There's a contract: Students are to cooperate, attend class, study, do homework, generally apply themselves, and meet reasonable standards with the aid of competent instruction. In return, they are supposed receive the skills and credentials they need to be informed American citizens and to make a living. That's the deal. Anything short of that operates as a fraud on our young people. Part of this ongoing fraud is a function of the way public education is funded -- to wit, property tax. This perverse system guarantees gross inequities in our schools and perpetuates the economic and racial disparities that American values are supposed to abhor. Another part of the problem is the undervaluing of the teaching profession in terms of prestige and compensation. Both have become ingrained in the educational system. We are going to need much better politicians and a determined polity to over come these very serious problems.
9
The evident wrongness of the notion that simply saying something will be so can make it so was the reason I rejected standards based education as it was introduced all those years ago. I knew with scientific certainty that standards based education would fail even in the early 1990s because its expectations seemed oblivious to basic statistical concepts like average and standard deviation.
To optimize a process, we must first know process capabilities. To know what our education system is capable of, we must submit its outputs to careful statisticsl analysis and set goals that can reasonably be achieved by the target population and the resources we are willing to allocate.
We have that data. Why do we pretend it doesn't suggest clear limits on what our students, individually and collectiveky, are capable of?
It would be great if just wanting something to be true could made it true, but life does not work that way and we all know it.
To optimize a process, we must first know process capabilities. To know what our education system is capable of, we must submit its outputs to careful statisticsl analysis and set goals that can reasonably be achieved by the target population and the resources we are willing to allocate.
We have that data. Why do we pretend it doesn't suggest clear limits on what our students, individually and collectiveky, are capable of?
It would be great if just wanting something to be true could made it true, but life does not work that way and we all know it.
7
This is not a country that admires highly educated people. It must be one of the few countries where calling someone an intellectual is not a compliment. Most people have little understanding of the technology that they rely on every day and in many of the nations' schools they are still arguing about something as basic as teaching evolution in science class. A devastating storm is more likely to have our politicians calling for prayer than calling for more meteorologists. An acquaintance moved to the north and couldn't understand why winter days were shorter... I sometimes feel like I'm living in the Middle Ages not a sophisticated 21st century society, with all this belief in the supernatural and such a low level of understanding of the natural systems that govern the earth we live on. We value good looks above everything, and style over content. We teach our children to rely on technology (calculators, spell checkers, cell phone apps) but don't equip them with the skills to control or direct that technology, just to consume it. We worship our sports stars and denigrate the nerds.
I believe more of the population are literate than a couple of generations ago, which is obviously a good thing, but compared to most of the world, we are falling behind in STEM, and our educational standards are too low for the challenges ahead which need rational analysis and technical literacy. Does it matter, when we can import the scientists and engineers we need from overseas? Do we care?
I believe more of the population are literate than a couple of generations ago, which is obviously a good thing, but compared to most of the world, we are falling behind in STEM, and our educational standards are too low for the challenges ahead which need rational analysis and technical literacy. Does it matter, when we can import the scientists and engineers we need from overseas? Do we care?
25
"The first results, from the ACT college admissions tests, showed that only about a quarter of students statewide were ready for either college-level math or reading. "
A quarter. That is the fraction of students that originally were expected to be admitted to the California State University system. Now, we suppose everybody goes.
Call me an elitist. I own the label proudly. A quarter of all students are capable of college level work. I have watched stunts who do not fall into that group struggle with basic concepts like fractions and percentages.
Here is an ugly fact, staring us in the face. A small proportion of folks are able to succeed in traditional college level courses. Make of it what you will, but there is a natural range of abilities, and lots of people are not made for what used to be college work.
So, two choices. Change the graduation requirements. Or try to teach people who can't handle the traditional requirements. I predict difficulties with this second approach.
The old concept of the 'semi skilled job' needs to be brought back. You can NOT teach large numbers of people how to code and master all the intricacies of 'high tech'.
My first "real job" expected me to thread laces into sneakers. It does not require a ton of brains to do that.
Bring back THOSE jobs. Give up this hopeless dream of supposing everyone can do algebra and computer programming. I find those hard enough myself, and I am rather bright.
A quarter. That is the fraction of students that originally were expected to be admitted to the California State University system. Now, we suppose everybody goes.
Call me an elitist. I own the label proudly. A quarter of all students are capable of college level work. I have watched stunts who do not fall into that group struggle with basic concepts like fractions and percentages.
Here is an ugly fact, staring us in the face. A small proportion of folks are able to succeed in traditional college level courses. Make of it what you will, but there is a natural range of abilities, and lots of people are not made for what used to be college work.
So, two choices. Change the graduation requirements. Or try to teach people who can't handle the traditional requirements. I predict difficulties with this second approach.
The old concept of the 'semi skilled job' needs to be brought back. You can NOT teach large numbers of people how to code and master all the intricacies of 'high tech'.
My first "real job" expected me to thread laces into sneakers. It does not require a ton of brains to do that.
Bring back THOSE jobs. Give up this hopeless dream of supposing everyone can do algebra and computer programming. I find those hard enough myself, and I am rather bright.
25
The policies promulgated by politicians have created this mess. Instead of addressing poverty and providing early childhood education with lots of discovery, play, stories and fantasy, we have early "academic" work and lots of computers. Everything we have done is contrary to current knowledge of child development.
On a different, similarly depressing note: I've encountered many folks with Ph.D's or E.D's, who can't write, can't think and haven't had an original thought in their lives. A graduate degree used to indicate a real level of scholarship and intellectual acuity. Now they are a dime a dozen.
On a different, similarly depressing note: I've encountered many folks with Ph.D's or E.D's, who can't write, can't think and haven't had an original thought in their lives. A graduate degree used to indicate a real level of scholarship and intellectual acuity. Now they are a dime a dozen.
22
Sorry, but I think this article does not really meet my needs. To start with, even 70 years ago, in a group of high school students, did we ever find that the majority would have been ready for college math? HS graduation should grant some level of competence but are we setting expectations too high?
7
37% of the US population has an IQ of 95 or less. And half the population is less than average. How do we fix this? Or can it ever possibly be changed?
Let's face it, we aren't generally turning out college bound material.
The most educated people are having only 1 or 2 children. The bottom half are multiplying more rapidly therefore we've got a general population with a decreasing level of IQ. So in short yes, we are becoming more stupid.
Let's face it, we aren't generally turning out college bound material.
The most educated people are having only 1 or 2 children. The bottom half are multiplying more rapidly therefore we've got a general population with a decreasing level of IQ. So in short yes, we are becoming more stupid.
23
"Los Angeles initially required that students earn at least a C in those classes, but the number of students on track to graduate plummeted. Now grades of D or higher are accepted." - NYTimes
That trend would continue into the college so more talent development programs in colleges to get these students up to speed in college are getting popular. I am afraid the value of a college diploma won't be as worthy as before. We need to educate today's students to become tomorrow's citizens who can think and make good decisions for themselves and their families.
That trend would continue into the college so more talent development programs in colleges to get these students up to speed in college are getting popular. I am afraid the value of a college diploma won't be as worthy as before. We need to educate today's students to become tomorrow's citizens who can think and make good decisions for themselves and their families.
3
The US Department of Education has awarded a research grant to evaluate a new text formatting method -- called Visual Syntactic Text Formatting -- that has been shown to add an average of 3 points to students' ACT scores in reading.
With half of college freshmen starting college, especially community colleges, with borderline ACT scores in the 18 to 20 range, the 3 point boost from this new format, which trains the brain to read words in groups in addition to one. Word at a time decoding, has the potential to cut the US college drop out rate in half.
With half of college freshmen starting college, especially community colleges, with borderline ACT scores in the 18 to 20 range, the 3 point boost from this new format, which trains the brain to read words in groups in addition to one. Word at a time decoding, has the potential to cut the US college drop out rate in half.
How 'bout the goal is LEARNING???
When did learning become just another commodity?
No wonder kids don't learn well in these pushy high schools where the only goal is to go on to college and get a career.
If Learning is not its own reward, it is cheap and useless.
When will parents, administrators, and politicians GET that??
When did learning become just another commodity?
No wonder kids don't learn well in these pushy high schools where the only goal is to go on to college and get a career.
If Learning is not its own reward, it is cheap and useless.
When will parents, administrators, and politicians GET that??
10
I continue to be AMAZED at the obsession with he focus on 'urban schools' when the FASTEST rates of poverty lies and are in the SUBURBS!
1
I spent two years working in urban schools, and now work for an Ed nonprofit that operates within the same urban district. While I don't claim to be an expert, it has given me enough insight to feel comfortable commenting on this issue.
In so many urban districts, there is a shocking lack of parental support. It's tough to motivate (let alone discipline) a student when they feel comfortable daring you to try and get ahold of their parent. The family unit is incredibly important to the success of any individual student, but of course, it's now passé to suggest that family does/should matter in American culture.
Underperforming students generally fall off track relatively early on, and learn quickly that regardless of what is said, they will be pushed through the system. Elevated graduation rates are being celebrated around the country as college and career readiness steadily declines.
In this country, we continue to glorify equality to such an extent that we insist upon equal outcomes. It used to be considered viable to pursue trade or technical school, but beyond the lip service paid to "career readiness" in high school, the push is always toward college these days. Why? Our grandparents
In so many urban districts, there is a shocking lack of parental support. It's tough to motivate (let alone discipline) a student when they feel comfortable daring you to try and get ahold of their parent. The family unit is incredibly important to the success of any individual student, but of course, it's now passé to suggest that family does/should matter in American culture.
Underperforming students generally fall off track relatively early on, and learn quickly that regardless of what is said, they will be pushed through the system. Elevated graduation rates are being celebrated around the country as college and career readiness steadily declines.
In this country, we continue to glorify equality to such an extent that we insist upon equal outcomes. It used to be considered viable to pursue trade or technical school, but beyond the lip service paid to "career readiness" in high school, the push is always toward college these days. Why? Our grandparents
20
" decline in the teenage pregnancy rate"
Thank you Clinton era welfare reform.
Thank you Clinton era welfare reform.
I give here a practical example of how things can be easily got done by the children if we groom them properly right from early stages.
My daughter and son - in - law stay in Ann Arbor, MI. Right from the day when her daughter was born, my daughter started talking to her baby. My daughter's mother tongue is Telugu. My son - in - law's mother tongue is Marathi. So they have been speaking to their baby in Telugu, Marathi and English till now. My granddaughter is one and half years old. She understands all the three languages and also speaks a few words in these languages too. She identifies my relationship, that of her mother and my wife in Telugu and that of her father in Marathi.
When my daughter sings a particular tune, her daughter immediately picks the concerned nursery rhyme. Whenever I ask her through Skype to bring certain letters and certain alphabets, she plucks the same from her mat and shows them to me. She also identifies colours. In addition, she makes the sounds of certain animals etc.
Many of my relatives in America and in India are doing same and may be even more. I think this is the only way to groom our children in a systematic manner in order to make them responsible students and citizens later on.
My daughter and son - in - law stay in Ann Arbor, MI. Right from the day when her daughter was born, my daughter started talking to her baby. My daughter's mother tongue is Telugu. My son - in - law's mother tongue is Marathi. So they have been speaking to their baby in Telugu, Marathi and English till now. My granddaughter is one and half years old. She understands all the three languages and also speaks a few words in these languages too. She identifies my relationship, that of her mother and my wife in Telugu and that of her father in Marathi.
When my daughter sings a particular tune, her daughter immediately picks the concerned nursery rhyme. Whenever I ask her through Skype to bring certain letters and certain alphabets, she plucks the same from her mat and shows them to me. She also identifies colours. In addition, she makes the sounds of certain animals etc.
Many of my relatives in America and in India are doing same and may be even more. I think this is the only way to groom our children in a systematic manner in order to make them responsible students and citizens later on.
8
I taught for 25 years and retired 2 years ago and would never recommend teaching to anyone! Teachers are at the mercy of school administrators who demand a certain pass rate for every classroom in order to placate the latest round of ‘quick fix’ legislation by know-nothing, self-serving politicians. Students are apathetic and know full well that if they fail a course, eventually they’ll pass – either by edict of the principal requiring that their much-deserved failing grade be changed - or in a dumbed down credit recovery course, where all they have to do is pass a few multiple choice quizzes over the material they just failed. Oh…I should mention that those credit recover classes allow students 5 attempts to pass each test and quiz en route to demonstrating ‘mastery’ of the subject matter.
We’re churning out kids who have no concept of what hard, honest work is, or with skills to succeed in life – and they’re the generation that’s going to pay off our almost 20 trillion dollar debt? We’re in big trouble! The wealthy kids who go to exclusive private schools will continue to do well, while the kids in public education (the majority of which are now minorities) will continue to fall behind and be suited to do nothing more than fill low-wage, dead-end jobs….just the way the Republicans want it.
We’re churning out kids who have no concept of what hard, honest work is, or with skills to succeed in life – and they’re the generation that’s going to pay off our almost 20 trillion dollar debt? We’re in big trouble! The wealthy kids who go to exclusive private schools will continue to do well, while the kids in public education (the majority of which are now minorities) will continue to fall behind and be suited to do nothing more than fill low-wage, dead-end jobs….just the way the Republicans want it.
25
I was with you right up to your last phrase. Really? You honestly think this a Republican problem? I live in a majority Democratic area and the same problems exist. I believe both major parties are failing miserably to address the education of the next generation.
17
Everyone seems to agree that the public schools are largely broken, by many measures.
The Democrats and teachers unions have had largely unfettered control of these public schools for the last half century. We are spending about $15k per kid throughout the country. It's long past time for a new direction, for the abandonment of the political correctness that has been imposed upon us. It's time for some truth, and for a real focus on the task.
It's time to get to work.
The Democrats and teachers unions have had largely unfettered control of these public schools for the last half century. We are spending about $15k per kid throughout the country. It's long past time for a new direction, for the abandonment of the political correctness that has been imposed upon us. It's time for some truth, and for a real focus on the task.
It's time to get to work.
10
Of course we want all our students to be well-educated, to be able to handle mathematics, to write comprehensively and to think logically. But not all students are meant for college. Nor should they necessarily be "career ready" when they graduate from high school. Instead, a high school diploma should be looked on as the "next to last" step for virtually all our students. Those in the top 20 to 30 percent of each class, should go on to a four-year college. Others should go on to a "technical" school or community college where they are trained for various trades. This country suffers from a lack of carpenters, plumbers, electricians, millwrights, phlebotomists, X-ray technicians, computer repairmen and trained factory workers who know how to repair robots and run complex assembly lines, etc., etc., etc.
When living in Europe, I saw children deliberately sent down a technical track in their very early teens. By the time they were 20, they had already received the equivalent of a high school diploma, an associate's degree in their chosen field and had been working as an apprentice in the field as well. These young people were now well-equipped to earn a good living and support a family. This type of education is virtually non-existent here in the USA, to our detriment.
By denying our children these opportunities, we are not only hurting them but making our nation less rather than more competitive.
When living in Europe, I saw children deliberately sent down a technical track in their very early teens. By the time they were 20, they had already received the equivalent of a high school diploma, an associate's degree in their chosen field and had been working as an apprentice in the field as well. These young people were now well-equipped to earn a good living and support a family. This type of education is virtually non-existent here in the USA, to our detriment.
By denying our children these opportunities, we are not only hurting them but making our nation less rather than more competitive.
26
Non-educator Arne Duncan is quoted in the article as saying, "But “the goal is not just high school graduation,” .... “The goal is being truly college and career ready.”
Tragically humorous as perhaps no Secretary of Education has de-emphasized important meta-cognition skills as Arne. These are difficult to impossible to measure and simplistic measure are easy to show in a spreadsheet. PARCC's complexity favors those districts who emphasize thinking skills and deep understanding. So much time and effort is spent in the dog-and-pony show of simple data that districts often have no ability to interpret accurately among admins and BOEs whose data skills are limited at best and who foster haphazard pedagogical decisions onto teachers and students.
Most of the last decade in education, but especially under Duncan, has been predicated on the idea that teachers have no idea how to teach and that local BOEs should also lose some autonomy.
Key issues remain unresolved: there is an enormous link between income and academic success as well as waning parental responsibility to support schools and teachers. Failure is no longer the responsibility of the student, but of the army of teachers and student support staff who "failed" the student who spends more time gaming, surfing the net, and the like rather than on studies. Many parents have put all responsibility on the schools who now are as much a social as academic institution for many students.
Tragically humorous as perhaps no Secretary of Education has de-emphasized important meta-cognition skills as Arne. These are difficult to impossible to measure and simplistic measure are easy to show in a spreadsheet. PARCC's complexity favors those districts who emphasize thinking skills and deep understanding. So much time and effort is spent in the dog-and-pony show of simple data that districts often have no ability to interpret accurately among admins and BOEs whose data skills are limited at best and who foster haphazard pedagogical decisions onto teachers and students.
Most of the last decade in education, but especially under Duncan, has been predicated on the idea that teachers have no idea how to teach and that local BOEs should also lose some autonomy.
Key issues remain unresolved: there is an enormous link between income and academic success as well as waning parental responsibility to support schools and teachers. Failure is no longer the responsibility of the student, but of the army of teachers and student support staff who "failed" the student who spends more time gaming, surfing the net, and the like rather than on studies. Many parents have put all responsibility on the schools who now are as much a social as academic institution for many students.
10
The plethora of test today only values simplistic cognitive knowledge. That is all that "Race to the Top" under non-teacher Arne Duncan has desired. Local and state BOEs love quickly understandable data and loathe complex, hard-to-measure concepts such as problem-solving and critical thinking. Therefore students and teachers are both judged by the most simplistic ways out there. As state BOEs have increasingly demanded teacher evaluations be linked to the test scores of students (perhaps the only industry where others' performance is used to evaluate someone ELSE), teachers have caught on and de-emphasized critical thinking and other meta-cognitive and cognitive skills that admins and BOEs do not care about. This has worsened now as more districts have moved toward social promotion including insipid programs where work not turned in no longer receives a zero, but 42% to "help" students insure that pass and do not take up more time--and dollars--in the educational system.
The current educational atmosphere is about hurrying students along with minimal accountability while developing pathways to avoid responsibility. This is the direction of cost-conscious admins and BOEs who feel more responsibility to the taxpayer and less to true educational equity and responsibility. No wonder teachers are leaving in droves.
The current educational atmosphere is about hurrying students along with minimal accountability while developing pathways to avoid responsibility. This is the direction of cost-conscious admins and BOEs who feel more responsibility to the taxpayer and less to true educational equity and responsibility. No wonder teachers are leaving in droves.
6
The rise of high school graduation rate does NOT mean the rise of high school educational quality. To improve the quality of high school education is to demonstrate the achievement of highly reliable standardized testing scores. There is a clear disconnect between high school graduation and college readiness. Increasing the importance of standardized testing scores in the college admission selection process will be crucial to improve graduation rate among higher educational institutions. My older child had ACT of 34 and admitted into a top 20 liberal arts college(per US News Ranking) as a top 20% student (Mid 50% ACT 29-33) and will receive two BA degrees one in Social Science and one in Natural Science in 4 years, The younger child had ACT of 30 and admitted into a top 40 National University(Per US News Ranking) as a top 20% student (Mid 50% ACT 24-29) has obtained all A's so far and will graduate for sure in 4 years. It is clear that standardized testing scores played an important role as a highly reliable indicator and it has nothing to do with one's family income. For example, my two children who are one year apart and were offered the exact same opportunities such as both participated in varsity sports in high school and both took free test prep course offered by a local non profit group. Therefore, it is more related to as who is a better student and who is not as good. Any efforts to diminish the importance of standardized testing scores is to ignore the fact.
3
Leave it to the experts to fear what is common knowledge to anybody who's taught in the classroom lately. Test scores are up. Grad rates are up. Competency is down. Why? Because the answer to any problem is to dumb it down. I taught middle school math for 10 years after retiring from the Marines. I kept the faith for as long as I could but I was appalled by what I saw. The dirty little secret of American education is that the kids have become almost unteachable. They simply don't care. Nobody studies for exams and homework is a lost cause. Cheating is rampant, enabled in large part by the Internet. They know if they botch it badly enough or procrastinate long enough or complain loudly enough, somebody will bail them out. If a teacher tries to apply some standards and academic rigor in the classroom, the system fights you every step of the way. If I taught math the way I think math should be taught, 90% of my students would have failed. They just can't hack it. After 10 years of this, I couldn't either.
34
I think the remedy for this malady is very simple i.e to groom the children correctly right from one and half years. The parents must initiate these steps in all sincerity such as teaching them about identifying various colours, fruits, vegetables, birds, animals, nursery rhymes, numbers, alphabets etc. When the children reach the age of two years, then parents must teach them about the significance of practicing by writing down alphabets, numbers, names of vegetables, fruits, birds, animals etc in step by step fashion.
Once children get used to the regular practice at home before attending any school, then things will automatically fall into place. In addition, parents must invariably teach the children about respecting parents and elders and also teach children how to keep their spoons, plates, glasses etc in the sink after usage. So that children can feel equally responsible for what they do.
Once children get used to the regular practice at home before attending any school, then things will automatically fall into place. In addition, parents must invariably teach the children about respecting parents and elders and also teach children how to keep their spoons, plates, glasses etc in the sink after usage. So that children can feel equally responsible for what they do.
10
It's probably an apocryphal story but I remember hearing how when the Nicaraguan dictator Somoza was in Costa Rica he received a tour of a school he was told was for the education of the peasants. He replied something to the effect that in Nicaragua he didn't need educated peasants, he needed oxen.
The recently published book “Phishing for Phools: The Economics of Manipulation and Deception” by Nobel laureates George A. Akerlof and Robert J. Shiller sheds an enormous amount of light on why education and especially training in critical thinking skills has taken a low priority in America since the 1960s.
Our American Somozas (the 1%?) don't want educated consumers. They want mindless grazing herds willing to spend money they don't have on things they don't need, and who will ignore the gasses being spewed into the atmosphere, the garbage and toxins being plowed under our landfills, and the chemicals and plastic clogging our oceans that result from this mindless, peer-driven, status-seeking, knee-jerk, buy-on-credit behavior so many of us evince.
An education might get in the way of all this.
The recently published book “Phishing for Phools: The Economics of Manipulation and Deception” by Nobel laureates George A. Akerlof and Robert J. Shiller sheds an enormous amount of light on why education and especially training in critical thinking skills has taken a low priority in America since the 1960s.
Our American Somozas (the 1%?) don't want educated consumers. They want mindless grazing herds willing to spend money they don't have on things they don't need, and who will ignore the gasses being spewed into the atmosphere, the garbage and toxins being plowed under our landfills, and the chemicals and plastic clogging our oceans that result from this mindless, peer-driven, status-seeking, knee-jerk, buy-on-credit behavior so many of us evince.
An education might get in the way of all this.
56
There is an enormous disconnect between what the high schools think you need to know to be prepared for college <-----> and what the colleges expect you to know <--------------------->. The blame falls totally on the high schools for dumbing down their graduation requirements and not expecting the kids to work hard enough to be ready for college-level work. At worst, these kids will end up in the for-profit diploma mills which will take their money and hand them a worthless piece of paper in return that will be absolutely useless in helping them get jobs.
4
In an Op-Ed piece in the Times today, we are told that "power marriages" are responsible for income inequality.
In addition to everything those commenting here have observed in regard to the sad state of our schools -- about undereducated teachers, education professors with misguided axes to grind, administrators looking to smooth things over, money-mad makers of inane action movies and vicious video games, and so on -- we do need to say that people who have babies they cannot begin to rear and to support are responsible in part for schoolchildren who cannot or will not learn.
And they are responsible in part for income inequality.
Teenagers having babies and continuing to have more babies send unprepared and, too often, badly socialized children to school. They are not ready to learn and might never be. We pass them anyway. And so the pattern goes.
In addition to everything those commenting here have observed in regard to the sad state of our schools -- about undereducated teachers, education professors with misguided axes to grind, administrators looking to smooth things over, money-mad makers of inane action movies and vicious video games, and so on -- we do need to say that people who have babies they cannot begin to rear and to support are responsible in part for schoolchildren who cannot or will not learn.
And they are responsible in part for income inequality.
Teenagers having babies and continuing to have more babies send unprepared and, too often, badly socialized children to school. They are not ready to learn and might never be. We pass them anyway. And so the pattern goes.
9
I would imagine that single welfare mothers and those who have far more children than they can possibly afford to raise are far more responsible for income inequality than well educated, well paid "power couples" who only have one, or at the most two, children.
6
This is a problem I've had to deal with my whole life, what with growing up in a country where over 90 percent of the population gets a bachelor's degree. Still, from what I've seen, just because everyone has a diploma doesn't mean that "good" diplomas lose their values as well.
Employers aren't stupid; they know what they're doing. Sooner or later, they'll learn to distinguish from "good" (meaning ones from the most prestigious institutions) diplomas from the "bad". What is bad is that this causes a massive waste of money on the individual household's part. College isn't cheap, everybody knows that. But when everyone has a diploma in some shape or from, it will, without a doubt, look bad to employers to not have something like it as well.
"What did you do in high school while Randy over here went to a 2-year community college, even when he had worse grades?" employers will say.
All in all, you can't reverse this new trend. People will want to get a diploma, because it provides, for the time being, a better life. What needs to be done is a cut down on over-the-top college tuition that is, frankly, a waste for some colleges that don't give as much as they take. Will this happen? I don't know.
All I know is, Korea's had this problem for 15 years now, and nothings being done about it here.
Employers aren't stupid; they know what they're doing. Sooner or later, they'll learn to distinguish from "good" (meaning ones from the most prestigious institutions) diplomas from the "bad". What is bad is that this causes a massive waste of money on the individual household's part. College isn't cheap, everybody knows that. But when everyone has a diploma in some shape or from, it will, without a doubt, look bad to employers to not have something like it as well.
"What did you do in high school while Randy over here went to a 2-year community college, even when he had worse grades?" employers will say.
All in all, you can't reverse this new trend. People will want to get a diploma, because it provides, for the time being, a better life. What needs to be done is a cut down on over-the-top college tuition that is, frankly, a waste for some colleges that don't give as much as they take. Will this happen? I don't know.
All I know is, Korea's had this problem for 15 years now, and nothings being done about it here.
7
Does the No Child Left Behind Policy have anything to do with the changing standards for graduation?
3
From the story:
“ .. only one in 10 Berea students were ready for college-level work in reading, and about one in 14 were ready for entry-level college math...".
Shouldn’t the verb be singular? “Only on in 10 ...WAS...” and “one in 14 WAS ..”
Where are the Times editors?
“ .. only one in 10 Berea students were ready for college-level work in reading, and about one in 14 were ready for entry-level college math...".
Shouldn’t the verb be singular? “Only on in 10 ...WAS...” and “one in 14 WAS ..”
Where are the Times editors?
7
In this context, 1 in 10 represents a ratio and is, thus, plural. So, the "one in ten group", they "were" apparently ready for college.
2
Exactly right. Add the Times' grammar to the casualty list.
George Carlin noticed this concept a long time ago. As he said in a concert special recorded in *1990*: "Think of how stupid the average person is... and then realize, half of them are stupider than that."
None of this is new. It's just that conventional standards of social behavior (sometimes referred to as political correctness) compel us not to say what many notice on a routine basis.
None of this is new. It's just that conventional standards of social behavior (sometimes referred to as political correctness) compel us not to say what many notice on a routine basis.
17
Imposing a failed schooling model on students, keeping them in locked down cohorts for 12 years, is the antithesis of education.
Creativity and self-directed discovery have nothing to do with poverty or skin color.
Creativity and self-directed discovery have nothing to do with poverty or skin color.
4
The Big Lie: College is the key to your future...
Truth is your future was sold out from under you by a corporative state that puts its citizens into debt and servitude or sends them off to fight in the perpetual wars.
Instead of a good job and a fair wage, you get a piece of paper that says you're smart and then you set about spending the rest of your life paying for it. Yeah, real smart. Congratulations, suckers...
Truth is your future was sold out from under you by a corporative state that puts its citizens into debt and servitude or sends them off to fight in the perpetual wars.
Instead of a good job and a fair wage, you get a piece of paper that says you're smart and then you set about spending the rest of your life paying for it. Yeah, real smart. Congratulations, suckers...
9
The big lie is that a college degree is a college degree is a college degree. College degrees are not created equal. The economy needs and values certain degrees from certain schools much more highly than others.
Manu students choose majors based on which classes that they happened to take Freshman or Sophomore year were the easiest and/or favorite(s).
That is a failure of universities to offer market-/economy-based feedback as to what jobs are in demand and seem to have a bright, sustained future.
As a result, plenty of kids get things like Art History and Poli Sci degrees then complain when they can't find work in their fields post-graduation.
Another problem is the number of crumby colleges in the US that leave students with effectively useless degrees. The extreme of the spectrum would be the Phoenix University-type for-profit schools whose degrees no employer respects.
Students need to be educated about what degrees from what institutions are viewed as worthwhile not by the tenured professors and college administrators who need to put butts in seats out of self-justification, but rather, by employers and with an eye toward long-term career viability.
Manu students choose majors based on which classes that they happened to take Freshman or Sophomore year were the easiest and/or favorite(s).
That is a failure of universities to offer market-/economy-based feedback as to what jobs are in demand and seem to have a bright, sustained future.
As a result, plenty of kids get things like Art History and Poli Sci degrees then complain when they can't find work in their fields post-graduation.
Another problem is the number of crumby colleges in the US that leave students with effectively useless degrees. The extreme of the spectrum would be the Phoenix University-type for-profit schools whose degrees no employer respects.
Students need to be educated about what degrees from what institutions are viewed as worthwhile not by the tenured professors and college administrators who need to put butts in seats out of self-justification, but rather, by employers and with an eye toward long-term career viability.
3
Ok this is great... You think getting a diploma is easy there you should try getting a drivers license! They are awesome! When all else fails go there!
3
IThese diplomas are lies to young people; they are pieces of paper that mean little. This is also true at the community college where I teach. There are no standards to say that the diploma means something. Employers tell me a college degree only means that 'they can finish something'. How sad!
4
Here's the problem: the bar has dropped entirely too low. Plain and simple.
9
Rising graduation rates are good news, and are at least partially a natural result of a society where a high school diploma or more is required for most entry-level opportunities. And, with rising rates, there will be more academically-weak students graduating, but that's not a crisis. The skills of graduates reflect the reality that the country has always had a mix of students with high levels of academic skills, and with a range of talents, maturity levels and life experience. And it's great to always try to do more to strengthen K-12 education -- many students would graduate with stronger skills given the right school environment.
BUT.... it's important to turn a critical eye toward studies and surveys from experts who see education as a business opportunity. The College Board testing company (ACT, etc.), Achieve, and similar organizations are part of a worrisome trend toward the corporatization of education. Their studies and surveys that raise alarm about college and career readiness are generally just marketing ploys to build a market for more tests, more educational software, more corporate-run charter schools and more expert consultancies.
BUT.... it's important to turn a critical eye toward studies and surveys from experts who see education as a business opportunity. The College Board testing company (ACT, etc.), Achieve, and similar organizations are part of a worrisome trend toward the corporatization of education. Their studies and surveys that raise alarm about college and career readiness are generally just marketing ploys to build a market for more tests, more educational software, more corporate-run charter schools and more expert consultancies.
7
talk to teenagers and see if your opinion remains the same.
4
Add the ignorant Americans to all the new,uneducated immigrants, means Democrats will be ruling for the foreseeable future.
5
Do you mean the ignorant Americans and new, uneducated immigrants will vot Democrat because Democrat programs will help them?
3
We can only hope so. Immigrants, turned off by Republican racism, do tend to vote for Democrats. So does pretty much anybody who's rational and not a selfish, elderly millionaire.
7
NO, the Democrats will promise them even more "free stuff", food stamps, Section-8 housing, Obamaphones, if they vote Democrat.
3
Check your grammar: Perhaps only one in ten WAS ready for college?
3
On the other hand, the "one in ten" could be taken to be a collective, idenifying a ratio populated by a plural. What about "one in ten of fifty"? That would be five.
1
If there were exactly 10 and one graduated it would be "was". Here the context suggests that one in ten is a fractional ratio and, as such, plural. Therefore, those that graduated "were" ready for college.
2
bet all of these so-called experts would have a very hard time finishing high school today. congratulate those who achieved it and stop being so cynical.
Y'know, Kamau, you have a point. Some commenters here have referred to calculus in high school. I graduated in 1961. I took algebra in my senior year. Calculus? Whuzzat?
2
For those of you who think educational tracking solves the problem of the under education of all students, and that we should follow the example of Germany where children are geared into academic or trade school tracks as early as the sixth grade, bear with this personal anecdote. I was raised in poverty and my friend's father owned a business. In high school she was placed in the academic track and got to take Latin and French (both languages I yearned to learn), she got calculus. I got Spanish, typing, and business math. She earned an MBA and became wealthy. I earned a Ph.D. and entered the Middle Class, but I had a great deal of catching up to do by not having had a more rigorous high school academic preparation. All kids deserve the chance to learn what is needed for college should they decide to follow that path. If they fail to do the work in grammar and high school for an academic diploma, then they can choose to enter a trade school. Let them decide, but give all a chance.
13
By God Almighty, you are RIGHT!
2
Thank you for this! For all of those commenters who say not all students should or need to go to college a true enough statement) but then say the solution to underperforming schools and students in urban areas is trade schools, retread observer's comment. I live in a high achieving school district but travel into the lowest performing school district in the state to work. Everyday my bus passes through A devastated landscape of urban decay. One of the saddest aspects, in my mind, of growing up in that area is that the child, the parent and the school may expect too little. The teachers cannot make up for all the child has missed and is missing but schools (and parents, community, Leroy, et al) perform a real disservice by not challenging and pushing these kids to achieve. And parents, community leaders and activists abet this disservice by not treating education with the reverence it deserves.
Maybe the kids in my district will study medicine, law, IT, education, etc. Some may go on to be leaders in their fields. And maybe some kids in this school system would benefit from not being pushed so hard and understanding alternatives to these professions are fine. But maybe the kids in the city in which I work deserve the opposite approach. I cringe to think about the potential teachers, lawyers, doctors wandering the streets and school halls who will never achieve their potential because no one has ever demanded from them the academic work of which they are capable.
Maybe the kids in my district will study medicine, law, IT, education, etc. Some may go on to be leaders in their fields. And maybe some kids in this school system would benefit from not being pushed so hard and understanding alternatives to these professions are fine. But maybe the kids in the city in which I work deserve the opposite approach. I cringe to think about the potential teachers, lawyers, doctors wandering the streets and school halls who will never achieve their potential because no one has ever demanded from them the academic work of which they are capable.
6
Better teachers make better graduates. Better pay and better working conditions make better teachers. Better facilities make better graduates.
When millions of tax dollars were given to private corporations and the money failed to trickle down beginning in the '80's under Reagan's economic scheme, schools deteriorated and failures were predictable.
The response by our present Republican dominated congress was to try more get-rich-quick and for-profit schemes like charter schools, and endless testing, achieving two results: more corporate dollars for political donation, and a less informed electorate. Lowering the educational standards makes for more gullible voters. They believe what Fox News screams.
When millions of tax dollars were given to private corporations and the money failed to trickle down beginning in the '80's under Reagan's economic scheme, schools deteriorated and failures were predictable.
The response by our present Republican dominated congress was to try more get-rich-quick and for-profit schemes like charter schools, and endless testing, achieving two results: more corporate dollars for political donation, and a less informed electorate. Lowering the educational standards makes for more gullible voters. They believe what Fox News screams.
2
vandalfan - Yes, it's the Republican's fault for children throughout America not learning anything, so typical.
6
"Better teachers make better graduates. Better pay and better working conditions make better teachers. Better facilities make better graduates. "obviously logic is not your forte or perhaps it is. start with a false premise and you can logically draw any false conclusion that your heart desires.
there is no proof to your assertions. it is just an appeal to emotions.
there is no proof to your assertions. it is just an appeal to emotions.
4
As a former high school teacher, principal, district administrator in NYC and Northern CA, and now consultant, I find that a hidden culprit of students being unprepared for college is our system of assigning grades.
A grade a student receives in a course is supposed to reflect their knowledge of the content--presumably, their test and quiz scores. However, teachers include a hodgepodge of other non-academic information in the calculation of a student's grade. Teachers award points to students when they complete homework, raise their hands, bring their notebooks to class, work well in a group, bring kleenex boxes in the winter, return permission slips, don't talk unless called upon--in other words, for behaviors that have nothing to do with academic competence in a subject area, but reflect the student following a teacher's instructions. As a result, grades often become unreliable and inaccurate. Students receive passing grades when they have complied with a teacher's expectations even though they score low on tests. This is not grade inflation in the typical sense, but grade fog, where the grade includes so much information that it becomes nearly meaningless.
At best, it's important that teachers teach and reward "soft skills", but we need to find another way to report students' attainment of these non-academic skills. At worst, we're rewarding compliance over content. In either case, we're giving students a false sense of their own readiness for the rigors of college.
A grade a student receives in a course is supposed to reflect their knowledge of the content--presumably, their test and quiz scores. However, teachers include a hodgepodge of other non-academic information in the calculation of a student's grade. Teachers award points to students when they complete homework, raise their hands, bring their notebooks to class, work well in a group, bring kleenex boxes in the winter, return permission slips, don't talk unless called upon--in other words, for behaviors that have nothing to do with academic competence in a subject area, but reflect the student following a teacher's instructions. As a result, grades often become unreliable and inaccurate. Students receive passing grades when they have complied with a teacher's expectations even though they score low on tests. This is not grade inflation in the typical sense, but grade fog, where the grade includes so much information that it becomes nearly meaningless.
At best, it's important that teachers teach and reward "soft skills", but we need to find another way to report students' attainment of these non-academic skills. At worst, we're rewarding compliance over content. In either case, we're giving students a false sense of their own readiness for the rigors of college.
10
Well in my long ago days in Catholic school, we had two separate parts of the report card. There were grades for the content areas--what you learned-- and there were also grades for non-content and behavior categories. Fulfilling expectations on items such as you outline would come into play here. The content grade would never go up simply because the student turned in homework but the content of the homework, itself, contributed to the grade. And you'd best believe your content grade would go down if you failed to submit the work. What's more the grades in the non-content/behavior part of the report would also suffer.
Seems the nuns were on to something...
Seems the nuns were on to something...
5
I would not want to be a high school student today. Graduate, and you are criticized for getting an inadequate education. Fail, and you are criticized for your inability to master the material.
Worse, the author seems to equate test scores with learning, a link that could generously be described as tenuous. And don't even get me started on how poorly ACT/SAT scores are as a predictor of future educational or economic outcomes.
Worse, the author seems to equate test scores with learning, a link that could generously be described as tenuous. And don't even get me started on how poorly ACT/SAT scores are as a predictor of future educational or economic outcomes.
4
We are seeing the results of well intended, but lousy policies. The department of education should be abolished as it marked the beginning of the dumbing down of our education system. Until the mid-80s we had school systems run locally, with limited administrative interference. We still had national tests, but they were i frequent.
Then came the doe. No longer could kids be left behind to repeat a grade. Competition was mean, so kids in early grades didn't get grades like A-E. No need for average students to get a C - that was mean and didn't make kids feel good.
Unions ran the show as far as keeping bad teachrrs and certification exams were dumbed dowm, supposedly to assure diversity.
Lost in all this pc was the student.
Then came the doe. No longer could kids be left behind to repeat a grade. Competition was mean, so kids in early grades didn't get grades like A-E. No need for average students to get a C - that was mean and didn't make kids feel good.
Unions ran the show as far as keeping bad teachrrs and certification exams were dumbed dowm, supposedly to assure diversity.
Lost in all this pc was the student.
5
You can't win for losing. At first too many were not dropping out, the schools were failing, No Child Left Behind, Race to the Top, make instruction and testing more rigorous, more regents were added to attain an high school diploma, link schools and teachers salaries to student's success on standardized test scores, Now too many students are graduating and the Diplomas are worthless. President Obama and his education crew just came out with a new agenda. What up we can't handle success?
3
In the mid-1990's a friend and I, both nurses, decided to take a class on nutrition at the local community college. Sandra misplaced her student ID. We went to the office to get another. We walked in and saw a student crying. Sandra knew her and her family and went to comfort her. No family tragedy: the girl was flunking one or more courses.
When we left, I learned the girl had recently graduated from the local high school, along with Sandra's son. She was an honor graduate.
Read about 'parties' so-called educators held to change test scores: "44 out of 56 schools cheated on the 2009 CRCT.[2] 178 teachers and principals were found to have corrected answers entered by students.[3] The size of the scandal has been described as one of the largest in United States history." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atlanta_Public_Schools_cheating_scandal
Read today's NYT story about victimhood: http://www.nytimes.com/2015/12/27/opinion/sunday/the-real-victims-of-vic...
If it happened in Atlanta, it happened in towns across the USA. As the writer shows, it's still happening with grade inflation.
The victims include children who think they are making good grades and are ready for work or college.
Millions of potential victims, billions in actual costs, billions in loss of potential for those who did not receive an education and trillions in loss for our country.
When we left, I learned the girl had recently graduated from the local high school, along with Sandra's son. She was an honor graduate.
Read about 'parties' so-called educators held to change test scores: "44 out of 56 schools cheated on the 2009 CRCT.[2] 178 teachers and principals were found to have corrected answers entered by students.[3] The size of the scandal has been described as one of the largest in United States history." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atlanta_Public_Schools_cheating_scandal
Read today's NYT story about victimhood: http://www.nytimes.com/2015/12/27/opinion/sunday/the-real-victims-of-vic...
If it happened in Atlanta, it happened in towns across the USA. As the writer shows, it's still happening with grade inflation.
The victims include children who think they are making good grades and are ready for work or college.
Millions of potential victims, billions in actual costs, billions in loss of potential for those who did not receive an education and trillions in loss for our country.
14
This is just propaganda issued by corporate research groups to feed the narrative that public education isn't working, so it should be taken over by for-profit education companies. It also serves the interests of companies like Apple that complain they can't find enough qualified workers in this country so they want to bring in more foreign workers on visas. We always get the same whining complaints from them that they can't compete with foreign companies unless they can decimate our own work force. They're supposedly American companies. They want all the security and advantages offered by the American government, so they should hire American! Given this incentive, students will learn, but with the poor employment picture in this country they have no incentive. It disturbs me that the NYT would run an article like this one that only perpetuates these self-serving corporate lies.
8
Are you kidding?! Where have you been. 25% on incoming college freshmen are not ready to start college. They take remedial classes for up to a year - taking 5-6 years to graduate. Most don't
5
Yes -- in part, the goal of the propaganda is to drum up business for educational testing, software and charter schools, in part, to reshape education to be a training tool for corporations , and also, as you mention, an excuse not to hire at all.
