this whole f-bomb thing is getting ridiculous. It started with the Sopranos but it was warranted for that show, it worked. Then the suits decided that tossing in the f-bombs to every sentence would make their show another Sopranos. Thank God Matthew Weiner didn't go along with the program for Mad Men. Every character now has an f-word in nearly every line of dialog. I can't wait till this idiocy goes out of "style". I imagine buttoned-up types across the country who have the intelligence to watch this show wincing at the endless gratuitousness of it all. It's as if F-ing is the only adjective out there. Shame on Andrew Ross Sorkin for going along with this, but I sense the order came from upstairs....I for one can't wait for this "phase" in TV scripting to be over. I welcome writers to come up with some other expressions for a change...
5
Couldn't agree more. What's interesting though is that many people in the entertainment industry - from the actors to the writers - use the 'F' word in real life left and right. You would think people with such creativity and command of language would have more of a lexicon to draw from.
Look, I appreciate a good F bomb myself once in a while, but only when it's warranted. And 9 times out of 10 in TV these days, it's just not.
Look, I appreciate a good F bomb myself once in a while, but only when it's warranted. And 9 times out of 10 in TV these days, it's just not.
2
Great actors playing interesting characters engaged in a battle of wits make this a show I really enjoy. I would rather not hear the raunchier dialogue; although traders may talk that way, I think it is unnecessary and pandering. Ditto with sex scenes. Do the writers think we need that stuff in order to view the show as cutting edge? Because instead it flags a lack of belief in the quality of the rest of the show. And I agree, the scene in the strip club must be coming soon! Since we already saw the massage parlor. NEVERTHELESS, I look forward to the next episode!
2
This show is like ones in the earliest days of cable. Have sex scenes, some fake lesbian stuff, cocaine, lots of cussing and crude misogynist language, lots of the word the NY Times won't print especially by women, and the rest of it is terrible storylines and bad characterization. Is the obligatory strip club scene far behind? Bah
3
I enjoyed the first two episodes but think it could use more subtlety and logic. For instance, I liked Bobby sending in the faux SEC team to see how his staff would react, and I understand that he didn't tell Wendy because he's not sure he can trust her, but firing Victor was just stupid if V's knowledge of firm operations could provide him with revenge (whether Wendy scares him out of it or not).
The writers should do more to make Bobby likeable and to show why Wendy married Chuck. I always wanted to meet Giamatti's father! I wish that had happened before he died.
The writers should do more to make Bobby likeable and to show why Wendy married Chuck. I always wanted to meet Giamatti's father! I wish that had happened before he died.
1
Writing is so so heavy handed with way too many "sayings" & " teaching points".
As someone who is from Blue Collar NYC ( born in Bklyn in the 1970's and then raised in Queens my whole life) and knows many people who have gone to Wall Street to find their riches, I do not believe Bobby or wife have ever even been to an outer borough or Yonkers which is not in the Bronx NYT.
Have writers met guys from Brooklyn and the Bronx/Yonkers who are from nothing and got really rich? Seems no research was done to me..
Wife also sounds super Canadian to me and very hard to imagine him as anyone but Broody right now.
The lesbian coke story line is also ABSURD.. and the fact that Wendy works at Bobby's firm and pees on her husband is also ABSURD and just bad writing.
As someone who is from Blue Collar NYC ( born in Bklyn in the 1970's and then raised in Queens my whole life) and knows many people who have gone to Wall Street to find their riches, I do not believe Bobby or wife have ever even been to an outer borough or Yonkers which is not in the Bronx NYT.
Have writers met guys from Brooklyn and the Bronx/Yonkers who are from nothing and got really rich? Seems no research was done to me..
Wife also sounds super Canadian to me and very hard to imagine him as anyone but Broody right now.
The lesbian coke story line is also ABSURD.. and the fact that Wendy works at Bobby's firm and pees on her husband is also ABSURD and just bad writing.
