"Democrats could pursue impeachment, but it would be to make a symbolic point."
Yet it just might rally people who do not normally vote to get off the sofas and/or disinter their noses from their electronic devices and put an end to this crooked, vulgar idiot.
11
I fully agree that impeachment must be explored, now.
If the Democrats are not serious about it, they will seem gutless.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Gutsy leaders like Trump make news, all the time
Trump was elected because he had guts and Hillary did not.
Obama was no drama and Hillary was boring compared to Trump.
Democracy, itself, requires courage and immediate action.
"Eternal vigilance is the price of liberty" (Att. Jefferson and others)
"Democracy is coming to the USA" (Leonard Cohen, song)
"Sail on, sail on, oh mighty ship of state." ("Democracy")
7
@Harry Pearle: what and who you consider one of “guts”:
1. A draft-dodging swell who mocks the memory of a North Vietnam-tortured POW
2. A white “movement “ racist who calls genocidalist white racist movements/terrorists “fine people”
3. A serial rapist/sexual abuser of women.
4. A serial liar ( 9000 lies + since 2017)
5. A serial bankrupt.
6. A serial scofflaw
7. A serial violator of the Rule of Law
8. A serial violator of the Constitution.
9. A proven mountebank
10. An unindicted conspirator by any other name with America’s prime adversary
Your contemptible animus against fact, Truth, Reality makes you a contemptible figure.
3
Amen! Trump’s incessant, pathological lying alone should be solid grounds for impeachment. He is a disgrace to his office and our nation. We should be ashamed that he has remained in office as long as he has. A prosecutor who declines to take a well-founded case to trial unless he or she is sure the jury will convict is a coward and should find another line of work. I believe that many of those who sat out the 2016 election are looking for someone who has the spine to fight for them against demagogues like Trump. It is time for the House of Representatives to show that it has what it takes.
12
Impeachment won't be necessary -- he'll walk away first.
Besides that, he is not mentally or physically well. That is not just a mere stating of the obvious, it is physiological fact.
He is acting brave in his public persona, but I guarantee you, the nights are even more sleepless, and there is tremendous fear, including among all family members involved.
6
We can only hope.
3
There remains the argument that his entrenched followers do not care about his criminality, his corruption, and his general contempt for the rule of law. They might be more concerned with ethnic purity, with tax cuts, with conservative judicial appointments. It is hard to see pure politics as a force to unite us in the near future. Maybe it is better to vote him out of office. Maybe it is better to have Congress work on student debut relief, making a fairer tax code, building infrastructure and fixing immigration.
3
@JSK: this is not a show for his supporters. This is reality. He’s committed impeachable offenses and should not get a pass because of the political climate in the senate.
6
This president actively tried to obstruct an investigation into Russia's attack on our electoral process- an attack by a hostile military unit on the very foundation of democracy.
This president tried to stop that investigation for the sole reason that he didn't want us-- americans, the world- to know that his campaign wanted and sought that help every step of the way.
This president needs to be impeached and removed from office.
The case is sound, the cause is just.
20
If Trump is not impeached, we will have two very different standards for impeachment.
Impeach Republicans
- Hire burglars to undermine an election
- Lie about it and obstruct justice
Do Not Impeach Republicans
- Sell arms to terrorists
- Take the profits from those arms sales and use them to finance right wing paramilitary death squads in violation of Congressional vote
- Lie about it, obstruct justice and pardon criminals
- Cooperate with Russian efforts to undermine an election
- Lie about it and obstruct justice
Impeach Democrats
- Disgustingly take advantage of your office for sexual satisfaction
- Lie about it and obstruct justice
Do Not Impeach Democrats
- Wear a tan suit (whew, close call)
17
Immoral, insane, incompetent, malicious, dishonest, devious, rude, lecherous -- how much more proof do we need? Trump is a really, really bad employee who wouldn't be hired at any of his own companies. He should be fired immediately.
81
I am old enough to remember Watergate and the investigations within Congress that led to the resignation of Richard Nixon. I am still disgusted that Pres. Ford--a man never elected by the nation--pardoned Nixon and allowed him to escape full justice. It galls me to think that this Congress is seriously considering foregoing impeachment for fear of political fallout. This is not a question of politics to me; it is a question of right and wrong. As a nation, we absolutely cannot condone allowing a candidate to be elected because he and his campaign knowingly allowed a hostile foreign government to criminally assist him. The fact that the successful candidate then flagrantly obstructed the investigation into the repugnant campaign activity only makes it worse. Even Nixon would never have stooped that low. Even Nixon showed remorse and some level of humility, and resigned for the good of the country. Trump has no concern whatsoever for this country and its institutions. Impeach!
5
How / Why did Mueller go from the most trusted and dedicated of all investigators --- to oops, we don't like what you wrote. If he did not find evidence to conclude there was an obstruction why in heaven's name would anyone else --- much less with an objective point of view.
Let us please put self righteousness aside.
Let he who has not sinned cast the first stone.
The problem with impeachment is that it distracts from the "kitchen table" issues and infrastructure that have been neglected for a half decade. Policy needs making and Trumpian assaults on clean air and water and as well as human rights and voting rights are clear and present dangers to the Republic and need to be combated now. Impeachment will take months and it will involve diving into the weeds of Trumpian falsehoods and misdirection. The mud flying around impeachment will clog the atmosphere of our politics and confuse the public at a time when we need to wind hearts and minds over to the clear and present work of winning the next election and that badly needs doing much more than impeaching the lawless clown in the white house.
The word impeachment is so charged with emotion its meaning is continually being obscured. The phrase "impeachable offense" itself misleads. Any offense can be used to impeach a president. Any. Salacious activity in the Oval Office --or was it lying about it? that got Clinton impeached. Firing a cabinet member is what got President Johnson impeached after the Civil War. Choose your offense, just so it can be sold as a high crime or misdemeanor. Stand up and be counted as a defender of morals and democracy Mr. Bouie, but I for one would rather be wise tactically and avoid the obvious outcome of impeachment: Trump remains in office, strengthened by the Democrats being defeated. To think such a defeat would somehow translate into Democrat power is naive. The Republicans are not the least afraid of impeachment because they'll be able to achieve their subversive goals more efficiently under the diversion of all consuming impeachment proceedings. But there is one other possibility, not envisioned because it seems at this point too unlikely. Suppose impeachment succeeds in persuading the nation, including Republicans,that Trump must go, and the Republicans are cornered and have to dump Trump. Where are we then? The perception of Republican turpitude would be mitigated or erased, Pense would be President and likely be elected in 2020. Are you willing to accept that danger for the sake of a symbolic act that makes you feel good about yourself? Not me!
How did President Trump not protect and defend the Constitution? How was he a “traitor”?
Remember he had the combination of FISA- spying and Mueller’s team dominated by Clinton attorneys all digging into his and his family’s entire lives, phone calls, emails, texts and full unrestricted access to staff and records.
Does that sound like someone trying to hide something?
And after two years of Obama allowing Russians to attack America, two years of the surveillance and deep dive into every niche of Trump’s life, and zero evidence of Russian collusion by anyone, all they found was some unofficial notes from meetings - words Trump said, not actions, from which Democrats have concocted the crimes of the century.
Sounds more like the propaganda of the century.
4
Attorney General Barr will be an obstacle to overcome, and Congressional hearings seem to me the best way around interference by this compromised and unethical AG.
It's my belief that Special Counsel Mueller anticipated lacking funds, lacking support for any investigation going forward, from this old friend, whose defects he knew as well as his strengths.
Impeachment hearings are not as limited as Special Counsel investigations, but they are not as wide-ranging as required to deal with the financial crimes committed by our kleptocrats, in sync with Russian and Middle-Eastern kleptocrats. Let's push for investigations first. Let impeachment be underway after at least six months of information-heavy investigations by the House of Representatives.
Meanwhile, let's hope Barr can't hinder the counter-intelligence probe.
1
I can only add my complete agreement with this writer in regard to this matter.
If the Congress fails to begin impeachment proceedings, it will in effect be condoning the actions and behaviour of this President and will have created a new precedent for what Americans will tolerate from their President.
7
I suggest the House consider these “high crimes and misdemeanors” as impeachable offenses
1. Obstructing justice
2. Using his office for financial gain
3. Conspiring to defraud the United States
4. Advocating physical and police violence
5. Posing a threat to national security
6. Insulting our allies and lowering our standing in the world
7. Abusing his powers
8. Engaging in reckless conduct
9. Attempting persecution of political opponents
10. Disregard for the rule of law
11. Lacking empathy and simple human decency required of his office
12. Committing perjury for tax an financial disclosure forms
13. Filing fraudulent tax returns
14. Denying immigrants’ right to due process
15. Illegally separating children from their parents
16. Violating campaign finance laws
17. Suborning perjury and threatening witnesses
18. Attacking the First Amendment rights of free press and free speech
19. Failing to see that “the laws are faithfully executed”
20. Engaging in a daily fusillade of lies, misrepresentations, and misleading and erroneous facts
21. Being unfit for the office of president in accordance with Federalist #68 (Hamilton)
"It will not be too strong to say, that there will be a constant probability of seeing the station filled by characters pre-eminent for ability and virtue."
22. Trump has a psychotic narcissistic personality disorder (see DSM-5) and acts like an autocrat. He should not under any circumstances be allowed to be president.
8
The standards you walk past are the standards you accept.
5
Read Joe Lockhart's column just above you own in today's NYT - don't impeach; he and his cronies have enough rope to hang themselves
What if, like the Mueller Report, an impeachment process would continue and sustain the "reality" of Mueller, a reality that none of wants to stare in the face and admit and acknowledge - that Trump is simply unfit and deserves to be removed for the sake of America's soul? And after initiating the process, and if that reality does not die, but sinks in deeper and deeper - yes - energizing his base, but also inspiring other Republicans and independents to take the plunge and get into the primary? Republicans who have cast their lot with Trump may not change and are waiting and hoping for this report to go away in a few more news cycles. It is so damning, I am asking, how can the "reality" - the expose - remain present so that voters like me can actually understand what it means, what it may portend for America's future? What it means if "nothing" significant is done to change this slide into insignificance and permanent partisan divide? So, ponder. Impeachment. Could it be a process that would finally wake up America, shake it by the collar, and say - stop this insanity?
1
Written by a man who proclaimed before the January 2017 inauguration that Trump's election was illegitimate because he believed the Russians tipped the scales. Blinded by his obsession.
2
@johnlo The Mueller Report proves the Russians did tip the scales. It happened. This author was correct, not obsessed.
2
There is only one reason why most Democrats are dragging their feet on this; they are just as much corporate tools as the Republicans and don't want to upset their true masters with uppity activities.
Expect Biden to be the 'choice' in 2020.
As usual, the fix is in.
1
Impeach Trump now and look what you end up with in the White House. Out of the frying pan and into the fire.
1
On Sunday Elijah Cummings was one of the first members of Congress I have heard to stand up strongly for the responsibility of Congress to pursue an investigation Trump's actions as set out in the Mueller report. Thanks to Jamelle Bouie for expanding that call so thoroughly, and reminding us that impeachment occurs in two stages; investigation and creation of the articles of impeachment in the House and the actual trial in the Senate Knowing that the removal of the president is nigh onto impossible in the Republican Senate should not be a bar to investigation. If in our own lives we only undertook activities we knew we would win, then individually and collectively we would be in a very sorry state. The same is true of Congress. Failure to undertake an impeachment investigation because it might negatively impact the 2020 election, or because the Senate is unlikely to vote a conviction would be a disavowal of the values America supposedly stands for, and a fundamental and demoralizing failure of the system of checks and balances. My only fear is whether the Democrats are capable of such strength and clear minded purpose. Some are...too many are not.
2
It really should be self-evident by now that Trump is unfit and undeserving of the office he holds.
The debate the country should actually be having is among the following options:
Plan A - 25th amendment
Plan B - impeachment
Plan C - 2020 electoral defeat
When a corrupt and delusional clown occupies the office of president of the United States, it is irrational to merely bemoan the fact and hope that Plan C will remediate the situation.
3
I am glad that Jamelle Bouie is now a NYT opinion columnist. This column is well reasoned, thought-provoking, and beautifully written.
6
It's time for the pusillanimous democrats to actually do the job they were elected to do. Stop focus grouping everything and just act like adults and do your job. People will respect that, regardless of the outcome. Why is that so hard for politicians to understand? The dearth of courage is shameful.
3
Trump must be impeached regardless of what the senate might do. "conviction" is not the point.
Please remember that no US President in history who has been impeached, has ever been "convicted" by the senate, Not Andrew Johnson, not Clinton. Nixon was never impeached, but was forced from office by the threat of it.
The point is that the people's Congress must be a forceful part of the checks and balances against a President's abuse of office and no one in the history of our country has abused the office greater than the corrupt, vulgar Donald Trump.
It is imperative that Congress impeach this lying, corrupt, criminal Trump for his abuse of office for the long term sake of our democracy, and our three branch system of government.
Trump needs to leave office with a very well deserved stain on his time in office - impeachment-
Trump must be impeached as a matter of principle and as a clear signal to the next president, regardless of Party
P.s. If your looking for a conviction, you can feel some satisfaction that the NY southern district DA will start formal legal proceedings against Trump and his family the minute he's out of office for tax evasion, self dealing in his "charity", Russian money laundering .... and the list goes on and on. Hopefully then we’ll get what we all want - a conviction.
5
The overzealous announcements of the Democrats regarding the supposedly “horrible crimes” of Trump, of him being a “traitor”, and his “destruction of the Constitution” are all sounding more and more excessive and non-factual - like a last ditch effort - and frankly just over-emotional propaganda meant to meddle in our election.
3
Wow. Democrats would be overly zealous to hold Trump accountable for breaking his oath to protect and defend the Constitution when he willingly accepted help from Russia, a hostile foreign power, to become president. What happened to believing no one is above the law?
4
When the President takes the word of Putin over his own intelligence agencies, or similarly stands with MBS over our intelligence agencies, is he committing a high crime or misdemeanor?
The question is why is Trump acting as if he is afraid to stand up for the truth, as seen by our investigators. The Mueller report confirms the existence of a compromising tape of Trump held by persons associated with the Russian real estate conglomerate Crocus Group. Michael Cohen was made aware of that tape.
It is easy to speculate that Trump has been made aware of said tape - he may even have seen a copy - and been told to just say what he has been told to say or else the tape will be revealed.
If that be so, then Trump is, in Russian argot, a "useful idiot", or in English, an unwilling agent of a foreign power. Unwilling, but not unwitting...and clearly unfit to serve.
No, that's neither a high crime nor a misdemeanor, but still, if included as supporting evidence for his impeachment, would make for a stronger case.
4
Mr. Bouie hits the mark on every point. Including the consideration that caution is good when it comes to impeachment. But caution is one thing, timidity is another...and is not good. The process is playing out the way it should so far but if the Democrat-controlled House fails to do their job by backing down from impeaching a demonstrably justice-obstructing President because they fear the political risk, then they have no right to complain when that President and his subservient Republicans continue to subvert the Constitution and the institutions of the USA.
5
Congress should spare us the oversight charade.
The House of Representatives should vote tomorrow morning to impeach the president on grounds there are more Democratic representatives than Republican representatives.
Tomorrow afternoon, the Senate should vote to acquit the president on grounds there are more Republican senators than Democratic senators.
1
"Impeachment gives Democrats a real chance to seize the initiative."
The initiative toward what? Convincing a large part of the electorate that impeachment is nothing but political sour grapes? The outcome of the Mueller report has already convinced many that Trump's complaints about the special counsel investigation was just that, and that he didn't obstruct justice but defended himself from a purely political attack. Do you think the Dems will win any converts as a result of the Republican Senate refusing to convict him and remove him from office? Really?
Impeachment will be a waste of energy and time. He has only a little more than 18 months in office. If they Dems win the presidency they can undo much that he has done. The route to recovery from the Trump presidency is through superior politics, not political judicial action. Nancy Pelosi knows this, which is why she tries to damp the fires being set by political know-nothings.
Impeachment will only make our internal conflicts burn more intensely. The Dems will lose, and will lose their chance to narrow our divisions.
We need to impeach to tell the rest of the world:
-There are adults in the room
-We stand by our values
-We uphold our Constitution
-And, above all else, as Mueller noted, no one is above the law.
7
We shouldn't impeach a president cause we don't like the outcome of an election and that is all this is about. We can find a reason to impeach any president if we start with the premise the person is unfit to hold office. Democrats should focus on 2020 and presenting a platform of ideas rather than personal politics. I voted for Obama twice and Trump in 2016. I may vote for Trump again (strong economy & tough on China which is long overdue) but I can be persuaded by policy positions. Mayor Pete intrigues me, so does Bernie. Impeachment is the talk of sore losers who have run out of ideas.
1
"if presidential accountability of this sort is impossible under divided government — then Americans deserve to know. Then, at least, we can have a national discussion about what that means for the Constitution."
At this point, can there really be a national discussion on anything? Pursuing impeachment to vet our loyalty to the Constitution sounds grand but more likely it will further divide us and elevate Trump's argument that he is the victim here. If a voter is not already convinced Trump is corrupt and unfit for office, reading Mueller (which most trumpers haven't) isn't going to change anything. His fan club will simply dig in and Fox &Friends will beat their breasts and call it persecution. I'm with Nancy...he's not worth it.
2
This column is well thought out. But its most important sentence is near the end: "At worst, impeachment could crowd out the material case against Trump, centering the election on legal questions versus the impact of his presidency on people’s lives." That's some "at worst." The problem with impeachment is the danger that it will suck all the political and media energy out of the air, and the issues that could actually turn some Trump voters around -- what he's doing to the federal government and to working people -- will be shunted to the side. If there's an impeachment, it can't be allowed to obscure those issues.
The struggle to impeach him will draw away from the issues,
which are far more important, and willtake years. Instead, push for Universal Healthcare, a minimum wage of $15, free tuition in state colleges, and control the banks and their wild investments, which helped bring about the '08 debacle.
That should be the Lure.
1
@JFP You hit the nail on the head! Focus on the issues!
I think Democrats have to accept that impeachment and removal from office are separate. Clinton was impeached, but not removed from office. Johnson was impeached but not removed from office. I think the House owes it to the country to do its job and impeach Trump even if the Senate acquits. The Mueller Report reveals a president massively unqualified and unethical. To avoid impeachment based on political calculation is the equivalent of looking the other way. The House should not do that, even if the Senate abdicates its responsibility. Trump deserves to be remembered through history as the third president to be impeached.
5
The USA is our home, we live here and DJT is trying to burn it down or make it unlivable except for the super rich and their servants.
To survive as a constitutional democracy DJT must be removed from power. Those loyal to the Constitution, which exclude his supporters have two shots to do the job. The best is the 2020 election, which may be rigged by DJT's foreign sponsors, and a gift, the Mueller report which shows that DJT is a criminal and his crimes are impeachable.
Impeachment may not hit the bull's eye, but it might and even if it does not it will in the process damage him further in the coming election.
Democrats are thinking about wasting this shot and giving this criminal a reprimand. That would be political malpractice and a great victory for authoritarianism.
A trial in the Senate would put every GOP Senator running for reelection in danger of defeat. We have an illegitimate, criminal and self dealing, president who lies and deceives all the time and he should be impeached even if not convicted by his pals in the Senate.
It is the duty of the House to make it clear that no one, is above the law. The president is not a king. In 1776 we revolted against King George as our ruler and installed the rule of law in his place and we need to reject the Rule of Trump and the notion that he is the State.
3
The founders of our democracy wrote into the constitution that the House of Representatives is responsible to protect our Constitution from government officials who do not believe in the rule of law, do not believe in a free press or protecting our country and our elections from foreign interference.
This directive is not optional. It cuts to the heart and soul of our republic, a democracy that gives supreme power to the electorate and their representatives.
There is enough evidence that Trump has obstructed justice to warrant an impeachment investigation. Like a Grand Jury, an impeachment investigation is to decide whether or not our President should be indicted and put on trial. To not do so is to break the law by refusing to be responsible to the electorate
It is politics if house members choose to ignore this constitutional mandate. It is politics if it is about the 2020 election. If it is politics over ethics and responsibility in order to control the election, it is no better than Trump's illegal behavior.
3
Well stated as far as you go, but you have not looked to the next step: what is needed after Trump. The circumstances which led to Trump, argue for changes to law and culture that Americans can agree upon. Then the question shifts into: will impeachment help provide the information and foster the dialog that will lead to change? I tend to think it will, but think the argument needs to move past Trump and to the future.
1
Bouie seems to take for granted that if the Democrats push it, articles of impeachment would pass the House. Not necessarily. It might fail because some Democrats fail to vote for it, either out of principle or out of fear of the consequences in purple districts.
What could the principle be, you ask? The concept that impeachment is such a drastic step, it should not be taken without bipartisan support. Until Trump came along, that was the accepted wisdom. It ought still be.
Regardless whether you agree, progressives should consider what the political scene will look like if Democrats try for impeachment and can't get it through the House.
3
I think that Democrats need first, and immediately, to make a forceful statement about the very nature of the Mueller report--to counter the characterization put forward by AG Barr. The report is damning. The report details reprehensible, indeed unconstitutional behavior, behavior that is not acceptable to the American people. And therefore the House will amplify those findings on our behalf. A STRONG statement, rather than letting this appear to be a political calculation.
3
Sure, Jamelle. Sucking the country into a deranged adversarial mental state over a bogus treason accusation against a fairly elected president the Democrats despise; and then when the hoax is exposed, double down, change the subject and start the process all over again regarding a new dubious accusation. Demonize anyone who disagrees with you. Employ McCarthyite tactics accusing anyone who hasn't drunk the kool-aid of being an idiot or a traitor, making a big deal about Russian internet memes and hacking when your candidate lost, but when Obama was president and the same activities were occurring long before Trump, he looked the other way or dismissed it as not worth his time -- as he did all the time (remember ISIS was simply a JV terrorist team?). Demand impeachment of a president without proof of any crime; and so force the country to endure yet another fishing expedition hoping to find one somewhere in the minutia of the person's 70+ years of life while it drains the country of its energy and morale. And to add frosting on the cake, have your political candidates endorse the elimination of the Electoral College which would basically guarantee a second American civil war within a generation when the South and West in particular refuse to be permanently dominated by California and the Acela Corridor (which of course by amazing coincidence are the two biggest Blue Democrat areas). That'll certainly restore the moral health of the body politic.
6
I really admire this recitative, composed of taglines from Hannity and ending with the usual threats. The passage in which you linked a pack of lies about Obama to the fantasy of his helping ISIS was especially gorgeous.
There are simple and clear facts: Trump has shown a PATTERN of disregard for the Constitution, there are multiple instances of corrupt intent to end the investigation for personal gain, and a near total abdication as the commander and chief to face a threat to our country from a foreign power.
What else do you need?
Really!!! Stop being wimps Democrats. There will be no putting this genie back in the bottle if Congress does not live up to it's responsibility as a co-equal branch of government that is duty bound to provide oversight.
Do your jobs.
And the one thing the GOP is hoping for is to NOT have to actually vote on whether to impeach. They need to be on the record betraying their duty and country.
4
As Charles Blow has pointed out, neither previous case for impeachment led to conviction. Nonetheless both Andrew Johnson and Bill Clinton carry that stain into history. This president* deserves no less. It is the House’s responsibility to draw the line in the sand in support of the Constitution and the law. Let the Senate Republicans share the stain if they fail to convict. Their names will likewise live in infamy. One other point, no matter how energized this president’s* base is, they are still a minority. Impeachment isn’t going to get him any more supporters and the ones he has can only vote once.
3
The actions by Schiff and Nadler proves they are more interested in stroking their egos than governing.
3
Amen, Mr. Bouie.
2
Why have so many FBI seniors resigned under pressure or been fired the last few years?
Impeach, impeach, impeach - Now.
Or forever hold your silence Dems.
3
https://www.congress.gov/congressional-report/105th-congress/house-report/830
compare this to Mueller Report
1
Impeach or not, just be comforted by the fact that his portrait will hang in the WH for eternity.
1
Pelosi said she wouldnt go for impeachment because trump “isnt worth it”. He may not be worth it, but Dems have a habit of passively standing by while Rs shred the Cinstitution. They did it in 2000 when the SC appointed Bush, again when the Sec of State ran his own election victory for Governor of Georgia, and other times. No one else will stand up for the Constitution unless the Democratic Party does. It will make them winners, no matter what the Senate does, and heroes in the eyees ofmthe people.
I also think it is important to put an asterisk next to the names of Gorsuch and Kavenaugh (*appointed by POTUS charged with high crimes).
2
This is what Nancy Pelosi is doing. She wants to pursue congressional investigations that will be so damning that impeachment proceedings will have to be started. It's a good strategy. We all know how awful Trump is. Mueller just pushed the curtain back a little. Give her a chance to explore all avenues of corruption and wrongdoing and make a case in front of the American people. Mueller only looked at two things. There is much more and a good prosecutor in a real trial setting could prove obstruction. Trump has yet to be placed under that level of scrutiny.
A champion boxer does not flail away, wildy throwing punches. A true champion is a skilled tactician who sizes up the opponent, wears them down and then throws the knockout punch. She has just begun to wear him down.
10
I have read the 'redacted' Mueller report and it is a damning indictment of the president, his campaign, his associates and cronies. There is ample evidence of corrupt and criminal behaviour. We must demand that the House initiate articles of impeachment immediately.
3
Well written argument FOR impeachment!
4
Dems must go on offensive against GOP senators and reps. Make them comment on the President, not a process.
They have hidden and danced through their few comments talking about Mueller, investigation, etc.
it's easy for them to say they are against impeachment.
It would painful to speak against the president.
Hold their feet to the fire against this lying self-serving fear mongering 1950s nationalist.
p.s.
NYT... ditto.
We're counting on you like our future depends on it.... because it does
2
What is wrong with these elected democrats? Are they waiting for the roof to collapse before calling the fire department? What signs of corruption and obstruction do they need? If they can't handle Trump now then how are they going to handle the country? Democrats only know how to ask. Such a great strategy - keep asking so he can keep saying No! He is a racist, cheating, lying, sexist corrupt President that is bogged down in twitter drama with a junior high mentality. Yet only a few Democrats are willing to stand in his conflagration and face the barking dog. I'd rather have the bully in charge than the doormats. I swear if the democrats continue to lie down I will vote for Trump in 2020!
1
This is not an informative article by any means. Author is not saying "On the 1 hand this; on the other hand that, but here is my opinion and u, reader decide for yourself!"AG Barr declared that "all Americans should be appreciative that their president has been cleared of collusion,"despite 40 million dollars spent to prove otherwise by attorneys, some of whom were linked to, and actually worked for HRC in 2016. Time now to investigate the investigators, and the liberal media, including the Times gazette, and formulate the question: Why have we the taxpayers and citizenry been lied to for over 2 years?" Have they no integrity?Since the outset of the campaign in 2015 the left has been out to get Trump! Why? Perhaps because he is white, conservative, Christian, and stands up for America! Have we ever known a time when the economy has been so thriving, booming to the extent that it is now?Yet the left is not satisfied. It wants more, and even has doubts about Mueller himself. 1 cable t.v.host, reformed alcoholic--check it out--even accused the c-in-c of having dementia! Should not be too hard to figure out which 1. He became a police officer to avoid having to go to VN.(Nothing more vicious than a reformed drinker:They can no longer drink and vent their anger on everyone else). But "revenons aux moutons:" Our c-in-c has been declared clean of any collusion and it's time to "sabler le champagne"and for all America to wish him well.
1
Democrats are worried about how a losing impeachment proceeding would look. What about how not impeaching looks when the president is so lawless?
5
Dear NYT:
A profoundly silly argument which, if heeded, will get Trump re-elected.
2
This is foolish. The last time the idiots in congress decided to waste time on impeachments going nowhere was during the Clinton administration. We took our eye off the ball and the result was the bombing of the Cole and the World Trade Center and two major wars. Still all those representatives got their names in the paper every day. Congress and the president need to address the problems that we have in foreign and domestic policy and not waste any more time trying to rerun the 2016 election.
Oh me, oh my! What shall we do! Stop with the hand-wringing already! Get Mueller in there, get the obstruction in there, get the tax things in there, get emoluments in there, get Russia/Putin in there, get the whole pile in there and laid on the table for everyone to see. Then take a vote! Jeez!
4
Of course, Trump deserves to be impeached. But one thing the Mueller report clearly shows is that he was stopped from following his worst instincts. The key to getting through the next two years and getting him out of office is to tacitly encourage his TV watching, his tweeting, and keep him from doing anything substantial. That's easy because he doesn't have any clear ideas about what he really wants to do, other than making himself look good. So, encourage his rallies, get him to meet all kinds of famous people, play lots of golf, and eat lots of beautiful meals.
In the meantime, Congress should take a magnifying glass to examine his personal finances, and once he is out of office, let him face justice on those matters.
1
Please remember Nixon was not impeached; the shear weight of the evidence made public by the House's investigation prompted the Republican Senate leadership to visit the White House and tell Nixon the game was over. Current GOP leaders could forestall having to explain a conviction vote by making the same trek up Pennsylvania Avenue.
1
The pressure of Impeachment proceedings is vital for our democracy. Without that pressure Richard Nixon never would have resigned.
By 1972 it was an open secret in Washington that Henry Kissinger and Richard Nixon conspired to undermine the 1968 Paris peace talks between the Johnson administration and the North Vietnamese.
At just under 150 pages, Christopher Hitchens, laid out a brief detailing the crimes of one Henry Kissinger. In this brief is the detailed summary of what was known in 1968 to be "the open secret" of Kissinger and Nixon's treasonous undermining of the Paris negotiations the Johnson administration was conducting with the North Vietnamese.
The country failed to hold Henry Kissinger to account for his conspiracy to undermine the active peace negotiations of a democratic administration struggling to end a costly war. The war would continue as a result of Kissinger's meddling and under the new administration its cost in both treasure and blood is well documented by Hitchens and others.
The nation must learn from our Kissinger mistake and act forcefully to hold modern day traitors to account for their failure to protect the voting rights of every American whose vote was negated by a foreign power's actions to meddle in the 2016 election. The crime has been documented. It occurred and it is now our modern day "open secret" that the current administration has not done enough to secure and strengthen our election system from the threat of Russian meddling.
2
@Perren Reilley
Do you really think President Trump is a traitor to the USA, an agent of Russia?
2
@Dr. John
https://foreignpolicy.com/2018/12/21/how-russian-money-helped-save-trumps-business/
After Trump's financial disasters two decades ago, no U.S. bank would touch him. Then foreign money began flowing in.
1
@Dr. John
The real traitors to the USA are the people who will vote for Trump despite the fact that he and his administration have done close to nothing to prevent Russia from again meddling in the 2020 election.
1
An informal survey of the media and chattering class shows about 50% for and 50% against impeachment proceedings by the house. All want the same goal of removing Trump from office. I’m no political insider but it’s obvious the strategy to achieve that goal is all over the board.
1
The Republicans in office do not have any love for democracy. They really do prefer a plutocracy with the powerful making decisions, exploiting the masses. They have made that very clear with their voter suppression, support of a crook in the Oval, a political Supreme Court, support of laws that the majority of the country oppose.
Waiting for the GOP to have any support for a democratic republic will be fruitless.
2
I prefer censure over impeachment. Sure it will be spun as political. But asking employees to lie to special counsel must carry with it some consequence.
1
It seems illogical to me that members of the House would choose to forego impeachment of Trump because of what the Senate might do. They should just vote their conscience and let the Senate do the same. History would tell us who was right.
4
The oath of office taken by members of congress does not obligate them to uphold and defend the Constitution unless some alternative is more politically expedient - or less personally risky.
The oath is not simply a collection of words to be mumbled before a person can enjoy the benefits of office. There are solemn duties involved here. Democrats should end the Clintonian playacting and realize that history is knocking on their door.
4
Impeachment will play right into Republican/Trump hands of being the victim, and rally his base further.
No, it's a politically FOOLISH idea my friends... despite his deserving to be impeached.
Let him sit at the top of the party, keep pointing to all of his conniving, gutting of American values, helping the rich get richer while trying to defund Medicare (seniors are a huge voting block), defund education while all the new young voters are struggling AND going to the polls in great numbers. Let him keep spouting out his xenophobic, race-baiting, bile in a country that has grown more tolerant. Let him take more trips south of the Mason-Dixon line and talk about the destruction of "our history" to Confederate flag-waiving crowds. Let him insult and mock everyone who doesn't kowtow to his bullying self-aggrandizement. It's a gift in the long run.
Let the Republicans ignore the mid-term election.
Need I remind you (them): what we hoped was a slim majority turned out to be an 80 seat flip from 40 under to 40 over!
2020 looms closer every day. Let's keep our eyes on the prize.
2
Go right ahead, do it! Impeach the President for something (collusion) that Mueller explicitly said he didn’t do and something that he (Mueller) can’t prove (obstruction) he did. He will neither be convicted nor removed from office. End of story? No. We will go into the 2020 election with a martyr candidate, stronger than ever for having survived a coup, running against some sorry candidate chosen from a rag-tag collection of failed plotters. Do some critical thinking, for god’s sake and come up with a strategy that has a chance of working.
3
Speaking as someone who lived through Governor Scott Walker's recall in 2012: I think you underestimate how much a political act like this will not only galvanize the GOP base, but will even swing some independents to their side. Scott Walker had a terrible record as Wisconsin Governor; the state lagged literally EVERY one of its neighbors in recovering from the Great Recession. His naive giveaway to FoxConn was not the first stupid thing he did, though thankfully it was the last. But I personally know voters who pulled the lever for him in 2012 and even 2014, even though they did NOT in 2012, because they thought the recall election was out of line, not democratic. I predict there will be at least some voters like that nationally in 2020.
Besides, all the removal of Trump would lead to would be a *decreased* likelihood of Democrats winning in 2020, because then they would be facing Mike Pence, and there is about a hundred times less useful oppo on Pence; Dems would be reduced to attacking his character, and would probably lose where they might've beaten Trump.
Sorry to be so pragmatic; believe me I wish we could afford to be purely idealistic too. But we can't; too much is at stake, to risk it all for "symbolism" (*your* word, not mine).
