What does the New York Times and this reporter plan to do to ensure that interview subjects for articles are not hoaxing them? Could Ms. Tavernise have done anything differently to confirm the accuracy of what her sources were telling her?
3
E-cigarettes deliver an addictive substance, nicotine. It's difficult for the young to imagine how hard the nicotine habit is to quit and later in life they may deeply regret their addiction. Also, there is still the matter of public health. I would not want to be around vaping anymore than I want to be around tobacco smoking.
2
Do people who use Ecigs really and truly want to quit smoking? I mean, if nicorette gum, the patch or cold turkey didn't do the trick, Ecigs won't either. But I can guarantee what will work. It's a desire so strong, so definitive that you quit. That's what I did. I smoked 3 packs a day for 40 years. Tried everything to quit. One day I just simply knew it was killing me so I stopped. My lungs were wheezing. After a nice shower i'd feel fresh and clean but my lungs felt polluted. At times they felt like they were made of iron. Breaths were shortened. I was definitely on a downward spiral so I stopped. Didn't tell anyone. Didn't share. Didn't want the pressure. just stopped. The physical addiction is gone in three days. That's the easy part. The hardest part is the daily triggers. Fortunately no discernable effects from the heavy smoking has shown up with me. I am one lucky son of a gun! And that's how you quit
2
That's wonderful. Glad for you. But people are different! I quit cigs 8 years ago and started vaping to save myself from picking them up again. I missed the other things about smoking: the tactile, the lung punch, the placebo relaxation effect, the activity that's apart from the other things in your life, the aroma. Oh, NOT THAT, sorry.
And you're right, the nicotine addiction is not really the big deal... contrary to the hysterics expressed here. The lozenges taste awful; the patch is too expensive, and they don't address all the things I just listed that seem so much more important.
The data, and the many anecdotes, are pointing to a dramatic advantage to these devices for kicking cigs. Wish the various complainers would just get out of the way and let it happen.
And you're right, the nicotine addiction is not really the big deal... contrary to the hysterics expressed here. The lozenges taste awful; the patch is too expensive, and they don't address all the things I just listed that seem so much more important.
The data, and the many anecdotes, are pointing to a dramatic advantage to these devices for kicking cigs. Wish the various complainers would just get out of the way and let it happen.
5
The tobacco industry is criminal. It should be outlawed and all the profits accumulated should be confiscated to pay for healthcare since it has caused so much illness. There are NO good uses for tobacco. It has no redeeming qualities. It is harmful in all forms. Having been born in 1945, all the adults I knew smoked. Even our doctor--who came to our home when we were sick--always had a cigarette hanging out of his mouth. My sister and I started stealing cigarettes from our parents before we were ten years old--it was the cool thing to do. We and our friends would pool our money and buy a carton to share. The advertisements were everywhere. We were inundated with them. It's time these criminal drug pushers get what they deserve--some long jail time and the confiscation of their ill-gotten wealth! That, at least could be put to good use.
3
I know which way you vote!
Conservatives and the people who made this country the leader of the free world took responsibility for the choices they made and never trusted the very thought of trying to blame others.
Liberals feel religiously obligated to hate companies in general asnd profitable companies in particular. Whenever you find a person who instinctively blames anyone other than himself or herself for choices that they made all by themselves, you have found a liberal 95% of the time.
Throw in the fact that farmers are involved, and the liberal has a perfect dead horse to beat!
Conservatives and the people who made this country the leader of the free world took responsibility for the choices they made and never trusted the very thought of trying to blame others.
Liberals feel religiously obligated to hate companies in general asnd profitable companies in particular. Whenever you find a person who instinctively blames anyone other than himself or herself for choices that they made all by themselves, you have found a liberal 95% of the time.
Throw in the fact that farmers are involved, and the liberal has a perfect dead horse to beat!
E-cigs were never meant to be a standalone addiction, but a substitute for tobacco, which eventually leads to quitting. I tried them but went back to smoking in a few days. Finally I found the Simpleguided Smoking Plan and got rid of it for good, hopefully.
more correct, rise is sharp for white people.
1
But not in the key of C-Sharp Major.
Hope people of color are able to quit at the rate white people, apparently, are. Of course they can, just without the comfort and pleasure vaping offers.
Oh NO! This must be banned! Society can not afford another gateway to hard drug use, alcohol addition, cigarette smoking, obesity, school skipping, spousal abuse, child neglect, general all around antisocial behavior and failure to vote! (did the tongue-in-cheek sarcasm come through?)
For decades the anti-smoking lobby hammered away that it was all that nasty stuff released by the combustion of the additives, tobacco and paper that made cigarette smoking so detrimental to one's health, and everyone who's close by. Having that issue resolved, the buzz-killers now trot out a new tune casting vaporizing as an irresistible evil gateway to all of our bad habits and social ills...supported only by their active imaginations and fiery rhetoric.
The U.S. is supposed to be a 'free society,' contrary to the spate of recent restrictive legislation. In a 'free society,' an activity is supposed to be permissible until proven detrimental and, often, even then (ie. alcohol). If and until the medical profession can honestly document harmful effects from vaporizing nicotine specifically, or even vaporizing in general, governmental regulation should be no more onerous than for any other consumer product 'out there.'
For decades the anti-smoking lobby hammered away that it was all that nasty stuff released by the combustion of the additives, tobacco and paper that made cigarette smoking so detrimental to one's health, and everyone who's close by. Having that issue resolved, the buzz-killers now trot out a new tune casting vaporizing as an irresistible evil gateway to all of our bad habits and social ills...supported only by their active imaginations and fiery rhetoric.
The U.S. is supposed to be a 'free society,' contrary to the spate of recent restrictive legislation. In a 'free society,' an activity is supposed to be permissible until proven detrimental and, often, even then (ie. alcohol). If and until the medical profession can honestly document harmful effects from vaporizing nicotine specifically, or even vaporizing in general, governmental regulation should be no more onerous than for any other consumer product 'out there.'
16
Too bad there weren't more media literacy classes where kids could learn the ugly truth about corporate practice! It' comical to read that the teens want to "make their own mistakes" by doing things like smoking candy flavored nicotine delivery devices so they can grow up successfully (as long as they don't get some form of cancer from their freedom of choice), Along with media literacy classes for everyone who owns a tv, we should also have corporate reform laws, whoever deemed a corporation a "person" should be thrown in jail! It's just a sick tragedy that these things are marketed to teens, but also it's no surprise because those teens who "want to make their own bad choices" are just being USED by corporations who make ecigs, as the target group they can hook on their product so they can make money off of these teens for as long as their lungs hold out. SAD. Data gathering will, I am sure prove that sucking hot smoke with nicotine in it, and artificial flavors too, through hot plastic will prove dangerous and toxic to humans on some level. In the meantime, I will conduct my own personal campaign of leaving restaurants and other places if exposed to vapors...
1
This is probably the worst place in the world to live if you were trained to hate all companies. You could try a company-free nation, like Cuba or Venezuela. Zimbabwe, Albania, and some of the old Soviet republics would also fit the person who hates employers and the profit motive.
I just bet that if you went around and hit up the rich liberals in your area they'd buy you a ticket once you make you choice. Good luck!
I just bet that if you went around and hit up the rich liberals in your area they'd buy you a ticket once you make you choice. Good luck!
1
Always good to have people who freely cast a jaundiced eye on corporate shenanigans, but in this case, it's misplaced. Big tobacco is trying to get into this market, but they're late and stuck on old models for their products. Adults might fall for them, but kids know the best products are online, in companies run by people not much older than they are, true entrepreneurs.
1
This report doesn't even mention that the liquid used to fuel the e-cigs is availabe bit with and WITHOUT nicotine! Looks like the author doesn't have a clue. Of course, the new trend isn't concerning at all if most kids use the nicotine free stuff. There's got to be some data on this, but it's missing in this poorly researched hack. FAILURE!
6
All these people who are squawking about nicotine and "drugs" don't seem to realize that there are 0% nicotine fluids available.
My son was smoking (behind my back, obviously), for two years. This past Christmas, his sister bought him a vape. I was unhappy to discover he'd been smoking, but allowed the vape as a form of cessation. He started at 18% nicotine, and is now down to 3%, working his way to 0%.
I don't believe he'll stop vaping, but with the 0% nicotine, I have FAR fewer concerns about his health. Yes, there are still concerns, but there are also benefits- he deals with an anxiety disorder, and vaping has a visible relaxing effect upon his symptoms. The anti-anxiety drugs he gets from his doctor have known possible severe side effects. Everything I've read tells me that vaping has possibly unknown side effects, but that those that we do know about are mild at worst.
I'm a fan of vaping as a very effective cessation therapy. And hey, if kids try vaping in school with 0% fluids, rather than cigarettes, I'm all for that, too.
My son was smoking (behind my back, obviously), for two years. This past Christmas, his sister bought him a vape. I was unhappy to discover he'd been smoking, but allowed the vape as a form of cessation. He started at 18% nicotine, and is now down to 3%, working his way to 0%.
I don't believe he'll stop vaping, but with the 0% nicotine, I have FAR fewer concerns about his health. Yes, there are still concerns, but there are also benefits- he deals with an anxiety disorder, and vaping has a visible relaxing effect upon his symptoms. The anti-anxiety drugs he gets from his doctor have known possible severe side effects. Everything I've read tells me that vaping has possibly unknown side effects, but that those that we do know about are mild at worst.
I'm a fan of vaping as a very effective cessation therapy. And hey, if kids try vaping in school with 0% fluids, rather than cigarettes, I'm all for that, too.
16
Smoking is a hazard to all. People are just stupid. Seems they'll go to all kinds of trouble to kill themselves. Regulate the awful things. Useless.
2
Good strategy, nicotine pushers! In high school, it's way to be unique by putting on a rebel uniform. In their twenties, it'll be Ostentatious Bro Vaping, the latest barbarian yawp. For the subsequent six (unless health truncated) decades, it'll be a profitable addiction.
1
Ms. Tavernise: Thank you for pointing out that the smoking rates have dropped dramatically--a fact that the CDC failed to mention in press releases. Surveys in the UK have asked teens whether there is nicotine in the e-cigarette they are using. They found that non-tobacco users are using zero-nicotine. That tends to negate the simplistic theory that e-cigarette use is nothing but "drug seeking behavior." Discouraging condom use (because "it's still sex") results in disease and unwanted pregnancy. Discouraging e-cigarette use is resulting in smokers continuing to smoke instead of switching to a product at least 98% less hazardous than smoking. Convincing teens of the falsehood that e-cigarette use is likely to cause cancer and other diseases is equivalent to telling them, "You might as well smoke."
6
This is no surprise. I hardly even knew about e-cigs until I went to a large shopping mall and saw the e-cig kiosks crowded with teens and college kids buying up stuff. Frankly, e-cigs are less dangerous than regular cigs, so I really don't care all that much. And, so long as people who smoke e-cigs don't have cigarette breath and cigarette smelling clothes, well, some young guys are hot when they have a cig.
4
Does anyone understand that 'pot' is smoked through a vaporizer, not just cigarettes?
1
Trying to understand your point... 'pot' is also ingested via baked goods, rolling papers, candies, pipes, and various other edibles...
2
The article doesn't point out that the reason vapor smoking has caught on so quickly is more due to pot than cigs. No tell tale smell, easy to use and can be disguised as an instrument to wean someone off of cigs.
2
All good info, useful when more states legalize it. A safer way to smoke pot!
I have ten grandchildren, from age 9 to age 26, males and females. None of them are tattooed, pierced, use pot or "vapes." Alcohol is consumed judiciously, beer on a hot day, wine with dinner, sometimes, no hard liquor. All worked their way through high school and college. The 4 oldest earned graduate degrees and are self-supporting. Where are the parents of these kids? Why haven't they taught their children not to waste money on such stupid stuff? Pathetic.
2
When it comes to your grandchildren you're a queen! - Sorta like Cleopatra, Queen of DENIAL!
5
I take it you do not accompany your grandchildren to high school or college parties. I also worked through college, earned a graduate degree, and am self-supporting, but I had my fun in college, despite the fact that my mother believes that I have never used pot, tobacco, and only consume alcohol judiciously.
2
The anti-tobacco people are the ones who are keeping tobacco products cool, the more they exaggerate, the more appeal it has.
If they had told the truth from the beginning, the whole allure of tobacco would have faded away a long time ago.
Just like when the prohibitionists stopped yapping about alcohol, the number of people drinking went down precipitously. They stopped talking about it in the 90s and since then less and less people drink every year. Per capita alcohol consumption in the US has dropped 23% since 1990. There have been no anti-drinking campaigns in that time.
The hyperbole of anti-smoking league is almost laughable, except for the fact that it is contributing to the rise in tobacco use because people generally know when they are being lied to and they push back against it.
Just stick to the facts, no hyperbole needed and smoking would die a natural death just like alcohol consumption is doing.
If they had told the truth from the beginning, the whole allure of tobacco would have faded away a long time ago.
Just like when the prohibitionists stopped yapping about alcohol, the number of people drinking went down precipitously. They stopped talking about it in the 90s and since then less and less people drink every year. Per capita alcohol consumption in the US has dropped 23% since 1990. There have been no anti-drinking campaigns in that time.
The hyperbole of anti-smoking league is almost laughable, except for the fact that it is contributing to the rise in tobacco use because people generally know when they are being lied to and they push back against it.
Just stick to the facts, no hyperbole needed and smoking would die a natural death just like alcohol consumption is doing.
4
Never looked up the actual data have you?
At one time not all that long ago 50 percent of US adults were daily tobacco smokers.
The anti smoking programs kicked in along with higher taxes and indoor clean air regs and today it's 19 percent regular tobacco smokers.
A dramatic downturn for a true addiction
So much for your insight
At one time not all that long ago 50 percent of US adults were daily tobacco smokers.
The anti smoking programs kicked in along with higher taxes and indoor clean air regs and today it's 19 percent regular tobacco smokers.
A dramatic downturn for a true addiction
So much for your insight
1
If e-cigs contain nicotine and create addiction, they will always have the potential to be an entre to regular cigarettes for the individual. Availability and cost are two factors.
3
Study finds nicotine safe, helps in Alzheimer's, Parkinson's | Tampa Bay Times
"It seems very safe even in nonsmokers," he said. "In our studies we find it actually reduces blood pressure chronically. And there were no addiction or withdrawal problems, and nobody started smoking cigarettes. The risk of addiction to nicotine alone is virtually nil."
