If, as I believe, the most important thing each of us is doing on the planet is learning lessons so our souls can evolve, then this woman’s life has had a great deal of meaning. She and her husband both suffered through the difficult chapter with the sociopath and as painful as that was for them, it appears it was beneficial as well. Their path back to each other speaks volumes. The responders who are showing compassion likely no longer need to learn those lessons. From my perspective, kindness is where we should always begin when viewing the actions of others. Being judgmental is not often helpful. However, I struggle with both those values everyday whenever I watch CNN and the daily update to our modern 'Rocky Horror Picture Show'. With regard to telling the children? They are clearly strong and resilient and will likely be fine either way 'mom' decides to go.
27
To the letter writer:
You have used up your entire supply of “me” chits, perhaps for the rest of your life. My best advice is that you dedicate your remaining existence on this planet in gratitude to your husband for his saint-like forgiveness of your abhorrent, family-destroying behavior and that you make a daily effort to seek out ways to serve others and do good. You have proven to be an unsafe driver in your family’s trajectory. Settle into a passenger seat and practice silence when tempted to interject. And while you’re there perhaps you’ll learn empathy—that putting others first and being kind and humble is not a chump’s role, but a role that eventually garners the respect and appreciation of your family.
75
Where was all this concern when you having this affair ?
43
I must agree with the almost unanimous reaction that this is a narcissistic approach to your life and that you haven't matured at all and are just one very fortunate woman that you got your life back after recklessly throwing it away. You need to own your behavior and move on. Let your children live their lives without further disruption by you!
67
She should go on the Jerry Springer show. She probably can even get the woman she was involved with come on the show and who knows who else.
17
This horrible story is familiar to me except I was the husband. The grown children know it, but are mostly in denial. Leave it alone.
54
The mother does not want to help her children; she wants to unburden herself. She should keep quiet.
85
Your kids have figured it out. Why dredge it all up? It sound like a cry for attention, like the rest of the story. I feel for the husband.
48
I'd say there is no need to dredge up the subject unless you end up published and climbing the charts on the NY Times!
As far as your children are concerned, this was a part of the past and resolved itself with Mom and Dad getting back together and in a stronger relationship this time. Adult kids aren't stupid, they generally realize through their own experiences on the way to adulthood that relationships have their ups and downs and can be difficult at times to maintain (even more so if they have their own children now).
If there ever comes a point where they ASK you about that period of time, you can be honest with them but I doubt they'll want all the blow-by-blow details so you can edit things down, just be sure to accept your part in the whole episode.
Sometimes finding out something about a parent's past can answer a lot of questions the child had and open up a new understanding that you're not just a parent, but an actual human being. All without going into a lot of detail. My own Mom happened to mention something about herself as a young mother, in a general conversation, which answered so many questions about my childhood. She didn't go into detail, didn't try to blame anyone or anything else, but simply expressed self awareness about her internal feelings at the time.
22
No compassion for the LW? It seems as though she needs closure and sought to own the narrative by writing it. And she also seems concerned that by writing this story she could jeopardize her relationships with her family. My gut tells me she was just looking for advice.
Why accuse her of profiteering? Of being selfish? Do we not all as human beings have the right to own our own stories? And, yes, she is troubled about telling her story and that is probably why she sought the Ethicists’ advise.
Why must we victim shame her? Why must we call her horrible names and accuse her of selfish motives when we have not walked in her shoes? I for one feel it was very brave of her – after such a long time – to tell her story and wonder if her torment can be alleviated by writing that story.
As one who has also been the victim of a sociopath, do not judge the power of a manipulative sociopath unless you can say from experience that you resisted their power. In a vulnerable state, as this writer apparently was, it is hard not to fall prey to a sociopath’s manipulations. Recent nonfiction books recounting being victimized by a sociopath include “Duped” and “My Friend Anna” and describe being totally duped and unaware of the lies and manipulations they were subjected to and being victim shamed for not recognizing the lies and pulling out of the relationship sooner. It happens, people! And there, but for the grace of God, go I.
65
I think you should talk to your therapist and husband first about this. I understand your need to write this letter as a trial balloon. But don't do anymore without talking to your support system. If your therapist and husband aren't very supportive of you now, I suggest finding another therapist. I thought many of the comments were judgmental and unkind. I have never cheated on my husband. The only male friends I have are also married and I only talk of married issues with them on a generic basis. I have a grief counselor because my husband is ill. But your situation is very different. If what you said is real, you are reliving the pain you felt and caused in the past, and that happens as we get older. However, it is your life and your husband's life mess and not your children's. As parents, we don't need to tell our children every stupid thing we did! And our grown children don't have to tell us everything either. There are boundaries. Go ahead, write your story, make it fiction, but only if your husband is supportive. And as for telling your kids, I would just open the door, and also only with your husband's support, by stating if they have any questions about the past, they can ask. Otherwise, if they don't ask, they already know enough or they are too busy with their own lives to want to know. Respect the boundaries. Your children are not your therapist. They should not be your best friends either. Please, please talk to your therapist and your husband now!
31
No compassion for the LW? It is obvious that she feels she needs closure and sought to own the narrative by writing it. And she fears that by writing this story she could jeopardize her relationships with her family. She was looking for advice
Why accuse her of profiteering? Of being selfish? Do we not all as human beings have the right to own our own stories? And, yes, she is troubled that she shouldn’t tell the story and that is why she sought the Ethicists’ advise.
Why must we victim shame her? Why must we call her horrible names and accuse her of selfish motives when we have not walked in her shoes? I for one feel it was very brave of her – after such a long time – to tell her story and wonder if her torment can be alleviated by writing that story.
As one who has also been the victim of a sociopath, do not judge the power of a manipulative sociopath unless you can say from experience that you resisted their power. In a vulnerable state, as this writer apparently was, it must be hard not to fall prey to a sociopath’s manipulations. Recent nonfiction books recounting being victimized by a sociopath include “Duped” and “My Friend Anna” and both describe being totally duped and unaware of the lies and manipulations they were subjected to and being victim shamed for not recognizing the lies and pulling out of the relationship sooner. It happens, people! And there, but for the grace of God, go I.
15
Depending on whether the records were sealed, anyone can read the divorce court records. And. if anyone were interested, they would have investigated already. The LW must have a sad boring life with this as the most important interesting thing to have happened to her. I can imagine her as the nightmare seatmate on a flight repeating this eye-rolling story to anyone willing to be tortured by her. Victimhood is not interesting.
14
Please don't make any decision without talking this over indepth (and perhaps with a therapist around for a reality check) ) with your husband. He will be affected regardless of what you decide. He has a right to be in on your thinking, and you need to consider his feelings and thoughts on the situation. .
14
I'm a little concerned you want to tell your children to open a path to making your story a published memoir. (Sounds like it would be a good story...) Be careful. You seem very honest with yourself, so this step should be well within your grasp.
3
Wow! Get this story to a good screen writer who has good connections with the studios. Would make a great movie!
2
If the writer needs to correspond with a newspaper columnist for directions on future life choices then sadly I don't think she is as strong as she thinks she is. She should be consulting her husband, and possibly a therapist, to deal with her deep-seated guilt, which seems to be the reason she has this need to "come clean" to her adult children.
21
I found this letter to be very tedious, and congratulate Dr. Appiah on his patience.
How about "I had an affair long ago. Am I ethically bound to tell my children?"
19
No don't tell your adult kids. You may be very surprised to find out that they are not so understanding. I personally would dislike this story. There is a similar story in my family and it did not work out well. This thing of being honest about everything is not such a great idea. If you want to do it out of guilt, well, that is something to be discussed with a therapist.
You went on and on about this, many years have passed and you are still obcessed. As long as you feel this way, it is your problem. Don’t put it on you family. If I were your husband I would be furious. Take your good fortune and live with it.
22
Do yourself and your children a huge favor: say nothing to them. If they don't ask they don't want to know. Don't go and disturb their status quo. The world is loaded with miseries don't add more.
25
When the now adult child asks, you will know that it is the right time to share. Answer their question and then wait to see if they want to hear more. They will ask more, when they are ready. A story like yours will have repercussions on three or four generations in different ways. By staying silent you allow adult children to grow emotionally into a new and better life without weighing them down with your own brokenness. Recommend "Sexuality, Violence Against Women and Children" by Cling.
10
I am always stunned by the details people write that they think can remain anonymous to someone who is sleuthing.
These children will find out someday, and it will just about kill them that they spent their adult lives with everyone knowing except them. The siblings will age and become less discrete. The spouse, not this crazy mom, gets to control this narrative.
Reading this left me feeling like I had just lain down on a bed still warm from another’s indiscretions.
7
Why? Let it alone. There's nothing to gain by going through all of this again and very much to lose. If the adult children ask, by all means give the simplest, most honest answer. Otherwise, let it lie.
12
Tell your children that you divorced because you did not appreciate how wonderful and understanding their father was at the time, but now you do. Tell them that you also learned from the experience not to over-romanticize happiness, because real happiness takes hard work, not a sudden magic "solution-to-all-your-problems." And tell them that it is easy to fall prey to someone offering this magic solution. Leave it at that.
This way, if they find out about your affair, the harsh news will be softened by your statements about what you learned. And, also, it is the truth.
26
LW: honestly investigate your soul, alone or with a therapist, until you find peace. Talk with your husband. Write your truth. If you still feel that you want to tell your children, ask yourself why. If you have an iota of a doubt, don't. If you have good reasons, share them with your husband first.
Your responsibility is to be your best self, and to be honest, acknowledge your past wrongs, find forgiveness, all in inner solitude, not to pull children and husband into a situation that may hurt them far more than it could help them.
Be happy in your marriage, give your children wise advice When They Ask For It. If they don't, don't talk about your past behavior. They do not need to know, or to understand.
9
A very wise man once said to me, "Honesty can be the cruelest game of all. Not only can you hurt some -- and hurt them to the bone -- you can feel self righteous about it at the same time."
If you really do feel you must put it all down on paper, don't write a memoir, make it fictional. Work it out that way, which might be a more satisfying creative endeavor for you in the long run.
14
You are entitled to privacy or sharing if this is what you wish but your husband is entitled to the same. Discuss with him what you want to reveal and what you want to say. Then answer any questions that your children ask but don't sit them down and go over all of this. You are perseverating on this and want relief. It's not for your children's well being that you want to share but your own. Only share if they have questions. Deal with this issue with a counselor so that you can live with your past but don't put your children through this again unless they need to know for themselves and initiate conversation. They've already suffered for your actions. Why should they have to do it again to make you feel better...that is your ultimate goal after all.
5
I just wish my parents had told me more about the messiness of their lives (and the lives of other ancestors) rather than allowing me to grow up thinking that I was the only crazy one in the family and facing years of self revulsion. I'm not saying "tell them." I'm just saying that I wish my parents had told me a lot more about their rough histories and struggles. It would have made a difference to my sense of self.
8
To the LW:
I hope you won't be discouraged by the commenters who told you not to write your story.
For some inspiration, go to Amazon, Books, Biographies and Memoirs, Memoirs. Read samples of those that look good to see how they organize their material, etc. (Michelle Obama, Elton John, Trevor Noah, Rachel Ray, et al.)
3
Young children often need to construct their own comprehension of adult behaviors and adult explanations for such like divorce, neglect, suicide, death, etc. with answers from their own personal perspective that are often way off. A workaholic father’s busyness and neglect becomes to the son his not being masculine enough to be worthy of his father’s attention, a mother’s suicide due to a “sickness of the mind” (actually schizophrenia) becomes brain cancer, children’s misbehaving caused the stress that lead to divorce, etc. Engage children in continuing dialogue with simple but straightforward explanations. They need to eventually make sense of adult behaviors in their lives and if you don’t help them, they may construct an impactful fiction.
4
I was confused that she mentioned instant messaging decades ago.
13
I grew up with two grandfathers on my mother's side. At the appropriate age, I was told that my beloved Grandma had been married to my mother's father and that they had divorced. Then Grandma remarried and that was why I had Grandpa Gerry and Grandpa Bill. I never questioned anything about the situation, simply accepted it for what it was.
At the age of 63, I asked my mom why her parents had divorced. She didn't know, only suspected that it might have been because Grandpa Gerry wanted to move to his hunting and fishing camp in Maine. It is a very rustic place without even a decent house at the time and it is by a lake back a long dirt lane. It gets VERY cold in Winter and I can see why Grandma wouldn't want to live there!
Point being, my mom never knew any details, never wanted to know and certainly didn't need to know. This LW needs to think of her family for once instead of just herself and her perceived needs. She's not even a very good writer and I doubt her autobiography would be published, so she should either seek professional help or write the story for herself and keep it well hidden.
Not only do her children not need to hear the sordid details, they don't even need to know generalities about their parents' divorce. If she does write everything down, she should burn it before she dies to protect her children from having good memories of their mother destroyed forever.
10
This is a little off-topic but since so many commenters see this LW's memoir getting published as an issue I think it is worth considering. While all aspiring writers like to believe they will get published--indeed, it is probably necessary to the process--the fact of the matter is that it is a rare occasion. Certainly the LW could self-publish, which is expensive and fraught and in which case she would need to tell her children. That is, if the body of work is published as non-fiction. What I sense in the letter, though, is a need to write and to communicate. I think it would serve her well to keep a journal in which she also visits the past. At some point put it away and revisit it later and edit heavily. That way she is serving the need to write but waiting for revelation. She could take creative writing classes and write about other things to sharpen her skills.
There is nothing particularly romantic about trying to become a published writer. It is work and daily effort and lots of practice. It is often discouraging. You have to love the process even more than some imagined result.
3
On the one hand, I don't see any reason to tell the grown children. On the other, I'm dismayed by the nastiness of many of the comments, and how judgmental they are. Lots of hyperbole--"it was a soap opera." Do these people live in some utopian world not accessible to the rest of us? Pretty much everyone I know, including me, has had, for a variety of reasons, periods when they were blind to the faults of other people and of themselves. What an incredible success story that the writer was able to heal enough of the damage to reconnect with her husband and family. I wonder if the commenters who ooze smugness and condescension, and who focus on condemning her for her past behavior rather than on responding to her question in the present, will gain the in-sight and strength to heal their own blindnesses.
13
Unlike some other commenters, I have no difficulty believing that this is a true story. My issue is with the Letter Writer’s motivation in wanting to tell her children about it. I believe the LW feels terrible about herself. She thinks that by telling her children and getting their forgiveness and reassurance, she can relieve herself of some of the shame and guilt she feels after all these years. That’s a manipulative use of her children’s love. They don’t need the details, but the LW seems to need to share them. More forethought is in order, specifically to remove ego-driven motivations from the decision.
13
"My instant messages and my writings were blown up and printed on large whiteboards."
I have no experience with divorce proceedings but is this something they would do? I thought this was used in criminal trials so that the jury could see things clearly. Aren't divorces civil so there isn't a jury? Why not just hand the judge the paper with the messages on it? The whole description of the proceedings sounds like a television criminal trial.
