just like to see background checks, mandatory training, and requirements for insurance, as well as a fair legal procedure for taking guns away from dangerous crazy people.
seriously: you haven't any evidence at all that more guns means more safety. there is, however, good evidence that guns increase the number of accidental deaths, suicides, and family killing family.
i'm certainly in favor of Second Amendment rights, which I take to be the rights to own and use arms in a reasonably-regulated fashion. I'd just like to see background checks, mandatory training, and requirements for insurance, as well as a fair legal procedure for taking guns away from dangerous crazy people.
4
I would like to see the discussion change to 'responsibility'. The conservative crowd loves to talk about the responsibilities that come with every right.
So if you own a gun, you are 100% responsible for anything that is done with it. If one of your children picks up a loaded gun in your house and kills their sibling, you just committed first degree murder and will go to jail for life.
Gun manufacturers must report all sales to dealers. Since gun owners are so paranoid about "gun registries", all future reporting is optional, but the last reported owner of a gun is 100% responsible for its use, as stated above.
If the dealer does not report a sale and someone is killed with a gun they sold, that dealer is put out of business and goes to jail for life. It's a really simple solution, and if every gun owner is as trustworthy and responsible as the gun lobby says, they have nothing to worry about.
So if you own a gun, you are 100% responsible for anything that is done with it. If one of your children picks up a loaded gun in your house and kills their sibling, you just committed first degree murder and will go to jail for life.
Gun manufacturers must report all sales to dealers. Since gun owners are so paranoid about "gun registries", all future reporting is optional, but the last reported owner of a gun is 100% responsible for its use, as stated above.
If the dealer does not report a sale and someone is killed with a gun they sold, that dealer is put out of business and goes to jail for life. It's a really simple solution, and if every gun owner is as trustworthy and responsible as the gun lobby says, they have nothing to worry about.
65
This is nonsense Mike. There are so many other things killing or maiming people in numbers very year and in higher numbers than guns.So why is it we just want to pick on guns but will turn a blind eye to all the other things happening in america today. What if we put on all the restrictions you want on guns here on automobiles? Anyone owning a automobile would be responsible for any damage,maiming of a person or death.You let your son use the car he goes out and decides to drink that night wrecks does 100 thousand in damage, or someone dies in the accident,then you should be responsible its your car. Your daughter is driving it she is texting while driving a family dies because of it. You should be held responsible right? The list could go on.And with so man people dying every year with smoking and driving up health care cost ,Why are we turning a blind eye here? Sure there have been laws past on it and a lot of fines but a blind eye is turned on smoking no one is out there going against smoking like they are going against guns. And smoking kills many times over what guns do.
2
In a perfect world when everyone plays by the rules Mike, perhaps.
The issue is that laws are designed to protect people from the irresponsible, while not blocking people from certain privileges or rights. Look at the speed limits. It appears to be a non-verbally established fact that 10 mph over the limit is "safe". You won't get a ticket, except in uncommon circumstances. Yet, there are places where people can get away with 20 mph over the limit. And why, just why does someone need to travel that fast? 99% of the time they do not. There is no emergency. They just "feel" better going faster, with the illusion that they will get to their destination faster (which may be a couple minutes at best).
Gun laws are an inconvenience to those who want to own guns, but not an obstacle. It means it is not immediate. You have to go through a proper screening. Is that really so terrible? And what of assault weapons? There is no good cause for an individual to have one, except if they are a soldier and going to war. No, people want to own them for the visceral power pleasure of it. And then when the weapon is abused... people seek to disavow responsibility. Lives are at stake. It is not worth the death of others just to fulfill some power fantasy of some gun loving men. People need to step back and look at REALITY, instead of pure self interest. Is that too much to ask?
The issue is that laws are designed to protect people from the irresponsible, while not blocking people from certain privileges or rights. Look at the speed limits. It appears to be a non-verbally established fact that 10 mph over the limit is "safe". You won't get a ticket, except in uncommon circumstances. Yet, there are places where people can get away with 20 mph over the limit. And why, just why does someone need to travel that fast? 99% of the time they do not. There is no emergency. They just "feel" better going faster, with the illusion that they will get to their destination faster (which may be a couple minutes at best).
Gun laws are an inconvenience to those who want to own guns, but not an obstacle. It means it is not immediate. You have to go through a proper screening. Is that really so terrible? And what of assault weapons? There is no good cause for an individual to have one, except if they are a soldier and going to war. No, people want to own them for the visceral power pleasure of it. And then when the weapon is abused... people seek to disavow responsibility. Lives are at stake. It is not worth the death of others just to fulfill some power fantasy of some gun loving men. People need to step back and look at REALITY, instead of pure self interest. Is that too much to ask?
What are you actually stating here when you talk about manufacturers?
Manufacturers report every single serial number produced to the ATF.
They report every transfer to a wholesaler to the ATF.
Every wholesaler reports every transfer to a retailer to the ATF.
Retailers are required BY FEDERAL LAW to maintain sales records (meaning keeping the Form 4473) on file for 20 YEARS. That form 4473 is the background check form that you folks love to claim isn't present.
Any law enforcement official with a valid legal warrant can access a dealer's records to find the last recorded transferee of a firearm.
That is how the system works. Period.
As a gun owner, concealed carry permit holder and certified pistol instructor, I absolutely AM 100% responsible for every single round that exits my firearms. I expect to face an investigation and possible legal proceedings if something happens involving my firearms. I have advocated very strongly for parents who fail to properly secure their firearms to be held criminally liable if someone comes to harm as a result of unauthorized access to said firearms!
Get off your high horse, stop listening to Chris Matthews, the hacks at NYT and HuffPost, and the halfwits elected to Congress by the irrational and ignorant masses in states like NY and CA and actually TALK TO GUN OWNERS!
Manufacturers report every single serial number produced to the ATF.
They report every transfer to a wholesaler to the ATF.
Every wholesaler reports every transfer to a retailer to the ATF.
Retailers are required BY FEDERAL LAW to maintain sales records (meaning keeping the Form 4473) on file for 20 YEARS. That form 4473 is the background check form that you folks love to claim isn't present.
Any law enforcement official with a valid legal warrant can access a dealer's records to find the last recorded transferee of a firearm.
That is how the system works. Period.
As a gun owner, concealed carry permit holder and certified pistol instructor, I absolutely AM 100% responsible for every single round that exits my firearms. I expect to face an investigation and possible legal proceedings if something happens involving my firearms. I have advocated very strongly for parents who fail to properly secure their firearms to be held criminally liable if someone comes to harm as a result of unauthorized access to said firearms!
Get off your high horse, stop listening to Chris Matthews, the hacks at NYT and HuffPost, and the halfwits elected to Congress by the irrational and ignorant masses in states like NY and CA and actually TALK TO GUN OWNERS!
3
The data is chilling, to be sure.
I do have a question about the reported statistics, however.
With sales (and manufacturing of more guns) on the rise, how many of these weapons are going to first-time gun owners and how many are augmenting the cache of those who are already armed? I'm not whistling past the graveyard here - a particularly appropriate metaphor, sad to say - but rather I think the news is worse for the country if more & more people are becoming gun owners versus more & more guns owned by people whose ranks are not rapidly expanding. (With NRA membership going up, I fear the worst.)
Does anyone have the data? If so, please share. Thanks!
I do have a question about the reported statistics, however.
With sales (and manufacturing of more guns) on the rise, how many of these weapons are going to first-time gun owners and how many are augmenting the cache of those who are already armed? I'm not whistling past the graveyard here - a particularly appropriate metaphor, sad to say - but rather I think the news is worse for the country if more & more people are becoming gun owners versus more & more guns owned by people whose ranks are not rapidly expanding. (With NRA membership going up, I fear the worst.)
Does anyone have the data? If so, please share. Thanks!
7
The statistics you ask for (first time vs multiple ownership) are unavailable. We are left with anecdotal evidence provided by the observations, not measurements, of firearms dealers and considering firearms training classes attendance. Another measure would be considering those states that require licensing for ownership and any statistics they may release. Self reporting of firearms ownership is notoriously inaccurate as discussed by polling organizations themselves.
Its doubtful that the privacy laws associated with firearms purchasing and ownership will be loosened so as to allow an accurate analysis.
Its doubtful that the privacy laws associated with firearms purchasing and ownership will be loosened so as to allow an accurate analysis.
The guns are "probably" going to people who ALREADY have weapons. Many see it as a hobby collecting guns. Some surveys say increased number of gun owners, some say decreasing number of gun owners.
Gun stats are VERY hard to get...You are looking at many gun owners who are paranoid about saying if they own guns..1) The gov'mint will take them away and 2) Criminals (blacks, hispanics etc) will rob me of my guns.
The Pew Research group has the best statistics:
When the GSS first asked about gun ownership in 1973, 49% reported having a gun or revolver in their home or garage. In 2012, 34% said they had a gun in their home or garage. When the survey first asked about personal gun ownership in 1980, 29% said a gun in their home personally belonged to them. This stands at 22% in the 2012 GSS survey.
http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2013/06/04/a-minority-of-americans-...
As an ER and family doctor I study gun habits as much as I study the diagnosis and treatment of ebola..ebola is safer.
Gun stats are VERY hard to get...You are looking at many gun owners who are paranoid about saying if they own guns..1) The gov'mint will take them away and 2) Criminals (blacks, hispanics etc) will rob me of my guns.
The Pew Research group has the best statistics:
When the GSS first asked about gun ownership in 1973, 49% reported having a gun or revolver in their home or garage. In 2012, 34% said they had a gun in their home or garage. When the survey first asked about personal gun ownership in 1980, 29% said a gun in their home personally belonged to them. This stands at 22% in the 2012 GSS survey.
http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2013/06/04/a-minority-of-americans-...
As an ER and family doctor I study gun habits as much as I study the diagnosis and treatment of ebola..ebola is safer.
1
This nonsense that GOP senators trot out about the background check legislation not being effective flys in the face of very effective NRA-sponsored legislation giving gun dealers immunity for negligent criminal behavior that takes a toll daily in the blood and guts of innocents. Multiple lawsuits have been filed against gun dealers who did not take reasonable steps to prevent sales to straw purchasers who resell on the black market. In an ordinary case involving any product other than guns, evidence can be gathered and witnesses subpoenaed. But for guns these suits are regularly dismissed almost immediately thanks to a special legal immunity that Congress gave gun manufacturers, distributors and dealers, and their trade associations, at the behest of the NRA. Unlike any other industry, the gun industry can commit negligence with impunity
22
There is already Federal law making straw purchasing a felony.
http://www.fbi.gov/baltimore/press-releases/2015/chestertown-felon-sente...
http://www.fbi.gov/baltimore/press-releases/2015/chestertown-felon-sente...
This report stinks of fear. Even the gun dealers cited admitted as much. And fear is the coin of the realm when it comes to NRA membership, Wayne LaPierre's hate-mongering, and gun manufacturers' swelling accounts.
Note to 2nd Amendment worshipers- we already have a well-regulated militia, and the right for citizens to bear arms could easily be accommodated: if you need the psychological security blanket of a gun, join the military. Otherwise, use your gun money to pay for therapy.
Note to 2nd Amendment worshipers- we already have a well-regulated militia, and the right for citizens to bear arms could easily be accommodated: if you need the psychological security blanket of a gun, join the military. Otherwise, use your gun money to pay for therapy.
36
It's obvious that you have no knowledge of what is a militia.
Militia
Also found in: Legal, Encyclopedia, Wikipedia.
mi·li·tia (mə-lĭsh′ə)
n.
1. An army composed of ordinary citizens rather than professional soldiers.
2. A military force that is not part of a regular army and is subject to call for service in an emergency.
3. The whole body of physically fit civilians eligible by law for military service.
So you see until the Congress calls up the militia, as described in Article I section 8 of the U.S. Constitution, there is no militia. But in order for the militia to be called up, the U.S. citizen must be given the right to own and bear arms as provided for and by the 2nd Amendment.
Yes I do worship the 2nd Amendment as I worship all of the U.S. Constitution's amendments including your right to exercise the 1st Amendment.
The NRA was formed as the result of poor marksmanship observed of the Union Troops in the civil war. Dismayed by this lack of marksmanship shown by their troops, Union veterans Col. William C. Church and Gen. George Wingate formed the National Rifle Association in 1871. The primary goal of the association would be to "promote and encourage rifle shooting on a scientific basis," according to a magazine editorial written by Church. A full history can be read here: http://www.nrahq.org/history.asp.
So what other part of the U.S. Constitution do you want to destroy?
Militia
Also found in: Legal, Encyclopedia, Wikipedia.
mi·li·tia (mə-lĭsh′ə)
n.
1. An army composed of ordinary citizens rather than professional soldiers.
2. A military force that is not part of a regular army and is subject to call for service in an emergency.
3. The whole body of physically fit civilians eligible by law for military service.
So you see until the Congress calls up the militia, as described in Article I section 8 of the U.S. Constitution, there is no militia. But in order for the militia to be called up, the U.S. citizen must be given the right to own and bear arms as provided for and by the 2nd Amendment.
Yes I do worship the 2nd Amendment as I worship all of the U.S. Constitution's amendments including your right to exercise the 1st Amendment.
The NRA was formed as the result of poor marksmanship observed of the Union Troops in the civil war. Dismayed by this lack of marksmanship shown by their troops, Union veterans Col. William C. Church and Gen. George Wingate formed the National Rifle Association in 1871. The primary goal of the association would be to "promote and encourage rifle shooting on a scientific basis," according to a magazine editorial written by Church. A full history can be read here: http://www.nrahq.org/history.asp.
So what other part of the U.S. Constitution do you want to destroy?
2
10 US Code Subsection 311 states two tiers of militias.
And why do people like you have an issue with my ownership if I haven't committed any crimes?
Tolerance for those with your own views. Not for those who differ from your views? Interesting.
And why do people like you have an issue with my ownership if I haven't committed any crimes?
Tolerance for those with your own views. Not for those who differ from your views? Interesting.
Richard, the military is not a malitia, it is controled by the very government that the 2nd is in place to protect us from. The malitia has always been average Joe's (ie the butcher, or the cart boy at walmart, local farmers ect.) taking up arms. You can spout all of the non sense you want but even the SCOTUS agrees.
1
I'm reminded of a bumper sticker I saw years ago:
"When guns are outlawed, only outlaws will accidently shoot their children!"
Another question I have is: Didn't all those "illegal" guns out on the street start out as legally purchased guns? Someone somewhere went to a gun shop, legally bought the gun and then passed it on to the criminal. Doesn't this make a case for much stronger registration restrictions and background checks?
"When guns are outlawed, only outlaws will accidently shoot their children!"
Another question I have is: Didn't all those "illegal" guns out on the street start out as legally purchased guns? Someone somewhere went to a gun shop, legally bought the gun and then passed it on to the criminal. Doesn't this make a case for much stronger registration restrictions and background checks?
15
Straw buyers. Gun shows. Internet sales.
Not every gun is bought "legally."
Not every gun is bought "legally."
1
There are an estimated 300+ million guns in the US.
Semi-auto pistols, and rifles, with detachable magazines, have been legally sold to the American public, some models for over a hundred years.
Can anyone explain why the over 40 year old "war on drugs" has been largely a failure?
Semi-auto pistols, and rifles, with detachable magazines, have been legally sold to the American public, some models for over a hundred years.
Can anyone explain why the over 40 year old "war on drugs" has been largely a failure?
I see as much an Obama/Biden failure, as a NRA victory.
Obama fails to understand basic elements of leadership. Instead of making the pulpit his center stage after the Newtown massacre, he should have shamed John Boehner and Mitch McConnell into sitting next to him in the pew. Why weren't they publicly invited to help America mourn this tragedy, and come to our collective common sense.
And Biden seems to have no grasp on rhetoric or leverage. Following Newtown, he could have made gun control a "right to life" issue. The first group that he should have reached out to for consultation should have been leaders in the American faith community.
The NRA succeeds mostly because of the supreme bungling on the supposed "other side."
Obama fails to understand basic elements of leadership. Instead of making the pulpit his center stage after the Newtown massacre, he should have shamed John Boehner and Mitch McConnell into sitting next to him in the pew. Why weren't they publicly invited to help America mourn this tragedy, and come to our collective common sense.
And Biden seems to have no grasp on rhetoric or leverage. Following Newtown, he could have made gun control a "right to life" issue. The first group that he should have reached out to for consultation should have been leaders in the American faith community.
The NRA succeeds mostly because of the supreme bungling on the supposed "other side."
8
The NRA succeeds mostly because of the supreme mount of money they spend to buy the vote of the majority in Congress. It makes no difference what the American people think or want on whichever side.
1
Re: '' ...he should have shamed John Boehner and Mitch McConnell into sitting next to him.''
Do you not realize how many times both have shunned presidential invitations? Boehner and McConnell are constantly leveling a torrent of insults, disrespect, and paralyzing antipathy that eclipses what any president in living memory has had to put up with. Indeed, no president since the 19th century has been met with a less cooperative, less civilized, less mature opposition
Do you not realize how many times both have shunned presidential invitations? Boehner and McConnell are constantly leveling a torrent of insults, disrespect, and paralyzing antipathy that eclipses what any president in living memory has had to put up with. Indeed, no president since the 19th century has been met with a less cooperative, less civilized, less mature opposition
1
I should have known and expected: Obama was blamed for the ebola epidemic, the Iran negotiations, the shooting in Ferguson, North Charleston and many other places, failure of the VA, the tropical storms, the drought in the West, etc. etc. But I must admit, I would never have considered him the cause of the domination of the NRA! Thanks for adding to the list. I will sleep better tonight knowing who to blame for the next killing spree.
1
As many commentors here have noted, the only reason they own guns (except for hunting rifles, which do not include AK47s) is to kill other people. The bottom line is that except for access to weapons many innocent people would be alive today. The preachers can scream thou shalt not kill all day long, but with people owning millions of guns in this country it's a hollow (and ignored) exhortation.
12
Really? The only reason to own firearms is to kill?
So, the tens of thousands of competition shooters in this country and abroad are doing what, exactly?
Yes, I own firearms. I shoot competitively. I also carry concealed. I hope I go to my grave an old man having never even had to draw my pistol in self defense, never mind fire it at another human being.
So, the tens of thousands of competition shooters in this country and abroad are doing what, exactly?
Yes, I own firearms. I shoot competitively. I also carry concealed. I hope I go to my grave an old man having never even had to draw my pistol in self defense, never mind fire it at another human being.
Hope left America 47 years ago with the assassination of Bobby Kennedy, a trauma so severe it aroused the national conscience for gun control.
At 30,000/year gun deaths since 68, 1.4 million corpses, more than in all American wars, say yes to the proposition that the NRA has won its crusade for lies and mass killings.
At 30,000/year gun deaths since 68, 1.4 million corpses, more than in all American wars, say yes to the proposition that the NRA has won its crusade for lies and mass killings.
18
I have given up on this issue---yes as a nation the entire gun debate is embarrassing. But guns are who we are, at least a small part of who we are. The one comfort I take away from the entire debate, according to numbers on gun deaths, is knowing that I have made my family safer my not owning a gun.
16
While I agree that you have made your family safer, I hope you will not give up. As noted in other comments, a few local and state efforts are still managing to pass gun-safety legislation and /or resist the wave of everyone-buy, everyone-carry-anywhere laws pushed by the NRA and the gun industry, its sponsor. Please, for the sake of other people's children, don't give up.
Cutting off the head of the snake is the solution, no question. The NRA's unwarranted power and influence must be countered with strong accountability measures for it´s actions, including criminal prosecution for deliberately thwarting governance.
19
Excellent point. I'd love to see a class action suit against the NRA by family members of murdered and mass murdered Americans.
What are the responsibilities inherit in personal gun ownership and should Americans be comforted this nation has become the weapons underwriters to the rest of the 'free' world?
Where does the American populace get its information about politics and politicians, about crime and race relations? To whom are they listening? Whom are characterized as terrorists, as our enemies? How long will America continue to wage its War on Terror, when will America know when we are winning and when will America conclude that the war needs to end? Who are our heroes and what are those heroes doing in our name, in this country and throughout the American Empire? Has America decided to encourage her leaders in Washington and in her state capitals solve the more perplexing problems of governance including crime and combating terrorism in our representative democracy as we watch sports and American Idol?
Where does the American populace get its information about politics and politicians, about crime and race relations? To whom are they listening? Whom are characterized as terrorists, as our enemies? How long will America continue to wage its War on Terror, when will America know when we are winning and when will America conclude that the war needs to end? Who are our heroes and what are those heroes doing in our name, in this country and throughout the American Empire? Has America decided to encourage her leaders in Washington and in her state capitals solve the more perplexing problems of governance including crime and combating terrorism in our representative democracy as we watch sports and American Idol?
1
Other than a fear of crime, one the major reason the public favors the right-to-bear arms is that trust in all levels of government is near an all time low.
Polls show that government is seen as being incompetent while at the same time being over reaching.
Polls show that government is seen as being incompetent while at the same time being over reaching.
5
And so Joe Citizen goes down to the local pawn shop and buys a hand gun so that he can protect himself from the most powerful military force in the history of the world? Please.
1
My remaining curiosity is why Democrats are SO determined to see the black family unarmed. There can be no greater need for a firearm than the urban black family in a setting where the cops are so far away and criminals are so close by.
It just beats everything I ever saw. In all these large cities, the creeps have no problems getting their hands on any weapon at all, but mom & pop dare not even ask, with the fees and bureaucracy making legal gun ownership by law-abiding citizens a complete joke.
Is Charles engaged in a War on the Black Family?
It just beats everything I ever saw. In all these large cities, the creeps have no problems getting their hands on any weapon at all, but mom & pop dare not even ask, with the fees and bureaucracy making legal gun ownership by law-abiding citizens a complete joke.
Is Charles engaged in a War on the Black Family?
8
There are a lot of problems with your assertion. For one, there's no conclusive evidence suggesting that arming a populace lowers crime. There is, however, statistics that demonstrate a relationship between gun ownership and an uptick in gun violence.
You're also assuming that blacks living in inner cities have the money to purchase guns. Food, clothing and shelter are higher priorities for the thinking man and woman.
Also, most black communities in urban areas support gun control measures, so why lay this at Mr. Blow's feet? Shouldn't the people have the right to make their own decisions? Do we not still favor democracy in this country? The answer to that last question is in serious doubt, especially among conservatives.
You're also assuming that blacks living in inner cities have the money to purchase guns. Food, clothing and shelter are higher priorities for the thinking man and woman.
Also, most black communities in urban areas support gun control measures, so why lay this at Mr. Blow's feet? Shouldn't the people have the right to make their own decisions? Do we not still favor democracy in this country? The answer to that last question is in serious doubt, especially among conservatives.
Nice straw man.
Your average gun worshipper wants nothing less than to see black people armed the same way they are.
Your average gun worshipper wants nothing less than to see black people armed the same way they are.
And if anybody'd said anything about not letting black families have guns, your comment would be more than cheap sophistry based on nothing.
In my world, among my own family and friends, the gun people are the provincial ones who stay at home and almost never travel outside their home County. They live terrified at home. Myself, and the other gunless ones, travel the world freely, have lived in several States. We the gunless are unafraid and getting into our sixties, miraculously, unarmed. How is it possible?
14
Ah, the cowboy mentality on steroids. Fear-mongering is so much easier than rational thought. And much more profitable. I wonder how many of the NRA hierarchy has stock in gun and ammo manufacturers? What worries me is that I no longer will be able to know who enters my house with weapons. If one is carrying a gun one is more likely to use it without sufficient thought.
7
To answer your first question, Charles, yes. As a moderate Democrat with strong advocacy toward strict gun laws, background checks, etc., I have finally given up on our country, from a practical and moral standpoint. When our Congress was unable or unwilling to pass stricter gun laws after the massacre of CHILDREN at Sandy Hook, that for me was the end of my involvement in gun control. I have to face the reality that Americans have been utterly brainwashed and/or bought by the NRA, and, with more than a dash of utter ignorance thrown in, are incapable of seeing straight on this issue. It's all so sad, so embarrassing, so insane, yet so lacking in remedy. Signing petitions, marching, calling our Congressmen--it all seems such a fool's errand. Because it--is.
11
We try not to pass poorly written, misrepresented laws in a period of media-driven hysteria following a traumatic event. If these laws that failed had any merit they would pass today.
I can't pin it to an exact date, but with over 300,000,000 firearms in private hands in this country (almost one gun for every man, woman and child), and laws enacted every day to protect the rights of gun owners, and court decisions affirming gun rights in nearly every corner of every part of our country, I think it would be fair to say that the NRA won quite some time ago. With daily news accounts of more than a few "Good guys with guns" accidentally (and not) killing other people (including many children and other innocents) every day, we're beginning to see where all of this is taking us. I feel less safe in my community than I ever have in my whole lifetime. And with 300,000,000+ guns out there, I'd dare anyone to just TRY to convince anyone, in the name of restoring some kind of sanity around this issue, to surrender even SOME of their weapons.
6
The source of the divergence between the public's beliefs and reality is not far to seek: the right-wing propaganda machine. Until that is shut down, we are all whispering in the storm.
13
SO true. That media machine has misinformed and confused many, to the extent that they're voting and advocating against their own self interests. (another example: low-paid people against obamacare)
Do people who are against gun control think that safety belts lead to fewer traffic deaths, or that smoke and co2 alarms lead to fewer deaths? Or do they see those safety devices as unnecessary government meddling?
13
"Gun control" is a misleading term.
The issue is 'gun safety'. Do users and owners of guns have any duty whatsoever, to securely store and sort of safely use, their guns?
Or, is this just a right without any obligation? A unique sort of right in America.
The issue is 'gun safety'. Do users and owners of guns have any duty whatsoever, to securely store and sort of safely use, their guns?
Or, is this just a right without any obligation? A unique sort of right in America.
8
Well in some places they have the right to shoot anyone who they think MIGHT pose the tiniest possibility of any sort of threat. I don't think any responsibility goes with this right.
So maybe we should all get guns and shoot anyone who we think might pose a threat -- you know -- anyone with a gun.
So maybe we should all get guns and shoot anyone who we think might pose a threat -- you know -- anyone with a gun.
1
The inmates at the asylum don't necessarily have to outnumber the staff. The inmates just have to convince enough of the staff members that their actions are sane. The next thing you know, the asylum is in the control of the loony-tunes.
8
I'm confused. Here in Tennessee it's now legal to carry guns in public parks. Unless laws will also require gun bearers in parks to wear either a white hat or a black hat (you know, so we can tell the good guys from the bad guys) I'll quit taking grandson to the parks.
The N.R.A. had their convention here last week and while attendees could carry their personal operational weapons, the gazillion on display (for sale? to worship?) had to have the firing pin removed. But I thought "Guns don't kill people, people kill people" was the mantra?
Took grandson to the toy store for a treat and noticed some of the [toy] guns had orange tips and came with the WARNING "carrying, handling or brandishing in public any model that resembles a real weapon may be in violation of the law, may create undue apprehension on the part of law enforcement officers or other persons and could result in INJURY to the person handling the model". So...this is a toy, for sale...?
Not to mention the shootings of unarmed black men and boys by both law enforcement and neighborhood vigilantes. What exactly should their Standard Operating Procedure be in order to escape harm?
Like I said, this whole gun thing has confused me. Apparently gun rights trump everything else in the whole world? Whatever happened to gun responsibilities?
The N.R.A. had their convention here last week and while attendees could carry their personal operational weapons, the gazillion on display (for sale? to worship?) had to have the firing pin removed. But I thought "Guns don't kill people, people kill people" was the mantra?
Took grandson to the toy store for a treat and noticed some of the [toy] guns had orange tips and came with the WARNING "carrying, handling or brandishing in public any model that resembles a real weapon may be in violation of the law, may create undue apprehension on the part of law enforcement officers or other persons and could result in INJURY to the person handling the model". So...this is a toy, for sale...?
Not to mention the shootings of unarmed black men and boys by both law enforcement and neighborhood vigilantes. What exactly should their Standard Operating Procedure be in order to escape harm?
Like I said, this whole gun thing has confused me. Apparently gun rights trump everything else in the whole world? Whatever happened to gun responsibilities?
12
You now have gun rights in National Parks, subject to local law. I was recently at Arlington House, surrounded by Arlington National Cemetery, and wondered whether you could legally drive through the Department of Defense's cemetery to the House with your pistol (Virginia gun laws seem as lax as the District of Columbia's are strict).
Until recently most people figured the visibly armed guys in the park with the blue hats were the good guys.
You may drive through a lot of places, where your legal firearm is not locally legal, with a legal firearm legally locked securely away, until you get to a destination where it is legal to unlock, and remove the firearm.
Virginia law does not supersede the gun prohibition rules for Federal Property.
Virginia law does not supersede the gun prohibition rules for Federal Property.
The reason for gun ownership rising is profits. Profits for gun manufacturers is just a by product of gun sales. What motivates people to buy guns is fear. Where does the fear come from? - mostly from the media, and the local media at that. And when 50% of the "news" stories on local news is about crime you get two things - first you get lots and lots of fear because people think there is violent crime everywhere and it is one hell of a profitable script for local news production. Think about it, crime sells and it's very cheap to produce when all you do is follow a "script" and change the names, pictures and that's it. But it is expensive to society because it's corporate focus is profits and not education, it promotes racism when it overwhelmingly focuses on crimes committed by poor minorities in it's framing - don't see many "White" guys from Wall Street or K street bribing Congress do you? This behavior is not just limited to the suburban or rural landscape either but it's much worse in that cohort of news markets and companies. Think about why they give away the New York Post on the streets of Manhattan often for free. It's always been a battle for the hearts and minds of the people, the mostly uneducated people, who don't know that the brainwashing machine is on every night just for them because crime pays, and pays well.
7
The NRA won a long time ago. There hasn't been a serious gun control success in 20 years. Democrats have ceased to even talk about it. Despite recurring mass murders, we have demonstrated over and over that we lack the political will to override the NRAs incessant drumbeat of the inalieneable right to a subverted second amendment.
The final blow came when the right seized upon the paranoia over a black "muslem" president to securely burn their image of a tyranncal governent against which a vulnerable citizenry needed to arm themselves.
The final blow came when the right seized upon the paranoia over a black "muslem" president to securely burn their image of a tyranncal governent against which a vulnerable citizenry needed to arm themselves.
6
The N.R.A. hasn't won. The Bill of Rights has won. When a Federal court upholds the rights of protestors to burn the American flag, we don't say the flag burners have won. We say that the First Amendment has won. If the country agrees the Second Amendment is no longer necessary, then amend the Constitution.
9
The steady decrease in crimes involving the use of guns since the 1990s is very strongly correlated with a steady increase in legal gun ownership.
An inconvenient fact.
An inconvenient fact.
