Time isn't the issue, which isn't hard to solve. It's politics. Until now Congress could have it both ways - they allow DACS to continue without any embarrassing or difficult votes.
1
So only those that are in college are eligible for permission to stay in the country, but others that may be performing valuable work that does not require a college degree are not eligible?
I wish there could be honest discussions by both sides (Dems and Repubs) about the impact of illegal immigration. Dems want to allow everyone a free pass, without a honest assessment of the impact that illegal immigration has on lower skilled citizens and legal residents. Repubs want to allow no one, except when large multinational corporations need a workforce to exploit those working in dangerous jobs. Both sides need to admit that there are both positive and negative impacts for illegal immigration and stop holding fast to their respective positions.
BTW, if the DACA students are permitted to stay and eventually become citizens, don't they then have the right to sponsor relatives to live in this country? Are they then eligible to have their parents, who brought them here illegally become legal?
I wish there could be honest discussions by both sides (Dems and Repubs) about the impact of illegal immigration. Dems want to allow everyone a free pass, without a honest assessment of the impact that illegal immigration has on lower skilled citizens and legal residents. Repubs want to allow no one, except when large multinational corporations need a workforce to exploit those working in dangerous jobs. Both sides need to admit that there are both positive and negative impacts for illegal immigration and stop holding fast to their respective positions.
BTW, if the DACA students are permitted to stay and eventually become citizens, don't they then have the right to sponsor relatives to live in this country? Are they then eligible to have their parents, who brought them here illegally become legal?
5
Perhaps having to work on the more sympathetic "Dreamers" issue might encourage the Congress towards breaking the logjam on beginning comprehensive immigration reform. Here is a suggested compromise: a DACA Act would permit those already in the country and under the age of 30 to remain in the country working toward citizenship (especially veterans). However, to discourage parents from illegally coming here in the future to get their children into the program, provide in the act that no children arriving in this country after the effective date of the act do not qualify for the program and will be subject to laws applying to illegal immigrants.
The concern about granting amnesty to the DACA recipients would be that it would encourage the next generation of parents to bring their children here illegally and wait it out for legalization. The whole point of having a borders is so that migration can occur legally.
6
Trump visited the hurricane affected areas of Texas, looked at the forecast for Florida, and then he went back to Washington and said to his immigration policy team, "What we need is more homeless refugees."
It has always been figured out. They are illegal.
5
Years ago, when Zoe Baird was in the headlines, I was at a Texas State Bar function. The speaker asked the audience if anyone could truthfully say they had never hired an undocumented worker. When one brave member raised his hand, the speaker retorted, "Bob, I've seen your house! You really should!"
In the late 1970's, when I was in college in California, I recall the corporate farms had crops rotting in the fields after increased border enforcement. The corporate farmers begged for the enforcement to be relaxed.
I suspect those opposed to immigration would be happy if we had Star Trek transporter technology - at 6:00 a.m., we beam the Mexican immigrant from Mexico into the fields and construction sites, and at 6:00 p.m., we beam them back to Mexico.
In the late 1970's, when I was in college in California, I recall the corporate farms had crops rotting in the fields after increased border enforcement. The corporate farmers begged for the enforcement to be relaxed.
I suspect those opposed to immigration would be happy if we had Star Trek transporter technology - at 6:00 a.m., we beam the Mexican immigrant from Mexico into the fields and construction sites, and at 6:00 p.m., we beam them back to Mexico.
3
Many immigration advocates assert that these dreamers are very valuable to the US and will make significant contributions to the US and that the US should be greatful and honored that they are here, illegal or not, and that the US would lose out were they required to return to their home countries.
I would assert that their home countries need them that much more than the US does, the education gained here and their English language fluency should be strong assets to their home countries. These dreamers are bilingual and should be a good educated addition to their home countries' work force. A kind of brain surge, instead of a brain drain, for their home countries.
Let them be a dream for their home countries instead of dreaming in the US.
After all, the US should not be the only country or one of a few countries worth living in; the other countries of the world need talented people to remain in their countries, or in the case of the dreamers, to return, for their societies to function and even improve.
I would assert that their home countries need them that much more than the US does, the education gained here and their English language fluency should be strong assets to their home countries. These dreamers are bilingual and should be a good educated addition to their home countries' work force. A kind of brain surge, instead of a brain drain, for their home countries.
Let them be a dream for their home countries instead of dreaming in the US.
After all, the US should not be the only country or one of a few countries worth living in; the other countries of the world need talented people to remain in their countries, or in the case of the dreamers, to return, for their societies to function and even improve.
7
The headline seems to imply that somehow the failure to pass a bill is a sign of systemic failure. It is not. The Constitution insures that an ill-considered bill which is controversial in nature cannot be pushed through just to pander to an aggrieved constituency in order to get their votes. There's a definite problem with giving the so-called Dreamers a way of getting around the immigration laws after they or their parents have already violated these same laws. To give them a path to citizenship because of their particular circumstances raises issues which are irresolvable. Why give them a break or favored treatment not given to others? Rather than being a sign of weakness or failure the inability of Congress to resolve the irresolvable after sixteen years is a sign that the system is working unless the goal is to subvert the constitutional process and to open up the borders to everyone as if the Constitution itself is just a relic of the past.
10
If this is an issue for Congress, why haven't they done anything one way or the other? They could shut DACA down easily if they think it is illegal. Doing nothing for 16 years is effectively an endorsement of the program.
6
Under the Constitution Immigration reform is a job for Congress. The law professor knew that but was frustrated by the failure of congress to act and crossed well over the constitutional line with DACA that included work permits.
The President put the job fairly and squarely back where it belongs, in congress. He did give time for a change from the unconstitutional policy that has been in place for five years now.
It is long past time for congress to address the entire issue.
The President put the job fairly and squarely back where it belongs, in congress. He did give time for a change from the unconstitutional policy that has been in place for five years now.
It is long past time for congress to address the entire issue.
11
Congress could easily have shut down the program any time they wanted to if they disagreed with it. Doing nothing all that time sends a clear message: we like the program but don't want to admit it to our constituency.
4
Lost in the current clamor over DACA is Trump’s termination of DAPA, which deferred deportation of undocumented parents of children who were born in the U.S. and are thus American citizens.
That policy of deporting parents of American children is arguably as or more counter-productive and cruel than DACA, since these are fellow Americans children who suffer the consequences of losing their parents. And it is well known that parental presence and guidance is the most important firewall that prevents children from falling into delinquency, dropping out of school, being recruited by gangs, etc.
That policy of deporting parents of American children is arguably as or more counter-productive and cruel than DACA, since these are fellow Americans children who suffer the consequences of losing their parents. And it is well known that parental presence and guidance is the most important firewall that prevents children from falling into delinquency, dropping out of school, being recruited by gangs, etc.
Really? Why don't we simply do away wit all laws, every one of the pernicious roadblocks to an anarchistic free for all? What great fun that would be!
3
DAPA should never come to pass as it is fundamentally rewarding illegal behavior and denying justice and fairness to those who are patiently waiting to legally immigrate. DAPA parents should be deported and in fact if ultimately DACA recipients were to be given a path towards a legal status; the parents should be deported and or never be allowed any legal status in the US because they are responsible for initiating this problem in the first place.
2
Since Trump ended the American dream, what can Congress do fix things? I think they will pretend to work on it, but in the end say, there was nothing we could do.
How many Dreamers does Canada have? None... Canada has some of the toughest, most restrictive immigration laws in the civilized world, which is really amusing when one stops to think about since most of Canada is open space...
4
life is unfair.. in this case it is to potential immigrants who played by the rules. the question is what to do? my feeling is they should be allowed to stay if they arrived before the arbitrary age of 13, but with tough financial penalties. they should like all working americans contribute to social security but should never receive benefits or put an equivalent surcharge on their income on top of foregone social security taxes for the privilege of staying here. furthermore they should never be allowed to receive welfare or medicaid. let their communities or other generous people support them but not the rest of us.
there has to be a rough equivalency between those immigrants who played by the rules and those who didn't. my suggestion of financial penalties will achieve this purpose although it can not do it completely.
there has to be a rough equivalency between those immigrants who played by the rules and those who didn't. my suggestion of financial penalties will achieve this purpose although it can not do it completely.
5
Making E-Verify mandatory for employers would solve this issue quickly.
The system is already in place. It works very well for both employers and employees.
DACA provided social security numbers to those who qualified, therefore allowing them to work without fear of retaliation.
If these people are already cleared to work in this country, revoking that right for no good reason is nothing short of shameful. What purpose does it serve other than inflicting cruelty?
The system is already in place. It works very well for both employers and employees.
DACA provided social security numbers to those who qualified, therefore allowing them to work without fear of retaliation.
If these people are already cleared to work in this country, revoking that right for no good reason is nothing short of shameful. What purpose does it serve other than inflicting cruelty?
3
To all those who have harshly and reflexively criticized Trump on his DACA announcement, save your energy for something else. Nothing has happened, is happening, and will happen that will cause deportation of qualified dreamers. Some of the reactions here sound like all dreamers have already been rounded up and forced to leave the country at gunpoint.
What Trump has done is brilliant. In essence, he threw the entire issue into Congress' lap - where it belongs. The constitutionality of President Obama's order has always been in doubt and may not survive a court challenge, which is imminent. If Congress acts ( which it will), the issue goes away, and dreamers are permanently protected by the enacted laws of this country.
Politically, both parties can claim credit. Trump obviously knew this and chose a method knowing that the resolution would give opponents political capital. What leader has done this in recent memory?
I have often criticized this president. In this case, he did the absolute correct thing, and set into motion a process that will insure the security of dreamers
Are there risks, knowing the dysfunction of Congress ? Of course. But I predict Congress will act in a bipartisan manner to protect dreamers.
Would anyone bet against my prediction ? Let me know, so I can remind you how wrong you were when my prediction comes to pass.
What Trump has done is brilliant. In essence, he threw the entire issue into Congress' lap - where it belongs. The constitutionality of President Obama's order has always been in doubt and may not survive a court challenge, which is imminent. If Congress acts ( which it will), the issue goes away, and dreamers are permanently protected by the enacted laws of this country.
Politically, both parties can claim credit. Trump obviously knew this and chose a method knowing that the resolution would give opponents political capital. What leader has done this in recent memory?
I have often criticized this president. In this case, he did the absolute correct thing, and set into motion a process that will insure the security of dreamers
Are there risks, knowing the dysfunction of Congress ? Of course. But I predict Congress will act in a bipartisan manner to protect dreamers.
Would anyone bet against my prediction ? Let me know, so I can remind you how wrong you were when my prediction comes to pass.
5
As a legal immigrant (not a citizen, still in-line), I am strongly against illegal immigrants (including DACA recipients) from getting ahead of the line towards citizenship. I just don't see a valid argument for illegals to be given priority or privilege (unrestrained work permits, where they can work for any employee/start business) when there is a significant backlog for legal immigrants.
Ban the parents for life from entering USA but provide the kids the opportunity to enter the country legally. However, the kids should not be able to obtain citizenship before anyone else who is legally waiting in line is my argument. Why should one economic migrant (DACA) be provided better opportunity to become a citizen while another (legal immigrant) is pushed to the back of the line?
Getting a citizenship because your parents broke the law is not right because your right to citizenship is dependent on someone breaking the law. I am not talking about a permanent ban on DACA recipients but prioritizing opportunity for the truly deserving (refugees, people fleeing violence and legal immigrants). Rest of the DACA recipients can apply for legal entry just like millions of others who are waiting in line. Don’t reward an illegal act, even if it was committed by parents. Illegal immigrants were legalized in the 80s/90s. How many times and how many illegals should be provided this opportunity? Doesn't this set a bad precedent? Moral Hazard.
Ban the parents for life from entering USA but provide the kids the opportunity to enter the country legally. However, the kids should not be able to obtain citizenship before anyone else who is legally waiting in line is my argument. Why should one economic migrant (DACA) be provided better opportunity to become a citizen while another (legal immigrant) is pushed to the back of the line?
Getting a citizenship because your parents broke the law is not right because your right to citizenship is dependent on someone breaking the law. I am not talking about a permanent ban on DACA recipients but prioritizing opportunity for the truly deserving (refugees, people fleeing violence and legal immigrants). Rest of the DACA recipients can apply for legal entry just like millions of others who are waiting in line. Don’t reward an illegal act, even if it was committed by parents. Illegal immigrants were legalized in the 80s/90s. How many times and how many illegals should be provided this opportunity? Doesn't this set a bad precedent? Moral Hazard.
29
I very much agree with this. Every form of amnesty sends the same message:
Ignore our laws, come here illegally - and we will let you stay.
Obey our laws, wait your turn - spend thousands and likely we won't let you in.
If my parents stole something that benefitted me - I wouldn't be allowed to keep it, even though I am entirely innocent and will be hurt by losing whatever it was they stole.
Ignore our laws, come here illegally - and we will let you stay.
Obey our laws, wait your turn - spend thousands and likely we won't let you in.
If my parents stole something that benefitted me - I wouldn't be allowed to keep it, even though I am entirely innocent and will be hurt by losing whatever it was they stole.
3
Immigration reform has been pending in Congress since the 90's. Dreamers are the easiest part of the puzzle. There is very little support in deporting kids who have known no other country than this.
The solution though is simple. Let the dreamers with no criminal history stay. Deport any illegals who are not dreamers regardless of criminal history. Offer them a pathway back into the country by allowing for visas for low skilled jobs.
Stop distributing employment based visas on a lottery where a database engineer with 1-year experience is the same as a doctor with 10. Make work visas temporary again - no more people on work visas for 15 years. Offer a path way to outstanding foreign students who graduate US universities.
Every 2-3 years identify areas which require immigrants to fill jobs. Open those areas for limited permanent immigrants with points based system. Invest in training skilled man power in the recognized field to cover the shortage of workers. Offer scholarships - etc,
The solution though is simple. Let the dreamers with no criminal history stay. Deport any illegals who are not dreamers regardless of criminal history. Offer them a pathway back into the country by allowing for visas for low skilled jobs.
Stop distributing employment based visas on a lottery where a database engineer with 1-year experience is the same as a doctor with 10. Make work visas temporary again - no more people on work visas for 15 years. Offer a path way to outstanding foreign students who graduate US universities.
Every 2-3 years identify areas which require immigrants to fill jobs. Open those areas for limited permanent immigrants with points based system. Invest in training skilled man power in the recognized field to cover the shortage of workers. Offer scholarships - etc,
2
As another legal immigrant with an impending decade long wait for a green card- I agree with you.
I came here as a skilled worker (which honestly seems to be lower on the totem pole of immigrant desirability than being illegal these days).
How will this 'pathway' to permanent residency/citizenship fair to legal immigrants?
Honestly though, the POV of a legal immigrant matter very little in this debate. The Democrats back amnesty-type solutions for illegal immigrants because of the electoral dividends that will accrue from that.
When the South Asian and Asian origin population in this country reach a number enough to sway a vote, maybe things will be more fair for legal immigrants like me.
Till then, we will be cursed at for 'taking jobs' but unlike illegal immigrants- will not have the Democrats on our team!
I came here as a skilled worker (which honestly seems to be lower on the totem pole of immigrant desirability than being illegal these days).
How will this 'pathway' to permanent residency/citizenship fair to legal immigrants?
Honestly though, the POV of a legal immigrant matter very little in this debate. The Democrats back amnesty-type solutions for illegal immigrants because of the electoral dividends that will accrue from that.
When the South Asian and Asian origin population in this country reach a number enough to sway a vote, maybe things will be more fair for legal immigrants like me.
Till then, we will be cursed at for 'taking jobs' but unlike illegal immigrants- will not have the Democrats on our team!
1
He gave Congress six months? How are you supposed to get anything done in six months. I mean really. Six years or six decades maybe but six months? Rome wasn't built in a day.
1
How about 16 years of inaction? They could solve this in a week if they had the will.
2
I just don't think most Americans care about this to see it everyday in the paper.
We have impending war, hurricanes, debt ceiling issues.....what more can we stand to worry about?
I'm legal, not a concern.
We have impending war, hurricanes, debt ceiling issues.....what more can we stand to worry about?
I'm legal, not a concern.
5
There is plenty I don't care to see in the paper. That doesn't mean it's not important. And I am relieved to see that "being legal" is all that is needed to not be a concern. Whew.
1
It was the previous clown's responsibility to have done something to protect those that had "no choice" in being an illegal. It was also that person's responsibility, when reaching an age of majority, to assure their status as a lawful resident of this country. It is not like this subject has NOT been out in the public domain for EVERYONE WITH HALF A BRAIN TO SEE AND HEAR.
3
AS an American, I resented Obama's over-step of authority in allowing DACA. But, we must move forward. Legalization ONLY should be given to those current DACA recipients, and no further applications effective immediately...no DACA, no more illegal aliens getting preferential treatment. A path to citizenship can only be granted if they abide by our laws and get in the back of the line, behind the hundreds of thousands of legal immigrants who hve waited years, and spent much money for the privilege of coming and working the the U.S. And most important, absolutely no consideration for DAPA. Ever! A "quick fix" to our immigration problem would be to "rewrite/reword" the 14th Amendment....no more anchor babies..supported by the majority of Americans. Any politician who would vote against it should be run out of Washington. Obama caused the problem, and he should stay out of this conversation and encourage his OFA and other alt-left progressive extremists to do the same.
7
"I resented Obama's over-step of authority in allowing DACA."
If Congress objected they could have ended it right away with a simple majority vote. Their acquiescence all this time demonstrates they are not interested in voting it down.
If Congress objected they could have ended it right away with a simple majority vote. Their acquiescence all this time demonstrates they are not interested in voting it down.
3
The Dreamers are 800,000 individuals who are contributing to American society, whether they are enrolled in the military, getting a higher education, or contributing to the communities in which they live. This alone should be enough to keep them in the country, but, evidently, President Trump believes otherwise. One would expect that President Trump would be able to see at the very least the economic destruction that deporting the Dreamers would cause. Repealing DACA isn’t about cracking down on illegal immigration. Repealing DACA is about racism. The amount of racist comments about Mexicans and illegal immigrants made by President Trump were astounding, and with the repeal of DACA it has become clear that he is acting out of personal prejudice. Though he, like every American, has the right to free speech, acting simply out of a personal prejudice as the POTUS is simply immoral, and against the checks and balances written in the U. S. Constitution. This action should serve as a reminder that racism is not only alive and thriving, but that it is institutionalized in our government, and we, as voters, need to do our part to fix it. I hope that, whatever Congress chooses to do about the Dreamers, they all come out of this with either a visa or a green card.
3
You have no idea how many are "contributing." None, nada. You just don't like Trump. And you obviously know little about the Constitution, and care very little about the rule of law. Here's the truth: what The former president, Mr. Obama, did was unconstitutional. He knew that. He knew it was the job of Congress to resolve the matter through legislative action. But he simply didn't care. He chose to employ the "Rule of Me"; whatever he said goes. But only so far... He made a mess for someone else to clean up... In fact, the current POTUS is doing exactly what the Constitution and belief in the rule of law requires... Its time to stop the crazy uninformed partisan sniping... The country deserves better...
4
Is it fair for all the other immigrants who have legally applied and are patiently waiting to give DACA recipients favoritism? Absolutely not - its not fair and its unjust to all those who are trying to immigrate legally. In the end these DACA recipients are illegally in the country because their illegal parents brought them here illegally. No reward should be given to illegal behavior. However, some form of solution should be fashioned maybe allowing them to apply for immigration from their home countries and getting in line just like every other applicant. The DACA parents who are responsible for this debacle should never be allowed any legal status in US and should be deported.
5
Protesting what the fake president did is pointless. While I despise him, his character and everything he stands for, I really don't think he did such a monstrous thing here: he set up the Dream Act to become law. It's up to Congress--the Republican led majority--to work with their president on immigration reform, because they refused to work with "the black guy." Okay, now you have one of your own: work.
2
Sorry to disagree but it's closer to 50 years of failed immigration policy and legislation that has given rise to this mess.
Penalizing decent hard working people in order to punish their parents is not just inappropriate, it is unjust and evil.
The entire world is now completely clear in understanding that Trump and the GOP do not want foreigners to come here, ever, ever again.
Are you really going to let him destroy the country?
Penalizing decent hard working people in order to punish their parents is not just inappropriate, it is unjust and evil.
The entire world is now completely clear in understanding that Trump and the GOP do not want foreigners to come here, ever, ever again.
Are you really going to let him destroy the country?
1
Legitimizing illegal immigration betrays legal immigrants that have stood in line and waited their turn.
13
People are so busy vilifying the president, that they forget that Obama stated, when issuing the executive order creating DACA, that it was a temporary fix and he did not have the authority to change federal immigration law through his executive orders. Only Congress can pass immigration laws. However heart rending the stories of Dreamers might be, they arrived in the United States illegally. If their status is to be changed, it must be done through legislation and not constitutionally dubious means. If the Rule of Law means nothing, then why have laws at all? We cannot pick and choose which laws we enforce as a nation. If the law is broken, then fix it through legal, not extra legal, means.
10
All the problems you identify could easily have been solved by Congress long ago. Their inaction is a sign of acquiescence - at the very least they want to have it both ways.
1
Just one more sign of the "whiting of America" push by Trump and his Nazi, KKK, and other white supremacist partners.
It is curious that approximately 80% of the DACA and similar persons are descended from countries in the Americas. Their roots are in the Americas, be that Mexico, Guatemala, etc. In most cases, this goes back millenia, through the Bering Strait thousands of years ago.
And now the descendants of white European immigrants of the last 100 years or so are suddenly the guardians of American ethnicity. And they clearly aim to make it even whiter. Trump's cowardly handling of DACA is just the first salvo. Will DNA classification at birth be next? Will a "clean" DNA Certificate be needed to be a legal native-born American Citizen?
We must all be alert and call things for what they are. Congress should read the tea leaves. 34% of the population will NOT be electing Congress next year, nor will they be electing the President in 2020. The remaining 66% majority of the citizenry must stand up and be counted. And put an end to this tyranny.
We must reaffirm the motto: "E PLURIBUS UNUM".
This is totally unbelievable. But true.
It is curious that approximately 80% of the DACA and similar persons are descended from countries in the Americas. Their roots are in the Americas, be that Mexico, Guatemala, etc. In most cases, this goes back millenia, through the Bering Strait thousands of years ago.
And now the descendants of white European immigrants of the last 100 years or so are suddenly the guardians of American ethnicity. And they clearly aim to make it even whiter. Trump's cowardly handling of DACA is just the first salvo. Will DNA classification at birth be next? Will a "clean" DNA Certificate be needed to be a legal native-born American Citizen?
We must all be alert and call things for what they are. Congress should read the tea leaves. 34% of the population will NOT be electing Congress next year, nor will they be electing the President in 2020. The remaining 66% majority of the citizenry must stand up and be counted. And put an end to this tyranny.
We must reaffirm the motto: "E PLURIBUS UNUM".
This is totally unbelievable. But true.
Most DACA enrollees are Hispanic. Hispanics can be of an race, but most are white. According to the U.S. Census Bureau, the United States was 77.1 percent white in 2015, up from 72.4 percent in 2010, due mostly to immigration from Latin America.
The Census Bureau projects the United States will continue to grow whiter as long as current migration trends continues, but that whites may decline slightly as a percentage of the population around mid-century due to an increase in immigration from Asia. However, proposed changes from family unification-based immigration to merit-based immigration many change immigrant demographics.
https://www.census.gov/quickfacts/table/PST045215/00
The Census Bureau projects the United States will continue to grow whiter as long as current migration trends continues, but that whites may decline slightly as a percentage of the population around mid-century due to an increase in immigration from Asia. However, proposed changes from family unification-based immigration to merit-based immigration many change immigrant demographics.
https://www.census.gov/quickfacts/table/PST045215/00
7
Mr. Case - For better or worse, most people put Hispanics in a separate category although most are Caucasian. I'm quite sure that the white supremacists who universally support Trump don't think of Hispanics as white.
1
All of the libs are writing with hateful emotions and not one ounce of reality: For two years Obama had all 3 branches and he could have worked through congress on new immigration legislation, which he didn't do, Obama tried to legislate the dreamer solution via executive order. Prior to DACA order Obama stated 7 times he can't make laws then he turned around and did it anyway. Obama the dictator at it again. DACA encouraged even more illegals pouring across our borders. So now Trump throws it back to Congress and he receives such hateful comments from the NYT and their commenters. Executive branch power has is out of control. I'm hopeful this move will force congress to legislate.
20
The republican Congress in power for 7 years could have undone Obama's action any time it wanted to. Clearly they didn't want to. They wanted to have it both ways. More Republican hypocrisy.
2
Great. Give them all 30 days to leave along with their parents. Hand them an application and they can mail it in from their home country. If they don't self deport in 30 days, round them up, arrest them and bus them back south of the border directly to Mexican jails.
8
I say all parents of Dreamers must come forward for immediate deportation and then maybe their kids can stay but NEVER should they be allowed to vote. Consequences. Pick your poison.
12
Please comepare F-1 Kids came here legally wand walk the H1b lottery path to DACA. How is this fair? F-1 kid has no parent, no relatives? Tons of them came here under 16, paid double tuition fees...Yet, if their academic path and h1b path did not walk out, they have to be deported just like the illegal ones. How is this fair?
3
NYT Headline: "Trump Tweet Saying He’ll ‘Revisit’ DACA Creates Confusion"
My Headline: "The Head of the Most Powerful Democracy in the World Engages in Willy-nilly Bozo Strategies - Duh!"
My Headline: "The Head of the Most Powerful Democracy in the World Engages in Willy-nilly Bozo Strategies - Duh!"
2
Just so we all have the same facts here: From 2009 to 2016, Obama deported more than 3 MILLION illegal immigrants. Think about that. Your hero, was the deporter-in-chief. But Trump cancels the Dream Act and its liberal mayhem.
8
Congress will continue to fail as long as lobbyists are allowed to fill their pockets with fat money. The true scam on America. Where are the parents of these dreamers? Any illegal immigrant bearing children in the US should not be allowed to be US citizens. You have the state bearing the responsibility of the children.
11
Is there any punishment for a president who willfully violated constitution as Obama did?
11
Bombastic, blubbering, banal, benign bunch of baboons.
