And why should humankind in any way depend on the United States.
6
This murderous thug MBS cannot be allowed to anymore buy our government along with the UAE and Israel lobbies who subverted our elections in 2016.
5
Susan, Saudi Arabia stands as a bulwark against Iran and Russia.
Do you know why oil futures are tanking? It's because Traitor Trump and Prince Jared's mentors are dumping oil on the world market.
Why are the doing that? Because these two third world countries have nothing to sell other than oil, gas, vodka, and pistachio nuts.
"....that is all/Ye know on earth, and all ye need to know."
2
Yeah, we get it. You guys love Iran. The good news is you aren't in office anymore.
2
Obviously Trump’s and Kushner’s support for the House of Saud is nothing short of sickening. But what was your excuse since the administration you served under also supplied lethal weapons to the Saudis when they first began their carpet bombing blitz in Yemen? And didn’t the Obama administration also launch thousands of deadly drone strikes in Yemen (as well as Afghanistan, Syria, Iraq, Somalia, Libya, and Pakistan) that killled countless innocent civilians, including women and children? I’m sorry, Ms. Rice, but you really don’t have much credibility when it comes to lecturing about foreign policy practices that actually value human rights/human life.
5
I still can’t believe the US leans towards Saudi Arabia rather than Iran. It’ll take 300 years for Saudia Arabia to join the modern world.
12
Susan E. Rice, she has a fine intellect and much experience in American and World affairs. Perhaps if we could somehow give Susan a hint: please, consider running for POTUS...Susan's essays are some of the most coherent I've ever read.
3
Unfortunately, as long as President Donald Trump is enamored with gold trappings and peculiar balls that light up to bring magic to anyone who lays hands, there will be no changes. Obviously, selling armaments with the absurd claim that it will bring 10 million jobs to the United States is more important than a moral stance that would protect humanity.
And yes, Mr. Kushner should be sent home.
6
Trump's only plan for his re-election campaign - and let's face it, Trump has done nothing but campaign since he was elected to office, he has taken no part at all in the administration of the country apart from signing what Senate Republicans tell him to sign - is to start a war with Iran so he can run for re-election as a "war president", following the example of Dopey Dubya.
So forget all about America taking any action at all about anything that MBS has done or will do. Trump needs MBS more than MBS needs Trump, so protests against the way Trump deals with the Saudis and their constant and blatant criminality are just so much wasted breath. There is the hope that House Democrats will exert some control over Trump next year, but I will only believe that when I see it.
The people who are paid to write for The New York Times must be forced or desperate enough to agree never to actually confront the obvious when they write about Trump. The Times maintains a very complex relationship with power and that is being laid bare by Trump, who treats The Times with contempt because the NYT editors have demonstrated they are totally unable or unwilling to confront him.
Trump is going to start an election stunt war against Iran sometime in the next 12 months. He will do it with a nuclear strike against Iranian nuclear facilities, justifying the first use of nukes since Nagasaki by saying "the fallout was going to be radioactive anyway." And The Times is going to just watch it happen.
2
Something tells me that Trump would only use Susan Rice's advice to justify doing the precise opposite.
Sad!
2
Interestingly, Ms. Rice had a different opinion of how to engage with the Saudis during the Obama adminstration's time on station.
I guess she woke up one morning having an epihany, but not until after a Republican adminstration was in place and having to deal with the mess she helped create.
3
For some reason while reading this article the Seinfeld episode where George does the opposite of his normal behavior, to better results than he usually gets. Is this an 'opposite' piece? Is Trump supposed to read this and do the opposite? What would the opposite of what Rice suggests be?
1
At the end of this article Ms. Rice makes 6 'should' suggestions of U.S. policy changes. It's wishful thinking at it's best and just Alice-in-Wonderland thinking at worst. It ain't gonna happen with the rogue administration in place here. We've fallen into the rabbit hole...
Time to realize that Mr. Bone Saw, and his family are NOT allies of the United States. Matter of fact, with ‘friends’ like these, who needs enemies.
Never forget 9/11.
9
Susan Rice is the last person who should be judging world leaders. She worked for one of the worst leaders whose policies almost ruined the USA. MBS may not be a good person, but compared to Susan Rice, he is almost a Saint.
1
I find it curious that the Times continues to publish the opinions of Susan Rice, who over years of government service, has shown that she is inept, with everything she touches turning out badly. She's been so bad that she couldn't get confirmed as Secretary of State. There are plenty of other voices, liberal voices if necessary, that carry more weight and legitimacy. This one isn't worth reading.
4
Appoint an ambassador? That will give him a strong message? The Obama crowd still can't get it right, which is why the deluded masses voted for Trump.
Get all Saudi diplomats out of the US and recall all US diplomatic personnel from Arabia. Put all US military personnel on alert until they can be evacuated. Tell all US businesses that they deal with the Saudis at their own risk - and tell the Bushes that the US no longer will protect their investments in Arabia. Tell the king that the Ottomans did a better job.
Tell the Israelis that they are cozy with the wrong gang. And And remind the Persians what happened when Alexander decided that Greece was not enough.
2
The Saudi behavior in Yemen reminds me of the US behavior in Vietnam.
6
Great sentiments, but Trump and Kushner have already stated that money is all that matters. The lives being destroyed are not their concern. I mean Trump does not even care about the Americans who are being killed in the United States due in part to his hateful rhetoric.
2
"The Saudi-led coalition .. shares direct responsibility, along with the Houthi rebels and Iran, for the worst humanitarian crisis in the world, while the US has shamelessly continued to provide support to their bloody war."
If you have not noticed, Ms. Rice deploys her diplomatic skills to play on words here. By criticizing the US separately in the above statement, she excludes the US from: 1) being part of the "Saudi-led coalition"; and, 2) sharing "direct responsibility" for that war. But, as it is the US diplomatic corp's mantra, she gives Iran "direct responsibility" for the war, partly to further tarnish Tehran's regime and, in part, explain the "Saudi-led coalition" defeat at the hands of a rag-tag rebel army.
As a respected diplomat, one has to expect much more rectitude from Ms. Rice. She is well aware of the fact that the US is, and has been supplying the Saudis its most modern, lethal, arms worth billions of dollars. And, it is the direct US help in the form of intelligence gathering, target selection, and mid-air fueling that has kept that war going. In contrast, no Iranian military or para-military forces have been helping the rebels nor there has been any Iranian made arms used in that war (the NYT debunked alleged use of Iranian-made missiles by rebels: "U.S. Accuses Iran of U.N. Violation, but Evidence Falls Short"; 12/14/2017 ).
One has to wonder if Ms. Rice is actually interested in ending the war in Yemen or is pursuing another agenda here.
4
We will never be able to have a healthy relationship with Saudi Arabia. It's time to cut the cord, unfortunately this will not happen. As long as there are billions of dollars to be made, the powers that be will not care about anything else. Our involvement and acceptance of the slaughter in Yemen should tell all of us who we are as a nation. It tells us that money, not human rights or the right to life, is more important. The disgustingly, disturbing and horrendous murder of Jamal Khasoggi is already fading from the news. Until we as a nation reset our moral compass there is no hope for change. We need to understand that to many in power, money is more important than anything else. It's tragic, it needs to change and it will change only if we change ourselves and learn to value humanity more. I fear we will allow a lot more suffering until that happens. Maybe it is us that needs to suffer more, and only then will we care enough to demand change.
