This is in response to the comments of Mark Anderson and Susie: I wholeheartedly agree with your assessment of waiting until all of the evidence has been presented before assuming guilt based on public opinion. However, in this particular incident, I think if it were not for the various reports of the pilot being heard knocking, pounding, screaming and eventually hacking away on the cockpit door with the Germanwings regulation axe in desperate attempts to garner access in order to save the plane, readers would be less inclined to draw the conclusion that the alleged acts of the co-polite were performed with deliberate and willful malice. If I had a loved one who perished on that flight, one of the things that would haunt me to my dying day would be knowing in his final moments, he witnessed the frantic actions of the pilot trying to save everyone on the plane.
7
There is so much more to the Aviation Industry Story in the U.S. and Globally; this is but one. Just food for thought: Where do you think all of the old out-of-service aircraft from the American aviation industry goes; Overseas for regional, intra-European, and Caribbean island hopping. Those 30 + year old MD-80s, and older Boeing 727s, 737s, 767s, 747s and possibly L1011s all with fewer and fewer spare parts? They certainly dont all end up in the Air Craft Graveyard.
2
It doesn't take much imagination, technical knowledge, or economic sense to see the road that events such the horrific crash of the Germanwings flight likely lead to.Drone technology will become more and more sophisticated, lowering the risk and cost of hiring traditional pilots.
Consider Mercedes and other companies with extraordinary technical expertise and vast capital, like Google and Amazon. They are developing cars and drones that are more and more driverless. Traditional pilots likely will be needed less and less. A pity that the Germanwings flight could not have been taken over remotely once the pilot showed he was failing.
A commercial pilot I met once said he was leaving the profession for more intellectually challenging work, and that flying a 727 was really like driving a big bus. Not really that hard these days. Drones and driverless cars are the precursors.
The loss of lives, the business cost of losing 150 lives, demand solutions, new thinking, and inevitably we will look to promising tools at hand.
Consider Mercedes and other companies with extraordinary technical expertise and vast capital, like Google and Amazon. They are developing cars and drones that are more and more driverless. Traditional pilots likely will be needed less and less. A pity that the Germanwings flight could not have been taken over remotely once the pilot showed he was failing.
A commercial pilot I met once said he was leaving the profession for more intellectually challenging work, and that flying a 727 was really like driving a big bus. Not really that hard these days. Drones and driverless cars are the precursors.
The loss of lives, the business cost of losing 150 lives, demand solutions, new thinking, and inevitably we will look to promising tools at hand.
After a spate of crashes involving Asian air carriers some years ago, I remember reading that the authorities investigating the accidents felt there was a particularly serious cultural problem resulting in co-pilots being afraid or too deferent to question actions by captains who were older and had more seniority. Extremely hierarchical societies like Japan have had to address this problem even more than the U.S. when training airline pilots.
6
I'm glad to see someone (particularly a pilot) remark on the low number of hours the Germanwings co-pilot had logged. That number immediately jumped out at me when the story broke. Maybe it's time airlines had a public information page on their cabin crews, listing training and number of air miles logged. I check out the experience of any doctors or dentists I use, and any contractors I hire. Shouldn't I be able to check out the people who are going to launch me to 30k feet and bring me down -- one hopes -- safely?
6
I would caution against beginning some sort of widespread psychological testing regimen. The most likely result of such an effort would be to disqualify perfectly capable pilots who would never pose a threat to anyone.
What other much more imminent threat would we neglect if we chose to devote resources to extensive psych testing of pilots? In December 2014 a gun smuggling scheme at the Atlanta airport was broken up. The airport employees involved managed to get guns onto planes 20 times before they were caught.
As evidenced by the charades we are routinely put through by the TSA there appear to be many instances where we would all be better served if we resisted the urge to ‘do something.’
What other much more imminent threat would we neglect if we chose to devote resources to extensive psych testing of pilots? In December 2014 a gun smuggling scheme at the Atlanta airport was broken up. The airport employees involved managed to get guns onto planes 20 times before they were caught.
As evidenced by the charades we are routinely put through by the TSA there appear to be many instances where we would all be better served if we resisted the urge to ‘do something.’
2
When I think about this tragedy, it just seems to me that despite automation and computers, the planes, trains and other machinery still depend on a rational person. And despite training, human beings are messy and can have issues. I think the planes and trains that can potentially carry thousands of people need more robust back up systems. The systems that can take over if necessary, if they notice that human begins are acting strangely. For example, for the situation this week, there really should be some monitoring system that would've determined that the plane is heading dangerously low outside of the airport. It should've alerted the air traffic controllers that it is taking over and should've just locked or ignored pilot's controls. Subject to an override from air traffic control, of course. I think systems like that are technologicaly feasible but perhaps culturally difficult.
1
This just proves that no one is immune to dark thoughts. And those who are responsible for the lives of others should be assessed, and not just once, but periodically throughout their career.
2
The Germanwings disaster is preventable.
Since 9/11, much emphasis has been placed on denying physical access to the cockpit space. A better approach is to deny control access to the aircraft control system itself. This can be done by switching-over control to a "Black box" computer that would redirect the aircraft to a sanctuary airfield (in the case of a terrorist) or simply prevent the pilot from flying outside of its flight corridor.
This is achievable because most airliners use "fly-by-wire" systems. [Cockpit controls are converted to digital signals that control motor/actuators.
Once black box control is established, it can not be over-ridden from within the aircraft.
Rationale:
1. Flight corridors are 3-D highways in the sky with specified range of altitude, width, and direction.
2. GPS provides continual location information.
3. GPS is used to precisely guide a missile to a target. Why not use it to ensure an airliner stays within its flight corridor.
4. In the Germanwings situation, the system would simply prevent the pilot from flying outside of the assigned flight path corridor (unless it receives an FAA enabling signal).
5. In a Terrorist take over attempt (like 9/11), the pilot would handover the flight control to a computer that would redirect the aircraft to a remote airfield and summon emergency responders. Once that was fully initiated, it could not be changed. The plane would fly to a sanctuary air field.
Since 9/11, much emphasis has been placed on denying physical access to the cockpit space. A better approach is to deny control access to the aircraft control system itself. This can be done by switching-over control to a "Black box" computer that would redirect the aircraft to a sanctuary airfield (in the case of a terrorist) or simply prevent the pilot from flying outside of its flight corridor.
This is achievable because most airliners use "fly-by-wire" systems. [Cockpit controls are converted to digital signals that control motor/actuators.
Once black box control is established, it can not be over-ridden from within the aircraft.
Rationale:
1. Flight corridors are 3-D highways in the sky with specified range of altitude, width, and direction.
2. GPS provides continual location information.
3. GPS is used to precisely guide a missile to a target. Why not use it to ensure an airliner stays within its flight corridor.
4. In the Germanwings situation, the system would simply prevent the pilot from flying outside of the assigned flight path corridor (unless it receives an FAA enabling signal).
5. In a Terrorist take over attempt (like 9/11), the pilot would handover the flight control to a computer that would redirect the aircraft to a remote airfield and summon emergency responders. Once that was fully initiated, it could not be changed. The plane would fly to a sanctuary air field.
2
I don't refer to this as pilot suicide. I refer to it as pilor homicide. As to the comments that this is a few and far between episode so step back and take a breather before responding to it; I don't think that holds true as the murder was committed that day 150 times not just once. This mass murder deserves stringent investigation and response to the foibles that this individual took advantage of.
2
Logic suggests the pilot suffered from, concealed severe mental illness. Most likely, some form of obsessive compulsion disorder, the chemical imbalance that forces the fevered mind to act out uncontrollable urges. A normal mind is able to suppress, to control the bad thought, but not so with the abnormal mind. The tortured mind is a scary, most tragic thing, indeed..
I don´t believe in this theory,about SUICIDIO.no way
All health records for all flight personnel must be allowed to be scrutinized by their respective present and future employers on as needed basis, but not less than the number of times per year that air transport personnel are so required.
The German government intended to protect the privacy of individuals with their laws, but in fact they neither protected the co-pilot nor the passengers, nor Lufthansa, not Airbus, nor the misguided government of Germany.
Even with the enactment of such transparency, door which can be opened can be hard to open if they are unbreachable for a sufficient period of time.
A pilot with any type of weapon can render intruders and co-workers to be unfit mentally or physically, and thus depending on one's motive, disasters can be prevented or not.
Airbus and Boeing will be busy rethinking egress insofar as cockpits can be made continuously safer,
The German government intended to protect the privacy of individuals with their laws, but in fact they neither protected the co-pilot nor the passengers, nor Lufthansa, not Airbus, nor the misguided government of Germany.
Even with the enactment of such transparency, door which can be opened can be hard to open if they are unbreachable for a sufficient period of time.
A pilot with any type of weapon can render intruders and co-workers to be unfit mentally or physically, and thus depending on one's motive, disasters can be prevented or not.
Airbus and Boeing will be busy rethinking egress insofar as cockpits can be made continuously safer,
I was a pilot for Delta Air Lines from 1969 to 2003. Before the I was a Navy carrier pilot. I agree wit Mr. McGee's opinions. Dealing with different personalities while safely performing a very tightly structured mission required some give and take. I never, ever, flew with a pilot that I felt was unstable enough to consider a suicide and mass murder/ manslaughter. When I was hired by Delta in 1969 an interview with an industrial psychologist, who was not a Delta employee, was the last part of the pilot hiring process. For may years Delta had a unique and comfortable corporate culture. I suspect the psychologist's opinion weighed heavily on who made the cut.
7
Very informative opinion piece. I think we all know there are multiple personality types who go into flying, and actually no way to know exactly what they might do in a given situation, but we also expect enough scrutinizing prior to giving them a go-ahead to fly commercial planes to assure a high level of stability. From all indications, this pilot who apparently allowed the plane to crash in France appeared to be a stable and capable person prior to the crash. If he was being treated with mind altering drugs for a depression, the negative affects that sometimes occur with these drugs should be addressed. Just recently, another case where the former marine who shot and killed two other veterans was also on medications for mental disturbances, and his thinking process was far from normal at the time of the tragic event.
Since Reagan's deregulation and the proliferation of off-price airlines, I've always felt uneasy with how little some pilots are paid, given the immense responsibility even a regional "express" pilot carries on his or her shoulders. I have to admit choosing my air routes to assure larger planes where I am more apt to see more mature, better-paid pilots, more often with thousands of hours on their clocks. I stick to the yellow cabs for much the same reason.
4
Perhaps 1% of male humans are psychopaths. 0.5% of female humans are psychopaths. There is no cure or treatment for psychopaths. Even spotting them can be very difficult.
The cleverest psychopaths are notoriously good at pulling the wool over the eyes of the most experienced criminal psychiatrists and psychologists. This may make some folks uncomfortable, especially if they are convinced that we are all capable of redemption or that it is our environment that solely shapes us.
I recommend that folks start by reading Harvey Cleckley [1], then move on to reading Robert D Hare on the subject [2].
1) 'The Mask of Sanity: An Attempt to Clarify Some Issues About the So-called Psychopathic Personality'; Hervey Cleckley, MD; Fifth Edition: private printing for non-profit educational use; Emily S Cleckley; Augusta, Georgia (1988); http://www.cassiopaea.com/cassiopaea/sanity_1.PdF
2) 'Without Conscience'; Robert Hare's Web Site devoted to the study of Psychopathyhttp://www.hare.org/
The cleverest psychopaths are notoriously good at pulling the wool over the eyes of the most experienced criminal psychiatrists and psychologists. This may make some folks uncomfortable, especially if they are convinced that we are all capable of redemption or that it is our environment that solely shapes us.
I recommend that folks start by reading Harvey Cleckley [1], then move on to reading Robert D Hare on the subject [2].
1) 'The Mask of Sanity: An Attempt to Clarify Some Issues About the So-called Psychopathic Personality'; Hervey Cleckley, MD; Fifth Edition: private printing for non-profit educational use; Emily S Cleckley; Augusta, Georgia (1988); http://www.cassiopaea.com/cassiopaea/sanity_1.PdF
2) 'Without Conscience'; Robert Hare's Web Site devoted to the study of Psychopathyhttp://www.hare.org/
4
Many airplanes flying many millions of people in numbers unimagined twenty years ago. Still safer than walking across the street or living with a gun nut without cabinet or lock. Nevertheless, this essay points out that looking under the noggins of these pilots is a good idea regardless. Also, ethics of physicians and counselors treating Pilots might be duty bound to take the car keys away sometimes.
4
I still have far more trust in those at the very front of the plane than half the drivers I encounter on the highway.
14
Commercial pilot, architectural designer, and now a graceful writer. This guy has talent.
14
I simply love this statistic: For our airline industry to 'become' 99.9% safe, 10 planes would have to crash. Every day.
8
Like most, I have followed this story looking for answers to how it happened and how it could be prevented, now that it is on the map of what can happen. I did some recreational flying in college and have followed the technological advances from the sidelines in the 40 years since. Is it not possible that the ubiquitous auto-pilot system could be designed to prevent catastrophic manual override such as what appears to have happened?
3
The airplane cabin door problem is an example of one of the ways systems evolve ; the solution to a problem opens up a whole range of new, previously unsuspected outcomes, some of which are problems in urgent need of a solution. When the systems in question involves human lives dependent on machines in an unforgiving environment, there are historically, dire consequences .
2
This is typical of our paranoid and scared of everything mindset. There is no doubt that some friend of the Bush Administration made a fortune supplying those doors to the airlines, just like former Homeland Security Chief Michael Chertoff's post-government business made him rich selling X-ray scanners to airports.
Aircraft are becoming increasingly automated. In fact, drones with no pilots are now commonplace. Modern airliners are already automated to the extent that if the pilot gives a control input that would be harmful (such as overstressing the plane or causing an aerodynamic stall), the computers overrule the pilot and moderate the control input.
Maybe the day will come when, if a pilot tries to dive an airliner into a mountain, the computers will say, "no".
