This was a guy who should not have been running around loose.
As strongly as I support the 2A, there was no excuse for giving Reinking anything dangerous, let alone firearms.
1
The first step when someone is mentally deranged should be to remove all guns from them until they are deemed normal by a judge. Family members should not be in a position to return these guns.
1
The combination of untreated mental illness, which this man has clearly had for years, plus rediculous gun laws that allow him to have guns plus a father who should be charged with being an accessory to murder leads to tragedy. I am so sad for the victims who did not need to die. I am also sad for the young man who had no mental health care. There is something seriously wrong with this country where we're too cheap to properly care for the mentally ill while providing access to guns, including assault rifles, to anyone. Shame on us.
2
If our law enforcement agencies can't protect us, then what?
See NYT-- "Comparing Gun Deaths by Country: The U.S. Is in a Different World", June 13, 2016
In other democracies they don’t let wealthy gun lobbies donate to their candidates to promote norms of irrational acceptance of guns for all as a mark of individual liberty.
Here, irrational gun violence goes on and on, as if we are powerless because our govt's priorities are warped.
See past op ed after another horrible massacre by Richard Painter, Bush's ethics lawyer---"The NRA Protection Racket”. Says if US politicians don’t play ball, their donors threaten to run somebody against them in a primary who will.
The money factor is coupled with our irrational gun laws being identified with “American Freedom from big govt”. This combines to endanger all our safety. The bodies of the dead and injured keep piling up.
Yet polls show most gun owners, and even many NRA members favor stronger gun control laws. Where are they on our media? Let them be interviewed on televised town halls to tell the public their reasons.
‘Yes-- “WEAPONS CONTROL” --- let’s not be afraid to use those words, to counter the promotion by our weapon profiteers and their dupes.
Let’s affirm our independence from the gun lobby over our politics, and demand sensible rules passed by democratically elected govt to protect public safety---govt’s 1st duty.
2
What was the father of this disturbed young man thinking?
1
He wasn't. Thinking, I mean.
2
"It's the guns, stupid." In the end when we see these tragedies, it's about guns which have no other purpose but to maim, terrorize, and kill.
3
Can't wait to see what the NRA has to say about this one.
1
My questions are with the father of this mentally unstable man. What do you say to the family of your son's victims? Why did you give assault weapons back to your son? Can your hands ever be clean?
4
My country is in deep trouble with no help in sight. Why didn't the cops just keep the weapons. The kid was obviously sick and his dad was probably no better.
5
DEMAND MUCH STRICTER GUN LAWS NOW.
2
I do believe the state of Illinois and Jeffrey Reinking are culpable in the 4 innocent lives lost while eating breakfast on a Sunday morning.
More guns and less laws! When will it ever end?
Stop the NRA and gun lobbyist from being just citizens from election donations.
What a messed up country
3
A mentally ill son. A delusional dad. An AR-15 assault rifle. What can possibly go wrong?
5
How long before someone on the far right fringe declares this as a false flag operation?
1
Why couldn't the firearms have been confiscated under the onerous "civil forfeiture" laws? They take homes, cars, cash, etc, but not guns from a mentally ill person?
4
Gun laws are too lax. Someone in this condition should not have access to guns and neither should his father if his father is that careless. The Father should be held accountable. Why would he return an military style weapon to a son that was so clearly deranged? Why did the local police in his home town not take greater action to investigate where his guns were and if he had access to them? Over and over again the police fail to take timely action to prevent these shootings where there is clearly a deranged person who is putting themselves and others at risk.
4
The judicial system here in Nashville is trying to release Reinking on bond. A huge outcry stopped it today, but there may be a renewed attempt tomorrow. Great.
2
"His case raises questions over how such a troubled individual could have legally carried weapons for so long..."
No it doesn't. Those "questions" have an obvious, well-known answer: the Republican Party is owned by the NRA and the supporters of both organizations are dangerous, bloodthirsty fanatics.
6
Since we don't have basic mental health care or hospitals available anymore, we just let people run around our country like it's an open air asylum but with guns available to all. What could possibly go wrong?
We've now all gone collectively insane, with mass fear and paranoia.
Our nation is a pathetic, helpless mess.
Uncivilized nations lapse. Quickly.
6
Based on misinformation posted by a reader last night, sourcing Reuters ...
A name like ‘Minassian’means the driver’s patralinial relatives were originally from one of the former Yugoslavian states, perhaps Serbia or Croatia.
If so, given the name, his male ancestors were most likely Christian.
The horrific act may have been done as an act to incite terror - of a particular man seeking 15 minutes of fame and looking to end things with a “suicide-by-police, something Toronto ‘s/Ontario ‘s/Canada ‘s police in general do not care to provide as willingly as their southern neighbor’s. In that nation, personal handguns are few, especially in the @30 mile strip north of the US border where 90% of Canada’s @30 million people live - with a radically different culture masked by an externally common language where words carry very different connotations.
The vile allegations concerning the faith and intent of the driver in the time-connected Toronto van massacre, insisting the Toronto driver was a Muslim committing “terrorism” appear to this amateur linguist to have been FALSE, whether actually posted on Reuters, or a creation claiming to be quoting Reuters on a Social Media open gossip system or a hate site.
People frequently ”upgrade” an info source and, accept easily altered photos & video on Facebook & the like as accurate- or believe anything on the ‘net as they accepted TV and newsreel images over witnessed newspaper stories - and will explain they “saw” it happen.
1
How was this man never arrested? If he were black at least one of these incidents before the shooting would have lead to his arrest, if not his tasing and death.
