The way I saw it, Trump owned them both. Interesting how some saw it as a big win for Pelosi and the Democrats. Not sure what meeting they were watching – must have been the dream sequence. It was interesting how Pelosi made a point of proclaiming how the house would be run with "transparency" when she takes over as speaker, and yet, she sure heck didn't want any transparency right there in that meeting. Can't spin it later in front of the cameras when we all saw it happen in real time....but they tried anyway.
2
Her dad must be so proud! And I mean that sincerely. He’s the one who taught her how to lead.
9
Democratic leaders made a fundamental mistake in agreeing to meet with Trump at all. He is not capable of negotiating a deal he won't later renege on. Nothing he says has any substance beyond his own self-serving ends to sow chaos. Giving him inappropriate credibility by meeting with him undermined their own leadership positions and raises questions about their ability to assess the reality of their situation.
8
I’m in love. What a towering example of “Nevertheless, she persisted”! I’ve always admired Ms. Pelosi but I now see her as an everlasting historical icon that will loom large over Trump, even Schumer, and all the impotent white males who have brought us to this disastrous precipice in American history.
There have been fabulous memes flooding social media since yesterday but my favorite is this:
Nancy Pelosi strutting confidently out of the White House rocking a red coat as she puts on her sunglasses while a tremendous fiery explosion erupts behind her.
14
And what are Pelosi’s strengths?
This feels like a cultivated event, to make it look like she is proving her woman-hood in the same way that Trump is trying to prove his man-hood.
This has nothing to do with being an aggressive and progressive leader, who will put the 95% first, it is just another manifestation of the status quo in politics.
Politics above leadership, keeping 5% in charge of the country. Her aggressiveness against all new Congress members, force them to fall in line behind her and giving them no or very little power in the new Congress is prove that nothing has changed in the Democratic party, very much the same as no changes in the Republican party.
Why did we have to fight so hard to get the majority back in the House and have at least a chance against Trump?
Elections have become a farce on both sides.
Trump said during this exchange that ten terrorists recently were caught at the border. He also recently tweeted that he has ten applicants for White House Chief of Staff. I wonder ...
18
The guy who has made a career of transporting suitcases full of money for the Russian Mafia, where a regular, legal money transfer would have been way too transparent for this type of crime money, poses as the proponent of transparancy?
And being allowed to lie unwithspoken out of fear for the tyranny of his raw power grab is his idea of transparancy?
The new definition of transparancy is the brazenness of the sadistic, racist, xenophobic, misogynistic, power abusive, kleptocratically perfidious, monomaniacally self-enriching, and deceitful bully?
7
What happened to the promise that Mexico will pay for the wall. Why can't Mr. Trump get this money from his own assets until he can recover it from Mexico. After all this was his loud and clear declaration and promise
19
How refreshing to see a leader politely tell Trump "how it is". Even more so from the next Speaker of the House.
This will be a breath of fresh air after outgoing Speaker Ryan's namby-pamby, mealy-mouth, prevaricating doublespeak for the last few years.
My guess is that Trump will now learn that he has to actually respect Congress. He can no longer get what he wants from the outgoing spineless sycophants.
So...he will learn how to really negotiate and actually do something. A good spanking might actually be good for him.
And for the country!
14
Fox & friends better go back to saying "Merry Christmas" the Trump horse cannot be found it left the stable and cannot be protected.
Giuliani & Trump now have NO case at all the Muller investigation will be more devastating than anyone thought . Trump is such a ego trip that I am sure people told him not to run but his brain is TINY and his EGO is outrageous. His family will be hurt . The country and the world have Trump problems but will move forward in the long run. TRUMP . will stall and go backward. He deserves it and so does his lawyer. It is over wake up Hannity
3
Mike Pence has brought new depth to the term “sitting Vice-President”. Well done.
28
Why would the writers note that Ms. Pelosi talked to the press afterward wearing sunglasses and a "swingy" red coat? Whatever a woman wears is part of the story while a man's dress is immaterial?
20
As Pelosi herself admitted, republicans don't have the votes for the wall. Which is exactly what Trump said. So how did she "explain how congress works?" By telling him republicans can bring it up and state their case? I'm sure he was blown away by that game-changing revelation.
And what part was "mansplaining?" I'm guessing you don't appreciate the irony of treating women as somehow special when they engage with men as equals in a conversation where gender doesn't even come up. Women are either delicate snowflakes in need of special accommodations and charitable cheerleading, or they're equal. Pick one.
1
trump tried to play the "she's just a woman & doesn't know anything" card. He got whopped.
trump threw a temper tantrum worthy of any 2 year old in a WalMart store.
He said he will take the blame for the shut down but he won't he will blame everyone in the Democratic party & everyone who voted for Democrats in the mid-terms. He never takes the blame for anything.
Just another lie from trump ( he told many yesterday on nationwide TV).
12
Pelosi made my day. The only thing that could have made it even better is if Pelosi or Schumer turned on live TV to Trump and said, "Mr. President, why do you need 5 billion dollars from American taxpayers? You promised us all Mexico would pay for your wall. Was that not true?"
19
Apparently Nancy is NOT Afraid of Virginia Woolf...
8
Perhaps, just perhaps, at least some of Trump's sycophantic, compromised White House women absorbed, firsthand, an important life lesson on how an intelligent, classy, experienced, and mature lady successfully confronts an ignorant and dismissive, no-nothing boor.
7
Total respect for Nancy Pelosi. I have not been a fan of hers, but she demonstrated strength, moxie, and smarts while sitting properly with her hands in her lap...legs to one one side. She even got Trump to agree with her characterization that he lies. It was an astounding moment.
13
Ms Pelosi was controlled, soft-spoken, assertive, and knew who she was, in representing the American people. As I first generation American, I know how much the freedom of this country means to immigrant parents, and how much we are encouraged to get an education to contribute to our families and our nation. Mr Trump's rhetoric inflames fear and smokescreens sincere efforts at immigration reform. The one who yells loudest is he one to hold suspect - in business and in government. Well done, Ms. Pelosi.
9
Trump won this impromptu debate. As always, he had one or two simple soundbites and kept repeating them over and over. Yes, Ms Pelosi remained composed, but her language was complicated and contained legalese, such as asking for the facts to be stipulated. Who could understand what she was trying to say? For example, what did she mean by "Don't characterize the strength that I bring". What on earth was she getting at? Moreover, Mr Schumer interrupted Ms Pelosi on multiple occasions, indeed more so than did Trump. Mr Schumer made his points concisely, almost as well as Mr Trump did his, but his smiling and smirking did not project well. In the end, neither Ms Pelosi nor Mr Schumer clearly stated that the bill in question is a government funding bill, not a border protection bill, an immigration bill, or a bill to build a Berlin wall in the American southwest. This was not a good moment for the Democratic publicity machine.
3
I guess everyone sees what they want to see, but I hope this meeting makes everyone see why we need Rep. Pelosi as Speaker. Lets give her a big hand - bigger than the president's anyway.
7
I agree with this article's assessment of the confrontation between Mr. Trump and Nancy Pelosi. Together, she and Chuck Schumer are going to be two burrs in the president's saddle, and I hope that the discomfort they create will result in the president's life will result in his throwing in the towel.
Meanwhile, when I discuss Mr. Trump either verbally or in writing, I have never, since the inauguration, referred to Mr. Trump as president immediately preceding the word "trump", as I view him as illegitimate for the office due that what I believe will be proven that his election was a fraud.
8
All time Pelosi comment: "Don't characterize the strength I bring to this meeting". More profound than anything I have ever heard come out of Trump's mouth. There are so many things that could be read into her statement. Most importantly- don't you dare mess with me.
8
"Don't /characterize/ the strength that I bring" seems to me not the word Pelosi must have been grasping for, perhaps in the heat of the moment. I wanted to fill in with a different choice. "Minimize?" "Underestimate?" Even "MIScharacterize" would have been clearer.
As much as the writers made of her strength in this bout, after seeing the video, I was nonplussed. I was looking forward to seeing a real-life version of 'the Good Wife's' Diane Lockhart character, who would have made a hole in Trump's embarrassing mansplaining large enough to leave no QUESTION who knew what was going on and who did NOT.
It would probably have been too much to ask for her to have placed a lampshade over Pence's head, but he'd not likely have noticed.
3
@808Pants
I too found her use of the word "characterize" difficult to discern.
Thank you for clarifying.
I've never heard the word "characterize" used in that way. Did she mean to say "mischaracterize"?
If someone would respectfully respond I'd appreciate it :)
4
@2016-2018: “What Not To Do” Blueprints
Thank you, because I, too, have absolutely no idea what she meant. And yet, The NYT editors headlined this article with this quote from Ms. Pelosi. Maybe the NYT editors know what she meant.
On one side we had an experienced negotiator who had facts on finger tips, who believes in protecting the constitution and on the other side it was Trump and Pence known alternate fact and conspiracy theorists. On one side we had a Democratic Leader and the Other the Republicans.
6
How can anyone call DT the Leader of the Free World? IT has no interest in leading, and even if it did, Freedom is the last destination it has in mind.
6
Competence versus bluster. I will take competence. And give no quarter to gross inexperience as a plus. We saw who know what the Constitution says. And who never reads.
6
Exactly the type of journalism I expect from the Times. Great coverage of Pelosi's coat and sunglasses. But what type of suit was Trump wearing? Schumer's shoes? Does Pence wear boxers or briefs? Why was this not included in the article? I learned so much more about Nancy as a woman knowing that she chose to wear sunglasses on a sunny day in DC.
5
@ScottWeil
The item about Pelosi's sunglasses and coat was not intended as a sartorial comment but, I suspect, as evidence of Pelosi's satisfaction with her performance with 45. Your remark misses the point.
6
If this article is written to highlight Pelosi's strength and political acumen as a powerful woman, why are her coat, swingy or otherwise, and her fashionable sunglasses mentioned? No one felt compelled to describe Shumer's sartorial ensemble or Pence's fashion choices, and Trump's extra-long tie and baggy suit didn't rate a mention. Until Congressional women can speak and legislate and make policy without being viewed through their appearances, their real power and influence will continue to be undercut by a sexist slant.
4
This is one of the most cringeworthy articles the Times has written since they started to up their game in shedding light on women’s accomplishments. Until articles like this stop stop referring to successful people as ‘successful WOMEN’ they are rubber stamping the patriarchy. They’ve made it front page news that a ‘woman stood up to Trump.’ I think in the Boardroom Trump is probably less condescending to woman than this article. If Chuck Schumer told him off they wouldn’t have made a big deal about him being a dude. This article is equivalent to calling an African American person ‘articulate.’ Especially when they add in a comparison to Hillary. What does this meeting or Pelosi’s actions have to do with what happened in a debate 3 years ago?! You can do better than this Times!
Trump taking ownership of shutdown was actually a brilliant stroke. By agreeing, the Ds took ownership of illegal immigration & all its consequences.
The Prez can think out of the box. & he knows where the country—& the world—stand on immigration, illegal & not. Check the latest polls. It isn't even close.
The only demographic in favor of open borders & indiscriminate influx of terrorists, criminals, chronically dependent & drugs are leftist globalist elites, who send their kids to private schools & live in gated communities.
Baltimore smoke-filled back-room deals are more Nancy's speed.
It took only 12 minutes for Trump to demonstrate that the Empress has no clothes without the Armani label…or with the Union label!
In only 12 minutes he also managed to expose the hypocrisy, lies, danger & a certain out-of-touch opacity of the Left.
Not bad for a "dummy" like the Prez.
"The wall thing" is not "a manhood thing with him," Nancy. It's a national security "thing."
By adding, "as if manhood can be associated with him,” all she managed to do by the personal attack was diminish herself further. It's entirely possible Nancy will lose the speakership over this.
Just wondering: Couldn't the NYT find a less flattering photo of Trump? ;)
Seriously though, the photo fails to capture the 12 minutes. Trump was—in actuality—in total control.
That photo is the face of a 1-yr-old crybaby. Literally.
OTOH, no one can accuse The Times of being inconsistent in its Trump coverage.
1
@Marian
False: "By a 21-point margin — 57 percent to 36 percent — Americans think the president should compromise on the wall to avoid a government shutdown, rather than stand firm."
3
Democrats can shut down the government. President Trump would keep it shut until the 2020 election. Voters would then reelect him with glee.
If Trump thought he would prove how strong he is by making this meeting public, he just blew it.
Instead he just gave Nancy even more gravitas than she had before the meeting and confirmed her election to Speaker of the House. On top of that, he provided the stage for Pelosi to show Ocasio-Cortez how it’s done.
19
@Jane this Bay area woman agrees with you 100%. Cortez needs to find the congressional lunch room before declaring herself the savior of the Democratic Party.
4
Could you imagine if Barack Obama had treated a white Republican woman with such disrespect? I shouldn't be surprised. Hypocrisy, along with bigotry, is what the GOP is built on. Plus, it's not like Republicans would ever let a woman hold a leadership position anyway.
22
This is an opinion piece not based on the facts. If Pelosi were really getting the best of Trump, why would she request to move behind closed doors? Why also would she question his "manhood" if she thought she emerged victorious. Trump's strength is reality TV and positioning himself facing the cameras while the other two had to chose talking to him or the lens gave him a huge advantage.
4
Nancy Pelosi will not let Trump talk down to her and abuse her as he does other women. She will hold her own and call his bluff. An experienced and intelligent woman can easily take on Trump and Nancy is that woman.
24
@Jacquie
Mr Schumer repeatedly interrupted Ms. Pelosi and hijacked the microphone.
To the "rising stars" newly elected; take note. You just witnessed a Master-Class in negotiation and remaining dignified in the midst of ignorance and intransigence: Not Chuck- but Nancy.
12
The media continues to play to Trump by allowing him to direct their breathless attention to some manufactured crisis rather than his inability to staff his administration with competent people, or his ever-tightening noose of legal problems.
What should Pelosi have said? Try this: "Mr. President, I understand that you want to distract the public from the Mueller investigation and the daily barrage of fake news issued by your press spokes person. But, I refuse to cooperate with your plan to damage the country with a shut down just to protect your narcissistic ego ."
13
Trump put on a clinic for Chuck and Nancy on how to get your message out. He had them both repeatedly saying "No" on the Wall directly to the American people who are 79% in favor of building it. Also, does Nancy's legislating - "which is what we do" - include the brilliant, forever giving tactic of "passing the bill before you read it". Your feminist writers can spin it anyway you want, but in the end Nancy and Chuck looked like fools, Trump a true savvy leader.
