The article is not accurate regarding China's exports of metal to the USA. Their metal exports are "value added" exports; they have been manufactured into finished goods before being exported. This is why putting duties on raw metal product alone will do very little to balance trade with China, and I believe Trump knows this, but was afraid to come to more serious blows with China by recommending an expanded list of imported items that simply contain steel and aluminum.
It's becoming clearer that Trump is steering America down the same road he frequently travelled; bankruptcy. He has just hiked our national debt tremendously, in order to give himself a huge tax break. Now, with international trade about to shrink as a result of new duties, and with prices to consumers soon to rise as a result, the debt will be more difficult, if not impossible, to repay. The result is bankruptcy. What does bankruptcy look like when a country goes down that path rather than an individual? A weaker US dollar is the immediate result, further pushing up inflation while slowing the economy further. Thank Donald Trump for this forthcoming rotten economic cycle that follows Obama's successful launch of our economy.
11
America does not currently have manufacturing capacity to meet American manufacterer's demand for aluminum and steel, and it would take several years to build new, automated plants to meet demand. There would be few jobs in these plants, although building them would provide temporary work to some. But more importantly, American's need goods now, and at their usual cost.
Trump's threatens retaliation. For example, 5 of the top 10 pharmaceutical companies are European.
Every drug company outsources: China provides the active ingredient, India inactive fillers, and Brazil assembles and packages these into medicine.
A tariff on Chinese and Brazilian steel and aluminum could lead to higher American drug prices, through retaliation.
America's Top 10 imports, besides drugs, are electronics assembled in China and Southeast Asia, cars and trucks (Mexico, Europe, Korea), oil, optical devices (Mexico), plastic (China), fresh fruit and vegetables (Mexico).
The U.S. exports tech, cars, oil, pork, music, film. We're not an industrial nation. Factories, if ever built, would be automated. The U.S. is dependent on other countries for its survival.
Aggravating those on whom we survive, and creating trade wars that would hurt everyone but the wealthy, is bad for Americans.
American leaders need to support new and green tech, manufacture of products using solar and wind energy, organic agriculture and distribution, job re-training, and prepare Americans for the future.
8
How can the largest economy in the world have such an incompetent administration. Watching Wilbur Ross on CNBC... he is a complete dolt. China is the 11th largest exporter to the US of steel and aluminum, Canada #1. Canada has a trade deficit with the in steel and aluminum (imports $2b more than it exports). Canada also has a trade deficit with the US...and the list goes on. He doesn't seem to understand this or maybe hasn't been briefed.
Not only does this risk a global trade war and a global recession, but America's reputation in the world is also suffering dearly. Maybe people in the US don't care... but eventually this will go beyond trade wars and lead to consumer boycotts of American goods, services, etc. Just watch... Complete insanity.
6
I'm no economist, but why didn't Trump just suggest (maybe behind the scenes) that domestic manufacturers use more US steel and tout "our cars are made with US steel" etc. Let the public decide if they want to keep American steel companies alive. No tariffs, no trade war, but the effect would be the same, i.e. more US steel being used. If you are paying for a car or tractor over 5 years, the couple hundred dollars extra (at most) for US steel would have negligible effect on your payments.
3
I really do believe that he should have stayed with golf courses.... they go broke slower..
11
Why are we not hearing more about Commerce Secretary Wilbur Ross's huge conflicts of interest. He made his fortune buying up bankrupt steel companies and selling them to major steel companies, for cash and lots of stock that I believe he still holds. He is conflicted up the wazoo, putting on tariffs that will help his own holdings. Talk about draining the swamp!!??!!
8
"Decimated" is a big word....
Great job DJT!!! Who gave you this advise? Your son-in-law?
3
Wilbur Ross owns steel manufacturing....hmmm lining the pockets.
2
"...trade wars are good..." Just one of the more stupid Trump comments, although not the apex of his stupidity or cupidity. To those few who understand, "War is Peace" and "Ignorance is Strength", you can understand that the dystopian prediction was simply about 30 years off target. Those who do not know or understand the depth of this reference, or think it fake news, must surely be cheering this madness on.
6
Our next President is going to have so much carnage to undo
2
That steel plant looks like Mordor.
good grief!!!! smoot hawley revisited!! this is voodoo economics at its worst!!!
2
...as soon as Fox News tells him to do something else
1
Just when the US manufacturing industry is starting to come back to life, the dolt in chief tries to nip it in the bud. The steelmakers must have outbid the National Association of Manufacturers for trade support.
American steel producers got what they deserved years ago from Wilbur Ross, who is currently in charge of the Department of Commerce, which oversees the International Trade Administration. Your reporters need to dig deeper!
1
This is unbelievable stupidity. And the stock market of February continues in to March. In fact in one day, about 2/5ths of February’s entire loss.
1
At a certain point you have to draw a conclusion from what all of Trump’s actions amount to:
He is doing everything he can to undermine, ruin, destroy, your country.
At a certain point it’s not stupidity anymore.
He’s not that stupid.
It has to be by design.
Therefore you have elected a traitor as Commander in Chief.
What next America?
10
Another day in day care.
Cohn is a joke. He threatened to resign after Charlottesville which any self-respecting Jew would have done (Kushner included). But he didn't because he wanted the Federal Reserve job.
Trump saw Cohn for what he was: another unprincipled Goldman invertebrate , callow in his pursuit of power and money . And judging by the tariffs decision, comically ineffective.
Cohn will eventually return to NYC where he will regale his friends with amusing stories of his time in this wacky White House, as if he operated above the fray intellectually and ethically. He is complicit in the damage done by this Administration, and forever stained by it.
4
A trade war would be a good thing? For God’s sake! What a moron. This man is destroy ing this country’s future to show he’s a tough guy and the free-trade GOP stands by fiddling. Wake! Up! Wait until the MAGA base starts to feel the impact of this. They will be told is Hillary’s fault, Obama’s fault, the DNC’s fault, China’s fault, immigrants’ fault ... and they will raise their fists in agreement. And the country will slide farther away from its leadership role in the world. I. Want. My. Country. Back.
7
Let's hope this is another of the stable genius's 'run it up the flagpole' stunts wherein queued forces will now jockey for position and the chance to be last to, 'whisper in his ear,' change the mercurial one's mind and position...as has occurred on more than a few occasions.
If not, wonder who Trump will pick as his patsy when the economy reacts and follows Wall Street down the Crapper.
Wow, this move is outstandingly poor - even for Trump!
Maybe it will win him some shouts of joy from some US nationalists but that's about it summing up the advantages.
In return steel and aluminium prices in the US will increase sharply, consequently lead to increasing prices in ALL steel and aluminium dependent industries; retaliation measures from the rest of the world will hit other industries as well (by the way, Trump mainly hits allies with those tariffs, why the hell?!) and the effect Trump hoped for would - if at all - come up in a decade or later. By then these tariffs surely will be revoked already by the new government and all that remains are years of recession for everyone.
So my question is: Why?
2
Reading these comments, most people are so blinded by hate that they don't stop for a moment to ask themselves what is best for our country, and how a country with no steel and aluminium production can be screwed if there is ever a war on its soil.
2
First, the US does have a steel industry. It produces more steel than any of the countries mentioned as the leading exporters of steel to the US. Second apparently you seem to miss the point being made, that this will damage other manufacturing industries in the US. The US exports 1.3 Trillion in goods every year.
6
So how is that “hold your nose” act working out for Republicans now?
2
Don’t worry. Just like all of Trump’s impetuous tweets, like gun control, the Great Wall, immigration.....this will fall to wayside as soon as Fix News
Here's the Australian Broadcasting Commision's (Govt funded broadcaster) report if anyone in the US is interested about what other countries think..
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-03-02/donald-trump-tariffs-not-great-for...
So much winning!
Can we revisit HS social studies- can we all say Smoot-Hawley ? I am thinking Trump was in the class when Ferris Bueller's teacher was teaching the tariff act and he was the kid sleeping and drooling. Rather than Hoovervilles we are headed to Trumpvilles of Cheetoh villes if he actually enacts this stupidity. The man needs a basic HS education.
A shot from the hip. He didn't even have his usual written script!
1
Perhaps Jared bought 300 million dollars worth of steel and aluminum stocks on a stock 'tip'. The outrage is ...we don't know.
1
These tariffs will lead to wars and WW3!
Oh yeah, he's a genius ... sadly, just a legend in his own (perverse) mind.
Can't we get a judge to block this - and quick?
I used to think trump was forever stuck in 1979. But his policy agenda, or what passes in this ridiculous illegitimate administration for a policy agenda, is more like 1879. Coal, protectionist trade wars, unfettered pollution, tax policy to create an aristocracy of wealth, racism enshrined in law. ALL right out of the rotten at the core Gilded Age
1
This guy is a total and complete fraud. Don't trade and we win big, that's his business strategy. Think about that for a moment since we import almost everything into this country, from textiles to TVs. Guess who loses in a trade war? We do in the cost of what we pay for goods made abroad. As much as he likes to engage in dishonesty, this will not bring jobs back that were shipped abroad as they went abroad for lower wages, not tax benefits as he claims. Last but not least, almost all of Trump's junk merchandise is made abroad and none of it has or will be brought back to the USA. That's because he speaks from two sides of his mouth...bring the jobs back to America, but I'm not bringing my jobs back. This is the most dishonest man on the planet. Nothing that he does or say can be believed. He's no business mental genius, but a midget mental case. Somebody else is in his organization makes the real business decisions for him as he has proven to be clueless about everything, including business, particularly on the international scene. This country will be much worse off in commerce, in economics, in intellect, in health care, and world standing, much like a banana republic. The destruction to our reputation and standing in the world will take many more years to repair after he's gone. China, India, and Russia will fill the void along with others while we figure out how to get out of this mess he leaves behind. The Trumps however, will be much richer.
5
So, I'm learning more everyday about the Imperium Trumpium. Deriving unilateral authority from some shady commerce report about steel imports (an industry sold down river more than 20 years ago) gives our Fuhrer the right to impose (singlehandedly) punitive tax across the board.
Might we reconsider the re-branding of our so-called democracy, and call it what it is: a plutocratic imperium.
So what is the exact statute that defaults all powers to the head of the executive branch? Please someone educate me.
Along with that beautiful pate of blond coiffed chevelure, (not a bald spot)I can see a beautiful pair of jackboots.
The Republican enablers have created a Frankenstein. He is now out of his box and wandering around.
1
Maybe he thinks there is a special election in Pennsylvania coming up.
2
"Let's see. I've taken health care away from the poor, food assistance from the needy, arranged for the deportation of the Dreamers, given tax breaks to the 1% and destroyed the environment. What can I.....I know, I know! I'll start a trade war! That just leaves North Korea...
5
Hang on. It's going to be a bumpy night.
For starters watch Canada slap 25% tariff on its auto imports from the US.
2
Trump destroying the economy one day at a time. DOW down 250 pts at the bell.
1
Another grand entrance of the absurdity of the last election.
1
Well, at least now Trump can take true credit for the performance of the stock market, or is this market downturn just fake news perpetrated by the Democrats?
1
i m shocked that a wharton graduate could be so ignorant of economics. I m sure - since he doesn t read- he doesn t know what Smoot Hawley was and how badly it affected the world economy.
Each tweet shows him as being more of a disaster. Please Mr. Mueller indict him asap.. Finally a few feckless Republicans are calling him out. what will it take for the rest of them??
2
claude,you are so right! keep agitating!
this could be the beginning of a beautiful friendship.
Once again, the level of Trump's hypocrisy is downright obscene. His own businesses chose to import less expensive steel from China rather than 'supporting' the U.S. steel industry. We need to stop reporting on what this so-called President says without also talking about what he actually does.
2
don the con wants to bring his "business success" with his Taj Mahal to the entire country.
bumper sticker slogans do not an economic policy make
Chinese have a tariff on EVERYTHING from USA, including people. Besides blocking USA, Americans must hand over all technology to a Chinese partner upon doing any business in China. After the Chinese partner knows everything, the Americans are kicked out. China’s tariff on people means 0 Americans get permanent residency or citizenship in China., This is why there are 0 American-Chinese even though there have been millions and millions of Chinese-Americans.
4
A narrow interpretation would have a better way the go but unfortunately the ”Impatient” Commander in Chief shoots from his well used hip yet again. Maybe if he took his China blinders off he’d have realized we import a lot of steel from many countries. It’s time for another map lesson.
1
Is this what Adam Smith had in mind? The all too visible hand is Trump's.
1
Strategy: break toys, get attention. Heck of a way to govern Trump.
45th does he know what is he doing? I mean consequences of doing something like an adult?
How many patriots within Trump’s circle of trust took short positions on steel and aluminum manufacturing in the last week?
1
You know it never hurts to do your homework and get all the facts before you make a business or political decision. Trump does not care, to him, ignorance is bliss because then you can view every decision in a vacuum and they seem so simple. Nothing is simple - it is all complicated and we have a President that values ignorance.
5
The trump stock market bomb to the trump stock market slump. Or schlumpf to be precise. There never has or never will be anything great about this man. He is all about chaos and destruction. This is why Putin wanted him elected.
2
Yanqui bad faith. Again. Softwood lumber, aircraft and now this. Is there a Euro boycott of U.S. goods we can join?
1
No thoughts really just logged on to see if I could find one of these yeah let's make american steel strong again, or yeah we have to be on top of the row and not anywhere in between. (they always make me giggle).. - Well of course found lot's, but also some more reasonable ways of expressing the same
Thanks
Using national security as the rationale for imposing large tariffs on steel and aluminum makes no sense when Canada and other close allies are the main suppliers of these materials. Even assuming trade wars do not ensue, the net effect will be increasing profits for domestic producer at the expense of higher prices to the public and reduce domestic sales in a number of domestic industries( automotive, appliance,etc,). This will also reduce U.S. exports in these same industries given the higher costs of production, unless of course the value of the dollar falls. Which in turn will make the cost of imports even higher. Very few winners and lots of losers.
Reviewing so many comments posted on this article- anti-tariffs- the fears of market chaos, increased prices, uncertainty as to how long the tariffs would last— actually confirms the Commerce Department’s conclusion that our national industrial, economic base is threatened by unfair trade practices. Small farms used to be self-sufficient, raising many different animals, crops, living off a small part of the harvest, slaughtering..selling the rest. Specialization took over. One crop on hundreds of acres. Raising only one type of animal, massive feed lots. Dependence on the suppliers of inputs- seeds, fertilizer, machinery needing specialists for repairs, and on and on. We don’t need to go back to the past, but we do need to regain our autonomy, maybe in new ways.
This president has finally done something right- no doubt for his own wrong reasons. And how comical that Republican lawmakers...seem to suddenly forget about American workers. Heaven forbid they write laws to provide certainty as to length of tariffs, which countries might be exempt....etc. aka, do their job. And..hello...we buy Russian aluminum?? While they subvert our election process?? Wake up Congress!
1
Trade war? Great, bring it on. Since we always run a trade deficit we have much less to lose. Thank you President Trump. It's about time someone stuck up for the American worker. All this hand wringing by a bunch of city liberals who never did an honest days work in their life is laughable.
1
Whether we like it or not those "big city" people contribute the vast majority of income and cash flow to our government. They also often make do with less and complain less when you look st the numbers. But go ahead, make unnecessary
comments and contribute to the animosity in our country.
1
It's about time we got a President who has the guts to stand up to China for blatantly violating trade treaties and causing great harm to Americans in the process. I was initially a Trump basher, but I'm starting to appreciate him more and more. He's really ramping up on his campaign promises, which is so rare among members of our government. I guess it's because he's not a politician, but a business man.
1
Well there goes her $1.60/week raise as Speaker Ryan's admin assistant buys a can of pop.
It is not a coincidence that Canada and Mexico are material exporters of steel and aluminum to the USA and these tariffs are announced at the height of NAFTA negotiations.
1
Donald Trump and his cohort of myopic advisors be warned: retaliation can be swift and brutal. It need not be confined to trade in goods. These days trade in services is huge and perhaps strategically more important as services are the real growth industry of the future. Services include anything from conventional banking & finance, to internet operations, the entertainment industry, travel and tourism, etc. The US has huge advantages in these areas that can all be undermined by punitive retaliatory measures. Canada could slap punitive taxes and duties on all manner of services provided from companies headquartered in the USA, making a huge dent in their viability. The leverage can be a high multiple between sales volume and net profit - e.g. if a Canadian tax on tickets to Florida wiped out X% of winter travel to Florida and sales in Florida's food, accommodation and entertainment industries, it could wipe out a much higher %, if not all, of the profits in the Floridian balance sheets depending heavily on the Canadian tourist dollar. Likewise taxes and regulatory impediments on US financial institutions operating in Canada or providing cross-border services could be very hard hit. Nobody wins from any of this. It's just lose-lose all round, but illegal US tariff setting would need to be countered, and Canada's Minister for International Affairs has indicated that it will be. Likewise for other countries. Recall, for Trump, debt and bankruptcy are "wins" - do be mindful.
“Trade wars are good, and easy to win.” The ignorant grandiosity of that statement literally sends a chill up my spine. We will all pay a price for the bad judgment or rank stupidity of those who voted for a narcissistic fraud and huckster whose business acumen is lacking rather than legendary. Most disturbing, I think he would just as readily utter that same sentence without the word “trade” in it.
What goes on in Trump's head does not resemble thought. It's all reaction and far too much of it is hate and seeking personal advantage. He is a dangerous provocation to far too many people who have far too many military-style guns, and seem to be planning to use them if they don't get what they want. This is not a democracy.
I was listening, with nausea, to a replay his suggestion that football players who don't salute the flag correctly because their unarmed brothers and sisters are being shot and other racist abuses are ongoing are unpatriotic.
It is you, Mr. Trump, who are unpatriotic. You have always sought your personal advantage by any means you can find, and hurt huge numbers of people on that path. Racism, check. Mafia, check. Gaming New York City fees and taxes, check. Multiple bankruptcies and blaming your creditors, check. The Russian mob, check. Money laundering, check.
This one may get more attention because wealthy people and labor will be hurt, but it's just one of many points of evidence that Trump does not have our country's best interests at heart.
He is in violation of his presidential oath from day one. He is not a patriot. He is a demagogue who doesn't consider the consequences of the daily dangers he poses to my country.
3
If the President is playing to his base, maybe one the countries that purchase significant quantities of corn or soybeans should announce that they will go elsewhere for their purchases. This would directly affect the middle of the our country where these crops are very important and show how important international trade is. It's also the area where his base is concentrated.
1
One factor in his decision, which may be the factor that is weighing most heavily on his mind, is the Russia investigation. I think that when Trump looks at the 2018 elections, he understands that maintaining a Republican majority in the House will be critical to holding off impeachment proceedings based on any critical findings in the Mueller investigation. And the impending special election in Pennsylvania's 18th district, steel country, will be important to holding back the Democrats.
All of this just to say, that Trump is laser-focused on stopping the Dems in 2018 and will readily take steps which threaten the country's longer-term economic, social, and political well-being to prevent his own impeachment. The tariff announcement is just one example of what I expect will be an increasingly important theme in his decision-making.
4
Technology is reducing the cost of labor in manufacturing. Right at the point where there are more middle class customers in Asia and labor rates are becoming less important to global trade we decide to increase the cost of our production.
I suspect BMW might want to move the production of the all wheel drive vehicles manufactured in South Carolina. The plant that makes every BMW SUV sold across the entire world from.
If China is subsidizing steel, it's costing China money. If we tariff it it costs manufacturers and US consumers more money. US Steel is a very important industry. This helps US producers maintain an obsolete footprint into the future insuring that when we need steel we will have a second rate industry producing it.
Hopefully Fox and Friends will educate the President and he will change his mind.
2
“The United States Constitution gives Congress the power to impose and collect taxes, tariffs, duties, and the like, and to regulate international commerce. While the Constitution gives the President authority to negotiate international agreements, it assigns him no specific power over international commerce and trade. Through legislation, however, Congress may delegate some of its power to the President, such as the power to modify tariffs under certain circumstances. Thus, because the President does not possess express constitutional authority to modify tariffs, he must find authority for tariff-related action in statute.”
This from the Congressional Research Service Paper: Presidential Authority over Trade: Imposing Tariffs and Duties.
The seminal question is whether the GOP Congress will continue to abet Trump’s hugely dangerous antics. Hardly a day passes that the fomenter of chaos in chief doesn’t roll out another crisis utterly of his own making.
4
The President authority comes from him invoking the threat to national security.
You have to separate what he actually said about bringing back jobs with how he is actually trying to get away with it.
2
If there is no consequence for enemy countries exploiting our working class, then they are free to do so. The unbelievable generosity of the US working classes over time must have limits somewhere. The US middle classes have been enriching both the highly educated and have also lifted over 1 billion people out of poverty in India and China. But it is important to understand that middle class people, most of them without college degrees, still vote in the US. That is a basic civics lesson that many pundits seem to be begging to re-learn.
1
Will be another Trump bankruptcy. One person should not have such power. Why does Congress allow him to do this?