6
Typically, the NRA is silent when the circumstances don't fit their narrative. I suppose if a good guy with a gun had shot the bad guy like John Wayne, there would be righteous praise of heroism. Instead, unarmed black guy wrestles gun from (another crazed white male) shooter, and wait for it....crickets.
8
The father must be charged as well.
11
Make no mistake: Jeffrey Reinking is an accessory to murder. He should be charged immediately and imprisoned for life: if he hadn't given his mentally ill son the means to commit murder, 4 people would be alive in Nashville today. What a despicable person Mr. Reinking the elder is; his son is clearly suffering, but might have only resorted to self-harm if he hadn't gotten his guns back from his loathsome father.
10
Yeah!
The almost unlimited right to own guns carries with it an implicit and de facto right to commit murder.
The accused was simply exercising his 2nd Amendment rights.
Most Americans values their gun over their children; the proof is this sour, rotten pudding.
6
So he walks into a Waffle House wearing no pants carrying an assault rifle and kills four innocent people. What rung of hell are we living in? I can't even find the words for the grieving families. . .
6
Your holy 2nd Amendment guaranteed Reinking's right to bear arms.
8
How could such a troubled person still be in possession firearms? Well how in the heck do you THINK such a thing could possible?
Because we made it so. Because 400+ shot in Las Vegas, and 800+ injured, and 59 dead, doesn't mean a damn thing to Americans. Because all the kids shot in all the schools over the last 50 years do not mean a damn thing to anyone. And the PROOF is in the FACT that we do NOTHING about it.
11
You look at these blank face perps, they all look brain impaired, as if their mothers drank heavily while pregnant with them. I see people up here who have this appearance, and they all are less than 100%
6
When I heard this on the news I was reminded of the Sandy Hook shooting where the perpetrator's mother and first victim had the weapons in a locked cabinet in the living room (apparently).
4
Mr. Reinking's father clearly knew his son was deranged and yet gave him back his guns. I believe that Mr. Reinking's father should be prosecuted as an accessory to murder and also be charged with depraved indifference. He MUST be accountable for his actions.
17
This story chronicles the absolute ineffectiveness of our mental health laws and many of our gun laws. Just as with the Stoneman High School killer, this man also slipped through our laws and law enforcement officials--and four people are dead because of it. This man is obviously mentally ill, but he has been enabled by forces and people in his life. To say that these killings weren't racially motivated because the alleged murderer is mentally ill is a weak and incorrect conclusion. A person can be mentally ill and a racist. Another sad failure of our mental health system and our gun laws--not to mention this man's family and friends.
8
The father here owns a large part of the responsibility. Clearly his son was mentally ill. So by giving his guns back to him, his father is equally guilty for the deaths of these people. This also demonstrates how difficult it is to remove access to guns from the mentally ill.
11
So many levels of incompetence here. Why did the Secret Service not confiscate this guys guns, forever and charge him with a crime...and commit him to a mental institution? Why did the local police give the guns to his father, who lived in the same house? Why hasn't the father be charged? Why aren't guns just seized and crushed? At what point does someone lose their right to possess military style weapons? And finally, why did Republicans pass a law allowing mentally ill people to own guns and why do voters keep electing them?
10
Only a court of law using professional advisers can adjudicate a person mentally ill and deny them access to their constitutional rights. The blame falls again on law enforcement for failing to follow through on a complaint.
How many crazy things must a person say and do before he's evaluated legally by a judge and psychiatrists?
Too bad it doesn't quite fit the standard in IL, for a charge of felony-murder for the father. Anyway, this case study offers a powerful argument for making high-capacity magazines illegal.
2
Let us not forget the fact that the brave man who stopped the shooter did not need a gun. So much for carry and conceal nuts.
7
I hope the victims' families are permitted to sue the shooter's father on some negligence theory for returning the guns to the son, when the family was aware of the shooter's failing and dangerous mental state. The father's irresponsible action of returning the guns is simply incomprehensible. I wonder if the father also considers himself to be a "sovereign citizen"?
9
It's upsetting that this man's father would give him back his guns under the circumstances. But didn't an even worse dereliction of duty and common sense take place when deputies gave the guns to the father? What cockamamie theory of law enforcement would dictate, or allow, an action like this?
5
Returning confiscated guns to a parent makes little sense. That parent obviously had no problem with his son having the guns in the first place.
Under our new Vermont law, guns can be confiscated from persons such as this and held by the State itself. And there is due process in the courts, in either having the confiscation period extended by the State, or ended by the owner.
But returning the gun to a parent for safe keeping? Ridiculous. Adam Lanza's mother actually bought him his gun.
8
Many of the gun control laws we currently have in place, clearly did not work in this instance. Neither did they work for the Parkland massacre. I don"t believe more laws are the answer, enforcing those laws along with a little common sense would go along way.
2
Maybe it is because the laws are not strict enough. If the law permitted the police to confiscate and hold the guns this crime was less likely to happen.
4
I would hope that the father is prosecuted for letting his son have the guns back.
That said, it is not guns that is the problem, it is the pathetic state of mental health assistance that led to this problem... there were numerous warning signs and I have yet to see in articles and news clips any real help offered to Travis.
The bombs, knife attacks, and van tragedies all show that if there are not guns, some other way will be found to do harm. We need to get to the bottom of what is driving this alarming trend that drives people to these extremes, and deal with it. Would be a very interesting psychological study, that could have a profound positive impact.