8
@Holly
You are correct. Divorce/custody is heard by a judge. The primary evidence is evaluations by a social worker and/or psychologist/psychiatrist of each parent and each child. Their reports are filed before trial; no one hands the judge evidence during the trial (except on TV).
All evidence must be provided to the other party before trial and ruled to be admissible by the judge. There would be no "surprise" info nor would there be a parade of hearsay witnesses testifying about The Other Woman at trial.
Proceedings don't "snowball." There are pre-trial negotiations. The LW admits doubts during these negotiations when her husband tried to reason w/her based on evidence. She knew she had no chance of sole custody (her husband "not being good enough for her" isn't a legal reason to deny him custody) & chose to put herself, her husband, and the rest of her family through a futile trial.
The rest of the story sounds as you say like a TV show culminating in her vague "collapse" & a custody arrangement that was no doubt what would've been granted w/o a trial.
10
I read this letter and felt something didn't mesh. It sounds more like fiction. For all we know, this is a made up story by a guy. If it is real, she hasn't changed her need for others to validate her next move. She is still requesting others to take responsibility for her actions. Too much drama.
32
@KLL Yeah, I agree. Especially about the instant messaging occurring several decades ago. Was that technology widespread and available then?
8
My mother once shared more information about her relationship with my father than I wanted to know. She did it out of her need, which many years later I can actually understand. I just feel sorry that she didn't have a friend to confide in regarding the matter at the time. So I agree with other commenters: think long and hard about why you want to do this now, and involve your husband in the decision. My guess is that your children may already know more than you think, and don't want to revisit it.
28
I must confess that I found this women's story interesting, compelling and worthy of reflection not only for herself and her family but for others going through similar situations--whatever the genders involved. I heartily encourage her to write her story as honestly as she can. Writing is not the same as publishing. Writing one's story can be an incredibly healing and maturing exercise in and of itself. On the other hand, this type of memoir is practically a genre and, as such, can be executed well--or less well, with the worst of motives--or the best. I have enjoyed and grown from reading the accounts of others who have shared their painful experiences. Many of the best ones are brutally honest about the arc of change that their authors have experienced. I hope this woman contributes to this body of work. Of course, she should talk to her husband about this project. Of course she should process this project with her therapist or spiritual director. But I hope that she does this with an eye towards how to tell this story rather than whether to tell this story, and to find in this story the inevitable grace that comes from honestly confronting the person one was before becoming the person who is now.
7
Writing is valuable therapy. I've written many long, long letters to people in my life and I never mailed any of them. I've also done journaling and burned them, an act which gave me great satisfaction.
This woman, who may or may not be telling the truth - her story is very self-centered and contains inconsistencies - should never, under any circumstances, breathe a word of her past to anyone but a professional psychiatrist or therapist.
Her children don't need to know any of it and telling them could damage them and their relationship with their mother. Our kids don't need to be informed of but the barest of details about our pasts. This kind of information should be on a need-to-know basis and even mature, well-adjusted adult children simply don't need to know.
6
She is once again thinking only of herself. This absolutely must be considered with her husband. It is/was his life, too. Anything she reveals also reveals his actions and responses. There are many times in our lives where events happen that we don’t own - they are shared experiences. And as such, they are not ours to do with as we want.
I would opt for telling the children some information about the events leading to the divorce. It was a part of their life too. But her husband must also agree to what is being revealed.
Sounds like the mother needs counseling on how not to railroad her marriage once again.
20
My son has been after me for years with questions about why we divorced. He was a baby at the time; his father and I kept the peace for him and his sister. Finally, I shared some of the reasons. He thanked me. We'll see.
6
Children once grown can be, not always amazingly understanding and forgiving. When my kids were teenagers I got swept up in drug addiction along with alcoholism and the whole 9 yards. My son, who was a hard kid to deal with at the best of times wanted nothing to do with me and I moved away 1000 miles to Texas from Ohio to get in treatment.
One day my son called me. I told him I didn't blame him and I was a terrible father and still believe that, but something amazed me. Both my kids on quite separate phone calls assured me they would never want any other man to be their father and despite all my shortcomings I was always there for them growing up...even through alcohol and drug use. Both of my kids pointed out to me that they had been the only kids in our old neighborhood to so much as even have a father much less a lousy dad.
I still struggle with drug use, but now I talk nearly every week with both of my kids even though I live in another state far from either. I wouldn't trade our relationships for the world.
28
I can't imagine how this will possibly be helpful. If they inquire, just say you were going through a very difficult time in your life, which included severe, undiagnosed and untreated depression, and happily as you got your life together, you and your husband were also able to put your marriage back together. Win-win. Done.
Don't do it. No, no, no, no, no.
76
@Paul in NJ
I agree she shouldn't tell. When errant spouses wrote in about their affairs to Dear Abby, she would always point out that any "confessions" they might make to spouse or child were for their own selfish benefit; to ease their own consciences.
Her husband didn't deserve to be caught up in her exploration with a conscience-challenged person, but as her husband it was part of his story "for better or for worse." Children make no such vows to their parents and should be spared these stories, unless vague intimations of personal struggles don't cut it and a grown child insists.
5
Please...just reading this overblown mess was exhausting. Learn to edit both your writing and your life.
102
Well, if your children read the NY Times, my guess is you just told them.
80
LW1: Please speak to your therapist at length and examine your motives honestly before you even consider doing anything more.
58
Why on earth would you want to burden your children with this pathetic soap opera? Why would you want to relive it on this forum? Don't fall into the Monica Lewinsky trap; don't turn a short, sordid period in your past into a career. Bury it in your heart, and move on. Don't infect others.
67
@Perry White
What a needlessly nasty crack on Monica. Far from living off her public past, she devotes herself now to discouraging public shaming and helping people be kinder to one another.
Although her own notoriety emerged before wide use of the Internet for social media, Ms. Lewinsky's experience and frank good nature makes her seasoned and empathetic in the face of new challenges, like revenge porn. I appreciate her voice and her frank good nature. She's funny, too.
4
The volume of replies combined with the consistent observations of narcissism suggest that we all have been impacted by someone as self absorbed as this woman. I challenge this author to write as deeply and as provocatively on any topic (except herself).
25
This is all in the dead past, see it as such. See false as false, and the truth will blossom. Be here/now, and just be.
If the others want the truth, then they will seek it, and then tell them. They cannot perceive that timeless, spaceless thing inside of the body, be that!
I am happy ur life is being lived happy, and the wakefullness dream is seen as such
Got any cool dreams to share?
Love and Truth the highest path, ur on it!
5
The comments are, as usual for this column, all over the place. I’m now wondering what exactly this woman — if the story is real — is afraid of. Is it telling her children that she had an affair with someone who was mentally unbalanced and manipulative, or is it owning up the the fact that her inamorata was a woman? I suspect that it’s the latter fact that worries her. If her adult children can’t handle that news, that’s their problem.
2
If your children wanted to know, they would have asked. If that time ever arrives, please consult with your husband before making any decision.
I'm happy your life turned around/turned out so well.
42
Great to read these comments... the wisdom of crowds!
10
Why tell the adult children something they have not asked about?
50% of all marriages end in divorce. They likely went to school with more kids from divorced homes than not. It may seem "normal" to them. Why disrupt things now?
To me it seems like you're more interested in your writing career than in anyone else in this soap opera. I mean, sorry it happened to you and all that, but you were an adult at the time and could have ended things when the red lights began to flash everywhere.
25
I have the feeling that LW is attempting to write a novel and using this column as a weathervane about how to end it. Does the heroine tell the children? Does she allow a family secret to fester undisclosed, only for the children to discover after she's dead? It's more like a soap opera than good fiction, and the world certainly doesn't need more self-serving memoirs. Does that make me the "cruel person" so defined in several comments? I don't think so, but maybe I should write a letter asking Mr. Appiah.
19
I am also a woman who made selfish decisions in my 20's that caused harm to others. Also one of the lucky ones who learned the lesson and have received both grace and opportunity to spend the rest of my life learning, growing and changing. I think it's selfish to drag all the painful things from the past over the coals. No one is perfect. They get it. My advice? Make it fiction, and find a way to move forward.
26
"They don't need to know." "You shouldn't initiate informing them." would be my reply to 48% of the queries made in the column.
14
In theory I think it is a good idea but I am finding it hard to imagine that children would want to hear this kind of story or would think that this helped them understand their childhood experience.
If you were not writing a book about it I don't think the issue of telling them would come up at all. It is a pity because it seems like one should be able to pass on lessons so painfully learned ... Perhaps readers of the book might reflect upon those lessons but would your own kids want to be those readers? I doubt it.
5
A quick tech education for those confused or doubting the timeline of this letter. (Look up “bulletin board system” in Wikipedia for an expanded education.) There have been messaging systems since the invention of the internet in the 1970s, especially on college campuses and amongst computer savvy people. In the late 80s and early 90s regular people and many teens were talking through “electronic bulletin board” messaging applications if you owned a computer, games or were part of a college. Kind of like Facebook messenger or Discord, but you’d dial up with your modem and connect to others in forums and chat rooms. I knew college staff that communicated in the 70s through BBS, teens in the 80s that gamed and shares files on these forums and I myself chatted on BBS forums starting in 1993, although my friends who were into computers had been doing it for 10 years already since they were 13 in 83.
8
@Gcnyc Yes. I got on the Carnegie Mellon based BBS in 1984 or '85, through a friend of a friend.
1
I think Mr. Appiah's question of why does this woman want to tell her adult children what caused her divorce is the most important part of the article. Sometimes we use other people listening to our story as a confessional, so it's still really all about us. Or we just like being the center of a drama and telling something a little risque and naughty. Or maybe she relishes the idea of having an excuse to talk for an hour or two about herself. Or she honestly believes her children have a right to know, although, this seems a little absurd with adult children - if they really wanted to know, they'd have asked by now. It sounds to me like this woman is still obsessed with herself. So maybe choosing not to tell her children about that chapter of her life would be the unselfish thing she could do.
26
If your children, now adults, ask about your affair and your divorce, tell them that it's all long in the past and would give them no happiness or peace of mind to know more details now. Whatever wounds were inflicted on your relationship with their father, they have now been healed and only pain and resentment would come from the re-opening of these issues.
It is not necessary for children to know everything about their parents' intimate relationships, which if revealed, may cause many problems. Write if you must, but share it only with your therapist.
17
My past is littered with bad decisions and sordid details that I would NEVER disclose to my adult children. They know that I was married twice before I married their father, that the first man was a cheater and the second a beater. My older son is aware of his biological father, whom I left when my son was only a year old, why I left, that the man has disappeared and that he was adopted by my husband of 36 years. The younger son knows less and isn't interested.
I agree that the LW's story seems fictional in part, but if it's true, she shouldn't bother burdening her children with the sordid details of her past.
23
There's no good reason to burden your adult children with details of the most sordid period in your life and the disastrous mistakes you made. Children survive their parents' divorces and adult problems because they're focused on their own age-appropriate interests and lives- their schooling, friendships, and activities. This is a good thing. Your kids may remember that time as a time when Mom and Dad weren't getting along but then resolved their differences. Leave the past in the past and let your well-adjusted adult children enjoy their lives in peace. To the extent they're happy and well adjusted it's in spite of that bad time and because they were able to put it behind them and move on. The last thing they need is to revisit it as adults and to learn things about you that they don't need or want to know.
26
"The story of your life can’t be written in the passive voice."
This is a spectacularly apt metaphor for the situation described, and somehow conveys both admonishment and encouragement. Dr. Appiah's thoughtful analysis is, as always, beautifully written as well as compassionate.
15
When we become parents, we need to mature so that sometimes we put our children’s needs above our own. This is one of those times. Your children know plenty about what happened. They know more than you realize. They have matured to the point that they are able to love you knowing you, like all of us, are imperfect. Revel in this love. Give thanks that you are so exquisitely blessed to have the love of your good children and your amazing husband. Write about what happened, then respect your good fortune by burning your only copy of your memoir. Delete it from your computer and go forward doing your best to deserve and share the love you are so fortunate to receive.
23
Although this was a great learning experience in your life, that has no real significance for your children. There is a boundary built on trust that gives children space to feel secure in who you are (their mother). You have evolved magnificently on personal level from the time of insecurity. As mom, ask yourself, why you want to share this now? What do you hope to accomplish that would be meaningful for your children? How would sharing enhance your relationship with them? If your children ask you, then by all means share the lessons and the guilt, but chances are, they love the you you are now and find strength in your strength. We all play roles and growing up is a personal experience. Congratulations on tapping into your own courage and dignity. That is beautiful
17
@Jane Bernard like "Growing up is a personal experience."
It's impossible to know what the adult children would want to know about their mother's past. How old were they at the time? How much do they know or remember that they can't make sense of, but want to? I'm generally of the mind that honest open communication is healthy and can be illuminating and healing if there's stuff that needs to be healed, explained or "unpacked", but if there is nothing to heal and if her adult kids are blissfully unaware and aren't struggling in their adult lives in any way connected to that time in their childhood then what is the point of telling them? Then again, maybe she just wants to be fully authentic and more connected with her kids now that they're adults. She seems to feel a need to control the narrative regarding a time in her life where she made decisions that affected them and that she regrets. It's also understandable that someone who felt manipulated and controlled would want to take control back by telling/writing her story. But she spends a lot of time describing a sociopath's actions and explaining her fragile, vulnerable state and frame of mind, while making no mention of how events impacted her kids' childhood, or why it would benefit them now to know everything. She also doesn't mention her husband thoughts on or role in the decision. That said, she does have every right to tell her story and doesn't need his permission.
6
@Temple
Not his "permission" but his input, he was a part of all that!
3
It is not that unusual for people to have an episode like this - of idealizing another person - when they have been stripped of their context for identity and self-esteem. It's probably also not uncommon in midlife, when this happens naturally and mortality seems nearer. So it would be great to let go of the guilt. But one reason to tell your kids would be to make sure they don't find out when you are much older and not able to a lid on things! In the case I witnessed where this happened, it did not do harm, but for some it could.
3
"Fast forward" how many years?
Are the children grown by now?
What would make YOU feel more comfortable?
1
Also, here's a thought: maybe her adult children, being adults like all of us, will understand that no one is perfect and that everyone makes mistakes, will be empathetic, and will learn from her story. You can't "ruin" adults; they either are or they aren't. As someone with a really messy childhood, I respect this woman for still being able to raise well adjusted kids and waiting this long to share something so heartbreaking and personal with the people she loves the most. If my mother had waited until I was an adult, instead of shoving it onto me as a child, I would have been well adjusted and I would have been proud of my mom for being able to be vulnerable with me. We all champion people like Brene Brown, and are all keen to jump on ted talks talking about emotion and vulnerability. Maybe the best example she can set for her kids is giving them the opportunity to be kind, empathetic, understanding people. Also, I just need to reiterate: her children are already adults. The selfish thing would have been to tell them as children. Once your kids are adults, you need to respect them as such in every form of the word. Or else, you're robbing them of an opportunity to grow and practice actually being a good person. If it changes the way they view their father, great, they had a false image of both of them in the first place. Maybe this information will lead to open, honest, nonjudgemental conversations. The type of convo we should all be teaching and championing.
