Trump did not dodge taxes. He simply filed taxes according to the law. This man did nothing illegal. He took a huge loss and then made an amazing comeback, and we Americans love a comeback. Trump is not a traditional Republican candidate. Michael Moore stated that Trump is the equivalent of a Molotov cocktail thrown into the Washington ruling elite. He is correct. The disenfranchised voters have proved their willingness to vote for this man and he might just be our President. Win or loose, the way Trump has appealed to the masses should be looked at and understood. His appeal is not because of racism or xenophobia. He is a messenger. Our messenger. Go to Washington and tell them we wont stand for this anymore. We want leaders with our best interest at heart. That care about our daily lives. We are not on the right path. Stop selling out America!
11
I don't know which possibility is worse to contemplate - that Trump is such an inept businessman that his businesses lost almost $1 billion or that he intentionally created some kind of paper loss so as to avoid paying taxes on his future personal income. Whichever possibility is correct, I am confident that he lost very little of his own personal money. Instead, the loss has been borne by his real estate partners, lenders, small business suppliers, and us, the taxpayers.
17
I finally understand why there are so many empty, dilapidated properties peppered throughout this country. When I leave my neighborhood and see the abandoned strip center next door, I have frequently wondered who the genius was that built it and never filled it with tenants. Blame it on the tax code! Seems to me all the generous breaks for investing in real estate incentivize reckless behavior in those predisposed to it.
13
I get the feeling Mr. Mitnick is thankful for the opportunity to relieve himself of the burden of guilt for helping Trump avoid his civic duties. Bravo, old man. You have redeemed yourself.
8
Will Hillary state that she will close these generous tax loopholes for the wealthy? That might be a step forward for average Americans when considering who to cast their ballot for.
3
Talk about hypocrisy! In 2014 the NYT company had positive cash flow of $80.5 million and had a profit of $33.4 million - yet PAID $0 INCOME TAXES in 2014 and actually got a tax REFUND of $3.5 million due to using a depreciation tax "loophole"! [source: SEC filings, publicly available].
And the NYT has the audacity to criticize Trump for also legally using Congress' tax code to his best advantage? Really?
And the NYT has the audacity to criticize Trump for also legally using Congress' tax code to his best advantage? Really?
8
If the NYT is running for president, they have my vote, hands down!
3
The Times reported what it learned. The Time's tax filings are public. Trump kept his tax history secret. No hypocrisy on the Time's part. Plenty for Trump.
13
Donald Trump's 1995 salary: $3.4M, while Trump and team bring home $916M in losses. Scott Stevens' 1995 salary: $3.4M, while Stevens and team bring home the Stanley Cup. Go Devils!
3
Wouldn't half, or $408 million, be Marla's tax break to take? Did Donald take the whole $916 tax break loophole for himself?
2
Which one is Marla? I forget. There are simply too many celebrities I am expected to know by first name -- at least according to the front pages of the tabloids which assault my sensibilities every time I find myself at a supermarket checkout. I blame it all on the Gabor sisters -- or, actually, I blame it on their mother.
1
yes I want to know this, too
1
Let's see now. Trump has repeatedly complained about the wasteful spending of his federal income taxes, yet from all signs he has likely paid none for a very long time. He and his advisers say this manipulation of tax codes makes him a "genius", not a scofflaw. But his own accountant says the developer took almost no interest in how his taxes were prepared. In fact, it would have been his daddy's former accountant who likely devised the strategy. And what kind of genius does it take, anyway, to lose close to $1 billion in just one year amid a bullish real estate market? Still, because the Republican candidate apparently hasn't been contributing to the tax system, he says it means he is "the only one" who can fix it. Whenever things don't go his way, Trump whines that a system is "rigged" -- from his presidential-debate microphone to national elections. So congratulations to him. He finally trumped a truly rigged system.
11
I don't think the NYT articles have been correct. If Trump had NOLS from businesses they would be on line 11 on the NYS return. Plus, for federal tax, those losses would be limited first to his basis, how much capital does he have in the project, and if a partnership, subject to at risk basis, and the passive loss rules, though most likely Trump would say he is not passive the whole project depends upon him. But its not true that he can take all of his losses when earned, they may be suspended, in his case probably due to the at risk rules. He can when the partnership is ended, but those are capital losses, subject the the $3000 annual limitation for federal taxes, not NOLs. I think Statement 1, if we knew what it was, is far more interesting than NOLs and I do not think they are personal NOLs. Trump most likely does all business through a LLC or partnership to limit liability, not as an individual. Wish we knew. Someone out there who has access, send the NYT Trump's federal returns and be a patriot.
4
You realize you are advocating crime, stealing tax return information?
3
Ever hear of the word ANONYMOUS?
4
So now that the cat is out of the bag, he needs to show the country his past 10 years taxes so we can see how really smart he is.
8
Sooooo...is no one going to bring up that this tax law was authorized by Bill Clinton to protect his rich buddies? Of whom Trump is one of?
I think ya'll are just mad you can't exploit the same law. It's legal, he used it, just as Bubba intended, and this is yet another thing to add to the Clinton list
I think ya'll are just mad you can't exploit the same law. It's legal, he used it, just as Bubba intended, and this is yet another thing to add to the Clinton list
Who knew that when Mitt Romney castigated the 47% of Americans who don't pay taxes, that Donald Trump was one of them.
9
There is no accusation of illegality of Donald Trump's tax filings. On the other hand, IRS officials have opened up an investigation into the Clinton Family Foundation for alleged fraud and criminal wrongdoing, although it is almost certain that the IRS will not act prior to the election. No story here?
3
I read that Gov. Christie gave Trump a "pass" on approximately $30,000,000 owed to the State of New Jersey.
So, wonder if the expenses paid for with New Jersey money is included in that loss of $916,000,000.
The reason I wonder, is that...in BANKRUPTCY, "debt forgiveness" is not considered not be taxable income....but it would be galling if he got the deduction but never paid back the loan.
(The result is that $30,000,000 loan forgiveness benefit, not taxed, gave Trump a $9,000,000....at a 30% tax rate.)
(BTW....I am a recovering/retired CPA.)
So, wonder if the expenses paid for with New Jersey money is included in that loss of $916,000,000.
The reason I wonder, is that...in BANKRUPTCY, "debt forgiveness" is not considered not be taxable income....but it would be galling if he got the deduction but never paid back the loan.
(The result is that $30,000,000 loan forgiveness benefit, not taxed, gave Trump a $9,000,000....at a 30% tax rate.)
(BTW....I am a recovering/retired CPA.)
8
There are many reasons to not want Donald for president, but using a loss to negate future income is the least of them. As a small (and I mean small, I own one small self-storage property in a rural town) real estate investment owner, I certainly can understand that an investor will show a loss when developing a property, but will have profits later. In a business such as retail, you buy a widget, then sell for an increased amount. YOu are taxed on the difference between cost and sell price. The thing is, that in real estate, the time between buying the real estate and reaping the income is many years.
I'm still more irritated by campaign finance, low taxation of unlimited dividend income, and more specifically with Trump, how you can lose that much in one year and still be considered a genius. And so much more that makes him unqualified. But allowing carrying of losses is the flip side of taking a risk and losing money in small business. To attack that system would be a mistake and will turn off many small business owners and moderates who understand the subject.
I'm still more irritated by campaign finance, low taxation of unlimited dividend income, and more specifically with Trump, how you can lose that much in one year and still be considered a genius. And so much more that makes him unqualified. But allowing carrying of losses is the flip side of taking a risk and losing money in small business. To attack that system would be a mistake and will turn off many small business owners and moderates who understand the subject.
2
Did you people read this? The story says that Mr. Trump could have legally not paid income taxes for up to 18 years, if his losses in previous years legally gave him the right to do so.
You people are nothing more than liberal sheep. You can't be serious. Where is the story about 5 people pleading the fifth and 2 people seeking amnesty when asked to testify regarding Hillary Clinton's blatant misuse of her office for personal gain? Unlike Donald Trump tax filings which were perfectly legal, what Hillary Clinton did was illegal. You people need to get a life.
You people are nothing more than liberal sheep. You can't be serious. Where is the story about 5 people pleading the fifth and 2 people seeking amnesty when asked to testify regarding Hillary Clinton's blatant misuse of her office for personal gain? Unlike Donald Trump tax filings which were perfectly legal, what Hillary Clinton did was illegal. You people need to get a life.
5
The real lesson here is for the American public. If you're angered by this article, you should stop writing a comment here and start calling your representatives in Congress to demand that they make tax reform their central issue.
And then take 20 minutes to research the "other" people on the ballot-- the people who aren't running for president. If they support the status quo with the tax code, vote them out or call them out.
I only hope that America will do a lot more with their outrage than just write anonymous comments. That is the power of the vote, so don't take it for granted.
And then take 20 minutes to research the "other" people on the ballot-- the people who aren't running for president. If they support the status quo with the tax code, vote them out or call them out.
I only hope that America will do a lot more with their outrage than just write anonymous comments. That is the power of the vote, so don't take it for granted.
13
With his track record, I believe it is Trump himself playing another game by mailing his tax papers to show off he is a "genius".
6
U.S. tax codes are a travesty, but don't let Trump who took advantage of the system to change because he is in office. Deception is a great weapon.
3
I wonder if trump is collecting social security since he is age 70? Please NYT reporters let us know. Greatest paper ever!
9
This is why I have no second thoughts about paying for a subscription to the Times. Good journalism requires money and I'm happy to contribute my share.
12
What shoddy reporting. He could avoid taxes for almost two decades, says the Times. This with no knowledge of what his income for the two decades was. Essentially, you are saying that the tax law provides for a net operating loss carryover of twenty years, and, if the carried over loss exceeds the income for those next twenty years, there will be no tax. This would be true of anyone who suffered a business loss on their individual tax return. I do not like Trump, but, this sort of shoddy and biased reporting could propel him to the Presidency (gulp).
5
Nytimes, and calling trump "the comeback kid" in 1995 because 900+ billion dollar loss.
http://www.nytimes.com/1995/10/25/nyregion/crowning-the-comeback-king.html
http://www.nytimes.com/1995/10/25/nyregion/crowning-the-comeback-king.html
4
I have to assume that you recognize that the article you reference fully supports the idea that Donald Trump is a fraud.
10
Dollars to donuts you will find Trump's fingerprints on the envelope. A brilliant ploy to toot his horn about how brilliant he is.
He also sent it only to the Times and News, two papers that have been a thorn in his side.
The media bought it hook, line and sinker.
He also sent it only to the Times and News, two papers that have been a thorn in his side.
The media bought it hook, line and sinker.
1
The stuff that he is doing is possibly legal but not helpful to anyone but himself.
What if he does something like this if he is elected president? What if he does something that is not helpful or bad for the country but good for himself? Why would we want a president like that?
What if he does something like this if he is elected president? What if he does something that is not helpful or bad for the country but good for himself? Why would we want a president like that?
9
Maybe small potatoes but the minuscule salary claimed also tells us he likely has contributed nil into Social Security or Medicare coffers that us "stupid little people" pay and depend upon when we have been swindled by him and other "smart beautiful" people
12
Trump is bad for America, and every person here today. I pay my fair share of taxes and he should too. Why should we reward a cheat?
7
Because that is our current system that even Mrs. Clinton benefits from using. You'd be better off challenging that anger into your vote for your Congressional representatives who actually have the power to change the tax code.
8
Might have been an interesting article but you guys are really overdoing the truly awful autoplay video -- might as well be on CNN, which I never am because of the autoplay.
2
Someone who losses $916 million is a looser and we cannot afford to elect a looser as our next president.
If Trump is so smart he should have never lost so much money.
Those honest and rational people that are supporting Trump on the basis of his business genius should dump him now before it is too late.
Trump is no genius, he is a fraud.
If Trump is so smart he should have never lost so much money.
Those honest and rational people that are supporting Trump on the basis of his business genius should dump him now before it is too late.
Trump is no genius, he is a fraud.
13
Apply grandma wisdom to Trumps refusal to release his taxes, "the devil lurks in the darkness"
8
Do you think that when Republicans were complaining that 50% of the households in America pay no tax ( largely because they don't make enough to qualify) they ever thought their next presidential candidate would be from such a household?
22
Since the Times didn't bother to explain why the tax code allows people to carry net operating losses and there seems to be some confusion, here's an example:
Let's say one person starts a business that will make a half million dollars in taxable earnings every year. Over five years, they will have made $2.5 million pretax, and will owe $875,000 (simplifying, for the sake of example, by assuming a straight 35% tax rate). Someone else starts a business that will require a bunch of up front costs and will have more variable revenues. In the first year, it loses a $1 million, in the second year it loses $500,000, in the third year it makes $3 million, in the fourth it makes $1.5 million, and then loses $500,000 in the fifth. Over the course of five years, it will have made the same $2.5 million as the first company. Since the law allows losses to be carried, it will be taxed comparably. But if they forced everyone to go based on annual earnings with no ability to carry losses, it would owe $1.58 m in tax. So, having had similar earnings, the owner of the second company would owe 82% more in taxes than the owner of the first.
Carrying net operating losses isn't a loophole. It's a fundamental part of our tax system without which it would be not only unfair but economically crippling.
Let's say one person starts a business that will make a half million dollars in taxable earnings every year. Over five years, they will have made $2.5 million pretax, and will owe $875,000 (simplifying, for the sake of example, by assuming a straight 35% tax rate). Someone else starts a business that will require a bunch of up front costs and will have more variable revenues. In the first year, it loses a $1 million, in the second year it loses $500,000, in the third year it makes $3 million, in the fourth it makes $1.5 million, and then loses $500,000 in the fifth. Over the course of five years, it will have made the same $2.5 million as the first company. Since the law allows losses to be carried, it will be taxed comparably. But if they forced everyone to go based on annual earnings with no ability to carry losses, it would owe $1.58 m in tax. So, having had similar earnings, the owner of the second company would owe 82% more in taxes than the owner of the first.
Carrying net operating losses isn't a loophole. It's a fundamental part of our tax system without which it would be not only unfair but economically crippling.
4
Ah but these were his personal taxes not his business taxes!
1
As a Tax Accountant, and accounting Teacher this is legal but it IS typical of the inequity of our needlessly convoluted Tax Code. Shame!
3
The tax code is unfair, but getting rid of NOL carry forwards wouldn't make it more fair. It would make it impossible to start businesses in a lot of industries and unfairly destroy people who had the misfortune of having failures and successes land on the wrong side of New Years Day. Tax accounting (like other accounting) should try to characterize things as closely to economic reality as possible. That it enables carrying NOLs is one of the rare areas where it does that.
Donald Trump: A successful business man?
The house always wins......unless you're Donald Trump
He's no Sheldon Adelson!!
Trump Shuttle: Trump is no Branson!!
Charity Foundations: Trump is no Carnegie (or Clinton)!
University: Trump is no Leland Stanford!
America First?: not if you're a Trump tie or Trump suit or Trump furniture or Trump picture frame or a Trump anything.
Trump the military strategist: tax payments provide ships and planes and weapons and cavalry horses.......
Trump the Landlord?....he's a regular Ross Barnett.
and he is psychologically challenged.
The house always wins......unless you're Donald Trump
He's no Sheldon Adelson!!
Trump Shuttle: Trump is no Branson!!
Charity Foundations: Trump is no Carnegie (or Clinton)!
University: Trump is no Leland Stanford!
America First?: not if you're a Trump tie or Trump suit or Trump furniture or Trump picture frame or a Trump anything.
Trump the military strategist: tax payments provide ships and planes and weapons and cavalry horses.......
Trump the Landlord?....he's a regular Ross Barnett.
and he is psychologically challenged.
20
So what, if it is legitimate? Get rid of your negativity and hate. Use reasons instead.
1
I am with him. We need a leader in the White House who understands business and the tax system. Let's be very clear that GE and Delta Airlines, amongst others have not paid taxes for years and their investors benefit from that positions. To call Trump out for planning and hiring expert advisors is absurd.
4
Only one problem, Delta didn't loose a billion dollar and the businesses that invested didn't get stiffed. Having little knowledge of economy would leave your investment in disaster. But that might serve you right.
6
Leader is the one that has the gravitas to be followed,,, are you implying we should follow his cavalier attitude toward taxation? If so how are going to pay for infrastructure, federal government and military,,, duh
5
Delta filed for bankruptcy in 2005. What do you think happened to unsecured creditors?
2
"Donald Trump Legally Avoided Federal Taxes For Two Decades, The Times Found". THAT is the headline you should have published. Hate the action? Change the law. That will not happen under a President who had the opportunity to do that as a Senator and took millions from corporations, including those 23 among the S&P 500 that paid no federal tax in 2015. Stop being so holier than thou.
Truth is, I cannot vote for anyone in this rigged election.
Truth is, I cannot vote for anyone in this rigged election.
6
Hear hear - agreed
Except that they didn't find that. They found that he didn't pay (state or federal) income taxes in 1995 because he lost a bunch of money. Then, they "discovered" one of the least obscure elements of the tax code which is that you can legally carry losses for a period of up to twenty years (and actually botched the details on that). They have no idea how long it took Trump to make back enough to wipe out that loss. It could have been two years.
They could have written the same article about a pizza shop owner who lost money one year. They would say that he could have "avoided paying taxes for almost twenty years" if he made, on average, less than his loss divided by 18 (it actually should be twenty, but the journalists got confused.)
They could have written the same article about a pizza shop owner who lost money one year. They would say that he could have "avoided paying taxes for almost twenty years" if he made, on average, less than his loss divided by 18 (it actually should be twenty, but the journalists got confused.)
2
Why not? Is your vote too sacrosanct to be defiled by actual candidates?
3
Sounds like he could have afforded to pay at least a few dollars just show believed in America. But he didn't.
6
Everyone is saying the loss is legit and he didn’t do anything wrong. How do we know? I’m sure the IRS conducted an audit. Maybe it was adjusted.
2
There's basically a 100% chance that the IRS conducted an audit when there was an NOL approaching a billion dollars.
2
Trump is a money sucking vampire. I'd say a big exorcism is called for to deal with him permanently.
17
I think the Times missed the real story here. It is clear from prior reporting that Trump did not make large enough equity investments in his real estate projects to justify this level of net operating loss. Tax losses are limited to cost basis. Logically, the only way Trump could support this level of loss for tax purposes in the early 90's is because he had provided personal guarantees of the underlying debt of the real estate entities. But we know in later years he convinced the lenders to let him off the hook for those guarantees. At that time, Trump should have reported large gains for "Cancellation of Indebtedness", which is required to be reported as income for tax purposes. Perhaps Trump is hiding his tax returns because he failed to report that income, a massive tax fraud.
32
nailed it, Randall!
8
Right on the money!
3
It is the unethical part that bothers me: he paid himself back FIRST when his companies went bankrupt and left left others out in the cold, for which he took a tax brake. Legal yes, ethical no.
23
He's a deadbeat. Donald the deadbeat.
3
The Donald now tries to tell us that his losses occurred as a result of the greatest recession since 1928, a recession greater than 2008. Fact checkers take note. The recession in the early 90s was turning around by April 1991, and incurred one the the mildest loss of GDP. The tax losses occurred in 1995. Surely Mr. Trump hardly navigated the recession and recovery with notable business acumen.
9
Is it possible that Mr. T had seen The Producers and realized he could make more money in the long run by purposefully producing a casino failure?
13
If Trump wins, we will have elected a duplicitous, lying, unqualified con man. If Clinton wins, nothing will change, not immigration, not trade, not our unemployment problems and, obviously now our "corrupt for the rich" tax code. So, we are about to stick a knife in an electric socket. So take your choice -top outlet or bottom outlet?
6
Since only about 40% vote in a big election, the non-voters have allowed this business as usual to continue. We are not only electing a President but the next 8 years of service. Clinton has a track record of working with a Republican congress and many Republicans support her. Give her a chance and let Trump do what he really wants to do, have his own reality show.
7
Tom, if people keep voting in the same obstructionist Koch-funded Congress members, not even President Karl Marx could change anything! Put away your magic eight-ball and work to give Clinton a Congress that will back progressive efforts. Presidents aren't monarchs, for heaven's sake.
4
What's amazing is the insane and completely irrational thought process that his surrogates and supporters possess. It's not his "genius" tax dodge but the fact he lost almost a billion dollars as a business man and it doesn't effect or concern his base. Do they actually believe he will do anything except expand and/or create even more loopholes for the wealthy once elected especially with a GOP controlled congress. His uneducated,which he loves,willfully ignorant supporters have consistently voted against their own interest for decades to the detriment of this country and those of us that are rational and sane.
10
Has any commentary addressed the fact that the New York Time just violated the law? Intentionally, wantonly viciously...
3
Where'd you get your law degree, Djon? It's perfectly legal for the NYT to receive unsolicited materials. The anonymous sender could be in trouble, but not necessarily -- they're not just Donald's returns, after all. In 1995, he was married, filing jointly, correct? Just not with the current Mrs. Trump.
5
He is on TV right now saying again that he understands the tax code better than anyone who has run for president (which includes attorneys). What is he going to do when the debate moderator starts asking him specific questions and it becomes clear he knows nothing? He sets himself up for this every day. He never learns.
16
Haha. So true.
Pride over brains.
Pride over brains.
6
One could make the argument that avoiding taxes for nearly two decades is a certain type of success for a businessman. After all, their job is by definition to make money. One could also make the argument that Trump either fully understands the tax code or has successfully hired someone that does. After all, surrounding oneself with experts is part of a successful presidency.
Where all of this breaks down is when we ask why in the world he would close the very loopholes that have made him so successful and will continue to do so for his children who have decades left in their working lives. Take millions, if not billions of dollars, out of his children's pockets because he is a civic-minded patriot? Please point to anything he has done in his life that this indicate that this would happen in reality.
Where all of this breaks down is when we ask why in the world he would close the very loopholes that have made him so successful and will continue to do so for his children who have decades left in their working lives. Take millions, if not billions of dollars, out of his children's pockets because he is a civic-minded patriot? Please point to anything he has done in his life that this indicate that this would happen in reality.
13
So? Friends of Hillary and Bill do much the same thing.
7
Yaj, got any evidence for your claim? What does it have to do with Trump's deficiencies? Making up random stuff isn't the same as a rebuttal.
3
After some thought, granted he used the tax system to his advantage so how has he been a good citizen? Was he charitable? Absolutely not, except for one gift (Washington Post actually thinks it's a bookkeeping error of $10,000) since 2008 he has donated NOTHING OF HIS OWN MONEY.
Fact is, he charged outrageous amounts for his Trump facilities to the charities. He took credit for giving donations to charities by using the money other people gave his charity and gave none of his own money. When he recently pledged $100,000 to a Veterans Fund, he reneged until a reporter called him out and he was forced to save face. He is a con and fraud all around.
Fact is, he charged outrageous amounts for his Trump facilities to the charities. He took credit for giving donations to charities by using the money other people gave his charity and gave none of his own money. When he recently pledged $100,000 to a Veterans Fund, he reneged until a reporter called him out and he was forced to save face. He is a con and fraud all around.
14
I am ashamed to be registered as a Republican. I don't want to be registered or associated with Republican party anymore. Furthermore, I am very disappointed that GOP actually nominated Trump.
22
Hey, I'm starting to get ashamed to be a citizen!
2
The New York Times effusively praised Mr. Trump for his "comeback" at the time.
https://t.co/j6T6XxEtUR
It's unfortunate that the Times chooses to forget (or just not read) its own coverage. After reading partisan screeds like this one, many other (former) readers may choose to do th esame.
https://t.co/j6T6XxEtUR
It's unfortunate that the Times chooses to forget (or just not read) its own coverage. After reading partisan screeds like this one, many other (former) readers may choose to do th esame.
3
Paying taxes is for suckers, evidently. And many millions of such people - most of whom almost certainly pay taxes on their meager existence - support this odious man. What a country.
9
A less-noticed aspect of these revelations puts the lie to a claim Donald Trump wishes to advance. He is NOT an able, efficient businessman who can fix any financial problems the country may have. He was a miserably inefficient businessman who ruined his companies.
13
In the debate Trump declared his income as approx 630 million for this financial year. This is approx 70% of the 1995 loss. It implies that he has not earned the balance 30% in the last 15 years. Surely this is something that warrants discussion in the print and television media.
3
Let's consider the scale of this. It's not often talked about in human terms.
1 million dollars is 20 years of a $50,000 per year salary - a career for a lot of folks.
If Trump takes $50 million per year, which is 20,000 person years of salary, for 18 years it adds up to 360,000 person years of salary.
All to keep the Donald in hair product.
Despicable.
1 million dollars is 20 years of a $50,000 per year salary - a career for a lot of folks.
If Trump takes $50 million per year, which is 20,000 person years of salary, for 18 years it adds up to 360,000 person years of salary.
All to keep the Donald in hair product.
Despicable.
13
I have to admit that I havent read the volumes of comments to this point [nearly 7,400] and likely repeating, but I'll post anyway: "Pages From Donald Trump’s 1995 Income Tax Records - The tax records [illegally] obtained by The Times"
Please explain how the Times [and any other media outlet reporting same] is different from Gawker or their ilk?
- Private information - and admittedly illegally gained - being published and disseminated.
- Public filings certainly are such: public but private records are private are they not?
Public interest you say? Well perhaps it would in some of the public interest if Medias personal info such as family, residence, or compensation were published; e.g. to better understand their respective bias's or perspective.
Utterly ridiculous and a testament to the subjective application of laws.
Please explain how the Times [and any other media outlet reporting same] is different from Gawker or their ilk?
- Private information - and admittedly illegally gained - being published and disseminated.
- Public filings certainly are such: public but private records are private are they not?
Public interest you say? Well perhaps it would in some of the public interest if Medias personal info such as family, residence, or compensation were published; e.g. to better understand their respective bias's or perspective.
Utterly ridiculous and a testament to the subjective application of laws.
3
Ever hear of the Pentagon Papers?
7
What illegal act did the NYTimes commit. There is no evidence that the sender stole the tax forms so possession of stolen property by him nor the NYTimes is mere conjecture. Also Pentagon papers and other court decisions support NYTimes decision to publish papers that even if stolen provided the NYTimes neither paid for nor conspired to steal
3
It's not just what's said, it's also about what isn't said.
I'd cut Trump more slack if he said that he pays little taxes because the tax code allows it and b/c he thinks tax money is squandered -- but he didn't stop there; he then went on to say that there are so many causes, so many unmet needs, that he's donating what should be a fair tax amount to them. He could donate to charity, he could spend money on initiatives to (e.g.) help patch up infrastructure, or something.
But it appears he spends no money on anyone outside his immediate family. No money on any leaving any kind of a lasting legacy. It's as much about what he doesn't do as about what he does.
I'd cut Trump more slack if he said that he pays little taxes because the tax code allows it and b/c he thinks tax money is squandered -- but he didn't stop there; he then went on to say that there are so many causes, so many unmet needs, that he's donating what should be a fair tax amount to them. He could donate to charity, he could spend money on initiatives to (e.g.) help patch up infrastructure, or something.
But it appears he spends no money on anyone outside his immediate family. No money on any leaving any kind of a lasting legacy. It's as much about what he doesn't do as about what he does.
15
Kudos to Trump! Coming back from a huge NOL carry forward took courage, smarts and a lot of focus. These are exactly the type of traits we are looking for in our next president.
5
TB What smarts?
A cpa told him he could do that, so he did it, & got rich off his failure. Courage? It's apparently not illegal to more than recoup one's own fortune that way after losing a yuge amount of other peoples' money.
Focus? You mean an intense obsession with massive wealth, power & general self-aggrandizement? Not sure why you think that's desirable in a nation's leader, except maybe Genghis Khan.
A cpa told him he could do that, so he did it, & got rich off his failure. Courage? It's apparently not illegal to more than recoup one's own fortune that way after losing a yuge amount of other peoples' money.
Focus? You mean an intense obsession with massive wealth, power & general self-aggrandizement? Not sure why you think that's desirable in a nation's leader, except maybe Genghis Khan.
9
Thank you, moderators, for keeping this article open for so long... and for your dogged work perusing and posting volumes of comments throughout this election season.
I have no idea why Donald Trump was in my subconscious but...
about 15 years ago I dreamed I found myself in an evening gown, headed down the FDR Drive in the back of a limo. When I saw Trump beside me in a tuxedo, my reaction was to look out the car window for a break in traffic so I could open the door and roll into the street without being run over.
If nothing else he's said or done thus far has swayed his supporters that he should not be the next POTUS, shouldn't the tax returns be the impetus for them to open the door, dive out of the car and flee? Is there anyone, metaphorically speaking, who really wants to go the ball with this man?
I have no idea why Donald Trump was in my subconscious but...
about 15 years ago I dreamed I found myself in an evening gown, headed down the FDR Drive in the back of a limo. When I saw Trump beside me in a tuxedo, my reaction was to look out the car window for a break in traffic so I could open the door and roll into the street without being run over.
If nothing else he's said or done thus far has swayed his supporters that he should not be the next POTUS, shouldn't the tax returns be the impetus for them to open the door, dive out of the car and flee? Is there anyone, metaphorically speaking, who really wants to go the ball with this man?
10
What do people think of Mark Cuban saying he doesn't exploit every tax loophole because he is patriotic? I think that is an interesting POV in this debate.
7
Trump is a looser. Just look at his tax returns.
4
So now that he supposedly has billions, why doesn't he pay all those vendors he stiffed back then. It's heartbreaking to hear some of their stories. Come on deadbeat Donald, you got the tax break and they got the shaft. Think about it the next time your sitting on your golden toilet.
17
Don’t believe what you’re reading!
The New York Times and the Hilary Clinton Campaign both had the same tax break that Trump had during his bankruptcies... The American Mass Media has gone totally berserk! They are lying. They are manufacturing stories. They are hiding bad things about Hilary and good things about Trump. This is incredibly dangerous for our freedom - when the entire national media has completely ejected Journalistic Integrity, Objectivity, and their duty to just report the facts. Are we being prepared for a coup?
They are lying. Don't believe them. Donald Trump is a Boy Scout compared to the 30 years of Clinton Corruption. The media wines about his taxes but hides the truth of the Clinton Foundation corruption; Hilary's selling influence while Secretary of State; Getting her people killed in Benghazi. This woman is a walking disaster people! Don't vote for her.
Titus Corleone
The New York Times and the Hilary Clinton Campaign both had the same tax break that Trump had during his bankruptcies... The American Mass Media has gone totally berserk! They are lying. They are manufacturing stories. They are hiding bad things about Hilary and good things about Trump. This is incredibly dangerous for our freedom - when the entire national media has completely ejected Journalistic Integrity, Objectivity, and their duty to just report the facts. Are we being prepared for a coup?
They are lying. Don't believe them. Donald Trump is a Boy Scout compared to the 30 years of Clinton Corruption. The media wines about his taxes but hides the truth of the Clinton Foundation corruption; Hilary's selling influence while Secretary of State; Getting her people killed in Benghazi. This woman is a walking disaster people! Don't vote for her.
Titus Corleone
3
Stop watching fox news. They have infiltrated your brain. Research yourself before you repeat their propaganda. Learn the truth. It's out there should you wish to find it.
3
The point is, do we really want a wheeler dealer in the White House? Some politicians may be crooked, but none of them made it a game to get out of paying taxes.
11
The New York Times claimed a $3.6 Million Dollar tax refund in 2014 and paid $0 taxes in spite of $29.9 Million net profit due to capital loss carryovers.
Constructing scandals without disclosing your conflict of interest is just petty.
Constructing scandals without disclosing your conflict of interest is just petty.
6
While Mr. Trump is a buffoon and a tax evader (doing exactly what most corporations do) and is certainly not getting this vote, he should ask Mrs. Clinton at the next debate to explain to the American public exactly what her role was in the midnight pardoning of Marc Rich, the Billionaire tax cheat/fugitive. Now that's a question that would make these interminable "debates" actually worth watching!
Hillary's main achievement in all her years in public office was to funnel bucket-loads of "Pay-To-Play" Biz to the Foundation. Trump is what he is. There are no surprises. Hillary, on the other hand, is really the most deplorable of them all and at this late stage in the game she still finds herself struggling to establish her credibility and "connect" with a significant segment of registered Democrats who, like myself, can't get past the stench of deceit and blind ambition in this most despicable, sanctimonious, fundamentally dishonest candidate.
And, no, it's not a "right-wing conspiracy" or sexist to say it (tired arguments) but a perception borne out of a well documented history of obfuscation and duplicity. With Hillary, what you see and hear is not what you get (unless you're among the "big donors," behind closed doors.)
http://www.counterpunch.org/2016/10/03/the-pardon-of-arc-rich-how-hillar...
http://www.counterpunch.org/2016/09/19/hillary-clintons-basket-of-deplor...
Hillary's main achievement in all her years in public office was to funnel bucket-loads of "Pay-To-Play" Biz to the Foundation. Trump is what he is. There are no surprises. Hillary, on the other hand, is really the most deplorable of them all and at this late stage in the game she still finds herself struggling to establish her credibility and "connect" with a significant segment of registered Democrats who, like myself, can't get past the stench of deceit and blind ambition in this most despicable, sanctimonious, fundamentally dishonest candidate.
And, no, it's not a "right-wing conspiracy" or sexist to say it (tired arguments) but a perception borne out of a well documented history of obfuscation and duplicity. With Hillary, what you see and hear is not what you get (unless you're among the "big donors," behind closed doors.)
http://www.counterpunch.org/2016/10/03/the-pardon-of-arc-rich-how-hillar...
http://www.counterpunch.org/2016/09/19/hillary-clintons-basket-of-deplor...
6
As a woman, I find HIllary despicable because no self-respecting feminist would defend her husband and try to discredit the women who accused him of improprieties. You have two misogynistic candidates running for president. Every women in this country should vote for the only feminist candidate, Jill Stein, and then the Green party would win the election.
4
If any Clinton supporters really believe all of her tax returns she released are the true honest returns, then they must be drinking gallons of the Clinton Kool-Aid. Those tax returns have falsified financial information.
2
How about provide some proof for that assertion?
9
Ron Goodman - you want proof? How about the wealthiest never pay any taxes, and all their tax returns are falsified? What does it matter (according to Clinton) about the tax returns? ALL tax returns of the wealthiest contain falsified information.
1
This makes Trump the biggest Welfare Queen in NYC.
16
If you have no income, you pay no taxes. So complicated, we needed a front-page article to 'splain it to us.
1
Really oil companies lose 60 billion Uber loses 1.2 billion. righting off losses is the key to survival.
The California Public Employee Retirement System (CalPERS) is about to report the world’s largest public employee pension suffered an actuarial investment loss of $30.8 billion last year.
CalPERS manages the defined pension plan investments and record keeping for 3,007 California state and local government entities. The pension plan is also responsible for paying the pension benefits to 611,078 retirees and will eventually be responsible for paying retirement benefits to another 868,713 active and 335,908 inactive government workers.
Despite Governor Jerry Brown last summer demanding CalPERS immediately “lower its investment risk and volatility of returns” by reducing its “assumed” annual investment return from 7.5 percent to 6.5 percent, the CalPERS board voted 7- 3 on November 15, 2015 only to slowly reduce the investment return expectation over the next decade.
The California Public Employee Retirement System (CalPERS) is about to report the world’s largest public employee pension suffered an actuarial investment loss of $30.8 billion last year.
CalPERS manages the defined pension plan investments and record keeping for 3,007 California state and local government entities. The pension plan is also responsible for paying the pension benefits to 611,078 retirees and will eventually be responsible for paying retirement benefits to another 868,713 active and 335,908 inactive government workers.
Despite Governor Jerry Brown last summer demanding CalPERS immediately “lower its investment risk and volatility of returns” by reducing its “assumed” annual investment return from 7.5 percent to 6.5 percent, the CalPERS board voted 7- 3 on November 15, 2015 only to slowly reduce the investment return expectation over the next decade.
And the Clinton's turned their foundation into a slush fund from which they will pay themselves millions they did not earn. You can rest assured the Clintons will sell sleepovers in the the White House, for contributions to the Clinton Foundation slush fund. Remember when Bill was President they sold sleepovers in the Lincoln Bed rooms.
2
Beyond his racism, xenophobia, misogyny and downright shocking ignorance of world issues (like the concept of NATO not being optional, of nuclear non-proliferation, or even the concept of promptly paying government debt obligations to maintain our stellar credit rating), Trump has one truly major shortcoming for the post he seeks: he only ever cares about himself, and his own personal welfare. How can we possibly expect him to care about us, the population at large, who have problems that he cannot possibly begin to relate to? And clearly would never care to listen to?
It was informative to me to read, here in the Times, that even his comments about Mexicans being killers and rapists were not his own; he stole them from a book by Ann Coulter. A Con Man in every sense of the word, with the end goal always being to promote his own, personal agenda.
