There is no dignity left indeed in politics , on a day to day basis even if you are a Senator and Congressman . If you have any self respect and conscious left , to follow NRA 's agenda in the aftermath of Sunday , June 12th the worst national tragedy i.e. , killings of 49 and injured 53 innocent Americans . The Senate led by GOP majority , once again failed to muster commitments and courage . The 56 Senators felt duty bound and helpless . Why they refused to stop gun violence by passing amendments to exiting Laws ? The terrorist involved in Orlando attacks had high - powered gun which should not be allowed in the hands of a person on : a ) FBI Terrorists Watch List b) TSA 's No Fly List . This happened due largely led by NRA , the influential Gun Lobbyists . The majority of Senators' faced with re-election campaign funds problems a huge challenge , are forced to accept dictations from Special interests lobbyists and big money Billionaires ' business and political agenda on economic and Social policies . This at what cost for the people in these United States . What do you think ?
9
I am happy to say I didn't watch the OJ trial and still less do I want to waste my time paying attention to this ugly Trump v Clinton match. It seems all wrapped up for Clinton in any case, unless of course she is indited, but I'm sure that won't be allowed to happen.
3
Really talented sand artist in India.
Eevryone all over the world is paying attention to America's politics. In third world countries, bribery, corruption, wealthy and powerful people bending rules, is a given, business as usual, America is no different. The fact that both Hillary and Trump are the only ones left standing means exactly that - wealthy and powerful people are aided and abetted by the media.
Eevryone all over the world is paying attention to America's politics. In third world countries, bribery, corruption, wealthy and powerful people bending rules, is a given, business as usual, America is no different. The fact that both Hillary and Trump are the only ones left standing means exactly that - wealthy and powerful people are aided and abetted by the media.
14
Just change 1 word to:
Is there any dignity left in reporting?
More time has been spent in the newspapers covering trivial reportage (e.g. This article,The Donald's could mouth, Hillary and Bill's Foundation, the lack of reporting of Bernie Sanders, the bias for Hillary and against Bernie Sanders, and on and on…….
I hope the reporting will get better once the 2 "official" (presumptive is a new word in met lexicon) candidates are crowned, and the 5 months of true debating and and campaigning begins!
Is there any dignity left in reporting?
More time has been spent in the newspapers covering trivial reportage (e.g. This article,The Donald's could mouth, Hillary and Bill's Foundation, the lack of reporting of Bernie Sanders, the bias for Hillary and against Bernie Sanders, and on and on…….
I hope the reporting will get better once the 2 "official" (presumptive is a new word in met lexicon) candidates are crowned, and the 5 months of true debating and and campaigning begins!
9
It is worth noting that Mr. Arthur Brooks and David Brooks, staunch supporters of the GOP status quo, are now wandering about the grounds of the GOP asylum, pondering "Dignity" and some-such, even snagging visits with spiritual leaders whose teachings they regulary toss away by their unaccountable attachment to a party that regularly makes use of religion that "is perverted to promote violence against innocent people". A party that treats women like some sort of second class citizens does not get to brag about dignity.
It is beyond the realm of humor when things are this hypocritical.
It is beyond the realm of humor when things are this hypocritical.
34
Probably not - and no death with dignity either!
2
Gee maybe the two of you could talk to Congress? Thanks for a great article, and yes, Gail, you are my role model even if I am older.
6
I do not share Arthur's enthusiasm for the Dalai Lama who is chosen as a child to "lead" and then thrust into power until he is old enough for decisions. Maybe we could try that here but we have child abuse laws. Also, this man may be very uneducated, probably didn't attend seminary or even know much and lives in a country that is hanging on every day. Not a person that impresses me.
3
I'm NOT even going to read this but just point out that our current President is one of the most dignified person we have ever had in the office ...
24
Well that's not saying much is it?
1
And the fact that the younger women benefited from the work of the prior group of women who made so many legal changes and strides probably explains why the younger women don't know enough to rally round Hillary. They would rather go for another white male, Bernie, who spouts platitudes of revolution, and who voted for a 2005 law that specially exempts gun manufacturers from liability for the carnage guns cause. Way to go Bernie! Better be armed for your revolution!
11
When Republican Congressman Joe Wilson pointed and shouted "You lie!", twice, during President Obama's speech to a joint session of Congress in 2009, I felt that the unspoken agreement to maintain an atmosphere of dignity and mutual respect--despite political differences--was violated in a way it might not easily or quickly recover from.
It seemed a harbinger of Republican lawmakers' attitude towards the President over the next seven years, and likely caused many, at the time, to despair that something important had been lost.
Their fears came true.
The current wretched state of the Republican Party and its takeover by a scary cartoon caricature of a politician feels like a natural outcome of the path chosen by the Republicans at the beginning of Obama's presidency. And all for the want of a bit of mutual respect.
It seemed a harbinger of Republican lawmakers' attitude towards the President over the next seven years, and likely caused many, at the time, to despair that something important had been lost.
Their fears came true.
The current wretched state of the Republican Party and its takeover by a scary cartoon caricature of a politician feels like a natural outcome of the path chosen by the Republicans at the beginning of Obama's presidency. And all for the want of a bit of mutual respect.
20
And to think that Arthur Brooks is the new innovative genius of the "thinking" conservatives of the Republican Party. Meet the new boss, same as the old boss. Bankrupcy reigns in the Never-New Grand Old Party. Of all the Republicans running in the primaries, only Trump would occasionally buck the Sacred Commands of the tired and fact-less Republican creed that has been destroying our country slowly for 30 years, including 8 years of political cowardice and caving of Bill Clinton. Enough is enough of this Right Wing Militia hate the government silliness. It's too much like the partisanship that led to the Civil War and Lincoln and the so-called party of Lincoln.
7
Let me answer that for you. No.
2
Obama is as dignified as its definition.
6
No dignity left on the Republican side. More Ryan (Eddie Munster) "if we take away all the rules, allow more unfettered capitalism, and enhance pollution the poor will have jobs". I say reduce the 0.1% tax breaks (they are the real takers in our society today and spend more on the common good. I, for one, do not want to see the homeless on my doorstep - like India. For what republicans call a Christian society, we are far from it in word and deed.
17
Research so far is "insufficient" to determine whether pre-K is beneficial?! What planet do you live under, Arthur? If true, then why do rich, preferential people such as yourself jump at and fight over slots in pre-K for your privileged children? Are you saying that the rich (especially conservative rich who want to keep these opportunities to themselves) are so ignorant as to throw money away at something so untested and unsure, that we just don't dare expose our less-than-rich children to such a thing? What logic...may we introduce you to another fool named donnie?
25
The job creators are businesses and investors but the fault for unemployment is the unemployed who fail to find jobs for themselves. That is the conservative Republican assertions about employment and unemployment, contradictory. As more and more of the new wealth is concentrated in the hands of businesses and investors who are saving it for better economic conditions, the costs of supporting the unemployed are to be reduced by saving the unemployed from having their incentives to work affected by giving them the means to survive without jobs.
The statistics are clear about the effects of pre-K education on children in poor communities it helps them a lot through third grade but they tend to move towards the mean, that is underperformance in later grades, with a significant number actually doing better than the mean by the time that they reach adulthood. The success of students in school is severely constrained by the consequences of living in a poor community. Money does not make people succeed in school but lack of it can prevent it.
The statistics are clear about the effects of pre-K education on children in poor communities it helps them a lot through third grade but they tend to move towards the mean, that is underperformance in later grades, with a significant number actually doing better than the mean by the time that they reach adulthood. The success of students in school is severely constrained by the consequences of living in a poor community. Money does not make people succeed in school but lack of it can prevent it.
6
The fix is simple: public campaign funding. Instead of a perennial media circus, we can have a 6 month campaign with a national primary and general election, with free TV ads as PSAs, and serious debates replacing talking points.
Once politicians are responsible only to the public, we won't see Congress voting against 85% of the people to avoid NRA wrath.
Once politicians are responsible only to the public, we won't see Congress voting against 85% of the people to avoid NRA wrath.
22
Fighting Poverty? An organization in Los Angeles called the Youth Policy Institute has a model that is actually working. Focus on a poor neighborhood and supply, tailored house by house, the resources needed for the children there to be the first in their families to go to college. Not primarily money. Not easy and does take resources -- but it is not just do-gooder idealism giveaway and numbers show effectiveness See how it works at ypiusa.org. Disclosure: I am an unpaid volunteer.
2
Politics is inherently without decency because it is a struggle for power and control in which the losers will tend to lose and the winners will tend to win -- win-win arrangement in politics never endure. The greatness of a Lincoln or of an FDR is never from the means of their having accomplished what they accomplished but the endurance of the effects of what they accomplished. The great lights of our great liberal democratic state like Jefferson and Adams and Hamilton all accused their opponents of treason, foolishness, vanity, and self centered seeking after personal advantages and privileges, eager to win by any means necessary. As Bismark once said, 'the people should not be shown how either their laws nor how their sausages are made'.
2
Gail smartly settles on pre-K when talked at about poverty because education might be the most politically implementable, effective anti-poverty measure. But we get the counterargument from Brooks that pre-K programs don't work even though I see no affluent people skipping them for their own children. The study of which programs work and which don't need not be done prior to implementation of the programs, it can go on simultaneously. But no, anything that results in unionized employees needs to be nipped in the bud.
16
Unlikely since there was never any dignity in politics to begin with.
3
Is there any dignity left in politics?
Better question: Was there ever any sanity?
Better question: Was there ever any sanity?
4
Are we really having this conversation? The answer is a simple NO. You don't even have to leave your couch to know with certainty that American politics, economics and our society are in decline. And we have greed, envy, inequity, injustice, extreme ideologies, classism, misogyny, racism, homophobia, religious extremism and my favorite: the worship of capitalism above all else to blame. We are incapable of absorbing any personal responsibility for resorting to voyeurism over informed activism. We have become the most self absorb, egotistical, unenlightened creatures on this planet clinging to the false notion of our exceptionalism. We, as a people and nation have no dignity, so how could it even be possible for their to be any dignity in our politics. We have reaped what we have sown.
7
The Democratic front-runner's husband sullied the Highest Office 20 years ago with a textbook definition of a sexually hostile work environment with an intern, boldfaced lied about to the country, and propped up by his party and social an media elite wouldn't gracefully leave because it was "nobody's business," and the NYT asks -- now -- if there's any dignity left in politics?
7
On Pre-K, Sorry but isn't the right perennially saying that there's not been enough research to justify action? Climate change, tobacco, gun control, on and on. Let's just keep studying the problem and don't do anything to improve outcomes for millions of kids in the meantime. Surprised Gail let that slide.
5
Was there ever any dignity in politics, except maybe for JFK's brief shining moment of Camelot and Ronnie and Nancy's Hollywood glitter? Read accounts of the old campaigns, when adultery, calling Abe Lincoln a "babboon" and drunken fistfights on election day were the norm.....
But let's be honest here. To paraphrase Don Vito Corleone in "The Godfather," "Politics is a dirty business. If our friends knew our business was politics instead of gambling or drugs or even women, they'd run for cover..."
But let's be honest here. To paraphrase Don Vito Corleone in "The Godfather," "Politics is a dirty business. If our friends knew our business was politics instead of gambling or drugs or even women, they'd run for cover..."
3
If 1 of my 3 children had come up to me and said, "Dad, I want to become a politician", I would have felt like I had failed as a father.
7
Is There Any Dignity Left in Politics?
Nope. There never was and there never will. To be a politician one has to have an oversized ego and ambition. Most of the time, the job they fight for is not worth it, but they go after anyway because it massages their ego and somehow it helps their pocket. Obama, whether is a good, a so,so president or a bad one, he'll make a fortune just giving speeches after he leaves the job he's got now. If we audit every member of congress, we'll realize that most of them have a lot more money than they had when they started in politics. Dignity in politics? Forget it!
Nope. There never was and there never will. To be a politician one has to have an oversized ego and ambition. Most of the time, the job they fight for is not worth it, but they go after anyway because it massages their ego and somehow it helps their pocket. Obama, whether is a good, a so,so president or a bad one, he'll make a fortune just giving speeches after he leaves the job he's got now. If we audit every member of congress, we'll realize that most of them have a lot more money than they had when they started in politics. Dignity in politics? Forget it!
3
I'm happy to say that our president consistently brings dignity to our politics and I remain extremely proud of him.
23
How is it that Arthur could miss the child care access challenge so completely? The point of "free", or publicly funded early child care, is not educational, that is a side benefit, the point is to provide a safe, affordable place parents can leave their children while at WORK. Of course that has always been a concept difficult for the blue-blood-nanny-raised-class to grasp. Oops, sorry, too class warfarey for dignified politics?
8
What seems to be missing in politics is a sense of decency. Maybe it's because of the article today in the Times about Roy Cohn's influence on Mr Trump, but I'm reminded of Mr Welch's famous exchange with Senator McCarthy on the subject.
6
The headline implies that there was dignity in politics in the first place. Dignity and politics are two words you will NOT find in the same sentence. Especially, in reference to the American political system.
2
I always saw Raphael (Ted) Cruz as the Manchurian Candidate. His father coming here mysteriously after some trouble during the Castro revolution. Arriving in the U.S. and marrying an American so as to have an American son who would grow up with the intention of destroying this country. He has already wrecked havoc with the credit worthiness of the country and has tried to become president (to please his Soviet masters). This man is evil and even John Boehner has called him "Lucifer in the flesh".
As regards education, children need to be nurtured to truly learn. The parents of the economically and socially disadvantaged do not have the grounding that say the middle class or better off. They are not read to at an early age, have a limited exposure to vocabulary, do not have the opportunity to travel or visit museums and are exposed to the school of hard knocks. Society needs to provide the nurturing in early and extended school activities, year round, to keep these children interested and involved. The U.S. pioneered universal education and must make the leap to providing educational needs that meet the current situation. Without this commitment, the nation is bound to failure and the creation of a divided society.
As regards education, children need to be nurtured to truly learn. The parents of the economically and socially disadvantaged do not have the grounding that say the middle class or better off. They are not read to at an early age, have a limited exposure to vocabulary, do not have the opportunity to travel or visit museums and are exposed to the school of hard knocks. Society needs to provide the nurturing in early and extended school activities, year round, to keep these children interested and involved. The U.S. pioneered universal education and must make the leap to providing educational needs that meet the current situation. Without this commitment, the nation is bound to failure and the creation of a divided society.
4
There may be some dignity left in politics, but it is not being manifested by those in leadership positions. Take, for example, the response of Ryan and McConnell to Trump.
The presumptive nominee for their party, Trump, has implicated Ted Cruz's father in the assassination of JFK; accused Hilary Clinton of being involved in the death of Vince Foster; urged disqualification of the judge presiding over the Trump University case because of the judge's ethnicity; implied that the president is a jihadist.
If Ryan or McConnell were leaders, that would not have endorsed Trump in the first place or un-endorsed him because of all his lying.
There is no dignity in politics as long as those in leadership positions refuse to provide leadership and do the right thing for advancing the public/common good, the major purpose of politics, as noted by Pope Francis in his address to Congress: "You are the face of its people, their representatives. You are called to defend and preserve the dignity of your fellow citizens in the tireless and demanding pursuit of the common good, for this is the chief aim of all politics."
The presumptive nominee for their party, Trump, has implicated Ted Cruz's father in the assassination of JFK; accused Hilary Clinton of being involved in the death of Vince Foster; urged disqualification of the judge presiding over the Trump University case because of the judge's ethnicity; implied that the president is a jihadist.
If Ryan or McConnell were leaders, that would not have endorsed Trump in the first place or un-endorsed him because of all his lying.
There is no dignity in politics as long as those in leadership positions refuse to provide leadership and do the right thing for advancing the public/common good, the major purpose of politics, as noted by Pope Francis in his address to Congress: "You are the face of its people, their representatives. You are called to defend and preserve the dignity of your fellow citizens in the tireless and demanding pursuit of the common good, for this is the chief aim of all politics."
9
I am pretty sure my very religious Senator- Cory Gardner "prayed for peace".
I called his office when I found out that he supports the status quo on gun control and that he voted against background checks. He also got nearly 4 million dollars from the gun lobby. Someone who sounds about 13 tried to explain his stance.
I think this got filed in the "white-washed sepulchre" section in the teachings of Jesus. So much for "human dignity". I am disgusted by my senator's completely sold out sham of a vote. No doubt he cries over fertilized eggs. Ugh.
I called his office when I found out that he supports the status quo on gun control and that he voted against background checks. He also got nearly 4 million dollars from the gun lobby. Someone who sounds about 13 tried to explain his stance.
I think this got filed in the "white-washed sepulchre" section in the teachings of Jesus. So much for "human dignity". I am disgusted by my senator's completely sold out sham of a vote. No doubt he cries over fertilized eggs. Ugh.
16
My longer comment got cut off, somehow. What works, from my personal experience is the early childhood education. I went to pre-K way back in 1944 in Louisville, KY. At 76 years of age I have experienced and seen a lot in many parts of the world. We waste too much time in this country paying so called experts to study everything. Time to spend the money on the true needy, not on those who think they know everything.
5
Maybe pre-K isn't about helping the kids at all. Maybe it is about enabling the single mother to get a job!
5
Hillary Clinton is just beating herself down if she continues to yell and attack. She should be worried about getting votes. The bad-mouth year of campaigning is not attracting people IN. If there is only yelling back and forth and playing into the Trump screaming machine, than everyone will tune out. I am voting Jill Stein if Bernie Sanders isn't on the ballet in November. Vote for sanity, not corporate greed and establishment!!
4
From Hillary's speech: "We know what sound fiscal policy is, and it sure isn't running up massive debt for giveaway's to the rich." This must be backwards day, Hillary of all people calling for spending restraint??? Is this the same Hillary that received a fatwa from her Wall Street Imam's about not have Warren on her ticket because she would be too tough on them?
I'm confused, does Hillary stand for anything? Oops, if forgot. . . Hillary stands for Hillary, first, last and always.
I'm confused, does Hillary stand for anything? Oops, if forgot. . . Hillary stands for Hillary, first, last and always.
8
Thank you Arthur for these insightful and accurate words: "Your question of who’s against people working is more than rhetorical. On both left and right, there are some who understand work as a key to helping people thrive, and others who see it as a punishment — lower-skill work in particular. You can tell the “punishment” crowd on the left when they argue that people shouldn’t be forced to take “dead-end jobs,” implying they are less dignified than joblessness. On the right it’s those who act like work requirements are a good way to stick it to shiftless welfare recipients.
I am convinced by a lot of solid research — and ancient wisdom to boot — that work is a vitally important institution of meaning and happiness in our lives." I think, This is the crux of the left right issue debate. Amen Perhaps the solution/answer is in the middle. Safety net for only very few under extreme circumstances; and then some sort of public work at minimum wage for those who would simply prefer not to work unless they consider it meaningfully worth it!
I am convinced by a lot of solid research — and ancient wisdom to boot — that work is a vitally important institution of meaning and happiness in our lives." I think, This is the crux of the left right issue debate. Amen Perhaps the solution/answer is in the middle. Safety net for only very few under extreme circumstances; and then some sort of public work at minimum wage for those who would simply prefer not to work unless they consider it meaningfully worth it!
2
"Is There Any Dignity Left in Politics?"
If there were, no one who voted for the illegal War on Iraq would show their face in public again.
If there were, no one who voted for the illegal War on Iraq would show their face in public again.
1
"New poverty ideas" from Paul Ryan (or Arthur Brooks for that matter) has such an interesting syntactical spin to it. Sort of like "Avoid Boring People".
