Or the Times could simply have looked at http://www.gonavy.jp/CVLocation.html to check Admiral Harris' statement and exposed this "fake news" a little earlier.
1
This isn't the first time USN and The Times didn't correctly describe vessel movement, positions, and Pacific Ocean geography. Whether the USN is intentionally issuing disinformation is a question I asked in 2005. See
"Corrections: For the Record [NY Times]
Published: June 23, 2005"
A USN nuclear submarine event was reported incorrectly as occurring in the South Pacific instead of the North Pacific.
I asked at the time but did not receive a reply to the question, did the Navy or the Times introduce the geographic terminology "South Pacific"?
Today's article contains more of the same from DOD: "'The ship is now moving north to the Western Pacific.'" (Here, an understanding of the context is essential. Roughly, speaking, in the Eastern Hemisphere, The Western Pacific extends northward from the South Pacific, southeast of Southeastern Australia, to the equator into the North Pacific, to eastern most Siberia. Communicating that "'more clearly at the time'" and thus precisely is not the kind of future position information to share outside secure channels.
Nonetheless, the persistence of inelegance of communication in the chain of command, and then to the public, particularly the Trump White House is unacceptable.
"Corrections: For the Record [NY Times]
Published: June 23, 2005"
A USN nuclear submarine event was reported incorrectly as occurring in the South Pacific instead of the North Pacific.
I asked at the time but did not receive a reply to the question, did the Navy or the Times introduce the geographic terminology "South Pacific"?
Today's article contains more of the same from DOD: "'The ship is now moving north to the Western Pacific.'" (Here, an understanding of the context is essential. Roughly, speaking, in the Eastern Hemisphere, The Western Pacific extends northward from the South Pacific, southeast of Southeastern Australia, to the equator into the North Pacific, to eastern most Siberia. Communicating that "'more clearly at the time'" and thus precisely is not the kind of future position information to share outside secure channels.
Nonetheless, the persistence of inelegance of communication in the chain of command, and then to the public, particularly the Trump White House is unacceptable.
Can't fault the navy for mistaking Java for Jeju island south of Korea.
Haven't you heard of "climate change"?
It has the effect of changing the coastlines and old maps become unreliable.
Haven't you heard of "climate change"?
It has the effect of changing the coastlines and old maps become unreliable.
2
One starts to wonder, with the growing incompetence of the Trump administration, how many of the officers and enlisted men and women of our military forces, are starting to question the ability of their senior leaders to provide competent and professional leadership? Are these men and women going to continue to join the military or to remain in their positions. Much is asked of our countries armed forces, and they deserve capable and coherent leadership.
This ongoing fiasco, brought about by Trump's lack of anything resembling a coherent plan and understanding of the situation is disturbing, to say the least. Add to that the disjointed, ridiculous and questionable performances of Mattis and McMaster, and one begins to seriously worry where this country is headed. The country and its citizens deserve so much more than what they are getting from the incompetence emanating from the White House and the Pentagon on a daily basis.
This ongoing fiasco, brought about by Trump's lack of anything resembling a coherent plan and understanding of the situation is disturbing, to say the least. Add to that the disjointed, ridiculous and questionable performances of Mattis and McMaster, and one begins to seriously worry where this country is headed. The country and its citizens deserve so much more than what they are getting from the incompetence emanating from the White House and the Pentagon on a daily basis.
1
A friend of mine owns a food stall in Singapore, and she confirms that the U.S.S. Carl Vinson is no longer in port.
I have an email pen pal in Jakarta, and he says that he's pretty sure that a huge boat passed by offshore a few days ago, but then again, it might have been a bank of thunder clouds.
Please pass this information along to President Trump, Sean Spicer and so forth. Every little bit of intelligence helps. I look forward to a Tweet.
I have an email pen pal in Jakarta, and he says that he's pretty sure that a huge boat passed by offshore a few days ago, but then again, it might have been a bank of thunder clouds.
Please pass this information along to President Trump, Sean Spicer and so forth. Every little bit of intelligence helps. I look forward to a Tweet.
9
These keystone cops are too busy finding ways to enrich themselves before they're caught and tossed out that they can't be bothered to know where our naval task groups are. Armada, he shouldn't be allowed to talk about grown-up things.
1
I know to bridge and reconcile wide cultural canyons is a helluva difficult job. Most of the Korean expats who live in Japan are rooting for North Korea, still, after all these years. But I wonder if it has at all been tried. To jump on the chance that North Korea offered us with King Jong Un's study in Switzerland by sending a few brilliant young seductresses with a mission to enchant him forever for more enlightened values? If not, this signifies in a much stronger way we send our sails in the wrong direction than the public misstatement of the immediate course of the Carl "Lost" Vinson. Diplomacy and well-financed subtle and intelligent "reverse Russia Today" propaganda for more enlightened Western and democratic, open-society perspectives (not the Voice of Bigot America style that permeates the whole military-industrial-Big Oil-Goldman complex efforts to rule trade and the waves to the relentless benefit of the 0.01%) in many, many languages would have offered a so much more fruitful path than the Fifth Avenue demonstrative gunman madness one we keep destroyer cruising like forever, stubbornly ignoring Bob Dylan.
We lose our direction when 6 trillion in military expenses go unaccounted for and lost.
We lose our direction when all we look at in building our ships is sheer deterrence and destroyer and mass transport speed and force, while the oceans die from willfully spilled crude, plastic waste that could have been biodegradable and other stupefying short-sightedness.
We lose our direction when 6 trillion in military expenses go unaccounted for and lost.
We lose our direction when all we look at in building our ships is sheer deterrence and destroyer and mass transport speed and force, while the oceans die from willfully spilled crude, plastic waste that could have been biodegradable and other stupefying short-sightedness.
4
You elected a known liar.
Did you ecoect him to suddenly become honest?
Did you ecoect him to suddenly become honest?
1
Regardless of whether there were misstatements or intentionally misleading statements about where the Carl Vinson was headed, this debacle should frighten everyone everywhere. It reveals the incomprehensible level of ineptitude and arrogance of the Trump White House. Incomprehensible!
2
Does anyone imagine that the Chinese didn't know where it was 24/7? Of course they did! Does anyone imagine that senior administration officials thought the Chinese wouldn't know? Of course they didn't. Think about that and the signaling implications.
An "intelligence" failure by a caricature, business insider staffed, "Trumpean American Government" whose only purpose seems to be the design of a 4 year Ponzi scheme to feed corporations at the public trought........paid for by the loss of health care,environmental destruction,and taxes of the "make America great electorate".........who voted for the Trumpean populist " casino and tower" economic model and "bomb the hell out of them" conserative military policy.
One more lie over one more incompetence. Ask me if I care. It's a U.S. problem. They 'democratically' elected Trump. Suffer the consequences!
1
Ineptitude at the top breeds ineptitude downstream. Even formerly capable people will be affected, indirectly if not directly.
The bad thing is, a nuclear war started because of ineptitude instead of bellicosity is still one nuclear war too many.
The bad thing is, a nuclear war started because of ineptitude instead of bellicosity is still one nuclear war too many.
Right out of the republican playbook: don't take any responsibility for one's actions, and shift the blame. Qualities sure to make American great again.
1
How much more evidence does Congress need to initiate impeachment procedures on the grounds that Trump is a clear and present danger to the welfare of the US in particular and the world at large in general?
What will it take? Is there room for an escalation of incompetence to get our representatives to act? I think that we are about as close to the ceiling as we can get.
What will it take? Is there room for an escalation of incompetence to get our representatives to act? I think that we are about as close to the ceiling as we can get.
2
Hello. Who holds the majority in the House? They are republicans that care more for their party far more than they do their country. Do yo really think that they are going to take Trump to task?
they will as soon as he becomes a huge liability
Let me see if I have this correct. The Commander-In-Chief of our military didn't have the slightest idea where on the planet was our Naval Strike Force consisting of a 1,092 foot long, 101,300 long ton nuclear-powered aircraft carrier and three warships? This on top of his botched raid in Yemen and eating cake while deploying 59 Tomahawk missiles at a sovereign country without consulting congress. God help us if the United States ever needs to defend itself while Donald J. Trump is pretending to be our Commander-In-Chief.
2
Great. Now we all need to wonder if that piece of chocolate cake actually was "the most beautiful piece of chocolate cake" we've ever seen.
When will Congress face the fact that Trump is an ignorant, thoughtless man who has no business making decisions about war, taxes, healthcare or anything else that affects the security and well-being of our nation?
We are in grave danger with him in the White House. When will our elected representatives begin to act in our interests and remove him due to the obvious national security threat he and his family present to this country?
Trump is a con man. That is all he ever was or ever will be. WAKE UP!
We are in grave danger with him in the White House. When will our elected representatives begin to act in our interests and remove him due to the obvious national security threat he and his family present to this country?
Trump is a con man. That is all he ever was or ever will be. WAKE UP!
Why aren't the top Democrats SCREAMING about this? If this isn't a 25th Amendment "unfit for office" impeachment event, what is?
1
For all of those that claim that President Trump is buddy buddy with Vladi, this is proof in a new plan hatched by the CIA like the exploding cigars to kill Fidel during the JFK time. The plan was that Putin will laugh so hard in his new command center watching the carrier group saling to Australia when Donald made his statement about sending a "Big... really big armada to Korea" that he would fall of his chair and hit his head and die. So you see they are not friends.
How can you tell when Trump is lying: His ships move.
From the NY Times story "South Koreans Feeling Cheated After U.S. Carrier Miscue"
"On Wednesday, after it was revealed that the carrier strike group was actually thousands of miles away and had been heading in the opposite direction, toward the Indian Ocean, South Koreans felt bewildered, cheated and manipulated by the United States, their country’s most important ally."
Welcome to our world, South Korea! We feel the same way as you do.
"On Wednesday, after it was revealed that the carrier strike group was actually thousands of miles away and had been heading in the opposite direction, toward the Indian Ocean, South Koreans felt bewildered, cheated and manipulated by the United States, their country’s most important ally."
Welcome to our world, South Korea! We feel the same way as you do.
1
Are Abbot and Costello in the house? Sounds like a "Who's on first" scenario between the Navy, the Pentagon, the President.....
This is like watching a skit on Saturday Night Live! It would all be really funny if the problems were not so serious and the stakes were not so high. Somebody at the White House needs to buy a roll of duct tape and use it to silence Spicer as well as the "Incompetent in Chief" before we end up starting World War III.
War with N Korea? What could possibly go wrong?
1
Australia needs to be on alert for when he orders the bombing of North Korea.
1
It is not that the USS Carl Vinson was heading for Australia
It is just that it took an Alternative Way
Trump dixit
It is just that it took an Alternative Way
Trump dixit
5
Another lie by the trump administration.
2
Not only can't the Gang shoot straight they're directionally challenged too!
5
Another lie from the trump administration.
3
The gang thst couldn't shoot straight ;(
2
In response to steve p in Korea:
Thank you. I completely agree with your assessment that most of us Americans don't understand the "hair trigger" environment there - nerves understandably on edge - especially along the DMZ, with an "accident" - contrived or otherwise, always present.
And with all the talk centering around "nukes", we also have little comprehension of the DPRK's conventional war capabilities. Seoul itself is within easy range of N. Korea's tactical missiles and advanced artillery massed along the DMZ in hardened sites.
Furthermore, no aircraft carrier Captain (or Admiral) in his right mind would leave his ship within range of N. Korea's land based attack aircraft, currently at least 450 not counting fighter support... more than enough to overwhelm the USS Carl Vinson's fighter CAP and supporting missile destroyers and Aegis cruiser.
"Sabre rattling" works only when the threat is credible, and Trump's "armada" isn't. The ROK's alarm is fully justified, and the people of the U.S. need to wake up to the reality of conventional warfare on the Korean peninsula.
Thank you. I completely agree with your assessment that most of us Americans don't understand the "hair trigger" environment there - nerves understandably on edge - especially along the DMZ, with an "accident" - contrived or otherwise, always present.
And with all the talk centering around "nukes", we also have little comprehension of the DPRK's conventional war capabilities. Seoul itself is within easy range of N. Korea's tactical missiles and advanced artillery massed along the DMZ in hardened sites.
Furthermore, no aircraft carrier Captain (or Admiral) in his right mind would leave his ship within range of N. Korea's land based attack aircraft, currently at least 450 not counting fighter support... more than enough to overwhelm the USS Carl Vinson's fighter CAP and supporting missile destroyers and Aegis cruiser.
"Sabre rattling" works only when the threat is credible, and Trump's "armada" isn't. The ROK's alarm is fully justified, and the people of the U.S. need to wake up to the reality of conventional warfare on the Korean peninsula.
4
Very reckless and dangerous actions by the Trump administration.
With tensions between North Korea and the US this high and possible use of nuclear weapons a reality, to stoke a false narrative is extremely troubling and impulsive.
Doing stupid things could lead to a full-out war. And let's be honest: Trump and his administration is not known for smart, deep analytical thinking and restraint. President Twitter Boy could start a war where hundreds of thousands die just with a dumb tweet.
With tensions between North Korea and the US this high and possible use of nuclear weapons a reality, to stoke a false narrative is extremely troubling and impulsive.
Doing stupid things could lead to a full-out war. And let's be honest: Trump and his administration is not known for smart, deep analytical thinking and restraint. President Twitter Boy could start a war where hundreds of thousands die just with a dumb tweet.
According to Korea sources;
North Korea has manufactured a bunch of cargo ships the use FREE ENERGY technology. They do not require gasoline/diesel. These NK ships are self-powered using magnetics!
This revolutionary free energy tech is self-driven, and can sail around teh world numerous times without docking for fuel.
http://www.tongilnews.com/news/articleView.html?idxno=120494
Sanctions helped them develop without OIL
when America still uses steam powered, diesel powered 15th century ships buying from houston for three hundred years and counting!
Amazing to never hear about this revolutionary development for the world.
North Korea has manufactured a bunch of cargo ships the use FREE ENERGY technology. They do not require gasoline/diesel. These NK ships are self-powered using magnetics!
This revolutionary free energy tech is self-driven, and can sail around teh world numerous times without docking for fuel.
http://www.tongilnews.com/news/articleView.html?idxno=120494
Sanctions helped them develop without OIL
when America still uses steam powered, diesel powered 15th century ships buying from houston for three hundred years and counting!
Amazing to never hear about this revolutionary development for the world.
Does it never end with these incompetents?
4
Gives new meaning to that often repeated presidential question, "Where are the carriers?"
Turns out the much-vaunted unpredictability is just the product of incompetence.
7
You people really think that Trump is clueless about where the ship actually is? You really think this was a mistake by our government? What do you not understand about the word unpredictable?
Do YOU not understand the meaning of unpredictable? Trump, himself, does not know what he is going to do next. None of his advisors know. The military does not know what he is going to order next. Unpredictable is not a positive attribute for the POTUS. Trump's unpredictability is a severe danger to the entire free world.
1
North Korea has unveiled footage of a simulated missile attack on the United States at the latest performance to mark the birthday of late state founder Kim Il-sung, Pyongyang's media reported Wednesday.
Footage of what appeared to be a new intermediate-range ballistic missile being fired and the missile crossing the Pacific and hitting an unidentified city of the U.S. was shown on a giant screen at the performance hall, according to the state-run TV station.
After the simulated attack, footage of burning the Stars and Stripes was shown, overlapped with an image of a cemetery.
Footage of what appeared to be a new intermediate-range ballistic missile being fired and the missile crossing the Pacific and hitting an unidentified city of the U.S. was shown on a giant screen at the performance hall, according to the state-run TV station.
After the simulated attack, footage of burning the Stars and Stripes was shown, overlapped with an image of a cemetery.
If Trump did not know where his carrier was he should have emailed the Russians. They did.
10
Ok We are at a point where a Major war can break out with North Korea. Did the left hand not know what the right hand was doing in the Administration? Was it all just a tatic they all were aware of? We may Never know but it sure does not give people a warm feeling as the go to bed at night. This is not a game of Chicken it's the real deal.
4
Sounds like Bannon's naval experience has proved useful after all.
5
Either Bannon's or Barron's.
3
who suggests that the commander in chief or the dept of defense or the navy or army or air force needs to publicly announce their plans? Does the public have a right to know where we intend to deploy our military assets -- before they are deployed?
1
Thank you NYT for being on "our side."
They were the ones who chose to make the announcement
5
He needs to give accurate information or say nothing.
Have you wondered what Trump's personal laziness, his disdain of diplomacy and his reliance on the military might lead to? This and far worse. The military focuses on the deployment of force. Diplomats focus on predicting perceptions of friends and foes. The military works on how best to confront an enemy. Diplomats work on how to read minds and anticipate reactions. Who do you want driving your foreign policy?
4
Pity Mike Pence. His boss' first National Security Adviser lies to him. Now he's played for a chump while on a mission to reassure our East Asian allies about our military commitment to defend them. He must feel like it's somebody else's turn.
3
We have gone from a President who controlled everything to a Preident who can't even control his mouth. Donald, you are making us look bad.
5
Its time for Americans to grow up and remind itself that their way of life is not the only way of life on the planet- others are there for thousands of years before you and you think but starving them you would succeed- Never learnt a lesson at vietnam where millions lost their lives but you never won the war or changed their minds.
Trump Administration
The executive branch has grown too stupidly arrogant, the judicial branch too arrogantly strong, the legislative branch too stupid and the legal branch too parasitic.
History - The hypocrisy of American democracy is unfolding- same old farts like old vine in new bottles. American way of life being enforced onto the east where people have grown up on philosophy of thought than western gods and faith the emotional thing.
Trump Administration
The executive branch has grown too stupidly arrogant, the judicial branch too arrogantly strong, the legislative branch too stupid and the legal branch too parasitic.
History - The hypocrisy of American democracy is unfolding- same old farts like old vine in new bottles. American way of life being enforced onto the east where people have grown up on philosophy of thought than western gods and faith the emotional thing.
2023 comments! (2024 now). With all your brain power, how could something this silly happen?
Do you mean to tell me that there was SOMEONE in our government (ie, the Pentagon) who actually KNEW where that carrier group was going? Amazing! The military is still as screwed up as it was when I spent 20 years there........
2
For those who didn't get the Pogo clue- "we have met the enemy and it is us" was a famous line from that comic many years ago.
1
How does reporting this, especially as a major story, help any of us in the US, or our allies? Sure - truthiness is always welcome - but the NYTimes seems intent on bashing our president at any cost - including weakening the perception of US power in the region in the name of news. We are in the neighborhood, we are projecting a strong image required by current international politics. Sure - perhaps current direction of the armada is away from Korea - for now - Why is that a 'problem' the Times needs to report? Perhaps NYT defensiveness regarding all the fake news, perhaps loyalty to socialist/communist regimes around the world. My immediate reaction? Treasonous disloyal news from an American newspaper. I'm very disappointed.
Even now in the period of news-reports-at-any-cost - there are times when keeping a lid on details is important to national security. Thanks NY times for making us a little bit less safe.
Even now in the period of news-reports-at-any-cost - there are times when keeping a lid on details is important to national security. Thanks NY times for making us a little bit less safe.
1
"the NYTimes seems intent on bashing our president at any cost"
All they have to do is report the straight facts and it inevitably sounds like bashing, or even satire, but it's the sad and scary truth. America's greatest security risk sits in the Oval Office.
All they have to do is report the straight facts and it inevitably sounds like bashing, or even satire, but it's the sad and scary truth. America's greatest security risk sits in the Oval Office.
Yes, you wonder which team the NYT is on.
1
It was Trump who announced the fake news. He publicly stated that he had a powerful armada closing in on North Korea. Now, thanks to Trump, the US navy doesn't seem to know where its ships are. Trump, with his own fake news has made America look foolish. You cannot blame the NY Times for publishing what Trump said.
1
Miscues like these I can live with.
Miscues like The Affordable Care Act that anybody with half a brain, and a bit of common sense could see would make health care more UNAFFORDABLE for everybody? No excuses.
That "the armada" was in the neighborhood, and would ultimately make its way to the waters off North Korea is enough for me.
Don't be so sure that had the "fat kid's" latest nuclear test not fizzled out as it did, that those "joint exercises in the Indian Ocean with Australia" wouldn't have been scrapped post-haste.
Miscues like The Affordable Care Act that anybody with half a brain, and a bit of common sense could see would make health care more UNAFFORDABLE for everybody? No excuses.
That "the armada" was in the neighborhood, and would ultimately make its way to the waters off North Korea is enough for me.
Don't be so sure that had the "fat kid's" latest nuclear test not fizzled out as it did, that those "joint exercises in the Indian Ocean with Australia" wouldn't have been scrapped post-haste.
1
I am not worried, it does take some time to turn those big ships around, even if the captain is in the loop.
Did you look at the map that accompanied the story? The "armada" was no where near what you call the "neighborhood". And it was not a "nuclear test"
that fizzled; it was a rocket launch. Try to get your facts straight. BTW, the ACA has reduced health care costs for millions.
that fizzled; it was a rocket launch. Try to get your facts straight. BTW, the ACA has reduced health care costs for millions.
1
Everyone is assuming that the administration made mistakes in their comments. What if all this is part of the alternate facts strategy.
2
What a great tragedy has befallen on America under the rudderless stewardship of Trump!
A nation built brick by brick by some of the great statesmen is now staring at the unfathomable abyss.
"The story of the wayward carrier might never have come to light had the Navy not posted a photo online Monday of the Carl Vinson sailing south through the Sunda Strait?" What a joke! Do you want people to believe that a Carrier Strike Group consisting of Carrier Air Wing , Destroyer Squadron and a guided missile covering a vast area, can be hidden from the plain sight that too in one of the densely travelled sea lanes!
Every other littoral nation would have kept a tag on the plainly visible fleet movements.
It's loud and clear that entire humanity is facing grave existential threat from the drunken monkey stewardship of Trump with a finger on the buttons of thermo nuclear warheads.
What is preventing the impeachment of Trump whose mental deficiency is unbelievably low and visibly demonstrated time and again!
We the people of world await with trembling heart.
A nation built brick by brick by some of the great statesmen is now staring at the unfathomable abyss.
"The story of the wayward carrier might never have come to light had the Navy not posted a photo online Monday of the Carl Vinson sailing south through the Sunda Strait?" What a joke! Do you want people to believe that a Carrier Strike Group consisting of Carrier Air Wing , Destroyer Squadron and a guided missile covering a vast area, can be hidden from the plain sight that too in one of the densely travelled sea lanes!
Every other littoral nation would have kept a tag on the plainly visible fleet movements.
It's loud and clear that entire humanity is facing grave existential threat from the drunken monkey stewardship of Trump with a finger on the buttons of thermo nuclear warheads.
What is preventing the impeachment of Trump whose mental deficiency is unbelievably low and visibly demonstrated time and again!
We the people of world await with trembling heart.
5
This gets my vote for weirdest article of week. Hard to choose.
1
There is no greater danger in the military than being ordered into harms way by an incompetent and unreliable superior. Arrogance and ignorance kills just as sure as a well aimed missile or bullet.
6
How to express it? The mouth that roared(Trump), or The gang that couldn't shoot straight(White House). Trump's propensity to bloviate and misdirect our attention is troubling and will eventually lead our nation down a path harmful to our interests. His eagerness to place our military in harm's way, reflects an alarming mindset.
6
This President likes to exaggerate. It may have been a bit of bluster--especially since it looks like that is all he is going to do. Show of force where its easy and bluster in the face of a harder nut to crack.
Now that the so-called president has told Maria Bartiromo that he bombed Iraq [sic] betwen bites of chocolate cake and falsely claimed the USS Carl Vinson was bound for North Korea, can we all finally agree that he is so incompetent and dishonest that he poses a clear existential threat to the United States of America and must be impeached and removed as soon as the laws allow? I'm not willing to wait until a major U.S. city is reduced to radioactive ashes, even if the GOP is.
