According to CNN, “Overall, about half of Americans say they would blame either Trump (21%) or his Republican counterparts in Congress (26%) should Congress fail to fund the government by the midnight Friday deadline. About a third, 31%, say they would hold the Democrats in Congress responsible, and another 10% say they'd blame all three groups. Among Republicans, 62% would blame the Democrats in Congress, while 43% of Democrats would blame Republicans on Capitol Hill and 29% would blame Trump. Still, 56% overall say approving a budget agreement to avoid a shutdown is more important than continuing the DACA program, while just 34% choose DACA over a shutdown.” When the federal paychecks stop showing up and federal programs start closing, the 56% is going to grow to closer to 100%.
http://www.cnn.com/2018/01/19/politics/cnn-poll-shutdown-trump-immigrati...
DACA is toast, done, over.
This last 'Hail Mary pass' of the Dems, holding our federal government hostage to a shut down, for the DACAs alone is just plain stupid and ridiculous.
2
It was never the art of a deal but the art of a con-game with that vile excuse of a human being. He and the rich people who are the sole beneficiaries and who manage to dupe poor, anxious and frustrated whites among the non-racists (shades of the old Confederacy) being the combination of his "base." Good word for it.
4
Not sure what the point of this article was, but I like Pelosi more now.
2
More like the "disfunctioning of government".
1
Nancy Pelosi is a know nothing cynical politician.
Donald Trump is an arrogant blowhard.
The DNC is a corporation dedicated to its high powered politician boardmembers, scru America.
The RNC is a corporation dedicated to its high powered Bush Family boardmembers, scru America.
The NYTs is lost in the past.
And I WELCOME a govt shutdown.
....
Tax the Internet.
Tax all Political Donations to the point that DNC and RNC are ruined.
Death and Taxes.
The breakdown in trust that Rep. Israel focuses on is only half the story.
If it were not for the "Freedom Caucus" and the "Hastert Rule" - otherwise known as the the "To Hell with Democracy Rule" Meaningful, compassionate immigration reform would have been law for almost 8 years.
The biggest headline -buried in all of trump's bizarre vaudeville show - is that Lies, Money, Talk Radio, and Fox News gave birth to the "Freedom Caucus" which is by its very DNA a dysfunctional contagion designed for destruction rather than governing.
Ryan and McConnell can blame Democrats, but the truth is, the Freedom Caucus is the Frankenstein of their own design.
4
Keep it up Dems, keep fighting for the rights of criminals and this is the end result. Keep fighting tooth and nail for illegals and this is what you get. Forget the plight of average Americans and legal immigrants and you will continue to lose election after election. You can't say you haven't been warned. The tragic thing of it all is that they never learn from past mistakes. One very big reason HRC lost.
2
Trump will sign whatever deal the Congress puts on his desk. They know that.
2
This government doesn't speak for me, or any other Democratic voters. So just shut it down, please.
1
Take what Pelosi was referencing, out it between two slices of bread, add some mustard and a pickle and see who's willing to take the first bite. That's leadership!
Actually, in the case of Trump, the use of "indecent" as a descriptor is a compliment.
2
The President cannot be trusted. Within the same non-grammatic sentence he often contradicts himself, and what he states at any time is subject to future denial by to his whim. He is truly the poster boy for dysfunction and deceit.
And through this national ordeal Republicans: genuflect, grovel, stroke and flatter, and are even are willing to blatantly lie for this disgraceful person.
Is it hardly surprising that there can be no trust between Democrats and Trump and his minions. Feckless McConnell and Ryan are not leaders, they are shipwrecked and just clinging to the detritus left in the wake of this ignorant President.
5
Before there can be a breakdown in trust between the parties, there must be trust. Possibly some is out there, very miniscule, but for our "genius" president's first year in office I never have seen any trust at all. Actually, more stories are told of how this president has reneged on many occasions to prior commitments. I say time will show he will become the loneliest president in our history because he can not be trusted.
2
I think this is yet another reason to consider term limits for congress-critters. At some point EACH of them will be kicked out of office. Then, they won't be chronically running for office and may actually spend time DOING something (even half-way useful) for a change. If you consider the last several two-term presidents, they tend to do a lot more useful stuff when they knew they were going out of office anyway in their second terms.
Meanwhile, I'm deathly tired of the Sturm und Drang emanating from DC. Perhaps a shut down (and shut-up) would be useful.
I was just starting the first day of my week long vacation in Washington, DC, when the last shutdown happened in 2013. By the end of that day, barriers were being erected around everything, from the Lincoln Memorial to Washington's obelisk, because even security guards were laid off. I spent one more day in DC, mostly wandering around the now shuttered city and riding on the excellent Metro train with LIVID travelers from all over the world. All of whom had come for the vacation of their lives, which of course began with visiting DC and the excellent museums (now closed) and typically including a visit to at least one of our National Parks (also now closed). These understandably irate people had just thrown away a LOT of money and time, and loudly expressed their new belief that America had lost its mind, and they would tell EVERYONE back in their home countries to never ever ever come to this insane country. Like them, I took a big financial hit with cancelling reservations and leaving town many days early, and headed to Canada, where sanity still prevailed.
Nothing good will come of this. Again.
1
Everyone should remember that this president firmly believes you should never convey your position to your opponent. "Keep them guessing" is his mantra. Only in Trump's case, the joke should be evident. He keeps everyone guessing because even he doesn't know what his position is.
In previous shut-down dramas, everyone knew the positions staked out by Democrats and Republicans. What does this president want? Even the majority leader in his own party can't answer that one.
Sorry but comparisons to past dramas just doesn't cut it.
2
Where to start, good negotiations in faith is what caused the Dreamer situation to implode. If it dies a death of a thousand cuts, The democrats (Durban) in particular own it. While language that was said behind closed doors of a negotiation process was colorful and arguably non-presidential it was a grave misjudgment by the Democrats to use it for perceived political gain. The statesman (if there had been one present) would have worked for a solution to the situation vice holding a position that was not obtainable. Instead we have the Democratic party holding the Country (and it's Legal Citizens) hostage for a group of Non-Citizens. Mark my words that when Grandma doesn't get her check that you have converted voters against you. Especially when this issue affects so few of us out here away from the White Palace on the hill...
1
Democratic leaders are smart enough. Perhaps their strategy will be to facilitate a permanent "extension mentality" where each time they agree to fund the government for another week or another month, they get a concession to their agenda. First, CHIP. Next, immigration. Then, non-defense program funding. Etc.
Trump's erratic nature should enable the Dems to exploit him and the GOP. Dems need to stay cool and be patient. Trump will undermine his own side.
1
"The fact is that governing does require deal making, and deal making requires trust between opposing leaders."
Well, what if we don't want to be "governed"? What if the obsession with expanding federal power through governing is exactly the reason one side is obstructing the negotiation?
Some of us are happy that the government will, probably, "shut down" for a while. In fact, much of hte government will continue to function. But many of the parts of the government that have no useful function will stop being paid to do nothing worthwhile. That is a good thing. The government has shut down, in this sense, in the past and life went on. Yet, then and now we are encouraged to treat such money saving breathers from government as catastrophic failures to govern. I look on them as refreshing episodes. They remind us that the world will keep turning even if there are delays in form processing, closures of some roads in national parks and what ever disaster we are supposed to believe will befall us if Congress and Trump do not come to agreement today.
If the government shuts down at midnight, the sun will rise on Saturday morning. Water will flow downhill. The vast majority of Americans will go on about life as usual. The reason for the hysteria among politicians, particularly those on the left, is the risk that more people will realize how little we get from all this governing. Then they will call for less of it.
Trump imported his take no prisoners business ethic into the White House. Taking hostages is among his arsenal of tactics. In the business world Trump may have "closed" many deals, but he also left behind a trail of strewn bodies of "losers": investors, lenders, customers, contractors and suppliers burned by his failed deals, bankruptcies and deadbeat tactics.
The GOP has followed Trump down this path of negotiations by hostage taking. He he taking them for the same ride he took Trump
University students who thought they were following Trump down a golden path. They of course got burned...but although he GOP may get burned at the polls, we will all have to suffer through the rest of this Presidency.
1
While it is interesting to read all the philosphical comments on why and how we got to this point, I am even more interested in what happens after the shutdown, if one occurs. We will certainly be in "uncharted territory"; I wish Mr. Israel had offered his thoughts on the ways it might play out.
Shut it down. This will stop all the Pretend King Trump's edicts from implementation at all agencies. While it is shut down, we do need to care of the government workers who have been uneasy since the Republican cuts and the continued up and down budget negotiations. While our government is shut down we need to make these people fully aware who is at fault, the GOP and those who fund them corporations. This is our time to make it known who really has the power in a democracy. They are our employees including the Pretend King, even if he does not take a paycheck he eats and travels with our money. Go ahead make our day.
I see the don basically as a shill for far-right politicians and mega donors. Leave him out of the equation. He loves to sign stuff with his big pen. Democrats must hold the line somewhere.
1
This guest column by Steve Israel points up the paralyzing instability and intellectual flaws of Donald Trump.
While Trump characterizes himself as a highly skilled negotiator, nothing could be farther from the truth. Throughout his business career, Donald Trump has made one bad deal after another or lost the opportunity for many good deals because of his foolish, tough-guy tactics.
How did Trump accumulate considerable wealth, even though it’s less than he regularly claims? He did so because there were long-time business employees or family members who stepped in and saved Trump from himself. He also took advantage of unique laws available to people involved in commercial real estate development. Over time, the Trump name became a rentable commodity in some circles.
Donald Trump has the theatrical flair of a street huckster to draw attention to himself. When the crowd which gathers is relatively naïve (as happened in the 2016 presidential campaign), they swallow the spiel -- hook, line and sinker.
Getting back to Steve Israel’s thoughts on the negotiations over a government shutdown because of Donald Trump’s inexplicable reversal, Mr. Israel should note that it occurred after someone in the White House apparently got to Trump.
The prime suspect is Chief of Staff, John Kelly, a man who has shown that he has very harsh anti-immigration views and that he has no sympathy for black folks, no matter where they come from.
The problem in the equation is clearly Mr. Trump, no matter how much many other Republicans are stirring the pot too. When you agree today and then change your mind tomorrow, only to change it again the day after, no one can function intelligently. No deal can be made under such circumstances.
Apparently, Mr. Trump is not the dealmaker he pretends to be.
1
I'd still like to know why the Legislative branch is kowtowing to the Executive branch. Surely the Democratic and Republican leaders can 'trustfully' negotiate deals and send them to the president, always ensuring that they send him something that is veto-proof. Just cut Trump out of the (art of the) deal.
Trump's a firefighter who's an arsonist; sets a fire in the theater when everyone's sitting but there isn't an image of him on the screen, then rushes in and douses the flames proclaiming himself the hero. It's his usual pattern - if it ain't about him, it needs to be set on fire.
1
Trump's idea of negotiating is threats + bribes + going back on his promises. Trusting someone like that is for fools.
3
The Schumer Shutdown, aka, the Democrat (reverse) Potemkin Shutdown—
If Schumer decides to shut down the government, the shutdown will be in name only. It will be virtually undetectable. Trump officials have been instructed to use their carry-forward money and transfer authority to fund their departments during a Schumer Shutdown.
Obama, by contrast, wanted to make sure the people felt the pain of shutdowns under his watch. He weaponized the shutdowns by instructing his officials not to use their carry-forward money and transfer authority to fund their departments.
Obama wanted the people to suffer so that he and the Democrats could gain political advantage when they cynically and falsely blamed the Rs. Pain for the masses was standard-issue Obama abuse-of-power tactics; you will be hearing more about this soon. The greatest scandal in our lifetime is about to break. Stay tuned.
2
Yeah. Because the GOP is all about negotiation and compromise.
To get back to sane, I believe the only option is to abolish political parties. (Well, a second option is to break into two countries. I'd have to move, but I'd be OK with that.) Combine that with publically financed campaigns of a limited time frame, say two-three months, and we might be able to elect people who are willing to work together and compromise.