7
I suspect that the husband did more of the "raising" of the children. Mom was too busy with her affair and her emotional disturbances to have much time for her children. If the now-adult children are well adjusted, I believe they have their father to thank, not their hot mess of a mother.
2
Ms. Name Withheld,
Your story is now published. Your adult children may read it.
I suggest you go to wherever your husband is at this moment. Show him this column. Then, discuss how to handle the fact that you sought help in a public forum about private matters and how you both should approach discussions with your children.
Good luck. I think you will need it.
57
@Faraboverubies
Sincere question: How can her published story be traced back to her when she withheld her name?
@Temple Because there are a number of details that most children of divorce would not have experienced, because the adult children live in communities which may have already told them some of these details, because they may have observed more than the letter-writer realizes, and because the world is full of busybodies who read the NY Times and are perfectly capable of saying, "Hey, pal, I thought you should see this, it sounds like your mom."
24
@Temple
Really? So they stumble on it, note the similarity in timing and are led to the court records?
Her siblings read the column and recognize the scenes in which they were participants?
It sounds familiar to the kids because they know that their parents struggled divorced and remarried?
Probably won’t happen, but more than possible.
Heck, when I was in grad school, I met a man who had heard the same childhood tale as I... turns out our dads were once friends.
1
I know there is a proper time to tell the truth. People are not always prepared to face reality. The education to learn how to learn is never easy. That said, I can tell that I had my own family breakup experience and I was one of the children. Yes, my mother waited for years to let us know the bad behavior of our father - he had been cheating for several years and wasting money in the process. Yes, it took years to heal the wounds, even if we were all already adults at the time. However, I wouldn't trade what I learned for the false bliss of knowing nothing. We matured. We enhanced our life experience. We could have more empathy for the troubles of other people. We become more humane.
7
I suspect we perhaps should have quit reading at the words "a prestigious university."
46
@K Why?
4
@K, that jumped out at me, too. An unnecessary detail, added for what purpose?
7
@K That rubbed me the wrong way too at first, and immediately biased me against her and skewed everything she wrote thereafter as manipulative and disingenuous.
But I read the whole thing again and softened to that "prestigious university" comment, b/c I was reminded how pride is (a false) antidote to shame. Ironically, she didn't do herself any favors, but that's probably exactly what she was hoping to do: Impress upon the reader something about herself that she takes pride in, to ease the shame she feels about what she went on to discuss. We're all human.
9
Your kids will never forgive you for having made whatever is left of their memories of their childhood years seem like a bad joke and told at a drunken swinger's party. If they ask about such struff in the future when they are older-that's different. But why ruin a good thing. You can see the way to get from beginning to end is full of potholes. Write is down-if you must and then leave it in a box. anyone with the desire may read it after you're gone
4
@meloop "anyone with the desire may read it after you're gone"
And then it doesn't matter whether or not they forgive her?
4
@meloop Whoever you are, you're incredibly unkind, uncharitable and not very knowledgable about adult relationships and personal growth. I hope you never need a similar level of understanding and latitude for decisions and actions taken in a time of confusion and desperation.
What you did was shameful, and I would advise against telling your children. If you do tell your children, I would go beyond just advising that you respect their wishes about you even attempting to get this story published. They were innocent in all this, and trying to get this story published without regard to the embarrassment this would likely cause them is another link in this chain of events that have been more about you than anyone else. You were lucky to get your husband back, don't risk losing your kids.
46
I agree. As I was reading I kept wondering why the writer would want her children to know what an abject failure as a human being she has been. I know that sounds harsh, it is. But the writer all but absolves her behaviour by writing of her depression/low self esteem etc. she did not speak of her own agency no, not good enough. The writer remains on antidepressants and I can’t help but wonder what steps she has taken to improve her mood (maybe medication for life is appropriate). I’m also curious about the husband who saw the real picture and extended his had to her, what does this tell us about his own agency and self-esteem? Goodness, these children (now adults) have been through enough, I can only imagine their own dysfunction and impact their mother’s appalling life choices had on them.
24
My first and lasting impression is that the last paragraph here should have been the lede in the answer. This should be his decision. Not hers.
7
It really sounds like you want to write a memoir and know that there will be collateral damage so you are using this “ethical” situation to condone doing what you really want to do. Your memoir may hurt your loved ones. You have to decide how much you care. That’s your dilemma. Good luck.
37
Was there instant messaging several decades ago?
14
@cinnamom, you could send brief texts on a simple cell phone (pre-smartphone) back in the 1990s. Maybe that’s what she’s talking about. Not really “several” decades ago, though.
7
@Passion for Peaches yes there have been messaging since the invention of internet. In the late 80s early 90s regular people and many teens were talking through “electronic bulletin board” messaging applications. You’d dial up with your modem and connect to others in forums and chat rooms.
1
@Passion for Peaches After 28 years, "several decades" is pretty darn close.
What possible good come out of telling your adult children now? Why would you write to an ethics columnist about such a personal relationship question? Go talk with a good psychologist. See your psychiatrist to readjust your medications. You seem to be going through something that you need to reckon with. Maybe it’s hormonal or psychiatric like the start of a manic phase. Talk with your husband and sibling. Don’t get ahead of yourself regarding your writing.
155
There are many questions I wish I had asked my grandparents while they were still alive, but I was too young and too clueless.
Now, with Ancestry.com et al., I can see where they lived, what jobs they held, etc., but I can't ask them WHY they did certain things.
I would like to make a suggestion to anyone reading this: call up your oldest living cousin and see what information you can get. I called a cousin, well into his 90s, and learned stuff I never knew about my parents, his parents, our grandparents, etc. People who are very old are willing to talk about stuff that was kept secret in days of yore.
53
@Pecan Does this really have anything to do with the letter writer's dilemma, though? I hope she doesn't take this as some kind of green light (which she seems to be looking for) to inform her adult children.
10
@SKS
I hope the LW doesn't think she NEEDS a "green light" from a stranger on a comments board to write a book.
Everyone is free to write a book. As I mentioned in another comment, publishing a book on Amazon's Kindle Direct Publishing is easy, free, fast, and can bring in royalties.
I hope everyone writes at least one book. You might be surprised at how satisfying it can be.
@Pecan Suffice it to say that I do indeed know how vey satisfying publishing a book can be. More so, it's rewarding to have satisfied readers. And, yes, at this point in the publishing industry's history, anyone IS free to write a book, and I'm not sure where you got the idea that I was suggesting that they weren't. Maybe you'll re-read my post.
1
The rampant mental health stigma in this comment section is very real, and very saddening. Where is your empathy? Remember, a mental illness isn’t a personality trait. No one chooses to have one. And just like taking care of or loving someone with a physical illness, sometimes things get messy or complicated in a way they would not normally. The only difference between a mental and physical illness is that one is well researched, understood, and exists in a society equipped to properly handle it. The other is stigmatized and chalked up to personal failings. Imagine you got pneumonia, and all people did was tell you how it’s your fault and how you are inconveniencing everyone’s life by being sick. Sounds pretty awful, right?
10
@V :
that misses the point here. She takes anti-depressants, so do I, so do millions of others. It doesn't mean we all have "mental illness".
Her former friend apparently did , but we're hearing only one side and WHY do the adult kids need to know this soap opera drama?
It has nothing to do with "our" empathy.
6
@V
Don't really see what any of this has to do with mental health. She mentioned being depressed, but lots of people are depressed. Doesn't seem to relate to the story.
1
@V
Don't really see what any of this has to do with mental health. She mentioned being depressed, but lots of people are depressed. Doesn't seem to relate to the story.
I admire that you have analyzed that affair for what it was and, most importantly, that you repaired your relationship with your husband. You are among the very small percentage of people who get that chance. However, sharing this with your children would be like playing with fire. Why would you risk causing them agony and pain and destroying the relationship you have with them? Keep it between you and your husband. It is really great he knows. But do not risk damaging your family.
24
The letter writer seems extremely self centered. I would advise her to think more about other people’s feelings and way, way less about her own.
Texting first became popular with teenagers when my daughter was in high school. She graduated in 2002. Older people with children generally did not text much at the time.
28
@Margaret Davis
There were other technologies. People at “prestigious universities” often had access to more but even many of the rest of us had AOL, desk tops and modems.
I'm stuck on the LW being a "middle aged woman" who had school aged children "several decades ago." Even if the youngest was 6, they would now be 40ish and THEY are middle-aged not the LW. The letter is full of such discrepancies & I'm surprised it was taken seriously by The Ethicist. Moreover, these adult children lived through a trial & divorce, reconciliation & remarriage, and have had decades to hear gossip about their parents. They KNOW. The fact that the LW has been treated for depression for several decades also means they're aware of her mental illness that eliminates any medical justification. The letter reeks of delusion & fantasy starting with the 1st sentence.
33
I am shocked at the unkindness of so many of the writers.
9
@Jean
Ditto. There seems to be some jealousy.
2
It’s called REALITY. Empathy for MH issues is one thing, don’t assume people commenting are ignorant.
5
It sounds to me as if the writer wants to justify her actions; blaming her ‘svengali’. That’s a terrible burden to put on her children. Keep quiet about the past. It’s over, and the nitty gritty details are not their business, nor their responsibility. Further, why can’t she write her story and then burn it, or put it in a drawer. If she thinks its an important warning to others, write it as fiction. Change the recognizable details
22
@Sal E My guess is that the discrepancies that other commenters have pointed out in the letter-writer's story are already an attempt to change the recognizable details.
If I were one of the children, or if I were a child of parents with an equally bizarre and troubled marital history, I'd probably be distressed and would fear that this letter was about my mother.
My take on this, therefore, is that the letter-writer has already "published" her story, and I only hope that the harm it causes to her descendants will be limited.
This is going to be as blunt as I can make it.
Confession is good for the soul, dumping ain't the way to go.
I'd give heavy odds your children carry stuff around that they have put behind them.
"Oh, Mom & Dad, it was great to hear that you made mistakes just like we did, do we get a turn to tell your of our stupidities?"
Let the dead past bury the dead.
13
My main reaction to this essay is that it is fictional. I am just not sure if it is the entire story that is fiction or the stories this woman tells herself that are coming off as untrue.
21
Follow your children’s lead. If they ask, reveal a little bit. Otherwise let it be history.
5
My guess? The children already know. In this day and age, secrecy is dead... especially if there was a trial.
3
Came back to read new entries: there are ethical issues, but it is significant that the only characters that come alive in this narrative are herself and the woman she had the affair with. The husband and children are bit players. She doesn't take responsibility for her actions; she doesn't give a clue as to whether she noticed how this already affected everyone else in the family at the time. Suggestion: get into some serious therapy before dumping anything on the children.
41
@Daniela Smith Who says her children see her as two-dimensional, even if they know nothing of the details of their parents' divorce years ago?
She needs a therapist to help her express what she needs to express--to the therapist. My parents fought because they were each pursuing different goals. I saw them as multi-dimensional and if there were any other sordid issues or affairs, it is irrelevant to me as an adult and I don't need to know. They both loved me. They just weren't a good match. She should give her children the gift of NOT telling them anything. And if they ask, she and her husband need to have an agreed upon limit of what to say.
18
Please tell your children! I was 29 years old when I learned through a Google search that my parents had BOTH been previously married before their marriage to each other. Everyone in my entire family knew about this "secret" except for my brother and me. It was a total shock - not necessarily that they had both gone through a divorce, but that not one person in my family had found a way to tell us over the course of 30 years. I agree that certain details of our relationships and personal lives should be private, but if anything is searchable online, you might as well get ahead of that information and communicate it to the people you love face to face.
Parents also have the opportunity to teach their children about healthy relationships by being open about their own past experiences - failures, struggles, successes, whatever it may be. Perhaps this is a moment to deepen the adult bond with your children. From the child's perspective, I say be honest and communicate what you can. I've always appreciated knowing about struggles my parents have been through - it always makes me feel less alone and like we can relate in a better way.
9
@KR "Please, tell your children?????" Not so fast.
Has this wife/mother discussed this issue with her husband, or is she looking for approval from outsiders?How does her husband feel about a discussion with the adult children? Has he had more of a stable influence on the family than the mother?
Since the children are adults, she might consider asking them what stories they have heard of the divorce and if they want or need details for clarification.
There are so many programs on TV (that I usually watch for on a semi-annual yearly basis) where families put all the sad details out for the entire world.
Does this kind of public disclosure really help a family or does it make only one individual feel justified in their poor choices?
It is good that this mom and her husband reconcilied, and the children seem to be successful with their lives. She needs to proceed with caution and consideration for the entire family and not justification for a book.
She is to be commended for working on her own personal growth, but the past and present are not just about her.
15
This is not at all the same thing. The adult children know the basics of their parents ' lives. They were married when the children were born, divorced and later got back together. If the children want to know more, they are free to ask. I'm sorry that important family events were withheld from you, but I feel that even your own parents should be able to keep some details private (though I agree that it would have been kinder to tell you the facts).
1
Is it real story or test drive of a draft of a book? I can't say. I don't see an honest mea culpa. Yes, I did it, but she made me do it; it was all her fault.
And to ask whether she should tell her kids? May be a real question, or seeking feedback from audience for the next chapter in the book?
37
As a psychologist, that strikes me as catastrophically bad advice. How her adult children will respond is a complete unknown, and the fact that they're described as well-adjusted doesn't preclude the possibility of their forever seeing their mother as permanently defective in ways that they may not have otherwise. Access to a parent's past is not an entitlement. And children of all ages are invested in seeing their parents in a particular light, sometimes curated by their own psychological needs for predictability and security. Yes, perhaps they'll say, "Aw mom, we're so sorry that you had to go through that. That must've been very confusing for you. Glad it all worked out." Or they might as easily say, "Wow, you are really not the person that I thought you were. I'm really disappointed in you. I don't think I can ever look at you in the same way again."
59
@Josh I, too, am a therapist and believe Josh is absolutely correct.
And, of course, if you decide to go forward with the truth, be sure you have searched your soul and have taken accountability that you were not just a victim, but make choices, understandable ones under your life circumstances at the time, but nevertheless your choices.
And also, should you go forward your husband should be included and involved in what you share.
17
@Josh, in am floored that this would come from a “psychologist.” Adult children do not need to be protected from the fact that their parents are human and naturally fallible. A parent has no obligation to keep silent about her own story. You think that children have an innate right to see their parents — forever — “in a particular light”? That’s absurd. And limiting.