5
The problem isn't the puffery of grades to keep moving the kids up and out, endlessly.
The problem is the death of manufacturing in the US and the end of good-paying jobs for reasonably intelligent people better at manipulating tangible objects than abstract--and often useless--concepts.
Most advanced countries recognize that a university education isn't for everyone. Though I don't agree with the sometimes too-early tracking of kids, there*s no shame in being more suited to fixing clogged pipes than acing a string of philosophy courses. Many extremely smart people are not particularly intellectual and there*s no denigration in saying so.
Too many kids, though, don't even have the minimum attention span to learn anything at all. That must be addressed at the prenatal level...
The problem is the death of manufacturing in the US and the end of good-paying jobs for reasonably intelligent people better at manipulating tangible objects than abstract--and often useless--concepts.
Most advanced countries recognize that a university education isn't for everyone. Though I don't agree with the sometimes too-early tracking of kids, there*s no shame in being more suited to fixing clogged pipes than acing a string of philosophy courses. Many extremely smart people are not particularly intellectual and there*s no denigration in saying so.
Too many kids, though, don't even have the minimum attention span to learn anything at all. That must be addressed at the prenatal level...
16
"The problem is the death of manufacturing in the US"...
We were told as far back as Clinton and NAFTA that the jobs we lost would be replaced by better jobs that would be created here. And so it went. The people in Foot Locker earned 10 times the wage of the people making the sneakers overseas and it seemed, there was no problem. We got caught up in the consumer dream of cheap imported goods and their "too good to be true" prices.
As corporate profits grew, so too, did our imbalance of trade. Those profits are similar to the "hole" and are small compared to the hidden costs of unemployment, social services, and loss wealth (via the trade deficit which, this year with China alone will be about 400 billion dollars -or- about half what we spend on Social Security) that the dounut represents. The irony is, we don't see the money as missing because much of it returns to this country by the foreign purchase of businesses and real estate or, through loans to our government.
Until they can produce it themselves, China will only buy from us that which they need while, through unfair trade practices, make sure we need what they have to sell. The result is, we no longer have the "supply chain ecosystem" necessary to produce electronics, solar panels, or most manufactured goods critical to our security, at the same time, leaving a large segment of our population without jobs and blaming our educational system for the whole mess.
We were told as far back as Clinton and NAFTA that the jobs we lost would be replaced by better jobs that would be created here. And so it went. The people in Foot Locker earned 10 times the wage of the people making the sneakers overseas and it seemed, there was no problem. We got caught up in the consumer dream of cheap imported goods and their "too good to be true" prices.
As corporate profits grew, so too, did our imbalance of trade. Those profits are similar to the "hole" and are small compared to the hidden costs of unemployment, social services, and loss wealth (via the trade deficit which, this year with China alone will be about 400 billion dollars -or- about half what we spend on Social Security) that the dounut represents. The irony is, we don't see the money as missing because much of it returns to this country by the foreign purchase of businesses and real estate or, through loans to our government.
Until they can produce it themselves, China will only buy from us that which they need while, through unfair trade practices, make sure we need what they have to sell. The result is, we no longer have the "supply chain ecosystem" necessary to produce electronics, solar panels, or most manufactured goods critical to our security, at the same time, leaving a large segment of our population without jobs and blaming our educational system for the whole mess.
6
...and how many students will retain what they have largely been taught to MEMORIZE, rather than to UNDERSTAND, the former being the only method that our public "educational" institutions are able to employ, given the number and "variety" of students they are required to educate. Most children are, and will continue to be "left behind" in this race, while the elites, as always, will continue to prosper.
7
I'm pretty sure a lot of school districts have dumbed down a high school diploma in order to avoid the cost of remedial education for the semi-literate. That's one problem. Another is that the impoverishment of many full time workers has undermined the belief that education pays. Sadly, in a society of increasingly extreme income inequality, the non-rich can't be so sure.
7
I like to think about the Ivy graduates on the Upper West Side who hug themselves as they imagine how much better the world is for the disadvantaged now that we don't force them to learn calculus, you know, like fascists. Or racists. Or whatever, honey, just open that Pinot!
7
The degradation of US standards in so many areas is pathetic. The US is in decline, and most people want to cloak this with falling standards.
This slovenly attitude, so prevalent, is part and parcel of the decline of the US. And try telling this to the people involved. They do not want to hear it!
This slovenly attitude, so prevalent, is part and parcel of the decline of the US. And try telling this to the people involved. They do not want to hear it!
15
People argued "you can't test students into learning" during Bush's failed education reform attempt. Perhaps we need to revisit this idea with respect to our newest version of education "reform" that has added draconian penalties for teachers (based on flawed evaluations) and schools based on measures like graduation rates.
A reward/punishment system has been set up, but it's all external. When teachers get poor evaluations, for example, there is little in the way of instruction on how they can improve their teaching. One begins to wonder if it this is all a charade with the actual goal of privatizing education and siphoning off education dollars. The fact that classroom teachers have hardly been consulted about reform measures points in this direction.
In my state, which was early to the reform party, experienced teachers have been largely replaced by brand new graduates with no experience. The university has a fast-track teacher certification program, so the new teachers don't even have a traditional teacher education. A lot of money is spent on something called "credit recovery" in high schools which is where to look if you want to see how students are pushed through to graduate without being able to fulfill the requirements without special help.
It's all about appearances and not actually doing the work it would require to educate people.
A reward/punishment system has been set up, but it's all external. When teachers get poor evaluations, for example, there is little in the way of instruction on how they can improve their teaching. One begins to wonder if it this is all a charade with the actual goal of privatizing education and siphoning off education dollars. The fact that classroom teachers have hardly been consulted about reform measures points in this direction.
In my state, which was early to the reform party, experienced teachers have been largely replaced by brand new graduates with no experience. The university has a fast-track teacher certification program, so the new teachers don't even have a traditional teacher education. A lot of money is spent on something called "credit recovery" in high schools which is where to look if you want to see how students are pushed through to graduate without being able to fulfill the requirements without special help.
It's all about appearances and not actually doing the work it would require to educate people.
5
Will there be enough and suityable accomodation in jobs for all those who graduate ?
3
Many of the comments here come from older folks who have forgotten (or, never realized) that the high schools of "the old days" were not actually that good with their low rates of graduation and college attendence. These are the same people that have forgotten about polio, mumps, tire blow-outs, and asbestos brake linings. Many of their peers went into manufacturing jobs that no longer exist and at time when a family could survive on one income.
Other comments come from people who themselves did not do well and want to blame their schools or teachers. The best comments are those from people who do not have kids of their own or, from those whose comments start with "I know a teacher that says...." or, "my friend's daughter says....."
We have severe cultural and socio-economic problems that make educating our population in this country difficult. We have never had more students that know how to use a graphing calculator while, simultaneously, applications for, and admission to, the best schools has never been more difficult. Meanwhile, here in America, we at least "try" to provide a basic education and the opportunity for higher education to all. It is here for the taking though, unfortunately, not all do. It is that reality which is most disquieting.
But, I digress...... back to the blaming and finger pointing.
Other comments come from people who themselves did not do well and want to blame their schools or teachers. The best comments are those from people who do not have kids of their own or, from those whose comments start with "I know a teacher that says...." or, "my friend's daughter says....."
We have severe cultural and socio-economic problems that make educating our population in this country difficult. We have never had more students that know how to use a graphing calculator while, simultaneously, applications for, and admission to, the best schools has never been more difficult. Meanwhile, here in America, we at least "try" to provide a basic education and the opportunity for higher education to all. It is here for the taking though, unfortunately, not all do. It is that reality which is most disquieting.
But, I digress...... back to the blaming and finger pointing.
7
Almost all these comments are seriously mistaken. Here are three basic failures of understanding by your readers:
First, only 5% of jobs in the US require the advanced STEM education that many of your readers bemoan our schools lack. Yes, our students often compete for those jobs with graduates of schools in India, Taiwan, etc. So what? If you don't like that, fight the politicians and multi-nationals who enable that alternative. (data from BLS)
Second, and more importantly, many of the commentators on here are as pompous as Trump. They might be in the top 5%, but were in the top 5% of their high school and college too. Now they have ego-driven amnesia that makes them think their school was better, that everything was better in the good old days. That's nonsense.
Third, some comments focus on public schools. Having extensive teaching experience in both public and private schools, we can tell you that grade inflation is worse in private schools. That's what the rich kids are paying for, guaranteed good grades. And to give everyone an unfair advantage when they apply to college, the best private schools don't rank their graduates. That's how, statistically, you can make it look like everyone is "above average."
So the truth, if you can handle the truth: only 5% of kids in high school really need to take calculus in high school (at most, since they can still take it in college), and learning to read, write, and add are all high school graduation ever required.
First, only 5% of jobs in the US require the advanced STEM education that many of your readers bemoan our schools lack. Yes, our students often compete for those jobs with graduates of schools in India, Taiwan, etc. So what? If you don't like that, fight the politicians and multi-nationals who enable that alternative. (data from BLS)
Second, and more importantly, many of the commentators on here are as pompous as Trump. They might be in the top 5%, but were in the top 5% of their high school and college too. Now they have ego-driven amnesia that makes them think their school was better, that everything was better in the good old days. That's nonsense.
Third, some comments focus on public schools. Having extensive teaching experience in both public and private schools, we can tell you that grade inflation is worse in private schools. That's what the rich kids are paying for, guaranteed good grades. And to give everyone an unfair advantage when they apply to college, the best private schools don't rank their graduates. That's how, statistically, you can make it look like everyone is "above average."
So the truth, if you can handle the truth: only 5% of kids in high school really need to take calculus in high school (at most, since they can still take it in college), and learning to read, write, and add are all high school graduation ever required.
6
" Here are three basic failures of understanding by your readers".....
Well......... some of the readers. Some interesting thoughts however.
Well......... some of the readers. Some interesting thoughts however.
3
I disagree about private schools. There are different private schools and all depends on parent's preferences. My son goes to a private HS and 99% of his classmates are not from 1% but rather from 10-5% and parents have delivered the message that they want good education regardless of grades. I went to a HS in Soviet Union, I can attest that what my son is learning is more advanced than what I was learning at the same age. However, kids do have to self-select into more advanced classes. My son is taking physics with algebra and pre-calc (they use formulas like in first college physics) and advanced algebra 2 (matrices in depth and linear programming) in the 9th grade, but very few students have enrolled in these classes. So far no one is getting A in physics in my son's class and I can attest (I have a PhD in Physics) that they are learning pretty advanced (for 14 year olds) stuff in there without getting any slack from the teacher.
2
I used to work with a group of Jewish Russian expatriates and they all said that high school in the old Soviet Union was much more difficult than college in NYC.
2
When will Liberals wake up? Both of my kids, home schooled, started their own businesses. One owns a construction company. Another has a coop for artists and musicians. Join the home school movement.
7
Homeschooling, by its nature, is hard to study, so we don't have any reliable facts about how homeschooled kids do. What we mostly have is anecdotes from the already converted.
But I think about the average understanding of education exhibited in these comments, and it doesn't convince me that homeschooling is a good idea.
But I think about the average understanding of education exhibited in these comments, and it doesn't convince me that homeschooling is a good idea.
8
I see my neighbors driving to work at 6 AM. When are they going to school their children at home?
5
When the metrics of evaluating schools and teachers are based on student scores, you can bet that test performance will improve, one way or the other. That's as true in education as in, say, policing, where departments like NYPD and LAPD (they've been caught) pressure cops to downgrade crime reports so the stat's look better year after year.
The dumbing down of a high school education has been a problem for decades.
When City University of NY was forced into open admissions decades ago large numbers of high school graduates needed *remedial* classes.
Among the problems in education is that teachers are drawn from the lower level of students. Poorly educated teachers can not teach what they do not know.
When City University of NY was forced into open admissions decades ago large numbers of high school graduates needed *remedial* classes.
Among the problems in education is that teachers are drawn from the lower level of students. Poorly educated teachers can not teach what they do not know.
10
.
truly Bizarre
the sad fact is that graduation standards have been Dumbed Down for years
why?
if you don't Dumb Down graduation standards, WAY too many kids won't graduate
and that's a Political Problem
better to pretend that kids who graduate have Learned Something
3 part Solution =
1) pass a Federal Law that mandates standardized Exit Exams at every High School
2) once the nation's Jaw has finished hitting the floor (in response to the very poor results that the Exit Exams will reveal), everybody will point the finger at everybody else. This is a necessary, and mildly humorous, step.
3) pass a National Referendum that states, clearly, "hey Brothers and Sisters, if you don't do your homework, you aren't going to learn very much." As socially antagonizing as that Referendum will be, it's the Only Way.
truth be told
.
truly Bizarre
the sad fact is that graduation standards have been Dumbed Down for years
why?
if you don't Dumb Down graduation standards, WAY too many kids won't graduate
and that's a Political Problem
better to pretend that kids who graduate have Learned Something
3 part Solution =
1) pass a Federal Law that mandates standardized Exit Exams at every High School
2) once the nation's Jaw has finished hitting the floor (in response to the very poor results that the Exit Exams will reveal), everybody will point the finger at everybody else. This is a necessary, and mildly humorous, step.
3) pass a National Referendum that states, clearly, "hey Brothers and Sisters, if you don't do your homework, you aren't going to learn very much." As socially antagonizing as that Referendum will be, it's the Only Way.
truth be told
.
7
I graduated from high school in1974 (seems like a hundred years ago) and I was given a diploma that said I met the basic standards to compete with everyone else of my era. I had attended autoshop, metal working to include foundry work and we also had home economics for boys that taught some of us how to at least scramble an egg and wash our own clothing. When my children attended school in the 80s and 90s I went to one or more orientations with them and not only did they not have that type of curriculum but were not required to read a book and submit a book report!? I asked about the reasons and was told liability for the school precluded the school system from teaching the basics that my wife and I felt are required for a young person to function independently of their parents and that a book report would be discriminatory against minority students as their family might not like some of the subject matter (think Mark Twain). Needless to say I was flabbergasted and my wife and I set about educating our children in what we perceived to be the basics. None of them went to college but all are doing rather well and can balance a checkbook, have homes that they bought. They will survive quite nicely when I am gone and I hope they understand why we did what we did.
11
If "coming up short" is to be used as a measuring device, how will they tell of any change????
Well, we also have the disappearance of actually writing something by HAND instead of "keyboarding". If these kids make it out of school and have to read an historical document or fill out an application form, and they're toast.
From what I hear, handwriting is stopped in the 3rd grade and kids can use any kind of scrawl or numbers to represent their signature. Pretty soon kids will be born with nubs for fingers instead of nice long normal fingers.
Keep making Americans dumber and these politicians will reap what they sow. You know, an educated population is a dangerous population.
From what I hear, handwriting is stopped in the 3rd grade and kids can use any kind of scrawl or numbers to represent their signature. Pretty soon kids will be born with nubs for fingers instead of nice long normal fingers.
Keep making Americans dumber and these politicians will reap what they sow. You know, an educated population is a dangerous population.
6
By virtue of cost, speed, or efficiency most documents today are required to be submitted digitally. Even the IRS discourages the use of "paper" for filing tax returns. The "kids" today are remarkably proficient in the use of technology to acquire information, move documents, and even complete "applications" at "the speed of light". This is the new industry standard and there is no going back. Handwriting is not the problem in education. At my age, my handwriting is no longer what I would like but, that is the least of my concerns.
3
But numerous studies have shown that we process and retain information when we read from paper and write by hand, whereas reading and typing on a screen is uncritical and unfiltered, with poor retention and comprehension. I see corresponding examples in my college students every semester. Kids that only know how to transcribe, cream and dump but not to think. Digital-only is NOT working and hasn't for a long time.
BRAVO! These statistics indicate a positive trend. They show us more students are staying out of trouble while staying in school. More students are saying: "I can do this education thing!"
Historically, a greater percentage of our students who graduate from high school make a better fit in vocational and trade fields. That is true everywhere, around the world. In America we need to support students in non-college fields, updated from the antiquated manufacturing sectors of the past. Instead of beating our heads against the wall about "college" readiness for all high schoolers, is it not wiser to thoroughly recognize the needs of "workplace" readiness? Practical skills in interpersonal communications, strong practical math skills, critical thinking, etc, benefit all of us.
Now that we have their attendance, let's add some grit, inspiration, and broader relevance to education. We must engage our young people for success in all fields, not just the narrow band width that allows a fraction of graduates into college.
Historically, a greater percentage of our students who graduate from high school make a better fit in vocational and trade fields. That is true everywhere, around the world. In America we need to support students in non-college fields, updated from the antiquated manufacturing sectors of the past. Instead of beating our heads against the wall about "college" readiness for all high schoolers, is it not wiser to thoroughly recognize the needs of "workplace" readiness? Practical skills in interpersonal communications, strong practical math skills, critical thinking, etc, benefit all of us.
Now that we have their attendance, let's add some grit, inspiration, and broader relevance to education. We must engage our young people for success in all fields, not just the narrow band width that allows a fraction of graduates into college.
5
This is not a complex issue. Sean Reardon and other researchers have shown that over the past few decades, academic success has been increasingly tied to family income, also with parents' education. So yes, in a "poor, rural district" students will not do well -- who is really surprised? Our country's rising economic inequality is causing rising educational inequality. It's sad that the wealthy have been so successful at "teaching" the middle class that the lower classes fail because they don't try hard enough, and they have moral failings. Oh, and of course it's those teachers' unions too! (Our main hope for addressing inequality is stronger, more angry, unions.) Talk about a failure in education!
3
I retired after teaching university level and practiced in five states. I watched it transformed from a respected profession to an itinerant labor pool. Every college administrator who willingly converted a tenured professorship to part-time lecturerships with no benefits was a highly paid participant in destroying the general welfare of American citizens.
What we are seeing throughout the U.S. is destruction of a free-thinking, highly educated middle class and the educational system that built it. The routine attacks on education and educators, the corporate-led exportation of jobs and career opportunities and the corruption of educational standards are parts of one putrid package.
Educators no longer control education. The leaders of our two major political parties have worked to ensure this is the case as they complete their planned disempowerment of the middle class.
What we are seeing throughout the U.S. is destruction of a free-thinking, highly educated middle class and the educational system that built it. The routine attacks on education and educators, the corporate-led exportation of jobs and career opportunities and the corruption of educational standards are parts of one putrid package.
Educators no longer control education. The leaders of our two major political parties have worked to ensure this is the case as they complete their planned disempowerment of the middle class.
13
This cuts both ways. My kids go to our highly ranked local public school. My kids were taught that it is okay to spell poorly; it is your effort that counts. (I had them do online spelling to get up to speed ).
The school never taught them their math facts like the times tables, so we did that.
My younger one has been through three different math textbooks in six years. The teacher admitted she doesn't understand the Common Core math. We finally put him in a weekly year round commercial math tutoring program at $2500 a year to get him up to speed.
Etc. A lot of the teachers are not very good and are at fault too.
The school never taught them their math facts like the times tables, so we did that.
My younger one has been through three different math textbooks in six years. The teacher admitted she doesn't understand the Common Core math. We finally put him in a weekly year round commercial math tutoring program at $2500 a year to get him up to speed.
Etc. A lot of the teachers are not very good and are at fault too.
14
Common Core was poorly written and forced on schools as an excuse to sell more pre-packaged curriculum, computers, test prep, and new tests. It's no negative reflection on a teacher that she doesn't buy into that scam.
I've known bad teachers and I've known parents who wanted to claim that good teachers were bad so that the fault didn't lie with their parenting or their kids' effort. But I've known few of the former and a lot more of the latter.
I've known bad teachers and I've known parents who wanted to claim that good teachers were bad so that the fault didn't lie with their parenting or their kids' effort. But I've known few of the former and a lot more of the latter.
4
The typical student of Asian heritage does well because the Asian family demands that he or she do well.
17
Public K-12 education in the US has become a jobs program for some of our most mediocre knowledge workers.
Finland transformed their education system into one of the two best in the world by focusing on boosting teacher quality.
The current refrain in the US teacher-union-industrial complex is that our children and parents are broken and that it's unfair, even impossible to measure teacher quality.
Clearly, the low quality of American public education and its failure to deliver a solid education to children of the middle class, let alone the most socio-economically disadvantaged children in our society, is the great civil rights crime of our time.
It's time we hold public education in the US to the highest standards...not pretend it's impossible to fairly apply ANY standards.
FREEDOM!
Finland transformed their education system into one of the two best in the world by focusing on boosting teacher quality.
The current refrain in the US teacher-union-industrial complex is that our children and parents are broken and that it's unfair, even impossible to measure teacher quality.
Clearly, the low quality of American public education and its failure to deliver a solid education to children of the middle class, let alone the most socio-economically disadvantaged children in our society, is the great civil rights crime of our time.
It's time we hold public education in the US to the highest standards...not pretend it's impossible to fairly apply ANY standards.
FREEDOM!
7
What a collection of misconceptions.
Know what happens if you compare US schools with a (very low) level of child poverty similar to Finland's to Finnish schools?
Hint: the Finns don't come out on top.
Our teachers are more than competent. The job we expect them to do is enormously more difficult. Complaining that our schools fail to deliver an education to students is pretty much analogous to complaining that FedEx won't deliver to your house because you can't be bothered to open the door and pick up the package.
Know what happens if you compare US schools with a (very low) level of child poverty similar to Finland's to Finnish schools?
Hint: the Finns don't come out on top.
Our teachers are more than competent. The job we expect them to do is enormously more difficult. Complaining that our schools fail to deliver an education to students is pretty much analogous to complaining that FedEx won't deliver to your house because you can't be bothered to open the door and pick up the package.
5
We need a return to the days when teachers determined the grade received by the individual student - not the school board, not the parents, and certainly not the student. And we need the return of the hands-on classes - shop, music, tech. There are people whose hands are somehow their smartest parts, and who can figure things out without formulae and pedagogy. We have ignored them long enough.
13
A classic Catch-22 scenario: change students' standards; measure students' performance against new standards; find students' performance wanting; change students' standards; cut funding; call for "schools of choice" as schools have failed expectations.
If one wishes to have a fully functional educational system, which follows national economic needs, then that nation must state what are its short- and long-term goals, and what skills need to be fostered in order to promote goal attainment.
Or, one could out-source everything, take short-term profits, and get out of Dodge!
If one wishes to have a fully functional educational system, which follows national economic needs, then that nation must state what are its short- and long-term goals, and what skills need to be fostered in order to promote goal attainment.
Or, one could out-source everything, take short-term profits, and get out of Dodge!
1
My husband went to one of NYC's exam schools back in the 1960s. His school, the Bronx High School of Science, graduated more Nobel Prize winners than any other high school in the world. In fact, BHSS has more Nobel Prize winners than all but a handful of countries. Now the mayor and some other influential people want to make entrance dependent on subjective factors rather than the scores on entrance exams. Instead of improving the quality of NYC's elementary and middle schools that serve minority students, the favored choice to improve minority entrance to these top-notch schools is to dumb down the requirements. I think the NY Times may even support such a policy change. Isn't it ironic that here is an opportunity to favor substance over appearance by keeping the current exam system in place and the political correct option is to support appearance.
16
In the past several years, the New York Times has very aggressively attacked exam schools and performance charters.
Not too concerned about the day-to-day business of the typical public school, though.
Not too concerned about the day-to-day business of the typical public school, though.
6
You are right, Cheri. This mayor's attempt to dumb down even places like Bronx Science and Stuyvesant is a flagrant pandering to a constituency that resents others for their success.
How do impoverished Asian kids get into these so-called "exam schools"? Not by attending fancy, expensive prep classes -- that's a lie -- but by forming study groups and studying.
It can be done. But so much easier to cry foul.
How do impoverished Asian kids get into these so-called "exam schools"? Not by attending fancy, expensive prep classes -- that's a lie -- but by forming study groups and studying.
It can be done. But so much easier to cry foul.
7
Schools are designed to make money for educators, not to educate. The people in charge pay themselves big money because it makes them feel good. They feel they deserve big money because their work is important, etc. They always justify whatever it is they're doing.
They lard up the curriculum and extend and pretend and put people into debt.
The health care system is the same way.
Big money, killer complexity, poor health outcome.
Formal education?
Who are the best musicians?
The ones who go to college for music?
Not...
There is more than one way to learn about life.
They lard up the curriculum and extend and pretend and put people into debt.
The health care system is the same way.
Big money, killer complexity, poor health outcome.
Formal education?
Who are the best musicians?
The ones who go to college for music?
Not...
There is more than one way to learn about life.
3
There's a lot of money being sucked out of the school system for profit. Very, very little of it is going to educators.
4
This comes as no shock to me, unfortunately. I retired five years ago last June, after 38 years of teaching, most at high school level. The writing was on the proverbial wall: the emphasis being drilled home by administration was "passing at any cost" which meant, quite simply, dumbing down. We were strongly encouraged to throw out lowest test scores, give opportunities to re-take failed tests, grade on a curve, accept late assignments, etc. You get the picture: The administrators looked good, and the district looked good, at least on paper, if the passing and graduation rates were up, and they were. Problem is, I and others realized that the kids were actually not as educated.
13
Did administrators also encourage kids to go to community college, so as to pad the college enrollment stats? That's the California way.
8
Really interesting article. What's more concerning than rising graduation rates is the affordability of college should these students choose to pursue higher education. Many times, students who are middle of the road in high school, excel in college because they are studying something they are actually interested in and understand, unlike the pre-determined math and science based K-12 curriculum.
2
To all those posters who decry "college ready, not everyone needs college," College Ready now is the equivalent of a sixth grade education in 1950. No, not everyone needs to attend college, but attending helps most even if they do not graduate. It tries to give students the knowledge they should have acquired in high school
6
As a student in the 70's I did well in HS with a GPA 3.87 at graduation, including calculus and other Advanced classes. In my career as an Executive chef, earning close to 6 figures, I have not used any of those materials deemed necessary to succeed. Now at age 54, I have 2 years completed at university towards a bachelors so I can teach. I have maintained a 4.0 GPA through 70 credits, and have used very little formation from the core classes needed to complete the Food Science degree. America spends to much on old theories of education, we teach core classes the same as they were taught 60 years ago. The problem with are education system is not the students it is the administration,teachers, and teacher unions. I will not even discuss the many alternative instruction theories that have been implemented to great success, but are ignored by the old guard of education. This network of so called educated instructors, which will never take blame of not progressing education, but will continue to spew lies about students lack of desire to learn.
1
So... you've just gone to school to start to study education, and you know more than all of the experienced teachers? And the realization that you've come to is that teachers and their unions are the problem, coincidentally the narrative that's pushed by crooked media and politicians in the pocket of investors who want to dismantle public education for profit?
Do tell.
Do tell.
4
I just love it! When all else fails, lower the standards. My great state of California is undoubtedly the national leader in the Politically Correct campaign to make sure everyone succeeds, regardless of how poorly motivated or accomplished an individual student is. Not surprising at all. Thanks Democrats!
12
In a society where everyone is proclaimed to be equal in both physical and mental ability and everyone gets a trophy for "participation" why shouldn't everyone also get a diploma? When society decided that "feelings" were much more important than results the rules of the end game changed.
19
NOT a single solitary mention of the disaster NCLB? these 'graduates' grew up totally attending schools that were forced to OBEY NCLB! you know... that wonderful Bush law that changed the focus of Education from learning & teaching to crunching numbers that are basically misleading & useless, including these 'graduation' rates that the 'experts' (read as ACT and SAT) who make money off what they do, as well as the other test manufacturers.
do you realize how far behind we actually are? it takes TWO years to make up for every ONE 'bad' year for a student. when you include the poverty statistic the 'experts' are so gleefully eager add, you can multiply by at least another 2 years!
do you realize how far behind we actually are? it takes TWO years to make up for every ONE 'bad' year for a student. when you include the poverty statistic the 'experts' are so gleefully eager add, you can multiply by at least another 2 years!
6
Happy to see you mention No Child Left Behind, the legacy of President George Bush (R), Senator Ted Kennedy (D), and two other senators, one Democrat and one Republican).
Then there's the next iteration of NCLB - President Barack Obama (D) and his Race To The Top!
It all started when President Jimmy Carter (D) decided there should be a Department of Education and made that huge jobs program happen.
There are many things wrong with the education system in the USA now. It's likely the two largest problems are 1) the idea that a teacher didn't have to know his/her subject - just had to know 'education theory'; and 2) the politicizing of the education system. .
Then there's the next iteration of NCLB - President Barack Obama (D) and his Race To The Top!
It all started when President Jimmy Carter (D) decided there should be a Department of Education and made that huge jobs program happen.
There are many things wrong with the education system in the USA now. It's likely the two largest problems are 1) the idea that a teacher didn't have to know his/her subject - just had to know 'education theory'; and 2) the politicizing of the education system. .
3
In the late 1960s, I had a biology teacher whose standards made the New York Regents requirements look like nonsense. She was impossible to please. Nothing was ever good enough. The stress was overwhelming at times. In the time leading up to regents exams or SATs, she held "voluntary" review sessions after school. The weren't really voluntary because if we didn't show up, she'd come looking for us or call our homes and ask our parents what was wrong with THEM. That was not something we wanted to experience more than once. 45 years later, her students still speak of her with nothing but love and respect.
My son had three teachers like her in grades K-12, and just one in college. Maybe that's as many as we can hope for.
My son had three teachers like her in grades K-12, and just one in college. Maybe that's as many as we can hope for.
17
Unless we do what citizens of other developed nations do and demand higher standards! In a post-industrial, knowledge economy the resource of paramount importance is our human capital. It's time to put our smartest graduates into teaching and fire the under-performers!
1
An excellent teacher at my school went after school and knocked on the doors of 5-6 students because he could not reach any of the parents after multiple phone calls.
He took a translator with him, since all parents only spoke Spanish. He didn't want to be misunderstood or breach any cultural norms (their cultural; not his).
Some of the parents complained that they didn't want to be "harassed" at home by teachers, that they didn't call the school back because from 8-4, it's the school's job to deal with their children. The teacher was written up.
That's what we're up against today.
He took a translator with him, since all parents only spoke Spanish. He didn't want to be misunderstood or breach any cultural norms (their cultural; not his).
Some of the parents complained that they didn't want to be "harassed" at home by teachers, that they didn't call the school back because from 8-4, it's the school's job to deal with their children. The teacher was written up.
That's what we're up against today.
12
Good idea. Have you taken any direct action to that end? Like any other massive system, it must be changed one detail at a time. Here's a good example: My son took an AP trig class whose teacher could never be bothered to answer questions or give kids a few minutes of extra time after school. Two thirds of the class had complaints. I told my son "Create a petition and take it to the principal." He ignored this idea until two days later when he and a friend created a petition. (It had to be their idea, not mine). This created quite an uproar with the administration, but the teacher vanished for a week. When he returned, my son said "I think they put new batteries in the teacher." Someone read him the riot act.
My doctor once said that the word "patient" places him on an undeserved pedestal, because it gives the impression that I'm not a customer. It twists the relationship. It's the same with teachers. They are service providers and we're their customers. We have every right to expect excellence, just as we would with any other service we buy.
Of course, this requires that parents actually pay close attention to their children and their school work. Don't get me started...
My doctor once said that the word "patient" places him on an undeserved pedestal, because it gives the impression that I'm not a customer. It twists the relationship. It's the same with teachers. They are service providers and we're their customers. We have every right to expect excellence, just as we would with any other service we buy.
Of course, this requires that parents actually pay close attention to their children and their school work. Don't get me started...
3
If kids learned any math at all in school, they'd probably be unwilling to get into debt for a college degree, let alone take out a 6-year car loan or leverage themselves with a 30-year mortgage.
An uneducated child is the ideal sucker, i.e., the perfect debt slave.
Forget the degrees and just give them credit cards...
An uneducated child is the ideal sucker, i.e., the perfect debt slave.
Forget the degrees and just give them credit cards...
9
Isn't this what "No Child Left Behind" was supposed to remedy? Instead of fixing and improving the law, the reaction seems to be, "if they don't meet the standards, lower the standards," resulting in "graduates" who can't read, write, or do math. "Local control" really means surrender to local mediocrity. We really do need a national-level set of standards if children everywhere are to have an equal chance. States can't be trusted to give all their children a chance, based on history and results.
3
That law (and Obama's 2.0 version of it) was nothing more than a sell-out of public school kids. Testing companies created a "problem" and offered to provide the "solution," along with plenty of campaign contributions to whomever would legislate the requirement that districts buy more and more standardized tests.
Charter operators, TFA, Pearson testing and host of other vendors now take public tax dollars intended for children. In exchange, they provide "services" that (obviously) are not benefitting any students.
Achievement was rising before NCLB. NCLB, charters, Race to the Top and the Gates' involvement (buy more technology!) are killing public education.
Charter operators, TFA, Pearson testing and host of other vendors now take public tax dollars intended for children. In exchange, they provide "services" that (obviously) are not benefitting any students.
Achievement was rising before NCLB. NCLB, charters, Race to the Top and the Gates' involvement (buy more technology!) are killing public education.
5
The statistics on graduation from community colleges are not valid (I teach in an urban community college) because many of the students there today don't care whether they "graduate" because they are taking inexpensive courses which then transfer to the university they want to graduate from.
6
You are absolutely correct. The "bashing" of community colleges for their graduation rates or remediation programs is despicable. The student body at community colleges is diverse and attend for many reasons. Whether to improve personal skills for their own lives or jobs, to obtain college credit at an affordable cost (one of the biggest complaints today), or, attain admission to a four year college, these schools play an important role in our post secondary education system.
5
According to the OECD, the United States now ranks 19th out of 28 countries in college completion. It used to be first. The OECD's Director for Education and Skills Andreas Schleicher states that: "The lack of educational mobility has serious implications for individuals and society. Higher education levels are associated not just with higher earnings, but also with better health, more community engagement and more trust in governments, institutions and other people." http://www.businessinsider.com/r-us-falls-behind-in-college-competition-...
Of course American young people are capable of doing college-level work. It's up to parents to demand higher standards, and for teachers and school administrators to make certain that they meet those higher expectations. Let's stop this nonsense about "teaching to the test," and catch up to the rest of the developed world.
Now.
Of course American young people are capable of doing college-level work. It's up to parents to demand higher standards, and for teachers and school administrators to make certain that they meet those higher expectations. Let's stop this nonsense about "teaching to the test," and catch up to the rest of the developed world.
Now.
6
Many if the nations outperforming us teach to the test. Measurement is crucial.
1
Virtually every reference to schools winds up describing shortfalls and deficiencies; we choose those things we prefer and then detail how the schools miss the boat. Most missing, however, is that the schools actually represent their customers: the sponsoring organizations. The parochial school is supposed to "train up a child in the way he should go,"; the profit-making school need make a profit, and the public school is supposed to produce citizens, ready for productive - well, citizenship.
Thing here is that the public and the school are out of step with each other; the public seems uncaring, wishing not at all to pay for the results they "want" , while the schools face little but ridicule from a dominating pop culture.
In the face of present conditions it's almost odd to want to become a teacher. The school boards face perpetual budget crises, in which they must never, never touch sports. Somehow the need is for the public to desire instruction rather than entertainment, and to get back in step.
Thing here is that the public and the school are out of step with each other; the public seems uncaring, wishing not at all to pay for the results they "want" , while the schools face little but ridicule from a dominating pop culture.
In the face of present conditions it's almost odd to want to become a teacher. The school boards face perpetual budget crises, in which they must never, never touch sports. Somehow the need is for the public to desire instruction rather than entertainment, and to get back in step.
6
As I aged, I saw the change; that high school is really junior high, college is really high school, and most graduates are ignorant and, perhaps, stupid. When did America stop producing kids with brains? It was about 30 years ago. Too bad we let it all slip for PC.
12
Coincidentally (??!), teachers unions became common in the 60's. Many Baby Boomers were educated through much of K-12 by non union teachers.
2
In the early 70s the US began populating classrooms with teachers who were graduates of education departments rather than teachers who majored in STEM subjects. As per "The Schools We Need and Why We Don't Have Them".
4
Yeah, teachers' unions are responsible for everything that's wrong with schools.
Oddly, though, the damage seems to be felt mostly at the NON-union schools. The schools WITH unions are usually better than the ones without.
But I'm sure that'll all just some union thug plot.
Oddly, though, the damage seems to be felt mostly at the NON-union schools. The schools WITH unions are usually better than the ones without.
But I'm sure that'll all just some union thug plot.
3
When Arne Duncan States: ""The goal is not just high school graduation. The goal is being truly college and career ready."
ARNE DUNCAN, the departing secretary of education, on the United States' 82 percent graduation rate in 2013-14, the highest on record."
Not only is He Wrong on all Levels but this may be exactly what is wrong in our entire Ed System--educating Kids for the Future rather than for the Now!
ARNE DUNCAN, the departing secretary of education, on the United States' 82 percent graduation rate in 2013-14, the highest on record."
Not only is He Wrong on all Levels but this may be exactly what is wrong in our entire Ed System--educating Kids for the Future rather than for the Now!
2
Another resounding failure of the Obama administration and the department of NO wdication.
The constitution does not provide for any federal level department of education - it is a fiction of legislature that it exists at all.
To be effective, education needs to be administered at only the local level because the people know best the needs and means of and for their offspring. Doe funding should be eliminated and the federal budget reduced commensurately.
The constitution does not provide for any federal level department of education - it is a fiction of legislature that it exists at all.
To be effective, education needs to be administered at only the local level because the people know best the needs and means of and for their offspring. Doe funding should be eliminated and the federal budget reduced commensurately.
3
Nonsense. The dumbing down of America, and of our school system, has been going on since the late 1960s. You can blame the Democrats if you'd like, and I am no fan of Mr. Obama, but this education crisis is not his fault.
2
So many adults here bemoaning the lack of rigor and sub-par graduation standards, the lack of critical thinking skills and general academic incompetence in this new generation of students. Yet most adults posting here proudly display their ignorance of the issues and their poor critical thinking skills. Project much?
The shabby reporting in this article does little to help the casual citizen to understand the complexity of the issues surrounding public education and the test-and-punish reform movement of the NCLB/RTTT/CCSS era.
We now have all the evidence we need to know that a narrow emphasis on math and ELA testing is a FAILED policy. Yet Congress just passed the new ESSA which will keep us on this path of "one-size-fits-few" approach to educating the incredible diversity we see in our country's classrooms.
The shabby reporting in this article does little to help the casual citizen to understand the complexity of the issues surrounding public education and the test-and-punish reform movement of the NCLB/RTTT/CCSS era.
We now have all the evidence we need to know that a narrow emphasis on math and ELA testing is a FAILED policy. Yet Congress just passed the new ESSA which will keep us on this path of "one-size-fits-few" approach to educating the incredible diversity we see in our country's classrooms.
5
What experts? ANY teacher knows that rating schools by graduation rates would lead to lower standards.
10
I asked a friend who taught "gifted" children in NYC public schools how gifted was measured, how bright were the children. She said that the kids would have been considered "B" students in the 1950s and early 60s. In some of the community colleges the professors assess the general knowledge and academic skills in reading and writing of the students admitted in the last 15 years akin to fifth graders of the mid twentieth century. About 20 years ago Time Magazine published a study saying that the average 14 year old used to have a vocabulary of 24,000 words, but now that had fallen to 10,000 words. Currently, youngsters even from middle class homes, have a pitiful acquisition of language.People don't really need algebra to succeed in life, geometry is useful, but they do need a good command of language. The standard of education in American public schools over the past 30 years has been degraded into America's tragedy. "No new words!" was a marketing selling point for children's readers. Now when these kids reach college many become resentful when their professors expect them to learn just half of what the profs were expected to learn in the same gen ed course. Reading is painful for this generation as they struggle to make sense of the words before their eyes. Toss the book aside and get back to one's text messages.
23
A huge growing class of Americans is being created which will never earn a living wage!
Their future will be sitting in front of media on government subsistence or in societal conflict with the haves.
Those alternative choices will depend on how much subsistence is allocated to their placation.
Their future will be sitting in front of media on government subsistence or in societal conflict with the haves.
Those alternative choices will depend on how much subsistence is allocated to their placation.
8
End of empire.
3
roman circus modern style.
4
Of course, the elephant in the room is race. What has driven this ‘graduate at all costs’ mentality is the different level of academic success experienced by different groups. Obviously if one group is relatively better in getting through school than another, that is prima facie evidence of discrimination. So graduation rates have to be the same.
A real return to high academic standards at the public school level would bring these differences into very stark relief, and that is not something that most people (and most particularly the good souls who write for and read this newspaper) really want to take a hard look at. Everyone is created equal, or should have been, so let’s just keep passing people from grade to grade and hope they magically get smarter somewhere down the line.
As America’s demographics move more in the direction of those which experience - for whatever reasons - less scholastic success, we should resign ourselves to a less ambitious academic future for the average student. Some sort of rigorous vocational training is no doubt a better fit for most than 'college prep'. But even that would require a much more disciplined and demanding schooling regime than we currently have. As things stand, we are all just whistling past the educational graveyard.
A real return to high academic standards at the public school level would bring these differences into very stark relief, and that is not something that most people (and most particularly the good souls who write for and read this newspaper) really want to take a hard look at. Everyone is created equal, or should have been, so let’s just keep passing people from grade to grade and hope they magically get smarter somewhere down the line.
As America’s demographics move more in the direction of those which experience - for whatever reasons - less scholastic success, we should resign ourselves to a less ambitious academic future for the average student. Some sort of rigorous vocational training is no doubt a better fit for most than 'college prep'. But even that would require a much more disciplined and demanding schooling regime than we currently have. As things stand, we are all just whistling past the educational graveyard.
19
Teacher of 14 years here - agreed
3
Thanks for pointing out the obvious, unspoken truth. Equality means equality of rights, nothing more or less. As long as we live in a society that DEMANDS equal results for all groups of people based on race, sex, and ethnicity, the dumbing down of America will continue. Tomorrow's average college graduate may very well be more no more knowledgeable or literate than yesterday's average grammar school graduate. Would not surprise me in the least.
10
equal results is the goal of the left. the resultant mediocrity is the goal of the elite. look at cuba and venezuela. castro and maduro's famiy are billionaires while the masses suffer/starve.
