The BPP came at a time where police brutality had been a normal practice, much like today. The BPP were determined to stand up to the brutality. We need a party like that TODAY!
Some of the Black Panther Party leaders and members walked into the California state legislature while in session fully armed, holstered handguns, shotguns, and long guns bringing to attention the fact that carrying unconcealed weapons in public was still perfectly legal in that state. They stated that police were 'pigs', in the manner in which propagandists portray the enemy in wars so that it becomes okay to kill those less than human other people. They rejected non-violent resistance but instead preached violent resistance. They portrayed themselves to all as an active resistance movement ready to become insurgents. The made themselves seem to be everything which paranoid people like J. Edgar Hoover feared most, and so they became the focus of what amounted to an anti-terrorist project involving everyone from the Justice Department to local law enforcement. While their goal was to achieve justice for African Americans, they just turned themselves into victims of the nation's law enforcement institutions.
Black Panther Party For Self Defense was not the only black org. that took up arms. Whatever the outcome was for them we all know or should know that the Federal Govt. law agencies sabotaged , used provocateurs, false testimony etc to discredit the Panthers.
Hoover said the same thing about Marcus Garvey, MLK, Malcolm X.Any black man that spoke to self determination was a threat to the white establishment. The Panthers became thoroughly infiltrated by black govt. agents who would bomb facilities in black communities , provoking havoc and chaos.
Whites have no clue. It seems many never do or will.
However today you have those brave white souls, who do have more than a clue and are willing to risk their lives to effectuate change. It happened in the past, what hasn't changed is how they are viewed by the white establishment by and large as.....TRAITORS
Hoover said the same thing about Marcus Garvey, MLK, Malcolm X.Any black man that spoke to self determination was a threat to the white establishment. The Panthers became thoroughly infiltrated by black govt. agents who would bomb facilities in black communities , provoking havoc and chaos.
Whites have no clue. It seems many never do or will.
However today you have those brave white souls, who do have more than a clue and are willing to risk their lives to effectuate change. It happened in the past, what hasn't changed is how they are viewed by the white establishment by and large as.....TRAITORS
Long ago while living with friends in the black part of town, most just called it the ghetto, we were interested to see what would happen after a section of the Black Panthers moved into the building that we were living in. There were some visits from the Brown Berets, the Latino group of like kind, and less interaction with the SDS in the area. We didn't find the Panthers to be racists, they tolerated us predominately young white kids in their midst, and we got to know some of them. Some of the girls in our group helped with the breakfast program for kids, other people helped to distribute their newspaper. Some of the Panthers were from out of town, most seemed to be from the community, and while it probably wouldn't be fair to label them all as criminals or thugs it would also be honest to not label them as squeaky clean middle class citizens. A few lines from 'Sympathy for the Devil' is perhaps warranted, which ironically is also the name of a documentary of the same name by Jean-Luc Godard, which is in part about the Black Panthers; "…Just as every cop is a criminal, And all the sinners saints, As heads is tails…"
A closer review of this documentary highlights, and uncovers the true nature the United States police policies towards minorities, with as always, special attention paid to Black Americans. If you are open minded semi-rational, take special note of the sentiments, and comment made by the former Director of the FBI, J. Edgar Hoover. The reporter asks; "Do you feel the nation is in trouble?" Hoovers reply, "Yes, the nation is in trouble...Vigorous law enforcement is the answer. The ONLY answer." More chilling was his next statement. "Justice is merely incidental to Law and Order." That statement is clear testimony of the resentment that Black Americans received from ALL Law Enforcement, and the open acceptance of any an all methods used by police, to destroy any and all disturbances of the white American status quo.
Part II
The Black Panthers as the number One threat to the internal security of America? Seriously? The Cold War was still under way, there was still blood on Cuban beaches after the Bay of Pigs fiasco, and Viet Nam was in full deadly bloom. These sentiments and the vigorous enforcement executed by the Police continue today. For all of you who may think that the current Global resentment of American polices, and the a hatred so palpable that the beheading of any White American is the act of deprave terrorist. It's not. We should all be reminded that when you let your dogs bite innocent people, for something as asinine as the color of their skin, and refuse to punish the dog for his bad behavior. You shouldn't be surprised when one day your dog bites you. .What is a terrorist organization? In 1925, 60,000 KKK marched in full regalia, down Pennsylvania Ave, in Washington D.C., to the applause of all who watched. Marching right along side of them is President Calvin Coolidge. The Black Panther Party, a terrorist organization? Finally, President Woodrow Wilson's remarks after watching Griffith's "Birth of a Nation". "It is like writing history with lighting, and my only regret is that it is so terribly true." No body is running from tyranny any more. Long Live the Panthers...No Justice. No Peace
The Black Panthers as the number One threat to the internal security of America? Seriously? The Cold War was still under way, there was still blood on Cuban beaches after the Bay of Pigs fiasco, and Viet Nam was in full deadly bloom. These sentiments and the vigorous enforcement executed by the Police continue today. For all of you who may think that the current Global resentment of American polices, and the a hatred so palpable that the beheading of any White American is the act of deprave terrorist. It's not. We should all be reminded that when you let your dogs bite innocent people, for something as asinine as the color of their skin, and refuse to punish the dog for his bad behavior. You shouldn't be surprised when one day your dog bites you. .What is a terrorist organization? In 1925, 60,000 KKK marched in full regalia, down Pennsylvania Ave, in Washington D.C., to the applause of all who watched. Marching right along side of them is President Calvin Coolidge. The Black Panther Party, a terrorist organization? Finally, President Woodrow Wilson's remarks after watching Griffith's "Birth of a Nation". "It is like writing history with lighting, and my only regret is that it is so terribly true." No body is running from tyranny any more. Long Live the Panthers...No Justice. No Peace
1
As I recall, ( I was about 19 then) The Black Panthers served as a good balance to Martin Luther King. He espoused non violent civil action to combat racism; and they offered more confrontational " violent " threats to achieve the same goal. It was a well balanced 'carrot vs. stick ' presentation for white society to consider at the time and especially crucial because it was not "scripted".
Both black positions seemed to be genuine in their beliefs.
What both the Panthers and King shared in common was an understanding of the magnitude of what they were up against.
Some positive change occurred, in my opinion, because of the dynamic interaction of their opposing approaches.As is usually the case in struggles for freedom, many have to die. Many Panthers and King, not to forget thousands of anonymous blacks paid the ultimate price for progress.
There has been much progress since the 60's but racism is still pretty entrenched. Police actions today toward blacks Seem almost worse to me because much of the white population Believes that civil rights have been "won". They fail to accept the subtle racism. If whites believe racism does'nt exist' they need to ask themselves , all things being equal, would I prefer my chances in this society as a black person?
Both black positions seemed to be genuine in their beliefs.
What both the Panthers and King shared in common was an understanding of the magnitude of what they were up against.
Some positive change occurred, in my opinion, because of the dynamic interaction of their opposing approaches.As is usually the case in struggles for freedom, many have to die. Many Panthers and King, not to forget thousands of anonymous blacks paid the ultimate price for progress.
There has been much progress since the 60's but racism is still pretty entrenched. Police actions today toward blacks Seem almost worse to me because much of the white population Believes that civil rights have been "won". They fail to accept the subtle racism. If whites believe racism does'nt exist' they need to ask themselves , all things being equal, would I prefer my chances in this society as a black person?
