What an agonizing decision the father had to make. I can only imagine the internal struggle. One point that I hear in this story is that Mr. Shafi tried on numerous occasions to intervene and help his son eschew Muslim radicalization. He spoke of hoping the government would help his son get treatment or counseling. It sounds like he had months to try to help Adam before he was arrested. Mr. Shafi is an educated man. If he can't change his son's mind, how does he think the government can? I agree with others about the gang mentality and many of our youth feeling some sort of detachment in society. This makes absolute sense. I'm not sure exactly what the answer is. I do, however, feel that had Adam not been arrested, he would have killed innocent people and possibly himself. As a parent, I can only imagine the heartbreak Mr. Shafi is going through. Though, I must say that if I were in his shoes and couldn't persuade my child to come to his senses, I wouldn't have any other choice but to turn him in. I wouldn't be able to live with myself if innocent people died at the hands of my child, especially if I saw the writing on the wall. Such a tragedy!
2
It's the craziness of the prosecutors that bugs me. A few years of cooling off time in a fed facility seems reasonable. Draconian behavior will cause other parents to avoid informing police.
2
Never cooperate with the FBI. I repeat, never cooperate with the FBI. Make anonymous call to FBI to report a suspicious activity is fine. If the FBI is asking for your cooperate with an investigation, refuse. And if the FBI wants to talk to you, do it with a competent attorney present if you are dumb enough to agree to it in the first place.
FBI have a nasty habit of investigating the people they are seeking "cooperation" and will entrap you while you are carelessly "cooperating" with them. Don't think you are too smart to be entrapped. he laws in this country are so numerous and contradictory you will be entrapped.
Fighting ISIS is every American's duty but if you are not careful, you might be charged along with the terrorist. It might just be a tactic to force you to turn state witnesses but it is not something you want to go through.
FBI have a nasty habit of investigating the people they are seeking "cooperation" and will entrap you while you are carelessly "cooperating" with them. Don't think you are too smart to be entrapped. he laws in this country are so numerous and contradictory you will be entrapped.
Fighting ISIS is every American's duty but if you are not careful, you might be charged along with the terrorist. It might just be a tactic to force you to turn state witnesses but it is not something you want to go through.
5
My heart goes to Sal Shafi, I hope things will work out and something good comes out of it and his faith is restored.
In my opinion, People in most of western countries and few developing countries are taking religion easy to just fit their faith and beliefs. On the other side, muslim religion dominated countries still depend a lot on religion and build faith towards it rather than their own. So there is a conflict among both and its affecting migrants as well in this case who think for good in general but left in a state of confusion. I think, too much following of any religion/cult-thinking is generally bad.
In my opinion, People in most of western countries and few developing countries are taking religion easy to just fit their faith and beliefs. On the other side, muslim religion dominated countries still depend a lot on religion and build faith towards it rather than their own. So there is a conflict among both and its affecting migrants as well in this case who think for good in general but left in a state of confusion. I think, too much following of any religion/cult-thinking is generally bad.
2
I feel for Mr. Shafi and anyone else who gets the heel of the government's boot for doing the right thing. Unfortunately, in this day and age once a kid is "in the system", for whatever reason, the driving force is to keep them incarcerated in order to keep so-called "correctional officers" employed and their fat pensions funded. Meaningful rehabilitation or any attempt to fix what is broken with individuals like Adam Shafi is simply not available. To the contrary, attempts to educate, provide training or meaningful mental health counseling for offenders in the U.S. are at all time lows. When will we learn?
5
Often, it is only immediate family who is aware when a member becomes radicalized. However, our ill thought out policies will not encourage families to seek help if they suspect a a sibling or child is turning to jihad. They will, instead, remain silent. Putting children like Adam in prison will not make us safer. I would argue that it makes us less safe because other parents, in a similar situation, will simply remain silent rather than destroy the lives of their children on a "hunch".
7
he did the right thing. as a muslim, i sympathize with this father tremendously, but he should focus on the fact that he saved countless lives. this sick son was clearly on his way to joining ISIS and raping/murdering innocents before returning here and killing only more. his son clearly had chances to leave the jihad but he was mentally too far gone. he was already dreaming of martyrdom and afterlife pleasures.
9
He may have saved countless lives, but no one will ever know if that it's true. He did, thing, destroy at least on life, that of his son. Though it's all but certain I'll never have children, I'd much rather not destroy the life of my child
3
"this sick son was clearly on his way to joining ISIS and raping/murdering innocents before returning here and killing only more"
Did you read the article? Adam didn't endorse ISIS. He was joining another group that was fighting the Islamic State. How on earth did you draw from the information provided that he was clearly on his way to raping/murdering innocents before returning and killing only more?
I am shocked that the Times endorses this comment. It is drawing upon fearful stereotypes that aren't helpful.
Many people in the US are afraid of Muslims and quick to judge them as terrorists. Let's take a look at the way we relate to other countries and objectively decide who the terrorist is.
Actually, let's get deeper than pointing fingers at any group or institution. Lets remember how it feels to be labeled as something negative, and think about how sensitive we all are. how impacted by others we are. in those moments of insecurity, we rely on those who see our value and believe in us. When all of society is undervaluing you, when your own parent doesn't trust you because they and everyone else is so afraid of this "terrorist other" that you are beginning to resemble to them before you've even considered it yourself, you start to internalize this identity. They lock you up and fail to realize that they created the terrorist in the first place.
Did you read the article? Adam didn't endorse ISIS. He was joining another group that was fighting the Islamic State. How on earth did you draw from the information provided that he was clearly on his way to raping/murdering innocents before returning and killing only more?
I am shocked that the Times endorses this comment. It is drawing upon fearful stereotypes that aren't helpful.
Many people in the US are afraid of Muslims and quick to judge them as terrorists. Let's take a look at the way we relate to other countries and objectively decide who the terrorist is.
Actually, let's get deeper than pointing fingers at any group or institution. Lets remember how it feels to be labeled as something negative, and think about how sensitive we all are. how impacted by others we are. in those moments of insecurity, we rely on those who see our value and believe in us. When all of society is undervaluing you, when your own parent doesn't trust you because they and everyone else is so afraid of this "terrorist other" that you are beginning to resemble to them before you've even considered it yourself, you start to internalize this identity. They lock you up and fail to realize that they created the terrorist in the first place.
1
Did you read the article? Adam didn't endorse ISIS. He was joining another group that was fighting the Islamic State. How on earth did you draw from the information provided that he was clearly on his way to raping/murdering innocents before returning and killing only more?
I am shocked that the Times endorses this comment. It is drawing upon fearful stereotypes that aren't helpful.
Many people in the US are afraid of Muslims and quick to judge them as terrorists. Let's take a look at the way we relate to other countries and objectively decide who the terrorist is.
Actually, let's get deeper than pointing fingers at any group or institution. Lets remember how it feels to be labeled as something negative, and think about how sensitive we all are. how impacted by others we are. in those moments of insecurity, we rely on those who see our value and believe in us. When all of society is undervaluing you, when your own parent doesn't trust you because they and everyone else is so afraid of this "terrorist other" that you are beginning to resemble to them before you've even considered it yourself, you start to internalize this identity. They lock you up and fail to realize that they created the terrorist in the first place.
I am shocked that the Times endorses this comment. It is drawing upon fearful stereotypes that aren't helpful.
Many people in the US are afraid of Muslims and quick to judge them as terrorists. Let's take a look at the way we relate to other countries and objectively decide who the terrorist is.
Actually, let's get deeper than pointing fingers at any group or institution. Lets remember how it feels to be labeled as something negative, and think about how sensitive we all are. how impacted by others we are. in those moments of insecurity, we rely on those who see our value and believe in us. When all of society is undervaluing you, when your own parent doesn't trust you because they and everyone else is so afraid of this "terrorist other" that you are beginning to resemble to them before you've even considered it yourself, you start to internalize this identity. They lock you up and fail to realize that they created the terrorist in the first place.
2
The Economist reported the program of de radicalization Europeans
are trying to wean young men off Terrorism. It involves psychologist,
social worker and religious leader who could provide an alternate
version of Islam to what ISIS or al Qaeda are preaching. If young men
are attracted to certain ideology of ISIS on internet and it is reinforced
regularly because they access the same web site, exposure to a
different ideology could break the cycle. It is worth trying. Putting
young men in jail didn't solve the drug problem and it won't solve
the problem of terrorism. Deprogramming is needed.
are trying to wean young men off Terrorism. It involves psychologist,
social worker and religious leader who could provide an alternate
version of Islam to what ISIS or al Qaeda are preaching. If young men
are attracted to certain ideology of ISIS on internet and it is reinforced
regularly because they access the same web site, exposure to a
different ideology could break the cycle. It is worth trying. Putting
young men in jail didn't solve the drug problem and it won't solve
the problem of terrorism. Deprogramming is needed.
5
This father did the right thing, despite the pain he feels today and despite the way he feels betrayed by the system. No lives have been lost, and a young man is facing the consequences for his own behavior and poor choices. The FBI, one hopes, does not waste resources and personnel on weak cases. The son will have time to consider how his father loves and supports him enough to keep him from descending into a truly dark madness. I hope and pray that the parents facing these agonizing situations find solace in knowing they are not alone and that their fellow Americans deeply appreciate them for the decisions they made to cooperate with the authorities. Peace and sala'am and shalom.
6
I hate the purity monster. Kids (and people can get quite old without maturing), looking for solutions to their difficulties, looking for leadership, trying to find a leader, a guiding principle, to solve life's problems. Ready-made victims for manipulators and control freaks.
Life is not simple. I've just been reading about Tunisia, and how many young people go over to Syria in search of a living, of answers, of a simplified life. Next thing you know, they're dead or they're killing people. Nobody wins.
Then we go and punish the victims. Our hands are not clean, as we've gone and ruined the neighborhood, over and over again. We wanted the oil, maybe, or somebody influenced somebody. We think we can "convert", export "democracy", but we don't finish the job, repair the infrastructure, make sure there is a civil society, figure out ways they could make a living, support their families. How could we? Adventures abroad always have unintended consequences, and since WWII most of ours were doozies.
Saddam was a hatable guy, a horrible excuse for a human being. We wanted somebody to shoot. Bush went in half cocked, but that's nothing new. We went in and replaced Mossadegh on behalf of BP (that turned out well) with the Shah, and the whole story escalated from there.
Nothing is ever simple. But we are better off with the mess than hating and looking for simple solutions.
Life is not simple. I've just been reading about Tunisia, and how many young people go over to Syria in search of a living, of answers, of a simplified life. Next thing you know, they're dead or they're killing people. Nobody wins.
Then we go and punish the victims. Our hands are not clean, as we've gone and ruined the neighborhood, over and over again. We wanted the oil, maybe, or somebody influenced somebody. We think we can "convert", export "democracy", but we don't finish the job, repair the infrastructure, make sure there is a civil society, figure out ways they could make a living, support their families. How could we? Adventures abroad always have unintended consequences, and since WWII most of ours were doozies.
Saddam was a hatable guy, a horrible excuse for a human being. We wanted somebody to shoot. Bush went in half cocked, but that's nothing new. We went in and replaced Mossadegh on behalf of BP (that turned out well) with the Shah, and the whole story escalated from there.
Nothing is ever simple. But we are better off with the mess than hating and looking for simple solutions.
5
Forgot to mention, we could use a good bit of repairing infrastructure, making sure there is a civil society, and figuring out ways people can make a living at home here in the US, too.
7
Similar intervention models have worked better for street gang, and Jihadist organizations are really similar to street gangs in some key ways. There is a veneer of religious and political aspiration, but it's still mostly a racket that relies and pulling in misguided young people as foot soldiers.
Unfortunately, as the intervention model for dealing with street gang violence was slow to gain acceptance (despite support from even within law enforcement,) I think it may be slow to gain traction with home-grown terrorism.
Unfortunately, as the intervention model for dealing with street gang violence was slow to gain acceptance (despite support from even within law enforcement,) I think it may be slow to gain traction with home-grown terrorism.
1
Look at this boy's bedroom; it's clear how he suffers from poverty and lack of education. It's clear how he has been marginalized by "the west" ?
No one in my family has ever lived like that. My kids lived (in the US) in a house with no kitchen, no internet, no working toilet and no potable water all their high school years. Why are we so terrified to admit there is something about Islamic texts and doctrine that mandates and causes this kind of radical violence? There are many hundreds of millions of poor around the world, lacking power, opportunity and agency. Including my family.
Islamism is the inspiration and driver for this global insurgency. We ignore this truth at our peril.
No one in my family has ever lived like that. My kids lived (in the US) in a house with no kitchen, no internet, no working toilet and no potable water all their high school years. Why are we so terrified to admit there is something about Islamic texts and doctrine that mandates and causes this kind of radical violence? There are many hundreds of millions of poor around the world, lacking power, opportunity and agency. Including my family.
Islamism is the inspiration and driver for this global insurgency. We ignore this truth at our peril.
12
When I think of how attacks on France and Belgium have affected my psyche and made me feel unified with Western Europe and its citizens, I empathize with Adam Shafir. He is much younger and more malleable than I am, and I can see how the violence in the Middle East would have appealed to his idealism and his sense of injustice against those of his own ilk. Sure, it's terrorism that he would have been joining. But it's not hard to see why a young man would be drawn to defending those he views as like him against the Western world and its encroachment, as he sees it anyway, on the Muslim world.
2
The F.B.I.'s tactics need to be streamlined for individual cases and not deceive those with hardcore choices of turning loved ones and relatives in till all is known about the suspected individual's motives. True, the intercepted calls were indicting but talk does not always come from those perceived as following through with criminal acts written in stone. I would suspect that many on the verge of making the drastic choice of diving into full-blown terrorism are deeply troubled perhaps even manic-depressive, lacking lasting relationships and a whole plethora of problems. We don't know all of the intricate details of this case for such a harsh sentence to be handed down, but to get and keep the trust of communities harboring potential candidates for indoctrination must be handled in a more professional manner .
1
Terrorism is awful. But ....since 9-11, approximately 130,000 US. citizens have been killed by American drunk drivers. An entire city, or 4-5 small towns, wiped out, with countless more injured.
Two friends lost relatives this way, both drivers with previous DUI's. Two killed in one accident, one in the other, plus an injured child. The sentence in each case: 3.5 years.
That was for killing, not talk.That was with previous illegal actions (dui's). Let's put this is perspective, if we are really serious about this.
We need programs to help both these groups, before they kill others, so they are monitored, not incarcerated. We need friends and family to know that turning them in will benefit them and society, not lock them up for future actions.
Two friends lost relatives this way, both drivers with previous DUI's. Two killed in one accident, one in the other, plus an injured child. The sentence in each case: 3.5 years.
That was for killing, not talk.That was with previous illegal actions (dui's). Let's put this is perspective, if we are really serious about this.
We need programs to help both these groups, before they kill others, so they are monitored, not incarcerated. We need friends and family to know that turning them in will benefit them and society, not lock them up for future actions.
8
There seems to be more to the story than published here.
Aside from that, what troubles me is the fact that nytimes put Mr. Shafi in an unenviable position of publicly encouraging others to not cooperate with the federal government in matters relating to terror investigations. Can this be construed as obstruction of justice which may lead to further problems for the Shafi household? Another matter is that although Mr. Shafi responded as a duty-minded citizen in reporting his son's activities, commendable as it is, it's no different than thousands of parents who report illegal activities of their children regarding use of drugs. At least in the case of drug abuse there is no potential for large scale killing of innocent civilians. Shafi Jr. may or may not have participated in a terrorist attack but that's why we have due procedures to deal with the risk he poses and I'm quite confident justice will be served in an American court.
Aside from that, what troubles me is the fact that nytimes put Mr. Shafi in an unenviable position of publicly encouraging others to not cooperate with the federal government in matters relating to terror investigations. Can this be construed as obstruction of justice which may lead to further problems for the Shafi household? Another matter is that although Mr. Shafi responded as a duty-minded citizen in reporting his son's activities, commendable as it is, it's no different than thousands of parents who report illegal activities of their children regarding use of drugs. At least in the case of drug abuse there is no potential for large scale killing of innocent civilians. Shafi Jr. may or may not have participated in a terrorist attack but that's why we have due procedures to deal with the risk he poses and I'm quite confident justice will be served in an American court.
4
These aren't homegrown terrorists, these are imported terrorist. Stop the Muslim immigration. Even the lunatic Trump gets it right.
I am tired of people saying:
- there are 1000 Muslim cops in NY
- not all Muslims are terrorists
- Muslim doc saved my life etc etc..
Those cops, doc position would be taken by Christian folks, we would still get the service. Just because they are Muslim doesn't make them special.
Not all Muslim are terrorist, but you can't tell about their children. Muslim immigrated to England to escape precautions, now their children and grandchildren wants sharia in Europe.
Librals are so naive when it comes to Islam.
I am tired of people saying:
- there are 1000 Muslim cops in NY
- not all Muslims are terrorists
- Muslim doc saved my life etc etc..
Those cops, doc position would be taken by Christian folks, we would still get the service. Just because they are Muslim doesn't make them special.
Not all Muslim are terrorist, but you can't tell about their children. Muslim immigrated to England to escape precautions, now their children and grandchildren wants sharia in Europe.
Librals are so naive when it comes to Islam.
10
Boy did your article start out promising and then tank. That's all we need is story which ends with the message "don't cooperate with the government." Adam was clearly going down the wrong path, and thanks to his dad and the government, we're safer. This father could have been a great example of a Patriotic Muslim. So close.
11
Mr. Sal Shafi is a courageous man. Reporting your son to the authorities admits defeat that you could not manage your child. This is a very hard call for any parent be it admitting that your child should be tested for autism at a young age or admitting your teenager has a drug, alcohol or suicidal problem. Terrorism is a bigger scarier issue that can fatally harm many people. Mr. Shafi had the choice of turning Adam in or the possibility of seeing his son in the news as a terrorist blowing up innocent people. The FBI and Homeland know much more than we will ever know but reporting someone like Adam is the right thing to do.
6
Thanks NYT, you just paved the road for the next 9/11. Reckon we will call it something else then. Thanks again.
5
And precisely how has the NYT done that? This article is NOT an editorial, nor is it made up. This is something that actually happened. Do you propose only writing about subjects from a pre-approved list?
10
By suggesting that parents think twice about reporting when they see obvious signs of radicalization.
4
There should be a program to help the parents of these kids. They need help living with their actions, which were right but obviously very painful.
2
Another good reason for when in Rome do as the Romans.
Why don't these Muslims convert to Christianity when coming to predominately Christian countries? Then his son would not even identify with Muslims. Many many if not the majority Asians immigrants in the US convert to Christianity. If you want to be a Muslim go to a Muslim country.
Of course the Jews did not convert. But they're not stuck in the 9th century like many Muslims.
Why don't these Muslims convert to Christianity when coming to predominately Christian countries? Then his son would not even identify with Muslims. Many many if not the majority Asians immigrants in the US convert to Christianity. If you want to be a Muslim go to a Muslim country.
Of course the Jews did not convert. But they're not stuck in the 9th century like many Muslims.
11
I find this comment as disturbing as anything Adam Safri did.
An Ametican citizen is clueless enough to claim that immigrants should be obliged to convert to Christianity. And thinks it's Mr. Safri who's living in another century. Sad. This commenter missed out on pretty much every basic concept of Anerican history in grade school.
An Ametican citizen is clueless enough to claim that immigrants should be obliged to convert to Christianity. And thinks it's Mr. Safri who's living in another century. Sad. This commenter missed out on pretty much every basic concept of Anerican history in grade school.
1
I would suggest that folks leave their religion at home if the country they are moving to does not hold it as a dominant religion. Of course no one should be forced to convert to another religion, just don't bring the baggage of your old religion and its self-limiting beliefs with you. Give yourself and your family a fresh start. Imagine how different Europe would be today if that had been practiced by Muslim immigrants over the past 30 years?
9
No where did I say immigrants should be obliged to convert. But logical sensible people who want to assimilate adopt the ways of the culture they want to join. I see many many Asians (immigrants) in christian churches. They understand the concept of when in Rome. I see many (I think too many mosques in the US and Europe). You don't see many Buddhist, Shinto, etc... temples.
3
These people would commit murder if given the chance. They would, intentionally, try to murder are many people as possible.
They intentionally target women, children and non-combatants.
If their parents don't turn them in they should be charged as well. I am tired of worrying about the feelings of religious lunatics.
They intentionally target women, children and non-combatants.
If their parents don't turn them in they should be charged as well. I am tired of worrying about the feelings of religious lunatics.
22
When I went to China at age 18 for a study abroad course, my dad thought I was a terrorist.
I don't even know how that works. I really don't. But that was what he thought, and I'm lucky he didn't "turn me in". I don't trust the system to do its job, judging by one time when my mom falsely called the police on me. Adults are trusted far more than children in these cases.
I'm in my 30s now, but I worry for current youth who might be accidentally ensnared by their own misguided or delusional parents.
I don't even know how that works. I really don't. But that was what he thought, and I'm lucky he didn't "turn me in". I don't trust the system to do its job, judging by one time when my mom falsely called the police on me. Adults are trusted far more than children in these cases.
I'm in my 30s now, but I worry for current youth who might be accidentally ensnared by their own misguided or delusional parents.
3
What does this have to do with a 22 year old involved with terrorist who the FBI has on tape confirming his violent intent?
12
What are we now, Phillip K Dick's dystopian "Minority Report" where you're convicted of crimes you haven't yet committed?
Fighting radicalization in our Muslim communities just took a HUGE blow! A father is worried about his son, talks to the FBI, and, rather than work with him and the son, they arrest the son for a dubious crime and for crimes he hasn't yet committed and aim to lock him up for 20 years.
I'll bet a hundred bucks Mr. Shafi is the LAST father to do so. The FBI and the Federal Government will never be trusted by loyal citizens like Mr. Shafi again. Why should they? And so, getting help from the Americans of the Muslim faith, having been betrayed by the Feebs, isn't likely to happen again.
Flat-out ham-handed stupidity that hasn't changed since J. Edgar Hoover.
Fighting radicalization in our Muslim communities just took a HUGE blow! A father is worried about his son, talks to the FBI, and, rather than work with him and the son, they arrest the son for a dubious crime and for crimes he hasn't yet committed and aim to lock him up for 20 years.
I'll bet a hundred bucks Mr. Shafi is the LAST father to do so. The FBI and the Federal Government will never be trusted by loyal citizens like Mr. Shafi again. Why should they? And so, getting help from the Americans of the Muslim faith, having been betrayed by the Feebs, isn't likely to happen again.
Flat-out ham-handed stupidity that hasn't changed since J. Edgar Hoover.
7
Better than carrying the burden of 100 deaths for the rest of your life and a dead child. Terrible, but better.
16
The article doesn't detail what the family background is relative to their settlement in the US. Some say that the young Muslims in the West that are most vulnerable to radicalization are the 2nd generation, the children of immigrants, particularly if these children were at a vulnerable age when the family immigrated, ie, adding to the difficulties of assimilation. Even if US born, there is still some risk - radicalization becoming the 21st century version of young adult rebellion, not unlike the 60's were for a generation of disaffected youth. Depression, disaffection, rebellion and thoughts of suicide, fleeting or otherwise, are hallmarks of youth.
I agree with the earlier thoughts by commenter Binx Bolling that the Muslim community needs to address the thought disorder that's oozing into the minds of the young in their community. Like this ex-jihadi -
http://www.npr.org/2015/01/15/377442344/how-orwells-animal-farm-led-a-ra...
I agree with the earlier thoughts by commenter Binx Bolling that the Muslim community needs to address the thought disorder that's oozing into the minds of the young in their community. Like this ex-jihadi -
http://www.npr.org/2015/01/15/377442344/how-orwells-animal-farm-led-a-ra...
7
Why is it that ONLY Muslim 2nd generation appears to be having this problem? We don't hear children of Vietnamese war refugee's children blowing up people in the west? Nor do we hear Tibetan children blowing up the in Chinese Subway. Is it that they never go through a vulnerable age? Why is is that a rich privileged kid think of killing innocent fellow human beings?
I think folks who rationalize are worse than the perpetrators themselves. They give these radicals room to grow and make them feel that there is a valid reason behind their vile radical thought.
I think folks who rationalize are worse than the perpetrators themselves. They give these radicals room to grow and make them feel that there is a valid reason behind their vile radical thought.
6
What a brave father who tried desperately to save his son from himself. I am not sure that once radicalized, people can change, so I do not know if his son could ever be helped, nor what kind of danger he would pose going forward. Religious radicalization is a situation similar to what happened to some of our servicemen who were captured in the Korean Conflict. However, I would imagine radical religious convictions must be much be more difficult to deal with than political convictions, because religious convictions are at the core of a person's being.
Mr. Shafi, I am so very sorry the government let you down. You acted out of love for your son, and didn't want to lose him. Is there a solution to all this? I really don't know. I hope that your son can somehow be saved.
Mr. Shafi, I am so very sorry the government let you down. You acted out of love for your son, and didn't want to lose him. Is there a solution to all this? I really don't know. I hope that your son can somehow be saved.
4
People can always change away from radical, violent, and destructive thoughts and ideas. They can learn to channel these identity stealing notions into positive reinforcements to live productive, meaningful lives. It's getting over the trauma of adolescence and the self identity crisis that many times accompanies this period of life that is crucial. Equally important is that there be the older mentor to guide a young person down the right path for themselves, away from death and self destructiveness.
The clash of ideas that the Earth's civilizations are currently engaged will end eventually. If not we probably will destroy ourselves, as Carl Sagan warned us to seriously figure out. So far we continue to straddle the fence. No one can bring themselves to lead their 'people' away from the ancient hold of angry, frightful, and all punishing god(s). Even messages of "peace" become supernatural dogma that rigidly forbids one from straying less they lose the "afterlife"... . There's little left for the populations to explore when any religion lets itself get left behind the unrush of progress and technology.
The clash of ideas that the Earth's civilizations are currently engaged will end eventually. If not we probably will destroy ourselves, as Carl Sagan warned us to seriously figure out. So far we continue to straddle the fence. No one can bring themselves to lead their 'people' away from the ancient hold of angry, frightful, and all punishing god(s). Even messages of "peace" become supernatural dogma that rigidly forbids one from straying less they lose the "afterlife"... . There's little left for the populations to explore when any religion lets itself get left behind the unrush of progress and technology.
1
Should we fear radicalized youth of any religious persuasion (read violent armed Christian protesters at abortion clinics as well as Moslem jihadists returning from Syria) ? Of course. But it also seems that imprisoning someone for 20 years is a ridiculous way to deal with this problem. Why not work to construct and encourage groups of Moslems and Christians to try to work with these individuals. If necessary it could be in jail or in civil therapy sessions. 20 years make no sense especially in this case where the family structure is clearly concerned for their family member.
10
Yes! Finally a voice of reason!
It wouldn't even have to be in jail, a minimum security boot camp where the kids are occupied with projects serving the community, such as cleaning up the environment, beaches, parks, highways, building trails, roads, etc. for a year or two would do wonders. Anyone escaping from those camps, they become fair game. They had their chance and blew it.
Just put them on the no-fly list, mark their DL or their passport and make sure they can't buy guns. The amount of damage they could then do while on the run would be limited and a reasonable balance of risk vs benefit.
It wouldn't even have to be in jail, a minimum security boot camp where the kids are occupied with projects serving the community, such as cleaning up the environment, beaches, parks, highways, building trails, roads, etc. for a year or two would do wonders. Anyone escaping from those camps, they become fair game. They had their chance and blew it.
Just put them on the no-fly list, mark their DL or their passport and make sure they can't buy guns. The amount of damage they could then do while on the run would be limited and a reasonable balance of risk vs benefit.
7
I would be very afraid of violent of violent christian terrorists if they bombed this many places as ISIS did:
http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2015/06/17/world/middleeast/map-isis-...
Until then I would focus on the clear and present danger, that you seem to be ignoring,
http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2015/06/17/world/middleeast/map-isis-...
Until then I would focus on the clear and present danger, that you seem to be ignoring,
4
This is part of the problem. So many wonder why family members don't report suspicious family activity yet when someone does they feel guilty and misled by the government. Look, an adult this age knows right from wrong. If the facts are correct as to the comments heard in the eavesdropping this is exactly what the father should have done. What else are you going to do when a grown adult makes these kind of comments? Other choices turn to sorrow when the acts take place. Let the kid rot in jail as far as I'm concerned. In today's world we don't need these types of conversations taking place. Assuming the comments are correct to begin with. I say get the kid off the street before innocents get killed.
4
This poor father had a decision to make and he made the only one he could, really. Not only has he saved the life of others, most probably also saved his sons life. No clear crime has been committed yet so perhaps the son will get some help.
9
The Muslim community must take the first step here by providing a peace-directed path for young people seeking a mission in life.
13
Tragic. The US government let down a honest, decent American.
6
Had the US failed to act and Adam killed or maimed, they would be letting down a country decent enough to give them freedom and opportunities unknown in their own country. It's tragic we don't use more common sense in immigration selection.
5
How can Mr. Shafi blame himself? Only because he is a parent who loves his son. The only person to blame is his son for engaging in this kind of activity and discussing violent actin a time such as this. Mr. Shafi needs to consider how he would feel if he hadn't notified the government but then his son had been involved in a San Bernardino-type incident. Sometimes there is no easy choice but of course no parent can ever imagine that their child would be capable of violence against strangers. This is human. It is just such a sad circumstance. Thank you Mr. Shafi for doing the right thing. One can only hope that justice will be served in the end and that your son will be free if that is the right thing. It is so hard to know.
12
Vanessa, your reasoning is blinded by fear.
Did Adam need reeducation? Definitely!
Are there better ways than 20 years in a maximum security prison in solitary confinement to achieve that? Definitely!
Is our society prepared to discuss this rationally? Definitely NOT!
Did Adam need reeducation? Definitely!
Are there better ways than 20 years in a maximum security prison in solitary confinement to achieve that? Definitely!
Is our society prepared to discuss this rationally? Definitely NOT!
7
Thou Shalt Not Kill ! This commandment of God tells us what the N.Y. Times does not; that those 'Drawn to Terrorism', as The Times phrases it are in fact drawn to Evil, to Satan who desires a culture of Death. Life is the domain of God, hence everything that leads to death is demonic, like murder, suicide, terrorists, abortion, war, death penalty, euthanasia, etc. So parents of terrorist killers are only one amongst the many whose children satan corrupts with the culture of death.
1
But I bet you support the Death Penalty and Wars.
2
You don't help by proclaiming yourself commanded by God.
2
How tragic. Shame on our justice system. this was a boy that perhaps could have found fulfillment in doing community work and helping the less fortunate here. What a courageous father and for God's sake, couldn't our system here found a solution? This country tosses 20 years around like it's nothing. Massey killed 29 people and got a year. I don't trust our government any more either Mr. Shafi.
5
The 'boy' is 22 years old. Sorry, but he is totally responsible. The comment about not wanting allah to take his soul until he had at least a couple gallons of blood he spilled for him is not just unnerving, but a clear signal that something is going on. Then the attempted flights to Turkey, etc. What would we have all thought if the Govt did not intervene and he ended up killing Americans going about their daily lives, or joined isis? I think the government was actually restrained and took it's time intervening. The father and mother should be glad their son is not a murderer, which sounds like the path he was going down. And the comment about telling other not to even think about going to the government indicates that Dad takes absolutely no responsibility for raising an unstable man who craves violence. With this level of shallowness in so-called leaders, the Muslim community doesn't have a prayer.
