Neither Steve Mnuchin nor Jared Kushner are going to ever be confused with the 2nd coming of Lawrence of Arabia nor Ralph J. Bunche.
America is not seeking answers about the killing of the Saudi propagandist ally and friend of Osama bin Laden, the Muslim Brotherhood, Wahhabi clergy and the Saudi royals. Saudi Arabia has been slaughtering and starving Houthi Yemeni men , women and children with glee and gusto with Uncle Sam passing them the arms and ammunition.
America is seeking excuses for the killing of Jamal Khashoggi. It was an accident or it was a rogue operation or he was a terrorist or a traitor or we need to sell Saudi Arabia arms for the money and jobs or he worked for a Jeff Bezos owned newspaper.
Why would a foreign journalist's life matter more to America than thousands of Houthi lives?
Why can't Mohammed bin Salman and Saudi Arabia get a Benjamin Netanyahu Israeli pass from their American allies and friends?
2
This the same Gina Haspel who destroyed the evidence of her own participation in torturing Muslims “suspects” for terrorist activity against the USA. America is getting ROTTEN TO THE CORE.
The Soddy King appoints his son, the Clown Prince, ti investigate Murder, and we (the USA) appoint a destroyer of Torture Evidence to go conference with the Father & Son Murder Incorporated. To me it seems that America is sending an expert to guide the Soddies on how to DESTROY Eveidence and Spin Fairy Stories.
"But Mr. Trump reiterated the value of the $110 billion arms deal he announced with Saudi Arabia, as well as other American business ties with the kingdom. 'I do not want to lose the investment being made in our country,” he said.'"
Trump is no better than any of the greedy business moguls who are collaborating with the fabulously rich Saudi prince at the Saudi conference in Riyadh. If they didn't attend the conference themselves, they sent their minions; Trump sent Mnuchin.
For Trump, a deal trumps everything and money calls the tune.
1
It is a diappointment to me to see that the democratic news media New York Times and Washington Post, like the Trump administration, are downplayng the most beastly murder in modern history. But not so astonishing when I remember that all administrations in Washington has made the worst regime on earth their friend for a very long time. Is it very difficult to admit that this has been a great US blunder? But this fact is also a fundamental reason for people throughout the world to doubt that US mean anything serious when it speaks out about freedom, democracy and human rights.
1
Sorry, but since Gina Haspel, like the FBI in the case of the "FBI Investigation" of Kavanaugh, is under orders from President Trump, she has no possibility whatsoever of doing a fair and objective investigation. That, my friends, is the American we live in now--we have a royalty, and very, very crooked one at that.
1
Love the photo with this article. Mnuchin looks like he's ready to bolt if the prince pulls his sword. One picture is still worth a thousand words.
2
It's a pity that the Saudi liars don't know even the basic rule all liars follow: To make a lie believable, one has to stick to the narrative.
According to their first narrative, Khashoggi exited their consulate soon after he entered it. Thanks to the latest video leaked by the Turks, we now know that the Saudis did their best to back up that narrative: They made a Khashoggi body double wear Khashoggi's clothes and exit the consulate.
Bu their bluff was called when they changed the original narrative on Khashoggi's disappearance. The new one says that he was accidentally killed inside the consulate in a fistfight with 15 men.
After shamelessly parroting both narratives, President Trump now says that he is "not satisfied with what I have heard.” But he hastens to add that he wouldn't retaliate against the culprits because of the $110 billion arms deal he had announced with them. Aren't we tired of hearing about this deal? All reliable sources say that the actual contract signed in pursuance of the deal is only worth $5 billion. The richest country in the world worried of losing a $5 billion dollar contract? Whom is Mr. Trump kidding?
Is he reluctant to punish the Saudis because of the fear of jeopardizing billions of dollars’ worth of business transactions he and his son-in-law Jared Kushner are engaged in with them? One wonders what he is going to say if and when President Erdogan of Turkey gives his promised “unvarnished account” of what happened to Mr. Khashoggi.
.
1
I guess we'll soon see what Kushner and MSB cooked up as a ME 'peace' plan - crush Iran and Palestinians, making SA the one and only power in the region. This murder is just a clear and open symbol of what this administration plans for the ME, iron rule by autocracy.