2
The politician who exemplifies dignity, in both his personal life and his views, to me, is Bernie Sanders. No millionaire he; instead he speaks of the "we" and not the "I", and posits solutions to help end the crippling wealth inequity and inequality rampant in our nation today.
5
Of course Mr Brooks cites his own "resident expert" on pre-K, who reports that the evidence is insufficient to justify establishment of a program. If "experts" at the AEI ever found evidence that supported the creation of a large-scale government program, they would cease to be employed at the AEI. Mr Brooks needs to look for impartial sources if he expects anyone to believe him.
3
Only in Politics there is no "dignity" left? Just look at the way average people appear in public, i.e., nearly naked. Our society at large has gone down the tubes - it would be insulting to compare us to chimpanzees, insulting to the chimpanzees, that is.
3
Paul Ryan's budget plan includes eliminating the rule that financial advisors put the clients interest first when offering advice. This is going to help with poverty???
7
Arthur: "Wouldn’t it be great if government could find a surefire method to close the achievement gap and give poor kids a good start in life? But wanting pre-K to do all these things and the programs actually working are different things." Not so fast!
This is the conservative set-up for trashing & refusing to fund or successfully de-funding pre-K programs for poor children. Is this what pre-K programs are really for--to "close the achievement gap"? Or are such programs for small children for lots of other things too?
Here is how the conservative set up works. Nixon did it successfully for Head Start, which conservatives seem to detest. Nixon wanted to get rid of Head Start, so Westinghouse was commissioned to do a study of how "successful" the program was by second grade. Westinghouse measured children's reading and arithmetic scores in second grade and compared the scores of those who had been in Head Start, finding that many were not "performing" in reading and arithmetic at grade level. Ergo: Head Start is a failure, so cut the funding.
A friend of mine who worked in Head Start at the time had a fit because the real benefits were so much more, such as readying poor children for school, the health benefits and attention given to the children and their parents, the parents' gains from helping in the school, etc. When Head Start argued these benefits were not measured, the Nixon administration said "tough," and funding was cut
It is all in the definition & measurement
This is the conservative set-up for trashing & refusing to fund or successfully de-funding pre-K programs for poor children. Is this what pre-K programs are really for--to "close the achievement gap"? Or are such programs for small children for lots of other things too?
Here is how the conservative set up works. Nixon did it successfully for Head Start, which conservatives seem to detest. Nixon wanted to get rid of Head Start, so Westinghouse was commissioned to do a study of how "successful" the program was by second grade. Westinghouse measured children's reading and arithmetic scores in second grade and compared the scores of those who had been in Head Start, finding that many were not "performing" in reading and arithmetic at grade level. Ergo: Head Start is a failure, so cut the funding.
A friend of mine who worked in Head Start at the time had a fit because the real benefits were so much more, such as readying poor children for school, the health benefits and attention given to the children and their parents, the parents' gains from helping in the school, etc. When Head Start argued these benefits were not measured, the Nixon administration said "tough," and funding was cut
It is all in the definition & measurement
6
This year's presumptive presidential candidates may be the political equivalent of tennis stars Billie Jean King and Bobby Riggs, who battled it out on the tennis court in the well-publicized and entertaining Battle of the Sexes in 1973. In both cases, the women took their roles seriously while the men are just clowning around and enjoying the notoriety.
3
Ryan and Brooks are of course right that the poor need jobs. But what is on offer for them are jobs that essentially exploit their desperation. What they need is some power in the marketplace (that Brooks worships). And the way those on the bottom end of the economic ladder have gotten that historically is via unions. So when Ryan and Brooks start talking pro-union, I will think they are serious about ending poverty. It worked 100 years ago, transforming exploitative industrial work into a path to the middle class and beyond. And it would work again if we can empower unions in the areas currently open to the working poor -- whether it's behind the counter at a McDonald's, stocking the shelf at Wal-Mart or retrieving an order at an Amazon warehouse.
7
Like Nike says, "Just do it." It works.
1
Career politicians have removed dignity from our nation's government. Their only dignity is in protecting themselves and getting reelected.
Term limits will bring back dignity to government.
Term limits will bring back dignity to government.
5
Trump is America; undignified to a point of ignorance, contempt for all and any that don't grovel at his feet, content to steamroll over anything preventing him from getting his way, crass huckster to the end, the personification of that which ends empires. Thank God there are enough Americans the antithesis of all that is Donald.
5
Y'all covered a lot of ground, today. More serious than usual. Did, poverty get to you? I don't mean Trump running out of money!
More seriously, Pre-K at least. I'm sure you're aware of Maslow's hierarchy of needs. Many don't even make it through the bottom level. Where does one expect theses children to wind up in adulthood?
So, the eternal nature of politics, (competition for power).
I'm old enough to remember when women had a rough time of it in the work place. I'm glad things have changed.
More seriously, Pre-K at least. I'm sure you're aware of Maslow's hierarchy of needs. Many don't even make it through the bottom level. Where does one expect theses children to wind up in adulthood?
So, the eternal nature of politics, (competition for power).
I'm old enough to remember when women had a rough time of it in the work place. I'm glad things have changed.
6
To cut to the quick of the GOP/Ryan/Brooks ideology: The U.S.A., "greatest" nation on earth cannot afford to provide the basic services to its citizens that EVERY other nation on earth has been doing for years. The politics on "budget deficits" came as soon as Obama took office facing GW Bush's financial collapse. It became a litany of absurdism and cynicism. Trump, like Jesus and Hitler, did not come from nowhere. I do not gloat at the utter destruction of the current Republican party but it comes just in time before it destroys our country.
7
.
"When I go out and speak with groups of women, there’s often an implicit invitation for me to talk about the gender hurdles I’ve overcome in my career. And the fact is, there weren’t any."
This admission by Gail Collins, amplified across America, could become a turning point in the left-right culture war that is beleaguering the nation. This problem is multi-faceted and complex, no doubt , but one thing is certain: the endless feminist drumbeat of “women are victims and men are perpetrators” is not helping and is extraordinarily divisive to our society. Next step: eliminate women’s studies at university.
"When I go out and speak with groups of women, there’s often an implicit invitation for me to talk about the gender hurdles I’ve overcome in my career. And the fact is, there weren’t any."
This admission by Gail Collins, amplified across America, could become a turning point in the left-right culture war that is beleaguering the nation. This problem is multi-faceted and complex, no doubt , but one thing is certain: the endless feminist drumbeat of “women are victims and men are perpetrators” is not helping and is extraordinarily divisive to our society. Next step: eliminate women’s studies at university.
6
Wouldn't it be great if the government could find a surefire method to close the achievement gap and give poor kids a good start in life? Pre K is a start but will those perhaps absentee parents read with their children do math, etc. with them and nurture them through the continuing educational process? Are those parents literate, are they physically and mentally there for them? Do they have too many children already and too much responsibility already? Kids in ghetto projects do not live the parental/familial life in many cases.
This 'crashing through the glass ceiling' epiphany keeps being used like a sales ad. Margaret Thatcher came to power over 40 years ago. I think our country has been ready to elect a female president for decades. The pool of candidates is just limited. This isn't because of electorate prejudice, but that of the "old boy" networks of our political parties and their financial support channels. The glorious and symbolic breakthrough that is being used here is only reinforcing, through a political-insider poster couple, this establishment network. If the coerced nomination of Hillary Clinton was really a liberation moment for women, one would expect that women who would have the most to gain from this, namely, young women would be the most pleased by this result. This is simply NOT the case, not matter how the establishment tries to spin it otherwise.
14
Reply to Carl Bumba: Yes, I agree that foreign countries have been breaking the glass ceiling for decades; the US has obviously lagged behind. And yes the "old boy" network has played every card to diminish a women's place in the voting electorate. That Clinton has finally made it to the national stage is testimony to the fact that the US HAS NOT been ready to recognize a woman in the White House. These young women that you speak of have grown up in an atmosphere of Republican naysayers that have used every trick in the book to keep women at bay. Young women (under 30) have no idea of the obstacles that were laid before us because our education system has been decimated to basic facts that the GOP finds germane. Alteration of Civil War history, short shrift on women's issues, the never ending argument about birth control and abortion...the list goes on and on. I'm a child of the 60s; I remember the times before abortion became legal, women taking "secretarial" or "nursing" jobs because those were the only fields women were allowed to participate in. Yes, young women have no idea what has happened to provide them the "leg up" that they have today. I'm hoping that the election of HRC will enlighten those women to the sacrifices that so many others have made before them and will show them they need to stand up with the "old ladies" that got them where they are today! And believe me, there are enough of us old ladies to propel HRC to the White House.
3
Agreed. It is an absolute shame that the first woman president will be the highly corrupt Hillary – and only because she is up against a lunatic fringe candidate who couldn't defeat a Waring blender. Women deserve better. Feminists deserve better. Americans deserve a better choice than always between two evils. The two-party system has failed to represent us, and so now we are a divided People.
6
Oh give it a rest.
Women will be glad to have more than 20% representation in a country where they are HALF the population. Maybe you dont see it from Vienna, Austria, but that is the fact on the ground in the USA>
Women will be glad to have more than 20% representation in a country where they are HALF the population. Maybe you dont see it from Vienna, Austria, but that is the fact on the ground in the USA>
2
Mr. Brooks is seriously claiming that the research on Pre-K is still unclear about the benefits?
my 3 year old would come home from pre-school asking me if I knew what constellations were and what the properties of mammals were. now she just finished the first year of high school in a rigorous program with straight As.
so yeah, I think pre-K and academic achievement are pretty clearly linked.
my 3 year old would come home from pre-school asking me if I knew what constellations were and what the properties of mammals were. now she just finished the first year of high school in a rigorous program with straight As.
so yeah, I think pre-K and academic achievement are pretty clearly linked.
7
That is the dirty bargain. We now have a political party roughly of the Id and a party of the aspirational Super Ego
"This tragedy really puts the smallness of our politics in perspective, doesn’t it? I had hoped that the candidates might keep politics out of it for a few days, but of course they didn’t. "
Really Brooks? How naive.
Shaped by the NRA multi-decade campaign, a whole new meaning of the 2d Amend was politicized by the Roberts Court. I doubt many see the Supreme Court as anything but a political animal now. Hence the unprecedented no vote on the dem nominee. The raw partisanship is completely exposed.
IN the original second amendment language in the time of muskets, the PA delegates wished to insert explicit individual gun rights language.This was rejected for the militia version that the Roberts court politically subverted.
I think with our polarized country everyone knows to avoid a 2nd civil war the right has guns and the left has expanding civil liberties. That is the dirty bargain.
I would not mind the UK type devolution where 2 states could sort out a sane life for citizens. I go with the science based, Elizabeth Warren espousing, liberal civil rights one. Think it would have to be bi coastal with the middle whatever wild wild West state they want. I don't want their guns, I just don't want to live with them next door to me with their bullets flying through my walls. Why do you think the millennials love so much dystopian culture?
"This tragedy really puts the smallness of our politics in perspective, doesn’t it? I had hoped that the candidates might keep politics out of it for a few days, but of course they didn’t. "
Really Brooks? How naive.
Shaped by the NRA multi-decade campaign, a whole new meaning of the 2d Amend was politicized by the Roberts Court. I doubt many see the Supreme Court as anything but a political animal now. Hence the unprecedented no vote on the dem nominee. The raw partisanship is completely exposed.
IN the original second amendment language in the time of muskets, the PA delegates wished to insert explicit individual gun rights language.This was rejected for the militia version that the Roberts court politically subverted.
I think with our polarized country everyone knows to avoid a 2nd civil war the right has guns and the left has expanding civil liberties. That is the dirty bargain.
I would not mind the UK type devolution where 2 states could sort out a sane life for citizens. I go with the science based, Elizabeth Warren espousing, liberal civil rights one. Think it would have to be bi coastal with the middle whatever wild wild West state they want. I don't want their guns, I just don't want to live with them next door to me with their bullets flying through my walls. Why do you think the millennials love so much dystopian culture?
7
Hillary Clinton has been running a classy issues based campaign. She has had to deal with the childish nonsense spewing endlessy from the right wing slime and lie machine, but even in crushing Sanders in the primary she stuck primarily to the issues at hand.
So no, the dignity is not gone, it is just absent on one side....
So no, the dignity is not gone, it is just absent on one side....
11
There was never any dignity in politics and never will.
2
Better statement abot politics was by the Tibet politicians who sold out to the Chines in the movie bard Pitt in the movie on Dalai Lama:
"There is no honor in politics"
Think of the woman in Delaware who had to assure us she was not a withc. Or Sharron Angle in Nevada or the two senate candidates in Missouri and Indiana assuring us that women shut down body when raped so no baby. or King of Iowa or Louie Ghromet of Texas. After these people, we should not be surprised Trump is the voice of the GOP. And they all answer the question of whether there is honor in politics? The answer: a resounding NO!
Republican right wing advocates always offer prayers first because they do not want to provide money for anyone but the !% to get more.
"There is no honor in politics"
Think of the woman in Delaware who had to assure us she was not a withc. Or Sharron Angle in Nevada or the two senate candidates in Missouri and Indiana assuring us that women shut down body when raped so no baby. or King of Iowa or Louie Ghromet of Texas. After these people, we should not be surprised Trump is the voice of the GOP. And they all answer the question of whether there is honor in politics? The answer: a resounding NO!
Republican right wing advocates always offer prayers first because they do not want to provide money for anyone but the !% to get more.
6
There is no doubt in my mind that pre-K exposure for children is a very positive step in their developing lives (and for the parents). The opportunities to develop socialization skills, rudimentary ABC's and learning that the entire universe doesn't revolve around them will be invaluable as they continue through their lives.
PM Trudeau has made subsidized universal pre-K a priority for Canada, hopefully it will see the light of day. Our children are our future, they deserve the best we can give them.
As to the US, perhaps social programs could be costed in terms people understand, for example a national pre-K program could be fully funded for 5 years for the same price as a new aircraft carrier, a school lunch program could be funded for the price of 3 F22's, etc.
PM Trudeau has made subsidized universal pre-K a priority for Canada, hopefully it will see the light of day. Our children are our future, they deserve the best we can give them.
As to the US, perhaps social programs could be costed in terms people understand, for example a national pre-K program could be fully funded for 5 years for the same price as a new aircraft carrier, a school lunch program could be funded for the price of 3 F22's, etc.
5
'and although you can’t stand it, you just can’t stop watching.' - How can I stop watching, if this is all you keep talking about?
2
Great exchange, but---
The 'glass ceiling' and equal pay for women can be greatly improved with early child care. It is almost impossible for women to give their professional career the attention needed and contend with the work and worry of raising small children. It also has a huge bonus, the kids get a much better head start in their school careers. Also, the economy will benefit from the higher productive levels of working women that have a better comfort zone to work in.
Poverty and work:
The budget cutting, tax cutting policies of the conservative right has failed. The percentage of the work force in the lower income levels has increased, job satisfaction has been a gutter ball.
We desperately need to get the infrastructure, roads, schools, communications etc., back in operating conditions. We need much more seed money in research and development. This will all create jobs as well as promote private industry to grow and produce more.
Last, but not least, we are the world leaders in almost every field, but we are not acting like one. We need both the soft glove approach as well as tough love.
Oh yes, we need real leadership, not a raving maniac that is so dumb he thinks Belgium is a city.
The 'glass ceiling' and equal pay for women can be greatly improved with early child care. It is almost impossible for women to give their professional career the attention needed and contend with the work and worry of raising small children. It also has a huge bonus, the kids get a much better head start in their school careers. Also, the economy will benefit from the higher productive levels of working women that have a better comfort zone to work in.
Poverty and work:
The budget cutting, tax cutting policies of the conservative right has failed. The percentage of the work force in the lower income levels has increased, job satisfaction has been a gutter ball.
We desperately need to get the infrastructure, roads, schools, communications etc., back in operating conditions. We need much more seed money in research and development. This will all create jobs as well as promote private industry to grow and produce more.
Last, but not least, we are the world leaders in almost every field, but we are not acting like one. We need both the soft glove approach as well as tough love.
Oh yes, we need real leadership, not a raving maniac that is so dumb he thinks Belgium is a city.
37
I believe there was some dignity in the late 1700's. Since then it's been all downhill.
3
Lack of dignity is actually a bipartisan issue, apparently having deep ethical convictions equates to sparse media coverage. The media focus on Trump is only making less worthy politicians look more reasonable and that is dangerous when left out of context. This presidential campaign really is a race to the bottom. I hope the media can start to gaze above the horizon to elevate the discussion over the next few months and stay out of the gutter.
1
"...work is a vitally important institution of meaning and happiness in our lives."
Work in one thing. Work-for-employers is another--it's a form of subservience.
When capitalists/plutocrats say "work is good"--they mean subservience to them is good--for them and for their servants.
They do NOT mean "their work is good for them"--they are above work; their money works for them--it's another servant.
Nor do they mean that dignifying servant work with collective bargaining rights and other "entitlements" is good good for workers. Just as the entitlements conferred on the monied/employing classes by property, tax and labor law are good for them.
And--they say--good for the workers because perks trickle down.
More like oozing down, like slime.
Ideal work is not subservience. It's artistry, craftsmanship--professional pride in accomplishment--not a mere means to an end, but and end/goal in itself.
The union busters like Scott Walker do not value work. They value groveling subservience.
Work in one thing. Work-for-employers is another--it's a form of subservience.
When capitalists/plutocrats say "work is good"--they mean subservience to them is good--for them and for their servants.
They do NOT mean "their work is good for them"--they are above work; their money works for them--it's another servant.
Nor do they mean that dignifying servant work with collective bargaining rights and other "entitlements" is good good for workers. Just as the entitlements conferred on the monied/employing classes by property, tax and labor law are good for them.
And--they say--good for the workers because perks trickle down.
More like oozing down, like slime.
Ideal work is not subservience. It's artistry, craftsmanship--professional pride in accomplishment--not a mere means to an end, but and end/goal in itself.
The union busters like Scott Walker do not value work. They value groveling subservience.
3
To answer the question, No. Until the politicians and those who attempt to manipulate public opinion, take us and our needs seriously, their is no dignity.
2
The American Enterprise Institute is well-known for ignoring inconvenient truths. We see this again when Arthur Brooks, writing about closing the achievement gap using high-quality pre-K, says, "Katharine Stevens, our resident AEI expert on this topic, studies the actual results of these programs. She finds that so far, the research is simply insufficient to justify huge long-term investments that would set us in one direction for decades."
This is a staggering misstatement. Ms. Stevens, Mr. Brooks, and their ilk should check out the fine, academically solid work of the NAEP, which for well over 30 years has demonstrated the positive effects of Head Start and other such programs. It is unfortunate that Ms. Collins herself is not knowledgeable enough to call him out on this canard.
This is a staggering misstatement. Ms. Stevens, Mr. Brooks, and their ilk should check out the fine, academically solid work of the NAEP, which for well over 30 years has demonstrated the positive effects of Head Start and other such programs. It is unfortunate that Ms. Collins herself is not knowledgeable enough to call him out on this canard.
11
"More research" is needed........while this "research" and the "good-faith" evaluation is going on another generation of poor children will be steered into lives as slaves to large corporations--best-case scenario--or will end up living on 2 dollars a day.
We also need more research to determine whether or not sugar is harmful or part of a normal, "healthy" diet.
Much more research is required before we acknowledge whether global warming exists. If yes, we'll need more research to discover the "best way forward".
More research is required before we can say with 100% certainty that tobacco is actually related to poor health outcomes.