Illinois could institute a system where the state or local jurisdictions keep firearms for anyone whose permit is revoked and not released to anyone without court orders to do so following hearing determining that public safety is assured in doing so. Unclaimed guns after a certain time unless determined otherwise by a court should be destroyed.
Since Bush was President Congress has cut funding for the Firearms inspection and protection unit. There is not enough personnel to enforce existing laws. This GOP congress wants states to honor concealed weapons permits from other states. Just who will enforce new law this and pay for it. Rather the crowing about their Tax Reduction bill that trows the country deeper in debt, this Congress has reduced access to mental health care and enforcement of existing gun laws. President Trump in his first 6-months in office made it easier for people with mental health problems to buy firearms. Go thank and Evangelical and a Koch Brother.
2
So here is one more shooting by a person who was not allowed to have guns. It would seem that the issue isn't so much 'gun control' (should be called 'reform' for PC purposes if we ever want a change), but the inability of law enforcement and the system we live under to reliably enforce the laws. Everyone here seems to think more laws are better, but I'd say if we enforced current laws at the national level, we'd have eliminated most of the tragedies of the last 20 years.
It's a simple approach to attack gun ownership and the NRA and gun manufacturers. But that's not the root cause, and most know it.
This person's father (no name mentioned as it glorifies the criminal) should be put in prison for years. It was his illegal act that led to this tragedy. Period, end of story.
3
"Yet even after the Illinois police revoked his firearms license and ordered that his guns be transferred to his father, Mr. Reinking got them back, including the AR-15 used in the Tennessee shooting ... " This is why all the talk about databases, mental health screening, etc., is just a dodge by the NRA and its followers. With thousands of gun shops selling such lethal weapons, weapons with no legitimate civilian purpose, it is not hard for anyone to obtain one. That includes deranged people like this shooter. If nothing else, a person can simply pay another person with a clear record to buy the gun for him. These type weapons must be banned.
2
I believe in the right of private citizens to be able to own reasonable weapons for personal and home defense and for hunting (reasonable means no mass killing machines). But we must as a society raise meaningful hurdles and create a process that ensures these people are mentally stable, not criminals, competent in the use and storage of these weapons, and will be held accountable. Why can’t we legislate this the way we legislate motor vehicles. This is the public health issue of our times. Responsible gun owners please continue speaking up on this issue and don’t support the crazy NRA.
1
I'm a gun owner and fan. I support REASONABLE gun control. For instance, no military weapons in civilian hands.
4
"no military weapons in civilian hands."
The AR 15 and others like it are not military weapons. I've been in the military and what I used there were military weapons.
Was this a case of Tennessee's general laxity regarding gun ownership playing out on a city street? Does local law enforcement mirror the states republican support for the NRA?
Is it a matter of giving someone who wishes to pick up a gun the benefit of the doubt? As long as their name does not show up on a list? Or they are vouched for by a relative?
This is a mind set that could reasonably be expected to have an effect when an unhinged individual intent on killing someone reaches for a weapon and picks up an efficient killing machine like the AR-15.
1
Something deep down tells me we are not hearing the entire story, truth, about Travis Reinking and this relationship with his father.
I can't help but wonder if there was a bit of shall I say behind the scenes 'negotiating' going on regarding Travis' last brush with the Capital Hill police and those guns. Which in and of itself, is deeply troubling.
Why was the son, a legal adult at age 28 not formally charged by Federal authorities last August, for the trespassing. Which leads one to ask, why was the AR-15 not confiscated by authorities and instead 'returned to the father' of a legal adult. Does this infer that Jeffrey Reinking is acting as the son's legal guardian, due to his low IQ and high degree of past criminally negligent behavior.
Or is the father a hot headed second amendment screamers who demanded the Feds return "his guns" or 'he'd sue'.
I smell corruption and white entitlement wafting out of this latest tragic case of criminally negligent murder.
When will this madness end.
23
By what right did the father have a claim on his son's guns in the first place? At the time the guns were taken away, Travis Reinking was an adult. Those guns belonged to him alone. Once confiscated, how would a Sheriff justify handing them to anyone -- father, friend, stranger. It's akin to confiscating my car for drunk driving, and handing the keys to my neighbor. What gives?
Those guns should have remained out of circulation, locked in a police station. In addition to prosecuting Travis' father, Federal agents should look long and hard at the Sheriff's decision to relinquish the guns to the father, in the first place.
67
I'm as conservative as people come and I agree with you 100%
2
Perhaps the father claimed they were some kind of family heirloom? Regardless, if someone is caught on the White House lawn, they should be thankful they are still free and they should have nothing more dangerous than takeout chopsticks.
A golden opportunity for the president of the US to recognize the heroic efforts of a man who wrestled away the deadly weapon from someone who had just killed four people and injured others. Not a word even with his expanded Twitter at the ready. Could it be that the killer was a white man, the hero was a black man and all those dead were not white?
48
I see many instances in this case where if he were black he would have been shot and killed by the police before now. White privilege continuously gave him benefit of the doubt.
48
An accurate and succinct assessment of a major intersection in this tragedy. It's interesting that this comment, nor any that implicate race are among the NYT picks.
2
Contrary to the impression one might get reading this article, the New York Times has generally supported the right of most mentally ill to own firearms. See, for example, the following front page article
https://www.nytimes.com/2014/10/19/nyregion/mental-reports-put-34500-on-...
This philosophy was also evident in several columns the Times published following the Parkland shooting.