2
These statistics are sickening. Its unfortunate that our public school system doesn't work preparing students for college and real world meaningful jobs. My girlfriend's 10th grade daughter is a 4.0 student, member of the National Honor Society, speech & debate champion, choir star, and good soccer player. She attends one of the top rated AA public schools in the country. Her biggest complaint at school is that she wants to learn but very few of the other students care about learning. Most students want to just do the bare minimum, and the teachers do not challenge the students at all. Many times she is just bored in class even though she is taking AP classes in both history and math. Our schools are teaching to the dumbest kids and leaving the smarter kids and students who want to learn spinning their wheels. America is falling further and further behind in education. Let's see if the new legislation putting the responsibility for education back into the State's hands works or just creates more of the same.
9
If the teachers were to challenge the students and the students refused to rise to the challenge and failed, the teachers would be reprimanded for not passing enough students. If all the teachers at a school did that, the state would take over the school and fire them.
What rational person would do that?
What rational person would do that?
3
If this were Texas, the students mentioned in this article would be granted full admission to the UT system ahead of more qualified applicants so long as their skin tone was of the wight shade. Further evidence that affirmative action is unfair from every angle.
One should note that the ACT and SAT are not really that great at predicting college completion. See Paul Tough's How Children Succeed. There are a number of problems with these exams and we shouldn't lean on them too heavily as indicators of student readiness for college.
3
Most students can’t read, write or otherwise communicate well. Or do math. They lack an adequate academic background and discipline.
The causes are many: poverty indifferent parenting; emotional or physical illness; language deficiency; inadequately trained teachers and principals (especially principals); money.
The solutions?
Long term, there is hope, but it will require a sea-change in education. Not much evidence yet.
Short term and for individual students, teachers, principals, parents and small schools, there are a couple of strategies.
First, for parents: seek good schools with strong principals and teachers. They exist. There are many great teachers mired in poor school systems.
Second, for students: develop self-knowledge. Without self-knowledge students will never find their talents, gifts and abilities.
Absent self-knowledge, students will not enter the right academic field (or ultimately, the right career) for themselves. Once they gain it, they will see themselves and their place in the world and will not be prevented from striving for it. It doesn’t matter what the child’s background is or was, personal academic and professional success can be reached on this individual basis. The history of North America and other places in the world proves it.
There are ways of doing this. I teach students how to do it at Dropout to Dean’s List. The success rate is high.
The causes are many: poverty indifferent parenting; emotional or physical illness; language deficiency; inadequately trained teachers and principals (especially principals); money.
The solutions?
Long term, there is hope, but it will require a sea-change in education. Not much evidence yet.
Short term and for individual students, teachers, principals, parents and small schools, there are a couple of strategies.
First, for parents: seek good schools with strong principals and teachers. They exist. There are many great teachers mired in poor school systems.
Second, for students: develop self-knowledge. Without self-knowledge students will never find their talents, gifts and abilities.
Absent self-knowledge, students will not enter the right academic field (or ultimately, the right career) for themselves. Once they gain it, they will see themselves and their place in the world and will not be prevented from striving for it. It doesn’t matter what the child’s background is or was, personal academic and professional success can be reached on this individual basis. The history of North America and other places in the world proves it.
There are ways of doing this. I teach students how to do it at Dropout to Dean’s List. The success rate is high.
1
Unless our education system is overhauled, we will continue sliding in cultural and educations scores. We are already among third-world countries. Over 30 years since my emigration from the Soviet Union, I had compared our education many times: during my son’s school years, his years at the prestigious university, and mentoring my new colleagues fresh out of college. When I was young, the soviet school system felt too rigid, disciplinarian and lacking imagination, but we graduated with a firm grip on grammar, love of literature and strong skills in math and science, including advanced topics in mathematics. My son is always amazed how many poems I can recite by heart. In the US, students read only what is in the school program, and for many it is limited to the Cliff Notes.
The roots of the problem lay in a culture that no longer praises personal responsibility. A need for hard work is replaced by schools competing in pursuing racial, cultural and gender diversity. Teacher and university instructors are concerned with being “liked” on the evaluation reports. The teachers have better pensions and benefits than the majority of us in the country where the defined benefit pension is a thing of the past. But the teachers themselves are a product of poor college education, and many are not subject matter experts. It is a vicious circle. To break out of it, we should take a sober look at the reality and stop kidding ourselves that we are the “greatest country on earth”.
The roots of the problem lay in a culture that no longer praises personal responsibility. A need for hard work is replaced by schools competing in pursuing racial, cultural and gender diversity. Teacher and university instructors are concerned with being “liked” on the evaluation reports. The teachers have better pensions and benefits than the majority of us in the country where the defined benefit pension is a thing of the past. But the teachers themselves are a product of poor college education, and many are not subject matter experts. It is a vicious circle. To break out of it, we should take a sober look at the reality and stop kidding ourselves that we are the “greatest country on earth”.
15
A shrinking number of teachers still have pensions. And their pensions plus their salaries still add up to less than what they'd be paid at equivalent private sector jobs for less work and fewer headaches.
1
Private sector jobs may pay more, but I disagree with your assessment of "fewer headaches". You lose job and have to compete to get another one. How many teachers do you know that have lost jobs?
But while individual teacher's talents and skills are important, the problem lies in the educational system itself. Understandably, the bureaucrats want higher graduation rates and test scores. Let's change the way tests are given to make them more meaningful. Replace multiple choice tests with written essays on the subject and oral examination where students must actually answer questions and elaborate how well they understand the discipline. Students have to be prepared to solve problems and think, not just guess one of the multiple choice answers. Surely, it will put a bigger burden on teachers, but won’t it be worth it?
We will have to stop collecting students’ evaluation of teachers’ and college instructors’ performance at the end of semester and replace it with peers’ evaluation. Only professional pedagogues and subject matter experts should have a right to assess the teachers’ performance.
But while individual teacher's talents and skills are important, the problem lies in the educational system itself. Understandably, the bureaucrats want higher graduation rates and test scores. Let's change the way tests are given to make them more meaningful. Replace multiple choice tests with written essays on the subject and oral examination where students must actually answer questions and elaborate how well they understand the discipline. Students have to be prepared to solve problems and think, not just guess one of the multiple choice answers. Surely, it will put a bigger burden on teachers, but won’t it be worth it?
We will have to stop collecting students’ evaluation of teachers’ and college instructors’ performance at the end of semester and replace it with peers’ evaluation. Only professional pedagogues and subject matter experts should have a right to assess the teachers’ performance.
I believe there are many retired scientists and engineers, with great skills in science and math, who would love to come into classrooms. But education bureaucracies must provide the incentives.
10
Teachers unions use professional certification barriers to protect their largely sub-standard workforce. Public education in many districts remains a jobs program for the unambiguous members of the bottom 66% of their college cohort.
The last thing they want is smarter, more qualified competition from the private sector to enter their cosseted workforce and show that the crucial factor is not an education degree but well-above-average intelligence and deep and excellent domain-area expertise.
The last thing they want is smarter, more qualified competition from the private sector to enter their cosseted workforce and show that the crucial factor is not an education degree but well-above-average intelligence and deep and excellent domain-area expertise.
8
There's been lots of loosening of restrictions over the last decade and a half, and lots of private sector, unqualified workers have managed to teach. The problem is that they're not nearly as "smarter" and "more qualified" as ignorant teacher bashers insist.
1
You're right, but people hate to hear it. Many prefer a sentimental notion about teachers that was outdated 70 years ago.
The common core focused on college readiness, but now many want to remove it. We continually focus on the wrong parts of education and our antidote is to punish schools and teachers rather then support them to achieve the end goal of college readiness.
A failing school gets additional support but once it meets the targeted goals the money is removed. Unfortunately, the need didn't disappear and it's only a matter of time before it is once again a failing school.
Our children need to be college ready and we need to focus our energies on achieving that rather then blaming and shaming.
A failing school gets additional support but once it meets the targeted goals the money is removed. Unfortunately, the need didn't disappear and it's only a matter of time before it is once again a failing school.
Our children need to be college ready and we need to focus our energies on achieving that rather then blaming and shaming.
1
I see way too many comments by so-called educators blaming parents and the educational hierarchy for their inability to teach.
Here's some tough ethical love...
Without teachers, corrupt government bureaucrats, overpaid administrators and universities that collude with banksters to sell worthless degrees have *nothing to sell* and no way to enslave the next generation of deadbeats.
No one forces teachers to essentially prostitute themselves under the system.
Take the money and blame the system?
Guess what?
You *are* the system...you are the gate-keepers.
America is going down the toilet because everyone is selling out and that includes teachers.
Think the system is too entrenched to fix?
Maybe that means you need to find another line of work, assuming you wish to live an ethical life.
Too high a bar?
Unrealistic?
There are people who've put their lives on the line for what they believe.
You cannot say no to the boss?
I think you are a coward. I think you've been corrupted by the system.
And, parents?
Do not like the schools?
Pull your kids *out* of those schools.
Students?
Advocate for change...
The quality of a society reflects on the quality of its people.
Here's some tough ethical love...
Without teachers, corrupt government bureaucrats, overpaid administrators and universities that collude with banksters to sell worthless degrees have *nothing to sell* and no way to enslave the next generation of deadbeats.
No one forces teachers to essentially prostitute themselves under the system.
Take the money and blame the system?
Guess what?
You *are* the system...you are the gate-keepers.
America is going down the toilet because everyone is selling out and that includes teachers.
Think the system is too entrenched to fix?
Maybe that means you need to find another line of work, assuming you wish to live an ethical life.
Too high a bar?
Unrealistic?
There are people who've put their lives on the line for what they believe.
You cannot say no to the boss?
I think you are a coward. I think you've been corrupted by the system.
And, parents?
Do not like the schools?
Pull your kids *out* of those schools.
Students?
Advocate for change...
The quality of a society reflects on the quality of its people.
6
Question- how many teachers do you actually know that are selling out? What are they selling out exactly? Taking a job in a system means you have to work within it to do the best you can- many do - I see it every day. I'm sorry if your experience with teachers has been less than perfect - and I'm simply not sure what you are getting at with the prostitution comment. I spend many days in the system questioning it and many others also speak out.
7
@JBG: How many teachers do I need to know? I taught at the university level in the 1970's. Standards started falling in the latter part of that decade. I changed careers in 1980. I basically started over because I did not wish to be a party to what I, presciently, saw awaited.
2
I taught for five years at a sprawling 2-year college system that neighbors Greenville, SC, where Berea HS is located. During that time, I watched in dismay as our Administration shifted its strategy from meeting the skills-deficits of incoming students with remedial courses to adopting a "if you can't beat em, join 'em" approach. Community colleges depend almost entirely on contingent faculty -- at my college we were 75% -- so in addition to working unpaid hours to accommodate the needs of disabled students as the ADA dictates (Autistic Spectrum Disorder, learning disabilties, vets with traumatic brain injury, emotional and behavioral disorders, and students with moderate to severe mental illness), we were increasingly pressured to accommodate students who were functionally illiterate, attendance-averse, or who worked forty hours a week and did not have time to complete and submit assignments. In this latter sense, "accommodate" was synonomous with "passing." We were told that we had to retain as many students as possible in order to raise retention rates, which the SC legislature had tied in to our funding levels. It was clear to me that by maintaining college-level curriculum I was making myself unemployable at that particular institution, so I left, despite knowing that I was a good teacher and had helped many students with first-rate minds but incomplete educations to make great strides in my classes.
60
So you "gave up". That's your "educator's" lesson to young people?
To be fair, while many of our community colleges are terrible by international standards, the war to educate our children is being lost much earlier, in K-12. Deficiencies usually start early in a student's career and cascade and compound down the years. The idea of instructors of grade-13 students having to try to make up for the failure and downright professional malpractice of their students' K-12 instructors is as impossible as it seems. No amount of cramming in college can obviate the need for a functioning K-12 system staffed by excellent teachers smarter than their students.
3
No, that's my message to lawmakers, administrators and parents who demand quality results when they are neither willing to pay for them (my adjunct colleagues and I earned 1/4 the salary that full-time faculty did, when some of us had more education and experience than many of these instructors), nor are they willing to make the reforms necessary, since the essential component: academic standards, is incompatible with "no child left behind."
3
Research of 'successful' high schools is paramount, To look for commonality on how and why these schools succeed. For example there is a 'public' high school in Massachusetts with a substantially large student population that had serious problems with their students' academic achievement and behavior. Through the years, gradually, with teachers working as a team and at times with intense exchanges, made progress. Now, this high school has achieved awards not only for the state, but nationally as well, for the number AND quality of educated,, college ready students.
1
Education must be the worst thing we do to kids collectively.
Educators ruin it by denaturing it, the creative-discovery process especially. The system beats spontaneity and insight out of students -- the term "student" a subordinate social-class designation. The dry academics supplanted are dull and unfocused if not pointless because, although marketed as "foundational", they are segregated from real work.
Previously "unschooled" children are grouped by age and presumed maturity then forced to submit to authoritarian discipline: to obediently sit at desk-chairs quietly, passively listening, taking notes. Six hours a day, 35 hours a week.
Grouped, but isolated. Instilled with social values that prize order through submission, their individual talent and interests subordinated to better meet uniform standards of academic proficiency set by others, elsewhere. Forced to compete against each other in a creatively sterile, hot-house, often hostile environment. Their reward, such as it is, to go punished -- to not to be penalized for mistakes made, judged by authority. The mark of excellence, a letter grade awarded after paper and pencil tests are administered, not by doing something actually, physically real or through completing tasks as part of a team.
What makes the "real world" run? Initiative. Inspiration. Dedication. Courage. Spontaneity. Insight. Sacrifice. Risk-taking. Responsibility. Teamwork. So, of course "education" fails to prepare; a miserable, abject failure.
Educators ruin it by denaturing it, the creative-discovery process especially. The system beats spontaneity and insight out of students -- the term "student" a subordinate social-class designation. The dry academics supplanted are dull and unfocused if not pointless because, although marketed as "foundational", they are segregated from real work.
Previously "unschooled" children are grouped by age and presumed maturity then forced to submit to authoritarian discipline: to obediently sit at desk-chairs quietly, passively listening, taking notes. Six hours a day, 35 hours a week.
Grouped, but isolated. Instilled with social values that prize order through submission, their individual talent and interests subordinated to better meet uniform standards of academic proficiency set by others, elsewhere. Forced to compete against each other in a creatively sterile, hot-house, often hostile environment. Their reward, such as it is, to go punished -- to not to be penalized for mistakes made, judged by authority. The mark of excellence, a letter grade awarded after paper and pencil tests are administered, not by doing something actually, physically real or through completing tasks as part of a team.
What makes the "real world" run? Initiative. Inspiration. Dedication. Courage. Spontaneity. Insight. Sacrifice. Risk-taking. Responsibility. Teamwork. So, of course "education" fails to prepare; a miserable, abject failure.
3
Students need chops and moxie - it's not either - or. You must have command of language and math, understand how to analyze and have a bank of facts at your disposal, as well as being creative.
3
Why is the requirement always university prep? When are we going to get smart and go to a dual track system: academic and trade?
11
This absolutely does not surprise me, nor is it anything new. I, myself coasted through high school in the late seventies, taking the easiest classes I could, the bare minimum. Military entry requirements were also lax, so I joined the Air Force. I was very fortunate to have a supervisor that cared and challenged me. I got my Bachelor's due to his guidance. Even with that, the last few years since the financial crash have been hard. I feel for young people coming out of high school today, in an Era of corporate greed not seen since Teddy Roosevelt's monopoly busting presidency. High school has got to be more than cheap day care.
6
I'm in my 70s and was a totally average student. The question is at what stage in life did I learn to THINK. I know my work taught me a great deal, I learned to contribute to a team and to apply my knowledge to actual use. Everything I did over the next twenty five years made me respected both by others and my self, this can make coming to work each day wonderful. It was also necessary for me to have an Associates Degree (not much) and take ongoing educational credits continuously through the years.
In my opinion, the biggest gift students can get is the ability to ask questions and problem solve. Education currently appears to spend most time teaching to the test and regurgitating facts, without understanding what we are learning and why.
In my opinion, the biggest gift students can get is the ability to ask questions and problem solve. Education currently appears to spend most time teaching to the test and regurgitating facts, without understanding what we are learning and why.
5
I have interviewed dozens of individuals with a High School diploma from NYC public schools and no further education. At least 25% of them I would classify as innumerate and or illiterate. The teachers got paid, the principals and administrators got paid and these people, (all minorities from poor neighborhoods), got a guaranteed life of poverty.
I have problems with standardized tests and the common core, but meaningless diplomas exploit the most vulnerable students.
I have problems with standardized tests and the common core, but meaningless diplomas exploit the most vulnerable students.
8
The assistant principals in schools have no tenure . If they were to accuse a principal of forced promotion as a culture they could be removed and the principals want their bonuses so it won't happen anytime soon. The safety net in high school is so wide it could catch anything . Of course when the kids graduate the net disappears - that's when many of them have realizations - it should happen much earlier - but our society doesn't "leave anyone behind " - good teachers are left to do what they have always done- do the best they can within their limited space - the classroom- I agree that many of them leave high school Ill prepared - personally I have about 20-5 students right now who never walk into a classroom- the parental contact numbers are all wrong - I'm not allowed to go to their neighborhood and knock on their doors - so those kids lose their chances for a variety of different reasons - home life problems , peers , language barriers, Unidentified learning disabilities ,
170 students on my roster at any given time makes it more difficult , ultimately students need to learn responsibility- and learn it from patient , understanding people , and face real consequences for messing up- most people don't like to talk about that anymore
170 students on my roster at any given time makes it more difficult , ultimately students need to learn responsibility- and learn it from patient , understanding people , and face real consequences for messing up- most people don't like to talk about that anymore
4
The teachers, principals, and administrators are reacting to a system that judges (and in some cases closes) schools based on graduation rates.
You're mad at the wrong people. Don't blame educators who have to put food on their families' tables. Blame the politicians who've passed laws holding educators "accountable" for factors that predictably distort the educational process.
You're mad at the wrong people. Don't blame educators who have to put food on their families' tables. Blame the politicians who've passed laws holding educators "accountable" for factors that predictably distort the educational process.
2
Teachers and parents cannot want you to learn more than you want to learn. You must be taught to love learning at your parents' knee.
3
The world wide glut of labor and the wholesale importation of unskilled, low education immigrants to this country will insure that not only will our unemployment rate remain high, but the wages and prospects of similarly unskilled, low education u.s. citizens will remain bleak.
In an era where even a college degree doesn't mean you won't end up living in your parents basement and serving burgers, those left even further behind by a neglected education system and a race to the bottom economic globalization disaster will likely never get off the lowest wrung of the ladder.
In an era where even a college degree doesn't mean you won't end up living in your parents basement and serving burgers, those left even further behind by a neglected education system and a race to the bottom economic globalization disaster will likely never get off the lowest wrung of the ladder.
7
When will Americans learn to fight for their lunch?
3
I find the comments on the need for pouring more money in to education to be somewhat self serving, more likely than not. Certainly the Teacher's Unions have an interest in that. The problem is we spend more on education than any other country.......and get less for it. It is astounding how much we spend on inner city schools. Perhaps we need to realize our declining educational situation reflects the huge equalization that is occurring as the nation demographically integrates itself into Mexico and Central America. Maybe a guaranteed annual income for these families or all families would work. How can a single mother take care of five or six kids and be doing fast food two shifts per day. For the millions of immigrants coming into Germany a basic living wage is provided that amounts ot quite a bit.
1
The funding we put toward schools has declined over the last decade, while the job we expect schools to do has been expanding for much longer than that.
The teachers' unions aren't self-serving. They're on the right side of a policy question, as usual.
The teachers' unions aren't self-serving. They're on the right side of a policy question, as usual.
1
Other than national, and some would say local, security ..... I cannot think of a larger U.S. tragedy. The sad combination of poorly trained teachers (some, not all ... but all are protected from accountability) and inadequate parents (again, some, not all) are producing whole generations of mediocrity .... but, at least, they may feel good about themselves and know what they are entitled to.
As with most significant societal problems, money alone will not fix this.
As with most significant societal problems, money alone will not fix this.
3
How are teachers protected from accountability? You don't specify tenure or union status. Those are the usual scapegoats, but that claim is a myth. Tenured, unionized teachers can be fired if they deserve firing. Few do.
2
Meanwhile the NY Times and teachers unions continue to fight against standards and accountibility for public schools. Is it any wonder they are not ready for college when tests are considered "the" problem in grades 1-12?
4
The NYT is pretty consistently anti-teachers' union. And the unions are almost always on the side of policy questions that's best for the kids. Neither the Times nor the unions are responsible for falling standards; that's mostly due to perverse incentives caused by politicians who've passed laws holding teachers and schools accountable when students are lazy and fail.
In other words, you seem to have gotten out of your depth and lashed out at what you consider to be the usual suspects, without any understanding of the issue.
In other words, you seem to have gotten out of your depth and lashed out at what you consider to be the usual suspects, without any understanding of the issue.
2
Instead of concentrating on graduation rates and concern over our kids becoming "college ready", how about teaching subjects in school that will actually help students in their future careers and life path? Basic discussion skills, old-fashioned grammar, job interviewing skills, personal finance, history along with current global issues, self-sufficiency? How about inspiring students to formulate and communicate creative ideas or use their scientific mind? Yes, math and english is important, but the kind of math that may actually be used in real life. Is higher level Algebra or Calculus essential for much in our day to day life? No. Even when I went to high school, there was so much focus on subjects that had nothing to do with real life, which caused boredom, a "just get through it" attitude and very possibly turned students off from the most important and fulfilling aspect of being "educated"; staying curious about the world,
3
The reality is that contrary to the Truman edict, everyone should NOT go to college. Since the 1950s the levels of simple knowledge have sunk consistently. Every teacher and professor I've met in the last 40 years agrees. A college degree today is worth a HS diploma of 50 years ago. The young are kept off the work force rolls for 4 more years. That makes employment statistics look good, but leaves us with a mass of students unable to read, write, spell, or do math.
We've made it all easy, made a nation of dumb adults - and complain about it. No one wants to be Responsible, Do the hard part, or take the blame.
Perhaps we should get out the texts from the '40s, relearn to give bad grades that make kids cry and parents scold the students, not the teachers, and teach teachers to tell parents who blame teaching, not parenting to just buzz off.
We have a system where the administrators and the teachers get an F, the students get a lousy life, and America sinks in the world of nations, flailing around and dependent on war for attention.
And don't mention the brilliance of our politicians and their top advisors!
We've made it all easy, made a nation of dumb adults - and complain about it. No one wants to be Responsible, Do the hard part, or take the blame.
Perhaps we should get out the texts from the '40s, relearn to give bad grades that make kids cry and parents scold the students, not the teachers, and teach teachers to tell parents who blame teaching, not parenting to just buzz off.
We have a system where the administrators and the teachers get an F, the students get a lousy life, and America sinks in the world of nations, flailing around and dependent on war for attention.
And don't mention the brilliance of our politicians and their top advisors!
6
Why waste time studying when your smartphone can do all your thinking for you?
1
"...some educators say such tests do not accurately predict whether students will do well in college or in the workplace anyway."
Sure Wilbur...that's akin to the politician, who's hopelessly losing in the polls, saying 'polls don't mean anything anyway'...
Sure Wilbur...that's akin to the politician, who's hopelessly losing in the polls, saying 'polls don't mean anything anyway'...
2
These statistics are meaningless until we discuss the elephant in the room: students do not start off on a level playing field when they begin public schools. Because of the funding for public schools being tied to property taxes, students from affluent districts have the advantage of additional educational resources at the outset. Frankly, the parents who can afford to live in a more affluent school district like it that way; less affluent parents have no choice but to accept it.
This won't mean anything until a student begins to experience difficulty as coursework becomes more complex and demanding. Two students of similar native intelligence, with similar preparation and parental support, will begin diverging in their performance as soon as math progresses from arithmetic to algebraic functions; science from memorization of facts to understanding systems; and history from memorizing significant dates to understanding cause and effect. In the affluent school district, teacher-coaches and after-school support can bridge the gap. In the less affluent district, the teachers are not compensated at the same level and may be less inclined to "volunteer" their time to assist struggling students. Moreover, more affluent parents are in a position to pay for outside tutoring.
When the student from Brownsville meets his roommate from Scarsdale at Harvard freshman orientation, believe that they have travelled very different roads to arrive at the same place
This won't mean anything until a student begins to experience difficulty as coursework becomes more complex and demanding. Two students of similar native intelligence, with similar preparation and parental support, will begin diverging in their performance as soon as math progresses from arithmetic to algebraic functions; science from memorization of facts to understanding systems; and history from memorizing significant dates to understanding cause and effect. In the affluent school district, teacher-coaches and after-school support can bridge the gap. In the less affluent district, the teachers are not compensated at the same level and may be less inclined to "volunteer" their time to assist struggling students. Moreover, more affluent parents are in a position to pay for outside tutoring.
When the student from Brownsville meets his roommate from Scarsdale at Harvard freshman orientation, believe that they have travelled very different roads to arrive at the same place
7
From a former math professor, here is the sorry story in a nutshell. (It's much worse than most people could ever imagine.)
Please follow this carefully.
First, major universities (not unlike the one where I recently taught, Wash. U. in St. Louis) are motivated to grant math PhD's to totally unqualified candidates. (By "unqualified" I don't mean that they don't meet some high standard, I mean, "Are you kidding me?". Look at my blog, inside-higher-ed , for examples.)
Second, these unqualified PhD's become unqualified professors at state regional schools. (I taught at one once and give examples on my blog.)
Third, many high school teachers go to state regional schools to learn their subject; but, given their professors, they don't have a chance.
Finally, we get high school teachers who have little choice but to pass their students without teaching them because those teachers don't have the tools to teach well - and it all started with the "highly regarded" colleges, the ones that are making out like bandits in this system. (That's because their "customers" are naïve, and politicians like Lamar Alexander work hard to make sure that they are never held accountable. See my blog for how Vanderbilt worked with him.)
That's it in a nutshell, and it is highly destructive.
Please follow this carefully.
First, major universities (not unlike the one where I recently taught, Wash. U. in St. Louis) are motivated to grant math PhD's to totally unqualified candidates. (By "unqualified" I don't mean that they don't meet some high standard, I mean, "Are you kidding me?". Look at my blog, inside-higher-ed , for examples.)
Second, these unqualified PhD's become unqualified professors at state regional schools. (I taught at one once and give examples on my blog.)
Third, many high school teachers go to state regional schools to learn their subject; but, given their professors, they don't have a chance.
Finally, we get high school teachers who have little choice but to pass their students without teaching them because those teachers don't have the tools to teach well - and it all started with the "highly regarded" colleges, the ones that are making out like bandits in this system. (That's because their "customers" are naïve, and politicians like Lamar Alexander work hard to make sure that they are never held accountable. See my blog for how Vanderbilt worked with him.)
That's it in a nutshell, and it is highly destructive.
5
A no-brainer. If state and federal agencies are going to punish/reward school districts partly on their graduations rates, graduations rates will go up.
Until we decide to educate elementary school teachers in the subjects which they must introduce to students--English, Math, history, and science--students are going to waste a lot of time and deliberately time-wasting, ignorance-hiding group and class projects which teach little if anything.
Proof: Just a few years ago, everyone was worried about dropout rates. When everyone realized that high school was too late, everyone worried about pre-school education. In effect, this self-serving strategy blames parents for their children's education. The "donut-hole" in public education is elementary school teachers. I do not care how well-motivated or hard-working they claim to be; I care only that they they cannot teach what they do not know and do not emphasize. Their unions define them as self-serving welfare recipients by shielding their ignorance and incompetence, and resisting reforms. Teacher employment trumps student educaiton every time.
Until we decide to educate elementary school teachers in the subjects which they must introduce to students--English, Math, history, and science--students are going to waste a lot of time and deliberately time-wasting, ignorance-hiding group and class projects which teach little if anything.
Proof: Just a few years ago, everyone was worried about dropout rates. When everyone realized that high school was too late, everyone worried about pre-school education. In effect, this self-serving strategy blames parents for their children's education. The "donut-hole" in public education is elementary school teachers. I do not care how well-motivated or hard-working they claim to be; I care only that they they cannot teach what they do not know and do not emphasize. Their unions define them as self-serving welfare recipients by shielding their ignorance and incompetence, and resisting reforms. Teacher employment trumps student educaiton every time.
1
Teachers' unions are usually on the right side of policy (which is why our schools with unions are generally better than the ones without), and blaming parents for parenting (which is, apart from student ability, the main thing that determines educational success) isn't self-serving, just accurate.
The teachers are teaching. Moreso where they've got unions to support them, but they're teaching. Where the parents support the kids so they're ready to learn, there aren't any problems.
The teachers are teaching. Moreso where they've got unions to support them, but they're teaching. Where the parents support the kids so they're ready to learn, there aren't any problems.
1
Sorry, but as a K-12 student in one of the nation's best public school systems, I never had parents teaching me my ABCs before I went to school, or helping me with my homework or going to parent-teacher conferences when I did go to school. The teachers were expected to start from scratch and get the students up to scratch--end of story. If your parents went to your school, it was to see the principal about bad behavior. The teachers were fully competent and needed no protection from principals because there were no issues of competence.
As a long-time teacher and as an activist in public education, I have witnessed the decline of competency, and no amount of anti-anti-union talk and pro-parent pre-kindergarten preparation is going to explain it away. But defending the indefensible means not making much of a change for the better in public education. So teachers will become serfs in the feudalism of charter and for-profit schools--a fate which they will have earned for themselves.
As a long-time teacher and as an activist in public education, I have witnessed the decline of competency, and no amount of anti-anti-union talk and pro-parent pre-kindergarten preparation is going to explain it away. But defending the indefensible means not making much of a change for the better in public education. So teachers will become serfs in the feudalism of charter and for-profit schools--a fate which they will have earned for themselves.
The 11th grade is far too late to assess whether a student is prepared for entry-level undergraduate courses; let alone for basic work skills. Such an assessment ought to be implemented in elementary school for the latter and grades 7 or 8 for the former. If students are passing courses and assessments that allow one to earn a high school diploma, and yet are unprepared for the next step, the mitigation needs to begin long before high school. My experience with my own recent or soon-to-be high school grads points to math education, through no fault of teachers, being absolutely abysmal in the first tens years of this millennium. These cohorts knew nothing of the basic operations and time honored algorithms, and it's these very cohorts that are the fresh crop of the workforce, or already in college. In school districts across the country, especially in wealthier communities, parents were in a huge uproar. The curriculum thankfully changed for my younger children but I'm afraid K-12 curriculum is a pendulum force. Our kids would be best served if educators of mathematics and writing in IHEs were meaningfully involved with K-12 curriculum design.
1
Currently, our politicians and parents are telling educators to pass everybody or look for a new job. Certainly, teachers could do a better job making sure that the kids who passed had earned it... IF we changed things up and told them we wouldn't fire them for giving too many F's.
2
Part of the problem is ignorance (or laziness or whatever) on the part of the parents. When my kids started high school I told them I didn't care what courses they took as long as they took everything required for entrance into the University of California. This meant 4 years of English and other requirements. When my son was going into his senior year his counselor told him he didn't need to take that 4th year of English and my son said "You don't know my mother"! They were in a "blue-collar" high school, very mixed race, and all of them and most of their friends have graduate degrees and have done well economically. Parents have to pay attention!
9
The problem of increasing high school graduation rates is by no means solely the result of seeing every child as a special snowflake. No, it’s what happens when we have a society where students who don’t move from high school to college are treated as scum. It wasn’t always this way, but once academic failure became a cause of failure in life, flunking a student took on ethical implications.
It's difficult to trace how it happened, but today's rising high school graduation rates are an indirect consequence of that “giant sucking sound” Ross Perot told us to listen to when we first started to merrily ship American jobs overseas. Had there been any political will at the time, that giant sound could have been softened by developing replacement opportunities, aside from going to college, for all the young Americans left behind--especially those not suited to higher education. Just think how different things would have been had our corporations made the collective decision to offer thousands of apprenticeships to 17-year-olds, the way they do in Germany.
Instead, we Americans made the easy political decision to ignore our responsibility to young people by warehousing the whole lot of them in college.
For this cowardice, we are now paying the price.
It's difficult to trace how it happened, but today's rising high school graduation rates are an indirect consequence of that “giant sucking sound” Ross Perot told us to listen to when we first started to merrily ship American jobs overseas. Had there been any political will at the time, that giant sound could have been softened by developing replacement opportunities, aside from going to college, for all the young Americans left behind--especially those not suited to higher education. Just think how different things would have been had our corporations made the collective decision to offer thousands of apprenticeships to 17-year-olds, the way they do in Germany.
Instead, we Americans made the easy political decision to ignore our responsibility to young people by warehousing the whole lot of them in college.
For this cowardice, we are now paying the price.
4
A few notes from the ACTUAL planet.
1. The first complaints about American edication's lousiness, and the lazy immorality of students, date to 1832. They were aimed at entring Harvard education.
2. Back in the day that we hear so much about, nobody so much as tried to educate most American kids. Except for maybe 5%, basic literacy and math and very odd versions of history were drilled up to what we'd consider junior high levels, and you were done. If you were lucky, and millions weren't.
3. Johnny hasn't been able to read since I was a kid. Johnny was lazy, irresponsible, didn't pray enough, and read too many comic books. Oh, and colleges were filled with commies and sympa back in the days everybody's loudly mourning, too.
4. Common Core's a good idea. It came from more or less the same people who're complaining about students, starting with E.D. Hirsch. Know the main reasons for the opposition? The godbotherers don't want evolution, and actual history and literature taught. Know what that matters? Without them, you're left with boredom and incoherence.
5. The best school sysemsnon the planet are heavily unionized, so ease on up. Know why the yelling about unions? Illiterates, and right-wingers, don't want teachers to have any power. At all.
Are there lots of probs with education and teachers? Absolutely. Like about half of teacher education is demented. And poverty. And cheap voters. And...
But the stuff yelled about here isn't what's wrong.
1. The first complaints about American edication's lousiness, and the lazy immorality of students, date to 1832. They were aimed at entring Harvard education.
2. Back in the day that we hear so much about, nobody so much as tried to educate most American kids. Except for maybe 5%, basic literacy and math and very odd versions of history were drilled up to what we'd consider junior high levels, and you were done. If you were lucky, and millions weren't.
3. Johnny hasn't been able to read since I was a kid. Johnny was lazy, irresponsible, didn't pray enough, and read too many comic books. Oh, and colleges were filled with commies and sympa back in the days everybody's loudly mourning, too.
4. Common Core's a good idea. It came from more or less the same people who're complaining about students, starting with E.D. Hirsch. Know the main reasons for the opposition? The godbotherers don't want evolution, and actual history and literature taught. Know what that matters? Without them, you're left with boredom and incoherence.
5. The best school sysemsnon the planet are heavily unionized, so ease on up. Know why the yelling about unions? Illiterates, and right-wingers, don't want teachers to have any power. At all.
Are there lots of probs with education and teachers? Absolutely. Like about half of teacher education is demented. And poverty. And cheap voters. And...
But the stuff yelled about here isn't what's wrong.
1
Common Core might spring from a good idea, but the implementation has been so horrible and dishonest, more about enriching vendors than what's best for kids, that it's probably not salvageable.
Otherwise, you've got some strong points, especially about unions. There's lots of rhetoric to the contrary, but the reality of what unions do is give a voice in how the system's run to the people who know most about it and are most invested in it. That's a very good thing (unless, of course, your goal is to destroy the system for profit, in which case I can see why you'd want to convince people that teachers' unions are bad).
Otherwise, you've got some strong points, especially about unions. There's lots of rhetoric to the contrary, but the reality of what unions do is give a voice in how the system's run to the people who know most about it and are most invested in it. That's a very good thing (unless, of course, your goal is to destroy the system for profit, in which case I can see why you'd want to convince people that teachers' unions are bad).
2
When the president of a university tells the faculty in no uncertain terms that your budgets and jobs are tied to how many students you pass and graduate, what do you think is going to happen?
8
We decided decades ago that schools are not for education, they are for molding our society. The limited skill set of current high school graduates is the natural consequence of these policies.
We passed the tipping point long ago. But if you want to restore learning to public education:
1. Stop rewarding teenage girls for having babies.
2. Stop social promotion.
3. Expel those who disrupt classrooms. Permanently.
4. Focus your resources where they do the most good, on the brightest students. Stop pouring millions of education dollars on students who can't/won't be educated.
If you won't do these things, you are not serious about improving education. Anything less is the triumph of hope over experience.
We passed the tipping point long ago. But if you want to restore learning to public education:
1. Stop rewarding teenage girls for having babies.
2. Stop social promotion.
3. Expel those who disrupt classrooms. Permanently.
4. Focus your resources where they do the most good, on the brightest students. Stop pouring millions of education dollars on students who can't/won't be educated.
If you won't do these things, you are not serious about improving education. Anything less is the triumph of hope over experience.
11
"Even on simpler tests of the cognitive skills needed for many jobs, fewer than two-thirds of South Carolina 11th graders could show sufficient skills in both math and reading."
While reading skills are essential to success in the workplace, too much emphasis is being placed on high school-level mathematics.
I can count on the fingers of two hands the number of times I have had to use algebra or geometry in my career as a lawyer, banker and manager.
Granted, I did not go into a STEM field, but if I had I doubt I would have been called upon to use what I learned in my high school math classes.
Unless one is going to be an engineer. it's hard to understand the benefit of learning algebra, geometry or calculus.
The main reason for putting students (pre-meds come to mind) through math isn't for the applicability of the knowledge in one's career but to weed out the underachievers from the students with the most agile minds - for that subject matter, that is.
Those who excel in math and physics are assumed, rightly or wrongly, to have what it takes to succeed in advanced course work and in the work place even if they're never called upon to use their knowledge of high school math.
This is the academic equivalent of hiring someone who played varsity football because it's assumed the experience taught him about teamwork, fair play, self confidence, and strategic thinking.
But are these indirect indicators of ability at all reliable or fair?
While reading skills are essential to success in the workplace, too much emphasis is being placed on high school-level mathematics.
I can count on the fingers of two hands the number of times I have had to use algebra or geometry in my career as a lawyer, banker and manager.
Granted, I did not go into a STEM field, but if I had I doubt I would have been called upon to use what I learned in my high school math classes.
Unless one is going to be an engineer. it's hard to understand the benefit of learning algebra, geometry or calculus.
The main reason for putting students (pre-meds come to mind) through math isn't for the applicability of the knowledge in one's career but to weed out the underachievers from the students with the most agile minds - for that subject matter, that is.
Those who excel in math and physics are assumed, rightly or wrongly, to have what it takes to succeed in advanced course work and in the work place even if they're never called upon to use their knowledge of high school math.
This is the academic equivalent of hiring someone who played varsity football because it's assumed the experience taught him about teamwork, fair play, self confidence, and strategic thinking.
But are these indirect indicators of ability at all reliable or fair?
7
In the 70's graduated from a middle HS, was among the upper graduates and an Illinois State Scholar. Was tested and had to take remedial algebra the summer prior to entering college.
I guess I was not college ready, but I didn't know enough about college to be discouraged by that. Was able to make progress with the instruction of very good teachers and finished with a Phd in engineering. Now teach at a top university.
I think what was different then, is that college costs were much lower then and was able to take a variety of courses and make up for my deficiencies without any debt. Now students cannot afford to to this.
I guess I was not college ready, but I didn't know enough about college to be discouraged by that. Was able to make progress with the instruction of very good teachers and finished with a Phd in engineering. Now teach at a top university.
I think what was different then, is that college costs were much lower then and was able to take a variety of courses and make up for my deficiencies without any debt. Now students cannot afford to to this.
3
Based on my experience in dealing with my grandchildren's education, the academics of High school are Taught to the "test" and non test teaching is dumbed down to insure that 80 to 90 percent of the students will be able to receiving a passing grade. The current high school diploma (often called a High School "Degree" to enhance its value" often carries no more value than a Junior High school certificate did 40 years ago. It is little more than a certification of participation. That is precisely why over 50 percent of "high school graduates" are required to take remedial courses in English, math, science and history in their first year of college and why few college students are able to complete a 4 year college degree in less than 6 years.
4
Not here in NYS. Our graduation standards have never been higher while our urban school districts have been unable to meet those standards. Students left without success for a whole host of reasons but still: LEFT WITHOUT SUCCESS.
I say: Stop the analysis of the impact of every reason students fail to thrive and care for the whole person as all good teachers do.
I say: Stop the analysis of the impact of every reason students fail to thrive and care for the whole person as all good teachers do.
2
A one size fits all package does not work. In Ontario we have a two track system where a student can get a diploma where the courses are geared towards university or they can get a diploma that assumes the student is not continuing their education but wants proof that they have an education that is good enough for trade work or equivalent.
Is it not possible to provide both types of diploma as it seems it is necessary in today's world.
Is it not possible to provide both types of diploma as it seems it is necessary in today's world.
1
A big part of the problem is the math requirements, which are irrelevant to most people's lives and doom students to near-certain failure---or lower standards. The language component of school education, together with history, should be re-emphasized and the math component de-emphasized.
3
Math teaches you how to reason and how to think a problem through. How many young people do you know who have the ability to face a problem and think it through to a reasonable conclusion?
4
Math requires students to reason and think through MATH problems.
It does not teach them how to think, just experiences in doing so. there is very little to any transference to other types of critical thinking.
It does not teach them how to think, just experiences in doing so. there is very little to any transference to other types of critical thinking.
1
You can throw lots of resources at students, but if they are too distracted with their mobile devices and college life, it won't do any good. Students are more coddled than ever before. Colleges compete for students in areas like best dining halls, best work out gyms, best recreation available in the area, best off-campus beer halls....etc. Where is the motivation for students to work hard? Universities have now become big businesses that are top-heavy in management and sports, which pull in revenue. The scenario that Thomas Friedman had in mind (World is Flat) has come to pass: The kid from Bangalore knows education is the doorway to the good life and the kid from Average School in USA does not, isn't even aware of how to get there. When I worked in a state government department, many of the civil and bridge engineers were from other countries because the state couldn't find American kids who wanted to work that hard, even for a good salary. Mathematics, engineering, science, technology all take hard work and goal setting, which many American kids have never had to confront. They know their way around the internet, but don't know how to read or write. Mobile devices have prepared them for quick Google searches, not deep or critical thinking.
7
When was the last time most adults used algebra or chemistry? Or thought about the literature they read in high school? The real skills needed for college or work are the discipline to get to work on time, clean and sober with a good attitude, cooperation and respect for co-workers and bosses, willingness to follow directions, the ability get the job done while creatively thinking about better ways to do it, motivation to excel and improve. I interview many applicants and never do I ask what they think of Shakespeare. I evaluate 1 - attitude; 2 - personal evaluations; 3 - work record; last - education. I would rank an 18 year old who has held one job consistently through high school higher than one with straight A's or a top sports record. To most employers, the requirements of a job can be taught, but attitude can not.