2018 here we come!
2018 here we come!
1
So what is the problem? I recall that St Ronald of Reagan made close to 3 million illegals citizens with the stroke of pen. Congress can pass a law stating that anyone in the DACA program is now a citizen. Then we can all watch the orange one sign it. RIGHT
2
Limbo is meant to hurt brown people. It is in effect a form of quasi slavery. It is morally offensive. But in this offense to innocents who were children when they arrived in our nation a new generation of leaders will arise who will work to right this great Southern injustice.
Our current leaders (broken down morally corrupt generation of white men) will pass on and good riddance to them and their foul ideology.
Our current leaders (broken down morally corrupt generation of white men) will pass on and good riddance to them and their foul ideology.
1
Open borders and illegal immigration hurts my black relatives.
Please consider that poor Americans are being hurt by illegal immigration.
Please consider that poor Americans are being hurt by illegal immigration.
11
Well 16 years not enough you say. Are you ready to absorb close to 1 billion dollars to deport (one way only at about 1 thousand dollars per deportee) all 800,000 DACA. Are you really ready?
Had Congress not jettisoned their responsiblities to go on August holiday, they'd have 7.25 months to solve this problem. It's hard to understand why Americans put so much faith in Article I. See: Congress, an army of shirkers & no shows.
2
Rep Mike Coffman is a perfect example of GOP dysfunction. This has been a problem for well over a decade, he even represents a majority Latino district, but it's not about the DREAMERSs, it's not about justice, it's about how the Republicans can claim credit for something. (And waste $1.6B on a wall.)
These demonstrating "dreamers" might have more credibility if their signs were in English rather then Spanish. Apparently they expect the rest of us to understand Spanish.
22
The original settlers in Jamestown were undocumented. The pilgrims on Plymouth Rock were undocumented. Many of ancestors of NY City's Irish Police were undocumented. But they were all white.
White people really do hate us.
White people really do hate us.
My African and English ancestors were documented for over 300 years; these people need to get in line and be counted and respect our country's laws.
8
Except for Native Amerindians, Americans, South Americans and Canadians, we are ALL immigrants or their descendants.
The only thing holding the 'dreamers' back now is the 'racist nativism' of white supremacists in the Trump Administration and Congress who fear all people of color. What a pity!
'That' (fear and bigotry) does not make America Great AT ALL!
Trump and his administration are a disgrace to your country.
The only thing holding the 'dreamers' back now is the 'racist nativism' of white supremacists in the Trump Administration and Congress who fear all people of color. What a pity!
'That' (fear and bigotry) does not make America Great AT ALL!
Trump and his administration are a disgrace to your country.
I am so frustrated by congressional inaction. This should have been done a decade ago. When it came up for a vote in 2007, it failed in the Senate even though some Republicans -- like Collins (ME), Snowe (ME), Hutchison (TX), Hagel (NE), Lott (MS) and even Hatch (UT) and Brownback (KS)! -- supported it. And I lay a lot of the blame at the feet of Democrats: both senators from Montana (Baucus and Tester) and North Dakota (Conrad and Dorgan) voted no. Montana and North Dakota? Were they afraid of all those Canadians rushing the border? There aren't enough Latino migrants in both states to say 'hola' to each other! This was racism, pure and simple, either on the part of these senators or the constituents they pandered to. Shame on the US and the Democrats who voted no (including Claire McCaskill) for this despicable record.
Interesting that for the majority of Americans, there were NO IMMIGRATION LAWS TO BREAK until the late 80s and 90s --when we began country quotas. So for all immigrants prior to this time, they were able to 'legally' enter the country as long as they had not previously broken the law - ie. they were not prostitutes, convicts within their home country. Today some focus on a legal standard that never applied to their ancestors --and apply it without mercy in a way that would have destroyed their own family.
You are incorrect. Colonies did not work that way; that is why different areas of America had different nationalities. Stranger danger applied then as well as now.
Build the wall and fix illegal entry.
Build the wall and fix illegal entry.
5
Mr. Trump is without a doubt the worst president in American history. He knows nothing of American history, even less about politics and is a conniving, sneak about president interested basically in himself, his money and finally his family. He is also a narrow minded fascist who has no understanding that America is the land of the free. He should boat out to the Statue of Liberty and read what it says. Most of us have. For that reason we understand that our immigrants are OUR people and we aim to keep them. May the protests continue even in the face of that horrid Mr. Sessions.
Let's get one thing straight. Only congress has the constitutional right to create immigration policy in the United States. DACA is an act implemented by Mr. Obama, hence it reflects the opinion of the then POTUS not the will of the American people. Mr. Trump's action to phase out DACA directs congress to get off its collective derriere and create a viable law to define the status and rights of the so-called Dreamers. If the American people want to incorporate them as legal aliens with a quick track to citizenship, the law should permit them to remain and seek citizenship. If the American people don't want them to remain in the country, the law should grant appropriate powers to the executive department to remove them. It's as simple as that.
13
Wow. I'm amazed at some of these comments. They broke the law. Deport them all. Why didn't they become citizens?? These dreamers had to go to school, get jobs, join the military and stay out of trouble. They speak English or are bi-lingual. They are registered in the DACA database and pay $500 each time their term ends. There isn't a pathway to citizenship the way the law was written. All they know is how to be a responsible American. Where's our collective compassion?
2
Trump threw congress a hand grenade with a 6 month fuse burning down.
he doesn't want to be declared a coward for not jumping on it himself so he's letting his best buds do it.
Too bad the GOP congress are all shirkers who don't know how to load their weapons. . .
he doesn't want to be declared a coward for not jumping on it himself so he's letting his best buds do it.
Too bad the GOP congress are all shirkers who don't know how to load their weapons. . .
Obama skated the issue by refusing to address it and instead ruled by fiat.
2
Donald Trump is doing what the Obama administration failed to do, he's spearheading making Dreamers legal, once and for all. Trump haters are so full of rage they fail to recognize the handwriting on the wall.
8
I have read that educational requirements for DACA are very loose and signing up for an "underwater basket weaving" course would count as meeting the educational requirements for DACA. Trust Obama to make it super easy for anyone to get DACA,
We need to vet everyone carefully before we allow them to get on a path for LPR and we must be prepared to eliminate some who do not MERIT admission to the US.
But make no mistake this is just another amnesty, which in 1986 we were told that the amnesty given that would be the last one. As you can we were lied to and tricked. Now we have another amnesty. Personalty I am against it. I don;t care how sympathetic this current group is, they are still illegal aliens and should be deported, instead of forcing another amnesty down the throat of Americans who don't want one. I don't find the cause of any illegal alien so appealing that I believe we should give them amnesty.
Let me add this word of advice to the NYT editors =Unauthorized, undocumented = illegal. Stop using euphemism as an effort to try to conceal people's status. Those words you think up do not change the reality - they are illegal.
We need to vet everyone carefully before we allow them to get on a path for LPR and we must be prepared to eliminate some who do not MERIT admission to the US.
But make no mistake this is just another amnesty, which in 1986 we were told that the amnesty given that would be the last one. As you can we were lied to and tricked. Now we have another amnesty. Personalty I am against it. I don;t care how sympathetic this current group is, they are still illegal aliens and should be deported, instead of forcing another amnesty down the throat of Americans who don't want one. I don't find the cause of any illegal alien so appealing that I believe we should give them amnesty.
Let me add this word of advice to the NYT editors =Unauthorized, undocumented = illegal. Stop using euphemism as an effort to try to conceal people's status. Those words you think up do not change the reality - they are illegal.
20
Reagan gave amnesty to millions.
Everyone thought his action was moral when it was really immoral.
His action has resulted in the current dilemma.
Granting amnesty to these illegal immigrants will only lead to bigger headaches.
Everyone thought his action was moral when it was really immoral.
His action has resulted in the current dilemma.
Granting amnesty to these illegal immigrants will only lead to bigger headaches.
15
Reagan later said that this action, of pushing through the 1986 Amnesty Bill, was the "stupidest decision I ever made."
A complete disaster that is repeatedly revisited upon us, in Groundhog Day movie fashion, by our inept and cowardly political class. It fits perfectly the definition of insanity attributed to Einstein: "doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results."
End the insanity. No more amnesties.
Start enforcing the laws. Restore control over our borders and over our immigration policy.
A complete disaster that is repeatedly revisited upon us, in Groundhog Day movie fashion, by our inept and cowardly political class. It fits perfectly the definition of insanity attributed to Einstein: "doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results."
End the insanity. No more amnesties.
Start enforcing the laws. Restore control over our borders and over our immigration policy.
5
It's time for Congress to stand up and do something.
I'm glad Trump did this. Congress needs to act. I'm sick and tired of all the executive orders...pass a Bill.
I believe the problem with Congress...BOTH parties...is really a simple one. Instead of legislating...and solving problems...they spend all their time trying to figure out what special interest group might get angry if they do the right thing...and how many campaign dollars will be lost. It's ridiculous. Do the right thing...put America first...not special interests and lobbyists.
I'm glad Trump did this. Congress needs to act. I'm sick and tired of all the executive orders...pass a Bill.
I believe the problem with Congress...BOTH parties...is really a simple one. Instead of legislating...and solving problems...they spend all their time trying to figure out what special interest group might get angry if they do the right thing...and how many campaign dollars will be lost. It's ridiculous. Do the right thing...put America first...not special interests and lobbyists.
8
These people are no longer immigrants more or less since they have been here for years. There is a quick solution rather than keeping this as a political football. It is disgusting that BOTH parties have used this.
the FIX: give them all green cards ONLY, no chance for citizenship. Revoke the greencard if they commit a felony, if they pay into social security then they get medicare -and social security when they retire, and most importantly, reducing legal immigration from Mexico and south until the numbers zero out. If 50000 legals are admitted every year, it will take 16 years to work that off. Straight forward and no hostages.
the FIX: give them all green cards ONLY, no chance for citizenship. Revoke the greencard if they commit a felony, if they pay into social security then they get medicare -and social security when they retire, and most importantly, reducing legal immigration from Mexico and south until the numbers zero out. If 50000 legals are admitted every year, it will take 16 years to work that off. Straight forward and no hostages.
3
People, listen. There is a difference between anti-immigration and anti-illegal-immigration. Can't you see?
I am a legal immigrant and I am against Trump on all accounts, except for immigration. Illegal immigration should be stopped. Period. It is unfair and enabling. The US government is very gracious already to these undocumented people who came to the US without legal paperwork. I don't understand why people think it's okay to allow these people in the country and eventually naturalize them. I wish you all knew how difficult it is to enter and migrate to the US LEGALLY. Illegal immigrants should not receive preferential treatment. They are law-breakers. People can see why one should not drive without a driver's license. Similarly, if you don't have proper paperwork/visas, one must not stay let alone live and work. Period.
I am a legal immigrant and I am against Trump on all accounts, except for immigration. Illegal immigration should be stopped. Period. It is unfair and enabling. The US government is very gracious already to these undocumented people who came to the US without legal paperwork. I don't understand why people think it's okay to allow these people in the country and eventually naturalize them. I wish you all knew how difficult it is to enter and migrate to the US LEGALLY. Illegal immigrants should not receive preferential treatment. They are law-breakers. People can see why one should not drive without a driver's license. Similarly, if you don't have proper paperwork/visas, one must not stay let alone live and work. Period.
22
The strongest voices against amnesty and in favof of enforcing our immigration laws are those of legal immigrants. It takes over TEN YEARS for a resident legal alien to gain citizenship.
It is outrageous that nationals of one country (four, if you add Mexico's southern neighbors) should be allowed to trample on the laws that nationals of 190 other nations are required to abide by.
Why is this Mexican Exception supported so earnestly by our politicians?
It couldn't possibly have to do with cynical vote-getting and political opportunism, could it?
It is outrageous that nationals of one country (four, if you add Mexico's southern neighbors) should be allowed to trample on the laws that nationals of 190 other nations are required to abide by.
Why is this Mexican Exception supported so earnestly by our politicians?
It couldn't possibly have to do with cynical vote-getting and political opportunism, could it?
8
Not a new idea but what if every single US citizen were required to carry a federal ID card? The card would be required to vote, get a job, open a bank account, get a drivers license, apply for benefits, or any other significant event regulated by the government. 1984? Maybe, but it would eliminate the need for a 'beautiful wall' and voter registration and potentially many other requirements we currently fret and argue about. I realize this concept may be opposed by people on both ends of the political spectrum for various reasons. If I say that this system is used by other countries successfully does that automatically disqualify it?
We pride ourselves for being exceptional but there are people in other countries that look at us and just shake their heads in disbelief. For the haters: I am an American patriot, retired military officer and combat veteran. I am not a member of any secret globalist society or communist sleeper cell.
We pride ourselves for being exceptional but there are people in other countries that look at us and just shake their heads in disbelief. For the haters: I am an American patriot, retired military officer and combat veteran. I am not a member of any secret globalist society or communist sleeper cell.
2
The Democrats and Obama would like DACA to be hanging over the heads of Congress while they try to pass a bill. There is no reason why an illegal executive order should be given such legitimacy. Congress passes bills and then the President signs them. There is no place for stop-gap measures which assume the force of law as a fait accompli until such time as Congress can act. Obama, of course, thinks it was the "right thing to do," as if his personal moral judgment should be the deciding factor regardless of the separation of powers. Likewise the emotional reaction of Democrats to the rescinding of the order is extra-Constitutional. If they're looking for someone to blame for the false hopes given to Dreamers it should be Obama for acting illegally in the first place. Ultimately the law is all we have, not the bland assurances of a self-appointed benevolent despot who seems reluctant to let go of the reins of power. He would do the country a greater favor by following Bush 43's example and keeping his mouth shut.
9
Since many Dreamers came out of hiding and revealed personal information based on the Government's promise not to us it against them, aren't there Fifth amendment issues here? Could the Feds be barred from using any of that information to support a deportation order?
Our Homeland Security should have information on every illegal immigrant or visitor who enters our country, and MONITOR their where-abouts much as Russia, China and yes, North Korea does to their visitors.
Enough, already.
Enough, already.
3
They need to keep DACA going. It's unfair to the potentially countless millions of other DREAMERS waiting to be brought into the US. The time to immigrate under the cover of night is NOW, while immigration laws are not really enforced. I am not recommending that anyone break the law, but if the government doesn't enforce it's own laws, why should anyone looking to enter the country play by the rules?
8
trump campaigned on deporting millions and millions voted for deportation.
Now trump has almost 1 million peoples personal information making tracking, locating and deporting 1 million people easy - almost tailor made - to the electrifying cheer of his base. Imagine his rallies come next February.
The DACA followed the rules, registered, paid the $468 fee, got an education, hold jobs, and pay taxes. They are law biding citizens. How does our government repay them? By rounding them up in order to intern them and then deport them.
Had the US not been at war with Japan, we would have deported the interned Japanese Americans back to Japan.
And we wonder why people do not trust their government.
Now trump has almost 1 million peoples personal information making tracking, locating and deporting 1 million people easy - almost tailor made - to the electrifying cheer of his base. Imagine his rallies come next February.
The DACA followed the rules, registered, paid the $468 fee, got an education, hold jobs, and pay taxes. They are law biding citizens. How does our government repay them? By rounding them up in order to intern them and then deport them.
Had the US not been at war with Japan, we would have deported the interned Japanese Americans back to Japan.
And we wonder why people do not trust their government.
DACA recipients are not citizens of the United States but of the various countries in which they were born. Presidents can't give citizenship to people. Only Congress can.
5
While it may be up to Congress to write legislation, for generations, the president has had a critical role in setting the legislative agenda and shaping U.S. domestic policy. Yet with healthcare, Donald Trump set no legislative goals and remained aloof of the policy details, while leaving the crafting of the ACA's replacement to congressional leaders. Unsurprisingly, that effort failed. Now, Trump has ended DACA without providing any policy aims for a legislative fix, while shifting responsibility to Congress.
In short, the president has twice sought to "lead" by punting to Congress on two complex and consequential issues. And this from a man who claims the mantle of leadership based on his deal-making skills.
In short, the president has twice sought to "lead" by punting to Congress on two complex and consequential issues. And this from a man who claims the mantle of leadership based on his deal-making skills.
8
This seems to actually be a good position for the Dems.
And if the GOP wants concessions, such as funding for the wall, then accept it, and call it what it is, a stimulus to put American to work.
And if the GOP wants concessions, such as funding for the wall, then accept it, and call it what it is, a stimulus to put American to work.
Good luck getting help for these folks. We have the absolute weakest congressional leadership that I can remember, and I'm 53. The man at the top isn't much better, but he did pass the buck to those who should address this issue.
1
Gosh..I hope i'm not the only one that says this. But it seems that in this case..much like the pro choice/pro life argument we meet ourselves in that "gray place" in our conscience. And we shouldn't, we can't waffle here. Allowing the hard right wingers to gain more purchase into the "spirit" of our experiment in self governance. With the GOP in control of the halls of governance and we (the left) standing against this constant ill wind, again we will be cast as the obstructionists here. And we can feel it coming, thus that nagging feeling of being at odds with the very people we seek to lead.
Hear that Mr President, 16 years! Both sides. All that came from it was the flawed DACA, and that was something.
But listening to the WH Press Co. yesterday Sarah made a very telling statement.During a response,Sarah argued statistics,that a higher unemployment rate of Americans are within the average age range of Dreamers BUT she refered solely on one group making up that number: African-Americans!
While I try didn't want to read anything into it, the ideology was very clear. Out with the Dreamers and return menial labour to its 'rightful' group: African-Americans. Perhaps I might be reading into it,but that is the impressions I got. And, frankly, we all know, majority of Americans are NOT willing to do "humble jobs" because it's NOT for them, it's meant for immigrants who find themselves here.
I am certain, there are highly educated immigrants that wind up taking on these kinds of jobs because that's the norm and what, in the eyes of some Americans, is acceptable for them because better opportunities are for an entitled lot.
But listening to the WH Press Co. yesterday Sarah made a very telling statement.During a response,Sarah argued statistics,that a higher unemployment rate of Americans are within the average age range of Dreamers BUT she refered solely on one group making up that number: African-Americans!
While I try didn't want to read anything into it, the ideology was very clear. Out with the Dreamers and return menial labour to its 'rightful' group: African-Americans. Perhaps I might be reading into it,but that is the impressions I got. And, frankly, we all know, majority of Americans are NOT willing to do "humble jobs" because it's NOT for them, it's meant for immigrants who find themselves here.
I am certain, there are highly educated immigrants that wind up taking on these kinds of jobs because that's the norm and what, in the eyes of some Americans, is acceptable for them because better opportunities are for an entitled lot.
Thanks to all the liberals who insisted on encouraging illegal immigration and all the conservatives who lacked the guts to stand up to them. Time for somebody to step up and do what is right, not what is politically expedient. Allowing illegal activity of any kind to continue unchecked never resolves a problem.
11
I am horrified at the idea of putting the lives of students, workers and family members in a state of limbo. To throw a wrench or spanner into the system, who is goin' to pay for this vicious idea? 800,000 adults and young adults - whos gonna catch them and haul them onto airplanes? Who's gonna pay for the flights, the legal costs, the bills that they aren't able to pay (cars, insurance, mortages, you name it). Are classrooms and factory floors gonna be disrupted and Dreamers hauled away, while others watch, fight back or are just frightened out of their wits?
There is no puzzle. Just like raising the debt ceiling and hurricane relief should be so simple that Congress can do them in their sleep, protecting dreamers should be simplest thing in the world: people who were brought here as children and grew up here are not at fault, and should be protected, whatever consensus Congress comes to on changes in immigration policy. By calling it a puzzle you are normalizing the extraordinary dysfunction that has become the federal government. Congress is so inept and the president is so inept, that they can't even pass legislation when every branch is controlled by the same party.
11
Stop with the euphemisms. "Grant legal status" means amnesty in the real world. "Unauthorized immigrants" means illegals. I will not support any pol of any party who is in favor of amnesty for illegals. It is the Dems who the hardliners on this issue. They are unwilling to allow any immigration laws at all. A country that does not enforce immigration laws is not a country.
21
Maybe you haven't heard but we are a nation of immigrants. Just ask the American Indians.
2
We want our laws obeyed and enforced. Illegals have no right to even be in OUR country, they broke the law
12
I wonder if Native Americans, from whom this land now known as The United States was stolen, feel the same way about "YOUR" country.
2
This problem could be solved in a day. Give amnesty to every undocumented immigrant worker residing in America. Give them more money, food, housing, free college and healthcare. It's our responsibility to make their lives easier. Allow them to bring all of their extended family members from abroad so they can live here too. Let's just keep giving, giving, giving, giving- and the first person to disagree with my policy of compassion is a xenophobic racist!
15
I have a much better solution. Let's round up 800,000 opioid addicts in the Midwest. These people are a drain on the economy, useless parasites, wasting the taxpayer' s money. Let's dump them in Mexico and in exchange accept 800,000 young productive citizens, all of whom, at the very least, have completed high school (or they would not be in DACA). Population exchanges are legal under international law if both sides agree, and I'm sure the drug cartels would appreciate having a captive consumer base close to home. And if you disagree with my opinion, you are a bleeding-heart snowflake, unable to understand the fundamentals of economics.
1
THIS Congress will not solve the problem. They are unable to move, or govern. They don't have the humanity to deal with such an issue. So many of them are racists who will never change, even if it effects our economy. They are incompetent, and should be replaced. Blah, blah, blah. Renew DACA. It is NOT illegal, and everyone knows that.
2
I really hate to say it but I think Trump did the right thing to try to force Congress to act. Unfortunately, he has not shown the leadership potential, and Congress has not shown the ability, to be optimistic that it will work this time. And the lives of millions (the Dreamers and their families) will be uprooted. Sad!
2
Simple solution. Start jailing employers of illegal aliens. As work dries up for the parents of these Dreamers the parents will self-deport. And then when DACA expires the Dreamers can join their parents in their native country, keeping the family unit intact.
13
Maybe, just maybe Trump has stumbled into a strategy that might work. His mixed message to Congress is that if they don't legalize this then they will have to live with the Obama policy. Even a broken clock is right twice a day.
4
Wow have you been bamboozled. They will not "live" with the Obama policy. The Justice Department and Homeland Security are in the process of dismantling it. If Congress does nothing, DACA will not come back.
Barbara. DACA, as a program is DEAD. The 800,000 recipients will be grandfathered in (no doubt). DACA will never come back. It's gone. Thank heavens, and thanks President Trump.
3
See this analysis from Vox of DACA and the effects of Trump's action for a simple but thorough explanation:
https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2017/9/1/16243080/daca-trump-cha...
Josh Marshall of TPM comments:
"One of Trump’s cardinal impulses is to hurt people. A secondary impulse is to make deals if he agrees not to hurt people. In other words, a typical gangster."
But he's also a coward and con man, so he tries to shift blame and equivocate, hoping to dupe the gullible that he means well to all.
https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2017/9/1/16243080/daca-trump-cha...
Josh Marshall of TPM comments:
"One of Trump’s cardinal impulses is to hurt people. A secondary impulse is to make deals if he agrees not to hurt people. In other words, a typical gangster."
But he's also a coward and con man, so he tries to shift blame and equivocate, hoping to dupe the gullible that he means well to all.
3
Marshall makes a point so good, it's frightening.
I'm not sure that we should frame it as a sixteen-year effort since the members have changed multiple times over the last 16 years."Congress" isn't a jello mold. Might we not rephrase it as 16 years of electing incompetent representatives. Or something?
3
"Congress" isn't a jello mold."
RIGHT. It is a box of spineless gummy worms that have used this issue as political football, and some of that problem BELOGNS to the voters who could also care less because they also benefit from cheap labor supplied by immigrants , legal and otherwise. This is an issue that began in California in the 50's known then as the bracero program which got out of hand and really pushed up the illegal immigration, and of course the agriculture industry is very much to blame for our current problem. LEt them pay for all this business--they are the biggest benefactors anyway.
RIGHT. It is a box of spineless gummy worms that have used this issue as political football, and some of that problem BELOGNS to the voters who could also care less because they also benefit from cheap labor supplied by immigrants , legal and otherwise. This is an issue that began in California in the 50's known then as the bracero program which got out of hand and really pushed up the illegal immigration, and of course the agriculture industry is very much to blame for our current problem. LEt them pay for all this business--they are the biggest benefactors anyway.
When did it become appropriate to punish children because their parents violated a law?
1
When did children reap the rewards of their parents illegal actions? If I rob a bank, do my children get to keep the money?
9
Agree with you. Deport the parents.
7
Why didn't the (now grown) children start the process to become citizens? Surely we can't punish those that are still minors, but those who have graduated from High School and/or College should be held accountable, no?
1
Hopefully, Congress will solve a bigger puzzle in less than 6 months, and that will be the removal of Trump from the presidency.
3
Yeah, let's hope for that... President Pence will be far more sympathetic than Trump to illegal aliens. Conservative Republicans are rooting for Mueller to actually find something!
It is all up to the Congress now. I'm glad the President decided not to act like an autocrat and is, in effect, forcing Congress to do its job.
Of the 800,000 children often cited in the press, it seems like many of them have been in the country for many years. For those that fit the bill, if they love it so much here, why didn't they start the process to become citizens? Immigration is a wonderful thing, if it leads to these same 'immigrants' becoming part of our union.
Of the 800,000 children often cited in the press, it seems like many of them have been in the country for many years. For those that fit the bill, if they love it so much here, why didn't they start the process to become citizens? Immigration is a wonderful thing, if it leads to these same 'immigrants' becoming part of our union.
5
Wow 700,00 perfect citizens. I wonder when the parents of these adults told their children they were here illegally. They parents must have know that they were here illegally and probably under the radar. While we can't send them back to what ever country we can limit their ability to gain citizenship and that of their parents to acquire legal status but never be able to vote. There must be some penalty.
8
Well, 800,000 perfect ones, apparently, and more who did not trust the process and chose not to try to legitimize their standing.
But, yes, all are upstanding, perfect, etc like they're from the fictitious Lake Wobegone.
And, by the way, are you interested in buying an iconic bridge?
But, yes, all are upstanding, perfect, etc like they're from the fictitious Lake Wobegone.
And, by the way, are you interested in buying an iconic bridge?