All of this important research must be conducted by the AEI, The Chamber of Commerce, The Heritage Foundation, and The Manhattan Institute. We can't leave it to independent researchers and scientists, they're only out to feather their nests with grant money.
And a shout out to Mr. Brooks--he's hanging with the Dalai Lama! One cool dude!
We also need more research to determine whether or not sugar is harmful or part of a normal, "healthy" diet.
Much more research is required before we acknowledge whether global warming exists. If yes, we'll need more research to discover the "best way forward".
More research is required before we can say with 100% certainty that tobacco is actually related to poor health outcomes.
All of this important research must be conducted by the AEI, The Chamber of Commerce, The Heritage Foundation, and The Manhattan Institute. We can't leave it to independent researchers and scientists, they're only out to feather their nests with grant money.
And a shout out to Mr. Brooks--he's hanging with the Dalai Lama! One cool dude!
3
Civilized discourse: so rare, so appreciated.
4
It's interesting that Arthur Brooks one of the more rational apologists for the GOP is at a loss to come up with a single issue or proposal put forth by Dishonest Donald beyond his ego-driven blather and "Trust me. I know how to do it" rhetoric.
Also, I don't share Mr. Brooks's confidence in Katharine Steven's views which go against the grain of research showing the positive gains in later life among poorer kids who went through the Head Start programs. Once again, we're confronted by the GOP logic of low public spending to vouchsafe tax breaks for the superwealthy.
Also, I don't share Mr. Brooks's confidence in Katharine Steven's views which go against the grain of research showing the positive gains in later life among poorer kids who went through the Head Start programs. Once again, we're confronted by the GOP logic of low public spending to vouchsafe tax breaks for the superwealthy.
5
This column was wasted space. It wasn't even slightly humorous! I'd have rather read an analysis on Paul Ryan's so-called poverty plan. Which is once again as clueless and misguided as his last one! Republicans have made this mess we call the US today. Vote them out in November!!!!!
6
There was Richard Nixon's scandal, then Bill Clinton going on SNL (and subsequent presidents and their spouses going on any show which asks them), then we have all of Hillary's MANY real scandals, then Bill Clinton receiving $16 million from Laureate University/Hillary Clinton's state dept sending $55 million to Laureate founder's groups and receiving millions in donations from him. The Laureate University scandal is certainly as bad if not worse than Trump's problem, but, don't expect an article dedicated to it in the NYT. If I'm wrong, I will gladly apologize. Hopefully it won't be buried somewhere.
4
All commenters agree on Trump's utter lack of dignity. The only way he can redeem himself, even partially, is by winning the nomination on the first ballot at the convention ["I won!"], and then DECLINING the nomination while blaming his problems on others [of course], and just go home [taking all remaining funds with him to pay off his loans to the campaign, naturally]. Good riddance to bad rubbish. Then let Paul Ryan have the nomination and run on his "ideas" -- good luck with that. We will get a competent president, Trump will get a new lucrative TV show -- everyone is happy.
3
Politics wallows in the swamp of 'decontructive information' that bombards us and in the lack of time available for hard working people to gain an understanding of the complexities of governance.
This seems to provide plenty of opportunity for rats and other scavengers to feed. We need to cut back on the rat population, and bring a few more humans into the game.
This seems to provide plenty of opportunity for rats and other scavengers to feed. We need to cut back on the rat population, and bring a few more humans into the game.
2
In 2009 President Obama pushed through a stimulus bill as part of the recovery package, but conservatives (mostly republican) balked at the idea of infrastructure rebuilding and instead wanted stimuli in the form of tax breaks.
A full blown infrastructure rebuild would have been the greatest jobs program in modern history. From "dead end" entry jobs to more skilled labor to engineering and manufacturing jobs we would have seen America get back to work.
Why did that not come to pass, Mr. Brooks? Because your bosses, the koch bothers and their ilk, do not want full employment. Full employment means good paying jobs with benefits. It means labor has the same kind of clout that capital has at the bargaining table. (Your dig at "unionized teachers" says all that is need to say.)
A full blown infrastructure led recovery would have done something else; it would have made it clear that Obama is a great president and the hatred your party has riled up against him would have been blunted. Your party was afraid if he got the credit republicans would be once again out in the cold for the foreseeable future.
Because your party didn't want to share the credit it tilled the soil for the seed that is T rump to sprout and take hold. Had you put his base to work they wouldn't be at his rallies.
A full blown infrastructure rebuild would have been the greatest jobs program in modern history. From "dead end" entry jobs to more skilled labor to engineering and manufacturing jobs we would have seen America get back to work.
Why did that not come to pass, Mr. Brooks? Because your bosses, the koch bothers and their ilk, do not want full employment. Full employment means good paying jobs with benefits. It means labor has the same kind of clout that capital has at the bargaining table. (Your dig at "unionized teachers" says all that is need to say.)
A full blown infrastructure led recovery would have done something else; it would have made it clear that Obama is a great president and the hatred your party has riled up against him would have been blunted. Your party was afraid if he got the credit republicans would be once again out in the cold for the foreseeable future.
Because your party didn't want to share the credit it tilled the soil for the seed that is T rump to sprout and take hold. Had you put his base to work they wouldn't be at his rallies.
13
As the late Senator Daniel Patrick Moynihan said, "Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts." Why would the same Conservatives who supported the Bush stimulus oppose Obama's continuation of the Bush stimulus? Obama's ill fated rhetoric about shovel ready jobs masked the fact that Obama literally copied Bush stimulus proposals from 2007 and made them his own.
I need to repeat this.
Every syllable of the Obama stimulus, in real dollar outlays mimics the Bush stimulus. Obama CONTINUED the Bush stimulus.
It is laughable to watch Obama and his supporters taking victory laps for Obama's imaginary successes while trying to blame the nearest Republicans for the same failed Obama presidency.
I need to repeat this.
Every syllable of the Obama stimulus, in real dollar outlays mimics the Bush stimulus. Obama CONTINUED the Bush stimulus.
It is laughable to watch Obama and his supporters taking victory laps for Obama's imaginary successes while trying to blame the nearest Republicans for the same failed Obama presidency.
4
What? The whole stupidity of the article is encapsulated in the title.
"Left" (and particularly the meaning "Remaining", not "Democrat" as in
Hillary.)
There never, ever, was any dignity in Politics.
"Left" (and particularly the meaning "Remaining", not "Democrat" as in
Hillary.)
There never, ever, was any dignity in Politics.
1
I thought that there would be a discussion about dignity in politics. Did I miss that?
But in the quest for dignity in politics, maybe we should start with a good concept: facts. Once facts are known and accepted, then a dignified conversation can occur. So here's a fact: the minimum wage in 1968 was, in today's dollars, $11.39. Nationwide. And today the federal minimum is still $7.35. Now some prosperous cities (and some states) are raising the minimum wage to a level that is capable of sustaining life, but most have not. So when Ryan hears about "work," he is really hearing about work that earns enough to live on, that is, work with "dignity." Has he addressed that? Nope.
But in the quest for dignity in politics, maybe we should start with a good concept: facts. Once facts are known and accepted, then a dignified conversation can occur. So here's a fact: the minimum wage in 1968 was, in today's dollars, $11.39. Nationwide. And today the federal minimum is still $7.35. Now some prosperous cities (and some states) are raising the minimum wage to a level that is capable of sustaining life, but most have not. So when Ryan hears about "work," he is really hearing about work that earns enough to live on, that is, work with "dignity." Has he addressed that? Nope.
2
So Brooks, Ryan and his conservative friends want more research. This from a party that refuses to accept what is the most researched issue that 98% of qualified experts agree upon, namely the catastrophic impacts and causes of global climate change.
7
I just wanted to mention that jobs are always prominent when it comes to getting off unearned benefits. I think we have our heads in the sand when it comes to convicted criminals. When a criminal is released from jail they will have a hard time getting a job. I think we need to have a pathway for them to get the record clean. They will be committing a crime out of necessity otherwise.
2
When Arthur talks about spending time with the Dalai Lama, I'm reminded of Sam Harris comparing the Dalai Lama meeting with Western thinkers to a nuclear physicist from Cambridge having a dialog with a group of Kalahari Bushman. I wonder if Arthur better comprehends the manifest intellectual inferiority of Conservative thought after a dialogue with a more liberal, enlightened, intellect like the Daiai Lama.
1
We'll well, Mr Brooks, there is a study. It's called Headstart and the positive outcomes among children who attend Headstart are unambiguous. Children even begin kindergarten with higher I.Q's. Having done a therapy group at a Headstart I can tell you, that fabulous program teaches personal hygiene, addresses food insecurity ( Monday morning some children arrive not having eaten oven the weekend) as well as intellectual needs. Want to know why Headstart is so often on the chopping block? Because children lose some of their gains when they leave the program. Does that mean preschool isn't valuable? No, it means we as society are too short sighted to make the investment need in our most valuable resource and our most vulnerable population. Get thee back to the Dali Lama, and think about it again.
6
"a hate crime and terrorism intersecting in one ghastly, pointless tragedy."
All terrorism IS hate crime.
Hate desires another's harm. Vengeance wants to personally inflict the harm--"Make my day," says Dirty Harry.
Sometimes hate is justified--hating Hitler--but only if he/they are beyond redemption. Harming (without killing) others, said Socrates/Plato makes them worse as people. How can that be good for you?
Jesus' "Love your enemies" is a paradox, since "Loving friends and hating enemies" seems a truism.
But enemies (from "in+amicus"--not friendly) hate/want to harm you. But you needn't reciprocate. Instead of hate/harm for hate/harm, you could try to reform your enemies. At least try for peaceful co-existence.
Otherwise it's the pathetic multi-generational hatreds of Hatfields and McCoys--making human-being embarrassing.
Or Sunnis and Shias.
Or Protestants and Catholics (Ireland).
Or Hindus and Muslims.
Or Jews and Muslims.
Or Christians and Muslims.
Terrorists hate others even if they are not hated in return; they vow "Death to [mere] unbelievers."
Why? Merely because disbelief itself is a challenge to orthodoxy--dogmatic belief regardless of evidence.
Hatred (as in misogyny or mis-LGBT) is due to a phobia (as in homophobia). Phobias are irrational fears--fear + hallucinated danger.
The phobias may be suppressed temptations.
Or forms of xenophobia--culture shock + ethnocentrism.
The small minded fear mere difference.
Thus Trump and terrorists.
All terrorism IS hate crime.
Hate desires another's harm. Vengeance wants to personally inflict the harm--"Make my day," says Dirty Harry.
Sometimes hate is justified--hating Hitler--but only if he/they are beyond redemption. Harming (without killing) others, said Socrates/Plato makes them worse as people. How can that be good for you?
Jesus' "Love your enemies" is a paradox, since "Loving friends and hating enemies" seems a truism.
But enemies (from "in+amicus"--not friendly) hate/want to harm you. But you needn't reciprocate. Instead of hate/harm for hate/harm, you could try to reform your enemies. At least try for peaceful co-existence.
Otherwise it's the pathetic multi-generational hatreds of Hatfields and McCoys--making human-being embarrassing.
Or Sunnis and Shias.
Or Protestants and Catholics (Ireland).
Or Hindus and Muslims.
Or Jews and Muslims.
Or Christians and Muslims.
Terrorists hate others even if they are not hated in return; they vow "Death to [mere] unbelievers."
Why? Merely because disbelief itself is a challenge to orthodoxy--dogmatic belief regardless of evidence.
Hatred (as in misogyny or mis-LGBT) is due to a phobia (as in homophobia). Phobias are irrational fears--fear + hallucinated danger.
The phobias may be suppressed temptations.
Or forms of xenophobia--culture shock + ethnocentrism.
The small minded fear mere difference.
Thus Trump and terrorists.
1
Katharine Steven's research and the argument against Head Start from the right is that the gains are lost by 3rd grade. it has always seemed odd to me that one institution could be blamed for the failure of a second institution.
The research shows that students in pre-K who come from lower socio-economics close the gap and then, unfortunately, they are placed into an institution that we have failed to correct-the urban public school. Research, again shows, that if the school has the means and the dedication to invest in structured interventions the gap continues to close. Unfortunately, in many school districts that is not the case.
The research shows that students in pre-K who come from lower socio-economics close the gap and then, unfortunately, they are placed into an institution that we have failed to correct-the urban public school. Research, again shows, that if the school has the means and the dedication to invest in structured interventions the gap continues to close. Unfortunately, in many school districts that is not the case.
6
Yes there is dignity left in politics. That is if Hillary would just get out of the way. With choices like these two in your picture, what are we to do? I certainly don't think the one on the left will win anything.
2
I nearly fell off my chair when I read the phrase "resident AEI expert on this topic." That's all I needed to know to be skeptical of what followed.
5
Yeah. How about talking about how the nature of work is changing? The reason why Obamacare matters, is because millions more will be working Uber type jobs in the future. Huge corporations like GM, that had to spread money around to hundreds of thousands of workers are things of the past. The Huge amounts of money made by Google and Facebook et al. does not a wealthy nation make. We need leaders that can see at least a few years into the future.
2
If work is the answer to poverty, why not take all the "social welfare" money that we throw at the wall and actually create an FDR type jobs program? Let the government actually put people to work for the benefit of the nation. Bring back the CCC and the WPA; the benefits that they provided in real results are still in use today in state parks, small towns, and in our knowledge of what America was like then.
My real question is why the policy makers do not seem to understand that the draft was a huge part in the diminution of inequality in the post WII era? Required military training and service taught discipline, skills, pride and fostered integration. It was the only place that people of all races, national origins and religions not only worked together but had to live together. It may not have functioned perfectly, and it did have flaws that could be exploited, but it seemed to work. We have nothing at all to replace it in today's world, and America and its ideals suffer.
If Pre-K would be good, restoration of the draft would be far better.
Our country is atomized for the benefit of corporations
My real question is why the policy makers do not seem to understand that the draft was a huge part in the diminution of inequality in the post WII era? Required military training and service taught discipline, skills, pride and fostered integration. It was the only place that people of all races, national origins and religions not only worked together but had to live together. It may not have functioned perfectly, and it did have flaws that could be exploited, but it seemed to work. We have nothing at all to replace it in today's world, and America and its ideals suffer.
If Pre-K would be good, restoration of the draft would be far better.
Our country is atomized for the benefit of corporations
4
Isn't it kind of ironic that when asked about the Presidential candidate's policies, the conservative advocate has to default to Paul Ryan, one of the few Republicans who didn't run for President?
And asking about the policies of the presumptive candidate for President is a "trick question?" Isn't it about time he had some?
And asking about the policies of the presumptive candidate for President is a "trick question?" Isn't it about time he had some?
5
When the President endorsed Hillary Clinton it truly became a new low.
ANY boss would have fired an employee who blatantly disregarded policies, endangered national security, disobeyed FOIA requirements, and refused to meet with the Inspector General investigating the situation. Then lied for 18 months to the American people about virtually all of it. Incredulously, he actually then endorses her for a promotion. Go figure.
No, there is no dignity or honor left there. And certainly we don't want 4 more years of lies, gauzy half-truths, and cover up.
Go Bernie.
ANY boss would have fired an employee who blatantly disregarded policies, endangered national security, disobeyed FOIA requirements, and refused to meet with the Inspector General investigating the situation. Then lied for 18 months to the American people about virtually all of it. Incredulously, he actually then endorses her for a promotion. Go figure.
No, there is no dignity or honor left there. And certainly we don't want 4 more years of lies, gauzy half-truths, and cover up.
Go Bernie.
4
Pretty hard to be dignified while trying to support a racist, misogynist, narcissist Presidential candidate while tying yourself in knots to disavow his policies -- such as they are.
As a general comment regarding "poverty" of "anti-poverty" plans: If you formulate a policy of requiring some form of work as a condition for receiving benefits, then you have to assure an adequate supply of jobs in both urban and rural areas. This implies that there must be an employer of last resort. That employer pretty much has to be the Federal Government. Think CCC and WPA modernized to meet the demands of a more complex world.
The concept of "welfare to work" is reasonable only if there is an adequate job supply and support services for families. Tax cuts for the "job creators" simply hasn't created the jobs that are needed. These job creators don't.
As a general comment regarding "poverty" of "anti-poverty" plans: If you formulate a policy of requiring some form of work as a condition for receiving benefits, then you have to assure an adequate supply of jobs in both urban and rural areas. This implies that there must be an employer of last resort. That employer pretty much has to be the Federal Government. Think CCC and WPA modernized to meet the demands of a more complex world.
The concept of "welfare to work" is reasonable only if there is an adequate job supply and support services for families. Tax cuts for the "job creators" simply hasn't created the jobs that are needed. These job creators don't.
64
Three things struck me about this conversation. (1) Brooks' need to shore up his ego by borrowing the Dalai Lama. (2) Brooks take on early childhood education contains the entire Republican problem: If you cannot swallow the elephant in one bite, give up and study the elephant. (3) If humor is indicative of intelligence, Gail is super intelligent.
7
Politics is the only process we have to negotiate the master social contract that provides the framework for all the other contracts we enter into in life.
Too bad most of the money in politics spent to paralyze the process and dis-educate the public.
Too bad most of the money in politics spent to paralyze the process and dis-educate the public.
2
I just discovered this series...a conservative and a progressive civilly discussing issues despite their differing points of view? How refreshing and necessary. College campuses take note.
1
Where did they discuss? It seemed to me that what we read was the social bantering of two "elites" who have know connection to the reality of the common person.
Name-dropping Brooks (the Dalai Lama, please!) really thinks we have to study the advantages of pre-school before we fund it for the poor -- a cynical joke, a dignified way to say no. And to bring up Ryan, whose preschool didn't teach him not to endorse racist presidential candidates! Why does the Times run this column?
5
The left does not want the unemployed to sign on to "dead end jobs"?
Where did this observation come from? And since when is the government responsible for creating jobs? It is Wall Street's demand for profits and the inherent cruelty of capitalism that creates voids in our jobs market as they are moved to lower cost parts of the world to enhance stockholder values, workers be damned.
Pre-K is great but if it does not extend through college for the gifted it means little. A good start needs to be followed with a good ending.
Where did this observation come from? And since when is the government responsible for creating jobs? It is Wall Street's demand for profits and the inherent cruelty of capitalism that creates voids in our jobs market as they are moved to lower cost parts of the world to enhance stockholder values, workers be damned.
Pre-K is great but if it does not extend through college for the gifted it means little. A good start needs to be followed with a good ending.
1
The old joke was that 'politics is show business for ugly people.' Now it's just ugly.
4
Elsewhere in the paper today, Mark Leibovich summarizes Speaker Ryan's anti-poverty plan like this: "...lower taxes, entitlement reform, less regulation..." I don't know if Mr. Brooks's resident expert on the economics of poverty has done a thorough study of the efficacy of this policy on the poor, but I can see at a glance how beneficial such a policy on poverty would be for the rich.
4
I did more and contributed more to Bernie Sanders campaign than to any other in the 55 odd years I've participated in political campaigns. I don't know if any of the other campaigns maintained their dignity, but I sure as hell know that Bernie has maintained it fully all the way from the announcement speech in Burlington last spring to the issues he plans to bring to our convention in Philadelphia last month. Dignity, trust and credibility are intrinsically intertwined in just a few of the best political candidates. Bernie's score with these three attributes far exceeds of all other candidates in this year's presidential race and the polls about character and honesty reflect this.
3
"...they argue that people shouldn’t be forced to take “dead-end jobs,” implying they are less dignified than joblessness."
Or perhaps you've willfully misunderstood the argument: When you are insisting that large numbers of educated/experienced people take jobs that don't use that education/experience, something is really wrong.