Maybe the day will come when, if a pilot tries to dive an airliner into a mountain, the computers will say, "no".
5
It's out of print but the best book on the subject is "Blind Trust" by John Nance. http://www.amazon.com/Blind-Trust-John-J-Nance/dp/0688069673 it was required reading in flight school.
In the book, several accidents are dissected as to why they happened (many preventable). It's mesmerizing stuff and changed the industry.
While on the subject, viewing Charlie Victor Romeo, both an East Village play and now a documentary, will leave you speechless. http://charlievictorromeo.com/
In the book, several accidents are dissected as to why they happened (many preventable). It's mesmerizing stuff and changed the industry.
While on the subject, viewing Charlie Victor Romeo, both an East Village play and now a documentary, will leave you speechless. http://charlievictorromeo.com/
1
I learned nothing from this article other than the fact the author used to fly turboprops and gave it up for the less stressful work of an architect. Had he left to become an engineer I would have understood his decision making much better, as engineers like pilots are ultimately responsible for risks brought about by faulty execution. My sense is that automation contributes to boredom which contributes to a lot of private thought during hours of down time. If those thoughts are sad and disponded I can see how the Germanwings event happened.
1
Pilots: what do you think of the new policy of allowing pilots to carry guns? Now seems like a terrible mistake. This guy could have had a gun to shoot the pilot, at least on flights in the U.S.
3
I earned my private and instrument license at my own expense. To go from there to a commercial ATP-licensed airline pilot could cost an individual upwards of $500,000 to get the requisite hours needed to become a First Officer for an airline.
There could be a better way. Airline apprenticeship programs. However, the airlines are too busy thinking up new ways to scam the flying public out of their money with more fees, to come up with a good apprenticeship plan. There are jump seats in every cockpit. I suggest a pilot-in-training occupy those seats during flights and learn from observation, much like young doctors observe, touch and question. Also, the airlines could take promising young pilots with a certain number of flight hours and train them, at the airline's expense, to become a First Officer with a contract that keeps them with the airline for a set number of years. This would not only increase the number of well-trained pilots, but turn a somewhat haphazard private flight training industry into a military-like environment with proven outcomes.
There could be a better way. Airline apprenticeship programs. However, the airlines are too busy thinking up new ways to scam the flying public out of their money with more fees, to come up with a good apprenticeship plan. There are jump seats in every cockpit. I suggest a pilot-in-training occupy those seats during flights and learn from observation, much like young doctors observe, touch and question. Also, the airlines could take promising young pilots with a certain number of flight hours and train them, at the airline's expense, to become a First Officer with a contract that keeps them with the airline for a set number of years. This would not only increase the number of well-trained pilots, but turn a somewhat haphazard private flight training industry into a military-like environment with proven outcomes.
3
brilliant. in the aftermath of 9/11 airlines are going to allow strangers who aren't employed by the airline entry into the cockpit. just because they want to "learn from observation."
please don't quit your day job, neither the airlines nor the TSA will be extending a job offer your way.
please don't quit your day job, neither the airlines nor the TSA will be extending a job offer your way.
I don't understand why airlines dredge the bottom of the barrel looking for pilots who will practically pay to work for them. Since so many people love to fly that there is no shortage of people willing to indenture themselves, I don't understand why there isn't the slightest effort to pay as much as bottom dollar (instead of 50% below) and insure some minimal level of quality.
3
Until we know what happened in those 5 months where the pilot left the program without explanation, all judgements need to be suspended as that may be the key to understanding what may have transpired.
If anything the employer should have demanded an explanation, and let him reenter the program until such time that they were satisfied that they really know where he was, what he did, and why.
Ary Kempler
Ary Kempler
If anything the employer should have demanded an explanation, and let him reenter the program until such time that they were satisfied that they really know where he was, what he did, and why.
Ary Kempler
Ary Kempler
Isn't it ironic that our response to 9/11 created the unintended consequence that we made it possible for a suicidal pilot to kill all his passengers.
2
It's also ironic that the 2nd Amendment, written over 200 years ago and meant to keep a well-regulated citizen-militia in an era of no standing army, has now been turned into a deadly weapons free-for-all? We lose 800x more people to gun violence every year than to aircraft accidents.
6
It would not be difficult to modify current commercial air carriers to be flown remotely as drowns. This amongst other consideration must be addressed to prevent reoccurrence of this magnitude. Having a backup ground pilot safely land the air craft when all else has failed. Safety is expensive, but when one considers the magnitude of the costs of 9/11 and making the craft pilot proof, as well as greatly overcoming of deranged commandeering.
I worked as a jet-rated professional pilot for twenty years and was the chief executive of an aviation company. The reporting and opinion in the press concerning this incident is entirely premature: no professional investigation has been undertaken and completed, nor has any third party, non-state investigative organization or expert examined it along with numerous facts of context.
It does however have all the hallmarks of structured public narrative and is following other sudden events which seem to have ready explanations, expert testimony and broad commentary poised across any number of otherwise unrelated issues.
Moreover, even the timeline and script provided in the press are inconsistent with crew procedures and flight operations; relatedly, other more obvious sources of flight disruption are being avoided in explanatory reporting.
Manipulating the public through cognitive infiltration is relatively easy, and emotionalism and fear are heightened when aviation is used as an operational event platform. Readers should resist premature explanations, as well as irrational inferences to special interest objectives.
It does however have all the hallmarks of structured public narrative and is following other sudden events which seem to have ready explanations, expert testimony and broad commentary poised across any number of otherwise unrelated issues.
Moreover, even the timeline and script provided in the press are inconsistent with crew procedures and flight operations; relatedly, other more obvious sources of flight disruption are being avoided in explanatory reporting.
Manipulating the public through cognitive infiltration is relatively easy, and emotionalism and fear are heightened when aviation is used as an operational event platform. Readers should resist premature explanations, as well as irrational inferences to special interest objectives.
13
Agree. I have been wondering how, seemingly overnight, authorities have decided that the co-pilot did it on purpose. It seems too easy and now all findings are probably being examined to support that theory.
What if he was rendered unconscious and therefore kept breathing normally? Given that the recording picks up the captain pounding on the door, wouldn't it also pick up any sounds of the co-pilot moving around, touching controls, clearing his throat, etc. if he was conscious?
Thank you for discouraging people from jumping to conclusions which 1) slander a possibly innocent man, 2) provide more pain for the victims' families and 3) could distract us from solving what the real problem is if it is not the narrative being pushed by the press.
What if he was rendered unconscious and therefore kept breathing normally? Given that the recording picks up the captain pounding on the door, wouldn't it also pick up any sounds of the co-pilot moving around, touching controls, clearing his throat, etc. if he was conscious?
Thank you for discouraging people from jumping to conclusions which 1) slander a possibly innocent man, 2) provide more pain for the victims' families and 3) could distract us from solving what the real problem is if it is not the narrative being pushed by the press.
2
Really? The fact is, we may never know exactly what happened in this case. It is pretty hard to image that at the exact moment the Captain left the flight deck, the co-pilot had a medical incident. Recovery of the FDR will show what actions the co-pilot took to cause the A320 to enter a descent into terrain. Nothing but deliberate pilot action could make that aircraft go into a smooth, but deadly descent. Did he overdose on his meds deliberately? Possibly. But that would take longer than 1 minute to affect his judgement. Plus, how would he have know the Captain would leave at that moment, so he could not have pre-planned an overdose. However, it is possible that he heard voices that told him to crash. What does it matter. 150 people were pulverized in 1/1000 sec.
1
It may have seemed a self-serving comment, but Germanwings' CEO Carsten Spohr was right when he said that even the best systems aren't going to anticipate and prevent all tragedies. Someone will slip through the cracks of the psychometric profiling. A safety procedure (locking cockpit doors) designed in response to one type of tragedy we hadn't anticipated (terrorists commandeering planes and crashing them into the WTC) leads to another type of tragedy similarly difficult to foresee (a copilot locking the pilot out so how can crash the plane into the Alps).
We can, and should, implement rules that could help forestall these tragedies (e.g., the two-person rule in the cockpit, overhaul our insanely easy access to guns, etc.). But as much as we minimize risk, it will always be there. I'll take my chances on flying because I enjoy, and need, the mobility it gives me.
We can, and should, implement rules that could help forestall these tragedies (e.g., the two-person rule in the cockpit, overhaul our insanely easy access to guns, etc.). But as much as we minimize risk, it will always be there. I'll take my chances on flying because I enjoy, and need, the mobility it gives me.
21
I don't think it's about doors or how many people we have in the flight deck. I think it is about trying to find out what was going on this poor guy's mind, try to learn from what he left behind, his interviews with his doctors and then use that in a positive way to avoid giving certain personality types the chance to get a pilot license and to try to help the ones who are already flying from getting to this point.
Everybody is at risk of having a nervous breakdown. A few years ago a cabin crew from JetBlue reached his, deployed a slide in an airport, grabed a couple of beers, and shouted I quit before sliding down and going home.
Everybody is at risk of having a nervous breakdown. A few years ago a cabin crew from JetBlue reached his, deployed a slide in an airport, grabed a couple of beers, and shouted I quit before sliding down and going home.
1
It seems to me that a critical step is missing in this discussion. A physician excused the co-pilot from work. WHY? It would seem logical that physicians would see the situation as a "code red" and inform the employer immediately. It ought to be impossible for pilots to hide physical conditions from the employer.
3
EMR --Electronic Medical Records-- do exist.
So, look for the error(s) in that case.
So, look for the error(s) in that case.
I was amazed to find out that in the training and in the hiring process, there is no psych exam? Now days, most corporations are using various personality profiles and exams to hire people who will be in much less critical positions than flying a huge hunk of metal full of people. I had to take a personality test when I applied for a position with 7-11 corporate and that was years ago.
I would think that the airlines as well as the FAA will be looking into this very closely. No doubt it won't solve the problem but might prevent airlines from hiring pilots who may be prone to serious mental issues.
I would think that the airlines as well as the FAA will be looking into this very closely. No doubt it won't solve the problem but might prevent airlines from hiring pilots who may be prone to serious mental issues.
1
The age of the suicidal co-pilot is shocking. 27? What does a 27 year old know about handling stress? Why on earth was he given control of an airliner filled with people? I would think piloting a passenger jet with 150 people on board requires nerves of steel, maturity, self assurance, and a clear instinct. These qualities do not happen in a 27 year old under the best of circumstance.
6
Agree - I thought the same thing when that Continental flight crashed in Buffalo a few years ago. The co-pilot was about 22 years old. In fact, her published photo had her in her graduation cap and gown and not in a pilot's uniform!! At first I assumed she was a passenger on the flight and was shocked that she was the co-pilot.
3
You sound cocky! Yet, at the same time I guess that might be a character trait airlines would look for in a prospective pilot!! Nonetheless, this whole Germanwings event is an unbearable tragedy to think about, and my heart goes out to the family and friends of those who perished in such a horrific manner!!!
1
Requiring two people to be inside the cockpit would most likely have avoided this tragedy regardless of the co-pilot's mental state. I noted yesterday that the two-person rule is being instituted immediately in some countries that previously did not require it. While more psychological profiling of pilots should be required, this one simple rule which the U.S. follows, is probably the best safeguard against the kind of terrible tragedy that occurred.
4
I was shocked to read that the author "never met with a psychologist." The NYPD requires a fairly extensive psychological exam and the worst a police officer could do is shoot one or maybe two innocent persons with the standard issue handgun. I'm amazed and will feel differently about flying in the future.
1
Mental health professional here:
The pilot's motives are unimportant. Unfortunately, we now know that this is a plausible scenario. Now what?
We ask "how could we have imagined this?" But if one were to have imagined this scenario prior to the occurrence, it would be seen as a sign of disturbance. There is no professional realm in which there is no mental illness.
If the FAA can't think outside the box, is there a suggestion box somewhere in which imaginative and traumatized individuals may drop the terrifying scenarios they imagine, which can--at any time--become reality?
The pilot's motives are unimportant. Unfortunately, we now know that this is a plausible scenario. Now what?
We ask "how could we have imagined this?" But if one were to have imagined this scenario prior to the occurrence, it would be seen as a sign of disturbance. There is no professional realm in which there is no mental illness.
If the FAA can't think outside the box, is there a suggestion box somewhere in which imaginative and traumatized individuals may drop the terrifying scenarios they imagine, which can--at any time--become reality?
The Headline needs to be changed to:
"How My Anecdotal Stories Have Nothing to Do With The Mental State of the Inside of A Pilot's Mind"
I'm trying to understand the objective of this opinion piece. While somewhat interesting it shades zero light on the "Inside a Pilot's Mind".
"How My Anecdotal Stories Have Nothing to Do With The Mental State of the Inside of A Pilot's Mind"
I'm trying to understand the objective of this opinion piece. While somewhat interesting it shades zero light on the "Inside a Pilot's Mind".
1
there are some services (e.g security services) where candidate's medical record is made available to employers. perhaps this should also be the case for services like airline pilots, where other people's lives are at stake
5
The article is incorrect when it says that most landings are automatic. For example, zero of the airline flights on most smaller and older jets are going to be auto landed and for the planes that are auto land equipped only the smallest percentage of those landings will be auto land. I'd like to point out that the auto land capability is for extremely low visibility conditions where a human would not be able to see the runway. This would mean low lying fog typically and these conditions have low or calm winds associated. The auto land systems currently in use, to my knowledge, can't handle much wind and are restricted by that. It's just not that prevelant to use auto land day to day. In fact, I've never personally witnessed it's use in an A320 after jumps eating in the cockpit many times. This author may have had a different experience flying in the corporate world since he flew business jets for a while.
1
No one would think of leaving a major airline career.There are plenty who leave careers as Regional pilots to pursue other more lucrative careers. If the author would have been hired by Delta like his father he would still be there. You will attract better candidates with better pay and working conditions at the Regional level. My nephew considered the profession but he chose medicine instead. Increased experience required may have kept this individual from attaining this job.