3
How hypocritical that the filmmakers lionize the Panthers for protesting the murder of black men, while omitting the black men murdered by the Panthers.
What s shame they never red Tom Wolfe's famous article on the Black Panther cocktail party hosted by Leonard Bernstein.
What s shame they never red Tom Wolfe's famous article on the Black Panther cocktail party hosted by Leonard Bernstein.
3
I remember Fred Hampton, a leader of the Black Panther Party in Illinois. He implemented a number of non-violent communtiy empowerment programs in the West Side ghetto of Chicago. This of course made him a threat to the white establishment, particularly J. Edgar Hoover.
Consequently, Hampton was targeted in the crosshairs of the FBI Cointelpro program, culminating in a 'death squad' sent ot execute him, consisting of elements of the Cook County, IL State's Attorney's Office, the Chicago Police Dept., and the FBI. Of course, this 'death squad', which successfully assassinated Hampton on Dec. 4, 1969, and those who directed the 'death squad', were exonerated.
Where are the significant black leaders of today, who are actually changing things, or even attempting to change things, at a grass roots level as, according to Wikipedia, Hampton did:
"Hampton's organizing skills, substantial oratorical gifts, and personal charisma allowed him to rise quickly in the Black Panthers. Once he became leader of the Chicago chapter, he organized weekly rallies, worked closely with the BPP's local People's Clinic, taught political education classes every morning at 6am, and launched a project for community supervision of the police. Hampton was also instrumental in the BPP's Free Breakfast Program."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fred_Hampton
Consequently, Hampton was targeted in the crosshairs of the FBI Cointelpro program, culminating in a 'death squad' sent ot execute him, consisting of elements of the Cook County, IL State's Attorney's Office, the Chicago Police Dept., and the FBI. Of course, this 'death squad', which successfully assassinated Hampton on Dec. 4, 1969, and those who directed the 'death squad', were exonerated.
Where are the significant black leaders of today, who are actually changing things, or even attempting to change things, at a grass roots level as, according to Wikipedia, Hampton did:
"Hampton's organizing skills, substantial oratorical gifts, and personal charisma allowed him to rise quickly in the Black Panthers. Once he became leader of the Chicago chapter, he organized weekly rallies, worked closely with the BPP's local People's Clinic, taught political education classes every morning at 6am, and launched a project for community supervision of the police. Hampton was also instrumental in the BPP's Free Breakfast Program."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fred_Hampton
5
Yes, this. There was a targeted campaign of assassination directed against Panther leadership. Nothing like a few deaths to bring a trajectory to a screeching halt. The movement toward greater and more equitable human rights here might have been far different had Hampton (and others) lived and other Panther leaders not fled the country.
1
The Black Panther Party was successful in expressing anger and resentment towards the established public institutions which were dominated by white people and indifferent the circumstances of African Americans. Unfortunately, the anger and resentment lead to some very unwise actions and talk which portrayed them as revolutionaries eager to begin an armed insurgency against all governments in this country in pursuit of achieving power quite independently from the legal governments. Other groups in our history also proposed that for African Americans to achieve freedom they would have to separate from the white dominated governments, but they did not give signals that they were intent upon going to war to achieve it. In the end the Black Panthers could not persist, but what drove them to those extremes does continue to persist.
We have not seen the end of racial discrimination yet and until we do there will be a continuing presence of anger and resentment amongst those being discriminated.
We have not seen the end of racial discrimination yet and until we do there will be a continuing presence of anger and resentment amongst those being discriminated.
The Black Panther Party is just another rasicst gang.
They intimated voters at a Philadelphia polling site in 2008.
They intimated voters at a Philadelphia polling site in 2008.
3
Oh, please.
1
Uhh. Is that all you got? I'm sure you agree with Michele Bachmann that "the Founding Fathers fought tirelessly until slavery was no more". History didn't start in 2008. Are you not understand the point of the article? Black Americans have given and continue to give us the chance to correct our history. Are we going to pay attention when it's done non-violently or do we only react to violence?
1
Zac you're misinformed. They are not the same. The one you're talking about is the New Black Panther Party which has been sued by the original for using their name.
1
The Black Panthers were Freedom Fighters, fighting for the freedom of a colonized people. The only difference between them and MK was that South Africans were colonized in their own country, Afro-Americans in a foreign one to which they were taken by force. In both cases Africa was robbed, raped and pillaged for her riches and labor.
5
"[t]o which they were taken by force."
You want us to believe that 50 or so crewmen were able to safely drop anchor off the African shoreline and go off into the depths of the continent and collect-up a thousand Black men, women and children for shipment back to the colonies with no help from the locals? Again, "TAKEN?" The captured people were looked upon as merchandise by all parties involved.
You want us to believe that 50 or so crewmen were able to safely drop anchor off the African shoreline and go off into the depths of the continent and collect-up a thousand Black men, women and children for shipment back to the colonies with no help from the locals? Again, "TAKEN?" The captured people were looked upon as merchandise by all parties involved.
Wasn't it in South Africa that Gandhi developed his philosophy of Satyagraha, which he would use to lead India to its independence and instigate the world movement of decolonization?
The similarity is between South Africa and India where the majorities were oppressed by a white minority, which was just the opposite of the situation in the U.S., however, the religious basis behind the Indian independence movement was influential among US civil rights leaders and was studied by MLK and Bayard Rustin to name a few.
I think one unstated reason for the Black Panther Party's appeal to white students in the 1960s was that unlike CORE and SNCC, racially integrated organizations that jettisoned their white staffers around 1966, the Panthers were the Black Power group that refused to sever its alliances with with white radicals.
That's Eldridge Cleaver at 2:50 of the video, sittin' in a car puffin' on a stoogie. In "Soul on Ice" he described rape as an act of revolutionary insurrection that he had been "practicing" but had given up. Not according to David Hilliard's biography of Huey Newton. Cleaver became the Peace and Freedom Party candidate for president of the United States in 1968.
The similarity is between South Africa and India where the majorities were oppressed by a white minority, which was just the opposite of the situation in the U.S., however, the religious basis behind the Indian independence movement was influential among US civil rights leaders and was studied by MLK and Bayard Rustin to name a few.
I think one unstated reason for the Black Panther Party's appeal to white students in the 1960s was that unlike CORE and SNCC, racially integrated organizations that jettisoned their white staffers around 1966, the Panthers were the Black Power group that refused to sever its alliances with with white radicals.
That's Eldridge Cleaver at 2:50 of the video, sittin' in a car puffin' on a stoogie. In "Soul on Ice" he described rape as an act of revolutionary insurrection that he had been "practicing" but had given up. Not according to David Hilliard's biography of Huey Newton. Cleaver became the Peace and Freedom Party candidate for president of the United States in 1968.
Bob Cherry@ ok that explains how they got captured, what does that have to do with 400 yrs of systemic oppression / suppression from white establishment ?
In the 1960's Watts, Detroit, and Newark burned, in part because of police brutality. Today, we have a series of instances of black killings by white police, all of which have racial overtones, but none of which can be said to involve overt racial hatred. The recent killings have coalesced to create a sense of police racism. But when racial hatred is overt, cities burn. When race is a disturbing issue, the people march and chant "I can't breathe." The affected blacks are much smarter about this than those demonstrating on their behalf. The blacks know the difference between intentional hate and gross insensitivity. To them, it's real life. The demonstrators tend to lump all of the police killings together because it makes for better chants and better signs. The Black Panthers used intimidation because that was what the situation called for. That's a far cry from today. And those who think otherwise were either not born or had their heads in the sand in the 1960's.