5
It would appear that there are only two demographic groups who are opposed to DACA: 1) Trump's base. 2) House Republicans.
16 years of failure is not enough. Let's try another 16 years. 2017 16 = 2033.
1
So far in the Trump Presidency has either the President or our GOP Congress shown one ounce of courage or moral leadership? Have they gotten anything done? No. No. No. Nothing.
So why are we expecting anything different in September? Healthcare failure because who cares about the people. And now we expect the GOP to care about Mexicans (hispanics)? Reaching across the aisle? Why?
Today's photo ops and sound bites to compassion are just a show because it is the topic du jour. Soon Irma will refocus the camera angles and the GOP will go back to fighting about how much harm those Dreamers are really doing to American society. Taking jobs, crime!!!
The GOP knows what Trump and Sessions want and it has nothing to do with law and order. Remember Sheriff Joe? His concentration camps were just fine with everyone - debasing then deporting 'them'.
I will be surprised if anything gets done regarding the Dreamers. Big money matters are looming and Trump and the GOP smell tax cuts/reform. So much more satisfying that worrying about 'them' besides we can kick 'them' out soon so why worry they won't be around to complain.
And the Democrats what can they do? Show support but lacking votes is not a winning position. We are suffering from a completely ineffectual and weak Congress with no ethical compass to guide them.
So why are we expecting anything different in September? Healthcare failure because who cares about the people. And now we expect the GOP to care about Mexicans (hispanics)? Reaching across the aisle? Why?
Today's photo ops and sound bites to compassion are just a show because it is the topic du jour. Soon Irma will refocus the camera angles and the GOP will go back to fighting about how much harm those Dreamers are really doing to American society. Taking jobs, crime!!!
The GOP knows what Trump and Sessions want and it has nothing to do with law and order. Remember Sheriff Joe? His concentration camps were just fine with everyone - debasing then deporting 'them'.
I will be surprised if anything gets done regarding the Dreamers. Big money matters are looming and Trump and the GOP smell tax cuts/reform. So much more satisfying that worrying about 'them' besides we can kick 'them' out soon so why worry they won't be around to complain.
And the Democrats what can they do? Show support but lacking votes is not a winning position. We are suffering from a completely ineffectual and weak Congress with no ethical compass to guide them.
4
I realize some are way, way beyond reason and facts, but just so's it gets said:
1. A bipartisan reform bill was in Congress about 2006. It had the President's full suppport. The far Right blew it up.
2. DACA requires that you have been brought into the country as a kid; that you have a clean criminal record; that you are working or in school or in the military; that you pay your taxes. It also imposes a registration reauirement, and imposes assorted fees.
3. DACA doesn't give you welfare benefits or a driver's license. It also doesn't guarantee you can stay and become a citizen. All it does--see if this sounds familiar!--is put a hold on deportation, to give Congress time for a fix.
4. As the CATO study showed, DACA enrolees look a lot like H1B visa holders...the smartest, most-productive immigrants we have. Immediate cost for deporting them: $60 billion. Long term economic cost: $280 billion.
5. A question: okay, we round all these people up. And when their birth countries refuse to take them? How about housing, jobs, language skills there? If you think it's just tough beans...what does this do to the political and ecinomic stability of, say, Guatemala?
Grow up.
1. A bipartisan reform bill was in Congress about 2006. It had the President's full suppport. The far Right blew it up.
2. DACA requires that you have been brought into the country as a kid; that you have a clean criminal record; that you are working or in school or in the military; that you pay your taxes. It also imposes a registration reauirement, and imposes assorted fees.
3. DACA doesn't give you welfare benefits or a driver's license. It also doesn't guarantee you can stay and become a citizen. All it does--see if this sounds familiar!--is put a hold on deportation, to give Congress time for a fix.
4. As the CATO study showed, DACA enrolees look a lot like H1B visa holders...the smartest, most-productive immigrants we have. Immediate cost for deporting them: $60 billion. Long term economic cost: $280 billion.
5. A question: okay, we round all these people up. And when their birth countries refuse to take them? How about housing, jobs, language skills there? If you think it's just tough beans...what does this do to the political and ecinomic stability of, say, Guatemala?
Grow up.
17
It was 2007, the President was George Bush - and the right didn't blow it up - it was 5 Democrats voting with the Republican minority that undercut it - it had passed the House and would have passed the Senate and become law if these 5 had voted for it. Then again in 2010 15 Democrats and Bernie Sanders voted against the Dream Act because the AFL-CIO put their full force into making sure it didn't pass and we know that Democrats always do what Labor wants. Bernie made some embarrassing comments about it at the time backing big Labor against illegal immigrants. That 2010 bill had a path to citizenship for the Dreamers.
Washington Post has an excellent article on this today - balanced and fair in assigning blame.
Washington Post has an excellent article on this today - balanced and fair in assigning blame.
5
DACA recipients don't need DACA to avoid deportation. Ice deportation list is overflow all the time with criminals. Stop worry so much. There is hardly any time to "take care" of low level persons. Hack even criminals don't care about deportations. Save time and money on managing DACA , and you will have more resources to deal with criminals.
Crucial here indeed is that DACA recipients are not ALL children of illegal aliens who came here as a child, but only those who managed to get a college degree for 2 years in 2 years, or of 4 years in 4 years, or who accept to serve 2 years in the military.
IF they do, they will not be deported during those 2 years, but then ... they have to ask for yet another 2-year extension.
Only after having received it three times in a row, and having a clean criminal record, can they start applying for citizenship.
So this is not some kind of automatic "amnesty" - first of all because they did nothing wrong, legally, but most importantly because only those working very hard, and for six years, have a CHANCE (not a guarantee) to become legal citizens.
Needless to say that part of those young adults will fail in college or need 3 rather than 2 years, or won't be able to adapt to the military. Those can not obtain DACA status, and can be immediately deported, EVEN under DACA or the Dream Act.
That means that it takes a LOT of courage to come out of the shadows and risk to engage in the entire, highly demanding procedure.
THAT's why it's true that we're only keeping the best, those who notwithstanding very difficult circumstances at home, during their entire childhood, nevertheless managed to have learned how to study and succeed.
So yes, in a way it's comparable to H1B visas, except that we ALREADY invested in those kids' education by the time they can enroll in the program ...
IF they do, they will not be deported during those 2 years, but then ... they have to ask for yet another 2-year extension.
Only after having received it three times in a row, and having a clean criminal record, can they start applying for citizenship.
So this is not some kind of automatic "amnesty" - first of all because they did nothing wrong, legally, but most importantly because only those working very hard, and for six years, have a CHANCE (not a guarantee) to become legal citizens.
Needless to say that part of those young adults will fail in college or need 3 rather than 2 years, or won't be able to adapt to the military. Those can not obtain DACA status, and can be immediately deported, EVEN under DACA or the Dream Act.
That means that it takes a LOT of courage to come out of the shadows and risk to engage in the entire, highly demanding procedure.
THAT's why it's true that we're only keeping the best, those who notwithstanding very difficult circumstances at home, during their entire childhood, nevertheless managed to have learned how to study and succeed.
So yes, in a way it's comparable to H1B visas, except that we ALREADY invested in those kids' education by the time they can enroll in the program ...
1
How about if we make DACA part of our immigration law while also adding mandatory e-Verify for all employers - with significant penalties for employers hiring illegal aliens. Both sides get something that way.
10
I believe this is a part of the Senator Cotton bill: permanent green card residency for DACA recipients, but no citizenship, they will not be able to engage in chain migration by bringing other relatives, e Verify work enforcement for employers, close the borders and build the wall.
I would add, send their illegal immigrant parents home except that many of these illegals have young children who are anchor babies to keep the parents here and that also keeps the social services flowing to them.
Deport anyone with a stolen social security number.
I would add, send their illegal immigrant parents home except that many of these illegals have young children who are anchor babies to keep the parents here and that also keeps the social services flowing to them.
Deport anyone with a stolen social security number.
10
Well ... E-Verifying is EXACTLY what the bipartisan comprehensive immigration reform bills in the past ALREADY proposed.
And it's part of the 2013 bipartisan comprehensive immigration reform bill that passed in the Senate by 68 votes - a "supermajority".
It's also what the vast majority in this country wants and supports.
And yet, it never got signed into law because of a minority of Trump-base members of Congress who block it and want the extremely partisan immigration reform bill that Tom Cotton recently proposed and that Trump now supports.
On certain issues, there are no "both sides". Congress and the president were elected to represent the American people, NOT a fringe of extremists.
Here's an overview of the 2013 bill:
http://www.politico.com/story/2013/06/immigration-bill-summary-093557
And then we're even not talking yet about the fact that the Dream Act, where DACA is based on, was originally a bipartisan bill ITSELF, so by definition not something you can use in negotiations in order to please one side all while giving the other side of the aisle something in return.
So Trump should have FIRST urged Congress to pass a standalone Dream Act within six months, IF he was serious when all of a sudden he suggested to support it (contrary to what he campaigned on), and end DACA only once Congress passed it and he had signed it into law, rather than using it to try to force the majority to accept an immigration bill that is way too partisan to ever get passed ...
And it's part of the 2013 bipartisan comprehensive immigration reform bill that passed in the Senate by 68 votes - a "supermajority".
It's also what the vast majority in this country wants and supports.
And yet, it never got signed into law because of a minority of Trump-base members of Congress who block it and want the extremely partisan immigration reform bill that Tom Cotton recently proposed and that Trump now supports.
On certain issues, there are no "both sides". Congress and the president were elected to represent the American people, NOT a fringe of extremists.
Here's an overview of the 2013 bill:
http://www.politico.com/story/2013/06/immigration-bill-summary-093557
And then we're even not talking yet about the fact that the Dream Act, where DACA is based on, was originally a bipartisan bill ITSELF, so by definition not something you can use in negotiations in order to please one side all while giving the other side of the aisle something in return.
So Trump should have FIRST urged Congress to pass a standalone Dream Act within six months, IF he was serious when all of a sudden he suggested to support it (contrary to what he campaigned on), and end DACA only once Congress passed it and he had signed it into law, rather than using it to try to force the majority to accept an immigration bill that is way too partisan to ever get passed ...
Puzzle??? What "puzzle"? If Congress and the President do not wish, or do not intend, to obey our immigration laws, let them change the laws. What is so difficult? What is there to understand? OBEY THE IMMIGRATION LAWS!
7
that would be Einstein's 3rd law of relativity:
We can have immigration laws fixed UNLESS it effects the economics and then we can't have immigration reform. IT IS ALLABOUT THE MONEY.
CHEAP LABOR.
We can have immigration laws fixed UNLESS it effects the economics and then we can't have immigration reform. IT IS ALLABOUT THE MONEY.
CHEAP LABOR.
1
Throughout our childhood, dad strictly taught us 3 boys the value of hard work. Whenever we asked for something he'd say, "what do you think, money grows on trees?". Dad served us well. From him, I now find myself strongly empathizing with the plight of the Dreamers.
Without preaching it, he taught us to never punish a hard worker. Never Never Never. Congress, I implore you to learn from my dad and fix DACA. Quit punishing and start valuing America's hard working Dreamers.
Without preaching it, he taught us to never punish a hard worker. Never Never Never. Congress, I implore you to learn from my dad and fix DACA. Quit punishing and start valuing America's hard working Dreamers.
22
Has anyone thought about who reaps most of the benefits from undocumented immigrants? It's the people who hire them, underpay them, and threaten them with deportation if they complain about working or living conditions. We benefit from their cheap labor. If we penalize the companies and agencies that knowingly hire undocumented immigrants the flow might cease. But that means that our government would have to do a much better job keeping track of our social security numbers, perhaps issuing official IDs to all Americans, and even safeguarding our social security numbers. That involves spending money and with a GOP dominated congress it won't be done.
12
This is one of the most shameful and despicable things that has ever been done in American politics. The Republicans have had over a decade to fix immigration laws. Instead of making hard choices and fashioning a sensible policy, they go after the weakest, most vulnerable and innocent immigrants, smashing the hopes and dreams of young people who had been promised a better life by the government!
23
the GOP is pro labor--cheap labor that is, and fixing the immigration laws would very likely have affected that supply of cheap labor, thus creating a problem between the business money donors and republicans running for office. ANOTHER reason to get the money out of politics. FOLLOW THE MONEY.
2
Total nonsense--Obama was President for eight years and had a total control of the Congress in his first term--which is how Obamacare passed. It was the Democrats who did nothing except have Obama put in place an unconstitutional policy. Call your representative in Congress and tell them what you think. I plan to call my representative and tell them to deport the illegals and allow them to apply for entry the legal way.
7
DVE...you live in CA...home of more liberal, progressive billionaires per square/acre than any other state in our country. They, and the Wall Street, banksters and hedge fund hucksters want to make sure cheap labor is here to stay. And for the record, most of them are Democrats!
4
President Trump's approach to this is essentially correct -- we cannot have immgration policy based on executive order alone. This has to be under legislati0on. Now you may not trust Congress to get thisright; but iot should be easier to do than Health care.
I'm all for gov't programs as long as they are funded and in the budget -- if not, then we cannot continue to provide a blankk check. Fair for all must be a principle followed!
I'm all for gov't programs as long as they are funded and in the budget -- if not, then we cannot continue to provide a blankk check. Fair for all must be a principle followed!
7
Trump , who has proven to be deceitful, dishonest ,hypocritical,heartless, incompetent,unstable and all around unfit for the job has now added another glaring character deficiency--he's weak to a point of complete inability to function as president.
2
Let's see how much "HEART" the POTUS has for the Dreamers. If he has campaign style rallies championing the cause of the Dreamers in an effort to get legislation passed that would allow these young people to stay in this country then he will have demonstrated the compassion he stated for them.
My bet is he doesn't lift a finger and let's any legislation flounder or go down to defeat in the House. This is a mean spirited demagogue make no doubt about it who bends the rule of law as he sees fit in pardoning Sheriff Joe and bridling over court decisions against his Muslim ban.
My bet is he doesn't lift a finger and let's any legislation flounder or go down to defeat in the House. This is a mean spirited demagogue make no doubt about it who bends the rule of law as he sees fit in pardoning Sheriff Joe and bridling over court decisions against his Muslim ban.
2
I hope they succeed this is Congresses job not the President.
6
Obama and others crafted temporary imperfect policies to extremely difficult problems because Congress chose not to address these difficult problems over many years. Now Trump revokes these temporary solutions without replacement plans and tells Congress to "solve the problem". When will Trump's supporters realize that this is not progress? When one revokes an imperfect plan addressing a very difficult problem, WITHOUT a proposed replacement plan, that chaos results, and that this hurts America. This is true regardless of which side of the aisle you are on.
5
That our country continues to tolerate Trump is evidence that we have deteriorated into a state of unspeakable evil and richly deserve the harsh punishment which awaits us. Harvey and Irma are among the first of the emissaries.
4
For whatever reason, the parents of these dreamers broke the law by entering the US illegally; there is no escaping that fact. Most of these individuals work hard and made substantial contributions to our society, however, the fact remains is that their good fortune came at an illegal gain. Do they deserve citizenship? No. Should their children suffer because of their decision? No. Keep DACA intact for their sake. Frankly, the parents should stay, but they can never become US citizens and they must pay a hefty fine for initially breaking the law to enter this country. Impose stricter immigration laws, including stricter financial and educational requirements for persons seeking US citizenship and instead of building a wall, use the money collected in fines to beef up Immigration and Naturalization staffing to better track individuals who enter the US.
7
What about about legal Immigration? I read that a proposed bill that would legalize DACA recipients, would also cut legal immigration by 50 per cent. If true, this is worse than doing nothing. It will create a tsunami of negative economic and social impact that will dwarf the current disturbance. The reason why high-tech companies scramble for hiring immigrants has nothing to do with immigrant labor being cheaper. This is a lie perpetrated by sore losers. The fact is that immigrants are better educated, more determined, savvier and more hard-working than native-born Americans. Forty percent of founders in the Silicon Valley are foreign-born. If Trump or this retrograde Congress try to lash out at immigrants in order to placate their ignorant and xenophobic base, it is this base that will suffer in the ensuing economic downturn.
2
"The fact is that immigrants are better educated, more determined, savvier and more hard-working than native-born Americans"..
And yet they are scrambling, begging and whining to get into my country. I'm not trying to get into theirs. I actually like such things as working sewage systems, which large portions of the planet haven't yet figured out. One would think that if immigrants were so smart their countries would be better places to live.
Americans have built a more desirable place to live than anyone else has done. And we did this before the 1965 tsunami that started to alter the demographics of this country. High tech companies are only concerned with cheap compliant labor.
But please tell us more about how native born Americans are so stupid and racist. I'm sure that will increase the chances of Americans welcoming more immigrants...
And yet they are scrambling, begging and whining to get into my country. I'm not trying to get into theirs. I actually like such things as working sewage systems, which large portions of the planet haven't yet figured out. One would think that if immigrants were so smart their countries would be better places to live.
Americans have built a more desirable place to live than anyone else has done. And we did this before the 1965 tsunami that started to alter the demographics of this country. High tech companies are only concerned with cheap compliant labor.
But please tell us more about how native born Americans are so stupid and racist. I'm sure that will increase the chances of Americans welcoming more immigrants...
4
Policy makers of various types and levels, local to national, and even global,within a range of political systems and temporal frames of reference,
continue to be permitted-even enabled- by us, you and me, not to pay a personal price for the consequences of their actions. Temporary or more permanent. Words as well as deeds. Knowingly violating in some way. People. Menschlich values.Norms.Qualities of life. pTypes, levels and states of well being. Communities, neighborhoods and a range of systems underpinning our daily healthy functioning.Our coping and adapting with mutual caring.Respectfulness.Helping one another in a good enough manner.Behaviors which are not acceptable in a market economy which continues to commodify people traditional can, and does,result in being replaced.Fired."Axed."And yet, national policy makers continue to be permitted to violate and not be personally responsible. To live, daily, as if there are no consequences for what they do, which causes unnecessary pain.Even death.And not to do what their leadership roles mandate them to do. And each of us permits this toxic, infectious ummenschlichkeit to continue.Even as some of us, at times, experience unexpected consequences. Ourselves as well as for others.16 years?It's been a lot longer that all of this has been going on,even as targeted people and issues change.WE-THEY is institutionalized.Consider, as we are media-minded to focus on the opioid epidemic how we lose sight of our no consequences
reality.
continue to be permitted-even enabled- by us, you and me, not to pay a personal price for the consequences of their actions. Temporary or more permanent. Words as well as deeds. Knowingly violating in some way. People. Menschlich values.Norms.Qualities of life. pTypes, levels and states of well being. Communities, neighborhoods and a range of systems underpinning our daily healthy functioning.Our coping and adapting with mutual caring.Respectfulness.Helping one another in a good enough manner.Behaviors which are not acceptable in a market economy which continues to commodify people traditional can, and does,result in being replaced.Fired."Axed."And yet, national policy makers continue to be permitted to violate and not be personally responsible. To live, daily, as if there are no consequences for what they do, which causes unnecessary pain.Even death.And not to do what their leadership roles mandate them to do. And each of us permits this toxic, infectious ummenschlichkeit to continue.Even as some of us, at times, experience unexpected consequences. Ourselves as well as for others.16 years?It's been a lot longer that all of this has been going on,even as targeted people and issues change.WE-THEY is institutionalized.Consider, as we are media-minded to focus on the opioid epidemic how we lose sight of our no consequences
reality.
1
Who said it would be easy? Politics is the art of compromise and persuading other a to join you. If Congress wants to stop the short curcuiting of popular sovereignty through executive orders and Supreme Court rulings that become the new law- then do what the most powerful branch in government is meant to do- make laws that represent the will of the people.
6
Immigration Reform and Control Act of 1986, granted amnesty to 3.2 million illegal immigrants
GOP won't do again without border/visa control
GOP won't do again without border/visa control
7
Why does DACA need to be addressed now? Nothing more pressing on the list? It is blindingly obvious Trump is doing anything to deflect the Americans from Mueller's investigation, healthcare and North Korea and so on.
Stop the conundrum: 'Dreamers' should be accorded US citizenship. Amnesty for their parents. Then enforcement of immigration laws (not a wall). The President and leaders in Congress should used their heads, put themselves in the other person's shoes and stop the in-house corruption.
Sorry but Donald Trump as your president does not make your country credible anymore. With 45th President Hodgepodge and the GOP - - unfortunately USA has lost its heart. What we see - from the outside - is petty politics of deflection and systematic destruction of any basic human kindness and fairness. A cruel and coward president who thinks that he is above the Law. Political games! Hypocrisy! Racism! Bigotry! Self-righteousness! Bent Democracy! Violation of the US Constitution! Since Trump elected in Office NOTHING is right nor has been accomplished toward Unity, Harmony and Peace on a domestic level nor on the diplomatic level with other countries - only daily jumble.
Stop the conundrum: 'Dreamers' should be accorded US citizenship. Amnesty for their parents. Then enforcement of immigration laws (not a wall). The President and leaders in Congress should used their heads, put themselves in the other person's shoes and stop the in-house corruption.
Sorry but Donald Trump as your president does not make your country credible anymore. With 45th President Hodgepodge and the GOP - - unfortunately USA has lost its heart. What we see - from the outside - is petty politics of deflection and systematic destruction of any basic human kindness and fairness. A cruel and coward president who thinks that he is above the Law. Political games! Hypocrisy! Racism! Bigotry! Self-righteousness! Bent Democracy! Violation of the US Constitution! Since Trump elected in Office NOTHING is right nor has been accomplished toward Unity, Harmony and Peace on a domestic level nor on the diplomatic level with other countries - only daily jumble.
2
Surprise, surprise! Ending DACA after being elected, something Trump promised multiple times on the campaign trail, is causing a furor by the press. I say there is going to be a fight because there is also a big case for stopping all illegal immigration and the democrats certainly have no stomach for that. The takeover in the lawn care field, the construction industry and many other industries has only hurt the middle class - a group the democrats have shown by their actions to have cast by the wayside.
7
It's time to provide a "pathway to citizenship" for the DACA Dreamers. They've earned it by hard work, education, and being lawful and productive workers. Except for Native Americans, we are all immigramts or their descendants. That is what Made America Great in the first place. The only thing holding the Dreamers back now is the racist nativisn of white supremacists in the Trump Administration and Congress who fear all people of color.
2
The argument being used constantly by DACA proponents is that "Dreamers" only speak English. That makes no sense at all when raised by Latino Parents. The lawn service folks in my neighborhood barely speak English, if at all, except their leader. Just wait for Congress to give this thing their Yes or No.
Obama truly created one big mess here.
Obama truly created one big mess here.
9
The Republican party is a hodgepodge of different ideologies, most of them twisted. To expect them to agree or reach across the aisle is a long shot. Our traitor in chief has abdicated his culpability to try to protect himself from all sides. It hasn't been working.
2
What If the Weasel had fired the A.T. a natural born racist and hater' touting the rule of law, Would He would have found another perhaps himself to deliver the message; You can bet your life not so because he loves his base.Do not Forget He shares some traits with the animal above.
Maybe a little more coherence would help.
1
As usual, Trump chooses the worst possible course of action.
Dreamers, you deserve better!
We, as a nation, are failing ourselves.
Dreamers, you deserve better!
We, as a nation, are failing ourselves.
2
Just get Congress to vote as opposed to blathering in the press. Have John McCain and EVERY SENATOR AND EVERY REPRESENTATIVE vote, unlike 2007 when cowardly McCain ducked the vote
1
"This is what you better do, see. I have the 800K Hostages see. I'll give you 6 months see....:)"
Ahhhhh, the art of Hostage Negotiations.
Ahhhhh, the art of Hostage Negotiations.
11
I think that we need to have a heart. These are people who were kids when their parents sneaked them into the country.
However, illegals who have engaged in criminal behavior should get the boot. Those who have been responsible people should be allowed to stay and get properly naturalized.
However, illegals who have engaged in criminal behavior should get the boot. Those who have been responsible people should be allowed to stay and get properly naturalized.
15
Illegal immigration is aided and abetted by the greed and exploitation of American companies and individuals who are too cheap to provide a reasonable living wage to entice American citizens and legal residents to work for them.
If a CEO is making upwards of 250 million annually in bonuses, the company he/she represents should be able to find the means to pay its janitors and cleaning staff a decent wage.
Same goes for wealthy individuals who employ maids and housekeepers who upgrade their expensive automobiles on an annual basis, but only pay their help what amounts to a slave wage.
Time to put an end to this exploitation, and if that means that people have to pay more for their fresh fruit and morning coffee, then so be it!
The demand for cheap and illegal labour is the result of the above.
If a CEO is making upwards of 250 million annually in bonuses, the company he/she represents should be able to find the means to pay its janitors and cleaning staff a decent wage.
Same goes for wealthy individuals who employ maids and housekeepers who upgrade their expensive automobiles on an annual basis, but only pay their help what amounts to a slave wage.
Time to put an end to this exploitation, and if that means that people have to pay more for their fresh fruit and morning coffee, then so be it!
The demand for cheap and illegal labour is the result of the above.
24
Republicans support this strange narrative that says Mexicans; (that's what they mean when they say "immigrants"; giving little or no thought to the fact that there are Dreamers from many countries), are somehow a thorn in the side of the US economy. Digging ditches for minimum wage (or less) is a problem? Working off the books to the benefit (not legal) of small, medium, and even large businesses is a problem for the bottom line of those businesses? Working legally with a Green Card, hired properly, legally, and paying taxes isn't valid? Especially when that job is sweating 12 hours in the Central California sun? As someone who is familiar with the farm fields in Northern, Central, and Southern California; other than a stray hippie here or there, I've never seen any white people in those fields; let alone a native born American. The "they take our jobs" part of the narrative is patently false; yet IT WAS CITED BY JEFF SESSIONS in his speech yesterday. American may have an immigrant problem; but it is also becoming apparent there are millions in the country who have a tough time dealing with REALITY ITSELF. It's weird. And one of them occupies the Oval Office.
15
I'm curious. If illegal immigrants are not taking jobs, how do they manage to shelter and clothe themselves, eat, etc?