2
I am surprised that any pilot who suffers from depression at any time in their training or career could get or keep their medical certificate.
1
It has been reported that the German authorities found several doctor's attesting for Lubitz being able to take sick leave, even for the day of his flight.
With only 630 flight hours on his back within 18 months of flying, it seems that he must have calling in sick very often. Possibly Lufthansa also put him more frequently on so-called reserve and stand-by duty, only to jump in when another pilot suddenly fell sick.
The 630 hours flight time alone raise a red flag, considering that pilot was only flying an average 35 hours per month. The average flight time of pilots from blocks to blocks is about 70 hours per month.
With only 630 flight hours on his back within 18 months of flying, it seems that he must have calling in sick very often. Possibly Lufthansa also put him more frequently on so-called reserve and stand-by duty, only to jump in when another pilot suddenly fell sick.
The 630 hours flight time alone raise a red flag, considering that pilot was only flying an average 35 hours per month. The average flight time of pilots from blocks to blocks is about 70 hours per month.
2
How many pilots are out there? Today one plane requires 8-10 crews. With the number of commercial planes around that means there must be hundreds of thousands out there. I trust them. Lubitz is a rare exception and I think there is little we can do to catch those exceptions in a free society. Doctors records are in most countries confidential. A pilot who is happy in todays psychological evaluation may experience a personal desaster the next day which deeply saddens him. Who will know, who will tell? Unfortunately life is unpredictable and often unfair. I think the 2 person rule is a good idea, but let's not go overboard. A lot of people can do horrific damage in their workplace. 99,9999% never do. A free society may have to live with that uncertainty for otherwise it would be not free anymore.
6
If this pilot was mentally ill then he may not have been legally reponsible nor morally culpable for what happened. The stigma attached to mental illness along with decreasing expenditures on mental health constitute a "perfect storm." The mysteries of the human mind are concealed, confined and controlled by biology, physics and chemistry.
Culpability doesn't do much for the 149 people aboard that plane who died because he willfully ignored his doctor's advice.
Just because someone is suffering mental illness doesn't absolve them of personal responsibility. He obviously knew he was suffering from something that would have disqualified him from flying, otherwise why tear up the doctor's notice giving him permission to stay out of work? He read the note, decided not to follow it, and then destroyed it. That sounds like someone who can think rationally, at least to the point of understanding that whatever that diagnosis was, it would have prevented him from flying, had Lufthansa known about it.
The person who may be most culpable and potentially legally responsible is the co-pilot's physician, who should have notified the airline that this man was too unstable to fly the plane. Otherwise, why would he issue him a note stating that he should not be working?
If a healthcare provider or anyone in a position of trust is aware that someone is liable to harm himself or others, that person is required by law, at least in the US, to notify the police. Why didn't the co-pilot's doctor do that?
Just because someone is suffering mental illness doesn't absolve them of personal responsibility. He obviously knew he was suffering from something that would have disqualified him from flying, otherwise why tear up the doctor's notice giving him permission to stay out of work? He read the note, decided not to follow it, and then destroyed it. That sounds like someone who can think rationally, at least to the point of understanding that whatever that diagnosis was, it would have prevented him from flying, had Lufthansa known about it.
The person who may be most culpable and potentially legally responsible is the co-pilot's physician, who should have notified the airline that this man was too unstable to fly the plane. Otherwise, why would he issue him a note stating that he should not be working?
If a healthcare provider or anyone in a position of trust is aware that someone is liable to harm himself or others, that person is required by law, at least in the US, to notify the police. Why didn't the co-pilot's doctor do that?
6
Interesting article in The NYT on 9 March: Blocking Paths to Suicide
Article states: "In one study of people who survived a suicide attempt, almost half reported that the whole process, from the first suicidal thought to the final act, took 10 minutes or less. Among those who thought about it a little longer (say, for about an hour), more than three-quarters acted within 10 minutes once the decision was made."
Article states: "In one study of people who survived a suicide attempt, almost half reported that the whole process, from the first suicidal thought to the final act, took 10 minutes or less. Among those who thought about it a little longer (say, for about an hour), more than three-quarters acted within 10 minutes once the decision was made."
4
The most pertinent sentence of the op ed is "The standards were exacting when he started". We all know why that has changed Salaries and working conditions have not kept pace so the Pilots we get today aren't as qualified as they once were.
6
"Eternal vigilance is the price of liberty."
=============================
When we travel on a airplane we place our lives in the hands of the pilots. But all of our lives we trust people to lead us safely. We trust our political leaders to guide us as well.
But ultimately it is up to all of us to be involved in the process of control. It is up to all of us to question authority, all the time. How often do we question, parents, teachers, bosses, politicians, friends and others? And if we do question them and they ignore us, do we persist in our questioning?
Prof. Murphy questioned. He said,"if anything can go wrong, it will". So, we can learn from this tragedy to question and to make changes. And this concern can add meaning and purpose to our lives, all the time...
THANK YOU
=============================
When we travel on a airplane we place our lives in the hands of the pilots. But all of our lives we trust people to lead us safely. We trust our political leaders to guide us as well.
But ultimately it is up to all of us to be involved in the process of control. It is up to all of us to question authority, all the time. How often do we question, parents, teachers, bosses, politicians, friends and others? And if we do question them and they ignore us, do we persist in our questioning?
Prof. Murphy questioned. He said,"if anything can go wrong, it will". So, we can learn from this tragedy to question and to make changes. And this concern can add meaning and purpose to our lives, all the time...
THANK YOU
2
As always, after an incident like this, there is the immediate impulse to find a way to predict and prevent the next.
Some want more mental health evaluations. Not a bad idea, but as a psychologist, I can tell you that those tests are not nearly as revealing as 20/20 hindsight. It's extremely difficult to predict individual behaviors, especially to predict the first time someone acts out.
So, the next suggestion is usually to rule out allowing anyone for a high-risk job, like piloting, if they've ever had any history of mental health treatment. Aside from obviously discouraging people from seeking help, this would probably rule out more people than you think. Look around your own workplace. Chances are, there are coworkers there who have had treatment for depression or anxiety ... and you'd never know it. Many psychological problems can be successfully resolved. It's important for the patient to watch out for signs of recurrence, but most can do that very well.
But, you say, why take the chance? A pilot is responsible for so many other lives! You're right, which is why ongoing checkups might help. But why stop with pilots? Let's do intensive evaluations and monitoring for everyone whose job affects others' safety. Not only pilots and law enforcement, but bus drivers, taxi drivers, food workers (they might poison people!).
At some point, you have to accept "safe enough." Life will never be without its risks.
Some want more mental health evaluations. Not a bad idea, but as a psychologist, I can tell you that those tests are not nearly as revealing as 20/20 hindsight. It's extremely difficult to predict individual behaviors, especially to predict the first time someone acts out.
So, the next suggestion is usually to rule out allowing anyone for a high-risk job, like piloting, if they've ever had any history of mental health treatment. Aside from obviously discouraging people from seeking help, this would probably rule out more people than you think. Look around your own workplace. Chances are, there are coworkers there who have had treatment for depression or anxiety ... and you'd never know it. Many psychological problems can be successfully resolved. It's important for the patient to watch out for signs of recurrence, but most can do that very well.
But, you say, why take the chance? A pilot is responsible for so many other lives! You're right, which is why ongoing checkups might help. But why stop with pilots? Let's do intensive evaluations and monitoring for everyone whose job affects others' safety. Not only pilots and law enforcement, but bus drivers, taxi drivers, food workers (they might poison people!).
At some point, you have to accept "safe enough." Life will never be without its risks.
10
Years ago, I was a flight attendant for a Comair Airlines. I have nothing but great things to say about those pilots I flew with during that time. It was a small airline so most of us congregated outside of work, getting to know each other well, both professionally and personally. I found those pilots to have the highest of integrity, both during the flights, and on the ground.
Later in life, I flew part-time as head flight attendant for an airline, who will remain anonymous. I found those pilots to be just as professional, while on duty. As with my former colleagues we too would congregate occasionally outside of our work.
Imagine my surprise when I attended a house party hosted by one of the airlines pilots, to find him on all fours eating/drinking out of dog bowls. Turned out that on the job, this pilot's performance was outstanding, but once home, he became the essence of a dog. Needless to say, I quickly left, not only the pilot's home, but the airline, letting the airline know about this pilot's behavior outside the cockpit. He had mental issues and presented a danger to the other pilots, flight attendants, and worst of all to the passengers.
My point? We don't ever really know "who" we are working with, but when you work with someone at 30,000 plus miles in the air, and you have responsibility for hundreds of innocent lives, that "who" becomes even more important.
Later in life, I flew part-time as head flight attendant for an airline, who will remain anonymous. I found those pilots to be just as professional, while on duty. As with my former colleagues we too would congregate occasionally outside of our work.
Imagine my surprise when I attended a house party hosted by one of the airlines pilots, to find him on all fours eating/drinking out of dog bowls. Turned out that on the job, this pilot's performance was outstanding, but once home, he became the essence of a dog. Needless to say, I quickly left, not only the pilot's home, but the airline, letting the airline know about this pilot's behavior outside the cockpit. He had mental issues and presented a danger to the other pilots, flight attendants, and worst of all to the passengers.
My point? We don't ever really know "who" we are working with, but when you work with someone at 30,000 plus miles in the air, and you have responsibility for hundreds of innocent lives, that "who" becomes even more important.
8
This excruciating event captures our imaginations.
A commercial pilot's world is a mixture of wonder and routine. The miracle of human flight compounded with the regular checking off of lists adn logging of hour after hour of repetitive surveillance of instruments and tasks. To an extent that is as it should be. No one wants to have Icarus in the cockpit trying to chase the sun. It takes a special blend of attributes, and for the most part those with the jobs have those attributes. We have more Sullenbergers than Lubitzs in the front seats.
Every professional person is granted a level of trust. Trust that we know what we're supposed to know. Trust that we know enough. Trust that we will apply that knowledge for thse who do not have the training, the time, the position to do certain things for themselves. Every mechanic, every lineman, every lawyer, every bus driver, every teacher, applies her or his efforts among others who cannot check every aspect of their work.
sometimes the mix of responsibility and dependency is as blatant as this sad event. Other times there is no sure way to know what the effects are of our actions, for good or ill.
And what happens when the trust is misplaced and the only ones who know it are the very ones who guard it? This is what happens.
A commercial pilot's world is a mixture of wonder and routine. The miracle of human flight compounded with the regular checking off of lists adn logging of hour after hour of repetitive surveillance of instruments and tasks. To an extent that is as it should be. No one wants to have Icarus in the cockpit trying to chase the sun. It takes a special blend of attributes, and for the most part those with the jobs have those attributes. We have more Sullenbergers than Lubitzs in the front seats.
Every professional person is granted a level of trust. Trust that we know what we're supposed to know. Trust that we know enough. Trust that we will apply that knowledge for thse who do not have the training, the time, the position to do certain things for themselves. Every mechanic, every lineman, every lawyer, every bus driver, every teacher, applies her or his efforts among others who cannot check every aspect of their work.
sometimes the mix of responsibility and dependency is as blatant as this sad event. Other times there is no sure way to know what the effects are of our actions, for good or ill.
And what happens when the trust is misplaced and the only ones who know it are the very ones who guard it? This is what happens.
3
This piece made me think of the other professionals to whom we entrust our safety. As an OR nurse with 30 years' experience I watched men and women respond in inappropriate and dangerous ways to emergencies. A surgeon knicked a blood vessel in a parient's abdomen and instead of handling the situation, he ran into the staff lounge screaming that he needed help. I watched an anesthesiologist reading the newspaper while the IV tubing was on the floor, disconnected. A surgeon came to work so drunk he walked I to the wrong OR and interrupted the procedure. There is also a culture in the OR that discourages staff from questioning the senior surgeon's judgement. Because what goes on behind the OR doors is not seen by the public, this behavior won't change. The medical profession could learn from the airlines regarding a hierarchy that puts people, and who trust them, in jeopardy.
7
Perhaps it is time for air traffic controllers to be able to interfere when a rogue pilot manages to overcome the co-pilot or vice versa.
1
As a commercial pilot for almost forty years, my initial reaction to the current controversy is to cringe at possible unnecessary outcomes. The eventuality of a thing like this ever happening, much less happening again is so remote that, in my opinion, our best course is to resist the impulse to change anything. With one exception: the Germanwings incident does illustrate the acute shortage of qualified pilots existing in the industry, a situation that's been predicted for years. More pilots equals better selectivity equals higher standards, simply true.
13
The biggest change - as noted by this ex-military pilot - is the smaller number of airforce vets in the seats.
You get through a military academy and multiple years of flight school - if you have foibles - they will be noted and dealt with - maybe not so much when you attend a private flight college and pay tuition to buy a set of wings.
You get through a military academy and multiple years of flight school - if you have foibles - they will be noted and dealt with - maybe not so much when you attend a private flight college and pay tuition to buy a set of wings.
34
Ahh yes, the Charm School in Colorado Springs...
I guess the folks from Annapolis or West Point are just barely at your exalted level. Forget about about the dirty civilians.
I work with lots of egocentric, "I'm the best" type guys from the USAFA (it make for a long trip). I believe the one of the guys who shut down the wrong C-5 engine at Dover ten years ago was one of the chosen few.
It all smells the same and we all make mistakes.
I guess the folks from Annapolis or West Point are just barely at your exalted level. Forget about about the dirty civilians.
I work with lots of egocentric, "I'm the best" type guys from the USAFA (it make for a long trip). I believe the one of the guys who shut down the wrong C-5 engine at Dover ten years ago was one of the chosen few.
It all smells the same and we all make mistakes.
5
This is hubris.
Your thousands of hours of flying around at the government's expense in multi-million dollar aircraft does make you a better pilot than my thousands of hours flying in private industry. Albeit most of my time is in Jet Turbine helos.