When I was a kid, my grandmother lived with us. One day we were talking about an upcoming election and my grandmother commented on how she just goes in the voting booth and votes straight party. I was appalled that she did not take the time to know who the candidates were and what they stood for. At a minimum, let's get rid of straight-party voting everywhere it's still in use.
2
The problem is that Democrats refuse to negotiate from a position of strength. Instead they declare issues lost without even trying to win, then offer a compromise position as their opening offer and let the republicans demand concessions from there. Any real negotiator will term you that both sides start at the preferred outcome and negotiate from the. Democrats keep starting in the middle than move to the right, so that they end up supporting Republican legislation, then take blame when it doesn't work. If Obama had fought for Medicare for All, he could have accepted Romneycare as the compromise and republicans would be co-owners.
To win:
Focus on policies that are good for workers: raising the minimum wage, universal healthcare, subsidized education, infrastructure, social security, actual immigration reform (much faster legal immigration and prosecuting employers that create the demand for illegals) and tax increases on the mega rich to pay for it.
Make well thought out (not triangulated) arguments to the people for these policies.
Build the base of working people who are a large majority of eligible voters. Win elections. Negotiate from a position of strength.
Blaming voters for not voting for the lesser evil, while negotiating in full retreat is causing Democrats to lose 2/3 of all elections for decades.
Workers outnumber every other "interest group." Fight for what workers need, and they will follow you on social policy too.
10
The problem is that Democrats are not in a position of strength to begin with.
Do the math.
1
Harry Truman: "The buck stops here!"
Donald Trump: "Whatever."
7
Other countries have figured out a solution, and it's not that hard.
If the legislature fails to approve a new budget, the government automatically continues to operate under the previous year's appropriation levels until such time as the legislature enacts a new budget.
Imagine. Stable government without so much drama.
8
So the President allegedly says "bad" words about nations that objectively are dangerous, yet Pelosi verbally paints a pictured of the same idea about "our" country and gets a free pass from the press? Hypocrisy at its essence from the NYT.
2
But perhaps there is method in this madness, and Trump's real mission is to Make America unGovernable Again (MAuGA!).
3
Trump wants to make America unconstitutional, so he can proclaim imperial edicts sms send his critics to Guantanamo.
Continue to make illegal aliens the priority and this is what you get.
How did people who are breaking our laws become the reason our government shuts down??
Laughable.
4
Isn't it rich to hear democrats lamenting about shutting down the government. Mr. Israel and his ilk will do anything in their power to destroy this President and harm this country. The bitterness of the Nov.8 democrat thrashing is still raw and the utter hatred by democrats of all thing republican is both dangerous and real. Democrats will fail in their efforts to sabotage this Presidency. The nation is onto their bag of dirty tricks and underhanded politics. There was no collusion. Potus will prevail as he always does. Stay tuned.
3
This is the art of the con, negotiating deals that serve only one person, Trump. Don't like a rule - ethics? - ignore it and dare anyone to stop you. The Republicans have been sucked in by the belief that he will get them what they want, so letting him steal our money is just the price they're willing to pay. Stand up Democrats, don't bargain with a con man and his fools, stick up for us until you get us what we need. Shut it down, it's not doing us any good.
7
Shut it Down, and shut Him up. Let them OWN their creature.
Thanks, GOP. November.
11
Kakocracy at its best.
1
Republicans holding children hostage.
Republicans controlling both houses of congress, AND the WH (illegitimately) and they STILL cannot manage something as fundamental as keeping the lights on.
They are doing what they always do, lying abut it. Dotard, McConnell, and Lying Ryan were all on social media weeping for the damage the TrumpShutdown will do to the military. At least McConnell and Ryan are aware the military is 100% unaffected by a RepublicanShutdown. Dotard, may or may not know. Hard to tell sometimes whether he is lying or ignorant.
Remember in November. A Democratic led congress functions while Republicans just tell lies.
10
I’m afraid we’re living in a dying country in a dying civilization, and this is simply part of the stench.
5
When your only tool is a hammer, everything looks like a nail. This president has no capacity for nuance. He is the whiny brat who gleefully ruins the party for everyone else. His temper tantrums are intended to steal the show. Even when everyone is willing to let him have his way, his way changes to something else just so he can spite those around him. This is the opposite of leadership. He is a nihilist, a bomb-thrower, an upsetting destroyer, the bull in the china closet. There is no moral center to this man. He thrives on chaos. "Make America Great" was a sham from the start. This is the habitual liar whose MO has always been bait & switch. He is the carnival barker, the snake oil salesman. Why does anyone believe anything he says? His deceitful and untrustworthy character has been revealed time and again. He is a fake, a phony, a fraud. He promises nothing, nothing, but more of the same.
7
If the government shut down, I just hope we still don't have to pay for Trump's trips to his golf courses.
6
This is Putin and his tools at their best. Putin wanted to destroy Ukrainian independence and steal their land, so he used Manafort to weaken the government.
Now we have the same sort of people running our government, into the ground. They want confusion, and arguments, and a people disgusted with their government, so Putin can gloat along with his oligarchs strutting about Russia. One cannot trust Putin or Manafort or Trump to do anything but lead this country to ruin. Manafort's previous client/leader, who did the same for Ukraine, now lives in Russia wanted in Ukraine for High Treason. I would keep a close eye on Manafort... and his ties to Russia. If Trump pardons him even for a day, off to Russia he will go.
We are at war with an enemy, Russia, and their spies have been able to get Trump and others in positions of power. That is getting to be more obvious as the days progress.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qu-8CtvtO9k
Hugh Massengill, Eugene Oregon
6
What would happen if these political drama queens had no audience? Republicans can't possibly pander more obviously to their donors, and Democrats can't possibly be bigger victims. How did they all get elected, and why do we keep them there?
2
What bad form this is. We'd benefit a lot if we had a statute dictating that "All Members of Congress shall only receive salary payments if a Federal Budget is passed by regular order [...]".
Guess who'd have to pass that statute though...
3
Wouldn't work.
Their money comes from other sources, far more than their salary, and the worse they are, the more this is true.
The problem with trust is that from the Gingrich era, through the Tea Party, to the present, the GOP has devolved from a political party to something that more closely resembles a political insurgency or insurrection. The distinction is that the GOP has demonstrated they are willing to harm people and the country to achieve their ideological goals.
How else would you describe the debt standoffs during the Obama administration? The GOP flirted with a default that could have grievously harmed our economy. In the current conflict, they have taken the CHIP program hostage and are using the health coverage of 9 million children as a bargaining chip. “We get our way on immigration and the budget or the kids lose their health coverage.” That’s not a political bargain; it’s a hostage negotiation.
8
Trust requires reason, and there is no reason in Washington. All that seems to matter is spin. And the Republicans are vastly superior to Democrats as spinmeisters. The Democrats are in the minority in part because they are the worst message crafters in the universe. Even with a winning hand (rescuing the economy from a new Great Depression, having the Access Hollywood tape land in their laps) they could not defeat the GOP in the message wars.. If there is a shutdown, the Republicans will almost certainly "win" it politically. Which will damage Democratic prospects in the midterms. They probably need to fold and live to fight for DACA another day.
2
although the President seems erratic and unreliable, in fact he is not.
he will take any acton, make any statement, face any risk... as long as he keeps himself firmly at the top of the news, the lede every day, all the time... and manages a zigzagging course of distraction from any issue that could affect him personally.
Mr. Trump, in all his inconsistencies, is remarkably consistent in his mania for the limelight and the adulation of his base... and his quest to evade responsibility for his own highly questionable actions.
all the rest is commentary.
6
Shutting down the government to benefit a handful of illegal immigrants. Appalling.
6
What is appalling, M, is the fact that the Republicans turned the Dreamers and the Haitians into "illegal immigrants" by reneging on their promises. They now have the dishonesty to shut down the government because Democrats will not surrender.
1
Actually, about 800,000. Lets keep our facts straight.
1
I know this isn't a big deal, especially in this context, but I keep reading that the government will shut down "Friday at midnight." No. Twelve AM belongs to the next day, not the ending day. So the government would shut down at midnight Saturday, not Friday. There, I feel better.
2
I am afraid that DACA is about more than "the functioning of Government." It goes to the heart of the principle of how state power is deployed in a civilized society. What are the consequences of the far right's position on DACA? Are we seriously going to use the power (and prestige) of the United States of America to forcibly deport people who were brought here as children, have known no other country, HAVE no other country, are integrated into this society, contribute to this society, have friends and colleagues and loved ones in this society. Is the power of the state to be used to forcibly evict them? What principle of justice can one call upon to defend this monstrous use of state power?
11
Do you understand that a majority, possibly a super majority of Republicans and Republican Representatives want to find a way to help the direct DACA recipients? The argument is about chain migration where each recipient can claim Primo Jose (who is loosely related, perhaps a third cousin) is to be allowed in? Many of these loose relationships are supposed to be believed simply because the recipient says they are blood relation, with no verification. The secondary argument made by Republicans is that they want border security so that when current recipients are legalized we have a way to control future immigration.
I don't think that is unreasonable. What I do think is unreasonable is refusing to negotiate in any way and preferring to shut down the government for the sole sake of people who technically don't have a right to be here. I don't understand how Democrats can believe it is a smart or good thing to hurt actual Americans to help those who dream of being American.
The history of our democracy is replete with similar breakdowns in trust across branches of government, within its institutions, and--yes--within its political parties. This is nothing new. It does require leadership to overcome and clear demands by an electorate wiling to reward and punish at the voting booth.
Trust is a forgotten genre in any government issues today. And, to use Nancy Pelosi as an example of one who furthers discussion is beyond any sanity. She is a destructive, power hungry, unbending zealot just like so many other Democrats who whine and accuse and grandstand to keep the government from ever working. She, along with Schumer, Warner, AND Republicans, like McConnell and his ilk...ALL should be ashamed at how they conduct, so-called government. Both parties are filled with self-absorbed, power hungry, money grabbing men and women who have lost all kinds of civility or decency. The government wil never work again. It’s so far down in the gutter, the representatives and senators so bent on “their way or the highway” it will be almost impossible to right the ship.
1
this time, it appears to be about more than money:
who is american?
how many poor people will there be?
what will we do when they have no work? Open the landfilld?
1
Will someone explain why Congress can't vote on anything unless the president approves in advance (and doesn't change his mind)?
Voting on bills makes a commitment so voters can evaluate performance in office. Not voting denies constituents that information.
This Congress doesn't seem to understand it is independent of the White House as a coequal branch of government. Instead, we have a recumbent legislature that is all but moribund.
3
Why would the Democrats ever, in a million years, believe the Republicans will negotiate on anything once they've secured the votes they need? Democrats need to avoid a Charlie Brown moment where the Republican led congress, channeling Lucy, holds out the football and promises not to snatch it away. it's funny, in a mean and instructive way in comic form. This is anything but funny.
3
Trump is the worst negotiator ever. Take the embassy in Jeruselem, where he basically gaveIsrael a free pass and got nothing. Then, there's the TPP where the chance to fight Chinese economic dominance in Asia was just tossed in the trash. Now, he shows the world that he actually has no idea what his position is fromminute to minute as he wrestles with trying to show his humanity, which conflicts with his racism. He's terrible at this. I guess,it isn't the same as stiffing contractors.
2
A few years ago a Republican congressional candidate said he believed in “bipartisanship,” then defined it as “Democrats doing what we want.”
I can’t believe Dems aren’t quoting that every time they speak. Instead, they once again let Rs define them (and media is complicit).
1
There seems to be some confusion. When the Republicans don’t have a sixty vote majority in the Senate, they have to compromise to get Democratic support. Republicans think they can blame Democrats for not going along 100% why aren’t Republicans to blame for not compromising? Ans: twisted thinking.
1
Mr. Trump tweets or says something outrageous at the beginning of the week. He or his staff by Tuesday deny--by Friday morning he is leaving DC for one of his golf properties.
Tonight he will celebrate, at a lavish party, doing this for the last 52 weeks. He is laughing all the way to the bank...golf course. Electoral College you got played!