3
I'd love to see a unified Democratic Strategy in 2020: Impeach Trump then have every single Dem running for office directly tie every Republican opponent to Trump and his immoral, incompetent, treasonous governance. The GOP at this point has shown their willingness to stand for Trumpism above all. A massive, countrywide coordinated effort to call them out and show the Democratic alternative. Every TV ad, speech, and op-ed blasts them and shows what they have wrought on our country.
1
In an impeachment trial the chief justice presides but Mitch McConnell will have considerable power to influence the proceeding( https://www.lawfareblog.com/can-senate-decline-try-impeachment-case). Obviously McConnell's influence would be focused on helping Trump. Republicans wold turn the proceeding into an investigation of the investigators and Trump's accusers. Don’t expect statesmanship from Republicans. Expect ruthless scorched earth tactics. If it happens it will be an ugly spectacle.
2
Has anyone thought about this ‘impeachment question’ logically?
1. What, exactly, are you hanging your hat on Dems? What’s the sell? Tough question bc there isn’t a CRIME to point to yet, but the investigations should be kept up and the threat of impeachment ever growing. There’s no question he’s done enough to be impeached, the real question is HOW.
2. HOW are you going to impeach Trump in a way to SHAVES OFF his supporters? The first priority should be showing voters Dems are not hysterical in their impeach trump zeal. Dems can’t have Trump supporters rally around him in droves bc of the WAY impeachment proceeds.
Seems everyone’s forgotten how to deal with bullies and demagogues. The only way to meaningfully reduce their popularity (other than violent defeat) is by SHOWING PEOPLE THE COST OF THEIR LEADERSHIP. The Midwest has done well economically so it’s going to be tough, if not impossible. The answer to Trump is someone who CANT be bullied. It’s a matter of demeanor. Calm, collected, in touch with reality.
CREDIBLY SELL BETTER INSTITUTIONS DOMESTICALLY, A RETURN TO AMERICAS PLACE IN THE WORLD INTERNATIONALLY. Understand Hilary was defeated BC she represented the status quo. Dems job now is to sell NORMALCY.
(Intentionally did not address the possibly that Trump could be impeached AND REMOVED FROM OFFICE because it’s not possible. Republicans Senators are shameless, hypocritical, and shortsighted. Voting Trump out of office? Might as well be asking pigs to fly.
1
Crime is obstructing Justice by asking his employees to lie for him.
3
Republicans impeached Bill Clinton. Do you remember why? He lied about an affair with an intern in the White House. To fake-morals Americans, Bill Clinton's indiscretion can never be forgiven. But Trump can do no wrong.
Only completely brainwashed people think like that. People like Americans - perfectly and completely brainwashed people think that an affair is worse than being a traitor to your country. In that world, how can anyone care about anything?
4
Donald Trump has no one to blame but himself.
Let the impeachment proceedings begin.
2
To impeach or not to impeach. "To be, or not to be: that is the question: Whether ‘tis nobler in the mind to suffer. The slings and arrows of outrageous fortune, Or to take arms against a sea of troubles".
It's not what Trump has done to disrespect the office, profit off of it, and brand himself while undermining decades of diplomacy, wrecking trade relations, and dismantling environmental progress — it's what the heck the increasingly dysfunctional, fragile. migrant, Trump/GOP administration and cabal could do next. What the heck will they fudge and dismember next?
All we will have till Trump and trumpism is gone is a sea of troubles. What they Mueller did is less important than what they will do and how many billions/trillions they will ill spend till this nasty episodic Trump show ends. Impeach in the media sphere but go sell the progressive issues. We need a competent administration. That's many people, not a one-person.
It's the issues that help US, that matter. Not the Trump show.
Or any show personality. One crack progressive team. It's simple enough. We know what to do.
1
The voters will stray away from Democrat voting in 2020 because of waste of time in Mueller report. Impeachment would be worse, good luck controlling the in 2020. Also what comes around goes around, the Obama administration and all high positions are going to be investigated . For spying,treason and other high crimes, people never learn.
If fidelity to the constitution is a benchmark, all Democrats should resign for violating the second amendment.
Great pieces today by Jamelle and Joe Lockhart. Trump deserves every bad thing he’s set in motion for himself, but so does the GOP. It deserves to burn for standing by this corrupt man.
1
It is as simple as this. We have a brazen criminal family in the White House. They are being protected by an equally reprehensible republican party. Something must be done or the damage (already severe) will be unfathomable. Impeachment - NOW!
2
Bottom line:
Without impeachment, Trump is getting a pass.
3 marriages, 4000 lawsuits , and 6 bankruptcies .
Trump has always relied on getting a pass which is why he will never change his ways.
There may be nothing left of the Constitution by November 2019.
3
"The Russian government interfered in the 2016 presidential election in sweeping and systematic fashion," said Robert Mueller in his famous report.
Will the government allow it to happen again?
Come on, Democrats, investigate and follow the facts. Protect our elections.
And shine a light on any Republican who tries to defend the status quo. Russia (and anyone else) can never be allowed to interfere in our elections again.
4
"If the verdict is out of reach then the house should not impeach!"
Mr. Bouie and Speaker Pelosi are both correct with regards to their opposing views on Articles of Impeachment. This is new ground and the modern history of impeachment doesn't provide guidance.
Nixon didn't resign because he feared impeachment. Instead he wanted the inquiry to end because some of his buddies who got caught did much dirtier deeds over the course of Nixon's political career. Were it not for the hush monies paid and an end to the inquiry upon his resignation, chances are good that these activities (and Nixon's knowledge of them) would crush Nixon. In other words, he had no choice but to resign and take a pardon. Trump has a long history of corruption but outside of his run for office, none of it is political.
Clinton had sex and lied about it. Republicans thought that American's would punish him for that. Trump already knows better.
Pelosi's best move would be to straddle the impeachment fence until the fall of 2020. Permit some hearings to proceed but remind her fellow Democrats that there is no rush. Time is on their side. A new hearing every few months or so vs. a full blown impeachment investigations & proceedings would keep Trump's Un-Constitutional corruption in front of voters.
And just prior to the 2020 elections, she would come off as a saint if she suspended hearings for the sake of elections, particularly if Trump's numbers are weak. If Trump is surging she can always go nuclear.
1
I thought impeachment would only lead us to Pence and the Gilead. But now I see that it is time to start down the road to impeachment. This needs to be done carefully, gathering and exposing all of the evidence so the Public can be informed with a transparency required. But this needs to be done to protect the office of the Presidency and to protect the balance of power of our government. This is duty bound by oath.
4
I would like to see Pelosi privately ask McConnell to convene a Senate Select Committee on Election Security to insure non interference in our electoral process. If he says no do it publicly. Have the House oversight committee interview Pence about whether the 25 th was considered to evaluate the functional level of the government and get his balance sheet and taxes. Let the Judiciary Committee focus on the unredacted testimony and get to the bottom of the issues. After all that, there should be a good sense of whether or not Senate conviction is possible. There should be an opportunity for the Republicans to show whether they care.
2
Impeachment may be frought with perils and difficulties but silence--or saying "let the voters decide"--carries some too.
Impeachment must not be carried out vindictively, or as a punishment of Mr. Trump. The Founders intended impeachment proceedings, ultimately, to protect Americans and that is the spirit in which it must be done if Congress pursues it. We have, in the White House, a man unable to tell an American ally from an enemy. He cozied up to the Russians out of self-interest as they hacked official American emails. Yet he is unable even to understand how he compromised himself and American interests. He is a danger to us all.
1
I want to see Trump face criminal charges. I worry that a failed impeachment attempt might lessen the chances of Trump going to prison where he belongs. First, it might increase his re-election chances. Second, it might taint a criminal trial. The just outcome would be impeachment, removal from office and criminal conviction but unfortunately that seems unachievable even if more incriminating evidence is uncovered.
1
Please. Please. Please. Do not impeach this man. His replacement would pardon him for all crimes he committed.
I say wait until he loses in 2020 and then LOCK HIM UP. LOCK HIM. LOCK HIM UP.
3
There's no lure! The evidence revealed from Mueller's investigation is not exculpatory
There is very little doubt, even by Mueller, that Donald Trump trued his best to obstruct the judicial process. There is also little doubt that Trump is an incompetent President and that incompetence kept him from an out-and-out charge of obstruction and conspiracy. It’s clear that high-ranking members his campaign were very willing to engage in conspiracy.
In the first case, McGann kept him from firing the Special Counsel and in the second, there is no doubt that Putin wanted Trump in the White House but he quickly realized he better going ahead on his own.
Trump should be brought to trial and as Mueller clearly stated, impeachment is the only way to do so. It’s the right thing to do but I hope the Democrats refrain.
First because I think they should focus on 2020 and driving Trump and Republicans out of Congress and impeachment proceedings are a distraction.
Second, because an impeachment trial would play to Trump’s strength (perhaps his only real strength). He loves a spectacle and being the center of the spectacle, and he’s very good at it. He loves playing the victim and lashing out at perceived enemies. An impeachment trial would give him all of these.
Don’t do it. Let the voters do their job. Let US prove we are up to the task of ridding our country from Donald Trump and start the hard task of cleaning the mess he will leave.
1
Let's be real: would the GOP be having the same honest debate with itself over impeaching Clinton or Obama for what Trump has done?
4
No. But Democrats are less vindictive and still have the good of the country in mind.
The Mueller report is out. Nothing egregious was found. Move on.
Don't the DEMOCRAT'S who keep harping about meaningless Trump wrongdoing have anything better to do to serve US?
BTW, where are the high crimes and misdemeanors?
1
How about asking employees to lie to special counsel?
1
Do Democrats have any other initiatives to support working Americans besides impeachment?
While the Democratic Party stands back, wringing its hands, equivocating over what they should do, Trump and his Administration go on, undeterred, with the systematic rape of our country. If the Democratic Party fails to act under these circumstances, they will fully deserve the ignominy history will rightly heap upon them.
If not now, when? At least we have the moral courage of Senator Elizabeth Warren, as lonely as her voice is on the Democrat side of the aisle.
Bestir yourselves, Democrats.
5
Impeach Trump in the House and put political pressure on the Republicans in the Senate if they don't also impeach.
Stop being cowards Dems and do the right thing for America.
6
Commenters here have divided themselves into two groups: (1) the Joe Lockhartians (Don't impeach); and (2) the Charles Blow-Jamelle Bouieans (Impeach).
Both camps have good arguments. So the good news is that, no matter which path we take, it's a win for Democrats.
Republicans have painted themselves into a corner. Time is not on their side, but they did make a game of it. Soon they can hit the showers and try to get some of that paint off. Redemption may be possible for some, but they have largely destroyed their honor and trustworthiness. And it is with no joy that I say this: If my fellow citizen suffers, so do I. No man is an island. We are, in fact, all in this together.
1
Whatever the Ds do on impeachment, basing it on what happened 20 years ago with Clinton is absurd.
Clinton’s nemesis was Gingrich, one of the worst human beings on the planet till Trump came along.
Do what’s right and lead public opinion instead of chasing it.
We have a pathological liar with no character and no morality ruining our country. He’s a worldwide disaster and a disgrace to the office.
Fight back and do something.
5
Statecraft isn't just venting.
Donald Trump is, by far, the most unstable, corrupt and profoundly ignorant man to have ever been elected as a US President. The Mueller Report has provided, as a minimum, five clear statements of Trump's clear obstruction of justice. Every day, we awaken to this embarrassment of a man who, as leader of a small segment of our country, lies to the world habitually, compulsively, pathologically.
During the work week, Trump spends most of his time watching television and tweeting. His weekends are spent flying to Florida where we read that he cheats at golf.
This incredibly corrosive man must be impeached. History demands it. America's future requires it.
3
This is America.
We don't allow criminals to be president.
Trump is a criminal and has been his whole life.
He must be removed from office.
Otherwise our democracy has lost all meaning.
5
Impeachment has been a knee-jerk go-to for a long time. My party lost? Impeachment. The opposition passed a bill I don't like? Impeachment. No, impeachment is really serious business. While this administration couldn't possibly be more weird, it does not cross the impeachment line. It would put the country at large into a total uproar. We have a very robust, stable culture. We have to see this through to the election. Enough novelty seeking, independent, minority and women voters are being shed to allow a new administration into office. The novelty has worn off.
An excellent article. It would serve all Americans well to read our Constitution. Note that Article I deals with Congress -what they can and cannot do -mostly what they are obligated to do. Article II sets out the rules for the President. It even tells us that "...in case of the removal of the President from Office, or his Death, or INABILITY TO DISCHARGE THE POWERS AND DUTIES OF THE SAID OFFICE..." and goes on to discuss handing power over to the VP and an asterisk tells of the 25th Amendment.
Article II, Section I ends with a restatement of the oath of office.
Given that President Trump has violated so much of our Constitution, his oath of office - faithfully execute the Office of the President...preserve, protect and defend the Constitution..., I believe it is time for Congress to fulfill their duties and call the President to account for his many, disgraceful, violations of both the Constitution and his Oath of Office. His ignorance of norms and flagrant violation of same is shameful.
Note that almost everything the President is charged with doing requires oversight of Congress. Should the House fail to have the proper hearings and move to Impeach this President, I believe they will fail in their oversight duties. Already, we have seen the leaders of the Senate slip into devotion rather than oversight. Republicans must ask themselves if they are ready to honor their oath of office and work for the Country or continue to bow down to this renegade President.
1
Good arguments, Jamelle. You might be changing my mind on this issue.
I think you are correct that Trump will try to invigorate his base through fear-mongering and lies to get them to the polls regardless of what the House decides to do. They may as well hold him accountable via Articles of Impeachment. It is probably true that impeachment proceedings wouldn't make us any more divided than we already are.
Anyway, such a proceeding would likely make for good TV (remember Sam Ervin?)
3
In a perfect would, Trump would be gone by sundown. But we obviously don't live in a perfect world. This also is not about Trump vs. Democrats. It's about Trump (and members of his camp) vs. Decency. I'm a Conservative who has been abandoned by the GOP, and although I would like to see Trump removed from offie, that would not be a cure for what ails the nation and the Republican Party. Better that Trump remain in office and that the GOP either comes to its senses or crashes and burns. Impeachment would create a backlash of sympathy for Trump, and who knows where that would lead? Better he remain in office and stumble toward the exit.
2
Even if it is conceded that Impeachment is only of symbolic significance, the concern remains that the symbolism may not be grasped by as significant portion of the American populace. Given the gravity of Trump's wrongdoing and misfeasance, it is important to impeach Trump; he has already done more than enough to warrant impeachment. However, if the Democrats have poor timing, or do not make adequate preparations for the impeachment, then I fear that the symbolism will be lost. A good strategy is to ramp up the investigations, subpoena Mueller, McGahn and other, and to obtain access to Trump's taxes. That could provoke Trump to lash out with new instances of obstruction, or engage in illegal acts of political retribution. The idea would be for the Democrats to slowly leverage disclosures so as to force new revelations, and keep the narrative solely focused on Trump and his illegal and unethical behavior. It should also be made clear that once Trump is out of office, the Democrats will see to it that he is no longer immune to the application of the rule of law.
2
There is reason to impeach Trump even if conviction is unlikely and backlash leads to his reelection. It is the only way to look at ourselves in the mirror.
Cable hosts and newspaper pundits argue from a distance, selecting evidence that makes their case and satisfies their base. Each side has adequate rationale, if not legitimate justification, to dismiss the other point of view. It is like we are watching two different movies in America and can't talk to each other about the story. Even the Mueller report is incomplete without vigorous interrogation in front of one audience.
Articles of impeachment will make the case in one narrative for all to see. A Senate trial, broadcast across America, will force a reckoning. Witnesses must tell truth under threat of perjury charges. Cross-examination is the only effective test of that truth. If GOP Senators want to pander and obfuscate, they'll have to do it in full view, denying what we all can see and etching their dark place in history. There is no other way to conclude this ugly time in our history. And if, in the full presence of the truth about this president, our system fails, we will know what we have become.
And I, for one, will no longer think of myself as an American.
1
I will post nearly the same comment I made to Ross Douthat's column yesterday:
I'm sorry, Mr. Bouie, but impeachment is just a terrible idea. Here are my reasons:
1. There is no chance of this actually succeeding in the Senate.
2. Yes, it would "fire up the base."
3. Believe it or not, if impeached, Trump could just run again anyway. And he would! Republicans would not be able to stop him, any more than they could in 2016. (What does that tell you about "the base"?) And he could win! Do we want four more years of Trump, unfettered by even the casual worry about being re-elected?
4. The time to the next election is going to go by very quickly. Let's concentrate on choosing the best candidates and make sure that Trump is kicked out by the voters, by a very decisive margin. He CAN be prosecuted criminally, once he's out of office. The odds are not great there, but better than the odds of getting 67 votes in the Senate for impeachment.
5. A vote of CENSURE by Congress is far more preferable. It is an official reprimand. Andrew Jackson is the only president so far to have ever been censured. It requires only a majority in each chamber.
6. President Mike Pence.
7. President Mike Pence.
8. President Mike Pence.
1
Point of fact. He can run if impeached. He cannot run if convicted. The judgement of impeachment shall extend only to removal from office and disqualification from holding any office of honor, trust under the United States. The convicted party can nonetheless be subjected to criminal trial—paraphrased from Article I Section 3, last paragraph
Impeachment would be a Wrestlemania-like spectacle that changes no minds, leaves Trump firmly in his soap opera metier, and further enables the cartoonish victimization narratives peddled by cornermen like Limbaugh and Hannity.
And impeachment feels like a fateful line to cross here — the ante on the table being far larger than those staked on Nixon or Clinton.
I would rather see Trump’s presidency die by a thousand cuts from a hundred investigations. Impeaching will focus all attention on Trump and his epic amorality. Investigating the whole stinking administration can illuminate the prize package that is awarded for fealty to Trump and the party he’s hijacked. Just look to yesterday’s infuriating NYT Magazine cover story. The Trump administration is making predatory lending great again.
Democrats need to learn a learn a lesson from the GOP’s relentlessly disciplined messaging. The whole party is reading this script: “Socialism! Starring AOC, the new Democrat (sic) Party diva. Coming to your town in 2020?!”
Supercharged impeachment version: Deep State seeks to replace your president with a socialist regime.
To win over any Trump voters, Democrats need an equally simple delivery system for their policy ideas. Over the last 40 years, corporations have become people, and money has learned to speak. But the Democrats are still the party Americans come to with their unfinished business.
The country is splitting apart. Win in 2020. Forbearance will then look wise.
40
@Railbird
Democrats aren't going to win over any Trump voters. They can win by mobilizing and expanding their own base, not by trying to appeal to his.
16
@Railbird
"I would rather see Trump’s presidency die by a thousand cuts from a hundred investigations.". Absolutely the way to go. The drip drip of relentless corrosion, rather than the indeterminate rush of a tsunami which will leave him standing.
7
@Railbird
Glad to know that you think the facts to be aired during an impeachment will change no minds. Did you also know that Trump would be elected?
If minds can't be changed, why did the Russians expend so much effort to influence our election? Why did the Democrats cry foul when Comey spoke out about Hillary? Why even have campaigns?
Because (answering my own question) the situation is analogous to why we eat. We're hungry, so we start eating until we feel we have enough. What no one knows is when it will be enough.
2
Honestly folks, look in the mirror and get a grip. Every day that is used to harass the President takes away the opportunity to help this country move forward on REAL issues!
Trump Derangement Syndrome started off as a joke but now is a credible condition.
Conservatives couldn't stand President Obama. Eight long years we had to wait. What's wrong with the Trump haters?
Yeah, conservatives waited eight long years alright. And, once elected, they got what they were waiting for: a tax cut.
Impeachment won’t prevent congress from moving forward on real issues. Republicans prevent that all by themselves, whether they hold both houses and the presidency or not. McConnell hasn’t brought up a exactly one important bill this term: prison reform. He’s champing at the bit to do nothing else for two years other than pack the courts.
1
There’s no chance of the wounded demagogue being impeached. Better to have him limping on with the shadow of his high crimes and misdemeanours being cast over his remaining campaign for 2020.
Better that than emboldening him and making him a martyr for his base.
1
At first I thought let's wait for the election to throw him out. I didn't want to rile the ultra-sensitive Trump voters who may be inspired to vote for him again simply because they hate the so-called "elites" who impeach him (never mind that they're voting against their own interest). But truth is, they'll hate us anyway. They will vote for him no matter how many lies he tells, because he makes them feel better about themselves (never mind that he thinks they're fools). We can't worry about them anymore. Someone, and it looks like it's going to have to be us, need to say emphatically "Enough!"
4
I agree 100% percent Trump must be impeached by the House. The Senate will not uphold it due to partisan politics, as they have continually demonstrated with their hypocrisy related to Trump's behavior. But if Republics could impeach Clinton for lying about sex, Democrats must impeach Trump for his blatant disregard for law, ethics, and the truth.
3
Look at who's suddenly NOT in glib "bring it on" impeachment mode: Mr. Trump. A mature, focused push to a fact-heavy impeachment resolution is the ONLY antidote to the venom of false claims of complete exoneration and victimization that will gush forth from Trump and his toadies, no matter what the House Democrats do. Pass an impeachment resolution. Shame every GOP Senator who votes against it, and "primary" every Democratic Senator who does the same (that means you, Joe Manchin). The facts call for impeachment. History and our form of government scream for it.
5
This is far different from Clinton's impeachment over lying about having consensual sexual relations, which I never understood why he was forced to testify in the first place. This is about obstruction of justice to hid the truth which is Trump probably did collude with Russia to rig the US election.
Mueller had his hands tied, it is time for congress (the house) to do its job and hold Trump accountable.
1
Throw caution to the wind. Start impeachment. Trump is daring the Democrats to do it. It not only sends a strong message to Trump but it will help save our democracy, which Trump could care less about. Yes it will be defeated in the Senate by feckless Republicans. So what. They are just shooting themselves in the foot or bone spurs. Don't shoot the messenger. Voters in 2020 will overwhelmingly vote for the Democratic candidate. Once Trump is annihilated then he will be taken down in NY. And all the king's men won't be able to save him.
2
Values matter. The office of the Presidency stands for something. Trump's conduct is a daily affront. IMPEACH!
4
I have to acknowledge, with maximum regret, that it would be impossible to convict Trump in the Senate given its current composition and given the GOP's inability to stand up in defiance of this malignant president and his Kool-Aid-imbibing base. And what if the Democratic House can't even secure a vote to impeach him- the Party would look foolish and weak as a consequence. Better to just settle for investigations at this point: keep on digging, call Mueller to testify (I'm sure he'd have a good deal more to say on the subject of Trump's malfeasance if he's properly questioned) and wait for the Southern District of New York to come up with its findings (and likely indictments). Let the revelations come out little by little, pinprick by pinprick until the entire fetid corpse of the Trump kakistocracy can be hoisted up on its own petard just in time for Election Day 2020.
1
Michelle Goldberg was first out in the Times under the headline: “In a Functional Country, We Would Be on the Road to Impeachment”
Next was Charles Blow: “Impeach Donald Trump”
Now today, April 23, Jamelle Bouie: “The Lure of Impeachment”
But first of all was Elizabeth Warren as I read here in Astead W. Herndon’s report: “Elizabeth Warren Calls for Impeachment Process Against Trump”
Herndon made this observation: “Her comments stood in contrast to much of the rest of the Democratic field, as several other candidates for president have treaded carefully around the impeachment question.”
Time for the rest of the field plus Nancy Pelosi to stop treading water and support Warren - now.
Only-NeverInSweden.blogspot.com
Citizen US SE
3
Impeachment is even more important for the Senate than the House. Every member of the Senate must be made ot record their vote on the morality and legality of their Party leader. It is more important for the Senators to tell their constituents just how lawless, how crooked they will be for their base.
4
We need to impeach Trump. Otherwise, we are pandering to his criminality. Democrats must take a stand, no matter the outcome. II am disappointed by all those who do not stand for this, the right thing to do. We must send a message, or I predict that our history will be forever tainted because we did not act decisively against a tyrant.
6
Trump displayed contempt for the law again and again. It is a fundamental question of right and wrong, not political maneuvering. Impeaching Trump sends the correct message to all Americans: No one is above the law including the "wannabe" dictator Donald Trump. Yes, the Republicans demonstrate their contempt for our nation as they continue to support Trump, but- -Yes..Justice for all. Impeach Trump!
5
The Dems are not doing anything to impeach Trump,
as they will fade into history as collusionists" for neglecting the
their Constitutional duty to investigate and impeach a corrupt
president.
The Dems are coming over as weak and futile in their Congressional duty.
3
@PropagandandTreason - All but one!
ELIZABETH WARREN
Only-NeverIn Sweden.blogspot.com
Citizen US SE
"The potential impossibility of conviction itself is an important message for the public to take in."
This can't be stressed enough. Every Republican "patriotic" hypocrite in the Senate needs to be forced to put it on record whether or not they support this corrupt president who operates as though he is above the laws that constrain mere mortals. No more keeping their heads down until the Trump problem fades away.
2
Dems should stick to investigating Trump's cabinet, all of whom seem worthy of prison sentences for blatant corruption.
1
I wish Congress would get on with the job they were elected to do. Has any worthwhile legislation been passed by Congress? I am so tired of hearing about impeachment and all of the supposed failings of Trump and his administration. The VOTERS elected him to be President. And all the Democrats have done is harassed him and threatened impeachment even before he took office. Please give him a chance! Let the VOTERS decide if they want him to continue as President. What an outcry there would have been if Obama had been treated the way Trump has been treated. Talk about a double standard and hypocrisy—if the Democrats could only see themselves the way many voters do: as a bunch of trouble makers. Grow up and stop throwing tantrums!
The Electoral College and GOP voter suppression elected tRump. Nearly 3 million more voted for Clinton.
Had we a one-person-one-vote system, this tRump national nightmare would have been avoided. Support the National Popular Vote initiative in your state!
2
Dear Virginia,
I too wish that Congress would get on with the job they were elected to do, namely uphold the Constitution of the United States. In the recently released Mueller Report (have you read it, Virginia?) there is sufficient evidence to compel Congress to investigate impeachable offenses by the President. The Constitution compels them to do their jobs. The cynic in me says that Republicans in the Senate will not vote for impeachment, no matter how convincing the evidence may be, but through the process at the very least we will learn, as VOTERS, just what we are getting if we choose to vote for this man again. Fair enough?
2
Can we impeach an ex-president who allowed Russia to attack our electoral process without taking any counter action during the attack, who used his security agency heads to spy on Trump campaign, who filed false documents to obtain FISA warrants to surveil on Trump associates, who fixed Hilary e-mail investigations and created a Russian collusion hoax that paralyzed America for several years now. Obama's actions were really bad for America, but liberal pundits do not see anything wrong with his actions.
1
I don't think impeachment is enough to restore our nation's moral fiber. As long as Americans are willing to install people like Trump, McConnell, Jordan, Meadows, and the rest of the sociopaths in the GOP, none of whom have an ounce of respect for the rule of law or the rights of women, people of color, or nation of origin, our nation will be a third rate nation, no better than the worst of the worst, like Russia. In fact, it is Russia. We have turned our nation over to Russia by allowing a Russian operative to slither through the cracks into our White House.
Our nation is on the brink of all out civil war and the GOP is pouring gasoline on the flame.
Donald Trump is a terrible embarrassment to America--a dangerously inept, crude, uneducated, and imbalanced man in a position to do great harm to the world and especially to America. But let us not think that removing him from office through impeachment or through election will save the day.
So long as American spends money like confetti on the military, we will enrich the investors in the military industries, impoverish the majority of the rest of us, and invite the rest of the world to view us as a crude threat.
Getting rid of a symptom is not a cure for a disease. Our disease has produced a Caligula-like Mr. Trump, but it also has produced terrible inequality and suffering, a world burning with incessant wars in which America is central, a society at home that produces massacres on a regular basis, and a climate crisis that will make our world far less habitable at best and inhabitable at worst.
Replacing Mr. Trump with a sophisticated, erudite, and mentally balanced non-Trump will be but a cosmetic covering a blemish. Something is horribly wrong with the basic structure of our society--the evidence of dysfunction makes that clear. Until we face up to that, Mr. Trump provides mainly a distraction.
For the sake of our democratic institutions, please impeach Donald Trump. We have documented evidence that he attempted to go above the law and obstruct justice. Are we to go the way of the Russians and submit ourselves to a cynical acceptance that democratic institutions no longer matter? Are we to just give up an attempt to make a statement that no one is above the law--if we do so, we have lost the battle. The Republican party has obviously played it's hand as the party of the rich and cynical. Please let the democrats show the world that there is some hope on this planet for a government of the people, the people who care enough and have faith enough in themselves to fight for their rights. Acquiescence to this narcissistic, ignorant man who clearly thinks he can bully his way around the law is a death knell for a democratic nation.
4
Impeach him on the campaign trail and vote yes to throw him out at the ballot box.
Rebuke the Republicans for supporting him by providing the American people with a strong counter narrative.
Those who think it/he is not worth it to go through the impeachment process should be removed from office by the ballot. Democrats have to return to being a party that has principles, that stands for something. This caution (really worrying about your own office) rather than doing your duty is a losing position with progressives, young people, people of color. Do something.
2
Impeachment is the wrong course of action because a conviction will never pass the Senate. A statement of charges by the House makes for a great front page, but it will only fuel the fires of 'fake news' and more importantly 'witch hunt'. Impeachment feeds into his hysterics and tantrums. Is there a case? possibly, but the proceedings would only prove to be another weapon to use against House Democrats. Play the long con Dems and go for long term progress, not short term proof of 'told you so'. We know. We knew. Make a real change.
Had Clinton won the Fox crowd wouldn't be so hesitant. If my memory serves both the nytimes and Fox were talking impeachment before the election. So what's behind it. Are we incapable of looking at the real problems we face where virtue and hate signaling are not enough?
Our government and it's experts in foreign policy are once again gearing up sanctions against Iran. Mostly oil sales will be affected. I recall, my memory again, the sanctions we had against them in the late 20th century caused according to the Red Cross the deaths of 50,000 children. The sale of medicine was part of the sanctions. The Red Cross does exaggerate don't they?
Just off the top head we have sanctions against Russia, N Korea and Venezuela. Nothing like the ones against Iran but still not something we want to talk about.
Warren demands impeachment, but she must know that the Senate will not bring in a guilty verdict. Maybe she's pushing this to highlight the corruption of the leaders and most members of the GOP Senate. Fair enough--so long as she doesn't convince voters that impeachment at this time is achievable. Getting voters riled about the impossible would be counterproductive. And we know some voters can believe nonsense. Some people think vaccination is evil; some think Hillary Clinton is a criminal; and some think George Soros is a threat to mom and apple pie. Where did they get those ideas? Not by a process of reasoning from first principles! So let’s have a care with populism—it can turn voters away.
We are spending too much time on the impeachment debate and too little time on trying to remove our nation's first dictator.
The fact is, dictators never need the support of a majority of citizens -- a hateful, ignorant minority will do just fine. And this is exactly what Trump has.
There are thoughtful arguments on both sides of the impeachment debate. But regardless of which path the House Democrats choose, the result will be the same: Trump will leave office only at a time of his choosing.
For the past two and one-half years, we have come to learn that the will of the majority of us means nothing. His vicious, bigoted base will stop at nothing to keep their "president" in power.
But Trump has so many more cards to play before he has to unleash his heavily-armed base. He has a cowering Senate that will be controlled by Republicans beyond 2020. He has five votes on the Supreme Court ready to kowtow to imagined "emergency" he will dream up as a pretext to cancel elections. The case law on presidential authority in declaring martial law is by no means settled, and with the Muslim ban, this Court has already shown it will defer to Trump despite his administration's having produced no evidence in support for his actions. And he has "his military" ready to support him as well.
Trump has already told us more than once that he intends to stay in office more than eight years.
So understand this: there will be no peaceful means to remove this tyrant - bet the rent on it.
1
The equivocation in the first few sentences left me unwilling to read further. What is wrong with saying, directly: "The Mueller report shows a president with criminal disregard for the rule of law and constitutional government. Congress should address this in accordance with what the report reminds us is 'our constitutional system of checks and balances and the principle that no person is above the law.'”
There. Fixed it for you. Your first 6 mealymouthed words taking Trump off the hook make me sick. Your unwillingness to stand up and tell the truth leaves my moral health in peril. Quit equivocating. Trump has got to go and the sooner the better. The ONLY argument I've heard against impeachment that makes any sense boils it down to timing, not "should" or "if". Those of us hoping to reacquaint ourselves with good government are not going to wait until 2020 for the Democrats to use the Constitutional tool in place to try to pry Trump out of office. Impeachment is fully earned and deserved, now or next week, but it must happen and it must happen soon. If not, establishment Democrats are dead to me.
We are spending too much time on the impeachment debate and too little time on trying to remove our nation's first dictator.
The fact is, dictators never need the support of a majority of citizens - a hateful, ignorant minority will do just fine. And this is exactly what Trump has. There are thoughtful arguments on both sides of the impeachment debate. But regardless of which path the House Democrats choose, the result will be the same: Trump will leave office only at a time of his choosing.
For the past two and one-half years, we have come to learn that the will of the majority of us means nothing. His vicious, bigoted base will stop at nothing to keep their "president" in power. But Trump has so many more cards to play before he has to unleash his heavily-armed base. He has a cowering Senate that will be controlled by Republicans beyond 2020. He has five votes on the Supreme Court ready to kowtow to an imagined "emergency" he will dream up as a pretext to cancel elections. The case law on presidential authority in declaring martial law is by no means settled, and with the Muslim ban, this Court has already shown it will defer to Trump despite his administration's having produced no evidence in support for his actions. And he has "his military" ready to support him as well.
Trump has already told us more than once that he intends to stay in office more than eight years. So understand this: there will be no peaceful means to remove this tyrant - bet the rent on it.
An impeachment investigation is completely warranted, regardless of the final outcome. The American people deserve to know the full truth about our president and the rest of his criminal enablers.
2
The impeachment process would also allow for the inclusion of yet another deeply offensive, corrupting, and democratically undermining behavior cavalierly and constantly engaged in by this Fake President: His documented, unprecedented amount of lying and spreading of falsehoods to the American people on all manner of occasions. In fact this conduct by Trump could serve as the legitimate basis for a separate article of impeachment.