The notion that 79% of Americans want to build a boarder wall is patently false. A recent poll shows that a majority want Trump to compromise rather than shut down the government.
7
Back Up- please provide backup (a legitimate source) for your false claim that "79%" of Americans support the wall.
6
Yeah, four out of five Americans support a border wall. Also, what actually really happened is the Patriots beat the Eagles in the Super Bowl.
5
great, great
Now that we know how poised and states=person like Pelosi and how she skillfully shifted blame to Trump...
What exactly are her border security proposals?
We have 8 million undocumented workers, groups of Hondurans demanding $50,000 a piece to go back to Honduras, illegal drugs, gang members and likely illegal weapons crossing the border.
The Democrats have called to disband ISIS, catch and release and a porous physical barrier
but at least Trump agreed that they can blame him, so long as they can actually work for the people they were elected to represent
2
I don't think that Stolberg and Karni give Hillary Clinton proper credit for the way she directly challenged Trump in the debates. She called him Putin's puppet. And she was right apparently.
16
Pence appears to be comatose as he sits stone like and wordless while the others argue rudely with each other.
Apparently Pence has been permanently silenced by Trump and has forgotten how to speak in public.
Despite Pences scary demeanor, I still vote for Trumps impeachment and removal to make way for Pence as a caretaker president until the next election in 2020!
5
The civil war among democrats is overblown in my opinion.
The "new radical" democrats are not a threat nor is Pelosi the incarnation of evil. They need to struggle with each other, neither the progressive wing, nor the suburbanites need to lie down in submission in order to beat Trump.
They need to struggle with each other and find a new synthesis they can both get behind.
What does this look like?
Let's take a specific example: Medicare For All (which I fully support in its pure form.)
The progressive wing should not give up its struggle for Medicare For All. Why? Because Obamacare, currently constituted, is unsustainable both economically and politically in the long term. It needs to evolve, and it needs to evolve in the direction of Medicare for All.
So, what would a compromise look like?
Here's an example:
1. Lower the eligibility age of Medicare to 55. This saves money in the long term because most chronic disease people face over the age of 65 begins and develops from the ages of 55-65. So, if those are addressed earlier they are less expensive later.
2. Allow those under 55 to buy into Medicare.
3. Allow CMS to negotiate drug prices for Medicare. And allow private insurance companies to opt-in to that pricing structure.
4. Allow veteran opt-into Medicare and transition VA assets into a public option of service, focusing on particular treatments/procedures most suitable for economies of scale-- and open it up for all Medicare recipients.
Stuff like this.
10
If you know something of Nancy's background, where she grew up in an Italian political family in Baltimore. Any woman who grew up in an Italian family in 50s/60s has learned how to hold their own with macho thinking men . While I am not a big fan of hers, I see from whence she came and applaud her for utilizing all those political skills learned.
12
Can you imagine President Barack Obama declaring to the world he would "Proudly Shut the Government Down" if John Boehner or Paul Ryan told him "You don't have the votes [in the House]" to pass a particular agenda?
11
Pelosi totally misunderstood what Trump was saying. She said several times that she doesn't want to debate in public.
Trump acknowledged that by saying she was “in a situation where it’s not easy for her to talk right now,” acknowledging that she didn't want to debate.
Pelosi totally missed it and took it personally.
Anyone who watches the full exchange knows I am right.
Another example of Fake News.
2
Speaker Pelosi stood her ground and made a good show for herself. Her comments reminded me of UN Ambassador Nikki Haley's "I don't get confused" response to Larry Kudlow's accusation that she gets hysterical. Trump and Co. don't do well with strong women in leadership positions. He could learn from former Treasury Secretary Hank Paulson, who got down on bended knee to ask Pelosi for a $700 billion bank bailout.
5
I'm confused . Shouldn't she have said , " Mr President, do not" mischaracterize" the strength that I bring, rather than " characterize the strength " ?
6
"Throughout, both Ms. Pelosi and Mr. Schumer made clear that they believed it was unproductive to negotiate in public and repeatedly prodded the president to move the discussion behind closed doors. (“We didn’t want to contradict the president when he was putting forth figures that had no reality to them, no basis in fact,” she later told reporters.)"
Why? What's wrong with publicly calling out the President's lies when he started this very public conversation in the first place?
15
It weakens their ability to negotiate with him in the future if he is humiliated to the extent you are suggesting.
12
Just as Clinton should have said "Back off, Creep" to Trump when he was stalking/trying to intimidate her during the debates, Pelosi should have said "You patronizing Jerk - don't you dare try to speak for me" during this meeting. Trump will never change his demeaning, misogynistic attitudes towards women, but if Pelosi had spoken out more forcefully, it would have been a good way to show even the most die-hard Trumpians his true colors.
5
She came out on top precisely because she didn’t say what you’re proposing. A savvy, disciplined, strategic person doesn’t resort to name calling even though it may feel good in the moment.
6
It is by no accident the Democrat won 40 House seat in Nov 6 under the stewardship of Pelosi.
23
These comments are amazing! Trump owned them both. Took them to the woodshed. I cannot understand how Dems think this was anything but embarrassing for them.
20
@ptbandy We'll see. The proof is in the pudding. If anything was embarrassing, it was dt's body language. So odd.
37
@ptbandy They have more intelligence? than the average moron?
13
@ptbandy I feel badly for you, pt. In your space capsule (I imagine you as being in one of the zillon identical sensory deprivation chambers that we saw in the Matrix, with all individuals trapped in a deleterious virtual landscape with no connection to reality. If you won't disconnect, then there is little we can do to show you reality. We will just have to work around you.
35
Thank you Nancy Pelosi for daring to stand up to this lying bully! Who like all bullies, revealed his cowardice and ineptitude when finally confronted. Nancy Pelosi you have my support!
17
This embarrassing video clip is out there for the world to see on how terrible the leader of the free world is. Mr. VP is sitting there like a wax statue from Madame Tussauds without a single expression on his face. Pelosi was the adult in the room yesterday. Why did Chuck and Nancy not ask DT about his campaign promise that "Mexico was paying for the wall" whatever happened to that???
13
Can't figure out whether she's channeling her inner Ocasio-Cortez – or whether AOC's channeling her inner Pelosi...
Math is straightforward, though...
1 + 1 = 2020...
Adding in some trigonometric triangulation...
Her dad was mayor of Baltimore...
Michael Bloomberg was a mayor, and – before that – was from Baltimore...
Oh, to be a fly on the wall when those two talk about how to really fix things – even before 2020...
PS
Kudos, Madam Speaker...Centrist leadership is as centrist leadership does...
7
I doubt DT understood her comment.
13
"...their voters sent them to Washington to compromise more than fight."
I'm really sick of this "centrist" pabulum. I wish the Times would shift to reporting reality rather than wishful pipe dreams. As in: one party is insane and increasingly authoritarian, and the other is showing long-overdue signs of resistance to this un-American depravity.
13
Yesterday's televised meeting gave the world a side by side contrast of the bombastic ridiculousness of Donald Trump as POTUS compared with the elegant dignity of Nancy Pelosi. Regardless of what one may think of their political views, Nancy Pelosi certainly presents the appearance of someone who knows how to be a "leader" compared to Trump who came off behaving like the adolescent bully we all know him to be. Once again Trump came off as the loser he really must be. So sad!
18
Gender scripted news analysis at the least is misleading and encourages gender bias, credit and value.
3
Little Donnie got schooled, and sent to the corner in a duncecap.
13
Pelosi is the perfect foil to the Felon in Chief. The Democrats if they have any brains (sometimes ) they should allow her to retain leadership till they win White House back in 2020. She has the moxie and heart (I cannot use another word ) to go toe to toe with the Felon. She has nothing to lose but much to gain. It was on full public display for all Americans to see what a pampered buffoon the Felon has become.
My guess is that after yesterday's event Conway and Sanders were applying cold compresses to his forehead whispering that he is the greatest president ever!
12
Trump is “rarely challenged to his face in public, especially by a woman”. The hook in this story seems to be that a woman was actually capable of taking on a man — even “gave as good as she got”! I don’t think that’s exceptional. Why wouldn’t she? But the NYT is full of that; the first woman to do this, the first woman to be that. It’s patronising.
8
They're both too old to be behaving like this, they could cause a mischief.
This exchange really made my day. I loved seeing someone, and especially a woman, put Comrade Cheetos in his place. We have needed more Democrats and Republicans to call him out on his many, many lies and not just 'roll-over', as they have these past 2 years. Pelosi has shown she has the spine to handle this orange-disaster.
13
What was with Mike Pence? Was he "re-booting?"
13
@susan Pence, the Evangelical Whisperer, was worrying about prison time after lying repeatedly for Trump about the Russian contacts.
7
The first Democrat to "man-up" to Trump was a woman. I have changed my mind about Speaker Pelosi - you go girl!
215
@Jack be Quick
Jack, your comment made me think of what Bernie would have done to Trump.
In fact, it made me picture the last verse of the old song “Bad, Bad Leroy Brown”:
“Well the two men took to fighting
And when they pulled them off the floor
Trump looked like a jigsaw puzzle
With a couple of pieces gone”
1
@Jack be Quick One swallow doesn't make a Spring.
@Jack be Quick Really? you sure you were watching the same thing the rest of us were?
How is Mr. Trump characterizing her strength? Weak, strong, what? I infer that he said she cannot be honest about the Democrat's true position on border protection with the cameras on and the public viewing the meeting. Only in hiding her true views in the darkness of privacy can she lay it all out. That is her strength: subterfuge.
Trump played both of them - Pelosi wanted to talk behind closed doors and Trump shot back with "Transparency" -- This is exactly why you don't want to argue with this guy with the cameras running -- The Dems had the substance- but Trump nullified their game plan from the start.
4
@Aaron They were merely giving him an out from the lies he is telling about the border. Having a public position is almost impossible for trump to back away from. They were giving him an opportunity to save face. Now he has nowhere to go or hide.
9
Did Sheryl and Annie forget President Trump offered to provide Nancy with Republican votes of she fell short on Democratic ones?
President Trump wants Nancy to be a combative Speaker. She will energize his base in 2020 like no one else can, except maybe if Hillary were Speaker.
I thought it was time for new leadership on the left. I was wrong. Nancy is amazing as ever. I fell in love. She will go down in history as one of the most successful speakers of the house ever. Very astute and no opportunity missed. Presidential and cunning. Exactly what the left needs. The people trying to oust her are the corporatist blue dog dems with zero platform other than cut taxes (fake democrats).
11
Nancy Pelosi: "This one's fpr you, Mr. McCain."
And indeed for all the others who have been mocked by Donald Trump without having had an opportunity to respond.
7
Interesting that you mention "mansplaining", but then tell us what she was wearing. What does her attire have to do with anything? Be careful that you aren't part of the problem.
7
Nancy Pelosi did a really great job in this interview. She staid polite; she staid calm; she staid focused on the facts; she gave as good as she got when Trump did his manipulative tactics like name calling "Nancy and Chuck", and outright lies. She did not get snowed or bowled over by him. She is not using insults to get one-up on Trump. She is calling out reality, when almost the entire country has been clueless about how to deal with Trump's lies and manipulations. Great job, Congresswoman Pelosi!
7
Governing requires compromise and sometimes admission of defeat. Since those governing are only human, that happens more easily in private and among people who recognize their shared interest in the welfare of the US. However, Individual-1 has no such interest and believes it is all a reality show and he's the star. Well, welcome to your dose of reality, trump. You made this bed and may yesterday's little lie-down be the beginning of you sleeping your way out of DC.
14
1) "“No, we don’t have the votes, Nancy, because in the Senate we need 60 votes,” Mr. Trump said, a talking point he repeated multiple times."
He repeated it multiple times because it is one of the few facts about governing that he has managed to grasp and he thought he was showing off. Well, not really grasped/mastered, if you read the whole context and listen to the meeting. But, it might be reasonable to say, after such a performance, "Good doggie". For his next trick, he'll come to the realization that obstruction is plain sight is still obstruction.
2) Why does he call Mr. Schumer "Chuck"? By that breach of etiquette, and by evincing such juvenile behavior, wouldn't it be appropriate for Shumer to respond by calling him "Donnie" or "Liddle Donnie" or "Cadet Bonespurs".
3) I note that he is now saying that "the people" would revolt were he to be impeached. So he has escalated from calling for Hillary's assassination to calling for the whole country to go down in flames? His ego truly knows no bounds. To even mention a word like "revolt" in the context of our political system is stepping over a line which should NEVER be crossed. I'd say "Shame on him." but he has no shame.
19
@R.Will Maybe Trump got it backwards?? Perhaps "the people" would revolt if Trump is NOT impeached??
4
Nancy Pelosi's leadership style - terse, dispassionate, fact-based - is one all elected representatives could learn from regardless of their gender.
Those who are challenging Pelosi look overwrought and hysterical by contrast.
28
Trump might want to consider a new nickname:
No Nonsense Nancy.
For all of those who thought she shouldn’t be speaker, I’m sure she’d welcome your apologies.
28
I hope anyone who aspires to leadership in the House saw Nancy Pelosi stand up to trump yesterday. We do need younger people in our government, desperately, but the value of “seasoning” was beautifully demonstrated. I would have loved to have seen the prep sessions.
On another note, the comment on the sunglasses and “swingy red coat” was probably unnecessary, although it did round out the portrait of Pelosi yesterday and was an interesting detail, I’m sure carefully deliberated before setting out. I loved it. I wish you wouldn’t do it. But I still loved it.
14
Fox is characterizing the meeting, as one of the first times congressional members showed such disrespect for a president in his office! Figures.
8
BRAVO Nancy Pelosi!!!! I love this women and to all those sexist/ageists who seek change merely for the sake of change rather then getting real results and our desired outcomes....wake up....she has so much to offer us, experience, expertise, and a long list of real accomplishments including the ACA, she has already done so much for so many Americans...she is incredibly impressive! I hope she is is easily confirmed as out next Speaker of the House..... I can't imagine a better candidate for that crucial position. Get behind Nancy Pelosi please, she is clearly THE ONE we need now. YES TO SUPPORTING NANCY PELOSI!!!!
22
This whole "wall" thing was supposed to be a metaphor since trump was so bad at staying on message. So his writers were said to have given him a crutch to remember his bigoted message. trump must have been so proud to have morphed the meaning into a stupid literal wall.
I get it that trump's base finds this amusing. The whole global warming thing is just a joke. trump's mouthpiece in Poland was openly mocked when he suggested that oil and coal are part of a sustainable future.