"There are also fresh doubts about the Saudi government’s claim that Mr. Khashoggi was strangled accidentally after he got into a fist fight with 15 Saudi operatives."
As well there should be. In the second alibi (subsequent to the narrative that had Khashoggi walking out unharmed), the Saudi's claimed that the American green card holder and resident died as a result of the fist fight that was sparked by the incendiary conduct of the homicide victim. Later, a third story emerged in which Khashoggi attempted to leave and was placed in a choke hold that led to his strangulation.
None of the narratives have Mr. Khashoggi breaking free from the mob that was pummeling him, then being strangled to death by the killer who was supposedly trying to control a mild mannered journalist engaged in a dangerous plan to walk out of the building just as he had walked in. None of these stories point to anything but a state sponsored killing of a journalist identified by Saudi's crown prince as "an enemy of the people," as Donald Trump would put it. Lies, lies, and more contradictory lies!
8
It is only in Trump Administration where you find a treasury secretary in meeting with the accused Saudi prince of international crime, to discuss the crime and terrorism.
What are heads of CIA, NSA, Homeland Security and Secretary of State for?
6
Jared makes no pretense of being a servant, public or otherwise. He is a member of the imaginary king's royal family. Just as Ivanka screamed at Steve Bannon that she was "not staff," claiming the much higher rank (in her mind) of "first daughter," her husband is a prince by marriage. Be it a royal family or a mob family, there is no mistaking that the Trumps see themselves as autonomous rulers, much as MbS sees himself and his father as the embodiment of Saudi government, superior to all others in the realm (or elsewhere, as in the case of Khashoggi).
1
Jared Kushner clearly belongs nowhere near the field of public service if he is not open to listening to and engaging with critics. A public servant should be open to regarding viewpoints from constituents, even those whose views are in opposition to your own. Even those who don't agree with the way you do your job. That is the very nature of working with the public.
We already know that this Trump administration has no standards other than the gold standard a.k.a. the almighty dollar. As long as you an buy them, no doubt, you will have their ear.
9
It amazes me how Trump can spontaneously spout specious statements, it indicates decades of practice at twisting the truth. “I do not want to lose the investment being made in our country,” he said.
Saudi purchase of billions of $ of war materials is not an investment in the US, it is an investment in the continued slaughter of innocent children and civilians in Yemen.
How money can be a justification in continued relations with a despot country that beheads people for dissent and is praised for finally allowing women to simply drive a car is stunning hypocrisy.
American is not being made "great again", it is being exposed as the imperialistic tyrant it is. We are no longer looked to as a force of good in the world. Trump and his minions are seeing to that.
11
@Jussmartenuf
Sorry for correcting you, but America has always been a looter, a tyrant, an hypocrite. It started with Columbus "discovering" America; it continued throughout the colonial period; and of course it did not stop in 1876 (July 02 or 04, does not really matter). For a short period of time after WW2, it tried to distance itself from its atavistic norms. After, the demise of the Soviet Union, we are back to form: loot the weak, terrorise all others, never tell the truth, if you can tell a lie.
Drump's decision is based on his total lack of ethics or morality. He is a frantic opportunist. Never trust him, ever.
7
Deep in their guts, they believe that the Trump administration and many American voters prefer an alternative fact that there was enough evidence to support explanation offered by Saudi Arabia’s independent press.
For political maneuvering, of course, they may say they didn’t believe Saudi Arabian court’s from the beginning.
Whichever, the American voters are deciding what they want to believe and dividing the nation.
If it was just about money, the US wouldn't have walked away from hundreds of billions in Boeing contracts and other potential deals with Iran. The reason we buddy up to the kingdom that spawned 9-11 and ISIS is because our foreign policy has been hijacked by Israeli interests. Sheldon Adelson is Trumps biggest financial backer, and personally requested the replacement of national security advisor McMaster with Bolton. Adelson wants to eliminate all of Israel's regional adversaries (he has even publicly advocated for a demonstration of nuclear weapons in the middle east).