2
Now Trump show us how is "make America great again". Say one thing and do other thing... Avoid DACA is that way for to get " make America Great Again". Country of laws, applying the law now means the kids pay for the mistake of the parents, This is the America that need to be? this is a Justice for show around the all world?
1
so if a dreamer is 13 years old and we give them either residency or citizenship, what do we do with the parents or grandparents? do we send them back and put the child in foster care? that leaves 2 options. 1) we have to grant at least residency to the dreamer parents who came here and brought their child illegally or 2) dreamers (I dislike that term) must be 18 to obtain residency or citizenship. not an option is allowing parents to stay 3, 4, 5, or 10 years until the child reaches 18.
5
1. The average age of DACA is 26.
2. We don't owe younger kids anything. They can go home with the guardians. You don't get to drop a child here and then demand to stay.
2. We don't owe younger kids anything. They can go home with the guardians. You don't get to drop a child here and then demand to stay.
5
If I was a Dreamer I'd be planning my exit from the country to go to Canada or somewhere where I'd be welcome. Trump and the GOP are perfectly willing to waste the money that has been invested in these youngsters because of choices their parents made. In America the quality of mercy doesn't exist unless you are rich, white, Anglo Saxon, and straight. Has no one ever explained to the GOP that what goes around comes around?
7
"Welcoming" Canada is not easy to immigrate to - you should know this before posting inaccurate statements.
Getting into the country as a student is the easiest path to permanent residency. Once a person has an offer of acceptance to a Canadian college or university, the process of getting a temporary resident permit is straightforward. When the permit expires, Canada allows many students to apply for something called a post-graduation work permit. Working in Canada greatly improves one’s odds of being able to stay in the country permanently.
For businesspeople, Canada has an “immigrant investor” program, which allows a person with a personal net worth of at least $10 million (in Canadian dollars, naturally) to fast-track a permanent residency application in exchange for an investment in a government venture capital fund.
Most Americans would probably prefer to emigrate to Canada as skilled workers, because doing so requires neither university acceptance, nor $10 million. But it’s nearly impossible to get permanent residency this way without first working in Canada, or at least getting a job offer from a Canadian employer.
And getting a Canadian job offer is, by design, very difficult. Ordinarily, to hire a foreigner, a Canadian employer needs to get what’s called a Labour Market Impact Assessment, which is an official ruling on whether or not hiring that specific foreigner is in Canada’s interest. If the assessment is negative, the job offer is void.
Getting into the country as a student is the easiest path to permanent residency. Once a person has an offer of acceptance to a Canadian college or university, the process of getting a temporary resident permit is straightforward. When the permit expires, Canada allows many students to apply for something called a post-graduation work permit. Working in Canada greatly improves one’s odds of being able to stay in the country permanently.
For businesspeople, Canada has an “immigrant investor” program, which allows a person with a personal net worth of at least $10 million (in Canadian dollars, naturally) to fast-track a permanent residency application in exchange for an investment in a government venture capital fund.
Most Americans would probably prefer to emigrate to Canada as skilled workers, because doing so requires neither university acceptance, nor $10 million. But it’s nearly impossible to get permanent residency this way without first working in Canada, or at least getting a job offer from a Canadian employer.
And getting a Canadian job offer is, by design, very difficult. Ordinarily, to hire a foreigner, a Canadian employer needs to get what’s called a Labour Market Impact Assessment, which is an official ruling on whether or not hiring that specific foreigner is in Canada’s interest. If the assessment is negative, the job offer is void.
12
How about coming in legally through the front door?
Allowing "dreamers" to stay is grossly unfair to those that applied/immigrated legally.
You are only subverting immigration law and encouraging more illegal behavior by giving any consideration to these "dreamers".
They should have been immediately deported w/their parents along w/charging the parents w/smuggling/trafficking.
Allowing "dreamers" to stay is grossly unfair to those that applied/immigrated legally.
You are only subverting immigration law and encouraging more illegal behavior by giving any consideration to these "dreamers".
They should have been immediately deported w/their parents along w/charging the parents w/smuggling/trafficking.
13
I didn't say it would be easy. But given what we're doing now they'd do better there. And I'm glad to see that Canada has a vested interest in keeping its jobs open for Canadians unlike what we allow here: outsourcing, importing foreigners without looking for Americans, and other nice little tricks.
1
If I was a Dreamer, I wouldn't believe one word Trump says about DACA, especially his "revisit" tweet. Why should they? Trump pandering to his base demanding he keep his hardline immigration promises mixed in with his cowardice in the face of political fallout sends a signal to all of America, thispesident has zero credibility and his word means nothing.
ICE knows exactly where to find each and every single one of the 780k Dreamers, they willingly gave all their information to our government in good faith.
We're watching a cruel and self-centered President hold 780k lives hostage in a particularly ugly point in American history.
ICE knows exactly where to find each and every single one of the 780k Dreamers, they willingly gave all their information to our government in good faith.
We're watching a cruel and self-centered President hold 780k lives hostage in a particularly ugly point in American history.
14
If I was a Dreamer I'd admit that just because my parents broke the law and smuggled me over the border doesn't mean I "deserve" US citizenship, rights and privileges.
21
Trump has ended DACA. If Congress votes against granting DACA enrollee citizenship or legal status, Trump could not revive DACA, since Congress would have made its intentions known. He could make deporting former DACA enrollees a low priority. On the other hand, he could order them to report for deportation hearings.
3
As all 800,000 are the best of the best, when they return to their home countries they will easily fit into high-level positions and do exceedingly well.
1
I think Trump is handling this correctly. It appears he supports DACA in principle. It will end up in the courts either way. It puts pressure on the Republican majority Congress to do something, and perhaps this is where the Trump team's negotiating skills can actually work. Everyone has to compromise something to get what they want.
On the other hand, Sessions and the Trump administration are the worst PR people I've ever heard. A good spokesperson could have put a very positive spin on this action and scored a lot of points.
Hopefully Congress will get its act together and take action on this part of the immigration policy.
On the other hand, Sessions and the Trump administration are the worst PR people I've ever heard. A good spokesperson could have put a very positive spin on this action and scored a lot of points.
Hopefully Congress will get its act together and take action on this part of the immigration policy.
9
Dont hold your breath waiting for an effective solution to come out of this Congress
16
I'm sorry, but this article omitted an important fact.
The Dream Act has NOT just Democrat Dick Durbin as author: from the very beginning (= Aug. 1, 2001) it has been a BIPARTISAN initiative, introduced both by Durbin and Republican Senator Orrin Hatch.
And it's precisely because Democrats knew that Republicans supported it that they hoped to pass it as part of comprehensive immigration reform and in exchange obtain certain things that Republicans rejected but Democrats wanted.
DACA only exists because Republicans have always refused to pass bipartisan comprehensive immigration reform bills. Just like with healthcare reform, they never found the courage to actually think this through and come up with a clear answer and a bill ... until Obama got engaged in it, and the Senate finally found 68 votes approving bipartisan comprehensive immigration reform, that included the Dream Act. But in the meanwhile, the GOP rhetoric had brought the "Freedom Caucus" to the House, so it failed to pass there.
Conclusion: the Dream Act has been bipartisan from the very beginning. It's only when Obama became president and Republicans started lying much more than before, that all of a sudden they started to reject it, just like all of a sudden they rejected Romneycare when Obama signed it into law.
If Congress passes it now, NO one should be mistaken: it will not be passed thanks to GOP leadership, but only because Democrats accept to put country before party, and the GOP not.
The Dream Act has NOT just Democrat Dick Durbin as author: from the very beginning (= Aug. 1, 2001) it has been a BIPARTISAN initiative, introduced both by Durbin and Republican Senator Orrin Hatch.
And it's precisely because Democrats knew that Republicans supported it that they hoped to pass it as part of comprehensive immigration reform and in exchange obtain certain things that Republicans rejected but Democrats wanted.
DACA only exists because Republicans have always refused to pass bipartisan comprehensive immigration reform bills. Just like with healthcare reform, they never found the courage to actually think this through and come up with a clear answer and a bill ... until Obama got engaged in it, and the Senate finally found 68 votes approving bipartisan comprehensive immigration reform, that included the Dream Act. But in the meanwhile, the GOP rhetoric had brought the "Freedom Caucus" to the House, so it failed to pass there.
Conclusion: the Dream Act has been bipartisan from the very beginning. It's only when Obama became president and Republicans started lying much more than before, that all of a sudden they started to reject it, just like all of a sudden they rejected Romneycare when Obama signed it into law.
If Congress passes it now, NO one should be mistaken: it will not be passed thanks to GOP leadership, but only because Democrats accept to put country before party, and the GOP not.
90
Well, it's nice that the Dems are on the right side of something since they have been on the wrong side of a lot of other somethings.
4
Actually, DACA exists because Obama was in danger of losing the Hispanic/Latino vote because he prioritized healthcare over comprehensive immigration reform. It worked pretty well - he won. Current politicians aren't the only ones who have used these young people as a football to kick around.
4
@ GreggMorris
Such as?
Such as?
The fact that yesterday there were people demonstrating in front of Trump Tower in New York who were holding up signs in foreign languages suggests to me that these people who were illegally sneaked into our country have not fully assimilated and should give some thought as to whether English-speaking America is really for them.
31
I noticed a few Mexican flags in the crowd, also. Awful.
10
I tend to agree with the idea of assimilation. Somewhere between the experiences of the immigrants in the 1920's -- who were prevented from speaking their native languages in class, for example -- and today's immigrants -- who hold up signs in Spanish demanding the right to live and work in the U.S. without following any immigration laws -- is the best way to live together as a multicultural country.
4
I'm not Hispanic, but I speak Spanish. I can certainly make a sign in spanish.
1
Now is the Time for Congress show the world America is a caring open heart Nation. Time for real Men and women to stand up and show their Strength.
2
Frank, from your lips to God's ears.
Yes. Time for real Men and women to stand up and force forty percent of the citizens in this country to accept something they disagree with. Who cares what they want- stupid, racist bigots.
I vote for Frank to be the guy who decides which people count and which do not.
I vote for Frank to be the guy who decides which people count and which do not.
1
So much for the guy who campaigned that he was a true leader, unafraid of confrontation. He send out his AG to do the dirty work. But you can bet the farm that if there was any credit to take, Trump would be present front and center.
Transparent, uninformed, incurious. And he's president.
Transparent, uninformed, incurious. And he's president.
6
Don't forget - he sent his body guard to fire Comey and Kelly to fire Bannon.
You're right - I forgot about Keith Schiller.
Give them an opportunity to earn citizenship over a three year probation period. During this time they can opt for entering the military, performing disaster, conservation and forest fire management, teaching Spanish to kindergarten kids, etc...
We'll end up with 809,009 very dedicated to the success of the USA citizens.
We'll end up with 809,009 very dedicated to the success of the USA citizens.
12
No to citizenship. It will only encourage others to do the same. We can't reward them with US citizenship.
7
Pedro Loco, I don't know that it was your intention but you seem to illustrate the misconception that those opposed to DACA rely upon for its defeat. The Dreamers aren't sitting around being a drain on the country's resources. They have strong family ties, are going to school, being educated, adding to the culture and value of their communities at large, and are employed. They are not "throwaways" who should be shuffled into jobs that Americans cannot or will not fill.
1
"teaching Spanish to kindergarten kids"
This isn't Mexico or Spain.
This isn't Mexico or Spain.
5
Democrats know that Republicans will grant DACA enrollees citizenship or permanent legal residence status only as part of a comprehensive legislative package designed to stop future illegal immigration. This is why they are in such a panic. To rescue DACA enrollees, they will have to vote for legislation that would stop future illegal immigration and make life in the United States untenable for other unauthorized immigrants already residing in the United States.
16
Even if they tack on the DREAMER Act to the debt ceiling/Harvey bill????
A few minutes ago President Trump and congressional leaders agreed to increase the debt limit and fund the government until mid-December.
The solution is simple: Create a multi-tiered tax system. Citizens are charged one set of tax brackets. Current illegals are charged some ridiculously high brackets, but are offered a chance not to get deported. After some set period, they could enter some quasi-legal residency whereby they achieve a lower tax bracket than being fully illegal while they sign up and wait in line to become an actual citizen like some many people have to do. Future 'dreamers' after some set date are forever assigned the ridiculously high bracket, or are deported. There's your solution. You can't fully reward breaking the law. You're welcome.
5
DACA is a magnet for further illegal immigration. If you live south of the border and already have children, you will be tempted by DACA to illegally immigrate to a sanctuary city, try to avoid deportation for as long as possible, and then hope that your children qualify for DACA or its equivalent. You further hope that the bleeding hearts will not want to break up families, so you get to stay too. To further anchor yourselves to this country, you have additional children after you arrive, thus contributing to the population explosion that is destroying the earth. There needs to be comprehensive reform. I dislike Trump immensely, but asking Congress to do its job in a comprehensive manner is the right thing to do.
35
As an immigrant I am all for letting them stay and offer a path to citizenship however what are the odds we will have the same conversation in 5 years/10 years? Congress should let the "dreamers" stay but prevent future illegal children from ever getting the same benefit.
8
and what do we do with the parents of a 13 year old dreamer?
2
Nope. No to the citizenship deal. Never.
5
I said path.. anyone with prior criminal record has to leave.
citizenship should not be immediate either.. maybe 5-10 years.
citizenship should not be immediate either.. maybe 5-10 years.
I don't agree with Trump on very many issues however I agree with his approach on DACA, even if it is an accidental approach that occurred without any conscious thought or strategy on his part.
The Republicans can finally either do what they have said they were going to do (and take the consequences) or act to codify in legislation the DACA executive order. We are finally going to see that many things that they complain about are different once they are responsible for the consequences.
The Republicans can finally either do what they have said they were going to do (and take the consequences) or act to codify in legislation the DACA executive order. We are finally going to see that many things that they complain about are different once they are responsible for the consequences.
5
I do not think Congress will be able to help the dreamers.
I am so sorry to hear all their sad stories.
All of us good people know what the right thing to do is. Sadly our system gives every citizen a vote- even mean citizens. Even the dreaded r citizens.
Equally sad our system does not just give people here illegally more rights than citizens. Something about a democracy. Something about laws.
All us good people know what to do. All us moral people know what is right. All of us good people know that laws should not apply to people with sad stories. Laws should not apply to sympathetic people.
No matter how much we wish it we cannot simply disenfranchise forty percent of the electorate and replace them with law breakers. I am afraid it is going to take a little more time to replace the current citizen population of the US with economic migrants.
I am so sorry to hear all their sad stories.
All of us good people know what the right thing to do is. Sadly our system gives every citizen a vote- even mean citizens. Even the dreaded r citizens.
Equally sad our system does not just give people here illegally more rights than citizens. Something about a democracy. Something about laws.
All us good people know what to do. All us moral people know what is right. All of us good people know that laws should not apply to people with sad stories. Laws should not apply to sympathetic people.
No matter how much we wish it we cannot simply disenfranchise forty percent of the electorate and replace them with law breakers. I am afraid it is going to take a little more time to replace the current citizen population of the US with economic migrants.
12
It would be good if good people who are good would take a good hard look at what DACA actually says, for the good of the good country. Rather than sneering.
6
This should be a no-brainer. It's way past time to update immigration laws. Local business owners in the southern states must not want immigration reform - they can hire and mistreat immigrants without papers with no threat of legal action against them.
Come on Congress. The time is now to allow young people who had no choice in coming here permanent status. Require them to become citizens within one year. Take care of this first, then update other immigration laws to prevent mafia-type slavery of immigrants.
Come on Congress. The time is now to allow young people who had no choice in coming here permanent status. Require them to become citizens within one year. Take care of this first, then update other immigration laws to prevent mafia-type slavery of immigrants.
7
Don't assume that it's only southern states that hire and mistreat immigrants with or without papers. It occurs in northern states too. One of the reasons it's so easy to underpay immigrants and Americans is because employers are not penalized for hiring undocumented immigrants or for underpaying all of us. Anytime a penalty is too expensive businesses are allowed to appeal it, have it reduced, or write it off as the cost of doing business.
6
I am happy.
For eight years I saw the republican congressional leadership backstab every legislative effort of President Obama. The dream act was killed by the Senate Republicans (did not get 60 votes) circa 2010.
Now they have to legislate the DREAM for their own survival. Good penance!
For eight years I saw the republican congressional leadership backstab every legislative effort of President Obama. The dream act was killed by the Senate Republicans (did not get 60 votes) circa 2010.
Now they have to legislate the DREAM for their own survival. Good penance!
5
The penitent in Sacrament begins reconciliation, forgiveness and grace for sinning with a private confession.
Dream Act was killed by 15 Democrats and that darling of the left, Bernie Sanders voting with the Republicans because big labor ( AFL-CIO) vehemently opposed it. Please get your facts right!
1
Six months ought to be plenty of time, even for this do-nothing Congress...
3
Hurricanes are sweeping through the Atlantic and hitting the U.S. The Russian investigation continues to discover new ties and new evidence against Trump and his campaign people. Trump sends out generals to threaten North Korea, with the entire State Department that normally handles international crises missing in action due to the destruction of the State Department by Trump and his secretary of state. Trump remains obsessed with anything President Obama did or was. His racist birther lie is still believed by all of his white supremacist followers.
The human cost now also includes 800,000 young Dreamers, in this country through no fault of their own but good citizens, good kids, good students, good soldiers, and good employees. According to the chart here, the main age when they came was three years old. Toddlers.
The evil that emanates from Trump and his followers with their cruelty on this issue directed towards young people and children is glaring.
Leon Panetta had an interesting suggestion. Just attach the Dreamer's Act to the National Defense Authorization Act. Many Dreamers serve in military or public service capacities and many have been in ROTC or other organizations.
The Dreamers are far better Americans than the many white supremacists and bigots who rant against them.
The human cost now also includes 800,000 young Dreamers, in this country through no fault of their own but good citizens, good kids, good students, good soldiers, and good employees. According to the chart here, the main age when they came was three years old. Toddlers.
The evil that emanates from Trump and his followers with their cruelty on this issue directed towards young people and children is glaring.
Leon Panetta had an interesting suggestion. Just attach the Dreamer's Act to the National Defense Authorization Act. Many Dreamers serve in military or public service capacities and many have been in ROTC or other organizations.
The Dreamers are far better Americans than the many white supremacists and bigots who rant against them.
16
Like my own thoughts here, I pray that Leon Panetta's are allowed to self extinguish before they are given the slightest consideration.
@Ana - that bad bill proposed huge increases in the number of the badly abused, little-audited so-called skilled worker visas: H1b, L1 and B1. That would have resulted in almost immediate unemployment for many American STEM workers. In addition this bill would not have enforced border control or properly fund modern visa tracking.
So NO, that was a bad bill and deserved to fail.
I should point out that at every opportunity President Obama proposed increases to those harmful, so-called skilled worker visas while "fronting" the effort with sops to Dreamers, etc. His attempts to camouflage increases to harmful changes to our immigration policy only caused MANY people to avoid voting for Democrats. The H1b lobby and PACs have been VERY generous to politicians.
So NO, that was a bad bill and deserved to fail.
I should point out that at every opportunity President Obama proposed increases to those harmful, so-called skilled worker visas while "fronting" the effort with sops to Dreamers, etc. His attempts to camouflage increases to harmful changes to our immigration policy only caused MANY people to avoid voting for Democrats. The H1b lobby and PACs have been VERY generous to politicians.
2
Prior Congressional attempts to pass a Dream Act failed because they weren't wasn’t part of a legislative package designed to curtail future illegal immigration. Congress should grant citizenship to DACA enrollees as part of a legislative package designed to stop future illegal immigration. The package should also:
1. authorize state, county and city police to enforce federal immigration laws;
2. empower states, counties and cities to make it unlawful for unauthorized immigrants to reside within their jurisdictions;
3. make E-Verify mandatory nationwide;
4. change asylum laws to deny asylum to anyone who enters the country illegally;
5. initiate a process to reinterpret or, if necessary, amend the citizenship clause to grant birthright citizenship only to children born to U.S. parents; and;
If these measures were put into effect, we wouldn’t need a border wall or a border fence, but the compromise package should designate the existing border fence the “Donald Trump Border Wall” so Trump will sign the bill. We can tear down the fence after he leaves office.
1. authorize state, county and city police to enforce federal immigration laws;
2. empower states, counties and cities to make it unlawful for unauthorized immigrants to reside within their jurisdictions;
3. make E-Verify mandatory nationwide;
4. change asylum laws to deny asylum to anyone who enters the country illegally;
5. initiate a process to reinterpret or, if necessary, amend the citizenship clause to grant birthright citizenship only to children born to U.S. parents; and;
If these measures were put into effect, we wouldn’t need a border wall or a border fence, but the compromise package should designate the existing border fence the “Donald Trump Border Wall” so Trump will sign the bill. We can tear down the fence after he leaves office.
12
What you outline is not only reasonable, it is long overdue. And the suggestions to contain future illegal immigration are far better than a useless and expensive wall.
I don't know why a majority of Dems and Republicans wouldn't go for this.
The fly in the ointment is Trump's stupid border wall idea. Something tells me this will have to be included. That would be a shame, but maybe a necessary (and expensive) evil if we are to protect the DACA kids (who are not kids anymore, but contributing citizens in all but name).
I don't know why a majority of Dems and Republicans wouldn't go for this.
The fly in the ointment is Trump's stupid border wall idea. Something tells me this will have to be included. That would be a shame, but maybe a necessary (and expensive) evil if we are to protect the DACA kids (who are not kids anymore, but contributing citizens in all but name).
3
Pretty much exactly what President Bush and Congress had on the table about 2006.
The right wing blew it up.
The right wing blew it up.
1
In addition to granting DACA enrollees citizenship, I also would grant unauthorized immigrants whose children are U.S. citizens legal permanent residence status, but they probably wouldn't pass.
Granted that this was a fairly dumb, cowardly move by Trump, but I don't think this conundrum is going to have a huge amount of effect. For sure, these immigrants are not going to get automatic citizenship. They are also not going to get rounded up and deported en masse, because most major urban areas have absolutely no interest in hunting down and deporting children. Sure, some older teens are going to get busted on minor crimes and wind up deported, but in the big picture, this is no big deal.
So Trump gets to demonstrate yet again that he hates non-whites and can't get deals made, but aside from that, I don't forsee any major change in policy and procedures coming from this.
So Trump gets to demonstrate yet again that he hates non-whites and can't get deals made, but aside from that, I don't forsee any major change in policy and procedures coming from this.
1
Nor do I because democrats are too busy calling everyone they don't like names. It expends all third party opportunity to energize good will that could have helped anyone who was, in the light of day, able to demonstrate mitigating life circumstances.
Like it or not that has much to do with why Trump is president. The potential for popularity which translates into electoral victory is not a single party phenomena. Trump knows the art of bringing disparate individuals together for the deal.
Obama settled for rolling out new legislation which only required a pen and a single digit in the air. That is not single party either, the pen part but since Republicans continue to take democrat seats in both houses of Congress then what is there for us to worry about, right?
Trump has mastered his role of reassigning responsibility to the most appropriate body of government. His action reestablishes the old idea that we are a representative government and not a dictatorship.
Like it or not that has much to do with why Trump is president. The potential for popularity which translates into electoral victory is not a single party phenomena. Trump knows the art of bringing disparate individuals together for the deal.
Obama settled for rolling out new legislation which only required a pen and a single digit in the air. That is not single party either, the pen part but since Republicans continue to take democrat seats in both houses of Congress then what is there for us to worry about, right?
Trump has mastered his role of reassigning responsibility to the most appropriate body of government. His action reestablishes the old idea that we are a representative government and not a dictatorship.
Let's say that this afternoon you learn that your parents brought you here illegally when you were two years old. Now you can't work. You can't get a driver license. You now must scuttle around hoping not to be seen. Then, you happen to be in the next room when ICE raids a house for illegal aliens. You get picked up just for being nearby. With no legal status, deportation to a country you do not know and a language you do not know is your future. Now suppose your 18th birthday was yesterday. Sure, you have the wherewithal to land in a strange country with no language skills, no identification, and nowhere to go. Yeah, right. "This is no big deal."
Dear MichinobeKris,
I don't think that scenario is very likely, but basically, when people enter a country illegally and bring children along, those children are going to have a tough life, no matter what, all around the world. This is the result of illegal immigration, life is tough. My point was, eliminating DACA is not going to result in roundups of small children for deportation, because cities are not going to focus on that. The ICE doesn't raid houses for illegal immigrants much either, they raid workplaces.
Overall, in my view, this is simply not that important either way. Entering a nation illegally always causes risk, hardship, and insecurity, and that's how it should be.
I don't think that scenario is very likely, but basically, when people enter a country illegally and bring children along, those children are going to have a tough life, no matter what, all around the world. This is the result of illegal immigration, life is tough. My point was, eliminating DACA is not going to result in roundups of small children for deportation, because cities are not going to focus on that. The ICE doesn't raid houses for illegal immigrants much either, they raid workplaces.
Overall, in my view, this is simply not that important either way. Entering a nation illegally always causes risk, hardship, and insecurity, and that's how it should be.
Setting a six month span for the congress to act is like sounding the death knell.Trump knows full well this congress can't get its collective head together over a menu for lunch. The Bridge Act sounds like a reasonable plan and would allow time to weed out some of the trouble makers.
One striking thing about the arguments that have been waged on this issue is that those who support DACA rely on positive and negative emotional appeals, and the skeptics talk about constitutionality and the law. The Congress must find a mix between the two in order to get a bill passed. Just for branding purposes, I would suggest ditching that 'Dream Act' designation, and to stop calling these young people 'dreamers', which is kind of exclusionary. Every kid should be encouraged to dream in our country!
6
If existing immigration law was enforced this DACA issue would never come up. This has been engineered by Democrats. DACA was an end run around existing laws, using "Children" (who can be up to 36 years old) as pawns.
23
Exactly; the constant propaganda by the left on this issue is sickening.
These "children" arrived in this country because they/their parent broke the law.
Allowing them to remain in any way, shape or form will only further incentivize further breaking of the law.
These "children" arrived in this country because they/their parent broke the law.
Allowing them to remain in any way, shape or form will only further incentivize further breaking of the law.
14
They were children when they were brought in. The vast majority know no other country, and their non-English language skills range from non-existent to fair. Are you really advocating for a mass diaspora of young people who did not themselves commit the "crime" that offends you?