Extinctions are occurring at rates similar to when an errant asteroid slammed into the planet, and killed the dinosaurs. A wall will wipe out a dozen or so species, but that is nothing compared to ignoring the existential threat that climate change represents.
In short, hubris will be our downfall. Some HATE change. Keep the tried and true. But the planet has chemically changed so humans need to adapt. It will apparently have to get a lot worse before traditionalists around the world grasp the desperate situation in which we exist.
5
Ms. Pelosi speaks softly but carries a big stick. Thank you for standing up to the bully currently squatting in our oval office, Ms. Speaker.
Thank you, also, Mr. Schumer for that cock-eyed grin as you baited the boor time and time again into revealing his true colors. It was another nail in the coffin of autocracy, and another feather in Trump's cap of overweening ego and childish petulance.
25
Ms. Pelosi proclaimed ...“I was trying to be the mom.”... to Democratic colleagues in a private meeting. Elected women found the comment hilarious. Had He-Who-Must-Not-Be-Named said "you sound like you're trying to be a mom" there would have been screaming about disrespect.
I'm a woman and I don't support him. But I am tired of women's double standards. Had a male reporter named those pink knit accessories "pussy hats", women would have been outraged.
In a different meeting, women activist would have analyzed her calm ladylike demeanor - legs crossed at the ankle, hands folded in her lap - as yet more proof that women must be polite when dealing with men. Yet here we are, crowing about her polite calm performance. Had a man instructed a clueless elected woman about how the government works in a public meeting, oh! the outcry about talking down to women. Her civics lesson was handed out with the same intent. Tit for tat, perhaps.
Pelosi went into to that meeting to pick a fight on national TV. The NYT nailed it by saying she knew it would set him off by labeling it his shutdown. By repeatedly pushing buttons and talking over him, she made herself look like she was already the Speaker - the whole purpose.
This exchange was motivated by Pelosi's self interest. Something that is as keenly developed as her insider skills. She craves the top spot so she can add impeachment of a President to her resume.
@B Dawson Like GHW Bush, she probably believes, with some basis, that she is the best qualified to serve as Speaker. And of course, she has an ego - she is a politician, isn't she?
Fights need to be picked with Trump, and the "wall" is a perfect one - but there will be others. Ms. Pelosi is fully capable of doing it, will, and will make Trump look like what he is - a neurotic boor. And she will prevail.
8
While watching this strange interaction the first time through, I had difficulty hearing Nancy Pelosi, and I missed much of her contribution. Due to microphone placement, frequency range of those speaking and my personal high frequency range hearing issues...Senator Schumer and President Trump boomed through clearly and at times nearly drowned out Pelosi’s contribution.
Fortunately, I had a chance to listen later with better sound quality and was able to follow the full interaction. It was only then that I was able to fully appreciate what a strong, savvy position Nancy Pelosi had staked out. Given the ambush-like nature of this event, I am left with respect for Pelosi’s preparation and ability to think well on her feet.
An important point I’d like to make: in a “free for all, reality show” exchange as this appeared to be, a natural competitive advantage goes to those with inherently loud (male?) voices that interrupt and talk over others...even when making less valid points. This may be “rude” but it can be an effective tactic. But ultimately, many of us are more influenced by the intelligence behind the voice. My hope is that effort will continue to be made by the media to ensure that quieter but reasoned voices are not drowned out in the discussion of planning our country’s path. By the way, I’m a male with what has been described as a loud booming voice.
12
Next time the Wall comes up in public conversation, I hope the following may be mentioned:
$5 billion are be paid to Trump or Kushner companies;
He promised Mexico would pay for the wall; and
His tax cuts mean that only middle class taxpayers will be on the line to pay for it.
9
Thank you, Ms Pelosi. I take exception to the author's comment: "While she is being cheered on the Democratic left, centrists may react more warily, knowing that their voters sent them to Washington to compromise more than fight." I consider myself a centrist. It has become apparent that you cannot compromise with a president who cannot grasp the facts and is so dishonest. A better answer is to send the v.p. to Mexico City with orders not to come back until he gets some an agreement from Mexico to pay for the wall. Hopefully, we will never have to see Pence again for the balance of this presidential term.
16
One conversation of Pelosi and Trump has no meaning. Neither shows any leadership qualities and Pelosi is bought and paid for by wall street. She is a moderate Republican in policy and has has been a large cause, with other dems, of the massive disparity in wealth in this country. She lies and is corrupt and manipulates the policies of health care, taxes etc. to benefit her wealthy donors. She needs to go and I hope she is not elected Speaker. The new progressive Dems need to transform this country as it slides away from democracy and moves toward a near fascist state. Corporations are now running this country as it deteriorates and massive problems are building, from massive climate change related economic problems to riots as in France. Study that French problem and you will see it has been caused by the same NeoLiberal takeover as in the USA. And that is austerity for the masses and tax breaks for the wealthy and a rotten, rotten campaign finance system. Good luck to us with the same ole, same ole people and philosophy for decades.
1
So now it’s a sign of “strength” to beg to have the cameras turned off? Her lack of transparency as an elected official was frightening.
2
Alleluia! The public and newly-elected Dem reps finally got to see for themselves why Pelosi is the one to lead the party. And the beauty of it was that it was spontaneous, and she was not expecting the cameras.
13
Two words, Ms. Pelosi: tax returns.
5
Thank God the Democrats now have the majority in the house and can stop mollycoddling the president. It's about time. woulst that the Republicans would follow suit.
4
So Nancy - a woman with a voice, is about to become 3rd in line to the Office of President. The current occupant about to be indicted, the second in line appears to not want the job anymore! I see an interesting move script here. Any takers?
6
I'm sure that was Alec Baldwin running the meeting. On the other hand it's actually Trump doing his impersonation of Baldwin's impersonating Trump!!
6
"Leader of the free world". Mr Trump is not my leader and he as removed USA out of that position. USA hooked arm with Russia and Saudi in climate change denial. USA may have the military power to threaten any country, but it no longer has any moral authority.
8
It isn't helpful at all for Nancy Pelosi to engage in personal insults -- that building the wall is a "man thing" for Trump. Doing so simply puts her on Trump's level, the master of personal insults. Ms. Polosi, please stick to debating the issue of the wisdom or folly of a border wall without degrading comments about Trump or any others who might support it.
38
@Sam McFarland I dunno. It's the first thing that popped into my mind.
15
@Sam McFarland Why should she not stoop to the level of the president? Isn't that the highest and most revered office in the land? I say it's about time to stop babying him and call a spade a spade.
47
@Sam McFarland
"Tit-for-tat" is the proper game-dominating strategy for nearly 100% of all games. It is a strictly proportional response. When trump talks about hitting back 10 times as hard, he violates that principle. When Pelosi responded as she did, she signaled that she would not being a punching bag and would not be a passive target for trump's juvenile barbs. Her response was appropriate: women don't have to sit with their hands in their laps when they are not serving the tea.
It is quite helpful for her to set the tone early. Toddlers need boundaries and trump, as the toddler in chief, needs to know that calling Mr. Schumer "Chuck" is juvenile and unacceptable behavior and merits Mr. Schumer responding with "Donnie" to set the tone.
60
Not only the House Democratic leader Nancy Pelocy's sharp reaction to Trump's insulting remark was a fitting response to Trump's mysoginic arrogance but was equally a preview of the difficult days ahead that Trump is going to face while confronting legislative hurdles to his executive overreach. This encounter also firms up her claim to the House Speaker that she deserves.
24
I never understood why my fellow progressives thought that Nancy Pelosi should not be the Speaker of the House.
I never understood why voters, including some of my friends, thought it was a good idea to elect a clueless grifter President of the United States.
Without Nancy Pelosi there would be no ACA. She, not Obama, was the person who got that bill though the House, allowing it to become a bill. When she schooled Trump and told him to allow a vote in the House on the wall, and said that's how you start, she was educating him on how bills are passed, since Trump still doesn't seem to understand two years into his presidency how government works.
Yesterday all Americans saw firsthand the knowledge and political savvy Pelosi brings to her job. The Speaker has to wrangle cats and know where the votes are.
Pelosi even knew that Trump didn't have the Republican votes in the House.
Stop looking for people who don't know how to do this job and know how politics work for this job.
Nancy Pelosi should be the Speaker of the House in 2019!
33
Excellent comment. I completely agree that Nancy Pelosi brought us the ACA. I always felt that Obama left the speaker swinging in the wind after it passed to do all the heavy lifting. Had Obama gotten out front with this huge accomplishment I think death panels and all the nonsense would have been minimized. I liked Obama but think he just wasn't there for the blowback. Ann
6
What a thrill. Pelosi, calm, clear, steady and to the point. What a magnificent opportunity our president gave the country to watch how he "runs" the affairs of sate. Any incoming representative who opposes Pelosi as speaker deserves to be defeated next time around. There is no substitute for excellence plus experience...she achieved what 15 republicans tried to do when seeking the nomination. She quietly took the stage.
18
But do they care about the truth? The wall is not what will make the border secure. Read the fact check of all the misleading points the president was making in that interview—policy based on inaccuracies is not good policy and Trump supporters need to recognize that.
6
If only Hilary had done as well in her exchanges with Trump as Ms. Pelosi, she might be the president today. She needed to "be the mom," as Ms. Pelosi said, and told misbehaving Donnie to sit down when he stalked her during the debate.
12
Trump is not used to the push-back, particularly by a woman. Now he has a smart, experienced, fearless, crafty soon to be House Speaker to deal with. And this as Mueller turns up the heat. He didn't look comfortable, and the cameras were his idea. What does that say about his judgment? I expect we'll see Trump looking childish, angry, ineffective, frustrated... I don't think he has the inner resources to make this better.
19
It struck me, among many other things at this meeting, that the president pointedly kept referring to Ms Pelosi and Mr Schumer as Nancy and Chuck while they, per protocol, called him Mr President. It seemed purposely demeaning. The plèbes there with the prez. What’s the protocol for addressing the pair in a situation like this?
10
@Susan
I noticed the same thing and thought that they should have considered meeting him on his own ground: "Well, Mr. President, since only my friends call me "Chuck", I guess we are friends and I'll have to assume that you are inviting me to call you "Donnie" ".
3
Nancy Pelosi just solidified her position as the next Speaker of the House in 2019 by her performance at Trump's attempt to play politics instead of conscientiously working to make government work for all of us. How humiliating for Trump have "Nancy" challenge the adolescent bully who now is recorded showing how he will try to "shut down the government" if he doesn't get his own way. Who else in the current House could have handled Trump as adroitly?
201
Of the $1.2 billion that he's already received from Congress for his beautiful, glorious wall, only 6% of that amount has actually been spent so far. Maybe Congress needs to cut the amount asked for to what has already been spent.
10
I want my money back!
2
I agree with many others who have commented here. For me, this ends any doubt that Nancy Pelosi should be elected speaker for both her experience and her fearlessness. In another environment--without a reckless rookie in the White House--it would be fine to elect a speaker-in-training. But now is not the time.
26
It is not clear to me why you would call Trump "the leader of the free world." He is an isolationist. He does not want to lead. Free or otherwise. Nor does he want to follow: how many world leaders, other than he, did NOT sign the recent G20 statement? "I'm not crazy. Everyone else is."
19
After watching yesterday's session, it was easy to understand how there have been 4000 law suits and 6 bankruptcies in the wake of the Trump Org including a $25M fraud settlement days before the inauguration. Operating as a servant of the people, it is far more onerous.
Trump places himself at the center of any negotiation obscuring both the issue and the compromise to move it forward. He is not merely obstructive but destructive. Operating as a servant of the people, it is far more onerous and pernicious.
13
Despite the wish for new Dem leadership—an identity crisis not backed by any real exciting leadership talent options—Pelosi really is the best choice to stand up to Trump. A role where experience and past legislative accomplishments will be critical.
19
Good for her.
Perhaps it is time that Mr Trump learns that going through life isnt about constantly being a spoiled privileged brat who always thinks he should get what he wants.
Political leadership is the ability to compromise and negotiate, not a zero-sum game of which he seems to (mistakenly) believe he is a master. Being a grownup isnt Mr Trumps strong point.
Very interesting, the message delivered by an accomplished, intelligent and strong woman. My guess is Mr Trump has not been around many such women in his 70+ years. I love it.
22
This was a nice piece of reality TV. There might be a future for a “Nancy and Chuck” spin-off.
4
Nancy Pelosi wanted to impress upon Trump he can no longer just willy-nilly things he says in her presence, more of the lying, exaggerating, or spinning of facts he knows his 'incurios' base will accept as being truthful. He's been getting away with his lying, spinning, or exagerrating for months during those ridiculous gaggles he stages on the white house lawn as he prepares to board his helicopter.
This was a moment she drew a line in the sand.
24
Mr. Trump just doesn't know what to do when he is in a discussion with a woman who will not be cowed by him.
His waving his hand at her was him saying to her "pipe down", he failed miserably.
Pence sits there like a stuffed pillow.
I will say both Ms. Pelosi and Mr. Schumer do know how to push Mr. Trump's buttons.
30
The scene between our POTUS with
“Chuck and Nancy” yesterday demonstrated two facts about Trump we already know; he rants like a petulant child and he talks down to women (all women).
23
"For those who study women in politics, it was a notable moment — a behind-the-scenes peek at a powerful woman negotiating with the leader of the free world".
I beg to differ. Other advanced nations hardly consider the vulgar, pompous, dim-witted, misogynist, racist, self-enriching man in Oval Office as a "leader" of the free world any more.
They see him acting akin to a Banana Republic leader of the good-old fascist kind, one who also doles out cushy jobs and ill-gotten money to his off-springs and in-laws.
20
In an earlier Comment I mentioined the 'gaggles' Trump holds on the White House lawn before boarding his helicopter where he gets to freely answer questions without any chance for follow-ups to question what is typically a spin, a lie, or an exaggeration.
Well, apparently Nancy Pelosi has also seen enough of Trump getting away with this opportunity to get his message across without being told, 'Stop this lying, spinning behavior Now. I'll not stand for it in my presence.'
Again, another instance of why we need Nancy Pelosi leading the House and not an inexperienced 'wanna-be'.
22
@merc The apparent urgency of a noisy helicopter in the background is a useful foil for Trump....as the press urgently shout their little questions.
