This bill is an irresponsible act of our Senators. It elevates the tension between USA and Saudi Arabia. It will be an expensive litigation nightmare with no end in sight. On average, 9/11 victims were compensated with 1.8 million/victim. It was 3 times more than a soldier killed in the war following the 9/11 attack. Is it fair? In the same irresponsible manner, should Senate allow or encourage Oklahoma City bombing victim family to sue US Army? Timothy McVeigh, a Bronze Star Army veteran who was responsible for the bombing. Where is the wisdom of our senators? Get back to work to benefit our country.
Terible idea. Terrible idea. And all the craven politicians are signing on to it, only because they want to appear patriottic. Meanwhile, Americans could take a serious financial hit to their 401ks if the Saudis start selling off assets! But no one cares about that.
If there's any substance to the "9/11 Truth" claims that a U.S. shadow government cabal, and not Osama bin Laden and Al Qaeda, engineered the attacks on the Pentagon and WTC, then I'd expect the Saudis to raise that defense here. If they don't, then that would seem to explode the massive 9/11 conspiracy theory.
Good move for a change! Next should be release of the findings what actually Saudis role was in 9/11 - it is never too late to know how Saudis pulled it through (and how W saved them by frying them out of the country on the day of the tragedy). It si also shame that Obama does not have guts to embrace this sane move by the US senate.
Just look at the Kosovo article in the current NYT:
http://www.nytimes.com/2016/05/22/world/europe/how-the-saudis-turned-kos...®ion=top-news&WT.nav=top-news
http://www.nytimes.com/2016/05/22/world/europe/how-the-saudis-turned-kos...®ion=top-news&WT.nav=top-news
This won't go far. Way too many parties would do anything to keep anything related to 9/11 out of a real courtroom with a jury and decent lawyers. The amount of unanswered questions are just astounding. Even if you discount any kind of so-called "conspiracy theories" (which takes some real blinders to say the least..) the failures of the US to defend its own territory, the allowing of potential terrorists from Bin Laden's own family to fly during the no-fly period, the fact that it took several years for an official report of WTC7 to be created, and it just goes on and on. And then when you start looking at the responses..the hastily (in fact, previously) written Patriot Act, the invasions of two countries...
If there ever was a public court case, with a jury, and an impartial judge, any kind of defense attorney could start wheeling out all manner of embarrassing stuff, to the point that it would take an executive order to shut it all down before it got completely out of control and Bush and Cheney and Rice and others would have to be hauled in to testify under oath..and their testimonies would be so full of holes that the judge would have to charge them with felonies!
If there ever was a public court case, with a jury, and an impartial judge, any kind of defense attorney could start wheeling out all manner of embarrassing stuff, to the point that it would take an executive order to shut it all down before it got completely out of control and Bush and Cheney and Rice and others would have to be hauled in to testify under oath..and their testimonies would be so full of holes that the judge would have to charge them with felonies!
Saudi Arabia didn't sponsor these attacks. One could justify that the state knew radical islamists from Saudi were transplanting themselves in the west, including the us. That was and is true today. They work continuously to export dissidents that may threaten the monarchy.
However, I don't believe for a second that they were directly involved. It was their export of evil tjat should be addressed in a court of law.
Mostly, I'm behind the investigation and blocking of Saudi immigrants while this plays out.
But the never ending greed of families that have already collected very generous reparations from the tax payers, insurance companies, and private donations is astounding; no sympathy. Sometimes bad things happen for no reason at all. Shame.
However, I don't believe for a second that they were directly involved. It was their export of evil tjat should be addressed in a court of law.
Mostly, I'm behind the investigation and blocking of Saudi immigrants while this plays out.
But the never ending greed of families that have already collected very generous reparations from the tax payers, insurance companies, and private donations is astounding; no sympathy. Sometimes bad things happen for no reason at all. Shame.
Great efforts went into making Saudi Arabia look like they masterminded 9/11. Having 15 out of 19 hijackers of Saudi origin sure helped. The Wahhabi extremist ideology sure helped. The barbaric beheading execution custom of criminals sure helped. Women oppression and poor human rights record sure helped. The fatwa religious decree system did not help at all.
But the Saudi Arabian government did not support Al-Qaeda. In fact, they exiled Osama Bin Laden and stripped his citizenship after the Khubar Towers terror act. Bin Laden was more interested in the fall of the Saudi's for colluding with the US and putting American interests above those of the Saudi citizens.
Only one Saudi prince had an axe to grind. He was resented by the rest of the royal sons and cousins for being "the son of an African slave." He alone colluded with successive US administrations in a series of to make the Afghani Mujahidin movement possible, and he alone once more made the chaos in Syria possible by recruiting jihadists and twisting arms in Jordan and Turkey to enable free movement for ISIS.
I'm not going to add anymore for now.
But the Saudi Arabian government did not support Al-Qaeda. In fact, they exiled Osama Bin Laden and stripped his citizenship after the Khubar Towers terror act. Bin Laden was more interested in the fall of the Saudi's for colluding with the US and putting American interests above those of the Saudi citizens.
Only one Saudi prince had an axe to grind. He was resented by the rest of the royal sons and cousins for being "the son of an African slave." He alone colluded with successive US administrations in a series of to make the Afghani Mujahidin movement possible, and he alone once more made the chaos in Syria possible by recruiting jihadists and twisting arms in Jordan and Turkey to enable free movement for ISIS.
I'm not going to add anymore for now.
1
The more I think about this, the more I think Obama should call the Senators out on their political grandstanding bluff and actually threaten to pass the law when it hits his desk. Watch how quickly it this thing dies in Congress if he comes out with that promise. "I'm out of here boys. Have fun with the endless civil lawsuits that will be arriving by the truckload from foreigners around the world!"
1
Both Saudi Arabia and Israel are fighting the release of these pages with ferocity.
Saudi Arabia is more public and rancorous, while Israel has silently lobbied and continues to lobby both House and Senate.What is not stated is that Chuck Schumer has taken all sorts of flak from Israeli officials because he sponsors the bill.
We need to ask Israel, as well as Saudi Arabia to step up and let the American Public know how deep their involvement was.
Saudi Arabia is more public and rancorous, while Israel has silently lobbied and continues to lobby both House and Senate.What is not stated is that Chuck Schumer has taken all sorts of flak from Israeli officials because he sponsors the bill.
We need to ask Israel, as well as Saudi Arabia to step up and let the American Public know how deep their involvement was.
6
The Wahabi/Salafist ideology that is the foundation of the house of Saud, is taught in madressas all around the world, financed directly by the members of the royal family.
This is the EXACT same ideology that form the foundation of the belief system of the groups such as Boko Haram, Daesh, Al Queda, Al Nusra.... Terrorist groups we are spending $billions to fight.
What is wrong with this picture.
This is the EXACT same ideology that form the foundation of the belief system of the groups such as Boko Haram, Daesh, Al Queda, Al Nusra.... Terrorist groups we are spending $billions to fight.
What is wrong with this picture.
6
About time the USA got its "allies" right? Slow learner?
3
"A bill that would let the families of those killed in the Sept. 11 attacks sue Saudi Arabia ..passed the Senate unanimously..."
Incredible and encouraging.
"the White House, which has threatened to veto the legislation."
Of course , you only need 2/3 to override! How about also prosecuting the Bush/Cheney gang along with accomplices after the fact including...
Incredible and encouraging.
"the White House, which has threatened to veto the legislation."
Of course , you only need 2/3 to override! How about also prosecuting the Bush/Cheney gang along with accomplices after the fact including...
3
I'd love to put the Saudi's feet to the fire but....
Can you imagine how many foreign citizens would want to sue the US for OUR misadventures....
It's a bad can of worms to open....
Can you imagine how many foreign citizens would want to sue the US for OUR misadventures....
It's a bad can of worms to open....
1
So let's let Saudi's off the hook for the a HUGE crime because we are afraid others may take us on for crimes we have done?
2
Some would consider the Vietnam war, support for right wing death squads in Latin America, and the war in Iraq to be huge crimes. Were the Saudis behind those? It is a bad can of worms to open.
Sounds like a great idea except to be fair about it, Iraq as a country and every Iraqi should be able to sue Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld and the US Government for the destruction of their country, the killing and maiming of their civilians for starting a war under false pretenses. Every Chilean who lost a friend or a relative in the US instigated coup should be included also. The same with the Ukraine. And, of course, we shouldn't forget the relatives of those 'allowable margin of civilian casualties' of drone strikes across the world.
2
Crazy we had to wait 15 years to do this. Forget the "usual suspects" Iran and Iraq. Almost all these murderous fanatics came from our "beloved" ally Saudi Arabia! We should perhaps rephrase that to the Bush famoliy's close business partners. With friends like the Saudis and their extremist (basket case) cousins, the Pakistanis, who needs any enemies?!
3
Ask yourself this:
If the Saudis have nothing to fear, why would they protest this?
Ask yourself this: Why is Obama protesting this?
Duh?
If the Saudis have nothing to fear, why would they protest this?
Ask yourself this: Why is Obama protesting this?
Duh?
4
Because, at least on the face of it, SA and Jordan are our allies. It's easy to chest-thump when your foreign relations experience is nil. And folks should read the bill. It applies only to American killed in U.S. soil through acts of terrorism.
1
They're protesting because the US kills thousands (tens of thousands by some estimates) of citizens in its "counter terror" raids and air strikes. If the US begins to sue other countries over deaths and injuries those countries were complicity responsible for, then other counties will sue the US for the deaths and injuries the US is explicitly responsible for.
It's the same reason the US does not belong to the International Criminal Court - US military and intelligence actions are sometimes illegal and the US doesn't want to be held accountable for its actions abroad.
It's the same reason the US does not belong to the International Criminal Court - US military and intelligence actions are sometimes illegal and the US doesn't want to be held accountable for its actions abroad.
Why is Saudi Arabia a U.S. friend?
What does that says about the U.S.?
Saudi Arabia was behind the 9/11 attacks.
Why U.S. protecting Saudi Arabia?
Was U.S. also behind the 9/11 attacks?
What does that says about the U.S.?
Saudi Arabia was behind the 9/11 attacks.
Why U.S. protecting Saudi Arabia?
Was U.S. also behind the 9/11 attacks?
3
Innocent people get convicted. Look at the number of death sentences reversed in the past 20 years. Having done no wrong going the legal process is itself something to fear. Why should nations be any different?
Senator Schumer: Your cousin Amy might be able to educate you about the fears of those who don't have Senatorial protections and enjoy legions of lawyers at their command.
Senator Schumer: Your cousin Amy might be able to educate you about the fears of those who don't have Senatorial protections and enjoy legions of lawyers at their command.
1
"Senator Chuck Schumer of New York, a Democrat and a sponsor of the bill, said the legislation would help the families of the victims seek justice. “For the sake of the families, I want to make clear beyond the shadow of a doubt that every entity, including foreign states, will be held accountable "
Of course as long as the terrorist state of Israel , Schumer`s declared 1st concern , is not sued but continues to get its $4 billion/yr gift from the AIPAC controlled Congress (30 billion so far).
Of course as long as the terrorist state of Israel , Schumer`s declared 1st concern , is not sued but continues to get its $4 billion/yr gift from the AIPAC controlled Congress (30 billion so far).
7
Duncan, very profound post. It is true. But know that Israel also does not want this report out due to 3 of the pages alleging Israel knew prior to the attacks and that Mossad failed to inform us.
2
Of course, one of the problems with dissing old friends is that they may decide to air your dirty laundry. The Saudis are all too familiar with much of the CIA and MI6 skullduggery in the region. It has been said that 911 was the brainchild of US intelligence. If it was, the Saudis likely have details. There is very little actual evidence of a 911 conspiracy. Who knows, the Saudis may enlighten us on the subject.
1
A Republican president would do exactly as Obama. Democracy.
1
Given that Osama bin Laden publicly called for the overthrow and death of the Saudi Royal family back in the 90s, I, for one, find it hard to believe that that Saudi government directly provided support to al Qaida.
2
Interesting legislation - so any victims of IRA bombings or their relatives can sue US citizens that raised money to fund Irish terrorists. The US courts will become very busy once this becomes law. Sue Saudis to show us how its done and then everyone else will return the favour.
3
The White House and the State Department are are probably looking at this as a matter of realpolitik and that's fine. The White House should keep saying "don't do it" but Congress should go ahead and pass the bill. There's nothing dearest in this world to the Saudi royal family than money and the best way to hold them accountable for what they did to us is to make them pay through the nose. By the way, does the bill include a provision to sue Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld et al as well? I think it should.
3
My concern is will we be sued by the Iraq's families who lost loved ones for a war of choice started by the Bush family? As for Schumer he has always been predictable and wouldn't expect differently.
2
If Trump gets into the white House, there will be a larger cast of defendants. He has been threatening to expose other players behind the scenes. One of his main real estate competitors in had three asbestos filled buildings demolished for free. He almost pulled of a "per incident" or double your money claim on the insured buildings. Trump will call out all of the players who knew details of the attack and remained silent.
2
so if I was an Iraqi man i could go to an US court for the destruction of my country??
3
The Guardian had a few days ago an article in which it claims that everything in the famous "28 pages" has already been published in other documents that have been released. So it will not be hard to find evidence.
http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/may/13/september-11-saudi-arabia...
However, I am not fond of this strange American habit of suing foreign governments, as it goes against international law. And there can be little doubt that if citizens of Iraq, Libya and Syria adopted the same standards in suing the US they would be able to bankrupt it many times.
http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/may/13/september-11-saudi-arabia...
However, I am not fond of this strange American habit of suing foreign governments, as it goes against international law. And there can be little doubt that if citizens of Iraq, Libya and Syria adopted the same standards in suing the US they would be able to bankrupt it many times.
9/11 was a tragedy, as you chase Saudi Arabia through your courts, for as you say justice, will you allow the likes of Vietnam to do the same to you? Iraq? Afghanistan? The countless other countries where your country has meddled in, causing death to the inhabitants? I like the trend you set, it should be same for everyone, shouldn't it? United Kingdom is no different, neither Russia, it is just total abuse of power, by corrupted people in government.
4
Those documents linked to make it crystal clear that Saudi Arabia, at the highest levels of government, actively collaborated and conspired in 9/11. Saudi Arabia attacked the US entirely provoked, murdered just under 3,000 people, and nothing happened to them. In contrast when Japan attacked the US and killed 2,403 soldiers they were invaded, bombed by nuclear weapons, occupied, and laws were set in place that exist to this very day.
Dangling towards the end is this question:
"To what extent have the U.S. Government's efforts to investigate possible ties between the Saudi Government and/or Royal Family, and the September 11th attacks been affected by political, economic, or other considerations?"
This is the question I think the whole world wants answered.
After reading those reports on Saudi Arabia this law being passed is far too little much too late. The US would have been entirely justified invading Saudi Arabia, occupying the country, rewriting their laws, and deposing their government.
Dangling towards the end is this question:
"To what extent have the U.S. Government's efforts to investigate possible ties between the Saudi Government and/or Royal Family, and the September 11th attacks been affected by political, economic, or other considerations?"
This is the question I think the whole world wants answered.
After reading those reports on Saudi Arabia this law being passed is far too little much too late. The US would have been entirely justified invading Saudi Arabia, occupying the country, rewriting their laws, and deposing their government.
1
Hopefully the US are ready to be sued by their numerous victims since WW2, e.g.:
- The U.S. CIA's (along the UK) overthrow a democratically elected Iranian government in 1953 to plant the Shah of Iran infamous dictatorship that they had to endure for decades,
- The U.S. (along the UK, France, etc) supported Iraq war against Iran, helping decades-old CIA's asset Saddam Hussein pinpoint his chemical strikes on Iranian troops among others.
- The U.S. attacked two Iranian oil rigs and sank or damaged six Iranian vessels, including two naval frigates after one US missile frigate run into an Iranian mine from the iraq-iran war.
- The U.S. navy shot down the Iran Air Flight 655 airliner, killing 290 civilians aboard, including 66 children.
- The U.S. and allies sanctioning economically, sabotaging, bombing civilians and assassinating scientists all while claiming to wish talks about a military nuclear program 16 US intelligence agencies assess as stopped since 2003. (*)
etc.
(*) "U.S. intelligence agency officials interviewed by The New York Times in March 2012 said they continued to assess that Iran had not restarted its weaponization program, which the 2007 National Intelligence Estimate said Iran had discontinued in 2003" (wikipedia, NYT "U.S. Faces a Tricky Task in Assessment of Data on Iran", March 17, 2012)
- The U.S. CIA's (along the UK) overthrow a democratically elected Iranian government in 1953 to plant the Shah of Iran infamous dictatorship that they had to endure for decades,
- The U.S. (along the UK, France, etc) supported Iraq war against Iran, helping decades-old CIA's asset Saddam Hussein pinpoint his chemical strikes on Iranian troops among others.
- The U.S. attacked two Iranian oil rigs and sank or damaged six Iranian vessels, including two naval frigates after one US missile frigate run into an Iranian mine from the iraq-iran war.
- The U.S. navy shot down the Iran Air Flight 655 airliner, killing 290 civilians aboard, including 66 children.
- The U.S. and allies sanctioning economically, sabotaging, bombing civilians and assassinating scientists all while claiming to wish talks about a military nuclear program 16 US intelligence agencies assess as stopped since 2003. (*)
etc.
(*) "U.S. intelligence agency officials interviewed by The New York Times in March 2012 said they continued to assess that Iran had not restarted its weaponization program, which the 2007 National Intelligence Estimate said Iran had discontinued in 2003" (wikipedia, NYT "U.S. Faces a Tricky Task in Assessment of Data on Iran", March 17, 2012)
The Saudi Royal family is a criminal enterprise. It stays in power through force and by intimidation of its populace. It stays in power by appeasing the religious extremists in its realm. It stays in power by oppressing women, by Sharia Law, by disallowing religious freedom for minorities, by concentrating black gold wealth mostly to itself, by silencing dissent, by imprisoning and executing dissidents and it has carried on a shameless war in Yemen against the Shias, it loathes. It is a sectarian nabob that has spawned several members of the Islamic terror movement and it is a snake head and yet, the Clintons have cozied up to it, as have the Bushes and President Obama has been no better. I applaud the Senate's actions. Saudi Arabia, the birthplace of Osama bin Laden, sent us 9/11 and has never paid a price for this perfidy. Instead, time and again US presidents have called the Saudi royals our trusted allies. You're kidding me. Among the myriad declarations of American foreign policy, that stands out as the most bizarre to date, in my mind. As expected the Saudis, who have never been held accountable by the US, are throwing a hysterical fit, that we will suffer economic consequences for for holding them legally accountable. If that's what it takes to get justice, I say, justice feels glorious.
6
Correction toward the end when I implicated Ned Bush I meant to add Bush 43 not Bush 41. He got his booty early in the 1990's and the boot when he said Read My Lips I will raise your taxes because someone has to pay for the war I waged and it's not going to be me or my royal family.
1
If Chuck Schumer really wants to honor the dead, he should do so by forcing the government to own up to the truth. Saudi Arabia may well have been involved, but it also seems like there had to be many more people involved in what the hard scientific evidence seems to say was an "inside job". Yes, controlled demolition. Any nay-sayers should watch the Architects and Engineers for 911 Truth documentary, "The Explosive Truth." Maybe one of these days people will stop covering their ears and eyes and realize how ridiculous the official stories have been. i.e. plane hits the Pentagon, incinerates instantaneously, does not make a hole remotely close to the size of the plane,yet leaves the grass and windows unbroken and unscorched...meanwhile in NYC, 7 WTC is not hit by a plane or debris, yet it 47 stories fall to the ground faster than a falling object (i.e. faster than gravity). And we are thinking suing Saudia Arabia will help uncover what? Maybe the Saudis will at least start talking about what really happened.
2
The USA has had it eyes well fixed and its brains well attuned on the ammassed fortunes of Arab oil states for quite some time and the presumed power they can provide, though they were never managed by their owners!
High time to do something about it, which should have been anticipated and planned for by SA long ago if for no other reason the money of Iran in mind!
The real question here is Will American courts be law or policy driven and MORE importantly are American courts , to start with, really sufficiently unbiased and hence qualified to consider and render fair judgement on this,politically entangled issue ?
Why Not The Hague where issues between different countries are meant to be adjudicated and more unbiased and national disinterest are supposed to prevail.
SA will never find justice in American, politically driven, courts!
High time to do something about it, which should have been anticipated and planned for by SA long ago if for no other reason the money of Iran in mind!
The real question here is Will American courts be law or policy driven and MORE importantly are American courts , to start with, really sufficiently unbiased and hence qualified to consider and render fair judgement on this,politically entangled issue ?
Why Not The Hague where issues between different countries are meant to be adjudicated and more unbiased and national disinterest are supposed to prevail.
SA will never find justice in American, politically driven, courts!
1
So now that in the past week, Anwar al-Awlaki has been seen in testimony of an al Qaeda recruit as having shown him how to make bombs and financed him to carry out an attack, and now shows up in the National Archives release as the "spiritual mentor" of two 9/11 hijackers who even followed him when he moved from San Diego to Falls Church, and had apparently been on the FBI radar since 1999, can we have a new piece by the people who have held him up as an undeserving victim all these years, say, at least hear from Mr. Greenwald for instance?
The crickets are deafening.
The crickets are deafening.
1
A bit of good news after still living with the specter of W. literally holding hands with the Saudi leadership.
5
Fake sanctions and punishments are inevitable, taking advantages unavoidable and unescapable!
Purely, it's like "I'm the most powerful country and I need MONEY so then I will try to punish my allies for what they did along 100000xxxxxx years ago, funny".
I'm disclaiming that Saudi Gov. or Saudis are involved, that attack still vague and there are no indications and clues that Saudis or even Muslims engaged on that attack. However, Let's take it from the beginning, it happened on 2001 and on that time US news or FBI or whatever agency has announced that terrorists who did the attack, so why you are digging and exploring again since you had announced clearly. OK some of you will say "Bush Administration was not good, really!!!!!", if bush administration wasn't good why then Saudi Gov. care.. Obviously, you are suffering or you want to negotiate again to take an advantage (OUR MONEY) from a government whose never plotted for a attack.
Purely, it's like "I'm the most powerful country and I need MONEY so then I will try to punish my allies for what they did along 100000xxxxxx years ago, funny".
I'm disclaiming that Saudi Gov. or Saudis are involved, that attack still vague and there are no indications and clues that Saudis or even Muslims engaged on that attack. However, Let's take it from the beginning, it happened on 2001 and on that time US news or FBI or whatever agency has announced that terrorists who did the attack, so why you are digging and exploring again since you had announced clearly. OK some of you will say "Bush Administration was not good, really!!!!!", if bush administration wasn't good why then Saudi Gov. care.. Obviously, you are suffering or you want to negotiate again to take an advantage (OUR MONEY) from a government whose never plotted for a attack.
2
Hassan, You are not making any sense. This didn't happen 10000xxxx years ago but 15 years ago and it was covered up by people that benefit monetarily and politically by the cover up.