There is an obvious trade-off here, between the rights of the many people with many types of mental illness, and the desire to avoid mass murder as here and in Toronto. The vast majority of people with mental illness do not turn to violence.
But I think the Times is wrong on this issue, and that we should restrict the right of those with mental illness to own guns. Frankly, its not a big deal if one is not allowed to own a firearm. Personally, I would like to see more gun control, but I also must respect the Constitution, as interpreted by the Supreme Court.
But it seems clear we can and should pass laws prohibiting those with many forms of mental illness from owning guns, and laws prohibiting assault rifles, large ammunition magazines, etc, and still comply with Supreme Court's interpretation of the Second Amendment. And we should.
7
Quite disappointed by the biased reporting and analysis of both the Nashville and Toronto mass murderers in their respective countries.
The press and law enforcement authorities in the US and Canada cannot bring themselves to label these senseless acts of barbarism as forms of terrorism, pure and simple. Unfortunately Reinking's status as a WASP and Minakian's as a purportedly Christian Armenian do not fit into the contemporary world's narrative of ALL terrorists today having to be affiliated with Islamic society. If nothing else, both monsters appear to be sexually embittered misfits who struck out at random humans as an expression of their frustrated libidos. So many walking time bombs amongst the North American young white men who refuse to admit that minorities and women have got the right to fulfillment in life, too.
19
Did you know that there's a legal definition of "terrorism" in our penal code? If it would make you happy to see the word used more widely, get in touch with your elected barnacles and see if they'll change the law so it satisfies your cravings.
Reinking's father MUST be charged. Absurdly, and CRIMINALLY irresponsible.
46
The FBI should be arresting guys like Travis Reinking rather than harassing President Trump's lawyer, Michael Cohen.
5
The FBI is a very big organization. They are able to do many things at the same time.
2
how about both!
1
Why can’t they do both John?
1
While the fact the man's father returned these weapons to his obviously mentally ill son, keep in min that it is extremely difficult to require someone with a mental illness to be institutionalized or to have treatment if they do not want it. This is a real problem. Families in some cases know their family member is dangerous, either to other and/or themselves, yet there is nothing they can do until the person takes a negative action. I remember the Congressman from VA who took his son to a hospital and they said there were not beds - on the way home the son stabbed the father, almost killing him, and then I believe committed suicide. We have a serious problem with lack of mental health facilities and providers, and we must examine laws which make it nearly impossible to deal with someone who is dangerous to themselves and others. On top of that, we need to improve our gun laws to try and make it more difficult for these folks to obtain and use fire arms.
24
There is a good reason it's difficult to commit someone against their will. In fact, there are many good reasons why it's very difficult to institutionalize people without their consent. We should not abolish these protections in order to fix our gun control problem. You observation about a lack of capacity is correct and entirely different than the difficulty of commission. It should be difficult to institutionalize someone, but it should not be difficult to remove weapons designed to kill people from their possession.
Yes, quite simple don't give them a gun.
@Meg....
I'm curious to know what's your criteria for commitment? He had delusions. Fantasies unconnected to any reality. Human life meant nothing to him.
Naturally, most mentally ill people are going to resist being committed. But the 1st duty of a modern society is to separate them, treat them, and protect their families and the public.
It's not only guns. The case described says the son stabbed the father after the hospital didn't admit him. We see also on the news regular cases of children being murdered by parents.
Irrational, possibly dangerous people have to be committed, then evaluated over time by responsible experts to diagnose their illness.
It's absurd to think just because some dictatorships have put opponents in mental wards, that the the US should go too far in the opposite direction and let deranged people endanger all our safety.
Jeffrey Reinking should be charged with murder for returning guns to a mentally ill son.
27
"But under the law, the process to keep firearms out of the hands of a person whose card has been revoked is weak, allowing many people to keep access to the weapons with little threat of enforcement or penalty."
Win for the NRA!!
Loss for the victims of the shooting and the rest of society.
The NRA says "people kill people." Here, the people who resist common-sense regulation of our "well-regulated militia" helped in the killing of four customers at a restaurant.
17
Travis will be declared mentally incompetent and committed to a hospital. Jefferey needs to go to jail as if he pulled the trigger himself.
13
Suddenly I have lost all desires for waffles and even other early morning meals.........
1
Florida? Figures.
1
When Cleveland can rightfully knock your state down a peg you know you've got a problem!
jk stay cool Cleveland
NRA spokesperson: "Second Amendment Rights! Second Amendment rights! If we let them take away guns from crazy people, where will it end. Next thing you know they'll be taking away guns from us so-called sane people."
6
Well, so much for our "gun control" programs, America! Perhaps we should start building once again those "cold war" backyard bunkers.......But, on the other hand, the killer bus drivers would probably locate us there and bury us. Where to hide, Where to hide, America??? Maybe colonizing the moon IS the next best thing to consider.........
1
The State of Tennessee should be issuing warrants for the arrest of Wayne LaPierre, Mitch McConnell, Paul Ryan and Donald Trump in addition to the father of this murderer. All of these so-called leaders have allowed mentally ill people access to weapons of war. It is past due time for this to end. We as a nation cannot be responsible for allowing a man this ill to own a semi-automatic weapon. The US Congress needs to immediately pass strict controls, registration and bans as needed. This is a state of emergency and our nation is in crises. Our elected leaders are at fault and if no action is taken by the November election then we the voters must vote these scoundrels out of office. The time for prayers is over, the time for new laws is now.