1
It's pretty hard to trust a bunch of Republican sycophants who have made Congress a rubber-stamp Duma for a reality show president who changes his mind not only daily but sometimes hourly. And it's pretty hard to trust a "president" who goes golfing the day the government may shut down and who is more concerned with hosting fund raisers at Mar-a-Lago than the 800,000 Dreamers he wants to deport. No wonder we have become a joke to the rest of the world.
2
I would not call this a "breakdown" in trust. That implies mutuality. That is a false equivalency.
This is a betrayal of trust, perpetrated by one party, with roots going back to the bomb thrower Newt Gingrich, and culminating now in the inevitable and utter destruction of trust manifested when that party cynically and knowingly sold its soul - and any last vestige of decency and patriotism it still held onto - to a narcissistic and dangerous charlatan.
4
This is an excellent explanation of the corrupted so-called “art of the deal” when you have no trust in one of the primary negotiating parties. Just impossible!
Until now, I had not realized that Donald Trump's Art of the Deal was a book of fiction.
2
There are going to be some angry people if the government shuts down tomorrow. How would you feel if you did the work, or loaned your money and didn't get paid?
President Trump: "I keep throwing grenades into the negotiations, and weirdly the negotiations keep blowing up. I'm not sure what's going on with that."
3
Tie Trump to a chair and don’t give him any Big Macs until he signs something sensible.
1
I read the tea leaves this way: The Dems are in 2018 & 2020 political trouble and they know it. They are desperate and desperate people do desperate things. Making this shutdown about a DACA fight-when it is NOT emergent-is a sign of how bad their situation is. Dems are not interested in establishing or maintaining trust to do the peoples business, rather to hold on to their power.
There is still time to negotiate, but it is fleeting.
1
Some men see things as they are and ask why, whereas Robert Kennedy, (according to his brother Edward who was quoting George Bernard Shaw), saw things as they could be and asked, why not? Trump? He flies to Mar-a-Lago for yet another weekend of Mulligan golf, to be fawned over by staff, and the best chocolate cake in the world.
3
Two things.
First, a quote from Harvard Business Review:
A Culture of Candor
James O’TooleWarren Bennis
JUNE 2009
"A culture of candor doesn’t just develop on its own—the hoarding of information is far too persistent in organizations of all kinds. That said, leaders can take steps to create and nurture transparency. The bottom line with each of these recommendations is that leaders need to be role models: They must share more information, look for counterarguments, admit their own errors, and behave as they want others to behave.
When followers are asked to rank what they need from their leaders, trustworthiness almost always tops the list. Leaders who are candid and predictable—they tell everyone the same thing and don’t continually revise their stories—signal to followers that the rules of the game aren’t changing and that decisions won’t be made arbitrarily. Given that assurance, followers become more willing to stick their necks out, make an extra effort, and put themselves on the line to help their leaders achieve goals."
Second, I read somewhere that one method of psychological torture of POWs has been to convince the prisoner that if they behave a certain way, then they will be rewarded. As soon as they exhibit the behavior, they are punished.
Constantly changing the rules is a form of torture.
5
It’s really fairly simple. Trump is not well informed on the issues. Why not? He doesn’t choose to inform himself - to do the required reading, research, and basic work any competent leader understands must be done. But since he must say something on legislation and issues, he opens up his mouth (or Twitter feed) and expresses ideas based on random things he has heard someplace, personal prejudices, theories floated by politicians decades ago, or just stuff he thinks will get him attention.
It is also important to understand that virtually everything he expresses is negative. “This is bad, this must be repealed, this is the worst, this is a disaster, etc.” Tearing things down is easy, and is not leadership. Basically, we have taken that guy who sits on a barstool all day nursing beers and railing against the world and made him president.
13
Interesting, I have often thought of this president as that same loud guy at the end of a bar pontificating on the state of the country, and blaming everybody around for the crisis. Yes, indeed, this country pulled this fellow off his bar-stool and brought him into the glare of the sunlight and cameras, and along with the light came the reality of his life, now and in the past. What have we done to ourselves? The true believers, according to statements published by this paper a few days ago, showed once again how gullible, willing and easy it was for some Americans to to jump off a cliff. Tragic, really.
3
Ryan is to blame for not giving last week's bill to Trump. If his professed fear comes true and Trump vetos it, well that's entirely on him. Win win.
2
Time for a third party in the United States. We need a center party that is fiscally conservative(not reckless) and socially liberal(not reckless as well). The leaders of the Republican and Democratic parties have become too radical for a person who still sees merit in the other person's argument or who simply wants to do something for the common good. Who left in Washington puts country before party? Or better yet, can handle someone who disagrees with them without calling them a snowflake, bigot, racist, and the rest of the usual terms? Term limits first order of business as leaders have been there too long and now are career politicians. Second order of business is to restructure campaign financing and put time limits on campaigns. Clearly big money has too big a say in things and it feels like we are constantly in a campaign.
7
And where is the radical left that some keep tallking about? It might be my imagination, but all I see from my left leaning perspective is GOP folks willing to eliminate CHIPS and send dreamers back to counties they never knew, really. The GOP was high-jacked not by moderates, but by folks who followed the Bannon and Trump approach to government, willing to explode all traditions and institutions along their way. These are very troubling times. Margaret Atwood, who wrote the Handmaidens' Tale, looked into the future and saw the beginning of dark times in our politics. Creeping gradual elimination of certain constitutional protections and respect for our nations institutions is what might be coming to main street, USA.
Trump is like Lucy with the football in the Peanuts comic strip — constantly pulling the ball away from Charlie Brown as he tries to kick it. Congressional Republican need to STOP paying attention to whatever Trump is tweeting about a legislative proposal at any given second. They need to ignore Trump and just sit down with the Democrats, negotiate with them, and then pass the bills. Trump will NEVER veto a bill that has Republican support.
3
The art of the threat: my way or I pull the pin on this grenade on my vest. Four -- or five -- business bankruptcies. Survivors are offshore predators with binocular vision.
1
The GOP is just cramming their priorities for the 1%ers and the wealthy down the throats of Dems and Americans. They are not even trying to negotiate when the time is appropriate. Trump does not seem to have a clue about the legislation until he meets with Congress and then he changes his mind every hour as he checks Fox. The GOP clearly is unable to run the government effectively even when controlling all of government. While, the GOP is pretending like the Dems will be responsilbe for the shutdown, they will be held responsible by Independents and these are the only people that matter. This will be the first time that the government has not been able to pass a budget under a government controlled by one party and their leaders continue to send mixed messages and sow confusion. Their lack of leadership is the primary takeaway.
3
The art of the deal, according to Trump and as embraced by Republican leadership, is a zero sum game. Compromise equals defeat, therefore one can only win if the other side is bullied or conned into making a deal in which they receive nothing. This is why Trump appears to be negotiating against himself. At each turn of the negotiation he calculates whether he has won or lost and, more importantly, whether the opposition has gained anything. If they have, he scuttles that part of the deal. In the end, if he finds that he's been backed into a corner from which he cannot escape without making concessions, he simply reneges on everything and, if necessary, files for bankruptcy. He loses nothing and gains nothing but, again, most importantly, the opposition gains nothing and most likely suffers financial losses. This has been his MO throughout his business career, and it is the approach he promised to bring to governing the country.
The Republican leadership has consistently doubled down on this approach, in the process destroying any trust between the two parties and employing a political cynicism that is breathtaking in its scope and audacity. With control of both houses of Congress and the presidency they have set about dismantling the progressive agenda without so much as a hint of negotiation or compromise. Now that they need the Democrats to support the spending bill, they accuse them of being obstructionist for refusing to give away everything. Compromise? Never!
4
in a strange, and infinitely sad way, the election of Donald Trump and congressional Republicans majorities may be what many of us, particularly me, needed to jolt us out of electoral complacency. Mr. Israel's brief, but excellent, summary about the make-up of Congress and the legislative process provides context for our current legislative dysfunction, and a path forward; i.e. pay attention to politics at the local, state, and national levels and vote.
8
Having Trump "negotiate" in bad faith worsens the situation to the point that nothing gets done.
4
It's not a "functioning government"; it's an intellectually lacking lying narcissist in the WH and a party with no soul, empathy, or conscience that is willing to lie about anything being whipped around by his every word.
How can there be trust when there is no good faith? Their aim is most decidedly NOT "of the people, FOR the people, by the people"
18
As always, the NYTimes takes a complex issue and blames Trump, as if we have not seen this sort of behavior at other times under other presidents, on other even more important issues than the budget per se. This is what happens when one loses all sense of even recent history in order to continue to push a narrative. It's what make all of us who support neither side right now all the more frustrated ---this silly notion that somehow it's the other guy who really stinks. Meanwhile...the Republic sinks
4
I don't know. It worked for Republicans. They shut down the government. Then they win elections. Go figure.
8
One word: gerrymandering.
8
There is no possible way a nation can survive being governed by the installed full-blown incompetent autocratic traitorous lying lunacy that is dump and the GOP dumpsters. Deep crisis is surely on the horizon and when it hits there is simply no one in charge. I hope somewhere, behind some closed doors, our leaders of the past are gathering and creating the emergency plan wherein they all step back in to take charge and lead us out of the swamp - at least temporarily - until we can collectively gather our wits and maybe the nation back together. Or not.
4
Compromise, these days, sounds like a process that gives you the choice of the Electric Chair or Lethal Injection.
2
This is what happens when uninformed Americans vote for a person with no proven track record of being someone trustworthy.
So what else would one expect from a man who listens to no one besides himself, doesn't play well with others, and has a history of driving his own businesses into the ground or bankruptcy?
Donald Trump clearly doesn't know, or care what a government shutdown means as long as he gets his own way and a weekend to go golfing at Mar a Lago.
This is what you wanted, America. Get used to it.
14
No this is what happens when you put up a canditate with a proven track record of dishonesty. Thats why i and many would not vote for her.
Reality TV.
Somebody: "a canditate with a proven track record of dishonesty"
You must have meant "him"
This is really simple, act as if Trump does not exist. He will never veto anything, he is a wimp.
6
Perhaps our elected representatives should try to give the people that they are charged with representing actually want rather than trying to balance the various competing slices of the plutocracy that fund their campaigns with an eye to a post electoral sinecure. Hopelessly pie in the sky I know but one can hope, eh?
2
I believe the purpose of any process, legislative or personal, should be to work toward a resolution of the issue at hand, but was once engaged to a person who made every issue, whether mine, hers, someone else's,only about herself. Her self-referencical focus might have been tolerable if she remained consistent in her approach to a specific issue, but she delighted instead in often switching sides in the midst of our disagreements, which made resolving them impossible. It soon became apparent that the point of her behavior was to keep all attention focused on her and on her perceived needs to the detriment of mine or of anyone else's. Republicans in Congress have exhibited a similar psycho-dramatic symptoms for years--e.g., Democratic deficits are bad or destructive, Republican deficits are okay or simply irrelevant--and now we have a President for whom self-referncing psycho-drama appears to be the whole point of his own, and this administration's, existence. I was able to end my unworkable engagement, take back the ring and walk away. Would that it would be that easy for our country.
3
Republicans should stop whining. They have the power and can't seem to get out of their own way. Or is it that they can't get out of the way of the monster they have created in Trump? Maybe they're finding that the Art of the Deal, bomb throwing to get a "better deal" has an effect on their ability to negotiate their draconian agenda too. He's not only untrustworthy he's impulsive and erratic. Maybe they have been obstructionists for so long to stop progress they don't know what they stand for anymore. OR...maybe they do and there are no more shared interests. They may have sidelined Bannon but they still believe in his plan to take down the administrative state. Today it's healthcare for children or DACA. What happens the next time North Korea rattles Trump's cage? Maybe this is how the greatest failure of an American presidency unfolds.
2
I look forward to seeing the Republican party swept from office in 2018 mid-terms.
9
It is beyond belief that the country has been brought to this precipice again. But this is not about the president. This is about what every member of Congress believes is his or her duty is as an elected official and your obligation to the country.
