Teachers like Carmen Fariña because she was a former teacher. The suggestion is that a chancellor who is a former teacher will somehow have special insight into how to improve educational outcomes.
This is, of course, absurd. A chancellor requires a different skill set from a teachers in the same way a general requires a different skill set from a tank driver. The general must be concerned with strategy, logistics, and politics. The tank driver must be concerned with tank tactics and the physical skills of operating a tank.
A former businessman comes much closer to fulfilling the requirements of chancellor than a former teacher.
This is, of course, absurd. A chancellor requires a different skill set from a teachers in the same way a general requires a different skill set from a tank driver. The general must be concerned with strategy, logistics, and politics. The tank driver must be concerned with tank tactics and the physical skills of operating a tank.
A former businessman comes much closer to fulfilling the requirements of chancellor than a former teacher.
4
Once again the falsehood of public charter schools "culling" their special-needs students to improve test scores has appeared among these comments. In fact, public charter schools in NYC actually retain more of their special-needs students than public non-charter schools. See the NYT article "More Special-Needs Students Remain at Charter Schools, Report Finds".
Nationally, public charter schools provide at least an equivalent education to public non-charter schools, at a cost savings of $4000/student (national average). Clearly, public charter schools are more efficient than public non-charter schools. The public non-charter schools should learn from them.
Nationally, public charter schools provide at least an equivalent education to public non-charter schools, at a cost savings of $4000/student (national average). Clearly, public charter schools are more efficient than public non-charter schools. The public non-charter schools should learn from them.
1
There is an entire paragraph in here about how Ms. Farina uses her grandson as an example while talking about education, but no mention of the fact that her grandson goes to private school.
7
Ms. Farina may be right that "you know it when you see it" - any parent can tell you that. My daughters 3rd teacher blew me away every time I dropped in –because she clearly loved kids and teaching. Most parents agree a test is not the whole picture. We can all agree that teachers need to connect and empathetic, care about kids and teach content. But what happens when a teacher won't do that? Ms. Farina and her labor partners need to offer an alternative to charters and test-based evaluations.
When teachers who are chronically drunk remain in the classroom for years, or a "screamer" can last for years, or cases of outright abuse last for years - it's time for labor and the left to step up. Just like the GOP can't just repeal Obamacare without offering a replacement, teachers must offer a sensible solution that ensures that all teachers are caring, connect with children, and have solid instruction. We don't need to have a system of heroes - but we need every teacher to be solid. And the litmus test that NYT readers should use is: would you want your kid in this class.
My kids went to a charter, by the way, where the teachers ran everything, using collaboration and held each other accountable, and the social-emotional health of children was deeply valued - I am pretty sure it's an exact replica of what Ms. Farina espouses.
When teachers who are chronically drunk remain in the classroom for years, or a "screamer" can last for years, or cases of outright abuse last for years - it's time for labor and the left to step up. Just like the GOP can't just repeal Obamacare without offering a replacement, teachers must offer a sensible solution that ensures that all teachers are caring, connect with children, and have solid instruction. We don't need to have a system of heroes - but we need every teacher to be solid. And the litmus test that NYT readers should use is: would you want your kid in this class.
My kids went to a charter, by the way, where the teachers ran everything, using collaboration and held each other accountable, and the social-emotional health of children was deeply valued - I am pretty sure it's an exact replica of what Ms. Farina espouses.
1
Teachers who are chronically drunk can be fired. Teachers who are "screamers" can be fired. Cases of outright abuse can get a teacher fired. But none of those will show up in student test scores that mostly reflect students' home environments and the parenting they receive.
To fire any of those teachers, all you need is a competent administrator. Union contracts and tenure won't stand in the way; they specifically allow the firing of the sort of teachers you describe. And they also DIS-allow the firing of good teachers, if you happen to have an incompetent administrator, so good teachers don't have to worry... unless they work at charters.
To fire any of those teachers, all you need is a competent administrator. Union contracts and tenure won't stand in the way; they specifically allow the firing of the sort of teachers you describe. And they also DIS-allow the firing of good teachers, if you happen to have an incompetent administrator, so good teachers don't have to worry... unless they work at charters.
2
The education industry does function in a sphere different from business. But don't think collaboration is absent from the typical corporate planning meeting. It is a means to an end. Successful CEO's don't rule in autocratic fashion. They set goals and time parameters with the advice of their direct reports who delegate responsibility to skilled line managers and workers. For it to work, everyone must be on the same page. If not, you are gone because the customer has options.
Education’s customers (the children) are not reading or doing math at grade level. Yet over 90% of teachers in many states were deemed satisfactory. The principals won’t go on the record criticizing teachers for fear of retaliation from teachers unions and the Dept. of Education. No one is on the same page. In fact, there is no "page." And the children? Well, it’s not really about the children. The education industry's customers will only have one opportunity at this. They can't go back and start over and they can't vote with their feet.
It takes a long time to turn a ship around and the educational system is a big ship. The past 12 years of educational reform under the Bloomberg Administration is now being dismantled brick by brick. A new Administration brings a new plan. Most of the children who entered first grade when Michael Bloomberg became Mayor are in middle school now--more than half way to nowhere. If the education system were a corporate entity right now, it would be out of business.
Education’s customers (the children) are not reading or doing math at grade level. Yet over 90% of teachers in many states were deemed satisfactory. The principals won’t go on the record criticizing teachers for fear of retaliation from teachers unions and the Dept. of Education. No one is on the same page. In fact, there is no "page." And the children? Well, it’s not really about the children. The education industry's customers will only have one opportunity at this. They can't go back and start over and they can't vote with their feet.
It takes a long time to turn a ship around and the educational system is a big ship. The past 12 years of educational reform under the Bloomberg Administration is now being dismantled brick by brick. A new Administration brings a new plan. Most of the children who entered first grade when Michael Bloomberg became Mayor are in middle school now--more than half way to nowhere. If the education system were a corporate entity right now, it would be out of business.
5
Madelyn, if the children who entered first grade when Michael Bloomberg became Mayor over 12 years ago are still in middle school, then there is obviously something wrong with his administration! Or your math.
The only thing we learned from the Bloomberg regime is that if you set up small high schools and charter schools who only educate selected students, you can crow about their results while the students those schools don't want to educate are left behind.
If the education industry was run in the corporate way that charter schools wish it to be run, every public school could spend money to advertise to the families they wanted, and simply "encourage" students who can't make the grade to leave. What happens to the students that the "good" charter schools refuse to teach is what Chancellor Farina and Mayor de Blasio want to address. I only wish that the most well-funded charter schools gave them something more than lip service as they market to the middle class families they covet as new "customers".
There is no "profit" to be made by teaching to students who may have no desire to learn, or who come from at-risk families who aren't able to help them when they struggle. And yet, unlike charter schools, the NYC public schools can't dump those "unprofitable" students on someone else. They are in schools where teachers do their best to educate them. Do they always succeed? Nope, and yet they don't abandon them, and for that effort they are trashed by people like you.
The only thing we learned from the Bloomberg regime is that if you set up small high schools and charter schools who only educate selected students, you can crow about their results while the students those schools don't want to educate are left behind.
If the education industry was run in the corporate way that charter schools wish it to be run, every public school could spend money to advertise to the families they wanted, and simply "encourage" students who can't make the grade to leave. What happens to the students that the "good" charter schools refuse to teach is what Chancellor Farina and Mayor de Blasio want to address. I only wish that the most well-funded charter schools gave them something more than lip service as they market to the middle class families they covet as new "customers".
There is no "profit" to be made by teaching to students who may have no desire to learn, or who come from at-risk families who aren't able to help them when they struggle. And yet, unlike charter schools, the NYC public schools can't dump those "unprofitable" students on someone else. They are in schools where teachers do their best to educate them. Do they always succeed? Nope, and yet they don't abandon them, and for that effort they are trashed by people like you.
3
"Education’s customers (the children) are not reading or doing math at grade level. Yet over 90% of teachers in many states were deemed satisfactory."
Most studies show that a teacher's impact on test scores is very low (around 7-10%), far behind other factors such as poverty, yet no one is talking about poverty.
"The past 12 years of educational reform under the Bloomberg Administration is now being dismantled brick by brick."
Thankfully so. The Bloomberg administration was a total disaster, and I speak as a parent of two daughters in public high schools here in NYC. The system under Bloomberg destroyed parental involvement and stripped schools of the very things that make us human, such as music and art, while claiming largely fraudulent gains. We are now tasking our children with largely low level clerical work as we have turned schools into test prep factories.
The cynic in me sees all these pro-charter, pro-Bloomberg comments and I wonder if charter school advocates have organized to respond to such articles. I know they have gone to even more bizarre lengths to score political points - such as giving their students the day off to protest.
Keep going Carmen!
Most studies show that a teacher's impact on test scores is very low (around 7-10%), far behind other factors such as poverty, yet no one is talking about poverty.
"The past 12 years of educational reform under the Bloomberg Administration is now being dismantled brick by brick."
Thankfully so. The Bloomberg administration was a total disaster, and I speak as a parent of two daughters in public high schools here in NYC. The system under Bloomberg destroyed parental involvement and stripped schools of the very things that make us human, such as music and art, while claiming largely fraudulent gains. We are now tasking our children with largely low level clerical work as we have turned schools into test prep factories.
The cynic in me sees all these pro-charter, pro-Bloomberg comments and I wonder if charter school advocates have organized to respond to such articles. I know they have gone to even more bizarre lengths to score political points - such as giving their students the day off to protest.
Keep going Carmen!
5
What a clever leader! She is so smart to set the schools up for loss of recent gains and a return to even more abysmal performance than before objective measures were put in place. This can help facilitate a swift return to a competent mayor in the next election! Thank you!!!
3
I fully support the Chancellor in knowing "a good quality school when I'm in the building." This is similar to a principal who once said on television that he can tell if his students are learning "by the look in their eyes." Who needs quantifiable metrics when a person's keenly developed set of senses can precisely hone in on the extent of actual learning?
8
The New York City Department of Education faces unique challenges, that few other education departments in this country face. We have a diverse population of students that require a variety of services, ranging from housing to special education supports. However, there still needs to be a streamlined provision of services. Some schools execute RTI (Response to Intervention) to reduce special education referrals, while others don't even have ANY academic interventions in place. Some schools have bilingual services for ELLs, while others lump new arrivals together and wait for some miraculous improvement. The only way to remedy this is via leadership.
The school Principal is everything. There are many DOE horror stories of sociopathic Principals that do absolutely nothing for their schools or community. Why are they still in charge? This is where to start.
The school Principal is everything. There are many DOE horror stories of sociopathic Principals that do absolutely nothing for their schools or community. Why are they still in charge? This is where to start.
5
She is absoslutely right. Most charter schools are money-grubbing attempts to make a profit from taxpayers. WIth a few idealistic exceptions, they have been a disaster nationwide. Speaking from experience.
8
You can follow Joel Klein's subsequent career trajectory, as executive vice president for Murdoch's News Corporation and as executive of a for profit education company, to know where his true interests and loyalties lie.
11
"Ms. Fariña has, with the help of a labor-friendly mayor, turned the union into a close ally, giving teachers more time for training and appearing less zealous about firing subpar teachers."
That's great, unless that's my kid's subpar teacher.
That's great, unless that's my kid's subpar teacher.
6
I will take seriously the "concern" about not firing enough sub-par teachers when the NYPD and other public agencies across the State are also rated on how many sub-par employees they fire--including ones who carry weapons. Why doesn't scrutiny of "dead wood" in any other part of government approach the level of severity that is being advocated in education?
7
My goodness, doesn't everyone yet understand the concept that education is the great civil rights issue of our time?
More then that, the nations that best educate their natural resources (their children), will lead the world.
For seventy years I have watched our New York public school system slowly go from bad to "the worst!"
We need to try "everything" to change this failing system.
Not only Charter Scools, everything!
Nothing else is as important.
Everything else is education related.
Crime...education related.
Income inequality....education related.
Race relations...education related.
When I read articles like this, about a Chancellor who knows what is good for the system by "feel", I think "soothsayer".
When I read about a union that stops every attempt to reform the system, I think "education mafia".
Both need to just go away.
We need to try "everything new".
Someone needs to think about "all of our" children.
Think about the possibilities.
More then that, the nations that best educate their natural resources (their children), will lead the world.
For seventy years I have watched our New York public school system slowly go from bad to "the worst!"
We need to try "everything" to change this failing system.
Not only Charter Scools, everything!
Nothing else is as important.
Everything else is education related.
Crime...education related.
Income inequality....education related.
Race relations...education related.
When I read articles like this, about a Chancellor who knows what is good for the system by "feel", I think "soothsayer".
When I read about a union that stops every attempt to reform the system, I think "education mafia".
Both need to just go away.
We need to try "everything new".
Someone needs to think about "all of our" children.
Think about the possibilities.
6
Please just stop right now using the Language that billionaires who want to privatize public education use - do not coopt the term'civilrights' movement to the problems facing public education today . There is no legal barrier preventing students of color from the schoolhouse doors - there is no segregation by law. Do not compare what brave courageous - nameless many - gave and or risked their lives for to what some billionaires, multimillionaires, and misguided liberals aim to do today from the safety if their homes, and to other people's children.
If indeed you and others sincerely believe that it is the so-called c'ivil rights' issue of our time, then take the next step in the fight as defined then by those true civil rights leaders for (1) fair funding and(2) an end to de facto segregation .
This charter school /testing/evaluation/data/kids as widgets on spread sheets is corporatizaton of education, a takeover by the business elite, not a "civil right steuggle".
If indeed you and others sincerely believe that it is the so-called c'ivil rights' issue of our time, then take the next step in the fight as defined then by those true civil rights leaders for (1) fair funding and(2) an end to de facto segregation .
This charter school /testing/evaluation/data/kids as widgets on spread sheets is corporatizaton of education, a takeover by the business elite, not a "civil right steuggle".
1
Too bad that many (not all) charter schools are NOT thinking of "all" of our children. They simply educate the ones who "fit" their system, counsel out the rest (back to public schools) and then congratulate on how much better their system is! In fact, middle class students (and many low-income ones) in NYC public schools are learning far more today than in years past -- that is what parents understand that the "experts" don't. The standards are far higher than they were when Bloomberg claimed his "success". But since that does nothing to address how to educate a class of 30 at-risk students who have almost no family support, we will simply pretend that spending money to test them instead of spending it to teach them is somehow a good thing.