Dr. Paul Newhouse, the director of Vanderbilt University's Center for Cognitive Medicine.
http://bit.ly/1nxFsfG
"It seems very safe even in nonsmokers," he said. "In our studies we find it actually reduces blood pressure chronically. And there were no addiction or withdrawal problems, and nobody started smoking cigarettes. The risk of addiction to nicotine alone is virtually nil."
Dr. Paul Newhouse, the director of Vanderbilt University's Center for Cognitive Medicine.
http://bit.ly/1nxFsfG
4
No, they not...
1
Since in the US cigs were never marketed for their specific flavors or quality of the contents, they all fell into the yuck category for non-smokers. No person who choses her hardware and juices from the many quality products on the market for vaping would NEVER consider smoking cigs. They taste like floor sweepings, which, sadly, many are.
Let's call this what it is: drug-seeking behavior, most of it being done by teenagers, who want to tout that their choice is the lesser of two evils. It could be worse, they say. We could be smoking regular cigarettes. This is a little bit like using a condom while having sex. It's still sex, it's just a bit safer than than it was before. The over-all question remains the same: is this behavior that should be encouraged, or discouraged? I'd say the answer is pretty easy: it should be discouraged.
Nicotine is one of the most addictive substances on earth. What happens when it is not easily available to these drug-seekers? Like all drug seekers, they begin acting out in stereotypical behaviors, like rats in Skinner boxes: getting fidgety, nervous, pacing about. What if vape devices are absent, but regular cigarettes are present? I'm guessing a good percentage of the current vape crowd would begin smoking regular cigarettes. Some them probably already do.
People, including people who know better such as drug researchers, are attempting to put the best face on this phenomenon. But, when you remove the initial sigh of relief, it's still drug-seeking behavior driving the train here. This shouldn't be encouraged. The lesser of two evils is still an evil. Addiction is addiction, smoke or no smoke.
8
"Let's call this what it is: drug-seeking behavior" Like Starbucks?
5
Anyone who down plays condoms as a public health approach is not to be taken seriously.
Anyone who equates tobacco smoke with vapor is not to be taken seriously.
It's about reducing risks not a perfect world the type we have never seen and will never see.
Anyone who equates tobacco smoke with vapor is not to be taken seriously.
It's about reducing risks not a perfect world the type we have never seen and will never see.
4
Breaking news! Children in our country are truly, factually, suffering from abject poverty and abuse, but first look at these pictures of middle class kids puffing on $150 battery containers with substances akin to caffeine fumes and prepare to spit out your cappuccino. This! THIS! THIS! e-cigarettes! That is what we are upset about. Half of you 50+ goofballs on here glorified everything you say is bad now. Please let us make our own mistakes...we would appreciate the exercise in character building.
10
Surprise, Jonathan. I'm a Boomer but think you're correct in several ways, a bit off only in suggesting vaping is a mistake. Clearly something's going right here.
Anybody who vapes does so after studying the action, the gear, the costs, and possible harms. We're not stupid. We've discovered vaping is like smoking cigs only in the way it appears to onlookers.
The CDC spokespersons and other campaigners against ecigs seem laughably ill-informed about the subject, which is horribly discouraging since this relatively benign activity could be *outlawed* if their misinformation is taken as scientific truth.
Call them anecdotes, the many thousands of them out there, but vaping helps smokers get off cigs. This is important. Look at THOSE figures very carefully. The truth about this activity lies there.
Anybody who vapes does so after studying the action, the gear, the costs, and possible harms. We're not stupid. We've discovered vaping is like smoking cigs only in the way it appears to onlookers.
The CDC spokespersons and other campaigners against ecigs seem laughably ill-informed about the subject, which is horribly discouraging since this relatively benign activity could be *outlawed* if their misinformation is taken as scientific truth.
Call them anecdotes, the many thousands of them out there, but vaping helps smokers get off cigs. This is important. Look at THOSE figures very carefully. The truth about this activity lies there.
6
I was born and raised in London in 1967.
and from my childhood till 2003 cigarette advertising had been legal.
but smoking causes cigarette smoking causes more than 480,000 deaths each year in the United States,
and Around 86% of lung cancer deaths in the UK are caused by tobacco smoking and overall tobacco smoking is estimated to be responsible for more than a quarter of cancer deaths in the UK, around 43,000 deaths in 2007.
so the obvious question is why was smoking legalized?
why was such a highly addictive and highly health damaging death causing product allowed to be advertised?
also consider the financial strain smoking puts upon hospitals?
only an unreasonable person would defend the legalization of smoking.
think about it.
every smoker is paying for a product that damages their health.
where is the sense in that?
and considering the devastating effect smoking has on human society,
it is reasonable to call the legalization of smoking as one of the grossest acts of irresponsibility on the part of our governments.
they were willing to misuse their authority in order to benefit themselves at the expense of leaving us open to exploitation and manipulation by the the cigarette and advertising business.
that kind of irresponsibility is inexcusable and reveals the true nature of politicians.
so should we be surprised that they are now ready to allow us to be exploited and manipulated again by the e cigarette business?
I say to everyone...avoid it and stay in control.
and from my childhood till 2003 cigarette advertising had been legal.
but smoking causes cigarette smoking causes more than 480,000 deaths each year in the United States,
and Around 86% of lung cancer deaths in the UK are caused by tobacco smoking and overall tobacco smoking is estimated to be responsible for more than a quarter of cancer deaths in the UK, around 43,000 deaths in 2007.
so the obvious question is why was smoking legalized?
why was such a highly addictive and highly health damaging death causing product allowed to be advertised?
also consider the financial strain smoking puts upon hospitals?
only an unreasonable person would defend the legalization of smoking.
think about it.
every smoker is paying for a product that damages their health.
where is the sense in that?
and considering the devastating effect smoking has on human society,
it is reasonable to call the legalization of smoking as one of the grossest acts of irresponsibility on the part of our governments.
they were willing to misuse their authority in order to benefit themselves at the expense of leaving us open to exploitation and manipulation by the the cigarette and advertising business.
that kind of irresponsibility is inexcusable and reveals the true nature of politicians.
so should we be surprised that they are now ready to allow us to be exploited and manipulated again by the e cigarette business?
I say to everyone...avoid it and stay in control.
1
Smoking was never "legalized" anymore than alcohol or drugs were. Smoking and alcohol were never "illegalized" (except during Prohibition, and we see what happened there). LSD, marijuana, cocaine started out legal, then were "illegelized". Stuff isn't discovered then made legal, it is legal when discovered, then outlawed. Like all the designer drugs coming out of labs. One molecule different, and it is legal until it is described in a law making it illegal.
So smoking started out "legal" and has never been changed.
So smoking started out "legal" and has never been changed.
1
I love the ads. Don't you. This rugged looking guy talking all about freedom who is running and cycling with something like a baby's pacifier in his mouth filled with nicotine. Yep, he's free; he's mature. He needs a pacifier.
Now these drug delivery companies are flavoring these pacifiers with strawberry and other flavors, not to attract kids you understand just to heighten the "freedom" experience. Look, I am of two minds when it comes to adults using drugs and having the choice to do so. Usually I come down on the its their choice as long as they don't hurt any one. I believe the goverment can regulate that use but I think criminalization is a bad idea.
E Cigarettes are drug delivery devices, nothing more and nothing less. They are NOT freedom delivery devices. They should be regulated by the FDA. They should not be available to underrated kids. And their use should not be permitted in areas where nonusers will be exposed to the vapor they emit. No matter what the companies say it isn't just harmless steam and they know it. As a non user I should not have to bear the risk of any and I mean any negative consequences of their use. You want your "freedom" to take drugs; I want my freedom not to have to exhale your leavings.
You want to smoke (don't care what) you want to vape, fine. Do it where I won't be bothered by it. I am sick of my freedom always having to take a back seat.
Now these drug delivery companies are flavoring these pacifiers with strawberry and other flavors, not to attract kids you understand just to heighten the "freedom" experience. Look, I am of two minds when it comes to adults using drugs and having the choice to do so. Usually I come down on the its their choice as long as they don't hurt any one. I believe the goverment can regulate that use but I think criminalization is a bad idea.
E Cigarettes are drug delivery devices, nothing more and nothing less. They are NOT freedom delivery devices. They should be regulated by the FDA. They should not be available to underrated kids. And their use should not be permitted in areas where nonusers will be exposed to the vapor they emit. No matter what the companies say it isn't just harmless steam and they know it. As a non user I should not have to bear the risk of any and I mean any negative consequences of their use. You want your "freedom" to take drugs; I want my freedom not to have to exhale your leavings.
You want to smoke (don't care what) you want to vape, fine. Do it where I won't be bothered by it. I am sick of my freedom always having to take a back seat.
6
the "steam" you refer to is made up of propylene glycol, vegetable glycerin, flavorings (dependent on the flavor) and nicotine (unless you are using 0 mg nicotine liquid of course)
vegetable glycerin - has a variety of uses, cough mixtures, due to its soothing properties, to moisturizers for topical use, to being a food additive, and of course, ecig liquid.
Propolyne glycol - also has various uses, from food preservative, to use in inhalers and other medical vaporizers.
your claim that it is a harmful steam, is invalid. It is a water vapor that dissipates in seconds.
vegetable glycerin - has a variety of uses, cough mixtures, due to its soothing properties, to moisturizers for topical use, to being a food additive, and of course, ecig liquid.
Propolyne glycol - also has various uses, from food preservative, to use in inhalers and other medical vaporizers.
your claim that it is a harmful steam, is invalid. It is a water vapor that dissipates in seconds.
3
Not all "vapes" have drugs in them. Regardless of what "they" say, it is NOT steam or water vapor, but polyetheylene glycol (or some derivative) vapor. I would rather not share a public space with vapers, either. I would like vaping prohibited in the same places smoking is, because I do not choose to vape or smoke, and would rather not inhale someone esle's.
A bit childish with the pacifier comparison, though. You lost a lot of credibility, kind of like a child whining.
A bit childish with the pacifier comparison, though. You lost a lot of credibility, kind of like a child whining.
3
My only reaction to all these efforts to stop this and regulate that is -----> Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha!
I don't have any answers (I never do), but I remember (barely) my teen-years, and I wasn't in the mood to listen to anyone. Teens, and I, engage, and engaged, in risky behavior. Most of us survive; and that's the way it is ... Friday, April 17, 2015. (Apologies to Mr. Walter Cronkite)
I don't have any answers (I never do), but I remember (barely) my teen-years, and I wasn't in the mood to listen to anyone. Teens, and I, engage, and engaged, in risky behavior. Most of us survive; and that's the way it is ... Friday, April 17, 2015. (Apologies to Mr. Walter Cronkite)
2
I have unsuccessly tried to quit cigarettes dozens of times. I was finally successful using e cigarettes. The should be regulated and not sold to minors, but they are a better alternative who are truly addicted.
13
I was unaware that the majority of scientists felt that e-cigs were safer than cigarettes. In fact, I'm pretty sure that statistic has no basis in fact. Probably because there are no long term studies and no solid data to that effect.
Filtered cigarettes were supposed to be safer and they weren't. Light cigs were supposed to be safer and they weren't. This is just another way to get more children using nicotine products so they'll be lifelong addicts. Only the life won't be longer.
All of this comes from the ridiculous allowance of big tobacco company owned c-cig companies to advertise on television targeting teens and tweens, making it look cool and acceptable. Again.
Filtered cigarettes were supposed to be safer and they weren't. Light cigs were supposed to be safer and they weren't. This is just another way to get more children using nicotine products so they'll be lifelong addicts. Only the life won't be longer.
All of this comes from the ridiculous allowance of big tobacco company owned c-cig companies to advertise on television targeting teens and tweens, making it look cool and acceptable. Again.
7
Strange that even with the facts, as few as they are, right in front of you, you are sure they're wrong. I suggest you read the Wikipedia entry on vaping just to get yourself up to minimal speed on the issue. You'll learn that the liquids used in these devices are extremely simple, composed of the same two ingredients used in breathing enhalers to enable vaporization, pure nicotine (if desired), and flavorings. Careful shopping gets you high quality juices which can cost far less than this article suggests. No need for anyone to be fooled as we were in the olden days by big tobacco.
4
Articles like this exist precisly because the ecigs do not come from Big Tobacco..
2
"... You'll learn that the liquids used in these devices are extremely simple, composed of the same two ingredients used in breathing enhalers to enable vaporization..."
Hogwash. "breathing enhalers" contain medicine to expand airways and stop spasms. The "vaporization" of their contents is in fact NOT vaporization, but atomization, and is achieved by forcing the medicine through an atomizer. Vapes actually vaporize, or evaporate the vape liquid, which in no way contains ingredients found in "breathing enhalers". ANyone who uses Wikipedia as any king of authority is foolish, as pretty much anyone can change Wikipedia entries.
Hogwash. "breathing enhalers" contain medicine to expand airways and stop spasms. The "vaporization" of their contents is in fact NOT vaporization, but atomization, and is achieved by forcing the medicine through an atomizer. Vapes actually vaporize, or evaporate the vape liquid, which in no way contains ingredients found in "breathing enhalers". ANyone who uses Wikipedia as any king of authority is foolish, as pretty much anyone can change Wikipedia entries.
Although this article doesn't show any bias against e-cigarettes, why does it repeatedly call them tobacco products? There is no tobacco.
"The sharp rise of e-cigarettes, together with a substantial increase in the use of hookah pipes, led to 400,000 additional young people using a tobacco product"
...
"making the act of puffing on a tobacco product normal again''
i
"The sharp rise of e-cigarettes, together with a substantial increase in the use of hookah pipes, led to 400,000 additional young people using a tobacco product"
...
"making the act of puffing on a tobacco product normal again''
i
12
Is this really any surprise?
1) Kids aged 10 to 18 are the primary targets of *all* non-pharmaceutical drug marketing.
2) Kids who vape get to "smoke" without coming home smelling like ashtrays.
3) Vaping began as a cannabis-use method... so kids think it's cool.
Seriously. I predicted this 10 years ago, and I'm sure not as "market savvy" as anyone in the commercial "legal drug" industry.
3)
1) Kids aged 10 to 18 are the primary targets of *all* non-pharmaceutical drug marketing.
2) Kids who vape get to "smoke" without coming home smelling like ashtrays.
3) Vaping began as a cannabis-use method... so kids think it's cool.
Seriously. I predicted this 10 years ago, and I'm sure not as "market savvy" as anyone in the commercial "legal drug" industry.
3)
"...3) Vaping began as a cannabis-use method... so kids think it's cool..."
Bet most kids who vape don't know that.
Bet most kids who vape don't know that.
