Clarence Thomas was a liar then and his lie still continues today. He should resign from the Supreme Court.
8
When the Weinstein case became public, I knew it was important to keep it in the news. Because it is the proverbial last straw. Now, the whole matter of sexual harassment has to be dealt with--not only to get justice for the victims but to illustrate how condoning such behavior leads to further degradation of society.
In the case of Anita Hill, having her testimony against Clarence Thomas be disregarded set other wheels in motion. The sponsors of Clarence Thomas still got him seated on the Supreme Court where he has amassed a record of non-participation in so many issues before the court that he's set a record for silence. He's been a rubber stamp for the business and government reps. who put him on the court. He was a Monsanto attorney before they elevated him to the supreme court. Anita Hill's position has similarities to Rosa Parks in bringing an injustice to a head.
Weinstein's gross activities serve as the domino which can bring down all the dominoes who have avoided publicity or punishment. It must stay active in the media until justice is fully served.
9
The Weinstein scandal does appear to be a tipping point in the longstanding issue of workplace sexual harassment and exploitation. But I wonder about the sudden willingness of abusers' enablers to cut them loose rather than dismiss the behavior as "boys will be boys," "the perks of power," etc. Could it simply be a growing fear of being sued?
4
So glad to see women fighting back. Who will educate the men? Can they be taught not to be sexual harassers? Who will teach them? Mothers? Schools? Fathers? Someone, please. Keep up the drumbeat women.
8
I agree Patsy, it's quite sickening how rampant misogyny and sexism is, but I'm grateful for and proud of the women who are speaking out(I fully support those who feel uncomfortable and(or) are in fear of speaking out). I'll attempt to answer your question as best I can. It starts with fathers teaching their sons as my father did with me. He taught me about the history of patriarchy and misogyny, he taught me respect of a women's dignity and personal space, he taught me that everyone is a human being. He also taught me that I'm a white man, which means I have privilege, and unwarranted power, particularly with women. My mother taught me why respect is important, why sex is not a mans right or need, and that respect for women starts with respect for your mother. But societal change is desperately needed as well. As a white man who has been a professional is the music industry for 17 years, I've seen some of the worst of sexism and misogyny. I'm continually astonished at the level of superiority men feel over women. It's often made worse by their colleagues and friends, who not only allow it, they encourage and participate in it. At times I'm at a loss as to how to help enact change, and in particular, how to get men to understand how their behavior is harmful. Many of the men who harass and assault see no wrong in it, and therefore, see no need to change. I'm confident in my assertion that it starts with parents(my evidence is subjective, but relevant in my opinion).
12
And yet we have a secretary of education who wants to rewrite the rules for colleges with regard to sexual assault cases. As a college professor, I can attest that this is a very, very serious problem. DeVos' actions will discourage many women, and men, from coming forward or contacting authorities. This doesn't seem like progress.
9
I'm amazed at how many people — okay, women — are unaware that the ERA never passed and is not the law of the land. Let's get that 40-something-year-old business done right now, today. And let's try to better educate ourselves and each other.
20
Let’s hope that this unleashed tsunami can go beyond the sexual harassment of women...and also look at the pervasive lack of equality and pay in the workplace! Most of we woman in our 6th and 7th decades were sexually harassed and often. And it’s sad to note that in addition to that, we are today making 70 cents of the dollar men make and afforded less opportunities for advancement. Germany made it law that every corporation must have a Board of Directors that is a minimum of 30% women. We must do the same to allow real change in our male dominated culture.
32
"#metoo" is nice. It is a step.
I'd prefer to see "#geteven".
8
@angbob:
French journalist Sandra Muller created the hashtag #BalanceTonPorc, which means "out your pig" -- that seems to fit the bill!
4
This is a serious subject. But i chuckled and admired the reporter’s ability to drop into the straight reporting this dry humor gem:
“If you are a woman, or know somebody who is, it’s safe to assume you have talked about Mr. Weinstein at the dinner table, on the subway...”
Gotta think hard. Do I know someone who is a woman? Well my mother was a woman, but she’s dead. Not sure if that means she still IS a woman (Mom—if you retained your NYT subscription in some afterlife, I don’t mean any offense). Whoops! I almost forgot! My wife IDs as a woman. And we did discuss Weinstein at the breakfast table (not dinner table, but close—within ten hours.) Thus, I rate this article’s claim as TRUE!
11
the problem with accusation, whether anita hill's or ashley judd's is that they are just that, the problem with investigation is that it requires close examination of accusation which is where the power comes in...more often used against the accuser, re-abuse if you will, rarely respectful and intent on justice.
the treatment of anita hill by the congressional boys' club phalanx she faced, most notably sens kennedy and (talk about teflon) biden, was shameful...ashley judd, by comparison was heard and respected (an easier lift because weinstein was such a known quantity) not swept aside with the prejudice so many women have felt and which has deterred so many others from speaking out.
for the future, sanctions against "...what many have called silent co-conspirators: dozens of people, over dozens of years, who knew what was going on but did nothing" will prove even more effective in changing the culture than after-the-fact outing of bad behavior which ranges from the criminal to the clueless and requires commensurate punishment...speaking out can prevent all of it.
and, while we're at it, the press could be more helpful in parsing the terms of the matter...for example, casting couch, presented here without quote marks, (though "strong convention" is), is simply inaccurate and distracting, "casting couch" is a convenient catch-all that makes a cartoon of the peril faced by women who are assaulted in hotel rooms not offices, in situations designed for capture not casting.
14
An important difference between Anita Hill and Ashley Judd is that Ashley Judd is white.
15
I am tired of hearing many of these sociopathic men say they "apologize and accept full responsibility."
The only way for these men to accept "full responsibility" for these crimes is to turn themselves into the police.
19
“ … while Ms. Hill went quietly back to being a law professor in Oklahoma.”
Ironic that Justice Thomas is renowned for not asking questions during Public Hearings by the Supreme Court. Ms. Hills quiet behaviour has been deafening to those “who have ears to hear” whilst nothing of consequence has been heard from Justice Thomas.
20
Would love to see the women we know are out there line up behind Professor Hill and get Justice Thomas outed.
10
If only Anita Hill had social media then. Clarence Thomas may have become a footnote.
29
Anita Hill's ordeal didn't end in 1991. Remember when conservative lobbyist Ginni Thomas called her at 7:30 in the morning and left her a message asking her to apologize to her husband Clarence?
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/10/20/us/politics/20thomas.html
15
I cannot think of a better proof that the personal is political, as Carol Hanisch argued almost 50 years ago, than the phenomena of sexual abuse, -harassment, and -assault. Sexual abuse and sexual harassment cannot be understood clearly, let alone addressed effectively, in the absence of a feminist critique of society. One must analyze matters to which sex and gender are germane within the context of how sex and gender function to privilege some while disadvantaging others. There is no question but that our society, to this day, reflects persistent patterns of male privilege and entitlement (for those who choose to avail themselves of it) in certain key areas (and, to a much lesser degree, female privilege and entitlement in others) and that the everyday acts of oppression or abuse that occur as a direct consequence of this social structure cannot be viewed in any meaningful or useful way by artificially detaching them from the overarching social structure that creates the conditions that allow these acts of oppression and abuse to occur in the first place.
http://dbalablog.blogspot.com/2017/11/eugene-wallach-setting-record-stra...