A lot of people lost their lives due to this cover up. And I am not just talking about the families of the victims of 911. Because of this cover up we were duped into attacking the wrong country, Iraq, which in turn caused 100's of thousand of loss of Iraqi lives and to this day is raging havoc in that part of the world.
So please take your support for the Saudi regime and their wahabi ideology, which is single most ideology contributing to world wide terrorism of our age.
A lot of people lost their lives due to this cover up. And I am not just talking about the families of the victims of 911. Because of this cover up we were duped into attacking the wrong country, Iraq, which in turn caused 100's of thousand of loss of Iraqi lives and to this day is raging havoc in that part of the world.
So please take your support for the Saudi regime and their wahabi ideology, which is single most ideology contributing to world wide terrorism of our age.
2
Entitled to your own opinins, not your own facts. Deny all you want.
1
Watch for which rats run for cover. Should not be difficult if one is paying attention.............
1
This whole idea is wronghaded, stupid and likely unconstitutional. It undermines the ability of the United States Federal Govt. to conduct its constitutionally mandated responsibilies in dealing with foreign countries, whether those countries be Islamic, Communistic, Democratic, enemies or allies.
It establishes dangerous precedent and almost certain international backlash from countries and individuals that are not just Saudis but also from a host of other countries with their own 9/11s allegedly caused directly or indirectly by the United States through decades of conduct by our own CIA, suspect private organizations and a host of individual Americans.
People and countries in Latin America, Cuba, Iraq, and Southeast Asia come immediately to the mind of this ol Vietnam Vet.
It establishes dangerous precedent and almost certain international backlash from countries and individuals that are not just Saudis but also from a host of other countries with their own 9/11s allegedly caused directly or indirectly by the United States through decades of conduct by our own CIA, suspect private organizations and a host of individual Americans.
People and countries in Latin America, Cuba, Iraq, and Southeast Asia come immediately to the mind of this ol Vietnam Vet.
14
So you are saying if a foreign government, or a certain part of it, plot a murderous terrorist attack in US that kills thousands of people should be immune from any prosecution?
1
President will veto because Saudis are President buyers. The USA has decided to support establishment of Saudi religious law in Syria and Yemen. The USA is allied with enemies of the Constitution.
1
The pain and suffering inflicted on Iraqis, something still ongoing at great intensity, if it could be quantified, is likely to be a thousand times greater than what happened on 9/11. Can Iraqis sue the perpetrators of savagery against their country, which had absolutely nothing to do with 9/11 or islamic terror in general?
If they had no responsibility for 9/11, then why are they so worried about this law that they are trying to blackmail the U.S. into not passing it?
Did not the Saudis give Hillary's foundation 11 million? I wonder how much money they have donated to her campaign through the wing tipped Ivy League lawyer lobbyists they hire on K Street? Our nation is being run for the benefit of those who pay off our politicians. Bernie says we have to change political funding. That is the only way to get the Saudis out of our government.
2
ITS about time! The corruption by both Obama & Bush have let the American People down and allowed tyranny to rein. The Saudis knew on 911 they played a huge role and yet they played US ALL for FOOLS, but now we know Bush was the reason they got away with their tyranny! And now Obama will try and veto this bill.
As I have stated many many times Obama is Our Problem and must be
removed!
Now you know why TRUMP beat Bush - not only for this - but for collapsing the US Economy through Financial Fraud twice: 1988-1992 and 2008! Plus Trump knows as many of us know Obama is a fraud!
And his Bush Buddies - The Bush Family have been a disaster for us
all! The 911 Families knew this from day one! Congratulations to the
Families, that lost their loved ones through the crimes of Saudi
Arabia!...... TIME for PAYBACK!
As I have stated many many times Obama is Our Problem and must be
removed!
Now you know why TRUMP beat Bush - not only for this - but for collapsing the US Economy through Financial Fraud twice: 1988-1992 and 2008! Plus Trump knows as many of us know Obama is a fraud!
And his Bush Buddies - The Bush Family have been a disaster for us
all! The 911 Families knew this from day one! Congratulations to the
Families, that lost their loved ones through the crimes of Saudi
Arabia!...... TIME for PAYBACK!
1
There is little doubt that the 9/11 terrorists were nourished by Wahhabi money. Even today, Saudi Royal-Wahhabi alliance and money is no doubt behind ISIS-inspired crimes and mayhem in Syria, Iraq, Afghanistan and Yemen. The problem in the U.S. is to overrule the military-industrial complex to forgo the lucrative Saudi market.
2
It's called "follow the money".
This is a good idea to go after the Saudi's for the terrible things the US. puppet has done, and it is now the time to hold the U..s. responsible for all the invasions, wars, murders and terrible things this country has done, including sending to the courts the claims by native people and black families whose ancestors were held in slavery. We also need to set court dates for all the blacks whose family members were terrorized by the white governments of the South from the beginning of the nation. It is the usual U.S. arrogance that condemns nations of the world, while ignoring, completely, our country's acts that are as bad as any thing any other nation have done, and in most causes, have inflicted more terror, misery and deprivation of life and property than terrible nations such as Saudi Arabia.
The culpability and complicity of the house of Saud in the 9/11 are incidents of the past and it is a lesser relevant issue for the country today. What will happen to the US if Saudi executes the threat of selling all their US debts overnight in the world market? What are consequences of that: will the US suffer another credit crunch and meltdown, hyperinflation and losing our ability to finance our budget deficit and debilitating the US dollar serving as a world reserve currency?
Such a terrible moment of grandstanding. Regardless of who did or did not do what in regard to 9/11 or any other international incident, this law sets a terribly dangerous precedent that will come back on us 100 fold.
Let's allow citizens to sue sovereign counties, then we can sit back and watch as hundreds of thousands of foreign citizens come after us with lawsuits. This is election year nonsense on the part of both parties.
Let's allow citizens to sue sovereign counties, then we can sit back and watch as hundreds of thousands of foreign citizens come after us with lawsuits. This is election year nonsense on the part of both parties.
1
This is great news for the hundreds of innocent victims of US drone attacks. We all know the Saudis were not behind 911, Bin Ladin was wanted by the Saudis, but we know for sure the CIA is responsible for killing Pakistani civilians.
2
And just how do "we all know?" Are you privy to documents and intel no one else has seen? We do know bin Laden was receiving funds from members of the Saudi royal family. We do kow he was living in Pakistan with full knowledge of its government. That government is solely responsible for its citizens' deaths. If you're going to weep, do so for the young women stoned for wanting an education, talking to a young man or simply to go about in public without wearing a tent.
Except in cases where someone in Pakistan is threatening the U.S. (Bin Laden) the U.S. Should turn away from such a troubled society. No drones. Nothing.
There were over 350 non-US citizens among the 9/11 victims. Would their families be able to sue Saudi Arabia as well?
2
This law is for U.S. citizens. Non-citizen families should look to their countries of origin for redress.
With wider international and domestic consequences the Senate approved legislation on the 9/11 though unsettling yet important from the point of view of establishing the truth about the ghastly tragedy of the 9/11, which is the minimum US owes to its citizens, specially the victim families of the9/11. Again, It's not necessary that the Saudi Arabian government might be directly involved in the events yet the role of some of its officials, clergy, and individual or group entities in plotting and directing the terror attacks couldn't entirely be ruled out, and that should be exposed, and accountability fixed accordingly.
6
uf they dump the note's bomb them and steal their oil . how bout dat
1
As noted here, it's bunk that Saudi Arabia is or ever was our ally. What did they ever do for us? Name one thing, please.
9
They built lots and lots of mosques and sent lots of money to educational institutions so that they would teach that islam is a religion of peace.
1
The Saudis supplied half of the oil consumed by the United States in the early 80's. The U.S. was dependent on middle east oil until 10 or 15 years ago. If there was no oil in the middle east, the U.S. would have no interest in the region.
Good, most Americans don't support the Saudi dictatorship anyway.
6
Obama would be unwise to veto this bill. Override imminent. Protecting unloyal "allies"? Trump 2016. Never forgive. Never forget.
7
Given their budget problems, the Saudis may well need to sell assets to pay for the 9/11 damages. Good that they're thinking of getting a head start. The next thing the West needs to do is address climate change and really cripple the terrorist economies by eliminating the need for their major money-earning export, oil.
4
But don't you know that climate change is what is causing islamist jihad?
I can't stand the Saudis and their wahhabism. They've been meddling with their petro-dollars for decades and accomplished nothing good in all that time. Unless you consider exporting fundamental Islamists around the world and supporting terrorists on the Sunni side of the almost 1400 year war between Shias and Sunnis a good thing.
But, if this holds up- can the descendants of the native Americans slaughtered by US troops sue the federal government for the equivalent amount? What about the Vietnamese civilians we massacred? How about those fighting on the side of the Sandinistas in Nicaragua? The Iraqi civilians that died during Bush Jr.'s shock and awe campaign against the wrong country that had nothing to do with 9/11? The civilians killed by drones living in countries we've never declared war against?
Just curious where it all ends, and who makes those decisions. Islamophobia is a misnomer, the religion has killed millions and millions in the name of Allah. No other religion is destabilizing countries and conducting terrorist attacks against civilians on a practically daily basis in the name of its deity.
But this country has its own shameful history, the stuff they omit from the history books.
But, if this holds up- can the descendants of the native Americans slaughtered by US troops sue the federal government for the equivalent amount? What about the Vietnamese civilians we massacred? How about those fighting on the side of the Sandinistas in Nicaragua? The Iraqi civilians that died during Bush Jr.'s shock and awe campaign against the wrong country that had nothing to do with 9/11? The civilians killed by drones living in countries we've never declared war against?
Just curious where it all ends, and who makes those decisions. Islamophobia is a misnomer, the religion has killed millions and millions in the name of Allah. No other religion is destabilizing countries and conducting terrorist attacks against civilians on a practically daily basis in the name of its deity.
But this country has its own shameful history, the stuff they omit from the history books.
22
What is the criteria or justification for President Obama to veto the Senate legislation?
Is the President putting economic interest above American lives?
Is he seeing that shielding the ruling House of Saud from its crime or its complicity is more important than redressing the pain and sufferings of those families who lost their loved ones in the 9/11 terrorism?
Is America truly against terrorism? Or, is it merely a lip service?
I love President Obama. I have the greatest respect for him. That is why I am worried about what his veto can do to his legacy. Please, Mr President, don't despise the wish of the majority, just to protect an "ally" in a volatile region.
Allies can be earned. Enemies should be annihilated. No favour should be shown in this task.
Is the President putting economic interest above American lives?
Is he seeing that shielding the ruling House of Saud from its crime or its complicity is more important than redressing the pain and sufferings of those families who lost their loved ones in the 9/11 terrorism?
Is America truly against terrorism? Or, is it merely a lip service?
I love President Obama. I have the greatest respect for him. That is why I am worried about what his veto can do to his legacy. Please, Mr President, don't despise the wish of the majority, just to protect an "ally" in a volatile region.
Allies can be earned. Enemies should be annihilated. No favour should be shown in this task.
6
Nobody can know for sure. Obama has read the 38 pages. Being that he has run on the platform of transparency, it should tell you the evidence is pretty damning for him to attempt to supress it. Even Bernie Sanders has refused to read the 38 pages, because he knows he can't run a campaign on transparency and refuse to disclose classified information to the public.
2
Obama may be aware, and the conservatives pushing this need to be aware, that the Bush administration would be drawn into any complete hearing and the truth coming from that would not be well received by these conservatives pushing for a hearing. If Obama had wanted a hearing he would have done it seven years ago. this is just another challenge by conservatives to put him on the spot.
Be careful what you start! The whole truth and nothing but the truth.
Be careful what you start! The whole truth and nothing but the truth.
1
The Obama administration has been a continuation of the Bush Administrations
It could be one of the few right actions to deal with global terrorism.
1
PART II (see PART I first)
Yes, some minor Saudi royals have knowingly supported Al-Qaeda (and now ISIS). There are thousands of princes in Saudi Arabia. For every prince from the sub-clan in power, awarded a plum ministry, or lucky enough to score a BMW franchise; there are several on the outs. In fact, one assassinated the king a while back. Just as a few minor royals flirted with the French Revolution, so there are certainly some who would turn on the king in a heart beat.
The fact is that the ruling clique has always been pro-American. But since they bequeathed the education curriculum in their initial grand bargain with the zealots; the kings have been unable to convincingly turn the populace toward the West.
Remember how powerful the Soviet leadership until the day it crumbled? Similarly, the Saudi Monarchy is more fragile that we think. And if it falls, it won’t be replaced by the handful of liberal intellectuals with advanced degrees in English Literature from American universities. More likely, an ISIS-like cabal would emerge.
In the province of Qassim, for example, the government would likely last less than a day. One would have to doubt the loyalty of the National Guard as well. Its existence was initially justified to occupy the Ikhwan: and many rebels, such as Juhayman of the Grand Mosque assault – and some ISIS sympathizers today – come from that institution.
So rather than suing the Saudi Royal Family over 9/11, we should be praying they hang on.
Yes, some minor Saudi royals have knowingly supported Al-Qaeda (and now ISIS). There are thousands of princes in Saudi Arabia. For every prince from the sub-clan in power, awarded a plum ministry, or lucky enough to score a BMW franchise; there are several on the outs. In fact, one assassinated the king a while back. Just as a few minor royals flirted with the French Revolution, so there are certainly some who would turn on the king in a heart beat.
The fact is that the ruling clique has always been pro-American. But since they bequeathed the education curriculum in their initial grand bargain with the zealots; the kings have been unable to convincingly turn the populace toward the West.
Remember how powerful the Soviet leadership until the day it crumbled? Similarly, the Saudi Monarchy is more fragile that we think. And if it falls, it won’t be replaced by the handful of liberal intellectuals with advanced degrees in English Literature from American universities. More likely, an ISIS-like cabal would emerge.
In the province of Qassim, for example, the government would likely last less than a day. One would have to doubt the loyalty of the National Guard as well. Its existence was initially justified to occupy the Ikhwan: and many rebels, such as Juhayman of the Grand Mosque assault – and some ISIS sympathizers today – come from that institution.
So rather than suing the Saudi Royal Family over 9/11, we should be praying they hang on.
5
If the Saudis participate, most likely in some manner of funding, they are accountable!!!!!!
1
I like it. The Saudis should bear some responsibility for fomenting political Islam.
7
Hey, help us out, give us oil, you can have my sister. What a shameful history we have had in the Middle East. We have been willing to do ANYTHING, topple leaders, forget our morals, Kowtow to absolute scoundrels for oil. I am embarrassed for the U.S.A.
6
In order for the Saudi royal family to keep at the top of the pyramid in their country they have to spread around lots of dollars to the clergy to keep the masses in line by preaching terrorism and kill the infidels!
So, they are getting caught with their hands in the cookie jar and yes they may have to pay out billions of dollars in settlements to the victims of 9/11 but in this world hitting them in the wallet is unfortunately but necessary.
I truly hope this bill passes unanimously and then when Obama vetoes it for being the terrible president that he has become hopefully the house and senate will override him . Why he would choose to defend them and not us is well just truly disgusting a trait that has become one that he has made his own!
So, they are getting caught with their hands in the cookie jar and yes they may have to pay out billions of dollars in settlements to the victims of 9/11 but in this world hitting them in the wallet is unfortunately but necessary.
I truly hope this bill passes unanimously and then when Obama vetoes it for being the terrible president that he has become hopefully the house and senate will override him . Why he would choose to defend them and not us is well just truly disgusting a trait that has become one that he has made his own!
4
Finally, after nearly 16 years, justice for the nearly 4000 people who die don 9/11 and more than 10,000 Americans died in two wars (and counting). Not to mention thousands more maimed fro life.
The exporter of Wahhabism, and funder of world wide terrorism, will soon gets it day in court. To answer to to what they have spent their oil wealth on; spilling blood. Meanwhile, in Saudi Arabia, the kingdom struggles with trying to keep its people in line, especially with the decline of oil revenue and building a Mecca Las Vegas across from the Grand Mosque. Repression and economic pain will take its toll. Especially, when more and more people learn what the House of Saud, and its connect oligarchy, helped fund middle east destabilization and various terrorist groups; like ISIS. Billions more spent on themselves, and turning their form of Islam into a faith of hatred.
Let;s hop the do nothing House has the guts to do what the Senate did. And Let's further hope that our president grows a backbone, and signs it into law. The families of thousands of Americans need closure and relief they suffered at the hands of the House of Saud.
The exporter of Wahhabism, and funder of world wide terrorism, will soon gets it day in court. To answer to to what they have spent their oil wealth on; spilling blood. Meanwhile, in Saudi Arabia, the kingdom struggles with trying to keep its people in line, especially with the decline of oil revenue and building a Mecca Las Vegas across from the Grand Mosque. Repression and economic pain will take its toll. Especially, when more and more people learn what the House of Saud, and its connect oligarchy, helped fund middle east destabilization and various terrorist groups; like ISIS. Billions more spent on themselves, and turning their form of Islam into a faith of hatred.
Let;s hop the do nothing House has the guts to do what the Senate did. And Let's further hope that our president grows a backbone, and signs it into law. The families of thousands of Americans need closure and relief they suffered at the hands of the House of Saud.
8
As much as I disagree with President Obama on many things I think he is right in this instance. This may be nothing more than witch hunt designed to enrich the bank accounts of trial lawyers.
7
It is the United States that has set the Middle East aflame. Blaming Saudi Arabia for our depredations is grotesque.
7
You would be right blaming both: the US & SA complicity (with the US shielding SA from their misdeeds by providing them the diplomatic cover -UN SC resolutions ,etc- and moreover the means for their mayhem with constant arm shipments) in the overall Middle-east mess is clear from Syria to Yemen...
"Saudi Arabia is said to be the world's largest source of funds and promoter of Salafist jihadism, which forms the ideological basis of terrorist groups such as al-Qaeda, Taliban, ISIS and others. Donors in Saudi Arabia constitute the most significant source of funding to Sunni terrorist groups worldwide (...). According to a secret December 2009 paper signed by the US secretary of state, "Saudi Arabia remains a critical financial support base for al-Qaida, the Taliban, LeT and other terrorist groups."" (wikipedia, State-sponsored_terrorism)
"Joe Biden let the cat out of the bag when he told an audience at Harvard’s Kennedy School last October: “our allies in the region were our largest problem in Syria … the Saudis, the emirates, etc., what were they doing? They were so determined to take down Assad and essentially have a proxy Sunni-Shia war, what did they do? They poured hundreds of millions of dollars and tens of thousands of tons of military weapons into anyone who would fight against Assad, except the people who were being supplied were Al Nusra and Al Qaeda and the extremist elements of jihadis coming from other parts of the world.”
"Saudi Arabia is said to be the world's largest source of funds and promoter of Salafist jihadism, which forms the ideological basis of terrorist groups such as al-Qaeda, Taliban, ISIS and others. Donors in Saudi Arabia constitute the most significant source of funding to Sunni terrorist groups worldwide (...). According to a secret December 2009 paper signed by the US secretary of state, "Saudi Arabia remains a critical financial support base for al-Qaida, the Taliban, LeT and other terrorist groups."" (wikipedia, State-sponsored_terrorism)
"Joe Biden let the cat out of the bag when he told an audience at Harvard’s Kennedy School last October: “our allies in the region were our largest problem in Syria … the Saudis, the emirates, etc., what were they doing? They were so determined to take down Assad and essentially have a proxy Sunni-Shia war, what did they do? They poured hundreds of millions of dollars and tens of thousands of tons of military weapons into anyone who would fight against Assad, except the people who were being supplied were Al Nusra and Al Qaeda and the extremist elements of jihadis coming from other parts of the world.”
PART I
As much as I’d like to pile on, the issue is a red herring. This is about the difference between state-sponsored terrorism (like Iran’s Revolutionary Guards attacking Jews in Argentina and Bulgaria) and terrorism conducted by a country’s private citizens and perhaps some minor royals.
One of the keystones of the Saudi Monarchy’s legitimacy as custodian of Mecca and Medina has been financing the spread of Islam – also a valid use of funds for private citizens to fulfill Zakat – charity giving – one of the pillars of the faith. Following the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan, global missionary work morphed into Jihad against the atheist communists, with the full support of the U.S.
When the war ended, some charities became sympathetic to the aims of Al-Qaeda – and despite some preliminary attacks abroad – donors only became hyper-aware of the type of people behind the curtain at some of their favorite charities following 9/11 itself.
Some of those terrorism-facilitators embedded in those charities might have made the journey from foreign freedom fighter in Afghanistan to global jihadist – like Osama Bin Laden himself, in fact. In any case, throughout the 90’s, it would have been relatively easy for charities to fool donors as to their true aims and activities.
After 9/11, there were no more excuses, but it’s pretty clear that Saudi donors – some of them no doubt living in the U.S. at the time of 9/11 – were unwittingly contributing to those charities.
As much as I’d like to pile on, the issue is a red herring. This is about the difference between state-sponsored terrorism (like Iran’s Revolutionary Guards attacking Jews in Argentina and Bulgaria) and terrorism conducted by a country’s private citizens and perhaps some minor royals.
One of the keystones of the Saudi Monarchy’s legitimacy as custodian of Mecca and Medina has been financing the spread of Islam – also a valid use of funds for private citizens to fulfill Zakat – charity giving – one of the pillars of the faith. Following the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan, global missionary work morphed into Jihad against the atheist communists, with the full support of the U.S.
When the war ended, some charities became sympathetic to the aims of Al-Qaeda – and despite some preliminary attacks abroad – donors only became hyper-aware of the type of people behind the curtain at some of their favorite charities following 9/11 itself.
Some of those terrorism-facilitators embedded in those charities might have made the journey from foreign freedom fighter in Afghanistan to global jihadist – like Osama Bin Laden himself, in fact. In any case, throughout the 90’s, it would have been relatively easy for charities to fool donors as to their true aims and activities.
After 9/11, there were no more excuses, but it’s pretty clear that Saudi donors – some of them no doubt living in the U.S. at the time of 9/11 – were unwittingly contributing to those charities.
1
Unwittingly? I seriously doubt it.
1
Plaintiffs deserve their days in court. But do keep in mind that they have to provide their allegations with a preponderance of evidence. In other words, evidence will be the guide, not rumor.
3
I am glad the senate passed that bill. If Saudi govt. tacitly sided with the 9/11 attackers, that should be exposed. The families have a right to sue them. If they don't win anything, that's that.
U.S. ought to gradually disengage from Saudi Arabia. Their Wahhabi brand of extremism has led to the rise of al Qaeda & ISIS. Now they themselves are becoming the victims of ISIS
U.S. ought to gradually disengage from Saudi Arabia. Their Wahhabi brand of extremism has led to the rise of al Qaeda & ISIS. Now they themselves are becoming the victims of ISIS
7
My problem with this law is not that is asks the House of Saud to be accountable nor that it does not hold the House of Bush accountable. Neither does it hold the Cheney attendants to the houses accountable.
The law rather opens wide the door to international chaos. Imagine the rightful suits by the Vietnamese, the Laotians, the Japanese, and myriad of South Americans against the terrorist actions of the US government -
Let she who is without sin cast the first stone.