It was informative to me to read, here in the Times, that even his comments about Mexicans being killers and rapists were not his own; he stole them from a book by Ann Coulter. A Con Man in every sense of the word, with the end goal always being to promote his own, personal agenda.
10
If you think these illegally obtained tax returns are outrageous, who should you be angry at? A savvy successful businessman that legally filed his taxes according to the law to pay as little as possible just like you and I do, or corrupt politicians like hillary who wrote those laws? Or does that make to much sense to be considered?
2
If he truly believes that what he's done is so honest and righteous, then why does he conceal it? For a man who so enjoys trumpeting his virtues, it makes no sense to think that he thinks he's in the right.
15
The candidate named Donald Trump,
Gets his speeches straight out of the dump.
He spews out that trash
Cuz he’s all outta cash
But he won’t tell you that on the stump!
Gets his speeches straight out of the dump.
He spews out that trash
Cuz he’s all outta cash
But he won’t tell you that on the stump!
9
There are thousands of businesses generating tax losses and it is not because the business owners are smart.
What is interesting;
The loss does not appear to be carried back. A smart person would carry the loss back to recover taxes already paid. Did Trump have no income in the prior two years to which he could not apply the loss carry back?
As well, even when the $909 million loss is removed from the return he still has an additional $2 million loss to bring it to $915 million. Is Trump generating losses for multiple years?
It all points to Trump not paying taxes in 1993, 1994, and obviously, for possibly 20 years (lose expires 20 years after incurred) going forward.
In Trump's fitting character, he would have bragged about the amount of taxes he had paid to further demonstrate his wealth. So there were no taxes paid to brag about?
What is interesting;
The loss does not appear to be carried back. A smart person would carry the loss back to recover taxes already paid. Did Trump have no income in the prior two years to which he could not apply the loss carry back?
As well, even when the $909 million loss is removed from the return he still has an additional $2 million loss to bring it to $915 million. Is Trump generating losses for multiple years?
It all points to Trump not paying taxes in 1993, 1994, and obviously, for possibly 20 years (lose expires 20 years after incurred) going forward.
In Trump's fitting character, he would have bragged about the amount of taxes he had paid to further demonstrate his wealth. So there were no taxes paid to brag about?
5
What Former Mayor Guliani conveniently fails to mention in his comments is that Trump took the deductions in his taxes PERSONALLY, not as a business. So that the idea that Trump was benefiting those who he cared about include only one person, HIMSELF.
14
The NYT paid no taxes in 2014 because of losses. How is this any different?
Did the NYT Board decide to pay taxes anyway out of a sense of duty to the country?
When the NYT Board members get the news from their accountants every year as to how much they owe, do they say "Hey Mary, I will throw in an extra 10%? Do Bill, Hill, Soros, Buffett etc do this?
Did the NYT Board decide to pay taxes anyway out of a sense of duty to the country?
When the NYT Board members get the news from their accountants every year as to how much they owe, do they say "Hey Mary, I will throw in an extra 10%? Do Bill, Hill, Soros, Buffett etc do this?
4
Congratulations are in order for The New York Times and every reporter and editor who worked on this story. Whether it will influence the thinking (if one may call it that) of "reality television" fans, is, of course, unfathomable.
The piece is enlightening not only for what it reveals about the machinations that Trump and his supporters would pass off as (diabolical?) "Genius," but also for what it reveals about the legwork needed to authenticate what could just as easily have been bogus documents intended as bait. As the items, consisting of the first pages from three separate state filings, were reasonable authenticated prior to publication, one must cringe to imagine Trump's minions seeking to identify the "mole" in their organization.
One item puzzles me. A "story-about-this story," in the Washington Post, mentions authenticating the items by means of information that can be corroborated because it is publicly available. The Washington Post says that Trump's social security number would be in this category. Since when is another person's social security number available to the general public? Are we not cautioned to guard our social security numbers to prevent identity theft?
The piece is enlightening not only for what it reveals about the machinations that Trump and his supporters would pass off as (diabolical?) "Genius," but also for what it reveals about the legwork needed to authenticate what could just as easily have been bogus documents intended as bait. As the items, consisting of the first pages from three separate state filings, were reasonable authenticated prior to publication, one must cringe to imagine Trump's minions seeking to identify the "mole" in their organization.
One item puzzles me. A "story-about-this story," in the Washington Post, mentions authenticating the items by means of information that can be corroborated because it is publicly available. The Washington Post says that Trump's social security number would be in this category. Since when is another person's social security number available to the general public? Are we not cautioned to guard our social security numbers to prevent identity theft?
2
Sounds like an incredible recipe--take big risks, flop big, then use it not to pay taxes, build incredible personal wealth, and live like a king. Why don't we all do this? Oh, wait, we didn't get that $14 million loan from our dads to start us in the right direction.
For me, since it never seemed like he would have done anything different than a lot of rich people do, it's that fancy schmancy "fiduciary duty", "knows more about the tax code" malarkey that bothers me the most. Always excuses, always the most ridiculous hyperbole. Who writes this stuff for him? I feel sorry for the unsuspecting middle class voter who believes he will bring change and not just make life easier for rich people like himself.
For me, since it never seemed like he would have done anything different than a lot of rich people do, it's that fancy schmancy "fiduciary duty", "knows more about the tax code" malarkey that bothers me the most. Always excuses, always the most ridiculous hyperbole. Who writes this stuff for him? I feel sorry for the unsuspecting middle class voter who believes he will bring change and not just make life easier for rich people like himself.
3
Trump says paying no taxes is OK because using the tax laws is smart. He says he is the only person who knows exactly how they should be changed to ensure billionaires with ridiculous tax advantages don't leave regular people with far more than their fair share of the tax burden.
Currently, all of his tax proposals benefit the rich. So exactly what tax codes related to people like developers, hedge fund people, etc. does he intend to change? He says he is the expert. Laying out specifics on his web site and in speeches would make sense and win a lot of votes, but will he do it?
People do things for two reasons - gain a benefit or avoid a loss. People who strive for good character benefit from doing the right thing. People whose moral compass is calibrated to money, applause, ratings, self-aggrandizement do not. What happens to the world when the full power of the presidency comes to this man and his cronies? Nothing that is likely to benefit you or me.
Currently, all of his tax proposals benefit the rich. So exactly what tax codes related to people like developers, hedge fund people, etc. does he intend to change? He says he is the expert. Laying out specifics on his web site and in speeches would make sense and win a lot of votes, but will he do it?
People do things for two reasons - gain a benefit or avoid a loss. People who strive for good character benefit from doing the right thing. People whose moral compass is calibrated to money, applause, ratings, self-aggrandizement do not. What happens to the world when the full power of the presidency comes to this man and his cronies? Nothing that is likely to benefit you or me.
6
The story is not tax avoidance, it's monumental business failure.
14
Just another Moonbat Crock o' Crap. You ALL use legal deductions to minimize your tax burden - and you take advantage of EVERY deduction available to you. Don't blame Donald Trump because HIS Tax Accountants do their job better than yours do.
2
Thats not the problem. He says he'll "fix" the tax laws.. Why would he get rid of or change the loopholes that he takes advantage of and gains from? Why would anyone believe he would make tax laws better, he isn't going to shut off something that has made him rich.
7
Given that Mr. Trump has already stated, in "The Art of the Comeback", that he lost the money, I don't really see how the tax papers themselves are relevant. I wonder, will the times expense the cost of its lawyers and expect the taxpayers to pay for part of it, or does it plan to have the Democratic Party pay?
Why do we provide incentives for over 'development'? This tax incentive system has ruined our lands. It's crazy.
According to Mr. Trump, he knows more about the tax code than anyone in history running for president -- so he is uniquely qualified to reform it.
According to Trump's accountant, Mr. Trump knows little about the tax code and displays no interest in learning about it. Mrs. Trump was more interested in the tax code than Mr. Trump.
I'm not surprised that Mr. Trump's taxes are being audited. Everything he says should be audited. His version of events bears little relationship to the reality occupied by the rest of us.
According to Trump's accountant, Mr. Trump knows little about the tax code and displays no interest in learning about it. Mrs. Trump was more interested in the tax code than Mr. Trump.
I'm not surprised that Mr. Trump's taxes are being audited. Everything he says should be audited. His version of events bears little relationship to the reality occupied by the rest of us.
8
Thank you Times, for this public service.
9
Rest assured, to the sanctimonious amongst you readers, almost all of Clinton's very wealthy donors, including those Wall Street tycoons and hedge fund professionals which you conveniently forget, take advantage of every tax law available to them to pay less taxes. You sanctimonious self-righteous commenters easily forget that your pal, Warren Buffet, pays even less taxes as a percentage of income than his secretary; and he wants Americans like me (and you!) to pay more - talk about a hypocrite - why does he not simply give more money to the U.S. government? Rest assured, self-righteous commenters, almost half of Americans don't pay federal taxes at all. For those of us who live off the donations and gifts of others, i.e. luxury lifestyle beneficiaries of the Clinton Foundation such as the Clinton's themselves, deferring a tax benefit here or there is a yawner. While I despise Trump, and while I pay taxes (and hate watching my taxes get wasted on disasters like Solyndra and the Gulf War) what he has done is legal. To all sanctimonious self-righteous commenters, get over it.
3
Republican politicians like Christie & Giuliani are saying this news shows Trump is a "genius." What kind of genius looses nearly a billion dollars in a single year? (And what kind of political party thinks letting the middle class pick up the tax tab for such a "genius" is ok? Republicans, of course.)
9
US Treasury - be ready for this 'business genius' to blow the bank once he is the president! It's other people's money (federal tax payers') anyway since he is not contributing to US Treasury. Perhaps Trump will take the trillion dollar losses as personal tax write-off for his estate.
2
GE, New York Times do and did the same thing......50% of population do not pay income taxes while Trump pays millions in payroll, real estate and more fees/taxes of other kinds but no mention of this on this hit job by NYT......NYT really got the pom-poms out this time and no mention of millions of other taxes he has payed.
3
Makes me ill. To think of all of us, hard working Americans, working hard to stay afloat, working hard to support our families, paying our fair share of taxes - and for me to provide for my family, make a decent income, pay taxes (not even a homeowner in CA, a renter in LA County), that wealthy people like Mr. Trump have such incredible net worth and they don't even pay taxes, is mind-blowing and completely un-American. America is built on the backs of immigrants, hard working families and decent people while folks like Mr. Trump get richer and richer without paying their dues to our fantastic country. It is a privilege to live in America, and he and many others should pay for that privilege just like all of us.
9
Donald's one of the 47% who don't pay federal taxes. Loving his claims of paying enormous state and locals, like we don't know he got a cut in his NJ tax debts.
7
Wait...Didn't the Times report a loss and subsequently pay no taxes in 2014? Am I wrong here? If so then why such bias in your reporting? And isn't releasing someone's tax returns without permission a crime? Furthermore, no crime was commuted so where is the story?
4
I pray that someone asks Mr. Trump if his golden toilet seat was a tax deductible expense.
4
It seems as if Trump is also trying to avoid paying social security taxes. He only shows $6108 in wages so his social security contributions were much less than the $61200 in wages that would max out social security contributions for 1995. He clearly derived more than $61200 in some kind of remuneration from his work in 1995.
He not only is avoiding paying the general treasury taxes he is also avoiding paying his fair share of social security. I am a small business owner and If I tried to shift income away from wages I would be audited and fined.
He not only is avoiding paying the general treasury taxes he is also avoiding paying his fair share of social security. I am a small business owner and If I tried to shift income away from wages I would be audited and fined.
6
Hilllary ought to offer Bernie Sanders a special cabinet appointment devoted to holding the wealthy accountable for their share of taxes.
9
Can the NY Times print and show their TAX records, that indicate they paid NO taxes in 2014, even though they had millions in profits. Talk about "the pot calling the kettle black". Geeeze.
4
It's not only that he's a tax dodger, but that he's a lousy businessman.
How does one declare a loss of close to a billion dollars?
How does one declare a loss of close to a billion dollars?
5
I am so tired of the hypocrisy. As with any job, there should be qualifications of the applicant, which should be upheld. How this con man, tax evader, sleeping with the Russian enemy, deplorable human being gets a pass at our expense is simply criminal. Is this our democracy being tested? It is a nightmare.
6
There is no crime, or even moral culpability, in not paying taxes if you legally don't have to.
Please focus on the many things Trump has done that actually do disqualify him from being President.
Please focus on the many things Trump has done that actually do disqualify him from being President.
What is vexing about Trump's loss is not its size, but its origin.
For finance professionals who have experience working with people like Trump, the story here is in how this loss was generated. Was it an investment loss? Was it a loss of cash? Was it a loss of property? Or he did he aggressively abuse the tax code to take "credit" for losses that he never personally absorbed?
Only his tax returns will reveal what byzantine pieces of the tax code he used to document his losses, which may be figments of an accountant's imagination and not real costs to his personal fortune -- but certainly to the coffers of the US Treasury and the American people who must share the burden through payroll taxes, Medicare taxes, Medicaid taxes, social security, and every other garnishment that wage earners are obliged to obey, but that he can skirt.
Add to this the continuous review of his taxes by the IRS for 12 years now, and you have a disturbing pattern of a man who has been unable to take responsibility for anything that goes wrong either in his business life, or in a presidential debate.
If Trump's personality were one of responsibility and restraint, a $916 million dollar loss for a billionaire would be understandable, and perhaps “genius”, as Giuliuani described. But for a man who to this point has demonstrated a poor understanding of the truth and its necessity within the context of the public discourse for the sake of the people he hopes to lead, it only proves him unfit.
For finance professionals who have experience working with people like Trump, the story here is in how this loss was generated. Was it an investment loss? Was it a loss of cash? Was it a loss of property? Or he did he aggressively abuse the tax code to take "credit" for losses that he never personally absorbed?
Only his tax returns will reveal what byzantine pieces of the tax code he used to document his losses, which may be figments of an accountant's imagination and not real costs to his personal fortune -- but certainly to the coffers of the US Treasury and the American people who must share the burden through payroll taxes, Medicare taxes, Medicaid taxes, social security, and every other garnishment that wage earners are obliged to obey, but that he can skirt.
Add to this the continuous review of his taxes by the IRS for 12 years now, and you have a disturbing pattern of a man who has been unable to take responsibility for anything that goes wrong either in his business life, or in a presidential debate.
If Trump's personality were one of responsibility and restraint, a $916 million dollar loss for a billionaire would be understandable, and perhaps “genius”, as Giuliuani described. But for a man who to this point has demonstrated a poor understanding of the truth and its necessity within the context of the public discourse for the sake of the people he hopes to lead, it only proves him unfit.
7
Yes, the tax code favors real estate pyramiding and Trump was very practiced at it with the help of his accountant. Is this really news? If I thought that this revelation would lead to a reform of the tax code, I be cheering. Instead, I'm supposed to be outraged that a real estate mogul is taking advantage of legal provisions in the code.
So let's all hate Trump for his perfectly legal activities. Is the NYT in favor of eliminating these tax giveaways? Probably not! That is the real test, though. And, while we're at it, we can attack the farm subsidies and the oil and gas breaks in the tax code.
So let's all hate Trump for his perfectly legal activities. Is the NYT in favor of eliminating these tax giveaways? Probably not! That is the real test, though. And, while we're at it, we can attack the farm subsidies and the oil and gas breaks in the tax code.
5
How stupid is this man to have incurred a loss close to a billion? Do we need him as our President. All sane people will say and vote an emphatic NO!!!
Whichever way one looks at it, he is either stupid, or a big-time crook (if he fudged the loss in order to get reduced taxes.) It's still an emphatic NO for me!!!
Whichever way one looks at it, he is either stupid, or a big-time crook (if he fudged the loss in order to get reduced taxes.) It's still an emphatic NO for me!!!
6
Ok losing money and filing for losses is very normal in the business world, Casinos are dependent on the economy and losses need to be written off. The 1990's were difficult for many resorts and Casinos Trump has a brilliant skill set to navigate through these losses. Here are losses for the oil companies and trust me they will navigate around there losses as best they can or go out of business and layoff millions of workers.
There were eleven different oil and gas exploration firms on this year's Fortune 500 list that lost more than one billion dollars.
The big losses suffered by these companies is almost entirely the result of the continued struggles of the oil and gas markets in 2015, when prices for those and other commodities plunged. Apache alone lost $23.1 billion; Chesapeake and Devon took the #2 and #3 spots will losses of $14.7 billion and $14.5 billion, respectively. Things may be looking up for many of these firms for 2016, however, as the price of oil has rebounded roughly 60% since January.
There were eleven different oil and gas exploration firms on this year's Fortune 500 list that lost more than one billion dollars.
The big losses suffered by these companies is almost entirely the result of the continued struggles of the oil and gas markets in 2015, when prices for those and other commodities plunged. Apache alone lost $23.1 billion; Chesapeake and Devon took the #2 and #3 spots will losses of $14.7 billion and $14.5 billion, respectively. Things may be looking up for many of these firms for 2016, however, as the price of oil has rebounded roughly 60% since January.
The headline should read:
"Donald Trump, Billion Dollar Loser"
"Donald Trump, Billion Dollar Loser"
7
Good for him!
Congress writes stupid tax laws, and presidents stupidly sign them.
As the saying goes, don't hate the playa, hate the game.
Congress writes stupid tax laws, and presidents stupidly sign them.
As the saying goes, don't hate the playa, hate the game.
3
How much of the $916 million loss actually went against cash flow can only be determined by an examination of his financial statement, his balance sheet (assets and liabilities) his P&L (his income statement) and the notes from his CPA.
Trump did nothing illegal here, so why is this an issue? The reason it matters is for several reasons: First, Trump is presenting himself as this successful businessman that will use his talents to 'Make America Great Again'. The question I have is, if you're such a successful businessman, how did you lose close to $1 billion in a year? Second, how does someone who writes off $1 billion know (or potentially care) about the disadvantaged workers in this country that he plans to make whole? And finally, he's a genius for writing off $1 billion? I think his accountant did his taxes, so how much was he really involved?
2
Does anyone really believe that Donald Trump does his own taxes? Giuliani and Christie would have you believe that this is proof that Trump is a genius. He's not, and he can afford to hire the best tax lawyers, money managers and tax accountants, a huge industry that exists primarily to serve the 1%. Moreover, those experts know that they should go for the maximum deductions they can come up with, because the worst that can happen is that the IRS will order and audit. Trump actually admits that he has been audited every year for a very long time.
4
Printing Mr. Trump's tax return (or a portion of it) is terrible crime -- and this paper, the individuals involved in this crime, should go to jail for it. I despise this lawless and completely unhinged paper, this sheet of lies, and its writers. Let us see if they are brought to justice.
3
Think about it folks. Yes, it is unfortunate that Trump paid so little in taxes, but take a step back and look at your own situation - if you had a legal means to reduce your taxes, wouldn't you take it? Instead of cursing the person who took advantage of the United States' horrible tax code, why don't we take issue with the politicians who made the horrible code to begin with? Trump is not alone with his low tax bill. I am sure Hillary Clinton has also taken advantage of tax loopholes as well.
4
The money, massive as it is, is the least of this story. Who is Mr. Trump beholden to? Who are his business colleagues? To whom does he owe money, and how much?
Bill Moyers story sheds some light, and asks questions still unanswered today. http://billmoyers.com/story/donald-trump-story-youre-not-hearing/
Bill Moyers story sheds some light, and asks questions still unanswered today. http://billmoyers.com/story/donald-trump-story-youre-not-hearing/
3
Donald is a corporate welfare queen.
Donald is "smart" for avoiding paying taxes like "welfare queens" are smart for avoiding work and having children to collect more government benefits or some malingerer might be "smart" for exaggerating an injury to collect disability payments.
Think of every bad stereotype of someone receiving government benefits. Donald is no different from those stereotypes except that he wears a coat and tie and thinks highly of himself. That and he is a much bigger leach on the government dole than any poor person.
Donald is "smart" for avoiding paying taxes like "welfare queens" are smart for avoiding work and having children to collect more government benefits or some malingerer might be "smart" for exaggerating an injury to collect disability payments.
Think of every bad stereotype of someone receiving government benefits. Donald is no different from those stereotypes except that he wears a coat and tie and thinks highly of himself. That and he is a much bigger leach on the government dole than any poor person.
5
According to Chris Christie and Rudolph Giuliani, the man who reported a $912 million loss--a loss--in a single year qualifies as a business "genius."
10
This has probably been noted but I can't pick through 7,000+ comments: Forget the disturbing loophole, tell us more about the $916 million loss! How can anyone "lose" so much money and still declare themselves to be very, very, rich? If that's the case, who got poor as a result of this loss?
39
When the ships going down, the idea is to dump more debt on the object so to hold accountable the shareholder while taking a lot of money out of that flounder.
1
It's an accounting definition of loss and is affected by timing, valuation, depreciation schedules and accounting principles. If you bought a house this year and could write it down over a five year period, when balanced against your income, you'd have a negative result as well.
The American hard working tax payers.
Why is he being audited?
11
Because he hasn't paid taxes for years and years and years and years.
4
Because the losing never stops. Donald can bank his loses while claiming he's a big success. He's an amazing escape artist. If it weren't for his tax advantages, he'd be a loser. Instead, we all are.
2
Mr. Trump, you said Sen. John McCain is "not a war hero." You also said. "He was a war hero because he was captured. I like people who weren’t captured."
Mr. Trump, you are not a business hero because you were captured by your creditors and banks with $1 billion in bad debts. You were insolvent. I like people who have a net worth and can pay their debts.
Mr. Trump, you are not a business hero because you were captured by your creditors and banks with $1 billion in bad debts. You were insolvent. I like people who have a net worth and can pay their debts.
43
John,
Well said!!
Well said!!
3
Not shocking at all. It is what we all expected. Of course, what Trump did is not criminal. Would Clinton, if elected, end this practice of dodging taxes? Perhaps that is the question we need to ask ourselves.
5
So many folks here, and in the Trump camp, excuse Trump's behavior because he apparently didn't break any laws. He just took advantage of existing laws, it was all legal.
Trump rally's his supporters with chants of "lock her up," yet Clinton has not broken any laws either. That doesn't seem to matter to his supporters; the hypocrisy is sickening.
Trump rally's his supporters with chants of "lock her up," yet Clinton has not broken any laws either. That doesn't seem to matter to his supporters; the hypocrisy is sickening.
32
Laws were broken. Evidence was destroyed. Witnesses pled the fifth and were also given immunity. Crimes were not charged. Not guilty does not mean crimes were not committed, it just means insuficient proof "exists" to lead to a conviction. It also does not mean, nor imply, nor verify "INNOCENCE"
2
But she has broken the law..Lied to congress..that's a crime..Mishandling classified information is a crime...ask Edward Snowden why he can't come back to America..
2
Not telling the truth, lying, to the FBI is a felony. You don’t have to be under oath. Ask Martha. You go straight to prison. Evidence had been destroyed. Witnesses pled the fifth and were also given immunity. Prosecutorial discretion bowed to political influence. Nothing was charged. This does not mean crimes were not committed, it just means insufficient proof "exists" to lead to a conviction. It also does not mean, nor imply, nor verify "INNOCENCE" or that laws were not broken.
2
If this were the Titanic does anyone have any doubt Trump would tread all over women and children to make the lifeboat?
46
Trump's campaign: “Mr. Trump knows the tax code far better than anyone who has ever run for President and he is the only one that knows how to fix it.”
By the same reasoning, should we make every mass-murderer a police commissioner?
By the same reasoning, should we make every mass-murderer a police commissioner?
37
In some counties, they would. Many of Trump's cadre of Deplorables would undoubtedly be pleased, should this come to pass. This is the most important reason why Trump must be defeated.
2
Yes, farmers all over the country are now discovering that they should have put foxes in charge of guarding their hen houses all along because, well, who better than a fox to point out the gaps in the chicken wire! And it's a well known fact that seasoned foxes only have those chickens' long term interests in mind... several chicken dinners in the interim notwithstanding.
3
Modern day journalism at it's finest!!! Page A1, above the fold "news" that a multi-billionaire real estate businessman reported a high business loss... 21 years ago. That's actually the only pertinent facts in the article and I'm not sure why that is news. Everything else (how long he "could" have gone without paying taxes off this loss) is complete conjecture. And in my opinion, complete conjecture isn't worthy of page A1 "news" in the NYT. The vast majority of this article is someone guessing how much he did or didn't pay in taxes over 18 years, and EVERYONE admits that guess is completely contingent on his year to year income, other deductions and other losses etc etc etc NONE of which anybody cited has. So... how exactly is this news???
9
It isn't. Trump stated he lost the money in "The Art of the Comeback". Thus, the only thing new is the protected tax information.
1
It's news because Trump is running for President and touting his supposed business expertise as his main qualification.
3
It is news precisely because Trump, unlike presidential candidates for decades, refuses to share his tax return.
"What is he hiding?" is the operative question. As his future employers we have the right to ask. He is not required to answer and like any prospective employee he won't be hired by me.
"What is he hiding?" is the operative question. As his future employers we have the right to ask. He is not required to answer and like any prospective employee he won't be hired by me.
2
Everyone is still missing the core story about Trump's tax write off. The tax code provides incentives to encourage businesses to take risks. That's on purpose. And, on the face of it, there's nothing wrong with a business amortizing their losses over many years. That is all well and good, though maybe not something that all Americans are familiar with.
The real problem is when those tax laws are gamed by dishonest practices. For example, Trump Casino Corp sells all of the property, buildings, and assets to Trump Property Corp. -- at below market values ... like $1 Billion below market value. Trump Property Corp says, "Wow, what a geat deal". Meanwhile, Trump Casino Corp now has to lease buildings and other assets and above market value. Because Trump Casino Corp didn't receive market value for its assets, it dips into the red and then must file for bankruptcy. As a result, Trump Casino Corp can get away with paying its employees and creditors only a portion of what they are owed.
When Trump Casino Corp shows an enormous loss, Trump can amortize that loss for years, avoiding his taxes. All this despite the fact that Trump Property Corp now has substantial new assets obtained at below market value.
This is what Cerebus did to Mervyn's -- sold off all their property to another holding company, then let Mervyn's go bankrupt. Mervyn's then did not have enough to compensate their employee's wages, vacation, sick time or retirement benefits.
The real problem is when those tax laws are gamed by dishonest practices. For example, Trump Casino Corp sells all of the property, buildings, and assets to Trump Property Corp. -- at below market values ... like $1 Billion below market value. Trump Property Corp says, "Wow, what a geat deal". Meanwhile, Trump Casino Corp now has to lease buildings and other assets and above market value. Because Trump Casino Corp didn't receive market value for its assets, it dips into the red and then must file for bankruptcy. As a result, Trump Casino Corp can get away with paying its employees and creditors only a portion of what they are owed.
When Trump Casino Corp shows an enormous loss, Trump can amortize that loss for years, avoiding his taxes. All this despite the fact that Trump Property Corp now has substantial new assets obtained at below market value.
This is what Cerebus did to Mervyn's -- sold off all their property to another holding company, then let Mervyn's go bankrupt. Mervyn's then did not have enough to compensate their employee's wages, vacation, sick time or retirement benefits.
37
Follow the collusion. Subject matter aside, we must examine the handling of this information. Take it on faith? unsolicited, over the transom submission? investigated for weeks, then concluded authentic. Forward to first debate where the liberal candidate states opponent has not released taxes for three reasons, one of which - ‘he has never paid Federal taxes.’ Miraculously this was coincidentally followed up with the ‘in depth’ “bombshell’ ‘October surprise’ expose from the NYT. Had the NYT consulted/colluded with the Dem campaign before the debate SHARING the information and enabling the candidate to promulgate the information? Had they equally presented/shared the info with the opponent? Is there a problem with news outlets appearing to collude in political campaigns? Duh?
Even our upper level officials in the DOJ simply blow off the appearance of impropriety, so why not the media as well?
The media, the fourth estate, was relied upon to offer unvarnished news and facts to the public. Media, in bed with a campaign, goes beyond the pale, and can no longer be trusted nor relied upon for truth and objectivity, when they are total harbingers of, and traffic solely in, bias. Far more dangerous is media becoming the dupe of maniacally driven, obsessed with power, individuals who have allegiance only to their nefarious use of power and influence. In their purpose, the country be damned and its people be damned.
Even our upper level officials in the DOJ simply blow off the appearance of impropriety, so why not the media as well?
The media, the fourth estate, was relied upon to offer unvarnished news and facts to the public. Media, in bed with a campaign, goes beyond the pale, and can no longer be trusted nor relied upon for truth and objectivity, when they are total harbingers of, and traffic solely in, bias. Far more dangerous is media becoming the dupe of maniacally driven, obsessed with power, individuals who have allegiance only to their nefarious use of power and influence. In their purpose, the country be damned and its people be damned.
5
Leaving aside the question whether the Times committed, or aided and abetted, a crime in publishing Donald Trump's tax returns, the article suggests much and proves little. The 1995 tax returns don't establish whether, for example, he was entitled to the $915 million NOL or how it was applied in future years. Given the shaky real estate economy in those years, and the highly levered nature of most commercial real estate ventures, as well as special depreciation benefits afforded to real estate, we don't know to what extent the tax losses were real economic losses. Like many real estate developers, Trump went up, he went down and then up again. That's a sign of risk, not so much of competence or lack thereof.
None of that mattered to the Times, of course. What mattered was to do a big hit job on Trump, with little regard for whether the implications and insinuations in the article(s) are warranted or represent a fair reading of the facts and circumstances.
None of that mattered to the Times, of course. What mattered was to do a big hit job on Trump, with little regard for whether the implications and insinuations in the article(s) are warranted or represent a fair reading of the facts and circumstances.
8
Some commenters point out that Trump was within the letter of the law, and that his actions in avoiding taxes is a rational response within a system that incentivizes such behavior. Take into consideration the excellent reporting done by David Fahkrenhold of the Washington Post regarding Trump's Foundation. What Fahkrenhold has documented is that the Trump Foundation appears to be operating in violation of New York State law and the federal tax code. In fact, Trump has already acknowledge a federal tax violation related to the Foundation's payment to the Florida AG. Trump must have aged out of the tax loss allowable by the 1995 loss, and in recent years has turned to using his Foundation to avoid paying taxes.
While there might not be anything illegal about the recognition of the 1995 tax loss as an offset of his personal taxable income in subsequent years, Trump has clearly crossed the line in recent years in his Foundation's dealings. He has instructed payees who owed him money to pay the Foundation (thus avoiding personal taxable income). He has deployed the Foundation's assets to benefit his businesses. The overall picture is of a man who spends his time and energy scamming others, constantly seeking ways to avoid paying taxes and flagrantly flouting the law in doing so.
While there might not be anything illegal about the recognition of the 1995 tax loss as an offset of his personal taxable income in subsequent years, Trump has clearly crossed the line in recent years in his Foundation's dealings. He has instructed payees who owed him money to pay the Foundation (thus avoiding personal taxable income). He has deployed the Foundation's assets to benefit his businesses. The overall picture is of a man who spends his time and energy scamming others, constantly seeking ways to avoid paying taxes and flagrantly flouting the law in doing so.
20
How do you think the Clinton Foundation got contributions? If you wanted Hill or Bill to speak, you paid both person and foundation.
2
The Clinton Foundation is an international humanitarian organization that operates programs around the world. The Trump Foundation is a private, non-profit grant-giving foundation that donates money to causes. Between 2007-2014, Bill and Hillary Clinton gave $4.6 million to the Clinton Foundation. Trump has not provided a dime to the Trump Foundation personally since 2008. The concern with the Clinton Foundation (and I believe it's a valid concern) is that Hillary gave special access to donors, and that as President, a potential conflict of interest might exist with respect to the Clinton Foundation. The Clintons have addressed this by saying that Bill would step down from running the Foundation if Hillary is elected. On the other hand, Trump has operated his Foundation outside the bounds of the law, apparently using the Foundation to benefit his own personal financial and business interests. Today the NYAG found the Foundation in violation of New York State law and ordered it to cease operating within New York State. Other reports suggest Trump might have used the Foundation to evade personal federal income taxes.
2
If these rich people can avoid taxes, I want that ability too! They are laughing all the way to the bank at the middle class. When are the politicians FINALLY going to reform our tax code? Trump says the middle class is getting ripped off, but has not offered any plan to fix this. He is all talk and no brain, and I doubt he has ever done anything to help anyone that didn't help himself too.
20
The system is rigged ---for the wealthiest .
10
Hey Bill
You want that opportunity. Become a businessperson. Create jobs, pay property tax, employee tax, insurances, real estate taxes.
Don't tell me you want his negative tax positions when you are just receiving a paycheck.
You want that opportunity. Become a businessperson. Create jobs, pay property tax, employee tax, insurances, real estate taxes.
Don't tell me you want his negative tax positions when you are just receiving a paycheck.
2
Tom, in Trump's case that would be more like create jobs, but stiff the workers for their work, file for bankruptcy, four, five, six times, don't pay your bills, stiff your creditors, don't pay investors, claim a loss and laugh all the way to the bank. You mean that kind of businessman?
1
Donald Trump is a business man. He pays when he needs to.
Does anyone have a problem with using the rules as they are laided out ? Or do you clinton supporters have a different approach ?
I don't.
Does anyone have a problem with using the rules as they are laided out ? Or do you clinton supporters have a different approach ?
I don't.
5
The problem is that none of us normal people would ever in a million years have a loss of nearly a billion dollars to write off. What we need to know is what business practice led up to such a loss?
2
Taxes are a relic of commodity based money, absurd in a world of pushbutton cash.
Trump went bankrupt and came back. The US is bankrupt. Can Trump use his expertise to bring the country back? I may doubt it, but Hillary is a lightweight when the issues are business.
Trump went bankrupt and came back. The US is bankrupt. Can Trump use his expertise to bring the country back? I may doubt it, but Hillary is a lightweight when the issues are business.
5
To quote the man himself, "The system is rigged!"
8
so let me get this straight, a Mcdonalds hamburger cook paid more federal income tax than Donald Trump. How is that possible?
18
Why would he "fix" the tax code? Certainly no incentive to do so, from his standpoint. He has benefited mightily from it... And if his supporters think this is okay....there is no help.
16
Contrary to Trump's silly defense and ridiculous spin, he does not know the "ins and outs of the tax code." His high paid lawyers and accountants do. Trump gambled and lost, and then told his lawyers to make the best of it. The notion that this makes him a "genius" as his surrogates have claimed is one of the more absurd claims in an election of very absurd claims.
24
Then again, maybe the gamble paved the way for a concocted loss.
You have to wonder how the NY Times vetted this "tax return". I am just a lowly Enrolled Agent, but it is inconceivable to me that the accountant of people with Trump's money would be using tax preparation software that could not handle 9 digits, 2 commas, and a minus sign.
5
Some guy in Florida says he did it. I'm somewhat amazed that Mr. Trump would use a man without ethics, or who is available for cash, but obviously he learned better at some point.
What am I missing here? Some kind of scandal? Seriously, Times, are you supposed to pay more taxes that you owe? If so, I'm in trouble. The statement from the Trump campaign says all you need to know--maybe you should re-read it and stop wasting our time with tax returns from 1995.
5
What you may not understand is that a business loss may have been pre-arranged. After all he claims to be the guru of debt.
The serfs, lackeys and economic royalists are out in force testifying that Trump did nothing wrong in his tax filings. They claim, unctuously, based on scant, shading into illusory, insights into the financial affairs of billionaires, that it's all "business as usual." They claim the mantle of hard-headed economic realists, yet they are more akin to mediaeval peasants gazing slack jawed at a stained glass window. Clearly they have no comprehension of the byzantine business operations of Trump, yet they stand in simian awe of his wealth regardless. Trump himself alleges that he is currently under IRS audit, and some wrongdoing may yet be uncovered.
9
1) To generate a -$916 million NOL; an income statement and taxable income document could be created as follows: [Total Revenue ($1,000 million) - Total Expenses ($1,916 million) = Net Operating Loss (-$916 million)]. This is a huge loss.
2) If a business earned a 10% annual ROI from a $500 million investment, its annual net profit and taxable income equals:
[Total Revenue ($500 million) - Total Expenses ($450) = Net Profit ($50 million)]. With a carryback period of 3 years and a carryforward period of 15 years, or a total period of 18 years; and since [(-$916 m NOL/-$50 m Loss/yr) = 18.32 yrs], then about 18 tax-free years result; per The Times analysis.