4
I'm posting before I read ANY comments, but based in the recap , I am gonna hear a whole lotta hating. Haters in comment sections? Who could imagine such a thing! My comment is that this is great tv. Showtime has some of the best stuff on. Recap was great. There are some classic lines in both episodes. Speaking of episodes, hoping to see that come back. I guess californication is gone, though
7
I disagree with many of the commenters here; I think I am hooked now. First episode didn't do it for me--too technical--but with Brody in the series I decided to give it a second shot (plus I was too lazy to delete the series from my DVR and there it was last night in my recordings). My mind goes to mush when I hear most investment terms, but this episode had the right mix of technical and great soap opera stuff that is the reason most of us get hooked on a dramatic series. I think I'm staying for the duration.
6
Am I from a different planet???? I love this show and think it's miles beyond, say, the hyper-vaunted, melodramatic, corn-pone buddy-drama True Detective, Season One (never mind season two). "Billions" assumes the audience is sophisticated, and has fun with the writing, the talent, and the production. Is this program unpopular because it's not a downer, like so much "serious" television? Just like the Academy Awards, grim and dreary get the nods, while fresh and invigorating are disparaged.
16
i find it weird watching a show with so many good actors I've seen in other shows. Dennis Boutsikaris and Jack Gilpin --- regulars as defense attorneys on Law & Order (and, in Boutsikaris' case, on Better Get Saul as a corporate lawyer for a sleazy nursing home chain). And David Costabile, also seen as Daniel on Suits. Of course all of these on many other things. Still it's weird.
1
What's with all the negative comments here?! This is the smartest, best-written show since House of Cards.
The gratuitous sex is supposed to be gratuitous -- and it makes fun of itself. Two lesbians doing their thing while doing lines of coke is a classic male fantasy. Upended by The Fixer pointing out that it doesn't do it for him. [Thanks for including the scene that did.]
The female trader pumped up by the in house shrink and the Prom Queen's privates? Another poke at a classic male fantasy. As a woman, I find the use of sex here to be a fun rip on what supposedly constitutes the stuff of male traders' dreams.
Love the chess match between Damian and Paul. Looking forward to more Riderless Horse-type explanations for the moves (much like The Big Short). Really looking forward to elucidation re why The Axe wasn't in the office on 9/11.
The gratuitous sex is supposed to be gratuitous -- and it makes fun of itself. Two lesbians doing their thing while doing lines of coke is a classic male fantasy. Upended by The Fixer pointing out that it doesn't do it for him. [Thanks for including the scene that did.]
The female trader pumped up by the in house shrink and the Prom Queen's privates? Another poke at a classic male fantasy. As a woman, I find the use of sex here to be a fun rip on what supposedly constitutes the stuff of male traders' dreams.
Love the chess match between Damian and Paul. Looking forward to more Riderless Horse-type explanations for the moves (much like The Big Short). Really looking forward to elucidation re why The Axe wasn't in the office on 9/11.
8
Regarding 9/11, it seems to be loosely based on Cantor Fitzgerald who's CEO at the time, Howard Lutnick, was on vacation. Lutnick lost his brother as well as all employees of the firm located in the WTC.
2
Doesn't it seem likely that Axelrod survived the 9/11 attacks just because he was "out of the office" on a tryst with....Wendy!!
Agree w/you on this. More 9/11 next week, with the wife from Inwood. As a family member, I am watching quite carefully this part of the underlying story & theme.
After Michael Douglas (twice) and Leonardo DiCaprio--among others--played handsome, ultramacho Wall Street guys, do we really need another?
1
I never thought of Leonardo DiCaprio as macho, not even in Revenant. He's a man-child who's had the good fortune of being a Martin Scorsese favorite.
2
This show rocks! Love Bobby Axe and his revenge on the worthless rich who dissed him on the golf course so long ago. Both main characters make me glued to the set. The next Sopranos for me, in terms of much watch. Week 2 was awesome.