The law rather opens wide the door to international chaos. Imagine the rightful suits by the Vietnamese, the Laotians, the Japanese, and myriad of South Americans against the terrorist actions of the US government -
Let she who is without sin cast the first stone.
14
Almost 15 years later the wheels of justice are moving. Will there be justice after all this time. Osama is gone but Aiman Al Jawahare is still surfacing every now and then and has not been caught.
3
Gee, what a bird flock together! A guy from IL claiming to be a progressive for over eight years in the White House decides to internally protect the criminal legacy of Bush and Cheney over the 9/11 report, which reveals the Saudi ties to Al-Qaeda and Osama Bin Laden, and how the kingdom contribute the worst terrorist attack on US soil in history in NYC. And you liberals expecting Obama to be that great, given the fact that he fought this report transparency tooth and nail? Paul Ryan was right for one thing in 2012: college graduates who are overly progressive need to stop looking at Obama posters in the childhood bedrooms and move on with adulthood. Obama is about Republican you can possibly get in Washington DC politics.
5
Senate particularly Chuck Schumer have played the
game to fool the people. The bill says Saudi Govt.
can be sued but provided no evidence of that Govt.
complicity. It makes you wonder if the senators are
rational and thoughtful people. Doubts grow every time
they act. Can't Iraq sue USA for invading the country
on false pretext, killing thousands and destroying plenty.
The shoe could be on the other foot. Lawyers are
celebrating.
game to fool the people. The bill says Saudi Govt.
can be sued but provided no evidence of that Govt.
complicity. It makes you wonder if the senators are
rational and thoughtful people. Doubts grow every time
they act. Can't Iraq sue USA for invading the country
on false pretext, killing thousands and destroying plenty.
The shoe could be on the other foot. Lawyers are
celebrating.
7
If Saudi Arabia is not liable for any aspect of 9/11 then the cases brought against them will be dismissed. What's the problem?
As far as Saudi moving assets go, in a court case when a defendant threatens or is in imminently about to move assets out of the jurisdiction to thwart collection by successful plaintiffs the court may impose restrictions to prevent such asset movement. That should be done here immediately.
As far as Saudi moving assets go, in a court case when a defendant threatens or is in imminently about to move assets out of the jurisdiction to thwart collection by successful plaintiffs the court may impose restrictions to prevent such asset movement. That should be done here immediately.
6
Since our courts ruled in favor of plaintiffs of 9/11 in a lawsuit against Iran which was shocking, I don't see why lawsuits against Saudi government should not be allowed. If we can link Iran to 9/11, Saudi Arabia is no brainer.
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-03-10/iran-told-to-pay-10-5-...
The ability to sue any government in the world and win AND collect, is something unique to US ,and perhaps our some of our Western European allies who also hold assets of foreign governments.
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2016-03-10/iran-told-to-pay-10-5-...
The ability to sue any government in the world and win AND collect, is something unique to US ,and perhaps our some of our Western European allies who also hold assets of foreign governments.
3
Thank you for pointing out this absolutely grotesque and disgraceful ruling... What a farce is this American "justice"!
It usually takes us a long time to accept that we made a huge mistake, but we eventually do it. For example, there might still be fifteen people who believe what we did in Vietnam made any sense, and that all those soldiers died for nothing.
Iraq II was a mistake.Part of that mistake was not blaming the right country for 9/11. Enough time has passed; we should now get down to finding out (or just admitting!) what really happened. If a law court is not the best place for this, then let the government (OUR government, remember?) come up with a more effective way.
Iraq II was a mistake.Part of that mistake was not blaming the right country for 9/11. Enough time has passed; we should now get down to finding out (or just admitting!) what really happened. If a law court is not the best place for this, then let the government (OUR government, remember?) come up with a more effective way.
8
Obviously you have a short memory. Afghanistan was the one blamed for 9/11 and we carpet bombed their mountain ranges for a long time. Iraq was a strategic ploy of WMDs orchistrated by the Bush administration so that the son could finish daddy's legacy. The pathetic thing is that Iraq was the least of out worries, they had previously sold their chemical weapons to Syria to continue to float the crumbling empire. Let's not forget Sadam Hussain was found hiding underneath a farm house like a common rat.
2
Mistake? No: this was a voluntary deception made of lies and forged intel.
"[George W.] Bush wanted to remove Saddam Hussein, through military action, justified by the conjunction of terrorism and WMD. But the intelligence and facts were being fixed around the policy." (wikipedia, Downing_Street_memo)
"The Niger uranium forgeries were forged documents (...) which seem to depict an attempt made by Saddam Hussein in Iraq to purchase yellowcake uranium powder from Niger during the Iraq disarmament crisis.
On the basis of these documents and other indicators, the governments of the United States and the United Kingdom asserted that Iraq violated United Nations Iraq sanctions by attempting to procure nuclear material for the purpose of creating weapons of mass destruction." (wikipedia, Niger uranium forgeries)
Then of course:
"The United Nations secretary general, Kofi Annan, declared explicitly for the first time last night that the US-led war on Iraq was illegal. Mr Annan said that the invasion was not sanctioned by the UN security council or in accordance with the UN's founding charter." (theguardian, "Iraq war was illegal and breached UN charter, says Annan", Sep 15, 2004)
"To initiate a war of aggression, therefore, is not only an international crime; it is the supreme international crime differing only from other war crimes in that it contains within itself the accumulated evil of the whole." (Nuremberg Trials chief American prosecutor, Robert H. Jackson)
"[George W.] Bush wanted to remove Saddam Hussein, through military action, justified by the conjunction of terrorism and WMD. But the intelligence and facts were being fixed around the policy." (wikipedia, Downing_Street_memo)
"The Niger uranium forgeries were forged documents (...) which seem to depict an attempt made by Saddam Hussein in Iraq to purchase yellowcake uranium powder from Niger during the Iraq disarmament crisis.
On the basis of these documents and other indicators, the governments of the United States and the United Kingdom asserted that Iraq violated United Nations Iraq sanctions by attempting to procure nuclear material for the purpose of creating weapons of mass destruction." (wikipedia, Niger uranium forgeries)
Then of course:
"The United Nations secretary general, Kofi Annan, declared explicitly for the first time last night that the US-led war on Iraq was illegal. Mr Annan said that the invasion was not sanctioned by the UN security council or in accordance with the UN's founding charter." (theguardian, "Iraq war was illegal and breached UN charter, says Annan", Sep 15, 2004)
"To initiate a war of aggression, therefore, is not only an international crime; it is the supreme international crime differing only from other war crimes in that it contains within itself the accumulated evil of the whole." (Nuremberg Trials chief American prosecutor, Robert H. Jackson)
Perhaps a brilliant move by our President- he actually wants the Saudis to be held responsible as much as the rest of us, but the only way to get Congress to cooperate would be to say he opposes it.
7
I never understood why those rich Saudis were allowed to fly out of here without ever being detained or questioned when all the other flights were grounded. I also wonder why Mayor Giuliani or Governor Pataki didn't order police helicopters or commandeer TV station helicopters to at least make an attempt at roof rescues on the World Trade center buildings. I don't understand Republicans. They will not do what it takes to keep America safe. It sure seems like they'd rather protects their Saudi buddies than their fellow Americans. I applaud this bill and Bob Graham's efforts on declassifying the "28 pages." Ret. Sen. Graham of Florida is a real patriot, and still looks great. Maybe Sanders picks him for VP.
11
Not to mention Osama bin Laden's family members being flown out of the country while all other flights are grounded, and far in advance of any announcement of blame on Al Queda or Bin Laden, who was finally caught and killed where? In Pakistan, in their special forces' back yard, and Saudia Arabia's closest Muslim ally... A child could connect the dots.
It was better to make sure they all died. Dead men tell no tales. What is utterly ridiculous is that after the first plane, the NYC wasn't defended by everything the USAF could put in the sky...not a single fighter was scrambled?
The Defense Department (not called "offense department for some reason, I would hope) could not or WOULD NOT defend our own country...what's up with that?
The Defense Department (not called "offense department for some reason, I would hope) could not or WOULD NOT defend our own country...what's up with that?
I suggest the president get fully behind this or he will definitely go down in my personal approval ranking. I voted for him twice but this geo-politiking to keep a closed off, maximum male dominated, caste system society that secretly and overtly has a great deal of contempt for the nation that made them super wealthy is offensive to me.
Mr. Obama, are you listening?
Do the right thing here. Do not get in the way of this traumatized nation and it's most acute victims.
Mr. Obama, are you listening?
Do the right thing here. Do not get in the way of this traumatized nation and it's most acute victims.
6
Why limit the law to foreign government and not Bush Administration who ignored the warnings of Osama determined to attack USA and did not do their duty to protect America.
7
I think this is just. The House of Saud bears significant responsibility for 9/11 as the spread of religious-based terrors around the world. It's time they bear economic consequences for it.
6
What with all these GOP-trumped-up scandals geared to thwart Obama governance the one real scandal still lingers, unnoticed and seemingly forgotten. Just what were Bush/Cheney doing on the Bush ranch when they got intelligence reports that al qaeda was going to attack the US in the summer of 2001? It was a huge intelligence failure. It was on Bush/Cheney´s watch that the biggest domestic attack in US history happened, of which the catastrophic effects are still being felt ... the 30% increase in gov´t ($4 trillion for Homeland Security alone and counting), two unnecessary wars (another $4 trillion and counting), and the huge cost in blood and guts. This is the scandal that warrants investigation.
8
Maybe they were reading "My Pet Goat".
1
I’m a Sunni Muslim and I despise Saudi Royal Family for exporting their violent and radical interpretation of Islam to our country (Pakistan) and its neighboring Afghanistan, leading to disruption of civil society in both countries, radicalization of youth, and loss of countless innocent lives due to war and terrorism.
However, I find this move by U.S. Senate laughable. Americans may not know this but any educated person in Middle East knows that British helped to install Saudi monarchy and Americans have protected it since then. U.S. supported House of Saud when they were exporting their violent ideology to rest of the Middle East and Asia and continue to support this corrupt regime after 9/11. Bush administration colluded with them for oil politics and Obama administration counties to support them to ensure sales of weapons worth billions of dollars and to keep a tight control on Middle East politics. So this bill is nothing but political theatre to give illusion to ordinary Americans that their government and politicians care about them.
I hope I’m wrong.
However, I find this move by U.S. Senate laughable. Americans may not know this but any educated person in Middle East knows that British helped to install Saudi monarchy and Americans have protected it since then. U.S. supported House of Saud when they were exporting their violent ideology to rest of the Middle East and Asia and continue to support this corrupt regime after 9/11. Bush administration colluded with them for oil politics and Obama administration counties to support them to ensure sales of weapons worth billions of dollars and to keep a tight control on Middle East politics. So this bill is nothing but political theatre to give illusion to ordinary Americans that their government and politicians care about them.
I hope I’m wrong.
80
You're right.
4
At least it will give birth to a tangled web of new conspiracy theories. The JFK assassination is getting old, not to mention the 9/11 truthers and, of course, Area 51. Unfortunately the truth will be lost in plain sight -- that Americans don't mind if Muslims kill Muslims, they'll even help, as long as Muslims don't kill Americans.
2
Riz, you have been right all the way and made all the sense until you come to a point where you call it all a political theatre. I don't think the US Senators are playing a political game. May I remind you that the vote was unanimous. Even Senators deemed as close friends of the Saudis voted for this legislation. That speaks volume. Let's not disparage the Senators who have finally come together to make a right decision.
Will the conspirator addicts never stop. The actual truth is that Martians, in conspiracy with Bush and Cheyney, planned the whole thing. I read it on Facebook it must be true.
These are descendants of the folks who concluded that FDR knew about Pearl Harbor in advance.
I'm not saying that Saudi Arabia had nothing to do with it. They have been exporting terrorism forever. But is a little late, and futile to attempt to prove in a court of law responsibility. 9/11 was a supreme screw up on the part of the intelligence agencies involved. That we know. And Bush et.al. allowed it to happen. They got away with it.
This bit of grandstanding is just that, grandstanding. No good can come of it, except making the families of the victim feel a bit better.
We need to revaluate our relations with the Saudis. Playing the blame game is a exercise in futility. They have gotten away with too much in the past. It's a time for a reckoning. This bill doesn't help.
These are descendants of the folks who concluded that FDR knew about Pearl Harbor in advance.
I'm not saying that Saudi Arabia had nothing to do with it. They have been exporting terrorism forever. But is a little late, and futile to attempt to prove in a court of law responsibility. 9/11 was a supreme screw up on the part of the intelligence agencies involved. That we know. And Bush et.al. allowed it to happen. They got away with it.
This bit of grandstanding is just that, grandstanding. No good can come of it, except making the families of the victim feel a bit better.
We need to revaluate our relations with the Saudis. Playing the blame game is a exercise in futility. They have gotten away with too much in the past. It's a time for a reckoning. This bill doesn't help.
7
I agree that the classified report should be declassified (there is no national Security reason for it to have been classified in the first place. Protecting the Saudis from exposure is in their, not our, national interest).
I agree that the victims should be able to sue on the basis that the Saudi Government knowingly supported the terrorists.
However, we must be prepared for thousands of foreign lawsuits against the US government for the harm we have done all over the world. Need I point to one of our drones taking out a hospital in Afghanistan and another killing a dozen members of a wedding party. What we now call "collateral damage" will become not only a moral dilemma, but a gigantic monetary liability.
I agree that the victims should be able to sue on the basis that the Saudi Government knowingly supported the terrorists.
However, we must be prepared for thousands of foreign lawsuits against the US government for the harm we have done all over the world. Need I point to one of our drones taking out a hospital in Afghanistan and another killing a dozen members of a wedding party. What we now call "collateral damage" will become not only a moral dilemma, but a gigantic monetary liability.
4
Unfortunately you are right. Counter Terrorism is STILL terrorism. How are we any better for going to Iraq and invading their country, killing innocent people, then installing our own government. How is what we are doing to other countries any better than what is being done to us. We created ISIS by not staying out of the middle east. America is responsible for just as much if not more terrorism practiced under the guise of justice and freedom.
1
The president owes the families of the 9/11 victims and those of the four thousand four hundred and twenty five American service men that died in Iraq the truth.
No matter where it might lead to.
Or those have died in vain.
No matter where it might lead to.
Or those have died in vain.
5
More than just Americans are owed the truth, Woof. We've spilled more of the blood of others than our own.
2
The situation seems to be clearly of culpability. If POTUS is against the legislation what is the Truth of Reality. As I recall, most, if not all those on the two jet airliners were of Saudi Arabian citizenship. What are they trying to hide? Where lies the fine line between morality, truth and the American Way?
4
Aaron - Ladera Ranch - 5 hrs ago - is right - unanimous Senate fully aware this bill is hogwash, going nowhere - your tax dollars at work - lying to the American public 24/7 w no fear of ever - not even on election day - being held to account for treason, nor even for career-focussed cowardice.
4
spot on
1
Break, break with this horrendous regime, the major instigator of fundamentalist terror not only directed at US, Europe but directed predominantly at people of Muslim faith as well.
Still, disturbed at this: "Senator John Cornyn, Republican of Texas, said the legislation was written in such a way that Americans would not be subject to legal action taken by other nations".
Read this as follows: our war crimes in Iraq, one million dead Iraqis (nobody seems to bother counting anymore), four million refugees, the birth of Al-Queda in Iraq and now ISIL as a consequence of the Bush-Cheney, one-two trillion (no one counting it seems also) adventure - no risk somebody from the USA will be taken to the Hague and the suffering Iraqis slaughtered every days on the streets of their ancient cities are denied justice. Bravo!
Still, disturbed at this: "Senator John Cornyn, Republican of Texas, said the legislation was written in such a way that Americans would not be subject to legal action taken by other nations".
Read this as follows: our war crimes in Iraq, one million dead Iraqis (nobody seems to bother counting anymore), four million refugees, the birth of Al-Queda in Iraq and now ISIL as a consequence of the Bush-Cheney, one-two trillion (no one counting it seems also) adventure - no risk somebody from the USA will be taken to the Hague and the suffering Iraqis slaughtered every days on the streets of their ancient cities are denied justice. Bravo!
6
I guess you forgot that Al Queda was born in Afghanistan and the thousands of bombs we dropped on them. Iraq was a completely separate lie about WMDs after the government had fear mongerd enough of the population into viewing anyone middle eastern or Muslim as a terrorist.
2
The NYT cited that many economists are skeptical that a sell off of Saudis' assets in Treasury securities and other assets would be hard to execute and would do harm to Saudi Arabia. How ethnocentric we, Americans, are. We are judging others based on our values and beliefs. The Saudis, like most non-Americans, lives by a different cultural and value system. If the bill is also passed by the House, the Saudis would most likely sell a big chunk of their American assets. The victims of 9/11 deserve justice if the Saudis were somehow responsible but don't count on the Saudis to turn another cheek.
3
Mr. Paul, the ruling the Saudi ruling family wouldn't do it because that puts its existence at big risk.
I had to laugh when I read the "into the law of the jungle" quote. A reality the rest of the world is going to start facing up to is pretty much this: If those terrorists keep coming our way the general plan here is to kill everything that ain't American.
911 changed everything and there's not a thing on the world that will be able to protect Saudi Arabia when finally get to the bottom of this muck.
911 changed everything and there's not a thing on the world that will be able to protect Saudi Arabia when finally get to the bottom of this muck.
2
Really, Kerry...what in the world will save us for our decades of war crimes? Fair is fair, right?
4
Nothing will save us. Nothing...So either we don't need saving or we are doomed. The cool thing is: We get to get up every morning and decide how we feel about it. Too many do not...
I believe that I am correct that just recently the Supreme Court ruled that Iran could be sued for the attacks in Lebanon during the Reagan Administration. I am not taking up for the Iranians but if they can be sued why not the Saudis. After all the people bringing the law suit would have to make the case that the Saudis were involved and the Saudis could offer a defense.
The Iranians have done some bad things but I don't think that anybody thinks that they had anything to do with 9/11 or support Isis or Alquida. We like to think that Saudi Arabia and Pakistan are our friends but they are actually two of the centers of Sunni Muslim Extremism.
The Iranians have done some bad things but I don't think that anybody thinks that they had anything to do with 9/11 or support Isis or Alquida. We like to think that Saudi Arabia and Pakistan are our friends but they are actually two of the centers of Sunni Muslim Extremism.
7
I think the real reason why Saudis did 9/11 is because they wanted to punish US for swindling them out of billions of dollars in the dot-com bubble bust.
As for the the threat of US dollar assets sale being hollow, I think it's actually very serious. US cannot possibly repay even a fraction of its' debt, and the whole system is built on trust. Start the sale, ignite the panic, and there's a good chance the world banking system will suffer greatly. This may greatly diminish US influence, because US has swag as long as it pays the bills.
As for the the threat of US dollar assets sale being hollow, I think it's actually very serious. US cannot possibly repay even a fraction of its' debt, and the whole system is built on trust. Start the sale, ignite the panic, and there's a good chance the world banking system will suffer greatly. This may greatly diminish US influence, because US has swag as long as it pays the bills.
1
65% of our debt is owed to our own country, i.e., social security, government agencies. There are plenty of USA citizens and other countries who will buy up the Saudis' share of USA T-bills.
I wonder if Iraq will sue the U.S./CIA for overthrowing its government in 1953?
Who is paying all the lawyers to sue Saudi Arabia? Must be a lot of money involved.
Who is paying all the lawyers to sue Saudi Arabia? Must be a lot of money involved.
8
Reading the news today they have just done so at the International Court of Justice.
Bush, Clinton and Obama need Saudi money to continue their shining legacies enshrined in their Presidential libraries and foundations. Holding hands with Saudi Kings and Princes is a small price to pay for these generous contributions from their benefactors if you don't count the trillions spent on unnecessary wars and the million of lives destroyed by collateral damage. Only certain very privileged lives matter.
7
Bingo!
its all gesture and posturing
nothing of substance will ever come of it
nothing of substance will ever come of it
3
"...the White House, which has threatened to veto the legislation."
"Obama administration officials have lobbied against the bill,"
Why are we not listening to the President now? This bill's passage will be cutting off our economic nose to spite our face. Consider the adverse economic repercussions.
"Obama administration officials have lobbied against the bill,"
Why are we not listening to the President now? This bill's passage will be cutting off our economic nose to spite our face. Consider the adverse economic repercussions.
2
No more free passes for the Saudi's!
They are the very best at playing to ends to the middle. This time the have been nipped at the bud!
They are the very best at playing to ends to the middle. This time the have been nipped at the bud!
1
Maybe that's what we need, too, DMan. Maybe if we had to pay the horrendous price the citizens of the Middle East pay daily, we wouldn't be so quick to always be rattling our sabers like the privileged super power we are (once were?) Our day is yet to come.
2
Every victim of terrorism deserves their day in court. Their communities deserve to know exactly what the truth is. What these folks that are trying to stifle the facts don't get is they can't get away with things anymore. If this had happened last year, we would be all over the authorities to dig for the facts of their investigations or lack thereof. You know what we had to fight for last year? Medical benefits for first responders. It took the efforts of Jon Stewart to bring some star power to the hallowed halls to get 'er done. I don't know why it took so long or why there was a holdup. Doing the right thing doesn't have to be idled by peer review. Why argue against the facts? Everyone can SEE YOU. They will find out why you've done the things you're doing. There is such a thing as being on the wrong side of history. The Saudis have never been our friends. Those tin hat conspiracy nuts are right.
1
Then by your arguement there are plenty of Iraquis we terrorised with our fake war on WMDs. How many died, over a million? You do the math. Counterterrorism is still terrorism.
2
And every yahoo in the Bush/Cheney administration need to go before a criminal court. You betcha sir. The American military is rogue. Our government needs an accounting. Look at how the Navy is screwing with China in the South China Sea. See NATO build a shield that Americans pay for to keep our Baltic friends from wetting their pants at night worrying about Russia. Our unaccountable military is out of control. The weapons and arms Uncle Sam makes and sells are killing our young. America has lost her way and our government needs an overhaul. In our next incarnation we should endeavor to revert back to our constitutional rights.
Oh this is rich.
What's the difference between a country that funds terrorists and a country that funds a Military-Industrial Complex that has waged war, overthrown governments, and caused death and destruction around the world for the past half century? Corporate profits.
By all rights, this country and some Presidents should have been held legally and financially responsible for actions in numerous countries in the Middle East, Latin America, Africa, and beyond IF we lived by the same rules we apply to everyone else. The rest of the world knows and understands why the USA refuses to be a member of the International Criminal Court.
Because we're so 'exceptional', we're the exception to the rule of law, but that's the catch-22. If we allow these suits against Saudi Arabia, we're a target too. Compared to how the US Gov't does its dirty business around the world, 9/11 looked like amateur hour.
It would be the end of the USA if we were held legally, criminally, and financially responsible for our own actions. It's the real reason we must strive to remain the World's Sole Superpower, otherwise someone could change the rules and decide they too are exempt, or worse yet, make us pay for our actions.