4
There was one person in the Senate in 1991 who believed
Anita Hill without hesitation -- the late, great Senator James
Jeffords of Vermont. His service to our country is worth study.
22
I believe Anita. Then. Now. Always.
72
Until men stand up and denounce other men who harass women, it's not going to stop. While we have tsunami of women revealing their experience, very few men have come out and showed their support for these women. As long as men stay silent, the message is "go on, you can continue to harass women, we've got your back when they start complaining." They have to denounce them not in terms of "I have a wife/daughter/sister and this is wrong" they have to say, "Stop it, what you've done is wrong and must stop now." Until then, it's the same as "thoughts and prayers" for the latest gun violence victims.....
103
Ms. Bennett, read the comments carefully and ask yourself what have you signed up for.
The more time goes on, the more people have fixed opinions never to be changed, which is just sad.
In 1984-85, I was persistently sexually harassed by the married male chef in the first kitchen I worked in after graduating Hotel and Restaurant school.
It was rough, demeaning and disorienting. The sexual abuse stopped when I slugged him. He tried to have HR fire me, but we had a forward looking HR director who told him he would be fired, as well. Not for repeatedly groping me, mnd you. At that time, there was literally no legal recognition of same sex sexual harassment. But he was on premises drunk, and that could have gotten him fired.
He never touched me again, but he tried to run me out of the kitchen by giving me prodigious amounts of prep work to do instead of being a line cook. I got a new job about three months later, but even 32 years later, I still think about it.
43
David Brock not only apologised for his "little bit nutty, little bit slutty" statement, he converted from a Republican to a Democrat and loyally worked for Hillary Clinton's campaign. Please give credit to those (few) who redeem themselves.
29
I would call it a 'Tipping Point"
7
If Anita Hill was such a revelation, why are we having precisely the same debate a generation later?
15
Her hearings were an important step in the process. Social change takes time. Look how long it took for women to get the vote, for instance.
Because we are living in a highly paternalistic society where women and children are chattel.
7
Because most really don't care about it. They'll say they do but in the end, do nothing. Like a previous poster said, as sad as it may be, the loudest voice for change has to come from men. I posted "metoo" (no details) on FB and not one man I know gave the post a "like".
14
I remember how excited my friends and I were when we realized Anita Hill was going to testify. I, and most of my friends, did not miss a minute of the televised proceedings. We thought "this is it! Finally--this will make all the difference." What a horror it was to see Anita Hill eviscerated by that committee. Joe Biden, in his own way, was not any better than the rest of the senators, though he has been trying to explain it all away for years. He would not have, and never will, have any support from us during any primary race (ok--the big one), should he choose to run. For the same reason, Hilary Clinton's lame defense of her husband, and ugliness to the women involved, ensured our lack of support (in the primaries) for her, too. We have long memories.
The fact is that when those hearings ended, we knew if would be years before there would be any cessation of all that ugly behavior by those men who did not feel at all threatened by the thought of disclosure, let alone a price to pay for it. I'm not at all sure that much will change now, either. Perhaps awareness and threat of redress for those men who continue to violate women will continue to matter in Hollywood, and the mass media, but I have my doubts--very strong doubts--that there will be any justice on behalf of waitresses, cashiers, billing clerks, secretaries, etc. for quite some time. If ever.
37
Let's start with the obvious, Joe Biden headed the Judiciary Committee, he led the hearing and asked some of the most pointed questions concerning Prof. Hill's veracity. Let's move on the Hillary Clinton. You seem to be from the school of "blame the victim." Having an affair is not the same as sexual assault. To conflate the two incidents shows a strange ellipse in the thought process. Hillary Clinton endured the same sort of behavior during the debates, as trump stalked her. Or doesn't that count, because she didn't leave her husband?
Lots of us have long memories, but we are a little more discerning in how we act on those memories. 4 million more of us voted for her in the primaries because we were voting for the woman and what she could do for the country. Not on some perceived and censorious memory from a by gone era.
17
No, I do not "blame the victim." In the case of Hillary Clinton, I believe she was as much a victim as the women he pursued, groped, and had affairs with. Further, I admire her for staying with her husband. That was her choice, and is not for anyone else to criticize. Perhaps due to my conflating and elliptical thought processes, I am a bit confused as to what Trump's stage-stalking (I find him to be a vile, narcissistic, racist, utterly disgusting excuse for a human being) has to do with Hillary not leaving her husband. Well, I suppose I'm a bit slow, too.
Perhaps what I should have said in my response to the article in the first place is that there were also other reasons I supported Bernie Sanders rather than Hillary Clinton in the primaries, and the one I mentioned is only one of them. And "bygone era"? Really? Please stand by while I whack myself in the head with my parasol, and swing my hoop skirt in dismay.
5
Joe Biden might have spent 8 years as America's favourite uncle, but I could never quite shake the memory of watching him on CNN in 1991.
5
I grant that there is never a perfect time to right a wrong and that those who argue that the time is not right often don't want to right it at all. That said, I wonder if I am alone in thinking that this moment, in which I perceive a real prospect of collapse of democratic societies, may not be a good one for starting a gender war over ills that have been with us for centuries. We are losing the contributions of a lot of very talented people. (Yes they are mainly men.) Liberals usually argue for a healing, rather than a punishing, approach to bad behavior, but that doesn't seem to apply here. In science, which is my line, I have seen the career of at least Nobel quality person destroyed in the current frenzy. Do we really want to do that kind of thing on a massive scale?
4
Society could redefine itself with noble leaders and democratic ideals that include women as equal people, not as conquests or booty. I prefer a democratic society where half of the population isn't expected to accept harassment for the sake of predatory "great men" and their contributions. And let's hear it for the contributions of great women, by the way.
30
Yes. We are losing the contributions of a lot of very talented people. They are not “mainly men.” They are overwhelmingly women. Women who have been denied employment, equal pay, advancement, and leadership positions for centuries in this country. Women who have been sexually harasssed at school and at work. Ending this monumental waste of human talent will not incite a “gender war.” The war, if there is one, would be between people who think this state of behavior is okay and those who think it is abhorrent. I believe that most men are in the second group and join a huge majority of women. On the other side are Mr. Weinstein and his ilk. My money is on the good guys.
47
Yes!! Many of these men have destroyed the personal lives and careers of their victims. They deserve no less.
3
given the women only now expressing offence about Weinstein were typically seeking money and fame from his influence - which he was happy to negotiate strongly in terms of 'if you want this from me, I want that from you' - what if we suggested such women stop seeking money and fame from men – e.g. go out and start your own business and do better ?
3
Are you concluding that it was only women (and not men) that sought money and fame from Weinstein's influence? Because if it were a man doing this, it would simply be called "networking."
17
Interesting. Though I wish the author could have explained how to distinguish sexual harassment from vast right wing conspiracies.
4
I'll give it a go. "Sexual harassment" usually happens to one person at a time, and she (usually) is given to understand that there's no point in "going public."
"Vast right wing conspiracies" get news coverage, and while they may be discounted by some, as evidence mounts up, nobody says, "they (the citizens) must have been asking for it."
4
We obviously still live with the effects of the smear campaign against Anita Hill (in the form of a disengaged Supreme Court Justice who no longer can copy over Scalia's shoulder, who has a chip on his shoulder, and a past history of sexual harassment his shadowy supporters were able to blur). Now we live in an age where social media can serve a 'karma discipline' function. There should be thousands, tens of thousands, of male supervisors shaking in their boots. Changing and outing their behavior is one thing; punishing the perps with termination, criminal charges, and civil penalties, will increase the efficacy of the former.