4
Shame on Carmen Farina for celebrating the rollback of Mayor Bloomberg's positive changes to the city's Education Department. She says she can tell a quality school when she sees it. I suggest that the 71 yo get a "vision" test. Having spent her entire life in a school system that constantly fails to provide quality education it's time for her and the other lifers to take their bloated pensions and hit the road.
When she says that people have the idea that educators are not as smart as people in other professions she is right, because the statistics prove that college students in education programs are among the weakest students in college. So when you have mediocre students like Ms. Farina eventually controlling the education for your kids, be afraid, be really afraid. For Ms. Farina your child's education is not her upmost priority, it's the salary, exorbitant pensions and other perks for mediocre teachers that makes the top of her list.
When she says that people have the idea that educators are not as smart as people in other professions she is right, because the statistics prove that college students in education programs are among the weakest students in college. So when you have mediocre students like Ms. Farina eventually controlling the education for your kids, be afraid, be really afraid. For Ms. Farina your child's education is not her upmost priority, it's the salary, exorbitant pensions and other perks for mediocre teachers that makes the top of her list.
9
Were your teachers bad? You sound literate. Bloomberg's policies were only a mere fraction of the school system's problems.
Can you tell us about the "exorbitant" pensions and perks? I have never heard of people pursuing teaching for the money.
3
I can tell you that with my "exorbitant" pension, I still have to work quite a bit in order to live in NYC. Great teachers never did work for the love of money as much as the love of their craft. Getting the summers off is needed by all those in the system. If you can remember, when the classrooms was 95 degrees and June came about, students really shutdown, as far as learning was concerned.
3
The chancellor's arrogance is breathtaking. I fail to see how anyone can argue that saying "I know good quality schools and educators, because (reasons)" is more conducive to wise policy than looking at metrics and a broad base of quantitative and qualitative inputs.
While the previous administration didn't bat 1.000 on public education (or anything else), the results reflected dramatic improvement that will bear positive consequences for tens of thousands of New Yorkers who graduated from high school as a result of its policies. Mayor de Blasio made a terrible mistake in appointing a chancellor who seems to have come out of retirement (while, it's worth noting, keeping the entirety of her very generous pension in addition to the chancellor's salary) solely to reverse those choices. Chancellor Farina's tenure is looking like a golden age for the UFT, but could bear tragic consequences for students in reverting to the culture, governance structures and choices that delivered a sub-50 percent graduation rate.
The crowning irony: a mayor whose animating cause--a righteous and necessary one--is fighting income inequality, is likely to preside over a decline in educational attainment… which, above any other single factor, drives employability and earnings.
While the previous administration didn't bat 1.000 on public education (or anything else), the results reflected dramatic improvement that will bear positive consequences for tens of thousands of New Yorkers who graduated from high school as a result of its policies. Mayor de Blasio made a terrible mistake in appointing a chancellor who seems to have come out of retirement (while, it's worth noting, keeping the entirety of her very generous pension in addition to the chancellor's salary) solely to reverse those choices. Chancellor Farina's tenure is looking like a golden age for the UFT, but could bear tragic consequences for students in reverting to the culture, governance structures and choices that delivered a sub-50 percent graduation rate.
The crowning irony: a mayor whose animating cause--a righteous and necessary one--is fighting income inequality, is likely to preside over a decline in educational attainment… which, above any other single factor, drives employability and earnings.
12
Nope- the education reform movement, based on data collection, testing, and a "no excuses" ethos has failed because poverty is at the root of poor performance in schools. Adressing poverty rather than blaming teachers for societies ills is a step in right direction. I have yet to see non cherry-picked data that shows any success with the ed reform movement.
2
Hmmm. I think the arrogance here is far less than the arrogance of the former Mayor and his appointees to the DOE…I believe this to be so obvious for anyone with a true personal stake in the system (beyond just being a 'taxpayer')…that I don't think Im out on a limb to say that I think every single person with children in the system (parents) and every single adult working in the system would agree with me...
2
Unfortunately the multimillion dolllar charter school PR campaign attacks whomever tries to tell the truth. Charters have higher test scores and graduation rates because they expel--back to the traditional public schools--those students who don't succeed with their program. Eva Moscowitz's Success Academy has a 40% cohort graduation rate! 40% of the students who started with her in first grade did not graduate with their 8th grade class. What happened to them??? Charters do not take new students into existing grades each year the way public schools are required to do. After the lottery selection of students, charters tell parents that they have stringent requirements for parent participation and if parents are not willing to comply, they should send their children elsewhere. The charters reject from the start those children from the most vulnerable families. The billionaire boys club that supports charters are fine with these policies--they subscribe to the "talented tenth," and care nothing for the others. And ironically the education they support for the most promising is all test-prep and militaristic behavior--definitely not the education they choose for their own children. Now finally, the charters are discovering that these no excuses behavior policies don't work and in fact back fire when students get to high school. Experienced educators such as Farina could have told them that from the get-go!
10
If that's what's required for success, why not let those who are willing to put in the work (parents and students) succeed? That's what people who can afford private schools pay for. Related: How many teachers send their children to private schools? Charter schools?
1
My 7 year old daughter learns math alongside 34 other children. 35 7 year olds learning math. What is Ms Farina going to do about class size??
2
“I know a good quality school when I’m in the building."
I live in a Boston suburb with five local elementary schools. By state and national standards all are excellent.
However, there is still a notable difference among them. The two worst among these five are in a gleaming new building. The best are in buildings that are nearly 50 years old, and they show their age. Parents are shocked when the kids from the gleaming new school enter 7th grade and are way behind the kids from the dilapidated buildings.
I would hate to think what Carmen thinks of our town schools.
I live in a Boston suburb with five local elementary schools. By state and national standards all are excellent.
However, there is still a notable difference among them. The two worst among these five are in a gleaming new building. The best are in buildings that are nearly 50 years old, and they show their age. Parents are shocked when the kids from the gleaming new school enter 7th grade and are way behind the kids from the dilapidated buildings.
I would hate to think what Carmen thinks of our town schools.
1
She would probably judge correctly - I suspect she is looking for the "feel" you get in a happy, productive school, not the quality of the building per se.
2
In the words associated with Senator Roman Hruska during Watergate, "Don't confuse me with the facts."
It's sad that Ms. Farina doesn't want to blend her vast experience with an appreciation of objective evidence.
It's sad that Ms. Farina doesn't want to blend her vast experience with an appreciation of objective evidence.
8
Good to see Teachers union members out in force but you are not going to change the mind of rational and logical people who don't share your conflict of interest and think you should be judged on performance even if that scares you.
1
What conflict of interest? Teachers care about teaching, care about the students doing well, and have years of on-the-ground experience. Teachers are NOT scared of being evaluated, but they want to be evaluated fairly. Which means not by top-down people with not real experience in education.
Where do these "logical and rational" people come from? And why do they "know" so much better than those that have been there.
It's like saying "I am logical and rational. I read a map, so of course I know more than people who actually live there."
Where do these "logical and rational" people come from? And why do they "know" so much better than those that have been there.
It's like saying "I am logical and rational. I read a map, so of course I know more than people who actually live there."
3
If I were able to do so, I'd use a multi-model evaluation system. Something like the corporate 360-evaluation. I'd include classroom observations,and lesson plan reviews, I'd have each teacher write a "mission statement", review it, and evaluate the results as prat of the review. Among other techniques. I'd invite parent, student and union input into the evaluation process.
Lastly I'd use test results data as well.
That is as logical and rational to me as giving one high stakes test, which depends on test-taking skills as much as real learning. Expensive perhaps but worth it.
Lastly I'd use test results data as well.
That is as logical and rational to me as giving one high stakes test, which depends on test-taking skills as much as real learning. Expensive perhaps but worth it.
2
Most teachers don't mind being judged on performance, provided people understand that teachers are only one part of that performance.
4
Farina decides to embrace the failure that has been "balanced literacy" because she's tight with Lucy Caulkins from Teachers College, versus the success of a pilot program involving the Core Knowledge philosophy of E.D. Hirsch? She insists the size of the sample (ten schools) for the Core Knowledge program was too small?
Putting an end to shuttering chronically under performing schools and instead following another failed program from Cincinnati Public Schools (Ohio) that will throw more money at unsuccessful schools (good money after bad) and turn them essentially into "community centers?" When Farina's "feelings" trump data, watch out.
When's the next mayoral election? It can't come soon enough for the 1.1 million school children of New York City.
Putting an end to shuttering chronically under performing schools and instead following another failed program from Cincinnati Public Schools (Ohio) that will throw more money at unsuccessful schools (good money after bad) and turn them essentially into "community centers?" When Farina's "feelings" trump data, watch out.
When's the next mayoral election? It can't come soon enough for the 1.1 million school children of New York City.
7
Only in NYC under this administration could the below facts be presented in the NYT and yet the article is about current leader trying to change everything back to old ways. Think teachers union as any role in this new approach due to political reasons regardless of what it does to education chances of poor students?
Under Mr. Klein and Mr. Walcott (and in the brief interlude of Cathleen P. Black), the four-year high school graduation rate rose significantly, to 68 percent last year from 46.5 percent in 2005. The dropout rate fell by half, and the percentage of students considered “college ready” doubled. Scores of fourth and eighth graders on national reading and math tests improved.
Under Mr. Klein and Mr. Walcott (and in the brief interlude of Cathleen P. Black), the four-year high school graduation rate rose significantly, to 68 percent last year from 46.5 percent in 2005. The dropout rate fell by half, and the percentage of students considered “college ready” doubled. Scores of fourth and eighth graders on national reading and math tests improved.
4
Plese don't include Cathie Black, who did nothing, nothing, nothing (except alienate people.)
2
Could you please link to data here? I am always suspicious that these huge shifts are based on manipulation rather than real gains, but am happy to be proves wrong!
2
It's “ridiculous to think that you can be a principal under the age of 35,” the new commissioner is alleged to have said.
Fascinating that in the sciences, by the time you're 35 you're washed up in terms of arriving at new, exciting theories.
Looks like in NYC public school education it's back to the same old, same old --- literally.
Fascinating that in the sciences, by the time you're 35 you're washed up in terms of arriving at new, exciting theories.
Looks like in NYC public school education it's back to the same old, same old --- literally.
5
In the sciences, it is not that important to form coalitions, manage relationships, deal with hostile contingents, work with the mayor, unions, parents, the press - and most importantly, with children.
Your comment is such a false equivalency its hard to know where to start.
Your comment is such a false equivalency its hard to know where to start.
5
"In the sciences, it is not that important to form coalitions, manage relationships, deal with hostile contingents..." You clearly haven't worked in the sciences.
1
Wrong, I clearly have. I have worked in research, also in hospitals and medical settings. I knew someone would comment about the politics of science. There are politics everywhere; that's nothing new.
But the politics of the sciences are not the "heart" of the sciences. And, did you look at the rest of what I said: "work with the mayor, unions, parents, the press - and most importantly, with children." Scientists do that?
That's the heart of what educators do.
But the politics of the sciences are not the "heart" of the sciences. And, did you look at the rest of what I said: "work with the mayor, unions, parents, the press - and most importantly, with children." Scientists do that?
That's the heart of what educators do.
3
FINALLY, an educator in charge of education -- such a welcome relief from the Bloomberg/Klein/Duncan test them/shut them down mentality. Yes, the new chancellor is looking at the data, but she is also looking into schools. Having been a principal for many years, you do not need data to know a good school---step into lunch rooms, step into hallways, and step into classrooms and in pretty short time you can know what kind of learning is going on. What is most encouraging about this article is the understanding that to get better requires continuous training/education, which means, you have understanding about what to train for and how to train for those goals. Telling a principal your scores are low, get them up, or your fired (the Michelle Rhee approach to management), is not a pathway for improving student achievement. Having said that, the real road to improving urban schools, lies in improving the lives and futures of the publics surrounding these schools. The inconvenient truth of schooling, which the Coleman report pointed out decades ago, is schools have little impact on student achievement---what matters most is what happens in homes before and after school.
7
Well if this is true: "The inconvenient truth of schooling, which the Coleman report pointed out decades ago, is schools have little impact on student achievement---what matters most is what happens in homes before and after school."
Why should this matter?:
"FINALLY, an educator in charge of education..."
The truth is that the current Chancellor was, for decades, an integral part of the system that steadily deteriorated to the detriment of NYC students but solidified the position of union members and leaders.
Why should this matter?:
"FINALLY, an educator in charge of education..."
The truth is that the current Chancellor was, for decades, an integral part of the system that steadily deteriorated to the detriment of NYC students but solidified the position of union members and leaders.
2
If "schools have little impact on student achievement" then you have just made an argument to close schools.
deBlasio brought in Bratton to reform the NYPD but maintain the low crime rate success. He brought in Farina to kill charter schools and make peace with the teachers union so it not surprising a vision for achieving student educational success is lacking. If the modest but measurable success of the Bloomberg years in higher graduation and college ready rates as well as lower dropout rates is reversed, then deBlasio is going to have created a serious political problem for himself come next election not to mention leaving students ill-served.
deBlasio brought in Bratton to reform the NYPD but maintain the low crime rate success. He brought in Farina to kill charter schools and make peace with the teachers union so it not surprising a vision for achieving student educational success is lacking. If the modest but measurable success of the Bloomberg years in higher graduation and college ready rates as well as lower dropout rates is reversed, then deBlasio is going to have created a serious political problem for himself come next election not to mention leaving students ill-served.
1
Buzzy, whatever does what happens in homes (before and after school) have to do with unions? They are different and unrelated factors.
1
How ironic that under the "accountability" administration that one could become a principle with as little as three years of teaching experience. Not surprising since one could become a chancellor with no educational background whatsoever.
The small schools movement that is erroneously attributed to charters actually began thirty years ago under the leadership of Deborah Myer and Anthony Alvarado in East Harlem. So let's not invent history and make this a Bloomberg innovation.
There was one major difference. They created higher performing public schools without resorting to privatization. They also accomplished this without any support from the Board of Ed. The idea was simple, in a smaller school teachers knew their students and students and staff all knew one another. This improved school safety as well as educational accomplishments. They may have been too successful. That's probably why Alvarado was blocked in his efforts to become chancellor.