3
Thank you Mr. Shafi for protecting innocents from your son's dangerous intentions. As painful as his incarceration must be to you, think how you would feel if you had kept quiet and he had carried out his murderous intentions. Please do not discourage other parents from contacting the authorities. It would be much better for the Muslim community to become much more vocal in promoting peace and tolerance. Turn the other cheek need not only be a Christian concept. It is the only way to achieve the moral standing that will bring peace and justice to the world.
5
Government persecutors cannot be trusted to act honorably. They deceived the Unibomber's brother who identified him to the FBI, to whom they promised they would not seek the death penalty but did anyway.
I don't think any family member has a higher duty to the community than they do to their own family members. The only situation where anyone should assist the government against one's family member is when the family member has harmed another family member.
I don't think any family member has a higher duty to the community than they do to their own family members. The only situation where anyone should assist the government against one's family member is when the family member has harmed another family member.
3
Mr. Shafi can't be blamed for feeling that the government let him down but what was the government to do? From all accounts it appears as if his son was incorrigibly indoctrinated in the violent ways of radical Islam. The truth is he lost his son long before he was arrested.
8
I think you are right that he lost his son long before the arrest. But the behaviors that the law requires to subject a person to conviction are now so minimal, yet the punishments so severe. The laws are intentionally written over-broad and vague. The Supreme Court looks the other way instead of striking them down as unconstitutionally vague. And as broad and vague as the laws are, the government persecutors interpret them even more broadly.
Not only the government, but the citizenry seem to desire to punish people before that have even done anything really harmful. I understand the desire to be proactive to prevent serious harm, but it is unjust nevertheless and prone to abuse, misuse, and mistake.
Not only the government, but the citizenry seem to desire to punish people before that have even done anything really harmful. I understand the desire to be proactive to prevent serious harm, but it is unjust nevertheless and prone to abuse, misuse, and mistake.
3
I was so saddened and engrossed in the article that i must have missed it - What law did he break that he's facing 20 years in prison? Did he actually DO something criminal?
3
"But days later, the F.B.I. went to the Shafi home with a warrant for attempting to support a terrorist organization — a charge that carried up to 20 years in prison."
3
I can sympathize this the father; this is the most awful kind of dilemma to be in. No matter what you do, there will be pain.
HOWEVER, it is worth reflecting here that the Unibomber Ted Kaczynski was turned in by his own brother -- Bernie Madoff was turned in by his two adult sons, who were in business WITH him.
There is nothing new here. Decent human behavior and morality demands that if our loved one is doing something truly evil, we MUST turn them -- for their own good.
Better a son serving 20 years in prison, than one blown to smithereens in the act of murdering dozens of innocents -- who can only be identified by smears of DNA.
HOWEVER, it is worth reflecting here that the Unibomber Ted Kaczynski was turned in by his own brother -- Bernie Madoff was turned in by his two adult sons, who were in business WITH him.
There is nothing new here. Decent human behavior and morality demands that if our loved one is doing something truly evil, we MUST turn them -- for their own good.
Better a son serving 20 years in prison, than one blown to smithereens in the act of murdering dozens of innocents -- who can only be identified by smears of DNA.
7
I deeply sympathize with those parents who are disappointed in their children's choice of the road of crime, be it petty theft, hooliganism, robbery or terrorism.
Given the variety of environmental influences, to which a child or a teenager is exposed, there might have been little the parents could have done to forestall the entry on the path of crime. And I doubt that the psychologists pointing the finger at "dysfunctional families" are always right in their analysis of the roots of children's sociopathic behavior.
Given the variety of environmental influences, to which a child or a teenager is exposed, there might have been little the parents could have done to forestall the entry on the path of crime. And I doubt that the psychologists pointing the finger at "dysfunctional families" are always right in their analysis of the roots of children's sociopathic behavior.
A parent needs to weigh the possibility of incarceration with long sentences against the other real possibility that the child may end up dead, no matter the reason, if authorities don't intervene.
It is not easy, no matter what you would decide.
It is not easy, no matter what you would decide.
4
The FBI has not deailt with these cases responsibly, choosing publicity over public policy. Compare the treatment of these cases with, say, unhinged or immature people who make death threats agains the President. The FBI would set them up with fake weapons, etc. to maximize the PR value, and, of course, lock 'em up forever. All this does is make the community reluctant to cooperate.
4
I agree, purposeful entrapment is not the way to go, but it generates bureaucratic results and that brings promotions. Classic conflict of interest and much cheaper than doing the real work.
But this is not unique to the FBI. Every bureaucracy does that, it generates job security, easy and predictable accountability, nothing can really go wrong and as long as liberals support an ever mushrooming bureaucracy that is subjugating us all and choking freedom to death it will continue.
But this is not unique to the FBI. Every bureaucracy does that, it generates job security, easy and predictable accountability, nothing can really go wrong and as long as liberals support an ever mushrooming bureaucracy that is subjugating us all and choking freedom to death it will continue.
1
We have many crises: young Muslims becoming radicalized; rapidly spreading jihad, previously unaffected middle class youths using drugs and alcohol to oblivion and death; working class whites (and many others) filling with hate and turning away from logic and facts. Advanced societies spending billions on cosmetics, elite electronics, all sorts of luxury items etc. while others languish for a place of refuge. And we wonder what is going wrong. My sense is that Rehab, special programs etc will only touch the surface of the problems.
A good job, good education, nice neighborhood does not answer the longing of the soul. And until we collectively recognize this nothing will change.
I recently read a touching comment re the environment by acoustic ecologist, Gordon Hempton:“We don’t have an environmental crisis at all,” he said. “What we have is a spiritual crisis. And our environment is tanking because of the way we’re living and our relationship to the world that supports us.
I would say this applies to all our other crises as well. "What we have is a spiritual crisis". And our society is tanking because of the way we are living and treating each other. Sanders is partially right. We need a revolution...of the soul. Then everything else will follow.
A good job, good education, nice neighborhood does not answer the longing of the soul. And until we collectively recognize this nothing will change.
I recently read a touching comment re the environment by acoustic ecologist, Gordon Hempton:“We don’t have an environmental crisis at all,” he said. “What we have is a spiritual crisis. And our environment is tanking because of the way we’re living and our relationship to the world that supports us.
I would say this applies to all our other crises as well. "What we have is a spiritual crisis". And our society is tanking because of the way we are living and treating each other. Sanders is partially right. We need a revolution...of the soul. Then everything else will follow.
3
The government expects parents and the community to turn in people who are talking, so they can be put away for 20 years. I cannot think of another crime treated like this. People can threaten specific women with rape and assault on the net with impunity. Maybe they'll get a restraining order.
Yes, Adam went to Turkey and was at risk for radicalization. There should be a program for this, with serious consequences if actions are taken. All this does is discourage anyone from reporting a relative, neighbor or coworker. We should have a program for those at risk, who have not committed any crime.
I've had 2 friends with relatives killed by drunk drivers,both with previous DUI's and/ on meth as well. In both cases, the driver got 3.5 years, in one case for killing 2 people, the other killing one, and severely injuring a small child.
Yet,radical talk gets you 20 years, with a closed case. Even Japanese Americans only got 5 years incarceration for actually doing nothing.
Yes, Adam went to Turkey and was at risk for radicalization. There should be a program for this, with serious consequences if actions are taken. All this does is discourage anyone from reporting a relative, neighbor or coworker. We should have a program for those at risk, who have not committed any crime.
I've had 2 friends with relatives killed by drunk drivers,both with previous DUI's and/ on meth as well. In both cases, the driver got 3.5 years, in one case for killing 2 people, the other killing one, and severely injuring a small child.
Yet,radical talk gets you 20 years, with a closed case. Even Japanese Americans only got 5 years incarceration for actually doing nothing.
9
Because as awful as a drunk driving accident is....it doesn't knock down 2 skyscrapers and murder 3000 people at once. Terrorism can and does.
8
Can we please stop confusing the maximum penalty with the actual penalty? No one knows if this guy will even be convicted, much less what his sentence will be. 20 is the maximum, not the required sentence. And, if you believe the DUI drivers were sentenced too lightly, why should that effect any other case?
The creed of jihadists, which is the creed of Sal Shafi's son, is: Kill anyone who disagrees with Islam.
What to do about jihadists? What to do with the children who blindly obey the arbitrarily interpreted edicts of a 7th-century tribal witch doctor who heard voices in his head?
The US does not act in a rational manner - so the children of Silicon Valley execs choose to believe in a religious irrationality instead of the irrationality of Washington DC. Why choose the irrational dictates of Washington politicians when you can choose the irrational dictates of a 7th century tribal witch doctor who was hearing the word of "god"?
In WW2, the US fought the ideology of Shinto and the ideology of National Socialism - and we destroyed the nations that embraced those ideologies.
The US has an opportunity to do the same right here, right now: Destroy the nations that embrace the ideology of violent Islam, Iran and Saudi Arabia.
If you want to understand the details, see: https://www.theobjectivestandard.com/2015/11/ten-steps-to-end-jihad-agai...
What to do about jihadists? What to do with the children who blindly obey the arbitrarily interpreted edicts of a 7th-century tribal witch doctor who heard voices in his head?
The US does not act in a rational manner - so the children of Silicon Valley execs choose to believe in a religious irrationality instead of the irrationality of Washington DC. Why choose the irrational dictates of Washington politicians when you can choose the irrational dictates of a 7th century tribal witch doctor who was hearing the word of "god"?
In WW2, the US fought the ideology of Shinto and the ideology of National Socialism - and we destroyed the nations that embraced those ideologies.
The US has an opportunity to do the same right here, right now: Destroy the nations that embrace the ideology of violent Islam, Iran and Saudi Arabia.
If you want to understand the details, see: https://www.theobjectivestandard.com/2015/11/ten-steps-to-end-jihad-agai...
3
As much as I sympathize with your frustration, your approach is not going to work.
Moreover, passing Muhammad off as a schizophrenic tribal witch doctor is too easy. I don't think he was either. To me he looks more like a highly intelligent snake oil salesmen who studied and astutely recognized how he could manipulate the people of his time by spinning a fascinating yarn nobody could disprove. What made it more compelling is that he built this yarn on older stories that are central to the older Jewish and Christian religions and adapted them to the cultures he was selling the yarn to. In a way, he did nothing different from what a modern day spin doctor who yearns for power is doing, but with a much more lasting effect.
Think of the Prophet as an ancient Mark Zuckerberg and the Quran as the Facebook of the 7th century: All powerful. with supreme influence granted by the power to manipulate the 'code' (i.e. Facebook algorithm or the Quran) to serve his personal interests (money, power, publicity) and the promise of (virtual) immortality. And now - in the present - with the power to bring Armageddon to the planet - which he had also foreseen - courtesy of an army of delusioned and lost souls.
And with modern ways of communications to spread the cancer more rapidly and more effectively than ever before....
Moreover, passing Muhammad off as a schizophrenic tribal witch doctor is too easy. I don't think he was either. To me he looks more like a highly intelligent snake oil salesmen who studied and astutely recognized how he could manipulate the people of his time by spinning a fascinating yarn nobody could disprove. What made it more compelling is that he built this yarn on older stories that are central to the older Jewish and Christian religions and adapted them to the cultures he was selling the yarn to. In a way, he did nothing different from what a modern day spin doctor who yearns for power is doing, but with a much more lasting effect.
Think of the Prophet as an ancient Mark Zuckerberg and the Quran as the Facebook of the 7th century: All powerful. with supreme influence granted by the power to manipulate the 'code' (i.e. Facebook algorithm or the Quran) to serve his personal interests (money, power, publicity) and the promise of (virtual) immortality. And now - in the present - with the power to bring Armageddon to the planet - which he had also foreseen - courtesy of an army of delusioned and lost souls.
And with modern ways of communications to spread the cancer more rapidly and more effectively than ever before....
2
Tribal witch doctor. Highly intelligent snake oil salesman. Name calling the prophet of a religion followed by one and half billion people, that is a little more than one out of every seven people on the planet and growing. Nice strategy.
November-Idiot,
Even in the old West, gullible people followed the snake oil salesmen until someone exposed their ploy. Once the people realized they had been duped, they would tar and feather the fraudsters and drive them out of town.
But someone had to expose them first.
It is high time that happens again today.
There are way too many people selling snake oil and - worse, as you point out - far too many buyers on this planet.
By the way: There are a whole lot of Americans of all walks of life who follow Trump, Cruz, Bernie or Hillary. Many are routinely called all sorts of names here, not only by commenters, but also by the staff writers of the NYT.
Nice strategy?
Even in the old West, gullible people followed the snake oil salesmen until someone exposed their ploy. Once the people realized they had been duped, they would tar and feather the fraudsters and drive them out of town.
But someone had to expose them first.
It is high time that happens again today.
There are way too many people selling snake oil and - worse, as you point out - far too many buyers on this planet.
By the way: There are a whole lot of Americans of all walks of life who follow Trump, Cruz, Bernie or Hillary. Many are routinely called all sorts of names here, not only by commenters, but also by the staff writers of the NYT.
Nice strategy?
One of Mr. Shafi's mistakes was conflating the American spirit and people with the American government. His lawyer was right, essentially the government cannot be trusted to do what is right for the individual citizen. They will always choose the easy way out which is incarceration and push the can down the road. We need a wholesale change in our government such that the American spirit is once again represented by the government as it was in the era between and just after the great wars. Instead we have a government that embarks on preventative wars that turn out to be endless wars that kill tens of thousands innocent civilians and damage countless cultures while bankrupting our middle class. Beware of foreign entanglements. Vote in November.
5
The lawyer gave the father the Miranda warning: 'You have the right to remain silent, whatever you say can AND WILL be held against you'
Precisely what happened.
Precisely what happened.
1
Law and order, and the threat of jail time, will fail every time as a remedy for a mentally ill person. ISIS is a cult preying on the susceptible, and until organizations like the FBI fully comes to grips with that fact, and take action based on that approach, they will not have much luck with "preventing terrorism".
3
This reminds me of the decision that Ted Kosinski's brother had to make to aid the authorities in capturing him. Of course it is a moral dilemma pitting the family connection against the harm that person might do to many others, however, it should not be that difficult. Each of us has a responsibility to the society at large as well as to those we love, indeed, stopping a loved one from doing harm (or further harm) is the right thing to do for them as well.
Parents of young people who suddenly become devout or who spout extreme radical views calling for violence have an obligation not only to get them appropriate help but also to stop them from acting on these views. This is not just an issue for the Muslim community as we have seen young men and women from other backgrounds in the thrall of terrorists. They come from all over the world.
Glossing over this and hoping for the best does no good. Nor does advising parents not to inform the proper authorities about nascent terrorists who are their children. Would it be better to be the parents of those who carried out the terror like that in Paris or Brussels, knowing you could have stopped it?
Parents of young people who suddenly become devout or who spout extreme radical views calling for violence have an obligation not only to get them appropriate help but also to stop them from acting on these views. This is not just an issue for the Muslim community as we have seen young men and women from other backgrounds in the thrall of terrorists. They come from all over the world.
Glossing over this and hoping for the best does no good. Nor does advising parents not to inform the proper authorities about nascent terrorists who are their children. Would it be better to be the parents of those who carried out the terror like that in Paris or Brussels, knowing you could have stopped it?
3
I feel for the father; he wants to believe his son could have been saved by mental health treatment. I'm a mental health professional and I am somewhat dubious. But what parent wants to believe their child is a cold blooded killer? Perhaps one day Sal Shafi will realize he did the right thing.
8
Muslims studying up or supporting any form of radical Islam should be tracked and arrested as soon as possible.
Its in the interests of Muslims too!
No one can really say they feel safe anywhere near your typical muslim community anymore. Not even the people living there.
Just ask a Parisian.
Its in the interests of Muslims too!
No one can really say they feel safe anywhere near your typical muslim community anymore. Not even the people living there.
Just ask a Parisian.
12
It appears without substantive and actionable intelligence, law enforcement will be unable to effectively use their resources. If the outcome of sharing concerns with law enforcement is long prison sentences or worse for misinformed/disenchanted/possibly immature youth, we are not going get the intelligence we need from the people who are most able to assist us. It is time for law enforcement to empower and enable new processes that encourage working with them. Without such a win-win process, families will continue keep their concerns to themselves waiting for some true validation of their concerns - by which time it may be too late. To suggest that this is the problem of the Muslim community is akin to saying that the problem of organized crime by the Mafia was the problem of the Italian community. In the latter case, several new law enforcement processes were deployed including the witness protection programs. Actual murders were committed and the murderers were let off scot free into the witness protection programs so as fry bigger fish. The point is law enforcement needs to think differently and come up with a process that while not perfect, does more to enable good information to them. This case was perhaps a missed opportunity to show how the actions of a responsible parent can be a win-win, thereby incentivizing other parents in a similar situation to do the same.
4
Here is an opportunity for a community to be self policing and yet our government squanders it by going all sticks. Hope u succeed 100% of the time. Precisely, the images these adolescents see, via instant Internet, give them a reason to die for a cause. Doesn't our government know by now the effectiveness of suicide bombers? They will always have more of them than drones we can build.
1
Mr. Shafi, if you happen to be reading the comments - good for you. You did the right thing. Your son's life isn't ruined - but it would have been if he'd made it to Turkey, gone to Syria, and joined a terrorist organization. There's no going back from that. Your son is sick and he needs help but he wanted to kill people. He now will not have the opportunity to do that, because of you. You didn't ruin your son's live - you saved others. Don't give up on the de-radicalization programs, we need them. Our country and our world need forces against radicalization, we need people pushing for empathy and tolerance. You can still be an important voice, please don't give up.
47
Good family, engaged parents, decent schools, safe community, the necessities of life no problem at all. Why would a smart young person want to attach himself to the community of jihad instead?
I know as little of the actual circumstances of this family as any reader. But I do know that children need more from a family than simply a roof and a table, affection and even love. They need to know from an early age that they are important, that the family depends on them. Far apart from unconditional approval, this prompts them to take themselves and their decisions seriously. The source of self-esteem, and connection that can spread from their family to their society, to mankind.
This is hard-wired into us from a past when each person was indeed crucial for our joint survival. In giving our children everything except a sense that they can be important to us, we give them a desperate craving to be a valuable part of something larger. Perhaps that doesn't apply here. But it does apply to countless young people. In its absence, they pick up other values which, in our world, tend to be those of celebrity, indulgence, and the easy answer. Jihadis know this, and know how they starve the spirit.
I know as little of the actual circumstances of this family as any reader. But I do know that children need more from a family than simply a roof and a table, affection and even love. They need to know from an early age that they are important, that the family depends on them. Far apart from unconditional approval, this prompts them to take themselves and their decisions seriously. The source of self-esteem, and connection that can spread from their family to their society, to mankind.
This is hard-wired into us from a past when each person was indeed crucial for our joint survival. In giving our children everything except a sense that they can be important to us, we give them a desperate craving to be a valuable part of something larger. Perhaps that doesn't apply here. But it does apply to countless young people. In its absence, they pick up other values which, in our world, tend to be those of celebrity, indulgence, and the easy answer. Jihadis know this, and know how they starve the spirit.
4
With US importing tens (hundreds?) of thousands of islamic worshippers every year through refugee resettlement, family unifications, bride visas, etc, it is worth recognizing that a certain percentage represent a ticking bomb, be it current generation of "imports" (Boston bombers, San Bernardino shooters) or 2nd-generation immigrants, like Adam Shafi. Cost-benefit analysis, anyone?
9
No one is allowed to ask how this benefits their country and anyone who dares ask that question will be called a 'racist' and a 'xenophobe'.
9
I feel bad for the father in this story - he was trying to get help for his son and prevent terrorism.
I have worked in community mental health for 20 years and it is fairly common to see mentally ill people embrace extremist ideologies.
Any ideology that is rooted in paranoia, good vs. evil and offers members the ability to pursue grandiose goals (e.g. victory for Islam via suicide bombing) can be very attractive to clients with mental health problems. Especially those with personality disorders and psychotic disorders. Often, those kind of mental health issues first become clear when a person is in their late teens and early 20's. We should be offering help to family members, as they are often the first people to be aware of symptoms.
I can't even begin to articulate how many times I have had family members call our clinic in despair and begging for help for their adult child with mental illness. Often, these adult children are threatening others and refusing to pursue voluntary mental health treatment. We can't do much to help these parents unless the adult child meets 5150 criteria - danger to self/others or gravely disabled. Instead, I have to try and encourage the family to go to NAMI support groups, set limits with their kid, evict him/her, etc. It is painful and I believe that family members and mental health professionals need more legal ability to get help for an adult child who lacks awareness of their own illness.
I have worked in community mental health for 20 years and it is fairly common to see mentally ill people embrace extremist ideologies.
Any ideology that is rooted in paranoia, good vs. evil and offers members the ability to pursue grandiose goals (e.g. victory for Islam via suicide bombing) can be very attractive to clients with mental health problems. Especially those with personality disorders and psychotic disorders. Often, those kind of mental health issues first become clear when a person is in their late teens and early 20's. We should be offering help to family members, as they are often the first people to be aware of symptoms.
I can't even begin to articulate how many times I have had family members call our clinic in despair and begging for help for their adult child with mental illness. Often, these adult children are threatening others and refusing to pursue voluntary mental health treatment. We can't do much to help these parents unless the adult child meets 5150 criteria - danger to self/others or gravely disabled. Instead, I have to try and encourage the family to go to NAMI support groups, set limits with their kid, evict him/her, etc. It is painful and I believe that family members and mental health professionals need more legal ability to get help for an adult child who lacks awareness of their own illness.
9
"Don't even think about going to the government" if you are ready to live with the thought that your child might murder dozens of innocent people.
Imprisonment might not be so hard to deal with compared to the slaughter of innocents.
Imprisonment might not be so hard to deal with compared to the slaughter of innocents.
13
I feel deeply for the parents of Adam. I have a 20 year old son myself. If everything in the article reported is true and accurate, it sounded like there were only a handful of possible outcomes if the dad had not gone to the police:
1) Adam is killed fighting abroad, after possibly killing others including innocent victims
2) Adam commits an act of terror in the US and is killed
3) Adam commits an act of terror in the US and is on the run
Right now Mr Shafi, your son is alive. There is probably some means by which he can get a reduced sentence at some point. You may get your son back some day. But do you really think you made the wrong decision to turn him in? I hope you will continue your work on helping to de-program radicalized youth here in the US, and to help families intervene before it gets too late.
1) Adam is killed fighting abroad, after possibly killing others including innocent victims
2) Adam commits an act of terror in the US and is killed
3) Adam commits an act of terror in the US and is on the run
Right now Mr Shafi, your son is alive. There is probably some means by which he can get a reduced sentence at some point. You may get your son back some day. But do you really think you made the wrong decision to turn him in? I hope you will continue your work on helping to de-program radicalized youth here in the US, and to help families intervene before it gets too late.
12
Actually, there is a 4th possibility 4) Adam goes to Turkey, works in a hospital helping refugees, finally figures out that the Salafists are self-righteous nutjobs, and returns home to his family to grow up a good citizen. That's what happens to many people who have wild adolescences.
3
Except, Teed, that he was fantasizing about spilling a gallon of American blood... then again, there was the poor French guy who wanted nothing else but go on a wild party vacation in California and who had the misfortune to tweet before his plane left France that he was going to 'destroy America'. He was promptly deported back to France upon his arrival.... Lucky s.o.b., he might as well be serving 20 these days.
There are many innocuous phrases like that in the English language that are open to extreme interpretations of impending violence: 'dropping a bomb at a meeting', 'shooting the messenger', 'being prepared to kill for whatever one finds desirable at the moment', 'ripping your opponent apart' and many others.
We all have used these phrases before. We are all one foot away from Supermax.
There are many innocuous phrases like that in the English language that are open to extreme interpretations of impending violence: 'dropping a bomb at a meeting', 'shooting the messenger', 'being prepared to kill for whatever one finds desirable at the moment', 'ripping your opponent apart' and many others.
We all have used these phrases before. We are all one foot away from Supermax.
Teed: the dad turned him in because he knew that your fantasy choice #4 was not going to happen for his son.
2
Tough call, gotta feel for the dad. He did the right thing, but wow that's brutal. Courageous dad.
14
Yes, "Don't even think about going to the government." Your son is soooo much more important than all the people he might kill.
9
The important word here is "might". If the penalty for drunken driving was 20 years in prison, would you unhesitantly turn in your son for that charge? If not, would you be thinking "My son is soooo much more important than all the people he might kill."? If you answer this unconflictedly, you probably don't have a son, or anyone else in your life who really matters to you.
2
How many other young men and women like Adam Shafi are biding their time here in the USA waiting for a call to do harm.
10
A tragedy that everybody can feel. Sadly though, the best efforts of parents are not always guarantying a good outcome. Mr. Shafi performed the most noble and painful act in the name of both Islam and a free society.
9
Unfortunately the Islamic theological texts contain many literal and explicit statements inciting violence and hatred towards other human beings. When a person is seduced by and adopts Islam as their religion they are necessarily presented with these doctrines and must choose to disobey the teachings of the Prophet in order to live peacefully. These same Islamic texts are used as a political manifesto by the Islamic State with disastrous and barbaric consequences.
It is illegal in many free western societies to publish 'hate speech' and yet we seem to give Islam a free pass to do just that. It is time for decent Muslims to take control of their religion and rewrite their holy text books to be consistent with the Universal Declaration of Human Rights and remove the calls to jihad.
Christianity managed to create the New Testament to tone down the fundamentalism of the Old Testament but still discriminates against the human rights of gay, lesbian, bisexual and transgender people and denies them their rights to marriage. The Pope recently published a long-winded Apostolic Exhortation called the Amoris Laetitia that danced around these issues but did not provide any breakthrough recognition of Universal Human Rights.
It is the world's greatest moral tragedy that religion so actively conspires against all human beings experiencing 'Amoris Laetitia', the joy of love, in their lives on this planet in peace.
It is illegal in many free western societies to publish 'hate speech' and yet we seem to give Islam a free pass to do just that. It is time for decent Muslims to take control of their religion and rewrite their holy text books to be consistent with the Universal Declaration of Human Rights and remove the calls to jihad.
Christianity managed to create the New Testament to tone down the fundamentalism of the Old Testament but still discriminates against the human rights of gay, lesbian, bisexual and transgender people and denies them their rights to marriage. The Pope recently published a long-winded Apostolic Exhortation called the Amoris Laetitia that danced around these issues but did not provide any breakthrough recognition of Universal Human Rights.
It is the world's greatest moral tragedy that religion so actively conspires against all human beings experiencing 'Amoris Laetitia', the joy of love, in their lives on this planet in peace.
5
Islam is just as explicit as Judaism about taking the name of God in vain. The practice of claiming to know what God thinks is called "shirk", and the practice of trying to change what it thinks, or encourage others to do things to change what it thinks, is called "idolatry", and both are called "sins".
1
The Koran and Hadiths, like all texts, are subject to multiple interpretations, and most Muslims don't interpret them that way. See link below for other interpretations.
http://muslimbuddhist.blogspot.com/search/label/Muslimoutrage
http://muslimbuddhist.blogspot.com/search/label/Muslimoutrage
Never heard of any Jews who rioted and murdered due to someone taking the name of their god in vain. Getting tired of statements like "All religions have fanatical members" Is it possible that some religions or cultures are the result of a mistake multiplied over the centuries? I can think of one...
1
While huge resources are devoted to the risks of terrorism, the chances of being harmed are less than that of being hit by lightning. If only these resources were better spent on actively helping people throughout the world. If only the US government were not funding the very terrorists in Syria it purports to fight. If only Bush/Cheney and then Obama/Clinton hadn't put our nation in such debt, both morally and financially by promoting endless war and regime change in the middle East. Perhaps then we wouldn't have impressionable young people looking for foolish ways to take a stand. I wish they would just go help plant trees, but they suffer from the angst of war. Our founding fathers are rolling in their graves.
2
Ted Kaczynski's brother alerted the FBI about him, leading to his arrest. A tough choice, but lives were saved.
13
His family gave him so much, and he spat on it and his family, and gave it all away. I feel terribly for his father, but it is the son who should be apologizing to him, not the government. 22 is still just a child for a lot of folks, I know I made a lot of mistakes and only really matured into a useful adult around 24, although my mistakes were a good deal less terroristy. The issue of guilt for intention vs. actually committing a crime is a whole other issue that I don't really have a settled view on.
5
19? 20? 22? Exactly what age constitutes "children"? These are men making these decisions. Perhaps the "crime" here needs a clearer definition, but the fact that it's adults who are joining the terrorists does not.
7
This dilemna reminds me of that of parents of a (legally) adult child with mental illness who is showing violent and suicidal tendencies (often at the same time, as are these radicalized young adults) and endangering themselves or others. Shall such parents call the police, and risk the death of their beloved child when the cops shoot to kill if charged by the ill person? If jailed for assault while mentally ill the subject is unlikely to receive psychiatric treatment. The important work of the Treatment Advocacy Center to get laws passed in most states allowing parents to seek court orders for assisted/mandatory treatment if harm is likely to occur (not after) might be a template for these radicalization cases. Extreme religosity is a common symptom of psychosis and it could be argued that such people have been "triggered" into a psychotic break and need/deserve treatment until such time as they have recovered sanity. To lock them away in solitary for 20 years seems unwise.
5
I'm left uncertain by this article as to the ground's for Adam's charges and conviction. Can mere language - of distress or even anger - be held to legal account without plans to act on a specific threat? Did he actually materially abet a terrorist organization? I couldn't find that in the text and I hope the government met a sterner burden of proof.
I'd certainly believe that others have been arrested for both these and less compelling reasons, but I can't escape the feeling our liberty of thought and speech is being constricted by the fear of terrorism. I agree that a third way is needed beyond inaction or damnation - we can start by refocusing the productive aspects of the empathy Adam felt for a conflict with no moral victors.
I'd certainly believe that others have been arrested for both these and less compelling reasons, but I can't escape the feeling our liberty of thought and speech is being constricted by the fear of terrorism. I agree that a third way is needed beyond inaction or damnation - we can start by refocusing the productive aspects of the empathy Adam felt for a conflict with no moral victors.
5
A criminal threat involves one person threatening someone else with physical harm. The threat must be communicated in some way, though it doesn't necessarily have to be verbal. A person can make a threat through email, text message, or even through non-verbal body language such as gestures or movements. However, some states require written or verbal threats, and in those states gestures are not enough.
Fear and Intent
Criminal threats are made with the intention to place someone in fear of injury or death. However, it isn't necessary for a victim to actually experience fear or terror. Rather, it's the intention of the person making the threat that matters. The intent of a person who makes threats is usually determined by the circumstances surrounding the case.
Specificity and Reasonableness
You cannot commit a criminal threat if the threat is vague or unreasonable. The threat must be capable of making the people who hear it feel as if they might be hurt, and conclude that the threat is credible, real, and imminent. If, for example, you threaten to blow up the world unless your bartender doesn't bring your drink to you immediately, no reasonable person hearing it would believe the threat was real. On the other hand, if you walk into a store with a gun and threaten to shoot the clerk unless she gives you a refund, such a threat is credible and specific.