4
As a Canadian I should point out that even though we are the largest exporter of steel to America, Canadians don't own any of our steel mills. They're owned entirely by foreigners, mainly American. Like America, our steel industry has shrunk drastically due to globalization and we are net importers of steel. In fact much of our economy resembles that of America, having lost in excess of 1 million manufacturing jobs due mainly to automation, globalization and offshoring. Even though Trump keeps saying Canada has a trade surplus with the United States, that is not true if you include goods as well as services. I won't even get into the nature of supply chains because my head will blow up. In short we have been good neighbors, fair traders and fellow travelers who want to live in peace and have a great relationship. As an example of some of the Trump bullying, we a have a $345 million trade deficit in wine and U.S. negotiators are insisting that we allow even more American wine in the country, which will hurt our infantile wine industry and cost jobs. Most of the wineries in Canada are quite small(as in America) and the big ones are owned by American companies. There is a very close relationship which needs to work for both countries but the Trump "art of the deal" is code for bullying. We Canadians are very polite, but we won't be bullied. When are you guys going to make your country great again by getting rid of the clowns running this circus?
9
One thing we know about Mr. Trump. When he comes under a lot of pressure, he tries shifting attention of the media away from himself by doing something that results in others starting to scream. Today was one of those days.
First, upon entering into office this morning, he started to realize what it means to lose a close confidant (Hope Hicks). Then it started to sink in that public humiliation of his son-in-law, by Kelly downgrading his security clearance, is in fact at shot at him and does reflect badly on his authority. Then the NRA and a group of Republican Congressman called in putting the squeeze on him to retreat his statement on gun control. And, finally came the last straw: Putin's speech and his "invincible missiles". Recognizing that troubles were pouring down, he was left with no choice but to use one of his big distraction cards, one suited for rainy days.
So, he told his inner circle what he wants to do. That pushed the WH panic button. They started calling CEOs of steel and aluminium companies and rush them to the WH. Then Mr. Trump showed up in the WH meeting room and announced the imposition of tariffs on imported steel and aluminum products. And the news of the tariffs was immediately on all news networks.
6
The United States is heading for a recession the likes that have not been witnessed since the dark days of September 2008 and October 1929...!! Scary words, but I believe it's far more possible now than it was before Trump decided to play President Hoover.
Now, a recession is going to happen since the ebb and flow cogs are built into our economy. Yet, do not concern yourself with Trump's knee-jerk reaction to trade. It can be a good thing if handled properly. He is a deal maker, after all. The problem? I believe that Trump has no idea what he is doing. What could turn to have become a mild, manageable recession could quickly turn in an economic disaster that cannot be wished away by adding even more debt and uncertainty.
3
The American people need to ask themselves whether they want cheaper steel, cheaper aluminum, and cheaper labor outside the U.S. to undercut U.S. steel, U.S. aluminum, and U.S. workers. The U.S. has the resources to produce steel and was a big steel producer for many years.
4
Since the big beautiful wall just got a lot more expensive, it will be scaled back to a small beautiful curb.
2
Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it.
2
You know that measly tax cut you were looking forward to getting? Kiss those savings bye-bye if these tariffs move forward.
1
Is it wrong for a president to promote domestic industry? Foreign governments do that and more for their industries. Some even give subsidies. The payoff is more domestic employment.
4
This move makes perfect sense when taken in context with all the other fiscal maneuvers.
You take an economy that is at full employment, juice it up with a big tax cut on credit, introduce a big infrastructure spending plan, begin kicking out productive immigrant workers, and finally tack on import tariffs. I daresay it will work....
To bring back stagflation. It's like we are attempting a time warp back to the 1970's. Get ready workers, save up for strikes and the big pay raises you will get out of them. Wages will rise faster than corporate profits or dividends, which is going to help, in a gut-wrenching way for many rich people, to reduce inequality. Perfect. Thank you Donald.
2
Steel and Alum have been dumped on America for two reasons - one tactical and the other strategic.
Tactically -- other nations support their people by providing jobs and dumping their output on America below the cost of production -- we should immediately stop buying from "dumpers" until they raise their standard of living by paying wages equal to the US.
Strategically -- we must never allow a few extra pennies in the businessman's pocket to place us in a position of weakness where we cannot defend our selves because our industries cannot make a simple product like steel.
2
> The president told more than a dozen executives that he wanted the tariffs to apply to all countries, one executive in attendance said.
The U.S. actually enjoys a $2 Billion trade surplus with Canada when it comes to steel. So if this tariff were imposed on Canada, Canada could possibly put the same tariff on U.S. steel imports. The next result would be businesses scrambling to change suppliers on both sides of the border and steel prices going up in both countries. And steel companies in the U.S. would end up LOSING business.
This makes no sense at all.
So much for the 'astute businessman' thing, eh?
6
This is yet another distraction. News reports are trickling out about Jared and possibly Ivanka utilizing their positions to broker business deals. There are rumors Meuller may be sending down more indictments related to Russian hacking. Lastly, Pennsylvania special election is looking dicey for a GOP politician in Trump country. This announcement gets Jared & Ivanka off the top page and maybe helps in PA.
Look for a walk back or for exemptions that render tariffs meaningless in a few days.
What is scary is that Trump is willing to inflict damage on the economy and hurt American workers just to shield himself and his family from possible corruption charges.
5
The man is myopic. Trump cannot see the big picture, all he can see is that he's helping steel and aluminum companies and workers, but doesn't see that he's doing damage to greater number of industries and therefore, the economy.
Same with coal, he wants to restore coal jobs, but doesn't see the infinite damage the pollution will cause and adversely impact economy in a myriad of ways
1
It looks like 45 is doing everything to weaken the economy.
Not smart. We know he doesn’t listen to advice.
Unfit.
1
Can some one remind Trump that Sep 11 when WTC went down , USA shipped/dumped the Nuclear active melted and wasted Steel to third World Countries so as to keep America Clean. So he has no Moral standing is imposing such tariffs on any one in the World just to save American Steel Industry.
Lest TRUMP Forget - Please Remember how much the World helped at that time in the past. We should base our Future actions with a bearing on the Past Mr President. Thanks
1
It is clear that other countries are dumping, China being the worst offender, and time we did something about it. We should talk the same approach with other strategic industries. It may cost us a little more, but it is worth it in the long run.
2
Your readers were afraid that, when the noose would be tightehing around Trumps'neck, he would, as a distraction, start a nuclear war with North Korea or Iran, Don't you think that this totally improvised announcement of trade tariffs that will start a war and a fiery debate in the US and around the world is not a way for Trump to change the conversation, moving it away from the trump's finances, Jared, Ivanka, Hope and the like?
1
Who are the forces pushing Trump to do this? He's not smart enough to be informed on his own -- which businesses have his ears on this?
2
Trump is such a superb "busnessman" and "negotiator" that he is likely to start and international trade war without even knowing it. Is the Republican party comfortable with this?
2
Good for the President, it is past time that the US stop acting like a door mat for other countries when those countries dump their manufactured goods in our economy. Free trade has proven to be neither free nor fair, these agreement are drawn up by globalists who care little for protecting domestic industry while caring more for growing their own profit.
3
A main Trump base, the rural America, will come out as the biggest loser in this trade war. Other countries can impose heave tariffs on, or just discontinue, their agricultural imports from USA. The rural America will become decimated by (1) tanking price and (2) rising labor cost. Rural America will pay the price for voting for Trump. Rural America will simply declare bankruptcy and stop voting in the future or vote Democrat.
Having been trained as a Metallurgical Engineer and worked in metal industries for decades, mostly in steel and aluminum, this reader MUST say that Donald Trump's knowledge in metal industries is exactly zero!!
The primary metal industry in North America, including in the US, has been in decline for a variety of reasons. The ONLY reason aluminum, specifically, is still thriving in Canada is because of inexpensive hydroelectricity that Canada is fortunate in having in more abundance.
In all likelihood, other countries will strike back in a trade war. Often in the past, the aggrieved countries brought their cases to WTO and GATT and the US had to retreat. Chances are that the SAME thing will happen this time as well.
However, this is ALL about political optics. Trump will bang his trade drum and mesmerized Americans will listen to it, hollering victory. Soon thereafter the countries will strike back, including complaints to WTO and GATT, and very likely the US will slink away -
quite as a mouse - by tucking its tail behind hind legs. Of course, Trump and his cohorts will refrain from making any mention of that. A majority of the American populace will still claim victory. Ignorance is bliss after all!
EVEN if there is a resurgence of metal industry in the US, it will take MANY YEARS - let's say a couple of decades - to find out if they can truly compete. This will be LONG after Trump's gone with destruction only to be left and felt.
2
GATT and WTO. Really. Its time to pull out and start bilateral trade negotiations rather than abide by those unfair and lopsided organizations. Abiding by GATT and the WTO has done nothing but damage the US economy. Change is due.
(Dec 2017 data:) Canada accounted for the largest
share of U.S. imports by source
country at 16 percent ,
followed by Brazil at 13 percent
, South Korea at 10
percent , Mexico at 9
percent , and Russia at
9 percent. (Note: China is not on the list.)
So, which countries are we hurting the most? Canada and Mexico. Has this been thought through?
3
Would be laughable, if not so alarming-the supposed windfall from “the biggest tax cut ever” will quickly go away when consumers see their costs rise for everything
Another Boomer starting a war they have no intention of fighting with full commitment and so will loose. Again. Also, no one wins a trade war especially no one in the lower 95%.
Poor quality, Chinese 2 3/8” tubing, has cost Upstream Energy Producers billions with premature failures. The losses are eventually passed on to consumers.
1
When American companies find it more expensive to buy foreign steel to manufacture their products - from cars to whipping cream cans - the only steel available in many instances - and will be for a long time to come even if we now start to gear up the old or build new plants - what do you think they'll do? Eat the increase or pass it on?
Guess.
That means that the $1.50 tax break that Ryan obscenely bragged about will go to increased consumer prices.
Anyone who thinks the GOP cares about the financial situation of the middle class is deranged.
2018 and 2020.
President trump does make one point that I heartily agree with. Most Americans do not know the extent to which some countries (particularly China) manipulate trade with us. One infamous case is the honey market. China has incessantly flooded the honey market with 'fake' honey causing prices to plummet in an attempt to slow or shut down honey production in the US. China has flooded the market with steel in an attempt to drive out the US Steel industry. There s nothing less than a full blown trade war between the US & China and most people are oblivious to it. By the way, China has been on the winning side of this war for quite some time. Just take a look at the American Rust Belt. An entire region decimated not by conventional war, but by a trade war.
It is a foregone conclusion that this will end badly, but what did we really expect when we put a mercurial and uninformed amature in the white house?
At least now it is clear that Fox News is actually running the country. They simply had to air an ad during a show which Trump often watches and minutes later national policy is decided! And it is so quick and easy this new authoritarian way, with no legalities, tedious thought or careful consideration getting in the way, as they often did during the last administration.
What are all those American farmers going to do when countries slap tariffs on American agricultural products, citing "national security" and the need to protect their own food supply (and which incidentally, will jack up the rural base in those countries). All those agricultural red states? Collateral damage. Be careful of what you vote for...
As a Canadian I am fed up with these stabs to the back from our US "neighbours."
First, this administration went after Canadian sawmill workers with tariffs on our softwood lumber, despite the fact American sawmills don't produce enough lumber for the domestic market. This hurt a lot of small mill towns in Canada. And the higher tariffs on Canadian lumber now add $3,000 to the price of a new house in the U.S.
Next the US went after Bombardier, maker of a great new jet ordered by Delta. Huge tariffs imposed at the behest of Boeing, although later reversed when it was obvious that Boeing was damaged at all.
Now its tariffs on our steel and aluminum. What's next?
Its not as if there will be no repercussions. A year ago I was worried Trump would cancel Nafta and that would hurt the Canadian economy.
Today, I say go ahead and cancel Nafta. We Canadians need to realize our close ties to the US economy are not giving business any stability. We need to diversify with other customers in other countries. Hence the new trade agreements with the EU and we will proceed with the other TPP countries minus the US.
Both Canada and Mexico are looking at closer economic ties to China, and its easy to see why.
2
Closer ties to China. LOL have at it!
This is a move of panic to target the Pennsylvania special election. Mr. Trump thinks these steel tariffs are for voters in that district.
But the consequences will backfire in higher prices for automobiles during a slow selling period. And now there's talk China and other countries will retaliate with tariffs on our exports. Then the jobs will go and your tax cuts with it.
There has been a recession in every Republican administration since 1945. I am sure this will be the start of Trumps recession. The GOP keep getting voted in and keep the same failed policies alive from the past. When will his supporters learn their policies are no good.
1
The Smoot-Hawley Tariff Act (effective 13 March 1930) was legislation enacted by the Republican Congress to provide revenue, to regulate commerce with foreign countries, to encourage the industries of the United States, to protect American labor, and for other purposes. Opinions differ as to its impact on the Great Depression, but all opinions shared the view of large negative consequences. In 1932 the Democratic campaign platform pledged to lower tariffs. After winning the election, President Roosevelt and the now Democratic Congress passed Reciprocal Trade Agreements Act of 1934. Smoot-Hawley was dead.
The current administration is not heavy on either reading history or learning its lessons.
1
As usual with Trump what you don't know, will hurt us. Can't wait to see prices on appliances, cars, etc. Another example of not looking at what global impact would be or maybe not caring. Looks good to his peeps.
"The administration has said it wants to combat cheap metals flooding into the US, particularly from China..."
Hmmm... This is strange since Russia exports more than twice as much to the US as China. Here are the top ten steel exporters to the US according to Reuters.
16.7% Canada
13.2% Brazil
9.7% Korea
9.4% Mexico
8.1% Russia
5.6% Turkey
4.9% Japan
3.7% Germany
3.2% Taiwan
2.9% China
So is this the way Trump is trying to be "more tough on Russia than Obama"? Or is it Canada and Brazil he is after? Care to guess how many times China was among the top ten the past four years?
1
I saw the president of the steelworkers union complain about Chinese "cheating" as a rationale for the tariff. The solution to that is to bring an action at the WTO. If the case is so obvious, why haven't we done so already? It's not like steel tariffs are a new issue as the article shows.
Oh, by the way, Chinese steel apparently constitues two percent of US steel consumption.
What countries don't we have a trade deficit with?
1
I agree with President Donald Trumps decision to slap a 25% tariff on all imported steel. China's greed and indifference to global air , water, land pollution must stop now. A cross board tariff makes sense making no special concessions for any country is in the United States best interest.
The Chinese / Russian steel mills produce steel world wide so don't be fooled by the made in USA stickers on these imports.
2
Steel companies who benefit - only in the short term - from imposition of tariffs are those manufacturers of "merchant grade" low alloy carbon steels - flats, rebar, angles, I-beams, rounds. Firms such as Nucor and Steel Dynamics have performed rather well despite the influx of cheap imported steel from China, Brazil, India. Given today's strong economy, I'm puzzled as "why now?" imposition of tariffs.
There could have been a much saner approach to the problem of steel imports: Infrastructure.
Infrastructure spending could have given US steel companies a preferred advantage over foreign steel in large projects without irritating trade partners. Once again, President Chaos plays without thinking through consequences of protectionism which keeps steel prices higher to intermediate consumers and converters of steel products. Without a comprehensive infrastructure plan in place, Americans will see an increase in costs passed through from suppliers, and into any infrastructure raw material costs.
Specialty steel producers - Timken, Carpenter, ATI, PCC - Special Metals - are less likely to feel the impact, although their customers (aerospace, power generation, and automotive) will see price hikes in the short term, and lead-times will be extended on capital goods items like aircraft. Delays in manufacturing capital goods increase overall Supply Chain costs.
It's clear Trump is incompetent, and reckless. Get him out of power!
1
One normally should have a list of countries engaging in price dumping and target them. Why penalize a country that has high production costs in the first place?
1
I used to wonder how it was possible for anyone to declare bankruptcy 6 times. I wonder no more.
1
It's sad to see so many people who would rathr r the U.S. be a hollow shell of minimum wage jobs than to allow any industrial base at all.
If China started war today, we'd bespeaking Chinese in a decade. Too many TPP advocate have gotten rich selling out the ability to manufacture anything. Just last year, Obama tried to dismantle the only tank production facility in north America. Without steel mills, a trade embargo could destroy our ability to make anything except memes and strongly worded letters.
Obama has naively, ignorantly stumbled on a truth that's blatantly obvious to anyone who thinks about it. Without an industrial base, we are puppets to those with. That's why the south lost the civil war. It wasn't that long ago.
1
Time for Canadians to start taking their business elsewhere. My next vacation - somewhere overseas.
The main victim of this policy will be the American consumer : beer and coke cans as well as cars will become more expensive.
Trump mistakenly thinks that by putting tariffs on imported steel and aluminum, suddenly American companies will emerge to manufacture those materials here? Trump seems unaware that if homemade material costs become higher, than goods made in the USA relying on those materials will be less cost competitive on world markets.
Trump desperately needs an economics tutor.
I doubt Trump's Libertarian purist supporters demanding unregulated "free trade" appreciate government going back to artificially influencing markets through tariffs.
Of course this can start a trade war with Canada, the EU, Mexico, China, Brazil and other trading partners enacting retaliatory tariffs on American products. It's astounding that Trump's followers blindly follow a pseudo-business person with a long history of failed businesses and lawsuits as he childishly "plays at government".
I shop and buy local but from a macro economic perspective I understand the value of free trade agreements, assuming they are fair for labor markets and native country environments, because tariffs and trade wars can spiral out of control causing needless harm.
With the tariffs, Trump is now in the business of picking winners and losers in American industry. He’s chosen our non-competitive metals sector at the expense of our world-leading aerospace companies. Way to go big guy!
If a country is not able to produce competitive products, I imagine raising tariff will not help. Otherwise everyone would do that.
The US already looks to many as the most potentially dangerous country in the world, because of this horrible leadership, the obsession with weapons, the lack of basic safety net for the unlucky citizen. This doesn't affect the good relations and admiration I have for so many US citizens (I have been living in the US and I am still working for a US University), but let me say that you are really looking for becoming the most hated and isolated country in the world. I am so sorry for the many of you I have good relations with. You really need a big, big change if you want to remain what you were.
1
I guess we have enjoyed too high a standard of living here in the good ole USA. The trade wars we are about to engage in will definitely reduce our standard of living. People will probably pull back on purchases in which steel pushes the cost up, especially in the automobile and new housing industries. Then there will be the trickle down effect, in which more and more goods will become more expensive. Looks to me like capitalism is going to get a big black eye. Oh well...
That Trump lets himself be influenced by Fox News which has been used by the steel industry to televise their ads shows how vulnerable his presidency is. The hefty tariffs he seeks impose on imported steel and aluminum to protect domestic production will only hurt America’s allies – Canada, South Korea and the EU – more than it will hurt China, which is only the eighth largest importer to the US.
It suits Trump fine to walk away from “a rules-based trading-system” because his own business empire is in the real estate sector. And he needs to pander to those who supported his campaign to boost approval ratings.
1
Is the SEC or anyone monitoring Trump and his cronies for insider trading? Would we be surprised to learn that they bought into US steel and aluminum company stock a few days before the tariff announcement and 7% price increase? So many ways to monetize the power of the office.
2
Economic illiteracy. The wonders about electing an historically illiterate president is that we get to re-experience past mistakes over and over again, producing predictable disaster. After which we pledge never again. Until the next time we elect an historically illiterate president and the cycle repeats.
2
What surprises me is that none of the so-called independent rating agencies have downgraded US Sovereign Ratings. In the last year, the new administration has reversed every single policy of his predecessor. So if the policies change every 4 or 8 years, how is it that the US ratings are not downgraded? What is the long-term policy of this country? if this had happened in any other country the rating agencies would have been crying copious tears.
Sorry to disappoint but the US long term debt rating, the most important measure, was recently moved to “upgrade watch”.
Although Trump has been itching to announce these new steel and aluminum tariffs “several times in the past eight months,” the timing couldn’t have been more appropriate – soon after Putin’s claim about developing an “invincible” missile, which is aimed at US “vulnerabilities.”
Now Trump keeps the whole country and the entire world busy talking about a possible trade war, and he wouldn’t have to address the potential threat Putin’s new toy could pose to US security. It may also be a welcome distraction from the ongoing investigations and Hope Hicks’ departure etc.
3
My guess is that Trump announced that he would impose tariffs on steel not to help the steel industry but because he wants to rescue the Republican running in a special Congressional Election in Pennsylvania, near Pittsburgh.
Look at this comment in today's NY Times article about the election, quoting a voter disappointed in Trump so far:
"So she voted for Donald J. Trump, hoping he would shake up Washington and bring back steel, the way he promised."
[the reporter checked back with the voter and found that Trump's proposed tariff won't work to lure this disappointed voter back to the Republicans]
2
" “Trade wars are good, and easy to win,” he tweeted the next morning."
Soon we will hear: "who knew trade wars could be so complicated?"
6
This too little too late. If tariffs are to be imposed, they should have been in place 20 years ago before our steel industry was decimated. Our businesses now are reliant on the steel and aluminum sold on the open market. The tariffs sound good but the inflationary ripple that will run through our economy could be devastating. Again, a feel good policy with no real thought behind it. This won't create jobs, it will seriously imperial them.
6
Tariffs should be directed at China, Vietnam, India, Mexico and others who offer either much cheaper labor or sub size their manufacturers as China apparently does. We’ve e heard nothing but stories about China dumping steel and aluminum on U.S. markets yet now it’s all about Canada and Germany, what gives, these countries treat their employees much better than American companies, everything else being equal that leaves only management and Wall Street( and their overly compensated roles)as the culprit in the price differential and lack of competitiveness of American Companies, a very likely scenario.
6
Where is Trump's study that explains the ultimate ramifications of his actions before his "shoot from the hip" implementation of these shoot from the hip tariffs? What is the CBO's study and opinion in this matter.
