Let's ban all games. It's a slippery slope. One day you're attacking your opponent's bishop with your knight, the next, you're blowing people away in Call of Duty. And then it's all downhill from there.
29
Why write “despite little evidence” in the headline when there is zero evidence?
10
Of course, the international data on gun ownership presented by the Times showed no statistical correlation. Only that the US is an outlier. Virtually proof of the absence of relationship. NY Times, what’s the R value? Please supplement with approprate stats.
1
Spineless, brainless, profiles in lack of character are the republican NRA fishmongers. I think everyone should be allowed into the capital and white house with all the guns and ammunition they can carry. Why should politicians and discredited supreme court be safe behind metal detectors and guards when the rest of us and school children have to take our chances out on the street.
Let them take their chances with the gun laws they have given to the rest of us.
10
Duh, politicians are going to say they blame the white, uneducated, gun toting conservatives?
4
Should I run someone over and seriously hurt or kill that person, my legal defense will be:
I didn’t run that person over.....
my car did it.
23
What the studies on the link between video game violence and real world violence don't capture is how these games might affect young men who become schizophrenic, with its associated paranoia. Schizophrenia typically doesn't manifest in males until their late teens and early twenties. If such a person has been playing hyper-realistic, hyper-violent, first-person-shooter video games since their early teens, how will their behavior be affected?
To understand how these games might desensitize a newly paranoid individual to violent mayhem please check out this video of ultra-violent 'Call of Duty' gameplay:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cgzDK1vKQKc
6
Lazy, stupid scapegoating from a party that knows very well that guns are the problem, but who never fail to take every opportunity to send this country further in the abyss.
7
Title is bothsiderism. It’s GOP, not pols, who point to video games. Editors, get it right.
2
Blaming violent video games is a rhetorical distraction that targets the aging GOP demographic. Boomers can’t relate to video games like the under 40 crowd can, so this distraction works on them. Notice how there is no mention of violence in movies, tv shows, books etc. They would smell the bull if the scapegoat involved the media their demographic is most likely to consume.
Also, If the shooter was a Mexican immigrant and killed a bunch of “real Americans” you know damn well we wouldn’t be talking about video games. It would be walls, ICE, MS-13, “and I assume, some of them are good people” etc.
16
What if we simply taxed guns to pay the total social cost of gun-murder and also pay to promote gun safety and allowed victims to sue gun makers when they sell to the mentally ill?
9
The American College of Surgeons issued a detailed report on gun violence in our Country last year. They have worked diligently to get your elected officials to do something as simple as fund science based research into gun violence. To see what really does contribute and what might reduce it. Please demand that your elected officials, especially the Republicans move forward quickly with these efforts. The time for “praying for the victims and their families “ rings hollow , hypocritical and immoral if they don’t act. This President unfortunately continues to tweet and lie, not caring about determining fact or truth. He enable domestic terrorists. He puts you, your children and your grandchildren at risk.
6
Using Japan and South Korea to prove video games have no effect is nonsense. Their most popular video games are Nintendo and FIFA. Call of Duty and other real-life shooter games haven't even been in the top 50 games until this year.
To my knowledge, there hasn't been a study specifically done on real-life shooter games effect on the mentally unstable. Until there is, claiming video games don't have an effect on our epidemic is irresponsible. To say that Wreck it Ralph and other cartoons only moderately increases aggressive behavior does nothing to convince me there is no effect of our teenagers growing up on Call of Duty, with real-looking people with real guns shooting other real people out a kitchen window around a school bus. Come on, you don't have to be a psychologist to see a correlation there. Any parent that has winced at her 12-year old casually shooting other people knows there is likely a correlation. This generation grew up shooting real people every day. That's not okay and you are ignorant if you can't see that.
Yes, gun availability trumps all causes because without availability you can't even study the other causes. But the fact that you can't study other causes doesn't mean the other causes don't exist.
6
But of science based research on the subject will be denied. No research about guns is allowed in the USA.
3
I think it's time we take a hard look at the 'Experts.'
Not only is there countless 'experts' telling us violent video games are not dangerous, we also have countless 'experts' telling us that it's ok for children to spend time on social medial.
Both of these fine pastimes are doing serious damage to our society.