Hopefully the karma discipline function is used with responsibility. But in an age where verifiable facts seem to be either luxuries, nuisances or conspiracies, depending on your hyperpartisan perspective, it's easy to be cynical as well.
9
Yes, we have "famous female accusers". I am so ready to have famous female leaders- women in power, not positioned as victims.
I believe Anita Hill and always have. Let's talk about her amazing scholarship, career, brilliance, leadership since then. She is so much more than an "accuser".
Men in power, even the accused don't seem to torn up about it- they, including DT, are unfazed by women "telling their stories"- after all, the men still get to be viewed as the one's with the power, however ill-wielded. The media loves this, as women (and a few gay men) chime in with their moments of trauma, harassment, pain- the details of how they were weakened at work.
Can we give this amount of media play to women in their moments and strategies of power, strength- winning? That is what really gets men to "listen" and creates a profound shift that is actually useful to women and girls.
30
I believed Anita Hill. But I remember being dismayed at the time that the majority of women did not, notwithstanding the numerous "I Believe Anita" buttons. And when 53% of white women voted for Trump in the 2016 election, I was dismayed again. I think things are changing, yes, but we should keep the
record straight.
58
I am a white woman who believed Anita Hill back in 1991 and voted for Hillary in 2016. There are a lot of us, believe the media or not. I live in Virginia and remember being sickened the morning after Election Day when I realised how many people around me that I thought of as normal, nice people actually voted for Trump. I felt like I was on another planet.
23
Wish someone would ask David Brock if he still stands by his comments about Professor Hill during the Thomas hearings. Or, if he feels some mea culpas might be in order.
3
You must not have read the comment above that says that he has apologized and even changed his party affiliation.
1
Buck: David Brock apologized publicly years ago.
3
So...such as Weinstein was not just a Democrat, but a very actively donating-money Democrat...what does this say of Democrat values? Are there any?
7
Not to shift the subject or anything . . .
8
It says nothing of Democratic values.
It says something only of Weinstein values.
16
This issue has nothing to do with democrats or republicans. It is power hungry men who abuse women because they can get away with it, all over the world
25
Let's not forget how badly Joe Biden treated Anita Hill. I am a registered Democrat, but I would never vote for Biden as President.
18
yep, one of the all male committee.
All of those males disgraced themselves. And showed no understanding of the treatment to which women have been subjected in the workplace.
9
And now for a contrary view.
These anti-harassment laws are for people who have really been subjected to antisocial behavior. But they can be abused for another agenda.
I had hired a qualified woman on my staff. After a short time, she wouldn’t perform her duties, preferring instead to do her homework on company time.
After many warnings and HR notifications, I placed her on probation. And she promptly accused me of sexual harassment.
Huh?
Unbeknownst to me, she had applied for a co-op loan and could not risk losing her job.
I had quite a time proving my innocence, but she was dismissed when HR discovered that no harassment had taken place. False charges.
Now it makes me wonder if all of these women, or just some of them, are telling the truth.
8
when more than 1 woman is accusing the same perpetrator, then ... do you believe the women are telling the truth?
I understand your skepticism given your experience, but don't make the mistake of believing ALL women are being untruthful.
13
Yes, this does happen. When I was in high school, and I am now 75 years old, a girl from my class would steal from a store across the street from the school. When the owner caught her she told him to let her go or she would tell the police that he tried to force her to have sex with him. He let her go, and she bragged about it at school. But when we have more than one accusation, or when the accusation comes from someone of Anita Hill's character, that is different. But there are cases that are questionable, cases where innocent men can be badly damaged. But in cases like Bill Cosby or Harvey Weinstein we need to prosecute with the full force of the law.
As an aside, I now realize how close I came to being one of Bill Cosby's victims, many, many years ago. I had gone into a restaurant on North Beach in San Francisco. I was waiting to be seated when I saw Bill Cosby having lunch with the owner, Enrico Banducci. Cosby saw me notice him and motioned me over and asked me to join them, which I did. I was so impressed. I was having lunch with Bill Cosby!! We talked and he invited me to see his show at the Circle Star in San Jose that evening, and then to come back with him and have Enrico's famous apple pie. I wanted to do that, but had other plans, so didn't go. I was fortunate, many weren't!
1
It's like Bill Cosby. Yes, it might be suspicious if only one or two women had come forward to claim that he had drugged and raped them. But sixty women, almost all telling the same sordid tale? They can't all be lying, especially when so many of them were destroyed as a result.
6
I believe we are going to continue to live with a remarkably high level of tolerance for sexual harassment. There are many of us who work for powerful and wealthy septuagenarian men who still consider a little squeeze on the tuchus absolutely normal. As a woman who could easily post #metoo, I can absolutely say that these men do not see their behavior as anything like Harvey's nor do they have any compelling reasons to change. The power dynamic is still in their favor.
12
Yes but they will be dead in 20 years and things are changing...
5
As usual the deniers and disparagers all show up in attempt to make the world safe for predators.
10
Recognizing that which feminists have been saying for decades, it might be an opportune moment for a rhetoric based on persuasion rather than invective, but the commentariat is out in full force, painting with a roller rather than even a wide brush.
3
Yes, they put a puppet on the cover of Ms. Magazine and Gloria Steinem went "undercover" in a bunny outfit at the Playboy Club just to see what it was REALLY like--for the sake of journalism.
1
I'd like to be the #metoo moment means there has been a fundamental shift in how women are treated in the workplace and at school and even out and about in public.
Sadly, though, I don't think a whole lot has changed. We can talk about Anita Hill, how it was the first times that the every day harassment of women was discussed, but nothing really changed. Almost every women can describe an incident of sexual harassment that she has endured at work, or she can describe being groped by someone she thought was a friend or assaulted by a stranger on the subway, etc. In 1991 I was in college, Anita Hill speaking out didn't change the fact that I was thereafter groped by a friend and thereafter sexually harassed at work, etc. I doubt the #metoo movement will make much real change because the real problem is that women lack power in government and in business and without power its hard to change the rules, just look at Trump who bragged about sexually assaulting women and was elected President.
10
Admittedly it's a fine distinction, but the Clinton-Lewinsky scandal was not sexual harassment. No one questioned whether the woman in question welcomed the advances; in fact, according to testimony, she did everything she could to attract him. The other women who claim Clinton hit on them, however, are another story entirely.
29
Wrong. She was an intern - deluded and immature . He was a married grown man, POTUS, and he had a choice, but he he took advantage of her. It was abuse of power.
7
At what age would she graduate from ‘deluded and immature?’ Give us your best estimate.
5
I think she'd graduate from deluded and immature at a net worth of 4 million. That's the amount that, very cautiously invested, would yield six figures of passive income. Without that independent income, she'd still be the prey of power.
2
What if credible evidence that a person abused his or her power over someone else really became a disqualification for public office, for a judicial appointment, for media pundits and moguls and stars, and for promotion to management positions in any business? What a wonderful world it would be!
But everyone needs to take responsibility for calling out abusers especially of those with little power and few chances to escape. Let’s not just fade away!