2
"the blacks," just know, do they? All live in the ghetto, do they?
Perhaps no image struck more fear in the minds of white America during the sixties than what they saw on May 2, 1967. Standing on the steps of the California state capital thirty Black Panthers in their uniforms and armed, graphically introduced the public to a new vision of black politics.
Powerful images of handsome black men and beautiful black women projected the Party's appeal to allies, supporters, and recruits. The power the Black Panthers achieved grew out of their politics of armed self-defense.
The federal government, under Nixon and Hoover, responded by unleashing the most intense repression ever waged against a political party in the history of America.
Powerful images of handsome black men and beautiful black women projected the Party's appeal to allies, supporters, and recruits. The power the Black Panthers achieved grew out of their politics of armed self-defense.
The federal government, under Nixon and Hoover, responded by unleashing the most intense repression ever waged against a political party in the history of America.
2
What responsibility do people in African-American communities take for crime and violence in their communities?
Stop blaming the police for everything.
Stop blaming the police for everything.
9
What responsibility do white Americans take for crime and violence committed in THEIR communities? Or better yet, by them in other communities?
1
We've all got to change our evil ways, baby.
1
Us? none. Don't be laying white people's massive financial crimes and war-mongering off on us, neither.
That's COMPLETELY different. i mean, it's not like we're all alike and all know each other...
That's COMPLETELY different. i mean, it's not like we're all alike and all know each other...
My entire life (born 1969) I've witnessed one incident after another where incidents involving blacks are quickly overtaken by emotion and a narrative is quickly formed that places blacks as the victim where they were the perpetrator (LA riots which were in fact anti-Asian hate crimes all over this country, Crown Heights, Jena 6, Ferguson). Then there are instances where a wrongdoing occurred but their criminal behavior played a huge part creating the situation (Rodney King, Central Park 5, Sean Bell, Oscar Grant, Trayvon Martin). In the case of the latter group there are people far more worthy of advocating whose injustice goes unadvocated for because they are not black. Is this not racist?
Growing up I heard all these stories about racial injustice and innocent black men being killed simply for being black. All the exaggerations, lies, half truths, and dishonest myth making ("hands up don't shoot", Trayon was hunted down for being a hoodie wearing black male) I have seen in my lifetime makes me wonder how credible are the claims I'd taken for truths that occurred before my time.
Growing up I heard all these stories about racial injustice and innocent black men being killed simply for being black. All the exaggerations, lies, half truths, and dishonest myth making ("hands up don't shoot", Trayon was hunted down for being a hoodie wearing black male) I have seen in my lifetime makes me wonder how credible are the claims I'd taken for truths that occurred before my time.
6
Well, there are plenty of picture postcards ("Having a wonderful time! Wish you were here!!") of lynchings you can look up.
The op-ed leaves out some interesting information about the Black Panthers, and how they ran drugs and weapons through the Bay Area, and murdered anyone who disagreed with them, or who cast light on their illegal and violent activities. They were thugs, plain and simple.
8
A very nice historical perspective. I would just like to add that because of the Party police brutality did decrease and this change both defines and informs the situation today. It is different today because of what was done in the past. Today as pointed out in the documentary the question of police abuse and the militarization of policing are not just a race or African American issue. Today the response flows from a much broader cross section of society, not just out of the Black Community, and that is just one part of the legacy of the Black Panther Party.
7
Michael Brown assaulted a police officer and tried to take his gun.
Now that even Eric Holder's Department of Justice could not find fault with the officer's actions,
the New York Times wants to resurrect Brown as a heroic figure in the mold of the Black Panthers -- who did nothing but pose in berets and leather coats.
Now that even Eric Holder's Department of Justice could not find fault with the officer's actions,
the New York Times wants to resurrect Brown as a heroic figure in the mold of the Black Panthers -- who did nothing but pose in berets and leather coats.
9
"...the Black Panthers -- who did nothing but pose in berets and leather coats..."?
You must be much younger than I am because I remember the Panthers doing much more than you claim.
You must be much younger than I am because I remember the Panthers doing much more than you claim.
4
A minor technical detail: the Justice Department only said that they couldn't make a civil rights case work, not that everything was ginger-peachy.
Oh, and any cop who lets a big guy who he thinks might be guilty of a violent armed robbery waltz right up to his car door while he's sitting there, belted in, is a moron.
Oh, and any cop who lets a big guy who he thinks might be guilty of a violent armed robbery waltz right up to his car door while he's sitting there, belted in, is a moron.
The Black Panthers are the response of people who have given up hope. Protestors protest because they believe things can change. If you don’t, if you’ve given up hope, you don’t even bother, and you can well envision your life ending any day in a shootout. Today, it’s the responsibility of older men to teach men coming up that the fear they feel, which they feel for good and real reason, can turn to anger, the kind of anger that makes you feel that it doesn’t matter what you do in life, because it’ll make no difference and all come to the same, the kind of anger that makes you not care whether you live or die or what you do in between—but there’s a better way, and maybe it’s the only way: if you have hope, you can do a lot.
Will they listen, even when they know they’re hearing truth, but it does not feel like truth to them at the time, more like the rambling of “old” men, who are pathetic and know nothing about their lives? It takes a lot to get old; you could learn a lot from the men whose skin has lost its glow.
Will they listen, even when they know they’re hearing truth, but it does not feel like truth to them at the time, more like the rambling of “old” men, who are pathetic and know nothing about their lives? It takes a lot to get old; you could learn a lot from the men whose skin has lost its glow.
1
Barry Goldwater: "extremism in the defense of liberty is no vice"
I wonder--does his quote apply to African Americans?
I wonder--does his quote apply to African Americans?
6
People interested in this subject might also like to read a book by:
Author Pearson, Hugh.
Title The shadow of the panther : Huey Newton and the price of Black power in America / Hugh Pearson.
Publication Info Reading, Mass. : Addison-Wesley Pub. Co., c1994.
Author Pearson, Hugh.
Title The shadow of the panther : Huey Newton and the price of Black power in America / Hugh Pearson.
Publication Info Reading, Mass. : Addison-Wesley Pub. Co., c1994.
1
Here's another: The Black Book of the American Left, by David Horowitz. Horowitz was Communist, then Left-Leaning, and while on that side of the political spectrum, assisted the Black Panthers in the Bay Area to help them operate as they professed they wanted to. Then he witnessed the actuality of life with a criminal gang.
7
Horowitz, let it be known, now gets paid rather well to write books and flit about the country, telling right-wingers stories that please them.
At least try reading David Frum, who's willing to chew out the Right too.
At least try reading David Frum, who's willing to chew out the Right too.
As I'm sure others have pointed out, one of the primary catalysts for the creation of the Panthers in Oakland was a series of police shootings of unarmed Black men. Several of the cases, if I recall, involved teenage boys as young as 13 years old. I guess everybody knows when enough is enough.
5
Lots of reaction have blurred the lines between the truth and the feelings of the truth. So, facts become even more blurred by different views about what should be and not what is and what is not. The fact remains that the police have their limitations, just like anyone else. So, do not expect them to be perfect human specimens. Until then, we would not understand what has gone wrong. Sad that we should come to this state of affairs, but, we still have to seek a general solution to alleged police brutality.