The Golden Rule is still the best guide to justice. Don't do to others what you wouldn't want done to you.
What's the difference between a country that funds terrorists and a country that funds a Military-Industrial Complex that has waged war, overthrown governments, and caused death and destruction around the world for the past half century? Corporate profits.
By all rights, this country and some Presidents should have been held legally and financially responsible for actions in numerous countries in the Middle East, Latin America, Africa, and beyond IF we lived by the same rules we apply to everyone else. The rest of the world knows and understands why the USA refuses to be a member of the International Criminal Court.
Because we're so 'exceptional', we're the exception to the rule of law, but that's the catch-22. If we allow these suits against Saudi Arabia, we're a target too. Compared to how the US Gov't does its dirty business around the world, 9/11 looked like amateur hour.
It would be the end of the USA if we were held legally, criminally, and financially responsible for our own actions. It's the real reason we must strive to remain the World's Sole Superpower, otherwise someone could change the rules and decide they too are exempt, or worse yet, make us pay for our actions.
The Golden Rule is still the best guide to justice. Don't do to others what you wouldn't want done to you.
9
Unanimous vote. A rare unity in the Senate personifying the angst of the American people.
Finally, all the intelligence reports pointing the accusing finger at the ruling House of Saud is vindicated.
Riyadh is not only responsible for 9/11, but it is also responsible for promoting terrorism around the world. The terrorist attacks in western capitals is a crude reminder from the Saudis to the West to keep their hands off Islam. The ruling House of Saud is opposed to moderate Islam, which is a threat to its conservative, medieval Wahabbism whilst the West was just the opposite - supporting moderate Islam.
But what is very dumbfounding is that, US administration after administration, be it Democrat or Republican, having full knowledge of Riyadh's role in promoting radical Islam, was playing coy and continues to shield the House of Saud from criticism.
Now Saudi Arabia is openly threatening to upset the US apple cart by warning that if the legislation passes, it might begin selling off up to $750 billion in Treasury securities and other assets in the United States.
Now the big question is, should the US succumb to such threats and let the House of Saud off the hook? Should President Obama veto the Senate legislation?
If President Obama vetoes the Senate legislation he will be leaving a legacy that will be remembered as a big blot in his judgement. At worst, he will no longer be held in endearment.
That's going to be a big price for him to pay.
Finally, all the intelligence reports pointing the accusing finger at the ruling House of Saud is vindicated.
Riyadh is not only responsible for 9/11, but it is also responsible for promoting terrorism around the world. The terrorist attacks in western capitals is a crude reminder from the Saudis to the West to keep their hands off Islam. The ruling House of Saud is opposed to moderate Islam, which is a threat to its conservative, medieval Wahabbism whilst the West was just the opposite - supporting moderate Islam.
But what is very dumbfounding is that, US administration after administration, be it Democrat or Republican, having full knowledge of Riyadh's role in promoting radical Islam, was playing coy and continues to shield the House of Saud from criticism.
Now Saudi Arabia is openly threatening to upset the US apple cart by warning that if the legislation passes, it might begin selling off up to $750 billion in Treasury securities and other assets in the United States.
Now the big question is, should the US succumb to such threats and let the House of Saud off the hook? Should President Obama veto the Senate legislation?
If President Obama vetoes the Senate legislation he will be leaving a legacy that will be remembered as a big blot in his judgement. At worst, he will no longer be held in endearment.
That's going to be a big price for him to pay.
6
It's an election year, Senate has to save face to get re-elected, lest we remember their failures, shutting down the government, passing legislation to take away our freedoms. Nobody remembers that, just the noble gesture of allowing families to sue Saudi Arabia.
The memos written by the 9/11 Commission staff members seem to
incriminate the Saudi government to the extent the White House, to the
degree it opposes the proposed legislation, is in the ignominious position
of retroactively sanctioning these murders.
incriminate the Saudi government to the extent the White House, to the
degree it opposes the proposed legislation, is in the ignominious position
of retroactively sanctioning these murders.
Maybe there is something here - or could be a wild goose chase similar to the hunt for the 2nd shooter on the grassy knoll. Before accusing the Saudis there should be provable or even plausible motive; especially of a crime of this magnitude. What could it be?
There is no logic to a Saudi government complicity. In fact there is overwhelming logic to the contrary. Schumer's legislation bears all the evidence of a politically driven witch hunt; letting the cats run wild, and certain to damage international relations beyond Saudi Arabia. This is not the way to end an alliance just because some don't like the Saudis.
There is no logic to a Saudi government complicity. In fact there is overwhelming logic to the contrary. Schumer's legislation bears all the evidence of a politically driven witch hunt; letting the cats run wild, and certain to damage international relations beyond Saudi Arabia. This is not the way to end an alliance just because some don't like the Saudis.
4
Considering the Senate has the ability to read the 38 classified pages and then pass legislation to allow this. When the rest of us, including yourself, have no ability to read the pages, you have to be a special kind of ignorant to think that it is unwarranted.
Fifteen of the 19 hijackers were Saudi. Not one Iraqi. SA made both Cheney and Bush rich before their time in the white house. Prince Bandar was so ingratiated into the Bush family his nickname was Bandar Bush. The only planes allowed to fly right after 911 were those taking members of the Bin Laden family out of the US. Read House of Bush House of Saud. It's been known forever that Iraq had about as much to do with it as Tahiti, and that SA is the biggest financial supporter int the world of wacko Wahhabist extremist Islam. Hussein was a bad guy but if he's seen Bin Laden walking down the street before 911 he would certainly have had him shot on the spot - Hussein thought he was god, so he didn't like the competition. I really thought when the troops were massing in Kuwait that they would head South, not North. We really are an awfully stupid bunch of people when it comes to the world to let Cheney do this to us. When you read about rednecks attacking a Sikh temple afterwards thinking they are Arab you realize that as a country in general a large percentage of us is just too stupid to even know who our enemies are. I remember in the Atlanta airport just hearing some idiot lady saying "we had to retaliate against Iraq for 911." Maybe we should reconsider spending 95% of history class in high school learning only about the US. And now we're going to elect Trump or Clinton, who supported the war?
11
It is widely known that there would not have any Islamic Militancy WITHOUT Saudi money. Because of rise in oil price, these Arab Sheikhs has so much money.......that they look for the way to spend that money, resulting global tension and rise in Islamic militancy. Only answer to this problem is alternative to fossil fuel.
6
Wow, the first intelligent bill I've seen in months.
Maybe it will help erase that image in my mind of Bush holding hands with an Arab sheik.
Maybe it will help erase that image in my mind of Bush holding hands with an Arab sheik.
3
The Republican controlled senate is hoping to do just that during an election year.
When can Americans sue the US government for criminal negligence and incompetence leading up to 9/11 and the individual politicians and bureaucrats responsible? What about suing Bill Clinton who had 10 opportunities to kill Osama? What about the Clinton officials who erected a communications barrier between the CIA and FBI? What about the failure of our government to put in place a safe, effective and manageable immigration and visa system and intelligence system in 50 years? What about the Clinton and Bush officials facilitating Saudi Arabia's shenanigans and taking their money? Ask yourself how many hundreds of billions did we spend on the FBI, CIA. and NSA before 9/11?
Do you ever notice how our government officials and politicians are never held accountable for incompetence, negligence and failure...even if thousands of us are killed? All we get out commissions (jobs for old payrollers), investigations that never end, pointless congressional hearings that establish nothing and media hype until the next athlete or movie star scandal. Can a sane adult believe that the same 9/11 slaughter won't happe tomorrow!
Do you ever notice how our government officials and politicians are never held accountable for incompetence, negligence and failure...even if thousands of us are killed? All we get out commissions (jobs for old payrollers), investigations that never end, pointless congressional hearings that establish nothing and media hype until the next athlete or movie star scandal. Can a sane adult believe that the same 9/11 slaughter won't happe tomorrow!
6
I guess now Congress is going to take up Iraq claims against the US.
6
SA is (was) our "ally" because they had the oil. Back in the day when they shut it off, we were caught empty-handed, so we had to kiss a lot of Saudi posteriors so we'd get our oil again. And because of that, SA got a pass on everything.
Well, new game now. WE have plenty of oil but of course over the decades our "relationship" with SA got more and more complex so this will be a tough one to unwind, but face it, we don't need them, and most of all, they no longer get a pass on being, well, terrorists.
Well, new game now. WE have plenty of oil but of course over the decades our "relationship" with SA got more and more complex so this will be a tough one to unwind, but face it, we don't need them, and most of all, they no longer get a pass on being, well, terrorists.
As disturbing as the possibility of Saudi complicity in 9/11 is the even more disturbing fact that the U.S. government is eager to keep American citizens in the dark about it.
If the Saudi government really is free of guilt then releasing an uncensored account of the 9/11 investigation should be welcome by both them and the president.
Self-evidently, something very sinister is being hidden from our view, and we citizens are being regarded like little children by our government.
If the Saudi government really is free of guilt then releasing an uncensored account of the 9/11 investigation should be welcome by both them and the president.
Self-evidently, something very sinister is being hidden from our view, and we citizens are being regarded like little children by our government.
56
I'm all for opening up the princely gangs who rule Saudi Arabia to litigation from the families of those killed in the September 11 attacks. Let the US courts weigh the evidence and decide.
I'm also all for the facts, outside as well as inside the courts. The NYT needs to cease, therefore, picking out absurd comments repeating absurd conspiracy theories that don't have an ounce of actual hard evidence to support them.
It's when I read the most highly recommended comments here that I really begin to see where that idiot Trump gets his clueless supporters from.
I'm also all for the facts, outside as well as inside the courts. The NYT needs to cease, therefore, picking out absurd comments repeating absurd conspiracy theories that don't have an ounce of actual hard evidence to support them.
It's when I read the most highly recommended comments here that I really begin to see where that idiot Trump gets his clueless supporters from.
1
The only people who will benefit from this are the tort lawyers. The victim compensation fund has enriched NY law firms to the tune of billions of dollars. Senator Schumer you should be ashamed of yourself!
5
The article states that the Saudi government said it would sell "up to $750 billion" in Treasury securities and other US assets to avoid the possibility of them being frozen by US courts.
The actual total may be far less than that. The US government yesterday disclosed total US Treasury holdings by country, for the first time. Saudi Arabia owns $116.8 billion. Certainly there may be other government-owned assets in the US that are at risk, but not anything approaching a quarter of a trillion dollars.
This threat - which is what it is - looks all the more hollow now.
The actual total may be far less than that. The US government yesterday disclosed total US Treasury holdings by country, for the first time. Saudi Arabia owns $116.8 billion. Certainly there may be other government-owned assets in the US that are at risk, but not anything approaching a quarter of a trillion dollars.
This threat - which is what it is - looks all the more hollow now.
Their threat to sell 700B worth of assets, mostly Tbills is not only a hollow threat, but wouldnt affect our economy at all. For every dollar of supply of the treasury bills that comes on the market there is 3-4 dollars of demand, that's why the rates are so low, even if and it'a a big if were to somehow sell all of their holdings at once, they would quickly get picked up by other buyers, other nations, the FED, and other US institutions, the US treasury market is the largest and most liquid market on the planet. What else could they do, stop selling us their oil? Ha, ha, ha. (we dont need or buy much of it anyomore, as we make our own) Let's get these terrorists to account, for far too long we looked the other way as people that clearly hate us called us their friends, while plotting against us, and funding terrorism.
2
So if the Saudis can be sued in the U.S., why can't people abroad do the same, such as in cases where they were tortured or held in prison without trial?
7
Just Imagine for a moment, if Barack Hussein Obama had ordered the FBI to let the Saudis living on American Soil to fly out of the Country after a Terrorist Attack that killed more than 3000 Americans when all other Planes were grounded.
Mr Obama would have been impeached for Treason, not G. W Bush who on top of that, took the U.S to a. $2 Trillion War against Iraq a country that had nothing to do with 9/11.
Mr Obama would have been impeached for Treason, not G. W Bush who on top of that, took the U.S to a. $2 Trillion War against Iraq a country that had nothing to do with 9/11.
26
they have the right to pass the legalization and the saudi government has the right to sell the $750 billion in Treasury securities. If there a just court, the saudi government will sell the oil in the Russans or china currency. then let the wicked iran save america economy.
1
And we can stop buying Saudi oil and impose sanctions? While I am not advocating it, if we can bring down the Russian economy, we can make a dent in another country.
When is someone going to bring G.W. Bush to justice for his deception of the American people and creation of a war unsupported by evidence? Add Cheney, Powell, and Condoleeza Rice in too.
23
About bloody time, too. As Tom Friedman pointed out recently, neither the Saudis nor Pakistan are our allies - they are just geopolitical conveniences.
3
If the President signs this bill, the only way Saudi Arabia gets off the hook is by hiring O.J Simpson's lawyers.
3
I just want to know why Obama is resisting this. What’s wrong with you, Mr. President?
4
Even if the 9/11 victims can hold Saudi Arabia responsible for the attacks and sue the kingdom, it won't extradict those who had financially supported the hi-jackers, nor the clerics, who spread the austere vision of Islam - the Wahhabism - overseas, for fear of alienating its domestic audience.
Congress is also playing to the strong emotions in the public triggered by this dispute. Many Americans think their government take the Saudis' side, fearing it would damage its relationship with an important ally in the Arab world.
This bill will only fray the US-Saudi ties, if the 28 pages - set to be declassified - reveal that the attacks were clearly linked to Saudi Arabia.
Congress is also playing to the strong emotions in the public triggered by this dispute. Many Americans think their government take the Saudis' side, fearing it would damage its relationship with an important ally in the Arab world.
This bill will only fray the US-Saudi ties, if the 28 pages - set to be declassified - reveal that the attacks were clearly linked to Saudi Arabia.
2
Congress should know better than to pick on someone who sells us oil.
1
Congress knows that oil is very last century and even the Saudis have admitted that that day might not be too far off. We get most of our oil from other places. The former Gulf Oil states are suddenly realizing that their usefulness to the West may be ending.
That is the only reason this report is getting through Congress.
That is the only reason this report is getting through Congress.
1
"Sells us oil" you mean "sold" us oil. We don't need them anymore, so now we can sacrifice a pawn to make the Republican controlled senate look good during an election year.
So the Justice Department is fine with prosecuting Russian sports cheats who cheated on Russian soil half a world away, but the POTUS won't hear of the families of American citizens who died in a terrorist attack on American soil having their day in court, and hasn't had time in eight years to prosecute bankers that ruined the lives of millions, but also just happen to be major donors to the Democratic party and the largest contributors to the president's heir presumptive?
Glad we have our justice priorities straight.
Glad we have our justice priorities straight.
9
I am so sick of hearing this party this, that party that. This isn't a party issue, this goes way beyond party affiliation and who gives what to whose campaign. Superficial rot compared to what this could bring about, that is if it isn't all show and a sham, once again.
We're talking about hundreds of thousands dead, American, Afghans, and Iraqis (not counting those who died in the sanctions prior to the invasion) and all the thousands still dying in the quagmire (yes! I said it but only because they NYT won't let me call it what I really want to call it), how many maimed, all the children who've never known life without war, that all of these lies, deceit and greed have created...decades worth, in our name, without our permission, even when millions of us marched and organized against what we knew were lies.
I'm so sick of this giant pissing match between the U.S, and Russia, played out in other countries besides our own, between the Republicans and Democrats to decide who the next lot to lie and hide things from us will be, and do horrific things, once again in our name, for our national interests, for our national security. Who the hell are we that we deserve so much better lives and security, just by accident of where we were born?
We're talking about hundreds of thousands dead, American, Afghans, and Iraqis (not counting those who died in the sanctions prior to the invasion) and all the thousands still dying in the quagmire (yes! I said it but only because they NYT won't let me call it what I really want to call it), how many maimed, all the children who've never known life without war, that all of these lies, deceit and greed have created...decades worth, in our name, without our permission, even when millions of us marched and organized against what we knew were lies.
I'm so sick of this giant pissing match between the U.S, and Russia, played out in other countries besides our own, between the Republicans and Democrats to decide who the next lot to lie and hide things from us will be, and do horrific things, once again in our name, for our national interests, for our national security. Who the hell are we that we deserve so much better lives and security, just by accident of where we were born?
2
Too late now. If I'd been president during 9/11, I would have ordered diplomatic relations cut between the Tragic Kingdom and the U.S. for the mere fact that 15 of the terrorists were Saudi nationals. If 15 Americans had crashed jetliners into buildings in Saudi Arabia, or any other nation, murdering 2800 people,they probably would have reacted the same way.
7
It is beyond shameful that the White House is working against this legislation.
Saudi Arabia is the central sponsor. and financier, for all of the Sunni terrorism around the world. They are a medieval, misogynist, racist State. Why in the world are would we want to protect them against our own citizens?
Any veto would be shameful and any party that did not override the veto shall, and will, be voted out in November. It will be a top issue.
Saudi Arabia is the central sponsor. and financier, for all of the Sunni terrorism around the world. They are a medieval, misogynist, racist State. Why in the world are would we want to protect them against our own citizens?
Any veto would be shameful and any party that did not override the veto shall, and will, be voted out in November. It will be a top issue.
3
Seems to me if we know of Saudi involvement and who, a drone would have been the appropriate response.
As Thomas Pychon wrote In Gravitys Rainbow ,"War is a business of buying and selling." Look at all the money Halliburton has made over there. Include the rest of the military industrial complex with an incredible appetite for profit and new contracts , and you have several profitable conflicts around the world. Oh and the troops and luckless civilians, collateral damage.
4
As if the 28 pages would lead to anything truly spectacular... Analysis of the vast amount of "evidence," or lack thereof, more importantly -- would be taken into serious consideration and provided for peer review. That way, "truthers," or "people who acknowledge that the laws of physics are well established," would be able to draw a more clear picture of what happened that day. But, I'll stop there -- the insulting, distortion-of-reality campaign has evidently been extremely effective thus far. Until citizens understand that asking questions is not treasonous, and is actually their duty as an American, the proverbial "Sleeping Giant" may just awake from its slumber -- or coma, for that matter.
2
GWB let the Saudis return home after 9/11. Obama protects them from prosecution. This is not a red vs blue issue. This is the most powerful people in the country turning a blind eye to American deaths to keep oil money flowing and their donors happy. Bush should have been investigated by the current administration but Obama/Pelosi gave him immunity. Making this a partisan issue is doing a huge disservice to the discussion and the problems at hand.
56
As a true blue democrat I am aghast at Obama and the democratic leaders collusion in this apparent coverup.
Common knowledge: the Bush family has been in bed with the Saudis for generations. Study the formation and dismantling of the Middle East after WWI - who did what to whom (British, French, Arabs, American businesses and businessmen, etc.) And with that historical reference as a backdrop, did you really think we invaded Iraq because WMDs were actually there? Did you conveniently forget about all that oil, the sale and distribution of which made a very special group of insiders and their companies very very rich? Were you really surprised that buffoon Bush et. al. made sure to get the relatives of the Saudi royal family safely out of harm's way after 9/11? How blind and stupid were we!
Never too late to hear from George W., Chaney, Rumsfeld, et. al and hold them responsible for the harm they did to this country - whoops, sorry! They're all too busy being happily, safely retired with lots of money and no threat of facing criminal actions for their blatant fiduciary violation of the public trust. First responsibility of the President: protect America and its citizens. First responsibility of that prez and his cronies was to benefit themselves irrespective of the cost in American lives and treasure - and bear no responsibility for the spreading Middle East turmoil that continues to follow and escalate. We citizens reap what we allow to be sown by the leaders we elect. Remember that on voting day in November 2016.
Never too late to hear from George W., Chaney, Rumsfeld, et. al and hold them responsible for the harm they did to this country - whoops, sorry! They're all too busy being happily, safely retired with lots of money and no threat of facing criminal actions for their blatant fiduciary violation of the public trust. First responsibility of the President: protect America and its citizens. First responsibility of that prez and his cronies was to benefit themselves irrespective of the cost in American lives and treasure - and bear no responsibility for the spreading Middle East turmoil that continues to follow and escalate. We citizens reap what we allow to be sown by the leaders we elect. Remember that on voting day in November 2016.
6
Okay, so who could I vote for in November 2016 that would be any more moral than Bush, Clinton or Obama?
You bring up a very distrptive and disturbed question because all of them have a piece of the cake and come from the same establishment, in my point of view what is giving momentum to this bill is that the American oil cartel who contibuted to republican and democrat campaigns doesn't need the saudis anymore so it hasn't lobbied against it but Obama isn't on the ballot!
Wow, those pages implicate about two dozen Saudi government employees and countless Saudi-sponsored "students".
Don't hold you breath though Americans, nothing will come out of this bill, as the Saudis just bought 12 billion dollars worth of American arms. They are at this very moment using them on civilians in Yemen and funneling them to terrorists in Syria, so they will place a lucrative new order very soon.
Don't hold you breath though Americans, nothing will come out of this bill, as the Saudis just bought 12 billion dollars worth of American arms. They are at this very moment using them on civilians in Yemen and funneling them to terrorists in Syria, so they will place a lucrative new order very soon.
12
Even if it were to pass, King Pinocchio would never sign it.
America and its citizens FIRST and always, Mr. President!
5
Explosive situation. The Saudis will win this, rightly or wrongly. It's a complicated issue.
3
There is absolutely no doubt that Saudi citizens were involved and are to be pursued and punished. However, proving that the Saud Arabia government itself was involved is going to be a hard task. Not considering for the moment the merits of the case, it's just what is needed to create more chaos and confusion in that benighted region. In 1923, Gertrude Bell warned the West that entering into Pakistan was a losing battle, but territorial and oil interests have seduced the West into this unwinnable war.
4
Pakistan was not a nation in 1923. It was still part of India.
Former Florida Governor and Senator Bob Graham knows what's in the 28 pages relative to Saudi Arabia in investigations of potential complicity of that country in the 9/11. Part of this involves a rich Saudi family living in Sarasota at that time with frequent visits by the 'pilots' of the attacks doing flight training at an airfield nearby in Venice. The family suddenly left about two weeks before the attacks.
It's time to reveal what Senator Graham has demanded for years: release those 28 pages now.
It's time to reveal what Senator Graham has demanded for years: release those 28 pages now.
10
If it should come to pass that this bill is signed by a president, both former presidents bush and vice president cheney should be named as co-defendants in any legal action against the Saudis. The events of 9/11 have been smothered with official obfuscation from that day on, with way too many facts and occurrences hidden from public knowledge and scrutiny. It's particularly telling that w. resisted the formation of an investigative body, even in the face of so many unanswered questions and so many dead and injured.
It's fact that both bushes have been on the Saudi payroll for years at a stretch, and no mystery that, due to this, the bin Laden family was allowed to leave the U.S. on the day NO OTHER commercial air traffic was allowed.
It's fact that both bushes have been on the Saudi payroll for years at a stretch, and no mystery that, due to this, the bin Laden family was allowed to leave the U.S. on the day NO OTHER commercial air traffic was allowed.
13
The Bushes hold hands with the Saudis. W. lets them fly out of the country right after 9/11 when all planes are grounded before they can be interrogated. No suspicions here. They're all guilty of something and have to be investigated, including Cheney.