Fear and Intent
Criminal threats are made with the intention to place someone in fear of injury or death. However, it isn't necessary for a victim to actually experience fear or terror. Rather, it's the intention of the person making the threat that matters. The intent of a person who makes threats is usually determined by the circumstances surrounding the case.
Specificity and Reasonableness
You cannot commit a criminal threat if the threat is vague or unreasonable. The threat must be capable of making the people who hear it feel as if they might be hurt, and conclude that the threat is credible, real, and imminent. If, for example, you threaten to blow up the world unless your bartender doesn't bring your drink to you immediately, no reasonable person hearing it would believe the threat was real. On the other hand, if you walk into a store with a gun and threaten to shoot the clerk unless she gives you a refund, such a threat is credible and specific.
2
More worrisome is that our Constitution has been suspended by ISIS and those who do its bidding in DC. GW started it, but now Obama is their biggest champion.
Professor of Constitutional Law!
What else?
Professor of Constitutional Law!
What else?
As an Asian I find this case intriguing. Set aside judicial matters, there's conflict between family and society. I honestly do not have an answer. It's tough.
5
I don't think that would-be terrorists should be granted leniency as a reward for having parents who made the difficult and noble decision to turn their children in. But I also don't think that ordinary people, however misguided or repugnant their political and social beliefs may be, should be charged and arrested for those beliefs.
Concrete crimes are a different story.
Concrete crimes are a different story.
4
What I read out of most of the comments here is hand-wringing about how we can prevent radicalization.
JFK had the answer for it: "Do not ask what your country can do for you, ask what you can do for your country."
We need a mandatory national service, in the armed forces or in the national guard, the peace corps, or any other function that serves the public where the adolescent realizes the empowerment that comes from constructively serving community.
Once you have skin in the game and see that your actions can be used to do good to others, radicalization no longer can get a grip on you.
JFK had the answer for it: "Do not ask what your country can do for you, ask what you can do for your country."
We need a mandatory national service, in the armed forces or in the national guard, the peace corps, or any other function that serves the public where the adolescent realizes the empowerment that comes from constructively serving community.
Once you have skin in the game and see that your actions can be used to do good to others, radicalization no longer can get a grip on you.
3
JFK had the answer for it: "Do not ask what your country can do for you, ask what you can do for your country."
I always thought it rather ironic that shortly after making that statement, JFK raised the Federal welfare payments as an example of what your country can do for you.
I always thought it rather ironic that shortly after making that statement, JFK raised the Federal welfare payments as an example of what your country can do for you.
1
This kind of fiscal stimulus is evidently anathema to Republicans.
1
Mandatory armed forces, to do the evil bidding of politicians and multinational corporations? No thanks. I would sooner send my child out of the country.
Some other form of community service, fine.
Some other form of community service, fine.
The article is written from the perspective his treatment is unfair, but we don't know that is the case. Adam said he wants to spill gallons of blood, attack US troops and he was caught at the airport about to go get trained. The father saying, God I just destroyed Adam, is tragic in how he is looking at the situation. He may have saved his sons as well as countless other lives. Where were his discussions about what it means to be American? Where were the discussions about why he didn't believe in the stricter interpretations of Islam? The FBI did their job, the father of a radicalized psychotic son did his duty too. Thank you Sal for putting country and life ahead of letting your child become a killer.
11
Let the son be brought to trial ASAP. Without further information, it's impossible to make a full proof judgement but anyone talking about spilling gallons of blood and stopped while trying to flee to Turkey for a second time is, at the least, highly suspect. The risk of this troubled mind turning to mass murder appears very high. Therefore, until proven otherwise, the FBI acted appropriately.
The father also made the correct decision. That he now regrets it is neither here nor there. He may well have saved many innocent lives.
The father also made the correct decision. That he now regrets it is neither here nor there. He may well have saved many innocent lives.
5
To me, the key indicator in Adam Shafi's transformation was his growing compassion for muslim victims of war in Syria and elsewhere. As an adolescent, he was caught up in the same dilemma that perhaps a majority of American adolescents find themselves: Recognizing and empathizing with the plight of the downtrodden while being emotionally unaccepting of the adult world's willingness to accept this plight as a fact of life. It is important to note that, at least initially, young Mr. Shafi was more interested in helping innocent victims than in doing violence against those whom he thought were their oppressors. This idea that, once a young person is seduced into jihadist thinking, they cannot be turned back through an intervention - is preposterous. Of course, it wouldn't hurt any deprogramming efforts if our country would in fact stop doing the egregious things our young people see as unacceptably two-faced.
In any event, to incarcerate young people in the absence of having committed actual terrorist acts is tantamount to political imprisonment; and there is no better place for impressionable and passionate young minds to come under the influence of proven terrorist elements than in prison. The stories emanating from the Paris attacks show precisely this kind of in-prison indoctrination and the resulting creation of new terrorist elements.
In any event, to incarcerate young people in the absence of having committed actual terrorist acts is tantamount to political imprisonment; and there is no better place for impressionable and passionate young minds to come under the influence of proven terrorist elements than in prison. The stories emanating from the Paris attacks show precisely this kind of in-prison indoctrination and the resulting creation of new terrorist elements.
7
Mr. Shafi did not destroy his son, Adam. The US government did not destroy Adam Shafi. At over 20 years Adam is an adult and he chose this tragically destructive path. More of the blame for this tragedy should be put at the door of those who are preaching and encouraging and in too many instances aiding young people to become involved with violence. It must also be clearly pointed out that the insane violence of the jihadists has probably driven many people to renounce their Muslim identity completely.
8
The key issue is why are Muslim youth so easily radicalized in the west. The article never attempted to understand why this young American was willing to kill American soldiers when this is a fight between Muslims killing Muslims. If America intervenes we get blamed, if we do not we still get blamed for not helping. I prefer President Obama's approach of acting only when it is a threat to the homeland. Muslim parents must try to integrate kids into the American life style. Hang out with neighbors, watch local TV etc. Some immigrants tend to socialize only within their community and try to create a lifestyle close to their country of origin.
4
This is a very complex case. Not one of the more familiar FBI manipulates suspect to do or say something stupid- then issue an arrest. I would consider this a domestic version of GITMO.
The most important lesson was not learned and probably will not be learned by the FBI, father or writer of this story. What radicalized Adam? What stirred hatred inside him. What shifted his moral compass. Until that is well understood, there will be more Adam's.
8
Nowhere in the article did it say that Adam had any hatred toward anyone. He was moved by the refugees and wanted to help them and to protect Muslims. From the description, one can see that this young man was not a seasoned terrorist, rather he was filled with sympathy for the refugees. Many comments on here describe Adam as if he were a terrorist, already radicalized. Instead the article describes a young man who does not have much experience at all.
4
"I just hope Allah doesn’t take my soul until I have at least, like, a couple gallons of blood that I’ve spilled for him,” he said in one conversation last June, according to court records. He also mused about killing American soldiers."
I would call that hatred. If planning to kill compatriots is not hatred directed against America, I don't know what is.
I would call that hatred. If planning to kill compatriots is not hatred directed against America, I don't know what is.
5
This is really a badly written piece masquerading as news when it is obviously pushing an agenda. Out of the blue all of sudden one day this fine harmless boy just became "radicalized." The article then continues with the premise that "radicalization" is something that can be cured and is really an illness like zika that anyone can catch. And now of course the evil government instead of curing this condition seeks to imprison this innocent.
Please. I see an adult who decided that he wanted to kill some Americans and even once he knew that it was something that could land him in serious trouble with the law kept at it.
There is so much more to this story that is not being reported. I feel for this father, really I do but this had to be a long time coming and the time to get help if that is what was needed for adam was long ago not in plea bargain negotiations.
Please. I see an adult who decided that he wanted to kill some Americans and even once he knew that it was something that could land him in serious trouble with the law kept at it.
There is so much more to this story that is not being reported. I feel for this father, really I do but this had to be a long time coming and the time to get help if that is what was needed for adam was long ago not in plea bargain negotiations.
7
I feel very sorry for Mr. Shafi's plight. There are no easy answers. I usually think of myself as a person who smirks at the idea that law-abiding Muslims, i.e., the vast majority of Muslims, should feel in any way responsible for others who commit crimes or hold beliefs not usually held in the West in the name of Islam. I still feel that way 99 percent of the time.
But then I read the story the other day of the two teenage Muslim boys who are new immigrants to Switzerland who refused to honor the long-held tradition of shaking hands with the teacher each day - because the teacher was female. They refused to shake hands with a woman. The local school board decided the students would not be required to shake any male or female teacher's hands as a way to avoid controversy.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/worldviews/wp/2016/04/06/switzerland...
But is that the solution or is that a slippery slope? Letting two teenagers demolish an old tradition based on shaky interpretations of a religious text? You could say the same about Orthodox Jews or evangelical Christians. It now seems there is not even a slightest move to assimilate into a culture anymore, even if one is the newest member of that culture. The thinking appears to be: "The culture will adapt to us or we will make you adapt to us - one way or another." It's a recipe for disaster.
But then I read the story the other day of the two teenage Muslim boys who are new immigrants to Switzerland who refused to honor the long-held tradition of shaking hands with the teacher each day - because the teacher was female. They refused to shake hands with a woman. The local school board decided the students would not be required to shake any male or female teacher's hands as a way to avoid controversy.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/worldviews/wp/2016/04/06/switzerland...
But is that the solution or is that a slippery slope? Letting two teenagers demolish an old tradition based on shaky interpretations of a religious text? You could say the same about Orthodox Jews or evangelical Christians. It now seems there is not even a slightest move to assimilate into a culture anymore, even if one is the newest member of that culture. The thinking appears to be: "The culture will adapt to us or we will make you adapt to us - one way or another." It's a recipe for disaster.
13
If Adam Shafi would like to "spill blood" and be recognized as a hero, he will need to wear a police uniform and shoot people with brown skin. It is astounding that someone who almost supported a "terrorist" group will spend 20 years in prison but for a period of months a white male would kill a black male and not spend one day in jail.
The American Sniper film glorifies the hero Chris Kyle killing 255 defending American values. But if we change the person's name and make his skin tanned suddenly he is the terrorist and not the hero. This is not defense of terrorism because not only would that is illegal in the country I'm currently residing in (?!?) but there is never an excuse to take an innocent life. However, I would like to underscore the profound hypocrisy of these terrorism laws, which are both poorly defined and clearly target a specific group of people.
Not only are these harsh laws targeted, but prison as a solution is reprehensible. History has proven the top leaders of ISIS met and became more extreme AFTER serving a prison sentence. Adam Shafi needs the same thing every human being needs. Someone who constantly thinks of death, experiences a liable mood and extreme sadness needs medical help and not punishment.
The American Sniper film glorifies the hero Chris Kyle killing 255 defending American values. But if we change the person's name and make his skin tanned suddenly he is the terrorist and not the hero. This is not defense of terrorism because not only would that is illegal in the country I'm currently residing in (?!?) but there is never an excuse to take an innocent life. However, I would like to underscore the profound hypocrisy of these terrorism laws, which are both poorly defined and clearly target a specific group of people.
Not only are these harsh laws targeted, but prison as a solution is reprehensible. History has proven the top leaders of ISIS met and became more extreme AFTER serving a prison sentence. Adam Shafi needs the same thing every human being needs. Someone who constantly thinks of death, experiences a liable mood and extreme sadness needs medical help and not punishment.
5
The problem for parents is how do they work out the religious conclusions their teenage children adopt. If these religious ideas are moral, they should pose no problems. If they are not moral, the obvious responsibility of the parents Is to discuss them with the teenagers and point out the immorality of following religious beliefs that result in killing innocent people, as well as ways they can constructively follow to correct the injustices that are troubling them. Injustices are multiplied, not solved, when innocent human beings are blown up by suicide bombers. Killing others you do not know is murder not religious morality.
1
Articles like this will discourage people from reporting possible terrorist activity, and may lead to more attacks. Sometimes, it's better not to publish.
3
"Mr. Shafi has never been deeply religious...but his son had embraced religion."
I think the writer meant "embraced islam". This whole problem could have been avoided if the kid had simply not been brought up with islamic values.
Islam is not just a religion; it has social and political components which, when rejected by Western society, can radicalize all students of the koran. It happened with the San Bernadino murderers and is the root cause of all radicalized muslims.
I think the writer meant "embraced islam". This whole problem could have been avoided if the kid had simply not been brought up with islamic values.
Islam is not just a religion; it has social and political components which, when rejected by Western society, can radicalize all students of the koran. It happened with the San Bernadino murderers and is the root cause of all radicalized muslims.
8
The only antidote these jihad related ideas is to teach these young people that in no way does Islam inherently approve killing innocent people. Even in the event of war, it is strictly prohibited to kill women, children and the elderly. These are known to almost every Muslim but somehow some so-called Imams manage to find a way to misinterpret these doctrines. I think for some terrorists Islam is a tool to exploit and to use just like a gun. So they bend the doctrines to their use.
It is also interesting for me to observe that some fundamentalist radicals supposedly take Islamic law as a basis and out of it the penal code. Then like ISIS they end up punishing people for absurd things. All they can do is to punish and kill. However, where is art, literature, ability to live together?
I'd very very much like to let these jihadist young people know that according to the big scholar Muhammed Hamidullah, during the Prophet Muhammed's 20-year reign, the number of enemies killed is 250, and the number of Muslims killed is 150. But now it is so ordinary to kill! War is only a very brief moment during peace. What should be commanding is peace.
It is also interesting for me to observe that some fundamentalist radicals supposedly take Islamic law as a basis and out of it the penal code. Then like ISIS they end up punishing people for absurd things. All they can do is to punish and kill. However, where is art, literature, ability to live together?
I'd very very much like to let these jihadist young people know that according to the big scholar Muhammed Hamidullah, during the Prophet Muhammed's 20-year reign, the number of enemies killed is 250, and the number of Muslims killed is 150. But now it is so ordinary to kill! War is only a very brief moment during peace. What should be commanding is peace.
5
I'm so sorry, Mr. Shafir. Thank you for doing the right thing, because it was indeed the right thing. It would be even worse to be mourning for a son who had killed people in a suicide attack than mourning a son who's in jail. Sometimes even the most caring, responsible families have kids who are fragile and unpredictable; it's not your fault and without your action things could have gone much worse. I hope Adam grows up to channel his empathy for war victims into more constructive paths. There is still a lot of time; he is very young. Wishing you peace.
17
He won't be young when he gets out of prison
1
Would a 20 year old non-muslim 'domestic' terrorist have gotten the same sentence as Adam Shafir?
2
Certainly, or more. Life.
3
He was not sentenced to 20 years. He has been indicted. 20 years is the maximum sentence for this charge. Most likely Adam will get much less, because his actions had not yet harmed anyone directly yet. I believe that John Lindh (aka the American Taliban) was charged of the same crime and was convicted to 20 years.
2
Mr. Shafi - I thank you and your family for making the difficult choice you did. And please think of this not in terms of responsibility for the incarceration of your son, but rather saving your son from a certain death, along with thst of tens or hundreds of other innocent people, at his own hands.
8
This is a painful choice, exquisitely so, but it is not a hard one.
5
Dear Mr. and Mrs. Shafi:
I am sorry that there was such a bad outcome for you seeking to find help for your son. Many motivations that your son articulated were humanitarian. However, there were clear signs that his thinking about the solutions to these problems were distorted and grandious (two clear indicators of a mood disorder). Thank you for picking up on them.
The way his distorted thinking, and risk taking behavior was handled by authorities points up a big problem about how our country handles mood disorders. The problems our authorities have in handling distorted thinking also extend to some other crimes, which are the end result of distorted thinking.
Look at what happened in Columbine CO and Newtown CT. I think you feel that you had a tough choice but that you were trying to prevent just such an occurance.
I fully support your efforts to enlighten authorities about intervention, and thank you most sincerely for your efforts to be good parents and good citizens.
I am sorry that there was such a bad outcome for you seeking to find help for your son. Many motivations that your son articulated were humanitarian. However, there were clear signs that his thinking about the solutions to these problems were distorted and grandious (two clear indicators of a mood disorder). Thank you for picking up on them.
The way his distorted thinking, and risk taking behavior was handled by authorities points up a big problem about how our country handles mood disorders. The problems our authorities have in handling distorted thinking also extend to some other crimes, which are the end result of distorted thinking.
Look at what happened in Columbine CO and Newtown CT. I think you feel that you had a tough choice but that you were trying to prevent just such an occurance.
I fully support your efforts to enlighten authorities about intervention, and thank you most sincerely for your efforts to be good parents and good citizens.
3
Dear Mr. Shafi,
The only interventions in which the F.B.I. participates are:
1) Killing the suspect;
2) Arresting the suspect and trying to get her or him imprisoned or executed.
Unfortunately I think you may have watched too many TV shows about the F.B.I.
However, the penalties applied are OFTEN excessively disproportional to the crime that has been committed.
It's the American way. If only your son had been white and Christian.
The only interventions in which the F.B.I. participates are:
1) Killing the suspect;
2) Arresting the suspect and trying to get her or him imprisoned or executed.
Unfortunately I think you may have watched too many TV shows about the F.B.I.
However, the penalties applied are OFTEN excessively disproportional to the crime that has been committed.
It's the American way. If only your son had been white and Christian.
5
I'd like to see a photo of Mr. Shafi's wife, too.
We've been shown a nice Westernized-appearing father, and a (US-born?) son who's decided to revert to the seventh-century norm.
At what age did Adam begin displaying symptoms of depression and perhaps more serious illness? Many hard-to-treat psychiatric disorders first manifest in adolescence and many troubled kids are then prime meat for cult recruitment. A kid with similar problems might have been attracted to the Hari Krishnas or to Scientology or ultra-Orthodoxy.
But the heart of the problem for many kids of Adam's religious heritage is that the family lives a sort of schizophrenic life. The father is outwardly Western and the mother lives very traditionally, and the sons and daughters--often educated in public or secular private schools--must switch back and forth every day in identity and loyalty.
Further--here in the US they are often not seen as "real Americans" but back in the old country, the cousins in Cairo or Karachi laugh at them precisely for being "too American." They don't know who they are and they are desperate to find a meaning for themselves.
And a further difficulty of course is that Adam might have benefited from in-patient care at a good mental-health facility but had not yet done anything to qualify him for insurance-reimbursed care or to be involuntarily committed.
We don't know enough about Adam's prior ten years or so to say whether Mr. Shafi acted foolishly or not here.
We've been shown a nice Westernized-appearing father, and a (US-born?) son who's decided to revert to the seventh-century norm.
At what age did Adam begin displaying symptoms of depression and perhaps more serious illness? Many hard-to-treat psychiatric disorders first manifest in adolescence and many troubled kids are then prime meat for cult recruitment. A kid with similar problems might have been attracted to the Hari Krishnas or to Scientology or ultra-Orthodoxy.
But the heart of the problem for many kids of Adam's religious heritage is that the family lives a sort of schizophrenic life. The father is outwardly Western and the mother lives very traditionally, and the sons and daughters--often educated in public or secular private schools--must switch back and forth every day in identity and loyalty.
Further--here in the US they are often not seen as "real Americans" but back in the old country, the cousins in Cairo or Karachi laugh at them precisely for being "too American." They don't know who they are and they are desperate to find a meaning for themselves.
And a further difficulty of course is that Adam might have benefited from in-patient care at a good mental-health facility but had not yet done anything to qualify him for insurance-reimbursed care or to be involuntarily committed.
We don't know enough about Adam's prior ten years or so to say whether Mr. Shafi acted foolishly or not here.
10
You did a very good job of describing what I sense probably went on in this family. There are many families like this, not only Muslim and it is very hard on the children. As you said the mother is probably very reserved and traditional. I suspect there was a lack of communication within the family.
4
Is radicalization common to all religions or restricted to select few? And why are an increasing number of Muslim youth, including those from the the upper segments of the developed world, more prone to radicalization in the high tech twenty first century? And why do these radicalized youth not even care for their parents? Conclusive answers to these questions only can help to reverse the growing trend of radicalization and terrorism.
4
As I get older, I have less trust for our government and for police, FBI and all related agencies. The lawyer was right. I agree. If I were in the same shoes, I would not speak to anyone else and take matters into my own hand. Sad, very sad.
4
Even the government worshiping NYTs has said on numerous occasions that government is always inefficient and often CORRUPT, so why should anyone ever trust the government?
1
The dad kept his son from killing people and from being killed as a terrorist. He is to be saluted. The son gets no special treatment because the date was a saint. I am sure the son is mentally ill as are all terrorists A program could be helpful in some instances but its not likely to help stop terrorism since its not a lifestyle choice or religious choice, its sociopath mentally ill behavior
3
5 years ago, to almost the day, the Boston Marathon was bombed by two immigrant brothers. They both had all the best that America could possibly offer to them, including one who had an education at the prestigious Latin School. None the less, their hatred of us was real and finally they pulled off a horrifying atrocity that still reverberates within Boston and beyond.
The older brother was married to an American women (Katherine ?) originally from Rhode Island, who converted to Islam. They had a son and shared an apartment together. What I don't understand is that she NEVER came forward about her husband and brother-in-law who were making bombs on their kitchen table. How could she have possibly not have known? This women was whisked away into obscurity, until this day.
My thoughts are why can't someone be implicated of knowing about a potential terrorist act and not reporting it? And if proven so, why aren't they prosecuted for harboring or being complicit in terrorism? If more people were charged then perhaps this nefarious activity would be more reported and prevent senseless murder. We as a nation better get on top of this and quick. For we are next in line for more death and mayhem. These people know no borders and are already here.
The older brother was married to an American women (Katherine ?) originally from Rhode Island, who converted to Islam. They had a son and shared an apartment together. What I don't understand is that she NEVER came forward about her husband and brother-in-law who were making bombs on their kitchen table. How could she have possibly not have known? This women was whisked away into obscurity, until this day.
My thoughts are why can't someone be implicated of knowing about a potential terrorist act and not reporting it? And if proven so, why aren't they prosecuted for harboring or being complicit in terrorism? If more people were charged then perhaps this nefarious activity would be more reported and prevent senseless murder. We as a nation better get on top of this and quick. For we are next in line for more death and mayhem. These people know no borders and are already here.
10
Mr. Putin already practices the taking of families into custody when they suspect a family member may be engaged in some terrorist activity (no proof needed).
Is this the America you want to live in? Careful what you wish for...
Is this the America you want to live in? Careful what you wish for...
@ SG
Not too many Americans want our future to look like that and yet there are not a lot of Muslim terrorist attacks in Russia...
Not too many Americans want our future to look like that and yet there are not a lot of Muslim terrorist attacks in Russia...
3
When Mussolini ruled Italy, they said the trains ran on time. Is that justification?
Freedom is neither cheap or easy. The terrorists are counting on fear bringing out the worst in us. Stay the path of justice and we will prevail. It won't be easy, it won't be fast, but we will prevail.
Freedom is neither cheap or easy. The terrorists are counting on fear bringing out the worst in us. Stay the path of justice and we will prevail. It won't be easy, it won't be fast, but we will prevail.
The father did face a terrible choice...doing what he did (and he did more than just dumping his son onto law enforcement)...but the alternative likely would have ended with his son dying a horrible death. What would he rather have? Even if in jail in the US a chance that he might be rehabilitated and paroled in time.
1
My heart goes out to Sal Shafi and his family............
6
As a long time atheist, I can't agree with the attacks on religion. It doesn't square with my own observations of my friends and neighbors. The religious people I know are kind, community spirited, and very civilized. So belief in a magic being in the sky does not equate to acts of violence.
On the other hand, acts of violence can be justified - for some people - by a dogmatic religious belief. The task of society in general is to separate the wheat from the chaff. Where religion teaches things that tear down civilization, we should not be timid in stamping it out.
Religious belief alone isn't sufficient grounds for behavior to be protected. If all religious belief is to be protected, then I'll start training today for my ordination in the Church of the Robbing of Banks.
On the other hand, acts of violence can be justified - for some people - by a dogmatic religious belief. The task of society in general is to separate the wheat from the chaff. Where religion teaches things that tear down civilization, we should not be timid in stamping it out.
Religious belief alone isn't sufficient grounds for behavior to be protected. If all religious belief is to be protected, then I'll start training today for my ordination in the Church of the Robbing of Banks.
3
Religion tears down the machinery of civilization when it teaches people to take God's name in vain, which is the Biblical expression for claiming to know what God thinks.
1
A while ago I stood at a zebra-crossing with a traffic light. Next to me was a couple with their son. Mummy held his left hand, daddy his right. A scene right out of a book. But it wasn't. Because mommy had a phone in her other hand, as did daddy, and they were both talking to someone, totally ignoring their child, which was very, very bored, being held by both hands but totally ignored otherwise.
This is reality, today, and has been for quite a while. Children are no longer loved, no longer cared for, no longer taught, no longer part of the family. Everything else in the world is more important than your very own children, like the job, hobbies, "Friends" on Facebook, whatever. We have been creating a species of monsters, and now we pay for it!
How does a human being get corrupted by religion so bad that he or she is willing to give up their life? No book or preacher can be strong enough to do that if the victim hasn't been weakened by their very own family! In the olden days the young, ruthless ones would put their old parents on an ice-float and set them adrift at sea. These days they strap on a suicide vest and go kill as many people as they can. In both cases it's the fault of the parents.
Teach love. Teach understanding. Take time out of your busy day for your children. Never ignore them, Never scold them for asking questions you can't answer. They are the future. And if past is prologue then our future isn't looking very bright right now...
This is reality, today, and has been for quite a while. Children are no longer loved, no longer cared for, no longer taught, no longer part of the family. Everything else in the world is more important than your very own children, like the job, hobbies, "Friends" on Facebook, whatever. We have been creating a species of monsters, and now we pay for it!
How does a human being get corrupted by religion so bad that he or she is willing to give up their life? No book or preacher can be strong enough to do that if the victim hasn't been weakened by their very own family! In the olden days the young, ruthless ones would put their old parents on an ice-float and set them adrift at sea. These days they strap on a suicide vest and go kill as many people as they can. In both cases it's the fault of the parents.
Teach love. Teach understanding. Take time out of your busy day for your children. Never ignore them, Never scold them for asking questions you can't answer. They are the future. And if past is prologue then our future isn't looking very bright right now...
4
How does a human being get corrupted by religion so bad that he or she is willing to give up their life?
religion
religion
6
Choosing to be parents in the first place is a risky proposition under the decaying social contract of the US. Your child is possibly more likely to be dead of a drug overdose than established in a solid career by age 30.
2
in that case he doesnt have to worry about a career
1
Because lots of drug addicts come from good families and we know this because their parents told us so?
2
Uh, no. According to the CDC, there are approximately 47,000 overdose deaths per year across all age groups. There are about 50 million people in the U.S. ages 20-30.
The state is a violent human construct with force, violence and coercion behind and enabling all of its actions. Because of the inadequacy of force, violence and coercion of accomplishing anything productive in most if not all situations, and generally being counterproductive of achieving intended consequences, the state is incapable of dealing effectively with situations such as the one described so sadly by this father. God help us to learn to deal with our fellows by other means.
How do you suggest? Lynch mobs?
Governments exist almost everywhere because the alternatives are almost always worse.
Governments exist almost everywhere because the alternatives are almost always worse.
3
I feel for Mr. Shafi, but at least in confinement, Adam will likely still be alive in 20 years.
7
Out of all the comments I read on this article (I didn't read every one) nobody even mentioned the possibility that the root cause of this young man's extremism may not be depression, religiosity, psychosis, a radical Imam, or bad influences. The root cause may very well be an honorable and ethical commitment to justice and equality.
It is a documented fact that the US government has killed many innocents and continues to do so, through the drone program and through foreign invasions and occupations, e.g. of Iraq and Afghanistan. Young people who look at this horror and feel it deeply want to do what they can to stop it. Yet, how? In no way do I approve of terrorism, but in the face of state terrorism, there is a certain moral logic to responding with jihad -- i.e., responding in kind.
Yes, those who commit crimes, even out of idealism and a desire for a better world -- such as members of the weather underground in the 70s -- should be prepared to pay the price. However, the ultimate solution to this kind of ethically-inspired (if unethical) violence is not punishment but peace, justice and equality. As a nation, our foreign wars are costing us our treasure and our souls.
It is a documented fact that the US government has killed many innocents and continues to do so, through the drone program and through foreign invasions and occupations, e.g. of Iraq and Afghanistan. Young people who look at this horror and feel it deeply want to do what they can to stop it. Yet, how? In no way do I approve of terrorism, but in the face of state terrorism, there is a certain moral logic to responding with jihad -- i.e., responding in kind.
Yes, those who commit crimes, even out of idealism and a desire for a better world -- such as members of the weather underground in the 70s -- should be prepared to pay the price. However, the ultimate solution to this kind of ethically-inspired (if unethical) violence is not punishment but peace, justice and equality. As a nation, our foreign wars are costing us our treasure and our souls.
3
I don't get how killing strangers going about their mundane lives becomes a cure for any injustice.
16
Killing strangers is not a cure as you and I know. But that is not clear to everyone. My point is that terrorists may have good motivations, despite their terrible means.
1
An honorable and ethical commitment to justice and equality can never lead to the cold blooded ambushing and murdering of other people, especially those who have absolutely no connection to whatever the cause may be. Using the lives of other people as pawns can never be justified absent a gangster amorality.
4
As so many have pointed out, the pull toward extremism of ANY kind is about attaching to something bigger than yourself. We need to find a middle ground way, an option to allow parents to get help from authorities who are empowered TO help, and not just destroy a life and family, and existing bonds of trust in the US as a fair country and community. Because how can the Muslim community ever trust that getting help will do more than blow their families apart? And cause even more kids to become radicalized against a government that demonstrates it cannot be trusted to provide help? It IS heartbreaking. Cooperation is the way out of this -- not an overwhelming show of force.
Until Prosecutors are prosecuted for their crimes, there cannot be true justice
2
The father is an American hero for making the excruciatingly difficult decision to call the authorities. Who knows how many lives he saved by preventing his son from waging jihad? In the last paragraph he tells others not to do what he did, but I wish he could find a way to see that it was a heroic deed that others in similar situations should follow.
4
The father did the right thing contacting the authorities. But the parents did not do a good enough job as parents teaching the kid right from wrong. But lots of parents fail - parenting is more art than science. But despite what many say there are clear delineations black and white rather than gray of right from wrong. But in the past 30 years or so there has been too much moral relativism nonsense from those who want to excuse antisocial /criminal behavior.
2
I agree with this guy. All that the Justice system does is destroyed human beings. The comments on this section treat Muslims like some alien community, but I, a white woman, totally empathize with these people. Imagine if you called the FBI because u want them to help your opiate addicted white son get away from what he was involved in. You know what the FBI and the police are going to do....they are going to tap his phones and the second he sells an oxycontin he will be shoved in jail for dealing drugs for 5 years. The Justice System only helps the 1%. For the rest of us, the police are just another gestapo out to make sure our jails are filled to capacity to feed the industrial prison complex. I don't care if this 22 year old kid MAY have wanted traveled to some failed state halfway across the world. Instead, now I have to pay more taxes to house this kid in supermax for the next 20 years. The terrorists are winning. Every time we make laws that abrogate freedom and allow the FBI and NSA to tap the phones of everyone and anyone whenever they like, they win. Terrorism is an permanent part of our culture now, we need to live with it while preventing ourselves from becoming a surveillance state. If you think about it, terrorism kills very few people a year compared to the huge wars we used to get into. Read Benjamin Barbers McWorld vs Jihad.