11
You are using correlation as if to imply causation.Gun ownership has increased dramatically since 1999, but the crimes involving guns has stayed steady during that same time period (the last big drop in crimes involving guns was in the 80s-90s.) It all depends on which window of time you choose.
1
And also directly quoted from NRA propaganda.
1
Actually, gun ownership has declined steadily over the past thirty years ( http://www.cnn.com/2012/07/31/politics/gun-ownership-declining/ ). The number of guns in circulation has gone up, but that is because a small number of people are increasing their stockpiles, and it's hard to see why that would have any effect on crime.
15
Whether you like it or not, the Supreme Court ruled that municipalities cannot ban the ownership of firearms, but they can continue to regulate the ownership. Therefore, we need to back off from the rhetoric of gun control and the gun lobby and figure out practical strategies to reduce gun violence. Some states and municipalities are better at this than others and it's worth figuring out what works instead of pulling out the rhetorical stops when the latest tragedy takes place.
9
I gave up on fighting the NRA a long time ago. We're number one in per capita gun ownership, and that's not about to change anytime soon.
The reality is that Americans don't just own guns. They passionately adore, love, cherish and worship them. They love guns the way Romeo loved Juliet or Antony loved Cleopatra--erotically longing for them, holding them, stroking and petting them, and continually obsessing over them. Just leaf through any weapons magazine, or watch the faces of people packing weapons while strolling the street, or look at pictures of families posing with guns in front of their homes, or try to fathom the way private families own whole arsenals of weapons. The satisfied, glowing faces of the gun owners say it all.
We're repeatedly told that Americans own guns because of the peculiarly American heritage of belief in self-reliance, and our legitimate fear of government--taught to us by the Founding Fathers--and our simple, pure desire to protect family and property. Poppycock. Americans own guns because of a bizarre, psycho-sexual, deeply erotic and unbreakable attachment to guns.
I live in New York City, and also have a home in a rural area upstate. There guns are a "way of life"--which is to say, people hunt, and every month or so there's a deadly shooting accident.
Meanwhile, my family and I happily live life without guns. Note to the NRA: The only people we ever fear are your members.
The reality is that Americans don't just own guns. They passionately adore, love, cherish and worship them. They love guns the way Romeo loved Juliet or Antony loved Cleopatra--erotically longing for them, holding them, stroking and petting them, and continually obsessing over them. Just leaf through any weapons magazine, or watch the faces of people packing weapons while strolling the street, or look at pictures of families posing with guns in front of their homes, or try to fathom the way private families own whole arsenals of weapons. The satisfied, glowing faces of the gun owners say it all.
We're repeatedly told that Americans own guns because of the peculiarly American heritage of belief in self-reliance, and our legitimate fear of government--taught to us by the Founding Fathers--and our simple, pure desire to protect family and property. Poppycock. Americans own guns because of a bizarre, psycho-sexual, deeply erotic and unbreakable attachment to guns.
I live in New York City, and also have a home in a rural area upstate. There guns are a "way of life"--which is to say, people hunt, and every month or so there's a deadly shooting accident.
Meanwhile, my family and I happily live life without guns. Note to the NRA: The only people we ever fear are your members.
3
Actually, the NRA was never in danger of losing. The idea of telling responsible adults how they should live their lives based on the bad behavior of a very few will always be a waste of time.
7
Ah yes, all those responsible adults who let their weapons fall into the hands of children. Not to mention those responsible adults who end up shooting people in movie theatres etc.
I live in Chicago, a big city. Years ago drug dealers could be seen lurking on corners, guys pitched pennies in the doorways of stores, shootings were not that uncommon and gangbangers trolled the streets and school yards. Today the dealers are gone, and so are the guys in the doorways, the gangbangers are gone from the school yards and streets, shootings are down in my neighborhood at least. No gentrification has not really touched us. No the neighborhood is not full of yuppies anymore than it was before. There are still rich and poor and every race and race combination you can think of. What happened? Strict gun laws, stepped up community policing, cameras at the EL stops and an Alderman who pushes community involvement produced a safer environment for everyone. Recently Chicagoans have been told we must get rid of our strict gun laws, so much for local rule.
Will Police now see every cellphone as a gun, or every child playing with a squirt gun or BB gun as a threat because guns are no longer illegally or rarely carried and can be bought and carried by anyone even gangbangers and criminals?
We are told to fear terrorists and criminals and that guns will help, but our children are being killed by average Middle class Americans and the police. My community in a big city became safer because we worked peacefully together. What does that say about the gun toting culture and its myths?
Will Police now see every cellphone as a gun, or every child playing with a squirt gun or BB gun as a threat because guns are no longer illegally or rarely carried and can be bought and carried by anyone even gangbangers and criminals?
We are told to fear terrorists and criminals and that guns will help, but our children are being killed by average Middle class Americans and the police. My community in a big city became safer because we worked peacefully together. What does that say about the gun toting culture and its myths?
7
Actually, you are wrong about "strict gun control". It was almost impossible for a law abiding citizen to legally own a gun in Chicago during the bad old days. As the crime rate soared, Chicagoans were prohibited from legally owning guns.
Then in January of last year a Federal Judge ruled it was unconstitutional to ban the sale of guns in Chicago. Yes, crime is coming down in Chicago.
And it will continue to decline as long as law abiding citizens honor the US Constitution.
http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2014-01-07/news/chi-citys-gun-ordinan...
Then in January of last year a Federal Judge ruled it was unconstitutional to ban the sale of guns in Chicago. Yes, crime is coming down in Chicago.
And it will continue to decline as long as law abiding citizens honor the US Constitution.
http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2014-01-07/news/chi-citys-gun-ordinan...
I fear that the NRA has won. And it didn't have to do that much. Just stock the world with guns, fan paranoia, and prey on the ignorance of those who have bought into the new interpretations of the 2nd amendment lock stock and barrel (pun intended).
The NRA has now become a new political voice, not only for gun "rights" but also to sway presidential elections. To hear Wayne LaPierre attacking the presumed Democratic candidate made my flesh crawl.
Guns plus crazy equals mayhem. We are living in an armed state, where so many guns proliferate that every public event is armed to the teeth with swat teams to protect against potential terrorists as well as the occasional crazy that might come unhinged at said event.
Every advance for gun rights is a blow to personal rights to safety in the public square. Charles, you make much of the argument that gun proliferation stems from people's perceptions of safety.
What about the rights to safety of those who don't own guns, don't want guns, but want to move around freely without getting shot?
The NRA has now become a new political voice, not only for gun "rights" but also to sway presidential elections. To hear Wayne LaPierre attacking the presumed Democratic candidate made my flesh crawl.
Guns plus crazy equals mayhem. We are living in an armed state, where so many guns proliferate that every public event is armed to the teeth with swat teams to protect against potential terrorists as well as the occasional crazy that might come unhinged at said event.
Every advance for gun rights is a blow to personal rights to safety in the public square. Charles, you make much of the argument that gun proliferation stems from people's perceptions of safety.
What about the rights to safety of those who don't own guns, don't want guns, but want to move around freely without getting shot?
8
They will have won when they change the Pledge of Allegiance...""I pledge allegiance to the Flag of the United States of America, to the Second Amendment, and to the Republic for which it stands, one Nation under God, indivisible, with liberty, justice and guns for all."
1
More than the NRA, it is irrationality itself that has won out, as evidenced within the comments section every time this topic is even raised in the NYT.
Irrationality that deems itself the epitome of common sense. Irrationality is the one disease that makes it impossible for the one afflicted with it to recognize his own condition. The 'common sense' that argues for unfettered gun ownership deems itself unassailable.
Irrationality that deems itself the epitome of common sense. Irrationality is the one disease that makes it impossible for the one afflicted with it to recognize his own condition. The 'common sense' that argues for unfettered gun ownership deems itself unassailable.
4
"...the N.R.A. appears to be winning this round...."
And exactly because of statements like that. Statements which imply that the goal of gun prohibitionists is to legislatively crush the Second Amendment, regardless of how many, "rounds" it takes to accomplish that end.
How many gun prohibitionists have repeatedly employed Orwellian double speak in that regard? Insisting that the Second Amendment actually means, "...the right of the well-regulated militia to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed."
Surely, the subtext of every "more gun control" argument, in a nation where there are already any number of existing gun laws, is that in the end the State should control all aspects of our liberty; as if our Rights derive from the consent of the Government.
Meanwhile, in places like New York City, where the 2nd Amendment has been largely crushed, the slippery slope abounds. Career criminals have guns, the police shoot unarmed innocents, and the assault on the 4th Amendment right against unreasonable searches is one Mayor away from roaring back.
And exactly because of statements like that. Statements which imply that the goal of gun prohibitionists is to legislatively crush the Second Amendment, regardless of how many, "rounds" it takes to accomplish that end.
How many gun prohibitionists have repeatedly employed Orwellian double speak in that regard? Insisting that the Second Amendment actually means, "...the right of the well-regulated militia to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed."
Surely, the subtext of every "more gun control" argument, in a nation where there are already any number of existing gun laws, is that in the end the State should control all aspects of our liberty; as if our Rights derive from the consent of the Government.
Meanwhile, in places like New York City, where the 2nd Amendment has been largely crushed, the slippery slope abounds. Career criminals have guns, the police shoot unarmed innocents, and the assault on the 4th Amendment right against unreasonable searches is one Mayor away from roaring back.
4
So the part of the 2nd amendment that you don't like is "Orwellian double speak"? The origin of the 2nd amendment came from English tradition where a "citizen" (white, landed gentry) was expected to be skilled in all kinds of arms because (and here's the part you don't like), the local citizenry were expected to apprehend criminals because the local constables were unable to go it alone. The tradition continued in Colonial America, and in addition to law enforcement, the colonists were expected to form militias to fight enemies because of the lack of a standing army. That is the reason for the first sentence in the 2nd amendment. Yet, you and NRA consistently ignore this language because to accept is as part of the amendment might inconvenience gun owners and certainly would impact gun sales.
One final thought. Requiring training, background checks and safe storage is not the same an banning ownership of guns, although the shrieks from NRA make many such as yourself believe that nonsense. Too bad the shrieks from the innocents killed by the lack of background checks aren't heard as well.
One final thought. Requiring training, background checks and safe storage is not the same an banning ownership of guns, although the shrieks from NRA make many such as yourself believe that nonsense. Too bad the shrieks from the innocents killed by the lack of background checks aren't heard as well.
30
The well known phrase " We have nothing to fear but fear itself" apropos here. Fear of the 'bad guys' and fear that big government may want to take away our beloved guns. Fear is an age old tactic by dictators the world over. Instill fear in the hearts of the masses and you can lead them anywhere.
I have sporting guns and have hunted since I was 10 years old. Expert with the M-1 when in the USMC. But I would not touch the NRA with a very long stick.
I have sporting guns and have hunted since I was 10 years old. Expert with the M-1 when in the USMC. But I would not touch the NRA with a very long stick.
8
The NRA has won, for various reasons. The US constitution favors states with sparse populations: a senator who represents fewer than a million people can block the wishes of a senator who represents 18 million.
It is also a matter of the age-old town versus country divide. Country dwellers have needs that city dwellers do not share, and vice versa. The NRA has capitalized on that distinction, too often with the help of strident lefties.
The gun problems of cities will not be solved until our "Christian" neighbors on the heath realize they, too, are their brothers' keepers.
It is also a matter of the age-old town versus country divide. Country dwellers have needs that city dwellers do not share, and vice versa. The NRA has capitalized on that distinction, too often with the help of strident lefties.
The gun problems of cities will not be solved until our "Christian" neighbors on the heath realize they, too, are their brothers' keepers.
6
By now the positive correlation between mass shootings, gun sales and insane demands for looser gun laws cannot have escaped the NRA's notice. They must be doing the happy dance behind closed doors every time a few dozen six year-olds get mowed down and they can watch the lines form at the gun store to buy whatever weapon the mass murderer used.
9
The evil of the NRA is behind this whole gun-walking mess in Mexico. Most of the guns being used by the mexican cartels are from us gun makers, and these guns are so powerful that the mexican army is hard put to counter effectively. A lot of innocents are being killed. The NRA has the blood of some 50,000 mexican deaths on their hands, no question. That´s as many as americans killed in the Vietnam War. The NRA is the epitome of corporate enabling of gun-running and truly merchants of pain and suffering for so many.
14
Please, Obama ran the gun walking to Mexico via Fast & Furious to the tune of over 2,500 weapons. When US Attorney Dennis Burke (an author and propoent of Clinton's Assault Weapons Ban) is personally approving straw purchases of 45 AK-47's when the gun dealer didn't want to make the sale, don't blame the NRA for that! They wanted to create the problem to Mexico to compel and justify anti-gun measures here in the US.
Otherwise, please explain to me how anti-gun Burke approved (ithout public knowledge) hundreds of assault weapons to walk, while at the same time publically calling for action to stop the "river of iron" to Mexico.
Good Luck with squaring that otherwise.
Otherwise, please explain to me how anti-gun Burke approved (ithout public knowledge) hundreds of assault weapons to walk, while at the same time publically calling for action to stop the "river of iron" to Mexico.
Good Luck with squaring that otherwise.
Could it simply be: the more guns, the more crime? "Conceal and carry" challenges law and order.
7
Violent crime is at a 40 year low throughout the nation, in all but a few densely populated metropolitan areas with serious, ongoing social problems.
No. The number of guns sold in teh last 20 years has increased by tens of millions. But over the same time period, gun-homicides have dropped 49% (1993-2012, PEW research). What has increased? news reporting on violent crime. One industry news letter found that in 2000, crime and murder news stories had increased over 500%! We see it today in this age of instantaneous 24/7 competing news coverage, where every little tragedy across the US and world can be displayed in our homes as if it were happening next door. That same PEW finding I mentioned above, also found that 77% of the respondents thought crime was either worse, or the same, as it was 20 years go. It's no wonder.
19
The facts show more guns = less crime.
This article is hilarious. Why is it so hard for them to see what gun owners have seen all the time? BTW, the NRA has not won this round, the People have won this round. If it was not for the People buying their guns and joining the NRA, there would be no gun industry or NRA.
18
The ignorance of NY Times readers knowledge of firearms laws is apparent from the comments here. Also the isolation of readers from association with other viewpoints with comments such as 'I don't know anyone who owns a firearm'.
Both are understandable if your only information source is the NY Times and other media that doesn't provide details on firearm laws. There are thousands of laws on books restricting firearms and their sale.
If you live in Washington DC or Chicago firearm ownership is effectively banned for individuals. NYC restrictions keep ownership to a miniscule number. Research it yourself. If you are a resident of these cities you will not know a gun owner.
Not stated by Mr. Blow, as gun ownership has increased crime has sharply dropped. Read paragraph four. It doesn't sound like the public opinion of gun ownership making them safer is misplaced. Read professor John Lott's articles or book for more details. In short if you live in a state with concealed carry permits you are safer. Even if you don't want to own a gun you benefit from the rights of others. This also translates into protection for women and the elderly. Criminals can't assume they are weak an unable to protect themselves!
Finally if you think that the police can protect you and fears of others are unfounded do you remember hurricanes Katrina or Sandy?
Both are understandable if your only information source is the NY Times and other media that doesn't provide details on firearm laws. There are thousands of laws on books restricting firearms and their sale.
If you live in Washington DC or Chicago firearm ownership is effectively banned for individuals. NYC restrictions keep ownership to a miniscule number. Research it yourself. If you are a resident of these cities you will not know a gun owner.
Not stated by Mr. Blow, as gun ownership has increased crime has sharply dropped. Read paragraph four. It doesn't sound like the public opinion of gun ownership making them safer is misplaced. Read professor John Lott's articles or book for more details. In short if you live in a state with concealed carry permits you are safer. Even if you don't want to own a gun you benefit from the rights of others. This also translates into protection for women and the elderly. Criminals can't assume they are weak an unable to protect themselves!
Finally if you think that the police can protect you and fears of others are unfounded do you remember hurricanes Katrina or Sandy?
21
There is little effective gun control in this country. If there was then on a federal level:
1/All gun sales would be monitored & registered in a national database.
2/ Mandatory waiting periods on sales would be required.
3/ No guns could be sold to people with violent backgrounds, psychological issues, felony arrest records, etc.
4/ All owners would have to be licensed with regular renewals required.
5/ High powered assault type weapons would be banned. There would be limits on how many guns people could purchase.
6/ All bullets would be tracked.
7/ Guns in the home would have to be locked up.
8/ Trigger locks would be mandatory.
But none of these things will happen. We have no real gun control in this country and everyone knows it.
1/All gun sales would be monitored & registered in a national database.
2/ Mandatory waiting periods on sales would be required.
3/ No guns could be sold to people with violent backgrounds, psychological issues, felony arrest records, etc.
4/ All owners would have to be licensed with regular renewals required.
5/ High powered assault type weapons would be banned. There would be limits on how many guns people could purchase.
6/ All bullets would be tracked.
7/ Guns in the home would have to be locked up.
8/ Trigger locks would be mandatory.
But none of these things will happen. We have no real gun control in this country and everyone knows it.
Gun ownership rising and crime falling is a correlation and not evidence of causation--crime has fallen due to a number of factors, gun ownership almost certainly not one of them. Owning a gun and/or having one in the home is clearly connected with higher rates of death and injury from guns (causation, not correlation). And I'm not sure what your fear mongering about the aftermaths of hurricanes is supposed to mean or for that matter what reality it is based on.
I grew up with guns, loved to hunt and shoot, and do not favor banning guns from private ownership, but this nonsense of gun-toting individuals filling in the massive gaps in our civil and personal protection is just crazy and dangerous.
I grew up with guns, loved to hunt and shoot, and do not favor banning guns from private ownership, but this nonsense of gun-toting individuals filling in the massive gaps in our civil and personal protection is just crazy and dangerous.
Gun ownership rests on 2 fundamental fantasies:
1. That the gun can be used to protect law-abiding citizens from criminals. This sometimes is true, but sometimes goes very wrong - many innocent people have been shot either by a small child who gets their hands on an improperly stored gun, or by accident by a family member mistaking them for a burglar.
2. That the gun can be used to take on the United States government if it abuses its authority. This idea is total nonsense - the United States government has drones, bombs, missiles, and artillery that a guy with a rifle simply cannot counter. The only reason that Cliven Bundy has held out as long as he has is that President Obama has pulled his punches.
1. That the gun can be used to protect law-abiding citizens from criminals. This sometimes is true, but sometimes goes very wrong - many innocent people have been shot either by a small child who gets their hands on an improperly stored gun, or by accident by a family member mistaking them for a burglar.
2. That the gun can be used to take on the United States government if it abuses its authority. This idea is total nonsense - the United States government has drones, bombs, missiles, and artillery that a guy with a rifle simply cannot counter. The only reason that Cliven Bundy has held out as long as he has is that President Obama has pulled his punches.
18
Hardly fantasies. Read More Guns Less Crime by Gary Gleck. He was a gun control supporter before he did research. He found guns are used to stop a crime more than 3 million times a year. I personally have used mine twice. Never fired just displayed before I was going to get robbed. Once after leaving an ATM the other while parked in a downtown alley. Children being accidentally shot are at historic lows.
Your other point about the government. We couldn't hardly beat a bunch of camel jockies in a 3rd world desert with all that technology. And myself and all members of the military that I know will side with the citizens not the government.
Your other point about the government. We couldn't hardly beat a bunch of camel jockies in a 3rd world desert with all that technology. And myself and all members of the military that I know will side with the citizens not the government.
1
Gun restriction rest on 2 fundamental fantasies:
1. Criminals always obey the law.
2. Just because the news does not report how guns save lives does not mean it is rare. Most laws state you must be in fear of your life or someone else's life to fire your weapon. If I pull my weapon and the criminal drops his weapon and runs, the fear of death is gone. I did not fire but the gun saved my life or someone else.
1. Criminals always obey the law.
2. Just because the news does not report how guns save lives does not mean it is rare. Most laws state you must be in fear of your life or someone else's life to fire your weapon. If I pull my weapon and the criminal drops his weapon and runs, the fear of death is gone. I did not fire but the gun saved my life or someone else.
1
1. A firearm is used for defensive purposes hundreds of times a day. Even the lowend DOJ estimate is around 200,000 times a year. This could be as simple as the intended victim showing the aggressor that they are armed.
2. The number of Taliban in Afghanistan is estimated at a high of 35,000....it was actually much lower at the beginning of the war. There are around 100,000,000 gun owners, many of which are ex-military, in the US. If only 3%(the percentage of Americans that fought against the British) took up arms, that would be around 3,000,000 well armed soldiers. Not to mention, our military takes it's oath to the CONSTITUTION, to uphold and protect it from ALL enemies, foreign AND domestic. If our POTUS suddenly turned rogue and became tyrannical, the military is not obligated to follow him. In fact, they're sworn to stop him.
2. The number of Taliban in Afghanistan is estimated at a high of 35,000....it was actually much lower at the beginning of the war. There are around 100,000,000 gun owners, many of which are ex-military, in the US. If only 3%(the percentage of Americans that fought against the British) took up arms, that would be around 3,000,000 well armed soldiers. Not to mention, our military takes it's oath to the CONSTITUTION, to uphold and protect it from ALL enemies, foreign AND domestic. If our POTUS suddenly turned rogue and became tyrannical, the military is not obligated to follow him. In fact, they're sworn to stop him.
1
Time to either transform the argument or … embrace the horror.
We hear almost daily calls to amend the U.S. Constitution to remove or severely restrict the right to have and use firearms – a prospect about as likely as seeing a grinning pig fly past Michelle Obama’s bedroom window. We hear constant demonization of gun owners as lacking the simple civic awareness to strip themselves of the means of protecting themselves from predators and from a right that was taken for granted for most of our history as a nation.
And where have these arguments and all this emotion gotten us? Nowhere – indeed, with every call for imposition of one side’s view over the other’s, we get MORE outlandish legislation, that argues for allowing guns in schoolrooms and buses, in BARS, for heaven’s sake. Yet, popular shifts in supporting gun control clearly owe their power to the recognition that it doesn’t control the availability of guns to predators – just to decent people.
But, step back. Propose a constitutional amendment that removes even the hint of suggestion that Americans DON’T possess the right to have and bear arms, but allow legislatures to regulate public use of weapons. You’ll still have resistance from those who wish to pack in bars, but these are few … and you’d win what is rational for you to win. You’d cut the legs out from under the NRA.
But I’m not actually sure that some Americans are ready yet to stop hating other Americans and seek real solutions.
We hear almost daily calls to amend the U.S. Constitution to remove or severely restrict the right to have and use firearms – a prospect about as likely as seeing a grinning pig fly past Michelle Obama’s bedroom window. We hear constant demonization of gun owners as lacking the simple civic awareness to strip themselves of the means of protecting themselves from predators and from a right that was taken for granted for most of our history as a nation.
And where have these arguments and all this emotion gotten us? Nowhere – indeed, with every call for imposition of one side’s view over the other’s, we get MORE outlandish legislation, that argues for allowing guns in schoolrooms and buses, in BARS, for heaven’s sake. Yet, popular shifts in supporting gun control clearly owe their power to the recognition that it doesn’t control the availability of guns to predators – just to decent people.
But, step back. Propose a constitutional amendment that removes even the hint of suggestion that Americans DON’T possess the right to have and bear arms, but allow legislatures to regulate public use of weapons. You’ll still have resistance from those who wish to pack in bars, but these are few … and you’d win what is rational for you to win. You’d cut the legs out from under the NRA.
But I’m not actually sure that some Americans are ready yet to stop hating other Americans and seek real solutions.
9
What he said: Thank you, Rich in Atlanta.
Most americans don´t know what ALEC is or how it is affecting them. It is an organized clique of right-leaning corporate interests that operates clandestinely to advance politicized self-serving agendas to alter laws and facilitate their streamlined enactment and imposition on unwitting and gullible populations, in essence hi-jacking traditional legislative processes.
ALEC has worked with the NRA for years developing efficient law-making machinery that deliberately thwarts governance of agencies like the ATF which has been rendered impotent in achieving its gun control mandate. These laws create a shield for illegal conduct. Currently ALEC is even attempting to introduce laws to criminalize legitimate investigative reporting of the gun industry.
ALEC´s work is also aiding and abetting GOP-dominated state legislatures to implement radicalized GOP ideologies dismantling a host of individual rights, including voter rights, women´s right, and union rights throughout the nation.
ALEC has worked with the NRA for years developing efficient law-making machinery that deliberately thwarts governance of agencies like the ATF which has been rendered impotent in achieving its gun control mandate. These laws create a shield for illegal conduct. Currently ALEC is even attempting to introduce laws to criminalize legitimate investigative reporting of the gun industry.
ALEC´s work is also aiding and abetting GOP-dominated state legislatures to implement radicalized GOP ideologies dismantling a host of individual rights, including voter rights, women´s right, and union rights throughout the nation.
24
The reason most Americans don't know about ALEC and its pernicious impacts in taking away their rights and freedoms is that 95% of members of the mainstream U.S. media are cowards who are more concerned about pleasing their pro-ALEC "conservative" bosses and keeping their jobs.
If you think the NRA is actually "winning" look at its leader Wayne LaPierre. Really? The are millions of us who are in favor of what we prefer to address as "gun safety, " trust me, even NRA members.
4
Suelsman, So why aren't you and other NRA members who feel as you do, organizing and proposing gun safety measures, including but not limited to background checks.
10
So, where are they speaking out? What kind of and how much pressure are they applying? Unfortunately, I see no evidence of anything accomplished to stop the the trend of more guns and more open carry!
You mean "gun safety" such as has recently occurred at police gun safety training ranges and officers have died from gunshots. THAT kind of gun safety?
"it used to be that the people most worried about crime favored stricter gun control," - Charles Blow NYT.
The crime rate has nothing to do with your rights and privilege under the US Constitution and neither does the NRA. You seem to be totally confused about the purpose of 1st. Ten Amendments which is to protect the citizen from an oppressive central government !?
The crime rate has nothing to do with your rights and privilege under the US Constitution and neither does the NRA. You seem to be totally confused about the purpose of 1st. Ten Amendments which is to protect the citizen from an oppressive central government !?
14
Lightfoot,
What pray tell is oppressive about government of the people, by the people and for the people? Every two, four, or six years the ballot box can decide if we the people feel we are being oppressed. If the "conservatives" get the fascist government they want all the guns in the world will not suffice, if you believe in protecting us from oppressive government help stop legislation designed to limit voter participation, work your butt off stopping the gerrymandering of electoral districts that entrenches weighted electoral population misrepresentation and help make the Senate more representative of a 21st century nation that is 83% urban.
The world of 2015 is a world of speed of light communication the wars we are fighting are wars of ideas. Our armies simply convince those that oppose us and western democracy that they possess the truth and all we have are the guns.
The Canadian poet Irving Layton who was in no way a milquetoast liberal once said "What power ignorance that makes your possessors seem so strong." The American constitution was written to protect us from those who believed in Divine Providence and that we were given Kings and Princes because as Calvin would put it that is the way God and conservatives believe it should be.
Let us again try to make the USA a light unto the world, let us show that the way to make the world a better place is the ballot box and let us try to achieve at least a semblance of one adult one vote.
What pray tell is oppressive about government of the people, by the people and for the people? Every two, four, or six years the ballot box can decide if we the people feel we are being oppressed. If the "conservatives" get the fascist government they want all the guns in the world will not suffice, if you believe in protecting us from oppressive government help stop legislation designed to limit voter participation, work your butt off stopping the gerrymandering of electoral districts that entrenches weighted electoral population misrepresentation and help make the Senate more representative of a 21st century nation that is 83% urban.
The world of 2015 is a world of speed of light communication the wars we are fighting are wars of ideas. Our armies simply convince those that oppose us and western democracy that they possess the truth and all we have are the guns.
The Canadian poet Irving Layton who was in no way a milquetoast liberal once said "What power ignorance that makes your possessors seem so strong." The American constitution was written to protect us from those who believed in Divine Providence and that we were given Kings and Princes because as Calvin would put it that is the way God and conservatives believe it should be.
Let us again try to make the USA a light unto the world, let us show that the way to make the world a better place is the ballot box and let us try to achieve at least a semblance of one adult one vote.
5
How about violence in Chicago, where the innocent can't defend themselves?
And the rights of the states to form a militia will not be abridged.
1
The NRA has "won" because the NRA represents the interests of millions of law-abiding gun owners who vote based on 2nd Amendment issues.
The NRA has "won" because gun ownership is a right guaranteed by the U.S. Constitution; not a privilege to be doled out by small-minded politicians.
The NRA has 'won" because in America one has a right to protect him/herself without relying on understaffed police departments.
Charles - when you start spending some time with the majority of Americans who reside between the Sierra Nevada mountains and the west side of the Delaware River, you may begin to truly understand why the NRA has "won". Remember Charles, the NRA is protecting your rights too - whether or not you want to exercise them.
The NRA has "won" because gun ownership is a right guaranteed by the U.S. Constitution; not a privilege to be doled out by small-minded politicians.
The NRA has 'won" because in America one has a right to protect him/herself without relying on understaffed police departments.
Charles - when you start spending some time with the majority of Americans who reside between the Sierra Nevada mountains and the west side of the Delaware River, you may begin to truly understand why the NRA has "won". Remember Charles, the NRA is protecting your rights too - whether or not you want to exercise them.
25
Remember, too, that this had nothing to do with the millions given to the NRA by firearms manufacturers in this country and in China, and absolutely nothing to do with Republican politics, and really absolutely nothing to do with FOX and friends trying to make an advertising buck.
It's simply a matter of Americans asserting a pure Constitutional right to not one gun, not two, not a rifle and a shotgun, but ten or fifteen or twenty weapons of every description.
Odd that we got through 200 years without, isn't it.
It's simply a matter of Americans asserting a pure Constitutional right to not one gun, not two, not a rifle and a shotgun, but ten or fifteen or twenty weapons of every description.
Odd that we got through 200 years without, isn't it.
Protecting our rights too? LOL. You mean like the heroic NRA representatives in the Cliven Bundy Brigade who lined-up the women and children in front of them to protect us?
Not an honest account as to who is playing the crime card . NRA and the facts point to lower crime in states with less gun control . and gun control groups point to all this so called crime as a reason to have more gun control city and states with the most restrictive gun laws have the highest crime rate and victims because the criminals know they can not fight back . that's why criminals with attack the old lady and not the body builder the one least likely to be able to fight back . but give the old lady a Colt ,or Smith & Wesson and that dynamic changes drastically .
9
In what state or city is it illegal for an old lady to own a Colt or Smith & Wesson?
The "lower crime in states with less gun control" points to the fact that those states have smaller, rural, homogeneous populations, thus less crime overall. As to grandma protecting herself, that almost never happens. People get surprised in the middle of a mugging and your gun does no good. But go ahead cowboy, get yer gun, feel safe, it's the American way.