5
@Josh As long as you like fake relationships with people you should be able to actually be honest with, then sure, kids don't have an entitlement to know parents' pasts. You can do whatever selfish fear based coverups you choose, but you will get what you deserve when they find out and rightfully accuse you of keeping secrets or lying outright. In other words, they will eventually find out who you really are, know that you are not an honest person, and that is going to be more damaging no matter what their response would have been to a parent choosing to not be a coward and coming clean. I assume you like to "manage" the reactions of other people. That may be advisable with strangers or those who are not to be trusted, any sort of person incapable of logical thought - you cannot actually have a valuable relationship with those types no matter what. Go ahead and manage people you don't value. That is the message it sends. If you do it with intelligent people capable of logic when you should be treating them with respect, you will lose. It is insulting. You might as well tell them you thought they were stupid enough to fall for your manipulations and/or you do not respect them. You get what you deserve. Lying, disrespectful, cowards do not deserve much. Trauma isn't finding out your parents made mistakes, that is the parents' selfish trauma of being found out to be liars. Trauma is finding out that you are ahamed of your parent for who he/she STILL chooses to be. Selfish.
3
All I would say is to think carefully before you or your husband speak to the children. They may very well have childhood memories that have been reanalysed by adult minds. Adding to what they know is adding information to a pool of information you do not understand.
You need to evaluate the promise of catharsis against the risk of trauma.
23
@A ...Stop pretending the kids will be traumatized. You know it is completely the parents who don't want to face the trauma of ending their comfortable, preferred lies. ..because it is traumatic for cowards (the parents)to come clean. It is not traumatic for your children if their parents finally end a lie and start living with some integrity and actually deserving respect for the first time. That is a good thing. Way too many cowards rationalizing their selfish self defense mechanisms which violate others' freewill to choose how to feel about someone based on the truth. NOT the facade.
I have two, perhaps conflicting reactions here. One - (and not that this helps the writer) - no big family secrets, ever. Tell your children (and other children in your extended family) the truth, in age appropriate ways, always. No big reveals, ever, about anything. Two - no. No need to dump all this on them now. I so, so wish my own parents had not unloaded their own marital discord of 30 years ago on me. It has served nothing to have shared this information with me, and it has forever changed my relationship with them. So, no.
39
@Sunshine - Two is the ONLY way to go.
1
@Sunshine "Tell them - but no big reveals" How does that work?
5
Many ears after my mother died, I was told she’d had an affair that resulted in the birth of a sibling. That sibling had died very young. My father had abandoned his family but it was he who had put this information out there all those decades later. I did not judge my mother since she’d already had a very very tough life and death and before this came up, and I’d long since put my dysfunctional family into a perspective I could live with. But I can assure you it was not information I had any interest in possessing. In retrospect I can only shrug and attribute the story to myth and legend and let it go. Take away advice: your kids likely do not want to know and there is no reason to burden them with this story unless they ask to be told. They have their own problems as adults and don’t necessarily need yours added to theirs. Deal with your guilt and sadness yourself, with a professional if necessary. Leave them out of it.
51
I honestly can’t imagine a circumstance in which the adult children would be better off for knowing all of this. So, no, I don’t think their parents should share the details and I wonder about the real reasons their mom would be tempted to do so.
37
@Notta Coward She wouldn't be lying by not revealing the details of the affair. But if by some stretch of imagination she were, I'd rather have her lies than your truth on something that is personal and embarrassing to her, and really none of my business.
A friend of mine, who had a long affair and then years later divorced his wife, felt he needed to tell his grown children about the affair because 'it's important that they really know me.'
No, it's not. Parents are not friends. Our children want us to be their parents, not their confidants. What he really wanted was their absolution--which was inappropriate for him to ask for, as he had betrayed their mother.
We are not our children's friends. They have friends. They don't want to know, and we need to resist the selfish temptation to have them recognize us as 'whole people,' or whatever the jargon is.
That's what adult friends (and therapists!) are for.
49
@Concerned Mother At one time I taught basic education (literacy thru 5th grade) at Odyssey House, a drug rehab. One of my students said to me, 'my daughter really needs to know what I've been through'. & I replied 'no she doesn't. You need to know what she's been going thru. Why? Because you're the parent & she's the child'. That was in the 1980's. I still believe I had it right.
31
@Concerned Mother
You do not have to be their friend. You are making some ridiculous assumption that you only need to respect friends. You acknowledge that it is selfish to want kids to forgive the past. But your next step is to decide, since you cannot expect absolution, there is no need to stop lying bc you get nothing out of it. That is just as selfish as telling the truth just so you can expect forgiveness. It is not for YOU (the liar), it is for the ones whose trust you violated by telling yourself you get to pretend to be the person you SHOULD actually be and your kids do not deserve to ever figure it out. Just because you can get away with a lie doesn't mean you should do it. If you tell yourself someone could never be ok without you, or never handle the truth, you are being codependent and assuming the other parties consent to that fakeness. It is disrespectful. Someone with integrity would choose truth. Selfish people are more worried about maintaining the relationship with no effects. You do not get to own your kids. They will figure out your lies. They will hate you for it. And they will lie to you in return bc that is what you taught them.
1
This story doesn't add up. Since when was there "instant messaging" technology "several decades ago"?
18
There were a couple two decades ago, but primarily AOL. I can still hear the notification noise it made because my college roommate (freshman dorms) would stay up late on it - that was 1999.
(I get it though - in my mind it seems like two decades ago was the 80’s and I have to remind myself that was actually almost four decades ago.)
6
@Chris Gray I caught that too. I also cannot imagine the "girlfriend" being a focus of the divorce proceedings; the courts don't care how the affair panned out.
14
Unlike before, where she chose her own needs above everyone else's, this woman needs to consider what her children would get out of it. Being weak and falling apart doesn't need to be detailed. Writing fiction is always more revealing and cathartic (and interesting) than a memoir.
When I saw an old girlfriend after 20 yrs, and remembering how we were such great friends, she felt a need to tell me how she had cheated on me and with whom. An incredibly selfish act on her part, both in the past and in the confession, trying to once again serve her own needs at someone else's expense.
27
@Jorge I suppose she likely was doing the right thing, but for selfish reasons. Not necessary unless she wanted to be in your life I suppose. It seems she was hoping to be in your life again (that might be a bad thing, or not) but maybe she knew that she only wanted to be in your life if you knew the facts, and you had the freewill to make an intelligent choice according to your own wishes, instead of making a mistaken decision based on lies. There is no point in a person liking, accepting, or loving you if they do not know the truth about you bc you will never feel it is real (bc it cannot be real based on lies or incorrect assumptions). She may have been selfish. Or she may have wanted to give you an option of a real friendship that you could take or leave. At least she wasn't a coward.
1
If the children didn't know earlier what happened, there are so many specific details here--assuming the writer is telling the truth--that they surely have guessed now. Isn't this questioner looking for publicity that might get her a book contract rather than a reply to an ethical question? She has already decided to tell.
14
Once I had a falling out with a close friend. After three years we reunited. A relative told me never to open that door again and try to explain, discuss, analyze, etc. Why would anyone disrupt grown children with mistakes from the past that can only be hurtful? It's a Pandora's box with no closure after that. Your past relationships and marital disruption should remain private. If you children want to know all the reasons, they will ask you; then you can decide.
20
I don’t think you made a mistake here. It sounds like you were really, really unhappy with your husband at the time and that there were some really bad problems in your marriage. Your divorce and affair was necessary for both you and your husband to change your relationship for the better. You may not have the happy marriage you have today or value it as much as you do now without something as dramatic as this episode happening. You should totally own it. It sounds like everything worked out well in the end and that it is less threatening to look back on it from that perspective. It’s probably weighing on your mind far more than on your kids. But, I think it would be beneficial for you to hear their perspectives of that time and what they remember and think about it. If you have as good a relationship with your kids as you think you do, they will probably be more forgiving and understanding than you fear.
2
Nothing wrong with opening up a conversation with your children in which YOU LISTEN and learn. Ask them how they feel and what they think about the period of the divorce and subsequent remarriage. Seems like there's not any communication with them about THEIR feelings, and maybe that's what's bothering you. As for your explanations about what happened, that should be guided by your children's desires and your husband should be there and talking also. I think you just might be surprised how little your adult children really want to know about the gory, granular details of their parents' love lives. Seems also that you are entranced and feel a creative spark concerning your story, so write it, but understand it's not of breathless interest to your children. That's generally how the natural order works, and isn't that fortunate?
15
Go on with your life and be happy .
Your past is past , why rimuginate ?
You were able to reconnect and reconcile with your husband and to be happy again together.
Your children shouldn’t be burdened by your old relation , putting in their minds insecurities and doubts.
Bury those tempestuous days and go on with your life .
All of us went through regrettable experiences, but we carried on .
Life is short , enjoy !
8
This situation sounds like it must have been hellishly humiliating for her husband to live through. The two have worked through it and are now a couple again. But can you image what HIS family--his siblings, his parents, his friends--all said to him at the time? He rode through this excruciating, public embarrassment once. And now she wants him to live through that all over again? Really?
35
I got some very good advise from a friend of mine when my marriage broke up. It was "remember your ex wife is the mother of your children so even though you want to rave and rant about her failings she deserves the respect her being the mother of your children brings" I was able to follow this advise most of the time and I'm glad I did. It is better to keep the non-combattants (children) out of the divorce war and the many injuries it inflicts on everyone.
27
Why tell them?
"We were in different places at the time," should be enough.
Just my humble two cents.
24
If the kids haven’t asked, no, you should not tell. You and your husband are back together and happy. That’s all that matters.
I have to say I really question the motivation of the letter writer in wanting to bring this information to light. The question could have been asked of the Times without providing so many specifics about what happened. Why the desire to tell a stranger, plus millions of other strangers these sorted details? I personally would be furious if my mother made a point to explain in detail that she cheated on my father with a lunatic when I had never asked.
18
All I know is that words once spoken or written can never be unspoken or unread . Who will benefit from this disclosure ?You can't control or even predict how your children will react or respond to information about "this dark period" of your life. As your children have not asked you perhaps this indicates they don't wish to know .What is certain is that sharing the reasons you divorced is information that will change your relationship with them in some way but exactly how ,is the unknown and it may not be for the best. I do not feel that children just because they have become adults need to know (or even want to know)the past details of their parents lives.It isn't about "coming clean" as you put it because you don't owe them an explanation. As they are "well adjusted " and "successful" and so much time has past you should leave them to their own memories ; why burden and disturb them with yours ? You say you feel terrified of the effects of telling them so my advice is to heed your intuition and keep silent and explore your "demons" and put them to bed without involving your children who have probably tried to move past what must have been a difficult time for them. This isn't just about what you want or need.
15
what you do with your children is your
own business, but,and I say this with
a sense of profound weariness, don't write about all of this. no one on this planet
needs yet another self lacerating
memoir about people making a mess
of a certain part of their lives.been there,
done that. just live what remains of
your life as well as you can. good luck.
17
Did instant messaging even exist several decades ago?
5
Let me add a quote to yours.
In the Leopard (a book that I love), Giuseppe Tomasi di Lampedusa also wrote: “we have never been as divided as when we are united“
Tomasi di Lampedusa referred to Italian unity. But I think that the principle also applies to many human couples.
Sometimes division is the first step towards a stronger union
Let me share exhaustive details about my previous behavior when you were very, very young. I felt anxiety and shame about those details. When I tell you all those details, you will have an opportunity to be embarrassed, possibly ashamed, and anxious as well. Sharing anxiety and embarrassment does not lower the level to which the author feels them. It just makes other people very uncomfortable. There really is such a thing as too much information. I think sharing this information is an attempt at lessening the feelings of guilt one has by diluting them. It doesn't work.
21
Great idea. Divulge all, I suggest, over Thanksgiving dinner. That should take the onus off political discussions.
28
@Tom T Agreed, it would be an interesting change from the unrelenting drumbeat about how awful you-know-who is.
1
@Tom T
Most hilarious comment of all!
6
There is little remorse here, no discussion of how her husband came to forgive her, or his pain. It is chilling.
28
An excellent counsel that cannot be improved upon.
4
I have two observations on this very detailed story. First, I see a lot of self justification in the writer’s account. The writing program was affiliated with a “prestigious” school (why would that matter?). She was lonely and unhappy and depressed. Fragile. Insecure. Why do we need to know all that? Because she wants to be seen as the victim.
Second, we all own our own stories. This is her story, and her children are adults. Where’s the conflict? She should write about her life and give the kids a heads up on the content. Odds are, they know more about what went on than their parents think they do.
I think that the real question here is whether the writer has come to terms with her decisions and actions all those years ago. I think the answer is that she has not. Writing about it might help purge the guilt she evidently still carries with her.
9
Sometimes it’s best to let sleeping dogs lie. If you’re children are well adjusted and not questioning your divorce, why bring up a dark and uncertain period of their lives? Just because you feel the need to explore this period of your life, when you succumbed to the charms of a conwoman at tremendous cost to your family, doesn’t mean anyone else is eager to join you on your journey of self-reflection. Write what you need to write, but digging up these bones may be the last thing anyone who loves you is interested in. And for heaven’s sake, have the grace not to put your family through further trauma
by seeking to get it published. Whatever attention you seek for writing about that interlude will be met with as much skepticism as these comments regarding your letter to this column. For every reader who validates your navel gazing, there will be dozens who find you haven’t changed your self-serving ways nearly as much as you give yourself credit for. You have been blessed with a second chance to have your family whole - don’t be an ingrate and undermine that gift by indulging in the desire to pick at the scar tissue covering the wounds you inflicted.
16
About the instant messaging ...
Some people seem to have missed that I questioned not the "instant messaging" part but the "several decades ago" part. I didn't question this to suggest the story is fabricated. I think the writer is distancing herself from her own actions as much as possible. It's a "long ago and far away" thing, and it's not an important detail in the story, but it's one reason so many commenters find the story very off-putting.
The "Svengali" detail, too, is so ridiculous it does not garner sympathy, it just sounds over the top. Smacks of a serious lack of self-awareness. Everyone who had an affair thinks the other person had a "Svengali-like hold" over them.
A case of unreliable narrator, basically. For someone asking an ethical question, not a good look.
20
@DW
Agreed that the "several decades ago" makes it less credible - especially since she describes herself NOW as a middle aged woman and "several decades ago" as a mother of school-aged children. "Several decades ago" a now middle aged woman would probably be a teen.
5
LW1 gives us the plot line of "Fatal Attraction", but with a twist. In her rendition, the wife is seduced, rather than the husband. I wonder if the affair happened around the time when that movie was released. Perhaps her affair resonated with influences in the popular culture of the time when it occurred. Maybe she felt that she was becoming part of something much larger than herself, and thus becoming important. (See "The Purple Rose of Cairo" for how this happens.). Ultimately, though, she's just another borderline personality who for a time acted out her conflicted inner life. There's no evidence that the story of how this happened would matter to anyone. She seems to have no insight or transformative emotion to offer to her family. Nor does she have anything to offer a publisher. From a publisher's perspective, the lesbian-who-leads-into-perdition thing has been aced by "Orange is the New Black". Maybe LW1 has seen that, too.
11
Write your manuscript without talking to your children. Get the work on paper, and let it sit; decide, after an appropriate length of time, if the story is more diary than memoir. From the question you've posed, it seems to me you're looking for permission from you children to publish a manuscript that may not be worthy of publication. Don't put them through this, especially if, in retrospect, what you produce isn't of good quality. You've already been down a road that has led to regrets. No point in going there again.