The small schools movement that is erroneously attributed to charters actually began thirty years ago under the leadership of Deborah Myer and Anthony Alvarado in East Harlem. So let's not invent history and make this a Bloomberg innovation.
There was one major difference. They created higher performing public schools without resorting to privatization. They also accomplished this without any support from the Board of Ed. The idea was simple, in a smaller school teachers knew their students and students and staff all knew one another. This improved school safety as well as educational accomplishments. They may have been too successful. That's probably why Alvarado was blocked in his efforts to become chancellor.
6
Yes, small scholls have nothing whatever to do with charter schools. Different concepts entirely.
But I'm sure its a typo that you wrote "principle" rather than "principal."
But I'm sure its a typo that you wrote "principle" rather than "principal."
2
Actually, Anthony Alvarado was Chancellor in the early 80s. He was forced to resign when financial wrong-doing he had committed as a District Superintendent came to light.
1
One tenth of "minorities" test as "college ready?" Forget about college. Just get these kids reading and ready to go earn their living.
3
This article is depressing. Changing policies and procedures that put students' achievements and progress first and replacing them with policies that put teachers and their union first does not strike me as a positive development. Those quoted in the article who are waiting for the mayor and chancellor to communicate their 'vision' are ignoring the evidence to date; the 'vision' is to roll back the charter school movement.
7
Here we see the mid term battle between a dying elitist driven reformist fad and the irresistable forces drawing us back toward managing a complex reality.
7
The school privatization folks posting on here are either ignorant or purposely misleading in their pretense that a public school system can (and should) be run like a profit-making business. And it infuriates them to no end that Carmen Farina refuses to buy into that farce.
Common sense. Everyone here knows exactly why public schools "fail" and it has nothing to do with the teachers or union. That is why there are just as many failing schools in states without unions. Paying consultants hundreds of millions of dollars for "data"? What a farce. We all know that schools with primarily middle class or affluent students do fine. We all know that schools with low-income students whose families are very involved in their education do fine. We all know that schools that require parents to sign up for a lottery AND make it very clear that their school has very high standards and strict rules and any deviation means your child leaves, do fine.
Sadly, the charter schools that claim to be successful aren't making the slightest effort to educate the students who are difficult. Why? They claim they have the solution, so why not recruit the hardest to teach students instead of scaring away their parents if they are lucky enough to win the lottery by warning of their high standards? Or, in the case of Success Academy, moving into high-income neighborhoods and promptly dropping all priority for low-income students in your lottery! Thankfully, Carmen Farina is different.
Common sense. Everyone here knows exactly why public schools "fail" and it has nothing to do with the teachers or union. That is why there are just as many failing schools in states without unions. Paying consultants hundreds of millions of dollars for "data"? What a farce. We all know that schools with primarily middle class or affluent students do fine. We all know that schools with low-income students whose families are very involved in their education do fine. We all know that schools that require parents to sign up for a lottery AND make it very clear that their school has very high standards and strict rules and any deviation means your child leaves, do fine.
Sadly, the charter schools that claim to be successful aren't making the slightest effort to educate the students who are difficult. Why? They claim they have the solution, so why not recruit the hardest to teach students instead of scaring away their parents if they are lucky enough to win the lottery by warning of their high standards? Or, in the case of Success Academy, moving into high-income neighborhoods and promptly dropping all priority for low-income students in your lottery! Thankfully, Carmen Farina is different.
14
Thank you. And further, it is erroneous that teachers don't want to be "accountable" or that Farina doesn't care about data. Some people only believe "data" (usually collected as needed to prove a pony) while others see more big picture, with - and beyond - numerical "data."
5
I hate my typos! And "spellcheck" changes. I'm sure readers know I mean "point", not pony!!
3
Sounds like Ms. Fariña is on the right track. Mr. Nadlestern's comments in this article only highlight the problems of those who think the results of education should be "measured" like a business. Accountability comes from letting departmental supervisors actually go and physically monitor teachers teaching in the classrooms, instead of bogging them down in their offices filling out "performance measurement questionnaires" of one sort or another that "measure" and "quantify" the "results" of teachers. All those questionnaires are filled with drivel; the only success they measure is the amounts of money the consultants who design them reap from the process. Ms. Farina is setting a good example for her Principals and department supervisors that they have to walk around and know exactly what's going on in their schools. Then they can immediately spot the "bad" or "ineffective" teachers. Very simple. But, they can;t walk around and supervise until they are relieved of the bureaucratic performance measurement paper pushing exercises and meetings that now occupy their time and keep them from doing their jobs. Ms. Farina sounds like she is practicing genuine school reform, but it will take time and great effort to dismantle the "business bureaucracy" that has poisoned the public school system by "treating it like a business." But she's headed in the right direction and the good teachers I'm sure know it! Less bureaucratic paperwork, more documented direct supervision/observation.
8
I supervised teachers as a principal for 20 years. My district tried several times to 'quantify' effective instruction. Some think teaching is akin to industry building a car but kids aren't products. I knew great teaching when I observed it, I knew ineffective teaching when I saw it, but turning my beliefs, feelings, and instincts into a check the boxes on this form eluded me. Ever principal I knew could list the best teachers in their buildings but it was all very subjective, not objective. I suspect having effective supervisors who encourage good teachers and counsel out poor ones may be the best we can do at this time.
8
Charles, could you please elaborate more on your knowing what great teaching looks like when you observed it? To what degree did your or the principles' subjective evaluations agree with or contradict the objective evaluations?
Copley, I will respond as well:
A good teacher:
- models a positive attitude about learning
- works towards motivating students
- uses positive reinfocement
- manages the group dynamics of a class
- moves around the classroom and engages students
- encourages students to contribute to discussion and ask questions
- gives 1-1 time when appropriate
- uses a variety of methods (large group, small group, computer, video/film, etc.
- is aware and responds to students who are "drifting off"/don't get thr material
- is well-groomed and has a professional appearance
- has good eye contact and involvement with students
- has a good sense of humor
Well, there's a few. And they are not so "subjective." And these can be "quantified": have observer use a rating scale (1-5) as well as aggregate score.
Perhaps you were never a teacher so you wouldn't know these things (which most teachers already know)? This is data, too, which should be used in addition to standardized test results.
A good teacher:
- models a positive attitude about learning
- works towards motivating students
- uses positive reinfocement
- manages the group dynamics of a class
- moves around the classroom and engages students
- encourages students to contribute to discussion and ask questions
- gives 1-1 time when appropriate
- uses a variety of methods (large group, small group, computer, video/film, etc.
- is aware and responds to students who are "drifting off"/don't get thr material
- is well-groomed and has a professional appearance
- has good eye contact and involvement with students
- has a good sense of humor
Well, there's a few. And they are not so "subjective." And these can be "quantified": have observer use a rating scale (1-5) as well as aggregate score.
Perhaps you were never a teacher so you wouldn't know these things (which most teachers already know)? This is data, too, which should be used in addition to standardized test results.
1
But isn't the point of a union and a union contract to ensure all are treated equal? Feels to me like with Farina's keen eyes, we can probably get rid of the contract, and go back to subjective hiring and firing...
It is good to have an educator as Chancellor and I applaud her changing the atmosphere of the schools I and others work in. We are not a business and should not be judged like one. We are a government agency empowered to educate children. I would like to add, that we never read about the changes in special education that are needed. These are the neediest children and if we don't go back to providing them with what they need rather than being concerned with less special ed classes because it doesn't look good, the graduation and literacy rates will plummet and the crime rates will increase. That is the legacy of special ed reform instituted by the Bloomberg administration, that must be changed. No one comments on all the students that are put into inclusion classes who cannot read, who need more individualized attention. That's what's happening now and the results will be seen in the future. I wish the Chancellor would change that policy that leaves so many children struggling.
8
Ms Farina don't need no stinkin' data to understand what's working and what's not. All she has to do is walk into the building and consult with the union heads.
"Accountability" is a corporate word?
It will take NYC a while to recover from the deBlasio administration.
"Accountability" is a corporate word?
It will take NYC a while to recover from the deBlasio administration.
3
Where ever did you get the idea that "All she has to do is walk into the building and consult with the union heads. "? Not true.
In her NYC gov bio, it is said that when she was a prinicipal, she visited almost every classroom every day, She used acute professional observational skills, not "feelings". Accountability is not necessarily a corporate word, but chidren are not widgets and teachers are not robots (thank goodness).
In her NYC gov bio, it is said that when she was a prinicipal, she visited almost every classroom every day, She used acute professional observational skills, not "feelings". Accountability is not necessarily a corporate word, but chidren are not widgets and teachers are not robots (thank goodness).
4
So no plan???? Last I checked - the schools system has been in shambles since the days of Mayor John Lindsay... Beame - Koch - Dinkins... Guiliani was focused on crime - rightfully so... So ok - you reverse what Bloomberg was doing - then what??? She is part of the problem in the long term establishment. When people start emphasizing the importance of parents then we will see improvement.
2
According to some posts here, Ms. Farina is an advocate of removing certain educational items (including, as one mother below indicated, long division in math).
From a managerial point of view, it's easy to 'reform' things if the biggest hurdles in your path are removed and ignored. Surely math and other scores will improve if the difficult issues in those fields are no longer taught. Statistically, NYC schools will be on top, but don't ask the graduates to perform basic, everyday, business chores (like figuring out change or "split checks," or dividing business equipment among the workers, etc).
I'm no fan of Bloomberg, but he came into office having run a highly successful business in which he needed to hire local people to perform very basic business chores, like operate a copy machine. He saw that he could not depend on the pool of high school "graduates" that were applying for the jobs, nor could he depend on recruiting kids from the suburbs because the salaries for those jobs would not justify the commute. This is why he made better education his primary goal. Whatever his success, it obviously still has not generated enough. But to blame the entire teachers' union, and/or the teachers themselves across the board, is ludicrous on its face. It seems that the problem(s) lie elsewhere.
The question now is, do we want to face those basic challengers and address them, or continue pointing fingers?
Unfortunately, we will continue to point fingers, I fear
From a managerial point of view, it's easy to 'reform' things if the biggest hurdles in your path are removed and ignored. Surely math and other scores will improve if the difficult issues in those fields are no longer taught. Statistically, NYC schools will be on top, but don't ask the graduates to perform basic, everyday, business chores (like figuring out change or "split checks," or dividing business equipment among the workers, etc).
I'm no fan of Bloomberg, but he came into office having run a highly successful business in which he needed to hire local people to perform very basic business chores, like operate a copy machine. He saw that he could not depend on the pool of high school "graduates" that were applying for the jobs, nor could he depend on recruiting kids from the suburbs because the salaries for those jobs would not justify the commute. This is why he made better education his primary goal. Whatever his success, it obviously still has not generated enough. But to blame the entire teachers' union, and/or the teachers themselves across the board, is ludicrous on its face. It seems that the problem(s) lie elsewhere.
The question now is, do we want to face those basic challengers and address them, or continue pointing fingers?
Unfortunately, we will continue to point fingers, I fear
2
Under Bloomberg, "graduation rates improved 68%" - really? Then why does the exit data show at least 70% of students are unprepared to do college level work? These "improvements" were achieved via grade inflation & "credit recovery." Thousands of students were systematically pushed out by principals who were rewarded with cash bonuses for their efficiency in "improving" the graduation rates.
Under Bloomberg senior experienced (expensive) educators were harassed out of the system in favor of enthusiastic, but utterly unskilled first year (cheap) teachers, who quickly burned out & left the profession within 3 years (47% of new teachers leave within 5 years).
Large comprehensive high schools were dismantled in favor of mini schools which are "Potemkin Villages": test-prep factories with fancy names & no substance. They're only funded to prepare students to pass standardized tests & exit out of the system. Graduates of these "academies" have few or no skills for careers & employment. They fail out of community colleges within 2 years.
The devil is in the details, comrades & the DoE keep the details & their proprietary data secret. Insiders who reports the truth are labeled as "disgruntled" or "incompetent". Go on to any website for any school & try to find substantive information about anything. It's all window dressing.
Under Bloomberg senior experienced (expensive) educators were harassed out of the system in favor of enthusiastic, but utterly unskilled first year (cheap) teachers, who quickly burned out & left the profession within 3 years (47% of new teachers leave within 5 years).
Large comprehensive high schools were dismantled in favor of mini schools which are "Potemkin Villages": test-prep factories with fancy names & no substance. They're only funded to prepare students to pass standardized tests & exit out of the system. Graduates of these "academies" have few or no skills for careers & employment. They fail out of community colleges within 2 years.
The devil is in the details, comrades & the DoE keep the details & their proprietary data secret. Insiders who reports the truth are labeled as "disgruntled" or "incompetent". Go on to any website for any school & try to find substantive information about anything. It's all window dressing.
8
The answer to your first question is that high school graduation requirements and college (non-remediation) entrance requirements aren't aligned.
More to the point, the college-ready rate doubled during Bloomberg's mayoralty, from about a sixth of graduates to about a third. I sincerely hope we see the same gains during de Blasio's tenure. But I see no reason for optimism in Farina's "because I said so" approach.
More to the point, the college-ready rate doubled during Bloomberg's mayoralty, from about a sixth of graduates to about a third. I sincerely hope we see the same gains during de Blasio's tenure. But I see no reason for optimism in Farina's "because I said so" approach.
The truly useful data, then, would be how many graduated ready to do college level work under different systems.
The problem with relying solely on data, and creating pressure and accountability from high stakes testing is that it is a force for assimilation and conformity over diversity. It preferences a very narrow band of activities and skills over all others, largely math and English. This in essence leaves millions of children out of a meaningful day at school, because their interests and skills are ignored and the school day becomes filled with low level clerical work in preparation for state exams. Sure you might argue teacher should do more than prepare for a test, but when your very job, your ability to pay rent and buy food, rides on the results of a test, your students will be doing a lot of test prep.
A good question would be where do these preferred skills actually come from? Well, they are not coming from educators as they were largely left out of the Common Core Learning Standards process. No, they come from the business world and the likes of Bill Gates at Microsoft. It has been decided apparently that reading low level informational texts is more important than reading literature. Why? Well when you go to work, you don't read novels, you read reports and are expected to evaluate and extract information from business reports, agendas, meeting minutes, etc. Sure there is some token literature in the CCLS, but it is truly token. I know entire schools that have forbidden the teaching of novels, in order to prepare for the Common Core exams. Is this what we want?