He has two options, either a) a war with Iran, or b) to destroy Iran's economy. In 2 weeks, Kushner will begin implementing part b) of this plan, with what will amount to an economic blockade of Iran. This will put Iran in a desperate situation where it is likely to strike out, giving the opportunity for the Trump administration to begin a) military action against Iran. That is why it is so important for them to cover up Khashoggi's' assassination.
11
They sent the CIA Director to help with the investigation? Unheard of.
That can only mean one thing: one of the assailants, or the fiancée, works for US intelligence. It might be the fiancée, from whom we heard nothing for a couple of weeks, and her willingness to simply wait while Khassoggi walked into what they both knew was possibly a trap seems odd to me.
The presence of a body double did complicate matters for her.
Yesterday it was reported that she was under the protection of the Turkish police. Today, Haspel arrives. A coincidence?
If the CIA had anyone involved in this murder, it will seem that Khashoggi’s life was traded for Saudi arms deals and investments in Trump and Kushner properties. That would mean that the CIA is a mob organization that kills to protect the commercial interests of the President’s family and the arms deal that offers thousands — no, millions — no billions of Americans jobs.
No wonder the President’s guesstimate is ever growing; he may know that the price that was paid for these alleged jobs and future hotel stays was too great: the life of a journalist.
And this should be a stark warning to all those who would turn a blind eye to what the CIA really stands for.
3
Did CIA director fly to Turkey to help with investigation or to find a way to cover up the torture?
5
Not a coincidence that Munchin visits as Ergo speaks. Gives US extra leverage to either show support via optics or denounce if they dont get improved terms in whatever they are scheming. We have a government of opportunists and they would never waste such an event serving the people.
4
Now we have the head of the CIA in Saudi Arabia. She obviously can't help with the details of the murder investigation because it ended when the Saudi government announced that he was killed. The CIA Director can only help to create a story about a murder. In this case it is to separate Prince bin Salmon from issuing the order to kill, and to create a story for where they put the body.
We have seen that secrecy and denial are the core of CIA activities. Sitting presidents do not identify and direct regime changes. The apparatus for making adjustments to the world order is the longtime body working silently in the background. We have learned indirectly of the countless regime changes that were never conducted by anyone other than the bad tooth fairy.
This is just the first step in the spin we are about to see. Soon the statesman in training, Pompeo, will give the story given by the appreciate president. He will say that the US will be tough on the Kingdom. The apprentice president will read from the cheat sheet that his controller, McConnell will give him. He will say that the kingdom is run by nice people. And finally, McConnell will say and do what his billionaire wealthy donors tell him to tell the President.
It would be surprising If there is anyone who doesn't realize that this is all a charade. The only one playing it straight is Erdogan. He is holding back until the kingdom issues the next falsehood.
7
"Once those facts come in, the secretary of state will work with our national security team to help us determine what we want to believe.” We probably know what Kushner and the administration WANT to believe, but it would be much better if they were interested in determining the TRUTH instead.
7
I, for one, feel a lot better knowing Mnuchin and Kushner are on this, don't you?
11
Relying on the house of Saud, funders of the 9/11 terrorists, to advance anti-terrorism measures, is like relying on Republicans to protect children's health and education. And we're paying them to do this to us?
13
Welcome to the era of Trump. What the Saudis do is of no concern to Trump as long as their money keeps flowing to Trump inc. Trump only "stands up" to those who can't fight back at him, our president is a coward. He knows that if he calls out the Saudis they will punch him back personally and financially. This is why our Constitution has an emoluments clause, to prevent foreigners from having undue influence on the decisions of our "leaders". But alas the rules only apply when a Democrat is in control, just ask Mr. Defecit hawks Paul Ryan and Mitch McConnell.
13
Just one of the downsides of petulantly electing businessmen over public servants (“Can’t trust politicians, nothing gets done. Drain the swamp!”). The only things Mnuchin is capable of “discussing” are investment portfolios and the color of his wife’s drapes in Aspen. Now, instead of trained diplomats committed to serving the US, we have Munchkin, committed to Saudi dollars. Would you trust that man to get to the bottom of anything, much less a murder?
I would say ‘despicable’ but the word has become overused in the last 2 years.
18
It is a lie to say the US is trying to get to the bottom of this.