3
Terrorism today is not local, regional or national and its ranks are drawn mostly from disaffected young people. And when you combine societal and cultural turmoil in their countries of origin with isolation and hoplessness in their new countries, the sad fact is that families of putative terrorists have to be convinced to the extent possible to report their terrorist-susceptible children to authorities. Once reported, government security agencies should know how to follow up with respect and understanding for the families' fears and the further erosion in their ability to live decent lives.
Not sure he had any rational reason to feel hopeless with all the opportunities here and his parent's comfortable economic status. Silicon Valley is an awfully diverse area where countless immigrants thrive. The government can't protect him from the predictable and justified fallout --and has to be outraged that he now regrets turning him in.
1
Wow! Smart move by our government, letting punitive thinking and neocon brutishness shut down what could be a great opportunity to find a middle way for these young people.
Now, what do they have? No program, and a text book example splashed all over the pages of the New York Times on what happens to your family when you "trust the government" as a good citizen-parent. They won't be getting many other calls from parents after this!
The idea that the young man was "too old" was also pathetic: this is not juvenile court we are talking about. Too much "Gitmo thinking" has crept in to our respnses. A kid that has not yet killed anyone now faces twenty or more hard years, likely in solitary in a Supermax Prison somewhere. So pathetically unimaginative. We have billions for making one jet, but not the money, time, or patience to build a program like this, even for something so very critical. We can incarcerate and punish, but can't rehabilitate - even when a true crime has not been committed yet.
So much for being an "enlightened nation" or for a young citizen's rights. This father deserves better. Now, he has spread the story of the failed consequences of trust for the world to see. Yet again, unthinking bureaucracy took the opportunity to not take an opportunity.
Now, what do they have? No program, and a text book example splashed all over the pages of the New York Times on what happens to your family when you "trust the government" as a good citizen-parent. They won't be getting many other calls from parents after this!
The idea that the young man was "too old" was also pathetic: this is not juvenile court we are talking about. Too much "Gitmo thinking" has crept in to our respnses. A kid that has not yet killed anyone now faces twenty or more hard years, likely in solitary in a Supermax Prison somewhere. So pathetically unimaginative. We have billions for making one jet, but not the money, time, or patience to build a program like this, even for something so very critical. We can incarcerate and punish, but can't rehabilitate - even when a true crime has not been committed yet.
So much for being an "enlightened nation" or for a young citizen's rights. This father deserves better. Now, he has spread the story of the failed consequences of trust for the world to see. Yet again, unthinking bureaucracy took the opportunity to not take an opportunity.
8
The person who is at fault here, the one who broke his father's heart, is the son. At 22 years of age, he is not a child. He should have known better and should have considered how his actions would impact others.
As bad a I feel for the father, I don't think - from the information we are given here - that the government acted improperly. Understandably, Mr. Shafi is upset - but presumably he would be more upset if his son detonated a suicide vest in the middle of a busy train or square or music venue.
As bad a I feel for the father, I don't think - from the information we are given here - that the government acted improperly. Understandably, Mr. Shafi is upset - but presumably he would be more upset if his son detonated a suicide vest in the middle of a busy train or square or music venue.
7
This case simply conveys the message: Despite the best intentions of president Barack Obama, the State apparatus are always cruel, soulless and without foresight. Al-Shafi seems to be a resourceful person. He could at least go to places to have the problem addressed. Think about the less resourceful who face similar problems. Attorney General Loretta E. Lynch has a greater responsibility here. If the government working with the community decides that a person like Adam could be incorrigibly dangerous, he/she should be put in confinement and under strict vigilance (something like in a half-way house). Such victims of radicalization ought to be treated or counseled out of their misguided path. But, to throw them behind the bars in the company of hardened criminals will certainly be counter-productive. Released Guantanamo prisoners should serve as good examples, many of them have gone back to join the ranks of Islamic terrorist organizations. Eventually, Americans will have to grapple with a vicious problem where the US law-enforcing agencies, contrary to the intentions of the law-makers or the people, over-play their hands. Their ruthlessness both domestically and internationally turns many people disgruntled or possibly hostile who could other wise be dependable and productive friends. This problem may exacerbate if the arms of the government isn't using heart over mind in the next administration. This President and Attorney General who happen to be blacks are the last hope.
1
We need to give the communities surrounding emerging extremists a choice beyond sending their loved ones to prison. Perhaps we could de-politicize this issue enough to help them handle their kids the way anyone would handle their kid getting sucked into a cult? That sure would be a nice, humane way to deal with the situation.
2
The Shafi family doesn't realize how lucky it is. It's easy to name a dozen countries off the top of your head where the results of Adam's activities would be summary execution.
10
The heart of our ambivalence with this case is that we have thrown away the concept of reasonable doubt when considering terrorism. Most young people do stupid things while in the process of growing up: drive drunk, deal drugs, join cults, get pregnant. In most cases they grow out of it, and there is a high probability that this young man would have done the same. We are so afraid of terrorism however, that we will not grant this man the freedom to be young and confused. I would gladly lock him up and throw away the key if he had actually hurt somebody. But it appears that his life has been destroyed for a "thought crime."
As far as we can tell from this article, this young man is getting 20 years in prison for some macho posturing in private phone conversations. Also, like Ronald Reagan during the Russian invasion of Afghanistan, he believes that Al Qaeda is an effective tool against a corrupt and murderous dictator. There is no evidence that this young man has actually hurt anyone. He has been arrested because it seems plausible he will commit a crime someday. "What!!" you say. "Are we supposed to wait until he actually commits a crime until we arrest him?" Well, yes, actually. That is how things are done in a democracy. It's risky, but freedom doesn't come free.
As far as we can tell from this article, this young man is getting 20 years in prison for some macho posturing in private phone conversations. Also, like Ronald Reagan during the Russian invasion of Afghanistan, he believes that Al Qaeda is an effective tool against a corrupt and murderous dictator. There is no evidence that this young man has actually hurt anyone. He has been arrested because it seems plausible he will commit a crime someday. "What!!" you say. "Are we supposed to wait until he actually commits a crime until we arrest him?" Well, yes, actually. That is how things are done in a democracy. It's risky, but freedom doesn't come free.
5
The only way to stop radicalization of the youth is to stop the source - imams and clerics, as well as any immigration from Saudi. We want privacy and free speech, but even politician's knew that yelling fire is not free speech. Certainly yelling murder, rape, robbery, and destruction is at least as bad as yelling fire?
As far as the adam's of the world - parents give too much with no demand that they earn or face responsibility. The school system is the same - let's not give kids bad grades or fail them through lack of performance lest we make them feel bad.
Well, kids are being raised in a numb environment where everyone gets a pat on the back - and it leaves them numb inside, searching for meaning. Some turn to extreme religious interpretation just for something other than gray. Wake up parents, teachers, and the countless government agencies trying to re-engineer han beings!
As far as the adam's of the world - parents give too much with no demand that they earn or face responsibility. The school system is the same - let's not give kids bad grades or fail them through lack of performance lest we make them feel bad.
Well, kids are being raised in a numb environment where everyone gets a pat on the back - and it leaves them numb inside, searching for meaning. Some turn to extreme religious interpretation just for something other than gray. Wake up parents, teachers, and the countless government agencies trying to re-engineer han beings!
2
Nothing is ever as hard to do as reaching out to a disaffected son or daughter, especially when they reach late adolescence or early young adulthood. It becomes intensely more complicated when the young person hasn't made successful connections to the greater world outside of the parents and family. This happens all the time regardless of religious background or practicing faith.
In this example of a father who became bewildered at reaching his wandering son, to pass on intelligent advice, or to help guide him into becoming successful in managing all the conflicting emotions concomitant with the process of growing up is not unique to any particular faith. That's the first part of starting to unravel the confusion of identity for young adults.
The dreadful caveat for present day Muslims however is the sinister nature of ready-to-go alternatives to the built in difficulties growing up in our modern, very ungrounded, unstabilized, globalization. Navigating this 21st Century phenomena is not completely unique. What is very different however happens to be our technology. The information age has an ever present unyielding threat of psychological and physical trauma everywhere. Conflicts thousands of miles away have suddenly landed at our front doors, literally. And wars are always taken up by the young. Guarding your children against it enveloping them will sometimes be very painful, as in Mr. Shafir's case. At least Adam is still alive, albeit in protective custody for now.
In this example of a father who became bewildered at reaching his wandering son, to pass on intelligent advice, or to help guide him into becoming successful in managing all the conflicting emotions concomitant with the process of growing up is not unique to any particular faith. That's the first part of starting to unravel the confusion of identity for young adults.
The dreadful caveat for present day Muslims however is the sinister nature of ready-to-go alternatives to the built in difficulties growing up in our modern, very ungrounded, unstabilized, globalization. Navigating this 21st Century phenomena is not completely unique. What is very different however happens to be our technology. The information age has an ever present unyielding threat of psychological and physical trauma everywhere. Conflicts thousands of miles away have suddenly landed at our front doors, literally. And wars are always taken up by the young. Guarding your children against it enveloping them will sometimes be very painful, as in Mr. Shafir's case. At least Adam is still alive, albeit in protective custody for now.
2
“I just destroyed Adam.”
And potentially saved the lives of dozens or hundreds of innocent Americans who foolishly allowed these people in (while tens of thousands of immigrants who embrace our values are stuck on endless waiting lists).
When you have a thousand FBI agents working full bore to investigate Muslims –including programs to pay Somalis to monitor their community for terrorists--who were permitted to settle here, the system is horribly broken and the vetting process is worthless. It's way past time to drop the “compassionate liberal”- ”narrow-minded conservative” dangerous and idiotic tripe and hold the gatekeepers and administration accountable.
And, yes, if parents can't police their minor kids and they turn to terrorism, the family needs to be promptly stripped of their papers and deported.
And potentially saved the lives of dozens or hundreds of innocent Americans who foolishly allowed these people in (while tens of thousands of immigrants who embrace our values are stuck on endless waiting lists).
When you have a thousand FBI agents working full bore to investigate Muslims –including programs to pay Somalis to monitor their community for terrorists--who were permitted to settle here, the system is horribly broken and the vetting process is worthless. It's way past time to drop the “compassionate liberal”- ”narrow-minded conservative” dangerous and idiotic tripe and hold the gatekeepers and administration accountable.
And, yes, if parents can't police their minor kids and they turn to terrorism, the family needs to be promptly stripped of their papers and deported.
1
This article and the comments I have read focus far too much on the sensitive Adam making sandwiches for the poor and crying over displaced Muslims and too little of his intent to spill blood for jihad and deceiving his family on multiple occasions as he tried to join the fight. He was not, in any way, passive; he acted and there's every reason to believe he would act again. And exactly how would these imagined government-sponsored "intervention" programs be regarded when -- inevitably -- one or more of the would-be jihadists goes rogue and makes good on their murderous beliefs? Many posters have drawn analogies with addiction- recovery programs and possibly they have better knowledge of how well these programs work; my impression is not so well, certainly far below 100%. Like many other posters I had to think of my own two sons who are passionate about many things, maybe Adam's just like them. And then I remember how I thought the same thing about the Tsarnaev brothers, just two over-grown kids whose passions went too far.
2
I certainly understand Mr. Shafi's sentiments. He seems like a very good father, but as a father, I think he did the right thing.
What is troubling is the message for other fathers not to cooperate if their sons become radicalized.
What if they choose not to go to Syria to conduct their mayhem, but choose somewhere in the United States instead?
And, what if other fathers follow the advice of Mr. Shafi in the final paragraph of this story and people are maimed and killed? Would not such a father then be complicit in the son's actions?
What is troubling is the message for other fathers not to cooperate if their sons become radicalized.
What if they choose not to go to Syria to conduct their mayhem, but choose somewhere in the United States instead?
And, what if other fathers follow the advice of Mr. Shafi in the final paragraph of this story and people are maimed and killed? Would not such a father then be complicit in the son's actions?
1
As a teacher with thousands of parent interactions under my belt, I can guarantee you that Adam's problems were years in the making and the tracking app is just the tip of the iceberg full of red flags.
Sadly, behind almost every problem child, there is a parenting issue. Often, the parents are well-meaning and trying very hard, but they can't see the disconnect as clearly as an outside, objective observer. They can't see the few, but often critical, times when their parenting is about meeting their own subconscious emotional needs. It's not a question of "fault" as much as it's about lost opportunity.
If a parent is reduced to a tracking app or is even thinking about calling the police, there is still time for the parent to look at themselves and get help to address the disconnect.
Mr. Shafi did the right thing, but I'm sorry it had to come to that. It didn't happen because Mr. Shafi was a "bad" parent, but more aware, informed parenting might have been able to prevent it. Some kids have very different, difficult-to-meet needs. Parents simply need the information.
Sadly, behind almost every problem child, there is a parenting issue. Often, the parents are well-meaning and trying very hard, but they can't see the disconnect as clearly as an outside, objective observer. They can't see the few, but often critical, times when their parenting is about meeting their own subconscious emotional needs. It's not a question of "fault" as much as it's about lost opportunity.
If a parent is reduced to a tracking app or is even thinking about calling the police, there is still time for the parent to look at themselves and get help to address the disconnect.
Mr. Shafi did the right thing, but I'm sorry it had to come to that. It didn't happen because Mr. Shafi was a "bad" parent, but more aware, informed parenting might have been able to prevent it. Some kids have very different, difficult-to-meet needs. Parents simply need the information.
23
'...Often, the parents are well-meaning and trying very hard...their parenting is about meeting their own subconscious emotional needs. It's not a question of "fault"...'
When a parent cannot set aside their own emotional needs to do what is best for their child, it is most assuredly is their 'fault' when their child becomes toxic to society.
The attitude that 'it is nobody's fault' means that no has to take responsibility for anything.
That even parents of terrorists now expect sympathy, as if the way they raised their children could not have had anything to do with them turning into mass murderers.
It must be society's fault for 'marginalizing' their children, because of their '[fill in designated victim status here].
When a parent cannot set aside their own emotional needs to do what is best for their child, it is most assuredly is their 'fault' when their child becomes toxic to society.
The attitude that 'it is nobody's fault' means that no has to take responsibility for anything.
That even parents of terrorists now expect sympathy, as if the way they raised their children could not have had anything to do with them turning into mass murderers.
It must be society's fault for 'marginalizing' their children, because of their '[fill in designated victim status here].
2
Oh good, same old, same old. Parent's fault. Many years in the offing. Look to the outside, objective observer (the teacher). Parents should look at themselves.........address the "disconnect" (whatever the heck that is). Informed parenting.
Spare me. I'm tired of teachers being the authoritarian models of parenting issues, discipline issues, bullying issues, ADD issues, issues about emotional needs of parents, etc., etc.
Most teachers are overburdened with unmanageable class sizes, uncooperative administrations, a Common Core philosophy which no one understands, PARCC testing, decreased budgets, more testing, union fights with Boards of Education...........etc. Please don't expect me to receive a detailed psychological profile of a particular student, and pay it too much mind, when it's coming from the overworked teacher in a failing system.
JimF from Sewell
Spare me. I'm tired of teachers being the authoritarian models of parenting issues, discipline issues, bullying issues, ADD issues, issues about emotional needs of parents, etc., etc.
Most teachers are overburdened with unmanageable class sizes, uncooperative administrations, a Common Core philosophy which no one understands, PARCC testing, decreased budgets, more testing, union fights with Boards of Education...........etc. Please don't expect me to receive a detailed psychological profile of a particular student, and pay it too much mind, when it's coming from the overworked teacher in a failing system.
JimF from Sewell
I think that you have jumped to conclusions about this family that are simply not supported by the facts provided in this article. I just don't think reading a newspaper article provides anyone, regardless of background, with enough information on which to make the conclusions and judgments you assert. We don't know what happened and how or why Adam ended up like he did. To suggest that Mr. Shafi's ability to track his son's phone is "tip of the iceberg" is really a stretch. I have three teenage sons. I can "find" their phones as they are all tied to one family account. I have this feature for many reasons - including wanting to be able to locate them should they be in an accident or, because we live in Europe, if they are traveling in a city or country in which a terrorist event occurs and I can't reach them. I can at least know where the phone is. Having this ability to "track" my boys doesn't mean I am disconnected from them. And it doesn't mean I am a bad parent. This poor man made an unbearably agonizing decision. He is (and will forever be) questioning every parenting choice he ever made. Speculating about missed "signs" that an "outside, objective observer" (I assume you mean you?) would have recognized and theorizing that Mr. Shafi might have parented in a way that met his own "subconscious emotional needs" feels like a form of shadenfruede.
3
In the 1970s many people's children joined cults and they hired de-programmers to intervene, essentially to kidnap the kids out of the cult, and undo the brainwashing that was done. This is essentially no different -- here you have a cult, whether it's ISIS, Al-Queda, or whatever, and children who are weak and looking for a purpose, and voila, you have a jihadi.
We need to have a de-programming approach, likely privately operated but with governmental approval, for these kids drawn in for whatever reason to these nefarious groups. Either that or you'll fill prisons with a bunch of mis-guided and easily influenced people.
We need to have a de-programming approach, likely privately operated but with governmental approval, for these kids drawn in for whatever reason to these nefarious groups. Either that or you'll fill prisons with a bunch of mis-guided and easily influenced people.
5
Yes, whatever happened to joining a 70's style NRM (new religious movement)? Peace, love and unity with the optimistic mindset all would join. Look at what happened tho the Unification Church (Rev Moon), Hari Krishna, Children of God, etc. They sold candies in a parking lot, handed out leaflets to potential converts and maybe brought home an exotic foreign born spouse. Deprogramming aside (it was bogus anyway) after a time, most adherents quietly trickled back into mainstream society.
Now its running off to some hellhole where trying to change the world entails blowing themselves and others up. Its going to be hard coming back from THAT.
Now its running off to some hellhole where trying to change the world entails blowing themselves and others up. Its going to be hard coming back from THAT.
To me, it seems the article missed the point. The fact is, this young man, locked in jail, cannot commit a violent terrorist act, killing or maiming others. He must have demonstrated a strong enough desire and ability to do so for his own family and the FBI to be concerned about him. His father should take solace that his son is alive and didn't hurt anyone. Hopefully he can be deradicalized and released when he is seen not to pose a threat to others anymore.
2
Mr. Shafis, My heart goes out to you and your family. As a mom, my heart breaks. As a person who was once young--and wondered if violence were the answer to our terribly flawed society--my heart breaks for your son. I know it would be much worse for you had you done nothing and he taken the lives of others. I also know that this is an "if." You did the right thing. It is America that failed.
2
It is amazing and profoundly disturbing how many people, regardless of age, fail to see the irony, hypocrisy and evil in wanting to spill buckets of blood "for Allah." What a total perversion of any idea of religion.
3
While the reaction to young people threatening to join terrorist organizations may be over-the-top that misses the more fundamental question - Why? Some decades ago the threat was "cults" from Hare Krishna to Jim Jones. Today the problem are terrorist organizations. What is it about the adolescent mind that draws some young people to join these organizations?
Once inside the organization the brainwashing is easy (I know because the US Military managed to brainwash me in just 13 weeks of training). Yet, what is the draw, what is the trigger, that pulls a young person out of a path of behavior and leads to joining an organization that is inconsistent with the family you grew up with?
Nobody seems to have an answer, yet it is the question that needs answering. Prison, or the threat of prison, doesn't seem to be the answer. Where do we go from here?
Once inside the organization the brainwashing is easy (I know because the US Military managed to brainwash me in just 13 weeks of training). Yet, what is the draw, what is the trigger, that pulls a young person out of a path of behavior and leads to joining an organization that is inconsistent with the family you grew up with?
Nobody seems to have an answer, yet it is the question that needs answering. Prison, or the threat of prison, doesn't seem to be the answer. Where do we go from here?
1
@George
Excellent questions. Very young adults many times have yet to find the connections necessary to develop an identity. All they know is that 'life' seems to just have happened to them. These times are difficult and as you suggest, "brainwashing is easy". Your experience is a great example but ironically it was in an organized military setting. You weren't just taught to hate while they put weapons in your hands, and there plenty of lessons on how to discern the difference between non combatants and the 'enemy'. All this had the beneficial side effect of creating self confidence and an identity that still remains a nationally acceptable way to achieve positive personal growth.
I know because I grew up on SAC Air Force Bases my entire childhood, became a psychotherapist, began my career counseling active military enlistees, Vietnam Vets coming home with heroin addiction issues, and civilians with both substance abuse and mental illness issues. Now in my mid sixties it all seems that history keeps repeating itself with different actors and the cause has a different name. Youth around the planet continue to struggle with identity issues and becoming connected to the world around them.
Those thirteen weeks gave you more than "brainwashing", they gave you a structured outlook that is a far better start than all those disconnected kids out there. Thanks for your service.
Excellent questions. Very young adults many times have yet to find the connections necessary to develop an identity. All they know is that 'life' seems to just have happened to them. These times are difficult and as you suggest, "brainwashing is easy". Your experience is a great example but ironically it was in an organized military setting. You weren't just taught to hate while they put weapons in your hands, and there plenty of lessons on how to discern the difference between non combatants and the 'enemy'. All this had the beneficial side effect of creating self confidence and an identity that still remains a nationally acceptable way to achieve positive personal growth.
I know because I grew up on SAC Air Force Bases my entire childhood, became a psychotherapist, began my career counseling active military enlistees, Vietnam Vets coming home with heroin addiction issues, and civilians with both substance abuse and mental illness issues. Now in my mid sixties it all seems that history keeps repeating itself with different actors and the cause has a different name. Youth around the planet continue to struggle with identity issues and becoming connected to the world around them.
Those thirteen weeks gave you more than "brainwashing", they gave you a structured outlook that is a far better start than all those disconnected kids out there. Thanks for your service.
2
If I had a child who grew up to want to murder innocent people, I would realize that I had failed them in every single way and do everything in my power to right that wrong, even if it meant locking that child away.
It appears that abdication of parental responsibility is now the standard, as blame is assigned everywhere but where it belongs.
It appears that abdication of parental responsibility is now the standard, as blame is assigned everywhere but where it belongs.
3
Its heartbreaking for the parents, but as a muslim raising children in the west, i have to question what conversations they had at home during his growing years that led to this radicalization in the first place.
3
As a responsible and courageous parent Mr. Shafi did all the right things while FBI mishandled this case on many levels. As a PR case for potential Adams in the future FBI could have handled this case in a way that would have encouraged other parents or family members to come forward who may find themselves in similar situation.
This story shows that FBI is unprepared to handle cases like this.
Still not too late! Instead of trying Adam in court FBI should offer intervention and rehabilitation with the help of Imams, psychologists and relatives and other useful methods in a house arrest situation for as long as necessary.
Again, for a millionth time, if the world, particularly US, does not halt and reverse hate spewing machine, that is Saudi funded Wahhabism and Salafism, we are going to keep suffering because a small group of thugs want to preserve their inhumane Kingdom. A lot of Sufi-like religious denominations in the wider Islamic world have been wiped due to thugs of Saudi funded religions.
This story shows that FBI is unprepared to handle cases like this.
Still not too late! Instead of trying Adam in court FBI should offer intervention and rehabilitation with the help of Imams, psychologists and relatives and other useful methods in a house arrest situation for as long as necessary.
Again, for a millionth time, if the world, particularly US, does not halt and reverse hate spewing machine, that is Saudi funded Wahhabism and Salafism, we are going to keep suffering because a small group of thugs want to preserve their inhumane Kingdom. A lot of Sufi-like religious denominations in the wider Islamic world have been wiped due to thugs of Saudi funded religions.
2
These kids are different from your everyday criminals. A drug dealer might sell drug to make ends meet, but s/he knows what s/he is doing is wrong. These kids, they think what they are doing is correct, moral, just.
Even though the actions are different, but the thought process going through our soldiers/police officers minds when they pull the trigger are the same as when terrorists press the detonate button. They believe they are killing to protect the people they care and love.
As long as we still teach our children "heros are those who sacrifice themselves to save others", there will be people who would kill to protect. It's just a matter of probability whether you are included in the "love" category or not.
Even though the actions are different, but the thought process going through our soldiers/police officers minds when they pull the trigger are the same as when terrorists press the detonate button. They believe they are killing to protect the people they care and love.
As long as we still teach our children "heros are those who sacrifice themselves to save others", there will be people who would kill to protect. It's just a matter of probability whether you are included in the "love" category or not.
This is hard for many to swallow regarding youth who become attracted to terrorist groups. Namely, Its easier to build a happy fulfilled well-adjusted cherished boy (by appropriately meeting his psychological/emotional/developmental growing up needs) than to mend an abused neglected ignored unwanted older boy who develops angry anti social tendencies as a result.
1
Mr. Shafi´s takeaway about never collaborating with government agencies is sad. Yet not so different from families torn apart by drugs and violence in their communities. When collaborating with cops, FBI and officialdom makes situations worse the system is truly broken. There needs to be a middle way, one in which prosecutors, agents, cops are not vainglorious about winning, but rather have the long range peace of their communities of people at heart.
1
Since 2001, our fight against terrorism has wrongly skewed our government in so many different ways. Decency, leniency, and privacy are disappearing rapidly in the name of safety- for what? The sad thing is that as Americans, we may have to insist on keeping our liberty (for some terrorists as well) and live with more bombings and killings in our homeland. If not, we are quickly becoming lambs on our way to the slaughter house.
Once again I wish to give my thoughts for a total solution. I point to the refuges trying to escape their countries usually in terror. I also point to the US position of our President to have the Arab countries fight their own battles tho with American help but not our troops on the ground. We bomb and pray but no solution. Where are the mid-eastern troops ??? I point to the millions fleeing, at least one third are fit for the military and the rest able to farm for food, sew for uniforms , put together bullets, drive trucks, tanks, teach, return with the overwhelming number of trained relatives, to their home lands to rebuild after routing the monsters who ran them from their homes. While we furnish them the means to do so. I also will bet that the children will be the ones running to join their fathers to fight for a more just cause than blowing themselves up because they have nothing to live for... How about it Hillery/Bernie/Democrats???
The outcome here suggests our governments needs to re-calibrate how we deal with potential terrorists identified by others. We need people with the courage Mr. Shafi's took in alerting authorities about his son. Will what our government did in this case encourage family, friends and neighbors to contact government officials with their fears? I think not.
1
In the wake of Muslim terrorism, somehow we fail to see that it is not divorced from the mass slayings in our own country by often privileged young white men. I just finished A Mother's Reckoning, the memoir of the mother of one of the two Columbine killers, Sue Klebold, and I'm convinced that we are not addressing a systemic problem of depression and rage among young males around the world. Is there something we have failed to identify in our post-modern culture that makes them susceptible to the call to arms? It can't simply be radical Islamic ideology, odious as that may be. It's become all to familiar here—a young man or men arm themselves and set out to commit mass slaughter. And how different is that, really, from the gang warfare that goes on in poor communities of color?
Simply calling for better mental health treatment is not adequate. We need to research the roots of male susceptibility and create a protocol for integrating our young men into a society in which they feel profoundly alienated. Prison will only make it worse.
Simply calling for better mental health treatment is not adequate. We need to research the roots of male susceptibility and create a protocol for integrating our young men into a society in which they feel profoundly alienated. Prison will only make it worse.
1
Women played prominent roles in the Pairs, Brussels, San Bernadino terror attacks and many others.
1
We already have a non-punitive prophylactic program: A sound, public education for all Americans, especially a civics education that promotes western secular values, integration and science. Start early and often to create Americans who are grateful, connected, secular, informed citizens. Enough with the precious apologies to self-enclaving cynics. Welcome to the United States. Now become a true citizen and leave your toxic fairy tales and disdain for the West behind. We will all prosper and yes, your children will be happier and freer. Isn't that what we all want?
1
I feel terrible for the father but grieving for him being in prison is likely easier than grieving for him being in the ground or having your family and life swamped by hatred because your son has helped terrorize a public setting in the USA. The father was in a touch place, but he did the right thing for him, his son and society at large. I hope he will find peace.
3
There has got to be a better way, but I'm at a loss as to what it is. They effectively sent a young man to prison for 20 years for a crime he hadn't committed yet. (While they did come up with an actual crime, supporting a terrorist organization, the purpose of this really is to keep someone potentially dangerous off the streets.)
Adam does indeed sound like someone who is a danger in his present state of mind. Could that state of mind be changed by the type of program described? I don't know, but I do know that prison will certainly not do it.
Adam does indeed sound like someone who is a danger in his present state of mind. Could that state of mind be changed by the type of program described? I don't know, but I do know that prison will certainly not do it.
Sometimes stumbling on your path is enough to throw you off track, hopefully not forever. As a child watching the Russians invade Hungary, I cried watching citizens throwing flaming Molotov cocktails at the tanks, thinking "what are the adults doing?" Now as an adult I've answered my own question.
Adam's father hopefully will continue his honorable attempts for intervention. Whatever progress he can achieve can be shared and duplicated and helpful in holding a powerful government responsive to inquiry and improved techniques.
Adam's father hopefully will continue his honorable attempts for intervention. Whatever progress he can achieve can be shared and duplicated and helpful in holding a powerful government responsive to inquiry and improved techniques.
This article falls short in so many ways.
What are the community efforts or options to go to if one suspect one's family member is being radicalized?
- what help could be given?
The article fails to describe if any of the community / religious teacher's offered to help. Could the religious community step in or did they offer to help?
In jail, could he not be radicalized further? Out in 20 years, he would be in his 40s or younger.
Counselling or rehabilitation programmes could tailored to the person's specific circumstances, including age, it said. Should it be necessary, the person could be arrested for further investigations. But this will depend on the extent of radicalisation, and the risk and potential threat the person poses.
What are the community efforts or options to go to if one suspect one's family member is being radicalized?
- what help could be given?
The article fails to describe if any of the community / religious teacher's offered to help. Could the religious community step in or did they offer to help?
In jail, could he not be radicalized further? Out in 20 years, he would be in his 40s or younger.
Counselling or rehabilitation programmes could tailored to the person's specific circumstances, including age, it said. Should it be necessary, the person could be arrested for further investigations. But this will depend on the extent of radicalisation, and the risk and potential threat the person poses.
We really need to figure out how to prevent and deal with radicalization, without trashing human rights. Freedom of speech and thought is part of what makes our society what it is, and to compromise in order to prevent terrorism defeats us. That's how terrorism works. Having just read about the FBIs shenanigans during the 60s, 70s, and after going after "subversives" like the American Indian Movement and the Black Panthers, not to mention McCarthyism before that, I do not trust that the FBI is the right tool for the job. They can be trusted only to be heavy-handed when on a self-defined holy crusade, and to disregard civil rights and liberties while accomplishing little.
3
An awful lot of free speakers take it very badly when another free speaker points out how they revealed themselves to be fools with it.
Irresponsible article to print. How many parents will now not do what this father did and perhaps allow an untold amount of innocent people to die? The article could have been written in a more balanced way and had a more balanced conclusion. Even though he may regret this decision now, how would he have felt if hundreds of innocent people died because he did nothing? Sometimes a hard decision is not the preferred decision, you may even regret it once it is made, but the right decision is always the better decision - and it takes extreme courage to make it.
