Well, aren't we typical New Yorkers? Demand everything but refuse to accept the cost--human and financial--to get it. Condemn every new idea and fault every proposed solution. Pontificate on topics about which we are clueless. We're a perfect storm of know-it-all cynicism and negativity. We can only hope that Mr. Byford will plug his ears, ignore all the unsolicited advice and pseudoexpertise, and just get the job done.
7
The stickey wickets of nyc transit are gonna be tough for a guy who sounds terrific. I love the subways and hope he (a) cleans 'em up, (b) builds efficiency & efficacy into each route as well as into our motormen and our yards maintenance/mechanics staff, (c) joins with an elon musk type to rethink how the entire Woodlawn to Coney island to Flushing system operates, (d) buys cheaper & smarter buses and train cars; and finally (e) extends the Brooklyn lines and the Queens lines, as they were originally conceived.
Does Mr. Buford know that our same-party Mayor & Governor are shockingly at odds over any & every new proposal to save our city, simply to further their own greedy political ambitions and yet both are kowtowed to by the media and the voter and of course by the lobbyist? ...PJS
1
The man has good ideas, but will he be able to implement them given the unions and the price gouging by contractors?
4
What will he do about the Cypress Hills bottleneck on the J line? No express track between Broadway Junction and Cypress Hills.
Andy Byford has been amazing in Toronto. Keep in mind that governments love to build things and are loath to fun maintenance and repairs. Give this guy what he needs. He can be trusted.
They did that here in DC. They called it "Safe Track" and they inspected every inch of every mile. Result? A week after Safe Track, a train derailed on the newest line (a very new line). This week, a fault like the one that resulted in the multi-fatality crash in 2009 was found on that same line (hey - at least this time they found it). A lot of this is apparently the result of falsified reporting by inspectors but some of it is basic inadequate maintenance. So the shut-downs didn't really solve the problems.
3
New Yorkers may not be aware of it, but visitors from the far east now are openly contemptuous of the NYC subways as being filthy, out of date, broken down and not on time. And not sufficiently air-conditioned.
At a point when I needed a shower upon arriving at work after changing trains at the 59th Street station during the summer and New York riders told me that AC wasn't possible, I traveled through delightfully air-conditioned stations in Hong Kong. I read that A/C has now installed at Times Square and a few others, the subway stations in NYC are at the main hubs.
And the platform of the #7 station in Grand Central was paved with gum. And at street level, you could tell when you were nearing a subway entrance by the increased density of gum on the sidewalk.
After I moved to Shanghai, I realized that an entire subway line in that city was being built in less time than the 14th Street Stations took to be refurbished in NYC.
In my view, this lack of attention to basic urban infrastructure is a firing offence for both the Governor and the Mayor.
And yes, no future governor of Georgia ought to be elected without a specific plan to route interstate trucks away from Atlanta's one and only ring road.
In both cases, the cost of catching up will run to around $50 billion.
5
Net, TTC/Toronto Transit improved across the board on Byford's watch. Is it perfect? No. But it is much better than before he arrived. NYC/MTA is clearly a much bigger challenge; no doubt whatsoever that Byford will improve it, & the experience of the folks that use it.
Funding and a willingness to act is what we need, and sounds like Byford has at least one of those things. More people might have to learn that buses, ferries, and biking are all very real transport options, but this is necessary to fix a truly behemoth and dilapidated system.. what we really need now is a government that truly values public transport by putting their—in fact, our taxpayer—money where their mouth is.
1
No one wants to pay taxes in this country, and the result is decades of stalling critical upgrades in infrastructure, education, etc. etc. And the longer you put these things off, the more painful and difficult it is to fix when you finally can't ignore it any longer.
I've used the D.C., Paris, and Montréal subways and they are absolutely gorgeous. Coming back to New York after traveling to those cities, and I'm just like..."ew".
3
The transportation problem, exacerbated by the Bloomberg and De Blasio administrations, is slowly choking the economy of New York City to death. If nobody can get anywhere in a reasonable amount of time, the city will shut down and slowly implode. More unchecked real estate development (corporate and residential), without the capacity for the sidewalks, streets, subways, bridges and tunnels to handle the additional people, is what will lead NYC to become a basket case that will feel like Times Square on New Years Eve every day of the year.