Flight schools are not stupid, they don't turn out substandard pilots and last very long. Nor is the military any better at "noticing" if something is wrong. This could just as well as been a F22, (if this was the cause), with a depressed pilot or one with another agenda. (The army kind of missed what was going on with Hassan Nadal and it resulted in mass murder.) I have never got how 3,000 hours of time in an F14/F18 and the ability to pass carrier quals translates into flying commercial airliners. The first time a military pilot sits in an Airbus, they have 0 hours in type. Just like any other pilot. The military trains their pilots to entirely different parameters.
Your thousands of hours of flying around at the government's expense in multi-million dollar aircraft does make you a better pilot than my thousands of hours flying in private industry. Albeit most of my time is in Jet Turbine helos.
Flight schools are not stupid, they don't turn out substandard pilots and last very long. Nor is the military any better at "noticing" if something is wrong. This could just as well as been a F22, (if this was the cause), with a depressed pilot or one with another agenda. (The army kind of missed what was going on with Hassan Nadal and it resulted in mass murder.) I have never got how 3,000 hours of time in an F14/F18 and the ability to pass carrier quals translates into flying commercial airliners. The first time a military pilot sits in an Airbus, they have 0 hours in type. Just like any other pilot. The military trains their pilots to entirely different parameters.
1
SteveRR: Correct. The majority are not trading their military careers for poor wage civilian flying. When I flew in the 70s-90-s Every Captain, First Officer and Flight Engineer had flown or had military careers; Korea/Vietnam. Those were the days when there were numerous Airlines. One could tell which Captain had been in the Navy or Air Force by the type of landing: Navy pilots seemed to always have a little bump when they hit the run-way; trying to catch that Tail Hook on the Air Craft Carrier. Now, with American/U.S. Air- United/Delta owning the airways- there simply are not sufficient jobs to draw experienced mature military pilots.
The pilots I know run the gamut, but there is a lean towards Tea Party libertarians, it's a lot of I am on my own up here. Nothing should surprise anyone. I've never worked anywhere where I did not see the bell curve of a normal distribution, regardless of how har organizations try to convince us they are the cream of the crop. Design for all the points on the curve.
20
This awful civilian disaster, and means to prevent it happening, dominates the news. On the other hand, every day, every military in the world hands equally-destructive tools to kids with even less training, much of that devoted to destruction, and also has to cope with things nuclear in the air, underwater and on the ground. Is it because the ensuing damage is often shrouded by war that we forget to be as concerned? Is it just because we don't picture ourselves at the receiving end, as do millions of innocents around the world.
4
Mr. McGee mentions in this article that his father, - a former Military Trained Pilot who flew theP2 Neptune in Korea and then went on to fly for a Commericial Airlein Company mentioned the fact that he felt it strange that with only 630 Hours of Flying time was flying 2nd seat in the A-320 Lufthansa Aircraft. As a former Air Force pilot who flew the B-52, after a year long stint in the Aier Force Pilot Training School, - after which one attends Survival school, and in my case Nuclear Weapon School and the the Actual B-52 Training School, (a 3 month Program), before being assigned to a Combat Ready Crew, it became quite obvious that one was under HEAVY Scrutiny by the Air Force once he stepped on a Undergraduate Pilot Training Base, and then even recognized that the Scrutiny continued throughout his Military Flying carreer, - not only by the Flight Surgeon whose presence was always visibile, the Medical phyiscals, AND the 1 complete day taken up with the Psychiatric testing, - 600 question exam 1st, and then a meeting in the afternoon with the Wing Psychiatrist with a face to face interview ever 2 years. While one was initially assigned as a Co-Pilot to an experienced Aircraft Commander and his crew, - it was clear that the newbie was being 'observed' - not only for the flying Skills possessed, but the interaction with the rest of the crew, Leadership skills, and their Judgement skills when a situation came up that might have altered the planned flight. IE: Emergenicies.
2
I'm a former US Airways Express pilot who retired after 18 years of accident and incident free service in the Northeastern United States. Me. McGee's suggestion that because of one poor mentally ill German running an Airbus into the Alps and killing 140 people, that pilots be subject to ongoing psychological testing is ridiculous. He knows nothing about the German pilot screening process, or their cockpit access procedures. In the US, when either pilot left the cockpit, a flight attendant had to come in and stand by the door. That was so that when the pilot wanted to come back in the cockpit, the flight attendant could look out the peephole and make sure it was the pilot. If the Germans had done that one little thing, this event may never have occurred.
35
Thank you for sharing this information. It helps calm my existing jitters about flying in general as well as bringing balance to the question of what’s involved in a pilot’s training. I always assume the pilot and crew want to arrive safely to whatever destination they are flying to, and will continue to believe that because what other choice do I have? Even the most vigorous training, screening and evaluating process will not always guarantee a successful and fail-safe result. If someone is determined to do evil and destructive acts while flying, I just hope either I’m not on board, or at least God is the co-pilot
27
Is it settled that the pilot deliberately crashed the plane or is it an interesting proposition because we rely so much upon airline pilots to be highly skilled, reliable and completely in control of their aircraft, and are basically helpless to do anything when a pilot is not? I think that perhaps we should consider that fortifying the cockpit against intruders which became the focus after the September 11th, 2001 hijackings was an example of the kind of thinking that is going on with respect to this crash in Europe, too much concern with one problem and not enough with all the other significant problems that might occur. Better to examine what happened and to think through is all thoroughly before rushing to relieve everyone's anxieties.
24
Andrew McGee has been there, done that, and left the airline pilot profession on his own terms. The traveling public would be well served by following his advice.
2
What, no longer fly?
1
I wonder if we would be talking about his psychology if he were Muslim
3
Me, too, Anthony, but I suspect we mean this differently. People seem to think that all things mental are "psychological" and can be understood in those terms. But some things mental are not psychological at all; they're more in the realm of philosophy, and the kind of nihilism that the copilot exhibited is not likely to be psychologically explicable. We just happen to live in a time in which everything is taken to be scientifically explicable.
Even so, I'm hoping it is so. I'm hoping that the pilot had a brain tumor, in fact. I can't think of any hell worse than coming to a nihilistic point of view.
Even so, I'm hoping it is so. I'm hoping that the pilot had a brain tumor, in fact. I can't think of any hell worse than coming to a nihilistic point of view.
2
Interesting take. I agree about people always seeking scientific explanations for things. I would add that they do so with a religious faith in science.
In the Western world, the idea of the individual taken to its extreme becomes Nihilistic. Those of us who stop short of Nihilism are doing so not because of, but in spite of the philosophical underpinnings of our society. Whereas extreme Islamic fundamentalism drives people to do crazy things, so does extreme Nihilism, and whatever other philosophies that make people in the Western world so consistently depressed and likely to perform mass killings.
In the Western world, the idea of the individual taken to its extreme becomes Nihilistic. Those of us who stop short of Nihilism are doing so not because of, but in spite of the philosophical underpinnings of our society. Whereas extreme Islamic fundamentalism drives people to do crazy things, so does extreme Nihilism, and whatever other philosophies that make people in the Western world so consistently depressed and likely to perform mass killings.
The time has come not only to return to having a minimum of three pilots in the cabin to start thereby always have two left if one has to get coffee or use the head but we need to take things one step further. Using the satellite systems now in place where the location of the plane is always known while at the same time having Google Earth data where the land contours are close to being exact computer software can be developed rather easily to prevent even a pilot from taking a plane down into a location where it cannot land safely.
3
Pilots are only human, and all humans are just a mass of wiring representing neurological mysteries that may never be fully understood. Ordinary people go crazy all the time, so what's to stop a pilot from suffering the same mental breakdown? They will try to fully understand this situation but they never will, the same as why we won't understand why young men suddenly go into crowded theatres or school lunch rooms and start firing indiscriminately into the crowd. Its a scenario out of a Stephen King novel, no point in trying to grasp it. What really needs to be done is for the security system for the cockpit to be revised. I find it baffling that they don't purely have a code or biometric entry system rather than this scenario when it can be locked - and kept locked - by someone from the inside. That to me is asking for trouble.
31
Biometrics? Knock the pilot who's outside the flight deck out and hold his hand or retina up to the scanner.
To be absolutely sure there is no way a high jacker can get into the flight deck to make it absolutely impossible for ANYONE to get through the door.
To be absolutely sure there is no way a high jacker can get into the flight deck to make it absolutely impossible for ANYONE to get through the door.
A lot of readers are calling for "a test" to challenge suicidal thinking in pilots, matched by others who scoff at this. But there are tests to see if someone taking anti-depressants should be taking them. Brain scans indicate that a full 20% of patients react negatively to anti-depressants, some catastrophically and resulting in suicide. The younger the person, the more dangerous they can become. The questions we need to ask now pertain to this issue. Was this pilot on anti-depressants? Had he taken them, ever? Did his doctors even consider a brain scan to verify proper treatment, especially considering so many souls were in his care?
4
I was "shocked" when I read that Lubitz had only 630 hours of flight time. I thought that all pilots who fly the "big iron" had Air Transport Pilot certification, which has a minimum requirement of 1,500 hours of flight time. The minimum amount of time you must have for a Commercial license, required to do any flying-for-hire whether it is carrying a paying passenger or towing a banner at Coney Island, is 500 hours. So Lubitz was by any standard a very low-time pilot, even compared with many recreational pilots.
15
The idea of having at least 2 people in the cockpit makes sense. The idea that having a steward or stewardess as the designated 2nd person, when someone has to have a bathroom break, makes no sense.
I would respectfully suggest having a 3rd pilot sit there. It would add pilot jobs, in a market saturated with pilots wanting to fly--and would permit a qualified person be able to manage any and all emergencies.
Human nature is such, that there will always be the potential for pilot related mid-air criminal acts.It really is sad and tragic to think that all those innocent passengers lost their lives because of a high functionning misfit.
I would respectfully suggest having a 3rd pilot sit there. It would add pilot jobs, in a market saturated with pilots wanting to fly--and would permit a qualified person be able to manage any and all emergencies.
Human nature is such, that there will always be the potential for pilot related mid-air criminal acts.It really is sad and tragic to think that all those innocent passengers lost their lives because of a high functionning misfit.
6
It is strange that no psychanalist mentionned the Szondi test and the Icarius complex and the epiletiform professions.
Icarius complex :
ascensionism (the notion that the future is not dictated by the past or present, and no destination or goal is unreachable) combined with the prospection of falling (The notion that the future will include a failure, foreboding sense of encountering a "crash and burn")
Epiletiform professions[
The work objects of the epiletiform professions are the primordial elements, earth, fire, water, air, spirit; the work circumstances are height/depth, rise/fall, waves/swirling motion (turning in circle); the main sensory perceptions are balance and olfaction; work instruments are means of transportation: bicycle, electric or conventional train, boat, automobile, aircraft; professional activities are locomotion and moving occupations for the striving e-, and praying (silence), devotion, care, help, charity for the striving e+.
Jobs of the epiletiform, "Cain" striving e- include: porter (bellhop), carter (truck driver), sailor, able seaman, chauffeur aviator etc (see Wikipedia).
Icarius complex :
ascensionism (the notion that the future is not dictated by the past or present, and no destination or goal is unreachable) combined with the prospection of falling (The notion that the future will include a failure, foreboding sense of encountering a "crash and burn")
Epiletiform professions[
The work objects of the epiletiform professions are the primordial elements, earth, fire, water, air, spirit; the work circumstances are height/depth, rise/fall, waves/swirling motion (turning in circle); the main sensory perceptions are balance and olfaction; work instruments are means of transportation: bicycle, electric or conventional train, boat, automobile, aircraft; professional activities are locomotion and moving occupations for the striving e-, and praying (silence), devotion, care, help, charity for the striving e+.
Jobs of the epiletiform, "Cain" striving e- include: porter (bellhop), carter (truck driver), sailor, able seaman, chauffeur aviator etc (see Wikipedia).
One of the problems with commercial aviation, is the lack of experienced military pilots. Most of the old-guard have long retired from commercial careers and today's military pilots are staying in the military due to lack of jobs and pay in America's shrunken civilian aviation industry. Most new pilots have very little tangible flying experience-receiving all of their training at for-profit schools. The lack of real flying skills and over reliance on automation have rendered a real crisis in our aviation industry. The age of pilots [left seat] has decreased dramatically. The lack of a real skill-set combined with lack of maturity and levity is something the remaining old-guard talk about. In some arenas, there is also a push to lower the age to 21 for a Captain's seat. As a retired airline employee, I have no desire to fly with someone whose only experience is what they've gotten from a flight training school.
94
Actually, many military pilots tend to eventually arrive at the major airlines with fewer flight hours and less pertinent flight experience than pilots that come from a civilian path. For example, flying a fighter jet is completely different than flying a passenger jet. Many old timers like to lament the changing of the guard in any indusrty, but it's all talk. The U.S. has the safest system in the world and our pilots young and old should be applauded.
2
Very ignorant comment, by the time a pilot makes it to a major airline whether he is military or civilian, he has an average of 7 to 10 years flying experience. I fly for a major airline and we hand fly the aircraft quite a bit, both after takeoff and for landing. Many pilots go to four year colleges like Embry Riddle where they get an excellent background in all facets of aviation. I was civilian and flying turboprops for several years in the winters of Montana, and two other flying jobs, gave me a skill set that was as good as any pilot as I have ever flown with. When I got hired at a major US airline I had over 5000 hours, about the average amount for a new hire in my class. US pilots go through a far more demanding gauntlet than a German kid who is hired off the streets and is in the cockpit at less than 700 hours. In the US you can not even qualify as an airline copilot with less than 1500 hours.
2
Well, the airlines are too busy thinking up new ways to scam the flying public out of more fees to come up with a good apprenticeship plan. There are jump seats in every cockpit. I suggest a pilot-in-training occupy those seats during flights and learn from observation, much like young doctors observe, touch and question. Also, the airlines could take promising young pilots with a certain number of flight hours and train them, at the airline's expense, to become a First Officer with a contract that keeps them with the airline for a set number of years. This would not only increase the number of well-trained pilots, but turn a somewhat haphazard private flight training industry into a military-like environment with proven outcomes.