I hope both the author and readers are aware that you can buy e-cigs and vapor liquid without any nicotine in them at all. I quit smoking at age 40 after smoking for 25 years, first buy vaping at 18 mg nicotine levels and weening myself down to 0 mg. Now Iu vap because I enjoy it, not because of nicotine addiction.
You'll find that many of those who vap don't use the nicotine varieties at all.
You'll find that many of those who vap don't use the nicotine varieties at all.
6
Don't care. If you vape you are emitting a vapor and I am exposed to it.
You are sucking up car fumes and toxic waste from chemical plants, I bet you just love a roaring fire in your fireplace too...tell the truth, this is all about control, you feel powerful when you can make other people suffer... since the whole 'exposed to vapor' thing is nothing but a lie.
3
Well, make sure you avoid most concerts, magic shows, dance halls, etc. They use fog machines which are basically giant e-cigs. You're uninformed, conformationally biased, and prejudiced against facts, kinda like republicans who think climate change is a hoax.
1
"bringing the share of high school students who use them to 13 percent" This is how far I got into the article before I hit this massaged statistic. How often? Measured by whom?
I'm against people in the age of minority vaping but can we keep things empirical please Mr. or Ms. Editor?
This is the Times after all.
I'm against people in the age of minority vaping but can we keep things empirical please Mr. or Ms. Editor?
This is the Times after all.
1
I completely agree about statistics and the teenager. My children are required to fill out a MetroWest Health survey every year which questions them about their behaviors. High schoolers are mixed about accurate reporting but middle schoolers? They claim the most outrageous behaviors and these are then tallied and used as the statistics about risk taking behavior.
That said, my son (13) has friends who vape, supposedly without nicotine.
That said, my son (13) has friends who vape, supposedly without nicotine.
What I really want to know is this:
Assuming the USA is honest in its pursuit of "ridding society of addictive drugs"... why on *earth* is the DEA not being tasked to hound "e-cig" manufacturers into extinction in exactly the way they've been trying to do with cannabis (a non-addictive drug) for the past 80 years?
Don't get me wrong: I'm a 40-year+ Cannabis user and I've smoked tobacco for a couple of years longer... but the reality of this "drug use" thing (tobacco has killed many hundreds of thousands and cannabis has killed *no one* in those 40+ years) makes US drug policy more than Kafka-esque.
Considering that US Cannabis is almost as big a cash-crop as tobacco... perhaps bigger... the only difference between the two is who's getting paid for it.
Assuming the USA is honest in its pursuit of "ridding society of addictive drugs"... why on *earth* is the DEA not being tasked to hound "e-cig" manufacturers into extinction in exactly the way they've been trying to do with cannabis (a non-addictive drug) for the past 80 years?
Don't get me wrong: I'm a 40-year+ Cannabis user and I've smoked tobacco for a couple of years longer... but the reality of this "drug use" thing (tobacco has killed many hundreds of thousands and cannabis has killed *no one* in those 40+ years) makes US drug policy more than Kafka-esque.
Considering that US Cannabis is almost as big a cash-crop as tobacco... perhaps bigger... the only difference between the two is who's getting paid for it.
3
Thats easy Michael, Nicotine doesn't impair judgment or motor skills. It may be addictive but so what? So is coffee, food, chocolate, exercise, sex, you name it.
8
EXACTLY! and it is no one's business what Americans want to put in their bodies, suicide is not illegal and if some of us want to take the scenic route, that is also no one elses business.
The exact same people screaming about 'The Nanny State' when they want an excuse to starve children to death and cut out all healthcare funding are all suddenly so worried about the health of other people that they want to set up a huge bureaucracy to monitor everything we ingest.
What they gonna do, hire a million more cops to handle the arrests of smokers and vapers?
All of this is one HUGE LIE, it is all bout the power trip they get from being able to force people to do stuff they don't want to do like quit smoking.
The exact same people screaming about 'The Nanny State' when they want an excuse to starve children to death and cut out all healthcare funding are all suddenly so worried about the health of other people that they want to set up a huge bureaucracy to monitor everything we ingest.
What they gonna do, hire a million more cops to handle the arrests of smokers and vapers?
All of this is one HUGE LIE, it is all bout the power trip they get from being able to force people to do stuff they don't want to do like quit smoking.
1
Vaping products sold in an actual vape shop are NOT made by big tobacco. In fact, big tobacco is trying to shut down these shops because they are losing thousands of customers to vaping. While I will admit that vaping is not healthy, it is less harmful than actual tobacco. Also vaping products have no tobacco in them so why are they called tobacco products? If you want to look into the regulations being proposed by governments you'll see that things like 18650 batteries, which are commonly used for flashlights, will be put into the category of a tobacco product because they have come to be used for this purpose. Do you really think a battery should be considered a tobacco product? Your answer should be no, and just as ridiculous as batteries being considered a tobacco product is vaping products being considered a tobacco product.
7
Serious mistake here -- e-cigs are not a "tobacco product." They have varying amounts of nicotine (from zero to 24mg), but are NOT tobacco products, any more than nicotine gum or the cessation patch.
I am surprised that this common misperception survived the author's research.
I am surprised that this common misperception survived the author's research.
10
I agree 100%. So what if nicotine is derived from tobacco? Nicotine can be synthesized in a laboratory without any plant material.
Nicotine is no more a tobacco product than vitamin C is a citrus product.
E-cigs contain no tobacco, create no smoke and have nothing to do with tobacco cigarettes.
Nicotine is no more a tobacco product than vitamin C is a citrus product.
E-cigs contain no tobacco, create no smoke and have nothing to do with tobacco cigarettes.
6
Nicotine is a poison, what part of that don't you understand?
Everything is a poison in large enough doses...what part of that don't you understand? Perhaps you have evidence that the doses present are harmful in ecigs?
4
Okay, so if you're so scared of that "poisonous" nicotine, you better avoid eating tomatoes, potatoes, peppers, cauliflower, just to name a few other plants that have high nicotine content.
The problem is YOU don't understand basic chemistry.
The problem is YOU don't understand basic chemistry.
I do not support the use of the e-cigarette. The next think they will want is the e-joint! I don't believe anyone, especially the youth of America, should be smoking anything! The youth of America are the future leaders of our nation. Do we want smokers leading our nation? I don't. Do you?
1
I live and work in NYC. I vape. I have NEVER seen a teenager out of thousands of people I see everyday vaping. They are always smoking cigarettes. If I go to a vape shop, anytime someone under 18 has come in, they have been carded and kicked out. I regularly go to the shop in this article. If I don't go to the vapor shop, I might see 1 or 2 other people (out of literally hundreds upon hundreds of real smokers) vaping. And they are usually in their late 20s or early 30s and have quit using the products. People always bash and are afraid of what they don't understand. There is just as much positive research as negative. And the negative is always described as "potential".
The quotes from teens sound like a vape-marketer's dream. I'm a bit shocked that everyone seems to think that these are safe, healthy, cool, and non-threatening. E-cigarettes seem to have shed ALL of the stigma of smoking.
Dear teens, three things: one, e-cigs are still delivering a drug, one that you might use to self-medicate the stress of adolescence when instead you should be learning to cope with your feelings in productive ways; two, you will still end up addicted and I predict that nobody will think these are cool in a decade; three, nobody is making sure that there aren't harmful additives in these liquids, and I can't think of a single product like this that didn't have some harmful unintended consequences. Buyer beware, indeed.
Dear teens, three things: one, e-cigs are still delivering a drug, one that you might use to self-medicate the stress of adolescence when instead you should be learning to cope with your feelings in productive ways; two, you will still end up addicted and I predict that nobody will think these are cool in a decade; three, nobody is making sure that there aren't harmful additives in these liquids, and I can't think of a single product like this that didn't have some harmful unintended consequences. Buyer beware, indeed.
3
This is so much a dad lecture - uninformed, patronizing, scolding - what's not to ignore?
I suspect within 10 years maximum, we will find e-cigarettes as harmful or even MORE harmful than regular cigarettes. We're going to see a generation of then 20somethings crippled up with emphysema if not lung cancer itself.
Once upon a time, it was cool to smoke. I smoked very heavily for about a year & a half because I desperately wanted to be "cool."
And when all this comes to light, we will see lawsuits by the thousands on behalf of those crippled w/emphysema or other respiratory diseases and/or cancers. When, indeed, will we ever learn? Or will we....
Once upon a time, it was cool to smoke. I smoked very heavily for about a year & a half because I desperately wanted to be "cool."
And when all this comes to light, we will see lawsuits by the thousands on behalf of those crippled w/emphysema or other respiratory diseases and/or cancers. When, indeed, will we ever learn? Or will we....
2
E-cigs have already been around for 10 years. There are smokers who quit 10 years ago using these products. The people commenting on this article actually think the ADULTS that use these products have not looked into them at all? They think we have done no research. There is no tar in vapor. There is no carbon monoxide. There is no formaldehyde even though the NEJM and news media came out with that scare tactic (unless of course your heat the liquid to a degree that its impossible to inhale). There are not even close the the amounts of toxins in cigarettes. Rayon, arsenic, etc. All you right wingers who are commenting on here probably don't know that most of the GOP backs these products. Boehner was key in relegating that the government could not move the grandfathering date for open system products back to 2007 which would have effectively destroyed the market. Goes to show the electorate has no idea what they are voting for. Go to CASAA.org if you don't believe me.
As a grown woman who started smoking at the age of 12 because it was "cool" to my peers and what they were doing, I am appalled. It tool me almost a decade to quit at age 30 and I will probably still die of a smacking related illness. Why can't we encourage healthy habits-- diet, fun sports, reading? This is just the capitalist market finding a way back into our children. Its awful. Addiction is not a good habit to create in kids. They are so vulnerable and just not mature enough to make decisions about their health.
4
As a parent, If I could pick something for my teenager to experiment with, this would be it.
4
As a former smoker I know tobacco addiction well. For the better part of fifteen years on an almost daily basis I gave money to big tobacco. Because of this technology they have not got a penny from me in almost two years. Adds up to at least $2500. I hope their bean counters noticed. Many people don't understand that big tobacco is not at all a part of the vaping trend. I see the vape stuff tobacco sells in gas stations and it's a joke. Nonsmokers will never understand what it's like to be a smoker. It's awful. I doubt they can understand vaping. It's liberating. There is a lot more than just nicotine going on in a cigarette that keeps you coming back.
5
The report begins by saying little is known about the long-term e-cigarettes. Yet it concludes quoting David Abrams who claims they are not a gateway to cigarettes but rather a gateway out. How does he know? What to believe here?
Believe Dr. Abrahams. There is abundant evidence that E-cigs are indeed a gateway from tobacco and virtually no evidence to the contrary. I'll never smoke another cigarette again.
4
You've just read the latest data on the subject. Or did you?
I quit a 16 year 2 pack a day tobacco habit.. spending 300 a month on cancer sticks.. started vaping. never ever looked back.. started at 34 mg nic. weened down over the 6 years to zero nic.. I still love vaping the flavors << as instead of a real cheesecake. I vape some blueberry cheescake e juice after dinner.. So far lost 50 pounds.. I will NOT lose my freedom to vape because of gov idiots. or an ignorant public.. nor because of stupid teens. Vaping has so far saved my health... and also 15 grand (over 6 years) not buying cancer sticks from big tobacco. or funding the gov thru taxes applied to them.... God Bless freedom and the USA !!!!!!!
2
Corporations are obligated to produce profit without violating the law. With sufficient lobby influence laws can yield.
Addicted consumers are idea since they lack free will. Without some moral clause, there won't be any changes in corporate culture.
Addicted consumers are idea since they lack free will. Without some moral clause, there won't be any changes in corporate culture.
Corporations are not legally required to produce profits as you say. That is a mantra used by CEOs who don't want to follow the law. It'll hurt profits; change it! But don't worry TPP will change all that; coprations will just go to a friend arbitration panel whose only charge will be to protect corproate profits. Fright the TPP and regulate e cigarettes.
As a passive smoker (and admit it - almost all of us are forced, willingly or not, into that category) - I agree that these devices are much less noxious than the wretched plumes of toxic waste emitted by conventional cigarettes. If they remain free of all those added chemicals, chances are they will be shown to be safer over time. And their effectiveness in decreasing nicotine addiction needs to be taken seriously and studied in detail.
But the skeptics' concerns are legitimate. Many of these are being manufactured and encouraged by the same dirtbags in the tobacco industry who lied about the health effects of their products until open court proceedings forced that out of them.
And COPD and lung cancer require years of epidemiological data to attribute causation.
Because these products have the unfortunate distinction of being made by traditional tobacco manufacturers, there will remain a shroud of skepticism over their benefits. It's therefore incumbent upon their manufacturers to commit to transparent research aimed at uncovering their benefits and harms and, especially, to prevent every one of the hundreds of known poisons used to make cigarettes more addictive from ever finding their way into these devices.
But the skeptics' concerns are legitimate. Many of these are being manufactured and encouraged by the same dirtbags in the tobacco industry who lied about the health effects of their products until open court proceedings forced that out of them.
And COPD and lung cancer require years of epidemiological data to attribute causation.
Because these products have the unfortunate distinction of being made by traditional tobacco manufacturers, there will remain a shroud of skepticism over their benefits. It's therefore incumbent upon their manufacturers to commit to transparent research aimed at uncovering their benefits and harms and, especially, to prevent every one of the hundreds of known poisons used to make cigarettes more addictive from ever finding their way into these devices.
2
Transparent research? That won't happen. Never does. At least as to second hand exposure and underage use e cigs should be strictly regulated.
Tobacco companies were very slow to enter this market and are responsible for less than 5% of it. So y'all can relax about that.
90% of people who use these products don't use the products offered by big tobacco that you see in corner stores and gas stations. That is what people don't understand. Big tobacco is against e-cigs because they are losing market share. They want the only option to be the inferior and potentially more dangerous products made in China, rather than the open system reusable tanks and batteries made in the good ol' USA. Go figure, now everyone wants to snuff out new American businesses as well. If you want teenagers to use e-cigs from China, let the real vape equipment be banned. Then you probably will see health problems. Shame on the NY Times for more fear mongering with this article.
1
My daughter got into her 'vape'. I am totally not trustful of what it is, but at first I admitted I was surprised that there could be smoke with no odor. Which apparently emboldened her to start sneaking vape time in her room. Although it doesn't have the smell you associate with cigarettes, within an hour or two, it does produce the smell I associate with a 1970s bowling alley, which must be nicotine residue. So the notion that it's odorless isn't true at all. It doesn't have a pronounced immediate odor, the way a burning cigarette does, but over time something builds up and stinks just the same.