The president can spew whatever rubbish he wishes and attempt to subvert any negotiation. But it is the Legislative branch that has the duty to adopt a budget. If there were enough members of Congress willing to set aside their party allegiance, we would have a budget and we could have a functioning government, in spite of the foolishness in the Executive.
The real breakdown lies in the fact that personal ambition has superseded the best interest of the country. And this permeates both sides of the aisle. We need to have more members of Congress willing to negotiate and compromise with one another (in good faith) at the risk of losing their elected office. The alternative, after all, is you keep your seats and we all lose our country.
6
There are bipartisan bills such as that by Durbin and Graham. Do you think Trump would approve of any that doesn't appeal to his racist base? He proved last week that he is intensely racist in regard to immigration, and has also proved that he prefers white supremacists ("very fine people") and Putin to normal Americans.
Let us not make a math problem out of this. Trump is a charlatan, a swindler and a crook and he and his cronies are totally responsible for where we are and what he has brought us.
4
More the gop and dem party are to blame for the candidates offered to the voters.
1
Republicans are responsible for this crisis, bluster and script. Contrary to his boasts, the president is no deal maker. Compromising and negotiating in good faith are qualities that are unknown to him. The Republican party was entrusted with the entire governmental apparatus in November 2016 and have done nothing since to reward American' faith in their government. The president and his party are solely responsible for the logjam on Capitol Hill.
3
What Ryan and McConnell are doing is extortion-not negotiation.
3
In the end trump seems to make everything about himself or at the very least that he is the central focus. I have been reading the commentaries of his supporters in this newspaper (‘Vision, Chutzpah and Some Testosterone’
JAN. 17, 2018) and we have good reason to fear for the future of our democracy.
4
The more interesting and basic question here is whether or not democracy is a viable form of government for human beings. It appears that societies evolve but more accurately revolve into more or less at times socialist/Democratic and authoritarian/religious forms of social order. I wouldn't call it government, rather social order because kingdoms and klectocracies, or socialist/Democratic forms of social order can all be taken over by oligarchs. It appears that the ruling factor in the evolution of governments is the power of a few with the money. Even in our country the people who originated the idea of our democracy with the financially powerful, although they had the naïve notion that others would not use their wealth against the masses. I just wonder if democracy can actually exist over a long period of time, without some corruption of the system – usually by monied interest. Power corrupts absolutely and absolute power corrupts eventually.
Stop trying to involve the man in the functioning of government. He has no clue. But he loves signing things. Look at his signature, for goodness sakes. Put some cameras in the room, and he will sign anything that's put in front of him. He doesn't read, so you don't have to worry about him knowing what he's actually signing. So just ignore him. Work out the details, put it in front of him, and he'll sign it and find out what he signed later on Fox News.
9
Every time I read another story about Leader Pelosi, I’m impressed with her intelligence & political savvy. We’re lucky to have her representing the City in Congress. Well played, ma’am!
3
Totally agree. Nancy Pelosi is a force to be recon with. I am really aggravated when I hear or read unfounded, negative criticism of her. Republicans might insult her all they want, but I am pretty sure the GOP would like to have somebody as intelligent, savvy and classy as Nancy Pelosi on their side.
She has demonstrated many times over that she can get us through moments of crisis by sheer determination and I do support her 100%. You go girl !
2
Some conservative men I work with seem obsessed with Nancy Pelosi. They spend way too much time complaining about her. I wonder why.
I think it's clear that Trump prefers to manage and govern through chaos--this CHIP issue being only the latest example. (This paper's own Maggie Haberman calls him the "chaos president"!) In the early days of the Trump White House, three factions competed for influence and control (Reince Priebus; Steve Bannon; Jared Kushner and Ivanka Trump). Now that General Kelly has removed competing factions within the White House, we see the chaos pattern repeating itself in the way that Trump interacts with Congress.
By creating chaos among his subordinates or in Congress, Trump retains power and the attention stays on him. He appears to want little else.
2
So the world's so-called #1 deal maker and source of the"The Art of the Deal" sabotages his own party, which is pretty craven in its own inherent intentions, during negotiations with democrats. This should tell you all you need to know about Trump and today's GOP who make goof faith negotiation nearly impossible.
2
Trump's business model relied on lawyering up and defying government and his business associates to stop him. You evidently could rely on him to break contracts, promises, common sense itself. So he hasn't changed his personal model. Why should he? Being outrageous works perfectly. Everything is about his current reality show and his ratings are on the rise. Up 6 points. So who cares if the audience is suffering? Not Trump's problem, not Trump's world.
1
Trump, of course, thinks he's the best negotiator ever! By far! What a disaster this government is; I just hope we survive.
1
There should be no question that avoiding a government shutdown should be done with a clean bill. Playing hard line politics on this issue just validates the notion that we are being led by a very large group of 13 year olds.
To even suggest that Nancy Pelosi is somehow a grand negotiator is pure political fantasy. She has one agenda and that is to advance her liberal/progressive agenda and lead the country to the same fate as her home sanctuary state of California. NO THNKS TO THAT!!!
How could anyone be expected to “trust” a President that has outwardly lied over 1000 times on record since his inauguration, a vapid, poison habit that has been so easily adopted by Republicans in Congress and the Senate? Democrats have done nothing material to not trust they say what they mean. You may not always agree, but they don’t treat the people with the undulating disrespect, they are not cavalier know nothings on Foreign Policy or most frighteningly war. For now finally, after 37 years of complaining and running for office on lowering the debt, they borrowed $1,500,000,000 to give 83% to 1.09% of the country.
Better add three more zeros.
Is it truly about trust? Or is it more about shared interests.
When Im driving on the highway, I dont trust the other drivers...I just expect we all share the same interests of moving in the same direction towards our various exits, and doing so without banging into each other.
Now when it comes to Trump. I wouldnt trust him to watch a stuffed animal.
But hes always been like this...and now that there are really important issues on the table, and there are parties with their own interests - other than his - surrounding him...hes getting spun around all day long. Last person in the room with him is his latest opinion.
1
Maybe I do not understand the way these things work, but as a liberal leaning independent, why not accept the CR with the CHIP extention thrown in, and then let everyone know that if DACA is not addressed in the next CR the Democrats will not support it. This way the Republicans can't say that the Dems voted against a continuing CR which includes CHIP, to shut down the gov't and you can have DACA solved (hopefully) in 4 weeks. Then the Repubs are the bad guys if they do not include DACA.
Politics is the art of the possible; what we are seeing is not politics, 'politicking' instead, a scary swamp where politicians are trying to avoid being swallowed by their own stupidity. Trust in achieving people's needs and wishes, by thwarting needed compromise, is gone. During Obama's years in office, republicans in congress had a single aim in mind, obstruct any and all proposals, even if the original idea was republican. And now, they seek compromise with democrats to avoid shutting down government. Ironic, given that the G.O.P. controls all three branches of government, obstructing their own goals. Much of the conflict right now stems from a wishy washy con man in the Oval Office who has no idea what he's doing, shooting his own foot in the process. This 'most stable genius' is as confused as ever, unscrupulous and irresponsible, nasty and vengeful in trying to stick it to whoever comes close, scapegoating right and left...under the false security of his own irrelevancy. The current government is not functioning, it's shutdown will merely confirm it...and likely allow a short time of peace and calm from Trump's malfeasance.
The only aspect of business Trump understands is bankruptcy.
1
Trump's incompetence and his deliberate undermining of trust is not what is driving an imminent government shutdown. After all, Trump was not part of the earlier shutdowns, near shutdowns and threats to shutdown the federal government. Sure he recently wrecked efforts to reach a deal, but the real failure is the Republican's desire to make the federal government fail.
It should be obvious to all that Republicans have a take-no-prisoners, scorched-earth approach to politics. Children's healthcare is a ploy, and ultimately, a pawn to be sacrificed; Dreamers are a card to be played, and ultimately, discarded.
Republican politics are all about acting. They are Oscar winning performers who can convince the person they just spit on that it was a Democrat who did it. The master of "The Art of Mugging and Blame" is Donald Trump. For example, he took away DACA, claimed he has "great love" for Dreamers, says it is up to Congress to save them, tells Congress what he wants, then kills their efforts and blames Democrats. Give him an Oscar!
But the real rub is that the people who Republicans kick, punch bite and spit on, believe what Republicans tell them. Much of their success is due to their propaganda outlets like FOX and Fools, Hannity, and their evangelical "Christian" true believers. Democrats are unarmed; they only have truth and reality on their side, but both are now the latest victims of Republican mugging.
May as well have a good shutdown now. If not now, it will be soon.
The Republicans, thinking they have a savior on a white horse, have attempted to govern, along with a dysfunctional White House, without really including the Democrats, only using them in as part of their carnival side show. Trump, the dysfunctional leader, is doing the same with the Democrats and shooting himself in the feet (yes, those with the bone spurs) with his idiotic tweets that shift his position hour to hour.
Now, the Republicans and President Dysfunction find themselves really needing the Democrats, and from all appearances, the Democrats are not willing to be used as side-show exhibits, so, the "president" and the GOP lawmakers find themselves boxed in.
What will they do? Unhitch themselves to the dying star called Trump and work for the good of the country (which they have failed to do for years), or, allow another costly and disruptive government shutdown.
It will be interesting to see who blinks.
Negotiations must establish agreed upon, measurable performance goals as well as mutually acceptable methods for validation of fiscal and programmatic costs. These senators have no clue what accountability requirements mean or how to implement them; then throw in perverse incentives and knuckle headed ear marks, and the negotiations cease to be negotiations and become gambling by another name. The only thing for we the people will be more uncertainty and tax dollars down the drain; and we still will not know whether the programs are any good, or not. These negotiations are poisoned from the get-go.
The Republican problem seems to be the inability to address the rogue (pace SP) elephant in the room.
Article 1 Section 9 clause 7 says: “No Money shall be drawn from the Treasury, but in Consequence of Appropriations made by Law; and a regular Statement and Account of the Receipts and Expenditures of all public Money shall be published from time to time.”
I don't think they meant every 6 to 8 weeks. April 2009 is an important date in US History, that was the last time a Annual Federal Budget was signed into law.
I believe Mr. Israel you are/were part of the problem. It's 435 people v. the entire US population.
435 people randomly selected could have gotten it done the way our founders directed.
1
Spot on.
To quote my dear deceased Scottish grandmother:
"You can trust a thief, but you can never trust a liar."
2
"What, me worry?" After several days of dropping "tweet" bombs at the congress, Trump is off to Mar a Lago for some well earned r&r. He's created so much chaos--- he must be exhausted--- And now he's setting up the Democrats to take the fall for a government shut down. He knows he creates the daily narrative for the media, and he is all but certain his base will believe any and all of his fictional fabrications.
2
She is radioactive for reasons that escape me, but Nancy Pelosi is hands down the best legislator in my lifetime. She knows how to get it done.
1
Just another step along the Grover Norquist road to "drown" government. Whether you want to call it corporatism, plutocracy, anarchy, fascism doesn't really matter. None of it is good. Transformation is needed but toward light and justice, not more darkness and corruption.
After monkey-wrenching this legislative process, Trump will sue the Congress for damages he caused.
The only thing one can trust about a chameleon (or a used car salesman) is that they change color---and change in a hurry depending on the situation. No conviction in bait & switch, and even less in the flat-out lie.
Sideshow Donny and his Legislatve clown car of cronies will be discovering very soon that they made a serious miscalculation with the infantile games that have been played for the last year, especially the useless excrement they shoved down everyone's throats they term "tax reform," just so they could say they accomplished something. And that wasn't even an accomplishment given they were unable to pass it without abandoning proper protocol, and taking hairsplitting ethical liberties.
But hey, they had to do SOMETHING, because the one thing they CAN'T do is govern. Right now, the Legislative body is so impotent that they can't even perform the function the Constitution set out for it, namely to be a check on Executive power. So it should surprise no one if the funding spigot is shut off for a while. The litany of previous close calls this essay lists were based in nothing more than vitriolic tantrums aimed at someone that could govern circles around them, without ANY of their support, and they all privately know it.