What is happening is that the US, a serial murderer of massive proportions, is doing what it can to sweep it under a rug, so the world doesn't get inflamed for justice and start looking for other criminals, or start a real international criminal court and put American, or Israeli, or Russia leaders on trial.
The bald and bloody truth is, the rich and powerful run things, and must, from time to time, murder opponents. That is why Russia murders its turncoat spies, or Israel kills at will, or why America invades countries like Vietnam, or Iraq, or...
We could eliminate war in a generation and stop many of these murders by government simply by creating an international criminal court and make all nations subject to its jurisdiction. The fact that we don't means we plan on killing many more in the future.
But then, my country, in its wisdom, trained my entire generation to fight and kill and go to Vietnam to kill hundreds of thousands for the rich and powerful in America...as before, so tomorrow.
Hugh Massengill, Eugene Oregon
11
That court too would just become compromised. What we need is to be run by the spirit of democracy and freedom, in AI form. No human relationships or loyalties to disrupt the truth.
1
@Mark Patrick
Interesting thought, though I would rather just create a new type of international university, maybe sited on Alcatraz Island, where people from all over the world train to be international jurists.
AI, sure, it would be the most just, but it would also be the most corruptible, and corrupted, eventually.
Hugh Massengill, Eugene Oregon
Each crisis highlights the Trump administration's disregard for long held norms. America Intelligence Agencies are capable and probably already have reached a robust conclusion on what happened at the Saudi Embassy. Trump is giving the Saudi's a chance to clean up their story. This is is pathetic. The arms deal cannot be the reason America abdicates its responsibility to lead the world.
4
This has little to do with arms deals, if it was Trump would never have said it publically. Geopolitics and power balance in the region more so. Not to mention many personal fortunes at stake.
2
@Paul And what has Kushner been up to?
1
How are the Saudi's going to dumb it down enough so that Trump will accept it and still be able to do business with them.
Lets see, he's working to destroy the environment, creating trade wars to destroy the economy, tearing up treaties to destroy world security, accepting the fact that it's OK to kill news people so long as there's a big enough pay off, and all of these things have a price tag that makes money for him.
VOTE!
7
I think that the US should start ramping up oil production,,,, , just in case.
Plus it send Saudi a message - we will not be intimidated by talk of oil embargoes or cutbacks because we point an accusatory finger Saudi's way.
6
The coldness of Jared Kushner is astonishing and dangerous because Trump listens to him. His statement that “our job is to see through it, but also to stay focused on what’s best for the American people" is mind-boggling in its stark assertion that protection of commerce beats human rights. The subtext is that human rights are "not his job". I am not sure if he meant "see through it" or "see it through". The former is more chilling. So Kushner expects the administration to ignore the murder of one US resident whilst accepting blood money from the Saudis? How low can this regime go in its denial of human rights? One wonders how many murders it would take for Kushner to change his mind? Ten? Fifty? One Hundred journalists? What is on trial here is the intent, the values, the truth and the deception. Let Americans not be deceived also by the many smoke screens being emitted to change the subject. Erdogan has succeeded in keeping this murder alive and kicking for nearly three weeks. We need a proper investigation, trial and autopsy to determine the truth. In what is increasingly looking like a premeditated state assassination, establishing the guilt is critical since it occured in the borders of Turkey, although Kushner does not really see it that way.
Be in no doubt, for Kushner, more or less in his own words: the death of Jamal Khashoggi is a price worth paying.
24
Why was Treasury Secretary Mnuchin sent to meet with Crown Prince Salman in such a delicate legal and diplomatic crisis? This issue should be outside the purview of the Treasury Secretary. It underscores that it is, and always will be, all about the money. And lest we forget, Trump has not appointed an ambassador to Saudi Arabia. For such an important relationship, why do we not have an ambassador to Saudi Arabia? Too much of a risk for transparency into the Trump Organization’s business relationships there?
16
Pretty clear the White House has decided to view this as an opportunity to squeeze the Saudis for all they can.
5
@Mark Patrick
Right Mark. Under this administration the integrity of the United States is for sale to the highest bidder.
Human rights have been "Trumped" by dollars.
I still want to know what Mueller has found.
I still want to see Trump's tax returns.