15
this is a joke
Iraq and Afghanistan will ask you about many deaths caused by America
the world do not forget what happen in Japan by US government
Hiroshima and Nagasaki by your nuclear weapon
Bye Bye America
Iraq and Afghanistan will ask you about many deaths caused by America
the world do not forget what happen in Japan by US government
Hiroshima and Nagasaki by your nuclear weapon
Bye Bye America
6
One word: Money. Any other country that allowed the kind of terrorism that the Saudis did and still does would not have the cozy relationship it has with the United States without some quid quo pro. They brought terrorism to our front door on 9/11 yet they literally walked away from it unscathed. Politics, like life, is a game where the obvious can be overlooked when ignorance is more profitable.
6
It's about time. There is so much evil that has been hidden from the American people and for what end? Money? Greed? No doubt, nothing good. In a recent report by the Guardian "Declassified documents detail 9/11 commission's inquiry into Saudi Arabia" - there is a chilling quote from a former staff commission worker:
"he was annoyed that so much attention has been focused on “the 28 pages” when, in fact, the commission had full access to the congressional report and used it as a roadmap to gather new evidence and witness accounts that demonstrated sinister connections between low-level Saudi government officials and a terrorist support network in southern California."
Can we finally have some justice please................
"he was annoyed that so much attention has been focused on “the 28 pages” when, in fact, the commission had full access to the congressional report and used it as a roadmap to gather new evidence and witness accounts that demonstrated sinister connections between low-level Saudi government officials and a terrorist support network in southern California."
Can we finally have some justice please................
4
You know, you really haven't lived until you've sat in a public theater and watched Fahrenheit 9/11, sharing the communal gasps and groans with your fellow audience members over the Bush family's many-generational relationship with the Saudi royals. If it's 100% accurate, you'll want to kill yourself. Even if it's only 20% correct, my advice would be to take up drinking.
2
Dear Mr. Mazetti,
I realize you don't know much about foreign relations (why would you?).
"The legislation, which will now be taken up in the House and is opposed by the White House, is another sign of escalating tensions between the U.S. and Saudi Arabia."
But there are no escalating tensions between the U.S. and Saudi Arabia, because the government of Saudi Arabia has a relationship with the government of the United States, not with Donald Trump and his allies, the radical extremist Republican Congressional leaders who think we will defeat ISIS...with the help of Saudi Arabia...in spite of the fact that we are kicking our allies every chance we get.
I'm not saying Saudi Arabia SHOULD be our ally; I'm just saying that, like them or hate them, Saudi Arabia IS our ally.
I realize you don't know much about foreign relations (why would you?).
"The legislation, which will now be taken up in the House and is opposed by the White House, is another sign of escalating tensions between the U.S. and Saudi Arabia."
But there are no escalating tensions between the U.S. and Saudi Arabia, because the government of Saudi Arabia has a relationship with the government of the United States, not with Donald Trump and his allies, the radical extremist Republican Congressional leaders who think we will defeat ISIS...with the help of Saudi Arabia...in spite of the fact that we are kicking our allies every chance we get.
I'm not saying Saudi Arabia SHOULD be our ally; I'm just saying that, like them or hate them, Saudi Arabia IS our ally.
2
President Obama was against going into Iraq. He realized the dangerous mistake that the Bush administration was making. Before the White House decides to reject this Senate endorsed, the President needs to stand in front of the American people and explain WHY this inconceivable atrocity occurred, as well as the sensible way it will be handled. If it is going to be rejected, we better hear a damned good reason why. And if it's going to be approved, well then let's get on with this final path to 9/11 closure. It has been an open wound for too long.
3
Bravo Senate Dems for demanding that Obama stop protecting the Saudis! 9/11 may be over and W may be gone from power, but Obama continues the kowtowing to the Saudis by selling them weapons to kill 1500 Yemeni children per year and providing intelligence to kill 6500 Yemeni adults, as well as fighting a senseless war in Syria on the kingdom's behalf. Release the 28 pages and let the chips fall where they may.
10
The Senate is Stoopid. Can't wait for other other countries begin to sue us. It would have been better to diminish the foreign aid we send them.
4
The fact that the Senate was able to have a unanimous passage of the bill works into the favor of both Obama and the 911 victims, yet it all depends on what Paul Ryan, (an Obama Fan Boy) does to pass or block the bill in the House.
If the bill passes the House with enough votes to make it difficult to veto Obama can still Veto the bill maintaining good personal relations with the Saudis. Once it is sent back to the House and Senate it will then be up to the D GOP to help get it passed. If they succeed in a veto override their approval ratings will rise just in time for a November Bump, and the 911 victims and families will benefit as well.
If the override fails, then the House representatives, and Senators who voted for passage can claim they are on the right side of history.
Obama has a choice to make, either way his approval rating would have a marginal negative hit for a veto, as well as a small bump for signing it into law.
If the bill passes the House with enough votes to make it difficult to veto Obama can still Veto the bill maintaining good personal relations with the Saudis. Once it is sent back to the House and Senate it will then be up to the D GOP to help get it passed. If they succeed in a veto override their approval ratings will rise just in time for a November Bump, and the 911 victims and families will benefit as well.
If the override fails, then the House representatives, and Senators who voted for passage can claim they are on the right side of history.
Obama has a choice to make, either way his approval rating would have a marginal negative hit for a veto, as well as a small bump for signing it into law.
Good news. The alternative is taking the hidden 28 pages and burning them so that we don’t anger an “ally” in the region. After decades of watching this behavior, I’m convinced the U.S. – supposedly the most powerful nation on the planet – is interested only in maintaining strategic alliances. But after decades of this, doesn’t one think that our “allies” know how to push our buttons in order for us to behave? I’ve seen enough placating of dictators and repressive regimes in my time to be thoroughly sick of it. A temporary setback. They’ll get over their sucky when they collectively realize how much they rely on US.
6
While a hard core group of frustrated people want to say 9/11 was an inside job, which is patently absurd, there was definitely some things afoul... namely outright incompetence or negligence, as well as politically expedient actions that sought to play the "status quo" at the expense of exposing the truth. The truth being that key Saudi Arabian people fostered those attacks, to not only make money on the incident, but to further Saudi agenda. Saudi Arabia detests our Western way of life. The only reason why they've "played ball" with us is because we needed their oil. It has been a dubious relationship for decades. And then George W. Bush acquiesces by letting them off the hook, because this wonderful coincidence paved the way for the war he always wanted.
2
Why is it patently absurd? So all our defense systems were on an exercise that day and we were left basically wide open to an attack. And those steel framed buildings just crumpled in what looked like a controlled demolition. And then building number 7 collapsed in straight freefall. I'm not frustrated. I'm logical and realize that the story were being told is a lie.
5
And let's not forget that intact passport from one of the terrorist from those planes. After a fiery crash. What a coincidence!
4
Spot on. And the biggest perpetrator of the lies that 9/11 was an inside job are the Saudis. What do they have to fear if this bill passes? Besides potentially on the hook for billions, they will have to eat the gossip words they have helped spread.
While we're at it, we (and victims of Wahabi-inspired terrorism the world over) might consider suing the United States government for financing the institutional proliferation of Wahabi Islam in Saudi Arabia since at least 1946. See http://www.mei.edu/content/saudi-wahhabi-islam-service-uncle-sam for details. Recall that our government's Cold War strategy of stoking the flames of Islamic fundamentalism (to create a local buffer against the "godless" Communists in Afghanistan and the larger region) - as well as our more recent strategy of removing Middle Eastern strongmen by force and then leaving power vacuums that can easily be filled by militants - are among the most important causes of the terror crisis the world faces today.
Needless to say, the resolution discussed in this article will not pass. It would open up the U.S. to far more severe legal troubles than Saudi Arabia.
Needless to say, the resolution discussed in this article will not pass. It would open up the U.S. to far more severe legal troubles than Saudi Arabia.
6
The Senate Bill has happened because U.S. foreign policy is skewed with regard to Saudi Arabia and Pakistan. We are trying to coordinate with them to fight terrorism while at the same time, both states sponsor terror on behalf of maintaining personal, home rule longevity and regional power. There isn't anyone in the Middle east we can trust and work with (except for Jordan)--not even the money laundering Emirates. The U.S. knows this but just keeps following the same failed policies. President Obama should be out of town when this bill reaches his desk so he can let the five days lapse. Message to Pakistan and Saudi Arabia? We're simply going to stop dealing with you guys.
4
Saudi Arabia has been living off the generosity of the American taxpayers for too long. I want to see the kingdom crumble.
As for the administration of GW Bush ignoring the warnings of a terrorist attack, it may be true, but let's not forget this happened because of the failure of the previous administration of WJ Clinton to capture and kill Osama bin Laden, who was practically being handed over to the U.S. But Clinton didn't want to risk possibly killing a few "innocent" civilians standing near bin Laden, so he allowed him to continue on his merry way to killing thousands of people on 9/11.
As for the administration of GW Bush ignoring the warnings of a terrorist attack, it may be true, but let's not forget this happened because of the failure of the previous administration of WJ Clinton to capture and kill Osama bin Laden, who was practically being handed over to the U.S. But Clinton didn't want to risk possibly killing a few "innocent" civilians standing near bin Laden, so he allowed him to continue on his merry way to killing thousands of people on 9/11.
4
the Bush legacy lives on. why do we let conservatives make any decisions? everything they do is wrong.
12
Let the Saudis sell off their US treasury assets. As an American, I would tolerate the impact, whatever it may be. They are a pegged currency anyway, so they would be shooting themselves in the foot. If not guilty, what are they worried about? They are not an ally; they merely pose as one:
- Built and funded the madrassas attended by the female terrorist in S. Bernardino
- '98 bombings of our east African embassies
- Al Qaeda
- Bin Laden
- 9/11
- ISIS (thank you wiki leaks)
- bombings of the only group fighting AQ in Yemen where our drone war was not successful
- excuses for not carrying out a single anti ISIS attack in Iraq and Syria
- a decline to our president's invite to hold a Syria peace conference
- Have threatened to dump $700B worth of US treasuries if congress passes a law allowing Saudis to be sued for 9/11
Yes, both our parties consider them our "ally", but why? Why are we allowing our arms sellers so much discretion over how we conduct foreign policy?
The KSA is an inept partner who could not even organize its 34 member coalition against terror. It's closest friends, Pakistan and Indonesia reacted with surprise when their names were included in the coalition. The whole female vote...another publicity sham. Let's call a spade what it is.
- Built and funded the madrassas attended by the female terrorist in S. Bernardino
- '98 bombings of our east African embassies
- Al Qaeda
- Bin Laden
- 9/11
- ISIS (thank you wiki leaks)
- bombings of the only group fighting AQ in Yemen where our drone war was not successful
- excuses for not carrying out a single anti ISIS attack in Iraq and Syria
- a decline to our president's invite to hold a Syria peace conference
- Have threatened to dump $700B worth of US treasuries if congress passes a law allowing Saudis to be sued for 9/11
Yes, both our parties consider them our "ally", but why? Why are we allowing our arms sellers so much discretion over how we conduct foreign policy?
The KSA is an inept partner who could not even organize its 34 member coalition against terror. It's closest friends, Pakistan and Indonesia reacted with surprise when their names were included in the coalition. The whole female vote...another publicity sham. Let's call a spade what it is.
6
Elon Musk and his Tesla's could gut this country's addiction to gas/oil by three quarters or so. Many paths to peace, let's use them all. Oh, and take care of business once and for all with the matter at hand.
4
Are you suggesting that the righteously angry American public stop gulping Saudi oil? Oh my, oh my. Now that is radical. You didn't get the memo - it's all about those evil Bushes and their love of the Saudi royal family and Cheney and Wahabism - it all has nothing to do with us. We are entirely innocent. We've done everything to reduce our consumption of MIddle Eastern oil and no one was in favor of Gulf War II in 2003. Not one American.
Can't wait for Bush and Cheney getting interrogated for their involvement in 911 (=actively protecting the planers of the attack). That's called high treason. Maybe they should try some of their own medicine and use waterboarding to get out some answers..
The fact that democrats are trying to block the files from declassification only shows their true nature. Hillary brags about publishing UFO files, but giving the population (and not just the US one!) a real and relevant piece of truth about the nature of the political environment they are living in is off limits.
That is why so many are just fed up and say: Trump for president!
The fact that democrats are trying to block the files from declassification only shows their true nature. Hillary brags about publishing UFO files, but giving the population (and not just the US one!) a real and relevant piece of truth about the nature of the political environment they are living in is off limits.
That is why so many are just fed up and say: Trump for president!
6
If money is the root of all evil,
and oil is the root of all money,
then oil is the root of all evil,
and Saudi Arabia is the root of lots of oil and lots or evil.
and oil is the root of all money,
then oil is the root of all evil,
and Saudi Arabia is the root of lots of oil and lots or evil.
8
it becomes more interesting, Senate OKed to let people sue a sovereign country to compensate the victims-reward and enrich the lawyers-halluajah-Saudi has enough money to nourish the feeding frenzy the lawyers for several decades. Now, theoretically Iraqi and Afghanistan can sue The United States of America because we destroyed their country, killed and crippled several hundred thousands based on manufactured bogus evidence plus ridiculous excuse. When Timothy McVeigh bombed Oklahoma Federal Building, killing several hundreds of federal employee, did US send the troops and bombed Upstate NY where he is from? To kill the rats, can US justify invading and destroy the entire nations? This argument will not fly to most of American yet think about close to 5,000 Americans were killed during this fiasco and all of those killed plus injured can sue George W Bush plus majority of the Capitol Hill Members who were eager to stamp the war.
6
The Saudi's have been and always will be key players in the religious turmoil of the Middle East. It is here that the seeds of terrorism have been born in the name of The Prophet and who is legitimate heir to his leadership. Just how involved they have been has been hidden in the latest version of "the sands of time". Well perhaps now we should find out something. But one can not absolve Bush for his blatant lies regarding who was doing what to whom and, in doing so, led us to attack the wrong target. This of course has led to this never ending war against new enemies, some of whom undoubtedly have Saudi support for the same reasons they had it "how many years ago??"
And in the end remember that the Arabs never liked each other and are now living in countries cobbled together by colonial powers.
And in the end remember that the Arabs never liked each other and are now living in countries cobbled together by colonial powers.
3
Finally some sanity in our dealings with the Saud family, The term Saudi Arabia is a misnomer. It gives the impression this is real country. It is a large piece of real estate with lots of oil blow it controlled by one family. A more appropriate name would be the Saud Estate.
9
So the Saudis threaten to sell off assets in the U.S. It would be easy to freeze such assets until pending lawsuits are settled and that is likely to take decades. Meanwhile, the price of oil continues to diminish. Check and mate... the game is over.
1
Obama will just veto it but I say it about time & yes I blame Bush as much as I dislike Obama. It is true he( Bush) let some of his Saudi friends get out of the country & protected then. I never understood why we went to war with Iraq when they had nothing to do with 9/11 so I hope the families get justice.
The Saudis have always used us to protect themselves and I am glad to see this go down against then.
The Saudis have always used us to protect themselves and I am glad to see this go down against then.
1
I need some help to understand this
The US gov allows private citizens to sue the Saudi gov for their involvement in 9/11 but does not take any action against them? Really?
So the lawyers and civil courts should deal with it??
Is this not all just about the money???
Looks like to fam of 9/11 victims are not into the truth but to cash out more $$$$
The US gov allows private citizens to sue the Saudi gov for their involvement in 9/11 but does not take any action against them? Really?
So the lawyers and civil courts should deal with it??
Is this not all just about the money???
Looks like to fam of 9/11 victims are not into the truth but to cash out more $$$$
3
Hey Congress, while you're at it, how about releasing the 28 redacted pages of the FBI report on 9/11 that show the Saudis involvement in that attack?
Who is being protected?
We allegedly live in a democracy and we would like to know what's in those 28 pages. Now.
Who is being protected?
We allegedly live in a democracy and we would like to know what's in those 28 pages. Now.
8
For a serious tie-in do some reading on the financial ties between the House of Saud and the Bush Family. According to various sources, the Bush family has been awash in Saudi money for years. Journalist/author Craig Unger in his book "House of Bush, House of Saud" traced millions "in investments and contracts that went from the Saudis over the past 20 years to companies in which the Bushes and their allies have had prominent positions – Harken Energy, Halliburton, and the Carlyle Group among them." According to the Boston Herald, that includes a $1 million gift from Prince Bandar to the Bush Presidential Library in Texas." And when GW's businesses were failing, who bailed him out? That House of Saud, of course, with loans in the millions that were written off the next day.
117
Craig Unger is one of the most definitive authors on the subject. Glad you brought him up.
Add Russ Baker's "Family of Secrets" to the must-read list.
The Saudis who may have sponsored terrorism in the past are unlikely to be deterred from violence by lawsuits against their country. In fact, retaliation may set off further attacks and suffering for many. In theory, that shouldn't deter lawsuits. In reality, are we willing to pay the price?
While I do not think the rulers of the House of Saud had a DIRECT hand with Bin Laden in planning the 9/11 attacks- I don't understand how the Saudis cannot be made to take responsibility for creating the culture that foments the hatred of the West and all the things we stand for. They promote Wahhabism and that's what they teach in their madras' in effect brainwashing their youth in radical Islam. They do this as a means of controlling their population in the extreme- and the West and other Muslim nations take the negative consequences of jihad.
It's a prime example of just how sick ,bizarre and illogical this country is. How can they think this brainwashing their people to hate the West as well as the Shia Muslims will not have extreme consequences. But, at the same time, they are supposed to be our allies. The leaders come to the West and enjoy Western lifestyle they wouldn't dare to participate at home. The hypocrisy is mind boggling- but more than that- the stupidity of unleashing extreme radicalism that has now come to haunt them... ISIS and other radicals are in fact threatening the Saudi monarchy. They created this monster and now cannot control it. The promote Sharia law and their culture is based on it but they had no foresight into how destructive that would be to themselves. The monarchy has total authority but even they cannot abolish or don't want to abolish Wahhabi and their madras system of religious education. They will never admit they are the problem.
It's a prime example of just how sick ,bizarre and illogical this country is. How can they think this brainwashing their people to hate the West as well as the Shia Muslims will not have extreme consequences. But, at the same time, they are supposed to be our allies. The leaders come to the West and enjoy Western lifestyle they wouldn't dare to participate at home. The hypocrisy is mind boggling- but more than that- the stupidity of unleashing extreme radicalism that has now come to haunt them... ISIS and other radicals are in fact threatening the Saudi monarchy. They created this monster and now cannot control it. The promote Sharia law and their culture is based on it but they had no foresight into how destructive that would be to themselves. The monarchy has total authority but even they cannot abolish or don't want to abolish Wahhabi and their madras system of religious education. They will never admit they are the problem.
4
I know you won't let my comment be submitted cause you never do. Can we finally admit that our government was complicit with 9/11? I know it's a hard pill to swallow. Bush/Cheney/Rumfeld let it happen. Horrifying, I know. There were too many weird "coincidences that day.
6
9/11 was the new grassy knoll. There were operatives inside our own guvment. We don't want to admit to that sad truth cause if we did we would know we got played.
4
I'm all for holding the Saudi government accountable if they had a hand in this. But what stops the Iraqi people from suing this country for our actions? The damage continues to this day.
20
This appalling, autocratic, medieval-religion-supporting, women-torturing, terrorist-coddling state has been able to get away with not modernizing their primitive ideologies for decades due to their oil. Now that they can no longer blackmail the west so effectively, it's time they paid for their considerable sins. It's particularly rich to see them have to deal with a newly-empowered Iran. These two regimes deserve each other.
1
"Obama administration officials have lobbied against the bill"...
Oh goody, get ready for another "largely manufactured narrative"
Oh goody, get ready for another "largely manufactured narrative"
3
If the Saudi monarchy thinks the threat of selling off U.S. Assets is real threat then they should think twice, if there is a possibility that there was Saudi government involvement then all of their U.S.-based assets would be frozen and they may not ever see them again.
Sometimes the evidence is right before your eyes, planted there by those who demand your unquestioning loyalty while they engage in cynical criminal treasonous behavior in plain sight. The assassinations of the Kennedys, Martin Luther King, others. The holding of the hostages in Iran until Reagan was elected, followed by the clearly treasonous Iran-Contra deal. The stealing of the 2001 election, followed by 9/11 and the intensive propaganda campaign to invade Iraq for no good reason. Each brazen act that the brainwashing machine gets away emboldens them for the next even bigger misdeed. And in the end, the American people finally get mad and...
elect Donald Trump.
elect Donald Trump.
3
Let me get this straight.
This is the same Senate that refuses to recognize global warming accelerated by use of fossil fuels, and insists that use of renewable energy sources shall not be promoted by the government in any meaningful way in the US?
If the US can become (and remain) free of imported energy through use of renewables, one could reasonably assume as a nation we could blissfully have little to no interest in the internecine squabbles of the Mideast, nor in the resulting decline in the fortunes of the KSA.
Just saying. All this political grandstanding serves little purpose but to give out a quick feel good lashing.
Revenge is a dish much better when served cold.
Weaning the US off of imported energy, creating a sustainable industry with good tech jobs and helping the climate .... looks like a permanent win-win-win from here, without all the high drama of making a fresh set of enemies.
This is the same Senate that refuses to recognize global warming accelerated by use of fossil fuels, and insists that use of renewable energy sources shall not be promoted by the government in any meaningful way in the US?
If the US can become (and remain) free of imported energy through use of renewables, one could reasonably assume as a nation we could blissfully have little to no interest in the internecine squabbles of the Mideast, nor in the resulting decline in the fortunes of the KSA.
Just saying. All this political grandstanding serves little purpose but to give out a quick feel good lashing.
Revenge is a dish much better when served cold.
Weaning the US off of imported energy, creating a sustainable industry with good tech jobs and helping the climate .... looks like a permanent win-win-win from here, without all the high drama of making a fresh set of enemies.
2
Next step: all the redacted and hitherto classified documents about the
Dancing Israelis, and the FBI arrests of the Israeli "Art Students". This is all connected to 911.
Another government that can be sued.
Dancing Israelis, and the FBI arrests of the Israeli "Art Students". This is all connected to 911.
Another government that can be sued.
2
It's long since past time we started holding the Saudis accountable. Their possible involvement in 9/11, as abominable as that was, is the least of their crimes, in comparison to the beheadings, amputations, suppression of rights of all kinds, and treatment of 50% of the human population (women) like cattle. The abuse and oppression of black south Africans was nothing at all to the abuses practiced in this country, and yet the whole world agreed to sanctions on South Africa. Oh but wait: the Saudis have oil, don't they. Yes, different story.
Drive the smallest car you possibly can, folks, and send the barbarian Saudis back to their caves, until they are ready to grow up and join the 21st century. The Saudis are nothing other than ISIS, established. Let's all be clear on this. Obama, sign this bill. If we are anything other than very hostile to this appalling nation, we are hypocrites all.