6
If the author has had therapy, it is clear that she has not resolved this issue. Things that are resolved in therapy do not have to be repeated to others, especially if they were children when it happened. Even if revealed to them by someone else in the course of time, this episode can be and should be glossed over with minimum revelations. Those who were not involved have no inherent right or need for all the gory details. This person needs additional therapy to resolve the issue within herself which may actually be a need for further “punishment” or to show how hip she was to have had an affair with a woman.
8
The following is what I would have advised:
Don’t do it. If your adult children eventually find out then have the discussion. I’m afraid your family situation will turn into turbulent times again and your adult children could become alienated from you. Do you want your husband to relive those painful memories again? Maybe the outcome for him won’t be the same. Ask yourself if there is some reason at this time as to why you would want to create chaos in your home. It may be best to find another interesting topic to write about that won’t cause turmoil for your loved ones.
11
No. Do not tell them. Telling them sounds like it’s for YOU, not them. Don’t subject them to your own exorcism of guilt and confusion.
Someday, one of them might ask about what happened and you can answer truthfully but briefly. They might have troubles in their own marriages, so some details about how you and your husband rebuilt your marriage might be relevant. But telling them serves no purpose and might cross boundaries that are comfortable for them. They went through enough that was wounding. Don’t inflict this on them now that there has been a lovely healing.
13
Do LW's children read the NYT? If so, they may have read the revelation via this publication rather than through a personal face to face revelation from their mother. With so much detail, they can probably get whose story it is, or at least ring a bell. Ditto with family and friends. LW can do the same in the bigger project of writing a memoir. Use as pseudonym. If they are not into reading, they may not find out. Do not send them to the transcript of the trial, though. That could be shocking. Though after reading this consultation, they may do so on their own. Or they may ask LW to elaborate the story for them (or even to please say no more).
3
To the disbelievers,
IM and cell phones have been around decades. Obviously, they were not as refined or widely available as they are today.
IM
1980s CompuServe
1990s AOL
Cell phone
1973 Motorola
1
If you write about it, use fiction. Consider writing in the voices of the different characters.
KA Appiah does a thorough job of framing how and what and how to prepare to explain to the "children" what happened earlier in all of their lives.
But, I thought of one additional possibility in the patchwork of emotional land mines. What if one "child" wishes (or needs) to know more about that period of family history than the other?
I do suspect the off spring know more about what happened than mom realizes. They always do. And, they will probably--as mom brings up the subject--realize she is still healing and want to help her.
4
The silver lining to this story is that the letter writer and her husband were able to work through a terrible (truly, terrible) situation and find their way back to a new kind of love, AND that their children have grown up to be well-adjusted adults. That all does take a lot of work.
I'm not sure she should spontaneously tell the children everything about that painful time. Kids (no matter how old) may not want to hear about the mistakes of their parents. Perhaps if the kids ever ask, then both parents can tell the story. There has to be a balance between keeping secrets stuffed away and picking at a long-healed wound.
9
I have another idea for LW's writing project. Instead of a memoir, write a novel using the genre of the memoir. Here's the plot: LW can write about a middle aged woman who has the sudden urge to write again and decides to write a dramatic memoir of this episode in her life. She gets this idea by returning to a writing workshop where she again meets another person who encourages her to write the memoir after hearing some bits in class, is enthralled with her writing (may even be the professor this time); and repeat the first story all over again. She can repeat the same plot when the character reaches old age too. Each time the story is the same but different getting her to invent new scenarios.
14
@tdb Anyone else get the feeling the LW is receiving free creative writing workshop responses?
6
re: marriage breakup
No, there's no need to "come clean". This dates me as an old man and old fashioned, but there's a lot to be said for not disclosing private and personal matters. Unless you're a Hollywood star or a Kardashian, or there's something about the breakup that's important for the children to know, leave it in the past and don't talk about it. Two of the good things about the old days that I miss are better manners and far less airing of personal things.
25
@John such callous disregard for the emotional well being of the children who were at the center of this terrible episode. This episode will be with them their entire lives, which is a far longer time than the actual spouses and adulterer will be around. They most certainly DO have a right to know every factual detail of the episode. The key word here, and the most elusive is "factual" - because with facts, now as adults, they can make their own decisions on how to process what happened so it does not have a long-lasting negative impact on their lives.
1
@Celtique Goddess
According to the mother's letter, the children are well-adjusted adults, are doing fine, and have a good relationship with their mother. Your statement that, "This episode will be with them their entire lives" is just plain wrong given that the children don't know about their mother's affair. They'll only know about it if someone tells them, and the only person likely to do that is their mother. That's because she wants to reveal it, and the only thing holding her back is her fear that disclosure will affect her good relationship with her children. I should say that if that's her main concern, she should not tell them, and under no circumstances should she write about it at a memoir-writing workshop and consider having it further published. That kind of revelation, though consistent with 21st century "sharing" culture and taste, would undoubtedly create embarrassment and negative effects on the children. No, the best thing for the mother to do is to maintain her silence and her family's privacy. She's the one who created this sad situation and who, more than anyone else, can keep it from further harming her family.
3
@John Clearly you've no expertise in psychology. There's a reason it took 21+ centuries to advance to a point where we recognize the secrets and lies between people who love each other is very unhealthy. A blithe comment in a letter to a newspaper that "the children are well adjusted" doesn't address the deep seated trauma that all children experience when their parents go through divorce. While the children have every right to say they don't want to know, - this is an opportunity to strengthen their relationship with both their mother and father. It's very admirable how this mother and father survived this horrible drama, the children could learn a great deal that can help them in their own lives. There's no reason to "hide" the events from them.
Gee, I read a few of the comments and most seemed to agree that the woman who wrote this piece shouldn't tell her adult children what happened. I disagree. It's deeply confusing to grow up with family secrets. Children feel it even if they don't know what is happening and they may carry a sense of confusion into adulthood. I suggest emphasizing how amazing their father was and is to work this out and re-connect. Life is confusing and people make mistakes. Why not approach each other's stories with the understanding the that most of the time we are doing our best.
9
@G. Jensen Why not have this women first discuss this issue with her husband before dumping all the details on her adult children?
I have a feeling that if these adult children were really curious about the separation between mom and dad, they might have asked to be filled in by now.
7
We learn and grow from our mistakes. And why call them mistakes? Do we just have our youth and young adulthood to ‘try things out’? Before we marry? If only...life is as polished as we pretend it to be.
What is important is that we talk about our growth to each other, and that we respect each other for the pace of growth that is different with each and everyone of us. Communication is key to growth.
My adult children have witnessed their parents’ rollercoaster marriage but with comments when necessary or when asked for. Don’t be afraid to share growing pains with your loved ones.
4
No parent or person is perfect. The best thing you can do for your family is to make sure they feel open to discussing life's challenges with you.
Telling them of your difficulties and the strength both you and your husband found to overcome them is wonderful.
Your children will benefit from the openness and forgiveness. I agree you should discuss with your husband first.
5
Middle-aged woman, as Appiah points out, needs to be prepared to know that the kids likely know far more than she thinks they do.
Appiah is also correct to argue that the husband must be consulted before she takes these steps.
And finally - agreeing with Appiah again - middle-aged woman, if she is to start this conversation, should start it with an inquiry with the kids as to whether they want to know.
My parents died over 2 years ago. On the first anniversary of their death, I had a dream about a troubling episode that happened between them when I was 4 years old that I witnessed. This memory had been suppressed for exactly 60 years but came back in painfully vivid detail. What the dream revealed explains many of the choices I have made in my own life, and how I came to be me.
I am the oldest of 5: a sister was 2 at the time, a brother an infant, the others not yet arrived.
As my sister was there, I asked her if she remembered. She did not. I have chosen not to speak of this episode with my other siblings. What would be accomplished by doing so? Beyond permanently altering their perception of my parents in a not good way, nothing much. I have chosen to remain silent.
12
I think this is a brave and good question. Considering all that has happened, one of my favorite points is that this be a team consideration between husband and wife.
I favor disclosure, for the sole reason of what the adult children may learn from their parents' experience. Learning from parents (overtly or subconsciously) does not stop when one becomes an adult. What I'd like to address is the subconscious part. I think whether we like it or not, we often, counter to our best efforts, embody the characters and behaviors of our parents, even in cases where we may feel that we are highly aware of their shortcomings and feel "eyes open" about their faults or foibles. How might the mother's feelings of low self-worth have been be passed on to her children? What can they learn from what "happened" to her and how mired she became in it and ultimately how she handled it? What too is instructive about how their father responded to the situation and that a reconciliation has been established--a positive outcome after what was a truly traumatic experience for them as a couple. There really is a lot (potentially) to explore here.
I don't see any point in putting parents on pedestals. They are human beings, and there are opportunities in family units for us to continue sharing and learning about our emotional selves throughout our lives.
8
It is none of her children's business. Why would you tell them? Perhaps if they ask but, if not, why burden them with the emotional mess of your younger life?
24
There may come a day when one of your children needs to hear your story, for their own personal life progression. Until one of them NEEDS to hear it though, why tell them?
16
Please believe me, your children do not need to or want to hear about what caused your divorce. At most they might want to know that you as a young mother were at a vulnerable point in your life where you did not feel fulfilled and you may have even had a bit of post part un depression. Because of your own vulnerability, you could not see the good things that led you to love your husband and choose him in the first place. But as you grew in wisdom, you clearly recognized what you saw in him to begin with, and the two of you were able to rekindle the love you nice had. That should suffice. It is true. You need not add the unnecessary details. Your children don't need to know those details, and frankly it would be unkind to unburden yourself by burdening them.
26
Is she lying?
She says that this happened several decades ago.
Then she says her "instant messages" were blown up for the world to see.
They didn't have "instant messages" back then.
14
@As That's what struck me, too - cellphones were not widely in use till about the 90s; when did SMS come in? Maybe it was not that long ago?
1
@As
hey did have online services for computers decades ago. I used the the Source and CompuServe in the 1980's. Using today's terminology to describe the past services could well be described as instant messages. I do not make a judgement as to the truth of the OP just saying a possible explanation.
3
@As the instant messenger AIM was released 22 years ago and was widely adopted. I remember well, because I was in middle school at the time and was the only kid in my class without an account! I’m in my mid-thirties now, so Middle-aged woman’s then young children could easily be in their mid-late twenties, certainly old enough to qualify as adults. It’s an amazing story, I hope she writes the memoir.
1
How many children are we talking about here? You write as though they are the same person - but surely they may have quite different responses and reactions to this tale, should you decide to share it with them. If you are simply looking to expiate the guilt you evidently still feel about the past, then opening up this saga may create more problems than you think it will solve. And ... be honest with yourself on this question: are you thinking of the children as a necessary plotline in your story? Of your finally telling them the tale within the tale as the perfect denouement?
6
Wow, there are a lot of mean people out there. I'd say that you should be completely honest when your children ask for details. Most likely, as humans go, they will most likely want you to listen about their lives, and that should be your number one priority. If the subject comes up, you should be honest with them as you seem to have resolved to do. Give yourself a break. We all make mistakes. Keep seeking to move onwards and upwards and don't let negative feedback get you down.
4
Whether or not this story is true, it should not be retold.
18
It is really none of your children's business. If they ask, simply tell them that you were suffering from depression, which is now being treated and the rest is private. Anything else/more is really abusive. And if they don't ask, don't talk about it. There really is no good that will come from this.
If you feel the real need to spill your guts, tell a professional. Your kids are not your therapists.
28
If you are a real writer (work on pith, insight, and wordsmithy), you can turn your experiences and those of your relatives and friends into readable fiction. Try that.
7
I find this piece terribly self serving, notably for the spouse at the genesis of the sordid crisis. Somewhere I have to admit my response is just as self serving, but yes truth is better than obfuscation.
Having had a mother who abandoned me before I could understand what happened, then denigrated for a decade by an abusive father, I promised I would never let that happen to my children should I once have a family.
My ex-spouse went through a similar albeit heterogeneous experience, at first without my knowledge, then requesting separation resulting in the failure of the other relationship. The hurt and damage was too great for reconciliation, the paths had grown too wide, our marriage ultimately ending in divorce.
Three children, two adolescent and a latter younger, a cultural stigmate in which the father was the default culprit, I accepted that role and never allowed blame to be expressed.
The real victims are the children, it is their fractured world, to let blame insidiously occupy the consciousness of their formative years is to allay reconciliation and perhaps mold their future adult relationships.
For the "other" spouse to accept this role is to carry an unfair share of the burden and to forever poison the spontaneity of parental relationship.
6
I think your comments, Mr. Appiah, are right on target ... and asking the children first if they want to know more about the circumstances of your divorce is the cherry. When I make a tough choice involving someone else, I have to make sure I'm prepared for both a yes and a no. That preparation is usually an amazing process that reveals your motives to yourself clearly. It also acknowledges the agency of the other person.
24
I know my late parents were not perfect as no person is perfect. But I'm okay not knowing every detail and challenge they faced. I'm okay keeping them on a pedestal. Whether justified or not, it is a truth I prefer to hold on to.
21
Where is it written that children need to know the inner souls of their parents? While I was growing up, my mother shared her life's mistakes, dramas, childhood pain, etc with me like I was her best friend. I hated it - it robbed me of the last remaining innocence and fun in my childhood. But your children are grown and have their own lives, dramas, mistakes, etc. If they aren't asking, don't tell them. If you want them know or have access to that information, then write a detailed letter and leave it with your will and other final paperwork.
52
@Sue
But that way they can’t ask questions
2
In the absence of the truth children (even grown children) will fill in the blanks with a much worse story than what really happened. And -- this is vital -- they will make up a story in their heads that will put them at the center of the blame for everything. Tread lightly, truthfully, and with professional help, ensuring that the children understand that this is NOT their fault.
18
@Brigid McAvey I dunno, this is pretty bad. I actually think this should be left private and vague from the kids. " I made a mistake, I was conned" is probably good enough. To drag out a lot of crazy painful stuff and lay it on the kids seems counter productive to me.
5
@Brigid McAvey
But in this particular case, the true story is far more distasteful and sordid than anything the children could possibly imagine.
6
I agree with the commenters below who say one should ask the adult children if they want to know more or not. Another advantage though to coming clean would be in the sense of a "cautionary tale" and how easy it is to be taken in by someone.
15
Although there is an ethical angle in this story, I see this is more in the province of a marriage and family therapist who has lots of experience working with the whole family, and helping coming to grips with the situation.
39
Whether we end up telling stories like this to our loved ones should first and foremost be decided based upon the effects that such disclosure will have on THEM, not ourselves. We all make mistakes in our lives (some of them huge) and often those mistakes have significant consequences and cause significant pain to those around us.) It is possible to find clarity and peace with our own past actions through other means than sharing that process with those we love and care about. Such stories and processes can be shared with third parties (like therapists) that are emotionally unattached without the risk of additional pain and damage. Of course sometimes sharing our mistakes with those we love is valuable for THEM. But it is really important to make that determination ahead of time and give them full control of how much they want to hear. I personally regret having made such a sharing because it was in fact motivated by a desire to assuage my own guilt rather than by concern for the needs of the other party.