8
Seems another case where the authorities had ample warning and did nothing. The system is failing due to the people in it. Almost all of these crazies were known to authorities ahead of the killings. We need to totally reevaluate the types and abilities of people we put in these important positions. Paying low wages, bashing them publicly, ignoring their problems will not work. Our FBI, police system, courts, social systems, mental health services are inadequate. No matter what laws are passed these problems will stop progress.
21
Good for Mill Valley, which I often ridicule as over-evolved. How many times does the cliche 'failed to connect the dots' apply to these situations?
The authorities aren't the problem. It's the guns .
Unfortunately, we can expect more of the same from those who are both sane or insane. More violence and aggression when we as a country fundamentally support and encourage a culture of gun violence, and when black lives, and lives of people of color, matter little. I admire the efforts of the young who are trying to turn the tide, but I have not seen any outcry on the scale of the 1960s protests. Tells me that we have a long way to go to change this culture.
6
There is a very simple solution to all this, so that we don't see variations on this article every other week: ban guns, starting with semiautomatic rifles.
12
Anyone who has a fire arms permit revoked should have their guns revoked as well, permanently.
Once again, weak laws and lax law enforcement has led to a public massacre.
10
I am amazed that his behavior at the White House got him only 32 hours of community service, considering his history. It should have resulted in jail time and/or involuntary commitment until he stabilized. Did he also get 32 hours of community service for the BMW theft?
It’s just very disappointing that he was so underpenalized.
8
How about undertreated?.
Has anyone else noticed that, if you kill lots of white people, you're a terrorist, but if you kill lots of black people, you're just "mentally ill"?
41
Ding ding ding.
1
This shooter is a poster child for what the NRA has done to our nation. The NRA's recklessness, callous inhumanity, and lust for blood money gives free reign to killers like this. When you strip away all of the rhetoric- THIS is what the NRA stands for. And because the NRA owns the Republican party, this is also what Republican politicians stand for, too.
21
If families are supposed to be the first line of defense in keeping guns away from people who shouldn't have them then we should at least do the following:
Publish a photo of the father that gave the guns back to the perpetrator.
Send the father to prison as an accessory to murder.
15
So there are up to 7,000 more people with a troubling (violent?) history that have not surrendered their guns. In Illinois alone. And we wonder why this keeps happening.
14
The son belongs in a mental institution. The father belongs in jail.
36
It is a federal crime to transfer a firearm to a person known to have been convicted of, or under indictment for, a crime punishable by imprisonment for a term exceeding one year; likewise if the recipient has been adjudicated as a mental defective or has been committed involuntarily to any mental institution.
It is also a federal crime for an unlicensed person to transfer a firearm across state lines without a background check by a federally licensed dealer, manufacturer, or importer, even if the recipient is legally allowed to possess the firearm. Jeffrey Reinking seems to have remained a resident of IL while Travis was living in TN. If the elder Reinking transferred the firearms without involving a federal licensee, he presumably either broke IL state law by transferring to someone who had lost his FOID card, or he broke federal law by crossing state lines. If a background check was in fact done and Travis passed it, this may be yet another case of the U.S. background check system failing (e.g. Sutherland Springs).
A usual NRA talking point is that existing federal firearms laws should be enforced more stringently. Trump and IL governor Bruce Rauner were elected with NRA support. Let's see if they do what the NRA claims that it wants: throw the book at Jeffrey Reinking, and/or enact comprehensive reform of the NICS background check system.
14
To SCOTUS, the NRA, and Murphy's law I would like to present the Rube Goldberg award for foisting on us a system, so flawed, that it guarantees unlimited future mass murders.
12
The shooter and his father are guilty of murder.
The Tennessee government from the top down are all in the pocket of the NRA, so nothing will ever be done to fix the problem, which are the guns.
26
So, bottom line all the gun control ideas that IL, a totally Blue state, failed, just as they did in FL where a liberal democrat sheriff refused to act.
Why? No one wanted to commit either of these obviously sick men.
Why? Too much trouble and expense for GOVERNMENT bureaucrats.
We can not continue to believe more government will work, until the government we have starts working.
5
Unfortunately, we have this thing called the Constitution. Even mentally ill people have rights. Stop whining about the Government, you are a voter, and you ARE the GOVERNMENT!!!
7
Well at least one party has decided that lower taxes are more important then basic services. Rural Illinois is pretty red.The County Sheriff never checked to see if the court order was being upheld; the father violated the court order - these men are as responsible as the actual shooter. But in red Illinois and Tennessee they'll get a pass. The NRA will moan able mental health - but no funding will ever be made available.
1
The shooting occurred in TN. Why didn't the authorities there, fail to apprehend him before he went on his shooting spree. Why did they allow him to cross into their state with guns. Oh yea, reciprocity.
Maybe this is A perfect time to share accountability with the Father. Maybe make people think before handing weapons out?
I also feel the authorities done their pet taking license and firearms. After that I’m sure we can’t afford to follow all these type people around weeks after an altercation.
6
The enabling father has much to answer for.
50
He deserves a gold medal for stupidity -- and at least a 50 year prison sentence for being an enabler of mass murder, too.
9
This is classic paranoid schizophrenia. These people should never have access to guns as even with proper treatment they can frequently relapse.
The father should be charged as an accessory to murder and his business should be seized to compensate the family of the victims. Love, prayers and understanding is all well and good, but action and justice are needed.
96
Talk about white privilege.
Reinking never had to take responsibility and was always given yet another chance, ending in the taking of four BLACK lives. And racism wasn't a factor because he was mentally ill? Gettouttahere.