A good question would be where do these preferred skills actually come from? Well, they are not coming from educators as they were largely left out of the Common Core Learning Standards process. No, they come from the business world and the likes of Bill Gates at Microsoft. It has been decided apparently that reading low level informational texts is more important than reading literature. Why? Well when you go to work, you don't read novels, you read reports and are expected to evaluate and extract information from business reports, agendas, meeting minutes, etc. Sure there is some token literature in the CCLS, but it is truly token. I know entire schools that have forbidden the teaching of novels, in order to prepare for the Common Core exams. Is this what we want?
6
How about turning the Tweed Courthouse back to the people?
2
She is presiding over a death watch as it regards the achievement level of our school kids. Instead of adopting the Charter Schools model, she will fight to the end to kill them. Our kids are under-achievers by any measure. Measures she will not even look at because they are too painful.
2
Talk to me about the charter school model when the elite private schools adopt it.
4
The charter school model provides profit and uses selectivity to mask worse instruction. There's a reason that teachers oppose it, and it's not because they're all involved in some vast conspiracy. It's because they understand education.
4
There have been many changes over the last 40 years by the so called "experts on education". I am a product of the NYC public school system. I also taught in the school system for 35 years and have lived through these changes. Many of them have led to the destruction of a great system. But the one change that destroyed the schools was when the city decided to let children go to schools outside their neighborhood.
Schools are the foundation of a neighborhood. Teachers are the base of that foundation. Principals are supposed to be the leaders. Today, when a child has to travel all over the city to attend a "good" school outside of their neighborhood, he/she no longer connects with the community they live in. Years ago, we walked to our neighborhood school, had excellent teachers who taught in the old fashioned way. Today, the experts at the DOE, changed all of what worked so well. For example, they want kids to engage each other. That's a lot of nonsense. Assistant Principals in my day were respected for their knowledge. Today, they become AP's because they want out of the classroom. In essence, they don't like teaching and make more money out of the classroom. They are not respected by many. Don't get me wrong some are good educators, but not many.
The solution is to make students attend their neighborhood schools and infuse funding where those neighborhood schools are not performing. We need better teachers and administrators and not a few specialized schools.
Schools are the foundation of a neighborhood. Teachers are the base of that foundation. Principals are supposed to be the leaders. Today, when a child has to travel all over the city to attend a "good" school outside of their neighborhood, he/she no longer connects with the community they live in. Years ago, we walked to our neighborhood school, had excellent teachers who taught in the old fashioned way. Today, the experts at the DOE, changed all of what worked so well. For example, they want kids to engage each other. That's a lot of nonsense. Assistant Principals in my day were respected for their knowledge. Today, they become AP's because they want out of the classroom. In essence, they don't like teaching and make more money out of the classroom. They are not respected by many. Don't get me wrong some are good educators, but not many.
The solution is to make students attend their neighborhood schools and infuse funding where those neighborhood schools are not performing. We need better teachers and administrators and not a few specialized schools.
8
The majority of kids in US public schools are poor. In many ways, it seems as if we're intentionally developed policies to increase the number of poor kids, and kids with specific challenges, in our schools.
NYC schools are no exception. 30% of the kids in New York public schools have a learning disability or are English language learners. And that's before problems related to health, housing, nutrition, etc.
We don't know what works, because we're facing challenges we've never faced before. And the challenges aren't just for us. They're for the country.
NYC schools are no exception. 30% of the kids in New York public schools have a learning disability or are English language learners. And that's before problems related to health, housing, nutrition, etc.
We don't know what works, because we're facing challenges we've never faced before. And the challenges aren't just for us. They're for the country.
9
"cut off the official who was presenting the data. “I know a good quality school when I’m in the building,”
Should other professionals be rated, not by data and objective methods, but by feelings and subjectivity of one person?
How many people would like their doctors and medical treatments chosen by subjective methodology and the feelings of one person?
Should other professionals be rated, not by data and objective methods, but by feelings and subjectivity of one person?
How many people would like their doctors and medical treatments chosen by subjective methodology and the feelings of one person?
13
Doctors and medical treatments are far more susceptible to objective evaluation than teaching. You might choose your doctor based on the results and overlook his horrible bedside manner, but the "bedside manner" IS teaching, and the "results" we blame on schools are mostly the result of parenting and socioeconomic status.
Subjective evaluation of teachers depends on the competence of the evaluator, but it CAN be accurate. Evaluation by test scores cannot be, except by random accident.
Subjective evaluation of teachers depends on the competence of the evaluator, but it CAN be accurate. Evaluation by test scores cannot be, except by random accident.
3
R.R., your comment makes a lot of sense on the face of it. However, the use of supposedly "objective" data in education often camouflages a subjectivity just as significant as Farina's comment that you quote. Test score data is often meaningless out of the context of the student population and also ignores the quality (or lack thereof) of the test. Observation data, by principals or others, using theoretically objective rubrics, is also in actual practice very subjective, as anyone who has participated in a NYC DOE "quality review" can attest. These forms of data are in some ways more dangerous than Farina's comment, because they have the false appearance of objectivity. I wish I could say what the answer is… I don't know, but I do know that this apparent but false split between subjective opinion and objective data presents another obstacle to better evaluation of schools and teachers.
3
Chancellor Farina may not be perfect but she is the first educator that we've had in the role of chancellor in more than a decade. It's significance is manifold. First and foremost, the chancellor knows first hand what a successful learning environment looks like first hand. I surmise that the "feeling" she gets is based upon several things including teacher preparedness, class room environment and the school and local community's assessment of how the school is doing and what it needs. A partnership that was sorely lacking during the Bloomberg years.
As for those who point to charter schools as the "savior" for black and brown disadvantaged children. What one should really consider is what do children from disadvantaged background need to succeed. The answer can be found in the following: effective teachers, experienced teachers, safety and access to enrichment opportunities. In other words equity in education. Let's look at the tried and true paths to success. Rather than measuring success by tests that get easier or harder depending upon the stage of the election cycle.
I have yet to meet a parent or a community who doesn't want the best possible for their children. Let's do well by our children and offer a true public education that will afford them the ability to attain opportunity...
As for those who point to charter schools as the "savior" for black and brown disadvantaged children. What one should really consider is what do children from disadvantaged background need to succeed. The answer can be found in the following: effective teachers, experienced teachers, safety and access to enrichment opportunities. In other words equity in education. Let's look at the tried and true paths to success. Rather than measuring success by tests that get easier or harder depending upon the stage of the election cycle.
I have yet to meet a parent or a community who doesn't want the best possible for their children. Let's do well by our children and offer a true public education that will afford them the ability to attain opportunity...
34
Schools are good when the main players are good -- and those players must all be in sync. Parents must instill in their children a desire to learn and a solid work ethic, and keep at it; children must put in the effort and studying needed to get over hurdles and not get discouraged and quit when they don't understand something right away; teachers must actually know and enjoy the material they are teaching (and enjoy the kids); and school administrators must stop foisting inane, often counterproductive "new methods" onto experienced teachers -- especially when the teachers know a lot more than their bosses.
The reason we are an educational mess is that in too many instances we have one or more, or all, of these players not doing their job.
And that is true also of many private schools whose administrators push "innovations" that are, at best, wasteful of real teaching time and, at worst, self-serving at the kids' expense; or whose young, bright, under-educated teachers have their degrees in education. (Of course, in those schools many parents hire tutors; not so, of course, those on full or part scholarships, of which there are many.).
It's not just public schools that are in trouble. Sit in a faculty meeting pretty much anywhere, and your hair'll stand in end.
The reason we are an educational mess is that in too many instances we have one or more, or all, of these players not doing their job.
And that is true also of many private schools whose administrators push "innovations" that are, at best, wasteful of real teaching time and, at worst, self-serving at the kids' expense; or whose young, bright, under-educated teachers have their degrees in education. (Of course, in those schools many parents hire tutors; not so, of course, those on full or part scholarships, of which there are many.).
It's not just public schools that are in trouble. Sit in a faculty meeting pretty much anywhere, and your hair'll stand in end.
13
New Yorkers should be deeply distressed when the chancellor blithely dismisses results of significant research showing positive effects of smaller high schools, saying only, well, research can say anything. It can't say anything. It says what it was designed to measure, and the studies in question were well-designed.
The point is not about doing more small high schools. It's the deeply held suspicion the chancellor seems to hold against numbers, evidence, and accountability. Doing what her fellow educators want certainly will gain a measure of peace and quiet in the system. It's not the way to improve it.
The point is not about doing more small high schools. It's the deeply held suspicion the chancellor seems to hold against numbers, evidence, and accountability. Doing what her fellow educators want certainly will gain a measure of peace and quiet in the system. It's not the way to improve it.
30
Mark, of course you can get "research" to say anything. Technically, the example in this story in not "research" (which consists of a hypothesis, a control group, etc.) It is data-churning.
That's why I like to see the details of research, not just the "conclusion."
Some ways to skew research:
- only show results that prove your point/make you look good
- leave out any "bad" results
- sample to get the results you want
- construct initial initial questions to get the results you want (this may not apply here, but I once worked for a company that offered "customer feedback." So the customer was given a rating form with 3 choices: excellent, very good or poor. So we could tell the client: "90% of customers rated us very good or excellent!!! Yay!"
Just because someone questions "data" (usually pre-selected data) does NOT mean they are "against numbers, evidence, and accountability." That is propaganda, especially with the word "accountability". Almost all educators want to be accountable, want good results for the students. Most teachers are not "self-serving" (they go into the field to serve others, BTW). But there are many ways to measure; classroom observation is as much a form of "evidence" as is "sorting through a database." (to find the results you want).
I am not against research and stats, but I think we need to be knowledgeable about them and how they are "used."
That's why I like to see the details of research, not just the "conclusion."
Some ways to skew research:
- only show results that prove your point/make you look good
- leave out any "bad" results
- sample to get the results you want
- construct initial initial questions to get the results you want (this may not apply here, but I once worked for a company that offered "customer feedback." So the customer was given a rating form with 3 choices: excellent, very good or poor. So we could tell the client: "90% of customers rated us very good or excellent!!! Yay!"
Just because someone questions "data" (usually pre-selected data) does NOT mean they are "against numbers, evidence, and accountability." That is propaganda, especially with the word "accountability". Almost all educators want to be accountable, want good results for the students. Most teachers are not "self-serving" (they go into the field to serve others, BTW). But there are many ways to measure; classroom observation is as much a form of "evidence" as is "sorting through a database." (to find the results you want).
I am not against research and stats, but I think we need to be knowledgeable about them and how they are "used."
5
That "deeply held suspicion" is well-founded. Policies implemented to increase graduation rates (the shameful "credit recovery" policy) and changes to test items and cut off scores, not to mention the loopy algorithm used to award schools letter grades, gave a false impression of success and made it even harder for parents to assess what was happening in their children's schools
1
Honest research is a good thing, but dishonest "research" really can say anything the "researcher" wants to say, and the Bloomberg/Klein methods have support only from the second sort.
3
seems to be a strong opinioned leader without a vision. No new ideas to be tried, just same old.
8
"Education reform" in the last fifteen years or so has retarded improvements that were going on for decades before we tried to "fix" them. The "same old" represents a significant improvement.
1
I guess most parents don't know anything about charter schools. Charter schools pick the best and brightest of all races to be in an environment where there isn't any disruption to the classes. When you have students who are never going to graduate, holding back the students who are serious, that is unfair to the students who want to get ahead. I guess MS Farina has never been married. If so, that speaks volumes.
5
But Chancellor Farina (what does her marital status have to do with anything?) is in charge of a school system that is obligated to educate every single child within the boards of NYC. If you don't think that should be the case then lobby for a change to the laws.
2
Yes, whatever does her marital status have to do with any of this?
2
To "fix" NYC public schools, we first have to accept that no one thing will work because people -- the students we are trying to educate -- are very complicated things. Add to that mix the myriad teachers, paras, administrators, etc.involved , and it'll be clear that a one-size-fits-all strategy simply won't work.
But here are some basic ideas: First, make sure that kids can read. So, early in their school lives lavish on them every arsenal in our disposal to make them proficient. Seventh graders cannot master the Common Core if they never learned how to read or write well. Also focus on numeracy early on. Learning how to add, subtract, multiply, and divide shouldn't be a higher-order skill. And acknowledge that some rote learning is necessary to achieve proficiency. Again, we can't expect middle schoolers to master Common Core math concepts if they haven't mastered arithmetic.
To deal with the most disruptive students-- one of the biggest challenges teachers face -- implement sophisticated behavior modification programs drawn from different ideologies, e.g., psychological, penal (without the use of corporal punishment, of course), etc., to get these kids on track. If they -- and by "they", let's admit that we're often talking about black boys -- don't get on track early enough, they will most likely fail as adults.
And lastly, let's make sure our teachers are as well-educated as possible by hiring better educated candidates.
But here are some basic ideas: First, make sure that kids can read. So, early in their school lives lavish on them every arsenal in our disposal to make them proficient. Seventh graders cannot master the Common Core if they never learned how to read or write well. Also focus on numeracy early on. Learning how to add, subtract, multiply, and divide shouldn't be a higher-order skill. And acknowledge that some rote learning is necessary to achieve proficiency. Again, we can't expect middle schoolers to master Common Core math concepts if they haven't mastered arithmetic.
To deal with the most disruptive students-- one of the biggest challenges teachers face -- implement sophisticated behavior modification programs drawn from different ideologies, e.g., psychological, penal (without the use of corporal punishment, of course), etc., to get these kids on track. If they -- and by "they", let's admit that we're often talking about black boys -- don't get on track early enough, they will most likely fail as adults.
And lastly, let's make sure our teachers are as well-educated as possible by hiring better educated candidates.
4
Sounds like she's doing everything right. And I'm sure she'll be raked over the coals for it.
The Bloomberg/Klein approach was all about making the numbers look good, regardless of the reality in the schools. It's not unique to NYC; that's the approach that's been pushed nationwide in the Bush/Obama era of "school reform," and it's horrible. It's what you get when you put people who know nothing about education in charge of it.