6
From the article: "'There is no doubt that having an accused sexual predator in the White House is hanging over this,' said Jaclyn Friedman."
--------
Accused? How about self-proclaimed? He boasted about his assaults on tape!
65
Sexual harassment in the workplace is typically overt and readily understood. What Anita Hill and countless women since her testimony describe leaves little to the imagination. More pervasive and insidious, however, is discrimination against women without physically predatory conduct. Fortunately, increasing attention is now being paid to the high-wire act achieving women must sustain to be both assertive and accommodating, effective but not "bossy". A double standard exists but it is subtle and not easily confronted. The numbers tell the story - although many girls and young women soar as students, women in the workplace are not adequately represented in power positions and still have a long way to go. I hope the focus on sexual harassment eventually expands to look at other expressions of how some men in power use and abuse that power.
22
JB,
Most people who achieve positions of power do it by eating other people. I work in finance. Men prey on weaker men.
Women may succeed in school, but it takes ruthlessness to succeed in business. Most super successful people are at least a little bit sociopathic.
School is not really a zero sum game, especially not with grade inflation. But imagine if a teacher could give out only one A and only one A-. Students would sabotage each other trying to get that lone A. That's Wall Street and Silicon Valley. Business is a zero sum game. To succeed, one must be good at zero sum living and not just good at academics.
Tech start ups may talk about connectivity and team work, but their fighting ruthlessly for monopolistic control of niche markets.
The ads I see for finance jobs often say they are seeking former college athletes. It's more important that a candidate has been nvolved in competitive sports than that they achieved good grades, or so it seems.
8
Perhaps you could define 'super successful people' for the rest of us non-sociopaths?
7
Having “former college athlete”as a screening criterion is itself sex discrimination since so few colleges support women’s athletics to the same extent as men’s teams, offer far fewer women’s athletic scholarships etc. It is code for “women need not apply.” If your company does this, please identify it so there can be an investigation.
6
Thoughts in general on sexual harassment:
Both men and women sometimes want just sex. No romance and love, thank you. Both married men and married women sometimes want extramarital sex but do not want to leave their spouse.
Both sexes are open to a sexual relation at work because of the convenience.
A man adjusts his approach to a woman according to what he wants.
If he wants love, he may tell an appealing woman, "Hey, looking good today." Or "You're the best-looking woman in this building/town/bar." Such compliments are feelers to see how receptive a woman might be to a direct request for a date. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't.
If a man wants only sex, he may use an approach that includes sexual overtures. This works if the woman is in the market for the same thing. If she isn't, it doesn't work, though she may have wanted a relationship with the man.
Points/questions to remember:
Some -- but not all -- men persist, sometimes with success.
“Many women acknowledge eventually marrying men to whom they had at first said ‘No;’ that is, men who had in fact persisted.” -Warren Farrell, "The Myth of Male Power," cassette tape version
Consider:
"I asked her out," he said. "She refused. I kept asking. She kept refusing."
"I'm your adviser," she said. "It's not appropriate."
The "he"? Barack Obama
The "she"? Michelle, his future wife.
http://www.oprah.com/world/barack-and-michelle-obamas-first-date-famous-...
Cont'd.
6
@MaleMatters: Yeah -- thanks for the junior high social studies/sexual dynamics lesson.
We're not talking here about mutual attraction between equals. Unwanted sexual advances are never OK. Exploiting a power imbalance is never OK. No means no, in every language, in every situation.
Got it?
29
More of the "got it." No, don't got it: all sexual advances are "unwanted" until they are "wanted", so your junior high school logic is lacking. Moreover, men really don't like your tone, and it's not sexual harassment to avoid you, not to promote you, and think ill of you for using it. I predict a men's "whisper network" is in the offing; perhaps not among the virtue-signaling liberal NYT readership, but it's coming nonetheless: I suggest trying better to convince, because there is no tipping point: women still want what men have and they're not going to "get it" just by saying "got it."
5
Your post, and your point, is missing an important word/concept: unwelcome.
3
The global extinction of patriarchy - men's entitlement to dominance - will unleash the creative potential of billions of women and solve every problem under the sun, including the climate crisis. Patriarchy is the most ancient and insidious tyranny, driven by testosterone, the most corrosive element on the planet. Thus, gender equality is the next step in human evolution: the struggle for global gender equality is our #1 struggle.
20
No tsunami after the head of the IMF assaulted a black maid in a Times Square hotel. No tsunami after endemic harassment in the Armed Forces was exposed in Senate hearings. But a tsunami after one of the most privileged classes — high-end actresses — broke the industry omertà.
This highlights the same problem with the Women's Movement as a whole, and why so many blue-collar & poor women abjure it: It's only a crisis when it happens to the upper classes.
58
Sexual harassment is about sex, and more importantly it’s about power and corruption.
A factor in the recent accusations of sexual harassment levied against mostly white men in power, is not merely an accusation of unwelcomed sexual advances.
It’s an accusation of corruption, both by these men and by the institutions that surround them. The Hollywood machine, Fox News, Silicon Valley and Wall Street.
When Anita Hill spoke out against Clarence Thomas, it was not enough to topple the Supreme Court nominee. The accusations were true but the bigger question of corruption was not really raised or tried. And Thomas went on to serve on the highest court.
Now the climate has changed and there is fertile ground both in the media, the courts and the among the public for exposing and cracking down on corruption of money and power, in the political and private realm.
And after years of abuse of power and money, moguls and political operators are being taken to task and toppled, just like the statutes of the confederacy.
It’s no coincidence that these forces align, at the precise moment of the black lives matter, taking a knee, the 2016 election and the Russian investigation, movements are emerging.
And these cases of corruption are exposed, perhaps history will tell us that these are defining moments of our time, for renewal and redirection, towards a better equilibrium and greater equity for all.
4
Anita Hill’s sexual harassment charges were not really sexual harassment, but were trumped up charges to discredit a conservative from becoming a Supreme Court Justice. She used stereotypes against black men to level false charges to advance her political agenda. Whatever she leveled against Thomas should be treated only as a minor inappropriate behavior. It was not serious enough to treat as sexual harassment and to deny him justiceship.
During the last election this tactic was used against Trump to defeat him. Many accusations were not credible enough to treat as sexual harassment, but those were used by his political opponents to discredit him and to defeat him in the election.
But these same people were willing to ignore serious charges against Harvey Weinstein and Bill Clinton to advance their interest. This kind of double standard cheapens the seriousness of the issue. This has to change. Sexual harassment should not be used as a political weapon to attack political opponents, especially males since they are more vulnerable in this situation.
5
Can we wait to see if anything actually changes as a result? Or will this be just another brief feel good social media moment that passes with very little, if any, actual change?
Like "Occupy Wall Street" and "Black Lives Matter"?
Last I checked, Thomas was still in a life-time appointment, Wall Street runs the country and Trump is our president with the support of millions of women.
#YAWN
25
It may well be that society is becoming more sensitized to sexual assault and ready to take action...one can only hope. But I doubt it. Weinstein, O'Reilly, Ailes, Spacey...they're all of a piece. It wasn't until wrongdoing had an impact on bottom-line performance that boards and C-suites took action. Until then, no one but the victims cared.
24
I don't know if men who've been sexually harassed are 1%, 5%, 20% or some other share of the total. But maybe a little more attention is warranted than "and some men, too". Maybe that will get more men to think "that could have been me."