Your claims are not borne out by the facts. The latest year that I found in a search for murders per 100,000 residents and percentage of population owning guns show the following
murders per gun ownership
LA 9.6 44%
MO 7 41.7%
SC 6.1 42.3%
NV 5.9 33.8%
MS 5.6 55.3%
TN 5.6 43.9%
GA 5.3 40.3%
TX 5 35.9%
NY 4.4 18%
IL 3.5 20%
MA 3.2 12.6%
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_violence_in_the_United_States_by_state
murders per gun ownership
LA 9.6 44%
MO 7 41.7%
SC 6.1 42.3%
NV 5.9 33.8%
MS 5.6 55.3%
TN 5.6 43.9%
GA 5.3 40.3%
TX 5 35.9%
NY 4.4 18%
IL 3.5 20%
MA 3.2 12.6%
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_violence_in_the_United_States_by_state
Cities in other countries are safer because their laws put the public good before the private one. America does exactly the opposite, with the logical result: you're on your own wherever you go, and you're expected to reply to the threat of violence with violence of your own. How this will ever change, I have no idea.
43
There was a column here last week by Thomas Edsall that showed how, as income inequality grows, the public becomes more conservative and less accepting of government solutions.
I'd bet that sense of helplessness and feelings of injustice also drive people to own guns as a way of thinking they are exerting control over their lives as well as safeguarding what little they do have.
I'd bet that sense of helplessness and feelings of injustice also drive people to own guns as a way of thinking they are exerting control over their lives as well as safeguarding what little they do have.
28
I have never owned a gun and I never will. However, the possibility of gun control in the U.S. or a decline in repeated mass killings is a pipe dream. There will never be fewer guns and there will always be mass killings. There is simply no bridging of the divide between gun zealots and common sense gun legislation regardless of how beneficial it is to society. The NRA has and will always block even the most insignificant gun legislation. For example, simple research on the affects having a gun in the house, which significantly increases the likelihood that gun will be used purposely or mistakenly on a member of the household, or the repeal of the law in some states that precludes a physician from asking if a gun is located within a patient's house. The more they can keep people in the dark about the realities of owning a gun the greater the NRA's power.
33
There have recently been two unpredictable wins: MADD (mothers against drunk drivers) and the LGTG lesbian gay and transgendered) have swept the table. Perhaps we should add legal canebis, though it may be early.
Sometimes Americans surprise us pleasantly.
Deus vult
Sometimes Americans surprise us pleasantly.
Deus vult
The United States is descending into lawlessness on many fronts. It is not happening in the imaginary realm of "thugs and gang-bangers". It is happening in middle America where people increasingly feel they must have the option of taking the law into their own hands, and with deadly force and consequences. For people who value a civil lifestyle, it's time to move.
46
Gun violence has in fact, been steadily going down, not up, during the past forty to fifiy years now.
The Thugs are now in charge. We can't tell the criminals from "enforcers." You can change that at the voting booth.
Every 30 minutes, a child is killed or injured by a gun. The American Academy of Pediatrics (AAP), the largest organization of pediatricians, recommends that conversations about guns and gun safety start during a prenatal visit and be repeated every year as part of anticipatory guidance. NRA wants doctors gagged and are actively facilitating the enactment of legislation to do just that.
67
Its none of a doctors business if I have a gun or not. Want to stop crime? Start teaching kids about law in grammar school so they understand consequences of actions when they get older. Also, authorize public executions of people who commit heinous crimes and throw out the old "cruel and unusual punishment" argument.
THank God the NRA is made up of people who understand that owning guns allow us protect ourselves and loved ones. It is them who stand between tyranny and the senseless idea that we should be left defenseless.
THank God the NRA is made up of people who understand that owning guns allow us protect ourselves and loved ones. It is them who stand between tyranny and the senseless idea that we should be left defenseless.
So many seem to believe that a nation bristling with guns is safer than one where sensible gun management is the rule. I guess if we did away with every control on traffic or drivers we would have safer roads.
When gun owners become jittery after a shooting, their fears only make it more likely that they will use them or someone else close to them will use them. So a vicious cycle is begun where violence and the use of deadly weapons is inevitable. and any sensible rules are labeled insane.
When gun owners become jittery after a shooting, their fears only make it more likely that they will use them or someone else close to them will use them. So a vicious cycle is begun where violence and the use of deadly weapons is inevitable. and any sensible rules are labeled insane.
49
It's worthy of mention that the many bad cops, I can no longer say few bad apples, who shoot down the unarmed and unthreatening are in some way linked to this trend. Those who have a license to kill have grown used to using it.
I am a gun owner, and have been for most of my life. But I have steadfastly refused to join the NRA since leaving the Marines (where I learned a bit about handling and using weapons) 50 years ago for the simple reason that the politics of fear which the NRA so effectively manipulates is abhorrent to me. Guns are simply to easy to get in this country, and far to often they get into the hands of frightened untrained people that truly believe that they alone are the last best hope for the American nation standing against the dictatorial assaults of an freedom robbing government. More often than not these frightened citizens end up shooting themselves or others in accidents or anger because they are unable to step outside their fears of crime and government imposed mayhem. The NRA does a magnificent job of exploiting all this fear. Until this country can come to grips with its fear there will be no common sense control of guns.
169
There are very few people who have the temperament and self control to have deadly force at their disposal during the course of day to day living. This country is armed to the teeth and most of these armed people lack the temperament to have deadly force at their disposal. They are very dangerous. Gun owners fully understand this and consciously or sub-consciously understand they need to own a gun and have access to guns in order to protect themselves from other gun owners including the Police.
We have reached critical mass in gun ownership and we all know we need to protect ourselves from the calamities that fact presents. Increased gun sales is a best reason to buy a gun and it's working.
We have reached critical mass in gun ownership and we all know we need to protect ourselves from the calamities that fact presents. Increased gun sales is a best reason to buy a gun and it's working.
2
Tens of millions of people who own guns legally have not killed, harmed or even threatened others with them.
Who's the fear-monger here?
I loathe guns btw. Don't own, never will.
Who's the fear-monger here?
I loathe guns btw. Don't own, never will.
About 12 million people in the US have concealed carry pistol permits. They are among the most law abiding people in the country with very few incidents each year. Worry less about them.
Of course the IRA is winning. The United States is the largest manufacturer of weapons in the world. The public, therefore, is merely following the example set by the government. This April 18 Times headline says it all: "Sale of U.S. Arms Fuels the Wars of Arab States." Thus the puny efforts to make guns harder to obtain here at home are poor attempts at camouflaging our real national character as the most belligerent nation on Earth.
14
I have noted in my six decades, that sometimes when you win, you lose. ?As a gun owner and NRA Life Member, I worry that the "success" of the gun rights movement has created the foundation of its own defeat. When knuckle heads start going to coffee shops with AR-15’s slung over their shoulder, nothing good can come of getting in people's face like that.
There are real gun rights issues that need protecting, After Katrina disabled public services in New Orleans and 1/3 of the police force deserted or went renegade, the authorities went around confiscating people's guns just when they needed them the most. A strong lobby to prevent and punish these violations of essential liberty is needed. Some self restraint is needed however.
On the issue of whether a gun makes one safer, their are too many variables to know. One thing is clear from the statistics to date. The police make a lot more mistakes with their guns than do concealed carry permit holders who have a much better record.
There are real gun rights issues that need protecting, After Katrina disabled public services in New Orleans and 1/3 of the police force deserted or went renegade, the authorities went around confiscating people's guns just when they needed them the most. A strong lobby to prevent and punish these violations of essential liberty is needed. Some self restraint is needed however.
On the issue of whether a gun makes one safer, their are too many variables to know. One thing is clear from the statistics to date. The police make a lot more mistakes with their guns than do concealed carry permit holders who have a much better record.
8
The nra has won the war, and will continue to do so with greater assertion of religious differences and the death of civil society in this country. We csn pretend thst automatic weapons andvthrur cousins don't facilitate killing by criminals but it won't change the bare, indifferent, facts. Reasonable gun control was a good idea that is dead.
7
Misuse of the First Amendment and abuse of the Second Amendment may very well doom our democracy in the real sense of the word. Already the NRA, the Wall Street and the corporate lobbyists are dictating terms to our "elected" Representatives by influencing the election process itself with their mega, mega bucks. If a majority of people is happy with the system, nothing can be done. Our children will continue to pay with their lives.
26
Tae away guns, and things will only get worse. They'll just start using baseball bats and machetes, and the thugs will still be armed anyway.
The success of the NRA in peddling its version of 'freedom' guaranteed in our Constitution rests on a single reality, the fragmentation of our sense that we are each citizens of one Nation under God with liberty and justice for all. We have never been one people. Rather we are a highly volatile mix of race, ethnicity, social class and wealth and abysmal poverty with a frightened 'middle class' that has a distorted version of our history and our rights and mutual responsibilities made all the more frenzied by a media that highlights our fragmentation. We, is there ever a 'we', feel frightened and insecure and anxious and overwhelmed and deceived and threatened and so we buy guns as though they are a solution to the fragmentation of a Nation.
Much blame belongs to the media and the extremism exploited by our media throughout the political and social spectrum especially the Rupert Murdoch empire, This most cynical of the media giants shapes a view of the world that enhances fear and desperation and suspicion of 'other'.
So...we buy guns to fix our malaise. We fear and do not trust the 'other' and government to seek compromise and balance and sanity and competent resolution of socioeconomic inequities.
It suits the FOX empire well...they rule through fear and fragmentation pitting us one against the other throughout their 'entertainment' empire and their 'news' enterprise. They are the propagandists of fragmentation and fear and the rise of militancy and guns, lots of guns.
Much blame belongs to the media and the extremism exploited by our media throughout the political and social spectrum especially the Rupert Murdoch empire, This most cynical of the media giants shapes a view of the world that enhances fear and desperation and suspicion of 'other'.
So...we buy guns to fix our malaise. We fear and do not trust the 'other' and government to seek compromise and balance and sanity and competent resolution of socioeconomic inequities.
It suits the FOX empire well...they rule through fear and fragmentation pitting us one against the other throughout their 'entertainment' empire and their 'news' enterprise. They are the propagandists of fragmentation and fear and the rise of militancy and guns, lots of guns.
32
I saw a statistic yesterday in an article on DailyKOS that this year in March, police officers killed more people (110) in the United States than police have in Britain since 1900. I also read an article showing that the laws in Arizona and other states regarding guns during the Wild West era were far more prohibitive than today. People were requied to check their guns at the sheriff's office before entering town. Guns were not allowed within city limits. What is this current "need" about? I don't know anyone who owns a gun or who would own a gun. We've lived our whole lives without them just fine.
I can't listen to the gun people anymore. The astonishing selfishness of the mindset that claims a "right," questionable to begin with in the interpretation of the second amendment, is too much to bear when I read reports of toddlers who shot a sibling, a mother, or were shot themselves, gun deaths of children, and gun deaths in domestic violence. Those who assert that their rights supercede the right to life for the rest of us have destroyed the moral fiber of our country. I find this angry assertion immoral, sociopathic on a large scale. We have lost our minds.
I can't listen to the gun people anymore. The astonishing selfishness of the mindset that claims a "right," questionable to begin with in the interpretation of the second amendment, is too much to bear when I read reports of toddlers who shot a sibling, a mother, or were shot themselves, gun deaths of children, and gun deaths in domestic violence. Those who assert that their rights supercede the right to life for the rest of us have destroyed the moral fiber of our country. I find this angry assertion immoral, sociopathic on a large scale. We have lost our minds.
28
The NRA and the gun lobby are skilled in the use of media to promote the fear that "the government" is looking for any and every excuse to confiscate all guns. If I saw any indication that this was true -- that some sizable set of our elected representatives favored bans on the sales of all handguns, say -- I too would be worried and would immediately purchase weapons. But we in the United States do not live in a dictatorship; we do not have secret police; and we do not have closed government in which new laws are suddenly announced without input and debate. We have a system built on the concept that compromise and accommodation are desirable.
I am so saddened and frustrated by the manufactured hysteria in the wake of mass shootings. The inevitable conflagration of rumors that the murder of innocents will result in bans on weapons is such a shameless exploitation of a tragedy. Is there no way to have a calm, reasoned discussion?
I am so saddened and frustrated by the manufactured hysteria in the wake of mass shootings. The inevitable conflagration of rumors that the murder of innocents will result in bans on weapons is such a shameless exploitation of a tragedy. Is there no way to have a calm, reasoned discussion?
8
The best hope lies with state action, our current federal government is as effective as it was pre-civil war. It will be an urban focused state, led by someone without short term national ambitions. The NRA and our electoral college have made national action impossible. I suspect the prospect of election defeat coupled with assassination has stifled any real momentum in elected officials.
We spend trillions on security theater in airports to "save" no lives, and we let an indefensible interpretation of "militia" take twenty thousand a year. Public opinion must be changed, that is the only hope.
We spend trillions on security theater in airports to "save" no lives, and we let an indefensible interpretation of "militia" take twenty thousand a year. Public opinion must be changed, that is the only hope.
8
The idea that more guns make us safer is one more manifestation of the wider phenomenon of irrationality running rampant in the land. It's no coincidence that right wingers also are the ones denying climate change, and promoting religious fundamentalism, aka Irrationalism, vs science. Whether these trends are explained by personality disorders, lack of education, reduced mental capacity, or something in the water in Flyoverstan I don't know, but it is evident that with candidates like Cruz, Huckabee, and Paul, the yokels ("Ignorant and Proud of it!") stand a reasonable chance of taking control of a second branch of government, and maybe a third. Look ahead and tremble at the thought.
21
Yokels. Flyoverstan. That's the rational way to persuade people who disagree with you?
Huckabee was governor of Arkansas. I don't recall anything especially terrible happening. He promoted art and music in the schools and wanted people to lose weight.
Huckabee was governor of Arkansas. I don't recall anything especially terrible happening. He promoted art and music in the schools and wanted people to lose weight.
It is not irrational to imagine our government, led by either Democrats or Republicans, becoming first dysfunctional, then oppressive and finally murderous and tyrannical. A cursory review of world history shows that this has happened repeatedly. The second Amendment to our Constitution was not written to protect duck hunters but to defend ourselves when those final days arrive.
More guns than ever in this country. Yet gun-homicides are down over 49% since the peak in 1993 (1993-2012 was 49%. 2013 was even lower). We are hovering close to a 50 year low, and if the trend continues for another 3-5 years, will easily be at a 100 year low.
They have won but it is a dirty, shameful victory. Gun restrictions are Constitutional but they say otherwise. Gun restrictions reduce deaths (and we need to count accidents and suicides as well) but they lie and say otherwise. Gun restrictions reduce incidents of mass murder in every country where they have been put in place. And, gun restrictions work here - note that guns are not permitted in the U.S. Capitol although the Congress seems to think they should be allowed everywhere else. They (the NRA) are liars and they know it. Shame on all of us for not demanding what is right.
29
I am not sure you should count suicides. In the US lots of people use guns for suicide. Canada, more similar to the US than any other country on Earth, has stronger gun control, and suicide by gun is not common. Yet the overall suicide rate in Canada is about 90% of the US rate. Evidently people who want to commit suicide will use a gun if one is available. If not, they will find some other way.
Nothing causes more gnashing of teeth among the forces of Correctness than their utter failure to prevail in the "gun debate". One senses that democratic processes do not seem attractive to them when they do not produce the correct outcomes.
But Mr Blow can always be relied on to provide an illustration of thinking among the ranks of the Correct. Here he bases his "analysis" on the unquestioned assumption that the argument has turned out in this appalling way because the unenlightened majority do not understand the issue as he and his allies do.
But Mr Blow can always be relied on to provide an illustration of thinking among the ranks of the Correct. Here he bases his "analysis" on the unquestioned assumption that the argument has turned out in this appalling way because the unenlightened majority do not understand the issue as he and his allies do.
10
And by the actions of the NRA and inaction (or abdication - take your pick) of lawmakers, it is obvious to those without blinders on that Mr. Blow, and his allies (include me here) are correct.
Gun deaths are a public health issue, but politicians have muzzled the CDC from doing studies on gun ownership and gun related deaths. Also, gun manufacturers appear to be immune from litigation. If they were any other industry, lawyers would have been all over them with class action lawsuits. I do believe that making gun manufacturers liable for their products would be the most effective way to reduce gun-related deaths.
25
In NJ one can get 10 years for unlicensed possession of a 300yr old flintlock pistol- one nearly identical to the ones all those who signed the constitution owned with no license.
Call me when people in NJ have any idea what "reasonable" actually means, when the gun prohibitionists have found a law that is "over the line."
Call me when people in NJ have any idea what "reasonable" actually means, when the gun prohibitionists have found a law that is "over the line."
9
Helena, you need to do a bit or reading, I have the perfect book for you that is filled with actual facts instead of rhetoric:
Dana Loesch: Hands Off My Gun: Defeating the plot to disarm America
Dana Loesch: Hands Off My Gun: Defeating the plot to disarm America
So if you believe that making gun manufacturers liable for their products would reduce gun-related deaths then we should hold the automobile and alcohol industry to the standard. They are also immune to litigation if someone is killed neglecting their product.
2
Few people own guns in my town, and I never knew anyone did until a neighbor's son killed himself with one. I accept gun ownership as a legitimate right. I don't begrudge people who own guns for hunting or protection from real danger, use them only when necessary, and keep them safe from children, i.e, the many, many responsible gun owners. But why is there so much emphasis on absolute, unlimited rights? Why do some people want to arm themselves more heavily than soldiers in Afghanistan? I remember the assassination attempt on Pres. Reagan by a lunatic, who apparently was able to buy a gun as easily as I buy groceries or clothes. I remember the ferocious resistance to background checks that followed that crime. After Newtown, we heard that the answer to massacres perpetrated by disturbed men was better mental health screening. More recently, I read the op-ed "Censorship in Your Doctor's Office," about attempts to pass laws barring doctors from asking patients about gun ownership. A Dec. 2013 NYT story described how police confiscated guns from a mentally ill man, but had to give them back because state law entitled him to keep his guns - and how he used them to kill his mother and one police officer, and wound four others. In the face of all the carnage that these few stories represent, the NRA refuses all compromise and can't recognize any middle ground. The opposition to any limits on gun ownership smacks of self-pity, victimhood, and boundless entitlement.
4
Economists pointed out long ago that pacifism can be predicted over large populations using household income data. Those near the bottom and the very top of the income range believe strongly that violence is legitimate. As incomes rise, violence is seen as less legitimate, until it peaks in those who see themselves as upper-middle-class and rising (the "New Middle Class" who portray themselves as wealthy even when they are not). Economists theorized those at the bottom and top of the social scale believe violence is necessary - to change their status for the poor and to preserve it for the elite. As households see themselves moving up, they fear sudden change, so delegitimize violence.
Given the widening gap between the very rich and the very poor coupled with decrease opportunities for economic change, is it any surprise more and more people seek not only guns, but fewer restrictions on their use?
Given the widening gap between the very rich and the very poor coupled with decrease opportunities for economic change, is it any surprise more and more people seek not only guns, but fewer restrictions on their use?
1
It may depend on a person's confidence that the legal system can be made to work for them.
Fear has probably been the winner. Few people want to be the only one without a gun (perception not reality), a lot of people don't believe the police can protect them in any proactive sense and even if they do simply don't want to get caught up in the faceless and unsympathetic legal system even if they are the putative beneficiaries of a prosecution.
And our culture has done a pretty good job of promiting a huge variety of apocalyptic scenerios where being armed is a necessity of survival. Sure, many of these are fictional but how different is the apocalyptic wasteland of some TV show from the reality of a huge swath of the Third World as depicted on the front page of the Times every day? It's the same scramble for resources, the same crazies, the same twisted militias and the same messianic cults -- the lack of actual zombies is just a minor thematic difference.
And our culture has done a pretty good job of promiting a huge variety of apocalyptic scenerios where being armed is a necessity of survival. Sure, many of these are fictional but how different is the apocalyptic wasteland of some TV show from the reality of a huge swath of the Third World as depicted on the front page of the Times every day? It's the same scramble for resources, the same crazies, the same twisted militias and the same messianic cults -- the lack of actual zombies is just a minor thematic difference.
We are victims of our myths. Rugged individualism, the wild west, survival of the fittest, the value of the individual over the interests of society in general.
We are also victims of our tribalism. Western culture, English speaking, fundamentalist Christianity, Confederate nostalgia, fear of the "other".
Over time we have conflated our romantic views of the frontier, western movies (the tall dark stranger administering frontier justice), with freedom. Too many people associate guns with freedom instead of death and danger.
The NRA, not unlike the Republican Party, has learned all too well how to exploit the fears and misguided "individualism" of the American people.
Now we have many who believe that guns are freedom and that ordinary citizens should walk around in public with the ability to deliver lethal force at a moments notice. Trained policemen make mistakes in the use of lethal force but we should be comfortable with ordinary citizens making these decisions. They are "law abiding" and protecting us "individuals" from the dangerous "others".
We are also victims of our tribalism. Western culture, English speaking, fundamentalist Christianity, Confederate nostalgia, fear of the "other".
Over time we have conflated our romantic views of the frontier, western movies (the tall dark stranger administering frontier justice), with freedom. Too many people associate guns with freedom instead of death and danger.
The NRA, not unlike the Republican Party, has learned all too well how to exploit the fears and misguided "individualism" of the American people.
Now we have many who believe that guns are freedom and that ordinary citizens should walk around in public with the ability to deliver lethal force at a moments notice. Trained policemen make mistakes in the use of lethal force but we should be comfortable with ordinary citizens making these decisions. They are "law abiding" and protecting us "individuals" from the dangerous "others".
4
It took a whole cascade of post-2000 Supreme Court decisions to bring us to this point including, of course, the grotesque majority ruling in DC V Heller.
Still, the real victory for the right and for right-wing front organizations like the NRA came when John Roberts handed down his malignant, deeply corrupting ruling in Citizens United, finessing not just the constitution but the core governing principles of representative democracy itself.
A billion dollars, it turns out, can speak a lot more thunderously than 300 million citizens. A billion dollars can buy everything from a cable news network to a generation of reporters and academics to a polling result to a host of governorships and legislatures and seats in Congress to the very soul of a nation.
A billion dollars can humiliate and marginalize and even silence the most dedicated reformers, the most compelling advocates.
A billion dollars can blend a cacophony of toxic noise--paranoid narratives, racial antagonisms, a John Wayne mythos, artfully-faked statistics--into a deafening cultural shout-down that drowns out the voices of sanity and reason and simple human decency.
As it turns out, it doesn't matter how many bodies pile up, how many communities are riddled with bullets and grief and chaos, how many mothers and fathers are left grieving, how many innocents are consumed by this madness.
A billion dollars says it doesn't matter, and according to John Roberts and his cronies, that's what America is all about.
Still, the real victory for the right and for right-wing front organizations like the NRA came when John Roberts handed down his malignant, deeply corrupting ruling in Citizens United, finessing not just the constitution but the core governing principles of representative democracy itself.
A billion dollars, it turns out, can speak a lot more thunderously than 300 million citizens. A billion dollars can buy everything from a cable news network to a generation of reporters and academics to a polling result to a host of governorships and legislatures and seats in Congress to the very soul of a nation.
A billion dollars can humiliate and marginalize and even silence the most dedicated reformers, the most compelling advocates.
A billion dollars can blend a cacophony of toxic noise--paranoid narratives, racial antagonisms, a John Wayne mythos, artfully-faked statistics--into a deafening cultural shout-down that drowns out the voices of sanity and reason and simple human decency.
As it turns out, it doesn't matter how many bodies pile up, how many communities are riddled with bullets and grief and chaos, how many mothers and fathers are left grieving, how many innocents are consumed by this madness.
A billion dollars says it doesn't matter, and according to John Roberts and his cronies, that's what America is all about.
12
Gun manufacturing and it's "recreational use" have become a component of the entire mass incarceration and criminalization industry. Homicides provide a stable basis for creating fear. The fear compels lawmakers to adjust the law to make killing easier (stand your ground laws) to reduce the interference from the law in killing. Meanwhile, the inner cities continue to produce a steady stream of new murdereres with weapons bought at gun shows. These murderers then fill the privately controlled prisons. The prisons provide good paying union supported jobs for correction officers. It is all for the good of creating new jobs. Meanwhile the police officers contribute their own ranks. Thus we require more District Attorney's and legal professional to pursue the ones who should protect us but instead kill us. Thus we need more guns to self protect. But more guns create more suicides and accedidential deaths. Charles, it is all good! Now I must stop short my comment; I need to go and get an automatic assault weapon for duck hunting next weekend.
1
This is the nation of "give me Liberty, or give me death!"
And we haven't done so well in the liberty department. All of the Amendments are in a sorry state. Equality before the law, a free press, freedom of religious practice, freedom of assembly, freedom from cruel and unusual punishment, voting rights, and so on: all are in perilous standing.
So is it surprising that we hang on with ever-tightening grip to the one amendment that promises both liberty and death? It's a sign of a desperate populus. As much as the politics of money accounts for the rise of the NRA as a political force, the rush by regular citizens to buy guns tells us there is more than just money involved. There is also real fear. And I suspect it is not just the fear of violence, but also the fear of loss of liberty.
And we haven't done so well in the liberty department. All of the Amendments are in a sorry state. Equality before the law, a free press, freedom of religious practice, freedom of assembly, freedom from cruel and unusual punishment, voting rights, and so on: all are in perilous standing.
So is it surprising that we hang on with ever-tightening grip to the one amendment that promises both liberty and death? It's a sign of a desperate populus. As much as the politics of money accounts for the rise of the NRA as a political force, the rush by regular citizens to buy guns tells us there is more than just money involved. There is also real fear. And I suspect it is not just the fear of violence, but also the fear of loss of liberty.
4
The NRA is winning because gun control advocates are shrill and condescending.
Yes, the NRA is also shrill. It's paranoid too. And laws such as open-carry and "stand your ground" are completely out of Idiocracy.
But gun control advocates refuse to acknowledge two facts of American life:
The first is that America, largely, is a country that likes its freedom to own guns. I do not own a gun (nor do I want one), but I grew up in a part of the country where most of my friends lived in a house with a gun cabinet. Sometimes it was proudly displayed hunting rifles, sometimes it was a discretely kept gun collection. It's part of the culture, and most Americans have always been fine with it.
The second aspect is that gun control advocates have to acknowledge that a lot of the gun violence and mass shootings are caused by the fact that we live in a violent culture. We are a country that glorifies violence - in conflict resolution, in our popular entertainment, in the way we deal with other countries. It's sick, in my opinion, but it has to be acknowledged and dealt with, because stricter gun control laws don't deal with this - shootings will inevitably continue. I don't know how this is dealt with, but much too often, gun control advocates (in what happens to be a very annoying liberal trait) dismiss the cultural aspect out of hand - they see it as a way to 'change the subject,' when it's anything but. Until it's dealt with, any gun control law will be little more than a band aid.
Yes, the NRA is also shrill. It's paranoid too. And laws such as open-carry and "stand your ground" are completely out of Idiocracy.
But gun control advocates refuse to acknowledge two facts of American life:
The first is that America, largely, is a country that likes its freedom to own guns. I do not own a gun (nor do I want one), but I grew up in a part of the country where most of my friends lived in a house with a gun cabinet. Sometimes it was proudly displayed hunting rifles, sometimes it was a discretely kept gun collection. It's part of the culture, and most Americans have always been fine with it.
The second aspect is that gun control advocates have to acknowledge that a lot of the gun violence and mass shootings are caused by the fact that we live in a violent culture. We are a country that glorifies violence - in conflict resolution, in our popular entertainment, in the way we deal with other countries. It's sick, in my opinion, but it has to be acknowledged and dealt with, because stricter gun control laws don't deal with this - shootings will inevitably continue. I don't know how this is dealt with, but much too often, gun control advocates (in what happens to be a very annoying liberal trait) dismiss the cultural aspect out of hand - they see it as a way to 'change the subject,' when it's anything but. Until it's dealt with, any gun control law will be little more than a band aid.
5
The NRA has won, thanks to the conservative wing of the Supreme Court. The courts interpretation of the 2nd Amendment is right out of conservative ideology more so than clear jurisprudence. Think about it. State fire arms regulations have been in place for the last hundred years. Other courts have considered the scope of the 2nd Amendment and never found the sweeping expansion of individual gun ownership rights as this last court has.
Is this because they are smarter than previous courts, or understood constitutional law better? Or is it because of the ideological approach that they brought with them from the Federalist Society?
Yes, occasionally one of their members will break ranks, like Kennedy on affirmative action or Souter who switched to the liberal wing on a number of issues. But by and large SCOTUS has mirrored the hard right wing drift of GOP politics.
We can also thank the media for crime reporting even when there's no crime to report. If there is no salacious local story to cover, don't worry, my local station will find some crime to focus on even if it occurred a thousand miles away. We are manipulated by fear and seldom told that the states with the highest rate of gun ownership have the highest rates of gun violence.
There are over 300 million weapons floating around. This guarantees that the unstable and untrained will have guns just as the careful and well trained will. We celebrate violence and then wonder why it lands on our doorstep?
Is this because they are smarter than previous courts, or understood constitutional law better? Or is it because of the ideological approach that they brought with them from the Federalist Society?
Yes, occasionally one of their members will break ranks, like Kennedy on affirmative action or Souter who switched to the liberal wing on a number of issues. But by and large SCOTUS has mirrored the hard right wing drift of GOP politics.
We can also thank the media for crime reporting even when there's no crime to report. If there is no salacious local story to cover, don't worry, my local station will find some crime to focus on even if it occurred a thousand miles away. We are manipulated by fear and seldom told that the states with the highest rate of gun ownership have the highest rates of gun violence.
There are over 300 million weapons floating around. This guarantees that the unstable and untrained will have guns just as the careful and well trained will. We celebrate violence and then wonder why it lands on our doorstep?
5
I was pleased to read the words "this round" at the end of Mr. Blow's column about NRA's putative victory in the war about gun sense. Given the history since Columbine, there can be little doubt that the NRA and all that it represents has won many current battles.
Also beyond doubt, however, is the fact that the "war" is anything but over. Several increasingly vocal and bankrolled gun safety organizations have not thrown in the towel. At some future point, the gun-enabled carnage of death and disability disability on American soil will become so intolerable that action will be demanded by a critical mass of the US electorate.
Even in today's discouraging setting, glimmering points of common sense victory are evident. Witness the states cited by Mr Blow and the citizens' petitions in such jurisdictions such as Washington State. These show that the struggle remains very much a work-in-progress.
The longer-term trend should persuade nobody to give up. And nobody will.