3) This -$916 million NOL provides an immediate return of all federal income taxes paid for the carryback years. But, for the 15 year carry- forward period, the future deductions would represent a type of monetary asset from the balance sheet; whose nominal value is constant. With the passage of time and yearly inflation, like other monetary assets, the NOL would decline in real value. For ex, with an annual inflation rate of 5%, the present value (PV) of the tax deduction for 15 years would equal only 48.1% of its nominal value. [[1/((1.05)^15)] = (1/2.0789) = 0.481; and 0.481 x 100 = 48.1%]. At an inflation rate of 10%, the PV of this NOL declines to only 23.9% of its nominal value. So, to take full advantage of this NOL deduction, higher ROIs with their greater risks, are encouraged.
10/3 M 12:09p Greenville NC
2) If a business earned a 10% annual ROI from a $500 million investment, its annual net profit and taxable income equals:
[Total Revenue ($500 million) - Total Expenses ($450) = Net Profit ($50 million)]. With a carryback period of 3 years and a carryforward period of 15 years, or a total period of 18 years; and since [(-$916 m NOL/-$50 m Loss/yr) = 18.32 yrs], then about 18 tax-free years result; per The Times analysis.
3) This -$916 million NOL provides an immediate return of all federal income taxes paid for the carryback years. But, for the 15 year carry- forward period, the future deductions would represent a type of monetary asset from the balance sheet; whose nominal value is constant. With the passage of time and yearly inflation, like other monetary assets, the NOL would decline in real value. For ex, with an annual inflation rate of 5%, the present value (PV) of the tax deduction for 15 years would equal only 48.1% of its nominal value. [[1/((1.05)^15)] = (1/2.0789) = 0.481; and 0.481 x 100 = 48.1%]. At an inflation rate of 10%, the PV of this NOL declines to only 23.9% of its nominal value. So, to take full advantage of this NOL deduction, higher ROIs with their greater risks, are encouraged.
10/3 M 12:09p Greenville NC
2
Don't hate him ...just want to know if I can work for him!
Despise soooooo much tax taken from my Incredible Shrinking Paycheck.
Despise soooooo much tax taken from my Incredible Shrinking Paycheck.
3
Please read on for the stories of people who worked for him, got screwed, and lost everything.
That's really the point. If he REALLY created thousands of good paying secure jobs, that might make this a little easier to swallow. But he's nothing but a con artist, and a despicable person.
That's really the point. If he REALLY created thousands of good paying secure jobs, that might make this a little easier to swallow. But he's nothing but a con artist, and a despicable person.
1
Would you have him pay more tax than the IRS thinks he owes?
If so, who else would you hold to that standard? Do YOU pay more tax than you owe?
If so, who else would you hold to that standard? Do YOU pay more tax than you owe?
6
I would like him to OWN the fact he pays less than Mitt. Instead, he's ashamed of it? Or understood most of us haven't any hope of sheltering our loses into decades of tax free rides?
What have we got to lose? Not as much as Donald.
What have we got to lose? Not as much as Donald.
If Trump has not paid taxes for 18 years, then either the net result of this business genius's endeavors for those 18 years has been to lose money or, he has cheated.
4
Can the NYT please publish an article explaining in greater detail how the Donald could use business losses to offset his personal income tax burden by 915 MILLION dollars? The brief description of net operating loss doesn't make much sense to me since I thought business losses were just that, losses that the business itself could use to offset future taxes, but if he was able to reduce the business's obligations by declaring bankruptcy, how can he then use those same losses on his personal obligations. I'm sure that what he has done is legal since anyone with that tax return is going to be carefully scrutinized, but why is it legal?
3
So much for being a brilliant businessman that Trump claims to be- he is clearly not.
We all knew he declared bankruptcy multiple times, stiffed small businesses by not paying bills and we all suspected he was not nearly as rich as he claimed.
Now we know- he's a loser deadbeat. Who can lose nearly a billion dollars in one year and claim to be a brilliant business person? Sorry Donald- your one claim to fame is being a great business man- and now we know even that was nothing but a lie. Trump=lies.
No wonder he doesn't want to release his tax returns- it's not so much his not paying taxes for decades- and that is bad enough.
It's really because everyone will know he has lied and lied and lied about his great business acumen.
He's an idiot- and if Trump wasn't born into wealth and got a great start financially from his father- he would never have made it in business today.
He doesn't have the mental capacity, he doesn't prepare, he seems lazy and untrustworthy and I cannot imagine anyone hiring him even as a middle manager.
Unlike Obama and Clinton who were not born into wealth but pulled themselves up by their own hard work with no advantages- Trump has had everything handed him on a silver platter- and still managed to run his businesses into the ground.
We all knew he declared bankruptcy multiple times, stiffed small businesses by not paying bills and we all suspected he was not nearly as rich as he claimed.
Now we know- he's a loser deadbeat. Who can lose nearly a billion dollars in one year and claim to be a brilliant business person? Sorry Donald- your one claim to fame is being a great business man- and now we know even that was nothing but a lie. Trump=lies.
No wonder he doesn't want to release his tax returns- it's not so much his not paying taxes for decades- and that is bad enough.
It's really because everyone will know he has lied and lied and lied about his great business acumen.
He's an idiot- and if Trump wasn't born into wealth and got a great start financially from his father- he would never have made it in business today.
He doesn't have the mental capacity, he doesn't prepare, he seems lazy and untrustworthy and I cannot imagine anyone hiring him even as a middle manager.
Unlike Obama and Clinton who were not born into wealth but pulled themselves up by their own hard work with no advantages- Trump has had everything handed him on a silver platter- and still managed to run his businesses into the ground.
15
The average income (adjusted for inflation) for the top 1% went from $871,100 in 2009 to $968,000 over 2012 and 2013. That's an 11% increase.
The average income (adjusted for inflation) for the bottom 99% dropped. Average incomes for the bottom 99% fell by a $100 from $44,000 to $43,900. That's a loss of almost a quarter of a percent.
When you factor in items like the tax loopholes that people like Donald Trump use to shelter all of his income, as is noted in the article, then it becomes clear that the bottom 99% of people who have lost buying power from their base income are still paying for all the services like police, fire protection, infrastructure maintenance, schools, etc. that are also being used by the top 1%.
Don't let them change the message. If you are living in America and you run a business, you should be paying your share of the use of all the services provided by the government. With great financial gain comes with great responsibilities. Didn't Spiderman say something like that when he got rich?
The average income (adjusted for inflation) for the bottom 99% dropped. Average incomes for the bottom 99% fell by a $100 from $44,000 to $43,900. That's a loss of almost a quarter of a percent.
When you factor in items like the tax loopholes that people like Donald Trump use to shelter all of his income, as is noted in the article, then it becomes clear that the bottom 99% of people who have lost buying power from their base income are still paying for all the services like police, fire protection, infrastructure maintenance, schools, etc. that are also being used by the top 1%.
Don't let them change the message. If you are living in America and you run a business, you should be paying your share of the use of all the services provided by the government. With great financial gain comes with great responsibilities. Didn't Spiderman say something like that when he got rich?
5
Nine Hundred and Sixteen Million ---Bad Business Decisions doesn't mean you're a genius!
13
This has to be the only place in the USA where people like paying taxes.LOL
4
So you like paying for all the services that Trump uses for free.
Please, folks, Donald Trump does NOT do his own tax returns.
He hires people -- expensive people -- to do his tax returns.
He is no genius. What he is is a Very Wealthy man who can and does hire expensive and smart people to do his taxes.
That does not require genius; it just requires money, lots of money.
Meantime, the rest of us dopes (suckers?) are paying for the police and fire personnel and military people and equipment and everything else the government provides to protect us.
Donald trump rides over the roads and bridges and tunnels we taxpayers do our best to maintain. Trump is yelling at rallies that we tax-paying dopes aren't doing enough to maintain those facilities well enough for his taste.
Maybe we could borrow the Tax people Donald hires and then none of us would have to pay taxes.
Then, I am sure we would all donate our free time to maintaining our roads during snow storms and providing help to people and homes and businesses harmed by hurricanes an tornadoes.
We tax-paying dopes would also devote our vacation time to being police and fire personnel. I'm not sure how we would or could replace our military personnel, but who cares? -- we can be happy none of us dopes are paying taxes!
He hires people -- expensive people -- to do his tax returns.
He is no genius. What he is is a Very Wealthy man who can and does hire expensive and smart people to do his taxes.
That does not require genius; it just requires money, lots of money.
Meantime, the rest of us dopes (suckers?) are paying for the police and fire personnel and military people and equipment and everything else the government provides to protect us.
Donald trump rides over the roads and bridges and tunnels we taxpayers do our best to maintain. Trump is yelling at rallies that we tax-paying dopes aren't doing enough to maintain those facilities well enough for his taste.
Maybe we could borrow the Tax people Donald hires and then none of us would have to pay taxes.
Then, I am sure we would all donate our free time to maintaining our roads during snow storms and providing help to people and homes and businesses harmed by hurricanes an tornadoes.
We tax-paying dopes would also devote our vacation time to being police and fire personnel. I'm not sure how we would or could replace our military personnel, but who cares? -- we can be happy none of us dopes are paying taxes!
13
The late great Leonia Hemsley told her housekeeper, We don't pay taxes, only the little people pay taxes." She was known as the Queen of Mean and a fierce rival to Trump. It appears The Donald wants that crown very, very badly.
13
How does a great business man loose almost a billion dollars in the financial boom times of the 1990s? And the business was not selling ice in Alaska. It was casinos in NJ. Casinos where the house ALWAYS wins! To loose that much money in such a venture he must have made hundreds of bad business decisions. Toto (aka NYT) just pulled the curtain back!
9
Maybe he learned how to launder his money from the guys that know the most about Casino's, the mob.
The leak of scant tax information could have been a “calculated move” on Trump's part. Media has only been been to conclude that ’95 losses could have allowed Trump not to pay taxes for 20 years. His followers have already portrayed him as smart businessman for his ability to come out of the hole. Media’s inability to conclude much else also support Trump’s claims that sharing returns doesn’t reveal much.
Absent Trump’s full tax returns, media needs to do more investigation. Benchmark other billionaires and show if they paid more taxes than Trunp did. Benchmark other real estate moguls and see if they also went through similar market driven dire circumstances as Trump did.
Strong chances that Trump returns will be anomalous compared to others because Trump woes were not tied with bad real estate market. The losses have largely been due to bloated projects in casinos without any foresight related to diluting casino business in Atlantic City.
Media should report his failed ventures relative to successful ones to prove he is not as smart a businessman as he claims to be.
Media also needs to point out that Trump’s policy would include changing the tax code biased in favor of the super-rich class if he really meant to fix the broken system to the benefit of middle class. Instead, he guarantees further reduction in taxes for the super-rich. Go figure Trump followers.
Absent Trump’s full tax returns, media needs to do more investigation. Benchmark other billionaires and show if they paid more taxes than Trunp did. Benchmark other real estate moguls and see if they also went through similar market driven dire circumstances as Trump did.
Strong chances that Trump returns will be anomalous compared to others because Trump woes were not tied with bad real estate market. The losses have largely been due to bloated projects in casinos without any foresight related to diluting casino business in Atlantic City.
Media should report his failed ventures relative to successful ones to prove he is not as smart a businessman as he claims to be.
Media also needs to point out that Trump’s policy would include changing the tax code biased in favor of the super-rich class if he really meant to fix the broken system to the benefit of middle class. Instead, he guarantees further reduction in taxes for the super-rich. Go figure Trump followers.
7
I think the point that needs to be reiterated is that for people in real estate, like Trump, the losses made in real estate are not limited offsetting other real estate gains. For a certain small section of people, those real estate losses can offset any and all income the person makes in those 18 years. That means Trump very likely paid no taxes on any income during those years including the income he made for his T.V. income from The Apprentice.
Wouldn't that be nice to do for yourself?
Wouldn't that be nice to do for yourself?
5
So, If I understand correctly, Trump supporters' response to the Times story is:
This was an outrageous, illegal, defamatory hit job that shows that Trump did nothing illegal or wrong and that he is a genius.
This was an outrageous, illegal, defamatory hit job that shows that Trump did nothing illegal or wrong and that he is a genius.
5
If you can stop pretending to know what a conservative thinks, I will help. We don't have any response save that Donald Trump is a better, more honest candidate than her.
2
Air Marshal - Every reputable fact checker on the planet has noted that Trump lies far more than Hillary so how can you claim that he's more honest?
1
By strongly disagreeing with their methods which lead to such dishonest conclusions and your blind acceptance of them. Thanks for asking.
Please show me the illegal activity here...using business loss write offs are a common legal tactic of millions of US taxpayers. Trump has used them as have the Clintons and event the NY Times. The only illegal activity here is the leaking of private tax returns and subsequent publishing. Let's prosecute the leakers...
4
Now we know why Trump has been audited for so many years; still exhausting his first big failure. I mean really BIG! Almost a billion.
But I bet he's been able to add to it, you betcha! Poor Deutsche Bank, left holding the bag.
But I bet he's been able to add to it, you betcha! Poor Deutsche Bank, left holding the bag.
11
We don't know that the 1995 $900 million loss survived IRS audits. We don't know, but we can guess, that the loss was not of Mr. Trump's money, but the loss of his partnership interest paid for as carried interests by his investors. We do know is that Mr. Trump has a long record of paying too much for hotels and casinos and a long record of losing other people's money. Buyer beware.
3
OK, so Trump uses our current Federal Tax regulations and doesn't pay any Federal Taxes on his current income because of previous Real Estate losses. Now that sounds legal and since the IRS has audited his Company for the last ten years, what's the problem? Just think of all the other Real Estate tycoons who do the same thing, just amazing! This article makes it sound like Trump did something wrong and should have been prosecuted for those actions, am I missing something? But why doesn't Warren Buffet pay his "Fair Share" as he pays less than his secretary. Time to change the system, don't you think...!
3
Warren Buffet not only pays his fair share, but he also gives a lot of his money to charity. Trump is his own charity. He didn't build any great business; he appears to have deliberately failed at certain businesses to benefit his own bank account! I don't care if it was legal--he bilked investors and contractors and walked away with a huge personal tax savings. All Trump cares about is Trump--what makes anyone think that once he is president, he will work to change the tax code to benefit the rest of us? This is NOT a man who acts for the greater good, particularly if it is against his own self-interest!
7
Was it illegal? Was he the only one doing it? Was it 20 years ago? Did Hillary use the same loopholes?
4
Trump's accountant told the reporter most of his clients were in Donald's position; he was Fred's accountant, too. But I think Donald lost more than the average bear.
3
No.
Wow. Just Wow.
As a self employed business owner and father of two this enrages me. To think of the things I could do with the $20k+ in taxes our family pays each year. Vacation, time off, save for college, save for a house, new clothes for the kids, etc. I don't mind paying my taxes, but when you hear about this you think of all the things you could do if you didn't have to pay anything, like Trump.
To think that Trump has avoided paying this really sickens me, knowing that so many people in less coddled circumstances work so very hard to keep our heads above water and pay our share of taxes.
As a self employed business owner and father of two this enrages me. To think of the things I could do with the $20k+ in taxes our family pays each year. Vacation, time off, save for college, save for a house, new clothes for the kids, etc. I don't mind paying my taxes, but when you hear about this you think of all the things you could do if you didn't have to pay anything, like Trump.
To think that Trump has avoided paying this really sickens me, knowing that so many people in less coddled circumstances work so very hard to keep our heads above water and pay our share of taxes.
13
Turn your home into a golf club, and you get to vacation every day, tin cup!
Realty, they live in their own realities. Depreciating property while pitching it as a never lose proposition. No wonder Donald can't fathom it.
Realty, they live in their own realities. Depreciating property while pitching it as a never lose proposition. No wonder Donald can't fathom it.
3
Where is the Times exclusive on Hillary Clinton's speeches to corporations, banks, et al.?
If she has nothing to hide, why not just release the speeches and be done with it?
At this point, she has over a 75% chance of winning. Yet, she is still hiding by a wall of secrecy.
-- From an independent voter that supports neither candidate and wants the major media outlets to scrutinize them both.
If she has nothing to hide, why not just release the speeches and be done with it?
At this point, she has over a 75% chance of winning. Yet, she is still hiding by a wall of secrecy.
-- From an independent voter that supports neither candidate and wants the major media outlets to scrutinize them both.
4
Bob, Clinton has made her tax returns public so you, and all voters, can learn exactly where her income comes from. As far as releasing the actual speeches: it is very common for speakers to get honoraria for giving speeches. The content may be protected as intellectual property by whatever organization paid for her time. This hardly represents a "wall of secrecy." Meanwhile, Trump continues to lie, and it is about time the media scrutinized him. Clinton's emails have received far more scrutiny than any of the dozens of Trump's scandals.
9
Trump prides himself in avoiding paying taxes to help cover the expense of all the government services and security from which he benefits and then has the gall to criticize NATO allies for not paying their fare share for American protection?
19
"The three documents arrived by mail at The Times with a postmark indicating they had been sent from New York City. The return address claimed the envelope had been sent from Trump Tower."
Did Trump himself send the returns to the Times?
Considering what he says and does, it's as if he really doesn't want to be president.
Did Trump himself send the returns to the Times?
Considering what he says and does, it's as if he really doesn't want to be president.
4
Taxes are the price of civilization, but Donald is not in that market.
6
While the numbers involved in this issue may seem huge, Trump using legitimate tax code shelters is not the main story. The tax laws have long ago been moving towards excessive benefits to the wealthiest people and corporations in our country. There are two issues that are of legitimate concern. One, for a man who claims to be very very successful how could he accrue such a level of losses to take the tax breaks he did. More important, in my view, is the unknown amount that he has, or more likely has not, given to charity. In all probability this number is going to be drastically lower than one would think, or that he himself has claimed. True, there is no law that says you must share your wealth but there is an expectation that those who have benefited from the opportunities in our country would show a desire to help others through charitable giving. As is already known, Trumps foundation has been funded for a number of years now completely by the donations of others. Once again the issue returns to the character of the person that we will chose to lead our country. Will this matter to his supporters, likely not or not enough to counter their distaste for Clinton, but in a race where the undecided will decide our future, these glimpses into the character, or lack thereof, of the man may influence their choice. Good motivation to keep recent tax records in hiding.
4
What most of the readers of this Hillary rag fail to grasp is that the Tax Code is written by the Congress, the same fellows who took us to war in Iraq--both of which Hillary was a part of when she was a New York Senator.
What seems to be the message here is that Rand Paul's everybody pays taxes, rich or poor, and no deductions is what everyone seems to be demanding--stock market crash for sure and less income for New York City--or, perhaps, a special Bloomberg Tax regardless of Federalized Adjusted Income--rich pay a special tax.
The greater crime is the home mortgage deduction--who makes up that billions of dollars in tax loss? Those who don't own homes?
What seems to be the message here is that Rand Paul's everybody pays taxes, rich or poor, and no deductions is what everyone seems to be demanding--stock market crash for sure and less income for New York City--or, perhaps, a special Bloomberg Tax regardless of Federalized Adjusted Income--rich pay a special tax.
The greater crime is the home mortgage deduction--who makes up that billions of dollars in tax loss? Those who don't own homes?
3
Obama EBT Holding Company.
"A company created to buy and possess the shares of other companies, which it then controls."
"A company created to buy and possess the shares of other companies, which it then controls."
Wow. A billionaire who doesn't pay taxes, what's this world coming to. Like Warren Buffet said his secretary pays a higher tax rate then he does in a country founded by and for business. Now back to revelations, available 24/7 on all channels.
4
I'm no Trump fan, but this is rank yellow journalism. "Could Have"? What kind of reporting is that? He also "could have" made $2 billion profit the next year. And what exactly is the story here--that Trump used the Net Operating Loss (NOL) rules the same way every other business, large and small, in America does? Look at any public corporation's financial statements that has had net losses, and you are likely to see disclosure about use of NOLs. This would be no surprise to anyone who knows anything at all about taxation of businesses in the US. Is the suggestion that Trump should voluntarily have paid more taxes than the law said he owed? Let me ask you, who does that? Do you? Do the NYT reporters? Does the NYT? Let us see the NYT's tax returns--how about that?
4
Maybe Donald can share his genius with the rest of us that are not are as smart. Will he teach us, non-billionaires, how not to pay taxes?
3
And as HRC pointed out in the debate, prior to this news, DR did not help fund veterans, education, etc., if he paid no taxes. The other implication of his massive loss from the mid-1990s and his massive business failures is that the people who worked for were not paid or at least not in full. And many could not afford that loss, nor could they take advantage of tax loopholes. So while DR was living high, they got bilked. The voters will get bilked if they elect this fraud to office.
4
Can we finally put to bed Paul Ryan and the rest of the Republican's ideology that the wealth need more tax breaks and loopholes? First we discover GE paid no taxes now Trump. It really is hard to fathom how poor, middle class Americans can support this man.
Ask any tax attorney or average tax payer who has gone through bankruptcy proceedings, not only is your life a living hell for decades, but not for the wealthy who has much more wealth protections than the average American.
It's time that we admit to ourselves, America no longer rewards success and hard work, it protects those who make a career of failing big and suck the life blood from those who do the hard work. This is true of Wall Street, Silicon Valley and the real estate speculators like Trump.
It is the height of hypocrisy that undocumented workers pay more in a year to support this country, than people like Trump who talk about spending more on war, building walls contribute nothing. Tea Partiers and the Conservatives think its tax cuts that will make America great again, when in reality its closing the loopholes and making their wealthy patrons pay their obligations first, then we can talk about cuts.
Ask any tax attorney or average tax payer who has gone through bankruptcy proceedings, not only is your life a living hell for decades, but not for the wealthy who has much more wealth protections than the average American.
It's time that we admit to ourselves, America no longer rewards success and hard work, it protects those who make a career of failing big and suck the life blood from those who do the hard work. This is true of Wall Street, Silicon Valley and the real estate speculators like Trump.
It is the height of hypocrisy that undocumented workers pay more in a year to support this country, than people like Trump who talk about spending more on war, building walls contribute nothing. Tea Partiers and the Conservatives think its tax cuts that will make America great again, when in reality its closing the loopholes and making their wealthy patrons pay their obligations first, then we can talk about cuts.
2
And the Brilliance in losing a Billion is where exactly?
If you lose a Trillion are you the MENSA Chairperson?
If you lose a Trillion are you the MENSA Chairperson?
6
When billionaires use their legislated loop holes to avoid paying any taxes, the rest of us get to pay more, to pick up the slack. We are the chumps in this story.
It is time for repair. We should abolish the NOL, Net Operating Loss carry forward, for anyone worth over $200 million, and allow all citizens to wipe out student debt through bankruptcy. While we are changing the playing field, we should pass laws that say that the student debt interest rate must be pegged at the lowest 30 year mortgage rates, and no doctor's office can charge someone without health insurance more than the lowest fee they accept from the strongest insurance company or government payer.
It is time for repair. We should abolish the NOL, Net Operating Loss carry forward, for anyone worth over $200 million, and allow all citizens to wipe out student debt through bankruptcy. While we are changing the playing field, we should pass laws that say that the student debt interest rate must be pegged at the lowest 30 year mortgage rates, and no doctor's office can charge someone without health insurance more than the lowest fee they accept from the strongest insurance company or government payer.
5
People are impressed with Trump's "business acumen" because he plays with such large numbers. Anyone who can put "billion" in his c.v. must be smart, right? No. It's true Trump plays with big numbers, but a loss is a loss, and a loss as huge as his tax write-off from 1995 denotes a clumsy and/or careless businessman, no matter how many zeroes there are to the left of the decimal point.
3
His lawyers said audits on his 2002-2008 returns were closed “without assessment or payment, on a net basis, of any deficiency.” What a squirrelly sentence, that the lawyers refused to clarify! This can easily mean they found substantial deficiencies, charged him for them (including penalties) but that he had not yet used up his $916 million tax loss carry-forward, so "on a net basis" there was no "assessment or payment". Even by his logic of not releasing returns under audit, there is no basis for not releasing his returns up through 2008. With three pages from 1995 the public has learned a lot. We'd learn a lot more from the returns through 2008.
2
…for tax year 2014, The New York Times paid no taxes and got an income tax refund of $3.5 million even though they had a pre-tax profit of $29.9 million in 2014. In other words, their post-tax profit was higher than their pre-tax profit. The explanation in their 2014 annual report is, “The effective tax rate for 2014 was favorably affected by approximately $21.1 million for the reversal of reserves for uncertain tax positions due to the lapse of applicable statutes of limitations.” If you don’t think it took fancy accountants and tax lawyers to make that happen, read the statement again.
2
using the tax cose to ones advantage is smart business, after all the government will waste it or steal the money anyway. tax avoidance is legal, tax evasion is not. and who out there thinks she did not selll state dept influence for cash under the table.be careful what you wish for.....
2
Well, if he violated the law, just put him to justice. If he didn't, then get the politicians who made those laws accountable. It's that simple. As far as I know, most big corporations, NYT included, all took advantage of the legal apparatus out there to dodge tax. It's just the fact. It's the incompetent law makers to blame, and Hillar Clinton is one of them. That's why we cannot afford those stupid but greedy politicians anymore.
1
Six bankruptcies and losses of $900 million on his tax returns?
Yeah, he's a real successful businessman!
What a loser.
Yeah, he's a real successful businessman!
What a loser.
9
When is the NYT going to host a roundtable of real estate moguls to discuss how they view the ethics of the way Donald Trump has conducted his business?
I suggest a substantial list of potential participants should be drawn up, each should be presented with one or two pages of questions and topics to be covered and positions they will be expected to take on the main issues, and any refusals to participate should be published by the paper.
The list should not fail to include those operating in all the swing states, as well as other major metropolitan areas.
I suggest a substantial list of potential participants should be drawn up, each should be presented with one or two pages of questions and topics to be covered and positions they will be expected to take on the main issues, and any refusals to participate should be published by the paper.
The list should not fail to include those operating in all the swing states, as well as other major metropolitan areas.
2
The law, in its majestic equality, forbids the rich as well as the poor to sleep under bridges, to beg in the streets, and to steal bread. Anatole France,
And it keeps on coming; depreciating real estate while it is accruing value. Thanks a lot congress, you criminals.
And it keeps on coming; depreciating real estate while it is accruing value. Thanks a lot congress, you criminals.
3
Clinton Campaign Admits Hillary Used Same Tax Avoidance "Scheme" As Trump
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-10-02/clinton-campaign-admits-hillary...
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-10-02/clinton-campaign-admits-hillary...
2
Atlantic City got gambling and took away Las Vegas business because people on East Cost did not have to travel there to gamble.
Atlantic City did a land order business.
The Indians got the courts and state legislators to declare a five acre plot in the middle of a city as an Indian Reservation with the right to run casinos.
Atlantic City went bankrupt because why would somebody travel from Boston to Atlantic City since they there was an Indian Casino nearby.
The crooked politicians who allowed the Indian Casinos had their white buddies run the casinos with firewater and (real) nickels handed to the Indians.
Trump took a billion dollar loss and lived to tell about it.
He is worth billions, lives in a Manhattan building that he owns and flies on his own plane.
The Progressives, who mostly work off of paychecks, think he is a business failure.
Atlantic City did a land order business.
The Indians got the courts and state legislators to declare a five acre plot in the middle of a city as an Indian Reservation with the right to run casinos.
Atlantic City went bankrupt because why would somebody travel from Boston to Atlantic City since they there was an Indian Casino nearby.
The crooked politicians who allowed the Indian Casinos had their white buddies run the casinos with firewater and (real) nickels handed to the Indians.
Trump took a billion dollar loss and lived to tell about it.
He is worth billions, lives in a Manhattan building that he owns and flies on his own plane.
The Progressives, who mostly work off of paychecks, think he is a business failure.
1
How can anybody look upon Trump's business career without concluding that the US tax law has been constructed to favor flimflam artists?
3
Who's more likely to want to reform the tax code: the Clintons, who have always wielded the power of the government, or Trump, who has had to pay for the tax lawyers? I'd bet on the one who pays. It's not tax avoidance, by the way, because he had already paid taxes when the profit was first made. It is double tax avoidance, but that wouldn't sound so scandalous.
It should also be noted that the NYT itself is using the same strategy.
It should also be noted that the NYT itself is using the same strategy.
2
Firstly, I'm on the fence.
Mr. Trump is not a lifelong politician and has not lived his life positioning himself for political office. His ethics and behavior are shameful while Mrs. Clinton's ethics are also questionable. Where o where is the ethical, moral, AND fiscally responsible (female) candidate? Maybe 2020 will have us seeing things more clearly ;)
Mr. Trump is not a lifelong politician and has not lived his life positioning himself for political office. His ethics and behavior are shameful while Mrs. Clinton's ethics are also questionable. Where o where is the ethical, moral, AND fiscally responsible (female) candidate? Maybe 2020 will have us seeing things more clearly ;)
2
I have a query to help me better understand something that I am curious about. Has the Republic Nominee Donald Trump personally donated large amounts of his personal fortune to his campaign or are they (business) loans that require repayment. If they do require repayment would they payment where would the payment come from?
Not sure of the election system hence my query. Hope you can help to clarify?
Not sure of the election system hence my query. Hope you can help to clarify?
1
I wonder if the Times has come across any information on Trump doing business in Iran or Iranian banks?
7
My father immigrated from Europe to the U.S. in 1932. His name is on the wall at Ellis Island. He went to college full time and worked full time at night as a janitor.
He later taught radar to the military in WWII. His brothers both fought in that war. He then worked for RCA and then for IBM until he was 75.
At one point, when he had three young children, he was unemployed, but refused to receive unemployment. When he tried to start a magazine it failed, but he repaid all of his investors.
He always said he was proud to pay his taxes. He considered it the price of freedom.
Mr. Trump, these are the kind of people that made America great.
He later taught radar to the military in WWII. His brothers both fought in that war. He then worked for RCA and then for IBM until he was 75.
At one point, when he had three young children, he was unemployed, but refused to receive unemployment. When he tried to start a magazine it failed, but he repaid all of his investors.
He always said he was proud to pay his taxes. He considered it the price of freedom.
Mr. Trump, these are the kind of people that made America great.
12
Thank you for writing about your dad. What integrity! You made my day.
1
Why any self-respecting working man or woman would support Donald Trump is beyond me. Trump drove multi-million dollar businesses into the ground, all the while ridiculously over-paying himself. In truth, he made himself rich on the backs of the working man, who ultimately got stiffed when Trump declared bankruptcy after sucking all the money out before declaring bankruptcy. And this makes him a successful businessman?????????? Baloney.
Ask all of the small businesses who went bankrupt or suffered debilitating losses when they weren't paid for the work they did. The bankruptcy proceedings will list all of them. Or what about Trump's propensity to let contractors do the work, and them stiff them on the bill by insisting that their work wasn't acceptable.
This is why Trump won't release his taxes. He wants to pretend that he's the Great Businessman. In truth, he's nothing more than the Great Snake Oil Salesman, no better than Bernie Madoff, who has lived off the blood and toil and suffering of the little guy. Trump is the guy who knew how to find the soul-less accountants who know how to play tricks with the money so the boss comes out ahead even when the working folks go home with empty pockets to hungry children.
And this guy wants to be president????? In years past, when his misdeeds became known, he would have been run out of town covered with tar and feathers. And he knows it. That's why no tax returns.
Ask all of the small businesses who went bankrupt or suffered debilitating losses when they weren't paid for the work they did. The bankruptcy proceedings will list all of them. Or what about Trump's propensity to let contractors do the work, and them stiff them on the bill by insisting that their work wasn't acceptable.
This is why Trump won't release his taxes. He wants to pretend that he's the Great Businessman. In truth, he's nothing more than the Great Snake Oil Salesman, no better than Bernie Madoff, who has lived off the blood and toil and suffering of the little guy. Trump is the guy who knew how to find the soul-less accountants who know how to play tricks with the money so the boss comes out ahead even when the working folks go home with empty pockets to hungry children.
And this guy wants to be president????? In years past, when his misdeeds became known, he would have been run out of town covered with tar and feathers. And he knows it. That's why no tax returns.
6
So the mystery is likely solved. Trump has, within the tax code, avoided paying taxes, possibly for decades. For middle class taxpayers this is surely upsetting. How dare he ask for our vote from the glitz and glitter of Trump Tower, or Trump Anything!
Trump doesn't live like you and me. We work five, six, seven days a week to pay for rent and mortgages, dentist bills, car payments, Christmas. This guy flies around on his private jet and eats appetizers prepared by top shelf chefs. I'm ticked.
But the question that keeps nagging me is where should my anger be directed? Towards Trump? Or towards a ridiculous tax code that underwrites the ability of the rich to avoid federal income taxes? The answer is pretty obvious to me.
When was the last time I did my taxes and concluded I should not take a deduction or tax credit I'm entitled to claim? Never. If I can legally lower my tax bill I'm on it.
The tax code has been corrupted over decades to provide legal ways for the very wealthy to lower or eliminate their federal income taxes.
Let's fix the tax code and not demonize good accountants.
Trump doesn't live like you and me. We work five, six, seven days a week to pay for rent and mortgages, dentist bills, car payments, Christmas. This guy flies around on his private jet and eats appetizers prepared by top shelf chefs. I'm ticked.
But the question that keeps nagging me is where should my anger be directed? Towards Trump? Or towards a ridiculous tax code that underwrites the ability of the rich to avoid federal income taxes? The answer is pretty obvious to me.
When was the last time I did my taxes and concluded I should not take a deduction or tax credit I'm entitled to claim? Never. If I can legally lower my tax bill I'm on it.
The tax code has been corrupted over decades to provide legal ways for the very wealthy to lower or eliminate their federal income taxes.
Let's fix the tax code and not demonize good accountants.
6
"This guy [Trump] flies around on his private jet and eats appetizers prepared by top shelf chefs."
Trump does real work -- see "The Art of the Deal" by Trump and Schwartz.
Trump does real work -- see "The Art of the Deal" by Trump and Schwartz.
1
The issue is the super wealthy keeps the special interest groups in place to make certain those laws are in place... This is what The donald "claims" to be fighting against..
3
In his response as a surrogate, Rudy used a telling phrase on which our culture hinged, a tipping point past come back to shake his chains and haunt us.
"He had a fiduciary responsibility to his company." When exactly did our fiduciary responsibility eclipse, all others? When did the bottom line, become our "Utmost"? I have been told by those with the gold to follow the golden rule. Then they always said, "The one with the gold makes the rules." And the unfathomable, "But I'm taking all the risk." They might lose money, God forbid some baubles, but we, we lose hours, days, weeks, months and years of our lives....for basic cable?
"He had a fiduciary responsibility to his company." When exactly did our fiduciary responsibility eclipse, all others? When did the bottom line, become our "Utmost"? I have been told by those with the gold to follow the golden rule. Then they always said, "The one with the gold makes the rules." And the unfathomable, "But I'm taking all the risk." They might lose money, God forbid some baubles, but we, we lose hours, days, weeks, months and years of our lives....for basic cable?
3
Breaching one's fiduciary duty, under such circumstances, would mean deciding that other people, that is, the shareholders, should have less income because of what you view as a need for more money by the government. I would not invest with such a fiduciary, possibly hipsters have other views and like losing money.
Republicans think it's OKAY for the wealthy to avoid taxes while the rest of us pay for everything. I got news. Running the largest economy in the world costs money to maintain, and the wealthy are the ones who benefit most. MAKE them pay 50%, and let's get this country back on the track. I am certain that Trump violated some laws while he was evading his taxes. Find the evidence, and send that creep to prison. He's the Bernard Madoff of the Republican party.
5
Rudy says Trump would have been sued had he not claimed the available deductions. This is nonsense. Assuming the accounting for the various failed businesses was proper, his decision to claim the losses on his PERSONAL tax return is the issue here. No one could have or would have sued him either way. Rudy knows this. Shame on him.
4
Clearly, loss of 916 Million is indication of Racketeering or running sham businesses in order to make extremely risky decisions, decieve investors and dodge taxes. He's like Wells Fargo robbing people by creating phony accounts --- meanwhile claiming to be a legitimate business. On the other hand, If everybody refused to pay taxes --- America Would Not Be Great. Donald Trump (a.k.a King George) gets "Representation without Taxation" and we are paying taxes for him to use the highways, airports, streets and hospitals --- for free! He cannot solve problems by being a problem!
4
I am more concerned about the fact we are spending money for Mr. Obama to campaign for the Democratic Party. When he takes Air Force One from New York for LA for the third fundraiser that week, he pays only a first-class airfare, a thousand or so. We pay through the nose.
1
Here - Did you have those same concerns about G.W. Bush? How about all of the travel that G.W.'s wife and daughters did?
1
Not to point out the obvious or anything, but the taxes pages posted are NY state taxes, not federal. The NY Times is making a huge assumption here, and they know it as evidence by their headline featuring the words "COULD HAVE". NY tax laws are different than federal tax laws, which limit the amount of a business loss you can take per year. That is why the loss can carryover. You can take the limit each year until you use up the total loss. What they are essentially stating by saying he could have taken the loss for 18 years is that his limit, it seems, is $50 million per year.