Any study that just looks at video games to measure how it is possibly instilling violent notions in children and young men is useless without including virtually every form of entertainment available.
Violence is not just in video games. It seems that the main topic in most movies and television shows is some form of killing, maiming, raping, kidnapping, and most of all GUNS, GUNS, GUNS. Try and count the number a beautiful model-actor/actresses pointing large long powerful military style weapons. It would take you months to do so. And yes most of them are supposedly liberals or progressives. HAHAHAH.
And then ad that mess to the what's happening in the real world and you have a 24 hour news feed of horror. Which of course is the number two most common plot point - HORROR.
I was recently with some friends who gave their ten year old daughter an iPhone and taught her how to access every possible form of media. That is SICK. And when she started talking about Hurricane Erick heading towards Hawaii I wanted to pull it from her tiny hands and smash it to bits.
Bottomline in my thesis is - First let's kill all the Experts.
2
some (GOPers all) politicians seem to deny science, data and comparative statistics in their rush to fall over backwards so as not to admit that it is the availability and sheer astounding numbers of GUNS that are SOLELY to blame.....
2
Something that has become imminently clear in the past few days is that there are a lot of people who want to redirect the conversation away from both guns and white privilege. My Facebook feed is filled with people falling all over themselves to proclaim that it's not about guns and that racism isn't a problem. Video games, violence, hate, mental illness, even prayer in school; anything other than guns. It is the same Venn Diagram of people who refuse to consider the idea that white privilege exists. They are all about how non-racist they are, but the reason they cannot acknowledge the possibility of white privilege is that if it truly does exists then they have been on the beneficial end of it. Acknowledging that guns are a problem is akin to acknowledging that white privilege exists, and that acknowledgement is oppressive for those accustomed to its privilege.
6
This headline is curious. This is while most all Democrats and much of media blames Mr. Trump for speeches that they link to extremists who commit violent acts! While I am no Mr. Trump fan, this is hypocritical. It's obvious to me that, like Mr. Trump's speeches, these violent video games desensitize and destabilize a few lonely people off their marginal mental stability, leading them to cause violent acts that they otherwise would not have committed.
5
Weren't we just celebrating the Fortnite World Cup in Queens?
6
Well, the one thing we know for sure is, these shootings don't have anything to do with guns. Right, Marion Hammer?
5
The outcome variable in the study was depressive symptoms, not violence - but playing video games had the least significant negative impact on 7th to 11th graders in Canada in the study that inspired this article - https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/life-refracted/201907/does-more-time-spent-screens-lead-depressionhttps://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/life-refracted/201907/does-more-time-spent-screens-lead-depression
2
Why isn't this article titled "Video Games Aren't Why Shootings Happen. Republicans Still Blame Them"?
Democrats have not made that claim since Parkland.
2
If playing video games were the problem, Japan would be the king of mass shootings. But Japan has no guns. We have over 300 million.
13
The madness continues - the GOP is determined to do ANYTHING by doing NOTHING to stop this carnage. People play violent video games around the world and yet have very little gun violence (Japan buys more video games than the U.S. and I believe their gun deaths are in the single digits). So what could possibly be the difference? Oh I know, the access to killing machine assault weapons. Of course it's the guns. How can these NRA supported politicians sleep at night? How can they look the other way while hundreds of innocent citizens are slaughtered in stores, churches, clubs, schools, offices, etc? It just keeps happening and the fact that the GOP won't even mention guns shows how controlled they are by the NRA. VOTE these people out. There is no excuse not to VOTE in 2020. We have to change this - my kids deserve to live in a nation where they don't have to worry about being shot to death because they want go out in public. Gun rights? What about THEIR rights not to get shot??
5
This article should have at least referenced The New York Times journalists Dirk Johnson and James Brooke. When covering the Columbine massacre in 1999, Johnson and Brooke pushed the theory that video games caused mass shootings. Their work today is, of course, patently risible. Nevertheless, we must cope with their ideational legacy.