Also beyond doubt, however, is the fact that the "war" is anything but over. Several increasingly vocal and bankrolled gun safety organizations have not thrown in the towel. At some future point, the gun-enabled carnage of death and disability disability on American soil will become so intolerable that action will be demanded by a critical mass of the US electorate.
Even in today's discouraging setting, glimmering points of common sense victory are evident. Witness the states cited by Mr Blow and the citizens' petitions in such jurisdictions such as Washington State. These show that the struggle remains very much a work-in-progress.
The longer-term trend should persuade nobody to give up. And nobody will.
1
Of course the NRA is winning -- just as I predicted here time and time again.
The simple fact is this: that the Obama Administration and most Democrats want to abridge the Second Amendment protections for all honest citizens based on the aberrant behavior of a few, twisted mental cases.
Furthermore, gun grabbers present such laughably ignorant and incorrect interpretations of the Second Amendment (all over this comments section, for example) that it's clear that their objections have no basis in law but are rooted only in prejudice and emotion.
Concealed weapons permits went up 11% in Massachusetts in the shadow of of tighter gun laws.
Of course gun ownership increases after, for example, Joe Biden suggests shooting through doors since it's clear that the Administration is gun-ignorant and hell-bent on disarming the American public and preserving power only for itself.
Yet the corrupt government agencies that give guns to drug gangs, that cannot control their own agents are hardly models for letting the government abrogate the Constitution and control all the guns.
As the saying goes, "Gun control is not about guns, but about control."
The simple fact is this: that the Obama Administration and most Democrats want to abridge the Second Amendment protections for all honest citizens based on the aberrant behavior of a few, twisted mental cases.
Furthermore, gun grabbers present such laughably ignorant and incorrect interpretations of the Second Amendment (all over this comments section, for example) that it's clear that their objections have no basis in law but are rooted only in prejudice and emotion.
Concealed weapons permits went up 11% in Massachusetts in the shadow of of tighter gun laws.
Of course gun ownership increases after, for example, Joe Biden suggests shooting through doors since it's clear that the Administration is gun-ignorant and hell-bent on disarming the American public and preserving power only for itself.
Yet the corrupt government agencies that give guns to drug gangs, that cannot control their own agents are hardly models for letting the government abrogate the Constitution and control all the guns.
As the saying goes, "Gun control is not about guns, but about control."
9
We've been paranoid since 9/11--the giant SUVs, the false belief that a firearm will "protect the family" better than a dog and an alarm system.
That said, I enjoy shooting sports and have handgun training. I keep a gun locked up but accessible if our alarm goes off. I would use it. But most gun owners I know lack the sort of training I've had.
That is where "gun control" must go in the era of an ascendant NRA: requiring that all handgun owners wanting concealed-carry permits obtain the same sort of tactical training that police have, before owners can carry a gun beyond the home. I think that is an obtainable goal.
That said, I enjoy shooting sports and have handgun training. I keep a gun locked up but accessible if our alarm goes off. I would use it. But most gun owners I know lack the sort of training I've had.
That is where "gun control" must go in the era of an ascendant NRA: requiring that all handgun owners wanting concealed-carry permits obtain the same sort of tactical training that police have, before owners can carry a gun beyond the home. I think that is an obtainable goal.
4
A gun will protect a family better than a dog that can be shot by an intruder or an alarm system that becomes disabled if the electricity isn't working.
A very interesting correlation: as the number of mass shootings increases the number of guns purchased increases along with NRA membership. This of course will result in more mass shootings which will result in the number of guns purchased increasing along with NRA membership not to mention your ordinary day by day death by gun. Given this trend , our country is clearly evolving backwards.
9
The trend of court decisions for the last eight to ten years has been recognition of the 2d Amendment as an individual constitutional right. Change the topic of this article from gun control to speech control and you may be able to understand the angst from people when you support limiting the rights of gun owners. Guns kill people the same way spoons make us fat. It is their use by people that is abhorrent, not their existence.
Combine talk of limiting existing constitutional rights with the admitted fact that our government lies to us in order to pass sweeping legislation (e.g. the ACA) and then sends the legislation to rule making bodies to write the rules that define our acceptable range of actions and one should easily be able to understand why Americans distrust their government. They should!
Write an article like this about organizations who are trying to limit the acceptable speech of the media, and support that concept, and you will understand that people will rect the same way reporters would to that story.
Combine talk of limiting existing constitutional rights with the admitted fact that our government lies to us in order to pass sweeping legislation (e.g. the ACA) and then sends the legislation to rule making bodies to write the rules that define our acceptable range of actions and one should easily be able to understand why Americans distrust their government. They should!
Write an article like this about organizations who are trying to limit the acceptable speech of the media, and support that concept, and you will understand that people will rect the same way reporters would to that story.
5
I'm not giving up, certainly not based on one poll from Pew Research. I am seeing grassroots resistance to reckless gun laws become greater every day with every egregious incident of unnecessary death. State laws in some states are becoming more reasonable. People are slowly waking up, as irresponsible use of guns and needless death keeps rising. Gun Frenzy among whites right now is partly fueled by the resurgent fear of the Black Man, but of course, you know that. Please continue your efforts. Best to you, Mr. Blow.
5
Perhaps if we had accurate information on the epidemic of gun deaths in our country, we might be less enthusiastic about the guns themselves. But Congress has actively prohibited the collection of such data by the police.
We need a "What are you afraid of" campaign to put backbone in Congress to get rid of this tribute to ignorance. If a Congressman were asked "what are you afraid of" every time he appeared, after a while we might get some action to undo this ridiculous Orwellian law.
Only with the truth can we evaluate our gun ownership situation. That's why the NRA is so adamant that it's Congressional minions prevent us from finding out that truth. This whole gun situation is frightening and sickening.
We need a "What are you afraid of" campaign to put backbone in Congress to get rid of this tribute to ignorance. If a Congressman were asked "what are you afraid of" every time he appeared, after a while we might get some action to undo this ridiculous Orwellian law.
Only with the truth can we evaluate our gun ownership situation. That's why the NRA is so adamant that it's Congressional minions prevent us from finding out that truth. This whole gun situation is frightening and sickening.
11
Congress hasn't prevented the collection of such information, look up the info on the FBI site and private organizations can study it all they want, what can't happen is Federal agencies trying to push an agenda.
The Center for Disease Control--CDC--keeps statistics on gun deaths and injuries. The FBI keeps statistics on gun deaths. The CDC reports some 11,208 gun homicides in 2013; some 81,000 gun injuries. The FBI Crime in the US--2013--Table 9--reports some 8,454 gun homicides. (The discrepancies result from how gun homicides are reported--medical or police. The medical profession are accurate.)
Mr Blow is absolutely right, gun control is a must in this country... However. it appears as though people really do not care about others and only think of their self defense.. So much domestic violence, criminal activity escalates because someone has a gun in their hand.. When will we ever learn?
10
Plenty of places that are perfectly have plenty of legal guns
One thing that needs to change is what happens when a small child is killed "by accident" by a gun. Either the child finds the gun and thinking it's a toy, kills himself. Or he is killed by another young child. Everyone stands behind the grieving parents and say, what a terrible accident. Sorry, but it's not an accident. If a person keep a loaded gun in a place, which a child can get to, that person is at fault if the child is hurt or killed and should be held accountable. Accidents do happen, but it's not an accident if you're too unconcerned to store your gun safely.
37
The National RIFLE Association was originally a gun safety organization composed of hunters. It should now be named the National GUN Association, since its new members are mostly self-defenders.
4
This country has turned into something unbelievably evil and immoral, almost all due to the racism and greed spawned by the NRA in the interest of the gun industry. I simply do not want to be an American anymore, and will immigrate in another year or so to a better place for the remaining years of my life. I cannot think of one single politician of either party, at any level--local, state, national--who has the guts to come out for gun control. Everyone of them is happy with the perversion of the second amendment and the money that follows it, and is too, too craven to say anything. Any morals that they might have had, are long departed. The 'devout Christians' who live near me seem to think Jesus Christ carried a gun and was willing to kill. I will no longer vote nor contribute money to any political party. Essentially, I am gone.
10
See Mother Jones cover story this month that gun violence costs $250 billion a year, $800 per person in one state.
4
I'm amazed at the 30% shift (from 2000 to 2014) in people who believe that their homes would be safer with a gun.
I believe that my home would NOT feel like a "home" with a gun in it.
If I shot an intruder I wouldn't be able to live with myself.
If I wounded him/her I would be afraid they'd be back to "get me" after they got out of jail.
If I killed them, my life would not be worth living.
My pre-frontal cortex tells me calling 911 is a better choice.
I think it's very sad that our legislators believe they have to sell their souls to be re-elected & therefore avoid taking the guns away from both the citizenry as well as the police.
I believe that my home would NOT feel like a "home" with a gun in it.
If I shot an intruder I wouldn't be able to live with myself.
If I wounded him/her I would be afraid they'd be back to "get me" after they got out of jail.
If I killed them, my life would not be worth living.
My pre-frontal cortex tells me calling 911 is a better choice.
I think it's very sad that our legislators believe they have to sell their souls to be re-elected & therefore avoid taking the guns away from both the citizenry as well as the police.
4
As restrictions on gun carry has dissolved, I have increasingly limited my financial support for community businesses. I used to shop in malls, go to restaurants and pick up a few treats when I get gas, but now I so not shop in malls (I shop at Amazon), I do not go to restaurants and I only buy gas where I can use plastic at the pump. This hurts my local economy and I regret this fact, but what can I do. I am not smart enough to know if some old guy packing a piece is in the early stages of dementia and may start hallucinating a nonexistent threat. If I am out shopping and I see someone packing, I leave and take my purchasing power with me.
8
2nd Amendment Supporter here: Mr Blow is beginning to get the picture, but most anti-gun people just don't get it. There's a lot that they don't get, some of it from lack of experience but much of it from willful blindness. Here's one of the bigger things--Most Americans support gun ownership, but they are not politically activated or mobilized into useful political groups--even today. After a mass shooting (which are largely copy-cat crimes facilitated by the 24/7 news), the anti-gun political blathering threatens us, so we go out and buy more guns and stock up on ammunition before some anti-gun law can be passed. And also, many gun owners are realizing that we must become politically active to protect our rights. Many gun owners (most gun owners?) who were politically disinterested and perhaps not even registered to vote become politically engaged. And when that happens, they become single-issue NRA-line voters. They pay attention, they remember, and they vote. And it's becoming clear that there are a lot more of us 2nd Amendment supporters than there are anti-gunners. That's what's happening.
8
Gut feeling has won out over facts and data. That you're more likely to shoot a loved one with your gun than to deter a crime against your home or person goes in one ear and out the other. That guns escalate situations into mass casualties when emotions spill over means nothing. Every one wants to be that one case out of a hundred where they save the day.
Marketing works. The NRA is brilliant at carrying the water for gun manufacturers. What I don't get is why people are so willingly duped by them. I'd think pride would win out more often, but people seem very happy to pick up what they're laying down with nary a question about who benefits. More guns = more death.
Marketing works. The NRA is brilliant at carrying the water for gun manufacturers. What I don't get is why people are so willingly duped by them. I'd think pride would win out more often, but people seem very happy to pick up what they're laying down with nary a question about who benefits. More guns = more death.
8
As FDR said, and the NRA understands only too well: We have nothing to fear but fear itself. The NRA is turning America into a nation of scaredy-cats armed to the teeth. Could there be a worse recipe for the well being of our society?
13
As with the long, but ultimately successful struggle against smoking, efforts to influence legislators will gain traction sooner or later, though it seems clear that tragedy, even unspeakable and recurring tragedy, is not enough to tip the balance, and may even, as you suggest be sadly counterproductive. We can only wait, and watch more lives be lost until a more sensible approach is found and adopted.
I had put my thoughts to song, and "Not Again" - https://youtu.be/cXsg03xiUoU - has given me a voice, albeit small, in this discussion. The song was written in the wake of Aurora and Sandy Hook, but there have been so many more senseless shootings since. Your article and the above reason suggest there will be more. One day we will truly be able to say, "Not Again," and that day cannot come soon enough.
I had put my thoughts to song, and "Not Again" - https://youtu.be/cXsg03xiUoU - has given me a voice, albeit small, in this discussion. The song was written in the wake of Aurora and Sandy Hook, but there have been so many more senseless shootings since. Your article and the above reason suggest there will be more. One day we will truly be able to say, "Not Again," and that day cannot come soon enough.
A lot of people in my community are concerned about crime, but conversations about guns generally shift into conversations about future stability and sustainability of institutions. A lot of people don't believe "society" as we understand it will last much longer, and in the coming collapse (whatever that looks like) we will need to arm ourselves. Think about energy, food, environment, water safety and access, health, militarism, the economics of poverty - for each of these issues, we see from "leaders" either refusal/denial (on the right), or tepid reforms (from the liberals/left) that give temporary relief at best while doing nothing to solve the underlying issue.
Honestly, I'm not sure what I think of all this. I live a privileged life, and the last thing I want to imagine (or have to prepare for) is the kind of fictional dystopian society I read about/watch on TV becoming reality (which it is already in many parts of the world, of course - ask the families of the 43 disappeared students in Mexico).
But we should not reduce this discussion to 20th century right-left arguments about crime as Mr. Blow seems to. There are deeper, more complex arguments in favor of owning guns and knowing how to use which make sense to a lot of people.
Honestly, I'm not sure what I think of all this. I live a privileged life, and the last thing I want to imagine (or have to prepare for) is the kind of fictional dystopian society I read about/watch on TV becoming reality (which it is already in many parts of the world, of course - ask the families of the 43 disappeared students in Mexico).
But we should not reduce this discussion to 20th century right-left arguments about crime as Mr. Blow seems to. There are deeper, more complex arguments in favor of owning guns and knowing how to use which make sense to a lot of people.
1
IN the Aftermath of Katrina, the local gov't confiscated, if I remember correctly, a few thousand guns from legal gun owners RANDOMLY. Congress had to pass a law making such an action illegal.
1
It is also a sign of the triumph of the right. The narrative I see is white people unable to cope with the idea a black president. From there it's not hard to see them in flight, going to the disinformation world of FOX, Wall Street Journal, Infinity Radio, Post, etc. There, they are basically fed a stream of lies ("guns make us safer," "bomb Iran", "lowering taxes for the rich creates jobs", "global warming is a myth", etc). In the end the only real winners are the oligarchs and hedge fund managers who manage this flock for there own selfish ends.
Triumph of NRA? No, triumph of the right.
Triumph of NRA? No, triumph of the right.
13
I wonder how much of this may be because people believe the left as well. The environmentalists are warning us that society will collapse due to global warming, the economists warn us of the upcoming collapse due to income inequality causing revolts if not changed, and the sociologists warn us that unless we do something about the racism in society we may see riots in the streets.
People who believe these predictions often feel that they are powerless to make the macro level changes to society necessary to prevent such tragedies, so they work on the micro level to protect themselves and their immediate families by arming themselves against the upcoming chaos.
People who believe these predictions often feel that they are powerless to make the macro level changes to society necessary to prevent such tragedies, so they work on the micro level to protect themselves and their immediate families by arming themselves against the upcoming chaos.
It started with PRes Clinton, race was never the issue.
I have never shot an animal. I was born on the West Side. I'm Jewish. I'm a union member. I'm pretty much a libertarian. I have 3 teachers in the family. I live in Westchester. I went to college, and have had letters published in the Times. I'm a life NRA member. I have a carry permit, as does my wife and my daughter.
Charles, the day when we entrust our safety to some Irish guy named Mike who wears a badge are over. I know some nice cops, and some bad ones. But if one of the women in my house chooses to go to CVS at 3 a.m., she doesn't need me to drive her or walk her. She doesn't need to stay in, as she would in many parts of the country controlled by so called "progressives". She can, if she chooses, open a draw, and slip a nice .38 in her pocket. If I decide to, I can go to the ATM and take out 500 bucks at midnight, and not worry. As for the long guns, Charles, other than mental patients who up until the Community Mental Health Act of '67 would have been locked away, there really is no issue. The terrible shootings committed in the last quarter century have been by those people, maniacs. Additionally, terrorists like Maj. Hassan have also been an issue. But as we learned from France recently and in other parts of Europe, terrorists always get their AK-47, and maniacs too. People can do the math. We do not trust our leaders.
Charles, the day when we entrust our safety to some Irish guy named Mike who wears a badge are over. I know some nice cops, and some bad ones. But if one of the women in my house chooses to go to CVS at 3 a.m., she doesn't need me to drive her or walk her. She doesn't need to stay in, as she would in many parts of the country controlled by so called "progressives". She can, if she chooses, open a draw, and slip a nice .38 in her pocket. If I decide to, I can go to the ATM and take out 500 bucks at midnight, and not worry. As for the long guns, Charles, other than mental patients who up until the Community Mental Health Act of '67 would have been locked away, there really is no issue. The terrible shootings committed in the last quarter century have been by those people, maniacs. Additionally, terrorists like Maj. Hassan have also been an issue. But as we learned from France recently and in other parts of Europe, terrorists always get their AK-47, and maniacs too. People can do the math. We do not trust our leaders.
6
I live in NYC and I can do all those things at the hours your propose without a gun. I do not think someone is out there waiting to attack me. Maniacs do get guns, and as you've seen, having your own gun will not stop them. It might, as has happened so many times lately, be picked up by a toddler who kills his brother, or mother, or be used by you because you happen to hear an odd noise in your house that turns out to be your wife. No, guns are not the answer. They only serve to put us in more danger, not less.
1
Rick Murray:
I can't imagine risking having to shoot another human being by going to CVS at 3 a.m carrying a firearm. What could possibly go wrong?
I can't imagine risking having to shoot another human being by going to CVS at 3 a.m carrying a firearm. What could possibly go wrong?
The Second Ammendment was enacted to facilitate the quick mobilization of local militias. Citizens were to keep weapons at home so they could quickly move into ranks. The Swiss army has such a policy.
Since so many passionate Americans are arming themselves, their preparedness in forming informal militias could be used to supplement our National Guard units that are called up for duty in our many foreign military adventures.
Since so many passionate Americans are arming themselves, their preparedness in forming informal militias could be used to supplement our National Guard units that are called up for duty in our many foreign military adventures.
11
The National Guard is not like a pick-up game of basketball. If the Guard needs more manpower (or womanpower), it will recruit and train more. The last thing any military unit need are, literally, loose canons.
Fear, NRA is nothing more than a fraternity of cowards who are handy tools for gun manufacturers. Big men, they weren't even confident enough in each other to allow each other to 'carry' at their latest get together.
This is all about money. We need to start fully prosecuting gun owners whose guns are used in killings (think the young children who 'accidentally' get their hands on them). Give these Rambos something real to be afraid of that is a net positive for the rest of society.
This is all about money. We need to start fully prosecuting gun owners whose guns are used in killings (think the young children who 'accidentally' get their hands on them). Give these Rambos something real to be afraid of that is a net positive for the rest of society.
18
As a dyed-in-the-wool liberal, I used to think that people who cashed their farm subsidy checks to buy more guns and ammo were paranoid, angry, racist hicks who valued isolation and ignorance over society and education, and most of all, they hated the government, warning us that it is too big and wants to take away our freedom.
I have sadly learned that we're both right. Our police force has become militarized, in occupation of the entire country, and our police forces are empowered to fire at will, largely without consequences--even overwhelming evidence like video of unwarranted brutality may result in little more than outrage but no charges brought against the police. We hold some 1 in 4 of every prisoner on earth, the highest known rate. We have more people on death row than some nations have in college, and we literally throw people in jail for being poor--too poor to pay for a parking ticket, so off to jail they go, which results in job loss and keeps the cycle going.
So in regards to the statistics that the country has never been safer, they don't count the violence, loss of life and violation of civil rights in the hands of those entrusted to protect us, because no one is keeping those statistics. So while I will not be buying my own firearms anytime soon--it only radically increases the odds of the violence finding me--I can understand the reaction to do so, as unwise as it may be.
I have sadly learned that we're both right. Our police force has become militarized, in occupation of the entire country, and our police forces are empowered to fire at will, largely without consequences--even overwhelming evidence like video of unwarranted brutality may result in little more than outrage but no charges brought against the police. We hold some 1 in 4 of every prisoner on earth, the highest known rate. We have more people on death row than some nations have in college, and we literally throw people in jail for being poor--too poor to pay for a parking ticket, so off to jail they go, which results in job loss and keeps the cycle going.
So in regards to the statistics that the country has never been safer, they don't count the violence, loss of life and violation of civil rights in the hands of those entrusted to protect us, because no one is keeping those statistics. So while I will not be buying my own firearms anytime soon--it only radically increases the odds of the violence finding me--I can understand the reaction to do so, as unwise as it may be.
17
"Our police force has become militarized, in occupation of the entire country, and our police forces are empowered to fire at will, largely without consequences...."
The overwhelming percentage of police work makes persons and communities safer. Good police forces, which are the rule, not the exception, use armor only in the most drastic situations. But even accepting your promise, the idea that arming yourself against the police would make you safer could not be more mistaken.
The overwhelming percentage of police work makes persons and communities safer. Good police forces, which are the rule, not the exception, use armor only in the most drastic situations. But even accepting your promise, the idea that arming yourself against the police would make you safer could not be more mistaken.
Just as people flock to gated communities, take a rabbit's foot on an airplane, or buy expensive supplements, we strive for control. To many, obviously now the majority of Americans, guns represent the ultimate protection for ourselves and our families, although stats show the opposite to be true. I refer to an excellent op-ed in the April 19 Sunday Review by T.M. Luhrmann. He/She argues that people put their values before the facts; what the belief or faith in firearms does for their lives means more than statistics or empirical evidence. Until we can change this fundamental faith in the power of guns to provide security, those of us who pay attention to the facts are facing a losing battle with the ever wily NRA.
10
So crime is at 20 year lows and gun buying is at all time highs. So more guns do equal less crime? Or, more guns doesn't mean more crime. This reminds me of the argument the left makes when it says, "crime is down yet we're incarcerating more criminals than ever". Uh, yeah! Take out the inner city crime, and you'll see that gun crime is very low. How many gun crimes do you see in Greenwich Ct? How about New Haven?
5
How about Sandy Hook, CT? How about the crime rate drop in NYC, where gun ownership is heavily restricted? How about the fact that the US, gun capital of the world, has more gun deaths by far, than any of the western style democracies?
2
does your definition of "gun crimes" include shootings within a family or suicide?
1
Plus, lots more people who committed crimes are in jail. I believe those numbers are up.
The one industry which has bloomed under Barack Obama is the firearms industry. How perfectly ironic!
The one industry which has bloomed under Barack Obama is the firearms industry. How perfectly ironic!
1
Years ago, most people relied on the police to protect them from criminals. Nowadays, many people think the police are a bunch of thugs who are just as likely to shoot them as they are to arrest criminals.
I can't imagine how they got that impression.....
I can't imagine how they got that impression.....
15
"Vinaashkaale vipareeth buddhi" - this is an old Sanskrit proverb that one's mind/intelligence acts perversely when one is in the spiral of one's downfall. Crime is going down; but Americans think it is going up; social mobility is decreasing, and is now less than many OECD countries, but Americans don't see that; Obamacare has bent the healthcare cost curve downwards, but Americans see it as bankrupting the country. Saudi Arabia, the prime source of and home of funders of the vile violent Islamist ideology making inroads in the world, is an American ally; the Muslim nations or ethnicities most opposed to al Qaeda, ISIS are American enemies. The American economy is not working for a great number of working people; interests rates are low, and the infrastructure needs renewal - but there is little push for infrastructure spending. Climate change is real, but cannot be discussed officially in at least a couple of states, and in general, the hostility to the science is great.
The last decade and this one is when the US goes from being truly exceptional to exceptional only in the imagination, because Americans have lost their grasp on reality.
The last decade and this one is when the US goes from being truly exceptional to exceptional only in the imagination, because Americans have lost their grasp on reality.
67
If you turn on the local news there is no shortage of shootings. In Houston they focus on domestic shootings, car chases and burglaries featuring a stolen pick up trucks driven thru a store front. Violent crime is down but you couldn't tell looking on TV and the movies. European polls show a belief that crime is out of control. Can a steady diet of American media be part of their perception? End of the world preaching from the right and left also has an effect. Crime, global warming and the apocalypse but hey are also useful propaganda tools.
Arun, Great post.
For all the money we spend on defense, we are very paranoid in this country and yet we have this peculiar confidence that we can take care of ourselves by owning guns. Plus guns represent freedom too. Add to the mix the economic gain of fomenting gun sales the NRA 's message brings. Cancer would be cured if the NRA ran research and fundraising efforts.
9
Could it be that this is a natural reaction to a booming federal gov't that demands that IT control more and more of the choices that we used to have ourselves?
I mean, kids can't even eat a decent lunch at school anymore, or buy the light bulbs their parents used. The more demand for conformity from the elites in charge produces more craving for control & protection in the people who are paying for all of this enormous government - which itself never has to answer to its citizens.
I mean, kids can't even eat a decent lunch at school anymore, or buy the light bulbs their parents used. The more demand for conformity from the elites in charge produces more craving for control & protection in the people who are paying for all of this enormous government - which itself never has to answer to its citizens.
1
Weapons R U.S.
Add this column with yesterday's article about U.S. weapons makers selling fighter jets and drones to Middle East countries and it it becomes abundantly clear we are all about violence as a means of making money.
Add this column with yesterday's article about U.S. weapons makers selling fighter jets and drones to Middle East countries and it it becomes abundantly clear we are all about violence as a means of making money.
41
Gun rights activists promote a simple message: Freedom coincides with safety. Despite the vast expansion of gun rights, and gun sales, crime is down. Well, duh, why would anyone give up freedom for no gain?
Gun prohibitionists need to reboot. They need to start opposing ridiculous laws in NJ, MD, and CA to buy credibility they lost.
Gun prohibitionists need to reboot. They need to start opposing ridiculous laws in NJ, MD, and CA to buy credibility they lost.
5
Freedom does coincide with safety. And the drafters of the Bill of Rights, a document that the Sovereign states insisted upon being pass as the first legislation of the new United States Congress, were well aware that safety and freedom from a tyrannical federal government required that the citizenry be able to resist unacceptable authoritarianism.
And if any of liberal...er...progressive...er...whatever he is calling himself these days to avoid having to accept responsibility for his previous hypocrisies...would like to research this, he should turn to the official minutes of the conventions of the Sovereign States for guidance.
And if any of liberal...er...progressive...er...whatever he is calling himself these days to avoid having to accept responsibility for his previous hypocrisies...would like to research this, he should turn to the official minutes of the conventions of the Sovereign States for guidance.
Not just "reality TV." Programming channels are clogged with crime-based "entertainment" shows. I suspect that "Breaking Bad" did more to create the perception of crime running wild than "reality" series. Watch the FBI bag someone for insider trading and we're talking ZZZZZZZZs here.
Might explain why people are buying guns instead of incarcerating the executives who tanked the economy with risky, fraudulent "investments."
Might explain why people are buying guns instead of incarcerating the executives who tanked the economy with risky, fraudulent "investments."
13
Gun ownership is not rising. It's declining as the US becomes increasingly urbanized. Only about a third of households own guns. However the number of guns in circulation is rising because the households that have guns have more of them.
23
I run a training class for new owners. About 30% of them are woman. I have 20 new owners every two weeks and there are at least 20 other training schools in the city. Almost all of them come back for the concealed carry classes so they can get that permit. How do you explain that compared to your posted information?
“The National Rifle Association’s paying member ranks have grown by 100,000 in the wake of the December school shooting in Newtown, Conn., the organization told Politico.”
I hate to say this but the mass shootings seem as if collateral damage for gun rights enthusiasts.
I hate to say this but the mass shootings seem as if collateral damage for gun rights enthusiasts.
27
Perhaps mass shootings are a symptom of our society's apparent desire to keep the mentally ill on the streets with a bottle of pills, and a pat on the head.
Even as the over all crime rate outside the largest metropolitan areas continues to decline, as the number of legal guns in those areas continues to increase.
Even as the over all crime rate outside the largest metropolitan areas continues to decline, as the number of legal guns in those areas continues to increase.
2
Oliver,
imagine one or two of the Newtown teachers having a gun on their person. As soon as the first shot is heard, they go looking for the bad guy, and dozens of lives are saved.
How can this better result possibly bother you? You trust those teachers with every other aspect of students' lives - you even allow them to drive cars onto school property, and cars can easily kill!
But you stop at small, concealed firearms? Why?
(The following sentence is added to make your position perfectly obvious.)
Do you just hate children?
imagine one or two of the Newtown teachers having a gun on their person. As soon as the first shot is heard, they go looking for the bad guy, and dozens of lives are saved.
How can this better result possibly bother you? You trust those teachers with every other aspect of students' lives - you even allow them to drive cars onto school property, and cars can easily kill!
But you stop at small, concealed firearms? Why?
(The following sentence is added to make your position perfectly obvious.)
Do you just hate children?
There was a news story this morning about a kid in Spain shooting a teacher and several others - with a crossbow.
Progressives have been on this anti-gun crusade for decades. It is going nowhere. Gun control is contrary to our rights as established in the Constitution. Gun control is contrary to many, many Americans' concept of freedom. (Sorry folks, this isn't Europe so don't throw that argument up about how other cultures can live with strict gun controls).
Please Mr. Blow and other misguided nannies, stop tilting at windmills and move on to the real issues that we can manage - like why Hillary shouldn't be president.
Progressives have been on this anti-gun crusade for decades. It is going nowhere. Gun control is contrary to our rights as established in the Constitution. Gun control is contrary to many, many Americans' concept of freedom. (Sorry folks, this isn't Europe so don't throw that argument up about how other cultures can live with strict gun controls).
Please Mr. Blow and other misguided nannies, stop tilting at windmills and move on to the real issues that we can manage - like why Hillary shouldn't be president.
8
@Know It All: How is it possible that there were more people killed by police in America in the month of March than have been killed in England (by cops) since 1900? Since 1900! We are a violent society. No doubt about it. I'm beginning to believe we always will be. We will never 'grow up' as other civilized countries have. We cal ourselves civilized, but...um.....not so much.
I'd rather face a young boy with a crossbow than a glock. So if he had a gun with a thirty round clip (like here in the U.S.) how many more would have been dead? this is a great example of how gun control saves lives, thanks for bringing it to our attention
And let's not forget that in the just-concluded NRA national convention, guns were banned from the convention floor. Yes, the same organization that has pushed to allow guns in parks, schools, stores, hospitals, and anywhere else it can smell dollars, didn't see fit to allow "good guys with guns" on its own convention floor. The hypocrisy is beyond huge. According to their own bumper sticker logic, banning guns from their convention should have made it "a shooting gallery" with thousands of "defenseless targets" just begging to me attacked by the legions of evildoers its members imagine under every bed and behind every tree. The fact that no one was shot makes you wonder if the public will realize the NRA's propaganda has it exactly backwards: guns ARE dangerous.