A Republican majority across the board, and THIS is what they have to offer? Keep all this mind if the Senate collapses on this too, and the Repubs, in their never-ending wisdom, blames this on the evil Democrats.
The American government has turned into thieves. Let it shutdown. Punish them like the criminals they are. The energy will slowly disperse preventing an all out revolution which seems to be building rapidly.
The surprise is, that the Republicans have been caught off-guard by the unhinged behavior of our unhinged president . . .
Are the same people having “ignorance privilege,” (twitter Trump for sure) as a claim against learned and conscious compassion? Are those that are supporting Trump and GOP generally living under “ignorance is bliss” or living based upon fear of a misinformed or an ill informed narrative? And is having faith or a religion an excuse?
Funny that you should chose a picture of Nancy Pelosi to illustrate your article. I just read in the Washington Post this morning that she is going to be a guest judge on 'RuPaul's Drag Race All-Stars.' And you lament a "breakdown in trust" of our government?
My problem with this is not that she is on TV judging drag queens, but rather that she is on a TV reality show in the first place. This says something about us as a people, including Democrats. It says something about our "leaders."
Trump is now setting the tone in this country, whether you like it or not. It's now ok to lie, to stiff the helpless and the poor, to avoid responsibility, to hang out with porn stars, to insult people with abusive and indecent language, etc. The Democrats don't know what to do with it, or where to put it. Because the media is eating it up to sell headlines and to provide "click bait."
Consider Robert Mueller, perhaps the last real hero in America. He is not cool, he is not hip, he does not hang out with Hollywood types. He's SERIOUS –– as serious as a heart attack. Our leaders used to be like this, especially the Dems during the thirties when they were putting the country back on its feet heading into WWII. Bernie got traction with a lot of people, as distracted as he could be, because he had a moral and ethical SERIOUSNESS that was aimed at the Kleptocracy that is behind our political decisions.
The Dems need a clear moral vision.
This makes no sense? How can it be? I thought Trump was a “stable genius” and “like, really smart”?
So the Democrats are willing to shut down government? Shame!
1
As thousands of contractors have learned, never trust Donald Trump.
2
I really do not care how many mental tests trump aces, here is proof positive he is unbalanced and unfit to be president. I believe he has no position or understand of anything involving his present job, he just says whatever the last thing he saw on TV was.
1
This is really political grandstanding. Both CHIP and DACA can be addressed - should have been - a long time ago. Had it been in the Obama era, they would not have seen the light of day at all. Now, the Republicans are calling all the shots. They can call the terms to their liking. Yet, they did nothing. For a long time. They are the ones holding both CHIP and DACA hostage. The Dems, as incompetent as they have been, can only use the only tool to push back. If they cave now, rest assured the Republicans and Trump will walk all over them for the next three years if not longer
What mistrust?
3
Part of effective negotiating is being able to back out of your shoes and move mentally to the other side of the table to understand what is truly non-negotiable. This cannot happen when the current GOP entities live in alternative universes.
8
Whatever they attribute to God is non-negotiable.
The individualism which built the US is now destroying it:
'Me first, me second, me only.'
8
Just as the map is not the territory the word is not the thing. Trust me! Trust, a group of letters, a word, a concept, a term, a value, a norm, a process, an outcome, and much more is many things to may people.It is time and place bound! What can/does "trust" mean in an enabled daily, toxic WE-THEY violating culture? In a reality in which alt-facts is a fact for many. And the consequences and implications of reality's dimensions of ever present uncertainty, unpredictability, randomness, lack of total control, no matter the types, levels and qualities of one's efforts is not considered.Not weighed.What can trust mean re elected and selected policy makers when not taking personal responsibility for words and deeds is the norm? When "copping out" becomes a career? What can/does "negotiations," often associated with "in good faith," mean within condoned amoral political operations, supported by complacent citizens, many of US evidencing signs of chronic willful blindness, deafness and ignorance.About words and deeds that shouldn't BE. And those which are so badly needed for creating and sustaining viable levels and qualities of equitable well being for all of US in daily, civil, menschlich life styles at home. In our neighborhoods and communities. In our streets which are more than just for walking. At school and work. Wherever we pray, time out and play.This article presented a case for blaming. Not a guide for creating and sustaining much needed trust or mutual respect!
1
Yes, Mr. Israel, trust is key. When the actors in our government betray the trust of the many legitimate stakeholders then the divide widens with suspicion and apprehension. A man's word used to mean something. His word was his greatest personal value that didn't even require a handshake.
Trump never wrote the art of the deal, which is why we watch him fail time and time again to negotiate any deal. With him, it's winning by any means and dirty trick. His word means nothing. All we have are his lies and dishonor. Can't make a deal with those.
5
I really think you have to separate Trump and his tweets from the whole negotiation process. Trump will sign whatever is put in front of him. He just wants to be on stage holding the pen. Republicans and Democrats in Congress would do well to simply ignore him. Work out the compromise, and send it down the street. Trump will NOT be seen as the guy shutting down the government. He just wants his face-time with the camera.
96
And sometimes he leaves the stage without having signed the bill! Just wanted to be on camera.
There is no trust between Democrats and Republicans in this day when our 45th American president is unfit for office. The art of the government deal - the functioning of our government - is dead as a doornail in the context of Trump and his Republican enablers
3
Congress has failed in multiple decades to pass the necessary legislation, why? In the Never Never Land of Washington, all Legislators are constantly funding their next run and so are scared to death of those nasty sound bytes, called political ads. You know those ads, dark with very scary music, X voted for Y, OMG! The Donors also have personal agendas which need to be enacted to continue funding.
Add to this the death blow of Citizens United and those Super Pacs where donors are hidden from view.
The money needs to be removed from the Election process and Legislators should have only one term, it was never meant to become a life's work.
Maybe then we can return to sanity and the Legislature can perform their job, to serve their constituents, uphold the Constitution and enact necessary laws.
3
Trump and McConnell, although not in collusion, did a good job of closing down government, making it look like the Democrats did it and giving it the alliterative name of the Schumer Shutdown.
The full responsibility lies in the GOP which controls all three branches of government, and, if the voters do not comprehend this, then they deserve the lousy show that is now entertaining them.
5
“Back in the day, there was a basic trust between interlocutors.”
Before the Republican Party went barking mad. Trump desecrates and destroys everything associated with him, the foremost example being the Republican Party. I’m a former Republican ready to do her patriotic duty and vote against Republicans at every opportunity and do my bit to stop them before they destroy my country.
5
The shared basis for basically everything seems to be breaking away in record time. Even unpredictable disasters seem to have become partisan and always hit blue parts of the country: Hurricanes hit blue cities, deadly wildfires in blue California, a faux atomic attack in blue Hawaii. If you follow right-wing commentary, people are actually cheering for this kind of thing as long as it happens to 'the enemy', i.e. Democrats. A growing portion of the people would honestly be fine if the others just dropped dead. Congress reflects this reality.
1
Trump clearly doesn't care about trust. That's obvious from his long pattern of stiffing creditors in his business dealings. He also clearly doesn't care about government. The key to understanding Trump is that he cares only about his own status, wealth, and power, and about being the center of attention. His outrageous statements and constantly shifting positions keep him at the center of attention. The outrage of the mainstream media and responsible politicians only pleases his base. He obviously doesn't care a whit whether this behavior cripples the government, damages the country, or destroys trust in the presidency both at home and abroad.
4
Nicely said, but the piece ignores the systemic cause: the country is too big and values are too disparate for a centralized federal government to compromise and solve problems. Red states absolutely despise blue states. They will not compromise on anything and will do whatever it takes to hold power (cf. Gorsuch). The entire policy platform of the GOP is "make liberals angry." How do you compromise with that?
1
There could be a silver lining if the government shuts down. No State of the Union speech where Trumpy will be self congratulating himself on his major accomplishments.
One can hope!
2
I don't think Trump understands the things he's "negotiating." Little by little, glimmers of awareness enter his brain, and he flip-flops.
Want progress? Take away his cellphone and keep him on the golf course.
1
Trust comes from dealing with someone who is honourable and honest; who firstly doesn’t lie, secondly doesn’t often change their position, and third doesn’t attack you publicly because you don’t agree with them. Honour is the keystone; it’s why British members of April ment are referred to as the Honourable member from...and why members of Congress are similarly labelled, although interestingly, not so often. Politics depends on verbal negotiations. You trust the person you deal with, but Trump has destroyed all this. He’s a liar and a cheat; his word is worthless; he says one thing one day and the next day the opposite. The Republicans have laughingly promised the democrats that if they vote for the budget, don’t worry they will adress DACA next month. That’s the key issue, and I don’t blame the Democrats one bit for not believing it for one minute. Trust and honour are dead, and so is the American political system.
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Jeff Flake voted for the tax bill because he was "promised" immigration reform would be addressed, how's that working out?
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"Trust comes from dealing with someone who is honourable and honest"
Then no politicians can be trusted.
If trust is necessary for the government do to anything, then we could have no government.
A functioning government would not require impossible things, like honest politicians. Our government works, to the extent it does, when run by a group of lying, scheming criminals. That is the only way it can work.
No decent person would agree to be a member of Congress, let alone President. So we have crooks negotiating with crooks. Thieves negotiating with thieves. But in between they do some useful stuff and a lot that is harmful.
Glad we are headed to a shutdown.
May I ask, WHO, in our Congress, would be the honorable, honest, truthful, stable and decent 'someone' you speak of? I like the British tradition of referring to members of Congress as "the Honourable member from...". I think it would be a swell tactic to use in our Congress. For one, it would remind members of Congress that their "honor" is at stake, and two, it would inform the people from wherever, of what their representatives are saying and doing.
When I was young, I was too busy with immediate life issues: family, career, finances. I became more aware of my state's "honorable" representatives, when they were resisting Obama for all the wrong reasons. I learned the name of "representatives" from other states, like Mitch McConnell, a right out racist, who played major influence in our government
Now, retired and with more time in my hands, I hound these infatuated scoundrels, appearing to represent me. (They don't care what I think.) An automatic note, thanking me for reaching out, appears on my email---showing no accountability whatsoever. However, they know that I know their names and where they come from.
I encourage all of you who read and exchange ideas to make it "your" business to learn the names of those "honorable" members of Congress who represent you and let them know of your approval or/and dissatisfaction. Knowledge equals power. You may appeal to their sense of "honor."
Shutting down the government is exactly what Republican-Conservatives have been wanting to do for decades, so I don't see why they'll seriously try to avert it now. As many of them like to quote Reagan's ignorant dismissal of government - "The scariest words ever spoken: Hi. I'm from the government and I'm here to help you", they ought to also remember another, even truer line: "You won't miss the water until the well's run dry".
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It's time for the Republicans to be the adults in the room, but they have no idea. what that means. They take all their cues from billionaires, like puppets dancing on strangling strings. The shutdown will be a huge mess, and the Republicans have no way out. They Senate will remove the House "figs," and pass a clean CR. This will be our government until the November election. It's only getting worse for the Republican party and all of their insincere faint cries about our valiant, brave, and grossly underpaid military is falling on deaf ears. None of them have served anyone or anything with honor, ever.
The whole idea of having Congress is to represent the people of our nation. One party is working almost exclusively against our interests. This essay helps to provide an inside view of the situation. Government is broken. Where do we go from here? What can we do to fix it?
This whole craziness reminds me of Joe Biden’s personal policy while in Congress: never doubt the other’s intention when negotiating policy. That is the basic trust the author manifests and that Mr. Trump has never possessed. His dealings were always with his interests first as any businessman, which does not applies to government. This is why Congress is broken. The GOP is catering the needs of a no-idea President while the Dems are battling their own leftist faction. They are all doubting their intentions to serve the US population as a whole.
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If Trump has done nothing else for America, he has given us daily civic lessons. How do we get back to the point where negotiating isn't a dirty word? How do we get back to the idea that negotiations isn't a sign that either side lost?