Solution: Modernize the subway and bus system, crack down on illegal bicycling, widen sidewalks, build the additional tunnel under the Hudson that Gov. Christie canceled, get rid of on-street parking in the most congested areas, and don't approve every single real estate project just for the tax revenue (a lot of which is lost on tax breaks for empty storefronts and corporate incentives).
1
Buses, buses, buses! For every person who objects to closing the subways to fix them, I wish to remind them that, with political will (a big ask), we could convert our bus fleet into a Rapid Transit fleet to rival or at least equal the speed of the shut down trains. We need to think creatively rather than simply say, "No, not possible, it'll never work".
In addition, I urge the mayor to reconsider his position on congestion pricing, as well as his reason for opposing it. Far more of the economically disadvantaged people of our city will be affected by poor transit than by higher prices for driving. How many poor people does the mayor believe own a car? Less than 36% of households in NYC owns a car. Far more households cannot afford a car and are instead relegated to having to ride multiple buses to get to the closest subway so that they can get to and from work. Congestion pricing will raise far more money than a so-called 'millionaires tax' and it is a much more logical way to fund better transit. To incentivize the transition from car to transit, we need to both make driving more costly and make transit more affordable and effective. We can do this! We are New York City!
7
I agree with the improvement of the signalling first. This will maximize the current infrastructure while other plans can be made. Also, the improvement in the quality of service will be noticeable and give added credibility to the rest of the planned improvements.
Closing the L line is arguably the biggest, worst and least rail-duplicated project. Bringing that in on budget and on schedule - or faster - will go a long way to increase confidence in Mr. Byford's ability to handle the rest of the needed updating.
Two thoughts about aesthetics:
Where possible and practical, restore and enhance the once-beautiful tile work that graces many of the older stations and for which the subways were once famous. This would include burying new wiring in the walls, not tacking it over them, and improve pride in and rider "ownership" of the system.
And bathrooms? Yes, please! I remember the last scary ones when I was a kid, so they will need some updating, including improved security. But I believe that their return would be worth the cost.
Finally, can Messrs. Cuomo and DI Blasio declare a truce long enough to let Mr. Byford do his job? Couldn't hurt, would probably help!
3
Closing the subways from midnight to 5 am will disproportionally affect the working poor in NY - the service workers, nurses and care-takers, the maintenance crew and city workers whose days start in the wee hours.
These are the same people who have been and are being pushed farther and farther from subway lines and busses due to gentrification.
Not everyone can use taxis and Ubers to get to work, especially when that work is not all that lucrative.
Nighttime service is not all about nightlife and party people, it is also about the people who keep this city running.
13
Closing the subways when they are least used is the fairest and smartest way to do it. Of course some will be affected more than others, but the work needs to be done. Best to get it done as quickly and inexpensively as possible.
5
At those hours shuttle buses work well.
5
Call me cynical but I have been riding NYC transit since the 15 cent token and two fare zones. There have been countless saviors of our transit system brought in to rescue us and yet the more things change the more things stay the same. Now we have gone out of the country to find a John Wayne to ride in and rescues us from ourselves. We have a mayor and governor at each others throats about who should pay for improvements when everyone knows in the end who always pays. Solving our transit woes is little solving congestion getting to our Airports. Does anyone remember how "The train to the plane" was going to save us from the parking lot called The Van Wyck Expressway. I hope Mr. Byford didn't sign a long term lease on his new digs in the Apple because he won't be staying long. I guess they had to go beyond our shores to find someone willing to take this job.
8
The track for the train to the plane is still in place but inactive. There is a lot of unused system infrastructure that could have new uses if needed. Perhaps a new vision "from outside" could be an answer.
3
I’m for shutting down the system for a prolonged shut down rather than these weekends or late nights or mid day shutdowns. It just makes sense. Just setting up every night takes time. If they are able to pickup where they left off, or better yet work 24/7, the work will ultimately be done quicker and with a better quality result. We will be better for it in the long run.