68
I guess you only read the NY Times misleading story on the NRA convention and not their retraction. At the NRA convention, guns that were on display had their firing pins removed. There was no restriction on the attendees carrying loaded weapons on the convention floor or elsewhere in Nashville, except for one concert hall that always bans weapons. It was probably the safest place in America for those three days.
Also note that despite the fact the NRA claims it holds the 2nd Amendment sacrosanct, the version on the wall of their corporate lobby is edited. Deleted is the reference to a "well armed militia". Apparently the 2nd Amendment isn't the Holy Grail, only an NRA approved portion of it.
Perhaps the leadership of the NRA will come to its senses when one of their own becomes a gun victim.
Gun violence is tragic. I don't believe the NRA condones it, nor that there is a link to their lobbying of legal gun ownership. Drug overdose is also tragic. Heroin deaths now number over 8,000 per year, a very rapid increase in the past three years. Deaths from prescribed opiates is double that number. Should the AMA be held accountable? It is the silent killer, that has no voice in these pages, and it far exceeds gun violence in numbers. Perhaps Mr. Blow could climb down from his high horse, and get busy writing a column about death by opiate.
3
Heroine use is not legal and protected by massive industries and their captive organization. Heroine dealers and users don't have any political power to speak of.
I was recently told that two young people in my white, middle class neighborhood died from heroin overdoses. Neither were reported in the local press. When I asked a friend in the media business why that is, he told me it was out of a desire to not embarrass the families or drag the deceased through the mud. Had those two people been killed by handguns, you know that it would have made the media - probably for multiple days.
1
apples to oranges is a common pro gun argument.
Columbine started it. That senseless shooting of innocents was frightening in its sheer randomness. It could happen anywhere, and it has......over and over again. People with no thought of ever owning a gun for protection have experienced new misgivings. Since Columbine, the NRA has masterfully exploited each new opportunity to stoke the haunting fear of the next random shooter who might turn up anywhere.
7
And no one has ever prevented one of these events with a privately owned gun.
"t could happen anywhere, and it has......over and over again." Actually, no. It doesn't happen just anywhere. Columbine, Aurora, Virginia Tech, Sandy Hook, all happened in "gun free" zones. Even Ft. Hood and the Washington Naval Yard, thanks to President Clinton, were gun free zones. How do you train people to defend this nation, to use all kinds of arms, but then are afraid to let them defend themselves? So is it the masterful exploitation of the NRA of all the mindless people in America who can't think for themselves or is it the failure of government by preventing Americans from defending themselves while failing to do it for them.
Dear Mr. Blow,
With the NRA using the 2nd Amendment as a cover and with organizations like "Fox News" propagandizing about the "gu'ment gonna cum take yer guns away" and the general white support for the police no matter how badly they behave, of course the firearms business is, pardon the inadvertent pun, "booming" with women making up a good chunk of the purchasers.
After the sandy Hook shootings, I had an opportunity to drive by one of the largest gun dealers in the state a week after the massacre; the lot was full, cars were waiting to pull in and, as I heard later, they had almost sold completely out of every caliber of ammunition.
Reason pales when confronted with irrational fear. Terrorism after 9/11 was the motive force for gun sales as if one could shoot down an attacking airliner with a pistol. Now, the mantra is "the left is going after the cops; arm yourselves before they take YOUR guns away!"
With unfettered money to spend and a white population ready to believe anything that Conservative propaganda spews forth ("Ya'll gonna be a minority in 2050"!), the gun industry has probably the most "growth oriented" business in the country. If they can elect a GOP/TP/KOCH AFFILIATE as president, the "the land of the free" will also be the "home of the hand gun" as any attempt at reasonable firearms legislation will be tossed out the window.
Sadly, with only 36% of the voting population voting, this last scenario may become all too real.
With the NRA using the 2nd Amendment as a cover and with organizations like "Fox News" propagandizing about the "gu'ment gonna cum take yer guns away" and the general white support for the police no matter how badly they behave, of course the firearms business is, pardon the inadvertent pun, "booming" with women making up a good chunk of the purchasers.
After the sandy Hook shootings, I had an opportunity to drive by one of the largest gun dealers in the state a week after the massacre; the lot was full, cars were waiting to pull in and, as I heard later, they had almost sold completely out of every caliber of ammunition.
Reason pales when confronted with irrational fear. Terrorism after 9/11 was the motive force for gun sales as if one could shoot down an attacking airliner with a pistol. Now, the mantra is "the left is going after the cops; arm yourselves before they take YOUR guns away!"
With unfettered money to spend and a white population ready to believe anything that Conservative propaganda spews forth ("Ya'll gonna be a minority in 2050"!), the gun industry has probably the most "growth oriented" business in the country. If they can elect a GOP/TP/KOCH AFFILIATE as president, the "the land of the free" will also be the "home of the hand gun" as any attempt at reasonable firearms legislation will be tossed out the window.
Sadly, with only 36% of the voting population voting, this last scenario may become all too real.
44
This debate is tiresome. This country wanted voting rights for all, they got it. This country wanted to end the draft. They got it. This country wanted to ban public smoking despite the best efforts of the tobacco companies, yet we can't seem to get a handle on the gun issue. Fact of the matter is that bad guys can get guns whenever they want just like they can get drugs. We need to face up to the general level of lawlessness in our society which legislation is not going to take care of. Our rot is cultural....one pass around the TV dial or the internet will bear that out. Left...right...libertarian....the answer isn't to be found in legislating morality, its in finding a way to foster a reawakening in decency and trust. America is bleeding. Time for a reboot.
11
Gun ownership is up....violent crime is down???? Duh!
12
One was the exclusive cause of the other? Really?
violent crime went down long before gun ownership went up, Of course accidental shootings have gone up while gun ownership has gone up.
Correlation is not causation. By your logic, the same argument could be made using the lower % of people owning guns causing the reduced crime rate.
99 percent of those arguing that the second amendments protects their right to arms are defending the amendment as if the amendment was written today. When the Constitution was written there were no rules of grammar, punctuation or fpelling. Because there were no rules their interpretation is wrong. So the next time one argues that that they have that right remind them they don't only a well regulated militia does.
Face it, the NRA has become a terrorist organization in it's leadership not the law abiding owner of the gun who gladly submits to regulations.
Face it, the NRA has become a terrorist organization in it's leadership not the law abiding owner of the gun who gladly submits to regulations.
27
That's an interesting issue for law school students to debate. But do you think that the framers of the Bill of Rights, who were primarily concerned with limiting the ability of government to abuse its citizens (what GB was doing) would have intended to disarm the citizenry? Of course not. Guns were an essential tool in those days just as smart phones are today.
I live in a rural area where there is not a lot of crime and many people have guns. I am pretty sure that one of the deterrents to the midnight burglar is the knowledge that the homeowner is likely armed. Guns have the ability to level the playing field between the weak and the strong. If she keeps her cool, grandma or a young mother stand a pretty good chance against a home invasion if they are armed. If not, they are at the mercy of the bad guys.
I might support limiting the right of law abiding citizens to possess guns if you could tell me how you would keep them out of the hands of criminals. We have tens of thousands of children and lots of drugs pouring over our southern border. I am sure that that route could be used to illegally import all the guns that the bad guys could want. In which case the law abiding citizen would be disarmed and the bad guys would be armed. That seems like the worst of all possible results.
I live in a rural area where there is not a lot of crime and many people have guns. I am pretty sure that one of the deterrents to the midnight burglar is the knowledge that the homeowner is likely armed. Guns have the ability to level the playing field between the weak and the strong. If she keeps her cool, grandma or a young mother stand a pretty good chance against a home invasion if they are armed. If not, they are at the mercy of the bad guys.
I might support limiting the right of law abiding citizens to possess guns if you could tell me how you would keep them out of the hands of criminals. We have tens of thousands of children and lots of drugs pouring over our southern border. I am sure that that route could be used to illegally import all the guns that the bad guys could want. In which case the law abiding citizen would be disarmed and the bad guys would be armed. That seems like the worst of all possible results.
If you think the Second Amendment is the result of poor grammar, consider this. If you look at the concurrent writings of the Founding Fathers in the Federalist Papers and other speeches you will see clearly their intent was based on a distrust of government. How the Supreme Court is now ruling on the 2nd Amendment is as the Founders intended. It is not due to a misplaced comma.
Looks like you yourself have thrown out the modern rules of punctuation.
The 2nd Amendment uses "well regulated", it's true. Note, please, my appropriate use of "it's" and your own inappropriate one. But the self same
amendment also states that the "right of the people to keep and bear arms
shall not be infringed". That looks like a contradiction in the document itself, spelling, grammar and punctuation differences notwithstanding.
The 2nd Amendment uses "well regulated", it's true. Note, please, my appropriate use of "it's" and your own inappropriate one. But the self same
amendment also states that the "right of the people to keep and bear arms
shall not be infringed". That looks like a contradiction in the document itself, spelling, grammar and punctuation differences notwithstanding.
Increased gun ownership reflects in part the rampant distrust of government and its ability to carry out its normal functions, including law enforcement and national security. Gridlock and the huge influence of corporations have led people to see government as a dysfunctional servant of the well to do, pushing people toward anarchy, suspicion and a perceived need for self-protection. Thanks a lot Republicans.
40
Barack Obama has been the leader of our country for the last 6 years. Why is it with the sad state of affairs identified in the article and the subsequent comments, is he not held responsible as our leader? Every leader since Jesus Christ and before has had opposition but the good leaders find ways to work with there opposition. FDR, LBJ and Reagan working with Tip O'Neal for example.
Obama won't even have coffee with the opposition because he has never had to work with diverse positions. He has always been surrounded by like thinking people.
This is why we have very little progress over the last years. When arrogance meets obstinance, we have dead look on all issues including gun control. The NRA winning, can be laid right at our leaders feet.
Obama won't even have coffee with the opposition because he has never had to work with diverse positions. He has always been surrounded by like thinking people.
This is why we have very little progress over the last years. When arrogance meets obstinance, we have dead look on all issues including gun control. The NRA winning, can be laid right at our leaders feet.
The N.R.A., and the Gun Lobby, will continue to dominate this irrational craze for guns as long as they can 'pocket' Congress' officials to do their bidding. The public remains misinformed by propaganda, and does not reflect reality's needs, as crime is down. Background checks ought to be the minimum any law-abiding citizen should demand. No other civilized country has so much thirst for gun availability...and its unrestricted use.
72
Most people watch local and network news on television. The most prevalent daily reporting is a regurgitation of the police and fire logs. It costs the stations very little because there is no journalism involved.
Faced with nothing but images of police and criminals, it is no wonder the average American wants a gun under their pillow and knows next to nothing about local and federal government legislation being undertaken.
Faced with nothing but images of police and criminals, it is no wonder the average American wants a gun under their pillow and knows next to nothing about local and federal government legislation being undertaken.
25
A reason, Mr. Blow, for the "win" of the NRA is the basic dishonesty of those that would curtail gun rights.
By making illegal things that have zero impact on the problem of gun crime, the anti's cause those that are on the fence to dig a bit deeper and see that prohibitions against vertical grips, flash hiders, collapsible stocks and so on are simply attacks against an esthetic that they find abhorrent. Once such dishonesty is exposed, every other claim becomes suspect.
I would also point out that between the aftermath of hurricane Katrina and other events where the ability of the government to protect citizens failed, in effect saying "you are on your own", makes the imposition of restrictive laws highly unattractive. Couple that with Warren vs. District of Columbia wherein the SCOTUS found that police have no specific legal obligation to protect individuals and you have a reasonable reaction amongst a broad swath of Americans that is inimical to more laws.
I am in favor of laws that will reduce crime. I am not in favor of pandering and laws for the sake of a political soundbite. I also understand the concept of gradualism when dealing with an implacable foe. For these reasons and others I and other thinking citizens reject knee jerk legislation.
Finally, there is the united front of the liberal mainstream media. The Times, for example, has not published any story concerning the use of firearms in a self defence situation. Dishonesty does not sell ideas.
By making illegal things that have zero impact on the problem of gun crime, the anti's cause those that are on the fence to dig a bit deeper and see that prohibitions against vertical grips, flash hiders, collapsible stocks and so on are simply attacks against an esthetic that they find abhorrent. Once such dishonesty is exposed, every other claim becomes suspect.
I would also point out that between the aftermath of hurricane Katrina and other events where the ability of the government to protect citizens failed, in effect saying "you are on your own", makes the imposition of restrictive laws highly unattractive. Couple that with Warren vs. District of Columbia wherein the SCOTUS found that police have no specific legal obligation to protect individuals and you have a reasonable reaction amongst a broad swath of Americans that is inimical to more laws.
I am in favor of laws that will reduce crime. I am not in favor of pandering and laws for the sake of a political soundbite. I also understand the concept of gradualism when dealing with an implacable foe. For these reasons and others I and other thinking citizens reject knee jerk legislation.
Finally, there is the united front of the liberal mainstream media. The Times, for example, has not published any story concerning the use of firearms in a self defence situation. Dishonesty does not sell ideas.
30
Your arguments are spurious to say the least. Your statement that the "liberal mainstream media" offers a united front against guns. Perhaps because gun ownership is the bigger problem.
In 2010 the FBI reported 230 justifiable homicides by private citizens using guns. It reported 36 times as many, 8,275, criminal homicides by guns. Thirty-six times as many gun deaths!
And as to your argument that we "are on our own," due to SCOTUS' decisions that police have no duty to protect, you fail to reach the logical conclusion: that if police are the perpetrators against specific members of our nation, then don't members of that group need to protect themselves from the police by arming themselves? And who decides, in a confrontation, who has the right to draw first? Even many nations believe that pre-emptive strikes are justifiable.
I'm sorry. That's not a nation I want for my family. I want less guns and less military-style weapons, less large-capacity magazines, less automatic and semi-automatic weapons, and less hollow-point bullets, called 'cop killers' and might as well be called bystander killers.
I want less babies killed in their own homes by bullets that pierce the outer walls of the houses. I want less Newtown's which I can barely stand to even think about.
I want no wild-west shoot-outs on the streets by people who think they're protecting themselves or others but who only add to the carnage.
We are not the ones who are basically dishonest. That would be your side.
In 2010 the FBI reported 230 justifiable homicides by private citizens using guns. It reported 36 times as many, 8,275, criminal homicides by guns. Thirty-six times as many gun deaths!
And as to your argument that we "are on our own," due to SCOTUS' decisions that police have no duty to protect, you fail to reach the logical conclusion: that if police are the perpetrators against specific members of our nation, then don't members of that group need to protect themselves from the police by arming themselves? And who decides, in a confrontation, who has the right to draw first? Even many nations believe that pre-emptive strikes are justifiable.
I'm sorry. That's not a nation I want for my family. I want less guns and less military-style weapons, less large-capacity magazines, less automatic and semi-automatic weapons, and less hollow-point bullets, called 'cop killers' and might as well be called bystander killers.
I want less babies killed in their own homes by bullets that pierce the outer walls of the houses. I want less Newtown's which I can barely stand to even think about.
I want no wild-west shoot-outs on the streets by people who think they're protecting themselves or others but who only add to the carnage.
We are not the ones who are basically dishonest. That would be your side.
There is a good idea here. Detailed and accurate reporting on situations where armed civilians engage criminals would provide fair and balanced coverage. Not anecdotal fluff , hard detailed statistical evidence.
1
also tell me, aren't open carry laws pandering? Let's not be dishonest here
1
What is an effective response to the fear and alienation and willingness not to believe facts but demagogues? I doubt it's something as specific as an "antidote" or single policy or argument, I suspect it's something broader and deeper like changing social and political relations many steps before we get to the point of an audience this receptive to the idea that buying more guns will reduce violence.
And perhaps there is also an idea being bought that if I buy a gun my chances of dying by someone else's violence will be reduced. That would be an orientation not about public health or community but about individual (perceived) self-interest. And that would point up a distrust of others in general, not just distrust of the government and police to adequately protect. What are the roots of that distrust?
I don't think we adequately address the basis of the fears.
And perhaps there is also an idea being bought that if I buy a gun my chances of dying by someone else's violence will be reduced. That would be an orientation not about public health or community but about individual (perceived) self-interest. And that would point up a distrust of others in general, not just distrust of the government and police to adequately protect. What are the roots of that distrust?
I don't think we adequately address the basis of the fears.
1
Diana:
The extreme fears of those who are "frightened to death of guns" and oppose any form of gun ownership are what you should be exploring. It is they who skew the debate, introducing an element of irrationality -- unsupported by data -- and cause gun owners to stand firmly against radical attempts to infringe upon their rights.
Gun owners do have facts on their side. Mr. Blow would just never make their case for them.
The extreme fears of those who are "frightened to death of guns" and oppose any form of gun ownership are what you should be exploring. It is they who skew the debate, introducing an element of irrationality -- unsupported by data -- and cause gun owners to stand firmly against radical attempts to infringe upon their rights.
Gun owners do have facts on their side. Mr. Blow would just never make their case for them.
11
AACNY: You've got that backwards. Gun owners, most particularly gun owners who need guns to feel safe, are the ones who are frightened.
And the rest of us aren't 'frightened to death of guns,' we're frightened by those irrational gun owners.
And the rest of us aren't 'frightened to death of guns,' we're frightened by those irrational gun owners.
No one is "frightened to death of guns", but we are rightfully concerned about all the gun nuts who thing a gun is the answer to every one of life's problems.
I think that guns need to be controlled the same way we control driver's licenses. The Second Amendment does not refer to the rights of untrained, unthreatened citizens. It was written in a day when we did not have a standing army, when people were worried about being killed by Native Americans, and when we were a young nation needing every bit of help we could get from our citizens. Having a gun then was also a necessity. Now it is not. We've seen the results.
Trayvon Martin was killed because George Zimmerman carried a gun, followed him against police instructions, and killed him. We've seen visitors to this country killed because a homeowner felt threatened and, rather than call the police, decided to shoot. We object when the police play judge, jury and executioner. How is a homeowner who shoots someone who is not endangering him any different? The fact is that owning a gun or carrying a gun in public places will not stop most crimes. It may cause more problems because someone who is in a position to call the police decides that shooting is better.
If people want to carry guns in public places they should have to undergo the same training police officers get. And they should have to do it on a yearly basis. They should also have to prove their fitness to own and carry a gun in these same places. I don't want to be "rescued" by someone who waves a gun in public and winds up getting me killed because he's playing hero.
Trayvon Martin was killed because George Zimmerman carried a gun, followed him against police instructions, and killed him. We've seen visitors to this country killed because a homeowner felt threatened and, rather than call the police, decided to shoot. We object when the police play judge, jury and executioner. How is a homeowner who shoots someone who is not endangering him any different? The fact is that owning a gun or carrying a gun in public places will not stop most crimes. It may cause more problems because someone who is in a position to call the police decides that shooting is better.
If people want to carry guns in public places they should have to undergo the same training police officers get. And they should have to do it on a yearly basis. They should also have to prove their fitness to own and carry a gun in these same places. I don't want to be "rescued" by someone who waves a gun in public and winds up getting me killed because he's playing hero.
41
According to a CDC study, guns are used defensively between 500,000 and 2 million times per year. Very little of this is reported in the news, so few people realize this happens. The reasons these situations are not reported are that in most cases no shots are fired. The gun is presented and the aggressor flees ("If it bleeds, it leads" is the motto of most news organizations. No bleed, no lead). The main stream media is anti-gun. If a story involves someone using a gun for a lawful purpose that does not support the narrative that guns are bad, it doesn't get covered.
1
I agree with you, Hen3ry - a logical reading of the 2nd amendment may permit anyone to own a gun, but it certainly does not seem to permit anyone to carry it around in public without the "well regulated" clause coming into play.
To answer the headline question, think about this: gun proponents want virtually no restrictions on gun "rights," meaning that guns should be allowed in any place where the public congregates, including grocery stores, day care centers, shopping malls, bars and restaurants and schools.
If there is a right to bear arms (and there isn't, if one reads the 2nd Amendment honestly), how does it follow that that right carries with it no limits on or where guns can be present?
It doesn't, but that is the legacy of the weapons makers and their stooges who run the NRA.
If there is a right to bear arms (and there isn't, if one reads the 2nd Amendment honestly), how does it follow that that right carries with it no limits on or where guns can be present?
It doesn't, but that is the legacy of the weapons makers and their stooges who run the NRA.
12
After the next fatal mass shooting by some lunatic with mental problems or a thrill kill, we must require the White House, Congress and the Supreme Court to allow the public to walk unfettered into their domains with loaded weapons. If you want to make these laws and uphold them and pee your pants in a corner for the rest of us, put your body with your money puppeteers. It's fine for me, a mother wife and business owner, to have to worry about being shot due to carelessness or malice while buying paint at Lowes or picking up groceries but all three branches of government ban any weapons except for the people protecting THEM from being anywhere near them.
If the actual amount of home invasions that were deterred because the owner shot the would be burglar, rapist, etc.. were true, Wayne Lapierre would be a walking billboard like a NASCAR driver and car. He'd be shouting it from the rooftops but that's not the case. The reality is that most fatal deaths from guns are suicides, accidents within the home (tragically young people and even toddlers sometimes as cause and victim) and homicides. Even in controlled environments like firing ranges, things can go terribly wrong. The poor man who was killed and the poor little girl who needs to live with that comes to mind. That was truly an accident which could easily have been avoided had our society not fancied themselves as a tv detective or action "hero".
If the actual amount of home invasions that were deterred because the owner shot the would be burglar, rapist, etc.. were true, Wayne Lapierre would be a walking billboard like a NASCAR driver and car. He'd be shouting it from the rooftops but that's not the case. The reality is that most fatal deaths from guns are suicides, accidents within the home (tragically young people and even toddlers sometimes as cause and victim) and homicides. Even in controlled environments like firing ranges, things can go terribly wrong. The poor man who was killed and the poor little girl who needs to live with that comes to mind. That was truly an accident which could easily have been avoided had our society not fancied themselves as a tv detective or action "hero".
13
The people know why the 2nd amendment exists, and the reason for it is a valid today as it was in colonial times.
10
Oh really? I believe one of the reasons for the 2nd Amendment was southern plantation owners' fear of slave uprisings. In addition, of course, to protection against hostile Native Americans. Not sure I can identify the contemporary analogies to these.
No it is not as valid. Now we have a standing army on our side and we have National Guards. We don't need "militias."
This article points out that gun ownership is up, crime is down. Could it be that gun ownership reduces crime? Just asking.
13
No. Just saying. Policing and decent social policies reduce crime.
I'm no fan of the NRA but I'm no more a fan of the far left who refuses to punish mostly young me who fuel the underground gun trade in the northeast. The twisted policy of the far left is effectively, criminalize the rancher living on 300 acres in the west with a law that makes no sense, so that many young inner city men don't face prison time for murdering each other with illegal guns. Harsher punishments for being caught with an illegal gun is the answer, not taking away guns from law abiding citizens. The murder rate in the northeast comes from underground gun trade, (from the south of course). The media focuses on rampages, never the majority of the killings which involve minority men carrying illegal guns. Their answer, make guns illegal. Well, I'm not crazy and I like to hunt and I like to target practice. So, my guns get taken away and the illegal trade and criminals in inner cities continue to have guns. How does this help the matter? It worsens it in my opinion. The left is as much to blame as the crazy far right wingers who fear an alien government or the U.N. is plotting to take over. The two groups are made for each other.
12
MCS - what you say sounds logical, but I'm not sure it is based on fact. First, young men in big cities definitely go to jail for carrying illegal weapons. Second, how do we know which young inner-city men are defending themselves from criminals by using weapons, vs. the ones who are actively committing crimes? It's dangerous to be a young man in the poorer areas of many big urban centers (just as there are added dangers in being a young man in rural areas where crime - e.g. meth labs and sales - and poverty also go hand in hand). And the laxer the gun laws, it seems, the more impossible it becomes to tell the good guy from the bad guy. Already we as a nation seem to have been unable to tell the difference in the case of Trayvon Martin.
You rarely see the statistics on the hugely disproportionate murder rates visited on african-americans by other african-americans. The stats are there, published by the feds but simply ignored by the Times, Mr. Blow and other agenda driven liberals.
I'm a life member of the NRA, Gun Owners of America and the Texas Rifle Association. Many of my fellow gun owners believe that the United States suffers from rampant and irreversible crime. However the crime statistics show that the U.S. has relatively low crime rates excepting the tragic mass killings that occasionally occur. I've noticed one common trait among my gun owner friends who tend to always keep a firearm within easy reach and that is they are generally 'news junkies'. Unfortunately, the NRA uses the 'runaway crime' issue to increase their membership and the gun control advocates use the occasional mass murders that occur to enact more legislation. Americans used to be masters at compromise. I doubt the two opposing factions will ever come together until the contentious emotions surrounding this issue are addressed intelligently.
15
I live in Canada - which shares many cultural characteristics with the USA, from fast-food chains to sports to movies.
However, our histories with guns are different. We did not have a Revolutionary War, we negotiated our independence from England. We did not have a Civil War, we had a referendum about independence. We did not settle the West with pioneers, we had the Royal Canadian Mounted Police establish law and order.
These experiences don't make us better - or worse - than the United States. It just means that our experience with guns has been different - with consequent effects on the way guns are used in our country now, compared to the USA. Mr. Blow needs to look at his country's history to see the differences from country-to-country.
A simplistic analysis does not shed much light on the topic of gun laws. Mr. Blow has demonstrated time and again that if he can demonize a topic, by looking at it from one angle, he will.
However, our histories with guns are different. We did not have a Revolutionary War, we negotiated our independence from England. We did not have a Civil War, we had a referendum about independence. We did not settle the West with pioneers, we had the Royal Canadian Mounted Police establish law and order.
These experiences don't make us better - or worse - than the United States. It just means that our experience with guns has been different - with consequent effects on the way guns are used in our country now, compared to the USA. Mr. Blow needs to look at his country's history to see the differences from country-to-country.
A simplistic analysis does not shed much light on the topic of gun laws. Mr. Blow has demonstrated time and again that if he can demonize a topic, by looking at it from one angle, he will.
15
Makes you consider moving to Canada, doesn't it. A saner, more secure place to live.
Well said. And with characteristic Canadian tact. I'd like to think Mr. Blow
is in favor of stricter gun control for police inasmuch as a gun was pulled
by a Barney Fife cop on his son last winter. The kid was at school and guilty of walking while black.
is in favor of stricter gun control for police inasmuch as a gun was pulled
by a Barney Fife cop on his son last winter. The kid was at school and guilty of walking while black.
In a 2005 article in National Review Online, John Lott, Jr. reported that the "International Crime Victimization Survey" showed that Canada's violent crime rate was twice that of the U.S. Gun control in Canada is much tighter than in the US.
1
The NRA promises reduced crime rates when concealed carry laws are passed - that just the possibility of someone carrying a concealed weapon is enough to prevent some thug from robbing someone on the street. Well, it ain't working, NRA! People are shooting each other in drive bys, in bars, in cars, on front porches, everywhere. Just having a concealed weapon hasn't stopped anyone from shooting another person.
In fact, there are very few cases - almost non existent - of some weaponized do gooder pulling out their concealed weapon and using it after a thug has pulled his weapon and shot someone. All these guns being carried around by people but the only people using guns are the thugs.
Hardly ever do we hear of a do gooder pulling out his weapon and preventing a robbery, a rape, a drive by. Bullets keep flying around hitting their intended and unintended victims with no retort from the concealed carry crowd the NRA is so proud of.
In fact, there are very few cases - almost non existent - of some weaponized do gooder pulling out their concealed weapon and using it after a thug has pulled his weapon and shot someone. All these guns being carried around by people but the only people using guns are the thugs.
Hardly ever do we hear of a do gooder pulling out his weapon and preventing a robbery, a rape, a drive by. Bullets keep flying around hitting their intended and unintended victims with no retort from the concealed carry crowd the NRA is so proud of.
10
Read the CDC report that President Obama ordered and then buried. Guns are used defensively 500,000 to 2 million times per year, which is hardly "almost non-existent"
The NRA is winning - with the help of the news and entertainment media, and the fundamentals of psychology. Humans are more motivated by fear than reason. The media use our fascination with the horrible to sell ads to us by attaching them to their spewing endless streams of violence, from faux criminal investigations to scouring the globe for the world's bloodiest headlines, to the blockbusters at the cineplex. The NRA then pushes their agenda by fanning our paranoia, convincing us that the only way to end gun violence is by buying more guns, which, of course only makes gun violence more likely.
It is way past time for the media to break this cycle by calling out the NRA en masse for what the organization is: a hazard to the nation's collective mental health and safety.
It is way past time for the media to break this cycle by calling out the NRA en masse for what the organization is: a hazard to the nation's collective mental health and safety.
24
Since when has the media been afraid to promote gun control? There are more guns in this country than ever before and the crime rate falls most precipitously where concealed carry is least restricted. Those are facts.
the belief that gun ownership will make them safer is just one more manifestation of the libertarian flavor of modern right wing politics. their propaganda machines convinced them they dont need corporate regulation so kill the minimum wage and all epa regs, they dont need safety nets so kill social security and medicare and unemployment insurance, they dont need healthcare so oppose aca, now they dont need police. amazing how effective the media campaign of the fox news and rush crowd has been at convicining people to set themselves up for slaugther. problem is we are all being dragged along too.
14
Reviewing the Pew Research Center report, it's clear why NYT chose to occupy a large chunk of space in the article with a graphic of three cherry-picked points in time, rather than show the graphs themselves - the data do not support the alarmist conclusions. Crime did fall sharply, then distinctly decrease in rate of fall, falling slowly and intermittently. At that same point, the number of people responding to a survey that crime was on the rise, also stopped it's sharp rise, slowing distinctly with intermittent fluctuations. Perception reasonably reflected reality, especially considering two factors not discussed: 1) People best sense change in direction, or rate of change. As crime flattened out, sporadic incidents and events lead to changes in perception less well linked to trends. 2) This charge is largely driven by media portrayal of events. The media co-opts gun control by generating news on guns when there is none, or wildly accentuating news when there is a tragic shooting. A similar WSJ article on the Pew report opined that the media and perception on crime and guns may be somehow connected, that this is not well known. One has to ask - why would Pew not study how the media alter perceptions on guns and crime? The answer is plain - they chose not to bite the hand that feeds them. It's a shameful collusion between Pew and the mass media that drive the bias against guns - but I'm sure they both tell themselves the ends justify the means.
8
The fault for this lies not in the NRA but in ourselves. Each individual has a choice as to whether to truly be pro-life, and hence never even think about owning or touching an instrument whose purpose is to kill. That is a choice each and every one of us can make, and do make. Outside agencies perhaps can influence, but they are not the ones that hand our cash or credit card over the counter. If every single person decided tomorrow to have nothing more to do with guns, the gun industry and the NRA would all disappear within a matter of months. How is this really different from giving up smoking? The choice lies with me, and with you.