1
MUELLER REPORT: “On November 20, 2018, the President submitted written responses that did not answer those questions about Trump Tower Moscow directly
and did not provide any information about the timing of the candidate’s discussions with [Michael] Cohen about the project
or whether he participated in any discussions about the project being abandoned or no longer pursued.”
Apr 18, 2019: the Mueller Report. Trump refused to answer questions on the Trump Tower Moscow project. This is an incriminating action!
Impeachment is required of the House. Required. Be clear that the house has an obligation to impeach the president for treason, bribery, high crimes and misdemeanors. Misdemeanors did not have a particular criminal meaning at the time. It meant misbehavior. Behavior unsuitable or disreputable to the office of President.
Trump has committed serious misdemeanors every single week he has been in office. The Mueller report is completely unnecessary. Trumps appalling public demeanor has been the near continuous misdemeanor the House should at least include in its impeachment. Trump has degraded the united states to itself and to the world. That is inarguable and that is impeachable. Add to that the attempted criminality in the Mueller report.
On the political question...Republicans have to have their feet held to the fire. Every single time, the accusation of witch hunt has to be turned around. So you believe when Trump did X, Y or Z that that is acceptable behavior for the president of the US, regardless of party? Yes or No? You would have been OK with Obama doing it for example?
Do not let them EVER get away with calling witch hunt without a challenge of fact.
I've been shocked at the complacency of the media, of other politicians and of the American People in the face of Trump's grotesque debasement or our highest office. I was astonished impeachment wasn't started six months in to his abuse of office. Do Your Duty!
I don't like Trump. I think he is a disaster. He has made flawed fundamental changes in what is proper behavior for those we give the power to govern us. Much that is now acceptable would never before have been accepted. However, I do not want to see the impeachment trial. I am certain that the Republican Senators would not convict. There is nothing that is more important to these Republicans than their jobs---easy jobs , countless benefits, good income, long vacations , jobs of power . To convict would endanger these cozy jobs, and principle is rarely as important as maintenance of lifestyle. They won't convict.
Is there a need to inform the public? No. Anyone who even only glances at the news can see what is obvious that the man in power and his enablers are con men and charlatans, who try to hide their unethical and illegal actions but only partially succeed. There is no need for the impeachment trial to inform. The same can be achieved by the House investigations and iteration of the actual facts. But were we to have the impeachment, then Trump would be able to don the garb of the poor, innocent victim, who is being preyed upon by the treasonous deep-state Democrats, who hate him because he won, and he would claim, following the no conviction by his Senate, that he is thoroughly vindicated, exonerated---like a mantra, over and over--and those who have not yet been convinced of his true nature will agree and strengthen their support for this man.
1
Focus on 2020. Maintain the house. Take the Senate or beat McConnell in Kentucky. Force Republicans to face their self-inflicted damage.
Meanwhile, investigate. Find the smoking gun. Without one, impeachment will galvanize the right for a decade.
Mr Bouie has clearly shown his utter lack of knowledge regarding the impeachment process. He would rather see the Dems initiate proceedings without a solid Constitutional violation. Tantrums and boorish behavior doesn’t meet the standards the Founding Fathers demanded. The standards Bouie wants to have would have resulted in other Presidents, including Obama, being subjected to the impeachment process whenever the opposition gains control of Congress.
If Mueller, who is an experienced prosecutor as well as former head of the FBI, was unable to clearly and unequivocally state that crimes had been committed by the President, then the standards for impeachment have not been met.
I suggest Mr Bouie clearly begin all of his columns stating that he is a non paid operative for the DNC.
Whatever happened to common sense? Where has it fled to? Where will and by who will it come?
The President of the U.S. is a charlatan. Always has been. He did not receive the popular vote but he is our man that is in office.
It's time to take the law and make it accountable to all Americans.
If Trump does not meet the standard for impeachment, no President ever has or ever will and, as Bouie says, the impeachment clause becomes a dead letter. Which part of "crimes and misdemeanors" do some people not understand?
1
Did it every occur to this columnist and most of the commenters that Donald Trump was actually elected president? Everybody seems to assume that Trump has no supporters who are not imbeciles. Remember how many college educated women voted for Trump? Please remember that not all Americans feel as most commenters and the columnist do. Regardless of Trump has or has not done, no one should assume that everyone feels the same way. This is NOT an endorsement for Trump--it's just common sense.
1
@rocktumbler
I agree with you that there were some educated people who supported Trump---some of them of course who might have benefited from the tax cuts or other policies--and some who might actually have thought he would be a good president. But I think that the statistics would show that the more educated tended to and still tend to not support Trump (both genders included) and the less educated tended to and still tend to support him. Education does enhance the ability to think critically and recognize incompetence, ineptitude, and breaking accepted traditions more readily.
Impeachment would not succeed, and likely it would give Trump a lock on the presidency in 2020. Democrats should not even talk about it. Trump would LOVE to be impeached.
Let the electorate impeach him, at the ballot box. That is a fight that can be won, as long as the Dems genuinely rally round their nominee. They did not in 2016 and the result is history of the worst kind.
If Trump's actions while president do not rise to the level of deserving impeachment, what in the world would?
Does it take a more intelligent, more clever, more manipulative, more Machiavellian and sinister demagogue who will have already compromised the entire working of the government to serve his authoritarian ends to the point that no effective action can be undertaken to remove him?
I've got news for you. We have a demagogue in the White House right now who is more ignorant, crude, and lacking in intelligence than the above and he is already demonstrating that with the control of just one house of Congress he is effectively immune from conviction in a trial for his crimes and misdemeanors.
This does not bode well for the future of our democratic system. If this Mafia- like crude and ignorant person is able to flout the rule of law and violate his oath of office swearing to protect and defend the constitution with no consequences as we watch the fabric of our democracy disintegrate, God help us if the more clever and intelligent version of a demagogue as described above gets hold of the reins of power.
We need to reform the terms under which a president can be removed. Under the present system too much damage can be done in a situation where there is effectively no recourse to the citizens to stop the usurper of our democracy.
Indictment is the goal-- impeachment by law must come first.
Did Churchill think England's necessary resolve in WWII would end in success--Of Course Not. Was it the right thing to do. Of Course. You do What's Right--Not What's Easier
A total waste of time. There is no way this will pass in the Senate. Democrats are better served having hearings and leaving it to the public to decide.
Maybe Trump expects to be impeached. He dares us to impeach him with every egregious lie and move. And yet nothing. So far. He did not even expect that a person such as himself would win. Yet he did (with aid). This enfant terrible goes on only with our tolerance.
This is a battle that must be engaged lest this be the new normal, and a failure of the Democrats as much as the Republicans. The tools are there and all have yet to be used or used fully. The public too, though tired of this, is not going to be able to abdicate either, brush it away, "game over". They must be alerted to this pivotal moment.
Bouie, like many Democrats, is blinded by Trump and loses sight of the big picture which is passing legislation that helps all Americans.
Pursuing impeachment is a dead end, accomplishing nothing useful to Americans.
1
While I favor impeachment, I respect Nancy Pelosi and respect her smarts and leadership. I will back her decision.
Impeach?
It is very easy for the electorate to tell elected leaders what to do, and who what is grossly unpleasant on our behalf.
We knew Trump had more in common with a dictator and a crime overloard than he did with a regular person.
Now we want our elected leaders to do the heavy lifting, and get rid of a person we directly or indirectly (by voting third party candidates), explicitly (by switching votes to Trump to prove a point no one cared about) or implicitly (by not voting).
Shame on us.
Impeach? Fuggadaboutit.
Ask not what the elected leaders can do for us. The democrats are a class apart; polished, educated, urbane; the republicans have manners of pit bulls, anti-intellectual, and indistinguishable from rabble).
Ask what we can do for our country.
And that part is clear; unite behind who ever survives this circular firing squad of democratic primary, and vote for that ticket without squirming.
Along the way, we need to knock on the doors of people who agree with us, and disagree with us, and start talking. We are the ones who reject hate and disdain; well then let's act like it. I am not suggesting we go and try to convert a Limbaugh or Alex Jones fanatic, but there are plenty of people in between.
If I can't do that, then I cannot expect my elected rep to get messy with impeachment.
How about an article on "The Lure of Citizenship: Use it or lose it forever."
While the Democrats keep digging, maybe they could also tell us why so many FBI Senior Executives resigned under pressure or were fired the past few years.
“Democrats still have to defeat Trump at the ballot box, which means building a mass coalition against his politics...(yet) impeachment helps Democrats make a truly comprehensive case against the president, uniting his corruption, his criminality and his contempt for ordinary Americans under a single narrative. Impeachment, pursued with vigor, then becomes part of the larger argument against him.”
Congress & the voters boyj need to do their jobs. The only way to end this long national nightmare is to elect a Democrat to the presidency in 2020. Trump still has his base, faux emergencies, & his authoritarian right will fund an “independent” 3rd candidate to split the opposition.
We need a Blue Wave in 2020 by any name. Hold your breathe & your vote for the near perfect (?), & we’ll get more authoritarians like W & Trump.
Trump and other corrupt figures now possess a roadmap for conspiracy with a foreign power: just look aside enough when the treason is occurring, and you’re home free, per the implications of the Mueller report. Mueller refused to bring down the hammer on Trump, so if the Congress doesn’t do it, then goodbye to fair and hello to stolen elections, reeking with foreign support and motive to bring us down. Congress has no choice but to impeach Trump. Maybe then Trump—and any dishonest successor—will realize that getting in bed with adversaries cannot be endured.
For the first two years a Republican Congress showed themselves to be spineless wimps and I'm not expecting anything more from the Dems. They'll use different arguments but the result will be the same.
Jamelle Bouie
"The Lure of Impeachment
We need congressional action to cure our body politic as much as we need it for our moral health."
So true, so true.
What exactly is "criminal disregard for law and order"..? Is that the charge Mr. Bouie wants to impeach the President over.??
Seems pretty vague, to say the least..
-- I have yet to hear what specific action the President took that merits impeachment hearings and possible ouster from office. What is the exact crime he committed.??
- 'Misconduct' does not demand impeachment (no matter what Elizabeth Warren may think). Nor is outrage & contempt for Trump a reason for his removal...
-Let's get past the hyperventilating emotion.. What is the specific criminal act that calls for impeachment..?
Democrats must impeach Trump and have him removed from office. They are just waiting to have POTUS Pence in office.
Good article.
Thoughtful.
Now it's time to turn to the GOP, not the Dems, even though the Dems are in control of the House and impeachment.
The only reason why impeachment hasn't begun is due to the fact that the GOP won't convict Trump in a Senate trial.
This "fact" is repeated multiple times daily.
Instead of handwringing about what the House should do, it's time to turn the spotlight on McConnell et al relentlessly.
Those GOP Senators need to be reminded that they violate, and violated, their oaths of office every day.
They need to be named, called out, put under pressure to defend their cowardice and fear of a pathetic bully.
Trump isn't the only one failing to defend the constitution.
Lindsay Graham, for example, needs his feet held to the fire.
Light must be shown on all of them. Deer in the headlights.
Impeachment is only one half of the equation.
Trial in the Senate is the other half, and once again the GOP is silent in the face of Trump's high crimes and misdemeanors.
We can't allow this to continue.
They must be questioned, pressured, and reminded of their oath of office.
They must be shamed into doing what's right.
1
The Democrats are failing the country by not impeaching Trump.
They are coming over as weak and ineffectual, so why should the people vote for the Democrats in 2020?
1
I seem to recall learning that a seat in Congress meant a bit more than just the opportunity to ride that cool Capital Subway System. Aren't members of Congress supposed to represent their constituents and to work for the best interests of their country? Perhaps someone can explain to me why the Republicans in our Senate have collectively chosen to do nothing. Nothing. I would love to see the House of Representatives Impeach the Liar-in-Chief, and then I would love to see and hear the reactions of the millions of Americans who, like me, are sick and disgusted with the inaction of the Republican senators, led by the likes of McConnell and Graham. The freak show that is our government is a disgrace, but it can be stopped. Would that the 2020 elections were being held tomorrow!
Impeachment is an “all eggs, one basket” strategy. It will dominate the news cycle and drown everything else out.
At the end of it, there will be no conviction (the Senate won’t convict, even if the House impeaches). Nothing will come of it — failure. Worse, the Democratic Party will wind up more splintered. Purple state representatives may lose their seats in 2020. And Americans will be likely to view the Democratic Party as merely “the resistance” — the party of “no” — rather than as “leaders”, since nothing else will get done.
Democrats have a lot more to gain in 2020 than just getting rid of Trump. The goal should be a big blue wave in 2020. Dems, if they are smart, will play a long game instead. Pelosi is right.
Be you ever so powerful you are not above history.
History is destiny and Trump will be impeached by the facts,
and by the truth.
All is needed is that the Democrats embrace their destiny and start impeachment hearings, and give the people of America a chance to understand and know the truth about what criminality this man, Trump, has committed against the American people.
1
Hoyer probably thought Clinton would win by a landslide in 2016. Probably thinks an unimpeached Trump will lose again. Probably thinks the Russians won’t help Trump again.
You can’t control the outcome of an election, but Democrats can control the outcome of impeachment.
Would they rather have an “innocent” Trump to run against or one of three impeached Presidents, whose had all the dirty laundry aired to run against?
Whether impeached or not, Trump will blame Dems for the investigation and run against that. So you might as well impeach him and if you do a good enough job, sway the public and put pressure on the Senate to convict . And if public sentiment runs high against Trump during the process and there is no conviction, put pressure on those Senators who voted against conviction and get them out of office.
52
@SXM-Does it have to be an either/or choice? There are at least 17 investigations underway and necessary--what will these bring to light? I suspect Trump's criminality and evidence of treason, including selling the office of the Presidency. His children too are likely complicit. With so to lay out in public, the question of impeachment can hang in the air for a long time. No need to rush. Let's keep the focus on the investigations and getting progressive legislation passed.
6
@SXM: "You can’t control the outcome of an election..." Indeed. That's what makes the claim that Russia ensured the Trump victory as nothing more than an urban myth.
1
@SXM@Railbird
The real risk is detailed in Adam Golman's April 19 column with two other NYT reporters "Mueller report will draw more scrutiny to the Steele Dossier." They detail how the discredited dossier that was used to get FISA warrants on Paige and others was bogus. Comey, McCabe and Rosenstein AFFIRMED it to be credible when knowing it wasnt. Thereby misleading the court. Michael Horowitz, DOG IG has been investigating for six months and will issue his "damning" report in May.
With no warrants -no justification for Muellersinvestigation. Along with Barr and Graham probes will all reveal that documented (Andrew McCarthy) illegal spying on Trump campaign started with Obama meeting with Biden, Brennan, Clapper and Rice to stand down their anti-Russian election interference efforts in 2016. Rice confirmed in memo hours before Trump inauguration.
Barrs comments about unlawful spying wouldn't have been made in my view w/o him knowing what conclusions Horowitz would reveal. Barr has received 8 criminal referrals from GOP controled House Intel Commitee to further support the claim that the highest levels of NSC, IC, DON and conspiring MSM and leaking congressmen (eg. Schipp) conspired to unseat Trump.
It would not be prudent for Pelosi's House to forgoe impeachment until above is concluded. For if they don't -damaging Dem revelations will make "I" a forgotten dream, probably a dozen inditements, a Dem party wounded and pulled to far left and with a stunning defeat in 2020.
Concerned acquittal would mean martyrdom, I had been opposed to impeachment on political grounds. Then I heard Mr. Bouie and former Rep. Elizabeth Holtzman make the case. I have seen two presidents impeached in my lifetime, Richard Nixon in 1974 and Bill Clinton in '98-'99. Following Nixon's resignation, Democrats swept to a wave election victory in the '74 midterms and evicted Gerry Ford from the White House in '76. Following Clinton's acquittal in '99, his party lost the White House in 2000. Confronted with the facts, the political case against impeachment collapses. I trust Jerry Nadler, Adam Schiff, Speaker Pelosi, and the other Democratic leaders to conduct a thorough and deliberate investigation which holds the President accountable and educates the public. In the end, the truth will out. Politically, we are not trying to win over Trump's base, but keep in the fold the moderate Democrats and more than a few Republicans who turned out in '18 to give the Democrats their House Committee gavels which they now must wield. The President may have an army, but we have the rule of law - if, to paraphrase Benjamin Franklin, we can keep it.
1
I'd like to see every single Republican in Congress go on record as to whether what was clearly documented in the Mueller report is legitimate and acceptable Presidential behavior.
1
Whether to impeach is inherently a political decision and therefor the ONLY lens through which it should be viewed is: Will going forward increase or decrease the likelihood of electing a Democratic President in 2020? Every other consideration leads down a blind alley.
A public interview of the testimony is required. Republicans keep the investigation in the national security committees and thus kept a lid on the public knowing anything. Muller did not leak anything and the press releases were from unnamed sources and Fox and Trump stated that it was fake news. The Muller report is not fake news, it's bad news for America. Russia attacked us, got the president it wanted, and president took the help, lied about getting the help and obstructed the very legitimate investigation. People believed Cohen, the will believe the other witnesses. Keep passing legislation that will not pass in the Senate and start impeachment investigation, put it in tv and let it go to the public.
Democrats must pursue impeachment proceedings. Put it on the record, process the investigation through the senate. Otherwise, the 2020 voter apathy will be deafening.
3
Volume 1 of the Special Counsel’s Report leaves some unanswered questions. I would like answers to these questions. I encourage people to read it, not with the conclusion of the Special Counsel’s Office in mind, but with an open mind.
Vol. 2 of The Report demonstrates President Trump obstructed Justice.
As a young adult during Watergate, the idea a President had committed crimes and acted corruptly was disgusting and I thought demanded more punishment than Congress just removing President Nixon from Office. Impeachment is a constitutional remedy to fire a sitting President. One Republican Senator decided to vote for Impeachment, shifting a majority in the Senate for Impeachment. One.
It is the abuse of powers of some in Congress that make Impeachment political; it is blind loyalty to Party and to a criminal and corrupt President that says to Americans, “Our Party does not embrace the Constitution or the rule of law. Our Party condones criminality and corruption.”
Some suggest a presidential election decide the fate of a criminal President, but this is the job of Congress. The American voter should decide the fate of those in Congress who reject the Constitution they swore to uphold.
The majority in the House must proceed to hold this President accountable. Voters need to make a choice to preserve our democratic Republic by rejecting corrupt and anti-democratic politicians.
3
Bouie is an addition to the Times that I always look forward to. I began favoring impeachment last night, and this morning he is right on time. An outstanding writer and needed voice on the opinion staff. Very glad he's here.
4
I am not in favor of impeachment. I was angry at Republicans for wasting time with a lengthy impeachment process against Bill Clinton. Even though Trump’s transgressions are arguably more serious and substantial than the charges against Bill Clinton impeachment is a political loser for Democrats 18 months ahead of an election. However, if the House chooses not to impeach then they better make use of the time remaining in this term. Besides conducting oversight hearings I haven’t heard of a compelling agenda for the rest of the this year. What are you going to do and when are you going to do it?
1
“Very frankly, there is an election in 18 months and the American people will make a judgment.”
- Steny Hoyer
“The American people should have a voice in the selection of their next Supreme Court Justice. Therefore, this vacancy should not be filled until we have a new president.”
- Mitch McConnell
In both cases, it seems, the people did use their voices and make a judgement. In the previous elections: Re-electing President Obama in 2012 and flipping the House in 2018. Mr. Hoyer should at least come up with a less Republican-sounding argument against impeachment.
2
Yes, yes, and yes. Is impeachment the courageous and principled choice? Yes. Is impeachment the politically strategic choice? We just don't know. But if we don't have the guts to do what's right instead of gambling on what might be more expedient, where are we going to end up long after 2020?
For those who say with absolute certainty that impeachment will hurt Democrats in 2020, where did you buy your crystal ball? For those who say impeachment will distract from other issues like health care and immigration, don't you think voters are capable of holding more than one idea in their heads? Also, don't be so sure Democrats will win on those other issues.
3
Go for impeachment. But do it without all the grandstanding and capital steps interviews. Just do it. Do it without the naked partisan politics. There needs to be solemn discipline.
7
I’ve been reading the report - I’m still blown away by what I read on page 10 - that people in the report were known to have destroyed documents or used online chat tools that permanently deleted content. To the point that the report had to state that it is possible recommendations would be different if that content missing was available. I’ve only heard one news report reference that detail from page 10. After reading it, I thought “future generations are going to learn so much more about this story than we’ll probably ever know”. That said, this makes holding hearings even more important.
7
The Mueller report left a blueprint for House Dems to follow. Before screaming impeachment with no popular support, I think they need to follow that blueprint in front of the public. Convince the people because ideologues will never be convinced until popular demand. Call for all witnesses to ratify what they presented in the report and with follow up questions. Bring the feeling to the report, because that’s how politics is played now, in the arena of emotions. By disarming Trump, Dems can keep the pressure and continue doing other stuff (healthcare improvements, economics discussions, family support) that they also need to pay attention. Impeachment proceedings may burn them if not with enough support, but by any means stop pursuing what Mueller just detailed in his report.
3
The Democratic leadership has no real choice.
If they care about the rule of law and the concept of Congressional oversight, they must choose the path of impeachment and hold the President accountable
for his actions. It is more than symbolic. It is doing their duty and demonstrating that no President is a above the law. The Mueller report reveals at least 10 separate acts of obstruction and traitorous contacts with Russia to influence the election. It is not just up to the voters to seek justice. In addition, Trump is an unindicted co-conspirator in the Cohen hush money case and likely has impeachable violations of the emoluments clause. His organization is rumored to money launder for Russian kleptocrats and Arab autocrats and his taxes and financial records have not been revealed possibly due to malfeasance.
These all must be investigated and scrutinized so that justice is served and so that in the future Presidents will not behave like Trump and act above the law. This is choosing the courageous path of duty and forgetting about political calculations.
It is about the Constitution and Congressional oversight not winning elections. I believe the Democrats will be rewarded politically by doing this and sweep all the national elections in 2020. More importantly history will judge them kindly for their courage.
4
Couldn’t disagree more with the author. Democrats need to just focus on running a great candidate and voting Trump out in 2020. The Republicans would like nothing better than the Democrats wasting precious time and resources to mount a full blown Trump impeachment show. It would energize the way right Republican base and their rich donors. Their whole strategy is to whip up fear and anger in their base so they can stay in power. An impeachment circus will accomplish that for them. If Democrats fall for this trap, they very well could be looking at Trump until 2024,
3
In politics, it’s important to ensure that you lead people where they want to go and no further else you risk blowback. The issue of impeachment centers on how many people want it and want to get rid of Trump. Dems aren’t really saying no to impeachment, they’re saying get more data and get more people behind it. As a practical matter they have less than 18 months to get this done. So the strategy should be to investigate and present the facts to the American People who will take the information into he voting booth.
3
Totally agree. Could be done by oversight committee first. They need to know the redacted information if legal to reveal. They need to interview Mueller partly behind close doors and interview Pence to understand the support in the Cabinet for the 25th amendment use and Trump taxes and his businesses taxes and balance sheet to see if his hands are tied financially by debts to foreign powers. The present Mueller report tells us little we didn’t really believe about Trump but the above things would indicate he can’t continue to do his job. Otherwise censure him.
Jamelle,
If the Democrats impeach Trump, it will leave scars in America for a long time. Big scars.
I would recommend avoiding the division. A large number of American's love Trump and get all of their info from Trump tweets. (work on that problem, because that is the root of what you are experiencing).
If we impeach Trump, those tweets will turn dangerous, and, so will the people reading them.
Is that really what you want? Have you really though it through?
I don't think so.
5
We need a long, granular and very public investigation with the intent that Congress will decide if he should be impeached once the investigation is underway. Public opinion will swing towards impeachment of this President once the amount of involvement and collusion with foreign governments, including Russia, is exposed to the light of scrutiny.
Until the public understands the depth and breadth of corruption and immoral behavior of this administration, impeachment will remain an unpopular option since it is so disruptive and was used so carelessly (by the Republicans) in the past. The press must cover the Congressional hearings extensively.
5
I love the statement, “Very frankly, there is an election in 18 months and the American people will make a judgment.” Perhaps the following should be added:
So! Please dear God, let the democrats get on with creating and passing legislation rather than wasting countless millions on some sort of impeachment process that could be seen as simply a juvenile revenge against a juvenile!
What!?!? Well, yeah - there are a few things to manage such as the ever increasing healthcare costs, mounting economic inequality, corporations/oligopolies granted zero tax obligation, abandonment of regulation of financial institutions, the ballooning deficit in a near full employment economy, and that’s just for starters.
Although, I guess I can understand that politicians always wish to be the center of the media frenzy spotlight, and I do see that they will get a lot more exposure if they play the impeachment game.
804 years the Magna Carta that pressured King John to follow the same laws as everyone, we are facing a similar situation with a president who believes following laws is for losers. We need an American "magna carta" more now than in any time in the history of our democratic republic.
1
Myself, and many other moderates, including several Republican friends I know, swung the House to Dems for this exact purpose. To check this lawless President. Of course, hold hearings and investigate, and see where the evidence leads. Sunshine is the best disinfectant. If, as it appears, the President is guilty of high crimes and misdemeanors, they must vote to impeach, which is really just another way to say "indict". What happens in the Senate is irrelevant. Let Trump go in to the next election with this "indictment" over his head, and his disregard for our laws laid bare. His 30% base will stay with him to the end, but there's a vast middle ground which can be swayed, as they hear the evidence. They will not rally behind a lawless man, who is only looking out for himself.
3
Facts matter. Truth matters. The law matters. We must take a stand, present a case, and the lies will collapse like a house of cards.
3
Trump has singlehandedly robbed us of our civility, comfort, and community.
If this is not reason enough to impeach him, I can't imagine what is.
5
@Ken. Please explain how exactly Trump has done what you claim in your first sentence. Because it reads like insane hyperbole. Watch MSNBC and CNN much?
1
The best justification for impeachment is when the president clearly breaks the law. Most people, even some Republicans, would agree with that.
However, Mueller came up just shy of providing irrefutable evidence of a crime. Why? Because we're dealing with liars who are actually pretty good at it. They know they can say things to the press, to the public, to government employees, to other politicians, that are clearly false, and get away with it because that's not a crime.
Clinton was impeached on the grounds that he obstructed justice by lying during a grand jury deposition. Trump has avoided having to answer in person to a jury or a judge, instead lying in written answers to written questions from the special prosecutor (e.g.,"I don't remember", etc). He needs to be caught in full view in the act of lying to proper authorities.
Given this, the House should subpoena Trump specifically to have him re-attempt to answer those questions where his memory seems to have previously failed. Of course he'll refuse to testify based on executive privilege, precedent, past practice, whatever. But through the process it will become even more obvious that he has something to hide and to lie about. Besides, deep down everyone knows he's a liar, so there will be no argument to settle; just another uncomfortable episode to watch of a two-bit businessman and celeb thrashing and squirming to get out of his latest jam.
I'd rather see that show than the impeachment mini-series.
2
It is curious that this huge outcry of how outraged we should be about how Trump acted is just being raised now after the Mueller report has been released. And this is because the actions in question have all been committed in public before the whole country. Mueller makes it clear in his report that everything Trump did that may have constituted obstruction of justice was all public knowledge. And so the Mueller report did not tell us of anything that was previously not known. And yet after Trump did all that he did nobody was the least bit outraged, let alone yell for his impeachment.
And the reason for this is beyond obvious to any objective observer. And that is all those now calling for impeachment were waiting for the Mueller report to be the end of Trump. And now that Trump has been fully cleared of the treasonous crime Mueller was tasked with investigating there is tremendous disappointment that Trump isn't going to prison, let alone being removed from office.
And so the calls for impeachment are a case of sore losers, people didn't get what they wanted so they are determined to get it anyway they can. And this is clearly the way history will view this impeachment. That the Democrats were eagerly waiting 2 years for a report that would have gotten Trump impeached and when that didn't happen they decided to impeach him anyway they could, making a total joke of themselves and the impeachment process itself.
I think the most persuasive argument for impeachment is that it puts the GOP on trial. Their only option is to acquiesce to the facts or to side with an incompetent crook. No, it won’t persuade Trump’s base, but that’s a given and who cares? The downside is the distraction, especially where down ticket races are concerned. Timing is critical, and in that regard it may already be too late.
2
Based on experiencing a first term with Trump, a decent person would not vote for him again.
1
"Impeachment gives Democrats a real chance to seize the initiative."
Sure. Go ahead. Move on to impeachment. But be prepared for the unintended consequences.
Will the electorate see the Democrats' obsessive hatred of Trump as the principled pursuit of their constitutional duty? Or will they see the spiraling onslaught of shotgun investigations as a politically driven abuse of their power?
1
An election in 18 months - the so-called people's option - will be WAY too late. The degree of damage these sycophants and petty grifters are inflicting on this nation (not to mention the globe) every day is going to take decades to undo, if in fact there is any way to undo it. Every single day that these people are ripping off the country will take years for the rest of us to recover from. Every 'decision' these people make on any policy whatsoever profits them personally, and too, this gang of jokers have very real and palpable incentives to stay in power, as otherwise they would be facing jail time. So, yes, thank you Mr. Bouie for helping get out this SOS. It's now or never.
4
This moment is peak Trump and Trump the master negotiator should seize his dead cat bounce of the Barr Report to negotiate a resignation while the gettin' away is good. At this point, he has more cards to play than he ever will again.
What's coming down the pipeline? The states and Congressional democrats investigations are gaining traction and once they get moving there's no stopping. Trump should negotiate now to get the best out of all the bad deals shortly to avalanche on his head. Surely the master dealmaker can see this. If not, then maybe he is Wile E. Coyote and that avalanche is really an anvil.
4
If Dems don't impeach they are guilty of dereliction of duty. We know he won't be convicted in the Senate but that is immaterial. Impeachment will expose the nefarious Trump far more than what we see in the Mueller report.
4
Written exactly like a classic Democrat... Triangulation and talking themselves out of the right thing to do constantly. It's so clear that Trump needs to be impeached, can you imagine the Democrats not impeaching and then losing the election in 2020? I can.
3
On the contrary dont do it right off. Let the House produce long painful hearings which will split the uninformed voters form the sauburban housewives. Embarss every last Republican. At that point if the polling numbers aer going down then Dems can introduce an impeachment bill. The goal should be to maximie Republican humiliation.
1
It is becoming so comical. An outsider becomes President of the United States. The Washington political establishment and the Deep State is shocked and so is the media as its narrative falls on its face.
The President is falsely accused of colluding with a Foreign government. He obviously reacts and tries to see how this can be stopped. A politically motivated team of prosecutors grinds through the process with jubilant media making millions on 'Breaking News' and feeding on leaks. They succeed in midterm elections.
The result comes as no collusion leading to elections. With the Democratic Congress in place, the special counsel says there were efforts to obstruct justice in a crime that never existed. Media and Opposition change goalposts and starts saying Impeach him for obstruction.
People associated with the President go to jail for lying to FBI, lying to Congress - they really get trapped in many cases and has nothing to do with collusion or election. Many go bankrupt due to legal fees.
The Pulitzer winning media with access to everyone not only misses the election call, but also misses the fact that the investigation was wrong to start with. But they still want a Pulitzer by bringing the President down.
How dare someone outside the Washington establishment comes over and takes over the White House? The founding fathers are probably turning in their graves.
Oscar please!!!
J. Bouie, you and the democrats should definitely do what you do best: pursue the symbolic, self-righteous (impeachment) at the expense of anything pragmatic, realistic or beneficial to the country as a whole.
To do otherwise would be completely off brand and potentially confusing to its constituents.
The moral argument is true but the political argument is not. This is exactly the same kind of magical thinking that got us Trump in the first place, when everyone who should have voted stayed home because they knew Hillary was going to win.
Now, I do not wish to roll the dice on an "it just may be" argument that the electorate will take heart from impeachment proceedings and vote against Trump. In fact, it is already clear that Fox News ideologues are salivating for the opportunity to hold up impeachment as the rallying cry for their failing base of good-ol'-boys.
Those who believe in this kind of commentary will be complicit in Trump's reelection. Don't whine in the aftermath of his success if you have goaded your representatives to follow this path to disaster.
1
It would be just for Trump to be removed from office in disgrace but it's not a realistic possibility. Better to focus on bringing about a better government and one that serves all justly. The problem with Trump is those who support him and it is they with who the rest of us must achieve a better relationship going forward. He is just not that important in the whole scheme of things.
Pelosi should wade into the quagmire now present in the House and take a firm stance.
The only rationale explanation for he not acting is the potential backlash from the far left in her own party. Impeachment is a waste of time as it will never stand muster in the Senate. Let’s not forget the Democrats are at the center of this attack on Trump over a conspiracy that did not exist and would then be held accountable for their actions.
1
I am in the camp of those who would not try impeachment. I think it all comes down to this - what would you do if you could see the future?
Seriously, if you knew, actually KNEW, that impeachment in the House would result in Trump being re-elected, while forbearance would mean his defeat, would you choose impeachment anyway, to satisfy principle?
I dont't want that, so I don't want a principled attempt at impeachment. The Democrats in Congress wouldn't be hurting just themselves, they would be hurting ME.
3
Hold hearings, yes, but ultimately make it a choice between impeachment and conviction or censure. The latter may force some Republicans to acknowledge that Trump has been a danger to our republic.
4
Some say yes, some say no. I say split the difference and wait until election season next year.
1
Prior to starting impeachment proceedings, Mueller’s equivocation and Barr’s exoneration must be pretty well thoroughly discredited in virtually all Democrats’ and Independents’ minds.
It’s important to stand on principle, but American culture is profoundly pragmatic (ie, we like winners); and unless you want standing on principle to amount to dying on your sword (ie, losing the war as well as the battle), you’d better be sure that most potential voters are ready and willing to stand with you and take the heat alongside you—and won’t see your principled-ness as self-righteous, self-interested, misguided, or merely symbolic. When was the last time Americans preferred the symbolic over the truly effective?