3
Money can't buy love. But it can buy everything else.
I wonder if those selling billions of dollars of highly advanced US arms to Saudis have ever considered the possibility of a "violent revolution" in Saudi Arabia, forcing the current King and princes out of the country and bringing a virulently anti-US, ISIS-type, regime to power.
Clearly, the US politicians must believe that everything is under control in Saudi Arabia and there can be no upheaval there. But, did not they think exactly the same way about Iran in the past? If not mistaken, the King of Iran had a CIA-trained secret police that kept tight control on everything within that country. And, there were US politicians who called Iran "an island of stability" in Middle East. But that did not stop Iranian to have their "Islamic Revolution" and turn anti-US.
If one thinks history repeats itself, one should be worried of selling modern, sophisticated, arms to Saudis, lest one day they can be used against the US military.
4
I find myself wanting to know more about the Crown Prince's personal and family life - which might well shed a lot of light on his other behaviors. Does he have a wife or wives? How many children? Is he close to any other members of the royal family? In mentions of all those close to him so far, none have sounded like equals or advisors. Where was he educated? What did he study? Besides spending hundreds of millions on yachts, paintings and palaces, what does he enjoy? How can we get through to him in a different way?
1
Dr. Rice is talking policy and having good allies. She is missing the point. Trump's relationship with Prince Mohammed is all about money for the Trump and Kushner empires, not about what is good for the USA.
4
To add to the list of Susan Rice's "musts", I suggest that we must make absolutely sure that there are no on-going or future financial relationships between the Trump and Kushner families and any Saudi person or entity.
"We should not rupture our important relationship with the kingdom"
Yes, we should. This piece by Susan Rice fails to get to the core of the problem, which is not any particular Saudi leader, but the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia itself. The U.S. relationship with Saudi Arabia is absolutely repulsive. Speak to any U.S. citizen outside the foreign policy establishment or big businesses involved, and you will not find even one who will express the notion that cozy relations with Saudi Arabia are in the interest of the American people. From a strategic perspective, Saudi Arabia is not a real partner to the U.S. It is difficult to see anywhere where the relationship with the Saudis has advanced U.S. interests or preferences. Where? Yemen? Syria? Palestine? Egypt? The relationship is only based on pure greed and profits for the U.S. defense and energy sectors, while on the Saudi side we are building up a massive arsenal - perhaps a nuclear one if the Trump administration reaches a nuclear agreement with Saudi - and enriching and empowering an absolute monarchy and Islamic extremist state.
5
President Trump recalibrate policy to serve national rather than personal interests? Good luck with that.
So what do you really suggest?
It would be hard to find an American president who has been able to successfully navigate the complexity of the Middle East. Even with good intentions, they’ve all done things that haven’t turned out as expected. Everyone… absolutely everyone… knows the Middle East is complicated.
But not Donald Trump. With a depth of knowledge and understanding no deeper than a puddle, he charged into the region and declared friends and foes. With no understanding of any complexities, he declared we’re with some and against others. With no understanding of US needs, he declared enemies he had to walk back and gave BFF status to others he should walk back.
There are reasons why it’s so easy to get things wrong in the Middle East. But we’ve never had such a reckless president who thinks he can solve everything without a molecule of understanding. There’s no way for this to turn out well.
1
"Finally, we should stop following Prince Mohammed down blind alleys and bring a healthy skepticism to our dealings with him, particularly any that require relying on his word or judgment."
So true, and the same can be said about Trump.
I have long considered myself fortunate to have been born in the United States. I’ve had many advantages because of that single fact. I know my life has been easier than most humans I share the planet with. I had parents who—despite growing-up somewhat disadvantaged—were grateful, ethical, and fair and passed their values along to my siblings and me. We never had much excess, but we always had enough. I was was always aware that I had the privilege of not being "of color," but sought, every summer for the first decades of my life, to use the sun to my advantage—because I thought/think "color" is more attractive than pallor. I've had good health, and so when I developed a very minor breast cancer, I also developed survivors' guilt when, in the radiation waiting room or my oncologist's office, I saw younger women with more virulent cancers than mine whose outcomes would be less successful.
So I guess I’m biased against privilege: I don’t understand that the Saudi Prince and my so-called president have so many advantages and privileges and still feel they're entitled to more and can feel free to hate "the other," and use hateful methods to get what they want. I'm sad their lives are so empty that they grab and horde and flaunt in order to fill an abyss where their souls should be.
My advantage makes me feel ashamed; I don’t like the feeling. I have an ache that is becoming increasingly distressful.
What can we do in order to feel better about our nation?
87
@Gerithegreek518 Do something kind for someone. If everyone did that, it would be a kinder more compassionate planet.
15
Aside from the nightmarish murder of Jamal Khashoggi, an equally disturbing development was Trump's immediate diversion away from that horror and on to the migrant freedom march.
Last year I warned vigorously against the Republican move to repeal the laws prohibiting the export of American Crude Oil because that oil is a strategic natural resource to rely on in the event of a political or military necessity. That time is now and we are crippled in our diplomatic leverage as we rely on five percent of our daily oil consumption from Saudi Arabia. In addition to that strategic blunder, the Republicans sold much of the national strategic oil reserve that we rely on as well.
Equally horrifying as the butchering of Khashoggi was Trump's apparent lack of shock at the murder as he sought to save the arms deal with Saudi Arabia. Would you hand your weapon to a burglar?
There is an underlying horror in this cooperation with the Saudi's absent any semblance of a conscience. We have lost the world's moral high ground and have descended to the pits.
Are we no better than the brutal murderers? The answer is yes in terms of leadership.
Should we really rely on Saudi Arabia as a bulwark against Terrorism as they practice it themselves? It's obvious the Pentagon is directing our foreign policy. With General Kelly as Chief of Staff and Mattis close to Trump, this must be so.
With the participation of former C.I.A. Director Pompeo, they obviously got their stories straight.
54
The Trump administration, more specifically Trump himself, has our priorities wrong. Trump thinks this is all about doing business. There are things that are more important. MBS carried out an act of personal terrorism against a U.S.-based journalist. No arms sale, no deal, no amount of American jobs are more important than taking a stand against terrorism. Sadly, the Trump administration has no one who will stand up to the president and his impulsive reactions to the Saudis. So Trump gets his way, and the Saudis know they are protected.
68
Strongly worded Ms. Rice, but, unfortunately, the administration you served did not back up strong words with forceful policy - particularly in Syria. As a result of US timidity in Syria, autocrats like the Saudi monarchs are now emboldened to completely ignore calls to do the right thing. I don’t necessarily disagree with that policy of military disengagement, but let’s not pretend that muscular rhetoric can take the place of forceful moves in the realpolitik of a region that lives by the rule of naked power. That is their method, it’s not our choice, but we kid ourselves if we think our words make much of a difference.
45
Well, you are correct that it's not our choice how the Saudis operate and that our words won't make much of a difference.
But we should not actively abet their ruthless campaign in Yemen.
We should base policy with Iran on what is strategic and practical for our country, not on Saudi hysteria.
The American president should not concoct cover stories for bin Salman, as in 'it could have been rogue killers.'