2
During his talk with the Crown Prince, Mr. Mnuchin was overheard asking, "Aside from the dismemberment, Your Highness, how did your meeting with Mr. Khashoggi go?"
11
Trump has made clear that he will not give up Saudi dollars no matter how atrocious their acts. He is also severely personally compromised, as Saudi dollars bailed out Trump Inc. more than once, He should appoint a Special President capable of making competent decisions.
7
Given that Mr Khashoggi was a US resident and columnist for a US paper, isn’t it perfectly plausible that they dangled this in front of Pompeo or Jared before doing it? “So, how would you feel if we...”? A dissident, a journalist, a critic etc - a troublemaker. “Sure, just keep it quiet”. Gambling that the response would be muted and their initial cover story would be enough (incl. the ‘stunt double’ they sent for a stroll).
That would also explain MBS being astonished by the uproar.
7
Sounds like Turkey is preparing criminal charges. Justice Department should do the same (Khashoggi was a Virginia resident, so US should have jurisdiction) and jointly demand the Saudis to turn over those implicated for trial. Once outside the country, they may finger higher ups, including the Prince. If the Saudis balk, that would give Congress more grounds for sanctions.
8
A fake President sends his Sycophants like Mnuchin and Pompeo to confirm Saudi story and Trupet "no proof" and Turkey is lying.
14
Economics will take precedence over morality.
The financial influence the Saudi’s have throughout the world will insure they take no responsibility or accountability for the murder of the journalist.
Saudi Arabia has been killing thousands of civilians in Yemen.
It’s no surprise they killed one of their own.
The U.S. will capitulate to the murderous Prince.
Follow the money, it leads to the Swamp.
21
@JMS
I agree with your comment except for the first sentence. The first word should be money. Despite his claims to the contrary, Trump has repeatedly demonstrated his utter ignorance of economics. His tax cuts, climate change denying deregulations, and protectionist trade policies have resulted in unprecedented growth in the deficit.
10
Mixed signals yes, but not confusing signals. Trump and Jared want M.B.S. to come out clean as a rose. The rest of the Administration and Congress want him punished. We've seen this play before. It starred Vladimir Putin.
22
Steve Munchin was in Jerusalem before he flew to Riyadh to meet Mohammad bin Salman (MBS). He must have been persuaded by Netanyahu to overlook the Khashoggi killing and focus more on Iran sanctions and terror financing, while maintaining close tie with Saudi Arabia.
Since when does Jared Kushner is interested in “what’s best for the American people?” He stands unconditionally by MBS, arguing the young despot would survive the outrage. He seeks to be Machiavellian, but lacks the acumen to be savvy. Who knows how he and Trump benefit privately from their relationship with MBS.
“Dismissing criticism of his ties to the crown prince, Mr. Kushner said he did not pay attention to his critics. At another point, he said he heeded criticism only if it was from someone he respected.”
He must have respect for Henry Kissinger. But the former secretary of state struggled to find something good to say about him in April 2017, when asked to write an entry for Time’s annual list of the world’s 100 most influential people.
Comparing Kushner to Icarus, Kissinger wrote: “All this should help him make a success of his daunting role flying close to the sun.”
15
Trump and his administration will go through the motions (ineptly) and rely on the attention span of the US public, which is about 15 seconds, and then proceed as usual. Money comes first, last, always. Human life isn't even a distant second.
19
Well, the Davos in the Desert is becoming the Dry Hole in the Desert!
Khashoggi has become a cause célèbre. A lot of resources and energies were expensed to play the charade.
Did MbS know and when did he know it? But this is even sillier after the ever changing narratives from "Khashoggi who?" to "he fought with 15 guys and accidentally fell on a bone saw!" by leaving MbS two choices: 1) he is culpable or 2) he didn't know; therefore, he is incompetent.
After making a mess, he has finally gone to the King. But if the King is smart at all, Khashoggi has become a cause célèbre for a reason. There are pent up dissatisfactions from all corners that fake reforms and frail alliances cannot cover up. Kidnapping his own countrymen for ransoms doesn't help much too either. His doubling down on his favorite son could sow further seeds of malcontents
13
I think I might co-opt Jared kushner's best lineup of the article:
Every day we deal with people who are trying to deceive us in different ways,” Mr. Kushner said during a CNN forum in Manhattan. “But our job is to see through it, but also to stay focused on what’s best for the American people.”