Please remove Michael Brown. Evidence points to his initiating physical attack on policeman. Other cases are better straw men to prop up your argument.
8
That "evidence" has served as an alibi for white cops for generations. Blacks know better, experiencing this injustice historically.
Today every instance of a cop killing an unarmed black man is "fear". That has been the basis of defense.
Black folks know that the cop Wilson cowardly gunned down Michael Brown, despite the outcome. This story has played before. Hence , the formation of the "Black Panther Party - Self Defense". Causality.....
Today every instance of a cop killing an unarmed black man is "fear". That has been the basis of defense.
Black folks know that the cop Wilson cowardly gunned down Michael Brown, despite the outcome. This story has played before. Hence , the formation of the "Black Panther Party - Self Defense". Causality.....
3
The Black Panthers began as a community organization as a response to the overcrowding in West Berkeley. The San Francisco redevelopment agency had torn down the low cost housing in the "Western Addition" leading to big profits for the Alioto's, and forcing the low income blacks into West Berkeley. It was in fact a ghetto, and the Panthers were a response to that.
One of their first efforts was getting lunches to school kids. Blacks could not buy in East Berkeley of East Oakland, they were pretty much confined to the area west of San Pablo Ave. One thing they did, was have their hair cut nice, beards trimmed and wore good clothing, and they would hand out pamphlets. The did this on the streets of Oakland, Berkeley and at Sather Gate at UCB.
The Oakland police were a collection of racist cops, and used force to prevent the Panthers from organizing. They started out as a peaceful protest group, but became militant thanks to The Oakland Police in particular. The Berkeley cops were more laid back.
I was there, I talked to them at Sather Gate, and I saw the living conditions.
I saw the Oakland cops prevent a peace march on Telegraph Ave. with cops dressed like storm troopers, and heavy duty vehicles. Real estate communities had covenants that prevented selling to Blacks.
All they did originally, was demand to be treated fairly, decently, and civilly.
Treat people with force and violence, and they respond in kind.
One of their first efforts was getting lunches to school kids. Blacks could not buy in East Berkeley of East Oakland, they were pretty much confined to the area west of San Pablo Ave. One thing they did, was have their hair cut nice, beards trimmed and wore good clothing, and they would hand out pamphlets. The did this on the streets of Oakland, Berkeley and at Sather Gate at UCB.
The Oakland police were a collection of racist cops, and used force to prevent the Panthers from organizing. They started out as a peaceful protest group, but became militant thanks to The Oakland Police in particular. The Berkeley cops were more laid back.
I was there, I talked to them at Sather Gate, and I saw the living conditions.
I saw the Oakland cops prevent a peace march on Telegraph Ave. with cops dressed like storm troopers, and heavy duty vehicles. Real estate communities had covenants that prevented selling to Blacks.
All they did originally, was demand to be treated fairly, decently, and civilly.
Treat people with force and violence, and they respond in kind.
28
i absolutely agree...right up to your last sentence. It's about time we all got over the notion that the way to respond to violent stupidity is violent stupidity.
It makes me so proud to see those elegant Black Panthers, who were just standing up for their rights. Turn the other cheek? I don't think so! And what a joke for Hoover to say they were the biggest internal threat at the time, to our country?
13
Hoover took aim at three groups of dissidents, much for the same reasons: the Black Panthers, the American Indian Movement and the Vietnam Veterans Against the War. I am proud to say that I was affiliated with the latter two. That should clue you in on what I think of the Panthers.
2
anyone doubt if it was armed bands of black men in our cities instead of armed white militias in the outback, we'd have stricter gun laws? as it is, a black man with a gun is shot. But those crazy militias can play army all day long, stockpiling arms and ammunition like Neanderthals waiting for a dinosaur and they get the protection of the U.S. Supreme Court and Congress. crazy.
13
There is an organized armed white group in Tarrant County Texas following and filming police arrests. They are alive and well.
1
Police ARE violent! Nearly everywhere in the world. And many times, their violence is unfair and directed at the wrong people at the wrong time, as we have seen over and over again. It is a violent job - one which I would not and could not do. I wish I had and idea of how to change those facts.
4
Actually, much-perhaps the majority of police work is not violent. Meter maids and city inspectors without guns have more problems and difficulties than most cops and must get by as they can.
Because so much of police work is tedious, boring and repetitious , the rare occasion when they actually reach for their guns is automatically fraught with tension and numerous opportunities to make mistakes.
Because so much of police work is tedious, boring and repetitious , the rare occasion when they actually reach for their guns is automatically fraught with tension and numerous opportunities to make mistakes.
1
Thank God the 60's and 70's are over. Things are obviously different now as the film says. Nowadays protestors are careful to keep their hands up and only the police are brandishing shotguns, and armored personnel carriers, and tanks, and helicopters, and drones and automatic weapons and .... Yes siree, its morning in America still.
11
Perhaps readers might delve into the doctoral thesis of Huey P. Newton, Ph.D.
7
Don't tell'em, their ignorance has always been a source of hilarity. One has to conjecture what if blacks were afforded the same rights and opportunities as whites? Imagine where blacks would be as a whole?
See what they did with the deck stacked against them , at the bottom of the totem pole? White establishment was petrified of the thought-
Black self determination; 'don't tell'em'...
See what they did with the deck stacked against them , at the bottom of the totem pole? White establishment was petrified of the thought-
Black self determination; 'don't tell'em'...
2
The Panthers believed that posturing with guns was going to be a short cut to getting everything they ever wanted. It turned out not to be the case, but in the process they gained the admiration of tens of thousands of young people from all walks of life while doing immense damage to all the people they touched, even to this very day.
10
One trusts that you say exactly the same to every "open carry," idiot toting a rifle into a Waffle House, every NRA fanatoc showing up at a political rally with an assault rifle, and every lazy, racist rancher who waves guns around because he doesn't want to pay his taxpayr-subsidized grazing fees.
Whites have always been afraid of self determined and assertive blacks.
At one time in Philadelphia circa 1920's police went into the black community door to door demanding they give up their firearms. This was before gangs , drugs, violence the white establishment didn't want blacks able to defend themselves. Why?
The Black Panther Party of Self Defense wasn't perfect but their ten point plan was incredible for the enfranchisement of blacks.
The ill informed whites and some blacks, never question the need for their creation...
At one time in Philadelphia circa 1920's police went into the black community door to door demanding they give up their firearms. This was before gangs , drugs, violence the white establishment didn't want blacks able to defend themselves. Why?
The Black Panther Party of Self Defense wasn't perfect but their ten point plan was incredible for the enfranchisement of blacks.
The ill informed whites and some blacks, never question the need for their creation...
22
The Deacons for Defense and Justice based in the South preceded the Black Panthers in organizing and arming Black people for mutual aid and protection.
God bless Huey P. Newton and Bobbie Seale. Our modern day Gabriel Prosser, Denmark Vesey and Nat Turner.
See film "Deacons for Defense.'
God bless Huey P. Newton and Bobbie Seale. Our modern day Gabriel Prosser, Denmark Vesey and Nat Turner.
See film "Deacons for Defense.'
3
During the Bobby Seale trial in New Haven, Connecticut in 1968, my young black high school students in my "opportunity class" wore black berets and black leather jackets. The Black Panthers served them breakfast. Skip Gates taught them black history. Students in my class, from what was then a called a ghetto, went on to lead successful lives.