And the Secretary of State should not fly across the world to do a friendly photo op and visit with a man who has fresh blood on his hands.
The above are unduly submissive to Saudi Arabia's wishes. And not going along with them would, at least, signal to US citizens who we are as an autonomous nation.
24
@Pete
As I recall congress wouldn't back Obama on any thing let alone war.
13
@Pete
Why didn't the Obama administration respond to chemical weapons by destroying the Syrian air force? Instead, Obama became a mass murderer, like Clinton in Rwanda, Bush in Iraq, Reagan in Central America. "sober, responsible leadership" casting the first stone.
3
It is high time we end all attempts to prioritize international relations based on so called “strategic interests”. This argument has been used for hundreds of years to excuse our tacit support of horrific, immoral and unethical human behavior. These relationships have a track record of virtually never working out, creating far greater human suffering than benefits over time. In an age where America is extremely technologically advanced and defended by a phalanx of the most powerful weapons in history, bending our moral code for any short term advantage is completely unnecessary. Our well-being and survival simply no longer requires it. We should consistently support all true and aspirational democracies with fervor, while aggressively decrying suppressive and brutal regimes wherever they exist. Only by adopting this straightforward foreign policy axiom can the United States reclaim it’s recently lost heritage as the greatest beacon of light, hope and freedom for the entire human race. This is the only true way to make America great again.
67
The pillars of US middle east policy seem to be to pander to Israel and to demonize Iran. That, coupled with our dependence on Saudi oil leave us few options. That dependence may be fading, but it's still a powerful force.
Maybe we need to rethink this approach.
MBS is bad, but we shouldn't pretend that he's the first bad Saudi potentate. The House of Saud has supported anti-Western movements throughout the Muslim world for a long time. We send them our money, they contribute it to our enemies: Al Queda, the Taliban, etc.
The war in Yemen is difficult to see as any anything other than an extermination campaign against the (mostly but not completely) Shia Houthis. That's not something we should ever have supported.
Of course Trump won't end support for the Saudis--not as long as there is money to be made.
68
Susan Rice is temporizing like a good pseudo-liberal. Saudi had no good reason for attacking Yemen in the first place. Houthi incursions were trivial; in fact, all I remember is their counterattacking (ineffectively) after the Saudi aggression. I'm not supporting Houthis; I'm saying Saudi is out of self-control and the U.S. should never have been supporting their war of choice in Yemen.
As for the people who think Obama was weak in Syria, I wish you the opportunity to go fight there yourselves. You probably know better, but you haven't learned the lesson of all U.S. failed interventions of the past several decades (except in minuscule Grenada and in Panama).
84
I long for a time when being an American ally meant some sort of alignment with American values. But ever since playing footsie with J. Stalin in WWII and the subsequent dysfunction of post-war anti-communism, it's been hard to tell which has gone downhill more: our allies or our values.
In any event, the history of the past 110 years and the next 50 is likely to show that petroleum boosted the world economy to unprecedented heights even as it sawed off the legs of geopolitical stability: climate change in so many different ways.
65
Maybe Susan Rice can explain why Saudi Arabia is a US "ally" in the first place. The Obama Administration in which Rice was the NSA, sought greater balance in the Middle East and a military pivot away from the Middle East to the Pacific, where our real strategic interests lie.
The current joke is that Saudi Arabia helps the US combat terrorism. The truth is that 9/11 was executed by Saudis and the Saudi government subsequently pushed the US to invade regional competitor Iraq, spawning ISIS in its disastrous wake.
If that and the epic humanitarian disaster caused by the Saudi war on Yemen are "fighting terrorism", our foreign policy needs its head examined.
185
A succinct and straight-talking article. Why the Yemeni situation garners so little attention is shocking. Before the Khashoggi murder there was practically no mention of this humanitarian disaster. Currently 13 million people are facing famine while the war continues unabated.
The article points to what is needed right now to start a process and sidelining MBS is a priority.
241
@Lorcán
One reason it got little attention is because the Obama Administration armed the Saudis, provided aerial refueling and like Trump, pretended to believe the bombing of civilians was accidental. Only in recent months have we started seeing people being honest about Saudi war crimes and even now, as in this article, the early support provided by Obama is whitewashed.
Trump, of course, is worse. He only cares about arms sales and pushing for confrontation with Iran.
15
the yemeni massacre garners little attention precisely because us arms are being used wantonly.
16
@Lorcán
There is no solution to the Middle East and there are no good buys in the Middle East.
The best we can hope for is time to change to bring the society into the present.
6
Ms. Rice your hypocrisy is showing.
Did American citizen Anwar al-Awlaki
get due process of law under the Obama
administration?
No! He was murdered by America's
“true character in impulsive and vicious actions.”
Just like Jamal Khashoggi.
Please save your breath.
Might equals right. Right?
7
@Joie deVivre I guess extrajudicial assassinations are OK if they're committed by powerful countries with clear agendas. Ask Israel, they've been doing it for years, including the murder of a man in Norway in a case of mistaken identity. I'm a Democrat but did not vote for Obama's reelection because of the murder of al Awlaki, who was never charged with a crime in any court of law and whose death was followed 2 weeks later by the similar murder (drone strike) of his 14 year old son. There are some acts that are egregious regardless of politics and regardless of who commits them.
"We need to stop privileging Jared Kushner’s relationship with the crown prince, and finally fill the vacant ambassadorship"....The special Kushner relationship smells of money. Did you ever wonder why it was necessary to terminate the Iran nuclear deal when all our allies thought it was a positive step forward? The nuclear deal removed sanctions on Iran and allowed them to sell their oil. Ask yourself what happens to the international price of oil when oil from Iran goes on the market. Of course, the international price of oil will fall and the value of Saudi oil will decline. In order for Kushner (Trump) to keep their sweetheart deals with the Saudis it was therefore essential to end the Iran nuclear agreement so sanctions could be reimposed. We can hope that part of the problem will soon correct itself. I think it likely that when the mid-term elections are over, the Mueller investigation will take the next step and Kushner will be indicted.
5
Is there really anything Ms. Rice can credibly say on any subject related to foreign policy after she famously went on 5 Sunday news shows to peddle Hillary's Benghazi video tale when she knew it was false and misleading? Go away please.
5
@Steveally ...Did you actually hear Rice's comments or are you just going blah, blah, blah Fox News? Rice was very careful to qualify her statement. Further, perhaps you were unaware that the Libyan responsible for leading the Benghazi attack was brought to the U.S. for trial. He himself has said that the Benghazi attack began as a protest against the video and then escalated.
@Steve so one misstatement disqualifies you from ever speaking again.
why are we even listening to anything trump says, then?
1
These crocodile tears about the U.S.-Saudi relationship are being shed at least 30 years too late. At the very minimum, U.S. pressure on the sheikhs a few decades ago would have prevented 9/11, ISIS and the Yemeni genocide, to name but three obvious results of U.S. appeasement.
No amount of Op-Eds can hide the fact that the U.S. made a Devil's Pact with the Saudis that left them fee to spread the most virulent and violent form of Islam across the globe, in exchange for cheap oil and weapons sales. You reap what you sew.