Drive the smallest car you possibly can, folks, and send the barbarian Saudis back to their caves, until they are ready to grow up and join the 21st century. The Saudis are nothing other than ISIS, established. Let's all be clear on this. Obama, sign this bill. If we are anything other than very hostile to this appalling nation, we are hypocrites all.
3
I've always felt that our true enemy in all of this has not yet shown his face. It would indeed be shocking to learn that the Saudi government was directly complicit in 9/11. I don't think it's true. Proof of that would be a terrible, unavoidable fact that would parallel December 7, 1941 in history. However, it would not surprise me at all to learn that one or more wealthy Saudis supported and financed 9/11. It's reasonable to assume that Osama bin Laden had a few like-minded associates at home in the Kingdom.
49
What makes you think Osama even existed in the media sense..? We never got to see his body nor did we receive any evidence whatsoever regarding his "death". Said "death" also happened to come exactly when it would have the largest impact on Barry's popularity. If there is one thing my 30+ years as an American has taught me, it is this: The government lies. Constantly.
If Americans can litigate against the Saudi's then what is to stop the Iraqi's, Afghans, Yemeni's, Pakastani's and whoever else we killed with errant drone strikes from taking us to court? When does the litigation end?
7
It's tragic if some people were allegedly killed by errant drone strikes, but if those people weren't in the way, they would not have been killed.
Not one condemnation of Obama's threat in the top 20 comments.
3
How stupid and typically Republican. If you can suit Saudi Arabia then you should also be able to suit George W Bush, Dick Cheney, and the Republican party for knowing a year in advance and having been warned by President Clinton that Bin Laden was going to attack; and Doing Absolutely Nothing about it.
So the US Senate is going to start blaming and sueing nations? How stupid. Thats like sueing Scotland because Trump is Scottish.
The Saudis have no control over individual terrorists just like the US Government had no control
over Timothy McVeigh.
The Republicans never surprise me with their stupidity, ignorance, and lack of depth and understanding. Sooner or later the USA has to ask itself as a nation whether the Republican party makes a contribution to the USA or is a conplete and total waste and laughingstock that does nothing but damage the country.
So the US Senate is going to start blaming and sueing nations? How stupid. Thats like sueing Scotland because Trump is Scottish.
The Saudis have no control over individual terrorists just like the US Government had no control
over Timothy McVeigh.
The Republicans never surprise me with their stupidity, ignorance, and lack of depth and understanding. Sooner or later the USA has to ask itself as a nation whether the Republican party makes a contribution to the USA or is a conplete and total waste and laughingstock that does nothing but damage the country.
4
You strike me as someone who is objective (just kidding!). The article says that Schumer is a sponsor and leading the effort to get the bill passed. All of the Democrats in the Senate voted for the Bill. Schumer is a Democrat -- even if you did not know that , it says it in the article.
1
Trump isn't Scottish. He's American. Please don't blame him on the Scots.
3
Will the Senate also be passing a bill allowing the families of innocent victims of drone attacks (a.k.a. "collateral damage") to sue the United States?
12
It's difficult to see the advantage of such a bill? Even if it were true that some faction of the ruling Saudis were somehow complicit in the attacks, in what possible way would making it public contribute to the national interest of the United States?
It seems to me that those supporting it are simply interested in enhancing their political images.
It seems to me that those supporting it are simply interested in enhancing their political images.
1
Like the JFK assassination (I'm originally from Dallas) -- and as an engineer -- I will always believe there were some significant cover-ups on the 9-11 investigation. It's just what governments do.
4
NYT manufactured consent for the Iraq War and now is all in for Hillary that helped push reluctant Dems into voting for it.
Main Stream Media is as corrupt as our Government.
Main Stream Media is as corrupt as our Government.
8
This may help explain why out esteemed president bows to the Saudis.
2
The NYT should provide the names of all our elected representatives who are against releasing the 28 pages unrestricted. The American people deserve to know. Whether they can be sued is another matter but the American people are entitled to and should know the truth.
Considering the President has said he'll veto this bill, we can start our list of names of elected representatives with Barack
1
The 28 pages were classified from day 1, means BUSH & Co. ordered it.
Obama might want to save this nation from much bigger embarrassing facts!
Obama might want to save this nation from much bigger embarrassing facts!
1
"I hear you, and the people who knocked down this building will hear you when they land back home. Go shopping, because we love freedom. I recommend the IPhone number 2 or 3. Oops, wasn't supposed to spill those beans. There is a sale on pillows at Target. Buy 2 for freedom. Your eyes are getting very heavy."
And now these are the "folks" Obama was talking about when he was denigrating Trump, "Folks count on the USA." Man don't they.
And now these are the "folks" Obama was talking about when he was denigrating Trump, "Folks count on the USA." Man don't they.
Da fix was in. Just like in the JFK assassination, with his head jerking towards the shot that killed him (Ignoring basic physics) and a congressional report about 4 shots and unknown additional assailants. Watch this baby go away.....
3
President Obama and the future presidents should freeze foreign assets of nations involved with unilateral, unprovoked attacks on civilians. In time an international court should rule on how to dispense a settlement to the families of the victims.
These cases would be a far cry from collateral losses from terrorists living among civilians or firing weapons at troops from a preschool with human shields.
These cases would be a far cry from collateral losses from terrorists living among civilians or firing weapons at troops from a preschool with human shields.
Good idea. Let's take a country whose actions are sometimes against us and make sure that it is always against us.
3
The Saudi threat,at best, a feeble one - it seems they own only 100 billion in US Treasury Bonds. Show us the truth.
Given the Saudis' clear culpability for 9/11 and most of the rest of the world's terrorism, we should have frozen all their foreign assets on 9/12 and used them to pay for airport security everywhere and forever.
American taxpayers have already contributed $7 billion into the September 11th Victim Compensation Fund. This was put in place to protect the airlines and compensate victims for their losses. If there are any damages assessed against the Saudi's, the taxpayers should get that money back first.
6
Does this open an opportunity for families whose innocent loved ones were murdered by US drone strikes to sue the US as a form of Justice?
10
Why would we support a medieval and religiously repressive kingdom? Why would they support us? We, together, created the nightmare of ISIS. And we have both done incredibly non-kosher things to promote ourselves. Time to change the relationship.
1
"Some" and "possible" are words with no meaning when it comes to evidence and criminal culpability. It would be educational to the reader to at least present some "theory of the case" to put the conspiracy theories into context. In addition, watch what you wish for when it comes to turning acts of international war and terrorism into the basis for civil lawsuits; lawsuits generally require real-live hard evidence that might be hard to obtain from folks living in Saudi Arabia. In addition, if you are so disbelieving in US government actions and knowledge, why would you readily accept the idea that the Saudis will not sell and move US assets?
3
Simple.
We need to raise interest rates but the dollar is WAY too strong.
Saudis (our puppets) sell a bunch of treasuries after we give them a good reason.
Dollar crashes and we raise rates to put the dollar back on par.
SA is only doing what we tell them to do and we get to keep our mass surveillance programs. Win Win for the powers that be.
We need to raise interest rates but the dollar is WAY too strong.
Saudis (our puppets) sell a bunch of treasuries after we give them a good reason.
Dollar crashes and we raise rates to put the dollar back on par.
SA is only doing what we tell them to do and we get to keep our mass surveillance programs. Win Win for the powers that be.
Is fear that the Saudis could make good on their threat to sell off Treasury securities the sole reason for the Administration to oppose this law? It sounds quite inadequate. The President should explain himself fully. In the meantime, let them sell and be damned.
Once again, Congress is looking to pass the buck to someone else. If they believe Saudi Arabia's government was culpable or the initial investigations were lacking, they should be opening up another investigation and looking into the matter themselves, not passing it off to private attorneys and the courts. In a similar vein, this is incredibly short-sighted legislation that could open us up to similar lawsuits in foreign countries. It's sloppy and bad foreign policy.
5
The first thing this brings to mind is the assasinations by drone that the US is involved in contrary to the laws of the many nations involved. Won't this lead to wrongful death suits against the US in Pakistan and Yemen? Maye thats a good thing.
3
I find it difficult to believe the Saudi's ruling class would betray the U.S. right before 9/11. The U.S. alone was responsible for almost all of Saudi's security- from weapons to training. It is likely that some officials- not sanctioned by the House of Saud- decided to help these terrorists. However, a few men's actions do not condemn an entire government.
4
Re-evaluating the relationship with Saudi Arabia is good. But it should be conducted orderly with the States Department at the helm, with oversight from the appropriate Senate and House committees.
This bill doesn't do that. In fact it could create a chaotic and intractable situation where numerous parties start suing the Saudi government left and right. And once the law suits start, neither the legislative nor the executive branch can intervene. Messy law suits do not a coherent policy make.
This bill doesn't do that. In fact it could create a chaotic and intractable situation where numerous parties start suing the Saudi government left and right. And once the law suits start, neither the legislative nor the executive branch can intervene. Messy law suits do not a coherent policy make.
3
Let's blame them for falling oil prices as well.
I would really applaud if the Saudis go through on their promise to sell off their US assets.
The reality that an economy that involves sitting around on your butt and watching oil bubble up from the sands is no match for an economy inspired by creativity and fueled by hard work - watching the Saudis slowly grasp this would be priceless.
This threat is a bluff that the world should call. We will all be better off. And, in the long term, so will the people of Saudi Arabia, if not the rulers.
To be clear, I am not American.
The reality that an economy that involves sitting around on your butt and watching oil bubble up from the sands is no match for an economy inspired by creativity and fueled by hard work - watching the Saudis slowly grasp this would be priceless.
This threat is a bluff that the world should call. We will all be better off. And, in the long term, so will the people of Saudi Arabia, if not the rulers.
To be clear, I am not American.
I lost both my parents in that first flight into the World Trade Center and have not been able to come to grips with How our government has hidden this information from us for so long. It is way past due that the 28 pages gets released and this bill gets passed so that we can ask the Saudi's some very specific questions under oath...If there is no connection then so be it but we should certainly be able to ask the questions given the amount of information we now have.
One of the other writers spoke about the ridiculousness of us going to Iraq versus Saudi Arabia which I could not agree with more.
One of the other writers spoke about the ridiculousness of us going to Iraq versus Saudi Arabia which I could not agree with more.
258
Also a family member here. And agree with all you state here. A long, long road it's been ... and no where near the end ...but all keep pushing, trying to get the whole truth. One day, for some generation, it will be revealed.
3
My God, the courage you had to have to navigate this unspeakable loss. You all deserve answers. Sending much respect and love your way. So sad, and so sorry.
3
I am so terribly sorry for your loss. I can't imagine how you must feel, knowing your own government has been stonewalling you over this from the beginning. How does one come to terms with something like this, practically confirmation of what so many suspected? And they are still willing to play with people's emotions to this day.
If 9/11 had been handled as a crime instead of a global war on terror, the cost to the US and the rest of the world would be a fraction of what our global war on terror post 9/11 has cost. The trillions spent has profited some mightily while others lost their lives and are crippled mentally and physically for life.
Two US administrations have followed a similar path of lies, death and destruction post 9/11. Maybe it's time for good investigation, criminal prosecutions and liability law suits to settle this in a way that's somewhat cost effective and might actually get to the truth. It's pretty clear the Bush and Obama administration haven't gotten to the truth and have no clue how to seek justice for the victims. It's time for the transparency that candidate Obama promised the American public when he became President Obama.
Two US administrations have followed a similar path of lies, death and destruction post 9/11. Maybe it's time for good investigation, criminal prosecutions and liability law suits to settle this in a way that's somewhat cost effective and might actually get to the truth. It's pretty clear the Bush and Obama administration haven't gotten to the truth and have no clue how to seek justice for the victims. It's time for the transparency that candidate Obama promised the American public when he became President Obama.
8
Saudi Arabia is our enemy, not our friend.
6
And that's a good enough reason to nuke them off the planet.
Lawsuit should name the Department of Justice, which rejected requests from the FBI to examine the laptop of Z. Moussaoui or to further investigate. Laptop had to contain plans, and had the FBI retrieve messages on the laptop, the World Trade catastrophe never would have occurred.
Sounds like the CIA or FBI had a Saudi on the payroll who knew 9/11 was about to go down and either failed to tell the CIA/FBI about it, or indeed told them and the agency/bureau blew it off.
If the some Saudi individuals were complicit in 9/11, we should go after them. If the Saudi government was complicit, why should we care for an instant if they sell off their US assets? Sure we might take a hit, but we don't want that kind of blood money anyway. And, most of all, we should not be afraid. The firefighters and police who went into the burning Twin Towers put their fears aside. We should do the same, and face the Saudis with resolution and strength.
1
Amazing! A miracle in DC!-- support from both Demos and Republicans. This has to be a first. What's the term? Frenemies? Based on what I read the Saudis are behind the most radical version of Islam and many of us assume that they pay off the terrorists. But they sell us oil and let us use their countries for military bases. Is it worth the price we are paying?
1
This will open the gates to foreign citizens suing US govt and citizens everywhere int he world de facto stopping US tourism and travel and creating a huge chaos of retaliation lawsuits, this will undermine severely the US role as superpower since the rest of the world will flock to the Euro instead of the USD as world currency, it will be a huge mess and probably the beginning of the demise of the US as we know them...
2
Very nice. We can have our cake and eat it as well. Naturally, we hope that no other nation will do something very similar.
1
knowing the truth and being able to sue are two separate issues. We can do one without the other. The American people deserve the truth from our elected officials.
1
U.S. Government should compensate the families of 9/11 rather than opening the door for all kinds of lawsuits around the world against our government. While it is clear that KOSA is responsible for the rise of the Islamic terrorists around the world, we are also responsible for unwisely overthrowing many governments! Once this can of warm is opened, there is no telling where it is going to stop. Sovereign Immunity laws protect us more than any other government around the world and should not be tempered with. Saudi threat of dumping $750 billion of our bonds not withstanding (they don't even have that much sovereign wealth) this is a bad law--period.
6
The US government did compensate the victims with US taxpayer dollars. While I agree US liability could be the highest in the world perhaps that will act to damper our desire to enter into global wars of choice.
4
As should Halliburton, Carlyle Group, all of Cheney and the Bush;s fat cat contractor friends who made money hand over fist in the aftermath, lumping more tragedy upon tragedy. :0(
10
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v-27FGbpBk4
Fifteen years after the fact is a long wait.
But at least now, if litigation is allowed to proceed, somewhere during the discovery, phase of the litigation, the nexus between the TexasSaudi and the Hochtief/Turner's "retrofit" of the WTC will become obvious.
Fifteen years after the fact is a long wait.
But at least now, if litigation is allowed to proceed, somewhere during the discovery, phase of the litigation, the nexus between the TexasSaudi and the Hochtief/Turner's "retrofit" of the WTC will become obvious.
2
Geopolitics 101......ignore the law, morality, and human rights when it comes to capitalism, money, or control of resources. Every time I hear the words "American Interests" I want to puke. If politicians were honest they would say "corporate interests" or "Exxon Interests".
24
Saudis are not our allies, they are adversaries at best and enemies at worst. They are responsible for financing and propagating radical Islam.aka terrorism, through out the world for four decades. They have fooled us until now, but the glut of oil gives us an opportunity to break from this twisted, one sided, relationship. Are we smart enough to do it?
8
Last month, the commission co-chairmen Thomas Kean and Lee Hamilton issued a statement saying that the 28 pages “were based almost entirely on raw, unvetted material that came to the FBI”
Well then, why didn't you guys vet it. I would imagine that was a serious accusation and if you guys were honestly looking for the culprits, that would have been one area to focus on heavily. They all had a hand in the cover up and poor Iraqi people had to pay for it. Something they are still paying for.
To me, this is true crime against humanity.
Well then, why didn't you guys vet it. I would imagine that was a serious accusation and if you guys were honestly looking for the culprits, that would have been one area to focus on heavily. They all had a hand in the cover up and poor Iraqi people had to pay for it. Something they are still paying for.
To me, this is true crime against humanity.
14
Why did Dick Cheney go into hiding immediately after the attack while Dubya was safely squirreled away in Florida? Why weren't the several airplanes obviously and lengthily off-course intercepted? Why weren't the several warnings about strange behavior (the Saudi pilot who wanted to learn how to fly a plane but not how to land it) not heeded?
So many questions unanswered. The time has come to open those 28 redacted pages and let the light of truth shine on this sorry coverup. Time for those responsible to be tried and punished.
So many questions unanswered. The time has come to open those 28 redacted pages and let the light of truth shine on this sorry coverup. Time for those responsible to be tried and punished.
4
I'd start with the one person known to have been dancing in the streets celebrating the attack, Donald J Trump.
He was with the celebrating combatants, he already admitted it.
He was with the celebrating combatants, he already admitted it.
1
Are really Americans so dumb?
this opens the possibility for everyone with a gripe against US policy to sue the US government in a US court, that means Vietnam, Korea, Chile (for Us supporting Pinochet), El Salvador (for supporting the junta there), Iran, Irak, Afghanistan, Syria, anyone with a case against the US government policy of the last 50 years....do Americans realize that this is the biggest Pandora box ever? It would work only if the US had nothing to hide or fear, as disgusting this is the President is right, he looks like he's the only adult in a congress made of children....
this opens the possibility for everyone with a gripe against US policy to sue the US government in a US court, that means Vietnam, Korea, Chile (for Us supporting Pinochet), El Salvador (for supporting the junta there), Iran, Irak, Afghanistan, Syria, anyone with a case against the US government policy of the last 50 years....do Americans realize that this is the biggest Pandora box ever? It would work only if the US had nothing to hide or fear, as disgusting this is the President is right, he looks like he's the only adult in a congress made of children....
14
My thoughts, exactly, biglio. Who knows where this could lead, maybe the courts, maybe all out war.
1
What have we been preaching all along........human rights, democracy, rule of law, etc. etc. Why was Russia sanctioned for their role in Crimera and we helped Saudi Arabia attack their neighbor, Yemen, and put down a rebel uprising in Bahrain? We look like hypocrites to the world.
6
That's because we are hypocrites, e.s., and have been for a very long, long time.
4
I believe George W. Bush and the members of his "security council" are just as culpable as the Saudis in this great tragedy. Holding hands with the Saudis was his foreign policy and the reason why he and his staff decided to invade Iraq; to protect the Saudi and obfuscate the truth. This legislation is necessary for the nation to learn about the event in the perspective of history, and bring those accountable to justice. If time can heal all, then we should let it.
89
The House of Saud and the House of Bush have been joined at the hip for decades. Both are culpable, neither will ever pay for the true villainy.
1
Senator Schumer:
"I want to make clear beyond the shadow of a doubt that every entity, including foreign states, will be held accountable if they are found to be sponsors of the heinous act of 9/11"
Accountability for Everyone whether sponsorship, participation or coverup. I hope the lawyers make billions $$ and go to every rat hole where these people are hiding in the US or elsewhere.
"I want to make clear beyond the shadow of a doubt that every entity, including foreign states, will be held accountable if they are found to be sponsors of the heinous act of 9/11"
Accountability for Everyone whether sponsorship, participation or coverup. I hope the lawyers make billions $$ and go to every rat hole where these people are hiding in the US or elsewhere.
2
Unfortunately, our government has had a zen-like focus on staying cozy with Saudi Arabia for decades and decades. It's not going to change because there's too much money to be made. A Saudi guy named Bin Laden organized a terrorist attack? Well, that was bad. But forcing his family to stay here on 9/12 was obviously worse, so they needed to scoot around by private jet when everyone else was stranded. Uh-huh. That action alone is a crystal clear indicator of our government's priorities.
The only way to stop this apart from voting against candidates who embrace Saudi Arabia is to cut oil use. Buy an electric vehicle, swap your gas-guzzler for a fuel efficient car if that's not possible. Trade in your oil heater for gas. Recycle plastics. Etc. We may not be able to cut oil consumption to zero, but we can cut it down. Oh, and vote against big-money-oil-loving candidates.
The moneyed interests have too much to gain from cozying up an oppressive medieval regime in the middle east with nothing to offer but a product that pollutes. Enough!
The only way to stop this apart from voting against candidates who embrace Saudi Arabia is to cut oil use. Buy an electric vehicle, swap your gas-guzzler for a fuel efficient car if that's not possible. Trade in your oil heater for gas. Recycle plastics. Etc. We may not be able to cut oil consumption to zero, but we can cut it down. Oh, and vote against big-money-oil-loving candidates.
The moneyed interests have too much to gain from cozying up an oppressive medieval regime in the middle east with nothing to offer but a product that pollutes. Enough!
13
Who are the candidates who aren't big-money-oil-lovers?
I wonder if even stopping oil use is enough. They are great customers for our military hardware, one of the biggest, if not the biggest, industries in America. Not only that, they are an important militarily strategic asset in "our" attempts to control the world. And I'm sure there is much more shadowy stuff going on behind the scenes than that. The US loves dictatorships and needs them as allies...true democracies cannot be trusted and a real threat to our power. This is why the US has tried so hard to keep Central and South American democracies from flourishing...they just aren't in "our" best interests...despite all the lip service to the contrary.
Somebody should ask Mr. Trump about his opinion on this matter.
5
So can Iraqi's now sue the US after they killed 400k citizens and accusing Saddam of having nuclear weapons and then they found nothing there!?
Why do american's pretend that this whole mess didn't happen and want everyone to move on! I hope Obama can pass the bill so that every human being can sue the US government.
Why do american's pretend that this whole mess didn't happen and want everyone to move on! I hope Obama can pass the bill so that every human being can sue the US government.
13
Follow the money. What was the source in income for those terrorists while in the USA? How did they pay their expenses?
And we need transparency of the business ties between the Bush and Saudi Royal families. Finding bin Laden was never a priority for W.
And we need transparency of the business ties between the Bush and Saudi Royal families. Finding bin Laden was never a priority for W.
14
Has Obama already booked his flight back to Riyad to apologize? It's time the Saudis are held responsible. Maybe, just maybe if Obama had allowed the American people know the truth or we would have frozen the Saudi assets like we did the Iranian assets or maybe if Obama didn't treat the Saudis like they were stand up guys and democrats to boot, the public wouldn't be so adamant that this law should be enacted. Will he veto it? Probably but I hope the Congress overrides.
Will the Saudis sell? I almost hope so but I Doubt it. They want their money away from the hell hole they've build in the ME. We should not allow sovereign funds or foreign governments to buy assets in this country. It puts us at risk and gives them leverage.
Boycott the Saudis. They deserve it!
Will the Saudis sell? I almost hope so but I Doubt it. They want their money away from the hell hole they've build in the ME. We should not allow sovereign funds or foreign governments to buy assets in this country. It puts us at risk and gives them leverage.
Boycott the Saudis. They deserve it!
5
How about Bush? How about 9/11, as in who was prez when this mass murder happened? How about him holding hands with the crown prince during state visits? How about lying about Hussein's involvement in WMD and failing to stop bin Laden from skulking out of Tora Bora? How about whose administration finally killed him? Many, many administrations have copied up to the Saudis. It needs to stop niw, so move forward.