Who's doing the deceiving Mr Kushner? you? the Saudi government? mr trump?
18
In Trumps America, if you have enough money, the US excuses the murder of a journalist. The US encouraged the murder by the President's attacks on the press.
16
Why go through all this charade?
What matters is the $110 billion arms sales.
What is one more bone saw when routine floggings and beheadings are the norm.?
Normally the shelf life of such shocking news is only a few days and in a few days it shall be business as routine!
8
The Trump administration is working overtime to try to mitigate the fallout of the sadistic murder by the Saudis of a journalist working for the Washington Post.Gina Haspel is not in Turkey to "help" with the investigation.If help were needed they would sent a team of expert agents.Ms. Haspel is there to work out a story which will match the information the Turks have.Mr Mnuchin showed up so there would be a photo-op with Prince Salman who wanted a visual to prove that the US was with him.Trump does not want to know the truth about the murder- he wants a mediated solution so the Saudi money can keep flowing.
28
The brutality of the Saudi leaders, their lack of accountability, their arrogance, and their repression of basic human freedoms -- these qualities are well-documented, and hardly news. But our own administration is demonstrating its total lack of any moral compass.
15
Can someone please clarify what was the point of pulling out of attending the conference if Mnuchin was going to go to Saudi anyway the same week?!...it completely undermines the message pulling out had sent.
I am so tired of reading how every time a US official has a meeting with MBS etc they have had discussions with their 'key ally' and on issues like counterterrorism, Iran etc. They are not a key ally, they are not in any qualified or fit to lecture Iran about aggression in the region and terrorism, and they are one of the most undemocratic nations on earth. Actually the more I look at this issue, Iran itself seems like a much more appropriate ally in the region in the long term.
Enough of this absolute nonsense that Saudi and the US has any form of shared values, culture, or mutually beneficial relationship.
50
We need a proper burial for Jamal Khashoggi. This should be a prerequisite for any further engagement with Saudi Arabia under MBS
11
MBS and Kushner are in their 30's? No wonder this kindergarten playground looks like a mess.
12
What IS that under the table ? The weirdness almost rivals the glowing crystal orb of Trump's first visit to Saudi Arabia in 2017.
5
@annpatricia23
Great start to a mystery novel.
The references to crystal orbs glowing and weirdness reads as New Age 80's stuff.
Lacks relevance to the article.
D-
1
“Every day we deal with people who are trying to deceive us in different ways. But our job is to see through it, but also to stay focused on what’s best for the American people.” Kushner
To a degree it does not matter who ordered the killing. The King did not and he represents the Saudi state. The King must deal with this matter to the satisfaction of the people of Saudi Arabia and to allies and the world.
The benefits of the decades long U.S.-Saudi partnership are clear and the relationship needs to be continued. But much depends on how Saudi leadership deals with this horrific situation.
A primary reason why the U.S. withdrew from JCPOA was because of the value the U.S. placed on the Saudi partnership.
It would be appropriate for the U.S. to now rejoin the JCPOA. This would be an indirect response to the Khashoggi killing that would be understood by Riyadh, that the U.S. must act in its national interests.
Withdrawal from JCPOA has made joint U.S.-Europe actions to counter Iran's behavior impossible. Reentry to JCPOA would enable joint U.S.-Europe action to address both nuclear proliferation and other concerns with Iran. Without multilateral commitment attempts to impose sanctions against Iran will fail. Failure is not what is best for the American people.
2
It looks as if the head of the CIA went to Turkey to see what Turkey got on the murder, under the pretext of helping, and at the same time MBS invited Mnuchin to offer a BRIBE, not personal but the US administration, in exchange of saving his behind. The fact that Mnuchin agreed to the meeting shows that the Trump administration is willing to leverage their indulgence for cash. However, I believe MBS should step down after this gruesome murder that violated diplomatic immunity.
11
Is the us govt so corrupt that it expects the crown prince to admit he dismembered our reporter? Yes it is.
10
It seems as if the Trump admin. is still hanging on, if only by a thread, to what is a rendition of the 'Keystone Cops' Saudi Arabian style.