6
@Hamid Varzi
Absolutely true. That Bush authorized flight out of the country by Saudis they day after 911 while American citizens were grounded. The fifteen Saudi trained fanatics on those planes. W. holding hands with vile mass murderers. Obama the supreme Saudi sycophant. Now Trump's open criminal corruption. Salute the flag. Polish the lapel pin. Wash those patriotic hands in blood money that requires innocent citizens from here and abroad as the necessary price to pay for filthy lucre. Disgust, horror...Language fails furnish words that might describe this fake predatory democracy of ours.
3
Susan, lied to anyone across 5 news outlets lately? Like the Saudi's, any means fits the end.
3
"We should not rupture our important relationship with the kingdom, but we must make clear it cannot be business as usual so long as Prince Mohammed continues to wield unlimited power."
Why not?
2
Oh please one guy getting killed should not change US foreign policy. People are making a mountain out of a mole hill.
1
@Peter B "Oh please one guy getting killed should not change US foreign policy."....The one guy that got killed lived in the U.S., had permanent resident status, and worked for a U.S. newspaper. I would suggest that means that the U.S. had a measure of responsibility for his safety, and that his assassination indicates our foreign policy is seriously flawed.
The targeted killings by drones in Afghanistan and Pakistan skyrocketed under Obama [the not-muslim]. Much worse than Bush. The more you bomb them, the more replacements they get.
1
"Can the United States continue to cooperate with Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman?"
No.
1
" ... Prince Mohammed will continue to drive his country and our bilateral relationship over the proverbial cliff."
Sound like anyone else we know? I'm looking at you, Donald. Jared. Mike (both of them).
1
"...his true character in impulsive and vicious actions."
Of the dictators or dictator wannabees,
MBS
the so-called president
Kim
Duterte
Maduro
el-Sisi
Mnangagwa
Khamenei,
Putin looks the most stable....
But how 'bout the new boy from Brazil...
2
Once again Obama was right to build some distance from S. A. Besides being a proven supporter and source of terrorism, S. A. is ruled by a despicable regime. I guess DJT enjoys the tacky furniture and gold leaf adorned rooms, and Jared needs the money, so...
5
I wonder how the leaders of the U.S. defense industry can look themselves in the mirror after heaping slews of advanced armaments from F-15's to who knows what on the heinous, inhumane regime(s) of Saudia Arabia. Would those ruthless captains of industry stand for a ban on weapon sales to, well, anybody.
2
I'm not surprised that Prince Mohammed had Kahoggi tortured & murdered in the most gruesome way. What I question is why he did it in such a way o-in a Saudi embassy, having brought in a murder squad that was known by all. Why did he deliberately stick his fingers in the eyes of the leaders of the democracies with the unspoken question 'what are you going to do about it?'. Unfortunately, the answer seems to be 'nothing'.
5
Sue you can talk to the newspapers all you want about punishing SA but you know last US allies in the middle east are Israel and SA and maybe the US doesn't need oil but the world does. if the saudi's don't get what they want from us russia will happily fill that hole. Checkmate Sue
2
Fill the vacant US ambassadorship in Saudi Arabia with an American Muslim.
Why?
We only send, as a matter of policy, American Jews as ambassadors to Israel. Why not the same for Saudi Arabia?
It's worked out so well on our relations and influence with Israel, it's sure to have a gihugic impact with Saudi Arabia as well. Right? Jared, are you listening? Facts, man, facts.
We keep making the same mistake and expect the result to be different. George W. Bush, with support from people like NY Times Op-Ed columnist Tom Friedman, and Democratic Presidential hopeful Hillary Clinton, started the Iraq War in hopes that our invasion would transform the Middles East into a flowering democracy. Of course, it was cynical and heartless to start a war for the sake of peace, and the result was a disaster for the ages. More recently, we've had Friedman and other MBS acolytes telling us that the "liberalization" of Saudi Arabia (allowing women to drive) is worth the war in Yemen, the extrajudicial shake-down of Saudi royals held prisoner at the Ritz-Carlton, and other MBS atrocities. That is, until a journalist was murdered; this cleared the minds of many journalists, such as Tom Friedman, who now demands justice. Better late than never! Yes, we need justice, and it cannot come with MBS running the kingdom.
4
The administration has decided that oil and coal are the future; the Saudi’s “...spend a lot of money here,”; the president’s various holdings owe the Saudi’s a mountain of cash, and he thinks the Prince is a “fabulous” guy. He spent the first week concocting cover stories for them, and now seems content to let the issue go away, so, no, we are saddled with another losing strategy in the Middle East because this administration doesn’t realize that conducting foreign relations with murderous, uber-wealthy religious fanatics is a waste of time and resources. They can barely conduct a press briefing without lying, so thank you for your considered and knowledgeable advice, Ms. Rice, it is much too diplomatic and representative of a real government for this group of dimwits to attempt.
Susan Rice hopes that: “the Trump administration must assume that Prince Mohammed will continue to drive his country and our bilateral relationship over the proverbial cliff.”
Probably the Trump Administration is aware of the issue, but driving our entire country over a cliff, nevermind our connection to Saudi Arabia, is not a concern of theirs.
2
Trump's "inexplicable fascination" with MBS is hardly inexplicable. It's driven by a love of authoritarians (i.e., the people being forced to support, praise, applaud or otherwise kowtow to you), a desire to make a lot of money, and a deep-seated longing to be seen as royal or somehow special.
Nothing will be done about MBS as long as Trump and the GOP are in office. Nothing.
3
It is truly remarkable that there is a media outlet in the country that would publish anything this proven liar has to say. She was doubtless a loyal and faithful member of the Obama administration, but the lies she told repeatedly re the Benghazi affair would, one thinks, disqualify her thoughts and opinions from any serious consideration.
But these are remarkable times, so anyone willing to speak out against the current administration holding some sort of superficially credible resume will find the NY Times more than happy to help her promulgate her views, which may, in fact, be worth thinking about. BUT SHE IS A PROVEN LIAR! I can remember when something like that simply disqualified a person from being taken seriously.
1
Sober, responsible leadership is so passé.
I think Ambassador Rice is correct. We cannot trust MBS and we must separate the Saudi State from him, however. Saudi Arabia needs us more than we need them They will be a burden for any country that supports them, be it us, Russia or China. The killing of Khashoggi was the execution of a medieval mad prince, like Vlad Dracul. Let us stay far from him and his ilk. Trump has based his foreign policy on MBS.
2
Free Raif Badawi - and probably a host of lesser-known Saudi critic political prisoners.
Still waiting for DJT to reserve and furnish a wing of Mar A Lago as recuperative ward for US-ordnance-shattered Yemeni children.
1
To the honorable Ms. Rice, first, I love you. You are brilliant. Direct but diplomatic and focused on the national security of the USA. Having said that I had to stop reading this column. Come on, MBS is undependable? We elected a traitor who has no credibility on anything inventing fantasies to justify his lies.
Until we take the log out of our own eye its a safe bet that the only role other unreliable authoritarian thugs will play is to distract from the criminal horrors of our own authoritarian thug.
1
Kushner's and Trump's relationship(s) with MBS must be scrutinized more closely, and the question of why Trump has not appointed an ambassador to KSA must be answered. Jamal Khashoggi's death is slipping into the past, and we cannot allow that. As Americans, we deserve plausible answers regarding this murder, the lies and coverup, and to look at how this affects our safety and security.