2
I would like to see a long, drawn out, and thorough grinding inquiry, conducted in public, that dangles impeachment like the sword of Damocles over the head of this administration for as long as possible. It should control the news cycle and supplant the press’s daily review of the president’s tweets and palace intrigue stories for the rest of his time in office.
But I would probably be satisfied if the outcome of the inquiry never quite made it to impeachment—just dragging on forever like Benghazi but with real scandals. I do support a censure resolution that would itemize everything and force everyone in both houses to vote on every element, and legislation to protect our elections from stuff like this ever happening again will be required to fight back charges of a do nothing Congress.
6
Yes. I especially like the "Benghazzi but with facts" point.
If Trump broke the law, let the criminal justice system and the courts deal with him.
I want my elected representatives to deal with my issues - lower the cost of prescription drugs, reduce the federal deficit, stop global warming, fix our infrastructure, and many more things.
I hope Trump goes to prison, but he’s just not that important.
1
Thank you, Mr. Bouie for voicing the arguments for impeachment. I second your arguments for impeachment and add these points:
- Trump’s goal is to run out the clock to get to the next election;
- based on the foregoing, it is imperative Democrats stop vacillating and proceed quickly;
- we all know the Republicans in the Senate will not support removal from office; fine, put them on record supporting an immoral, unethical and lawless President;
- the sooner this gets done, the sooner Democrats can focus on their agenda/message and demonstrate that they care about our constitutional government:
“if House Democrats believe Trump has violated the Constitution, they have an obligation to act on that belief, even if conviction in the Senate is impossible under current political circumstances.”
6
"Trump wouldn’t be president, for example, without his keen manipulation of race and identity"
No, that would be the media who attempt to insert this into everything.
3
The Democrats have no obligation to pursue an impeachment fated to fail to remove Trump from office.
The only obligation the Democrats have is to move heaven and earth to defeat Trump and his minions in 2020.
Jamelle, you may think that impeachment may help the Democrats build a "comprehensive case" against Trump in the 2020 elections, but for how to run an effective campaign, I think I'll pay attention to elected office holders who spend their time listening to voters and figuring out how to speak to them and address their needs.
1
@Marc: On the other hand, there must be some point at which we refuse to tolerate a president like this. It's not entirely about planning the 2020 campaign, there is the issue of the rule of law. You're right about respecting the judgement of the legislators who will be carrying out the procedure, or not -- but there are elected legislators on both sides of the issue. It behooves us all to make our opinion known. I lean toward impeaching him.
6
The Lure of Impeachment or The Compelling Pull of Justice. Lincoln didn't know how things would end and neither did Washington, FDR, JFK. But all were compelled towards Justice. This is what makes America Great.
4
@TWShe Said Can't argue with those guys, especially if you're saying they would want him impeached.
100 % in agreement with this article. Impeachment is clearly merited, and is ethically obligatory in fact. That it will be a good electoral strategy is gravy. We have to do this.
8
I’m not pleased to see Jerrold Nadler’s most recent press briefings with a backdrop that includes his name printed in big letters. It shows that he wants attention and wants everyone to know his name.
1
Donald Trump has already left a lasting deep scar across our US landscape - but Mr. Bouie states "Democrats should focus on their supporters, who voted in large numbers to give the party a House majority and keep the president in check."
This does not acknowledge that many of these representatives were elected in districts that are evenly split & the candidate did not focus on Trump but health care, the economy, and other issues important to a more broad spectrum of voters. To hold Impeachment Hearings that would run during the campaign & possibly the actual election would galvanize Trump & his supporters who thrive on anger & hatred - don't do it. Democrats should hold the appropriate investigative hearings to put his life of illegal behavior on display but please - make our main focus on organizing behind a good Democrat candidate & winning in 2020.
3
Impeachment proceedings are the Constitutional obligation of the House, given the findings available in the Mueller Report, even redacted.
It should not matter which party is in the majority in the House, but frankly, it does at this sorry moment in our political life, unhappily but not yet tragically for the health of American Democracy.
Voters elected a Democratic party majority in the House for precisely this check on the Executive Branch and abuse of presidential power and authority. The voters have already spoken on this matter. Resoundingly. It does not matter if the Republican-controlled Senate can be expected to do its duty. The House can and should do its.
Put aside strategy and take up responsibility. Act honorably rather than politically. Begin impeachment hearings now, and feed evidence from the House investigations into those hearings. There's more than enough to be going on with, just in the public record and the redacted Special Counsel's Report.
6
This. If politics outweigh constitutional responsibilities then we are no longer a country based on laws but of a county based on the choices of the people in power. The Constitution clearly states that impeachment is required in a circumstance such as Trump. To abdicate that responsibility now would signify that the duties of Congress stated in the Constitution are merely suggestions to be followed and not requirements that must be obeyed.
3
I am of the opinion that an impeachment might stretch out and disrupt the primary process. If I were Pelosi I bargain with McConnell over impeachment with a goal of getting him to agree that the Congress would censure the president. He would agree to bring such a measure to the Senate.
Then, the appropriate committees could go forward with processing Trump under the 25th amendment. He should be no more problem then.
1
Americans traditionally love an underdog.
If anything, impeachment in the House will build a good case not against Mr. Trump in 2020, but for him.
Impeach away. Unite Republicans, unite everyone who is not a die heart Democrat.
6
Impeachment is a political process and should be viewed in that light. So the real question for me would be whether this is good for the party, and I would say it isn't.
The reason for that is that if you look at the Nixon and Clinton impeachments, they happened much earlier in each president's term and there was time to wage an election campaign. Any impeachment process -- and it can take many months -- would take us right into the 2020 elections.
Americans have bread and butter issues they want the parties to address. To try to do that in the glare of impeachment hearings, an impeachment debate in the house, and an impeachment trial in the senate (which Dems would lose), would be a formula for suicide at the polls.
Let the American people impeach this guy right out of office. Conduct the trial of his actions in a presidential campaign. It's the best and only way at this point.
2
I've been torn about impeachment, worried about the political ramifications and Trump being re-elected. It's time. The man obstructed justice. He committed a crime. The American people must take a stand against lawlessness, against an imperial presidency. No man is above the law. Let's put our experiment in democracy on the line - the rule of law obeyed by all people, or autocracy. If we lose, we'll be no worse off than where we're headed anyway.
3
Impeachment is indeed a lure. When one evaluates the plusses and minuses of impeachment, the balance tends toward not pursuing it at this time. If indeed impeachment is successful now, there would be a quick pardon from M. Pence. The POTUS would not have to answer in federal court (and to history) for his offenses while in office. Democratic candidates for any/all offices must concentrate on the day to day issues that concern our populace. If the White House is indeed won by the Democratic party the current POTUS would go on trial with no pardon in sight. He must answer for any illegal or unethical activities.
3
Presidential Elections have 2 points: 1) to elect a President and 2) to convibce both supporters and opponents to that the election was legitimate. Since 2000, we've had 4 elections that significant parts of the population do not consider legitimate for reasons that have little to do with the obsolete Electoral College. 2000: the result of Florida's broken voting systems and the intervention of the US Supreme Court justified by pretzel logic, 2008 and 2012: by racist Birtherism; 2016: by the complete fusion of politics and the entertainment industries driven by the surveillance business models of Facebook and Google that killed traditional journalism. Each episode in a positive feedback loop. When Trump loses in 2020, he will not go quietly. The process of the Fall of the Republic probably reached the point of no return with McConnell's block of Merrick Garland, not even Trump. McConnell is the true Palpatine of this story.
5
The Mueller report documents the active and passive acts that permitted Russian influence of the 2016 presidential election. All the parties involved should be prosecuted to the full extent of the law. This includes Trump and the appropriate members of his administration as well as Obama and similar parties from his dats in the Oval Office. After all, it has widely been suggested that while there are questions about indicting a sitting president there is no such restrictions once they have left office.
2
Senator Warren's call for impeachment is a call to duty, for Democrats and Republicans. No one wants to impeach a sitting president, I'd rather Congress pass meaningful legislation on environmental protections, gun safety and healthcare, etc. And the Democrats in the House have passed some significant legislation, on Net Neutrality most recently, or on gun safety, that are effectively nonstarters in the Republican Senate. Does this mean that the House shouldn't pursue a progressive legislative agenda? No. Does Senate Republicans dereliction of duty to hold Mr Trump accountable mean that the House shouldn't pursue impeachment? Of course not.
If accepting help from a hostile foreign power to influence an election, then actively seeking to obstruct the investigation into that influence aren't offenses worthy of impeachment, then the Constitution is dead.
8
What is the Constitution for? Right now, it is some kind of joke. IMO, the Founders of our Nation thought those elected would do the right thing. No such luck, first on the Right, now on the Left.
Our Nation is doomed as both sides think keeping power over their duty to our country. The only difference is that the Left will debate before doing nothing, while the Right actively works to undermine our government.
If a sitting president cannot be indicted, then as a practical reality, our presdient is above the law. Taking any action, for any reason, that cannot lead to removal and punishment is at best, pointless. Ok, it might be instructive for a high school political science class but then the Republicans would just alter the texbooks.
1
Trump doesn't have a base--he has a broad collection of small fervent minorities, whose ideologies and fantasies embrace everything from violence to cruelty to children. Slave owner, Yale graduate, South Carolina senator John C. Calhoun described this as a majority of minorities. Not organic coalitions, but single issue groups bundled together behind a common authoritarian leader.
No Democrat will be able to shake loose Trump's racist supporters. None will be able to move his supporters towards a sensible immigration policy, as evident by his government shutdown that cost the US economy $15 billion. No Democrat will be able to shift Trump supporters toward supporting choice for women. Taken collectively, these groups make up Trump's base. Ideology is a better predictor of Trump's support than age race income or education.
It is too often lost on audiences that Trump's campaign included these multiple hot button talking points, foremost supporting misogyny and white nationalism.
That said, despite the warnings, there is every reason to pursue multi-paths to Trump's defeat. Impeachment would make clear the willingness to assume the responsibility and power of governing by American interests and values, unlike Trump's rush to put personal and private interests first. Policy and legislation would put forth the Democrats plan for prosperity and civil liberties in a changing world. The two approaches are not mutually exclusive!
4
Of course! Every aspect of every moment of every Trump supporters lives must be consumed by racism, homophobia and misogyny. It absolutely cannot be motivated by a revulsion for tax and spend policies (Warren and student loan forgiveness), social engineering (Sanders and Medicare for All), antagonist views of success (Ocasio-Cortez and the immorality of wealth) or the embrace of anti-market forces (the remaining dozens of Dem candidates and the push for $15).
1
The question of wether or not to begin impeachment proceedings seems to become more clear every day since the Mueller report came out. Not only do the many instances of President Trump's flagrant disregard for the laws and morals of his position as President of the United States become more evident and pungent, the constitutional obligation of the Congress to exercise it's checks and balances is pleading to be heard. Impeachment may now be the only way to honor and uphold both the United States Constitution and the office of President of the United States.
4
I understand why some are reluctant to go down the impeachment path. However, I am greatly concerned that the Democrats will botch another presidential election they should win easily (as in 2000, as in 2004, as in 2016). The Republicans are pulling out all the stops with voter suppression and stealing elections (e.g., in 2000, most recently last year with the governorship of Georgia). Will Democrat voters choose a candidate who can stand up to Trump in the debates and sway younger voters (and voters of color) to turn out at the polls in such numbers that voter suppression and the Electoral College won't be able to keep Trump and McConnell in office? I'm not confident. Thus I think Democrats have to pursue saving our country from Trump and the Republicans on every front they can, including impeachment. No, the Senate won't convict, but then the Democrats can use that as a campaign issue.
Will we fight the Night King or serve as his subjects?
3
If impeachment is not the goal of all these investigations, just what is the point of it all. Either impeach now or start doing real legislative work, like working on bills that might actually get signed into law. Quit stalling.
3
I was against impeachment but have changed my mind, partly because of Mr. Bouie's OpEd. Trump's offenses against the Constitution and the rule of law are so egregious that they must be tried in the House.
Mitch McConnell's Senate will not vote to convict. And Democrats may pay a price in 2020. But the issue here is greater than political calculus. The soul of our county is wounded, and we need to heal it.
4
I support impeachment as the constitutional duty of the House, but I think the most important thing to do at this point is present the case to the American people. For those of us who have read the Mueller report, the case has already been made. However, most Americans will never read the report, so they're left with Barr's summary and Trump's gaslighting. Democrats in the House had been doing real investigations into Nixon--with considerable pushback from Republicans--for months before the public was onboard. When the public came onboard, so did GOP Senate leaders.
I'm less cynical than many commenters about the possibility of getting 20 GOP senators to convict, but we have to lay the case out in vivid detail first. We have to frame this narrative, and we have to let Americans see the drama on C-SPAN. Let them see Trump officials testifying, as they did before Mueller. Let members of Mueller's team and Mueller himself testify. Let's get the tax returns and the records from Deutsche Bank and Trump's accounting firm. Most Americans don't have time to read a 400-page report, but they will watch the drama on TV because it's compelling.
Most important, let's have members of Congress see the full, unredacted report before they present their case.
As any prosecutor knows, you don't bring the case until you're ready.
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@SandraH. I think the televised aspect of the Watergate hearings was important, as in the earlier McCarthy hearings. But the Democrats must find a way to keep it from becoming a TV reality show circus, bearing in mind that that is Trump's natural habitat.
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@SandraH.
It is a slow but steady course. The House has a constitutional duty to investigate and impeach if the evidence is strong (and already it appears to be so). If the Senate does not cooperate, so be it. The Republicans will pay the price for their support of a compromised, corrupt, and criminal WH occupant who won with the accepted and invited help of a hostile foreign power.
25
@SandraH. This column is a great example of why Progressives rarely have good political advice. The left & their allies who are pushing this train are motivated by hate & outrage. They're completely oblivious to the consequences of their proposed actions. Impeaching Trump will facilitate his winning a 2nd term, which would be devastating for the Democratic party. The Democrats were not elected to hold endless hearings on the Trump administration. They were given a House majority to craft & pass good legislation. Pelosi to her credit is trying to keep everyone's eye on the ball. But leftist zealots are determined to drive the party straight off the cliff. The House should fix DACA, address immigration issues, & improve the healthcare system. Focusing on impeachment is an exercise in total futility. There's zero chance the GOP controlled Senate will vote to impeach. Going down this path will keep the issue in the forefront for the 2020 election. The election should be about health care, the economy, immigration reform, etc. & not about the Trump Russia scandal. Impeachment hearings driven by Progressive fanatics will certainly over-reach. It will be easily spun by Trump as a witch hunt to fair-minded voters. When impeachment fails in the Senate, Trump will again claim victory. The pure efficiency that Democrats are able to deploy when it comes to shooting themselves in the foot is often breathtaking. This is the one time we should resist the temptation to pull the trigger.
9
FDR: "So, first of all, let me assert my firm belief that the only thing we have to fear is...fear itself — nameless, unreasoning, unjustified terror which paralyzes needed efforts to convert retreat into advance."
We treat Trump as a justifiable fear, but he is but a man, a man who has broken laws and seduced a political party. Together they are complicit in undermining everything we believe in as Americans.
We need to overcome our fear and take action; our failure will be our downfall.
3
It seems to me that it is somewhat inappropriate for Senator Warren to be voicing her opinion on impeachment. Senators acts as the judges in an impeachment trial and should remain impartial until presented with evidence by the managers from the House and the time comes to vote.
28
@TH impeachment means there is an actual trial in the Senate. She’s stating that if a case is not even brought to trial then he really is above the law. That concept means not that you are convicted and jailed. It that you are held to account by a court whatever the outcom. People who are above the law aren’t even subjected to a proceeding, they exist outside the law. This is what the Senator opposes.
30
@TH I read her comment as being supportive of the process going forward, as in favoring prosecution. In the Senate, members would be prosecutors and jurors.
6
@TH
An impeachment trial in the Senate is unlike a jury trial in a circuit court. The only requirement to be able to cast a vote in an impeachment trial in the Senate is that you have to be a Senator.
3
The Mueller report flatly states that Russia began interfering in American democracy in 2014. Over the next couple of years, the effort blossomed into a robust attempt to interfere in our 2016 presidential election. The Obama administration knew this was going on and yet did very little to stop it. In 2016, Obama's National Security Adviser Susan Rice told her staff to "stand down" and "knock it off" as they drew up plans to "strike back" against the Russians lest it affect the Iran nuclear deal negotiations. While they did finally apply sanctions against the Russians, it didn't happen until Trump already became President Elect. So in retrospect, Putin, Obama and Clinton (who did not run a stellar campaign) appear to be share responsibility for the disaster that is Donald Trump
2
It is clear that Trump deserves to be impeached. Whether to initiate impeachment proceedings is a more complicated and strategic political decision.
If I were a democratic strategist, my mantra would be: RUSSIA HELPED TRUMP WIN. And per the Republican playbook, repeat ad nauseam. Especially now that Rudy Giuliani has proclaimed there's "nothing wrong" with accepting damaging information on a political opponent from a hostile foreign power or using their stolen information to benefit your candidate. Can it get any lower?
Trump supporters like to repeat the specious claim that Russia didn't change any votes. They have no facts or data to support this claim, but it doesn't stop them from repeating it over and over and over.
Democrats need to counter that argument with the fact that, according to every US intelligence agency, the Russians' goal was to help Trump win the election and, although the data is impossible to quantify, there is considerably more evidence that their efforts benefited Trump than that they had no effect at all.
96
@Morals Matter
Another good mantra in response to "No Collusion":
Yes Corruption
5
@Morals Matter
'Rudy Giuliani has proclaimed there's "nothing wrong" with accepting damaging information on a political opponent from a hostile foreign power or using their stolen information to benefit your candidate.'
My jaw dropped when I witnessed him say this on Meet the Press. This is the script to a Democratic campaign ad that practically writes itself. You go Rudy!
2
@Morals Matter, and add that "Trump encouraged and cooperated with Russia." It's not like the Trump campaign just sat back and accepted Russia's help. The cooperation they provided helped Russia time stolen email dumps and adjust targeting and messaging in their social media campaigns. And Trump knew exactly what Russia expected in return, namely the lifting of sanctions and a free hand in Ukraine. If there was "nothing wrong" with what they did, why all the lying? Why the obstruction? Russia helped Trump win, and Trump helped Russia do it.
5
It would be unfair to impeach President Trump. The democrats should be ashamed for being sore losers for so long. Detente with Russia and many other countries should be valued as something positive rather than something negative.
16
@Sandra J. Amodio
I don't see anywhere in the Jamelle Bouie op-ed or the comments a suggestion that Trump should be impeached because of a detente with Russia or any other detentes.
The resounding reason for impeachment seems to be the belief Trump has no respect for the office he holds and has abused it's powers and that he should be held accountable for his actions.
25
Detente is good and we should pursue it. But detente does not include permission for foreigners to participate in our election process, or an OK for the president to pursue business opportunities with foreigners while in office.
23
@Sandra J. Amodio Detente does not cover the Russian interference in US elections.
9
The argument for impeachment is a short-game argument because it ignores the long term consequences of an acquittal in the Senate - the odds of which are on a par with those of the sun setting in the West for the next 7 days straight.
Republicans don’t care what Trump did/does or didn’t/doesn’t do because they now have an unparalleled opportunity to pack the federal bench with jurists who will outlive the current administration and finish the Conservative-paint-by-numbers-still-life exactly as they have envisioned since the days of FDR.
As principled as the arguments for impeachment may be, we would all do well to remember that absent a considerable Republican buy-in, Trump would walk. And if he did, that would equate to another 4 years of Republican Rapture and unimpeded Federalist Society judicial appointments, including, possibly, 1-2 Supreme Court appointments.
Given what’s at stake, the long game is far more important than the short one.
40
The author is aware that chances of removing him from office are close to zero. That is not his argument. There is no reason not to impeach from an electoral standpoint, and no guarantee that, impeached or not, he will win in 2020. Doing nothing disrespects the office and everyone who has ever held it. Trump's actions as president are worse than those of Andrew Johnson, Nixon and Clinton combined.
14
@Julio Wong
You're right: Nadler and Schiff are pretty much self-serving DNC Politburo buffoons, a grotesque sideshow and reminder of what the DNC has brought to the American polis.
@Julio Wong
Yeah yeah yeah. The odds on Trump winning in 2016 were precisely 11.1:1. Sometimes the longshot comes in first. It would take only 20 Republican senators voting with the Democratic Caucus of 47 to clear their consciences and vote for conviction. Much better odds than 11.1:1!
1
There is an alternative, suggested by Karen Tumulty of the Washington Post: bring a censure resolution against Trump. Only one previous president, Andrew Jackson, has been censured by congress. By censuring Trump, House Democrats could put forth the same evidence of horrendous offenses that an impeachment proceeding would drag into the light, but avoid the futility of a vote in the Senate that Trump's Republican cohorts would surely defeat. Seems like an idea worth considering.
252
@Ncsdad
I am not sure censure would do anything to moderate Trump. First, it is not really part of the Constitution, so right away, you have a legal fight that would likely drag on past the election while simultaneously not allowing for the kind of discovery you hope to make. Then there is the idea itself -- it only matters to someone of principal.
11
@Tom. Neither will impeachment without conviction. He is incorrigible. But censure puts the Democrats on record as holding law above persons, unlike the gutless Republicans in the Senate and previously in the House. And it ameliorates the risk of overreach that could result in the loss of a majority in the House and failure to flip the Senate. A Democratic president without a Democratic Congress mandates governing by Executive Orders, which, as we have seen over the past 28 months, are easily overturned.
21
@Ncsdad Sorry, but that's probably the worst idea of all time. If you catch a bank robber in the act, do you threaten to tell his mother?
No--you land on him with the full force of the law. Anything else displays only weakness.
A censure says only that we don't like his behavior. Most of Trump's supporters are glad that we don't like his behavior.
A censure would amount to an admission, essentially, that while reprehensible, his behavior is not impeachable.
36
Totally agree, Mr. Bouie. And well stated.
I also believe that, aside from the Constitutional imperative, impeachment would be an electoral boon for the Democrats. Imagine the outrage when the House impeaches Trump, and Senate Republicans vote to acquit him and leave him in place! there would clearly be no place to go except to give the Democrats total control of government - House, Senate, Presidency.
Impeachment is a 'no lose' for the Democrats.
29
@Paul Birkeland I think like you do, and would have that reaction. Unfortunately, there is a sea of red to the east of us filled with people who would have the opposite reaction that we think is only sensible.
It’s discouraging, exasperating, even unbelievable at times. But there they are, and still are—watching Fox News, going to Trump rallies, and voting (R) from now and forever more.
Citizens United, super pac/special interest money, and the extent to which candidates are marketed like best-selling household cleaning products collectively make a Democratic 3-pointer in 2020 anything but a done deal.
1
The integrity and sanctity of our constitution must be upheld. Any president must be held accountable for his actions vis-a-vis the laws of our land and in accordance with our system of checks and balances.
Regardless of the political climate of opinion, Congress must uphold our laws and do what is right according to its constitutional charter and duties. My plea to Congress, impeach President Trump.
28
@JCT I'd agree if we had enough time to battle through all the obfuscation and delay and misdirection and legal remedies that may take months to resolve, and suddenly the election is on us and we spent our political energies slogging through the sleaze. Meanwhile there's infrastructure that needs restoration, voting rights that need protecting, bread and butter issues like protecting Social Security, Medicare and Medicaid, all which need congressional attention. You can't impeach and do those things too. We don't have Nixon's "Plumbers" nor his hours of incriminating tapes to win the impeachment argument. Instead we have a pathological liar who will smother the airways of the Right with ersatz urgency and pseudo panic to excite the right wing base and confuse the impeachment process. There isn't time for that, Constitutionally correct as it might technically be.
Is there any doubt that if the parties were reversed, Republicans would be moving ahead at full speed with impeachment proceedings? I wish such grave matters were above partisanship, but with the exception of Mitt Romney, the GOP has either fully backed President Trump and A.G. Barr's dishonest interpretations of the Mueller Report, or remained mute. Let the GOP defend the lies of their leader in front of the American public. I don't know if that brutal process will irreparably damage our democracy, but the path we're currently on certainly will.
54
@PeterKa -- "Is there any doubt that if the parties were reversed, Republicans would be moving ahead at full speed with impeachment proceedings?"
They did. It did not work out well for them. Gingrich was run out of town, and Bill Clinton emerged such a hero that his wife was expected to be President as Clinton II in a race against Bush III.
It worked out so badly for them, that Democrats should do the same thing?
3
@PeterKa
Mitt Romney's is my Senator. His public statement specifically said "The business of government can move on."
In standard Republican fashion, Romney criticized Trump while attempting to exonerate him. You should read the statement. Romney is pandering to Utah conservatives who don't like Trump while doing absolutely nothing to prevent or respond to Trump's misconduct. Sound like Jeff Flake? That's because it's the same exact political strategy.
The only difference is Romney is going to get reelected in Utah no matter what he does. Death or retirement are his only paths out the door.
3
@Mark Thomason. You forget that Bill Clinton was so radioactive by the end of his second term that Al Gore didn’t want his help on the campaign trail. Americans were repelled by Clinton’s infidelity committed in the Oval Office.
1
It will be a disaster for us and for the world if Donald Trump is reelected in 2020. I believe that if he is impeached in the House, but found innocent in the Senate, he stands a much better chance for a second term in office. The best course of action is for the Democrats to expose all of Trump's wrong-doing by means of house investigations and continuing cases in various federal and state courts. Keep the pressure on. Show him to be the cheat and con man that he is. Then take over the entire government — House, Senate and White House — in 2020. Also make huge gains in state and local elections. It isn't just Trump. The entire Republican Party has let this nation down. They must be removed from office. The people must act.
Care to state the basis for your "belief"?
Trump wanted to obstruct justice. He probably did by firing Comey (since it was right after Comey appointed Mueller) and would have fired Mueller a if he didn't have underlings with a conscience. In a nationally televised debate with Clinton, he called on Russia to hack/release her emails. Trump was supposed to divest his business dealings when he became a candidate but continued to try to get a hotel in Russia. He never released his taxes and actually bragged about not paying any. He has called the press the "enemy of the people".
Everybody has gotten too bogged down looking for the "smoking gun" when he has, in the clear light of day, done all of the above as well as paid off 2 women to keep quiet about affairs with him, using campaign funds to pay her off.
In other words, he has committed so many unthinkable acts for a person who is President of the United States there isn't any ONE thing! It is confusing and almost unbelievable. Let's all take the sand out of our eyes and stop letting him bamboozle us with his dissembling.
It's time for the Democrats to do the right thing. History will not look kindly at the Democrats if they stand by watching this man steal our country with the help of Russia and the Republicans who believe the ends justify the means. Russia will step in again to try to sway the election and we could have another disaster in 2020 if we don't call a spade a spade asap.
5
"Either the president is above the law or he isn’t." That's not a political question. That's a survival question for anyone interested in our onetime Republic. If Congress can't even rouse itself to defend our Constitution against the most blatantly corrupt administration in my lifetime, maybe we need 535 impeachments.
7
The problem with impeachment is Trump's critics were calling for it from the moment he was elected. It's as though his real impeachable offense was winning.
3
@AACNY
Incorrect. There were ones calling for it before the election ever took place.
And you're right, his biggest sin is that he won. That was not suppose to happen. The Repubs had planned for Jeb! to be the nominee. H would run a typical campaign, like Romney, where he would be nice & profession and get tarred by the Dems & media. In the end it would be a cake walk for Hillary. The Repubs would keep the congress so they could moan and complain but not have to actually do anything.
Trump didn't play according to the 'rules' and actually won. The Dem & Repub establishment couldn't let that go unpunished.
The tactic is reverse psychology. Republicans will intimate that they “secretly” “hope” for Dems to go for full blown impeachment cause “it will rile up the trump base” and put off lots of Dem voters. That means it’s most likely a good idea.
@AACNY
Of course Trump conspired with the American voters to obstruct justice by preventing Clinton from being elected. It's all Putin's fault.
Nothing would make me happier than Trump leaving office, like, tomorrow. But nothing would be more counterproductive than to charge into nasty prolonged impeachment proceedings, which would likely fail in the Senate, so close to the 2020 campaign.
We need to focus on making sure the next chapter of America isn’t the disaster that the current one is. Impeachment now would badly impede that process.
Be smart. Focus.
3
@Ken Nyt
Don't assume that either he or the Republicans in the Senate will look a lot better if he survives the trial in the Senate, after being impeached by the House. Both could look a lot, lot worse if he is tried and survives that Senate trial.
@Ken Nyt
Yes such a disaster that America has the lowest claims for unemployment, lowest unemployment figures, highest numbers of Americans working and also getting tax cuts.
Such a disaster to have such a strong economy.
@Ken Nyt
I read int he Washington Post that Dems who have been holding forums with their constituents aren't hearing very much in terms of demands for impeachment.
Having failed to use extraordinary measures to rein in and control this president, impeachment is the solemn responsibility of Congress. Yet, it must not be used carelessly. 1/3 or slightly more of the country would automatically take it as a coup and another equal portion of citizens might be convinced of the same by the massive, endless flow of Republican propaganda that passes for news on Fox Noise and through the efforts of talk mongers on talk AM radio coast to coast and by radical websites.
At what point does the necessity of carrying out an effort at salvaging our nation exceed the high political risks? It would be easy to say, right now!, because we have been in a national crisis for more than two years with a president who respects no laws, honors no citizens who do not bow and scape before him and who loves only Putin and his ilk, the pledged enemies of America here and around the world.
Everything the Democrats do on every front is going to be attacked relentlessly, so perhaps it is, indeed, time to stop worrying about the Republicans and go for broke, stand up for something regardless of the political calculations before it is too late. Fearfulness will not win any battles, just ask Hillary and the platoon of Republican hopefuls who fell one by one as Trump rose 3 years ago.
What is one to do torn between duty and the desire to win future elections? If the evidence is strong enough and can be presented to the public in a convincing way, then IMPEACH.
1
this argument is seriously flawed and potentially dangerous for the country, the constitution and democracy. the moral, political and legal case against t th ump is not predicated on impeachment. indeed holding it in abeyence strengthens its value to a comprehensive strategy--democrats need to get clear eyed about losing for the right and moral reason. or employing those reasons to win and lead, that will take courage, strategy intelligence. this impeachment first fever is self-destructive delirium
1
Democrats need to show backbone so that the Republicans are forced to show their spinelessness -- this is not so much a matter of polarization but clarification of the principles and issues at hand. Any politician with a modicum of decency should be willing to stand up against the corrupt and criminal behavior that has become normalized in today's America.
4
Honestly? I don't think most people care about the Mueller report. This investigation, though weighty, has dragged on for two years. Due to the slow drip drip drip of its nature, much of the impact of whatever wrong doing there has been, has lost its punch. I think the Dems would be out of step with the general public to get into some kind of dog and pony impeachment show. It's how many months til the next election? We have wage stagnation, millions of people can't get decent housing or health care. This is what matters to people: How am I going to eat, how will I keep myself and my family healthy, how am I going to keep a roof over my head. I will not support any Dem candidate that supports impeachment.
3
@Lillies
If you simply look at the comments on any of the many articles about the Mueller report, you'll see Americans care A WHOLE LOT about the report, and about impeachment.
@Lillies
That's the problem Pelosi has: so far her house hasn't really done anything of note. Its all been 'impeachment now!!'. That's what got the Repubs in trouble. They were so feckless they couldn't do anything.
@Diane
Comments to an article actually reflect public opinion? I think not.
Let's be honest: Democratic "leadership" is afraid to impeach Trump. They were told over and over again by Washington pundits that impeachment is a loser politically. So even when they have a report outlining criminal conduct by the President, their calculation is already baked in. They are afraid to move, afraid to lose a small handful of independent voters even if it means throwing cold water on the Democratic base.
This is a reminder why many Democratic voters wanted fresh leadership in this new Congress. Conventional wisdom isn't always right especially in unprecedented times like these. And here we are, watching Democrats make a political miscalculation by not pursuing impeachment while abdicating their constitutional responsibility.
15
I'll be supporting the Democratic nominee in 2020. I hope it's Bernie. But whoever it is, I really don't want to campaign against an incumbent President Pence. All of the "never Trumpers" in the Republican Party would fall in place and support Pence.
Or just maybe the impeachment and removal of Trump might cause Republicans to look elsewhere. What better place to look than to the first candidate who can legitimately say "I told you so." That is, William Weld. No, I don't want to campaign against William Weld, either.
Or maybe Mitt Romney with his recent remarks about Trump could find traction, too. No, I don't want to campaign against Romney, either.
Rather, I want to campaign against Trump. We have him in our sights. His approval rating has never been above 45 percent. As long as he remains ostensibly viable, we can continue to beat him up with the Mueller report and more congressional hearings. The Mueller report is a gift that will keep on giving the next 18 months. And, given Trump's track record, you know there will be more lies and buffoonery in the next 18 months. Just more reason for even his base to question his competency, sanity and trust.
No, let's just leave things as they are. We have Trump exactly where we want him. I believe the next Democratic nominee will present very different policies and issues than in the past. I'd rather have that candidate run against Trump rather than a Pence, a Weld, a Romney or pick any Republican you want.
1
@Robert Plautz
Trumps approval rating is probably a lot stronger than the polls show. And it is higher than Obama's were at the same stage.
@Robert Plautz
"Let's leave things just the way they are" and have Trump elected all over again, then, unimpeded.
Right?
Not okay with most Americans.
No doubt if President Obama had committed a small fraction of the things Trump, his family and close associates did, he and his entire family would have been put in jumpsuits and driven out of the White House by Republicans.
This Op-Ed is correct in asking for Impeachment. Democrats will also be judged harshly in history for not doing what’s required in the Constitution and specially out of fear !
18
It is more important to defeat Donald Trump in 2020 election than to impeach him. Democrats do not have that many Senators in Senate to succeed in Impeachment. If Democrats do not succeed in Impeachment, it will strengthen Donald Trump's ability to occupy White House again in 2020 Election.
3
@Trevor Diaz
I disagree. It is more important for the future of this nation that we impeach the President and our Representatives vote for the rule of law or for anarchy. If Trump gets away with the 10 instances of interfering with justice he will continue breaking any and all laws for the next two, and perhaps 6, years. The Congressional Representatives must vote for the rule of law or for anarchy and we now, and all future citizens of this country, must know each Representative of this Congress stands on law or anarchy
11
@Trevor Diaz
The House of Representatives can impeach, although they cannot remove, Donald Trump. Regardless of whether the Senate convicts (which they undoubtedly will not), Trump will have been impeached, and impeachment will be a stain on his presidency.