I agree that illegal immigration is wrong and should be controlled. However, for the last 4 decades, this country has only given it lip service and allowed it to continue with a wink and a nod. Look into how big business liked the substandard wages that prevailed in the illegal population. We as a country aided and abetted the illegal immigration. To toss out, like so much garbage, people who grew up here and did not even break that law themselves, is disgusting. We helped make the problem and we should do the right thing by these young people. Sure, enforce the borders now for newcomers. But don't destroy the lives of people who didn't make this happen. Take responsibility for this country's role in this disaster.
I agree that illegal immigration is wrong and should be controlled. However, for the last 4 decades, this country has only given it lip service and allowed it to continue with a wink and a nod. Look into how big business liked the substandard wages that prevailed in the illegal population. We as a country aided and abetted the illegal immigration. To toss out, like so much garbage, people who grew up here and did not even break that law themselves, is disgusting. We helped make the problem and we should do the right thing by these young people. Sure, enforce the borders now for newcomers. But don't destroy the lives of people who didn't make this happen. Take responsibility for this country's role in this disaster.
1
By allowing these "children" to remain you are only subverting the law and encouraging more illegal immigration ("if we can only get the kid over the border he can stay").
As regards being "children" who did not "break" the law themselves; you are proposing that children can break the law if their parents led them into it.
So by such logic a man that illegally enters/occupies your home w/his children will result in the children be allowed to stay because they are "children" and were "brought in"??????
As regards being "children" who did not "break" the law themselves; you are proposing that children can break the law if their parents led them into it.
So by such logic a man that illegally enters/occupies your home w/his children will result in the children be allowed to stay because they are "children" and were "brought in"??????
5
Let's not forget that DACA was quickly followed up by DAPA, essentially an amnesty for the parents who "through their own fault" violated our immigration laws and colluded with smugglers and traffickers to further undermine our territorial sovereignty.
The definition of dreamers needs to be tight and legalization should be contingent on the permanent repatriation of those who facilitated their illicit entry in the first place.
The definition of dreamers needs to be tight and legalization should be contingent on the permanent repatriation of those who facilitated their illicit entry in the first place.
19
This is vintage incompetent Trump administration: after 16 years of debate and little action, why does this need to be addressed now? Nothing more pressing on the list? Here are a few pointers:
(1) The North Korean nuclear crisis, which Trump and his henchmen obviously don't know how to handle
(2) the Harvey problem and the funding for its cleanup
(3) Mueller's Russia investigation
(4) Pushing through tax cuts for the rich
This is just once again a distraction tactic from the real issues. It's always the same spiel. Only once they have reversed all of Obama's achievements, they need to get more creative in coming up with excuses.
(1) The North Korean nuclear crisis, which Trump and his henchmen obviously don't know how to handle
(2) the Harvey problem and the funding for its cleanup
(3) Mueller's Russia investigation
(4) Pushing through tax cuts for the rich
This is just once again a distraction tactic from the real issues. It's always the same spiel. Only once they have reversed all of Obama's achievements, they need to get more creative in coming up with excuses.
9
Why do our elites allow one subset of immigrants from a handful of countries to trash the laws that all other immigrants are expected to comply with?
Could this exception - the MX/Central American exception - possibly be related to political opportunism rather than concern for due process and rule of law?
Enough of this madness. End the Mexican exception. Ask these immigrants to adhere the same standards that all other immigrants abide by.
No more favoritism.
End this cynical quid pro quo devised by our cowardly and incompetent political class.
Could this exception - the MX/Central American exception - possibly be related to political opportunism rather than concern for due process and rule of law?
Enough of this madness. End the Mexican exception. Ask these immigrants to adhere the same standards that all other immigrants abide by.
No more favoritism.
End this cynical quid pro quo devised by our cowardly and incompetent political class.
26
And I'm sure that you also violently opposed the special benefits given to Cubans who escaped the Castro regimes- including expedited paths to citizenship (not being offered to Dreamers in anyone's proposed legislation.
Knee jerk defense of your 'team' whatever your position is not a recipe for democracy.
Knee jerk defense of your 'team' whatever your position is not a recipe for democracy.
1
Agree, why are poor Bangladeshi, Laotian, Ethiopian, or sub saharan african kids not treated as dreamers. Why this bias to fast track and encourage spanish speaking illegal immigration.
3
Pretty much every comment here agrees that it is cruel to ask kids that were brought into this country when they were really young, to go to a country they barely know. It is also agreed that they had no say when they were brought here and they speak good English and this is the only country they know of.
Isn't that true of kids who came in here legally as well? There are a lot of kids who age out because of the green card backlogs and they have to go back to their country once they age out. Although, their parents followed every law, they need to go back on their own because they cannot be dependents once they reach the age of 21. Their green card application is pending, but because of the backlog, they are stuck. Why aren't they being included in this? Is it because their parents followed the law? Don't the legal kids also deserve a future?
Isn't that true of kids who came in here legally as well? There are a lot of kids who age out because of the green card backlogs and they have to go back to their country once they age out. Although, their parents followed every law, they need to go back on their own because they cannot be dependents once they reach the age of 21. Their green card application is pending, but because of the backlog, they are stuck. Why aren't they being included in this? Is it because their parents followed the law? Don't the legal kids also deserve a future?
21
You failed to follow your logic to its conclusion. Because government resources are scarce, and because we aim for equal treatment for all, it follows that we should suspend the immigration laws altogether.
Open borders from here forward. Why have rules?
Open borders from here forward. Why have rules?
5
What about the F-1 kid came here under 16? h1b lottery? Double tuition for non-resident? How is this fair?
1
Whether its 800,000 dreamers or 11 million living in the shadows, we need immigration reform. Both parties have to recognize certain realities: The GOP cannot bring back the 1950's and the DEMs need to acknowledge that those who fear for their job are not all xenophobes.
12
It's been 5 years since DACA was decried. Why did no one push Congress in that time? How long was 'deferred' supposed to last?
2
you would have to ask the president who unilaterally issued a presidential order to enact it. this was congress' responsibility all along.
4
Congress did nothing in that time because it was more important to stick it to President Obama than to actually take care of this massive human problem. All the Republican Congress could do was say "No!" Nothing more. Additionally, the corporate backers of Republicans wanted to keep wages as low as possible, so no action on immigration was exactly what they wanted.
Republicans got to benefit from the situation even as they complained and wrung their hands and vilified everyone else. They are at the very least, complicit in, if not leading engineers of, this appalling debacle.
Republicans got to benefit from the situation even as they complained and wrung their hands and vilified everyone else. They are at the very least, complicit in, if not leading engineers of, this appalling debacle.
1
Some commenters are suggesting congress should just confer citizenship for Dreamers, and be done with it.
Okay, yes. I wouldn't object.
But congress is filled with cowards, in thrall to their angry xenophobic bases.
For the faint of heart in congress, here's a compromise: confer permanent, legal residency status (i.e., "green card").
Many of my friends and acquaintances, and one family member, have that status. It allows full and normal participation in society, outside of voting. They can chose to pursue citizenship in due course, if they want to. Or not. They don't have to live in the shadows. They can contribute, pay taxes, etc.
It's really pretty easy.
These kids did nothing wrong. They committed no crime. Broke no rules.
You can argue about holding the parents accountable. That's a different issue. But these kids should be enfolded in to the legal structure of this country and all doubt about their status permanently removed.
So congressional cowards can do that: grant permanent residency to the kids, and promise their constituents they will tackle the harder issue of the parents...and then let that issue roll back on down the road like everything else that congress will never actually deal with.
Not ideal, but workable.
Okay, yes. I wouldn't object.
But congress is filled with cowards, in thrall to their angry xenophobic bases.
For the faint of heart in congress, here's a compromise: confer permanent, legal residency status (i.e., "green card").
Many of my friends and acquaintances, and one family member, have that status. It allows full and normal participation in society, outside of voting. They can chose to pursue citizenship in due course, if they want to. Or not. They don't have to live in the shadows. They can contribute, pay taxes, etc.
It's really pretty easy.
These kids did nothing wrong. They committed no crime. Broke no rules.
You can argue about holding the parents accountable. That's a different issue. But these kids should be enfolded in to the legal structure of this country and all doubt about their status permanently removed.
So congressional cowards can do that: grant permanent residency to the kids, and promise their constituents they will tackle the harder issue of the parents...and then let that issue roll back on down the road like everything else that congress will never actually deal with.
Not ideal, but workable.
5
No. Nobody illegal should get legal status to stay.
Why is this so hard for some to grok?
Why is this so hard for some to grok?
2
Neither Trump nor Sessions would address the elephant in the room.
That many white Americans, poor and rich like, are simply unable or unwilling to take on the lowest paying, most menial jobs out there.
Such as washing floors, picking grapes, cooking food, waiting tables and fixing cars, air conditioners and constructing our homes and offices.
Those jobs, at least here in Northern California predominantly fall to immigrants, or children of immigrants, many of them illegally arrived.
Take away this group and many white college kids would have to forget about going to Silicon Valley to make their fortunes, and instead they would have to take jobs scrubbing floors and other such menial tasks.
Certainly, neither Trump nor Sessions sought those jobs after finishing their education and presumably they would rather that their children not end up washing the floors and windows of Trump Tower or picking cotton.
That many white Americans, poor and rich like, are simply unable or unwilling to take on the lowest paying, most menial jobs out there.
Such as washing floors, picking grapes, cooking food, waiting tables and fixing cars, air conditioners and constructing our homes and offices.
Those jobs, at least here in Northern California predominantly fall to immigrants, or children of immigrants, many of them illegally arrived.
Take away this group and many white college kids would have to forget about going to Silicon Valley to make their fortunes, and instead they would have to take jobs scrubbing floors and other such menial tasks.
Certainly, neither Trump nor Sessions sought those jobs after finishing their education and presumably they would rather that their children not end up washing the floors and windows of Trump Tower or picking cotton.
18
Maybe that's true about washing floors, cooking food, etc., but I have never bought this argument when it comes to construction jobs. Construction jobs used to be a solid source of middle-class jobs for young men in this country with lower levels of education. When the labor pool became flooded by cheap labor from Central America, Americans could no longer afford to compete with the folks who would work for pennies on the dollar and get paid under the table to boot. American workers didn't just up and decide one day that they were no longer instructed in working construction - the endless supply of cheap labor pushed them out. I live on a street with two General Contractors who have been in the business in the Marin/SF/Sonoma/Napa areas for over 25 years, and they've both told me the exact same story when it comes to this issue.
14
Uh those tasks just would not be done or would be done by homeowners on their own property. The US does not need scared people in the shadows to make the economy work.
4
you are correct. many Americans would and do refuse to take these low paying jobs. the question is why. the answer is because the gov't will provide them with welfare income that rivals the salary of the low paying job. and they don't have to do anything for it. the welfare system needs to be revamped so that if necessary, people would need to relocate to take available work (that is no longer being done by undocumented).
why do the Silicon Valley College kids need to take low paying jobs? they will continue to use their education and strive to create silly tech that they can sell for millions. No need to scrub floors. that analogy is non-sequitar.
why do the Silicon Valley College kids need to take low paying jobs? they will continue to use their education and strive to create silly tech that they can sell for millions. No need to scrub floors. that analogy is non-sequitar.
3
Trump has clearly figured out because of his failed legislation that he can't write policy and it is better to pass the buck. It's simple: DACA works. So Congress should simply pass the legislation as it is written and send it back to Trump.
4
I have used over 20 health aides in my home. I have found that immigrants compared to American born aides are harder working, more reliable, more thoughtful and caring for their patients, and above all more honest and trustworthy. There is no comparison. They don't call in sick on nice days or rainy days just for a day off, and they always let you know if they might be late.
There is no comparison at all, really.
Congress should fix this.
When it comes to repairing the damage from hurricanes, you can bet that the immigrants will get the job done.
There is no comparison at all, really.
Congress should fix this.
When it comes to repairing the damage from hurricanes, you can bet that the immigrants will get the job done.
10
You have confused your desire for cheap compliant labor with moral virtue.
3
The Constitution stipulates the manner in which legislation is enacted into law.
It sets up a framework where the House, the Senate and the President get a say on the law and so compromise among the 3 is required. Not to mention compromise and horse trading among the individual representatives and Senators.
That's the way legislation works. It may be inefficient but it's the Constitution.
We don't have a King. We don't have a line-item veto (ruled unconstitutional). We don't have a system where the President can pick and choose which elements of the law to enforce to craft his own personal legislation free of the annoying riders and pork attached along the way.
That's why DACA as a unilateral executive "legislation" is unconstitutional -- it's legislation by executive fiat that skips the part about compromise among the separate branches and their constituent members.
It sets up a framework where the House, the Senate and the President get a say on the law and so compromise among the 3 is required. Not to mention compromise and horse trading among the individual representatives and Senators.
That's the way legislation works. It may be inefficient but it's the Constitution.
We don't have a King. We don't have a line-item veto (ruled unconstitutional). We don't have a system where the President can pick and choose which elements of the law to enforce to craft his own personal legislation free of the annoying riders and pork attached along the way.
That's why DACA as a unilateral executive "legislation" is unconstitutional -- it's legislation by executive fiat that skips the part about compromise among the separate branches and their constituent members.
5
So Mmm, I don't think anyone (except the far right) is calling DACA "legislation." The point is that after many years of legislative bickering over the matter, there was a human issue that needed to be addressed, not some scholarly argument over the best way to manage immigration. It was a temporary hold on the deportation of immigrant children until a comprehensive immigration policy could be developed (yeah we'll be waiting a long time for that). It would be really cool if the parties reached across the aisle and knocked out something reasonable in the 6 month timeframe - but pretty sure that was not the Trump expectation going in.
It is actually extremely easy to say what needs to happen.
The "Dreamers" need to be allowed to continue under the current system, and they should be offered a simple path to citizenship. Even make citizenship a requirement for anyone staying longer than say 5 additional years.
The problem is not the simple solution, it is the simpletons in congress.
Teabag Party members heads would explode, all sorts of racist rubbish will be thrown around, bigotry will flow like new wine.
And in the end we either adopt the simple fix the vast majority of Americans, both Democrat and Republicans want...
of because of the bigotry of the few we will perpetrate a massive grotesque injustice that will tank our economy and make us even more of a "rogue nation" in the eyes of the civilized world.
The "Dreamers" need to be allowed to continue under the current system, and they should be offered a simple path to citizenship. Even make citizenship a requirement for anyone staying longer than say 5 additional years.
The problem is not the simple solution, it is the simpletons in congress.
Teabag Party members heads would explode, all sorts of racist rubbish will be thrown around, bigotry will flow like new wine.
And in the end we either adopt the simple fix the vast majority of Americans, both Democrat and Republicans want...
of because of the bigotry of the few we will perpetrate a massive grotesque injustice that will tank our economy and make us even more of a "rogue nation" in the eyes of the civilized world.
7
Sadly many citizens disagree with you.
You need a more detailed plan-
1.) Make sure you characterize those that disagree with you as bigots, racists and evil.
2.) Intimidate people into silence.
3.) Replace wrong-thinking citizens with illegal immigrants.
4.) Add a dash of violence as needed- after all these are bigot racists and they deserve what they get- right?
I personally have issues with gaining economic benefit from the desperation of those who are here illegally. I am ok with the economy tanking- sure buddy- without easily exploitable illegal labor.
I just wanted to let you know that there are tens of millions of citizen kids who would love to be an active part of the economy. I know- they do not count because.... well because. Just because.
You need a more detailed plan-
1.) Make sure you characterize those that disagree with you as bigots, racists and evil.
2.) Intimidate people into silence.
3.) Replace wrong-thinking citizens with illegal immigrants.
4.) Add a dash of violence as needed- after all these are bigot racists and they deserve what they get- right?
I personally have issues with gaining economic benefit from the desperation of those who are here illegally. I am ok with the economy tanking- sure buddy- without easily exploitable illegal labor.
I just wanted to let you know that there are tens of millions of citizen kids who would love to be an active part of the economy. I know- they do not count because.... well because. Just because.
2
While they're at it, how about ending birthright citizenship, AKA anchor babies?
This is long overdue. It is no longer post Civil War days. End it now.
This is long overdue. It is no longer post Civil War days. End it now.
21
It will require a Constitutional Amendment.
3
how would you confer citizenship? what would that look like constitutionally?
2
It would be an inhuman act to deport these kid to where they came.
6
Did you know there are parts of the world, outside the US, that actually have running water?
I just read, recently, that other parts of the world may have electricity now.
Rumors are flying that someone spotted cars south of Texas.
I just read, recently, that other parts of the world may have electricity now.
Rumors are flying that someone spotted cars south of Texas.
7
The countries where they came could have every modern comfort but this is not important. Would any American kid with European parents would like to be deported to Europe for any conceivable reason? It is not running water and cars. It is being taken out from an environment one grew up and being sent to a country with a totally different culture. This is why deportation to a country of your parents is an inhuman action and punishment.
Trump has just tossed the GOP a live grenade with the pin removed - this should be an interesting six months.
4
I think it is safe to say that the GOP cannot count on many of the Dreamers voting for them.
What are they thinking? In another twenty years the children of illegal immigrants are going to be a huge demographic.
The GOP better start fighting for those votes now by opening the borders completely. If they have offended 20 million today they will need to import at least 30 million more illegal immigrants if they want to keep up.
One of the benefits will be much cheaper prices. Sure no citizens will have jobs because wages will be so low but I am sure the cheap prices will make up for it.
What are they thinking? In another twenty years the children of illegal immigrants are going to be a huge demographic.
The GOP better start fighting for those votes now by opening the borders completely. If they have offended 20 million today they will need to import at least 30 million more illegal immigrants if they want to keep up.
One of the benefits will be much cheaper prices. Sure no citizens will have jobs because wages will be so low but I am sure the cheap prices will make up for it.
3
No puzzle. They are in the country illegally, fine them, jail them, deport them. No excepprions. Just get rid of them. For churches and individuals granting these bloated tacks sanctuary, impridon them for harboring felons; for cities and states, fine them, cut off ever penny of aide and send in the military. To uphold the law.
9
Would that be the same law that Sheriff Joe broke?
Yes on DACA with a pathway to citizenship as long as no on DAPA (rewarding the parents who illegally entered with chained immigration off of their children becoming citizens).
6
I'm a proud American. But, only due to the fact that my great grandparents on mom's side and all four grandparents came from Europe to have a better life... my Swedish grandpa claimed Land in the Oklahoma land rush. My Spanish greatgrandpa came to open a grocery store in a small town in northern CA... they were all Dreamers. Yesterday's motion by racist haters makes me ill!!!
5
Down with racist haters.
People like you are the ones who are making a difference. I am sure you are donating your time and money to helping these kids. I am sure you have opened your doors and have supported these families.
I am sure you are not one of those types that loves causes so long as someone else is paying the bills.
There can be no reason, no reason at all, for someone to not have your view on this issue unless they are a racist hater. How dare they.
Yours is the kind of open-mindedness and empathy we need more of.
People like you are the ones who are making a difference. I am sure you are donating your time and money to helping these kids. I am sure you have opened your doors and have supported these families.
I am sure you are not one of those types that loves causes so long as someone else is paying the bills.
There can be no reason, no reason at all, for someone to not have your view on this issue unless they are a racist hater. How dare they.
Yours is the kind of open-mindedness and empathy we need more of.
1
What I find incongruous is that most of the 10 states threatening to sue the government over DACA aren't even states with significant undocumented populations! Texas is, but it pales in comparison to California. Why does the rest of the country want to pile on California, where 40 percent of all illegals live anyway?
Because we don't want to be California.
3
They know the corrupt unhinged personalities in the DNC have nurtured philosophic U Lock fringe bases which dominate those state governments to blindly support chaos.
1
I can see that. Too hard.
The Democrats really need to worry with all this deportation talk.
A lot of their voters are going to take a pass and not vote.
A lot of their voters are going to take a pass and not vote.
1
Let us look at the recent past. The Democrates controlled both houses of congress and the White House and did nothing. Now they blame the Republicans for foing nothing.
The solution, while not easy, is doable.
1. Legalize the presence of the "Dreamers" within the US. The number not to exceed 800,000.
2. Prohibit the "Dreamers" from citizenship, but not their children
3. Prohibit the children born of persons unlawfully in this country from being citizens; "anchor banbies"
4. Deport persons unlawfully in this country
5. Fingerprint all non-citizens entering this country
6. Make it a crime to enter or remain in this country unlawfully; the fingerprinting would help in the identification
7. Build the physical wall where practicable.
8. Create a quest worker program that permits work but under no circumstances citizenship or citizenship for the children of the guest workers whether born in the US or elsewhere unless they go through the lawfull entry process.
The solution, while not easy, is doable.
1. Legalize the presence of the "Dreamers" within the US. The number not to exceed 800,000.
2. Prohibit the "Dreamers" from citizenship, but not their children
3. Prohibit the children born of persons unlawfully in this country from being citizens; "anchor banbies"
4. Deport persons unlawfully in this country
5. Fingerprint all non-citizens entering this country
6. Make it a crime to enter or remain in this country unlawfully; the fingerprinting would help in the identification
7. Build the physical wall where practicable.
8. Create a quest worker program that permits work but under no circumstances citizenship or citizenship for the children of the guest workers whether born in the US or elsewhere unless they go through the lawfull entry process.
6
as a moderate republican, I can agree with that. but it must not be limited to just mex-latin americans. must be open to the irish (of which I personally know quite a few) as well as all others.
however, there needs to be a dreamer minimum age. if the dreamer is 18 or younger, the need to go back with their parents. can't give independent dreamer status to a 13 year old and send back the parents. who will care for the child?
however, there needs to be a dreamer minimum age. if the dreamer is 18 or younger, the need to go back with their parents. can't give independent dreamer status to a 13 year old and send back the parents. who will care for the child?
1
trump is holding these kids future hostage as a political bargaining chip. COLD.
2
http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/canada-could-gain-from-daca-move-1.4276201
As this article says, the "Dreamers" are educated, motivated, pre-screened, without criminal records. Excellent candidates for immigration. If America doesn't want them, I will be happy if Canada accepts them. We need this kind of people!
As this article says, the "Dreamers" are educated, motivated, pre-screened, without criminal records. Excellent candidates for immigration. If America doesn't want them, I will be happy if Canada accepts them. We need this kind of people!
3
Why is this even an issue? Because Obama initiated DACA? Why are these American children being played with like a cat plays with its prey? By being raised, educated and hired in this country they have earned a symbolic American citizenship, why not make it actual and permanent? What case can be made that they are doing real harm to their own country and its people? This is a death sentence for these children, our children, if not physical death then death of the soul. Trust this president and his administration and congress to do the the irrational and inhumane thing. A sad day for a once great country.
13
Why not make it actual and permanent?
Because many citizens disagree with you. I know- they are bad people for disagreeing with you.
The idea of a slight majority of citizens can just unilaterally grant full rights to law breakers does not sit well with me. This is a big decision that has ramifications that will last for generations.
Such a big decision should not be made because six out of ten people think it is right- some of those people agreeing only because they have been offered no alternative/
Do you expect your voice, as a citizen, to be respected? Do you think you should extend that courtesy to others? Even the mean people?
Because many citizens disagree with you. I know- they are bad people for disagreeing with you.
The idea of a slight majority of citizens can just unilaterally grant full rights to law breakers does not sit well with me. This is a big decision that has ramifications that will last for generations.
Such a big decision should not be made because six out of ten people think it is right- some of those people agreeing only because they have been offered no alternative/
Do you expect your voice, as a citizen, to be respected? Do you think you should extend that courtesy to others? Even the mean people?
5
To be American you have to be born here or be legally naturalized or born overseas to American parents.
So "Dreamers" aren't Americans. When the pro-DACA people try to fudge the plain meaning of words that's a sign that they are trying to practice deceit and appeal to emotion.
It is not a death sentence for a non-resident who entered illegally to be sent back to their own country. In fact it's what the law requires.
It is, like it or not, completely legitimate for American citizens to hold the belief that illegal immigration needs to be ended, not embraced. Perhaps if more illegal immigrants showed appreciation for not being kicked out instead of incredible levels of entitlement, we might not be here today. Perhaps marching around America waving Mexican flags talking about what you're not going to allow wasn't the best move. Dunno.
But I do know that what is done by executive order can be undone by executive order. Pro-DACA people need to convince detractors, not just yell at them and insult them. But they won't do that.
So "Dreamers" aren't Americans. When the pro-DACA people try to fudge the plain meaning of words that's a sign that they are trying to practice deceit and appeal to emotion.
It is not a death sentence for a non-resident who entered illegally to be sent back to their own country. In fact it's what the law requires.
It is, like it or not, completely legitimate for American citizens to hold the belief that illegal immigration needs to be ended, not embraced. Perhaps if more illegal immigrants showed appreciation for not being kicked out instead of incredible levels of entitlement, we might not be here today. Perhaps marching around America waving Mexican flags talking about what you're not going to allow wasn't the best move. Dunno.
But I do know that what is done by executive order can be undone by executive order. Pro-DACA people need to convince detractors, not just yell at them and insult them. But they won't do that.
4
The ironic hypocracy of an Attorney General who committed perjury at his Senate hearing calling for "law and order."
12
Trump says that if Congress doesn't act on DACA he will re-visit it. Perhaps he does have some feelings for those impacted.
Doubtful. He'll revisit it depending on where the Russia investigation is going in 6 months and depending on the bad or good news coverage. It's all about him. Nothing and nobody else matters, those of us who have watched this sorry excuse for human being in the past 30 years don't expect any different.
1
The issue of “Dreamers” isn’t about the actual people involved, it is about a segment of our population that has a visceral hatred of foreigners, particularly those who “don’t look or sound like me.” It is also about community punishment.
There is no question that our nation has a real problem with members of cartels crossing our borders with illegal drugs. The cartels are a very small portion of the people who cross the border illegally, yet they have the largest impact on our nation. Therefore, in the minds of many Americans, they all have to go; regardless of their connections with cartels. It doesn’t matter if they are adults or children, educated or not, good people or not.