1. There was no "American century." We were the greatest superpower from 1954-2000, less than 50 years. That's when we had our chance to change the world for the better. We didn't try very hard, because we were obsessed with weakening Russia.
2. Obama and Susan Rice had a conscience, but were already in charge of a country in decline (since SCOTUS handed the presidency to "W" by a partisan vote of 5-4).
3. 9/11 happened soon after "W" was appointed, by no coincidence. The Saudis knew "W" was incompetent, and his family was enslaved to oil money.
4. It is now too late to turn things around. MBS has more power than Trump or Kushner, and so does Netanyahu.
5. We could no more stop selling weapons than we could stop producing oil. Our economy depends on those two exports. We are now part of the "Axis of Evil." Trump supporters know this, and like it.
DC, especially Northern Virginia, is controlled by the defense industry...as Eisenhower warned us about. In Houston everyone works for Shell or Exxon or BP, in NoVa everyone works for the Pentagon, or Northrup, Raytheon, Lockheed, or General Dynamics. Which is worse? One will gladly destroy the planet and all of nature and wildlife for a profit, and the other will destroy all human life for a profit.
2
How do we get MBS to withdraw thousands of Saudi students from our universities?
Ms. Rice offers cogent reasons for our reassessment of this nation's policy toward the House of Saud. But quite frankly, we really need to dispense with the charade that Donald Trump has any policy with respect to any other nation, except to line his own pockets.
Ms. Rice offers several excellent suggestions, including sidelining the Crown Prince, investigating Mr. Khashoggi's cold blooded murder, and terminating financial and military support for the Yemen campaign. All sound actions that should be followed. Which is why none of them will be considered by this "administration".
Trump is motivated only by what makes him money, and the House of Saud has been one of his "sponsors" for decades. And Trump also knows that his voters could care less what happens some ten thousand miles away. As long as they get to target Middle Easterners here in the U.S. with impunity, this is all they want. Trump's squandering of our international standing is the least of their concerns.
Please, New York Times, please stop publishing these columns that are written as if we have an intelligent, decent, sane, thoughtful man in the White House, who cares about our country. We don't. We have an ignorant, selfish, hateful bigot in the White House. We need to stop pretending Trump is something that he is not.
The fact is, we have no national leadership. We have an ignorant, corrupt dictator. The media's continued pandering only enables this tyrant. It needs to stop. Now.
1
It is unconscionable that after being at the heart of the national security team that put together the largest arms sale in history to Saudi Arabia, and supported what from the very first day was a horrifically brutal war on the people of Yemen, Rice now tries to shrug off the Obama Admin's enabling and even encouragement of the war as if they didn't know precisely what was happening from the start and simply didn't care. History will not absolve you Susan Rice even if the NY Times OpEd page will. It's good to have your piece next to one on karma and reincarnation today because if either of those exist you will wind up being born a war orphan in Yemen.
3
If that is what they do with a simple bone saw, just think what they will do with $100,000,000,000 worth of our warplanes and bombs.
What did Ms Rice do about this in her years at WH? Suddenly, it’s someone else’s fault. Standard behavior from the folks who won’t just leave and go home.
2
I can’t believe the state dept. issued that pathetic letter. Has anyone been hired in trump world with actual experience in their respective fields?
1
Here's a big dose of gender politics to start the day:
We are BFFs with Saudi Arabia because our country has been led for far too long by greedy white men. (Before you argue this point, take a look at history).
Female American leadership would have handled Saudi Arabia's torture and murder of innocents in an entirely different manner. We wouldn't have tolerated it. Period. I'm not certain why our predominantly white male wealthy "civil" servants haven't gotten that memo. Maybe too much testosterone, or it simply too much greed?
"We need Saudi Arabia!" is baloney. We have oil. Our bases in the region are there to protect the Saudis.
If we want the Saudis to behave instead of rewarding them like petulant children, we simply need to take away our military. Alas, there's no money to be made from that! Instead, we sell the Saudis our weapons of mass destruction in exchange for political bribes of every shape and size and then act like we're not responsible when they kill civilians with them.
1
Any one with a Sunni DNA is not dependable. This has been proved again and again. The US and other Western nations made a great blunder in promoting the Sunni kingdoms of the Arab world against the non-Sunnis mainly because of their eagerness to ensure energy security ( from Arabian Oil) in the early 20th century. The non-Sunni states, who believed in more humane culture contrary to the Sunni's barbaric culture, were not preferred by the US & West. With decades of promotion & protection, the Sunnis spread their culture across the Globe- Africa, S-E Asia ( Indonesia & Malaysia), parts of Russia & China, Middle East ( Pakistan), apart from the non-Sunni states of the Arab World. Today's world wide presence of terror outfits is evidence of this. With the recent Kashoggi's barbaric murder, the US seems to have waken up to realize their past mistake. But it is a million dollar question, as to whether they will take action to curtail and eventually eradicate this barbaric ideology from this earth.
If we had a president truly committed to human rights and the rule of law, he would be demanding an international arrest warrant for MBS and prosecution of the crown prince at the Hague, not only for Khashoggi's murder but for crimes against humanity in Yemen. Unfortunately, some of those crimes are being committed with American weaponry and the help of the U.S. Air Force. And Trump does not support a rules-based world order, be it at the United Nations or the International Court of Justice.
2
Oil + Israel - Iran = Saudi Arabia
It's simple arithmetic.
2
I do not think that Ambassador Rice has spent very much time in Saudi or how much she really understands how the Kingdom operates. She makes quite a few assertions about the Crown Prince that are not proven and based on supposition and emotion rather than facts.
For a former US national security advisor to make the claim in a New York Times opinion piece that the Crown Prince had "likely ordered the killing" without having the facts to back that assertion up is outrageous. Perhaps if she departed her study and spent a bit of time in the Kingdom to met a few people privately and engaged in meaningful discussions she would discover the facts and arrived a conclusion based in facts not emotion.
But then again that would require her to undertake meaningful work or research. This is much harder than sitting in your living room drinking coffee and writing an opinion piece for the Times.
I am really fed up with experts that draw conclusions from information in the public domain that are not fully proven and really on emotion rather than facts. They should know better. This approach is why the current administration inherited quite a mess in the Middle East created by the previous two administrations.
Sorry to be so blunt about this but as a former professor at an Ivy League Institution, as an essay or outline for a research article I would as an academic advisor not give Ambassador Rice's article a passing grade.
@Wright......"that the Crown Prince had "likely ordered the killing" without having the facts to back that assertion up is outrageous."...... I think she used the qualifying word "likely"; and no, what would really be outrageous would be to assume otherwise
The question that first occurs to me as I read this column is: "Can the United States any longer be trusted as a rational and reliable partner for its allies on any measure of shared international concern?"
Looking at contemporary polling data from several of our most important allies, the conclusion would seem to be a resounding "No!" This seems to be what Naking America Great Again is all about.
Prohibit exports of U.S. Oil and Natural Gas.
3
I am, of course, like everybody else - opposed to this assassination
But it's an ugly world out there
If we stopped doing business with every leader and country that violated American definitions of human rights our ability to protect our national security would be severely compromised.
2
@Luciano...."If we stopped doing business with every leader and country that violated American definitions of human rights our ability to protect our national security would be severely compromised."......True, but over the long run it will be more severely compromised if we don't.