Helping young people to have a positive self image is a good thing. It is sad that almost fifty years have passed, and so many of these segregated conditions for African American students remain in hundreds of "Fergusons" across America.
Helping young people to have a positive self image is a good thing. It is sad that almost fifty years have passed, and so many of these segregated conditions for African American students remain in hundreds of "Fergusons" across America.
12
Not mentioned here, but Ronald Reagan, the Governor of California, then put in gun control laws.
Yes, the right-wing supported gun control
Yes, the right-wing supported gun control
7
There is no need to disintegrate police treatment of blacks from America treatment of blacks. Police men cannot be located outside of the society - that is simply impossible.
There has been a lot of progress and there is no need saying "the problem remain the same."
There has been a lot of progress and there is no need saying "the problem remain the same."
2
Why no mention of the murders of the Black Panthers in Chicago, machine-gunned in their sleep? The justification used back then was that "communist literature" was found after the killings.
10
One of the cops on that raid was Black and infamous in the Chicago Black community. His name was Edward "Gloves" Davis.
Eldridge Cleaver was a bad man, a rapist who characterized his crimes as political acts in his book, Soul On Ice. In 1968, he led a violent, unprovoked ambush of police officers in Oakland, resulting in the wounding of two officers and the death of a young Black Panther (Bobby Hutton). After fleeing to Cuba, he eventually "reformed", and became a Republican and born-again Christian.
Fred Hampton was a good man, who began as an organizer for the NAACP, and then joined the Panthers. He provided food and education to disadvantaged communities in Chicago, and brokered truces between street gangs of various ethnicities, which significantly reduced violence in that town (this was the origin of the term "rainbow coalition"). The local FBI agent reported to J. Edgar Hoover that the Panthers in Chicago were primarily involved in providing free breakfasts to children. He was murdered during a raid on his apartment by members of the FBI, the Chicago Police Department, and the Cook County State's Attorney Office. (Two Chicago police officers had recently been murdered by Black Panthers; no one has ever associated Hampton, who was in California at the time, with this event.)
It's a complicated world.
Fred Hampton was a good man, who began as an organizer for the NAACP, and then joined the Panthers. He provided food and education to disadvantaged communities in Chicago, and brokered truces between street gangs of various ethnicities, which significantly reduced violence in that town (this was the origin of the term "rainbow coalition"). The local FBI agent reported to J. Edgar Hoover that the Panthers in Chicago were primarily involved in providing free breakfasts to children. He was murdered during a raid on his apartment by members of the FBI, the Chicago Police Department, and the Cook County State's Attorney Office. (Two Chicago police officers had recently been murdered by Black Panthers; no one has ever associated Hampton, who was in California at the time, with this event.)
It's a complicated world.
11
Obama is hypocritical on this subject. He claims to support the anticolonial struggles of yesterday in Africa which included violence against the colonialists -yet he is against the black panthers who saw themselves in the same mode of struggling for self determination against discrimination which they saw as a variant of colonialism. My statement does not indicate support for the black panthers one way or the other. But it behooves a leader to be consistent - if he is against black American slave descendents taking the "black panther" route here in the United States, then why is not his view consistent for everyone accross the globe regardless of where their national origin is?
1
"He is a politician" Reverend Jerimiah A. Wright, Jr. USMC/USN
He did not talk about Boko Haram nor al Shabbab nor the Lord's Resistance Army in Africa.
The colonial era Mau Mau in Kenya were primarily Kikuyu. The Obama's were Muslim Luo.
He did not talk about Boko Haram nor al Shabbab nor the Lord's Resistance Army in Africa.
The colonial era Mau Mau in Kenya were primarily Kikuyu. The Obama's were Muslim Luo.
The same imaginary images of so called "police brutality" (see Ferguson Mo.) still holds sway to this day with many of the same preposterous claims recycled as 'a given'. Notice that police critics avoid the specific's of each alleged 'outrage' because of the success of this tactic vs. the truth.
Historic racism has caused much damage to minority communities but refusal to see the results on particular human beings, particularly racial self hatred and black on black crime, far in excess of anything police do, just masks cause/effect and makes solutions that much more difficult.
Historic racism has caused much damage to minority communities but refusal to see the results on particular human beings, particularly racial self hatred and black on black crime, far in excess of anything police do, just masks cause/effect and makes solutions that much more difficult.
11
For most of American history Blacks have been denied their humanity as persons during slavery and their equality as Americans during Jim Crow.
But most of the of the baby daddy and baby momma in America living on welfare with a high school education or less are white. While the proportion of Blacks is higher there are 5x as many whites.
Blacks have a legacy of slavery and Jim Crow along with being physically identifiable to partially explain their difficulties.
But what is the explanation or excuse for pervasive increasing white family pathology?
But most of the of the baby daddy and baby momma in America living on welfare with a high school education or less are white. While the proportion of Blacks is higher there are 5x as many whites.
Blacks have a legacy of slavery and Jim Crow along with being physically identifiable to partially explain their difficulties.
But what is the explanation or excuse for pervasive increasing white family pathology?
1
These don't seem to be the same misogynistic, antisemitic, small-time-criminal incoherent Black Panthers that I knew and mocked.
I though it was leopards that changed their spots.
I though it was leopards that changed their spots.
4
The history of the BP, while relevant to the "Black Lives Matter" movement, is an important case study for all groups advocating for more competent law enforcement & equal representation.
This is illustrated by the parallels between the Black Panther's systematic destruction and Barret Brown's recent 63 month sentence for providing a link in a chat room.
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/09/09/business/media/a-journalist-agitator-f...
The danger this poses to all of us is that if groups like the Black Panther, and Barret Brown's vigorous form of journalism can not exist then groups are going to eventually take notice of Al Qaeda's relative success with loosely coupled groups committing acts of violence. While slowly but surely legitimizing law enforcements as targets of that violence as law enforcement takes increasingly harsh countermeasures.
It's not good, but without clear and effective means for effecting change those that feel the need for change will find a way to make their influence felt.
Take a hard look at what tar and feathering in revolutionary war america really was. In today's perspective it it looks alot like a form of terrorism. We don't demonize those folks that tortured their loyally British neighbors instead of following the law of the land. I would also not demonize the Panthers for fighting their own battle against "taxation without representation" "by any means necessary", it's the most american thing they can do
This is illustrated by the parallels between the Black Panther's systematic destruction and Barret Brown's recent 63 month sentence for providing a link in a chat room.
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/09/09/business/media/a-journalist-agitator-f...
The danger this poses to all of us is that if groups like the Black Panther, and Barret Brown's vigorous form of journalism can not exist then groups are going to eventually take notice of Al Qaeda's relative success with loosely coupled groups committing acts of violence. While slowly but surely legitimizing law enforcements as targets of that violence as law enforcement takes increasingly harsh countermeasures.
It's not good, but without clear and effective means for effecting change those that feel the need for change will find a way to make their influence felt.
Take a hard look at what tar and feathering in revolutionary war america really was. In today's perspective it it looks alot like a form of terrorism. We don't demonize those folks that tortured their loyally British neighbors instead of following the law of the land. I would also not demonize the Panthers for fighting their own battle against "taxation without representation" "by any means necessary", it's the most american thing they can do
11
The Black Panthers were the logical political progression of an oppressed people in response to the predatory practices of police and federal law enforcement. Among others, Fred Hampton was murdered in cold blood by Chicago police.