This is a specious argument. Americans have a problem with admitting that the drug problem is an American problem. Americans are willing to spend billions of dollars every year for illegal drugs and the problem is pervasive and not limited to any one sub-group of Americans. We have to stop blaming others and look into the collective mirror and admit that we, as a nation, have a problem that is caused by Americans, some of whom are our friends, family members, work associates, neighbors, et cetera.
As long as there is a demand, somebody will try to fill that demand. As long as we ignore the real problem we will have people like Jeff Sessions (looking like a kid on Christmas morning) proclaiming that we are going to deport all the non-Americans who cause all our problems.
There is no question that our nation has a real problem with members of cartels crossing our borders with illegal drugs. The cartels are a very small portion of the people who cross the border illegally, yet they have the largest impact on our nation. Therefore, in the minds of many Americans, they all have to go; regardless of their connections with cartels. It doesn’t matter if they are adults or children, educated or not, good people or not.
This is a specious argument. Americans have a problem with admitting that the drug problem is an American problem. Americans are willing to spend billions of dollars every year for illegal drugs and the problem is pervasive and not limited to any one sub-group of Americans. We have to stop blaming others and look into the collective mirror and admit that we, as a nation, have a problem that is caused by Americans, some of whom are our friends, family members, work associates, neighbors, et cetera.
As long as there is a demand, somebody will try to fill that demand. As long as we ignore the real problem we will have people like Jeff Sessions (looking like a kid on Christmas morning) proclaiming that we are going to deport all the non-Americans who cause all our problems.
7
DACA was created by Obama, primarily to get more votes from the Mexican contingent and because he had a strong Socialistic spirit - rather than Democratic - he pulled two fast ones for the price of one.
Trump is not a nice guy, granted, but he is doing the right thing to tell Congress to figure it out.
Trump is not a nice guy, granted, but he is doing the right thing to tell Congress to figure it out.
12
Let us stand up for the Dreamers. Let us inundate D.C. with support for the Dreamers: letters, phone calls, Tweak, whatever it takes. Let us remember who they are, these Dreamers: people who will grow into maturity having benefited greatly from the largesse of their U.S. benefactors and who will not forget it. Let us forget our legalese and urge D.C. to welcome its inner godliness. What have we got to lose?
5
Inundate Ryan and McConnell, the two Leaders who initiate the vote-taking power in Congress. As House & Senate Leaders, they both must accept emails and calls from outside their own districts.
1
The problem is not easy but immigration reform is necessary. This requires that Congress actually do its job and act in a Solomon like manner. A lack of resolution leads millions to live in limbo, encourages people to come across the border to live in this limbo, allows for abuses of both (illegal or undocumented - take your pick) immigrants, and is simply the wrong policy. We need to ask the questions, who should be allowed to immigrate and under what circumstances? Should it be first come first serve or based on what they can contribute to American society? What numeric limits should exist? What layers of right to work, residency, and citizenship should exist? Who should be eligible for government benefits from healthcare to education? What are the protections for each of these groups under the law? When these items are defined, we need to close the borders and live by these rules. Reagan provided millions immigration amnesty. It served a group of people living here but ultimately the lack of a comprehensive policy and border controls allowed the problem to balloon. Partisans and the Press can use this moment to attempt to secure political advantage. This is the time to resolve the issues and not play politics
19
We already have answers to all of those questions.
The problem is that millions of foreigners have decided they don't like the answers. And they have decided to enter the country without permission. Unless we show the world that this behavior doesn't pay more and more and more people will do the same thing.
For people who do not like the current US demographics or fundamentally believe that the US (and the US alone) must pay for its sins, the idea of millions more immigrants entering has great appeal, particularly if the children of these immigrants are likely to vote Democratic.
But as the US is already the third most populous nation on the planet, it's not racist to ask if we really need millions more.
The problem is that millions of foreigners have decided they don't like the answers. And they have decided to enter the country without permission. Unless we show the world that this behavior doesn't pay more and more and more people will do the same thing.
For people who do not like the current US demographics or fundamentally believe that the US (and the US alone) must pay for its sins, the idea of millions more immigrants entering has great appeal, particularly if the children of these immigrants are likely to vote Democratic.
But as the US is already the third most populous nation on the planet, it's not racist to ask if we really need millions more.
4
the problem won't ever get fixed as long as we keep goping back to that "give your tired, your poor" nonsense. A poem does not make immigration policy and while there is some national sentiment that accompanys that feeling, we live in a different world. We need to exert control on the things that are necessary to make America work for all and an open door policy simply isn't going to help. Everybody knows that the 4.4% unemployment is a hoax--just go to any shopping mall and see it filled with cars DURING the workday. Look in the parks where the homeless and jobless live. Continual amnesties are not helping. Give tese kids a greencard, no citizenship, and curtail legal immigration until the numbers zero out.
4
Lilo, I applaud firm control of the borders and a rational immigration policy. However, you incorrectly assume that immigration is a financial burden. Immigrants are more entrepreneurial and drive economic growth in this nation. Native born are now 50% of STEM graduates down from 74% in 1985. We are a country of immigrants - 15% German, 11% Irish, 9% English, 15% other European, 13% African American, 16% Hispanic, 5% Asian, 15% other. 42% of America's Fortune 500 Companies are founded by 1st or 2nd Gen immigrants representing 30% of GDP and 10M+ jobs these include Apple, AT&T, Google, GE, IBM, McDonalds, Coke, Microsoft, and Tesla. It is not racist to demand a rational system. However, if you think that this country was better in the 1950's when men worked, women stayed at home, Christians ruled the land, Jews were second class, and Blacks knew their place, then I would say immigration policy is not your real concern
Every one has reasons to explain why he/she is exceptional to the laws. But we also know that "two wrongs" cannot make it "right." I don't believe that "those deserving "dreamers" are burden to society, but I also believe those "dreamers" must follow the laws to apply and obtain approval before they can be admitted to here. We just need a "transition law" to evaluate each individual case one by one no matter how long it will take. No exception, please.
3
They were already evaluated to get DACA status.
1
We should revisit the interpretation of the 14th Amendment. It was ratified in the wake of the Civil War and meant to clarify the citizenship of freed slaves, but has also given us birthright citizenship - something no European country has, nor does Japan, nor India, nor Australia, nor South Africa, nor ...
10
For the record and objectively, almost all countries in the Americas DO have birthright citizenship. This includes: Canada, U.S.A., Mexico, Brazil, Argentina, Guatemala, and Chile, among others.
Asian and European countries tend more to jus sanguinis, based on parents? national origin.
Indeed, if the U.S. followed Europe's example, then most American citizens would the Native Americans.
So--if we want to follow Asia and Europe, then we better start learning our new languages and customs.
For example, under the European citizenship model, Joe Arpaio would be an Italian citizen, resident in the United States. And, Donald Trump would be a German citizen, resident of the U.S.
So--if we want to follow Asia and Europe nationality laws, then we better start learning our new languages and customs. And enjoy our new nationality! Because in most cases, it would not be American.
Asian and European countries tend more to jus sanguinis, based on parents? national origin.
Indeed, if the U.S. followed Europe's example, then most American citizens would the Native Americans.
So--if we want to follow Asia and Europe, then we better start learning our new languages and customs.
For example, under the European citizenship model, Joe Arpaio would be an Italian citizen, resident in the United States. And, Donald Trump would be a German citizen, resident of the U.S.
So--if we want to follow Asia and Europe nationality laws, then we better start learning our new languages and customs. And enjoy our new nationality! Because in most cases, it would not be American.
Holding Congress' feet to the fire and demanding they actually do their jobs is an interesting tactic but considering they had seven years to create a viable alternative to the Affordable Care Act and failed miserably the prospects look grim.
3
I am a liberal, and I am increasingly impressed by Senator Lindsey Graham. I thought his comments at the press conference indicated actual leadership and a sincere desire to do the right thing.
And then there are his frequently witty criticisms of Trump ...
Maybe Trump if ushering in a new wave of bipartisanship: Trump is turning me into a fan of political conservatives opposing him.
And then there are his frequently witty criticisms of Trump ...
Maybe Trump if ushering in a new wave of bipartisanship: Trump is turning me into a fan of political conservatives opposing him.
10
Perhaps somewhere in his mind, Trump understands that the only way to pass horrible legislation is to put an unrealistically rushed timeline on things. If the media and the citizenry can't keep up, why, you can pass *almost* anything. One hopes the democrats do not fall for this little sales con, and puts the brakes on long enough for Americans to be informed about what is being proposed. The republicans won't like it, but that's the price you pay for trying to legislate outside of the light.
3
DACA was an act of extreme cruelty luring illegal immigrants with a false promise. All in an attempt to create more democrat voters.
18
DACA gave these kids a lifeline, after Congress failed to pass a bill giving them a path to legalization- what's so hard to understand?
6
Exactly. The height of political cynicism.
Notice how the law rewards a particular behavior that is expressed overwhelmingly by one subset of the immigrant population.
This is obviously aimed at achieving the stated partisan goal of creating an "enduring Democratic majority" by rewarding that subset of foreign nationals who can reliably deliver CA, NM, NV and eventually TX and AZ to the Democrats.
Disgusting.
Notice how the law rewards a particular behavior that is expressed overwhelmingly by one subset of the immigrant population.
This is obviously aimed at achieving the stated partisan goal of creating an "enduring Democratic majority" by rewarding that subset of foreign nationals who can reliably deliver CA, NM, NV and eventually TX and AZ to the Democrats.
Disgusting.
5
The only takeaway from this "tragedy" is that neither party cares about "Dreamers" beyond the extent it buys them currency with the Latino community. It's disgraceful to see the Left crying foul at the same time they are handing the Republicans the opportunity to fix what they couldn't when they had the chance. This not about decency, racism or anything else "liberals" are squawking about, it's pure politics plain and simple. Latinos should remember this when either party comes courting their vote in the next election cycle.
18
"President Trump gave Congress six months to pass legislation legalizing young immigrants brought to America illegally by their parents."
This NYT lede puzzles me. Did Trump actually say he wanted illegal immigration legalized? Because I'm pretty sure that not what he wants.
This NYT lede puzzles me. Did Trump actually say he wanted illegal immigration legalized? Because I'm pretty sure that not what he wants.
7
Then he is betting it won't happen. If it does happen, it will be a decision, finally. He wins either way.
1
He has no principles. He wants applause.
3
"President Trump gave Congress six months to pass legislation legalizing young immigrants brought to America illegally by their parents."
"This NYT lede puzzles me. Did Trump actually say he wanted illegal immigration legalized? Because I'm pretty sure that not what he wants."
Well, on the other hand trump said that he "LOVES" these young immigrants! With that kind of "love," I would advise them to run for the hills. It is tantamount to telling them: "Come out with your hands up; we are not going to hurt you...we want to help you." The minute you come out with your hands up, you are machine-gunned to death.
"This NYT lede puzzles me. Did Trump actually say he wanted illegal immigration legalized? Because I'm pretty sure that not what he wants."
Well, on the other hand trump said that he "LOVES" these young immigrants! With that kind of "love," I would advise them to run for the hills. It is tantamount to telling them: "Come out with your hands up; we are not going to hurt you...we want to help you." The minute you come out with your hands up, you are machine-gunned to death.
It used to be a time where there were practically no rules on immigration. But by then the immigrants were white Christian people.
7
When was that, during the time of the Mayflower?
2
There also used to be a time when the United States wasn't overpopulated, when computerized automation wasn't replacing more and more jobs each day, when we had seemingly unlimited natural resources and vast open spaces - those times came to an end nearly 50 years ago.
6
Wilbray,
I don’t think you understand our situation. Canada’s immigration laws restrict non-refugee immigration to those who could easily assimilate and who could contribute to the economy. At one point (perhaps this is still the case), a person had to already have a job offer in Canada before he or she could move there.
In contrast, we accept almost three quarters of our immigrants based solely on kinship. It does not matter if they could easily assimilate by speaking English or if they have a skill our economy needs. They certainly do not have to already have a job offer before being allowed to move here.
For at least the last few years, we have been giving more green cards to Mexicans than to people of any other nationality. (See the PEW Research Center's 7/6/17 Fact Tank web page for 2015, and The Department of Homeland Security’s web page titled "Legal Immigration and Adjustment of Status Report Fiscal Year 2017, Quarter 2” for the information gathered so far on 2016 and 2017.)
Despite our awarding legal immigration status to more Mexicans than to people from any other country, we have been flooded with Mexicans moving here illegally. Canada controls its borders. Don’t you think we should be able to do so, also?
I don’t think you understand our situation. Canada’s immigration laws restrict non-refugee immigration to those who could easily assimilate and who could contribute to the economy. At one point (perhaps this is still the case), a person had to already have a job offer in Canada before he or she could move there.
In contrast, we accept almost three quarters of our immigrants based solely on kinship. It does not matter if they could easily assimilate by speaking English or if they have a skill our economy needs. They certainly do not have to already have a job offer before being allowed to move here.
For at least the last few years, we have been giving more green cards to Mexicans than to people of any other nationality. (See the PEW Research Center's 7/6/17 Fact Tank web page for 2015, and The Department of Homeland Security’s web page titled "Legal Immigration and Adjustment of Status Report Fiscal Year 2017, Quarter 2” for the information gathered so far on 2016 and 2017.)
Despite our awarding legal immigration status to more Mexicans than to people from any other country, we have been flooded with Mexicans moving here illegally. Canada controls its borders. Don’t you think we should be able to do so, also?
28
Trump is a coward; Sessions is a Trump stooge more eager to stick with the letter of the law, has no interest in real facts or compassion; the GOP is paralyzed by its Alt-right wing/Tea Party members...and it is us, the citizens of the US are the losers.
20
If their parents had not broken the law by entering the U.S. illegally, these young people would not be in this fix and the President and Congress would not be faced with a no-win decision either way. When will illegal immigration be confronted? If Democrats have their way, the answer will be never. Meanwhile visit any town or village near New York, and you will see illegals lining up for day labor, much of which is off the books and robs America of work related taxes. Somebody needs to step up to address the issue, but fears of being labelled a racist have most politicians cowering in the corner.
50
Except this article isn't about their parents. It's about the 800,000 Dreamers, over 90% of whom, by all accounts, are employed and paying taxes. Deporting them would cost us billions, plus the tax revenue they pay into our system. Now, what do you say about *them*? And "They never should have been here in the first place" isn't an answer. They're here. For real. They're human beings. They were raised in America, identify as American, and for many, America is the only home they've ever known. *What do you have to say about THEM.*
4
You make a good point. Why are the employers hiring illegals not in jail? If there were no jobs, they would not come. So........ thanks for bringing up the fact that most illegals are here because they need work. Obviously, the answer is to be sure that only our economy succeeds, and that children need to be punished. The employers, well... they were just trying to make a buck, right? What could be bad about that?
5
How do you know those people lining up for day labor are "illegals? Did you check their papers? Or is it that they "look like Mexicans?
2
The rhetoric (Clearly) reveals these aren't 800,000 lives as much as they're 800,000 Hostages.
7
In simple terms: America welcomes immigrants. Yes, this issue concerns those who immigrated, illegally, when they were kids. So should blame be tossed into the mix?
Not only are they "Americanized", they study, serve in the military, pay taxes and apparently deserve legal residency. Only if this happens can we continue to say "Give me your tired, your poor...". Or should we remove The Lady in the Harbor?
Not only are they "Americanized", they study, serve in the military, pay taxes and apparently deserve legal residency. Only if this happens can we continue to say "Give me your tired, your poor...". Or should we remove The Lady in the Harbor?
8
The Lady in the Harbor has never reflected what actually happens here. The Irish were treated badly. The Italians were treated badly. A ship full of Jews who were facing certain death in their homeland were turned away. The descendants of slaves were treated like trash to be kept out back and out of sight. Women were deemed too stupid to vote. The Lady in the Harbor has always just been a hope, never realized. Are we ready to give up hope? I may have already....
1
Deport the parents and any that have committed crimes, and build the wall - only then would I support legalizing the rest.
24
I would just like to translate this statement. "Rip families apart, then build a wall between them. Only then I will support treating 800,000 hardworking young people, who have only ever known America as their home, as actual fellow Americans worthy of respect and decency."
2
Stop being hateful unless you're NOT an American who is NATIVE American. We. Are. All immigrants. All of f us.
2
No. We are not all immigrants. We are all citizens now. And some of us are not descended from immigrants.
2
Why is one particular subset of immigrants allowed to break the rules which everyone else must comply with?
Of all those who oppose rewarding this massive violation of our laws, the people most upset by this farce are LEGAL immigrants from around the world.
Imagine that you've been waiting patiently in line for the concert of a lifetime. The line stretches around the block and for miles. When you get inside, finally, having followed the rules and purchased your ticket, you see a large group of people kicking and screaming as they are escorted out of the auditorium by security.
They are screaming, "But we paid for our tickets!" Security (and everyone else) responds, "You jumped the queue."
Do you tell security to let these people back in to the show?
Or do you demand that their seats be given to people who obeyed the rules and waited patiently in line, as you did and as every normal civilized person is expected to do?
End this farce. Restore rule of law in this country.
Zero tolerance for those who trash our immigration laws.
Of all those who oppose rewarding this massive violation of our laws, the people most upset by this farce are LEGAL immigrants from around the world.
Imagine that you've been waiting patiently in line for the concert of a lifetime. The line stretches around the block and for miles. When you get inside, finally, having followed the rules and purchased your ticket, you see a large group of people kicking and screaming as they are escorted out of the auditorium by security.
They are screaming, "But we paid for our tickets!" Security (and everyone else) responds, "You jumped the queue."
Do you tell security to let these people back in to the show?
Or do you demand that their seats be given to people who obeyed the rules and waited patiently in line, as you did and as every normal civilized person is expected to do?
End this farce. Restore rule of law in this country.
Zero tolerance for those who trash our immigration laws.
35
Because by definition these are people who were brought here as children. They had no choice, no say. "Breaking the law" requires intent and understanding.
These people are Americans in every way EXCEPT the accidental geography of their birth. They are educated in American schools, hold jobs (almost all are employed or in school-it is a requirement of the program) and pay taxes to the US and their state and local governments. Many serve in first responder jobs and our military.
You think that it is a "good policy" to have zero tolerance for "law breakers" but I bet you pitch a fit when you get a parking ticket.
These people are Americans in every way EXCEPT the accidental geography of their birth. They are educated in American schools, hold jobs (almost all are employed or in school-it is a requirement of the program) and pay taxes to the US and their state and local governments. Many serve in first responder jobs and our military.
You think that it is a "good policy" to have zero tolerance for "law breakers" but I bet you pitch a fit when you get a parking ticket.
3
Ah, because they were children? I guess that's the next answer, send the children of those who go to prison to prison with them. After all, it is the parent's responsibility to take care of their children. The children should have been smart enough to be born to better parents. Simple, really.
1
How did your ancestors arrive in the US. kimosabe?
How cruel is America going to get toward these poor "dreamers?"
This certainly is time to change the laws. Perhaps "dreamers" should be considered refugees and given legal citizenship, and then move on.
This certainly is time to change the laws. Perhaps "dreamers" should be considered refugees and given legal citizenship, and then move on.
4
Rain falls on some while the sun shines on others. Very little in this world makes sense. I was lucky to be born in America. I didn't earn it, it was a simple stroke of good fortune. I want to pay it forward to Dreamers whose only fault was being born in the wrong place. This is our time to show the world that America is still the music maker and we are the dreamers of dreams.
6
Can there really be any basis for optimism that the lower duma
can pass a coherent and humane version of DACA when the
Hastert rule determines what legislation is brought to the floor
for voting upon? Ridding that chamber of the single
most effective vehicle for an extremist minority to dictate
policy to the majority is a sine qua non for anything useful being acted
upon.
If and when Ryan articulates that policy change, it will indicate that
something constructive is in the works.
Until then there will be lots of public posturing and empty rhetoric
designed to play to a distracted and ambivalent public, all hoping
to reassure people that this country has not morphed into something
very ugly.
But I do not see how this is possible when the same
people who feel so sure that they would never ever deport kids who
have grown up here all of a sudden grow very queasy about
letting their parents work here with some legal status.
can pass a coherent and humane version of DACA when the
Hastert rule determines what legislation is brought to the floor
for voting upon? Ridding that chamber of the single
most effective vehicle for an extremist minority to dictate
policy to the majority is a sine qua non for anything useful being acted
upon.
If and when Ryan articulates that policy change, it will indicate that
something constructive is in the works.
Until then there will be lots of public posturing and empty rhetoric
designed to play to a distracted and ambivalent public, all hoping
to reassure people that this country has not morphed into something
very ugly.
But I do not see how this is possible when the same
people who feel so sure that they would never ever deport kids who
have grown up here all of a sudden grow very queasy about
letting their parents work here with some legal status.
1
Extending DACA, pushing it further down the road without other substantive changes continues to leave the affected individuals in limbo. What is the point?
Are we actually bent on perpetuating a shadow population, a permanent under class?
Instead provide a clear path to citizenship with a reasonable time limit. Further, do not extend the DACA status to any newly arrived illegal entrants.
The border wall should not be a bargaining chip — no deal making can make it a rational or useful choice. It is elementally ill-conceived and outright foolishness. Viable, much smarter and affordable alternatives are legion.
Something else that is long overdue is the need to end the provision that automatically makes the children of illegal immigrants born on American soil citizens. It is a longstanding enticement to rampant abuse that includes those who are here with legal status for the primary purpose of birthing children in America.
Too many legislative tag-ons and passing a bill will be impossible for this Congress.
Having said this, comprehensive immigration reform is unbelievably overdue. Utterly disgraceful!
Americans of every political stripe are totally fed up with the disabled and dysfunctional governance that constantly emanates from Washington.
Are we actually bent on perpetuating a shadow population, a permanent under class?
Instead provide a clear path to citizenship with a reasonable time limit. Further, do not extend the DACA status to any newly arrived illegal entrants.
The border wall should not be a bargaining chip — no deal making can make it a rational or useful choice. It is elementally ill-conceived and outright foolishness. Viable, much smarter and affordable alternatives are legion.
Something else that is long overdue is the need to end the provision that automatically makes the children of illegal immigrants born on American soil citizens. It is a longstanding enticement to rampant abuse that includes those who are here with legal status for the primary purpose of birthing children in America.
Too many legislative tag-ons and passing a bill will be impossible for this Congress.
Having said this, comprehensive immigration reform is unbelievably overdue. Utterly disgraceful!
Americans of every political stripe are totally fed up with the disabled and dysfunctional governance that constantly emanates from Washington.
6
Why has this been the lead for the past week? Why not healthcare reform or tax reform? These are real matters that affect all Americans. This is a matter that affects only--like it or not--a small population of non-Americans illegally residing in the United States.
4
Groundhog Day - oh, the irony of it all. Pres. Obama asked Congress to solve this issue and they would not - and their inaction lasted much longer than the six months allotted by Pres. Trump. Obama then felt compelled to address the issue with DACA as the result.
Now, Pres. Trump, although he'd never admit it, does exactly what his predecessor did , but unlike Obama, Trump is leaving uncertainty, fear and despair in his wake. The same Republicans who obstructed Pres. Obama will now do the same to Trump - with a crucial difference: Trump and his ilk care not a whit for DACA children; they just wants Congress to take the blame for his lack of morality and compassion.
Now, Pres. Trump, although he'd never admit it, does exactly what his predecessor did , but unlike Obama, Trump is leaving uncertainty, fear and despair in his wake. The same Republicans who obstructed Pres. Obama will now do the same to Trump - with a crucial difference: Trump and his ilk care not a whit for DACA children; they just wants Congress to take the blame for his lack of morality and compassion.
5
Can we cut the dreamer bologna . We could absolve dreamers and then we'd be moaning about sending their mom and grandma packing. Border and visa control, then republicans might talk about citizenship. I'm a lifelong Democrat.
34
Wow. This should be simple enough: Just write a bill and we know Trump will sign it if it's called the "DJT Stay in America" legislation. He said for Republicans to "Fix it."
1
Thank you Yamiche Alcindor and Sheryl Gay Stolberg for writing an honest article. It is a shame that a version of the DREAM act has failed in spite of bipartisan support for its principles. Both sides of the aisle have failed us. Too many articles regarding DREAM target republicans and fail to report the failures of the democrats as well. These authors point them out - senate filibuster blocking DREAM included democratic senators - then "For years, they [democrats] used the Dream Act as a bargaining chip to push for broader immigration legislation, . . ." Both sides have made dreamers bargaining chips - both sides of the aisle are to blame. Will congress finally do the right thing? - Or will this devolve to the more partisanship - Another case where republicans come up with a bill but fail to get republican unamity and the democrats maintain unanimity to oppose a republican bill - or will several from both sides meet to get something right done? Will Mr. Ryan drop the so called "Hastert" rule. This is a test for both parties. I will watch.
43
Who would the Dream Act protect? Would all children brought to the US illegally be protected from 16 years ago to now and into the future? I don't know the answer to thes questions.
The blame for illegal immigrants should be placed squarely on the shoulders of Congress. They refuse to pass immigration laws and provide funding to enforce the laws. Simply fine employers for hiring illegal immigrants. They'll stop coming. This is why Congress refuses to do anything about illegal immigration. .
The blame for illegal immigrants should be placed squarely on the shoulders of Congress. They refuse to pass immigration laws and provide funding to enforce the laws. Simply fine employers for hiring illegal immigrants. They'll stop coming. This is why Congress refuses to do anything about illegal immigration. .
3
You are referring to Hastert, the child molester. A disgrace to Illinois. Mean and devious and depraved to the bone.
More accurately, Congress has failed for 16 years to solve a simple problem.
7
If Congress finds a solution to the DACA issue within six months, it may turn out that Trump did something right, but for totally the wrong reasons.
Trump isn't dismantling DACA because it is an executive order, he is dismantling DACA because it was an Obama executive order and because it favors brown people. Trump's ultimate objectives are to erase Obama's legacy (something that doesn't seem to catch the attention of the Press as much as it should), and to pander to his base of racists whites. Would Trump and his base of racist whites be so obsessed about DACA if the policy had been put in place by GW Bush and favored blue-eyed Scandinavians? Probably not so much.