4
The Russian goal was to disrupt the United States political process, and they succeeded. The Obama administration knew of Russian interference as early as 2014 but chose not to intervene - Susan Rice instructed her staff to not interfere. The arguments about preventing further Russian interference through sending a message by impeachment ring hollow. Impeachment will mire our congress in a futile effort which will die in the Senate. Instead, let our democratic majority legislative branch work to improve the life of the United States citizen by passing legislation for better healthcare and a stronger economy. Then maybe the citizens will vote for a democratic president.
6
@Antel Lopez
"Susan Rice instructed her staff to not interfere." That's a very serious charge. What does "not interfere" mean? What is your source?
Obama issued a muted warning about Russian interference during the 2016 elections, but it was not strong enough and did not reach most of the public. He and his aides have been quoted as saying they didn't want to appear, in the process of making a warning, to be big footing into the process. The result was that most people did not know the Russians were coming. Millions played into Russian hands by accepting and voting on wild rumors started by the Russians, the same kind of disinformation campaigns they had run around the world under the Soviet banner. They are past masters at disinformation and they are very likely to keep on trying to cause disruption in ways we don't now expect.
6
@Doug Terry
"Obama issued a muted warning about Russian interference …"
If I remember correctly, one critical incident went as follows. (Your "muted
interpretation is not altogether correct.) In 2016 our intelligence agencies briefed President Obama about the Russian interference on Mr. Trump's behalf. Obama believed there should be a public, bipartisan response. He met with Mr. McConnell in order to arrange for that announcement. Not only did McConnell refuse to go along with the joint announcement. He also made a serious threat. Were Obama to go ahead and make that announcement himself, McConnell threatened to say that Obama was falsely using the threat to help the Democrat win. In hindsight, McConnell's party-over-democracy threat looks borderline treasonous. Yes, Obama could have done some things differently. But the fault lies almost entirely with McConnell.
10
@Robert
Oh please.... If Obama was that concerned he could have still made the announcement and then denounced McConnell for playing politics. I don't care for Obama but I very much doubt that McConnell terrified him all that much.
It is imperative that impeachment articles get voted on in the House of Representatives; and, if they pass then they get voted on in the Senate after the prosecution takes place. I say this not just because The President must be held to obeying the law as we all are, but because the votes of the Representatives of this congress need recorded. I believe what the impeachment process should focus on is very cler and simply understood: Are we for the Rule of law or are we against the rule of law and for anarchy. If the President has violated the law against obstructing justice then he should be held accountable for violating it. here are ten arguments in the Mueller Report that show, conclusively, that the president would have been and should have been indicted for those ten separate actions. So, the Congress, our Representatives, must stand before the world, before history, and vote for the rule of law, and impeach the President; or, the Congress will vote for anarchy and the President will continue to violate any law he cares to because the Congress is for Anarchy over the rule of law.
16
"Either the president is above the law or he isn’t. Voters can’t determine this" I agree wholeheartedly. What a refreshing article. There are good arguments for and against. But I believe the Dems ruling out impeachment, are to centrist for the party at this point in time. They are the the Dems who don't really believe in what it means to be a Dem, they are more interested in keeping Corporations and their backers happy. Trying to appeal to too many voting demographics will end up alienating most. I wish the progressives would go out on their own and run as Independents. Time for a real opposition!
12
Two consistent themes impeachment are that 1) why bother because the Senate won't convict, and 2) let's not divide the party and make Trump a sympathetic martyr. One argument that I've not seen is how the decision will impact voter turnout.
Much ado made of the low turnout levels in 2016 because Clinton was the presumptive victor. If the House doesn't pursue impeachment, voters could conclude that Trump can continue his transgressions unpunished. If they think their votes would be meaningless, they'll stay home again.
It's more than a Congressional right or obligation. It's more than a response to obvious actions that fall within the realm of "high crimes and misdemeanors." It's a fundamental message that voters should, and do, have a means to voice their views on politics in America. If it's clear that their voices won't be heard, why vote?
11
To those in Congress who say "let the voters decide in 2020". NO, do your jobs!
The Voters do not have the power to investigate the redacted passages of the Mueller report.
The Voters do not have the power to subpoena witnesses.
The Voters expect the Legislative branch to do their constitutional duty.
Congress was given the power to impeach. When has there ever been a greater need to test those powers?
16
I agree with Mr. Bouie, Mr. Blow and the majority of the commenters here. We really have no choice but to impeach. I don't think the formal impeachment process needs to begin within the week, but I do think it should begin within the next 60 days. All, or the vast majority of the entire impeachment process, should be completed in 2019. This criminal presidential behavior deserves a swift response.
Yes, but what about the Senate? I, like the majority of Americans, have become very dispirited with the apparent mystical power of the Republican Senate. First, they deny a constitutional Supreme Court appointment now they effectively pre-cancel a necessary constitutional impeachment. Should we all just save time and alter our daily decisions to comport with Mitch McConnell’s views? I am in the minority, but I do not think it is a given that all Republican Senators will vote against impeachment. Twenty Senators is a high bar, however, many will turn following months of public House impeachment hearings. The congressional mood pivoted quickly in the months leading up to the Nixon resignation.
There is another article today talking about how Democrats are seeking young voters. 18 and 19-year-old voters have US Government/Civics course work fresh in their minds. The concept of three co-equal branches of government with checks and balances is real to them. The meme that will bring them in is that no one is above the law.
17
“The severity of this misconduct demands that elected officials in both parties set aside political considerations and do their constitutional duty. That means the House should initiate impeachment proceedings against the President of the United States.”
10
It is clear that all those speaking of impeachment as if the fact that Trump's actions were criminal is beyond question are doing so only out of complete ignorance of the law. Because as opposed to how Mueller's report is described here as "showing a president with criminal disregard for the rule of law", in his report Mueller addresses in length whether Trump's actions rise to the level of criminal obstruction of justice and he determines that he does not have sufficient basis upon which to conclude that he committed a crime. However the attorney general, as the highest law enforcement officer in the country, concluded that Trump's actions did not constitute a crime.
And the reason for this is that there are many complex legal questions here. Such as whether there can be obstruction of justice if no crime had been committed, as is the case here. Or whether attempts to obstruct an investigation in itself is a crime even though the investigation was not in fact obstructed in any way. Or if a president acting within his presidential powers can be considered to be obstruction. And most importantly if firing those conducting the investigation rises to the level of obstructions in the statute.
So the impeachment will not be based on the fact that Trump committed a crime as a matter of law. It will be based on the idea that the law is whatever we want it to be, and that is the way history will remember the impeachment of Trump.
5
@Michael Stavsen You are wrong on at least a couple of facts. Mueller's report does not say that he lacks sufficient basis to determine whether Trump's obstructive acts constituted criminality; it says that the question remains open because, according to DOJ policy, the president cannot be indicted and that it would be unfair to charge him if there is no venue in which he can fight the charges. Second, Mueller makes clear that he rejects the reasoning that obstruction depends on an underlying crime. He also rejects Barr's argument that a president cannot obstruct justice.
8
@Michael Stavsen
Meuller did not bring charges because per DOJ a sitting president cannot be indicted. Meuller thought it would be "unfair" to infer that there was a crime but then not charge the president because this would not give the president a recourse to due process to defend himself. What Meuller left was a roadmap for congress to impeach the president for obstruction of justice. It is all there. Take a closer read.
@ Michael Steven
.....[Mueller] determines that he does not have sufficient basis upon which to conclude that he committed a crime. However the attorney general, as the highest law enforcement officer in the country, concluded that Trump's actions did not constitute a crime."
That is just bunk, dear. Mueller knows that according to the DoJ rules a sitting president can't be indicted, while clearly saying that he can't exonerate the sitting president of having committed obstruction of justice.
And for heaven's sake, Barr applied AG job with a sycophantic 19 page memo, and is now acting as the private lawyer for the president instead of being the highest law authority for "We, the People".
1
The average American couldn't care less about impeachment They know that impeachment is a futile process, since Trump would never be removed from office, since the Republicans hold the Senate. Hence. the general public would view impeachment as a waste of time, as it did with Bill Clinton's impeachment. So, maybe a successful impeachment would make Democrats feel better. It certainly won't make the average Joe, who is looking for tax relief, a good job, a good retirement and good healthcare feel better. When it comes to the next election, the Democrats will have little progress upon which to rest their laurels other than the fact that they spent 4 years going after Trump and yet he is still President. Rather than impeachment, the Democrats should be proposing, and passing bills that help average American's. Then they may have a shot at displacing Trump. Impeachment is a dead-end.
9
@Jake P. I agree that the Dems should focus on issues that voters care about. That's what the election needs to be about. But it doesn't follow that the Dems should therefore ignore their oversight responsibility, which may include impeaching a president who has caused potentially irreparable harm to American democracy.
7
@Wrhackman The vast majority of voters believe most politicians cause "potentially irreparable harm to American democracy", Democrat or Republican. The Dems can be righteous and not "ignore their oversight responsibility" but it will cost them the next election. Right does not make Might.
This is a fine column. The report says there was cheating by a biased outsider and it says there was gross misconduct. Setting aside "trivia" like the obligations of our democracy and focusing on political outcomes, pursuing impeachment now might deter bad behavior in 2020, and it also preserves the right to oppose bad behavior in 2020. Failing to act now would be seen as a "green light", and I doubt an elected official could satisfactorily explain the combination of silence now and protest then should Trump prevail under another cloud of suspicion.
9
"Do Democrats charge forward on principle or do they leave the question to voters?"
Since we have a president and administration so obviously WITHOUT principles, the only correct response is to stand ON principle. Impeach now.
14
As a Bernie Sanders supporter, I believe that the base of the Democratic Party right now is galvanized by concrete ideas that aim to salvage what remains of hope for American wage workers and middle class. I could make a list for the wealthier Times reader: the peril of those with college bound kids...the peril of the suddenly hospitalized, the peril faced by those who have kin who are mentally ill or indigent. Homelessness and poverty beckon all wage workers.
If Democrats get together and hammer out their proposals right now, and make a louder noise with those proposals than the revving motors of impeachment, then yes I'll support impeachment. But if we are going to focus all our energy, even for a short time, just on the constitutional duty thing as indicated so eloquently by Mr. Bouie, then I say no. We need to win 2020. Ideas first!
1
Despite its attractiveness, we should resist the drive to impeachment. It will be terribly expensive, it will make a martyr out of Trump with his supporters, and the charges will be notoriously hard to prove. I say the democrats should concentrate on getting out the vote for 2020, strengthening the ACA, medicare for all, redistributing the budget away from the bloated defense spending, and other positive initiatives. The every last democrat must go and vote in this crucial election.
I agree with Jamelle Bouie, Charles Blow, and all the commenters who call for impeachment proceedings b/c it is the constitutional duty of the House under these circumstances. Only the House can protect our system of checks and balances from a President who disregards it.
Looking into the future, if the House does not step up and call this President to account, who knows what liberties he and some future President may take to continue to erode the delicate balance of our democratic institutions.
8
"To reject impeachment in the face of clear wrongdoing would all but prove the provision a constitutional dead letter." It would also prove that Democrats abandoned justice and principle over expediency. Failing to impeach Trump is to ignore egregious harm to the nation for a partisan political strategy.
"But embracing [impeachment] has pitfalls of its own, like energizing Republican voters in defense of the president." So you are saying Democrats should not choose the just and principled Constitutional remedy because Republicans will choose partisan loyalty and rally to a criminal in the White House? What happened to the concept of a nation of law and order? If Republicans choose illegality and disorder they are proving to the world THEY are unfit to hold office.
"There’s also no chance of conviction in the Senate — Republicans would almost certainly vote to acquit." Yes we have seen enough of Republicans in the Senate (and House) to know they WILL NOT DO THE RIGHT THING. They have already enabled the worst excuse for a president in the history of the nation. They have abetted his attacks on our institutions and the public confidence in the rule of law. They are nonredeemable. They must all go!
"Democrats could pursue impeachment, but it would be to make a symbolic point." No. there is more than symbolism in impeaching a crooked president. There is moral and ethical high ground which comes with a lesson: America DOES NOT EXIST if we are not a country of law and order.
16
I say leave it to the voters, use that money by not impeaching Trump for voter security and poll takers. My greatest fear is that Trump and Russia can already cook the books.
@CathyK
Did Trump and Putin cook the books in 2018 election? No
Did Trump and Putin cook the books in 2016 election? No.
Impeach? Not so fast. Whether or not the Senate convicts, McConnell & Co. win.
First, the nation is treated to an ugly, incessant rehash of everything we've already learned, to our pain, about Trump, as posturing opportunities abound. We discover nothing that had not already turned the tide against the GOP by the midterms, but apathetic/swing voters spurn the process and the ballot box - or fetishize an indie spoiler - while the hardcores are energized. Trump scores a fundraising and turnout advantage.
In the unlikely event that Individual 1 is dumped, the GOP swoons at the chance to anoint Mike Pence in time to run for a two-term presidency - halo burnished, far-right agenda pinned to his choirboy robe.
Sure, impeachment is possible, but removal requires a conviction, making the attempt a fool's errand and a supremely costly one. Especially when the remedy of removing Trump, his entire staff and cabinet of lackeys, child-cagers and SCOTUS-packers, and his see-no-evil Congressional enablers is available to be legitimized by the entire electorate.
Certainly, investigations can be pursued on clear national-interest merits by the House, the Southern District of NYS, and state attorneys general. None of them needs impeachment as a capstone.
In less time than it took us to get to this point in Trump's MAGA saga, the American people will have the keen satisfaction we've earned of voting the gold-plated loser out. I wouldn't miss it for all the impeachments in the world.
3
@Pam
"In the unlikely event that Individual 1 is dumped, the GOP swoons at the chance to anoint Mike Pence"
Let's deal with one bad leader at a time. Removing Trump from office is simply the right thing to do. Then we can focus on beating Pence, either by impeaching for impeachable acts (if any), or at the ballot box.
3
@Jason Pence is a non-issue. First, because the Senate Republicans will not vote to convict Trump. But even if by some unimaginable series of events they were to do so, we would be well into 2020 and the general election campaign. Pence has an even smaller, and certainly less fervent, base than Trump.
1
@Wrhackman
Pence might have a small base now but if you force the removal of Trump you can expect that base explode in size. Its call 'payback'.
"Donald Trump may not have conspired with the Russian government". Democrats are starting to admit their campaign against Mr. Trump has failed, it was all along a political hoax and, forgive me for mixing metaphors, a hoax that's run out of gas. What are they going to do now? their actual agenda for America is 'fantastic', and not in any positive sense: Free everything, coddling for self-responsibility-refuseniks, punishment for success, a quasi-religious climate crusade, open borders, an economically destructive 'Energy New Deal', and BTW, in case you haven't noticed, no foreign policy at all. Come on Dems, it's time to wake up, try to get back into the real world, It's probably already too late for you to revive your fortunes for 2020, but you have to start somewhere. Maybe you could begin with something simple--tell your followers to look for jobs. I know it'll be a comedown for them to have to wash the pink and green dye out of their hair, dress presentably and fill out employment applications, but they're going to have to face reality sometime--earning your way is how it's done in this life, and that's done by getting into the economy, not the welfare line.
2
@Ronald B. Duke
If they run on the 'Green New Deal', medicare for all, free college, open borders I think their platform with be considered the heir to the 'The longest suicide note in history'. The was the Labour Party's 1983 platform and it was a disaster. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_longest_suicide_note_in_history
1
I'm with Joe Lockhart in today's NYT, "There's a Bigger Prize Than Impeachment." Because Trump will not be convicted by the Senate, being "rebuked" by Democrats via impeachment is a meaningless and expensive ploy. From start to finish, impeachment is a dangerous political stunt that could backfire big time. It's not worth it.
"Principle and symbolism" don't matter to the people who voted for him in 2016 and who are needed to vote against him in 2020. Nor do they matter to me who voted against him. Is there a better way for the House to act? If the point is to "shape public perception," then by all means investigate, investigate, investigate. Get the rest of the dirt out in the open and garner the 2020 votes that are needed so that he can be indicted after the next election.
2
For those of us who lived through Watergate as young adults, I would remind all of you that in 1972, when the Watergate burglary happened (June 17), many people were "ho hum." After the Senate hearings started (May 18, 1973) people began to take notice. On July 13, 1973, Alexander Butterfield, former presidential appointments secretary, revealed in congressional testimony that since 1971 Nixon had recorded all conversations and telephone calls in his offices. that really got people's attention.
Then there were the court battles over the tapes, the "Saturday Night Massacre", the Supreme Court holding on July 24, 1974 (8-0) that the tapes had to be turned over, etc.
By that time, early 1974, even Republicans were beginning to question support for Nixon. Once the tapes were heard, in July 1974, Nixon was finished.
The purpose of investigations now should be to EDUCATE the American electorate, and they might even put enough pressure om the feckless Republican Senators who are up for reelection (22 of them) that there might just be enough votes (67 needed) to convict if a Bill of Impeachment were to be voted by the House.
7
Consider this plan of action:
The House rather quickly votes "Articles of Impeachment".
It cannot let what is revealed in the Mueller report go unanswered, either in terms of constitutional responsibility or in setting precedent for the behavior of future presidents.
BUT the House declines to present the articles to the Senate for trial. That would be futile.
Instead, the "Articles of Impeachment" are formally on the record and are the "indictment" of Trump that Mueller felt he was not allowed to bring against a sitting president.
And even more importantly, this action and constitutional responsibility can bind Democrats and indeed the entire Trump opposition together.
2
@srwdm An interesting scenario. I was wondering about this myself. Is it logistically possible? That is, can the House vote to impeach and not refer the matter to the Senate? Or is that built in?
@Wrhackman
srwdm is correct. The House does not have to refer it to the Senate.
Sorry, this isn't just about your "needs". We had an exhaustive investigation already. The country needs to move on. That's what's best for the country.
There's entirely too much partisanship masquerading as morality and justified as "for the good of the country."
5
@AACNY
I think the House is going to take a page from an old Republican playbook.
You may have heard of it.
It was called "BENGHAZI!" and that set of politically motivated investigations (conducted by Republicans with a straight face) went on for years, cost millions and accomplished nothing.
This set of hearings will be a lot more productive, because we already know that all manner of improper activities took place during the Trump campaign and in the Trump administration, and there were numerous attempts (all failures) to cover up or deflect from those events.
There is PROOF that the Russians did interfere in the 2016 elections, and we need to understand in detail what happened and how to prevent such attempts in the future. Along the way, we need to understand what Americans did to help those Russian efforts (like giving them polling data).
Mueller plainly did NOT plan to indict a sitting POTUS, or even to make assertions that would denigrate a sitting POTUS, but he did lat out the facts that were identified. Those facts are more than enough basis to support the investigations that the House will now conduct.
2
@AACNY
Democrats are behaving as though the Mueller investigation never happened and/or that the report is really just a laundry list of "to do" items.
No evidence of collusion was found by Mueller and his team. Obstruction was inconclusive. That's enough for most rational Americans.
If only democrats were as interested in Russian involvement as they were in getting Trump.
Very well-crafted and cogent argument to proceed deliberately, but with focused determination to begin impeachment hearings. Another argument against letting the voters decided in 2020 is that Russian interference may be even greater and more sophisticated in 2020 and could lead to another Trump victory.
6
Impeachment is necessary, but largely symbolic at this point since the Senate will not convict.
So if it’s symbolic let’s make this fast and easy. We don’t need more investigations or hearings. There’s plenty in the Mueller report the knock together some perfectly serviceable Articles of impeachment in a couple of hours. Jam it through committee. Get it on the floor, take a vote and get it over with without divisive grandstanding. One months tops.
This is a sorrowful chapter in our history and should be treated as such. Let’s get it over with so 2020 candidates can get to work on the real issues.
2
"Democrats should focus on their supporters, who voted in large numbers..."
Six million fewer Americans voted for Dem. House candidates in 2018 than voted for their losing presidential candidate in 2016. We now know that it is perfectly possible that a Democratic candidate can win the popular vote with a plurality of about three million and the Republican candidate can lose it by about ten million to all the other candidates combined, and the Republican can still be elected. Oh, yes, there was a large turnout in 2018 "for a midterm election," but that's like saying your niece is a "great pianist for a 13-year old." It doesn't necessarily get her an invitation to appear at Carnegie Hall. Democrats have to make sure that they maintain that 9% winning margin in 2020. Then even the Electoral college won't prevent them from replacing Donald Trump. The argument for impeachment proceedings is a strong one, leaving the number of votes it garners in 2020 aside. What a shame that the same action was taken against Clinton for reasons that had nothing to do with how he became president or served the people. Without having to mention Clinton by name, that enables Trump to plausibly contend that impeachment proceedings now are intended to serve the same purpose, embarrassing the president. He misses the point that the high crimes and misdemeanors he may have committed would have occurred in pursuit of the presidency and in the performance of his duties.
1
At the the Congressional Democrats are taking it methodically, taking it step by step. The investigations will reveal much. They are already at work on - have been for a while! Gathering the facts rather than accepting talking points as fact is getting the light of day. This is a great teaching moment - patience is the lesson. We already know how amoral trump and his codependents are. They do not know that NO ONE IS ABOVE THE LAW. This is why the USA has always been great.
3
It is true that "Each branch of government is empowered to check and challenge the others, and Congress has a specific obligation to hold the presidency to account between electoral cycles." However, today the politicians only point against others for their own benefit
2
Jerrold Nadler, the chairman of the House Judiciary Committee, said on Sunday that “if proven, some of this would be impeachable, yes. The accusations in the report are impeachable. Obstruction of justice, if proven, would be impeachable.”
Jerry Nadler is 71. I am about 75. Both of us lived through the Watergate scandal, with the Senate and House hearings.
Nadler understands that when Watergate first happened, most Americans did not care about a "second rate burglary." By the end of the hearings, when the Supreme Court obliged Nixon to turn over the tapes (which only became know to exist in July 1973), even most of the Republicans (who had been Nixon's enablers and supporters) came over to the position that he was guilty and would be impeached and convicted. So Nixon resigned.
Trump is NEVER going to resign. He cannot face the prospect of admitting any flaw whatsoever, because he is a narcissist.
Hearings need to serve the purpose of educating Americans, many of whom are not really paying attention yet (yeah, I know, "incredible, isn't it?"). If hearings are on the news, every day, with a discussion of all of the illegal and unconstitutional acts of the Trump administration, people will start to take notice and will come to understand what Trump and his people were doing.
They might even put pressure on their Senators to vote to convict Trump when a Bill of Impeachment may be voted.
Maximize the chance that an impeachment will be effective.
Vote (D) in 2020.
6
I think there is more case to be built, and we the people should demand that Congress do their jobs in getting to that. Promptly. What do Mr. Trump's tax returns show? Where are we on the emoluments clause of the Constitution? Add anything in those two to what Mr. Mueller determined, and we have several legal and Constitutional violations. To get the public, you are going to have to make a solid case, and that is what the founders expected the Congress to do in requiring a 2/3 majority to convict.
There is more work to be done before we invoke the "I" word. But we are doing that work--the tax returns have been requested, there are cases in the courts on the emoluments, and there is testimony to hear from Mueller, McGahn and appropriate Constitutional and legal scholars. Let's keep grinding, but post-haste...let's build not just a case, but the BEST case we can.
Also remember that any trial in 2020 will take 6 Democratic Senators currently running for President off the campaign trail. Timing is challenging in a first term president...
2
Impeachment is the ultimate act of voter suppression. That’s a plain fact. With few exceptions, elected officials should only be removed from office via the ballot box on Election Day.
3
@Conservative Democrat And this is obviously one of those exceptions. Yes, impeachment is strong medicine but there are times when is necessary to save the patient, namely, The United States.
6
@Conservative Democrat
What are the few exceptions?
All the Intelligence agencies (6 of them) say Russians interfered in our elections. What is president Trump doing with that information?
Trump is in cahoots with the Russians? What about all the ironclad evidence of obstruction of justice - all the attempts to fire Mueller (McGahn is the latest cited)?
3
@Conservative Democrat
Their argument would have more merit if they hadn't been denying that Trump is our president for 2 years. They were ready to impeach him for the act of getting elected.
I agree with this. Two opinions in the Democratic party; 1. Trying to second guess how to be the parent to the country (we know what's best not you) and 2. impeachment in order to actually do what the House of Representatives is supposed to do:keep a check on the president for the American people. He vowed in an oath to protect and uphold the constitution of the United States of America. This is not always a legal matter. The constitution is not a legal document, it's a set of ideas and norms that are accepted as part of how this nation shall be governed by its institutions and the rights of it's citizen's. Some of it is laid out in law, and some of it is not. This is all murcky stuff, but it's the job of congress to make the case to the American people. I remember these discussions from when Bill Clinton was impeached. The decision to impeach is not always based on what would happen in a court of law. If you ask me, this is what Muellers message is to the country. There are very important findings in his report. Its up to this congress to act on it, because legally it's not possible to indict a sitting president with a Supreme court stacked with Trump appointees and a Trump appointed AG who agrees with that point of view. Did Trump uphold and protect the constitution with his actions as laid out in the Mueller report? I say no he did not.
5
"But symbolism matters. It shapes public perception and the contours of political conflict. Trump wouldn’t be president, for example, without his keen manipulation of race and identity."
Indeed, symbolism matters. Democrats gained a lot of power in the 2018 election. What have they done with it? What symbol?
Yes race and identity matters, and it is also central to Democrats. What have they done with it since 2018?
What are the "public perception and the contours of political conflict" today? Specifically, what has the Democratic Party shown the public about political conflict, and its own role in such conflict?
Trump did not really win. He didn't deserve to win.
The Democrats lost. They deserved to lose. Sometimes an election like a trial is a race to the bottom, to find the loser rather than the winner.
Now the painful question -- have Democrats learned any lessons from their defeat in 2016? Have they displayed such learned lesson since winning in 2018?
This is where the talk of impeachment fits. It has become the substance of what the Democrats show the public.
They have learned nothing. They have done nothing. They are still in outrage over losing what they feel entitled to, what was theirs by right.
They are on course to lose again, to someone who does not deserve to win.
6
The Democratic Congress took their seats in January 2019. They have had the majority since then. November 2018 is not ancient history.
There's only one thing I'm sure of. If this were a Democratic President with the same egregious behavior and contempt for the Constitution as Trump, impeachment proceedings would be underway.
32
Before today and reading Charles Blow and also this article, and also the comments to both, I thought that impeachment was the right thing to do but that it would never happen. Now I think that the Judiciary Committee should examine the unredacted report and then vote to impeach. It’s the right thing to do, and if we allow this behavior to go without response of any kind, we don’t deserve the democracy we will surely lose.
33
@Lenore
I totally agree with you. Democrats must act by voting to impeach. Otherwise, they will be seen has gutless talkers.
Also, I think impeachment proceedings will drag out the focus on Trump's wrong doing into the election season. Impeachment will put the ball in the Democrats court, and keep the focus on them, not Trump.
Let me also mention the democratic prediction of Leonard Cohen. In 1992, Cohen wrote, "Democracy". He sang: "Democracy is coming to the USA."
I hope that the NYTimes will comment on the prophetic words of "Democracy."
Yes, lets keep the focus in the Democrats, with impeachment proceedings and hope that a new wave of "Democracy" is coming to the USA, in 2020.
5
I agree with other commenters here who say Congress must make a permanent record of the full evidence collected by Mr Mueller, and not allow any of it to be lost to history. This would be one useful result of the impeachment process. However, the contentious nature of impeachment would make it seem like just another partisan fight, unless the proverbial "smoking gun" is discovered, which is uncertain.
The most definitive rejection of Trump and the GOP would be an overwhelming vote against them in 2020. No matter what the result, they will claim it is rigged and illegitimate..so a plan for responding to GOP fake claims should be part of the effort.
Most important is that the Democrats behave in a judicious, careful manner, and try to control their intra-party squabbles. The objective should be to reveal the true nature of Trump and the GOP (as enemies of democracy) with overwhelming evidence based on their activities since 2015.
11
Medicare will become insolvent in 2024, Social Security will be insolvent in 2035. Hundreds of millions of American citizens and their employers have involuntarily paid trillions into this system. Congress needs to address that.
Trump has focused on increasing the economy and the tax base. Two things vital to staving off the calamity which would result if these two gargantuan programs collapse, as scheduled. Democrats would be wise to focus on that.
Didn't Bernie Madoff serve jail time for his Ponsi scheme? The American taxpayer should demand no less from Congress. After all, Madoff's victims were voluntary participants.
Point being. It is not Congress's duty to engage it politics, but to protect the interests of those who put them in office
3
@James
"Increasing the economy and the tax base" indeed.
trump's crazed pursuit of tariffs ("I am a tariff man") have hurt voters but enriched corporations as the NYT reports today.
"It raised prices on washing machines, as expected, but also drove up the cost of clothes dryers, which rose by $92 last year." And raised consumer prices overall by $1.5 billion.
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/04/21/business/trump-tariffs-washing-machines.html
1
It’s Congresses’s duty to provide oversight of the Executive branch. It’s written in the Constitution.
'Instead of thinking about their opponents, Democrats should focus on their supporters, who voted in large numbers to give the party a House majority and keep the president in check."
Precisely.
IMPEACH.
30
I do agree that congress should act, if not to convey a certain stewardship for the well-being of the government they've sworn an oath to protect and defend, out of a sense of appearing to care how they'll be remembered in history. But even if impeachment hearings happened, I doubt it would be anything other than Christmas for Trump and his ilk. They are playing a high-stakes race to the bottom of the barrel and they simply have no equal. They're setting fire to everything decent and laughing about it under a noontime Sun. I doubt there's anything Democrats can do but look at the country turn dystopic before our eyes - then start over.
1
"Either the president is above the law or he isn’t. Voters can’t determine this — elections aren’t actually the venue for adjudicating that kind of conflict. This is a job for our elected representatives in Congress."
Indeed! The voters not only can't determine this -- they won't. Congress needs to do their job.
26
What is best for the country? Is that even a consideration here? If impeachment is not pursued, then our very Constitution is at risk. Other candidates will perhaps decide that the best way to the White House is through lying, cheating, and making it clear that they are willing to accept foreign influence to decide our elections. It needs to be made clear that the dirty behavior displayed by Trump, and his lieutenants, will—shall—be punished. This country can’t stagger along for eighteen months til the next election, having more investigations preceding November 2020, making it seem that all is normal. All is not normal. Trump would have no incentive to change his gangster style of campaigning in the primaries and possibly the general election. He could continue to obstruct justice. If Trump and his associates can’t accept the Mueller report, he may never accept anything short of a second term. He could lie, cheat, and bribe his way to a second term and the country could be duped into letting him do it. He simply can’t be trusted. Having this kind of morally flawed president is simply too damaging to the security of the United States of America. This presidency can’t be allowed to continue. Start impeachment now.
30
The decision on whether to impeach is a strategic one that can be properly decided when the Democrats caucus on this. What is most crucial about that caucus is the need to unite behind the purpose of taking back the presidency and Senate, building a larger majority in the House, and winning statewide and local elections. In the end this isn't about Democrats versus Republicans but about electing leadership that is less corrupt and solves the problems of this country.
Allegiance to rule of law can be accomplished in oversight hearings and building a case that could eventuate in impeachment. But launching impeachment proceedings right now isn't required to start down that path anyway.
7
@Knowledge Is Power
Sure, and by the way, the way to address global climate change is to hold oversight hearings and unite behind the purpose of slowing carbon emissions after building a larger majority in the House, and winning state and local elections... and meanwhile cities flood and entire populations are dying or moving and yet it's all about not rushing into anything before we build a political case that could eventuate in the end of things. Right?
Democrats need to create the messaging that will create public support for impeachment. A hostile foreign power - Russia - interfered in our Presidential election. Trump embraced it. As president Trump tried to block the investigation into it. Impeach now.
44
@Bill Ejzak
Trump also committed what any thinking person would consider borderline treason when he was asked about the murders attributed to Putin. If Obama or ANY Democrat had said what Trump said, the entire right wing media apparatus and Republican party would have exploded in outrage and would have been screaming, "un-American!"
Trump was asked about Russian murdering opponents. He said words to this effect, "Let me tell you, America kills plenty of people, too." The statement is horrid enough but to make it in the context of defending the thug Putin is unforgivable.
What Republicans once abhorred in others, they have embraced with Trump. What they once considered ridiculous or outrageous, they have come to love if Trump says or does it. They have shown themselves to be the party of nothing, nothing that is except tax cuts for the rich, deregulation to allow corporations to run over ordinary citizens and an ugly train of insults pouring forth without end from the people's White House.
1
Of course the Democrats in the House of Representatives should impeach Donald J. Trump. Continuing House investigations can only help the effort. Perhaps they will come up with SO much against Trump (as if there isn't already enough) that the Senate Republicans will be shamed into voting to convict him. Also, any argument that it would make it difficult to get legislation written is specious: Trumpis not going to sign anything they pass anyway. AND if his supproters become even more frozen in their support for him, it could very well drive people who don't vote and independents and never-Trumpers to the polls. GET HIM OUT!
22
"But given existing public opinion, it’s more likely that an impeachment investigation would deepen the sense that Trump is unfit for the office he holds." Perhaps sadly, quite the contrary. The "public opinion" of the right is clearly and irrevocably that Trump is being unfairly bullied and abused by the left. And given the 'no collusion' outcome of the Mueller report, that argument has legs. Further, if you impeach him and the Senate clears him of all wrongdoing which is a very likely outcome given their makeup, that will overwhelmingly further his narrative of innocence and being the victim of a witch hunt and likely lead to his re-election. I do not see why Democrats seem so intent on stepping into clear political traps. Nancy Pelosi and her colleagues understand this and are desperately trying to steer the party properly but for some reason, those that get 99% of the media coverage every day are the most extreme and damaging to the party overall. The perfect gift for the Republicans would be to impeach Trump and have the Senate find him innocent of all charges late in 2020. If the Democrats were majority in the Senate, this would be very different discussion. But will somebody please do a reality check on those calling for impeachment.