8
Ultimately, it's up to the voters to get rid of politicians in the grips of the NRA so that change can be made to some of these gun laws. But, voters don't do that, so these events will continue. Too many still believe in the NRA slogan about guns not killing people, even as the bodies pile up. Considering all these people have bullets in them, it's hard to agree that a gun didn't kill them. Voters could change this if they wanted to, but they don't.
1
Well, several things. One, those Brady, Everytown, and Center for American Progress rankings of state gun laws need to take into account whether the states actually enforce the laws. Secondly, laws are broken. The father of this murderer needs to be held accountable since he turned over firearms knowing full well that his son was disturbed and further, prohibited from posessing guns. Also, its not clear if the son was ever put on a Federal no-buy list or if there were grounds to do so.
Finally, let's make a deal. A national ERPO system coupled to a national FOID card system so states can easily share information and gun owners can cross state lines with firearms for legitimate purposes. There is no reason that a Pennsylvanian should become a felon simply by crossing into NJ for lawful, peaceful purposes and accidently bringing her legal, licensed gun across state lines. What that means is that the gun haters need to swallow their prejudices and realize that the vast majority of gun owners are not dangerous and thus, shall never be subject to draconian, NJ or CA gun laws. In return, gun owners, given some hope that we can trust government, will support stronger laws designed to keep guns out of the hands of people like Reinking without victimizing the rest of us with deliberately prohibitive laws designed to violate our 2A rights. Any takers?
I've owned guns in California for almost 60 years. Nothing here seems draconian to me, although I'm not enamored of 30 round magazines and high tech laser sights. Neither one is needed to shoot targets or go hunting.
2
This young man is obviously mentally ill but the stunning part of this story is that he was captured and not killed. I wonder how his execution was prevented with so many cops searching for him in the woods. #whiteprivilege.
6
To Meagan
And just imagine what could have happened to the noble James Shaw Jr if the police caught him wrestling on the floor with Reinking at the Waffle House. Myriad recent incidents involving black bloodshed at the hands of zealous police offers would not have portended a favourable outcome for Mr Shaw. I would even take it further -- there are undoubtedly 'good ol' boys' who resent that a black man took away a firearm from a white person, no matter what were the circumstances.....
Another symptom of a brutal landscape built by unregulated greed.
Business is a dog-eat-dog world that we have constructed monuments to.
The emperors who control those monuments are corrupt with ill intention and deception for the common good of the citizenry.
Yeah, I mean the Mercers and the Koch Brothers et al.
1
His father is an accessory to murder and should be charged as such.
12
The father should be arrested for aiding and abetting. He should go to jail, state prison, or wherever (for life, would be my preference). How stupid can you get? The man must be just as insane as his son and should be taken out of the game. If he gave the guns to his son just to keep the peace, he should have taken all the guns in the house and sold them to someone else, or better still, thrown them into a fast moving and deep river.
4
What seems to be missing in all the analyses of this story so far is how racist it is. If Reinking had been black, brown, or any other "color," he would not have made it past his first entanglement with law enforcement. He would have been locked up, his mental health status be damned, or left to the criminal justice system to handle.
Aside from the horror of missed actions by his family, law enforcement, and the courts, did nobody think that his skin color was a privilege allowing him to get by.
And seriously, if it was an African-American man whose five guns were being confiscated, do you think his father would have been able to take control of them?
14
We learn that the shooter's guns were taken away after "Mr. Reinking’s family reported that he had talked of committing suicide." Nevertheless, the father decided to give the guns back to his suicidal son. It's hard to know which of those two was more insane, but our friends in the NRA are worse than either of them.
13
Is there some reason why private citizens could not voluntarily store their AR 15's in state guard armories for safekeeping. Some reason why when weapons are taken from members of their families judges could not order that such weapons must be kept in licensed armories? Such keep and bear facilities do not/would not transgress the Second Amendment.
3
Is there some reason unknown to me and most other Americans why ANY citizen NEEDS such an automatic weapon??Let alone, carry, conceal or use one?
5
America's history of private paralegal and paramilitary violence enlarges upon the keep and bear provisions of the Second Amendment, especially in the states. Pinkertons. KKK. Vigilantes. Corporate goons. The idea is that when Armageddon comes Americans will go down blazing. At each other.
1
For willingly returning firearms to his obviously unstable son, Jeffrey Reinking should be charged as an accessory to murder.
15
I cannot understand why this man was never hospitalized or received treatment for what was clearly mental illness. Just incredible.
9
Ask Reagan. Oh. wait....
4
This proves that taking away someone's guns does not stop them from getting more, or having them returned to them.
5
Actually, this proves that in nations without gun control, whose leaders approve guns’ ownership by the mentally ill, confiscated guns will always find their way back to their owners.
I sincerely hope that the shooter's father is not only charged for breaking the law, but also sued by the vicitims' families.
22
After the incidents with law enforcement in the past, it's shocking how Travis was able to continue without arrests or mandatory mental health evaluation. That it had to take until this point where innocent lives were lost to finally take action. The fact that there's no one following up on people who have had their FOID revoked is scary. What's more scary is that people with mental illness are able to obtain firearms in the first place. Something needs to change.
30
His family didn't stop Travis Reinking.
Law enforcement and the courts - State and federal - did not stop Travis Reinking.
Mental Health officials didn't stop Travis Reinking.
The NRA certainly didn't stop Travis Reinking.
An unarmed good guy did stop Travis Reinking from killing even more people.