As the documentary showed, the Panthers decided to take up arms in compliance with the law and, as the NRA would be chagrined to note, in celebration of the 2nd amendment to the US Constitution.
J Edgar Hoover was the most notorious, but was clearly typical of law enforcement in the 1950s and 1960s, perhaps longer. His version of justice (great quote) wasn't just characteristic of the south, but of most urban police departments. His legacy is a major dishonor to Americans.
What can we learn from the Black Panthers?
Well, first off, their movement failed politically and exacerbated the scisms within the civil rights movement. Their allignment with the weather underground further alienated middle Americans from the legitimate grievances of oppressed black Americans.
Second, the organizations that remained after the political leaders of the BPP were eliminated or jailed basically became drug and related criminal enterprises.
Third, the combination of the Stand Your Ground laws, the proliferation of gangs, the proliferation of guns, the militarization of too many cops and the breakdown of black family culture could lead to a re-emergence of the gun battles that once played out in the cities between the Panthers and the police.
As the documentary showed, the Panthers decided to take up arms in compliance with the law and, as the NRA would be chagrined to note, in celebration of the 2nd amendment to the US Constitution.
J Edgar Hoover was the most notorious, but was clearly typical of law enforcement in the 1950s and 1960s, perhaps longer. His version of justice (great quote) wasn't just characteristic of the south, but of most urban police departments. His legacy is a major dishonor to Americans.
What can we learn from the Black Panthers?
Well, first off, their movement failed politically and exacerbated the scisms within the civil rights movement. Their allignment with the weather underground further alienated middle Americans from the legitimate grievances of oppressed black Americans.
Second, the organizations that remained after the political leaders of the BPP were eliminated or jailed basically became drug and related criminal enterprises.
Third, the combination of the Stand Your Ground laws, the proliferation of gangs, the proliferation of guns, the militarization of too many cops and the breakdown of black family culture could lead to a re-emergence of the gun battles that once played out in the cities between the Panthers and the police.
13
The war on drugs and welfare deformation and voter suppression were and arr a socioeconomic political educational white supremacist war on Black African Americans.
The Panthers called bad cops "pigs" while recognizing all cops as an army of occupation, suppression and control.
Hoover and the FBI were after SCLC, NAACP, SNCC, CORE, the Panthers and anyone who strong and pro-Black.
See COINTELPRO
"Up against the wall Missouri Farmer!" "Blood to horses brow and woe to those who cannot shoot!"
The Panthers called bad cops "pigs" while recognizing all cops as an army of occupation, suppression and control.
Hoover and the FBI were after SCLC, NAACP, SNCC, CORE, the Panthers and anyone who strong and pro-Black.
See COINTELPRO
"Up against the wall Missouri Farmer!" "Blood to horses brow and woe to those who cannot shoot!"
1
We need a new Black Panther Party, updated for today, but using the lessons they learned. I would like such a party to include people of all ethnicities, to become a united force against police brutality towards anyone.
20
Once it was chic for leftists to support "Off the pig!"
This even includes Leonard Bernstein, who had a fund raiser for the Black Panthers at his NY home.
Disgraceful.
This even includes Leonard Bernstein, who had a fund raiser for the Black Panthers at his NY home.
Disgraceful.
18
I sense some serious dampness behind the ears!
4
once, it was chic for white americans to hunt indigenous-americans for sport and to lynch african-americans for entertainment, too!
7
Yes, now its white ranchers and other brave patriots who point guns at officers to celebration in the finest living rooms of our nation. But their young Fred Hamptons aren't being hunted down and killed by security forces. Yes, things have obviously changed, as the film maker says.
12
The US Department of Justice under Eric Holder has affirmed the "right" of the New Black Panther Party, the ideological successors to the original Panthers, to intimidate White voters at polling places, by among other things, shouting racial threats while waving billy clubs. anyone who doesn't believe that this has happened in America really needs to look up the whole sordid story of the Philadelphia Black Panther Voter Intimidation case and how the US DOJ reversed itself on Eric Holder's appointment to AG, to allow this racist behavior to stand.
So tell me, who exactly has a "privilege" in our society.
So tell me, who exactly has a "privilege" in our society.
9
Thank you Sarah Palin!
Somebody needs to study the way lies turn into zombie legends in the right wing community. They live in a fact denied Bizarro World.
Somebody needs to study the way lies turn into zombie legends in the right wing community. They live in a fact denied Bizarro World.
8
white people. No one else would make such a fallacious statement.
6
I'll attribute your statement to anger. White people (like myself) are sources of very strong attacks on that kind of statement.
And, if you inquired of Thomas Sowell or Clarence Thomas, or even Shaquille O'Neil who just took an honorary badge in Fla, you might find some surprises in how they think if what you say is what you believe.
And, if you inquired of Thomas Sowell or Clarence Thomas, or even Shaquille O'Neil who just took an honorary badge in Fla, you might find some surprises in how they think if what you say is what you believe.
Those interested in a serious historical and political analysis of the Black Panther Party should read Joshua Bloom and Waldo Martin's new book, Black Against Empire, The History and Politics of the Black Panther Party.
Most people, whether they love or hate the Panthers, have a caricatured view of them. This is a serious history that understands both their importance and their complexity. The issues that originally gave rise to the Panthers have not gone away and we would do well to look at their experience for the lessons it has to teach, both positive and negative, those who would confront those issues today.
Most people, whether they love or hate the Panthers, have a caricatured view of them. This is a serious history that understands both their importance and their complexity. The issues that originally gave rise to the Panthers have not gone away and we would do well to look at their experience for the lessons it has to teach, both positive and negative, those who would confront those issues today.
19
Great point....
4
Incredible to me to hear the statement 'justice is merely incidental to law and order' come from the mouth of J. Edgar Hoover. If I had been President at the time I would have fired him on the spot.
As a middle-aged white businessman who, on several occasions, has suffered from inexplicable unprofessional and threatening behavior by police, I have more sympathy with the intent of the Black Panther Party than with the historical intent of police.
If police want more respect and fewer problems they should first put their own house in order by ceasing to defend bad cops. Period. It is an unaccountable culture.
As a middle-aged white businessman who, on several occasions, has suffered from inexplicable unprofessional and threatening behavior by police, I have more sympathy with the intent of the Black Panther Party than with the historical intent of police.
If police want more respect and fewer problems they should first put their own house in order by ceasing to defend bad cops. Period. It is an unaccountable culture.
39
If you had been President at the time you would not have fired Hoover for at least two reasons: (1) he probably would have had a damaging file about your personal indiscretions or past political activities (2) you would have been able to benefit by using the files he dug up on the members of Congress. Those files were LBJ's ace in the hole. Mr. Hoover knew how to keep his power.
5
"Better to having inside the tent urinating out, than outside the tent urinating in." LBJ on why he kept Hoover.
LBJ said of Hoover, "I'd rather have him inside the tent pissing out than outside the tent pissing in."
1
This story's focus on the guns neglects the real social benefits provided by the Panthers, like food, and pride, and respect for law and order as well as justice.
31
There are many similar cases of violence from police offers with not only minorities but "whites" as well. So was the problem always about racism, or equality? Or was it the people we have running our systems (police officers, politicians, etc) and they way they handle situations?