8
Secretary of Defense James Mattis sent mixed signals about the "armada's" mission, stressing the need for the Navy to operate freely in the Pacific, but he added, “There’s not a specific demand signal or specific reason why we’re sending her up there.” This is the fundamental flaw of all Trump policy: there is no policy, only disjointed fragmented narcissistic Tweets.
2
It just gets crazier and crazier with each passing, petrifying day. The only thing that would have completed the idiocy of the caper would have been if the Carl Vinson had been the Caine and Donald Trump himself had been at the helm. What's next? Everyone in the United States get ready to surrender your keys?
Although "armada" is perhaps technically correct, anyone with a sense of history wouldn't have called this fleet an "armada", with its resonance to the pivotal events of 1588; that's when the Spanish Armada sailed north to invade England and overthrow Queen Elizabeth I, but was outmaneuvered and destroyed by Sir Francis Drake's English fleet, with assistance from the Dutch and the weather. See: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spanish_Armada
That's the first association of most English-speakers for "armada". The Reuters headline-writer knew this, and apostrophized it.
But since there's little evidence that Trump has ever actually read a book -- although he's paid others to ghost-write a couple under his name -- this shouldn't surprise us.
That's the first association of most English-speakers for "armada". The Reuters headline-writer knew this, and apostrophized it.
But since there's little evidence that Trump has ever actually read a book -- although he's paid others to ghost-write a couple under his name -- this shouldn't surprise us.
6
It is this type of incompetence that puts our national security at risk, not the threat from other nations.
It's has been 72 years since we had a world conflict, very few people have any real idea what WAR is about and considering the advances in technology it would be devastating. And this time, with out a doubt, on our shores.
As a country, we felt hurt after losing a couple of buildings, How do you think we will fell after our ill thought out brinksmanship triggers the vaporization of New York, Los Angeles, Dallas and Chicago.
Out president thinks he is playing some type of game, and has no real idea how to corenate a massive organization like the US government.
It's has been 72 years since we had a world conflict, very few people have any real idea what WAR is about and considering the advances in technology it would be devastating. And this time, with out a doubt, on our shores.
As a country, we felt hurt after losing a couple of buildings, How do you think we will fell after our ill thought out brinksmanship triggers the vaporization of New York, Los Angeles, Dallas and Chicago.
Out president thinks he is playing some type of game, and has no real idea how to corenate a massive organization like the US government.
4
One more "cheap shot" to discredit or ridicule President Trump by the Washington stablishment, mass media and others interested in invalidating his presidency. Mr. President stick to your original plan AMERICA FIRST and give the country back to the people, do not allow them to manipulate you.
2
Really? It was Trump who published this stupid fake news about his non- existent armada closing in on North Korea. Trump is the one making America look stupid.
1
Trump is systematically training the world to ignore everything he says because, when the going gets tough, the liars get lying.
3
Trump's blustering, bumbling attempts at threatening North Korea seem totally unaware of potential consequences. His lack of historical awareness becomes laughable. We're sending "an armada," he brags, seemingly totally unaware of the fate of the Armada--a "complete disaster" to use Trumpish phrasing. We can wonder if some North Koreans are smiling and we know many South Koreans are disturbed by Trump's ignorance. Unfortunately, the American Ship of State is following an unpredictable course.
20
this is one of those "carry on" british comedies from the '50's and '60's, right? s.n.l. couldn't make this up.
the bad news? the so-called "adults" in the administration are almost as bad as trump, himself. if trump is a third-grader, the others, maybe, are in middle school.
the bad news? the so-called "adults" in the administration are almost as bad as trump, himself. if trump is a third-grader, the others, maybe, are in middle school.
2
Stories like this one are the result of unfilled second and third level positions essential to administration communications as well as a thoughtful decision-making style when lives are at risk. Trump was clearly unqualified to be Commander in Chief due his abnormal decision-making style. Those he has appointed are apparently good at giving orders but unfamiliar with the communication needed within large multi-function organizations which must produce results quickly in a coordinated manner
This whole incident is one more reason that makes me wonder why so many men and women in military service--all volunteers--supported Trump over a more qualified alternative just as they supported Bush II who sent them to Iraq without proper body armor and without a plan to leave. When will voters look at the evidence over time that Republican office holders are not as good as Democratic office holders at either boosting the economy or implementing effective national security policies.
Perhaps it is the decision to allow Fox to provide its entertainment, opinion and some agenda-driven news to those serving on foreign military bases and their families. Talk about being trapped in a bubble of right-wing faux news! The men and women of the Carl Vinson "armada" will never hear about the purpose Trump had for them in the sea of Japan two weeks ago.
This whole incident is one more reason that makes me wonder why so many men and women in military service--all volunteers--supported Trump over a more qualified alternative just as they supported Bush II who sent them to Iraq without proper body armor and without a plan to leave. When will voters look at the evidence over time that Republican office holders are not as good as Democratic office holders at either boosting the economy or implementing effective national security policies.
Perhaps it is the decision to allow Fox to provide its entertainment, opinion and some agenda-driven news to those serving on foreign military bases and their families. Talk about being trapped in a bubble of right-wing faux news! The men and women of the Carl Vinson "armada" will never hear about the purpose Trump had for them in the sea of Japan two weeks ago.
13
Thank you for your insight. The flaws in the administrative hierarchy are disturbing. There are no checks and balances to avoid reaching the point of no return in these dangerously incompetent military misadventures. At what point is incompetence an impeachable offense? Hopefully, before Armageddon.
Democrats generally try to govern on principle. Republicans govern on opportunism. Trump wants to be the Mother-Off-All imperialists. The Republican Congress is abetting him at the world'e expense.
Democrats generally try to govern on principle. Republicans govern on opportunism. Trump wants to be the Mother-Off-All imperialists. The Republican Congress is abetting him at the world'e expense.
2
If this had happened on Obama or Hillary had had make this mistake, how long would it take the Repub's to impeach them?
9
Dear Pundits Who Were Swooning over Donald Trump's Presidentialness After the Pinprick Strikes Last Week,
Three questions:
1) How high is Trump registering today on your "Presidentialness Meter?"
2) Have you ever read _The Emperor Has No Clothes_?
3) Why don't you learn?
Three questions:
1) How high is Trump registering today on your "Presidentialness Meter?"
2) Have you ever read _The Emperor Has No Clothes_?
3) Why don't you learn?
7
Elect someone unfit to occupy the oval office and you can expect incompetence. These endless blunders put our nation and the world at risk.
7
And these are the idiots that are running this country. They lie to the world about where our naval forces are and we're supposed to trust them to run the country? Luckily these pictures were posted to show the world the truth. We have idiots in the white house who would rather lie to start a war then try to negotiate peace. Get this entire lying, cheating administration out of DC. New elections are needed.
5
The White House has a serious infestation of cockroaches. Call a pest control expert as soon as possible.
3
Can someone please explain this?
Rear Admiral Jim Kilby wrote Carl Vinson family members on 4/12 that the carrier was heading toward Korean waters.
https://www.facebook.com/pg/CSGONE/posts/
From Carrier Strike Group 1
April 12 at 5:47am ·
CSG-1 Families and Loved Ones,
“I want to start by thanking you for your continued support of our Sailors as we continue on our deployment and thank you for all you do while we are out to sea...As being a flexible force for our nation’s leaders, we answer the call when directed. The world has a vote of where we go and what we do...
We received direction to provide presence in the Waters off the Korean Peninsula as a demonstration of our flexibility, capability and dedication to our Indo-Asia-Pacific partners...
Rear Admiral Jim Kilby
Commander, Carrier Strike Group One #WESTPAC2017
The 5th and 6th fleet have facebook pages. I'm sure the other commands have them too. I just haven't looked for them yet.
Rear Admiral Jim Kilby wrote Carl Vinson family members on 4/12 that the carrier was heading toward Korean waters.
https://www.facebook.com/pg/CSGONE/posts/
From Carrier Strike Group 1
April 12 at 5:47am ·
CSG-1 Families and Loved Ones,
“I want to start by thanking you for your continued support of our Sailors as we continue on our deployment and thank you for all you do while we are out to sea...As being a flexible force for our nation’s leaders, we answer the call when directed. The world has a vote of where we go and what we do...
We received direction to provide presence in the Waters off the Korean Peninsula as a demonstration of our flexibility, capability and dedication to our Indo-Asia-Pacific partners...
Rear Admiral Jim Kilby
Commander, Carrier Strike Group One #WESTPAC2017
The 5th and 6th fleet have facebook pages. I'm sure the other commands have them too. I just haven't looked for them yet.
3
And while all of this carrier fiasco was taking place, we had Chicken Little Mike Pence strutting his stuff in South Korea, trying to convince anyone that would listen to him, that he knew what he was talking about. Pence is the barker for a second rate traveling circus.
10
Tenth-rate, rather.
1
he was wearing some sort of cool dude military jacket which made him look silly. sort of like bush in our recent Iraq fiasco
1
Times, thanks for blabbing for the benefit of our enemies. Typical!
Dude. You really think they didn't know? And btw. The navy did the blabbing. Try reading the article first.
4
One does not stoop so low as to actually read these articles, DUDE!
Garz,
Do you really think that the enemies as you called them and our allies did not know this before donald.
Do you really think that the enemies as you called them and our allies did not know this before donald.
in the light of this fiasco, trump should not attempt to send a manned mission to mars
it may well end up on mercury
well, they start w the same letter, dont they
7
It's Mercury, and don't copy, just try to be original. The Krell? Altair IV? Make up your own stuff.
Typical block-headed move by the president. If he had met with his military advisers instead of going to his Mar-a-Lago he would have known the truth. This grave mistake could have had dire consequences if Kim had reacted. By going to Florida he put his own interests ahead of the country's again. Plus it cost us another $3 million.
9
A new website is taking a dig at President Donald Trump’s frequent, costly trips to his Mar-a-Lago resort and suggesting how the money might be better spent.
The site IsTrumpAtMarALago.org, launched on Friday by the Center for American Progress Action Fund, tracks how many weekends Trump has spent there and what the estimated cost has been for taxpayers. As of Monday morning, he had gone to the resort seven out of his 13 weekends as president, costing taxpayers an estimated $25 million.
https://istrumpatmaralago.org/
The site IsTrumpAtMarALago.org, launched on Friday by the Center for American Progress Action Fund, tracks how many weekends Trump has spent there and what the estimated cost has been for taxpayers. As of Monday morning, he had gone to the resort seven out of his 13 weekends as president, costing taxpayers an estimated $25 million.
https://istrumpatmaralago.org/
5
The media believed the WMD lie put forth by the Bush administration and appears to be doing the same now, despite the Trump administration's use of falsehoods to achieve their political goals. Why would the press now believe the administration on Iran's nukes, bombs dropped on Afghanistan, China's intentions, or North Korea? This lie was caught belatedly, but how many others are reported as fact because they relate to national security or because questioning them may appear unpatriotic?
3
The Gang that couldn't shoot straight meets F Troop meets McHale's Navy. I am ever so confident that this Grifter White House can manage any crisis foreign or domestic. Well, that is, if they have any spare time between business deals, Mar-A-Lago trips, and campaign rallies. God help us
9
However the US spins this gigantic credibility fail, every international news outlet is painting this as yet one more - & possibly the most dangerous to date - evidence of the ignorance & distraction Trump displays on a daily basis. The whole world held its breath in real fear while Trump's world breathed fire where there was only smoke, where the enemy was enticed to react in such a way as to affect us all, & finally, once again, as the smoke drifts away, the emperor can be seen fully in all his naked 70 yr old, angry, impotent self.
When & how will reasonable Americans evict this usurper & con artist supreme from the office he stole with Russia's help?
When & how will reasonable Americans evict this usurper & con artist supreme from the office he stole with Russia's help?
6
Careful what you wish for; start reading up on Mike Pence and you might choose the devil you know.
1
The NYTimes, and other news outlets, published a story regarding military operations that were not true in a place and time that is fraught with risks and rising tensions, and the description of where the ships were (n't) added to the tensions. I suspect the Times was operating with the notion that they could trust these sources. Obviously, you cannot. I hope that the Times, and all other news organizations, will now learn that NO story from this administration can be trusted without more verification. All parts of this administration is at best, incompetent, and to use single sources, even from 'officials' at DOD, etc., MUST be vetted for veracity. Every, last, story.
11
Imagine if the press had vetted the WMD in Iraq story. (To be fair, some did, e.g. Knight-Ridder.)
1
There are many reasons this kind of play was prudent. There was a non-zero probability that the announcement alone would have produced beneficial results. On the one hand, N. Korea could have softened. On the other hand, it could (and may have) tipped it's hand. Finally, a delay of 2 weeks means, that despite casting Trump as impetuous hot head, in fact he was comfortable taking a middle term view of actions rather than demanding immediate action. Only the reporters who jumped the gun, made assumptions to support their anti-Trump narratives, and failed to ask the inciteful questions, or read into non-answers: "Q: When will the carrier arrive?" "A: No comment" Ok, so if you run with that and say it's an immediate deployment, then it's a case of the tail wagging the dog.
Surely, you jest.
after chest thumping in n/k waters, the vinson will stop in china to pick up a few million pair of ivanka brand shoes and other fashion accessories, and transport them to the usa for sale
just to show shes not using her dads connections to make her richer
3
What a great day to be liberal! The President loses an aircraft carrier with all hands on board. O'Reilly is on the canvas taking a ten count. A non-resident of the 6th Congressional District of Georgia wins a "victory for the ages" with a little help from his friends in Hollywood and $9 Mil from close friends.
The Left is finally showing signs of recovering from the Massacre of '16. It just goes to show that a grassroots movement fueled by tons of money from compassionate, empathetic billionaires (not dolts like the Kochs or Adelson) can restore America to its former glory.
With The Times and its top drawer jurinalists leading the way, it's only a matter of time. Vive la '60s!
The Left is finally showing signs of recovering from the Massacre of '16. It just goes to show that a grassroots movement fueled by tons of money from compassionate, empathetic billionaires (not dolts like the Kochs or Adelson) can restore America to its former glory.
With The Times and its top drawer jurinalists leading the way, it's only a matter of time. Vive la '60s!
1
The Key Stone Kops and the Three Stooges are all alive and well and residing in the White House. McMaster and Mattis are the new Abbot and Costello comedy duo, stumbling around in the dark. Mel Brooks would be hard pressed to come up with something funnier, except it isn't funny. It's gross incompetence in all its glory with the very real possibility for a very tragic outcome.
3
LIES by the administration - now the default and standard operating procedure.
3
All over the world intelligence and foreign policy teams are putting together timelines and assessments about how this played out and I expect it won't look good for Trump's foreign policy and military expertise.
Trump is rapidly destroying U.S. credibility with lies and bluster. He calls it unpredictability but it could also put us into game of chicken from which there is no return.
Trump is rapidly destroying U.S. credibility with lies and bluster. He calls it unpredictability but it could also put us into game of chicken from which there is no return.
4
Foreign policy and military expertise????
1
The most likely explanation was that Trump didn't know where North Korea is. Someone told him that a carrier group was in the Indian Ocean and that was enough for him to go on Fox News and make his false claim. Afterwords, every one had to support his statement.
Are we sure that the missiles we lobed into Syria actually landed there? Or that the mother of all bombs landed in Afghanistan and not in the Köbi desert?
When North is South and East is West in this White House, anything is possible.
Are we sure that the missiles we lobed into Syria actually landed there? Or that the mother of all bombs landed in Afghanistan and not in the Köbi desert?
When North is South and East is West in this White House, anything is possible.
6
What has me wondering: this deception and/or blunder was revealed when the US Navy released a picture of the Carl Vinson in a clearly identifiable location at a specified time. This wasn't foreign intelligence, a civilian posting on Facebook, or loose lips on one of the ships. So are such photos so common that it was released without thought? Or was someone in the Navy trying to deliberately embarrass Trump?
1
given his past record, its blunder
blunder is his metier, his leitmotif, his mo, his idiom
1
Embarrass trump or tell the truth about Trump lying?
I'm definitely not a Trump supporter, nor do I think embarrassing Trump is necessarily a bad thing.
But I am a computer programmer and the daughter of an Air Force auditor, so trying to understand *how* a system goes this badly awry is in my blood. Because at some point after we get rid of Trump someone is going to have to put the US government and military back together again. My greatest fear is that the chain of command is so fragmented or distrustful that "accidentally" releasing the information was the only way to say "Hey! No one changed our orders, we're still going south!"
Navy captains and even admirals aren't allowed to turn their squadron around just because they read the president's tweet. Obviously the orders didn't make it down the chain of command, and possibly requests for clarification didn't make it up the chain either.
But I am a computer programmer and the daughter of an Air Force auditor, so trying to understand *how* a system goes this badly awry is in my blood. Because at some point after we get rid of Trump someone is going to have to put the US government and military back together again. My greatest fear is that the chain of command is so fragmented or distrustful that "accidentally" releasing the information was the only way to say "Hey! No one changed our orders, we're still going south!"
Navy captains and even admirals aren't allowed to turn their squadron around just because they read the president's tweet. Obviously the orders didn't make it down the chain of command, and possibly requests for clarification didn't make it up the chain either.
13
Feckless Potus is leading a feckless nation and the US got what she deserves.
4
Ship of fools.
4
With such bungling the world could be incinerated. This blundering president ignorant of facts, reinforced a provocation stating an armada was proceeding towards North Korea. Rather than protect this country, as he swore when he took the oath of office, he endangers it by his reckless behavior. He should not be in that office.
5
But it's what the deplorables want, and there are at least 63,355,306 of them. And they wanted, and got, a unified government, so that the entire Congress is on board with an inept, narcissist president. All there is to do now is hope that enough of the deplorables will figure out that the coal mining industry is not now, and never was, coming back so that they vote the GOP out of every office they can, as soon as they can.
2
Any fool can see the boat is going the wrong way....
1
Do y'all realize that when you use phrases like "the President's muscular style" it is the ultimate validation for shooting missiles at people? Trump is basically going to get a printout of this article with that sentence highlighted by one of his lackeys and tape it up on his bathroom mirror while musing about other places to bomb.
The Fourth Estate needs to take more responsibility for its contribution to the decision-making process of the most venal of all modern presidents.
The Fourth Estate needs to take more responsibility for its contribution to the decision-making process of the most venal of all modern presidents.
3
I am the monarch of the sea,
The master of the Trump Navee;
I always answer to my country's call,
Though they never bother telling me my course at all . . .
(with apologies to Gilbert and Sullivan)
The master of the Trump Navee;
I always answer to my country's call,
Though they never bother telling me my course at all . . .
(with apologies to Gilbert and Sullivan)
Maybe Trump needs one of those thingamabobs to find your keys on our fleets. Makes me nervous that the "Adults In The Room"either went along with this or were ignorant of the facts. Maybe they all get their facts from the tube.
5
I wake up every morning with a knot in my stomach...and check the TV to see that WW3 hasn't started. So SCARY.
5
Does anyone on our government know what is going on anywhere?
5
nope
have a nice day
and sleep well
have a nice day
and sleep well
2
Like the Boy Who Cried Wolf, Trump et. al. will soon exhaust our and the world's credulity -- and it's not even 100 days into his four year term. While it is uncomfortable to become the butt of "Make America Great Again -- Lie Like Trump" jokes around the world, it is dangerous when the Trumpites continue to issue statements not based in fact while facing adversaries who can inflict serious harm on us and/or our allies. Uncertainty and unpredictability are not always positive things on which to base a superpower's foreign policy.
6
We are all in grave danger from this administration. "this is the way the world ends, not with a bang but a" c-o-n j-o-b (forgive me, Mr. Eliot). Trump and his generals are playing liars poker with nuclear arsenals, both with the Syria "spray of force" and now North Korea and the "prudence that wasn't." Not knowing what one is doing, and then ex-post-facto calling it "strategy" only works so long, the administration, like Trump's long-standing practice in the real estate "game," is going to have to keep escalating to "win at any cost," in lives. This reinforces the need for the FBI and Congressional probes to continue with all good speed.
9
Having ZERO confidence in the commander in chief, I do have confidence that the military leadership have their X's & O's in line. This is really disconcerting!
5
I hope you're right. However, I think they should be tested for dyslexia?
Mattis and McMaster didn't seem to have their hands around this particular blunder.
"Which way did they go? Which way did they go?"
A cartoon line that is clearly the MO of Trump and his administration.
We're all in serious trouble.
A cartoon line that is clearly the MO of Trump and his administration.
We're all in serious trouble.
7
"Pride goeth before a fall." Last week on cable news, retired Generals were maligning the Obama Administration for micromanaging the military and bragging how things will be so much better with Trump's hands off approach. The military men in the new administration and the military itself will be making those important decisions now. Well so much for "the buck stops here" idea of the American Presidancy. Me thinks the buck is lost somewhere in the Indian Ocean!
11
I'm impressed to read that our Navy has developed stealth capabilities for its vessels. If only now they can keep out of sight of cameras.
4
Don't blame Trump. He said "We're sending an armada." He didn't say which way.
7
and it isn't an armada- he's so dumb.
We've had satellite surveillance for decades. The number of planes on deck could doubtless be counted. The Russians and the Chinese certainly knew where the carrier group was and which way was it was heading. I bet North Korea knew too. Either our President didn't know or he lied about it: either would be appalling beyond belief.
Incidentally, NYT, how many under-secretarial appointments in the DOD are unfilled? In fact, Trump has not appointed a Secretary of the Navy. Sean Stackley is the Acting Sectreary.
Incidentally, NYT, how many under-secretarial appointments in the DOD are unfilled? In fact, Trump has not appointed a Secretary of the Navy. Sean Stackley is the Acting Sectreary.
8
This could have been a blufff. Had it not been reported by NYT's it could have been used to scare the N. K. But not sure the admin. Is clever enough.
1
I'm very sure he's not.
Mission accomplished! A Republican Commander and Chief has now lost track an entire Powerful Armada! SAD!!!!!
10
Nice article by the authors. However you might recall Trump made a very weird statement about the time he mentioned the armada was heading for the North Pacific right about the time he met with the Chinese president in Mar-a-Lago.. I recall he made mention of submarines heading that way also so don't mess with the US. Did he give away the cover with his loose mouth I wonder? So from that point on all he and Spicer (and others) mentioned was the visible armada (heading in the wrong direction I may add).
4
Do we have any credibility left? Crying, "Wolf, Wolf" at home and abroad, who's going to take us seriously? Trump is leading us on a treacherous path until the real wolf appears ( could be dictator Kim, Czar Putin or an apparently sleeping giant Xi ). God save America. We will have no real allies or friends except for our pet poodle, Great Britain. We Americans don't deserve this. We don't deserve to be mocked at. But with Trump that is exactly what's happening.
9
NI, We Americans DO deserve this. We ELECTED Donald Trump, a far right House, a far right, Senate, and 33 of 50 right wing governors. We have the government we deserve. Yes, God save 'merca, from ourselves.
Caught 'fair and square' at the Fake News game. Read about this two days ago on RT.
5
The only thing the NY Times did wrong was believe the garbage that falls out of Trump's ugly mouth. He's the freakin' liar, and supposed to be beholden to us. There is no reason to blame the NY Times for this. They are generally about 1000 times more credible than RT.
1
Trump lied to Americans and the world about an issue of national security. If citizens and legislators can't get the truth, how is the effect different from dictatorship?
8
its not
not at all
not at all
And what of all the people, including all of Congress and all military officers high and low, whose Oath requires them to "defend against all enemies, foreign and domestic"? Don't see much defending going on.
The NYT continues to make silly claims to undermine the Trump administration with a story regarding which way the USS Vinson was steaming. The Vinson, being an aircraft carrier projects power through its air wing. The air wing is capable of striking at long distances given aerial refueling capabilities.