8
@NYer While impeachment may energize Trump's supporters, failure to do so will likely cause a withdrawal of Democrats from the political process, if not from the party. We know that it is not likely that Trump will be impeached by the Senate, despite the evidence amassed by Mueller, yet failure to act by the Democrats will be just as much a negative. Not to deal appropriately, through the political process with an unstable, incompetent, unlawful president will be a failing that may actually cost them more votes than they fear they will lose with impeachment. They need to step up to the plate and do the right thing for our nation.
1
@NYer
No, he has only his small base who will support him regardless. The Senate, as is apparent to the non-base Americans, will support trump
There is one key argument against impeachment. Trump and his minions are currently trying very hard to undermine and discredit the democratic institution of the Republic. To many of his followers, and to many other Americans who believe that the Democrats are hell-bent on hurting Trump and on preventing him from exercising his 'legitimate' right as an elected president, impeachment procedures would look like an abuse of power, a political vendetta, an illegitimate use of the democratic institutions.
America's democratic institutions, under attack from Trump, are weakened and the last thing they need is to be seen as a tool of a political vendetta. Congress should fall back on exercising the most clearly legitimate part of its mission, to
carefully monitor and check the exercise of power by the presidency. In this role, Congress has overwhelming support and its legitimacy is not generally questioned.
As for Trump, the only means to remove him that is fully legitimate in the eyes of virtually all Americans is the election of 2020. An electoral defeat would not undermine the democratic institutions of the Republic, it would bolster them. An electoral defeat could not be easily challenged as illegitimate by his supporters, those same supporters who keep using his 2016 victory to assert that he is the rightful President. Defeating Trump in 2020 would demonstrate for all to see that the institutions work, are fair, and proper. That should be the greater priority.
8
Without the Senate votes impeachment is totally pro forma. Everyone knows it and it is a distraction from real issues progressives should be pushing through anywhere they can including the House.
Bhaskar Sunkara’s article in the Guardian says as much. I agree for once with the milquetoast Pelosi using the depiction by the editor of the excellent Jacobin magazine: impeachment at this day and time is impracticable.
Let’s hammer everything wrong with Trump and Pence. Expose every lie they tell the gullible and undereducated GOP supporters and further expose all the sleazy party bosses sucking up to the .01 percenters led by eco-criminals called Koch Brothers who pollute the globe while donating money to Lincoln Center and The Met to absolve their soulful sins. Indulgences as they used to be called in the dark times of Europe.
There is no time to lose in endless proceedings in the House by underpaid representatives trying to satisfy their egos by talking louder than the next fellow, reveling in the insanity of their own voices.
Let’s prepare the ground for Bernie to deliver us from this Calamity called Trump & Co.
5
@Blunt, you hammer everything wrong with Trump by holding open proceedings on CSPAN. That's how you prepare the ground for the 2020 election. Pelosi is no milquetoast--she knows what she's doing, and she's probably the savviest politician in Washington.
Do Democrats have a spine, or do they endlessly hand-wring, poll-test, wait-and-see and apologize? How they make this impeach-or-not decision will tell voters how they will govern on all the big issues that face this nation. I'm beginning to have doubts myself about whether they are capable to doing anything hard that needs to be done, when and how it needs to be done. Elizabeth Warren didn't wait-and-see and that makes her one of my two top choices. I'm ready for a Democrat who stands for something, come hell or high water, because I want someone I can trust to stand up for me.
7
@abigail49 You don’t seem to realize Lizzie is just trying to keep her name in the news while she thinks of more free stuff. Her support keeps falling.
Lack of action to hold Trump accountable with the constitutional powers given to congress would further underscore...that congress is composed of political do-nothing hacks.
9
Going for impeachment, if done well, would allow democrats to correct frame republican proffered: replacing conspiracy instead collusion, intent through back channels instead of feigned clueless-ness, and incompetence regarding matters of national security rather than witch hunts, all just for starters.
Impeachment not even if the senate remains passive but because the remain passive in the face of House findings could allow democrats to get in front of republican attempts to control the national dialogue -- for the first time since Ragean.
6
@no one special
Are you saying Obama did not control the national dialogue even when he controlled the WH, the House and the Senate?
More important than an itinerary of impeachment— The existential threat posed to our democracy and ultimately to our security, is that Russian activities at present are dangerous in the extreme.. A feckless leader may have to be removed first to allow for a focused response to Russia, but keep the priorities straight. The threat from abroad is more important than any one person’s culpability.
2
I disagree with pursuing impeachment. Only 34% approve of impeachment, despite the fact that nearly 57% disapprove of Trump, according to a recent post Mueller report poll. Better to allow him to drag the Republican party down.
Democrats currently have the GOP in a death grip. Trump can't rise above 40-43% approval, but he also can't fall below it. This means that the GOP can't just abandon Trump with his rabid base. It also means Trump has failed to appeal to moderates, giving Democrats a prime opportunity as they saw in the 2018 midterms.
Democrats would be wise to pounce on this and come out with a solid, pro middle class, pro worker policy platform that has broad appeal. Defending SS, Medicare, and Medicaid, addressing infrastructure, addressing education/jobs training, addressing the costs of prescription drugs, middle class tax cuts, and comprehensive immigration reform should be at the forefront, in order to get after 53-55% of the vote.
6
@Joe Arena
Democrats also know that their constituents aren't concerned about Russia but rather consider the economy and health care much more important. This is why they didn't campaign on Russia during the midterms.
1
@Joe Arena. You don’t see me to realize how split the Dems are. A leftist will never be voted in.
The debate around impeachment shouldn’t focus on removing Trump from office. It should focus on the process for revealing the truth about his actions and on holding him and his administration to account. The French root of “impeach” is the word for “hinder.” Impeachment proceedings would prevent Trump from running the whole show. Failing to hold Trump’s feet constitutionally to the fire allows him free rein to shape his own narrative and crow victory. Sure, the Senate, dominated by know-nothing Republicans, is highly unlikely to remove him, regardless of what impeachment hearings reveal and that House decides. But the constant glare of damaging public testimony cannot be good for Trump or Republicans who insist on defending him or keeping quiet. If Democrats dodge impeachment and place their hopes solely on the next election, they could be very sorely disappointed. Their current bench of presidential candidates does not inspire confidence—or even hope. An empowered Trump with Republican “Dobbies” would have a field day. It would be better for the country to see impeachment proceedings induce enough Republicans to back away from “the Don” and—for example—endorse a Romney candidacy to restore some dignity and decency to the GOP.
10
The Democrats should continue their aggressive investigation of President Trump, including subpoenaing the unredacted Mueller report and Trump's tax records. However, if they try to impeach Trump, some members of the public may argue that the Democrats are pursuing an impossible goal rather than focusing on the problems their constituents face.
5
I trust the Dems to walk and chew gum. Impeach and work on other things. The Repubs will stop them from passing any worthwhile legislation anyway. So, do both things.
The Trump team wants the Democrats to initiate impeachment proceedings. They believe that it will not only mobilize their base but also cause some voters in the middle to support him because they feel that there is insufficient evidence against him. The current state of the evidence may appeal to some Democrats, but it is not the clear and convincing case which Nancy Pelosi called for. Will it win more for Trump? I personally have no idea, but I am not willing to take a chance. He seems headed for a big loss and only the Democrats can save him.
4
Impeachment had already been brought up before the new president was even sworn into office and it looks as though it will be a topic for discussion as long as he remains there. What is not being mentioned is the impeachment of the political establishment itself, implemented by their loss of the 2016 election. Spending the next two years talking impeachment of Donal Trump mainly serves to distract our attention from the real issue here, which is what was wrong with the politics in place, that would cause this loss of confidence by the electorate.
8
I think hearings are a good idea. This will help educate the public. It is very different for them to read a newspaper than to see Don McGann actually being grilled by the Congressional committees. If this does lead to impeachment, so be it. If Trump is not convicted in the Senate, then the Republicans who vote for acquittal will have to justify their actions at their next elections. Maybe we could end up with a filibuster-proof Democratic senate!
8
Impeach or Evict ?
Or......count at the ballot box.
By 2020 the Russians will have perfected interfering in the election. They have a lot to work with, a married gay guy with a husband, a socialist, an old VP kind'a not to nice guy, just a few of our Dem's motley crew. Oh, I forgot, a woman that dines using unique utensils, she wants to play footsie (partisan politics) with the Republicans. The media super enhances the candidates flaws and differences instead of their ability to beat Trump. Maybe the 'perfect' person who can win hasn't arrived yet.
The Dems don't have a plan. If they do, it is a secret.
Unite like the Republicans.
2
@s.whether
The Russians have ALREADY perfected interfering with the election.
Could putting the Illegitimate One in office possibly have gone any better for Putin and Russia?
And because there's a self-obsessed con artist in the White House the US can't even muster an adequate response. Heck, the US can't even speak with a singular voice in saying that the Russians did it!
There is absolutely NOTHING for the Russians to perfect. They got it right the first time. And there is absolutely no reason they can't do it again in 2020.
1
Nice. It's nice to be nice. Trump is not nice. A grifter, a draft-dodger, a philanderer, a tax cheat, a felon. Not nice.
It's important to be nice: liberal, checks-and-balances, bilateral, seeking consensus, practical, realistic, not pushing the envelope...while the Republicans eat your lunch.
Meanwhile, back in the jungle...
7
Time to impeach Trump.
Democrats should boldly showcase Trump's errant behavior; let his partisan defenders publicly state their "concerns". If having oral sex in the Oval Office with an adult intern is impeachable; then obstruction of justice certainly is.
Even if the Senate acquits Trump; the Senators have to go on record and defend him. The voters will decide their fate and Trump's as well in 2020.
This is the time to stand up and be bold. If Democrats show no backbone then too the voters will have their say. And boot out the weakling Democrats. Democrats would deserve that thrashing.
2
Please stop trying to make a career out of Trump's impeachment. Either do it or don't. Trump did not obstruct justice. None of this obstruction stuff would have happened if a Special Council (SC) ( prosecutor) was not charged with trying to remove Trump from office based on false accusations by the Democrats. The Democrats lied to everyone about Trump colluding with the Russians to beat Hillary Clinton and they were assisted by the top people in the FBI and the other intelligence agencies so we have confirmed after almost 2 years of investigation by the SC.
Two of the top Constituonla lawyers in the Country say: Ken Starr, the independent counsel who investigated President Bill Clinton, said that Robert Mueller’s Russia report showed that Donald Trump went to the “brink” on obstruction of justice but didn't commit a crime.
Starr talked about why the president was not prosecuted on obstruction of justice despite evidence that he had tried to interfere several times with the special counsel’s probe into Russian election interference.
“The law cares about what is done, not what is thought or what is said,” Starr said. “The president’s instincts are very aggressive, he knows how to fire people and he fires people but guess what: He may have come to the brink but he didn’t walk across that red line.”
Law professor Alan Dershowitz argued the Mueller team got the law wrong on whether or not President Donald Trump could be charged with obstruction of justice.
6
@NYChap
Democrats have backed themselves into a corner. Peevish progressives will sit out the election if they don't move forward.
Lets be honest that the Democrats are playing 2020 politics instead of looking at the criminality of Trump now.
Nancy, Nancy, Nancy, just do the job that the people who elected you wants you to do - and stop preventing the impeachment hearings to start its Constitutional duty to investigate a corrupt presidency.
Stop playing politics - and start doing your job under the Constitution Dems, or lose all credibility with the people of America.
3
Without the Senate votes impeachment is totally pro forma. Everyone knows it and it is a distraction from real issues progressives should be pushing through anywhere they can including the House.
Bhaskar Sunkara’s article in the Guardian says as much. I agree for once with the “milquetoast” Pelosi using the depiction by the editor of the excellent Jacobin magazine: impeachment at this day and time is impracticable.
Let’s expose everything wrong with Trump and Pence. Expose every lie they tell the gullible and undereducated GOP supporters and further expose all the sleazy party bosses sucking up to the .01 percenters led by eco-criminals called Koch Brothers who pollute the globe while donating money to Lincoln Center and The Met to absolve their soul full of sins. Indulgences as they used to be called in the dark times of Europe.
There is no time to lose in endless proceedings in the House by underpaid representatives trying to satisfy their egos by talking louder than the next fellow, reveling in the inanity of their own voices.
2
@Blunt
Nixon was never convicted, and his impeachment proceedings (hearings, etc) took just months. They started the process in February, started hearings in May, and by August he was out of his own accord since the hearings brought forth information to the public that disgraced Nixon.
The same CAN happen to Trump - and Nixon was FAR more popular than Trump.
If he doesn't leave and isn't convicted, at least Congress has done their job, and a lot more information about Trump is exposed to the public.
3
@Diane
Don’t misunderstand me, I want him out two years ago! The problem is our constitution which allows for the President to get away with murder if the senate lets him or her.
Nixon was caught red handed. Plus he was a better mensch than Donald Trump can ever be.
We should’ve learn from this and change the constitution.
And this is why the Democrat party remains a loser. Instead of articulating policies that are based in reality, they continue to throw bread crumbs at the masses and yell "impeachment".
5
I completely disagree. My position is spelled out by Joe Lockhart’s column “There’s a Bigger Prize Than Impeachment” in this issue. While I would love to see the Village Idiot kicked into the gutter the real goal is the destruction of the Republican Party for decades. Joe is more optimistic than I am though. I believe that history will follow the past. He is re-elected in 2020, an economic crisis occurs in 2021, it is completely mismanaged, dives into a depression, and the Republican Party is crushed in 2024. Progressive policies rule for 20 years. Sound familiar?
2
"...but the Mueller report still shows a president with criminal disregard for the rule of law and constitutional government."
Riddle me this Batman, what if you receive testimony that contradicts Mueller's report? Do you go with the greater crime?
And there are so many Democrats that want to beat Trump. So many. They will have to compete with the House Judiciary committee for tv time. People might not hear their message. Heck, they won't remember their names. What is the name of the fourth person to declare their candidacy?
Adam Schiff and Jerry Nadler are saying, "American voters are too stupid to replace President Trump. We will do it for them." 606
1
All of this in nonsensical, and if the author believes that impeachment would bring the country's citizens together rather than drive them further apart, while exacerbating widening the rift between right and left, he has made a mistake!Attempting to delegitimize a national election won squarely and fairly by Mr. TRUMP, now President Trump, by calling for the "mise en accusation"of the c-of-state is "loufoque,"farcical and imperils what national unity we have remaining. Word to the wise, to the author:"Don't go down that road."Take to heart the millions of voices, newly naturalized Americans including my "epouse," Juliana who, when she descended from that Delta flight in 2008 from ACCRA with Billy Boy, a dog whom we rescued together from the dusty merciless streets of Dansoman the year before,shouted "Vive les Etats Unis!"She is now with EMS and our son, Alister HaLL,attends Success Academy! Juliana is a Trump supporter, "tout a fait!"She credits Trump for making it possible to succeed in this great country of ours.Author should wake up and smell the coffee!This is a great country, and no one appreciates it more than she and millions of others who have been fortunate to get here and breathe the air of freedom and economic opportunity!
2
@Alexander Harrison "Fair and aquare" are not words I would associated with GOP gerrymandering and vote suppression, nor with the documented Russian intereference in the 201 election.
@Alexander Harrison "Fair and aquare" are not words I would associate with GOP gerrymandering and vote suppression, nor with the documented Russian intereference in the 201 election. Trump wants to be a king, and is no supporter of democracy.
It would be a blot on the history of this country if Trump isn’t impeached. Let the Senate GOP suffer the ignominy of acquitting this loathsome creature.
4
@Jay Impeachment is the Constitutionally defined solution for a corrupt president like Trump. But the issue is how to document the grounds for impeachment, and make the public aware of the reasons Trump must be removed, without the whole thing turning into a partisan circus. We know the Trump voters are not that fond of facts and evidence, and the GOP will lie about anything to hang on to power.
The GOP Senate : “ the gloves DO fit, but we’ll still acquit “.
See the problem ? Use your brains, not just your rage.
2020, the GOP goes down. Bigly.
4
Trump deserves to be booted out of the White House..along with his Criminal family. While Republicans burn the country down Democrats are always asked to take the high ground, whatever that means...
No one is immune from being held accountable so YES, begin Impeachment..it's what Trump deserves ...people get away with stuff because others allow it.
And as he walks out, tail between his legs with his sickening, scowly face we all should have a come to Jesus moment or two..Trump proved himself a Criminal before he ran for office. .why did we stand by, allow him to get away with all sorts of hideous things, some more hideous than others and then elect him? It's mind numbing...this isn't about being a Republican or Democrat..it s about being a Principled, Patriotic American
5
An solution to this impasse is "impeachment lite". That is, go through the same procedure as formal impeachment (i.e., hold hearings, supoena witnesses and documents), but instead of voting on formal impeachment, vote on a resolution that says, in effect:
"the undersigned declare that the president has committed high crimes and misdemeanors worthy of impeachment, enumerated below; and that this document stands in lieu of a formal impeachment finding, to avoiding further polarization of our country in a Senate trial that would be tainted by extreme partisanship. Nevertheless each and all of us declare that we would have voted for formal impeachment, if it has been offered "
"Impeachment lite" presumably would allow the same fact-gathering and debate as actual impeachment, would lay down an impeachment-like marker for historians and Trump's legacy; and possible also create a new, more flexible method for documenting future presidential overreach. FWIW
4
The essential question in my mind is this: In the event of a Trump re-election in 2020, can this nation survive another four years of his misrule?
2
Just today and even though Congress is on an (undeserved) Spring break, Ms Pelosi held a long conference call with many of her Democratic colleagues. Word is that her experience, political savvy, and smarts are telling her to not act prematurely. We have yet to hear from both Mr. Mueller (hopefully) and McGann. They both can very well provide the impetus needed to proceed with impeachment.
Then there is the flip side. Let us imagine that there was never a Special Counsel with its final report. We would not, and certainly do not, need any more than these past two plus years of observations which blatantly reveal the utter corruption, cruelty, and amorality of Donald Trump. The man not only as a president but also as a human being is a disgrace.
Finally - and maybe it's desperate hope - if the House does impeach, I believe there will not be a back-lash. There is a silent majority out there. They may be quieter than those vociferous and rabid MAGA supporters. They are definitely more ethical, more courageous, and neither greedy nor bigoted when juxtaposed with this new version of a Republican Party in Congress. But they are still true Americans who very likely may en masse send Mr. Trump packing in 2020, replacing him with the woman or man deserving of the title President of the United States.
3
@Kathy Lollock
I dont really understand the need to have hearings before impeachment although there is a clear assumption in all I read there must be such hearings. Is this just U.S. practice? Doesn't the Muller report with all its detail provide enough 'evidence' to draft an impeachment statement and bring on a vote? Remember that the impeachment process is not a trial even though everyone treats it as if it is with constant references to hearing evidence etc.
3
@james, if you're going to get the jury (the American people) on your side, you have to have a trial that presents a story. The Mueller report doesn't do that because the evidence was presented in grand jury hearings which the public will never see.
Impeachment proceedings in the House are the process we use in the U.S. to get the case to the public.
2
@james Based on the history of Watergate and the McCarthy hearings, people kind of expect to see witnesses testify on TV. Most citizens will never read the whole report. Mr Barr should have made public the summaries of main points that were written by the investigators, but I don't know if he did..
Thank you, Mr. Boiue. As I was reading this column, I kept thinking yes, yes, yes, yes, yes. Checks and balances! Co-equal branches of government! Laws and justice! Right and wrong!
Even if Trump's "high crimes and misdemeanors" aren't criminally prosecutable they are nonetheless in evidence. He attempted many times to obstruct justice, and if I'm not wrong, someone who attempts a crime is no less guilty than someone who successfully commits one (regardless of whether the penalty is lighter). And it's possible that Trump attempted to obstruct justice in many [REDACTED] ways that we don't yet know about.
Even before the Mueller Report, I thought impeachment would have been in order, due to Trump's unfitness, ineptness and unscrupulousness. He won't release his tax returns, won't do the necessary work and homework required for the job (Fox & Friends is on!), can't keep a staff, can't be trusted to say what he means and mean what he says, and plays way too much golf (at which he, of course, cheats). Trump doesn't read, but maybe he could learn something from the books upon books that have been written about just how crooked, lazy, unfit, and inept he is by people who have traveled in his orbit.
And Mueller does indeed issue a challenge for Congress to do something about an executive such as Trump through their Constitutional mandate of checks and balances. It's not just Congress's right to do so, it's their duty.
7
Speaker Pelosi hit the nail on the head. Democrats, she said, must now show the nation that its reaction to the Mueller report "is not driven by passion and prejudice".
5
"Tell the truth but tell the truth slowly..."
I don't know where to attribute that quote. It probably dates as far back as Confucius. Although, obviously not in English.
I think the central point however is to respect duty even where your duties conflict.
A middle space exists between Hoyer's cold water absurdity and a recreation of the Battle of Civetot.
Democrats need to seize the authority of impeachment without offending deference to the executive position. That's why Gingrich failed against Clinton. Disrespect. If you take the matter with utmost seriousness though, even your opponents are inclined to take you seriously.
Right now Democrats are failing in this task, Pelosi first. She and Nadler need to take the matter in hand and fast.
6
@Andy, if what your saying is let's have a slow moving - say 15 month long investigation by congress, that looks, tastes and smell like an impeachment proceeding, I agree.
Turn the spit slowly!
Impeaching Trump will not help Democrats.
It will permanently infuriate the working class Trump voters of Michigan, Wisconsin, and Pennsylvania -- former Democrats -- against Democrats for trying to remove their man. Conviction won't happen in the Senate. While pursuing impeachment, governance in the House to help the working class will come to a screeching halt. In short, it is a waste of time, an aggravation of people who might vote Democratic if they weren't being assailed by Trump haters, and detracts from the time needed to pursue positive goals which would help the working class.
Instead of wasting time with impeachment, the House should further define Medicare for All and the Green New Deal, explaining to working class voters in the Midwest and throughout the country what Democrats can do for them with such legislation. Then enough 2016 Trump voters can see a positive alternative to Trump and vote him out of office in 2020.
Of course, promoting Medicare for All and a Green New Deal presupposes
10
@Steve C One problem is that things that you suggest the house should work on are all issues that the GOP will do anything to block. Would Trump voters listen to and believe explanation of policies that are backed up by facts and evidence? Maybe, but they sure didn't get any such thing from Trump, whose appeal was based on fear and anger and prejudice. Do we know that Trump voters could be motivated by sensible plans for economic problems? I think this is uncertain.
1
@Steve C
Ignore last 2 lines of text in my post.
@Steve C
Is there a reason the Democrats can' do both?
Mr. Bouie - What an eloquent and convincing argument for impeachment. There is a reason Congress' popularity is so low - many/most Americans perceive it to be a place where individual judgment has been corrupted by campaign donations. What does the Democratic Party stand for now, beyond being anti-Trump? If it sits by and does not vigorously press a case, based on what was revealed in the Mueller report, how does that reflect on any sense of right or wrong it might have? But perhaps it's just too late - the Democratic Party having no moral compass left at all, so....just do a little grandstanding and let it go.
14
I agree to the extent that dems have to continue investigations and, on all fronts of Trump’s corruption. But they need not call this “impeachment”. If inconvertible evidence emerges they will be in place to impeach and bring along some honest republicans.
8
@Maryellen Simcoe, I agree. Keep putting the pressure on Trump and the Republicans. Don't take impeachment off the table, but there's no need explicitly pursue it either while you investigate and accumulate evidence. Avoiding impeachment for fear of helping the opposition in the elections is wimpy and timid. There's a smart way to go about it.
On a side note, how can we prevent a self-dealer like Trump from seeking the White House again? We know that his behavior toward Putin, both during the campaign and even now, is probably driven by his expectation that Putin is the man who decides whether the biggest deal of his life--Trump Tower Moscow--gets built.
Trump thumbs his nose at democratic norms like transparency and maintaining the appearance of no conflicts. Unlike every president since Nixon, he refuses to share his tax returns. Unlike every president in memory he refuses to divest himself of his business interests. He openly monetizes the presidency by doubling the fees at Mar-a-Lago, where he provides access--and even ambassadorships--to members. He maintains a hotel in D.C. where foreign dignitaries court his good will.
The answer may lie with the states. I'm not sure it's constitutional for Congress to legislate that a presidential candidate must share 10 years of tax returns and promise to put his assets in a blind trust. However, the states have wide latitude in deciding which candidates' names can go on the ballot. A number of states have already passed legislation that a candidate must share his tax returns before his name goes on the ballot. It's time for more states to follow.
6
Here's something to think about: Should impeachment succeed in ousting Trump, how should we feel about the prospects of winning the general election against Mike Pence instead?
Perhaps the current energy level of anti-Trump voters would subside without Trump as a foil. If the single issue responsible for galvanizing Democrats is getting Trump out of office, and Trump has been removed from office before the election, does that satiate those voters enough to make a bunch of them stay home on election day?
2
@Kal Al Well, I'm just one person who would like to see Trump make a swift exit, but having Pence instead would not de-energize me. If anything, I would see it as a great opportunity for Democrats to have a decisive electoral victory and put this ugly chapter of history behind us. For whatever reason, Trump inspires a cult of personality that sticks with him through thick and thin. Pence on the other hand, not so much. Can you imagine an auditorium full of screaming Pence supporters? Neither can I.
I appreciate Mr. Bouie's consideration of possible political backfire if the public perceives impeachment proceedings as a media circus, political grandstanding, witch hunt, fruitless venture and/or waste of time, money and attention. Blue-state Democrats may underestimate these narrative pitfalls, as they're surrounded by like-minded voters. What matters is the views of swing-state voters. What meme would prevail? This is my concern because impeachment won't actually get rid of Trump. Only 2020 will. Please remember: politics are negotiable, but nature does not negotiate. We may only have this last shot at effectively addressing climate change and rescuing the planet from a 6th extinction. That's the biggest, most important issue. With that in mind, for god's sake, don't blow it.
2
Since a new Congress takes over on January 1st, but the president isn't sworn in until January 20th, couldn't a House and Senate impeach and convict a president during that time frame? While short, control of Congress would be known for nearly 2 months in advance.
1
Trump is sure to lose the North East and California by wide margins. Unfortunately, that doesn't add up to 276 electoral votes. But by all means proceed. If nothing else, you'll have a feel good moment.
5
Mr. Mueller has a number of criminal investigations dispersed to other parts of the Justice Department, mostly but not exclusively to the SDNY that at this time is being overseen by AG William Barr. That is an immensely troubling situation. I would rather Congress work on first getting rid of Bill Barr or at the very least force him to recuse and then go after Trump.
5
Impeachment proceedings can reveal more than Mueller discovered, will result in a conclusion denied (or not used by) Mueller, and can render a determination that the occupant of the WH has stained the office of president. That determination and stain can be effectively mined in the 2020 campaign to show unfitness for a second term.
The possible and expected failure of the Senate to convict saves the nation from the prospect of Pence as president and denies him what he so clearly prays for.
Recall that the current occupant only has 40% support. He will be denied the Independents and cross-over Republicans he has in 2016, never rising above 40%.
60% beats 40% every time.
8
While the Senate will not vote to impeach, the House should still go through with the process and make Trump squirm. Essentially, he needs to go down in history as one of the presidents impeached by the House.
20
@Anthony...
The Republican Senate will never vote to impeach Trump because this would mean voting to impeach the Republican party.
This is why we need to aquire the maximum amount of evidence against him before proceeding to the Senate.
The Mueller report is only the beginning.
Let's wait until the House interviews folks like Mueller, Weisselberg, McGahn, Deutsche Bank and the English translator for Trump/Putin.
Let's wait for the evidence from SDNY, the AG of NYS, and the DA of NYC.
Let's not let ego impulsivity rule over effective strategy.
1
@AnthonyHmmm....How is that going to play out in the presidential election?
1
Clever politics would dictate that the Democrats do not go for impeachment but instead raise the electorate to a crescendo of outrage through continued investigations and hearings. Impeachment will fail in the Republican Senate. Failed impeachment will aid Trump. Tantalizing the electorate will increase the drumbeat for change going into the 2020 election. Then their will be great change. Let Pelosi handle this, she knows what she's doing.
11
I don’t favor impeachment to remove this lawless president. I rather see 2020 as a test for the American voters. Will they support an incompetent, ill tempered, cheating and immoral man a second time? Nothing but a crushing defeat will remove the stain of 2016. But if yes, then it’s not a one man problem anymore. He will be merely a living symptom of a national malaise.
7
Speaker Pelosi wake up.
The spineless Senate Republicans must be held accountable . They have a duty to hold The Con Man in Chief accountable so let them stand up and vote him not guilty of high crimes and misdemeanors .
Twenty- two of the McConnell cult are up for re-election. Democrats should have a field day during Senate debates asking Collins and McConnell about the criminal in the White House.
19
Why decide such things now? Call Barr, Mueller and others to testify.
4
@MKR
All these people can be called to an impeachment hearing.
The GOP are spinning out anti-impeachment propaganda just to stop the Dems from doing their Constitutional duty to investigate a corrupt presidency.
3
Agree 100%. As the republican don't act and try to derail any action against this president to escape exposing their complicity in covering up for a misfit president, the democrat should act.
Fear of a bully or blow back orchestrated by a bully as an excuse to not perform their legislative duty to defend the constitution and the rule of law makes the democrats look awfully weak.
The 2018 vote towards the democrats was about accountability. Congress do your job !
7
If the Democrats are fearful of emboldening Trump supporters, impeachment proceedings will embolden Democrats and Independents, probably canceling each other out at the voting booth. Initiating impeachment proceedings will prove that the Democrats can have the guts to fight the GOP. They have the truth and law on their side. Trump is a criminal and a traitor to Democracy and must be held accountable now. The record will state all the GOP senators who voted not to impeach. May those senators and their families carry that shame on their shoulders forever.
17
Politics is the antithesis of morality and science.
Impeachment is a partisan political process tool. There is no lure in favor of impeachment. Except among the cackling and quacking mass media class.
The American philosopher kings D. L. Hughley and Nick Cannon have given deep wise insight on where America is and why in the era of Donald Trump.
Professor D. L. opined that the election of Barack Obama exposed what America aspires to be while the election of Donald Trump showed who America really is.
Professor Nick offered the observation that white America wants black America to be silent and grateful.
Donald Trump is the one and only Article II executive office of the President of the United States because 63 million Americans voted for him including 58% of the white voting majority made up of 62% of white men and 54% of white women.
Donald Trump did not run a covert stealth subtle campaign. Every American knew who Trump was and was not and voted accordingly. Trump's election can't be blamed on divine royal sanction selection nor an armed uniformed military coup.
See " Uncensored" TV1 featuring D.L. and Nick.
5
This all makes sense, if we were dealing with a rational man, supported by a Party that cares about decency, integrity and ultimately, our Country. They do not. By fully supporting and collaborating with Trump, the GOP have shown their true face, and color. That color is singularly white, and that gender is exclusively male, along with their consorts and brood mares.
Forget the talk and fantasies of impeachment. We have a much more important task to finish. Vote them out. ALL of them. It’s the least they deserve, after foisting this monstrosity upon us all.
PERIOD.
3
This is a muddled argument for impeachment and is not convincing. Better to hang Donald Trump around the neck of the Republican party, like a chicken around the neck of a miscreant dog - and then focus on the 2020 election. Impeachment will not force Trump from office, as you admit; losing in 2020 will.
5
I think it's a call for purpose. A Trump presidency has shown us how terribly low we can fall. We have tried doing the politically expedient thing and we still ended up with Trump.
I'm a pragmatist, but I can't keep compromising my beliefs for the hope that something good will come. I'm tired of going through the permutations and guessing how this political choice will play with an American public that is anything but predictable. I'm done with that. I'm going to do what I think is right because that is the consistent choice. I'll never have trouble defending a choice that I believe in now.
This president is unfit for office. We have ample evidence. I'm not going to avoid impeachment because Republicans are blind or because I'm afraid it won't help politically. Maybe it won't work. Maybe it will backfire and we'll get four more years of Trump. I'll have the same sense of loss, but I won't have any regrets or misconception about the state of our country.
6
This impeachment talk is absurd. There is no chance that the Republican controlled Senate will vote for impeachment.
The election is just a year away. The election is the proper mechanism to vote out Trump. You may not like the electoral college, but both candidates knew the rules going in so neither would waste any time in California. Any impeachment talk is just an end-around to a potential Democratic party loss in 2020. If Trump was that bad in the eyes of the voter, the Democrat would win both the popular and electoral college vote. If you're saying the voters are ignorant and dumb and don't know better, that's pretty insulting and it's an incorrect assumption. The fact that fringe candidates are doing well right now shows the Democratic party's moderate candidates are are a hot mess and unlikable. Because the Democrats have a decent chance of losing again, that's why there is impeachment as plan B.
Democrats need to forget about plan B and run on issues. If the party platform is "anyone but Trump" and impeachment, you might as well concede the election today.
4
@FrankM
I agree that Democratic presidential candidates need to, and must, run on bold, kitchen table issues. However, Mueller has handed the ball over the Congress. Should the House just drop this ball? Congress should do its job, the presidential candidates should do theirs. Why not both?
2
Trump's manipulation of race and identity through social media made him our president 2 years ago. Acts count. If the Democratic Congress doesn't act now to impeach Donald Trump -- the most ignorant and unfit president in our history -- he'll be re-elected by his fear-mongering base next year. How much longer can we wait before acting on behalf of Democracy and against our demonic president? Why wait 17 more months to start impeachment proceedings?
The rubber met the road in the Mueller Report. A tidal wave is rising for impeachment of president Trump. Trump's maga loyalists will resist impeachment. What further harm can there be with the Democrats standing with the Constitution and against Donald Trump? Trump has already done appalling harm to our Democracy and America in the world's eyes. Why should our legislature continue to delay the day of reckoning with our demonic president?
7
In any argument concerning impeachment, the financial incentive of the media organizations making this argument should be disclosed.
Reporting about President Donald Trump is big business. Reporting on the impeachment proceedings of Donald Trump would drive readers and viewers to the news like nothing else. Whereas careful rational investigation by Congress does not draw nearly as many eyeballs.