7
I am even older than those geezers and wish they all would get out of the way and let younger representatives take over the leadership. It doesn't help that Pelosi reminds me of that film Brazil. As I watched the 3 (well, 3 and 1/2) of them argue I thought, "Amazing, none of them, even Trump, have a clue about how stupid they look. Well, that's America now."
"While she is being cheered on the Democratic left, centrists may react more warily, knowing that their voters sent them to Washington to compromise more than fight."
This is such a huge mis-characterization of the voters' choice. The blue wave did not happen in favor of compromise; it happened to increase checks on a runaway presidency. The new house majority is there to say NO! No more kowtowing!
We are back to the mode of checks and balances.
18
Agreed that this was a fine showing by the Democratic leaders, but I wish one of them would have had the presence of mind to ask, "And what do you think, Mike?"
22
Amen!
3
@Camille
He sat quietly like a neglected ventriloquist’s dummy during the entire exchange.
4
Pretty remarkable, though unsurprising, to see a President with such a dismal approval rating and who won the election without a popular majority to warn the next House Speaker that she may not have the support to speak for her party.
15
In politics the Republican power structure not elected to Congress has conditioned us to hate two women- Hillary Clinton and Nancy Pelosi. If you are a fan or not they are educated, smart and stand their ground. There has been a decades long public misinformation campaign of hate and mistrust fed by a lot of money and fear of women of strength. It has worked. Clinton and Pelosi are widely disliked but when you ask why, most folks I've asked can't tell you why without using some mysogynistic terms. Get ready for the Republicans to attack the rising Democratic stars-Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez, Kamala Harris, and Amy Klobuchar. They'll go for AOG first. She'll need a tough skin and a quick education. Beware women, have their backs, the backlash and onslaught of misinformation is just beginning.
16
Sometimes Trump stumbles into a good idea through sheer bluster. Journalists invited to a meeting that's historically taken place behind closed doors? Bring it. But why not bring it all the time? Why can't our elected lawmakers do all their deals under the harsh light of public scrutiny? Big money and lobbyists are the biggest reason, they're driving a wedge into the cracks of democracy and I fear it's starting to break. And Chuck and Nancy? If they're going to be the new stars on Presidential Apprentice...don't just push back with dignity...use your big words and your big voices.
8
@Skidaway seems like a good idea on the surface, but then all the energy goes into performing and scoring points with the audience instead of looking for acceptable solutions.
5
I am glad to see that Nancy Pelosi will stand up to Trump. But the extravagant praise heaped on her in this article seems a bit exaggerated. "Don't characterize the strength that I bring" is not exactly a rallying cry.
4
Pelosi schooled Trump publicly. She got him in front of the cameras he arranged. That's a personal sting for Trump. He loses the thing that matters most to him, showboatmanship.
But he wins the larger battle, the one he always wins, which is that he still owns the news cycle, which he has owned since June 2015. He still is totally having his way, all while liberal forecasters predict his imminent downfall.
I virulently dislike trump. But I also have eyes. He not only is winning he won.
5
Pelosi, by resorting to her gutteral remark about Trumps "manhood", has chosen to descend into the same cesspool that Trump's vulgar namecalling inhabits. It would have been better to resist lowering her role as representative of the Democratic party to that level but, as we now see, neither side has chosen to offer higher character.
3
This is sad. President Trump looked like a spoiled baby, and VP Pence was wall decoration. A strong woman told Trump the truth and crybaby actions ensued. I wish Schumer stopped looking down and looked more confident. But in the end, Speaker-elect Pelosi delivered America's message, with confidence and grace.
17
I thought Nancy Pelosi was terrific and handled the situation as well as anyone could have. She was calm and civil, and demonstrated self-control. She and Senator Schumer looked like grownups dealing with an oversized child.
19
As an expatriate American in France it is fascinating to see presidents Trump and Macron, who are both birds of a republican feather, behave in a similar inexperienced and authoritarian manner.
Both attempt to rely on the authority of their office to make up for their lack of experience. This attitude only serves to alienate both their adversaries and allies.
Macron just caved in to the violent and destructive yellow jacket movement by giving them cash bailouts and bonuses after they caused millions of euros of damage in Paris by rioting.
The thuggish and shameful mentality of the French hooligans commands no respect and should have not have been rewarded with monetary payouts.
The alternative plan B for Macron would be to offer a jobs and training program to address the chronic ten per cent unemployment that persists in France. This would be an appropriate way to ask the hooligans to earn their place in society!
5
Having just finished reading “Fear” by Bob Woodward, this exchange between Nancy Pelosi and Trump gave me a bit of hope. The book revealed in detail that this president is willfully and breathlessly ignorant on every nuance of government and how it operates. The only reality, the only “facts” he spews exist in his head, stored and locked away for 40-plus years, never to be challenged, never to be changed.
Passages in the book taught me that everyone in his orbit knows that it is pointless to argue with Trump. You argue around him.
Ms. Pelosi may be in for the fight of her political life here, but I don’t believe for a moment that this exchange was to benefit her. She is the only member of Congress thus far to stand up publicly to the idiotic “principles” of this man to his very face. She argued around him and it worked. Granted, this tactic should have been used a long time ago. One can certainly not accuse her of having a short fuse, but who knows, maybe she just finished reading the book too.
Democrats have relentlessly struggled to come up with a name or two to run against Trump in 2020, a task that shouldn’t really be all that difficult. Pelosi successfully challenged Trump yesterday with backbone and grace. She’s not the only woman in the party to possess both.
12
Amen!
4
It is so obvious why Trump and Republican minions loath Mrs. Pelosi.
She is infinitely smarter and more skilled at her job than any of them are.
Ye gods! and a W-O-M-A-N.
Were the Democrats to trade her leadership for anyone else, it would be the biggest mistake since Boston traded the Babe.
18
Two ancient geezers telling each other to get off the lawn. Very inspiring.
2
Point of order: does anyone seriously consider President Trump as "leader of the free world," as mentioned in this article? I mean, c'mon.
13
@buster did Trump say at one point early on (I don't recall if it was before or after the election) that he DIDN'T want to be the leader of the free world. Well, he's certainly accomplished that!
4
If I didn't know it was the president, I'd have thought she was speaking to a child.
8
There is something refreshing about seeing Trump beat at his own game. To disrespect leaders of the other party by springing the press on them, without their knowledge or consent- and then to lose control of the conversation.
Kudos to Pelosi and Schumer- Chuck and Nancy.
Pence looked like the elf on the shelf.
No-one wants to see government run like this but, at last, there is another side to the argument being represented.
227
@vwcdolphins No one has yet mentioned how out of his depth Pence appeared at this meeting. He was there to remind voters that if Trump were ousted from office before the 2020 election Pence would be the next POTUS.
17
@vwcdolphins "elf on the shelf" hahahahahahaha!
13
@vwcdolphins
"Elf on the shelf". Not much makes me laugh out loud these days. Thank you.
14
Good Job, Speaker Pelosi!
The Con Don hates women in power, particularly those who speak softly and will not be sucked into his hate-anger-fear-bully tactics.
You Go, Girl!
36
Look, the time is past for trying to assuage an ego that is bigger than Mt. Everest and as truthful as Pinocchio. Ms. Pelosi possesses a great intellect, is calm but firm and will do what she needs to do to protect the values that she has always stood for and which decent Americans believe in and support. For many years Democrats were hamstrung by southern Democrats who were Republicans in disguise. It's not that she's "seeking a fight" but she will not for one instant allow the agenda to be determined by a man who doesn't even understand the concept of "truth" or "compromise". If the Democrats end up being as stupid as the Republicans and allow extremists on the fringe to hamstring their agenda, then they might as well hand over the keys of government to the Republicans and shut the doors to the Democratic Caucus. I refer to the newly elected members with radical agendas. What the Democrats have to do and which Ms. Pelosi has always believed in is to address forthrightly how to achieve progress in dealing with the myriad problems that face this country and seek ways to bring as many people along in support as possible. If that means the fringes break off, let them go because in that case they were never part of the deal anyway. Just ask those turncoat "Democrats" in Albany who voted to give the Republicans Senate control for decades. They were the WORST OF THE WORST and have no place in any government. Ms. Pelosi knows what she's doing and I fully support her.
409
@ManhattanWilliam
What "radical agenda?
A "Green New Deal" to save Earth from the climate crisis?
Medicare for All/singlepayer so that healthcare costs don't continue to consume 20% of the national budget and medical bills don't bankrupt the seriously ill?
Free public colleges so that our bright young people don't start ou in life w/the noose of debt strangling the?
That radical agenda?
179
You seem to suggest that nothing radical has undermined the American dream and that if we stick to centrist, conventional measures the country will right itself. Trump is a symbol of the false hope we have all, at one time, placed in wealth as a legitimate power with political integrity. But it isn't and never was. It can mean many good things but of itself it can just as easily represent fraudulent and authoritarian motives as it can represent genius and good motives. If Clintons represent centrism they also represent the fallacy of mixed motives. The transfer of wealth and power this poor country has experienced over the last sixty years cannot be reversed with half measures. Just ten years ago talking about 'income inequality' was considered class warfare but some persisted, kept 'extremist' views front and center, and now it's universally understood as a central problem in the US. Three cheers for the freshman Democrats that will leep doing the same thing in the House.
29
@marjorie trifon
You are not going to achieve anything of value if you weaken or defeat Pelosi. She was the defender of healthcare reform and the protector of Social Security, among other things. And, highly effective at that! A band of inexperienced and naive will not be effective and will just snatch defeat from the hands of victory.
61
I was not a fan of Speaker Pelosi, believing her time was up and she needed to go. I can now see the great benefit of having a seasoned, rational, and mature voice taking on the likes of Trump. She won that conversation, hands down, and was a model for women finding themselves in similar situations. She has my vote and full confidence going forward.
1088
@EB
Thanks for that. I have had arguments with a friend - another woman - over whether Speaker Pelosi should have "retired" from the Speaker's position.
I wouldn't support her for President because of age, and I want younger people brought in. However, almost all comments which begin with I am not a fan of" are directed at women. And often the reason given is: "I just don't like her." Lack of charisma is an electability issue - but there are plenty of men who lack it.
There are a lot of subliminal prejudices against women: for their "irritating" tone of voice, their appearance, and for their manner of speaking. Maybe that applies here. With the number of women newly elected to the House, I think we may be getting over that.
47
@EB
I've experienced the same thing. I thought perhaps it would be good to replace her, but after watching her yesterday I'd say she's definitely still got what it takes. She and Schumer played Trump like a fiddle. Of course, most people do... all you have to do is pique his ego one way or the other.
44
@EB
I don't mean to be rude but wasn't obvious from the outset that the only way forward for the new Democratic controlled house was to have Ms. Pelosi lead? She is Trump's nightmare, a mature woman with a brain who doesn't get rattled or shrill and calls his lies out in language that he probably doesn't even understand. She's a mother trying to explain the facts to an ignorant, tantrum prone child. I really like Seth Moulton but that little revolt over the Speakership was just plain stupid and ill-timed.
63
Why, exactly, did Dems want to get rid of her as Speaker? I understand why some on the far left edge of the party don't like her. But as for winning the redder districts that turned against Trump, they spoke with their votes. Their votes were a clear rejection of Trump. Schumer has a hard time handling Trump, but Pelosi showed how to do it with steel and class.
28
Pelosi was great but it was Schumer who got Trump to assume responsibility for a shutdown.
4
This exchange was nothing more than Trump communicating to his base, and Nancy to hers. There is a small uncommitted contingent whose opinion might be affected and Nancy did well to win more of them.
Who is the cadaver on Trump's right?
I wish media would not attend press conferences hosted by this administration. Here is what they should be publish:
"The White House organized a press conference today and we ignored it. We don't care."
"Trump tweeted today. We don't care."
"Trump insulted people today. His targets were not affected. We don't care. Global warming is the issue."
"Kanye West and Kim K still exist. Maybe. Maybe not. We don't care. Never did."
7
I was watching this live time . . and was loving every moment. It was such a pleasure to finally witness someone give as good as they got. I have a lot more respect for Nancy Pelosi after yesterday. I love that a smart woman stood up to that idiot man-child for all the world to see.
31
The freshmen class of Democrats, especially the 29 year old darling from Queens, should take note: This is what leadership looks like. You go Nancy!
22
Schumer wasn’t bad, either. The body language said oodles.
14
Pelosi exposed (finally) on live TV what the failing New York president has always been under his bluster...an ignorant coward.
Face to face, he ain’t so tough.
The only thing he had going for him was his LOUDer voice and at times shouted over her, but she kept her cool.
Pence looked like a cut out poster board of himself. Maybe he was worrying about what Flynn told the special counsel about him.
17
Who is that guy sitting between Trump and Rep. Pelosi?
Guess that's why "Cactus Jack" Garner characterized the office of V.P. as he did.
Trump really is frightened of smart women. Fun to watch.
18
After she reprimanded him, he back down. What a coward, through and through.
15
“She has to prove that she’s tough enough for her caucus,” said John Feehery, a Republican strategist"
Ms. Pelosi doesn't have to "prove" herself to anyone (especially Trump).
She earned her chops long ago.
17
Quote:
"it was a notable moment — a behind-the-scenes peek at a powerful woman negotiating with the leader of the free world. "
Sorry US friends, the leader of the free world is now Merkel. Free world doesnt kneel down before dictators.
20
Ms. Pelosi missed a good opportunity. She should have said: "Mr. President, you promised the American people a thousand times that Mexico was paying for the wall. So once we get the check from Mexico, we'll build the wall."
15
Trump's typical railroading of opponents, especially women, is tiresome. The bullying, interrupting, and hyper-body language of this man is almost comical in some respects, and is always predictable. I thought Pelosi was marvelous--bravo!
18
As a woman in science, I find it frustrating when people refer to me as a "woman scientist" or a "woman in science." Can't I just be a "scientist"? Similarly, can't Nancy Pelosi just be a politician? Every time you point out her gender, you imply - whether you want to or not - that her gender makes her less capable. Please stop it.
32
As a woman who went before you, and hopefully helped pave the way for you to be a scientist, I can say it’s not as easy as you think to “ just stop it.” There are plenty of people out there, men like Trump and even women, who think we can’t hold our own. I’m perfectly happy to have it pointed out that a woman can go toe-to-toe with the president.
148
One photo not widely shared showed John Kelly and Javanka at the other end of the Oval staring, wide-eyed, at the squatter-in-chief, being verbally disemboweled by soon-to-be-President Pelosi and Chuck Schumer.
Its a picture of unbridled fear.
Made me all warm and fuzzy inside.
Congressional oversight - what a wonderful thing!