97
Bush told us that Iraq was behind 9/11. Many of us knew it was a lie because the majority of the hijackers were Saudis as was bin Laden. Cheney was completely beholden to the Saudis and wanted to invade Iraq instead so his company could rebuild it and enrich the shareholders. At the time he was one of the major shareholders. The sad part is that the majority of Americans supported the Iraq invasion. I think we need to be more vigilant against our government going to war as the stated reasons are usually bogus. I heard people say they wanted to invade Iraq so that gas would be cheaper. Since when is that a valid reason for going to war.
10
It is common knowledge that both Democrats and Republicans have been bought out by Saudi charitable giving. It's a factor in the revolt going on in both major parties. The Saudis have been spreading their tentacles around Washington for 30 years, making charitable donations in the name of important Washingtonians. Those people are now indebted to Saudi Arabia for their elevated social and political standing on boards of influential charitable organizations, hospitals, museums.
4
The Saudis' alleged complicity in 9/11 deserves at least as much scrutiny as Hillary's e-mails for heaven's sake.
9
What will now happen to the petro dollars schemes set in place since 1979 whereby all oil revenues have to be used to buy US treasuries? The brilliant plan was invented by Kissenger and his banking pals wherby all OPEC money earned had to be deposited in Eurocurrency markets and the US capital accounts? That's why the current account always corresponds to a deficit . That' oil money in US capital accounts would be that loaned to Japan and Europe. And if the Saudis behaved, they could get some of the interest earned on THEIR money which they had to INVEST in foreign markets . I think I am glad the Saudis got screwed this way since the 1970s . There is no excuse for stupidities
1
This would means all Saudis should be added to the no-flight list!
Oh wait, Saudi and 5 other oil rich Arab countries from the ME have the lowest US visa rejection rates!! How is this possible?? Germany 12%, UK 11%, even the Nordics are there with 9 - 13%.
Saudi & Co. below 3%
Oh wait, Saudi and 5 other oil rich Arab countries from the ME have the lowest US visa rejection rates!! How is this possible?? Germany 12%, UK 11%, even the Nordics are there with 9 - 13%.
Saudi & Co. below 3%
4
Now we need the Senate to open up lawsuits against Israel for their part in the 9/11 attacks. That would be fair don't you think?
7
You can accuse Israel of many things. You might be right in some cases, wrong in some.
But to imply, or actually accuse, Israel of complicity in 9/11 is lunacy.
But to imply, or actually accuse, Israel of complicity in 9/11 is lunacy.
2
What was Israel's part? Facts, not innuendo, please.
2
Just wait...
We'll see a Saudi showtrial, a few heads will roll, they'll pay a few bucks for damages, and Americans will cheer up and accept beheadings and cash- bringing Sharia law into favor.
We'll see a Saudi showtrial, a few heads will roll, they'll pay a few bucks for damages, and Americans will cheer up and accept beheadings and cash- bringing Sharia law into favor.
3
Ok - 16 out of the 19 terrorists were from Saudi and now we hear that also the Saudi gov was involved and we can sue them! :)
I think all Afghan and Iraqi people should sue the Saudi gov as they were bombed by "mistake", ohhhhhps, wrong house ;)
I think all Afghan and Iraqi people should sue the Saudi gov as they were bombed by "mistake", ohhhhhps, wrong house ;)
Anyone still want to buy stock in a Saudi oil company IPO?
1
This is utterly insane. By declaring the USA the arbiter of world justice the USA opens up a Pandora's box of unintended consequences. Imagine Iraqis suing the USA for their loses in an unjustifiable war.
The only positive outcome of this legislation would be never again having to hear about debts and deficits as nobody will be able to get blood from a stone.
The only positive outcome of this legislation would be never again having to hear about debts and deficits as nobody will be able to get blood from a stone.
11
9/11 happened in the USA. The US government is absolutely authorized to bring the perpetrators to justice, even if they are on mars!
9
BK,
The Iraqi war happened in Iraq does that mean that Iraq can't bring America to justice in IRAQ?
I would suggest you study or at least read about political economics and the over riding features of international law and how international agreements trump even National Constitutions. There is no such thing in the time of Globalization of pick and choose international law. If the law is deemed legal by the US Supreme Court anyone anywhere can sue the US in their own courts of law.
The Iraqi war happened in Iraq does that mean that Iraq can't bring America to justice in IRAQ?
I would suggest you study or at least read about political economics and the over riding features of international law and how international agreements trump even National Constitutions. There is no such thing in the time of Globalization of pick and choose international law. If the law is deemed legal by the US Supreme Court anyone anywhere can sue the US in their own courts of law.
3
It is well accepted that the Saudi royal family is propped up by the clergy, who are very sympathetic to the fundamentalist jihadist agenda. As long as the royals stay out of the clergy's business, they are allowed their position of wealth and power. And, of course, some in the royal family and government support the same jihadist agenda.
The Obama administration is opposed to the legislation because it makes diplomacy more difficult. The Saudis are the most reliable country in a region where nobody is truly reliable. The big mistake in the Obama position is that the US cannot make do without the Saudi regime.
At some point, we need to chose what is right over what is expedient. The senate unanimously supported what is right (an incredibly rare event these days).
Politicians like Obama who are making deals with the devil (in order to have a more orderly foreign policy) only fuel the demagogues like Donald Trump. Ultimately, the Obama position will become a losing strategy. More important, innocent people continue to be devoured by a heartless royal family that has no interest but to retain its lock on money and power.
The Obama administration is opposed to the legislation because it makes diplomacy more difficult. The Saudis are the most reliable country in a region where nobody is truly reliable. The big mistake in the Obama position is that the US cannot make do without the Saudi regime.
At some point, we need to chose what is right over what is expedient. The senate unanimously supported what is right (an incredibly rare event these days).
Politicians like Obama who are making deals with the devil (in order to have a more orderly foreign policy) only fuel the demagogues like Donald Trump. Ultimately, the Obama position will become a losing strategy. More important, innocent people continue to be devoured by a heartless royal family that has no interest but to retain its lock on money and power.
6
I sympathize with the families of the victims, but let's not forget this is all about money and the attorneys who stand to gain from the lawsuits. Any financial judgments...if they're ever paid...will have absolutely no impact on the Saudis.
2
You're very wrong on the motivations, as least as it goes to families. Or at least as it goes to my family
As a sister of a father fighting EVERYDAY for the last 15 years on behalf his murdered 25-year old daughter ... the mantra has always been ... 'Justice for Andrea.' And all the others so viciously and callously murdered that day.
This lawsuit, along with getting the FULL 28 pages released, is an on-going part of that fight for justice.
I know my brother doesn't want money. Esp. Saudi money. He does want SA, if a sponsoring party to this heinous act, to shown for what they may be. For the world to fully see and know. Open records entered into court and public view. That's it.
If there's nothing there, then let that be shown also.
As a sister of a father fighting EVERYDAY for the last 15 years on behalf his murdered 25-year old daughter ... the mantra has always been ... 'Justice for Andrea.' And all the others so viciously and callously murdered that day.
This lawsuit, along with getting the FULL 28 pages released, is an on-going part of that fight for justice.
I know my brother doesn't want money. Esp. Saudi money. He does want SA, if a sponsoring party to this heinous act, to shown for what they may be. For the world to fully see and know. Open records entered into court and public view. That's it.
If there's nothing there, then let that be shown also.
153
So long as we don;t mind when foreign nationals begin bringing suits for the atrocities the US has committed in other lands.
3
Hoping this exposes Bush, Cheney, Rice, Rumsfeld and the rest of that band of crappers to the punishment that they so richly deserve for ignoring the warnings of an attack and then taking us to fraud war in Iraq with their claims that Iraq had WMD.
28
What is the government hiding?? First we go to war with Iraq--WRONG. Now we are told Saudi Arabia should pay.. There is no credibility in any of this. Obviously someone is spinning for calculated gain.
2
This legislation is awesome. And long over-due. The links between 9/11 and the Saudis are well-documented. We have to stop tip-toeing around and treating countries like Saudi Arabia as our peers. No one is our peer---let's start acting like it
2
The primary reason the national security establishment doesn't want Trump as president is the issue of 9/11. They know he will investigate how 2 planes knocked down 3 buildings on their own footprint.
The Saudi participation as bankers and pilots should really be looked into to satisfy the 9/11 families. But those that permitted this to happen to our nation should be exposed. The culprits will circle the wagons and only a brash Trump will be able to penetrate.
That single event created hell on earth in the Middle East and changed the USA forever. It's time to reread the Heart Of Darkness.
The Saudi participation as bankers and pilots should really be looked into to satisfy the 9/11 families. But those that permitted this to happen to our nation should be exposed. The culprits will circle the wagons and only a brash Trump will be able to penetrate.
That single event created hell on earth in the Middle East and changed the USA forever. It's time to reread the Heart Of Darkness.
3
"[M]uch of [the material on the secret 28 pages was] ultimately deemed inconclusive by the Sept. 11 commission."
Does that not mean that some of it was conclusive?
And, as Schumer said, if there is no culpability for 9/11 on behalf of the Saudi government, then the plaintiffs are just wasting their time and the entire case is a worthless non-event.
So: what's on the secret pages that is conclusive, and why are the Saudis fighting so hard if they are not responsible?
Does that not mean that some of it was conclusive?
And, as Schumer said, if there is no culpability for 9/11 on behalf of the Saudi government, then the plaintiffs are just wasting their time and the entire case is a worthless non-event.
So: what's on the secret pages that is conclusive, and why are the Saudis fighting so hard if they are not responsible?
4
Since the days of Kissenger the Saudi's have agreed to transact all their oil for the world using the USD base. That will be coming to an end very soon and THAT in the long run will hurt the U.S more than the selling of treasuries.
3
It's beyond shameful our government has kept the 28 pages hidden from the 9/11 families and the public.
For the people who say we need Saudi Arabia to fight terrorism, when do they plan on showing up to the fight? How many of their ground troops are currently in Iraq fighting ISIS?
Either individuals in the government or citizens, they have helped fund Al Qaeda,the Taliban and ISIS.
For the people who say we need Saudi Arabia to fight terrorism, when do they plan on showing up to the fight? How many of their ground troops are currently in Iraq fighting ISIS?
Either individuals in the government or citizens, they have helped fund Al Qaeda,the Taliban and ISIS.
13
Good now the house should tack on to their bill the ability of American Oil investors that have loss billions to also sue over Oil price manipulation by Saudi. Although good for consumers the Oil industry is on its knees because of Saudis financial terrorism.
2
I'm not saying not to push your bill through, but I think it's high time we STOP adding bills piggybacked on others overall. Congress adds numerous bills not in the best interest of the American people, sometimes extremely beneficial to members in congress & other branches of government. Yes, I know it's been done this way all along. That's just it, don't fix it if it's not broken but DO FIX IT if it is! I'd say it's way over due to be fixed!
1
With friends like these, who needs enemies?
112
With enemies like these we need all the friends we can get.
Sure, expose our allies to the pathetic casino which is our tort system. Why should our own productive citizens be the only ones to feed the liability lawyer continuing bonanza?
4
But as long as the Saudis continue to denominate all their oil & gas contracts in US$ & spend billions a year on US weaponry, they can finance US enemies, because what good is the Pentagon without enemies? The Saudis are surgically attached to the US & vice-versa.
9
Four months shy of the 15th anniversary of September 11, 2001, and we still don't have 100% of the truth. Shameful.
226
and we probably never will. Sad for a supposedly free country.
1
Hahaha! We don't even have 10% of the truth. The entire 9/11 narrative is cancerous lies. If I had a loved-one die in that horror, I don't know what I'd have done by now...
"we" don't have 10% of it, I'd say. the power of the media to describe reality for the world never fails to amaze... hell, i just read an article discussing Trump's Supreme Court nominees...think about that for awhile. The current president is Constitutionally bound to select one, and yet, the media is already telling us that Trump will be doing it...
In the interests of justice we can now look forward to the senste and congress voting to allow the US to be exposed to legal jeopardy for war crimes and the illegal invasion of Iraq under international law. And drones. And Guantanamo. What's holding it up?
8
A long history of Saudi Arabia's involvement with al Qaeda exists. Even today the Saudis are providing money to terrorists in Syria. The Saudis are responsible for al Qaeda taking control of parts of Yemen. The Saudis paid extortion money to al Qaeda for years. They paid the Pakistani gov't to hide bin Laden for years.
116
Apparently, if you have enough money and power, even Barack Obama will overlook it when you violate human rights or support terrorism. Not one of the President's finer moments.
59
The Guardian recently reported on Obama's efforts to help the Saudis win the war in Yemen by providing banned cluster bombs, intelligence and selling double the amount of weapons to them than Bush did. The results are 6500 dead Yemeni adults and 1500 dead Yemeni kids in one year alone. Obama is also fighting the Syrian war on behalf of the Saudis. One has to wonder why he is as cozy with them as Bush was.
1
"even" Obama? Are you an ostrich? How many people have been killed by remote control drones under his watch? Did they get a fair trial? How about the innocent women and children that happened to be nearby? Is that not violating human rights? Is that not, by definition, terrorism? Obama is a terrorist with no concern for human rights...it's quite clearcut.
Maybe the trial lawyers see a lot of potential money they can go after. I agree that this is a bad idea to open this door of people suing foreign governments and foreigners suing us but it's a sharme because the court proceedings may bring up all kinds of embarrassing things, which is probably one reason Obama is against it.
2
"because the court proceedings may bring up all kinds of embarrassing things"
Yes, the truth might be exposed. A scary thought.
Yes, the truth might be exposed. A scary thought.
4
I continue to be surprised that there has been no "official comment" from those associated with U.S. government support for the late Chilean Tyrant, Augusto Pinochet, given his now-proven role in the first state-sponsoed act of terrorism on U.S. soil, In Washington, D.C, when the victims included a young, newlywed American woman. This guy / this incident: /// Where are the comments from Kissinger, then-CIA directer Papa Bush? The 40th anniversary of this heniuos crime looms. http://www.thenation.com/article/why-the-state-department-finally-confir...
5
Saudi Arabia must be split in two new entities Hidjaz and Najd by America and the developing world . All terrorists actions was directly or indirectly guided by the Saudi clerics with the benediction of the royal family .
Saudi failed to become the Sunna world leadership , they tried to buy with the petrodollars many politics and governments .After the collapse of the Ottoman Empire the Sunna lost their unifying leader . Sunna must be under one theological authority like Shia .
Saudi failed to become the Sunna world leadership , they tried to buy with the petrodollars many politics and governments .After the collapse of the Ottoman Empire the Sunna lost their unifying leader . Sunna must be under one theological authority like Shia .
Yuck, no. We're staying out of your crazy religion. Sunni, Shiite, the heck with the lot of you.
1
Iran is not the problem,it is the wahabbi Saudis that are the issue.
25
US, UK, France, etc, "ally" "Saudi Arabia is said to be the world's largest source of funds and promoter of Salafist jihadism, which forms the ideological basis of terrorist groups such as al-Qaeda, Taliban, ISIS and others. Donors in Saudi Arabia constitute the most significant source of funding to Sunni terrorist groups worldwide (...). According to a secret December 2009 paper signed by the US secretary of state, "Saudi Arabia remains a critical financial support base for al-Qaida, the Taliban, LeT and other terrorist groups."" (wikipedia, State-sponsored_terrorism)
"Prince Bandar [former Saudi ambassador in Washington and head of Saudi intelligence] pledged to safeguard Russia’s naval base in Syria if the Assad regime is toppled, but he also hinted at Chechen terrorist attacks on Russia’s Winter Olympics in Sochi if there is no accord. “I can give you a guarantee to protect the Winter Olympics next year. The Chechen groups that threaten the security of the games are controlled by us,” he allegedly said." (Telegraph, "Saudis offer Russia secret oil deal if it drops Syria")
"The Independent reported that Saudi Arabia and [NATO's member] Turkey "are focusing their backing for the Syrian rebels on the combined Jaish al-Fatah, or the Army of Conquest, a command structure for jihadist groups in Syria that includes [al Qaeda affiliated] Jabhat al-Nusra." (wikipedia, Al-Nusra_Front#External_support)
Wonderful times.
"Prince Bandar [former Saudi ambassador in Washington and head of Saudi intelligence] pledged to safeguard Russia’s naval base in Syria if the Assad regime is toppled, but he also hinted at Chechen terrorist attacks on Russia’s Winter Olympics in Sochi if there is no accord. “I can give you a guarantee to protect the Winter Olympics next year. The Chechen groups that threaten the security of the games are controlled by us,” he allegedly said." (Telegraph, "Saudis offer Russia secret oil deal if it drops Syria")
"The Independent reported that Saudi Arabia and [NATO's member] Turkey "are focusing their backing for the Syrian rebels on the combined Jaish al-Fatah, or the Army of Conquest, a command structure for jihadist groups in Syria that includes [al Qaeda affiliated] Jabhat al-Nusra." (wikipedia, Al-Nusra_Front#External_support)
Wonderful times.
20
About time! Right is right regardless of what financial retaliation the Saudi's and their backwards kingdom might try to act on. We need to start acting like the moral compass we claim to be.
88
I have not heard Pres. Obama say anything against Saudi Arabia's gas manipulation so they keep market share even though many companies have gone bankrupt from the low price of oil. Why would Pres. Obama bow down to Saudi threats? Who does Pres. Obama work for?
2
e.s. - Who do you work for? A conspiracy theory think tank?
4
Hog wash! This is a symbolic, propaganda moment by the Senate to fool their constituents that they care about 9/11 justice. Do you think for a D.C. second they are going jeopardize the multi-billion dollar weapons deals the DOD and their cadre of contractors have forged with King Fahd? They know this bill is DOA on Obama's desk and just "going through the motions" wasting time and taxpayer money to look like a vengeful patriots. The Bison is our national mammal and that's as good as it's going to get this year.
191
Jesus, I hope you're wrong, but your post makes a lot of sense, does it not, citizens?
1
Since the House of Representatives is up for re-election in November, they should not pass legislation this year.
1
Not necessarily. This could be an effort to uncover the actual guilty party (the US gov). If the Saudis are the popular scape-goat (which they currently are), questioning them could throw the entire official 9/11 narrative into doubt. This might actually be a good thing if it isn't crushed at the executive level.
The Saudis should welcome the opportunity to prove their innocence in court and if they want to unload their Treasuries at fire sale prices, many savvy investors would welcome the bargains.
120
Our government's hands are bloody, too. I can certainly understand the position of the 9/11 families, but then what? We always think the Middle East cannot become more destabilized, and then it does.
There was a time when we could have modeled, urged, or insisted at least some democracy on others. If we ever truly had that moral authority (and perhaps that was always wishful thinking), we've squandered it. We're in the middle of our own secular vs. religious civil war. Not to sound too Karl Marx, but I've kind of had it with religion. (And some of my best friends are religious. Lol.)
Remember this article in the New York Times, shortly after the 9/11 attacks? 'A NATION CHALLENGED: THE FAMILY; Fearing Harm, Bin Laden Kin Fled From U.S.' (http://www.nytimes.com/2001/09/30/world/a-nation-challenged-the-family-f....
Not a plane in the sky, except their planes. A Saudi prince stating that 9/11 was "the worst thing that has ever happened to us [the Saudis]."
I guess ultimately we all just look out after our own. I have a sick ambivalence about this senate bill. We're way more economically interconnected than most of us can begin to understand. Humankind seems always to defer to economic interest.
There was a time when we could have modeled, urged, or insisted at least some democracy on others. If we ever truly had that moral authority (and perhaps that was always wishful thinking), we've squandered it. We're in the middle of our own secular vs. religious civil war. Not to sound too Karl Marx, but I've kind of had it with religion. (And some of my best friends are religious. Lol.)
Remember this article in the New York Times, shortly after the 9/11 attacks? 'A NATION CHALLENGED: THE FAMILY; Fearing Harm, Bin Laden Kin Fled From U.S.' (http://www.nytimes.com/2001/09/30/world/a-nation-challenged-the-family-f....
Not a plane in the sky, except their planes. A Saudi prince stating that 9/11 was "the worst thing that has ever happened to us [the Saudis]."
I guess ultimately we all just look out after our own. I have a sick ambivalence about this senate bill. We're way more economically interconnected than most of us can begin to understand. Humankind seems always to defer to economic interest.
3
Can't explain why my link was abbreviated. Copy 'A NATION CHALLENGED: THE FAMILY; Fearing Harm, Bin Laden Kin Fled From U.S.' and paste to search. Article can be found in this way.
“Accusations of complicity in that mass murder from responsible authorities are a grave matter,” they wrote. “Such charges should be levied with care.”
That was the commission's not so sublte warning that the US has committed enough atrocities to get tied up in court lawsuits around the entire world for decades. Quid pro quo.
That was the commission's not so sublte warning that the US has committed enough atrocities to get tied up in court lawsuits around the entire world for decades. Quid pro quo.
127
Can you imagine if we had to pay for all the casualties as a result of the Iraqi War? The Iraqi War makes 9/11 look like a ding on your car caused by a shopping cart.
2
Then maybe the US will think twice before it gets involved. Not a bad thing.
3
So we give them Bush , Cheney and crew ..They can prosecute them and strip them of their fortunes and freedom ...as it should be
The Senate's passing of this bill makes complete sense since we have been on the path of destabilizing the Middle East since Papa Bush started dropping bombs on Iraq in 1991. Is the world really better off without the dictators in the Middle East?
48
The US planted or supported half the dictatorships in the Middle-east if not worldwide, Saddam Hussein was a CIA's asset starting at the end of the 50s and then given by the CIA lists of allegedly pro-communist/lefty civilians or politicians to assassinate...
"Saddam first became involved with U.S. intelligence agencies at the start of the September 1980 Iran-Iraq war, his first contacts with U.S. officials date back to 1959, when he was part of a CIA-authorized six-man squad tasked with assassinating then Iraqi Prime Minister Gen. Abd al-Karim Qasim. (...)"
("Exclusive: Saddam key in early CIA plot", UPI)
"Saddam first became involved with U.S. intelligence agencies at the start of the September 1980 Iran-Iraq war, his first contacts with U.S. officials date back to 1959, when he was part of a CIA-authorized six-man squad tasked with assassinating then Iraqi Prime Minister Gen. Abd al-Karim Qasim. (...)"
("Exclusive: Saddam key in early CIA plot", UPI)
1
When are we going to realize that:
1) Saudi values are not compatible with ours
2) They view us as a false ally and perhaps enemy, as we are unIslamic.
3) They realize our endless appetite for their cheap oil is our weakness
5) In their view, our lack of individual, societal and governmental discipline will require us to continue to support their fake monarchy and fund their seeding of Wahabist schools whose main purpose it to twist young minds against the West
6) Now we reap what we have sowed
24
"it might begin selling off up to $750 billion in Treasury securities and other assets in the United States before they face a danger of being frozen by American courts."
Sounds like the Saudis think those lawsuits have some merit.
Sounds like the Saudis think those lawsuits have some merit.
29
Only works if the US is made co-defendant, since security lapses were all homemade, only breaches Saudi. Sue 'em both and force a settlement split down the middle with no admission of fault, just like the SEC does it. Ultimately it boils down to $ compensation, possible as long as sovereign egos are not tarnished.