6
but over time something builds up and stinks just the same....
I'm sure my wife would say the same about my cooking.
Vapers will be quick to tell you it is not smoke, it is water vapor. Which is correct. No combustion = no smoke.
I'm sure my wife would say the same about my cooking.
Vapers will be quick to tell you it is not smoke, it is water vapor. Which is correct. No combustion = no smoke.
No, its not correct. The mist may not be the result of burning but it is most assuredly not water vapor. Testing has show tht their are other materials in it. Those materilas or compunds are what produces the smell and that is what nonusers inhale. I don't want to inhale them. E Cigs need to be regulated like cigarettes, not because they are cigarettes but because they are drug deliver devices and because they expose nonusers to possible risks.
As an addiction psychiatrist pretty well informed on this subject I totally agree with Dr Frieden.
Clever how the tobacco industry is getting kids hooked on nicotine with e-cigs and hookahs. Sooner or later many or even most of them will be hooked on tobacco instead.
We need a massive public information campaign to prevent this.
Clever how the tobacco industry is getting kids hooked on nicotine with e-cigs and hookahs. Sooner or later many or even most of them will be hooked on tobacco instead.
We need a massive public information campaign to prevent this.
11
I am not sure how you can make the leap from the available data to the assumption that "sooner or later" most will be hooked on tobacco instead. Why would they. If alternatives to tobacco are kept less expensive than cigarettes themselves there will be no reason to make that switch. They are saying they find regular cigarettes "gross" etc. It's nice that you think you are "well informed" but there really is very little long term data out there on how the usage of e-cigs will evolve.
The products these kids are using were more than likely purchased in a vape shop which sells none of the products made by big tobacco. The only products made by big tobacco for vaping are the products you see in walmart or gas stations like blu or mark 10. An actual clearomizer or RDA system bought online or at a shop was made by an independent person and sold at a store owned by someone who more than likely was a former smoker and opposes big tobacco. We don't need vaping regulations, we need tobacco regulations.
Clearly it's better to pay money to an addiction professional than quit smoking using a cheap and legal e-cig.
Think of those poor addiction professionals and their lost business.
Think of those poor addiction professionals and their lost business.
1
This is not news to uptown Manhattan dwellers, where every restaurant turns into a thumping nightclub at night and all of them offer hookah. It's hated by many but beloved by the users, who tend to be young. The feds need to get on top of regulating hookah out of existence before everyone ends up back in Marlboro Country (with the cancer, but minus the cigarette).
2
Judging by the chart, most of the increase in e cigarette use has been at the expense of smoking -- either kids who were trying to quit, or kids who would otherwise have taken up smoking. So how is this anything but a positive development? What is negative here is the increasing use of hookahs, which are known to be harmful.
Of course, as time goes on, we may see kids starting on e cigarettes who would not have started smoking, owing to the perception that they aren't as risky. Well, such is life. If the public health establishment wants to deal with this, we will see more research now on the health effects of e cigarette use, either to reduce whatever risk there turns out to be or if the risks turn out to be significant and unavoidable, to discourage kids from taking up the habit.
But for now I don't see any reason to panic. These kids could be doing things that are far, far worse, including not just regular cigarettes but heavy drinking and drug use. Would you rather see your kid vape e cigarettes or suffer a permanent IQ loss from marijuana?
Of course, as time goes on, we may see kids starting on e cigarettes who would not have started smoking, owing to the perception that they aren't as risky. Well, such is life. If the public health establishment wants to deal with this, we will see more research now on the health effects of e cigarette use, either to reduce whatever risk there turns out to be or if the risks turn out to be significant and unavoidable, to discourage kids from taking up the habit.
But for now I don't see any reason to panic. These kids could be doing things that are far, far worse, including not just regular cigarettes but heavy drinking and drug use. Would you rather see your kid vape e cigarettes or suffer a permanent IQ loss from marijuana?
7
Permanent IQ loss? Sources please.
With the exception of your reference to "marijuana" (and the long-discredited brain-damage association), you're absolutely right.
No, I'm not advocating cannabis use... it's a personal choice people should be free to make on their own with *all* the facts behind them... but I've used the stuff myself for more than 40 years (since 1972 at age 12), and I really don't think anyone's likely to say that my 145 IQ would be higher if I hadn't done that.
No, I'm not advocating cannabis use... it's a personal choice people should be free to make on their own with *all* the facts behind them... but I've used the stuff myself for more than 40 years (since 1972 at age 12), and I really don't think anyone's likely to say that my 145 IQ would be higher if I hadn't done that.
1
Actually there is recent research supporting the hypothesis that marijuana affects the growing brain. Unfortunately I have yet to learn had with to copy links on my awful King node Fire so c a not supply sources b u t google it and you should focus nd t he research
Wow! When I was a teenager the attraction of cigarettes (whcih I never smoked other than as an experiment) was that they were "cool". The flame, the exhaled smoke (and the things you could make it do, like smoke rings), the glamour (all the movie stars smoked them!). The e-cigarette seems about as uncool and unglamorous as anything I could imagine. And it causes cancer just like the old fashioned kind.
2
Your post made me laugh in a good way. With two teens I cay say with authority I am no longer in a position to determine what is cool.
1
Show me any source or research by a doctor that links these to cancer.
1
There is no basis to claim that vaping causes cancer. Totally unwarranted statement, devoid of evidentiary support.
2
These addictive nicotine delivery systems should be regulated just like regular cigarettes and taxed too.
Nothing like an addictive product for corporate profits. Adding sweet flavors to attract youth. And assume this is spreadng all over the world. Where are our government agencies? Have libertarian absolutists thrown so much dust in their eyes that they can no longer see?
Maybe health care ("Obamacare") should simply stop paying for health needs of smokers. But young people wont care because they usually think they are immortal. But they are not and neither are we and neither are our loved ones.
Nothing like an addictive product for corporate profits. Adding sweet flavors to attract youth. And assume this is spreadng all over the world. Where are our government agencies? Have libertarian absolutists thrown so much dust in their eyes that they can no longer see?
Maybe health care ("Obamacare") should simply stop paying for health needs of smokers. But young people wont care because they usually think they are immortal. But they are not and neither are we and neither are our loved ones.
1
Is addiction your only criteria? Coffee is in trouble.
1
At least with tobacco you are dealing with a full blown addiction. You would also have health care not pay for other addictions such as the costs of alcoholism?
It would make more sense to not pay for the health care of those who ride motorcycles without helmets or those that engage in unsafe sex, or play tackle football?
Is that the way you see health care in the US?
It would make more sense to not pay for the health care of those who ride motorcycles without helmets or those that engage in unsafe sex, or play tackle football?
Is that the way you see health care in the US?
These products were not made by big tobacco. Don't you see that the only vaping products that will be left after regulations by the government are going to be made by big tobacco? Any products sold in an actual private vape shop were not made by big tobacco and do not have the billions of dollars that big tobacco does. That means the companies that are actually successful for the moment without these proposed regulations will be forced to shut down as they go bankrupt, while millions of people who managed to finally stop smoking are forced to either go back to the products that were killing them in the first place or switch to a product made by the company that was killing them.
2
If the NYT is going to pick on an industry, how about beer, wine or liquor instead of this continual drumbeat against e-cigs and legal marijuana?
The beer and vineyard clans are responsible for more deaths, disease and other ills than just about any other product on store shelves today -- yet their business leaders and family connections are treated as socialites and VIPs by media outlets. Where's the perspective?
The beer and vineyard clans are responsible for more deaths, disease and other ills than just about any other product on store shelves today -- yet their business leaders and family connections are treated as socialites and VIPs by media outlets. Where's the perspective?
11
E-cigs are unlikely to be a gateway out of smoking. The combined data from all available population studies find that e-cigs REDUCE quitting smoking, by about 30%:
https://tobacco.ucsf.edu/meta-analysis-all-available-population-studies-...
https://tobacco.ucsf.edu/meta-analysis-all-available-population-studies-...
3
I stopped smoking completely from using them and know many others who have. Just not by using the products offered by big tobacco. We use open systems, with USA made products. That have great flavor and the ability to choose what nicotine level you use so that you can cut it down. And no, it doesn't taste like cigarettes.
What's the argument in favor of nicotine addiction?
3
What is the argument for restricting a product that is orders of magnitude safer than the legally available far more dangerous product that kills millions of people worldwide every year?
1
E cigs are drug delivery devices and should be regulated as such. Because they emit a vapor ( not just water vapor) which poses a second hand threat to non users they shoulda be regulated like other smoking materials. No users should not have to bear the burden of someone else's use.
So much for not selling to minors...................................
The modern cigarette as we know it was itself a product of technological innovation to make the consumption of tobacco more efficient, streamlined, regularized. I do not see why we should start crying foul now, unless one secretly believes we should just cry foul, period.
Not in that camp, sorry. Prohibitions do not work.
Not in that camp, sorry. Prohibitions do not work.
5
Correct prohibitions do not work. The war on drugs is proof of that.
But anti smoking regs, indoor clean air acts, and higher taxes do work.
Today with a serious addiction only about 19 percent of the U.S. adult population is a tobacco smoker.
Not all that long ago it was 50 percent.
We don't need prohibition. Just tax the addicts and make them stand out in the freezing cold like lepers and in time they quit.
But anti smoking regs, indoor clean air acts, and higher taxes do work.
Today with a serious addiction only about 19 percent of the U.S. adult population is a tobacco smoker.
Not all that long ago it was 50 percent.
We don't need prohibition. Just tax the addicts and make them stand out in the freezing cold like lepers and in time they quit.
I wish there had been e-cigs when I was in High School. I would have quit smoking cancer sticks long before I did.
This is all about the big tobacco companies losing money, and States losing their yearly tobacco settlement money. What the states & the Feds aren't looking at, is the BILLIONS of dollars in savings in Medicare and Medicaid. Like the article talks about smoking related deaths each year, which doesn't include the years of healthcare with lung diseased patients.
The two main ingredients in e-juice is propylene glycol and vegetable glycerine. PG has been use in Asthma inhalers for 50 years, so they know that doesn't cause any health problems. Vegetable glycerine is in most foods we eat, and since VG & PG are not incinerated, but rather a vapor, it's chemical properties don't change.
Make no mistake, this is all about Money, and nothing to do with health, and they know it.
This is all about the big tobacco companies losing money, and States losing their yearly tobacco settlement money. What the states & the Feds aren't looking at, is the BILLIONS of dollars in savings in Medicare and Medicaid. Like the article talks about smoking related deaths each year, which doesn't include the years of healthcare with lung diseased patients.
The two main ingredients in e-juice is propylene glycol and vegetable glycerine. PG has been use in Asthma inhalers for 50 years, so they know that doesn't cause any health problems. Vegetable glycerine is in most foods we eat, and since VG & PG are not incinerated, but rather a vapor, it's chemical properties don't change.
Make no mistake, this is all about Money, and nothing to do with health, and they know it.
17
We're going to have the same debate with the new generation of automobiles. They're going to reduce the number of accidents and deaths significantly, but people are still going to complain whenever there's a death or an accident involving a self-driving automobile.
4
Regarding autos, how can your assertion that automated travel will be safer be tested? How many lives are we willing to risk implementing the technology? Then how long is the study period to determine if it is "safe enough"?
Hey, we live in an imperfect world, which is perfectly alright with me!
6
When I was considering beginning to smoke 70 years ago, a friend told me he smoked because it gave him something to do with his hands in a social situation. Today's kids have I-Phones and equivalents, maybe even more addictive. Why do they need cigarettes or E-cigs?
2
Tobacco is a major addiction.
The issue is hardly what to do with your hands.
The issue is hardly what to do with your hands.
[C]ould we quit the 'bashing' for a (mo)ment Please.(i)ask this sincerely to you and try to truthfully answer Exactly how many different United States STATES will do allow or have VERY liberal (A)ttitudes To USE and or Medical USE of Cannabis. i say this with a straight face kids -Carcinogens PARENTS Educators."THE addicting? chemical? on the Tobacco cigarette does is what caused causes(US,i,you,them,etc)to be-come "hooked" and "addicted"?. let us Flash forward to NOW - there's a 'good-bad' dichotomy here. Vaping is not 'smoking' as it used to be known. IT's vapor that can does not having to be inhaled although some do. Most select a "flavored" e-juice with perhaps an (i)ncrement of some specific level of nicotine or better none. Lots of "vapers" aspire and intend to be at 0 nic and eventually will stop vaping all-together. Really. Now the big lie is that nicotine (is?) as addictive? as a form of opium street named 'Heroin' or harder to quit? I SAY witness all of the 'true statements' of the "vaping community at large et. al."i [W]E don't have to deny that addiction to nicotine was is our 'pandora' 'albatross' 'sword' Not always by choice. Also it's Not un-thinkable that REAL people i.e. (A)lco-holics or (O)piod patients or other real people can be "addicted"? Almost anything can we become addicted to. So they say.? living in denial is not my option or intent. WE quiters no longer stench up your our fellow beings environment selves etc,etc. Vaping nicotine' is MY least worry
2
It doesn't matter whether the nicotine came from tobacco, tomatoes or potatoes, it is a potent neuroTOXIN. Its LD50 is 50-60 MILLIGRAMS for a typical human--this is why so many children have suffered severe poisonings and deaths thru accidental ingestion of these liquid nicotine preparations. Why any "scientist" would not class nicotine along with the other hazardous substances present in cigarettes is a mystery to me. HELLO, nicotine is roughly as toxic as STRYCHNINE. And what does it do to teenage brain developement?
E-cigs are nothing but a way for the tobacco companies to continue making money at the expense of others' health. They should be heavily regulated and taxed. And EPA, if you're listening--nicotine is a highly regulated waste, so consider hitting up some of these vaping stores to ask them how they rid themselves of out-dated chemicals that have to be handled by a Hazmat waste company, not dumped down the drain...
E-cigs are nothing but a way for the tobacco companies to continue making money at the expense of others' health. They should be heavily regulated and taxed. And EPA, if you're listening--nicotine is a highly regulated waste, so consider hitting up some of these vaping stores to ask them how they rid themselves of out-dated chemicals that have to be handled by a Hazmat waste company, not dumped down the drain...
5
You're completely wrong about big tobacco trying to make money from E cigs. The E cigs offered by tobacco companies are so inferior to what is being offered by dozens of small companies that one is tempted to believe they are trying to sabotage the vaping industry.