16
Perfect, Ms Pelosi, Bravo, Mr Schumer!
8
Pelosi is the one that restored ACA that was left dead by Obama. Democrats who said they will vote against her in election campaign should know that elections are over. On the next go, they will be judged by their performance in the House. Pelosi is the best in the house of either sex and either party.
20
Pelosi is Trumps secret weapon....she will ensure independent voters don’t vote for Democrats
1
@Chicago Paul ... the 2018 election proved the opposite. Despite the GOP use of Pelosi as the bogeyman the Dems won an overwhelming victory in the house.
6
I applaud Pelosi’s attitude and fortitude, and I am all for antagonizing Trump. But I was bothered by her wanting the cameras turned off - while Trump was making it into a spectacle for the wrong reasons, it ended up helping us as much as it helped him, though her response to Trump’s “transparency” remark was too convoluted to be effective (not that I could have done any better in the heat of the moment, but that’s not my job.) A better response would have been “speaking of transparency, where’s your tax returns?”
As for her “manhood” comments, I don’t disagree, and Trump says less appropriate things on an hourly basis, but remember, when they go low, we’re definitely not supposed to go just below the belt. Leave those kind of remarks to the pundits and late-night hosts, and concentrate on fighting the good fight for all of us.
44
@James Jacobs You're right on a number of points, assuming the point of governing is to one-up the other side. Sure, she won what you might call a debate, but that doesn't gain anyone anything. Turning off the cameras might have enabled them to get down to the nuts and bolts of keeping the government open because it would have deprived the president of the oxygen he needs - publicity.
Is there a chance of convincing him that the border wall is a wasteful expenditure? No, because it is his big promise, the manhood thing referred to.
14
@James Jacobs With respect, your comment about turning off the cameras would make sense under any other White House administration. However, this President is more interested in making television drama than he is in making policy. For Trump, turning off the cameras is like turning off the oxygen that feeds a fire. He can't exist without them, and Pelosi and Schumer know that.
21
@James I think her requesting to be off camera was a manipulation by her. She knew that anything she appeared to want would be automatically rejected. Therefore, the dotard insisted upon staying on camera, and made his statement about shutting down the government for all the world to see. Great move Mrs. Pelosi.
25
“I think this was an example that really speaks to women’s capacity to lead, and to do it civilly, to do it with grace and to be strong and clear.”
Debbie Walsh nails it. Women have a doubly harder job than men dealing with men in a professional setting, because of age-old stereotypes and expectations.
For my money, Nancy nails this capacity for grace under pressure and strength without insult.
The president tried to put her down, and she "gave as good as she got" as Graham put it.
Yes she must walk a fine line, but if anyone can, it's this woman who people love to malign and rarely praise.
I frankly cannot imagine anyone else in the Democratic caucus doing what she did, including "Chuck" who lacks her directness, purpose, and resoluteness.
384
@ChristineMcM
You just gave the reason why Pelosi should be Speaker.
I hope the Democratic Caucus is listening.
25
@ChristineMcM
Watching the once and future Speaker Pelosi yesterday was as enjoyable as watching Ginger Rodgers dance so gracefully, and as we all know, she did it backwards and in high heels.
28
@ChristineMcMI
Yes, "strength without insult" indeed.
"Please don't characterize the strength that I bring to this meeting..."
I am still smiling.
7
Pelosi was impressive, and I look forward to her holding the line over the coming two years. But I found the Schumer-Trump dynamic to be even more interesting. Senator Schumer was direct, blunt and tough; he looked every bit the New Yorker that he is. Trump clearly didn't like it, but understood it. He's not used to be challenged like that, and it showed.
148
@J Wilkinson actually, I don't think Trump understood it at all. He is like a petulant child and felt he could talk back to his mommy, and she put him in his corner.
18
@J Wilkinson
I agree as to Schumer, but for God's sake the man needs to sit up and tighten up his body language. He looked like a kid hunched over in the Principal's office waiting for the cane. When trump calls him "Chuck" he should respond with "Donnie". Yes, that would be juvenile, but that is what trump has done to the discourse and Schumer needs to, politely or mockingly, take the gloves off.
12
@R.Will
Very true! At one point Schumer was slouched in a way that made me think that couch must be horribly uncomfortable.
7
Just how much of that "extraordinary back-and-forth, which lasted for a heated 15 minutes" did you see on the evening news on major broadcast and cable networks. On Fox?
Did the sound bites flatter Trump or Nancy Pelosi?
The real issue for the next two years is going to be how the media covers Trump. I don't know the answers to these two questions because I don't watch TV. But I'm willing to bet that the romance between Trump and major media with Trump starring and being flattered by the camera's attention rather than being ignored by the camera continues unabated.
4
Ms. Pelosi doesn't have to prove anything. As far as I'm concerned, she controlled that conversation and proved to one and all -- once and for all -- that she has the guts and the smarts to both challenge and deal with this president.
24
Mrs.Pelosi must retain her seat, she epitomizes what the Speaker should be, as demonstrated in her discussion with Trump.
15
The first thing I did after seeing coverage of that Oval Office meeting was to call my House Representative to voice my praise of Nancy Pelosi.
I urge other folks to do the same.
22
I can almost bet what the opening on this weeks SNL is going to be, Alec Baldwin get ready for prime time.
15
Yesterday's Trump spanking was nothing near what he deserves. He calls himself "President" but is little more than a spoiled, entitled, ignorant narcissistic sociopath who, had he been even minimally vetted prior to the 2016 election, would never have been allowed to sit in that seat.
So far he has brought chaos, dishonor, criminal enterprise and constant lying to a job that requires a real human. Pelosi's chastisement, both during and after this staged Trump event, was minimal. She is aware of the gravity of the situation and significance of that level of governance; Trump has no clue - he thinks it's a game show.
Congress has so far, at least the Trumplican tribe, not met their obligations as a co-equal branch of government. They have sold America down the river for personal profit and political power. They ignore the FACT that THEY WORK FOR US. It is well past time to retake our power, fire them and hire people who are fit for their jobs and who care about this country. With the new Democratic House, we are on our way. Let's show them what good governance is and take both the Senate and Executive next time around as well.
14
To paraphrase Barnie Frank, trying to reason with Trump is like trying to reason with a table leg.
Hopeless.
13
After this Trump debacle where he got egg all over his face I doubt we will see anymore public "debates". It will be much easier for him to keep on lying if he doesn't have a live video of him speaking the lie.
11
I guess I can finally forgive Pelosi her "pass" for GWB in 2006, when she took hearings "off the table" about war profiteering and lying us into a war of aggression against Iraq.
Interesting, too, to watch Pence squirm. Was he uncomfortable sitting that close to a woman who is not his wife? Or was he uncomfortable with a woman bearing herself as an equal to a man? It certainly couldn't have been because he was complicit in his boss's "bearing false witness," since he's been a loving participant in that little sin since he sold what was left of his rancid little soul the day he accepted the nomination for VP.
11
Why didn't Pelosi and Schumer ask Trump why he needs $5B when he still says Mexico is going to pay for it. Can't let him move the goal posts. On the other hand, I particularly liked Schumer countering Trump that if he claimed he built such great wall last year with $1.2B why not do the same again. Why $5B. The media should focus on this point and call Trump out on his faulty arguments.
122
@Charles Zee
trump bumped the number up because it is just another construction project to him and why not increase the grift by a few hundred percent? What is a billion or two between plutocrats? trump doesn't get off the toilet unless emoluments are involved, the bigger the better.
7
@Charles Zee-The closer cost estimate is $17 to $21 billion.
5
@Ann, He could outsource the wall to China for much less.
4
Please don't call Donald Trump the leader of the free world. More like the traitor of the free world.
36
@Diane That is why the UK, France, German and most of the EU is chanting "We Want Trump"....
@Eric Clarke Uh, no. No they're not.
4
Great article except: we were informed about what Pelosi, the only woman at the meeting, wore, but not what the men wore. Why is wardrobe news? And if it is, why not describe what the men wore?
45
@Lee Stivers
Because men are sadly constrained by convention to always wear the same, boring outfit: dark suits and white shirts.
Now, if Sen. Schumer, for example, had worn a flashy red sport coat, that would have been worth reporting!
8
@Lee Stivers
Pelosi was wearing red whatever. Schumer was wearing a suit and tie. Trump was wearing nothing. He was caught naked.
6
@Lee Stivers Good catch and amen.
3
Thank you Nancy! You are amazing.
33
For some reaason I never liked her. But I like her now!
19
The same whiny, "democrats have to be careful not to antagonize (place interest group here) and "times pick" quote from a fox news viewer in OHIO. Next up the Times will be back at the Red Hat diner or some such, to ask Trump country if they still love him.
The New York Times has lost its way editorially since the 2016 campaign and hasn't been able to find its footing since. The WaPo has slowly and steadily become the trusted source that the Times was for most of my life. One can only hope that this disturbing trend doesn't persist.
13
Democrats look for a way to compromise their position before any negotiation even takes place. They won the house by a huge margin and are looking for a way to give up theirs power already.
1
I didn't see any mansplaining going on here. Trump endorsed Pelosi for House speaker. I invite liberals to watch this post-election exchange between Barack Obama and John McCain from 2010 over the healthcare issue. Obama calls John by his first name while John McCain calls Obama, "Mr. President." At one point Obama is attempting to cut off John McCain. Was Obama mansplaining John McCain? I don't think so.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KZc-iztdhZY
Why do Trump supporters constantly use Obama as a defense to something Trump has done? It’s like my son saying, “you let my older brother do it ...” When will they learn that we see through charade. Obama is history. Trump is president now.
5
@Mark--According Merriam-Webster, "Mansplaining is, at its core, a very specific thing. It's what occurs when a man talks condescendingly to a woman about something he has incomplete knowledge of, with the mistaken assumption that he knows more about it than the person he's talking to does."
Obama was not mansplaining McCain.
12
@Ms. Pea
If McCain was a woman, would it qualify?
But Ms. Pelosi must also be careful; many of the newly elected Democrats whose support she needs come from districts won by Mr. Trump, and she is walking a fine line in antagonizing him.
Huh? This seems way off...
18
@B What "fine line" do you mean? #45 lost those districts in the midterms! What don't you understand about that?
2
Nancy: the facts, Mr President, the facts.
What a breath of fresh air swept through that room and perhaps this nation.
Too many of his staff and Congressmen have forgotten that facts count in discussions and compromises and legislation.
Facts count, Mr President!
34
@Whatever
Here is a fact, you have to enter the United States LEGALLY. A country without borders is no longer a country. Millions have poured across our southern border illegally.
Build the wall! And lock her up while you are at it!
@Sven Gall How about enforce e-Verify and prosecute violators? That will severely curtail illegal immigration.
3
Nancy standing up to reckless trump for Americans. Thank you, Madam Speaker Pelosi. The US Congress needs to understand that it’s job, as an institution, is to protect all of America and all Americans.
45
Please stop using the the phrase "leader of the free world" as descriptive of this president. Trump does not believe in a free world and he certainly doesn't lead it. He does just the opposite by giving political and diplomatic space to despots and murderers. Other writers do the same here in the NYT and elsewhere out of habit or ignorance. The application of the phrase to Trump cheapens and degrades it to a point where it no longer has meaning. Save it for it a future president who will believe and act accordingly.
55
@Jack B, Jack that's right--the world isn't free without work, money moblity.
To Donald having a woman publicly challenge his manhood and saying she has to act as his Mom to school him must be totally infuriating. If Nancy had faced him in 2016 and not Hillary, I think we would have a highly professional female President.
22
When Trump does his "Nancy" and "Chuck" shtick, they should go right back with "Don." Why does everyone kowtow to him? When he's demeaning, give it right back. Playing into the "respect for the office" baloney only feeds Trump's inflated view of himself, and he certainly shows no respect the office he holds. Just once, I'd like to see him face to face with someone just as rude, argumentative and dismissive as he is. He fears confrontation like nothing else. Faced with a strong adversary, he'd crumple like a kleenex.
23
"... a powerful woman negotiating with the leader of the free world."
What, at that meeting? It has become painfully obvious that POTUS is not leader of the free world. He has repeatedly demonstrated he doesn't understand the concepts of "leader" or free world."
24
Why describe Pelosi's sunglasses and "swingy red coat" without any fashion nods to what the men were wearing? Why bother to describe what the only woman was wearing?
50
@Nancy
Sheryl Gay Stolberg and Annie Karni should be put in the corner facing the wall with dunce caps for their reference to NP's clothing.
But, I must confess, I was pleased to see Mrs. Pelosi in the high collared red coat, looking chic. I'm a man, I like to see a woman, important, or not, dress to advantage. Years ago I took a college professor friend--a woman-- to meet my mentor Dr. Margaret Mead at Columbia University. After meeting MM, my friend's first comment was:" I was really surprised at how well dressed she was, her suit was really very tasteful."
Back in the days of Hillary Clinton's bid for the Presidency, I was always evaluating the way she dressed, whether it sufficiently disguised her advancing widening, whether the pink suit or the black suit were the right choice. I wanted her to look good so she had a better chance of winning. Pulchritude is a huge factor in politics, even among the men.
There have been examples of commentary on the clothing of men in government. There was much comment about Comey's sartorial habits, I recall. Maybe lets talk more about what the men wear, including their wigs. And soon the men will have to start going to the tailor and the hair parlor more often. It might lead to a sartorial/peruke inflation like that of the court of Louis XIV, but first we must tax hair pieces.
Nancy Pelosi has exerted her power in enacting two major political agendas for the country, namely TARP (Bush administration) and Obamacare (Obama administration). No Republican congressional leaders have changed our country like Nancy Pelosi. Trump looks so ignorant of her capability.
27
Mike Pence steals the show!
15
After watching this president attempt to use his demanding tactics in the discussion with the other two leaders, I am left wondering why anyone prefers him as their leader. Debbie Walsh, the director of the Center for American Women and Politics at Rutgers University said that Ms. Pelosi's remarks "speaks to women’s capacity to lead, and to do it civilly, to do it with grace and to be strong and clear.” She was everything that the president was not.
28
These are our petty no class leaders. Wonderful.
1
As adept and poised as soon-to-be Speaker Pelosi was during the circus of their "transparent" meeting yesterday, it was painful to hear what she said about it afterwards.
Rather than characterizing the meeting as a "tinkle battle" and deriding Trump's manhood, it would have been much better if Pelosi had kept her opinions to herself, and simply glowed in the praise of the political acuity she displayed during the meeting.