For curious readers, I invite you to read one infamous article titled "Portrait of Outcasts Seeking to Stand Out From Other Groups" (April 22, 1999) in which Johnson and Brooke examined the Columbine killers' add-on levels in video games such as Doom and Quake in order to gain insight into their killers' motives:
http://www.nytimes.com/library/national/042299colo-school-suspects.html
1
Playing a video game for 10 hours a day won't push a shooter to action but hearing a 5 second clip of Trump will? It's either both are possible or neither are.
5
The President is an idolized authority figure. And it’s real life. That’s the difference.
2
In the 50's it was comic books. Rock n Roll in the 60's, disco in the 70's, movies in the 80's, and video since. I guess when you can't deal with the truth, you find a boogeyman.
7
I've played "violent" video games since the days of Wolfenstein 3D, Doom circa 30 years ago. 1,000's of hours
No detrimental effects as far as I can see
Though, I do recall the only drawback is that I did date less in my 20's for all the time behind the keyboard, however that could also be tied to my lacklustre personality. Ok, not really detrimental
What else?
If I ever have the urge to go shooting, its with my DSLR camera and its usually giant piles of dirt and the spaces of air surrounding them that are my targets...so... nope
Oh, yes!
We do own a rifle-like gun at home but its one of those plastic ones you get from Bass Pro and load up with salt to shoot flies with. Certainly haven't felt the urge to mow down the colony of gnats congregating around the fruit bowl.. so.. no..
Is any of this actually relevant?
Probably not, like the connection of real world violence and video games
1
Cowabunga, dude! It's the 90s again!
It feels so good to be a teenager! Watching some "Saved by the Bell" and TMNT, hang out at the comic book store and Blockbuster Video!! Oh yeah, and old people blaming video games for everything. RADICAL!
4
Video games may not have anything to do with white nationalist terrorism but they're still a dreadful waste of time and a poor substitute for real play and relationships.
Video games are definitely to blame.
Or was it heavy metal?
Movies, definitely movies. Been downhill since Rambo. No, wait, gangster rap. Definitely MTV.
3
So the only thing that can stop a bad guy with a copy of "Grand Theft Auto 3" is a good guy with a copy of "World of Warcraft"?
11
The author notes that people in Korea and Japan spend more on video games than in the US, but we don't see an epidemic of mass shootings there. It's also important to note that while the US has many more gun suicides per capita than Japan or Korea, both of those countries have higher suicide rates than the US, despite the absence of guns. Using the same logic, one can therefore conclude that there is no correlation between guns and suicide.
Similarly, there are more guns in the US than people. The likelihood that any one of them will be used in a mass shooting in any given year is less than 0.00001%. The likelihood that a black person will kill someone (based on a black population of about 15% of the US population and about 2500 murders by blacks per year) is about 0.005%. So if we want to base decisions on statistics, blacks are more of a threat than guns - a clearly nonsensical conclusion.
The problem is that mass shootings are sufficiently rare that there is likely little correlation with anything. I suspect that everyone of the mass shooters ate a banana sometime in his life. So to paraphrase Dr. Ferguson "The data on bananas causing mass shootings is about as conclusive" as that on guns.
6
Identifying the causes and finding potential solutions are a long-term goal but, in the short term, there is something the USA could do that would mitigate the end result of whatever it is that causes people - and it is mostly white males - to commit random, violent acts.
The UK and Australia banned all semi-automatic weapons and all handguns after horrific incidents which pale in comparison compared to what you routinely suffer. Our countries both still have physical assaults and violence, knife crime and acid attacks but would you rather an assailant arrived at your child's school with a kitchen knife, a baseball bat or an AR-15 with an extended capacity magazine?
Ideally you don't want assailants turning up at all but consider that a longer-term outcome with heated debates on surveillance and privacy.
Our countries both still allow gun ownership (breech-loading sporting shotguns mostly) but you must provide proof to the authorities that you need one (self defence is not accepted) and you must provide proof that they can be safely stored. Your background will be investigated in depth by our security services.
It's not my place to moralise or tell Americans how they should react. Culturally you are very different from Australia and the UK (despite us sharing the language) but our politicians didn't spend time hand-wringing and looking for cultural scapegoats for the problem.
They accepted it existed and fixed it. They didn't laughably blame video games.