49
Wouldn’t it be more appropriate for LW1 to discuss these issues with a family therapist? Her decision to share seems to be about her feelings. The kids won’t be better off. If they’ve sensed something is off and wanted to know why...but that’s not suggested.
34
I would personally prefer if a parent asked me to what degree I wanted to know the details about why their marriage ended, rather than decided for me that I should know.
Discussing the broad points might have a fundamental value - for example, the warning signs of depression, how being a stay at home parent can be isolating, the importance of marrying a true partner, when and how to seek help dealing with all of those things, and that it is absolutely possible to overcome difficult times and build a better life.
But I don’t personally want to know the fine details of my parents’ relationship. That is between the two of them, not me. And if all people involved are adults, and now have a healthy, happy, productive relationships with each other, they should have input about whether they want to have this discussion or not.
79
If you needed to write it down in order to understand it, then write it. But the question seems to be whether anyone will be permanently hurt if you use this experience as the core of a published book. Such a book would highlight your priorities and allegiances at that time. In some cases, the noble thing is to remain silent and I think this is one of those cases.
58
@W. Lynch
She can use a pseudonym and change things around a bit ( number of children, etc) so she cannot be identified.Or she can write fictional memoir.
"I still blame myself for what I allowed to happen to my life..."
It is not clear that the writer has fully understood what she allowed to happen to the lives of others. If she has devoted so much effort to her perspective in all this, barely mentioning her husband (and surely not his perspective...yet), one wonders if she should exert more effort to the effects on his life, and how her actions, present and future) will impact him.
One hopes her history of myopic concerns is not repetition.
88
Have the children--adults now--begun asking questions? What prompted this dilemma? If the children are happy, leave them alone.
102
I’m glad I know story of my parents’ divorce including who betrayed who, why they did it, etc. I’m able to see them as nuanced people who were young and confused like me once (I think they still remain confused- maybe that doesn’t always go away). Also their divorce was hard and messy for me as a kid. Knowing the whole story now helps me get some distance and process it. We keep these secrets because we’re worried and ashamed but really knowing each other brings a lot of clarity and peace. Just my 2 cents.
34
I think the damage that is most damaging is really to yourself as it seems clear to me you are still feeling the effects of it. The children don’t need to know, they can’t possibly understand, the confluence of chemical imbalance and vulnerability at that stage in your life. If they are happy and well adjusted now, why dwell on it.
Live life, be present - here and now, with your husband, find peace and happiness in the here and now within yourself. Let the past go, and don’t write a memoir, doesn’t it require you to go deep into the painful past?
47
@Orion Giving advice is a very delicate thing; especially when we are far from the experience and players, as this responder is to the woman who is posing the question, her husband and kids. What the kids need to know and don't need to know (and what they underrstand and do not understand) is not for any of us to decide except this woman, her husband, their kids and perhaps their therapists. The same applies to whether she should write a memoir. Each person's voyage to greater peace and understanding is their own.
14
I think whether and what to tell the "children" will become clear from their need (or lack of need) to know. There's nothing kids hate more than to be forced into seeing bunches of personal messy stuff about parents - until they are ready to know. Some children never know or want to know the very-human side of their parents; others do want to know. Just don't unload all your stuff on them if they don't care to hear it.
But writing a memoir? I say, go for it - and after you write it, decide if it is needed to share it - if it isn't published or widely circulated, then again, let each kid decide what to read and discuss.
13
I think you should tell the children, now that they are adults and presumably have some understanding of life and its ups and downs. Very young children often believe that their parents' break-up is somehow their fault and carry that guilt into adulthood, with sometimes disastrous consequences. So I think it would be helpful if they understood exactly what went on and why. Showing them this letter might even be a great way to start.
11
If all else fails, you could ask them if they want to know more or not--but even that seems too intrusive.
A better idea might be to mention in passing that they could look up the court records if they ever want to know more about that period in their lives. If they don't want to know, they won't look. If they do look, it can be in private, and they can ask you questions afterward. If you were to use this approach, there would be no pressure on them and no drama. I dearly hope the latter is not a problem.
There is something disturbing about the tone and atmosphere of your letter. Furthermore, the children are barely present in it--they are all but invisible. You do not express concern about them, but only about your relationship with them.
My greatest fear here is not for your relationships. It is that your children, quite apart from their future interactions with you, will for the rest of their lives repeatedly recall in pain what they are evidently about to hear--"all by themselves."
27
@AF No, don't direct them to the court records if you want to minimize drama!
2
@AF In most states, certainly the record and decrees of divorce actions and Family Court proceedings are sealed and viewable only by the named parties and their attorneys of record. The trials might be public as required, but typically no outside parties or the press attend (unless a celebrity is involved).
1
I have a friend who told me she loved all the attention she got in a writing class when she wrote about her abusive husband. She went on and on about how everyone loved her writing. She told me how her husband was abusive for more than 20 years . We talked for a while and I assured her she could afford to leave him. Then she gave me a look. As though to say why would I do that and she went off with him to dance to some Michael Jackson song.
28
@judy, I have participated in a lot of retreats and workshops where people (almost all women) talk openly about bad and even abusive marriages and relationships. There is crying and hugging and uttering of affirmations of self worth. And yes, many go home to their spouses or partners and continue their lives as before. But for that brief time they felt special, supported. It’s a strange dynamic. I’ve known women who hold tight to their personal traumas, and hold them up like glittering jewels whenever an opportunity presents itself. It’s part of their identity. Sometimes the main part.
77
Their wounds become their identity.
8
We don't choose to become victims, but it's our choice whether or not to STAY victims. Some people, especially women, choose to stay victims because they can get attention, empathy, sympathy or whatever it is that they want and/or think they need.
It's so much better to move on and take with you the lessons learned from the situation. I say this as a woman who has been through a lot of ugliness in my life. I've become a better person through my travails and also learned how to NOT become a victim again.
I'm not a victim - I'm a survivor.
There is the possibility of father/mother coordination in this presentation to the children. That is a rarity in explaining the source of divorce. Most divorce narratives for adult children are a he said/she said mess that do little to calm the waters or clear the air. In many instances one parent has been 'forthcoming' while the other reluctant to enter narrative combat.
My own tactic has been to ask my adult children: "What would you like to ask." They have yet to inquire.
51
@john
As a family mediator, I always recommend that the parents agree on a coordinated and mutual presentation to the children of why the marriage has stranded and especially dealing with children's reflexive self-blaming. I am speaking of parents of young children. When the children are adults, we focus more on avoiding blaming and jockying to "win" the children for their side(also implicit in the approach to young children). ( out of 10 couples succeed in doing this and the follow-ups show the positive influence of this approach. Of course those couples who come to mediation are a select group to start with. Concerning informing the adult children in this case I would recommend restraint as is spoken of in many other comments. Adult children will ask if they feel the need to know. The parents can also agree on what to tell and how to tell it.
7
Yes, tell them. Because depression and vulnerability can happen to anyone, and your experience is a precious lesson about the twists and turns that can result. Precious: lived knowledge not to be kept just to yourself but shared, especially with your children who of course you would want to protect from any similar challenges — or at least advise so that should they encounter anything similar they could benefit from your experience. But agreed, absolutely you and your husband should tell them together, because it is an experience *both* of you had. And also, it’s clear from your submission you are a wonderful writer. How excellent that you are pursuing it again.
6
@SL
As a kid that survived living with a "mother" who was diagnosed as manic/depressive and bi-polar, I knew she was sick and knew first hand the symptoms of her illnesses. This was far more than enough to deal with as a kid. I didn't need to know that she tricked/lied to the man who adopted me that he was my biological father. They were married when I was 5 and divorced when I was 7. She came clean to all when I was 12 and it ruined my whole family. Then there the times when she demanded that my 10 year old self needed to be her therapist. Even as an adult she wanted to come clean about my conception, childhood, etc. I told her no. I had more than enough of her caa-caa. I wasn't going to carry more for her. Her conscience dumps on me were child abuse. I have not spoken to her for 20 years. I don't know if she is alive or dead and do not care to find out or change it.
The writer can unburden herself and risk losing her kids for good.
6
It sounds to me like she already did tell the children because she thought it was right and it felt good, the husband disagreed, and now she's looking for advice that supports her action.
29
Let things in the past remain in the past. It seems the submission author wants to capitalize on the tawdry details of this dark period in order to create a marketable writing piece. Is it really worth it to put your spouse and children through this again? You have been selfish enough so defer to their needs instead of your own.
Using "and so on" isn't indicative of any great prose either.
91
@dw That makes sense. The long letter is more about her experience than about her ethical dilemma, which is not clear. I hadn't understood the purpose of the letter, frankly, before you comment.
1
This reads like the Magnum Opus of a borderline personality disordered person. People with borderline personality (or even just traits) find life without High Drama achingly dull, nearly unendurably so. What could possibly a better preamble to the holidays than telling the kids all about your rollicking lesbian affair with a sociopath?
Surely, everyone will agree that Mom just had to Do Mom and pass the sweet potatoes...because while you were a married mother, in a writing program, at a prestigious university, when “sociopath” was used to described your extra-marital paramour and you didn’t know the meaning, you weren’t curious enough to grab a dictionary and extricate yourself from her grasping tentacles.
Yikes. Please, lady, just get out of your own way, stop making it All About You.
251
@hey nineteen How insulting to belittle “Mom just had to do Mom.” Mothers often struggle with identity issues, especially when they choose, or must pursue, the stay-at-home route. Callous disregard of the real challenge of that experience betrays a lack of understanding of, or sympathy with, a common existential conflict that should not come as a surprise to anyone in 2019.
6
My thoughts exactly, but better stated than my own...
4
No.
You should not tell the children.
It's not all about you.
176
People make mistakes all the time but this one was a real doozy. Children have a personal view of their parents and remarkably these kids have reportedly grown up unscathed. Even as a stranger to the writer, I am rather appalled by her story--imagine how this could affect her children. My advice would be to forget about it and move on--don't put at risk what you are so so very fortunate to have saved.
100
This writer makes herself out to be the victim of the story, and perhaps in some ways she might have been to a certain extent, but she certainly victimized her spouse and her family in the process.
Lady, you're very lucky your husband took you back and your family seems intact. Keep your mouth shut about this mess, and if you need further catharsis for what happened in the past, tell a therapist about it, not write a book.
278
Why dredge up the past and drag your adult children into your emotional, nightmare drama. It will not behoove them in any way.
Your marriage is between you and your husband. You don't need to give details to anyone.
Are the children demanding intimate details about why and your husband divorced?
You are looking for a way to "offload" your emotions, trauma and drama and it is not fair to dump this on your children, adults or not.
Just write about it. OFFLOAD on paper.
Get it off your chest and mind. It will be cathartic at the very least.
36
@Hope
Write it all out, read it yourself, and then, burn it. Your children suffered enough. No one else needs to know. Nor does anyone else want to know.
2
This lady should have sought sound advice for so much on many levels long ago. A tawdry, excuse laden Dear Abby letter ex post facto is rather moot.
36
Are the movie rights available?
12
Can you spell ridiculous ? Both the substance of the story and the way it is told. Who gets bowled over by a Svengali and then sues for sole custody and knows darn well the text messages etc will be fodder for the courtroom ? Perhaps, I left out, the absurd tack the lawyer for this person detached from reality. What a silly litany of foolishness. She should keep her mouth firmly shut because she can only lose credibility and esteem from her offspring for the telling.
41
The harsh judgments about LW1 are shocking and uncalled-for. Anyone who thinks that s/he isn't susceptible to being conned is fooling him-/herself -- and is lucky never to have been as vulnerable as the LW was.
The lack of empathy among such commenters is a pretty clear indication that everyone is broken -- just in different ways.
I'm glad that things have worked out better for LW1, and I don't think there's a one-size-fits-all answer re: telling the adult children, given that there is such variation in parent-child relationships; some can support the weight of seeing the parents as full and flawed people, some can't.
40
@Doro Wynant "Several decades ago" she had an affair where she spent innumerable hours texting this person. Several means more than two; this being being 2019, it suggests a time sometime before 1999. Has anyone looked up when texting became common? This is just one example in which this story appears made up.
2
This is not just the writer's story to tel. It is also her husband's. If she wants to tell it, she needs his complete buy in. Her motivations, to me, are shifty. Whose interests would this revelation serve? Just because they are older doesn't mean they need to know this now. As adults, I think they would ask if they wanted to know. I don't see how this benefits anyone, except maybe the writer's weird ego.
62
Well, LW, I have no idea what your relationship with your parents is like.
And I don't know what percentage the divorce "phase" of their childhood makes up of your kids' overall picture of their lives with you.
But imagine your parents pulling you aside, out of the blue, and telling you a story of similar size and weight, with the same degree of shattered assumptions, revelation of information withheld, etc.
How would that go down with you?
41
Navel-gazing from a cheater, who immediately provides excuses for her cheating, instead of taking responsibility for it and not making excuses.
I'm sad for our world, in which everyone's bad behavior is explained-away, instead of directly recognizing it for the selfishness (and nothing else!) that it is.
45
NO. Unless they are making amorous confessions and you feel responsible to quid their quo.
9
Here's an idea. Say, to the now-grown 'children' - "Children? If you would like me to tell you how your father and I became divorced I am willing to tell you." Abide by their instructions.
10
Yikes, what a story. And what a guy to forgive you and get back together! Be prepared to learn that all these things are obvious to your children. They knew it all along or figured it out later.
18
@Jonathan Or, possibly, they didn't care to. Hard to know which.
1
I had a mother who freely "shared" details of my parents' marriage that I, to this day, hate her for "sharing". Trust me when I say we all knew how miserable their marriage was. But, the extra helpings of info my mother felt the need to serve up? Wish I could have passed.
To the writer I advise keep your yap shut. Your kids already have probably pieced together the broad outlines of the story. Trust me when I tell you that they don't want you to ice this particular cake.
143
@Well-edited My mother did the same with me. When I asked her why she felt the need to tell me, she said she wanted me to feel her pain. My mother suffers from borderline personality disorder and is always the victim. The person who wrote this letter, sadly, seems to suffer from the same malady. I hope as you say she keeps her "yap shut."
2
As other commenters have noted, LW1 has little or no insight into what occurred with this third party, described as a sociopath. Indeed, she is lucky to have had any contact with her children after such appallingly bad behavior. Even assuming that any of the facts recited in the letter are true (except for the divorce and number of children), LW1 lives in a parallel universe that is best set out for a major course in forensic psychiatry. I am not qualified to know just how much more (and what type of therapy) will assist LW1 in gaining any insight about her part behavior, and why her children do not need to know. In an episode of Seinfeld, Jerry meets a particularly unpleasant person and asks, "Shouldn't you be out on a ledge somewhere?"