8
The reason intelligent and idealistic kids like this one get involved with terrorist groups is easy to understand. It is because the US Government and its allies are slaughtering millions of hapless Muslims. The see us as their enemy and they are right. If we really want to end terrorism let's stop killing them.
3
It seems to me that Assad has been busy killing lots of Muslims in Syria and dictators and fanatics have been doing the same in at least half a dozen other Muslim countries.
1
In Syria it was us and our allies that armed the opposition and sent foreign fighters in to enable a civil war, and we did it for our own purposes. Assad is a dictator but like Sadaam he killed relatively few, compared to the general slaughter that came later. If Asaad had fallen the chaos would have gotten even worse.
We don't care what happens to these people and they know it. We are interested in oil or bases or pipelines.
We don't care what happens to these people and they know it. We are interested in oil or bases or pipelines.
1
I too have mixed feelings, but in the end, I have two thoughts: Mr. Shafir has saved his son's life, for there is a great chance his son would have ultimately died in a terrorist cause & secondly, if every parent the world-over did this, there would be far fewer terrorists,& less innocent deaths from attacks. On the flip side, an intervention program is long overdue. Placing these ' may be' recruits into the prison population makes absolutely no sense,& placing them w/ others of the same ilk makes no sense either. It is a knotty issue, fraught w/ dangerous consequences. And...what about this young man's impressionable siblings? Finally, why not take these would-be sympathizers to sites like the Brussels airport or the Paris tragedies immediately after and let them see the horror. Maybe then they might consider working for peace.
4
"Back home in California, Mr. Shafi's lawyer ordered him not to talk to the F.B.I." Surely, this lawyer was consulted for a reason, presumably including knowledge and experience. He might have gotten closer to his long term goal for the young man if he had heeded his lawyer's advice. Mr. Shafi was right to be concerned for his son, and for his country, but the job of law enforcement is to enforce the law. Mental and emotional health issues have nothing to do with that; so, calling the law will almost always end badly for families thinking they have called a social worker when they have actually called the "police."
4
Maybe the father, himself seemingly a devout Muslim, could have gone to the local imam at his local mosque for advice first. Assuming that that man is against suicide bombings as a means of helping "his people", that imam could have rallied some like-minded Muslims to do an "intervention".
3
Unfortunately the article doesn't say what the charges are. But when it quotes the prosecutors as saying "his son was simply too dangerous to remain free" it looks like preventative detention, which means that the Constitution has been totally overthrown and none of us is safe. The terrorists have won. We are so terrified we have given up the rule of law.
6
26000 foreign fighters/murderers are in Syria. We can no longer take any chances with deranged Muslims who get emotional over the mass slaughter of their brethren in the Middle East. Too many come back to the USA and Europe to turn into mass murderers.
3
Could he have just been placed under surveillance rather than in prison? If he wasn't a committed terrorist before spending a lifetime in prison I would bet he will be when he gets out!
2
Theres a very telling part in this story where Mr Shafi says, "I've never dealt with law enforcement before...I'm naive..." Whats telling about this, is that far too many people are under the misguided notion that US law enforcement agencies are concerned with doing the right, just and ethical thing in such cases. That if a young man is just doing what young men do, explore and maybe get too close to danger, that the agents will see that and act properly with the best interest of the person in question. Thats not what most agents are concerned with. They want arrests and fast. They want them for their careers, and they want them because its truly all they are taught to do.
There has to be some middle ground with these cases. As there is in many cities now (woefully underfunded by the States and Fed Govt) that deal with intervention among those most prone to joining violent criminal gangs. Outreach programs that seek to get to young men, and now women, from seeing gang-life as a viable life-style. Where former gang-members, social workers and churches, etc, work quickly to intervene with high risk youth.
These programs are seeing success, and could see more if our elected officials would get off their incarceration addiction. But regretfully we live in a society where prison is seen as the only solution to far too many problems and where intervention programs are seen as coddling and too costly.
Whats too costly is that we're literally abandoning our youth!
There has to be some middle ground with these cases. As there is in many cities now (woefully underfunded by the States and Fed Govt) that deal with intervention among those most prone to joining violent criminal gangs. Outreach programs that seek to get to young men, and now women, from seeing gang-life as a viable life-style. Where former gang-members, social workers and churches, etc, work quickly to intervene with high risk youth.
These programs are seeing success, and could see more if our elected officials would get off their incarceration addiction. But regretfully we live in a society where prison is seen as the only solution to far too many problems and where intervention programs are seen as coddling and too costly.
Whats too costly is that we're literally abandoning our youth!
36
Sorry BoRegard, but you could not be more wrong in your comment that a young man will do what young men do.
There is not a young man alive in our country today who does not understand that terrorists are barbarians who defile, oppress and slaughter innocents.
There is not a young man alive in our country today who does not know that criminal gangs are thugs who target and prey upon the weak and unprotected among us.
Both forms of predators, terrorists and gangbangers have chosen (key word = chosen) to inflict pain and anguish on innocent people. Society cannot afford to allow them to gradually see the error of their ways; we cannot afford it ethically or financially.
Imprisoning terrorists or gangbangers is not abandoning our youth. It is protecting our youth and everyone else from predators without conscience.
There is not a young man alive in our country today who does not understand that terrorists are barbarians who defile, oppress and slaughter innocents.
There is not a young man alive in our country today who does not know that criminal gangs are thugs who target and prey upon the weak and unprotected among us.
Both forms of predators, terrorists and gangbangers have chosen (key word = chosen) to inflict pain and anguish on innocent people. Society cannot afford to allow them to gradually see the error of their ways; we cannot afford it ethically or financially.
Imprisoning terrorists or gangbangers is not abandoning our youth. It is protecting our youth and everyone else from predators without conscience.
2
I don't see how anyone could not feel for the father. Hard for a parent (especially middle class or higher) to think a child who is raised to believe otherwise might end up a murderer. The story gets to the nature of how powerful the message radical Islam is to young Muslims. The question is for those responsible to execute the war on terror is how to fight this message. Perhaps the young man needed to be in jail but was 20 years necessary? If the government expects family members to be government informants they need to find a way to get the Muslim community to participate. As a father and having read this story I probably would have called the police. 20 years is better than innocent people being murdered and your son (or daughter) spending life in federal jail.
20
"...Hard for a parent (especially middle class or higher) to think a child who is raised to believe otherwise might end up a murderer..."
There is no reason to believe the child was raised to 'believe otherwise', except for the father insisting it was not his fault.
There is no reason to believe the child was raised to 'believe otherwise', except for the father insisting it was not his fault.
Why especially middle class and upper? Surely you do not think that the poor have less than full lives. Surely you do not think there is a weaker bond between parent and child where there is poverty.
As a licensed masters level social worker, I am perplexed that civil libertarians and law enforcement hesitant to mix social work tasks with those of law enforcement. At least on the local level, that is already happening, or at least efforts made to encourage it, in many communities. I was a part of those efforts when I worked in at an incest family treatment center where we build relationships with families referred by child welfare, juvenile justice, and family and criminal courts. I interacted with those systems regularly. Our work relied heavily on building relationships, and focused on understand family dynamics, risk, prevention and learning new skills and behaviors. And some families still regret reporting but individuals and families are being asked to change. I can't imagine it would be much different for families struggling to intervene with an teenager or adult children drawn toward terrorist groups.
The marriage of social work and law enforcement, also happens in less obvious ways. I see it at community events, when a group of kids surrounds of cops on bicycles with admiring questions about their cool bikes and gear. Sometimes the cops are also passing out free helmet and bike lights, and I never fail to see smiles, laughter and understanding. We need to embrace that and figure out how to do more of it.
The marriage of social work and law enforcement, also happens in less obvious ways. I see it at community events, when a group of kids surrounds of cops on bicycles with admiring questions about their cool bikes and gear. Sometimes the cops are also passing out free helmet and bike lights, and I never fail to see smiles, laughter and understanding. We need to embrace that and figure out how to do more of it.
What a sad, heartbreaking story.
2
Mr. Shafi deserves respect for what he did. But blaming the Govt is wrong. He needs to acknowledge why his son went on a potentially violent path. It has to do with the acceptance of Jihad among Muslims. Muslims the world over are silent, as this parent is, when it comes to ending Jihad. Against their silence, leading clerics say it is a religious duty, and apologists try to hide it's violent nature by saying Jihad is a struggle against ones self.
Ironic, that Muslims did not do this type of Jihad, where Muslims from the world over come to help liberate a territory, until Ronald Reagan and the CIA taught them how to do it. And now the FBI has to clean up the mess.
Ironic, that Muslims did not do this type of Jihad, where Muslims from the world over come to help liberate a territory, until Ronald Reagan and the CIA taught them how to do it. And now the FBI has to clean up the mess.
2
I hope Mr. Shafi reads this. You should not berate yourself; you are a good father who tried to do the right thing. This shows a huge failing in our system. People are jailed, shot by the police, when there should be alternative methods, eg. people trained to deal with radicalization, mental illness. We have a Draconian system in this country which needs to be changed!
5
No good answers here. But one thought occurs to me: Isn't it better to see your son in a jail cell than in a suicide vest?
2
Of course go to the government... how many lives have been saved as well as Adam's? Dead and forever despised or alive and jailed?
3
He remembers his son’s response. “He said, ‘You wouldn’t have let me go.’ Which is true. You say you’re going to visit refugees by yourself? Hell no.”
This sentence shows the love Mr. Shafi has for his son. He didn't want his son to visit refugees by himself. As in alone. You can feel the love and concern.
This sentence shows the love Mr. Shafi has for his son. He didn't want his son to visit refugees by himself. As in alone. You can feel the love and concern.
2
Talk about being caught between a "rock and hard place". As a parent you feel very sorry for Mr Shafi. He did all the "right" things as a US citizen and now his son is in prison. The only "good" and it is purely imaginary, is that no innocent civilian was blown up or killed in the outcome. Again this is purely imagined. I wonder if Mr Shafi had followed his lawyer's advice and gone thru his lawyer, would his son still be in prison?
1
This article does not tell us much about the son and the unfolding of the events. I understand that the story is about the father, but knowing what happened and the timeline would help us understand better. The father reported Adam's disappearance in August 2014. Adam was interrogated by the FBI and his phone under surveillance for almost a year (he was arrested in June 2015). Although he knew that he was investigated, it did not deter him at all. Had this just been an juvenile infatuation with jihad, it would be reasonable to assume that Adam should have been scared enough to stop. In fact, he continued with his plans. This was not just a brief phase in his life. I think the father did the right thing and it took enormous courage to do it; however, the FBI did not act in a rushed way in this case. Adam had almost a year to walk back from his mistakes. I understand that the father didn't know how to stop his son (as an adult Adam could not be committed for an "intervention"), except talking to his son and hoping that he'd change back to be his old self, once scared enough. But that did not work. Also, the article should make it clear that 20 years in the maximum sentence; most likely Adam will be sentenced to a much lower time, as his actions have not resulted in anyone's direct harm. But assisting a terrorist organization is a crime-as it should be- and Adam had been plenty of warnings. But I feel for the choice the father had to make. It was the right one.
6
Mr. Shafi - You did the right thing. Your son will be out in 10 years or less, and he will be alive. The path he was on would have led to his death, and likely the death of many others as well.
3
I see a pattern here. Criminalization of Immigrant youth and African American youth. Could it be that the racism and isolation these youngsters face in schools and their communities be a factor in causing the mental disorders that skew them in their youth? America is a melting pot of all the cultures in the world , yet the mainstream American society prefers to keep all these people on the fringes. I know many Chrsitian immigrants who are active in their churches for many years, and yet not welcomed by the mainstream Americans who are fellow church leaders and members beyond a polite smile or hello. So we can imagine what children of different faiths and cultures are facing in schools.
1
Sorry, but your theory cannot be substantiated with facts. This kid has a wealthy family with all the advantages of the 1%. Most of those radicalized fit the same description - privileged, educated, and loved.
1
As a parent, I feel the agony of Mr. Shafi's guilt and horror. But I wonder, how would he feel if his son had become a suicide bomber and killed hundreds of innocent adults and children because he had not gone to the authorities. Clearly he would have been far more pained to know he might have averted such an atrocity if only he'd have reported it to the government. It is a no-win situation and I sympathize with Mr. Shafi's loss of his son. He made the right decision. Adam Shafi was clearly on the path to murdering people and no one was going to deter him from his goals of "spilled blood for Allah." I am gravely sorry for Adam as he is young and had his whole life ahead of him. He made a terrible choice and now must face the consequences. One lost son does not make up for the sons and daughters and mother and fathers and children who have died because of terrorism.
3
We need an intensive intervention program for young people who have been swayed by terrorists, before it is too late. Mr Shafi should not be feeling as if he betrayed his son by doing the right thing and turning him in. But our government, while trying to keep us safe, should also not be giving up on him. So long as a recruit is still just a recruit, and hasn't engaged in any attacks, I do believe they are worth trying to salvage. Think of it as an intensive intervention similar to what is used to remove people from cults, with serious consequences if it fails.
4
A 22 year old is not a "child" and law enforcement is not the "enemy."
As a culture we have long gone down the road of excusing every criminal action by a youth as merely the unfortunate product of their social environment, and relieving them of any individual responsibility for their actions. It's society that's really to blame, not the "child!"
Likewise, the drumbeat of propaganda has been to villainize law enforcement out of all proportion to any real and systemtic problem. Discussing real systemic problem, i.e., 3% of the African-American male population being responsible for over 50% of all murders and almost 60% of all violent crime, on the other hand, is verboten.
The police is not our enemy, and no one older than 18 years old is not a child (unless they have a medical problem). If we do not straighten out our perspective, we'll be reaping the whirlwind sooner rather than later.
As a culture we have long gone down the road of excusing every criminal action by a youth as merely the unfortunate product of their social environment, and relieving them of any individual responsibility for their actions. It's society that's really to blame, not the "child!"
Likewise, the drumbeat of propaganda has been to villainize law enforcement out of all proportion to any real and systemtic problem. Discussing real systemic problem, i.e., 3% of the African-American male population being responsible for over 50% of all murders and almost 60% of all violent crime, on the other hand, is verboten.
The police is not our enemy, and no one older than 18 years old is not a child (unless they have a medical problem). If we do not straighten out our perspective, we'll be reaping the whirlwind sooner rather than later.
45
your first sentence summed it nicely
1
I disagree with much of this comment. A 22 year old is legally an adult, but the vast majority are still far from completely matured abd still benefit from things like parental assistance and guidance.
2
There is a comment by a commenter (Shah) which caught my eye. "Teach them what Islam is. The Truth." Therein lies your problem. Do non muslims who never come in contact with Islam ever go to go to Syria to kill infidels and non believers? Never. The issue is that there is enough justification for violent Jihad in Islam. We need to start believing that people willing to die for an ideology probably do so because the ideology does indeed legitimize terrorism. Muslims believe that their Prophet created a golden age and was a model citizen for humanity. With this belief in place what is a young impressionable mind to do when he reads about all the military exploits of the Prophet. There is a list of military expeditions of the Prophet on wikipedia (link below). The list is so long that just to scroll through the entire list takes a few minutes. There are stories of entire tribes captured and every adult executed and the women taken as sex slaves. Or a poet assassinated for mocking the Prophet. These are exactly the things ISIS is trying to recreate in all honesty.
Here is the related article:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_expeditions_of_Muhammad
Here is the related article:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_expeditions_of_Muhammad
13
For most of Christianity's existence, non-believers have been killed in the name of the Lord, based on Scripture. The divergence between the two religions is based more on economics than anything - more recent Judeo-Christian societies have had economies that share the wealth and there are usually opportunities for the poor and down-trodden. However, in much of the Muslim world, there is hopelessness and powerlessness in many of the unemployed young men, which can lead to radicalization. If Christianity was the dominant religion in the Arab world, they would still be killing people in the name of the Lord based on scripture.
2
" There are stories of entire tribes captured and every adult executed and the women taken as sex slaves."
If Islam has the goal of a world wide Caliphate they should keep in mind that the non-Islamic world has more than enough nuclear weapons to wipe Islam off the face of the earth
If Islam has the goal of a world wide Caliphate they should keep in mind that the non-Islamic world has more than enough nuclear weapons to wipe Islam off the face of the earth
1
There are 3 people who made mistakes.
1) The Kid; Made the mistake of going over to a known gateway zone, without properly informing anyone of his exact intentions, and on his own, not with a legitimate, or making a legitimate, organization, to do what he wanted to accomplish while there.
2) The Father; by taking a laid back position during a time period where there are silenced calls to reforms of Islam. He needed to step up and involve himself more in his son's interests and concerns, and by involved, I mean participating with his son in some of the local activities that were taking place. He would have known better, and had been in a position to know to direct his son to a better way of going over to Turkey to see the refugees.
3) The Government; Though I agree that some jail time is necessary, I wholly disagree with the term of the sentence. He should not be spending 20 years in prison, but I could see 6 months with chance of parole with good behaviour in 2 months. It needs to be impressed strongly on the boy that to go un-escorted to such places is a very bad idea, yes.
Never say "Don't go to the government!", instead, you should be making sure that the "de-radicalization program" actually gets put in place, and you do need to go to the government and lobby in order to put it in place.
1) The Kid; Made the mistake of going over to a known gateway zone, without properly informing anyone of his exact intentions, and on his own, not with a legitimate, or making a legitimate, organization, to do what he wanted to accomplish while there.
2) The Father; by taking a laid back position during a time period where there are silenced calls to reforms of Islam. He needed to step up and involve himself more in his son's interests and concerns, and by involved, I mean participating with his son in some of the local activities that were taking place. He would have known better, and had been in a position to know to direct his son to a better way of going over to Turkey to see the refugees.
3) The Government; Though I agree that some jail time is necessary, I wholly disagree with the term of the sentence. He should not be spending 20 years in prison, but I could see 6 months with chance of parole with good behaviour in 2 months. It needs to be impressed strongly on the boy that to go un-escorted to such places is a very bad idea, yes.
Never say "Don't go to the government!", instead, you should be making sure that the "de-radicalization program" actually gets put in place, and you do need to go to the government and lobby in order to put it in place.
5
It depends on what the kid actually did. Pure thought crimes are still unconstitutional in America.
An intervention group should be set up by the mosques. Perhaps the mosques could set up ways to help the refugees. The FBI cannot be expected to do anything except law enforcement.
People should be allowed to go to IS if they want to. But, we should make it clear that anyone who has gone to Syria will be stripped of their US citizenship and cannot come back. Another approach would be to revoke the passport of anyone trying to reach Syria.
People should be allowed to go to IS if they want to. But, we should make it clear that anyone who has gone to Syria will be stripped of their US citizenship and cannot come back. Another approach would be to revoke the passport of anyone trying to reach Syria.
5
My heart aches for Sal Shafi, his wife and daughter. As a father, I can only imagine the struggle between his moral conscience and his love for his son. As painful as the choice may have been, Mr Shafi made the morally correct decision.
Try as we might, we can only guide our children, but at some point, they become adults and make their own choices. In the case of Adam Shafi, his choice to support the barbarians who murder innocents in the name of some cleric's interpretation of god's will speaks for itself.
Adam Shafi needs to be locked away for the safety of innocents as well as for the future of Muslims who wish to live in peace with their fellow men. The gravest threat to Muslims today are their own religious fanatics who believe they have the duty to enslave, to oppress, to mutilate and to kill those who do not conform to their nilistic and soul less dogma.
Sal Shafi did the right thing as a moral human being. That doesn't undo the pain, but it does earn him the gratitude of thinking people who actually care.
Try as we might, we can only guide our children, but at some point, they become adults and make their own choices. In the case of Adam Shafi, his choice to support the barbarians who murder innocents in the name of some cleric's interpretation of god's will speaks for itself.
Adam Shafi needs to be locked away for the safety of innocents as well as for the future of Muslims who wish to live in peace with their fellow men. The gravest threat to Muslims today are their own religious fanatics who believe they have the duty to enslave, to oppress, to mutilate and to kill those who do not conform to their nilistic and soul less dogma.
Sal Shafi did the right thing as a moral human being. That doesn't undo the pain, but it does earn him the gratitude of thinking people who actually care.
68
Mr. Sal Shari would, I suspect, feel much greater remorse if Adam were to have "spilled gallons of blood."
I agree with the desire to develop a way to counter the brainwashing with some community based program. My question is, what will this 22 year old learn in jail? Who will he pay attention to in there? And, is there a parallel to parents struggling to keep their children away from serious drugs? Can one learn from the other?
4
"The process has shaken Mr. Shafi’s faith, both in his decisions as a parent and in his government". We've all heard of Apple's defiance of the FBI's request for access to the terrorist's cell phone. So might the values of the private corporation with the world's biggest capitalization - Apple, HQd in Silicon Valley - affect the relationship between a Silicon Valley executive of 62 and his now working-age son? It’s a provocative question, but my experience compels me to consider it.
Corporate executive life places huge strain on families. Everyone has difficulty reconciling typical organizational values with personal ones. Because the Shafi case is so heart-wrenching and points to so much of what, in my opinion, desperately needs adjusting in westernized and westernizing societies, I think it worth setting out here the 8 values I work at advancing in both the personal and the work segments of my life. These values work for me and they now work also for three companies I have coached. Additional values suited to the circumstances of each particular home and each particular ‘workplace’ are needed, but the following eight have proven to work in enhancing life in both: Honesty, Verbal Integrity, Empathy, Accuracy, Clarity, Courage, Discretion, Coherence. Of course, I’m still working at them and of course my clients are too. But no one in my circle now disagrees with the definitions we’ve collaboratively worked out for each of the 8, nor with the benefits of aspiring to keep them
Corporate executive life places huge strain on families. Everyone has difficulty reconciling typical organizational values with personal ones. Because the Shafi case is so heart-wrenching and points to so much of what, in my opinion, desperately needs adjusting in westernized and westernizing societies, I think it worth setting out here the 8 values I work at advancing in both the personal and the work segments of my life. These values work for me and they now work also for three companies I have coached. Additional values suited to the circumstances of each particular home and each particular ‘workplace’ are needed, but the following eight have proven to work in enhancing life in both: Honesty, Verbal Integrity, Empathy, Accuracy, Clarity, Courage, Discretion, Coherence. Of course, I’m still working at them and of course my clients are too. But no one in my circle now disagrees with the definitions we’ve collaboratively worked out for each of the 8, nor with the benefits of aspiring to keep them
There was one line in this article, almost a throwaway, easy to overlook, which described Adam Sahfi's tearful response to media images and stories about the conflict in Syria. He had a longstanding interest in the homeless and refugees. If what he said about wanting to spill blood is true, then the difference between his work with the homeless and his supposed radicalization would seem to lie largely with the media and how it influenced his emotions. We don't see constant images of the homeless, ill and uninsured, or desperately poor in the media, daily, over and over.
I don't mean to say there should be no coverage of any of these people. In fact, I think awareness of their plight is vital for understanding, for charity, for political awareness and voting. But there is not only a media bias towards foreign wars vs. conditions in our own neighborhoods, but also perhaps something about the kind of coverage or the commentary (what news source was Adam relying on?) that made the difference for this young man.
I don't mean to say there should be no coverage of any of these people. In fact, I think awareness of their plight is vital for understanding, for charity, for political awareness and voting. But there is not only a media bias towards foreign wars vs. conditions in our own neighborhoods, but also perhaps something about the kind of coverage or the commentary (what news source was Adam relying on?) that made the difference for this young man.
1
Would Mr. Shafi feel any better if his son actually went to Syria and was killed, or injured or captured? Or if he chose to become a suicide bomber and killed and injured many other people along with himself?
8
I applaud Mr. Shafi's courage informing the government of his son's activities although I realize what intense pain such a decision must have been personally to him and his family. I wish more family members came forward like this, especially people like the mother of the Belgium/France terrorists. Sometimes parents and family need to make sacrifices for the greater good of society and not get swayed by parental love. I am not saying this will not be horribly painful and hard and extremely difficult, but it will prevent great societal harm which these radicalized young people in their mistaken views of Islam are doing. In the long run, actions like Mr. Shafi will protect Islam from being hijacked by these radicalized terrorists who say they are acting in the name of their religion.
39
In the end, this parent has decided that, should he choose again, he would choose to shield his son rather than going to the government (again). That says a lot about what his own community at large would do.
1
Mr. Shafi, apparently, doesn't realize that he saved his son's life and probably the lives of an unknown number of innocent people. His regrets at having done so are unfortunate, if not shameful.
When someone is attracted to the obscenity that is radical Islam, this is little room for negotiation and little hope for redemption.
When someone is attracted to the obscenity that is radical Islam, this is little room for negotiation and little hope for redemption.
11
What an incredibly brave, admirable man. He tried everything he could to help his son and help his country. He even wanted to set up a program for such difficult situations. Such strength and integrity are rare.
I wish the very best for Mr. Shafi, his son, and his whole family.
Thank you for sharing.
I wish the very best for Mr. Shafi, his son, and his whole family.
Thank you for sharing.
13
It is mind-boggling that someone living with all the benefits provided by America would turn to psychopaths as mentors and feel more of a connection with random Syrians than with his own countrymen (and women). No doubt he needs to be re-educated. Prison is most likely not the best option. Perhaps a mental institution would be more appropriate. Perhaps giving parents the option to have children committed would be a softer first step that the FBI could offer. Doctors could then utilize a special regimen of drugs and counseling to turn these boys back (or else keep them detained if they don't).
1
More articles like this--refreshingly profound; about Americans with no name recognition--and fewer about megalomaniacs such as Donald Trump, please!
6
Did Adam Shari actually contact terrorist groups or was he contacted by terrorist groups? Did he purchase any weapons? I don't know about Caucasian in the US. I am originally from China. I grew up knowing something you just can't say. It seems 2nd generation immigrants are losing touch.
Good question! If the govt can't prove he contacted terrs, I shd think he'd be acquitted. I hope he is. & I hope the govt keeps a close watch on him afterward.
The Western world is adopting Eastern crime fighting ideology. Legalism, a school of thought accredited to ancient Chinese philosopher, Han Fei, promotes over punishing crimes to deter others from committing the crime. It is by far the most effective method of social control, however it is an antithesis of the Eighth Amendment. How did the Western World allowed such weak forces like religious radicalization to pose such a big threat? Is Islamic radicals such a big threat as to force us to compromise our founding ideals?
heartbreaking decisions like Mr. Shafi's to notify the authorities of his son's political leanings must have a more gradient, thoughtful response by law enforcement. how many times did I as a teenager cook up dramatic schemes in my head? I hope the son gets the care and counseling he needs.
6
Sal, you did the right thing. As hard as it is to know that your son is suffering in solitary confinement, think about what could have happened if you hadn't intervened. If he carried out a terrorist attack, he could have died in the process and if not, would end up in jail anyway. He would end up in the same situation. I believe that your actions kept your son from becoming a murderer. How would you feel if you didn't stop him and he went on to commit a terrorist act, killing many innocent people? That would be a heavier burden. Thank you for doing the right thing. Don't give up hope. We need to find a way to keep kids from becoming radicalized and to de-radicalize them. In the meantime, we can't take the risk that they will do something they'll regret.
18
Pardon my paranoia but please be aware that this comment section is a likely target by over zealous law enforcement agencies.
The point of the article is that you cannot trust the judgment of government agents. The paranoid and suspicious environment they work within can easily lead to poor judgment calls.
Bonne chance!
The point of the article is that you cannot trust the judgment of government agents. The paranoid and suspicious environment they work within can easily lead to poor judgment calls.
Bonne chance!
11
Exactly Michael. And individual agents enhance their own careers at the expense of the arrestees.
1
Yes it is sad that this young man faces 20 years in prison. However, he is alive and no other people have been killed as a result of his actions.
16
I feel sorry for the parent but the government should have left the son go but made sure he never came back.
These young men (and women) who join Al Queda one ISIS aren't going to summer camp they know what they are joining. I have no sympathy for them.
These young men (and women) who join Al Queda one ISIS aren't going to summer camp they know what they are joining. I have no sympathy for them.
13
Muslim parents find their kids drawn to ISIS wanting to kill Americans on a large organized scale....the rest of us can easily find our kids with guns or weapons willing to kill Americans on a smaller scale....more localized and personalized crime. Neither set willingly wants to pull the trigger on their kids by calling them into the authorities. Muslim parents have more pressure to contact the FBI....whereas if we find our son with a gun in his drawer, it wouldn't dawn on us to do the same
8
How's it a hard decision at all. This man did the right thing, unlike many other cowardly individuals. If you know someone is planning to commit mass murder, you stop them, regardless of who it is.
17
The difficulty lies in deciding what constitutes "planning." And in determining whether helping to relieve the misery of refugees in Turkey, which may be motivated by religious feelings (or not), constitutes supporting terrorists.
It may be correct for the FBI to err on the side of caution, but we should be aware that mistakes will be made if we don't have, fund, and follow good procedures.
And many who read this article and find themselves in similar situations will come to the opposite conclusion: Work it out with the family member and protect them from going to jail for thought and private speech that has not become action. "Our son is stupid but not criminal. How's it a hard decision at all?"
I, for one, would find it gut-wrenching.
It may be correct for the FBI to err on the side of caution, but we should be aware that mistakes will be made if we don't have, fund, and follow good procedures.
And many who read this article and find themselves in similar situations will come to the opposite conclusion: Work it out with the family member and protect them from going to jail for thought and private speech that has not become action. "Our son is stupid but not criminal. How's it a hard decision at all?"
I, for one, would find it gut-wrenching.
1
I am struck that this father was so "protective" that he had tracking software installed on his children's phones. There are so many ways this is a bad idea. It's disrespectful of the children, it treats them like animals, it is very controlling, it is arrogant, it is powerful, it is a misuse of the technology, it is definitely not parenting. I am also struck by the fact that Adam is over 18...well over. Nevertheless, the father called the American Embassy when told that Adam had gone to Turkey. Note to father: Adam is over 18, an thus an adult. Adam's being right about "you wouldn't have let me go" is a very sad statement..because he shouldn't have had to ask. Adam is allowed by his majority to go whereever he wants, without parental approval. It occurs to me that Mr. Shafi's error was not in calling the FBI, but in trying to raise an obedient adult rather than and independent and well-functioning one.
11
I've got news for you--you are being tracked all the time on a modern cell phone.
Do you feel disrespected, treated like an animal, controlled by an arrogant, powerful government that is misusing the technology, and definitely not to protect you? Welcome to the other 321,000,000 of us--in the USA alone. Now, what will you do about it?
Do you feel disrespected, treated like an animal, controlled by an arrogant, powerful government that is misusing the technology, and definitely not to protect you? Welcome to the other 321,000,000 of us--in the USA alone. Now, what will you do about it?
1
maybe the alternative would have been the father explaining to the grieving families of Adams victims why he didn't drop a dime on his radicalized son before he had blood on his hands.
1
How did this father "miuse" the tehcnology? What do you think those programs are for? Adam was not 22 when this started, and probably not when he went to Turkey. Do you have children over 16 or are you a 20-something? This man has 5 children and sounds like a stand-up citizen and excellent father, only too trusting of the government.