It has already been stated that 40,000 Americans will lose their jobs. And what will be the cost to the three hundred twenty-two million of the rest of us, who have to purchase products of steel and aluminum, like cars and houses?
If they negatively impact our country more than if they hadn't been implemented, who will pay for them?
How about the 1%, including the businesses that derived the vast majority of the "tax reform" benefits to the tune of $1.5 billion? After all, the rest of us are already paying for them. It's their turn to step up to the plate!
1
Well all that "supposed money in people's pockets" that the "Tax Reform" was supposed to produce has just disappeared before it was even there. 25% increase cost in steel and 10% in aluminum means more expensive cars, more expensive major appliances, etc.
Result, less consumer spending in high ticket items, less production required of those products required, people getting laid off. Unemployment goes up. The beginning of the implosion of the "Great Corporate and Wealthy Tax Gift Act of 2017".
1
Politics of populism trump sound economic policy, as we witness the creep of protectionist import duties. The financial brunt of these tariffs will be born by our consumers as prices rise on products using steel and aluminum. Carried to an extreme, our honeymoon with a low inflation environment will erode. Beneath the headline, we export almost as much to Canada as we import, so our neighbors to the north are well positioned to impose their own protectionist measures. History informs us that the Smoot-Hayley protectionist tariff legislation contributed far more to the economic depression of the last century than the implosion of the stock market. Short term job gains for US manufacturers in some sectors will be offset by job losses by workers who assemble imported products. Then again, our president does not permit facts to confuse him.
4
Rather than punish our suppliers of Steel and Aluminum, why don’t we compete. The imports metal industry was our own doing. The insistence of short term thinking and profits made it easy for board room decisions to be taken in favor of reduced costs, lower investments and higher EPS. In some cases entire metal processing plants were uprooted and moved to offshore sites , and the companies selling the equipment remain a significant stakeholder in these offshore plants.
Engineers , like myself , disillusioned with the fact that our best technology was being sent overseas because, they could produce metal at a lower cost. Some blamed the unions and others the leadership running the unions and companies.. the blame goes across the board.
When the engineers proposed new and better technologies we were told either do not bother our foreign partners can still do it at lower cost, or develop the processes and we will decide if we can keep it here in the USA.
Well, we all know what happened, middle class factory jobs suffered, young folks knowing that manufacturing jobs are not a stable career path, we are now at point skilled labor is difficult for manufacturers to hire.
My answer, no tariffs, set quota limits on how much metal can be imported and incentivize companies to invest in new technologies that create skilled manufacturing jobs..
7
If this is an attempt to distract the kids from demanding assault weapon bans, this sleight of hands will not work
If this is an attempt to distract the American people from knowing Mueller is closing in, this will not work
If this is a way to distract the pol junkies asking about Jared, Hope Hicks, HR McMaster et al, this will not work
If this is a way to destroy world's economies, sure, go ahead... Those people getting a 1,000 dollar bonus this year may have to pay an extra grand or two for a car, no more price rollback from Walmart... all in the name of getting steel CEOs another banner year
7
Aside from the economic argument, how is it that the President can unilaterally impose tariffs? Isn't that Congress' job?
5
Okay, I think it's nuts, but if Trump wants to put tariffs on steel and aluminum I guess it's going to happen.
But why in Dog's name would he announce a 25% tariff on steel but only a 10% tariff on aluminum?
Aluminum is the more important metal for the 21st Century, providing lightness with strength and ductility, characteristics important to the growing businesses of electric autos and fuel-efficient aircraft, and the reports I've seen indicate US aluminum production has dropped nearly 90% over the last 30 or so years. I'm not saying steel isn't important, but it's nowhere near as important as aluminum, at least in my opinion.
Also the tariff will not revive the domestic aluminum industry, which still depends on massive inputs of electricity at very low cost, which today means electricity supplied by hydropower (largely tapped out now), solar power (Trump opposes) and wind power (Trump opposes). Despite Trump's and Rick Perry's pipe dreams, coal is not going to enter the picture.
These tariffs look like another Trump bow to the departed past, but this one all but guaranteed to cost us all in many deleterious ways.
1
Mr. Trump seems not to realize that this kind of protectionism will be the start of an economic „war“ with his allies ( I.e. Germany, Canada etc.) and other trade partners. How could this man be elected to POTUS? Here in Europe we have no answer.
16
isn't is strange... the majority in the United States ask the same question. I guess the difference is, we're embarrassed.
I can explain. Trump is a Russian agent out to destroy the US. Our population is a basket of deplorables as Clinton once remarked.
1
Is there any evidence that there is capacity in the US steel industry to step up production at a cost less than imports, even with tariffs? Many mills here have closed and there seems to be little interest in starting up new ventures, especially since soon down the road the tariffs may be reversed. Same for aluminum. Likeliest outcome will be higher prices for Americans and reprisals by countries all over the world. We continue to involute, not becoming great again.
6
This is an old world industry that made the U.S. an industrial power in the late 19th century leading into the 20th century. However, U.S. industries have changed dramatically since that great revolution. Today, the U.S. is about inventions such as artificial intelligence (AI), sporting the best universities in the world and producing the next generation of engineers to lead the way.
To focus on this old world industry is miopic and a dangerous precedent
to set. Why not focus on producing the AI that run the furnaces and machines inside the steel mills. Better margins & lower costs always drives profitability.
8
With all due respect to the aluminum industry, American aluminum ore isn't very good. They can only work with what they've got, but this makes no economic sense at all. Trump in his economic genius will impose a massive tax on everyone and it will not add a single job in aluminum mining and production, and will probably cost tens of thousands of jobs in American industries other nations will now sanction.
7
I wouldn't be surprised if some of this is an attempt to boost GOP support during the March 13 Pennsylvania special election. Polls have shown the race being even, and though they said they'd go there to campaign, Trump and Pence rallies wouldn't do much since they haven't increased employment in the area.
9
I don’t think Trump knows what he’s doing. It is clear to me that he is making a lot up as he goes along. Some people elected him into office because he was a successful businessman. His success in business, however, is an unknown, since he won’t release his tax returns. What we do know is that he declared bankruptcy several times. Was it four times? A really clever entrepreneur never has to declare bankruptcy at all. Ever! But in any case, he is in politics now, heading up an administration. That is very different from heading up a business. Heading up a business, he had to understand business, commerce and the bottom line. As POTUS, he has to understand economics. There is a world of difference between understanding a balance sheet and understanding macro- and micro-economics. That’s what the people who elected him into office don’t seem to understand. It is my opinion that they have set themselves up for disappointment.
7
Mark, he was never successful at business. His presidency is a dumpster fire.
Another idiotic move by the child-president Clown, who, as it turns out, actually knows very little about business and even less about...well...everything else.
16
Wonder how many of the foreign car manufacturers that built plants in the US recently will now shutter those plants and take production elsewhere, where their most importany raw material will be much cheaper?
And what about good old Tesla, which has been trying to ramp up production of a moderately priced electric car? Raising the price of its major raw material won't help the company in its pursuit of an affordable, mass-produced electric car.
But then, who knows? Trump said he would help the Dreamers and then changed his mind.
Then he said he would consider gun control, but his emergency meeting with the NRA has changed his mind - surprise.
He said he'd bring us all better healthcare at more affordable prices, but instead has brought many of us worse care and much higher prices.
We certainly live in interesting times.
21
Contrary to what many commenters seem to think, including NYT picks, Trump's tariffs are directed just as much, if not more so, at advanced economies and welfare states, with labour costs and environmental standards that are at least equivalent to American ones, not just third world countries with low costs and standards. Their goal is to undermine and destroy the Canada/US free trade agreement and the WTO ---what's the point of trade agreements and rules if the US is free to break them as it sees fit. The only rational response of other advanced economies isn't simply to accept a free for all international trade war , but to develop free trade agreements among themselves that operate independently of the US and excludes it, and, ultimately to do the same with respect to a reserve currency and foreign and military affairs. They need to ensure, in other words, that America First means America Absolutely Alone, not America Imperator. Everyone will likely be worse off, except perhaps China and Russia, but other advanced democracies will at least avoid a complete international state of nature subject to the arbitrary whims of America.
36
This process is already underway, outside of the USA. I am quite frankly shocked at how many people in this country are so deluded to think that the world cannot function without the US, or even that the USA is entitled to lead at all times. Sad. I am fairly certain that the global economy is better off with the USA as a cooperative participant, but it does exist with or without. Isolationism will likely hurt everyone, but it will hurt the US the most. I would rather not go down this path to the point where even the last ignorant has to admit this.
Self-reliance is imperative in time of war. Could it be that Trump is planning one in the near future? Tune into the next episode of "He said/did what ?????"
8
I am so UNPROUD to be American . Enough said . We need a new president
. This is not a reality show .
17
Another Trump Train Wreck. Imagine that?
11
how much steel does russia make?
3
I work int he aluminum industry as it exists in the US. The aluminum they are discussing here, is essentially pure aluminum, which isn't used for anything outside of some niche wire usage. We import it because the cost of electricity to smelt aluminum is enormous. We can't do it here in any cost effective way without massive subsidies from power companies which receive incentives from the state.
And that aluminum that would be made is not the final product of anything. It is the base that is remelted with other alloying elements to make things like airplane parts, beverage cans, automobile sheet and structures, window frames, boat hulls, and all kinds of defense applications from guns to armor plating to jet fighters. These are all made from alloys that remelt the aluminum we import from cheaper producing nations.
I would guess that 90% of the aluminum industry in the US is based off of producing these alloys, or forming them into products. I'm not sure how this doesn't raise costs for the entire US aluminum industry. Only a couple of companies still have smelters and even they can't keep up with the entire industries demand - they can't even supply themselves often.
So notwithstanding the trade wars this is likely to start, I don't see how it is any benefit to the US aluminum industry as it exists today.
32
Maybe a wiser course would be to subsidize our steel industry like other countries subsidize theirs.
Those that dismiss the hollowing out of basic industries like steel production don't seem to understand that you can't be one of the great industrial nations without industry. You can't base an entire modern economy on services.
And China and other countries have been stealing our industries for decades though market manipulations. You can't look at 35 straight years of trade deficits without questioning the very premise of free trade theory. This is not supposed to happen. Currency prices are supposed to balance the trade and that is not happening.
But the arguments about starting a trade war, and more importantly hurting our industries that depend on steel and aluminum do have merit.
So maybe instead of using club of large tariff doing the same thing that other countries do would make more sense.
A lot of people seem to take the view of trade that the global trading system is a done deal and nothing can be changed. Considering how bad the current system is for workers and the environment, this seems more like drinking the corporate cool aid than wise counsel. We must find a better way to trade than forcing all governments to compete by slashing investment in humans and the environment. That is not natural advantage that is market manipulation by extortion.
But Trumpian slash and burn techniques are not going to make things better either.
Build a Human Economy.
16
Subsidizing the steel industry would violate NAFTA rules
In the construction industry, steel is used in both steel framed buildings and in concrete framed buildings (in the reinforcement.) I just can't imagine the U.S. has the capacity to meet the demand. It would not surprise me if a lot of architects start specifying wood (engineered wood beams and wood slabs known as cross laminated timber, etc.) for projects - and contractors, in the interest of keeping costs in check, ditch steel and start becoming acquainted with the ins and outs of wood. There are going to be a lot of angry union iron workers out there.
Furthermore, a lot of window systems are made out of aluminum. It will be another opportunity to see a paradigm shift there as well.
This is in no way a defense of what is surely a dimwitted appeal to populist fantasy. Just speculation on what may happen in the industry.
6
As an architect in the steel city we just completed our first zero energy engineered timber framed building with sips panels. Competitive with steel for some applications... not a panacea but an option.
Time for Canada to stop exporting electricity, oil and gas to the US. After all, if it's no longer an integrated economy then I guess those don't need to cross the border any more than the steel exports.
Let's see how well that works out for Trump.
12
Sadly, I think that would lead to us here in Canada being labelled as enemies. Our harmonious relationship would end.
When Trump gets removed from office the stock market will resume its bull run.
4
Trump is colluding with some of his cronies to tip them on certain tweets and policy moves that are designed to disrupt the markets, even specific stock movement (like autos and Boeing - dependent on steel and aluminum pricing).
This is far from the first time he's pulled this. His first year of "chaos" is full of examples that the SEC (were it a functional agency) should be looking into for accompanying trading irregularities in the days immediately preceding disruptive 'tweets.'
Most of what Trump does has a simple motive, greed, and self-dealing.
25
Hey GOP! Figure out your boss is crazy yet?
28
Everyone, rich or poor, just got another tax increase, since as mentioned in a previous comment (https://goo.gl/QtNdhv),
“Rising interest rate will decrease the value of the dollar [A], which when coupled with tariff on foreign goods would induce an effective tax increase for everyone, from the lowest earners to the top 1% [B], since consumer prices would increase significantly [C].”
So goodbye “big and beautiful tax cut”.
[A] The Treasury is set to borrow nearly $1 trillion this year, and at least that much afterward. Here's why it matters, David 2018.02.05 (https://goo.gl/UA9uMx)
[B] Last Week Donald Trump Raised Taxes on Every Single American, Tamny 2018.01.28 (https://goo.gl/xknZ7X)
[C] The Economics of Dirty Old Men, Krugman 2018.01.25 (https://goo.gl/dfCdBg)
13
wow. back in the early 80s the steel industry was moving to korea. now it's in china. all of this took a long time to change..... now we are going to be protectionist without preparing for the disruptive consequences? ugh. what a moron. the people on wall street will be fine but the working guy is going to take it in the shorts.
8
Trump reminds me of all the anti-Free Traders the we had in Canada in the 1980s... Gummo Marxists (even though Karl Marx was for Free Trade)... Many many many years have passed and you are today where the socialists of old were... You go girl!!!
5
Marx favored free trade because he believed it would heighten class antagonism and hasten the end of capitalism.
1
Because of NAFTA American companies didnt have to maintain large corprorate Cdn HQ’s which led to thousands of job losses. Wages didn’t dramatically increase for Cdns under NAFTA, there are many problems just as well as there are some good things in it
I'm no economist, but I know this is yet another stupid, stupid, destructive move by our lousy so-called president.
6
For a Business Person, he sure is Stupid...as they say, Penny Wise, Pound Foolish!
7
Stupid human tricks, ... again.
2
Steel in America is mostly non-union jobs in mini-mills that work with recycled materials in smaller arc furnaces. The corporations found ways to make it cheaper, with more automation and fewer workers. Only 140K steel jobs remain today - because the industry changed, not because of imports. But Trump's tariffs will raise steel prices and impact negatively on the more than 6M people working in industries that process steel. This is a tariff only a corporation could love, it does nothing for the American worker.
6
No bigger win for Putin. Trump is dedicated to putting the US permanently behind the eight ball.
6
Trump just popped off with this news in a totally unrelated meeting and the markets immediately plunged. This must be Trump's idea of him "Making America Great Again" with his stellar leadership.
Trump needs a leash--badly. This kind of irresponsible stunt is yet another way that Emperor Donald the Dumb is destroying our nation.
8
This is what happens when you have a senile old fool in the Oval Office who doesn't read. doesn't understand the complexity of global trade and whose mind bounces like a yo-yo from one bad idea to the next. He pulled us out of the TPP and now is said to want to rejoin because he didn't realize it gave China a leading role in that trade pact. He imposes tariffs on steel and aluminum, against the advice of his own National Economic Council, without realizing that price hikes to cover the tariffs will cost jobs in other industries such as construction, oil and gas and car manufacturing, which employ far more Americans than steel and aluminum. In short, the only threat to our economy and our national security is his empty head.
29
The plot thickens.
4
So how is your immediate recession in Michigan, Illinois, New York, Main and god- praying Wyoming? Canada will/has stopped buying from each in retaliation. Well done bigots ( in 50 years, that is tough to write, but now so accurate).
6
Screw up the stock market, get the gun regulation issue and the Kushner blatant financial corruption out of the news, also the departure of another close aid, and on we go. Thanks again, Russia, for providing us this great leadership.
7
Bunker mentality. Gearing up for what, World War III? Or is it just a bully move? And what gives him the right to impose tariffs all by himself? This is nuts.
6
So who is getting to him on this? NYT - that is your story -- not just reporting that this president, who has not ever had any position on anything just decided abruptly to do this. Someone got to him, and convinced him it would somehow help his image. That is your story-go for it and come back to us readers when you have something more.
8
Clueless.
Not.A.Clue.
PS: Donald Trump didn't use U.S. steel when he needed steel.
Why?
7
Solid Republican leadership!
3
Horrible move. If other countries want to "dump" their products on our shores, the American consumer benefits! I love buying below cost. Tariffs are nothing more than a protection racket for workers who can't compete in the free market.
2
Wow. Seriously? Tell me, Joe how do you compete with a government subsidized mill that pays it's workers the USD equivalent of $2.50 an hour?
Trump started a trade war with the whole world.
4
#HiddenTaxHike This ill-conceived tantrum is nothing but a sop to his MAGA base which will be sorely surprised when they go to buy a new car or anything with aluminum or steel in it and ... wait for it ... it costs more.
2
This is what happens when a man with the intellect of a toddler tries to make trade policy. And I bet he won't clean up his mess when he's done.
4
Good for Trump for trying bring good jobs back to the US rather than trying mandate entry level retail workers be paid exorbintant wages.
RE: Markets Plunge as Trump Plans Tariffs on Steel and Aluminum
Really? 2% before a recovery is a plunge> NYT reporters needs to get therapy for their severe Trump derangement syndrom.
1
Oh Goodie. Inferior steel and aluminum products at a higher price.
6
A trade economist once asked Trump if he was familiar with the (widely accepted) trade theories of David Ricardo (1772-1823). Trump responded by asking if he was "an illegal".
Then the meeting turned to the burning question of how to bring back America's whale oil industry..
MMGG! (Make 'Merica Great 'Giiin!)
5
If I'm not mistaken, Canada imports more US steel than all the rest of the world combined. Time to hit back at Canada! They are so foolish to mess with Wilbur, Robert & Donald!
7
If to disrupt is equivalent to leading, or to creating cogent policy, Donald Trump simply would have no equal.
But it is not.
With each new casually dropped statement, America is like the proverbial bull in a jewelry shop. More specifically we are seen as feckless, rudderless, undependable, and a failed coalition leader. Mr. Trump is a spoiler with no sense of politics, history, economics, or war. There is no policy behind the disruption but the damage it creates is very real. Were I an enemy of America, or of the West, I'd be beside myself with joy at this president. He is doing more to unravel mindlessly the stability we've fought for and created post WWII, he might as well be a foreign agent. He is ghastly.
121
The economic unraveling has finally begun. Trump’s election signaled the end of one the longest post war expansions. The anticipation of tax cuts fueled a last gasp rally in stocks, which will now lead by about a year, a global recession, thanks to the moronic economic policies of a would be tyrant and his band of thieving cronies. The big question is, will the rest of the world learn from history and wait for the current US administration to be tossed in the dustbin of history, or will they foolishly reply tit for tat? If they follow Trump’s lead, the next global war seems inevitable, Only this time, with lots and lots more nukes. Live each day fully, my friends.
9
That is one way to cut down on guns, make the metal needed to make them really expensive.
7
Remember when Trump told us to look at our 401(k) balances and thank him? What about now?
3
Canada and Germany are some of the closest allies of the USA, and importing metals from them is clearly not contrary to our national security interests. This move by Trump is clearly a ruse to gain some political talking points. He will claim to have saved jobs in the metals industry, while in fact this move will cost many more jobs in other export-driven industries as other nations curtail US imports. It's a bad move strategically, serving only a few special interests while harming the majority of Americans.
9
Right. Ridiculous to think that Germany could ever be our enemy.
Sounds like another reiteration of idiocy. But most countries aren't really in a position to launch a trade war with America. Outside of China and perhaps India, we simply have far more consumers than most other countries. His base is probably too stupid to realize that this will merely drive up the price of goods that every American purchases sooner or later. If American steel production was competitive from a price perspective, we wouldn't be importing any at all, we'd be a net exporter.
On the other hand, it seems like the height of folly to rely on aluminum from countries like Russia, unless one is 100% certain that other countries could pick up the slack if they decided to stop supplying us. Plus there's the involvement of sanctions that Congress passed but Trump has refused to implement. Why would America want to give any money to Putin?
Geopolitics and international trade, very complicated games. China has been taking advantage of America on many levels for decades, with the complete complicity of our own plutocrats and politicians. We need better deals, the one way street has to end. Trump, as is his wont, will probably make things worse. He's got the SadiM touch, the opposite of the ability to turn ordinary material into gold.
3
The solution is simple for exporting countries and their foreign suppliers. Export more finished products, cars, machines, containers, rail cars, airplanes, as well as simple products, as cutlery, pots and pans. It will greatly help their industrial base to grow.
And the US will need less construction.
They will bless US policies for making them great as well
2
So who is paying Trump to make these absurd uninformed moves? Will his adoring base that becomes even more unemployed as a result of this disastrous scheme blame him? or Obama? or Hillary?
3
This is the one scenario where you can find Democrats lining up to defend Wall Street. Look in the mirror, Democrats! Are you going to defend Main Street Americans or not?
2
This may have been germane about 50 years ago... when the US started making steel overseas.... but now where the steel mills once stood
there are Walmarts -- . Meantime, the citizens iof Pittsburgh, Birmingham (Bessemer), Etc. breathe clean air; the Ohio River water no longer emits delightful odors from the tap_- in those days no one drank bottled water... The point is there are fewer places to install this type of infrastructure.