34
@Patricia, to quote a favorite song, "What the world needs now is love, sweet love. It's the only thing that there's just too little of."
5
" I am not qualified "
Well said.
10
There is no reason except for self gratification to provide the details to your children. I speak from a similar experience. if they are not asking they do not need to know. Telling them is only self centered unburdening of your self.
it will backfire.
good luck
165
Give this woman a break. I was in the same situation as one of this woman’s children. I learned the real reason for my parents’ divorce in my 40s, from my father, who admitted to multiple infidelities and excessive drinking during his marriage to my mother. I idolized my father, and probably still do. He was a terrific, loving father despite his failings - always there for his children in ways he could not be for his spouses. I’m grateful that I learned the truth. It helped me appreciate my mother even more, and to understand that the kindness and lack of judgment my father showed to others came from a deep sense of his own frailty. And it’s made me a kinder person myself. Grown children can handle these things. People who do rotten things at certain points in their lives are not necessarily rotten or selfish altogether.
To the people criticizing this woman, I would invite you to have some mercy on those who are not as strong or capable as you. I won’t get into the weeds of discussing point by point why the LW seems credible - I just want to say to her that if your relationship with your children is as strong as you say, it will not hurt for your children to know you fully.
80
@cathelou Your father was brave to confess his own shortcomings and that was positive for you. But this woman wants to retell an embarrassing story of the past as some heroic narrative of the present. It's very different and it may have different effects on the children.
4
Way way too much information provided by the letter writer. If she wants to be a writer, learning how to be concise will serve her well.
53
Depends on the writing workshop. And the instructor. https://opinionator.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/12/31/make-me-worry-youre-not-o-k/
2
I think the so-called Ethicist writes these sometimes as a ‘captivating’ narrative with context to fill column space.
11
Sorry, but where exactly is the ethical dilemma in this tale?
35
@Darcy same question. The letter is not about a moral dilemma.
2
Why do we need to know it was a "prestigious university?" Is that supposed to excuse some of the behavior. "I never would have fallen for her if it had been a community college?"
188
She's providing context, the adjectives prestigious is important because she tells us very plainly that her own ego was fragile. So if you want to use your imagination, you can think about what the reflected glory would mean to someone whose ego is weak. As a history person, this should be obvious.
27
Boom!
6
I can't believe that publishing this letter is anything more than an attempt to pique reader interest - which it certainly has done.
The question it raises should be asked (if at all) of a family therapist because it's about family dynamics. But this is supposed to be a column that focuses on "ethics," not on the whiny, self-indulgent nattering of an aspiring writer. I found it difficult to keep reading but I did read the whole thing to be sure I didn't miss the non-existent ethical question.
58
Having encountered this nightmare of a woman when LW was hoping to pursue writing at a "prestigious" university, the LW now finds herself healthy enough to write again and intends to revisit the darkest time of her life. She wants to share with her well adjusted children how she wrecked their childhood to please a sociopath. Don't. Write fiction, or biography, or local reporting, or bury your writing dreams permanently and take up gardening. Pursue classes at the local adult ed center, as you are too easily impressed by anyone who has academic credentials, or says they have them.
103
@M.R. Sullivan You actually knew her? Wow!
4
Interesting that so many commenters here are so very judgmental, and equate LW's "self absorption" with disqualifying her from opening up to her children about what happened. I don't necessarily disagree that she definitely sounds somewhat wobbly still, and that a therapist wouldn't be a terrible idea, but that's not the same thing as whether or not her children should know. Do they "deserve to know," no. No one is entitled to anyone else's extremely personal business. But there can be something to be gained from a straight-on understanding of why relationships sometimes work and sometimes don't - if indeed the LW is capable of delivering such.
23
From my perspective I doubt if I would have remarried a woman who had shown such astonishingly and incredibly poor judgement. How on earth could you trust her? But ... no one asked me. While she has a right to tell her version of the story, (including this letter to Professor Appiah) she should be prepared for people who were there, including her kids, sibling, and her husband, to have their own versions. I wonder if she can handle that?
59
I think that The Ethicist's advice is good, covering man of the issues.
No 1 is that the children may not want to know "everything" or "anything," and the husband/father has a role in any narratives of this part of their shared history.
A more complicated issue: it's not possible to tell the "true"story of anything from one's sole perspective.
It is also critical to be able to see what it is that one expects from this. Marriage and parenthood isn't a confessional; children don't exist to grant absolution to wayward parents -- so explaining her past actions to her children, in other words, cannot be about the writer's needs, but about their desire to know, if this is about their feelings.
30
This story stinks.
On what planet would, in a divorce trial, opinions [and assorted junk and factoids] of third parties be admissible about other third parties?
At the very least, NW is not telling half the story of what the divorce was really about. The real story? If all this testimony was given and was deemed admissible, NW somehow put the children at horrible risk through contact with this person; not because she was controlled by this Svengali or was "lost, insecure and unhappy" but because she utterly lacked sound parenting judgment.
Now she wants to blame everything on someone else...and write a book about it.
165
@Clotario
100% agree re trial; said same below. The LW contends had she not "collapsed" she would've gotten sole custody; she's lucky her attorney negotiated shared.
33
The LW still sounds like a trainwreck.
Nothing has really changed.
And destroying her own family because she was unhappy with her new town - really?
81
NO. there is no need to tell them. It's between you and your spouse. He's OK with you. You're OK with him. Your marriage does not belong to your kids no matter how mature and well adjusted they are. If someone tells them and they ask you, you can simply say: "that's between your dad and I."
84
@Vincent Maher “Your dad and me”
46
@Allison
Oh, stop.
Why grammar-shame someone who has contributed a wise and useful comment to a national publication?
If it were the writer, fair game. But it wasn't.
It makes you look like a person lucky enough to be well-trained in grammar. It also makes you look petty.
4
@Petuunia Sorry, it’s my personal annoyance and from the number of people who recommended it, I’d say I’m not alone. When I learned my grammar in 8th grade this was called a “gentilism” where the speaker thinks incorrectly he or she is being refined. It doesn’t hurt to absorb these niceties and expand your knowledge.
3
What instant message program was there 40 years or ago, or even 30? Or does the writer mean AOL, which was only technically decades ago, but really not so long ago. Something is fishy here.
56
@PrairieFlax - AOL's instant messaging program was a part of the service before there was an Internet, back when one connected via dial-up modems, back in the early 1990s. I first used it in 1992, which is - rather shockingly - almost 30 years ago. It was as seductive a medium as FB is today.
17
AOL's precedessor QuantumLink had a chat channel called "QuantumSex."
@Elr Before AOL there was Compuserve and before that The Source. As early as 1979 those at some “prestigious” universities had the possibility of what could be called instant messaging. This was recognised at the time byIsaac Asimov who hailed that year as “the start of the Information Age.” So 40 and even 50 years ago is correct. There’s nothing fishy about it. And we should not confuse the World Wide Web with the Internet, even though most of us do. The invention of the WWW made today’s websites possible and did get momentum in the early 1990s but there was an Internet much before that even though it was not generally available.
As for the poor woman in the Ethicist’s column. Well, she isn’t as clever or well balanced as some of us, but is that any reason for us to be so judgemental? She outlined her concerns.He answered them well. Good luck to her in whatever path she takes as a result of his advice.
13
I had a girlfriend who ended up having a new love relationship with one of her girlfriends. Didn't bother me at all, in fact I liked the idea (always hoping we might end up in a 3 way).
3 way never happened but I never felt in competition from a girl. If it had been a guy, our relationship would have ended instantly though...
5
@kenzo Holey Moley.
(Sounds sexist tho.)
2
How is it sexist ? Seems judgmental to label him for his preferences though.
Perhaps those who have never had a close encounter with a sociopath, think this story sounds off. Having spent five years with a sociopath co-worker I thought was my friend I believe every word. That's the truly sad thing about being victimized by a sociopath, when you tell your story it sounds like you're the crazy one. I'm so lucky that I have a professional colleague who had a run in with this woman, who completely validated what happened to me.
63
@ROK
I think we all get she got entangled with a sociopath and it was awful. What folks are questioning is her judgment NOW re: telling the story to her children. That's a different matter.
24
You may want to write this memoir as a form of healing, but I suggest you lock it away in a drawer somewhere. You will bring a lot of pain to your family by dragging this out into the limelight.
341
@Person
Why not write a novel? A memoir will only cause a good deal of pain to your children; if you write it as a novel, you'll have much more freedom, and even if people do know it is based on 'real' events (as are most novels!) it can be elided...
16
@Person Why not write it as a screenplay? This would make great movie on Lifetime.
5
@Person
Or write is as a fictional memoir changing things around a bit. Or use a pseudonym.
3
Although my parents never divorced, after my mother's death, my relatives began to divulge unpleasant stories about her. I say, let sleeping dogs lie and shame on the letter writer for pitching her book, and Professor Appiah allowing her to in this column.
117
Amazing how little agency this woman attributes to herself. She trashed her husband's life and was prepared to take his children away from him because somebody her told her to do it. Why he still speaks to her is a mystery.
218
So many harsh comments for the writer. Is it so wrong to want our children--some of the people we love and sacrifice most for in this world--to know us and understand us as human beings, rather than two dimensional "mom and dad"?
10
@Daniela Smith
A loving parent makes decisions based on their children's best interests. That's not being "two-dimensional."
60
@Daniela Smith Who says her children see her as two-dimensional, even if they know nothing of the details of their parents' divorce years ago?
She needs a therapist to help her express what she needs to express--to the therapist. My parents fought because they were each pursuing different goals. I saw them as multi-dimensional and if there were any other issues or affairs, it is irrelevant to me as an adut and I don't need to know. They both loved me. They just weren't a good match. She should give her children the gift of NOT telling them anything. And if they ask, she and her husband need to have an agreed upon limit of what to say.
@Daniela Smith Who says her children see her as two-dimensional, even if they know nothing of the details of their parents' divorce years ago?
She needs a therapist to help her express what she needs to express--to the therapist. My parents fought because they were each pursuing different goals. I saw them as multi-dimensional and if there were any other issues or affairs, it is irrelevant to me as an adut and I don't need to know. They both loved me. They just weren't a good match. She should give her children the gift of NOT telling them anything. And if they ask, she and her husband need to have an agreed upon limit of what to say.
After all these years she is still saying" Pay attention to me" but once again she wants to mess with the lives of her children. Seems that her husband and children deserve better.
96
"Dear Children, I want to tell you a story which will exemplify how messed up I was year ago and it lead to your father and I getting divorced. You will never look at me the same again." Great idea.
74
Existence is too good to spend much attention on mistakes of the past. Instead of directing attention to the worst mistake you've ever made, why not ask a better question:
How can I live well today without reference to mistakes from the past?
Who could I help today?
What even more interesting, yet honest and adventures could I find today?
What's new on Netflix?
80
@David I copied your response, printed it out, and thumbtacked it to my home office wall. Thanks for making my day a lot better!
19
"The story of your life can’t be written in the passive voice." I love this line so so much. Perfection.
39
Unless I passed over something, I think the comments miss one thing: the letter writer wants to write about this and possibly publish, and, as a writer she has every right to do so. If and when the memoir is accepted for publication, she must tell her children about her past; she probably wouldn't want her children to read about it in a book. If she's not publishing, I can see no reason for her to tell them now, unless they ask.
10
Maybe she can write it as “Anonymous” or Name Withheld as she has done here in NYT. That is if this is a genuine letter and not a fiction.
6
@Suburban Cowboy
"Maybe she can write it as 'Anonymous' or Name Withheld as she has done here in NYT. "
Well, in that case she's already done it.
1
I agree with most of the writers here, that this person is still way too self-absorbed to spill this long story to her children.
If an adult feels they have secrets from their adult children, sometimes it does help those children to learn things that help THEM put together pieces of their lives. But disclosing such secrets always needs to have their interests in the forefront. A parents can share what they learned or what they suffered, in a way that clears up a child’s unasked questions. But there isn’t a need for intimate details.
14
@Suzenn
Self-absorbed is right!....and toss in more than a degree of
narcissism ........
22
The letter writer just wrote her memoir via her letter, which should help her get her past "out of her system," so to speak, if that's the purpose of writing it. However, it sounds as though she would like to expand it and get it published, therefore her concern about her adult children finding out about her affair.
She says she's had professional counseling and has come to terms with her responsibility for her actions. She's very fortunate that her husband took her back and that her (now adult) children have turned out so well. If her children aren't asking for information about the reason for the divorce, why provide it? It seems self-absorbed and pointless to dredge this up now. It's one thing to write your memoir for your own satisfaction. To think it's publishable is entirely different. If I were her, I think I'd burn it. She put her husband and children through a lot years ago. Why inflict more pain on them now?
50
My parents divorced when I was young, but no matter how many times I asked them why it had happened, even after I was an adult, they refused.
This bothered me, but in fact it was not really my business, except to know that I was not to blame (which they always made clear to me). I suspect they may have made an agreement to not discuss the reason(s) for their divorce with me, and kept it.
In retrospect I'm glad they never discussed it with me. If they had, I most likely would have been tempted to assign blame, and that would have had no upside. Instead, in my blissful ignorance I could accept that they just weren't right for each other, without my faulting either one.
107
What is the point of disclosing this information to her adult children? They aren’t asking.
Could it be to justify her desire to write it all down and make money over the sordid details?
There is no cleansing of the soul or relieving guilt here. There are professionals who can help her navigate through this soul searching if necessary. A publisher is not the professional she needs.
143
@ArtM
Not asking questions of parents doesn't mean an adult doesn't want to know. It could be that s/he hesitates to ask because s/he doesn't want to cause pain or embarrass the parent.
Children sometimes (often?) blame themselves for the parents' divorce. Explaining it could help the mother and the children.
As far as "professionals" who help with "soul searching?" They're glad to take your money, but with writing a book and selling it on KDP, you get to keep the money (plus royalties) and will probably get better results.
3
@ArtM Her story is a farce. There was no instant messaging decades ago. Unless she means AOL in the 1990s.
13
I usually love The Ethicist and enjoy the moral quandaries posed by the letter writers (as well as Mr. Appiah's wise and well-considered replies).
However, I'm very sorry that he chose to print and reply to this particular letter. There's just something very "off" about it. I think those who have said it sounds like a pitch for a book, not a request for ethical guidance, have it right. And those who have added that the letter writer seems to be setting forth her story our of a desire for attention, not out of a desire for clarity and counsel, also have it right. Inauthenticity and questionable motives shine through this letter, whether the letter writer is aware or unaware of them.
If this is the space from which she is writing, she should definitely not tell her children, as the telling would be all about her, and not really about them. She might benefit from the sharing (as someone recounting a horrific car crash over and over again benefits from the distancing it provides); her children would not.
306
It actually sounds like a pitch for a movie script, right down to the courtroom scene with the dramatic, public reveal of the villain in which the bewitched and gaslighted victim finally comes to her senses.
19
Wonderful advice. I had a few thoughts reading it.