1
Proof that ISIS (or Trump) can attract the unsuspecting is evident in some of the comments here. When people are searching for truth and meaning, there will always be a charlatan or a demagogue who will promise to make everything great again if only you stop thinking and follow them.
What this article shows is that we are all like that. Even in smart, rich America, we offer no "right" alternative to "wrong."
What this article shows is that we are all like that. Even in smart, rich America, we offer no "right" alternative to "wrong."
2
In my view, there is no need to write a column that poses a problem for young people.
As humans, even with little or no parenting, we know the basic difference between right and wrong. All the other arguments are put on.
As humans, even with little or no parenting, we know the basic difference between right and wrong. All the other arguments are put on.
5
Had the father done nothing, it's likely that his son would have died in Syria or Iraq or in a police shoot-out at home or would have been discovered and prosecuted without his father's help. He simply cannot protect his son.
6
My heart goes out to Mr. Shafi, who only wanted to help his son like any father would. Adam appeared to lose his way, but it's possible he could have been helped, as his father pleaded for the government to do. Adam could have been a great example of how the government can help the parents of children that might be radicalized. Instead, they only made it more likely that others will decide not to come forward with information about suspicions they may have about their own family members.
65
The point of this article is there are no good options for parents who suspect their children are being radicalized. Report them to the authorities, and they are slapped with 20 years; don't, and they may become the next marathon bomber, die in Syria, or if female, married to an ISIS fighter.
Radicalization is mental illness, clearly. Treatment must be developed, in concert with the Muslim community, to deprogram converts. To be sure, this raises civil liberty concerns. The de-programmers who broke people's attachment to the Moonies, did so outside the law. They held their captives against their will for days, until the job was done, which is kidnapping, But given the clear danger of Islamism, legal provision must be made.
Radicalization is mental illness, clearly. Treatment must be developed, in concert with the Muslim community, to deprogram converts. To be sure, this raises civil liberty concerns. The de-programmers who broke people's attachment to the Moonies, did so outside the law. They held their captives against their will for days, until the job was done, which is kidnapping, But given the clear danger of Islamism, legal provision must be made.
7
You could say the same things about other's beliefs, from radical Christianity to radical Capitalism, which less directly, kills thousands or more every year. Who is to decide? And the other thing, those kids have more choices than going to Syria, or becoming violent, and they might chose to exercise them, especially given more information. I doubt it is as clear cut as going to Syria or 20-years in jail.
The attacks on religion are a red herring...what is really missing from this young man's life is a sense of community and purpose, which we all innately desire but the secular western "religion" of consumerism and self-absorption cannot provide. Both religion and secular belief can fulfill this desire in positive and negative ways.
41
I wouldn't be so quick to dismiss religion as a minor player in this tragedy, nor the western secularism that also gave him affluence, choice and dignity.
I do consider the effects of dark Internet communities and a lack of critical thinking skill on the part of this young man to understand this outcome.
I do consider the effects of dark Internet communities and a lack of critical thinking skill on the part of this young man to understand this outcome.
1
You're wrong on that count, that this young man lacks "community and purpose." He found his, in the community of ISIS and the purpose of establishing a caliphate. He grew up in US, and purposely rejects the community and purpose in the western society. So much for that.
1
This heartbreaking and frightening story illustrates many points.
Radicalization is contagious and spreads like an infection.( A meme, spread from mind to mind, accelerated by global communication.) Susceptibility to this infection is unpredictable using common sense metrics like "a good home". The "Natural History" (course of the untreated illness) is not known making it impossible to predict if the individual will act on the constructive impulses manifested e.g. sandwiches for the homeless, or the destructive impulses e.g. spilling gallons of blood. There is no established treatment or prevention.
Answering these questions is not the job of the FBI. Local entities are unlikely to have the resources to tackle a problem that is this complex. It seems like the scientific/epidemiological tools of the CDC would have a lot to offer in the analysis of this "infection" that threatens civilization.
Radicalization is contagious and spreads like an infection.( A meme, spread from mind to mind, accelerated by global communication.) Susceptibility to this infection is unpredictable using common sense metrics like "a good home". The "Natural History" (course of the untreated illness) is not known making it impossible to predict if the individual will act on the constructive impulses manifested e.g. sandwiches for the homeless, or the destructive impulses e.g. spilling gallons of blood. There is no established treatment or prevention.
Answering these questions is not the job of the FBI. Local entities are unlikely to have the resources to tackle a problem that is this complex. It seems like the scientific/epidemiological tools of the CDC would have a lot to offer in the analysis of this "infection" that threatens civilization.
5
I don't mean to sound cynical, but I wouldn't be surprised that pretty soon AMA would classify the weak-minded, impressionable people who succumb to radical religious belief as yet another "disorder" or "syndrome." Afterall, wouldn't it be nice to blame it on "mental illness" for someone who turn to religious belief to justify their terrorist acts? Isn't it much easier to say, it's not my son who did it because he's just sick, he has "mental issues" and then he can go free, if only there's some magic pills that can "cure" him into thinking straight away. I'm getting really tired of arguments like these.
8
Yeah, and people with mental illnesses "get really tired" of their suffering. Not that budding terrorists are necessarily mentally ill. I sense another agenda in these comments.
Unfortunately, what's reported here may well stop other worried parents from notifying authorities, as Mr. Shafi did. I hope not as law enforcement is not set up to do "interventions" but, rather, to enforce the law - so I'm unsure what Mr. Shafi expected to happen, but he's clearly feeling overwhelming guilt.
I can only ask him to consider what could have happened had his son committed a bad act and people were hurt or killed. He did the right thing, albeit naively, and I hope he has some peace knowing that, at least, his son is alive versus the end result of some irrational act of martyrdom.
Hard choices? Indeed, for any father. But there is no question he did what was right for society and, ultimately, his son.
I can only ask him to consider what could have happened had his son committed a bad act and people were hurt or killed. He did the right thing, albeit naively, and I hope he has some peace knowing that, at least, his son is alive versus the end result of some irrational act of martyrdom.
Hard choices? Indeed, for any father. But there is no question he did what was right for society and, ultimately, his son.
14
How many parents are now going to report their children to the government now?
So many of these disillusioned young people come from families who have largely assimilated into our culture, "don't do bad things", the extent of the practicing dogma. Young people are looking for something larger than themselves to believe in. Religion, drugs, rebellion, radicalization fills the void. By all means, intervene. Take them away from the danger of harming other people, but do something else besides throwing them in prison which will only further their radicalization.
They have been programmed at a crucial time in their life. There has to be at least an attempt made to deprogram them. If we can't stomach the idea that we should be that kind to young people like this, then let the motivation come from a sense of our own self preservation. We have already discovered that throwing vast numbers of the disaffected into jail is counter productive. How is this helping?
So many of these disillusioned young people come from families who have largely assimilated into our culture, "don't do bad things", the extent of the practicing dogma. Young people are looking for something larger than themselves to believe in. Religion, drugs, rebellion, radicalization fills the void. By all means, intervene. Take them away from the danger of harming other people, but do something else besides throwing them in prison which will only further their radicalization.
They have been programmed at a crucial time in their life. There has to be at least an attempt made to deprogram them. If we can't stomach the idea that we should be that kind to young people like this, then let the motivation come from a sense of our own self preservation. We have already discovered that throwing vast numbers of the disaffected into jail is counter productive. How is this helping?
8
Excellent point, especially in a society where incarceration is designed to punish, not to reform and rehabilitate (cf. Germany).
Heartbreaking story. If you want to ensure your children never become radicalized, teach them ethics and forego religion. Trying to make sense of religion requires one to suspend reason and once you suspend reason (19 virgins anyone?) all bets are off. It's not just Islam. I left the church in my late teens. I couldn't get my head around the hocus pocus -- the magical acts. I like being ethical solely for the benefit of the society I live in. I don't behave in order to please some "God," I behave to please my neighbor. I may not like him, but I know he is real.
121
You are obviously too young to remember communism--a totally god-free ethical system that inspired terrorism and other forms of mass murder. Religion is not the essential factor, nor is poverty. Fremont is a a highly affluent community. There are no easy answers to this problem.
1
Was it Voltaire who said something about believing absurdities and committing atrocities? I firmly believe that being forced to accept fantasies, myths, and opinions as facts, at a young age and as a condition of one's place in the family and larger community, establishes a potentially deadly ground -- no matter which religion does it.
1
What real example of communism are you referring to? I remember fascist states pretending to practice communism, but that's hardly the same thing. And present-day nations with the least religious populations appear to have the moral edge on the more religious ones, if we are using actual compassionate treatment of people as a standard.
Police work involves a lot of "social work." The police (some) actually helped citizens and were not tied to a quota of daily arrests. But the new incarceration rate and prison for profit has changed that.
4
It appears that young Muslim men see going off to jihad is a romantic adventure. Once in a strange violent group reality sets in and many have second thoughts. Perhaps reformed jihadists could travel and talk to the Muslim community about their experience and help curtail the young from going a terror group.
6
"His message now to parents of troubled or confused children? “Don’t even think about going to the government.”
And that's why we do need a different and better way to deal with these kids who are in the process of being radicalized. Otherwise help from the Muslim community on which we depend will dry up or be much reduced. Making a father choose between possibly seeing his son radicalized or risking spending 20 years in prison before he's actually done anything is not much of a choice.
We need to provide a third way.
And that's why we do need a different and better way to deal with these kids who are in the process of being radicalized. Otherwise help from the Muslim community on which we depend will dry up or be much reduced. Making a father choose between possibly seeing his son radicalized or risking spending 20 years in prison before he's actually done anything is not much of a choice.
We need to provide a third way.
15
You need a solution??? We have millions of potentially motivated refuges fleeing their own countries in terror...We have no place to put them in the west... But the Western countries have hundreds and hundred of military camps thru-out these areas... Not only send them there but also separate the masses into those who can be trained for combat, those who can contribute to the new war effort, farming for food, sewing uniforms, making bullets, driving six-by army trucks, fly drones...? Put the troops on trucks, tanks, pulling artllery, into vast armies that will send the MONSTERS fleeing for their lives and drawing the youths into the war effort for a just cause instead of blowing them selves up for some thing to do !!! Then our bombs will accomplish some thing and instead of having tp with draw our troops these can stay, repair their lives, homes and countries while maybe thinking about Democracy, while we fly back home and take all our troops around the world back home with us. We can then make Trump and Cruz Generals so the rest of the world will be too scared to oppose us; appoint Obama to the Supreme court (after a proper rest) to scare the Republicans to not dare run for public office state, county or city and maybe we can also think about equality and Democracy again being GREAT
Heartfelt empathy for Adam's dad. I can't imagine the sorrow. I understand that there is possibly so much more to the case which we can't get a flavor for in a short article. Those facts obviously swayed a jury. That being said I'd like to make a few observations about Adam. He seems like a person motivated by compassion and anger at injustice. He cried for victims of war and fed the homeless. He determined in his mind that he wanted to fight the enemy, a similar impulse of many young men I know. It's interesting that the group he was admiring is targeting the exact same enemy as the U.S. He's statement about spilling blood is alarming but the context might change minds. Was he talking about targeting civilians or going to fight on the battlefield? All this to say that maybe some of this young people have purer motives than we thing and they need strong voices of guidance and ways to effect change that they truly believe will make a difference.
8
Working in the criminal justice field, I see the potential benefits of intervention particularly when there is no such thing as expungement in the federal system and most state's systems. The result is that rehabilitation as a result of (or in spite of) probation or prison ultimately brings with it the label of "felon" which - after limiting opportunities- then begins to erode the rehabilitated person's new found self-esteem and (lawful) purpose so that the person finds his/her way back to the thoughts and behaviors that started the descent. An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure unless we are talking about dollars. In such case, those selling the cure make way more money than they would selling the prevention. Wait, I'm becoming radicalized?
7
"Though civil libertarians — and some F.B.I. agents — are skeptical of what they see as blurring the line between social work and law enforcement......."
Law enforcement and social work should never have a sharp line between them. In fact, it seems obvious they should be well integrated if prevention and building an overall better society is the goal. If, of course, that is the goal. My heart goes out to Mr. Shafi and his entire family.
Law enforcement and social work should never have a sharp line between them. In fact, it seems obvious they should be well integrated if prevention and building an overall better society is the goal. If, of course, that is the goal. My heart goes out to Mr. Shafi and his entire family.
13
The basic tenets of Islam support the type of Islamic terrorism we keep seeing, especially in Europe, where disturbing percentages of Muslims voice support for terrorist acts. We can either admit this truth, or we can keep lying to ourselves with articles that keep acting as though the terrorists' motives are somehow mysterious.
34
It is no different than why some Americans are criminals and some are not. We all live in the same culture, but most of us are not criminals. Same with Muslims: Most are not terrorists.
Or shall we admit that there is something inherently wrong with American culture when so many people kill others?
Or shall we admit that there is something inherently wrong with American culture when so many people kill others?
1
Yes. I'm currently reading a book by Mark A. Gabriel, who left Islam because it's history was "an ocean of blood."
We keep lying to ourselves about Islam because we don't want to offend Muslims. It's called 'political correctness."
We keep lying to ourselves about Islam because we don't want to offend Muslims. It's called 'political correctness."
What is missing in an otherwise fine article is this: What role (or lack of) did the family's Masjid and Imam play in this story?
28
Sadly, Mr. Shafi learned the hard way what parents in low-income neighborhoods have known all along. Instead of joining cooperative parents in finding solutions that will keep the children alive and out of jail, contacting the authorities will more likely create another nightmare. This is also the case for domestic violence victims. Women are afraid of contacting the authorities because that call can result in the children being removed from the home, instead of the abuser being removed. The people that most need law enforcement assistance are the ones most reluctant to make that call. That is more a statement about law enforcement than about the victims, when people have to think hard about calling the authorities.
195
I feel for Mr. Shafi, who sees that his actions led to his son being imprisoned for 20 years. And yet, as I read this, I kept thinking that Adam was well on his way to committing an act of terrorism. Would Mr. Shafi's intervention have worked? Are we as a society willing to experiment to find out? No easy answers here.
129
It appears that a lot of people have been terrified out of their minds, which of course is the goal of ISIS and their ilk. We are no linger a free country when we lock people up not for a criminal act, but for the suspicion that they might commit one.
34
I feel for the father, who has suffered before this arrest and now must feel guilt that his son is now in the maw of the criminal justice system.
But I don't feel sorry for the kid. Active supporters (recruiters, funders and recruits) of terrorist groups like ISIS and Al Qaeda belong in jail.
But I don't feel sorry for the kid. Active supporters (recruiters, funders and recruits) of terrorist groups like ISIS and Al Qaeda belong in jail.
23
There are close to 900 active hate groups and close to 1000 anti-government groups in the United States. [Per the Southern Poverty Law Center]. Those numbers do not include Islamic terrorist groups. Should all our homegrown supporters of domestic terrorism be locked up too?
2
Not the same. We are in a war of ideas with hate groups, a violent war with the other.
This is exactly the kind of man (he was 22, not 16) I want locked up, and for a lot more than 20 years.
27
But for what? Thinking? Traveling? Those are not crimes.
4
Thinking? No. Attempting to travel to join a terrorist group- yes. Adam was convicted on one count of attempting to provide material support to a designated foreign terrorist organization. That is a crime and rightly so and the punishment is 20 years imprisonment. Adam was an adult and I'm glad that he's in prison and unable to ''spill blood''. Islam is a religion in which according to the koran, the only sure-fire way to get to Paradise is to ''spill the blood of infidels''. If you aren't a Sunni Muslim- this means you.
We have had a lot of teens recruited by ISIS in Canada but there is now an anti-radicalization program in place which is meant to help parents save their children and keep society safe. These policies in the U.S. will only lead to more teens getting irreversibly sucked into groups like ISIS because the parents will be too afraid to report them to the authorities. Here detained youth are counseled by imams and mental health workers in an effort to undo the brainwashing and bring them back into society when it is deemed safe to do so.
33
I'm confused on how Imams who teach the Koran and its "us versus them" concepts are point men in undoing the brainwashing. They appear to be the source.
I have no sympathy for this father. He shouldn't blame the US government for imprisoning his son, he should blame his son for deliberately choosing the path of terrorism.
41
He deserves sympathy. He did a difficult and selfless thing to protect the innocent. His response to the government might not be totally rational, but considering all he has been through, I think that's understandable. This is a heroic thing this man did. He is entitled to our sympathy.
61
It is greatly disappointing to se how vengeful people is this country can be. And you Ms. Robertson are a perfect example. But uncountable other examples abound in our society every day.
3
I sympathize with the father's plight, but his message now to parents of troubled or confused children that they shouldn't even think about going to the government. Is like a parent who loses a son in wartime telling other parents not to encouraging their children to enlist in the military because they might die serving the country.
He should also ask himself would he be happier if his son blew himself up in a US airport then serving prison time.
He should also ask himself would he be happier if his son blew himself up in a US airport then serving prison time.
23
Not at all hard to feel the pull of what could be for terrorists. If you were in a country where the political leaders sided against the masses, all the while giving lip service to them, lying about what they were doing while taking bribes from entities with huge financial resources, then they may be inclined to act out in a violent way. Anyone feeling like there is no hope for their position in life to change, may be inclined to do something that levels the playing field and that is gorilla warfare. Anyone care to chime in?
4
I agree. People without hope are capable of horrific things.
1
How does gorilla (sic) warfare level the playing field?
Yes, comeonman, I'll chime in. If you are in despair over the government's corruption, why would you kill those "masses" the twisted leaders are "siding against"? These recruits are not killing corrupted officials. They are killing the man, the woman, and the child on the street. Gorilla warfare? You are insulting gorillas. This is all too human and all too horrific. So, no excuses. None.
1
What a waste. Teenagers say ridiculous things when they think they're not being heard. What is an acceptable false positive rate for these incarcerations? What if 99/100 Adams end up in Turkey, and support Muslim refugees, and not their murderers? Are we willing to put those 100 kids away, for a collective 2,000 years, to prevent one kid from dying in Syria?
10
The man's son is 22, not a teenager.
And the waste is the fault of Adam, who was willing to waste his own life by choosing to join a group of murderers, choosing to become a murderer.
And the waste is the fault of Adam, who was willing to waste his own life by choosing to join a group of murderers, choosing to become a murderer.
14
Fair enough, he's a few years older, but my point stands. How do you know he would have made the choice to become a murderer? We don't lock people up for suggesting that they might join a gang.
I'm grateful to parents like Mr. Shafi who have made this incredibly difficult, but ultimately necessary, choice. He probably saved many lives, including his son's. To ease the burden for others like him, let's pass a law that reduces punishment by some significant amount for those whose parents or friends raise the flag.
113
Absolutely NOT! Why should a budding terrorist get a break because their parent said something. As sorry as I feel for the parent., his conduct should not dimish the punishment his son receives. He is a danger to innocents and his father's actions doesn't make him any less so.
8
Excellent article, strongly suggesting the potential value of a program of the sort Mr Shafi was seeking for his son. The article also shows that, if the FBI is, as a reader comments, "not your friend", they are also not the enemy. To judge from what we see in the article, they seem to function (well) as a government agency whose agents may not, in this case, have the range of alternatives that would enable better responses to situations such as the Shafi family's. A program of the sort suggested in the article (and found elsewhere in the world) would require a lot of work and new training for agents, but it would at least be non-hammer-like tool in the toolbox, so everything and everybody wouldn't have to look like the proverbial nail. The loss of faith on the elder Mr Shafi's part is a strong reason for instituting such a program, even if it is only of limited use.
76
What a mess. What a tragedy. No resource for help short of jail? Muslims are NOT the only source of terrorism in this country. Kids with guns shooting school mates, people in church, fellow students in college or young misguided men blowing up buildings or threatening people are also terrorists. Groups whose hatred is based on race, religion or politics are terrorists. What a mess. We live in a place where fear of each other is rampant. Will the rich take away all means of self-reliance and support by raising the cost of medicine, health care, food, housing? Are the poor demanding support which will take away my money that I want to use for my own goals of an expansive palatial life. Are law-enforcement personnel too bigoted to be fair? Is our government so much in the pocket of the rich they no longer serve 99% of us? Are we now so divided in this country we can no longer cooperate toward any goal that would otherwise benefit all of us? So it would seem. Where is compassion? Where is empathy? These are principles that are implied in the Constitution and Declaration of Independence and supposedly all religions but seemingly no longer practiced to too great a degree in this country. Horrors like the one described in this article make news because they are not the norm but there are far too many such instances and far too much silence in reaction to them or more frightening too much approval. What happen to the Shafi family is patently wrong.
27
Better to visit your son in prison on a conspiracy conviction rather than a mass murder conviction.
44
"Don’t even think about going to the government" Mr. Shafi says. I guess the thinking is that it is better a score or so of Americans die than that a jihadi-minded son pay for his crimes. This is a mindset of too many parents (not just Muslims) when it comes to their children committing crimes.
34
James, the boy hasn't done anything. Not yet at least. Talking about whatever is not a crime.
5
But what, exactly, were his 'crimes'? The worst thing he did, at least according to the article, was to go to Turkey without telling his parents. I live in hope that this, along with the numerous other convictions like it, may bring back a return to the principles of freedom of speech and association enshrined in the Constitution. I would expect imprisonment because one might commit a crime, or because one met and talked to the wrong sort of people, to occur in a country which had already adopted Sharia law, not here.
1
Yes it is...it is called conspiracy.
1
There's no question but that the government should provide intervention services, probably administered by social services entities, and not law enforcement, to give parents an alternative to "calling the FBI." But, at the same time, there must be an understanding that if the individuals in question are showing signs of preparing for violence, then law enforcement will be involved.
Perhaps there can be leniency, but there must be trials in courts of law, and once there is a conviction, punishment. Parents in this incredibly difficult situation perhaps will understand that the punishment and consequences, once there is violence, would be far more severe.
And there must be active involvement of the mainstream Moslem community, who must actively assist in early interventional programs, and work to convince people on the road to radicalization that violence and jihad are not part of the Moslem religion.
Perhaps there can be leniency, but there must be trials in courts of law, and once there is a conviction, punishment. Parents in this incredibly difficult situation perhaps will understand that the punishment and consequences, once there is violence, would be far more severe.
And there must be active involvement of the mainstream Moslem community, who must actively assist in early interventional programs, and work to convince people on the road to radicalization that violence and jihad are not part of the Moslem religion.
6
The father should take comfort in the fact that it is only 20 years. There's still hope of this man having a life afterward. It seems to me the only other solution at this point was to wait until he ended up dead and likely having killed many others.
20
A friend's son is having some serious issues but because he's white and american he's able to post his hatred right on his Facebook page for the entire world to witness. His profile picture is overlaid with a Rebel Flag and his cover photo is of him and his friends, shirtless and posed with their big pickup trucks and American flags and Confederate flags. Assault weapons and alcohol are proudly featured. A bonfire blazes illuminating the night. Down in the lower left of the shot, almost too small to be noticed is a young boy, maybe four, proudly holding his rebel flag.
"It's just a phase. It's only a rebel flag." says his mother.
"It's just a phase. It's only a rebel flag." says his mother.
59
Thomas Payne - Thank you for this. These are indeed manifestations of the same symptoms. Hatred, fear, disillusionment with the establishment.
Young people seek the radical for empowerment. The only solution I can see is to not make them feel disempowered in the first place.
I don't understand why the son of your friend is not under investigation. His hatred is no less corrosive than the young man in this story.
Young people seek the radical for empowerment. The only solution I can see is to not make them feel disempowered in the first place.
I don't understand why the son of your friend is not under investigation. His hatred is no less corrosive than the young man in this story.
1
The failure to report a felony is in most states a felony.
That aside, the article does not tell us what the father did raising the man to assimilate him. Did the family fly the US flag on the 4th of July to honor the country that had made them wealthy? Did the father have to take the young man to Egypt when he should have been home attending college?
Tell the whole story, please.
That aside, the article does not tell us what the father did raising the man to assimilate him. Did the family fly the US flag on the 4th of July to honor the country that had made them wealthy? Did the father have to take the young man to Egypt when he should have been home attending college?
Tell the whole story, please.
21
That's a ridiculous argument. I never fly an American flag at our home. Does that make me unAmerican or less American than a family who does? No. What in the world does flying the flag have to do with anything?
4
I know many US Muslims and they are all as American as Apple pie, 4th of July, baseball, camping, you name it.
5
As parents, it's damn if you do, and damn if you don't. I hear their pain. If you don't report the child and let the government step in first, the result could be even worse if the child turns to ISIS. It's a choice between a rock and a very hard place, and it's the helplessness that drives these parents. If they had been able to talk some sense into their child, if the child had listened to the parents and their advice, they would not have been talking to the government in the first place. It's thus unreasonable for these parents to turn around and blame the government for heavy-handedness since they would have turned their own kids around, if they had been able to but couldn't. It's all too easy to blame the government for being the bogeyma, but the other option is to wait until kiddo left for Syria and be killed, or worse still, wait until kiddo picked up some guns or knife to behead someone on camera before they (or the government) act. These parents don't need to look much further than all those young men in Europe (France, Belgium, and beyond) in the terrorist attacks. If anything, and if they really need to find a bogeyman to blame for all these happening to their kids, they should blame terrorist groups like ISIS that have hijacked their faith and brainwashed their kids into maiming and killing.
14
I completely sympathize with Mr. Shafi. Though for entirely different reasons I, too, had to turn my own son into authorities in order to save him from himself. Once inside the criminal justice system, however, and later the penal system, any notion of help with his drug problem and rehabilitation into a contributing citizen, became a pipe dream.
What we Americans seem to do better than any other country, is punish people who break the law. We simplify everything into black and white; friend or foe, if—then.
What we Americans seem to do better than any other country, is punish people who break the law. We simplify everything into black and white; friend or foe, if—then.
38
Mr. Shafi did not "destroy" his son. Adam did that himself. He kept his son alive even if in prison. How would he have felt when his son became a murderer and died as a suicide bomber?
33
Since when does traveling to Turkey, talking about wanting to spill gallons of American blood, killing American soldiers, and wanting to die fighting with NF, then trying for a second time to go to Turkey, constitute mere "flirting" with terrorism? As a parent, I understand the father's guilt for turning his child in, however, how would he have felt when his adult son ultimately hurt innocent Americans or others? He left the country twice to go to Syria, he didn't just post crazy things on Facebook. This case is more proof that homegrown terrorists are not the disenfranchised, marginalised, uneducated people that Obama insists they are. This young man is the son of a Silicon Valley executive. Like other homegrown terrorists, he is a second generation, privileged American citizen who became more religious than his parents ever were, and hates the US for oppressing his fellow Muslims in lands he has never known. All that privilege, yet he still identifies more with his faith than as an American who has the right to vote if he's unhappy with the current direction of American foreign policy. Something is terribly, terribly wrong with this picture.
52
Lots of Americans identify with their faith more than then as an American, it's just that faith is Christianity or Judaism.
2
Nothing here talks about what this son did for a living. He was living at home and volunteering for the poor through his mosque. How did he get the money for trips to Turkey?
The only 'flirting' going on here was when to actually jump the border into Syria or carry out actions here. I agree with those who say that parents in this situation should just let them go but would add that the U.S government should be far more careful about letting them come back.
And peaceful Muslims who love this country need to step up and cure the cancer within or they will not find much empathy.
The only 'flirting' going on here was when to actually jump the border into Syria or carry out actions here. I agree with those who say that parents in this situation should just let them go but would add that the U.S government should be far more careful about letting them come back.
And peaceful Muslims who love this country need to step up and cure the cancer within or they will not find much empathy.
43
You sound tough, with a complete lack of understanding about how difficult it is to be 20 - 24 , male, and not seeing a clear path, job, or inspiration for the future. Few young men know what they want to do with the next 50 years of their lives at that age. Do you know how many college students still have undeclared majors at age 20, when Adam was feeding the homeless? No matter the economic situation, most young people don't know what they want "to be when they grow up" until their brains fully mature at around age 26. Sad that this boy could not connect his charitable works with his role in life. Read the article again, and understand the loss of direction is not just limited to young Muslims. Many comments here seem to ignore the son's sympathy for the suffering of the refugees and others who are in horrible circumstances. He would definitely have benefitted from counseling and guidance. He could have become someone who made difference in a good way, if not for his frustration with the ills of the situations in Mideast.
He talked about joining a group but did not DO anything to harm anyone. He could have been talking about spilling his own blood to save lives.
He talked about joining a group but did not DO anything to harm anyone. He could have been talking about spilling his own blood to save lives.
“Don’t even think about going to the government." I guess it would be better to hope that he didn't kill innocent people, ala' San Bernadino. If that didn't work out, Shafi could just explain to the survivors that his son was really a good person, just a little miss-guided. This is a phenomena that is unique to Islam and the solution must come from Islam, since these extremists don't put any stock in non-secular codes of civility. Until then, the attacks will continue...
13
NOT unique to Islam; all parents think that way.
1
The fact is that Mr. Shafi's rejection of going to the government is precisely what feeds into today's anti-Muslim rhetoric being espoused by Trump and others. As poorly as the FBI is currently responding to these parental warnings/suspicions of their children's behavior, Mr. Shafi's actions must be acknowledged positively by Muslims and everyone. The potential from the alternative is unacceptable.
1
This is so sad. It reminds me of parents whose children become drug addicts. They live in constant fear that their children will commit a crime, kill someone while DUI, hurt himself, or end up in prison where he is sure to be raped, and ruined. Unfamiliar with what road there is to de-radicalization, it seems like a possibility. In the meantime, we have to protect those in danger from people like Adam.
6
The Obama administration wants Americans to believe we are safer in America because Muslims often report other Muslims who they know to be radicalized to the authorities. But here we have a father who is essentially telling all who will listen not to go to the authorities. I can certainly understand the father's remorse but left to his own devices his son may just as easily ended up dead after taking other innocents with him. Unfortunately the son will now go to prison where the muslim inmate community will have another disciple.
10
I admire and feel pity for Sal Shafi as a father but do think his son was a danger to others either overseas or in the US. With Islamic terrorists killing so many around the world, how can the FBI be lenient and give him the benefit of the doubt?
20
In my therapy office I see plenty of kids disaffected for a variety of reasons. Often they yearn for more than money and the material. A common denominator is that they lack a strong identification with family, religion and ethnic group, the traditional anchors. They seem to be floating around with no strong sense of who they are or a sense of purpose or goals for their lives. These radical movements may be filling a void.
These traditional identities can cut both ways. They can be sources of hatred and division and racism and xenophobia, but they can also bring out the best in human beings. It all depends. (CS Lewis famously said that what kept him from Christianity so long was....Christians.). Parents dispense with ethnic and especially religious identification at their peril, but especially at the peril of their offspring.
My close friends who like me were raised in reasonable Catholic households were not susceptible to the Hari Krishna folks and the various cults of the 60s. Or even to sex and drugs writ large. (We were very susceptible to rock n roll.) I've seen many kids raised with what some would call cafeteria Catholicism to good effect. Same with Judaism.
I have a manuscript on this subject on my blog www.uncommon-tary.com. It is titled: Thinking About Raising Your Kids Without Religion? Think Again.
These traditional identities can cut both ways. They can be sources of hatred and division and racism and xenophobia, but they can also bring out the best in human beings. It all depends. (CS Lewis famously said that what kept him from Christianity so long was....Christians.). Parents dispense with ethnic and especially religious identification at their peril, but especially at the peril of their offspring.