I cannot confirm that without seeing the FEDERAL income tax return, but if that is the case than the NY times is purposefully being misleading by implying without saying that he could have used the loss to pay $0 taxes. If his income was the same or less than the loss, that would be true. If he is only able to deduct $50 million per year and his income is higher, which is most likely is, then that is not true.
I cannot confirm that without seeing the FEDERAL income tax return, but if that is the case than the NY times is purposefully being misleading by implying without saying that he could have used the loss to pay $0 taxes. If his income was the same or less than the loss, that would be true. If he is only able to deduct $50 million per year and his income is higher, which is most likely is, then that is not true.
2
Even before every vote is counted, billionaire Don Trump wins the title, Poster Boy for Tax Reform.
Congress, do your job or go home one by shiftless one.
We the people, use our votes to reform Congress.
Congress, do your job or go home one by shiftless one.
We the people, use our votes to reform Congress.
3
Awe, just when I got my Mitt message on Private Equity down, we got to go back to real estate clowns? Donald told us there's a big bubble about to burst, and I bet Deutsche Bank was on his mind.
2
Trump puts himself forward as a role model. What kind of role model is a billionaire who shirks his civic and philanthropic responsibilities?
6
I'm sure Trump figured out a long time ago it was more profitable to bankrupt companies since he's got a golden parachute to land on his golden toilet bowl every time. Every once in awhile it does catch up to him (Trump University, etc), but that's when he makes an illegal campaign contribution or waives a golf membership fee-- and voila! he's off the hook. Does this make him a genius or just plain corrupt? All political/legal/economic systems have inherent flaws, and all depend on the spirit of the citizenry to help overcome them. If everyone in this whole country operated solely under the principles of greed and obeying the letter of the law as Mr. Trump does, this would be a land of pure chaos.
4
Despite these revelations Trump's base still follows him mindlessly. They are, inexplicably, hoodwinked and no facts will move them. I'm afraid of the possibility of a Trump presidency, but I'm more afraid of the people who will vote for him regardless of what is uncovered these last weeks of the campaign. If this is how so many Americans feel right now then our country is in more trouble than I ever thought. Such angry, angry, and ignorant people.
4
What is even more tragic and an astounding failure of journalism, is that this was finally reported on at the 11th Hour and not during the primaries, a year ago. Anderson Cooper with his kid-glove access-journalist questions. Matt Lauer in total deference providing misplaced awe and abdicating his professional obligation. Chuck Todd, unable to formulate a tough question for fear he'll never get another "name" booking, and the worst of all, Jake Tapper with his ever-respectful "Walk me through this again?" beating around the bush, rather than being tough, with one iota of firm, Mike Wallace-style straight-talk and interview questioning.
Jake Tapper has actually said that he "does not want to get in the way of the story," and "the people have made their choice of nominee," on NPR's "On The Media" program. Well, in standing back and out of the way as the worst kind of access journalists, Tapper and the rest of the press corps have done the crucial vetting interval a great disservice. It's not by accident that it was a print outlet that broke this most recent story.
Jake Tapper has actually said that he "does not want to get in the way of the story," and "the people have made their choice of nominee," on NPR's "On The Media" program. Well, in standing back and out of the way as the worst kind of access journalists, Tapper and the rest of the press corps have done the crucial vetting interval a great disservice. It's not by accident that it was a print outlet that broke this most recent story.
3
October Surprise!
2
And no one is surprised but Donald!
We knew he had right to some pretty amazing tax advantages, but no one expected him to fail so brilliantly he could ride tax free for so long! He took a lot of money out of that disaster.
We knew he had right to some pretty amazing tax advantages, but no one expected him to fail so brilliantly he could ride tax free for so long! He took a lot of money out of that disaster.
2
So, who knocked out Lyin Ted and Little Mario? Why look, it's DEADBEAT DONALD.
5
Dear mr. Trump,
This is what happens if you don't open up your tax registers yourself. So come on, release those tax forms. Don't make America wait again.
This is what happens if you don't open up your tax registers yourself. So come on, release those tax forms. Don't make America wait again.
4
Disgusting, very disgusting for the rest of us who pay taxes.
Any person who says that Mr. Trump is a genius because he found a way not to pay taxes like the rest of us is despicable and demonstrate a profound contempt to our country and its citizens.
Any person who says that Mr. Trump is a genius because he found a way not to pay taxes like the rest of us is despicable and demonstrate a profound contempt to our country and its citizens.
3
Entrepreneurs mitigate risk to their personal wealth by incorporating. It would be interesting to know if his businesses also claimed losses in that tax year.
1
We should never forget Donald Trump's own words.
He has bragged endlessly about how, over decades, he has contributed to the political campaigns of primarily Republican politicians and then expected them, in return, to take his calls and do his bidding.
Doesn't it seem reasonable to conclude that over the years, Trump has persuaded various (mostly) Republicans to tinker around the edges of our nation's income tax code to put in provisions favorable to Donald Trump's business interests?
Should we doubt Mr. Trump would have continued, over decades, contributing to politicians' campaigns if he was not receiving some benefit to himself from so doing when he tells us he always has benefited?
Yes, Donald contributed to Hillary's campaign, years ago, because -- as he stated -- he wanted the Clintons to attend his wedding! He has never even hinted that he asked Hillary Clinton for and/or rec'd -- as a result of her efforts on his behalf -- any tax code changes that benefited himself or his businesses
He has bragged endlessly about how, over decades, he has contributed to the political campaigns of primarily Republican politicians and then expected them, in return, to take his calls and do his bidding.
Doesn't it seem reasonable to conclude that over the years, Trump has persuaded various (mostly) Republicans to tinker around the edges of our nation's income tax code to put in provisions favorable to Donald Trump's business interests?
Should we doubt Mr. Trump would have continued, over decades, contributing to politicians' campaigns if he was not receiving some benefit to himself from so doing when he tells us he always has benefited?
Yes, Donald contributed to Hillary's campaign, years ago, because -- as he stated -- he wanted the Clintons to attend his wedding! He has never even hinted that he asked Hillary Clinton for and/or rec'd -- as a result of her efforts on his behalf -- any tax code changes that benefited himself or his businesses
3
So now it is somehow un-american to take all of your losses as tax deductions, or is it just because it's Trump? I take every deduction and write off I am entitled to, as I am sure every taxpayer does. How does that make me a tax dodger? I am legitimately entitled to them.Since when does that make me a criminal? God, you people sure have a way of twisting what is every taxpayers right into cheating.
4
"Highly skilled businessman.." my butt. Businesses he ran lost $900M+ in one year. That is worthy of a repeat: businesses he ran lost $900+M in one year. The only thing he is highly skilled at is using the bankruptcy code and the tax code to fatten his wallet at the expense of the small businesses and individuals who quit screwed in the bankruptcies, and honest, hard working people who actually pay taxes. While he likely is entitled to a Oscar for "Screwman Of The Century," he has no "business skills" that qualify him to run for dogcatcher.
7
The NY Times is incredibly brave to publish this when newspapers are in a dire way financially and they are one of the few papers in the west standing up for western democratic freedoms -well done.
6
Yes, and I will bet the NYT uses their losses to offset future income, like all businesses do.
6
But I am sure they will have no problem in showing people their records and if you are a great champion of the working people surely you should be doing this
1
Trump does not prepare his own taxes; he doesn't know the tax code.
As this article states:
"But if Mr. Trump lacked a sophisticated understanding of the tax code, and if he rarely showed any interest in the details behind various tax strategies, Mr. Mitnick said he clearly grasped the critical role taxes would play in helping him build wealth. “He knew we could use the tax code to protect him,” Mr. Mitnick said."
Yesterday, Trump tweeted the following:
"I know our complex tax laws better than anyone who has ever run for president and am the only one who can fix them. #failing@nytimes" 6:22 AM - 2 Oct 2016
But the huge glaring lie here is that Trump is not a taxation genius, with incredible mystical knowledge of our convoluted tax code, his accountants are.
He wants us to believe that he alone has run his financial empire, and that he alone will "run" the government--but he is not campaigning to be king, merely a president, and he doesn't operate his businesses alone.
He isn't "smart" for paying no tax, his accountants are--at best--smart for finding a way to do this.
The con-artist spin-master Donald takes credit for everyone else's work and actions. He isn't only hiding the truth about his finances, but the fact that he is a frightened, jealous, little man who uses swaggering lies and bragging to cover up his profound sense of inferiority.
As this article states:
"But if Mr. Trump lacked a sophisticated understanding of the tax code, and if he rarely showed any interest in the details behind various tax strategies, Mr. Mitnick said he clearly grasped the critical role taxes would play in helping him build wealth. “He knew we could use the tax code to protect him,” Mr. Mitnick said."
Yesterday, Trump tweeted the following:
"I know our complex tax laws better than anyone who has ever run for president and am the only one who can fix them. #failing@nytimes" 6:22 AM - 2 Oct 2016
But the huge glaring lie here is that Trump is not a taxation genius, with incredible mystical knowledge of our convoluted tax code, his accountants are.
He wants us to believe that he alone has run his financial empire, and that he alone will "run" the government--but he is not campaigning to be king, merely a president, and he doesn't operate his businesses alone.
He isn't "smart" for paying no tax, his accountants are--at best--smart for finding a way to do this.
The con-artist spin-master Donald takes credit for everyone else's work and actions. He isn't only hiding the truth about his finances, but the fact that he is a frightened, jealous, little man who uses swaggering lies and bragging to cover up his profound sense of inferiority.
4
@Joseph Kaye
Trump is going to win Florida because real teachers and military families don't care much for the undeserved reward system which corrupt democrats reap after disgracing their own party. Debbie Wassermann was forced from the DnC and recycled back into office for making a sham of the primary election on behalf of one candidate. Of the two corrupt officials only one will be in office after the November general election election and you can help President Trump reduce the dropout rate.
Trump is going to win Florida because real teachers and military families don't care much for the undeserved reward system which corrupt democrats reap after disgracing their own party. Debbie Wassermann was forced from the DnC and recycled back into office for making a sham of the primary election on behalf of one candidate. Of the two corrupt officials only one will be in office after the November general election election and you can help President Trump reduce the dropout rate.
I wonder how the military families in Florida feel about Trump's recent comment about military suicides.
Okay, have you asked them?
It takes a really, really, really great and I mean really great businessman to lose close to one billion dollars. Yes - a lot of skill and business savvy. Just imagine what he could do to the good old USA.
7
And that was back when a billion was REAL money!
4
I'm no fan of Trump but I assume what he did was legal under the tax code. The tax code is a mess and favors wealthy people. The code created by congress is the problem.
To expect him to pay more than the law requires is odd. None of us do. We take all the deductions allowed by the law: personal exemption, mortgage interest etc. Trump took, I assume, all the deductions he was allowed by the law.
To expect him to pay more than the law requires is odd. None of us do. We take all the deductions allowed by the law: personal exemption, mortgage interest etc. Trump took, I assume, all the deductions he was allowed by the law.
5
I expected him to be a man about it and own his advantages, not run from them. Now he's got the National Realtors on their heels trying to field if this is really the way they all do business.
6
Why does every reply that mimics US Expect, it was legal - no one pays more taxes then they have to, forget to address the fact that this really really really great, I mean I am talking about the greatest, business man had all these losses to legally deduct?
2
I concur there is something counterproductive in the tax code, incentivizing commercial development to spur economic growth while leaving the residents who locate nearby forlorn when enterprises move on after a couple of decades to chase a new tax incentive to replace the expiring one. But in doing so I first would ask why anyone thinks that the annual basis for reconciling finances for the purpose of taxation has anything to do with the life-cycle of an investment? Congress was smart enough to allow some flexibility in the system - and if it is wrong I can find no effort by the other candidate in her legislative career to change the way the calculations are made .- that clearly upsets the authors. So on that point I must non-concur with the authors and would dispatch them to look into the bankruptcies to assess whether the man sucked money out of companies recklessly knowing they were headed that way. If he did so, then he might just be a perfect fit with the current political crowd in DC...
2
What keeps getting left out of the discussion is the question what is the psychological effect of this disclosure for Trump and his staff? Who knows if it the return was literally mailed from Trump Tower. Figuratively speaking, it might as well be true. Someone with close access to Trump's records leaked this. There has to be much paranoia and finger pointing within Trump's cabal. One can only imagine the shoutfest behind closed doors.
4
Make America Greater by getting the rich to pay their taxes.
4
There is a rather ridiculous Disney movie with Fred MacMurry as "The Happiest Millionaire." He loved nothing more than taking his hand to hand combat innovations down to Congress to show them how to spend his money on warfare.
This is back when ONLY rich people paid our federal taxes, but Donald Duck lined us all up and told us all get behind the war or Hitler wins. Nice trick, Donald. Ducking!
The estate tax used to help fund our wars, too, and sometimes, when at peace, we didn't even collect.
Now there's an idea worth revisiting! Paying for the real sacrifice of blood and national treasure that secures their own rather than just riding on our backs while dictating how to direct it. Put a yoke on war mongers by reminding them this is their war to pay for, so if you want to pass on a legacy, you might be more enamored of diplomacy, unless you are a copper jacket baron.
This is back when ONLY rich people paid our federal taxes, but Donald Duck lined us all up and told us all get behind the war or Hitler wins. Nice trick, Donald. Ducking!
The estate tax used to help fund our wars, too, and sometimes, when at peace, we didn't even collect.
Now there's an idea worth revisiting! Paying for the real sacrifice of blood and national treasure that secures their own rather than just riding on our backs while dictating how to direct it. Put a yoke on war mongers by reminding them this is their war to pay for, so if you want to pass on a legacy, you might be more enamored of diplomacy, unless you are a copper jacket baron.
2
No one is surprised. Suspicions confirmed. These are his personal tax returns. Not business. So how does he live day-to-day with a negative income? I mean how does he buy groceries? Clothes. Gold-plated toilets? Would this self-proclaimed "amazing and smart" business man actually create changes in the tax code that would prevent him from doing this? Funny thing. 10 yrs ago we made an error in our taxes. $540. The IRS was all over us- two years later. We disputed the error. We lost, they got well over $700 in taxes and fees. OF course they did. Enough of us have those problems maybe we can make up the revenue deficit created by "successful" businessmen like TRUMP. The GOP owes this country an apology for the farce they've made of this election.
5
Although I'm not an expert on tax code, I'm aware that there are much more sophisticated schemes to amass loses while actually making a profit than the ones described. The NYT needs to talk to attorneys for the mob who are in the same league as Trump.
4
A few questions:
1 - How did the NYT acquire these records? Isn't the government supposed to keep taxpayer's information private? Were the records obtained legally?
2- The accusation is that Trump had a large deduction. If it was legal (and after 20 years the IRS should have been able to determine otherwise) what is the issue.
3- Why are the current politicians still in power if they are the ones who have been writing and enacting these tax laws that allow these legal deductions?
1 - How did the NYT acquire these records? Isn't the government supposed to keep taxpayer's information private? Were the records obtained legally?
2- The accusation is that Trump had a large deduction. If it was legal (and after 20 years the IRS should have been able to determine otherwise) what is the issue.
3- Why are the current politicians still in power if they are the ones who have been writing and enacting these tax laws that allow these legal deductions?
6
In lines 16 and 18 of the tax return, why are the first two numbers, 9 and 1, not lined up with the remaining numbers? The first two numbers seems like they were added after the 5,729,293 digits were entered. There could be a legitimate reason for this, but just saying: it looks strange.
It's explained by the retired accountant who prepared Trump's taxes if you read the entire article:
"A flaw in the tax software program he used at the time prevented him from being able to print a nine-figure loss on Mr. Trump’s New York return, he said. So, for example, the loss of “-915,729,293” on Line 18 of the return printed out as “5,729,293.” As a result, Mr. Mitnick recalled, he had to use his typewriter to manually add the “-91,” thus explaining why the first two digits appeared to be in a different font and were slightly misaligned from the following seven digits."
"A flaw in the tax software program he used at the time prevented him from being able to print a nine-figure loss on Mr. Trump’s New York return, he said. So, for example, the loss of “-915,729,293” on Line 18 of the return printed out as “5,729,293.” As a result, Mr. Mitnick recalled, he had to use his typewriter to manually add the “-91,” thus explaining why the first two digits appeared to be in a different font and were slightly misaligned from the following seven digits."
8
The answer is in the article. Apparently at the time the software didn't allow for a loss that large, so the guy who prepared the forms had to type in the two extra digits.
6
We are expected to believe that Mr. Trump hired an accountant who could not capably us a word processor.
A guy down the street from me earned $2 million and didn't pay a penny in federal income tax. His secret? He spread his income over forty years, got married, had several kids, and took the standard deduction each year regardless of how small his itemized deductions were. And yet, I can't imagine any New York Times reader or columnist taking offense that my neighbor paid the taxes he legally owed and not a cent more. However, if you don't like the results of people such as my neighbor (or even Donald Trump) following the current tax code, then change the tax code. I'm personally in favor of a national sales tax set at 20% across the board, with an annual payment of $5K delivered to each adult citizen on 1 January (thereby making this consumption tax progressive).
3
Is your neighbor running for President? Does your neighbor call other people freeloaders? Does your neighbor claim that he's a great businessperson while he loses large sums of money, declares bankruptcy multiple times and stiffs the people who work for him?
I am a Hillary supporter, but let me say this: This article is a dishonest hit piece. If Trump actually lost money (and the piece does not say otherwise), he can deduct his net operating loss and carry it over to another taxable year. There is nothing wrong with this.
Suppose there are two businesses. Businesses One loses $100 in Year 1 and makes $200 in Year 2. Business Two makes $50 each year. Both businesses net $100 over the two year period, and pay about the same amount in federal income taxes. According to the NYT, Business One is sneaky and dishonest, at least if it is named Trump.
Suppose there are two businesses. Businesses One loses $100 in Year 1 and makes $200 in Year 2. Business Two makes $50 each year. Both businesses net $100 over the two year period, and pay about the same amount in federal income taxes. According to the NYT, Business One is sneaky and dishonest, at least if it is named Trump.
7
The article never claimed that what Trump did was illegal. The point of the article is that Trump's tax returns reveal what a fraud that guy is. He claims to be a skilled businessman, yet he ran his casino businesses into the ground in the 1990s, incurring a loss of almost $1B. He then took advantage of on a personal level, while shareholders, creditors and bondholders were wiped out (not to mention all of the employees who lost jobs when Trump's businesses failed). He criticizes the military and our national infrastructure, but apparently has not paid anything in taxes to support or fund these critical resources. Trump claims he is a tax expert, but obviously he relied upon the advice of tax professionals to find the loopholes to eliminate his tax burden. Trump's entire personal narrative is fraudulent.
3
Chris Christie and William Louis "Rudy" Giuliani are total morons by saying Donald J. Trump is a "genius" by ripping off the US and local tax systems. Trump made money by failing. (Sounds like "The Producers.") Trump is an idiot. It is obvious everyone would get lower tax if Trump and Hedge Funds paid taxes. Why should the people of the United States put a Trump, a bum, fool and idiot as President of the United States.
2
NYT has tried to explain some of the differences between capital creation/investment (highly encouraged by the Tax Code) and simple W-2 services income - where most of us are): http://www.nytimes.com/2012/03/04/business/capital-gains-vs-ordinary-inc...
What a "genius" everything he touches turns to bankrupt or loss and that's what's called good business. If he cared so much about fixing the so called tax loop holes, why didn't he mention these loop holes or include a control measure in his policies. Appears it runs in his so called "good genes" tax avoidance, avoidance of military-service obligations. Maybe the label draft dodger is an inherited one in the Trumps family, from granddad Trump to THE DONALD!
2
If we look at Hillary's she did the same thing page 17 of Hillary's tax returns from 2015 part 2 699,540 and then a loss of 699,540 so wheres the outrage over that?
3
You're looking at Schedule D, capital gains and losses. Because the Clintons show no net capital gain (indeed, no realized capital gains or losses) in 2015, they were able to deduct only $3,000 of the capital loss carryforward from the prior year. The remaining ($696,540) loss carries forward to future years, subject to the same rules, until used up or the taxpayer dies.
2
The man lost nearly a billion dollars, primarily in the real estate market, during one of the biggest booms in American History.
Any claim of being a "great businessman" is utterly and completely laughable.
A billion dollar loss. The real estate market in the 1990s. Now we know how everyone else made money then - it was off of his losses.
Any claim of being a "great businessman" is utterly and completely laughable.
A billion dollar loss. The real estate market in the 1990s. Now we know how everyone else made money then - it was off of his losses.
4
Nobody seems to ask "what were those losses?" None of Trump's bankruptcies occurred in 94 or 95.
Randall Lane (FORBES) wrote: "In 1990, however, Trump hyperbole blew back on him. The New York real estate market was crashing, his Atlantic City casinos began struggling, and he was underwater with his new toy, the Trump Shuttle airline. In 1989 FORBES had his net worth at $1.7 billion. By spring 1990 FORBES figured it was $500 million at best. By that fall the overleveraged Trump was “within hailing distance of zero” and dropped from The Forbes 400."
So if the big losses started in '90 ... why were they not realized for tax purposes until '95? Or were there previous years of large losses from '90 onward?
One fact of the tax code to remember -- consider investors start a company -- the shares in the company need not be distributed proportional to cash investment -- some investors might get much more share for know-how, or creating the deal or whatever. But losses incurred by the company accrue to the shareholders by shares, not proportional to investment.
This makes it possible, if you can find suckers, to generate losses for tax purposes that are larger than the actual investment at risk.
Randall Lane (FORBES) wrote: "In 1990, however, Trump hyperbole blew back on him. The New York real estate market was crashing, his Atlantic City casinos began struggling, and he was underwater with his new toy, the Trump Shuttle airline. In 1989 FORBES had his net worth at $1.7 billion. By spring 1990 FORBES figured it was $500 million at best. By that fall the overleveraged Trump was “within hailing distance of zero” and dropped from The Forbes 400."
So if the big losses started in '90 ... why were they not realized for tax purposes until '95? Or were there previous years of large losses from '90 onward?
One fact of the tax code to remember -- consider investors start a company -- the shares in the company need not be distributed proportional to cash investment -- some investors might get much more share for know-how, or creating the deal or whatever. But losses incurred by the company accrue to the shareholders by shares, not proportional to investment.
This makes it possible, if you can find suckers, to generate losses for tax purposes that are larger than the actual investment at risk.
The tax code is an abomination. The Times uses the same tax code to avoid paying their fair share, but nobody has the courage to expose them and their pettifoggers for who they are. Jerry Brown was absolutely right in 1992... you should be able to pay your taxes on a form the size of a postcard.
2
Hopefully the so called "poor uneducated whites" whom Mr. Trump speaks for, will remember this in the polling booth. Another shameful example of how the rich of America benefit by the tax laws they helped write.
5
The problem here is not Trump. The problem here is an Internal Revenue Code that is obscene, indeed pornographic, in its complexity and whose accretions favoring a variety of special interests cannot be weeded out incrementally, piece by piece; rather, like a garden choked by weeds, the entire Code, like so much of our government, needs to be blown up and refashioned anew.
1
This will not change anyone's mind who is for Trump. It is not illegal, most would say not even unethical. He wrote off a (big) loss over a period of 18 years. Calling this a revelation is stretch.
4
In all fairness, it is difficult to condemn Mr. Trump for minimizing his tax liability without condemning the special treatment afforded real estate developers and investors by the tax code.
If you're a college professor, or an accountant, and you own a rental property that generates a loss in a given year, you can use that loss to offset income from that rental property, but not income you earn by teaching or preparing P&L statements for business clients. If you're an assembly line worker, become unemployed, and run up $20,000 worth of debt while you're looking for work, you cannot write off those losses against earned income when you finally find another job.
But, in you're in the real estate game, and you lose $916 million, you can use that loss to offset income from the ties that bear your name, or the steaks, or the rotgut wine you peddle. No problem, no problem at all.
America will become great again when we start rewarding people for productive labor and investment rather than for gaming the system. Mr. Trump has proven himself expert at the latter, and a total failure when it comes to the former. And that -- in addition to his personality defects and smarmy personal values -- is why he has absolutely no brief to support the case that he should be elected President of the United States.
If you're a college professor, or an accountant, and you own a rental property that generates a loss in a given year, you can use that loss to offset income from that rental property, but not income you earn by teaching or preparing P&L statements for business clients. If you're an assembly line worker, become unemployed, and run up $20,000 worth of debt while you're looking for work, you cannot write off those losses against earned income when you finally find another job.
But, in you're in the real estate game, and you lose $916 million, you can use that loss to offset income from the ties that bear your name, or the steaks, or the rotgut wine you peddle. No problem, no problem at all.
America will become great again when we start rewarding people for productive labor and investment rather than for gaming the system. Mr. Trump has proven himself expert at the latter, and a total failure when it comes to the former. And that -- in addition to his personality defects and smarmy personal values -- is why he has absolutely no brief to support the case that he should be elected President of the United States.
5
Framing - ultimate ungrateful Cadillac welfare king; we give Trump $50M a year to "get back on his feet" and Republicans still savage the auto industry, which paid back its assistance and pays its workers. a "real" genius would be grateful and humble and set aside the gold-plated toys.
2
The problem isn't Trump (or any of the other billionaires who pay less taxes than school teachers); the problem is with a law that allows them to do so.
4
Tax payers are permitted to arrange their affairs in a way that will minimize taxes. The NYT, having either a real or feigned ignorance of tax law, seeks to make something out of nothing. Must get some sort of payoff for obtaining those returns illicitly. Keep trying.
4
Other way around. Trump thought he could make nothing out of something, and we found out before he would admit to it. He pays much less than Mitt.
2
Corporate Greed incarnate.
3
Makes Private Equity look like a bunch of "Saint boys." Did he need to deny this is how realtors fly? They depreciate their property while telling us the value NEVER goes down.
Guardian has all his tweets on the subject of tax deadbeats. I think Hedgies should pile on him in a tax advantage smack down!
Guardian has all his tweets on the subject of tax deadbeats. I think Hedgies should pile on him in a tax advantage smack down!
3
I wish the NY Times would address the next logical question raised by this- if Donald Trump used a $900+ million write-off to not pay taxes for however many years he has not done so (which he all but acknowledged in the debate) then that would imply he has not earned more than that amount in the interim and if he has not earned $900+ million dollars over that period it would be extremely unlikely that he could have possibly amassed the $10 billion in wealth he now claims to be worth.
7
The Times has really stepped in it now. It seems both Hillary and the Times have done the same thing.
3
Really? When did Hillary lose almost a billion dollars?
1
That he successfully doged paying his taxes speaks not of his genius as the Misters Christie and Guillani claim, but to the genius of the tax lawyers and accountants. Mr. Trump has not the attention span nor the intelligence to decipher our country's bizarre tax codes.
6
I have a simple question. If he was not running for office, this sort of deduction would have never come to light alongwith demands for tax code reform. What does that say about our tax code? And, both parties - Democrat and Republican have had their chances to reform since 1995.
2
Everyone's forgotten the cash he scooped up after 9-11 for fixing his undamaged property. If there were another attack, he'd say "Be glad -- write it off yer taxes."
4
I find it interesting that Trump tells us he does not consider John McCain a war hero because he was shot down and captured - he likes those who were not shot down. Now, his allies tell us he is a genius because he lost and declared almost a billion dollar loss. That certainly doesn't make him a genius in my book. Almost anyone, through poor management skills, can lose tons of money. A little two-faced here? Republican politics is disgusting.
7
The system is in trouble for a person of no conscience and no moral compass to be nominated. The system will be broken when this person is elected to the office.
Thank you for informing the public. The people have the right to know who they elect to the office. At least one part of the government works for the people. Go 1st Amendment.
Will this be a broken system?????
Thank you for informing the public. The people have the right to know who they elect to the office. At least one part of the government works for the people. Go 1st Amendment.
Will this be a broken system?????
2
And given his endless business failures since 1995, its fair to assume the losses have grown in the 20 years since then, as has his $10,000,000,000 net worth has. He must have reaped quite a bit more, just from his Trump University.
3
Dude. Go to Fifth Avenue and around 57th and see what's written in the sky. It's not "CLINTON".
2
Yeah not seeing a problem here, he took advantage of the tax laws, just like any other American could have done and most assuredly are doing to this day.
5
Remember the Mel Brooks Musical, "The Producers" and the wonderful number about "loosing money to make money?" Deadbeats like Trump game the system alright, and they make sure that they have "their people" in office to receive the legal benefits they so justly paid for. His types (and they are all over Manhattan) make money if they "win or loose" by robbing the tax coffers, one way or another. I can only shudder to think what is really behind his candidacy. Its not the little person, that's for sure. Is this democracy? Will the public hold his feet to the fire? Will the media, or will they continue to bow and scrap their face before him?
4
Dear NYTimes:
Most of us do not care about Bill Clinton's infidelities, but it is your front page story on-line. Yesterday, the front was all Trump, Trump, Trump. Even when it's all criticism, it's still Trump, Trump, Trump. Clinton won the debate. Where are your articles that are about her plans for being President? Trump accused her of not having stamina. Why not give your readers a day in the life of a Secretary of State so we can decide what "stamina" is? Why not talk about her public legacy, in Alabama and New York, and internationally? I don't care who Bill Clinton had fun with. This is ridiculous. If you want the election to be about serious issues, then your front page is the place to start.
Most of us do not care about Bill Clinton's infidelities, but it is your front page story on-line. Yesterday, the front was all Trump, Trump, Trump. Even when it's all criticism, it's still Trump, Trump, Trump. Clinton won the debate. Where are your articles that are about her plans for being President? Trump accused her of not having stamina. Why not give your readers a day in the life of a Secretary of State so we can decide what "stamina" is? Why not talk about her public legacy, in Alabama and New York, and internationally? I don't care who Bill Clinton had fun with. This is ridiculous. If you want the election to be about serious issues, then your front page is the place to start.
4
So when bridges collapse for lack of maintenance and soldiers die for lack of properly armored tanks, thank a tax-avoider like Donald "Make America Great Again" Trump.
6
How does Trump take a loss when his debt was forgiven (which the article says is taxable) and then he's paid millions by the banks to promote the casinos (see Frontline profile on Trump and Clinton) while shareholders' value falls from $35.50 to a dollar something?
Sounds like he got paid three times for the casinos -- the initial loan and then the debt forgiveness and then the promotion fees -- and was still able to take a $916 billion tax write off. What????
So our tax code actually incentivizes massive losses. That's not great for our economy!
Sounds like Clinton's plan to raise taxes on the weathly is a good plan.
Sounds like he got paid three times for the casinos -- the initial loan and then the debt forgiveness and then the promotion fees -- and was still able to take a $916 billion tax write off. What????
So our tax code actually incentivizes massive losses. That's not great for our economy!
Sounds like Clinton's plan to raise taxes on the weathly is a good plan.
5
Trumps losses were born by the banks he failed to repay. They should in all fairness have gotten the tax break, not him.
6
Yeah, what about the banks?
"It shall be unlawful for any person to whom any return or return information (as defined in section 6103(b)) is disclosed in a manner unauthorized by this title thereafter willfully to print or publish in any manner not provided by law any such return or return information. Any violation of this paragraph shall be a felony punishable by a fine in any amount not exceeding $5,000, or imprisonment of not more than 5 years, or both, together with the costs of prosecution."
Im sure this won't get past moderation though.
Im sure this won't get past moderation though.
2
And in final insult, he claims he received only $6,000 in wages that year. This is another dodge where he uses his business for all of his expenses but then claims he got (virtually) no wages from it. Not only is he dodging income tax, he is also dodging social security and Medicare tax as well as unemployment insurance taxes.
8
Not surprised at all and I think the person who mailed these forms should be commended for public service. I mused somewhat at the thought of how I too would be a lot better off if I could write off every financial disaster in my life and increase my nest egg by not paying taxes for two decades. The grand scale on which he has been doing this is mind boggling and the tax system that enables these rich folks to get away with these write offs is unjust. Change the tax code. Everyone needs to pay their fair share. This man is no business genius. His accountant is the hero here. No one likes paying taxes but have you noticed the state of the countries where rich people do not pay their fair share? They are emeshed in economic chaos, crumbling infrastructure and rife with corruption. This is how you earn the label third world nation.
9
"... have you noticed the state of the countries where rich people do not pay their fair share?"
Please give some examples of such countries.
Please give some examples of such countries.
1
Try India for example. They would have considerably less poor people and a healthier middle class if the rich did not spend all of their time avoiding the taxman. People go to extraordinary lengths to avoid paying their fair share of taxes and it is truly deplorable.
There may be more to the loss carryforward. If he or his companies have had debt forgiveness, he would have to pick up income or reduce benefits such as loss carryforward. If this was the case he wouldn't have the full billion dollar loss to offset income. Is it possible that this may not have been taken into account?
Whether elected or not, he can have a place in history as the freeloader in chief. I bet he would consider the approximately $250,000 that I've paid in federal taxes while working as a teacher over decades to be "chump change." Without people like him, we could have been making America greater. Instead, he and his ilk got a free ride.
6
I think I'll have a net operating loss this year.
4
Speaking as an accountant, it irritates me that the government wants to participate in my capital gains but not in my losses. We're supposed to be taxed on income but one year is an arbitrary measurement of income. If one pays taxes on a gain that was already taxed as a gain then one should be able to recover the previous taxes paid. Simple concept.
1
How about this conspiracy theory: To get off the issue of not releasing his tax returns, Trumps family mails a copy of a few key pages from his 1995 tax returns showing that he paid no taxes and probably not for a number of years. The Trump campaign surrogates then call him a genius business man, smart, etc. Then he and they will claim he now doesn't have to release his tax returns since there is nothing else to see. All this to really hid what is in his actual tax returns. Let's see, Democratic National Committee e-mails are hacked and revealed right before the convention and a copy of Trumps tax returns just magically show up four days after the first debate! Wow magical coincidences in politics!!
3
While I was reading about the outrageous way Trump had legally used the tax code to his advantage I ran across a similar story elsewhere in your paper.
Alistair Cooke, the renowned British journalist lived in a rent controlled apartment on Fifth Avenue that is now on sale for $11.75 million, for over 50 years.
Both transactions legal, but you do wonder don't you.
Alistair Cooke, the renowned British journalist lived in a rent controlled apartment on Fifth Avenue that is now on sale for $11.75 million, for over 50 years.
Both transactions legal, but you do wonder don't you.
5
Ed Koch kept a rent controlled apartment through his 12 years as mayor. The times never uttered a peep because it liked him.
2
To the IRS auditors … either (1) DJT’s $50B asserted wealth is recognized but not claimed (fraud) or (2) unsecured and subject to substantial risk of forfeiture (yet another house of cards). In the 1st case, he goes to prison. In the 2nd case, he’s running to lower his eventual hit to 15% (disqualifying conflict of interest re: assets from which he cannot first divest). In either case, bridge-and-airport-corruption-guy and stop-and-frisk-but-not-my-friends-guy lap dogs have established genius culpability where even ignorance is no defense. Also, find out why the assets, and particularly the ostentatious gold, jewels and toys (1) are not recognized income, and (2) why the "wealth" is apparently not executed on by the alleged creditors holding $900M of DJT's markers.
4
People do not seem to understand there's a difference between "a successful businessman" and "a rich man."
7
Congratulations for your professionalism. There will be some headaches because Trump is very nasty. Remember the ways he treated a female journalist? Good luck.
4
It just goes to show that the press has no remaining scruples when it comes to bringing down Trump. Biased reporting is one thing, but you may be needing a pardon from Mr. Obama should Mr. Trump win. I urge Mr. Trump to keep up his guard; applauding him for not permitting supporters of his opponent to travel on his plane, and keeping press members in a secure, guarded pen at his secure rallies.
3
Really …. This is all there is? A story that Mr Trump’s accountants knew the tax law and processed his returns according to that law in three decades ago? This is great… it proves that Mr Trump is a law abiding citizen.
He did not keep secret government information on his own private server, exposing National secrets to international hackers
He did not lie to the families of Bengasi knowing the 911 attack in Libya was a terror attack within hours of its occurrence
He did not sell his government position to the highest bidder in exchange for donations to his personal private foundation and vast speaking fees paid to his other half.
He did not in reckless abandon start wars in Egypt and Libya which will result those countries being threatened by ISIS control
He did not take the money which was earmarked for Hattian relief 1.7 billion and divide those as spoils among his private foundation, hiring his own brother to profit from Hattian misery. He did not abscond with those monies to build lavish hotels in other parts of Hatti while the poor who were put out by the vast earth quake continue with no housing and no relief
He did not have to be dragged from the curb lifeless into his awaiting medical van 2 weeks ago.