Besides which plastic and various polymers continue to replace steel... What about things made of aluminum.. What are car engines made of these days?? (Are we taxing raw materials or manufactured products.)
OTOH shipping costs should be less... and the shipping industry may "suffer." Oh Boy -- more disruption from the Prez. Too bad the market didn't fall ten percent.
2
Yep, exactly what happens when a President who is a puppet for Big Business and legislates by the Internet has an idea put into his head and who won't read books to learn what such a far reaching taxation will do...not can do. If Trump thinks he can make more friends on the International scene by dealing in legislation which attacks our allies then he really hasn't done his homework. and by the way, President Trump, our friends DO NOT include Russia in case you didn't know that.
6
It's disheartening to read so many comments from well-informed readers who actually know what happened when Bush tried this in 2002. It's disheartening because Trump is so poorly-informed that even though multiple economists and business leaders have pointed out the flaws in these tariffs, he persists in his narcissistic pattern of thinking he knows more than the experts, or history, are telling him.
8
Just two points I want to make. First, aluminum. Something like 9 out of the 10 Canadians aluminum plants are in Quebec and that's not just a coincidence. Electricity is is the most expensive part and producing aluminum, and we have lots of cheap hydro-electricity here. That's why we produce a lot of it and the U.S. can buy it dirt cheap. If you cut us out, It will just raise the price for American business no matter who produces it.
Then there are the consequences of a trade war. Wars inflict pain on the adversary. There is already talk on the news that the Europeans will retaliate by targeting Red States' products like Bourbon whisky and the like. I'm not sure the President figured all that out today before his surprise announcement that all his economic advisers are reportedly against. Some pain is impossible to avoid, but the consequences of this brainless idea will be 100% self-inflicted and counter productive.
. ine r
17
Stable genius at work.
11
Pity the nice folks in New York state, Illinois, Wyoming, Maine, Michigan that just lost every purchase order from Canadian companies. All gone to EU or TPP partners.
8
You're running out of toes, this is a gift to the accelerating repositioning of China and the Russians are going to need more popcorn to enjoy this show that they helped get on the air.
With the base turned up to 11, here's hoping that a few of those marchers find their way to the booth in Nov.
4
Maybe some of you that think that it is enough to vote for an hour every two years should go out and do some marching too.
It wasn't voting that raised the minimum wage in NY State. Cuomo was already in office and opposed to the idea, It was fast food workers marching that did that.
Women didn't get the vote because a bunch of old white men got elected. They stopped cleaning and cooking and hit the streets. FDR didn't run on the New Deal. His policies were the same as Hoover's. Millions of marchers forced him and congress to do that.
The EPA wasn't formed because Nixon was elected. Nixon formed the EPA because the environmental movement changed what is normal.
And there was no election last week, but young people are forcing politicians to shift on gun laws by speaking up and walking out of school.
Neither protest nor voting are sufficient by themselves. Both are necessary because they operate together, like Yin and Yan or the positive and negative parts of a wave.
While you sit at home ad wonder why some activists don't vote, they are marching and wondering why you are home.
If you want people to vote, you need to get them involved ore than once every two years. And if you want to get activists to vote, you have to help them instead of insulting them.
You can't use tarrifs to erase the history of economics.
5
Maybe, but you can't let the history of economics become the future of economics either. Otherwise we would still be hunter gatherers.
The current free trade regime is making billionaires richer, but US workers are not seeing any of the gains in their productivity, and lax regulation is causing climate disaster that will dwarf anything a trade war can do.
We need to move carefully to a fair trade system. "Free Trade" religion is a fervent belief in a bad system.
We can create a Human Economy.
1
Wage stagnation is the choice of employers to better profit themselves and share holders. Its been so for 30 years, and improving company profits has never proven to lift wages in our lifetime. That's why we had strong Unions until the 80's.
Anyone want to bet that Trump and Putin (through their agents, of course), shorted the market yesterday, in anticipation of Trump’s announcement today?
12
This will, at the very least, be inflationary. The economy will definitely suffer and those who are less well off, will have an even bigger burden as prices for automobiles, housing, and even foodstuffs increase. This will be a job killer as well, as some employers especially those in the building trade, look to cut costs in order to even stay in business. There isn't even an easing into this situation so that businesses requiring the use of steel and aluminum in whatever products they produce can can adjust to the new reality.
The world is rapidly, and with good reason, turning its back on us. We are becoming isolated. The cheese is standing alone, at a dangerous time in this world when we need allies. We have no captain to steer our ship of state, instead we have an impetuous, ill-informed, dangerous vulgarian whose every utterance is demoralizing a great many of the citizens of this country, every single day. We have a White House in chaos with major players there using the cachet of their information to personally enrich themselves (thinking of Kushner especially). We have senior diplomats resigning their positions because of the untenable posturing of the man who is our President . I honestly do not know what this country even stands for anymore.
5
It is easy for the President to undo things but we don't hear any forward thinking about what he replaces them with.
3
“Brazil, Canada, Germany, Mexico and South Korea were the largest suppliers of steel to the United States in 2017, while Canada, Russia and the United Arab Emirates shipped the largest share of aluminum imports in 2016.”
So, Mr Trump, exactly how does this penalize China? It appears you have aimed your economic weapon at our allies. Or was it just aimed at your “base”?
6
Expect any future aircraft carriers and other ships to cost a lot more now that US steel companies are protected and free to raise their prices.
3
Trump is having a bad hair week so he goes back to his "deflect and double down" strategy. Impulsively and against all advice he proclaims 25% tariff on steel and aluminum imports; he really has no idea of the consequences of these tariffs, he just need to deflect from all the bad news. The fact that the stock market went south by 500 points is meaningless to him - he has managed to deflect. Unfortunately US consumers will bear the consequences. But again he doesn't care so long as his base approves and they will even as they suffer. And this is American democracy?
6
Wow. Trump actually does the RIGHT thing, for once, supporting steel mills and union jobs, and Wall st cries? Gee, WHO exactly are Wall St. supporting? Anyone but THEMSELVES?!? It's about time the markets died a little to help the middle class.
2
Trump is imagining all those rust-belt rallies where he can feel the love of guys in MAGA hats when he tells them "You're going back to work." As with solar panel tariffs eliminating thousands of jobs for installers, it's more like "You're fired!"
4
To all those Trump voters. How much of the tax reduction is left in your wallet?
Trillion $ budget deficit - someone has to pay. Then there are the fees not covered under the Trump lower priced healthcare plan. Keeping it simple....the increase in the gas taxes states will impose to pay for all the gifts the Federal Government pushing downward.
3
Better read the history of the Great Depression - begin in the early 20s with the Fordney-McCumber Tariff that prevented many nations from dealing with their WW1 debts and then the Smoot-Hawley Tariff that basically ended international trade and opened the full slide into Depression in 1930.
4
Well again trump is viewing these things thru his gold tinted glasses & his mission to make the richest Americans richer & of course make the poor & middle class poorer.
The increase in everything from cars, appliances, medical devices, tools etc. would be a heavy burden to those of us that look at the price tags when considering a purchase.
I won't even get into the environmental impact, but he doesn't care about that, what's important to him is the money grab race in this life time.
Thanks a lot rich dude.
2
Another impulsive action sure to have unintended consequences. Where are the seasoned civil servants who understand foreign trade and can give serious advice and guidance? Oh yeah, many have left or are heading for the exits.
3
RE: The president of the European Commission, Jean-Claude Juncker, called the measure “blatant intervention to protect U.S. domestic industry” and said the European Union had been a close security ally of the United States for decades.
If the EU does not like it you know it's good for the US. The EU is not an ally. The EU is a dependent. The US has been supporting Europe for over a century - WWI, WWII, Marshall plan, cold war. Time for Europe to pull its own weight.
1
That was then. Putin just announced that the U.S. missile shield is irrelevant (if he's to be believed). So, the Europeans may ask, how relevant or necessary is Uncle Sam these days?
I don't know why people are surprised. Trump is not doing this FOR workers. He is doing this because he is a nationalist. He is implementing leftist policies to get loyalty from working people. This is classic authoritarian nationalism. Don't buy it for a second.
4
The U.S. economy, like it or not, is hopelessly entwined in the international economy, with the myriad facets tangled up like a Gordian Knot. Simply dealing with one aspect - steel and aluminum imports - will only make matters worse domestically. There needs to be a holistic approach to significantly reducing the off-shoring of manufacturing and jobs, without wrecking our domestic economy. Like a cancer that has spread to vital organs, if we aren't extremely careful with how we remove it, the "patient", our economy, can die.
Trump, in his typical ham-handed, simplistic, fashion, is trying to solve it by hacking away with a sword instead of a scalpel. Let's hope he realizes his folly before it's too late.
5
Ford and GM lost value bigly -- because now they'll be paying more for their steel and aluminum. Gee, I wonder if that will motivate them to move more plants to other countries where the tariffs don't apply?
4
Looking for the easy quick fix. This guy is now rudderless and drifting at sea. He is using a shotgun to kill flies. If we are victims of the dumping foreign goods into our country at below the cost of production, single out those countries and negotiate with them, impose targeted sanctions, or take them to court instead of spraying bad will at all countries including the few that still call us friends.
4
"America First" means a smaller, weaker, and poorer America. Rather than growing the American dream, it means living in anger and fear of the world. Thinking the world is a zero-sum game moves us from win/win to lose/lose.
Whether in immigration, trade, or international alliances, Trumpist illusions about things foreign are hurting us.
7
Why am I reminded of China’s Great Leap Forward when Mao tried to boost domestic steel production at the expense of everything else in the economy? Turned out not so good.
4
I have a question: are not modern steel manufacturing plants using many robotics systems these days instead of humans?
3
Every Republican President since Reagan has cut taxes, created huge deficits and debt and caused a recession and or market crash, each one worse than the last. As Republicans continue to decimate the safety net this time it will be a depression.
6
Trade war are bad, very bad. But what would REALLY hurt the US economy if countries targeted by the the tariffs wanted to retaliate is simply to stop buying T-bills. This would not violate any WTO rule and could not trigger retaliation BUT it would send interest rates to the roof. It's a passive retaliation and no country has any obligation to support the US massive debd. Also with a president that presided over six bankruptcies and is now significantly increasing the debt burden of generations of American, one could ask if he's not simply plannig just another bankruptcy... the whole USA this time. Sad.
6
Whatever your views on metals tariffs, let’s admit that the national security argument here is completely specious and cannot withstand scrutiny. Ex: Two-thirds of steel used here is made here, and importing from allies, especially Canada, is not a concern. It’s every bit as hollow as the now-abandoned plan at FERC to prop up coal and nuclear on bogus “resiliency” grounds. This sort of arbitrary and capricious action is begging for a court challenge. Congress also needs to clarify what is a legitimate national security concern.
3
So while the rest of the world is figuring out how to capitalize on 21st century businesses, such as AI, our self-described “big brain” is attempting to bring back businesses and jobs that peaked in the 19th century. Progress does not mean going backward.
3
Prices will go up across the board: vehicles, medical machines, homes, wherever you look, we use steel and aluminum. The price of cookware, TV sets, bicycles....we are looking at paying more for goods, while losing trade. Brilliant move by our fearful leader.
3
I expect Canada would lodge a complaint with NAFTA to be handled under the dispute resolution procedure, or with the WTO. This move clearly violates the NAFTA Agreement. It seems obvious that Trump, Navarro, Lighthizer and Ross are all technically incompetent in matters of international trade regimes. They appear to be ideological agenda-driven people without a clue about the collateral damage they are doing around the world and in the USA. The issue for tariffs isn't whether the imports are cheap - the issue is whether they are cheap because their manufacture is violating the terms of the trade agreements; the country imposing the tariffs needs to prove this before doing so. According to the information in this article, the US has not proven the case, leaving it open to legal and retaliatory sanctions from all affected countries. This is serious given the importance of steel and aluminum throughout the goods sectors of the economies concerned, be it autos, aircraft and many other manufactured products. Special interest groups should not be allowed to destroy the greater good of the American economy, even if they could care less about countries with whom the US has entered agreements. Those countries already know by now that the US is not a trustworthy country to do business with and would likely guide their future relationships accordingly - not only in trade.
80
Dear Mark, I think you should sit in the White House, instead of the monkeys who are there right now.
1
It seems like many of the commenters would like to keep going with more than half a trillion dollars in ANNUAL trade deficits. Of course it can be paid with cheaper dollars at a future date or we can borrow from foreign countries. But this cannot go on forever or can it?
I agree with many of the commenters that this announcement seemed to be ad hoc rather than well thought out policy. A point-of-sales tax on all imported goods, albeit a moderate one, will wean us away from buying so much useless imported consumer goods (including Trump neckties and Ivanka fake jewelry) while at the same time it will raise much needed revenue to fix our infrastructure.
1
Cheaper dollar?? my foot. The dollar is way down against the Eruo...
Once upon a time there was a 10 percent LUXURY TAX on useless stuff including luxury yachts, expensive jewelry and art at auction... and I am in favor of bringing that back...
3
I think quotas would be more effective than a tariff, but we shall see soon.
1
By imposing tariffs on steel and Al from *all* countries Trump is saying that American products are 2nd rate and need protection. Even if that's not true now it will become true after a few years of protective tariffs.
4
Milton Friedman, the Nobel Prize winning economist, used to say if countries want to subsidize products and sell them to us at a loss, we should take advantage of it to acquire those discounted products. Why should we decline free money?
One can only assume that Trump from the subliminal cacophony that is his thought processes, recognizes that the inflation spiral he is about to unleash will push up the values of his personal property and diminish the debt he has outstanding.
4
US tariffs against Canadian lumber have added about $2000 to the cost of building an American home. These new tariffs will add large new costs to American manufactures, but they will also spark a trade war. China is already preparing to devastate large chunks of US agriculture. I hope that my own country, Canada, does not take this lying down. Canada is the number one trade partner for about 35 American states. If the US hurts us, I think that Canada has every right to strike back and put as many Americans out of work as possible. What's sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander.
29
America has a more robust and diversified economy than Canada and we are much harder working too (Americans have 2, 3, 4 jobs and little vacation). Do you honestly think Canada will come out ahead in an all out trade war with USA? Please.
That’s right Andy. We’ll each have 4 jobs, never go on vacation, and be so much better off for it. Take that Canada!
History repeats itself when we do not learn. The snake oil will not save the US but it certainly can make the US less competitive in the global economy.
7
I'm in the renewable energy industry; a solar developer. We have had to incorporate trump tariff values into our financial models for the past year as just the potential for a tariff on Asian panels affected prices; now we're looking at the same scenario for racking (although the tariff may be more immediate), as materials are generally sourced through overseas companies. . . Racking that we purchase is fabricated but not produced by local and regional businesses.
As most do, I wonder how trump will affect the renewable energy industry; his track record shows that he cares less about jobs and more about promoting industries that are nearly obsolete.
American automotive industry: watch out; . . . this dude has no idea what he's doing.
24
Steel tariffs - any tariffs - are ill-advised. So are subsidies to the "renewable energy" business.
2
In my state, in terms of commercial ratepayers, we can all afford a $.0007/kWh charge (current combined PBC, one third of which goes to RECs for renewables; residential is a bit higher charge) to promote clean skies and reduced CO2 emissions. NC is a state that benefits more from solar than most; not happy about that?
You may be happy, though, to know that most larger solar projects, as a part of internal project costs, are paying for grid upgrades, regardless of utility. . . . They're effectively modernizing the grid, just for you.
2
Putting the pieces together, it makes sense. Tax reform was step one - a temporary and tiny reduction for the ordinary people while 0.1% gets to keep bucketloads of gold. Step two is to grab the tax money that the ordinary people pay. Trump will go big on infrastructure and the White House has been a very popular joint for people in the infrastructure business and for friends of Trump, and Kushner, that suddenly find that ventures around infrastructure has a bright future. Keep an eye on how the capital flows within the steel business. That the US will loose big in the long run does not matter, this is about the rich getting the rest of what the US of A has to offer.
Steel will be more expensive in Trumpland and it will be paid by tax money.
Directly from the middle class into the pockets of Trump, Kushner and their friends.
EU, in the mean time, are already preparing counteractions and I'm confident China is as well.
You're getting robbed. The robbers have an inside man. Actually, they are all inside.
32
Trump is about to announce a huge $trillion+ infrastructure program. It is a safe assumption that lots of steel and aluminum will be needed. In his wisdom, Trump wants to raise the prices of these commodities first. Can we have an explanation? Please?
6
Could this particular announcement simply be the latest in creating chaos to creating a lot of smoke to hide the next Mueller arrests? Could some one go that far? Or is he POed that Hope Hicks left him alone with Jared, Ivanka, Sarah and his General? He has just declared a trade war. Will he say that he was just joking when he issues his Sunday AM tweets?
He gave up US influence in the Pacific to China - - - now he is making certain that the US won't be competitive.
22
Hmmmm. Seems to me that aluminum production requires huge amounts of electricity. Since our aluminum exports are to be taxed, we should probably put tariffs on all our exported hydro electricity.
13
Canada is the country most affected by these proposed tariffs. Bringing up the national security case over goods imported from America's closest and oldest ally is like a slap in the face. By the way the US enjoys an annual $2billion trade SURPLUS with Canada with respect to steel.
Is it a coincidence that these tariffs are being announced during the latest round of NAFTA meetings?
23
Looking forward hopefully to Prof. Krugman addressing this, "wonkish" or otherwise.
9
A lot of jobs can be generated by the renewable energy industry. Real jobs in a sustainable industry.
This new idea is likely to hurt the middle class, just like everything else coming from the Trump-GOP Borg.
12
Did Trump ever use just American steel in any of his buildings? The only practical reason for this is that it will be good for the bottomline of Trump. I'm sure Trump will get a good deal on any steel he needs.
12
Gary D. Cohn, the director of the National Economic Council, is against this move and tried to talk Trump out of this little "pre-announcement" today, but Trump insisted. I think he just pulled this stunt to deflect attention away from his newest crop of embarrassments, Hicks's departure, Kushner's downgrade, etc.
18
Looks like "Trump Bumps" go both ways. Who'd of thought? But when you're clueless about the economy, among other things..
6
Hey, c'mon now, strengthening Papa Putin's economy while simultaneously protecting America's economy is no simple thing! It's a delicate balancing act fergawdsakes! What, he's Humpty Dumpty all of a sudden? Just a little more slack, a little more rope please and he'll get us there!
8
Trump's predecessors tried tariff wars; they led to increase prices and reduced employment. Tariff wars also invite retaliation and reinforce the message that the US is an unreliable trading partner. It is magical thinking to expect a return of major steel production in this country. The US has not been competitive in steel (other than specialty steel) since the 1980s at the latest. And no investor will see trying to rebuild steel manufacturing as a sensible investment, because it will be dependent on tariffs -- a form of subsidy -- that is inherently political and can disappear as soon as the White House changes hands. Autocrats love the idea of autarchy, but it's been tried and failed repeatedly. This is remarkably bad economics and policy.
11
That was then, this is Trump.
It's never too later to bet on American ignorance, or traditional native arrogance.
11
Wilbur Ross, our Secretary of Commerce, owns steel companies.
18
Wow, every man for himself...Sounds so trumpian. This is gonna come back and bite us on the boo boo.
9
Wonder why he doesn't impose these tariffs on clothing manufactured in Asia and beyond? Oh, silly me, I forgot! Ivanka's company would suffer!
23
Those who don't know their history are doomed to repeat it.
But given our politically inexperienced, know-nothing-and-don't-want-to-know-nothin President, it is not surprising Trump and his advisors--no doubt chosen because they only tell him what he wants to hear rather than incur his rants, wrath, and childish insulting tweets--have made another colossal error in judgment and sent our nation and the trading world into chaos. More Republican amnesia and fuzzy math.
What could possibly go wrong??? Count the ways, because Trump never does.
14
I'd like to see Trump's family brokerage account and see if they bought steel companies yesterday and shorted car and airplane manufacturers (Ford, GM, Boeing, etc).
The Trump crime syndicate , fleecing America one day at a time.
32
Please do not call a 1% decline a “plunge,” as you have done on your website. That is an irresponsible characterization that may influence small, less sophisticated investors in a harmful way.
2
It's a "plunge", because the reason why the markets dropped 10% last month, was fear of inflation and higher interest rates. Trump, today, just added to those fears. Not only is his move going to fuel inflation, it is also going to cause the Fed to raise interest rates faster. While will lead to higher bond prices and higher consumer interest rates. So, you better buy that house ASAP. And that credit card, you better get rid of carried debt.
Finally, that great tax cut is not going to raise your salary to meet inflation.Nor, are the Trump/GOP tax cuts. So, you will spend less, which means manufacturing will decrease. Which, in turn, will lead t o lay offs and less consumers buying things. Unemployment will go up, consumer financial troubles will go up with it. This will lead to non-payment of debts and bankruptcy. And, the finally a deep recession, in which the GOP will not do thing like provide a stimulus or extend unemployment benefits. Not because they are be fiscal conservatives, but because they cut business and 1% taxes, leaving an empty well. And the Fed, may have no choice but do what they did in Europe, negative interest rates. Finally, all those people who do not have pensions, will see their 401ks an d IRAs tank. And, with that, state and federal pension funds.
No, a 1% drop is not a "plunge", but a signal that the US economy is just about to do a 180 degree turn and hit an ice berg with the USS Trump.
You thing 2008 was bad, Trump may repeat 1929.