The needless nastiness of her post-meeting remarks lowered the entire impact of the event. It also adds fuel to the right-wing fire that the Democrats will be organizing a political coup come January. How does she expect the GOP to work with her in a bipartisan way after such petty and demeaning statements?
Her articulate responses to Trump's nonsensical statements were sufficient to show how ill-prepared he was for the meeting, and demonstrated his narcissistic, bullying nature. That was clear enough for the public to see. If Pelosi were truly acting as a "mom" she should have realized that moms generally do know what to say to their children to defuse rather than inflame the rest of the family.
Expressing these after-thoughts was a major faux pas on Pelosi's part - and Trump's GOP "family" only will become more brazen about supporting his avowed shutdown before their control of the Houses ends this month. Sad!
10
@wysiwyg I think you're right, she shouldn't have responded to her instinct to go after The Donald in kind. She should have kept up the "Cool, calm and collected" act. Trump loves to bait people into losing their composure, and her statements after the "meeting" sounded like she just couldn't help herself.
6
Actually, I think we need more of it. Trump’s 1-way street of denigrating nicknames and insults is sadly effective. Time to hit back whenever we want, any way we want.
7
Just the opposite. She is enticing him to continue with childish behavior that plays right into her hands. The more Trump gets exacerbated, to say the least, the more she looks like the leader he is not.
9
Pelosi sounded more like a stern grandmother than a mom. The distinction doesn't really matter though. Trump, like all bratty children, wants to wear the parent down until he gets his way. It's like trying to have a rational conversation with a two year old. You won't get very far.
32
@Andy It really was just another Trumertantrum, for all the world to see.
14
Take notes "boys and girls" this "Mom" knows how to handle a "schoolyard bully" and teach him a modicum of civil order and process ... how our American Democracy functions. If the Executive wants a "show" they will get a true dose of reality once the 116th begins in January.
34
Surely the dems can find a more articulate leader than this. Some of her retorts were just plain incoherent.
Like this gem: “It is not transparency when we are not stipulating to a set of facts and when we want to have a debate with you about saying we confront some of those facts without saying to the public this isn’t true.”
What!? Does that even qualify as English?
Democrats: For the love of your country, find someone with the verbal skills to cogently put this moronic bully in his place. It really shouldn't be that hard.
5
@Drew
Pelosi's remarks are often incoherent. Hard to believe her mind is as garbled as her words.
@Drew She was asking for facts from a man who has too few. This was abundantly clear and beautifully articulated to all clear headed listeners.
18
It was clear. She was politely calling him a liar.
15
Catering to the few at the expense of the many is a fools mission. The major problem with Democrats is they allow those on the fringes, states that can’t take a position, to skew the party goals for the rest. The party needs to have a firm, established base before the venture into the quagmire of grey areas. Giving in to whims before establishing substance makes it easy for republicans to make fools out of Democrats.
2
Pelosi both outclassed and outmatched Trump. What I saw in this exchange was a deeply misogynistic man offended and outraged that a woman dare stand up to him and outwit him. He disgusted me. She, and Schumer, made me proud. It looks like we finally have leadership in our government that is willing to stand up to this bully. About time.
530
Democrat centrists are being sent to Washington to compromise? Compromise what? trump doesn’t compromise...he bleeds you to death with plans that run fully contrary to nearly everything my party is supposed to believe in! He and his absurd agenda needs to be confronted and challenged and ultimately defeated, and if the lemmings in that other party haven’t the backbone, and they do not of course... then the Democrat party will do it! I’m not and never have been, a tree- hugging flaming liberal... just an American senior citizen who’s smart enough to recognize the most serious threat to this country since Buchanan... there are NONE so Blind as those who REFUSE to SEE!
29
This is actually being presented as a news story written by "reporters"? Are you kidding? I guess so, but no worries, nothing important, just our country!
1
“It’s like a manhood thing for him. As if manhood could ever be associated with him. This wall thing,”
“It goes to show you: You get into a tinkle contest with a skunk, you get tinkle all over you.”
Hail to the Skunk-In-Chief !
9
Both Nancy Pelosi & Pres. Trump disclosed public official negligence in promoting their position on border security. Each was proposing political positions with out any study and recommendations by the border security experts.
The smallest local government would not make such a relative tremendous expenditure of taxpayers’ money with out a study.
This is why I remain an independent.
4
@t gallen
Thank you for the false equivalence.
Nancy Pelosi is an expert public policy legislator as a past (and future) House Speaker known for her hard work and preparation and helping people without health insurance.
Donald Trump is an expert bankruptcy-filer known for his intellectual incuriosity and giveaways to the rich.
Your independence appears to be a result of your obliviousness.
61
This is the reason she needs to be Speaker! She has the strength and smarts to stand up to Individual 1!
57
Nancy Pelosi does not have to “walk a fine line” because some “newly elected Democrats whose support she needs come from districts won by Mr. Trump”. Many of the midterm votes were a referendum on Trump; this was an opportunity to show these voters, and the country, that she is not the person the misogynistic right wing has painted her to be. She is a strong, rational, extremely competent woman. And, she was the calmest and clearest person in the room yesterday (for those who spoke).
More Nancy, please.
84
Mr. Schumer was pretty calm, cool, and collected, too.
Pence’s pained face and faux stoicism doesn’t count.
11
I don't understand why Nancy Pelosi is still struggling to have the Speakership, and not Schumer in the Senate. She is tough, intelligent, speaks always appropriately, whereas Schumer no so much.
18
Yes, Pelosi was the Mom and the adult in the room, but Trump still wields most of the power to create Wall Street chaos, tear down environmental regulations, pick judges, appoint a cabinet that does the opposite of it's intended goal, and start international crisis. He even has access to the bomb. Even smart Moms can't control their teens and undo their mischief.
10
If Nancy Pelosi is what the Dems are marching out as it's voice this independent voter will never be swayed.
You can flower the meeting with all the "woman power" commentary but most Americans don't care.
They do care about a secure border though.
21
@Ari Most Americans believe in border security but also understand a $5 billion wall is folly.
102
@Ari not so much. I'd rather spend the billions on infrastructure right in my back yard and patrol the border with drones, as we seem to be able to do elsewhere in the world with some specificity.
84
@Ari In the same meeting, Trump claimed the border was already secure, so why do we need the wall? And why do taxpayers have to pay? That was not the deal or what voters agreed to when he was elected. This loss is going to really hurt Trump
74
I think it is a mischaracterization to suggest Nancy Pelosi was antagonizing - she was civil, measured and offered to have a constructive dialogue. And newly elected members of congress should remember how prior attempts to compromise with the executive branch have gone (they haven't because there is no integrity). Perhaps the two parties can compromise in Congress.
61
One assumes the two women who share the byline for this account have no personal political bias. That certainly didn't come across from the spin they gave this "opinion" piece.
4
@durban5670 Please do "mansplain" to us all exactly where this political bias surfaces in this article. Specific locations and phrases.
15
YOU GO GIRL!! I don't care much for Pelosi, but to see someone--finally!--stand up to Trump's verbal bullying and to match or better him, was amazing. It's about time. I hope she is signalling that the days of all and sundry rolling over for Trump's rude, bullying, misogynist conduct are over.
89
Soon-to-be- Ex-Speaker Ryan - never send a man to do a woman's job. (I feel better about our country already).
142
This is wonderful, Gina Wynn: "Never send a man to do a woman's job." This man loves it--and completely agrees!
24
Trump would be overmatched in any fact contest with Pelosi, which is why he will turn tail and run, lying all the way while his "base" cheers the lies.
63
“According to one Democratic aide in the room, she questioned Mr. Trump’s manhood, calling the wall debate “a manhood thing for him.”
Pelosi needs to give us a trigger warning if she’s going to be sexist.
6
@Midwest Josh
She did not make the comment in front
of Individual 1. Reread the artickr
10
@Maggie - I’m aware of when it was said. Lighten up, I’m just poking fun at our train wreck called Washington DC.
@Midwest Josh Actually seems to be an accurate characterization of what is driving Trump - vis a vis the "wall" and pretty much anything else he wants. That's what his focus on "winning" is about - I don't fault Pelosi for pointing out the obvious.
4
So, after this meeting, the press' reanointed feminist hero ran to a closed door meeting with other Democrats to "regale with stories" using gender stereotypes in making allusions to the President? This is behavior from the age in which polite ladies would retreat to the woman's lounge to gossip with each other, not that of a modern women's icon! No wonder she didn't make these comments for all. Perhaps she should listen to the President when he says "It's called transparency", instead of disappearing to say what she really thinks.
3
This is the least shrinking violet you will ever meet.
15
i wish this tough new yorker would have hit him harder - that his wasteful border wall money could instead go to our crumbling infrastructure, environmental crisis', and proper job training for the unemployed and disenfranchised. i wish she would have called him a flat out racist.
28
Speaker Pelosi, and any Democrat who would oppose her after yesterday is a Republican, did the political equivalent of rubbing the bad doggies nose in his mess and told him "bad boy." It was a joyous moment to see the buffoonish Individual Number One flail around like a petulant child getting sent to time out.
If that meeting is an indicator he is going to REALLY lose it in 3 weeks when a tractor trailer of subpoenas show up at 1600 PA Avenue.
56
@John Nancy Pelosi has been unfairly maligned for years. She is intelligent and articulate. She has always worked hard to support the people's needs, and anyone who looks at her record, rather than right wing attempts to demean her, will understand how fortunate we are to have Nancy on our side. This woman is a hero, the only person who can help us work to have a better, fairer country.
3
I watched the full video of the meeting between President Trump, Ms. Pelosi, and Mr Schumer. Pelosi was condescendingly lecturing Trump also, which this article left out, while characterizing Trump as “mansplaining”. I thought Trump was exasperated by the conversation and was goaded by both Pelosi’s lecturing and Schumer’s shut down trap. Pelosi and Schumer both in my mind showed more adept debating skill than Trump, but I wonder how this will appear to others whose sympathies lie elsewhere.
What shall we call it when a woman condescendingly lectures? There must be a good sexist buzzword for that also.
6
Hmmmm?? Confidence?? Experience?? Strength??
19
@Gary Kedziora It's called educating about how legislating works to someone who appears to not have a clue.
25
@Gary Kedziora. How does one avoid appearing “condescending” when trying to educate someone as intellectually limited as Donald Trump?
25
yeahhhhhhh-hooooooo! I always knew I liked her. That girl's got game. May this be the first of many Nancy vs Donald.
35
It always takes a woman, doesn't it?
44
I can't make sense of the dialogue in this exchange but the still photo does capture the revealing facial expressions and body language of those present, none of which is encouraging.
7
Many people have long condemned Trump for his manner, that it lacks presidential dignity. Although I am often opposed to his policy and actions, I have always had an appreciation for his manner.
I think the public is ill served when our leaders our elevated on a pedestal by the media and by themselves. That is why I prefer the behavior of the British parliament sessions to that of the US House or Senate sessions. I think it is good to see and hear Trump, Pelosi, and Shumer speak publicly to each other in the manner they did. The only way it could have been better would have been if Pelosi would not have repeatedly addressed Trump as "Mr. President" (I don't know if Shumer did, too).
The public is best served if we view our leaders as just regular people, with all the faults and fallibility that every one of us is subject to.
8
The point of saying “mr president” is that there is supposed to be respect inherent in the office . Her repeated use made it more and more clear that he doesn’t deserve respect as a person but that he cannot destroy democracy
20
She was careful to show him respect, which I think is wise and generous.
17
@ryurick @Sean Casey junior
What you have called "respect" really isn't. It is elevating the person because they occupy their office. Real respect would just as much have been shown by addressing the individuals involved as Mr. Trump or as Donald instead of Mr. president, as Mr. Shumer or as Charles instead of Senator Shumer, and as Ms. Pelosi or as Nancy.
The Democrats don’t need to include Trump in the discussions. The House should pass needed legislation-immigration, infrastructure, health care- and let the Republican Senate turn it down and Trump tweet it down.
The Dems MUST take advantage of this situation to show voters they care about everyone and the GOP just caters to the rich.
48
Having Pelosi go toe to toe with him was a lesson in knowledge and experience in what you're doing vs. someone who has very few ideas about what his job is and certainly less about what his duties to the country are. As much as I applaud Pelosi, when one thinks this is the same guy who is supposedly negotiating with the Chinese, Russians and NK, the thoughts are chilling.
89
Ms. Pelosi has given women AND men in politics the courage to rebel against corruption. It can be done and she just proved it; a great example for others to follow. Trump won't know what hit him.
47
I have changed my mind. i want Nancy Pelosi for Speaker of the House. We need someone to finally stand up to Trump. Pelosi can not only do it, she can shut him down with the power that has corrected wayward toddlers for centuries--the mean mom voice.
75
@Jacqueline Gauvin
I do take exception to the adjective "mean". Nothing mean about giving a lesson in civility to a 3 year old having a temper tantrum.
3
Frankly I've never understood the animus that apparently so many people hold toward Nancy Pelosi. Yesterday's media circus starring our current belligerent, clueless president sparing with Ms. Pelosi and Chuck Schumer was a cringe-inducing train wreck of a meeting but in my opinion the victors were Schumer and especially Pelosi. Complain all you want about Senator Schumer's body language and seeming reticence but he got his digs in too. Both were the adults in the room taking on the immature, often incoherent 'Commander-in-Chief'.
46
The show was just a cheap knockoff of The Apprentice. Trump brought in two stage props (Pelosi and Schumer) as a pretext for the supposed display of his majesty and deal-making prowess. The entire reality show conceit is wearing thin. It's hard to believe that anyone on either side of the great divide is still buying it. Trump has finally jumped the shark as a clueless misogynist who thought he could get away with his feeble mansplaining to a seasoned pro who is far superior to him in every category of politics and deal-making. The Trump Show is a tiresome remake of yesterday's news. I give it a half-star star out of ten.
29
‘Don’t Characterize the Strength That I Bring,’ Nancy says.
She might also say, "don't underestimate the strength that I bring" in a nod to those Democrats still wavering on whether or not to elect her House Speaker.
Her response, "then do it", to Trump's taunt that the House Republicans could "easily pass a spending bill that included wall funding", showed a devastating mastery of what's going on in the House.
Right now, she needs to be there. She will then leave "at the top", having secured a solid take-back of the House and having helped identify and nurture a successor.