1
This story is so incredibly sad. I know this is old school, but couldn't we give pilots a key to the door?
40
The pilot had a key (code) which could be overridden from the cockpit.
1
Even if they did Cathy, there is a mechanical old style bolt the we use to close the door in case the electronic system fails. Having another person in the cockpit will not help either. I think it's time to reevaluate the way new joiners are tested for a training license. I have been flying airliners for 30 years and the pressure has never been greater that in these days, not only for crew members, but for everybody involved in the operation, from mechanichs to controllers. You either have what it takes or you don't, as in all careers.
I agree with this - that seemed curious to me that the pilot did not have guaranteed access back into the cockpit
1
We do not know for sure if this was deliberate. There is a possibility the pilot could have suffered some disability making him borderline conscious and just pressing this door toggle the wrong way in a haze. Setting plane for descent could be an automatic action of pilot thinking he is suffering from hypoxia. I know the odds point in other direction, but let's wait for the end of investigation. The charge of deliberate murder is serious, let's try not to go through the equivalent of a public lynch.
63
I disagree, respectfully. There is more evidence to show this was in fact, intentional.
2
After watching BBC America, PBS, CBS, and reading the NYTimes and listening to the various commentaries of what happened the same phrase kept coming up, "....fly with different pilots all the time." It might be an idea to have pilots be partners, like in police departments. What better way to keep tabs on fellow pilots when you have a partner you have a connection with and want to have their back....as well as the passengers and flight crew.
3
I would not use the police as an example to emulate. We have recently seen too many acts of thuggery by our trigger happy police. A yearly physical and psychological exam for pilots (and police) would be much more effective. And removing the stigma from mental illness would go a long way towards encourage victims to seek the help they need.
1
I suspect that the basic answer to this "issue" is to have three qualified pilots on board all commercial passenger (and freight) aircraft, regardless of the additional cost. What possible good could a flight attendant in the cockpit do in another case of a renegade pilot or co-pilot? The difference in status alone would give the flight-qualified individual an advantage over a flight attendant, not to mention the difference in technical qualifications.
3
Mr. Spohr, the CEO of Lufthansa would be well-advised to read this article. Up to now, he publicly refuses to recognize there could be anything wrong with Lufthansa's practices and procedures and he has refuted the measure of requiring two persons in the cockpit at all times. This after one of his staff appears to have murdered 150 people due to an allegedly psychotic condition. It brings to mind the time-tested notion that arrogance breeds mediocrity - or worse. The German regulators may well force it upon Lufthansa, but this accident is beginning to reveal fundamental weaknesses in the management attitudes of the company that raise serious questions about whether they are truly safe to fly with.
20
So far Lufthansa is one of the safest airlines. We don't know yet if the pilot had a 'psychotic condition' as you write. So let us wait with judgements until we know more.
3
"....fundamental weaknesses in the management attitudes of the company that raise serious questions about whether they are truly safe to fly with....."
Mark; Have you studied the safety record of Lufthansa vs. other carriers in the world, particularly Canadian and U.S. carriers?
You may want to research this issue before issuing a blanket criticism of the entire company.
I have flown Lufthansa before and I'd fly with that company or any of its affiliates again.
Mark; Have you studied the safety record of Lufthansa vs. other carriers in the world, particularly Canadian and U.S. carriers?
You may want to research this issue before issuing a blanket criticism of the entire company.
I have flown Lufthansa before and I'd fly with that company or any of its affiliates again.
7
I have flown with Lufthansa too. And I've had issues with their passenger management under not unusual weather-related stress conditions. And yes, they did get me from Point A to Point B safely, as they do for most people most of the time; but that is not the issue. Their overall safety record can be fine, but the negative reaction of their most senior management to the idea of always having two people in the cockpit, as is normal practice in North America, was kind of shocking to say the least. A less arrogant approach would have been to tell the public they were taking the matter under advisement. Now it looks as if the German regulators will do it for them. Thank goodness for that.
Yes, it would be great to have a test that would predict whether a pilot would deliberately crash a plane, a kid would bering a gun to school, a bright high school student would sign up with ISIS.....Please produce it and make everyone take it, so that we will never have to worry about such tragedies anymore.
34
Career airline pilot here.
After a pilot gets caught drunk or hungover, passengers poke their head in the flight deck and ask if I've been drinking.
After an accident attributed to fatigue, they will ask me how I slept or if I'm tired.
Going forward I imagine they are going ask if I've experienced any suicidal ideations.
After a pilot gets caught drunk or hungover, passengers poke their head in the flight deck and ask if I've been drinking.
After an accident attributed to fatigue, they will ask me how I slept or if I'm tired.
Going forward I imagine they are going ask if I've experienced any suicidal ideations.
70
It is a legitimate question to be asked by a trained psychologist engaged by the employer and passenger has to trust both.
3
There's a simple technological fix to prevent this tragedy that could be done immediately and wouldn't require extra personnel in the cockpit or other expensive changes.
Just change the lock on cockpit doors to a push-button combination lock that uses a pass code. This would let either pilot leave the cockpit to use the lavatory or for other personal reasons, and the other pilot would be unable to lock him or her out. Unlike a lock using a key, a combination lock using a pass code would prevent anyone else on the plane from overcoming the pilot and using the key to enter the cockpit themselves.
Pilots and flight attendants often fly on different routes, so the same pass code should be used on all the planes in a fleet. It could be changed every month or so to enhance security.
The only downside to this solution is that pilots and flight attendants would have to learn the new code at intervals, but this is a trivial price to pay to prevent similar tragedies in the future.
Just change the lock on cockpit doors to a push-button combination lock that uses a pass code. This would let either pilot leave the cockpit to use the lavatory or for other personal reasons, and the other pilot would be unable to lock him or her out. Unlike a lock using a key, a combination lock using a pass code would prevent anyone else on the plane from overcoming the pilot and using the key to enter the cockpit themselves.
Pilots and flight attendants often fly on different routes, so the same pass code should be used on all the planes in a fleet. It could be changed every month or so to enhance security.
The only downside to this solution is that pilots and flight attendants would have to learn the new code at intervals, but this is a trivial price to pay to prevent similar tragedies in the future.
2
Would every pilot, outside the cockpit, be able to withstand the threats of a potential hijacker or terrorist and withhold such a code when under duress? Having the code override inside the cockpit is supposed to counter this threat.
3
It looks like( Bild newspaper source) that the coopilot stopped the training because of serious depression and was under medication for 1 and half year.
How could Lufthansa employee someone him?
How could Lufthansa employee someone him?
1
How many thousands of airline pilots are there in the world? And what are the chances of spotting an exceedingly rare anomaly like Lubitz, when we don't even know what signs we're looking for?
Rules that forbid having a single person in the cockpit at any time during a flight might be the best we can do. As a security feature, there is a button in the cockpit that can be pushed to "lock out" someone who has the key code, and it appears that Lubitz used this to his advantage. I'm sure the system could be modified, in conjunction with the two-occupant rule, so that two widely separated buttons have to be pushed; this would ensure that one person, acting alone, cannot commandeer the plane.
Rules that forbid having a single person in the cockpit at any time during a flight might be the best we can do. As a security feature, there is a button in the cockpit that can be pushed to "lock out" someone who has the key code, and it appears that Lubitz used this to his advantage. I'm sure the system could be modified, in conjunction with the two-occupant rule, so that two widely separated buttons have to be pushed; this would ensure that one person, acting alone, cannot commandeer the plane.
17
Finally, a constructive and inexpensive addition to this scattershot discussion. The double key solution, which we often see in depictions of procedure in missile launch controls, absolutely insures that two people are needed, significantly reducing the potential problem with door lock overrides. Since this is not connected with any flight controls, the usual enormous technical delays for implementation plain should not be there. Good call, Jim.
5
Thank you for the valuable information from your father. So 630 hours flying should not be enough to qualify someone to act as a pilot and have the lives of hundresds of people in his hands. Who knows, maybe with more hours of training that co-pilot would have exhibited strange behaviors that could raise a red flag.
Also, doing a psychological test only in writing seems pretty absurd! Who would ever answer yes to questions like "Do you ever feel angry/depressed/suicidal etc"?
I sure hope this horrible tragedy will improve those aspects of pilot training.
Also, doing a psychological test only in writing seems pretty absurd! Who would ever answer yes to questions like "Do you ever feel angry/depressed/suicidal etc"?
I sure hope this horrible tragedy will improve those aspects of pilot training.
3
I would contend that anyone who does NOT answer "yes" to a question like "Do you ever feel angry/depressed/suicidal etc" is lying and should be further evaluated. In fact, simple "tests" of this sort are not good indicators of mental stability. An in-depth assessment conducted by a qualified and impartial professional is a good, but not perfect, indicator of an applicant's, and a practitioner's, overall suitability for any high-stress/high-significance job.
6
I'm old enough to remember when Delta pilots at parties at our complex would not drink the day before they flew. But there were Eastern airlines pilots who were drunks, and some Eastern pilots brought in drugs from South America. So those pilots all bring the same issues to the cockpit that doctors bring to the operating room. One time a doctor I dated asked me why I only had one glass of wine, and I said I'm trying a case. He told me he'd operated when hung over. I said that's why he wasn't my personal physician.
19
Can we predict this kind of thing? I do not know, but stories like this--this direct, honest, funny and sad description of what it's like to fly and what it's like to deal with difficult co-pilots are exactly what we need in trying to find some way to understand this tragedy.
http://www.thecriticalmom.blogspot.com
http://www.thecriticalmom.blogspot.com
4
Clearly Germanwings is not being upfront about everything that they know. They are only marginally more vocal than Malaysia Airlines when they lost MH370. A lot is being kept secret for whatever reason. Airlines must start putting in place better systems to evaluate the mental conditions of their Pilots . Right now Airlines need to upgrade safety standards in general, The two people at all times in the cockpit, putting in a system in place where the crew also can communicate with the ground control, better tracking of aircraft etc need to be taken up on priority basis. Perhaps even CCTV cameras in the cockpit with monitors in the crew/passenger area and vice-versa.
3
Planning for every contingency is probably impossible, but still it is always worth trying to improve safety. With that in mind, the two person rule in the cockpit sounds like good policy. Might I suggest another possible policy?
In today's world, planes can be operated remotely, or can fly themselves. Why limit ourselves to the people on the plane? In an emergency let ground control assume control. A panic button outside the cockpit could alert ground control who could then monitor the flight path and action of the plane, and take over if it appears to be necessary.
In today's world, planes can be operated remotely, or can fly themselves. Why limit ourselves to the people on the plane? In an emergency let ground control assume control. A panic button outside the cockpit could alert ground control who could then monitor the flight path and action of the plane, and take over if it appears to be necessary.
11
I wonder if it is possible to design an objective test to evaluate the mental state of a person. The mental state need not necessarily be purely psychological; it could just be religious belief, as in the case of the Pilot Batouti who deliberately ditched Egypt Air Flight 990 into the Atlantic ocean, on 31 October 1999, killing all 217 passengers on board. Some kind of brain scan may be needed.
3
At the very least, we can take comfort that this isn't a systematic problem. It would have been far more troubling if the aircraft had some design flaw or mechanical fault. We can't guard against every contingency, but at least this demented individual--if he indeed did act deliberately--will never harm anyone again.
3
To me, it's more troubling that a pilot could harbor both suicidal and homicidal thoughts without anyone noticing any unusual signs or symptoms. A mechanical design flaw can be replaced or fixed going forward. As for never harming anyone again, I guess the friends, families and loved ones of the 149 other people who were on that plane would respectfully disagree.
3
It seems that anyone who has been treated for a serious mental illness at nay time during their lives should not be allowed to be a commercial pilot.
5
What better way to discourage people who recognize that they may have mental problems from getting treatment than to have them know that their treatment will not only be made public but will preclude their obtaining future gainful employment.
17
Don't the mentally ill have enough stigma, NYChap?
1
Did I miss something? No one is talking or writing about incapacity anymore. Unless I missed something, that this kid deliberately, consciously flew his plane into the mountain is now the conclusion.
5
Apparently the breathing of the co-pilot can be heard continuously on the cockpit voice recorder while the pilot is banging on the door, indicating co-pilot was at least conscious. That and the new report out this morn that co-pilot had been declared unfit to work by a doc in Germany.
1
Maybe this is what the airlines can do with all those millions (billions?) they've been keeping for themselves since fuel prices have dropped...train, test, and evaluate their pilots.
6
They're sure not spending it on comfortable seating.
3
This 10 year airline pilot should know better than to draw such conclusions before all the data is in and analyzed by experts. In the industry. we call that "hanger flying", pilot gossip.
8
I can see no way to prevent another occurance again as long as we have the limited technology in the cabin that we presently have. With an advanced technology that prevents any change to a flight plan without the approval of a controller remote from the plane it is just too easy to bring a plane down.
3
With todays technology, it would seem that as all the signals indicating an descent toward an imminent crash, that an autopilot computer should have taken over the plane. Also, the captain should have been able to talk directly to air traffic controllers from outside the cockpit.
13
A interesting write-up by this pilot. Thought provoking on any number of levels.
For me the write-up points to this...and it's a question all of us who work, be you a pilot or a janitor, mid-level corporate minion or trucker....how well do you know your coworkers, eh? Really....how well? There's no way to know what's truly going on in anyone's mind.
However spend time (with a person) and perhaps you can read the signs. And that might be the key. Proper worker training in interpersonal skills to pick up signs, and to then alert the companies health pro's that there might be a problem. I know...I know...'tis easy to say, but hard to do. File it under "no one likes a squealer."
But that might be the best we can do because regardless the multi-layered security apparatuses designed to prevent catastrophic failures that we deploy. Regardless of all the procedures we grind into people to facilitate safety, at heart there is no protection from a flawed human being intent on harm. Excepting being able to read the signs.