Mr Trump did none of these things …. He simply paid his tax burden according to the law, just like everyone else does……
He did not keep secret government information on his own private server, exposing National secrets to international hackers
He did not lie to the families of Bengasi knowing the 911 attack in Libya was a terror attack within hours of its occurrence
He did not sell his government position to the highest bidder in exchange for donations to his personal private foundation and vast speaking fees paid to his other half.
He did not in reckless abandon start wars in Egypt and Libya which will result those countries being threatened by ISIS control
He did not take the money which was earmarked for Hattian relief 1.7 billion and divide those as spoils among his private foundation, hiring his own brother to profit from Hattian misery. He did not abscond with those monies to build lavish hotels in other parts of Hatti while the poor who were put out by the vast earth quake continue with no housing and no relief
He did not have to be dragged from the curb lifeless into his awaiting medical van 2 weeks ago.
Mr Trump did none of these things …. He simply paid his tax burden according to the law, just like everyone else does……
5
With losses of this magnitude, everything, down to his tie is paid for with
other people's money and that would be the tax payer's money, the money
stolen from those he contracted to do work, and the banks who extended
him credit. If that's good business, I really don't understand anything.
To me it sounds like a person who shouldn't be president, or anything else
in the public arena at the very least.
Now, let's talk to the law makers who have sold out the vast majority of the American citizenry. It is clear that our "leaders" would have use "eat cake" and their talk of the greatness of America and the America people is lip service designed to shut us up. My disgust is beyond measure.
other people's money and that would be the tax payer's money, the money
stolen from those he contracted to do work, and the banks who extended
him credit. If that's good business, I really don't understand anything.
To me it sounds like a person who shouldn't be president, or anything else
in the public arena at the very least.
Now, let's talk to the law makers who have sold out the vast majority of the American citizenry. It is clear that our "leaders" would have use "eat cake" and their talk of the greatness of America and the America people is lip service designed to shut us up. My disgust is beyond measure.
5
If it's true it only makes me respect him more. Legally avoiding taxes is.a very good thing.
2
Admiring him for loosing money, let alone whole businesses, that allowed him to avoid taxes BC? Yes, that is quite admirable. Yes, let's allow him to do the same to the US.
3
Good for who? Do you really enjoy paying Trump's share of things like infrastructure?
3
And then we find out the New York Times hasn't paid Federal Income tax either.
3
How much more than what is required are you paying in taxes? Oh, what not? Is it not your civic duty?
1
"Taxes are the price we pay for a free society." That's inscribed in stone on the IRS building in DC, and is very clear. If you don't believe in this statement, then America is the wrong place for you. Please get out. You are not an American, you are a freeloading taker living off the work of everyone who pays their taxes.
5
So are you talking about the 47% or Mr. Trump?
1
NYT, you have taken a risk publishing this information, which shows that you have the nation's best interests at heart, unlike the two-faced, tax-dodging Donald Trump, who evades taxes while complaining about the state of our country. Thank you for your courage and, yes, patriotism.
8
The risk that they've taken is that people will find out they're doing the exact same thing themselves.
1
That's okay, Little Donnie. We hard-working Americans will pick up the tab for our infrastructure. Since you're so special, you can continue to use and complain about it.
7
Donald Trump is NOT interested in representing American Citizens. He is interested in adding to his personal assets and bank accounts. This whole situation is bizarre and crazy. Wake up America.
7
Could we please get perhaps a few of our public servants running for re election or for the first time to promise that they will work to close this giant tax loophole for the uber wealthy?? Anyone? ....
5
"... this giant tax loophole for the uber wealthy ..."
You don't need to be "uber wealthy" to claim a net operating loss (NOL). See IRS Publication 536:
"If your deductions for the year are more than your income for the year, you may have a net operating loss (NOL)."
Publication 536, Net Operating Losses (NOLs) for Individuals, Estates, and Trusts
https://www.irs.gov/uac/about-publication-536
You don't need to be "uber wealthy" to claim a net operating loss (NOL). See IRS Publication 536:
"If your deductions for the year are more than your income for the year, you may have a net operating loss (NOL)."
Publication 536, Net Operating Losses (NOLs) for Individuals, Estates, and Trusts
https://www.irs.gov/uac/about-publication-536
"... this giant tax loophole for the uber wealthy ..."
You don't need to be "uber wealthy" to claim a net operating loss (NOL). See IRS Publication 536:
"If your deductions for the year are more than your income for the year, you may have a net operating loss (NOL)."
Publication 536, Net Operating Losses (NOLs) for Individuals, Estates, and Trusts
https://www.irs.gov/uac/about-publication-536
2016-10-03 16:07:13 UTC
You don't need to be "uber wealthy" to claim a net operating loss (NOL). See IRS Publication 536:
"If your deductions for the year are more than your income for the year, you may have a net operating loss (NOL)."
Publication 536, Net Operating Losses (NOLs) for Individuals, Estates, and Trusts
https://www.irs.gov/uac/about-publication-536
2016-10-03 16:07:13 UTC
Is it wrong that some small part of me wants to hire his accountant?
7
You mean that broke his confidentiality, at least by confirming the pages are from Mr. Trump's return? Use my accountant. He stonewalled through my parents' divorce and wouldn't admit he knows my name without a court order. You don't want an accountant who plainly hates his former client.
1
I don't think the fact that DJT used losses to off-set future income is a big negative -- it's in the tax code and he is in business to make money and stay in business. It's called capitalism. So far there's no evidence that the law was broken. Further, an integral part of being a developer large or small is to cozy up to city hall so that permits, variances and other government favors just happen to go your way.
I think that the key fact in this story is that Donald Trump is a LOSER. After all, he is reaping tax benefits from LOSSES and if you LOSE nearly $ 1 billion in a year you are not a winner. You aren't quite the financial "genius" that your camp followers proclaim.
Further, DJT is not in the kind of businesses that generate prosperity - it's mostly low tech consumption - golf courses soaked in herbicide, casinos for people who are bad at math, beauty pageants and reality TV which are the definition of the rehearsed, the augmented and the un-real.
Please DJT, so fond of toxic Twitter trash talk about others, if you aren't a LOSER - make the case by full disclosure of your tax returns going back 5 or 10 years.
I think that the key fact in this story is that Donald Trump is a LOSER. After all, he is reaping tax benefits from LOSSES and if you LOSE nearly $ 1 billion in a year you are not a winner. You aren't quite the financial "genius" that your camp followers proclaim.
Further, DJT is not in the kind of businesses that generate prosperity - it's mostly low tech consumption - golf courses soaked in herbicide, casinos for people who are bad at math, beauty pageants and reality TV which are the definition of the rehearsed, the augmented and the un-real.
Please DJT, so fond of toxic Twitter trash talk about others, if you aren't a LOSER - make the case by full disclosure of your tax returns going back 5 or 10 years.
8
Along with the 45.3 percent of other American households that also pay no income tax. Absent an allegation that he broke the law - who cares. It is his right, as it is the right of every American, to minimize their taxes as much as the tax code allows. Blame the folks in Congress for enacting the laws - don't blame citizens for using them to their advantage. I do not agree with him on everything for sure - but I certainly do not blame anyone who tries to minimize their tax payment in accordance with the law. What exactly is the story here?
6
The 45.3 percent you are referring to are made up primarily of children, the elderly (who have already paid taxes for decades), the disabled and those who are too poor to pay federal taxes.
The story is that Trump isn't a good business man or a good citizen.
The story is that Trump isn't a good business man or a good citizen.
4
If a person in those 45.3% Households, manages to parlay their FreeLoader Status to Billion $$ proportions, hide their FreeLoader Status, denigrates: Muslims, Women, Minorities, Veterans,...and garners the GOP Nomination to be the Spokesperson for the GOP,...
I'm certain they'll be scrutinized too.
I'm certain they'll be scrutinized too.
2
the story is that he wants MORE tax breaks for the rich and more payments by citizens with less income.
2
Trump is the most despicable, ignorant and repulsive both as an individual and public figue. I hate, cringe and fear the possibility of his presidency.
This subject has been already discussed by many and there is no doubt about it being the reality.
At the same time, being as objectve as I can, it must be said, that he did not break any laws, used the existing ridiculously structured tax laws and as long as he did not authorize the publication of his tax returns the NYT had no business nor moral standing to do it.
In the end, his tax filings are probably not much different than most of the super wealthy for whom the tax deductions (or avoidance) have been government sanctioned for over 50 years now.
This subject has been already discussed by many and there is no doubt about it being the reality.
At the same time, being as objectve as I can, it must be said, that he did not break any laws, used the existing ridiculously structured tax laws and as long as he did not authorize the publication of his tax returns the NYT had no business nor moral standing to do it.
In the end, his tax filings are probably not much different than most of the super wealthy for whom the tax deductions (or avoidance) have been government sanctioned for over 50 years now.
4
Neither did Hillary, so why is the media after her emails?
You think Bill Gates does not pay taxes? Or it's only the failed business people who make money out of other people's money are the people who shouldn't be paying taxes.
What's missing from yet another piece of yellow journalism from the NYT is the fact that Trump's businesses have employed thousands of employees who have contributed millions to the federal and state coffers in the form of payroll taxes. So what if he used a tax loss carry forward to shelter future income? Politicians created the IRS code and Trump has never been accused of tax fraud. I'll bet Buffet and other billionaires have done the same thing. Let's assume Hillary has paid $1million/year in income taxes for the past 18 years- that would be a rounding error compared to what Trump has contributed to the economy.
2
Guiliani calls him brilliant. I believe I could lose almost a billion dollars, easily. I could bankrupt a casino, start an airline even though I know nothing about the airline business and buy a hotel high and sell low.
6
Well, in order to lose a billion, you'd first have to make a billion. The only exception is the government, which loses trillions it never made while congress gets rich.
1
Wonder how many different filers claimed part of that loss.
1
Clearly we need to start boycotting H&R Block and Intuit (Turbotax). Not to mention every CPA in the country. These organizations are allowing individuals who should be paying full measure of their fair share federal income tax to take personal and business deductions to offset their tax amount. These deductions are perfectly legal, but just not fair.
1
Thanks Donald. You warned America that the system is rigged and that we are becoming a 3rd world nation. Now further evidence is provided just how rigged it is . You have performed a valuable public service and it is time for change. A few centuries ago ,citizens would have picked up weapons to right the wrongs but now we have the ballot. Be thankful that is the case.
8
Bottom line: Trump is living in a world we paid for. He is the baby and we are the adults taking care of him. Or perhaps he is the teenager who spends all his money on fun and games while his parents foot the bill for the realities of life.
9
Why is this even a political issue when this goes on every day by Americans with this much money in their hands....how we dodge the Tax Man. It would be Un-American not to do so.(or so our thinking goes...)
Revamp the tax code if one does not want the wealthy taking advantage of the rules.
Revamp the tax code if one does not want the wealthy taking advantage of the rules.
3
The New York Times could have published articles on Trumps losses from his bankrupt properties and done the estimates about how much he could have written off this way. . .during the primaries.
Makes one wonder whether the NYT and its very left leaning agenda was just licking its chops about what it would and could do to this Republican candidate if he every got the nomination.
What NYT didn't count on in its efforts to destroy him is the scandal fatigue from its litany of Trump hit pieces it prints virtually every day.
You've cried "wolf" so often that, to the astonishment of many, Trump still has a chance.
Makes one wonder whether the NYT and its very left leaning agenda was just licking its chops about what it would and could do to this Republican candidate if he every got the nomination.
What NYT didn't count on in its efforts to destroy him is the scandal fatigue from its litany of Trump hit pieces it prints virtually every day.
You've cried "wolf" so often that, to the astonishment of many, Trump still has a chance.
2
It also brings up the question of what Trump should do with the press if he is elected. I think he should move the facilities of the White House Correspondents' Association to the federal building in Baltimore. No one expects him to nurse a viper to his breast.
2
Imagine if the Republican committee had insisted on seeing each candidate's returns before letting it get this far!
Let's hope people focus on this instead of getting involved in more petty bickering, name calling and insults. We have all been dragged down into the mud with this bully.
Let's hope people focus on this instead of getting involved in more petty bickering, name calling and insults. We have all been dragged down into the mud with this bully.
4
Let's see, lost a Cool Billion (give or TAKE a few grand), then FreeLoads his way to the GOP Nomination to lead them.
Who's next to lead the GOP Revolution, the Coach of the basketball team that plays the Harlem Globetrotters?
It would be a step up, for at least he's not a FreeLoader of monumental Narcissistic proportions.
Who's next to lead the GOP Revolution, the Coach of the basketball team that plays the Harlem Globetrotters?
It would be a step up, for at least he's not a FreeLoader of monumental Narcissistic proportions.
5
6856 comments so far. Hillary, you better be paying attention. Address the inequities built into the system (not just the tax code). Otherwise, in 4 years ........
8
@AP,
Your comment is spot on. Inequality is the story for the developed economies and no one in power is addressing it. Congratulating ourselves on a Trump "gotcha" moment isn't a substitute for dealing with the elephant in the room problem of financialization of our economy.
Your comment is spot on. Inequality is the story for the developed economies and no one in power is addressing it. Congratulating ourselves on a Trump "gotcha" moment isn't a substitute for dealing with the elephant in the room problem of financialization of our economy.
4
First Trump broke no laws, second the NYT's did break the law by publishing the returns and third anyone in there right mind would have done the same thing. When the automakers were bailed out I took a loss in GM stock for three years. If my loss had been greater and the law allowed I or anyone would have taken all the tax breaks available at the time. That is sound business.
3
So why is he so loath for us to understand his business acumen? He pays less than Mitt! One of the 47%ers. Can't live with it.
In addition to being a serial liar, rampant xenophobe, racist, misogynist and birther, Trump is a COWARD - afraid to release his tax returns and be straight with the American citizens who pay their taxes.
7
If a "genius" can lose a billion dollars, how much could that same person lose if they were stupid? We have yet to hear the 400 lb lady sing.
7
Folks say had he put his dad's money into a CD for all these years he'd be vastly richer, but also had to pay his fair share.
Amazing! Truly amazing! What we have turned our political process into, and what ingenious - read crooked - messes have been concocted to avoid paying taxes. There is much more to tax paying than we the citizens are permitted to see or to know. This country is wron-out mentally and morally and will go missing in the near future. I am glad I am very old.......
1
What exactly is the fiduciary responsibility the Trump campaign is claiming? Even if the corrupt tax code allows the declaration of a loss on PERSONAL income taxes due to loss in a (presumably corporate) business, the fiduciary responsibility would only apply to the business. So what fiduciary responsibility did Mr. Trump have to exploit every loop hole in the tax code on his PERSONAL income tax statements? The Trump claims a fiduciary responsibility to family and employees -- that's mumbo jumbo when talking about PERSONAL income taxes. That fiduciary responsibility applies to the business, not Mr. Trump's PERSONAL income tax filing. I smell a huge lie here! But then when you're talking about Trump there's another lie ever 5 minutes.
If I'm wrong on the facts, I'd love to be educated on the matter. I'm certainly not a tax accountant but I think something stinks here. Lies, lies and more lies from Donald Trump and his campaign.
If I'm wrong on the facts, I'd love to be educated on the matter. I'm certainly not a tax accountant but I think something stinks here. Lies, lies and more lies from Donald Trump and his campaign.
7
Mr. Trump was an officer of the corporations that ran the casino. Thus, he had a fiduciary duty to the shareholders, which he fulfilled.
As a small family farm organized as a corporation, I do the same thing, i.e. carry losses forward. It is not jet rocket science. I frequently manage to avoid paying federal corporate tax also. No US corporation pays the top rate.
3
When all else fails, you can achieve immortality by being a spectacular failure.
6
Shakespeare had a competitor who made a bundle telling stories about Edward the Second "with the Tragical Fall of Proud Mortimer." Mortimer convinced his queen to dump Edward and put Mort in charge of her son's inheritance. Didn't work out so well, so maybe the first historical play was trying to sell us something? Don't get too uppity when practicing regicide.
The only "genius" here is Trump's tax accountant turning Donald's business disasters (bankrupt casinos, airline, etc) into lemonade.
5
This is the best kind of reporting - congratulations to the Times. At substantial legal risk, the Times devoted resources to investigative reporting and published an article of national interest. Pulitzer-worthy.
7
What risk? They have no clue who posted these at Trump Tower, but perhaps security does by now?
If I were his adviser and he refused to admit to his own tax advantages, I'd have tried to out them before the debate so he could look straight in Mitt's eye and claim to be the wiser. A big success AND in the47%!
Look at NYTs waiting to make sure they got their story straight, while someone else must have waited and waited...
If I were his adviser and he refused to admit to his own tax advantages, I'd have tried to out them before the debate so he could look straight in Mitt's eye and claim to be the wiser. A big success AND in the47%!
Look at NYTs waiting to make sure they got their story straight, while someone else must have waited and waited...
And I hear the chorus breaking out into "Springtime for Hitler!" The Producers was based on the financial value of failure to the people at the top and here you have a great example. Make America Great Again? Not nearly. Take this narcissistic personality and add tax law exceptionalism for the rich and you can see where this guy could actually believe a lot of what he says. Problem is that a lot of others may believe it as well.
7
I'm no fan of Donald Trump and I have no intention of voting for him. But, as a CPA, I have to say that, whether from ignorance, liberal bias, or a purposeful attempt to smear Mr. Trump...this is one of the ten worst written articles I've read this year. The headline, alone, is outrageous.
I imagine that sensationalist and misleading stories like this are exactly the reason that Donald Trump has declined to release his tax returns. Do you remember the stories about Mitt Romney claiming tax deductions for the costs associated with his wife's horse?
If the NYT has an ounce of journalistic ethics, you'll retract this story and hire a competent and unbiased CPA to rewrite it for you. (Seriously. Give me a call. I'll rewrite it...for a fee.) The result will be a bit technical and likely quite boring, but it will show that there is nothing the least bit illegal, immoral or unfair about how federal tax laws handle operating losses.
Nor is it a "loophole" only used by the rich. Anyone who operates a business, from a real estate developer to a hot dog vendor, is subject to the same rules. In good years, they make profits and pay taxes. In bad years they lose money, and they can use those losses to claim refunds of taxes paid in the previous two years or avoid paying taxes in future years, until those losses are offset by gains. The net effect is paying taxes on the net of a business' profits and losses, over a multi-year period of up to 20 years.
I imagine that sensationalist and misleading stories like this are exactly the reason that Donald Trump has declined to release his tax returns. Do you remember the stories about Mitt Romney claiming tax deductions for the costs associated with his wife's horse?
If the NYT has an ounce of journalistic ethics, you'll retract this story and hire a competent and unbiased CPA to rewrite it for you. (Seriously. Give me a call. I'll rewrite it...for a fee.) The result will be a bit technical and likely quite boring, but it will show that there is nothing the least bit illegal, immoral or unfair about how federal tax laws handle operating losses.
Nor is it a "loophole" only used by the rich. Anyone who operates a business, from a real estate developer to a hot dog vendor, is subject to the same rules. In good years, they make profits and pay taxes. In bad years they lose money, and they can use those losses to claim refunds of taxes paid in the previous two years or avoid paying taxes in future years, until those losses are offset by gains. The net effect is paying taxes on the net of a business' profits and losses, over a multi-year period of up to 20 years.
9
BRAVO - some sanity shines - not to mention that the NY Times itself didn't pay taxes in 2014 for the same reason......
4
Well said!
1
In many recent years, the New York Times has reported net operating losses.. Those losses, like Trump's, can be carried back and carried forward under the tax law. Because recent losses at the Times have been substantial, it is possible that the newspaper hasn't paid, or won't pay, any income taxes for decades. Simply stated, the Times is blaming Trump for reporting tax losses and reducing tax payments just as they do. I would call that hypocritical. Monumentally hypocritical.
5
Of course, Trump's evangelical and other anti-choice supporters won't care, because (as they've openly said) they think they'd have an ace in the hole with Pence as vice president, who they think will be a "strong" (manipulative) vice president like Cheney, and will somehow abolish abortion. Wouldn't they get a surprise if Trump were elected and they found this wasn't going to happen.
3
Trump's losses just show that he's a bad businessman, saved by the tax laws. It doesn't take genius to fill in a tax return to show a loss. Genius would be to deliberately crash one's businesses in order to qualify for permanent tax writeoff status. You don't suppose…
8
The speed with which the Trump surrogates have spun their stories--the very next day--and the coordinated nature of what they're saying, plus the fact that the envelope that the NYT reporter received has Trump Tower as its return address, makes me wonder if this tax return was released by Trump specifically in order to claim that he's a tax and business genius, as Giuliani is claiming, in an effort to defuse Clinton's line of attack on this. I don't think it's a coincidence that this is the particular tax return that cites his $916,000,000 loss. I also can't help but wonder if Trump deliberately crashed his casinos, and regularly crashes many of his other businesses, in order to qualify for a permanent tax writeoff.
9
Perhaps I am missing something -- and I am no defender of The Donald -- but if you had a $916.7 million loss deduction, what on earth would you do with it?
2
Mad as hell! I paid a higher tax rate than Hillary! I can not believe Hillary took a huge loss on her taxes too! She is terrible ripping off us tax payers! Time for big change!
2
She actually paid over 30%, but then, unlike SOME Presidential candidates, you can go and look up her taxes.
1
And when was the last time you self righteous hypocrites deliberately maximized the taxes you paid by refusing to claim exemptions legally allowed and entitled to?
5
Newsflash: This isn't going to work. We're going to vote Donald J. Trump "Biggest Loser."
We aren't self-righteous hypocrites. We're hardworking Americans.
We aren't self-righteous hypocrites. We're hardworking Americans.
Well, it must have been the year that I went bankrupt, lost the $916 mil, got to write it all off, and started yelling about what a genius I was.
1
so you decline to take the standard (or itemized) deduction on your return? That's a write off also. And you never benefited from a stock loss to reduce a gain? Never subtracted repair costs from rental income?
2
I have to wonder whether Marla Maples herself was the tipster.
If she signed the tax return, she may have kept a copy in her files.
If she signed the tax return, she may have kept a copy in her files.
8
I admit most of this was over my head but I had a question. Trump wrote into his prenup with Maples something about it was to last only 5 years and they divorced in 1997. Was he able to use this divorce in some way to help shield money?
1
Dear Mr. Trump:
Given that you seem to know the tax code needs fixing, and so does the infrastructure, I'm sure you'll be delighted to learn you can contribute funds to the US government directly:
http://fms.treas.gov/faq/moretopics_gifts.html
A generous check in roughly the amount of all the taxes you missed would really help make America great again!
Love,
America
Given that you seem to know the tax code needs fixing, and so does the infrastructure, I'm sure you'll be delighted to learn you can contribute funds to the US government directly:
http://fms.treas.gov/faq/moretopics_gifts.html
A generous check in roughly the amount of all the taxes you missed would really help make America great again!
Love,
America
19
As anyone made the connection yet? Trump loudest defender on the tax returns scandal is Giuliani, and who was NYC mayor at the time? Giuliani. Was there some kind of deal that Giuliani aka the city of New York offered Trump? And if so how legal was it.
11
"... who was NYC mayor at the time? Giuliani."
Giuliani took office in 1994, but the NOL is, presumably, from several prior years: "the $916 million net operating loss declared by Mr. Trump in 1995 almost certainly included large net operating losses carried forward from the early 1990s, when most of Mr. Trump’s key holdings were hemorrhaging money."
Giuliani took office in 1994, but the NOL is, presumably, from several prior years: "the $916 million net operating loss declared by Mr. Trump in 1995 almost certainly included large net operating losses carried forward from the early 1990s, when most of Mr. Trump’s key holdings were hemorrhaging money."
3
$916 MILLION! Just ponder the immensity of that number. Forget about the taxes; the big story here is the magnitude of the loss. I've heard many people say that they're voting for Trump because he's a brilliant businessman. Please explain to me how running several companies into the ground, resulting in losses of incredible magnitude, makes one a great businessman.
15
To Trump a courageous soldier (John McCain) who is captured is a failure. But a businessman (Trump) who loses hundreds of millions is a success. Go figure!
19
Almost a billion. Not trillion. But that's still an irresponsible loss. Unless it's a trumped up loss - figures jiggered so as to pay no taxes. I bet we don't know the half of this. It's just the tip of a nasty iceberg, I bet.
8
I couldn't care very much about the tax avoidance. But losing nearly a billion dollars in order to avoid paying taxes doesn't sound like business genius to me.
7
Trump also skipped out on $25 million he owed NJ in corporate taxes thanks to a settlement he cut with the Christie administration.
11
Among all the comments I've read on the subject I don't think I've read one that addresses the fact that Trump *should have* been prepared to address his taxes should the information become public. As someone who is claiming to be ready and fit to serve as the president his lack of preparedness is more alarming even than the original business failings that generated the deductions because it is now, in the present, where he has demonstrated a lack of consideration and forethought.
His taxes are obviously important in the political arena and to the people as shown by the 7000 comments. For someone who builds his case on his business abilities to be sitting on a bombshell that they aren't so good (hence the $900M deduction) hoping that "I'll release the returns after the IRS audit is complete" especially after the IRS has said that the audit has no bearing on his ability to release his returns if he wishes, will prevent him from having to address it is failure not to anticipate and have a thoughtful response or contingencies.
His taxes are obviously important in the political arena and to the people as shown by the 7000 comments. For someone who builds his case on his business abilities to be sitting on a bombshell that they aren't so good (hence the $900M deduction) hoping that "I'll release the returns after the IRS audit is complete" especially after the IRS has said that the audit has no bearing on his ability to release his returns if he wishes, will prevent him from having to address it is failure not to anticipate and have a thoughtful response or contingencies.
8
You say his taxes are important. No. The times publishing his taxes, obtained illicitly and published possibly in violation of law, is what is pushing the comments. Everyone knew Trump had losses when Atlantic City went bad. People are outraged at a newspaper publishing a man's personal taxes with no allegation of unlawful conduct. I think this will hurt Hillary in the polls.
1
Naturally you were also complaining Here when the DNC and it's emails were illegally hacked and published, right? And bristled that Trump would suggest that people should illegally hack Clinton's email server? Or when Putin said “Listen, does it even matter who hacked this data?’’ “The important thing is the content that was given to the public.’’? You were Here on that as well, yes?
2
Anybody trying to run a business would make a big effort on reducing the taxes he has to pay. Donald Trump went all the way and paid no taxes. It's not wrong and I doubt the taxes he should have paid would have made a big difference.
I wonder if the Clintons have payed the right amount of taxes on the millions they've made through the foundation and their speeches.
I wonder if the Clintons have payed the right amount of taxes on the millions they've made through the foundation and their speeches.
1
I don't know what the virtue of paying taxes when none is due - does anyone out there refuse to take legitimate deductions because they want the government to have more money? The man had horrendous business losses, which seems the worst way to get deductions.
Particularly silly are all the tax experts in the companion article to this one spouting off about how Trump is a bad businessman. Even the lowest estimate of Trump's net worth from his business enterprises places it north of 1 billion dollars. None of this so-called experts nor the reporters nor even the owners of the NY Times have made so much money from their business activities.
Who's kidding whom? The reporting is blatantly political which undermines the credibility of the Times.
Particularly silly are all the tax experts in the companion article to this one spouting off about how Trump is a bad businessman. Even the lowest estimate of Trump's net worth from his business enterprises places it north of 1 billion dollars. None of this so-called experts nor the reporters nor even the owners of the NY Times have made so much money from their business activities.
Who's kidding whom? The reporting is blatantly political which undermines the credibility of the Times.
3
Instead of being the financial genius he calls himself, now we've learned that Mr. Trump is one of the largest financial losers of modern times.
8
If, as Mr. Trump purports, not paying taxes in a given year "makes him smart", then why not release all your tax returns ? Wouldn't not paying taxes for 5 or 10 years make you, then, a genius ?
7
There is an issue here.
Donald Trump did not repay all the debt associated with those investments.
Either the loss is a real loss and the Donald was really was out of pocket by $916 million (in which case he has legitimate NOLs)
or the loss was passed on to someone else by The Donald defaulting on debt - in which case Donald Trump should be assessed for income from debt forgiveness.
After all if the debt is forgiven it is not Donald Trump's loss. The loss is borne by the person who lent Donald money and did not get it back.
So the alternative is the debt was forgiven in some way. But then the story the New York Times is running is wrong - because the $916 million of losses would not have survived the debt forgiveness and hence would have wiped out his NOLs and thus he would not be allowed to shelter his income for the next 18 years.
Unless that is there is an avoidance scheme the New York Times has not worked out. Those schemes go by the name of "debt parking".
Here is how debt parking works. Suppose the debtor (in this case The Donald) is going to get his debt cancelled for (say) 1c in the dollar. When he gets the debt wiped out the debtor (ie The Donald) will have to report assessable income equal to the debt wiped out (in this case 99 percent of $916 million).
The alternative though is for the debtor to set up a dummy party. The dummy party might be his wife or children or some company or trust set up by them or more likely some completely opaque offshore trust.
Donald Trump did not repay all the debt associated with those investments.
Either the loss is a real loss and the Donald was really was out of pocket by $916 million (in which case he has legitimate NOLs)
or the loss was passed on to someone else by The Donald defaulting on debt - in which case Donald Trump should be assessed for income from debt forgiveness.
After all if the debt is forgiven it is not Donald Trump's loss. The loss is borne by the person who lent Donald money and did not get it back.
So the alternative is the debt was forgiven in some way. But then the story the New York Times is running is wrong - because the $916 million of losses would not have survived the debt forgiveness and hence would have wiped out his NOLs and thus he would not be allowed to shelter his income for the next 18 years.
Unless that is there is an avoidance scheme the New York Times has not worked out. Those schemes go by the name of "debt parking".
Here is how debt parking works. Suppose the debtor (in this case The Donald) is going to get his debt cancelled for (say) 1c in the dollar. When he gets the debt wiped out the debtor (ie The Donald) will have to report assessable income equal to the debt wiped out (in this case 99 percent of $916 million).
The alternative though is for the debtor to set up a dummy party. The dummy party might be his wife or children or some company or trust set up by them or more likely some completely opaque offshore trust.
5
What an incredible lie! Saying Trump didn't pay taxes is like saying the poor don't pay taxes. But, here are some questions I'd like answered from the paper of record. Did Trump break the law? Didn't Trump use CPAs like we all do? Didn't Trump use deductions that we all do? Does Krugman pay taxes calculated upon his gross income?
Kinda tired of the far left media, lead by the Times, constantly dividing this country by attacking those it disagrees with for things we all do. The hypocrisy is asounding. The owners of the Times are as wealthy as anyone in this country. What do they do that is so great?
Kinda tired of the far left media, lead by the Times, constantly dividing this country by attacking those it disagrees with for things we all do. The hypocrisy is asounding. The owners of the Times are as wealthy as anyone in this country. What do they do that is so great?
4
The Billion dollar loss is even more astounding than the tax breaks.
Per Mayor Bloomberg - Trump wants to run the country the way he ran his businesses? God help us.
Here are two ways Trump could make America Great Again.
1) Pay his fair share of taxes.
2) Never start another business here again.
Per Mayor Bloomberg - Trump wants to run the country the way he ran his businesses? God help us.
Here are two ways Trump could make America Great Again.
1) Pay his fair share of taxes.
2) Never start another business here again.
4
Trump says he's "smart" not to pay taxes. OK then, reveal your last 5 years of tax returns so we can all see just how smart you are. I would like to judge for myself and not rely on your word - which is frankly not worth much.
Presidential candidates since Nixon have released their tax returns because the people have the right to know whether their potential President "is a crook or not." The non-payment of federal taxes over 18 years may be the tip of the iceberg.
Presidential candidates since Nixon have released their tax returns because the people have the right to know whether their potential President "is a crook or not." The non-payment of federal taxes over 18 years may be the tip of the iceberg.
4
Mitt Romney issued a statement this morning after hearing about Trump's tax dodging:
"All right, there is 50 percent of the Republican ticket who is dependent upon government, who believes that he is a victim, who believes the government has a responsibility to care for him, who believes that he is entitled to health care, to food, to housing, to you-name-it. That that's an entitlement. And the government should give it to him. And he thinks he should be president no matter what…This person who pays no income tax.
Romney went on: "Our job is to not consider this person. We'll never convince him he should take personal responsibility and care for his life."
Texas Gov. Rick Perry added, “We’re dismayed at the injustice that nearly half of all Americans don’t even pay any income tax.”
Rep. Paul Ryan told the Heritage Foundation, “We’re coming close to a tipping point in America where we might have a net majority of takers versus makers in society.”
“People who pay nothing can easily forget the idea that there is no such thing as a free lunch,” warned Rep. Michelle Bachmann.
"All right, there is 50 percent of the Republican ticket who is dependent upon government, who believes that he is a victim, who believes the government has a responsibility to care for him, who believes that he is entitled to health care, to food, to housing, to you-name-it. That that's an entitlement. And the government should give it to him. And he thinks he should be president no matter what…This person who pays no income tax.
Romney went on: "Our job is to not consider this person. We'll never convince him he should take personal responsibility and care for his life."
Texas Gov. Rick Perry added, “We’re dismayed at the injustice that nearly half of all Americans don’t even pay any income tax.”
Rep. Paul Ryan told the Heritage Foundation, “We’re coming close to a tipping point in America where we might have a net majority of takers versus makers in society.”
“People who pay nothing can easily forget the idea that there is no such thing as a free lunch,” warned Rep. Michelle Bachmann.
5
The system of taxation whereby salaried workers pay the lion's share and the rich pay less and less, has for awhile been a top subject of discussion by many ultra-left wing socialists, such as the icon of all American business and richest man in America, Warren Buffet.
4
Trump could not have afforded to rehab his first NYC hotel into a Trump property without the YUGE tax break he got from deceptively finagling the UDC, using money paid by New York taxpayers, not Mr. Trump. None of the other entrepreneurs who opened businesses in that area received a dime of UDC money. When it was all over, the two banks which lent him money to rebuild this hotel refused to ever work with him again.
When you're so toxic that even the Big Banks think you're too dishonest to work with, what does that tell you?
If that's not convincing enough, ask some of the undocumented Polish immigrants who worked 12-hour days, slept on the floor of their worksite, and only erratically got get fed or paid for their back-breaking labor by Mr. Trump. His Mafia buddies helped protect him from the understandable protests of unionized trade workers. His first attorney, the late McCarthyite Roy Cohn, introduced him to the underworld contacts that made his first financial houses of cards appear to be gleaming, golden castles.
When you're so toxic that even the Big Banks think you're too dishonest to work with, what does that tell you?
If that's not convincing enough, ask some of the undocumented Polish immigrants who worked 12-hour days, slept on the floor of their worksite, and only erratically got get fed or paid for their back-breaking labor by Mr. Trump. His Mafia buddies helped protect him from the understandable protests of unionized trade workers. His first attorney, the late McCarthyite Roy Cohn, introduced him to the underworld contacts that made his first financial houses of cards appear to be gleaming, golden castles.
8
Hopefully this will be a good wake-up call for voters and their legislators to get the tax loopholes for real estate developers (and others) under control. Revelations like these have a corrosive effect on the entire voluntary tax system. When average American's decide they don't need pay income tax anymore, the US is going to become another Greece.
5
Most of us have taxes withheld or pay at the POS.
So THAT's why Middle and Lower Class taxes keep going up...because born to privlege draft dodgers also dodge paying their taxes.
9
If Trump isn't paying taxes, you are making up the billion dollar gap.
7
Question Trumpets:
If Little Hands is so proud of his tax evasion strategy in his 95 returns, why hasn't he released his other returns?
Surly they will just show more of this tax evading brilliance.
Or will they????
Makes you wonder what the little draft dodger is hiding now.
If Little Hands is so proud of his tax evasion strategy in his 95 returns, why hasn't he released his other returns?
Surly they will just show more of this tax evading brilliance.
Or will they????
Makes you wonder what the little draft dodger is hiding now.
4
Starve the government till it doesn't work. Then trash what remains, say you're the only one to fix it and call yourself a Savior.
What a guy!
Living large and paying no taxes. It should be branded Treason!
What a guy!
Living large and paying no taxes. It should be branded Treason!
7
"Losing a billion dollars doesn't make you a good businessman."
Correct, but this tax return is from over 20 years ago. It's long been well known that Trump lost lots of money back then.
Trump apparently has MADE several billion dollars since then. If not, he's submitted fraudulent financial statements to the federal government, since his most recent one shows he made well over $600 million last year (consistent with his claim of a $10 billion net worth).
Do you think Trump lied in his 100+ page financial statement filing? If so, any evidence of that, or just speculation?