It isn't the NYT it is Trump undermining the Trump administration with amateurish management.
The Carl Vinson was three thousand miles from Pyongyang. The range of an F18 is about two thousand miles. So you would have to refuel each airplane at least twice before they could do the round trip. Besides that, if Kim made a strike against Seoul, that F18 would get there three hours too late (not counting refueling). Seoul would be in rubble. Your claim is silly, Mei Mei. We could send you the Trump administration. We don't want them anymore.
2
AKA The Lost Armada. Or The Wayward Warships, The Forgotten Fleet.
5
Well, first of all, the Earth is round. So it doesn't matter which way the ships go, they will eventually get there. Also: If you report on things like that, you know, that endangers our national security. So, to the media: If people die, because of this, that's on you. Also: I was kidding about the Earth. There is no consensus among scientists regarding roundness. Just look out the window.
[Excerpt: Sean Spicer, overheard practicing in his office]
[Excerpt: Sean Spicer, overheard practicing in his office]
6
Inexcusable. We're not just dealing with ships and guns and bombs, but with real human lives. So this administration that never apologizes makes a mistake that costs lives, what happens then? How do you bluff or bluster or lie your way out of that? I suppose they'll find a way.
9
What happens when? This Administration has already made mistakes that cost innocent lives--see for example the story of the bombing in Yemen, many civilians and a Navy Seal died--and no apology. There will never be an apology from a narcissist; only cover-ups and blame. Always someone else's fault.
Stop the hand wringing. It was a political blunder but that's the extent of any
negative aftermath.
This was a timing issue and nobody but nobody provided any
ETA.
negative aftermath.
This was a timing issue and nobody but nobody provided any
ETA.
It looks like the Defense Department, along with Gen. McMasters, has caught the Trump bug, prevarication. Is there anyone in the current administration that the American public and the world at large can trust?
5
Lucy, suggest a name, any name, and I'll give you good, factual reasons not to trust him/her.
And when a torpedo hits one of the ships in the strike force, the US next move is???
3
" And when a torpedo hits one of the ships in the strike force, the US next move is???"
Trump will send out several threatening tweets to scare them away.
Trump will send out several threatening tweets to scare them away.
2
Sorry to say but this kind of thing has occurred in the military for generations. People are fallible. We'd have had fewer wars if it were not so. Any President is going to make the most of any positive narrative. Too bad more Times reporters haven't served their country enough to know this.
Annabelle, Sorry to say but "this kind of thing" has most certainly NOT occurred in the military for generations--at least, not ours. This wasn't a mistake: it was a series of terrible judgments and miscommunications among the military's senior officers and civilians and the Natl Security Administration. It is what has historically made the United States military the best in the world. That, and civilian leadership that takes immediate responsibility for everything that happens beneath him. We don't have that now.
This wasn't simply a mistake. It was a series of misjudgments. I hope journalists will now stop trying to reassure us that the military constitute the "adult" in the room while Rome burns. This is a perfect example of how a military institution bumbles: it's a top-down structure where questioning higher authority out in the open is problematic and possibly promotion-threatening.
38
I'm with you one hundred percent on this comment. Anyone who doesn't believe that the military doesn't have its fair share of incompetence, is ignorant of reality. History is littered with the corpses of soldiers who have died and have been maimed through the incompetence of military officers. My fear of the military hero worship which we are now involved in, is that we forget that hero-worship creates huge blind spots. In those blind spots are hidden the incompetence and ultimately our blind trust may lead to our downfall.
What in the bloody world can we trust from Spicer and crowd....Is there anyone in what feels like a loony bin to double check on huge stories with national and international security implications? Imagine, losing an entire 'armada'! Does this include the nuke subs Trump told us about? Probably leaking classified information. Its just nutz down there.
3
This is amateur hour and is completely unacceptable. Where are the professionals? where are the adults in the room? this is beyond scary to me, your average citizen of the U.S.
Where is Congress? They need to take action. Oh, I forgot. They are bought off and gutless.
Where is Congress? They need to take action. Oh, I forgot. They are bought off and gutless.
12
This doesn't seem like innocent mistakes. I don't think this Administration can be that bad at checking the facts. They are purposefully publicizing deliberate misinformation to get people fired up about a show of force. More lies and propaganda to stoke fears and send the message that we need to go to war (again). Many in our country are biting at this dangerous bait. And these folks are likely not reading the articles that bring forth the facts and expose the lies because, well... you know.... fake news.
6
Why do I have this scary feeling that a lot of my fellow Americans are not as concerned as I am about this...
9
Let me get this straight: North Korea's missile blew up almost on the launch pad; our carrier group sailed off in the wrong direction....we seem to be missing the third Stooge.
9
There's an article in le nouvel Observateur that posits our fumbler-in-chief is exhibiting early signs of Alzheimer's...Such could explain a great deal, including his wandering through the WH at night... He simply can't figure out where he is...
6
I would say that Trump has now lost credibility, but that ship sailed long ago.
6
Somewhere (hopefully) above, Jimmy Breslin is relaxing, comfortable in the knowledge that his estate will collect handsome fees from anyone's use of describing the Trump Administration as "The Gang That Couldn't Shoot Straight".
4
Trump is using his position to benefit his family, now and in the future. The rest to him is noise, to be delegated to others...and this includes matters of war and peace.
Every day is incremental, he is simply trying to get away with as much as possible before people wise-up and throw him out.
Every day is incremental, he is simply trying to get away with as much as possible before people wise-up and throw him out.
Why the qualifier in the headline? Nobody "suggested" anything.
DT said he was sending a ship to North Korea. You quote him as saying, "We're sending an armada." No suggestions.
DT said he was sending a ship to North Korea. You quote him as saying, "We're sending an armada." No suggestions.
Donald Trump - "We are sending an armada, very powerful".
Lie #9253. But his supporters don't take notice of all his lies his chaos, and cheating failure. Things they criticized Obama for, travel on public dollars for example, Trump is doing several times over. It's all identity politics with them.
Lie #9253. But his supporters don't take notice of all his lies his chaos, and cheating failure. Things they criticized Obama for, travel on public dollars for example, Trump is doing several times over. It's all identity politics with them.
5
How long is our troubled nation going to be plagued with this self dealing miscreant who blustered his way into the presidency despite losing the popular election by nearly 3 million votes?
trimp is undermining democracy while roiling the economy and trashing the international credibility of the United States. But the wealthy business class will support him as long as he guts protections for workers, consumers, and the environment? And middle class retirees will continue to applaud him as long as he demonizes immigrants and drops bunker busters on Muslims?
trimp is undermining democracy while roiling the economy and trashing the international credibility of the United States. But the wealthy business class will support him as long as he guts protections for workers, consumers, and the environment? And middle class retirees will continue to applaud him as long as he demonizes immigrants and drops bunker busters on Muslims?
5
Trump pulls everyone around him down to his level of incompetence.
8
Does anyone know if we have a Secretary of State, yet?
The Republican's need to stop the stupid talk about preemptive strikes, this is dangerous and stupid. We need to make it clear that we would not initiate anything, but if attacked we will respond with everything we have in our arsenal other than nuclear weapons.
This is a needless saber rattling of egos.
The Republican's need to stop the stupid talk about preemptive strikes, this is dangerous and stupid. We need to make it clear that we would not initiate anything, but if attacked we will respond with everything we have in our arsenal other than nuclear weapons.
This is a needless saber rattling of egos.
3
I thought he had all the best Generals? The big tent circus may have left town but it seems the County Fair took its place.
10
This is nothing short of incompetent at the highest national level.
7
Really??? So we are now telling lies about our defenses? Seem to me that rather than being unpredictable, we are being unreliable and a laughing stock. We look and are acting like fools. Perhaps we are fools for not putting an end to this ridiculous and lawbreaking administration sooner rather than later.
In the same vein of right-hand/left-hand knowledge, I understand that Mr. Trump when appearing on a weekend talk show initially referred to the missile episode as having taken place in Iraq until his questioner carefully asked him as to whether he might have meant Syria.
Dear President Trump,
When you attempt to Sabre rattle with a mad man with a Nuke, it would be helpful if you first packed your Sabre.
Signed,
The Human Race
When you attempt to Sabre rattle with a mad man with a Nuke, it would be helpful if you first packed your Sabre.
Signed,
The Human Race
It is a relief that the carrier found its way to safety.
1
Does it make sense to move a vital asset like a carrier group into range of North Korean projectiles? Are we planning another Gulf of Tonkin?
5
Amongst all of the comments there must be some that the Carl Vinson was actually heading in the wrong direction as strangely symbolic of the Trump administration heading in the wrong direction as well (nudge, nudge Donald Trump).
6
Trump needs to read the story of Chicken Little and remember what happens when boys lie too much. No one comes to help when it's really needed. One day we may all pay the price for Trump's incompetence and lies.
5
Well, North Korea embarrassed themselves with their failed missile test over the weekend, so I guess now it was our turn to look stupid.
If this is a "slow-moving Cuban Missile Crisis," it seems to be devolving into a competition of incompetence. God help us all.
If this is a "slow-moving Cuban Missile Crisis," it seems to be devolving into a competition of incompetence. God help us all.
4
I wouldn't want Sean Spicer's job if you offered me all the perks of living in a palace and an army of body of armed guards twenty four hours a day, but the poor man is woefully out of his league. If Ivanka is really trying to tidy things up in this administration, replacing Spicer is one place to start. Find someone for this important position who is not only tough enough to field reporters well informed questions, but someone who is equally as well informed as the press corps he or she will be facing. These press conferences are an embarrassment to the administration and to the nation. Much like his boss, Spicer has neither the intellect nor the temperament for this job, but there are plenty of people who do.
5
Yeah, but those people who do don't want to touch that position with a ten foot pole.
1
To me it seems like the real news is not that Trump/Spicer didn't know what was happening, but that McMaster and Mattis didn't. Those are the guys who really need to know!
8
Now where did I put that carrier group? It was here a minute ago. These things are so easy to misplace.
Chalk up another "win" for Larry, Curley and Moe. There's no end to their "skills". Now everyone repeat after me "Our Father, who art in heaven..."
To all those here wondering what the big deal is about this apparent "armada" deception, I ask whether the United States can afford to take any more hits to its credibility concerning global defense issues.
Trump, apparently, is a bluffer, which is fine -- IF you have the expertise and knowledge to pull it off. But with him, I'm afraid it could rapidly become a dangerous, high-stakes game where that bluff could easily be called.
Trump, apparently, is a bluffer, which is fine -- IF you have the expertise and knowledge to pull it off. But with him, I'm afraid it could rapidly become a dangerous, high-stakes game where that bluff could easily be called.
1
The main reason he can't pull off a bluff is his own, narcissistic mouth.
Who's on first?
3
Why don't we have a NY Times reporter in all strategy meetings, national intelligence meetings and all stay all night to see where Trump may roam in the WH. So we can tell the world and make ourselves self-important.
Why don't you just admit that the person you voted into office and his appointees are incompetent grifters?
1
The nation should be thankful that such a paper as the NY Times exists, Mr. Volpi, especially considering that Trump's pledge for a transparent government is as empty and shallow as his policies.
If you voted for this guy you got what you wanted, that's for sure: a person who knows nothing about how government works and could care less about the struggles of most Americans.
If you voted for this guy you got what you wanted, that's for sure: a person who knows nothing about how government works and could care less about the struggles of most Americans.
2
The gang that couldn't shoot straight loses track of the gun.
1
Is there a problem with not informing our enemies exactly where our forces are? Only for those who spend their days looking for reasons to criticize Trump.
1
Look at the least three months - there are nothing but reasons to criticize the incompetence and graft pouring out of this venal, vicious untruthful administration.
Forgotten how much unfounded made-up filth was slung at President Obama, have we? Well, you have what you want now, and it's a steaming mess. Enjoy.
Forgotten how much unfounded made-up filth was slung at President Obama, have we? Well, you have what you want now, and it's a steaming mess. Enjoy.
3
It's not difficult to find reasons to criticize this president. Just turn on the TV. You make this gaffe sound like it was brilliant military strategy. Hardly.
You seem to forget, Larry, that we are not at war. YET.
Nobody has to look for reasons -- he provides them himself.
Nobody has to look for reasons -- he provides them himself.
1
What if this crowd of ideologues and buffoons had been in charge during the Cuban Missile Crisis? Or World War II? Where would we be (would we even be?) today? For the first time since the Cold War, I am terrified of nuclear war.
5
And you should be. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Il-9j7BjLqc
This lie is dishonorable and disgraceful news. We all know, except the fools who feed on the lies of the president, that Trump exaggerates and lies to the point of a sick pathology that is uncurable. I never have, ever read lies as this as it concerns the security of the nation. How can McMasters, National Security Advisor to that scoundrel in the White House and our Defense Secretary, Mattis, who should know the whereabouts and be knowledgeable of all movement of our military be on the same page as this lying fool we refer to as a president? How could this happen? The people of this nation should be horrified that our military leaders, responsible for the security of the country would participate in this lie and distortion. The same Assad, this president didn't care about the deaths of the children, why would he inform Putin, who, in turn, informed Assad. Why drop the MOAB when regular bunker blaster would have done the same job? This lie is dishonorable on the part of McMaster and Mattis. They have disgraced themselves and put into question their honesty and honor. Are they protecting the nation or distorting for president. I DON'T TRUST THEM.
7
From how this unfolded, I doubt it was a calculated bluff to buy time. It was another case of mismanagement by the White House and, incredibly, Pentagon people and high-ranking military officials who should know better. This is no way to handle our military people, our weapons, and international conflict. This might be acceptable if the White House was not occupied by a serial liar with no fixed convictions and obsessed with his own image, but that's exactly what we have. So less than 100 days into this administration, and we're already playing Russian roulette with deadly force—ours and that of others. And with Trump casually referring to career military professionals as "my generals," it's only a matter of time before the chamber with the live bullet comes around. The Fingers-Crossed Presidency continues.
4
Now known as Wrong-Way Trump
3
Either Trump has not a clue about geography and was too insecure to ask, or he knew exactly where these ships were not. Either way, these are the tactics of a crazed dictator.
2
Oh great, two unpredictable children in the room and no adult supervision.
2
Incompetence at all levels. We are one disaster away from chaos.
2
Trump and his band of amateurs are better equipped to guide their rubber duckies in their bathtubs. It's time that Trump may want to consider that his word is now meaningless to us at home and the world. He may want to consider taking up eating cake and golfing permanently. This is getting way too scary.
Who is in charge? We need to hear from the generals on Trump team, they need to clear this up via the press, I think the American public and Allies deserve answers.
It is either or total incompetence from the top down.
Aren't we lucky?
Aren't we lucky?
You can't fix stupid, I guess, even with the entire might of the US military and intelligence apparatus at your fingertips. Look for more like this in the future. Why? Because you cannot fix stupid, and I am afraid that is exactly what the man less than half the country elected is.
3
The Mr. Magoo presidency of gross incompetence, lies and mismanagement continues. Time for Trump to take another golf trip down to West Palm beach.
2
Again, and Again, we have the "Liar in Chief" always trying to take credit for something that isn't true and then looks like a insecure Gas Bag when it comes out that in fact he was actually lying and trying to take credit for something he didn't do...........Donald Trump is looking more like a Bozo the Clown each day in office rather than any kind of leader......a real Buffoon.
6
The left hand doesn't know what the right is doing--is literally true for split brained patients.
1
The most logical follow up question would be "Does this ship really exist or is it just a photoshopped version of another carrier?" Do we really have any ships? Where are they? What is real? What is up, and what is down?
The media seems to have fallen down a Rabbit Hole into Wonderland. Why are we getting all of our facts from comedians and foreign countries?
The media seems to have fallen down a Rabbit Hole into Wonderland. Why are we getting all of our facts from comedians and foreign countries?
I never thought we'd ever see a more incompetent administration than Dubya's, but the Republicans found a way.
6
Turning the Carrier Taskforce around had very real logistical tasks including what was th have been its mission to begin with. There is no reason to make a big deal over this. The Taskforce is now sailing for the previously announced mission and the effect of this has the same meaning now as a week or so ago.
1
I think the Navy term for a carrier and accompaning ships is a "Task Force." Trump must have been thinking of the Spanish Armada, which sailed in the right direction, but crashed on rocks. Spain is yet to recover. This is not comforting, Donald.
6
DOD is woefully understaffed at the senior levels, which likely results in skewed flows of information, both vertically and laterally. Ditto for State Department. There are unpleasant consequences for having incompetent ideologues "deconstructing the administrative state."
3
After losing a aircraft carrier group for weeks we can only hope that sooner than later this administration loses the keys to the White House and can't get in or better yet forgets where they parked air force one with the incompetent in chief on board.
3
Yeah, so let's get the approval of NY Times readers while military assets are moved around. Gee, saying one thing and doing another has never happened in military history before.
Maybe the Navy was worried about Trump's description of the fleet as a"huge Armada." The Admirals in the Navy know what happened to the Spanish when they touted that word. The Navy is a little superstitious, so they kept sailing towards Australia.
I have always failed to see, why, in a supposed time of no war, we have to submit to the expense (and sometimes embarrassment) of sending naval ships to any place on the globe for no other reason than posturing.
Does our government actually believe that other countries totally forget our armed might unless we show up at their doorsteps?
Is it no wonder that our country is dead broke, and running on borrowed fumes from all this belligerence we throw at the rest of the world?
Does our government actually believe that other countries totally forget our armed might unless we show up at their doorsteps?
Is it no wonder that our country is dead broke, and running on borrowed fumes from all this belligerence we throw at the rest of the world?
3
Unsurprising. Those individuals tethered to the Donald Trump space ship are not cool nor like their predecessors guided by no-drama Obama. That the new Sec Dev, General Mattis was unaware that claims of force against N. Korea at this precarious time in that nation's careless agression is unacceptable. World War I started over something far less important.
Most Americans, including those opposed to Donald Trump expect competence, security and protection. Only a photo turned the claim that U.S. force was on display against N. Korea changed that narrative. Scary to consider only a glitch might save us from war rather than competent leadership.
Most Americans, including those opposed to Donald Trump expect competence, security and protection. Only a photo turned the claim that U.S. force was on display against N. Korea changed that narrative. Scary to consider only a glitch might save us from war rather than competent leadership.
It appears the White House does not know what the military is doing or when. President Trump does not keep up with such things and let's his military commanders make decisions he should be making.
This is a small instance of a broader problem, ie that the media, including the NYT, is too often a passive and uncritical spreader of whatever juicy official soundbite bestowed by someone supposedly in the know. The misleading interpretation of what the Vinson was doing was not harmless; it magnified the danger of war, which is acute enough as it is.
1
White House is a House for people with only white matter in their brain. The US administration is led by a clown and a bunch of zombies living in never in never never land. These morins will start a war because of their inability to communicate and constant lies.
Trump upgrades Teddy Roosevelt Diplomacy:
"Speak loudly and pretend you're carrying your big stick."
"Speak loudly and pretend you're carrying your big stick."
1
We've gotten used to perpetual amateur hour at the Doll House at 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue and whining, blaming and temper tantrums by the lyin' teenager who is, tragically, in charge. That the incompetence virus has spread to the Pentagon is truly frightening as is the reluctance of the Republican party to do its patriotic duty and impeach the adolescent in chief to protect us and the planet from his hormone driven need for attention.
3
One has to wonder what was going through the minds of the crew aboard the U.S.S. Carl Vinson and the other ships when President Trump made this statement.
1
Incredible. Jimmy Breslin wrote a novel years ago, from which they made a movie about the PItheW (Trump) and the group around him. The prescient title: "The Gang that couldn't shoot straight." Go figure.
You've got to ask: Why didn't the Aussies tell us? In fact, many countries must have known, and yet no one said "boo." That's weird. And, for the record, maybe Mattis really is "Maddog Mattis" -- his role in all this is, again, nothing but weird.
1
Sounds like the NYT is trying to explain why they reported "fake" news.
This is a sad series of events. Not even Lemony Snicket would be so creative to depict the unfortunate telling of lies and dangerous statements from the Trump administration. His "muscularity " is just as fake as his claim of fake news. He is a bluffer, with no knowledge and no organization. Sad, sad... A tiny situation lead to WWI. His bluffing may lead us to a similar corner.
"described a glitch-ridden sequence of events, from an ill-timed announcement "
Sums up what has happened to this nation since Comey's announcement about the Weiner tapes.
Now what if Korea had taken this seriously and launched a war?
NK intelligence was bright enough to know that Carrier Strike Group 5 (USS Ronald Reagan CVN and its cruisers and destroyers) was in port in Yokosuka Japan and that all of this was bluster. After Pearl Harbor the US doesn't start wars with ships docked in an area that can be hit. I hope.
Sums up what has happened to this nation since Comey's announcement about the Weiner tapes.
Now what if Korea had taken this seriously and launched a war?
NK intelligence was bright enough to know that Carrier Strike Group 5 (USS Ronald Reagan CVN and its cruisers and destroyers) was in port in Yokosuka Japan and that all of this was bluster. After Pearl Harbor the US doesn't start wars with ships docked in an area that can be hit. I hope.
As in everything he says and does, it's all a con job to con the fragile and willing sheep from his cult. This guy is in this for the money for himself and his family as is clear to anyone with half a brain. He's not interested in really being President, but in how much he can leverage it to more wealth for himself and family. We warned folks about the con man from NYC, but the mindless ones just were too easy for his scam. The fact that Pence is going all around the world while Trump plays golf should tell you what the real deal is. America, you have been had big time.
1
Can we rely on Trump's icompetence to keep us out of an otherwise avoidable war?
Probably not.
This is frightening.
Probably not.
This is frightening.
1
The best thing for this country is Trump and Pence quitting. its barely a few months and the lies, nonsense, back door activities, lack of transparency is over the top. If they don't quit lets throw them out! Impeach!
2
This is the Gang That Couldn't Shoot Straight. The Trumpster and his minions really don't know what they are doing. What an embarrassment. SAD, as he would say.
Once again, I don't whether to laugh with derision at a trump and his staggering ineptitude or shake with fear at the potential ramifications. I'm no bible thumper, but I guess what the saying about there being no atheists in the fox hole is true. I pray a lot these days.
A lot of people say don't worry, North Korea doesn't have an ICBM that can hit the west coast. That's true, but North Korea has missiles that if loaded onto a merchant ship that sails 20 miles offshore can easily reach the west coast, with very little warning. The best way to overthrow Kim is from inside the country. The U.S. should be figuring out a way to make that happen.
You mean that after all the vociferous brouhaha by the megalomaniac and his Mobile foreign policy pawn about sending a message to NK " the carrier was sailing in the opposite direction"?
No surprise here...again. The narcissist continues to show he is big mouth and no brains.
No surprise here...again. The narcissist continues to show he is big mouth and no brains.
1
I truly believe this administration's incompetence, arrogance, and antipathy to reason and accountability will get a lot -- and I mean a lot -- of people killed.
Fake intel ( remember WMD?)
Fake news
Fake president
Fake news
Fake president
1
Once more. Hocus pocus The NY Times is out of focus. Noticed no basis reference for your knowledge on the positioning of any US carrier. You nor anyone other than those who should...... know More childish spatter from the liberal element
Though I do like the notion of acknowledging someone's birthday with a "celebratory weapons test." Aunt Lucy's 60th is coming up. Wonder if it's time to bust out that ICBM I've been tinkering with.
oh no!!! Donny lost his toy boats!!! why do i see body bags in the not-too-distant future. why do some people think you have to play with the toy soldiers when you take over...
2
This White House produces lies like bees produce honey. I hope you all realize that honey is digestive material that comes out of the other end after food goes in the mouth. Quite apt, don't you think?