My close friends who like me were raised in reasonable Catholic households were not susceptible to the Hari Krishna folks and the various cults of the 60s. Or even to sex and drugs writ large. (We were very susceptible to rock n roll.) I've seen many kids raised with what some would call cafeteria Catholicism to good effect. Same with Judaism.
I have a manuscript on this subject on my blog www.uncommon-tary.com. It is titled: Thinking About Raising Your Kids Without Religion? Think Again.
7
I was brought up as an atheist and felt no void that made me turn to crime or terrorism. Religion brings about most "peril" in the world. Ridiculous advice to suggest kids need to believe in imaginary beings to give them a sense of identity. Religion is the problem, not the solution.
12
Observing parents who act with a moral/ ethical compass helps most children acquire values, whether or not the parents espouse a religion. The problem is that very strong ethnic identification, like strong religious identification, has let to antagonism, distrust, alienation - and war. A lot of US citizens of us got away from ethnic ghettos before we learned that people are people.
This young man seems to have had a profound sense of right and wrong; which primed him for involvement in acts to harm others, all closely tied to a religious view.
This young man seems to have had a profound sense of right and wrong; which primed him for involvement in acts to harm others, all closely tied to a religious view.
4
My sister and I were raised in a household with no religion, in the 60's and 70's. We both have strong morals, values, neither of us have ever been arrested, both of us are successful and seen as role models in our communities, both of us give back to our communities. Neither of us sees anything missing in our lives because we did not fall for a religion.
It was really easy to grow up this way. Follow the Golden Rule. Treat others as you would want to be treated. No need for some magical sky fairy.
It was really easy to grow up this way. Follow the Golden Rule. Treat others as you would want to be treated. No need for some magical sky fairy.
9
Religion has a way to destroy good people. Being brought up, under the strict religious supervision of my father, prayers at breakfast, lunch, and dinner, I went to church every single Sunday, every Wednesday night was forced to attend bible classes I the village, often was told by some minister to ring door bells for money contributions, of course attended a Christian high school with bible studies and prayers at the beginning and end of the day, and at age 17 had to make the church commitment to be a Christian (whatever that means). As soon as I left home for college I dropped all that and focused on what life is all about. Never went to church again except for funerals, including my Dad's who committed suicide from great loneliness after my Mom died. Religion, by far the most poisonous invention of man-kind, certainly including right now the many varieties of the Muslim perspectives.
83
Amen!
4
The best part of the whole "religious" concept is how obvious it is. The power of indoctrination from an early age is awesome. I tell my religious friends - none of whom actually practice what Jesus taught -- that they really are only good students. They learned well from their parents. If they were born in Pakistan that would be Muslim; India, Hindu; Thailand; Buddhist; Salt Lake City, Mormon; and on and on. It would be funny if it wasn't so unhealthy.
6
I couldn't have said it better myself. Religion (of any variety) is a toxin and a tool used to manipulate the masses while hiding behind a shield of absolutism.
4
Americans should take a long at Trevor Phillips' article in this weekend's TIMES of London re surveys of British Muslims that, surprise, reveal that they actually do NOT share western secular values, especially in the social areas of women's emancipation, homosexuality, abortion, etc. Phillips has warned before that Muslims do note integrate "like the rest of us" and that Britain, and Europe, must do a "more muscular" job of integration. A recent article in politico.eu and a report by an American journalist who spent time in Molenbeek, Paris's banlieus, and neighborhoods in East London, and places like Bradford and Dewsbury, made no bones about what they found: small foreign countries dominated by conservative Islam that are like, as the reporter said, "colonial outposts of IS."
As people make it clear that they do feel a profound need for cultural identity, the left, the media, and the EU keep feeding the narrative that cultural identity is something no civilized person subscribes to because all cultures are equal, except for ethnic minorities, in which case, in a spot of massive hypocrisy, they should not be subjected "cultural imperialism". Hence, as minority cultures are lauded, when the Dutch vote against creeping EU imperialism, politico.eu jeers at white tribalism by sneering in its headline that "Little Englanders Take Comfort From Dutch Vote".
The AfD in Germany just hit a record high in German polls, up to 14%, while the SPD took a record dive. Wonder why?
As people make it clear that they do feel a profound need for cultural identity, the left, the media, and the EU keep feeding the narrative that cultural identity is something no civilized person subscribes to because all cultures are equal, except for ethnic minorities, in which case, in a spot of massive hypocrisy, they should not be subjected "cultural imperialism". Hence, as minority cultures are lauded, when the Dutch vote against creeping EU imperialism, politico.eu jeers at white tribalism by sneering in its headline that "Little Englanders Take Comfort From Dutch Vote".
The AfD in Germany just hit a record high in German polls, up to 14%, while the SPD took a record dive. Wonder why?
107
Wait. They "actually do NOT share western secular values, especially in the social areas of women's emancipation, homosexuality, abortion, etc"?
Neither does my neighbor, actually. He's a drag, but no one wants to deport him, and he has a flag on his porch and undoubtedly thinks he's a better patriot than I am.
This article is about a tragic moral dilemma, not the evil of all Muslims - in fact, very pointedly not.
Neither does my neighbor, actually. He's a drag, but no one wants to deport him, and he has a flag on his porch and undoubtedly thinks he's a better patriot than I am.
This article is about a tragic moral dilemma, not the evil of all Muslims - in fact, very pointedly not.
4
I completely agree, but suggest that the difference is even more fundamental; that rather than being brought up in a pluralist democratic legal system, Muslim children are indoctrinated into submission to religious law and authority.
Some time ago I attended a friend's naturalization and was greatly moved [indeed surprised] at the outward expressions of pride, including tears of joy, in becoming an American citizen.
Things rarely go well when a group of people adopt a country for convenience rather than with the intent of becoming part of its fabric,
Some time ago I attended a friend's naturalization and was greatly moved [indeed surprised] at the outward expressions of pride, including tears of joy, in becoming an American citizen.
Things rarely go well when a group of people adopt a country for convenience rather than with the intent of becoming part of its fabric,
8
I take your point, Confetti, but here may be the difference. Do you think your neighbor would cut off your head, or set off a bomb in a subway?
5
The parent did the right thing although that is probably little comfort to him today. I can only imagine the sleepless nights he has suffered worrying if there was a better way but most of the time there isn't. The time to talk to our children , as Muslim parents, is as soon as they have understanding of the world and the evils within it. Teach them what Islam is. The truth. Islam doesn't support these terror organizations in spirit or doctrine. Islam doesn't tell our children to kill wantonly. It doesnt teach us to kill innocents. The biggest problem that immigrant parents face is lack of understanding of what Islam teaches in these issues. They are affected by their emotionaly connections to what's happening in the Muslim lands. They have family and friends who have been harmed by oppressive regimes and welcome these renegade groups believing they are fighting for their freedom but this is never the case. They exchange one oppresor for a greater more malevolent one.
What a cruel exchange.
In my community, we have been told to report anything suspicious to the authorities. It is not a popular request but we do it.
Sometimes a parents love is not enough.
What a cruel exchange.
In my community, we have been told to report anything suspicious to the authorities. It is not a popular request but we do it.
Sometimes a parents love is not enough.
117
It's a horrible position to be in, especially when a great many non-Muslim Americans deeply question the morality and efficacy of our many violent interventions in ME affairs. Muslim children are growing up in a world so morally and socially complicated that I can't pretend to fathom it fully. Teach your children when they come of age to understand that warmongers deserve warmongers and that there are rarely virtuous sides to take once blood starts flowing - it only seems that way from the war-blinded perspective of either side. You have all my compassion, and sympathy. I hope you and your children can be patient and wise.
23
Is it feasible that we begin attempting to understand that jihadists do what they do because they believe in what they read in the Koran? Two engineers at a nuclear power planting Belgium quit their jobs and go to Syria for jihad. They are educated, have jobs that pay well, yet they undertake training for war, because the Koran tells them to do so. Why can we not realize this?
2
Islam doesn't teach its children 'to kill wantonly'? It doesn't 'teach us to kill innocents'?
Why doesn't it teach you not to kill at all? To ISIS there is no 'innocent' non-Muslim. To radical Muslims killing non-Muslims isn't a wanton act at all.
Why doesn't it teach you not to kill at all? To ISIS there is no 'innocent' non-Muslim. To radical Muslims killing non-Muslims isn't a wanton act at all.
2
Parents have a hard time understanding that, despite their best efforts, their children can be broken and in need of repair. Ignoring serious problems, which so many choose to do, is like driving a car with failing brakes. Someday, someone is going to get hurt. Family values makes for a catchy political slogan, but human progress and happiness over countless millennia has always been based on choices, not accidents of birth. Our culture honors that by protecting the communications between a husband and wife but not a parent and child. Otherwise, it's back to the proverbial cave for us all.
17
Very sad that a father, Sal Shafi turned his son in and did the right thing but in return he lost his beloved son, Adam Shafi. albeit radicalized but potentially being capable of turned around. What attracts a handful of young American and European Muslims to jump into Jihad or gradually go to the other side is what needs to be researched? More importantly how can draw to radicalization be stopped in its track. A very well to do highly placed father in Nigeria could not prevent his son from becoming the under wear bomber but he showed signs of behaving differently than his siblings and the father informed the police but not before his disappearance. Where is the money coming from to support terrorists that is a trillion dollar question that the FBI needs to probe and while they are doing that they need to monitor the content of the material that contributes to radicalization. Also try to find out how countries with large Muslim populations like India and Indonesia are able to manage to keep their countries free from influences that manipulate young minds so that the agony of fathers like Sal Safi does not keep repeating itself.
15
For those wondering how a young person can get sucked into ISIS, see a superb NYT video on a young Sunday school teacher in Montana who was recruited over the Internet.
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/06/28/world/americas/isis-online-recruiting-...
ISIS offers community, adventure, and purpose in life. It also distorts reality in the Middle East. The young woman believes that ISIS is bringing stability to the middle east, and that their actions are greatly exaggerated.
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/06/28/world/americas/isis-online-recruiting-...
ISIS offers community, adventure, and purpose in life. It also distorts reality in the Middle East. The young woman believes that ISIS is bringing stability to the middle east, and that their actions are greatly exaggerated.
21
Washington, not Wyoming. Come on, it's not that hard! Each state is the size of a middle eastern country. One could understand an easterner making this mistake, but a westerner from Southern California?
Community adventure? Like beheading people and drowning others in steel cages? Like treating women as chattel and refusing to let children play?
No, you have to be disturbed or dillusional to want to join those terrorists. But whatever you are, there is no place for you here in America except prison.
No, you have to be disturbed or dillusional to want to join those terrorists. But whatever you are, there is no place for you here in America except prison.
2
What would be helpful -- to me, at least -- would be an explanation as to just what the catalyst is for such a fine young man's/woman's radical change in mindset?
What is the trigger that abruptly resets their minds, transforming them from good students, fine sons/daughters, devout, caring individuals/citizens who take their faiths seriously, to viewing terrorism as the only solution?
Can it not be written about or discussed in a great publication like the NYT? Or does merely discussing the foibles of a religion (and every religion has at least a few) in print or in a documentary risk retribution or excoriation of the writer or publication or documentary or reader for even suggesting such a thing?
What is the trigger that abruptly resets their minds, transforming them from good students, fine sons/daughters, devout, caring individuals/citizens who take their faiths seriously, to viewing terrorism as the only solution?
Can it not be written about or discussed in a great publication like the NYT? Or does merely discussing the foibles of a religion (and every religion has at least a few) in print or in a documentary risk retribution or excoriation of the writer or publication or documentary or reader for even suggesting such a thing?
15
Islamic extremism is a cult, it hypnotizes the individual into foolish adventurism, foolish religious promises and hate. It must be stopped.
20
Your comment applies equally to all forms of religious extremism.
2
Any parent who uses the unquestioned influence they have over the developing minds and beliefs of their children to teach them to turn off their most human of all capabilities, their ability to assess reality and apply reason, should not be too surprised when their children are taken in by cult leaders who take advantage of their children’s inability to question and ability to blindly believe.
11
I feel for this father and for other parents who worry that their children may be radicalizing. They need a place to turn to for help. If religious communities and the government could offer support to these families and work to undo the appeal of jihadi rhetoric, it seems like this would be far better than locking people up for twenty years. So many of these terrorists were radicalized in prison. And how is spending 20 years in solitary confinement for thoughts (not acts) of terrorism going to make one more sympathetic to the U.S. government?
25
Im sorry but I am glad Adam is in prison. The father had to make a choice and he made it. His choice was to knowingly let another terrorist lose on our soil, or not. He chose not. I applaud the father. 20 years isn't that much time for a terrorist. Had he been more indoctrinated, trained well and armed, we would all be discussing a different topic this morning. As far as advising parents not to go to the government...I believe the father should be watched and perhaps jailed as well. This isn't a game...
Were the positions reversed, I would take whatever steps necessary to eliminate the threat caused by my son, up to and including turning him in or sending the swat teams in to arrest him. Unfortunately when your child is brainwashed by terrorists, it is almost too late to "fix" them.
I feel like the father did the right thing. Rather your son be locked up for 20 than have blood of innocents on his hands. As far as an intervention goes...I feel that a lifetime of talking with your children,explaining current events to them and helping them with a way of seeing that is healthy to us all is imperative. The father saw it coming...he knew and waited a bit too long. His advise to parents should say "call the cops as soon as you suspect ANY type of brainwashing."
I realize that it is easy for me to sit here, with my 4 sons not in prison and rant about this guy. I feel sorry for the dad, not the son. Sometimes you get a bad apple.
Were the positions reversed, I would take whatever steps necessary to eliminate the threat caused by my son, up to and including turning him in or sending the swat teams in to arrest him. Unfortunately when your child is brainwashed by terrorists, it is almost too late to "fix" them.
I feel like the father did the right thing. Rather your son be locked up for 20 than have blood of innocents on his hands. As far as an intervention goes...I feel that a lifetime of talking with your children,explaining current events to them and helping them with a way of seeing that is healthy to us all is imperative. The father saw it coming...he knew and waited a bit too long. His advise to parents should say "call the cops as soon as you suspect ANY type of brainwashing."
I realize that it is easy for me to sit here, with my 4 sons not in prison and rant about this guy. I feel sorry for the dad, not the son. Sometimes you get a bad apple.
24
There is a context found here and in Times coverage and media discussion generally, that is more important than the specifics of this or many similar and related news stories:
There ought to be zero tolerance in Western societies for Islamist radicalization. This is not radicalization to right- or left-wing ideologies. This is transformation of youth into terrorists. What methods work better is fair for discussion, but the rest -- the wringing hands, the apologism, the feeling for the poor parents, the blaming of society, racism, Islamophobia, inadequate opportunities and consequent "alienation" of Islam youth -- is just blather, as the nonsense that the West's coldheartedness will only create more terrorists. Adam Shafi will be tried not for his confusion or depression or anything other than for terrorist crime he may have committed.
What creates terrorists is terrorist ideology -- in this case, theology -- employed by existing terrorist institutions and individuals, who prey upon us all, and, in particular, prey upon the young and the impressionable. While the concept of "total war" that treats armies and civilians alike was rightly consigned to the garbage heap of history by the West post-WW2, Western society needs to resurrect a new form of total war. that is civilian-sparing, against Islamism -- which seeks to conquer and destroy "infidels" everywhere and which includes terrorism as a means.
There ought to be zero tolerance in Western societies for Islamist radicalization. This is not radicalization to right- or left-wing ideologies. This is transformation of youth into terrorists. What methods work better is fair for discussion, but the rest -- the wringing hands, the apologism, the feeling for the poor parents, the blaming of society, racism, Islamophobia, inadequate opportunities and consequent "alienation" of Islam youth -- is just blather, as the nonsense that the West's coldheartedness will only create more terrorists. Adam Shafi will be tried not for his confusion or depression or anything other than for terrorist crime he may have committed.
What creates terrorists is terrorist ideology -- in this case, theology -- employed by existing terrorist institutions and individuals, who prey upon us all, and, in particular, prey upon the young and the impressionable. While the concept of "total war" that treats armies and civilians alike was rightly consigned to the garbage heap of history by the West post-WW2, Western society needs to resurrect a new form of total war. that is civilian-sparing, against Islamism -- which seeks to conquer and destroy "infidels" everywhere and which includes terrorism as a means.
131
This is the failed mentality of the drug wars. Unable to bring down the cartels, we have instead ruined thousands of young lives over minor drug purchases.
Focus on eradicating ISIS and especially on interrupting their communications with youth - privacy rights be damned, because this is indeed an emergency - and subject vulnerable youth caught up in misguided sympathies to special mandatory programs of the sort that cult-brainwashed kids sometimes must undergo. Engage the Muslim community in that, go ahead and surveil it to keep it clean, and fund it - that's a good idea that has been promised, and never followed up on.
Focus on eradicating ISIS and especially on interrupting their communications with youth - privacy rights be damned, because this is indeed an emergency - and subject vulnerable youth caught up in misguided sympathies to special mandatory programs of the sort that cult-brainwashed kids sometimes must undergo. Engage the Muslim community in that, go ahead and surveil it to keep it clean, and fund it - that's a good idea that has been promised, and never followed up on.
1
so your solution is to bomb Brussels; The former head of the CIA and the NSA said that crack downs per say only play to and reinforce the Islamist rhetoric and generate more recruits. I doubt if he is a bleeding heart liberal. If you want total war it has to be carried out on the economic and psychological battlefield.
1
Your characterization of Islamic people is a gross stereotype perpetuated by those who are abysmally ignorant about Islam, the true Quran and the differences imbued in the violent Hadith that were later additions. In my opinion, you Dennis resemble the bullies of Germany in the 1930s, willing to broadly accuse humble, innocent people who have not a bit of brutishness in their hearts. There are many wonderful, kind, helpful, civic-minded Islamic people all over the world.
As a veteran of the Vietnam War, as someone who has seen the devastation of war and those who pound the drums of savage war, to you I say, "J'accuse...!"
As a veteran of the Vietnam War, as someone who has seen the devastation of war and those who pound the drums of savage war, to you I say, "J'accuse...!"
1
So, the coal CEO Blankenship got 1 year in prison for causing 29 deaths and this young man gets 20 years for... what? Bad intent? Possible future crime (with no planning or ability to cause harm from details in the article)
Does the punishment fit the crime?
There definitely need to be programs to tackle radicalization. It's money well spent. Parents need to have faith that a viable future for the kids can arise as a result of the intervention. And, it keeps citizens safe by raising concerns about, and monitoring, a potential problem early on.
Does the punishment fit the crime?
There definitely need to be programs to tackle radicalization. It's money well spent. Parents need to have faith that a viable future for the kids can arise as a result of the intervention. And, it keeps citizens safe by raising concerns about, and monitoring, a potential problem early on.
194
I'm also wondering, given tha apparently watching news coverage of the Syrian conflict and refugees, whether each news program could be followed by a list of humanitarian groups working for/with refugees, or balanced with stories of those helping refugees. The point would be to give impressionable young people a channel for their emotional response that would be constructive and not destructive.
3
"There definitely need to be programs to tackle radicalization. It's money well spent."
How about sharply limiting the immigration of groups that are so very prone to terrorist activity and spend our money helping those who have spent their lives living here and paying taxes here. A costly new social program of questionable efficacy to deal with immigrants recklessly permitted in is absurd--especially given the backlog of hundreds of thousands seeking green cards who pose a near-zero security threat..
How about sharply limiting the immigration of groups that are so very prone to terrorist activity and spend our money helping those who have spent their lives living here and paying taxes here. A costly new social program of questionable efficacy to deal with immigrants recklessly permitted in is absurd--especially given the backlog of hundreds of thousands seeking green cards who pose a near-zero security threat..
3
The Huston plan under Nixon was our generation´s intervention program. Underage informers were sent into meetings of antiwar protesters to argue for violent protests, and then turned up as prosecutorial witnesses in criminal conspiracy cases. It´s happening again, where prosecutors seek draconian penalties for what should be protected speech.
American Muslims are understandably distraught at our invasion of Iraq, the resulting destablisation of Syrian and refugee crisis, and our practical support for the Israeli occupation of the West Bank and Gaza. Not to mention the killing of Houthis with whom we have no bone to pick, except that they are Shi´ites who our Saudi masters despise.
The message is, that the FBI is not your friend.
American Muslims are understandably distraught at our invasion of Iraq, the resulting destablisation of Syrian and refugee crisis, and our practical support for the Israeli occupation of the West Bank and Gaza. Not to mention the killing of Houthis with whom we have no bone to pick, except that they are Shi´ites who our Saudi masters despise.
The message is, that the FBI is not your friend.
14
One could take your hypothesis and extrapolate it to argue, for instance, that African Americans should be radicalising and preparing to wage war against America for the havoc we have wreaked upon subsaharan Africa through our support of dictators and Obama's drone bombing runs that kill thousands of innocent women and children. They do not. Similarly, Ukrainian Americans could argue that the Obama orchestrated coup in Ukraine and installation of a fascist government there that kills innocent people merits radicalisation and a fight against America. They do not. As the European experience continues to show, it is the homegrown Muslim community that is vulnerable to taking up arms against their adopted country. Religion, whether a distorted interpretation of it or not, is the issue.
2
There are two reasons your analogies do not hold: we have yet to bomb Ukraine, and most Ukrainian Americans probably support Obama´s policy there, and the government you refer to as fascist. But the charges that Adam Shafi face, are due entirely to his speech. Speech that should be permitted under the First Amendment. It remains to be seen whether the conversations he had, were privileged, or were even the result of entrapment. One can argue whether the Obama administration has misused its power to stifle dissent, but that Nixon misused it, was a major reason he faced impeachment and had to resign. Giving this power to a President Trump or Cruz is a gamble we can ill afford as a free country.
The tone of this article is far too sympathetic to the father's change of heart about his decision. Early in the article comes a line about him 'believing he was doing the right thing' by talking to the FBI, as if there were any doubt… Of course he was doing the right thing!! What he did was incredibly courageous and set a great example. It's a shame that he is now actively dissuading other parents in similar situations from doing the same. And it's a shame that this article, as written, stands a cautionary tale to other parents, implicitly suggesting that they should remain silent to protect their aspiring terrorist children. As painful as it must be for him to know he played a role in putting his son in jail for 20 years, at least his son has not been killed in Syria after spilling 'gallons of blood' as he had hoped to do.
The article paints both the father and the son as victims and the government as being somehow villainous. As far as I can tell, the only way in which the government remotely failed in this case was by allowing Adam to go home for a few days before after his last attempt to go to Turkey before actually arresting him.
The article paints both the father and the son as victims and the government as being somehow villainous. As far as I can tell, the only way in which the government remotely failed in this case was by allowing Adam to go home for a few days before after his last attempt to go to Turkey before actually arresting him.
151
What do you think about the reader who compared this situation to the coal ceo blankenship getting just a misdemeanor and one year for 29 deaths. I guess the difference is "business" for the CEO, and in america workers are just fungible goods.
The question we should ask ourselves as a society looking for its safety and security is justice was served? because they're fundamentally intertwined.
The policy of encouraging relatives to come forward and cooperate with the authority should have a kind of reward otherwise is doomed to failure as proven by the advice of the father not to talk to the authority and the lawyer.
The policy of encouraging relatives to come forward and cooperate with the authority should have a kind of reward otherwise is doomed to failure as proven by the advice of the father not to talk to the authority and the lawyer.
11
These are the same choices parents face when confronted with any kind of delinquency their children get involved in, whether it is drug addiction, prostitution or crime. There is only so much parents can do to help. Ultimately Mr. Adam Shafi is an adult, and as an adult, there are consequences to your choices. The reason Mr. Sal Shafi's story pulls our heartstrings is because he seems exactly like us, an honest, upright, well-educated citizen who built his life and looked after his family through his hard work. But the point is, that makes Mr. Adam Shafi's actions even worse, because it only shows that despite all the advantages he had, he was prepared to throw it all away for some toxic ideology and he did not care what consequences it had on his family and those close to him.
93
The conclusion of the father Shafi at the end is correct - there is no law and order solution of this problem, very much like a drug addiction. We need recognized institutions separate from police to work on these cases like the drug addiction rehabitation program. Time has come to start few of those specialized institutions with psychologists, religious teachers of Islam, ex-terrorists, exmilitary personnel, lawyers, ... to reorient these young children back to the compassion and love in their religion and accept the nonviolence means of social protest. I am sure Mr Shafi's work will ultimately bring goodness to the society and one day we all appreciate his sucrifice and contribution.
20
Anyone who ignorres or protects a child who is involved in terrorism is also guilty. If you suspect your child is involved, report them. Otherwise, you are not much of an American, parent, or human being. To allow for the possiblity that your child might mass murder says a lot about what a lousy human being you might be. Those who plan mass murder should have a trial, and then be quickly executed. Their parents should be closely investigated. It they knew what was happening, they should be prosectued also. If they are new to the country, they should have their citizenship revolked and be deported.
17
"Should have a trial and then be quickly executed"
Excellent. We no longer have time for the middle bit - you know, the what's it called thingy - oh yeah, a 'verdict'. Let's just give 'em a good fair trial then hang 'em high.
Excellent. We no longer have time for the middle bit - you know, the what's it called thingy - oh yeah, a 'verdict'. Let's just give 'em a good fair trial then hang 'em high.
5
I empathise with the father and, were I in his position, would hope for an unintrusive intervention, but the reality is a Saudi style luxury deprogramming program is unrealistic and unjustified. Why did the son have a sleeping bag as a comforter, some sort of preparation for impending hardship?
8
Sometimes mental illness and emotional distress in teens and young adults can manifest in destructive and self-destructive ideologies or behaviors: gangs, shootings, fundamentalism ... or flirting with terrorists. The more we as a society can help parents try to redirect or heal their kids, the more families will feel safe telling law enforcement about their troubled kids, and the safer we all will be. I know we don't have that now, and I feel for these families, struggling to figure out the right thing to do for their kids and society.
79
Oh, pluuease, stop blaming mental illness for every single ailment under the sun.
1
Mr. Shafi suspicions regarding Adam's potential violence against innocent people is well founded. A depressed (lifeless, empty, apathetic) 21 yr old (unemployed? attending college?) who occasionally "makes sandwiches" at a shelter, who becomes devoutly religious, who shockingly vanishes from a family vacation in Cairo, Egypt to sojourn to Turkey (other visits to follow), who, in his own words, yearns to "spill gallons of blood" for Allah as well as murder American soldiers, whose father strongly suspects Adam has been recruited, not only deserves our government's attention, but demands it. Thank you, Mr. Shafi.
146
Yes, parents should contact the authorities. By doing so, it was revealed that he had been radicalized and could do real damage here or abroad. Once again, the parents have no idea what their kids are capable. i.e. Columbine, etc. Past the point of counseling or other means. The risks are too great. Too easy to fake being "cured" and then (with our easy access to killing weapons) to take out people. I think this process worked the way it should have. Parents lose the right to isolate their children from prosecution when their children are dangerous.
19
I think the lesson should be, don't contact the police until you have evidence your son is actually fighting in Syria, or planning an attack here. This Father made the mistake of contacting the FBI way too early, when what he really wanted was counseling, not law enforcement.
Other, non-Muslims, have made similar mistakes. A couple years ago, a man was arguing with his son who then took the father's truck and drove off. Hoping to teach his son a lesson, the father called the police. The police chased the teenager and ended up killing him. That father has regrets similar to this one.
Other, non-Muslims, have made similar mistakes. A couple years ago, a man was arguing with his son who then took the father's truck and drove off. Hoping to teach his son a lesson, the father called the police. The police chased the teenager and ended up killing him. That father has regrets similar to this one.
14
This article leaves much to be desired. Was Adam born in the USA? If not how long has he lived here? It fails to explore the troubling decline in "melting pot americanism" One cannot deny the existence of enclaves in america. China town, little italy etc... However during WWII Germans, Italians, many first and second generation fought for this country. They were americans first and italians and germans, second. If you are unwilling to to accept this basic law of americana then you are a threat to the very existence of this country.
There is scant detail in the article about this. There is no real discussion as to the mental state of this young man. There is no real discussion about the many knuckleheads out there who say disturbing things but have no means to commit bad acts. He said he wanted to kill american soldiers. Bad stuff indeed but is he mentally unstable or did he take affirmative steps or otherwise act to accomplish said goal? Again the article is thin in this regard. We all want security but we need freedom too. Those that would sacrifice freedom for security deserve neither.
There is scant detail in the article about this. There is no real discussion as to the mental state of this young man. There is no real discussion about the many knuckleheads out there who say disturbing things but have no means to commit bad acts. He said he wanted to kill american soldiers. Bad stuff indeed but is he mentally unstable or did he take affirmative steps or otherwise act to accomplish said goal? Again the article is thin in this regard. We all want security but we need freedom too. Those that would sacrifice freedom for security deserve neither.
20
I truly fear that more and more policies and actions done in the name of national security do nothing more than terrorize our own people.
10
The world is replete with people and organizations extremely well versed in the art of persuasion. In fact, a large part of our economy is based on persuading people to do something they normally would not do.
During the 70's I watched as several of my friends were recruited into religious cults. I once even attended a recruitment session for a cult know as EST. (Erhard Seminars/Sensitivity Training). I found their efforts to own you so off-putting I left before the first session was over.
Religious cults often have a life and death hold on their disciples. Many young people find the real western religion, Consumerism, to be vapid and unfulfilling. Then of course there is the subtle pressure of bigotry the children of immigrants seem to be far more sensitive to than their parents.
It is my opinion that the war on terrorism, like the war on drugs, will go on for decades and will never be won, if the only response we're capable of is punishment. Remember, the Romans punished the Christians in every manner they could think of and we all know how that turned out.
During the 70's I watched as several of my friends were recruited into religious cults. I once even attended a recruitment session for a cult know as EST. (Erhard Seminars/Sensitivity Training). I found their efforts to own you so off-putting I left before the first session was over.
Religious cults often have a life and death hold on their disciples. Many young people find the real western religion, Consumerism, to be vapid and unfulfilling. Then of course there is the subtle pressure of bigotry the children of immigrants seem to be far more sensitive to than their parents.
It is my opinion that the war on terrorism, like the war on drugs, will go on for decades and will never be won, if the only response we're capable of is punishment. Remember, the Romans punished the Christians in every manner they could think of and we all know how that turned out.
66
Failure to debunk belief in magic and life after death is the greatest idiocy in American public education.
11
I thought you were going to talk about the brainwashing of the American public, who still believe that 9/11 was carried out by a group of arabs in a cave. This country reeks more terror on anyone else than any other country in history, and we do it by attacking ourselves, blaming others, and then starting wars. Which is why the civilized world shakes its head at us.
What we think Sal Shafi should do depend on where our moral lies. No doubt the FBI has yet to have better solution than locking Shafi's son up in jail for 20 years, but is that worse than the son killing people -- 10, 20, 30... -- men, women and children, then get caught and go to jail for 20 years, or killing as suicide bomber?
Once somebody is radicalized to kill, there is no perfect solution, short of de-radicalizing them back. But that is no easy task, is it? One which the Muslim community themselves are clueless to do. Heck, in fact the Muslim community are clueless on how to prevent the radicalization in the first place. May be this is something the Muslims can prioritize on rather than just reacting to being profiled negatively?