42
Trump spent five years asserting on the basis of no credible evidencewhatsoever that the first Black President was illegitimate because he wasn’t a natural born citizen. Running against the first woman with a major party nomination for president, he repeatedly charged that she shouldn’t be “allowed” to run because of her unproven criminality. Now, side by side with the person occupying the highest elected position held by a woman in U. S. history, he calls her Nancy and mocks her fight for House leadership. Enough said.
78
@Golden Rose Based on what I noticed in this video I would prefer Trump over Pelosi as to me she is Pathetic in so many ways.She should resign on the grounds that she is not capable.
2
@Edward HC Graydon Ms. Pelosi is not my favorite person, but there is zero doubt that she is a formidable legislator. Please articulate whatever grounds you believe her incapable.
9
The characterization of what happened is reported here with the usual and obvious bias, a trying to build up Nancy Pelosi and somehow push down the President. But no matter how much is tried, this paper will never be able to smear its way into the heart of anyone. And there in lies the difference.
4
@Len
What they don't realize is that for every person who liked seeing the democrats take on Trump, there are two who liked seeing the president challenge democrats on immigration.
2
@Len Do elaborate as the NYT is one of the most respected journals in the world.
11
@Len Mr. Trump requires no help from anyone in making a fool of himself---it is the only aspect of this administration he has under control.
37
DJT wants his devoted fan base to see he's going to build the wall at any and all costs. On the other hand, who else but Ms. Pelosi is brave enough to stand up to the President? The swagger, the lies and fabrications, it has to be corrected. Go Ms. Pelosi!
67
@DR No he doesn't. He wants to change the subject because the news cycle for days was about how much of a criminal he was, and endless stories with legal experts laying out the case for indicting a sitting president.
He must know at this point there will never be a wall. It is pointless, expensive, and if Republicans would not fund it during the 2 years they held both houses of congress there is zero chance of it getting funded now.
20
Truth: I am not a Pelosi fan. New Truth: I am now a Pelosi fan.
83
I had always heard and read of Nancy Pelosi’s brilliance, but I hadn’t really seen it on public display. Most of the times I’ve seen her speak before groups on an impromptu basis, she’s seemed to be searching for the right words and a little doddering.
If what I saw yesterday is the real Pelosi, then I’m totally behind her as House speaker. As for Schumer, he is well beyond his expiration date. It’s time to find some new Senate representation for New York and the nation.
29
@LIChef Shumer is excellent, too. Two great, non-embarrassing politicians. Democrats can be proud.
12
Wrong. Schumer was showing respect for Pelosi and her ability to take on rump. He didn’t feel a need to jump in and speak for her. It was perfect - sure he was dying to have a go too but he knew it was better, visually, to let Nancy have all the fun
11
@LIChef Schumer looked battered in that room. Yes it's time for him to step down, ineffectual and yes man to the president on SCOTUS picks.
1
Pelosi's retort was perfect. She looked like the school teacher admonishing her impudent pupil. Trump will try to recover from yesterday's fiasco by going back out to his hokey rallies and excoriating Pelosi and Schumer, which he doesn't do face to face because he's a paper tiger.
64
I'm sorry to have to say this but I think it needs to be said. I also believe any elementary school teacher or child development specialist would concur. Mr Trump behaved like a three year old in both his verbal and body language. I watched the exchange in disbelief. We are in a perilous time here. The money it would take to build Mr. Trump's memorial to his racist foundations would be better spent on improving people's lives and our crumbling infrastructure.
107
Why is it always democrats that have to "walk a fine line"? What fine line does Trump walk and what harm has it done him that he doesn't walk one?
Pelosi should not care in the least if she antagonizes this man. She should relish antagonizing him if he sets himself up to be antagonized.
When reporters confront this liar with facts, he brushes them away and lies some more. In a dialogue with Ms. Pelosi, the person with whom he must work to get anything done, Trump is diminished by data, belittled by facts. Ms. Pelosi simply had to resort to the weapon of truth, and the bully was abashed.
She won every debate point exactly the way high schoolers win them, with facts and logic, Trump's two greatest enemies.
I recommend the dems now put forth a wall-less border security bill that includes high tech patrolling and ID requirements for employment and services; smart use of border forces; and appropriate penalties for illegal crossings and illegal hiring practices.
Then challenge Trump to shut down the government over his vaunted wall.
95
@Victor A much easier solution would be to announce that as of 06/01/19 fines starting at 10k will be levied on ANY and ALL businesses found to be hiring illegals. NO excuses
3
Nancy didn't appear strong and unwavering at all. I think that's what you wanted to have happened, but here's what actually happened: The two men spoke over her, didn't acknowledge her, talked down to her and were disrespectful. Embarrassing for everyone to watch the pathetic display on TV.
64
That is not a reflection on her. It is a reflection on them
73
@Amy what were you watching? sorry to disagree here, but Nancy did extremely well holding her own and then some. indeed, had Hillary done this in her debates it very well may have made a difference in the election.
94
@Amy
Mansplaining at its finest.
57
How can Saturday Night Live satirize yesterday's meeting? The image of Mike Pence as a motionless dummy, Trump repeatedly lying and interrupting Nancy Pelosi, yet another scene of Trump behaving like a toddler who wants all the toys, and the possible dawning in Trump's dim consciousness that he will actually face people who will call him on his lies and illegalities, all out there for us to see.
The few times Trump meets in public with anyone who is not worshiping at his altar, we have a scene of unbelievable incompetence and petulance. There is clearly no way to invent a more absurd and terrifying character than the most powerful man in the world clearly being the emperor with no clothes.
189
How to satirize live satire? I don't envy the SNL writers. The actual meeting was a skit in itself. For the writers to make it their own, maybe dress 'em all in bee suits?
5
Wow, all she has going for her is a shutdown of America. Just what Trump want. Playing into his strong suit.
3
@Ryan
Schumer was trying to use the "shutdown" narrative against Trump, repeating the word several times. He didn't realize that Trump had not only stolen it from him but hit him over the head with it.
The top 2 democrats still don't realize whom they are dealing with. They keep using an old playbook against him.
1
@Ryan Wasn’t Pelosi who talked shutdown.
5
@ryan @acnyy apparently you have no understanding of what a shutdown does. Even trump has that basic understanding. It is not something he wants to “own”
8
Pelosi is a first generation feminist; she knows how to take on Pinocchio. She might be exactly the right house speaker after all.
66
Clearly Trump’s “transparency” gets shuttled out the door when he’s made to look like the fool he is.
39
Pelosi demonstrated quite convincingly that she has "the right stuff". Experience counts.
98
Speaking from the left, I think the newly-elected Dem Reps should support Pelosi, apprentice themselves to her, and prepare for the most-powerful possible handoff when she’s ready to retire. What a resource she is!
143
Article maintains a focus on gender-- Trump's mansplaining, Pelosi's command of legislating-- and then at the last moment, the final sentence informs us "White House aides shooed the cameramen out the door.
13
To bad the technology leaders in this country are so weak. They show up to meetings and kowtow. Pelosi did a great job.
31
What we saw yesterday was the Nancy Pelosi’s Art of Politics and Legislative Maneuvering that beats Donald’s The Art of the Deal hands down.
108
@Anupam T
Trump’s “art” when it comes to deal making is having a few cards up his sleeve and a deck of marked cards.
Even then he can’t win whenever playing against someone with even a modicum of skill, much less when encountering someone with the stature and skill of Speaker Pelosi.
3
I don't believe we have a "border security" problem. We are purposely causing a bottleneck at the border because of Trump's play-acting about protecting the country. His bullying and threatening made him look weak and obstinate. Yes childish.
53
Pelosi was wonderful.
She stood up to Trump without losing her dignity or cool - she refused to be baited by someone who was obviously behaving badly.
With her intelligence showing, she calmly handled a man who was trying to sell the country a bill of goods.
Pelosi was a wonder to watch - loved every minute of it.
Made this woman very proud.
184
Anyone who has confronted a bully knows that step one is to give it back as good as it is given. What happens next is TBD.
What I’ve experienced is, some bullies once confronted back down because they are insecure. The graveyard is full of people who haven’t been able up to stand up the Donald. I have wondered when will someone would do that to set precedent? I’m not a big NP fan, but god bless her for showing the world enough is enough. God bless her for demonstrating she just may be the right person to lead the legislature in backbone and regaining our constitutional balance of power.
89
The Democrats gave Iran $150B and more money on pallets. Why not give Trump and America a measly $5B for border security?
10
@Scott K
The Democrats don't won't to be blamed for causing Trump to fail in his election promise that he emblazoned across nearly all of his campaign speeches that Mexico will pay for the wall. Why would Nancy Pelosi do such a thing, and cause Trump to fail his campaign promise, by giving Trump money from the American people, that Trump clearly stated that Mexico would finance?
20
Whatever money Iran gained access to from sanction relief was theirs in the first place. The Democrats didn’t “give” it to them. The nuclear agreement was a multi party agreement that everyone but you & Trump agrees Iran has kept, unlike North Korea who has agreed to nothing of importance and continues to expand their already existing program. But you know what they say, 5 billion here, 5 billion there and pretty soon it adds up to real biggly money.
46
That was already their money, not ours. Those were frozen assets the US had held, and released upon the negotiated nuclear agreement, which Trump has dismantled.
45
I think what is most striking about this interchange is how totally horrified/embarrassed/uncomfortable Mike Pence looks throughout it.
44
@Crybaby How can anyone tell how he feels? His face shows nothing. Did he even move during the taping? Oh yes, I think I saw his hand swivel to Pelosi.
4
Trump will not enjoy Pelosi. He dislikes women who talk back to him.
Pelosi is a confident, articulate and dignified politician who knows how to talk to a childish bully with class.
She should have leaned over before the cameras started rolling to shake-up Trump asking, "Do you want to give me your tax returns after this meeting or when we subpoena them in January?"
171
@Jose Pieste Those two have nothing in common except that they are women.
4
@Jose Pieste He lost the popular vote, so yes he did have trouble.
13
@Question Everything
Seems to me he dislikes women who talk......period.
3
As Lawrence O'Donnell quipped on MSNBC last night, Chuck and Nancy should have repeatedly reminded the skunk that the Mexicans were going to pay for the wall.
"We believed you, Mr. President. We're just waiting for the the check."
34
Finally, a strong, rational, seasoned leader who doesn't kowtow to Trump. And, she stands up to him with intelligence, grace, exemplifying true leadership. Thank you Nancy Pelosi.
222
Please be more careful in your wording. Saying Trump "prides himself on his negotiating skills" assumes he has such skills. He has given us ample evidence throughout his time in office (and before) that he is, in fact, a lousy negotiator, ignorant of the issues being discussed, incapable of subtlety, impatient of results. His "skills" run to bullying and blustering and very little else. A more accurate formulation would have been "Mr. Trump, who claims to be a great negotiator."
101
@che, Whatever works, and it does.
I have evolved. Nancy should be elected Speaker.
226
@Renaissance Lost.
Welcome aboard. But if evolution prevails Ms. Pelosi should become President.
Oops, I forgot. Evolution isn’t necessarily progressive. But at least it involves change. That ain’t gonna happen with ole infinite pinocchio, nor his sidekick, silently waiting in the wings, hoping.......
4
"...a behind-the-scenes peek at a powerful woman negotiating with the leader of the free world"
The NYTimes should note that the leader of the free world has been a woman for almost two years now. Angela Merkel will be sorely missed.
212
I wish she and Schumer and the other Democratic leaders would stop speaking Senate Speak and address the nation and the President more plainly--though still politely. Members of the younger generation like Rep. Eric Swallwell and Senator Kamela Harris are much more direct and forceful.
4
She was speaking reality of how to legislate. That is not "Senate speak" and completely understandable to those of us not in government. She was also careful about the "presidency"itself, which has been debased by shut-down Trump.
51
If Don and Mike are impeached, Nancy will be the first female president, whether our sexist country can handle it or not.
Wait, does that mean that all SCOTUS appointees in the past 2 years would be illegitimate too?
56
Dear NYT, please stop calling this President “the leader of the free world”. He isn’t. He doesn’t even try to be representative of half of America, let alone Europe and our other allies.
The next President, whoever and whenever that is, will now have a Herculean task reviving the very concept of a “free world” working together. So please stop giving this man credit for something he is actively tearing down.
395
Exactly this. Thank you @Charlie!
27
@Charlie
I think until a Democrat is back in the White House, the US Presidency should be referred to as "The Political Role Formerly Known as the Leader of the Free World."
Or simply as a squiggle.
9
@Charlie- Right. The NYT was trying to give Trump credit for a position that he does not deserve to dramatize his importance versus hers and her bravery speaking up to the "Grand Poobah". The fact is she is much more of a leader and Trump looked very small, unreasoning and stubborn.
3
It was when a furious trump looked over at Schumer and, pointing at Pelosi huffed, “What are you going to do about this?” That said it all for me.
In trump’s world Women say things but men are in charge. Be prepared for tantrums and tweetrums galore.
Go Nancy Pelosi and all our strong women in Washington. I’m laying in a supply of popcorn.
575
@Catherine
Right? And the best part was Schumer looking as if he was ready to burst out laughing at any second.
19
A further correction is required. Very few outside of the United States would ever consider the current president as "the leader of the free world", and I suspect that many within the US would feel the same. It is presumptious to assume this position. It must be earned.
157
Unrelenting professionalism. Thank you Nancy Pelosi. History will treat her kindly.
84
I hope she was able to rephrase her statement in a simpler way. I am sure he did not understand what she meant.
27
I am so proud of Nancy Pelosi for standing up to this man who lies with impunity and is a disgrace to the office. She has shown everyone, not just women, what it means to be qualified and tough and all of the demonizing she has suffered by the republican propagandists haven't stopped her at all. Now our newly-elected congressmen and women, including my own for whom I voted, Alyssa Slotkin, need to stop undercutting her and playing to the republicans' hand. We did NOT vote her in to do nothing and that includes supporting every hearing and subpoena that needs to be done by the House to get to the truth about any criminal conduct by Donald Trump. She and the other new representatives need to listen, learn and get to work and not become a divisive force.
100
@fg I voted for Slotkin and I hope she does challenge the old order. I think the House has to take back its traditional role of oversight and I hope there are hearings about everything the GOP has ignored or acquiesced to. In effect, you seem to be asking Slotkin et al. to be quiet, go along to get along, and wait their turn. And how long exactly should that be?
2
@Viking, they haven't even been sworn in yet and it is clear that Nancy Pelosi intends that the dems will challenge Trump and the House needs that status and experience for now. Also, Slotkin did in fact play the republicans' game when they demonized Pelosi, a particularly misogynistic attack line. I am certainly not saying they should go along to get along but certainly not go along with the republicans.