15
I think if anyone can turn it around it's this guy, he sounds qualified. If he closes down entire subway lines he will draw the ire of us New Yorkers already exhausted with the incessant delays, but if it works I say do it. It will be so worth it in the long run. Good luck Mr. Byford.
14
All of this talk about closing lines for repairs ignores he fact that most lines, except at the extreme north or south ends, are three or four tracks. And all NYC subway lines have signal systems that operate in both directions. So, on a good portion of the system, it is perfectly possible to close down one or two tracks but keep the system running.
And buses are a very poor solution. The "A" train has been closed in Rockaway mid-day and weekends for a month or so. Buses are packed. And they have become a major traffic problem since Transit Authority managers say they can't make drivers obey the law and police are unwilling to issue summonses to drivers for the most basic traffic violations
5
Think about the delays and crawling induced by trying to work on local tracks while keeping express tracks open. It's a mess. The point about speeding work through more complete shutdowns still stands.
A more effective point might be to highlight that many NYC subway lines have parallel lines that, while inconvenient, can carry the load during weekend shutdowns.
As for shuttle buses, again, you are trying to use past performance to indicate future results. NYC has never seen a real night bus system, so you can't use the currently lousy subway replacement shuttles as precedent.
5
reporting from Toronto I can tell you there is nothing more dispiriting than a looooooong line of would be subway riders standing on Bloor or Yonge Street, in the cold and dark, waiting for shuttle buses to continue their journey while repairs are effected. and it is an all too familiar scene here in Toronto. maybe it's a fact of modern transit management but Torontonians are sheep. New Yorkers are not.
4
This isn't Toronto.
2
Shutting down certain lines at night to get work done is the only way to move forward.
Renovating bathrooms? Are there any still open?
Good luck to Mr. Byford.
4
In March, 2012, I was the person who told Andy's predecessor he was no longer the boss of the Toronto Transit Commission, and that Andy was now the boss. I am not alone in being truly gutted that Toronto is losing someone who grew tremendously in his role, and that New York better treat him well. :)
11
I like this idea better than the proposal to scrap overnight service during the week. The overnight closure was proposed as a permanent measure, or at least very long term one. Here they could work on a line 24/7, they'd have a strong incentive to get it back online quickly, and presumably the line would be better than ever when it returned.
5
All these commenters who dismiss closing down lines out of hand are unrealistic. You cannot repairs tracks and signals when there are trains running on them. Lines need to be closed, maintenance needs to be done, and replacement bus service -- plus services to transport riders to other lines -- needs to be provided 24/7. Better to have the pain be quick than suffer through frequent delays and breakdowns constantly for decades! Think of the L as the test-run.
25
First thing Mr. Byford can do is cancel the 539.5 million contract to build a new electronic fare system and use the allotted money towards updating the outdated, decrepit signal system. Updating the signal system would address the crowding (from the late trains) that the new fare system purportedly (and doubtfully) will help ease. Honestly, as a New Yorker I have yet to encounter anyone who wants the new electronic fare system before improved service, more trains, functioning escalators/elevators, and a brand new 21st century signal system. Personally, I would take more clean bathrooms over the new fare system.
47
There are tens of thousands of Toronto ex-pats hiding in New York. Andy, please call on us anytime for help translating between Hogtown and the Big Apple, or if you need someone to explain why NYC subway riders always block the doors.
Also, in my conversations with the natives here, they are so used to horrible buses and lousy night service that they have no way of understanding how a Blue Night system could work here. All NYC subways run with overnight headways of 20 minutes, often in practice much worse, which means an express night bus running every 3.5 minutes (like the Vomit Comet in Toronto) could well provide a comparable service on deserted green-wave avenues.
13
And, of course, nights and early mornings most streets in NYC are empty, like Toronto. Oh, I forgot to open my eyes and look at the traffic.
5
A night bus system would not work in New York and you oversell the Toronto one. You’re referencing two well-serviced night bus lines which run along the two N/S and E/W subway lines, which also happen to be main road arteries with no geographical encumbrances (Yonge st and Bloor st). There is no equivalent, cross-borough setup here.