@Luciano
Our national security is compromised when we ignore these human rights violations, embolding the perpetrators to escalate their actions.
While I share Susan Rice's assessment of the situation, the chance of any of this changing in the way she recommends while Donald Trump occupies the White House is zero. Too much is at stake in Trump Organization's finances and the Kushner real estate empire for these things to occur.
Support for an unprincipled rich despot from a kingdom historically notorious for buying its friends is entirely predictable, even if it is a sad commentary of corruption in the American state.
7
Jared is right.
Just wait until his father-in-law replaces what should have been an international crisis arising from the torture, murder, and dismemberment of a Washington Post journalist at the direction of the Saudi Crown Prince with multiple other crises and the American media will largely forget about it.
Yep, what are the lives of a journalist and Yemeni women and children compared with a pact among world oligarchs ensuring their mutual protection?
7
Wow did not know about his roles in shocking occurrences that we here in America seem insulated from, without realizing we are complicit in one way or another. Not to mention his close “shallow as in money” relationship with Trump and son in law, their friendship will last only as long as they make money and power for each other. Then they will discard each other.
1
Susan Rice nowhere mentions the critically vital relationships, overt as well as covert, that Saudi Arabia has with other governments, such as Israel, which have committed politically motivated assassinations as well. The Obama administration responses to Israel’s hit jobs of Palestinian leaders elicit no more than official verbal rebukes, none in our press that lasts more than one weekly news cycle. Does she wish to end Israel’s strategic backdoor relationship with the Saudis in order to punish it for the Khashoggi murder? Does Israel?
For an end to present tensions with us over this savage display of Saudi brutality, the Saudis ought to negotiate a deal with Trump starting with candor, admission of responsibility, and restitution. President Trump may not know it but Saudi Arabia is where the Art of the Deal was invented.
1
Ms Rice’s article present good views but, unfortunately, lack credibility. The current outrage for Khashoggi’s murder is justified, however, the killing of thousands in Yemen deserves a much louder outrage by everyone. Saudi Arabia does not manufacture weapons. The US does. From political and economical aspects, the war in Yemen is more for Americans then it is for Saudis.
3
When Trump puts national interests above his personal interests, cows will jump the moon, dogs will purr like kittens, and Bernie Sanders will declare affection for the republican party. The idea was explored at length by Naomi Klein in her book, "The Shock Doctrine." We're a punch drunk nation. The assault on our national sensibility is necessarily both vicious and remorseless.
The idea that Trump and his press hating friends would care about a journalist being murdered is laughable. Trump likely slipped the crown prince an extra cruise missile for his initiative.
4
Hypocritical revisionism. Ms. Rice now advocates for a radical change in diplomacy with Saudi Arabia, and for that matter with the entire Arab world. But she conveniently fails to mention that it was the ill-informed policies of her last boss, and the administration in which she played a prominent role, that set the stage for the current regime in Saudi Arabia to put MBS in charge of the country. And she also fails to mention that the U.S. Intelligence services have trained, guided, and coordinated the activities of the General Intelligence Directorate, and the Mabahith, organizations responsible for documented human rights abuses to which the previous inept administration ignored because it desperately needed Saudi help and assistance to carry out American interests in the Middle East, particularly during the last ten years. So it should not come as a surprise to anyone with an average level of intelligence that now the Saudis feel free to carry out assassinations, kidnappings, torture and bombings of anyone they consider a threat to the regime. Certainly the Kushner connection should be questioned, but that will not stop MBS from imposing his will on the world. The damage is done and Ms. Rice should look into a mirror.
2
Prince or no Prince—when has Saudi Arabia ever been a reliable ally? It's been an open farce for decades.
5
Excellent op-ed. The press has been so overwhelmed with the mid-term elections, the pro-Trump bomber and the murder of Jewish worshipers, it seemed as if the brutal murder of Mr. Khashoggi had been forgotten. Those other stories certainly deserve all the attention they have been getting but we musn't overlook the savage killing that was obviously perpetrated by the leader of Saudi Arabia.
3
What you're suggesting requires the restoration of moral suasion as a priority component of our foreign policy.
Good luck with that...
2
The only criticism many of us would have of this essay by Susan Rice is that it does not go far enough.
Ms. Rice should be advocating more strongly for a trial before an international tribunal of Crown Prince Mohammed bin Salman. In the meantime, the Crown Prince should be completely removed from any and all official positions in the Saudi government.
Ms. Rice should be stating more forcefully that the feckless Jared Kushner should not be representing America in international diplomacy with any country, least of all with Saudi Arabia or any other Arab country which has bailed him out financially for his chronically inane real estate investments.
Ms. Rice should be more candid that, until Donald Trump’s tax returns show otherwise, Americans have the right to assume that he and his companies have received millions of dollars from the Saudi royal family and its businesses.
6
America, unfortunately, has not only tolerated, but buttressed the anti-Democratic, feudal regimes of Saudi Arabia that were based on male-inherited-royalty and 7th Century Islamic-Sharia laws or Wahabbi's faith.
Saudi's human rights violation is one of the worsts in the world.
There has always been a "hands-in-glove" relationship between the regimes of the United States and the Saudi Royal family. Remember, right after the 9/11, many Saudi students said to be related to the Saudi royal families and Osama Bin-Laden were put in a special flight and escorted to Riyadh. They were supposed to be investigated for their connection to the 9/11 hijackers.
The Saudis have delivered threats in the past to the US in no uncertain terms that if the Americans waver from their commitment to Saudi Arabia, their assets in Saudi Arabia would be confiscated, nationalized or sold out to other bidders in the world.
No matter whoever governs the USA -- Democrats or Republicans -- incurring the wrath of a ruling Princely family whose asset is estimated to be 16th times larger than the occupants of the Buckingham Palace will be inconceivable.
There's a "deep pocket" relationship between the two countries. Each has to shore up the other.
3
Correct from start to finish. The final paragraph which raises Trump's and Kushner's interests being taken care of in the absence of a US Ambassador to Saudi Arabia brings up the question of all those other missing US Ambassadors? Is this by design, not merely ineptitude?
20
Hard to argue with any of Susan Rice's points - easier to add supporting argument in the form of The Crown Prince's brazen seduction of American conservatives in business and entertainment. He was, for example, hosted by FoxNews Chairman and his wife at his home in Bel Air in April 2018. Also attending that soirée were Hollywood heavyweights Dwayne (The Rock) Johnson, Disney's Bob Iger, Warner Bros CEO Kevin Tsujihara, National Geographic CEO Courtney Monroe and filmmakers James Cameron and Ridley Scott. After the Jamal Kashoggi murder in the Saudi Embassy, Mohammed bin Salman may have difficulty getting his calls returned - hey, it's Hollywood!
My guess is - in this circle of influence to which the Crown Prince seeks access - the only one left holding the hot potato is Donald Trump - who may well be confused about which way to turn given that his family business finances are somewhat dependent on Saudi financing.
11
You are correct about MBS, but you are silent about some of your predecessors like Trump's adviser, Henry Kissinger, who ordered the assassination of President Allende of Chile. Until Carter became president and the law was changed, US presidents approved the assassination of so many world political figures they are too numerous to mention here. But I am sure you know who they are. I am no Trump supporter and have never voted for a Republican for president in my life, my first vote being cast for Sen. McGovern. But I am no fan of half truths and lies by omission.