23
Interesting to see how thoroughly free trade dogma is unquestioned among NYT readers. Nothing good could possibly come from protectionist trade policies. There could never be any reason to enact them, for any industry, under any circumstances
No mention of the fact that Protectionism helped nurture the US steel industry in the 19th century and the Chinese steel industry in the 20th
Protectionism can be smart policy. Not saying it is in this case. But it might be
And hey, it’s good to see an American President making policy regardless of Wall Street’s reaction. Trying to remember if Obama or Clinton ever did that...
No,come to think of it, don’t think they ever did...
6
Except he just dropped the protectionist trade tariff because of Wall Street's reaction.
Does he not know that the price of golf clubs (putters not Mara Lago) will go up?
5
Hooray for Mr.Trump! Hooray for his noble cause and action! Hooray his unselfish act of protecting our steel industry! Hooray for he is the best of the best, loving the nation unselfishly!
Wait, did he used Chinese steel on his buildings? did he hire foreign workers to work on his constructions? And he said he's going to run TOWARDS high school shooter even without a gun.... didn't he run AWAY from Vietnam drafting 5x just because of how spur?
Nevermind, he's just an empty barrel... (to use his Chief of Staff analogy).
11
Another hap hazard spur of the moment decree.
You’d think a reality tv host was running the country...
As if this will help. Other countries will do the same and it will mean more lost jobs.
9
Will be interesting to see how the white, undereducated, underemployed Trump
supporters will react when prices on so many different go through the roof, given reverse tariffs. If they can even make the connection!!
The rich supporters will not care, of course, any more than they care about the rest of T’s base!!
8
White Trump are "Undereducated", why? Because they didn't attend an Ivy league college? Have you sat in on an educated ivy league college social science lecture recently? I did, at my alma mater. It's not education. It's meets the criteria for a diagnosis in the DSM V.
1
beer cans are made from aluminum....
2
If this tariff on steel results in shortages within the US, I have a good solution. Let's confiscate the 300 million guns in this country and melt them down for peaceful domestic use. Oh by the way, China isn't even among the top ten importers of steel to the US. The evil empires, Canada and Mexico however are.
6
If I was homeless and penniless living on the streets and I watched the stock market going up and down like a yo-yo and people’s panic every time it did, I think I’d thank God for making me poor and not having to be part of that suffering because even the streets as potholed as they are aren’t going to crumble beneath me for no apparent reason.
7
Mr. Trump, please stop sticking your nose into things that you know nothing about. You can claim you are a businessman but you only dealt in real estate business and were not very successful at that, given that you went bankrupt 4 times, made some very ill-advised investments and regularly stiffed your creditors and workers. When it comes to international finance, forget it. Leave that to the economists who have been working in that area for quite a long time. And I don't mean the "Munchkin" either.
8
Trade with China is not free trade, but piracy. If you are against the tariff because you support free trade, you are incredibly naive or Chinese
2
Duh, a good 50% of trade in steel and aluminum between the US and X is between the US and... CANADA.
China is a huge producer of both steel and aluminum. But Canada, not China, is the big trading partner here.
So this blanket tariff (if that is what gets finalized) will nuke Canada in order to hit China with a fly swatter.
3
Economists predict that the tariffs will result in more unemployment and higher prices for Americans as well as diminished exports as other countries raise their own trade barriers.Thus,they will diminish the U.S. economy and the U.S. generally,a goal of our enemies,such as Russia (Putin). One explanation is that the tariffs are Trump's payback to the Russians for their help in the election or perhaps an installment payment on what he owes for their blackmail of him. Investigate it Mueller! .
7
It seems that all these tariffs will do is to make steel more expensive. Not that many companies make steel in this country. It is not clear if there are many or enough steel companies in this country that can even keep up with the demand for steel. Again Trump looks like he is in load, fire, aim mode thus shooting himself and the country in the foot. This will raise the price of everything from appliances to cars.
6
Can the media start calling these tariffs what they are: a tax on US consumers. Higher steel and aluminum prices move US car prices higher, and they're less able to compete against foreign imports.
A tariff on Canadian software lumber imports artificially raises the price of lumber in the US and the cost of building a new home. This sets back the home building industry and prevents new home buyers from entering the market. What's interesting here is that the US can't produce all the lumber needed. It must import. Maybe they're making Canadian lumber higher priced so that Russian lumber can be more competitive and can get higher prices in the US?
These are all taxes on US consumers. So where do these higher prices and profits end up going? In the case of lumber, they go to a few lumber barons who no doubt have contributed to Trump's campaign fund. Or into the pockets of Russian timber czars. Similarly, in steel higher prices flow into increased profits for steel producers.
Maybe the NYT should go check and see who is benefiting from these tariffs and check their political donations. This might involve getting Mueller involved in the Russian work. Pro tip for you: Follow the money! :) You're welcome.
Good work NYT!
9
This issue is what Trade Agreements are for. Often called "Free Trade Agreements" they are typically anything but "free". The term "free" likely means an agreement to keep trade free from punitive tariffs, not a simple free for all in trade. NAFTA is many many pages of give and take agreements all for the purpose of avoiding the repercussions of punitive tariffs. The various trade offs of tariffs are pointed out in detail by other commentors and it is virtually impossible to predict how other countries are going to respond.
ONLY ... Donald Trump is against Trade Agreements. Possibly because he doesn't/can't read and doesn't like the common addition of the word "Free" in the titles.
The way to deal with inequities and protection of American production interests is to NEGOTIATE trade agreements. However, our Negotiator in Chief is trying to cast all trade agreements to the winds and go it on his own and just find out whether his predictions of massive success is correct. He'll find out just like Bush did (see Look Ahead in NYT picks), his whims are likely to be wrong.
3
If the stocks go low enough there won't be a need for steel at all. Of course, if stocks go low enough that'll be the end of trump so bring it on.
2
Well, good-looking gun control and bad-looking tariffs. Well balanced. And as many expect, he will change his mind in a day or so, for both.
2
This move is certain to extend and broaden Trump's appeal and standing with the working class and especially organized labor which, of course, is not good news for the Democratic Party.
3
Trump is the Great Dealmaker, right? At least that how he bills himself. If he really wanted to counter what he contends are the malign effects of Chinese dumping why couldn't he have tried to negotiate with China instead of unilaterally imposing tariffs that will spark a trade war, hurt the U.S. economy and harm the very workers he claims to help? A stable genius indeed.
2
Playing both/multiple sides is Trump's strategy. It's like a used car salesman.
1
In your calendar, put down March 1, 2018,, as the beginning of the Great Trump Recession. If you have more than 10 or 15% in stocks, you are taking a big, big chance with your future.
3
Why doesn't Donald impose a "tariff", or surcharge on the purchase of commercial real estate by foreign interests? Couldn't it be argued that high real estate prices in NYC are partially caused by foreign investment? Oh wait, that might hurt Donald and Jared's pocket book.
3
Seemingly, every Democratic Party candidate for federal office in generations has wanted to boost tariffs on construction metals. They also yearned to increase limits on the availability of firearms in the marketplace.
So much for the concept promoted here that Trump is just another doctrinaire Republican. Trump has never fit any category. The free spirits rarely do.
This is Trump. Your urge to categorize him will always be frustrated.
3
Oh, i’ve categorized him: grifter.
5
No known blood relation to Bill or Hillary, but no one's accused him of accepting bribes as callously as they.
But he just doesn't play the D.C. game.
I'm certainly no economist, but I don't get this idea that other countries caused the loss of manufacturing in this country. I thought it was industry leaders looking for cheap labor overseas in order to maximize profits. In other words, we did this to ourselves.
8
How does President Trump expect the United States to pull this off when the United States simply no longer has the capacity for steel and aluminum production at the levels the United States requires? Does he expect an American car or Boeing aircraft, or other US product will not receive similar tariffs in other countries? I bought into making better trade deals, not the creation of tariffs on select industries because of an inability to negotiate better deals.
11
Does this suggest that Trump himself no longer needs to import steel from China? How will he build his hotels- or does he already have a deal in place with U.S. Steel to purchase at a discounted rate?
9
Let's break it down: more expensive steel means less construction. Less construction means that the property value of current buildings (like those owned by Trump and Kushner) will go up.
Trump's choices are really quite simple to explain, if you assume that he just wants to enrich himself personally and literally doesn't care about the rest of the world.
18
In the places Trump's and the Kushners' buildings are located, material costs are as minor a consideration as they are anywhere. Actions raising the cost of labor and real estate would pump up their values more than the cost of steel, no?
1
fundamentally, this is a question of whether economic stability or corporate profit is more important. China has been using blatant economic warfare to attack the west's manufacturing base. Our options are to allow Wall street to get rich with complicity, (the Clinton approach), start a trade war with punitive import tariffs (the orange approach) or to do something a bit more sane in the middle, like a reasonable set of import tariffs that balance the costs of exporting pollution to the developing world.
2
As a retiree of the American auto industry, and a former metalworker in that industry, I see both sides. We used both American and foreign steel. I knew a lot of the factory reps from both. I wanted to see American steel used exclusively, but the foreign companies certainly were competitive. I wasn’t management, I was union, so I loaded what I was given.
What Trump is doing parts on a car and they all can’t be American, even the steel. This is just going to run the price of the car up, which will eat into that Trump tax cut if you want to buy any car, foreign or domestic, built in the US.
Being UAW, yes, I want American-produced products, but sometimes, reality bites.
11
We are all going to pay for the sugar-coated tax cuts, even though they are probably good for a few votes. But add in protectionism and rapidly rising deficits, and things will turn south fast. The "economy" doesn't really care that the president is claiming credit for it. It will eventually come crashing down. I'm fairly certain the president won't be claiming credit for that. In fact, I haven't heard him address the recent stock market levels at all.
5
Does he not think that other countries will respond with their own duties on US products? I am a Canadian and I buy made in US or Canada as my first choice. In fact I just bought a US made mower (probably made with Canadian steel) this week. It was expensive and if it was any higher in price I would have made another choice. Multiply this little transaction millions of times per day . I thought republicans were conservatives.
11
The U.S. steel & aluminium industries have been decimated not by imports but my the capitalist markets in which U.S. buyers of steel & aluminium have sought out the least expensive producers of those goods. This is not an ‘attack’ on the U.S. as Trump would have it but a demand by U.S. consumers for the best value for their money. In the end these tariffs will not increase domestic production but will increase domestic prices for these products. The U.S. retail consumer will end up paying more for the same goods.
10
I am an anti-partisan. My philosophy on economic matters has generally coincided with what has historically been the economic principles of the Republicans. On non-economic matters, I have usually been more sympathetic to the policies of Democrats.
However, on economic matters Trump has proved himself to be very much in accord with the long standing positions of the unions allied with the Democrat party. This imposition of tariffs is the piece de resistance.
What is most amazing to me is that Republicans have been so willing to abandon their long standing principled devotion to free trade in support of Trump the economic Democrat.
3
In fact, the United Steelworkers union is AGAINST these tariffs as they would apply to Canada. Canada is both the biggest importer AND exporter of these products with respect to the US.
7
As a Middle of the Road Democrat, I think there should be more strictures on trade agreements for many reasons, - - - but - - he is simply nuts. Maybe he thinks he's the messiah. He seems to make decisions the way leaders to the far South ( Venezuela) have made them: whatever I feel is right is right. His lack of concern for the consequences isn't brave, it's just ignorant.
5
As a Republican, I oppose these sanctions.
And as the gentleman who owns a manufacturing plant pointed out, he gets no love from our domestic producers.
These producers are going to show even less love now.
The POTUS is fighting a battle that we "lost" a long time back. In general, commodities like steel, aluminum where hardly any value is added, by economic theory, seek lowest possible cost options.
America is best positioned when we use our technological prowess. The POTUS should be reminded of shale revolution. Every country has shale, but our ingenuity made a difference.
Commodities should be left to low cost producers.
UAE cited here for aluminum has no aluminum ores - zero, da nada. What it has is cheap electricity required for ingot smelters.
But elections have consequences - some bad and some good.
Chalk this up as a bad one.
5
As with many of the decisions Trump will find himself remembered in the history books for, this action doesn't seem like anything of a genius nature, and will likely benefit the already-wealthy, far beyond offering any help to the already-struggling.
3
There is no way to "optimize" a network of bi-lateral agreements. If you take a network of "actors" and try to establish mutually beneficial agreements between all parties on a 1-1 basis it can theoretically be done, but in practice it is impossible.
As a mathematician, I was hired by a US Telco to "improve" on the current network model where companies exchange data traffic as peers. Call it network neutrality, or a "level playing field".
I, and others, have constructed mathematical models to run on computers where multiple actors negotiate 1-1 agreements will all partners. You can do it for small numbers of actors (less than 1/2 dozen) on commercially available supercomputers.
For what Trump envisions there are not enough computational resources, in total, on earth, to solve his problem. But then, Trumps is "like really smart".
6
For readers interested in what forces are at work (rather than bashing Trump) I I recommend to read Peter Drucker "The Next Society" (if you are in management you know who Drucker is). Link below
In this 2001 piece Peter Drucker observed that when a vital sector of the economy falls below a critical level, protectionism invariably sets in. The US made the switch from a free trade in agricultural products to one protected over 3000 quotas protecting domestic production between 1900 and 1920 (Cuban sugar and Brazilian agricultural ethanol are more familiar examples"
Here is the core of his argument
"The decline of farming as a producer of wealth and of livelihoods has allowed farm protectionism to spread to a degree that would have been unthinkable before the second world war. In the same way, the decline of manufacturing will trigger an explosion of manufacturing protectionism—even as lip service continues to be paid to free trade."
https://www.economist.com/node/770819
That was written 17 (!) years ago. Peter Drucker, the founder of Management Theory, understood the modern industrial society better than any economist .
2
You should also read Michael Lind's "The New Class War" for the opposing perspective.
https://americanaffairsjournal.org/2017/05/new-class-war/
Simple solutions for simple minds. Lack of historical perspective, Think Hoot-Smalley in 1930 and the wonderful effect it had on not just the US but the world economy. Think about the concept that american manufacturers us a lot of this stuff, and you just increased their costs by 10-25% for this raw material which will put them at a cost disadvantage to the rest of the world. Think for just a minute about all of the tools China has to retaliate (think Bonds). I could go on, but the stupidity just boggles the mind.
8
When will it be recognized that NOTHING Trump does is for betterment. His modus operandi is to stick a finger in the eye.
It may well be that Trump is just duped into these actions by his cabal of wealthy wackos out to dismantle democracy to get voters so fed up they will settle for an Oligarchy of a few bonkers billionaires.
But either way, duped or deliberate, it’s past time to give Trump any credit for trying to improve matters: it’s not the plan, whose ever plan it is.
7
Of course he did this now. He needs the news media to talk about something other than Russia and the trump family's crooked business dealings.
8
The real irony is that so called Republicans are now screaming for government intervention because the free market is not functioning right. In fairness this is probably not true to the Republican elite, since they probably understand how misguided and self-destructive this is. But in true Republican form, they are silent when the Three Stooges (or so) in the White House come up with the daily idea of idiocy.
3
Let's see, "Trump Plans", not "Trump enacts". No one but Trump knew the announcement was coming. Wanna bet he & his crew shorted the market, he made the announcement, market got crunched, Congress rejects the concept, market goes up & he and his cronies make money on both ends. Corruption personified.
9
He just moved China one step closer to economic domination. What a nincompoop. To those who elected a reality TV celeb and Casino mogul, you were getting what you asked for.
8
Unintended Consequences.
It will now cost Mexico 25% more for the steel wall on the border.....
6
That this inept charlatan gained access to the White House (and the responsibilities that go with the presidency) is simply unbelievable. It is even more unbelievable to expect that he will do anything that is not wholly regressive, destructive and/or counterproductive. If you expect otherwise I concede that your optimism far exceeds mine.
3
And so it begins ...but it didn't have to be ...do I need to say it?
2
Unfortunately people the economy needs to tank--otherwise Trump's base will keep on drinking the kool-aid. Nothing else has worked. it is only when people lose trust in their "supreme leader" that they will wake up from the brain washing. Also, it looks like the Trump family needs to be "locked up"--Kushner getting a half a billion dollars plus quid pro quo--and what was all that noise about Hillary? Face it Trumpers --you have been duped.
4
Only Trump is girding the nation for the looming war vs. Canada -- saying we won't be able to import steel from them while fighting them!
2
I think a majority of people are sick, tired and scared about Trump acting like a king or dictator.
Paul Ryan showed his usual extreme passivness when speaking about Trump and his tariff's":
"The Speaker is hoping the president will consider the unintended consequences of this idea and look at other approaches before moving forward,"
Mitch McConnell has also been a total door mat for Donald Trump as well. Has "The Donald" cast a spell over Paul and Mitch?
Paul and Mitch you guys are being paid big month and benefits to do a job. Show some back bone and stand up to Trump or resign!
4
Dude, have you gotten out if CA to the rust belt or New England? There are whole swaths of the country where not even a new coat if paint has been added in last 30 or 40 years to inhabited dwellings across entire regions that used to be solidly middle class.
Canadians are livid. Great job, Trump, ticking off our best friends in the world and plunging the North American economy into chaos.
What could you expect from a man who has declared bankruptcy so many times. It's all he knows -- no boom and all bust.
3
It isn't three hours since Trump did his stream of consciousness announcement of these tariffs and the Canadian foreign minister fired off this:
“Should restrictions be imposed on Canadian steel and aluminum products, Canada will take responsive measures to defend its trade interests and workers...”
4
It's an unrequited friendship. Canada does not love us. I drive up to Canada for one reason only: to remind myself what a great country the United States (and its people) is.
There's a reason why this guy declared bankruptcy 6 times.
6
Can someone please explain how a tariff on imported steel would raise the costs of domestic producers.
Auto manufacturers, appliance manufacturers, medical supply (everything from operating tables to gurneys to syringes) companies, construction companies that use steel beams, oh, yikes, anything that uses stainless steel . . . umm, off the top of my head.
3
For example:
Overseas company sells steel at $10 a unit.
US company sells steel at $10 a unit.
Tariff implemented, overseas company now sells unit of steel for $15, US company raises price per unit to $14.95, still cheaper but more expensive.
Thanks Trump! My retirement account loves all the winning!
4
Didn't he say something like we were going to get tired of all this winning? I'm already exhausted.
2
This is the man who thought tariffs on Mexican products would make Mexicans pay for his ridiculous border wall. It has been obvious for some time that Trump knows nothing about economics. He must have studied basket weaving at Wharton. It certainly wasn't business or economics.
2
I guess he need some cheering up with the recent negative news on the White house. So here we are at a trade war, but he gets the steel workers cheering for him. May be we should hire a 24 hour cheering team just to keep Trump happy. It would be cheaper and less traumatizing for us.
After the Trump recession begins, maybe the Chinese will give me a job sweeping up the decaying streets.
After all, someone will have to after we pile up massive debts and no services due to the job killing Tax Swindle the GOP passed last year.
Some Xmas present that was!
3
Brilliant move by Trump! He should try putting a 10% tariff on all imports, that way he can get his approval rating below 10%.
4
If Putin had Trump on a very short leash, how would Trump act any differently than he has so far in his time in office? Trump is shooting America in the foot with a fully automatic weapon.
1
If President Trump exclude allies from this tariff, it will not only let this tariff be pointless ( Germany and Japan), but also initiate a trade war with China as the Chinese will think the US. only targeting them for steel export and they need to fight back. If President Trump include allies on this tariff, our allies won't be happy and the global market will panic( as the stock market shows right now), and the Chinese won't worry much because they are not the only one being affected so nothing to lose given that the steel export to the US. is relatively a small portion of their total export. In either case the tariff is dumb.
If anyone should know not to upset the source of your loans, it's Donald Trump who became a bad bet for bank after bank.
This proves he knows nothing.
1
Do you sense that when things aren't going well in Trump-land (think: Hope Hicks' departure, botched security clearances, Mueller indictments and plea deals, Attorney General angst, constant cabinet corruption, Melania's family visa hypocrisy, etc.), the "Big T" decides to lob a bomb somewhere else and distract the world and the press? Of course, the "tariff bomb" could blow up the world economy. Oh well, at least it disrupts the nasty "fake news" cycle for a day or so.
4
With this tariff the cost of tinfoil hats will be way up, thus dibilitating Trump's support base.
Trump shoots himself in the foot yet again.
3
@Look Ahead
I'm surprised you're surprised at the GOP's failure to learn the lessons of economic history. Reagan's tax cut was followed by Bush's tax cut followed by Trump's. Each increased the deficit and each increased the gap between rich and poor. The only time the GOP acts fiscally conservative is when a Democrat is in the White House
3
It takes a lot of coal to make steel, and it takes a lot of coal voters to win the electoral college.
1
"Dow Closes Down Sharply After Trump Imposes New Tariffs."
Thanks pal.
But if Trump keeps this up he will get impeached. Republicans don't care about no stinking collusion with Russia or national security clearance at the White house or bucking the NRA or domestic abusers or election security or Puerto Rico or, or ,or.
2
While there's no doubt China has abused the system in many ways, the only real national security threat in this story is Trump and his enablers. Can we please institute passing an IQ test and a background check as requirements to being included on the ballot for the Presidency and Congress?
Trump cannot get past the days of his youth, when coal mining and steel production were big business. He continually looks backward instead of forward into the economies of the future like alternative energy and new technologies.
Coal and steel? Really?
And the worst part of it is that people that remember those days want to believe he can bring them back. Just like farriers wanted believe horses would be the favored mode of transportation forever.