The fact is that the numbers we have available, test scores and graduation rates, are affected much more by out-of-school factors than by anything educators do. Telling them to focus on those numbers is telling them to pick and choose which kids to enroll or to cheat (both approaches which are much easier and widespread in charters, which is why people who understand education tend to oppose charters). To tell how well teachers are teaching, you have to watch them do it. Looking at the numbers basically tells you how the kids' parents are doing, or at best, how effective the schools are at limiting their enrollment or cheating. Sounds like Fariña knows this. And it sounds like a district managed by her might not turn out the false numbers that Bloomberg/Klein did, but it'll probably do a better job teaching kids.
The Bloomberg/Klein approach was all about making the numbers look good, regardless of the reality in the schools. It's not unique to NYC; that's the approach that's been pushed nationwide in the Bush/Obama era of "school reform," and it's horrible. It's what you get when you put people who know nothing about education in charge of it.
The fact is that the numbers we have available, test scores and graduation rates, are affected much more by out-of-school factors than by anything educators do. Telling them to focus on those numbers is telling them to pick and choose which kids to enroll or to cheat (both approaches which are much easier and widespread in charters, which is why people who understand education tend to oppose charters). To tell how well teachers are teaching, you have to watch them do it. Looking at the numbers basically tells you how the kids' parents are doing, or at best, how effective the schools are at limiting their enrollment or cheating. Sounds like Fariña knows this. And it sounds like a district managed by her might not turn out the false numbers that Bloomberg/Klein did, but it'll probably do a better job teaching kids.
20
Down the road, after Faina has been around a while, it should shock no one to see the same old profile of academic performance among students. The Asian kids will remain on top, a lot of white kids will do well, and the same groups will bring up the rear. The student body at Stuyvesant High School is 75% Asian, and plenty of the kids come from low-income homes. Farina should study those kids to understand where our best students come from.
Meanwhile, teacher training must change. It is a fact that one big classroom problem is the teacher, too often someone with no ability to manage a classroom full of kids.
Meanwhile, teacher training must change. It is a fact that one big classroom problem is the teacher, too often someone with no ability to manage a classroom full of kids.
9
Classroom management has got to be a priority in teacher education (and administrators should be required to have at serious classroom experience, to they understand what they're doing - here I think NYC is doing the right thing).
Also, the higher reaches of the administration and policy-makers should be required to spend a couple of weeks each year working as anonymous subs in the system, to REALLY observe how their edicts play out on the ground.
Also, the higher reaches of the administration and policy-makers should be required to spend a couple of weeks each year working as anonymous subs in the system, to REALLY observe how their edicts play out on the ground.
1
They should follow european teaching education and of course practice makes a master !
1
"It is a fact that one big classroom problem is the teacher, too often someone with no ability to manage a classroom full of kids."
Is it really a fact? Maybe at Stuyvesant but not at every school. Do you think you could easily manage a room full of up to 34 kids, some of whom have vastly differing social, physical, and mental needs? Have you ever tried it to be able to make such a statement?
Is it really a fact? Maybe at Stuyvesant but not at every school. Do you think you could easily manage a room full of up to 34 kids, some of whom have vastly differing social, physical, and mental needs? Have you ever tried it to be able to make such a statement?
2
Fluff! Farina like all chancellors is well meaning, but essentially a figurehead! Anyone who has ever worked in K-12 education, knows schools succeed or fail based up what uniquely goes on in each individual school. That goes for both the Public and Private sector... While the Chancellor is important as to how funds are allocated, and can set a certain tone, one needs to look at each individual school, and the nature of the community it exists in, the quality of its student body, and the atmosphere and techniques that its Principal and staff create, to find out if good educational practices are in use... The Chancellor is there for the Public and media conversation. Fluff!!!
4
[... the quality of its student body....]
Study after study shows that the influence of teachers is much less than the influence of parents. Teacher have to be educated and certified/licensed, but any two idiots with gonads can have a child, fail to train it properly and send it off the school expecting miracles.
Study after study shows that the influence of teachers is much less than the influence of parents. Teacher have to be educated and certified/licensed, but any two idiots with gonads can have a child, fail to train it properly and send it off the school expecting miracles.
3
Some of the talking heads in this piece - college professors and business types who have never taught a day in public school classrooms - would do well to keep their mouths shut. They add nothing but bias to these discussions. When they have their children in public schools or teach for a year in one, then talk to me.
As for charter schools and cherry picking, indeed they do. If you only pick from the children whose parents have assiduously searched for a school and actively entered a lottery, then you get only the kids whose parents are actively involved in their education. That is a form of cultural socio-economic discrimination that amounts to cherry-picking in a system largely "minority."
I've had the opportunity to meet some of the inexperienced principals mentioned in the article. Their lack of experience and wisdom was magnified by their inability to collaborate with educators older and wiser. All of which was a harm to the system, the teaching, the children, and worst of all, to the morale and enthusiasm of the educators themselves!
As for charter schools and cherry picking, indeed they do. If you only pick from the children whose parents have assiduously searched for a school and actively entered a lottery, then you get only the kids whose parents are actively involved in their education. That is a form of cultural socio-economic discrimination that amounts to cherry-picking in a system largely "minority."
I've had the opportunity to meet some of the inexperienced principals mentioned in the article. Their lack of experience and wisdom was magnified by their inability to collaborate with educators older and wiser. All of which was a harm to the system, the teaching, the children, and worst of all, to the morale and enthusiasm of the educators themselves!
30
"I've had the opportunity to meet some of the inexperienced principals mentioned in the article. Their lack of experience and wisdom was magnified by their inability to collaborate with educators older and wiser."
Experience matters. This current "reform" movement has done everything possible to remove as many people with actual teaching experience from all levels of education, from teachers to administrators, in the erroneous belief that running a big city school system is basically the same as running a Walmart, and that the skill set is just as easy to teach and measure.
Irreparable harm has been done. It will not end well.
Experience matters. This current "reform" movement has done everything possible to remove as many people with actual teaching experience from all levels of education, from teachers to administrators, in the erroneous belief that running a big city school system is basically the same as running a Walmart, and that the skill set is just as easy to teach and measure.
Irreparable harm has been done. It will not end well.
2
Can't respect your Comments unless you give any conflicts of interests you have such a being current public current school teacher or employee?
Garth: What you call "conflict of interest", I call "talking from knowledge and experience." You mean the only people who have no "conflict" are those who have never been there?
3
A balance of accountability structures & support of experienced methods used by educators seems like a smart path. Education is a field where the best & worst of the human experience is on display and the end results have critical societal consequences. Let teachers teach but ensure they are able to demonstrate effectiveness; not just in random disconnected data points that limit our understanding of progress.
Allow for teachers to provide samples & examples of how they moved a class or individual from incompetence to competence. From an isolated mind to one that engages. From a writer with severe deficits to one that now is moving towards proficiency. From a student who hated school to one that is now helping the class & teachers because they were given leadership opportunity or found something that inspired them. From a pessimistic or depressed person to one that enters ready to enjoy problem solving or artistic creativity in any subject or discipline.
Teaching cannot be measured from behind the desk but from behind the heart. It is a complex human experience that can be either tragic or devastating. Let us all work to ensure the results are amazing because assisting in the development of creative, self-confident, positive, problem solving & democratically minded youth will be the real story told long after the political & philosophical battles pass away.
Peace & hope for a chance that our city & nation will find its way.
Allow for teachers to provide samples & examples of how they moved a class or individual from incompetence to competence. From an isolated mind to one that engages. From a writer with severe deficits to one that now is moving towards proficiency. From a student who hated school to one that is now helping the class & teachers because they were given leadership opportunity or found something that inspired them. From a pessimistic or depressed person to one that enters ready to enjoy problem solving or artistic creativity in any subject or discipline.
Teaching cannot be measured from behind the desk but from behind the heart. It is a complex human experience that can be either tragic or devastating. Let us all work to ensure the results are amazing because assisting in the development of creative, self-confident, positive, problem solving & democratically minded youth will be the real story told long after the political & philosophical battles pass away.
Peace & hope for a chance that our city & nation will find its way.
7
Great news - within a few years standard testing will no longer be an issue and many more will achieved the success the Asian - immigrant communities have achieved in attending schools like Stuyvesant. A good follow up to this article would be more highlights of the students and caretakers interviewed for this article
From your mouth to God's ears. But I expect that until all parents have the work ethic of our Asian immigrants, and all students study as hard as our Asian students, we won't be seeing your dream come true any time soon.
And, to be fair, not every Asian family fits this stereotype.
And, to be fair, not every Asian family fits this stereotype.
3
"[Ms Farina]cited her experience with her 10-year-old grandson, who she said worshiped the high school boy her daughter had hired to tutor him."
Her point was about turning older students into role models for the younger ones, but the comment about her 10-year-old grandson already needing a tutor when by without comment!
This lady is no leader. She dismisses data, forgetting that you can't manage what you don't measure, and her goal seems to be to become beloved by the teaching establishment. She has no plan. And her ignorance of the only mini-system that actually works - charter schools - is astounding. At the very least, it seems like you'd want to define the outcomes you're looking for - higher graduation rates, higher college acceptance rates, etc... - and then mine the working schools, charter or not, for best practices to deploy across the broader school system.
Her point was about turning older students into role models for the younger ones, but the comment about her 10-year-old grandson already needing a tutor when by without comment!
This lady is no leader. She dismisses data, forgetting that you can't manage what you don't measure, and her goal seems to be to become beloved by the teaching establishment. She has no plan. And her ignorance of the only mini-system that actually works - charter schools - is astounding. At the very least, it seems like you'd want to define the outcomes you're looking for - higher graduation rates, higher college acceptance rates, etc... - and then mine the working schools, charter or not, for best practices to deploy across the broader school system.
14
"the comment about her 10-year-old grandson already needing a tutor when by without comment!" >> Good point!
As for raising high school graduation rates, that is a bad criteria to use for improvement because it is SO easy to fudge by relaxing standards further and further and......., which is the last thing the students or the system need.
As for raising high school graduation rates, that is a bad criteria to use for improvement because it is SO easy to fudge by relaxing standards further and further and......., which is the last thing the students or the system need.
1
People don't understand that what the data measures is not always what we need to measure, or what we claim it measures. Student test scores reflect mainly non-school factors. When we use that to claim that schools are failing, or that charters (usually a scam to extract profit from the public coffers) are succeeding, the main thing we're proving is that we don't know what we're talking about.
A leader who does things that are good for education is likely to be beloved by teachers. That is, after all, a group of people who voluntarily went into a low-paying, low-prestige occupation in order to help kids. That'd be the best indication that she's doing something right, and you seem to believe the opposite.
A leader who does things that are good for education is likely to be beloved by teachers. That is, after all, a group of people who voluntarily went into a low-paying, low-prestige occupation in order to help kids. That'd be the best indication that she's doing something right, and you seem to believe the opposite.
The ONLY question is what it means for the performance of the city's schools.
Under Klein and Walcott, the improvement in graduation rate to 68% from 46.5% and the halving of the dropout rate are significant improvements. If she's going to undo their policies, she had better have some good ones of her own.
Under Klein and Walcott, the improvement in graduation rate to 68% from 46.5% and the halving of the dropout rate are significant improvements. If she's going to undo their policies, she had better have some good ones of her own.
14
Sorry, but I think those numbers were fudged, and even if authentic, I would bet money that the additional graduates were no more college or career ready than their predecessors.
4
An increase in the graduation rate tells us nothing about whether students are actually learning or not. If New York City wants to be known as a school system where students can graduate without mastering content, then by all means focus on graduation rate.
4
She has no plan other than to undo Klein's policies. In her view, Klein's policies are the work of some kind of over-bearing CEO who lacked the kind of empathy she believes in. Unfortunately, her changes are going to create a hodge-podge system that becomes unmanageable, especially for her, someone too old for this job.
3
Finally, an educator for Chancellor, not a businessman who knows nothing about education, schools, teachers and students. And she doesn't hate teachers.
25
Olivia - so how come those "educators" could do anything for the past 45 years? Bloomberg was only around for 12 so STOP using him as an excuse... The public school system was terrible LONG before.
Andre, no the piublic schools were not terrible for 45 years. Many of our graduates have had long and distinguished careers after public school. Do you have data on your comments on "40 years" and "terrible"?
Further, 12 years of Bloomberg or not, his business-person approach did litte to improve thing yet much to alienate many.
Further, 12 years of Bloomberg or not, his business-person approach did litte to improve thing yet much to alienate many.
1
Well, first of all, she knows a bit about management and is willing to share it. Certainly anyone who doesn't understand Machiavelli is doomed to fail in her job.
Also, for all of the Bloomberg supporters out there, remember that he ran the system for 12 years -- long enough for students to go from the first grade to high school graduation under his ageist -- but how many did, in fact, graduate? Why not100%? or even 95%?
And hos likely is it the a majority, let alone even a significant minority of the NYC teachers are incompetent when teachers recruited in the suburbs, from the same available pool, are so much more successful (presumably more competent)? Does the city only hire incompetents? Or has it had something to do with management that evolved since "community control" followed by Bloomberg control?
Also, for all of the Bloomberg supporters out there, remember that he ran the system for 12 years -- long enough for students to go from the first grade to high school graduation under his ageist -- but how many did, in fact, graduate? Why not100%? or even 95%?
And hos likely is it the a majority, let alone even a significant minority of the NYC teachers are incompetent when teachers recruited in the suburbs, from the same available pool, are so much more successful (presumably more competent)? Does the city only hire incompetents? Or has it had something to do with management that evolved since "community control" followed by Bloomberg control?
6
"Under Mr. Klein and Mr. Walcott (and in the brief interlude of Cathleen P. Black), the four-year high school graduation rate rose significantly, to 68 percent last year from 46.5 percent in 2005. The dropout rate fell by half, and the percentage of students considered “college ready” doubled. Scores of fourth and eighth graders on national reading and math tests improved."
Seems like Bloomberg did okay.
Seems like Bloomberg did okay.
24
Nyalman, I think you missed the part where the article mentioned that scores rose UNTIL 2010, when the state education department decided the test was too easy, after which scores fell! If the DOE was doing so well under Bloomberg, why were parents so happy to elect de Blasio? Why did they reject the candidate who called for more charter schools and elect the candidate to ran on a platform in which he said he would not do as Bloomberg do as let some very "connected" charter school chains have the run of the DOE? I suppose you think you know better than the parents of the students in NYC schools? Or do you just think those parents are stupid and so their votes shouldn't count?