2
I read an interesting newspaper article, between ten and fifteen years ago, summarising the results of some Japanese researchers investigating the effects of video gaming on the development of the frontal cortex in teenagers and young adults. I think they were using MRI. The article did not specify violent video games, just any games.
They found that intensive video gaming interfered with the making of necessary neuronal connections and maturation of the frontal cortex. One of the functions of that region is ‘. . . override and suppression of socially unacceptable response,’ according to Wikipedia.
It is a reasonable assumption that violent video gaming is damaging the frontal cortices of youngsters, promoting antisocial behaviour and imprinting violent messages.
2
Before video games, they blamed role playing games like Dungeons and Dragons for the decline of youth. Before that, they blamed comic books. Before that, movies and radio. Before that, they actually blamed novels in the 19th century for our collective debasement. Socrates is said to have criticised young people for preferring conversation to exercise.
6
If young men who play violent video games are more likely to commit violent acts and mass shootings, then why don't the millions of people who watch violent movies do the same? There is no direct correlation between fantasy violence in entertainment and real-life violence. But there is definitely a correlation between easy access to guns without universal background checks and gun violence. That's why a vast majority of Americans want such checks to be made the law of this land, in all 50 states...
23
I find it interesting that video games are popular world wide, especially among the young. It's also interesting that mental health problems are also global. But mass shootings are an epidemic in the United States. Gee, whats the one ingredient of this carnage to explain that disparity?
21
This is a difficult statistical problem, and one this article seems to gloss over with one perspective.
That is, if you try to find a correlation between everyone who plays video games and violence, I agree, you likely won't. Lots of people play these games and never go on a rampage. However, that doesn't mean they don't have an impact. A far more difficult study would be to compare a mentally unstable person likely to commit this type of crime who DOES play violent video games, with the same type of person who DOES NOT. That would answer whether exposure to violent video games makes a person more likely to get violent.
Regardless, even if it is a factor (I believe it is but respect others who may disagree), it clearly is not the only factor. Would anyone seriously be confident that solely by banning these games we would stop these tragedies? There are dozens of actions I would like to see taken first which would have a much larger impact.
13
This story provides a very flawed review of the topic by only talking to Chris Ferguson and James Ivory, who do a poor job of representing the scientific consensus on this topic. The vast majority of experts who conduct media violence research agree that video game violence increases aggressive behavior (see Bushman, Golwitzer, & Cruz, 2015). By far the largest meta-analysis of violent video games to date (of which I'm a co-author) found that such games lead to increased aggression (Anderson, Shibuya, Ihori, Swing, Bushman, Sakamoto, Rothstein, & Saleem, 2010). The link with violent acts is less strong and I doubt any experts would feel comfortable attributing a particular violent crime to a single risk factor such as violent video games.
That said, the literature shows that the same risk factors that predict mild physical aggression also predict violence. Violent acts are the result of multiple converging risk factors, of which violent video games are just one. Their potential to increase aggression has been advanced in policy statements of the American Psychological Association, the American Psychiatric Association, the American Medical Association and the American Academy of Pediatrics. Extreme violent acts have many causes and violent video games alone will not produce such acts. Nevertheless, it's irresponsible and scientifically incorrect to dismiss violent video games as a factor in violent acts.
12
@Edward Swing
After thorough research and investigation, over two decades, no evidence of causative factors between violent video games and violent acts has been established.
It would be irresponsible and scientifically incorrect NOT to dismiss violent video games as a factor in violent acts.
8
@Justin There are indeed many studies and they were conducted across a much longer timespan than two decades. Meta-analysis is a method for statistically combining the results of many studies to arrive at a single, consensus answer. The meta-analysis I cited above is by far the largest on this topic to date. We found that violent video games do increase aggression. Simply saying otherwise doesn't change the facts.
2
It has no causal relationship. Video games are worldwide but gun violence us only in the States.
4
In his book, On Killing: The Psychological Cost of Learning to Kill in War and Society, Davis Grossman lists the ways in which the US Military de-sensitizes young adults (especially young males) to the inherent aversion to killing other human beings. Graphic videos, battle video games, and sloganeering are all used during Basic Training and AIT to change the way the human brain views the killing of other humans.