1
Presently the press is failing in their coverage of the Mueller Report by only demanding that the Democrats make a decision to impeach or not. I believe the Democrats are reacting properly. They want to get the entire report, talk to Mueller and others and become more informed and to better inform the public on weather the Congress should begin impeachment proceedings. It has been 4 days since the report came out. Let the country take in the report.
The media should however be questioning the republicans in Congress on weather the are okay with what the Trump Administration has done. Do they believe it is okay to lie to the American people. Should republicans hold Trump accountable? Are the republicans going to put the country before the party? I have every confidence that the Democrats will do the right thing. I have no belief that the Republicans will act in the proper way. They have no moral ethics left in the party. All those whom do not believe as they do, do not have the right to govern, interpret our laws and Constitution. Only they have that right. So lets have the media start asking the republicans what they propose to do. As them if obstruction of justice is okay. Are the okay with the Russians interfering with our elections? Do they believe that the Russians did interfere and that they have continued to do so. Is it okay to obstruct an investigation into the actions of the Republicans
4
Mr. Bouie makes a good case that "action, not passivity" is how a "high-stakes political argument" is won. (And, it shouldn't be this argument that some officeholders are having WITH the Constitution.)
There seems like no shortage of INDIVIDUALS coming forward with speeches of due cause. Even Romney is "sickened".
Furthermore, IT IS THE MUELLER REPORT ITSELF that reminds us of “our constitutional system". Mr. Bouie aptly shows as all the recommendation that we need.
The irony of "political calculus" is that Democrats will get blamed for playing it (impeachment) when they actually would rather not. But maybe, all INDIVIDUALS can embrace "symbolism matters" more easily, if they can consider the alternative:
Passivity, not action would place the INDIVIDUAL on a path toward "contempt for the Constitution".
6
The democrats should put all their energy and thinking into presenting to the American voters why Trump should not be re-elected . The independents and republicans can be convinced that Trump presents a danger to our democracy and national security despite the economy boosted with a sugar high with money borrowed from China to give to the rich and powerful .This debt will cripple our economy down the road when we need infrastructure and the economy has a downturn there is no bail out money already handed to the rich and powerful who will not give it back.
1
Well said Mr. Bouie! You've answered every conceivable objection to going forward with impeachment. In the end there must be accountability for the decisions and actions by Trump and those he directed on his behalf. Robert Mueller passed the ball on this, but Congress must not.
This transcends the political calculus of elections, this is about whether our elected representatives have the courage of their convictions, and the integrity to uphold their sworn oaths. If the Democrats are afraid of a backlash, then their timidity deserves the rebuke of election losses.
Not being a lawyer or legal scholar I may not have the knowledge required, but I cannot fathom how Mueller could outline and even spell out actions taken by Trump that show numerous attempts to obstruct, and yet decline to indict or prosecute. If the only reason was the DOJ opinion that a sitting President can't be indicted, well that's a flimsy reed to hang an "exoneration" upon.
The American people deserve to know, without any doubt, whether their President committed crimes, including possible treason. These matters were not fully investigated due to obstacles Mueller believed he couldn't overcome, but the Congress has full authority to do so, and that's why I believe he punted it to them. They must not fumble it.
6
I'm a former prosecutor. Democrats must move forward with impeachment even though it will fail because of Republican obstruction and may hurt Democrats at the ballot box.
Republicans insist the Mueller report "exonerates" Trump, when Mueller explicitly stated it "does not exonerate him". The report states how our republic rests on the First Branch of government, not the Special Counsel, holding Trump accountable for his crimes as a sitting president cannot be indicted under current DOJ guidelines. It means Congressional Democrats must exert that authority.
Congress, not the judiciary, is the institution created by the Founding Fathers to exert vigorous oversight of the Executive Branch in order to prevent the rise of an authoritarian despot.
Every attorney knows the law of obstruction. Yet William Barr, the US Attorney General entrusted to uphold the law and protect American democracy, lied about the law to deceive the public while blatantly misrepresenting facts before they could be reviewed. I know a bit about corrupt attorneys and Barr's actions prove he believes Trump is guilty.
The system is broken. We cannot expect an election to fix it. The GOP has eviscerated Federalist 51 which mandates checks and balances so as to protect our republic. The GOP in protecting Trump is advancing authoritarianism and creating an autocracy, destroying both our tripartite government and the separation of powers. Impeachment is necessary to save our republic and American democracy.
74
The most generic question about the public response to this foul presidency is "How to end it to achieve the most public good?" Defeat at the polls and impeachment and removal are all three desirable, complementary, and at least two can be achieved.
Electoral defeat of Trump in 2020 would likely further reduce down-ballot Republican officeholders, especially his most ardent enablers.
Investigations in progress should broaden public support for Trump's removal by voters and his impeachment, which could happen before or after the 2020 general election. Does anyone believe that we have seen the end of impeachable behavior from Trump?
A post-election Senate trial and conviction, whether by this Congress or the next, would eliminate the prospect of self-pardoning and would allow the Senate to apply the disqualification clause of Article I, Section 3 so that Trump would never again "hold any [federal] office of honor, trust, or profit". A Pence presidency would last only days or weeks.
If as expected Trump's behavior continues on course, the electoral defeat could be sweeping and Republicans might well join the vote to convict as act of redeeming the party.
4
@John Excellent points!
Not only the US electorate, but the rest of the world is watching and wondering how and when Trump and his minions will be called to account.
Making America Respectable Again means defending the Constitution, upholding the law, and Congress ' doing its job as a co-equal partner in government. Without these things happening......."fuhgeddaboudit".
Yes, yes, yes. Impeachment MUST lay out the sheer extent and volume of questionable behavior, all together, in no uncertain terms, loud and clear. Give truth and facts a voice, or they'll be drowned out by dishonesty and so much spin it'll leave voters dizzy.
11
I agree with Mr. Bouie, but, given his statement that "impeachment could crowd out the material case against Trump, centering the election on legal questions versus the impact of his presidency on people’s lives", it is time to remind people that impeachment is not a legal matter, in the sense of violating law. It is a constitutional matter, in the sense of the way our government operates. if Congress doesn't try to impeach a president as dubious as Trump, then it encourages future presidents to act as they wish without regard to laws or any responsibility to the people.
21
Thank you for laying out this important argument. Those who think that an vote articles of impeachment in the House is the end are wrong. It is the beginning of a process that will lay out for the American people loudly and clearly exactly what has been and is happening in the White House. That is important and is the responsibility and duty of the House of Representatives.
14
I want Trump gone yesterday, but impeachment without conviction (which is impossible with this Senate) will only make him stronger. Censure is the way to go.
3
I wish the Democrats would just go ahead and have an impeachment vote and get it over with. That's all they have.
6
For over two year Liberals, former Obama officials and Democratic politicians told us President Trump was a traitor and an agent of Russia.
Do they still believe that?
Or do they need to continue with their “traitor” ruse because they have no other way to obtain votes?
6
@Dr. John: Tour moniker is as fraudulent as your argument:
1. The report lists one hundred forty illicit and or illegal Trumpski -Russia contacts out of which more than thirty denizens of the aforementioned pig style have faced indictment, conviction, and prison sentences.
2. HRC won the popular vote —I. E. Will of the People—and the Democrats cleaned the racist, sexist Right-wing’s clock in House/governorship mid-terms.
You prove, yet again, that it is the American Right-wing that has nothing but lies, Red Herrings, and post how ergo propter how logical fallacies to obscure their corruption, malfeasance, general criminality.and
1
@Dr. John
We don't "believe" it, because we have facts, we know it. There's a difference.
Sure impeach him now and get Pence. And, then Pence will run against the Democrats and a very progressive agenda to include reparations to African American for the slavery that ended 8 generations ago and when the ancestors of most Americans were not in this country. Reparations is just one part of the Democrat platform most of middle America will not got for. Add to it payment to people "even if the do not want to work", no cars, planes, trains etc. In short, Pence who has only some of the taint of Trump, will look inviting to middle America, and they will elect the next president.
5
@Bian
Pence has no charm whatsoever. He has little backing, and no charisma. He'd not very popular and he is likely going to have to deal with a now-sealed indictment in his near future. He committed perjury, for starters.
If Democrats could get with their Arab allies and engineer a two-year oil embargo, impeachment against Donald Trump might work.
It helped drive out Nixon ('73-'74) and Carter ('79-'80).
1
For democrats to sit back and do nothing will again allow Trump to control the narrative and claim his "exoneration" which any thinking person knows is false. Action by the democrats will shut that down quickly. Keep up the pressure, have Mueller testify, get Trumps taxes and business records and expose him for the fraud he is. Then initiate impeachment proceedings. Expose the crook, no one will admit voting for such a despicable person. He is no victim, a con man yes, victim, no way.
13
Who are these "we" whose moral health needs action? Perhaps it you in the MSM whose morals are a little in need of reinforcement after two years of waiting for Mueller and being disappointed.
6
Trump was adamant about how this sort of thing should not happen to another President. For once, he is right, but not in the way that he imagines.
We need to have something (a law) with more bite than a mere policy against indicting a sitting president who engages in exactly the sort of things in which Trump engages, and we need a system in place for what to do if he does engage in criminal or treasonous activities.
We need to have laws in place that state that all candidates running for POTUS must release five years of their tax returns and public business records before their application can progress.
We need to require candidates to submit to physicals and psychological testing conducted by an unbiased, impartial and respected doctors before their application for candidacy can be accepted, and a high level of competency must be reached. A full disclosure of high school, college and post-graduate grades would also be a good idea, and so would bonafide character witnesses.
A candidate for POTUS is applying for a job, just as someone who is applying for the job of file clerk, dog catcher, teacher or cab driver. Unlike a clerk, dog catcher, teacher or cab driver, the position as POTUS is one of the most important positions in the world, and we as citizens owe it to ourselves to hire the best person for the job. Trump is right; we do not want someone like him to be granted this honor again.
8
Elizabeth Warren, it seems, has more courage than most of her colleagues and most of the other candidates to the presidency. Impeaching Trump is the right thing to do, even if some find it "inconvenient".
60
Looking ahead to 2020, may be impeachment does not appear a good idea, as Joe Lockhart argues in his article (on which we are unable to comment). It is also certain that Trump will not be removed from office, even if he is impeached by the House, given the simple arithmetic in the Senate.
However, these times are in need for leaders who are committed to say and do what matters. Let's do the right thing, and avoid the politicking promoted by the current Democratic leadership. And if Trump gets reelected, the citizens of this country certainly deserve him.
3
2020 vision matters. You cannot run for president or any high office if you don't release your financial records. Business and personal. That's a no brainer. It is obstruction of justice to decline to do so and so is disqualifying. No argument.
16
Mr. Bouie places on the table a set of false alternatives. "Do they commit to hearings and investigations with an eye toward impeachment proceedings or do they downplay the issue of presidential accountability?" They, the democratic majority in the House, need to commit in the strongest terms to hearings and investigations with an eye toward demonstrating that the Grifter in Chief is utterly unfit for public office of any kind, much less the presidency, and that he is accountable to us, the electorate.
We are fast reaching the point where America is in need of an interest group: Progressives for President Pence, PPP. Mr. Bouie would make a very capable standard bearer for that association.
2
Republicans impeached Bill Clinton for really nothing and the Democrats are still suffering from it.
If the Democrats do not impeach Donald Trump, they should just fold and let Republicans dictate the nation's future from now on. Trump is already acting like a ruler with absolute power.
15
Is anyone else perplexed by the headline of this column, "The Lure of Impeachment"? Mr. Bouie makes a solid case for impeaching the president in this column. Using the word "lure" has a negative implication that does not match the tone of the piece.
And the other main column today proposing impeachment is titled "Impeach Donald Trump?" with a question mark even though author Mr. Blow clearly calls for pursuing impeachment, no question.
I feel such headlines undermine the intent of the authors and bias those of us who only scan the headlines to think there is less momentum for impeachment than there is.
1
I am a Democrat. I loathe Trump. However, if he is impeached, we face civil strife at least, Civil war at worst. Blues calling for impeachment should not deceive themselves on that.
Had Mueller found Collusion, things would be different.
He did not.
Trump is unfit for office by multiple measures- but 40% of the country does not think so. That 40% control 80% of the space between the coasts- and they control the entire Gulf Coast. They have lots and lots of weapons. They call Trump "...Our President...".
We just have to win the 2020 Election.
10
@Lefthalfbach
Mueller did find sufficient evidence for obstruction of justice, but was unable to indict due to DoJ rules against indicting a sitting president. He was also careful to point out that Trump was not exonerated for collusion, but there was insufficient evidence for criminal charges beyond a reasonable doubt. Nixon's charges included: for obstruction of justice, abuse of power, and contempt of Congress.
Options now are to start impeachment hearings, hope Trump isn't re-elected and charge him after he leaves office but before the 5 year statue of limitations are up, or do nothing.
7
As high-minded and academic as this op-ed pretends to be, I says very little. Trump will not be removed from office by a Senate conviction prior to the 2020 election. If he were impeached, that would likely cost Democrats the 2020 election.
The only chance the Democrats have in 2020 is to not impeach Trump and to win the election on its merits. Winning the election on its merits will not involve discussions about impeachment, the emoluments clause, the electoral college, the validity of OLC opinions, or the proper exercise of prosecutorial discretion.
That Democratic op-ed columnists like Mr. Bouie are pretending to be experts on constitutional theory, legal theory, and legal philosophy tells you everything you need to know about the 2020 election:
Trump will win it.
4
OK. Let's take a deep breath.
It's true that Trump is detestable, corrupt and in-your-face-obnoxious. It's true that he has tried to take down everything Obama did, in a most vindictive and destructive manner. It's true that he had wanton disregard for the law in the obstruction of justice area. It's true that Democrats likely hate him, or at the least, have disdain for him. It's also true that his near-dictatorial form of leading is abominable and needs to be confronted.
All that being said...the House must demonstrate, convincingly, that his misdeeds are not just a Democratic construct to express the intense dislike they hold for him. Because, the next president, if a Democrat, will be the target of constant Republican obstruction, just as Obama was. Also, it might foment the base - although it seems like his lower approval ratings show that's not enough.
It would feel great to evict Trump, and he certainly "deserves" it, but it can increase the probability of the other side being on a permanent vendetta, whereas, the loss in his election - especially convincingly - would remove him in a democratic and altogether less volatile, less divisive way.
The case must be solid - solid enough for the voters to express that he is either guilty of wrongdoing (through polls) or suffering from House investigations into his actions.
Anything less than that could be questionable or even ruinous for the future elections of Democrats and 2020 presidential hopes.
3
@Srose
So this is where investigation and testimony under oath come in, rather than heading straight to impeachment.
Who honestly thinks that there is NO slime under the rocks that will be turned over?
Democrats can’t control what you know who says, or tweets, but we can decide better than to walk right into his propaganda. Trump has described the Mueller report as the biggest witch hunt ever, Democrats as obsessed with him, career politicians and agents as determined to remove him, the outsider, from office. Impeachment hearings would only fuel his narrative.
The Mueller report confirmed the seedy, duplicitous behavior we have all witnessed, but stopped short of finding a smoking gun. The Special Counsel’s work should be respected for what it was, but not used as a partisan tool, or squeezed like a dry stone.
How about all Trump’s wrongdoings which have nothing to do with Russia? The renewed attempt to take away guaranteed healthcare, the insults to our allies, the inhuman treatment of immigrants, the blurring of any separation of powers, the assaults on a free press, the nepotism and ineptitude in the Administration, doing the NRA’s bidding, his endless lies... All those, and more, are what Democrats should hit him with. And it will be at the ballot boxes next year when Trump faces defeat and we, at last, achieve a reckoning.
9
I started out by thinking that impeachment was a bad idea. Republican senators wouldn't convict, and it would only rile his base.
I have now changed my mind.
First and foremost, it the correct and constitutionally proper thing to do. Let's put Trump's feet to the fire: call witnesses against him from his own circle, highlight his crimes in office, reveal him for the scam artist and would-be dictator that he is and make republican senators deny the undeniable on live television.
And It will drive Trump absolutely crazy.
8
Democrats need to stop their incessant, neurotic fretting about "energizing Republican voters in defense of the president" and do their job, do what is right and do what is expected of them.
Of course Trump supporters will be energized by impeachment. Good! Let them defend this president. Let them side with and applaud his lack of ethics. Let them see and hail his clear corruption, point by point. Make them defend what is obviously immoral, and marginally legal. Let's let all Americans see how intensely they're willing to identify with what the Mueller report shows as "a president with criminal disregard for the rule of law and constitutional government."
7
No, the Mueller report did show that he obstructed justice but said Congress much decide to try the case in impeachment. It also said the Russians were involved with Trump’s people and decisively meddle in the election. From the Russian spy perspective, their plan worked. They lured Trump in and help rig the vote. That’s how the Russians, the masters of people manipulation, do it. They don’t sign some explicit pledge to conspire or say, “I want to conspire with you to rig the election.” They just lure people in over years, make all kinds of implicit offers, and then get their man to back Putin on the world stage in Helsinki. Putin and Co. are laughing it up right now, trust me. The Mueller report showed how to execute a master plan to manipulate our election and politicians, how to get revenge against an enemy (Clinton) and then how to be exonerated by the America media and President after the report comes out. Their misdirects are genius and you can see a picture of them laughing up their victory when Lavrov and Co. visited Trump in the Oval Office with no American press, only a KGB trained photographer taking the perfect picture of their victory lap.
3
The most critical question is not how to remove Trump. It is, how do we remove Trumpism from power over American life? Acting against Trump in ways that strengthen or even just extend Trumpism is a serious error. Trump is a personal affront but this is about larger business. Getting rid of him won't cure the disease.
3
What makes one think the next election won’t be corrupted by Russian influence? Are the Democrats willing to put our democracy at risk by taking that chance?
4
The reluctance to pursue impeachment is part of Nancy Pelosi's and the other corporate Democrats ill-considered plan to smooth the runway for a President Biden by not ruffling any feathers. That, and dismissing the progressives in the House as a handful of crazies. It's the same winning strategy that gave us President Hillary.
I agree the Dems should keep up the heat on Donald, not to impeach him, but to shave off the odds he might win re-election.
His choices: Lose the election and let the Dems throw him in jail. or... resign and let Pence pardon him.
Would you risk years in prison on Donald's chances of winning?
Hark I smell the nauseating stench of Hypocrisy. Obstruction of Justice? Give me a break, You could Easily prove obstruction of Justice and ignoring the Constitution on every president since Jimmy Carter. Let see some easy examples Reagan pretending Iran-Contra was all Oliver North no one else knew anything. Or perhaps as we continue on Bush 1 preemptively pardoning how many people before they werecharged or tried for Iran Contra? If that isn't interfering with justice what is ? Continuing on our odyssey we have Clinton discounting Monica Lewinsky which he lied about under oath no question. How about campaign Donations from the Chinese Government or perhaps pulling FBI files on opponents in 96, No Bill Clinton's hands aren't clean either. Has for Bush 2 what can you say about a man who fought an undeclared war under false pretenses ? Has for Obama how about executing people without trial and conviction including US citizens by Drone. No charges needed. Or perhaps Operation Fast & Furious?
I don't like Trump I didn't vote for him. But there no sense and certainly no truth in proclaiming impeaching him is about Morality or Justice, It isn't. It's about personal animosity no more no less. Pretending otherwise is at best.....hypocritical. We as a nation have ignored plenty of lies, plenty of interference by us and in our elections by other nations before. Trump is more blatant but hardly more guilty of the charges then his predecessors. Pretending otherwise?
4
He's not going to be impeached. Face it. Aint gonna happen.
But, the Dems can make his life totally miserable for the next 18 months, which is exactly what they should do.
Block his programs
Let him keep digging himself into a deeper and deeper hole
The electorate, at least the ones who aren't ardent supporters, have come to realize this guy is a charlatan, a liar, and a snake oil salesman. He won the White House by approximately 58,000 votes in a few key states. I honestly doubt those same ppl who voted for him before, sans the lemmings, will do the same in 2020.
Remember, Clinton got 3 million more votes. That number can easily translate across those states and give the Dems a victory.
One other factor that no one seems to mention...Clinton was not a well-liked candidate. The odds are pretty good that whoever is the Dem nominee will have a much higher approval rating than Clinton. This is a secret weapon that will be a major factor in his defeat. Mark my words.
6
Progressivism is the antithesis of our founding principles. If the author and his savants want to fundamentally change our structure, let's have a vote about it. Stop the impeachment nonsense in the meantime.
3
The Mueller report lays out offenses that require the Congress to impeach. The politics associated with the process must be secondary to the obligations members of Congress assumed when they took their oaths of office.
5
House Democrats must investigate and follow the facts wherever the they may lead. We need to remember that Robert Mueller is a Republican and his judgement regarding the president's behavior was likely clouded by politics, just like William Barr's.
Democrats have honor and principle on their side and they have a constitutional duty to investigate. If Democrats bow down to Republican pressure now they will go down in history as modern-day Neville Chamberlains.
Democrats must investigate with rigor and transparency. The facts will lead the way.
5
What we REALLY need, more than anything else, is getting Trump OUT OF OFFICE. That's not going to happen through impeachment. In fact, starting impeachment proceedings would be a diversion from fighting over everyday issues that is the sure way to get rid of Trump IF it remains the focus of the 2020 campaign, and nothing else. It might feel good to the Democratic base to start an impeachment process with ZERO chance of success, but anything other than focusing on solid campaign issues will prove to be a fool's errand and one that this country REALLY cannot afford!
6
@ManhattanWilliam
Keeping Trump in-office until 2020 will likely do better for forward-thinking people. His continued malfeasance will likely destroy the Repuglican party.
I think that House Democrats should stop this worried and indecisive handwringing about whether or not to impeach Trump, and "Just Do It" as the Nike ad says. Trump's base is already with him 100%, so their level of support cannot possibly go any higher, if they get mad about the Democrats impeaching him. As many op-ed writers and commenters, have already stated, it would set a horrible precedent for future Presidents of the United States, if Trump is NOT impeached, with all of his extremely high levels of corruption, then who will? If Trump's behavior does not trigger impeachment, another POTUS in the future can do the same thing as Trump, or even worse, and get away with it. Keep in mind that the standard for impeachment, of "High crimes and misdemeanors", is not that same as "beyond a reasonable doubt" for a jury conviction in a criminal trial, which is the highest burden of proof for a prosecutor to prove. There is no way that a Democratic President like Obama, could possibly get away with 1% of what Trump is guilty of without getting impeached by the Republican Party, if they had majority control of the House. I think impeachment would actually help the Democrats win in 2020 by firing up Democratic voters. Trump thinks that he is above the law, and has been getting away with murder. Let's put a stop to it and impeach. Even if the Senate does not convict, history will show that Democrats did the right thing, and Trump will be remembered as an impeached President.
13
There IS an upside if Trump is not impeached...and fails to win a second term. As a regular citizen he can then be charged with various crimes he committed while he was in office. But should he win another term he will, of course, be protected from indictment.
My take is that impeachment actions should commence soon while the Mueller report is still fresh in the public mind. Those who worry about his supporters being even more motivated by impeachment must remember that we will never sway them to a different train of thought anyway, impeachment or not. To move forward would make the Dems look tough, and with all the witnesses that could be subpoenaed to testify against Trump, who knows? We may even sway some Senate minds. At any rate, we need to let everyone know that the Dems are dead serious about removing the scourge from the White House.
6
If it could be guaranteed that Trump will lose the 2020 election, then perhaps the argument against impeachment would make more sense. But that isn't remotely the case.
Congress has a duty to take action. It may be impossible to predict all of the possible political ramifications of impeachment, but it's easy to see how a failure to follow up on the credible accusations against Trump would negatively impact the rule of law in this country. I think the message would be pretty clear that facts don't matter, the constitution doesn't matter, the only thing that matters is "how does this affect me and my chances for re-election?"
Moreover, if Congress doesn't act, it will reinforce the notion that the entire investigation was a sham, a "partisan witch hunt" that could safely be ignored. Imagine, just for a second, a world in which Congress decides impeachment isn't worth the bother, and then Trump makes the Mueller report and "presidential harassment" a major campaign theme anyway … and then he wins.
7
@Joe M. Well, back at you with this: If Trump *doesn't* lose the 2020 election, then isn't that an argument that it was democratically appropriate to leave him as President? You may not like it, but democracy *is* supposed to be about the will of the people (whether wise or not).
@MadManMark I would say that our constitution recognizes the fact that voters may approve of unethical, illegal, and unconstitutional things, and that's why we have checks and balances. The founders were very wary of the "tyranny of the majority." Whether or not Trump is re-elected, he needs to be held accountable.
How can House Democrats possibly justify not fulfilling their constitutional duty to impeach this President in light of everything we now know by complaining that it's no use because the Senate Republicans will certainly not fulfill their constitutional duty to remove him? The logic is absolutely bananas, like the republic we seem to have become.
9
@THFinNH "Constitutional duty?" Impeachment is a political action, not a criminal one, and there is *nothing* in the Constitution that states it *must* be pursued (aka is a "duty")
1
@THFinNH
You're right. Not to move toward impeachment in the House because....because the Senate might not go along, because doing so might "embolden Trump's base", because, because.....helps show the world that our government - all of it - is just rotten to the core.
1
I'm grateful for the clarity and perspective in this piece.
I suspect, that if the House were to hold hearings exposing all the evidence possible, including sworn testimony from Robert Mueller, Rod Rosenstein, William Barr, Andrew McCabe, Don McGahn, Michael Cohen, et al, the public would clamor for impeachment and the senate would have no choice but to acknowledge the fact.
At that point the president may be prudent and agree to resign in return for certain prosecutions being dropped, but I don't think he deserves that opportunity. If he chose to resign he should still face prosecution where warranted. Vengeance is not a worthy motive for punishment, but to establish that the president is not above the law and that there are no special deals available is a worthy motive, as is vindication.
I suspect Ms. Pelosi has made this calculation and knows exactly what she is doing.
30
@Mark
I agree, and I think that is precisely the path.
Subpoena all of these people and have them face questions as part of continuing investigation into what was and wasn't revealed by the Mueller report, and slowly but inexorably build the case for impeachment, making sure to explain the process, and what is found, every step of the way.
It will keep the whole idea in the news, and it will keep Trump raving--which also helps to build the case for an eventual introduction of articles of impeachment.
3
@Mark I hope so. I still can't excuse Democrats (Obama) for 'looking forward, not backward' from the Bush cabal's misadventures in the Middle East. This is the moment when the opposition needs to speak up loudly & clearly & re-establish the rule of law as our first principle of governance. If Democrats wimp out on this it will be time to start a new party.
I'm torn but after reading Bouie and Blow today, I"m less torn and more in favor of impeachment. Nothing worthwhile is liable to get done anyway given the polarization between left and right, House and Senate. If there were some legislation that had the possibility of making more America lives better, I'd say focus on that. But maybe impeachment will slow the mendacity of McConnell and his cronies in the Senate. Really, though I almost hate to ask, how much worse could the impeachment process make things?
19
Impeachment or not, Trump will still have a good chance of being re-elected. It’s time to stop worrying about 2020 and do what’s right today. It’s time to start impeachment.
14
Here's what Joe Lockhart -- former press secretary to Bill Clinton from 1998 -2000 has to say in today's NYT on the matter of impeachment:
"Allowing Mr. Trump to lead the Republican Party, filled with sycophants and weak-willed leaders, into the next election is the greater prize [than impeachment.] Democrats have a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity to realign American politics along progressive lines ..."
I'm not so sure that US zeitgeist will flip from center right to far left once the Republican party has so thoroughly embarrassed itself by remaining staunchly behind President Trump.
However, Lockhart offers a strategy -- a judo move, you might say -- that accelerates Trumpian momentum against itself, tossing him and his sycophants to the outlier-fringes of the body politic.
Better to publicly censure him. Republicans who wish to survive the next election will join in, adding to Trump's shame.
Those Republicans who abide by Trump's disgraceful behavior will have much to answer to come November 2020. Time for Democrats to reclaim the mantle of sensibility.
4
@Gluscabi
I agree...I'm liking the idea of censure more and more. Has a lot of the advantages of impeachment without many of the drawbacks. And it can be done in the House without any reliance on the Senate.
8
It ain’t happening- and my moral health feels just fine.
1
@Greg Aah, but like unknown, unseen cancer, the Trump/Republican tumor may suddenly show its deadliness to the country.
2
I am not concerned that impeachment will build sympathy for Trump and usher in a second term. Jamelle Bouie and Charles Blow both have laid that one to rest. But I am concerned that down ballot, Democrats who unseated Republicans just six months ago to take control of the House could be at risk of losing those seats in 2020. That won't happen in safe seats on the coasts, although even in Virginia, where three Democratic women unseated three Republican incumbents, one could be vulnerable. In my state, Kendra Horn defeated Steve Russell by a razor-thin margin, and with invigorated conservatives in a ruby-Red state could lose her seat. Multiply that just a few times, and you have a Democratic president, eager to implement a progressive agenda, but facing the hostility of a Republican House and Senate. We know the result of that. Do we really want a Democratic president to nominate justices to the Supreme Court and have a repetition of 2016? Do we want to confirm lower court judges to make some headway in the gains Republicans have made over the past few years? How much frustration in 2020-2024 is Schadenfreude in 2019 worth?
1
We require a new tradition in American politics, or maybe it's just living up to an old one we have forgotten.
Let's all just try to do the right thing. Got it?
Just Do the Right Thing.
Scrape this Orange Crud off the bottom of our shoe and try to regain our sense that America is a nation of decent people.
Say it to yourself.
Do the Right Thing.
24
I'm for impeachment starting 2 years ago.
Washington DC politicians - the majority are lawyers who manage to side step the law continuously.
The only other people there are lobbyists kissing up to them with big bucks.
7
Excellent summary to describe an unhinged and unscrupulous bully in the Oval Office, convinced he is above the law, and able and willing to abuse the power of the presidfency for his personal benefit. He is utterly corrupt, and incompetent to boot. Trump has become a royal disgrace for this democracy.
8
Yeah, House dems should go ahead and file articles of impeachment. He attempted to obstruct justice. We all know it. He and cronies did it on twitter for crying out loud.
It's the right thing to do. The office of the President shouldn't have as much power as it does. Making it clear that the President IS NOT permitted to obstruct justice sets a precedent that is good for our Union. It makes the rules more clear.
Impeach.
And then, after impeachment, let's go ahead and write an amendment that clarifies what "high crimes and misdemeanors" are, so that we don't have to run around like morons for 2 years next time.
14
We like to think that the prospect of shame will drive people to make the right decision. How can we explain to future generations the failure of Congress to act on such damning evidence of criminal behavior? How can we explain supporting our fossil fuel addiction to our grandchildren who must suffer the consequences of global warming? Unfortunately, the prospect of shame is a mirage. Look at the post-war reaction to slavery by supporters of the Confederacy. Look at the actions today of Big Tobacco. Time passes. Precedence is only a tool to be wielded when convenient. Our own actions can be explained. Shame is for our enemy.
5
In addition to their consideration of Trump's crimes and misdemeanors, lawmakers should add to their list of valid reasons to impeach him, his biased, abrasive, exclusionary communication style.
160 years ago, the Confederacy's president, Jefferson Davis, couldn't give a damn about the United States -- his sole interest having been to serve a hyper-devoted, hyper-delusional base of rebel supporters.
Today, the U.S. president, Donald Trump, can't give a damn about the United States -- his sole interest being to serve a hyper-devoted, hyper-delusional base of rebel supporters.
9
I reject the conclusion that conviction in the Senate is impossible.
Investigate, get the facts, then impeach or not, in public view. The back room deliberations of a prosecutor and a grand jury are fine to determine the facts of a crime. That model can't apply if they cannot indite. This is a Congressional responsibility and can not be delegated.
D**n "sources and methods" put the facts out there. If they support the removal of Corrupt Donnie, the Senate will either vote so, or they will be replaced along with Corrupt Donnie.
We have been living with a political fever. The cure is to do the public business, in public, so that all see and can access the situation. I have confidence that the facts are abhorrent and toxic enough to warrant Corrupt Donnie's removal.
Forty Four Presidents have left office:
15 did not seek another term,
11 lost in the general election,
8 died in office,
5 were term limited out,
4 sought their party's nomination in vain,
1 resigned.
Corrupt Donnie will the second to resign. Only a pardon from Preacher Pence will save him and his fortune from prosecution after he leaves office.
11
@JMM indict - formally accuse of or charge with a serious crime:
@JMM
If Trump is impeached, he CANNOT be pardoned.
@Steven
Thank you. One of 3 errors I can't go back to edit.
"Forty Four Presidents..." Four and president should not be capitalized.
"Corrupt Donnie will be the..." Forgot "be".
Ewe shore our tuff hon pour spellers. ;-)
In one sense, I kind of admire the author's gusto. "Dam* the torpedoes!" and all that. However he's in la-la land if he thinks the country will reward the Democrats for following their 'principles'. For one thing, impeachment proceedings without any kind of Republican support would make the Democrats come across as rank opportunists (which, make no mistake, many of them are). Second, in the absence of any flagrant illegality (i.e. lying under oath, which was Bill Clinton's mistake), such a move would, in fact, be nothing but symbolic. And the American public is tired of grandstanding.
Trump is a bully, a narcissist, a cheat, a liar, and a terrible President and human being. He has not, however, been shown to commit a crime. Let the American public sort it out at the ballot box next year, instead of doing an end run around them that will likely fail and make the Dems look idiotic besides. Because if there is one thing that Democrats and Republicans outside of Washington D.C. can agree on, it's a distaste for being dismissed.
4
Trump's voters will laugh all the way to the voting booth if Democrats, already extremely fragmented and firing at each other in the circle, spend their energy on impeachment proceedings instead of on tangible wins for the middle-class ahead of the 2020 election. If House democrats want to file a motion to impeach without time spent on follow-up hearings, that's fine with me. But spending time and energy on hearings and investigations will only destroy our chances to unseat Donald Trump in 2020. Vote him out, and then arrest him later.
20
@common sense advocate
I’m already laughing. The Democrats are done.
1
@common sense advocate
Hallelujah and Amen. YOU are aptly named.
Seriously.