7
I feel compelled to mention that attention, blame, statistics, and manifold other ideas are confused in the discussion of guns in America. I am as progressive and left-leaning as they come in social issues and this is, in my mind, perhaps the most politicized. We as a country are by far the biggest arms dealer to the world. Guns, planes, tanks, military aid to our friends (as long as they remain our friends), and nuclear weapons to protect our homeland. Until we effect disarmament (not going to happen in my lifetime) we should not compare the profit that is official and sanctioned by our leaders and the meager protections we citizens seek by wanting to protect ourselves and our homesteads.
4
>
"Has the N.R.A. Won?"
YES!
Now we have people walking around in public with semi-auto rifles and/or 50-cal. long rifles, which 25-yrs ago would have been unthinkable.
Folly is the name of the game for the "Crazy Ape".
Lest you think I jest as to the term "Crazy Ape". Albert Szent-Gyorgyi M.D, Ph.D and Nobel Laureate wrote a concise little book titled: "The Crazy Ape". Good read.
"Has the N.R.A. Won?"
YES!
Now we have people walking around in public with semi-auto rifles and/or 50-cal. long rifles, which 25-yrs ago would have been unthinkable.
Folly is the name of the game for the "Crazy Ape".
Lest you think I jest as to the term "Crazy Ape". Albert Szent-Gyorgyi M.D, Ph.D and Nobel Laureate wrote a concise little book titled: "The Crazy Ape". Good read.
5
I had no idea people were walking around with $5,000, 40 pound rifles. Have you seen one? Oh, you mean the cops.
1
The great irony is that the NRA thugs actually may have it right. It is only in this era that we have a government that is so tyrannical and undemocratic that only a violent uprising can bring social change.
But we who might join such an uprising are utterly horrified by guns and gun violence, so we are voluntarily unarmed and advocate tirelessly to disarm the populace.
Yep, we may need to overthrow the tyrannical government, but the other guys have all the guns. At least pot is being legalized in growing numbers of places (pun intended). There is that.
But we who might join such an uprising are utterly horrified by guns and gun violence, so we are voluntarily unarmed and advocate tirelessly to disarm the populace.
Yep, we may need to overthrow the tyrannical government, but the other guys have all the guns. At least pot is being legalized in growing numbers of places (pun intended). There is that.
@Steve: All our government would have to do is put weaponized drones hovering over our big cities and that would be that for any insurrection. And with the Air Force being almost 100% heavy duty evangelical, I wouldn't put it past them. I fear that more than a terrorist.
Steve, consider that --
1. We do have social change in America. That's what elections are about, although certainly the recent Republican gerrymandering, reversal of the Florida vote count, etc. are inconsistent with freedom.
2. We do not and will not have "violent uprising". If you think personal firearms can defeat Federal tanks and nuclear weapons, you are disconnected from reality.
1. We do have social change in America. That's what elections are about, although certainly the recent Republican gerrymandering, reversal of the Florida vote count, etc. are inconsistent with freedom.
2. We do not and will not have "violent uprising". If you think personal firearms can defeat Federal tanks and nuclear weapons, you are disconnected from reality.
I have a friend who is a hard-working citizen of this country and a decent human being. One day as we were talking politics, the "guns" issue came up. I was shocked to hear that he and many other libertarians believe the government is behind the recent mass shootings as a way to "drum up support for its anti-gun proposals."
I'm one for a good conspiracy theory now and again( area 51, JFK, etc.) but that one threw me for a loop. But, yes, the NRA is winning the war because it is winning most of the battles.
I'm one for a good conspiracy theory now and again( area 51, JFK, etc.) but that one threw me for a loop. But, yes, the NRA is winning the war because it is winning most of the battles.
23
Perception versus reality. The NRA never lets facts get in the way of their PR campaign to convince people of a phantom crime wave and phantom gun regulation.
11
The evening news in every major city is a repeat of gun violence, yet rather than causing concern it promotes the need for self preservation through gun ownership. This even though a high [percentage of these news stories of gun violence is between family members and friends.
The stories of children killing children with guns found in the home. the stories of family arguments ending in gun murders, the bar fights that end in murders, are not stories of people protecting themselves, but stories of too many guns in too many hands.
I for one, are sick of these stories and the media must start accepting their role of clearly showing that these killings are not from criminals committing a crime , but from violent settling of every day happenings, and are the result of gun s being present at these situations.
The stories of children killing children with guns found in the home. the stories of family arguments ending in gun murders, the bar fights that end in murders, are not stories of people protecting themselves, but stories of too many guns in too many hands.
I for one, are sick of these stories and the media must start accepting their role of clearly showing that these killings are not from criminals committing a crime , but from violent settling of every day happenings, and are the result of gun s being present at these situations.
21
Guns don't have anything to do with crimes, except to commit them. But as the bullet leaves the barrel, common sense exits, too. Fueled by the same powerful, explosive forces that have no vision of the carnage they will reek, no concern for the damages spread irreversibly in the name of the right to do harm, hidden under the loud shadows of protection and self-defense.
A constitutional right enables America's society of violence, which refuses to trim its edges of the blind fury of violence, whose highest calling is to turn civil communities into armed camps. Guns are tied to an imagined or real blood lust. Too often in America, these mad dreams come true.
A constitutional right enables America's society of violence, which refuses to trim its edges of the blind fury of violence, whose highest calling is to turn civil communities into armed camps. Guns are tied to an imagined or real blood lust. Too often in America, these mad dreams come true.
14
You've been watching too many movies. Guns are lumps of metal and plastic, they dont control you like the ring in the Hobbit. They dont make your choices for you.
5
dwb, the fantasy you offer has no place in reality, and doesn't reflect the truth by their own testimony of how gun owners and users react to guns. First, Los Angeles has a school problem specifically designed to intervene against gun violence from primary through the college level; that program reports the central issue is not depression, bi-polar disorder, but a deep symbiotic relationship with guns and their potential for destruction. In fact, their clients actively engage after every public case, in planning and improving on the details.
Second, five years of working in education with felons who committed gun crimes opened by eyes by their reporting of the rush and thrill that lump of metal provided them--most cited the feeling as more powerful than any drug they had used, and took great pains to explain its sentient power.
Finally, read the readers comments on any gun site online; esp. in talking about guns, their words and descriptions and personal expressions mirror exactly what I have described. The gun, for many, is an enabling agent.
Second, five years of working in education with felons who committed gun crimes opened by eyes by their reporting of the rush and thrill that lump of metal provided them--most cited the feeling as more powerful than any drug they had used, and took great pains to explain its sentient power.
Finally, read the readers comments on any gun site online; esp. in talking about guns, their words and descriptions and personal expressions mirror exactly what I have described. The gun, for many, is an enabling agent.
1
So the 2 year old who shot and killed her mother had a choice? Well of course she did i mean she's spent her whole life with guns.
1
It goes beyond the NRA. In America, ignorance has won. Greed has won. War has won. Fear has won, and racism and xenophobia have won. Religious fundamentalism has won, and the income gap has won. Anti-science has won, and fossil fuels continue to win.
Who benefits from all of this? Not the American people. No. The gun merchants, the fearmongers, Wall Street, the military industry, the hate merchants, and people like Sheldon Adelson, The Koch Brothers, the Walton heirs, Donald Trump, Wayne LaPierre, and Dick Cheney are still the only winners in modern day America.
Who benefits from all of this? Not the American people. No. The gun merchants, the fearmongers, Wall Street, the military industry, the hate merchants, and people like Sheldon Adelson, The Koch Brothers, the Walton heirs, Donald Trump, Wayne LaPierre, and Dick Cheney are still the only winners in modern day America.
424
Yes, Yes. The The history of all hitherto existing society is the history of class struggles. Communist Manifesto, etc. Workers of the World Unite! All you have to loose is your chains.
How has that been working out since The 19th Century?
How has that been working out since The 19th Century?
These venal people, as well as actively evil ones like Cheney, have won many battles. Don't despair. They have not won the war.
Out of this new Gilded Age will come an new era of activism. America is ripe for it. Think about how despairing it must have been to be a black person or a labor activist in the 1890s. You could well be shot down by police or have your life ruined and organization crushed. Then or now.
Ours is not yet the world of Jack London's The Iron Heel. We can still turn this around.
Out of this new Gilded Age will come an new era of activism. America is ripe for it. Think about how despairing it must have been to be a black person or a labor activist in the 1890s. You could well be shot down by police or have your life ruined and organization crushed. Then or now.
Ours is not yet the world of Jack London's The Iron Heel. We can still turn this around.
2
Thankfully, every one of these relics of a by-gone era has one foot in the grave. Soon enough, the healing will begin.
1
The very concept of "gun rights" says it all. Guns have rights, thanks to the NRA and the weapons manufacturers who fund it.
But people who hope to avoid the proximity of armed nutcases who believe they might need to shoot to kill at any moment (to prevent a robbery or overthrow our elected government)? We have fewer rights each day.
But people who hope to avoid the proximity of armed nutcases who believe they might need to shoot to kill at any moment (to prevent a robbery or overthrow our elected government)? We have fewer rights each day.
32
This Supreme Court has already said that are corporations are people.
I was reading your comment wondering if the SC would say that guns are people too.
I was reading your comment wondering if the SC would say that guns are people too.
I grew up in a gun culture - the upper peninsula of Michigan. Everybody hunted. Everybody had guns. We had rifles for deer hunting and shotguns for bird hunting. We didn't have any pistols because it's really hard to kill either a deer or a bird with a pistol. I never, ever thought of guns as a means of self-defense when I was a kid and I don't think anyone else did. Then I went to Vietnam in the infantry. I've shot people and been shot at. I know a lot about guns.
After I came back I never owned a gun, not because I had any distaste for them but because I had no desire to hunt and there was no war going on here.
There's still no war going on here. I have a brother-in-law who thinks that we live in 'the hood.' He lives an hour out from here in an all white area and owns 15 guns. I think he's an idiot. Last year, the house next door was broken into. One of my adult sons happened to be here. He walked out in the front yard where the robbers could see him and calmly called the police. They saw him and took off. End of story. I can't help but wonder what by BiL would have done in that circumstance.
It appears to me that most of the people advocating for open carry and widespread gun ownership are the very people who really have no business owning guns. They are fearful, irresponsible and in general just have no idea what they're doing. Self defense? Against what? Maybe against each other. I can't see any other significant threat in this country at this point in history.
After I came back I never owned a gun, not because I had any distaste for them but because I had no desire to hunt and there was no war going on here.
There's still no war going on here. I have a brother-in-law who thinks that we live in 'the hood.' He lives an hour out from here in an all white area and owns 15 guns. I think he's an idiot. Last year, the house next door was broken into. One of my adult sons happened to be here. He walked out in the front yard where the robbers could see him and calmly called the police. They saw him and took off. End of story. I can't help but wonder what by BiL would have done in that circumstance.
It appears to me that most of the people advocating for open carry and widespread gun ownership are the very people who really have no business owning guns. They are fearful, irresponsible and in general just have no idea what they're doing. Self defense? Against what? Maybe against each other. I can't see any other significant threat in this country at this point in history.
565
I don't own a pistol to use for hunting or for self defense. I own a pistol because it's fun to shoot. And I really don't care what you, or anyone else thinks about the matter.
1
@Rich in Atlanta: Wonderful comment. Thank you.
4
Though I didn't go to Vietnam, the gun culture of my youth was similar to Rich's. Any excessive fascination with guns, especially among us kids so inclined, was roundly discouraged. Guns had purpose but were dangerous, and not considered the solution by many to most every problem encountered as they seem to be today.
I recall in the mid-1950's a local search party being formed to look for an elderly lady who had wandered off in the woods. On fellow showed up with a pistol on his hip. My then brother-in-law looked him over and asked, " What are you going to do when you find her, shoot her?"
I recall in the mid-1950's a local search party being formed to look for an elderly lady who had wandered off in the woods. On fellow showed up with a pistol on his hip. My then brother-in-law looked him over and asked, " What are you going to do when you find her, shoot her?"
1
Abortion has been legal for decades, yet the rate is going down.
The left relies on anti-scientific fairy tales, flawed ecological studies, and strident belief in pacifism. Reality check: Drug and gun prohibition does nothing except encourage organized crime and DEA parties with cartels. It's time to end the tall tales.
Deterrence is a real thing. Criminal predators avoid armed citizens. Crime is going down because people are protecting themselves, an inconvenient truth for the pacifists on the left. Even worse, a disarmed populace plus a culture of dependency yields a corrupt government that extorts them for money (see: Ferguson).
The left will keep crying Blood! Streets! But no one is listening anymore. Politicians who push these false solutions are not elected.
If the NRA is winning, its because they have the facts and reality on their side.
The left relies on anti-scientific fairy tales, flawed ecological studies, and strident belief in pacifism. Reality check: Drug and gun prohibition does nothing except encourage organized crime and DEA parties with cartels. It's time to end the tall tales.
Deterrence is a real thing. Criminal predators avoid armed citizens. Crime is going down because people are protecting themselves, an inconvenient truth for the pacifists on the left. Even worse, a disarmed populace plus a culture of dependency yields a corrupt government that extorts them for money (see: Ferguson).
The left will keep crying Blood! Streets! But no one is listening anymore. Politicians who push these false solutions are not elected.
If the NRA is winning, its because they have the facts and reality on their side.
20
dwb:
If the NRA is winning, its because they have the facts and reality on their side.
*****
Mr. Blow fails to consider the overreach of his beloved big government. The more gun control fanatics talk about gun control, the more people buy guns.
If the NRA is winning, its because they have the facts and reality on their side.
*****
Mr. Blow fails to consider the overreach of his beloved big government. The more gun control fanatics talk about gun control, the more people buy guns.
14
"Crime is going down because people are protecting themselves, an inconvenient truth for the pacifists on the left."
There is absolutely no evidence for this. Talk about anti-scientific fairy tales.
There is absolutely no evidence for this. Talk about anti-scientific fairy tales.
8
@AACNY: The NRA is winning because Fox Noise is on their side. The facts and reality apparently no longer matter to a majority of people. As dwb said, "no one is listening any more." It does not bode well for our country when ignoring facts becomes the norm, and people who point them out are ridiculed.
4
Brave people don't need guns to defend themselves against statistically insignificant threats. America has become a nation of scaredy-cats.
141
Brave people are prepared to fight whatever the threat. Brave people are not afraid of armed people. People who are cowards reject the idea of firearms for fear that they may be attacked by them. They fear that possessing them may cause them to have to fight back rather than cower.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W9eCrs_MXxo
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W9eCrs_MXxo
Legal gun ownership is predominantly a white male thing. I should know. The white male demographic is already older than other segments of the American population and is continuing to get older relative to them. More and more younger black and brown people and fewer and fewer and older white people. They conflate rising black and brown population percentages with a nonexistent rising crime rate or if they know what the crime rate is now, they think it will inevitably rise just when they're at their weakest physically. The feeling among them is that they want the protection that only a gun can offer. "When seconds count , the cops are only minutes away." (Where old. mostly white people need more protection is from rightwing assaults on old age entitlements, but that's for another column).
128
Democrats have been passing racist gun control since slavery ended. Areas with high minority populations are mostly controled by Democrats and that leaves minorities disarmed.
People mistakenly believe that crime and homicide are on the rise because the gun control groups, the media and even politicians keep telling them that it is. The NRA and other pro second amendment groups keep pointing out that it has been declining for 20 years.
Its interesting how gun control groups want you to believe there is a warzone out there equipped with machine guns and other weapons of war then claim that poele are paranoid for arming up. People should arm up anyway its their right. Gun control is a losing argument. every inch they gain causes them to lose a mile.
People mistakenly believe that crime and homicide are on the rise because the gun control groups, the media and even politicians keep telling them that it is. The NRA and other pro second amendment groups keep pointing out that it has been declining for 20 years.
Its interesting how gun control groups want you to believe there is a warzone out there equipped with machine guns and other weapons of war then claim that poele are paranoid for arming up. People should arm up anyway its their right. Gun control is a losing argument. every inch they gain causes them to lose a mile.
If this comment were even slightly correct, it wouldn't be so sad. Take a look at the stats and you will see who is committing the crimes and murders with guns. It not middle aged white males.
I have recently been spending a great deal of time in Asia. Every day I read with dismay the news from my country. EVERY single day there are headlines related to shootings. If you look at it from the outside it would seem the country is out of control when it comes to gun use. This is especially true whe you look at the incredibly low number of murders in places like Japan, Hong Kong, Singapore and South Korea. You feel very safe walking even in huge metropolitan areas here. While it is true that many variables contribute to violence, the easy access to guns simply makes it more likely that people will use them. The US has the highest rate of gun ownership in the world. We have literally thousands of gun related murders per year and Japan has them in the low single or double digits. Hong Kong and Singapore are even lower. Gun control is very tight here and people are quite ok with it. This is one of the benefits of being able to visit other countries. If only some of our politicians would be open minded enough to take another view.
551
I agree 100%. I've lived in London for the last decade. There was a person shot and killed by a police officer this year. One. It made the national papers. There will be an investigation. The last time that happened was 2012. Yes, the last time a person was shot and killed in the UK by the police was nearly 3 years ago. In 2014 police fired weapons 3 times in the UK (it's all tracked and again investigated). I know this isn't all about police shootings...Murder by gunshot is low - 58 cases in 2011. The streets feel very safe. People don't live in fear that the other person has a gun. It's wonderfully liberating.
13
A false dichotomy that is constantly thrown up in the discussion of gun control - so many other nations compared to America have strict gun control and very low rates of gun violence and death. So what?!
Cultural differences mean that different people have different traditions and mores. Here in America we are saturated with violence and we just love to wallow in it. It is who we are as a people. If you can't live with it, then its time to go to somewhere more attune to your expectations. I'm sure Singapore's semi-police state will be most welcoming to a progressive mindset.
Cultural differences mean that different people have different traditions and mores. Here in America we are saturated with violence and we just love to wallow in it. It is who we are as a people. If you can't live with it, then its time to go to somewhere more attune to your expectations. I'm sure Singapore's semi-police state will be most welcoming to a progressive mindset.
4
Japan is not the US. There is no way to honestly compare our two countries. Mexico is our neighbor to the south and they have strict gun control. They are a war zone. There is no way to accurately measure the mass murders there. Bodies just disapear.
2
Sorry to say Mr. Blow, but game, set and match to the NRA. In the aftermath of the horror of Sandy Hook not only did they beat back any attempt to enact new legislation which could logically eliminate or else make it more difficult to obtain assault weapons but they stopped the debate. In fact, the only debates we hear today are about making it easier to get guns. In many states it is simpler and less bureaucrat to obtain a concealed weapons permit than a driver's license. Just like American's vote against their own financial interests when they vote for the GOP they apply inverse logic when discussing guns.
77
It clearly has nothing to do with logic. It's about culture, machismo, class, racism, etc.
1
Big Money won. Campaign contributions determine what the elected officials do. I'm always reminded of a Senator's tongue-i-cheek quote from Warren Buffet's op-ed piece (September 10, 2010) in the Times: ''Warren, contribute $10 million and you can get the colors of the American flag changed.''
So whether it is the NRA or some other group with money, they control the political agenda in this country. The "elected" officials will vote against the country's interest in a heartbeat as long as someone pays them to do it.
The Congress gave the Prime Minister of Israel a forum to speak out against their own President beause of the money thrown around by the likes of Sheldon Adelson.
Big Money has and continues to win, at the expense of the interest of the people of this country.
So whether it is the NRA or some other group with money, they control the political agenda in this country. The "elected" officials will vote against the country's interest in a heartbeat as long as someone pays them to do it.
The Congress gave the Prime Minister of Israel a forum to speak out against their own President beause of the money thrown around by the likes of Sheldon Adelson.
Big Money has and continues to win, at the expense of the interest of the people of this country.
205
I keep hearing about big money. Yet, for all Bloombergs billions i dont see him promoting safety by giving away locks, safes, or sponsoring training. He spends his money trying to get nanny-statist politicians elected, or on propaganda pieces from Hopkins (he gave Hopkins 300 million for "research").
His billions buys a lot of propaganda mongerers, yet he cannot help politicians. So, hmmmm, im thinking its not the money. Im thinking blaming the money is the last resort for people losing the debate.
His billions buys a lot of propaganda mongerers, yet he cannot help politicians. So, hmmmm, im thinking its not the money. Im thinking blaming the money is the last resort for people losing the debate.
7
There are still elections. People vote for the politicians who espouse the increase in gun ownership and reject the pols who advocate gun control. They have choices. We can't escape this truth.
3
@dwb
I'm afraid your case against big money not having an impact in politics is *not* helped by citing Bloomberg.
Bloomberg *did* get elected twice as Mayor, and managed to get a third term, despite term limits. So, no, he is not a good example big money not playing a role in politics. As to what he does with his money now is irrelevant.
Yes, there are cases where Big Money hasn't helped. Linda McMahon of CT is a better example than Bloomberg.
I'm afraid your case against big money not having an impact in politics is *not* helped by citing Bloomberg.
Bloomberg *did* get elected twice as Mayor, and managed to get a third term, despite term limits. So, no, he is not a good example big money not playing a role in politics. As to what he does with his money now is irrelevant.
Yes, there are cases where Big Money hasn't helped. Linda McMahon of CT is a better example than Bloomberg.
People operate on the delusion that packing a piece means that they are able to "defend myself" in a shooting or during a crime. There is a pending law in Texas to allow university students to carry weapons. One young woman was shown on TV news saying that it would make her safer because of campus rape. There are many problems with that assumption: women are generally weaker physically than men so that an assailant might simply disarm her and end up with a gun (he might not have) himself; she might simply introduce a lethal weapon into a crime which had none and end up dead instead of raped; many women involved in campus rape are too drunk to know what they are doing (imagine a firearm in their hands); would she really shoot a fellow student, maybe one she had gone to a party with who is himself drunk?
Even trained cops had a hard time shooting straight in an emergency situation; even they have a hard time judging when to shoot and when to hold back. How can people think that they, with far less training, can make the right decisions and the right shots when they themselves are under threat and maybe physically struggling with an attacker?
Even trained cops had a hard time shooting straight in an emergency situation; even they have a hard time judging when to shoot and when to hold back. How can people think that they, with far less training, can make the right decisions and the right shots when they themselves are under threat and maybe physically struggling with an attacker?
50
Yet, criminologists have found that between 200,000 and 2 million defensive uses of guns occur every year in the USA. Anti-gun fears are often fueled by imaginary or grossly exaggerated fears.
Reality shows that they reduce crime and save lives.
Reality shows that they reduce crime and save lives.
16
MisterMike:
"Anti-gun fears are often fueled by imaginary or grossly exaggerated fears."
*****
Probably the most distorted of any emotion in this entire gun debate are those of people "frightened to death" of guns. Terror is a terrible basis upon which to create policy. This kind of fear is never really exposed as irrational, which it is, and too often encouraged as rational input and allowed to influence policy.
This irrationality just leads to defensive actions on the part of legal gun owners; hence, the increased sales.
"Anti-gun fears are often fueled by imaginary or grossly exaggerated fears."
*****
Probably the most distorted of any emotion in this entire gun debate are those of people "frightened to death" of guns. Terror is a terrible basis upon which to create policy. This kind of fear is never really exposed as irrational, which it is, and too often encouraged as rational input and allowed to influence policy.
This irrationality just leads to defensive actions on the part of legal gun owners; hence, the increased sales.
9
I do not believe that.
The NRA has this round, the Moms have the next. Moms Demand Action, with more and more state house wins are bringing more back ground checks and sanity to the argument.
33
Bloomberg, the Brady campaign, and Violence Policy center wont win until they start to lobby for reasonable regulations.
To have credibility, they will need to show themselves to be more than mere prohibitionists, by lobbying to repeal ridiculous regulations in places like NJ, CA, and MD. They have never met a law they did not like. The NRA wins by showing that the Blood! Streets! Argument is false.
To have credibility, they will need to show themselves to be more than mere prohibitionists, by lobbying to repeal ridiculous regulations in places like NJ, CA, and MD. They have never met a law they did not like. The NRA wins by showing that the Blood! Streets! Argument is false.
3
I don't disagree, dwb, which is why I appreciate the Mom's approach, more state by state and more sensible.
I believe that the carrying of guns by so many Americans contributes to the excessive use of shootings by the police. On one video I watched of police apprehending a suspect, one of the officers was screaming--practically hysterically--he's got a gun, he's got a gun! If in their minds everyone they apprehend may pull a gun on them, they willbe more likely to shoot first without ascertaining whether in fact there is a gun.
139
Or it could be the inability to fire or discipline cops, the slow erosion of civil rights (e.g the courts allowing no-knock raids), plus a DOD program that hands out MRAPS like candy.
8
More, I think, to poor officer selection, poor training, and an ingrained belief of " us against the enemy" type of thinking. And the enemy is anyone who is not us...
Surely you are not suggesting that because some police are fearful and stupid enough to see guns everywhere that we must re-write our laws to accomodate their paranoid fantasies? All in the name of what? Of stopping police from feeling insecure? If they are insecure , let them resuign. Police get paid well to take the very tiny risks they do. Our firemen and women take far more risks daily fighting fires-,many set by insurance fraudsters, and more firemen are injured and killed by burns and being crushed, than police-who suffer about 100 fatalities a year-in all 50 states- from ALL gun "accidents" and the rare shootings.
Gun control, abortion, and gay marriage: the Republican Fear Trifecta.
248
I would assume there are millions of NRA members that are Democrats. You think owning a gun is just a Republican thing?
2
I'm a Republican. I'm not pro-choice, I'm pro-abortion. If you can't afford to have the child and care for it, or if you're not interested enough in the child then have an abortion. As for gay marriage, I'm neutral. I'm not going to oppose it but I'm not going to support it. As for gun control, I belong to the NRA and as we say I vote. You can't get everything you want in a party so you have to pick the one you're most aligned with but we don't agree on all issue. Democrats love to say don't stereotype and then they do.
1
No, I think Republicans use it solely to arouse irrational fear.
How's that gun ban in Chicago working?
25
FBI Uniform Crime 2012. Homicides/weapons Used
Total firearms. 8,855
Handguns. 6,371
Rifles. 322
Shotguns. 303
Bribes-cutting instruments. 1,589
Blunt objects. (Clubs hammers) 518
Personal weapons. 678
Fire. 85
2008
Total firearms. 9,528
Handguns. 6,800
Rifles. 280
Shotguns. 442
Knives or cutting instruments. 1,888
Blunt objects. 603
Personal weapons (hand feet fist). 875
Fire 85
Total firearms
2008. 9,528
2009. 9,199
2010. 8,874
2011. 8,653
1012. 8,855
4 straight year of decreased in total firearms. There is a drop is almost 1,000 from 2008. To 2012. There is a significant drop in 3 other areas as well
If The NRA is such a problem why is there such a significant drop in total firearm crime. From 2008-2012? You can cite whatever study you want but these are facts.
Total firearms. 8,855
Handguns. 6,371
Rifles. 322
Shotguns. 303
Bribes-cutting instruments. 1,589
Blunt objects. (Clubs hammers) 518
Personal weapons. 678
Fire. 85
2008
Total firearms. 9,528
Handguns. 6,800
Rifles. 280
Shotguns. 442
Knives or cutting instruments. 1,888
Blunt objects. 603
Personal weapons (hand feet fist). 875
Fire 85
Total firearms
2008. 9,528
2009. 9,199
2010. 8,874
2011. 8,653
1012. 8,855
4 straight year of decreased in total firearms. There is a drop is almost 1,000 from 2008. To 2012. There is a significant drop in 3 other areas as well
If The NRA is such a problem why is there such a significant drop in total firearm crime. From 2008-2012? You can cite whatever study you want but these are facts.
20
You should compare the US stats against those from other countries.
3
Crime is going down because the economy is getting better. These things like the crime rate don't happen in a vacuum.
FBI — Crime Statistics for 2013 Released
http://www.fbi.gov/news/stories/2014/november/crime-statistics-for-2013-...
Nov 10, 2014 ... They include the violent crimes of murder, rape, robbery, and aggravated assault,
... Firearms were used in 69 percent of the nation's murders, ...
Published on: 2014/11/10, Last Modified on: 2014/11/13
http://www.fbi.gov/news/stories/2014/november/crime-statistics-for-2013-...
Nov 10, 2014 ... They include the violent crimes of murder, rape, robbery, and aggravated assault,
... Firearms were used in 69 percent of the nation's murders, ...
Published on: 2014/11/10, Last Modified on: 2014/11/13
The NRA is an agent of gun manufacturers. This is big money-making capitalism; and as we know Republicans want no regulation of money-making. The NRA's role is to sell guns.
The NRA plays upon the fear of people and America has become paranoid. The more paranoid people become, the more guns are sold.
In the paranoid minds of Americans, America will only be a safe country when every paranoid person walks the streets with concealed or open carry weapons.
Our future is frightening: paranoid people, suspicious of everyone they meet, who should be under a psychiatrist's care, but instead walking the streets; all carrying loaded weapons, ready to empty their high capacity magazines if you bump into them.
The NRA plays upon the fear of people and America has become paranoid. The more paranoid people become, the more guns are sold.
In the paranoid minds of Americans, America will only be a safe country when every paranoid person walks the streets with concealed or open carry weapons.
Our future is frightening: paranoid people, suspicious of everyone they meet, who should be under a psychiatrist's care, but instead walking the streets; all carrying loaded weapons, ready to empty their high capacity magazines if you bump into them.
103
this is exactly, right. The gun lobby is a microcosm of the military industrial complex phenomenon. It's largely to do with economics, but another part is endless paranoia about loss of "freedom".
Nonsense. You sound like the very people you claim are our unfortunate future. Most people are reasonable. The very few who make the most noise make a big "impression" as they convince the very firghtened like CBlow that the entire US is turning against him and his people,(whoever they are). There is far more heat and smoke than light generatedby this tiny little fire . But this is a wonderful issue as most Times readers never see or worry about gun violence. One can yell and scream that the end of civilization is upon us, regardless of a supply of facts one way or another. It is one of our issues where reality need not impinge. All that matters are how a person "feels" about the issue.
America will change when we learn to love our children more than our guns.
179
I've been a recreational shooter since I was around 9. I own multiple firearms, some were my Grandfather's, others from my Father and I bought a few. I haven't purchased on since about 1970 - haven't needed to. I grew up in the metro area and I live upstate in a very rural area. My biggest worries are the deer eating every ornamental I've got and a sow black bear and her cubs who live nearby. Night time, especially on a clear night, is amazing; I can look up and see the arc of the Milky Way overhead. After over 30 years here that's always a moment I take - even when it's 20 below.