What's the good of saying that people should "get an education" to "better themselves" if too many of those who are already educated are wasted in low-level labor? Why does our society have so many service jobs now and not enough higher-level positions any more? Doesn't that say something very, very concerning about what we're becoming as a nation?
Or perhaps you've willfully misunderstood the argument: When you are insisting that large numbers of educated/experienced people take jobs that don't use that education/experience, something is really wrong.
What's the good of saying that people should "get an education" to "better themselves" if too many of those who are already educated are wasted in low-level labor? Why does our society have so many service jobs now and not enough higher-level positions any more? Doesn't that say something very, very concerning about what we're becoming as a nation?
2
Is there dignity in work? I agree there is, but not when "work" consists of slave wages, grossly insufficient to allow a person to feed his or her family and retain that sense of dignity. I have always taught my children that "there are no dumb jobs, only dumb people". However, after more than thirty years of Ayn Rand-like policies by the likes of Paul Ryan and his corporate masters, I am ready to concede that I may have been wrong.
Drastically reduce wealth inequality, force companies to pay a living wage, invest in a massive re-building of our country's infrastructure that puts people to work at decent wages, and make work "dignified again". Are you hearing us Mrs. Clinton?
Drastically reduce wealth inequality, force companies to pay a living wage, invest in a massive re-building of our country's infrastructure that puts people to work at decent wages, and make work "dignified again". Are you hearing us Mrs. Clinton?
57
Not only is there no dignity left in politics, there's no dignified way left to discuss it. Any cursory glance at the comments section, or social media will readily attest to that.
It's bad enough that a candidate as unqualified and mean-spirited as Donald Trump is now in the running for the White House, but do we all really have to be dragged down to his level?
It's bad enough that a candidate as unqualified and mean-spirited as Donald Trump is now in the running for the White House, but do we all really have to be dragged down to his level?
3
Brooks, even if we accept your claim that the jury is still out on the efficacy of preschool for children, there's no question regarding its effect on parents: it allows them to work. Given your feelings about the intrinsic virtue if work, isn't that motivation enough?
5
Dignity? Hardley!
(1) - When an individual vying for the highest job in the land asks for money to malign his opponent is akin to having a weapon and calling a friend to "bring the bullets" to the gunfight. Both are despicable. But, to respond to the 100K request is even worse.
(2) Emotions Potions
To "make America great again"--oh what a noble notion;
so, why's the pathway overwrought with divisiveness, conflict and commotion?
Instead co-mingle, cast elegant quests full of fun without regret;
create opportunity, to reap rewards so that basic needs of all are met
Escape to humanity's next great step on every face a grin
experience your power to change our world, for the epic win.
Skip the Toxic Emotions Potion
In the Highest Vibration of Love
--Kween Kleokatra
(1) - When an individual vying for the highest job in the land asks for money to malign his opponent is akin to having a weapon and calling a friend to "bring the bullets" to the gunfight. Both are despicable. But, to respond to the 100K request is even worse.
(2) Emotions Potions
To "make America great again"--oh what a noble notion;
so, why's the pathway overwrought with divisiveness, conflict and commotion?
Instead co-mingle, cast elegant quests full of fun without regret;
create opportunity, to reap rewards so that basic needs of all are met
Escape to humanity's next great step on every face a grin
experience your power to change our world, for the epic win.
Skip the Toxic Emotions Potion
In the Highest Vibration of Love
--Kween Kleokatra
1
The short answer to the question:
Is There Any Dignity Left in Politics?
is no, but honestly was there ever any?
Mr. Smith was a character in a movie, he did not really ever exist.
Is There Any Dignity Left in Politics?
is no, but honestly was there ever any?
Mr. Smith was a character in a movie, he did not really ever exist.
1
The problem with dead end jobs is that there aren't enough non-dead end jobs out there for folks to move to -- that's what makes them dead end jobs in the first place.
3
There doesn't seem to be any dignity left in media, et alone politics. People study and refine their skills and have to write about Trump. That has got to be pretty unpleasant unless you write for Vanity Fair or a gossip rag. You have my sympathies, for sure.
I don't really think there is anything left to say about the race as the difference in the candidates is so stark. I don't plan on spending my summer reading about, or debating, people who are never going to concede any clear fact let alone be persuaded to a new idea (like thinking about somebody other than their own ego). What I can do is make it safe for thinking people to join in electing the only real option, Hillary Clinton. And that is pleasure with dignity intact.
That click you just heard was me turning the channel.
I don't really think there is anything left to say about the race as the difference in the candidates is so stark. I don't plan on spending my summer reading about, or debating, people who are never going to concede any clear fact let alone be persuaded to a new idea (like thinking about somebody other than their own ego). What I can do is make it safe for thinking people to join in electing the only real option, Hillary Clinton. And that is pleasure with dignity intact.
That click you just heard was me turning the channel.
Arthur Brooks writes, "You can tell the “punishment” crowd on the left when they argue that people shouldn’t be forced to take “dead-end jobs,” implying they are less dignified than joblessness." I don't think he understands what a dead-end job is. It has nothing t do with the dignity or attractiveness of the work being performed. A dead end job is a job which does not pay enough to live on - to afford food, housing, clothing, health care and the ability to educate your children; which offers no avenue for advancement; and yet which demands so much of your time and energy that you have none left for training to find a better job.
That's what makes it a dead end. And if it leaves you in poverty, with no time and energy to give your kids the attention they need, thus blighting their chances for a better life, and prevents you from reaching a stable secure life -- yes, it's worse than temporary joblessness.
That's the distinction the left sees between dead end jobs and jobs which pay a living wage.
That's what makes it a dead end. And if it leaves you in poverty, with no time and energy to give your kids the attention they need, thus blighting their chances for a better life, and prevents you from reaching a stable secure life -- yes, it's worse than temporary joblessness.
That's the distinction the left sees between dead end jobs and jobs which pay a living wage.
94
Maybe, but there is a lot of irony. Watching this election cycle has been a dream come true for comedians, as well as for the Democratic Party. The GOP after almost 8 years of bashing Obama, with help from FOX news and fiends, have turned the GOP into little more than a reactionary group frightened of modernity. After winning the House and Senate in 2012, by 2016 the bet they can come with is Trump. This is the new face of the GOP, unmasked and seen for the hypocrisy they now represent. On the other hand, Mrs. Clinton is certainly the most prepared and qualified, and that is her biggest sin. She, being the wife of a former president and having served as Sec of State, she's been involved in politics for a while. So experience is actually her biggest detriment because, the GOP/Fox news clan have vilified her or years. And we all know, if you repeat a lie long enough, many will come to believe it. That's the biggest reason for her unpopularity, and the biggest irony of our time. In running for president in the US, experience is generally considered a detriment, or insider. The election of 2016 will probably have a low voter turn out, but Mrs. Clinton will most likely prevail.
2
Ryan wants to kill Social Security and every environmental and consumer protection ever enacted. He is actually worse than trump.
5
These discussions are really one of the highlights of my week. It gives me hope that reasonable people on opposite sides of the political spectrum can sit down and hold a civil discussion without talking points, name calling, and dog whistles.
Perhaps we could take members of Congress and pair them off and force them to hold similar conversations with their adversaries each week. Maybe they'd actually start working again for the good of the country rather than for the perceived good of their respective parties. What has the current system gotten them? Gridlock and an approval rating lower than cockroaches.
Perhaps we could take members of Congress and pair them off and force them to hold similar conversations with their adversaries each week. Maybe they'd actually start working again for the good of the country rather than for the perceived good of their respective parties. What has the current system gotten them? Gridlock and an approval rating lower than cockroaches.
2
Getting work for the poor is great, but "workfare" of the 1990s ended up (in at least one instance) a situation where a woman was fired from her job, couldn't find another, got welfare benefits and then was sent back to the agency that had fired her as her workfare assignment. So in that case, the taxpayers were in effect subsidizing the day-to-day operating costs of a business.
2
Whenever I see any proposal from Paul Ryan, even if it is about poverty, my first question is, "who's going to get rich off this?"
This is man who wants to rip insurance away from 20 million Americans by repealing ACA but not having any other workable plan.
This is man who wants to rip insurance away from 20 million Americans by repealing ACA but not having any other workable plan.
4
Mr. Brooks' commented "You can tell the 'punishment' crowd on the left when they argue that people shouldn’t be forced to take “dead-end jobs.” I consider myself to be distinctly left of center, assuming that I or anyone else can be packaged neatly into an ideological box, but frankly I hear virtually nothing about or from any 'punishment' crowd.
Most people want to work; fully, safely, with a decent living wage without the accurate sense that they're being stiffed as human chattel to feed the obscene wealth that today characterizes the top of the American economic pyramid. Most leftists honor the dignity of work, desiring all willing citizens to participate in such dignity.
I have avoided redundantly addressing the "dignity of politics" here because the current political carnival is speaking so elegantly for itself.
www.endthemadnessnow.org
Most people want to work; fully, safely, with a decent living wage without the accurate sense that they're being stiffed as human chattel to feed the obscene wealth that today characterizes the top of the American economic pyramid. Most leftists honor the dignity of work, desiring all willing citizens to participate in such dignity.
I have avoided redundantly addressing the "dignity of politics" here because the current political carnival is speaking so elegantly for itself.
www.endthemadnessnow.org
3
"Dalai" is Mongolic word meaning "ocean" and the Tibetan word lama meaning "guru, teacher, mentor".
The Dalai Lama ... and the Dollar Lama (Arthur Brooks).....together.....what an obscene conflation of lightness and darkness.
The Dalai Lama ... and the Dollar Lama (Arthur Brooks).....together.....what an obscene conflation of lightness and darkness.
20
Kudos to Gail Collins for avoiding the cliche that she is "standing on the shoulders of giants!"
2
Dignity?? In politics ?? What am I reading? The National Lampoon or Mad Magazine? C'mon, NYT.....get serious........
1
What is the cost benefit relationship between high quality pre-K and investing in vocational training? In a digital world, while many jobs are either being outsourced or replaced by robots, tradesmen seem to be in a pretty good place.
2
Time's awasting folks. While Mr. Brooks waits for the patiently results of a granular scrutiny of the benefits of pre-K, cohorts of four year olds are losing a foothold in the future. With no increase in the minimum wage, those same kids and their families will suffer from food insecurity. If they are unlucky enough to live in a red state that declines Medicaid, they won't have adequate health care. Out here in the burbs, preschool is a given, as are fine pediatricians, and plenty of groceries. Jobs are great, but the quality of childhood sure makes a difference in which ones you're likely to get. I think Brooks needs a longer session with the Dalai Lama -- this one didn't take.
9
Perhaps journalists....need to respect what the word dignity is...
so
Gail...and Arthur ....just think about what dignifies your words when you write.
I would like you two to......think before you write....as any professor would.
as Willard Strunk would....go back to class...and think....childishness is not
appealing...that is what tabloids do...what children think and do...
so
Gail...and Arthur ....just think about what dignifies your words when you write.
I would like you two to......think before you write....as any professor would.
as Willard Strunk would....go back to class...and think....childishness is not
appealing...that is what tabloids do...what children think and do...
2
The squalor of Trump dominates the conversation -- it cannot be disposed of, until he is disposed of.
6
Opining on dignity in politics after Bill and Hillary Clinton have been in it is about as Germain as decrying the fact that bacteria now grow in the still water pool has become a cesspool because they keep defalcating in it.
Were it not for the precedents set by those two greed-mongers posing as social reformers and social dividers like Barack and Michelle might never have come to pass.
A noble instinct of the United States citizenry gone terribly wrong to the benefit of only the generation-ally wealthy and their cronies.The sadist part is the continuing exploitation and support from the media.
Were it not for the precedents set by those two greed-mongers posing as social reformers and social dividers like Barack and Michelle might never have come to pass.
A noble instinct of the United States citizenry gone terribly wrong to the benefit of only the generation-ally wealthy and their cronies.The sadist part is the continuing exploitation and support from the media.
3
Mr. Brooks: Will you or will you not be voting for Donald Trump in November?
What policy positions could possibly ameliorate his sexism, racism and religious bigotry? Lower taxes on the rich? Starvation wages for many of the jobs in the economy? Carpet bombing the Middle East?
Do you talk to Norm Ornstein anymore? He's quite clear when he states the problem with our politics is the take no prisoners Republican Party of our way or nothing. Trump is that on steroids.
What could you possibly be waiting for, except maybe a backbone?
What policy positions could possibly ameliorate his sexism, racism and religious bigotry? Lower taxes on the rich? Starvation wages for many of the jobs in the economy? Carpet bombing the Middle East?
Do you talk to Norm Ornstein anymore? He's quite clear when he states the problem with our politics is the take no prisoners Republican Party of our way or nothing. Trump is that on steroids.
What could you possibly be waiting for, except maybe a backbone?
3
Is There Any Dignity Left in Journalism?
“Here are some startling facts about how Americans relate to their own country: Sixty percent believe the American Dream is out of reach for themselves and their children, and 40 percent of Americans aged eighteen to twenty-four believe they will need to migrate abroad in search for work.” Parag Khanna, Connectography: Mapping the Future of Global Civilization
Could you two at some point connect to the country you live in? There are issues unending concerning where America has gone in the last 30 years that are worthy of your time; but admittedly difficult to joke about. Time some for your own sake and ours.
“Here are some startling facts about how Americans relate to their own country: Sixty percent believe the American Dream is out of reach for themselves and their children, and 40 percent of Americans aged eighteen to twenty-four believe they will need to migrate abroad in search for work.” Parag Khanna, Connectography: Mapping the Future of Global Civilization
Could you two at some point connect to the country you live in? There are issues unending concerning where America has gone in the last 30 years that are worthy of your time; but admittedly difficult to joke about. Time some for your own sake and ours.
5
Who is against work and education? How about Paul Ryan and all the disingenuous Republicans that this Brooks guy (which Brooks is he again?) fronts for if they cost a dime in tax money? How stupid does AEI think we all are? Yes, let's continue to do nothing, spend nothing and then complain that the "research" isn't there yet. It's not biased research that's lacking, it's good faith. Is he writing with a straight face that he can't wait to dig into those meaty Trump policies just as soon as those hundred page white papers start hitting Trump's website? For Brooks to play the false equivalence card about Trump and Clinton policies or complain about "some" on the left is the kind of shop worn sophistry that we shouldn't have to tolerate. AEI claims to be "non-partisan." I guess neocons do have a sense of humor. Is this really the best the Times can do for someone for Gail to talk to?
5
The NY Times editorial policy should be that columnists must read the comments to their columns. Not only might they be exposed contrarian views but they also may discover that there are "civilians" out there that can write with equal aplomb to themselves, that theirs is not exactly the exalted pinnacle they assume to be in the grand scale of things.
1
Yes, there is most definitely dignity in politics, and it is being exhibited in superb fashion by Hillary Clinton. She is already leading the nation by example. Hillary's calm composure and reassurance in her speeches during times of crisis has been exemplary. She has long suffered the slings and arrows of her foes, a list of enemies far and wide who have attempted to destroy her. Their obsessions having mushroomed into certifiable psychosis.
Yet through it all Hillary has maintained her dignity under the most dire circumstances. She has taken all that has been thrown at her. Through it all she still remains standing. She is someone who I want to lead this nation. Like President Obama, I want a president who, like JFK, is the epitome of grace under pressure, a steady hand at the helm, a person who keeps his head while those around him are losing theirs.
Yes, Gail, there is dignity in politics. It exists as surely as all those people out there across the country get up every day and go about their business, doing good honest work, being good citizens. What may surprise some Americans is that many of those folks work in Washington DC and in state and local governments. They are all those folks you never hear of because they are doing their jobs, with dignity, and no thanks. But then if thanks is what they're looking for, government would not be the choice of one's profession.
DD
Manhattan
Yet through it all Hillary has maintained her dignity under the most dire circumstances. She has taken all that has been thrown at her. Through it all she still remains standing. She is someone who I want to lead this nation. Like President Obama, I want a president who, like JFK, is the epitome of grace under pressure, a steady hand at the helm, a person who keeps his head while those around him are losing theirs.
Yes, Gail, there is dignity in politics. It exists as surely as all those people out there across the country get up every day and go about their business, doing good honest work, being good citizens. What may surprise some Americans is that many of those folks work in Washington DC and in state and local governments. They are all those folks you never hear of because they are doing their jobs, with dignity, and no thanks. But then if thanks is what they're looking for, government would not be the choice of one's profession.
DD
Manhattan
102
"Katharine Stevens, our resident AEI expert on this topic, studies the actual results of these programs. She finds that so far, the research is simply insufficient to justify huge long-term investments that would set us in one direction for decades."
So . . . if the research is insufficient, how does Ms. Stevens come to a conclusion?
That dog don't hunt.
So . . . if the research is insufficient, how does Ms. Stevens come to a conclusion?
That dog don't hunt.
7
Arthur Brooks runs down the idea of subsidized pre-K available to all, claiming it doesn't work, but doesn't present a real "conservative solution" to the problem. How many generations of experiments will it take for the AEI to see what is obvious? They want the single moms to work. Who is going to take care of their kids? He clearly lacks compassion even while he talks up the Dalai Lama.
6
Again both of you miss the point on work. talking to people out of work to see what they want is work is a no-brainer. How about talking to people who work and still cannot make ends meet? It is propaganda put forth to garner disrespect of the kind of work you do so billion dollar corporations can pay you less while using welfare as part of your compensation program that is the problem in the US. Working people should be able to live without government assistance and billion dollar companies should be able to pay their employees a livable wage and not use government subsidies as part of their compensation programs. Either you are against welfare or for it you cannot pay off a Congress to push people off welfare while using it to compensate your employees.
The trickery used by the elite is no longer playing with the public. We see through you both Gail and Arthur and the powers that push you to this nonsense of an article. Billion dollar companies do not need our tax dollars. Our schools, infrastructure and government offices need it to make America the thriving country for all it use to be.
The Sanders revolution is not dead. We know revolutions take time. And in fact we know that the Trump followers have more in common with us than the Reps or Dems. We will bide our time, We will work towards our goals. Rome wasn't built in a day or even one election cycle.
The trickery used by the elite is no longer playing with the public. We see through you both Gail and Arthur and the powers that push you to this nonsense of an article. Billion dollar companies do not need our tax dollars. Our schools, infrastructure and government offices need it to make America the thriving country for all it use to be.
The Sanders revolution is not dead. We know revolutions take time. And in fact we know that the Trump followers have more in common with us than the Reps or Dems. We will bide our time, We will work towards our goals. Rome wasn't built in a day or even one election cycle.
19
Thank you. I was just about to ask how/why the NYT would allow two educated people to spend so many column inches on a myth that has long been debunked. The vast majority of people on government assistance work.
The conversation should be why do employees of corporate giants that continue to make record profits qualify for government assistance?
If we are going to have a serious conversation about work ethic it should be revolving around our representatives who work fewer and fewer days each year.
The conversation should be why do employees of corporate giants that continue to make record profits qualify for government assistance?
If we are going to have a serious conversation about work ethic it should be revolving around our representatives who work fewer and fewer days each year.
9
I have not read Ryan's proposals. This little summary and debate is all I have to go on, but I have a comment:
1) Actual good paying work without education is becoming a rare commodity. Good paying manufacturing jobs are not coming back in the large numbers that would save the middle class. A healthy middle class is essential for stable society.
2) Labor costs are set by market forces, supply and demand. Low labor costs and exploitation of labor is a feature of low margin business, so a minimum wage is tough for business.
3) Entrepreneurial business would be promising if everyone could be involved, but 50% fail. So labor is necessary.