"A great many women — and some men, too — have also spoken out more openly and more forcefully than ever before about what happens behind closed doors"
7
It never ceases to amaze me when women get attention for an issue or movement men immediately say: "What about the men?"
Examples - there has been a big response by women to Trump that first evidenced itself in DC the day after the inauguration with a march by 1 million women. There were more marches across the country. Trump has prompted 20,000 of those women to sign up and take training on running for office. There was an article about the organization providing the training and in the comments a few men wanted to know why they couldn't participate without explaining how.
Campfire Girls, after becoming really popular suddenly had to admit boys and change their name to "Campfire" although boys have their own groups like the Boy Scouts and girls don't demand to be admitted,
The "Take you child to work day" started as "Take your daughter to work" day in recognition that girls had to be encouraged to become doctors, lawyers, scientists, etc. b/c these are male dominated professions. But, no, although boys were already to encouraged by society to do whatever they want, girls couldn't even have their own "day."
These are all examples of the patriarchal world women are forced to endure and men ignore.
7
It's hard to imagine a situation in which a man would not welcome that type of attention from a woman (maybe not from another man). Maybe if the woman were a great deal older or something. If an attractive female boss told me she would give me a promotion, a raise, and corner office if I gave her oral pleasure, I would probably say, "yes. Get up on your desk." Heck, if I were married, I might say to my wife that the benefit (promotion, raise) outweighed the infidelity.
I am being serious. I just think most men are much less threatened by such attention. Perhaps for good reason.Women have more to fear.
In Horrible Bosses, Aniston's harassment of Day's character is funny because she's hot, abd being so, most men assume that they'd line up to be harassed by her. Sudeikis' (sp?) character even goes so far as to volunteer to have sex with her to help out Day.
I think Kevin Spacey, Kirt Webster and a bunch of priests made the point about men and boys before I did. Not to mention Quinn Cummings's story in Esquire. If sexual harassment and other sex-related abuses of power are an issue, what's gained by saying some victims don't matter?
I was a 26 year old Army Sergeant when Anita Hill came forward. It was the same year that I initiated a sexual harassment and assault investigation involving my Commanding Officer. I watched one powerful man after another use the same tactics to silence her as my superiors used on me. They relentlessly admonished, shamed, and attacked her, while characterizing Thomas as a victim, a modern martyr of "high tech lynching."
It was a surreal turning point in my life to be both victim and witness to such obstinate, arrogant injustice. To be steeped in the underworld of sexist sewage in private and in public. I learned then what so many are just now waking up to: the politics of gender create two distinct realities.
The first is a saccharine vision of women's experience that is filtered through a male monocle and propagated everywhere. It gives lip service to notions of equality, opportunity, and justice. It espouses respect for women, claims to revere them, and congratulates itself on supporting women's advancement in all aspects of society.
The second is the raw experience of female embodiment raised on platitudes and stuffed with fairytales. This is the body that walks through doors held open by chivalry rather than law. This is the body that finds itself stripped of power, knocked to the floor, and violated again and again and again.
69
hero...you.
1
And after Clarence Thomas's appealing "lynching" testimony, he has said almost nothing, but voted with the white patriarchy every single time.
14
The same people who ardently support and believe Anita Hill's narrative of sexual harassment at the hands of Clarence Thomas, also believe that the multiple women who claim sexual harassment and actual rape by Bill Clinton are liars. How do they reconcile their selective beliefs, other than what it really is, which is politically based hypocrisy.
10
How can you possibly speak for all those who believe Anita Hill was telling the truth?
17
please do not refer to Harvey Weinstein as a cancer. This is disrespectful to cancer (the disease) survivors like me. @CancerIsSoFunny
7
I would like to believe this is a "profound shift", but having watched and heard the outrage felt by women about Anita Hill and Bill Clinton and seeing no real change from those tsunamis I am pessimistic. I'm afraid sex and power will always win out and I am quite sure that in another 20 years a new generation of women will be fighting the same fight.
48
Bill Clinton? Three women accused him of sexual assault and/or harassment. Charges he has denied and were never proven. Women who were closely intertwined with a political agenda in opposition to Bill Clinton. The free use of Bill Clinton is dangerous and without basis. I think you meant Donald Trump - the man who has actually admitted to sexually assaulting women.
9
Dana:
Last time I checked the feminist left treated any sex between a superior and subordinate as sexual harassment.
"Never proven". You mean like Harvey Weinstein?
As I recall, Paula Jones alleged that Bill Clinton exposed himself to her and invited her to "kiss it." U.S. District Judge Susan Webber Wright dismissed the case, ruling that even if Jones's allegations were true, such "boorish and offensive" behavior would not be severe enough to constitute sexual harassment under the law. Clinton later wrote Jones a check for $850,000.
3
Let alone how 62 million people voted to put Trump in the White House.
I still believe Professor Hill, too.
67
I think it is past time for Clarence Thomas to resign. In addition to the sexual harassment, he is also a very poor jurist and contributes almost nothing to the Supreme Court except this predictably conservative vote.
107
You don't really want him to resign. that opens the court to an even more right wing jurist since it will be our Sexual Abuser in Chief who will make the appointment. Leave him there to go quietly into that good night until such time as we have an intellectual in the White House who will do the court justice.
13
Yeah, and now revered Dem senior statesman, Papa Joe Biden, joined the chorus of Hill attackers bravely subjecting her to a scurrilous cross examination from his perch as chair of the Senate Judiciary Committee.
Those courageous Senators on the Judiciary Committee served up the profoundly unqualified Thomas to SCOTUS on a silver platter with the all to predictable results we as a country are still experiencing.
And Papa Joe is thinking about running for Prez in ‘20?
Save the apologies on your conduct toward Hill, and just stay home Joe.
30
I watched the confirmation hearings for Thomas every day they were on. And watched as Biden presided over that sham of a hearing. When he attempted to run for president in '08, I attended the Democratic caucus in my state. A Biden supporter came to me to convince me to throw my vote toward his candidate, at which point he got a lecture on the Thomas hearings.
I am STILL angry about that. I haven't forgiven Biden, nor has he asked for forgiveness. Stay home, Joe.
20
He also sandwiched in the Rave Act, one of the most broadly repressive laws ever passed in this country, by sticking it into a mom-and-apple-pie bill for Amber Alerts. This guy is no saint; often, in fact, a rank opportunist.
3
Joe Biden was the chair of the committee and it was Joe Biden who declined to permit another Black woman from testifying against Clarence Thomas. The additional testimony might have made a big difference in the outcome. At least it would have provided Anita Hill with support. I have never forgotten Biden's role in the shameful way Anita Hill was discredited and the fact that it is, in large measure, Biden we have to thank for Thomas ascending the High Court where he doesn't belong; doesn't deserve to be.
4
I remember Anita Hill's testimony--her dignity, her bravery, and unwavering voice in front of a group of powerful men who insulted her, doubted her, and tried to ruin her reputation. She is a hero!
Like Black Lives Matter showing the world the danger of living as a person of color, the Me Too campaign and exposure of men who sexually harass women is showing men what it is like to live as a female.
Women have been stifled in careers and contributions to society by men who harass and try to "keep women in their inferior position." It has been 25 years since Anita Hill was raked over the coals....it is long since time that this matter is addressed and rectified. Women need to be in positions of power along with men, paid equal wages, and treated with the dignity all human beings deserve.