John~
American Net'Zen
For me the write-up points to this...and it's a question all of us who work, be you a pilot or a janitor, mid-level corporate minion or trucker....how well do you know your coworkers, eh? Really....how well? There's no way to know what's truly going on in anyone's mind.
However spend time (with a person) and perhaps you can read the signs. And that might be the key. Proper worker training in interpersonal skills to pick up signs, and to then alert the companies health pro's that there might be a problem. I know...I know...'tis easy to say, but hard to do. File it under "no one likes a squealer."
But that might be the best we can do because regardless the multi-layered security apparatuses designed to prevent catastrophic failures that we deploy. Regardless of all the procedures we grind into people to facilitate safety, at heart there is no protection from a flawed human being intent on harm. Excepting being able to read the signs.
John~
American Net'Zen
7
Let me know when you get inside a pilot's mind. That will be quite a feat.
6
The key difference between the crazy pilot and the crazy leaders is that the former killed 150 people while the latter saddled us with seven decades of never-ending wars and untold number of human deaths and sufferings.
Our leaders first dethroned democratically elected secular government of Iran and installed tyrannical and torturous Shah Regime that created a fertile ground for the rise of Ayatollahs.
Then they undermined a puppet socialist government of Afghanistan by training, financing, arming and indoctrinating the Taliban and mujahedeen in Afghanistan during the Soviet occupation of that country.
Then they were the best friends with the Saudi dictatorial clique that used their petrodollars to spread extremely rigid and distorted religious views called Wahhabism across the Middle East and the world.
Then they dethroned or undermined relatively moderate and secular governments of Iraq, Libya and Syria leading to the creation and spread of the Al Qaeda and ISIS.
Right now our leaders are supporting the Shiites in Iraq fighting the Sunnis and the Sunnis in Yemen fighting the Shiites.
If the aforementioned makes any sense to you, then you are much smarter than me personally...
I am simply befuddled with our foreign policy.
Our leaders first dethroned democratically elected secular government of Iran and installed tyrannical and torturous Shah Regime that created a fertile ground for the rise of Ayatollahs.
Then they undermined a puppet socialist government of Afghanistan by training, financing, arming and indoctrinating the Taliban and mujahedeen in Afghanistan during the Soviet occupation of that country.
Then they were the best friends with the Saudi dictatorial clique that used their petrodollars to spread extremely rigid and distorted religious views called Wahhabism across the Middle East and the world.
Then they dethroned or undermined relatively moderate and secular governments of Iraq, Libya and Syria leading to the creation and spread of the Al Qaeda and ISIS.
Right now our leaders are supporting the Shiites in Iraq fighting the Sunnis and the Sunnis in Yemen fighting the Shiites.
If the aforementioned makes any sense to you, then you are much smarter than me personally...
I am simply befuddled with our foreign policy.
8
But, what have your musings on the state of the nation to do with the topic at hand, which is air safety?
8
See, everybody is willing to check if a pilot is drunk or crazy but nobody is checking if the leaders are utterly incompetent. We always follow them blindly... This tragedy is an omen that we should examine our leaders in the same way...
1
Excellent piece "Inside a Pilot's Mind", Andrew MCGee. No point examining Andreas Lubitz , the Lufthansa co-pilot who suicided his plane alone in the cockpit, killing 149 innocent souls he was entrusted with carrying from Barcelona to Dusseldorf on Tuesday 24 March. Yes, pilots undoubtedly exhibit all varieties of human behaviour. But the only question that I wonder about is why Lubitz stopped his pilot's training for several months, when whatever "medical" reason cannot be disclosed because of German (or "luft")medical privacy rules? Where are privacy rules when it comes to the minute (and televised virally) details of the lives of the innocents who were murdered when Lubitz smashed his plane (with his pilot frantically beating on locked pilot cabin door) into the French Alps? People who have "medical" issues should be prohibited from flying any aircraft - remote-controlled miniature airplanes, paper planes, hot-air balloons and wee drones as well.
3
There's no psychological testing prior to getting into medical, law or business school. We don't demand psychological testing of judges, politicians, religious leaders. Applicants to police departments, the FBI and similar agencies are given psychological tests before being accepted as trainees, but we don't routinely monitor their psychological functioning via formal testing over the course of their careers when, presumably, job-related stressors are becoming paramount. Psychological tests can measure personality traits but cannot necessarily predict how those traits will be applied in real life, or how anyone will change over time. Often, it is not the trait itself that is problematic, but its application, hence the concept of the prosocial psychopath. Steady hands both build and diffuse bombs.
3
Regarding medical school, no one gets to take care of patients without a supervisor closely watching you for several years. And you can't even prescribe any medications until after you graduate and are licensed.
4
I find the whole discussion well meaning but misguided. To commit suicide is despair. But to be determined to take a lot of people with you is, in the absence of strong ideological loyalties, sheer nihilism. I know of no "test" for nihilism.
4
A despairing 28 year-old, driving a vehicle with 149 other souls aboard through empty air, ends up handing whole thing over to another power. There is no sense to be made of this. We shouldn't try. We lament the senseless loss and bow our heads to the strange force of mystery. Another thing we will never understand.
4
Apparently there is a downside to German medical privacy rules. Is there an upside?
1
The Germanwings tragedy makes me very sad and upset, because beyond every lost, pain and mourning it will seriously damage the reputation of Lufthansa airline included pilots. I am a frequent flyer between New York and Budapest. I have had many takeoffs and landings, and according to my experience with the Lufthansa pilots I had always extremely smooth flights. Unfortunately the crazy Germanwings co-pilot changed the world.
4
how exactly are pilots selected, trained and supported? We have accepted lower airfares with the corresponding absent customer service and experience. To be able to identify optimal crew members would take resources that we have deemed secondary to lower airfares. Perhaps a balance should be in the discourse
3
For every risk, whether it's heart attack, stroke, or mental crisis, there will be no perfect predictive test. Even with a good test, you will either ground lots of people who would never have an in-flight event, or miss some who would. Our tests for mental illnesses aren't good tests, and much can change between the day the test is administered and the day something happens.
4
Here's the kicker: even experienced psychiatrists only have a slightly-better-than-even chance of determining whether someone will commit suicide or not, and that's when there are obvious stressors. The idea that anyone can predict with any degree of certainty whether a pilot will decide to crash a plane into the ground? Don't make me laugh.
Now, as more information about this pilot emerges, likely there will be a lot of finger pointing and a lot of, "How could this have been allowed to happen?" What happened with the German plane was a tragedy. Was it avoidable? Perhaps. But hindsight is 20/20, and individual human behavior has always been, and will likely always remain, largely unpredictable.
Now, as more information about this pilot emerges, likely there will be a lot of finger pointing and a lot of, "How could this have been allowed to happen?" What happened with the German plane was a tragedy. Was it avoidable? Perhaps. But hindsight is 20/20, and individual human behavior has always been, and will likely always remain, largely unpredictable.
12
I agree. And personally I'm much more concerned about and endangered through all the irresponsible car 'pilots' who are texting or drinking or using drugs.
1
A pilot's job used to be sort of like a doctor's job. Wow, high paid, neato job dude. Nowadays you can be replaced by a button. And the airline companies and health-care biz make all those years of training worth about the same as a burger flipper.
5
Seems from all the news on this tragic crash ~ there needs to be at least two people in the cockpit (;-)) so a single action of instant insanity doesn't kill many innocents. Flying has suddenly taken on a new viewpoint. :-/
5
Nicely written and well-informed account, thanks!
7
Flying today out of SFO, I was sitting by a pilot while waiting to board my flight. In the midst of all the talk about the Germanwings tragedy, I couldn't help but think about what was going through his head. We instill so much trust in these pilots to do their jobs safely, and tragedies like the one aforementioned remind us that at the end of the day these pilots are people, too, who make human decisions.
Sadly, this decision resulted in a grave loss of many lives. My hearts go out to the families and friends of the victims.
Sadly, this decision resulted in a grave loss of many lives. My hearts go out to the families and friends of the victims.
6
Cockpit doors are designed to thwart hijackers. The irony is that lunatic pilots appear to be a greater threat to passenger safety.
1
There are more people flying, more flights, and thus more pilots today than ever before. At the same time, anyone who remembers flying 30 or more years ago knows that airlines now will cut whatever corner they are allowed to cut in order to maintain their profits. That's a bad combination. Almost inevitably, it means that unbalanced people will end up in control of the lives of hundreds of passengers more often than we would like. The measures that would change that reality would either raise the cost of air travel or cut into the profits of the airlines. Tragically, I suspect we will collectively prefer to lose a plane periodically, and hope we're not on it.
8
One theory is that the whole world went insane after 911, spawning the Bush Rampage and a general feeling of anomie something like what happened in "The Invasion of the Body Snatchers." Our lives have been surreal, reckless and generally directionless since then. People in "conservative" circles say the most insane, irresponsible things imaginable. A modest attempt to expand health insurance coverage generates hysteria about "death panels." Hobby Lobby goes all the way to the Supreme Court to certify its "sincerely held religious beliefs." The 911 hijackers did the unimaginable, and now this horrific act has been repeated at least twice. We invaded Iraq for no explainable reason and destabilized every stable government in the region, setting up an Armageddon-like showdown between Shias and Sunnis as the nuclear-armed Israelis create a Likud-Republican Axis of power that leaves the majority of Americans and Israelis powerless and ignored. Meanwhile, our major media are giving terrorist beheadings prime-time publicity. Our "public-be-damned" plutocrats destroy jobs, withhold raises for 15 years and fire anyone who asks for one. Our financial institutions have been taken over by frauds and con artists who swindled anyone naive enough to do business with them. Our "politicians" promise nothing but "austerity" in the dwindling twilight years of our once great nation. Our zeitgeist is pure madness! The wonder is that planes reach their destinations at all these days!
24
You should sign up to be pilot.
1
Why can’t the airlines install a bathroom WITHIN the cockpit or expand the secure cockpit to include the front passenger bathroom?
This might require the elimination of two first-class seats in order to provide another passenger bathroom, but that wouldn’t be an unreasonable price to pay to prevent another Germanwings disaster.
This might require the elimination of two first-class seats in order to provide another passenger bathroom, but that wouldn’t be an unreasonable price to pay to prevent another Germanwings disaster.
6
It was reported in another newspaper that a friend said that the co-pilot took a leave of absence because of depression and burn-out. It was also reported that the co-pilot was having relationship problems with a girlfriend. I have no way of knowing if these reports are true, but if they are, they could aid us in understanding the co-pilots frame of mind at the time he crashed the plane.
3
He had to postpone his training a few years ago due to " burnout" it was reported. This suggested a more thorough psych eval and greater supervision if allowed to work. Look for a big time coverup, the more accurate test is the test of time. Get to know someone 10 years observation etc. he was unknown entity.
5
There's a relatively simple technological solution to this problem that could be done immediately and would not require extra personal in the cockpit or other costly changes. The lock on the cockpit door should be changed to a push-button combination lock. This would allow either pilot to go to the lavatory and return
3
Once on a trip to Panama, I fell into conversation with a couple from Columbia, South America, about various experiences flying. The man informed me that he had been in a commercial airliner crash where the door to the cockpit had been open to the passengers (long before 9-11, 2001). As the plane was going down, the captain was slapping the co-pilot, trying to get him to calm down. Needless to say, whatever they were trying didn't work.
On the way out to the island where this conversation took place, I sat in the co-pilot's seat in the small prop aircraft we were on, carrying about 12 passengers. Since I had taken some flying lessons and flown on small planes before, it wasn't that surprising to me to be there, but I wouldn't want just anyone sitting in that seat.
Landing back in Panama city, the pilot and tower did something that would never be allowed here. Another aircraft was landing right behind us, so as soon as we hit the runway and slowed down a bit, our plane swerved off the runway and onto the grass. Outrageous.
One informal rule in flying that concerns me is the saying, "Eight hours from bottle to throttle," meaning a pilot should not drink alcohol eight hours before flight time. This is not enough time. Hung over is dangerous. If you fly a lot, you can see flight crews "tanking up" at airport hotels all the time. The bars do good business. There probably isn't enough vigilance on the whole issue of pilots, drugs and alcohol.
http://terryreport.com
On the way out to the island where this conversation took place, I sat in the co-pilot's seat in the small prop aircraft we were on, carrying about 12 passengers. Since I had taken some flying lessons and flown on small planes before, it wasn't that surprising to me to be there, but I wouldn't want just anyone sitting in that seat.
Landing back in Panama city, the pilot and tower did something that would never be allowed here. Another aircraft was landing right behind us, so as soon as we hit the runway and slowed down a bit, our plane swerved off the runway and onto the grass. Outrageous.
One informal rule in flying that concerns me is the saying, "Eight hours from bottle to throttle," meaning a pilot should not drink alcohol eight hours before flight time. This is not enough time. Hung over is dangerous. If you fly a lot, you can see flight crews "tanking up" at airport hotels all the time. The bars do good business. There probably isn't enough vigilance on the whole issue of pilots, drugs and alcohol.
http://terryreport.com
11
There is no good solution to this human problem. The idea that a second person in the cockpit could prevent a rogue pilot from crashing the plane is ridiculous. While the person is trying to fight the rogue pilot the aircraft would be completely out of control and a crash very likely.
Apart from having good psychological testing and counseling, airlines should consider paying pilots more and have them fly fewer hours, so that their lives are not as stressful in the first place. Budget airlines pay their pilots poorly and make them fly long hours, so someone who already has mental problems could reach a breaking point.
A longer term alternative is to have emergency remote flying procedures, since these modern airplanes are all computerized anyway and we know that we can fly drones from thousands of miles away.
Apart from having good psychological testing and counseling, airlines should consider paying pilots more and have them fly fewer hours, so that their lives are not as stressful in the first place. Budget airlines pay their pilots poorly and make them fly long hours, so someone who already has mental problems could reach a breaking point.
A longer term alternative is to have emergency remote flying procedures, since these modern airplanes are all computerized anyway and we know that we can fly drones from thousands of miles away.