7
It depends on the job. If you are hiring an engineer you don't want to have to teach her math. If you are hiring a law associate you don't want to have to teach him how to write. If you are hiring an English teacher or a literary editor you don't want someone who has never thought about what they read in high school. Learning difficult subjects is also one of the best ways to develop good work habits. A person who can concentrate on Algebra is a person who can learn new job skills more easily. Moreover, knowing something (as opposed to having a pleasant disposition and good habits) also makes you a more interesting - and arguably happier - person.
5
I don't care whether my fellow citizens need to know math, science, literature, or civics for their jobs. I want them to be broadly educated because they *vote*.
3
Did you drive a vehicle today? You used chemistry because you know different grades of gasoline react differently.
Did you really strive? You used physics, that is algebra and geometry put into motion, to get from point A to point B safely because you also observed all others to steer clear of the eye see ten tees out there.
Did you really strive? You used physics, that is algebra and geometry put into motion, to get from point A to point B safely because you also observed all others to steer clear of the eye see ten tees out there.
When Melanie D. Barton, from a SC legislative agency asks “Does that diploma guarantee them a hope for a life where they can support a family?” she demonstrates what is ‘wrong’ with education in low achieving schools. But the solution does not lie in the school alone, no matter how hard the students and the teachers try. Even with the high tech plants in upstate SC, high school graduates will find that jobs that can support a family are scarce. So, the child with the high school diploma in the low achieving school is likely to come from a family whose income did not support the family adequately. S/he has already accomplished a major victory. Most students are stressed by family poverty and all its results: poor and shifting housing, unsafe neighborhoods, inadequate food, stressed parents. In spite of the chaos that results, this school, this child and these parents have managed to get the child through high school. But the school, the child, and the parents cannot fix the whole problem. It is up to legislative agencies to create an economy where high school graduates and the families they live in can hope to find a job or two jobs even three jobs that can support a family adequately. When will the NYT, its readers and the public in general quit expecting that schools can fix all the problems the US economy dishes out for working families whose minimum wage jobs do not offer the hope of adequately supporting a family?
5
So all those reasons for no longer looking at test scores as a way to decide who gets into a certain university was just a lie. "We need to look at the whole person". "Some people don't test well". "Test don't really tell us what we need to know about a person". No. No. And no. The kids a dummy and you want his money.
4
'Go along to get along' is the mantra of the genetic fascist.
Authoritarian government rules breed silence, compliance and complicity. One day you'll wake up in a failed system and an impoverished society.
Group-think...
Drive all the smart, creative, ethical free-thinkers out of the system and what will be left?
Who will suffer?
Not the smart people...they're going to do fine, living according to disciplined self-reliant principles that produce merit, an approach that the brainwashed drones of the world have been told are nothing but a conservative myth.
Merit is not a myth.
You can buy worthless credentials but you cannot buy a good mind. You have to inherit the potential and earn the rest the old-fashioned way.
The only sure way to level the playing field in a society is to bomb it into rubble and that is why total government always leads to perpetual war and mass poverty.
Authoritarian government rules breed silence, compliance and complicity. One day you'll wake up in a failed system and an impoverished society.
Group-think...
Drive all the smart, creative, ethical free-thinkers out of the system and what will be left?
Who will suffer?
Not the smart people...they're going to do fine, living according to disciplined self-reliant principles that produce merit, an approach that the brainwashed drones of the world have been told are nothing but a conservative myth.
Merit is not a myth.
You can buy worthless credentials but you cannot buy a good mind. You have to inherit the potential and earn the rest the old-fashioned way.
The only sure way to level the playing field in a society is to bomb it into rubble and that is why total government always leads to perpetual war and mass poverty.
1
But they are are skilled in iphone. They have learned to use a computer.
Long division. Use a calculator. What is reading comprehension anyway?
Who will ever need to write an essay? Minions don't need no stinking education.
Long division. Use a calculator. What is reading comprehension anyway?
Who will ever need to write an essay? Minions don't need no stinking education.
1
Remember " everyone" deserves" to own their own home " preached by every politician from small towns to the white house. What happened? Now we have everyone" deserves" a college education.
4
As a teacher of 14 years, I have experienced the decline in standards. I am not certain who or what is to blame but schools have adopted in structure and focus a corporate culture of quarterly results without a long-term plan. So afraid of the "customer" complaining about grades and homework, teachers and admunistrators have ceded too much power to parents and students who see a high school diploma as simply another transaction at Wal-Mart, which prides itself on saving the customer time and money. Are we to be surprised at low standards when politicians run on low taxes and factory efficient schooling (i.e. virtual classes)? And when students can't read the diploma they received, blame the school because the "customer" is always right.
5
As anybody who has been through the mill knows, a high school diploma doesn't mean a whole lot. Reading that the graduation rate is up to 82% is more an indication of lowered high school diploma standards than increased preparation for college, as the ACT results indicate. To many of us working in highly skilled positions where our reading comprehension and math skills have to be top notch, the BA or BS degree is the new high school diploma.
The paucity of effective high school teachers is a result of the system and the value we place on teachers. Students have respect for teachers having depth of knowlege and an authoritative presence in the classroom. As a former industrial chemist, I tried to "give back" by teaching high school through a program that employed teachers in scarce subject areas, such as math and science. Using my doctoral training and industrial experience, along with a decent sense of humor, my students rated me the best teacher they've had, in just the first couple of months. However, this had the effect of inducing professional jealousy and made it very hard for me to stay. This illustrates another serious problem of the system: preservation of the mediocrity.
The paucity of effective high school teachers is a result of the system and the value we place on teachers. Students have respect for teachers having depth of knowlege and an authoritative presence in the classroom. As a former industrial chemist, I tried to "give back" by teaching high school through a program that employed teachers in scarce subject areas, such as math and science. Using my doctoral training and industrial experience, along with a decent sense of humor, my students rated me the best teacher they've had, in just the first couple of months. However, this had the effect of inducing professional jealousy and made it very hard for me to stay. This illustrates another serious problem of the system: preservation of the mediocrity.
4
The worst teachers tend to think they're the best, and students tend to give high marks to teachers who don't challenge them and low marks to those that do. But given our cultural hatred for teachers, I don't think you'll have much trouble finding an audience willing to believe that anecdote.
1
I am trying to help my neighbor in his K12 math. The topic is sine and cosine functions, but he still cannot add fractions, like 1/2 + 1/3. He tries to memorize the steps of a solution I showed him, but without any understanding of what he is doing. As a helping neighbor, I can only do so much for him. What has he been learning all those years at school?
11
And then people think the 9 in 10 who are not prepared for college or work should get affirmative action and get in college or jobs to drag down those who are prepared. Even D's are accepted in the dumbed down courses in these high schools and they eliminate exit exams because no one would graduate if there were any standards at all. And yet poor Asian refugees have arrived here not speaking a word of English and work hard and easily qualify for Ivy League and top-notch public universities. What good does it do to graduate students who can't read their own names on diplomas? They can't succeed in college, work or life. Their diplomas are lies.
6
Can we please stop with the model minority myth?! Contrary to popular belief, it is Southeast Asians have the LOWEST graduation rates!
CURRENCY COUNTS . . .
...so if I gave you One Million would you be pleased? If it was U. S. dollars, British pounds, or Euros ... you would be happy ... but if it were Japanese yen or from a nation with hyper inflation ... not so much.
I both attended Queens College/CUNY during the early 1960s ... when all of the senior CUNY colleges were considered to be 'the Harvard for the proletariat' and then taught at another CUNY senior college.
Until about five years ago, I taught at Baruch College ... which once had the standards and rigor that Queens had when I was a student there. But I soon found out that these newer students were less prepared.
Hence the substance of the college curriculum had to be watered down. I taught there for 25 years ... and also taught part time at Marymount Manhattan, LIU/Brooklyn, Manhattan College and other undergraduate institutions.
When LIU was compared to Baruch ... then Baruch became Ivy League.
So, when I read that the percent of graduates at high schools and colleges has risen ... few talk about how inflation or deflation which has impacted this number.
To be concise: my secondary school experience and diploma which I received a half century ago is worth far more in currency than the B.A.s now earned by most students today ... but few ... especially politicians ... care to acknowledge this fact.
...so if I gave you One Million would you be pleased? If it was U. S. dollars, British pounds, or Euros ... you would be happy ... but if it were Japanese yen or from a nation with hyper inflation ... not so much.
I both attended Queens College/CUNY during the early 1960s ... when all of the senior CUNY colleges were considered to be 'the Harvard for the proletariat' and then taught at another CUNY senior college.
Until about five years ago, I taught at Baruch College ... which once had the standards and rigor that Queens had when I was a student there. But I soon found out that these newer students were less prepared.
Hence the substance of the college curriculum had to be watered down. I taught there for 25 years ... and also taught part time at Marymount Manhattan, LIU/Brooklyn, Manhattan College and other undergraduate institutions.
When LIU was compared to Baruch ... then Baruch became Ivy League.
So, when I read that the percent of graduates at high schools and colleges has risen ... few talk about how inflation or deflation which has impacted this number.
To be concise: my secondary school experience and diploma which I received a half century ago is worth far more in currency than the B.A.s now earned by most students today ... but few ... especially politicians ... care to acknowledge this fact.
5
The continuing saga of the dumbing down of America. Yeah! - everybody gets a gold star, a certificate for participation and a diploma. Everybody gets free stuff, everybody is a winner and everybody is the just the best. No losers, no judgement and no fouls called. Everyone gets in, everyone's sensitivities are factored into the equation, real competition is banned and merit is just another word for - " Not fair, you obviously had advantages because you ...". "Kumbayah"!
10
Administrators are evaluated mostly on graduation rates. Higher graduation rates mean job security and pay increases. So the process for students to graduate has been streamlined.
9
My hometown newspaper, which reprints Times articles like this one, is also running a piece today looking back on the accomplishments of 2015. Right up there with a government-subsidized factory providing menial labor jobs is continuing success at organizational efforts to repeal the Common Core standards. The community is praised for its efforts to protect children from the "misery" of uniform-standards testings. I don't know if Common Core, which is unraveling in response of parents' and teachers' intense opposition, was the solution to inadequate preparedness. But the experience does illustrate how any future efforts to establish more rigorous, uniform standards will be received by parents and the educational establishment.
2
I do, in fact, know something about the CCSS. They were formulated by non-educators and forced on states, apparently in an effort to sell more computers, more "Core-aligned" pre-packaged curricula, more tests, and more test prep programs.
Teachers were right to oppose the CCSS. So were parents, even if some of them did it for crazy Tea Party reasons. And it's probably true that the CCSS were handled so badly that there won't be much receptivity to national standards for a while, but if the next try is an honest attempt by educators, I suspect you're going to find a lot less opposition from conscientious educators. The Tea Party wackos will be on their own.
Teachers were right to oppose the CCSS. So were parents, even if some of them did it for crazy Tea Party reasons. And it's probably true that the CCSS were handled so badly that there won't be much receptivity to national standards for a while, but if the next try is an honest attempt by educators, I suspect you're going to find a lot less opposition from conscientious educators. The Tea Party wackos will be on their own.
What happens in education is actually quite simple. It's all about incentives. When the educators and the politicians who shape the system are rewarded for specific outputs these will be delivered. So, since graduation rates became an important measure of school success, they went up. Never mind that the standards for meeting them went down. Duh. When standardized test scores in reading and math became the sole indicators of student achievement they become the narrow focus of curriculum. Never mind the burgeoning growth of students who can't think or create and a citizenry that knows nothing of history and civics. Duh (And never mind that such tests are designed to differentiate students not determine essential content mastery.) When the incentives to teach (low pay, low benefits, low morale, work overload, etc.) define it as an unbearable hard knocks stepping stone to some other career, never mind that we get teachers who leave as soon as they can. Why are we surprised when we get what the system asks for? Duh.
3
Gosh, knowing where to start is difficult. First, as a high school English teacher who is a content expert, I find many of these comments--that speak in absolutes of all educators--insulting. Most people think that simply because they have been to school, they are somehow pedagogy experts. And, of course, their children are geniuses and all deserve an A, but when those students get a B--or lower, the parents come tearing into school demanding to know why. Teachers need to be allowed to teach. Period.
State Departments of Education need to address failing schools with true means of improvement. Demanding that they increase graduation rates just invites a lowering of standards, which appalls most teachers but which also leaves them subject to administrative countermand. Yes, I have had grades in my gradebook changed by administrators, and I could do nothing about it.
Teachers are an overlooked resource. Most administrators have not been in a classroom in years, and those at the state and federal levels may never have been in a classroom at all. Yet, these are the very people determining policy. Most people have no idea what being a teacher means; they just think they do. If the goal is to improve K-12 education, then ask teachers, not administrators or elected or appointed officials, what to do. Good teachers are always seeking to improve their classrooms, but their efforts to do so have been thwarted these past many years, all starting with NCLB.
State Departments of Education need to address failing schools with true means of improvement. Demanding that they increase graduation rates just invites a lowering of standards, which appalls most teachers but which also leaves them subject to administrative countermand. Yes, I have had grades in my gradebook changed by administrators, and I could do nothing about it.
Teachers are an overlooked resource. Most administrators have not been in a classroom in years, and those at the state and federal levels may never have been in a classroom at all. Yet, these are the very people determining policy. Most people have no idea what being a teacher means; they just think they do. If the goal is to improve K-12 education, then ask teachers, not administrators or elected or appointed officials, what to do. Good teachers are always seeking to improve their classrooms, but their efforts to do so have been thwarted these past many years, all starting with NCLB.
68
I am often suspicious of people who claim to be experts. If someone is good at what they do, their work speaks for them.
2
Of course you're right, why would we all need that icky empirical evidence when we have you to tell us the way "it is". Thanks Bro.
2
I am a retired teacher, and I agree with much of what you have written. Where I live, however, it is illegal for an administrator to change a student's grade.
2
If you take the criteria of quality and quantity of degrees, everything else being equal, you will find that the number that you get when you multiply them will always be the same. Increase quantity, quality will go down; increase quality, quantity will go down. The only way you can change this formula is by adding resources. In the old, old days when others stayed home, close to 50% of productive potential was expended on children and homemaking. It wasn't necessary to spend quite so much time on these (especially the homemaking became mechanized). Unfortunately, in integrating mothers into the work force, we have not found a way to compensate for the loss of support for children, which was the result of this development. Schools were suddenly supposed to do what parents (mothers) used to do, but they were not given the resources to do that and are constrained by legal requirements.
Nobody has figured out how the educational, interpersonal, supervisory, comforting, disciplining part of 'women's work' (and men's work if the fathers are at home) can be paid for. But we must find a way soon.
Our economic and social organization precludes women simply staying home as an option in solving this problem (quite apart from social fairness). But we must find a solution for the inputs that children need that goes beyond stupid races to some top where no child is left behind.
Nobody has figured out how the educational, interpersonal, supervisory, comforting, disciplining part of 'women's work' (and men's work if the fathers are at home) can be paid for. But we must find a way soon.
Our economic and social organization precludes women simply staying home as an option in solving this problem (quite apart from social fairness). But we must find a solution for the inputs that children need that goes beyond stupid races to some top where no child is left behind.
3
A passion for learning, studying, perseverance, are all things that need to start being taught at home. A teacher can lecture til they're blue in the face but if the child doesn't have a parent that makes sure they're studying, help them read, make them read, quiz them, make their education a regular family oriented thing, how are they going to pass tests at school. It's not the teachers (although there are a few bad apples) it's the parents that need to take responsibility for their children's education.
9
I tutor a young man, now in eighth grade, attending one of Chicago's 'best' grade schools. His math teacher does not teach. Instead, she directs the students to Kahn Academy online.....this during the school day. On one of his exams, she marked two questions wrong which were in fact correct. She regularly skips around in the text without bothering to ascertain whether th students have mastered the preliminaries required to understand the coming lesson. She wrote notes to his mother, claiming that he did not do his homework (not true, since he did it with me). He was getting a D in math at the end of seventh grade.....that is, until he took the standardized test and scored higher than even the eighth graders in the school. His grade went from D to A literally overnight. He deserved the A. He had in fact mastered the material and quite a bit more than was required.
How can we expectbchildren to learn from incompetents who have not themselves mastered the subject? These same teachers are about to strike for more money, possibly as early as March. Many do not deserve what they already make.
Teaching doesn't require a lot of fancy gadgets, or computers, or whatever else schools are installing. It needs teachers whose mastery of the subject is unquestionable, who can approach the subject in a variety of ways and bring students to an understanding, who ar committed to working with the kids. Based upon y observations, those teachers are few and far between.
How can we expectbchildren to learn from incompetents who have not themselves mastered the subject? These same teachers are about to strike for more money, possibly as early as March. Many do not deserve what they already make.
Teaching doesn't require a lot of fancy gadgets, or computers, or whatever else schools are installing. It needs teachers whose mastery of the subject is unquestionable, who can approach the subject in a variety of ways and bring students to an understanding, who ar committed to working with the kids. Based upon y observations, those teachers are few and far between.
9
I agree that teachers need to have mastery of their subject. But--I would argue that most teachers do. Your generalization is based on your own experience, as you say, and you need to realize that your experience does not indicate a general truth.
And how are we to raise teacher quality? I submit that we would have to create major increases in pay and prestige for pre-college educators in order to attract the best and the brightest. Right now the pay scale and social cachet for teachers don't seem appealing to those whose other options include law, medicine, or finance.
If as former education secretary says, “the goal is not just high school graduation, (t)he goal is being truly college and career ready.”, it begs another question. Should ALL high school graduates go on to college. I'm all for a better education for all students, but do garbage collectors need an MBA? Do janitors need a BA? Or consider: If ALL students went on to college, and Arne Duncan's wildest dream came true, where they would ALL graduate, please tell me where all the jobs would be for them? And would they be jobs worthy of four or five years of college=level work? Has anyone ever considered going back to having tracks that educate children in the directions they appear to be going in and leave enough flexibility for change along the way?
1
To add to the argument, will those garbage collectors be fairly compensated? Not everyone can be a doctor or lawyer, or upper level professional. They should not be punished for it.
1
Shows what Unions do to teachers, lack of parents and their involvement, and students who show up only for the senior prom. What a joke. This is what the Democrats/Liberals/Progressives/Socialists bring to America's school system. Shame on them. Instead of addressing fat in school, the First Lady should have been addressing EDUCATION. If a person can read, they can determine calories.
4
What unions do "to" teachers, usually, is give them some collective voice in how schools are run. Since teachers are the ones who know the most about how that should be, it's not surprising that the schools with unions, all other things being equal, are usually the best ones.
Lowered standards, for the most part, were forced on schools over unions' protests. You're blaming the wrong people. But you're blaming exactly who investors eager to dismantle schools for profit would like you to blame.
Lowered standards, for the most part, were forced on schools over unions' protests. You're blaming the wrong people. But you're blaming exactly who investors eager to dismantle schools for profit would like you to blame.
The rot extends all the way through teacher education programs. I once taught several M.Ed. courses. In one course, at least one student was a clever illiterate who had masked his inability through his bachelor's degree. In another, a group mutinied because the class demanded exploration into the scholarly literature and did not involve playing games or having the professor engage in embarrassing activities to level the playing field between student and teacher.
The message learned by these students was clear: group management by force of personality and making things fun was the only thing that really mattered. Professors who did not model the personality-driven approach to teaching with fun and laughter liberally sprinkled through a class were demeaned and disrespected, no matter how reputable they were.
Interestingly, the students who enjoyed the class, demanded rigor, and worked the hardest were second-career students from business, the arts, or the sciences, who had seen how things work in the "real world" where business prospects and experiments can fail and not everyone passes an audition or creates an enduring piece. It takes discipline and acceptance of criticism to succeed. College teaching programs rarely incorporate those elements and train their teachers to avoid them in their teaching as well. Why, then, are we surprised at the deficient knowledge of our graduates?
The message learned by these students was clear: group management by force of personality and making things fun was the only thing that really mattered. Professors who did not model the personality-driven approach to teaching with fun and laughter liberally sprinkled through a class were demeaned and disrespected, no matter how reputable they were.
Interestingly, the students who enjoyed the class, demanded rigor, and worked the hardest were second-career students from business, the arts, or the sciences, who had seen how things work in the "real world" where business prospects and experiments can fail and not everyone passes an audition or creates an enduring piece. It takes discipline and acceptance of criticism to succeed. College teaching programs rarely incorporate those elements and train their teachers to avoid them in their teaching as well. Why, then, are we surprised at the deficient knowledge of our graduates?
7
If some of them learn from instructors who generalize from very limited experience because it fits their biases, we can conclude about their knowledge... well, nothing really, since to assume that your students are representative would be unfounded.
First of all, there is no American system of education – there are 50 systems – and that structure has recently been reinforced as the President's administration backpedals from centralized direction. The often completely misunderstood step toward national standards – the Common Core with its emphasis on thinking and students' demonstrating their understanding by using knowledge in new ways – will eventually be scraped for a new panacea.
Second, we remain stuck in the thinking that four years of reading and math adequately prepares students for the new world they'll face. We are increasingly a global society, yet we produce graduates who barely know their own nation's history and geography much less the rest of the world's.
Finally, most school districts think of curriculum in terms of content scope and sequence, and not how that content is taught. "Teaching" is usually left up to teachers – teachers who are not universally trained to understand or appreciate that how they teach is just as important – if not more important – than what they teach.
Second, we remain stuck in the thinking that four years of reading and math adequately prepares students for the new world they'll face. We are increasingly a global society, yet we produce graduates who barely know their own nation's history and geography much less the rest of the world's.
Finally, most school districts think of curriculum in terms of content scope and sequence, and not how that content is taught. "Teaching" is usually left up to teachers – teachers who are not universally trained to understand or appreciate that how they teach is just as important – if not more important – than what they teach.
2
We'll never improve education until we as a nation, value it. We don't; we never have. Money is our "value," not education. That's one problem. Another is that we've never defined, either on a state or national level, what it means to be educated or "learned." Knowing "stuff?" being technologically literate? being able to write? being able to think/reason? Until we decide what we want, we'll never get it. Worse, until we turn away from the billionaire and look towards, admire and appreciate the scholar, nothing will change.
7
I wonder whether teachers are afraid of being shot if they give a student a failing grade? What with children being raised to be narcissists who think they are so very special, and who have never learned to deal with disappointments this is a distinct possibility.
6
Graduating from high school need not be evaluated in the ideal context of suitability to enter college. There appears to be a larger societal value, and that is, to have fewer adults who lack high school diplomas. Such students have been known to inflict high cost on our society, either by consuming social welfare resources, or by entering the criminal justice system. But even as some graduates are not necessarily college material at graduation, the high school diploma does inoculate against some less than admirable engagements, and does preserve the opportunity for marginally qualified graduates to later remedy deficiencies.
1
sounds like their only career choice will be Congress
2
It is amazing to see so many students failing or struggling given the vast amount of education material available on the net. I often look at some great youtube videos when working with my children on various subjects. Our local library has a free tutor service via chat and a huge collection of books, DVD's etc for education.
2
"Struggling" implies effort. Few students struggle. Few fail, either, since their teachers aren't allowed to give them failing grades even when that's what they've earned.
But you're right that there are nearly endless resources out there for students who want to learn and care to put in some effort.
But you're right that there are nearly endless resources out there for students who want to learn and care to put in some effort.
1
Why do high schools continue to teach algebra and calculus? These are tough courses with no practical application that I can name. I have been in the workforce for many years in many different settings and there has never been a need for this type of mathematics. What is needed it he ability to solve problems that include the use of statistics and basic math.
I'm just grateful that when I went to college, I found a major that did not require any math. Otherwise, I would have never earned a college degree and enjoyed a long career.
I'm just grateful that when I went to college, I found a major that did not require any math. Otherwise, I would have never earned a college degree and enjoyed a long career.
4
I have heard this argument before, and totally disagree. Whether you realize it or not, you use algebraic concepts every day to negotiate your way, and solve problems, algebra is about taking real world problems, and creating solutions. Just because you don't write down a quadratic equation doesn't mean you aren't using higher math reasoning.
2
Really? You did not need Algebra but you problem solve? Wow. You did Algebra but did not realize it. Algebra is about problem solving bringing into play what you previously learned, what you saw worked thar developed into formulas so you could use them to solve those problems you faced, and you knew to do step 1 before step2 because in certain operations or experiments if you do things out of sequence you get stink bombs.
Remember high school chemistry class? We all knew when that sequence of experiments came up. Someone knew if you did steps out of order you got stink.
Remember high school chemistry class? We all knew when that sequence of experiments came up. Someone knew if you did steps out of order you got stink.
Even if we assume that you're right that algebra and calc are useless, I'd still object to your assumption that education is just job training.
1
Many high schools have "credit recovery" programs that allow students who failed a course to do a project assigned by the principal to get credit for the failed course. It is in the principal's and student's interest to pass the project and graduate. All "credit recovery" programs must be abolished!
5
Stop holding schools, not students, accountable when students don't do the work to pass and the credit recovery schemes will disappear on their own. They're an unavoidable result of that wrongheaded policy.
Common Core was begun by states to limit number of statewide tests and provide what children should learn each year of school. The states using Common Core have told students and parents that the tests are harder than the old tests. Conservatives dislike Common Core because the Obama Aministration liked and approved it. Now states like South Carolina have kids advancing who are not prepared for college or work.
1
You are right that conservatives dislike CC because it's (a) Obama's; and (b) centralized education. But most of the opposition has come from the left: from teacher unions who don't want uniform teaching performance metrics, and liberal, wealthy helicopter parents who oppose testing that their kids - raised to believe they excel at everything - cannot master.
1
Student standardized tests aren't useful for accurately evaluating teachers. What ignorant people label union opposition to uniform performance metrics is really just objections to bad policy that are pretty universal among people that actually know what they're talking about (and the unions, comprised of teachers, are the biggest groups of people that know what they're talking about).
Oh, there you go again. First the demeaning of teachers and students thanks to mindless repetition of the fallacies in "A Nation at Risk." Next, the bemoaning of the "loss of rigor" in coursework that many of the comments here reflect. Finally, the completely absent recognition of how economic/corporate factors affect the "quality" of education due to the seismic shift away from manual labor to service industries. The mantra of being "college and career ready" that supposedly undergirds the "reform movement" was led by the likes of David Coleman and his colleagues who simply "back-mapped"the Common Core standards by ignoring cognitive development. They are then measured by hundreds of standardized tests developed by corporations that cost billions of dollars for states to implement rather than reducing class sizes. What else can be expected?
If the European system of education is so "superior," what accounts for the significantly higher unemployment rates of its youth? The days when owning a high school diploma allowed entry into a workforce where employers provided on-the-job training are long gone. Corporations find it easier to maximize profits by hiring H1B workers trained by the Americans they displace. Economic disparities among public school districts based on local property taxes easily predict academic outcomes. Class sizes burgeon due to funds misspent on testing. So much is missing from this article that it is impossible to take almost any of it seriously.
If the European system of education is so "superior," what accounts for the significantly higher unemployment rates of its youth? The days when owning a high school diploma allowed entry into a workforce where employers provided on-the-job training are long gone. Corporations find it easier to maximize profits by hiring H1B workers trained by the Americans they displace. Economic disparities among public school districts based on local property taxes easily predict academic outcomes. Class sizes burgeon due to funds misspent on testing. So much is missing from this article that it is impossible to take almost any of it seriously.
7
It's interesting how much college readiness has changed. When I graduated from high school, only about 15% of students enrolled in college and those with a high school diploma could usually get a decent job after graduation. Today's requirements for graduation are much tougher than they were when I was in high school but the job market has changed so much thst even with higher requirements students aren't necessarily job ready. I graduated with 2 years of math, algebra and geometry, and still went to college and graduate school. In North Carolina, algebra and then geometry have been made requirements for graduation. Students are also required to take four years of English and four years of history/government/economics. They also must take a life science and a physical science. College prep students go way beyond that. I really think a lot of the preparation for life that my generation had was because we were allowed to make mistakes and to figure out how to deal with them with minimal guidance. Today's parents make the mistake of fixing problems for their children and insist that teachers to do the same. That keeps today's students from learning the life lessons needed to be successful. Schools can't do the job alone. They need support from families and communities.
5
Society has no shortage of blame for teachers but the truth is nobody can teach you anything but they can help you to learn. Learning is an active participatory process that only works unless the student is willing to work.
10
We must redouble our efforts to prepare students for college and careers. The world of work they will inherent is global, wired and requires deft communication and collaboration skills. This is the ultimate promise of the American Dream.
It must be pointed out that "leaving no child behind" means passing incapable children up the line, whether they have learned anything or not. Students who need "special" help are getting some, but most won't ever become "college ready," because of a sheer lack of intellectual capacity. But we can't admit this. It would stigmatize the students, and perhaps even relegate them to "special" schools suited to their "special needs." That, of course, was the pattern when I was in elementary and high school, 1957-70, and it was doubtless uncomfortable for special-needs students and their parents to have the labeled in this way (well, the hurtful label was that they were called "retarded," of course). But the alternative is to lower standards to a point where everyone "passes." In middle school, my son't classmate received a spelling-test sheet different from his: hers had about a third of the correct letters already filled-in for each word. Her "passing" spelling tests was a complete sham. I don't think it's fair to blame teachers when this level of incapacity has to be artificially rewarded through such measures. The best way to improve one's status and salary as a teacher nowadays is to study towards an MAT in Special Education. There are no MATs that teach teachers what might be an effective way to engage gifted students. In fact, gifted students are unashamedly pressed into service to educate their "peers." There's only so much a teacher can do at once.
7
Many kids who need "special" help in school are gifted children who have a learning disability (also called twice exceptional). I agree that there is only so much a teacher can do at once, but it's really important to not confuse the issues.
1
I've taught for 25 years and have seen a rise in graduation rates each year. The reason for this in Missouri is because the schools are punished if students don't graduate in 4 years. "Whatever it takes" is the mantra" Many times that means graduate in 4 years no matter because the school will take the "hit". Student learning and achievement take the backseat because of the punitive actions of the state on school administration and teachers. Thank you so much for this article!
5
As someone who has taught at a state university for 30 years, I have seen a steady decline in the number of students who are ready to do college work. Many cannot write a proper English sentence; few can spell. Many "students" reading ability is so abysmal that it is clear they should not have been allowed to graduate from eighth grade. The problem lies with many parents, those who don't push their children to do their best. Two other culprits are state legislators, who do not provide sufficient funding to education. Lastly, we have a problem with administrators who are driven by the numbers that legislators set in order to receive funding. These administrators intimidate teachers into passing students that shouldn't be passed or giving them better grades than they deserve.
10
Not a single mention of the Common Core reform hoax. Yes, there's Arne Duncan ... the Secretary of Education with no viable teaching experience ... mincing words once again. This is the man whose drooling words launched a parental blowback that will, in fact, sink any sort of standardized reform ... which is a very good thing.
States need to assess their own situations and devise their own solutions and remedies. This notion that what ails South Carolina also ails Rhode Island pr New York is dangerous nonsense.
But even within each state there are extremes ... and the unwilling reformists need to accept that not every school in this nation is in need of reform intervention. That's what Common Core did ... it intruded where it was not needed and then where it was needed it ignore the reality.
To exclude race and poverty from the remedies is another asinine assumption. When America begins to look at education as a truly human activity ... flush with all of the pain and wonder of humanity ... then perhaps this country will acknowledge that learning is more complex than an algorithm or some cheery curriculum built by ideologues who has never spent significant moments in a real classroom.
States need to assess their own situations and devise their own solutions and remedies. This notion that what ails South Carolina also ails Rhode Island pr New York is dangerous nonsense.
But even within each state there are extremes ... and the unwilling reformists need to accept that not every school in this nation is in need of reform intervention. That's what Common Core did ... it intruded where it was not needed and then where it was needed it ignore the reality.
To exclude race and poverty from the remedies is another asinine assumption. When America begins to look at education as a truly human activity ... flush with all of the pain and wonder of humanity ... then perhaps this country will acknowledge that learning is more complex than an algorithm or some cheery curriculum built by ideologues who has never spent significant moments in a real classroom.
5
This will not change until schools and teachers have protection against parents and communities who refuse to believe that THEIR kids might fail. This has as much to do with not hurting anybody's feelings as it does with standards.
6
The issue isn't necessarily the kids' feelings. Teachers that hold kids accountable and have high standards often give lower grades, and then because their grades are lower, many students assume that the teacher is not as good (it's the teacher's fault). Or, students will want to take classes with the easier teachers. When students request or have their parents request a different teacher, two things happen--the administrator thinks that there is something wrong with the tougher teacher and/or the tougher teacher has to make changes to increase their enrollment (lower standards). It must be understood that most students look for the easiest way to get good grades (I teach, and overhear the conversations all the time). They talk about who is a good teacher, yes, but sometimes they forget that part of being a student is actively participating, working, and TRYING to learn. They want to be spoon-fed.
It's all well and good to want teachers to have high standards, but when you have high standards and then half of your students don't do your assigned work and fail, kids and parents complain, and the teacher becomes the problem. You can't ask for high standards and then complain when your student can't handle it. I will never understand the parents that listen to their child's complaints and then calls to complain to the administration, as though they know what and how students should learn. This is a major problem.
It's all well and good to want teachers to have high standards, but when you have high standards and then half of your students don't do your assigned work and fail, kids and parents complain, and the teacher becomes the problem. You can't ask for high standards and then complain when your student can't handle it. I will never understand the parents that listen to their child's complaints and then calls to complain to the administration, as though they know what and how students should learn. This is a major problem.
2
One answer, of course, is that all teachers in a school should collaborate on their standards so they're uniformly high.
And then, with both political parties pushing "school choice" initiatives, the parents will pull their kids from that school and shop around for one that will award the grade they want for the level of effort their kids feel like putting in.
Race to the top, indeed.
And then, with both political parties pushing "school choice" initiatives, the parents will pull their kids from that school and shop around for one that will award the grade they want for the level of effort their kids feel like putting in.
Race to the top, indeed.
This is hardly surprising. We don't like to challenge our delicate students anymore, instead supplying them safe-spaces to shield themselves from microaggressions, contrary thought and life, generally. We may not like to admit it but the dumbing-down of America has been by design. I mean the stupidity of the premise should perhaps be examined - not enough people graduate so make graduating easier. The consequences of such cushy thinking should have been as glaring obvious up-front as in hindsight.
And then there's the world of problems with this gem of thought - “Does that diploma guarantee them a hope for a life where they can support a family?” Uh, no. One's own determination and drive are the only things that can guarantee anyone anything.
And then there's the world of problems with this gem of thought - “Does that diploma guarantee them a hope for a life where they can support a family?” Uh, no. One's own determination and drive are the only things that can guarantee anyone anything.
7
And determination and drive don't necessarily guarantee anything anymore.
This article is very misleading.
Claiming that students are not prepared for college or career because they did not do well on the ACT is nonsense. As a growing number of universities are admitting, performance on the ACT and SAT does NOT measure college and career readiness
http://www.pbs.org/newshour/bb/study-finds-high-sat-act-scores-might-not....
Performance on these tests primarily reflects family income, with low-income students consistently performing worse than wealthier ones.
Kentucky is one of the ten poorest states in the US and Berea has higher poverty rates than Kentucky as a whole, with an estimated per capital income of $15,475 in 2013 (down from $16,512 in 2000).
Berea also has a high percentage of immigrants – 12.8% of its population was foreign born vs. 4.8% for South Carolina as a whole. Not surprisingly, students who are English Language Learners also do not do well on standardized tests.
Toughening graduation standards will not improve educational outcomes.
Exit tests do not improve college participation rates or job prospects for graduates.
High school exit tests also increase dropout and incarceration rates. They especially push low income students and students of color into the school-to-prison pipeline.
https://www.newamerica.org/education-policy/the-case-against-exit-exams/
The real problem is growing inequality and lack of opportunity.
Claiming that students are not prepared for college or career because they did not do well on the ACT is nonsense. As a growing number of universities are admitting, performance on the ACT and SAT does NOT measure college and career readiness
http://www.pbs.org/newshour/bb/study-finds-high-sat-act-scores-might-not....
Performance on these tests primarily reflects family income, with low-income students consistently performing worse than wealthier ones.
Kentucky is one of the ten poorest states in the US and Berea has higher poverty rates than Kentucky as a whole, with an estimated per capital income of $15,475 in 2013 (down from $16,512 in 2000).
Berea also has a high percentage of immigrants – 12.8% of its population was foreign born vs. 4.8% for South Carolina as a whole. Not surprisingly, students who are English Language Learners also do not do well on standardized tests.
Toughening graduation standards will not improve educational outcomes.
Exit tests do not improve college participation rates or job prospects for graduates.
High school exit tests also increase dropout and incarceration rates. They especially push low income students and students of color into the school-to-prison pipeline.
https://www.newamerica.org/education-policy/the-case-against-exit-exams/
The real problem is growing inequality and lack of opportunity.
7
Why is this a "big news" story? We've been dumbing down for years.
5
This may be getting worse as this article clearly indicates, but it is nothing new. I went to California public school through K-12 at a time when CA had what was considered "good" primary and secondary education, (1960-1971), and was floored by the number of entering students at San Diego State University required to take remedial english classes.
2
The poor academic performance of students graduating from high school is a reflection of problems that were never addressed during earlier years. The low literacy and math scores of our students clearly indicate that they are not ready for college or a career. What's also troubling is that the low academic preparation of our students indicate that they are not ready to join the armed forces which could, in the long run, seriously impact our national security.
3
Our American culture does not want to hear this, but if 40% of a given high schools graduating class qualifies for "college work" then that is probably about right. It is absurd to believe that all students should graduate high school college ready. That is only possible if a given school's students all have an above average IQ. If a college is truly an accredited institution of higher learning then statistically only about a quarter of any given high schools graduates should come close to qualifying for admittance. Conversely if a high school truly has a college ready curriculum then the majority of an average high school would in reality not be able to graduate. We need to get away from this deceitful meesage that all students can be college ready' This can only happen if you dumb down the graduation exams and the type of so called college experiences that students can qualify for. Sound familiar?
11
I think one of the biggest, if not the biggest problem here is teaching just simply doesn't pay enough. It used to be that you would have teachers with several advanced degrees in the sciences or humanities teaching 10-12th grade English at a public school. People with minds like that influence in a different way today in that they work for fortune 500 companies as marketing executives that work form home and make $300k a year. Its so pathetic.
We need to revitalize some of that romance and stature to the teaching profession. The wise get paid for their wisdom. We need to figure it out how entry level teachers can make $80k a year and the ones who have lots of experience make $150k and up. This way lots of wise, deductive, powerful minds would be really educating our kids and paying better attention to them with a more qualified eye on their progress.
We need to revitalize some of that romance and stature to the teaching profession. The wise get paid for their wisdom. We need to figure it out how entry level teachers can make $80k a year and the ones who have lots of experience make $150k and up. This way lots of wise, deductive, powerful minds would be really educating our kids and paying better attention to them with a more qualified eye on their progress.
6
Teachers should certainly be paid much more, but I don't think your scheme would result in much better teachers. It's true that nobody goes into teaching for the money, but I'm not sure that the sort of person who picks a job based on the money is necessary the sort we'd want teaching.
Four years after graduating from one of our country's top 3 engineering schools, I taught science at a Junior High School in Borneo for the Peace Corps. Most of the students were the first ones in their families to ever attend school. Some walked to school with their shoes in their hands in order to save them for class. I taught Biology, Chemistry and Physics, and ALL students took these courses. There were three major ethnic groups - Malay, Chinese and Indian (from India originally) - with a number of students from tribes living in the surrounding jungle.
There were rigorous national tests at the end of each semester, but none any more rigorous than the work they did in class. Although the kids played ball and various games during the two twenty minute break times each day, there were NO school-sponsored sports.
Nobody told these kids that their courses were more rigorous than those taken by American high-schoolers. They only knew that their parents were counting on them to be among the first children ever to have a shot at a decent life, so they worked hard.
And, YES, there were no school sponsored sports!
There were rigorous national tests at the end of each semester, but none any more rigorous than the work they did in class. Although the kids played ball and various games during the two twenty minute break times each day, there were NO school-sponsored sports.
Nobody told these kids that their courses were more rigorous than those taken by American high-schoolers. They only knew that their parents were counting on them to be among the first children ever to have a shot at a decent life, so they worked hard.
And, YES, there were no school sponsored sports!
10
You get what you measure. If you reward higher graduation rates, you will get better graduation rates. Whether that meets the intended objective is up for debate.
4
I think the underlying reason is simple. Money. In the old days, a student was held back if not ready for the next grade and had to repeat senior year if not ready to graduate. Not anymore. As it costs too much money. I mean, imagine if this was done today. In some schools, not even half the kids would graduate. Imagine the cost of having them for another year. No way. It's always, "Follow the money."
2
The problem of low achievement is poverty. What is being done to alleviate poverty? Nothing. High stress in poverty areas is very similar to living in a war zone. Children in these situations have physical changes in their bodies due to stress and cannot learn.
When is society and 'education reformers' like Arnie Duncan and Obama going to admit this problem exists? The middle class is sinking into poverty so the problem is growing.
High stakes testing which determines teacher evaluations and salary is not improving learning for those most at risk. Nobody is encouraged to achieve by taking a test. Creativity and love of learning are not possible with 'teaching to the test'. Too often the arts, librarians, social workers and nurses are fired so that Pearson, Apple and Microsoft can make a profit.
When is society and 'education reformers' like Arnie Duncan and Obama going to admit this problem exists? The middle class is sinking into poverty so the problem is growing.
High stakes testing which determines teacher evaluations and salary is not improving learning for those most at risk. Nobody is encouraged to achieve by taking a test. Creativity and love of learning are not possible with 'teaching to the test'. Too often the arts, librarians, social workers and nurses are fired so that Pearson, Apple and Microsoft can make a profit.
9
I disagree. I recently completed a statistical analysis of college entrance rates from another state. Poverty, as measured by school lunch eligibility, was not a statistically significant factor in entrance into post-secondary schools and eventual graduation, but family stability and engagement were.
When education is valued enough that families organize their lives around making homework and reading a priority, students graduated from high school; what's more, many of them graduated from college or trade schools or entered the military, prepared for a satisfying adult life.
Poor students can and do succeed when family values and involvement support them. Saying otherwise only places another obstacle before them and diminishes their confidence.
When education is valued enough that families organize their lives around making homework and reading a priority, students graduated from high school; what's more, many of them graduated from college or trade schools or entered the military, prepared for a satisfying adult life.
Poor students can and do succeed when family values and involvement support them. Saying otherwise only places another obstacle before them and diminishes their confidence.