1
Once again Trump shows that he is not a leader. Trump doesn't know what he is doing. He man is an idiot. This is a very serious situation and a true commander in chief thinks strategy very carefully before talking. Trump puts his foot in his mouth so often, it's unbelievable. He is a detriment to the United States of America. He needs to be watched and restrained.
1
See, Trump was right.
They used a cheap navigation system Made in China and see what happened, they lost their way.
All those advertisements the free SatNav systems use to lure you to a different location just for shopping at a friendly place.
Had the US Navy used an American system like Google Maps, nothing of that sort would have ever happened.
So, listen to Trump, next time you take you aircraft carrier out for a spin, make sure you have an all American SatNav system on board.
Or you will end up in Oz instead of North Korea like those guys from the Carl Vinson.
So sad, such losers...
They used a cheap navigation system Made in China and see what happened, they lost their way.
All those advertisements the free SatNav systems use to lure you to a different location just for shopping at a friendly place.
Had the US Navy used an American system like Google Maps, nothing of that sort would have ever happened.
So, listen to Trump, next time you take you aircraft carrier out for a spin, make sure you have an all American SatNav system on board.
Or you will end up in Oz instead of North Korea like those guys from the Carl Vinson.
So sad, such losers...
China can surely see ships by satellite and probably told Kim Jong Un. By golly, that fancy-dan armada that POTUS said was sailing his way, was heading in the wrong direction. They probably had a big piece of chocolate cake (the most beautiful ever) to celebrate and laughed till they fell on the floor. The United States just looks idiotic to the rest of the world, not to mention its own people.
Don the con pulled another one on the American people. Hope y'all who voted for him enjoy it! Bon appetit!
Don the con pulled another one on the American people. Hope y'all who voted for him enjoy it! Bon appetit!
You have got to be kidding me.
What a sign of weakness for our nation to make such a huge mistake. Is it worse than bombing "Iran" - "You mean Syria?" "Yes, Syria," over "beautiful chocolate cake"? It's almost a tossup.
It's terrifying and deeply embarrassing. I have family in the military who voted for Trump because they disagreed with Obama's policies and style. I don't think they expected a downgrade into rudderlessness and utter incompetence.
What a sign of weakness for our nation to make such a huge mistake. Is it worse than bombing "Iran" - "You mean Syria?" "Yes, Syria," over "beautiful chocolate cake"? It's almost a tossup.
It's terrifying and deeply embarrassing. I have family in the military who voted for Trump because they disagreed with Obama's policies and style. I don't think they expected a downgrade into rudderlessness and utter incompetence.
1
Trump knows more about the chocolate cake served at his resort than about our aircraft carrier and its actual location. My fear grows more everyday with all of the incompetency of this administration and the republicans putting party over our country's welfare. It's so blatant that Trump and his family only care about enriching themselves at our nation's expense. Do your job Republicans ...get those tax returns now !
2
the explanation of how these misstatements and representations to the public took place is all gobbledygook. no one knows nothing! politicians at work here. i just hope the white house does not get us in a shooting war by using their mouth.
The military chain of command seems to have some broken links both top down and bottom up. The Commander in Chief, ready for battle with other people's children, says where is my army, where is my navy? How impressive; the North Koreans are probably laughing at the spectacle of U.S. incompetence.
46
Not his army, not his navy. It is really chilling to hear him refer to them this way.
2
You will never, ever hear this POTUS take responsibility for any mistake, or decision, no matter how big or small, that happens below him. It is the telltale sign of a narcissist, which is the easiest and most accurate description of this president. He's sick with ego.
Regrettably, you have made a perfectly accurate description of the leader of the most powerful nation. I'm keeping your post, as it is sums up perfectly in a time when the ability to sum up concisely all the evil of trump eludes us.
Breaking News
In a joint news conference moments ago Kelly Anne "Con" Way and Sean "puckering" Sphincter stated that POS Rump was actually sending an "alternative armada" to North Korea
In a joint news conference moments ago Kelly Anne "Con" Way and Sean "puckering" Sphincter stated that POS Rump was actually sending an "alternative armada" to North Korea
4
Not only has the Pentagon/Dept of Defense lost $6.5 trillion (that is with a T), we now learn that it lost an aircraft carrier and its warships for a period of days! Wha?
This excuse for leadership must stop being seen as acceptable. Our governmental structure and function is unravelling.
This "armada" story, with no less than three official variations, are bald faced lies made by incompetent fools. The republican-led Congress must initiate the impeachment process of the bomb-astic trumpist. Our other two branches of government must restore the balance of power to our democracy.
This excuse for leadership must stop being seen as acceptable. Our governmental structure and function is unravelling.
This "armada" story, with no less than three official variations, are bald faced lies made by incompetent fools. The republican-led Congress must initiate the impeachment process of the bomb-astic trumpist. Our other two branches of government must restore the balance of power to our democracy.
5
here we are, we the people, stuck between a rock (government fog, not invented by trump btw) and a hard place (a far less than diligent press)...
the announced intention to sail north in response to north korea's "provocative behavior" was true, the failure to mention a prior mission was or was not an error - the warning playing in public certainly did not hurt the present intention of putting the kim government on notice...if the mixup was indeed a glitch and not a decoy, the problem lies within, the right hand not communicating with the left, and therein lies the danger of the rock (lazy or incompetent - reader's choice - bureaucracy)...for sure the north koreans knew which way the ships were sailing, even if they didn't know why...the CYA "all of which perpetuated the false narrative" and "by "the time the white house was asked" defines the hard place, (an equally lazy, or incompetent - reader's choice - press)...to take anything an administration which the press mistrusts and dislikes (vilification and ridicule are routine) at every turn without diligent inquiry (old fashioned check-it-before-you-print-it reporting) and, instead heralding the fleet's "imminent arrival...
emblazoned" on front pages here as well as east asia, "fanning fears" which always sells more papers raises ratings than real news.
the information needed to report the story accurately was available, the dots were there to be connected, our beacon free press, just didn't show up for duty.
the announced intention to sail north in response to north korea's "provocative behavior" was true, the failure to mention a prior mission was or was not an error - the warning playing in public certainly did not hurt the present intention of putting the kim government on notice...if the mixup was indeed a glitch and not a decoy, the problem lies within, the right hand not communicating with the left, and therein lies the danger of the rock (lazy or incompetent - reader's choice - bureaucracy)...for sure the north koreans knew which way the ships were sailing, even if they didn't know why...the CYA "all of which perpetuated the false narrative" and "by "the time the white house was asked" defines the hard place, (an equally lazy, or incompetent - reader's choice - press)...to take anything an administration which the press mistrusts and dislikes (vilification and ridicule are routine) at every turn without diligent inquiry (old fashioned check-it-before-you-print-it reporting) and, instead heralding the fleet's "imminent arrival...
emblazoned" on front pages here as well as east asia, "fanning fears" which always sells more papers raises ratings than real news.
the information needed to report the story accurately was available, the dots were there to be connected, our beacon free press, just didn't show up for duty.
3
I'm sure that Trump* is lying (this time) for strategic military reasons, because it couldn't be for that level of general doofliness.
4
Despite the U.S. TV media blackout of this stupid lie by Trump, the global media, including 'Pravda' from Trump's friend Putin covered it before American citizens we told of this SNAFU.
http://www.pravdareport.com/news/world/asia/18-04-2017/137531-carl_vinso...
The Lost Carrier:
http://www.pravdareport.com/news/world/asia/18-04-2017/137531-carl_vinso...
The Lost Carrier:
6
Playing games--chicken, bluff, hide-and-seek, nanee-nanee-boo-boo, take your pick--with Pyongyang's autocrat seems to have successfully lessened our focus on our own would-be autocrat's previously open love-fest with Moscow's autocrat, let alone our focus on how else our fearless leader may continually be misleading and mistreating us.
6
Anyone who calls this a "snafu" is saying that both the secretary of defense and the national security advisor were all misinformed on the location of an entire carrier group for nearly a week. That is nonsense. Certainly China, Russia and N. Korea were not deceived about the location of the carrier group as their multiple intelligence resources were aware of exactly where the carrier fleet was. Trust is earned through telling the truth. We now have a nation who's so called leaders live the "big lie." The last time that happened was in 1938. What purpose does such outrageous deception of the American people serve? This is both malice and incompetency operating in parallel.
For those who thought that it was a smart move to "fake" a US naval deployment toward the Korean Peninsula, considered the repercussions to the South Korean people and the American based soldiers, if the nut leader from NK had launch an attack on their country. The only ones who were duped into thinking that there was "an armada" heading toward the Korean Peninsula were the American people. I'm pretty sure that China, with their eye in the sky satélites, knew the US was thousands of miles away. They probably were in contact with the North Koreans all along during the so call naval deployment.
4
BINGO, Oswald, the Russians very likely saw this even before China --- see my comment above on the "Lost Carrier".
There's much more to this story in the 'back-story' than we are being told.
Hopefully, it's another Revolt of the Generals (and Admirals), as happened with both Adm. Fallon, and the Air Force Generals in 2007 when some 'accidental' stuff happened, but was prevented when a VP instead of the President made some 'innocent goofs' --- which could have led to war.
Maybe Vasili Arkhipov and Stanislav Petrov in the USSR really do have some counter-parts in the USSA, hey?
There's much more to this story in the 'back-story' than we are being told.
Hopefully, it's another Revolt of the Generals (and Admirals), as happened with both Adm. Fallon, and the Air Force Generals in 2007 when some 'accidental' stuff happened, but was prevented when a VP instead of the President made some 'innocent goofs' --- which could have led to war.
Maybe Vasili Arkhipov and Stanislav Petrov in the USSR really do have some counter-parts in the USSA, hey?
1
Do the generals passively resist the liar-in-chief or call a coup. The structure and function is unravelling. Kim Jung-Un's pronouncements to his citizens are parallel to the lies and propaganda the liar-in-chief makes to us.
1
When you lack leadership, a competent team and a clear message & course of action, stuff happens.
3
Well, it is now and it's going to light up the Korean Peninsula if these knuckleheads even think of firing another missile.....
And then what?
And then what?
F TROOP
If this wasn't such a serious threat to world peace it would be a great idea for an episode in a television sitcom.
General Jim Mattis can star as Captain Parmenter. Lt. Gen. H.R. McMaster can costar as Sergeant O'Rourke. This is F TROOP at its finest.
We are in deep, deep trouble with this administration of misfits.
If this wasn't such a serious threat to world peace it would be a great idea for an episode in a television sitcom.
General Jim Mattis can star as Captain Parmenter. Lt. Gen. H.R. McMaster can costar as Sergeant O'Rourke. This is F TROOP at its finest.
We are in deep, deep trouble with this administration of misfits.
6
What if N. Korean's crazy dictator, fearing the armada that wasn't, decided to preemptively vaporize Tokyo with one of his nuclear weapons? Our crazy leaders could have killed millions with this incompetent error.
7
So how are "The Five" characterizing this Snafu? As a brilliant tactic, calculated to keep our enemies guessing? Along with our allies, Congress, the media and our own military? Brilliant!
1
Really scary considering the stakes involved not just re Korea but around the world. Not much room for mistakes in this world right now.
4
"His aides have praised this unpredictability as a virtue in dealing with rogue leaders in North Korea and Syria."--sounds like spin control emanating from the War Room in Dr. Strangelove. Nothing quite like turning into a loose cannon yourself when you have to deal with those pesky loose cannon adversaries, eh?
5
Or like Sheriff Taylor crediting Barney Fife's latest bungle with being a trick that worked in catching the crook.
A bluff is a hopeful and favorable interpretation. But the question is how smart is such a bluff if it can easily be easily discounted by any number of countries and organizations with access to air, sea, and satellite surveillance? Or just plain looking out the "window" at the time place the armada is supposed arrive and seeing nothing.
4
This is terrifying.
3
Well my platoon was sent opcon to other units during Tet of 68. Battalion completely lost track of us for a month. When they tried to find us the SSI had changed and the location we were at had changed names. So we had this funny conversation one day where the S3 was able to get the frequency we were operating on and we were using the new name and he was using the old name, if the enemy was listening it was pretty easy to get the location. Anyway they came and got us no incident and we were reunited with our company who accused us of taking a vacation. Really you can't invent this stuff up, so loosing an aircraft carrier, as they say verrrrry possible.
There's another explanation: Trump was lying ... as he does. Maybe he never meant to send a carrier, but was forced to when he got caught out in the lie. It's the kind of guy he is.
2
Was this a mistake or yet another example of lying to the American public? I vote for the latter.
2
More "alternative" news coming from the White House.
The lying head of state strikes again!
What good does all the lying do except to make the United States look incompetent and undisciplined.
So sad..,
What good does all the lying do except to make the United States look incompetent and undisciplined.
So sad..,
With mistakes such as this, Trump is making us look like fools. There is absolutely no positive communication within members of his administration. Trump is a war lord and has no intention of working within the system of checks and balances of the government which were set up by our forefathers. Get ready for WWIII.
Trump has stated he gave his military power to some general, can't remember his name. Also this doesn't make him look any more or less stupid..that would be impossible.
This wasn't a "Wag the Dog" moment. It was a "Grab that Sucker by the Tail and Whirl Him around like a Helicopter Moment". Well played, Trump! I can hear Canada laughing from here......
1
Trump is lost in the job, or not. His goals are self enrichment, shallow, greedy and amoral. So, he is accomplishing what he set out to do.
5
Extremely disturbing that the Navy is only sending ships to back up the presidents lies.
This is fake news. So what the US navy completes exercises meant to show China the sponsor of North Korea the allies are not only united they will coordinate delivery. Then once completed they sail to North Korea. NYT the US will arrive then you will claim they should have spent time practicing for the event - you are starting to make me want to vomit.
3
You don't seem to understand military strategy, how public statements and military actions interact, or how long it takes to move equipment of this kind to a destination thousands of miles away, or that this positioning is relevant for all the states in that region.
Of course it is good to showcase a united front with allies. But that is separate from this specific statement that was made. The point is, this President made a statement that was not true - in military or diplomatic terms, it simply was not true. This falls short of the standard for a military leader on the world stage.
Of course it is good to showcase a united front with allies. But that is separate from this specific statement that was made. The point is, this President made a statement that was not true - in military or diplomatic terms, it simply was not true. This falls short of the standard for a military leader on the world stage.
That is a shopworn, lazy tag that this is "fake news" markjuliansmith. Everyone knows it is designed to provoke, not make a reasoned argument.
Trump said that the carrier group was steaming toward N. Korea in response to N. Korean provocations, and it was going in the opposite direction. Trump did not say it was making its way to N. Korea after running a couple of errands, making a couple of stops here and there.
Vomiting aside, your post actually concedes that.
Trump said that the carrier group was steaming toward N. Korea in response to N. Korean provocations, and it was going in the opposite direction. Trump did not say it was making its way to N. Korea after running a couple of errands, making a couple of stops here and there.
Vomiting aside, your post actually concedes that.
1
Shades of Benghazi. Perhaps there is a video to blame. Ask a Democrat to explain how to spin it !
Gag Trump and his team. The Keystone cops appear to be in charge, but who knows for sure? News media must really treat everything with a dash of salt . . .or better yet, silence. Spicer and Pence and all the other so-called spokesmen should simply be ignored.
1
China and Russia knew the true location of the Vinson the whole time -- and N. Korea too most likely. So who was this theater intended to infuence? Sure changed the news cycle in the US away from possible collusion between the Trump campaign and Russia. Makes ya wonder...
Is there no end to the gross incompetence of Trump and his incompetent administration? It would seem most certainly not.
1
Trump: dishonest and INCOMPTENT.
3
Foreign Policy broke this story early Tuesday morning, long before the Times. No credit?
1
So the Secretary of Defense doesn't talk to the Secretary of the Navy to be sure everyone is aware of the location of an entire Carrier Group during a time of high tension with an aggressive nation threatening a nuke strike? Then Sean Spicer says they're getting the information from the Department of Defense? Who are they responsible for answering to, Devin Nunes?
Do all of you Trump voter's feel safe now?
America, be afraid, be very afraid.
Do all of you Trump voter's feel safe now?
America, be afraid, be very afraid.
2
There is no story here except that for the NYT, anything DJT does or says is wrong, a lie, whatever. I clearly recall the first I heard the news of the carrier group heading to Korea. The story was that it was heading for AUS for war games when it was ordered to change course for Korea. That is all. That is the entire story. However the NYT and MSM in general need to sell papers/advertising clicks so it has to gin up a controversy where none exists.
I remember when the NYT was an actual, real newspaper that did actual, real journalism. I miss those days.
I remember when the NYT was an actual, real newspaper that did actual, real journalism. I miss those days.
1
NYT, next time get some reporters in Jakarta. Many of my friends there enjoyed seeing all these ships going South. It was nothing but a poker game.
2
Since the Russians and Chinese were bound to know where our "armada" was, what was the point of lying about its location? Or did Trump really not know? Or was he simply saying this for domestic political consumption? Anyway you put it it is just ruins our credibility. What a bunch of amateurs.
1
Remember when it was fun reading the Times in the morning?
Now with every Trump blunder I ask:
1, Is he really that stupid?
2, Is he Lying?
3, Is he delusional?
4, All of the above.
4s have been coming up a lot lately.
Now with every Trump blunder I ask:
1, Is he really that stupid?
2, Is he Lying?
3, Is he delusional?
4, All of the above.
4s have been coming up a lot lately.
When I heard and saw photos of the Carl Vinson heading to the Sea of Japan I held by breath. I was conflicted about the president's decision for his motto is "might is right". Given the unpredictable, pretentious ego and dictatorial nature of Kim Jung-Un I was not certain if a flex of US muscle would cause him concern or inflect more rage. Then the Carl Vinson was heading in the opposite direction!
Another exhibition of this president's incompetence displayed in words and actions which not only afflict distrust and grave concern on our soil but, globally.
Another exhibition of this president's incompetence displayed in words and actions which not only afflict distrust and grave concern on our soil but, globally.
1
Imagine if the NY Yankees had to forfeit an exhibition game against a Little League team in Pennsylvania because the front office forgot they first had to play the Red Sox and unable to manage the logistics of a scheduled two-city road trip, let the airport limo driver take the blame for arriving a day late. We can envision another late, great general named George - (no Mr. President, not Patton, Steinbrenner) "spinning in his grave" at how the current ownership has pursued the "dumbest policy" and "reduced" our once great team "to rubble". It's not just loose lips that sink ships Mr. President. Even limited to 140 characters, undisciplined digits are equal to the task.
I wonder if the media and Republicans are tripping over themselves to call him Commander in Chief on this "mission"...
The Peter principle in operation here. The entire administration has risen to its own level of incompetence, and threaten to take the world and this country with it.
Theodore Roosevelt, who built the U.S. into a modern naval power, must be turning over in his grave. For it was the navy that TR was referring to when he famously said, "Speak softly, but carry a big stick." Now with the President, Defense Secretary, and the National Security Adviser all engaging in a "fake news" version of "Speak loudly, and carry no stick" you have to wonder once more about America's credibility in world affairs, and especially whether this will further embolden North Korea and lead to the confrontation we all hope to avoid.
to give proper credit to someone who months ago used this phrase-just when you thought the clown car was empty another pops out. This is the gang that cannot shoot straight.
Perhaps the ships were racing away to chase the (yet to be successfully fired) North Korean missiles instead of intercepting them! Mr.Trump as usual without checking facts created a war hysteria in South Korea and Japan and gained newspaper headlines. This type of administrative ineptness in the mikitary's chain of command of a superpower is a matter of concern whether we are "America First" or not. Especially when the President is also the commander in chief. Photo depictions placing the ships in the Sea of Japan when in fact they were thousands of mikes away in the Sunda Straits adds a comic finale to the mid April theatricals and parades in North Korea ending with a botched missle firing!
It was bad enough for Commander-in-Chief Trumpster to seemingly order a US fleet to and around North Korea, but worse that the US navy didn't know about the order and Trump didn't know it wasn't being carried out. Great image to N. Korea and China: Trump with his Navy jacket landing aboard the carrier with the banner reading "I'm confused".
The Commander in Chief, of the world's largest navy doesn't know where his highly publicised armada is heading? Very scary, nothing new, but very scary!
One must assume, the N Koreans, Russians, and Chinese are once again laughing out loud, not to mention the confusion / fear on the faces of the S Koreans and Japanese.
Somehow the image of VP Mike Pence in his "battle" jacket doesn't bring calm to the situation.
One must assume, the N Koreans, Russians, and Chinese are once again laughing out loud, not to mention the confusion / fear on the faces of the S Koreans and Japanese.
Somehow the image of VP Mike Pence in his "battle" jacket doesn't bring calm to the situation.
The changed direction of the warship adds to a new dimension to the doctrine of preemptive deterrence against the nuclear belligerence of North Korea,or a matching response to the abortive nuclear missile test by Pyongyang?
Just some more fake news nothing new here. Just like the casualty reporting during the Vietnam war. Everyone acts like fake news is something new.
1
wow. This wasn't even a true escalating emergency and this White House is in tatters as far as being able to coherently communicate within its own people and protect the American people. This administration is an abject failure. The GOP is complicit and protects him, even went so far as to weaken our democracy by over-riding Senate normative rules.
Thanks. I read this twice and still cannot figure out how there was such a collosal error.
1
Agree in millions. Great save for US taxpayers. Exactly what would one not like?
Well it was classic Trump.
FAKE NEWS!
FAKE NEWS!
All the deception. How much conceit? All of our leadership class are prone to deceit. This attack group's actions, or rather the interpretation of their actions, is an apt metaphor for the current unhinged state of our governing system. Our leadership leads by tweets, lies and emotional reaction, so the body politic flails. All of this occurs under the watchful eyes of our adversaries. History tells us where it goes from here so long as this sort of governance continues.
John~
American Net'Zen
John~
American Net'Zen
An administration that's all hat and no cattle, America shaming seems to be the Trump administrations full time job.
When stupid starts at the top it rolls downhill fast I suppose. But you'll never convince me that our SECRETARY of DEFENSE and Trump's NATIONAL SECURITY ADVISOR - both heavy military brass - didn't know that characterizing the Vinson armada as Korea-bound was utterly false. That's far more disturbing because it strongly suggests this was some kind of calculated ruse. 50 years ago JFK kept absolute control over all public statements from all government departments during the Cuban Missle Crisis - terrified that one bit of bad information could lead to the miscalculation precipitating WWIII. The fog of war has nothing on the fog enveloping our President's thinking.
5
Who is lying? I say both or the reporters got it wrong.
How many things can they lie about?
What won't they lie about?
In times of war, deceptions of some kind are justified. The Allies used ghost battalions of canvas and plywood tanks to mislead German spy planes reconnoitering the English coast in WW2. They even used the body of a dead soldier, supplied with fake papers, to suggest that D-Day landings would be in the Pas de Calais region. But we are not at war. Trump has surrendered to the generals, who are unschooled in the democracy of a Republic.
When a promised show of strength in a time of peace, even a tense time of peace, turns out to be lying propaganda, what can we expect if war breaks out? When Gen. Kelly tells Congress to "shut up;" when a cabinet secretary tells the Speaker that the POTUS is contemplating a change in a treaty involving our key allies, we have truly strayed far from the Constitution of the USA, and are now witnessing parliamentary politics rather than divided government. No, this is the German Reichstag after the election of 1933 when the National Socialists won only 44% of the vote.
When a promised show of strength in a time of peace, even a tense time of peace, turns out to be lying propaganda, what can we expect if war breaks out? When Gen. Kelly tells Congress to "shut up;" when a cabinet secretary tells the Speaker that the POTUS is contemplating a change in a treaty involving our key allies, we have truly strayed far from the Constitution of the USA, and are now witnessing parliamentary politics rather than divided government. No, this is the German Reichstag after the election of 1933 when the National Socialists won only 44% of the vote.