4) Education is appealing but what if we had 50 times more engineers?
5) The world has changed and we may have to reevaluate our social contract. Income inequality seems to violate that contract. The current imperfect solutions are either tax the rich or prop up the poor. If Ryan's plan is to expand business to provide more jobs and thus mitigate maldistribution of income, it has some real theoretical problems that I outlined above.
6) We need to have a real discussion about how to solve this problem. That will require that we actually have civil civic discourse.
1) Actual good paying work without education is becoming a rare commodity. Good paying manufacturing jobs are not coming back in the large numbers that would save the middle class. A healthy middle class is essential for stable society.
2) Labor costs are set by market forces, supply and demand. Low labor costs and exploitation of labor is a feature of low margin business, so a minimum wage is tough for business.
3) Entrepreneurial business would be promising if everyone could be involved, but 50% fail. So labor is necessary.
4) Education is appealing but what if we had 50 times more engineers?
5) The world has changed and we may have to reevaluate our social contract. Income inequality seems to violate that contract. The current imperfect solutions are either tax the rich or prop up the poor. If Ryan's plan is to expand business to provide more jobs and thus mitigate maldistribution of income, it has some real theoretical problems that I outlined above.
6) We need to have a real discussion about how to solve this problem. That will require that we actually have civil civic discourse.
12
I never thought I could honestly say the following: Arthur Brooks is absolutely correct - David Amran wrote a wonderful score for "The Manchurian Candidate". Even a stopped clock...
7
There is something about these right wing types and the music they love (David Brooks and Chris Christie going wild over Bruce Springsteen) that touches some part of their soul but not any part of their social imagination.
5
Not a word about our decade long Trillion Dollar Oil Wars? There seems to be an agreement among Politicians, Pundits and the denizens of Think Tanks not to mention the Wars that just seem to keep going and going and going.
Could we have an "Arthur & Gail Show" dedicated to the Wars, why we are fighting them and what are our goals from them?
Being witty about a million dead and millions displaced and no realistic end in sight would be difficult but I'm sure you two can handle it, your both very good at dignified debate.
Could we have an "Arthur & Gail Show" dedicated to the Wars, why we are fighting them and what are our goals from them?
Being witty about a million dead and millions displaced and no realistic end in sight would be difficult but I'm sure you two can handle it, your both very good at dignified debate.
20
It is said that even a blind squrel occasionally finds an acorn, and a stopped clock is right twice a day. So give Fox News some credit.
Last week their evening anchor, Bret Baer, interviewed the Dali Lama. After discussing religion, Chinese communism and the like, Baer asked the Lama if he played golf. "No," said the Lama.
"I heard you were a big hitter off the tee" said Baer.
The Lama just looked bewildered.
"I just had to ask," said Baer.
This exchange amused me to no end. To understand it, you have to have seen Bill Murray's performance in the film "Caddyshack" (1980).
Last week their evening anchor, Bret Baer, interviewed the Dali Lama. After discussing religion, Chinese communism and the like, Baer asked the Lama if he played golf. "No," said the Lama.
"I heard you were a big hitter off the tee" said Baer.
The Lama just looked bewildered.
"I just had to ask," said Baer.
This exchange amused me to no end. To understand it, you have to have seen Bill Murray's performance in the film "Caddyshack" (1980).
4
"Katharine Stevens, our resident AEI expert on this topic, studies the actual results of these programs. She finds that so far, the research is simply insufficient to justify huge long-term investments that would set us in one direction for decades."
How lovely to be so circumspect on education for children. What a shame your party wasn't so vigilant before it rushed into Iraq. An action that did nothing for anyone but the 1%.
How lovely to be so circumspect on education for children. What a shame your party wasn't so vigilant before it rushed into Iraq. An action that did nothing for anyone but the 1%.
26
Good point. When it blowing billions on war, thrusting young Americans into harm's way a quick, reckless "let's go". But nurturing our American children - the costs are prohibitive. "Let's study this some more before we spend $". Makes for a little cynicism Art.
6
Oh, please, the Dalai Lama .
come on let's just slip his name in and then
we can say whatever and people will think we really care
and add the Manchurian Candidate and David Amram
so we are smart
let's just call it all crazy
"Really,Gail? A hand -size joke"
How about dignity in journalism
Clinton, Trump, Brooks, Collins
will all be at the Waldorf Astoria
attending the "fundraiser for
the Dalai Lama "
just showing how out of touch
you both are with the struggle of most
Americans . It is not a comedy sketch
to get paid for.
come on let's just slip his name in and then
we can say whatever and people will think we really care
and add the Manchurian Candidate and David Amram
so we are smart
let's just call it all crazy
"Really,Gail? A hand -size joke"
How about dignity in journalism
Clinton, Trump, Brooks, Collins
will all be at the Waldorf Astoria
attending the "fundraiser for
the Dalai Lama "
just showing how out of touch
you both are with the struggle of most
Americans . It is not a comedy sketch
to get paid for.
12
The number one concern of American politicians is money, and how to get enough of it for election and re-election.
Because of this, we have the best Congress money can buy.
Needless to say, dignity in politics and bought and paid for politicians go together like oil and water.
Only in America.
Because of this, we have the best Congress money can buy.
Needless to say, dignity in politics and bought and paid for politicians go together like oil and water.
Only in America.
13
Is there any dignity left in politics? Yes, when President Obama is speaking. He and Mrs. Obama and their family have been the embodiment of grace under pressure. I will miss them but I wish them happiness in their life after the White House. Would that we could look forward to another such First Family.
60
Brooks' "dignity" here seems more a dogwhistle for WASP, male at that. He needs more precision in his language, less skirting of the issues. Ideology is an enemy of thought.
6
Dignity? Politics? No. Simply, no.
And the sad thing, we did it to ourselves.
And the sad thing, we did it to ourselves.
5
Oh my how Very Victorian.. Does anyone there have any knowledge of history.. There was NEVER any "dignity in politics".. People always accused each other of horrible things or in the past actually poisoned their political rivals-- that could be called premeditated murder -- like war done for the good of whom?
Just more Times silliness. BTW which is better closing the borders or bombing the Syrians to smithereens? Your call. Consider all of the alternatives. (I fear this latest call to action is just a way to get Hillary's warmongering approved before she is elected... )
Just more Times silliness. BTW which is better closing the borders or bombing the Syrians to smithereens? Your call. Consider all of the alternatives. (I fear this latest call to action is just a way to get Hillary's warmongering approved before she is elected... )
7
The republican poverty plan (shouldn't that be ANTI-poverty?) doesn't include a minimum wage increase. Ryan has specifically stated that he is against it. A poverty plan indeed.
36
To have dignity in politics, we would need dignified people. There seems to be a shortage of those types. America specializes in producing semi illiterates, who can shoot a gun, though. Good for going to war and for the gun industry, whether it be wartime or peace. What is it about a country that is unable to give up one of their toys to save lives?
21
The whole stinking political process in the US is anything but an equitable negotiation of a social contract. It is lies and cheating from A to Z.
9
The sand sculpture faces look like Jennifer Grey on "Dancing with the Stars" and George W. Bush.
1
And, it includes the Capitol building. Not the White House.
Brooks is a typical Republican. They just focus on the bottom line to the exclusion of everything else, including the welfare of the people. Paul Ryan has a plan to help impoverished people? I doubt that. It would cost money.
12
If the gloves are too large, you must be Trump!
3
Gail, that second mouse is the one who steps around the first mouse and gets the cheese. Unless the second mouse is named Bernie Sanders.
Bernie is still the most intriguing aspect of the 2016 campaign. Hillary Clinton cannot articulate policy and speak with Bernie's fervor and intensity. Donald Trump cannot get beyond the insults and hatred. There won't be much to talk about other than Trump's boorishness.
That surely makes for boring conversations.
Bernie is still the most intriguing aspect of the 2016 campaign. Hillary Clinton cannot articulate policy and speak with Bernie's fervor and intensity. Donald Trump cannot get beyond the insults and hatred. There won't be much to talk about other than Trump's boorishness.
That surely makes for boring conversations.
6
Dignity? Lusting after money has no dignity - or morals for that matter. The Republican Party protects the big money element in our national psyche. We all fantasize about getting rich quick and we have a peculiar trait of living our pathetic lives surreptitiously via our "stars." We are a sad people and the fact that our government has been turned into a money making machine is tragic. It's the manifestation of who we really are, money hungry people, turned thus because of our precarious life with little security. How did individualism turn into solipsistic narcissism?
7
Until we get a grip on the idea we need to move our empire away from its financialized and fossil fuel basis, we will not get anywhere. The lies being fomented at the highest levels, boggles the mind. It's why thousands and thousands have shown up to Sander's rallies. People know it's a sham. A lot of people KNOW it's a sham. But the spin continues. Election fraud remains hidden by the establishment and the police are militarized a plenty. Dignity? When the Supreme Court takes away our constitutional rights as it just did, there is nothing left but revolt. Americans will march and be peaceful, because they believe they will be heard, but that has never mattered before. Classically, violence will be fomented as an excuse to call them radicals and put down the dissent. It has happened over and over here and throughout the world. Now that is a loss of dignity! I'm not advocating revolt. I'm just observing it's highly likely based on such a ruling as just happened. Unless we as citizens speak out about what's happening, however, we will lose what ever rights and democracy we have left. Power doesn't give up easily under any circumstance.
13
Collins cracking her usual jokes and Brooks making even funnier claims about how statesmanlike Paul Ryan is. If there's any dignity left in politics it doesn't appear in this column.
16
Dignity in politics? Yes. After all, Politics is the art of the possible. What we are witnessing is "politicking", the lying and obstructing and insulting by thuggish 'entrepreneurs' ready and willing to sell you their mother if they had to...for personal gain; and for your irredeemable loss.
6
What a sanctimonious contribution by Collins to a dialog in search of the answer to the Dignity question.
She's been irritating people for her entire era of pusillanimous progressive punditry.
Ask the Dalai Lama, Gail! How can I bring peace and progress to politics? Show him some of your many demeaning columns. Bring a notepad. Write it down. Help restore diginity to politics instead of more dumbing-down.
She's been irritating people for her entire era of pusillanimous progressive punditry.
Ask the Dalai Lama, Gail! How can I bring peace and progress to politics? Show him some of your many demeaning columns. Bring a notepad. Write it down. Help restore diginity to politics instead of more dumbing-down.
4
Lake Woebegone - are you ready to embrace the Dalai Lama's embrace of Marxism?
5
Gail Collins is performing a time-honored service: Speaking truth to power. She pokes holes in dangerously inflated egos. She points out the contradictions fulminating from the podium. When the emperor strolls forth in his birthday suit, she is the kid who loudly states the obvious.
We need someone to do this. And Gail does it very, very well.
We need someone to do this. And Gail does it very, very well.
16
Dear L.W.:
Ask the Dalai Lama? I'd loved to but first I have to give him some money to hear his words of wisdom, whereas when I need some solace or have questions of a philosophical nature I can simply go see my local parish priest, and consult with him in private for free. So much for the for-profit Holy Man. The D.L. brings in more cash than Hillary on a good day.
DD
Manhattan
Ask the Dalai Lama? I'd loved to but first I have to give him some money to hear his words of wisdom, whereas when I need some solace or have questions of a philosophical nature I can simply go see my local parish priest, and consult with him in private for free. So much for the for-profit Holy Man. The D.L. brings in more cash than Hillary on a good day.
DD
Manhattan
1
"I especially like last week's poverty proposals, and think they are superior to what the Democrats have been doing." --ACB
You mean the one the NYT Editorial Board describes in their Sunday Review on June 19th as, "...57 pages boil down to one idea: Roll back hundreds of federal regulations that protect consumers, investors, employees, borrowers, students and the environment ...the Ryan plan is not, in other words, an economic agenda. It is a corporate wish list and a catalog of House Republicans' fantasies."
Mr. Brooks, do us all a favor and tell us next week what the Dalai Lama's take on the Ryan Plan is. Hard to believe you two are on speaking terms.
You mean the one the NYT Editorial Board describes in their Sunday Review on June 19th as, "...57 pages boil down to one idea: Roll back hundreds of federal regulations that protect consumers, investors, employees, borrowers, students and the environment ...the Ryan plan is not, in other words, an economic agenda. It is a corporate wish list and a catalog of House Republicans' fantasies."
Mr. Brooks, do us all a favor and tell us next week what the Dalai Lama's take on the Ryan Plan is. Hard to believe you two are on speaking terms.
107
I was curious when both Gail and Brooks lamented the long election season ahead without saying what could be done about it.
Maybe the next few months they could discuss the Dalai Lama's take on compassion and dignity. For those on lower rungs of our caste systems.
Maybe Brooks will enlighten US with the reasons his party refused to budge on infrastructure spending. Or the question of terrorist watch list suspects being able to buy military assault weapons. WMDs.
He could even just give one hint as to how the response to the Orlando tragedy was politicized by both parties.
Or he could just take his pencil and go away.
Maybe the next few months they could discuss the Dalai Lama's take on compassion and dignity. For those on lower rungs of our caste systems.
Maybe Brooks will enlighten US with the reasons his party refused to budge on infrastructure spending. Or the question of terrorist watch list suspects being able to buy military assault weapons. WMDs.
He could even just give one hint as to how the response to the Orlando tragedy was politicized by both parties.
Or he could just take his pencil and go away.
4
Brooks is certainly enthusiastic about research except when it comes to Unions. He continues to propagate the economic elites' lies and distortions about the role of these working and middle class institutions. Research clearly indicates that those nations with strong union movements outpace the USA in all quality of life issues. And they are crucial for limiting inequality and sustaining robust democracies.
52
AND I'd bet guns though it's not discussed here.
1
The so-called "new poverty ideas" to which this piece links talks about the "ideas" put forth in the report issued by a report issued by the Republicans in Congress. The Times article doesn't link to the actuat "report" but it can be found here. http://abetterway.speaker.gov/_assets/pdf/ABetterWay-Poverty-PolicyPaper...
If you actually read the "report" a look beneath the poll-tested pablum and spin reveals breathtaking dishonesty. For example:
"[The] 2008 Emergency Unemployment Compensation program. ...created a disincentive for states to help unemployed people return to work."
Anyone with a memory knows that in 2008 massive numbers of Americans were losing their jobs and nobody was "returning to work."
I could point out other examples of how dishonest this "report" is, but then again being a journalist and educating the public isn't my job.
If you actually read the "report" a look beneath the poll-tested pablum and spin reveals breathtaking dishonesty. For example:
"[The] 2008 Emergency Unemployment Compensation program. ...created a disincentive for states to help unemployed people return to work."
Anyone with a memory knows that in 2008 massive numbers of Americans were losing their jobs and nobody was "returning to work."
I could point out other examples of how dishonest this "report" is, but then again being a journalist and educating the public isn't my job.
26
Name-dropping the Dalai Lama and David Amram in the same column. Virtuoso! But how do we know Gail isn't cigar-smoking and hard-drinking? A sexist assumption?
3
Am I the only one who sees the irony in this conversation. Yes, work is good. It gives structure to lives, provides a sense of satisfaction and camaraderie with fellow workers. That may change just a bit when people have to struggle with child care, transportation and very low pay. Not to mention difficult working conditions. Those terrible unions....
I'm wondering when someone will start pointing out that perhaps the teachers' unions are the only force that might create conditions that would attract capable young people into the profession. It's not like the good old days when educated women had few other choices. I believe there is some evidence that places like Kansas that have been particularly punitive to teachers are having a hard time filling positions.
Then we might mention the differences between the women who are breaking that glass ceiling and the women who are working at the bottom of the heap. Nannies, cleaners, cooks or Blue Apron facilitate work as people rise in the hierarchy.
We might also think about the people who staff the early education programs. Are they analogous to the women who have left their own children to help rear the children of the richer? We might wonder if one of the flaws in early childhood education might be the very low pay and the lack of respect educators at that level endure. You can't just collect data and hold people accountable assuming there's a level playing field.
I'm wondering when someone will start pointing out that perhaps the teachers' unions are the only force that might create conditions that would attract capable young people into the profession. It's not like the good old days when educated women had few other choices. I believe there is some evidence that places like Kansas that have been particularly punitive to teachers are having a hard time filling positions.
Then we might mention the differences between the women who are breaking that glass ceiling and the women who are working at the bottom of the heap. Nannies, cleaners, cooks or Blue Apron facilitate work as people rise in the hierarchy.
We might also think about the people who staff the early education programs. Are they analogous to the women who have left their own children to help rear the children of the richer? We might wonder if one of the flaws in early childhood education might be the very low pay and the lack of respect educators at that level endure. You can't just collect data and hold people accountable assuming there's a level playing field.
28
Ryan proposes that with enough tax cuts for the rich, something will eventually trickle down. This comes right out of the Leona Helmsley School of Economics. Or is it the School of Urology?
33
More like the School of Burn Down the Outhouse: We'll think about installing plumbing later.
1
How quickly they forget. Poor Leona even she knew more than Ronald and Nancy with the soothsay Reagan.. REAGAN economics were sort of shored up by George H with the luxury tax on the toys of the rich but then decimnated by that great populist!! William Jefferson Blythe III aka Bill Clinton. Helped along by which ever administration decided that most estates should go untaxed up to 4 million.. And what about all of the charitable organizations that don't pay tax but do little for their fellow Amerians Poor blacks and guess what also poor whites-- try Appalachia. Yikes.
2
Is this guy David Brooks' brother or cousin? Their inability to admit that their party is a cancer on our country is truly pathetic.
40
Arthur brought up the Dalai Lama, "The Manchurian Candidate", research and experimentation on toddlers ( that sounds a little menacing, but then Arthur is a Conservative), and Gail breaking the Times editorial glass ceiling. Arthur, nice try, "Dysfunctional Donald"is still out there and you can't avoid him.
7
I appreciate this dialogue and the attempt to be civil and really exchange ideas. Good for them both.
The bummer, at least from the perspective of a liberal Democrat, is that it prevents Ms. Collins from calling Mr. Brooks on some of his more ghastly misstatements. Can he really believe that our current anti-poverty programs don't include "pathways to work" and don't try to expand the "human potential" of those in poverty? Or that Democrats don't support that? C'mon.
There are thousands of programs like that on local, state and federal levels... and they exist *in spite of* the GOP and its thousand cuts. If the GOP now wants to embrace them, that's wonderful and good for them. But don't tell us that Democrats are against people going to work.
The bummer, at least from the perspective of a liberal Democrat, is that it prevents Ms. Collins from calling Mr. Brooks on some of his more ghastly misstatements. Can he really believe that our current anti-poverty programs don't include "pathways to work" and don't try to expand the "human potential" of those in poverty? Or that Democrats don't support that? C'mon.
There are thousands of programs like that on local, state and federal levels... and they exist *in spite of* the GOP and its thousand cuts. If the GOP now wants to embrace them, that's wonderful and good for them. But don't tell us that Democrats are against people going to work.
56
This is without doubt my favorite column in the NYT. You folks give me the hope that maybe, just maybe there are bridges out there and people willing to walk at least part way across them. Please keep on keeping on.
1
Arthur Brooks says "You can tell the 'punishment' crowd on the left when they argue that people shouldn’t be forced to take 'dead-end jobs,' implying they are less dignified than joblessness." No, it's not about dignity. We're saying that people shouldn't be forced to take jobs that don't pay enough to cover rent and food in a system that offers no hope for doing better. There are millions of people in this country too poor to worry about dignity.
302
Just an observation: Where I work, the people who hold those jobs are decently paid, with benefits, and they do a great job and even seem pretty happy. How can that be?
Unions.