76
When I was a legal secretary for a several years in my early thirties, one of the attorneys for whom I worked, a man with whom I had never even spoken much except to type up his almost unintelligible notes about current cases, leaned over me as I sat at my desk and whispered in my ear, "Are we ever going to go to bed together?" My response was immediate and loud, a kind of Heimlich maneuver: I shouted "NO!" at the top of my lungs. Two weeks later I was refused a raise on the grounds that "Fred says you don't transcribe his work correctly." The recent exposure of sexual harassment and abuse also led me to re-think my relationship with a door-keeper at one of my local stores. We have had a pleasant, chatty, casual relationship, and sometimes he pulls me in for a hug, which I have allowed. However, yesterday,I realized that his hugs have been getting longer and closer, and when I tried to pull away he held on, making me squirm. Yes, these things happen to women daily, seemingly uneventfully, with no obvious repercussions. But I never forgot that lawyer's presumptuous sexual pass, and I dread going back to one of my favorite stores now.
23
Do NOT go in for that hug next time you see him. Tell him in a loud voice that his hugs are suspiciously like sexual harassment, and that if he ever does it again - or tries to - you WILL go to the store's HR department. It's not that hard to avoid his hugs, but if he follows you or tries to push you up against the wall, scream and yell l your loudest and resist. You CAN do it. And should.
5
I have had similar experiences. In my ongoing discussions with my live in boyfriend about this and what his point of view is, I asked his opinion about situations like what you describe. I asked what should I do the next time faced with something like this or unwanted kisses hello and goodbye. Say "no thank you" he suggests. I will do this. I have experienced the more I do something that may be uncomfortable the easier it becomes.
1
I confronted my harasser and went to his boss. Long story short, I was told that was how things were done in the industry and if I wanted to stay I had to deal with it. I left the company one year short of being vested in the retirement plan and got out of the industry. When his boss retired, the company promoted my harasser.
129
I experienced something similar in the 1980's and now my daughter and her friends are experiencing the same. It really infuriates me when someone tells the victim that they need to confront their abuser because this is illegal, etc, etc. The truth men or women for that matter who engage in this sort of harassment are smart enough to make sure there are no witnesses beyond the victim and the average HR department is quick to go down the "he said, she said path of least resistance. Otherwise, you can bet the management team will circle the wagons and offer protection for the abuser and disdain for the victim - until she finds new employment.
11
Celeste:
What you miss is that if you report the behavior to HR and someone else later reports the same behavior, with the same MO, the harasser's credibility is in shreds,
Do your duty and report the abuser.
1
It takes two-faced Hollywood liberals to bring the hidden crime of sexual harassment and assault on women in the workplace to the forefront. Just imagine if this horrible, criminal behavior was brought to light by the media and feminist leaders 20 years ago when Bill Clinton was coercing sexual favors from a very young and impressionable 22 year old Monica Lewinsky (sounds familiar, the targeting of the youngest and least powerful women in the workplace). We probably would have saved thousands of women the pain of this type of harassment and assault over the last 2 decades had we made big deal about it back then instead of pushing it under the rug as Hillary did for her husband.
12
Here will go again, as Yogi taught us deja vu all over again, the predator, the victim and the enablers and co dependents.
The pendulum swinging back and forth.
Pre 1980, sexual crimes in the workplace were de facto legal.
Post 1980, women finally had a legal recourse and many took advantage of it.
Then came the extreme feminists who got power, made a pact with men in top mgt. and mainly protected them i.e. Bill Clinton, Fox News execs, Weinstein etc but every man below them were guilty if accused.
Brave women finally exposed guys like O'Reilly and Weinstein while many of them waited 30 yrs to complain or worse complained when the promotions stopped or worse actively encourage it i.e. sleeping to the top.
Until we realize that either a witch hunt against men or an environment where women have to endure abuse are equally wrong, the pendulum will continue to swing wide and far.
2
And yet the dozens of women that accused Bill Clinton...crickets!
11
I lost my confidence in SCOTUS, when C.Thomas was confirmed. I still despise him. He diminished the court.
8
Work place harrassment is just the start. Any situation where women and men mix is a possible incident. Strange men yelling at you while you are walking is harrassment. The elderly neighbor who feels you need a hug every time he talks to you ...and the emphasis is on feels. Strangers grab you in public. Any woman in America can give you a long list of affronts.
Blaming women for this situation doesn’t help. You can’t stuff women into burkas because men think it’s their right to be smarmy and creepy. Hopefully this current story will ad to the awareness that harrassment isn’t okay.
8
So what’s the cultural “statute of limitations” on outing public figure sex abusers i the public sphere. Roman Polanski’s 1977 arrest?
I wonder when the “remove / rename statues” movement will merge with the #metoo movement and we get to work renaming all of those schools, airports, libraries, space centers and performing art centers named after JFK.
Perhaps The New Yorker can definitively investigate and summarizes all of his truly awful sexual escapades while “on the job” at 1600 Pennsylvania and get it out there for all to re-examine. Almost all have already been documented and squirreled away in various rarely-read-today books. Then we can perhaps truly take a good look at why across the society that we have created over the past century men and women often seem to choose to give a nominal pass and protection to powerful “altruistic dominant” men who behave this way…so long as the activity is discreet and in the shadows. It is only after our well-being and positive sense of ourselves and what we stand for is no longer dependent on these people, that they become fair game for outing. There is a significant manner in which we “progressives” enshrine figures such as JFK and LBJ because of the direction in which they moved the country and (in LBJ’s case) their legislative accomplishments. Their bad personal behavior is compartmentalized in much the same way Evangelicals compartmentalizes Trump's.
4
An "accused sexual predator" is not the same as a "sexual predator." And therein lies a major problem with the current campaign to identify and remove offenders.
History tells us that some, even if only a few, of those identified will be innocent. Who is going to deal with the collateral damage as the effort produces allegations and immediately moves on? Perhaps not too important to the movement as a whole, but critical to the innocent person whose life has been wrecked by an accusation.
9
I was first followed by men in a van shouting out comments about my body when I was 11.
I was sexually assaulted at age 13 by a male family member.
My father allowed his best friend to ogle me and finger his crotch while watching me mow the lawn when I was 15.
At age 16, the manager at my first job took advantage of the limited space in the McDonald's drive through to grab women's butts. I was "let go" when I didn't allow him to fondle my breasts during a training session at the counter.
Yet somehow, the accusers are the problem. Got it.
14
Yes, because of your personal experience, which we must all believe is narrated as true -- because, you know, everything you say is to believed without question as if you were a medieval nun -- we should ignore the rights of the accused everywhere. Jurisprudence of the mob. Got it.
4
Like another commenting earlier, I too am surprised at the lack of comments. Are men, in particular, not reading the article or do some feel guilty and have little to say? Sexual harassment, along with wife beating and rape, is how the patriarchy keeps women second-class even after legal impediments have been removed in history, e.g. Married women's right to own property, right to vote, right to serve on a jury, etc.
The article neglects one telling historical point related to suffrage and the Hill-Thomas debacle. After American women voters watched the treatment of Hill by all male (and all white) senators, the number of women in the U.S. Senate went up significantly e.g. from 1 or 0 to 5 or so in 1996!!!
In 2017, time to move it to 50+%. Only then will there be real change.