2
You've got one study (for which I can't look at the data but have to take your word) that shows poverty is a non-factor.
I've ready many (and been able to examine their methodology) that says it's a major factor. Though admittedly, what we were probably looking at were the effects of parents' education, stability, the value placed on education, and other things that correlate very well with poverty rather than the poverty itself. Still, poverty is a reliable predictor.
I've ready many (and been able to examine their methodology) that says it's a major factor. Though admittedly, what we were probably looking at were the effects of parents' education, stability, the value placed on education, and other things that correlate very well with poverty rather than the poverty itself. Still, poverty is a reliable predictor.
1
This article points up such a sad truth. As a teacher I know that most districts and states, even before the common core standards, increased their graduation requirements. In many Missouri, school districts, for example, a student to reached the needed graduation requirements in math by taking (for example) business math, general math and geometry. Not so today. Even students who can't reliably add a column of numbers are expected to make it successfully through Algebra II, or perhaps even pre-calculus. Pity the teacher who prevents a non-adder from graduating by failing them in Algebra II. And in fact, should every student really be required to pass Algebra II (or Brit Lit, or chemistry or any other random course.)
What is needed, in my opinion, are three things: a return to a more flexible high school curriculum, which meets the needs of diverse learners thus including such subjects as home economics, computer programming, wood shop, sculpting and choir); an insistence that the courses in that curriculum adhere to genuine standards; and teachers who provide students the skills, encouragement and time to meet these standards.
Of course, education is so complicated by other issues, from drug abuse to poverty to a lack of teacher retention, that curriculum changes are just one part of the solution. But pretending that all students master Algebra II when in fact some haven't been made to master addition doesn't have to be one of those issues.
What is needed, in my opinion, are three things: a return to a more flexible high school curriculum, which meets the needs of diverse learners thus including such subjects as home economics, computer programming, wood shop, sculpting and choir); an insistence that the courses in that curriculum adhere to genuine standards; and teachers who provide students the skills, encouragement and time to meet these standards.
Of course, education is so complicated by other issues, from drug abuse to poverty to a lack of teacher retention, that curriculum changes are just one part of the solution. But pretending that all students master Algebra II when in fact some haven't been made to master addition doesn't have to be one of those issues.
59
American high school standards are an international joke and the emphasis on jones-ing with the proper attire, accessories and hair in lieu of academics is ludicrous. Not to mention the disproportionate importance placed upon athletic competitions, which often cause lifelong injury to their participants so that a few good ole boys and gals can wager on their prowess. America is sinking into a third-world status while its children are led astray by innumerable electronic and social media distractions, without ever having the burden of really learning anything. They'll be a valuable pool of unskilled low-cost labor to the Chinese though.
18
One example of how schools are reinforced in their focus on appearance instead of reality is the ranking of America's high schools based on the number of students who take AP classes developed by Washington Post education reporter Jay Matthews. AP classes are a great thing, but when schools are judged by how many students take the classes and tests...whether they have been prepared for them or not...it makes a mockery of the rating system. Nowhere in the rankings based on students who take AP classes and AP tests are schools rated according to the number of students who achieve passing grades on the tests. Some schools have pushed unprepared students into taking AP classes, paid for their AP tests, and cheered at their rankings on Mr. Matthews "Challenge Index" even as only a tiny handful of the "AP students" passed the AP tests. This is gaming the system and one of the more publicized way some schools, and some school districts, honor appearance over substance.
8
Here here is the VIsual Syntax Format of this article.
http://www.liveink.com/Walker/HS_Diploma_But_Low_ACT_Scores.htm
When high school juniors used this format in their Social Sciences classes for the entire year, reading 50 minutes a week, the proportion who scored 21 or higher on the ACT reading section, (the score that ACT says predicts being able to get a C or better in college social science classes), rose by an additional 15 percent, from 48 to 63 percent of the junior class (all of whom were required to take the ACT in their junior year. The benefit is especially valuable in students entering community colleges with borderline ACT reading scores in the 18 to 20 ACT score range, by adding 3 or points for over half of these students.
http://idpf.org/sites/default/files/digital-book-conference/presentation...
http://www.liveink.com/Walker/HS_Diploma_But_Low_ACT_Scores.htm
When high school juniors used this format in their Social Sciences classes for the entire year, reading 50 minutes a week, the proportion who scored 21 or higher on the ACT reading section, (the score that ACT says predicts being able to get a C or better in college social science classes), rose by an additional 15 percent, from 48 to 63 percent of the junior class (all of whom were required to take the ACT in their junior year. The benefit is especially valuable in students entering community colleges with borderline ACT reading scores in the 18 to 20 ACT score range, by adding 3 or points for over half of these students.
http://idpf.org/sites/default/files/digital-book-conference/presentation...
1
In other words, do the reading for them, and their reading will improve.
Students continually arrive in my classes with high school diplomas, who can neither read adequately, or write coherently. They frequently have similar deficiencies in math skills. Unfortunately, this is not just a high school problem, colleges and universities pressed to retain students and demonstrate "success" also follow the path of least resistance, lower standards, and pass students on. The same questions being asked of the high school diploma should--and will-- be asked of the Bachelors Degree.
12
It takes smart teachers to properly teach kids of any intellectual ability.
Time to honestly assess the intelligence, knowledge, and teaching skills of our teachers and to re-train, mentor, promote and fire accordingly.
Name any other industry that is world class, in America or elsewhere, on which workers are promoted based on years on the job and rarely fired for underperformance!
Time to honestly assess the intelligence, knowledge, and teaching skills of our teachers and to re-train, mentor, promote and fire accordingly.
Name any other industry that is world class, in America or elsewhere, on which workers are promoted based on years on the job and rarely fired for underperformance!
10
Counselors at Law for one. Many of them are promoted on the basis of seniority and experience in the firm.
We need to stop this nonsense about teachers being the end all of student achievement and the mythology that no other industry uses seniority and experience for advancement. It's chicanery pure and simple and mostly tommyrot rhetoric from those who have never taught a day in their lives.
Good teachers are those who are effectively able to get students understand and internalize the material they teach. It's not necessarily WHAT you know, but how well you are able to to GET what you know over to others.
We need to stop this nonsense about teachers being the end all of student achievement and the mythology that no other industry uses seniority and experience for advancement. It's chicanery pure and simple and mostly tommyrot rhetoric from those who have never taught a day in their lives.
Good teachers are those who are effectively able to get students understand and internalize the material they teach. It's not necessarily WHAT you know, but how well you are able to to GET what you know over to others.
2
Your assertion that teachers are the only group of people where poor performers are allowed to hang around and even be promoted will find two likely audiences:
1. People who are so dead-set on bashing teachers that they don't think about any statement so long as it supports bashing.
2. People who have never held a job.
Meanwhile, in the real world, teachers usually don't need to be fired because about half of them quit in the first five years. KEEPING teachers should be our concern, not getting rid of them.
1. People who are so dead-set on bashing teachers that they don't think about any statement so long as it supports bashing.
2. People who have never held a job.
Meanwhile, in the real world, teachers usually don't need to be fired because about half of them quit in the first five years. KEEPING teachers should be our concern, not getting rid of them.
1
Well we cut funding for education at all levels, pay and prepare teachers poorly, cut social safety net funding thereby increasing poverty -- and we expect students to do well. Anyone have a magic wand?
9
Please. We pay more per student then just about every other industrialized nation. Education is not underfunded. Teachers are paid quite well, but their education at college is not very good. We will have to overhaul the education of teachers before we make any improvements in student achievement.
3
Teachers don't work markedly fewer hours than other professions but are paid about 60% of what comparable workers are paid. "Quite well" is a value judgement, and you may think it applies here. Rational people wouldn't.
As for the funding, we expect schools to feed kids, provide extracurricular activities (no matter how tight the budget, sports won't be cut), provide healthcare, sometimes clothe kids, and cater to their mental health, all while administering an endlessly expanding number of expensive standardized tests and paying consultants to investigate why the test scores, as they always have been, seem to be lower where kids come from deprived home environments. Our "education funding" may be high, but the amount we actually spend on education is certainly inadequate.
As for the funding, we expect schools to feed kids, provide extracurricular activities (no matter how tight the budget, sports won't be cut), provide healthcare, sometimes clothe kids, and cater to their mental health, all while administering an endlessly expanding number of expensive standardized tests and paying consultants to investigate why the test scores, as they always have been, seem to be lower where kids come from deprived home environments. Our "education funding" may be high, but the amount we actually spend on education is certainly inadequate.
2
Not Mark...
This issue is of special importance to me as an educator, social scientist and a social worker. This is such a tragedy. But I have come to the conclusion not all are ready for college and not all are meant for college. We need to have a four tiered selection program: Those who are not suited for college ; those who are not prepared for college ; those who are ready for college and those who are very smart and academically inclined. In America, after more than 25 years of social work, I find the squeaky wheel often gets the oil - lots of it in fact, while the kid who has no problems, does not create problems, does his or her homework, is respectful to educators and has good social values....gets ignored, shunted and pretty much has to swim on his or her own in the turbulent ocean of secondary and tertiary education. It is the kids who are not ready, who are not respectful to educators, the trouble makers and those who cause a lot of noise without content or substance or competency...get all the attention and the resources. We need to focus on our kids who are doing "average to well to very good to amazing" as well. I am tired of kids consuming money to sit in fifth grade five times with an attitude of self importance and entitlement with every social program directed at them, while smart kids, prepared kids, hard working kids, determined kids and kids who apply themselves are ignored.
This issue is of special importance to me as an educator, social scientist and a social worker. This is such a tragedy. But I have come to the conclusion not all are ready for college and not all are meant for college. We need to have a four tiered selection program: Those who are not suited for college ; those who are not prepared for college ; those who are ready for college and those who are very smart and academically inclined. In America, after more than 25 years of social work, I find the squeaky wheel often gets the oil - lots of it in fact, while the kid who has no problems, does not create problems, does his or her homework, is respectful to educators and has good social values....gets ignored, shunted and pretty much has to swim on his or her own in the turbulent ocean of secondary and tertiary education. It is the kids who are not ready, who are not respectful to educators, the trouble makers and those who cause a lot of noise without content or substance or competency...get all the attention and the resources. We need to focus on our kids who are doing "average to well to very good to amazing" as well. I am tired of kids consuming money to sit in fifth grade five times with an attitude of self importance and entitlement with every social program directed at them, while smart kids, prepared kids, hard working kids, determined kids and kids who apply themselves are ignored.
14
As a teacher, all I can do is ensure my own students are competent at the skills and thinking in my content area. As a parent, all I can do is review my child's work and make sure she makes sufficient progress. As a tax payer, all I can do is vote for educational programs. As a citizen, all I can do is make economic decisions thorugh my purchases that support educational programs and philosophies. As a neighbor, all I can do is make sure my neighbors have access to learning materials. As an individual, all I can do is keep abreast of the current news and best educational methods. As a human, all I can do is keep a positive outlook on making gains.
I'm doing all I can do. Some are incapable of guiding their children. Some choose not to support their schools with their money in order to own more possessions. Some aim to topple the entire system in order to earn profits by commodifying a child's natural right.
I'm tired of these alarmist "articles." The NYT should be above this kind of reporting. Do something that helps.
I'm doing all I can do. Some are incapable of guiding their children. Some choose not to support their schools with their money in order to own more possessions. Some aim to topple the entire system in order to earn profits by commodifying a child's natural right.
I'm tired of these alarmist "articles." The NYT should be above this kind of reporting. Do something that helps.
2
Uneducated and plentiful--that's how the 1% likes the population to be.
4
My daughter went to a fairly competitive high school in Massachusetts and worked hard. She gained acceptance to a top school and gave me her take on this article: the children who can handle college-level courses were well-prepared in high school; those doing poorly were often not.
She is often shocked to find those not doing well were not taught how to write essays or (she's a science major) lab reports. They were instructed in basic research techniques or, importantly, public speaking. Note that she is referring to skills, not just subject matter.
Teaching core curriculum's is fine, but only to a point. If our children aren't taught "how" to accomplish what's expected of them in college they will struggle or fail. State education commissioners, wake up!!
She is often shocked to find those not doing well were not taught how to write essays or (she's a science major) lab reports. They were instructed in basic research techniques or, importantly, public speaking. Note that she is referring to skills, not just subject matter.
Teaching core curriculum's is fine, but only to a point. If our children aren't taught "how" to accomplish what's expected of them in college they will struggle or fail. State education commissioners, wake up!!
7
What is the gist of this article?
The article evidences the growing concern about the “real value” of a high school diploma discussing ACT data drawn only from high-poverty schools. By itself, this is laden with cultural bias and presents skewed data.
Yet, the author goes on to use this skewed data to generalize the “diploma problem” as endemic to the entire U.S. education system by claiming “It is a pattern repeated in other school districts across the state or country—urban, suburban and rural…”
However, this claim fails the test when ACT data is separately examined from the highest-income high schools in the same Greenville school district. These schools are college and career readiness success stories with an average ACT benchmark of 23. Conversely, Greenville's high schools with the greatest poverty average an ACT benchmark of 4.
Same school district, same qualified teachers, same curricula…vastly different ACT data. So yes, the author is correct, there is a pattern repeated here, and in every school district across the country: POVERTY.
Ameliorating poverty should never be excluded from educational policy discussions. To do so is amoral and serves to surreptitiously shift the cause onto the oppressed and away from those who knowingly perpetuate it.
The article evidences the growing concern about the “real value” of a high school diploma discussing ACT data drawn only from high-poverty schools. By itself, this is laden with cultural bias and presents skewed data.
Yet, the author goes on to use this skewed data to generalize the “diploma problem” as endemic to the entire U.S. education system by claiming “It is a pattern repeated in other school districts across the state or country—urban, suburban and rural…”
However, this claim fails the test when ACT data is separately examined from the highest-income high schools in the same Greenville school district. These schools are college and career readiness success stories with an average ACT benchmark of 23. Conversely, Greenville's high schools with the greatest poverty average an ACT benchmark of 4.
Same school district, same qualified teachers, same curricula…vastly different ACT data. So yes, the author is correct, there is a pattern repeated here, and in every school district across the country: POVERTY.
Ameliorating poverty should never be excluded from educational policy discussions. To do so is amoral and serves to surreptitiously shift the cause onto the oppressed and away from those who knowingly perpetuate it.
5
It's not just poverty. Poverty has always existed in our country and every immigrant family from generations ago knows that. Poverty never stopped anyone from becoming educated. Period. But the people are dumber, the parents worse, the society more vile. That is the fact. And all these vile, dumb, and bad people have made excuses for themselves that obviously have become urban legends. It's always someone else's fault today. Except it really isn't.
3
Then why did so many during the Great Depression do so well???
1
Educational Romanticism
The theory that any child can become a nuclear engineer and do X,Y,Z.
The theory that any child can become a nuclear engineer and do X,Y,Z.
7
Let's dumb down our school systems so the liberals can feel good that everyone is going to college and getting a worthless degree.
12
I taught for 33 years in Montreal in a junior college. I taught in a career program, and we were expected to pass everyone. The average GPA entry level into the program was 70%, but by the end of the first semester we all had geniuses averaging 85%++. We were expected to help students from high school with their reading, writing, and math because they came to us poorly equipped to read, write, and do math. The passing rate was high as the article mentions.
The college administration expected high grades and high percentages of passing, the dean expected this, the chairperson expected this, and I was pressured to pass,pass,and pass.
Several times in my career, I was called to the dean's office for being too harsh on students, and with time, acquiesced to "the norm" and passed students who should either have never been in the program or should have failed. The dean said that "we should nurture the students- a direct line from the chairperson who had spoken to her about me.
From my point of view, the good news though is that you have to consider students and people as grains of sand filtering through a graded set of mesh (life). Students (the sand) get sifted to each level of mesh, finding their way to jobs and careers.
It didn't matter if they became professionals after the career program or not. Further down the network of mesh, other students went on to university (still following the policy of nobody hardly ever fails), and other found jobs in non-related industries.
The college administration expected high grades and high percentages of passing, the dean expected this, the chairperson expected this, and I was pressured to pass,pass,and pass.
Several times in my career, I was called to the dean's office for being too harsh on students, and with time, acquiesced to "the norm" and passed students who should either have never been in the program or should have failed. The dean said that "we should nurture the students- a direct line from the chairperson who had spoken to her about me.
From my point of view, the good news though is that you have to consider students and people as grains of sand filtering through a graded set of mesh (life). Students (the sand) get sifted to each level of mesh, finding their way to jobs and careers.
It didn't matter if they became professionals after the career program or not. Further down the network of mesh, other students went on to university (still following the policy of nobody hardly ever fails), and other found jobs in non-related industries.
4
The main problem with the American educational system is our egalitarian fantasy that every student can become president of the United States. They can't, and we shouldn't be educating them as if that were true.
Most European countries identify students with the intellect and drive for higher education around the age of 12 and channel those students into a rigorous and competitive college prep program. Those who don't make the cut receive high-quality technical or vocational training that enables them to pursue meaningful careers after graduation.
Unfortunately, we in the U.S. are unwilling to admit that some students simply aren't college material. Instead, educators continue to pretend that they can turn anyone into a college graduate if they try hard enough (and lower standards enough). That attitude ensures that American high schools pander to the lowest common denominator, thereby depriving gifted students of the rigorous academic program they need to prepare for college and less gifted students the opportunity to receive appropriate vocational training. As a result, everyone loses.
Most European countries identify students with the intellect and drive for higher education around the age of 12 and channel those students into a rigorous and competitive college prep program. Those who don't make the cut receive high-quality technical or vocational training that enables them to pursue meaningful careers after graduation.
Unfortunately, we in the U.S. are unwilling to admit that some students simply aren't college material. Instead, educators continue to pretend that they can turn anyone into a college graduate if they try hard enough (and lower standards enough). That attitude ensures that American high schools pander to the lowest common denominator, thereby depriving gifted students of the rigorous academic program they need to prepare for college and less gifted students the opportunity to receive appropriate vocational training. As a result, everyone loses.
19
I agree with you about the rigorous nature of the curriculum that university bound students in europe tend to follow. The problem in europe, (actually I should say France, since I'm not intimately familiar with every european school system, and they vary widely), is that the early weeding process can be notoriously heavy handed, leaving "late bloomers" in programs that they can't transfer out of when it turns out that they are, in fact intellectually capable or even gifted. I've seen the results a few times, and the options for "catching up" via a junior college type institution are very limited.
1
I agree that the European system disadvantages late a fairly small number of late bloomers, but I still think that is a relatively small price to pay for a superior high school curriculum.
You know who should be worried? The New York Times, because most of these kids, who constitute the vast majority of students, will never in their lives glance at it either in print or online, whereas in the past, doing so might even have been given as an assignment. I guess we can expect subscription fees in the stratosphere as a result.
4
Maybe those Asian parents in New Jersey are on to something with their demand for rigor and excellence.
9
When Algebra 2 tests with "What does 2+2=", the country gets McDonald's employees... "Fry's?"
1
The American education system is a joke.
5
The bedrock foundation of the inequality gap.
1
I'm a professor at a large state school that boasts of its superlative Carnegie ranking. Most of the students, even in our 'honors' unit are not remotely 'college ready.' We admit them, nonetheless, because we need their tuition dollars. Most of my effort seems to go into teaching they things they should have been taught by the time they reached the eighth grade. Some of them - often the weakest students - go on to become K-12 teachers, and the level of our frosh declines yet further.
17
2 things:
1- Schools got tired of it. Let’s just pass them. Everybody knows.
2-Boeing doesn’t need 20 million students. Nobody does. They have enough.
You worry too much.
1- Schools got tired of it. Let’s just pass them. Everybody knows.
2-Boeing doesn’t need 20 million students. Nobody does. They have enough.
You worry too much.
5
There is a big disconnect between raising the minimum wage and graduating people out of HS that cannot do basic reasoning. The employer is left to do the educating. Perhaps we should have standardized tests and attach a minimum wage to the results in recognition of this burden placed on the employer. This approach is probably too sophisticated for our hot and cold political system but it might start linking effort and reward together in a way that young people will clearly understand.
5
Employers used to be able to use tests in hiring. That stopped because it was quickly discovered that it wasn't mere racism to blame for not hiring minorities but true gaps in intelligence, aptitude, and acquired skills between whites and minorities. Once that became too hot to deal with, the tests were dispensed with and "credentials" were all that could be used to screen out poor candidates. Thus the college degree was suppose to be the accepted code for knowing who was smart enough to be hired.
Unfortunately, liberals started pushing for all minorities into college to go around this employment barrier. Despite the fact that it meant a college degree was dumbed down, the parade of students just kept increasing and the high schools began to pass the buck onto the colleges to teach basic skills. What we are left with is still a huge achievement gap between whites and minorities in addition to a huge swath of middle and upper middle whites who are likewise deficient in important skills. We all lose.
Unfortunately, liberals started pushing for all minorities into college to go around this employment barrier. Despite the fact that it meant a college degree was dumbed down, the parade of students just kept increasing and the high schools began to pass the buck onto the colleges to teach basic skills. What we are left with is still a huge achievement gap between whites and minorities in addition to a huge swath of middle and upper middle whites who are likewise deficient in important skills. We all lose.
2
Don't be surprised when employers shift jobs overseas because of incompetent workers who demand high salary and unrealistic benefits.
16
When I started teaching at the secondary level, I had to adjust to the flaws in the public education system. The main flaw is how government funds the schools. Schools are granted money based on their graduation rate. As a graduate of a top-tier university, I had high standards and expectations of my students, standards which had to be lowered drastically due to pressures from my principal, my supervisor, my mentor, guidance counselors, and "good" students who complained about the low grades I gave. No one was on my side. It didn't matter to anyone whether the students received a quality education. They viewed a school as a factory and each student as a commodity on an assembly line. I was not compliant with the set rhythm like other factory workers and was reviled as a result. The system must change. Schools should be funded based on how many students they fail.
63
Same story up here in Canada even at the junior college level and higher at the university. Money is the key criterium and motivation for the passing of students in the system.
1
As a fellow teacher, I cannot emphasize the value of your insight enough. We cannot hope to improve the quality of our graduates if teachers are not allowed to give grades that reflect real learning. Admins., coaches, parents all have a say in what grade a kid gets, when only the teacher knows what level of learning has been accomplished.
2
Although I agree with your initial thoughts about moving away from linking grant money with graduation rate, linking funding with the failure rate is too extreme and swings the pendulum far too much in the other direction.
1
I disagree with the entire, elitist slant of this article. A high school diploma in our society is a minimum credential for most jobs. If you don't have a high school diploma, you're almost unemployable except in the most menial positions, and sometimes not even then. So when you talk about restricting high school diplomas because of alleged poor academic qualifications, you're really advocating an even more stratified social pyramid than we have now. I frankly don't trust current school testing, which is preponderantly just another money-making scam. High school is not easy even in gritty urban public schools. It has, in fact, become much harder in recent decades, with the virtual elimination of social promotions. You normally can't graduate from any American public school without acquiring at least a sufficient basic literacy needed for entry level positions in the workforce. And thats really what a high school diploma is meant to stand for today.
26
The trouble is that those high school diplomas are worthless without standards and I have met young people with high school diplomas who cannot read or write their own names or even tell time on a clock. I recently watched one such young black man lose his job within 2 days since could not tell time and know when to clock in and he was unable to stock the grocery's shelves because he couldn't read words like corn or green beans on cans or shelves.
5
Caleb, what use is a high school diploma if you can't read or add a column of numbers? Businesses don't want the diploma for its own sake -- why would they when high school grads earn more? They just want the cheapest employee who will do the job. But as things now stand, the diploma no longer assures that students can do the job. And yes, that is very different than it was 60 years ago, when the curriculum was tougher and grades actually reflected performance.
It would be great if we could create economic success just by giving everyone a piece of paper, but in fact, it's a sad lie and we'd be better off restoring standards so kids and parents would know where they stand -- on track for a job at the secretarial or technician level, or on a college preparatory track so on track for entry into a learned profession or white collar one.
Also, consider a talented, hard working student at a school with low standards. Kids can and do graduate from such schools with straight A's only to discover when the enter college that they need remediation. That's unfair to those kids. I'm not exaggerating -- an A paper in a good suburban high school has been found to be equivalent to a C paper in a poorly-performing inner city school. Unfair to the inner city kids.
It would be great if we could create economic success just by giving everyone a piece of paper, but in fact, it's a sad lie and we'd be better off restoring standards so kids and parents would know where they stand -- on track for a job at the secretarial or technician level, or on a college preparatory track so on track for entry into a learned profession or white collar one.
Also, consider a talented, hard working student at a school with low standards. Kids can and do graduate from such schools with straight A's only to discover when the enter college that they need remediation. That's unfair to those kids. I'm not exaggerating -- an A paper in a good suburban high school has been found to be equivalent to a C paper in a poorly-performing inner city school. Unfair to the inner city kids.
3
Caleb, I wish I could agree with you, but I think you're missing the point. In my forty plus years in higher ed, I've seen academic standards significantly decline, partly because of society's hope to increase graduation rates among poorly qualified students. Too many students lack the habits of mind and study skills needed to succeed academically. The root causes of this decline are societal, and lowering the rigor of school curricula only masks the problem and penalizes those students who could benefit from higher expectations. There's nothing elitist about pushing for the rigorous standards achieved by other countries, unless you believe American kids aren't as capable as kids from Europe and Asia.
4
When there are abundant jobs and a reasonable opportunity for making a real living, students will perform just fine. Where have the opportunities been for career based work for those in less than upper-middle class situations.
Why work hard if you are screwed from the outset?
Why work hard if you are screwed from the outset?
4
You can thank the benemoth aka Federal Government meddling for ruining American education. Our kids were smarter when states ran their own schools. Do not forget that our Federal Education system is designed after the Prussian system. The goal of that system? Create mind-numb drones who do not know how to think for themselves.
Punish individuality.
Praise collectivism.
Mission accomplished.
Punish individuality.
Praise collectivism.
Mission accomplished.
4
"You can thank the benemoth aka Federal Government meddling for ruining American education."
Don't simplify the problem, Paz.
New York City's magnificent public school system was destroyed when, in the 1960s, we went over to "community control." What that meant was that experienced, highly qualified teachers, many of them Jewish, were removed from schools whose parents opined that their children were being "misunderstood" and bullied.
No, their children were being held to standards that had for many generations served our public school system very well.
The parents didn't like being told, in so many words, that while bringing babies into the world is easy, it's much harder to rear them responsibly and to prepare them for the rigors (and joys) of being educated. So they launched one of the first sallies in the culture-wars: white teachers can't teach non-white pupils.
Phooey.
Don't simplify the problem, Paz.
New York City's magnificent public school system was destroyed when, in the 1960s, we went over to "community control." What that meant was that experienced, highly qualified teachers, many of them Jewish, were removed from schools whose parents opined that their children were being "misunderstood" and bullied.
No, their children were being held to standards that had for many generations served our public school system very well.
The parents didn't like being told, in so many words, that while bringing babies into the world is easy, it's much harder to rear them responsibly and to prepare them for the rigors (and joys) of being educated. So they launched one of the first sallies in the culture-wars: white teachers can't teach non-white pupils.
Phooey.
I did badly in high school math, often learned by making mistakes on tests and not making the same mistakes again. I got the tests back, marked up, and could keep them to study for the next tests. Math builds on skills and you need to get the foundational blocks put in place.
It infuriated me that when my kids were in school, teachers flat our refused to hand back tests. They refused my requests. They didn't want to have to do several varieties of a test. So, my kids didn't have the same opportunity to learn from mistakes.
I went through my entire K-12 without ever encountering a unionized teacher. By the time my kids went through school, teaching was totally unionized. During the intervening years, schools went from being child centered to being teacher centered.
It infuriated me that when my kids were in school, teachers flat our refused to hand back tests. They refused my requests. They didn't want to have to do several varieties of a test. So, my kids didn't have the same opportunity to learn from mistakes.
I went through my entire K-12 without ever encountering a unionized teacher. By the time my kids went through school, teaching was totally unionized. During the intervening years, schools went from being child centered to being teacher centered.
9
I taught in a junior college in Montreal. I was the exception to the rest of the department. They complained they were overworked and underpaid. When I left eduction in 2010, I was making $ 72,000.00 a year. Three months off for vacations (Christmas and summer, along with another month of the semester ending and grading).
The department would not prepare anything over summer (we don;t get paid to work in the summer), so each semester beginning, we would plan courses and curriculum.
The public sector workers (teachers included) just got a 5 year contract with a 10% salary increase by the end of the 5th year. They're still complaining about class size and overwork.
As for the students, it was pass them all, and let's have great stats. Being a career program, failures would be deemed bad for the program, and reviews could create the thought of cancelling the program. Teaching jobs were the key factor or "raison d'être) for the program. As for the program, a good year would have between 8-10 students finding jobs in their professional field and remaining in the field after 3 years.
Was this a sign of success in education.
You decide!
The department would not prepare anything over summer (we don;t get paid to work in the summer), so each semester beginning, we would plan courses and curriculum.
The public sector workers (teachers included) just got a 5 year contract with a 10% salary increase by the end of the 5th year. They're still complaining about class size and overwork.
As for the students, it was pass them all, and let's have great stats. Being a career program, failures would be deemed bad for the program, and reviews could create the thought of cancelling the program. Teaching jobs were the key factor or "raison d'être) for the program. As for the program, a good year would have between 8-10 students finding jobs in their professional field and remaining in the field after 3 years.
Was this a sign of success in education.
You decide!
3
You might blame the unions, but we've got a patchwork of union and non-union teachers in the US today, and the schools with unions are generally the better schools. I'm not sure what was the cause of the change you describe, but it wasn't unionization.
2
It's way too easy to cast blame on teachers. In fact, the vast majority of teachers do the best they can with the resources and quality of students they inherit. The fact is the home environment has far more to do with student academic success than critics dare to acknowledge. If the country wants to advance education it needs to redesign the system. In addition to typical public school resources, parents have to be better educated in how to create learning environments. Moreover, the FCC could use its regulation powers to mandate network and cable television to provide more primetime educational instruction.
5
For decades now, articles have appeared in the media reporting grade inflation, faculty harassment for less than an A grade, administrators with advanced degrees in "education" and parents pushing for worthless degrees and diplomas at any cost. Education is for SALE. Low expectations and high cost, online degrees and community "colleges" now assure a worthless degree for all. There are individual classes, professors, and colleges that still educate but they are few and far between. This is what the public wants.
9
Devaluing the high school diploma has resulted in older Americans being discriminated against in the workplace. Their high school diplomas probably indicate a level of education equivalent to several years of state college today. When the economy collapsed in 2008 people in their fifties often took jobs which offered considerably lower pay than they were earning prior to the Great Recession. One rationalization for this low pay is that in times of high unemployment employers can base salary on degrees earned rather than experience. This rationilization is used to pay older workers less, or to pass over them completely with no fear of consequences for age discrimination. (Older workers on the payroll run ump the cost of insurance.) Workers nearing retirement age, who would have earned maximum social security benefits had they continued to earn their pre-recession salaries, are now facing the prospect of reduced income in retirement because they are now earning 50K a year instead of the 100K they earned in 2006.
7
"By one measure, Berea, with more than 1,000 pupils, is helping more students succeed than ever: The graduation rate, below 65 percent just four years ago, has jumped to more than 80 percent"
I would be more interested in knowing how this was accomplished. An increase of 15% over 4 years? Did they start giving all the kids "smart pills" with their breakfast? This is certainly newsworthy or should it be a reason for a little investigating ?
This is also coming at a time when many colleges are doing away with SAT min scores for admission, just need to write an essay they say. SAT's are at least a true measure of who knows what across the landscape of America.
If not for nothing this should be a good lesson in what inflation is. When everyone has one then there is no more value in it (high school diploma,college degree) I do feel sorry for these kids though because they will be thrust into our society with a piece of paper that says they are ready with a 100k worth of college loans to pay off.
I would be more interested in knowing how this was accomplished. An increase of 15% over 4 years? Did they start giving all the kids "smart pills" with their breakfast? This is certainly newsworthy or should it be a reason for a little investigating ?
This is also coming at a time when many colleges are doing away with SAT min scores for admission, just need to write an essay they say. SAT's are at least a true measure of who knows what across the landscape of America.
If not for nothing this should be a good lesson in what inflation is. When everyone has one then there is no more value in it (high school diploma,college degree) I do feel sorry for these kids though because they will be thrust into our society with a piece of paper that says they are ready with a 100k worth of college loans to pay off.
7
Well I know my uncle's school told him, if u just show up we'll graduate you. That's all your have to do.....I wonder if that's still going on
cheaters pet
another social promotion
just a drop in the ocean
unqualified for college
insufficient knowledge
graduation rates great
best in the whole state
class aides to do the test
no wonder we’re the best
another social promotion
just a drop in the ocean
unqualified for college
insufficient knowledge
graduation rates great
best in the whole state
class aides to do the test
no wonder we’re the best
4
In the Silicon Valley, 40 per cent of all start-up founders are foreign-born. Downtown Palo Alto looks like Hong Kong, with a little Mumbai mixed in. There are also French, Germans, and Israelis. My Iowa-born husband is a rara avis in the industry. And the reason is because the ethos in these countries is education above all. Not "self-esteem", not "let kids be kids", not "equality of outcomes" but real, honest-to-goodness hard work of reading, thinking and memorizing, and the hard-won joy of learning new things. If you don't study, you shame your family. If you study hard and don't succeed, it's because you don't have the talent or the intelligence, and you have to learn a trade, while your better-endowed peers go on to found Google. There is no shame in not being a genius: few are, and the genetic lottery is just that, a lottery. But if you try to educate everybody to the same standard, if you sell the lie that all kids are equal in potential, you shortchange a whole generation of Americans. But not to worry: we still have the best universities in the world, while China and India have a lot of smart kids to send our way.
29
The question is if raising the difficulty of an exam will actually help people in their careers. Isn't this more of an economical issue, than an academic one? How will making graduation harder help low income students get into College? Or how will allowing less students to graduate help more students get a job?
Yes, standardizing a curriculum could increase the academic standard in the country, but will raising the Standard in general solve economical issues that are way beyond that?
How will even a student passing the most difficult exam be going into College if he lacks the resources? How will making the exam even harder give him any extra resources?
Yes, of course we want out children to be educated. But just education won't solve all the issues that a bad local economy can bring.
Yes, standardizing a curriculum could increase the academic standard in the country, but will raising the Standard in general solve economical issues that are way beyond that?
How will even a student passing the most difficult exam be going into College if he lacks the resources? How will making the exam even harder give him any extra resources?
Yes, of course we want out children to be educated. But just education won't solve all the issues that a bad local economy can bring.
It's not an either/or thing. Yes, we need a more equal economy and we need to expand college access so that smart, poor kids can go. But we also shouldn't be graduating kids with a HS diploma who can't read and write. It should indicate a minimum level of education, and that won't happen until we shift our thinking and realize diplomas should be earned, not simply awarded, and that if a student doesn't do the work to earn it, that's not the teacher's or school's fault.
3
American Education is an embarrassment. Teachers need to be the BEST, high achieving, intelligent, creative, effective. And to assure that WE NEED TO PAY THEM TOP DOLLAR. Let's start with $100,000. That way we might get teachers who would otherwise go into industry. Let's reward them. Let them use the classroom as a laboratory. Util, this happens, we as a nation, will just answer be filling in the ovals on standardized tests! REFORM!
5
I'm not sure we WANT teachers who'd otherwise go into industry. And in any case, we've always gotten far more value in teachers than we've paid for. The teachers we've got are more than adequate to do a good job teaching our kids. We just have to start letting them. Prescribed teaching methods and a focus on test scores that are mostly the result of parenting and student ability aren't working. We need to let them teach.
3
It is embarrassing to the teacher's unions to continually hear that graduation rates are low so they've partnered with parents to change laws, eliminate exit exams and lower testing standards, especially in areas where the students need the most help. In this age of identity politics I guess it's more important to pass more unprepared for life kids than to allow change to the way that they are taught.
Why has it taken so long for the Times to question the graduation standards of public schools? Everyone I know has been aware of this issue for decades. Back in the early 70's a friend taught high school near Albany and her principal changed her low grades for a couple of her students. They were on the football team and were destined to a life of hard and unfulfilling work, thanks to fools like this principal -- imagine what a principal in Texas would do!
In Minnesota schools 12 years of showing up most of the time is the only requirement for graduation. Thus Minnesota has the highest graduation rate, that combined with the relatively low percentage of fatherless students whose parents conceived them without any capability of or interest in nurturing them or even feeding them. The St. Paul school budget includes free breakfast and lunch to all students. South Carolina has always been at the bottom of the competency list along with Mississippi and Alabama, partly because white parents send their kids to Christian (i.e. racist) Schools. I guess intact families are going to do what they think is best for their few children.
In Minnesota schools 12 years of showing up most of the time is the only requirement for graduation. Thus Minnesota has the highest graduation rate, that combined with the relatively low percentage of fatherless students whose parents conceived them without any capability of or interest in nurturing them or even feeding them. The St. Paul school budget includes free breakfast and lunch to all students. South Carolina has always been at the bottom of the competency list along with Mississippi and Alabama, partly because white parents send their kids to Christian (i.e. racist) Schools. I guess intact families are going to do what they think is best for their few children.
5
We have the same problem in high schools as we have in colleges. It is easier to pass students along than to give them failing grades. There is pressure to do so, definitely from the student but often from the institution as well. And, grade inflation is rampant - look at what % of students are now 'honors' students, or who are above a 4.0 gpa.
We end up with graduates who have not achieved the necessary learning. Where does the fault belong? The push to meet standards, institutional pressure, student/family pressure, the culture of every child being above average and being awarded. But I'd also lay the problem squarely at the feet of teachers who do not want to deal with the extra work and angst of actually grading appropriately and holding students accountable. It's hard work, but it's part of the responsibility of being an educator.
We end up with graduates who have not achieved the necessary learning. Where does the fault belong? The push to meet standards, institutional pressure, student/family pressure, the culture of every child being above average and being awarded. But I'd also lay the problem squarely at the feet of teachers who do not want to deal with the extra work and angst of actually grading appropriately and holding students accountable. It's hard work, but it's part of the responsibility of being an educator.
2
The problem is a dualistic dilemma matrix spanning over three levels of conundrums.
1. Do we enforce standrads?
2. Do we lower or raise standards?
3. Do we deny the actual affect of IQ on student achievement?
4. Do we dare to stand up and admit that we are not all created equal? In fact, none of us are?
5. Do we dare to pit individuality against conformism?
6. Do we foster confrontationalism to allow creativity?
7. Do we stamp down on individualiarism to ensure even content delivery?
8. Do we want to raise a nation of Einsteins, a nation of BurgerFlippers, or a good mix of all levels?
9. Is the education dilemma so complex that the mind of the American can't solve it?
10. Do the educators in Finland, China and India know something we don't, or are they the equivalent of "the grass is always greener on the other side?
Once we answered these questions to our and our parent's satisfaction, then and only then are we ready to leave kindergarten and enroll in grade 1.
1. Do we enforce standrads?
2. Do we lower or raise standards?
3. Do we deny the actual affect of IQ on student achievement?
4. Do we dare to stand up and admit that we are not all created equal? In fact, none of us are?
5. Do we dare to pit individuality against conformism?
6. Do we foster confrontationalism to allow creativity?
7. Do we stamp down on individualiarism to ensure even content delivery?
8. Do we want to raise a nation of Einsteins, a nation of BurgerFlippers, or a good mix of all levels?
9. Is the education dilemma so complex that the mind of the American can't solve it?
10. Do the educators in Finland, China and India know something we don't, or are they the equivalent of "the grass is always greener on the other side?
Once we answered these questions to our and our parent's satisfaction, then and only then are we ready to leave kindergarten and enroll in grade 1.
6
The article states that "...some business leaders worry that not enough students have the abilities they need for higher-skilled jobs at Boeing, Volvo and BMW, which have built plants here in recent years. What is more, they say, students need to be able to collaborate and communicate effectively, skills they say high schools do not always teach."
As "personalized" digital learning (each student learning on his or her own tablet at an individual pace, while in a classroom) is pushed by our government as well as by private enterprises like Mark Zuckerberg's new LLC, especially in poorer neighborhoods, we need to stop and consider whether this is really how our children should learn. Certainly the skills of collaboration and communication, mentioned above by business leaders, will suffer, leaving our children even less career-ready.
As "personalized" digital learning (each student learning on his or her own tablet at an individual pace, while in a classroom) is pushed by our government as well as by private enterprises like Mark Zuckerberg's new LLC, especially in poorer neighborhoods, we need to stop and consider whether this is really how our children should learn. Certainly the skills of collaboration and communication, mentioned above by business leaders, will suffer, leaving our children even less career-ready.
5
We need to get away from social promotion based on age. By age 5 a person can see significant differences in achievement. The gap only gets larger yet a kid with a 6th grade reading level will be in the same 12 grade English class as a kid with a 12th grade reading level. Both kids are being short changed.
Consider what our best and brightest would be if they were educated to their potential.
Consider what our best and brightest would be if they were educated to their potential.
7
The heap of superciliousness, pomposity, and ignorance among those who style themselves superior absolutely flabbergasts.
Want better students? Be better parents, citizens, and teachers. And if it's OK by you, let's just teach actual science (evolution's real, kids, and so in the global warming we're causing), actual history (no, Virginia, the Pilgrims didn't come to America for religious lberty for all), actual economics (sorry, Ayn Rand was a meth head), actual writing, stuff like that.
Want better students? Be better parents, citizens, and teachers. And if it's OK by you, let's just teach actual science (evolution's real, kids, and so in the global warming we're causing), actual history (no, Virginia, the Pilgrims didn't come to America for religious lberty for all), actual economics (sorry, Ayn Rand was a meth head), actual writing, stuff like that.
9
Until when the American will stop to pretend that every one is entitle to college education?????
6
I thought pre-K was going to solve all of this ?
After teaching 34 years in high school and 10 years at University --- I said in class - "eventually a high school diploma will be the equivalent of an elementary education - a college degree will become a high school diploma - and finally post-graduate work will become a beginning of a university education - and so it goes...
There should be no "fear" since "rigor" and "standards" are subject to the Vonnegut theory that "all men are created equal, but some (substitute all) are more equal than others." All shall pass as Monty Python did not say.
There should be no "fear" since "rigor" and "standards" are subject to the Vonnegut theory that "all men are created equal, but some (substitute all) are more equal than others." All shall pass as Monty Python did not say.
1
Vonnegut? Not Orwell in "Animal Farm?"