They have a union at their backs when it comes to wages, raises, time-and-a-half and all the other factors that make the difference between being a wage slave and being a satisfied employee.
The most stupidly self-destructive thing Americans ever did was to buy the GOP line that unions were the real problem at the core of the economy. Almost forty years after Reagan fired the air traffic controllers, look around and tell me who benefited from tearing down organized labor. Ask yourself: Are your lives better today than they were forty years ago?
Unions.
They have a union at their backs when it comes to wages, raises, time-and-a-half and all the other factors that make the difference between being a wage slave and being a satisfied employee.
The most stupidly self-destructive thing Americans ever did was to buy the GOP line that unions were the real problem at the core of the economy. Almost forty years after Reagan fired the air traffic controllers, look around and tell me who benefited from tearing down organized labor. Ask yourself: Are your lives better today than they were forty years ago?
15
People shouldn't be "forced" to work but somehow taking money from the government while not working is better? This is the antithesis of dignity.
1
I expected to read about dignity in politics but instead just watched a ping-pong game with a cat at the net interrupting the volleys. Talk about vapid. Any of the lost balls might be interesting topics but it was a cat's game, not a "conversation".
7
Mr. Brooks, how can you claim Paul Ryan's proposals last week can help create jobs or the poor working class or middle class? It's simply not true. Read the Times editorial on the same issue. That's more convincing and factual than your fake ideological spin.
By the way, I don't know one single liberal or Democrat who puts down entry-level (fast food service) workers. That's where any and all jobs are right now thanks to the 30-year Conservative Revolution you still believe in. Ryan's proposals all are consciously and cynically under-funded. Any extra money from these proposals go to the rich and the MNCs (who have famously been not hiring and hording their money since Sept 2008.
I don't think you learned very much from your chats with the Dalai Lama...nor do I think you can do an infocommercial on your "friendship". You can't claim to get the toxic smell of Trump and still want him, like Ryan, to beat the loathsome Hillary. That's intellectual and moral cowardice in motion.
By the way, I don't know one single liberal or Democrat who puts down entry-level (fast food service) workers. That's where any and all jobs are right now thanks to the 30-year Conservative Revolution you still believe in. Ryan's proposals all are consciously and cynically under-funded. Any extra money from these proposals go to the rich and the MNCs (who have famously been not hiring and hording their money since Sept 2008.
I don't think you learned very much from your chats with the Dalai Lama...nor do I think you can do an infocommercial on your "friendship". You can't claim to get the toxic smell of Trump and still want him, like Ryan, to beat the loathsome Hillary. That's intellectual and moral cowardice in motion.
23
I gave up. To read a serious suggestion that Republicans have somehow invented the concept of pairing the social safety net withanti-poverty programs like education and job training is laughable. This idea was the holy grail for Democrats when welfare reform was shoved onto us 20 years ago. Leftists do not decry deadend jobs because they devalue work. They decry them because they are dead ends.
33
Mr. Brooks pompously sets out proposals that only the entitled see as any solution to the problems that grip the society. Mr. Ryan's policies are punitive at best hiding behind more entitlements for the rich (more tax cuts? they pay nothing now). Sorry, the systemic problems are deep and real and need resources, not platitudes.
18
And while everyone is distracted by the celebrity news that is Trump, the Supreme Court has legalized the confiscation of all your property by the police for no valid reason except that they want to. What the hell is going on in this country?
21
So wait: Brooks praises Paul Ryan for a work-based solution to poverty, then snarks at teachers for wanting to ... work?
More painting the white roses red. And conservatives just can't seem to get enough of it.
More painting the white roses red. And conservatives just can't seem to get enough of it.
22
We've had pre K since President Johnson and it hasn't helped. We need to try something new. Like pre K for new parents.
4
Amen. People have been trying to replace bad parents with government programs for decades. Hasn't worked. They resort to emotional name-calling ("selfish", "mean", etc.) when someone dares question the efficacy of these programs. They blame everyone else (ex., for not spending enough) when the benefits don't materialize.
Big government proponents are very difficult to reason with.
Big government proponents are very difficult to reason with.
1
It seems the title of this article, "Is There Any Dignity Left in Politics," is a moot question. The tongue-in-cheek response to that question, of course, is, "Has There Ever *Been* Any Dignity in Politics?" And even with the most rudimentary understanding of political theatre in the United States, the answer is, arguably, a resounding "NO." US Politics, from its inception, has been rife with - and built upon - all of the social ills and interpersonal prejudices which now starkly define the race for the 2016 Presidential seat. Racism, sexism, antisemitism, violence, warmongering, greed, self-indulgence, and the not-so-unintended consequences of White privilege; all of these things are what have shaped both the political process and our Government policy from the moment this country established itself.
If, by now, the people of the United States cannot see that all we're being treated to in this election year is a new inversion of a very old game, that whatever sweeping changes they expect from the outcome of that election are most likely improbable, then we are truly are nothing less than a herd of sheep, willing to migrate and shuffle along in whichever direction this system prods us with its staff (pun intended). Until we collectively understand that change truly does begin with self-evaluation and personal shift in paradigm, this is literally the best we can hope to expect. And why not? It's what we've been doing for the last 300+ years. Why stop the party now?
If, by now, the people of the United States cannot see that all we're being treated to in this election year is a new inversion of a very old game, that whatever sweeping changes they expect from the outcome of that election are most likely improbable, then we are truly are nothing less than a herd of sheep, willing to migrate and shuffle along in whichever direction this system prods us with its staff (pun intended). Until we collectively understand that change truly does begin with self-evaluation and personal shift in paradigm, this is literally the best we can hope to expect. And why not? It's what we've been doing for the last 300+ years. Why stop the party now?
4
From his seat of power at the AEI, which is one of those think tanks that benefit rich people and conservatives, Arthur Brooks can find room to celebrate kindness and compassion as his friendship with the Dalai Lama demonstrates. There's not much to celebrate with Donald Trump, but he makes room for a False Equivalency when he suggests both presidential candidates politicized the Orlando tragedy. My memory isn't what it used to be but I don't recall Hillary Clinton demagoguing one of the world's great religions or suggesting the president was in secret cahoots with terrorists.
There's something intuitively wrong with using Buddhism to advance a politics of unkindness even if we accept that human suffering can perpetuate itself in our efforts to make the nation a better place. I agree with Brooks that politics is not enough. But Brooks isn't just anyone. He has much more worldly power than the Dalai Lama. You use the power you have to ameliorate the suffering you find inside and outside your own worldly path. I think the Dalai Lama would concur even if means higher taxes on the rich.
There's something intuitively wrong with using Buddhism to advance a politics of unkindness even if we accept that human suffering can perpetuate itself in our efforts to make the nation a better place. I agree with Brooks that politics is not enough. But Brooks isn't just anyone. He has much more worldly power than the Dalai Lama. You use the power you have to ameliorate the suffering you find inside and outside your own worldly path. I think the Dalai Lama would concur even if means higher taxes on the rich.
20
You two missed a Trumpdebacle chatting point which is the revelation
of the Trump kids' influence in the whole mess.
As if the guy himself is not bad enough, now these priviledged offspring
are interjecting themselves in the people's business. Imagine what
kind of problematic White House that would be.
of the Trump kids' influence in the whole mess.
As if the guy himself is not bad enough, now these priviledged offspring
are interjecting themselves in the people's business. Imagine what
kind of problematic White House that would be.
7
OK, got the new Ryan policy strategy: listening tour-->finds out work matters-->promises to do research and experimentation. Putting aside the Republican antipathy for any form of research and experimentation, can't the question be: is pre-K education a value we should promote and support in this country. Even if the research said, no pre-K doesn't increase achievement (again, the Republican love for quantification), isn't it better to have a child in poverty enrolled in some form of structured learning experience rather than sitting in front of TV all day. One added not, with Ryan's new discovery of poverty, does that mean he will publically renounce Ayn Rand?
9
Dignity relates exclusively to human conduct. So, to answer the question in terms of principal politicians...
Obama: Yes.
Trump: No.
Clinton: Some.
McConnell: No.
Ryan: No.
Reid: Some.
Pelosi: Some.
Most legislators: No.
A few legislators: Some
The NRA/Wayne LaPierre: No.
Obama: Yes.
Trump: No.
Clinton: Some.
McConnell: No.
Ryan: No.
Reid: Some.
Pelosi: Some.
Most legislators: No.
A few legislators: Some
The NRA/Wayne LaPierre: No.
21
May be old fashion but we need a respected Commander in chief figure, like Reagan was who could pull this country together. Instead we get two less than stellar choices The Clintons, or Trump. All while the likes of Warren and a Mike Bloomberg never even entered the race.
2
Bloomberg would have been a good thing, but he waited too long to consider entering the race and rightly saw the danger of being the next Ralph Nader.
1
One Clinton is running for office. One.
2
Ronald Reagan, with his "government is the problem" , "welfare queens", inability to acknowledge aids and trickle down economics began the disaster that we are dealing with today. When history analyzes this man he will be shown for the disgrace he was.
4
In truth, Hillary Clinton has lowered the bar so low it is now lying on the floor. One simply has to step over it.
It's safe to say there is no dignity in politics.
It's safe to say there is no dignity in politics.
5
Typical Republican from top Establishment down to the Trump supporters: Attacking the opposition (and federal gov't) is the only Policy on the GOP table. That's the reducto ad absurdum of Trump's victory over the GOP...and voters like you.
5
When did truth and dignity have anything to do with politics?
2
Several readers argued, in effect, that a pairing of 'dignity' and 'politics' creates an oxymoron, and that this judgment applies to the past as well as the present. If that is so, where does the responsibility lie? In a democracy, politicians respond to cues from their constituents. If candidates adopt positions whose vagueness enables them to appeal to a variety of groups, that practice stems from the necessity, in our system, of building coalitions in order to win elections. If mudslinging has achieved the status of a standard tactic in campaigns, that reality reflects the responsiveness of voters to the method.
At a deeper level, however, Americans' discontent with the political process probably arises from the necessity and inherent messiness of compromise. If our party wins the election, we expect elected officials to implement their campaign promises. In fact, however such victories rarely eliminate the ability of the losers to force concessions from the winners. The latter, moreover, comprise a coalition whose members must negotiate with each other.
Compromise plays a vital role in any democracy. Voters accept defeat in an election because they know the outcome does not deprive them of influence in government. An election that enabled the winners to dominate completely would provoke dangerous bitterness and weaken the legitimacy of the new administration. Messiness and the ugly effects of human ambition are intrinsic elements of a free society.
At a deeper level, however, Americans' discontent with the political process probably arises from the necessity and inherent messiness of compromise. If our party wins the election, we expect elected officials to implement their campaign promises. In fact, however such victories rarely eliminate the ability of the losers to force concessions from the winners. The latter, moreover, comprise a coalition whose members must negotiate with each other.
Compromise plays a vital role in any democracy. Voters accept defeat in an election because they know the outcome does not deprive them of influence in government. An election that enabled the winners to dominate completely would provoke dangerous bitterness and weaken the legitimacy of the new administration. Messiness and the ugly effects of human ambition are intrinsic elements of a free society.
5
Pre-school will only be effective if the parents are trained how to increase the world knowledge and vocabulary of their children. The essential element is for parents to talk, talk, talk WITH their children.
4
Several years ago, the "word deficit" was studied. Kids in impoverished homes started school having heard tens of millions fewer words than wealthy kids.
I have a friend who taught highly emotionally disturbed kids in the Bronx. When he visited homes, there was often nothing around, not a book, magazine or any written word. He said the kids lived in "silence". Never mind having been read to, those kids were barely spoken to.
There's no mystery why wealthy kids do better. Better parenting.
I have a friend who taught highly emotionally disturbed kids in the Bronx. When he visited homes, there was often nothing around, not a book, magazine or any written word. He said the kids lived in "silence". Never mind having been read to, those kids were barely spoken to.
There's no mystery why wealthy kids do better. Better parenting.
It seems that no matter what you two say we are saddled with a congenital liar vs a carnival barker as president of our great country . Pre K school is a wonderful idea but do you really think either one of these candidates can be trusted to follow through on any of heir pronouncementments? Not I !
2
So, Ryan's recycled trickle-down policy, already proven not to work, is a good thing, but we should hold off on early education since it hasn't been proven to work? This is typical GOP weasel-speak. It's good if it helps the 1%, not so good if it helps the rest of us.
14
If Arthur were honest, he & Gail would agree that a job guarantee program like the one proposed by good old Tom Paine in 1797 would be the way to go. The federal gov would become the employer of last resort. It would guarantee a decent job or paid training for such a job to everyone able to work.
There are plenty of things that need to be done--fixing roads & bridges, education, research etc. BTW there are plenty of support jobs in education and research that do not require a degree. As with unemployment benefits today, you could require each worker to show that he had applied for a comparable private sector job periodically.
How would we pay for it?
A) It would to a certain extent pay for itself.
1. When people are working, producing, & spending, they pay more taxes than when they are out of work. The money they spend provides jobs for others who also spend & pay taxes.
2. We could reduce much of what we currently spend on welfare.
3. It would raise private sector wages and thus taxes.
B) We could raise income tax rates on the Rich as we did during the Great Prosperity of 1946 - 1973. This would not only raise revenue, it would reduce inequality and financial speculation, both of which are bad for the economy.
C) We could sell Treasury bonds both to the public locking in low interest and to the FED which returns the interest.Since we would be producing more, there would be little inflation.
See http://www.levyinstitute.org/topics/job-guarantee
There are plenty of things that need to be done--fixing roads & bridges, education, research etc. BTW there are plenty of support jobs in education and research that do not require a degree. As with unemployment benefits today, you could require each worker to show that he had applied for a comparable private sector job periodically.
How would we pay for it?
A) It would to a certain extent pay for itself.
1. When people are working, producing, & spending, they pay more taxes than when they are out of work. The money they spend provides jobs for others who also spend & pay taxes.
2. We could reduce much of what we currently spend on welfare.
3. It would raise private sector wages and thus taxes.
B) We could raise income tax rates on the Rich as we did during the Great Prosperity of 1946 - 1973. This would not only raise revenue, it would reduce inequality and financial speculation, both of which are bad for the economy.
C) We could sell Treasury bonds both to the public locking in low interest and to the FED which returns the interest.Since we would be producing more, there would be little inflation.
See http://www.levyinstitute.org/topics/job-guarantee
10
How to pay for it: reduce military spending by 5%. Nobody would notice the impact--the cost of this sweeping, beneficial program would be lost in the noise level of the "defense" budget.
1
There’s not much more that’s so emblematic of the differences between liberals and conservatives than this exchange.
Arthur argues for the incremental approach of Congress’s new poverty proposals that focus on work and pay-as-you-go, which generates taxes that we can use to incrementally better support our needy; while Gail wants fully-funded universal pre-K NOW, because it MIGHT have an effect in, oh, 30 or 40 years.
But methinks Gail, in her loyalty to the Times, understates the efforts she had to make to become the first woman to lead the Times’s editorial page. It wasn’t JUST those women who sacrificed in the sixties and earlier who set up the conditions that Gail and others, arriving on the scene moments afterward, were able to exploit. The truth is that this fight continues to this day.
Arthur argues for the incremental approach of Congress’s new poverty proposals that focus on work and pay-as-you-go, which generates taxes that we can use to incrementally better support our needy; while Gail wants fully-funded universal pre-K NOW, because it MIGHT have an effect in, oh, 30 or 40 years.
But methinks Gail, in her loyalty to the Times, understates the efforts she had to make to become the first woman to lead the Times’s editorial page. It wasn’t JUST those women who sacrificed in the sixties and earlier who set up the conditions that Gail and others, arriving on the scene moments afterward, were able to exploit. The truth is that this fight continues to this day.
3
Arthur,
For as long as some jobs force you to forego welfare while paying an insufficient minimum wage, then yes, work will be punishment for some.
No amount of wishy-washy talk of "dignity" will change this.
Your tone deafness on this is directly related to rise of Trump.
For as long as some jobs force you to forego welfare while paying an insufficient minimum wage, then yes, work will be punishment for some.
No amount of wishy-washy talk of "dignity" will change this.
Your tone deafness on this is directly related to rise of Trump.
24
Those five long months of polarizing coverage and irritating TV commentators will be something I will miss altogether, the result of not having TV. Oh, and I missed the O.J. Simpson trial for the same reason. Haven't watched for years. Print media provides all the irritation I need and books provide the entertainment. I recommend it.
4
It's not just the RNC and right-wing ideologues that have gone after Hillary w hate & vitriol; it's actually the media as a whole with collective vicious, sexist fangs. I long for the day when there will be gender parity in TV news talk shows and not just the marginalized token Stepford blonde obediently watching the all-men panel bloviating and throwing dishonest punches at Hillary. Men panels and "mansplaining" have got to go!!
14
I would think that the Pre K question is a bit more complicated. It may not be settled science, but its pervasive existence in other places in the world and among the middle and upper classes here strongly suggest there are benefits to be had. Of course, one has to factor into the cost, the benefit of producing a more able individual who can contribute to his society. Let's have an experiment. Let all of the upper class kids forgo Pre K and instead have their parents pay for a poor child to have it. Then, let's measure the differences when they enter kindergarten. Yes, I know it's fanciful, but so is the notion that one needs a study to determine the value of trying to give poor kids help. And kudos to you Gail for identifying those they came before you. Our younger women ought to be made aware of how hard it was for those courageous women who lead the way.
6
There is as much dignity left in politics as there is in journalism.
11
Dignity was thrown out of the window with the election of this country's 1st Black President. Those in congress who signed on to make this president a "one term president" (apparently by any means necessary) lost all respect and dignity in my view. Unfortunately, bigotry and overall whiny kiddie sandbox diplomacy became the order of the day. It was my hope these 'bad children' would just hold their collective breath for 8 years. But no. The hangers-on and their attitudes dressed in nice suits for "battle" everyday - beautifying indignity as they represented a classic example of "trickle-down politics." Trump did not invent the indignities of politics we bemoan today. He is simply, loudly living the GOP message that's been accepted by those for whom he speaks.
216
Obama's election brought out the grievance movement in full force. Never has one president required so much defending.
The best thing about Obama's term coming to an end will be that we will hear the last of the excuse-making for this president's questionable performance.
The best thing about Obama's term coming to an end will be that we will hear the last of the excuse-making for this president's questionable performance.
1
Dignity was thrown out for a second time when the media shut off Bernie, who has been saying the same thing about inequality as both Pope Francis and the Dalai Lama, for several decades now. That inequality within nations, between nations, is the root cause of disharmony, discord, disrepair in human relationships, globally and domestically. Very few people seem to get the connection. They think that big money dictated programs and policies will somehow trickle down to benefit the not so fortunate amongst us. Strange. If you ask the Dalai Lama, he will tell you that violence can be uprooted from deep within us, that EDUCATION is the best way, secular way to remove violent means from our lives, in the absence of religion, which (religion) has added more to friction and division than religious founders had never anticipated nor intended. Bernie similarly focuses on education and proposes that free public higher education will provide our youth the best means to face challenges in the global work force in this 21st century. Bernie also believes in his heart and soul, exactly like the Dalai Lama, that war is not the means to attain peace, that war needs to be obsolete in the 21st century.
2
Ahhh, it's so nice to finally find out that my years of research and tortured mental debate can be so easily reduced to "I'm a racist." Very nice. You know, all these years I thought we wanted more or less the same things and had different ideas of how to accomplish that? A fantasy. Turns out I just hate minorities. A load off my mind, I can tell you that
2
"It’s true that the presidential race does intrude into everything. Who cares what the Brexit vote does to Europe — what does it mean to the Trump campaign? ....The very fact that the country knew that Trump’s campaign manager was named Corey Lewandowski is sort of amazing."