Nicotine does NOTHING to the development of the brain,. That is the propaganda that is put out on the government press releases. What really slows the development of brain function is LACK OF OXYGEN, lack of oxygen comes from inhaling SMOKE or some other medical condition i.e. asthma.
If you followed the Vapor industry or knew what you were talking about there are NO outdated e-liquids at any vape store. They usually sell out of most liquid products they carry within 2 days of receiving shipment.
Also , I read somewhere on the internet that water was the leading cause of drowning, Are we gonna ban that too?
If you followed the Vapor industry or knew what you were talking about there are NO outdated e-liquids at any vape store. They usually sell out of most liquid products they carry within 2 days of receiving shipment.
Also , I read somewhere on the internet that water was the leading cause of drowning, Are we gonna ban that too?
HELLO. Your comment is very misleading.
First, you are using old figures for nicotine toxicity. Per recent research, these figures appear to be the result of recycling 19th Century figures. From Mayer's 2014 article: "Nicotine is a toxic compound that should be handled with care, but the frequent warnings of potential fatalities caused by ingestion of small amounts of tobacco products or diluted nicotine-containing solutions are unjustified and need to be revised in light of overwhelming data indicating that more than 0.5 g of oral nicotine is required to kill an adult." Of course, 0.5g is 500mg, not 50-60.
Second, let's get real. LD50 for caffeine is 150mg, in the same range you cite.
Third, Botulism toxin is 0.000001 mg/kg. Now THAT's toxic.
Indeed, water is toxic -- 6 liters will kill you.
With your logic, you gotta ban everything.
First, you are using old figures for nicotine toxicity. Per recent research, these figures appear to be the result of recycling 19th Century figures. From Mayer's 2014 article: "Nicotine is a toxic compound that should be handled with care, but the frequent warnings of potential fatalities caused by ingestion of small amounts of tobacco products or diluted nicotine-containing solutions are unjustified and need to be revised in light of overwhelming data indicating that more than 0.5 g of oral nicotine is required to kill an adult." Of course, 0.5g is 500mg, not 50-60.
Second, let's get real. LD50 for caffeine is 150mg, in the same range you cite.
Third, Botulism toxin is 0.000001 mg/kg. Now THAT's toxic.
Indeed, water is toxic -- 6 liters will kill you.
With your logic, you gotta ban everything.
3
Not sure I get the hand-wringing about the "evils" of nicotine. I've been addicted to another stimulant, caffeine, since I was twelve, and I'm hardly alone. People need to ease up. Also, it's quite a nice change walking around my college campus now and catching the occasional whiff of strawberry-scented vapor instead of having disgusting cigarette smoke blown back in my face.
16
I really wish folks would do some basic research before writing about vaping.
Vaping is not tobacco use. There is a very tiny percentage of e-liquids (the substances used in vaporizers) that use small amounts of flavoring extracted from tobacco, but most don't.
Distinguish between the types of vaporizers out there. The ones being pushed by big tobacco and other large corporations are overpriced, nasty tasting, unsatisfying devices with short battery lives and little or no control over the power level of the device. There are many devices now available that deliver regulated power and a satisfying experience that is much more likely to get people off smoking - and they are getting cheaper every month.
Why do we start with the assumption that we must find a way to regulate vaping? There are so many things readily available that are harmful to our bodies and the environment in a major way that are accepted as part of daily life - from the foods we eat to the cars we drive. Shouldn't there be some kind of threshold of evidence of harm before we start solving a problem that may not exist with regulation? Big tobacco and big pharma would like nothing more than to see a complex set of regulations on the vaping industry, because they have been beaten to market by a host of small companies who are agile and responsive to their customers. Most of these companies would be out of business if required to jump through an obstacle course of regulatory hoops.
Vaping is not tobacco use. There is a very tiny percentage of e-liquids (the substances used in vaporizers) that use small amounts of flavoring extracted from tobacco, but most don't.
Distinguish between the types of vaporizers out there. The ones being pushed by big tobacco and other large corporations are overpriced, nasty tasting, unsatisfying devices with short battery lives and little or no control over the power level of the device. There are many devices now available that deliver regulated power and a satisfying experience that is much more likely to get people off smoking - and they are getting cheaper every month.
Why do we start with the assumption that we must find a way to regulate vaping? There are so many things readily available that are harmful to our bodies and the environment in a major way that are accepted as part of daily life - from the foods we eat to the cars we drive. Shouldn't there be some kind of threshold of evidence of harm before we start solving a problem that may not exist with regulation? Big tobacco and big pharma would like nothing more than to see a complex set of regulations on the vaping industry, because they have been beaten to market by a host of small companies who are agile and responsive to their customers. Most of these companies would be out of business if required to jump through an obstacle course of regulatory hoops.
32
There is no point in trying to reason with these people. They don't understand. Support CASAA and fight for your freedom because as you can see, there are a ton of enemies here.
Within tobacco and the booze control programs there has at times been a gap between the public health folks and the born again anti's.
There are those that hate the activity more than the diseases they cause.
I hate one off personal stories as a means of proving anything as far as the larger picture. But I have heard far to many of these one off stories to discount them----- ecigs for many smokers have been a godsend.
A way for the smoker to quit smoking. An effective way in many instances. Far to many stories to discount.
Ecigs may not be the elusive safe cigarette in terms of completely and totally 100 percent safe. But shame on the public health community if they cave on this issue without strong evidence they are really unsafe.
Harm reduction should be the goal not perfection.
There are those that hate the activity more than the diseases they cause.
I hate one off personal stories as a means of proving anything as far as the larger picture. But I have heard far to many of these one off stories to discount them----- ecigs for many smokers have been a godsend.
A way for the smoker to quit smoking. An effective way in many instances. Far to many stories to discount.
Ecigs may not be the elusive safe cigarette in terms of completely and totally 100 percent safe. But shame on the public health community if they cave on this issue without strong evidence they are really unsafe.
Harm reduction should be the goal not perfection.
28
I smoked for many years, probably longer than most of the posters here have been alive, and have been delighted that someone finally came up with something that would wean me from that habit. I started vaping almost four years ago and have not had a cigarette since. The improvement in my health has been amazing, and the best part is that I enjoy it even when there is very little nicotine in the juice. If there are some side effects i haven't noticed them yet, but even if there were some, it could never be as bad as smoking. Anyone genuinely interested in the health of young people should rejoice at the news that teenagers are vaping instead of smoking. After nearly a decade of use, there is no evidence that vaping is not relatively harmless.
49
Though not mentioned in this article, it should be pointed out that e-cigs are essentially a drug delivery device that can be used to deliver other substances such as caffeine. In the future, the complexity of regulating e-cigs will be increased by the introduction of other unregulated substances into e-cigs that are marketed to young people. It would be better for begin to formulate how to regulate these products now, and to include the potential for chemicals other than nicotine.
1
@ Casey - "...can be used to deliver other substances such as caffeine. In the future, the complexity of regulating e-cigs will be increased by the introduction of other unregulated substances into e-cigs that are marketed to young people.
How many cups of coffee (caffeine) does the government ALLOW us mere citizens to have daily? Should the government have the power to regulate ALL of our activities?
How many cups of coffee (caffeine) does the government ALLOW us mere citizens to have daily? Should the government have the power to regulate ALL of our activities?
5
Why must "substances" be regulated, in the absence of evidence that they are harmful?
2
Coffee is not regulated because, after many, many studies, there is no evidence coffee causes cancer, heart disease, and other diseases. Cigarettes do cause life-threatening disease. Cigarettes are not illegal, but most restrictions are by state regulation so that non-smokers do not have to be affected. That's okay by me. What's not okay is the extra expense to everyone's health insurance because people want to suck smoke into their lungs. Same goes for vaping, which as a new "technology," does not really seem to have any benefit to our society except... Well, except what?
Our bodies were not created to process these foreign substances. There is no free lunch on using cigarettes or e-cigarettes. Neither are good you.
3
Our bodies are also not made to process cheetos or sodas. Should the government regulate that? People should be allowed to make their own choices, period.
4
Applause, applause.
The harm reduction in this shift from very harmful cigarettes to e-cigs is an extremely salutary landmark. And should be celebrated loudly as such.
To conflate the problematic nature of smoking cigarettes to e-cig use, which eliminate most of the harm of smoking (as Thomas Frieden of the CDC does) is as anti-scientific as any creationist or climate change denier.
And to blame it on Big Tobacco (again like Friedan) is merely a demagogic attempt to create a bogeyman for e-cigs, that is absolutely not founded in reality.
The harm reduction in this shift from very harmful cigarettes to e-cigs is an extremely salutary landmark. And should be celebrated loudly as such.
To conflate the problematic nature of smoking cigarettes to e-cig use, which eliminate most of the harm of smoking (as Thomas Frieden of the CDC does) is as anti-scientific as any creationist or climate change denier.
And to blame it on Big Tobacco (again like Friedan) is merely a demagogic attempt to create a bogeyman for e-cigs, that is absolutely not founded in reality.
31
People are missing the point. Ecigs are far less harmful than cigarettes and once you vape, you realize just HOW disgusting cigarettes taste. Just because it is still a vice, doesn't mean that it necessarily means certain death or destruction - and the comments that it is a "gateway" to cigarettes and meth are pure hysteria. People should be applauding the e-cig movement and the reduction in cigarette smokers. Humans are going to continue to seek the benefits of nicotine (relaxation, increased concentration, decrease in depression, social benefits) and it is far better to vape (or chew nicotine gum, which no one seems to have a problem with) than to burn and inhale additive-enhanced tobacco leaves. This is a step for the future, whether you like it or agree with it or not.
53
WON'T SOMEONE PLEASE THINK OF THE CHILDREN!!!!
E-cigs: the latest moral panic. I started smoking cigarettes at age 12 (redneck Kentucky upbringing). I bought my first E-cig in early 2012 and have smoked only a handful of cigarettes since. This thing is saving my life every single day.
E-cigs: the latest moral panic. I started smoking cigarettes at age 12 (redneck Kentucky upbringing). I bought my first E-cig in early 2012 and have smoked only a handful of cigarettes since. This thing is saving my life every single day.
31
I find it sad that there is so much confusion about a remarkable devise that truly enables addicted smokers quit smoking tobacco. I am also sad to say that SABRINA TAVERNISE has added to the confusion with this article. There is no such thing as e-cigarette tobacco use or smoke. It's not that hard to write correctly that e-cigarettes vapourize glycol and have no tobacco, and as they don't burn anything, they do not create smoke, they create vapour. This difference is extremely important in the discussion as the difference between smoking tobacco and vapourizing glycol has profound health implications. I've often heard that in the news business it is important not to bury the lead (meaning highlight what is really important). The 'last' line of this article states “They’re not a gateway in, and they might be accelerating the gateway out,” said David Abrams... That's the important truth about vaping. I wouldn't be surprised to see the tobacco industry try to discourage e-cig use in every way they can, especially with misinformation and restrictive laws for e-cigs.
18
Fully 1/3 of E-Cig users use 0% nicotine and "vape" for the flavoring. Most former smokers start out at 12-18% nicotine and work their way down to 0-4% nicotine within the first year.
I started using an E-Cig to stop smoking and still use it with 0% nicotine flavorings for the pleasurable experience and aromas.
My current favorite flavoring tastes and smells like Baklava but won't require me to buy new trousers if I overindulge.
I started using an E-Cig to stop smoking and still use it with 0% nicotine flavorings for the pleasurable experience and aromas.
My current favorite flavoring tastes and smells like Baklava but won't require me to buy new trousers if I overindulge.
23
Most smokers start when they are teens, despite it being illegal in most states for young teens to buy cigarettes. Now the tobacco companies have a back door in...
There is no good reason to ever smoke. It kills, it's expensive to treat, it harms people in your company, it starts fires, it is unnecessary. Lets get rid of it.
There is no good reason to ever smoke. It kills, it's expensive to treat, it harms people in your company, it starts fires, it is unnecessary. Lets get rid of it.
2
All the evidence is that e-cigs are the best way to get rid of real cigarettes.
1
Smoking is indeed bad for you. Vaping is not smoking. No combustion, no smoke.
Back door? Perhaps...Unless you've compared the experiences. As a former pack-and-a-half-a-day smoker, I can assure you there's a profound (and factual) difference.
The rush by either ignorant or overzealous 'regulators' to try and kill off something vastly preferable to smoking in terms of public health is sad, unhelpful and deeply misguided.
Back door? Perhaps...Unless you've compared the experiences. As a former pack-and-a-half-a-day smoker, I can assure you there's a profound (and factual) difference.
The rush by either ignorant or overzealous 'regulators' to try and kill off something vastly preferable to smoking in terms of public health is sad, unhelpful and deeply misguided.
Even if e-cigarettes are safe, nicotine is one of the most addictive substances known to humankind. Teenager desire to be edgy is one thing. Smoking these vape things is going to cause most all of them to become addicted to nicotine. Do they understand that? Once they get on that bandwagon, they will not be able to get off.
What's the point of chaining yourself to a substance that does nothing more than cause you to want more of it? Once the addition sets in, freedom of choice is lost. That's not edgy, that's stupid. Addiction of any kind should never be a choice for a teenager.
What's the point of chaining yourself to a substance that does nothing more than cause you to want more of it? Once the addition sets in, freedom of choice is lost. That's not edgy, that's stupid. Addiction of any kind should never be a choice for a teenager.
5
Risk reduction. Not perfection in the goal.
Your argument is a little like condoms. Why have condoms when no one should be having unsafe sex to begin with?
Why have comdoms when no one should be having sex with anyone but there one true uninfected partner?
If ecigs reduce morbidity and mortality and I have absolutely no doubt they do then only the moralist among us should have a beef. The public health folks should be supportive.
Your argument is a little like condoms. Why have condoms when no one should be having unsafe sex to begin with?
Why have comdoms when no one should be having sex with anyone but there one true uninfected partner?
If ecigs reduce morbidity and mortality and I have absolutely no doubt they do then only the moralist among us should have a beef. The public health folks should be supportive.
11
“This is another generation being hooked by the tobacco industry. It makes me angry.”
Oh my god. What is wrong with people? E-cigarettes are NOT a tobacco product! THEY CONTAIN ZERO TOBACCO! That's the whole point! No tobacco. No 1,200 toxins. That's why they're CLEARLY so much safer than cigarettes! These people are scientists and they don't know what's a tobacco product and what isn't?
We're doomed.
Oh my god. What is wrong with people? E-cigarettes are NOT a tobacco product! THEY CONTAIN ZERO TOBACCO! That's the whole point! No tobacco. No 1,200 toxins. That's why they're CLEARLY so much safer than cigarettes! These people are scientists and they don't know what's a tobacco product and what isn't?