10
This show has Ray Donovan flaws but none of its strengths. Paul Giamatti is a force, and that tilts you to his character; though that's not the character I "root" more for. Lewis does not match Giamatti; though his character's roots are closer to home for me. Every "twist" you could see coming. Hoped for this show; don't know.
1
I'll give this show one more episode before I stop watching it. NONE of the characters are likable. They is no humor ANYWHERE, and yes, even serious dramas need some. Showtime got my hopes up with the recent airing of old "House of Lies" episodes. "Billions" is, so far, a very poor place marker until "House of Lies" returns.
1
I actually thought the second episode was better, although it crams too many 'ripped from the headlines and slightly modified' storylines into one episode. That doesn't bode well. It seems as if they're rushing to compress every hedge fund/Wall Street cliche into a short period of time.
It's funny, I too am looking at the number of comments here as a 'finger in the wind' gauge of how it's going over. It doesn't seem very promising. Interesting bit about it having a record opening.
It's funny, I too am looking at the number of comments here as a 'finger in the wind' gauge of how it's going over. It doesn't seem very promising. Interesting bit about it having a record opening.
2
People keep referring to her a psychologist. She is not. She is a psychiatrist. Her medical college degree was cited in the first episode.
The fact that the attorney has a dominatrix does not bother me. Many powerful people play dominance and submission games. However, I believe such a man would seek this outside his own home.
The writers who created the lesbian scene seem to be living in 1985, when such a thing would be looked at askance. Not today.
The fact that the attorney has a dominatrix does not bother me. Many powerful people play dominance and submission games. However, I believe such a man would seek this outside his own home.
The writers who created the lesbian scene seem to be living in 1985, when such a thing would be looked at askance. Not today.
2
This show is absolutely vile and I love it.
22
PRECISELY!! Hoe earnest and humorless can people be?
2
I'm enjoying this show, but struck by how utterly repellent the characters - especially Bobby Axelrod - are. Axelrod is, I think, supposed to inspire some degree of enthusiasm in the fans. After all, he is the little guy makes good. But he is so petty and obnoxious that he is hard to like. Similarly, his wife also comes across as equally predatory. I have no sympathy with the Ellis Eads family - they got their comeuppance for their entitled, unearned existence. But the very fact that Axelrod could be so petty so many years later is telling. It may well be that to be so successful in such a parasitic and worthless industry as hedge funds one has to be a petty, immature human being. But there is nothing appealing about it.
7
His prototype is running for president. And living in the land of hedge fund macho men, I can tell you these characters are SPOT ON. I mean, that's the whole point of this show. Otherwise, what's the point?
1
This is one of very few shows I turned off after the first 15 minutes - some of the worst writing I've had the misfortune to sit through!
7
Could barely focus on this week's episode, not engaging at all. And wouldn't a hedge fund tycoon wear clothes appropriate to Wall Street (at least a button-down shirt)? They're dressing Damian Lewis like a tech entrepreneur. Is there a point to that?
3
Yeah, that's how many, not all, dress. One guy I know has a thing for bowling shirts.
2
Poor characterization, bad dialog, cartoonish performances. Despicable scenes and degrading to women. Won't be watching. Don't care about any of these characters. They are not likable.
6
In an effort to generate an arc, the plot lines are obvious set ups with little intrinsic coherence. We all saw the coke&girls scene as pandering. The faux SEC raid showed us all major trades were guided by 'tips.' So the Big Reveal will have to be how Axelrod gets all the illegal insider info.
What's to watch for now ? If only there were more gritty authentic details of Wall St corruption as well as the strained effort to make a moral equivalent to public servants ambition. Rhoads may sens a family man to prison, but a crime was committed. Hedge Funds can put millions of people into the prison of poverty !
What's to watch for now ? If only there were more gritty authentic details of Wall St corruption as well as the strained effort to make a moral equivalent to public servants ambition. Rhoads may sens a family man to prison, but a crime was committed. Hedge Funds can put millions of people into the prison of poverty !