1
I actually think you are the obtuse person in the room here RJ. Assuming parents of public school kids even cast their vote in an election that had one of the lowest turnouts ever, they were happy to elect DeBlasio because he has fought against the State's imposition of higher standards and therefore allowing their kids to get the higher scores the previous mayor helped students achieve. But the problem is that DB appears not to understand the contradiction in his across the board dismissal of all things Bloomberg with his implied support of the results he achieved. Kinda scary and pathetic if you ask me.
She ignores the data, makes age related decisions about principal competence, won't fire subpar teachers. It's sad to see the regression of a school system that had been making progress by placing students first. We are going back to the days of pandering and poor schools.
38
Could you substantiate these claims? I really would like to look at the details.
5
Lori, I think Crhis is saying this based on the Katie Taylor article, which begins with an anonymous quote claiming that essentially, that's what Farina does.
Very unfair lede if you ask me. I wrote two posts about it because the Comments section hasn't yet published either one….the first was hours ago, the second just now.
I say the lede is unfair because it is an anonymous quote and it's also out of context - doesn't explain what the principals were meeting about and why Farina seemingly dismissed the data points they were pouring over. Yet it influences people like Chris to think she 'ignores' "the" data. Also, very biased unflattering photo, showing her tete-a-tete almost 'plotting' like with UFT! Oh, and the smiling, smiling, protesting charter school kids with signs, "we march for NYC kids!"
Very unfair lede if you ask me. I wrote two posts about it because the Comments section hasn't yet published either one….the first was hours ago, the second just now.
I say the lede is unfair because it is an anonymous quote and it's also out of context - doesn't explain what the principals were meeting about and why Farina seemingly dismissed the data points they were pouring over. Yet it influences people like Chris to think she 'ignores' "the" data. Also, very biased unflattering photo, showing her tete-a-tete almost 'plotting' like with UFT! Oh, and the smiling, smiling, protesting charter school kids with signs, "we march for NYC kids!"
13
The claims are made in the first paragraph of the anonymously sourced NYT article!
4
I find it interesting that the comments here supporting Mrs. Farina generally come from what I would call informed, experienced, and passionate places.
Yet, there are some here who oppose her and support the current education reform trend that, while suspect, are well intentioned, but if nothing else, are misinformed or under-experienced in what realities exist in education these days.
What a waste and misdirection of genuine concern.
What is most disheartening I think is the clear tenor of patronizing suspicion and condescension among critics of educators.
Is it any wonder why it is difficult to attract people to education (for the long haul) when the current climate is what it is?
Even among people who clearly care, the ability to listen to and understand the points of people who have actually been there in the classroom is apparently non existent.
Why?
Yet, there are some here who oppose her and support the current education reform trend that, while suspect, are well intentioned, but if nothing else, are misinformed or under-experienced in what realities exist in education these days.
What a waste and misdirection of genuine concern.
What is most disheartening I think is the clear tenor of patronizing suspicion and condescension among critics of educators.
Is it any wonder why it is difficult to attract people to education (for the long haul) when the current climate is what it is?
Even among people who clearly care, the ability to listen to and understand the points of people who have actually been there in the classroom is apparently non existent.
Why?
21
So you find people that agree with you to be the most "informred, experienced and passionate." How generous and open minded. While I am sure you are well intentioned, which the teachers unions and their amen choir never give credit to those that disagree with their viewpoint, the fact is our educational system generally delivers abysmal results for the money we invest in it (more per pupil than any other country). And to resist accountability and alternatives to our failing system to "protect" failing teachers and administrators perpetuates inequality in educational opportunities for poor and minority inner city children who deserve better. If you are concerned about inequality and economic mobility then everything should be on the table to improve our $20,000 per pupil per year NYC public schools (including expanding successful charters).
7
I get fired up on education. I can't speak for anyone else, nor is Emery entirely correct, but he has a point. I myself have a background in education (and corporate work); I am distressed by comments based on ideology and "media" sources rather than facts and experience. Everyone has strong feelings about education (everyone was once a student), but that's not the same as long term "on the ground" commitment.
The future of our children concerns us, and most people really care. But much of the rhetoric comes from bias and ideology, not reality. For example (as a teacher), unions have very very little to do with teacher's everyday experience. There's always anecdotes on bad teachers, but these are the vast minority. Anti-unionism is propaganda. They're NOT against accountability. Teachers want to teach, not to just "protect themselves." Most teachers are good; some folks with agendas want to denigrate them. I would trust an educator more than a politician.
If anyone cares about my credentials: I began as a 4th grade teacher in an NYC public, low income school (traditional education program in college). Taught for a number of years, earned an MA degree (3, actually), a Ph.D. (psychology) and a stint at NYU-B School. I've worked in corporate and public settings. I've taught college in different states, graduate and undergraduate, for over 20 years. I'm an avid NYT reader/contributor.
I love teaching, but not misinformation. Just my (I believe, informed) opinion.
The future of our children concerns us, and most people really care. But much of the rhetoric comes from bias and ideology, not reality. For example (as a teacher), unions have very very little to do with teacher's everyday experience. There's always anecdotes on bad teachers, but these are the vast minority. Anti-unionism is propaganda. They're NOT against accountability. Teachers want to teach, not to just "protect themselves." Most teachers are good; some folks with agendas want to denigrate them. I would trust an educator more than a politician.
If anyone cares about my credentials: I began as a 4th grade teacher in an NYC public, low income school (traditional education program in college). Taught for a number of years, earned an MA degree (3, actually), a Ph.D. (psychology) and a stint at NYU-B School. I've worked in corporate and public settings. I've taught college in different states, graduate and undergraduate, for over 20 years. I'm an avid NYT reader/contributor.
I love teaching, but not misinformation. Just my (I believe, informed) opinion.
4
Lori,
I appreciate your comments. And I appreciate your personal experience as a teacher and in academia. I believe you are sincere in trying to help us get better results in our educational outcomes and are probably closer then we both may think on how to achieve them. I hope we can both be successful in our mutual goal of improving our educational system. And I would like to thank you for your personal service I'm achieving this goal.
I appreciate your comments. And I appreciate your personal experience as a teacher and in academia. I believe you are sincere in trying to help us get better results in our educational outcomes and are probably closer then we both may think on how to achieve them. I hope we can both be successful in our mutual goal of improving our educational system. And I would like to thank you for your personal service I'm achieving this goal.
5
The biggest achievement is requiring principals to have seven year experience.
Five years should be required form assistant principals and labor leaders.
How many years was the Chancellor a teacher?
Five years should be required form assistant principals and labor leaders.
How many years was the Chancellor a teacher?
9
According to testimony she gave in Albany the other day, more than 20 years a teacher….principal and superintendent work was on top of that…relevant quote re Albany testimony (on Cuomo plan to inc. testing for teacher evaluation):
“There’s so many other things,” Fariña said. “I was a teacher for more than 20 years and if I was only measured in test scores, that would only have been a little bit of my work…..”
“There’s so many other things,” Fariña said. “I was a teacher for more than 20 years and if I was only measured in test scores, that would only have been a little bit of my work…..”
4
Here is the her bio from NYCity Gov. website:
http://www.nyc.gov/html/ohcd/html/workforce/carmen_farina.shtml
Summary:
- 22 years exp. as teacher at PS29 (Brooklyn)
- 18 additional years as school principal, district superintendent and New York City's deputy chancellor for teaching and learning.
- "Under her leadership, P.S. 6 in Manhattan... rose from 76th on the citywide reading test to among the top three, becoming one of the City’s best public elementary schools."
- Adjunct professor at Bank St College for Education.
- Bachelor of Science from New York University and
three master’s degrees
- Brooklyn College (Bilingual Education),
- Fordham University (Gifted/Arts Education),
- Pace University (Administration and Supervision).
PS:
Recent Bloomberg appointees include:
- Dennis Wolcott who has experience with day care, and an MA in education but no formal educational supervison credential,
- Joel Klein (attorney) had little teaching experience ("a few months") and no educational credentials
- Cathie Black (magazine publisher) had neither, no experience whatever with education, nor any grad school in any field. She did not attend any public schools, plus she sent her own children to private boarding school out of state.
http://www.nyc.gov/html/ohcd/html/workforce/carmen_farina.shtml
Summary:
- 22 years exp. as teacher at PS29 (Brooklyn)
- 18 additional years as school principal, district superintendent and New York City's deputy chancellor for teaching and learning.
- "Under her leadership, P.S. 6 in Manhattan... rose from 76th on the citywide reading test to among the top three, becoming one of the City’s best public elementary schools."
- Adjunct professor at Bank St College for Education.
- Bachelor of Science from New York University and
three master’s degrees
- Brooklyn College (Bilingual Education),
- Fordham University (Gifted/Arts Education),
- Pace University (Administration and Supervision).
PS:
Recent Bloomberg appointees include:
- Dennis Wolcott who has experience with day care, and an MA in education but no formal educational supervison credential,
- Joel Klein (attorney) had little teaching experience ("a few months") and no educational credentials
- Cathie Black (magazine publisher) had neither, no experience whatever with education, nor any grad school in any field. She did not attend any public schools, plus she sent her own children to private boarding school out of state.
70
I heard over 10-15 years *
As a fifteen year veteran teacher, I am pleased that Chancellor Fariña is turning the direction of the Department of Education towards supporting PUBLIC education and (I hope) away from PRIVATIZING education. She's not perfect, but she's not Cathie Black, either. Let's work on getting smaller class sizes, Chancellor!
AND, may I ask all public school supporters to turn their eyes and ears to Albany, where Governor Cuomo is holding the state legislature hostage to his demands as the upcoming budget battle begins (a 1.7% percent increase in education funding if the Legislature doesn't agree to his education 'reforms' or a 4.8 percent increase if it does). Really.
Instead of three men in a room making all the decisions in Albany. it will be ONE. No joke!
AND, may I ask all public school supporters to turn their eyes and ears to Albany, where Governor Cuomo is holding the state legislature hostage to his demands as the upcoming budget battle begins (a 1.7% percent increase in education funding if the Legislature doesn't agree to his education 'reforms' or a 4.8 percent increase if it does). Really.
Instead of three men in a room making all the decisions in Albany. it will be ONE. No joke!
21
Charter schools are helping thousands of minority, low-income students become successful, graduate school, and attend college. There is no denying that. Why would we condemn them so much when at the very least THOUSANDS of students receive a much better education (small class sizes, ability to fire terrible teachers, teachers who want to be there, etc.)? Nothing is perfect, but so many kids are benefitting from charter schools. Don't be a partisan participant and criticize what the Democratic party "wants" to do - precisely what the charter schools are accomplishing. Don't deny these poor kids, who didn't pick their circumstances or neighborhoods, a real shot at leaving.
12
clw: Yes, some charter schools are excellent, but they generally cherry-pick from more involved families. I know it is by "lottery" but you get in lottery by parents being involved enough to enter the lottery. And then they "counsel out" many students with additional problems and needs.
I assume you know that factors that contribute to educational achievement include socio-economic issues, parental involvement, and native ability, in addition to what the teacher does in the classroom, and how the charter school operates.
I assume you know that factors that contribute to educational achievement include socio-economic issues, parental involvement, and native ability, in addition to what the teacher does in the classroom, and how the charter school operates.
10
Lori
clw: Yes, some charter schools are excellent, but they generally cherry-pick from more involved families.
***
Quite frankly, I don't care what they do as long as those families have an opportunity to get a good education.
Involved parents should not be penalized and forced to be in a pool of uninvolved parents just to meet someone's idea of "fairness". They should get the best education they can for their kids. Period.
clw: Yes, some charter schools are excellent, but they generally cherry-pick from more involved families.
***
Quite frankly, I don't care what they do as long as those families have an opportunity to get a good education.
Involved parents should not be penalized and forced to be in a pool of uninvolved parents just to meet someone's idea of "fairness". They should get the best education they can for their kids. Period.
5
Yay for Carmen. You go girl. I am so sick of business thinki n g they can educate, they certainly destroyed the world with their greed and untold merciless money mongering. Let educators educate and leave the greedly monsters to lead us to economic doom
15
Let her keep her hands off Stuyvesant.
25
absolutely!
5
Why would she change it? A good educator supports success.
8
Amen, Paul.
1
I am truly sorry for all the NYC public school children (primarily poor and minority) whose future is being sacrificed at the altar of the UFT by our current chancellor's embrace of tried and failed educational policy. It is very sad.
30
You mean failed social policy and societal attitudes towards the poor and disadvantaged, right?
8
@Emery
It starts with education. If protecting failed schools and educators takes precedent at the expense of students we deprive the children in these situations of a quality education and chance to be successful. It is tragic. Glad you agree.
It starts with education. If protecting failed schools and educators takes precedent at the expense of students we deprive the children in these situations of a quality education and chance to be successful. It is tragic. Glad you agree.
3
What is a failed school and what is the cause of that failure?
Please tell us.
And what do you mean that "it starts with education?"
Please tell us.
And what do you mean that "it starts with education?"
4
First and foremost, the oudated or mal-functioning mechanical systems of class rooms, responsible for supply and return of air must be urgently checked and corrected in most old schools in Brooklyn, by independent engineers for the safety of all students.
8
In the old days we used to open windows. Of course, that had to stop when students began throwing chairs onto the sidewalks below.
3
"“There’s a perception that if you’re an educator, you’re against reform,” she said." Gee, where would the public have developed that attitude? Perhaps because of the unions strident defense of the minority of bad teachers over the good, the belief that money is the solution to all school woes regardless of how it's spent, of resistance to holding poor performers accountable (sorry, that's not a bad word or concept) whether principals or teachers, or of American educations almost annual flip flop from one new program or "solution" to another with no one held to account for these repeated failures or mismanagement.
22
Let's be clear what we mean by "reform".
It's it "change" (The original meaning to re-form)? Change is neither good nor bad on its own.
It is the political term "reform? (meaning right wing, conservative solutions or an ideology)?
Is "reform" a flip flop from one program to another (you wisely object to that).
How extensive is this "reform"? Does it mean correcting some genuine specific problems, like keeping school faivulites in order or having dress codes for students?