We are not at war, though. And all this does is make America look less reliable so when the next big crisis hits and some statement is issued, nobody believe us. That's the biggest danger in Trump's repeated lies and posturing--after a while everyone assumes that everything is just more hot air.
The Uniform Code of Military Justice Article 906a ESPIONAGE punishes by death who “delivers or transmits, or attempts to communicate, deliver or transmit to any entity described in paragraph (2)…..”war plans, nuclear weaponry..” or ( “D) any other major weapons system or major element of defense strategy,…”shall be punished by death or such other punishment as a court-martial may direct” for “(D) any other major weapons system or major element of defense strategy”
The Uniform Code of Military Justice 910 Article 110 “Improper Hazarding of Vessel” …”punishes by death who “suffers to be hazarded any vessel of the armed forces shall suffer death or such punishment as a court-marshal may direct”.
The United States Navy in the Navy News Service 170415-N-BL673-044 published a photo of the USS Carl Vinson Strike Force Group transiting the Sunda Strait.
It is an act of treason under the Military Code to reveal this information when People’s Republic of China has a military defense treaty with North Korea that requires China to retaliate against an act of aggression committed against North Korea. President Trump announced the repositioning of military assets to the coast of North Korea. North Korea has accused and it is widely believed that the failure of the North Korean missile launch resulted from an act of cyber-war by the government of the United States.
I request the New York Times forward this letter to the Defense Department for action.
The Uniform Code of Military Justice 910 Article 110 “Improper Hazarding of Vessel” …”punishes by death who “suffers to be hazarded any vessel of the armed forces shall suffer death or such punishment as a court-marshal may direct”.
The United States Navy in the Navy News Service 170415-N-BL673-044 published a photo of the USS Carl Vinson Strike Force Group transiting the Sunda Strait.
It is an act of treason under the Military Code to reveal this information when People’s Republic of China has a military defense treaty with North Korea that requires China to retaliate against an act of aggression committed against North Korea. President Trump announced the repositioning of military assets to the coast of North Korea. North Korea has accused and it is widely believed that the failure of the North Korean missile launch resulted from an act of cyber-war by the government of the United States.
I request the New York Times forward this letter to the Defense Department for action.
What the surprise here. Trump lies all the time, and our nation is going in the wrong direction.
To think just a couple of days ago we were gloating over Kim's fizzled missile - when all along we were going to potentially take retaliatory action for a successful test with a nonexistent ship.
I dont see anything wrong with this and I aint even a Trump supporter. Bless Obama for his cyber security program directed at NK. I think Trump knew all of NKs missles were going down (google: Obama North Korea Cyber Missle)
1
I love it. Obviously the intended party, North Korea believed it and that's what counts. Where does it say the military has to honest when dealing with the enemy? Have you ever seen inflatable tanks? Misleading information about troop strength by requesting certain quantities of food, ammo, blankets and socks? Planted stories about a broken water purifier allowed the US Navy to locate the Japanese fleet was heading toward Midway Island and a major victory for the US.
Misdirection is part of a valid battle plan. Get over it.
Misdirection is part of a valid battle plan. Get over it.
1
Self misdirection is confusion.....your president could have gotten Pence blown up. Fortunately, the rest of the world knew this was nonsense before Trump did. Now maybe Xi can 'splain to Trump how to keep track of your forces before looking stupid, yet again. Pathetic.
Just incapable of telling the truth or is it incompetence, either way scary the way this all could turn out.
Fire that mortar soldier ( Stripes). I know Stripes was the Army and this is the Navy I'm just making a point.
or as Admiral Nimitz famously asked: "Where is Task Force 34; the world wonders"
1
Is anyone in charge?
only one wod "incompetence"
When you lie, create false news, do things that no presidential candidate has ever said or done, that's one thing. When you actually become President of the most powerful country in the world and you continue to do and say the things you did during the campaign, that's Armageddon. WAKE UP PEOPLE!!!!!
Maybe it was just "puffery", but it didn't stop the North Koreans from attempting to launch a missile.
Well look on the bright side. At least the USS Carl Vinson didn't hit an iceberg.
And cue circus music...
The gang that couldn't shoot straight strikes again! They're 0-3 in clean, successful, well regarded military missions (O.K. 1-2 if you were impressed with the M.O.A.B.). Actually, I wondered if Trump was trying to get Pence killed in South Korea by ramping up the "pressure" on the North while he was in town. What a "Remember the Maine" moment THAT would have been! Fortunately, mankind's only fail safe is Trump's incompetence. Or, was the confusion about which way the boats were floating the work of Gremlins, or the 'Deep State?' Maybe Trump was producing a remake of "Gilligan's Island"? (A three hour tour, indeed!).
The presidential clown moves are only humorous in the aftermath of realizing we are not all thermonuclear dead by now! Trump and ("that gentleman") Kim Jong-in are a match made in heaven; two scions of ruthless, inhumane, and exploitive men. They need each other to reinforce their self importance (and hair care tips). I can't wait for Seth Rogen and James Franco to do a sequel to the "The Interview."
Let's remember Trump's credo and philosophy going forward: give em a great show, and if they don't like it; let them eat chocolate cake! You can't make this stuff up.
The presidential clown moves are only humorous in the aftermath of realizing we are not all thermonuclear dead by now! Trump and ("that gentleman") Kim Jong-in are a match made in heaven; two scions of ruthless, inhumane, and exploitive men. They need each other to reinforce their self importance (and hair care tips). I can't wait for Seth Rogen and James Franco to do a sequel to the "The Interview."
Let's remember Trump's credo and philosophy going forward: give em a great show, and if they don't like it; let them eat chocolate cake! You can't make this stuff up.
So much for the story line that Trump's choice of military advisors lend substance and rationality to his foreign policies!
5
I hope that when the North Koreans launch their missiles to our West coast,they are heading in the wrong direction,too.
6
Can Congress pass legislation to require Trump to be hooked up to a lie detector whenever he speaks? Probably not but in a perfect world it would be made so. With each misdirection, prevarication, and rearrangement of facts Trump degrades the element of trust that is required to be an effective leader. His lying makes all Americans suspect about our intentions around the world, if it continues unabated and widely unchallenged we will be left standing alone without our allies when we need them most. Trump is a taker in a country of givers, we should remember that whenever he speaks and acts.
3
Fifty nine missiles to show you are serious and now a convoy touted as a deterrent moving away from a crisis zone. Brilliant. Welcome to new uses for the US taxpayer's dollar.Of course this does not include non-taxpayers like the so-called president.
5
I had an argument with my father on Easter about the previous/current location/purpose of the US flotilla position "near the Korean Peninsula." It turns out that we were both right, so now he can withdraw his offer of an alternate subscription. The problem of course is that we should not have both been right, there should have been one set of facts only that clearly depicted what was actually happening - that phenomena being: Accuracy.
3
This is why we have, or should have, a civilian-run military. It takes political experience to make these calls, not military experience. It's simply not true that handing all command decisions and public communications to the top military brass will deliver better results.
1
It takes military expertise to know what kind of ship belongs where.
Wow.
The charitable interpretation is that this was a foolhardy bluff that we had an aircraft carrier in the region when we didn't. Not only did this risk Kim calling our bluff and exposing our inability to respond, but it cheapens the deterrent value of our armed forces going forward. It also implies that the administration does not have full operational control of the military, as the location of the Carl Vinson was revealed in a military press release.
The less charitable interpretation is that this was a colossal blunder in which the President and Defense Secretary were misinformed about the location of the Carl Vinson for over a week, and made inaccurate public comments based on that misinformation which significantly raised diplomatic tensions on the Korean Peninsula. It would have taken five seconds for either of these men to request an update on the Carl Vinson's actual location at any point in the past 10 days. That this apparently did not happen further underlines this administration's catastrophic incompetence.
Where some saw strength in the Syrian missile attack and MOAB deployment, I saw a President looking for flashy, insubstantial wins abroad as his domestic agenda grinds to a halt, in a GOP-controlled Congress no less. In this incident, some may see a harmless error, or even a bold gambit, but I fear that foreign powers will see the true weakness of the US under Trump, jeopardizing the international order whose security and stability America underwrites.
The charitable interpretation is that this was a foolhardy bluff that we had an aircraft carrier in the region when we didn't. Not only did this risk Kim calling our bluff and exposing our inability to respond, but it cheapens the deterrent value of our armed forces going forward. It also implies that the administration does not have full operational control of the military, as the location of the Carl Vinson was revealed in a military press release.
The less charitable interpretation is that this was a colossal blunder in which the President and Defense Secretary were misinformed about the location of the Carl Vinson for over a week, and made inaccurate public comments based on that misinformation which significantly raised diplomatic tensions on the Korean Peninsula. It would have taken five seconds for either of these men to request an update on the Carl Vinson's actual location at any point in the past 10 days. That this apparently did not happen further underlines this administration's catastrophic incompetence.
Where some saw strength in the Syrian missile attack and MOAB deployment, I saw a President looking for flashy, insubstantial wins abroad as his domestic agenda grinds to a halt, in a GOP-controlled Congress no less. In this incident, some may see a harmless error, or even a bold gambit, but I fear that foreign powers will see the true weakness of the US under Trump, jeopardizing the international order whose security and stability America underwrites.
7
The real story is: Does this indicate the military is defying the president, or at least genuflecting slowly? I think that's the "thumbsucker think-piece" we would write if we were looking at the same fact pattern in a third-world country.
Also, I would not mind knowing the answer. It speaks to how certain we are in responding to real threats, such as the former Soviets.
I read somewhere long ago that we did a trial "launch" drill of our ICBMS or submarine missiles and something like 30% silo commanders or sub commanders, forget which, called home rather than "take" the command.
Might be wrong. From memory, vague story, little coverage.
Commander in chief, in this case, might have a trigger problem.
Also, I would not mind knowing the answer. It speaks to how certain we are in responding to real threats, such as the former Soviets.
I read somewhere long ago that we did a trial "launch" drill of our ICBMS or submarine missiles and something like 30% silo commanders or sub commanders, forget which, called home rather than "take" the command.
Might be wrong. From memory, vague story, little coverage.
Commander in chief, in this case, might have a trigger problem.
The first reports were that the ships were headed for Singapore area. Suddenly we're shocked that the ships were headed for that region.
interesting to note that the group of ships being sent to waters off the Korean Peninsula does not seem to include submarines. I am no expert but I understand that the types of submarines known to be operated by North Korea are particularly dangerous because they are the quiet diesel electric models, very quiet and hard to detect.
I know the surface ships have antisubmarine capability as would some planes aboard the carrier but wouldn't our own subs be part of an effective antisubmarine defense?
does North Korea have anti-ship missiles similar to the one Argentina used successfully in the Falklands war against the British. Argentina took out a destroyer with one hit from 20 to 30 miles (32 to 48 km) away
I know the surface ships have antisubmarine capability as would some planes aboard the carrier but wouldn't our own subs be part of an effective antisubmarine defense?
does North Korea have anti-ship missiles similar to the one Argentina used successfully in the Falklands war against the British. Argentina took out a destroyer with one hit from 20 to 30 miles (32 to 48 km) away
But what's important is, they could have been heeded that way. And you better believe, next time we say they are, they absolutely maybe coulda woulda shoulda might almost for certain be doing exactly almost what we say, unless... Point is, we draw a red line, it is drawn. Take that to the bank. All those allies out there know whom to trust. You betcha. And anyway, all those foreign places sound the same, how can anyone keep it straight?
4
As we all know it takes time to turn a battleship around and more so for an aircraft carrier. In this case two weeks :)
1
If the Department of Defense under the Trump administration cannot be trusted on such fundamentals as a major deployment, how can it - and Trump - be trusted to keep America safe? This is yet one more, albeit a particularly egregious, example of the Keystone-Cops level of governance that Trump and his band of anti-government henchmen have brought to Washington. Worse, this public humiliation of the U.S. armed forces on the world stage will further undermine our standing and even threaten our security. Enough is enough. It is time for Trump and Pence to resign and for congress to agree on a caretaker, bi-partisan executive administration until a new, free, and fair election can be held.
4
Are we surprised? This is the man who, in an interview with Maria Bartiromo, said he (and "his" military) had bombed Iraq recently. When corrected and told that it was Syria, he had a look of confusion on his face the likes of which I've never seen on a president.
Mr. Trump and his supporters have never been very good with maps or actual facts. But never mind, what could go wrong?
1
If Hillary Clinton had made this mistake, Trey Gowdy would have started an investigation by now.
3
It is hilarious to watch all the armchair quarterbacks commenting here in reaction to The NY Times in this article quoting unattributed, unnamed "officials" in the White House and DOD. I don't think the senior command of the USS Carl Vinson would be watching last week's headlines unfold and not be checking such a blatant discrepancy through its Naval/DOD chain of command. Do you really believe Mattis wasn't aware the whole time of the actual situational awareness? All the sailors in the flotilla are probably laughing at the media pillars for being owned as an unwitting tool of psychological warfare.
1
@Gordon
Hereford, Arizona
They're having a collection to buy Mattis a compass. If Mattis was aware he was lying. Buddy this was screw up!
Hereford, Arizona
They're having a collection to buy Mattis a compass. If Mattis was aware he was lying. Buddy this was screw up!
1
It's OK. Fox News says the ruse will lead to the fall of Kim and crowns Trump's hundred days of greatness.
I try to understand this fumbling episode from the perspective of the North Koreans; they know when they lie. Apparently the Americans don't. Which means that the Americans can be led into strategic blind corners
The administration seems unaware that all the military know that a shooting war will fall firstly on the over 24 million South Koreans living within range of its 12,000 scattered artillery, protected behind blast doors in mountain redoubts. This is not a tactical situation anyone - much less the world's putative most powerful nation, wants to place itself in the middle of.
The administration seems unaware that all the military know that a shooting war will fall firstly on the over 24 million South Koreans living within range of its 12,000 scattered artillery, protected behind blast doors in mountain redoubts. This is not a tactical situation anyone - much less the world's putative most powerful nation, wants to place itself in the middle of.
2
This guy cannot stop lying, even at this sensitive level. I can't understand how he gets away with it, every time, surely this has to be a weakness in the American political system, something wrong with the vaunted Checks and Balances, because it is incomprehensible to me as an outsider.
Perhaps the military was just using trump's natural tendencies to huff and puff to see what Kim Jong-un would do with a little pressure exerted. They did manage to get bannon pushed off the National Security Council. Which leaves the possibility that with a mentally unstable president, a chaotic administration and a dysfunctional congress, the military is implementing foreign policy.
1
Isn't it abundantly clear by now that Trump has no concern for the truth? He wanted to send a message to North Korea about US might without any care about the consequences of his statements if it was disclosed that he was bluffing. How many times has he said that he does not have to show his hand, as if world politics is a game of poker. And, he will likely blame his continuing loss of credibility in the world on the "fake news" for having the audacity to report that he had nothing in his poker hand.
So, please NY Times and all other "fake news" outlets, can you please learn the lesson you should have learned a long time ago: have a high degree of skepticism about anything and everything our President says and, unless you can confirm his statements with credible sources, please assume that it is likely that he is bluffing and that his statements have no basis in reality.
So, please NY Times and all other "fake news" outlets, can you please learn the lesson you should have learned a long time ago: have a high degree of skepticism about anything and everything our President says and, unless you can confirm his statements with credible sources, please assume that it is likely that he is bluffing and that his statements have no basis in reality.
1
How can we trust anything this administration says?
1
Whether by design or more likely error, I don't think it's such a bad thing that North Korea did not know where our aircraft carrier was over the weekend. They probably kept their jets in the air 24/7 burning through their precious fuel looking for the ghost carrier.
Given their horrible launch success rate it seems very likely that the U.S. or alternatively China has infiltrated the North Korean missile project team. It is probably a bad week in the office for the team. Which project leader wants to raise his hand and say "my guys made some mistakes, sorry Dear Leader" rather than blame it on American agents? The search and destroy mission for American agents will result in many false accusations and aggressive prosecutions.
It would not be so difficult to recruit North Korean agents. The border with China is fairly easy to get through with lots of smuggling and crossings. Furthermore NK defense procurement agents are easy targets as they operate outside of NK to gather materials for their programs. A rogue clipper switch inside embedded electronics is very easy to hide.
Given their horrible launch success rate it seems very likely that the U.S. or alternatively China has infiltrated the North Korean missile project team. It is probably a bad week in the office for the team. Which project leader wants to raise his hand and say "my guys made some mistakes, sorry Dear Leader" rather than blame it on American agents? The search and destroy mission for American agents will result in many false accusations and aggressive prosecutions.
It would not be so difficult to recruit North Korean agents. The border with China is fairly easy to get through with lots of smuggling and crossings. Furthermore NK defense procurement agents are easy targets as they operate outside of NK to gather materials for their programs. A rogue clipper switch inside embedded electronics is very easy to hide.
I would like to remind everyone that this is the same person who carries all the US nuclear launch codes.
1
In this case, who fooled whom?
1
The president of the USA -- Donald Poker Face Trump -- never ceases to amaze friends and foes.
The real estate mogul turned president is a poker player who enjoys bluffing, particularly in dangerous international game situations. This is getting better or worse depending on how you approach reality in the post-truth world created by Trump and associates.
The real estate mogul turned president is a poker player who enjoys bluffing, particularly in dangerous international game situations. This is getting better or worse depending on how you approach reality in the post-truth world created by Trump and associates.
1
If it wasn't so serious it would be funny. Hilariously funny. Can this administration tie its shoelace? This makes Mattis look like a chump as well. The latest bit of fake news from the fake president.
5
The announcement of deploying USS Carl Vinson to the Korean Peninsula held the world in suspense, because it showed Trump's resolve to respond to Pyongyang's provocations: "We are sending an armada. Very powerful."
"The story of the wayward carrier might never have come to light had the Navy not posted a photo online Monday of the Carl Vinson sailing south through the Sunda Strait." It looks as though the Navy wasn't well informed of what was going on.
It's so hilarious, and the leadership in Beijing and the Kim regime in Pynongyang must find the mishap comical. America's allies in Seoul and Tokyo would see it as an erosion of America's reliability and Trump's credibility.
"The story of the wayward carrier might never have come to light had the Navy not posted a photo online Monday of the Carl Vinson sailing south through the Sunda Strait." It looks as though the Navy wasn't well informed of what was going on.
It's so hilarious, and the leadership in Beijing and the Kim regime in Pynongyang must find the mishap comical. America's allies in Seoul and Tokyo would see it as an erosion of America's reliability and Trump's credibility.
8
Welcome to Trumpland's fictional news! Maybe Trump will ask Disney to make him an offer for a new show, "Trump Goes to Washington" .
21
embarrassing like everything else....
Maybe the armada went on a "Three hour tour,..... a Three hour tour....l
37
Hate to knock a former Marine, but it seems that Mad Dog Mattis is starting to don (pun intended) a little of the Trump/Spicer clown makeup himself. We are looking incompetent and blundering militarily. I'm 60 and I've never said that in my life. And that, in a word--is scary.
57
america started looking incompetent and blundering military in vietnam
you just havent seen it till now, is all
If it scares liberals, it probably scares North Korea, too!
1
No. We haven't "blundered" anything. The group was headed to AUS and diverted to Korea. That is the entire story, nothing more. The Times is just trying to sell cick-bait.
Where are the checks and balances in this administration?
You wrote that officials at the defense department, "... described a glitch-ridden sequence of events, from an ill-timed announcement of the deployment by the military’s Pacific Command to a partially erroneous explanation by the defense secretary, Jim Mattis"
So the nuclear codes are in the hands of an administration that gives us "glitch-ridden?"
You couldn't make this stuff up - not that you would want to.
You wrote that officials at the defense department, "... described a glitch-ridden sequence of events, from an ill-timed announcement of the deployment by the military’s Pacific Command to a partially erroneous explanation by the defense secretary, Jim Mattis"
So the nuclear codes are in the hands of an administration that gives us "glitch-ridden?"
You couldn't make this stuff up - not that you would want to.
239
The glitch ridden sequence of events began one Tuesday last November!
It's yellow journalism using judgment-riddled adjectives to describe a simple conveyance of information that was never misunderstood in the first place. The Times despises DJT bc he isn't a simpering liberal and they got the election totally wrong. Pathetic, really. I would be embarrassed to work for the Times these days.
1
Trump's imagination is enhanced with his malignant narcissism, each glitch takes the world closer to a cataclysmic event precipitated by this man in need of psychiatric treatment which will not help at his advanced stage.
The blame goes to the unbelievably gullible voters that gave this fraud a place in history that will be seen as an era that produced the lowest intellect of Americans whose base is rampant with racists and hate.
The blame goes to the unbelievably gullible voters that gave this fraud a place in history that will be seen as an era that produced the lowest intellect of Americans whose base is rampant with racists and hate.
1
What's this? The Trump people are lying even when they don't mean to?
40
It could be comical, if not SAD and dangerous. Don't they know that the world is watching?
22
They are going to push us to the brink of nuclear war just to prove they we "need" them in time of disaster. But wait, it's Trump so his impulsiveness and stupidity will turn it into a disaster.
Indeed the world is watching I'am in NZ. Never before have I seen such a lack of communication causing such embassasment to the US Navy. The USS Carl Vinson and her battle group heading for the Korean peninsula on one day. Then the next she appears without her escorts in the Sunda Strait. Is this a ruse to confuse Mr Un? Perhaps as the days pass some clarity of the situation may be revealed.
Very disturbed to read about General Mattis, our Secretary of Defense seeming just as incompetent and uninformed as Trump and Spicer. He was supposed to be the 'adult in the room' that would interject reason and thoughtfulness into the chaos created by Trump. He certainly didn't seem to interject any sanity, expanded vision or common sense into the Tomahawk Missile or 'Mother of All Bombs' extravaganzas. Instead of being the 'only adult in the room' we so desperately need, he just seems like another conflicted player in the lunatic parade that calls itself the Trump White House Administration...
Sad
Sad
42
Maybe it's all those missed intelligence briefings.
North Korea has a misfire. Looks like the White House had one too. The Australian Navy will be disappointed on a delay to the joint exercise in the Indian Ocean - but only after they've stopped laughing.
25
They'll stop laughing once they realize we've been nuked in a "preemptive strike" according to the North Korean Secretary of Defense.
I love that he's unpredictable. It's why he won.
"We're going to North Korea with an armada". But psyche ! we weren't. And we WON again like in November.
"We're going to North Korea with an armada". But psyche ! we weren't. And we WON again like in November.
5
So it doesn't matter to you that his administration's buffoonery could just as easily have gone the other way? It's all good as long as we "win" this time?
.
That's a hell of a way to run a ship of state let alone a military ship.
.
That's a hell of a way to run a ship of state let alone a military ship.
7
I don't think we "won" when the world considers our leaders as unstable and mad.
1
He didn't win the election because he is "unpredictable." He likely won because of a combination of a flawed Clinton campaign and a lot of help from Russian intelligence dumping endless DNC emails in the US media every week in the run-up to the election.
And what, pray tell, have we "won" with N. Korea? Has Kim Jong-un surrendered? Did N. Korea go away? Seems like the problem is still there. They have nukes. They have missiles.
Nothing is changed.
Except maybe that we have too many Trump supporters that don't understand when he's running the country incompetently.
And what, pray tell, have we "won" with N. Korea? Has Kim Jong-un surrendered? Did N. Korea go away? Seems like the problem is still there. They have nukes. They have missiles.
Nothing is changed.
Except maybe that we have too many Trump supporters that don't understand when he's running the country incompetently.
Trump, making fake news
19
How fake? He ordered the carrier group's diversion himself. Nothing fake about it.