We're doomed.
35
They do contain nicotine which is addictive.
2
Do they contain an addictive, physically harmful substance? Are they being marketed by the tobacco industry?
Defending a personal chemical delivery system which contains only one poison (possibly two) instead of 1200 is hardly based on intelligent science when it only takes one poison to kill you.
Defending a personal chemical delivery system which contains only one poison (possibly two) instead of 1200 is hardly based on intelligent science when it only takes one poison to kill you.
4
Like Khalil said, and you both just illustrated...We're doomed.
1
I spent 27 years as a lung research scientist and have over 330 scientific publications to my credit. One thing I learned in that time, do not put anything into your lungs other than clean air!
66
And exactly where can most of us find clean air? We live near the I95 corridor in CT and the diesel trucks and cars are blackening our lungs.
6
Please tell us, Mark, where in this world do you find clean air? Possibly where I live, far from urban congestion, but most people are putting pollutants into their lungs with every breath they take. All of it is far worse than propyline glycol or vegetable glycerine vapor.
7
"One thing I learned in that time, do not put anything into your lungs other than clean air!"
And just where are we supposed to find that!
And just where are we supposed to find that!
It seems these 'experts' always leave out the fact eCig 'juice' can be purchased without nicotine. Nearly any flavor offered has a zero nicotine alternative. But as long as tax dollars are being lost and tobacco companies feel the sting of lost profits, we will continue to hear the anti eCig rhetoric. The science over harms has been done. Look to a Time magazine story from Nov. 16, 1942 where the idea was to use the main ingredient of eJuice, propylene glycol, as a tool to combat grems in public places.
The only time these products pose a threat is if the product substandard. The safety of the juice is the only concern. all the US manufactures I know have very strict safety standards for their juice, but I can't speak for Chinese products.
The only time these products pose a threat is if the product substandard. The safety of the juice is the only concern. all the US manufactures I know have very strict safety standards for their juice, but I can't speak for Chinese products.
9
There is absolutely no evidence that e-cigarettes are safe; although, there are reports that e-cigarettes can vary widely in the amount of nicotine they contain, and that some may give off toxins.
We have the freedom to choose, which includes the freedom to be a human guinea pig. If e-cigarettes do turn out to be harmful, will those who support their use then demand compensation and health care?
We have the freedom to choose, which includes the freedom to be a human guinea pig. If e-cigarettes do turn out to be harmful, will those who support their use then demand compensation and health care?
3
There is plenty of evidence that e-cigs reduce harm, and are safer than cigarettes. Go to onvaping.com. If you are worried about people that vape using Federal aid for health problems and not smokers, (which pretty much everyone who is a vaper once was) then you are nuts.
17
The exact problem is that they may be less harmful, but not harmless. And people seem to be willing to go with the 'healthier' image on faith. I wasn't arguing that vaping folks will need medical care more than your garden-variety smoker; who knows? But while we're on the subject: http://www.theguardian.com/society/2015/feb/04/e-cigarettes-toxic-chemic...
2
There is also absolutely no evidence that vaping is not safe. In the absence of any such evidence, you have no argument. So far all research has shown that vaping is relatively safe, especially when compared to smoking or breathing what passes for air in urban environments.
8
Regardless if you are pro-E-Cig or con, you must acknowledge that WE DO NOT KNOW what the long term affects of these products will be.
I commonly hear "it's just water vapor".
No it's not. When people Vape around me I can smell it. If I can smell it, it's not just water vapor. It's water vapor and something else.
What is the long term affect of vaping "something" into one's lungs?
We don't know
For those of you saying "well many of these don't have nicotine!"
That's true. Which means that YOU also don't know what's in the vapor when someone next to you (or a teenager) is vaping.
Given that:
is it wise to create products that taste like Skittles, with cutesy names like "Unicorn Puke," and sell it to teenagers so that they can inhale it into their lungs?
If you are a smoker and want to try Vaping to stop smoking, all the power to you. But don't do it around me, because *I* don't want to inhale your Vapor exhale, regardless if you think it's safer for you.
But you can do this using a product that isn't labeled in an enticing way for little children. So let's label and market these as adult-only products
There really is no reason why we need to get these in the hands of kids.
I commonly hear "it's just water vapor".
No it's not. When people Vape around me I can smell it. If I can smell it, it's not just water vapor. It's water vapor and something else.
What is the long term affect of vaping "something" into one's lungs?
We don't know
For those of you saying "well many of these don't have nicotine!"
That's true. Which means that YOU also don't know what's in the vapor when someone next to you (or a teenager) is vaping.
Given that:
is it wise to create products that taste like Skittles, with cutesy names like "Unicorn Puke," and sell it to teenagers so that they can inhale it into their lungs?
If you are a smoker and want to try Vaping to stop smoking, all the power to you. But don't do it around me, because *I* don't want to inhale your Vapor exhale, regardless if you think it's safer for you.
But you can do this using a product that isn't labeled in an enticing way for little children. So let's label and market these as adult-only products
There really is no reason why we need to get these in the hands of kids.
4
And, what's important is that the impression that kids have now is that the products are safe. As you say: we just don't know.
1
So then why do you have nothing to say to the hundreds of smoker that walk by you every day assuming you live in a major city? Are you really more worried about vapor. Because we do know what is in the vapor. A lot of people make it themselves. VG, PG, flavorings (thats the smell) and nicotine or no nicotine.
7
Paul:
I absolutely hate it when I have to walk by a smoker in public areas, and thus I try to avoid areas with smokers.
But this article isn't about smokers. It's about Vapers.
It's also not about people trying to quit smoking by using E Cigs.
It's about High School Teenagers Vaping.
Thus, I restrict my comments to the topic at hand.
I absolutely hate it when I have to walk by a smoker in public areas, and thus I try to avoid areas with smokers.
But this article isn't about smokers. It's about Vapers.
It's also not about people trying to quit smoking by using E Cigs.
It's about High School Teenagers Vaping.
Thus, I restrict my comments to the topic at hand.
Meh. It's better not to smoke tobacco and to vaporize weed.
4
The FDA should be pushing a ban on e-cig advertising just like there is for cigarettes. That's a no-brainer. As it stands now, the tobacco makers have to be sitting back rubbing their hands together at the thought of these kids graduating to the real thing. If you think otherwise, then you're either a smoker or you're stupid. Pardon the redundancy.
1
You didn't read the article, or perhaps you just ignored the fact that there is no evidence that vaping leads to smoking. The evidence shows just the opposite, smokers are taking up vaping. Any one who genuinely cares about young peoples health should rejoice with this news. As a vaper who used to smoke and would never go back, I can assure you I am not stupid, and I do pay some attention to the evidence.
5
Vaping has not been around long enough to determine if it leads to long-term physical health issues or that its not a gateway drug. Neither of those facts is debatable.
For the sake of my generation, I certainly hope these under-regulated mystery liquids are safe. What I expect is that Millennials reach middle-age, a host of ailments will manifest, science will tie them to vaping, and history will repeat itself. Unregulated and under-regulated industries don't seem to have a great track record, even when the product is as innocuous as milk.
25
I haven't tried vaping milk yet, but I suspect it would produce a lot of mucous, which propylene glycol and vegetable glycerine vapor does not.
1
The ingredients in E-Cigs are the same ingredients used in many food products. The flavorings are literally the same as artificial flavorings used in products like Fruity Pebbles Cereal and Big Red Chewing Gum.
Not exactly "Health Food" but certainly not overtly toxic.
Not exactly "Health Food" but certainly not overtly toxic.
There's no mystery. The formulas are readily available online, and many people mix their own. I agree that there needs to be more testing, but please don't try to make it sound as if there's some kind of conspiracy going on. Good grief.
I ended a two-pack a day unfiltered Camels habit of fifty years 18 years ago. One of the things I liked best about smoking was the harsh bite of tars; the nicotine lift was important but the sharp little pain the tars produced was what I remember best. The bite of salt and pepper; the heat of chilies; the real burn of whiskey when you chug a shot—all the minor, manageable pain we get from our pleasures: the spice of our lives. One of the reasons experienced smokers don't flock to e-cigarettes is that nicotine, faux smoke and an LED glow are not enough.
4
I know *exactly* what you're talking about. Happily, with the latest vaping rigs you can get a very nice, satisfying hit to the lungs. You can go to, where else?, Reddit to find your way to these devices.
Wonderful Casey; but I'm so old now and after long cancer, heart failure including many rounds of chemo, radiation and a surgery plus three heart stents, a simple vape might be the end of me.
Please stop calling e-cigaretts and e-juice for a tobacco product. Its not.
6
Nicotine IS a tobacco product. It's extracted from the tobacco plant. That's why the tibacco industry is pushing it and fighting regulation.
2
Its actually made synthetically, and can be done from other plants.
5
"...though it fell within the margin of error."
You don't understand. An apparent change that falls within the margin of error is completely meaningless. It's not something to be noted parenthetically. It means that the trend that seems to be up is EQUALLY LIKELY to actually be down.
As we approach election season it becomes increasingly important for reporters and editors to learn this uncomfortable fact lest we see a spate of stories drawing erroneous conclusions followed by a pointless citation of the margin of error.
You don't understand. An apparent change that falls within the margin of error is completely meaningless. It's not something to be noted parenthetically. It means that the trend that seems to be up is EQUALLY LIKELY to actually be down.
As we approach election season it becomes increasingly important for reporters and editors to learn this uncomfortable fact lest we see a spate of stories drawing erroneous conclusions followed by a pointless citation of the margin of error.
7
Having been hooked on cigarettes during my high school years, and continuing to smoke until my 30's, I can say that young people are no match for the marketing of large corporations. Nicotine is a serious drug, with serious health consequences and real financial cost to users.
The article is missing an overall percentage of children who are using ANY nicotine delivery device in the last 30 days.
The article is missing an overall percentage of children who are using ANY nicotine delivery device in the last 30 days.
4
This is the best possible news. Kids are not monks. They're going to follow trends. Far better for it to be flavored vapes (which may often not even contain nicotine) than cigarettes. Vaping up? Smoking down? Churches should be filled on Sunday with parents giving thanks to the Almighty. Or whomever thought up this genius diversion.
25
No, kids are not monks.
They are also not idiots, but they are naive and impressionable.
Give them solid, non-judgmental information and many can make reasoned and reasonable decisions. Treat them like adopting some form of nicotine ingestion is inevitable - are you a 1950s tobacco ad exec? - and you are abrogating responsibility as a parent.
Do you also believe that all kids are destined to get into violent altercations?
What's your advice there? They carry boxing gloves ... or weapons?
They are also not idiots, but they are naive and impressionable.
Give them solid, non-judgmental information and many can make reasoned and reasonable decisions. Treat them like adopting some form of nicotine ingestion is inevitable - are you a 1950s tobacco ad exec? - and you are abrogating responsibility as a parent.
Do you also believe that all kids are destined to get into violent altercations?
What's your advice there? They carry boxing gloves ... or weapons?
2
Kids are not idiots and most of them have a sensitive hypocrisy detector. They are well aware that vaping is not as harmful as some adults are trying to convince them it is. They also have at their fingertips all the unbiased information they need to make a decision. It's called the internet. You should try it.
3
I'm sorry, did you just declare "The Internet" as a source of legitimate, unbiased, accurate information?
That actually did make me LOL.
That actually did make me LOL.
e-cigarettes are gross. Every time I see someone lurking about with some mini hooka in their hands, I imagine them gravitating toward meth in three years; I know that's wrong, but it's what I think. The smoke these wizards blow out looks thick, like from some sickly person's 1970s humidifier. They are walking humidifiers. The pipes or cigarettes or what ever they are, are clutched and palmed, slight of hand, hid up a sleeves it seems, appear out of nowhere, sucked, all wide-eyed and sneaky and then the wetish dragon-smoke shoots out, first thin and then a mushroom of lameness, as they scuttle with semi-guilty, I-know-this-is-gross type eyes. So disturbing that high schoolers are picking this up.
10
That was hilarious!!
6
Oh my god, this was possibly the funniest comment on here. Really, vapers are going to turn to meth now? I think I've heard it all. And the fact that you think people feel guilty about their VAPOR (not smoke) just points out that they are less obnoxious about their use of nicotine than smokers. People don't do it to be "cool", they do it so they DON'T SMOKE.
16
I had a good laugh too. Thanks PE Seattle. It's Reefer Madness! OMG!
6
The paralysis of the authorities in the face of this epidemic of teens adopting what may well become a lifelong (and life ending) addiction would be mind boggling if it were't so predictable and typical.
7
I am surprised the author did not mention using e-cigs for liquid marijuana. I think many of those teens are using it to get high.
3
E-cigs will not vaporize liquid marijuana, and nor will other vaping devices. They need special equipment for that which is very expensive. If they want to get high, they'll either have to make a big investment or go back to the old fashioned way, smoking it.
1
Quit cigarettes two years ago by using e-cigs. I have weaned myself to the lowest nicotine levels I can get. I can now run, exercise, I don't get sick and don't smell. I am very glad that they were invented.
49
3.5 years for me buddy. Got back on the bike, lost 30 pounds.
Never underestimate the power of drug-seeking behavior.
Or the power of capitalism to exploit this drug-seeking behavior.
There is a lady in this area who is probably a member of our local chamber of commerce. Holly is a young, enterprising owner of a local 'vape shop', and is on record in print media in this small, Christian town as saying that she is delighted that even long-time cigarette smokers are using her products to help them quit smoking. Yes, only because they can continue getting their nicotine fix from her store. (I know, I know. It is 'healthier' for them this way)
I am older enough to remember 'head shops' from the hippie era. I was in a number of head shops back in the day. There is not a nickel's worth of difference between the look, the feel and the social 'buzz' surrounding today's 'vape shops' and the 'head shops' of yore.
This ain't your grandfathers' tobacco shop or head shop, kids. Come on down, and get 'high' on legal nicotine.
Yee ha! We is makin' money, ma! We got a guaranteed addictive product to sell! Ain't America great?
4
One of my brothers started smoking cigarettes when he was just 12 years old. After almost 9 years of smoking, e-cigs were able to help him stop. I see the use of e-cigs as one of the best ways to stop smoking now.
39
Vapes may or may not be less harmful than regular cigarettes, and kids may be switching from regular to vape, but the idea that kids are using this as a method to quit altogether is NOT what is happening. A finding like that comes from someone who just looks at data instead of observing actual behavior in practice.