Canadians generally run everything better than Americans, but transit systems aren’t one of them. The 24/7 subway service is a marvel of New York and replacing it with a “pretty good buddy” night bus service is a slice of Canadian mediocritizing that is (one of the few things) not worth importing.
3
Here we go with the New Yorkers looking to take down the outsiders. I've been here 20 years, which is long enough to know that traffic moves extremely well at 4 am, especially with those timed lights on some streets that Toronto does not have.
As for night bus being a perfect fit for New York, it may not be. Good point about the cross-borough obstacles; it could be the case that a weekday night bus system in New York could consist of some lines staying open (a la Chicago) with night buses supplementing. But I'm not overselling anything -- night buses can work, especially in a city where you can easily wait more than 20 minutes for a subway at night. And Canadians run transit much better than Americans, as any ridership/fare recovery stat will tell you for any peer-sized comp. I get your need to hammer Canadian mediocritizing -- that is a real thing after all -- but you're on the wrong topic.
5
"...focused on quick wins like cleaning subways, renovating bathrooms,..."
Bathrooms? You mean Canadians get universal health care AND bathrooms in their subways?
52
Bathrooms? Not many (very few stations have one) and frequently out of order. Andy did get some renovated and they are cleaner than they were. Still, as a system user, I don't expect to find a working bathroom and pity the train drivers who must depend on them....
Instead of looking in Manhattan, he should look for someplace in the outer boroughs (maybe Flushing) served by one line and a handful of buses AND he be docked pay when he is late for work. Then he can see how nonsensical it would be to shut down entire lines!
19
There were no battleships in the Falklands War. The nearest was the Argenine General Belgrano, a light cruiser. Previously named USS Phoenix, she saw action in the Pacific theatre of World War II before being sold by the United States Navy to Argentina.
The station in Toronto is Bloor Street, not Bloor Station.
1
Bloor-Yonge Station. But the image is great, since many New Yorkers are so self-centered they can't possibly imagine that a subway anywhere else in North America could be as crowded as theirs.
4
Well if he is already so important that he is prepared with makeup before an interview, he's clearly not going to be a public servant in the way the term used to mean, LOL.
1
Glad I had my fifty plus years here, but it’s time to sell and get the heck outta here. It’s just a big, overpriced mall without a roof anyway.
10
The subways get shut down all the time. What are you talking about? There was no service at my stop last weekend while the trains ran on the express lanes right past us. I've been dealing with shutdowns on the ACE for years - with zero noticeable improvement.
20
Shutting down whole lines is the right thing to do and won’t be half as painful as everyone seems to suggest. The hardest by far is the L train, which is already planned for.
Is there no awareness of how subways operate elsewhere? Commuters wait for the 6 at grand central to go one stop to 51st street, but in other cities (including Toronto) the distance between some express stops here is just THE distance between stops.
I realize this isn’t the case in other boroughs - Queens in particular - but much of Manhattan and Brooklyn could easily go without a whole line at a time.
7
Your comment makes absolutely no sense. You compared the distance from one station to another and then applied that to ENTIRE train lines. He's not proposing closing a single station! Lines run long distances, even in Manhattan.
1
NY State spends $2 billion a year on preschool for kids with educational difficulties.
But it can't come up with less than half that to fix the transit system for over 8 million New Yorkers?
This city has mismanaged the transit system and paying for it for years. It's a disgrace.
I don't know whether Mr Byford's ideas are good or not. But the need for this kind of closing and overhaul tells you there has been vast incompetence for a long time. Especially when you consider they managed to keep the subways running during both the Great Depression, and the NYC financial crisis of the 1970s.
11
The MTA, all of it, has a capital budget of a whopping $6.5 billion per year. It is rife with cost overruns, and nothing has been done to build performance clauses into its contracting. It is also chronically behind schedule.
Andy Cuomo, with his presidential ambitions, has concentrated on suburban rail over city transit. East Side Access for the LIRR to run into Grand Central, is already nine years late and 400% over budget. Originally planned completion date of 2013 is now put at 2022, and original budget of $2.5 billion is at $10 billion. And somehow it didn’t seem to occur to the MTA geniuses to include intermediate stops, particularly Queens Plaza, which might get rail commuters off the subway entirely, alleviating some overcrowding.