Don't worry, be happy. The military developed GPS, and as anyone with one of these units can tell you, they sometimes send you to the wrong address.
18
OK USA, this has been fun, but now it's just getting scary.
45
A day like any other in the Past where 'America' leans on her friend 'Africa', they walk together at the same pace in harmony and friendship, while ahead 'Japan' and 'Korea' are having a quiet talk. Both these men were to tell our international speakers' workshop held in the heart of the Children's Global Community of what it was like to grow up under their fathers having served in the Military.
A day like any other in the United States of America and we give thanks to The Statue of Liberty today knowing that we will prevail once again to bring back that day.
A day like any other in the United States of America and we give thanks to The Statue of Liberty today knowing that we will prevail once again to bring back that day.
Clearly Trump was being Trump the braggart and bully when he spoke of sending a whole armada. Unfortunately, that is how misinformation leads to misunderstanding, or worse. He needs to learn from President Kennedy and his handling of the Cuban misled crisis.
12
The notion of Trump learning anything is a non-starter . . . or an oxymoron, which is a much more appropriate word . . .
That would require him to read and understand history. Clearly two things this president doesn't do.
Don't have time to read 1500 comments but surely NYT realizes This was a bluff. Kim Jong Un was potentially about to launch a missile and conduct a nuclear test. It appears the imminent presence of the Carl Vinson gave the young despot pause. We'll never know but surely the US posturing was intentional. It's staggering that most media are howling "dishonesty" in the face of necessary geopolitical chess moves that worked!
6
@John Hills
"We'll never know but surely the US posturing was intentional."
"Surely" (not your name I know) doesn't follow "never know." Maybe you haven't been paying much attention (don't blame you being in Hawaii and 4 time zones away) but Trump doesn't do "intentional."
"...necessary geopolitical chess moves that worked!" Huh? They fired a missile, which happened to malfunction. Not even Trump has taken credit for that but don't let that stop you from attributing Iron-man powers to the Cake Wars wannabe host.
Newsflash: hard to suggest it was posturing when everything is. You're the leader of the free world (said with fear and trembling). You don't cry wolf.
You mean what you say. That's how Kennedy backed down Khrushchev.
Presidents don't bluff with the fate of earth in play.
There's no second chance.
"We'll never know but surely the US posturing was intentional."
"Surely" (not your name I know) doesn't follow "never know." Maybe you haven't been paying much attention (don't blame you being in Hawaii and 4 time zones away) but Trump doesn't do "intentional."
"...necessary geopolitical chess moves that worked!" Huh? They fired a missile, which happened to malfunction. Not even Trump has taken credit for that but don't let that stop you from attributing Iron-man powers to the Cake Wars wannabe host.
Newsflash: hard to suggest it was posturing when everything is. You're the leader of the free world (said with fear and trembling). You don't cry wolf.
You mean what you say. That's how Kennedy backed down Khrushchev.
Presidents don't bluff with the fate of earth in play.
There's no second chance.
The only problem with your theory is that North Korea has satellites (as do many of the other countries watching this debacle) and would have known there was no "armada" moving towards them. So, no. Trump was not being nefarious.
3
You don't think North Korea knew which way the ships were heading? Oh please!
If McMaster and Mattis have any integrity and honor, they would both resign immediately? They were either lied to and used by the president, or worse, they went along with his lying to the American people. Either way, they should both step down. Trump's lies and ignorance are going to get people killed. This flagrant display of hubris and ignorance is grounds for impeachment.
33
Please. McMaster and Mattis are the only grownups in the room at this point. All others are in-laws or oligarchs.
1
Mattis and McMaster should not step down or be fired. They have both repeatedly demonstrated their competence as administrators and combat operational commanders. They are both independent clear thinkers who are widely respected by foreign militaries and are the most competent members of the Trump cabinet. The person who needs to be fired AND demoted is the Admiral in charge of ship movement for the Navy. The Navy was told to send an aircraft carrier battle group to the Korean Peninsula to deter Kim Jong-Un. That did not happen. The urgency for this was obvious and clearly superseded any training exercises. The Navy chose to send the USS CARL VINSON which was scheduled for training exercises with the Australian Navy. According to the Wall Street Journal, Mattis told the Pentagon to cancel the exercises and go to Korea. Instead the Vinson went to Australia to do the planned exercises. The Navy apparently did not think it was necessary to clarify this with the Secretary of Defense who thought his order was being carried out. A ship's movement is supposed to be kept secret in times of conflict. The public affairs officer of the Vinson displayed lack of situational awareness by inappropriately posting the location of the Vinson online. This is a major blunder that made our enemies and allies think that America was bluffing about a serious matter. This is not a Trump problem; it is a Navy problem. That is where the heads need to roll.
1
@J.T. Stasiak.
Sorry, these two has beens need to take a hike. If these two are the most confident on Trump's team, then God help us all. Military does not automatically mean knowledgeable and competent.
The American military has been called heroes far too much and far too often. The adulation and over done praise has gone to their heads.
This kind of fiasco is going to get people killed. Incompetent, the lot of them.
Sorry, these two has beens need to take a hike. If these two are the most confident on Trump's team, then God help us all. Military does not automatically mean knowledgeable and competent.
The American military has been called heroes far too much and far too often. The adulation and over done praise has gone to their heads.
This kind of fiasco is going to get people killed. Incompetent, the lot of them.
The US government's stance toward NKorea is troubling. Please remember that there are more than 50 million Koreans that live in South Korea and that these people will be the vast vast majority bearing the cost of N Korea's retaliation. How about we let South Koreans and the S Korean government have a say in how to deal with NKorea?
147
Thank you, Madison, for the voice of reason. Calling on our Allies, calling on the United Nations where the previous Secretary General is Korean.
You really got a problem when your lying goes international.
25
It was good enough for trump government work.
7
Lying incompetents, including this James Mattis person who was supposed to know what he is doing. None of them do.
29
Impeachment now, please.
34
I thought the North Koreans were supposed to be the crazy ones with the nukes?
53
Our incompetent and dishonest commander in chief knows every hole at his golf course, but doesn't know one ocean from another. This administration has already failed, melting faster than -- what's that word they loved -- oh yeah, snowflake!
34
Thank God! We're saved. I was worried that America wasn't looking stupid enough this week.
50
Can you imaging if President Obama, or the person who is supposed to be president, except she is female..... [finish the sentence for me please ... I am too livid....]
26
We would be better informed, less uneasy and go about our daily business of affairs with some respect for the President and the Administration who represent us when it comes to these dangerous political matters and safety.
A lot depends on us now. Our children may come to us for reassurance, or an explanation. Let us be prepared because little ones have big ears on these occasions.
A lot depends on us now. Our children may come to us for reassurance, or an explanation. Let us be prepared because little ones have big ears on these occasions.
So True...especially when they hear the President of the USA making the kinds of comments he made about Mexicans being rapists....that sends such a goods signal to little Mexican girls and boys...and even though those remarks about how he can get away with grabbing you know what were on tape from a few years ago...our little girls from Republican households now know that their daddies voted for a guy like this....what else, Miss Ley...what else has Trump said, if ANYTHING that is suitable for little ones with big ears? This particular incident pales in comparison with how stupid he really has been on EVERYTHING and how scary is it that there is so much more to come. I mean that chocolate cake remark and then getting which country we were sending missles to while he and the Chines president were eating it...was that not enough for you people? Every day ... every single day whether he is RULING from the WH where he pledged he would STAY, or his GOLF CLUB in Mar Largo ... that costs Florida millions of dollars in extra security...it's BAD news and in his own word that he loves to use just SAD.
Stupid man, stupid ideas, schoolboy tricks. Now I fear he might be embarassed into dropping a big one.
17
Ever since I can remember the US military cannot disclose the itinerary, position or course of its carriers. NYT must be one of those anti-Trump media that enjoys bullying the President. Another fake news story.
3
So you're saying that when Trump CLAIMS we are sailing in a given direction that he's breaking the law? That's worse.
7
Worse than the gang who couldn't shoot straight, this is the gang who can't even SAIL straight !
14
When a con-man is involved, expect a con. Will something, anything just once come out of this Administration that doesn't involve three walnut shells and a pea?
47
The pea here might be a nuclear weapon.
Vice-President Pence to come forward with the President beside him and give a brief address to the Nation, a clarification and an update, while standing strong and steadfast.
The only spew missing from the White House were reports of phantom torpedoes being fired at the carrier by the North Koreans.
Gulf of Tonkin II.
Gulf of Tonkin II.
8
This president is a complete joke. It would be funny if we weren't dealing with nuclear weapons.
18
When Marlon Brando attended an acting class, the teacher asked the students to pretend that a nuclear weapon was going to fall on their heads. They all ran about like chickens except for the future star. When asked why he remained still, he replied 'because I am not a chicken'.
Military people, you understand, are men & women of honor. They are mission-oriented. They take their jobs seriously. And they don't like working for this guy, this racist and anti-Semite, who runs his mouth bit too much.
15
When Trump declares war on Russia, will he fire missiles at the moon?
12
Trump's Navy flees.
2
Jeez, it sounded to me the POtuS and the SoD just looked at a map of where the ships are and say: hmm, this is the closest carrier group, that the one the do the job... hahaha... that would teach them not to mess with us... hahaha... see who is mad now... ahaha.
1
This was a lie. Obfuscate all you want. This was a lie. Kind of like the kid who cried wolf. This was a lie.
12
Speechless, for now.
5
Was in military. Aircraft carriers " don't get lost". It is exactly where the commander at the Pentagon wants. I would not be so quick to want war. Fools rush in. If you actually think the situation isn't foremost in our military advisers minds on the forefront. Your all deceived. No one on this thread is in the situation room, your smarting off half cocked , hatred and emotions.
Unless one of you has the scoop, and is stupid enough to post it, so our enemies see it. I think all comments without real knowledge, are just words
Unless one of you has the scoop, and is stupid enough to post it, so our enemies see it. I think all comments without real knowledge, are just words
3
I think you miss the point. Yes, the Pentagon knows where the ships are: they were on course to do manuevers with Australia, as expected. The President just happened to make untrue claims about them to threaten N Korea.
9
Better hurry. North Korea could have packed up & left. This is what happens when you don't pay your cell phone bill. And as conservatives say, this what happens when government is involved in anything!
2
There are 1518 comments about this column and those I read are critical of the misinformation stated by Trump, Spicer and perhaps Mattis and McMaster.
Is this deliberate or subterfuge? Or just plain miscommunication and jumping to conclusions.
In all cases, this is dangerous -- in deeds and words and puts us and millions of people at increased risk. It pits one erratic, irresponsible dictator against an erratic, irresponsible 'president."
This looks more and more like a show of clowns falling out of a car --- but it is not at all funny. It is hugely and bigly SCARY !
Is this deliberate or subterfuge? Or just plain miscommunication and jumping to conclusions.
In all cases, this is dangerous -- in deeds and words and puts us and millions of people at increased risk. It pits one erratic, irresponsible dictator against an erratic, irresponsible 'president."
This looks more and more like a show of clowns falling out of a car --- but it is not at all funny. It is hugely and bigly SCARY !
8
Why does every day have to feel like another round of Russian roulette?
24
Unfortunately this is what it may take to unite the Nation and its People.
Trump's idea of a bluff? No wonder his casinos flopped.
13
Nuclear deterrence between the US and the USSR was developed over time and accomplished for many decades due to rational actors and predictable actions. Generally speaking, both sides saw it in their best interest and went out of their way to carefully telegraph major military moves and maneuvers to the other side, so that they were not misinterpreted.
Say what you will about the complete and obscene waste of resources behind the nuclear arms race, at least one benefit of deterrence theory was that the major nuclear powers did not annihilate each other.
By contrast, here we are dealing with at least one highly irrational actor, and the US misleads -- if not deceives -- N. Korea about a carrier group being sent to the region while tensions are sky high. This is a recipe for disaster.
Say what you will about the complete and obscene waste of resources behind the nuclear arms race, at least one benefit of deterrence theory was that the major nuclear powers did not annihilate each other.
By contrast, here we are dealing with at least one highly irrational actor, and the US misleads -- if not deceives -- N. Korea about a carrier group being sent to the region while tensions are sky high. This is a recipe for disaster.
8
If it were not truly serious, you could compare Trump's failure to correct which way our carrier was going with two laughers, The Mouse That Roared or better yet with Groucho Marx who led Fredonia into war back in the Thirties.
2
If it's not obvious by now, Trump likes to rile everyone up and then go play golf in Florida. Trump wants to appear tough and militant, but tough or militant he is not. Trump has soft hands and surrounds himself with gold.
When that college kid ran at the stage during the primaries (but didn't get very close), Trump had a reaction of raw fear and panic, looking for someplace to run, but knowing he was surrounded by secret service. It was a memorable reaction for such a "tough guy".
Soft hands and gold rooms. The rest is an act.
When that college kid ran at the stage during the primaries (but didn't get very close), Trump had a reaction of raw fear and panic, looking for someplace to run, but knowing he was surrounded by secret service. It was a memorable reaction for such a "tough guy".
Soft hands and gold rooms. The rest is an act.
21
well said
4
The Dunning-Kruger research hypothesizes that the incompetent are too incompetent to recognize their own incompetence. That sums up Trumpski and his Trumpsters.
13
Soooo... the one thing I ever agreed with Trump on was a lie. Now I know how his supporters feel. Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me. Shame on you, Trump.
4
I would love to know why this is even considered news. If the press would stop doing whatever they can to make us look stupid and report things that matter we as a country may be taken more serious. This is blatantly just a stick at Trump. So sick of seeing this kind of trash considered news making the great nation I spent 10 years defending look stupid. If we would support ourselves and not do whatever we can to put down our president, no matter who it is, we will become great again. Right now the trash considered news and the majority in the media industry is destroying us.
2
Dude... Trump lied to us.... again!
2
Show me one president that didn't lie to us in one way or another. Wasn't my point. The corruption in Washington is hid and fueled by ridiculous media like this.
SR, I was scared to death all last weeken, as were millions of others. And now, come to find out, the reason for my fear, was based all on a LIE. It was based on Trump's stupid TWEETS regarding North Korea, and on the Vinson and the US flotilla being in the Sea of Japan, supposedly, so close to North Korea on their Day of the Sun.
Put the blame where it belongs--on Trump and his administration. It is their incompetence, their lack of planning, their failure to develop partnerships and use diplomacy, to build on past success that is to blame.
Put the blame where it belongs--on Trump and his administration. It is their incompetence, their lack of planning, their failure to develop partnerships and use diplomacy, to build on past success that is to blame.
This con man is running the government like he ran his businesses, just lies and bluster. It is shameful that the Pentagon has allowed itself to be embroiled in this man's obvious disregard for the safety of the United States and its allies in the region.
9
To be fair the fleet could have been taking the 23-day luxury liner scenic route and still made it's way to North Korea. I have found that by not being swayed by either the Democrat or Republican persuasion the best way to figure out what is actually going on is to take what is the official WH comment and then think of the exact opposite scenario and the answer will be very close to that. Trust me it is working so far.
4
Likely nations who monitor through satellites, flyovers and have submarines patrolling the area knew where this ship was, and know the location of most US navy ships in the Sea of Japan (just as we keep tabs on theirs).
2
Found: Large gray aircraft carrier, 100,000 tons or so. Wandering aimlessly in the Sunda Strait. Full of nuclear reactors, loud jets and whatnot. Comes with complementary "armada" that seems to follow it wherever it goes.
If this is your aircraft carrier, please learn how to deploy. Thanks.
If this is your aircraft carrier, please learn how to deploy. Thanks.
4
But at least it wasn't a woman who misplaced an aircraft carrier.
5
The incompetence of this administration has no boundary and its recklessness no decipherable objective.
5
Was this fake news put out by Donald to divert us from the promised wall that Mexico isn't going to pay for and will never be built?
More of the same strategy to cover up broken promises and failures by Trump.
Plenty more to come.
This just in, the source of the most disturbing fake news has been found. The White House.
More of the same strategy to cover up broken promises and failures by Trump.
Plenty more to come.
This just in, the source of the most disturbing fake news has been found. The White House.
6
Of course the battle group is sailing away. Surely we want our troops to be well cleared of our super nuke's blast radius when it detonates over Pyongyang.
Commodore Trump: Wrong direction, wrong ocean. Full steam ahead!
5
On such blunders the world could be incinerated. With no clear understanding of the complexities surrounding him this so called president is unable to formulate policy and issue clear directives so that such blunders are avoided.
Once again the world laughs at us. Who is more embarrassed, North Korea whose missile launch failed or USA whose carrier 'armada' was in the wrong place and Trump didn't even know it?....For this he deserves to be removed from office...It is too dangerous to keep him there.
Once again the world laughs at us. Who is more embarrassed, North Korea whose missile launch failed or USA whose carrier 'armada' was in the wrong place and Trump didn't even know it?....For this he deserves to be removed from office...It is too dangerous to keep him there.
A Paper Tiger. Increasingly that is what Trump, and now thanks to him, what our country has became. Or, more bluntly, a laughingstock.
14
Does anyone really think that in this era of everpresent satellite and signals intelligent monitoring that North Korea was misled for more than a few minutes by the claim that the Carl Vinson was en route to the region? Hiding a carrier battle group is not easy; it's much easier to fool the press and the public than an adversarial foreign government. Trump sounded tough at home, and the North Korean leadership laughed.
12
From everything I've read about N. Korea, I'm not getting they would likely have a fleet of sophisticated satellites they can rely on for extensive monitoring of the U.S. military, which is spread out all over the world. And, even if they did, they would probably still use what Trump and the U.S. announced as a means to whip up the war fever in their citizens to an even higher level.
3
Exactly
Whether gunboat diplomacy (threatening North Korea with a US Navy carrier group) was a good idea is a separate issue. But publicizing this exercise as gunboat diplomacy and then admitting that both SecDef and the President had no idea what was happening is damaging to our military credibility. The next time one of them makes an announcement of a deployment in harm's way the first question will be "Does either one have any idea where the ships really are?" We've gone from farce to tragedy.
17
It was not a joke. It was a meter of defense, military operation and our national security. Trump lied and Spicer lied , that is bad but we are used to their lying. But Mattis and McMaster lied, that is extremely scary. We trust only three secretaries of Trump----- McMaster, Mattis and Kelly. If any of them get infected by Trump, then the nation will be very disappointed and scared. Please clarify about warships towards North Korea or it is just bogus.
11
The Trumpish Armada seems to have become lost at sea. Like the Presidency.
12
This should be unacceptable to the American Public.
18
What more evidence is needed that the POTUS is actually Captain Wrongway Peachfuzz?
Yes, dispatching the USS Vinson sends a strong message: the POTUS is an blithering imbecile.
Yes, dispatching the USS Vinson sends a strong message: the POTUS is an blithering imbecile.
27
President ordered them to send it, but they did not do it, probably for good reason, so they all just pretended it was heading to Korea. I guess when you have a president with a short attention span this will happen. Pretty weird though.
11
That's the first intelligent thing I've read about why the ship wasn't in the place where they said it was.
Incompetence at the highest level. Outrageous.
18
Where is Dan Quayle when we really need him. After all: "An aircraft carrier is a terrible thing to lose."
9
All enemy combatants and any maneuvers by our military in conjunction to any strategy us supposed to be classified. It is none of our business or the media. Wise up America, this should be your thoughts on this also
3
Uh huh. This is why President Wrongness announced he is sending A Mighty And Powerful Armada to North Korea, they should behave; and why we got days of misinformation aka "lies" (look it up) from White House spokespeople.
This is a democracy, supposedly, and when our so-called leaders make announcements like this and double and triple and quadruple down on them it would be better if we could assume they aren't outright LYING.
Anyway, in the era of satellites not to mention all our treaty obligations I'd be real surprised if a carrier strike force was invisible. Except of course to the current White House.
This is a democracy, supposedly, and when our so-called leaders make announcements like this and double and triple and quadruple down on them it would be better if we could assume they aren't outright LYING.
Anyway, in the era of satellites not to mention all our treaty obligations I'd be real surprised if a carrier strike force was invisible. Except of course to the current White House.
5
I sincerely hope that was "snark". Because if it wasn't, you terrify me, and all freedom loving Americans. We are still a self governing Republic and the business of the government is the business of all American citizens.
3
Should congress keep war declarations secret too?
4
Instead of Wag the Dog, we have wag the aircraft carrier...
11
Can't wait to find out how this is the fault of the Democrats upset with the results of the election.
39
Yes because Im not a republican. Yet I speak as neutral. No one knows Truly what is going on except Pentagon. Glad for that, because as ex military. You all would love to see the President fail. The fact is. If he loses, we lose. Until you really know what going on and why, I really don't see any intelligent comments here
2
It sounded like we forced to see North Korea hand (next move) on a Bluff
2
It sounded like fake news they accuse everyone else of reporting.
2
That there are people commenting here that somehow this was a military strategy, never seen before, that he said he wouldn't let our enemies know ahead of time and here it is in action, etc...
There is nothing cunning, clever, stealth, strategic or Napoleon-like here.
Nothing.
I wish there was. Truly.
Such stupidity only makes our country appear even more appetizing and vulnerable to attack by our enemies.
Our longstanding Allies can only wonder what happened to the country that once saved them from tyranny and death, fought for Truth and Justice.
We can only hope that reality seeps into our Country's worldview before its too late.
Which it may be already.
Put away that kool-aid.
There is nothing cunning, clever, stealth, strategic or Napoleon-like here.
Nothing.
I wish there was. Truly.
Such stupidity only makes our country appear even more appetizing and vulnerable to attack by our enemies.
Our longstanding Allies can only wonder what happened to the country that once saved them from tyranny and death, fought for Truth and Justice.
We can only hope that reality seeps into our Country's worldview before its too late.
Which it may be already.
Put away that kool-aid.
24
This is a dangerous to be so inept, Trump's fake bluster, misleading facts are bound to blow up in our faces.
I hate to say this but North Korea seems more in control of trumps strings than seems possible.
Now the American Generals who by all accounts are misinformed and the press has lost it's mission to report real news, at some point a blunder might happen, it's just a matter of time.
I hate to say this but North Korea seems more in control of trumps strings than seems possible.
Now the American Generals who by all accounts are misinformed and the press has lost it's mission to report real news, at some point a blunder might happen, it's just a matter of time.
8
weve all known cupcakes like trump who can be wound up by even a small amount of teasing and prodding
except they were 11 yo and not the pres of the usa
3
How can someone intelligently comment on such stupidity?
Just beyond my grasp smh, jsmh.
Just beyond my grasp smh, jsmh.
8
what a bunch of amateurs! this is like a MASH episode only with water
21
How dare you insult MASH like that!
4
Everybody settle down please. The White House and the Pentagon just need a geography course.
4
So Donald, there is the Northern Hempisphere the Southern Hemisphere.
You mean Canada and Mexico.
Build a wall on both. It's going to be a really great wall.
You mean Canada and Mexico.
Build a wall on both. It's going to be a really great wall.
After some thought and reading some excellent comments on here, I absolutely refuse to believe that the US Navy didn't know where the Carl Vinson was headed, or, in fact, exactly where it was at all times. The amount of people, planning, coordination, and work involved when a carrier is on the move makes accidental movement impossible. It's also one of the most important pieces of our military and critical to the US Navy. They did not mistake it's location or it's destination at any time. Not a chance.
So then what's left to wonder is why the White House, who would certainly have access to accurate real time information regarding exactly where the Carl Vinson was, is, and is going, would say that it was headed toward North Korea?
They didn't really intentionally lie about that, right? I mean there's no way they would lie about something so serious, and something that would almost certainly be discovered immediately? Right?