Or more substative reform, like being able to get rid of bad teacher? Even unions support that, but they insist on due process) Most people, including teachers and "unions" are not against change, they just want it done and in a fairly considered way, not just top-down by administrators (BTW, have you heard much about how administrators are held accountable?)
It's it "change" (The original meaning to re-form)? Change is neither good nor bad on its own.
It is the political term "reform? (meaning right wing, conservative solutions or an ideology)?
Is "reform" a flip flop from one program to another (you wisely object to that).
How extensive is this "reform"? Does it mean correcting some genuine specific problems, like keeping school faivulites in order or having dress codes for students?
Or more substative reform, like being able to get rid of bad teacher? Even unions support that, but they insist on due process) Most people, including teachers and "unions" are not against change, they just want it done and in a fairly considered way, not just top-down by administrators (BTW, have you heard much about how administrators are held accountable?)
10
"or of American educations almost annual flip flop from one new program or "solution" to another with no one held to account for these repeated failures or mismanagement."
Yeah, that's not usually a teacher-approved thing.
Yeah, that's not usually a teacher-approved thing.
10
Change should be reasonable and controlled. Too much, like to curricula, results in turmoil, while too little, like in protecting mediocre teachers, results in poor results.
The unions have done tremendous harm to the image of teachers. If teachers feel under siege, they need look no further than at the outdated and misguided protectionist efforts of the unions.
A battle between parents and unions serves no one, nor does a management teacher battle. Educators as managers would be ideal, but management experience is mandatory. As these last few years in NYC have shown, management experience leads to results.
The unions have done tremendous harm to the image of teachers. If teachers feel under siege, they need look no further than at the outdated and misguided protectionist efforts of the unions.
A battle between parents and unions serves no one, nor does a management teacher battle. Educators as managers would be ideal, but management experience is mandatory. As these last few years in NYC have shown, management experience leads to results.
The strategy seems pretty clear to me. The teachers union helped get Mr. de Blasio get elected as Mayor and he appointed Chancellor Farina to repay that debt. All of Chancellor Farina's policies are aimed at appeasing the teachers union. As you can see from the second picture, she even conducts her tours under the watchful eye of the union rep.
27
Except for one small thing: the UFT endorsed one of his opponents Democrat Bill Thompson for Mayor. Only when Thompson lost the Democratic primary in September, and De Blasio won, did the UFT, and almost all other unions basically, come to DeBlasio. (As the winner of the September Democratic primary was essentially going to be the winner of the November election).
You are from Wilmington, Del, according to your post, so I don't expect you would have known this nor the way that the winner of the democratic primary was essentially going to be crowned Mayor in November. The only question was whether the winner would win by a margin large enough to avoid a run off….anyway, De Blasio did NOT have the support of the UFT until he was essentially heading to City Hall as the Mayor…!
You are from Wilmington, Del, according to your post, so I don't expect you would have known this nor the way that the winner of the democratic primary was essentially going to be crowned Mayor in November. The only question was whether the winner would win by a margin large enough to avoid a run off….anyway, De Blasio did NOT have the support of the UFT until he was essentially heading to City Hall as the Mayor…!
9
Only you are wrong: UFT endorsed Bill Thompson, not DeBlasio. The UFT came to Blaz only when he was the de facto mayor, having won the September primary and slated to face no real opposition in November.
Appease the teachers' union and you'll be making the schools better. The teachers' unions are on the right side of nearly every education policy question.
Rank amateurs all, running City Hall and the DOE. Just like all the other rank amateurs running NYC at the moment.
From, the debacle of the PR assistant to Di Blasio (her with the criminal boyfriend, and living in NJ to boot!) to the Mayor's NYPD gaff, to hanging too much with his his pal, Sharpton, to this, and all else in between.
Our children deserve better.
The electorate should also be aware that murders continue to climb in our city. Any guess as to why?
Read the news between the lines: it happens every time we get a progressive mayor.
Remember the Dinkins years?
From, the debacle of the PR assistant to Di Blasio (her with the criminal boyfriend, and living in NJ to boot!) to the Mayor's NYPD gaff, to hanging too much with his his pal, Sharpton, to this, and all else in between.
Our children deserve better.
The electorate should also be aware that murders continue to climb in our city. Any guess as to why?
Read the news between the lines: it happens every time we get a progressive mayor.
Remember the Dinkins years?
13
The fact that you'd call Carmen Farina a "rank amateur" demonstrates your ignorance. You may disagree with her policies, but the one thing she is not is an amateur. If anything, we saw amateurs like Cathie Black appointed under Bloomberg. Or lawyers like Joel Klein.
11
We need professional management so that 2 BILLION dollars can be made to disappear on a perhaps 500 million rewrite of the 911 system.
Or professional management that spent how much on a non-working payroll system?
Or professional management that spent how much on a non-working payroll system?
4
Rank amateur? Farina has more experience in education than Wolcott, Klein and Black combined. 40+ years in fact, almost half (18 years) at the management level.
Where did you get your "facts"?
Where did you get your "facts"?
8
After more than a decade of doing things one way and ending up with the terrible results evident now (even Arne thinks kids are performing poorly), who can argue against changing the current system?
Bloomberg and Klein's ideas are the status quo and they obviously don't work.
Bloomberg and Klein's ideas are the status quo and they obviously don't work.
18
I think you have that backwards. There was substantial improvement as the article notes. Much remains to be done. The current regime doesn't care about data seemingly. How can we the public hold them accountable? How do they know if they are making progress? There are more than 1000 schools in the system. Does she plan on reforming them all by visiting them and giving a gut reaction and glib advice? As a liberal she reminds me of Geroge Bush. She just knows in her gut and heart what's right. Conveniently of things get worse or don't improve they will just say it was socio economic reasons that prevented kids from learning.
11
Honeybee - you have it completely backwards.
2
The article says that the graduation rate improved, but educators know that "credit recovery" schemes and pressure from Principals drove that statistic. College readiness actually dropped, substantially.
Please don't forget that Carmen Farina is the same educator who said on WNET in 2005 that children don't need to learn long division anymore. As a parent in the NYC public schools who worked with my children to compensate for the math they weren't learning in class, my jaw remains permanently dropped.
40
That's concerning. As a parent of kids in a top suburban school district, I paid privately for Kumon just to be sure they could add, subtract, multiply and divide.
After it took 3 paragraphs to describe a subtraction problem, I was convinced something was not right and decided to take matters into my own hands. With the basics down, they were then in a much better position to master the abstract concepts later.
It's hard to see how we can be expected to compete in STEM with this mentality.
After it took 3 paragraphs to describe a subtraction problem, I was convinced something was not right and decided to take matters into my own hands. With the basics down, they were then in a much better position to master the abstract concepts later.
It's hard to see how we can be expected to compete in STEM with this mentality.
4
Forget STEM. Gates has politicians upping the numbers of H1B visas so he and others can hire cheaper STEM labor from India and China and pay them slave wages.
1
Looks like the teacher's unions are once again running the show and public education in NYC is back to business as usual. What a shame for the students.
37
Oh please. Please provide evidence to support this silly and archaic "argument." Bring something substantive to the table please, and show that you actually understand the specific realities that pose a challenge to education in this country.
18
Why would it be bad if the TEACHERS' union ran the system? And if the business as usual is education, why is that bad?
7
We don't have unions in Texas that protect teachers. We are a right-to-work state and yet our student scores mirror those in NY.
"Reformers," charters, profiteers, endless testing…same methods, same dismal outcome.
Unions have nothing to do with it.
"Reformers," charters, profiteers, endless testing…same methods, same dismal outcome.
Unions have nothing to do with it.
11
Please, Please, please Chancellor Farina, establish a sensible attendance policy for NYC High Schools!!!
Currently a student cannot actually be required to attend any class other than gym (state law governs that requirement). NYC High School teachers are tired of being forced by their principals to create "make up" work for students who don't attend classes because it is the policy of NYC schools that a student cannot be failed simply for lack of attendance.
Currently a student cannot actually be required to attend any class other than gym (state law governs that requirement). NYC High School teachers are tired of being forced by their principals to create "make up" work for students who don't attend classes because it is the policy of NYC schools that a student cannot be failed simply for lack of attendance.
21
IF a student knows the work, why should s/he be required to sit in a classroom (other than the Regents "seat time requirement)?
1
You are making a tremendous error if you think the students we work with know the material. As I noted we are not asked to give them the materials all our students covered, but only "make up" or better, made up, work to increase pass rates. Invariably, if there is a state exam, they fail, (and the teacher's rating goes down) but this snowballs to other courses and skills, not always tested by the state. We are constantly being reminded that students need to be college and career ready. To be told I should "differentiate" my teaching for a student who simply WON'T wake up to get to school, or for one who would rather get high and roam the hallways, is disgraceful and ultimately is a disservice to children.
I hope that the cynicism towards teachers and education has not grown so much that there is NO value to the classroom experience.
I hope that the cynicism towards teachers and education has not grown so much that there is NO value to the classroom experience.
3
I'm glad that she sees the truth in what the school system really is. Unlike Klein, Farina actually does have an experience in teaching, which is why de Blasio picked her as the chancellor. All of Bloomberg's appointees were just there to do his bidding and nothing more, and they all had little to no experience when it came to teaching in public schools. As a matter of fact, Klein was a lawyer, which makes many think who would hire someone like him to begin with. I find it better to hire experienced teachers as chancellors because they know how exactly how the system works by being part of it yourself. Would you want someone out of the blue to be president of the US? I would think not, which is why many of them were governors or senators before becoming president. As for charter schools, they are nothing more than a joke of what they used to be. When they first thought of, they were supposed to help students that were almost unteachable in public schools, but now that hedge fund managers run them, they just pick only students who do well academically while rejecting those that are terrible. If they want the free space, then they should be teaching those that perform at the bottom or they can't have it by refusing to do so. For those who still don't understand teacher tenure, it's not an immunity, it just allows them for a fair due process before they can actually be fired based on findings. For the record, I'm not affiliated with the UFT by any means.
28
Have they rectified the ignominy, where teachers/students are having classes in decrepit trailers?
5
while Chancellor(ess) is making strides towards repairing ruptures of the previous, it will take years to erase the damage done during the Bloomberg/Klein/Walcott (and yes, Cathie Black) era. her most positive steps are realizing that NO ONE is going to do anything for the kids without the support of the teachers, and that teaching experience is not only necessary but vital to success as a principal. unlike the corporate world, schools contain that variable known as children. she (Chancellor Farina) might even try to shift staffs around every , say--seven to eight years. see how different staffs achieve in different environments. such action, of course, would cause havoc with the teachers' union, but, to date, carmen seems up to it. and yes, i am a retired educator from the nyc school district, with close to 40 years of credited service. ONWARD, CHANCELLOR FARRINA!!!
16
I will never forget the Cathie Black debacle. One of Bloomberg's biggest and smuggest mistakes.
9
"Let Them Not Breed" she bellowed, from her hallowed hall! How did the city let this insulting incompetent run the largest school system in the country, with zero experience?
EMINENT DOMAIN?
EMINENT DOMAIN?
1
So the last Administration's "technocratic" and "corporate" buzzwords - particularly accountability - have been replaced by friendlier ones, like "collaboration." Get along with the new boss, and things will be fine. There will be nothing written in stone, no testing of successful vs. unsuccessful methods, and no way of holding individual schools or administrators accountable to the public for their performance.
The de Blasio Administration's wholesale "dismantling" of the previous twelve years' progress in public education amounts to taking the pressure off administrators to do well, and eliminating all the pesky measurement tools those administrators hate so deeply. Of course they love it. There is no way to tell anymore whether things are getting better or worse, since with the help of de Blasio's media buddies, all critical focus on actual academic performance has vanished. All they need to do is keep up the happy talk backed up by a sweetheart contract with the teacher's union.
True, people seem to think Farina's school-by-school decisions about administrators are trustworthy because of her long experience. Does it occur to anyone that the school system has to go on functioning well after she's gone, based on rules and performance criteria that officials can be held accountable to over time?
I thought by now that the New York Times, if anyone, realized that "accountability" is not a dirty word when the subject is local government.
The de Blasio Administration's wholesale "dismantling" of the previous twelve years' progress in public education amounts to taking the pressure off administrators to do well, and eliminating all the pesky measurement tools those administrators hate so deeply. Of course they love it. There is no way to tell anymore whether things are getting better or worse, since with the help of de Blasio's media buddies, all critical focus on actual academic performance has vanished. All they need to do is keep up the happy talk backed up by a sweetheart contract with the teacher's union.
True, people seem to think Farina's school-by-school decisions about administrators are trustworthy because of her long experience. Does it occur to anyone that the school system has to go on functioning well after she's gone, based on rules and performance criteria that officials can be held accountable to over time?
I thought by now that the New York Times, if anyone, realized that "accountability" is not a dirty word when the subject is local government.
21
Progress over the last 12 years? What progress? According to Arne and crew, kids are dumber than ever and their parents are naive saps who think their kids are smart.
For 12 years, it's been testing, testing, testing on top of channeling money over to charters. And yet just last year, John King and Arne Duncan were lamenting loudly how badly kids are doing.
Testing and charters don't work. Obviously. Ask Duncan and King.
For 12 years, it's been testing, testing, testing on top of channeling money over to charters. And yet just last year, John King and Arne Duncan were lamenting loudly how badly kids are doing.
Testing and charters don't work. Obviously. Ask Duncan and King.
3
In project management, we learned that anything that you measure generally improves. The question is, how does one measure "education"?
Perhaps the classic project management example will illustrate the problem. A person is hired as a hospital orderly. The prime instruction is, cleanliness is next to godliness in a hospital. All is fine until one day an ambulance pulls up with a knifing victim. Blood is spurting out if the victim's body all over. Of course the orderly won't permit the victim to be brought into the hospital, because cleanliness is next to godliness.
Understand what you are measuring, and it's effect on the overall system. The Bloomberg measurements eliminated not merely "minor" subjects such as art and music as well as PE, but also such subjects as social studies and science.
Perhaps the classic project management example will illustrate the problem. A person is hired as a hospital orderly. The prime instruction is, cleanliness is next to godliness in a hospital. All is fine until one day an ambulance pulls up with a knifing victim. Blood is spurting out if the victim's body all over. Of course the orderly won't permit the victim to be brought into the hospital, because cleanliness is next to godliness.