25
Without dismissing the horrendous manner in which african americans were treated in the 1950s and 1960s, I have to agree that the police treated everyone badly. At least, that was the case in Los Angeles. In the 1960s LAPD was an armed gang.
THe Black Panthers were a violent organization, members of which committed murder. It is foolish to idealize them.
The issues being brought up by recent protests over "police brutality" bear little resemblance to the Civil Rights issues of the mid 20th century. Then, black people were being denied basic civil rights, and were fighting for such rights. Now, black male criminals are involved in many ambiguous situations with police, and protesters, in response, are making often unfounded accusations about either individual officers, or the police as a whole. Present day circumstances are far more ambiguous than the events half a century ago, and at the present time it is not clear that the problems many black males are facing are not caused in large part by black males themselves.
The issues being brought up by recent protests over "police brutality" bear little resemblance to the Civil Rights issues of the mid 20th century. Then, black people were being denied basic civil rights, and were fighting for such rights. Now, black male criminals are involved in many ambiguous situations with police, and protesters, in response, are making often unfounded accusations about either individual officers, or the police as a whole. Present day circumstances are far more ambiguous than the events half a century ago, and at the present time it is not clear that the problems many black males are facing are not caused in large part by black males themselves.
29
Were you alive half a century ago? I was living in Oakland 1966-1970, and it is difficult for me to imagine that you have a clear idea of what things were like then. Why don't you talk the matter over with some of your black male friends. . . nope, that won't work, will it.
35
That's absurd and offensive. In fact, many Black Panthers were themselves murdered by the police.
Go back and read some books, learn the facts, and then open your mouth.
Go back and read some books, learn the facts, and then open your mouth.
43
Police Departments ARE violent organizations, members of which commit murder without fear of arrest. It is foolish to idealize them.
30
Interpretation aside, this is excellent historical footage, we need to present more, because too many people think our times are the worst times. There is nothing wrong with working toward ever more justice, but perspective matters.
In fact however bad times are, they've probably never been better. There are numerous ways to confirm this, from various particular civil rights to the general opening of society to every sort of person. It may just be a general tendency of any young generation, but today's young people are very convinced that they are unusually heavily put upon. They are currently ballistic over the collection & storage of meaningless data bits by the NSA. They should have to face a military draft, that would be interesting to see.
In fact however bad times are, they've probably never been better. There are numerous ways to confirm this, from various particular civil rights to the general opening of society to every sort of person. It may just be a general tendency of any young generation, but today's young people are very convinced that they are unusually heavily put upon. They are currently ballistic over the collection & storage of meaningless data bits by the NSA. They should have to face a military draft, that would be interesting to see.
3
You are correct until you mention the NSA. That data is no more "meaningless" than were the "law & order" practices that created the Black Panthers. The collection of that data has deeper meaning than just the fact that it is being collected, it breeds a mindset of impunity and violation of rights in secret.
I doubt it has ever accomplished any effective help that spending time doing proven police work would not have also accomplished.
I doubt it has ever accomplished any effective help that spending time doing proven police work would not have also accomplished.
7
magicisnotreal - I mention the NSA on purpose and stand by that. Your comment strengthens my case that people lack a historical perspective. Security or authority "mindset" as you call it, must be considered over the course of history. There has never been a completely pure and righteous mindset in any security apparatus, from ancient times to today. Lincoln for instance suspended habeas corpus. Once again, things are better today than in the past!
For all it's discomforting implications, the collection of bulk data as done by the NSA (since 1979 btw) is 1. reviewed and authorized by our most trusted elected politicians. 2. It is designed by some of the most highly degreed, sincere & honest professional people in the world. 3. It is subject to endless legal review for it's own sake and for the consequences of any violation of it's use. That's what it's reality is.
If that litany of checks is compared with the FBI sending, "you should kill yourself" audio tapes to MLK, or Nixon's guys breaking into a doctor's office to copy patient files, the difference is OBVIOUS.
Only a lack of historical perspective, and a silly solipsism of our current generation, allows a comparison that would put the NSA (no evidence of any harm done) in the league of the nasties back in the day. Things will never be perfect, but we are better off by the measure of history.
For all it's discomforting implications, the collection of bulk data as done by the NSA (since 1979 btw) is 1. reviewed and authorized by our most trusted elected politicians. 2. It is designed by some of the most highly degreed, sincere & honest professional people in the world. 3. It is subject to endless legal review for it's own sake and for the consequences of any violation of it's use. That's what it's reality is.
If that litany of checks is compared with the FBI sending, "you should kill yourself" audio tapes to MLK, or Nixon's guys breaking into a doctor's office to copy patient files, the difference is OBVIOUS.
Only a lack of historical perspective, and a silly solipsism of our current generation, allows a comparison that would put the NSA (no evidence of any harm done) in the league of the nasties back in the day. Things will never be perfect, but we are better off by the measure of history.
5
@CK,
Lincoln was in DC surrounded on all sides for hundreds of miles with Southern sympathisers and no army to speak of. He suspended Habeus so that the Army could arrest and hold without trial any protestors or terrorists trying to hold them up as they came south to the Capitol from their northern Bases. It was not a useless pointless attempts to grab power and limit the People.
Your willingness to accept the illegal behavior of our employees is not OK with me. The NSA has been illegally collecting data or having private corporations do it for them for as long as you;d like to say. You cannot honestly assert that no harm has come of it as the act itself is harmful and each crime built on itself in the same way it does if you are profiling a criminal, and they have gone further every step of the way from then whenever it was until today.
I saw a T shirt once that said "It's only kinky the first time." which is a clever if crude reference to the principle that one lowers ones standards by increments and once it is done it can never be gotten back, and the necessity for it in the first place becomes more and more opaque as one continues down that path.
If one is using reason and progressing or changing over time one is not doing something "kinky" one is being reasonable. Being "kinky" in this context is not a good thing.
Lincoln was in DC surrounded on all sides for hundreds of miles with Southern sympathisers and no army to speak of. He suspended Habeus so that the Army could arrest and hold without trial any protestors or terrorists trying to hold them up as they came south to the Capitol from their northern Bases. It was not a useless pointless attempts to grab power and limit the People.
Your willingness to accept the illegal behavior of our employees is not OK with me. The NSA has been illegally collecting data or having private corporations do it for them for as long as you;d like to say. You cannot honestly assert that no harm has come of it as the act itself is harmful and each crime built on itself in the same way it does if you are profiling a criminal, and they have gone further every step of the way from then whenever it was until today.
I saw a T shirt once that said "It's only kinky the first time." which is a clever if crude reference to the principle that one lowers ones standards by increments and once it is done it can never be gotten back, and the necessity for it in the first place becomes more and more opaque as one continues down that path.
If one is using reason and progressing or changing over time one is not doing something "kinky" one is being reasonable. Being "kinky" in this context is not a good thing.
3
See the documentary film "The Murder of Fred Hampton" about the Chicago Police Department, Cook County State's Attorney and FBI profiling stalking entrapment murder of Chicago Black Panther leader Fred Hampton and Mark Clark. Learn about the informants William O' Neil and Nathaniel Junior. Fred was a young kind gentle wise empathetic dedicated man.
Learn about the FBI trying to turn Black street gang leaders Jeff Fort and Larry Hoover and David Barksdale and Henry Cogwell into war with Hampton and the Panthers. Read about former Illinois Black Panther leader and current member of Congress Bobbie Rush.