Please tell me there's another explanation, because I am having a very hard time imagining what it could be. If that is indeed what they did, then they are even more incompetent and dangerous than I thought they were, and they need to be removed from power immediately. This should be a wake-up call for Congress and the American public who still support this administration. Sadly, I am not convinced it will be.
So then what's left to wonder is why the White House, who would certainly have access to accurate real time information regarding exactly where the Carl Vinson was, is, and is going, would say that it was headed toward North Korea?
They didn't really intentionally lie about that, right? I mean there's no way they would lie about something so serious, and something that would almost certainly be discovered immediately? Right?
Please tell me there's another explanation, because I am having a very hard time imagining what it could be. If that is indeed what they did, then they are even more incompetent and dangerous than I thought they were, and they need to be removed from power immediately. This should be a wake-up call for Congress and the American public who still support this administration. Sadly, I am not convinced it will be.
22
My guess is the Vinson will end up off the Korean peninsula in the Sea of Japan sometime soon. No one said it would go there directly. You will probably see a number of B-1s flying to Guam. Obama did that two years ago and had them fly across South Korea escorted by South Korean fighters within radar range of the DPRK radars. That freaked Kim out.
2
Why would anyone with any brains believe anything these fascists say?! They lied to get into the government, and now they lie and cheat and worse till they destroy us all. One madman here verses another madman in North Korea. Won't end well for this nation, this earth, countless lives, democracy. They cannot be allowed to stay any longer.
9
1st of all National Security and where are ships are is none of the media, the public's, or are enemies business. I was in the USCG in 80's. It used to be wisdom not to unzip your pants in front of your enemies. However in this day and age, wisdom means nothing. Im not republican or democrat. Yet I sit and listen to the empty minds speaking here. Everyone's concerned about which political party is in control, and showing hatred instead of being concerned about what's really. Finger pointers and blame seekers. Theself centered ness of humans and citizens oor country nevEr cease to amaze. News flash. Elections are over. Instead of being against one another. We need to find common ground amongst ourselves
3
We have found common ground. We, the majority of people commenting, have a clear impression that the man who cheated his way into the office of president is a dismal fool and we want him gone.
10
Your first sentence indicates that you are not equipped to be a full participant in the American experiment.
3
Oh...sailing in the wrong direction....is anyone surprised...the first rule of management: be competent...Trump has no clue of what competent means.
13
In a 1980 speech Ronald Reagan asked - Are you better off now than you were four years ago? Well, with this additional misstep from the Trump Administration, the current question is..... Do you feel safer now than you did four years ago?
29
I agree with the sentiment, but would modify the question to "a hundred days ago." (My God, is it only that long since this guy took office?)
3
Even four months ago I felt better. Trump is not a serious man and he is playing with the lives of everyone in the world.
10
Try 4 months ago.
1
There is zero room for error in the NK situation and this is the amateur hour dopes we have running the show.
22
I knew that Trump's executive skills were miserly, but now I dumbfounded.
8
There's a message here somewhere. Not even our aircraft carriers know which way to go under this president.
16
... From the who-needs-briefings everyday crew, the put-it-in pictures and keep-it-to-one-page so that it doesn't disrupt my dinner President.
Perhaps maintaining ignorance. and letting the boys fight it out among themselves, after having gotten rid of much of the sort of line staff who make things work, are not sufficiently sophisticated strategies?
Perhaps maintaining ignorance. and letting the boys fight it out among themselves, after having gotten rid of much of the sort of line staff who make things work, are not sufficiently sophisticated strategies?
6
What a snafu! Congress needs to seriously ivestigate the failure of the whole command structure from Washington to South Korea. From the film clips I have viewed the mistakes and confusion emanated from the Pentagon and the White House.
Kim jong un and his pals must have gottten quite a laugh at the state of American "readiness"! No command, no control, and no communication!
Big question: Can we survive an administration bent on "deconstructing" our government? When will we put an end to this dangerous nonsense?
Kim jong un and his pals must have gottten quite a laugh at the state of American "readiness"! No command, no control, and no communication!
Big question: Can we survive an administration bent on "deconstructing" our government? When will we put an end to this dangerous nonsense?
30
As a U.S Navy veteran I was skeptical of the report. Generally, the U.S Navy deploys carrier groups on a regular basis throughout the globe for various drills and exercises. Just another example of Trump and his administration spinning fake/false and inaccurate events. And, is North Korea really a threat to the U.S ...????
18
What you see is what you get (WYSIWYG), with this arrogant, diabolical cabal, which has been foisted upon us all. Trump and his minions, in their nefarious old-boy’s club, are all about their personal, agendas, their egregious prejudices, their ugly rivalries; about power, and who, ultimately, wields it. And Trump has the biggest, longest red tie of them all, as he blithely bumbles along, ignoring our US Constitution, destroying America’s credibility around the world, and endangering us all.
18
The gang who couldn't shoot straight, except when aiming at their own toes, now displays its logistic expertise.
11
Either the current administration believes that revealing yourself to be a bluffer is an effective strategy or they genuinely don't know where their own naval vessels are. In either case, they are not going to induce fear in their enemies or the respect of their remaining allies.
16
Lacking know how, the Trump administration now demonstrates its lack of know where.
39
LIAR, LIAR, PANTS ON FIRE!!!!
14
Are there no Republican leaders out there who find this alarming???? If so, would love to see you start speaking up!
15
Ludicrous non-story. Trump never said how quickly the carrier would arrive nor should he reveal its stop off. The Times was similarly desperate to find something, anything, to attack Trump with during campaign and this led to monumental failure. Repeating the same mistake is just sad.
3
Oh please. Trump is a miserable failure and it appears the military isn't far behind him. They've been called heroes far too much, and they've started to believe it.
4
As opposed to, say, declaring China a currency manipulator, which he said he would do on day 1. And repealing Obamacare, also on day 1. Etc., etc.
3
OMG!! Is this scary, or what?? Our nuclear "armada" is rudderless. Our commander in chief seems unable to differentiate between Kim II-sung, Kim Jong-un and dim sum-warm. To the news he tomahawked Syria and not Iraq he responds, "oh yeah, right Syria. Pass that beautiful chocolate cake." Truly the Fareed Zakarrias of this world are engaged in a wildly radical redefinition of the word "presidential."
10
Its not fake news, it's embarrassing news.
15
These are the same tactics that DPRK have used for 70 plus years. In this case I like the deception
1
Thank you Mr Schmitt. Somehow I recall seeing your name on article after article that exposes the truth about this administration. Trump is an embarrassment beyond compare and a dangerous one at that due to his ignorance about foreign affairs. Come to think of it, he's just plain ignorant.
5
Korean missiles blow up on the launch pad.
US naval vessels move as fast as they can out of harms way.
At this rate, how are we ever going to annihilate ourselves?
US naval vessels move as fast as they can out of harms way.
At this rate, how are we ever going to annihilate ourselves?
4
It's plain and simple: Incompetence at a global scale.
7
It is still unclear who dropped the chemical weapon in Syria. Certainly everyone is more than capable of committing monstrous crimes. And everyone is more than capable of lying.
4
To Trump and Spicer no doubt Korea and Indonesia are near neighbors. (Actually they are as far apart as NY and SF.) They both have those yellow-skinned people, don't they?
9
Perhaps the military hierarchy in this country is becoming as corrupt and as learning impaired as the Trump administration. Mattis doesn't seem to be as adept and as good as all the hype that came with him. Maybe, at the end of the day, he's just self serving and plain greedy for attention, just like his boss Trump.
9
Like everything Trump does, it's wrong. SAD!
6
Let's walk this backwards. The Navy definitely knows exactly where every one of their ships are at all times - from massive carriers down to lowly minesweepers. What do you think the Pentagon uses all those satellites (capable of spotting individual humans anywhere on the planet), sophisticated global radio communications and GPS tracking for?
So while the top brass (McMaster, Mattis and Harris) were all telling the press a week ago that the USS Carl Vinson was "on its way" to the Sea of Japan - the rest of the Navy brass KNEW this was misleading at best and a lie at worst.
This sounds very much like Trump wanted to rattle a saber and his Secretary of Defense, National Security Adviser and Commander of the Pacific Fleet all humored Mr. Trump by going along with the story - while (either with explicit or tacit orders to the contrary) - the rest of the Navy brass kept the USS Carl Vinson's prior appointment with the Aussie Navy for a full week after Trump rattled the Vinson as a noisy saber.
The guy on the hot seat now is the Navy photographer who inadvertently publicized the Vinson's actual location yesterday to the civilian press. As JFK once allegedly said, "There's always some guy who doesn't get the memo."
Now the real questions are: Did Trump really think that the Vinson was steaming rapidly to Korean shores a week ago? Did Spicer believe this too (as he told the press)? Was the Navy engaged in "passive resistance" towards the C-in-C?
Inquiring minds want to know....
So while the top brass (McMaster, Mattis and Harris) were all telling the press a week ago that the USS Carl Vinson was "on its way" to the Sea of Japan - the rest of the Navy brass KNEW this was misleading at best and a lie at worst.
This sounds very much like Trump wanted to rattle a saber and his Secretary of Defense, National Security Adviser and Commander of the Pacific Fleet all humored Mr. Trump by going along with the story - while (either with explicit or tacit orders to the contrary) - the rest of the Navy brass kept the USS Carl Vinson's prior appointment with the Aussie Navy for a full week after Trump rattled the Vinson as a noisy saber.
The guy on the hot seat now is the Navy photographer who inadvertently publicized the Vinson's actual location yesterday to the civilian press. As JFK once allegedly said, "There's always some guy who doesn't get the memo."
Now the real questions are: Did Trump really think that the Vinson was steaming rapidly to Korean shores a week ago? Did Spicer believe this too (as he told the press)? Was the Navy engaged in "passive resistance" towards the C-in-C?
Inquiring minds want to know....
13
Well, McMaster did state very positively on the Brian Williams Show last weekend that we would NOT primitively strike NK. So, that wasn't a lie, because we didn't have any ships in place to do it with.
Just another lie from the lying liar in the WH and his minions.
9
Perhaps there is a squadron of United Airlines jets we could send in lieu of the Carl Vinson?
16
Iron Man. I vote we send Iron Man.
2
Geneva Convention prohibits that.
4
@Daveindiego
What? Yanking old men forcibly from their passenger seats? Didn't know that...
What? Yanking old men forcibly from their passenger seats? Didn't know that...
1
This "bluff" could have sent kim, or any one of his soldiers over the edge and/or the rising tensions could have easily resulted in a tension induced mistake. A soldier on the dmz could have made one due to hyper-vigilance or Kim could have made one due to being backed into a corner.
The fact is: the american government just played chicken with the lives of 25 million citizens of Seoul. No matter how much spin you put on it - that is not prudent.
In the recent past NK has sunk a south korean navy ship and sent artillery shells over the border.... Something like that, or a soldier on the dmz firing a shot, could have easily sent this over the edge. And in that case: American military hardware and soldiers WOULD NOT be available to counter attack as advertised.
How are people to take America serious in the future when unintentional gaffes or bluffs like this happen?
Like many of Trumps moves in the past almost 100 days -- this sets a dangerous precedent.
The fact is: the american government just played chicken with the lives of 25 million citizens of Seoul. No matter how much spin you put on it - that is not prudent.
In the recent past NK has sunk a south korean navy ship and sent artillery shells over the border.... Something like that, or a soldier on the dmz firing a shot, could have easily sent this over the edge. And in that case: American military hardware and soldiers WOULD NOT be available to counter attack as advertised.
How are people to take America serious in the future when unintentional gaffes or bluffs like this happen?
Like many of Trumps moves in the past almost 100 days -- this sets a dangerous precedent.
23
I think it's called a bluff. Trump bluffed.
@Ron
No, it's called a whiff. He swung his custom-made, gold plated big bertha and missed the ball on the tee entirely. He tweeted he hit a hole in one and called for another slice of chocolate cake. But I applaud your optimism.
No, it's called a whiff. He swung his custom-made, gold plated big bertha and missed the ball on the tee entirely. He tweeted he hit a hole in one and called for another slice of chocolate cake. But I applaud your optimism.
8
I agree, Trump bluffed his way into the Presidency.
5
Classic. If my classroom of high school juniors behaved as foolishly as this administration has, I, as their English teacher would expect to be fired. Oops, but there's no teacher or Democrat to blame...instead the ineptitude merely continues to astonish. And as for Mr. Trump? Oh yes, it's still full speed ahead. What a debacle.
10
Please Resign.... Get out Please Get Out.....
30
.. and take your family with you.
1
Maybe at first they just didn't know where the Korean Peninsula is located. Thankfully, it is now found and the USS Carl Vinson can go "full steam ahead" in that direction.
10
Bewilderment among government officials is not a reaction that inspires confidence in the United States Commander in Chief. We need a competent leader in the Oval Office.
11
Get ready for President Ryan. He may be here soon.
They voted for a fool, now we pay for their gullibility.
11
Keystone cops, everyone of them. I am so tired of hearing pundits say we're okay because of Mattis, McMaster and Kelly. I don't feel okay. When you purge any bureaucrat who worked under the previous administration (and many other past administrations as well), you lose the know how of all those people with history in the various departments. The Republicans have worked very hard since Reagan to make many Americans think government is bad. Well folks, a working gov't is necessary and we used to have one. For years Republican pols have attacked government workers and government programs. Funny thing though. Our gov't and those programs benefit Republicans too. Sadly, many of their voters don't seem to know that Medicare, Medicaid and even their state run ACA market places are GOVERNMENT PROGRAMS. Republicans can't govern. They have one message: lowering taxes on the wealthy. Oh yes, and telling women what they can do with their bodies.
26
President Trump to go to The United Nations.
2
Since the earth is a sphere Trump could argue that the aircraft carrier was headed for Korea, but the long way. I know this is a stupid argument, but let's not forget, Trump is stupid.
11
ridiculous!
3
Who knew overseeing a huge national defense apparatus was so complicated?
10
If North Korea's missile launch had been a success while the US aircraft carrier was "scuttling to safety" what a propaganda coup that would have been for North Korea.
5
Thanks Defense Dept for saving us by going along with Trump fake news, fake war talk. Detour his other crazy commands please!
4
It's 10 PM, do you know what the truth is?
Apparently someone knew where they were going and told someone.
Rear Admiral Jim Kilby wrote Carl Vinson family members on 4/12 that the carrier was heading toward Korean waters.
https://www.facebook.com/pg/CSGONE/posts/
From Carrier Strike Group 1
April 12 at 5:47am ·
CSG-1 Families and Loved Ones,
“I want to start by thanking you for your continued support of our Sailors as we continue on our deployment and thank you for all you do while we are out to sea...As being a flexible force for our nation’s leaders, we answer the call when directed. The world has a vote of where we go and what we do. We received direction to provide presence in the Waters off the Korean Peninsula as a demonstration of our flexibility, capability and dedication to our Indo-Asia-Pacific partners...
Rear Admiral Jim Kilby
Commander, Carrier Strike Group One #WESTPAC2017
The 5th and 6th fleet have facebook pages. I'm sure the other commands have them too. I just haven't looked for them yet.
Apparently someone knew where they were going and told someone.
Rear Admiral Jim Kilby wrote Carl Vinson family members on 4/12 that the carrier was heading toward Korean waters.
https://www.facebook.com/pg/CSGONE/posts/
From Carrier Strike Group 1
April 12 at 5:47am ·
CSG-1 Families and Loved Ones,
“I want to start by thanking you for your continued support of our Sailors as we continue on our deployment and thank you for all you do while we are out to sea...As being a flexible force for our nation’s leaders, we answer the call when directed. The world has a vote of where we go and what we do. We received direction to provide presence in the Waters off the Korean Peninsula as a demonstration of our flexibility, capability and dedication to our Indo-Asia-Pacific partners...
Rear Admiral Jim Kilby
Commander, Carrier Strike Group One #WESTPAC2017
The 5th and 6th fleet have facebook pages. I'm sure the other commands have them too. I just haven't looked for them yet.
6
No one ( except Fox News ) will believe Trump if he tells the world that Washington D.C. is located in the U,S. And while we are waiting to learn the truth or lie another country will invade and take over or trash Wall Street. How stupid can Trump be. And how stupid can the news media be.
6
What fools. What utterly irrational fools we have running the ship (?) of state.
7
Calm down folks. This is just Trump demonstrating his unpredictability. Keeps our adversaries laughing too hard to defend themselves!
18
North Korea (and the rest of the civilized world) are currently incapacitated, not from bombs, gas, or bullets, but from side-splitting, snort inducing laughter. The only thing more troubling than steaming off in the wrong direction is that no major news station is covering it.
10
So the Trump administration is either massively incompetent or they are deliberately lying to the American people. It seems highly likely that Russia and China knew the truth, and therefore knew that the Trump administration is incompetent or was lying. It's hard to see how this is going to make any country respect or fear the U.S.
18
So what happened to the Russian and Chinese warships that were supposedly tailing the USS Vinson task group In the South China Sea? I reckon they must be rockin' in the dry dock in Vladivostok.
14
I suspect they're still tailing ... and laughing.
5
All the serious stuff aside, a big shout out to the authors and/or editors; those two lead-in bullet points are truly one for the ages! In a mere 38 words, absolutely everything that can be said about this administration is being said, and then some. First time ever since Nov 8th that a succinct write-up of all the lying actually brought a big smile to my face. Now, back to the daily worry of where to hide with this so-called commander in chief who couldn't command a water pistol if his life depended on it.
18
So there is no clear chain of communication between the president and our nuclear armed security assets, what is the worst that can happen?
Or did the president know the fleet was steaming in the opposite direction, but make his bluff anyway because of the timing of the Korean festivities and Pence's visit?
Either way I can't see how that is an effective long term strategy, jettisoning your own integrity.
Or did the president know the fleet was steaming in the opposite direction, but make his bluff anyway because of the timing of the Korean festivities and Pence's visit?
Either way I can't see how that is an effective long term strategy, jettisoning your own integrity.
14
The Wh, DOD and Navy may have screwed up however, NK blinked. The threat of a nuclear test did not materialize and NK only put on the same lame military parade it does every year. That is valuable intel.
We will know in a short while if it was a screw up or a high stakes poker bluff. If heads start to roll in DOD or the Navy, it was a screw up. if not, a bluff. Time will tell.
We will know in a short while if it was a screw up or a high stakes poker bluff. If heads start to roll in DOD or the Navy, it was a screw up. if not, a bluff. Time will tell.
1
This is a high crime and misdemeanor.
18
So Trump boards Air Force One in DC and says to the pilot, "Take me to that place below Georgia, you know, that finger-looking thingy to the right of the Atlantic Ocean. Fly low when you get to the palm trees, and when you seen the golden castle, we're there."
7
Reported also was that 150,000 Chinese troops were massing on the NKorean border and that Russians were moving missiles to their NK border. Some of that may have been hoax on the NKs, too. That kind of hoax won't work very many times.
What really needs to happen is China has to realize that the USA will find ways to prick China if their businesses don't follow through on sanctions. Already, China doesn't like the defensive missiles being put up in SKorea....more unpleasantness towards China is needed not because we want to offend them but because they have been reluctant to take care of business on their own doorstep. Make no mistake about it: NKorea wants to invade and conquer SKorea. That hegemonic interest is horrific. Will it take another 30-50 y for NK to collapse and for SKorea to extend largess like WGermany did to EGermany?
What really needs to happen is China has to realize that the USA will find ways to prick China if their businesses don't follow through on sanctions. Already, China doesn't like the defensive missiles being put up in SKorea....more unpleasantness towards China is needed not because we want to offend them but because they have been reluctant to take care of business on their own doorstep. Make no mistake about it: NKorea wants to invade and conquer SKorea. That hegemonic interest is horrific. Will it take another 30-50 y for NK to collapse and for SKorea to extend largess like WGermany did to EGermany?
2
Intelligence agencies worldwide probably figured this out long ago, and it may be a coded signal to intelligence analysts, just as was North Korea's sale of an excess isotope. Remember, the Syrian strike and temporary travel ban were planned in secrecy. An outward appearance of incompetence and strategic use of the Information Age in defense indicate the news is not always what reporters believe or how they've been played.
1
While it is certainly true that "Loose Presidents Sink Nations", it would be nice if the media actually went out and covered events, instead of just "re-blabbing" government press releases.
7
MAD Mutually Assured Destruction. Isn't that what we should be worried about? Our government, our newspapers and media are run by cruel morons who want to end life on earth.
2
The gang that couldn't shoot straight strikes again.
14
Oh noes! The Deep State has thwarted our Commander In Chief from Making America Great Again, by redirecting our Righteous MIght. Still, Australia is on Trump's Bad List, so maybe there will be a happy ending and we'll be able to blow something up after all!
8
We do a pretty good show of shooting ourselves in the foot, so no worries cobber.
2
Imagine a major newspaper of a country deliberately naming their own country in the third person in an article like as if they do business elsewhere are so arrogant that they owe no country, society or people any allegiance at all? And then in the same article outlining how the country that they exist in apparently contradicts itself in military/political strategy? And lastly just because the ships are sailing in the opposite as the supposed proper one does not mean that there is no strategy in hand. Nothing is obvious in war. This is not 1812.
1
No newspaper owes unquestioning allegiance to anything but the truth. I for one appreciate that the Times does not use "we had a carrier group" but uses "the United States had a carrier group" It has an international audience and, like it or not, the USA is not the center of everyones world.
4
I am not surprised . This administration does not have any order , discipline or organization , and it comes from the top .
Meanwhile , our President is deliberating on whether or not we will go to a thermonuclear war in between golf rounds at Mar A Lago . Unreal .
I for one am TIRED of paying for his weekend getaways that are costing the American taxpayer 3.6 Million dollars a shot . Give me a break .
Mr President , stay in your house which is the White House and be a President . Sadly , you look like a fool .
Meanwhile , our President is deliberating on whether or not we will go to a thermonuclear war in between golf rounds at Mar A Lago . Unreal .
I for one am TIRED of paying for his weekend getaways that are costing the American taxpayer 3.6 Million dollars a shot . Give me a break .
Mr President , stay in your house which is the White House and be a President . Sadly , you look like a fool .
17
Madness. We were lied to about an important issue.
Overt and intentional.
Overt and intentional.
8
No, no, no. What makes it scary is that the lies were UNintentional -- the result of ineptitude, not diabolical scheming.. In the world of King Clown, there is no madness -- only stupidity.
3
Right..? So "Fake news" is ok if he spout's off or embellished it..? Geezus....! Lol
No John, we received at least three explanations from Trump's people restating the original Trump lie. It was all intentional.
This man is going to kill us all, or al least millions of us. He will destroy the environment, let financial companies steal as much as they can, doesn't realize the difference between Trump Enterprises and the US Government and loves to drop bombe, either in Iraq or Syria, he couldn't remember which one. Ummmm, cake. Strikes a "deal" with the Chinese that just happens to include 3 patents in China for Ivanka's products, doesn't know whetertyo salute or wrap his arms, Mussolini syle, while the Star Spangled banner is played and says he has financial interests in Turkey so calls to congratulate a dictator on consolidating power and eliminatine the free press.
And where are the Republicans of the United States os America?
They are down on 5th Ave. watching him shoot someone in the head while carrying a syuitcase full of blood tinged money from the Russian mob and saying, "I'll vote for this guy."
Good God, there is a monster in the White House and this Great Contry, with it's great Constitution and it's great people can't stop him?
Remember when those of us in the 50's and 60's and 70's, et al, said, in utter amazement,
"How could a man like Hitler come to such enormous power?"
Watch this space.
And where are the Republicans of the United States os America?
They are down on 5th Ave. watching him shoot someone in the head while carrying a syuitcase full of blood tinged money from the Russian mob and saying, "I'll vote for this guy."
Good God, there is a monster in the White House and this Great Contry, with it's great Constitution and it's great people can't stop him?