So let's not be too quick to judge, either way. Perhaps the law enforcement and the Muslim community can cooperate to set up intervention programs that preclude restraint outside of the jail system (like Baker Act) for trouble young people like this before they commit any terrorist acts.
Once somebody is radicalized to kill, there is no perfect solution, short of de-radicalizing them back. But that is no easy task, is it? One which the Muslim community themselves are clueless to do. Heck, in fact the Muslim community are clueless on how to prevent the radicalization in the first place. May be this is something the Muslims can prioritize on rather than just reacting to being profiled negatively?
So let's not be too quick to judge, either way. Perhaps the law enforcement and the Muslim community can cooperate to set up intervention programs that preclude restraint outside of the jail system (like Baker Act) for trouble young people like this before they commit any terrorist acts.
38
"...the Muslim community..." here we go again blaming terror on the Muslims when we all know that mostly men (any type) are terrorizing people in the world all the time with marital abuse, their guns and knives, the criminal police force beating and hurting innocent people or not, rape on college campus and other places, child molestation, robbery, kidnapping. Come on this is not just a Muslim thing! Why don't we focus on how to help all these men! Most women are not violent until the men give them the ideas!
2
I am guessing the point of this article is... that there is little chance of more cooperation if this is the result.
Mr. Shafi did the right thing; if not, tens of others could be casualties as well as his child. His son has already been brainwashed and unable to bring him back to sanity. At least in isolation, the boy can either fight his 'ideological demons or pursue his recalcitrance as a true jihadist. Those are the two roads for these madness. Seeking legal redress doesn't formulate any relieve and a majority of those released from Gitmo had returned to jihardism. Even the best re-conditioning systems cannot change what has evolved into a personal bucket wish list. I'd prefer to equate such obsession as a severe addiction with psychopathic and/or sociopathic tendencies.
18
Did you not read the end of the article that the father is suffering and says he wished he hadn't called the government? His son is now in jail for 20 years and when he is released he will be just as angry as when he went in. How is that a solution? The solution lies with helping people stay out of jail not putting them in jail! The solution lies with over population. There are too many people in this world and this is creating what we all know exists today, violence. There are too few people of wealth and means helping others and far too many people in poverty with no hope of anything for their future. There is way too much government corruption regardless of how many people there are so I don't know how to stop that including in the US. Humans have been killing each other and wiping out entire populations as long as we have been on this planet. Do you really think putting a young man in jail for 20 years is the answer?
2
What a maddening situation. It reveals that a young man, who resides in a good stable home, absent of poverty and with every opportunity can fall into the clutches of jihad. How does this happen? What is the allure? Is terrorism some kind of social drug addiction? That is, people think they can play with drugs and then walk away. They soon find out that they can't and the drugs become their masters.
Does terrorism work the same way? People from really great homes become drug addicts. Maybe it doesn't matter what kind of home life a person has. Once one samples the drug of the terror culture, they become hooked. We call it radicalized.
I have read that it can only take about two weeks for a person to become radicalized to jihad. Ditto for drugs. There must be some kind of addictive response going on for this to happen.
How do we treat drug abuse? Jail. Doesn't work. Jail doesn't cure an addiction. How do we treat jihad? Jail. It appears that many who embrace terror became radicalized in jail. Again, as with drugs, society has developed no treatment programs to combat radical jihad.
If I am correct, then the world has a serious problem with the spreading of jihad. It's a global epidemic of societal decay that can strike anyone anywhere.
There is something that lies very deep in the human psyche that jihad activates. The families can't combat it, the government has no treatment, and people keep
getting sucked into it.
Does terrorism work the same way? People from really great homes become drug addicts. Maybe it doesn't matter what kind of home life a person has. Once one samples the drug of the terror culture, they become hooked. We call it radicalized.
I have read that it can only take about two weeks for a person to become radicalized to jihad. Ditto for drugs. There must be some kind of addictive response going on for this to happen.
How do we treat drug abuse? Jail. Doesn't work. Jail doesn't cure an addiction. How do we treat jihad? Jail. It appears that many who embrace terror became radicalized in jail. Again, as with drugs, society has developed no treatment programs to combat radical jihad.
If I am correct, then the world has a serious problem with the spreading of jihad. It's a global epidemic of societal decay that can strike anyone anywhere.
There is something that lies very deep in the human psyche that jihad activates. The families can't combat it, the government has no treatment, and people keep
getting sucked into it.
273
The "something that lies very deep" in the human psyche is what religion taps into. Keep this religion away from the young like you would drugs. Religion has a narcotic effect on the frontal lobe. The sleep of reason produces monsters.
17
The first thing we me all must do is stop obsessing over the idea thare is a single solution. This notion, like the endless search for the single cause, is a favorite with government, the news media and the public at large. But complex problems tend to demand complex solutions, and we need to develop every tool, from the gentle to the draconian, if we are to have any chance of succeeding.
1
Yes it is something deep in the human psyche : a desire for meaning. It seems to me that these young men want to be part of something they see as heroic and therefore meaningful. They want to be part of something larger than themselves. They see muslims suffering in the world and their sense right and wrong is triggered. They may sincerely think they are being "righteous". Clearly these urges need to be channeled in some more positive outlet. That will be the hard part.
5
I think the lesson should be, don't contact the police until you have evidence your son is actually fighting in Syria, or planning an attack here. This Father made the mistake of contacting the FBI way too early, when what he really wanted was counseling, not law enforcement.
Other, non-Muslims, have made similar mistakes. A couple years ago, a man was arguing with his son who then took the father's truck and drove off. Hoping to teach his son a lesson, the father called the police. The police chased the teenager and ended up killing him.
Other, non-Muslims, have made similar mistakes. A couple years ago, a man was arguing with his son who then took the father's truck and drove off. Hoping to teach his son a lesson, the father called the police. The police chased the teenager and ended up killing him.
23
Indeed. It doesn't help parents making this choice that the material support for terrorism charge is so broad. If one is concerned that his child has been radicalized, then the child is probably convictable.
2
Muslim parents need help; turning one's children over to law enforcement cannot be easy. The best help they can get from the US government is a program that returns every Saudi financed mullah, and shuts down every Saudi financed mosque. Yes, the young impressionable kids with nascent anger and self-loathing will find messages of hate online and on youtube. But we need to begin somewhere.
There is no appropriate analogy here, but imagine if US financed radical preachers to open churches all across Saudi Arabia, and informed the flock that it was their divine duty to keep women in chains, and kill all infidels. The Saudis would never allow it. For good reason. So, why are we allowing them to do just that - here?
This cannot be done at a local level. The radicalization, and the message of hatred, "we are good, they are infidels" is occurring first in the mosque where families and friends go with their young impressionable ones - and legitimize the message.
Muslims - like everyone else - have a right to exist in a free society in which our government does not coddle, and allow a foreign government to finance sedition within our borders. Let's call Saudis for what they are: financiers of sedition in the US. This must stop.
I get that Mr. Shafi is hurting badly; but cooperating with law enforcement is the best way to go. Otherwise, everyone gets hurt because no one acted when necessary.
Kalidan
There is no appropriate analogy here, but imagine if US financed radical preachers to open churches all across Saudi Arabia, and informed the flock that it was their divine duty to keep women in chains, and kill all infidels. The Saudis would never allow it. For good reason. So, why are we allowing them to do just that - here?
This cannot be done at a local level. The radicalization, and the message of hatred, "we are good, they are infidels" is occurring first in the mosque where families and friends go with their young impressionable ones - and legitimize the message.
Muslims - like everyone else - have a right to exist in a free society in which our government does not coddle, and allow a foreign government to finance sedition within our borders. Let's call Saudis for what they are: financiers of sedition in the US. This must stop.
I get that Mr. Shafi is hurting badly; but cooperating with law enforcement is the best way to go. Otherwise, everyone gets hurt because no one acted when necessary.
Kalidan
47
All roads dont lead to Saudi Arabia. Daeesh are recruiting from Saudi too. The ideology that creates these groups is a khawarij mentality. The khawarij were a group ,who in early Islamic history, rebelled against their leaders. They rebelled and part of their actions included killing innocents.
One of the biggest red flags of "radicalization" is to hate Saudi Arabia.
Every single terror group hate Saudi Arabia for a variety of reasons. Saudi Arabia do not have a perfect state but they do not have an imperfect one either .
We are not in chains. Muslim women are not the world's new oppressed. We dont need to be your new world project.
I have never heard one Imam in my mosques call to kill " infidels ". Your rhetoric is exactly the type that fuels confusion.
One of the biggest red flags of "radicalization" is to hate Saudi Arabia.
Every single terror group hate Saudi Arabia for a variety of reasons. Saudi Arabia do not have a perfect state but they do not have an imperfect one either .
We are not in chains. Muslim women are not the world's new oppressed. We dont need to be your new world project.
I have never heard one Imam in my mosques call to kill " infidels ". Your rhetoric is exactly the type that fuels confusion.
Shah, are you being truthful? What does every Friday prayer's begin with - except the call for destruction of infidels? Where do the women sit in your mosque that you claim to speak for? With you, in a secondary room?
You are in chains. Moral and intellectual chains. Your denial is exactly the kind that has kept 90% of the good, decent Muslims on the planet in chains; at the mercy of nihilists.
Regarding your concern for the Saudis. Again, you are either in denial or are untruthful. All roads don't lead to any one place, but too many lead to moneyed interests in Saudi and Emirates; the government (massive royal family) and Sheiks. It has begat mosques and a belligerent, strident population that continually demands a special status. Enough already.
Sorry, no one, not you, nor anyone is that special. I see no reason at all for any accommodation from me to you. Your behavior is offending me, my beliefs about America as a land of the free where women choose to do what they want (and yes, wear what they want).
Just know this; I am no Trump supporter. And you are not my project. But please know that I am plenty fed up of the terrorism, violence, arson, angry youth, and seeing women being treated as second class citizens. I am not living in your caliphate, you are living in my free society that values all kinds of freedom. And yes, this country is more precious to me than all religions. Adapt, learn, and fall in love - like the rest of us have.
You are in chains. Moral and intellectual chains. Your denial is exactly the kind that has kept 90% of the good, decent Muslims on the planet in chains; at the mercy of nihilists.
Regarding your concern for the Saudis. Again, you are either in denial or are untruthful. All roads don't lead to any one place, but too many lead to moneyed interests in Saudi and Emirates; the government (massive royal family) and Sheiks. It has begat mosques and a belligerent, strident population that continually demands a special status. Enough already.
Sorry, no one, not you, nor anyone is that special. I see no reason at all for any accommodation from me to you. Your behavior is offending me, my beliefs about America as a land of the free where women choose to do what they want (and yes, wear what they want).
Just know this; I am no Trump supporter. And you are not my project. But please know that I am plenty fed up of the terrorism, violence, arson, angry youth, and seeing women being treated as second class citizens. I am not living in your caliphate, you are living in my free society that values all kinds of freedom. And yes, this country is more precious to me than all religions. Adapt, learn, and fall in love - like the rest of us have.
3
Kalidan, you are right that the government should have a program to return Saudi-financed mullahs and shut down Saudi-financed mosques.
However, this will never happen because the U.S. government is in bed with the Saudis. And why is that? Because of Americans' insatiable greed for oil. No American politician would risk voters' ire by doing anything that would stop the flow of oil.
So ultimately, all those who drive humongous gas-guzzling vehicles and go jetting around the world are, with their demand for oil, contributing to the rise of radical Islam.
However, this will never happen because the U.S. government is in bed with the Saudis. And why is that? Because of Americans' insatiable greed for oil. No American politician would risk voters' ire by doing anything that would stop the flow of oil.
So ultimately, all those who drive humongous gas-guzzling vehicles and go jetting around the world are, with their demand for oil, contributing to the rise of radical Islam.
2
Religion is an endless source of trouble, which is why the original states would not ratify the Constitution until it was amended to ban all legislation that gives respect to faith-based beliefs.
155
Contrary to what an earlier comment put forth the constitution didn't ban all legislation that gives respect to faith, all it did was say that all people would have the right to worship as they please (or not worship,if that was their choice).
6
The Constitution/Bill of Rights does give respect to faith-based beliefs. It just does not endorse them.
7
Its wrong to conflate all religions and label them as "an endless source of trouble" because the tenets of *one* religion, Islam, exhort 'believers' to kill 'infidels'.
3
I feel terrible for the parents who believed the government (FBI). This reach out program by the agency was so poorly executed that it has done more harm than good. The program has been reduced to reporting someone with gun in hand or a revenge tip. This very obvious outcome is inexcusable and I hope an official is reprimanded This is a resourceful parent, I can only imagine the outcome for less fortunate families. There is an opportunity to intervene, understand and prevent these young people from being radicalized. Unfortunately the FBI has blown their chance to be part of it.
22
Ruby Tuesday states the reach-out program " has done more harm than good". What if Adam Shafi (or someone else's son or daughter) had been wearing a bomb vest on a plane and your son or daughter was on the plane when it exploded? Or in the shopping mall or the concert hall?
Mr. Shafi has lost his son for a long time. What if he had lost his son while his son was murdering a planeload of people? Would he feel better knowing he had not turned his son in? I submit that he would feel worse, much worse.......feeling guilt every day for the rest of his life.
Mr. Shafi has lost his son for a long time. What if he had lost his son while his son was murdering a planeload of people? Would he feel better knowing he had not turned his son in? I submit that he would feel worse, much worse.......feeling guilt every day for the rest of his life.
40
This guy was already radicalized, it was too late to prevent it. Luckily, we have prevented another terror attack, maybe even one on our shores. The parents seem pretty clueless. Your son disappears and says he is in Turkey. How did he get there, who did he contact, etc. Check his phone and computer, I bet he was in contact with or was watching jihadi videos for quite some time.
4
Tragic! This father tried to do the right thing,that the government told him to do and now he has to live with the consequences for the rest of his life. He has no reason to feel that his son's actions are his fault. The young man was depressed and needed help. Parents hope for the best but don't always know what to do to help their children No one can judge him. His take away,"Don't turn to the government," is the only obvious one that he can make. The U.S. government grievously let this honest citizen down. I am not a supporter of Islam, in fact, I am Jewish, and I feel for this man.
53
The father didn't try to do the right thing, he did the right thing. Like many hard choices, both had consequences. Adam made the wrong choice and now lives where he belongs. Seems the system actually worked pretty well for a change. I am sympathetic to the family who lost their son but seems the loss was inevitable if Adam continued to have his way.
9
In a way, this attachment to an outside stabilizing group, however radical, is similar to the lure of "communes" felt in the early seventies by the disillusioned young, who missed the 1960's or who had abandoned a family home for many reasons: wanderlust, parental divorce or neglect, overprotectiveness. When I joined the "Moonies," the Unification Church, in 1973, this trend had become nationally visible thru the concept of "deprogramming" (cf. Patty Hearst), counseling and temporary confinement. I really think that if the motivation of young people like Adam was seen as a) an attachment disorder not associated with the specific Islamist context and b) treated in an organized, "interventionist" way by an established deprogramming system, there could be much more success in preserving family unity.
254
This, a thousand times over. Mr. Shafi's expressed regret in talking to the government, and his recommendation that other parents not follow in his footsteps, is the nail in the coffin of our anti-terrorism efforts. What bin Laden intended has borne very bitter fruit and most of us don't even recognize it: our mindless fear and kneejerk reactions are the very capitulation to terror that he was aiming for.
11
I think this is a view that reduces politics to psychology. There are real issues of oppression and injustice and lack of opportunity in the world and because some people respond to them in horrific ways does not mean the political issues themselves are irrelevant in understanding the response. I don't want to single this comment out, because so many others seem to avoid the role of governments, including our own, in the deeper sources of the problem. I am also struck by how many people think the Muslim communities are responsible for fully solving problems that they did not in any way fully create. I might ask the American Jewish community, who actually has a nuanced view of the current Israeli situation, to take responsibility and denounce AIPAC and the big PAC men, Adelson (Rubio then Trump) and Saban (Clinton) who poison our rational discussion of America's blind support if Israel, which plays a role in Muslin radicalization and endangers Jews as well as non-Jews everywhere. Or the Christian community, to denounce the right wing fundamentalist Christians who support Israeli expansion to fulfill a biblical prophecy about the Second Coming.
4
I agree that modern religions need to actively support reasoning and the separation of church and state.We cannot solve these problems solely with prison. But a certain percentage the population seems to like rigid, conservative religions.
. We already have so called charter schools teaching that science is bad, evolution is false and so forth. The Catholic church is purchasing hospitals to enforce no choice, no contraception, etc.
My ideal would be to do away with religion, make all their properties except the physical church taxable, and make it mandatory to teach reasoning, science,in all schools.
. We already have so called charter schools teaching that science is bad, evolution is false and so forth. The Catholic church is purchasing hospitals to enforce no choice, no contraception, etc.
My ideal would be to do away with religion, make all their properties except the physical church taxable, and make it mandatory to teach reasoning, science,in all schools.
1
The best choice is to raise your child with no religion. You will avoid having to make these particular hard choices if you encourage critical thinking, meaningful connection and obligation to your fellow citizens and gratitude for this life here and now. These Muslim terrorists don't get their ideas from nowhere. This is a spectrum problem (moderate parents, terrorist children) and at the root of it is Islam. Free your minds from pathological fairy tales so your children don't suffer and become killers. I feel bad for this father, though. That photo is devastating.
71
Ever heard of the Baader-Meinhof gang? Your don't have be be religious to be a terrorist. And the worst mass murders of the 20th century were committed by atheists--Stalin and Hitler.
2
It sounds like in this case the parents did raise their children with essentially no religion, unless you consider “don’t do bad things” to be a religion.
4
This article said that Mr. Shafi's religion basically consisted of the attitude, "Do good things." He as not heavily involved in institutional religion. Neither were the parents of several recent terrorists. Parents sometimes watch their children become pulled into conservative or fundamentalist religion when the parents themselves are not particularly religiously inclined.
In this case, the "ideas" seemed to be greatly influenced by media coverage of the Syrian conflict and refugees.
In this case, the "ideas" seemed to be greatly influenced by media coverage of the Syrian conflict and refugees.
1
People who are being drawn to Islamic terrorism are not necessarily religious and can easily avoid indications they are considering that path. The government should try to develop programs and so might Muslim communities, but these are band-aids. The deeper sources of recruitment are specific to each country. In France, for example, it's the marginalization of the Muslim community. In Tunisia, it's the lack of job opportunities for education youth. In the U.S. Muslims are well-integrated and thus far radicalization has been minimal. However, there are three potential factors that may offset that. The first is the Islamophobia generated by politicians and the media, which is probably making even affluent Muslim youth feel a growing lack of acceptance by peers and concerns about future employers. The second is American foreign policy, which has sided with Middle East despots and, autocratic regimes. In the latter category are the Saudis, who are adherents of the Wahhabist form of Islam which fuels Al-Qaeda and Islamic State. Finally, America's complicity with Israeli colonialism and never-ending expansion and concomitant ethnic cleansing. Among all the current presidential aspirants Sanders is the only one who is even willing to acknowledge that the settlements, forever ruled illegal by international law, should not exist.
There are going to be more stories like those involving Sal Shafi if these deeper sources of the problem are not addressed.
There are going to be more stories like those involving Sal Shafi if these deeper sources of the problem are not addressed.
21
Milton Mankoff wrote of "Islamophobia generated by politicians and the media".
I submit the Islamophobia is caused by Muslims who blow up planes / trains / automobiles / ships / buildings / hotels / concert halls / shopping centers and on and on.
Do all Muslims commit terrorist attacks? No. But the rise in Islamophobia can be tracked by the rise in terroristic attacks.
Some politicians count terroristic attacks beginning AFTER 9/11/2001, to make the numbers appear lower.......as if we don't know that 3000 Americans died on that awful day.
All news media report on terrorist attacks around the world. That's their job: to report the news.
Don't blame politicians or news media: blame those who cause the problems. Until you identify the problems, you cannot begin to find solutions.
I submit the Islamophobia is caused by Muslims who blow up planes / trains / automobiles / ships / buildings / hotels / concert halls / shopping centers and on and on.
Do all Muslims commit terrorist attacks? No. But the rise in Islamophobia can be tracked by the rise in terroristic attacks.
Some politicians count terroristic attacks beginning AFTER 9/11/2001, to make the numbers appear lower.......as if we don't know that 3000 Americans died on that awful day.
All news media report on terrorist attacks around the world. That's their job: to report the news.
Don't blame politicians or news media: blame those who cause the problems. Until you identify the problems, you cannot begin to find solutions.
14
Mr. Shafi absolutely did the right thing. He knew one of the consequences for Adam would be incarceration, and it is Adam's decisions, not his Dad's, that got him in trouble. If Adam could not intuitively know that supporting or even sympathising with known terrorist organizations is wrong, despite extensive contact with Federal agents and his Dad's efforts, then he was committed to his cause beyond hope. Maybe a girlfriend's calming influence could have helped - I don't hear anything about that possibility.
11
Adam Shafi is in prison because his father didn't listen to legal advice. An attorney told him not to contact law enforcement but he did so anyway. This program is a P.R./entrapment scam and Muslims ought to know that. Never, never, never contact law enforcement. Unless you want to end up with a long prison term.
Parents like Mr. Shafi should also let their children leave the country. As much as it may pain them. There isn't anything they can do to stop them and contacting law enforcement here means they will end up like this young man.
Parents like Mr. Shafi should also let their children leave the country. As much as it may pain them. There isn't anything they can do to stop them and contacting law enforcement here means they will end up like this young man.
16
If I had any thought that my child was becoming a terrorist I would have to call some type of law enforcement. Can only imagine how a parent feels when their child goes out and takes the lives of many and can imagine how much worse they feel if they had thought the child may do just that. Better for the child to be in prison than dead.
27
Brilliant!!! Let parents allow their radicalized child to leave the country to further develop their radical beliefs and put them into practice. Mr. Shafi made a painful decision and did the right thing!
21
Agree with you, jacrane. Mr. Shafi has lost his son for a long time but he could have lost his son while his son was murdering a planeload of people. I expect if this worst-case scenario occurred, he would feel terrible guilt every day for the rest of his life, knowing he could have prevented the murder of many people.
15
I feel safer with Adam Shafir in jail. His father would do just as well grieving for having raised a son who embraced terrorism instead of grieving for having reported that son. Just because Adam is young does not mean he is not dangerous. The tragedy is that of a family not knowing what they did wrong to raise a would-be terrorist. His attraction to terrorist groups was not just due to the influence of bad people; he embraced and chose to join terrorists. We are actually told very little about the son in this article, only about the father. This is similar to other cases of families that have no idea their child is about to commit violence and where others remark that they never saw it coming. Here, the family saw all the signs of imminent violence by their son and did the only thing they could to prevent complicity with it.
298
Don't be so quick to blame parents whose situation you know next to nothing about. Do you honestly believe that it only takes good parenting to prevent a child from taking a wrong turn? Are you even a parent yourself? Try visiting any number of support groups for families whose children got into trouble, then re-think this merciless conclusion of yours.
14
Thank you Rac. The son was on his way to becoming a killing jihadist. I'm sorry for the father but not really. He did the right thing. Perhaps allowing your kids to go to radical places, with radical people trying to turn them is not good parenting.
1
Like the vast majority of parents, I'm sure that the Shafis did their best to raise a good son. Yet he became radicalized. And some kids become drug addicts. While parent behavior undoubtedly plays a role in kids' development it is a bit too simplistic to assume that it caused terrorist tendencies.
5
I admit to having hugely mixed feelings about this case. Who wants kids desperate to join a terrorist cause free to do so? Yet, 20 years for the crime of what? It's not clear here - giving a bit of money, promising to come join in? What about innocent before proven guilty and destroying their lives at such a young age when their mental ability to judge morality is still forming? It eerily reminds me of the Aaron Swartz case, the admirable, brilliant "hactivist" who was threatened with multiple felony counts and 35 years of jail for WHAT? Making a political statement via downloading volumes of scientific research, which he had every right to do if it were for his own use (he never "used" it or sold it for anything). And then committed suicide - perhaps due to the legal battle placing him and his family facing financial ruin. I wonder if that is this young man's future as well. We do seem to need some more sanity in dealing with young, ideologically driven minds than simply threatening to take their whole lives away from them (and them from their families). It is all so heartbreaking.
383
Adam was probably convicted under the statute for material support of terrorism, which is incredibly broad. All one needs to do is offer one's support to a terrorist organization, even if the nature of that support is an inchoate future promise to do something.
2
According to the article, the case is at trail. He hasn't been sentenced to 20 years or even convicted. Lots of people face 20 year sentences if convicted for much more run of the mill charges than terrorism, the nome owner committing insurance fraud, the town clerk embezzling the tax receipts and so on. It sounds like a good measure of defense lawyering was written into this article, but in the wake of some terrible incident, the public outcry is always about why law enforcement didn't prevent it.
That is enough for me! Actually, just contacting a known terrorist organization is enough for me to agree with a person being jailed. This isn't a joke or a game any longer. If you promise to do something for me...I believe you and I expect you to carry out your promise.
1
Fathers like Mr. Shafi are our best hope for peace and freedom.
90
Uh, no. He's our worst hope - His message now to parents of troubled or confused children? “Don’t even think about going to the government.”
45
Why doesn't the Muslim community step up to the plate to address the problem? Surely they have the resources in this country to build and run an effective program to deter young people from becoming radicalized - and to deprogram those who need it.
This is not the job of US law enforcement. If the Muslim community offered such a program, one which was demonstrably successful, the FBI would not have to dabble in social work.
Parents like Mr. Shafi who find themselves in such a difficult situation should be able to turn to a trustworthy and reliably effective program - one which does not depend on US government law enforcement agencies.
The Muslim community needs to take responsibility for this.
This is not the job of US law enforcement. If the Muslim community offered such a program, one which was demonstrably successful, the FBI would not have to dabble in social work.
Parents like Mr. Shafi who find themselves in such a difficult situation should be able to turn to a trustworthy and reliably effective program - one which does not depend on US government law enforcement agencies.
The Muslim community needs to take responsibility for this.
400
In reply to Binx Bolling, your point is well taken. There are programs in individual communities to address this problem.
I am wondering why you didn't call for the same program in white communities, given the prevalence of mass shootings by white males.
I am wondering why you didn't call for the same program in white communities, given the prevalence of mass shootings by white males.
17
Are you willing to blame Christian churches for Timothy McVeigh?
14
As a Christian, am I responsible for preventing Americans who were raised by Christian parents to join ISIS? How about Christian parents whose children go on a shooting rampage, killing children in their school?
The majority of ISIS recruits have never read the Koran, and only know a perverted few slogans taught by equally irreligious leaders.
This father, a secular Muslim, "stepped up to the plate". The way the FBI handled it will certainly prevent other "Muslim" parents to contact law enforcement. Why is there no diversion program, including mental health, for 20 year olds?
My heart breaks for Adam's family. His father is like any other parent - sometimes we are put in a position by our children in which there is just no "good" choice. I hope his family will eventually heal from this ordeal.
The majority of ISIS recruits have never read the Koran, and only know a perverted few slogans taught by equally irreligious leaders.
This father, a secular Muslim, "stepped up to the plate". The way the FBI handled it will certainly prevent other "Muslim" parents to contact law enforcement. Why is there no diversion program, including mental health, for 20 year olds?
My heart breaks for Adam's family. His father is like any other parent - sometimes we are put in a position by our children in which there is just no "good" choice. I hope his family will eventually heal from this ordeal.
10
"His message now to parents of troubled or confused children? “Don’t even think about going to the government.”"
So it would be better to let your child kill people? How does this differ from other families whose children (or adult children) are killers or criminals?
So it would be better to let your child kill people? How does this differ from other families whose children (or adult children) are killers or criminals?
229
>>“Don’t even think about going to the government.”
>>So it would be better to let your child kill people?
Maybe he just means "Instead of going to the government, I wish I had sent him to a cult de-programmer / confiscated his passport and locked him in his room / done some other thing to stop him."
>>So it would be better to let your child kill people?
Maybe he just means "Instead of going to the government, I wish I had sent him to a cult de-programmer / confiscated his passport and locked him in his room / done some other thing to stop him."
You hit it right on the head. Thanks.
I think the question posed by this article is whether or not there is a middle way. It's far more likely that a parent with a child that is becoming radicalize will seek help if they know they will not be dooming their children to years in prison. If that were the case they would be far less likely to hide their children's problems from the authorities making all of us safer.
1
I think it was Ronald Reagan who said the scariest words were We're the govt. and we're here to help. Never truer words spoken. OJ Simpson was right, Deny Deny Deny.
4
Matt, you are defending O.J.? This parent did try to help but he had a very misguided and ill son. What is society to do? Give this kid a break because he had a nice father? This is why Muslims need to stay within a country that they feel more like others. They don't assimilate well, no matter how hard they try. Why should we continue to bring Syrian refugees to westernized nations? Rather, western nations should collectively send money and create "safe places' so they aren't completely out of their culture or displaced. I feel for this father but both the father and our government did the right thing.
15
Well I guess the Police, Fire Departments, Sewer Systems, Electrical Grid, Airports, Military, NASA, Food Research and Safety, CDC, Educational System, Financial System, Research Hospitals, Interstate Highways and Healthcare System - including SSI and Medicare are all a big problem.
The real problem was not so much that Ronald Reagan said something in a mocking, dismissive tone in his stump speech, it's that so many people cannot think it through 40 years later to understand just how simplistic and corrosive his little laugh line it was.
The real problem was not so much that Ronald Reagan said something in a mocking, dismissive tone in his stump speech, it's that so many people cannot think it through 40 years later to understand just how simplistic and corrosive his little laugh line it was.
36
I look at all the so called Christians who have fallen for the violent rhetoric of Trump and Cruz and ask myself, how do they convince themselves that theirs are true American values?
17
I feel the father's pain but after killings in San Bernardino I don't think I can blame agency for.being cautious. I just don't get these youths who live comfortable life -in this case what is the agency to do?
I am sure they have evidence of his violent intentions. ..
I am sure they have evidence of his violent intentions. ..
73
Your version of caution is 20 years in prison for thinking of a crime. If America is different than the U.S.S.R, this cannot stand.
26
Not exactly, Mark. The maximum penalty is 20 years. Adam will go through due process to see if he violated laws relevant to supporting terrorists. Exactly the opposite of the USSR.
9
If they do not have evidence, the court will discharge him. Courts responsibly do that every day of the week. We do not quite yet have fascist government that fascists are seeking. If you do not want fascist government, vote for responsible government. If you do not do so, then you will see real pain.
7
I can't even begin to imagine the agony of families such as this. Thank heavens I will never have to make that choice, and therefore I would never condemn the parent who did or did not choose to make it.
97
It is difficult, but the father did the right thing even if it means his son spends 20 years in prison. It was his son who made the choices that will determine if and for how long her does time, not the father. As far as I am concerned, if Adam were to have committed a terrorist act down the line and his father had not reported him tothe authorities, he should be charged with facilitating the activities of a terrorist.
62
Then you are part of the problem my friend. By not condemning a parent who chose NOT to turn his terrorist son in, you are sending a message that someones precious little boy is more important than the lives and welfare of innocents. The dad did the right thing. Period. Anything else is sponsoring terrorism. Let's not allow our bleeding hearts to get in the way of common sense.
16
Absolutely!
2