The whole idea of not passing a budget is like me telling my husband, "nah, I don't want to pay those bills". Only this time the consequence isn't mine, it's all my neighbors. We need more discourse to educate the public. Perhaps then we'll get a saner Congress voted in to office that truly realizes that their job is to represent and carry out the rule of law. Right now we are running on chaos.
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You cannot expect good faith if Senators divulge the content of private communications with the president.
What the Democrats do not understand is that this president may, in fact, want a government shutdown. He was elected to make government smaller, and shutting it down is one way to just do that.
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If one assumes, and there is plenty of confirming evidence, that Trump really doesn't care about or understand policy, why doesn't congress just get on with negotiating and passing the CR and presenting to Trump for him to sign or veto as he wishes. As the Senate needs 60 votes on the CR, I would have thought that they could muster enough votes to override a Presidential veto and if they can't, it will at least be crystal clear as to who has caused the government to shut down. Lets see him tweet his way out of that one!
Get-the-big-money-out-of-our-elections so we can elect moderates again.
I swear, how the court thought Citizens was good for the country is beyond me. When politicians are scared to death to speak their honest opinions in the primaries and then worried about how much they are able to raise each day and who is handing it out and for what price while actually working in Congress, things have gotten so far out of hand that we need to start over.
Hey SCOTUS, what are your considered opinions on do-overs?
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To recap, the GOP managed to pass a tax bill last year and confirm a SCOTUS judge as well as many other lower level people intent on cratering the government. This year they have taken cratering to a new low. The Dems are giving the majority party all the rope they need to hang themselves. The GOP have the right and the duty to do better but not the ability. November will not be kind to them.
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Let's not romanticize the recent past. The bad-faith partisanship in budget negotiations is fierce and unrelenting. I agree though. Most of the blame falls squarely on Trump's desk this time. The question is whether the proper blame will stick. There's a certain contingent within our population that won't hold Trump accountable no matter what he does.
Naturally, Trump will just blame Democrats. He's already started. Democrats will blame Republicans. They want to tie Congress to the President. Republicans will shrug their shoulders and say they tried. There's not really much they can do while Trump is in Office.
The true determining factor will be the outcome. The Obama shutdown was prolonged, painful, and largely pointless. The iconic moment everyone remembers is the National Park closures. However, the underlying unpopularity was actually economic. The shutdown caused real harm to many people's lives.
The Atlantic speculates Trump will leave the Parks open during his self-induced shutdown. I don't much see the point as mid-January isn't exactly peak season in most parks. Aside from more work for Rangers when the shutdown ends, the gesture is symbolic rather than substantive. School trips can still visit the Mall. Big deal.
The true question is whether Trump is putting the breaks on his own economy. Government spending has a multiplier effect. I doubt a shutdown is enough to trigger a recession but we're definitely going to notice the impact. Remember who to thank.
If this is how he conducts business negotiations, it's no wonder he owes everything to Russian money. The question is whether we want Russian money controlling our nation.
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The Republicans who have the White House and both houses of Congress can't get a budget passed. They are unfit to govern. No more continuing resolutions, not now not ever again. The budget is due when it is due and that is October 1. And maybe working a full week like the rest of us instead of Tuesday through Thursday would help Congress get their job done.
trump has no ideology other than whatever will gain him the most attention, and in the process stir up the 25% of the electorate who cheer at his every irrational move, who are also motivated by some damaged need to have an effect.
The demand for the wall isn't the issue; it's the excuse. Give him the wall and he will come up with another demand equally irrational.
With every unhinged antic our democracy sinks lower and lower. We have already plumbed to depths from which there may never be a return.
GOP, cowards.
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Successful negotiation aims for a win-win outcome. When Donald Trump negotiates, he aims for an "I win, you lose, and everyone knows you've been humiliated," outcome. He practices negotiation as a dominance game, not as a procedure for reaching an agreement all can embrace.
At this point Trump does not seem to know whether he wants a deal that humiliates Democrats, or to humiliate Democrats by offering a carrot, then jerking it away when they reach for it, and repeating the process until it's clear the Democrats have surrendered all their dignity, at which point he walks away from any deal.
There's a remedy available: passing a bipartisan bill by a veto-proof majority. Don't expect our blessings in Congress to avail themselves of that option.
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Unfortunately, instead of insisting upon a clean funding bill, the Dems are now seen as leveraging a deadline to accomplish extraneous matters. As a result, they are seen to be playing the same game as the GOP and will share the blame.
It could have been a clear demo of GOP ineptitude. But the Dems have again snatched defeat from what could have been victory.
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"An erratic negotiator"? His ideas seem to fluctuate from day to day, sometimes from hour to hour. He seems like a free-floating ego, untethered either to reality or to any form of consistent, persistent ideation. All that is fixed in his political universe are a few enemies -- the media, Obama, Clinton; a few nicknames for his enemies (which I won't repeat here); and a few words and phrases -- the wall, immigrants, Muslims, Obamacare, the deep state (meaning, apparently, any regulations to protect the environment and consumers). And this is the background against which Congress has to try to "negotiate".
What we're seeing isn't a breakdown in trust. We're being treated to "my way or the highway" politics where compromise is a dirty word. That may play well with your base but it plays out very quickly when it comes to effective government. Say what you will about the ACA, the process was open to the public and Democrats allowed Republican input in the process. Yes the GOP voted against it but they had a seat at the table and plenty of say.
The bipartisan plan that was presented to the President should be what is voted on. Compromise is necessary for a healthy democracy. If Trump wants to veto it and shut down the government that's on him and he'll own it.
Enough is enough. Do your job.
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Excellent point:
The bipartisan plan that was presented to the President should be what is voted on. Compromise is necessary for a healthy democracy. If Trump wants to veto it and shut down the government that's on him and he'll own it.
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http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2017/mar/16/luis-guti...
IRT ACA saying the Republicans had input is like stating that the failed committee inputs from the Dems on the latest Tax bill was involvement... This has been claimed in the past and has been stated as a bunch of Bunk... Yes there were technical amendments on the floor that were accepted but ACA remains and always was a Dem Law that was pushed through the congress before Scott Brown (R-Mass) could come to DC and cast votes against the passage. We are now have a situation where the Dems (Schumer) are holding the country hostage so Non-Citizens can stay? Good luck in November with that narrative... Parks close and Grandma doesn't get her social security check so we can have 25 year olds bough here illegally stay...Hmmm good luck with that...
"With a breakdown in trust, we can begin to trust something else entirely: that keeping the government open and functioning will be harder than ever."
I disagree with this statement. The breakdown in trust actually leads at least some of us on the outside to question the value of keeping government open at all. Seeing the amount of incompetence displayed by the GOP - who increasingly control all three branches of government (Executive, Congress, and the Judiciary with all the recent judicial appointments) leaves one to believe that we've entered a race to the bottom with little competence or individuals who are working on behalf of the Nation.
Trump negotiates like a bully. He believes that if he is impossible to deal with, others will cave. He thinks this is a laudable characteristic, only concerned with winning. He could care less about the policies involved.
At some point you have to not cave in the opposition to him.
This is not democratic government: it is tyranny. Trump and the GOP last year did not negotiate with Democrats on the tax breaks for the rich and corporations. They essentially locked the Congressional doors against them, created an unpopular bill behind closed doors with only lobbyist input. There were no public hearings; rules were changed to shove through the bill in a few days with almost no debates. Democratic representatives and senators represent far more American citizens in their districts and states than Republicans do. In a representational democracy, the lawmakers act on behalf of their citizens.
These procedures are not Constitutional. Where in the Constitution does it say that the majority of the citizens have no say? The Hastert Rule and the McConnell Obstruction deny most Americans--those who elected the Democratic members of Congress--their right to representation. They have no voice, and their votes do not count.
More than 70% of Americans want Dreamers protected; some 55% do not want this dependent on wall funding. This has been consistent: some 70 to 80% want Dreamers not to be deported which will begin to happen in three weeks due to Trump's callous and heartless move.
This is dysfunctional. There was a bipartisan plan but Trump lied as usual when he said he would sign it.
Negotiations are not one-sided, unpopular demands representing a minority. The GOP cannot govern, and Trump is cruel and clueless.
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You have identified the problem. It is Donald J. Trump. Unfortunately, as president of the United States of America, he is invested with enormous authority. His mercurial behavior reveals an unstable mind that is making a bad situation worse. Will the Republicans allow this man to determine the future of America?
Trump obviously wants a shutdown. We have to consider the possibility that he wants this because he is desperate to knock over the game board, knowing Mueller is closing in on him.
If the goal is sound governance, then DT is way off the mark. However, nothing we've seen so far leads us to believe that is his goal.
DT is the PT Barnum of the 21st century. His goal is to attract attention to himself, because that earns him money. That's how he spent his life, and that's been his MO since entering the White House.
When we recognize what the real goal is, we can see that DT's approach has been extraordinarily effective.
Trump stated he would sign any bill Congress brought to him to avert a shutdown. The Democrats have made it clear they want to leverage the situation to get concessions on DACA. That's poor policy and poor negotiating by the Dems. They will be blamed for a shutdown.
For almost a decade the GOP in Congress has been allowed to obstruct with impunity and be rewarded for it by larger majorities and silence if not approval of the press. The Republicans have gotten used to doing exactly as they please and not being accountable for any of it. Now they run the government and the GOP can thank the false equivalence of the media for much of their success. I don't know why anyone expects that Trump will negotiate in good faith or that the Republicans will make him. It is so much easier to blame the Democrats or both sides instead of calling a proverbial spade a spade. This is a mess the Republicans have made over many years and it has been rubber stamped through false equivalence by a weak media.
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Cross your fingers after President Donald Trump was voted in. Now it's cross your heart not to stay silent as the President would like the Media to do. There must be a reason for the 21st century and the advent of the Internet and World Wide Web and social media is on top of the list Trump would like to eliminate among freedom of speech. Except for Trump and his billionaire oligarchs. Now is the time cross your fingers and cross your heart and the sign of the cross.
If our so-called president is unable to decide what he wants and prevents congress from agreeing on a feeble compromise to keep government open, we may be facing an even greater problem in getting government back open again once it shuts down. Mr “Dealmaker” wouldn’t know a negotiation if he tripped over one and can’t be convinced that he is a mere clog in the machine of government function. The current situation has been predictable since the election travesty a year ago and it was only a matter of time before a tantrum would hold the American people hostage. Beyond sad.
Trump's out of the blue attack last week of the FISA Act was telling.
Trump only associated FISA with his own fantasy about being wiretapped by Obama.
This was important legislation so Congress and WH staff saw fit to keep him uninformed and removed ; or he was informed and engaged but completely dismissed Congress and WH staff in the end without any advance notice; or he was informed and engaged but simply forgot what had been agreed upon while watching television.
All of these scenarios reveal a dangerous dysfunction and unfitness, and Trump's GOP enablers are kidding themselves if the think the American electorate and communities around the world are not alarmed.
This much I know: I’m sick and tired of this chaos.
Our government is not working; thus, this beautiful ideal of democracy is suffering. What happened to the concept of a nation by, for, and of the people? I don’t get the impression that our chosen leaders have our best interests in mind at all. They each look out for themselves and their "party" and they have turned the business of governing into a food-fight.
Another thing I do know is that although Trump is not a leader in any sense of the word, he has only been in office one disturbingly chaotic year. Many of the members of Congress have been there for decades, most for far more than a year. Obviously, this mess isn’t all Trump's fault—he has been a catalyst in recent snafus and dysfunction, his election a symptom of our nation's problems. He cannot negotiate, he will not compromise, and over-all he is simply a dishonest, mean-spirited, ignorant bloviator who is pulling the nation apart. But the cracks were already there—and they were hardly hair-line fractures.
If we can’t pull together as citizens, find some candidates for Congress who are honest and hard-working and interested in getting this nation back on track, we will be a failed experiment. We've got to clean house, starting with at least one of my Senators: Mitch McConnel, who has been an impediment far too long. And get rid of that festering boil at the top of the dung heap before he spreads his poison any further.