Remember when those of us in the 50's and 60's and 70's, et al, said, in utter amazement,
"How could a man like Hitler come to such enormous power?"
Watch this space.
14
Setting aside which direction the Carl Vinson is heading, Trump may have shown he's capable of strategic thinking if -- as appears -- his otherwise ineffectual missile strike on Syria was really intended to induce China to rein in North Korea. China reportedly did, and Kim appears to be worried.
If Hillary Clinton were President, we'd probably be more deeply embroiled in the Syria war right now, but she wouldn't have "linked" any US attack on Syria to a threat to NK. We'd just be pouring billions of dollars, and the lives of numerous young Americans, into Syria because Hillary vowed to impose a "no fly zone" over the whole country. ISIS would be thrilled, of course, since it has no planes, and Kim would just have kept doing whatever he was doing in NK. Maybe Clinton would have backed down, in which case she and we would look weak, or maybe not, in which case we might be shooting down Russian planes right now. Either result would be terrible.
How Clinton got depicted as the more peace-loving of the two candidates utterly escapes me. She's been a loose cannon war-mongerer for as long as I can remember. I'm glad she's finally, finally out of the picture.
If Hillary Clinton were President, we'd probably be more deeply embroiled in the Syria war right now, but she wouldn't have "linked" any US attack on Syria to a threat to NK. We'd just be pouring billions of dollars, and the lives of numerous young Americans, into Syria because Hillary vowed to impose a "no fly zone" over the whole country. ISIS would be thrilled, of course, since it has no planes, and Kim would just have kept doing whatever he was doing in NK. Maybe Clinton would have backed down, in which case she and we would look weak, or maybe not, in which case we might be shooting down Russian planes right now. Either result would be terrible.
How Clinton got depicted as the more peace-loving of the two candidates utterly escapes me. She's been a loose cannon war-mongerer for as long as I can remember. I'm glad she's finally, finally out of the picture.
3
Hillary lost. What is the possible point of your rant?
Trump is President, it's all on him now. You can't go back.
Trump is President, it's all on him now. You can't go back.
10
How you can turn this terrifying turn of events into more vapid whining about Hillary utterly escapes me. Trump just gratuitously baited a crazy dictator and casually rolled the dice on 50 million lives. If that's not a loose-cannon war mongerer I don't know what is.
2
In case you hadn't noticed, it's now April 2017 and the election of 2016 is over.
How about that clip of Melania having to jab her elbow into Trump's side yesterday because he forgot to put his hand over his heart when the Pledge of Allegiance began?
A clueless, crass rich man who is absolutely bereft of any traditional American values and customs. And to think he held himself out as a man who could represent the working class, trying to prove it by munching on KFC and other fast-food garbage.
A clueless, crass rich man who is absolutely bereft of any traditional American values and customs. And to think he held himself out as a man who could represent the working class, trying to prove it by munching on KFC and other fast-food garbage.
26
Wow I can remember Fox News calling Obama incompetent for weeks on end. I am curious to know how Fox will describe this. Deep Strategy? This is what you get when you elect a Con Man. Perhaps this is a sign of His genius that Trumps often mentioned.
Ins't incompetence like this worthy of an Congressional Investigation. Benghazi is dwarfed by this foolishness. He called Clinton incompetent, well she never lost an air craft carrier for a week.
Ins't incompetence like this worthy of an Congressional Investigation. Benghazi is dwarfed by this foolishness. He called Clinton incompetent, well she never lost an air craft carrier for a week.
14
Nor were missiles flying towards Iraq as Trump ate cake with Xi Jinping, folks in NJ cheering the collapse of the twin towers on 9-11, or Putin going into Ukraine, just some of the nonsense Trump has spouted on the campaign trail and as President. It is difficult to imagine a greater ignoramus or someone less fit to be President of the U.S.
24
I think this is the kind of bluff that goes on, on daily basis, in Trump's business world, and Trump thought he'd use the same tactic. It's intentionally done to give yourself better leverage in poker, and in business negotiations. Little did Trump know that the government doesn't work the way he thought it did. There's scrutiny, and accountability in everything he does, which is something Trump and his entire team are not used to. It is another reason why he and his admin are in support of less transparency, and more "privacy." Expect more failures of this sort from Trump and his team because that was how they operated.
9
Sadly our current government is a gang of idiots bumbling and fumbling their way through the day as if they were managing an Atlantic City Casino. Exactly what can be expected of wealthy heirs who have never actually done anything, studied anything or had to fight for anything. God help us.
14
"It is possible that the implied threat dissuaded the North Koreans from an even more provocative action, like a nuclear test."
Or it might just as easily triggered the destruction of Tokyo, Seoul, US military bases in SE Asia, all within reach of N. Korea's current firepower. This is David v. Goliath. David "wins" by acting first because there's nothing to lose once it looks like Goliath is stirring.
N. Korea knows it faces annihilation if Trump attacks. If that seems imminent -- in this case by mistake -- it goes down taking all it can with it. That's 27 million+ Japanese in Metro Tokyo, 26 million in Metro Seoul, and 70,000 US military personnel. The unknowns are N. Korea submarines off the West Coast and Hawaii, suggested by the increase of P-3 Orion sub patrols in recent weeks.
This isn't just two twitchy adversaries in a staredown waiting to see who blinks first. This is a total mismatch where one side knows it can't win so it's taken hostages to make the giant think twice.
Negotiating for hostages isn't like a showdown at OK Corral. Firepower doesn't determine the outcome.
Now a complicated hostage scenario has an intervening variable: the negotiator has no experience and isn't much of a thinker but more a bumbling, clumsy oaf who talks tough while playing golf and eating chocolate cake.
A zero to Nero who wouldn't know a tripwire while doing a faceplant tripping over one. And thinks a body count is the occupancy rate at his hotels.
Are we having fun yet?
Or it might just as easily triggered the destruction of Tokyo, Seoul, US military bases in SE Asia, all within reach of N. Korea's current firepower. This is David v. Goliath. David "wins" by acting first because there's nothing to lose once it looks like Goliath is stirring.
N. Korea knows it faces annihilation if Trump attacks. If that seems imminent -- in this case by mistake -- it goes down taking all it can with it. That's 27 million+ Japanese in Metro Tokyo, 26 million in Metro Seoul, and 70,000 US military personnel. The unknowns are N. Korea submarines off the West Coast and Hawaii, suggested by the increase of P-3 Orion sub patrols in recent weeks.
This isn't just two twitchy adversaries in a staredown waiting to see who blinks first. This is a total mismatch where one side knows it can't win so it's taken hostages to make the giant think twice.
Negotiating for hostages isn't like a showdown at OK Corral. Firepower doesn't determine the outcome.
Now a complicated hostage scenario has an intervening variable: the negotiator has no experience and isn't much of a thinker but more a bumbling, clumsy oaf who talks tough while playing golf and eating chocolate cake.
A zero to Nero who wouldn't know a tripwire while doing a faceplant tripping over one. And thinks a body count is the occupancy rate at his hotels.
Are we having fun yet?
10
Trump will say that this all worked to his benefit; North Korea did not do the test and things have supposedly settled down. My concern is this, did Trump think the Carl Vinson was actually headed to North Korea? Was he actually misinformed? It's one thing to use chaos theory as a strategy but another entirely to live in chaos. My bet is the latter, and that scares the he'll out of me.
10
I just pray Trump doesn't start playing with nuclear missiles the way he plays with his aircraft carriers.
6
It's like a 10yr old that just got his first GiJoes and army men, the man is scary.
4
Keystone cops strike again. This is no point in saying that you are sending the Vinson to Korea when you are not.
4
Well, it was "in the general vicinity at the time", right?
2
You're suggesting the Whitehouse dabbling in 'fake news"? Heaven forbid!
7
This is not just trump and truth-slayer spicer. Those two generals that were supposed to be the adults, save the world from trump's incompetence....they lied. When asked why we were told about the carrier heading to N. Korea instead of keeping it secret Mattis said: we cancelled its involvement in an exercise so we had to give an explanation...all a big fat LIE. And Kelly....same lie. So, we can't trust trump and the White House and now we cannot trust the generals either. Any doubt bombs in Syria and the "mother of all bombs" in Afghanistan weren't publicity stunts!
10
It must have been a fake aircraft carrier sent by the fake president as part of his administration's non-existent foreign policy. As he always says, "sad."
6
Shouldn't we keep N. Korea in suspense? or should we tell them out next move?
2
@mccary
How about the US Navy fleet command? Think they should know where they're supposedly headed?
How about the US Navy fleet command? Think they should know where they're supposedly headed?
1
It's sort of like when Queen Victoria ordered the British navy to shell the coast of land-locked Paraguay.
5
Any Man who is familiar with the street, never makes a threat he can't back up. No maybe about it, any move against Kim Jong In would guarantee Seoul (121) mi away, and Tokyo 799 mi out, would be scorched Earth as would be the 10's of thousands of American troops in those vicinities.------of course the US would then take out Kim's entire regime, but it would be to late for our troops. The USA flexing muscles and sabre rattling is a joke, the US is a global laughing stock. This N. Korea problem could only be resolved at a negotiating table; not with China, but with N. Korea & the US in a face to face meeting on coming to an amicable resolution that satisfies both parties.
6
Was this fake news or a brilliant Trojan Horse by Trump, designed to get inside N. Korea's collective head? Or was it just more trash talk? Newspapers around the world announce where the Vinson is presumably headed, but - GASP!!! - the defense satellites aren't SHOWING what the media is reporting. Of course, the world was led to believe Iraq had WMD' s, and a costly war ensued. Does anyone trust anything anymore?
6
Once again this administration's words bite them in the rear. They need to follow Will Roger's advice ... "Never miss a good chance to shut up".
9
Wait... what? You mean that carrier we re-directed up the Korean Peninsula wasn't actually going in that direction? There would have to be hundreds, if not thousands of people involved back in DC with the carrier's movement, and most of those people would also have been aware of the public statement about it's supposed direction of NK. How did that not get corrected? This might not have been Trump's fault at all (or maybe he was involved?), but it doesn't help him look like any less amateurish. This isn't like a rogue Sub or Destroyer, this is an Aircraft Carrier. They don't move lightly.
7
Impeach him now!!!
14
The Commander in Chief did not know where his military was...
11
The "Libs" just don't understand President Trump's strategy. See, here is how it works. President Trump acts in the clear knowledge that he doesn't know what he's doing. If he doesn't know what he's doing, his thinking is that no one else will either, especially America's enemies. Someone who behaves erratically and irrationally is difficult to read. Why anything could happen! It's a lot like trying to predict which way a drunk driver will swerve or or what they might hit. It's anybody's guess!
6
"The "Libs" just don't understand President Trump's strategy."
So being a fool is a ruse to throw our adversaries off their game. . .hmm, then that explains why Melania had to prompt Donald at the Easter egg roll hunt, to pledge allegiance to our flag.
https://youtu.be/-NLIhVs57OE
So being a fool is a ruse to throw our adversaries off their game. . .hmm, then that explains why Melania had to prompt Donald at the Easter egg roll hunt, to pledge allegiance to our flag.
https://youtu.be/-NLIhVs57OE
2
All you need in this life is ignorance and confidence, and then success is sure.
- Mark Twain
- Mark Twain
2
An Aircraft carrier battle group not where it should be?
Maybe one can misplace their wallet or keys, but a battle group with enough nuclear power to destroy mankind, .... and nobody seems to give a dam?
We are in deep trouble.
Maybe one can misplace their wallet or keys, but a battle group with enough nuclear power to destroy mankind, .... and nobody seems to give a dam?
We are in deep trouble.
8
Chinese military satellites continuously track our ships.
So do the Russians.
They knew the truth, while our own leadership didn't.
This is dangerous.
So do the Russians.
They knew the truth, while our own leadership didn't.
This is dangerous.
14
The whole world is laughing?
Sneering? Smirking?
Life imitating farce?
Saturday Night Live I stopped watching the night that Trump was a guest but ... I'd like to see what Lorne/Baldwin does with this one.
I'm waiting for millions of "I-told-you-so" showing up on Facebook.
Sneering? Smirking?
Life imitating farce?
Saturday Night Live I stopped watching the night that Trump was a guest but ... I'd like to see what Lorne/Baldwin does with this one.
I'm waiting for millions of "I-told-you-so" showing up on Facebook.
4
It appears that this is indeed our circus and these are our monkeys.
12
"Nobody knew that geography could be so complicated."
20
Keystone Cops, except we are all in danger.
9
Loose lips sink ships. Old Navy saying. No one needs to know. Especially the enemy. It's called the element of surprise. Ship movement and next location is secret information, too bad the media is a security risk.
If a bunch of reporters could tell by looking at a photo where the ship was, don't you think the North Koreans, Chinese, Russians, and any country with a semi-competent foreign ministry/intelligence service could also?
9
Given the amount of satellites orbiting the earth these days, it is pretty hard to hide an aircraft carrier in the ocean. This is why they have submarines
7
Hilarious.
The Presidential administration doesn't know the difference between North and South.
But you can bet your boots that the governments o Russia, the DPRKorea, the RoKorea, the PR of China, and Japan knew exactly where the USS Carl Vinson and accompanying escorts knew exactly what their course was.
No excuses are acceptable.
The Presidential administration doesn't know the difference between North and South.
But you can bet your boots that the governments o Russia, the DPRKorea, the RoKorea, the PR of China, and Japan knew exactly where the USS Carl Vinson and accompanying escorts knew exactly what their course was.
No excuses are acceptable.
15
A jeering Candidate Trump and a crowing President-elect Trump spoke of recent administrations as "people who didn't know what they were doing". A menacing President Trump continued to insult those people in his inaugural address.
So his predecessors "didn't know what they were doing"! Of all the foolish ways to set himself up for humiliation. This babe in the woods of government, this paragon of incompetence. But of course he doubled down with the declaration, "No one knows the system better than me, which is why I alone can fix it."
What Donald Trump has given us in his first 100 days has been a kind of political theater that almost defies naming. Grand Guignol? Burlesque? And the more he shows himself to be pathetically out of his depth in government, as he was in business and in New York society, the more he doubles down with brave talk.
Or, as Sam Spade growled, "The cheaper the crook, the gaudier the patter."
http://thefamilyproperty.blogspot.jp/
So his predecessors "didn't know what they were doing"! Of all the foolish ways to set himself up for humiliation. This babe in the woods of government, this paragon of incompetence. But of course he doubled down with the declaration, "No one knows the system better than me, which is why I alone can fix it."
What Donald Trump has given us in his first 100 days has been a kind of political theater that almost defies naming. Grand Guignol? Burlesque? And the more he shows himself to be pathetically out of his depth in government, as he was in business and in New York society, the more he doubles down with brave talk.
Or, as Sam Spade growled, "The cheaper the crook, the gaudier the patter."
http://thefamilyproperty.blogspot.jp/
20
Given the fact that Mr. Toad, the erratic, unrestrained narcissist, is thrashing around in the White House, I've stocked up with tincture of Iodine in the interest of mitigating body uptake of Strontium-90.
6
naw, you're way better off stocking up on pills to give yourself an easy exit when he messes up. extending your suffering by fighting radiation poisoning isn't going to look like an attractive option. that's the real reason states are stocking up on execution drugs, because the state executives know they might want them.
2
Actually, I think what you need is potassium iodide pills, not tincture of iodine. Since I live in the Hudson Valley I keep a stock of potassium iodide pills at the ready for when Indian Point Nuclear Power plant goes Fukushima. Not if, when.
1
Now, this is embarrassing. Since the advent of spell check, the only mistake I have made is misstating "Strontium 90" when I meant to say "Iodine 131".
Thank you for the potassium iodide correction.
Thank you for the potassium iodide correction.
The absolute worst.
Can someone in the government hold this man responsible for something-anything?
The longest most tumultuous 144,000 minutes I have ever endured.
Can someone in the government hold this man responsible for something-anything?
The longest most tumultuous 144,000 minutes I have ever endured.
13
the founding fathers' pessimism failed badly when considering what future voters might do. so they never engineered an escape hatch for plain gross incompetence and malfeasance, not leading to impeachment-worthy crimes.
4
In public, we Americans must speak in measured tones about the blundering stupidity and incompetence of this "so-called President," lest we sound unpatriotic. Meanwhile, the rest of the world is unrestrained by such etiquette. People are repulsed -- or laughing their heads off -- as they watch a once-great country implode. We are still, for the moment, the world's largest economy and pre-eminent global power but we officially have our heads in the sand about climate change, we're destroying 200+ years of international goodwill, we're playing nuclear brinksmanship with a dictator who's got nothing to lose, and, at home, we're watching as this dangerous blowhard dismantles the entire public service sector of our precious people's government. We've got to get rid of him, and while we're at it, dump his Republican enablers in Congress. Let's hope Jon Ossoff is the first step in that direction.
15
@I Remember America
Sorry, but we rank number two now on Economy Size China number one based on purchasing power index, but doing well on a per capita basis. Our problems predate the Trump.
To see the world as it is better try Easternization: Asia's Rise and America's Decline From Obama to Trump and Beyond by Gideon Rachman.
Sorry, but we rank number two now on Economy Size China number one based on purchasing power index, but doing well on a per capita basis. Our problems predate the Trump.
To see the world as it is better try Easternization: Asia's Rise and America's Decline From Obama to Trump and Beyond by Gideon Rachman.
1
"Our problems predate the Trump..." to me smacks of the line we heard before the election, that there was no real difference between him and Hillary. Now it sounds like you're conflating Trump with Obama. Correct me if I’m wrong. Trump is a clear and present danger to our very existence, starting with those reasons I mentioned in my comment. Obama may have been too weak and conciliatory but in no way was he malevolent, as this criminal idiot is. Your man Rachman supported Obama twice. Nor was the zero-sum rise of the East wholly inevitable. The years from, say, Reagan's inaugural, saw the calculated hijacking and dismantling of American government by the oligarchs, and their sell-off of American jobs to China and the East. We could have replaced those jobs with high-tech, climate change-mitigating technology, but they pointedly refused that obvious, life-saving choice, and still are. Point being that getting rid of Trump and the Republicans is essential at this point if we are to rejoin the world, as much as possible. Muddying the water with suggestions that it’s the same as ever was, is decidedly unhelpful, and I would counter is not “see[ing] the world as it is.”
This is a bad Marx Brothers movie. Trump can't figure out which way the ship is going? And by the way, President Moron, look up the word "armada." It means more than one ship.
11
Easy to understand really, Geographer once commented that Americans are weak on geography; we go to War to learn place names. True enough but so hope Trump and his crowd get booked up soon enough not to follow through on that thought.
4
Trump is the Inspector Clouseau of International Diplomacy. But rather than bungling an investigation into a jewel heist, he will be responsible for a global conflagaration.
I can't believe the Times' indignation that it wasn't provided with accurate information on the location and planned track of the Vinson. Rest assured DOD, the White House and the skipper of the Vinson know precisely where the carrier is and where it is heading. Has the Times considered that it might have been fed deceptive information? Generally when there is a chance of combat you don't want to advertise your location and intended tactics..
The Times should get a life. North Korea poses an imminent nuclear threat to South Korea and US territories (Guam) as well as Hawaii and possibly the West Coast. Trump is first president to develop a working relationship with China to defang Kim. It is time to stop bashing Trump.
The Times should get a life. North Korea poses an imminent nuclear threat to South Korea and US territories (Guam) as well as Hawaii and possibly the West Coast. Trump is first president to develop a working relationship with China to defang Kim. It is time to stop bashing Trump.
2
This is a horrible excuse for this mishap. Our adversaries clearly keep track of our carriers via satellite and I am sure they all along knew where it was going. Trump didn't fool any of them. He just simply had no idea and he lied to us, Americans. The idea that this was an intentional strategic move is just false. Straight from Spicey's spin school. Scary thing is many of my countrymen (like Crosby Boyd here) are buying this!
And no one in the world can use a satellite to see where it actually is at every minute, right? You must be reading trump's mind: "Hee, hee! This will fool them; they'll never figure out it isn't really going that way."
@Crosby Boyd
(Credit to Visitor Tau Ceti plus the 3 not included
Laos, Serbia/Yugoslavia, Yemen)
Countries North Korea has attacked since 1950:
South Korea
Countries The United States has attacked since 1950:
North Korea
Cuba
North Vietnam
Cambodia
Dominican Republic
Zaire
Lebanon
Grenada
Libya
Panama
Iraq
Somalia
Bosnia/Yugoslavia
Afghanistan
Iraq (again)
Libya (again)
Syria
Which country is the dangerous aggressor again?
(Credit to Visitor Tau Ceti plus the 3 not included
Laos, Serbia/Yugoslavia, Yemen)
Countries North Korea has attacked since 1950:
South Korea
Countries The United States has attacked since 1950:
North Korea
Cuba
North Vietnam
Cambodia
Dominican Republic
Zaire
Lebanon
Grenada
Libya
Panama
Iraq
Somalia
Bosnia/Yugoslavia
Afghanistan
Iraq (again)
Libya (again)
Syria
Which country is the dangerous aggressor again?
3
We're all going to die.
17
Yes, we are.
5
Remember the Pueblo?
Sigh. Probably not.
Remember Pearl Harbor?
A few more mistakes like this and we'll have a disaster that will double the losses we suffered at Pearl Harbor (I feel entitled to say this since I lost an uncle on the Arizona). Even now, after all these years, the historians can't agree on who to blame for that disaster. Can you imagine what would happen if we lost the Vinson carrier group because some idiot in the White House or Pentagon or Pearl Harbor didn't get their donalds in a row? The lights should be on late tonight in the White House and the Pentagon, but I bet they aren't. This time the the blame gamers are beating the take responsibility-ers badly. So sad. Another night of Amateur Night at the White House. Simon would be so proud. So sad.
Sigh. Probably not.
Remember Pearl Harbor?
A few more mistakes like this and we'll have a disaster that will double the losses we suffered at Pearl Harbor (I feel entitled to say this since I lost an uncle on the Arizona). Even now, after all these years, the historians can't agree on who to blame for that disaster. Can you imagine what would happen if we lost the Vinson carrier group because some idiot in the White House or Pentagon or Pearl Harbor didn't get their donalds in a row? The lights should be on late tonight in the White House and the Pentagon, but I bet they aren't. This time the the blame gamers are beating the take responsibility-ers badly. So sad. Another night of Amateur Night at the White House. Simon would be so proud. So sad.
8
Why would the lights be on at the White House when everyone spends more time in Florida?
For most p, the WH is the most prestigious residence they will ever occupy. For the current office holder its where he goes for photo ops.
For most p, the WH is the most prestigious residence they will ever occupy. For the current office holder its where he goes for photo ops.
3
To repeat an apropo NYT quote from a previous article attributing it to an Iranian poet, "Empty words disgrace the one who speaks them like the serving of a walnut shell without the nut".
9
We have an inept man/child with a personality disorder in charge of the world's largest military and nuclear capabilities.
How the millions who voted for him did nor see the danger of this is beyond me. We are in very treacherous waters...
How the millions who voted for him did nor see the danger of this is beyond me. We are in very treacherous waters...
27
Perhaps the choices offered were not that great, few voted and many voted against. It is a form of a weakened democracy.
Obviously a clever ploy by the administration to confuse a would be adversary; in fact one might say all the gaffs and stupid mistakes of this administration since taking office are a calculated plan to spook the nations of the civilized world into wondering what our next move will be. I know it's having that result on me.
There is an alt explanation to all this. In a diabolically brilliant move to shake up the North Koreans, Trump's crack communications team must have sent them a secret memo that the Vinson had a Klingon cloaking device.
5
Watch......Trump will end up blaming Captain "Wrong Way" Corrigan.
More fake news from the White House. The only thing muscular about this white house is the length of its nose, pinocchhio style.
7