This is a new method for kids to achieve socially acceptable, cool behavior, that cuts out the cigarettes (which could be great), but it does not mean they are trying to cut out the smoking or behavior itself.
This is a new method for kids to achieve socially acceptable, cool behavior, that cuts out the cigarettes (which could be great), but it does not mean they are trying to cut out the smoking or behavior itself.
2
And you get your data from where?
1
If you note what I wrote, this is not data, this is observational. I have seen the vape scene for 3 years. It's better than cigs (smoke that I cannot tolerate), but the idea that kids are using this to quit is misguided. Older smokers maybe. Teens, no.
Well, Jonathon, your post misses the fact that vapers are not smoking, and that is the point.
3
Look folks, at least there's enough common sense out there to move to ban powdered alcohol. Pick your battles.
7
Have you actually done any research on powdered alcohol? The actual 'powdering' technique, molecularly encapsulating the ethanol in cyclodextrins has been around since at least 1974. From what I can gather, it's a solution looking for a problem. I watch a video from the guy trying to market it in the US (Palcohol), and the best use cases he could describe for it is for a hiker who wants to have a drink out in the wilderness, and for airlines to reduce the weight of the alcohol they carry on board. Neither really makes much sense, as you would still need to carry the water/fluid to mix it with to make it drinkable, so where's the benefit? There doesn't seem to be any additional abuse potential for it either...some have suggested it could be snorted but it appears that would be extreme unpleasant, and the only other viable method of consumption would be to use a nebulizer, which seems unlikely to either be popular or to have any significant abuse potential beyond plain old liquid alcohol.
So..."common sense?" Perhaps for those looking for excuses for moral panic; otherwise not so much.
So..."common sense?" Perhaps for those looking for excuses for moral panic; otherwise not so much.
Why consider using e-cigarettes as the use of a "tobacco product"? Nicotine is produced synthetically as well.
8
There is so much confusion on e-Cigs. I know several people who use them but I have never seen anyone using products like Fuse. Most vapers acquire separate components and configure a device to their liking. The number of devices available is overwhelming to those who first venture into e-cigs. But once you figure it all out it's a much more pleasant experience than smoking. I doubt that a large number of people will move on to regular cigarettes because 1) they taste so bad in comparison, 2) you smell bad, 3) you are severely limited in where you can use it, 4) organics (that's what vapers call traditional cigs) are much worse for you, and 5) it's more expensive. After a lifetime of struggling with cigarette addiction, I'm in my sixties, these devices have been incredibly effective at helping me to quit. I quit smoking the day after I got my first kit. BTW, another misunderstanding is the flavors. We vapers love our candy flavored juice.
7
I don't see how e-cigs are any different than nicotine patches or gums. Both deliver the same amount of nicotine as e-cigs do and have been used for years with no hysterical complaints from cigarette haters. I doubt seriously they give a hoot about "health" issues as they claim.
24
One difference is that some -- perhaps even most -- vaping liquids sold don't even have nicotine.
3
That's just false. They do not give the same amount as patches and gums, and patches and gums do not emulate the behavior. With personal vaporizers, you choose exactly how much nicotine you want. You can buy juices in many different nicotine levels, including zero nicotine. You can't do that with patches and gum. And the action of inhaling and exhaling the aerosol provides the satisfaction and appeal to get people off of cigarettes. They can then step down the nicotine until they don't need the nicotine at all.
3
"The decline in cigarette use among teenagers accelerated substantially from 2013 to 2014, dropping by 25 percent, the fastest pace in years."
So E-cigarettes work at inducing young people to quit.
So E-cigarettes work at inducing young people to quit.
21
That is not what the statistics say.
Teenagers are only teenaged for five years. Far more rational takeaway is teens who otherwise might have taken up smoking for the first time are instead taking up E-Cigarettes.
Teenagers are only teenaged for five years. Far more rational takeaway is teens who otherwise might have taken up smoking for the first time are instead taking up E-Cigarettes.
That is indeed what the study says. Oppose e-cigs all you like, teens' abandoning the smoking of cigarettes is a major, and celebrate-able, event.
3
Again, they aren't smoking, using less nicotine, and not inhaling tar and 7000 other chemicals. So what's the problem?
3
I quit smoking cigarettes when I was 30. I never thought I could do it. The only way I was able to was by using an e-cigarette. I know I am not alone. This is the most powerful weapon against big tobacco's death grip in a century -- and because of alarmist articles and reactions like this, we are at risk of sliding right back to where we were. Would it be better if everyone simply stopped smoking cold turkey? Of course. But I'm guessing those who are advocating getting rid of e-cigarettes altogether have never known the pull of addiction and the lifelong struggle to break free of it. I'm so grateful for e-cigarettes and know that it can save so many more lives as well.
70
Well you better be prepared to fight for that right. As you can tell from the article and the comments here, we have many enemies.
2
I quit smoking in the 80's (after 25 years) only because of nicorette. I had to hunt for doctors willing to prescribe it, because so many felt that it was an addictive "drug", and a fake solution to a real problem.
For me, there was absolutely no comparison between withdrawing from smoking, and withdrawing from nicotine gum.
I chalked the doctor's problems up to "religious thinking" versus "rational thinking".
For me, there was absolutely no comparison between withdrawing from smoking, and withdrawing from nicotine gum.
I chalked the doctor's problems up to "religious thinking" versus "rational thinking".
5
Yes but Regulate as We Do Not Know enough about consequences and long term use yet.
New England Journal of Medicine: Hidden Formaldehyde in E-Cigarette Aerosols
http://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMc1413069
Not to mention the fact that these devices deliver concentrated "hot spots" to surface areas of the mouth, over and over again. This is another "feature" of e-cigs that can cause mouth cancers and other lesions.
http://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMc1413069
Not to mention the fact that these devices deliver concentrated "hot spots" to surface areas of the mouth, over and over again. This is another "feature" of e-cigs that can cause mouth cancers and other lesions.
9
This study was garbage. They heated the liquid to levels that nobody would normally vape at. It was never even considered to be an official study because they could not truly replicate the way a person uses the various types of e-cigs. I honestly thought more people would think that e-cigs are a good thing, boy was I wrong. Enjoy smelling smoke the rest of your lives then.
http://info-electronic-cigarette.com/health-experts-debunk-the-formaldeh...
http://info-electronic-cigarette.com/health-experts-debunk-the-formaldeh...
20
The conclusion the media jumped to about formaldehyde levels in e-cigs was completely incorrect, as stated by David Peyton, one of the study's authors -- in the New York Times!
“It is exceedingly frustrating to me that we are being associated with saying that e-cigarettes are more dangerous than cigarettes,” he added. “That is a fact not in evidence.”
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/01/27/opinion/joe-nocera-is-vaping-worse-tha...
“It is exceedingly frustrating to me that we are being associated with saying that e-cigarettes are more dangerous than cigarettes,” he added. “That is a fact not in evidence.”
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/01/27/opinion/joe-nocera-is-vaping-worse-tha...
10
This is false. I'm guessing you have never tried vaping. It does not cause hot spots at all. It is cooling when vaping at normal levels. It does not cause lesions and there are zero carcinogens. Nicotine is not categorized as a carcinogen.
The oft cited New England Journal of Medicine article you quoted has been widely discredited. If you read the study, they used old devices that are no longer in use and pushed them well past their typical usage point. They measured the formaldehyde from melting the device. No human want to or be able to vape at that level, and current devices do not use the same components as those in the study.
The oft cited New England Journal of Medicine article you quoted has been widely discredited. If you read the study, they used old devices that are no longer in use and pushed them well past their typical usage point. They measured the formaldehyde from melting the device. No human want to or be able to vape at that level, and current devices do not use the same components as those in the study.
15
E-cigs are, quite simply, drug delivery systems and need to evaluated and regulated as such.
16
Many -- perhaps even most -- of the liquids "smoked" don't even contain nicotine and have no "drugs" in them. What makes the vapor is heating (not burning) propylene glycol (a binder often used in making pills), food grade vegetable glycerin, and some variety of flavoring (from banana to coffee to almost anything). BTW: No, propylene glycol is not used in anti-freeze ... that's ethylene glycol.)
5
No, they are /potential/ drug delivery systems. This is an important distinction. The devices themselves are not solely for drug delivery, and many users (read thousands) have reported using zero nicotine juices. For some it is just an oral fixation.
What needs to be regulated is the nicotine. We need laws requiring child safety caps and mandatory ID for purchasing nicotine and nicotine-based juices.
What needs to be regulated is the nicotine. We need laws requiring child safety caps and mandatory ID for purchasing nicotine and nicotine-based juices.
2
So is coffee...let's freak out, overreact, and turn that into a public health menace, too.
I think Dr. Frieden, of the C.D.C., should get his head examined. We may not know of the long-term effects of vaping, but here is what we do know. Cigarettes kill over 480,000 people a year in this country. Cigarettes have thousands of harmful chemicals, hundreds of which are carcinogenic. Second hand smoke kills as well. To lament the eye-popping numbers of teens who are not smoking cigarettes today compared to just four years ago, even though they are vaping on something that may still have health risks--reduced albeit--makes as much sense as lamenting a meth addict giving it up for marijuana.
54
'[james] has never smoked cigarettes and said he could not imagine ever starting. “There’s a harshness to cigarettes,” he said. “Girls think they’re gross.”'
the girls are correct. the sexy cigarette is so 1960s (or even 1860s). sorry, don draper. heroin might be more chic now than tobacco (and about as addictive).
...
"E-cigarettes have arrived in the life of the American teenager."
that is, 13% of them. what about adult use of e-cigarettes, and of tobacco? i predict that adult use of e-cigarettes will drive the regulation of their use in public. kids generally have to be sneaky about their drug habits.
...
editor's note: e-cigarettes generally contain nicotine, not tobacco.
the girls are correct. the sexy cigarette is so 1960s (or even 1860s). sorry, don draper. heroin might be more chic now than tobacco (and about as addictive).
...
"E-cigarettes have arrived in the life of the American teenager."
that is, 13% of them. what about adult use of e-cigarettes, and of tobacco? i predict that adult use of e-cigarettes will drive the regulation of their use in public. kids generally have to be sneaky about their drug habits.
...
editor's note: e-cigarettes generally contain nicotine, not tobacco.
2
I never understood why many of the same people who back away from a smoking campfire will literally pay money to buy some kind of smoke to inhale in their lungs.
7
E-cigs produce a VAPOR not smoke.
14
That's like wondering why people who back away from drinking anti-freeze will pay money to drink other liquids. All smoke isn't the same.
3
Technically it's an aerosol, not a vapor. But either way nothing is being burned, there is no smoke.
2
I am enjoying e-cigs and haven't smoked tobacco since. Those posting that this is a return to tobacco need to research this more. The nicotine in my brand come from tomatoes and not tobacco.
15
Cauliflower also has nicotine. As does Eggplant.
The fact that not enough is known about the possible adverse effects of e-cigs coupled with the fact that tobacco companies are spending lots of money lobbying state legislatures to prevent legislation regulating their use should be enough of a clue to people that this might be something that should be avoided until more is known. What is known is that nicotine is highly addictive and e-cigs are nicotine delivery devices so clearly it is in the best interest of tobacco companies to keep people addicted to nicotine. No thank you. It was difficult enough to break my cigarette addiction many years ago, I don't need another addiction to dominate my life.
11
easy answer for you - don't use them.
3
You don't have to use nicotine at all. In addition, big tobacco has been lobbying /for/ regulation, not against. The personal vaporizer movement was not started by and is not supported by big tobacco. The few forays they have made into the industry have been met with criticism from the consumers. Recently there was a massive YouTube campaign about this, with the most influential personal vaporizer video makers speaking out against the products being released by big tobacco companies. This is very much an anti-tobacco movement.
4
I am 60 years old and have never smoked. When I was in grammar school in the 1960s, the local library had a display in the lobby on cancer and smoking. In a container of formaladahyde was a grotesque cancerous lung. This made quite an impression.
Now, a great number of the younger people with whom I work smoke. I gave up year ago asking them if they thought it might harm their health later on -- they looked at me like I was crazy.
Now, a great number of the younger people with whom I work smoke. I gave up year ago asking them if they thought it might harm their health later on -- they looked at me like I was crazy.
4
When a person first smokes the acrid smell is repelling and it leaves a nasty odor about the smoker, and it hurts the breathing passages and lungs even with the pain killing additives, all good disincentives for teenagers. For all smokers the immediate stimulation from the nicotine is slightly dampened by the influx of carbon monoxide into the blood which quick fastens to hemoglobin 200 times more strongly than carbon dioxide, which decreases the stimulation by reducing the ability of blood to carry oxygen and carbon dioxide. Thus the e-cigarettes are a less obnoxious delivery system for the nicotine.
4
Nicotine is a -poison-. Witness it's use as a systemic pesticide. Earlier in the week a toddler got into a relatives 'stash' of the liquid used to refill the e-cigs. The child died of nicotine poisoning. How easy it is for these teens, as they are wont to do, over use e-cigs and suffer similar consequences. Cigarettes are poison in more ways than one however it's harder to OD on cigarettes.
9
This is an outright lie. Yes, a toddler could die if it drank the nicotine or got enough of it on their skin, but give a link to the article before you accuse e-cigs of causing nicotine overdoses.
6
And some people drown in water.
4
Personal vaporizers are not the issue, then. It's the nicotine and the nicotine-based juices. Those do need to be regulated, requiring child safety caps and ID checks at time of purchase.
1
It's having grown up with the gadget tech habit. They are also highly proficient in the use of both thumbs...Just don't start any kind of conversation with them, that requires high capacity verbal abilities! PS Glad they are smoking less!!!
4
'He has never smoked cigarettes and said he could not imagine ever starting. “There’s a harshness to cigarettes,” he said. “Girls think they’re gross.”'
This is all you need to know about this generation and the future of cigarettes in the U.S. We are never going to stop young people from experimenting with something "edgy." But if cigarettes are no longer "sexy," despite a century of advertising and marketing and product placement to make them appear so, they are doomed.
Now we just need anti-tobacco advocates, who have won their battle, and the e-cig and "juice" manufacturers to drop their respective hysteria and paranoia, and move toward reasonable regulation of the materials in this comparatively innocuous product.
Continuing to cry wolf about e-cigs, as if they were as unhealthy as cigarettes and that old, discredited drug war saw, "a gateway drug," only plays into our larger American political nonsense about "The Nanny State," almost guaranteeing no reasonable, pragmatic consumer protections are passed any time soon.