I've also seen urban crime when I lived on the edge of Roxbury in the 70's and that world has changed - for the better. Crime stats show how much it has dropped. I am not fearful and I keep my firearms locked up except when I'm out somewhere breaking clays. I spent a year in Vietnam and will NEVER own an AR-15/M-16 type rifle ever. Ihope that rational gun legislation will happen someday. The notions of "preppers" and the paranoid are truly toxic to this country. In my teens there were gun stores all over Westchester, what you didn't see were military/combat looking rifles. This is the power of advertising, the power of the Internet to stoke fears and News outlets like Fox and right-wing radio that play on fear and fear alone. I fully expect the pendulum to swing the other way in the next ten years or so and when it does I suspect that my days of shooting clays will be over; thanks NRA.
I've also seen urban crime when I lived on the edge of Roxbury in the 70's and that world has changed - for the better. Crime stats show how much it has dropped. I am not fearful and I keep my firearms locked up except when I'm out somewhere breaking clays. I spent a year in Vietnam and will NEVER own an AR-15/M-16 type rifle ever. Ihope that rational gun legislation will happen someday. The notions of "preppers" and the paranoid are truly toxic to this country. In my teens there were gun stores all over Westchester, what you didn't see were military/combat looking rifles. This is the power of advertising, the power of the Internet to stoke fears and News outlets like Fox and right-wing radio that play on fear and fear alone. I fully expect the pendulum to swing the other way in the next ten years or so and when it does I suspect that my days of shooting clays will be over; thanks NRA.
240
Thank you for your comment!
> I fully expect the pendulum to swing the other way in
> the next ten years or so and when it does I suspect that
> my days of shooting clays will be over; thanks NRA.
I'm one of those people the NRA (and many other group) are warning you about. That is, I would support laws that would require the mandatory training and licensing of all gun owners. I would also support cradle-to-grave registration of all handguns, and the need for gun owners to carry liability insurance that charges fees commensurate with the gun owner's gun usage, accident history, and storage practices.
But I absolutely have no interest whatsoever in coming after your skeet shooting shotguns. I also don't want anyone's target-shooting guns taken away. I don't even have any interest in eliminating true hunting weapons with low magazine capacities.
What I *DO* want to eliminate is the situation where the police must enter every conflict assuming that the person they're facing is going to draw and shoot. Or the situation where every diaper bag must now be assumed to contain a loaded lethal weapon. We could also eliminate the black market in illegal guns, all of which started life somewhere as a legal gun.
We can do far, far better than we're doing without infringing one iota on your ability to "shoot clays".
I'm not your enemy (and I'm pretty sure you already knew that, but I just wanted you to be sure).
> I fully expect the pendulum to swing the other way in
> the next ten years or so and when it does I suspect that
> my days of shooting clays will be over; thanks NRA.
I'm one of those people the NRA (and many other group) are warning you about. That is, I would support laws that would require the mandatory training and licensing of all gun owners. I would also support cradle-to-grave registration of all handguns, and the need for gun owners to carry liability insurance that charges fees commensurate with the gun owner's gun usage, accident history, and storage practices.
But I absolutely have no interest whatsoever in coming after your skeet shooting shotguns. I also don't want anyone's target-shooting guns taken away. I don't even have any interest in eliminating true hunting weapons with low magazine capacities.
What I *DO* want to eliminate is the situation where the police must enter every conflict assuming that the person they're facing is going to draw and shoot. Or the situation where every diaper bag must now be assumed to contain a loaded lethal weapon. We could also eliminate the black market in illegal guns, all of which started life somewhere as a legal gun.
We can do far, far better than we're doing without infringing one iota on your ability to "shoot clays".
I'm not your enemy (and I'm pretty sure you already knew that, but I just wanted you to be sure).
Thank you for your comment! (This reply inadvertently posted earlier as a free-standing comment.)
> I fully expect the pendulum to swing the other way in
> the next ten years or so and when it does I suspect that
> my days of shooting clays will be over; thanks NRA.
I'm one of those people the NRA (and many other group) are warning you about. That is, I would support laws that would require the mandatory training and licensing of all gun owners. I would also support cradle-to-grave registration of all handguns, and the need for gun owners to carry liability insurance that charges fees commensurate with the gun owner's gun usage, accident history, and storage practices.
But I absolutely have no interest whatsoever in coming after your skeet shooting shotguns. I also don't want anyone's target-shooting guns taken away. I don't even have any interest in eliminating true hunting weapons with low magazine capacities.
What I *DO* want to eliminate is the situation where the police must enter every conflict assuming that the person they're facing is going to draw and shoot. Or the situation where every diaper bag must now be assumed to contain a loaded lethal weapon. We could also eliminate the black market in illegal guns, all of which started life somewhere as a legal gun.
We can do far, far better than we're doing without infringing one iota on your ability to "shoot clays".
I'm not your enemy (and I'm pretty sure you already knew that, but I just wanted you to be sure).
> I fully expect the pendulum to swing the other way in
> the next ten years or so and when it does I suspect that
> my days of shooting clays will be over; thanks NRA.
I'm one of those people the NRA (and many other group) are warning you about. That is, I would support laws that would require the mandatory training and licensing of all gun owners. I would also support cradle-to-grave registration of all handguns, and the need for gun owners to carry liability insurance that charges fees commensurate with the gun owner's gun usage, accident history, and storage practices.
But I absolutely have no interest whatsoever in coming after your skeet shooting shotguns. I also don't want anyone's target-shooting guns taken away. I don't even have any interest in eliminating true hunting weapons with low magazine capacities.
What I *DO* want to eliminate is the situation where the police must enter every conflict assuming that the person they're facing is going to draw and shoot. Or the situation where every diaper bag must now be assumed to contain a loaded lethal weapon. We could also eliminate the black market in illegal guns, all of which started life somewhere as a legal gun.
We can do far, far better than we're doing without infringing one iota on your ability to "shoot clays".
I'm not your enemy (and I'm pretty sure you already knew that, but I just wanted you to be sure).
50
@JustWondering: Excellent comment. Thank you for your military service and your candor here. I submit it's people like yourself, veterans and gun owners who favor gun control but not prohibition, who ought to be heard above the din. Signed, a fellow upstater, with the bears under the Milky Way.
As always Mr. Blow makes cogent, strong arguments. Still, I have to wonder if the ancestors of the American slave would ever have been captured had they been armed.
7
Since no one ever gets captured with firearms you must be right.
1
Chances are much better than even that the poor souls you mention were already the property of another group of Africans, who sold them to European slavers. No justification whatsoever intended for the still-existing practice of slavery, just pointing out that history shows slave markets to have existed in Africa prior to the arrival of while European slave traders - who then did business with local human traffickers.
They were armed. As with the native American they had many weapons, some very effective. Europe brought not just guns (which weren't always better) but better defenses and lots of debilitating disease to weaken the local population.
Our sick gun culture isn’t going to change anytime soon. Even, as Mr. Blow points out, expanded background checks, the ban on some semiautomatic weapons aren’t going anywhere. We’re a shoot’em up bang, bang culture, and the gun is the only thing that can cure everything society. The gun culture has been pushed down our throats ever since WW2. We see them in every Western, cop show, mystery on TV and the movies and now a huge push by the NRA and elected officials. Lately people have been confusing the purpose of the 2nd Amendment, back when our government set up militias to protect our shores from invading Tyrannical Governments.., back then it was England, France and Portugal we feared. But now so many people are arming themselves because they now claim the US Government is Tyrannical. Forgetting altogether, we have the voting power to change government if we so wish.
I’m a disabled vet, wounded four times in combat, and quite frankly, I’m very afraid of our own terror groups and like individuals arming themselves with impunity. Look at the gross legislation in states allowing open carry for all. We are sick and getting more primitive. We look with shame at the warring countries in the Middle East and Africa, but quite frankly we aren't doing a very good job of looking at our own gun issues. We are on the verge of killing ourselves off.
I’m a disabled vet, wounded four times in combat, and quite frankly, I’m very afraid of our own terror groups and like individuals arming themselves with impunity. Look at the gross legislation in states allowing open carry for all. We are sick and getting more primitive. We look with shame at the warring countries in the Middle East and Africa, but quite frankly we aren't doing a very good job of looking at our own gun issues. We are on the verge of killing ourselves off.
159
Winning, at all costs.
This should be no clearer than the case of Shaneen Allen. Ms. Allen fell afoul of NJ's strict gun laws but her treatment was less about the laws themselves and more about the behavior of overzealous police and vindictive prosecutors.
(http://tinyurl.com/lp6z3y4)
What should make people notice Ms. Allen's situation ... this Black single mother from Philadelphia secured the support AND advocacy of the NRA, so much so she was able to win a pardon from Gov. Christie.
When was the last time the conservative NRA types rallied around the cause of a Black single mother? They have no outrage over people of color, working class people, urban people struggling to survive, find good, stable employment (Ms. Allen juggles three jobs). They aren't passionately advocating, say, to have draconian drug laws abandoned.
But put a gun in this woman's hands and now we have the NRA and the entire conservative media coming to her defense.
Rather clarifies which of the Bill of Rights this group actually values.
This should be no clearer than the case of Shaneen Allen. Ms. Allen fell afoul of NJ's strict gun laws but her treatment was less about the laws themselves and more about the behavior of overzealous police and vindictive prosecutors.
(http://tinyurl.com/lp6z3y4)
What should make people notice Ms. Allen's situation ... this Black single mother from Philadelphia secured the support AND advocacy of the NRA, so much so she was able to win a pardon from Gov. Christie.
When was the last time the conservative NRA types rallied around the cause of a Black single mother? They have no outrage over people of color, working class people, urban people struggling to survive, find good, stable employment (Ms. Allen juggles three jobs). They aren't passionately advocating, say, to have draconian drug laws abandoned.
But put a gun in this woman's hands and now we have the NRA and the entire conservative media coming to her defense.
Rather clarifies which of the Bill of Rights this group actually values.
15
They're a *gun owner rights* advocacy group. Why would they be getting involved in gender or color issues?
People without a lot of control or power in their lives (or even those who don't think they have a lot of power and control in their lives) seek to establish a sense of control or power. What better way than to buy guns. It's a similar mentality to ISIS except ISIS does more than just buy the guns. Look at what happened out west where the US government tried to remove a rancher from government property. Lawlessness.
So to answer your question, the NRA has won.
So to answer your question, the NRA has won.
32
Perceptions are important here, and this column offers a good summary.
But reality checks are even more important:
1. 63% of the US population thinking "having a gun in the house makes it safer" in 2014, versus only 35% in 2000, certainly sounds dramatic. But another Pew report http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2014/07/15/the-demographics-and-pol... indicates that only 34% of households actually owned guns in 2014. Indeed, the only demographic subgroup showing a majority being gun owners was "rural" (51%) where, of course, guns for hunting are most common.
2. The NRA membership statistics are apparently quite unreliable, but even by the most exaggerated claims, the group's size has never grown beyond 2% of the general population. http://www.motherjones.com/mojo/2013/01/nra-membership-numbers
2. Though more important to Republicans, remaining subservient to gun manufacturers has long been a bipartisan stance. In 2009 the Democrats had control of the Senate, House and Presidency. In addition to failing to enact tough economic and financial reforms after the 2008 mortgage fiasco, to reverse the irresponsible Bush tax cuts, and to repeal the foolish Iraq war blank check, Democrats in Washington that year failed to even attempt any meaningful gun control legislation.
But reality checks are even more important:
1. 63% of the US population thinking "having a gun in the house makes it safer" in 2014, versus only 35% in 2000, certainly sounds dramatic. But another Pew report http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2014/07/15/the-demographics-and-pol... indicates that only 34% of households actually owned guns in 2014. Indeed, the only demographic subgroup showing a majority being gun owners was "rural" (51%) where, of course, guns for hunting are most common.
2. The NRA membership statistics are apparently quite unreliable, but even by the most exaggerated claims, the group's size has never grown beyond 2% of the general population. http://www.motherjones.com/mojo/2013/01/nra-membership-numbers
2. Though more important to Republicans, remaining subservient to gun manufacturers has long been a bipartisan stance. In 2009 the Democrats had control of the Senate, House and Presidency. In addition to failing to enact tough economic and financial reforms after the 2008 mortgage fiasco, to reverse the irresponsible Bush tax cuts, and to repeal the foolish Iraq war blank check, Democrats in Washington that year failed to even attempt any meaningful gun control legislation.
17
I was with you until your second number 2. The gun lobby is not a bipartisan issue-- it is predominantly GOP. And in 2009, the Dems had many hugely important issues to deal with, which they did. Gun control was not a top priority, somewhat understandably.
"The NRA membership statistics are apparently quite unreliable."
No doubt.
Most gun owners don't belong to the NRA, including ""rural"" gun owners.
And here's a reality check: they FAVOR gun control of some sort though obviously disagree with what sort of control there should be. They disagree amongst themselves as well as with people who would severely restrict or even ban gun ownership altogether. For example, hass the Safe Act served to reduce crime in New York or is it just window dressing for Gov. Cuomo's presidential ambition?
The question is, what do we mean by gun control? Is any law restricting gun ownership good--even one that doesn't reduce accidents, suicides and violent crime?
No doubt.
Most gun owners don't belong to the NRA, including ""rural"" gun owners.
And here's a reality check: they FAVOR gun control of some sort though obviously disagree with what sort of control there should be. They disagree amongst themselves as well as with people who would severely restrict or even ban gun ownership altogether. For example, hass the Safe Act served to reduce crime in New York or is it just window dressing for Gov. Cuomo's presidential ambition?
The question is, what do we mean by gun control? Is any law restricting gun ownership good--even one that doesn't reduce accidents, suicides and violent crime?
This horse has left the barn, never to return. Not only has the N.R.A. won "this round," Mr. Blow, it has destroyed the field, perhaps for all time. The N. R. A. doesn't just sell weapons of death and the ammunition required for their efficient operation, its greatest selling point is fear. Fear is what motivates those purchasing a weapon for "home protection." This discussion is not concerned with hunters or hunting, competition, or mere recreation, like target practice, conducted by responsible organizations observing rigorously strict standards of safety. As has been written and discussed in a thousand ways, the sloppiness of the wording in the Second Amendment created an endless roll of death. When Senator Barack Obama, seven years ago, truthfully remarked that the fearful "find consolation in their guns and their religion," all he did was to honestly expose the raw emotions which will forever dominate this long defeat: fear driven by hate, and blessed on Sunday. Congress's original intent was to summon gun-owning landowners, homesteaders and all able-bodied persons to defend the colors, nothing more. Over the centuries, it appears that the "right to bear and maintain arms" is nothing more than a preamble allowing unregulated, unfettered, irresponsible gun proliferation, blessed by a Congress divided on every issue but this one. They won and we lost.
114
The argument over the Second Amendment has become an argument about the hardware, not the people. To many people the hardware can be frightening but the founders all understood that the problem is the person, not the weapon. Hence the opening phrase: "A well-regulated militia being necessary for the defense of a free state,..."
While our government at all levels regulates those who bear arms as a part of their job, the regulation of the citizen militia is all but non-existent. The officials have to be screened, trained, qualified and periodically re-qualified on each-and-every weapon they are authorized to bear for official use.
Instead of focusing on the hardware, let us focus on the real problem - weeding out the percentage of the population that wants to "keep and bear arms" that would never make it past the initial screening process to officially bear arms (and we have ample evidence of more than one who failed the screening being involved in a gun related crime).
The founders recognized that the people factor was most important, yet we seem focused on the weapon itself. We have it backwards. Governments it is your responsibility to make sure that those who keep and bear arms are well regulated so do your job and regulate the people.
While our government at all levels regulates those who bear arms as a part of their job, the regulation of the citizen militia is all but non-existent. The officials have to be screened, trained, qualified and periodically re-qualified on each-and-every weapon they are authorized to bear for official use.
Instead of focusing on the hardware, let us focus on the real problem - weeding out the percentage of the population that wants to "keep and bear arms" that would never make it past the initial screening process to officially bear arms (and we have ample evidence of more than one who failed the screening being involved in a gun related crime).
The founders recognized that the people factor was most important, yet we seem focused on the weapon itself. We have it backwards. Governments it is your responsibility to make sure that those who keep and bear arms are well regulated so do your job and regulate the people.
8
For all the talk about NRA wanting everyone to own a gun and take it EVERYWHERE including schools, bars, and churches... I found it interesting that the NRA required the firing pin to be removed from guns at their gun show/convention in Tennessee last week.
274
Firing pins were removed on guns out for display by manufacturers. Anyone lawfully carrying a sidearm was permitted to enter with it. Sorry no blood in the streets.
4
Yep. But, the original poster can be forgiven...this was a major bit of disinformation "reported" by the NYT editors. Oops!
4
Mr. Fieselman was hardly wrong in his statement. And perhaps you should ponder why the NRA had those pins removed... hmm?
4
The 'freedom' to be constantly scared to death and to be utterly paranoid of being murdered, mugged or looked at wrong by your fellow American is what makes America truly exceptional.
American exceptionalism is the psychotic belief that your government and your neighbor are probably trying to kill you, so best tuck two guns under your pillow and get a good night's rest.
I weep for my country, which is little more than a shooting gallery for angry men who problem-solve with guns, bullets and paranoia.
The 82 Americans that die by gun shot every day in America have a friend in the NRA.
They didn't die in vain; they died as monuments to gun capitalism and merchants of death who market fear and paranoia for a living.
Like their sister organization - the Republican Party - the NRA markets fear, insecurity and violence - the lowest and most base instincts of human beings - and is immensely profitable because of it.
So what if it kills Americans --- a dollar is a stupid dollar.
The NRA has not only won; it has made America a fearful, paranoid and violent shooting gallery ---- a significant contribution to the decline of a once great nation.
American exceptionalism is the psychotic belief that your government and your neighbor are probably trying to kill you, so best tuck two guns under your pillow and get a good night's rest.
I weep for my country, which is little more than a shooting gallery for angry men who problem-solve with guns, bullets and paranoia.
The 82 Americans that die by gun shot every day in America have a friend in the NRA.
They didn't die in vain; they died as monuments to gun capitalism and merchants of death who market fear and paranoia for a living.
Like their sister organization - the Republican Party - the NRA markets fear, insecurity and violence - the lowest and most base instincts of human beings - and is immensely profitable because of it.
So what if it kills Americans --- a dollar is a stupid dollar.
The NRA has not only won; it has made America a fearful, paranoid and violent shooting gallery ---- a significant contribution to the decline of a once great nation.
856
Well said.
19
Very well stated, also our nation, unfortunately on several recent occasions have reacted to international challenges in the same manner.
7
Since you write like you have so many facts, please let me know how many of the guns used in shootings were used by the owners of the legal guns versus crimes used by illegal gun owners and guns. Not sure the Times will print this because it goes against their opinion or does it? I will not take either side, but just wish to know the true facts and not facts taken to support a one sided argument.
2
30,000 gun deaths a year. More than a million Americans have been killed by guns since JFK died. The statistics speak for themselves.
40
History in be South would've been much different had whites in power, invariably Democrats in the KKK , not taken guns out of the hands of law-abiding black people.
It's easier to lynch people when you are unarmed and your racist murderers are.
Stats show that if law-abiding Americans are allowed to arm themselves and enjoy their 2nd Amendments rights, crime is reduced. This is why crime flourishes in big city America: strict gun laws allows criminals to flourish.
It's easier to lynch people when you are unarmed and your racist murderers are.
Stats show that if law-abiding Americans are allowed to arm themselves and enjoy their 2nd Amendments rights, crime is reduced. This is why crime flourishes in big city America: strict gun laws allows criminals to flourish.
17
The big cities have stricter gun laws precisely because of the amount of guns. However, these guns don't come from the "big cities" which require permits and registration. They come from states like Georgia and much of the south where they buy in bulk and then bring them to the big cities to sell illegally. They know exactly what a person buying guns in bulk are doing with them. Because there is virtually no trail, they don't care. That's why big cities passed stricter gun laws. They are trying to responsibly control what little they can. I wonder if you were walked up upon in a parking lot and shot in the back and killed if it might be helpful to your family to have law enforcement be able to track who did it through the weapon?
5
What a bunch of nonsense.
Lynching happened because large mobs with the support of local law enforcement, killed what they feared.
And news flash, crime does not flourish when guns are restricted, look at Japan or England.
American police shoot more people in one day, then the Japanese police shot in the entire year. Gun crime is an American phenomenon.
Lynching happened because large mobs with the support of local law enforcement, killed what they feared.
And news flash, crime does not flourish when guns are restricted, look at Japan or England.
American police shoot more people in one day, then the Japanese police shot in the entire year. Gun crime is an American phenomenon.
5
What a preposterous concept. Crime is more prevalent in metropolitan areas as a result of high concentrations of people.
Gun control advocates are losing and it has nothing to do with facts.
Gun rights advocates are tapping into powerful emotions. Fear, hate, the feeling of injustice, and the feeling of being the self-reliant heroic figure.
People fear and hate violent criminals. They feel criminals always have the upper hand and it feels unjust. They think they can be the self-reliant hero who successfully defends themselves while removing a monster from society.
The NRA is going to keep winning unless we lock up violent criminals permanently for a first offense, reduce recidivism for violent crime to less than about 5%, or innocent people start getting shot on a regular basis by armed fools. If armed citizens start mowing down violent criminals, gun rights advocates will consolidate their wins and gain more ground.
Lots of people hate criminals and feel that permanently removing them from society, by whatever means, could only help. That's why they want guns and will continue to want them regardless of the statistical facts on crime. Simple.
Gun rights advocates are tapping into powerful emotions. Fear, hate, the feeling of injustice, and the feeling of being the self-reliant heroic figure.
People fear and hate violent criminals. They feel criminals always have the upper hand and it feels unjust. They think they can be the self-reliant hero who successfully defends themselves while removing a monster from society.
The NRA is going to keep winning unless we lock up violent criminals permanently for a first offense, reduce recidivism for violent crime to less than about 5%, or innocent people start getting shot on a regular basis by armed fools. If armed citizens start mowing down violent criminals, gun rights advocates will consolidate their wins and gain more ground.
Lots of people hate criminals and feel that permanently removing them from society, by whatever means, could only help. That's why they want guns and will continue to want them regardless of the statistical facts on crime. Simple.
1
So, all that gun ownership does for you is to provide the opportunity to be Judge, Jury and Executioner? That's what you're saying when you talk about "permanently removing them". That's truly a sad commentary.
1
When are the media going to start exposing the NRA for what it is: not a grass-roots, gun-owner's association, but an organization funded primarily by arms manufacturers and dealers who get rich by stoking paranoia? Their website tells us that we live just this side of tyranny, and it is our patriotic duty to own guns in case armed insurrection becomes necessary.
15
Not in our lifetime.
2
The NRA did not win!
The spirit of the American pioneer won.
The spirit of the American pioneer won.
12
Exactly. Charles cannot make a coherent argument against gun ownership without a boogey man. This op-ed is exactly why people fight for their Second Amendment rights.
2
Or, more precisely, the John Wayne western.
The spirit of the fable of the American pioneer won.
Do not undeestimate the effect of the law the prevents the research into gun violence. Sometimes the facts matter, but the NRA and its cronies on Capital Hill have censored the finding of facts.
17
Do not undeestimate the effect of the law the prevents the research into gun violence
=================
Then how did the CDC issue a research study on gun violence in 2013?
http://www.slate.com/articles/health_and_science/human_nature/2013/06/ha...
=================
Then how did the CDC issue a research study on gun violence in 2013?
http://www.slate.com/articles/health_and_science/human_nature/2013/06/ha...
The leadership of the N.R.A. and its craven Congressional lackeys are willing to let thousands of innocent people die so that they can continue to be funded. I have no doubt they will win the "war" for America since gun manufacturers are businesses following the golden rule-- those with the gold make the rules.
19
I don't think gun laws affect crime much. Crimes are committed by those who don't obey the laws, so if they want a gun they'll get it. As for the rest of us, we seldom shoot people.
12
What a comfort to the Sandy Hook, Columbine, Aurora, etc. families.
Look at the example of Australia. No multiple murders since reasonable control measures adopted in the 1990s. None. (One per year before that.)
GOP wants me to be afraid of ISIS? Living in the US, I'm FAR more likely to be killed by a neighbor for no discernible reason.
Look at the example of Australia. No multiple murders since reasonable control measures adopted in the 1990s. None. (One per year before that.)
GOP wants me to be afraid of ISIS? Living in the US, I'm FAR more likely to be killed by a neighbor for no discernible reason.
9
You've heard of domestic violence, haven't you? And how much of a role guns play in domestic murder — multiple homicide/suicides? And accidental shootings among children? And suicide itself?
We do indeed use our guns most on our loved ones, those whom we know (or they use them on us), and on ourselves.
We do indeed use our guns most on our loved ones, those whom we know (or they use them on us), and on ourselves.
If the United States of America fails or is transformed into something dramatically different, it will be due to the increasing, broad spectrum stupidity and fact denial of its voters and potential voters (and those who manipulate that stupidity for their own selfish ends). Unbelievable that we're in an apparent evolutionary societal dead end!
9
I would add that conservatives are winning overall. They control most of the state legislatures and drive the debate from reproductive rights to federal land ownership to protection of the environment to foreign policy. Progressives have no political party to represent their interests.
15
Or course the NRA is winning. They do it in two ways. First, they threaten, coerce and fund (aka bribe) government officials into passing foolish legislation at the state level through ALEC and other lobbying organizations. And they have mounted a very effective national public relations program to scare Americans into gun ownership and membership in their organization. And this combination of corruption and fear will continue to grow their influence.
12
Thanks to to the NRA and its ilk, the right to bear arms shall remain uninfringed for the unhinged. But at least they can help pay for the resulting mayhem.
Let's honor the "well-regulated" clause of the Second Amendment and require all gun owners to carry liability insurance. I don't see how any responsible gun owner, who doesn't keep a loaded gun in the house and who doesn't take guns where they don't belong could have a problem with that.
Let's honor the "well-regulated" clause of the Second Amendment and require all gun owners to carry liability insurance. I don't see how any responsible gun owner, who doesn't keep a loaded gun in the house and who doesn't take guns where they don't belong could have a problem with that.
22
The NRA offers such liability insurance now, relatively inexpensively. Are you saying that all gun owners should be required to pay the NRA to insure them? Gosh, NRA membership would skyrocket factorially if that sort of law were imposed (as it is, by the way, in Germany, I paid about $200 per year for it for the three years I lived there). Another unintended consequence of unnecessary and ineffective harassment of gun owners.
1
Here in Canada we have limits on freedom of speech which might explain why we can watch CNN, MSNBC, our own news networks any number of foreign news networks but we can't watch FOX news. We Canadians believe in free speech but we draw the line on speech designed to inspire hatred and distort reality.
The NRA and its friends FOX and the GOP have used American beliefs in unlimited freedom of expression and the "right" to bear arms to shred asunder the social contract that binds its people to their legitimately elected government which according to the contract is a government of the people, by the people and for the people.
The hate and venom spewed forth every second by America's plutocrat controlled right wing media undermines all the values that have evolved through the centuries that have made the USA the greatest nation on Earth.
Citizens United should have been the wake up call that freedom of speech and freedom to menace society with the threat of deadly force cannot be absolute when some speak with the energy of megawatt broadcast towers while most of us cannot be heard above a whisper.
What is it that prevents Americans from understanding that a medium like FOX news is banned in a conservative, moderate freedom loving country like Canada it is because spewing hatred and lies over the public airwaves is just not in the public interest and it threatens both our freedom and security.
The NRA and its friends FOX and the GOP have used American beliefs in unlimited freedom of expression and the "right" to bear arms to shred asunder the social contract that binds its people to their legitimately elected government which according to the contract is a government of the people, by the people and for the people.
The hate and venom spewed forth every second by America's plutocrat controlled right wing media undermines all the values that have evolved through the centuries that have made the USA the greatest nation on Earth.
Citizens United should have been the wake up call that freedom of speech and freedom to menace society with the threat of deadly force cannot be absolute when some speak with the energy of megawatt broadcast towers while most of us cannot be heard above a whisper.
What is it that prevents Americans from understanding that a medium like FOX news is banned in a conservative, moderate freedom loving country like Canada it is because spewing hatred and lies over the public airwaves is just not in the public interest and it threatens both our freedom and security.
545
And how anyone with a modicum of intelligence can watch or listen to that hysterical nonsense is beyond me.
2
This is rediculous! Sooo - does Canada ban denials (all lies) by Hillary Clinton too? Oh - and Michael Brown - guilty thug or just a poor slob murdered by the evil police as Sharpton insists? What does Canada say?
Much rather have our free speach than be censored by the agents of the government thought police. Sometimes the truth is just plain nasty.
Much rather have our free speach than be censored by the agents of the government thought police. Sometimes the truth is just plain nasty.
4
The fact that you brag about not being able to watch Fox News is truly pathetic.
6
Republicans have a simple narrative be it "cut taxes" or "they want to take your guns," and since people are essentially selfish, these messages resonate especially with a motivated minority. But people have always been selfish, so that can't be the problem. The problem is leadership or the lack thereof. Dems need to abandon nuance and "Us vs Them" and reframe this issue as a public health crisis (which to give just one example) is bleeding billions of dollars. The average person should be asking, "Why am I paying for this gun owner's or gun victim 's medical bill? Why isn't Congress doing something about this?"
18
Yes, the NRA won. Too many members of Congress are terrified of the NRA and make sure their utterances don't offend or annoy the organization.
9
Things look different in the country than they do in the city. I've lived in New York City most of my life and never thought it would make me or anyone else safer to own a gun. One summer, I lived in a house in a rural area of New Jersey. They house was a few acres from one neighbor, and surrounded by woodland on 3 sides. It felt fine during the day, but at night, alone in the house, I began to worry that someone would break in. It would be easy, a lot easier than breaking into an apartment. In short, I would have been a lot happier with a gun, and, of course, being trained to use one. I still thing that only law enforcement officers should be allowed to carry guns in public space. But I think that people who live in single family houses, as opposed to apartment buildings should be able to keep guns to defend themselves against intruders.
3
It is the fears of people like Ms. Wolf on which gun manufacturers and uber-right wing politicians prey. The politicians amplify these fears through political speech using gun-manufacturer's misinformation about guns-in-the-home creating a sense of safety, when the only things created by such advertisements are false senses of security and bravado.
It was a pretentious and swaggering display of courage coupled with inordinate fear (fear like discussed by Ms. Wolf) that was on display when President George W. Bush strutted onto the horrible scene of the nine-eleven destruction and then used that horrible event to justify the unnecessary invasion of Iraq.
The advertisements and perpetual infomercials that amplify a person's fears -- some purported to be news reports and many supported by the gun manufacturers via the aegis of the NRA and the GOP -- are what should be of true concern to Americans. As to our fears, Americans should remember what President Franklin D. Roosevelt said about fear -- FDR warned us that fear is the only thing to fear. Boy was he right!