2
@common sense advocate Democrats can walk and chew gum at the same time. They are putting forward bills already, but you know that Mitch McDeath will kill any legislation. So there is no chance Congress, and that includes the Republicans, will deliver tangible wins for the middle class. As for the Democrats, they aren't that fragmented and aren't firing at each other. The real enemy is Trump and we'll fall in line behind whoever is the Democratic candidate. He and his party are poison. We'll vote him out.
1
If and when their constituents demand impeachment, the Congress will have little choice.
While Trump's support seems to have eroded since the release of the Mueller report, we don't yet appear to be at the point where most people are demanding impeachment.
But it may yet come.
4
certainly congress needs to identify any and all illegal or antifiduciary activity by trump. If it appears that the public then clamors for impeachment, so be it. But if the public is still divided on a partisan basis, there should be an acknowledgement that impeachment is to remove a badly acting President, and clearly too much of the country does not believe impeachment is warranted. What is the value of an impeachment that has no possibility of removal of the president? it is the same reason prosecutors won't try a case that has no chance of conviction. His behavior should then be censored by the congress with (hopefully) the ability to force a vote on such a statement in the Senate. Once everyone is attached to that vote, and has to defend it in an election, then have the election and let the chips fall where they may.
3
Trumps base of support remain's solid and he is taking the country in the direction hard-working Americans want to go. Who knows, we may eventually get to the point where we feel like we are once again living in the best of times.
2
@Robert Howard, come all yea young children, so young and so fine/ seek not your fortune way down in the mines/it’s as dark a dungeon and damp the dew and the dangers are double and pleasure are few/ one fall of the slate and you’ll never survive....the morning, the middle of day, it’s the same to the miner who labors away.
This is the work trump envisioned. It’s not 21st century living. Clean coal...what idiot said that first?
2
I see the democrats heading down a slippery path. Impeachment proceedings and nomination of a candidate who is far to the left of the national electorate (eg. Warren, Sanders) is likely going to result in an electoral landslide similar to that of McGovern or Mondale (with the likely addition of NY and California). Trump could actually be the first president to win election after having been impeached. The real question will be whether the democrats pursue impeachment again in 2022, which would be the earliest they could then retake the house, or whether they let it go, and actually work on the myriad of other problems facing the country.
2
If the Democrats go down this road it will blow up in their face. The party's left wing who are pushing this are motivated by hate & outrage but not common sense. They're completely indifferent to the consequences of their proposed actions. Lets be very clear. Impeaching Trump will facilitate his winning a 2nd term, which would be devastating for the Democratic party. The Democrats were not elected to hold endless hearings on the Trump administration. They were given a House majority to craft & pass good legislation. Pelosi to her credit is trying to keep everyone's eye on the ball. But leftist zealots are determined to drive the party straight off the cliff. The House should fix DACA, address immigration issues, & improve the healthcare system. Focusing on impeachment is a total exercise in futility. There's zero chance the GOP controlled Senate will vote to impeach. Going down this path will keep the issue in the forefront for the 2020 election. The election should be about health care, the economy, immigration reform, etc. & not about the Trump Russia scandal. Impeachment hearings driven by Progressive fanatics will certainly over-reach. It will be easily spun by Trump as a witch hunt to fair-minded voters. When impeachment fails in the Senate, Trump will again claim victory. The pure efficiency that Democrats are able to deploy when it comes to shooting themselves in the foot is often breathtaking. This is the one time we should resist the temptation to pull the trigger.
13
@Bill Brown
Yes, agree 100% . What matters is removing him at the ballot box in 2020. Play the long game.
1
Nancy Pelosi has the right answer - to go down the path of truth (I would urge to "sprint" down the path of truth), in order to reach the right decision. Elizabeth Warren has identified the right action if it speaks to the truth - to impeach. The correct decision MUST "trump" politics, and be guided by the Constitutional duties of our elected officials. It is profoundly shocking that we have no answer to the question as to why Trump has not condemned the Russians for their unacceptable interference in our elections, as evidenced in the Mueller report? If the real reason is because that, although he allegedly has withdrawn from the running of his businesses, leaving it to his sons, they can continue to negotiate with Russia to build that Trump tower in Moscow. If Trump sanctions Russia for their electoral interference, that possible deal is off the table. And we know that Trump would sell his soul for any deal that brings in the billions. Let the truth, to be uncovered as speedily as possible, lead the way to the right and best decision for our nation.
12
@TR NJ. Please tell me when Obama condemned the Russians. After all, this occurred after he gave them the Crimea and our uranium.
Is this principle important enough to lose the fight? The 2020 election?
Yes!
Sometimes you just have to fight. I would hope that the people value the principles of lawful government enough that they will not ignore Trump's conduct. But if they di ignore it, then we at least will go down with a fight.
Mr. Trump did not act like a patriot, and Mr. Giuliani's explanations did not make it better. He can hug the flag all he wants. But when push comes to shove, he has shown that he will put his self interest in front of everything, including the security of the nation.
Mr. Trump's obstruction shows that he is willing to act the tyrant. And it will not get better. We might have a different situation had he acted rashly on one occasion but then demonstrated remorse and restraint. But he amps it up.
Trump's conduct will not stop. It will get worse. And he is getting rid of the people that tended to hold him back. If we tolerate this behavior we will get more and worse.
Now, if the people decide that they will ignore Trump's follies, then what can I say. They will reap the punishment for it. But at least they will have been warned. If it comes to that, I will shed a tear for the nation in general. But I will have no sadness for those that went along. And the most ironic thing is that his supporters will be the ones hurt the most.
24
@Andy Makar
I fail to see how a firm and principled stand on impeachment will cause the election to be lost. Think of all the disenchanted independent voters looking for some leadership. They might consider voting - instead of sitting home or voting third party - if they see some leadership among the Democratic candidates, and in Congress.
3
It is still mind boggling to me how trump got off Scott free when everyone around him has had surreptitious dealings with the Russians. Five covert meetings with Putin. And covert because of no documents, no evidence, no record as to what was said to probably the prime enemy of our country, of our democracy. Why Mueller threw the ball to congress? God only knows. When a judicial investigation becomes a political thing, it dilutes the Department of Justice’s credibility. How are the Democrats to convince Republican Americans that impeaching the president is not political? I don’t have an answer. I respect the effort of Mueller and his colleagues, but they have ended the mystery with yet another.
3
@DavidJ,
Maybe Mueller is a Russian agent?
Thanks for this column. I couldn't agree with you more.
7
Joe Lockhart, in another NYT article, argues that keeping the foul Trump in office will destroy the GOP. This is of course a far better outcome than just removing this orange stone from the national shoe.
Something to consider...
3
@Plennie Wingo. It’s hard to believe anyone can think that. Have another chocolate.
2
'Jerrold Nadler, the chairman of the House Judiciary Committee, said on Sunday that “if proven, some of this would be impeachable, yes. The accusations in the report are impeachable. Obstruction of justice, if proven, would be impeachable.”'
Proven? What was the Mueller report for? Mueller gave this evidence to Congress, not being able to (according to practice) indict a sitting President. How much more can kicking can go on?
5
One thing is sure. It would be absolutely hilarious to see the impeachment process going along the election. Yet, it is not a good reason to not impeach this man.
You are right on both counts: symbolism matters, and Democrats need to seize the initiative. This column is even better than that of Charles Blow, which was enough to convince me.
7
Unless congress (or anyone, really) uncovers a smoking gun, the people who support Trump are going to continue to support Trump despite the corruption, and the people who hate Trump are going to continue to hate Trump because of the corruption.
We have achieved nothing, changed no one's mind, and spent 30 million dollars on a report that has been distributed, most notably, by Barns and Nobles.
There is not going to end by "getting to the facts" because the "facts" are really just a gut feeling for either he's good or he's bad.
1
Huh ? ? After 2 and a half years and 30 million dollars - if the Mueller report showed " criminality" why wasn't Trump charged .. ? I think the American people will have a much clearer picture of what this was .. once the investigators are in investigated.. it appears there is more than enough " criminality" to go around.. and who knows how far up the Obama administration this goes.. ? I think we will soon find out ?
4
This commentator appears to me to be grasping st straws by brining in the Obama administration. Several Democratic commentators agree there is enough evidence to impeach President Trump. However, they recommend a wiser course of action by using the evidence to deny Trump a second term. I support this strategy.
"Instead of thinking about their opponents, Democrats should focus on their supporters"
No. Somebody should focus on the pro-Trump faction within the Homeland Security apparatus, the people Trump said would get "very, very bad" if they saw him threatened by his political opponents.
I do not believe Trump will go quietly out of office and into the threat of criminal prosecution. And I believe that the likes of Stephen Miller are capable of organizing a cadre of Trump loyalists, people with badges and guns and handcuffs, who would be willing to round up Pelosi, Schumer, and others in Gestapo/NKVD style.
Now, I write genre fiction for a living and this could be just the result of my overactive imagination. But there has never been a Trump in the Oval Office before, and that means all bets are off.
I hope that members of the FBI and military who are loyal to the Constitution are starting to think the unthinkable.
6
I would like to think the scenario you put forth would not occur. However, as a person who has spent many years working in the financial services industry, I am always surprised by the number of people who think wealth is a sign of intelligence.
2
@Matthew Hughes: I disagree. One thing we learned from the Mueller report is that the obstruction case against Trump would be airtight if not for the (non-) actions of his subordinates.
Trump told people to break the law and he was roundly ignored and defied. White House appointees and staff rejected instructions to break the law and generally cooperated with Mueller's investigation. I don't hold these people out as heroes; they chose to work for a horrible politician.
Nonetheless, they could have risked their necks for Trump and decided it wasn't worth it. If White House insiders aren't going help Trump obstruct justice they aren't going to help him commit treason either.
Impeachment will only energize the base. Let the Southern District of New York indict the ex-president on January 20, 2021.
4
@Scott
Impeachment will energize the Democratic base, that's for certain!
There is one very good reason to put impeachment on the table. In an impeachment inquiry everything relating to the President is "fair game" for a subpoena, and the chance of the courts not enforcing a subpoena are almost nil.
So let the House Judiciary Committee conduct hearings on whether to bring impeachment charges. And make them all public. And bring in all of the Trump associates involved.
Then, when it is all out in the open, decide whether to vote for impeachment itself or not.
23
@John Graybeard
Throw the ball into Trump's court...
Let all of the House inquiries issue their subpoenas and if Trump tries to deny, fight, or delay producing anything requested then hit him with a full impeachment inquiry.
This is exactly the threat that the GOP used every time they issued a subpoena back when both Clinton and Obama were in office, so I say the Democrats keep with "established protocol" and do the same. Standards need to be maintained.
7
Sounds reasonable, but only if this strategy does not impair the ability of the Democrats to win the next election.
1
Further investigations should be dragged out over the next 18 months. Then the house should initiate drawing up articles of impeachment, but halt that work because of the election. This way there is no implicit acceptance of Trumps actions at the same time as there is no lost cause in the Senate (cementing that this type of behavior is accepted by the lawful process).
1
I do not think dragging the Trump investigation over the next many months will help the Democratic Party candidate win the next Presidential election.
Thank you for your insightful contributions, Mr. Bouie. I agree with you that impeachment is the right and necessary course. I also will understand if this path is not taken.
5
Impeachment would play right into his small hands. Getting 67 Senators to convict is impossible. He'd win, and become as popular as Clinton was after he won in the Senate.
3
@MSK - you really think a third of the majority of people who actively despise him will start supporting him on Mitch McConnell's say-so?
@MSK
I respectfully disagree. Consider...
After the Barr 4-page summary was released and the republicans on the House Judiciary committee all signed a letter demanding Rep. Schiff's resignation, Schiff responded with one of the best take-down speeches, in which he called out over a dozen of Trump's publically-known actions, with the comment "you might think this is OK, but I do not" directed to the Republicans on the committee. By the time he was finished all of these Republicans were shifting uneasily in their seats, with one declaring "We don't think any of this is OK."
Now imagine the GOP Senators having to publically cast votes in the well of the Senate, with a camera pointed directly at their pasty faces, as article of impeachment after article of impeachment are read detailing each and every one of Trump's transgressions. Will they really risk throwing away their cushy careers to defend Trump. Ridiculous.
3
@MSK
As others have said in response to Charles Blow's column today, Do prosecutors not prosecute because a jury just might not convict? No!
If there is no impeachment process, whether the Senate convicts or not, the record will show that Trump's behavior and disregard and mockery of the Constitution is not acceptable to the House, which is charged with defense of the Constitution and is a co-equal branch of government.
If nobody does anything, the record /history will show that nobody cared enough about the rule of law to act, win or lose. Do we really believe that Trump is a fit president and that the awful things he does are acceptable?
I am convinced now that impeachment is the way to go. The litany of charges plus the additional information that will emerge will open some eyes, even among Trump supporters. Will they like looking like fools defending a criminal?
2
I would love to think that I am a person of principle. I think that there is a moral imperative to remove Trump from office. I also think that the single best way to get him reelected is to pursue impeachment.
We have been hanging on the Mueller report for nearly 2 years now and the public (rather than our more activist democratic friends) in general will move on. Democrats need to govern and continue to expose Trump for the person he is with new material like his tax forms. They should also take full advantage of Trump as millstone around the neck of the Republican party--Democrats need to figure out how to get McConnell shoved out in the same realignment that disposes of Trump. That could actually be a mortal wound to the rabid elements of the Republican party, and that is the principle that is driving my thinking.
14
It might very well be the case, as Joe Lockhart suggests, that keeping Trump in office damages the Republicans deeply and will lead to country in a much more progressive direction.
But I don't think that's an adequate reason to continue to tolerate a president that threatens every democratic principal upon which our republic is based, that weakens our friends and strengthens our enemies, and that undermines our national security.
Let the Republican Senators vote against impeachment. I would love to hear them explain why they voted to keep a criminal and traitor in office. Especially swing state senators.
Maybe the biggest advantage of impeachment is that it would allow Democrats to control at least part of the narrative rather than ceding it all to Trump.
15
The Democrats should focus 100% on strategizing how to take the Senate. It's not surprising that Bouie favors impeachment but it's a little absurd that Liz Warren is one of the only high ranking Dems he can find who supports his position. She is way behind in the polls and needs money; now the pro-impeachment base will contribute to her campaign.
If the Dems don't get at least to parity in the Senate, then even if they win in 2020 (which is not guaranteed at all) their candidate will be kneecapped just like Obama was. Mitch McConnell should be their biggest target, not Trump.
1
Yes. If we sift all the ideology and partisanship out of the debate, the questions that remain are fairly clear.
Is a president who tells subordinates to break U.S. law suitable for office? What about a president who encourages subordinates to ignore international law? One who encourages them to work around the Constitution?
Is it OK for any elected official to tell voters he'll accept results only if she wins?
We need to frame the debate in terms of questions for which the answers are consistent regardless of any political issues, ever.
7
From your lips to Nancy Pelosi's ears, Mr. Bouie.
Based on what has been put forth in Mueller's report (and any number of other transgressions not included in it's purview) clearly Congress has a Constitutional obligation to pursue impeachment. Let the chips fall where they may. Not to do so would be akin to dereliction of duty and would set a dangerous precedent that would certainly be exploited in the future.
17
"Instead of thinking about their opponents, Democrats should focus on their supporters, who voted in large numbers to give the party a House majority…"
Yes, indeed. Those supporters elected the 67 new representatives who swung control of the House to the Democrats in 2018. Those were moderate-to-conservative supporters. The Dems stand to lose them in 2020 if they choose to impeach. For those supporters, the issue is settled, there was no collusion, and no indictment for obstruction from Mueller, and they want to move on.
6
What do you base your contention that those voters clearly want to move on? I would suggest that at least some of them voted for oversight, which had been absent when the Republicans were in control.
5
@Ron Cohen
I am a much bigger fan of Direct Democracy than most, but as the Constitution is written, it is not the duty of the people to determine if the President is guilty of high crimes or misdemeanors--that duty lies squarely with congress, in plain english.
Mueller's report also states, in plain english, that the special counsel's office could never have indicted Trump, because of their understanding of the standards of the office of legal counsel. So that was literally never going to happen. It was impossible from the beginning. It has ALWAYS been Congress's job to come to its own conclusions about whether or not the President committed an impeachable offense.
Now that we have the facts, as laid out by the Special Counsel report, we can say with confidence that Trump committed obstruction of justice, and the House should move forward with articles of impeachment.
Obstruction of Justice should ABSOLUTELY be considered a "high crime" or "misdemeanor".
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@Ron Cohen
The net effect of impeachment, should it occur, would be to make the impeachment, itself, the subject of the campaign, and NOT Trump. That is a campaign the Democrats don’t want, nor is it one they likely can win.
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Forgetting entirely about the Mueller report Trump has given well publicized bribes to Stormy Daniels and Karen McDougal to keep silent about his affairs. On these grounds alone the briber in chief can be impeached. One good thing a formal impeachment inquiry would do is to tie up the executive branch in fighting about impeachment further discrediting Trump and making fight for reelection more difficult. Rather than ethics about impeachment, Democratic actions need to be guided by making this President as impotent and powerless as possible with the shortest stay in office obtainable under the circumstances.
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This argument recognizes the dangerous, powerful impact of the symbolism molded and wielded by Trump. Indeed, impeachment is the most potent symbolism to counter his corrosion of the American way of life.
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@Paul What has been corroded?
Bear in mind that Mueller invesitgated two matters: (1) The matter of Trump being directly involved in conspiring against the United States with an adversarial country - not "collusion" which is not a term used by real lawyers; and (2) obstruction of justice.
Then there are the various cases that against Trump acting in the capacity of the President of the United States. These were not part of Mueller's investigation, but he found so much on other matters that he had to refer to several other jurisdictions to handle the other matters.
Then there are the various cases against Trump as an individual.
How can we the people NOT initiate discovery that would ultimately lead to impeachment.
The GOP insisted on impeachment of Bill Clinton for far far less.
Nixon resigned for far far less.
(And at least when Nixon was involved in a burglary that involved stealing from the DNC he used American citizens and not foreign agents.)
It will not just reveal how corrupt a crook Trump is, but how corrupt the GOP is in supporting him - and please note that while they continue to covet Trump as if he's a gold nugget (fool's gold), what are they doing about Russia.
They don't seem to be all that upset about pages and pages of the unredacted report which revealed Russian agents even organizing Trump rallies.
A bonus when it comes to impeachment - the redacted parts will also be reviewed by Congress and there will be no question of whether or not they have that right.
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@Jbugko. I would love to know where you see corruption. You’ve been listening to Schiff too long.
@Jackson: Corruption? Start with the campaign finance felony Michael Cohen pled guilty to. He swore that he committed that crime at the direction of Individual-1 - who is Donald Trump. Trump has serious criminal liability there.
Alternately, one could look further into sworn allegations that Trump misstated assets on financial applications. That could be charged as bank fraud, among other crimes.
We also have reporting in this very newspaper that Trump knowingly acquired much of his wealth through a fraudulent tax scheme initiated by his father. Trump's older sister resigned her judgeship over this very thing rather than risk further investigation for tax fraud and violating rules of judicial conduct.
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Corruption for sure, but the way he combs his hair is enough for me.
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Strong arguments, I agree. If only at least a handful of Republican senators had any spine -- and fealty to the Constitution and they public they (should) serve. Begin with investigations, make it plain to the American people, and do not rule out impeachment.
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Impeachment is not a lure. It is a responsibility.
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"Donald Trump may not have conspired with the Russian government to influence the 2016 election..." is how this opinion piece begins, but that's just wrong. The winks and the nods between the campaign and the Russians is a conspiracy. Period. Uptight Robert Mueller couldn't bring himself to reach any conclusions for reasons I don't think I'll ever understand (even after he explains them in front of Congress), but that doesn't mean that doing nothing about Russian interference in the election, before, during, and after, isn't collusion, conspiracy, passive-aggressive participation.
At a certain point it became Trump's job to do something, and even then he pretended there was no interference. So could we please stop pretending he wasn't a participant? Could we please just look at the facts? Could we please now take the action that everybody said we were waiting for the Mueller report to take? There's more to prove, but the facts as we have them are plenty to justify impeachment. When Jerry Nadler says, "if proven," he's being disingenuous.
The 2018 Democratic wave was a call to action. If we don't get any and then people don't turn out to vote next time, we'll know why.
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"Trump and His Businesses Sue House Democrats to Hide Accounting Records"
- Article Headline in today's NYT
After obstructing justice in the Mueller investigation and successfully installing a GOP partisan with a history of assisting in presidential cover-ups as Attorney General, Trump will use every means possible, including using the DOJ as his private defense team, to obstruct the House Democrats from performing appropriate and constitutionally authorized oversight.
There are legitimate questions of timing and approach, impeachment is not to be taken lightly, but the House Democrats must "defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic" even if the GOP will not.
Trump must be impeached. Democrats should leave the weak-kneed political excuses for the oath breakers in the GOP.
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@LT. How can you possibly claim the investigation was obstructed?
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@Jackson. Endeavoring to obstruct, which Trump clearly did, is also indictable under obstruction of justice. Mueller clearly indicated that Trump's actions constituted obstruction (even though he did not indict him adhering to DOJ policy), and that Trump could be prosecuted once he leaves the protection afforded him by his current office. Barr should have pointed this out, as it is a key part of the report, but he chose instead to "spin" the finding in the opposite direction and to Trump's benefit.
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I think Mueller laid it out pretty clearly as well as laying out his reasons for not making a formal decision. He left it for Congress to decide. Barr ignored that and attempted to give as much cover as he could to Trump.
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Republicans came out largely unscathed from the Nixon presidency even thought they vehemently defended him an Agnew for years despite significant accusations of corruption (Bush Sr. was famously tasked with obstructing justice in order to help Spiro Agnew). One reason for that may be that they were never forced to etch their name in history while protecting him. If Republicans want to save Trump, they should be forced to vote in his favor. History won’t be kind to the Republican party for protecting a president that was obviously criminal, amoral and with authoritarian tendencies. The likes of Crenshaw and Rubio must not be allowed to distance themselves and rewrite history when they’ll pretend to have opposed Trump in 10-15 years
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What a cogent argument you have made, Jamelle Bouie, to do the right thing by defending the Constitution all the while taking the attention away from the demagoguery of Trump and bad company. The fact that Trump is suing Elijah Cummings because as chairman he is fulfilling his Constitutional oversight duties reveals the disdain that Trump holds for the laws of the land. It’s not time to play the waiting game, to allow Trump to spin his witch hunt lies, and to continue to be on the defensive. It is time for Democrats to follow Elizabeth Warren’s courageous call to act to impeach. To fail to do so s to undermine the constitutional duties that every congress member has sworn to uphold it is bad enough to have a rogue Russian-backed president. As Bouie put it so eloquently, we need our leaders to heed the cries of those who put them in office. Do your duties, by God and country.
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"Congress should launch impeachment proceedings against Donald Trump for welcoming Russian interference in the 2016 election and trying to obstruct the Mueller investigation. Trump's high crimes and misdemeanors stare us in the face, and each day he remains in power is a day closer to the collapse of the rule of law ... Trump poses a serious threat to this country. He tries to govern by one-man decree, declares phony emergencies to crack down on immigration, resists Congressional oversight and courts tyrants abroad." - Jeffrey Sachs, Columbia University. 20April2019
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@Steve Kennedy
Yes, and there is much more. Just one type of offense: his appointments of business lobbyists to Cabinet and regulatory positions look impeachably corrupt, comparably to Teapot Dome.
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The Mueller report did not ascertain that Trump conspired with the Russian government, but it did ascertain that Trump welcomed Russia's interference with the election. A person running for president should not be welcoming foreign crimes against the country that they supposedly want to lead.
Why has the Trump-appointed FBI director Christopher Wray called China "a whole-society threat" but refused to use the same description for Russia, which definitively committed crimes against us? Even if Trump and his cronies did not collude directly with Russia, they are still being extra-nice to a foreign enemy to a very arguably treasonous degree.
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Being not fan of the man to put it mildly, I nevertheless cringe when Warren suggests both parties putting aside political considerations (toward impeachment). It's a particularly glib and cartoonish thing to say in the heat of the MOST political consideration imaginable.
In expressing such a simple-minded generalization and implying others (especially the vast majority of repugnant republicans) are willing to acknowledge right from wrong, she dramatically damages her own candidacy consideration going forward.
3
The House cannot idly stand by and do nothing. A censure of this president along with fact-finding hearings should commence. Once enough sunlight is shed through hearings, the majority of Americans would support impeachment.
If we don't at least begin impeachment proceedings at that point, then it's senseless to think a president can or would be impeached. As the writer correctly points out, there is a difference between the partisan impeachment of Clinton and the crimes of Trump. Impeachment in Trump's case should gain traction among both parties, neither of which want to see a president of either party tear the moral fabric, destroy the American concept of justice, or operate outside of the Constitution. Both parties should stand for the people above party, right above wrong.
At least that remains my hope. For that is the America I know and still believe exists.
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@John
Actually Bill committed an actual crime.
President Trump has not committed a crime.
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@Dr. John - assuming that 11 counts of obstruction don't constitute a crime, which in fact they do. And that's just in THIS investigation. There was also Cohen, remember? And plenty more to come.
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@Dr. John
I get it, you are clearly a Trump supporter. But I have to ask, do you actually believe that Trump has committed no crimes? Also, have you read the Mueller report? In asking these questions I am trying to ascertain if you are unaware of the facts, or simply disregard them? Your answers will help me understand how people can continue to support Trump.
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Democrats should focus on beating Trump in the 2020 election. They should focus on putting together the best moderate agenda and candidate possible and use that to actually make progress.
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@John - only moderate progress, presumably.
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@John Do you honestly believe that the Russian election trolls won't be able to fool 107,000 voters in Pennsylvania, Michigan, and Wisconsin as they did in 2016? Do you honestly believe that the GOP isn't praying for this Russian assistance again?
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I,too, am worried about turning djt into martyr status and the senate not stepping up - but - I hope as a move toward impeachment advances more and more information from other investigations will come out. The Washington hotel and Mar-a- Lago scams, the hush money payments, the taxes. If this happens, the case for impeachment should be overwhelming.
What scares me though is how so many people purportedly do not even care about the Mueller report or the threats to our democracy.
6
This is an excellent sounding, take the "moral ground" opinion piece which is persuasive and wrong-headed.
Most people outside of the Democratic leftist liberal circle presses could care less about the Mueller Report or Trump's feuds with it.
If the House proceeds with impeachment of President Trump running up to the 2020 election, most voters out in the country who are satisfied with the economy will definitely vote Republican and for Trump.
13
@Philip Karp I note your observation about the voters. But the Mueller Report raises too many important questions. And the worst part of it is that if Trump's behavior is ignored, then we are certain to get more of it. And that certainty is even greater now that he has gotten rid of the relatively sane people in the government.
4
@Philip Karp - basically it means the rule of law has been abandoned in favor of the rule of public opinion. It doesn't matter how many crimes the president commits as long as he still has the support of his base. And he could shoot somebody on Fifth Ave and not lose their support.
7
@Philip Karp, how is defense of democratic norms only a leftist liberal cause? How is defense of honesty and decency only a leftist liberal cause?
4
Along with Charles Blow's recent column, this is a clear and clean articulation of the importance of Congress upholding their constitutional responsibilities.
Should Congress not begin the impeachment process, then our Representatives are is also in abdication of their sworn oaths. Or do we now only defend the Constitution if it's politically expedient?
100
This is an outstanding, concise argument that has pulled me firmly into the impeachment camp. Those who support Trump and his policies are blind to the historical consequences of such fear-mongering rhetoric, or, worse, choose to ignore it. We are pointed in the direction of chaos. I'm now convinced that impeachment at this critical moment is the only recourse to preserve our core Constitutional values for future generations, and to defend against future dictators and loss of a free society. That the Senate will likely vote against conviction is irrelevant to doing what is right, and indeed, what's in accordance with the House's Constitutional duties.
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"Leave it to the voters" is not an option in 2020. We have seen, in 2000 and 2016, the will of the voters overruled by the electoral college. In 2016 we saw how voter suppression (In WI, for example) affects the electoral college. And in 2018, we saw how voter suppression (in GA and FL and elsewhere) determines statewide results.
So, even if "leave it to the voters" in an election environment not so clearly tainted were a better course, that option is not available now.
In 2019, impeachment is the correct moral and political response to Trump's offenses.
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If not now, when?
Imagine that Trump finishes out his term without being reined in in the slightest, as even lack of conviction in the Senate would do. What will happen under a successor to Trump? We cannot count on the 2020 election to be fair and additionally have no reassurance there is not continued interference by foreign actors.
The right wing is on its way to caputring our judiciary. If the legislative arm fails to act now, there will be no checks and balances on unfettered executive power.
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Does it really make sense to rely on the 2020 election to end this corrupt administration? The party in control of our government executive branch came to power with the help of massive voter interference. They gage denied that, called it fake news, and have not made serious efforts to prevent it from happening again. We now have factual evidence that they knew the interference was real and that they have been lying about it since before the 2016 election. Another 18 months of continued, and quite possibly accelerated, dismantling of our democratic processes is a real and imminent danger. Absent removal from office, what is to stop this president from unilaterally declaring another "national emergency" and postponing elections indefinitely?
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Maybe I am too optimistic, but perhaps if the House voted to impeach on comprehensive evidence of wrongdoing across a wide range of responsibilities and actions, enough Republican senators would put country first and vote to convict. And, at least for the next election, we would know where our Senators' loyalties in a crisis rest.
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“TO DO OR NOT TO DO” ... That is the question. I say the House needs to do its job, and get the ball rolling.
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“...there’s also the real question of our constitutional order.”
This phrase in the sentence, I think, goes to the heart of the matter: the politics of civics and law as it is (or should be) applied to every citizen, or is it, as Tina Turner once cynically asked, “a quaint, old-fashion notion?”
We must decide first what kind of America we want. Do we want to yield its place and history and ideals to the right, a dark place that would allow all three branches of government to pursue, without effective coordination, its each particular goal? Or we might ask, “if another president’s name were the subject of Robert Mueller’s report, would we hazard the sobering, turbulent waters of impeachment, if only for the sake of a nation that has become fragile and torn at the edges? And if we approved of Russia’s ability to determine our system of government, then why not China, or the Congo, or Mexico, for example, at another time?
Donald Trump’s tenure is ripe for the start of responsible impeachment proceedings. The House must begin this awful step—awful only because the current occupant of the Oval Office brought it into being
Democrats, especially, must not be fearful of a backlash against them in 2020. They must not yield to the fear and rage that MAGA nation will surely bring to 2020 in defense of the man to whom decency forgot.
In any city or town, if a fatality occurs, it must be investigated. Why is impeachment so different from a local homicide than a national death?
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Those who find this presidents behavior acceptable should be forced to own it and defend it in public. Line for line, a disgrace to democracy and the rule of law.
369
Impeachment or no impeachment, Democrats HAVE TO SIEZE AND CONTROL THE NARRATIVE. Barr had a shady headstart with his little misinformation campaign, and there are many who accept his word as truth, case closed.
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Yes.
5
The writer states that in order to impeach, Trump’s actions must show “criminal contempt for the Constitution.” Not true. My Constitution says that the president has to be proven to have committed “high crimes and misdemeanors”. Contempt for the Constitution isn’t a crime. What is sub-criminal is throwing up phony roadblocks to the idea of impeaching Donald Trump. On the other hand, he objectively stated the case for impeachment, quite persuasively,
3
This is an excellent argument. I've been inclined against impeachment but am going the other way. In particular, the fact that DT will warp the narrative even more says that the House should take a firm stance against him. And the idea that his base is already lost to reasoned arguments is a compelling one.
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@RKD
I too am leaning toward impeachment... but how it is "presented" is so important is helping Americans understand WHY. Unfortunately, even if Pelosi decides to move toward impeachment, she is not the person to present it. She is somewhat frail, and inarticulate. In a word, she is NOT compelling. I fear Americans won't "hear" the reasons for impeachment because they won't listen to messenger.
4
@Tom
If the House were to vote a Bill of Impeachment, it would originate in the House Judiciary Committee, headed by Jerrold Nadler. He is the one who would announce the vote of the committee to present the Bill to the full House, and he would undoubtedly be the manager.
Pelosi would oversee the vote of the full House, but she would not be the one to run the impeachment. That would be Nadler and his staff.
8
I don't have much to add on the topic other than what Jamelle Bouie and Charles Blow have said on this site. But if Democratic Party leaders are wondering how these columns are reflecting, or affecting, public opinion, then here's my thought: I am convinced.
I sided with those who asked, what's the point? A Republican senate will never convict. But I have been convinced by the arguments that it will set a terrible precedent to sit by and do nothing. And besides, do we trust the electorate - and the electoral college - to do the job of throwing out a corrupt president based on recent results?
The time has come to impeach, and let the Republican Party go down in history as the ones who condoned Trump's behavior.
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@Brian M You don’t need to impeach to establish that Trump is unfit to be president or that the Republicans, by their active support or acquiescence, have condoned his behavior. For anyone who has been paying attention, there was already ample evidence of that even before
Mueller issued his report. Impeachment along party lines (would even one Republican senator or representative support impeachment?) would provide fodder for Trump’s argument that the Mueller investigation was a partisan “witch-hunt” designed to overturn the 2016 election. The objective is to end the Trump presidency, and impeachment won’t do that. Better to set the Democratic agenda for the 2020 election through proposed legislation and focus on selecting a presidential candidate who can beat him.
23
@philgat While your points have validity, investigation and Articles of Impeachment are the only remedies available to Democrats. To acquiesce and do nothing sends the pitiful message that Congressional oversight is non-existant unless the desired result is assured.
While after a Trump victory he would no-doubt claim "total vindication," he has done so already.
I have faith that the majority of Americans are sick and tired of Trump World, and that regardless of the outcome, they have had enough.
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@Brian M
You are right. The question is not who is to win the next election (pace Joe Lockhart and commenter philgat); it is the principle that the President is subject to oversight. I am convinced that we are worse off abandoning oversight than even losing the next Presidential election to a narcissistic dummy* with no concern for the country or the people.
I don't mean Trump is stupid, but that reacts on an emotional level and he can't manage to care about anything but himself.
26