This is all you need to know about this generation and the future of cigarettes in the U.S. We are never going to stop young people from experimenting with something "edgy." But if cigarettes are no longer "sexy," despite a century of advertising and marketing and product placement to make them appear so, they are doomed.
Now we just need anti-tobacco advocates, who have won their battle, and the e-cig and "juice" manufacturers to drop their respective hysteria and paranoia, and move toward reasonable regulation of the materials in this comparatively innocuous product.
Continuing to cry wolf about e-cigs, as if they were as unhealthy as cigarettes and that old, discredited drug war saw, "a gateway drug," only plays into our larger American political nonsense about "The Nanny State," almost guaranteeing no reasonable, pragmatic consumer protections are passed any time soon.
106
Sorry, but whenever I see someone covered with $50,000 worth of ink, sporting ear gauges and piercings, and sucking down vape as if their very life depended on it, I'll pass on to the next job candidate. Those people who find it impossible to say no to themselves whenever faced with the latest trends in advertising self-destructive vices will have to discover the high price they pay for their exclusiveness.
7
I hear your point.. but tattoos and pierced ears are not 'self destructive.' Don't let your biases confuse health issues from personal choices.
3
And what about me? I'm a clean cut guy with no tattoos or piercings and I vape zero nicotine. I run a tech business in Boston. Are you going to make all your judgements based on anecdotes and stereotypes?
1
Pretty poison...let the health insurance underwriters find a way to stick e-cig smokers with higher premiums and we'll see a commensurate decline in their use, one hopes.
6
I do not want to pool insurance costs with these people. You have the information. Smoking kills you and makes you incredibly sick for a long time. If you want to do it then take the full cost it will create later in life yourself. No government help. No cross subsidy. Can we please test for this and make sure insurance premiums are made contingent on that cost? Because if you are doing this expecting me to pay it is just stealing.
1
Thats the whole thing Andrew, people are no longer smoking, so your paranoia about paying for their health care will go away!
14
Paul. Did you read the article or did you just jump to the comment section and decide to call me "paranoid"? Let me highlight one part of the article you seem to have missed:
“This is a really bad thing,” said Dr. Thomas R. Frieden, the director of the C.D.C., who noted that research had found that nicotine harms the developing brain.
So yes, it is not necessarily the same health effect as traditional smoking but there are clear serious health problems. I do not want to bear those costs. I am not some anti-government or anti-welfare nut. But there has to be a line where people are made to take responsibility for their actions. When people started smoking they thought it helped your health. That was arguably an innocent mistake. But today we know better whether it is an e-cigarette or the old kind.
“This is a really bad thing,” said Dr. Thomas R. Frieden, the director of the C.D.C., who noted that research had found that nicotine harms the developing brain.
So yes, it is not necessarily the same health effect as traditional smoking but there are clear serious health problems. I do not want to bear those costs. I am not some anti-government or anti-welfare nut. But there has to be a line where people are made to take responsibility for their actions. When people started smoking they thought it helped your health. That was arguably an innocent mistake. But today we know better whether it is an e-cigarette or the old kind.
I was struck by one adolescent rejecting cigarettes because "girls think they're gross." This is so important because it shows how a new generation of cigarette smokers will be avoided - by an understanding that the behavior is repulsive, not cool.
46
Ironic it is that todays girls won't kiss boys who smoke. 40 years ago bad girls would kiss the boys who smoked.
All of these negative comments are not taking into account the thousands of adults that have quit smoking using these products. Myself included. And yes, adults use Bubble gum flavor. If you don't do it, you don't understand it. If big tobacco and the government regulates this industry, it will cause many people to go back to smoking. European studies have shown that the vapor is much less harmful compared to smoke. Any shop I have ever been to cards everyone that comes in. If they don't have ID they are kicked out. The only companies actually ADVERTISING their garbage "cig-alikes" are the big tobacco companies. Regulate what you don't understand? Makes no sense. There are plenty of liquids with ZERO nicotine by the way.
56
This author missed an IMPORTANT POINT. At vaping stores near me in San Jose, CA, about 90% of the vaping fluid going out the door HAS NO NICOTINE! Young adults like the flavors and blowing trick shapes with the smoke. Vaping is not about using nicotine products, that's a small percentage. All the health problems associated with cigarette smoking have been traced to tar, from burning the dried tobacco leaf. Before we demonize something, we should at least try to learn something about it.
73
It is unfortunate that real cigarettes were not "demonized" before so many people became addicted to the nicotine and "sophistication" of inhaling and exhaling smoke in the early part of the 20th Century, I have heard that smoking was once advertised very early on as being a healthy habit. I began smoking one pack a day around age eighteen, and continued for about thirty years. I smoked because my friends and family members did. Vaping may or may not be harmful. I hope that some very serious research will be done on this before it is too late.
4
I agree: "let's learn something about it". That begins with you, looking at the affects of nicotine on the brain, and looking at what we DO NOT KNOW about it. Okay for you to experiment on kids?
My husband is an oncologist, and e-cigs DO have a role for long time smokers. But do not be duped by Big Tobacco; their methods are exactly the same as their selling regular cigs in the past. Do you really trust cigarette companies? More than researchers or health workers?
And who told you about the nicotine content of that San Jose store- the owner?? Think about where your info comes from and who is making money off of this.
My husband is an oncologist, and e-cigs DO have a role for long time smokers. But do not be duped by Big Tobacco; their methods are exactly the same as their selling regular cigs in the past. Do you really trust cigarette companies? More than researchers or health workers?
And who told you about the nicotine content of that San Jose store- the owner?? Think about where your info comes from and who is making money off of this.
4
Exactly.
I quit smoking 15 years ago but several years ago received an e-cig as a gift. I pick it up a few times a week when writing at the computer, or having a drink or doing other things that used to go well with a cigarette. I have always used only "no-nic" cartridges.
As others have said, if only such a product had been available when I took up the real thing.
And who at the NYT has this obsession with vaping? This is the umpteenth front-page article on the issue in well under a year. Doesn't our society have more pressing problems?
I quit smoking 15 years ago but several years ago received an e-cig as a gift. I pick it up a few times a week when writing at the computer, or having a drink or doing other things that used to go well with a cigarette. I have always used only "no-nic" cartridges.
As others have said, if only such a product had been available when I took up the real thing.
And who at the NYT has this obsession with vaping? This is the umpteenth front-page article on the issue in well under a year. Doesn't our society have more pressing problems?
1
Please let this be a harbinger of the wisdom of banning palcohol.
We are a nation of addicts. It is the pursuit of Excellence, combined with the culture of Consumerism We might change the method, but the addictive behavior remains an unvarying constant. "Eat me, smoke me, drink me... buy me." The notion that e-cigarettes would become a gateway to cigarettes misses the point, entirely; our children (and ourselves) get hooked on "acquiring" long before they take that first puff.
3
The US has lower rates of tobacco use and alcholism than almost any other industrial nation.
6
Irrelevant. It's not the means or method, it's the behavior. Substituting one substance/product/activity for another does nothing to change the behavior.
It's nice that some people are quitting smoking, a fairly deadly habit.
But it's not so nice that Big E-Tobacco is introducing e-cigarettes to millions of children and adults by making the act of puffing on a tobacco product 'normal again' and introducing highly addictive nicotine in a 'new-and-improved' flavor to a new generation of soon-to-be nicotine addicts..
“This is a really bad thing,” said Dr. Thomas R. Frieden, the director of the C.D.C., who noted that research had found that nicotine harms the developing brain. “This is another generation being hooked by the tobacco industry. It makes me angry.”
We should all be angry.
Regulate these chemicals into the smoker's corner.
But it's not so nice that Big E-Tobacco is introducing e-cigarettes to millions of children and adults by making the act of puffing on a tobacco product 'normal again' and introducing highly addictive nicotine in a 'new-and-improved' flavor to a new generation of soon-to-be nicotine addicts..
“This is a really bad thing,” said Dr. Thomas R. Frieden, the director of the C.D.C., who noted that research had found that nicotine harms the developing brain. “This is another generation being hooked by the tobacco industry. It makes me angry.”
We should all be angry.
Regulate these chemicals into the smoker's corner.
88
Q: What's the only way to make liberals stay angry all day and night about something?
A: Tell them that people they don't go to parties with are making a profit.
As long as the profit-makers are the drugged-out rockers or the other in-crowd types, all is forgiven. But if the (legal) profits are going to strangers living in other states, it must be seen as E-vile.
And the Left wonders why they keep losing elections!
A: Tell them that people they don't go to parties with are making a profit.
As long as the profit-makers are the drugged-out rockers or the other in-crowd types, all is forgiven. But if the (legal) profits are going to strangers living in other states, it must be seen as E-vile.
And the Left wonders why they keep losing elections!
4
But these chemicals already are regulated. You are no more going to keep them out of the hands of teenagers than beer, cigarettes, marijuana, or anything else. And, really, are they really more harmful than the other substances we adults habitually use, like pot, liquor, and senility-causing tranquilizers, not to mention the harder drugs that are popular among partygoers in the their 20's?
Humans trying things, even ones you don't like is...normal.
1
These need to be highly taxed and regulated-NOW.
It's ludicrous that we have a whole new generation of youth becoming addicted to nicotine, in the second decade of the 21st century.
Bubblegum flavor? Ridiculous.
It's ludicrous that we have a whole new generation of youth becoming addicted to nicotine, in the second decade of the 21st century.
Bubblegum flavor? Ridiculous.
44
Do you know anything about the industry whatsoever? Or how many people it has benefited? There are testimonials from grandmas with early signs of COPD who quit by vaping (Bubblegum flavored and all)) all over the internet. The NY Times ran a video in Oklahoma a few months ago that showed older people hanging out at the vape shops in Oklahoma City. And by old I mean 60-80 years old. They were trying all types of flavors. There is no advertising by the small e-liquid manufacturers, only BIG TOBACCO who wants kids to use their products that look like cigarettes and taste much closer to the real thing.
8
If your only reason for regulating something is because it is addictive, then the government should regulate away your three to four daily cups of coffee, your glass of wine with dinner, and your ice cream for dessert as well. Throw in your Netflix too. I know you didn't move the entire weekend when the new season of House of Cards came out.
People should be allowed to do what they want unless it is scientifically proven that doing that thing creates a quantifiable detriment to society that far outweighs the value being created by the product (such as cigarette smoking being directly linked to lung cancer, creating enormous health care costs supported by taxpayers).
Who cares if teens (or people) are addicted to e-cigs if being addicted to e-cigs doesn't matter?
Addiction in and of itself is not an issue. The potential long term effects are what matter, but those need to be discovered before we jump the gun and implement reactionary policies.
This is supposed to be a free country, right?
Heck, they've got a FAR better case for regulating/banning soda and other sugary products that are directly linked to childhood obesity and diabetes than they do for banning e-cigs, but we'll never see that happen and most people wouldn't want it.
People should be allowed to do what they want unless it is scientifically proven that doing that thing creates a quantifiable detriment to society that far outweighs the value being created by the product (such as cigarette smoking being directly linked to lung cancer, creating enormous health care costs supported by taxpayers).
Who cares if teens (or people) are addicted to e-cigs if being addicted to e-cigs doesn't matter?
Addiction in and of itself is not an issue. The potential long term effects are what matter, but those need to be discovered before we jump the gun and implement reactionary policies.
This is supposed to be a free country, right?
Heck, they've got a FAR better case for regulating/banning soda and other sugary products that are directly linked to childhood obesity and diabetes than they do for banning e-cigs, but we'll never see that happen and most people wouldn't want it.
1
Great, so we'll have them smoke hookah and cigarettes instead? Talk about throwing out the baby with the bath!
The increase demand is primarily related to being able to get certain drugs in liquid form to use with e-cigarettes...like heroin...tobacco is passe`...
1
The other day I saw an ethereal commercial on TV for Vuse. The commercial voice over actually said some like "brought to you by the fine folks at RJ Reynolds." It stopped me in my tracks and made me wonder if my reaction was a generational stutter. Maybe the kids huffing Vuse and products like it just don't make the same connection. Like the old joke back in the ''70s: "From the same folks that brought you Vietnam."
Sad. More education needed.
Sad. More education needed.
15
Most people who vape stop using products like Vuse quickly. They get what is referred to as an open system, where they can regulate how much nicotine they take in, what flavor they want, etc. Its makes it much easier to quit that way. Big tobacco's products don't work, but they are lobbying for them to be the only thing available on the market. I wonder why? Did anybody catch that teen smoking has gone down tremendously over the same period that e-cigs have been available? Even the 18 year old kid quit that way. I'm not for teenagers being able to get the products, but lets face it, they can get whatever they want if they put their minds to it. Cigs, alcohol and pretty much anything else, legal or not. All regulating the industry would do is stop adults who need the nicotine replacement therapy from getting what they need. Makes no sense.
2
I saw that commercial during a baseball game yesterday and reacted similarly. I'm 30 - too young to have heard the Vietnam joke, but old enough to remember the death of Joe Camel.
It's a bad ad for sure, but not much worse than sitcom stars shilling scotch and lite beer.
It's a bad ad for sure, but not much worse than sitcom stars shilling scotch and lite beer.
1
Denine, you mentioned an R.J. Reynolds tobacco product, Vuse. A number of tobacco companies have gotten into the market, but much of that market is still "mom and pop" shops that produce their own mods (the battery-powered inhalers). Sometimes, the bottle their own juices that go into the mods or they sell bottles of commercially products usually made by small firms.
The irony here is that if possible FDA regulations increase the cost of doing business (such as, scientific studies on each product a shop offers), then the only players will be tobacco companies with their large advertising budgets.
The irony here is that if possible FDA regulations increase the cost of doing business (such as, scientific studies on each product a shop offers), then the only players will be tobacco companies with their large advertising budgets.
1
If The New York Times would like to address addiction and why, why not have one of its star reporters that is not addicted visit the nation's most successful Treatment Center (TC) in Mendham, New Jersey. There, on route 24, just past town on the south side of the road, is a record that began late in 1992, and has now spread across the asphalt covered Garden State. Hope I'm right.
Up to 75 adolescents live there. To enter, they must pledge no tobacco. This is voluntary. E-cigarettes would not fit that program. Liar professors would not help. The program focuses addiction. Most forms are addressed, and 85% return to society sober Fred. I know. I have treated a few Mendham clients.
Splitting hairs about the e-cigarette vs the cigarette itself begs the question. It could lead to real trouble.
Do we want the kids to quit? If we admit our own words, they will quit. I have worked this circuit.
Do not ask the prison guards. Not about culling the inmates... Upon which they depend...
For the prison staff is not pleased and sought this job.