Mr. Trump, the genie is out of the bottle. You cannot take us backwards, we must go toward the future, boldly, with all the money and resources and brains and expertise we have.
Or we will be left in the dust, like the farrier. Every day you delay, we fall further behind.
China has 39 factories producing batteries for electric cars. The rest of the world has 6. Get it?
3
I think that DJT made a policy remark about something (like this) a week or two ago, and one of the major papers, maybe NYT, made a big point that nobody even listened to DJT anymore, markets don't budge, etc. The opposite of that would be today when his remark on tariffs caused markets to fall 2% which is quite a bit. Just sayin'.
1
If Trump can get a lot of Wall Streeters to jump out of their high-rise offices, perhaps it would have been worth it.
2
Can someone get Art Vandelay on the phone to explain the import/export business to Trump? I think Art is relaxing down in Del Boca Vista, not far from Maralago.
4
Trade wars lead to recession, and if protracted, to shooting wars.
Another sad sample of the ignorance and resulting lack of judgment by
Trump. Not sure who got to him, or if he just wants more attention.
1
More and more I truly believe that Russia has control of this presidency.
2
I don't understand much about business tariffs and imported steel, but after over a year, I sure understand Trump! It is abundantly clear to anyone looking even not so closely, that Trump makes these outlandish toss out policy statements EVERY SINGLE time his back is against the wall. He cares nothing about uninteded consequences, and probably understands even less about the finances than I do. But you can be sure he knows a distraction when he sees one. And here you have it folks! Impose a tariff, suffer the fallout, even let the markets CRASH, and voila! Hope Hicks is a distant memory.
3
I miss the United States of America. Where are you?
Yes I am concerned about the fallout from NAFTA negotiations and its impact on my own and other Canadians' standard of living, but I am more concerned about America. We survived out own NEP crisis which is not unlike the chaos which ensues from deeming a first stage process on a base set minerals which is steel and aluminum smelting, a 'national security' issue. I get it...if you are an isolated, frightened country, then control every process and supply chain within your boundaries so that you don't have to buy from your enemies, or rely upon them supplying the goods and services when you need them.
Don't do this for the votes or for political contributions because the cost of this is further isolation, including ideological. As a friend and competitor, I would rather you fight for the American identity outside in the real world again, like most of the rest of us have to in order to grow and thrive. Help mankind once again by leading peace loving, democratic countries like us to raise up the eyes and thoughts of the uneducated, uninformed, poor, exploited and wretched whether or not they ever grace our collective doorsteps. This group should be the target future consumers for your innovations, ideas, products and services being imagined and actualized in today's US commercial pipeline, instead of the flotsam to leverage they will eventually become without your influence on the world.
I miss you America.
5
Are you really surprised? Seriously, by now, is anyone surprised?
This is only the beginning.
Mueller's got his income tax return and he's working from there.
5
The self appointed 'genius' president Trump better get settled in with his desire to impose tariffs. Many, many items are going to come up now that he has opened the door. Unfortunately, Americas' needs far exceed what is manufactured within our boundaries. And, the mind of China far exceeds the mind of our president. Times are changing, faster than our self appointed 'genius' president can imagine.
Not an economist, NOT a Trump supporter, I AM a supporter of domestic steel and aluminum production. I lived in Mexico for a time and paid FAR MORE for a low end Whirlpool washing machine than for a higher level one here in the States. Why? Because Mexico taxes EVERYTHING SOLD (VAT) and more on foreign corporate products. I bought THREE all Texas made KOBLENZ vacuum cleaners (motors all burned out) in Mexico. No quality whatsoever BUT who determined the build standards for that machine? MEXICO...VAT = value added tax. Where does that unaccounted for dinero go? Into the pockets of corrupt politicians and their corporate friends. Bravo Trump on this one.
1
Once again, the lords of capitalism reconstruct their faith to suit their greed. According to them competition is the moral foundation of capitalism until it isn't. And it isn't when they can't compete. Their answer is to make the entire country pay for their sins by having the government destroy the competition.
Trump and his jingoistic minions in the administration and Congress believe America is so great it can go it alone. So what happens when the economy crashes, taking with it the steel, aluminum, and coal industries with it? Either the country pulls its head out of the sand and recognizes the reality of the global economy or it goes to war to steal the resources it needs. Canada, you better start building a wall. And irony of ironies, Mexico might actually pay to have a wall built too!
This is a terrible mistake. I can understand that Chins and Russia may be targeted but Canada has a very large aluminum industry and supplied much of the needed metal to the US during ww2. I doubt that this is good policy for our allies where we depend on each other. Are we retreating to the policies of the 1930s?
2
This may not be the best year for this analogy, but...
Getting a flu shot hurts (needle stick, followed by a few hours of soreness), but...getting influenza is worse.
A little short-term pain is worth better health down the road.
1
Great. Real people are getting hurt here. Thanks a lot Trump supporters.
2
Another Trump Slump for the stock market. He hasn't mentioned the stock market lately, has he?
Won't that create problems with the WTO (World Trade Organization)? I wasn't aware other countries were dumping?
SOME CAREFULLY TARGETED tariffs for specific reasons would arguably be a good idea, but that's not what we have here. This will be a big wet blanket on trade and manufacturing. Seemingly even when Trump latches on to a reasonably good idea, he botches it.
I really hope that when the actual rates are announced next week, it will be a much more nuanced program. But evidently, Hope is leaving the White House.
2
Talk about really backward politics. The only outcome of the tariffs will be very high prices on items we import from countries like Canada -- and an almost certain rise in inflation. Who is advising Trump? Stephen Miller? Was the president sitting on the toilet in the early morning when he thought of this?
3
Remember a couple of weeks ago, when the economic genius imposed heavy tariffs on washing machines? We wants them made in this country. So now he's imposed big tariffs on imported steel -- so washing machines made in this country will cost a good deal more. And meanwhile, the US trading partners will retaliate with tariffs of their own on US exports to their countries. The Dow has already dropped 400 points on the news.
Let's see how the boy genius handles a trade war.
2
The US trade deficit is 100% fair. Except patriotism, there is not reason to buy anything "made in US", quality is too low, prices are too high.
1
I know absolutely NOTHING about tariffs, but I do know this: Donald J. Trump (reality TV star and failed businessman, and traitor to his own country) is not qualified to create policy regarding tariffs on steel and aluminum. My intuition tells me this is true, since he has displayed bad judgment on a number of important issues and he is nothing if not consistent in his bad judgment.
It would seem to make more sense to address these trade actions against circumvention of previous antidumping and antisubsidy trade actions and thereby affect a sufficient volume of international commerce to satisfy national security concerns at the same time.
1
Never has the spector of special interests driving policy been so obvious, nor so haphazard. This is hilarious for those who despise capitalism, less so for those of us who have to live with the consequences of a haywire system.
1
With the Mid Term Elections coming, Trump wants to show a huge increase in employment. In the process he will destroy world markets, and create inflation.
I rather he stuck with Russian Collusion.
1
You CAN'T MAKE JOBS OUT OF THIN AIR. ...Sure there are already jobs in place but Mr Trump wants to create jobs but Need Massive Amounts of Investments to Create the Jobs that He Wants. ...but it'll take 9-10years. In the meantime the American Worker will PAY THE PRICE so that Wall Street can get their Money Back. Is a Win-Win for Mr. Trump.
...but NOT FOR US.
1
Rust Belt + iron + steel + tariffs = loose canon. The trump missteps will sink us.
1
Tariffs aren't the best way to deal with a destabilizing trade surplus and unemployment, but it's better than nothing. We have a bunch of nincompoops in charge of the purse strings in the House so there will be no stimulus to help set things right.
We are NOT near full employment despite what Krugman and other pro-business liberals claim. They also refuse to admit that the rules of globalization were written to enrich the wealthy at the expense of workers.
Trump is actually doing something positive here - more than you can say for the Democrats during the Obama and Clinton years.
3
Bethlehem Steel in Bethlehem Pennsylvania will be re-opening their facility next week in response to this new tariff on foreign steel. Oh, wait, that's right, Bethlehem Steel which was one of the largest producers of steel in the US and employed thousands for generations closed down many years ago and now one of Sheldon Adelson's casinos, the Sands, sits where some of the greatest steel products in the US were made. Too late Trump-et -- that horse ran out of the barn years ago.
4
I'm a little bit alarmed that I understand economics better than does the President of the United States.
1
Follow the money. The SEC should investigate short sellers that cashed in just prior to Trump's announcement.
4
He's a bear in a china shop. And I'm not only referring to the stock market.
This can only get worse. Congress must act.
1
The tariffs imposed at this moment are a clear effort
to swing voters to elect the trumpican running in the PA special
election coming soon this month. There is little other reason
to "fulfill his promise" at this moment. He can then exploit
a successful outcome there to withstand whatever pressures
are being exerted from everywhere else he looks.
So I wonder whose brilliant political idea this was...did it come
from WH or did it come from ryan or rnc?
1
1. Donald Trump is targeting some of the US's "most reliable allies".
2. Supply chains between Canada, US and Mexico are highly integrated.
So - the US, Canada and Mexico, to say nothing of South Korea, and Japan all lose.
Marginally good politics for Trump, perhaps. The US will spend decades restoring the good faith it had with its allies and trading partners.
5
Trump has no longer term strategy. He shots from the hip or as he calls it his gut. He is easily influenced by others who have a vested interest in creating tariffs. Like always Trump is interested in "shock value" not constructive or meaningful solutions. It is for this reason that he is among and will be judged the poorest performing Presidents the US has ever had. As the job losses mount and inflation to start to rise and the stock market takes a steady downturn-Trump will more than likely blame his advisers and not take responsibility. Unfortunately we will have live with Trump for the next number of years. On the bright side we will at least be entertained by this live reality show that changes from day to day.
1
America has always been an individualistic country. In this case, hurting tens of millions of people for the (alleged) benefit of less than a few hundred thousand individuals.
2
Now let's be clear. Pres. Trump is not protecting a handful of companies, he's protecting the U.S. national security.
Without these measures, Canada will shortly denude us our steel industry, meaning we won't be able to make any tanks or machine guns and will be helpless in the face of the onslaught of Canada's war machine.
2
According to Sun Tsu the purpose of war is to advance the goals of the state. Von Clausewitz said it was to achieve an end state different and hopefully better than the beginning state. Those two fellows are generally considered the two most renowned military philosophers.
But within those definitions, one has to ask “Whose state is it and who is setting the goals”. What does the “better end state” look like by whoever it is that believes war is the means by which the advancement or the betterment of the state should happen?
If I talk to the regular man on the street, what is his life all about…? Home, food, safety, a desire to explore life’s amazement's, family, possibly a connection to God in whatever form? How about the average woman on the street! How many see their children leaving for war with a smile on their face? Well, then at what level does this belief that war is the means by which the state becomes better?
A review of the causes of war indicates that money, power and control are the base reasons for war’s causes. So who does the fighting over this money, this power and control? How many of these people that want this money, power and control actually fight in these wars?
With the estimated number of one billion people who have died due to wars, what seems better?
2
So will Trump take the blame for the precipitous fall in the market, as he took the credit for the upward trend?
Presidents bear a huge burden and responsibility that Trump is just not willing to assume, unless it works in his favor.
What the President says matters - in tweet or in person - and he must be circumspect, careful, measured - words that have never appeared in the same sentence with the name Donald Trump.
People got hurt today - real people. The $3,500 I had in a market investment that went to $3,300. Sad, huh?
And for what? Trump trying to take us back to the days of coal and steel that we will never see again?
Foresight, vision, intelligence - all words you will never see in the same sentence with the name Donald Trump.
2
This new tariff move by Trump is based on obscure national security provisions in the U.S. 1962 Trade Expansion Act.
Steel trade between Canada and the United States is roughly balanced with products worth about $6-billion going each way. So, it's a bit of a stretch that Canada -- with a total of three rusty old submarines -- poses a security threat to the U.S., by trade or arms.
Of course, our Prince Valiant PM will be forced to retaliate against Uncle Sam, as will the rest of the world.
It seems Mr. Trump is not happy unless he is poking various hornets nests -- economic, cultural, religious.
Risky business.
2
I believe that we have FOUR rusty old submarines...
2
Plunge is a little sensationalist to describe the market. At its current level, it fluctuates until you get a 1000 point drop that doesn't bounce back. Trump is wrong to not look forward, but I doubt that business will follow him in his desire to recreate a rust belt culture.
Not doubt this is one of the famous Trump bargaining strategies which have led to how many bankruptcies.
I feel better all ready.
What? Me worry?
6
Maybe this excerpt from The Economist might be helpful to those interested in facts ?
"Steel crazy after all these years
China needs lots of material to build all its homes, trains and tunnels. Even so, it produces more than it can use. It accounts for roughly half of global production of steel, coal, aluminium, glass and cement. By one oft-cited gauge, China’s unused steel capacity equals the total annual output of the next four biggest producers (Japan, India, America and Russia) combined. As the excesses piled up in China over the years, they weighed on global prices, depressing profits for all. However, unlike their international rivals, Chinese firms could carry on expanding, confident of state support."
https://www.economist.com/news/leaders/21728640-investors-have-been-chee...
It all depends on what you goal is: if it is $'s , the "depressing prices for all" is bad national policy for China. If it is "putting out Western competitors out of business" and "making sure that the folks in Liaoning are taken care of lest they begin to doubt uncle Xi" it makes very much sense.
If you are a Marxist, you can read this as : China's Steel policy has shown the superiority of the centrally planned economy over the capitalistic system
It is, basically, putting a tax on any industry that uses steel or aluminum. The increased cost will percolate through the economy. By dumping money into the economy through tax giveaways to corporations and raising costs for consumers, he is doing almost everything known to cause inflation.
7
I recall Milton Friedman advancing the theory that foreign nations dumping goods and commodities at low cost into the US market was a good thing, as it was a form of foreign aid to the US economy.
Apparently, from today's Wall Street reaction, it agrees. While it does lower cost in the short run, in the long run it can cause sectors of our economy to shrivel and disappear. At which point, we are at the mercy of foreign suppliers for price and actual supply.
I suppose foreign oil producers could dump crude oil into our market at $10 a barrel, killing off our domestic production. But once it was killed off, what would follow? The experience of 1973's oil embargo provides a harsh lesson.
5
I feel that the comment by Look Ahead sums up what I was thinking; it is very costly to reinvigorate domestic industry when costs of doing so are so steep, not to mention the fact that such re-patriation of industry will mean higher consumer prices for many products. Drawing businesses back when they left because of unfriendly tax bills has its cost too- reduced government revenues for services that are essential.
Many industries need more than the US domestic market to sell into; what tariffs will meet US companies when retaliatory / reciprocal tariffs are put in place by other nations?
As to the stock market wobble today, is there a bit of Russian bravado in that fall?
5
In December 2016 I told my broker I was going to take a "Trump break" from the stock market. He replied with the avuncular insight that the president really doesn't have anything to do with the stock market and the economy was strong.
A month ago it was tax cuts, followed very shortly thereafter by spending increases, and voila, a stimulus program and more future debt being piled up...while the country is in the midst of sky-high employment, meantime the folks who need help most, the undertrained and underemployed, are ignored. Now, steel tariffs and the Trump recession. And yep, workers and consumers will take it in the neck including the undertrained and underemployed (if you think they are getting steel jobs anytime soon, I have a bridge to sell you).
Glad I ignored the broker's government lesson. Yes, the market is still up since 12/16, but let's say I like my side of this bet.
4
My husband and I decided to leave the market, too. I wasn't understanding the economy and the enormous tax cut and bill is pretty cloudy to me as well. We've decided to not put anything back for at least the next six months, either. Who can understand what's going on in the day-to-day trading? The peace of mind is worth a great deal and there is simply too much emotion at work in the Executive Branch and the US economy. In the meantime, reading about Small Cap Overseas funds looks like fun for now. And my broker told me that he had a lot of other clients checking out for now, too. Good luck!
Well its almost if he wanted inflation, perhaps he sees the profits his advisers made after the last economic crash, and he wants another go around.
2
Given we import most of our steel and aluminum from Canada, it looks like Trump believes Canada is a military threat and may attack us by denying us these raw materials. (These tariffs are intended to be used for strategic, defense readiness purposes.)
Who knew?
Canada also buys far more dollar value of the finished goods we manufacture from their steel and aluminum. Want to bet they will be buying far less -- out of pique, or just because the goods from China and Europe are less costly.
This will cost us far more than it will cost anyone else--and for exactly zero strategic advantage.
20
Why would increased materials costs cause price increases or layoffs? Didn't most of the companies who would be affected just get a huge tax cut which should offset any increase in costs?
12
The problem seems to be (and I am NOT economist) that many of the companies receiving tax cuts are spending their new found money in buying back their own stock. Little or none of that new found money will find its way into lower product costs or higher worker wages but only higher stock prices (values) for those lucky enough to own the stock.
1
I'm assuming this was not serious, in which case, well done!
1
It's sad that the U.S keeps targeting it's good friend and ally, Canada. The U.S has a trade surplus or close to a trade surplus with Canada through NAFTA. Now Canada, who buys more than 50% of U.S steel exports is being targeted again for the steel and aluminum we export to the United States. As a Canadian, I would have to say that the present U.S administration is going to force Canada to look for new markets as we are an exporting nation. The largest market obviously is China. Personally, I would not be happy with this. But in order to maintain employment and exports we would have to establish closer ties with China. Is this what the American administration wants from their very good friends to the North?
25
When you're the Manchurian Candidate, you do whatever you can to disrupt good relations with allies. You do whatever you can to destroy treaties, reduce regulations that protect your citizens. Pollution, trade wars, estrangement from allies, tariffs that will rebound and hurt the US -- that's what you do when you're the bad guy. And he is a very bad guy. In all ways. He hasn't one redeeming quality and that's why it was so easy for Putin to groom him.
5
Survival of the fittest--Canada must do what's right for Canada.
3
So now we can see what is wrong with the President and this presidency...the long term amphetamine use...McMaster, Hope Hicks and now the Ambassador to Mexico. And Ben Carson stealing like so many of this administration. Not surprising that one more bad choice comes from the Oval Office. Finally, Wall Street sees that reality. An unpredictable President who makes unpredicatable decisions who is a lousy leader...all should add up to a logical person. America heads down as one would expect.
10
When stupidity gets this bad it should be reclassified as a felony to protect society.
25
Donald Trump has done some really stupid things since he became the 45th however this decision tops them all. He claims to be a great businessman but he doesn't understand economics at all.
30
Does he understand the reason for high prices of steel and aluminum is the workers much higher wages than in China and other countries? Production costs are very high in the US (compared to other countries, especially China), and the reason we enjoy a higher standard of living. But in order to understand that you must be at least IQ 80 (higher than a chimp).
14
Gee, I thought we were looking for China to help us with the North Korea problem. I guess we can kiss that opportunity good-bye. Great timing, White House!
23
He is absolutely clueless.
24
I think Trump is waking up Adam Smith by doing what you are not suppose to do ...
8
he's like a little kid, or a monkey, who's learning cause and effect--"if i do this, that will happen! ooohhh!" as tom steyer asks, "why is he still president?"
13
He is a clown. The ugly, scary kind that gives you nightmares. His and the Republican policies will bring back wicked inflation which is a TAX on everyone. It will whack the bond market and equities to follow.
13
"In recent days, the president appears to have grown impatient for action." Perfect. The knee-jerk bomb-thrower (metaphorically speaking) who just wants to hear the big noise he made.
11
Canada should be exempted from this blanket tariff but at this point isn't. Even the US steelworkers union wants this exemption but it hasn't surfaced yet. [There was such an exemption the last (disastrous) time the US imposed tariffs on steel.]
If Canada faces this tariff, it will be illustrative of what will happen more generally. At present 87% of Canada's steel exports go the the US. If they face this duty you are going to see a lot of excitement north of the 49th. One thing that excitement will focus on is that 59% of all steel imported into Canada comes from the US. A tariff on those steel imports from the US will be in place in about ten seconds. The retaliation won't help Canadians much but sure will hurt a lot of Americans. Similarly, placing these tariffs on Canada and other countries will wreck a lot of AMERICAN lives dependent on a wide range of the manufacturing sector and outwards to the oil and gas industry, construction, etc.
13
in 2006 "scrap metal buyers sold $15.7 billion of scrap overseas, which helped offset the trade deficit." So aren't we in effect MAKING foreign steel and aluminum cheaper by selling the raw materials?
4
Just how many jobs could be lost in a Trump-inspired trade war? Moody’s Analytics studied that problem for the Washington Post. It concluded that Trump is right: big tariffs on China and Mexico would push both countries into a recession. But because we live in a global economy, we’d be dragged into a recession as well. “Up to 4 million American workers would lose their jobs,” the Post notes, while “another 3 million jobs would not be created that otherwise would have been, had the country not fallen into a trade-induced downturn.” Seven million jobs. Gone... Trump thinks it’s perfectly acceptable to start an economic war with China, for example, while not considering whether this might affect other policy goals we have with Beijing, such as halting its military expansion in the South China Sea, curbing cyber attacks, or getting its cooperation against Iran (Beijing is one of the so-called P5+1 countries that signed last summer’s nuclear deal with Tehran.) These kinds of giant problems don’t exist in isolation. Like pieces of a puzzle.
22
China already started the trade war
1
Use to project future economics of US economy, the difference between Republican and Democrat governing.