The writers of Billions need to develop these characters a lot more. Otherwise, the writers run the risk of depicting a caste that is too New Yorker-ish. Although these portrayals closely resemble the greedy, heartless ilk of ultra wealthy New Yorkers and Wall Street scum, most Americans will quickly tire of this schtick. Outside of the tri-state area, New Yorkers are mainly disliked for their coldness, rudeness and lack of kindness. Despite how proud most New Yorkers are of ourselves and the city that immigrants built, most Americans don't share the love for the big-mouthed, icy hearted rich Manhattanites that reside on Park, Madison and Fifth. The writers can either step up their writing and character development or this show will fade into oblivion. Thus far, the characters are a little too godless for a country that loves God and guns.
The so over-the- top writing reminds me of an even more ridiculous Boiler Room scene, or some sort of Glengarry Glen Ross ripoff....also the part that psychiatrist Wendy plays is absurd. Why does Axe give a hoot what she thinks? And she is married to the US Atty and works doing in house sessions in an investment firm? Also , with just a bit of bondage and weirdness thrown in for good measure. This show is very disappointing ........
2
Imagine reversing the casting of the two leads: Paul Giamatti plays the business tycoon, Damian Lewis plays the relentless prosecutor. Wouldn't that have been more believeable?
4
Women are not sell served by Billions, far worse than the plight of women in the financial industry in general. The best of the bunch so far is the psychologist who seemingly ably services the psyches of the hedge fund employees, but her professional acumen at work is not enough to define her skills - no, she must also be a dominatrix at home. Other female characters are the cutthroat wife sidekick, a lesser female employee who talks about her balls, an employee who rats out her boss to hide her sexual secrets, etc. Much of the dialogue wallows in over the top thinly veiled sexual aggression. So women are for sex, servitude, and sidekicks. How utterly ridiculous. Bye bye, Billions.
3
I grow so WEARY of people thinking drama has to cut their own personal political gib.
this series is such a disappointment right now.
9
These people are all despicable, each in his or her special way. I'm only watching because Damian and Paul are captivating actors. But I'm not sure I'll stay with it.
7
This will be come bery obvious and predicatble as the weeks go on. We will become bored with Axe's revenge blather. Billions will not be a Homeland or Sahmeless or even for Damien Lewis, Band of Brothers.
3
The lines are plenty trite, as expected from this predictable writing team, but Giametti is always entertaining no matter the script! Rock on Pig Vomit.
2
No show can survive unless you like the characters. The Sopranos were crooks- but you liked Tony and his mob. No one is likable in Billions.
4
I certainly did not like Tony and his mob. They were scumbags - first class sociopathic creeps. I've always been puzzled by people who liked these examples of human filth. Don't their actions matter?
Ditto Mr. Tobias' final bullet point!
1
Maybe gratuitous; but it's good to see Terry Kinney again. He also had a smallish role in the second season of Fargo.
1
Bobby is from Yonkers, not the Bronx. I thought the thing with Chuck and the single dad made an interesting point about morality on both sides. I've spent 39 years working on Wall St., this is indeed cartoonish, that's why I love it!
11
Actually, they've repeatedly said they're from Queens
Nope, Yonkers
. By contrast, Bobby comes across like a working-class hero. Raised in Yonkers, where he resented the elite families he worked for as a golf caddy, he’s a self-made billionaire who enjoys humiliating other one-percenters and rewards his cash-strapped buddies by jetting them off to see Metallica in Quebec. True, he also occasionally conducts meetings in the nude while he’s running Axe Capital, a venture that sounds like a body spray for investment bankers. But while Billions pokes fun at his ridiculous douchiness, it’s betting that viewers will root for him, too.