5
Do now what we should have done in 1974. Prohibit the purchase of oil from outside North America. Invest full boat in sustainable energy. Better late than never. Painful, but a more productive pain than having to live with blackmail.
30
Ms Rice is to be commended for this article. But it is only fair to point out that, although generally the Obama administration's foreign policy was far superior to the disaster that is Trump, it was in fact Obama who led us down a blind alley with the rogue Crown Prince, right up to the last minutes of his presidency. I did not recall the limitation on arms sales to rhe Saudis rhat she mentions, due to their unconscionable bombing campaign in Yemen, which the Obama administration quietly supported and facilitated for years, so I followed her cite -- only to discover that it occurred in December 2016 -- AFTER Trump's election. In any event, better late than never, so Democrats are well advised to unite behind the policy Ms Rice has put forward. And if Trump has any sense at all, he will make it quietly clear to the Saudis that we would not be opposed to the rogue prince's abdication, to preserve our relationship with them.
3
Excellent article indeed but i am surprise that MS Rice who served as the national security adviser from 2013 to 2017 and served as the United States ambassador to the United Nations wrote it because she should know better. Ms. Rice should know that in the real world a nation can not select its partners according to its own values. The Saudi royal family, like most leaders in the Middle-East, Africa, Latin America. China, Russia and its former satellite states are not the partners civilized nation should have but can not live without them, especially the USA in today's environment. All your suggestions are great for a "normal" world but you know the facts. The US gov't tried several times before to change partner, to support the "good guys" (especially the administration you worked under). Did it worked?
5
Excellent article! Unfortunately it is not going to happen with someone like Trump. The US should vote him out, before he causes even more damage.
22
We've helped put ourselves in the current position by building and cultivating an economy based on oil and petroleum-based plastics, which has transferred vast wealth to Saudi Arabia and undermined western independence and security.
The sooner America is able to wean itself from this dependence, through the development, promotion and adoption of cleaner fuels and technologies, the sooner we can restore reason and leadership in our arrangements with petroleum-producing economies.
Saudi Arabia and friends, the big car companies, Big Oil, and politicians with stakes in these areas will fight to their last breath to prevent this from happening, but our time of complacency and subservience to fossil fuels has to end.
18
Finally, the voice of reason. Ms. Rice is far more qualified to represent the U.S. and help formulate its foreign policy than are the people currently entrusted with this critical task.
78
The CIA engineered a coup against a progressive Iraqi government and brought in the Baathist party. That didn't work out so well, no?
Our leaders kicked out an elected government in Iran and brought in the Shah. That also worked out not so well.
Throughout our lifetimes the U.S. has funded the Saudi kingdom, a gang of murders and despots. Surprise, this also is not working out well.
The NY Times is late in criticizing our government's imperialist oil strategy in the mideast. The U.S. should not have a voice at the table deciding the future of the region.
24
@RebeccaTouger
Shia run Iraq.
Worked out well for them.
But continue. Ain’t nothing changing your story. Least of all the lives of the people there and their perceptions of their interests.
A voice of reason crying out in the wilderness: Susan Rice. Would that we had more like her in what passes for a government these days: political hacks and cynical opportunists.
And then there's the malefactor in chief...
82
A lot of good prescriptions for what is wrong with our relationship with MBS. Unfortunately, no one in Congress seems to care and certainly President Trump and his cadre of family advisors don’t believe there is a problem.
53
Money, money, money makes the world go round. When in the future la ligne of drumpestan is history, it will be fastenating to unravel the correption of saudi, the gulf states, and the drumpf/kushner real estate dealings. It will be the meat of many scholarly dissertations I am sure.
1
This article by Ms. Rice reminds me of an old saying: if you want a progressive, or a liberal, in power to become again a real liberal wait until they are not anymore in power.
4
@J. Parula
You know, J., I'm pretty sure that's not an "old saying", and you didn't get reminded of it.
Mainly because most old sayings make sense.
And your's didn't.
Keep the pressure up, Ms. Rice. But as long as the GOP remains in power and trump is making money, not much is going to change.
53
Given the US Government’s complicity – over two administrations – in the Saudis’ aggression against Yemen, can we really be certain that neither Mr. Trump nor Mr. Kushner had prior knowledge of MBS’s plan to assassinate Mr. Khashoggi or gave him the green light to go ahead with it. After all, before the assassination, we heard much about how Mr. Kushner’s warm relationship with MBS was changing the geopolitical dynamics in the Middle East. Questions had already been asked whether Mr. Kushner green-lighted MBS's kidnapping of Lebanese Prime Minister Hariri last year. Since the assassination, we’ve heard practically nothing from Mr. Kushner about his good friend.
And in words reminiscent of the Nixon Administration’s airy dismissal of the Watergate break-in as a “two-bit burglary,” Mr. Trump has belittled the assassination’s importance with such keen observations as, “They had a very bad original concept, it was carried out poorly and the cover-up was the worst in the history of cover-ups.”
11
Great post Ms. Rice! You summed it all up very nicely, especially the point about the arms sales emboldening the Saudis to kill and starve more civilians in Yemen. What makes MBS any better than Assad?
31
I simply do not see the benefit to me, as an American citizen, to the US government giving any support to the Saudi regime.
The sale of advanced weapons to the Saudis because of defense industry pressures, as a financial expediency and the maintenance of a client relationship are totally repugnant.
23
"...he must recalibrate American policy so that it serves our national interests — not his personal interests or those of the crown prince."
Yah, right, like this has even a possibility of happening.
42
Somehow, we seem ever eager to repeat our foreign policy failures again and again. Backing cruel despots in order to acquire leverage in a contentious part of the world is a policy doomed not just to ordinary failure, but to a totally crushing and humiliating failure. (Remember the Shah?)
Foreign policy choices that work well enough for autocratic regimes like Russia will never be suitable for a democratic nation with a collective public conscience.
Not every ally will perfectly meet our standards of international behavior, but history promises that despots eventually will be replaced, and the surviving regimes will have long memories of our collaboration with their torturers. We simply must do better. Immediately!
15
Surprising as it may be to those bourgeois ‘educated’ folk in positions of power and influence, some of us have been acutely aware of how perverse so many of our government alliances often tend to be for quite a while now.
The United States has meddled in the affairs of the world’s Islamic population for far too long, and it doesn’t take an expert in foreign policy to recognize as much.
30
We cannot expect foreign policy based on sound analysis and US interests as long as Trump is President.
25
With Trump's family and friends making policy decisions, our only friends left are hardline ethno-nationalists and repressive autocrats who are leading us into a regional war in the Middle East. How did John Bolton wind up as our national security advisor, he was considered too radical by Bush and Cheney!!
27
Would the Houthi rebels have taken over much of Yemen without the backing of the Iranians? If not, I doubt that the Saudis would have become overtly involved in Yemen.
However, the Saudi Crown Prince reminds me of a more local president, with whom I am familiar.
8
Good column.
.
Even better policies:
.
End the 1945 USS Quincy Agreement.
Stop buying Saudi Oil.
Use the US Navy to break the blockade of Yemen and to deliver food to starving people.
105
"Use the US Navy to break the blockade of Yemen and to deliver food to starving people."