4
This seems as good a spot as any to reply. Having been falsely accused once when I was young of sexual harassment, and been called on the carpet by my boss, I tend to question whether every time a women makes an accusation that we fall over ourselves assuming it must be true. Acknowledge that just like there are lying men, there are lying women who have their own agenda, and whose comments can destroy a career before the accused has any chance to defend himself. But this is what it has lead to: men will no longer invite a woman for a drink to talk real work because they don't want the accusation of harassment, and they refuse to meet with women individually behind a closed door because its their word against hers. And who does it hurt? Women who need to establish collegial relationship with male supervisors, just like subordinate men have to do, as this is how business is done and how people move ahead.
I have no doubt that harassment is real, and men who are pigs proposition women subordinates. I also have no doubt that there are false accusations and the response women will face will serve to hurt and not help their careers.
5
I always shake my head when people judge others based on how much a story is commented on or how many post about something on social media.
3
Anita Hill is a hero! I watched the hearings and cried for her.
Certainly, she was sexually harassed by Clarence Thomas. She did was she could do by standing up to the establishment - she was very brave.
I hope she is well.
49
And we should all stop referring to "sexual harassment" as sex. This is long overdue. We need to switch the narrative (the reality) to the victim's POV not the perpetrator. It is not 'sexual (sic) misconduct' that the victim is experiencing.
"Sexual assault is an act of violence, not sex. This is an important distinction because by framing sexualized violence as about sex and not about violence we focus on the perpetrator’s narrative and not the survivor’s. Focusing on the perpetrator’s narrative leads society to blame the victim and to not hold the perpetrator accountable for their actions. Remember, sexual assault happens because perpetrators exert power over the survivor to take away any control the survivor has in choosing whether or not to engage in a sexual situation. Thus, sexual assault is not sex to the survivor – it is an act of violence."
more at:
https://sapac.umich.edu/article/52
5
Why not call it "sexualized harassment" or "sexualized coercion"? Sometimes it is coercion and sometimes it is harassment. There is a difference. But I like your use of the "-Ized" to reframe the word.
1
Anita Hill was stigmatized, excommunicated and humiliated for her testimony. So, what happens now with a #wetoo tsunami? How this behavior is not obviously wrong is a matter of... ? What's there to lose for an accuser? Not a lot.
1
When are we going to get justice for Anita Hill?!!!! Clarence Thomas must be forced to resign as he is no less a sexual predator than Harvey Weinstein. Be certain that he has used his power as a SCOTUS justice over women since his confirmation. And don't think for a minute that he has not acted as a predictor since his confirmation.
49
Predator?
Who needs due process? Throw all men in jail!
1
At least Thomas is relatively ineffective in building Court majorities for some of his more extreme positions. If he were to resign the replacement might be more in the Scalia/Alito mold of convincing Anthony Kennedy to go along with them sometimes. Be careful what you wish for.
1
Clarence Thomas remains a "very active" stain on the American judicial system. As long as he remains on the court its decisions will be compromised. How can anyone take seriously the opinions of a self-serving and abusive liar? What does this have to do with justice? Nothing at all.
What's the proof of his guilt? As in any criminal investigation - motive. Why would Anita Hill have taken upon herself the considerable risk of exposing a very public and powerful person like Thomas. Her previous and subsequent life shows that she is and was a model of stability. And Anita Hill was hardly a white racist engaged in a "hi-tech lynching" per Mr. Thomas's self-serving claim. The attacks on her were ludicrous and shameful. Her attempt to heroically defend the integrity of American justice was spat upon by mostly old white men.
If there is a Constitutional mechanism Thomas should be removed. This man was supposed to be the so-called replacement for the extraordinary and courageous Thurgood Marshall? What a disgrace!
More to the point, all the congressional figures remaining who enabled him should be removed as well. I guess that's a matter in the hands of the American electorate. Actions speak far louder than pious proclamations.
15
My addendum - the circulation of a petition demanding that Clarence Thomas vacate his position on the court and his replacement with Anita Hill. She certainly, by contrast, has both the technical and, even more importantly, moral qualifiers.
I think that at this point in history that would receive significant support from American - men and women. Could you get 100,000,000 or 150,000,000 signatures? Possibly. Put your money where your mouth is an appropriate concept in the post-Weinstein era.
Neither Trump nor Pence would be the man for the job. At this point I believe we need a full house cleaning.
1
Another step, thankfully, leading us from mastodons to muses.
8
And I hope that you will take action and stand up for your sisters where you even simply suspect that they are being abused, Joseph. Words are nice; actions are even better.
I STILL believe Anita. She was sexually harassed, if not sexually assaulted, by Clarence Thomas.
135
Thomas must stepdown from the Supreme Court.
3
From my perspective, sexual harassment is a form of emotional and psychological abuse.
4
Anita Hill will always be one of my heroes.
136
Heroines.
The shockingly slow evolution of this freedom and safety for victims to speak and be believed is almost unfathomable.
33
Not unfathomable at all. We have been too threatened not to fear speaking out.
2
Though we believed Anita BECAUSE of our experiences.
68
You know sexual harassment does not end. Last year I was propositioned by a male delivery person and I was 66 at the time. He made several stops by our home just to see how I was doing and not to forget the many promises he made. This guy was around his mid-30s I'd say. I finally told the business about my problems with this man. The last man I spoke to said to me: 'Women get better with age. We all know. You must be really attractive so it is a compliment.'. I responded with something like: 'I am an American and a legal French resident, so I am not afraid to tell every single person I know about your refusal to take this seriously. Perhaps I should have started with the Genaermerie, right?' I didn't know and still don't know if there are laws or of French laws regarding Gender Harassment. But I do know I have not been bothered by that man since.
I am no great beauty but that doesn't have any thing to do with sexual harassment. My mother was confined to wheelchair and men were always telling her to smile. She got a job in a doctor's office and the doctor reached down in her dress. Personally, I think sexual harassment is a power play but just a bit more 'polite' than out-right rape. When a person who has power feels it is ok to extend that power beyond the limits of the normal it is harassment, regardless of the victim's gender, job, age, income, education. A Troll will always be a troll regardless of the position they sit in.
A profound shift?
What makes it profound?
Trump is president. The crotch grabber got over half of white women's votes. still has them.
The republicans are trying to pass a fat cat tax cut with the unborn right to life in it.
Republicans are running America into the ground.
And for decades any normal worker bee who was propositioning or groping would be out of a job.
And it is the social media Russia used to rig an election. not that it was the key variable or took much effort with identity politics twits. Same crowd let Thmas lay the reach card.
Profound to one issue people who are a minority of a minority.
Meanwhile the Virginia race is CLOSE.
Fools.
And I changed my view of Clarence Thomas after that spectacle in which Thomas successfully played the "high tech lynching" race card, in fury that his porn viewing tastes were outed. He is still on the court. And Arlen Specter, like a cartoon Simon Legre, pulling out his suit ost to show the inner pocket where he had the evidence Anita Hill was just a nasty girl. Look up the photo. Trash,yes, but a moderate by today's standards.
Profound shift my...
90
In deed--...my... fat Aunt Alice. Absolutely correct. Fools.
And yet President Trump still won 42% of the overall women vote.
38
Yoav--Many of whom still believe in the Catholic Church. Go figure! Just because they're women doesn't mean they're smart, deductive, OR independent thinkers.