''all men are created equal, but some (substitute all) are more equal than others." is an adaption of a line from Animal Farm
Who is failing? Students? Parents? Teachers? Schools overall? All of the above? It seems that the last couple of years of high school are too late to be testing and finding that either the education was insufficient or the students simply did not learn. How did these students do in 1st grade or 4th or 8th? Were they on track at that time?
Education is a building process, so success in each grade depends upon the foundations laid in previous grades. If Johnny can't read well by 5th grade, he isn't going to do well in the work place or be college ready - unless someone stops him and does good remedial work before he moves forward - from 5th grade.
Dumbing down standardized tests or making course requirements or courses easier so that a student gets that little piece of paper is doing violence to that child - and to society. Young people unemployed or under-employed are much more likely to get into crime and drugs than are those who see a future for themselves. Those who do the work asked (even if it is well below what should be asked) and 'graduate' unprepared for the real world are bound to end up angry and resentful. The promise they believed they were receiving of a better life in return for their work does not materialize. Disillusioned youth who have seen their efforts lead to naught, are also more likely to end up cross-wise with the law.
We must look at the system from kindergarten on - the problem does not start in 10th or 11th grade. We owe our youth more.
Education is a building process, so success in each grade depends upon the foundations laid in previous grades. If Johnny can't read well by 5th grade, he isn't going to do well in the work place or be college ready - unless someone stops him and does good remedial work before he moves forward - from 5th grade.
Dumbing down standardized tests or making course requirements or courses easier so that a student gets that little piece of paper is doing violence to that child - and to society. Young people unemployed or under-employed are much more likely to get into crime and drugs than are those who see a future for themselves. Those who do the work asked (even if it is well below what should be asked) and 'graduate' unprepared for the real world are bound to end up angry and resentful. The promise they believed they were receiving of a better life in return for their work does not materialize. Disillusioned youth who have seen their efforts lead to naught, are also more likely to end up cross-wise with the law.
We must look at the system from kindergarten on - the problem does not start in 10th or 11th grade. We owe our youth more.
7
Never mind high school. Does a college degree mean anything any more, besides the willingness to take on an absurd amount of debt?
18
That depends on your major and grade position.
My wife graduated from MCV with a BS in Physical Therapy in 1972. Except for a few years early in our marriage she worked part time and retired three years ago at $44K a year.
My son graduated from NC State in 2000 with a double major in Civil Engineering and Construction Engineering and Management and was summa cum laude. He makes around $250K a year.
On the other hand, I dropped out of high school in 1967, worked in tool and die and sheet metal work for a while and then got a job with Southern Bell as a technician. I also did four years in the Navy.
I was laid off in 1985 and started my own business in telecom equipment and services including cabling systems. I can't say what I made annually but my Social Security pays me around $26K a year.
From what I've seen most jobs requiring a BA don't pay as well. oo many people going into Social Work has driven the starting pay down to around $25K and you mostly have to get a government job. A BS degree or a trade that can turn into self employment is the way to go.
My son had no college debt as I paid for all his costs.
My wife graduated from MCV with a BS in Physical Therapy in 1972. Except for a few years early in our marriage she worked part time and retired three years ago at $44K a year.
My son graduated from NC State in 2000 with a double major in Civil Engineering and Construction Engineering and Management and was summa cum laude. He makes around $250K a year.
On the other hand, I dropped out of high school in 1967, worked in tool and die and sheet metal work for a while and then got a job with Southern Bell as a technician. I also did four years in the Navy.
I was laid off in 1985 and started my own business in telecom equipment and services including cabling systems. I can't say what I made annually but my Social Security pays me around $26K a year.
From what I've seen most jobs requiring a BA don't pay as well. oo many people going into Social Work has driven the starting pay down to around $25K and you mostly have to get a government job. A BS degree or a trade that can turn into self employment is the way to go.
My son had no college debt as I paid for all his costs.
1. We need to pay teachers more, including student improvement over previous years. Higher pay equates with greater respect by families and students.
2. We need to spend more on early childhood programs, and we need to intervene in the early grades when students aren't on track to graduate. Social promotion and easy grades must end. You move to the next grade when you are ready.
3. We need to offer lots of extra help--with studying, with food--for students who aren't meeting the marks.
4. No matter what you think of the Common Core's most recent tests, having a benchmark of progress is necessary to improvement.
5. Any school that doesn't provide regular raises to teachers and cuts educators should cut their sports programs first, especially the ones where kids get bashed in the head.
6. The overwhelming majority of first-year college students I see today are working at about the level of sophomores in high school or lower, according to when I started teaching in the 1980s. I'm sorry, but colleges have a really hard time fixing the mess of 12-14 years of inadequate education. I have loved teaching for years, but count me now as one of those educators who thinks at least once a week about leaving.
2. We need to spend more on early childhood programs, and we need to intervene in the early grades when students aren't on track to graduate. Social promotion and easy grades must end. You move to the next grade when you are ready.
3. We need to offer lots of extra help--with studying, with food--for students who aren't meeting the marks.
4. No matter what you think of the Common Core's most recent tests, having a benchmark of progress is necessary to improvement.
5. Any school that doesn't provide regular raises to teachers and cuts educators should cut their sports programs first, especially the ones where kids get bashed in the head.
6. The overwhelming majority of first-year college students I see today are working at about the level of sophomores in high school or lower, according to when I started teaching in the 1980s. I'm sorry, but colleges have a really hard time fixing the mess of 12-14 years of inadequate education. I have loved teaching for years, but count me now as one of those educators who thinks at least once a week about leaving.
30
I agree with most of what you say except point one. I have not read salary studies, but in my experience teachers steadily employed in education make good salaries, especially when excellent retirement benefits are taken into account. "Pay teachers more" has become a pretty tired mantra by now. Society needs to "educate students better", a mantra more to the point.
All the above sounds good, but when do we admit not all kids are college material.
I don't think paying more to teacher fixes much.
When does parents involvement comes in?
I don't think paying more to teacher fixes much.
When does parents involvement comes in?
1
Any suggestions for measuring and holding our teachers to any standards?
Our teachers tend to come from the bottom two-thirds of their college cohort. The vast majority of developed nations outperform our K-12 education system and their teachers tend to come from the top third of their college cohorts.
Just paying higher salaries to unionized workers who are paid based on time on the job and not performance and who are rarely fired for anything short of gross misconduct hardly seems like the fix we need!
Our teachers tend to come from the bottom two-thirds of their college cohort. The vast majority of developed nations outperform our K-12 education system and their teachers tend to come from the top third of their college cohorts.
Just paying higher salaries to unionized workers who are paid based on time on the job and not performance and who are rarely fired for anything short of gross misconduct hardly seems like the fix we need!
4
we times readers are a relatively well-educated bunch;as such, we tend to think education is essential to a worthwhile life. however, i'm not sure this is universally self-evident. for many, happiness is defined as friends and family, plus a job which supports some degree of material comfort. intellectual pursuits, if they're considered at all, are often rejected as useless distractions.
a high school diploma was the gold standard when my parents were young. of course, there were lots of good jobs that did not require one. sadly, so many of these low-skill living-wage jobs have gone away.
a high school diploma was the gold standard when my parents were young. of course, there were lots of good jobs that did not require one. sadly, so many of these low-skill living-wage jobs have gone away.
16
Students who got all 'A's" in HS will go bananas when they get a lower grade in college--they will give the professors a low score on their evaluations, and those professors will not get tenure. A grade is something that is suppoosed to be a measure of something--but what? It is not a measure of 'worth' of a human, so students need to see it as a measure --in a finite situation--of what they produced in an exam or a paper. But they personalize and magnify it and go bananas, so they all get 'A's.'
35
And then people wonder why Starbucks et al, in many places, require a college degree (or at least lots of college credits) to serve coffee and give change (even with the machine calculating the change due).
Welcome to "equality" in America. Everyone now is a high school graduate. In a few years, everyone will be a college graduate. We can't let a single so feel like an underachiever.
Soon Starbucks will ask for a Masters degree to serve coffee and a PhD is Chemistry to brew it.
Welcome to "equality" in America. Everyone now is a high school graduate. In a few years, everyone will be a college graduate. We can't let a single so feel like an underachiever.
Soon Starbucks will ask for a Masters degree to serve coffee and a PhD is Chemistry to brew it.
27
I think not only should they bring back shop class, but one shouldn't be allowed to graduate until one has proven capable of operating at least two potentially deadly shop machines by reading the instruction manuals, with no other guidance.
27
Trial lawyers did away with shop class. When my son took shop (Tech ed) it was taking a piece of wood into a CNC cabinet then writing a CNC program to turn the piece of wood into the desired shape all safe and sound with no hands on with power or hand tools. So sad
1
Are you my shop teacher? Stop trying to make shop happen.
bad idea. the machines don't give out awards when fingers are mangled
Something that the Common Core standards addressed. Please, NYT, clarify the standards versus the buck for performance parts.
5
I am an employer. I take with considerable skepticism any claimed credentials of an applicant. A degree infers nothing nowadays, with grade inflation rampant and the Lake Wobegon (all the children are above average) ethos predominant. Even quality and elite universities admit and presumably graduate individuals who lack basic writing and communication skills. One of my children attended an elite college and had a job tutoring fellow students in basic writing - them having been admitted on some criteria that appeared to be other than rigorous and complete.
In the end, there are three tracks or more in the world of work;
- those who are honest about their capacity, and work within it, including the manual trades.
- those who have the aptitude and skills to compete at the highest levels in the professions. Their work is high quality and they don't ask for a pass.
- those who obfuscate, fake it and deny their limits. They substitute a narrow world view and limited personal experiences for the truth, they can't express themselves with proper grammar, syntax and narrative in writing, they dismiss the canon in favor of the easy, and can cluster in curricula and jobs that focus on values and intangibles that can't be measured. They blame their shortcomings and losses on the system rather than their own efforts. When hired in error, these C players play politics, destroy morale, and lead to mediocre organizational performance.
Believe nothing. Test for the skills you seek.
In the end, there are three tracks or more in the world of work;
- those who are honest about their capacity, and work within it, including the manual trades.
- those who have the aptitude and skills to compete at the highest levels in the professions. Their work is high quality and they don't ask for a pass.
- those who obfuscate, fake it and deny their limits. They substitute a narrow world view and limited personal experiences for the truth, they can't express themselves with proper grammar, syntax and narrative in writing, they dismiss the canon in favor of the easy, and can cluster in curricula and jobs that focus on values and intangibles that can't be measured. They blame their shortcomings and losses on the system rather than their own efforts. When hired in error, these C players play politics, destroy morale, and lead to mediocre organizational performance.
Believe nothing. Test for the skills you seek.
228
Degrees have never inferred. The possession of a degree may imply something, or it may not. The evaluator is the one who infers. Sorry, but on this subject, it's probably good to get it right.
11
The last category is the most prevalent and we see it in the Victim Olympics played by college students, even those at Yale.
It does not bode well for our future that young people wallow in self pity, yet seem incapable of understanding that years of effort and sacrifice is required for those of us not born into the 1% to succeed in life.
It does not bode well for our future that young people wallow in self pity, yet seem incapable of understanding that years of effort and sacrifice is required for those of us not born into the 1% to succeed in life.
6
This comment is ironic, coming from someone who thinks degrees can infer something.
2
There is a difficult balance between "engagement" and actual learning. To measure the former, you look at the numbers of kids completing assignments with reasonable cheerfulness, participating in class, and actually attempting the work. The result of engagement is that you lift the bottom end toward the middle levels of achievement. To measure actual learning, you need to apply standards that are rigorous and can actually separate the "approaching to standards" from the "meeting standards" and the "showing exemplary skill at the standards" (grades of C, B, and A). Of course, this is a discouraging system to many, and may lead to disengagement. What we have done, for better or worse, is try to increase student engagement, thinking it would raise all boats. Unfortunately, it probably doesn't raise all boats high enough. Anyone with a solution will be heralded. Anyone?
17
Create an environment where learning is extremely cool. Away from the popular culture, television, rap, sports, movies, etc. When the peer group dictates it, youth culture can do the most amazing things.
1
Truthfully, we need to look backwards and learn from history. Engagement is not the" be all and end all." Nor is technology. The purpose of school is for students to learn and teachers to teach. Engagement and technology may sometimes enhance learning but they are not essential to teaching nor to learning.
Children (note I say children, not just high schoolers, must learn to read and to develop a love for reading--or at least a respect for what reading can impart. Reading is the key to so much: learning to write and improving one's writing, acquiring the content of other classes such as civics and science. It is also the key to expanding one's horizons and opening oneself to the world. It is even key to learning math. How do you understand a math textbook if you cannot read at the level at which it is written?
I am no
Children (note I say children, not just high schoolers, must learn to read and to develop a love for reading--or at least a respect for what reading can impart. Reading is the key to so much: learning to write and improving one's writing, acquiring the content of other classes such as civics and science. It is also the key to expanding one's horizons and opening oneself to the world. It is even key to learning math. How do you understand a math textbook if you cannot read at the level at which it is written?
I am no
I submitted an incomplete comment
Continuing: I am no technophobe. Read a book,on your kindle or IPad. Just read...
As to my suggestion of learning from history: In the past, the expectations that the teacher vibrant and engaging everyday were not there. Don't get me wrong: I loved classes that exhibited creativity and engendered student engagement, but the expectation (by my parents. or me) that the teacher be a performer was not present.The teacher was to impart content and try to make sure students learned it. Parents reinforced learning and enforced studying and attendance. My parents did not attend college. But they sent me to a college prep Catholic high school and made it clear that attempting higher education was assumed. My mother stressed the importance of reading as the key to learning and education as the way to a rewarding life.
Lack of educational standards is worrisome; so is the fact so few students have the most basic skills. Sadly, in some school systems, a part of the problem is that students do not even ATTEND school regularly. In Sandtown-Winchester in Baltimore--the neighborhood where Freddie Gray lived before his death--the middle school truancy rate (more than 28 days absent) is 20%, the high school truancy rate is an incredible 40%! It is a travesty. It is also one part of the underbelly of lack of academic and job-readiness skills. Who can change this? Not cops, not teachers. Family, mentors, clergy, activists and kids themselves.
Continuing: I am no technophobe. Read a book,on your kindle or IPad. Just read...
As to my suggestion of learning from history: In the past, the expectations that the teacher vibrant and engaging everyday were not there. Don't get me wrong: I loved classes that exhibited creativity and engendered student engagement, but the expectation (by my parents. or me) that the teacher be a performer was not present.The teacher was to impart content and try to make sure students learned it. Parents reinforced learning and enforced studying and attendance. My parents did not attend college. But they sent me to a college prep Catholic high school and made it clear that attempting higher education was assumed. My mother stressed the importance of reading as the key to learning and education as the way to a rewarding life.
Lack of educational standards is worrisome; so is the fact so few students have the most basic skills. Sadly, in some school systems, a part of the problem is that students do not even ATTEND school regularly. In Sandtown-Winchester in Baltimore--the neighborhood where Freddie Gray lived before his death--the middle school truancy rate (more than 28 days absent) is 20%, the high school truancy rate is an incredible 40%! It is a travesty. It is also one part of the underbelly of lack of academic and job-readiness skills. Who can change this? Not cops, not teachers. Family, mentors, clergy, activists and kids themselves.
2
I wish that we would take politicians and government out of education. What should be a wonderful time of learning and exploring is now reduced to demanding test results. Student and school performance is based upon the ability to teach to a test. Nothing is learned. And now, very oddly, if students are graduating we're asking if the tests and curriculum have been dumbed down. What is the point of testing if next we question the test and the results? It makes no sense.
Somehow the baby boomers and their parents were able to go school, learn, graduate and go on to college. The worst test hurdle was the SAT. The children of the baby boomers still had a chance at a good k-12 education and an opportunity for college. Many kids qualified for and took advanced placement courses and did quite well. Of course, rigorous standards were in place and students had to demonstrate aptitude and skills to be part of the AP program.
The goal thought is not just high school graduation. It is defined now as "being truly college and career ready". But "testing does not accurately predict whether students will do well in college or in the workplace."
Our goals for students and schools seem to be at odds against themselves. And colleges seem to have even different standards.
We need to open a dialogue on what we all really want and what we need to accomplish. We need to remember that the future of our children is at stake. We can't push and pull our kids in every direction.
Somehow the baby boomers and their parents were able to go school, learn, graduate and go on to college. The worst test hurdle was the SAT. The children of the baby boomers still had a chance at a good k-12 education and an opportunity for college. Many kids qualified for and took advanced placement courses and did quite well. Of course, rigorous standards were in place and students had to demonstrate aptitude and skills to be part of the AP program.
The goal thought is not just high school graduation. It is defined now as "being truly college and career ready". But "testing does not accurately predict whether students will do well in college or in the workplace."
Our goals for students and schools seem to be at odds against themselves. And colleges seem to have even different standards.
We need to open a dialogue on what we all really want and what we need to accomplish. We need to remember that the future of our children is at stake. We can't push and pull our kids in every direction.
8
1 - There is a bell-shaped curve of intelligence.
2 - The issue is not the schools - it is the preparation, or lack thereof, of kids entering Kindergarten. Or even pre-school.
2 - The issue is not the schools - it is the preparation, or lack thereof, of kids entering Kindergarten. Or even pre-school.
18
But, can't we all pretend? Can't we all just shape reality the way we would like to see it? It's the American way.
2
California is facing an especially bleak combination of demographics and student achievement:
http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-ln-achievement-gaps-widen-20150...
http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-ln-achievement-gaps-widen-20150...
6
NO! Schools exist only to enrich monopoly teachers' unions and indoctrinate kids to the Progressive Ideology of an anti-free enterprise, anti-citizen, anti-white person, anti-Rule of Law, anti-American mantra. Learn to Be Prepared (as the wonderful, but now crucified Boy Scouts motto was)? Absolutely NOT. Equality in poverty, except fir the Harvard Elites.
Http://www.periodictablet.com
Http://www.periodictablet.com
8
One could say that you're doing an excellent job of demonstrating that your own schools were deficient, but I disagree with that suggestion. I don't blame your schools, but rather the raw material they had to work with.
5
This is completely untrue. I have been in public education for 11 years and every teacher a work with just teaches their discipline. There is no "indoctrinating" going on.
Grade inflation is the results of "the results at all cost" pressure put on teachers and the myth of an continuous advancement in education in our society. Not every student is made for college. But there is an equal dignity of being a MIT graduate or a pastry cook or an electrician. The salary of these latter should reflect this.
12
" there is an equal dignity of being a MIT graduate or a pastry cook or an electrician. The salary of these latter should reflect this."
WHY? The MIT graduate will be able to do things that the pastry cook or electrician would never dream of. Not all work has equal value despite what the liberal/progressives might claim.
WHY? The MIT graduate will be able to do things that the pastry cook or electrician would never dream of. Not all work has equal value despite what the liberal/progressives might claim.
6
You want to pay your electrician the same rate as a MIT grad? Carpenters and plumbers as well? How much would a house cost?
2
As a teacher in Mo. I agree completely.
This is the age of electronic garbage for quite sometime. Everyone takes fancy to these gadgets, parents, teachers and students are no exception either. What do these gadgets teach except to make us robots.
Everyone takes so much interest in learning how to make best use of these so called smart electronic gadgets by spending too much of time to become experts in handling the same. If only the students were to spend a fraction of that time in learning their class lessons on daily basis, they can achieve anything they want not only in their academics but also in their careers as well at a later stage. It's as simple as that.
Everyone takes so much interest in learning how to make best use of these so called smart electronic gadgets by spending too much of time to become experts in handling the same. If only the students were to spend a fraction of that time in learning their class lessons on daily basis, they can achieve anything they want not only in their academics but also in their careers as well at a later stage. It's as simple as that.
9
Western Civilisation will fall when the last AA battery runs dry........
2
I recall public education becoming progressively easier and less demanding after elementary school. I'm still impressed with the public elementary education I received in the early 60s. By high school, it was often a joke but good for me in terms of grade point averages. According to my mother, who spent some time as a foreign language teacher/dept head in high school, the attempts at inclusiveness, desegregation and relaxed discipline had undesirable outcomes of dumbing down curricula and grading of results. She would indicate administration directives of how many students "had" to pass whether or not they actually did. Her description of a significant minority of students, pointedly not race-based but behavior-based... "animals". Now, this is all from forty years ago.
It's the reverse Lake Wobegon effect. Everyone is below average.
It's the reverse Lake Wobegon effect. Everyone is below average.
20
The best science school I ever went to was a predominantly black junior high in Orange, NJ.
Final exam question: discuss the evolution of life on earth, up to the formation of complex organic compounds.
Wadda you got?
Final exam question: discuss the evolution of life on earth, up to the formation of complex organic compounds.
Wadda you got?
2
Robert- you can't discuss the evolution of life up to the formation of complex organic compounds because there was no life before organic macromolecules. Sounds like the course was not so good...
1
We have turned our education system into for profit instead of actually educating our kids.
13
I am a university professor. I can't believe the number of students in recent years (and it seems to be increasing) who ask if they can retake a test or do extra credit. Sometimes this is even when there are still papers due that they could be working on and doing multiple revisions of in order to make them really good papers and thus raise their grades. But they don't ask for your time to review a draft they're writing. They ask to redo a test or for some extra credit assignment. It's weird.
49
I think that's because that is the norm at my kids' high school--they are often able to bring up their grades with extra credit work and sometimes are able to redo tests. Most kids don't bother, although mine do because they're grade-focused. I agree that it would be much more important for the classes to focus on writing papers, but they don't. In a way that might be good, because some of the teachers aren't very literate and seem to struggle with grading essays. I think the administration emphasizes tests over essays because grading them is much simpler.
2
Teachers and schools can't fix this problem. Parents are to blame.
Middle class parents demand that their little snowflakes are never ever made to feel that they are not as smart as their friends. They opt junior out of standardized tests because... junior is a snowflake! How can any test truly measure junior's "snowflake-ness"?!
When enough soccer moms demand, politicians listen. Then policies are made where "failure is not an option" for any school, not even for those in poor neighborhoods with few snowflakes.
Middle class parents demand that their little snowflakes are never ever made to feel that they are not as smart as their friends. They opt junior out of standardized tests because... junior is a snowflake! How can any test truly measure junior's "snowflake-ness"?!
When enough soccer moms demand, politicians listen. Then policies are made where "failure is not an option" for any school, not even for those in poor neighborhoods with few snowflakes.
14
No one is teaching kids how to think or use common sense.
Some years ago a friend asked me to help her HS senior daughter with writing essays. The family's primary language wasn't English but this girl had been born in NY, went to good schools in high-performing districts in NY, and the parents were very invested in their children's education.
The girl was volunteering as a candy striper in a NY hospital. She could not comprehend the difference between a physician, and a physican's assistant. When I asked her what she thought the difference in their educational levels was, she had no idea of the years of training required to produce a physician. She just couldn't compare relative skill levels and what was required to obtain them.
She went on to study education in college and is presently an employee in the NYC school system...
Some years ago a friend asked me to help her HS senior daughter with writing essays. The family's primary language wasn't English but this girl had been born in NY, went to good schools in high-performing districts in NY, and the parents were very invested in their children's education.
The girl was volunteering as a candy striper in a NY hospital. She could not comprehend the difference between a physician, and a physican's assistant. When I asked her what she thought the difference in their educational levels was, she had no idea of the years of training required to produce a physician. She just couldn't compare relative skill levels and what was required to obtain them.
She went on to study education in college and is presently an employee in the NYC school system...
9
"She went on to study education in college and is presently an employee in the NYC school system..."
her job suits her talent. she reacted correctly to her limited learning ability.
her job suits her talent. she reacted correctly to her limited learning ability.
She was in high school when she was volunteering in the hospital. Why are you so certain that she never learned anything from her experience or from her subsequent years in college? Did you take the time to explain to her the years required to become a doctor? Young people have to be taught by the adults in their lives.
This is a complex issue and many factors are at play (though, as usual, most of the players involved are looking for a quick fix.). But I wish more people would consider the following: just a generation or two ago, most students who graduated high school were not expected to go to college. Plenty of professional jobs did not require degrees and smart people were able to make their way in a variety of fields. I should know--my parents don't have college degrees yet made a comfortable middle class living despite that. They wouldn't be able to even get an interview at their own companies today as entry-level employees--because those positions now require college degrees.
It's easy to blame K-12 education, but there is ample evidence that students from disadvantaged backgrounds begin to fall behind their peers academically well before they even enter first grade. By requiring everyone to adhere to increasingly rigorous academic standards (which, by the way, have no bearing on a person's ability to do well in a variety of job settings), we actually limit people's prospects all the more. Not to mention all the people WITH college degrees who still can't find jobs.
And the answer is to make it harder to get a high school diploma? I don't think so.
It's easy to blame K-12 education, but there is ample evidence that students from disadvantaged backgrounds begin to fall behind their peers academically well before they even enter first grade. By requiring everyone to adhere to increasingly rigorous academic standards (which, by the way, have no bearing on a person's ability to do well in a variety of job settings), we actually limit people's prospects all the more. Not to mention all the people WITH college degrees who still can't find jobs.
And the answer is to make it harder to get a high school diploma? I don't think so.
12
You should call to Obama and ask him to sign an executive order that allow every one in this country is entitle to a high school diploma.
Whenever the media gives us a report on the failure of public school education, judgment is passed according to how well public education prepares students for the myriad jobs in our economy with their myriad skill requirements.
How much money they will earn and what kind of jobs will be available to them are then used to judge the efficacy of public education, and only public education. Apparently, high school graduates from parochial, private and other religious schools are all getting into excellent colleges and then getting well paying jobs.
If parochial, home schooled, private or other religious high school graduates are all doing well and making good livings in this economy, then random criticism of our public school system is justified.
But if that is not the case, then maybe the problem is the economy and the way it's structured and not public schools.
How much money they will earn and what kind of jobs will be available to them are then used to judge the efficacy of public education, and only public education. Apparently, high school graduates from parochial, private and other religious schools are all getting into excellent colleges and then getting well paying jobs.
If parochial, home schooled, private or other religious high school graduates are all doing well and making good livings in this economy, then random criticism of our public school system is justified.
But if that is not the case, then maybe the problem is the economy and the way it's structured and not public schools.
8
The Program for International Student Assessment, or PISA, collects test results from 65 countries for its rankings, which come out every three years. The latest results, from 2012, show that U.S. students ranked below average in math among the world's most-developed countries. They were close to average in science and reading.
"In mathematics, 29 nations and other jurisdictions outperformed the United States by a statistically significant margin, up from 23 three years ago," reports Education Week. "In science, 22 education systems scored above the U.S. average, up from 18 in 2009."
In reading, 19 other locales scored higher than U.S. students — a jump from nine in 2009, when the last assessment was performed.
The top overall scores came from Shanghai, Singapore, Hong Kong, Taiwan, South Korea, Macao and Japan, followed by Lichtenstein, Switzerland, the Netherlands and Estonia.
"In mathematics, 29 nations and other jurisdictions outperformed the United States by a statistically significant margin, up from 23 three years ago," reports Education Week. "In science, 22 education systems scored above the U.S. average, up from 18 in 2009."
In reading, 19 other locales scored higher than U.S. students — a jump from nine in 2009, when the last assessment was performed.
The top overall scores came from Shanghai, Singapore, Hong Kong, Taiwan, South Korea, Macao and Japan, followed by Lichtenstein, Switzerland, the Netherlands and Estonia.
7
The US also has more students living in poverty than nearly any other developed country. When you control for that, comparing PISA scores for countries with low levels of poverty overall to US public schools with comparable percentages, comparing countries with moderate levels to US schools with similar poverty rates, and so on, US schools come first or close to it in nearly every comparison.
Which is not to say that there aren't real issues in our education system (largely caused by misguided policies put in place ostensibly to "fix" it over the last fifteen years). But the PISA scores are more an indictment of our economic distribution than our schools.
Which is not to say that there aren't real issues in our education system (largely caused by misguided policies put in place ostensibly to "fix" it over the last fifteen years). But the PISA scores are more an indictment of our economic distribution than our schools.
3
Collaborative cheating. That's what is behind the rising graduating rates and declining quality.
Administrators put pressure on teachers to increase "student success"--or else (mark you as ineffective). Students are "empowered" to demand the grades they want--or else (defame the teacher on the internet). All is FAKE, and making America falling farther, farther behind the rest of the world.
Administrators put pressure on teachers to increase "student success"--or else (mark you as ineffective). Students are "empowered" to demand the grades they want--or else (defame the teacher on the internet). All is FAKE, and making America falling farther, farther behind the rest of the world.
14
Sadly, this is the case.
You are correct!!
"... some business leaders worry that not enough students have the abilities they need for higher skilled jobs at Boeing, Volvo and BMW..."
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
A friend retired 5 years ago from a major car maker after 35 years. He was a 'tool man'; part of a team that made small fixes to vehicles coming off the line that were not "Job One!". Didn't finish H.S. His uncle got him in the plant. Started like everyone else and worked way up to tool man. Retired with full pension and benefits. Lives winters in FL. Comes back when the snow and cold are gone. Net worth? US $1.5 (2 homes paid) + full autoworker pension.
What's the secret sauce? If you have inside pull and health you also can become well-off enough to follow in my friends foot-steps. That may seem like a slight against getting good schooling at a tender age. Quite the opposite. Only those with bountiful inheritance and/or someone to pull strings to land inside a well-paid career in a union shop (at least in the 1960-70s) are set; everyone else, get to the back of bus. So study well to change the game in your favor. A good education is never a bad thing. It can be a life saver if you play your cards well. Forget the the misery and gutter peer group pressure that surrounds you. Stick to the books and homework. Make certain you ask questions if you don't understand things. Then you too can reach for the stars, even if you are not going pro-sports.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
A friend retired 5 years ago from a major car maker after 35 years. He was a 'tool man'; part of a team that made small fixes to vehicles coming off the line that were not "Job One!". Didn't finish H.S. His uncle got him in the plant. Started like everyone else and worked way up to tool man. Retired with full pension and benefits. Lives winters in FL. Comes back when the snow and cold are gone. Net worth? US $1.5 (2 homes paid) + full autoworker pension.
What's the secret sauce? If you have inside pull and health you also can become well-off enough to follow in my friends foot-steps. That may seem like a slight against getting good schooling at a tender age. Quite the opposite. Only those with bountiful inheritance and/or someone to pull strings to land inside a well-paid career in a union shop (at least in the 1960-70s) are set; everyone else, get to the back of bus. So study well to change the game in your favor. A good education is never a bad thing. It can be a life saver if you play your cards well. Forget the the misery and gutter peer group pressure that surrounds you. Stick to the books and homework. Make certain you ask questions if you don't understand things. Then you too can reach for the stars, even if you are not going pro-sports.
10
I do not think that many people even realize the difference between a good private school and public schools. I have had a student in my class who went to Harvard Westlake (a private school in LA). He was the best student performance -wise but never looked overworked while other students constantly complained about the workload. When I asked him about it he replied that the education he received at HW was enough to cast through 3 years at UC Berkeley without any sweat as he has covered most of the material at HW.
16
If it wasn't for spending the first six years of schooling at Catholic schools I don't know where I'd be. The last 6 years I spent at public school were an utter joke in terms of learning.
12
That sounds more like the smartest student than the best school.
But if he was so good, why didn't he take harder courses in college to put himself further ahead? Why coast?
But if he was so good, why didn't he take harder courses in college to put himself further ahead? Why coast?
7
One can certainly find a comparison between a good private school and a bad public school and draw a conclusion from that, but generally speaking, public schools have higher-quality instruction than private schools. People assume they're worse schools because they enroll everybody, not just a select group of kids from families that value education enough to pay a premium for it and are successful enough to foot the bill, with all that implies about stability and parents' education levels. The reality, though, is that with equivalent students, public schools do a better job on average than private schools.
1
And somehow, colleges are expected to magically ameliorate twelve prior years of horrendous non-education, simply by admitting unprepared students and maybe giving them some tutoring here and there. How much longer can we afford this ridiculous pretense, especially when we're faced with more than 1 trillion dollars in student loan debt?
26
So what are young people supposed to do to earn a living? And don't say, "be a plumber." There used to be factory jobs -- lots of them. And you could actually support yourself in a modest way by working full time in a factory. You might even earn a pension. Hard to believe, isn't it?
1
As long as the loans are available. Cheap student loans are a massive disservice to unprepared students. Sure the interest rate is low but if you are paying $40,000 a year for SIX years to get your urban studies degree....
1
ALL of this is a direct result of the involvement of "venture capitalists" like Broad, Gates, the Waltons, TFA, and every hedge fund manager out there in public education.
They sold the lie that "union" teachers were destroying schools and Americans believed them. This is your bed, America. You climbed into it with the Gates, the Waltons, the Broads and TFA.
The millions upon millions of children these people have mowed over in their quest for money have been left behind. Don't act surprised now.
They sold the lie that "union" teachers were destroying schools and Americans believed them. This is your bed, America. You climbed into it with the Gates, the Waltons, the Broads and TFA.
The millions upon millions of children these people have mowed over in their quest for money have been left behind. Don't act surprised now.
27
Strangely, Albert Shanker, the founder of the NYC teachers union said shortly before he died that if he'd known how much damage the union would do to the education system he wouldn't have worked to found it.
I will take Shanker's opinion before anyone else. He watched it happen.
I will take Shanker's opinion before anyone else. He watched it happen.
Shanker said that about charter schools. He wouldn't have said it about teachers' unions because teachers' unions have been, on balance, a positive factor in school quality.
Shanker was right. But you've got to quote him correctly to get any benefit from what he knew.
Shanker was right. But you've got to quote him correctly to get any benefit from what he knew.
Thanks for the correction. I looked it up and you are right.
The United States has completely lost its way in K-12 education.
10
th usa has completely lost its way
Alan
You are making quite a leap based on one NY Times article. I and my wife are both graduates of private college prep schools here in NY. My 2 kids attend public schools here in upstate NY. So far I'm plenty impressed with the quality of the public education that my kids are getting in their elementary school. The much maligned common core guides their curriculum and though tricky for my wife and I to adjust to for parental HW help, the quality of the expectations is high. Maybe it's just different here than in SC or maybe I'm Pollyannish (sp?), but please don't judge the entire U.S. Public education system on an expose of the worst performing state systems.
You are making quite a leap based on one NY Times article. I and my wife are both graduates of private college prep schools here in NY. My 2 kids attend public schools here in upstate NY. So far I'm plenty impressed with the quality of the public education that my kids are getting in their elementary school. The much maligned common core guides their curriculum and though tricky for my wife and I to adjust to for parental HW help, the quality of the expectations is high. Maybe it's just different here than in SC or maybe I'm Pollyannish (sp?), but please don't judge the entire U.S. Public education system on an expose of the worst performing state systems.
TC
My statement is based on much more than one NT Times article. My kid is in public high school in Japan and my statement is based on the ongoing debate in the US over common core, equality in funding and much more. The US has completely lost its way in education.
My statement is based on much more than one NT Times article. My kid is in public high school in Japan and my statement is based on the ongoing debate in the US over common core, equality in funding and much more. The US has completely lost its way in education.
School today is just so much garbage...
It used to be the best and the brightest were well educated. Now, the best and brightest would be well advised to avoid school like the plague.
However, skipping school is not going to work for you if you are average or below. School does raise the level of functioning of people of limited aptitude.
Put bluntly, if you're stupid, you'll need a formal education.
If you're not, look at the alternatives.
What alternatives?
If you have to ask, forget about it...go to class.
It used to be the best and the brightest were well educated. Now, the best and brightest would be well advised to avoid school like the plague.
However, skipping school is not going to work for you if you are average or below. School does raise the level of functioning of people of limited aptitude.
Put bluntly, if you're stupid, you'll need a formal education.
If you're not, look at the alternatives.
What alternatives?
If you have to ask, forget about it...go to class.
13
The Finnish school system uses the same curriculum for all students (which may be one reason why Finnish scores varied so little from school to school).
Students have light homework loads.
Finnish schools do not have classes for gifted students.
Finland uses very little standardized testing.
Children do not start school until age 7.
Finland has a comprehensive preschool program that emphasizes “self-reflection” and socializing, not academics.
Grades are not given until high school, and even then, class rankings are not compiled.
Teachers must have master’s degrees.
Becoming a teacher in Finland is highly competitive. Just 10% of Finnish college graduates are accepted into the teacher training program; as a result, teaching is a high-status profession. (Teacher salaries are similar to teacher salaries in the U.S., however.)
Students are separated into academic and vocational tracks during the last three years of high school. About 50% go into each track.
Diagnostic testing of students is used early and frequently. If a student is in need of extra help, intensive intervention is provided.
Groups of teachers visit each others’ classes to observe their colleagues at work. Teachers also get one afternoon per week for professional development.
School funding is higher for the middle school years, the years when children are most in danger of dropping out.
College is free in Finland.
Students have light homework loads.
Finnish schools do not have classes for gifted students.
Finland uses very little standardized testing.
Children do not start school until age 7.
Finland has a comprehensive preschool program that emphasizes “self-reflection” and socializing, not academics.
Grades are not given until high school, and even then, class rankings are not compiled.
Teachers must have master’s degrees.
Becoming a teacher in Finland is highly competitive. Just 10% of Finnish college graduates are accepted into the teacher training program; as a result, teaching is a high-status profession. (Teacher salaries are similar to teacher salaries in the U.S., however.)
Students are separated into academic and vocational tracks during the last three years of high school. About 50% go into each track.
Diagnostic testing of students is used early and frequently. If a student is in need of extra help, intensive intervention is provided.
Groups of teachers visit each others’ classes to observe their colleagues at work. Teachers also get one afternoon per week for professional development.
School funding is higher for the middle school years, the years when children are most in danger of dropping out.
College is free in Finland.
20
A small culturally homogeneous population is hardly an accurate comparison to the education issues in the United States.
3
Free college -- for those rigorously selected -- would be useful and motivational. This is in stark contrast to what we do, though. We have all manner of colleges for kids who can barely fog a mirror.
4
Enough already with the comparisons to Scandinavia. It's getting dumb.
Finland is a tiny country. The USA is not.
Finland is nearly all white and largely homogenous. The USA is not.
Finland has a population that speaks one language. The USA does not.
Finland has almost no underclass. The USA has a large one.
Finland has a very high tax rate. The USA does not.
And Finland does not not have 50 states who each make up their own laws.
Finland is a tiny country. The USA is not.
Finland is nearly all white and largely homogenous. The USA is not.
Finland has a population that speaks one language. The USA does not.
Finland has almost no underclass. The USA has a large one.
Finland has a very high tax rate. The USA does not.
And Finland does not not have 50 states who each make up their own laws.
29
My dictionary is 40 years old. I went to the bookstore to buy a new one, and was shocked at how minimal the level of the defined words were in a college level dictionay
15
There are two factors that contribute to this gilded achievement; Administrators and popular attitudes toward education.
Administrators do no care about how a student does after high school, which is why they will bend over backwards to facilitate having nearly every student graduate. As long as they have the "data" showing an "improvement" in what they are doing, then all is well. This moral hazard of pushing kids through by getting teachers to, for example, make rubrics that allow students to get at least a C on formative assessments, pressure to give students an inflated grade when they deservingly earn something less but with true and valuable recognition of ability, and allowing counselors, parents, and fellow admins to allow students to take AP/"honors" classes because of the paranoia of feeling that they (the student) will not get to go to college.
Additionally, the culture that students and our society as a whole pushes onto ourselves devalues education as a "means to an end." If a grade is not attached to it/number/anything "valued" by others, then it's either not worth doing or worth doing half way. Sadly, our society cares more about making other believe (the rest of the world) that we are truly caring about education rather than actually taking the time to invest time and capital in our education system to make it what we want it to be, figuratively and literally.
Administrators do no care about how a student does after high school, which is why they will bend over backwards to facilitate having nearly every student graduate. As long as they have the "data" showing an "improvement" in what they are doing, then all is well. This moral hazard of pushing kids through by getting teachers to, for example, make rubrics that allow students to get at least a C on formative assessments, pressure to give students an inflated grade when they deservingly earn something less but with true and valuable recognition of ability, and allowing counselors, parents, and fellow admins to allow students to take AP/"honors" classes because of the paranoia of feeling that they (the student) will not get to go to college.
Additionally, the culture that students and our society as a whole pushes onto ourselves devalues education as a "means to an end." If a grade is not attached to it/number/anything "valued" by others, then it's either not worth doing or worth doing half way. Sadly, our society cares more about making other believe (the rest of the world) that we are truly caring about education rather than actually taking the time to invest time and capital in our education system to make it what we want it to be, figuratively and literally.
8
Improving the graduation rate reminds me of the large metropolitan police department that was being criticized for its increasing crime rate. They "lowered" this within a year. What they failed to mention was the fact the city decriminalized certain minor crimes and made them civil offenses. Problem solved.
17
To those complaining about the college preparedness of the worst college students vs previous generations. A lot of the discrepancy is probably due to the everyone needs to go to college because it's the only path to the middle class attitude (and it's starting to become a fact), which forces a lot of people who would have been happy with a factory or sales job, for both of which good ones are becoming increasingly rare, to at least try college.
9
Such a sad picture. And no doubt a sign of the times. We aspire for so much more for everyone and the truth is that not everyone is good at everything. So we fake it; saying everyone is good to go. They go and fail or fail to go.
We are failing in so many ways. In a op ed piece Mr. Brooks points the the victim mentality that is rising up on College campuses. And to some extent it is probably true that "someone" else is responsible for so many failing in their efforts to rise up and be successful. But ultimately we each have some gifts and the sooner we each for ourselves figure out what that is and develop it and use it effectively, the better off we will be as individuals and collectively as a society.
We are failing in so many ways. In a op ed piece Mr. Brooks points the the victim mentality that is rising up on College campuses. And to some extent it is probably true that "someone" else is responsible for so many failing in their efforts to rise up and be successful. But ultimately we each have some gifts and the sooner we each for ourselves figure out what that is and develop it and use it effectively, the better off we will be as individuals and collectively as a society.
4
After being drafted into the U.S. army in 1957, I was lucky to spend some time in an army classroom teaching recruits how to perform in a paperwork MOS. At first, I was put off by the army methodology. I had grown up in a system wherein a student who had mastered 75% of the content being measured by a test was given a "C" grade and passed on the next test, or the next grade. But in the army, such an outcome meant that the teacher and student went back to work and kept at it until he or she had mastered 100% of the content, and thus was had mastered one more step on the path to mastery of a particular job in a complex organization. At the time, I found it shockingly at odds with just about everything I had bought into as a Liberal Arts major in a selective university. Today, I'm not so sure. "You try, you fail, you correct your mistakes, you get closer to our mutual goal" strikes me as a lot more effective way to set a teen on the path to success than "time for another test that will prove your mediocrity but not force us to "cut you off from the equally muddled classmates you find vital to sustaining your belief that you are all grown up and entitled". In the last analysis, competency counts. Clever and cute walks away sulking.