It was a pretentious and swaggering display of courage coupled with inordinate fear (fear like discussed by Ms. Wolf) that was on display when President George W. Bush strutted onto the horrible scene of the nine-eleven destruction and then used that horrible event to justify the unnecessary invasion of Iraq.
The advertisements and perpetual infomercials that amplify a person's fears -- some purported to be news reports and many supported by the gun manufacturers via the aegis of the NRA and the GOP -- are what should be of true concern to Americans. As to our fears, Americans should remember what President Franklin D. Roosevelt said about fear -- FDR warned us that fear is the only thing to fear. Boy was he right!
7
The NRA has "won", Mr. Blow and it has won because of the false propaganda proffered by the NRA that Obama "wants to take your guns."
That lie, believed by the uninformed, accounts, more than the threat of crime, for both the rush to buy guns and the push to weaken restrctions on gun ownership.
That lie, believed by the uninformed, accounts, more than the threat of crime, for both the rush to buy guns and the push to weaken restrctions on gun ownership.
18
It is the gun manufacturers who've won. Their lobbyists, including the NRA leadership, have spent decades infusing paranoia into their membership, and the results couldn't be better from the standpoint of a company that makes money selling weaponry.
When an Arizona congresswoman gets shot in the head in front of news reporters, or when children inside a school are systematically mowed down by an insane person possessing automatic weapons - such incidents need not be of any concern to the gun lobby, because as Mr. Blow notes, sales will continue apace. Meanwhile, new heights of paranoia act as a tool to open new markets.
Here in Texas, those posing as for our state leaders are about to enact laws that will allow people to wear guns in holsters, pretty much wherever they go - on the streets, into parks, stores or restaurants. And they are about to enact another law that will let people where those guns in college classrooms.
Ain't life grand?
When an Arizona congresswoman gets shot in the head in front of news reporters, or when children inside a school are systematically mowed down by an insane person possessing automatic weapons - such incidents need not be of any concern to the gun lobby, because as Mr. Blow notes, sales will continue apace. Meanwhile, new heights of paranoia act as a tool to open new markets.
Here in Texas, those posing as for our state leaders are about to enact laws that will allow people to wear guns in holsters, pretty much wherever they go - on the streets, into parks, stores or restaurants. And they are about to enact another law that will let people where those guns in college classrooms.
Ain't life grand?
43
I am reminded of a joke about how an airline passenger took a bomb on board his flight because the odds of two bombs was much much lower than one bomb being on a plane. Such is the impeccable logic that stands on its head when, after a mass shooting, people rush to buy more guns in the name of increased safety. More guns equals added safety! At this rate not make it compulsory for newborns to be issued a license to own guns.
With the ascendancy of the NRA and nonstop Faux News coverage we are living in an age when up is down and down is up, left is right and right is left. Logic has flown away. In its place we are fed a constant diet of fear. If only having guns would help many of the shootings on army bases ought to have had fewer deaths and quicker resolution. That, as we know, is not the case.
So, yes, sadly the NRA is winning as of now. I can only hope that in a generation or two down the road we will see logic and rational thinking returning. But until then we can only hope that we do not have too many more mass shootings.
With the ascendancy of the NRA and nonstop Faux News coverage we are living in an age when up is down and down is up, left is right and right is left. Logic has flown away. In its place we are fed a constant diet of fear. If only having guns would help many of the shootings on army bases ought to have had fewer deaths and quicker resolution. That, as we know, is not the case.
So, yes, sadly the NRA is winning as of now. I can only hope that in a generation or two down the road we will see logic and rational thinking returning. But until then we can only hope that we do not have too many more mass shootings.
33
The psycho-sexual lure of guns is not something that is susceptible to crime statistics, logic, or the original meaning of the 2nd Amendment. But maybe guns can be used to halt climate change? Yeah, that's it!
9
It's very simple: the NRA loves its guns more than it loves our children. Otherwise, Sandy Hook would have been a wake-up call that military-style weapons and 100-round magazines should not be sold to the public, whatever your interpretation of the Second Amendment.
60
Otherwise, Sandy Hook would have been a wake-up call that military-style weapons and 100-round magazines should not be sold to the public,
============
Jeez. The AR-15 isn't a military weapon and the Sandy Hook shooter didn't use a 100 round magazine.
============
Jeez. The AR-15 isn't a military weapon and the Sandy Hook shooter didn't use a 100 round magazine.
1
Has the N.R.A. Won?
Yes. Let's face it. America loves guns. And doesn't like the people who oppose guns.
Yes. Let's face it. America loves guns. And doesn't like the people who oppose guns.
24
All you need to know about the NRA and it's claim on macho, red blooded Americano patriotism is epitomized by Wayne La Pierre, Executive Director of the NRA.
Old Blood, Guts and Dead School Children sought and was granted an exemption from the Viet Nam draft.
For a anxiety disorder.
Apparently Lil Wayne was quite anxious about the possibility of being shot.
Old Blood, Guts and Dead School Children sought and was granted an exemption from the Viet Nam draft.
For a anxiety disorder.
Apparently Lil Wayne was quite anxious about the possibility of being shot.
633
That would explain his over-the-top hysteria act.
4
And, BTW, the NRA selectively banned firearms at their latest convention. Evidently, 'gun toting' Americans were just too much even for them.
3
Craig.....very interesting comment
4
As Rosenthal’s editorial points out, we have presidential candidates saying the 2nd amendment means we have the right of armed rebellion against our govt if perceived as too tyrannical. In their eyes, democracy and voting may not be enough.
They push the message that the modern federal govt as a tyrannical intrusion into our liberties and free enterprise. They keep absurdly expanding their definition of presidential imperial power to label everything Obama does.
These candidates are spreading the gop rw paranoia that the govt is a threat rather than a protector in a democracy. This delivers American citizens right into the hands of unregulated corporate power, with their own cooperation, while the gun industry scoops up profits, and directs lawmakers.
Typical tactics of fear, then divide and conquer to win elections, the main goal of those beholden to big money interests ruling US politics.
They push the message that the modern federal govt as a tyrannical intrusion into our liberties and free enterprise. They keep absurdly expanding their definition of presidential imperial power to label everything Obama does.
These candidates are spreading the gop rw paranoia that the govt is a threat rather than a protector in a democracy. This delivers American citizens right into the hands of unregulated corporate power, with their own cooperation, while the gun industry scoops up profits, and directs lawmakers.
Typical tactics of fear, then divide and conquer to win elections, the main goal of those beholden to big money interests ruling US politics.
120
As Rosenthal’s editorial points out, we have presidential candidates saying the 2nd amendment means we have the right of armed rebellion against our govt if perceived as too tyrannical. In their eyes, democracy and voting may not be enough.
==================
This isn't their argument. They are merely repeating what James Madison wrote in Federalist #46. You know, the same James Madison who wrote the Second Amendment. He wrote the Federalist #46 argument as a reason that the states should ratify the Constitution.
You really should read the whole thing
http://www.constitution.org/fed/federa46.htm
==================
This isn't their argument. They are merely repeating what James Madison wrote in Federalist #46. You know, the same James Madison who wrote the Second Amendment. He wrote the Federalist #46 argument as a reason that the states should ratify the Constitution.
You really should read the whole thing
http://www.constitution.org/fed/federa46.htm
1
Concerning why Americans think there is more crime, while there is actually less, I think it is obvious that Internet communications is the answer. There may have been far fewer house and vehicle break-ins in my neighborhood 20 years ago, but, thanks to the neighborhood email group list, I am aware not only of every break-in, but every vehicle that seems to be "casing" the neighborhood, when it probably is just searching for a legitimate destination.
8
Since the NRA is THE most grassroots organization in America, I certainly hope that they have won. The recent spotlights of government abuse against people of color should remind all of us the reason for the 2d Amendment in the first place. Never forget, gun ownership was not considered controversial in the USA (I walked to school carrying my my own rifle to my 7th grade rifle team class in 1974) until the Black Panthers made a show of demonstrating that the Right extended also to the Black population.
11
Do you really think the NRA is anything other than a lobby for gun manufacturers?
21
A Pyrrhic victory indeed
We're heading for nightmares with speed,
Distortions prevail,
Clear thinking assail,
On lies, misperceptions, we feed!
Those guns signify ticking bombs
And should engender many qualms
A movement is needed
One that should be heeded
A warning from pulpits that calms!
We're heading for nightmares with speed,
Distortions prevail,
Clear thinking assail,
On lies, misperceptions, we feed!
Those guns signify ticking bombs
And should engender many qualms
A movement is needed
One that should be heeded
A warning from pulpits that calms!
9
Wise words ... our society should realize that NRA stands for No Reasonable Answers ... and develop an effective counter message. It would need to be profound in order to overcome largely fact-free fear-mongering amplified through some parts of the media.
7
It is not the NRA that is winning but the American people. The Constitution gave us the means by which to protect ourselves and the people refuse to give up that right.
The Media are at fault for the public's perception that crime is rising because that's what they report. There are nearly 2 million incidents a year where a person has defended himself or someone else with a firearm and it is rarely reported while every every crime incident is. It also does not report with the exception of obvious shootings by felons, teenagers and the mentally ill that it is rare to see one where the owner has legitimately purchased a firearm applying for state background checks beforehand and the NICS reporting site run by the FBI.
Many people are under the impression that buying a legal firearm is an easy process. Except for a few exceptions nearly every state exercises strong control over who may purchase and carry concealed firearms. It's easy to understand why the public thinks we own Automatic firearms when most reporters and columnists don't know the difference between them and the Semiautomatics either. Automatics have been denied to the public since 1932.
The media needs to stop ginning up the hype and start reporting the news accurately.
The Media are at fault for the public's perception that crime is rising because that's what they report. There are nearly 2 million incidents a year where a person has defended himself or someone else with a firearm and it is rarely reported while every every crime incident is. It also does not report with the exception of obvious shootings by felons, teenagers and the mentally ill that it is rare to see one where the owner has legitimately purchased a firearm applying for state background checks beforehand and the NICS reporting site run by the FBI.
Many people are under the impression that buying a legal firearm is an easy process. Except for a few exceptions nearly every state exercises strong control over who may purchase and carry concealed firearms. It's easy to understand why the public thinks we own Automatic firearms when most reporters and columnists don't know the difference between them and the Semiautomatics either. Automatics have been denied to the public since 1932.
The media needs to stop ginning up the hype and start reporting the news accurately.
19
@Huguenot
First of all, the neoconservative interpretation of the Second Amendment is a perversion of it. The notion that our founders wanted us to live in anarchy, holding the very government they established hostage is lunacy.
From a piece on the actual meaning of the amendment:
"What changed was the NRA. In 1991, former Chief Justice Warren Berger said that the idea that the Second Amendment recognizes an individual right to gun ownership was "a fraud" on the public. That was the consensus, that was the conventional wisdom.
The NRA has been around for a long time. It used to be an organization that focused on hunters and on training. In 1977, at the NRA's annual meeting, activists pushed out the leadership and installed new leaders who were very intense, very dogmatic, and very focused on the Second Amendment as their cause. It was called the "Revolt at Cincinnati." From there, the NRA and its allies waged a 30-year legal campaign to change the way the courts and the country saw the Second Amendment. And they started with scholarship. They supported a lot of scholars and law professors. They elected politicians. They changed the positions of agencies of government. They got the Justice Department to reverse its position on what the amendment meant."
The Second Amendment Doesn't Say What You Think It Does
http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2014/06/second-amendment-guns-michae...
First of all, the neoconservative interpretation of the Second Amendment is a perversion of it. The notion that our founders wanted us to live in anarchy, holding the very government they established hostage is lunacy.
From a piece on the actual meaning of the amendment:
"What changed was the NRA. In 1991, former Chief Justice Warren Berger said that the idea that the Second Amendment recognizes an individual right to gun ownership was "a fraud" on the public. That was the consensus, that was the conventional wisdom.
The NRA has been around for a long time. It used to be an organization that focused on hunters and on training. In 1977, at the NRA's annual meeting, activists pushed out the leadership and installed new leaders who were very intense, very dogmatic, and very focused on the Second Amendment as their cause. It was called the "Revolt at Cincinnati." From there, the NRA and its allies waged a 30-year legal campaign to change the way the courts and the country saw the Second Amendment. And they started with scholarship. They supported a lot of scholars and law professors. They elected politicians. They changed the positions of agencies of government. They got the Justice Department to reverse its position on what the amendment meant."
The Second Amendment Doesn't Say What You Think It Does
http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2014/06/second-amendment-guns-michae...
73
George Washington himself state that the people should not only be well armed, but have sufficient ammunition to protect itself from anyone who might to exert control over the people including an oppressive government.
8
NYHugenot
You say there are 2 milliion instances a year of people using guns to protect themselves or others. That would be about 5479 such events each day.
How do you explain that such events are rarely reported, even tthough each one would be newworthy? For example, it is big news when a sorekeepper protects him- or herself from a robber by fihting bsck, ncuding using a gun. To hear you tell it, that is a daily event all over the US, but is ignored.
if nobody reports such events, how do you know that they actually happen? What little birdie is telling you but not the rest of us? Curious minds wuold like to see your proof.
You say there are 2 milliion instances a year of people using guns to protect themselves or others. That would be about 5479 such events each day.
How do you explain that such events are rarely reported, even tthough each one would be newworthy? For example, it is big news when a sorekeepper protects him- or herself from a robber by fihting bsck, ncuding using a gun. To hear you tell it, that is a daily event all over the US, but is ignored.
if nobody reports such events, how do you know that they actually happen? What little birdie is telling you but not the rest of us? Curious minds wuold like to see your proof.
49
This should be a no brainer yet despite the salient facts which Mr Blow has presented, Americans still bat for the contrary? How does anything get though to the american public without going through the lens of the media hype and the usual lobbying strategies of the NRA. This is really disturbing.
15
How does it get through? It doesn't. That's the problem. It's impossible to penetrate the fog of misinformation and hysteria.
Ebola anyone?
Ebola anyone?
4
You're right, Charles. The NRA isn't just winning. It was won handily and that victory will stand for as long as most Americans concede it to them. But that victory is only but one aspect of the plutocracy we have become. The NRA represents only one group of moneyed interests that is in control.
We are about to pick leaders for the next presidential election and, at least to me, it feels like a theatrical farce. As the actors come on stage, the winks at the audience. Everyone knows the plot and the outcome. Reality is just a formality.
I've been studying and writing about Martin Luther King and have been struck by his Three Evils of Society speech.
"But we have come. And we have come here because we share a common concern for the moral health of our nation. We have come because our eyes have seen through the superficial glory and glitter of our society and observed the coming of judgment. Like the prophet of old, we have read the handwriting on the wall. We have seen our nation weighed in the balance of history and found wanting. We have come because we see this as a dark hour in the affairs of men."
Unless America wakes up and changes the script that is unfolding, the farce will go on until victory is complete. I renew my call to readers to take a long hard look at the actors on the stage. Get involved, now! Stop this runaway train!
Wake up, America!
http://www.rimaregas.com/2015/04/mlks-message-to-blacklivesmatter-moralm...
We are about to pick leaders for the next presidential election and, at least to me, it feels like a theatrical farce. As the actors come on stage, the winks at the audience. Everyone knows the plot and the outcome. Reality is just a formality.
I've been studying and writing about Martin Luther King and have been struck by his Three Evils of Society speech.
"But we have come. And we have come here because we share a common concern for the moral health of our nation. We have come because our eyes have seen through the superficial glory and glitter of our society and observed the coming of judgment. Like the prophet of old, we have read the handwriting on the wall. We have seen our nation weighed in the balance of history and found wanting. We have come because we see this as a dark hour in the affairs of men."
Unless America wakes up and changes the script that is unfolding, the farce will go on until victory is complete. I renew my call to readers to take a long hard look at the actors on the stage. Get involved, now! Stop this runaway train!
Wake up, America!
http://www.rimaregas.com/2015/04/mlks-message-to-blacklivesmatter-moralm...
32
What's your plan to take guns out of criminals' hands, Rima? And no, I'm not talking about law abiding citizens. Criminals.
9
Walter,
Every police department run gun buy-back program's success has only been limited by the tiny amount of funding available. People do turn in guns when given the opportunity to do so. Make that a federal program that funds all police departments and municipalities that choose to opt in.
Jobs. Give young people jobs and job training. Youth unemployment is the highest it has ever been. Give people a way to make a living. Give them hope and a way out of poverty.
I've been sharing my pieces on Martin Luther King's Three Evils of Society speech because not only is it relevant to our lives today, but we are sliding backwards to a time that predates this 1963 speech.
http://www.rimaregas.com/2015/04/mlks-message-to-blacklivesmatter-moralm...
Every police department run gun buy-back program's success has only been limited by the tiny amount of funding available. People do turn in guns when given the opportunity to do so. Make that a federal program that funds all police departments and municipalities that choose to opt in.
Jobs. Give young people jobs and job training. Youth unemployment is the highest it has ever been. Give people a way to make a living. Give them hope and a way out of poverty.
I've been sharing my pieces on Martin Luther King's Three Evils of Society speech because not only is it relevant to our lives today, but we are sliding backwards to a time that predates this 1963 speech.
http://www.rimaregas.com/2015/04/mlks-message-to-blacklivesmatter-moralm...
6
Ah, the law abiding citizen. The righteous gun owner. The papers are filled every day with stories of such people who one day go berserk and out of rage or jealousy kill neighbors or family members or coworkers. Far more murders by these formerly law abiding citizens than gang members.
8
Unfortunately, our political system, shored by the Citizens United decision by has virtually made the NRA into a ruling policy maker in our government. With the backing of billions of dollars, a campaign of smoke and mirrors has equated the legal control of guns to an attack on the Second Amendment. (the right to bear arms was actually written to legalize militias to protect the government). Further, they firearms of today are capable of much more damage than muzzle loaders.
Statistics show that gun deaths (oh yeah, I know....it's not the gun, it's the person behind the gun) in the hands of private citizens accounting for more deaths than the lives that were lost in all of our wars.
Yes, the NRA is winning. It is up to us to find a way to decrease the lawless use of guns, the number of children that accidentally are killed, and the rise in mass shootings by people that are unstable. Let's put it this way....if you don't have a gun, it would be very hard to accomplish the bloody deaths that have become all too common, you might have to think a bit longer about killing others and then yourself, children wouldn't be victims, accidental deaths wouldn't happen as frequently as they do.
Until we exercise our privilege of voting -- to take the veil off of hidden political money, use our voices to put the NRA in its proper place, and educate ourselves instead of being influences by their PR machine -- they will have really won.
Statistics show that gun deaths (oh yeah, I know....it's not the gun, it's the person behind the gun) in the hands of private citizens accounting for more deaths than the lives that were lost in all of our wars.
Yes, the NRA is winning. It is up to us to find a way to decrease the lawless use of guns, the number of children that accidentally are killed, and the rise in mass shootings by people that are unstable. Let's put it this way....if you don't have a gun, it would be very hard to accomplish the bloody deaths that have become all too common, you might have to think a bit longer about killing others and then yourself, children wouldn't be victims, accidental deaths wouldn't happen as frequently as they do.
Until we exercise our privilege of voting -- to take the veil off of hidden political money, use our voices to put the NRA in its proper place, and educate ourselves instead of being influences by their PR machine -- they will have really won.
444
The only thing that you said useful was to educate yourself and decrease the lawless use of guns. Having more restrictive gun laws do not stop criminals. Perfect example Chicago. The strictest gun control laws in the US. Let focus on enforcing the gun laws that are already on the books. Let focus on teaching children what to do when they find a gun. Teaching gun safety is the first step in saving our children from accidental shootings. Just like prohibition did not work, more gun control will not work. If a person never seeks help for mental illness, they will never be diagnosed.
1
Thank you for this important commentary. In addition to the sources you mentioned, The Economist recently (April 4 edition) pointed out that Congress has refused to expand the number of gun buyers checked for histories of severe mental illness or violent crimes, even though polls show that 90% of Americans support such checks. There is "open carry", "concealed carry" and now "constitutional carry" which allows citizens to own guns with no license, checks or training.
This is a political issue, manipulated by the usual crowd of the NRA, partisan loons and anti-government thinkers, who are very able at convincing people to believe things which are against their own interest and welfare. Unfortunately, like many of the important topics touched by politics these days, truth and reason have little to do with the outcome. How did we come to this?
This is a political issue, manipulated by the usual crowd of the NRA, partisan loons and anti-government thinkers, who are very able at convincing people to believe things which are against their own interest and welfare. Unfortunately, like many of the important topics touched by politics these days, truth and reason have little to do with the outcome. How did we come to this?
221
To the best of my knowledge, no governmental entity has long survived. It can be said that we humans in due time "eat ourselves."
1
Statistics show that guns make a home less safe, yet in just 14 years this fact has almost completely evaporated from America's consciousness, to be replaced by a magical belief in the opposite. Will Americans now start believing the earth is flat and the moon made of green cheese?
281
The 2d Amendment is not about personal safety, it is about the safety of liberty. Of course there is a cost. But to fairly compare gun deaths of the 20th century between the USA and Europe, one must include the deaths of civilians by their own governments; that, after all, is the purpose of the 2d Amendment (it was certainly not to protect the ability of hunters to defend themselves against deer).
11
The question of the origin and "purpose" of the 2nd amendment is a complex and controversial one, but there are good arguments and documents supporting the view that it arose to ensure that landowners in Southern States could defend themselves against slave rebellions. At the very least it seems safest to acknowledge that we cannot be sure about the origin of the 2nd.
Can you give specific examples of how the high level of gun ownership in the US has been successfully used to protect citizens against their own government? There have only been a few rebellions, such as the Whiskey Rebellion and of course the Southern Secession. All have, rightly, failed.
Can you give specific examples of how the high level of gun ownership in the US has been successfully used to protect citizens against their own government? There have only been a few rebellions, such as the Whiskey Rebellion and of course the Southern Secession. All have, rightly, failed.
16
That "study" was never true. It was overloaded with addicts, felons, and predators. Sure, guns in the homes of addicts and felons make those homes less safe duh. Unfortunately that study has been misused to justify blanket prohibition. Most ecological studies are deeply flawed. You need only look at the guidelines for salt and egg consumption. Bad science makes its way into courts all the time (FBI recently admitted its hair analysis was flawed).
The courts have done a terrible job by allowing bad science into the court. If they did their job, laws would get struck.
The courts have done a terrible job by allowing bad science into the court. If they did their job, laws would get struck.
5
21st century democracy - 1984 in a different disguise. If you have the lobbyists and the money, if you're willing to threaten and bribe and intimidate and run negative advertising, you can not only influence the politicians and the laws, but eventually even the people start to believe you.
It's just so sad, but this is the nth example, along with climate-change, inequality, military-spending, education, taxation, poverty ... where the US is following policies which are almost totally at odds with what would be good for the US people. Everybody knows, but nobody knows how to stop it - everyone, even the politicians, feels like they're just small cogs in an enormous wheel, and that they will be crushed if they step out of line ...
It's just so sad, but this is the nth example, along with climate-change, inequality, military-spending, education, taxation, poverty ... where the US is following policies which are almost totally at odds with what would be good for the US people. Everybody knows, but nobody knows how to stop it - everyone, even the politicians, feels like they're just small cogs in an enormous wheel, and that they will be crushed if they step out of line ...
30
When I watch Wayne Lapierre run his mouth about the second amendment, in spite of a children's death-by-gun rate that is higher than the rest of the civilized world combined, I see pure evil, of a kind that makes Dick Cheney look benevolent.
When I watch spineless members of congress who are elected to serve the best interests of their constituents – Democrats included – cower under NRA thuggery, I see treason, of a kind that makes Benedict Arnold look like a weenie.
Obama pointed out that there's a segment of the population that clings to its guns and religion. The root of the problem, though, is that virtually the entire population clings to its constitution, which allows thugs like Lapierre to have their twisted interpretations of the second amendment taken seriously, and the NRA to win every era of the gun debate.
I live in the French Fifth Republic, where pragmatism outweighs tradition. As society has evolved and realities diverged from aspects of the constitution, it has been rewritten four times.
I'm not suggesting the entire US Constitution needs rewriting, but it is long past time to update the second amendment for modern realities. Retired justice John Paul Stevens has proposed adding the words "when serving in the militia" to the second amendment, which would effectively shut down the NRA's core argument. If for nothing more than the sake of the seven children PER DAY who are shot dead, Stevens must be heard and heeded.
When I watch spineless members of congress who are elected to serve the best interests of their constituents – Democrats included – cower under NRA thuggery, I see treason, of a kind that makes Benedict Arnold look like a weenie.
Obama pointed out that there's a segment of the population that clings to its guns and religion. The root of the problem, though, is that virtually the entire population clings to its constitution, which allows thugs like Lapierre to have their twisted interpretations of the second amendment taken seriously, and the NRA to win every era of the gun debate.
I live in the French Fifth Republic, where pragmatism outweighs tradition. As society has evolved and realities diverged from aspects of the constitution, it has been rewritten four times.
I'm not suggesting the entire US Constitution needs rewriting, but it is long past time to update the second amendment for modern realities. Retired justice John Paul Stevens has proposed adding the words "when serving in the militia" to the second amendment, which would effectively shut down the NRA's core argument. If for nothing more than the sake of the seven children PER DAY who are shot dead, Stevens must be heard and heeded.
713
You are spot-on HeyNorris but please also note that Judge Stevens now speaks all too conveniently from a powerless position as a RETIRED Supreme Court Justice.
That alone speaks to the ugly power of the NRA in this age of 24/7 media fear mongering and Citizens United.
Personally, the utter impotency of the entire congress to take any action what so ever after the horrific Sandy Hook Elementary School massacre in Connecticut was a turning point for me as I then fully realized that full scale gridlock was in effect and the voice of well endowed interests were all that matters to our "representatives".
That alone speaks to the ugly power of the NRA in this age of 24/7 media fear mongering and Citizens United.
Personally, the utter impotency of the entire congress to take any action what so ever after the horrific Sandy Hook Elementary School massacre in Connecticut was a turning point for me as I then fully realized that full scale gridlock was in effect and the voice of well endowed interests were all that matters to our "representatives".
26
That is precisely why the founding fathers created the bill of rights. To protect individual rights. You have this wrapped reality that law abiding citizen commit crimes. If criminals obeyed the laws the world would not need prisons. A Constitution that can be rewritten 4 times that easily is just a useless piece of paper. That means any time a group of people are elected they can easily change the constitution as they see fit. Seems like an abuse of the government to me. But since I don't live in France, I don't care what they do.
1
You make great points. But Dick Cheney looking benevolent? C'mon.
1
If the slaughter of innocent people via easily obtainable weapons is your cup of tea, then the NRA has "won."
24
Cars kill more people than guns, slaughter of innocent people via easily obtainable drivers licenses. The only difference is owning a gun is a constitutional right, a drivers license is a privilege. I have never known a law abiding citizen commit an unjustified homicide, only criminals.
1
Local TV news shows have expanded hours compared with the past, and mostly focuses on local crimes, and are mostly crime updates, along with weather and sports, plus other cable TV crime shows. Now they show more video than ever, likely a big factor in more public fears. Even if crime rates decrease, local news won’t decrease it’s focus on crime or whatever video they can grab.
Once the idea is planted that we should all be afraid, the more guns people carry, and the more shootings occur, then the more danger we’re really in, so we carry guns...it’s a vicious cycle. There's profit in keeping the cycle going, not in breaking it. .
The NRA and their politicians have been very organized, with media constantly reinforcing the power of their influence. A self fulfilling prophecy, leading candidates to kow tow, and the public to think this is all inevitable.
Otoh, past polls have shown that majorities of the public oppose guns for all and want stricter gun laws. Including NRA members and gun owners. But are these people ever interviewed in the media, to give another side of the story to the public? Publicizing the anti gun public as much as the pro gun, might shift the debate and start a new more positive trend. It’s all perception.
Big money elections tether congress to their powerful donors. So, as in so much else, campaign finance reform would help solve the gun epidemic.
Once the idea is planted that we should all be afraid, the more guns people carry, and the more shootings occur, then the more danger we’re really in, so we carry guns...it’s a vicious cycle. There's profit in keeping the cycle going, not in breaking it. .
The NRA and their politicians have been very organized, with media constantly reinforcing the power of their influence. A self fulfilling prophecy, leading candidates to kow tow, and the public to think this is all inevitable.
Otoh, past polls have shown that majorities of the public oppose guns for all and want stricter gun laws. Including NRA members and gun owners. But are these people ever interviewed in the media, to give another side of the story to the public? Publicizing the anti gun public as much as the pro gun, might shift the debate and start a new more positive trend. It’s all perception.
Big money elections tether congress to their powerful donors. So, as in so much else, campaign finance reform would help solve the gun epidemic.
15
Otoh, past polls have shown that majorities of the public oppose guns for all and want stricter gun laws. Including NRA members and gun owners.
====================
Read Mr Blow's article - polls no longer show this
====================
Read Mr Blow's article - polls no longer show this
1
The NRA has long represented gun manufacturers, not gun owners. People who join such an organization ignorantly believe they are demonstrating their right to keep and bear arms when what they're really doing is supporting Big Gun.
The NRA has cleverly and insidiously played upon deep-rooted fears and hatred of Obama (and Clinton) in its ranks to mobilize its members to keep Congress paralyzed on gun control issues for much of the last twenty years. It continues to get away with its philosophy of never giving an inch, even to win public approval for being willing to compromise, in part because it retains a shred of Democratic support. Yet, despite what the disappointing numbers tell us today, the writing appears to be on the wall: the next time Democrats control the White House and both congressional chambers (possibly as soon as 2017, but more realistically 2021), the NRA will have to rely solely upon Republicans to continue to filibuster legislation. That will give it very little margin for error. This battle is far from over and the NRA's combativeness and escalating partisanship may one day lead to the very thing it most fears: a national gun registry.
The NRA has cleverly and insidiously played upon deep-rooted fears and hatred of Obama (and Clinton) in its ranks to mobilize its members to keep Congress paralyzed on gun control issues for much of the last twenty years. It continues to get away with its philosophy of never giving an inch, even to win public approval for being willing to compromise, in part because it retains a shred of Democratic support. Yet, despite what the disappointing numbers tell us today, the writing appears to be on the wall: the next time Democrats control the White House and both congressional chambers (possibly as soon as 2017, but more realistically 2021), the NRA will have to rely solely upon Republicans to continue to filibuster legislation. That will give it very little margin for error. This battle is far from over and the NRA's combativeness and escalating partisanship may one day lead to the very thing it most fears: a national gun registry.
152
How well did gun control legislation go the last time the Democrats controlled Congress and the Presidency - that is only 7 years ago?
7