1
Let's look at it from the other side..... if women had been the only ones to vote, 58% of women voted against him. That is a majority margin and he would not be potus right now. Maybe that is the solution, whitemen had the vote, right to own property etc exclusively for the first 200 years, so time to switch. The next 200 years only women of all ethnic rainbows have the vote and right to own property etc. Time for people to either get it right or get off the bus. Just sayin
6
which means that most women did not vote for him
1
25 years ago I had swollen glands and a sore throat.(I was young and beautiful.) I went to a new doctor.He looked in my throat, gave me a strep test and antibiotics. To be safe he said he should also do a breast exam. So I took off my shirt and bra. After, I felt weird.....why did I have to do that? The friend who was with me thought it was weird, too, but figured that this might be a new way to detect infections in the throat.
Yeah......right!
61
My father had lymphatic cancer that spread to his chest. The doctor could’ve been checking for a possible cancer. That’s a possibility, he could’ve been a creep though.
4
Yes, but don't overreach. Besides the long list of genuine victims, there are a lot of activists whose careers have been orgies of man-hating. Prof. MacKinnon, for one, has argued that all heterosexual sex is rape. And also that "the availability of abortion removes the one remaining legitimized that women have for refusing sex besides the headache." Do you really trust her to lead you to the Promised Land?
Then there are the casual slurs against men -- Bennett mentions street harassment, rape culture and “toxic masculinity” -- that fail to distinguish between the guilty and the innocent and fail to acknowledge degrees of culpability. "Believe the woman" is a morally bankrupt rule. And stereotyping men is no less vile than stereotyping women (where is Justice Ginsburg when we need her?).
As Emily Yoffe has pointed out, many remedies pushed on campuses “are unjust to men, infantilize women, and ultimately undermine the legitimacy of the fight against sexual violence.” That goes for Hollywood and the world too.
And don't mistake an outbreak of hysteria for a secular trend. Pause to reflect on the tragic case of Peggy McMartin Buckley and the daycare child abuse hysteria of the 1980s that turned into a witch hunt.
I doubt that in the great cosmic balance sheet that the long list of crimes of men against women outnumber the crimes of women against men.
16
Ian--Well, I'm a card carrying man-hater, but I haven't made a career out of it, just adjusted my thinking to match my long term experience.
1
Without excessively studying the subject, I gather that one quarter to one third of ALL women have been, or will be the victims of sexual assault or serious harassment. Given this background, is it really likely that a "secular trend" of "me too," or "I also was Weinsteined" is likely to be the side that's off base?
6
Snopes says MacKinnon never said what you contend. What you contend was created by her detractors. See https://www.snopes.com/quotes/mackinnon.asp .
10
This is tiresome. Every working woman you know has experienced this to some degree. Almost all men will swear that they have never done it. It is a gap in perception. It is appalling, unacceptable and best addressed in the moment it happens by the woman in question. We have observed that credibility is diminished when one waits months, let alone decades, to address sexual harassment. Stop the bully in the act. Professional consequences for resistance are illegal. If your career means more to you than your dignity and that of your fellow women, suit yourself but don’t complain about it to me.
8
Yikes. Or Oy Vey.
6
"Every working woman you know has experienced this to some degree. Almost all men will swear that they have never done it. It is a gap in perception."
Agree completely.
"It is appalling, unacceptable and best addressed in the moment it happens by the woman in question."
Could not disagree more! It should NOT be entirely up to the women to remedy men's bad behavior while men plead ignorance. "Hey, we thought the women enjoyed being grabbed, fondled, etc,"
7
The lack of commentary is telling. I think most men are just hoping it will all fade away as the publicity lessens and they can go back to the way things were. After all, they elected Trump despite his predatory tendencies and views of women in general.
56
I don't know if "most" men elected Trump, but I do agree that "most" men coast on the systemic, collateral privilege of being male. To men: if you are truly "not like that," please speak out and act up to resist and change the system. Police your crude, un-evolved brothers. Women shouldn't have to do it for you. We have enough problems on our hands, like finally, finally getting paid as much as you do. (Yes, and work on that as well.)
11
[[Karen K Illinois
I think most men are just hoping it will all fade away as the publicity lessens and they can go back to the way things were. After all, they elected Trump despite his predatory tendencies and views of women in general.]]
Go talk to your "sisters." Trump got a huge chunk of the white female vote. They chose him over another white female!
Have a great day.
1
Your comments have been awesome, a pleasure to read!
My sister-in-law's niece (I'll call her "Trish") met her husband in college.
After graduation, they married and both entered the Army.
Trish went to language school and became one of those patriotic people who listened in and translates communications between terrorists, thus, defending all of us.
Trish lasted one enlistment and got out.
She couldn't take being constantly Weinsteined by all the male patriots in her unit.
119
Real men don't need to harass or abuse women. On the other hand, even those "real" men need to stop turning a blind eye and stand up for their sisters.
12
We should give Anita Hill a long-deserved medal. Without her brave example, we would not be where we are at this turning point. She paved the way and for that she was punished and ridiculed.
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I agree. I believe that Anita Hill should be the symbol of courage in a system carved from cowardice.
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It won't really be a turning point as long as Clarence Thomas remains on the Supreme Court. If he had any ethics, which we know he doesn't from his many years as Scalia's lap dog, he would publicly apologize to Anita Hill and resign his seat on the court.
2
Anita Hill would make a great interim president when Trump and his administration of felons are at last frog-marched out of the White House.
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I have also read that sexual harassment extends to child actors in Hollywood, and I would like to see those concerns included in the discussion.
15
Agreed but it is not sexual harassment -- it is violence.
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In terms of Harvey, I think we can safely conclude that his epic disgrace is long overdue, well deserved, and may in fact, result in a prison term.
In terms of Clarence and Donald, their just desserts are overdue. But karma catches up with everyone, sometimes when you least expect it. Keep looking over your shoulders boys, karma is coming for you. Her memory is excellent —much better than yours, Donald.
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I believe in the sociological butterfly effect, with a flapping of wings begun by historical figures ranging from Socrates to Patrick Henry to Marion Wallace Dunlop to Gandhi to Rosa Parks and so many other brave souls. But truth to power, I think more than anything else the astonishing shift of fundamental culture over the last several weeks is attributable to the New Yorker magazine's and New York Times's benevolent manufacture of consent.
1
As an older woman, I well remember my first encounter with the reality of sexual harassment when, after a raise, I was called into the boss's office. I had been told by his mistress, who sat outside his office, a glass-enclosed room, to thank the district clerk of Dallas County. He asked me after my thanks if that was all I would offer to him as thanks. I did and said nothing, smiled, and left. I was not frightened, nor really surprised. It was absolutely the way things were. That and the smoking in the offices stay in my memories. I hope this sexual outrage will join with other forces for change in attitudes to include equal rights for women, finally, that choice will continue to be the law of the land for women, that pay and advancement and real power will be part of this dialogue. The sexual harassment is a part of the package. Not the whole, a part.
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So much came out these days of sexual abuse in government offices, from California to Florida. All these abuses could have burst into the open at least twenty years ago. oh, it did once or twice or a few times, but in inconvenient times unfortunately.
I bet a dozen donuts that TRUMP never tweets a twit on Harvey Weinstein or the cultural shift that is outing so many of his peers as the amoral majority.
Time to question authority of all kinds.
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