If I were Trump, I wouldn't release any tax returns, and, if I were Hillary, I wouldn't release transcripts of my Goldman Sachs speeches. For Trump, the level of ignorance of US tax laws revealed by many comments here is nothing short of astonishing. I suspect Hillary Clinton would elicit a similar reaction if she were to release transcripts of her Goldman Sachs speeches.
In either case, I wouldn't feed the frenzy. If I were Trump, I'd say: "Have you read my 100+ page financial statement filed with the federal government? Is there some question the federal government neglected to ask?" If I were Clinton, I'd say: "I won't disclose release transcripts of my Goldman Sachs speeches. You'll have to accept my word, or not, that I didn't make any promises to Goldman Sachs."
Correct, but this tax return is from over 20 years ago. It's long been well known that Trump lost lots of money back then.
Trump apparently has MADE several billion dollars since then. If not, he's submitted fraudulent financial statements to the federal government, since his most recent one shows he made well over $600 million last year (consistent with his claim of a $10 billion net worth).
Do you think Trump lied in his 100+ page financial statement filing? If so, any evidence of that, or just speculation?
If I were Trump, I wouldn't release any tax returns, and, if I were Hillary, I wouldn't release transcripts of my Goldman Sachs speeches. For Trump, the level of ignorance of US tax laws revealed by many comments here is nothing short of astonishing. I suspect Hillary Clinton would elicit a similar reaction if she were to release transcripts of her Goldman Sachs speeches.
In either case, I wouldn't feed the frenzy. If I were Trump, I'd say: "Have you read my 100+ page financial statement filed with the federal government? Is there some question the federal government neglected to ask?" If I were Clinton, I'd say: "I won't disclose release transcripts of my Goldman Sachs speeches. You'll have to accept my word, or not, that I didn't make any promises to Goldman Sachs."
1
So this is a snap-shot of Trump's 1995 business losses & federal income tax avoidance gaming. What's the story with Trump's business losses and federal income tax avoidance for the many years subsequent to 1995 (1996-2015)? What about the prior 3 years to 1995?
Is it really possible Trump amassed his wealth just by gaming his federal income taxes?
Keep up the good work NYT!
Expose this fraud or we are doomed.
Is it really possible Trump amassed his wealth just by gaming his federal income taxes?
Keep up the good work NYT!
Expose this fraud or we are doomed.
3
Please list yourselves if you would pay more taxes than you must. Which large business owner does not have a team of CPA’s and attorneys hired to minimize his tax exposure?
That kind of self-interested determination to keep as much of one’s earnings as possible would be a refreshing change in Washington.
That kind of self-interested determination to keep as much of one’s earnings as possible would be a refreshing change in Washington.
2
Donny Boy says he has a fiduciary responsibility - to himself. Consider that a campaign promise!
He'd loot the treasury - for himself - if he could. He'd certainly make every decision for his own profit, to protect himself, his family, his business, and punish opponents.
He's a public menace!
He'd loot the treasury - for himself - if he could. He'd certainly make every decision for his own profit, to protect himself, his family, his business, and punish opponents.
He's a public menace!
3
“Anyone may arrange his affairs so that his taxes shall be as low as possible; he is not bound to choose that pattern which best pays the treasury. There is not even a patriotic duty to increase one’s taxes. Over and over again the Courts have said that there is nothing sinister in so arranging affairs as to keep taxes as low as possible. Everyone does it, rich and poor alike and all do right, for nobody owes any public duty to pay more than the law demands.” So said Supreme Court Justice Learned Hand. That said, it bears noting that Mr. Trump has not proposed to change the law so that it spreads the tax burden more equitably across home owners & real estate developers; nor is he likely to, since that would deprive him of income. So if you want to vote for a "genius" who knows how to legally use the tax code to his benefit then vote for him. But if you want the tax code changed so that you are more likely to benefit then vote for someone else.
4
Did Hillary Clinton vote for any of the tax laws that Donald Trump may have used to offset his losses?
Don't know.
Maybe if Little Hands released more recent returns we could figure it out.
Maybe if Little Hands released more recent returns we could figure it out.
2
Which of these responders volunteers to pay more Federal Income Tax than they have to? Do you want a smart President or a corrupt one?
2
You are so right.
I guess there's no reason for him to hide his most recent returns now is there?
When do you think he'll proudly release his other returns?
Surly they'll just show more Trump brilliance
I guess there's no reason for him to hide his most recent returns now is there?
When do you think he'll proudly release his other returns?
Surly they'll just show more Trump brilliance
1
Not a Trump voter here; however, The NYT has allowed Clinton Trump-bashing ads (though curiously it does not identify her and cannot be turned off) to be attached to a so-called "investigative" report of how Trump did not pay taxes it concedes were not due because of a tax code Clinton as a Senator helped write. Let's have THIS investigative report, NYT: Identify the corporations that have paid the Clintons $250,000 for each 15-30-minute speech and "investigate and report" the content of those speeches, which Clinton has refused to release.
1
If the article's assertions are correct, Donald Trump took advantage of tax deductions built into the federal tax code. Virtually all taxpayers take advantage of deductions. Hillary Clinton's tax returns shows she also takes deductions. Trump didn't write the tax laws. He just complies with them.
2
This man is a charlatan, plain and simple. As many have stated, he is completely overleveraged and we have no idea to whom he is, literally, indebted. For decades, this con artist has weasled and maneuvered around laws to benefit only himself. In some cases, as we've learned recently with the Bondi donation, the lack of state certification to solicit donations for his foundation and his spending in Cuba, he has actually broken the law. We'll see what happens with the Trump University case. I have no doubt, if he were to become President, he would simply repeat this same pattern of ensuring he and his family get the best deals possible while the rest of us (just like his stockholders and the many businesses and employees he has stiffed) are thrown under the bus. He doesn't care if this country thrives or even survives. He is only out for himself. Always has been, always will be.
8
Is it true that the Times paid no Federal taxes in 2014?
If so did their accountants use a loss carry forward?
Just asking.
If so did their accountants use a loss carry forward?
Just asking.
2
Page 3 of the pdf copy of the state return posted as a link to the NYT article Is even more explicit in stating that the -915,729,293 figure is "Federal adjusted gross income (from federal Form 1040, Line 31 ..."
http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2016/10/01/us/politics/donald-trump-t...
26 U.S. Code § 6103(b)(2)(A) defines “return information” to include:
“a taxpayer’s identity, the nature, source, or amount of his income, payments, receipts, deductions ...”.
26 U.S. Code § 7213(a)(3) states:
“It shall be unlawful for any person to whom any return or return information (as defined in section 6103(b)) is disclosed in a manner unauthorized by this title thereafter willfully to print or publish in any manner not provided by law any such return or return information. Any violation of this paragraph shall be a felony punishable by a fine in any amount not exceeding $5,000, or imprisonment of not more than 5 years, or both, together with the costs of prosecution.”
http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2016/10/01/us/politics/donald-trump-t...
26 U.S. Code § 6103(b)(2)(A) defines “return information” to include:
“a taxpayer’s identity, the nature, source, or amount of his income, payments, receipts, deductions ...”.
26 U.S. Code § 7213(a)(3) states:
“It shall be unlawful for any person to whom any return or return information (as defined in section 6103(b)) is disclosed in a manner unauthorized by this title thereafter willfully to print or publish in any manner not provided by law any such return or return information. Any violation of this paragraph shall be a felony punishable by a fine in any amount not exceeding $5,000, or imprisonment of not more than 5 years, or both, together with the costs of prosecution.”
1
Trump, take note: "Taxes are what we pay for civilized society." -- Oliver Wenedell Holmes Jr. in Compañia General de Tabacos de Filipinas vs. Collector of Internal Revenue, 275 U.S. 87, 100 (1927). https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oliver_Wendell_Holmes_Jr.#cite_note-48
4
The same taxes that pay for roads, also pay for supporting terrorism and killing millions in foreign countries without our consent, manipulate us, spy on us, and hide the government's activities from us.
Lose a billion because your a lousy businessman, write the red ink in the blood of the slobs you've duped, have it wiped from the records as you hide behind lopsided tax laws, and use xnephobic and mysoginistic messages, Twittered at twilight in unstable manic anger, to agitate mass hysteria that blinds them to the ultimate shell game - to vote against their own economic self-interest as they elect King Comb-Over.
5
This is a non-story.
Unless Trump has done something illegal, so what?
The tax code is what the tax code is.
Are you telling me that Hillary pays more to the IRS than she legally has to?
That the NY Times itself has also not paid income taxes in the past?
the issue seems to be with the tax code, not with Trump. Unless, of course, you are one of those people who like playing the class warfare and class envy card.
Now, we do know that other businessmen, like liberal Warren Buffet,, have also lost almost a billion dollars on business deals, yet Democrats never mention that.
Unless Trump has done something illegal, so what?
The tax code is what the tax code is.
Are you telling me that Hillary pays more to the IRS than she legally has to?
That the NY Times itself has also not paid income taxes in the past?
the issue seems to be with the tax code, not with Trump. Unless, of course, you are one of those people who like playing the class warfare and class envy card.
Now, we do know that other businessmen, like liberal Warren Buffet,, have also lost almost a billion dollars on business deals, yet Democrats never mention that.
2
the real story here is how a guy can take nearly $1b hit and come back to thrive, this is just what America needs
2
The point is he DIDN'T take a $1B loss, he used the system to his advantage to use business losses to build personal net worth while the businesses failed and investors lost everything.
2
I find it repulsive that the times would take someone who lost 1 billion dollars in one year and then ASSUME an income of a mere 50 million to speculate he might not have had to pay taxes for almost 20 years! What not assume he made only 1 dollar a year and say he might not have to pay taxes for the next BILLION years! Lame liberals demonizing legal tax actions for political gain, especially with the NYTimes did the same thing in 2014.
2
Come on the tax system is in place for every one to use fair or not. But a business man who sells self destruction and capitalizes on that is another story entirely. We have a glimmer of the future under Trump with his tax plan adding 3-5 trillion in debt. Is that the new CONSERVATIVE message?
6
A $916 million dollar loss...in one year?
Yeah, let's all vote for the "business" man.
Yeah, let's all vote for the "business" man.
11
Bravo Donald J. Trump, you weaseled out of paying your taxes!
But who do you think was forced to pick up the slack taxwise?
It sure wasn't the Bushes, the Romneys, the Kochs or the Waltons.
It is Joe Six Pack.
Why do you think Middle Class taxes go up?
Because the Donald Trumps of the world force "The Little People" to pick up the slack.
Bravo Donald...you're a real class act.
But who do you think was forced to pick up the slack taxwise?
It sure wasn't the Bushes, the Romneys, the Kochs or the Waltons.
It is Joe Six Pack.
Why do you think Middle Class taxes go up?
Because the Donald Trumps of the world force "The Little People" to pick up the slack.
Bravo Donald...you're a real class act.
11
It is really scary that Rudy and Chris went on TEEVEE and called Trump a genious with straight faces.., Followed up by Trump yelling at reporters with his Alec Baldwin pout. And the fact that half the country are buying their baloney , shows a country in decline!
5
Thank you, Times. And please keep digging and reporting!
4
Let's not forget, as too many do, that 916 M$ 1996 are in fact 1, 45 BILLION DOLLARS as per 2016, factoring in inflation. Source : http://www.bls.gov/data/inflation_calculator.htm
Well done, Deniald Trump
Well done, Deniald Trump
2
The chutzpah on this guy!
2
Trump labels mexicans...hes a hero
Trump insults women...its not a big deal.
Trump dismisses the presidency of the first black american...he's not racist, others are.
Trump mocks disable people...hes just bein playful.
Trump judges the weight of latino beauty...hes right and she's the nasty one.
Trump reports that he'd save US from debts...he's numerous bankrupcies and nearly 1 billion loss means he can fix america.
Trump doesnt pay taxes....hes a genious and otherd who pay are fools.
Trump insisted that the morgage crisis was good for him as he could buy properties at a cheap...he's business man and your painful loss is his gain.
And the list goes on.
What a big shame!
Do you see the pattern of hate, denial or ignorance by those who blindly worship him.
Can this man stand amongst republican giants like Lincoln or Reagan? They KINDA made america great, so he'll stand on shoulder to shoulder with them?
"He's the best thing ever and he'll make america great again" Trump Supporters.
Funny!
Trump insults women...its not a big deal.
Trump dismisses the presidency of the first black american...he's not racist, others are.
Trump mocks disable people...hes just bein playful.
Trump judges the weight of latino beauty...hes right and she's the nasty one.
Trump reports that he'd save US from debts...he's numerous bankrupcies and nearly 1 billion loss means he can fix america.
Trump doesnt pay taxes....hes a genious and otherd who pay are fools.
Trump insisted that the morgage crisis was good for him as he could buy properties at a cheap...he's business man and your painful loss is his gain.
And the list goes on.
What a big shame!
Do you see the pattern of hate, denial or ignorance by those who blindly worship him.
Can this man stand amongst republican giants like Lincoln or Reagan? They KINDA made america great, so he'll stand on shoulder to shoulder with them?
"He's the best thing ever and he'll make america great again" Trump Supporters.
Funny!
5
Clinton was a big part of creating the Syrian crisis, which killed millions, which sent several million more fleeing the war-zone that used to be home, which created crises all across Europe. The "three-strikes-you're-out" bill that she sold has ruined the lives of millions at home.
And you think Clinton has the moral high ground?
And you think Clinton has the moral high ground?
Let me say right up front that I will not be voting for this man; a second rate grifter styled businessman whose delusions of gradeur are starkly clear to all but the blindest of hominid. But let's be fair about this; so long as nothing is found amiss with his tax records in terms of information provided, etc., then I have little problem with him using the systems rules to his benefit.
Granted, as David S. said below, it just proves the old axiom that he who has the gold makes the rules but if you want change in how the Trumpster effected his tax gambits, and he must have had legions of minions all eager to do his service in that regard, then Congress and such must change the rules, redress the balance in domestic (and international) tax policy. To do that everyone must press, and press hard, on their elected elites. Else.....well....did I mention something about the holder of gold and rules effected?
Yes folks we are truly living within a Kurt Vonnegut novel. And somewhere that dear departed writer must be laughing his ever lovin'......off...
So it goes.
John~
American Net'Zen
Granted, as David S. said below, it just proves the old axiom that he who has the gold makes the rules but if you want change in how the Trumpster effected his tax gambits, and he must have had legions of minions all eager to do his service in that regard, then Congress and such must change the rules, redress the balance in domestic (and international) tax policy. To do that everyone must press, and press hard, on their elected elites. Else.....well....did I mention something about the holder of gold and rules effected?
Yes folks we are truly living within a Kurt Vonnegut novel. And somewhere that dear departed writer must be laughing his ever lovin'......off...
So it goes.
John~
American Net'Zen
1
Isn't the issue that all of his properties LOST money. A genius business man?
11
Hillary used exactly the same tax maneuver in 2015 as does every American who has capital gains or losses. Hillary on line 15 of her tax form took a deduction of $-700,000 for long term capital loss...exactly like Trump. The NYTimes ..oy
2
To offset sales of stock with long term capital gains.
Ordinary people are limited to $3000 per year deducting long term capital losses, no matter how much they had, or have carried forward.
Ordinary people are limited to $3000 per year deducting long term capital losses, no matter how much they had, or have carried forward.
5
Why did she declared capital loss of $700,000?
No, the $3k annual offset is against regular income--not gains, if no gains exist. Because I can't consider voting for Trump I haven't looked to see if the losses carried forward are income or gains. But there is no distinction between "ordinary people" and what Trump did, just ordinary income and gains. Even the most populist among the NYT readership should see that losses carried forward have been part of the tax code for generations. The numbers are big and the taxpayer is somebody most people find odious. But if his tax filings in 1995 were illegal, you would have known about it earlier. Once the numbers get to be this big, the IRS audits every year: not because of what people like Bill Maher like to propagate ("...because he's a CROOK!"). The IRS is not shy about shutting crooks down (except, perhaps, in Al Sharpton's case).
And this is worse than lying about 4 Americans dying in Benghazi, taking money from foreign nations that wish us no good will in return for who knows what, other than giving Russia 20% of the USA's plutonium (remind me again what they usE that for....oh yeah Nuclear Bombs), lying about deleting 33,000 emails, lying about not scrubbing them (Bleach Bit anyone). Yeah spare you comments on someone taking advantage of the tax laws that in place FOR EVERY AMERICAN TO USE.
1
The irony of the bigoted Mr Trump to base his entire political argument on illegal immigrants stealing jobs and NOT paying their fair share of taxes and DONALD HASNT PAID A TAX IN DECADES. You all still support this theif? Good grief
6
What is most amazing is that he earned ONLY $6,000 in wages and salaries!
This is MOST important. WHY?
Because it is the bare MINIMUM one must earn on which SOCIAL SECURITY and MEDICARE Taxes would have to be paid to claim FULL BENEFITS at age 66. (Maximum Social Security taxable wage is $118,000).
I BET that his 2015 tax return would show that he started getting social security checks of $2,800 a month (if he waited to collect at 70), and that he has a Medicare card too!
This is MOST important. WHY?
Because it is the bare MINIMUM one must earn on which SOCIAL SECURITY and MEDICARE Taxes would have to be paid to claim FULL BENEFITS at age 66. (Maximum Social Security taxable wage is $118,000).
I BET that his 2015 tax return would show that he started getting social security checks of $2,800 a month (if he waited to collect at 70), and that he has a Medicare card too!
5
Are we forgetting that Donald Trumps's tax returns have been AUDITED every year = NO news here is must be legal or he'd be in jail. If you have losses you must put them on your tax returns or you have no recourse to try and capture a little of your loss. The IRS code is not set up to dollar for dollar losses. You typically get a small percentage of your loss.
1
Dodgy Donald lost $916 Million through bad management (he should have stayed at Warton for the graduate program). About 500 average taxpayers will have to pay for that over 18 years. But he knows the "rigged" system, and only he can fix it. It takes a thief to catch a thief.
4
This is the US tax code working the way it was designed to work. The Clintons most certainly use it the same way along with everyone else in the ruling and political classes.
People in the early 20th century were duped when they accepted the sales pitch for the federal income tax and it being applied to wages. What was supposed to be a tax on the very wealthiest is now become simply a way to keep the middle class financially oppressed.
People in the early 20th century were duped when they accepted the sales pitch for the federal income tax and it being applied to wages. What was supposed to be a tax on the very wealthiest is now become simply a way to keep the middle class financially oppressed.
8
As we all applaud The New York Times for its persistence in digging for Donald Trump’s tax records, the most amazing thing is everyone’s surprise that Trump reported big losses.
We knew from various published analyses that Trump’s net worth, while very substantial, is well below the number he crowed about. That lower figure reflects the now-reported losses which, in turn, qualified Trump to avoid paying federal income taxes.
Were the returns fully available, they almost certainly would also show that Trump annually was very stingy about charitable contributions – another reason for his refusal to release his returns.
What is scary is how many people had begun defending Trump’s refusal to disclose his returns simply because the law does not require disclosure. Forget about two generations of presidential election transparency, Donald Trump was being portrayed as being singled out for persecution. His whining victimhood on the issue was winning converts until The New York Times article.
We knew from various published analyses that Trump’s net worth, while very substantial, is well below the number he crowed about. That lower figure reflects the now-reported losses which, in turn, qualified Trump to avoid paying federal income taxes.
Were the returns fully available, they almost certainly would also show that Trump annually was very stingy about charitable contributions – another reason for his refusal to release his returns.
What is scary is how many people had begun defending Trump’s refusal to disclose his returns simply because the law does not require disclosure. Forget about two generations of presidential election transparency, Donald Trump was being portrayed as being singled out for persecution. His whining victimhood on the issue was winning converts until The New York Times article.
2
A big thank you to The New York Times.
The Gray Lady gives us reporting as critical to the nation's well-being as the reporting done on the Pentagon Papers, perhaps even more so.
I'm patting my iPad; please consider it your pat on the back.
The Gray Lady gives us reporting as critical to the nation's well-being as the reporting done on the Pentagon Papers, perhaps even more so.
I'm patting my iPad; please consider it your pat on the back.
7
I certainly hold no brief for Trump but his tax returns reflect more on the legislature and the elected politicians so much in the clutch of the wealthy that they write text codes allowing for $50 millions a year tax free for years while enforcing tax payments stifling for the middle class and poor. Defeat Trump but just as importantly throw out those who legislate such tax laws.
4
The incoherence of so much of Trump's spoken exposition, is surpassed by the utter hypocrisy of so much that is comprehensible of his speech. To accuse Hillary Clinton of lack of transparency while refusing to release his tax returns, and to decry the crumbling infrastructure of our country while refusing to pay his fair share of taxes to pay for its repair, and then, effectively, gloating about that, is beyond the pale.
Add to that, the racism, misogyny, and the public mocking of the disability of a disabled reporter, and you have a man who is despicable beyond redemption.
Add to that, the racism, misogyny, and the public mocking of the disability of a disabled reporter, and you have a man who is despicable beyond redemption.
8
How come this kind of person could be chosen as a presidential candidate. If he should be elected as the president, it should be one of the new eight wonders of the world.
3
Taxes are for little people, the suckers . . . like all the poor, angry ones voting for Trump.
9
Perhaps the Trump campaign itself was the source of the tax records. "Send them a page and they'll feel like they've seen the worst." Meanwhile, any lack of charity or unseemly foreign entanglements remain hidden from voters' view.
But complete tax returns and financial involvements still need to be released.
But complete tax returns and financial involvements still need to be released.
7
You are absolutely correct. This very small piece of the puzzle might serve to get a brief respite from the public's demands to see Trump's tax returns.
I firmly believe that the sources of income and the likelihood of loans or obligations to banks in unfriendly countries is what the Trump people want to remain a secret.
I firmly believe that the sources of income and the likelihood of loans or obligations to banks in unfriendly countries is what the Trump people want to remain a secret.
2
Trump was fired from the only publicly traded corporation he ever headed. He took it into bankruptcy costing investors over one billion dollars in lost value. Well, I guess those facts are too difficult for people, but it seems they understand that losing over 900 million dollars in one year is a very big deal. That's more money that a lot of cities, towns and school districts spend on their entire budgets.
Most people did not realize that there could be great benefits from heading up a losing business enterprise. In this case Trump's gains from losing money had to come from his personal stake in the business. Most people who head corporations would not be able to take such massive deductions by failing because they don't own enough of the corporation to incur such benefits. Because he started out as a principle owner of the casino businesses, he was able to take the deductions.
I have also read in the course of this roller coaster, crazy campaign year that Trump pushed his personal indebtedness from the casino business onto the public corporation. In other words, it appears that he ensured the public company would fail by getting it to assume his personal debts. Yeah, he's a smart business guy, but he was doing things that normal people, trying to be moral, fair and decent, don't do. Trump is also on record in saying he was looking out only for himself in the casino deals, flipping the bird at his responsibilities to shareholders, bond holders, contractors and employees.
Most people did not realize that there could be great benefits from heading up a losing business enterprise. In this case Trump's gains from losing money had to come from his personal stake in the business. Most people who head corporations would not be able to take such massive deductions by failing because they don't own enough of the corporation to incur such benefits. Because he started out as a principle owner of the casino businesses, he was able to take the deductions.
I have also read in the course of this roller coaster, crazy campaign year that Trump pushed his personal indebtedness from the casino business onto the public corporation. In other words, it appears that he ensured the public company would fail by getting it to assume his personal debts. Yeah, he's a smart business guy, but he was doing things that normal people, trying to be moral, fair and decent, don't do. Trump is also on record in saying he was looking out only for himself in the casino deals, flipping the bird at his responsibilities to shareholders, bond holders, contractors and employees.
11
"Ultimately it is simply incredible for Liberal Democrats and their phony cronies to compare the alleged legal act of Mr. Trump in “legally” not paying taxes on profits due to past tax loss carry forwards and yet commit a crime by reporting on Trump’s taxes without his consent and then give the Clintons a pass on their criminal activities surrounding Whitewater, Travelgate, Filegate, Impeachment, Disbarment, Benghazi, the Clinton Foundation and Hillary’s illegal server and email activities, etc."
—-The author of this post has a CPA and attends Board and Audit Committee meetings for-profit and non-profit entities in the US, Bermuda, Australia, Korea, Taiwan, Japan, Malaysia, Hong Kong, China, Singapore and the UK. Tax loss carryforwards have been discussed at some of these meetings and they are common legal tax offsets.
http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2016/10/criminal-clintons-and-the-new-yo...
VERY hard to see how the NY Times can get away with this... then again, they do support Hillary.
—-The author of this post has a CPA and attends Board and Audit Committee meetings for-profit and non-profit entities in the US, Bermuda, Australia, Korea, Taiwan, Japan, Malaysia, Hong Kong, China, Singapore and the UK. Tax loss carryforwards have been discussed at some of these meetings and they are common legal tax offsets.
http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2016/10/criminal-clintons-and-the-new-yo...
VERY hard to see how the NY Times can get away with this... then again, they do support Hillary.
2
Really a very biased column. Even if absolutely everything said is true, the phrasing is not neutral but reflects an editorial stance. Frankly, it is not "journalism".
And Mitnick, perhaps he is or was a great accountant, but has zero professional ethics based on his public comment on private tax matters (even with his claim he couldn't talk, he said plenty). Even at 80 I guess some people are looking for their 15 minutes.
Everyone knows the US tax code is a sham. I completely understand why Trump said "it makes me smart". It may not be what politicians are supposed to say, it may seem insensitive to the average Joe's struggles, but it is the system all the established politicians have put in place and allowed to persist; Trump just used it as written. Whether he is elected or Hillaryis, it will not change, many thousands of wealthy Americans are doing the same or similar things and will continue to do so.
PS the US tax code is not the only sham tax code, but like so many things, good and bad in the USA, it is probably the greatest at being a sham system.
And Mitnick, perhaps he is or was a great accountant, but has zero professional ethics based on his public comment on private tax matters (even with his claim he couldn't talk, he said plenty). Even at 80 I guess some people are looking for their 15 minutes.
Everyone knows the US tax code is a sham. I completely understand why Trump said "it makes me smart". It may not be what politicians are supposed to say, it may seem insensitive to the average Joe's struggles, but it is the system all the established politicians have put in place and allowed to persist; Trump just used it as written. Whether he is elected or Hillaryis, it will not change, many thousands of wealthy Americans are doing the same or similar things and will continue to do so.
PS the US tax code is not the only sham tax code, but like so many things, good and bad in the USA, it is probably the greatest at being a sham system.
5
Hmmmm... 1995? No arrests for doing anything illegal? Oh, he didn't do anything illegal!! I seem to recall GM getting government monies to save their businesses at one time. The US banks, too, I believe Tell me, do you think they kept their losses off their income taxes because of that? NOT! Businesses get these breaks so they don't go under, causing a dramatic loss of 1000's of jobs, which can hurt the economy, especially in local areas. I believe a big businessman like Trump, who has a large corporation, does his fair share of payouts in the 100s of jobs he provides, which puts money back into the economy; benefits his company gives to the employed (so as not to pay out more govt money in welfare); & charitable contributions. Or should we say that Trump or any of the large businesses, should give most of their money to the govt; then, they get workers who work for free & everybody can go on a welfare system paid by the govt? An approach done by the Soviet Union that didn't work out too well. How would that be freedom?
2
Totally wrong!
The small business owners, vendors and their employees are the real victims here.The tax laws that Trump used benefitted only himself. He continued a lavish lifestyle at the expense of so many others, let alone the IRS.
Illegal-no. unethical - yes.
The small business owners, vendors and their employees are the real victims here.The tax laws that Trump used benefitted only himself. He continued a lavish lifestyle at the expense of so many others, let alone the IRS.
Illegal-no. unethical - yes.
2
I actually laughed out loud at this, so thanks to the Trump campaign for something: The statement continued, “Mr. Trump knows the tax code far better than anyone who has ever run for President and he is the only one that knows how to fix it.”
2
Polls are showing that 52% don't care about this issue - Trump has done nothing illegal...it's the crappy tax system - that's why we need him to address it!!
1
You don't actually believe Trump knows tax law do you? He has very pricey tax accountants and tax lawyers to do this for him.
2
Good, then releasing more recent returns shouldn't be a problem.
1
....and can we agree that Hillary will reveal her 30K emails and her speeches to Goldman Sachs and other banks which she's desperate to conceal?!
I'm sorry NYT, did you not do the same thing?
What's wrong with what Trump did? He followed the laws of this country. You may not like the laws, but that's your problem. He just saved himself some cash, like everyone else likes to do.
What's wrong with what Trump did? He followed the laws of this country. You may not like the laws, but that's your problem. He just saved himself some cash, like everyone else likes to do.
3
I hope this clarifies for the uncertain why Bernie is so intent on the 1% paying their fair share, because DJT is far from the only one.
2
Bernie lost.
Badly.
Let it go.
Badly.
Let it go.
1
Bernie was right, but Hillary has my vote.
One other point this affair raises is if The Donald generated $916 million in debt, what banker in their right mind would loan him money after this debacle?
This might explain the Russian connection many others have eluded to.
Yet another reason he won't reveal his recent taxes - there's probably a lot of involvement of Russian bankers and oligarchical Putin sycophants helping to keep him afloat.
This might explain the Russian connection many others have eluded to.
Yet another reason he won't reveal his recent taxes - there's probably a lot of involvement of Russian bankers and oligarchical Putin sycophants helping to keep him afloat.
6
Losing a billion dollars doesn't make you a good businessman. Unfortunately the system is rigged and Trump isn't the person to fix a rigged system. Reforming the system would remove the advantages that made Donald rich and he would never do that. It's not in his DNA.
4
30+ years ago, when I left graduate school and entered the business world, I was able to substantially reduce my tax burden with "the poor man's loophole", Income Averaging. Between that and putting away $2000 a year into an IRA, you could give yourself a lot of relief, legally.
Income averaging was especially good for people like me, who, after several years on the starvation income of a grad student, could use that against the increase of getting a good job. Originally, it was 5 years, but under the Reagan administration, it was first lowered to 3 years, then done away with altogether. Meanwhile, the pre-tax donation to an IRA was also done away with by "Mr. Lower Taxes, Saint Ronald". Hah!
For those at the higher end of middle class, "Alternative Minimum Tax" was installed, originally to tax wealthy Americans, but as inflation increase, the AMT wasn't adjusted to rise with it--catching better off middle class people.
Yet Donald Trump was able to use HIS losses as "income averaging" for not just 5 years, but for 18 years, and was able to BEGIN it long after ordinary people lost income averaging as an option. And he's for a "fair income tax"?
Give me a break!
Income averaging was especially good for people like me, who, after several years on the starvation income of a grad student, could use that against the increase of getting a good job. Originally, it was 5 years, but under the Reagan administration, it was first lowered to 3 years, then done away with altogether. Meanwhile, the pre-tax donation to an IRA was also done away with by "Mr. Lower Taxes, Saint Ronald". Hah!
For those at the higher end of middle class, "Alternative Minimum Tax" was installed, originally to tax wealthy Americans, but as inflation increase, the AMT wasn't adjusted to rise with it--catching better off middle class people.
Yet Donald Trump was able to use HIS losses as "income averaging" for not just 5 years, but for 18 years, and was able to BEGIN it long after ordinary people lost income averaging as an option. And he's for a "fair income tax"?
Give me a break!
4
Why do you think he refused to rease his tax returns?
1
What this really shows to me is just how much our economic and political system is a perfect oligarchy with the ruling elite creating laws, tax policy, and a government that specifically benefits themselves over all others.
10
January 1st is always an important date to celebrate in the Trump household. It's tax freedom day - the date on which you stop paying taxes to the government and you get to keep everything you earn!
4
Christie goes on Fox and tells Chris Wallace that Trump is a genius not to pay federal taxes.
But Christie failed to mention how HIS administration forgave $25 million of $30 million Trump owed the state of NJ in corporate taxes.
But Christie failed to mention how HIS administration forgave $25 million of $30 million Trump owed the state of NJ in corporate taxes.
8
Trump said: "I never pay more than 85 cents for each Dollar I owe and therefore when I am President I will not pay the U.S. debt creditors the full amount"..."As President you are in control because you are the one that prints the money"... "I love debt, I am the king of debt"..."I didn't pay taxes therefore I am smart"... (And you are stupid because you have taxes deducted from each and everyone of your paychecks)... "I will bring jobs back to America" (but not the jobs I just created in Scotland via my new golf resort)... "I lost almost a Billion Dollars in one single tax year therefore I am a great, very talented businessman"... What a "genius"!!!
6
Mr. Trump may think he is smart because he has made lots of money while not paying any taxes and not breaking the law. But with this record, he is stupid for running for President of the United States.
4
It's about time New York Times. Keep digging. Keep doing your job! Democracy depends on it.
6
Donald Trump, some businessman you are! You report a loss of 915+ million dollars and you think your business acumen is a persuasive reason to vote for you? You are part of the reason why the gulf between the rich and poor has widened so substantially over the last 25 years and economic injustice in the USA is so rampant. And how arrogant of you, to boast of your financial wealth, yet oppose paying any federal tax for so many years. Meanwhile, you say some of our citizens are living in hellish conditions yet you oppose raising the minimum wage for the poorest wage earners. I have two related questions for you to ponder: 1.) What would happen if everyone in the country did what you did and paid no income tax? 2.) Would such a practice-- of none us paying any income tax-- make this country "Great Again" as you so often promulgate? Using any loophole you can exploit to pay no tax does not make you "smart." Rather, it makes you unfit to serve as president-- or in other political office, for that matter. The overarching purpose of your job is to work for justice. In a country where millions of ordinary citizens pay their fair share of taxes to support our schools, our local police and fire departments, our military, and dozens of important infrastructure projects aimed at improving the quality of our lives, I am appalled that you have chosen not to contribute any money to the very same groups and projects your purport to support. It is now clear why you didn't any of us to see your tax returns, hiding behind the incessant excuse that "I'm under audit." You won't be surprised to learn that you did not earn my vote this November.
8
Since everyone secretly dreams they had a way, legal or not, of avoiding taxes, I doubt very much that Trump's ingenuity in finding legal ways of dodging the IRS will even raise eyebrows; thinking the leak is going to sink Trump's campaign is wishful thinking on the part of his opponents in media, just as was their conviction that Hillary Clinton's poll numbers would skyrocket after the debate: nothing of the sort happened, she is essentially now where she was before it took place.
Let's hope that every single person on the IRS team performing the audit of Trump's returns is a Republican. Why? Because no one would want an IRS auditor to be accused of being politically biased against Trump. We wouldn't want a "Lois Lerner" situation (Lois Lerner was the Democrat running the IRS and forced to resign under pressure due to alleged anti-Republican bias) to cloud an otherwise proper audit of Trump's tax returns. Let's hope the IRS flea-combs his returns.
5
Alleged? Her bias was well documented.
Even when you lose revenues in a down business year, you're supposed to somehow send large sums to Washington D.C. in the form of taxes, says the New York Times.
Taking legal deductions for the costs of conducing business makes you a bad person, the mainstream media is now insisting in its latest lame attempt to destroy the Trump campaign.
It's all ridiculous, of course. Sending moolah to Washington to be wasted by incompetent, corrupt bureaucrats and politicians has to be the dumbest idea ever...
Taking legal deductions for the costs of conducing business makes you a bad person, the mainstream media is now insisting in its latest lame attempt to destroy the Trump campaign.
It's all ridiculous, of course. Sending moolah to Washington to be wasted by incompetent, corrupt bureaucrats and politicians has to be the dumbest idea ever...
3
If it is such a great story, truly exemplary of his business prowess (I'm talking to you Rudy Giuliani & Chris Christie), then by all means - show us his tax returns...
2
While I'm thrilled this has come out and people're having a cow over it, I really don't care... It's the tax laws--not any horrible, disgusting, illegal stuff this creature has done--that need to be changed. What I wanna hear about are the horrible, disgusting, illegal things, like the Trump "Foundation" money and the Cuba ventures and whatever It's tried to make happen in Russia, as well as the consta-lies about It's net-worth. While this'll generate bad press, which's great, of course, how could this pond-scum be handed the nuclear codes (Yes, I just threw salt over my shoulder) when for all we know It had/has co-investments with our enemies? Shouldn't it be REQUIRED that we know these things?!?
4
One wonders whether, with all his nearly twenty years of untaxed hundreds of millions of dollars, Mr Trump bestowed any of that largesse on all the good causes he said he's contributed. Since he has steadfastly refused to allow any of his tax records to be examined, I think we can be confident that he's just as cheap as he is dishonest.
4
It is impossible to pay tax on a tax loss. Start and finish of the story. The only issue that might be subject of IRS audit is the validity of all or part of the loss and the size of any subsequent taxable income offset against that tax loss. This is the least controversial tax issue in the world. Hillary has the same issue in her 2015 tax return - $900,000 tax loss. Can't imagine what she lost real money on! Trump on the other hand presumably lost money on property transactions in the early nineties that he realized for tax purposes in the 1995 year and that he has since recovered from quiet spectacularly. The issue will undoubtedly be the qualification of that loss (assuming it's economic and not paper) as allowable and available for offset against future tax profits of like kind.