5
Steven Mnuchin should be ashamed of himself. Willing to go to the Prince over money after the Khashoggi atrocity. A Trump and Kushner pawn.
Looks like this country, with its now leadership dependent on all those “moral Christians” out there, has forgotten that old warning “The love of money is the root of all evil.”
21
Munchkin? Shame? Laughable.
5
I’m no fan of Mr Mnuchin and I’m suspicious as to why he and Ms Haskell are giving him their ear. Just look at his body language in this photo ~ it tells me he’s terrified of MBS.
10
Finland has been arming some countries, but only for defence purposes. We have sold some weapons also to Saudi-Arabia. Some time ago we got to know that these weapons had been used in Yemen, where Saudis are fighting. After that The Ministry of Defence decided to stop arming Saudis. It is a question of only some tens of million USD:s , but using our weapons against the citizens of Yemen was against our principals.
35
Remember, Mr. Khashoggi was a reporter, an "enemy of the people" working for the disreputable Washington Post.
Maybe the Saudis took their cue from Mr. Trump? It is a very short step from demonizing American reporters to ignoring the killing of foreign ones.
29
Yes, one gets the feeling Trump secretly admires the Prince for his control over critics, just as he admires Putin and Kim.
8
Is this some kind of joke? It would appear that the last thing Turkey needs is “help” with the investigation. They have been three steps ahead of Saudi Arabia on this thing, publically humiliating them with perfectly timed releases of evidence, and seem to have solved everything except where the body is. If I were Turkey, I wouldn’t trust the CIA, and would assume everything that Ms. Haspel learns will immediately be conveyed to Riyadh by her boss. News flash; the crime has already been solved. The fact that the murderers are lying and denying doesn’t make it any less solved.
54
@Jim I believe the Turks, not this "administration." Gina Haspel's mission is to whitewash facts, much like a perp cleaning down a crime scene with bleach. Her predecessor at the CIA, Pompeo, was the bagman; the Saudis transferred $100 million to the U.S. simultaneously with his landing at Riyadh last week. Who was that money actually paid to?
4
"U.S. Seeks answers ..." Really???
From my cheap seats in the rafters, it looks like the dead last thing Donald and his henchmen want is anything close to the truth.
Trump doesn't want answers, especially ones that would shine light on his murky back alley deals with Saudi Arabia and Russia. Mo Money Donnie wants more money. That's the only "answer" we're going to get from this.
28
@Sarah
My comments are my own.
Why are Americans so angry?
I live in Australia and I try to reference my comments based on verifiable sources.
My opinions are my own and try to make comment identifiably as such.
Financial relationships concerning Saudi Arabia and Russia have not been denied and may conflict with his tenure as President and foreign policy decisions if legally scrutinised.
Happily Americans can vote in November.
Saudi Arabia is a rogue state and we are helping them, everyday, murder innocent children in Yemen. We sold them our intelligence and arms, and we refuel their planes in the air as they bomb Yemen under the pretense that they needed better intelligence so that they wouldn't kill children. That is turning out to be untrue from the reporters who are risking their lives to enter that war zone. Saudis seem to be targeting civilians in Yemen using our intelligence to do it. Then, this horrifying murder of a US resident and journalist is slowly, painfully, revealed. And we are still talking money and arms? Where is America's moral compass? Is this really who we have become? I would rather work by candlelight than worry one minute over money or oil coming from the Saudi's. Invest in renewable energy, Mr. Mnuchin, not Saudi Arabia. Make our treaty with Iran work so we can dump those who harbored the 911 killers once and for all.
22
An expert on rendition and 'enhanced interrogations' and of destroying their record, who is promoted, is sent to find out what happened?And she is assisted by a former movie producer?
As they say in New York city:" what's not to like?"
4
@ Chuck Berger. Right. It’s all our fault? Since when do two wrongs make a right? Pointing out possible US complicity in other venues serves no productive purpose at this time in particular.
4
@RjW Never said it was all our faut, and not excusing the Saudi's. I think it's valid to point out that others around the world will view us as hypocritical for getting up in arms about this, when assassination (killing outside of war, without judicial process) is for the U.S. a standard practice. My hope is to raise some awareness that U.S. military killings abroad are basically unethical, and to encourage people to change that policy. I'd consider that a productive purpose.