This just demonstrates Trump's dominance in the airwaves, even when it's negative news. The media remain fascinated by this most unorthodox of candidates and the many ways he can shoot himself in the foot. Trump represents every ratings-driving element America loves after decades of celebrity worship of sports, movie, and cable stars: fame, fortune, erratic and colorful love life, questionable business practices, and "colorful" associations.
But otherwise this was a thoughtful "Conversation." Gail, I fully understand your point about the gains women fought for and the benefits coming to those immediately after. By now, young millennials think there is no problem (there still is) with how smooth the playing field of business is.
But as for Arthur's point about how "thoughtful" Paul Ryan's poverty plans are, I think Gail nailed it: the plans sound good but their vagueness overshadows their degree of support from the GOP rank and file--as in none. As for the novelty of saying, "poor people above all want work," all I could think of is: duh. How much did that Congressional research cost?
With the primaries over, I just hope you two go at it for the full campaign---we need some sanity once a week.
This just demonstrates Trump's dominance in the airwaves, even when it's negative news. The media remain fascinated by this most unorthodox of candidates and the many ways he can shoot himself in the foot. Trump represents every ratings-driving element America loves after decades of celebrity worship of sports, movie, and cable stars: fame, fortune, erratic and colorful love life, questionable business practices, and "colorful" associations.
But otherwise this was a thoughtful "Conversation." Gail, I fully understand your point about the gains women fought for and the benefits coming to those immediately after. By now, young millennials think there is no problem (there still is) with how smooth the playing field of business is.
But as for Arthur's point about how "thoughtful" Paul Ryan's poverty plans are, I think Gail nailed it: the plans sound good but their vagueness overshadows their degree of support from the GOP rank and file--as in none. As for the novelty of saying, "poor people above all want work," all I could think of is: duh. How much did that Congressional research cost?
With the primaries over, I just hope you two go at it for the full campaign---we need some sanity once a week.
27
You are so right about that. I had dinner with my politics-happy in-laws on Sunday and they had no idea that the Brexit vote was even a thing. I mean NOT ONE CLUE. And these are people who will rant about politics for hours.
11
"Katharine Stevens, our resident AEI expert on this topic, studies the actual results of these programs. She finds that so far, the research is simply insufficient to justify huge long-term investments that would set us in one direction for decades." She's a great example of reactionary job creation that is useless, mean and lucrative.
34
Is anything more stomach turning than the "compassionate" side of establishment conservatism saying that they "want to believe" in system X or Y to help the poor? And yet somehow they can't? They have all kinds of non-evidence based faith in thier own religion. Yet they need research into how to help folks when it comes to the government actually acting. Seriously, a study that proves that more education and support for 4 and 5 year olds will help them long term? Please. Arthur for a guy that wants to believe you are really, really bad at it.
75
I have a hard time thinking the Dalai Llama said anything about the importance of "faith," since Buddhism has nothing to do with faith. Faith in what? Buddhism is about doing, not believing. It is about taking the steps (the Eightfold Path) that improve yourself and therefore the world that that ultimately lead to enlightenment. It is about taking action to end suffering. Now, if only we would take the action, instead of babbling on in the service of our meaningless abstractions.
63
I was waiting to hear what Arthur Brooks thought of the Dalai Lama's self-proclaimed Marxism. Well, ok, I wasn't actually surprised he didn't mention it.....
9
"Is There Any Dignity Left in Politics?" Paul Ryan gave the Republican answer to that question when he disavowed Trump's racist attack on judge Gonzalo Curiel, pointing out that it was a textbook definition of racism, then said he supports Trump for president; the GOP can't stoop low enough.
As to dignity outside of politics Arthur brought up Paul Ryan's "new poverty ideas", which appear to be "tired" slogans--give people jobs and education--with no substance. And he dismisses Hillary's concrete plan to start the poor on a path to education and jobs by providing pre-K, by saying it must be studied--which is nothing more than the Republican way of saying "no". The value/importance of early education is hard to dispute, but not for Republicans who won't provide a dime unless it comes from a cut in some other safety-net program.
No doubt Ryan will come out with some details on how to achieve both jobs and education that combines tax cuts to corporations and the wealthy with indentured minimum wage servitude employment opportunities for the poor. And that will be the Republican answer to the question of dignity, both in and outside politics.
Real dignity is being demonstrated by the L.G.B.T. community and the broader community that mourns the deaths in Orlando. Real dignity is respecting others, treating others as you would want to be treated and respected.
When Paul Ryan shows support (respect) for a bigot, he shows a lack of personal dignity.
As to dignity outside of politics Arthur brought up Paul Ryan's "new poverty ideas", which appear to be "tired" slogans--give people jobs and education--with no substance. And he dismisses Hillary's concrete plan to start the poor on a path to education and jobs by providing pre-K, by saying it must be studied--which is nothing more than the Republican way of saying "no". The value/importance of early education is hard to dispute, but not for Republicans who won't provide a dime unless it comes from a cut in some other safety-net program.
No doubt Ryan will come out with some details on how to achieve both jobs and education that combines tax cuts to corporations and the wealthy with indentured minimum wage servitude employment opportunities for the poor. And that will be the Republican answer to the question of dignity, both in and outside politics.
Real dignity is being demonstrated by the L.G.B.T. community and the broader community that mourns the deaths in Orlando. Real dignity is respecting others, treating others as you would want to be treated and respected.
When Paul Ryan shows support (respect) for a bigot, he shows a lack of personal dignity.
191
Yes, and if Paul Ryan actually believed what he said, he would be pushing for a massive infrastructure bill which would put thousands, if not millions, of people to work. He's all talk and no show. And Arthur Brooks left out Ryan's latest manifesto calling for deregulation of everything - everything! Guess Arthur doesn't know how the Clear Air Act put out the fires on the rivers - fires caused by pollution. Finally, Ryan's call to privatize Social Security gives lie to his statement of helping people when they need it...Arthur Brooks missed out on what the Dalai Lama said re: acting in ways that make lives better.
6
"Katharine Stevens, our resident AEI expert on this topic, studies the actual results of these programs. She finds that so far, the research is simply insufficient to justify huge long-term investments..."
I guess she never read the work of Nobel Laureate James Heckman (http://heckmanequation.org/content/resource/case-investing-disadvantaged..., never heard of the Perry Preschool Program.
But then again, investing in the future of poor children would be against Republican policy.
I guess she never read the work of Nobel Laureate James Heckman (http://heckmanequation.org/content/resource/case-investing-disadvantaged..., never heard of the Perry Preschool Program.
But then again, investing in the future of poor children would be against Republican policy.
77
No, Sally, investing in programs that make people feel good but don't have measurable results would be against republican policy. Investing in "feel good" programs don't do anyone any favors.
Republicans are called "mean" and "uncaring" because they demand measurable results. Oh, the horror.
Republicans are called "mean" and "uncaring" because they demand measurable results. Oh, the horror.
2
An expert at AEI is like an expert at the RNC. Not to be trusted.
14
Meeting with the Dalai Lama must be fascinating; it doesn't confer some sort of spiritual seal of approval on Mr Brooks ( how much humbler to drop reference to a special friendship and simply provide his advice). But I like the COnversation -- but this particular one was a bit disjointed. Too many topics maybe?
Preschool is not some frivolous, un proven, route to prepare children for school. Accepting the AEI thoughts that we need a tremendous amount of research before offering it to the masses is idiotic, and simply echoes the sense that AEI exists to preserve the power of those in power. What better way to that end than to restrict access to education? The by the time the kids with no access are teens, lament their lack of preparedness. All the better to fool them with.
On Corey L: well, there was more coverage of that on cable yesterday than on anything else. Go Media.
Arthur: the "crowd on the left" doesn't prefer joblessness over dead end jobs. But dead end jobs do leave those in them reliant on welfare programs that conservatives love to hate. The goal of employment should involve at least a living wage: one that doesn't require food stamps ( SNAP) or Medicaid to survive. I do agree that work is important to "belonging" to society, if you will.
Gail: what a wonderful tribute to those uppity women who went before, and won the war, even if they last a personal battle on the way.
Back to the opening: No.
Preschool is not some frivolous, un proven, route to prepare children for school. Accepting the AEI thoughts that we need a tremendous amount of research before offering it to the masses is idiotic, and simply echoes the sense that AEI exists to preserve the power of those in power. What better way to that end than to restrict access to education? The by the time the kids with no access are teens, lament their lack of preparedness. All the better to fool them with.
On Corey L: well, there was more coverage of that on cable yesterday than on anything else. Go Media.
Arthur: the "crowd on the left" doesn't prefer joblessness over dead end jobs. But dead end jobs do leave those in them reliant on welfare programs that conservatives love to hate. The goal of employment should involve at least a living wage: one that doesn't require food stamps ( SNAP) or Medicaid to survive. I do agree that work is important to "belonging" to society, if you will.
Gail: what a wonderful tribute to those uppity women who went before, and won the war, even if they last a personal battle on the way.
Back to the opening: No.
79
Since when is a person under investigation by the FBI an acceptable candidate of the presidency? The press, media and DNC brush off Hillary's refusal to obey rules and laws protecting national security.
There are no standards in the DNC, or the liberal press and media who refuse to acknowledge Hillary's dishonesty and corruption. Shame on them.
Hillary may be protected at the moment by Obama but should she get elected, the Republicans will lose no time working towards her impeachment. Whatever she does Hillary brings her mixture of arrogance, incompetence, entitlement and corruption. Those who enabled her can only blame themselves for the second Clinton impeachment that is inevitable.
There are no standards in the DNC, or the liberal press and media who refuse to acknowledge Hillary's dishonesty and corruption. Shame on them.
Hillary may be protected at the moment by Obama but should she get elected, the Republicans will lose no time working towards her impeachment. Whatever she does Hillary brings her mixture of arrogance, incompetence, entitlement and corruption. Those who enabled her can only blame themselves for the second Clinton impeachment that is inevitable.
10
A lie. You can finds the facts at http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2016/jan/14/jeb-bush/...
Here is a quote:
"Actually, Clinton is not under FBI investigation. The inquiry to which Bush refers revolves around the private email server Clinton used while serving as secretary of state. And it is not a criminal investigation."
Here is a quote:
"Actually, Clinton is not under FBI investigation. The inquiry to which Bush refers revolves around the private email server Clinton used while serving as secretary of state. And it is not a criminal investigation."
12
Impeach Impeach Impeach. If it wasn't; for gerrymandered states, the Republicans would not even have the house. Although Democrats do not have the Senate, their Senators represent 65% of the country.
Isn't it time to tamp down the righteous indignation and try to govern with a fiscal policy to boost employment and fix our bridges to boot? Another thought, turn off the talk radio and TV for a few months, there is happiness in that.
Isn't it time to tamp down the righteous indignation and try to govern with a fiscal policy to boost employment and fix our bridges to boot? Another thought, turn off the talk radio and TV for a few months, there is happiness in that.
11
Wow! I'm shocked to see the "talking points" put forth by fox news. Secretary of State Clinton is "protected" not by our President but because all those entities you cite have not been able to find wrongdoing. If there was something -- it would have been made public -- quite public. And if congress wants to "lose no time" in impeaching Clinton --- it will be just a continuation of the last 8 years -- the anti-Obama sentiment has just been an excuse to do nothing but say "no"
"Republicans will lose no time working towards her impeachment." 'Republicans' and 'working' - a serious contradiction in terms.
"Republicans will lose no time working towards her impeachment." 'Republicans' and 'working' - a serious contradiction in terms.
22
Although you guys wrote a lot of nasty articles about Bernie Sanders over the last 9 months, if you actually investigate the man you will find an abundance of dignity is left in Politics, -if not this paper.
37
Yah, the status quo won!
Go wealthy white people, say Gail and this new fellow with all the fancy connections...
"We get to pick the winners!"
Here's the bill for all the goodies we are going to sprinkle on the poor people we choose to help! say Gail and he. We're not even sure if half this stuff works, but we've got the bills!
Now get to work and pony up, you working people. The poor have needs, you know, and we feel guilty unless we lift them up to OUR level...
Haha, ain't we funny! say Gail and her latest man friend...
You're a pioneer and all! he says as he stokes the ego and plays her like a fiddle...
Go wealthy white people, say Gail and this new fellow with all the fancy connections...
"We get to pick the winners!"
Here's the bill for all the goodies we are going to sprinkle on the poor people we choose to help! say Gail and he. We're not even sure if half this stuff works, but we've got the bills!
Now get to work and pony up, you working people. The poor have needs, you know, and we feel guilty unless we lift them up to OUR level...
Haha, ain't we funny! say Gail and her latest man friend...
You're a pioneer and all! he says as he stokes the ego and plays her like a fiddle...
6
What do rich folks or just us middle class folks do? We send our kids to preschool. No studies required. The Republican mindset exemplified by Ryan, McConnell, et al., and supported by Mr. Brooks, privileges money and maintaining power over human life no matter the issue — education, gun safety, Supreme Court appointees. People are starving for patriotism without a hollow core, a glimpse of decency—service to country and community without self interest. Some day we'll figure out how to elect representatives who study issues to solve problems not to camouflage partisan beliefs.
110
The American people can choose representatives who want to solve our problems; they are called democrats.
17
Until this morning I was blissfully unaware of this Arthur Brooks person, but I knew he was GOP when he dragged out the predictable complaint that the Orlando massacre was being "politicized." Trying to save human lives by restricting the sale of assault weapons is not political; it's merely civilized. The Republican response? Donald "appreciates the congrats" on the mass killings. How does Brooks' dear friend the Dalai Lama feel about that?
As for Brooks' ode to Paul Ryan's so-called budget, see Dr. Krugman's column on that subject. The Republicans keep setting Ryan up in his own little playpen, complete with a Fisher-Price abacus on which to practice his numbers. And he's clearly not a fast learner; his budgets contain so many asterisks (for unspecified revenue) that they look like maps of the Milky Way.
Ryan, like Brooks, starts with the conclusion he wants and then reverse-engineers his argument to reach that conclusion. Ryan, however, applies that interesting theory to mathematics, believing numbers to be Republican, which they aren't. Math represents objective reality, and reality has a liberal bias.
As for Brooks' ode to Paul Ryan's so-called budget, see Dr. Krugman's column on that subject. The Republicans keep setting Ryan up in his own little playpen, complete with a Fisher-Price abacus on which to practice his numbers. And he's clearly not a fast learner; his budgets contain so many asterisks (for unspecified revenue) that they look like maps of the Milky Way.
Ryan, like Brooks, starts with the conclusion he wants and then reverse-engineers his argument to reach that conclusion. Ryan, however, applies that interesting theory to mathematics, believing numbers to be Republican, which they aren't. Math represents objective reality, and reality has a liberal bias.
305
Oh, there is such a lot of meat in this conversation. The Dalai Lama on hate and death; Donald Trump's lack of policy; anti-poverty programs which focus on work - are they new deal or punishment; early education and the impact on later education; and our debt of gratitude to the women who broke through for us, and left women of my generation with opportunities.
So I will pull a slip out a hat and... aha!... anti-poverty and education. We will always have some people who are not able to be valued in market terms in a market economy. Our goal is to not create more. So while making the effort to find work for people so that they can help themselves - and I will tell you from personal experience, even a low level job can improve one's self-esteem - is a necessary step, so is remediation and prevention for the next generation.
We *know* that children thrive better in situations in which they are talked to, hear language, are stimulated. We know they can pick up on stress and negativity. So a focus on rearing children well from day one is important, and for those whose parents are not equipped, early education may be their only chance.
There will always be a bottom 20%. That is math. Upward mobility basically means raising the scope of experience and opportunity available to the bottom.
So I will pull a slip out a hat and... aha!... anti-poverty and education. We will always have some people who are not able to be valued in market terms in a market economy. Our goal is to not create more. So while making the effort to find work for people so that they can help themselves - and I will tell you from personal experience, even a low level job can improve one's self-esteem - is a necessary step, so is remediation and prevention for the next generation.
We *know* that children thrive better in situations in which they are talked to, hear language, are stimulated. We know they can pick up on stress and negativity. So a focus on rearing children well from day one is important, and for those whose parents are not equipped, early education may be their only chance.
There will always be a bottom 20%. That is math. Upward mobility basically means raising the scope of experience and opportunity available to the bottom.
67
Relatively speaking there will always be a bottom 20%. That shouldn't mean poverty.
4
And not to beat that horse again, but I will.
The "bottom 20%" in most European countries are miles ahead of their US counterparts, due to a comprehensive approach that takes into account both individual and collective well-being. It is sad that given the "head start" that the US had with the form of government that our Founders developed, that we have fallen so far behind while riding the fantasy of the individual above all and the idea that we have anything close to a level playing field.
The Dalai Lama gets it - but he clearly has no influence on US policy.
The "bottom 20%" in most European countries are miles ahead of their US counterparts, due to a comprehensive approach that takes into account both individual and collective well-being. It is sad that given the "head start" that the US had with the form of government that our Founders developed, that we have fallen so far behind while riding the fantasy of the individual above all and the idea that we have anything close to a level playing field.
The Dalai Lama gets it - but he clearly has no influence on US policy.
2
Ms. Collins categorized Speaker Ryan's policy proposals as "mushy." I think that I would categorize them as tired shibboleths. I think that the speaker may think of them as continuing the Jack Kemp tradition, which would make three or four decades old. Of course, his proposals still reek of voodoo and the notion that cutting taxes at the top will bring economic benefit to all.
One of those proposals, tax reform, always seems to be a matter of whose ox is being gored. I suspect that the Republicans' presumptive nominee has paid little or no taxes, of late. I note that with income far higher, hundreds of times higher, than mine, Romney paid a lower effective income tax, in 2011, than I do now. I feel gored.
One of those proposals, tax reform, always seems to be a matter of whose ox is being gored. I suspect that the Republicans' presumptive nominee has paid little or no taxes, of late. I note that with income far higher, hundreds of times higher, than mine, Romney paid a lower effective income tax, in 2011, than I do now. I feel gored.
95
Oh, it's better than that:
http://www.usnews.com/news/business/articles/2016-03-09/trump-received-t...
http://www.usnews.com/news/business/articles/2016-03-09/trump-received-t...
2
Arthur, Ryan is a horrible, conscienceless human being (right there with McConnell), who care not for the citizens in our nation, rather selfish ideology. Ryan received Social Security after his father's death, (his mom was wealthy, anyway) and wishes to destroy it for the future. He has never had a private sector job, takes all his government benefits and would deny any pittance to the rest of us.
6
Dignity in politics. Like MTF Tobin, I wish there had been more actual conversation about dignity in The Conversation. I realize it's has a thin, thin profile, but it raises a question that defines dignity in politics.
I am astounded, even in this bizarre campaign, to listen to commentators discuss Donald Trump's self-destructive performance over the past several weeks, and to hear the next questions out of all of their lips, "but can he pivot to the general election now? Will Paul Manafort be able to shape Trump and his campaign into a more acceptable form in the coming months?"
Why is Trump even offered the opportunity to stop the bleeding he has caused? He said what he said, and I for one, take him at his word. He showed us his heart, soul and psyche very clearly; we know who he is. Republicans are scurrying for the exits, unable to disown him.
If there were any dignity in politics, the GOP would grow a spine and candidly tell their base and those who support Trump, "we can't support this man; he is dangerous, and we will not be responsible for him becoming President of the United States". THAT would show dignity, even in defeat.