1
The more important thing in this $900 million loss (Trump is not disputing that number), is the incompetence displayed by that level of business failure. A plea to Trump supporters: please read about Trump's businesses. His wealth is based on wild gambles that sometimes pay off, and he keeps the profits, and often fail, and the losses are subsidized by all of us via tax loopholes discussed in this Times article, non-payment to hard working small business sub-contractors, law suits to force the city to give him tax breaks not designed for the ultra-luxury projects he engages in, etc.
To Rudy Giuliani: Please do not insult us by saying Trump was "using the tax code to best serve the people he represents." This is his PERSONAL tax return. The benefits serve only to enrich Trump, personally.
To Chris Cristie: Please do not insult us by saying Trump's "genius" knowledge of the tax code means "Donald Trump is the best person to fix it." Jack Mitnick, Trump's accountant who prepared his tax returns, has already told everyone that, unlike his father's attention to tax details, Donald was undisciplined.
And this is Trump's strong suit!! Trump doesn't even know the names of the key players in the Middle East!! http://www.nytimes.com/politics/first-draft/2015/09/03/donald-trump-stum...
Trump is unqualified on national security! http://www.nytimes.com/2016/08/05/opinion/campaign-stops/i-ran-the-cia-n...
To Rudy Giuliani: Please do not insult us by saying Trump was "using the tax code to best serve the people he represents." This is his PERSONAL tax return. The benefits serve only to enrich Trump, personally.
To Chris Cristie: Please do not insult us by saying Trump's "genius" knowledge of the tax code means "Donald Trump is the best person to fix it." Jack Mitnick, Trump's accountant who prepared his tax returns, has already told everyone that, unlike his father's attention to tax details, Donald was undisciplined.
And this is Trump's strong suit!! Trump doesn't even know the names of the key players in the Middle East!! http://www.nytimes.com/politics/first-draft/2015/09/03/donald-trump-stum...
Trump is unqualified on national security! http://www.nytimes.com/2016/08/05/opinion/campaign-stops/i-ran-the-cia-n...
5
You fail to note the 600 million write off the Clintons have taken, the fact they were broke when they left the WH but now, through their influence selling are quite wealthy...that they never invested in business but have been lifelong politicians...and I never knew the job paid so well...you may be on the high horses against Trump but remember, he did not illegal...no email scandal...never left Americans in an embassy to die then lied to cover it up...just did what every American citizen does when they pay their taxes...look for some way to retain some of their money...and frankly I am not faulting the Clintons for their deductions they have taken, I fault the Clintons for other faults and lies.
I am sure Mitnick was paid a handsome sum of $ to advise Trump on his taxes, then he has the gall to be critical of Trump for not paying tax on his incredible net wealth. How about Trump's incredible losses on the risks he took, the risks he hoped would create wealth and also create jobs for many people? It's too bad we don't have more people willing to take these risks. I realize that this concept is foreign to many of the birdbrains commenting on this article.
The issue here is not Donald Trump taking advantage of the tax codes, it's the tilt of the codes in favor of the 1%. Even though Trump is included in the 1% this same group refuses to support him, but supports his opponent. Why do you think that is? Allows follow the money.
The issue here is not Donald Trump taking advantage of the tax codes, it's the tilt of the codes in favor of the 1%. Even though Trump is included in the 1% this same group refuses to support him, but supports his opponent. Why do you think that is? Allows follow the money.
1
Clintons also took a large deduction in their returns if anyone takes the time to read it. I am only disappointed in myself for not following in their footsteps, about 43 years as politicians and they leave the white house broke, then US Senator and Secretary of State and now they are worth what, 3 quarters of a billion...they might well be the smart ones...it pays well to be a politician.
2
From the IRS website (https://www.irs.gov/taxtopics/tc453.html):
“If you are a cash method taxpayer (most individuals are), you generally cannot take a bad debt deduction for unpaid salaries, wages, rents, fees, interests, dividends, and similar items.”
And so many Americans wonder why they just can't seem to get ahead.
“If you are a cash method taxpayer (most individuals are), you generally cannot take a bad debt deduction for unpaid salaries, wages, rents, fees, interests, dividends, and similar items.”
And so many Americans wonder why they just can't seem to get ahead.
3
Mark, a cash method taxpayer cannot take a deduction for an amount unpaid because that amount had not been previously included in his taxable income. The other type of taxpayer -- called an "accrual method" taxpayer-- would only be able to deduct the unpaid receivable if he had previously included that amount in income. So the cash method taxpayer is not being screwed.
Jonathan- My point is, if you worked for one of Trump's businesses and got stiffed when it went bankrupt, the government gave you nothing, but allowed Trump a tax benefit for his losses.
The methods described to avoid taxes do nothing to create jobs or grow the economy. Simply deprives our government of tax revenue which is needed to support the necessary conduct of government, and results in a higher tax burden on middle income and lower income tax payers. His supporters will say no laws have been broken, but I say there are ethical and moral considerations which are of equal concern.
4
Presumably, before 1995, Mr. trump paid federal taxes on the $916 million when it was erned, prior to Mr. Trump losing that amount.
2
So basically, Donald Trump leaned on the expertise of an accountant (and lawyer ,who specialized in the handling of tax write-offs for the wealthy), to dodge paying taxes for 18 years. It wasn't Donald Trump's undisciplined "smarts" that helped him net millions while dodging tax payments. Rather, it was Mr. Mitnick's knowledge of tax break incentives for the wealthy, that helped him stay afloat. I wonder who's paying congress to write those incentives? And while those incentives are being written, who's fitting the bill? Who's paying for government infrastructures and for the U.S. military service?
5
Leona Helmsley will always be remembered for one of the most arrogant statements ever uttered: "We don't pay taxes. Only the little people pay taxes."
What will the Donald be remembered for (ie. Birther-in-Chief, "anything I said was just a .... suggestion", or "(Only the little people pay taxes and) that makes me smart.")
What will the Donald be remembered for (ie. Birther-in-Chief, "anything I said was just a .... suggestion", or "(Only the little people pay taxes and) that makes me smart.")
4
Trumps tax proposals seem to benefit him further. Of course we can't have a transparent discussion unless he releases his returns. His contractors and investors were the ones who got hurt, while his standard of living never suffered.
2
Ooops. Ny Times praises trump at the time, for bouncing back from these losses.
http://www.nytimes.com/1995/10/25/nyregion/crowning-the-comeback-king.html
http://www.nytimes.com/1995/10/25/nyregion/crowning-the-comeback-king.html
2
Donald Trump must have been a protégé of that 1980s queen of mean, Leona Helmsley, who famously said, “"We don't pay taxes. Only the little people pay taxes." The “yuge” difference is she landed up in jail for tax evasion, whereas Mr. Trump might be rewarded with the presidency for enriching himself with “other people’s money?”
2
If his supporters were reasonable people, his campaign would be over now, but so far they have not shown themselves to care about reason. They've got someone giving them permission to voice their extremist beliefs and feel good about it, a powerful thing.
3
Trump's tax affairs are a symptom of a very sick tax system which favors billionaires over workers.
The tax system must be overhauled so that everyone pays federal taxes to some degree. Nobody should be getting a free ride....but they do because the bought and paid for politicians make a tax system which favors the ultra wealthy.
The tax system must be overhauled so that everyone pays federal taxes to some degree. Nobody should be getting a free ride....but they do because the bought and paid for politicians make a tax system which favors the ultra wealthy.
4
NYT readers love people who've been dead broke.
Hillary said "When we left the White House we were dead broke." And why might that be...
Now that same person is worth well over 100 million. Not bad for a government employee.
Trump's taxes show a loss of 900 million. Now he's worth billions after employing tens of thousands.
If NYT readers love Hillary so much, then they must really love Trump.
Maybe the NYT can get just one copy of Hillary's Wall Street speech transcripts, since it loves divulging information so much. Wall Street has paid Hillary very handsomely.
Do you really think Hillary will reform the tax code that supposedly angers this readership so much? Really?
Hillary's love of money is really astounding. By the way, the Clinton Foundation pays ZERO in tax. In fact, the Clinton's get a tax deduction for every dime they contribute to their own foundation. Sure, Hillary will really reform the tax code...
Hillary said "When we left the White House we were dead broke." And why might that be...
Now that same person is worth well over 100 million. Not bad for a government employee.
Trump's taxes show a loss of 900 million. Now he's worth billions after employing tens of thousands.
If NYT readers love Hillary so much, then they must really love Trump.
Maybe the NYT can get just one copy of Hillary's Wall Street speech transcripts, since it loves divulging information so much. Wall Street has paid Hillary very handsomely.
Do you really think Hillary will reform the tax code that supposedly angers this readership so much? Really?
Hillary's love of money is really astounding. By the way, the Clinton Foundation pays ZERO in tax. In fact, the Clinton's get a tax deduction for every dime they contribute to their own foundation. Sure, Hillary will really reform the tax code...
2
So he claims he started with nothing, tells the IRS he makes no money, and yet he says that he is worth billions.
2
Please have more reporting like this. We need to see more about Trump's evasion of taxes, and bad business deals. In my work, which relates to design and construction of buildings, Trump is notorious for not paying architects, engineers, projects managers, contractors, and subcontractors he has hired to build his real estate empire. Thus, he hires people, doesn't pay them.
What is the evidence he is a good businessman?
What is the evidence he is a good businessman?
To put in the framework of the average American. In 1995 the median income was $33,456. To loose 918 million dollars in a year, Trump would have had to loose $2.5 million per DAY. It would take the average American 75 years to earn what Trump lost in ONE DAY.
1
I'm still trying to get my mind around any single individual losing $916 million dollars. Tell me again what his plan is to reduce poverty in America?
2
Put yourself in Trump's shoes:
If you were in Trump's position, having gone through all of this, would you change the tax codes? What is your reasoning behind answering yes or no, and do you sincerely believe that Trump would give the same answer?
Now compare your answer to what Trump himself (not his campaign) actually says, and that should provide some insight as to whether or not he actually perceives the laws as broken in the first place.
Given that perceiving something as broken is the first step towards fixing it, that insight alone should speak to the kind of tax-related changes we could reasonably expect from him.
If you were in Trump's position, having gone through all of this, would you change the tax codes? What is your reasoning behind answering yes or no, and do you sincerely believe that Trump would give the same answer?
Now compare your answer to what Trump himself (not his campaign) actually says, and that should provide some insight as to whether or not he actually perceives the laws as broken in the first place.
Given that perceiving something as broken is the first step towards fixing it, that insight alone should speak to the kind of tax-related changes we could reasonably expect from him.
So it appears that Donald Trump and the Times Corporation have something in common. Each suffered extraordinary losses of approximately a billion dollars, and as a result, have tax loss carry forwards that will keep them from paying federal income taxes for years. In Trump's case, he lost money on Atlantic City, in the Times case, it lost around a billion on its purchase, and subsequent sale for peanuts, of the Boston Globe.
If we cannot trust someone who has suffered a tax loss of this magnitude as President, can we trust an organization that suffered a loss of this magnitude to report on business matters and tax issues?
If we cannot trust someone who has suffered a tax loss of this magnitude as President, can we trust an organization that suffered a loss of this magnitude to report on business matters and tax issues?
6
Wow - this is news? I guess we should wait a year for NYT to report Hillary's return and he loss she claimed recently?
Wasn't the Clintons in the WH in the 90's?
Wasn't the Clintons in the WH in the 90's?
14
Yes, the Clintons was in the White House in the '90s; is I missing some relevant point here?
But they didn't finish returning all the stuff they ''accidentally borrowed'' - worth a couple of hundred thousand - until much later.
But they MEANT so well. Doesn't that cover it?
But they MEANT so well. Doesn't that cover it?
1
Actually, we didn't have to wait that long. It's already being reported that The Clintons used the EXACT same strategy to avoid paying taxes in 2014 and 2015. What I think is hilarious is that the New York Times also used tax loopholes to avoid paying taxes in 2014.
Create jobs my foot. I create jobs - I pay a maid and a yard crew $600 a month. I just refurbished my home for $105k and those workers had income for 2 months. When all of us pay our doctors, hairdresser and nail technician we are supporting jobs. I also pay $45k a year in federal income tax and another $10k in FICA and Medicare tax and that is after putting 20% of my salary into my 401(k) that a money manager makes a 1.5% fee on - more money spent on jobs. Cut the malarkey about Trump's jobs - his hotel wait staff paid $2 an hour and the rest are tips. I also give generously throughout the year to charities and $25,000 for a child's tuition each year which goes towards jobs for teachers.
Am I fortunate, yes. Blessed yes. I've been a tax professional at the Big Four for most of my career and I'm here to tell you the 0.01% are not paying their fair share. I'm mad - one more reason to vote for Clinton.
Am I fortunate, yes. Blessed yes. I've been a tax professional at the Big Four for most of my career and I'm here to tell you the 0.01% are not paying their fair share. I'm mad - one more reason to vote for Clinton.
156
AND if you took a big loss on one or more of your businesses... would you use the tax law to your advantage... or just give the government the money regardless of the tax laws? I have a feeling that you'd do the same thing Trump did... just not at the same level of income. Change the law... don't blame people who follow it.
So what. He wasn't runn8by for President 20 years ago! Al he needs to show is an asset and liability disclosure and that he has filed taxes...not that he owes millions in back taxes like freaking Willie Nelson. They shouldn't be confusing personal income taxes with bankrupt business ventures anyway. He was never a career politician...Look at his last 5 years personal income taxes...lets get on with the election.
Your comment is interesting considering you work as a tax professional at one of the Big Four firms. Doesn't that include pitching tax saving strategies to companies and others wealthy enough to afford the rates you guys charge? Tax saving strategies like how to generate and time loss generation to maximize offsetting future income (what Trump's advisors did), like cross border tax treaties to minimize paying taxes, like transfer pricing strategies to avoid repatriotating oversea income, and whole host of other "creative" ways to help companies and others avoid paying their fair share? And working for one of the Big Four firms, your billing rates must be such that only those companies and others large enough and rich enough can afford your services and to support your richly detailed lifestyle. Hopefully, you don't work for that one Big Four firm which partners went to jail for selling tax saving ideas that were in fact tax shelters to evade paying taxes. Big Four firms are one of the willing participants in perpetuating these tax loopholes - again, only for those wealthy enough to afford it. Having had to sit through numerous sales pitches from many of you guys from all of the Big Four Firms, not sure what to make of your comment when you make your living off of the exact practice that you are deriding.
$916 mil? Sounds like somebody's the biggest loser! LOOOSER!
72
You gotta add "Sad!" to the end of the comment if you wanna more accurately reflect It's Twitter feed.
Yes, and major losses happened to the banks in the housing crisis. Wonder why? I believe it was called government involvement. Big government = Bigger Loser!
This is truly hilarious.
The Times wants us to scream and ache because this man has legally done what every Democratic Party member would do with having his taxes prepared by smart people.
But when it comes to Hillary Clinton maintaining the secrecy of national security information - and failing - and getting people KILLED because of it - the Times immediately needs to discuss something else, anything else.
Trump must follow the law - and he does.
Hillary need never do that for the Times - and never has.
All the old rules of journalism give way when there is a political race to win.
The Times wants us to scream and ache because this man has legally done what every Democratic Party member would do with having his taxes prepared by smart people.
But when it comes to Hillary Clinton maintaining the secrecy of national security information - and failing - and getting people KILLED because of it - the Times immediately needs to discuss something else, anything else.
Trump must follow the law - and he does.
Hillary need never do that for the Times - and never has.
All the old rules of journalism give way when there is a political race to win.
26
Nobody got killed because of anything Clinton did. Everything else is a bald-faced lie.
1
Please elaborate: exactly which people were killed as a result of Hillary Clinton "mishandling national security information"?
Simply repeating a falsehood over and over again does not make it true.
Simply repeating a falsehood over and over again does not make it true.
Just what we want for president, a morally corrupt man who believes it's smart for a rich man not to have to pay any federal taxes because a poor single mother making $15 an hour will.
100
Yes, and just what do some others want? A morally corrupted, lying under oath woman, who by her own actions of demonizing the women her highly official, powerful husband took advantage of, basically condoned a womanizer, making it more difficult for the next generations of woman in the workforce to fight any type of inappropriate sexual behavior by men in power. Do you know what some women have gone through because HC didn't stand up for women when she needed to? Now she acts like she cares about a past womanizer? Looks like she thinks a womanizer can change considering the fact that she's still standing by her man!
1
Trump's loss of almost 1 billion dollars simply goes to show his incompetence as a business man.
The loss carry forward is legal. The loss itself is staggering in its amount and should trump any claims as to Mr. Trump's business acumen.
He has enriched himself at the expense of contractors, investors, workers and lenders.
And look at his salary income.
The loss carry forward is legal. The loss itself is staggering in its amount and should trump any claims as to Mr. Trump's business acumen.
He has enriched himself at the expense of contractors, investors, workers and lenders.
And look at his salary income.
95
Does the Times loss of over a billion dollars on its Boston Globe investment make it incompetent to report on business matters?
5
RE: "incompetent to report on business matters?"
If the business reporters were the ones involved in the business dealings of the Times.
If the business reporters were the ones involved in the business dealings of the Times.
No wonder Trump has to be audited every year and he whines about it. Well, taxpayers and the IRS want to audit not just his taxes, but also his books. You can dodge taxes if one can boost up your losses by increasing your expenses and lowering your revenues. It is obvious that Trump hasn't paid taxes year after year as he boasts to everyone how rich and smart he is. Tax evasion can send him to jail so getting into the White House may buy him some times. He is not running for the working families. He is running for himself.
52
If Chris "Bridge Shutting" Christie and Rudolph "Stop and Frisk" Guliani think that the exposed Tax returns only show Trump to be a genius then how come Trump won't disclose all his tax returns? He will then be considered a super-genius and voted right into the white house. We can then all stop paying our taxes, because we are all geniuses!! Now wouldn't that be a "huuggeee" genius idea!!
76
Mr. Trump's tax return shows, not Mr. Trump's badness, but the perversion of the U.S. Tax Code and the lobbying that has made it the product of Congress' venality, as suborned by the wealthy and powerful and of which both Hillary and Bill Clinton have been principal venal agents. One of my law professor's teacher had been the Tax Reporter for the United States. She told our class the story of Wilbur Mills, which she had from her teacher.
My teacher spoke of a time, during the reign of Wilbur Mills, when the U.S. Tax Code consisted of one volume, made economic and business sense, and could be mastered by a single scholar. Wilbur Mills (look him up) keep the Tax Code rational and simple, but then Chairman Mills got caught in a fountain with a stripper, Fanny Fox. He fell from power, and those who replaced him so corrupted the Tax Code that it became the instrument of for maintaining and enhancing the wealth and power of the wealthy and powerful, who worked through their agents in congressional and executive branches of our government. Over the years, there have been many venal agents of government, who have perverted the Tax Code for the benefit of the elite of wealth and power, but none more so than Bill and Hillary Clinton, which is why, prior to this campaign season, Trump, as a Democrat, along with may others, had lavishly contributed to both Clintons' campaigns.
So Trump benefits from our corrupted Tax Code, which the Clintons have done as much as anyone to corrupt.
My teacher spoke of a time, during the reign of Wilbur Mills, when the U.S. Tax Code consisted of one volume, made economic and business sense, and could be mastered by a single scholar. Wilbur Mills (look him up) keep the Tax Code rational and simple, but then Chairman Mills got caught in a fountain with a stripper, Fanny Fox. He fell from power, and those who replaced him so corrupted the Tax Code that it became the instrument of for maintaining and enhancing the wealth and power of the wealthy and powerful, who worked through their agents in congressional and executive branches of our government. Over the years, there have been many venal agents of government, who have perverted the Tax Code for the benefit of the elite of wealth and power, but none more so than Bill and Hillary Clinton, which is why, prior to this campaign season, Trump, as a Democrat, along with may others, had lavishly contributed to both Clintons' campaigns.
So Trump benefits from our corrupted Tax Code, which the Clintons have done as much as anyone to corrupt.
12
Amen
Which is worse...a billion dollar guitar player paying 1/10 of his taxes due when caught..or someone who legally files and uses deductions every year...
Which is worse...a billion dollar guitar player paying 1/10 of his taxes due when caught..or someone who legally files and uses deductions every year...
I hear what you saying and let's say I believe you, and what you say is true. Question - Of the two presidential candidates who would you say paid their fair share of taxes based on the info we have?
Reagan and Bush did far more than any Democrat to pervert the Tax Code in favor of the wealthy. We're still paying for that. Well, most of us anyway.
The power brokers in the banking business the Clintons have cozied up to probably cost the American taxpayers far more than Trump could ever have to pay even without the tax breaks.
Why is the DOJ brokering a deal with Deutche Bankto pay only a fraction of the $14 billion the DOJ was seeking for Deutche's role in the Mortgage Housing crisis?
The Clinton's earned over $500,000 from speeches the made at Deutche Bank in 2014
http://www.politico.com/story/2015/05/bill-and-hillary-clinton-made-roug...
Why is the DOJ brokering a deal with Deutche Bankto pay only a fraction of the $14 billion the DOJ was seeking for Deutche's role in the Mortgage Housing crisis?
The Clinton's earned over $500,000 from speeches the made at Deutche Bank in 2014
http://www.politico.com/story/2015/05/bill-and-hillary-clinton-made-roug...
8
Why did Trump only have to pay $5 million of the $30 million he owed NJ? Because Christie let him off the hook. HRC received speaking fees just as other successful speakers have and she paid tax on every dime. So your problem is ...?
2
Now we have this non-surprise in addition to unsupported insinuations that Hillary Clinton was unfaithful to her husband. Could Donald Trump and his minions, including Guiliani, possibly run a nastier campaign? We will probably find out before November 8.
This is beyond sickening.
This is beyond sickening.
42
What's sickening is a woman throwing around mail & tv ads about the message being sent to our daughter's about how Trump has treated women and yet is still standing by a man who was one of the greatest womanizers in history. What message does that send our daughter's?
Trump's almost $ 1 billion loss confirms that he is a LOSER writ large.
51
Lol..you think million dollar sports player don't write off all of their donations to the NAACP and business expenses for their specials sneaker sales?
Trump says he doesn't pay income taxes because he is "smart." I guess that means the people who support who pay income taxes are stupid.
Hillary says the are deplorable and Trump says they are stupid. That is quite a group supporting Trump.
Hillary says the are deplorable and Trump says they are stupid. That is quite a group supporting Trump.
41
Of all the attacks made on Trump by the NYTimes, this is the most ludicrous. The wordsmithing and phrasing used in this article to justify the pure hatred the Times has for Trump goes into LaLa Land... Trump shows a loss and then is able to carry it forward against future profit!! Horrors!!! How could he???!!!!
You paint this picture of a tax cheat because he has a loss. Shame on you. What is he supposed to do? What is any of us supposed to do? Suffer the loss, get in the hole, and then pay taxes the next year on profit without acknowledging the previous year's loss. This is the least rigged part of the system - you pay taxes on income, you deduct costs, expenses, and losses.
Your desperation to "get Trump" is beyond bizarre.
You paint this picture of a tax cheat because he has a loss. Shame on you. What is he supposed to do? What is any of us supposed to do? Suffer the loss, get in the hole, and then pay taxes the next year on profit without acknowledging the previous year's loss. This is the least rigged part of the system - you pay taxes on income, you deduct costs, expenses, and losses.
Your desperation to "get Trump" is beyond bizarre.
17
Your extreme reactions aren't warranted. The author stated several times that there does not seem to be tax fraud.
My take home from the article...Trump did not win, he lost and lost big. He failed, at least on paper. I will assume that this year was no different than others; his entire business career seems to be built through abuse of others. His bankruptcies hurt his investors, banks, taxpayers, small contractors, yet he always enriched himself.
Regarding the Times itself, I can't blame them for trying their utmost to bring to light the character of this con man. Unfortunately, as the con man himself said, "I could shoot someone in the middle of 5th avenue and not lose any voters"
My take home from the article...Trump did not win, he lost and lost big. He failed, at least on paper. I will assume that this year was no different than others; his entire business career seems to be built through abuse of others. His bankruptcies hurt his investors, banks, taxpayers, small contractors, yet he always enriched himself.
Regarding the Times itself, I can't blame them for trying their utmost to bring to light the character of this con man. Unfortunately, as the con man himself said, "I could shoot someone in the middle of 5th avenue and not lose any voters"
74
Umm, let's see... According to the first line the article "Donald J. Trump declared a $916 million loss on his 1995 income tax returns, a tax deduction so substantial it could have allowed him to legally avoid paying any federal income taxes for up to 18 years, records obtained by The New York Times show."
The line itself leads one to assume that Trump may have avoided paying taxes for "up to" 18 years... It's a Newspeak article published in a Newspeak paper. It's an utterly dishonest way to present the story.
The line itself leads one to assume that Trump may have avoided paying taxes for "up to" 18 years... It's a Newspeak article published in a Newspeak paper. It's an utterly dishonest way to present the story.
1
And you really believe that the NY Times published this out of the goodness of their heart... without trying to hurt Trump's case for the President. I'm NOT for Trump... but know too many who have known the Clintons for too many years... from AR, to the WH, and on to NY. I think even the staunchest Democrat would have second thoughts if they knew ALL of the stuff they've done over the years.
It's a SHAME that it's come down to these two for President!!!
It's a SHAME that it's come down to these two for President!!!
Trump lost about 6 million in 1995, not counting the 909 million on line 21. That amount, most likely, is an unused loss carried from another year; it is impossible to say what year. Speculatively, that loss was larger and a portion thereof had offset income in years other than 1995. Also, it is likely that much more than half the loss was cash because the size of real estate depreciation was significantly rolled back in 1986. I'd guess that the cash potion of the loss was 700 thousand, an amount that no one would purposefully incur merely to save taxes. The NOL carry rules have been around for decades. As a CPA, I have used them on clients' behalf many times to mitigate the effect of a large economic loss.
The real focus here is not that Trump. (legally and morally) paid no taxes having incurred the loss; rather, it is that he DID lose that much money.
So, his business acumen is not so sharp nor is he "smart" to have reduced his taxes by losing all that money. He is still out the difference--say, half a billion-- between the loss and the tax recovered so there is no genius here. (Besides, the tax advisors are the ones who reduced his taxes and are assuredly far smarter than Trump.)
The real focus here is not that Trump. (legally and morally) paid no taxes having incurred the loss; rather, it is that he DID lose that much money.
So, his business acumen is not so sharp nor is he "smart" to have reduced his taxes by losing all that money. He is still out the difference--say, half a billion-- between the loss and the tax recovered so there is no genius here. (Besides, the tax advisors are the ones who reduced his taxes and are assuredly far smarter than Trump.)
52
My comment should say the estimated cash loss was 700 million, not 700 thousand.
Donald Trump is simply doing what others in his position are able to do thanks to a corrupt and broken tax system whose philosophy can be summarized as "Government of the wealthy, by the wealthy, and for the wealthy."
15
And that will NOT change one iota under Clinton.
True, but the amazing thing is despite this guy long well documented deplorable past. People actually think he is the guy that will champion working class despite his history of hurt he has caused to the same working class with his numerous bankruptcies, and that's just to start. I hope you ain't one of them
Skinflint.
22
A common sentiment here is Donald Trump is a terrible, even unintelligent, businessman because he declared almost a $1 billion loss and declared bankruptcy six times. But we are missing the larger, vital picture. And it's frightening.
It appears success in American business has nothing to do with how much real, tangible profit, i.e., cash on hand one has or what your margins are. Rather, success is 1) building it and 2) keeping it afloat, by any means necessary.
Hence, the enormous ego and pride of Trump and his business ilk: "Of course I deserve these loopholes! Look at all the jobs I provide! All the revenue I generate for this state! The taxpayer base I created and the jobs for the commoners. And don't forget my campaign contributions to you elected officials. If it wasn't for me, this place would be nothing!"
Anyone who declares a bankruptcy six times and a billion dollar loss to the IRS and gets creditors to forgive millions in debt and is still presiding over his kingdom---however insane and despicable others find it---AND becomes the Republican presidential nominee is doing something "right". THAT'S the scandal.
It appears success in American business has nothing to do with how much real, tangible profit, i.e., cash on hand one has or what your margins are. Rather, success is 1) building it and 2) keeping it afloat, by any means necessary.
Hence, the enormous ego and pride of Trump and his business ilk: "Of course I deserve these loopholes! Look at all the jobs I provide! All the revenue I generate for this state! The taxpayer base I created and the jobs for the commoners. And don't forget my campaign contributions to you elected officials. If it wasn't for me, this place would be nothing!"
Anyone who declares a bankruptcy six times and a billion dollar loss to the IRS and gets creditors to forgive millions in debt and is still presiding over his kingdom---however insane and despicable others find it---AND becomes the Republican presidential nominee is doing something "right". THAT'S the scandal.
58
Well said. Need some common sense in the country. Run for president.
Lost in all this speculation about Trump's tax losses is the issue of real estate depreciation. Trump, like all commercial real estate owners, is entitled to write off a portion of the cost of the properties he owns each year. The rationale appears to be that the properties are wasting away - - - "depreciating" - - - every year. To compensate, the owners get to deduct an arbitrary percentage of their cost or other basis each year from their other income. Sounds fair, but commercial real estate mostly appreciates, not depreciates. So the depreciation deduction is just a tax benefit to a favored class of taxpayers. Real estate depreciation is sometimes called a "mythological expense". It is not insignificant - - - I know commercial real estate operators who have shown losses each year for decades, mostly due to deprecation. When they do dispose of a property, they can with certain limitations trade it for another property without paying taxes on the gain. So even without the carry forward from those disastrous years, Trump may owe little or no taxes on his current income.
21
How many workers lost their work? when Donald Trump declares is bankrupt To obtain a tax benefit.
31
Trump's massive losses came about because Trump is a terrible businessman. He failed miserably because he invested in casinos when he did not know a darn thing about how to run them, this according to many who advised him at the time. The word was out that Trump doesn't know what he's doing. When Trump's gambling empire collapsed he had a way out. Not so with others who were affected; business partners, contractors, employees were not so lucky when Trump declared bankruptcy. The legal loopholes Trump used were not available to them. Tough luck, wot?
The only thing more outlandish in today's news cycle is listening to Trump lackeys Giuliani and Christie attempting to spin we hicks and rubes the notion that Trump's tax-evasion plan is pure "genius", something Trump, if he becomes president, would bring to this nation's financial institutions.
Can you just imagine? As former Mayor Michael Bloomberg stated at the DNC convention, "Trump says he'll run the country like he runs his businesses. God help us."
DD
Manhattan
The only thing more outlandish in today's news cycle is listening to Trump lackeys Giuliani and Christie attempting to spin we hicks and rubes the notion that Trump's tax-evasion plan is pure "genius", something Trump, if he becomes president, would bring to this nation's financial institutions.
Can you just imagine? As former Mayor Michael Bloomberg stated at the DNC convention, "Trump says he'll run the country like he runs his businesses. God help us."
DD
Manhattan
72
What a strange and despicable comment. He is LITERALLY a billionaire and did nothing wrong here.
Dear sad:
Obviously you are unaware of The Donald's business record here in NYC. Most reputable real NY estate moguls, of which Trump does not even register in the Top 10, will not do business with him because of his nefarious practices.
Do you think former Mayor Bloomberg was lying when he cited Trump as one of the worse businessmen he's ever dealt with? Bloomberg really is a billionaire, one of the wealthiest men in Manhattan, who has contributed enormous sums to the City's art institutions and charities. Unlike Trump, Bloomberg really is worth what his taxes say he is, without the bankruptcies, without reneging on deals, refusing payment to people who already did the work, like Trump, who has left workers dangling on a string. The year Trump claimed his "massive" loss the folks who suffered did not include him. They were all the people involved in his AC holdings who were left holding the bag when it came to getting paid.
Those are facts, though you call them "despicable" they are the truth. They can be ascertained by reserching Archives of this paper's Financial Section and the Wall Street Journal.
Unless you also think they are in cahoots with the Clintons to discredit Trump? If you believe that then truly all hope is lost trying to convince you the charlatan Trump is. Your allegiance is blind and thus you will cling to the belief that everything printed about Trump is a lie. So be it.
We in NY know the truth. Trump will lose NY in a landslide.
DD
Manhattan
Obviously you are unaware of The Donald's business record here in NYC. Most reputable real NY estate moguls, of which Trump does not even register in the Top 10, will not do business with him because of his nefarious practices.
Do you think former Mayor Bloomberg was lying when he cited Trump as one of the worse businessmen he's ever dealt with? Bloomberg really is a billionaire, one of the wealthiest men in Manhattan, who has contributed enormous sums to the City's art institutions and charities. Unlike Trump, Bloomberg really is worth what his taxes say he is, without the bankruptcies, without reneging on deals, refusing payment to people who already did the work, like Trump, who has left workers dangling on a string. The year Trump claimed his "massive" loss the folks who suffered did not include him. They were all the people involved in his AC holdings who were left holding the bag when it came to getting paid.
Those are facts, though you call them "despicable" they are the truth. They can be ascertained by reserching Archives of this paper's Financial Section and the Wall Street Journal.
Unless you also think they are in cahoots with the Clintons to discredit Trump? If you believe that then truly all hope is lost trying to convince you the charlatan Trump is. Your allegiance is blind and thus you will cling to the belief that everything printed about Trump is a lie. So be it.
We in NY know the truth. Trump will lose NY in a landslide.
DD
Manhattan
3
And terrible businessman as he is, he's currently ruining the Trump Brand! His followers can't afford his hotels or restaurants or golf courses. And abroad he's gained so much notoriety that his properties will drop that Trump name as soon as they can.
We mustn't allow him anywhere near the Treasury that he refuses to fund. As he's just the person to rob and bleed it for his own aggrandizement, not ours.
What an idiot!
We mustn't allow him anywhere near the Treasury that he refuses to fund. As he's just the person to rob and bleed it for his own aggrandizement, not ours.
What an idiot!
In 1995 a single individual lost almost ONE BILLION DOLLARS, like that. And everything is fine. In 2001, just a few years later, Enron lost half that amount, $586 Million to be precise, and all hell broke loose. Miracles anyone?
32
"Enron lost half that amount, $586 Million to be precise, and all hell broke loose."
Enron executives committed CRIMES.
Enron Chiefs Guilty of Fraud and Conspiracy
By ALEXEI BARRIONUEVO
MAY 25, 2006
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/05/25/business/25cnd-enron.html
Enron executives committed CRIMES.
Enron Chiefs Guilty of Fraud and Conspiracy
By ALEXEI BARRIONUEVO
MAY 25, 2006
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/05/25/business/25cnd-enron.html
I find it interesting that there are so many people on here who can't wait to come to the defense of an unapologetic racist.
I also find it thoroughly disgusting, as ethically you can't get any lower than Trump.
All I can guess is that his apologists are as unapologetically racist as he is. Who knew there were so many virulent racists reading and commenting on the New York Times?
I guess he just brings them out of their sewers.
I also find it thoroughly disgusting, as ethically you can't get any lower than Trump.
All I can guess is that his apologists are as unapologetically racist as he is. Who knew there were so many virulent racists reading and commenting on the New York Times?
I guess he just brings them out of their sewers.
44
Is this some sort of joke? Racist? That is libel at best. I lived in NYC in the 90s. Many people hated Trump for many reasons . . . and not a single person ever said it was because he is "racist". I sense a lot of fear Trump may actually win, which is a very well founded
1
Please quote - exact words and citation, please - one racist statement Donald Trump has made. The allegation he is racist is tossed around 24/7, but I've yet to read an actual quote, with citations.
I have, however, read Hillary Clinton's various racist comments over the years, including the 1996 speech in which she referred to young black men as 'super predators'.
The NYT's rabid attempts to destroy Trump are only proving his point about the corrupt and biased media. For my part, I encourage all NYT readers to think for themselves and research the truth.
I have, however, read Hillary Clinton's various racist comments over the years, including the 1996 speech in which she referred to young black men as 'super predators'.
The NYT's rabid attempts to destroy Trump are only proving his point about the corrupt and biased media. For my part, I encourage all NYT readers to think for themselves and research the truth.
Let's hope he doesn't blame this story on a 400-lb hacker.
37
Meanwhile if you hypothetically lost $916 million in the stock market you could only claim a loss of $3000 per year on your income taxes. The good news is that you would be able to do this for 300,000 years.