Trump isn't dismantling DACA because it is an executive order, he is dismantling DACA because it was an Obama executive order and because it favors brown people. Trump's ultimate objectives are to erase Obama's legacy (something that doesn't seem to catch the attention of the Press as much as it should), and to pander to his base of racists whites. Would Trump and his base of racist whites be so obsessed about DACA if the policy had been put in place by GW Bush and favored blue-eyed Scandinavians? Probably not so much.
8
So I hate to be the bearer of bad news- Congress will NOT pass anything in 6 months.
Which means that DACA persons who gave their personal info to the government will be easily locatable at work and home.
This is going to be the easiest round up of "illegals" for Trump.
In about six months, America is going to become a cruel, unforgiving, harsh, and unjust society. America is not going to just destroy 800K lives- the collateral damage will be massive.
Which means that DACA persons who gave their personal info to the government will be easily locatable at work and home.
This is going to be the easiest round up of "illegals" for Trump.
In about six months, America is going to become a cruel, unforgiving, harsh, and unjust society. America is not going to just destroy 800K lives- the collateral damage will be massive.
9
This is a complex issue, as we all know. There are points on each side. I believe the children should not be punished for the sins of the parents, but I also understand the rule of law argument. If they are not granted any permanent status, I suggest that they prepare to flow (not emigrate as I doubt they have passports) to Canada, where they will be warmly welcomed, absorbed, and added to the economy. I'm sorry that's not a perfect solution Dreamers, but it's better than staying here or going to a country you don't know and won't be able to re-integrate into. And too bad for us stupid Americans who will lose your talents, educational promise, etc. I'm sorry you will be torn from your family and community, but get a passport and come back and visit. When this is all over, as it surely will, you might consider returning, though after what's happened, you may not want to (and I wouldn't blame you), and by then you might decide Canada is a very decent country that speaks English and does believe in humanity. Good luck to you Dreamers, I'm rooting for you.
4
I’m no fan of Trump, but in this case he’s right to put this in Congress’ lap. Our representatives have fallen into the ugly habit of kicking the can down the road with temporary legislation and more recently complete inaction. It’s time for them to put up or shut up.
For the record, I’m in favor of a permanent DACA program and broader immigration reform.
For the record, I’m in favor of a permanent DACA program and broader immigration reform.
3
Except Congress which hasn't fixed this problem in 16 years is unlikely to fix it in six months. Where does that put theses people?
Let me see if I have this right:
The (not my) president proposes changes to American immigration policy which would allow only educated, English proficient individuals with no criminal record to enter the U.S. Isn't he describing exactly the individuals which DACA has been protecting from deportation?
Rescinding DACA is cruel, immoral, costly and un-American and, it makes no sense. I guess decisions made by "leaders" devoid of intelligence and humanity should no longer surprise me. . .
The (not my) president proposes changes to American immigration policy which would allow only educated, English proficient individuals with no criminal record to enter the U.S. Isn't he describing exactly the individuals which DACA has been protecting from deportation?
Rescinding DACA is cruel, immoral, costly and un-American and, it makes no sense. I guess decisions made by "leaders" devoid of intelligence and humanity should no longer surprise me. . .
5
A six month run of the circus may require a bigger and more durable tent to withstand all the acrobatics, juggling acts and clowns. McConnell and Ryan are going to look even more ridiculous in long red tails and a top hats. I'm glad most circuses have dropped their animal acts, it would be cruel to make any animal endure something like what the next six months hold in store.
This Congress can't even agree on what time to break for lunch. DACA is doomed, and Trump is getting ready to place all the blame on Congress.
3
Maybe the all the blame should be on Congress, who should have figured out long ago what time to break for lunch. They in no way, shape, or form deserve a get out of jail free card. Much as i hate to agree with Huckabee-Sanders, if they can't do their job, we should find someone who will. And nobody may like what we dredge up for that one.
1
I am very confused about the Republicans distress about the way DACA came about. They have the nerve to be upset about an executive order from Obama, but say nothing about all of Trump's orders? This world has turned upside down.
1
I am no fan of Trump or this White House. I think they are incompetent, bigoted, self-serving and, often, actually deranged. However, extending the DACA Executive Order would have only put things off to the vagaries of another administration. There needs to be legislation on this issue, and it needs to happen quickly. I can't believe I am saying that I think this was the right move.
2
This is the worst administration to try handling something as sensitive as DACA.
Remember the healthcare mess?
Remember the healthcare mess?
The Apprentice has once again shot himself and the GOP into confusion by his lack of commitment to any process along with his 'lazy man' governing style. In addition, no group in Congress with a majority is apparently on the same page. Congressional caucuses are similar to putting a stick in an ant's nest for meaningful organization. The next time someone says we need a Presidential candidate without government experience, laugh him from the room.
As a legal immigrant who came to the US as a child, DACA, as it currently stands, provides unfair and biased treatment against those who are legal immigrants. DACA provides preferential treatment for those who have been in the US illegally since they were a child while doing nothing to protect those who have been in the US legally since they were a child.
DACA does not (1) protect those who have been in the US legally since they were a child from deportation. Should these individuals ever lose their legal status, they will be deported back to their home countries despite having grown up in the US.
(2) DACA does not allow those who are legal immigrants who have been here since they were children to pay in-state tuition (they get to pay, minimally, double the tuition because they are considered international students)
(3) DACA does not give legal immigrants who have been here since they were children specialized work permits that would allow them to work without limitations in the US after they graduate (they get to join the long line of people who are trying to get a H1-B visa in order to work in the US and who can't leave their employers because their application is tied to them).
DACA gives preferential treatment to illegals at the cost of legal immigrants. Congress needs to either expand DACA to include legal immigrants as recipients of DACA benefits or DACA needs to be repealed. It is only fair.
DACA does not (1) protect those who have been in the US legally since they were a child from deportation. Should these individuals ever lose their legal status, they will be deported back to their home countries despite having grown up in the US.
(2) DACA does not allow those who are legal immigrants who have been here since they were children to pay in-state tuition (they get to pay, minimally, double the tuition because they are considered international students)
(3) DACA does not give legal immigrants who have been here since they were children specialized work permits that would allow them to work without limitations in the US after they graduate (they get to join the long line of people who are trying to get a H1-B visa in order to work in the US and who can't leave their employers because their application is tied to them).
DACA gives preferential treatment to illegals at the cost of legal immigrants. Congress needs to either expand DACA to include legal immigrants as recipients of DACA benefits or DACA needs to be repealed. It is only fair.
42
What a sad day for America that we must resort to an obstructionistic, self-serving Republican Congress to be humane and compassionate, from DACA to "saving" the law of the land, the ACA.
But its leader has crossed the line, perhaps years ago, and has resurrected his rabid supporters from the dark side to follow him into an abyss of hate.
There is no hope for Trump. I firmly believe he is beyond saving both morally and politically. But if the GOP in the Senate and House can help the innocent in their many forms, this Democrat will hold her nose and bury my bitterness toward them, and support them and, of course, my Party across the aisle.
But its leader has crossed the line, perhaps years ago, and has resurrected his rabid supporters from the dark side to follow him into an abyss of hate.
There is no hope for Trump. I firmly believe he is beyond saving both morally and politically. But if the GOP in the Senate and House can help the innocent in their many forms, this Democrat will hold her nose and bury my bitterness toward them, and support them and, of course, my Party across the aisle.
2
The LIFE act, Legal immigration and Family Equity Act of 2000 was designed to enable undocumented children who were brought by there parents to adjust their status and get permanent residence. It was a 245(i) adjustment. There was a four month window between December 2000 and April 30, 2001 for relatives to file. Had this window been extended it would have helped more dreamers and severely reduced their numbers. It involved having a legal family sponsor and paying a $1000 fine. Could this LIFE act be quickly updated and revived?
28
Congress must return to working order. That's it. Look to find new leadership from within Congress as current 'leaders' have proved themselves to be nothing more than useless impotent hacks working for Trump. Congress is a separate but equal arm of government. Be that again. For the sake of the country, not your own agenda. We are equal partners in this country, with the same rights and responsibilities to the country and each other, and we need to publicly acknowledge and re-affirm that today.
1
Shocking I tell you that the President of The United States would want the 535 elected members of Congress to do their job they were elected for? We as citizens of America make hard decisions everyday that is what they get elected and payed for, if they can't or won't do their jobs quit and let someone who will.
8
President Trump has called on Congress to do what they are supposed to do, make laws. Our country is not structured to be run by executive order or rulings from the bench. The congressional lawmakers must perform their job - and then the public needs to accept those laws, which may include deporting illegal immigrants who have violated our immigration laws. No rouge executive orders, no rouge liberal judge or attorney generals. Set it in law and abide by it.
6
"There are 800,000 kids’ futures at stake,” Mr. Gutierrez said."
So build the Wall, end visa overstays and mandate E-Verify. Add in a path to citizenship for the existing Dreamers.
Compromise and get this done now.
So build the Wall, end visa overstays and mandate E-Verify. Add in a path to citizenship for the existing Dreamers.
Compromise and get this done now.
6
Trump punted of course rather than face his responsibilities, but Congress can't, it has had 16 years to do something, anything. Harry Truman said it best with the slogan on his desk: "THE BUCK STOPS HERE". I suggest the Congregational Printing office print that and leave it one everyone's desk.
I would think that the President would be inclined to stay his course and, should there be legislation, he would veto it if it includes anything that he and his narrow base of support think resembles special treatment or amnesty for any person.
The GOP has no intention of helping the Dreamers. They see this as a political opportunity to invigorate their base while demoralizing the democratic base.
How?
The GOP politicians will gnash their teeth and howl publicly about how ill-informed Trump was to suspend DACA. Then they will demand horrendous concessions from Democrats to pass a temporary and extremely limited Dreamers act. When the Democrats balk, the dreamers will be deported and the democrats will be labeled as obstructionists and not caring about the dreamers.
If the Democrats concede, the bill that will be passed will hurt many dreamers as well as minority and working poor communities. (Think weakening of ACA, cuts to social and education programs.)
Either way the democrats will be viewed as feckless and ineffective and the democratic base will be demoralized.
How?
The GOP politicians will gnash their teeth and howl publicly about how ill-informed Trump was to suspend DACA. Then they will demand horrendous concessions from Democrats to pass a temporary and extremely limited Dreamers act. When the Democrats balk, the dreamers will be deported and the democrats will be labeled as obstructionists and not caring about the dreamers.
If the Democrats concede, the bill that will be passed will hurt many dreamers as well as minority and working poor communities. (Think weakening of ACA, cuts to social and education programs.)
Either way the democrats will be viewed as feckless and ineffective and the democratic base will be demoralized.
1
Penalizing the innocent and marginalized is cruel and sadistic. Immigration reform has been needed, but this way is unnecessary. This is hurtful to our society who may be losing valuable skilled members and simply a poor decision. Many DACA recipients serve in our military, for example. And the idea of tearing apart the lives of these people, educated and reared here, for no reasonable or higher purpose at all, is simply repugnant. It's against what America stands for - or used to, at any rate. May reason, and kindness, prevail.
60
Stop. None of the DCA kids are going to be deported unless they decide to become felons.
The reason congress needs to address DACA is the question of what will be the country's standards for illegal immigration? Congress is the appropriate body to decide whether or not there should be a statute of limitatiol allowing illegal immigrants to stay if undetected for some period of years.
Setting illegal immigration standards is a very complex task but it is incredibly important that both those intending to break our laws by illegally entering the country and those charged with upholding immigration law should clearly know what are the ground rules.
The reason congress needs to address DACA is the question of what will be the country's standards for illegal immigration? Congress is the appropriate body to decide whether or not there should be a statute of limitatiol allowing illegal immigrants to stay if undetected for some period of years.
Setting illegal immigration standards is a very complex task but it is incredibly important that both those intending to break our laws by illegally entering the country and those charged with upholding immigration law should clearly know what are the ground rules.
2
Sadistic? Really? If you think that's sadistic then you haven't seen the world.
These so-called Dreamers are simply product of their law-breaking parents. I think the US government is so gracious enough to allow them stay here.
As we're speaking right now, thousands of Rohingya women and children are being raped and killed for living in a place where they were born and raised. As we're speaking right now, thousands of people with disabilities are denied access to basic needs just because they are disabled. Now, that's cruel and sadistic.
Allowing law-breakers to enjoy your tax dollars? That's an act of enabling. These dreamers should be grateful enough that they could live here without having gone through the proper avenues to get their paperwork. Protesting for more? That's blatant entitlement.
These so-called Dreamers are simply product of their law-breaking parents. I think the US government is so gracious enough to allow them stay here.
As we're speaking right now, thousands of Rohingya women and children are being raped and killed for living in a place where they were born and raised. As we're speaking right now, thousands of people with disabilities are denied access to basic needs just because they are disabled. Now, that's cruel and sadistic.
Allowing law-breakers to enjoy your tax dollars? That's an act of enabling. These dreamers should be grateful enough that they could live here without having gone through the proper avenues to get their paperwork. Protesting for more? That's blatant entitlement.
5
American stands for law and order. And granting an amnesty to illegal aliens is not upholding American law. After all it does not help the country to ram through another amnesty for illegal aliens and ignoring our laws to do so.
3
While Trump is correct that Congress needs to address this particular immigration issue, I question his method and motive. He doesn't favor immigration of any kind. He could have told Congress, "In 6 months I'm shutting this down." Instead he shut it down now. Dreamers thus become a pawn in a Washington chess game.
1
President Trump gave Congress six months to change DACA and said he might then 'revisit' the issue. Three years ago President Obama changed immigration policy and told Congress if they didn't like it to "Send me a bill". So Trump is doing exactly what Obama did - acting on his own while telling Congress to get off the dime.
1
If the left truly cares about these people it has to compromise on this, or nothing will get done. The impetus is on them. A simple renewal of DACA isn't going to happen, check the results of the last election if you think the political will for this is there.
Recent history has shown that the left is perfectly OK with virtue signaling and reactionary pummeling of their political foes. This has resulted in exactly nothing but division and legal chaos.
If you think "my way" is in the cards, then check who is in power now and who isn't. Try to do something useful. The citizens will accept a compromise, the activists need to get out of the way.
Recent history has shown that the left is perfectly OK with virtue signaling and reactionary pummeling of their political foes. This has resulted in exactly nothing but division and legal chaos.
If you think "my way" is in the cards, then check who is in power now and who isn't. Try to do something useful. The citizens will accept a compromise, the activists need to get out of the way.
6
While I do not think Trump has any mastery of the complexity of the issues involved in DACA or immigration in general, he continues to show either deliberate or intuitive skill in ambiguous speech: He argues that he had to revoke Obama's executive order on DACA as it was unconstitutional in spite of his "great love" for the DACA kids. His position is the President has no legal right to grant the DACA exemption; only Congress has. He then says if Congress doesn't act to fix the problem he will "revisit" the issue, implying he might do something himself, which he supposedly can't do as it would be unconstitutional. Down the road when Congress hasn;t done anything and all eyes turn back to Trump he can then say: "well, I only said I'd revisit the issue; I never said I'd do anything." Meanwhile ICE now has records on the DAKA kids and 800,000 people have their lives disrupted.
Will Congress finally get its Head out of its Assets and make some laws that make sense for the innocent, the productive, the valuable for the good of the country including business and our neighborhoods? Or, will we paint a Big Red D on the clothing of the Dreamers and declare them less than citizens, round them up into Detention Centers? "We'll See."
1
Well they aren't citizens. I don't know that I would make them the highest priority for deportation but I wouldn't exclude them from deportation either.
Citizens are people who were born here or who have been legally naturalized.
Citizens are people who were born here or who have been legally naturalized.
5
I'm just happy that Apple Pie wasn't invented by President Obama or Bizarro President Trump would seek to set aside that as well.
The idea that the Republican leadership in Congress is going to develop and pass meaningful immigration reform is hilarious, BTW.
The idea that the Republican leadership in Congress is going to develop and pass meaningful immigration reform is hilarious, BTW.
4
Sixteen years of failure is simply a testament to how ineffectual and corrupt Congress has become. They no longer represent the voters whom elected them but rather corporations and business interests. The 2018 mid-terms are an opportunity to rectify this absurd situation to some extent.
1
President Obama was correct yesterday when he remarked that Congress had years to put together an immigration bill but did not, leaving him with no ethical choice but to act.
There is no reason to think that Congress will do better now. Onetime immigration reform advocates like McCain and Rubio have devolved into hardliners on the subject. And Trump hasn't gotten other legislation he wanted, like repealing and/or replacing the ACA.
Trump has put the ball in Congress' court knowing the issue will die there.
There is no reason to think that Congress will do better now. Onetime immigration reform advocates like McCain and Rubio have devolved into hardliners on the subject. And Trump hasn't gotten other legislation he wanted, like repealing and/or replacing the ACA.
Trump has put the ball in Congress' court knowing the issue will die there.
2
Where does this idea come from that because Congress won't do what a particular President wants then that President has no other ethical choice but to take the law into his own hands?
Do you _really_want Trump to operate under those rules?
Only Congress gets to make law. Not the President. President Obama was wrong to unilaterally change the legal status of a subset of illegal immigrants.
Do you _really_want Trump to operate under those rules?
Only Congress gets to make law. Not the President. President Obama was wrong to unilaterally change the legal status of a subset of illegal immigrants.
6
Even this Congress can solve this problem right now. Simply pass legislation that declares that all immigrants who entered the U.S. under the age of 18 before 2017 are legal immigrants who can now apply for permanent resident status and citizenship. All economists and everyone else besides the mean-spirited haters like Sessions and Trump's deplorable base agree that the so-called "Dreamers" are a positive force for the economy and the country as a whole. We need them, we have already educated them. They are probably more productive than Trump's base supporters. We need them more than we need the base Trump.supporters.
2
All these Republicans voicing ad nauseam on any media outlet that gives them time stating that what Obama did was illegal is most offensive. I remember him, and to be fair, former president Bush II, pressing congress to take on immigration for a final complete resolution.
Congress, mostly fueled by the Republicans refused to act.
Well, Obama acted since congress wouldn't and he did the right thing for the right people the only way he could: protecting the most innocent caught up in this whole situation, the children children. The ones who could not make any decisions for themselves. What part of that do these "nationalists" not understand? Or care to understand?
I really wished the media, as they cover this story ad nauseam, would remind their audiences of that history a little stronger. I have yet to hear one mention of the real history and as a result it has all become one of two narratives - Trump's white fear baiting nationalism and also to be fair on the other side the adults who were those children brought here or born here after the fact. We need the whole story - Trump and all the other Obama bashers get too many passes and as a result have shaped the narrative completely to their desires.
Congress, mostly fueled by the Republicans refused to act.
Well, Obama acted since congress wouldn't and he did the right thing for the right people the only way he could: protecting the most innocent caught up in this whole situation, the children children. The ones who could not make any decisions for themselves. What part of that do these "nationalists" not understand? Or care to understand?
I really wished the media, as they cover this story ad nauseam, would remind their audiences of that history a little stronger. I have yet to hear one mention of the real history and as a result it has all become one of two narratives - Trump's white fear baiting nationalism and also to be fair on the other side the adults who were those children brought here or born here after the fact. We need the whole story - Trump and all the other Obama bashers get too many passes and as a result have shaped the narrative completely to their desires.
3
Seriously? Six months to sort out an issue that has been debated exstensively for the past 16 years should be plenty of time. Obama completely overstepped his authorities by enacting DACA by fiat. Thankly, Trump has shown some degree of restraint by not trying to dictate his own option.
This is an issue of such huge national importance that it simply must be decided by the legislative process. It also is a marvelous opportunity for bipartisan cooperation. The nut cases at the extremes of the two parties will prevent either party from imposing its will on the nation. This is as it should be with any legislation of such national importance..
Congress created this mess and now it needs to solve it!
This is an issue of such huge national importance that it simply must be decided by the legislative process. It also is a marvelous opportunity for bipartisan cooperation. The nut cases at the extremes of the two parties will prevent either party from imposing its will on the nation. This is as it should be with any legislation of such national importance..
Congress created this mess and now it needs to solve it!
2
Trump is effectively using these people as "human shields" as he threatens Congress over funding for a wall no one actually wants in the Southwest. He is totally morally bankrupt. This is simply further proof of the callous disregard he has for anyone other than himself.
Wow. Just renew DACA. Seems like Congress inactivity over the past 9 years on this issue and other immigration issues have been neglectful. Rather than renew DACA just do legislation that gives the Dreamer citizenship. How hard is that? Oh I forgot-Congress can't do that. We really need a new group of people in Congress (including the presidency). These people are not doing their job.
68
Ron,
Even though DACA has usually been described as protection for those who have graduated from high school, the truth is that it covers those who dropped out of elementary school. Many rural Mexicans and Central Americans drop out of school either in the elementary grades, or after finishing 6th grade, to go to work. Their cultures have a different concept of “adulthood’. (Females start to marry and have their own babies at age 14.) This describes many of the people who have moved here illegally. They were not brought here by their parents as schoolchildren. They came on their own, as adults, to find work.
If you would look on the Department of Homeland Security’s page where it addresses frequently asked questions about DACA (at question # 33), you will see that DACA is not reserved for those who have a high school diploma or a GED. It can also be given to anyone who enrolls in an alternative elementary school for adults or to anyone who signs up for a class in English as a Second Language, if it could lead to employment.
Most people do not realize how minimal DACA’s educational requirement actually is. If DACA is renewed, as it now stands, it could give protection to at least twice the number of people it now covers, many (perhaps most) of whom have had very little, if any, education. All they would have to do, to qualify, is enroll in an ESL class.
Even though DACA has usually been described as protection for those who have graduated from high school, the truth is that it covers those who dropped out of elementary school. Many rural Mexicans and Central Americans drop out of school either in the elementary grades, or after finishing 6th grade, to go to work. Their cultures have a different concept of “adulthood’. (Females start to marry and have their own babies at age 14.) This describes many of the people who have moved here illegally. They were not brought here by their parents as schoolchildren. They came on their own, as adults, to find work.
If you would look on the Department of Homeland Security’s page where it addresses frequently asked questions about DACA (at question # 33), you will see that DACA is not reserved for those who have a high school diploma or a GED. It can also be given to anyone who enrolls in an alternative elementary school for adults or to anyone who signs up for a class in English as a Second Language, if it could lead to employment.
Most people do not realize how minimal DACA’s educational requirement actually is. If DACA is renewed, as it now stands, it could give protection to at least twice the number of people it now covers, many (perhaps most) of whom have had very little, if any, education. All they would have to do, to qualify, is enroll in an ESL class.
11
Ann,
I am an immigration attorney and you are exactly right. The DACA standards are minimal. Also, the people who are saying "just give them all citizenship" are ignoring the chain immigration problem. Naturalized citizens are entitled to petition for many different relatives to get green cards...their parents, children, even brothers and sisters. Green card holders are then eligible to become citizens in three to five years.
I am an immigration attorney and you are exactly right. The DACA standards are minimal. Also, the people who are saying "just give them all citizenship" are ignoring the chain immigration problem. Naturalized citizens are entitled to petition for many different relatives to get green cards...their parents, children, even brothers and sisters. Green card holders are then eligible to become citizens in three to five years.
6
I was under the impression that over 790,000 are already registered in the DACA program and that to be admitted to the program they already have done the following.
1. The individual must have arrived in the USA before turning 16 years old.
2. They must be enrolled or graduate from high school
3. The individual must not have been convicted of a serious crime or deemed a threat to public safety or national security.
There are some individuals who do not meet these requirements and are to be deported. But how are we going to deport over three-quarter of a million young people? Spending more money and only to loose money from what employment and tax paying from these individuals.
According to the CATO Institute deporting these individuals (DACA individuals) would result in a $280 billion reduction in economic growth and a loss of $2 billion a year in state and local taxes. There is more to consider here than deporting these individuals.
1. The individual must have arrived in the USA before turning 16 years old.
2. They must be enrolled or graduate from high school
3. The individual must not have been convicted of a serious crime or deemed a threat to public safety or national security.
There are some individuals who do not meet these requirements and are to be deported. But how are we going to deport over three-quarter of a million young people? Spending more money and only to loose money from what employment and tax paying from these individuals.
According to the CATO Institute deporting these individuals (DACA individuals) would result in a $280 billion reduction in economic growth and a loss of $2 billion a year in state and local taxes. There is more to consider here than deporting these individuals.
The only thing Congress responds to is massive, widespread voter action. Putting the DACA/Dreamer question back where it belongs is a smart move by POTUS. Its the Legislatures responsibility to enact immigration law, not by presidental edict. If they pass it great. If they don't, then throw them out next election. I have bigger worries, like the other 30 million Americans who may lose healthcare coverage with these same maniacs and POTUS. So, join the long list of critical issues to resolve and get in line. Maybe more foreigners will see the downside of illegally immigrating to the US. Hopefully, a Korean War doesn't breakout later today, so I gotta go....
5
Agreed, but this is really all about that wall that no one in the Southwest actually wants who is not a construction company. This is major government graft and bully boy tactics at work.
If the effort is futile this time, blame should be completely on the Republicans --they control House, Senate, and Presidency. Democrats will support a clean bill on behalf of the Dreamers, and the spotlight is shining!
19
The Conservatives who want to fund Trump's border wall boondoggle for construction companies is going to be used to try to blame Democrats for refusing to vote for something that funds that graft. You watch. This is all a bullying game to get funding for that wall. He knows the Hurricane recovery funds cannot be tied up for this, so he is using these people as "human shields" to hide his real purpose.
If there was ever a time for the congress to act in a bi-partisan manner this would be it. Do the right thing, the real AMERICAN thing, and stop being so overtly racist!
21
The only racism are Latinos demanding the right to move here based on being Latino.
2
This is legislation reversal at full throttle. What's the matter with this guy? Is Trump now designing legislation only Neo-Nazi's, white supremacists and David Duke could love? At the risk of not having my comment published - I'd describe this as 'Ethnic Cleansing - American Style.' Except that this is not the America I know and treasure. Nor is it the America most Americans I know would endorse or enforce. And he does this when there is a real and present danger of a nuclear confrontation with North Korea? And, simultaneously, he picks a trade fight with South Korea? Does the expression 'Get your priorities right' have any meaning for this Administration? Foolish doesn't even begin to describe this man or his actions.