PoliticsThatWork Change in Unemployment Rate by Party of President- Since 1945
Each party has held the presidency for the same number of years since 1945. During those years, the unemployment rate has risen 11.8% under Republican presidents and has fallen 7.2% under Democratic presidents. Unemployment has fallen during the overwhelming majority of Democratic years since 1949. Unemployment rose steadily under Republicans up until 1982, then fell during the remaining Reagan years, and then rose again under both Bush Presidents.
PoliticsThatWork Dow Jones Performance by the Party of the President
During the most recent 15 years during which Republicans have held the presidency, the value of the Dow has increased by 42%. During the Democratic presidencies, it has increased by 609%- 14.5 times faster. The average growth in the value of the Dow under Democrats during this period has been 14.75% and under Republicans it has been 5.11%.
PoliticsThatWork Change in Disposable Income Since 1930 by the Party of the President
In the 44 years that we have had Democratic presidents since 1930, the real per-capita disposable income has increased 271%. During the 40 years during which we have had Republican presidents, it has increased 44%. On average, it has increased 3.1% (after adjusting for inflation) under Democratic presidents and 1% under Republican presidents.
22
This tariff action seems to be focused on rust belt politics instead of 21st century competitiveness.
If we want America to be economically competitive, invest in education instead of tax cuts, invest in infrastructure instead of wars, invest in healthy citizens instead of wall street bailouts.
54
Why can't we invest in American manufacturing, too?
Who is he going to blame for this fiasco?
Fiasco as in: a thing that is a complete failure, especially in a ludicrous or humiliating way.
Synonyms: failure, disaster, catastrophe, debacle, shambles, farce, mess, wreck... etcetera, etcetera.
19
Perhaps if steel and aluminum are a national security problem, that is , we are too dependent on that product from other countries, the government should buy and stock pile it from those places that make it cheaply. The idea as with the coal industry that we should subsidize that industry through tariffs is not only against conservative market forces policy, but bad economics. We are almost at full employment, but even if we weren't it is always better to retrain workers for available jobs instead of trying to save every industry that is not making it. The auto industry was an exception as the infrastructure for making cars was still viable during our last recession, bt that is not so for moth balled steel and aluminum mills.
7
The Trump pump and dump stumps chumps with plump slump.
How much did the top 1% make this time?
13
Trump's acts and actions are ruining our country day by day.
19
Has the Trump Org. been involved with short selling? Just asking.
22
Perhaps that is what Jared did with his half billion dollar loan from Citi and Apollo.
3
Let’s see. One of the last BIGLY Trump pronouncements was that transgendered people would be barred from military service. Hmmm? How’s that going? The military itself was blindsided, balked, and that policy is as vibrant as “don’t ask, don’t tell!” Trump threatens world wide trade wars? Let’s see how much “winning” happens now! The Stock Market took a dive and the oligarchs are worried about “profits”, not working wages, but “profits!” The Trump doctrine of ‘Ready’, ‘Fire’, ‘Aim’ is in full flight. His economic policy advisors are stumbling over each other to slit each other’s throats! If there is a destructive trade imbalance the answer is in compromise negotiation not ‘pistols at dawn!’ Economically, the various parts of the world are unfortunately stuck with each other so ‘zero sum’ annihilation cannot be the answer; unless Trump’s next announcement is World War III. As sure as there are still transgender soldiers serving, it’s a safe bet that the latest self destructive, hair brained Trumpian scheme means nothing good, if it comes to pass at all! Who knows, by crashing the economy and spiking unemployment, maybe the guy is trying to get impeached after all! Had we known, I guess we should all have ‘sold short’ on our steel holdings!
10
Well, Obama did save the American Auto Industry; I guess Donnie has to wreck it.
38
He’s going to hurt his base. The price of tinfoil hats is gonna skyrocket!
44
Trump is a special kind of STU***. Bush and Obama both tried tariffs and the job losses in metal fabrication and assembly were many times larger than the miniscule gains in the steel industry. At the same time, it priced American made steel goods out of the market. The sheer ignorance the administration is breathtaking.
21
Just write "Stupid" there is no other word for his actions and utterances.
6
Trump had really only 2 claims to fame: markets were up, unemployment was down. Now he destroyed one and laid the seeds for the destruction of the other one. Good doing. #MAGA????
25
Everyone is for jobs. U.S. Steel industry will make more profits but the tradeoff is that Tariffs are going to hit our trade allies and partners hard. It is a dangerous game. Manufacturing will become more expensive for the automobile and aviation industries. In the long run, tariffs will cost jobs.
12
Trump never read Adam Smith's work, clearly, since he never read any books; in fact, he probably doesn't even know who Adam Smith was. His lackeys in Congress, on the other hand, almost universally worship Adam Smith as the father of Capitalism, but it is obvious they never read his work either. That is too bad, because Adam Smith dedicates many, many page to explaining why protectionism is always, under all circumstances, a very bad idea for everyone, especially for those it is intended to protect.
The US produces very little Aluminum for the same reason it produces very few shoes - low tech is best done elsewhere. Of all the atrocious decisions the Ignoramus in Chief has made, a tariff on aluminum imports is the most emblematic of the hidden cost of ignorance. Aluminum is to industry like water is to agriculture - neither the ignorant Trumpian white rabble nor the Trump's toadies in Congress can't possibly understand the cascading effects of raising the price of Aluminum, not anymore than they can understand Quantum Physics or Global Warming. They'll find out soon enough.
37
When you set an ill-tempered bull loose in a china shop, you cannot feign surprise when a lot of dishes are broken. And you had better be ready with a broom and dustpan.
13
Raise tariffs to protect an industry that is already profitable. Cut taxes during a growing economy. Bring more guns to schools to avoid school shootings. All of these things make sense to Donald Trump -- and the gullible fools who believe anything he says because he panders to their bigotry.
23
1-2-3-4 -- Let's declare a Trade War!
10
I am amazed with the heading of this news. NY Times has taken such a simplistic notion that stock market slumped because of Tariffs. If we could predict stock market, there would be no uncertainty.
1
"They took our jobs!"
3
A real irony with this development is that one of the very few things that could hurt Trump with his loyal base is a downturn in the economy. Starting a trade war could do exactly that.
7
Seems like the result will be Americans (including T's base) paying a lot more for products using steel. Seems like the result of that will either be a lot of angry Americans, or families making choices they might not otherwise make in their purchases.
8
Trade tariffs and fiscal stimulus when we are at full employment seems strange. Why are we trying to boost our economy and protect our economy when it does not need boosting or protecting? The fed is worried about being beyond full employment.
6
Most Americans over the age of 45 should recall the 15 yrs period between 1970 and 1985. That is the period when steel and aluminum producers in the U.S. began closing facilities at home and off shoring production to Japan. At the time, Japan had the first generation of semi-automated, efficient and cheap to keep plants. Respective Republican administrations allowed American producers to import steel and aluminum from their joint ventures in Japan with no tariffs or barriers provided the materials were to be used for American consumption. That's how America's vibrant production facilities became the rust belt; not because of Canada.
15
The Rust Belt became the Rust Belt because of the inertia of Incumbent Industry and the associated failure to adapt. The Japanese auto and mini mills were newer and suffered less from sink cost and anchored types of thinking. That the US steel plants that were not competitive were allowed to die off was a good thing, clearing the way for smaller, dedicated mills, upskilling of workers and the transformation of Pittsburg from a dirty steel manufacturing hub to a knowledge economy with an advantage in medical care and education.
The Great Failure, of all administrations, is the robbery of the blue collar worker in the form of defrauded pension plans and the lack of governmental investment, on a systematic level, to retrain and redeploy this great workforce.
Unorthodox and widely criticized, but tariffs are a good move. If it were any other President, I would have hated it, too. However, DJT will use this as leverage to create a more fair playing field for citizens of the United States.
4
All this will do is drive up the cost of steel and aluminum for everyone. Doubt it will create much in the way of new jobs. To do that, you'd need a huge investment by the steel and aluminum companies to upgrade their facilities. Fat chance
1
Lol!!!!! Maybe it’s a negotiating ploy, but the downside could be huge if it doesn’t work. And if we have to back-off the loss of credibility will be yuuugggee.
1
What fun! Great Depression 2.0, just as the Baby Boomers are retiring! Cat food, anyone?
11
So what happens when Boeing and other companies move over seas for cheaper steel and aluminum? Jobs lost with rippling side effects throughout the economy. Trump is truly clueless when he plays wack a mole with our economy.
9
If Donald had paid attention in economics 101, he would have learned that tariffs are a terrible idea. Now he has started a trade war with our allies that will only serve to hurt the US economy in the long run. I guess Republicans are the party of protectionists now, so if you believe in free trade, vote for Democrats. The upcoming recession will have started with this move that was aided and abetted by the Republican congress.
7
Why no mention of Wilbur L. Ross, Trump's Secretary of Commence? Before joining the administration, Mr. Ross specialized in restructuring bankrupt American steel companies, among others, for large profits.
Will these new tariffs enrich the Commerce Secretary further? Maybe not. Maybe he even opposes them. But with crony capitalism full speed ahead in the Trump administration, it seems like an area ripe for further reporting.
8
Trump is like "really smart." Except for all of the ideas he pushes on the U.S.
8
U.S. citizens do not want to work in a steel mill unless they can make a decent wage.
Drive through certain areas of the Lehigh Valley in Pennsylvania. It's like the after-scenes in an apocalypse movie: miles-long rows of abandoned, rusting mill buildings. But, it's not like you can tool up these dilapidated facilities and start cranking out steel in a month.
What's the long-term strategic plan? One thing I know about skilled labor heavy tradesman - they're passionate about unions. How's that going to sit with the Republican oligarchy?
As far as the Commerce Department's concerns about the threat to "national security by degrading the American industrial base," we farm out a lot of logistical and technical security. I'm equally concerned about that, if not more so.
Lastly, per Mr. Trump, “People have no idea how badly our country has been treated by other countries.” We did most of this to ourselves in the constant quest for lower labor costs and higher profits. It's super-lame to be a whiner. Apparently, Mr. Trump does not realize he comes off as a crybaby with his fave go-to complaint. My advice: think of something else to say. 'My feelings are hurt' isn't working.
10
So did we hire a successful businessman to run our nation?
Or an expert in personal bankruptcy?
19
Trump has proven incontrovertibly that a "businessman" makes a terrible president, leader, clueless about the public interest and the public good.
A successful businessman more likely means he is a charlatan who has the ability to con everyone else to make himself a great fortune. Or is a criminal.
5
Trump a real estate businessman has no clue about international trade or other industries. Real estate business is a ZERO SUM game that if others lose you win. Trump has no idea about the win win game of international commerce.
We should be promoting commerce and prevent wars and conflicts. Trump is doing the opposite. FUTrump.
12
Like so many other Times articles that involve President Trump, the knee-jerk reaction is if Trump does it, it must be bad. What happened to objective and honest reporting? What happened to objective and honest commenting? When did Times readers become so enamored with Adam Smith?
Based on my own contacts living and working in Asia, it is pretty well accepted that China is desperate to keep its industrial base working at full throttle to keep labor peace and newly minted middle classes relatively satisfied that the Chinese system under a party dictatorship is working. This means using any means possible to export including dumping, violation of economic agreements, hobbling foreign competition and the like. What Trump is doing is therefore quite rational.
4
Using "Trump" and "rational" in the same sentence? You've got to be joking. The news story, on the other hand, is rational and balanced. You offer not one example of what you consider dishonest in the piece. And the fact that the commenters' refer to Adam Smith, the free-markets avatar, counters your allegation that the readers are blindly liberal. If anyone reacts in a knee-jerk fashion, it's Trump's supporters, who seem to take it personally when their hero is called to task.
Let the layoffs and inflation begin! Given that Trump considers himself to be his own best advisor it is not surprising that he thinks that all the other nations on the planet are competitors to the USA and that he can use tariffs to return the USA to the 1950's.
No, Trump doesn't understand what was the real cause of the boom of the 1950's (that the US was the only industrial power that wasn't destroyed in WW-II). The man who doesn't need to read thinks that all we have to do is isolate ourselves from the rest of the planet.
Perhaps somebody should remind Trump that he is only the POTUS, not a king and certainly not Master of the Universe.
The sad fact is that the US is going to need the help and assistance of the rest of the planet someday and thanks to Trump's go-it-alone posture the USA is going to have to fend for itself.
Mr. Peabody's "Way-Back Machine" isn't real Mr. Trump - there is no way to go back to the way we never were in the 1950's. Oh yes, the "Alt-Right" doesn't understand the world either. Bunker-America will not do well and we all lose as a result.
8
I'm disappointed in the A&S tariff because of the lack of information for the basis of the tariff. Maybe I missed it somewhere. But for a sample year of sales what are we talking about, the U.S. loses $750M in sales. OK, that is significant. Is the steel the same grade, are we in the U.S. producing inferior steel compared to other countries. Often, the U.S. has been do dominate in certain industries tht we are outright rude when it comes to competition. Excuse my critical comments, but for a year now I have been reminded on several occasions that our self appointed 'genius' president should never be assumed correct.
2
I’m not advocating a trade war. But since the U.S. is by far the largest importer in the world, wouldn’t other countries have more to lose than America in a trade war?
5
No it won’t. When you depend on imports, other countries with whom we trade in commodities will respond to these tariffs by simply jacking up their prices. We’re sunk. We need them far more than they need us.
1
Pennsylvania, Ohio, Michigan and Wisconsin.
These are the 4 states that wound up electing Trump in November 2016, and these tariffs will play well in these states. Why? Because there are a critical mass of voters in these states that view both parties as having failed them over the past 25-30 years or so with trade policies which have hollowed out the industrial base of the U.S. as a whole and of those states in particular. Trump's promise to put "America First" in trade policy and to take a tougher stance with the rest of the world on trade gave him enough credibility to win those 4 states and with them the White House. The expected actual economic impact of these tariffs is largely beside the point; many people in these states will simply say, "At least he's fighting for us, unlike everyone else in D.C. whether Republican or Democrat."
Those who have beat the drum for free trade over the past 25-30 years or so need to acknowledge that they haven't paid enough attention to the plight of those left behind as a result of free trade and that the U.S. needs to do a much better job in helping them get back on their feet. Otherwise, the tariff regime that the Trump Administration will expand and become more popular in those 4 states simply because it looks like he's at least trying to do something.
11
And Florida and NH and Iowa. States won by Obama.
There are also those that will loose jobs as a consequence of these tariffs. Including blue-collar, including those states. I'm hoping that these people will be bright enough to understand what caused their mess. But lately I questions a lot of things that should seem clear.
2
Trump's margin of victory in the Electoral College came down to about 77,000 votes in Pennsylvania, Michigan, and Wisconsin. Trump drew the equivalent of an electoral inside straight. When the Trump voters in these states suffer from the fallout of this misguided tariff policy, we'll see how kindly they view their hero. Trump can no more bring back the steel industry than you or I can. He can, however, advocate forward-looking employment policies that recognize we're in the 21st century. Unfortunately, that approach runs counter to Trump's desire to pander to his small minority of aggrieved supporters. "Trying to do something" is not the same as actually doing something honestly worthwhile.
I'd like to see a penalty for imposed on companies for offshoring call, claim and IT services. Bring those jobs back.
12
Voted for Obama twice and love his family. But this is why I voted for Trump.
Very proud of him for keeping his promises to blue collar workers who got him the Presidency in the first place. This is why he flipped the rust belts states.
There is no turning back time. But our blue collar workers deserve time to adjust. I don’t care that I will lose a chunk of money in the stock market.
8
And the potential loss of tens of thousands of middle class (blue collar working people) jobs is ok with you?
Really? You're the reason the country is in the state it's in. Thanks.
7
If you understood economics you'd know the major increase in prices is going to drop demand and cost a lot of jobs in the long run. But if you understood economics even a bit you wouldn't have voted for Trump so I guess we already knew that.
14
No economic action happens in a vacuum. By artificially protecting a (highly unprofitable) industry, you are also killing a much greater amount of jobs in other industries (that now face higher material costs and are less competitive vs foreign producers). This is why successful economies don't "pick winners" and let the free market determine the optimal set up and allocation. The opposite of that is a planned economy like in Soviet Russia. You really think that is a better system? It's not about the stock market (at least to me) but the fact that this will have serious repercussions for many Americans that will loose under this scenario.
Isn't the NRA against increasing the cost of guns and bullets by raising the cost of steel and aluminum?
3
What will happen to the price of American manufactured goods like cars that use lots of steal? How will the trade of those items be impacted?
4
If there is steel being "dumped" into the USA market than I am assuming US Companies are the buyers. Maybe our negotiator in chief might want to take a look at that? Asking for a friend......
6
Keeping his promises. Wanting to hear steel workers chant at his rallies and wear t shirts with obscene comments about HRC. Planning his 2020 run. And hoping no one remembers that Trump Towers et al were built with steel from China, American and imported workers were stiffed, and investors bailed him out to preserve the brand. LOCK HIM UP ? or just a straight jacket? we're not fussy.
18
Great idea. This is stop foreigners from taking advantage of our markets and boost American products. I support the President. I support Trump. May he triumph triumphantly. Thank you.
3
If you had any idea about economics, you might understand why your comment is wrong. Even if other trading partners would not retaliate, all this does is increase cost, since steel is mainly a raw material in this country. I guess that is what you mean by "boosting American products" - as in, boosting cost and destroying jobs.
4
It doesn't work that way. Lots of nations can manufacture goods and those that can buy inputs (such as steel) for less will do so. Outcome: fewer goods manufactured in the US. Jobs in steel manufacture have declined not due to trade but other factors: automation is a big one. So is containerization, making different components in different places (even different parts of the world) and then shipping to an assembly point. Computerization has made both of these advancements possible, and you can't turn back the clock. The future of the US depends on developing new industries, not trying to revivify old ones.
4
The world is a dangerous place. The US needs domestic industries that are robust. If US industries received subsities or were state owned as in other countries they would be thriving too.
5
The United States is still the third-largest maker of steel, nothing to sneeze at. And we export quite a lot of it. The steel industry in the US has declined for a number of reasons, trade is not and important one. Our country doesn't own industries because we our economy is capitalistic, not communist or Soviet.
3
Trump has already alienated his enemies, now he goes to work on his friends in industry, Wall Street, and the NRA... not to mention his own cabinet and staff...
4
So now the trade wars that Trump promised will start!
3
it would be great if the times would indicate the market drop (DOW) high up in the story, especially when the headline screams "Markets Plunge!" that's what we want to know, the size of the drop. Thanks. Same goes for the business page.
2
Billions less in tax revenue, tariffs on materials -- what chance do we have now of affording the promised, much needed, job-producing infrastructure improvements?
2
It would be better to subsidize these industries rather than to choose tariffs but it is nevertheless absolutely vital and in our national interest to have domestic steel and aluminum industries.
We do not want to be at the mercy of the rest world for these commodities, just as with oil and computer chips. Predatory dumping is a form of attack on the United States where it harms the industries vital for national defense. It's just as bad as a major cyber attack.
Free-traders are operating under the false assumption that the world is a peaceful place and that there are no winners and losers. This is not how the world works: it is a never-ending struggle for control over resources where some nations win and some nations lose. I am all for free trade but it can't come at the expense of national survival.
5
We are not at the mercy of the rest of the world. We are the world's third-largest steel producer. We rival Saudi Arabia in oil production. I don't know about computer chips, but my point is: all commodities and many products trade on a global market. If we choose not to participate in that market, then we forsake the entire world as a market for whatever we produce. We can't wish away the global economy, we need to engage in it. Tariffs are a clumsy way to engage. Having the world's most highly educated, innovative and healthiest workforce will ensure we're producing high-value, in-demand products instead of commodities.
3
Can't wait for Trump to tweet his OUTRAGE when our allies enact tariffs on the US.
Last time I checked, the US Defense Department gets ALL their weapons from US manufacturers - which just got a lot more expensive.
Not only will foreign manufacturers now have a leg up on US companies that need steel, but other foreign powers will be able to buy guns, tanks, and airplanes more cheaply than our DOD. Do you think maybe that fact should have been part of the study?
2
With this act, the president has not only severely underestimated the capacity of current metals companies here in the United States, but also the simple economic repercussions on all companies that require steel and aluminum. Couple this with the inevitable counter-tariffs to be introduced by other nations (I expect to hear the PRC placing an import tariff on soy beans) and we are looking at economic chaos.
Seriously, has he thought any of this through?
5
Think anyone in the Trump family took a short position in the market in advance of the announcement?
17
Smoot-Hawley Tariffs (1930) The Great Depression followed.
7
No... the Depression was already on. Smoot-Hawley didn't cause it. A global financial collapse did.
4
He argued that companies that use steel to make their products employ many times more Americans than the domestic steel industry. And therein lies the problem. Decisions like this are complex, nuanced, and require extensive knowledge of the factors involved. Does any of that sound like our president?
5
We have already tried this with coal, damaging a considerably larger 'green' energy industry. Now we move on to steel and aluminum, doomed to hurt the auto and airplane manufacturers and likely a number of other manufacturers and employers. This helps to confirm my suspicion that Trump and his minions do not knopw what they are doing.
8
Aside from the steel industry and trade issues, can we find out if anyone in the Trump/Kushner organizations and families made any prescient trades shorting the market index funds this morning?
7
Stock market just plunged 500 points.
3
Would someone please ask for Donald Trump's transcript from the Wharton School of business? I will guarantee you that he didn't pass economics1. In fact, I will pretty much bet the farm that he never went to class. Father most likely bought him his diploma, like he bought The Donald his heel-spur note from his doctor to get him out of the Vietnam war.