20
this is completely wrong
2
Given trumps using Foundation $$ illegally, I suggest NYT investigates if he is even filing the taxes correctly. And how he "lost" so much money on a casino. Where is the money? His must be the only casino ever that has gone bankrupt. Very fishy. The only thing smart about him is that he has not gotten caught yet. He knew no one would do the hard work of finding his criminal behavior. The rich get away with it. The rest of us don't get away with anything.
28
All of the other commenters calling the NYT out as a hypocrite for not paying taxes should read the article again. Nowhere in the article does it say what Trump did is illegal.
Turns out this is a lot like Clinton's emails. No law has been broken but hopefully a whole bunch of people will make the mistake of thinking there was and so decide that the "perpetrator" is a criminal.
Turns out this is a lot like Clinton's emails. No law has been broken but hopefully a whole bunch of people will make the mistake of thinking there was and so decide that the "perpetrator" is a criminal.
4
If it is not illegal then the article is irrelevant
The story suggests mainly that he is unfit to be president. He is neither a good businessman nor a patriotic American, and he doesn't have the moral fiber to be president. Much as many might enjoy it, the article is not suggesting he go to prison for the tax, er, loopholes.
NY Times you are biased for showing that trump is a moocher of the highest level - lets call him moochie.
15
The art of the STEAL. Thief. This sort of low lack of ethics from an insider to corruption, political and ethical, would lead to the collapse of America. This tax cheat costs us all. First Responders, the aged, poor children, infrastructure, all deprived for Trump's lethal greed.
20
Smart successful businessmen don't rack up $916 million in losses - they make profits. Trump's shortcomings as a businessman are compounded by the fact that he received $885 million in government subsidies. So he stiffed the taxpayer twice, once by receiving about $900 million in "corporate welfare" and then, despite the subsidies, being able to write off losses in about the same amount on his taxes. That's over $1.8 billion at the public trough.
I look forward to further revelations of how this self-described genius mismanaged his businesses resulting in these losses,
I look forward to further revelations of how this self-described genius mismanaged his businesses resulting in these losses,
72
7,000 comments is a lot to get through. I'm assuming someone in here has already said that this is actually good PR to attract voters from the 1%. I imagine raising this issue with my 1% inlaws and them responding not with indignation but with agreement that it was smart. These are inlaws, by the way, who regularly complained about paying more in taxes than I made in a year.
16
More on Trump Lawyer Jack Mitnick, mentioned in this article, available here: http://lawyerofnewyork.com/new-york-lawyers/jack-mitnick
2
So what's the outrage here?
That the Dems didn't fixed the tax code, even though they controlled the WH for the last 8 years, which included veto-proof majorities in both houses of Congress?
Or that Trump didn't pay more than he owed?
That the Dems didn't fixed the tax code, even though they controlled the WH for the last 8 years, which included veto-proof majorities in both houses of Congress?
Or that Trump didn't pay more than he owed?
11
No, they never had a veto-proof majority.
They had a filibuster-proof majority for 5 months in 2009, between the seating of Al Franken and the illness and death of Kennedy.
They haven't had a majority for quite some time in the House.
They had a filibuster-proof majority for 5 months in 2009, between the seating of Al Franken and the illness and death of Kennedy.
They haven't had a majority for quite some time in the House.
21
The white house does NOT write tax law - Congress does.
19
The Clinton's took a $730K dollar tax loss in 2008. They have been carrying it forward to offset capital gains ever since. Check the Schedule D on the published taxes. It's the same thing. Just like folks who lost money on their houses, or on stocks certainly wrote off those losses, and should have. It's not genius, and it's not a loophole for the wealthy. Everyone who has a capital loss uses it, and should. This is good tax policy.
But, whereas Trump's investments in creating or renovating buildings create jobs for construction workers, food companies, and many others as well as generating taxes from those folks and real estate taxes and all kinds of economic activity up until they fail. But the speeches that Hillary gives to the banks for $200,000 plus dollars that supposedly don't influence her, don't create any jobs. That's over $100 million dollars in income from the banks she so disparages. I guess the just really, really, like her, huh?
But, whereas Trump's investments in creating or renovating buildings create jobs for construction workers, food companies, and many others as well as generating taxes from those folks and real estate taxes and all kinds of economic activity up until they fail. But the speeches that Hillary gives to the banks for $200,000 plus dollars that supposedly don't influence her, don't create any jobs. That's over $100 million dollars in income from the banks she so disparages. I guess the just really, really, like her, huh?
16
You're comparing carrying forward 730k to carrying forward 915 million lol. Trump fans are delusional lol
6
Hey NYT, you should give equal time to writing about the $730K Capital Gains loss on the Clinton's 2008 tax return, which reduced their tax rate in subsequent years! Why no coverage of this?
5
Clinton paid a hell of a lot of taxes on her speeches. Look at her returns.
26
A draft dodger, a tax dodger, and a truth dodger. Welcome to the Trump Trifecta.
52
The exact same could be said of Bill Clinton...and so much more.
1
Bill is not in Trump's league - beside I won't see his name on the ballot.
This issue may well have been raised, but if Trump's refusal to release his tax returns is based on a supposed IRS audit of his federal returns, perhaps he should be asked to release his NY State and NY City income tax returns.
23
The real story isn't just the taxes. It's that this alleged business "genius" running for president on his strength as an allegedly super-savvy businessman, ran a string of businesses into the ground to the tune of a billion dollars, and walked away unscathed, paying no taxes for years as a result--thereby benefiting from this fiasco. Meanwhile thousands of employees lost their jobs due to this "genius" and hundreds of small businesses were stiffed by this "genius." And working people are looking to this con artist as someone on their side? Now that's a con.
52
Trump is an example of a rich man with sophisticated advisors that help him avoid taxes. On the flip side are people like my father, a blue collar worker with a job that involves travel. Determining deductions when a person is "away from home" is a real grey area in tax law. My father trusted the Jackson Hewlett expert who prepared his taxes and said he could claim all of these deductions. The IRS disagreed. No tax lawyer wanted to take the case because it wasn't big enough. Jackson Hewlitt didn't want to help because the tax preparer was no longer with the company. Fortunately, I'm also a lawyer (although taxes are not my area of expertise). I presented the IRS with the case law that said my father's taxes were correct, and the IRS agreed (yay!). But, here's the thing. If my blue collar father didn't happen to have a lawyer in the family who could do this work pro bono, he would have been stuck with a $40,000 tax bill. So, bottom line: if you're rich, you pay nothing even when you should owe something, and if you're poor, you pay a lot, even when you actually owe nothing. That's the system folks.
43
This is the man that America wants? A man who doesn't pay taxes? If he doesn't have good experiences in his own business, how would be a presidency in his hands? It showed us, he is unfit to be president of our country and even, Guiliani and other supporting him saying, he his a "genius", all of them are like him "men who don't pay taxes".
20
The reported $916 million loss was just for the 1995 tax year - he may have been doing the same thing in earlier years or subsequent years. In fact, DJT may still have a huge tax loss carry-forward available to shelter his income for years to come.
A key issue is what generated the tax loss carry-forward? Was it typical real estate developer deductions? (Doubtful because hard to see how that would have gotten to $916 million) Was it losses on investments he made that lost value? (Doubtful because he didn't have that much money to invest at that time and his MO all along has been to use other people's money, for instance from banks and bond holders, as he has proudly stated on the campaign trail), Did a hired gun put a high valuation on some asset he lost so he could take a large write off? (Possible) Did he somehow claim losses incurred by his lenders or bond holders as his own? (Possible)
DJT (or surrogate Rudy), please explain to the American people how you legitimately came upon a $916 million tax loss carry forward, and what additional tax loss carry-forwards you were able to obtain in other years.
And please spare us the comments of your surrogates and family members that the American people will be distracted or will not understand your tax situation - they are beyond condescending.
A key issue is what generated the tax loss carry-forward? Was it typical real estate developer deductions? (Doubtful because hard to see how that would have gotten to $916 million) Was it losses on investments he made that lost value? (Doubtful because he didn't have that much money to invest at that time and his MO all along has been to use other people's money, for instance from banks and bond holders, as he has proudly stated on the campaign trail), Did a hired gun put a high valuation on some asset he lost so he could take a large write off? (Possible) Did he somehow claim losses incurred by his lenders or bond holders as his own? (Possible)
DJT (or surrogate Rudy), please explain to the American people how you legitimately came upon a $916 million tax loss carry forward, and what additional tax loss carry-forwards you were able to obtain in other years.
And please spare us the comments of your surrogates and family members that the American people will be distracted or will not understand your tax situation - they are beyond condescending.
30
Perhaps Mrs Cinton should promise now to propose amendments to the Internal Revenue Code excising all its provisions that empowered Trump's incredible deduction of his past losses in the computation of his taxable income in his future returns.
4
ok, we understand $915 million part, but how did they come up with the $723? :)
Everyone who reads this should volunteer for the Hillary campaign to keep Trump out of the White House! Please make calls to swing states through the campaign website....all you need is an Internet connection and phone...there is a script...I made 50 calls the other day. Or go to volunteer in a swing state if you have the time and the means....I have been canvassing in New Hampshire on weekends. The ground game is how elections are won. Also, try to convince friends and family that a vote for third party is a vote for Trump. It will be extremely close and we cannot be complacent!
22
Actually this article has caused me to come off the sidelines . . . and vote for Trump . . . and I am residing in a swing State
We have known he is a tax dodger and he gets away with to while we pay up the nose of taxes every year since he is a "tax avoider" they ought to put him in jail for tax avoidance as they do with many other taxpayers. Anyone who thinks Trumpster is a great businessman ought to have their heads examined we are the dumbest to think he is paying his fair share which he isn't that is why he will not show his other returns. Shame on Trumpster!!
8
Trump not paying taxes on losses is not a "loophole." It reflects the simple fact that "income taxes" are payable when you have "income," not when you have "losses."
There certainly are many "loopholes," though. The "carried interest" low-rate preference has garnered considerable attention, though I doubt much will be done about it. For those not familiar with it, "partners" in a partnership (or an LLC taxed as a partnership, as most are), are "allocated" income or gains from the entity either for contributing capital or, in the case of managers (notably, of hedge funds or VC funds or other private equity funds), for managing the entity. While some might consider what those managers do to be providing "services" (because that is exactly what they provide), which should fairly be taxable at higher "ordinary income" rates like other "service" income (e.g. salary), that income instead is "passed through" from the partnership to those individuals with whatever characterization it had at the partnership level. If it was "ordinary income" at the partnership level, that's what it also will be once it's been passed through. But -- here's the good part -- most income "passed through" by partnerships to their owners (including service-providing managers) is NOT "ordinary income." It's "capital gain," and if the asset that generated that gain has been held 12 months or more, it's LONG-TERM capital gain, which is taxed at a much lower rate.
That's how fund managers get wealthy.
There certainly are many "loopholes," though. The "carried interest" low-rate preference has garnered considerable attention, though I doubt much will be done about it. For those not familiar with it, "partners" in a partnership (or an LLC taxed as a partnership, as most are), are "allocated" income or gains from the entity either for contributing capital or, in the case of managers (notably, of hedge funds or VC funds or other private equity funds), for managing the entity. While some might consider what those managers do to be providing "services" (because that is exactly what they provide), which should fairly be taxable at higher "ordinary income" rates like other "service" income (e.g. salary), that income instead is "passed through" from the partnership to those individuals with whatever characterization it had at the partnership level. If it was "ordinary income" at the partnership level, that's what it also will be once it's been passed through. But -- here's the good part -- most income "passed through" by partnerships to their owners (including service-providing managers) is NOT "ordinary income." It's "capital gain," and if the asset that generated that gain has been held 12 months or more, it's LONG-TERM capital gain, which is taxed at a much lower rate.
That's how fund managers get wealthy.
14
Just proves he is a big part of the problem and not the solution
23
The tip of the iceberg is tax avoidance. Beneath the water other illegalities and/or immoralities could exist: fraudulent default of bank loans, siphoning off to tax heavens of funds acquired in a less than licit manner, ulterior laundering of those funds via the construction of vacation resorts in foreign lands and the repatriation of inflated profits that do not really exist, "double dipping" by using previous fraudulent tax losses to offset subsequent years taxable gains and therefore pay no tax when was actually a taxable income. And many more variations of these criminal and immoral practices very frequently utilized by individuals that normally operate as sole owner or as heads of tightly closed family interests.
14
"Beneath the water other illegalities and/or immoralities could exist:"
True... he could have shot JFK, MLK, JR on Dallas and so many other things... while you're guessing, I'm going to propose that you could have done the same things... IF you're old enough.
True... he could have shot JFK, MLK, JR on Dallas and so many other things... while you're guessing, I'm going to propose that you could have done the same things... IF you're old enough.
Some people are fixated on Trump losing 900 million. For most people, if that happened, they'd fold completely, have a nervous breakdown, or never try anything again.
What did Trump do?
He made it back. He turned around a failure. He became successful all over again. That's where the story is.
Truman went bankrupt before he became president. So? He had what they call "leadership", a foreign concept to Obama supporters.
It's easy to gloat when you've taken no risk. When you take a risk and fail, people are lined up to tell you you're inferior. When you take a risk and succeed, many people are envious. When you fail and come back again, that's downright impressive.
Hillary hasn't hired anyone but attorneys to keep her sorry tush out of jail. We've already seen she can't run the State Department without one disaster after another. If she opened more than 500 companies, how many would still be solvent? Give me a break.
What did Trump do?
He made it back. He turned around a failure. He became successful all over again. That's where the story is.
Truman went bankrupt before he became president. So? He had what they call "leadership", a foreign concept to Obama supporters.
It's easy to gloat when you've taken no risk. When you take a risk and fail, people are lined up to tell you you're inferior. When you take a risk and succeed, many people are envious. When you fail and come back again, that's downright impressive.
Hillary hasn't hired anyone but attorneys to keep her sorry tush out of jail. We've already seen she can't run the State Department without one disaster after another. If she opened more than 500 companies, how many would still be solvent? Give me a break.
15
Ever hear Trump give a talk? He says he tries to risk only "OPM" -- that stands for "other people's money." He risked NOTHING. Other people lost their shirts trusting him, but he walked away from them with jingling pockets.
I've owned a small business. I paid all my creditors, suppliers and employees what I owed them. I put my own money into the business. I never cheated a customer. I was never sued. Any profit I made was earned from my own work, my own money, my own risk.
Trump is a cheat and a fraud. He deceived and cheated his banks, his partners, his investors, his vendors, his customers, and his employees. When they sued over it, he hired a team of lawyers they couldn't afford to fight. He mismanaged and cannibalized his own companies.
Trump "came back" only because his bankers were in too deep to cast him loose. That's why he's in debt to the Russians now. No bank in this country will extend him credit. They, at least, have learned the difference between a businessman and a con artist. You, apparently, haven't.
I've owned a small business. I paid all my creditors, suppliers and employees what I owed them. I put my own money into the business. I never cheated a customer. I was never sued. Any profit I made was earned from my own work, my own money, my own risk.
Trump is a cheat and a fraud. He deceived and cheated his banks, his partners, his investors, his vendors, his customers, and his employees. When they sued over it, he hired a team of lawyers they couldn't afford to fight. He mismanaged and cannibalized his own companies.
Trump "came back" only because his bankers were in too deep to cast him loose. That's why he's in debt to the Russians now. No bank in this country will extend him credit. They, at least, have learned the difference between a businessman and a con artist. You, apparently, haven't.
32
Where did Trump turn any failure around or risk anything? The Trump Taj Mahal went through bankruptcy to reduce its debt and it still folded this past August. It's locked up and empty and didn't even out last Blockbuster Video. Carryforward losses and real estate depreciation are a paper mitigation of risk that turns the theory of moral hazard upside down and rallies the investment of other people's and banks' money willynilly on highly speculative and unsustainable ventures without a fiduciary care in the world for the destruction of capital that could have been allocated to a greater good.
2
Trump is no Truman, never has been, never will be.
As a former President said about his opponent, "If you've got the guts, you know he's nuts."
5
That $1 billion loss was declared in 1995 and that Trump could legally skip federal income taxes for 18 years. Well, 18 years from 1995 is 2014 or 2015 tax year. That's past, folks. Watta good old sweet deal, yeah?
Fast forward, let's say his losses may not as big as that of 1995. So, he wants to change the tax system to cut more taxes that will directly benefit him. Thus, enjoying the same benefit in 1995 with lower losses or even more benefit with higher losses. Win-win right? Brilliant! And he wants the American people to help him realize that. Suckers!
When he say "Make America great again", he didn't mean the country, he meant "am", himself! He declared his net worth is $10 billion. Well, that is his target, not $1 billion. And 18 years? That's too short. How about his kids? How about even after his death with the inheritance tax?
Genius indeed! And what are we when that happens? Dummy.
Fast forward, let's say his losses may not as big as that of 1995. So, he wants to change the tax system to cut more taxes that will directly benefit him. Thus, enjoying the same benefit in 1995 with lower losses or even more benefit with higher losses. Win-win right? Brilliant! And he wants the American people to help him realize that. Suckers!
When he say "Make America great again", he didn't mean the country, he meant "am", himself! He declared his net worth is $10 billion. Well, that is his target, not $1 billion. And 18 years? That's too short. How about his kids? How about even after his death with the inheritance tax?
Genius indeed! And what are we when that happens? Dummy.
13
NY Times; Wait a minute here! 2 Oct. 2016
1. "Could" word in the Headline here should have been made crystal- clear w/by using instead a word such as "MIGHT" Your Editors (who do the Headlines, right? should have called upon a more Precision-type vocabulary, instead of carelessly using that (totally? fuzzy) term; "Could."
Right? It's a big difference; fix this misleading Headline word!
2. And oh yes...Re the ongoing GOP's 2016 Nominee's Selling-out our US to the Russian Neo-Imperial 'President for Life'; Might-not the NY Times do at least a magazine article/issue re this whole financial-history Subject? Do try & come up to Par w/ Newsweek's Trump's world-finance two scoops?!
3. David Cay Johnson's book: "The Making of Donald Trump" biography seems a clear & distinct docket of so many criminal charges.
4. The whole psycho 'Heart of Stone' story in that biography is also astounding!
5.Dear Public Editor--please come to our 'Emotional Rescue' here before the Election, just 4 weeks away.
-- Serene but also still Yours truly,
-- HBfE,
1. "Could" word in the Headline here should have been made crystal- clear w/by using instead a word such as "MIGHT" Your Editors (who do the Headlines, right? should have called upon a more Precision-type vocabulary, instead of carelessly using that (totally? fuzzy) term; "Could."
Right? It's a big difference; fix this misleading Headline word!
2. And oh yes...Re the ongoing GOP's 2016 Nominee's Selling-out our US to the Russian Neo-Imperial 'President for Life'; Might-not the NY Times do at least a magazine article/issue re this whole financial-history Subject? Do try & come up to Par w/ Newsweek's Trump's world-finance two scoops?!
3. David Cay Johnson's book: "The Making of Donald Trump" biography seems a clear & distinct docket of so many criminal charges.
4. The whole psycho 'Heart of Stone' story in that biography is also astounding!
5.Dear Public Editor--please come to our 'Emotional Rescue' here before the Election, just 4 weeks away.
-- Serene but also still Yours truly,
-- HBfE,
1
I guess he shares Leona Helmsley's view that only little people pay taxes. If this is legal, surely his use of charitable foundation funds personally for portraits of himself and payment of court mandated penalties are illegal. Maybe his crowds are shouting for the wrong candidate to be locked up.
21
Do you think I could have the name of his accountant? We had $27,000 in taxable income and our bill is about $4,000, but we had to put a new roof on the house and that cost $15,000, so I don't know where the $4,000 is gonna come from. So I could really use some of Trump's tax expertise right about now. Please? We are totally stressed out.
24
I know this is a very confusing subject for people to take on without putting time into the details. First, let me say that I think Donald Trump is totally unqualified to be a President, Senator, or even a Congressman. However, if he actually had a $900 M loss, all he is doing by carrying the NOL forward is offsetting the loss against an equivalent amount of income that would result in a tax liabillity in later years. I saw a column today from a "tax lawyer" who said that he was clever because he used "other peoples money" (banks, I suppose). But, if he did, he would still owe the banks the money. If the banks forgave the loans or if the loans were discharged for some other reason, the discharge of indebtedness would be taxable income offsetting his NOL.
In brief, I think the whole NOL stuff is nonsense. He should just release his most recent tax returns and we'll all be able to see that he's a phony, as if we didn't know already.
In brief, I think the whole NOL stuff is nonsense. He should just release his most recent tax returns and we'll all be able to see that he's a phony, as if we didn't know already.
5
Mr. Trump is laughing at us - tax payers. I am a genius and you are so so stu.....
12
Lets all run out and vote for him - things will be so great - trust him.
6
This is great. Now the NYT has a recording - after an ad, of course - in a derogatory tone stating that what Trump did was legal. If there's a problem it's with the tax code, not Trump. And do the owners of the NYT use tax shelters and write offs too? And man, that woman on the recording sounds tougher than my grandmother.
7
So, I'm guessing this makes Trump a "taker" and not a "maker".
Which percentage would Mitt Romney have put him in?
Which percentage would Mitt Romney have put him in?
16
I think Trump may have released those few pages from 21 years ago himself. Smart move. It sets up WHY he wouldn't have paid any taxes these past years. All legal too. Kind of diffuses the narrative. Pundits explaining the carry forward as a legal IRS tool. 1995 was the worst point in his career. He survived. He can use that in his next debate. He can even release some of his newer returns. Or,in case any of them have been hacked or leaked he has the why of paying no taxes already out there. Odd this one year of 21 years ago was the one leaked. The one that showed the biggest NOL. He can play that to his favor too....he can say he fought and clawed his way back, and conquered where as many other developers were vanquished.
The Comeback. (Like bringing the Country back.)
Bill & Hill were in the white house at the time and had no objection to the IRS laws, they actually used this particular deduction themselves. As Scott Adams said today (of Dilbert fame) Trump either leaked them himself, or it was the luckiest thing that happened to him all year.
The Comeback. (Like bringing the Country back.)
Bill & Hill were in the white house at the time and had no objection to the IRS laws, they actually used this particular deduction themselves. As Scott Adams said today (of Dilbert fame) Trump either leaked them himself, or it was the luckiest thing that happened to him all year.
4
Even if it's a so-called tax loss, it takes incompetence of the highest order to run all of his properties so far into the ground to claim this loss. Then Trump whines that this disclosure is unfair?
Memo to Donald Trump: This is partisan politics with a lot at stake. There is no such thing as fairness in politics. Never has been, never will be. It's not fair just when you say it is fair, either. Your long string of lies and false claims is not fair either, but they have a habit of coming back to bite you in the backside.
I wonder, if analyses had been done on the letter at the same level as the anthrax letters of a few years ago, if the DNA of the sender or analysis of the copying would have revealed who ratted Trump out. For sure, this was done by somebody inside his organization or his family or his ex-family.
Memo to Donald Trump: This is partisan politics with a lot at stake. There is no such thing as fairness in politics. Never has been, never will be. It's not fair just when you say it is fair, either. Your long string of lies and false claims is not fair either, but they have a habit of coming back to bite you in the backside.
I wonder, if analyses had been done on the letter at the same level as the anthrax letters of a few years ago, if the DNA of the sender or analysis of the copying would have revealed who ratted Trump out. For sure, this was done by somebody inside his organization or his family or his ex-family.
8
How is the Clinton Foundation not a tax shelter. Tax shelters are created for the purpose of avoiding paying income tax. And, how is it a crime to claim a loss on a income tax return. Every company in the US does so. Do you believe Hillary does not claim her operating expenses incident to her "speeches" as a tax deduction?... thereby avoiding paying income tax.
5
No one has demonstated Clintons have taken money from the foundation for personal use, as has Trump.
They DID pay income tax on their speaking fees. Look it up.
They DID pay income tax on their speaking fees. Look it up.
23
Trump's tax records reveal an incredibly savvy and smart man. Now. What does the evidence that Hillary had destroyed reveal about her? What about the destroyed travel journals? Why isn't the NYtimes investigating the clinton foundation?
Ordinary Americans recognize what the liberal media is doing. I see the signs for Trump all over fly over country. He's going to win. It does matter that your dishonest hypocrites. He's still going to win.
Ordinary Americans recognize what the liberal media is doing. I see the signs for Trump all over fly over country. He's going to win. It does matter that your dishonest hypocrites. He's still going to win.
6
if he represents any part of what is best in America - America does not deserve to survive -
14
The Clintons have already been investigated six ways from Sunday since the 1980's. Blowing smoke at them won't make the questions about Trump go away. No matter how much you wish they would. Why won't he release any tax returns? What is he hiding? If he's the guy he says he is, what is he afraid of?
13
This may lose Trump votes, but will it gain Clinton any?
Her problem continues to be that increasing Trump's negatives does nothing to increase her positives. Clinton will win the electoral vote walking away, but voter turnout will be low and her mandate, if she can claim one, will to not be Trump.
Her problem continues to be that increasing Trump's negatives does nothing to increase her positives. Clinton will win the electoral vote walking away, but voter turnout will be low and her mandate, if she can claim one, will to not be Trump.
5
Another hit piece by the NY Times.
It appears that Donald Trump followed the tax law. A tax law that was the result of legislation passed by Republicans and Democrats and signed by the Presidents who were both Republicans and Democrats.
It is absolutely legal to AVOID taxes. Trump would have been a fool not to avoid taxes. And he is no fool.
Anyone who owns real estate knows that under the tax laws one can have cash flow but not income and therefore no tax to pay.
Why Trump and his surrogates don't say the above straight out I will never understand.
It appears that Donald Trump followed the tax law. A tax law that was the result of legislation passed by Republicans and Democrats and signed by the Presidents who were both Republicans and Democrats.
It is absolutely legal to AVOID taxes. Trump would have been a fool not to avoid taxes. And he is no fool.
Anyone who owns real estate knows that under the tax laws one can have cash flow but not income and therefore no tax to pay.
Why Trump and his surrogates don't say the above straight out I will never understand.
12
How many real estate pros do you know that have lost amost a billion dollars, in one year? In a decent market?
5
Here's why they don't (or shouldn't) say that: what middle class or working class person has "a cash flow but no income"? That's insane and just underscores how the rich write rules for themselves and how Trump actually ran his businesses into the ground, bilked people he owed out of their legitimate compensation and still managed to live like a king. What has Trump proposed to fix this unjust tax code? Why, propose laws that further benefit large real estate developers, etc. That's the story that Clinton and her supporters should be shouting from the rooftops. Wave Trump's policies not his tax returns under the noses of sleepy eyed voters and wake them up!
18
A tax law that was the result of legislation passed by Republicans and Democrats and signed by the Presidents who were both Republicans and Democrats where is your proof? I suspect it is mostly if not all republicans behind the giveaway.
5
Sadly, none of this matters.
1) Clearly, we need tax code reform but this will never happen because lobbyists will ensure the loopholes for the wealthiest persist. It's a fact of our political system.
2) As egregious as Trump's tax situation may be, the hundreds of millions raked in by the Clinton Global Initiative are no better. Arguing that either is "less bad" is to further argue along party lines.
1) Clearly, we need tax code reform but this will never happen because lobbyists will ensure the loopholes for the wealthiest persist. It's a fact of our political system.
2) As egregious as Trump's tax situation may be, the hundreds of millions raked in by the Clinton Global Initiative are no better. Arguing that either is "less bad" is to further argue along party lines.
6
Nonsense. He is running for President of the United States and has refused to submit anything of substance about his business dealings, not just taxes. Until he was outed by someone close to him. Now he and his minions are spinning as fast as they can, pumping the smoke and moving the mirrors
15
apples and oranges. The Clinton Global Initiative does good in the world. Trump corporation does damage to the world and provides the Trumps with personal wealth while dumping on everybody else.
21
The Clinton Foundation money goes directly to help people in need around the world. Trump's money goes into his own pocket. See the difference?
https://www.clintonfoundation.org/about/annual-financial-reports
https://www.clintonfoundation.org/about/annual-financial-reports
11
When Trump pays zero Taxes, Conservatives call him a "Genius". When poor People pay Zero Taxes, Conservatives call them moochers.
47
Very enlightening, but very biased reporting by the NY Times. Why biased? If you lose $900 million, the reader needs to know how that number came about. Did he borrow $900 million and then proceeded to loose it? Did he make $900 million in previous years (and paid taxes on it(???)) and then proceed to lose it? (think of owning a stock. it goes up, you sell, pay taxes on the capital gains. Buy it back and the stock tanks to its original price. Then you have a capital loss that you can deduct on your taxes.)
Also, given the size of the numbers, it would of naturally triggered a careful investigation and a possible large adjustment to these figures which the NY Times does not report.
So something smells very fishy here. Not only on Donald's part, but also on the NY Time's part because they made very wide reaching conclusions with only partial information.
Also, given the size of the numbers, it would of naturally triggered a careful investigation and a possible large adjustment to these figures which the NY Times does not report.
So something smells very fishy here. Not only on Donald's part, but also on the NY Time's part because they made very wide reaching conclusions with only partial information.
5
Do all these outraged people not take advantage of the tax code when it favors them?
Get mad at the real culprits - the Democrats and Republicans who wrote this code at the behest of special interest groups and to afford full employment for tax lawyers and accountants.
Get mad at the real culprits - the Democrats and Republicans who wrote this code at the behest of special interest groups and to afford full employment for tax lawyers and accountants.
8
Trump said he had a fiduciary duty to his family and companies to pay as little taxes as possible. However, according to the Times article, his companies were partnerships or subchapter S corporations and the income or losses from these entities would be passed through to Trump's personal tax return - no tax at the entity level. This is why the loss shows up on his personal tax return. So his statement about owing a fiduciary duty is bogus. Likewise Rudy Giuliani's statement on Good Morning America that Trump had a duty to his companies regarding taxes is just not the case as far as S-Corp's and partnerships (limited or general ) or LLC's are concerned.
23
Are you people all idiots? You are arguing that an investor should pay taxes on all gains and not get to net losses from these gains? This is a basic rule of taxes in our economy - if you invest you get taxed on the net profit from these investments. The fact that gains and losses do not net to a profit for a given year should mean that the investor cannot net gains and losses? What an interesting and ridiculously stupid argument that in no way reflects how we tax investments!
8
This isn't news whatsoever.
If anything, it's rehashed from what was in the news in the late 80's. Earlier this year the NYT had a long article that mentioned this.
Nothing prohibits anyone to pay more in taxes than is obligated if they want to.
How many holier-than-thou readers have done this?
Or is it somehow morally superior to pay only the obligated amount if you earn under a certain figure?
If Trump or anyone like him paid one penny more than legally obligated, then that would be reason for a story. There's nothing here. Nothing.
If anything, it's rehashed from what was in the news in the late 80's. Earlier this year the NYT had a long article that mentioned this.
Nothing prohibits anyone to pay more in taxes than is obligated if they want to.
How many holier-than-thou readers have done this?
Or is it somehow morally superior to pay only the obligated amount if you earn under a certain figure?
If Trump or anyone like him paid one penny more than legally obligated, then that would be reason for a story. There's nothing here. Nothing.
12
Except that in order to lower his taxes he utterly lost over 900 Million.
11
The point to all the Trump defenders on this chain is this is not someone that pays his bills if he can help it. Ever. Period. End sum. He has an army of lawyers and accountants giving him every loophole possible, he stiffs little people of their pay and out of their homes left and right, and makes as few charitable contributions as possible. And has no regret or ethical concern whatsoever who or what he destroys. So what evidence has he ever shown to anyone that he will help any of us or take care of any of us when he is in office? He's not shown any beliefs or philosophies or principles other than PURE GREED. Someone please tell me how pure greed is going to help us in the Oval office?
30
No doubt a huge blow to Trump's legitimacy for any sane follower of the election. In any election year, a candidate with Trump's kind of record would not have gone pass the primary. Yet, this will not dent Trump's legitimacy for his supporters. Trump will continue to barrel on with the full fury of his supporters. The question now is, what else can we add to Trump's list?
9
'Could' is operative word. NY TIMES could not have paid any taxes because they LOSE money EVERY YEAR
5
The Time isn't running for president,
11
Who paid his $1 billion loss? Banks paid it? why these bank loan him again and again? The republican goverment bailed out these banks using our money. So you - tax payers paid his loss.
13
Hold Trump's feet to the fire and make him release his IRS audut letter. How do we know his taxes are under audit now? Only because he says so (and a letter from his paid accountants). Make him prove it. I think it's just another lie.
Make it a headline every day until he produces it.
#TrumpsFakeAudit
Make it a headline every day until he produces it.
#TrumpsFakeAudit
14
This amoral, arrogant, anti-American mess of a human being should crawl back into his gilded hole, and make way for hard working, tax paying citizens to continue building our country, stronger... together. Please vote on 8 November!
21
According to this article Donald Trump didn't do anything illegal with his taxes, but the NYT and Hillary Clinton imply that it would have been morally wrong to take full advantage of that tax legal provision. (We don't know if he did, or not.)
In 1995 when Trump's return was filled, America was ruled by Bill and Hillary Clinton. Why didn't Bill Clinton do anything to repeal that loophole or tax provision if the Clintons were so outraged by it and fund it so immoral?
Between 20001-2009 Hillary was a Senator of NY. She could have directly introduced legislation to kill that tax provision. Why didn't she take any action?
Up until last year, Trump has been a regular businessman with no legal power to change legislation, and he played the business game by the rules available to the entire business community.
Hillary is all talk and fake outrage, but no action. I bet all her donors enjoyed the same loopholes and she had no qualms getting their donations, which could have gone to the federal budget to help the vets and build roads.
I will trust the NYT more when it starts asking both sides uncomfortable questions, and when it discusses both sides of every problem in all fairness.
In 1995 when Trump's return was filled, America was ruled by Bill and Hillary Clinton. Why didn't Bill Clinton do anything to repeal that loophole or tax provision if the Clintons were so outraged by it and fund it so immoral?
Between 20001-2009 Hillary was a Senator of NY. She could have directly introduced legislation to kill that tax provision. Why didn't she take any action?
Up until last year, Trump has been a regular businessman with no legal power to change legislation, and he played the business game by the rules available to the entire business community.
Hillary is all talk and fake outrage, but no action. I bet all her donors enjoyed the same loopholes and she had no qualms getting their donations, which could have gone to the federal budget to help the vets and build roads.
I will trust the NYT more when it starts asking both sides uncomfortable questions, and when it discusses both sides of every problem in all fairness.
7
It is very likely that Donald Trump has leaked his own 1995 tax return. After getting pressure from all sides to release his tax returns and getting blamed for not paying any taxes, he is figuring it out how to reduce the damage should he release his returns.
He is now going to release his taxes (although short form so that we do not see all his details...) and say that everyone knows he is entitled to pay no taxes because of the huge loss he took in 1995.
Times reporter indicated to CNN that she does not want to tell whether she knows who sent in the tax returns. Maybe Donald did not have an unmarked envelope at the time he did this (or maybe his ego!).
I have seen enough of Trump tactics to deduce that it was HIM!
Anyone heard of John Miller?
He is now going to release his taxes (although short form so that we do not see all his details...) and say that everyone knows he is entitled to pay no taxes because of the huge loss he took in 1995.
Times reporter indicated to CNN that she does not want to tell whether she knows who sent in the tax returns. Maybe Donald did not have an unmarked envelope at the time he did this (or maybe his ego!).
I have seen enough of Trump tactics to deduce that it was HIM!
Anyone heard of John Miller?
5
Mr. Trump was evidently unable to pay the architects, builders, and small contractors after the failure of his casinos, airline, Plaza Hotel, and other deals. One can read many things into the Times's snapshot of Trump's mammoth paper losses, and subsequent license to avoid paying federal taxes for many years. But among the conclusions I reach is that Mr. Trump was not fair and gentlemanly enough, once he was allegedly again in the black, to make it up to the small businesses he'd stiffed during the bankruptcies, by paying them what he owed. Rather, he greedily pursued further self-aggrandizement.
16
The NYT is inadvertanltly helping Trump with headlines like: "...He could have avoided taxes for nearly two decades," with no proof he didn't pay taxes for two decades. If you want to help Hillary you need to stop being so blatantly bias. Anyone with the slightest bit of critical reading skill can see through it. The Times and CNN are beginning to scare some of us. Can the fix really be in? I thought the Russian involvement in our elections headline was over the top, now this. He can't stand up to fair scrutiny, why is the Times jeopordizing its credibility with this obvious overreach?
6
A Tax Question: Since Mr. Trump's $916,000,000 tax loss was on a tax return that was filled jointly by Mr. Trump and his second wife, following their divorce would not each one of them only be able to offset half of their income against the tax loss.
2
October Surprise!
4
The New York Times is the law breaker here and needs to be prosecuted for accepting a stolen tax return and publishing the information.