Trump should not get a "do-over", and be allowed to gloss over or cavalierly disown his own statements. And yet, the political world is apparently more than willing to let him weasel his way out of the hole he has dug.
I am astounded, even in this bizarre campaign, to listen to commentators discuss Donald Trump's self-destructive performance over the past several weeks, and to hear the next questions out of all of their lips, "but can he pivot to the general election now? Will Paul Manafort be able to shape Trump and his campaign into a more acceptable form in the coming months?"
Why is Trump even offered the opportunity to stop the bleeding he has caused? He said what he said, and I for one, take him at his word. He showed us his heart, soul and psyche very clearly; we know who he is. Republicans are scurrying for the exits, unable to disown him.
If there were any dignity in politics, the GOP would grow a spine and candidly tell their base and those who support Trump, "we can't support this man; he is dangerous, and we will not be responsible for him becoming President of the United States". THAT would show dignity, even in defeat.
Trump should not get a "do-over", and be allowed to gloss over or cavalierly disown his own statements. And yet, the political world is apparently more than willing to let him weasel his way out of the hole he has dug.
291
You nailed it very well
1
The first unforced belly laugh in this awkward interactive column with Gail and Arthur: her crack about being distracted by his mention of cavorting with the Dalai Lama. And Gail managed to finish by leaving a lump in the throat with her unexpected paean to the women who arrived at the glass ceiling a minute before she did. A beautiful, sincere and utterly grown up tribute by one who knows.
Gail as her best. Thank you.
Gail as her best. Thank you.
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Lonnie Barone makes the best points of all and is so eloquent. I don't know whether Lonnie is a he or a she, but I know for sure that even Arthur Brooks, who can sound so stuffy, agrees with Lonnie's conclusion that Gail Collins's remarks amount to "a beautiful, sincere and utterly grown up tribute by one that knows." Thanks, Lonnie. Sometimes I cringe at Collins's sarcasm, but then I read these kinds of remarks and remind myself that she is not a cynic but an idealist. one whose words we keep needing to read. Who else actually sounds as though he or she really admires a "great heart"?
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Golly, I felt that I just attended a session of "dodge ball" with both you guys sounding like, well, the "politicians" you appear to treat with such scorn. How can either one of you mention "poverty and education" without once bringing "race" into the issue?
I expect that from Mr. Brooks of the "conservative think tank" known as the A.E.I. but Ms. Collins you must surely recognize it's not as simple as giving people a "job" (By the way, in the "real" world those jobs are generally minimum wage, under 40 hours a week and offer NO overtime). Perhaps tackling "why" most poor people are collected in easy to recognize ghettos with little or no chance to move on because of skin color seems, to me, to be a huge issue especially when the police forces in our larger cities are little more than "containment departments" to ensure these folks don't drift too far into the lily white suburbs.
Really cool that you met with the Dalai Lama but how about drifting down to, oh let's say, Chicago, and try talking to some gang members and see what their "spin" on politics might be? I know, a little too scary and not nearly as "name droppable" as the D.L.
Oh well, I guess if your not part of the solution, your part of the problem.
I expect that from Mr. Brooks of the "conservative think tank" known as the A.E.I. but Ms. Collins you must surely recognize it's not as simple as giving people a "job" (By the way, in the "real" world those jobs are generally minimum wage, under 40 hours a week and offer NO overtime). Perhaps tackling "why" most poor people are collected in easy to recognize ghettos with little or no chance to move on because of skin color seems, to me, to be a huge issue especially when the police forces in our larger cities are little more than "containment departments" to ensure these folks don't drift too far into the lily white suburbs.
Really cool that you met with the Dalai Lama but how about drifting down to, oh let's say, Chicago, and try talking to some gang members and see what their "spin" on politics might be? I know, a little too scary and not nearly as "name droppable" as the D.L.
Oh well, I guess if your not part of the solution, your part of the problem.
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"you're" part of the problem. Maybe they teach this in preschool?
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Poverty and prejudice can be so darn funny.
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"Is There Any Dignity Left in Politics?". there has never been any dignity in politics. to claim otherwise is to show ignorance of the history of politics as it has always been payed in this country (the movie 'Lincoln' shows that politics as practiced is at best, a highly disreputable business even when the end result is laudatory). as the saying goes "if you want to be able to eat the food, don't go into the kitchen to see how it's made".
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I don't want to believe that the terribly fraught Primary Elections is a norm. This year has been the most disgusting and undemocratic event I have ever witnessed. That would include the time that Al Gore's election was usurped by the Supreme Court. At least in that instance the media was watching and the public saw what transpired. This year's cycle was a cave of MSM darkness and misinformation. I have no more faith in our social structures. It's Nixon all over again.
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Absolutely Correct. Politics without dignity goes back as far as the earliest civilizations. The Greeks, Romans, Chinese, Russians, and even the French and Italians today. Politics can be defined as how civilizations choose their leaders, or have their leaders chosen for them is the process of convincing the masses the leader is the best among all the candidates. In many civilizations, it also included getting rid of bad leaders and replacing one government with a different form of government. There is very little dignity involved; because winning or becoming the chosen leader is paramount to everything else. While this may seem like a cynical view, ask the people who did not become the leader of any civilization, but their words are seldom recorded.
I'll zero in on two sound bites from Arthur Brooks: "the real nature and purpose of faith at a moment when religion is perverted to promote violence against innocent people" and "so boring, yet so predictable."
I always find it so boring, yet so predictable (and so empty) when intelligent pundits talk about "the real nature and purpose of faith" in the wake of horrible, violent crime, where extreme but sincere religious belief obviously played a role. In light of religious commandments that clearly condemn homosexuality (Leviticus 20:13; Romans 1:27 and 1:32; Suras 4:16, 26:165. and 27:55) and which in Jewish and Christian scripture make homosexuality a capital offense, who is being true to the Word and the faith, and who is "perverting" religion?
The problem is not the "wrong kind" of faith. Among the many serious problems that we have, a huge one is the irrational will to believe that some powerful being has given commandments, is watching us, and answers prayers. One of the worst ideas ever invented by human beings.
At these times, I realize that "faith" and a kind of pious self-hypnosis is probably a source of comfort to many people (such as the surviving loved ones of the victims in Orlando), but it has no resonance with me. I imagine the praying that many of the critically wounded victims probably did in those 3 hours as they were trapped inside the pulse nightclub, and how most of those prayers were unanswered or answered with "no." It depresses me.
I always find it so boring, yet so predictable (and so empty) when intelligent pundits talk about "the real nature and purpose of faith" in the wake of horrible, violent crime, where extreme but sincere religious belief obviously played a role. In light of religious commandments that clearly condemn homosexuality (Leviticus 20:13; Romans 1:27 and 1:32; Suras 4:16, 26:165. and 27:55) and which in Jewish and Christian scripture make homosexuality a capital offense, who is being true to the Word and the faith, and who is "perverting" religion?
The problem is not the "wrong kind" of faith. Among the many serious problems that we have, a huge one is the irrational will to believe that some powerful being has given commandments, is watching us, and answers prayers. One of the worst ideas ever invented by human beings.
At these times, I realize that "faith" and a kind of pious self-hypnosis is probably a source of comfort to many people (such as the surviving loved ones of the victims in Orlando), but it has no resonance with me. I imagine the praying that many of the critically wounded victims probably did in those 3 hours as they were trapped inside the pulse nightclub, and how most of those prayers were unanswered or answered with "no." It depresses me.
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At the personal level, everything you say is true, and well said. But on the 'meta' level, religion does appear to have more positive than negative impact. Jonathan Haidt, in his book "The Righteous Mind," observes that no successful society has ever existed in which religion did not play a significant role, and cites a meta-analysis of research on utopian societies that found that those founded on religious belief were far more likely to endure than those founded on non-religious principles (barter, sharing, free sex, etc.)
3
And Leviticus 25:44 says you can have slaves (if they come from neighboring countries).
And Exodus 35:2 states that those who work on the Sabbath should be put to death.
And Lev. 11:10 says eating shellfish is an abomination.
And so forth.
And Exodus 35:2 states that those who work on the Sabbath should be put to death.
And Lev. 11:10 says eating shellfish is an abomination.
And so forth.
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One of the hardest things to accept is that sometimes the answer to prayer is no. God loves us enough to allow us to choose to love God. When we choose not to, there are consequences. Imagine our world if we really lived the teachings of Christ. All of us, all the time, everywhere. There would be no guns, no poverty, no hate. But, there's that choice thing getting in the way.
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Like Joshua Schwartz, whose Comment was posted earlier, I'm sorry that the Conversation did not touch on whether there is any dignity left in politics. The answer is, there's no dignity, but why use the word "left"? It implies that there used to be dignity. I don't see much dignity in politics from 1796-1803! Check out caricatures of Lincoln. Sick. And it went on and on like that. Gail knows this history far better than I do!
But on to Paul Ryan. What a strange creature! The House Speakership cloaked him in gravitas and awareness that his policies affected all classes of people in all states -- but the Chairmanship of the House Budget Committee didn't do the same a few years earlier. His budget outlines ignored human needs.
Please don't talk to me about the minor details of work, type of work, or how much to spend to put people to work! If money is needed, stop building bombs. Talk to me about childcare & health care for working families -- including contraception. Talk to me about paid leave. Just having a job is not enough, if structural factors guarantee that the wealthy can get childcare and healthcare while the poor have to scramble for both.
We do not tax estates worth less than $5 million; that is supposedly so heirs of a family business or farm don't have to sell it to pay the tax. But Mr. Ryan's job is to legislate for the families that stand to inherit nothing. Looked at from THEIR standpoint, it gets much easier to see how to resolve resource inequality.
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Like Joshua Schwartz, whose Comment was posted earlier, I'm sorry that the Conversation did not touch on whether there is any dignity left in politics. The answer is, there's no dignity, but why use the word "left"? It implies that there used to be dignity. I don't see much dignity in politics from 1796-1803! Check out caricatures of Lincoln. Sick. And it went on and on like that. Gail knows this history far better than I do!
But on to Paul Ryan. What a strange creature! The House Speakership cloaked him in gravitas and awareness that his policies affected all classes of people in all states -- but the Chairmanship of the House Budget Committee didn't do the same a few years earlier. His budget outlines ignored human needs.
Please don't talk to me about the minor details of work, type of work, or how much to spend to put people to work! If money is needed, stop building bombs. Talk to me about childcare & health care for working families -- including contraception. Talk to me about paid leave. Just having a job is not enough, if structural factors guarantee that the wealthy can get childcare and healthcare while the poor have to scramble for both.
We do not tax estates worth less than $5 million; that is supposedly so heirs of a family business or farm don't have to sell it to pay the tax. But Mr. Ryan's job is to legislate for the families that stand to inherit nothing. Looked at from THEIR standpoint, it gets much easier to see how to resolve resource inequality.
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I am ok with the five million exemption, its great to have that amount, however today five million puts you nowhere near the super rich.
4
You two are the embodiment of refined, cultured debate. Both parties would do all Americans a HUGE favor by dumping their respective presumptive nominees, and replacing them with you; that would make the next five months very enjoyable for all of us.
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This is as good as it gets?
Oy.
Oy.
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Refined and cultured they may be, but in what alternative universe was this a "debate?" And, while I'm at it, what possible relationship does the content of this article have to do with its title?
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As always Arthur Brooks likes to drop some names, the honorable Dalai Lama was the one he used this time. No matter my priors on Brooks, I commend him for this collaboration and would urge him to write more about it in future columns.
But the real bombshell, or not, was Brooks admitting that there were no policy proposals from the Trump camp. He said that Collins's question was a "trick question." And all she asked for was for him to "name one policy on which you think Donald Trump has the better take."
I don't know what Trump's supporters see in him. God help us if ever he got near, leave alone inside, the White House.
But the real bombshell, or not, was Brooks admitting that there were no policy proposals from the Trump camp. He said that Collins's question was a "trick question." And all she asked for was for him to "name one policy on which you think Donald Trump has the better take."
I don't know what Trump's supporters see in him. God help us if ever he got near, leave alone inside, the White House.
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As a Trump support (please don't beat me) I can answer that:
We like that Donald Trump cleaned house in the Republican party, and got rid of the warmongering Bushes and the people who played their campaigns on hating the gays. We like that.
We're glad to see McCain and Romney both set on their heels. They did not care about the working voters, and the working voters are showing them both the door, like with the Bushes. You've taken enough, gentlemen. Go, be with your grandheirs...
We like that Donald Trump want to address immigration issues, and not just talk about it like the rest of Washington. I see an elder Hispanic man on the corner where I get off of the highway ramp coming home from my second job. He is begging for help, and he looks hot out there. Is this normal in the rest of the country? Here, we used to be able to take care of our own. We didn't need to have men begging for their lives like that.
If this is the new America -- the richest of the rich, and the poorest of the poor -- you can have it. That's not normal, to have to resort to sending children home for the weekend with food, and opening schools over the summer just to feed them. Something's wrong in America. Trump has the courage to tell you that, while Gail and her male friend giggle and tell us about their plans for us, oh and how they are personal friends with the Dolly Llama...
That's the America you want to live in? Really? Why can't Gail converse openly with a working man of color
We like that Donald Trump cleaned house in the Republican party, and got rid of the warmongering Bushes and the people who played their campaigns on hating the gays. We like that.
We're glad to see McCain and Romney both set on their heels. They did not care about the working voters, and the working voters are showing them both the door, like with the Bushes. You've taken enough, gentlemen. Go, be with your grandheirs...
We like that Donald Trump want to address immigration issues, and not just talk about it like the rest of Washington. I see an elder Hispanic man on the corner where I get off of the highway ramp coming home from my second job. He is begging for help, and he looks hot out there. Is this normal in the rest of the country? Here, we used to be able to take care of our own. We didn't need to have men begging for their lives like that.
If this is the new America -- the richest of the rich, and the poorest of the poor -- you can have it. That's not normal, to have to resort to sending children home for the weekend with food, and opening schools over the summer just to feed them. Something's wrong in America. Trump has the courage to tell you that, while Gail and her male friend giggle and tell us about their plans for us, oh and how they are personal friends with the Dolly Llama...
That's the America you want to live in? Really? Why can't Gail converse openly with a working man of color
8
Midway writes, "I see an elder Hispanic man on the corner...He is begging for help, and he looks hot out there."
So we should send him to Mexico where it is hotter and his chances of getting a little money for food are much less? That really solves the problem.
So we should send him to Mexico where it is hotter and his chances of getting a little money for food are much less? That really solves the problem.
18
There is a tendency among NYT commenters to have little understanding of Americans who hold different views. The tendency is to assume those Americans are either too ignorant to know better or easily duped. Or they're racists, homophobes, etc. There's always something wrong with them.
It's like a collective narrow-mindedness or intolerance. It makes it rather tedious to listen to their lecturing on open-mindedness.
As for the "God help us" comment. There's unlikely to be an apocalypse if Trump is elected. We survived 8 years of a community organizer whose greatest gift was for gab. We'll survive.
It's like a collective narrow-mindedness or intolerance. It makes it rather tedious to listen to their lecturing on open-mindedness.
As for the "God help us" comment. There's unlikely to be an apocalypse if Trump is elected. We survived 8 years of a community organizer whose greatest gift was for gab. We'll survive.
3
The content of the conversation did not really have all that much to do with the title: Is there any dignity left in politics?
The answer to that is no. But then there never was any dignity in "politics". History will judge based on real accomplishments and not on the Luftgesheften (from the Yiddish, hot air) of campaigns or campaign promises.
The answer to that is no. But then there never was any dignity in "politics". History will judge based on real accomplishments and not on the Luftgesheften (from the Yiddish, hot air) of campaigns or campaign promises.
35
The last laugh, of course, is on Gail and this Brooks fellow.
Look at the character and quality of the people they interview and work with...
That's why the man is clinging to his time with the religious leader: he's as good as it gets, and maybe will absolve his other work at his wealthy foundation, working for dollars against the country.
Look at the character and quality of the people they interview and work with...
That's why the man is clinging to his time with the religious leader: he's as good as it gets, and maybe will absolve his other work at his wealthy foundation, working for dollars against the country.
5
Mr. Brooks - when it comes to universal Pre-K programs I do believe. There's nothing ambiguous here when you are down in the trenches. In my fairly affluent neighborhood, families shell out between $10,000 to $15,000 for the pre-K year (age 4, turning 5). The cost is staggering and yet there is no question that these kids will start school significantly better prepared than their peers who could not afford or access pre-K. It's not just the skills readiness, it's the socialization, being prepared for a daily school routine and turning up on day one ready to go. A few local schools do offer this for free - and the programs have huge waiting lists. Every parent knows this is critical for their child's early success, very few can afford it.
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Dana's statements of fact, and her analysis, are spot-on. I post this reply to give my own testimony as to my life experience.
I was born in NYC. There, I attended (private) nursery school; and public pre-K plus most of kindergarten. Then my dad's company built a new building out of the city where commercial land was cheap. His choice was to work there, work at company headquarters, or leave the company. So off we moved to the suburbs.
They looked at houses only in the highly-rated school districts. Still, in ten or eleven weeks in this suburban kindergarten, it became very clear that I had already learned things in NYC that these suburban kids had yet to learn. As I went through my public-school years in a school district so good as to be almost comical (I think 5% of my HS class attended Ivy League schools), it became clear that the highest achievers either had started in NYC (where pre-K was available) or were children of teachers. Or both.
Nursery school and pre-K were good for socialization. They gave professionals an opportunity to detect and address issues early. They allowed us to have exposure to art and music (which many California school districts got rid of after Prop. 13). And in pre-K, because so many of the students were from poor households, we all got lunch. It was yet another learning opportunity - table manners, sitting with people other than your friends.
If you want to experiment, experiment with lower defense spending. Give us pre-K. It works.
Dana's statements of fact, and her analysis, are spot-on. I post this reply to give my own testimony as to my life experience.
I was born in NYC. There, I attended (private) nursery school; and public pre-K plus most of kindergarten. Then my dad's company built a new building out of the city where commercial land was cheap. His choice was to work there, work at company headquarters, or leave the company. So off we moved to the suburbs.
They looked at houses only in the highly-rated school districts. Still, in ten or eleven weeks in this suburban kindergarten, it became very clear that I had already learned things in NYC that these suburban kids had yet to learn. As I went through my public-school years in a school district so good as to be almost comical (I think 5% of my HS class attended Ivy League schools), it became clear that the highest achievers either had started in NYC (where pre-K was available) or were children of teachers. Or both.
Nursery school and pre-K were good for socialization. They gave professionals an opportunity to detect and address issues early. They allowed us to have exposure to art and music (which many California school districts got rid of after Prop. 13). And in pre-K, because so many of the students were from poor households, we all got lunch. It was yet another learning opportunity - table manners, sitting with people other than your friends.
If you want to experiment, experiment with lower defense spending. Give us pre-K. It works.
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My son in Brooklyn says that a private pre-school costs 32,000 USD per child. They have twins. Lucky you live in Santa Monica.
33
Yup. AEI should do a study of all its wealthy supporters and find out what percent actually pony up for expensive preschool for their own kids. I can save them the effort: the percentage is 100. Study their performance later on.
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Then, Gail Collins makes a tawdry "hands" reference, with a predictable litotes apology, and an equally predictable scolding (but not really!) from Mr. Brooks. So, back to the dignity question...
Seems to me these two end up being the very flowering of the punditry they purport to disdain. Disappointing at best. Where's the honest, thoughtful discussion of political dignity in this conversation...
I guess we'll have to rely on the Dalai Lama to weigh in, since the two authors both tripped up in their responses.