Excellent! Is Uncle Sam a man or a mouse?! Come on, Donnie, Jared, squeak up there!
7
Might the Khashoggi affair provide an opening to improve relations with Iran at the expense of Saudi Arabia?
Of course both sides would want to change, which is far from a given. But Iran and its people seem to be the less crazy of these two Middle East powers.
22
@Jim S.
Yes, I agree. After all it was Saudis, not Iranians, who flew those planes into our buildings. And I don't recall any Iranians exporting an extremist version of Islam by supporting madrasas all over the world.
26
The past is indeed prologue. The Prince's history of malign and ugly actions is too lengthy to suggest that he will moderate his ways.
We have learned that lesson too many times. Look at what happened to Mr. Trump. Given power he didn't moderate his actions or speech as many hoped at all; if anything he's worse than ever - determined to undermine virtually every respectable institution - from the press to the FBI to the national security establishment - that he can.
Supporting this Prince will likely only lead to disaster in the long run.
22
Nothing new here. Despots, malign or benign in appearance have done this stuff for millennia. Just, in this computer age of instant information and extreme surveillanceit is far harder to pull off successfully.
3
@Michael Sherman
What is new is the open and public support of such an individual but the highest elected official in our country - and the correlated business dealing of that person's son.
15
The US had its chance to deal with Saudi Arabia in 2001, right after the terrorist attacks. If you recall, all but one of the terrorists were from Saudi Arabia. We got snookered into believing the lies about Iraq and Afghanistan.
62
@Jude Parker Smith
FYI 15 of the 19 jihadis were Saudi Arabian.
1
'Unfortunately, King Salman seems unwilling or unable to rein in his rogue son.'
Is that what Trump was hinting at when he kept repeating 'it could very well be a rogue operation'?
6
An intelligent if partisan offering, despite Ms. Rice’s admission to the lack of obvious options to MBS. She also offers an evidence-free dig at “personal interests” that Trump may have in supporting MBS. On balance, more and more people, on all sides, question the “belly” of Jared Kushner for performing an important role in the Middle East. And few question that Trump should appoint a highly competent ambassador to Saudi Arabia.
But the challenges the king faces are formidable. He could re-name Mohammed bin Nayef as Crown Prince, but that almost would require a convenient accident happening to MBS; and Saudi Arabia would lose the apparent willingness to gradually ease into a more permissive social framework that was making it easier for the West to tolerate one of the planet’s more restrictive societies as an ally. Easing up on Iran in Yemen would open the question of how ELSE we keep pressure high on Iran to dicker on nukes and delivery mechanisms. We need a strong Islamic ally in the Middle East; and if not Saudi Arabia … who? Ms. Rice attempts answers to none of these challenges.
Finally, Ms. Rice’s incremental punishments would fool nobody that we weren’t making a serious break with Saudi Arabia that the king could only salvage by caving to humiliating demands – something monarchs rarely do. By its nature solutions there are not easy, but Ms. Rice offers no real hope of a manageable transition to a more sustainable relationship with a more reasonable Saudi Arabia.
1
@Richard Luettgen Richard. We all agree on the certainty of Trumps failure to install any highly competent person in any position within the US government. If he in spite of tha,t still manages to do so, you may consider it an accident. And if US need a "strong islamic ally" in the middle east there might be one named Egypt, remember?
On the other hand, better fall in global policy hibernation and wake up after 2 years...
2
As with other things involving Jared Kushner, the Trump Admin is guided as to MbS by the desires of the right wing government of Israel.
MbS is key to two Israeli goals right now. First, he is an extremist on Iran. Second, his idea of reform includes ties to Israel that were previously unacceptable to the Saudis. Even his blockade of our ally in the Gulf is aimed in large part at its media outlets, which are harshly critical of Israel.
Ms. Rice herself aided the rise of MbS, which the US nurtured long before he burst into his full power.
She herself helped excuse the right wing excesses of both Israel and the Saudis, which now get only ever more extreme.
The problems she acknowledges are real, but they grew out of problems she does not yet acknowledge, and which she helped make worse.
An example is the Iran deal, for which she pushed, but for which she also at every turn enabled its opposition in Saudi Arabia and Israel.
The current problem is what comes of not standing up sooner.
13
@Mark Thomason
Excellent analysis (better than mine).
8
@Richard Luettgen
And even more right wing, which is your comment forte Richard/Mark. I wonder what it's like to see the world only one way. Comforting perhaps but not analytical. Neither offers a solution, just more Obama brickbats.
5
@AG -- Yeah, I'm the right wing die hard supporter of Bernie, Liz Warren, and Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez.
You can't just label as right wing anyone who thinks of things in ways other than your own.
12
The worst argument in the op-ed and in the comments so far is that it's right to force countries by economic pressure to change their political course.
It has two faults: first, it didn't happen that way for Iran and North Korea, which as economic outcast forwarded- and finally obtained for NK - nuclear development. Maybe this strategy worked for weak and poor countries, albeit this is tantamount to bully your way to superpower.
Second, admitting such international behaviour legitimates China, which has the economic strenght comparable to US, to do the same, and in some ways they are just doing it right now, with Senkaku islands and maritime militar expansion of its sovereignity. They are not interested in regime-change by now because they ar ein expansionism economics, but this doesn't exclude it from happening in the coming years when this stage will phase out in favor of a constant economics, and it could be even worse if it will go through bust-and-boom cycle.
"The good for me, then good for all" foreign policy admits one and only one superpower. And that isn't the case.
6
President Emoluments is not amenable to reason. No matter how airtight and ironclad the logic, if it endangers his self dealing it goes nowhere fast. Shy of voting him and his enablers out of office, we're whistling in the wind. But whistle we must while the sirens blare.
145
Red Rover, Red Rover
Let Saudis come over,
The odor I admit
Is not that of clover.
But if they buy arms
And strangle our foes
We can deal with the odor
By holding our nose.
128
"It should be United States policy, in conjunction with our allies, to sideline the crown prince in order to increase pressure on the royal family to find a steadier replacement".
It's baffling that after Iraqi (II) wars, Afghanistan's war some Dems still don't learn their lessons.
It's not her business to tell allies how they govern their countries.
It's not that difficult to understand. It's called not to be an interventionist, which was and is the cause of unintended consequences.
Still, mr. Rice is the best candidate to be vice-president to mrs. Rodham Clinton's renewed ambition to the presidency. And keep her as far as possible from Secretary of State's office.
3
@Alex p -- I would be pleased if we simply denied Saudi Arabia military support and treated them like the rogue nation that they are. Do you think the appropriate course is to continue to treat them like a valued ally and to support them without regard to whatever international crimes they commit or crises they create? That would be a little difficult to understand.
154
@Alex p
It probably is baffling to GOPs like you who think that smooth relations with ARAMCO trump all humanitarian considerations, but in fact at least since the establishment of the Marshall Plan we Americans emphatically DO tell other countries what behavior we will and will not support. We do this primarily through economic pressure.
Let us hope that you have no influence over what the estimable efforts of Ms. Rice produce in future American/ Saudi relations. For the first time in half a century we don't need the Saudi's oil, and they know it.
85
@Alex p
You seem to be more interested in in selling arms to SA than doing what is obviously the better choice in terms of world peace.
Unlike our so-called president, MS rice is willing to speak truth to power.
13