3
These tragedies are further compounded by the fact that in many of these cases, we don't know what really happened. We should collect the flight data in a cloud at some flight data collection center on ground somewhere, and video tape the cockpit & plane.
The airplane's descent started as soon as the captain left the cockpit. The captain must have felt the descent and wondered that something was amiss (he had just left it at cruising altitude). So perhaps he did not even go to the restroom and returned to the cockpit to check what was wrong within a minute. If the lock was disabled for five minutes as per the design (according to news reports), then the plane was doomed to hit the mountains, as it took only six minutes from the time the captain left the cockpit to the time it crashed. If the door was not locked from inside, then captain had a thirty second window to open the cockpit door by using his emergency code. Perhaps he forgot the code; perhaps the code did not work. Even if he could get in, at best he would have about two and half minutes to avoid the plane crashing into mountains. It is possible, but it would have been a close call. It is surprising that co-pilot's breathing was normal until the last moment, right before the crash. Only a person who is not seeing the impending death can be that calm. Is it still possible that the co-pilot was in-capacitated somehow, and was in a catatonic stage?
The airplane's descent started as soon as the captain left the cockpit. The captain must have felt the descent and wondered that something was amiss (he had just left it at cruising altitude). So perhaps he did not even go to the restroom and returned to the cockpit to check what was wrong within a minute. If the lock was disabled for five minutes as per the design (according to news reports), then the plane was doomed to hit the mountains, as it took only six minutes from the time the captain left the cockpit to the time it crashed. If the door was not locked from inside, then captain had a thirty second window to open the cockpit door by using his emergency code. Perhaps he forgot the code; perhaps the code did not work. Even if he could get in, at best he would have about two and half minutes to avoid the plane crashing into mountains. It is possible, but it would have been a close call. It is surprising that co-pilot's breathing was normal until the last moment, right before the crash. Only a person who is not seeing the impending death can be that calm. Is it still possible that the co-pilot was in-capacitated somehow, and was in a catatonic stage?
3
"...my father was struck by how little flight time the co-pilot was reported to have (only 630 hours)."
Actually, this only speaks to the foreign system, which is similar to the trade schools of Europe or even the US military. You pick relatively inexperienced pilots and put them through your own schools and training and then pair them with relatively experienced captains when they start flying the line. In order to fly for a major carrier in the US, you need to show up to your interview with 1000s of hours under your belt, experience gained through other sources, such as the military or instructing, or flying for smaller airlines.
Of course if you flew smaller commuter jets in the early to mid 2000s you likely saw hoards of pilots who looked barely old enough to drive, with 200 hours, in the right seat. That all ended with the crash in Buffalo, and stricter time requirements.
It's probably almost impossible to screen for mental problems. Pilots are smart, and who wouldn't hide their problems if he/she wanted to keep their job? It's not like you're going to strap people to polygraphs and ask them if they are depressed or drink to much--this isn't the CIA.
Congrats to the author for making such a big career change after 10 years as a pilot. That would be almost impossible nowadays with the economy the way it is.
Actually, this only speaks to the foreign system, which is similar to the trade schools of Europe or even the US military. You pick relatively inexperienced pilots and put them through your own schools and training and then pair them with relatively experienced captains when they start flying the line. In order to fly for a major carrier in the US, you need to show up to your interview with 1000s of hours under your belt, experience gained through other sources, such as the military or instructing, or flying for smaller airlines.
Of course if you flew smaller commuter jets in the early to mid 2000s you likely saw hoards of pilots who looked barely old enough to drive, with 200 hours, in the right seat. That all ended with the crash in Buffalo, and stricter time requirements.
It's probably almost impossible to screen for mental problems. Pilots are smart, and who wouldn't hide their problems if he/she wanted to keep their job? It's not like you're going to strap people to polygraphs and ask them if they are depressed or drink to much--this isn't the CIA.
Congrats to the author for making such a big career change after 10 years as a pilot. That would be almost impossible nowadays with the economy the way it is.
15
If I was getting on a flight with 150 people and I found out a 28 year old male pilot was going to be left alone in the cockpit I would have got off quickly. No way could they have enough experience. Many are way to immature at that age and now days many are spoiled and cannot handle anything that doesn't go their way. Did the captain say something to him that he couldn't handle and he cracked then and there? You know, "I show him"? One sees it now days, the kids in the family are in charge. They can't handle the responsibility and when they become young adults they cannot handle life's ups and downs. Is that what happened here?
4
I find it much more troublesome that we have presidential advisers in their mid 20s.
5
"... a 28 year old male pilot..." Lindbergh was 25 when he flew to Paris. How many fliers were younger when when they became aces in WWII? Would you have got off if it were a 28 year old woman? Too much second guessing and fake hindsight in your comment.
Sorry, but some twenty-somethings are sharp as a tack and more mature than many of their elders. (I'm in my sixties, so this is not generational loyalty.)
It's not at all clear that what happened with this young man has anything to do with immaturity or lack of smarts. We search for answers, and people like answers because answers make them feel at home in the world. But I feel much as I did when, presented with news of a mass killing, my mother would ask me, "Why in the world would he do that?" What rationale would be sufficient? Barring a brain tumor, what satisfying explanation can anyone offer?
It's not at all clear that what happened with this young man has anything to do with immaturity or lack of smarts. We search for answers, and people like answers because answers make them feel at home in the world. But I feel much as I did when, presented with news of a mass killing, my mother would ask me, "Why in the world would he do that?" What rationale would be sufficient? Barring a brain tumor, what satisfying explanation can anyone offer?
I spent 4 years doing pilot instruction. The ones that would kill you were of two types. Macho and trying to appear macho. A construction worker tried to run the left wing tip into the ground on takeoff. He quit after that. My boss had a huge college football player who was intent on diving into the ground. She covered his eyes. Several who went into the airlines had a phase of really bad landings. The appear macho one I remember the most would scream at air bumps, refuse to allow a turn for the first 15 minutes of flight. I went on vacation and he ended up with a macho instructor who made him fy in a nearly stalled condition, full flaps and power. The student in his attempt to stay level with the horizon caused him to push on the rudder pedal producing a spin. The instructor recovered from the spin at tree top level. There was a tear in the flaps about 3 inches long. He repeated the same thing on the next lesson.
Andreas may fit another pattern. 27 years old and single, described as very quiet. I can imagine relatives giving him a hard time about it, which can lead to depression.
Andreas may fit another pattern. 27 years old and single, described as very quiet. I can imagine relatives giving him a hard time about it, which can lead to depression.
2
I stopped before it got to the point where I had to trade flying for a living. I went as far as a J-3 off 900 feet mowed out of a bean patch in Marshall Michigan. Hot gusty days when, with the split door wired up and let down you could smell the hay or see an old horse skeleton in a field below or blow up balloons and chop them with the prop. stiff headwind and you can land with no groundspeed. i am still happy I refused to trade
2
It has become perfectly clear that changes should be made to procedures and standards for operating aircraft. This should NOT be left to individual operators or even national mandates, but agreed as a matter of International Standards or Convention, so that ALL airlines (flying across international borders) are working from EXACTLY the same set of rules.
3
Pilots are human beings. So are car drivers. Nobody can stop a car driver next to your car from texting or drinking or speeding or eating or reading or putting on makeup...
Give me the safety of airplanes with human pilots any day compared to the egomaniacal sociopaths we share our roads with everyday who couldn't care less about anybody's safety.
Give me the safety of airplanes with human pilots any day compared to the egomaniacal sociopaths we share our roads with everyday who couldn't care less about anybody's safety.
8
It appears Andreas Lubitz was an evil person who did something unforgivable. Such people create terrible harm from time to time--often destroying the lives of as many people as they can. There are also saintly people whose motivations can be just as hard to fathom. Perhaps this is because, at the extremes, there is no fathoming such things--these are realms of human experience that the rest of us are cut off from. But just as one shouldn't count on a saint to make things right, it's a bad idea to perpetually defend against the possible actions of a genuinely evil person. While the former is merely ill-advised, the latter tends to drag us down, resulting in a grimmer and more hopeless world. So, I think those who can should ignore Andreas Lubitz, pretend that he never existed. We should try to lift up our spirits and not fall prey to the doubts, paranoia, and malaise that people like him can leave in their wake.
1
My son in law is a pilot and has been for quite a long while.
When he and my daughter became engaged (years ago ,she's a flight attendant). People would ask - "what's he like?"
I would respond that he was like the most normal low key guy I had ever met and he would be exactly the person I would want "driving" an airplane that I'd be a passenger in. He's still of that demeanor - and so are his pilot buddies.
It is so unfortunate that people who are already afraid to fly may suspect they may be tragically harmed by the very person who should be keeping them totally safe in a plane. There's always going to be crazies around, but we hope the airlines will be able to finally figure out a way to really keep people safe, at least from those crazies.
It's just not fair for all the low keyed so normal pilots, such as my son in law, be feared by the public. But there will be some who fear even him and his so normal buddies. And too, are those normal easy going pilots going to ultimately suspect each other at times, too? Sad.
When he and my daughter became engaged (years ago ,she's a flight attendant). People would ask - "what's he like?"
I would respond that he was like the most normal low key guy I had ever met and he would be exactly the person I would want "driving" an airplane that I'd be a passenger in. He's still of that demeanor - and so are his pilot buddies.
It is so unfortunate that people who are already afraid to fly may suspect they may be tragically harmed by the very person who should be keeping them totally safe in a plane. There's always going to be crazies around, but we hope the airlines will be able to finally figure out a way to really keep people safe, at least from those crazies.
It's just not fair for all the low keyed so normal pilots, such as my son in law, be feared by the public. But there will be some who fear even him and his so normal buddies. And too, are those normal easy going pilots going to ultimately suspect each other at times, too? Sad.
21
So I learn from this ex-pilot that there is very little psychological testing of pilots before we put our lives in their hands, and in the Bergdahl article I learn that similarly, there is very little psychological testing of military recruits before we send them out with lethal weapons and the expectation that they will protect their fellow soldiers in battle. For jobs that risk lives we should be more caring and careful, shouldn't we?
44
Let's not forget the psychological testing, or lack thereof, of the police ... and the discussion now about the state of mind that officers bring to their interactions with the public everyday.
8
Excellent and thought provoking article. We need to ask which is more cost effective: providing counseling or other outreach resources to pilots who may be suffering from mild to moderate treatable mental illness before it gets out of hand and costs lives? Or settling with the families of each victim for millions of dollars? Most people with mild to moderate depression aren't suicidal but that's not the only risk. People with untreated depression often suffer from difficulty sleeping. Exhaustion alone causes loss of focus , difficulty concentrating, irritability, and at its worst erratic behavior. Throw in the anxiety of trying to conceal your distress from others and what you have is a recipe for tragedy. This young man was a ticking time bomb in control of a powerful instrument that can be easily turned into an IED. We assume that pilots want to take off and land as safely as we do. But they have careers that are stressful and frequently take them away from their personal lives, which could be plagued by debt, dysfunction, previous traumas, addiction issues, ECT. For the most part we have no clue what most of the people we come in close contact with have going on behind close doors and in their mind. The point when someone snaps and turns homicidal/suicidal is often just as much of a surprised to them as to everyone else.
59
Your point about the FO's flight time is interesting. I wonder if the US method of forcing pilots through either the military or a ladder of civilian flying jobs does a better job of weeding out unstable people than an ab-initio program. I suspect the answer is yes.
"I never met with a psychologist"
FWIW, that's not the norm at big carriers in the US. At least one major US airline has a full day psych "interview" before a job offer; it's literally half the interview process, and pretty clearly where the decision is made. All of the big three in the US require at least some psych evaluation.
"I never met with a psychologist"
FWIW, that's not the norm at big carriers in the US. At least one major US airline has a full day psych "interview" before a job offer; it's literally half the interview process, and pretty clearly where the decision is made. All of the big three in the US require at least some psych evaluation.
26
Being a trained psychologist, I would like to point out that the author's irony about having been asked "Do you ever get angry?", having apparently answered this question affirmatively, and still having been hired is completely out of place. This is a standard question on a "lying" or "faking" scale - as everyone gets angry sometimes, the author wouldn't have been hired if he answered NO on this and other similar questions.
Apart from that, I must admit I am nonplussed by learning that airlines do a very little ongoing psychological and psychiatric assessment of crew members. A standard psychiatric interview (not a test!) could do a lot to prevent accidents such as this latest one.
Apart from that, I must admit I am nonplussed by learning that airlines do a very little ongoing psychological and psychiatric assessment of crew members. A standard psychiatric interview (not a test!) could do a lot to prevent accidents such as this latest one.
36
On any given day at any given time what is known what is on a pilot or co-pilots mind is completely unknowable Assume the worst. When one decides to leave the cockpit in order to go to the bath room require a flight attendant to 'baby sit' the pilot or co-pilot until the one who left for the bathroom returns...
5
Apparently that is the rule for American airline companies, but that is not the case with many airlines around the world. I think that's about to change. I have already seen articles stating that companies (e.g., Air Canada) are now putting that requirement in place immediately. Hopefully that will be the standard on all airlines everywhere.
3
What is clear from this incident and the Malaysian catastrophe, the existing certification and control systems used by the airlines are inadequate.
There are precedents that airlines could use to help with passenger safety. The US military has an extensive personality screening and monitoring program for anyone who has control of nuclear weapons. The system is not perfect, but it has prevented any one person from going rogue, and detonating a nuclear device during the entire atomic age.
Due to the risk involved with nuclear weapons systems, the certification process in the military is VERY intrusive, but perhaps the principles can be adapted to airline use.
There are precedents that airlines could use to help with passenger safety. The US military has an extensive personality screening and monitoring program for anyone who has control of nuclear weapons. The system is not perfect, but it has prevented any one person from going rogue, and detonating a nuclear device during the entire atomic age.
Due to the risk involved with nuclear weapons systems, the certification process in the military is VERY intrusive, but perhaps the principles can be adapted to airline use.