First, if I can draw from my own life, ways to illustrate learning for my children, I usually err on the side of sharing. I have made mistakes, been taken in by people, though not to the extent as this woman. Drawing from my own life at time has allowed me to show my kids (now nearly adults) that everyone makes mistakes. What matters is that you prioritize growth and accountability and learning from every interaction. I have tried to instill in them the freedom to not just err, but to forgive themselves and move on using a formula of accountability + plan forward.
If that is achievable here, and your husband is in agreement, and you don't make it about you, then sure. It may bear sharing the story.
However. There are pieces of this story that speak to three things: emotional immaturity, self absorption, and lack of knowledge of self. I think we are all assuming that you are no longer the person you were during that dark period. We all have eras we would rather forget so I am not castigating you for having yours. However, use those behaviors to gut check your reasons for speaking out now. If this is about you, and mostly you alone, then continue to work on yourself.
If this is about growing closer with your children by sharing what your journey has been, and only if your husband agrees then move forward with care. Not all details will be necessary but the highlights should reflect how and why you grew.
21
I have an instantaneous, very strong reaction here: should you tell your children this sordid story?
NOOOOOOO.
Don't do it. You say you're happily married now - my guess is you'll end up split again if you do this, because it's monumentally selfish. And no, your children CERTAINLY do not want to hear this.
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Even now, as she's strangely eager to afflict the children with her tale of events, the writing here is full of "it wasn't really my fault."
Advice? Leave your children out of your desire to relive and reinvigorate your trauma. They're not your therapists. The work you still have to do should not involve them.
Oh, and if for some reason they should ever ask with real curiosity? Tell them to ask their father, first--after all, he was the one whose suffering was inflicted, not invited.
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@Blair M Schirmer That's a rather large conclusion to jump to - marriages are rarely between one person who is entirely the saint and one purely the sinner.
16
@NYCLady, I agree. If the description of the situation is correct, the husband bears a smaller portion of the responsibility for what happened. It seems he didn't give the woman enough emotional support when she needed it: moved to a new town, no friendships, quit the job to raise family, unhappy in the marriage.
9
@Blair M Schirmer
The children have already lived through this once. They weren't infants; they were both in school. They had to have been aware of a trial, gossip, and the fact that their mother "collapsed" at some point. Surely, over the years they've heard enough of the story from others to get the gist. They know she has experienced depression & has been on medication for several decades so there's no medical reason to tell them. Your term "invigorated" is exactly what she wants to do - dredge up the entire saga from her perspective w/no mention of having spoken to her husband about his opinion.
10
He who troubleth his own house shall inherit the wind.
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@PNRN Excellent!!
3
The story doesn't really even all make sense. "Several decades ago" no one was instant messaging. I'm guessing the affair wasn't as long ago as the author portrays; or else there's some fictionalization going on. There is a huge amount of self justification here or maybe some delusion.
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@DW Two, two and a half decades ago people were. While not everyone would consider two decades to be "several" I don't think that that wording is unusual enough to make the story suspect.
21
@DW
Agreed. Although aol has offered IM for 3 decades, there's something not quite right here. I'm puzzled by details of the trial.
A judge relies on the expert opinion of a psychologist, social worker, or psychiatrist who has examined both parties & the children. This woman wouldn't have featured so prominently at trial nor would her true character come as a last minute surprise to the LW - it would have been disclosed pre-trial.
Something has triggered this renewed interest in justifying ancient history. Delusion - especially of publication for someone who hasn't written a word in several decades - abounds.
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Um actually I was instant messaging in high school in the late 90’s.
10
Neither the letter writer, nor Professor Appiah, nor any commenter so far seems to have noticed that the letter writer has now published her story in the New York Times, and that her children may read it and guess who wrote it, as they are even more likely to if she expands the letter into a book. I agree with the commenter who writes that the letter sounds like a pitch for the book. The letter also sounds like the basis for a chapter of the book.
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@HC
We all noticed - it was the point of her question.
24
@HC Spot on.
12
@HC Yikes! Thanks for pointing that out!
5
This is an interesting question. The children are well-adjusted and successful, but what does that mean? Perhaps they are maladjusted in ways that will only be visible when they are older. Perhaps the success that they have acheived is a fraction of what they are capable of acheiving? Ask them what they want to know. Ask them what they need to know. The same details that might have stalled their development as children might liberate them as adults.
9
My father died several years ago. Since then, my mother has been telling my sister and me things about her relationship with my father that I wish I'd never heard. We had not been asking questions. She just volunteered this unwanted information. Way too much information. She did this for herself, not for us, and it's been very painful and unpleasant.
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@BA And I would say that the reason the woman who wrote to the Ethicist is doing this all for herself - not for her children. The same as she did when she entered the relationship with the other woman - she is still only thinking of herself.
288
@BA My stepmother did the same thing to me after my father died. First she swore me to secrecy, and then she told my siblings that I knew things about my father that they didn't. It put a wedge between my siblings and me for a while. I didn't want to tell them because it was really ugly and tawdry stuff. So I kept my mouth shut and I'm glad I did, but stepmom sure put me in a difficult position.
31
@BA I 100% agree. My parents did not divorce, but chose to stay in a miserable marriage. The contempt, mostly on the mother's side, was obvious. She would simmer for days or weeks and then explode in a rage against my dad. He was silent mostly. They both made a choice to just sit in that filth for their entire lives. They made that choice for their innocent kids, too, and it most definitely affected all of us. Anyway, in my teens, the mother told me things about my dad, which I accepted as complete truth. Only much later did I consider that they may not have been true. This was an entirely selfish thing that she did, designed to control and manipulate me. If she had been thinking at all about me, she would have kept her mouth shut.
11
Short answer - no. While the now adult children know of the affair and the ensuing damage it did to all in the family, there is little point in rehashing any of that in the detail the write apparently intends.
The children are not entitled to know all of the personal, intimate details of their parents lives. Parents are entitled to their own privacy and pasts, however ill advised, reckless or lurid. Her kids know there was an affair and that's enough.
Removing that incorrect justification ("they have a right to now what happened") apparently leaves us with the perception that the write wants to do this as a therapeutic element of her progression in life. Trust me, while her kids know the basics, they are not likely to want to hear all of the gory details, as the saying goes. Let sleeping dogs lie and move on with your life.
85
Tell your children what they need to know, not what you feel you need to tell them. Otherwise you are potentially putting a burden on them to relieve a burden you carry.
Your children have grown to be happy, successful adults without ever knowing the details. Will they be happier or more successful if they know everything?
Telling them won't decrease what you did. A sociopath was involved in their lives to the point of breaking up their home--and you let the sociopath in.
You found out what was going on and have made essentially a new life for yourself. You have tried to make amends. All to the good. But making amends doesn't count if it harms the person you're apologizing to. And your children could well be harmed by your telling all.
Leave it be. If they ever ask for details about the divorce, you can tell them what they need to know--that you had an affair with a person who turned out to be horrible, and that you and your husband rebuilt your life.
124
The letter sounds exactly like the pitch for the book. Hmmm.
200
@Di
Plainly.
22
@Di ...or a movie...
1
Right off the bat I got the impression that there are self esteem issues at play here as well (why use “prestigious” in the second sentence?). So please assess the entirety of issues that may be influencing your quandary as that may lead to a more satisfactory resolution.
46
I honestly think there's no need to say anything unless they are curious and ask. It seems self-indulgent. I'm not sure how it benefits them to know, and I don't see how it could improve your relationships - either with your children or your husband. If you end up publishing something and know they will see it, that would be a time to have the conversation so they find out from you first, before it's public knowledge.
34
What's her husband's opinion? It's his story, too.
Why bother her wonderful, well-adjusted adult children now?They've had decades to ask & haven't.
If she feels compelled to write after all these decades, write. Journal. She doesn't need a formal class to express herself & exorcise her "demons." She has zero chance of mass publication given how saturated this particular territory is.
She certainly seems to relish the story - 7 paragraphs to essentially say "During a depressive episode, I had an affair w/a charismatic woman." Even now, she's a victim & her focus is on the other woman's seductive prowess & mental illness. TMI.
362
@knitfrenzy Exactly... Apparently she has has "several decades" during which to perfect the mental gymnastics necessary to completely absolve herself of any blame in what happened. The writer's need to divulge this information feels nearly pathological, or (as other comments have observed) motivated by writing career aspirations.
65
@knitfrenzy you nailed it with
" zero chance of mass publication given how saturated this particular territory is"
15
Your children don't want to know all the details about your affair. Your motive is to defend yourself and put the blame on the other person. The other person was controlling, the other person made up stories you chose to believe, the other person was manipulative, and you were depressed. I can't imagine why your husband took such a weak-willed person back. Keep your details to yourself. Your children won't be happy to hear them. This may make your conscience feel better but it will make everyone else unhappy. Try thinking about your family first and not do something that you think will ease your conscience but at their expense.
104
If your Children ask questions, answer honestly only as much as you're comfortable sharing. Otherwise, why stir the pot ? Many of us have enough problems without actively seeking more. Also, it sounds like your Writing is fulfilling and a healing outlet. Please continue, and emphasize its fictional aspects, unless you want to write an actual memoir. That's a different kettle of legal fish.
Best Wishes.
24
It sounds as if the LW is still all too wrapped up in herself. I doubt her adult children are as interested in the sordid details of the breakup of their parents' marriage as she thinks they are. It's like thinking about your parents having sex-- you know they did it, but you really don't need any intimate details. I'd counsel keeping mum unless asked -- and choosing another subject to write about, if she's trying for publication, for the sake of both her children and her husband.
127
All these confessionals about matters long in the past! Is there an element of self-indulgence here? Being at the centre of an old drama?
The author learnt from her mistakes. Leave it alone.
Adult children don't need to know all these details now.
65
@Jill Reddan - There is only Now. The "past" that plagues you exists only as your re-creation of those events and, as with most/all "memories", is a fictionalization of what really occurred.
Each moment you spend chewing on this illusory "past" is a moment of your real life that is lost to you - and our real lives are always in The Blessed, Miraculous Now, and Now, and Now. As John Lennon said, "Life is what happens when you're busy making other plans."
Forget that old You. Gift yourself with today's beautiful You. Let go of the burden you're choosing to carry, acknowledge, move on…
5
This was a painful letter to read; I kept thinking therapist not ethicist. I don't think I would want to know if I was your child . Do they want to know about the divorce or do you want the freedom to write your memoir?
107
Good advice, Kwame.
To the LW: You're a good writer. No reason you shouldn't write your memoirs or a fictionalized version thereof. I would suggest Kindle Direct Publishing. Fast, easy, free, 70% of the royalties, etc.
You can tell your children that you've written about the divorce and give them a link to buying your book on Amazon. Tell them they're free to read it or not, no pressure. Set up a promotion week, so it's free during that time. Tell them you'll answer any questions they have, and you won't be offended if they have no questions or interest in reading your book.
Good luck with the project!
7
The old saying “let sleeping dogs lie” might apply in this situation.
56
Trust me your children do not want to know. I can’t think of anything I would want to know less than my parents personal and intimate relationship details.
319
Chances are, they spent time suffering and healing enough already.
Don't go back. Keep your selfish, blind period to yourself.
There will be no resolution, only for yourself--a reminder to them of what already happened.
Be thankful it turned out...and you were freed from further entanglement with distortion. Move forward. Write a novel not a memoir.
37
How is this ethical?? Shouldn’t a therapist be giving advice on this?
67
I'd ask, "Is it ethical to pitch a book idea publicly in a NYT advice column?". That's the only ethics issue I can see here.
36
You might want to read "What My Mother and I Don't Talk About" to get more perspective on your adult childrens' point of view. Good Luck!
10
Be honest with yourself. Can't you recognize a selfish act when you see it?
98
So many people believe they "need" to write about their painful missteps, how they were hurt and how they hurt others. That might be true. But unless they possess a gift that transcends moral trepidation (remember Philip Roth's father soiling himself in Patrimony and begging Roth "not to tell anyone, not even Claire?") the question is does a person "need" to publish, and profit from, confessions that have the potential to turn their children's and families' worlds upside down. This is what seems to be happening a lot.
65
@Susan
There's a difference between a need to write for private therapeutic purposes & for publication. She could've written at any time over the decades (pen & paper are available 24/7 in her home or office) but chose to wait until she's enrolled in a memoir-writing class where she'll have an audience. She's not interested in their feedback on technique; she wants to tell her story. No doubt she'll describe herself as having been published in the NYT. As you say, the "I had an affair w/a woman" trope has passed far beyond the hands of masters to celebrities to the mainstream to self-publication.
30
"Should I Tell the Children Why My Marriage Broke Up?" -- the best may be to formulate the issue not as of "breaking up", but as a "change in the nature of the relationship". After all, the latter is literally correct and carries no connotation of guilt.
5
@Tuvw Xyz "Honesty with yourself involves an acknowledgment of your own agency here; this episode wasn’t simply something that was done to you." Maybe some guilt is called for.
28
Having three adult children, I know that they ask questions that are hard to answer. If they are asking question, I would answer them honestly, but if they aren't asking about the situation then why rock the boat?
144
@ MS Ind
But are you really "rocking the boat" or exposing your children to the realities of life? At every age, "there is time and season [to learn] anything" (Ecclesiastes 3:1, slightly paraphrased).
4
As someone who went through a terrible divorce after a 25-year marriage, I can empathize with the writer. In many ways, we write our stories to heal ourselves. The private relationship I had with my ex didn’t map to the public one. He had an intimate relationship with a “friend” over many years and because I was in love with him, the way I coped with it was never talking about it to anyone. The pain of that affair finally burst through when I realized he’d been seeing the woman he eventually married long before I knew we were done. The truth is we were done many years before and I chose not to see it.
In my case, I moved, went back to school to earn an MFA, and I now write, and rewrite, serve in the community and spend time with new friends
Memoir writing would be impossible if we couldn’t confront the demons inside us and the people we love or once loved. So might some of the best fiction writing.
I write for myself but also for others who stay silent as I did.
I wish the writer well in her journey.
28
I wish my own parents had been less up front about their divorce and the details of their relationship and why it dissolved. It brought be absolutely no comfort and I am troubled by it even more now that I have my own young family.
496
@Lauren H. I'm not saying it is in your case, but it can be a form of narcissistic seduction for parents to overshare details about their relationships even with adult children.
56
I don't know why adults think that their children are entitled to the details of their parents intimate or personal adult relationships. Your children have no rights or responsibility regarding the relationship of their parents. Involving them places a burden of deciding who is to blame for the breakdown of the marriage. A romantic relationship is strictly the business of the adults involved, and they should realize that children, even adult children, are not privy to, nor entitled to the details of the relationship
468
@Jasmine This woman doesn't really care about what her children are "entitled" to, whatsoever. She cares about herself, period. It's all ME, ME, ME...and my future book deal.
53
@Jasmine I recall, at age 35, asking my mother, a gregarious, warm hearted, fun loving woman, if she was a virgin when she married my rather serious, dour father. She replied it was none of my business....and indeed it wasn't.
85