Learn about the FBI trying to turn Black street gang leaders Jeff Fort and Larry Hoover and David Barksdale and Henry Cogwell into war with Hampton and the Panthers. Read about former Illinois Black Panther leader and current member of Congress Bobbie Rush.
36
Yes Yes great point....
4
Fred was also funny, humble and brave.
4
This is standing history on its head. Huey Newton was a lifelong criminal. He went to jail for murdering a police officer. He was killed, not by the police, but by Tyrone Robinson, a member of the Black Guerilla Family. We remain in denial today as gun violence in the black community takes as many young lives annually as the Vietnam War at its worst, according to reports by the US CDC.
25
His criminality and the criminality of any of his associates and even them using the BP as cover for them does not remove the facts from the table. The police did abuse blacks with impunity and made life awful for them. The BP no matter what you think of them had a beneficial effect on the national conversation in spite of the personal problems of its members.
19
Huey Newton was not a "lifelong criminal." He was a heroic figure in his time and like most heroic figures he was also a tragic one. He was a Black man living in a racist country that criminalized Black men. He was the leader of a short-lived but important political movement who then had a prolonged and tragic decline after that movement was crushed by the political police (the FBI working with local police forces). Enormous resources were poured into destroying the Black Panthers in general and in breaking down Huey Newton in particular. Ultimately those efforts succeeded. Read a serious history of the Panthers like Bloom and Martin's "Black Against Empire" and your mind will reel at the extent of this assault.
14
Another misconception propagated by whites who have no clue. Or who will not question why there was a need for a "BLACK PANTHER PARTY OF SELF DEFENSE". Whites have always been AFRAID of self determined and assertive blacks....
5
The quote that stands out from this short New York TImes documentary is pulled from an interview in the late 60s of J. Edgar Hoover, "“Justice is merely incidental to law and order.” It is notable that the last time federal gun control legislation of any far reaching character was considered was not in the aftermath of Sandy Hook, but when Nixon was president and the Black Panthers strode the sidewalks of urban America bearing arms.
To all those with their 'unbiased opinions,' view the following segment from last May of Mr. Houseman in Kalamazoo Michigan drunkenly asserting his right to 'bear arms,' and ask yourself, if he had been black, how long would he have lasted before he was blasted?
http://www.mlive.com/news/kalamazoo/index.ssf/2014/06/dash_cam_footage_f...
Today, open carry advocates are almost entirely white, and they tend to associate with right wing narratives.
If we had real gun control, most police could conduct their business lightly armed or free of guns except when circumstances demand it such as in Australia today. Will we ever see that day? Seemingly not.
To all those with their 'unbiased opinions,' view the following segment from last May of Mr. Houseman in Kalamazoo Michigan drunkenly asserting his right to 'bear arms,' and ask yourself, if he had been black, how long would he have lasted before he was blasted?
http://www.mlive.com/news/kalamazoo/index.ssf/2014/06/dash_cam_footage_f...
Today, open carry advocates are almost entirely white, and they tend to associate with right wing narratives.
If we had real gun control, most police could conduct their business lightly armed or free of guns except when circumstances demand it such as in Australia today. Will we ever see that day? Seemingly not.
15
"It is notable that the last time federal gun control legislation of any far reaching character was considered was not in the aftermath of Sandy Hook, but when Nixon was president and the Black Panthers strode the sidewalks of urban America bearing arms."
Is this at all surprising? The government restricts weapons to preserve its own monopoly on violence. Gun control in this country was born of and abets racism.
Is this at all surprising? The government restricts weapons to preserve its own monopoly on violence. Gun control in this country was born of and abets racism.
7
Dear Op-Docs,
Simple enough; the Panthers had it right way back then.
Or as Machiavelli put it, "Violence can only be countered with violence".
Not pretty, very messy and, generally for the groups fighting City Hall, a losing proposition. But it seems the country hasn't gone too far from those days and if I were a young black male living anywhere in this country, I'd be sure to have 2 things;
a. A pistol permit
b. A pistol
Sad but, as I see it, the reality of our unequal society.
Simple enough; the Panthers had it right way back then.
Or as Machiavelli put it, "Violence can only be countered with violence".
Not pretty, very messy and, generally for the groups fighting City Hall, a losing proposition. But it seems the country hasn't gone too far from those days and if I were a young black male living anywhere in this country, I'd be sure to have 2 things;
a. A pistol permit
b. A pistol
Sad but, as I see it, the reality of our unequal society.
17
I don't believe Machiavelli said that, it certainly does not conform to his general ideas about politics being a very diverse game. Do you have a reference for the words in quotation marks?
4
Dear CK,
I was actually quoting out of Stephen Kotkin's book "Stalin" but, for the record, I should have written "I believe it was Machiavelli who said". My apologies for the potential inaccuracy and will now spend the afternoon trying to pin the quote down.
I was actually quoting out of Stephen Kotkin's book "Stalin" but, for the record, I should have written "I believe it was Machiavelli who said". My apologies for the potential inaccuracy and will now spend the afternoon trying to pin the quote down.
2
Indeed, CK is right that Machiavelli did not use those words. In fact, Il Principe was written from the perspective of an aristocrat and any recommendations would be to ensure effective rule and stability for the upper class and the peace keepers.
"If the population hasn't been routed and dispersed so that its freedoms and traditions are quite forgotten, they will rise up to fight for those principles at the first opportunity" (Il Principe, V)
It sounds like Machiavelli would wholeheartedly approve of the steps taken by police in the 1960s.
"If the population hasn't been routed and dispersed so that its freedoms and traditions are quite forgotten, they will rise up to fight for those principles at the first opportunity" (Il Principe, V)
It sounds like Machiavelli would wholeheartedly approve of the steps taken by police in the 1960s.
5
"Though the problems remain the same, the protests are different. "
The problems are NOT the same. Shooting a delinquent when trying to grab the gun from the police is neither a racial or a civil right issue. Stop the non-sense, please.
The problems are NOT the same. Shooting a delinquent when trying to grab the gun from the police is neither a racial or a civil right issue. Stop the non-sense, please.
33
How about shooting a 12-year-old with a toy gun? Shooting a young man who picks up a bb gun off the shelf at Walmart, intending to buy it? Shooting a young man who steps out into the stairwell of his girlfriend's apartment building? Etc. Pick your examples carefully.
31
it is unfortunate that these toy guns are sold. Of course such killings as you describe and unnecessary and tragic. BUT it is difficult for anyone to discern what is a real weapon from a replica, either close up or far away. I would never to point a gun, real, replica, loaded or unloaded unless I planned to use it. We have many instances here in my city where teens are "recruited" by older criminals, given a replica gun and told to go out and rob someone, anyone. It is no less scary if it happens to you and you don't know whether the gun is real or a fake. Nor is it less dangerous for the child robber to hold a fake gun - if he points it at an armed person, he will be shot. The streets are not safe these days on either side.
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Tom: Most certainly wasn't me the one that pick the Brown case to make an example of racism. Picking the wrong example and dumping disparate cases together doesn't make for a very good argument.
I will agree that there is a case to be made to reform police behavior. However, this case has been diluted by the agitators that insist on making every problem a simple white vs. black issue.
I will agree that there is a case to be made to reform police behavior. However, this case has been diluted by the agitators that insist on making every problem a simple white vs. black issue.
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