. By contrast, Bobby comes across like a working-class hero. Raised in Yonkers, where he resented the elite families he worked for as a golf caddy, he’s a self-made billionaire who enjoys humiliating other one-percenters and rewards his cash-strapped buddies by jetting them off to see Metallica in Quebec. True, he also occasionally conducts meetings in the nude while he’s running Axe Capital, a venture that sounds like a body spray for investment bankers. But while Billions pokes fun at his ridiculous douchiness, it’s betting that viewers will root for him, too.
3
Andrew Ross Sorkin should be ashamed to be involved in something this awful.
And the New York Times should have a prominent disclosure, above every one of its reviews, that one of its most renowned writers has a financial interest in this production.
Terrible dialogue, absurd charactizations with some kinky sex gratuitously thrown in. Truly awful.
And the New York Times should have a prominent disclosure, above every one of its reviews, that one of its most renowned writers has a financial interest in this production.
Terrible dialogue, absurd charactizations with some kinky sex gratuitously thrown in. Truly awful.
19
the actors are fun to watch but the languae is ridiculously cartoon ish and gratuitously offensive and decidly anti-woman. i assume its becuase the show is on an uncensored SHO but its ridicuolus (though decidly less so than the self-censorship of language practiced on behalf of its viewers and readers by both the NYT and MSNBC which is amazingly naive and condescending) and one female worker with a smartphone recording app and a human resource officer could have the entire company under lawsuit in minutes. also, the use of an in-house psychologist to 'pump up' the frail egos of the workers is luducrous. ths show calls out depararelty for some decent writing that makes use of the considerable acting talent of the cast. i often wonder how fine actors justify appearing in such garbage and then recall that when asked that question, Water Mathau replied "because my wife and i have expensive tastes".
5
Still kind of loving it. Paul Giamatti is a superstar in my book. Now we need to see Axe be as comparably multi-dimensional. I reluctantly forgive the writers. No writer on cable can resist cocaine-sniffing lesbians. Sad, but true.
12
It's a draw between JWK and AMT, one marches on, the other checks out. Me?
Stay tuned!
Stay tuned!
1
I didn't get that allusion at all.
The setup is too convinient. The U.S. Attorney's wife is the shrink at Axe Capital. It jumped the shark already.
7
I don't think that you can say it's "convenient" since we don't know how the Giammatti character met his wife, who was with Axe before she met Chuck. It is entirely conceivable that Chuck met Wendy at some event and things went from there. The show does make it clear that the tension between Wendy's job and Chuck's office is an ongoing concern.
Love the show. The writers in some sense emulate Michael Lewis, in taking some kernels of truth and writing great fiction around it. Axe is a combination of Steven A Cohen and Howard Lutnick, and maybe others as we might see in later episodes. A little hard to imagine Mr. Sideways (Giamatti) as Preet Bharara, but he's enjoyable to watch. And that piece of lesbian porn is the stuff traders will remember the most when discussing the show during trading lulls.
9
Dwarf tossing or tazing in future episodes??
2
Look, it wouldn't be Showtime without a lesbian cunnilingus cocaine scene. Are we led to expect some serious dwarf dominatrix debauchery next? Rolled straight over from this to Downton Abbey and struggled to stay awake—soap is soap, even if some is dirtier than others.
2
Of all the characters Axe's wife continues to ring the most true to me. Tough Irish American lass who is getting off on her husbands power and ruthlessness as much, or maybe more, than he is. It will be interesting to see if her loyalty to him gets tested and if so how she responds. This is the kind of show I wish were one I never watched and now it is all available on demand and I can marathon it. So there is my review.....a great future marathoning series!
2
Episode 2 was better, much improved from the Pilot.
4
I don't agree...I had higher hopes after the pilot. How tired was the lesbian sex/cocaine taping as leverage? It reminded me of a scene from Carol...Bobby in his tee shirts is a wild distraction. Can't someone zhush him up in a little Cucinelli?
1
*clarification, Carol was a beautiful love story. I was alluding to the secret filming and black mail of a lesbian tryst.
1
I'm done with this one
7
I switched off after the virgin Mary comment. Great show but going a bit too far trying to be cool.
3