So the great negotiator will retreat to one of his golfing hideaways while the non-functional congress flails around accomplishing nothing in spite of all of its sound and fury. Is it fear, is it the price required to resolve the problems, or is it that there just isn't a tweet-able excuse available?
There isn't any further proof needed to show how false is the boast of negotiating prowess by the president. To negotiate is to try to reach an agreement or compromise by discussion with others. It appears that no agreement is intended?
Our great negotiator has removed himself from the process and retreats to his room to try to manufacture a reason for his failure to provide agreement and lay the blame on anyone else. This is not leadership.
Would delaying a solution and compromise to the problem solutions now be eliminated by a one month delay in addressing them? Not without compromise then!
Not even 'trust but verify' is a plausible strategy in this Congress. The Republicans were out of the majority for so long that their brains and hearts have ossified--become bricks.
Trump shall lead them back into the minority.
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Come on, Steve! There is no breakdown of trust in Congress! The Freedom Caucus has distorted politics in America for at least ten years. Before that, Gingrich taught Republicans to cease socializing with Democrats, and he taught them to demonize their D colleagues as the enemy. When a man, Gorsuch, can happily accept a nomination to a SCOTUS position knowing that there would not have been a vacancy had regular order been followed, we're not talking trust. We're talking something extreme beyond partisanship. And that is a massive effort by the moneyed class to cripple democratic institutions while they have a puppet in the White House. Read some more: like "Ruling the Void," "Democracy in Chains," "How Democracies Die," "Dark Money,"...
This argument about the "breakdown in trust" is the exact same one that the Republicans used several times in refusing to negotiate anything with Obama. At the time, I thought this "trust" argument was basically a ruse to cover for intransigence. And, I still think so. By citing a breakdown of trust, the hardliners can blame their refusal to negotiate on the other party. It implies a character fault in the other party. And it provides a partisan-ready excuse for using hardline tactics.
I would rather see Pelosi and Schumer accept the deal and save children's health insurance along with government operations. Instead, it looks like they will shut down the government in their fight to make America a better place for--those who immigrated illegally. The Dems are painting themselves as the party of illegal immigration, something they will fight for even to the point of shutting down the government. Good luck with that.
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A dominate theme of Trump and his base is drain the swamp. A dominate theme of the tea party and hard core conservatives/libertarians is less federal government.
A government shut down would help achieve these themes. How? By making it chancy that many government employees would actually get paid, they might decide to leave the government...get a job where one actually would get paid for their efforts and not have to deal with the uncertainty. And if Amazon pickles northern Virginia, they might go to work there.
The actions by President Trump that are described in this article are very sad. I believe they reflect his inability to lead or have a clear vision of what he wants to do. Instead, he listens to the last person to get to him, and it appears to be the tea party, when they realize he's been listening to the grown-ups in the room and they don't care for a decision. These are the people that want chaos, not compromise, so nothing is going to happen, and that is what they want. Trump doesn't care either way, has no understanding of what chaos will do to our Government and is just happy with his tax cut. It's every man for himself in this Government.
Republicans are at heart secessionists. They are contemptuous of national government.
With the purge of Rockefeller republicans from the party, the republican party of today consists largely of people who find their archetypes for political ancestors in the old south's democratic party. Same types of people, just a different political party. We can thank LBJ and Ronald Reagan for that.
LBJ spurred the south to abandon the democratic party by championing the passage of Civil Rights and, less trumpeted, his nomination of Thurgood Marshall to the Supreme Court. Those actions caused southerners to flee the party.
Waiting with open arms was Ronald Reagan, Trump's more "charming" predecessor and still the patron saint of all republicans.
In addition to his racist dog whistle attacks on the Civil Rights legislation and social change, Reagan began the GOP's undermining of the faith American people had in their federal government. Gingrich and today's various republican conservative caucuses are making the confederate secessionists look like patriots.
Republicans today are the secessionists of the 1850s and 1860s. Reading the conservative caucus demands going into the last several shutdowns, including the current fiasco, indicates that compromise now on nearly any social or political issue has as much chance as Jefferson Davis supporting an end to the expansion of slavery.
They will shut down the government because they don't support the federal government.
Negotiations begin with trust--it is a given that each party will uphold their end of the bargain. How does this happen when Democrats have been demonized, are told that they are the enemy. And the other party pulls the rug out from under you. Trust is the key ingredient. It appears to be gone, maybe forever.
The Republican side got their tax cut, and used it as a way to undercut social programs -- no matter what the law says, there will be no money to pay for them. Now they are "negotiating" the budget that is the instrument for that underfunding. The Democrats have been presented with a "take it or leave it" proposition that included an embellishment -- that is, funding CHIP -- that was supposed to make it look like something other than a doomsday machine.
Should the Democrats allow the Republicans to bully them into a situation that will disempower the people who support them (a/k/a the "popular majority")? I don't think so. It's regrettable that the Republicans are blaming their victims, but that's what bullies do. This is a wretched state of affairs.
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Republicans vote 90% inline with the President. I'm not sure how Democrats voted with Obama but assume it's similar. This is a continued trend up from the 60% in the 1970's. When the parties are this disparate, that leaves only 10% up for negotiation. Good luck getting anything done.
This assumes there is any intent, at all, at negotiating. There isn't, and hasn't been for a very long time.
1
It's a familiar plan from the Republican playbook:
"Look at this; no Democrat will vote for this! We'll have to throw something in that they want, something that we took away and they want back, something we can later neutralize. DACA might do the trick; it's complicated enough. CHIP is too straightforward, but we can risk it -- later we'll figure out how to de-fund it or repeal it. There! Now, they'll vote for it! And if they don't, well then clearly THEY are the ones who shut down the government, which proves that they don't love America!"
2
Back in the days that I negotiated intergovernmental agreement this article aptly describes the process. Only once during many years were critical shutdowns reached (actual lives and deaths on the line). During that crisis my boss's words of wisdom apply here "One cannot negotiate with a dishonest person. They will promise and lie and cheat to get just what they want and then not deliver on anything. Enter every negotiation from your BATNA (best alternative to a negotiated agreement) because that's where you'll eventually end up."
4
"What's a negotiator to do?"
It appears to me that Republicans need to be negotiating with "Fox and Friends" so they can inform president Trump what he supports.
16
Trump is a problem--a huge problem-but he is not the problem. The problem is a greedy, power hungry, shrill, theocratic Republican party that is using him to get what they want. He is beholden to them because they are protecting him from impeachment. What's worse, at this juncture they probably understand it's only a matter of time before the party is over (double entendre intended).
1
There can be no trust when there is chaos at the top.
Trump loves to operate out of chaos. The GOP will do anything to get their way. This is no way to run a democracy.
3
So much for the negotiating skills of which Trump has endlessly bragged. He couldn't negotiate a deal between 5 year olds, using bags of candy as bribes. That he could negotiate with the warring tribes of Washington is almost laughable, except the future of the United States is on the line. The Republicans are cannibalizing each other while the Democrats sit in the stands watching and eating popcorn. We all know the fate of third parties in this country, but seriously, our choices are limited.
1
Please don't pin this breakdown of trust on Trump. Did McConnell even "advise and consent" on Merrick Garland? How about the tax bill? Did the Republicans help with legislation under President Obama? This is not about Trump or polarization, which paints what is happening with too broad a brush, but about a broken Republican party.
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True, but there's a lot of blame to assign and Trump doesn't get to skate away from this as if it were another contractor he stiffed.
2
You cannot deny that the uninformed President in combination with a fractured opportunistic Republican party will continue to add woes to the health of this nation. Changing his mind and denying things, while there are tapes to show what he said a few days ago is what is driving both Dems and GOP members a bit off the rails. All this while the nation's citizens, except the loyal Trumpistas, look on in horror.
If this is Trump winning, then yes, we're tired of all the winning.
We must continue to speak truth to power, ill-gotten or poorly-wielded power especially. The idea that the NYTimes has written some pretty balanced pieces lately, for the apparent sake of balance (maybe in the hopes of sanity) is to give in to power, when you know it is not speaking truth to the people.
Thank you for publishing Steve Israel's piece. There seems to be so much anger that no one has an idea what to expect from government and no on seems to care whether or not government is functioning in a healthy manner anymore. Identity politics is muting actual political progress (progress through policy making).
4
If Democrats roll over on this they will be rolled over for the rest of the year and may well lose the mid terms. Trump is negotiating in bad faith and that will never change. Democrats should stand strong and say, "NO."
8
Before the end of the draft and before Reagan's calculated lie concerning the nature of government and how all problems could be traced back to it. America was the Biggest, greatest and most powerful nation on the planet. All others were weak and supinely recognized that the US outclassed them. Either as a world controlling empire or just having better phone service. Russia had,(as the USSR), long since allowed it's criminal; classes and the Communists to merge & breed, falling ever further into a tar pit like death, struggling to escape but slowly being buried in it's own ooze.
Since the end of even the old lottery draft, we have lost the ability to field large armies that include the educated of our population. The new re-confederation of the various states and areas of the US, is leaving us almost permanently in an early 19th century mode. We will, one day, possibly keep oil wells and gas fields only to supply primitive equipment for our military, and the biased ignorant .
If we become technologically dichotomous, it's so much easier to split up the nation along political lines: Oleophile,(oil love), states and peoples, will have little in common with all electric adopters. Recall that once almost no one had a portable "cell" phone. Now, it is nearly impossible to find anyone who doesn't.
If devices can change us irrevocably-so too can dangerously primitive technology such as hydrocarbons.
1
This is more than simply a need to compromise. There is a extreme right wing agenda within the Republican Party that is leaning so far right as to be frightening. this is not a time for nice compromise. The number of potential DACA recipients is inconsequential and Republican opposition is more than illogical. What is their hidden agenda? What will the bullies ask for next?
Who is really controlling this agenda among our wealthy 0.0001?? Trump, who makes his own right wing leanings quite obvious (would he object to totalitarianism?) is not the only problem. After all, wasn't it Senator Cruz and his band of merry men who shut down the government last time? Dems must take a real stand against Republicanism as their party leans so far right as to topple Democracy before our very eyes. Will we stand by and watch in disbelief, or do something against this tyranny?
5
We're all going to miss a functioning federal government and its now on its way to being gone. Since Newt Gingrich, decency in governing has been in a steady decline and now we have the indecent (more likely, criminal) leader in chief with his party backing him up. The only possible corrective is to sweep in new government next year, with, hopefully a lot of women and people who are taking the jobs to look out for the common good of the nation. This will be very challenging with all the money flooding in from wealthy funders with their own interests. We are at a dangerous tipping point in our democracy and we are moving into a period of complete dysfunctionality and incompetence that will hurt us all.
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... "indecent"... Exactly the adjective I've been using since the Access Hollywood tape was leaked.
1
Tipping point indeed. Or perhaps an implosion.
2
"Since Newt Gingrich, decency in governing has been in a steady decline"
There has nver been decency in governing. Indecent government started with government. Newt Gingrich had nothing to do with it.
Remember that the "decent" governments long before Newt used to return escaped slaves to their owners...
The GOP has fully embraced a zero-sum mentality, first championed by its radical "Freedom Caucus" cult, which is by-definition opposed to any compromise whatsoever. Our national politics has come to resemble nothing so much as the intractable standoff between Arabs and Israelis. And one glimpse at the Middle East tells us where that ultimately takes us. Meanwhile, the rich get richer, and the poor suffer. For now...
18
I think that what see is that Trump’s business deals, the good, bad and the ugly, were made despite Trump not because of Trump.
9
I am tired of seeing the media and then the public say both parties are to blame. O that there is enough blame to go around. Isn't it about time that we face the truth that starting with the T party movement and now the freedom caucus, that these people are too uninformed to govern. It is then compounded by the extremist leadership in the senate. McConnell has utilized every trick possible to appease his handlers. The extreme example was refusing to grant hearings for SCTUS nominee for more than a year. The result is a SCOTUS that is extreme. He can't be trusted to make a deal which is further compounded by Trumps misinformation.