Grossman cites peer reviewed studies of the correlation between the de-sensitizing effects of watching graphic violence in games and videos, and the willingness to kill a human. Grossman also cites US military statistics proving the efficacy of training using graphic images, videos and games. He also points out that this training is done under strict supervision which is missing in civilian life. To deny the roles of watching/playing graphically violent video is foolish. De-sensitization through watching graphic violence should not be dismissed as a root cause of mass shootings
Grossman also writes that AR/AK type weapons have no place in civilian society.
9
@Sam 6 + 3 Maximum 6 bullets per magazine and a minimum of 3 second delay to change a magazine. Retrofit old magazines
1
@Sam
But you are conflating "being desensitized to violence" with perpetrating a mass shooting. They are most certainly not the same thing.
Video games, movies, books, etc. exist in all countries around the world, but only in a very small number are mass shootings a regular occurrence.
2
Give this book a read to understand a view that video games can be a factor in this.
“On Killing: The Psychological Cost of Learning to Kill in War and Society” by dave grossman. The only reason, no but this book is an interesting read on the topic. He is a former army ranger and taught psychology at west point
3
This is how I know with absolutely certainty that people blaming video games for mass shootings are wrong: number of people killed in mass shootings by a video game - zero; number of people killed in mass shootings by a gun - dozens or hundreds every year.
1
This article states that "If video games did indeed cause some mass shootings, one might expect such events to be common in Japan or South Korea" and almost immediately points out "both of which have very strict laws limiting gun ownership" without making the ridiculously obvious observation that second point invalidates the first.
9
@APH Well, according to the NRA and Republicans, strict gun laws don't matter because criminals will always get their guns.
By that logic, violent video games would still cause more shootings in Japan and South Korea.
13
@APH
"without making the ridiculously obvious observation that second point invalidates the first."
No it doesn't, it makes the exactly correct point- Video games are not to blame for mass shootings- extremely relaxed gun laws are.
11
The precise source doesn't immediately come to mind, but I am certain that some respected, peer-reviewed research has established that at least some so called "violent video/computer games" have the effect of decreasing personal aggression and violence. Apparently the stimulation can function as an outlet, relieving frustration and hostile impulses. In any event, blaming computer games for politically motivated violence is an obvious attempt to deflect attention from the political hostility at the core of hard-right conservatism.
3
The cycle is familiar: Shooting happens, pro-gun leaders blame video games, media responds with articles quoting scientists and declare there's no evidence. Fine, video games are not the cause. Yet the same media outlets, led - especially this time - by the Times, state or imply over and over again, with absolutely no evidence, that Trump's rhetoric is to blame. Where are the scientific studies? There are none, of course. Declaring Trump to be the cause of the El Paso shooting is even flimsier than blaming video games.
2
@Jason B
If you interpret the El Paso shooting as a political act, which is how the shooter characterized it, doesn't it make sense to look for a connection in the political rhetoric that dominates the media environment?
7
@Jason B. A person has to be willfully ignorant not to connect Trump’s years-long screeching messages of hate of the other not to connect the murderer’s screed on the “invasion” to Trump.
3
@Jason B
Really? the shooter echoed the virulent attacks on Hispanic "invaders" The president has been pushing since his first day in office and you see no connection? I see no connection between Islamic militants saying they should attack the United States and 9/11 where is the proof for that. WORDS MATTER and the Presidents own words (and actions) have specifically targeted Hispanic immigrants and two shooters in a week left behind extensive trails of believing the US was being "Invaded" and something had to be done about it.
3
Dan Patrick implored the federal government to do something about video games. Well McCarthy and Trump are part of the federal government. McCarthy can introduce a bill to make video gaming a crime, confiscate all current games, block all games on the internet, arrest anyone involved in the production of games, etc. He can do it today. Likewise, Trump can issue one of his executive orders so that it would happen immediately. On the other hand, why doesn't Patrick call for the Texas legislature to make anti-video game laws? Why should he have to wait for the feds?
But wait! How many Republican senators, congressmen/women, presidents, governors, etc. have been using this same wild-eyed, unsubstantiated argument for over 20 years? How many of them have introduced legislation? Could I confidently say - zero?