9
But if a much higher percentage of high school graduates were deemed prepared for college, and then graduated from four year colleges or universities, there wouldn't be enough jobs (aimed at college graduates) for them. We already now have college graduates doing jobs they are overqualified for - coffee shop baristas, restaurant waiters, Target cashiers. Most of the job growth is in the low wage service economy. Where are these better, higher paying jobs the business leaders of South Carolina seem to be referring to, which are supposedly going to go unfilled?
18
Why do you say they're overqualified? These seem like pretty good jobs for illiterate and semi-literate college 'graduates'.
There are plenty of good jobs for college graduates who actually know what college graduates should know. You'd be surprised how many smart and highly skilled people our economy could really absorb....if many such were available.
There are plenty of good jobs for college graduates who actually know what college graduates should know. You'd be surprised how many smart and highly skilled people our economy could really absorb....if many such were available.
2
In my community there's a regional high school that has been censured by the state for poor performance. I've met some of these students (graduates) and they should be returned to elementary school. On the other hand I've watched several students in my neighborhood who went on to college and graduate school. They are all successful and earning six figures. What happened? The difference can be spelled out in two words, "parental involvement". Overall the less involvement by parents the poorer the students grades. It appears we've lost a sense of value in education. We give lip service, but that's all. Now go figure out how to change that.
10
Take a look at Credit Recovery classes, which greatly improve graduation rates but do little to increase student knowledge of content or improve skills. Credit Recovery, teaches students that getting a HS Diploma is about gaming the system not learning.
Very interesting that Melinda Gates had great praise for Common Core increasing graduation rates in Kentucky. She was silent on the big 2015 dip in KY NAEP scores.
So many powers and players are manipulating the system for their benefit.. So sad.
Very interesting that Melinda Gates had great praise for Common Core increasing graduation rates in Kentucky. She was silent on the big 2015 dip in KY NAEP scores.
So many powers and players are manipulating the system for their benefit.. So sad.
6
My daughter attends the same expensive, selective private high school Melinda Gates attended.
Believe me, what Melinda Gates understands about urban public education could fill a square the size of a postage stamp...maybe.
Believe me, what Melinda Gates understands about urban public education could fill a square the size of a postage stamp...maybe.
8
It used to be middle class Anglo idiots who designed our public school curriculum, now it is our upper class idiots who also happen to be arrogant. :)) Ha, ha, ha...
well, in Iowa, the locals are very proud of their high graduation rates for high school. But, increasingly, the IA HS graduates have been poorly educated in basic skills such as writing and mathematics. i know this to be true because I get to teach them after they graduate from high school. Of course, there are always a few "gems" in a given class, but they are truly the 'diamonds in the rough'. for too many, I watch, and wonder what went on at their high school.
9
What bothers me is that people believe low standards aren't intended. They are. The fact is that the poorer the student, the more money it takes to achieve academic excellence. As public school students have gotten browner, America has gotten cheaper. We are paying for exactly the education we are getting.
4
From a jobs perspective this has been going on for a long time. If you look at the kind of jobs you can get with a high school diploma now vs what you could get 30 years ago its not even close. This isn't all the fault of bad secondary education as more people go to college companies started requiring or strongly favoring degrees for jobs that didn't used to require them, which is it's own issue, but a lot of the trade classes that less than ideal academic students can succeed at are now gone.
Of course, it's interesting hearing companies complain about the readiness of US workers when they are all busy trying to get congress to increase immigration to further decrease the skilled labor positions available for US workers and use current programs like h1b visas to get the US workers they complain about so much to train the foreigners taking their jobs.
Of course, it's interesting hearing companies complain about the readiness of US workers when they are all busy trying to get congress to increase immigration to further decrease the skilled labor positions available for US workers and use current programs like h1b visas to get the US workers they complain about so much to train the foreigners taking their jobs.
14
All of this talk about standards and diplomas mean absolutely nothing. If there are no WORTHWHILE jobs waiting for these graduates in the U.S. economy, what is the point?
7
As the saying goes, you get what you pay for. Sadly, as a nation, we are not willing to pay much for education. We have no problem approving expenditures of $300 million plus for a single mitary aircraft!! but spend money on quality educators or class sizes less than 30-40, forget it. Remember this come next November. Please!! No, I'm not a teacher, nor am I involved in the education industry.
17
For K-12 education, we spend about twice as much per student as any other country. Our problem is results, not spending.
6
The F-35 turkey-jet is only $250 million a plane...that's why it can't fly at night or in the rain.
4
Turns out, your general reference is correct, but exaggerated. It seems we do spend more but not twice as much as far as I can tell. Makes one wonder though.
The fact is that education is an investment most states don't want to make. Until it becomes a priority, kids from poor areas will not be prepared to work towards a nice and secure life. It takes money and not gimmicks or false promises. The current Republican party has worked hard to keep the poor down. This is not a slogan but the truth. Look at school funding in Kansas - its a disgrace. The battle between the state supreme court and the Republican governor and legislature is only one example of the interests of today's Republican party. There was a time when both parties believed education was a national resource, but that was long ago. There was a time when California and NY both offered residents free college educations and both states boomed, but that was long ago.
We need to put our nation's kids ahead of low taxes or else we will be an also ran in this 21st century.
We need to put our nation's kids ahead of low taxes or else we will be an also ran in this 21st century.
13
former senator Moynihan warned years ago of the dumbing down of america.
colleges have become dumping grounds. it is extended childhoods for students who should never been admitted to college in the first place. higher graduation rates are useful for teachers in unionized cities to demand higher wages. to pay a teacher with 12 years experience in nyc 80k + extensive benefits is a complete waste of money. the truth being that education in the US, below the college level, is an highly expensive baby sitting service. as one reader mentioned expenditure per student has risen inflation adjusted 3X since the 70's. the nation has gotten nothing in return except millennials who are unequipped for skilled work undisciplined and are stay at home adults and never quite grownup children.
colleges have become dumping grounds. it is extended childhoods for students who should never been admitted to college in the first place. higher graduation rates are useful for teachers in unionized cities to demand higher wages. to pay a teacher with 12 years experience in nyc 80k + extensive benefits is a complete waste of money. the truth being that education in the US, below the college level, is an highly expensive baby sitting service. as one reader mentioned expenditure per student has risen inflation adjusted 3X since the 70's. the nation has gotten nothing in return except millennials who are unequipped for skilled work undisciplined and are stay at home adults and never quite grownup children.
7
Unionized school districts generally have higher reading and math scores than districts with weak or no unions. So can take your theory and well, you know. So tell us how you would recruit better teachers with lower salaries.
Here's the problem.. School districts pay "experts" who have never taught a day in their lives to tell teachers with 30 years experience how to teach. Can you imagine hospitals paying experts who have never operated on a person telling experienced surgeons how to operate?
Here's the problem.. School districts pay "experts" who have never taught a day in their lives to tell teachers with 30 years experience how to teach. Can you imagine hospitals paying experts who have never operated on a person telling experienced surgeons how to operate?
12
Teachers are worth far more than we pay them (you compare them to babysitters, but teachers are actually paid less on a per-child basis), and unions are a positive force in education quality, not a negative one. You're very misinformed.
4
The same dumbing down and political correctness policies are happening in medical schools these days as well. Didn't I just read an article in the NYT where there is now consideration of allowing medical school graduates who cannot pass their medical examinations for licensure now be allowed to practice medicine? Just think what that will bring us.
9
As a teacher in an urban high school, it seems that the "data" reigns supreme rather than the students' actual ability to be college ready. It's a sham...I have lost count of all the student who have come back to visit me defeated by the work load college entails. With countless chances to pass high school classes, and the pressure on teachers to pass their students, what does this say about the state of education????? The frustration of the students is matched by their teachers' dilemma in passing unworthy kids just to maintain their "highly effective" ratings on their evals. It has nothing to do with education...it's all about the numbers now...
18
I have been teaching at a flagship public university in the US for the last 6 years.
We have been told to increase 4-year graduation rates from below 50% to above 75% in the next five years. If not public funding will be cut further (it is currently at 13%!). We have no control on the quality of the incoming class due to the 10% rule which makes up most of our admissions. Given that the majority of kids is not ready for college the standards will slip even further.
I think the only thing that would fix the miserable high school education in the US is if all desirable universities would hold their own entry exams. In particular in the STEM subjects most Professors would find it relatively easy to agree on the minimum entry standards: basic calculus, physics and chemistry. This would set relatively uniform standard across the nation that schools have to teach to.
We have been told to increase 4-year graduation rates from below 50% to above 75% in the next five years. If not public funding will be cut further (it is currently at 13%!). We have no control on the quality of the incoming class due to the 10% rule which makes up most of our admissions. Given that the majority of kids is not ready for college the standards will slip even further.
I think the only thing that would fix the miserable high school education in the US is if all desirable universities would hold their own entry exams. In particular in the STEM subjects most Professors would find it relatively easy to agree on the minimum entry standards: basic calculus, physics and chemistry. This would set relatively uniform standard across the nation that schools have to teach to.
18
High schools are given the same wrongheaded dictate you are: increase graduation rates. They're just as unable as you are to control the quality of student who walks in the door, so that means the same thing to them that it does to you: lower standards.
The answer isn't to blame the high schools. It's to accept that it's the student's fault, not the teacher's, when the student doesn't do enough work to pass.
The answer isn't to blame the high schools. It's to accept that it's the student's fault, not the teacher's, when the student doesn't do enough work to pass.
3
I've heard we plan to adopt the Texas approach when we select our next Olympic team. The top 10% of the sprinters, swimmers, pole vaulters, skiers, etc. from each school will be given an automatic spot on the team.
1
America's academic "struggles" is likely a reflection of how "cool" it is to learn and be intelligent in American primary schools. When I was in primary school there was great peer pressure, particularly among the boys to literally be stupid so as to avoid being vilified as a nerd. This kind of pressure may be mitigated today somewhat as computer geekiness is a clear path to future wealth. But in any case, other cultures and societies do not stigmatize intelligence as America does. But perhaps this is just a long cooling off period from the Age of Enlightenment, when being a learned, intelligent, polymath was literally cool. Don't misunderstand, it's still cool among a certain percentage of Americans, just not broadly across the culture. If it's a cyclical trend, perhaps we'll see education's woes eventually solved by a shift is societal perceptions and priorities from, let's say sports, to reading books, from shooting guns to learning the physics of ballistics.
6
"But 'the goal is not just high school graduation,' Arne Duncan, the departing secretary of education, said in a telephone interview. 'The goal is being truly college and career ready.''
No, that is the problem itself: the goal is not a graduation. The goal is, or at least ought be, an education. Perhaps that is what Duncan implies, but the current lack of proper educational standards results in a glut of college degree holders who are simply not "career ready." One must battle the mistaken belief that everyone is *entitled* to a degree. There is no guarantee, and there should never be such a guarantee. Everyone can give it his or her best shot to *earn* a degree, certainly, but like it or not, Mother Nature (god, DNA, or what have you) has shown us to all be different. We all have strengths and weaknesses, abilities and lack thereof. And there is absolutely nothing wrong with that.
Suffice it to say that if a high school diploma was and still is considered a measure of an individual's educational excellence, important for the individual to function at a societal standard, then the undergraduate degree is now that measure. Something is quite wrong with K-12.
No, that is the problem itself: the goal is not a graduation. The goal is, or at least ought be, an education. Perhaps that is what Duncan implies, but the current lack of proper educational standards results in a glut of college degree holders who are simply not "career ready." One must battle the mistaken belief that everyone is *entitled* to a degree. There is no guarantee, and there should never be such a guarantee. Everyone can give it his or her best shot to *earn* a degree, certainly, but like it or not, Mother Nature (god, DNA, or what have you) has shown us to all be different. We all have strengths and weaknesses, abilities and lack thereof. And there is absolutely nothing wrong with that.
Suffice it to say that if a high school diploma was and still is considered a measure of an individual's educational excellence, important for the individual to function at a societal standard, then the undergraduate degree is now that measure. Something is quite wrong with K-12.
3
I often wonder if AP courses are what our courses were decades ago. I'm amazed that we could learn better in classes of 45 with little equipment and no social workers or other ancillary staff.
15
Sadly, my friends who grade AP exams tell me that even those don't measure much in the way of knowledge or skills anymore. The rubric they're forced to grade to is a highly specific formula that kids are taught to write to. The end result is nonsensical essays that check the rubric boxes but show no critical thinking or understanding of the material. Graders must hold their noses and pass them anyways. Sad, but even AP isn't necessarily a quality education anymore.
And in this same newspaper, we find out that American born white parents are complaining that their schools are too challenging, that their students are pushed too hard and are feeling a little verklempt, stressed even, and that the curriculum literally needs to be dumbed down... well, and we wonder why our students can't read, can't handle criticism, and can't self-direct their way out of a paper bag. IT'S BECAUSE OF THE PARENTS. This is not the fault of teachers, administrators, legislators, Democrats, or Republicans. There are adequate resources in all but the most dysfunctional districts for motivated parents and students to be college and career ready - witness the achievement of many Asian and Haitian and Nigerian immigrant children, and not always in the best public schools. No, this is a message of mediocrity and overprotection from the parents to their children and it bodes very poorly for the future of our country.
35
The situation was bad there even iduring the period 2008 to 2012 when we were there. I know from first hand since I interacted with a number of students in New York at that time. The reason for this is that the will to learn is lacking.
Simple things such as paying attention to teachers, giving top priority to studies, practicing regularly, doing additions, subtractions, multiplications and divisions manually and concentrating on basics are not all implemented by the students. So nothing much can be expected from them.
Simple things such as paying attention to teachers, giving top priority to studies, practicing regularly, doing additions, subtractions, multiplications and divisions manually and concentrating on basics are not all implemented by the students. So nothing much can be expected from them.
12
This is exactly the problem. Anyone who says otherwise is in denial or has never set foot in a 21st century classroom. This generation of students do not care to learn and are not being held accountable at home.
6
I deplore the worsening of standards. High School diplomas rarely are a sign of any intellectual merit. There was a time when high school students studied Greek and Latin and trig. Now, they peruse an eviscerated range of subjects, generally don't acquire mastery of a foreign tongue, know nothing of history (They study this mish mash called social studies and can't find most nations on a map), and are sometimes even sluggish in arithmetic.
Also a college diploma doesn't mean that much any more either. Standards have been so watered down that graduation does not signify much of any thing.
Among other things, this HARMS students who did achieve and who did learn a lot. Their worth is often obscured because so many of their peers, who know nothing, also possess a diploma.
Also a college diploma doesn't mean that much any more either. Standards have been so watered down that graduation does not signify much of any thing.
Among other things, this HARMS students who did achieve and who did learn a lot. Their worth is often obscured because so many of their peers, who know nothing, also possess a diploma.
17
As all teachers in the NYC system knows, the value of a diploma has decreased over the past several years. Various ways have been used to inflate grades including allowing students to earn credit for failed courses with little effort (euphemistically called credit recovery) and, my favorite, "test corrections" (students who have done poorly on a test, take it again and receive credit for correct answers). If teachers fail over a certain percentage of students, they are called into administrators' offices to explain why. "Strict" are culled out as quickly as possible. Many teachers have received disciplinary letters if they report students cheating on exams. If students do not complete their homework, teachers are asked to provide unlimited time for students to complete their work. In addition, most students copy others' homework; this is also done during classes by using pictures of homework on students' phones. The level of cheating using cell phones, etc. must be high as well.
In addition, new pedagogical methods may be adding to the problem of unprepared students. Making colorful posters in academic high schools is popular. Bulletin boards decide whether or not a school is rated highly. Pushing group work as the ideal method prohibits students from being able to work individually. Strict enforcement of the Danielson method has become absurd and incomprehensible to most teachers.
In addition, new pedagogical methods may be adding to the problem of unprepared students. Making colorful posters in academic high schools is popular. Bulletin boards decide whether or not a school is rated highly. Pushing group work as the ideal method prohibits students from being able to work individually. Strict enforcement of the Danielson method has become absurd and incomprehensible to most teachers.
12
Yes, bulletin boards are the most important things in a school. I have seen assistant principals going around a school many times, critiquing bulletin boards with a clipboard to be used later in evaluating a teacher. Imagine that... a $130,000/year bulletin board critic.
10
If you don't like the results, change the metrics.
Ask almost anyone running a business these days if it is getting easier or more difficult to hire new graduates who are educated and competent.
Who is really getting short-changed here? (List all that apply).
Ask almost anyone running a business these days if it is getting easier or more difficult to hire new graduates who are educated and competent.
Who is really getting short-changed here? (List all that apply).
3
Not surprising, the Obama administration has come down hard on school districts for the disparate discipline between black students & everyone else. Evidently according to the Obama administration this disparity is proof positive of vicious discrimination. So school districts are desperate to bring down their suspension rates. So now they are implementing restorative justice and the suspension rates are coming down. Of course the behavior of the students haven't changed and now that they know punishment is rare schools have become more disruptive.
I suspect it's the same thing for HS diplomas reduce standards and almost everyone passes. The dreaded achievement gap disappears.
I suspect it's the same thing for HS diplomas reduce standards and almost everyone passes. The dreaded achievement gap disappears.
8
It would appear that it is not politically correct to even admit that such a thing as an achievement gap even exists.
8
The story is no different in India, very sad state of affairs indeed.
4
What is also sad is how unaware some people seem to be about their total inability to write. Anyone can have a blog nowadays. I know of one well-followed blog, which I won't name, whose author, a teacher (albeit of music) does not know the difference between than and then or proper use of the apostrophe. One of her most widely read blog posts spells torture as TORCHER. I kid you not! Then there are the absolutely horrible memoirs by celebrities, many of whom cannot articulate an idea without the use of profanity or triple exclamation points. Shameful.
10
The majority of high school students are ill-prepared for the rigor of the better university programs. The school districts themselves are a factor, but it appears the fact that too many high school teachers are teaching to a test, represent a greater challenge.
It isn't getting any better. This is a well known fact for those of us who have to deal with these issues.
It isn't getting any better. This is a well known fact for those of us who have to deal with these issues.
6
This happened to me in the early nineties. I was an A student in a college prep curriculum, so I believed I was prepared for college. I was in for a rude awakening when it turned out my rural school in no way prepared me for a rigorous engineering curriculum. I was horrified when I was put into what amounted to a remedial pre-calculus class that set me back an entire year because calculus was a necessary pre-req for many of my other classes. It took forever but I muddled through and last year I decided to go back to college for a second STEM degree. My parents really valued education and would have helped me prepare, but they simply didn't know. And I was a student who was highly motivated and loved math (I even used to go to math competitions in junior high!) If I wasn't, I wouldn't have stood a chance. By all accounts from my friends who have children in that school district, it has declined considerably in the many years since. Even the best of those students have no idea what they're going to be up against.
4
I believe by far the most important way to improve student outcomes is to have good, well supported, teachers. Unfortunately, the only things less stringent than high school graduation requirements are teacher ed graduation requirements, and the result is many teachers who are unexceptional at best. Most of us are products of public schools can and recall many poor teachers, some of whom became teachers so they could coach or have summers off. We need more good (well compensated) teachers. Improving teacher ed programs and making them much more stringent, including eliminating many poor programs, is the most attainable and fundamental way to improve our public schools.
90
I believe that the most important way is to make/teach young people to love learning. They will learn only if they like it.
2
The most critical issue is PARENTS who read to their children from infancy and turn OFF the TV, engage their children in conversations that require reflection and SET LIMITS for the use of electronic devices (especially for vacuous war games). Homes should have books and children should be encouraged to use libraries.
Teachers have large classes and can't make up for the lost years of quality childhood exchanges that should have taken place in families.
Teachers have large classes and can't make up for the lost years of quality childhood exchanges that should have taken place in families.
1
School factors including teachers quality are only a minor factor in student academic performance. The main factor is the students' culture and family attitude towards education. The children of poor, non-english speaking Jewish immigrants who came to America at the end of the 19TH century and the beginning of the 20TH century did extremely well in school. The children of poor, non-english speaking children of Indian, Korean and Chinese immigrants have also done extremely well in school.
The way to improve education in the United States is to try to reverse the anti-intellectual attitude of a large percentage of the American people.
The way to improve education in the United States is to try to reverse the anti-intellectual attitude of a large percentage of the American people.
3
This would not be such a worrisome problem if the U.S. had more diversity of job opportunities. When our educational leaders envision everyone as an "information worker" then the collision between ability and the demands of the job are inevitable. The severity of the discrepancy is amplified by the manipulation of standards at the high school level. It solves the high school's problem of meeting the demands of the regulatory authorities to which it is responsible; but it does nothing for the societal problem of a highly skewed set of work opportunities.
Were we bold enough to make living-wage manufacturing job opportunities a reality, then standards could be returned to whatever is required to support realistic university entrance competency.
Were we bold enough to make living-wage manufacturing job opportunities a reality, then standards could be returned to whatever is required to support realistic university entrance competency.
103
But until recently, Asian workers could do those jobs for 20% of the wages of an American worker. When jobs return and are mechanized, employers cannot find workers prepared for that work. During the Recession, The NYTimes had many stories of Employers unable to hire workers to operate their machines; not enough math & reasoning skills to adjust the machines.
When will we educate the 70% of American kids who are NOT ready or able to do College work, especially in Math & Science? Tell the Community Colleges to upgrade & repair their inadequate education skills they don't have? Many of these students resent the workload & requirements.
Employers will continue to hire Asians immigrants to fill technical jobs, while mahy White & Black Americans become peons due to lack of skills.
When will we educate the 70% of American kids who are NOT ready or able to do College work, especially in Math & Science? Tell the Community Colleges to upgrade & repair their inadequate education skills they don't have? Many of these students resent the workload & requirements.
Employers will continue to hire Asians immigrants to fill technical jobs, while mahy White & Black Americans become peons due to lack of skills.
Germany is "bold enough to make living-wage manufacturing job opportunities a reality..." I taught there for a short spell. Its educational system is ruthless, demanding and unforgiving. Germany has a large pool of highly-skilled well-educated workers able to make complex valuable manufactured goods, including industrial chemicals, a sector in which Germany has global dominance. German workers command high wages because their labor is valuable. You can raise minimum wages and pass laws from now until the crack of doom and you won't help working class Americans. There is no royal road. Back to basics.
1
Alan, I so agree with you! The travesty is not that only a percentage of students are really college "material", the travesty is that so many jobs that are essential to our society's functioning (service, manufacturing, health care, to name just a few) do not pay a living wage and don't ensure a decent living.
The article complains that only 1 in 14 students at the high school it studied was ready for college level math but then states that all 11th graders in this school are given calculus problems to solve. Since when has calculus been the standard for 11th graders? I don't believe that even one from every 14 11th graders were ever ready to master calculus. If we want students to do well, we need to teach them starting from where they are. If they don't understand multiplication and division, we can teach them fractions forever and they won't make progress. But, if we backu up and teach them the foundation skills they need to take the next step forward, they will finally move forward. Defining high expectations as taking high level classes encourages superficial knowledge that camouflages buzz words for understanding.
11
If students know they can refuse to learn multiplication and division while still being passed from grade to grade and eventually awarded a diploma, there are some areas where they'll do precisely that. And if enough do that, the school staff, knowing that policy holds them, not the students, responsible for failure rates, will pass them along rather than be fired for not doing so.
Teachers are teaching the kids where they're at. They're up against a society that doesn't trust or support them and a culture that, too often, celebrates ignorance and disdains education. Unless we give power back to the teachers, this won't be solved. It doesn't matter whether you're teaching basic addition or calculus to a kid who's fallen asleep on his desk with his headphones on because he doesn't care.
Teachers are teaching the kids where they're at. They're up against a society that doesn't trust or support them and a culture that, too often, celebrates ignorance and disdains education. Unless we give power back to the teachers, this won't be solved. It doesn't matter whether you're teaching basic addition or calculus to a kid who's fallen asleep on his desk with his headphones on because he doesn't care.
11
"If students know they can refuse to learn multiplication and division while still being passed from grade to grade and eventually awarded a diploma, there are some areas where they'll do precisely that."
Not with the right teacher. My younger son's 3rd grade math/science teacher had kids giving up recess to "compete" on timed multiplication tests. He's one of those that makes clear the distinction between "lecture" and "teach".
...Andrew
Not with the right teacher. My younger son's 3rd grade math/science teacher had kids giving up recess to "compete" on timed multiplication tests. He's one of those that makes clear the distinction between "lecture" and "teach".
...Andrew
Oh, if only all teachers were superhumans willing to do the impossible for almost no pay.
Yes, even with the right teacher. With some kids, it doesn't matter how spectacular the teacher is; they're primed to resist education long before they walk in the school door. And those kids often clump geographically.
Yes, even with the right teacher. With some kids, it doesn't matter how spectacular the teacher is; they're primed to resist education long before they walk in the school door. And those kids often clump geographically.
1
San Marino Unified School District boasts of the highest test scores and more students performing at or above their grade level. Yet, sadly, more graduates head to 2 year community colleges than MIT, Caltech, Stanford and all the ivy league colleges combined. Counselors say the cause is the students' indecision. Isn't it the job of a real college counselor to help the students find and decide on their college/career path? It is never the school's or the administrators' fault.
3
It isn't "indecision"!
California's Community Colleges are marketed to kids, as early as middle school, as the smart, FIRST choice for college. Every kid knows the CC's have no entrance requirements. It doesn't matter what courses a kid takes, what grades they get, whether they even pass. Community College is out there. So, some kids go into high school, figuring they will go to the CC, and just blow off high school, knowing the CC's don't care. Or, they hit a rough patch in high school and decide they don't need to get back on track. They'll just go to CC.
High schools encourage this because they report to the community that X% of their graduates are going on to college. They don't report what percent go on to Community College, much less what percent go, then drop out because they are so badly prepared.
The California Community Colleges are what lawyers refer to as an "attractive nuisance". It is disgraceful how many kids come out of the best school districts in California and go on to the local CC.
California's Community Colleges are marketed to kids, as early as middle school, as the smart, FIRST choice for college. Every kid knows the CC's have no entrance requirements. It doesn't matter what courses a kid takes, what grades they get, whether they even pass. Community College is out there. So, some kids go into high school, figuring they will go to the CC, and just blow off high school, knowing the CC's don't care. Or, they hit a rough patch in high school and decide they don't need to get back on track. They'll just go to CC.
High schools encourage this because they report to the community that X% of their graduates are going on to college. They don't report what percent go on to Community College, much less what percent go, then drop out because they are so badly prepared.
The California Community Colleges are what lawyers refer to as an "attractive nuisance". It is disgraceful how many kids come out of the best school districts in California and go on to the local CC.
4
And then, these kids often transfer to the University of California, having half the student debt upon graduating! And it's the same BS/BA/BFA as going all four years -
The nerve! The disgrace! That a Californian would use a public institution for their own advancement!
The nerve! The disgrace! That a Californian would use a public institution for their own advancement!
3
The stats on this happening are truly terrible. You should look. You have swallowed the mythology. There have been at least three major studies done in the last 5 years showing that the majority of community college students don't transfer or get a degree in six years. Why? Because they are terribly prepared in K-12 as any CC professor will readily tell you.
Quite surprising....just under 40% of ALL grads 2014 not math/reading reader for college-bound..
.WHY don't we aim for/evaluate German system of 2 yr. degrees, apprenticeships that for ex. with the growing green economy, with further labor/manu. re-structuring overall, certainly needed in labor, though, could SUCCESSFULLY absorb, while keeping the U.S. in lock step in being more service driven, not factory in the coming years/decades...
WHY..because like it seems to infer in comments/the article...college and HS is a BUSINESS...and the real intellect, drive, critical thinking is not as leveraged, nurtured even with curiousity, not delved deeply into...unless your in upper affluent/rich suburbs/cities...of course, poor and middle class do have opps., but not nearly like it was pre-90's...
There should be an article on Germany's successess/and lack of, with their 2 yr degree/apprenticeship programs, I've read them, and quality of output, satisfaction for employees/employers, seem from a wide standpoint, not niche like in finance sector, quite practical and efficient.
.WHY don't we aim for/evaluate German system of 2 yr. degrees, apprenticeships that for ex. with the growing green economy, with further labor/manu. re-structuring overall, certainly needed in labor, though, could SUCCESSFULLY absorb, while keeping the U.S. in lock step in being more service driven, not factory in the coming years/decades...
WHY..because like it seems to infer in comments/the article...college and HS is a BUSINESS...and the real intellect, drive, critical thinking is not as leveraged, nurtured even with curiousity, not delved deeply into...unless your in upper affluent/rich suburbs/cities...of course, poor and middle class do have opps., but not nearly like it was pre-90's...
There should be an article on Germany's successess/and lack of, with their 2 yr degree/apprenticeship programs, I've read them, and quality of output, satisfaction for employees/employers, seem from a wide standpoint, not niche like in finance sector, quite practical and efficient.
14
A comment about educational quality written like this one is written does not invite the reader to place much weight in what it says.
6
I've been teaching high school for over 30 years, and have been through a multitude of "reforms" designed to enhance student learning and teacher effectiveness. I have come to the conclusion that our schools try way too many of these skills based programs to the detriment of content. Content, pure and simple should be the driving force. Educating oneself is hard work and not always fun, yet we have been told that "learning should be fun", that it's the teacher's fault when kids fail, and the biggest lie of all, that all kids can be scholars and worthy of a college education. So what we get are high school graduates who are akin to 5th graders of a century ago when it comes to reading and writing skills, and college graduates who are much like high school graduates of the past. While there are some schools in which academics are rigorous, the majority are mediocre. The exchange students who attend the school where I teach, and who come from all parts of the world, are often surprised at how easy school is here and often do better even in the so called A.P. courses than their native English speaking classmates!
87
"learning should be fun"
Sara, you said it all.
What we get is everyone having fun.
Nobody learning.
Sara, you said it all.
What we get is everyone having fun.
Nobody learning.
4
I work with plenty of foreign born and raised folks (who knows how they were educated) making over $185,000 a year working for the Federal Government, and they cannot write proper English.
No one cares.
No one cares.
5
As part of Y2K remediation I worked with a group of Jewish Russian expatriates. They all mentioned that college in the US was the equivalent of high school in the old Soviet Union.
2
As the great Bob Dylan wrote in a song, "...there's no success like failure, and...failure's no success at all."
1
This is very scary in the respect that it will be 10-20 years before we have the slightest idea what societal effect this may have. The future may be bright, or not, but this is exactly why trivializing eduction or waiting for the next person to solve the problem is not a good thing.
I use the example of the Bloomberg administration to show how a child can spend their entire education from kindergarten through high school within the terms of a single politician and how that politician can have outsized influence on whether or not that child succeeds or fails.
I use the example of the Bloomberg administration to show how a child can spend their entire education from kindergarten through high school within the terms of a single politician and how that politician can have outsized influence on whether or not that child succeeds or fails.
6
I spent the entire beginning of my career under Bloomberg / Klein. They succeeded in disenfranchising teachers by empowering principals who graduated more students in turn, getting rid of teachers who did not pass enough students. It was all about graduation rates and teachers who passed more students were invited to the Leadership Academy, a free principal training program, while the teachers who had integrity were stepped over and ground down in the process.
I would think that if we have 80,000 teachers in the city, it may be time to start listening to them and using their skills and senses to improve the way we educate our students. Teachers have been under tremendous pressure in NYC for a very long time and most would like to help their students improve their skills instead of graduating with a meaningless diploma that only shows how the administrators game the system.
Teachers need to be given confidence that they can work on changing the system for the good while not being attacked for their ideas and principles.
I don't know if that kind of change is possible within the power structure of the New York City DOE. Superintendents are very comfortable in keeping the status quo. Why work harder when you can come in punch the clock every day for $150,000 or more?
I would think that if we have 80,000 teachers in the city, it may be time to start listening to them and using their skills and senses to improve the way we educate our students. Teachers have been under tremendous pressure in NYC for a very long time and most would like to help their students improve their skills instead of graduating with a meaningless diploma that only shows how the administrators game the system.
Teachers need to be given confidence that they can work on changing the system for the good while not being attacked for their ideas and principles.
I don't know if that kind of change is possible within the power structure of the New York City DOE. Superintendents are very comfortable in keeping the status quo. Why work harder when you can come in punch the clock every day for $150,000 or more?
9
BINGO!! Bloomberg/Klein destroyed the NYC system. They put in principals who had at most 2 or 3 years teaching experience if they had any at all. They came into schools and of course knew more than veteran teachers and assistant principals. They knew everything. When a teacher complained that what they were asked to do was impossible (from experience) he would ask the principal to show them how to do it. That is a principal's job, but I know of one case where the principal refused. Of course he did because he knew it was impossible.
7
Access does not equal success.
2
It does not matter one little bit if students graduate or not, if they are "college prepped" or not, or if they can read or write or compute.
You see, we have determined and decreed that the "minimum wage," what used to be paid those with absolutely no skills or value to offer the employer aside from being above room temperature, has been transformed into a "living wage" providing $ 30K a year "disirregardless" of ability, talent, or worth.
Ignorance is bliss.
You see, we have determined and decreed that the "minimum wage," what used to be paid those with absolutely no skills or value to offer the employer aside from being above room temperature, has been transformed into a "living wage" providing $ 30K a year "disirregardless" of ability, talent, or worth.
Ignorance is bliss.
5
Disirregardless is not a word. Regardless.
4
C'mon Ace even the Matrix provides room, board, and plenty of entertainment for being above room temperature surely US corporations can do better.
This article mentioned several big name companies like BMW and Volvo that have factories here. Sounds great, right? Truth be told, they are a rarity in communities accros the country. About as abundant as a four-leaf clover. There are almost no factory jobs availabe in the U.S. By and large, they have been shipped overseas. So our high school graduates who don't go to graduate from college don't get to apply for respectable factory jobs with benefits and retirement anymore. Hence, all year millions of grown men with families have be asking for raises at their fast food restaurants. The fast food industry is the nation's largest employer in 2015. Now think about that. And all these people want to talk about is how a high school diploma is too easy to get. Well, give the kids a skill. When the diploma comes with a certification, then we can have a conversation about what high schools are doing right and wrong. And keep in mind, only about 20% of the country actually completed college. So what are preparing the other 80% to with their lives? I'll tell you: they are in big cities and small towns saying, "Welcome to Mcdonalds, how may I help you?" Or "Welcome to Walmart!"
20
When this article says, in repeated cases, that graduation rates are going up while the actual preparedness is going down, that is an indication of fraud in the system.
Where one thinks the fraud lies, tells a lot about what one thinks is possible with both teaching, and the nature of raw human intelligence spread across a population.
Be careful with your assumptions; there are people's lives at stake.
Where one thinks the fraud lies, tells a lot about what one thinks is possible with both teaching, and the nature of raw human intelligence spread across a population.
Be careful with your assumptions; there are people's lives at stake.
3
This article proves the idiocy of free junior college for all, as the left is trying to push. Some people are just flat out not college material. The majority of junior college students require remedial classes to gain admittance to regular junior college classes, and the majority of those students in the remedial classes are unable to pass them.
16
Free junior college does not mean that everyone gets in. There would still be minimum standards for admission: a high school diploma or a GED.
...except that the left (which is in the right on this issue, as usual) isn't so much pushing college "for all" as they are saying that your intellectual ability should be what determines whether you can go or not, rather than your family's ability to pay.
5
California's Community College system, 112 campuses, enrolling fully 25% of all the Community College students in the country, have zero, absolutely no entrance requirements. It doesn't matter what courses a kid took in high school, what grades they got, whether they even passed. A high school degree isn't even a pre-requisite.
1
Astonishing story.
Who in the world ever thought a high school diploma signifies education? For 30 years we have made the careers of countless educators and school board members depend on that metric. Is it any surprise that people actually produce the results you pay them for?
Who in the world ever thought a high school diploma signifies education? For 30 years we have made the careers of countless educators and school board members depend on that metric. Is it any surprise that people actually produce the results you pay them for?
3
This is so sad, but it comes as no surprise. I'm sure school administrators and teachers are padding each other's shoulders for a job well done, with much improved high school graduation rate. Fact of the matter is, they fail these students who are most in need of help. All sorts of reasons were thrown around in stiff opposition against the test requirements of No Child Left Behind, but mainly teachers' unions (and curiously, parents alike) insist that the teaching part must be their decision, and their decision alone, with no oversight. What ends up happening, is the graduation simply becoming just another formality to get the kids out of the school, and they'll become someone else's (and the society's) problem for they cannot keep up or find a job.
If there's no across-the-board standardized tests to gauge what students have truly learnt (or not learnt), how can we ever be sure what they are up to? Why is it it's not ok to test kids in school, and then SUDDENLY when they get to college admission, those same parents would think the use of standardized tests demanded by colleges is perfectly fine? To say these same parents are naive and idiotic, is to put it too mildly.
Put it another way, would we rather demand teachers teach kids to perform in test so that at least kids can read and write at grade level, or would we rather not know about it at all until AFTER kids are graduated from high school that they can't even perform rudimentary math or reading?
If there's no across-the-board standardized tests to gauge what students have truly learnt (or not learnt), how can we ever be sure what they are up to? Why is it it's not ok to test kids in school, and then SUDDENLY when they get to college admission, those same parents would think the use of standardized tests demanded by colleges is perfectly fine? To say these same parents are naive and idiotic, is to put it too mildly.
Put it another way, would we rather demand teachers teach kids to perform in test so that at least kids can read and write at grade level, or would we rather not know about it at all until AFTER kids are graduated from high school that they can't even perform rudimentary math or reading?
3
We had more than enough testing before NCLB to fulfill any of the actual, legitimate purposes testing can actually do. NCLB's insistence that student apathy is the teachers' fault is partially the CAUSE of the problems you're describing, not an antidote to them.
Another cause is that education and testing are complicated, but too many people with no understanding of them nonetheless feel qualified to pass judgement, making ridiculous proclamations that NCLB wasn't a miserable failure or that teachers' unions' objections were self-serving without the slightest idea of what they're actually talking about.
Another cause is that education and testing are complicated, but too many people with no understanding of them nonetheless feel qualified to pass judgement, making ridiculous proclamations that NCLB wasn't a miserable failure or that teachers' unions' objections were self-serving without the slightest idea of what they're actually talking about.
5
@Eric, I bet you're a staunch support of the teachers' union too, what with all those same-old non-arguments.
Everyone who values and understands education supports the teachers' unions. Those who bash the unions do so out of ulterior motives or ignorance, always.
No wonder parents with means and understanding that lowering standards can't be good for their kids in the long run are moving away from Public schools to the Charter and Private ones.
14
I'm sorry, Jon. Someone in your school failed to inform you as to how to avoid a run-on sentence. Further, your misuse of capitalization is indicative of the truism that you (believe it or not) implied. Was it a "Private," "Public" or "Charter" school that led you astray? Nevertheless, we, the loyal readers, are at the ready to assist.
Your friend in grammar,
Christine
Your friend in grammar,
Christine
1
Charter schools, don't get me started! If we have problems in our school systems, which we do, fix them by whatever means. Creating a second school system with plant, maintenance and salaries is ludicrous! Just another privatization boondoggle.
5
Public schools are almost always superior to nearby private or charter schools. These problems aren't distributed evenly, and where they exist in public schools, they're usually even worse in nearby alternatives.
The myth that parents are leaving the publics because quality is higher elsewhere is popular and supported by lots of money, but it's a myth.
The myth that parents are leaving the publics because quality is higher elsewhere is popular and supported by lots of money, but it's a myth.
6
Why is a High School Diploma less of an achievement these days? Many valid reasons have been given, but I have one more:
Smarter people, and particularly smart women, are having fewer children. Less intelligent people are having more children. As a consequence, fewer children are easily learning grammar and math.
This was inevitable.
Smarter people, and particularly smart women, are having fewer children. Less intelligent people are having more children. As a consequence, fewer children are easily learning grammar and math.
This was inevitable.
39
Larry: You can not say that, or anything like that, in the U.S. today. Please repeat after me: All children are equal, all are above average, all should have a free university degree, all will make the Dean's List. If any of the above are not achieved, it is someone else's fault.
14
Is this the "dumbing down" of a once respected sign of achievement: the high school diploma. Just my little opinion here, but we need to get this fixed and quickly!
2
An aspect few are willing to discuss is the number of students who enter high school with little or no academic English. They can speak functional English, yes, but academic English takes 7-10 years to learn. If a student arrived in the US before her 10th birthday, she might be able to succeed academically, assuming she works hard and her parents support her by insisting on hard work, and if they all speak English at home -- parental English stresses its importance.
However, many students arrived in the US after their 10th birthday. Few non-Asian students have families that are completely supportive of spoken English.
Interestingly, for students who have grown up in the US, few have parents who speak much to them to enhance their vocabularies, and many come to high school with What Me Worry attitudes. That, plus a certain amount of entitlement among white students in the former Confederate states, adds to the phenomenon where East Asian students -- pushed and also supported in their academics by parents who insist that they succeed -- out-perform their English-as-first-language peers. It is about intelligence, and push, and support, and respect for education. Relatively few students have all four. It has always been so -- I well remember my own middle school classmates -- but back in the day, there was less competition for good jobs, and if you were male and white and had a high school diploma, there was practically none.
However, many students arrived in the US after their 10th birthday. Few non-Asian students have families that are completely supportive of spoken English.
Interestingly, for students who have grown up in the US, few have parents who speak much to them to enhance their vocabularies, and many come to high school with What Me Worry attitudes. That, plus a certain amount of entitlement among white students in the former Confederate states, adds to the phenomenon where East Asian students -- pushed and also supported in their academics by parents who insist that they succeed -- out-perform their English-as-first-language peers. It is about intelligence, and push, and support, and respect for education. Relatively few students have all four. It has always been so -- I well remember my own middle school classmates -- but back in the day, there was less competition for good jobs, and if you were male and white and had a high school diploma, there was practically none.
5
Progressive educators have been dumbing down standards for years so that slower students do not feel "inferior" to smarter students. Instead of directing children to trades and trade schools when the children are not succeeding academically, progressive educators have been directing everybody into college track academic programs. Add to that the teachers who feel the need to give passing grades to everyone to demonstrate how well they teach, and to avoid all of the grief from parents who delude themselves into believing their children are geniuses, and you have a recipe for making a high school diploma worthless.
4
I have had a career in industry, but have also taught science courses as an adjunct for many years. Today part-time adjuncts or non-tenure track staff teach roughly 70% of all college classes.