8
Another pilot told me a story many years ago about a student of his who showed up for a solo but only to fly near the airport. He kept in touch by radio with the student as she flew off. Then she told him over the radio that she was going to fly the airplane over to where she and husband lived, dive the plane into the house and kill her husband. She really meant it--she circled around the house a number of times. She had to be talked into abandoning that plan and coming back to the airport which she did. You really cannot say what is going on in anyone's mind and someone who seems fairly normal could be under stresses that others simply do not notice.
41
The PBS aviation expert, Miles O'Brien, said on the NewsHour tonight that in the past, commercial pilots came from the military, so in a sense they had already been vetted before they started working in the industry. They were known quantities. That's not so today.
This co-pilot was only 27 years old. The author's father (a life-long pilot) was struck by how little flight time the copilot had. I think that is significant, not because the copilot's flying skills were deficient, but because he had not been vetted, either by time or experience. He was an unknown.
This co-pilot was only 27 years old. The author's father (a life-long pilot) was struck by how little flight time the copilot had. I think that is significant, not because the copilot's flying skills were deficient, but because he had not been vetted, either by time or experience. He was an unknown.
118
What Miles O'Brian didn't detail was the difference between this guy's 700- hours and the 1250-1500 hours required in the US. FYI there are plenty of pilots who have come up through GA (general aviation).
1
Thanks for the info that more hours are required in the US.
Mr. O'Brien's point was not that all pilots should come from the military. Rather, it was that in the past, pilots were better known than they are now, because they had track records.
Whatever the case was in the past, the information that has come out in the last few hours (Friday morning, 3/27) about a "hidden" illness confirms that very little was known about this young man.
Mr. O'Brien's point was not that all pilots should come from the military. Rather, it was that in the past, pilots were better known than they are now, because they had track records.
Whatever the case was in the past, the information that has come out in the last few hours (Friday morning, 3/27) about a "hidden" illness confirms that very little was known about this young man.
3
If passengers and the airlines cannot trust their pilots then the whole system breaks down. It is only after these (thankfully) extraordinarily rare horrific tragedies that we really ponder how much power and authority these faceless people have over us. Will we now begin to demand that the airlines regularly test their pilots for any signs of psychological stress or possible impairment? We have already been made aware of some red flags concerning Lubitz's past and perhaps his leave of absence during training could have terminated his professional flying career (and in hindsight, definitely). What absolutely has to end is any "one person in the cockpit is OK especially if for a short time" policy. The US should codify its standard procedure and other nations should follow suit.
It's relatively easy to say that the red flag cases deserve deeper scrutiny, clearance by a psychologist, etc. But what about the rest of the pilots? What do we really need to expect them to reveal to their employers if they have thousands of hours of flight time and had no interruption in their training? I don't think people should panic here and many Americans can no doubt rest easier knowing that two people in the cockpit at all times on US flights is standard procedure (still should be an FAA regulation); the rest of the world deserves nothing less on its flights, too.
It's relatively easy to say that the red flag cases deserve deeper scrutiny, clearance by a psychologist, etc. But what about the rest of the pilots? What do we really need to expect them to reveal to their employers if they have thousands of hours of flight time and had no interruption in their training? I don't think people should panic here and many Americans can no doubt rest easier knowing that two people in the cockpit at all times on US flights is standard procedure (still should be an FAA regulation); the rest of the world deserves nothing less on its flights, too.
28
What happens when the isn't a "guy" flight attendant working the flight?
It seems to me that the lock on this particularly aircraft was called upon to function outside its design parameters. The pilots refusing to let other pilots into the cockpit scenario was either overlooked or considered and rejected as not necessary. Whatever assessment was made on the subject will be re-examined in light of this and every other accident.
This indicates to me we can't build in fail-safes for every situation. Yeah, they will figure out how to prevent this from happening again. (And at the same time, give someone without authorization access to the flight deck? I can't see a 'fail safe' for this that doesn't present a risk that an unauthorized person can access the flight deck.) We have to trade off one kind of safety for the other. And hope that our solution doesn't make something else worse.
As far as the guessing game as to the person's mental health; I am really not sure that's the reason he did it, if he did it. He had no symptoms. In my experience, you can tell when a person is really, really, really (suicidally) depressed. That's an anecdote and generalization, I realize. No symptoms leaves the possibility of other reasons for this guy doing this–for reasons of health–like he had a terminal illness like an ogliodendroglioma, the symptoms come on fast and it kills you really fast. Until your dead, though, you pretty much act normal except for severe headaches.
This indicates to me we can't build in fail-safes for every situation. Yeah, they will figure out how to prevent this from happening again. (And at the same time, give someone without authorization access to the flight deck? I can't see a 'fail safe' for this that doesn't present a risk that an unauthorized person can access the flight deck.) We have to trade off one kind of safety for the other. And hope that our solution doesn't make something else worse.
As far as the guessing game as to the person's mental health; I am really not sure that's the reason he did it, if he did it. He had no symptoms. In my experience, you can tell when a person is really, really, really (suicidally) depressed. That's an anecdote and generalization, I realize. No symptoms leaves the possibility of other reasons for this guy doing this–for reasons of health–like he had a terminal illness like an ogliodendroglioma, the symptoms come on fast and it kills you really fast. Until your dead, though, you pretty much act normal except for severe headaches.
Mr. McGee's perspective is very insightful.
But before we all go on an extreme introspective journey and analyze this tragedy into the next century, shouldn't we all take a step back, breathe and acknowledge this was one person, among thousands and thousands in this career, who inexplicably did a horrific act?
Can we prepare ourselves, in this world of answers for everything, that we may never know the reason why?
We simply cannot come up with technical fixes for everything that humans do. I will continue to trust the cockpit crew of whoever is flying my airliner. No amount of security, automated systems, etc. will ever replace our dependency on the humans in front.
The magnitude of the loss of life in an airliner crash takes our attention away from the everyday risk we expose ourselves to on the highway, subway, commuter train or other means of transportation.
We live every day with exposure to the mental state of others around us, whether they be driving our bus, sharing the road with us or handling our train.
Let's continue to give our pilots the benefit of the doubt. Our odds have been and will always be better with them.
But before we all go on an extreme introspective journey and analyze this tragedy into the next century, shouldn't we all take a step back, breathe and acknowledge this was one person, among thousands and thousands in this career, who inexplicably did a horrific act?
Can we prepare ourselves, in this world of answers for everything, that we may never know the reason why?
We simply cannot come up with technical fixes for everything that humans do. I will continue to trust the cockpit crew of whoever is flying my airliner. No amount of security, automated systems, etc. will ever replace our dependency on the humans in front.
The magnitude of the loss of life in an airliner crash takes our attention away from the everyday risk we expose ourselves to on the highway, subway, commuter train or other means of transportation.
We live every day with exposure to the mental state of others around us, whether they be driving our bus, sharing the road with us or handling our train.
Let's continue to give our pilots the benefit of the doubt. Our odds have been and will always be better with them.
206
... but Emile Durkheim warned us that suicides would become a common scourge of developed societies. We see this is the signs of stress and sudden "cracking" everywhere and pilots are certainly not immune.
4
Doing nothing, simply because these events are very rare, seems foolish to me. Maybe we can't prevent every disaster, but shouldn't we try? Unless we analyze the cause and try to come up with solutions, we'll never know.
For example, the 2-person cockpit rule seems simple and wise.
At the other extreme, ground-controlled planes might or might not be technically feasible, affordable, and useful to deal with emergencies.
Airplane travel has become safer over the years because every plane crash was analyzed, a cause or possible cause determine, and changes made - even if they took years to implement - to prevent future occurrences.
Some of these changes were mechanical, and some in procedures, or "cockpit culture."
Trying to weed out mentally ill and potentially dangerous pilots seems very sensible.
For example, the 2-person cockpit rule seems simple and wise.
At the other extreme, ground-controlled planes might or might not be technically feasible, affordable, and useful to deal with emergencies.
Airplane travel has become safer over the years because every plane crash was analyzed, a cause or possible cause determine, and changes made - even if they took years to implement - to prevent future occurrences.
Some of these changes were mechanical, and some in procedures, or "cockpit culture."
Trying to weed out mentally ill and potentially dangerous pilots seems very sensible.
3
It also takes our attention away from the millions of safe flights that occur each year. This was my initial reaction as well.
1
From a passenger perspective pilots need to undergo psychiatric tests frequently. Their personal life should be open to scrutiny, e.g. social media and emails.
From a pilots perspective, it will be hell from now on. They will be under constant scrutiny.
From an airlines perspective, the costs just went up.
From a pilots perspective, it will be hell from now on. They will be under constant scrutiny.
From an airlines perspective, the costs just went up.
12
Fail-safe. Buddy system. Automation. These are not new concepts. However, what is missing is the old good fashion of human value. Pilots and air traffic controllers are now a number on a spreadsheet, an item on a checklist or a pawn in government budget. When you take pride and sense of responsibility and all other intangibles by reducing human capital into another profit and/or cost center, humanity is altering its value system. It would not surprise me if some actuarial spreadsheet might exist out there calculating how much a human life is worth for a corporation running a tight ship. GM's ignition switch was not the first. Remember Ford's Pinto?
In the age of terrorism and suicide bombers, maybe mayhem is unavoidable, but you don't want corporations to be an accomplice in the name of profit. No, as Warren Buffett once pointed out, airlines were not such a great business - until now. Corporations need to survive but you don't want them to be just a profit machine irrespective of other cost. And a human life is one of those cost too high to breach. Will regulators worldwide heed to the warning against the everything goes low cost anything?
In the age of terrorism and suicide bombers, maybe mayhem is unavoidable, but you don't want corporations to be an accomplice in the name of profit. No, as Warren Buffett once pointed out, airlines were not such a great business - until now. Corporations need to survive but you don't want them to be just a profit machine irrespective of other cost. And a human life is one of those cost too high to breach. Will regulators worldwide heed to the warning against the everything goes low cost anything?
29
WE have to rethink the security issue. What is in place to prevent a terrorist from getting in also kept the pilot from getting in.
5
Well, I have seen this in JetBlue. The flight attendants bring the food cart up the aisle and then position it across the front end of the aisle. The guy is holding the cart onto the panels that are in front of the front-seat passengers. The lady then goes to the cockpit door. It might have been the co-pilot but let's just say it was the captain, who emerged and the lady flight attendant entered the cockpit. The cockpit door was open only a few seconds and the guy was blocking the path any terrorist passenger would have to take to get to the cockpit door while it was open. If there's any sign of trouble, they would wait until all is under control before opening the plated door. There was none. After the captain used the lavatory and emerged, he and the lady flight attendant traded places again. So for another few seconds the security door was open but you'd have to get past the man flight attendant blocking your path with the service cart. To reach that point, you would have to get past me, and any other passengers trying to subdue you. If any trouble, the lady flight attendant and the co-pilot would be inside the cockpit, door securely closed, and they would make an emergency landing. My guess is, the co-pilot would operate the controls and the flight attendant would make the announcements.
34
Clearly, pilot psychology will be more scrutinized than ever, and that is a good thing. I have about 3 million miles and I have sometimes wondered about the possibility of pilot suicide. Terrorists will always be with us, but so will disturbed individuals, some of whom are flying the airplane! We have been fortunate pilot suicide is very rare, but I fear it will now increase.
55
This is another failure of imagination. After 9/11 the focus was on keeping terrorists out of the cockpit. No one focused on the possibility of a pilot or co-pilot who might be the danger. The crew must always have a secret override for entry in case of such deliberate acts or medical emergency.
29
This tragedy highlights one feature on airplanes that should be relatively easy to change. The crew on the aircraft apparently can only communicate directly with ground control from the cockpit. Planes could be designed with a backup communication system so that, in the event the crew can't access the cockpit, they can at least alert flight control that there is a problem.
With the Germanwings plane, it appears that the co-pilot blocked the pilot from entering the cockpit, but there could be other situations where one of the crew might be accidentally locked out of the cockpit--perhaps a malfunction of the door coding system at the same time that the pilot was incapacitated--and it would be helpful to consult with ground control about possible solutions.
Also, if a rogue pilot was heading a plane toward the center of a city or toward a particular building, the crew could tell ground control to call authorities and order an evacuation of the area where the plane was headed.
I wonder if a similar situation happened with Malaysian Air (MH370) that disappeared. Perhaps one pilot was also locked out of the cockpit and left as helpless as the pilot of the Germanwings plane.
There's no way to make any airplane 100% safe, but I hope some improvements to aircraft design and / or staffing procedures come out of this nightmarish disaster.
With the Germanwings plane, it appears that the co-pilot blocked the pilot from entering the cockpit, but there could be other situations where one of the crew might be accidentally locked out of the cockpit--perhaps a malfunction of the door coding system at the same time that the pilot was incapacitated--and it would be helpful to consult with ground control about possible solutions.
Also, if a rogue pilot was heading a plane toward the center of a city or toward a particular building, the crew could tell ground control to call authorities and order an evacuation of the area where the plane was headed.
I wonder if a similar situation happened with Malaysian Air (MH370) that disappeared. Perhaps one pilot was also locked out of the cockpit and left as helpless as the pilot of the Germanwings plane.
There's no way to make any airplane 100% safe, but I hope some improvements to aircraft design and / or staffing procedures come out of this nightmarish disaster.
62
Certainly, take all precautions to protect the safety of everyone on the airplane. Two in the cockpit sounds good, for example.
But like multiple shootings I don't think there is a way to prevent all airline crashes, especially the intentional kind. You just cannot screen out every psychopathic or misguided or mentally ill person.
Sad. I'm hoping that, in honor of those poor victims, who had to be cognizant of what their fate was to be, we do find more ways to secure the safety on board.
But like multiple shootings I don't think there is a way to prevent all airline crashes, especially the intentional kind. You just cannot screen out every psychopathic or misguided or mentally ill person.
Sad. I'm hoping that, in honor of those poor victims, who had to be cognizant of what their fate was to be, we do find more ways to secure the safety on board.
56