Based on the history of this argument and their inaction, I would have to guess that they do not believe their own argument. Since the rhetoric and the actions do not jive, it makes one wonder.
2
@Rocky Exactly. If the Republicans truly think it's solely mental health or solely video games, then do something about them!
It's obvious they don't.
1
Guns without video games are still going to kill more people than video games without guns, as shown by the rest of the countries with large video game-playing populations.
I'll be the first gamer to admit that gaming culture has problems; it's a hotbed of toxicity and racism/sexism without many of the guardrails that more mainstream spaces have. The thing is, plenty of those mainstream spaces are also currently corrupted, but they have the blessings of our institutions and politicians.
2
I think it's strange how how conservatives so quickly buy into the "guns are inanimate objects, so they CAN'T be responsible, so stop trying to vilify them" logic, then immediately turn around and blame video games which are also inanimate objects and even less related to any shooting that has ever happened.
26
@Gaius
Another argument that pops up: that the millions of gun owners who do not commit shootings shouldn't be punished for the actions of the minority that do.
Shouldn't the same logic follow for video games?
1
The data on bananas causing suicide may be inconclusive, but there is no doubt about the combination of lawless banana republics and gun violence causing death.
It defies credulity that massive numbers of people aren't rising up to demand the banning and outlawing of all assault weapons in non-military hands. In case you don't know it - enhanced background checks would not have prevented the two latest disasters. Many evil and/or deranged minds are undetected and simply missing from databases until it is too late. They can only cause carnage with access to guns, so these guns are the problem. If the law made access tio weapons much more difficult, the slaughter would go way down.
13
@Mark
You suggest banning all "assault weapons". Let me ask you this: What is an assault weapon? The answer: there is no agreed upon definition. Half the things that are mentioned in some states' definitions don't even affect how deadly they are, they just *look* more intimidating.
For example, the Colt AR-15 was subject to the restrictions of the 1994 Assault Weapons ban; the Ruger Mini-14 was not. These two guns had the same caliber and similar length, and both held a 30 round magazine. They were equally deadly, despite only one of them being an "assault weapon".
The term is meaningless.
2
Thanks you so much for this article - I spent a weekend with my very conservative sister who keep on blaming video games for the El Paso and Dayton shootings. IT was pretty tiresome to say the least.
22
@ROK
You know what is really tiresome. Listening to liberals accuse their well meaning conservative family of being to ignorant to understand the complexities of gun violence.
Wake up Mr Progressive - Our culture in inundated with violence in every form of media. Not just video games. It's everywhere.
And children have more access than ever to all of it 24/7, whooo hooo. Now that can't be bad right?
It’s not that complex. Young men and watch video games all over the world. Gun massacres happen in the USA. Americans love their guns—far more than they love their children. Obviously
3
These "experts" should try living in a house where violent video game play induces screaming profanity, holes in walls and doors, destroyed furniture and computer equipment, and actual threats to parents within minutes of conclusion of play. Do that instead of depending on useless second and third data from published reports - get your data live and in-person. Unfortunately, I did. My post-thirty stepson moved in with us ten years ago after losing two jobs due to violent language in person, in-person, and on-line via Twitter, Facebook, and job-search sites. He lost two semi-auto rifles (AK-47 and AR-15 replicas) to a SC pawn shop because he could not pay the loans. Thankfully. After several months of the aforementioned behavior, I spoke to him about it leading to a violent, abusive argument during which he said he could easily kill a human being - looking straight at me. He stopped his threats when I told him that it's not so easy to pull the trigger for a sane person even when faced with an attack in wartime as I was during a real shooting war. But face-to-face with someone who can fight you, shoot at you, kill you, you run out of options in seconds. You also face an even, sometimes uneven, chance of being the dead one. The argument ended with a huff. Since he could not afford a new gaming system when he destroyed his, he has calmed down over the past nine or so years, gotten several decent jobs, and married. He is more civil and respectful to his family and employers.
7
@Angelsea every other country in the world has these violent videogames too. Gun violence is only a problem in the US. Guess what only exists in the US too? The second amendment.
Sounds like your post-thirty stepson has social or mental issues, the videogames were not the cause. Your assertion that 9 years without a gaming console was the reason for this improved behavior is laughable at best.
9