But already some crazy candidate in Tennessee is claiming there would have been fewer deaths if only there had been more guns. Because if unarmed people can stand up to the Travis Reinking's of the world, then the NRA can be shown for what it is, a collector of profiteering blood money. More guns equal more deaths. It's time for the Reinking militia to become "well regulated." Just like it says.
37
From the Federal government to the state government to the family, this is a story of the failure of our society to address gun violence in any meaningful way.
The FBI closed the book on the case, the state had passed a law with no serious enforcement mechanism and the father, to keep peace in the family I suspect, gave back his son's guns.
People are calling for the father to be held accountable.
Fair enough. But what about the FBI and the state legislators?
6
I’m curious to know what more the FBI or state could’ve done but take his forearms and license? Personally feel Father should be held acceptable. I’m not challenging your opinion just a question. Have a great day
Amurica, where a father can knowingly give his dangerously, mentally ill son multiple weapons that were confiscated from him by the FBI only to have his son use them to slaughter 4 innocent people and the police say it is "potentially a violation of federal law." Potentially! Let that sink in.
154
It seems that words like "potentially," "might be," "could be" are often used to describe actions or behaviors which to simple minded college-educated people like me are clear violations of law. I conclude more and more that we are not a "nation of laws" but a "nation of suggestions." If a law is violated or broken, penalties should ensue NOW. But it seems more often than not, that the above qualifying words are used and the situation is quickly forgotten. Disheartening to be sure.
12
I think they’re using this language to avoid legal liability for slander. I do hope they arrest the father for this “alleged” violation and that he is prosecuted to the full extent of the law.
1
The family is apparently very wealthy and not a minority. Does anyone really believe the police would have given the guns back to his father if they were a poor minority, or especially if his name was Abdul?
8
Current lawmakers will never fix this problem. Electing new legislators committed to reforming gun laws that are a deadly joke will be a good first step. Civil liability litigation should follow quickly here. Sue the father and any jurisdiction that dropped the ball until they have to stand at a freeway off ramp with a cardboard sign. Money will be the only way to force the change we need. Start now.
42
Parent is culpable.
41
Parent may be culpable. Definitely culpable are all the senators and representatives who voted to allow any citizen who wants one to run down to 7/11 and pick up an assault weapon. OK - it takes a little more effort to get an AR-15. Very, very little. Thanks Bob Dole, Orrin Hatch, etc etc and so on ad infinitum.
1
I can't even begin to understand why someone who needed medical treatment for mental illness wasn't getting it. The officer's comment to the dad about keeping the guns until the son got treatment, and the dad's response is what we see everyday as teachers. The end result no one ever gets treated, they end up on the street and kill people. Gun or van or knife or some other means of destruction, they ultimately take lives.
20
"I can't even begin to understand why someone who needed medical treatment for mental illness wasn't getting it"
Effective treatment for mental illness is expensive and lawmakers are unwilling to budget adequate funds for it.
The persons who need treatment most are frequently unemployable adults who have little or no money and no insurance.
No one is calling for publicly funded treatment until something such as this happens. Now everyone is shouting for it. In a few weeks no one will be.
Some persons are simply so ill that no treatment, other than forcing them to take medication, will work. That entails some form of publicly funded lifelong institutional housing.
Vote locally, statewide, and nationally! Keep this in mind when you do!
2
Jeffrey Reinking must face charges along with his son. When Illinois State Police determined it was necessary to remove guns from Travis Reinking's possession, they should never have given the guns to his father. It's no stretch of imagination Travis might access the weapons, or - as did happen - the father would give Travis the guns (in contradiction of the father's promise to police). The elder Mr. Reinking is even more culpable than his son, as he placed instruments of mass destruction in the hands of a mentally ill man with a history of law enforcement issues.
Multiple law enforcement agencies bear responsibility - why was Mr. Reinking not arrested? Why was he not in jail, or hospitalized for treatment - because he's young, white and cuddly? Sympathy must be set aside when the person is carrying an AR-15 and acting erratically. Two black men waiting for an associate to arrive at Starbucks before placing an order were swiftly arrested and spent several hours in jail; the same never happened to Travis Reinking. This is the personification of "white privilege", and it's cost four promising young adults their lives and shattered their families.
59
The answer to most, if not all, your questions is, "It's Tennessee! We vote Republican!"
2
We put people in jail for drunk driving not because they have murderous intent, but because they act recklessly. For the same reason, we should put the father of this killer in jail. Giving guns to a deranged man is inexcusable.
87
The amount of willful ignorance and negligence in this story is simply stunning. Looking forward to reading about Jeffrey Reinking's conviction on accessory charges.
55
And his business being turned over to the victims' families.
2
Zero support for mental healthcare.
Zero support for reasonable gun regulation.
Zero support for providing the proper funding and sensible public policy to fix America's unregulated national shooting gallery and national insane asylum.
But plenty of idiotic 'thoughts and prayers', National Terrorist Association campaign bribery and corruption, and blind support for the murderous 2nd Amendment:
"A well regulated dementia, being necessary to the paranoid security of a murderous state and record gun profits, the right of the people to be randomly slaughtered by an angry male with a gun fetish, shall not be infringed."
The Lord will provide....national mental illness on guns: GOP 2018
98
Correction. Angry WHITE male.
3
Racial hate wasn't a factor because the shooter may be mentally ill? All racists are sane and no insane person is also racist?
112
I think there is a special place in Hell reserved for this man's father.
62
And every politician who takes NRA blood money.