Do you suppose he has read any of the memos and policy papers on tarriffs that leading economic advisors have available for him? Or is he getting he opinions as usual from morning Fox News?
10
There goes that tax cut for the red states: Cars, and other durable goods will now cost more.
8
Net loss of jobs and a hammer blow to the American auto industry.
A man with no manufacturing knowledge embracing protectionism like it was something new and magical. BLOTUS proving once again that a lack of history dooms us to repeat it - with the same or more damaging results.
This decision plus his desire to destroy NAFTA will cripple the economy.
3
"...but it could tip off trade wars around the globe as other countries seek to retaliate against the United States."
Bring it on. As a country that runs over 500 Billion trade deficits per year, we have nothing to lose. Taxpayers are paying through the nose for all the unemployed manufacturing workers, their children who thought will have a similar jobs, by paying for social programs AND for OPIATE ADDICTION costs.
Trump is 100% right on this one. China has been shipping steel to Mexico to dump in US.
5
You don't understand trade at all. What are you going to say when this action does nothing to bring back jobs, causes prices to go up, and possibly brings on another recession or worse?
3
The steel industry is NOT a highly labor intensive one. It is environmentally unfriendly. US is an importer of services. Not steel. Trade deficit is a bogus measure. Taxpayers pay through the nose for corporate welfare to international conglomerates run by billionaires expensing cost in the US and hiding income offshore. Hedge funds (totally global man) paying cap gains rates (very very very low, dude) on carried interest (which is usually actually real income or performance bonus). When you understand how you are being schtupped by the GOP and Trump, then post.
3
Nothing to loose? Goes to show how much you comprehend about about economics.
1
Does 45 realize his diet Coke habit will become more expensive?
5
Wow, just open your mouth and watch the markets drop. That is some kind of leader we have got and I gotta wonder, is America great again already because we can't take much more greatness at this rate.
3
Doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results is the definition of Republicanism. First 'trickle-down' economics, and now protectionism. EPIC FAIL.
6
Two operating factors here:
1. Trump doesn't know what he's doing.
2. Trump has broad authority to do a lot of things.
We are going to get the results of that between now and 2020.
Have a nice day!
5
Well, thank goodness I'll be able to purchase a "Made in the USA" steel cup to beg for spare change.
15
Tariffs are never a winning strategy. Increasing productivity is the key to economic success and that can only be accomplished through education, skills, training and embracing new technologies. That will make our workforce competitive on a global scale. Unfortunately that takes hard work and dedication. So we are instead looking for a quick easy fix by implementing tariffs and it won’t work.
4
The markets fell because of the prospect of rising interest rates due to a strong Trump economy.
2
Um, I don't think so..... The ripple effects of such a tarrif is very complex and the notion of a strong Trump economy ridiculously simplistic. But yes, it's easier to believe a simplistic distortion than a complex truth.
3
I have to admit, this was a very funny comment, at least I hope that was the intention. Typically, markets fall when economies are doing well, so that makes sense. Especially since there is a couple days delay in market reactions, like in the old days of hand-delivered notes to traders, etc.
I seem to recall the market fell yesterday also before announcement of tariffs. Sometimes things are really pretty simple: interest rates go up, people head for bonds and away from stocks.
Reciprocal trade is a key node in the Trump reconfiguration agenda to restore American sovereignty in the context of a failed globalism. It is ironic that certain of our allies, confident to maneuver economically while we provided an umbrella of security, must now decide to play fair or continue to drain away America's vitality. Trump correctly realizes that a nation that depends on foreign producers for its steel and aluminum is well on its way to becoming a hollowed out nation. Their threats to retaliate will soon fade as the new American order unfolds.
7
We laughed so hard we hiccupped. You're kidding, right? You want to keep all the most environmentally devastating extraction activities here? With the high cost to clean up, restore ground water and soil, and their very low employment? You don't want higher value jobs here? Services that the US can export? Really? New American Order? Are you 90 and demented? So, we won't innovate. We won't create new technologies. We'll smelt and dig. Got it.
4
American steel. American aluminum. Don't you just love the sound of it? Or perhaps you prefer the sounds of "Chinese steel" or "German Steel." And tell the millions of Americans stuck with low-paying jobs more about your "higher value" jobs and "innovation." How long must they wait?
2
Agreed. Europe owes the U.S. for its very existence. The U.S. won WW II, implemented the Marshall Plan, and has provided an umbrella of protection from the Soviet Union/Russians for 70 years. I really don’t want to hear from some sniveling EU minister about American protectionism.
If the deficit spending resulting from the recent tax bill wasn't going to cause inflation, then these tariffs will do the job.
If the economy starts to tank because of this, I hope it does so just before the November elections.
4
While Trump can't claim all the credit for last year's increase in the stock market, he is responsible for this year's volatility and drop in share prices.
8
The President's Cabinet must vote Trump unfit for office. How many knee jerk actions are we supposed to live with, just because Republicans/Russians threw the election for a real estate salesman?
4
Memo
To: Tweeter-In-Chief
From: Concerned Citizen
Did you or members of your crime family sell equity index futures; short industrial equities; and/or purchase put options on industrial equities in anticipation of your announcement of tariffs on imports of steel and aluminum? The SEC and the CFTC would like to know about your insider trading.
Thanks for nothing.
10
If you want to break the economy, tariffs are a great way to go. In the 1990s tariffs placed on European and Australian wines made their prices go up - and California winemakers, who cheered on the tariffs to protect their markets from better, cheaper wines, raised their prices as well. Who got hurt? Americans.
Tariffs always hurt domestic consumers, because domestic consumers get worse products for more money. How do I know they're worse? Because the domestic producers don't need tariffs if their products are better.
7
That seems steep to start, though it depends on how much capacity we really have that we could put online, and could be fostered. The size of the tariff could be graduated over time (and perhaps differentiated by a country’s practices), as necessary, depending on results. To speak of a “trade war” acknowledges that we’re already in one, but implies that other countries would not alter their policies—but that we should.
Trump is an embarrassment to the Wharton School of Business.
5
Q. When will the idiocy end?
A. When the Republicans' investment portfolios start getting pinched.
Trump can do and say anything that occurs to him as long as the Heritage Foundation plutocrats are achieving their goals with him as their puppet/figurehead. As soon as his erratic, contradictory, ignorant, and mendacious behavior starts to mess with their money however, it's lights out for the orange orangutan.
If stock values start going south, I predict that these principled Republicans suddenly will find the resolve to question, undermine, impeach, remove, and perhaps even indict their confused and damaged factotum.
But Trump's in a bind: the red meat he feels compelled to throw to his trailor park base via protectionist tariffs, trashing of trade agreements, assailing venerable institutions and ad hominem attacks runs the risk, finally, of alienating his plutocrat country club puppeteers by diminishing their corporate profits.
Q. How will this conflict be resolved?
A. Stay tuned.
3
Trump had no problem with cheaper imported steel when he was building Trump Tower... once again the massive hypocrite...
7
How many more stupid promises does Trump have to honor before he decides to quit? I am sure that what he is waiting for is to say, "As the most brilliant and powerful President in history I have achieved what I said I would and leave the business of day-to-day governing (boring) to you losers who think you know more than me. Meanwhile I have money to launder. My family business needs me"
4
This is complex. Tariffs have their place. It is not a simple matter of neo-con open markets being always better all of the time. AND its not a simple matter of tariffs, being slapped on in this case as yet the latest nutty unthinking vote grab.
China rose by protecting its market and fixing its currency. China does not do free trade dont forget. The time for tariffs would have been 15 years ago. This would have served also to curb geopolitical decline of US v China.
Now to slap them on is about as silly as the token immigration ban from certain companies selected because they dont have any use for Trump resorts. And about as silly as the wall when the real way to stop illegal immigration is punish those many companies and individuals who benefit from cheap Latino illegal labor.
3
lets bring back steel and coal and ignore high tech, renewables and clean energy! our fearless gameshow host leader is a very stable genius and knows what he is doing. never mind he has zero qualifications other than being of age and a natural born citizen... these are the only requirements that enable one to serve as president of the usa . don't worry, be happy ! ;)
5
"Trump Plans Tariffs on Steel and Aluminum and Markets Slump"
but just look how many more times trump got his name in the media!
isn't THAT what really matters?
1
He's hoping that the WTO will save him from himself and give him someone to blame. Otherwise, he will just have to back down and look harder for someone to blame.
Now he really DOES "own the economy". Getting rid of Yellen was the first dumb move (the banks all love higher interest rates!), and there's no "overheated economy" to worry about. That just got fixed. Then there's the ever-more-costly, but 37th ranked health "system" (racket). And, of course, we must spend all our tax dollars on the empire level military we don't need. Time for the Mueller team to push this traitor to resignation, before he says we need to buy those new russian missiles!
2
While some sort of adjustment re trade/tariff protection is perhaps needed, it was needed pre-global economic integration, back in the 80s, after USS and Bethlehem finished building new state of the art still mills in Japan, China and Europe to ultimately compete with our domestic production. Today, this is more a nationalistic move that the WTO is sure step on. There are just too many treaties and formalized rules of global competition in a highly rationalized market. I'm sure that domestically, especially here in NWIndiana and other places in the U.S, are happy. Sounds more like export/import one-upsmanship or brinksmanship.
The Trump administration agenda of America First seems short-sighted, unable to embrace the interconnectivity matrix of global trade.
2
How does this square with the small government idea? I thought Trump and his cronies were trying to end all this government regulation that hampers business and industry and let the market sort everything out. Or is this like the Middle Ages, where we kill them all and let God do the sorting?
2
Yo Trump! If you raise the price of steel and other materials by putting tariffs on imports the promised infrastructure repairs will be out of reach. Did you learn critical path management at Wharton or did you snooze?
6
Trump wants the Great Great Depression.
Trump is hate and he doesn't care for people's wellbeing.
4
It'll be the greatest depression ever! YUGE!
1
Another clueless move by an infantile fool. Did he consult the world-class economists who've beat a path to his door to work with such an astute leader and protean thinker?
Maybe it was the Nobel winning economist Don likes to chat with at the end of his 18-hour work day?
Just kidding.. but then this is what his base voted for. We don't need no pointy-headed intellectuals when we got a successful real estate hustler.
2
Oh well, now Donalds starting to take control of the economy,
This time we're all investors.
Deja Vu all over again.
A regular Taj Majal...
i'm so tired of winning.
5
During the ‘morning in america’ Reagan 80’s the Chinese were allowed to buy any US steel company - many companies were bought - shut down - all US workers laid off - and incredibly the Chinese disassembled these US plants and then shipped the entire factory in parts to China for reassembly.
3
people keep building these ugly buildings in NYC. the steel industry has been booming. people have been underpaying and the suppliers have been overcharging. it's adjustment time.
1
I am a little lost here, cannot connect the dots
..
The trade action stems from a Commerce Department investigation that concluded imported metal threatens national security by degrading the American industrial base.
..
Foreign governments, multinational companies and the Pentagon have continued to push against the trade measures, arguing that the proposed tariffs could disrupt economic and security ties.
Gary D. Cohn, the director of the National Economic Council, had been lobbying for months alongside others, to kill, postpone or at least narrow the scope of the measures...
..
The tariffs have also divided industries, workers and policymakers. American manufacturers of steel and aluminum are among those pushing the White House to take action against cheap imports, which they say have hurt their ability to compete. But American companies that use steel and aluminum in their products, including automakers and food packagers, say that tariffs would raise their costs, eating into their profits or forcing them to raise prices for consumers or lay off workers.
.....
Roy Hardy, the president of the Precision Metalforming Association, which represents metalworking companies, said the tariffs would imperil “the U.S. manufacturing sector, and particularly downstream U.S. steel and aluminum consuming companies.” He argued that companies that use steel to make their products employ many times more Americans than the domestic steel industry.
oops' it is Trump who connected the dots.
89
The first dot is the key problem. It is the premise, and it is a lie, to wit:
"The trade action stems from a Commerce Department investigation that concluded imported metal threatens national security by degrading the American industrial base."
Although one might be able to make such a case re China, it does not work for the other major suppliers, in particular Canada. Canadian security is so tightly intertwined with American, that the notion that Canada would ever prove an unreliable partner in providing the US with steel and aluminum is absurd.
To grasp how irrational this national security issue is, consider oil. In the event of global war, it is above all oil that will be critical to a massive war effort. For many decades, US policy was to import middle eastern oil leaving American oil in the ground as a hedge against disruption of imports by war. Current US policy is to exploit local oil for short term profit, inevitably eventually jeopardizing national security needs.
Retaliation will follow. Canadian gas and oil is a potential response. Currently, under NAFTA rules, the US has the right to purchase Canadian gas and oil and the same price as Canadians. Steel & aluminum tariffs violate NAFTA--a suitable response would be placing equivalent tariffs on Canadian gas and oil shipped south.
Oh, BTW, China is begging for access to Canadian petroleum, so redirecting that essential national security product from an unreliable American ally to China will be easy. Very sad
2
When the trade agreements were signed they were good for corporate America or they would not have been signed. American corporations played the cheap labor in Asia out against union jobs at home and it was profitable for them. Trump still thinks American workers are paid too much. The standard of living for American workers went down with decades of stagnating wages, now they may be cheap enough for the industry to return.
1
I'm in the steel fabrication business and prices have gone up 20% in the last 2-3 months. Now this. Prices will go through the roof. This will begin the next recession. It's the first domino.
3
At least the cost of guns will rise. So teenagers will be less able to afford them.
Who benefits from a sudden drop in the market, DJ Trump & Company? Follow the money! This would be a good time for Trump to release his taxes.
1
Of course. There is one rule for Trump and another for everybody else. Please everybody, for God's sake read the Newsweek expose about the Crook in Chief using $350 million in Chinese steel and aluminum to build two of his buildings.
Donald Trump has ALWAYS gotten whatever he wanted. He cheated, lied, and did anything he wanted to "win"--no matter what it cost somebody else--and then lied about it to stay out of trouble. Ever hear about the friezes he removed from the Bonwit Teller building in New York City, after giving his (worthless) word that he would not? What about all the undocumented workers he used to build his buildings, and then paying them $5 an hour--or in vodka, since, after all, they were Polish--? What about the subcontractors who went bankrupt because of him?
What about the way he is bankrupting our country? He spends money like water--always has. What HE wants, buy buy buy. Spend, spend, spend. But he is always around to tell everybody that what they want, we cannot afford.
One can only wish that his immigration reforms had begun before his grandfather was allowed into this country. Alas, it was only because the Germans wouldn't have him back that we got stuck with him and his corrupt progeny.
1
In yet another lousy episode of loose lips sink ships, "U.S. stocks closed sharply lower on Thursday, with equities falling in a broad decline after President Donald Trump announced tariffs on steel and aluminum imports."
This guy wants endless distractions from his chaotic white house and that he faces daily legal scrutiny. So ordinary people's investments plummet.
Republican administrations cause recessions, and Democrats are elected to pick up the pieces. Just like the Bush administration left a mess for the Democratic successor.
1
Once again, it looks like what he sees on Fox News — including ads — dictates policy. What a message to send our friends — and our enemies.
For such an astute businessman, he is so clueless.
1
Inflation, increased debt, no free trade... where are the Republicans?
2
Is the tariff move the brainchild of Trump, Ivanka, Jared or Stormy Daniels, all such brilliant economists?
7
Does anyone doubt that trump somehow profits from these wild market gyrations? Anyone? He’s shown no hesitation in profiting from his stature as Oval Office occupant—why wouldn’t he bet for or against the market when he knows his next tweet or other pronouncement will move the indices?
2
"Trump Plans Tariffs on Steel and Aluminum and Markets Slump"
NOBODY makes better deals, hires better people, knows more about what Americans need and want, and is more presidential than Donald Trump. He's the finest president in the history of this 240-year-old republic. So, Trump voters and supporters, how's that working out for you now? How's it working in your coal and steel states? How's it working for your investments? How's it working out for your air, water and safety of your kids in school? The rest of us would like to know.
2
It's astonishing that Trump, through his outdated views on trade and a host of other economic views, is doing everything he can to kill an economy that's prospering.
The massive injection of capital through tax cuts in a time of low interest rates, the damping of local economic activity through deportations, leaving TPP, hammering NAFTA, and now this, sparking a trade war with country with a newly minted dictator with something to prove. ("All hail Chairman Xi Jinping!")
How did this monster come to swallow whole our entire government? Worse, how is it that only half of us are resisting?
"Will no one rid me of this meddlesome priest?"
8
No brain for economics. This shows Trump has no understanding of the economy he has power over. The result of this will probably be lost jobs and higher steel prices worldwide.
4
It's too late for steel and coal. The sooner we as a nation realize this, the better. Stop demonizing immigrants and trade. What is destroying the working and middle classes is the greed of CEOs and shareholders, who are like sullen children and don't want to share their profits with the workers, who make those profits possible.
8
Just in time for our infrastructure debt to pile up a little faster for the next few generations of Americans to pass on to their heirs.
1
Making America Great again by increasing inflation, by making raw materials more expensive, adding tariffs on foreign goods, to fuel inflation more, hurting the midd4el class and working class, by ring profits. Add a protectionist federal reserve chief, to cause market panic. And, to add to this toxic mess, the YUGE tax cut, that will spar large wage increases, is going to buy back stock and to share holders. Thus, having salaries not keeping pace with the inflation, our "president" is creating. Throw in wrecking NAFTA, and Trump may recreate the 1970s stagflation that led to double digit inflation, double digit interest rates and double digit unemployment of the early 1980s.
Trump is dreaming that all the manufacturing that went over seas is coming back, and that coal run factories will bring those jobs back. He is dreaming even more that all those cheap product made in China are going to be made here, at the wages paid in China, and developing Asian countries.
And where is he going to find the workers who will want to toil in a steel mill, or mine, or garment factory, non unionized, at $10/hour?
Another attempt to take this country back to gaslight age. Trump is going to take what little recovery there has been and send this country into a depression.
5
Trupmy say's I'm going to give you a tax break, then I'm going to place tariffs on washers, driers, steel and aluminum so Americans can use their tax break money to pay a higher cost for those items and the other items that I haven't thought of yet.
This fool plans things out so well.
13
Good news because the only way he won't get re-elected in 2020 is if he crashes the economy so he may well on his way of doing that.
2
This black swan is covered in coal dust. Did you know 74% of steel is made using coal? The electoral college has not only outlived it’s usefulness, it is perverting our economic interests.
6
If the president knows ahead of time that his actions will tank the market, and if he and his family profit from shorting the market, can that be construed as insider trading?
3
I believe that's the definition of insider trading.
Not many of us may like it, and many of us have serious issues we wish would be raised.
But at least we understand, this is not how free trade works in the age of globalization. Tariffs??? Someone needs to tell the stable genius this is 2018, not 1818.
3
The thinking on this is narrow, yes it will help steel manufacturing but it hurts all metal fabricators and consumers. the US does not have the domestic capacity (or the quality) to support all steel consumption so we will still nees to import steel. get ready for increased prices and inflation if this goes through as stated
Wonder if anyone in trumps WH looked at whether the US could even produce the necessary amounts of steel to replace those lost by these tariffs. if we do not, it guarantees huge price increase for everything. Or maybe that is the plan - increase prices to increase profits for US steel makers at no benefit to the US.
No one will ever claim trump is an economic genius!
Imagine you had a US President who barely won, elected by all the states with the least educated population, with the least income, the highest unemployment, and the least competitive industries, compared to the other states. Imagine if this President was loyal to a fault to his supporters, and decided to resurrect their uncompetitive industries by using tariffs that increased the cost of goods and materials to the entire country, increased cost because the industries in those states were hugely less efficient than industries overseas. So all of the US loses except those in the specific uncompetitive industries. Sad.
6
Wait till the beleagered middle class sees the price of that car they wanted to buy (with their tax rebate) go up higher than the tax credits Trump gave them.
1
Tariffs - because nothing says "MAGA" quite like American consumers paying more for everything made of steel and aluminum... which is, basically, everything. Anybody know if Trump's buildings are constructed with American-made steel beams and aluminum? No word on what this does to jobs in other industries, while the steel and aluminum industries gear up... if they gear up. Protectionism is such a dead-end most corporations will probably ignore Trump.
1
Wondering the real motive for new tariffs, are Trump's existing buildings now more valuable because to build anew will be prohibitively expensive?
Another time move by this collection of old clueless white men who want things to return a time that only ever existed in their minds. Will launch a trade war and start a recession just as the world is healing from "The Great One".
Unfortunately, Trump can't do a day without being the story. And this story blows for the workers he says he understands: the woebegone "forgotten men and women". The joke on them continues.
1
I thought it would take Trump four years to wreck the economy, but I guess he’s gonna do it in only two.
3
"Stocks fell as Mr. Trump announced the move, with the industrial sector seeing the steepest declines"
The MAGA magnate just shot himself in the foot again. Anti-Trade is against what we stand for. Tariffs to "correct" trade imbalances reminds me of the guy who lowers his goals so to better reach them rather than improving his skill set to attain his goals.
American manufacturing has following options
- consume American steel which is more expensive
- consume imported steel which is more expensive due to tariffs
It means everything made in America from steel is more expensive. Prepare to pay in store. Prepare to lose exports to the other countries, made elsewhere will be possibly cheaper. Oh, maybe entire thing will be imported to avoid tariffs. It means we will pay more in stores and American steel workers will lose jobs. Well done.
4
Or move manufacturing to Mexico where the price of steel is lower.
1