Understand what you are measuring, and it's effect on the overall system. The Bloomberg measurements eliminated not merely "minor" subjects such as art and music as well as PE, but also such subjects as social studies and science.
4
Honeybee,
Charters have been shown to work wonders in Louisiana compared to the public schools they replaced.
Charters have been shown to work wonders in Louisiana compared to the public schools they replaced.
Carmen Farina has abandoned objective measurements of success - for a "feeling" that she gets when she walks in a school. How do you do that across the thousands of NYC schools? Is she planning to visit every school in NYC on a regular basis to perform her special evaluations? Is she training those under her to get the same "feeling" when they visit and assess schools? And how does the public know that those feelings are in fact adequate measurements of student success? Ridiculous and retrograde. An embarrassment to educators - and I come from a family of educators.
103
Where has she abandoned objective measurement? I don't see that she has "abandoned" as much as "balanced." Nor does she rely only on "feelings" as you imply. But education (a human endeavor) consists of intangibles as well as metrics.
One of the reasons Bloomberg, Klein, etc. overemphasized tests are that they are not educators, they are business technocrats who believe all that matters are numbers. Since finance is measured in numbers, they just continue that criteria in all areas.
Why can't there be a multi-focal evaluation approach? Most educators, perhaps even those in your family, prefer that.
One of the reasons Bloomberg, Klein, etc. overemphasized tests are that they are not educators, they are business technocrats who believe all that matters are numbers. Since finance is measured in numbers, they just continue that criteria in all areas.
Why can't there be a multi-focal evaluation approach? Most educators, perhaps even those in your family, prefer that.
17
Meh. She knows something when she sees it. She doesn't rely on numbers on a paper. Makes perfect sense.
5
I think you are missing the subtext here. She is saying that the increasingly favored data-only means of assessing school quality is flawed and does not take into consideration intangible factors.
Based on your comments, you seem to judge her according to anecdotes alone.
Based on your comments, you seem to judge her according to anecdotes alone.
42
All good news for New York City schools. A human-based systems approach to making sure all of our students get a quality education - no small feat.
15
The article said:
"Carmen Fariña...cut off the official who was presenting the data. 'I know a good quality school when I’m in the building.'"
It is not rocket science to distinguish an orderly from a chaotic school, but Fariña seems to correlate positive qualitative observations with "good quality" in the sense that the school is succeeding in instilling in students values/skills/etc., that will serve them later in life, a premise with which we cannot agree. Of course, neither does data tell the complete tale.
Students practicing math worksheets, and even Common Core's new mantra "critique the reasoning of others" can appear orderly in their routineness, but it doesn't imply something is taken away beyond the ability to complete the assignment. When you pose lengthy, non-formulaic problems to students that involve real problem solving, as is rarely done in American K-12 math education, the classroom will be anything but orderly, because such novelty and putting the onus on students invariably induces panic, frustration and protest. But it is guiding students through that chaos in the quest for novel problem solving skills that provides long term value that will carry beyond the end of formal education.
"Carmen Fariña...cut off the official who was presenting the data. 'I know a good quality school when I’m in the building.'"
It is not rocket science to distinguish an orderly from a chaotic school, but Fariña seems to correlate positive qualitative observations with "good quality" in the sense that the school is succeeding in instilling in students values/skills/etc., that will serve them later in life, a premise with which we cannot agree. Of course, neither does data tell the complete tale.
Students practicing math worksheets, and even Common Core's new mantra "critique the reasoning of others" can appear orderly in their routineness, but it doesn't imply something is taken away beyond the ability to complete the assignment. When you pose lengthy, non-formulaic problems to students that involve real problem solving, as is rarely done in American K-12 math education, the classroom will be anything but orderly, because such novelty and putting the onus on students invariably induces panic, frustration and protest. But it is guiding students through that chaos in the quest for novel problem solving skills that provides long term value that will carry beyond the end of formal education.
20
When an experienced person "knows" something, it can , as well, be broken down to concrete components. There is an important role of "observation" of a school in addition to a prepared, cherry picked power point presentation. Farina knows more than spreadsheets, and she knows that human learning cannot (really) be reduced to metrics. Even though numbers have their place.
There are many ways to "quantify" subjective measures, if you want to. Things like number of children raising their hands in class and participating in lessons (especially those asking questions rather than parroting answers), type of teacher interaction with students (and administrators), number and type of books accessible in classroom and their actual use, content of bulletin boards/display of student's work (esp creative rather than rote work), use of constructive rather than punitive discipline, and, of course, expression on children's faces.
But these items are not mentioned by standardized testing sold by testing companies.
There are many ways to "quantify" subjective measures, if you want to. Things like number of children raising their hands in class and participating in lessons (especially those asking questions rather than parroting answers), type of teacher interaction with students (and administrators), number and type of books accessible in classroom and their actual use, content of bulletin boards/display of student's work (esp creative rather than rote work), use of constructive rather than punitive discipline, and, of course, expression on children's faces.
But these items are not mentioned by standardized testing sold by testing companies.
5
'...it doesn't imply something is taken away beyond the ability to complete the assignment...'
Which is one of the most important skills to have in life.
Which is one of the most important skills to have in life.
1
An educator as chancellor. What a concept!
60
If Ms Farina want to give good students a hand when it comes to getting into colleges, without needing to spend a penny of taxpayer's money, she can go back to a policy that helped bright but slightly clumsy or unathletic students tremendously - that of entering, and averaging, only the 'major' (academic) subjects on the transcripts sent to colleges. Not having to worry about the effects of barely passing a strictly graded gym class - in spite of a huge amount of effort - was a better stress reliever than all the tranquilizers a doctor could prescribe. Or has society in general, and the New York City school system in particular, become too tough minded to give a smart, klutzy kid a break?
If the answer is 'Yes', then we'd all better plan on staying fit and healthy. Or else.
If the answer is 'Yes', then we'd all better plan on staying fit and healthy. Or else.
6
Mayor de Blasio and Chancellor Farina are attempting to do what Obama promised in his first run for President, that is to decrease the amount of time and emphasis spent on testing and to approach education in a more holistic way, providing a more rounded education for all children. However wonderful this may be, the bottom line is that the majority of Principals of NYC's top middle schools and high schools will never stop looking at the test grades as the ultimate factor in choosing which students they accept. The only hope for diversity is quota or affirmative action.
2
Chancellor Farina is a superior Educator and advocate for all children. Contrary to Professor Nadelstern's suggestion that charter schools have exceptional graduation rates and rising test scores, the Pew Research Center offers mixed reviews on the success for public charters across the country and New York City. I never met a teacher that didn't want their pupils to excel, graduate and achieve the highest learning outcomes. Tests are a snapshot of learning. Critical thinking requires logical reasoning, problem solving, intellectual inquiry, curiosity and student engagement. Let's improve the writing, math, and science skills for all students and provide the necessary professional development, computer labs and textbooks for all and not just a few. Wall Street funded charter schools are not the only model for academic reform. When measured, their students simply fill out weekly test sheets from academic tutors and Teach for America overworked college graduates. Mandatory weekend tutoring sessions help some. But, students that fail are conveniently transferred back into their home districts to inflate the progress of the rest of the cohort. Moreover, the financiers promote their Pearson Publishing partners who gleefully provide test bubble sheets without any concern for the students' progress. That's the real shame of the so-called education reformers. Unions, Parents, Teachers, and Wall Street should collaborate; how about that kind of educational reform?
36
The public's interest in providing public education is to make people productive members of society. Thus, the primary goal of public education must be based on basic skills such as reading, math, science, civics. Most of the rest is distraction. It's fine for people to feel be personally fulfilled through the arts, but that's something their families should take care of, not the taxpayers.
10
Being a productive member of society goes far beyond basic skills. It also requires knowledge and the fostering of attitudes. We all know people who are intellectually brilliant but wreak havoc when it comes to work and home life. Your choice of what are considered basic skills can also be debated. But lets say the basic skills you identify are the only goals. The next question is how you get there. And this is what's being debated in school reform efforts. What are the best ways to teach identified knowledge, skills and attitudes for being a productive member of society? Moreover, to say that the arts are not necessary in education ignores what the arts bring to the table in regards to intrinsic value AND how it plays a role in teaching the very things you note as being the primary aims of a public education. There is quite a bit of empirical research, for example, that shows links between motivation in school with arts education.
The current DOE is acknowledging that while numbers matter (she's not getting rid of all tests) other criteria matter too. As EdBx points out, getting the most out of people is a strategy towards school reform. Education and what takes place in schools is a human endeavor and as such deserves the kind of attention and care suggested by Farina and company.
The current DOE is acknowledging that while numbers matter (she's not getting rid of all tests) other criteria matter too. As EdBx points out, getting the most out of people is a strategy towards school reform. Education and what takes place in schools is a human endeavor and as such deserves the kind of attention and care suggested by Farina and company.
6
Even in the "old days" when the basics you mention were stressed, art and music were parts of the high school curriculum. Just as "reading," as you term it, should include the classics as well as modern literature, a well-rounded educational experience includes the range of the humanities, of which the visual arts and music are surely a part.
6
Many studies have proven the critical thinking and problem solving skills embedded within an arts education actually improve test scores and academic performance. Let's not be "penny wise and pound foolish."
In coaching sports, there are two important parts to the job: strategy and handling the players. Strategy, the x's and o's, time management, player substitution, etc. is important. But getting the most from the athletes is even more important. With the schools, the Bloomberg administration was focused totally on the strategy. Their attitude toward the educators was demeaning and demoralizing. Ms. Farina is far, far better than the Bloomberg team at getting the best out of the educators. That is reflected in several comments in this article. Getting the most out of the people in the schools, principals, supervisors, and teachers is in itself the most significant strategy for improving our schools.
47
Farina sounds like a huge improvement over the disaster that was Joel Klein. The charter school profiteers are interested in closing down schools so that they can divert taxpayer dollars into the bank accounts of lavishly paid charter "management" executives. Bloomberg and Klein were basically looting the system, taking money from public schools and giving them to private (charter) schools. Good for DeBlasio for fighting to preserve public schooling in New York!
95
As a retired teacher, I worked in hundreds of schools doing staff training for one or two day sessions. Just being in a building, working with staff members, and observing students in the halls does give one a feeling for the school. When the administrators are professional but friendly with the students and the staff is happy and proud of their school, students are not as stressed and feel supported to do their best.
1
Charter schools are performing well. But more importantly, compared with public schools, they achieve the same or better academic results for less expense. That alone is enough reason to expand the charter school program. The same or better results for less money. That's the definition of improving efficiency.
Nonsense. Don't confuse trying to find a more efficient way of doing things with stealing.
1
Now her next move, hopefully, is to begin to put the high school division back together so that the students of today can enjoy the myriad of activities a high school education should provide. This has been denied them for the most part (there are a few exceptions but very few) with the phony "themes" and the inavility of these small schools to provide the variety of courses and activities such as band classes, arts classes, electives in language arts that have always been an extremely important part of a high school education. These students for whom Klein, Walcott at the orders of Bloomberg have had the good times a well rounded high school education shojld include will realize down the road what was taken away from them under the guise of "reform."
It's too bad the damage that has been done to these students' lives will only become apparent down the line.
It's too bad the damage that has been done to these students' lives will only become apparent down the line.
49
Time to look at what Veronica Conforme is doing with test scores and student behavior in Detroit, Michigan
Jeff, I see it differently. The main purpose of high school is not "activities". Further
"themes" (if done well) are an excellent way to organize learning. There are many advantages to small school, such as easier planning and control, students and teachers identifying with school (and its values) more easily, most students being known by most staff (quicker ability to pick up problems), etc.
Students need "activities" but they can do that after school, even right in the school, via clubs, competitions, etc. The emphasis on testing also take away from innovation in schools but that is not a function of size.
"themes" (if done well) are an excellent way to organize learning. There are many advantages to small school, such as easier planning and control, students and teachers identifying with school (and its values) more easily, most students being known by most staff (quicker ability to pick up problems), etc.
Students need "activities" but they can do that after school, even right in the school, via clubs, competitions, etc. The emphasis on testing also take away from innovation in schools but that is not a function of size.
4
I absolutely did not mean activities are more important than academics and if it came across that way, I apologize. However, high schools need both. When I went to high school, academics came first of course but it was great to have all the varied activities for after school like learning a musical instrument, being able to take a course in journalism and working on a school newspaper. And just this past May, we enjoyed our 50th anniversary of our high school graduation and there were at least 80 former classmates and we thought about the old times. I wonder how many of the kids today in these boutique schools will have those reunions.
In addition, it's a matter of math. If you have a school with 400 students and 2% want to take and are qualified to take AP chemistry, for example, that's 8 kids. Not enough for a class. If you have a school of 2,000, that's 40 kids, enough for 2 classes. We can do that with any subject. That's not to say none of the small schools don't have electives but in many cases, for the "prestige" of being able to say a school offers AP chemistry, many students are put in the class who are not qualified or the course is totally modified. It's a matter of simple math.
Down the line, we will realize what a mistake it was to destroy the concept of what a secondary school education should include. As far as the themes, the vast majority of them are nonsense. Some day we will put the high schools together again.
In addition, it's a matter of math. If you have a school with 400 students and 2% want to take and are qualified to take AP chemistry, for example, that's 8 kids. Not enough for a class. If you have a school of 2,000, that's 40 kids, enough for 2 classes. We can do that with any subject. That's not to say none of the small schools don't have electives but in many cases, for the "prestige" of being able to say a school offers AP chemistry, many students are put in the class who are not qualified or the course is totally modified. It's a matter of simple math.
Down the line, we will realize what a mistake it was to destroy the concept of what a secondary school education should include. As far as the themes, the vast majority of them are nonsense. Some day we will put the high schools together again.
8
Now comes Carmen Fariña, who doesn't need objective criteria to evaluate schools and teachers, but instead relies on her subjective gestalt. Why should we trust her intuition? How can one translate her hunches into a meaningful plan for improvement?
In the sciences, it was long ago learned that subjective judgments are inferior to objective measurements. This is why we have blinded, randomized, placebo-controlled trials. Relying on researchers' observations often lead to irreproducible results because of subconscious biases.
Any attempt to improve educational outcomes must adopt a simple, objective metric to judge those outcomes. Otherwise, we will obtain the same irreproducible results we once saw in scientific research.