While Congress is working on the bill, how about some text limiting lawyers' fees.
If public shaming is what's being sought, then why not cut to the chase, do the fighting for the 9/11 families. Something along suspending relations, threatening sanctions, freezing money etc.
As it stands now, looks very poorly thought-out, just a vent for victims families, crocodile tears, little else. Disrespectful. Obama should veto.
While Congress is working on the bill, how about some text limiting lawyers' fees.
If public shaming is what's being sought, then why not cut to the chase, do the fighting for the 9/11 families. Something along suspending relations, threatening sanctions, freezing money etc.
As it stands now, looks very poorly thought-out, just a vent for victims families, crocodile tears, little else. Disrespectful. Obama should veto.
1
Does that mean they'll also pass a bill to let families of foreigners hurt by the actions of the American military sue America? Like prostitutes raped in Okinawa? Or the people killed working for Doctors without borders? Or the civilians killed by drones?
14
As Schumer pointed out, it doesn't mean they'll lose in court, just that, like every other entity, they should face our legal system and see how it's played out.
It's a shame the president has put expediency ahead of doing the right thing in this case.
It's a shame the president has put expediency ahead of doing the right thing in this case.
6
"a 1976 law that gives foreign nations some immunity from suits in American courts."
Why then was Iran sued left and right by NY prosecutors on tenuous -to say the least- links by proxies to an attack on American (and french) soldiers in a remote Lebanon during the Lebanese civil war?
Is that any proof of the complete selectivity and politicization of this kind of trials? Hardly any kind of "justice for all".
This said if others countries start to sue the US for their numerous misdeeds abroad (from the CIA among many), starting with the families of the 30000 Iraqi soldiers literally slaughtered on a former administration officials lies and forged intel about non-existing WMS and Yellow cake stockpiles, i just can't wait to see the hypocrisy of the US authorities and same congress members, who will be then seen feigning outrage with nationalistic tremolos.
Why then was Iran sued left and right by NY prosecutors on tenuous -to say the least- links by proxies to an attack on American (and french) soldiers in a remote Lebanon during the Lebanese civil war?
Is that any proof of the complete selectivity and politicization of this kind of trials? Hardly any kind of "justice for all".
This said if others countries start to sue the US for their numerous misdeeds abroad (from the CIA among many), starting with the families of the 30000 Iraqi soldiers literally slaughtered on a former administration officials lies and forged intel about non-existing WMS and Yellow cake stockpiles, i just can't wait to see the hypocrisy of the US authorities and same congress members, who will be then seen feigning outrage with nationalistic tremolos.
39
Where were all these concerned Americans during the Iraq war, when Bush blatantly scapegoated the wrong country, and the rubes went happily along?
We've spent the last 15 years fighting terrorists, many of whom we created, and then politicizing that fight for political gain - seems more than a little disingenuous to finally be getting angry at the Wahhabists and their benefactors now. We've known for decades what they were all about, it's an "arrangement."
Saudi is our ultra-conservative Partner in Fear, they set up the scary terrorists and we knock them down, it makes for wonderful theater for the violence-addicted masses. And they also give us cheap oil! Whatever happened to loyalty, America?
We've spent the last 15 years fighting terrorists, many of whom we created, and then politicizing that fight for political gain - seems more than a little disingenuous to finally be getting angry at the Wahhabists and their benefactors now. We've known for decades what they were all about, it's an "arrangement."
Saudi is our ultra-conservative Partner in Fear, they set up the scary terrorists and we knock them down, it makes for wonderful theater for the violence-addicted masses. And they also give us cheap oil! Whatever happened to loyalty, America?
302
You are not too firm on the facts surrounding the Iraq war are you? It had nothing to do with state sponsored terrorism. It was done for the same reason that we went into Libya and Syria, so our president elect and democratic front runner are today's version of Bush.
Also, ISIS and al-Qaeda are born out of Mecca and Medina.
Also, ISIS and al-Qaeda are born out of Mecca and Medina.
Wrong. Bush and Cheney DID try to link 9/11 and Iraq. To say otherwise is ignorance. You were wrong then and you're wrong now, own it. Here are some links. You can find plenty more which corroborate these, if you are willing to look.
http://www.cnn.com/2014/12/12/world/cia-cable-iraq-war/
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A50679-2004Jun17.html
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/middleeast/iraq/6692586/George...
http://www.nbcnews.com/id/3080244/default.htm#.VztzGfkrK70
http://www.cnn.com/2014/12/12/world/cia-cable-iraq-war/
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A50679-2004Jun17.html
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/middleeast/iraq/6692586/George...
http://www.nbcnews.com/id/3080244/default.htm#.VztzGfkrK70
9
It wasn't just the 'rubes' that went happily along with the Iraq war. It was people who should have known better - like the editors of this newspaper. The media, including the NYT, failed to question the spurious logic of the illegal attack on Iraq.
8
Stinking Bushes won't like it. Because they are "not with us, but with terrorists" Harboring them, best body's going for investigation No,No!!!
So Saudi Arabia was behind the 9/11 attacks, yet Bush/Cheney and crew kept it secret and sold the war in Iraq and Afghanistan instead. The fact that this is getting so little play in the media is mind boggling. Biggest blunder in US history has now become a lie. Trillions spent, hundreds of thousands dead. This is beyond criminal. Bush/Cheney and everyone involved need to be prosecuted and jailed.
554
That's not what the article said.
Last month, the commission co-chairmen Thomas Kean and Lee Hamilton issued a statement saying that the 28 pages “were based almost entirely on raw, unvetted material that came to the FBI” — much of it ultimately deemed inconclusive by the Sept. 11 commission
The lies by Bush Co. about Saddam being behind 9/11 still stand, however.
Last month, the commission co-chairmen Thomas Kean and Lee Hamilton issued a statement saying that the 28 pages “were based almost entirely on raw, unvetted material that came to the FBI” — much of it ultimately deemed inconclusive by the Sept. 11 commission
The lies by Bush Co. about Saddam being behind 9/11 still stand, however.
8
Its not a blunder. It was a well planned strategy to start a war. Bush and Chaney were the major players in this attack along with the Saudis and the Israelis. Of course the Israelis will get a free pass because they run this country. Just ask you Republican Congressman.
5
Agree with all your points, except:
"Biggest blunder in US history has now become a lie."
Iraq War 2 was ALWAYS a lie, based on lies, and deceitfully twisted by Bush/Cheney/Tenant, etc to justify the worst fiasco in US history.
The culprits here -- Bush, Cheney, Tenant, etc -- are the ones who should be getting sued and be subjected to both criminal charges, abuse of government charges, and international war crimes charges!
"Biggest blunder in US history has now become a lie."
Iraq War 2 was ALWAYS a lie, based on lies, and deceitfully twisted by Bush/Cheney/Tenant, etc to justify the worst fiasco in US history.
The culprits here -- Bush, Cheney, Tenant, etc -- are the ones who should be getting sued and be subjected to both criminal charges, abuse of government charges, and international war crimes charges!
14
"Another sign of escalating tensions" between the Congress and Obama.
Anything to undermine his ability to conduct foreign policy and to create
a crisis before the election.
Anything to undermine his ability to conduct foreign policy and to create
a crisis before the election.
2
More idiocy from the idiot congress.....
Really tick off a key strategic ally when we really need their help with a really sticky problem....and to what end exactly?
Really tick off a key strategic ally when we really need their help with a really sticky problem....and to what end exactly?
2
The Saudis are our ally? Now that's funny.
79
Is one of the biggest human rights abusers our ally? Pray tell, what does America stand for?
9
Are the Saudis making a terrorist threat to destabilize the American economy?
That's a criminal offense right there just by saying it, let alone doing it.
Where are the laws in this country?
Where is the government?
In the pocket of the Saudis...
That's a criminal offense right there just by saying it, let alone doing it.
Where are the laws in this country?
Where is the government?
In the pocket of the Saudis...
19
I think we'd sooner pay our debt back to China before seeing a penny from them.
Good job we need to reevaluate our allies. The Saudis have never been our friends at all. They have been our enemies since day one. I don't care about their toxic oil at all. We have more oil than them. We need to sue Bush and Cheney as well because they knew about this attack all along.
219
Remember The Project for a New American Century that gave so many of us the shivers? This is apparently the project they had in mind. Spending the next century battling the terrorists the Bush Administration created.
1
And also put people in prison who lied to us and caused thousands of Americans die in false wa in Iraq. You are right that GW Buch and Cheney should go first, followed by Rumsfeld and all list of Bush's neocons. We need to clean this horrible legacy to become a real democracy.
So if we find out that Saudi Arabia was a combating enemy nation, since W Bush helped implicated Saudis escape, that would make W a traitor right?
241
I don't think we need to show W's complicity with SA to know he is a traitor. Everything he did was to enrich himself and the oligarchs that got him into power. Everything he did made America weaker. How is that not a definition of traitorous behavior?
259
And Cheney, Wolfowitz, Rumsfeld, Powell, Tenet, Condi "Oh, Why Can't You Be Like Your Cousin, Connie" Rice. Joint Chiefs of Staff, the list goes on.
I feel deeply for the 9/11 families, know one and have met others. As much as I would so love to see the entire bunch on trial at the Hague, please someone tell me why we've really no reason to fear passage of this bill and assure me of those reasons. Please. :0(
I feel deeply for the 9/11 families, know one and have met others. As much as I would so love to see the entire bunch on trial at the Hague, please someone tell me why we've really no reason to fear passage of this bill and assure me of those reasons. Please. :0(
6
W is already a traitor and a liar and responsible for the deaths of so many military and civilian personnel.
9
15 of 19 from Saudi Arabia. And we are now just discussing examining the role of their government??? And Obama might block it???
We know they are guilty, but are addicted to their oil!
The best opportunity we had to strengthen the American economy was after 9/11. Instead of encouraging general spending, we should have encouraged national security through self-sufficiency. That would have meant big changes to energy production, and Bush was never going to do that. It is sad that Obama is following his lead.
We know they are guilty, but are addicted to their oil!
The best opportunity we had to strengthen the American economy was after 9/11. Instead of encouraging general spending, we should have encouraged national security through self-sufficiency. That would have meant big changes to energy production, and Bush was never going to do that. It is sad that Obama is following his lead.
4
There is much more at stake here and it's not oil. We actually import much more from Canada than Saudi Arabia, and we export a fair amount as well.
http://www.eia.gov/tools/faqs/faq.cfm?id=727&t=6
http://www.eia.gov/tools/faqs/faq.cfm?id=727&t=6
2
If Americans can sue Iran, why not Saudi Arabia?
82
Indeed. That seems to be the completely arbitrary and politicized aspect of the American so-called "justice for all". That and reciprocity, as i can't wait to see the US equally sued abroad for their numerous misdeeds, if that could help in anyway to contain its unjustifiable military adventures in the future...
2
I think the concern is that they can sue us too. Also, how would you actually conduct such a lawsuit. Subpoena the Saudi government and witnesses. How would that work. I have no problem with us revealing what we know about Saudi involvement, in fact our government should tell us..
1
I hope the White House will be overruled on this one issue. 15 Saudi citizens conspired to kill 3,000 Americans with passenger jet, the pinnacle of Western engineering. No traces in Saudi Arabia were picked up. How can that be?
The conspirators are here and promised Saudi Arabia total immunity for their help in throwing over the dangerous liberalism of the Clinton years which was wealth for all and no stupid wars. 9/11 burst that bubble.
I hope the Saudis start to squeal and that we find out how this coup was planned.
The conspirators are here and promised Saudi Arabia total immunity for their help in throwing over the dangerous liberalism of the Clinton years which was wealth for all and no stupid wars. 9/11 burst that bubble.
I hope the Saudis start to squeal and that we find out how this coup was planned.
44
If the Saudis dump their T-Bills, the FED can just buy them all up, or the IMF will use Special Drawing Rights and buy them up. What will the Saudis covert their USDs into? The USD is THE reserve currency of the world and no real competitor from the BRICS is ready to challenge, yet. There is not enough available physical gold to buy and buying paper gold (ETFs) is just STUPID unless you want to devalue the very metal that you want to invest in. So, they are stuck.
3
What a shame that closing quote didn't appear much closer to the top of the story. Igniting international incidents is serious business; Mr. Obama, as usual, is right to show great caution before doing such a thing.
2
Geez, if we absolutely had to be at war with any country it would hands down be this 'friend' of ours. I'm shedding no tears at exposing Saudi Arabia to some kind of payback for 9/11. With friends like these who needs enemies. Break 'em, and rip their madrassas and mosques out of the rest of the world. Poisoned rats, spreading their poison around the world.
120
It's about time. They need to pay for their actions. Time to send the Bedouins back to their tents. When I think of all the war, pollution, and terrorism spawned by this relationship, I get sick. We no longer need their black gold. Bye bye Middle East!
171
We all wish we don't need it but we do.
Actually Mr. Green I understand your sentiment, but if the Saudis pull their money and investments, the US economy plummets. Without Saudi money and Chinese money our economy fails to exist. Sad but true. Petroleum..now thats another can of worms altogether.
So if this door is opened for US families to sue Saudi Arabia for loss of lives
of family members, can we then please foot the bill for the families in Iraq who had a half million of their children die as result of the US led sanctions against Iraq during Bush administration? Those who died in the bombing of the Doctors Without Borders hospital in Afghanistan? The several hundred Iranian civilians shot down by US navy in the Gulf? Or any other Middle Easterners who died as a result of our protecting out interests in the region,
i.e., oil?
of family members, can we then please foot the bill for the families in Iraq who had a half million of their children die as result of the US led sanctions against Iraq during Bush administration? Those who died in the bombing of the Doctors Without Borders hospital in Afghanistan? The several hundred Iranian civilians shot down by US navy in the Gulf? Or any other Middle Easterners who died as a result of our protecting out interests in the region,
i.e., oil?
1
Don't worry Saudi Arabia, Barrack Hussein Obama will veto the will of the American people.
5
Curious to see how President Obama wants to secure his legacy with this bill. He was all for "transparency" in 2008 but something tells me his veto pen is at the ready to favor the status quo re: Saudi relations over the victimized families who suffered such enormous emotional, personal, financial and psychic tolls after 9/11.
13
@DavidWatts - Curious that you completely ignore the problem of sovereign immunity, which is the real issue.
5
Too little too late. We've overlooked their involvement in our nation's greatest terrorist attack to preserve an alliance for what? Oil? I'm not exactly sure the justification, but the whole point is moot. The government let us down, and I'm referring to both sides of the aisle
18
It's strange that the article does not mention how the FBI, apparently at George W. Bush's directions, helped Saudi nationals flee the US immediately after 9/11. It was particularly notable because one would have thought that the FBI would not be interested in helping potential suspects flee.
414
I thought FBI was independent in the Free Land
What is potential suspect?
Our administration was apparently concerned that the Bin Laden family would be inconvenienced. I lost my father on 9/11 and traveled to NYC by bus. The three days on the bus -- not knowing the fate of my father, but knowing that my mother was alone in NY -- were the most difficult time of my life. No help from our government getting me and the other relatives of 9/11 victims to NY. We did not rate the kind of consideration that our own government gave to the Bin Ladens. Shame on Bush.
1
The US government is continuing to transact business behind closed doors. The 28 pages of the Congressional report are still classified and have not have been made public. Yet the Senate presses on and passes legislation without informing the public of facts. Whatever the classified information discloses it should not be used to do away with “sovereign immunity”. The United States may well be sued in foreign courts if sovereign immunity doctrine is abandoned. See my comments “America’s Double Edged Saudi Sword” at
http://deyanbrashich.com/home/2016/4/27/americas-double-edged-saudi-swor...
http://deyanbrashich.com/home/2016/4/27/americas-double-edged-saudi-swor...
1
There is obviously something very strange about the relationship between America and Saudi Arabia. At the very least, some members of either the Saudi royal family or high ranking government officials were involved in the 9/11 attack, hence the censorship of the 9/11 report from Americans.
The truth must be forced out into the open. America's dysfunctional relationship with the middle east, starting with Israel, needs to be exposed for what it is and reshaped into less American involvement. 68 years of America trying to police the middle east has only brought tragedy.
Enough is enough!
The truth must be forced out into the open. America's dysfunctional relationship with the middle east, starting with Israel, needs to be exposed for what it is and reshaped into less American involvement. 68 years of America trying to police the middle east has only brought tragedy.
Enough is enough!
104
Why "starting with Israel"? How about starting with Saudi Arabia who seems to have been complicit, at least to a degree, with the 9/11 attacks?
3
We should end the "aggressive deception" run through Obama and Bush's FBI!
John Lehman of the 9/11 Commission repudiated the comments of Kean and Hamilton. And former Senator Bob Graham wrote convincingly that John Brennan is wrong in claiming it's not time to release the pages.
Do we desire justice for the victims of 9/11?
John Lehman of the 9/11 Commission repudiated the comments of Kean and Hamilton. And former Senator Bob Graham wrote convincingly that John Brennan is wrong in claiming it's not time to release the pages.
Do we desire justice for the victims of 9/11?
1
It is about time the US Congress had the nerve to stand up to the Saudi's.
All of these years we have grovelled and bowed to them as if they were anything important in the scheme of things other than a gas station.
The memory of our presidents either bowing or holding hands with these sheikhs has been seared into my consciousness.
If not for our country and the brave soldiers who fought for their freedom Saddam Hussein would have had their heads lopped off, if they had the guts to stay and not run to the safety of their bankers in Zurich.
When I learned that our then President George W Bush allowed these "allies" to escape questioning directly after 911, I was incensed and highly suspicious of this event.
All of these years we have grovelled and bowed to them as if they were anything important in the scheme of things other than a gas station.
The memory of our presidents either bowing or holding hands with these sheikhs has been seared into my consciousness.
If not for our country and the brave soldiers who fought for their freedom Saddam Hussein would have had their heads lopped off, if they had the guts to stay and not run to the safety of their bankers in Zurich.
When I learned that our then President George W Bush allowed these "allies" to escape questioning directly after 911, I was incensed and highly suspicious of this event.
31
The vote was unanimous, I guess by a voice vote. Why would any Senator have the guts to resist getting "revenge" from an ally that probably was complicit in this attack. Lest we forget, the U.S. government, that is taxpayers, have paid all who lost family in the 911 attacks I believe a total of 10 Billion dollars.
This was not based on need, but earning capacity. So someone making a million a year could get 10 million while his clerk whose family is now without a breadwinner would get perhaps a hundred thousand for the family to live on.
I hope Obama vetoes this, as Sovereign immunity is a basis of international relationships. The U.S. could have demanded payment from the Saudis but they didn't, and if we had and they refused we could have imposed sanctions.
The world is not held together by "justice" but by interlocking alliances that keep the diverse moving parts functioning. This is a monkey wrench thrown into the mechanism.
AlRodbell.com
This was not based on need, but earning capacity. So someone making a million a year could get 10 million while his clerk whose family is now without a breadwinner would get perhaps a hundred thousand for the family to live on.
I hope Obama vetoes this, as Sovereign immunity is a basis of international relationships. The U.S. could have demanded payment from the Saudis but they didn't, and if we had and they refused we could have imposed sanctions.
The world is not held together by "justice" but by interlocking alliances that keep the diverse moving parts functioning. This is a monkey wrench thrown into the mechanism.
AlRodbell.com
2
Then why is Russia threatening to sue the UK over a judicial report accusing its government of killing a Russian spy? Apparently, Putin thinks it has standing.
1
Germany is throwing a comedian under the bus to placate Turkey. What has happened to sovereignty in this world? Does no country stand up for its own any more?
4
NYT can't talk to commission member John Lehman?
1
What is the need for the government to protect us from unbiased information? I don't get it. The truth is the truth. Just tell us. Fighting so hard to keep something from seeing the light of day only makes people all the more suspicious. And I'm not a conspiracy person...
30
It's remarkable how reticent the New York Times chooses to be about what the "glimpse into what is inside" the 28 pages reveals. I guess I'll have to look at the stuff myself.
Thank you for providing the Internet links, but why not report on them?
Thank you for providing the Internet links, but why not report on them?
52
And it only took 15 years for our glorious United States Senate to finally acknowledge what we all knew on 9/12/01, that Saudi Arabia was the true threat, not Iraq.
Impressive that money, power, and influence were sufficient to keep the manifest truth at bay this long! What a shame that President Obama feels compelled to keep playing the pretend game in order to protect our oil interests in the Middle East. It appears both the Bush and Obama administrations figured the death and destruction we suffered was the cost of doing business.
What an ignoble and vile calculus!
Impressive that money, power, and influence were sufficient to keep the manifest truth at bay this long! What a shame that President Obama feels compelled to keep playing the pretend game in order to protect our oil interests in the Middle East. It appears both the Bush and Obama administrations figured the death and destruction we suffered was the cost of doing business.
What an ignoble and vile calculus!
258
What an eloquent and accurate description of the weaknesses international chess. Bravo!
28 pages is more than Saudis – PLURAL foreign governments.
H.R. 14, 114TH CONGRESS: 2015-16
Reps. Jones (R-NC), Lynch (D-MA), Massie (R-KY)
“Whereas the [Obama] executive branch’s decision to maintain the classified status of these pages prevents the people of the United States from having access to information about THE INVOLVEMENT OF CERTAIN FOREIGN GOVERNMENTS in the terrorist attacks of September 2001;”
H.R. 14, 114TH CONGRESS: 2015-16
Reps. Jones (R-NC), Lynch (D-MA), Massie (R-KY)
“Whereas the [Obama] executive branch’s decision to maintain the classified status of these pages prevents the people of the United States from having access to information about THE INVOLVEMENT OF CERTAIN FOREIGN GOVERNMENTS in the terrorist attacks of September 2001;”
16
The 9/11 commission was a joke. They let the Bush administration off the hook, threw softball questions to Rudy, didn't hold Christie Whitman accountable for her statement that the area around ground zero was safe to breathe. And they purposely left these pages out so the Saudis were not going to have to answer to their actions. As a fireman who was there I want to know why we go to war against Iraq but not only do nothing to the Saudis, but actually help a bunch get out of town when the rest of the country was a no fly zone. Let's hear it George W. Tell us why
633
George W. Bush. The worst President we ever had...
5
Doesn't the Bush family have oil interests in common with the Saudis?
2
Just remember there were no Iraqis on the 911 airplanes. How many Saudis were there? Seventeen comes to mind.
3
Once again the Times reports on the vote on an important bill and fails to give the vote or a breakdown by party.
This has become depressingly the norm here lately
This has become depressingly the norm here lately
37
Maybe because it was a voice vote?
Jim, in the very first sentence of the article it states "passed the Senate unanimously". That would be a veto proof majority if it holds.
3
"unanimous"
Would have been nice if Congress had reacted this way after 9/11 instead of authorizing "W" to go to war with Iraq.
35
I'd worry more about the Saudi's dumping their luxury real estate and popping the bubble.
10
You mean, make Manhattan affordable?
6
15 years is a long time for accountability, Trump Effect