25
I agree completely. Trump's actions have more similarities to fascist Germany or Italy than to American values. Muslim ban, trangender ban, killing DACA, and other racist actions. It's all about a white supremacy ethos.
"This is legislation reversal at full throttle." This was never legislation in the first place. This was a purely executive action entirely unaligned with the precedent legislation, which says to deport them.
This is ethnic cleansing? Are all illegal aliens "ethnic" now?
This is ethnic cleansing? Are all illegal aliens "ethnic" now?
3
Well Congress did such a wonderful job fixing health care so this won't be a problem at all. What I'd like to know is what a rational approach to immigration reform looks like. Should we just open the borders? Should we enforce the current laws? Should we enforce E-Verify and fine employers who hire undocumented workers? I don't have any answers, just questions. We at least need a plan. Where is the plan?
5
You are absolutely correct that something comprehensive and mandatory is needed; however, using these people to force funding for a useless border wall that is actually just government graft for construction contractors is not the right way.
Like all bullies Trump is a coward, one who never faces the consequence of his actions. He'll take credit for "wins" and blame others for losses. If Congress passes a law protecting the dreamers and it turns out to be wildly popular with most of the nation, Trump will take the credit, saying he forced Congress to act. If his base screams too loudly, he'll blame Congress for passing an "amnesty", even though amnesty only applies to those who broke the law, and these kids did not break the law, only their parents did.
41
Grant them all citizenship. Puzzled solved.
49
And what about the legal immigrants who have been in the US for just as long or longer but have not received their citizenship?
7
No. This would result in many more millions entering our country illegally.
DACA is just another word for amnesty.
DACA is just another word for amnesty.
4
And to all those other perfectly decent people whose only wrong is their otherwise illegal status is of a different nature, you say what? Who's going to wring their hands over them, now that we've cleared of consciences with Dreamers.
1
The bigoted demagogue Trump at his worst.
However, having said that, the dreamers may eventually stay for these reasons.
The demagogue Trump must appeal to the bigoted end of his base and overturn the Obama edict instead of doing it the traditional way, thru the courts.
Trump and his biz. cronies need the dreamers. Both Trump and all his biz buddies employ many of these people and their corporations would hurt.
So, Trump is punting it to the Congress, telling his bigoted base he did his job and Congress will must likely keep the Dreamers and Trump will tell his bigoted base, I tried but my hand was forced.
However, having said that, the dreamers may eventually stay for these reasons.
The demagogue Trump must appeal to the bigoted end of his base and overturn the Obama edict instead of doing it the traditional way, thru the courts.
Trump and his biz. cronies need the dreamers. Both Trump and all his biz buddies employ many of these people and their corporations would hurt.
So, Trump is punting it to the Congress, telling his bigoted base he did his job and Congress will must likely keep the Dreamers and Trump will tell his bigoted base, I tried but my hand was forced.
8
Just make sure you get out and vote next time ....
73
Our Congress is so myopic on this issue. Pass legislation that makes these individuals citizens, with few exceptions, and let's move on. Since these individuals have been in the country since they were children and have been educated and most are productive members of our society they should be provided a clear path to citizenship so we can address the more difficult issues associated with immigration in separate legislation instead of trying to tie other issues onto the Dreamers bill and delaying enactment. The inefficiency of Congress needs to be addressed.
4
The callousness and insensitivity of this president is legion. How can you raise a decent child with this man as a model of the highest office in our land? It's a constant source of shame and anxiety. Every writer who mused on ethical governance from Plato to Confucius to Cicero would blush for us.
7
If Paul Ryan, who says he wants to prevent the upheaval and deportation of the Dreamers and can bring DACA to a vote at any time, would his fellow Republicans be supportive their plight? Jeff Sessions accused President Obama for executive overreach in allowing the Dreamers the opportunity to experience the American dream and Sessions also falsely charged the Dreamers of taking jobs away from American citizens.
Also, Ryan knows that the president doesn’t really want the Dreamers in the country so wouldn’t the Speaker’s desire to help the Dreamers run counter to the president’s wishes and campaign promises? There is already a rift between the Oval Office and Capitol Hill and a push by Ryan will only widen the gap in the Republican party.
Bartering a border wall for the future of the Dreamers is unconscionable. If the president wants a win, he can do the humane and right thing by reversing his order and allow amnesty to the Dreamers. America is the only country they know and America’s future is their future.
Also, Ryan knows that the president doesn’t really want the Dreamers in the country so wouldn’t the Speaker’s desire to help the Dreamers run counter to the president’s wishes and campaign promises? There is already a rift between the Oval Office and Capitol Hill and a push by Ryan will only widen the gap in the Republican party.
Bartering a border wall for the future of the Dreamers is unconscionable. If the president wants a win, he can do the humane and right thing by reversing his order and allow amnesty to the Dreamers. America is the only country they know and America’s future is their future.
7
How sickening to see Donald facing the camera after being asked about DACA, hearing him say, "I love these kids..." No, you don't, Donald. You have no love in your heart.
All the DACA recipients are hard working students, who must fill out a form from the government in order to be vetted! Not a single DACA recipient is a "gang member" not a single one!
Fact IS immigrants, legal or undocumented do not usually commit crimes. There's a blatant undercurrent of racism in this administration that has fanned the flames of hate.
All the DACA recipients are hard working students, who must fill out a form from the government in order to be vetted! Not a single DACA recipient is a "gang member" not a single one!
Fact IS immigrants, legal or undocumented do not usually commit crimes. There's a blatant undercurrent of racism in this administration that has fanned the flames of hate.
6
And so human lives once again become bargaining tools. I am under the impression the Emancipation Proclamation was supposed to change all of that.
3
Over the past 8 months, I have often wondered if there would come a time that I would have to face a similar decision that everyday Germans faced when the Nazis came knocking on their doors to take away their friends and neighbors. That say is upon us I believe, and when the time comes I am ready to stand up. I hope many of my fellow citizens will do the same.
4
If the principle of the DREAM Act is passed into law, dreamers will be given a path to permanent residency. Does that mean the parents can still be deported?
1
And why shouldn't they be? If you tie the Dream Act to a broader amnesty program, you are dooming the kids who should be allowed to stay. A lot of Republicans are on board with the concept of a path to legalization for Dreamers. They would immediately balk if it extended beyond that group.
5
We can only hope.
2
President Trump has chosen to put 800,000 lives in chaos for political gain. Disgusting.
Congress, though, is being challenged to govern. Congress hasn't governed for a decade. I personally believe the blame lies with the Republicans thwarting Obama at every turn, but there is enough finger pointing to spread around.
Now, though, it is time for partisan politics to become the side show and protecting our values and democracy to take center stage. Do we ruthlessly punish 800,000 productive young people for the actions of their parents? Is that who we are as a nation?
This.isn't.that.hard.
Get in a room.
Hash it out.
Be kind.
Be compassionate.
Legislate.
Govern.
Uphold democracy.
If our congress doesn't do this, can't do this then the fate of 800,000 young Americans is at stake as well as our functioning democracy.
Congress, though, is being challenged to govern. Congress hasn't governed for a decade. I personally believe the blame lies with the Republicans thwarting Obama at every turn, but there is enough finger pointing to spread around.
Now, though, it is time for partisan politics to become the side show and protecting our values and democracy to take center stage. Do we ruthlessly punish 800,000 productive young people for the actions of their parents? Is that who we are as a nation?
This.isn't.that.hard.
Get in a room.
Hash it out.
Be kind.
Be compassionate.
Legislate.
Govern.
Uphold democracy.
If our congress doesn't do this, can't do this then the fate of 800,000 young Americans is at stake as well as our functioning democracy.
7
The right wing keeps calling DACA "illegal," this lie needs to be contradicted in the strongest possible terms. DACA has never been declared illegal by any official body. It has never been tested in any court. The declaration that It is illegal simply the political opinion of the far-right, anti-immigrant crowd. They are using this falsehood to justify Trump's cowardly termination of DACA. There is no question that DACA needs legislation to make it permanent, but Obama's actions were never illegal.
7
So, you want to wait until the Supreme Court votes 9-0 that it IS illegal?
It is much better to admit that Obama's program is a lost cause, and do it the right way.
It is much better to admit that Obama's program is a lost cause, and do it the right way.
5
Fine, We should have let the DACA Assessment wind through the courts. Then see what actually transpired. One thing is clear, done this way, the decision would last beyond the 2018 elections and a new Congress, perhaps without the alt-Right baggage could then regularize the DACA residents, and they would not face the draconian 6 month deadline. Speculation on what the courts or the legislature would do cuts in multiple directions.
In the meantime the brute fact is that DACA never was illegal. Nothing is illegal until court authorities declare it to be so. We will see how legal Trump's actions have been as they are tested in court.
In the meantime the brute fact is that DACA never was illegal. Nothing is illegal until court authorities declare it to be so. We will see how legal Trump's actions have been as they are tested in court.
4
@Jb - As a punter who has followed the recent Supreme Court rulings carefully, that would be where I'd put my money. I could be wrong, but the trends have been in this direction.
Don't kick the can down the road. Fix this congress.
1
Trump's only objective in his announcement that he was punting the ball to congress was to avoid wrath from his base. He is consumed by his craving for approval. He gives not one hair on a rat's behind about 800,000 people. He cares only about his image with his admirers.
4
Why did Trump do this??? Because he CAN. Simple racism and spite towards Obama. Anyone saying otherwise is lying or a blustering Fool.
Or BOTH.
Or BOTH.
6
Phyliss, It is the President's job to enforce our laws. Obama's DACA edict is not law.
8
"Now, with 800,000 lives in the balance and a fiercely anti-immigration current running through the Republican Party"
People are not anti-immigration, but anti *illegal* immigration.
The NYT loses credibility when it falsely reports facts.
President Obama, a Harvard educated lawyer, broke the law when he created the DACA program by not only refusing to enforce the laws created by Congress, but even allowing people living here illegally receive documents such as Social Security Cards.
Not only is there an issue of rule of law, but there is the issue that DACA beneficiaries have taken spots that rightfully meant for Americans. For example, 200 students at the prestigious University of California at Berkeley went to these illegal residents instead of Americans.
I don't understand why the NYT and others lack the empathy for Americans who lost their opportunities to people living here illegally.
Please, please report the news accurately, please have respect for the law, please have empathy for those Americans who lost opportunities from President Obama's illegal action.
People are not anti-immigration, but anti *illegal* immigration.
The NYT loses credibility when it falsely reports facts.
President Obama, a Harvard educated lawyer, broke the law when he created the DACA program by not only refusing to enforce the laws created by Congress, but even allowing people living here illegally receive documents such as Social Security Cards.
Not only is there an issue of rule of law, but there is the issue that DACA beneficiaries have taken spots that rightfully meant for Americans. For example, 200 students at the prestigious University of California at Berkeley went to these illegal residents instead of Americans.
I don't understand why the NYT and others lack the empathy for Americans who lost their opportunities to people living here illegally.
Please, please report the news accurately, please have respect for the law, please have empathy for those Americans who lost opportunities from President Obama's illegal action.
37
They did report the news accurately. Obama didn't legalize anyone, he simply deprioritized people for prosecution, which he is allowed to do, who came in as minors, were improving themselves and stayed out of trouble. The purpose of the Social Security Cards was to make sure that they paid into the system. No court has ruled on DACA itself (the Texas v. U.S. case was re DAPA and a DACA expansion) so your statement on the "rule of law" is not as solidly founded as you think.
"there is the issue that DACA beneficiaries have taken spots that rightfully meant for Americans."
If the DACA students got those slots, it's because they earned them. There is no such thing as college slots meant for Americans.
Your putative claim of empathy is sanctimonious.
"there is the issue that DACA beneficiaries have taken spots that rightfully meant for Americans."
If the DACA students got those slots, it's because they earned them. There is no such thing as college slots meant for Americans.
Your putative claim of empathy is sanctimonious.
4
The Berkeley students were allowed to apply and be accepted under California State law. Obama and the Federal government had nothing to do with this.
You may think that other aspects of DACA were illegal, but they were never tested in court, so by definition were never illegal.
You may think that other aspects of DACA were illegal, but they were never tested in court, so by definition were never illegal.
3
"If the DACA students got those slots, it's because they earned them. There is no such thing as college slots meant for Americans."
Since they are living here against the law, they can't possibly earn the spots. Think about it.
Please have empathy for Americans who may not have had the privileges that many NYT readers had when growing up.
By giving people living here illegally Social Security cards, the President was "de facto" attempting to make legitimate people living here illegally.
Congress is supposed to pass laws. The President is supposed to enforce them. Obama should have worked with Congress to pass the law if he felt it was that important.
AG Sessions made it clear that what President Obama did regarding DACA is illegal. President Trump has done the correct thing (which President Obama *should have done*) which is to put law passing in the hands of Congress where according to The Constitution is where it belongs.
President Trump never went to law school, let alone Harvard Law like President Obama, yet, he has far greater respect for the law than President Obama did.
Since they are living here against the law, they can't possibly earn the spots. Think about it.
Please have empathy for Americans who may not have had the privileges that many NYT readers had when growing up.
By giving people living here illegally Social Security cards, the President was "de facto" attempting to make legitimate people living here illegally.
Congress is supposed to pass laws. The President is supposed to enforce them. Obama should have worked with Congress to pass the law if he felt it was that important.
AG Sessions made it clear that what President Obama did regarding DACA is illegal. President Trump has done the correct thing (which President Obama *should have done*) which is to put law passing in the hands of Congress where according to The Constitution is where it belongs.
President Trump never went to law school, let alone Harvard Law like President Obama, yet, he has far greater respect for the law than President Obama did.
1
I wish the media were clearer about what DACA is and is not. Contrary to what I heard a reporter say on TV news last night, the expiration of DACA is not "taking away legal status", because DACA never conferred legal status. All it ever did was say "we're deprioritizing your case for enforcement of the law, we're not planning to get around to you for at least two years." And there were hopes that Congress might write and pass legislation during that time that would open up a path to legalization. But Congress never did. That's not something that is within the purview of the presidency.
66
It seems Trump might finally have done something right.
The executive order would have lost a court battle from the 9 states opposing DACA. Immigration is clearly controlled by the legislation.
By pushing it to Congress, but doing it in the way he did with the six month time line, we'll see if Trump actually is given any credit. I would guess, not. Which is 90% of the time correct, but lets see.
The executive order would have lost a court battle from the 9 states opposing DACA. Immigration is clearly controlled by the legislation.
By pushing it to Congress, but doing it in the way he did with the six month time line, we'll see if Trump actually is given any credit. I would guess, not. Which is 90% of the time correct, but lets see.
33
If Trump got it right it would be for the wrong reason, which means he wouldn`t deserve any credit, regardless of the outcome. Trump is cancelling DACA to pander to his base of racist whites, and to erase Obama`s legacy, nothing else.
4
We have gotten into the habit of blaming the Executive Office for the Nation's immigration issues. The President's action in tossing the ball into the legislature is the right place to express the views and compassion of our citizens.
27
It's not just the problem with the DACA kids, who as a standalone issue probably wouldn't get the resistance that it does. It's the DACA kids as a gateway issue - potentially paving the way for DAPA+ redux, more potential relatives, continued lowered wages, more crowded low-income schools, more healthcare costs, etc on increasingly burdened states and municipalities, never mind the low-income neighborhoods and residents who get a solid chunk of the tab across the board. Can't kick these cans down the road for all eternity. Down to you, congress, time to do your job for a change.
32
Make it clear no amnesty and they will leave. Enforce our laws for once instead of pandering to the Latino lobby.
1
Sixteen years? We had bipartisan agreement with the Senate-passed S.744 in 2014. Extremists in the GOP torpedoed the bipartisan immigration reform, resulting in Obama's Executive Orders. As much as I disagree with Trump, I appreciate him putting it back on Congress where it belongs. Unfortunately, Congress is GOP controlled, so nothing will happen and we'll have more "lawless, unconstitutional" executive actions.
31
Thanks for the history lesson. The fact remains that DACA is dead absent Congress doing their job.
1
Following the fall of Saigon marking the end of the Vietnam War in 1975, the US accepted more than 800,000 Vietnamese refugees through a global resettlement program with the help of the UN High Commissioner for Refugees. This program lasted many years.
The US has similarly been accepting large numbers of immigrants and refugees in response to major world conflicts over a long time, including following the end of two World Wars.
The Statue of Liberty has an inscribed invitation to immigrants and refugees at its base which reads: “Give me your tired, your poor, your huddled masses yearning to breathe free.”
Mexico has a very long history of ungovernable violence and high death rates which is ongoing. One consequence has been the stubborn problem of the large numbers of illegal immigrants from Mexico to the US over many years.
President Obama responded to this problem with open arms and the long-term American generosity towards refugees.
But Trump responded to this problem with threats of deportation. This would destroy the lives of many adults and children who were/are seeking peace and stability in the US !!!
This is reprehensible and uncivilized !!!
The US has similarly been accepting large numbers of immigrants and refugees in response to major world conflicts over a long time, including following the end of two World Wars.
The Statue of Liberty has an inscribed invitation to immigrants and refugees at its base which reads: “Give me your tired, your poor, your huddled masses yearning to breathe free.”
Mexico has a very long history of ungovernable violence and high death rates which is ongoing. One consequence has been the stubborn problem of the large numbers of illegal immigrants from Mexico to the US over many years.
President Obama responded to this problem with open arms and the long-term American generosity towards refugees.
But Trump responded to this problem with threats of deportation. This would destroy the lives of many adults and children who were/are seeking peace and stability in the US !!!
This is reprehensible and uncivilized !!!
14
The proper response to "ungovernable" should not be disregard for laws in other countries.
3
No one has the right to come here. We have laws. Mexico's problems are not our fault. The Dreamers need to blame their folks for bringing them here and breaking the law. They are not refugees or immigrants.......they are criminals.
Time to put Americans first, we are not the mother to the entire world.
Time to put Americans first, we are not the mother to the entire world.
3
Mexicans should go home and fix Mexico. The solution to Latino poverty is not importing Latinos here. Canada has a merit based immigration system. There's no reason the US can't do the same. If you don't want to take every last living Latino in your nation, why should we?
2
It's a sad commentary on the state of affairs with the Congress that it might take a threat - the kind of threat one child would make toward another - to force it into action to solve the DACA (and other) problems. I am no fan by far of this so-called president but, ironically, it might take this terrible approach or method to finally get these kids on the path to full citizenship. Is this the way we now are to get things done?
Let's be clear - DACA was an imperfect stop-gap program where people were obligated to pay $500.00 to apply for the privilege not being deported from - what for many is the only home they know, and the privilege of legally contributing to the economy and paying taxes. However, they were never offered a path to citizenship. Without a path to citizenship, this can hardly be viewed as a long term sustainable program. However, looking at how the GOP recently viewed people who needed health care - I can't imagine members of Congress being the ones to create positive immigration reform/change. My guess is that Congress will pass some lame of legislation that will extend DACA for two more years....and then start the heavy work of tax rebates for the 1%.
5
Obama, a 1% person, took it upon himself to start DACA with an exec order
Not Constitutional at all.....we owe these illegal aliens nadad
Not Constitutional at all.....we owe these illegal aliens nadad
2
Being offered American citizenship for five hundred bucks would sound like a bargain to the billions who would like to come here legally. It is sheer ingratitude for DACA recipients to whine about it. Americans would be promptly jailed and shipped home if they dared pull the same stunt in Mexico.
1
What I suspect will happen is that there won't be enough votes for DACA to continue similar to what it was before Trump ended it.
By all accounts these DACA recipients are examples of the traditional American work ethic. Why are we making it hard for them to be openly productive members of our country?
Opponents of DACA claim it's because their parents came here illegally. Yes but American employer's that have menial or dirty jobs are hiring the parents. Jobs that the vast majority of Americans find "beneath them" to do. So someone has to do these jobs. They contribute to our Society with their labor, spending, and yes Taxes, and contributions to Social Security. If they also produce over-achieving children I say let them all stay and continue to make a positive contribution to our Country.
By all accounts these DACA recipients are examples of the traditional American work ethic. Why are we making it hard for them to be openly productive members of our country?
Opponents of DACA claim it's because their parents came here illegally. Yes but American employer's that have menial or dirty jobs are hiring the parents. Jobs that the vast majority of Americans find "beneath them" to do. So someone has to do these jobs. They contribute to our Society with their labor, spending, and yes Taxes, and contributions to Social Security. If they also produce over-achieving children I say let them all stay and continue to make a positive contribution to our Country.
3
@salvador444 - "Why are we making it hard for them to be openly productive members of our country?"
Pretty much because they are not white.
Pretty much because they are not white.
3
Fine the employers. You act like all the DACA young adults sing in the choir. How do they contribute to SS since they dont' have SS numbers, unless they're stolen one of ours?
1
Nonsense. If you don't want to pay a decent salary to locals, what gives you the right to import laborers to push down wages here? Whole industries have been decimated for the American worker as a source of income because of illegals. Fine them, fine their employers and stop dragging kids here and telling us you have the right to break our immigration laws.
1
There is no great mystery to the decline in the United States governance over the last 35 years. The quality of people who run for public office and get elected is substantially lower in terms of intellectual competence, capacity and honesty as compared with the WW II generation. This is particularly so in the Republican party both at the presidential(see e.g. Bush II, Trump) as well as Congressional candidates(too many examples to sample).
The Economist Magazine calls this, correctly in my view, "The Post-Truth World". You cannot found substantive public policy on the basis of falsity and falsehood. There is no evidence things will get better any time soon.
The Economist Magazine calls this, correctly in my view, "The Post-Truth World". You cannot found substantive public policy on the basis of falsity and falsehood. There is no evidence things will get better any time soon.
7
And you think a Mexican national with a DUI and a GED is going to do any better?
Why the screaming over Trump's DACA decision? Obama had zero authority to unilaterally change it. He only did so because Congress refused to do it via legislation, AKA, "the way our system of laws works."
Trump reversed Obama's illegal policy and returned the issue to Congress where it belongs. As the elected voice of the people they will draft the appropriate legislation that will (hopefully) keep those who are employed and assimilated while returning home the criminals and chronically unemployed.
Trump reversed Obama's illegal policy and returned the issue to Congress where it belongs. As the elected voice of the people they will draft the appropriate legislation that will (hopefully) keep those who are employed and assimilated while returning home the criminals and chronically unemployed.
36
Previous presidents issued executive actions on immigrations such as waiving requirements for Cubans and other groups.
Only right wing people turn a blind eye to history in this way.
No Dreamer is a criminal. Every Dreamer is screened by the Department of Homeland Security and can have no criminal background. Every Dreamer has to be enrolled or at work. No Dreamer receives any government benefits.
Please educate yourself about what Dreamers are, what their legal requirements are, and how many previous presidential actions similarly addressed immigration issues.
Only right wing people turn a blind eye to history in this way.
No Dreamer is a criminal. Every Dreamer is screened by the Department of Homeland Security and can have no criminal background. Every Dreamer has to be enrolled or at work. No Dreamer receives any government benefits.
Please educate yourself about what Dreamers are, what their legal requirements are, and how many previous presidential actions similarly addressed immigration issues.
4
Ok, I will bite, on the condition that trump quits.
He has done nothing but make himself richer and everything else worst.
He has done nothing but make himself richer and everything else worst.
1
sounds like stakes are so high on both sides nothing will happen except for congress to request another six-month deferral from Trump.
1
This is unconscionable. How does cruelly upending the lives of 800,000 young people, who came here at an average age of six, who have committed no offense and who know no other country possibly move us forward? How does turning your back on the young people who came forward and trusted the government with DACA not fuel cynicism? How does terminating this program with no Congressional alternative on the horizon remotely qualify as responsible?
84
Maybe you could ask the same of the DACA parents who knowingly, illegally came into our country in the first place.
6
You personally can vouch for 800,000 young adults???? Not one bad apple in the mix? Wanna bet?
1
The Republican leadership in Congress won't be able to craft a bill harsh enough to please it's hardliners and at the same time attract Democrats and Republican moderates. Possible it may force one thru the House but only to see it die in the Senate.
Healthcare redux.
Healthcare redux.
11
How is it harsh to want the laws obeyed and enforced? This is our country, doesnt' belong to the illegal aliens
2
Thank you for a comprehensive and balanced article.
Both sides have gummed up the works, it's time to fix it, once and for all.
Both sides have gummed up the works, it's time to fix it, once and for all.
1
The Trump administration should come up with a proposal, and Trump should lobby Congress to get it passed. Many Republicans in Congress might want to say: "Well, I wasn't really totally behind this bill, but I voted for it to support the President."
This is how politics works, and how things get done in Washington.
This is how politics works, and how things get done in Washington.
3
Great explanation of the process by Alcindor and Stolberg. Rather than be pessimistic about it, we could just view this as the way congress is approaching this problem. Either side could get upset about congress's not doing the "obvious" thing quickly, which either side believes is obvious, but is actually a debate on how to proceed. Extremists on either side of the aisle don't have the patience for rational debate.
An interesting aside that comes out of this article is that criticisms of Barack Obama's executive order are poorly argued. The fact that this bill had passed both in the House and in the Senate gave President Obama a documented rationale for him to issue his DACA executive order. DACA had strong justification. In fact, it's transparent because of all of the congressional work that they did on it.
No, the real problem is the elephant that is *not* in the room: Trump is no help. But Trump is protecting his brand with his followers. This way, his glassy-eyed followers will still believe that Trump is great when congress fails once again at this legislation.
What Trump people don't understand is that Trump is no leader. But they just love his brand. This is not TV.
An interesting aside that comes out of this article is that criticisms of Barack Obama's executive order are poorly argued. The fact that this bill had passed both in the House and in the Senate gave President Obama a documented rationale for him to issue his DACA executive order. DACA had strong justification. In fact, it's transparent because of all of the congressional work that they did on it.
No, the real problem is the elephant that is *not* in the room: Trump is no help. But Trump is protecting his brand with his followers. This way, his glassy-eyed followers will still believe that Trump is great when congress fails once again at this legislation.
What Trump people don't understand is that Trump is no leader. But they just love his brand. This is not TV.
108
Congress had many chances to act and failed. They refused to give Obama any victory in this regard.
12
Obama went above and beyond the law with this and most likely Congress will not act on it, and if they do, being strongly Republican it will get shot down.
1