East Side access might alleviate overcrowding at Penn Station, but Cuomo is going to insist on adding Metro North trains into Penn, potentially making things worse.
Also, Cuomo has concentrated on cosmetic expenditures, like the development of the main Post Office into an entry to an unchanged track warren in Penn Station below.
23
One small correction: This "State," not this "city," has mismanaged the transit system and paying for it for years. It's a disgrac3.
13
Agreed - It's still 1915 below Penn Station.
9
There will be no solution that doesn't severely impact a large segment of New Yorkers. But in my opinion, eliminating 24 hour service will severely detriment the livelihood and culture of the city. Avoid at all costs. More plausible is the potential for shuttle buses and ride sharing platforms to mitigate the impact--but this will only be feasible with congestion pricing in a majority of Manhattan. Which probably should be implemented regardless, but that's a separate debate.
4
The MTA has neither the money nor the manpower to work on all lines overnight. They should concentrate all money and personnel on one or two lines at a time until the jobs are done, allowing overnight commuters to bypass work areas and still be able to commute.
22
good at incompetence and harassing riders
2
God speed!
6
1. Shutdown 6 line.
2. Increase 4/5 service.
3. Add dedicated bus service up/down Lexington ave.
4. Rebuild 6 line (signals and stations)
5. Finish the work on time and under budget.
6. Reopen when the work is done and all safety checks are completed.
7
Would need to shift the 4/5 to local. Many people don’t realize this, but the 6 train serves some of the most busy stops in the city - around 51st to 79th streets. 68th street is hunter college, without local service 10k students are going to crowd the other stations.
8
If you’ve lived in Manhattan long enough, how can you not be aware of the mass of humanity that use the Lexington line on a daily basis?
10
Concerned, numbers 5 & 6 require a whole new paradigm for the MTA.
2
Yes, entire lines should be shut down for extended periods, otherwise the job will take forever -- and we don't have forever to solve this crisis. Riders will have to make sacrifices, but the MTA must also do its part to ease the pain. Regular tandem-bus service should be provided along the closed-down lines -- around the clock, not just during peak hours -- and service should be beefed up on lines that can serve as alternate routes. And the state and city had better get serious about financing these repairs and keeping the work on schedule. Business as usual and a ceremonial appearance on New Year's 2049 won't hack it.
Good luck, Mr. Byford, your work is cut out for you.
45
I’ll welcome anyone who has the will to do what needs to be done to fix our transit system. In the end, most NYers will be happy too. Might I suggest perhaps shutting down the subway from 12am-5am when ridership is typically lower? That being said, any decision would hurt the poor and middle class the most- essentially anyone who does not drive in Manhattan and has late night jobs. I look forward to the balance he tries to keep when going about this, and hope that any decision has the least negative impact as possible.
15
They could shut it down 10AM to 3PM and 2AM to 6AM. From 10AM to 3PM, it's mostly tourists on the subway, right? I mean most 9 to 5 people are at work and 4PM is the shift change for most restaurant workers and concierges.
2
"shutting down the subway from 12am-5am"
Absolutely not, unless you mean one line temporarily for repairs.
To keep NY running, people work 24 hours/day, including everyone from ER nurses to home aides to bakers to busboys to people getting that cart to the corner to sell morning donuts and coffee to early morning commuters, to the people who drive the subway trains. How will they get to work if the system is shut down?
Most people who live in NYC, wisely (and/or due to financial constraints), do not own cars.
23
You're assuming, as New Yorkers often do, that there is no alternative to subways. Plenty of 24/7 cities in Canada and Europe have excellent night bus networks, much better than current NYC buses, that may be a possible solution. NYC is a big place and perhaps, as Chicago does, a few lines may need to stay open. But surely if you were going from say Harlem to 14th St a bus running on empty green-wave streets every 3.5 min making express stops is comparable to a 6 train running every 20 minutes that may crawl past a construction site or get re-routed.
29