1
Unless Trump is prepared to have an objective view of the Khashggi murder case that seems impossible given his closer ties with the Saudi rulers, the US seeking further explanations from the Saudis is nothing but an eye wash.
10
I supect that the real and possibly only reason that Mr Mnuchin is in Riyadh is to ensure that the arms deal that the Trump administration care so much about is still on track.
No one could have failed to notice that this has been President Trump's real concern throughout this entire saga inspite of expressions of outrage and threats of dire repercussions!
37
Those who are so outraged by this latest killing would do well do recall that the U.S. has openly undertaken a campaign of assassination - euphemistically, "targeted killing" - across a broad swathe of Africa and Asia over the past 2 decades. The only difference between the killing of Khashoggi and the attempt on Sergei Skripal is that those were both done in a very personal way, whereas the U.S. prefers death by drone strike.
The moral context in which Russia and Saudi Arabia act with impunity was not set by Mr. Trump's bellicosity, but rather by the U.S. abandonment of international criminal enforcement in favour of unilateral assassinations under the Bush and Obama administrations.
Fine to be outraged about the killing of Khashoggi - but consistency demands we be equally outraged with our own conduct.
21
@Chuck Berger
this kind of whataboutism, although factually true, is a fallacy.
none of this validates what KSA did here and you can see that quite clearly by looking at the concept of intentions.
if the US had it their way (regarding the reason behind assassinations, think about who gets killed here) they would turn the rest of the world into nebraska. there'd be a starbucks on every corner.
if KSA had it their way (regarding the reason behind assassinations, again, think about who gets killed here) they'd turn the rest of the world into a 7th century hellscape where saying the wrong thing is a death sentence.
no one is denying that the US hasn't killed abroad in similar fashion. terrorist leaders, true. "collateral damage", unfortunately true. a kid they thought was a killer but was actually just holding his phone, also unfortunately true.
but journalists? for exercising free speech?
intentions matter.
6
@moralhazard You're right, it doesn't "validate" what the Saudi's did, and I didn't say that it did. And yes, intentions matter... although how do you know what U.S. intentions were with any given killing? What's the basis for assuming our intentions were "good", if that's the right word, when the "process" for ordering an assassination is subject to no transparency or legal regime?
I made my comment not to excuse Saudi Arabia, but because I believe U.S. conduct has given implicit "go ahead" to authoritarian regimes to do the same. The U.S. isn't responsible for Khashoggi's killing, but it is responsible for creating a global regime where such things are commonplace. There's no fallacy there.
@Chuck Berger
"... U.S. has openly undertaken a campaign of assassination - euphemistically, "targeted killing" - across a broad swathe of Africa and Asia over the past 2 decades. …"
Yes, true. However, the US is not killing journalists. Huge difference. Assassinating guys like Bin Laden is not 'equivalent' to killing guys like Khashoggi.
2
CIA Director Gina Haspel departed for Turkey on Monday.
Afterall, she is the expert on interrogations gone wrong.
But does she really know fist fights?
Nothing should be surprising in the Trump years,
but seriously, the CIA chief flies to Turkey,
for what exactly?
39
@Blue in Green : Answer : flies to Turkey for an Ansaoudwer.
or to be precise how to remain serious -even if it is necessary to recognize the seriousness of the situation and the dramatic chaos resulting from a cold blood murder- in the face of a Planetary Joke. And so-believed serious adults want to continue conducting business with a world-class assassin ?
9
Blue: The Turks have the tapes and other evidence. Why wouldn’t our CIA want to see this? It might help extricate us from the Venus Flytrap known as Saudi Arabia.
3
@Blue in Green Perhaps Ms. Haspel has some more torturing to oversee and cover up. Isn't that her sole qualification?
1
I am so disgusted that yet again, Saudi gets away with murder. Just like after 9/11/01 the USA doesn't care.
And why on earth are we arming them? We should be pulling all contracts and deals and tell them to eat oil.
All the usual corrupt,greedy suspects rush off for some bribe money.
What on earth is that contraption under the table?
51