4
Here is yet another example of how gun laws in this country need sensible reform and strengthening. A "provision in the law that allows people whose license has been revoked to transfer their weapons to another person with a valid card" is ridiculous loophole. I wonder how it got into the Illinois criminal code? Perhaps another gem constructed by NRA lobbyists?
87
Jeffrey Reinking's thoughtless and inexplicable act enabled his obviously mentally ill son to carry out his deadly attack. Mr. Reinking must have known at the time that his son was troubled, to say the least. Why he would hand over guns to a man with the history that Travis had demands explanation. He certainly shares some culpability with his son.
112
We need to know if dad gave the guns back because he shares (or encourages) his son's white supremacist "beliefs". Is Jeffrey Reinking a right-wing extremist or just a reckless idiot?
The problem here is that the guns should never have been given to his father.
Law enforcement should not be allowed to remove any property without proper authority but once that property is removed it should remain in law enforcement's custody until a person can show that they have the right to have it returned to them and never to an intermediary.
Now maybe Illinois doesn't have laws on the books to do that, and if so they need to fix that.
79
"Transferring firearms to another Illinois resident who does not have a valid card is a crime in Illinois. Jeffrey Reinking has indicated to the police that he gave his son’s guns back to him, but it is not clear how and when he did so, said Mr. Aaron, the spokesman for the Nashville police."
Are Illinois police selectively enforcing the law, ignorant of the law, or not enforcing the law at all? Why is the man who gave guns back to his son not under arrest right now?
37
Jeffery Reinking was a resident of Tennessee so it is not clear that giving him back the guns was a crime.
2
‘It’s not clear”? Give me a break, the police should just ask Jeffrey Reinking. Or is he not talking to detectives just like his son? To understand what happened the public needs to know who when and where these weapons were acquired and at what point in Reinking’s criminal career did that happen. Bottom line, in this killing as in others, if Reinking, mental illness or not, did not have the weapon 4 people would be alive today.
11
He likely gave the guns back to his son in Illinois before he moved to TN. Then he carried them across state lines.
1
The Nashville murder suspect had a resume full of red flags that went ignored, by law enforcement and his father, who dutifully returned these assault weapons to his son. This man's father is an accessory to multiple murders. For a man "who has exhibited significant instability", this suspect has lived a charmed life, committing murder at the Waffle House in addition to grand theft auto and eluding police officers after the commission of a crime.
These killings were racially motivated and Nashville's mayor is dishonest to blame what happened on "mental illness". Try telling that to the victims' families and friends.
56
The mayor widely missed the mark on this comment as the mentally ill are not immune from racism, but he's been very outspoken about the need for gun control. For a guy up for election in a few weeks, that's a commendable and bold stance in this gun-crazy state.
15
Give us a list of black-on-white mass killings. If you can.
Then, give us a list of black police officers killing un-armed whites.
4
Franko - The latest year I can find figures for so far (2015) shows 500 black-on-white homicides and 229 white on black ones.
Does that mean that blacks are twice as racist as whites?
How many more people have to die? We appear to be slow learners as a society...
17
There was so much wrong committed by the police, the father, federal government and state of Illinois. Take the guns away. No transfer. The father should be charged. Police telling the father to give the guns back to him after he seeks mental health? No comfort for the families or the four victims, all of whom were completely failed by everyone who came into contact with this murderer. Disgraced country, once again. No excuses.
51
What did the police do wrong?
John, when Travis Reingold committed a trespass at the White House, he should have been arrested, held in jail AND charged with a crime, especially as he invited the Secret Service to shoot him AND had a years-long history of delusions. Instead Travis Reinking was released and required to perform 32 hours of community service and to not return to the White House for four months! The US Attorney's Office offered a deferred prosecution agreement that resulted in the charges being dropped against Reinking in November 2017, even though he'd behaved bizarrely in June 2017 AND August 2017, That's what the police, and the Secret Service, and the FBI did wrong. That's what the prosecutor's office did wrong. See https://www.nytimes.com/2018/04/22/us/waffle-house-shooting.html
http://www.grandforksherald.com/news/crime-and-courts/4435579-waffle-hou...
“Yet even after the Illinois police revoked his firearms license and ordered that his guns be transferred to his father, Mr. Reinking got them back, including the AR-15 used in the Tennessee shooting, the police said.”
Shouldn’t dad be facing charges for this?
132
2 paragraphs later:
"Jeffrey Reinking’s act of returning the guns to his son is “potentially a violation of federal law,” Marcus Watson, a special agent with the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives, said at a news conference."
1
"Shouldn’t dad be facing charges for this?"
Yes indeed, and so should the police who made up their own gun laws and handed the disturbed son's machinery of death over to dad.
1
“enough indication that there was some element of mental illness associated with it.”
Ya think? Running around nude with an AR-15 shooting people seems to indicate mental illness...dad should be culpable in giving him back his weapons.
32
NRA types will try to blame this all on mental illness, but what about dad? What about the police? They're not literally ill, just sick. They were just making up their own "gun laws" and breaking the real ones. They are the real criminals here.
1
They should charge the father for illegally giving weapons back to a clearly sick man. Until we start charging the parents, nothing will change.
31
In 2016, only about 4,000 of the 11,000 people whose cards were revoked submitted the mandatory reports explaining what they did with their guns.
This situation is completely unacceptable. Why aren’t the guns in police possession the same day the FOID card is revoked? Put the person in the police cruiser and drive to their home and collect the guns.
143
Unfortunately the police have to answer to the NRA, and we know which is the more powerful institution in America today.
1