26
I thought that she let Trump interrupt her and talk over her way too much. Sure, its fine to let him dig his own grave, but for the TV audience, she did not have the presence that Trump had, mainly because of her softer voice. Schumer was much more forceful, although I could have done without the smirk. The whole thing was a show put on by Trump, and once again he proved to be adept at showmanship.
4
@Doug, What is it with men making judgments about women because of their voice? If she'd spoken more loudly you would have said it was "unprofessional for a woman to speak that way."
Tip: Listen to what women SAY, not how their voices sound.
Trump's "showmanship" is all incompetence. If his IQ is above 90 I'd be stunned.
21
So, Trump and Pelosi talked publicly for 15 minutes about Trump's wall. It sounds like Trump is still setting the agenda for the media. We need a public questioning of Trump about many things (if not an actual public spanking). When is that coming?
11
@Gregory Scott Nass Yes, and I remember him stating Mexico would pay for it, not us.
2
The problem with Trump from my POV, in this regard, is related to the fact that your President is both the chief and head of state. Thus commanding respect for the office over and above that of say one who is "prime minister" of a country - it's not been an issue like it is now, or at all by comparison, in the past, because the person occupying the office, regardless of political leanings, has on a basic level had respect for its traditions and conventions in terms of proper behavior. So doesn't require the sort of opposition that Trump blatantly does to keep him in check. It sort of illustrates rather well, the benefit of a constitutional monarchy of the sort we have in the UK - in that the Queen gets all the respect but doesn't say anything politically (that she isn't given to say), whereas the PM can get a battering as he or she is not the head of state. Thankfully we've never had a PM (that I know of) that has behaved anywhere near as poorly as Trump has done anyway. It would be nearly as outrageous here all the same but they wouldn't last long I'd bet. It also demonstrates that aspect of his abuse of office in shielding himself from legitimate robust opposition from Democrats who may understandably feel somewhat ill at ease in laying into him given his title. They do not wish to be seen to be demeaning the office like he does. They must push the boundaries to defend the integrity of the office however, as he apparently has no care for it.
9
What an excellent illustration of the simple fact that a woman with experience is not going to be intimidated by any man acting in a authoritarian way. Some times it is necessary for such staging to occur to illustrate to the entire country that women will no longer remain in the shadows when it comes to fighting to save the country.
76
@Tom Osterman
why does everything have to be about gender?
3
@gloria because it is, as demonstrated by how trumpf deals with women
7
Nancy Pelosi proved one thing: she's way better at this than an amateur, has more spine than Mitch McConnell and Paul Ryan combined, and as long as she's around, the best interests of We the People will be her true north. It took a woman from much maligned San Francisco to finally stand up for American values and responsibility. It was embarrassingly clear who in the Oval Office yesterday truly had the talent to be president.
412
This was a big mistake on Trump's part, aptly seized upon by Pelosi and Schumer, who played him to great advantage. And it will prove to be a turning point in future negotiations between the two parties. Keeping in mind that we are still weeks out from the new Congress even beginning, I think that, in a way that matters more than appearances, much was achieved.
This was a clarion call, announcing the importance of experience, to those who need that lesson.
67
What Ms. Pelosi and Mr. Schumer failed to do in the meeting was to repeatedly, repeatedly, repeatedly question Trump:
Did you lie to America Mr. Trump when you said Mexico will pay for the wall?
Why do you insist on making hard working Americans, farmers, police officers, fire fighters, our military service men and women, Walmart cashiers and bus drivers pay for your wall Mr. Trump? The wall you promised them Mexico was going to pay for.
Why Mr. Trump did you beg former President Enrique Peña Nieto to stop saying Mexico will not pay for your wall?
Democrats must not let Trump get away from his promise to make Mexico pay for the wall. They must remind Americans that Trump is trying to make them pay for the wall.
103
@JABarry Exactly. They could have challenged him and still been respectful. Instead, they end up playing the game by his rules and making meager gains.
5
@JABarry
Trump could also have asked Pelosi to explain her view that the wall is "immoral". Trump's critics don't realize democrats have given him plenty of ammunition when it comes to immigration.
1
Perhaps it is time that someone "talked-back" to Trump. He does have a certain amount of authority as President but that does not excuse bad behavior.
Generally there's not much to be gained by getting into a shouting match, but this is certainly an exception.
29
@David Clark, He has no real authority. He's a game show host.
8
Nancy Pelosi showed that she is a leader - for Dems and for GOP. Trump has sniveling cowards propping him up. It is fitting that Pelosi rationally and persistently brushed him back. It takes a woman to stand up to a narcissistic man-child.
381
I was driving behind a pick up truck on the highway last night that had multiple Trump, Republican, and 2nd Amendment bumper stickers. One read “We have the 1st Amendment because of the 2nd” with a gun pointing in the direction of the 1st. All I could think was “Wow, this guy is scary and WRONG.”
Watching Trump’s exchange with Pelosi and Schumer, I say again, “Wow, this president is TERRIFYING and SO, SO WRONG!”
113
Very impressive performance by Mrs. Pelosi. However, I do hope that she, the Democratic Party and the liberal press including the NYT don't get goaded too much into a debate about fringe issues such as the wall or Trump's behaviour if that would distract from debating and finding solutions to the issues the average voter who voted for Trump in 2016 is really concerned about, e.g. stagnant incomes, wealth inequality, poor prospects for their children, etc.
28
Good for Ms. Pelosi! She wasn't on-mic and was difficult to hear, but she got her points across. Two comments I wish she and Schumer had made:
"This is government, not a reality TV show"
"Why isn't Mexico paying for the wall as you promised?"
123
Tom, I'd add a 3rd. They should have turned to the prop in the corner and asked: "Mr. Vice President, your thoughts, please?"
17
@FL Sunshine Every time I see Pence I'm reminded of an undertaker.
14
I feel certain that Trump is convinced that he came out of this incident looking competent and powerful-----further and convincing evidence of his delusional state.
64
We know from numerous instances in the past that Donald Trump thinks women are inferior creatures that should not be taken seriously, so of course it is strong women like Stormy Daniels and Nancy Pelosi who are the ones that bring him down.
30
@New York Times: This confrontation between Nancy Pelosi and Mr Trump is not about gender, it’s about the spine and strength she exhibits as a leader , to stand up to him - as few people have - at least publicly.
319
There he goes, with the crossed-arms again. Works for any occasion.
29
@Bill Wilkerson
"Crossed arms" are a sign of weakness and vulnerability
58
@William
protecting himself from perceived threats, real or not, with his arms.
15
Trump played true to form, using bullying, intimidation and false “facts” to drive his agenda, but he was outmaneuvered by “Chuck and Nancy.” Watching him sit there thrusting his chin toward them made him come across as a caricature. He really can’t handle situations when he isn’t allowed to get away with his silly insults, can he?
349
@Ed M right! and watching pence sitting there like drying paint was no doubt his typical toadying stance in front of of his bully boss.
28
We’ve all seen pieces from Trump’s “living room” so to speak, but yesterday’s show was unprecedented.
Donald Trump had no idea what it meant to be president. He had no legislative training, no legal education. He had no demeanor for the job. He basically hated Barack Obama and wanted to “show him up at Obama’s game” as being president. That was the mindset of Donald Trump. So he spent a lot of his own money, ran his own planes, and spoke to cheering crowd after crowd and went on to make his way to the Oval Office.
What Trump didn’t count on was having to deal with Nancy Pelosi like he did yesterday. What a holiday gift from Pelosi we were able to see! The woman knows politics. The woman knows herself and believes in herself. The woman has Trump figured out and is not afraid.
I remember seeing pictures of President Obama when he signed the ACA - for me as a nurse, one of my best days in history, March, 2010. Who was there with him? Nancy Pelosi. She’s fought for this country. It was on her face, it’s in her soul. She’s been doing it a long time and the likes of Donald Trump is not about to stop her.
Maybe Trump is used to schmoozing women - Melania, the Betsy DeVos’s and women of his Cabinet, the wives of dignitaries, his immigrant undocumented female workers, but it is not going to work with Nancy Pelosi.
And new women coming into the legislative seats in Congress - don’t try to get rid of Pelosi - step back and learn from her. Now’s your chance.
1171
Frankly an unexpected gift given Pelosi's opening messages of willingness to still work with the GOP trolls after Election Day—and one I'm VERY happy to find under the tree.
Nevertheless, she persisted.
144
@MIMA
A small quibble, Corrupt Donnie didn't spend his own money. He accepted millions of in-kind funds from the Russians via their illegal, coordination of marketing support, he spent $30 million Russian dollars funneled through the NRA, millions of Republican Party funds, and millions of funds donated but those who were looking to shake up the system.
As to Speeker-in-Waiting Pelosi, she will go down in history as his nemesis and a great political figure.
143
@MIMA
Pelosi is a breath of fresh air after two years of Good Ole (Boys Club) Party failure to check the Oval Office.
Kudos Nancy on standing up to this tyrannical bully who is a blemish on the grand office he holds.
For now.
158
Trump showed here what a rank amateur he is as a negotiator - this is probably what he looked like when he wildly overpaid for the Plaza Hotel many years ago. I laughed at him then and now can only pray that he is gone soon. No wonder no one in their right mind wants Kelly’s chief of staff position.
If Trump is doing our bidding internationally with these kind of tactics against world leaders we might as well have him playing a young Kasparov in chess. Good grief.
75
I think the new Congress should give Trump the $5 billion he wants for the wall. That would take the issue off the table - no more “build the wall” chants at his taxpayer-funded rallies. Then every day - every day - Ds could ask “when is Mexico going to pay for the wall, Mr. President? You promised Mexico would pay for the wall.”
7
@Matt
He will reply with "NAFTA-2". Be careful.
4
@Matt Congress should never give into Trump's ignorant ways to waste tax payer money.
9
Likewise, the Times shouldn’t characterize the strength the Blue Wave brought to the table as a choice between “compromise” and “a fight.” There is holding steady to your values, to doing your best for the American people. Nancy showed that Congress can go back to doing that. She doesn’t need to be careful; she needs to keep up the good work.
385
So, the President bluffs and lies. The Speaker elect calls his bluff and suggests he go for a vote if he's telling the Truth.
The president bluffs and lies again. The Speaker elect calls his bluff again.
Repeat ad infinitum.
Conclusion 1) the President doesn't know he can't pass his plans in the House, 2) the President had no fall back negotiating position, and 3) the President believes that shouting a lot will get him what he wants.
Result; the president shoots the GOP in the foot and publicly announces he, and they, will be responsible for the shutdown of a government where they control the Presidency, Senate and House.
Goodness knows how he 'negotiates' behind closed doors, but its no wonder the results are no help to America.
272
About time Ms. Pelosi showed her mettle! A prelude of what is going to happen in January when Democrats are going to run the House. Trump can't always have the cake and eat it.
46
But Mr. Trump barreled ahead. “It’s not bad, Nancy, it’s called transparency,” he told her.
Ms. Pelosi shot back, “It is not transparency when we are not stipulating to a set of facts and when we want to have a debate with you about saying we confront some of those facts without saying to the public this isn’t true.”
Enhanced translation :
"Mr President, if transparency you want, so be it. On this issue, as on so many others, you are either mistaken, or you are lying. We suggest that it would be less embarrassing for you to clarify which it is, in private."
I'm afraid Pelosi's "shot", as delivered, is about as effective as a spray of popcorn.
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@Ewan Coffey As she explained later, she basically didn't want to tell him in front of the cameras that the "figures" he brought to the argument were fabrications/lies. Something about respect for the office (certainly not for him).
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"Don't characterize the strength that I bring". That is certainly not meant to be easily understood.
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I assume she meant “mischaracterize”.
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"...a behind-the-scenes peek at a powerful woman negotiating with the leader of the free world"
The NYT should stop using that erstwhile title for the US President. Many, if not most, of the free world have repudiated the notion that Trump leads them.
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Certainly, our "dishonest and weak" Prime Minister Trudeau is not to his liking, but it evens out since an overwhelming number of Canadians don't care for that old grifter either. Alas, the United States is no longer a leader of the free world. The President appreciates tyrants. You might as well say Putin is the leader of the free world. President Trump and "free" anything is an oxymoron.
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@Anita Putin by definition can't be the leader of a "free world." At this point, it's Merkel, soon to be replaced in that role by Macron. And the world will be better off for it.
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@Chris Bowling we all can agree at least that it is not Mr. Trump. Barak Obama still holds more respect and influence outside of the United States in what i would call the free world. Too bad that you don't have our process where a lack of confidence of 15% of his party would trigger a leadership contest.
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It is a sample case of an Uneducated and Unprecedented President being schooled by "Mom" in front of the camera.
Welcome to the new era of Washington's politics Donald!
Transparency is not about showing the rude character in front of TV but being truthful and showing the facts including both good and bad for the public. If one is faking the facts in front of the reporters and telling them you all are fake news, it is simply a trade mark of an uneducated macho trying to do a demanding job without knowing how to do it.
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Pelosi should have been delighted to have this meeting in public. Now she has Trump taking ownership on record of any shutdown.
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@Dana Charbonneau, Trump doesn't take ownership of anything he says -- it's lies and gaslighting all the way down. He contradicts himself weekly, daily, and sometimes within hours and minutes of the previous utterance.
He runs his operations (personal, business, & gov't) with chaos and confusion to try and get what he wants.
That Ryan and McConnell let him get away with this over there in the legislature is their failure and their shame, nobody else's.
Pelosi, by standing up to him like, *cough*, an adult, lets us all know that We the People have someone who will at the very least try to represent our viewpoints.
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The facts, the rule of law, and the Constitution are the pillars behind the Democrats now as the Republicans have abdicated all of the above. Never let the Rs claim othwise. Go Ms. Speaker!
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I am a liberal and admire Rep. Pelosi very much, but her comment about Trump’s manhood was way out of line. If Trump had made a similar comment about Pelosi, all the feminists and #MeToo-ers would be up in arms.
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Except she’s right on the money with that manhood comment. Trump deserves no sympathy and he doesn’t get to be the only one with a sharp tongue.
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Totally wrong. She stood up against our man-child president and just stated a simple fact about his ridiculous position on a border wall.
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@Miriam Chua
I think that time for being polite over being honest has long past. At least she said it behind closed doors.
PS. I am sure trump is saying much, much worst about Pelosi. I'll bet they can hear him screaming from down the hall.
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