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I don't think trust is the issue. The issue is a more basic problem. When you negotiate, you assume the other person has a defined and stable interest. He knows what he wants and wants to get it. Most of the time, Trump does not seem to know what he wants much less care if he gets it, since every day or every hour he wants something other than what he said he wanted the day before. And so here we are again.
86
Trump is like Indiana Jones -- he's making this up as he goes. What else can he do? He neither knows nor cares about these complex issues, and doesn't want to learn. He's just gaming till tee time.
3
Trust? Plutocracies don't need no stinking trust. They just need power. We no longer have a government. We have a corrupt, corporatist, paid off, gerrymandered, propagandized "board or directors" led by a maniac who flip flops on every issue three times a day. We have a ruling group that denies the truth about everything, lives in a fantasy world of falsehoods and lies, and adheres to failed supply side trickle down religion with the fervor of an ISIS fanatic.
Trust? No place for trust in that mess. We have fallen way beyond trust.
242
"The fact is that governing does require deal making, and deal making requires trust between opposing leaders. Negotiations can succeed only when all parties reflect their respective views, not when one party reflects multiple views. Per day."
From day 1, the administration put together by Donald Trump has acted like something straight out of "Alice in Wonderland" where up is down, down is up, and a loud, incomprehensible Queen of Hearts screams, "off with his head."
Sure you can't negotiate in good faith without some semblance of knowing that the next time you meet, the basic terms are still met.
But how can you negotiate a constantly moving target, where the head of the GOP has no notion of what policy acronyms stand for, how long programs last, and how much public support they garner from the American people?
138
President Obama was the last US President to sign an annual US Budget into law, that was April 2009, and that budget was actually put together by his predecessor.
So now Trump is to blame? Paul Ryan diligently sent the House Budget over to Harry Reid where it sat on his desk, year after year.
Now suddenly you folks think it's important?
So what you're saying is that the last time congress passed a budget, Democrats controlled both houses and the presidency.
I take your point, even though it's not the one you intended.
2
This is what happens when we have a president with only vague understanding of policy, poor impulse control, and a tendency to be influenced by what he heard last on TV.
274
We are at the logical end of what began under Speaker Gingrich, when working across the aisle/socializing with Congress-persons and Senators from the other side began to be actively discouraged - when the other party became demonized, and any compromises meant GOP'ers were working with devils.
This coincided with almost every single GOP'er signing onto Grover Norquist's anti-tax pledge, which states a GOP'er will never ever vote for a tax increase under any circumstance, and budget savings in one area will not be shifted to another area - such savings must be directed to 'debt repayment'.
The nation (and planet ?) were fortunate that Dem Nancy Pelosi was Speaker in the 2008 melt-down, so that she was available for Treas. Sec. Paulson (former Master of the Universe) to literally get down on one knee in the Capitol and beg her to get the Dems to pass a rescue package which not a single GOP'er would vote for - even though the financial collapse was occurring under their own GOP'er prez:
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/09/26/business/26bailout.html
What followed in the Obama terms were years upon years of GOP'ers faithlessly negotiating, constantly moving the goalposts during deal-making, tactics which Agent Orange from KAOS is currently showing don't work so well when the White House employs 'rabid ferret' (hat tip Gail Collins) techniques.
Things might get better when everyone absorbs these GOP'ers are a radical Wrecking Crew; they are agents of a Vulture Class, not builders.
371
Your historical perspective is right on target. I can only add that Gingrich did not only declare war on the Democrats, he also declared war on those Republicans who he believed were too amenable to making deals with the Democrats.
5
Well, they hate government. I don't know how you have a large nation without a large government, but apparently they are more than willing to try it.
2
the canny business man? Says who?
A Bankruptcy court just won't do,
Tells a Horse from a Lion
But no use denyin'
A POTUS with a wrecking Crew.
192
Larry-I was hoping you could slip the word extortion in there!
It’s not primarily a breakdown of trust, but one of shared interests. The worldviews held by congressional representatives are SO opposed that we’ve vastly narrowed the no-man’s land in which we can find productive compromise. ANY movement forward by EITHER side is perceived as a loss by an increasingly large percentage of them.
I’m entertained by the use of Nancy Pelosi’s image, as nobody still there has done as much to destroy a perception of shared interests in Congress as she has. Her tactics for advancing her ideological agenda since she became speaker were merciless, a constant frontal assault on the basic decency of everyone opposed to that agenda; and those tactics remain unchanged as she leads the House’s minority since 2011.
The most effective single thing Democrats could do to better advance their policy interests would be to cashier Nancy Pelosi.
Mr. Israel presents an apologetic, rationalizing view of Ms. Pelosi that simply doesn’t gibe with reality and history. History will record that the rise of the Tea Party and the consequent inability of Congress to govern for YEARS was the direct result of the excessive and polarizing antics of Nancy Pelosi and Harry Reid (retired former Democratic senate majority leader).
Republicans took it on the chin for the last government shutdown. If this happens on Saturday morning, Republicans will successfully tar Democrats as the cause, and that will be catastrophic relative to Democratic interests in the mid-terms.
33
History will be much kinder than Richard or most everyone else right now to the first woman to become Speaker of the House and the woman who to date has reached higher office in our country than any other woman.
I oppose hostage-taking and the use of government shutdown threats on either side, but it's the Republicans who made these "use 'em or lose" tactics in government.
Richard's alternative history is amusing; extreme polarization goes back to Gingrich, unless you want to take it all the way to the New Deal. And I'm sure we all feel so sorry for the plight of rich white guys since they had to endure the indignities of the New Deal and the notion that ordinary people might be entitled—I use that word quite deliberately—to a society that allowed them to obtain the basic necessities of a decent life.
However, I have to agree that it's time for Dems to have younger leadership that engages millennials, who contrary to media caricature are overall more thoughtful, ethical, and hardworking than my generation. Judging from my daughter and her friends, anyway.
Like it or not, politics is now a reality series viewed on a screen. Dems need to tell a better story. But knowing us, we will cluelessly allow some dull white guy to take Nancy's place.
68
Kabuki Theater Nonsense.
History will record that the Tea Party was hijacked by the Koch Brothers and was used to further their extremist views.
If the Koch Brothers and friends, like the Russian-backed NRA contacted their puppets in Congress and said the purse is closed, the “Freedom Caucus” would shrivel on the vine. Nothing happens in Congress unless the big donors want it to happen.
72
Most politicians who stay in a while are not too popular, so Nancy is not that popular, except the Dem voters don't want a popular leader, so she will suffer no backlash by showing resolve. Trump on the other hand is hated, and rightfully so. His intent is the destruction of democracy for his master Vlad. The brainwash that surrounds the GOP cult is very strong, but it only works on the FOX viewers. In short, most people won't buy your vilification of Nancy Pelosi. That's just and old tool that the GOP uses. They have always needed to create villains, otherwise they can't get their base invigorated. Hate is the thing that unites the GOP base. Well, that and the belief in magical things.
So what if Trumps base gets angry, they are always angry. It's kind of their thing.
16
This is a government of special interests, by special interests, for special interests, with an incompetent and erratic chief executive in charge of the process by virtue of an election that the better party should have handily won.
This is a two-party system in which both parties are each beholden to the same special interests, each to a different extent. One party has the unconditional loyalty of a brainwashed Fox News audience, while the other has been hemorrhaging voters who have been unwilling to abide by an increasingly corporatist party. The GOP has allowed itself to completely give into the corporatism that is on full display today. The mask is off. The pretense is over.
The way back for Democrats is clear. Resist. Show your voters who it is you are working for. Let the Republicans be seen for what they are: the proxies of America's oligarchy.
November 2018 will soon come upon us. No more triangulation. Let's resist this oligarchy!
--
https://www.rimaregas.com/2017/09/04/triangulation-when-neoliberalism-is...
291
Rima: Thank you for pointing out that both parties are complicit and both parties have contributed to the winner take all game we are engaged in. One can only hope that Democrats return somewhat to their roots, but with the money floating around out there , whether on Wall Street or in Silicon Valley, I’m not holding my breath: money has no party allegiance, until people figure that out we can continue the charade and the status quo will remain, as the elites from both parties are doing quite well. Thank you again for being a voice for reason and a return to a more progressive Democratic system.
6
And who are the Democrats working for? I think that's the question of the day. I don't trust most them to protect the interests of seniors, specifically, any more than I trust the GOP. I would trust Sanders, but, then, he isn't a Democrat.
3
What you're suggesting, Ted, is the political equivalent of bringing a knife to a gunfight. As much as I abhor it, Citizens United makes it absolutely necessary for Democrats to seek funding from any corporation that is willing to support Democratic values even if it requires a quid pro quo. The opposition is so well funded as well and organized that they are, on a national level anyhow, overmatched the minute they enter the arena.
1
The Constitution assigns political parties and party leaders no role to place in government. The Constitution specifies that all measure that come before the Senate except constitutional amendments, treaty ratifications and impeachments require only a simple majority. The Senate should ignore or override the “60 vote rule is necessary. If the stopgap spending bill fails, the ones to hold responsible will be the senators who vote against it.
14
Were you so quick to offer such a simple solution when the GOP was not in the majority in the Senate--remember, MMC words--every thing we can do to make "him" a one term president. Sounds like a tested strategy in the past, though I would agree it proved to be not a White House winning strategy.
7
The tyranny of the majority was one of the major concerns of the writers of the Constitution.
20
The Constitution empowers both houses of congress to make their own rules. So by your logic, they are following the Constitution in creating their rules, but you then want your political party to ignore the rules made as per the Constitution whenever it is convenient.
Or simply - rules are only followed when it benefits what you want.
4
The lack of trust that former Congressman Israel describes is due to the failure of institutions, particularly the political parties. The problem goes back to the Democratic presidential convention of 1968, which was a fiasco. It its wake, party activists formed the McGovern Commission, which took power away from party bosses and professionals to chose candidates and gave it to the people through a primary voting system. Since the most engaged and active members of the party participated disproportionately in the primaries, they selected candidates who were not inclined to make compromises. Over the years, these non-compromisers (my way or the highway politicians) became concentrated in the House and Senate. That is the reason why deals and compromises are hard to make today.
24
Diogenes - Curious why the problem is a Dem convention, with no mention of GOP'ers ? What about the 1964 GOP'er convention that produced Goldwater over Rockefeller, through the primary process ? Are Dems the 'non-compromisers' ?
71
Nice try. But this hyperp-partisanship was not evident in the 1970s, 1980s, or really until 1994. So the Chicago convention may have been a disaster, but it was the "Gingrich Revolution" that created this scorched earth, my way or the highway Republican coalition.
163
Don't know why he or she chose to focus on the Democrats, but it's a reasonable choice because it was the splitting of the Democratic Party between North and South over race that began the "slide" toward what we have today. I don't think it's as bad or as different today as many people do except that we have a President who is not trustworthy and deliberately so. Whether this is a good strategy in business I don't know, but it makes governing very difficult.
9
The Republicans with the exception of the recent DACA proposal made to Trump, don't appear to want to negotiate with the Democrats. They have repeatedly shut them out of the deliberative process and held closed sessions. Then gone on to pass bad legislation. Why compromise with someone who doesn't respect that you've earned a seat at the table?
458
Ann,
The Republicans in Congress are basically blueprinting what they have done in too many state houses. My way or the highway majority, "secret" Republican only meetings to advance legislation that throws red meat to their base (a religious test for health care providers?). They are furthermore taking the Federal Government down the road already travelled by Kansas (massive tax cuts without off-setting revenues or cuts in services)...we can only hope that Democratic voters wake up and turn out in droves in November (if we last until then).
5
Wouldn't it be fun to imagine that all the incumbents lists re-election in 2016? I wonder how strong that message would be to all those who participate in the dysfunction in our Congress. It is hard to imagine we could do worse. Members of the House and the Senate seem to have forgotten that their main function is to govern--simply put--and not simple prevent governing every chance that they get!
2
Ann: the Republicans have not wanted to negotiate with Democrats since at least the beginning of the Obama administration. What's new.?
2