My observations and experience echo many of the comments from other instructors.
Some incoming students today are of course hard working and well prepared, but a significant percentage are lazy, poorly prepared and have clearly been passed along whether they had grade level skills and knowledge, or not.
Many parents and some influential PhD's with no common sense have pressed for such practices (social promotions) for decades.
Now we reap the consequences; large numbers of dumbed down applicants.
Schools everywhere have lowered reading, writing and math standards to let them in, and to let them pass courses they take.
Today if you are an instructor, full time or part-time, you are under considerable pressure - primarily from the administration but also from students themselves, whose course evaluations often determine whether you are retained as a faculty member - to give mostly good grades and not hurt anyone's esteem. There are few meaningful standards left.
This is what happens when you make students "feelings" the major concern.
And don't let experienced instructors set the standards for course content and testing. And instead let no nothing politicians, administrators & others set them. You get worthless diplomas and people who aren't going to make it in life. Sad.
My observations and experience echo many of the comments from other instructors.
Some incoming students today are of course hard working and well prepared, but a significant percentage are lazy, poorly prepared and have clearly been passed along whether they had grade level skills and knowledge, or not.
Many parents and some influential PhD's with no common sense have pressed for such practices (social promotions) for decades.
Now we reap the consequences; large numbers of dumbed down applicants.
Schools everywhere have lowered reading, writing and math standards to let them in, and to let them pass courses they take.
Today if you are an instructor, full time or part-time, you are under considerable pressure - primarily from the administration but also from students themselves, whose course evaluations often determine whether you are retained as a faculty member - to give mostly good grades and not hurt anyone's esteem. There are few meaningful standards left.
This is what happens when you make students "feelings" the major concern.
And don't let experienced instructors set the standards for course content and testing. And instead let no nothing politicians, administrators & others set them. You get worthless diplomas and people who aren't going to make it in life. Sad.
6
The idea that a single curriculum will work for every high school student is one of the problems with students graduating and not being fully "prepared" for the next step in their life or in an academic setting. In NY there used to be two regular high school diplomas. The regents and the "local" diploma, the former being the college prep track and the later leading to a more vocational program. This all changed when No Child Left Behind with its high stakes testing entered the picture. Now all students complete a regents diploma course of study. Statistically 50% of all students are below the mean and about 50% score within the broad average range (e.g., IQ 90 to 110) on ability tests. Not everyone is "college material" though I'd argue that the experience should be available to anyone who wants to give it a try, hard work can still overcome many obstacles in life. Giving students more options (I would have enjoyed learning a trade, even if I wasn't proficient in it) in high school as opposed to studying French for example. The one size fits all approach, while commendable for its egalitarian goals doesn't meet everyone's needs. As for future employment it is hard to outsource your plumber to a country with cheaper labor!
5
In addition to the academic and general diploma, there was also a "commercial" diploma. The commercial diploma was a very good indicator that the graduate was literate and had the skills to succeed at a middle class office job. In short, it was a passport to the "hard-working" middle class.
More kids are graduating because the diploma is valued, the education is not. Consequently, as little as possible is learned. There is nothing new here, and for decades children have been ill prepared for college, but nevertheless, the system found a way to farm them like a crop. Is America smarter or less smart than it was 50 or 60 years ago? I doubt not. My father's Algebra book was more technical than my own college one, and all of this has been dumbed down even further. Our problem with the democratization of education is that it really shouldn't be made to apply to everyone, but when there are no technical jobs or industries that one could depend on for employ, we now have what we have, and it's a sad thing. This is where a country would be better off with Intermediate Technology, which is far more labor intensive and inclusive. We should consider this approach in our educational system, if we are able to extend it to our economic system, which means far more government control and regulation of industry, particularly about moving jobs over seas.
2
We appear to have confused a diploma with actually being educated. My local school district actually lowered the grade percentage so more students would get A's. And guess what? More did and the Superintendant is congratulating herself that there are more minorities getting A's. All smoke and mirrors and children with unrealistic opinions about their future.
8
For years the liberal establishment has been preaching that the only salvation from worldwide economic competition is for Americans to become better educated and thus more skilled. But they never considered that generations of psychological tests have shown that only a minority of any population will be able to master the kind of complex intellectual and social challenges necessary to earn a college degree. Not that such skills have ever been show to correlate with those necessary to hold down a good job.
Over time this stress on skills morphed into the principle that more schooled meant better schooled. The business world quickly adjusted and job descriptions were adjusted so everything moved up a step. Jobs that 50 years ago required a high school diploma now demand a bachelor's degree. And thus the onus for inequality was subtly shifted from economic institutions to educational bureaucracies. The latter were happy to respond. The public grew to accept that a college degree is the new normal. Adolescence was stretched out for "four more years". Bright but lazy college kids loved it. Parental bank accounts were bled and student loans went through the roof.
At this point no elected government dares tell employers to rewrite their job descriptions. But they can dumb things down so that everyone who persists can get a college degree. So they do it and the dumbed down intelligentsia roars approval. Wouldn't is be better to start over with plans rooted in reality?
Over time this stress on skills morphed into the principle that more schooled meant better schooled. The business world quickly adjusted and job descriptions were adjusted so everything moved up a step. Jobs that 50 years ago required a high school diploma now demand a bachelor's degree. And thus the onus for inequality was subtly shifted from economic institutions to educational bureaucracies. The latter were happy to respond. The public grew to accept that a college degree is the new normal. Adolescence was stretched out for "four more years". Bright but lazy college kids loved it. Parental bank accounts were bled and student loans went through the roof.
At this point no elected government dares tell employers to rewrite their job descriptions. But they can dumb things down so that everyone who persists can get a college degree. So they do it and the dumbed down intelligentsia roars approval. Wouldn't is be better to start over with plans rooted in reality?
2
The problem is that we have used the education system to serve social policy goals. If not enough African Americans or Latinos are passing or graduating high school, it must be the level of courses and not the myriad of social ills within these communities. This is similar to our response to low home ownership by minorities: let us lower lending standards. Either response ends up leaving the groups it was meant to help in poorer shape. We, as Americans, seem to like the easy way out of all problems - the proverbial magic pill. What we really need to do, instead, is focus on the social ills within these communities and the result will be better educational outcomes.
8
Rising graduation rates invariably mean that standards are being lowered. The problem is that education is being sold as a panacea for those who are not really able to profit from it. Social promotions have a long history and efforts to do away with these are almost always reversed.
So we are left with a situation in which little is done to rethink pathways for those who are not really the best candidates for formal education. Is vocational training for some truly so shameful?
So we are left with a situation in which little is done to rethink pathways for those who are not really the best candidates for formal education. Is vocational training for some truly so shameful?
1
We will continue this way until our fear that our children may not be able to support themselves becomes greater than our fear of judging their academic performance. Then we will insist on teachers, administrators and school boards who actually teach, we will return to them the authority to manage their classrooms, and we will protect schools from disruptive schools and parents. Instead of asking, "but what about that one child who needs special attention," we will ask, "but what about the other 24 children who want to learn?"
7
The only nit I have to pick with your comment is that, in public school classrooms today, there are usually multiple children who need "special attention," and the total number is closer to 35 or 40 than it is 25.
5
I have a serious question: why is there such an obsession with college level math readiness? Furthermore, what percent of the population uses college math, whether for work or life? Can we just come together as a society and recognize that not everyone has either an aptitude for higher level math or a desire for it? Isn't it time to begin treating neglected subject areas that actually provide utility to a student's future life? Where's our emphasis on sociology and history? Perhaps if our kids were actually taught about our societal structures and the impact they have on us we'd have a much more informed citizenry.
18
Had the same thought as Clyde, below. It is highly ironic that technologically sophisticated companies would set up in low-educational-achievment areas just to save a few bucks on labor. Have they ever considered that their product quality might suffer--consequent damage to their corporate reputations might well outweigh any cost savings.
5
I have worked in large corporations. The answer is 'no'. They would do anything to save money.
6
So many of the comments below are spot on, with many offering reasonable, common sense solutions. I would guess that many are parents and/or potential employers. I would also venture that not a one is a Senator, congressman, State legislator or local politician.
I was educated abroad and received an exceptional education. As a parent, living in the US, I pulled my own child out of public school in third grade and she was educated from then on in progressive private schools. Today, my grandchildren are also receiving progressive, challenging, private school educations.
I was educated abroad and received an exceptional education. As a parent, living in the US, I pulled my own child out of public school in third grade and she was educated from then on in progressive private schools. Today, my grandchildren are also receiving progressive, challenging, private school educations.
5
It's certainly possible that the public schools near the private schools your child and grandchildren attended were worse than the private schools they went to. There's variation in either model. But statistically, the odds are that the publics were better schools. Not seen as being as prestigious, of course, but better at actually teaching. That's usually the case, despite our cultural conviction to the contrary.
2
One problem is that the diploma serves too many different purposes. One is college readiness, but another is filtering applicants for jobs with no real academic requirements at all -- driving a bus, where I live, for example. Employers use it mainly as a certification that the kid has spent 13 years sitting down and following orders. So it's /good/ that all those ill-prepared kids can get a diploma, but then we need something else for academic certification. Even in the "information economy," not everyone is going to, or should, have an academic career.
3
I think educators would be wise to advise the parents of the described children to take a "chill pill". It's incredible how an individual can develop and change over a lifetime, and they are acting like many of these kids have already failed at life. Believe it or not, failure is always going to be a reality, and it has it's benefits, too, including aiding character development that can later on be extremely beneficial for society as a whole.
1
In the 60's and early 70's, New York State offered in its high schools, a "Regent's Track" and a non-Regent's "General" track. The Regent's track was rigorous, had a defined curriculum, and performance was evaluated by a Regent's exam in every course. The Regent's track did an excellent job in preparing students for college, but it wasn't for everyone. This tracking system was abolished by the educational levelers and the result was a system without tracking, but which either failed large numbers of students or allowed them to graduate unprepared for college, depending on the will of the local school board and local school administrators. The fact is that not everyone is above average!
28
In the 1960s there were three diploma tracks in New York City. We were given the choice of working towards an academic, commercial or general diploma. An academic diploma was for the more intelligent or college-bound students. A commercial diploma prepared students to begin working at a middle class office job immediately after graduation. Even the general indicated basic literacy and math skills. Many students entering community college today wouldn't have even qualified for a New York City general diploma fifty years ago.
1
These numbers suggest a push from below to try to achieve higher graduation rates below, but I don't see a pull from college entrance levels or business organizations trying to meet lower somewhere in the middle with these graduates. Perhaps the freshman courses are still too high to be achievable.
As a former college professor, I'm not advocating a reduction of standards, not at all. I've seen what too much accommodation can do to hurt students.
If we are to meet in that middle and keep the flow, we still have some work to do to fill the gap between senior year high school level and affordable freshman entrance levels. After all, that's our responsibility to these future citizens. Let's go to work. Society will benefit.
As a former college professor, I'm not advocating a reduction of standards, not at all. I've seen what too much accommodation can do to hurt students.
If we are to meet in that middle and keep the flow, we still have some work to do to fill the gap between senior year high school level and affordable freshman entrance levels. After all, that's our responsibility to these future citizens. Let's go to work. Society will benefit.
3
The only bright spot the last four decades of public school progress had been graduation rates. Now we see those gains were not what they appeared. Bottom-Line: Despite a more than tripling of inflation-adjusted per-pupil funding since the early 1970s, there has been NO improvement in pupil outcomes as measured by inflation-adjusted dropout rates and NAEP 17-year-old achievement levels.
This is a fraud exceeding that of Madoff!
This is a fraud exceeding that of Madoff!
6
Too much emphasis on testing vs how to learn, creativity and communication.
2
There are two groups of students going to high school, those who will go on to college and those who will not. As bad as this seems, some students will never be able to do the course work to go onto college, no matter how much the school wishes to teach them. In Europe, many countries have vocational schools as an alternative to academic high school. A student who has no interest in advanced algebra may see it in a different light if his vocation requires it.
Great care must be taken not to herd students into the alternate track based on race or socio-economic status as they do in certain countries. While it is not currently the job of a high school to teach a vocation it is the lesser evil. It is better to have a student job ready and not college ready if they show no interest in it. Students who are not well prepared for college or are not particularly interested, do not succeed there even with a lot of remedial help. It is better to have them educated to perform a job than to have them college ready when they show no interest. Make the time spent in high school meaningful to all students even if they are not on an academic track.
Great care must be taken not to herd students into the alternate track based on race or socio-economic status as they do in certain countries. While it is not currently the job of a high school to teach a vocation it is the lesser evil. It is better to have a student job ready and not college ready if they show no interest in it. Students who are not well prepared for college or are not particularly interested, do not succeed there even with a lot of remedial help. It is better to have them educated to perform a job than to have them college ready when they show no interest. Make the time spent in high school meaningful to all students even if they are not on an academic track.
13
Wake up folks now because we are getting passed on by in the world. We need to start pouring money into education if we want to maintain what we got because sooner or later we will be relegated to a third world status.
1
Once again, the schools are not the problem. The product in the schools is the problem. As the minority class, i.e., the lower class, expands, fewer students will be ready for college. Not because of their race but because they come from dysfunctional families in dysfunctional neighborhoods with poverty and high crime. Solve the poverty and crime problems and you will solve the education readiness problem. Or, of course, if you solve the education readiness problem, then you will solve the poverty and crime problems.
Chicken and egg, anyone?
Chicken and egg, anyone?
5
We've had a number of Presidents who have come from poor and dysfunctional families. We have had a number of CEO's of major corporations who came from poor and dysfunctional families. We have had doctors, lawyers, ministers, educators who came from poor and dysfunctional families. Wealth does not equate to functional by the way.
3
The exception doesn't disprove the rule. If you want to predict which kids born today will be wealthy and successful in three or four decades, the smart money is on the ones whose parents are wealthy and successful now. A tiny percentage of poor kids may surprise you and, through a combination of work and luck, climb the economic ladder, but when it happens it's just that: a surprise.
4
Much of the problem lies with the psychology of the classroom. The problem in my experience as an educator lies with the unwillingness of students to move beyond the low expectations to which they were accustomed and the inability of educators, including me, to persuade them otherwise. They prefer low or even failing grades to an approach that requires discipline. Over my years of teaching I encountered few students who were willing to follow guidelines if those guidelines involved significant work beyond the fill-in-the-blanks or paraphrase-the-source approach. Every student I ever encountered who was willing to adopt series study guidelines I offered did very well. The problem is unwillingness, not inability. Given this, how can we develop a fundamentally new approach that builds motivation and disciplined work?
7
so... when students can not pass the standard test... lower the test requirements....when they reach the real world and can not meet the basic requirements for a job... then.... demand special treatment.... say...how has this worked out for them?
5
Sad, isn't it, that all those high tech businesses that moved to the American South so they could get cheap labor in "right to work" states are now bemoaning the low achievement in those areas? Perhaps a few might want to reconsider the much maligned rust belt cities in the Northeast!
31
Regional bigotry has no rightful place in this discussion. I can find just as many students who have not achieved high academic standards in northern cities such as Chicago, Milwaukee, Detroit, New York City and others as well.
3
Yeah, you can find just as many poor students in Detroit as you can in Southern states... mostly because you framed the city-vs-state comparison to find what you wanted to find. Look at the states as a whole, though, and you start to notice definite trends.
3
The same has happened with respect to many undergraduate degrees, unfortunately. But not to worry, consideration of factors other than actual knowledge, thinking ability, competence, and work ethic will continue to ensure that a significant percentage of the unqualified will continue to succeed. Among these factors are family connections, race/ethnicity, gender, provincialism, school loyalty, general attractiveness, youth, nepotism, being slimmer or taller than average, etc.
23
1. Teachers, you just can't win this one. When you hear "What can my child do to get a better grade in your class?" and you know what the real answer is: "Have smarter parents." Well, you just can't say it.
2.And we certainly picked a bad metaphor when we talked about raising the bar. In track, the bar is raised until no one gets over it. At least not until one single gifted, hard working, well coached athlete breaks the old record, establishes a new record. Takes one more leap and doesn't get over the bar which has been raised to a new height. Leaving it for the next elite athlete. No way to run a school--
3. And, please, don't compare us to other countries that don't have our racial (racist) component and who don't try to educate everyone they way we do.
2.And we certainly picked a bad metaphor when we talked about raising the bar. In track, the bar is raised until no one gets over it. At least not until one single gifted, hard working, well coached athlete breaks the old record, establishes a new record. Takes one more leap and doesn't get over the bar which has been raised to a new height. Leaving it for the next elite athlete. No way to run a school--
3. And, please, don't compare us to other countries that don't have our racial (racist) component and who don't try to educate everyone they way we do.
20
I have a graduate degree, and I teach today's students-- I wholeheartedly agree that the standards have dropped! One of my professors used to say that today's doctorate degree is equivalent to the bachelor's degree of the "baby boomers", both in terms of quality and difficulty in obtainment.
In general, today's students expect to receive an "A" with little effort; they feel entitled, and lack motivation, discipline, morals, and ethics. Many students are more interested in what someone has to say on Facebook about their clothes than how to read, write, and do arithmetic. I fear for the future of this nation, since we as educators and guardians are failing overwhelmingly to produce individuals who will have good work ethics and social graces.
In general, today's students expect to receive an "A" with little effort; they feel entitled, and lack motivation, discipline, morals, and ethics. Many students are more interested in what someone has to say on Facebook about their clothes than how to read, write, and do arithmetic. I fear for the future of this nation, since we as educators and guardians are failing overwhelmingly to produce individuals who will have good work ethics and social graces.
35
Are we just averting our eyes to the simple truth ?
Lowering the standards on the Exit Exam so that more students pass
does no one any good.
Have we forgotten how to teach, how to ensure a positive/productive
learning environment ?
These children are going to live in a World where China/India dominate
the World's economy. They, if anyone, need the best education they can
receive and every care should be taken that they achieve it.
Lowering the standards on the Exit Exam so that more students pass
does no one any good.
Have we forgotten how to teach, how to ensure a positive/productive
learning environment ?
These children are going to live in a World where China/India dominate
the World's economy. They, if anyone, need the best education they can
receive and every care should be taken that they achieve it.
4
The National Governors Association and Council of Chief State School Officers, with ample help from conservative, business and faux education reform groups (read: anti-union and anti-public education) came up with Common Core, which was to be the Great Panacea. Until it wasn’t. Governors would not tell their constituents to be better parents, and their children to study and compete with Finland and South Korea. Superintendents saw resources outsourced to outside “consultants”, and principles and teachers were inundated with dozens of new teaching methods, and then castigated for not mastering and implementing every one in a New York minute. Conservatives were the most feckless and hypocritical: they anticipated that Common Core would be a body blow to teacher’s unions but when their lower middle-class white supporters rebelled, it was discovered that Common Core violated Tea Party principles.
For 20 years various criteria have fluctuated wildly in response to political pressures and pedagogical challenges. Probably too much for stability and real success in a child’s education or a teacher’s development. Here’s the rub: I don’t know what the answer is. NO ONE DOES! Yet, many profess to know and endlessly pontificate. However, we need to start with achievable goals and making every student “college ready” is an unrealistic starting point. There’s too much to do before that’s remotely achievable. That’s just a formula for disrupting policies in place and instituting chaos.
For 20 years various criteria have fluctuated wildly in response to political pressures and pedagogical challenges. Probably too much for stability and real success in a child’s education or a teacher’s development. Here’s the rub: I don’t know what the answer is. NO ONE DOES! Yet, many profess to know and endlessly pontificate. However, we need to start with achievable goals and making every student “college ready” is an unrealistic starting point. There’s too much to do before that’s remotely achievable. That’s just a formula for disrupting policies in place and instituting chaos.
2
What both liberals and conservatives don't want to admit is that regardless of how good schools and teachers are, half of the population will have an IQ that is below average. Assuming a normal distribution, 16% of the population will have an IQ below 85. If we want more than 80% of all students to graduate from high school, standards will need to be vastly lowered and the diploma will become meaningless.
On the other side of the curve, 16% will have an IQ of 115 or better. Again, if we want more than about 20% of students to graduate from a 4-year college, standards will have to be lowered (if they haven't been already.)
For the 60% in the middle, we can hope that most graduate from high school, but it's unrealistic to expect more than a few percent to graduate from a rigorous college program. Many would likely do well in various skilled training programs and/or community colleges.
So in the end we need to orient our educational system to the population we have, not the population of Lake Wobegon.
On the other side of the curve, 16% will have an IQ of 115 or better. Again, if we want more than about 20% of students to graduate from a 4-year college, standards will have to be lowered (if they haven't been already.)
For the 60% in the middle, we can hope that most graduate from high school, but it's unrealistic to expect more than a few percent to graduate from a rigorous college program. Many would likely do well in various skilled training programs and/or community colleges.
So in the end we need to orient our educational system to the population we have, not the population of Lake Wobegon.
32
'...half of the population will have an IQ that is below average...'
Incorrect. 50% of the population has an IQ of 100 (the average) or below, which means that many people have an IQ of 100.
The issue is that people with a 100 IQ and even a 85 IQ used to be able to work in blue collar jobs that paid a living wage, but the influx of low skilled immigrants, legal and otherwise, has destroyed the future of the American working class citizens.
That both parties have allowed this over the past four decades is incomprehensible, as without a thriving middle and working class, no economy can survive, much less grow.
Unfortunately, our economists, politicians, and journalists seem not to understand that the law of supply and demand applies to labor as it does to goods and an oversupply of labor cannot be fixed by bringing in even more labor.
Incorrect. 50% of the population has an IQ of 100 (the average) or below, which means that many people have an IQ of 100.
The issue is that people with a 100 IQ and even a 85 IQ used to be able to work in blue collar jobs that paid a living wage, but the influx of low skilled immigrants, legal and otherwise, has destroyed the future of the American working class citizens.
That both parties have allowed this over the past four decades is incomprehensible, as without a thriving middle and working class, no economy can survive, much less grow.
Unfortunately, our economists, politicians, and journalists seem not to understand that the law of supply and demand applies to labor as it does to goods and an oversupply of labor cannot be fixed by bringing in even more labor.
7
IQ scores can rise or fall precipitously. Intelligence is not and never has been a fixed quantity. We need to stop pretending it is.
Parents are a big part of this dilemma, according to retired teachers and principals in my family. Baby-boom parents want good grades and honor roll, and they have boosted grade inflation because they will go in and complain about difficult courses and "unfair grading," even in AP classes. They demand "fair" grading, which often means (1) no "C" term grade if the child is attending classes and doing all the assignments, and (2) no yearly "F" grade at all. In my high school senior class in 1971, 21 students out of 575 were on the honor roll. Today, in the same public high school, more than 80 seniors make the honor roll each term -- with fewer than 500 in the class.
19
I live in a gated community with million dollar homes. Schools are funded by property taxes.
We have all the AP courses and after school soccer, debate, etc. a student can want.
And most parents pay for private SAT tutoring.
No problem here.
But even here, most of our students are average and most don't go on to Harvard or MIT.
A lot more go to state universities with good football games and partying and get degrees in Communications or Marketing or Psychology, etc.
We have all the AP courses and after school soccer, debate, etc. a student can want.
And most parents pay for private SAT tutoring.
No problem here.
But even here, most of our students are average and most don't go on to Harvard or MIT.
A lot more go to state universities with good football games and partying and get degrees in Communications or Marketing or Psychology, etc.
10
Not only would they have to be top 1% smart, and hardworking also, they would have to be engaged in the world outside themselves, strongly directed (toward STEM for MIT), and cognizant of their worldwide competition. Outgoing personalities have a much easier time with interviews, and they must be world class at something, whether it's Olympic fencing or Intel science fair, saving a small African village from eye disease or a quantum physics publication in Nature.
1
Many schools in such places turn out to be worthless. They are too soft, and don't make the students work. The parents are too busy with their high-paid jobs to see what is going on.
Many homeschooling parents get better results with average kids. So did the old Catholic schools where nuns with rulers got everyone to learn, whether they like it or not.
Many homeschooling parents get better results with average kids. So did the old Catholic schools where nuns with rulers got everyone to learn, whether they like it or not.
2
Whenever I hear homeschooling advocates say that many homeschooled kids are successful, I reflect on:
1. How difficult it is to get hard numbers on something as diffuse as homeschooling.
2. My impression of the intelligence of the average parent.
3. How elastic the words "many" and "successful" are.
1. How difficult it is to get hard numbers on something as diffuse as homeschooling.
2. My impression of the intelligence of the average parent.
3. How elastic the words "many" and "successful" are.
As usual, the attitude of the high school student and their motivation, drive, desire to learn and understanding of the world play the largest part in what a student achieves in high school.
Yes, sometime a given teacher can motivate a student beyond the values of their family but most of the time, if they have no interest in learning and don't see its value, they will get little out of K-12. Family attitudes are primary in what a student learns there.
Yes, sometime a given teacher can motivate a student beyond the values of their family but most of the time, if they have no interest in learning and don't see its value, they will get little out of K-12. Family attitudes are primary in what a student learns there.
10
"As usual, the attitude of the high school student and their motivation, drive, desire to learn and understanding of the world play the largest part in what a student achieves in high school. "
That's true. But when 3rd graders argue with their teacher that 1/2 1/2 is not actually 2/4, and the teacher defends her "math", it is tough to blame students for losing motivation.
...Andrew
P.S. Yes, a true story. Happily rare. But true. Sadly, she was awarded tenure shortly thereafter.
That's true. But when 3rd graders argue with their teacher that 1/2 1/2 is not actually 2/4, and the teacher defends her "math", it is tough to blame students for losing motivation.
...Andrew
P.S. Yes, a true story. Happily rare. But true. Sadly, she was awarded tenure shortly thereafter.
1
Well, it would have helped if you had written a clear post. I gather that you meant to say 1/2 times 1/2 or 1/2 of 1/2. I don't believe your anecdote, either. Third graders are not exposed to multiplication of fractions. That is usually taught in fourth or even fifth grade.
Not Mark...
I had a similar problem at SFSU when undergraduate students, to whom I was teaching Basic Research 101, that each flip of a coin has 1/2 chance of giving you head or tail. But cumulatively it would give me 100% chance that I would get one tail and one head if I flipped twice. 1/2 + 1/2 = 2/2 = 1. But is this true? The chances of getting a head or a tail increases only when the number of flips increase. There is a very high chance (almost 100%, even then "only almost") that I'd get at least one head or one tail in 100 flips. It is still a probability even when the independent fraction for each flip leads to a clear specific whole number. That is the difference between statistics, used in research, and math. My students could not get the difference and complained to the Dean...who is an idiot. She got her tenure and Deanship by revealing her lesbian affair with a brilliant faculty who actually rejected her application for tenure and Deanship. The students did not understand that what is mathematically correct, in real research becomes only probabilistic... hence we have "Continuous Normal distribution" (moving towards the 1 or 100%). They argued with me so hard that I began to question my knowledge. In the US the aggressive entitled students (be they minority or majority) sometimes rule the class and the school, and faculty are thrust in a defensive posture. I left the school, I hope lot of the dysfunctional faculty have been kicked out.
I had a similar problem at SFSU when undergraduate students, to whom I was teaching Basic Research 101, that each flip of a coin has 1/2 chance of giving you head or tail. But cumulatively it would give me 100% chance that I would get one tail and one head if I flipped twice. 1/2 + 1/2 = 2/2 = 1. But is this true? The chances of getting a head or a tail increases only when the number of flips increase. There is a very high chance (almost 100%, even then "only almost") that I'd get at least one head or one tail in 100 flips. It is still a probability even when the independent fraction for each flip leads to a clear specific whole number. That is the difference between statistics, used in research, and math. My students could not get the difference and complained to the Dean...who is an idiot. She got her tenure and Deanship by revealing her lesbian affair with a brilliant faculty who actually rejected her application for tenure and Deanship. The students did not understand that what is mathematically correct, in real research becomes only probabilistic... hence we have "Continuous Normal distribution" (moving towards the 1 or 100%). They argued with me so hard that I began to question my knowledge. In the US the aggressive entitled students (be they minority or majority) sometimes rule the class and the school, and faculty are thrust in a defensive posture. I left the school, I hope lot of the dysfunctional faculty have been kicked out.
Here's one explanation. When I was in high school, we were not allowed to bring a TV to watch in class. These days, students stay glued to their cell phones in class with no consequences.
38
Look at the district in South Carolina, where a rude disruptive student would not stop yakking on her cellphone. Instead of punishing HER, the teachers and security officers were punished and/or fired! The student and her family are likely going to get some huge court settlement for her "discomfort".
2
Higher level learning is something like weight lifting: no pain, no gain. The process of getting somewhere in either may include joy and whimsy, but the essential ingredient is effort. As for public policy, I think a good teacher supported properly is the only thing that matters a lot.
136
A good teacher, supported properly (which would be the exact opposite of how we generally treat teachers) is about the only good public policy, but it's far from the only thing that matters. Parental factors (education, wealth) and student ability and motivation make a much bigger difference. No degree of instructional quality will consistently make up for a lack in those areas, and the fact that all our public policy currently arises from a refusal to admit that is a big part of why we're not properly supporting teachers.
4
I started teraching myself Spanish in my 50s the hard way--learning the rules--conjugating verbs over and over, creating tests for myself, reading a boring grammar book from page 1 to the end and 7 years in, I still start at page 1 and go through the book--I even have the examples memorized I've seen them so many times.
I did well in school and have a Juris Doctor but my view is that to really learn something, you have to do it over and over, A week of "immersion" in Costa Rica won't cut it. Doing it my way, I doubt that there is a verb I could not conjugate, including subjunctives, nor a word I cannot pronounce, etc
My phone and laptop are set in Spanish, When I watch a show, I read spanish subtitles.
I have a good memory but the bottom line is one has to learn in his own best way but whatever that is, it takes time, discipline, organization and repitition. I now write better than most natives. But I earned it--and I'm still not happy with my progress.
I did well in school and have a Juris Doctor but my view is that to really learn something, you have to do it over and over, A week of "immersion" in Costa Rica won't cut it. Doing it my way, I doubt that there is a verb I could not conjugate, including subjunctives, nor a word I cannot pronounce, etc
My phone and laptop are set in Spanish, When I watch a show, I read spanish subtitles.
I have a good memory but the bottom line is one has to learn in his own best way but whatever that is, it takes time, discipline, organization and repitition. I now write better than most natives. But I earned it--and I'm still not happy with my progress.
An example is Imari Nicholson, the 17 year-old student who failed chemistry only to retake and get an A. However, he still was not satisfied with his ACT scores. Why? “I expect better of myself,” he said.
So Boeing lobbies to get massive tax breaks, pits states against each other to offer the most generous packages (like Washington versus South Carolina), and then are shocked, shocked to discover that the high schools - left without a tax base to fund them - fail to produce competent graduates.
27
Even as high schools across the country fail to prepare their graduates for college, we hear calls from President Obama and others to expand access to community colleges and universities.
We don't need to make it easier for kids to go to college, we need to make it harder. We already have far too many unprepared kids going to college, because we have failed to focus our attention where the real problem is.
Let's get our priorities straight.
We don't need to make it easier for kids to go to college, we need to make it harder. We already have far too many unprepared kids going to college, because we have failed to focus our attention where the real problem is.
Let's get our priorities straight.
11
Fear not that the skill and achievement levels of high school students are so low. For I give you the modern American University, where standards are at an equally dismal place. Of course, then there's the issue of the workplace, where all of this eventually catches up to texting-boy and girl...
2
"Given a metric, people will always solve for the 'winning' solution"
quoted - with permission - from Susan Feldman.
quoted - with permission - from Susan Feldman.
3
"Education reformers" since at least 2000 and, in many parts of the country for much longer, have controlled local curricula, graduation standards and testing requirements.
If there is a "dumbing down" of graduation requirements or student achievement in this country whose fault is that at this point? And what, beyond more of the same, is the appropriate response?
If there is a "dumbing down" of graduation requirements or student achievement in this country whose fault is that at this point? And what, beyond more of the same, is the appropriate response?
1
Instead of having students sit through lectures by teachers who may know little or nothing about the subject matter, give them individual lessons on computers. Have an expert (Ph.D.) in history, e.g., provide the lessons. Let the lessons be like Ken Burns's Civil War.
At the end of the day's lesson, let the student take a little quiz. If she passes, she gets a new lesson the next day. If she fails, she will repeat the lesson the next day. She will repeat the same lesson every day until she passes.
When the student has passed all the lessons in all the courses required for graduation, he receives a diploma. Required courses include history, math, science, literature, code-writing, building trades, music, dancing, a language, how to apply to college, etc.
No more freshmen, sophomores, etc. A student sits in classrooms with others in her age cohort, but everyone works in privacy, at his own speed. An individual may be in advanced courses in math but in introductory courses in carpentry. Etc. No more boring lectures by bored teachers. No more disruptions by boring and bored students. No more shaming those who can't read. Liberty and justice for all.
(And no more "education" majors at colleges. Replace "educators" with classroom monitors.)
At the end of the day's lesson, let the student take a little quiz. If she passes, she gets a new lesson the next day. If she fails, she will repeat the lesson the next day. She will repeat the same lesson every day until she passes.
When the student has passed all the lessons in all the courses required for graduation, he receives a diploma. Required courses include history, math, science, literature, code-writing, building trades, music, dancing, a language, how to apply to college, etc.
No more freshmen, sophomores, etc. A student sits in classrooms with others in her age cohort, but everyone works in privacy, at his own speed. An individual may be in advanced courses in math but in introductory courses in carpentry. Etc. No more boring lectures by bored teachers. No more disruptions by boring and bored students. No more shaming those who can't read. Liberty and justice for all.
(And no more "education" majors at colleges. Replace "educators" with classroom monitors.)
2
Seems like a fine plan until you think about it for a short moment. Students of the current generation are not just emerging from the education system delinquent in knowledge and job skills, but also in the ability to communicate. Advances in technology have produced phones and social media that have probably let them down more than aided them. The last thing that is needed is to isolate them even more, which is what learning by computer does. What we need are highly-paid motivated teachers, sexually-segregated classrooms of no more than a dozen, the students sitting in a semicircle, and Plato-like discussions as the norm.
"No more shaming those who can't read" How do you expect a student to work independently on computer instruction if he/she can't read?
Worth an experiment at least.
This article simply affirms what people generally have known for some time:
A high school diploma in the public system in the U.S. is not necessarily
indicative of meaningful accomplishment. Moreover, College entrance requirements are being lowered, sometimes out of public view, to accommodate the situation.
Where are we headed? Not to a good place, I think.
A high school diploma in the public system in the U.S. is not necessarily
indicative of meaningful accomplishment. Moreover, College entrance requirements are being lowered, sometimes out of public view, to accommodate the situation.
Where are we headed? Not to a good place, I think.
7
Nobody really cares! America for the last forty years has been importing its doctors, engineers, scientists from overseas mainly India, Pakistan, Russia, Taiwan, South Korea, Taiwan, China, etc.. They come here to graduate school and stay forever because they are guaranteed a very good life. Our Congress and Wall Street doesn't need a good US public school system because of "globalization" of intellectual talent which provides America's brain power. It's so obvious to anyone who has worked in a technical field all his/her life. Our schools, except those in very affluent neighborhoods, are a wasteland and they will stay that way since the Fortune 500 corporations can do without them.
279
Someone needs to do a real piece on argument being made here. How true is this? Seems to make some sense, but we must be careful because reality and a good argument are not always the same. I am thinking Juris could be on to something, or maybe there is a trend.. Hmm.
1
Exactly right. No one needs expensive undereducated socialites when you can H1B in anyone to work for peanuts.
6
Our public schools are hardly a "wasteland." Generally speaking, they're very good, certainly better on average than charters or private schools. But they're certainly moving in the "wasteland" direction, and largely because wealthy people and corporations see them as an unexploited profit source rather than a public obligation.
3
In NYC we have students in high school, born here, college bound, who are practically pre-lingual, unable to string together a full sentence.
How sad it is when, trying to read a paragraph, a young man asks you, "What mean, miss?"
How he must feel.
We have teachers who work their hearts out for him and many, many more like him. And we do pour money into special education programs.
We have to thank our Ph.Ds in education who insist that, with enough help, everyone can do college work. We have dismantled our tech and shop programs on the strength of that misguided belief.
That's why having a high school or even a college degree doesn't mean what it used to.
How sad it is when, trying to read a paragraph, a young man asks you, "What mean, miss?"
How he must feel.
We have teachers who work their hearts out for him and many, many more like him. And we do pour money into special education programs.
We have to thank our Ph.Ds in education who insist that, with enough help, everyone can do college work. We have dismantled our tech and shop programs on the strength of that misguided belief.
That's why having a high school or even a college degree doesn't mean what it used to.
320
"We have to thank our Ph.Ds in education who insist that, with enough help, everyone can do college work."
Oh this is absolutely true. One just has to find a "college" with sufficiently low standards. Happily, most of them fit the bill. They even have dedicated staff to show applicants how to fill out those tricky loan applications.
Oh this is absolutely true. One just has to find a "college" with sufficiently low standards. Happily, most of them fit the bill. They even have dedicated staff to show applicants how to fill out those tricky loan applications.
1
When I was on the state board for all community colleges in Colorado I discovered that vocational education was destroyed in both high school and community colleges not just to make everyone college focused, but because of cost differences.
It costs much more to train a diesel mechanic, or heavy equipment operator then to offer more college psychology and sociology courses. College presidents and legislators only look at the per student cost, not the long term private and social benefits of making an investment in the costlier programs.
It costs much more to train a diesel mechanic, or heavy equipment operator then to offer more college psychology and sociology courses. College presidents and legislators only look at the per student cost, not the long term private and social benefits of making an investment in the costlier programs.
3
Not Mark...
Where have you see this? And what is the proof? How many studies have been done to show that PhDs in education believe that "everyone can go to college, should go to college and be supported to go to college"? Come one guys argue with facts...If you mean people in administration, or among some minority groups or some other group, then show the data before jumping into "extreme opinions".
Where have you see this? And what is the proof? How many studies have been done to show that PhDs in education believe that "everyone can go to college, should go to college and be supported to go to college"? Come one guys argue with facts...If you mean people in administration, or among some minority groups or some other group, then show the data before jumping into "extreme opinions".
1
Let me suggest that when the Right stops yelling about how high their taxes are and starts keeping those libraries open all day, and starts yelling that they want those art, music, and other "frilly," courses back, and stops glamorizing sports, and attacking science classes for teaching evolution, and attacking history classes for noting that sure enough, gay people got put in concentration classes and by the way, the Puritans didn't come here for religious liberty, and above all gets off the whole "I demand that schools make everybody pray to my version of Gawd!" well then, the Right gets to complain about public education.
And by the way, it's not great to yell about stupid kids and commie teachers while you're fielding pretty much the dumbest slate of Presidential candidates in American history, not to mention the loons you put in Congress.
Honestly, the Dems may be knd of unrealistic at times, and half of 'em never saw a campaign conteibution they didn't like, but at least they're not illiterate.
And by the way, it's not great to yell about stupid kids and commie teachers while you're fielding pretty much the dumbest slate of Presidential candidates in American history, not to mention the loons you put in Congress.
Honestly, the Dems may be knd of unrealistic at times, and half of 'em never saw a campaign conteibution they didn't like, but at least they're not illiterate.
21
Ain't no Republicans in New York City, or Philadelphia, or Detroit, or Washington DC, but the same problems in education persist in those bastions of Democratic Party thought and higher taxes.
7
I have an MA degree, own two businesses and am a Republican. I am hardly illiterate. Maybe you should stop generalizing.
7
Always amused by those who think judging "the Right" as a monolithic group of illiterate fanatical religious gun owners is somehow different from judging any other group by stereotypical standards
6
If you want to know why these kids aren't learning much, listen to the cacophony music they are listening to.
4
Problem solved!
1
Not solved. Just diagnosed.
3
How much longer are we going to go on pretending to believe that everyone is capable of doing college-level work? We're playing a cruel joke on many kids.
483
We r currently in England which has just passed regulations that students stay in school till 18 - either becoming work ready (trade school) or college ready. Isn't that what we hope for ? Either track ?
6
I taught for many years both at the high school and college levels and was known as a hard teacher. However I never encountered a student who was willing to follow guidelines but could not perform well. Unfortunately, the majority of students are not willing to follow guidelines that ask something substantial of them but instead expect the same fill-in-the-blanks approach. The problem lies in not in some lack of native ability but in resistance that resides in the relationship between students and teachers. The easy solution to this resistance is to lower standards. To confront the resistance is a hard road indeed. Therein lies the cruel joke. We are pretending that we have a functional and reasonable educational environment when it is anything but.
5
We absolutely must develop a mechanism for identifying the future needs of business that can coordinate with the education industrial complex to put the right people into the right jobs in ways that eliminate the wasteful nature of our current system. Something modeled on the ASVAB could prepare sufficient numbers of students for STEM careers while seeing to it that there was a sufficient pool of truck drivers (now in short supply) while addressing the surplus of attorneys.
2
In terms of measuring knowledge and skill in reading, writing, basic math, and general history and geography, for most a college degree today is the equivalent of a high school degree in the 1950's and earlier. A high school degree in 2020 is equivalent to an elementary school degree in the same years. My parents had high school degrees in the 1920s and could write 100 percent better than most university graduates today -- and many of those with graduate degrees as well. If everyone graduating from high school could simple read and write English at grade level and was financially literate, they would be a lot better off then then are currently. Why is this so difficult to achieve in 12 years of schooling???????????? What is the problem?
19
What's the problem? When kids don't show up, don't behave, and don't do the work to earn a passing grade, we ask what the schools did wrong. If they get suspended, we blame the school. If that happens a lot in one particular school, we fire the teachers. We hold schools responsible for teaching AND learning, and students and parents responsible for... well, I can't really think of anything.
That's the problem.
That's the problem.
2
Sadly, we are focusing so much on the wrong things.
This nonsensical definition of "college ready" would have eliminated 75% of my peers who went to college in the early 1980s without knowing any math more advanced than Algebra 1. Did they go to MIT? Nope. Did they go to community and state colleges and end up with perfectly fine jobs? Yep. Did they EVER have to take a "placement exam" that would have forced them to spend an extra year studying math (or perhaps more) in order to be "college and career ready"? Nope.
The more money your family has, the easier it is to attend a private school where you never have to bother with someone else telling you that you aren't "college ready". You don't even have to take the SATs anymore. And the private college that accepts you doesn't need any certification from you that you can do high level math or science. That is reserved for middle class, lower middle class, and low-income kids who need to be much smarter than the average rich kid to be "college ready".
This nonsensical definition of "college ready" would have eliminated 75% of my peers who went to college in the early 1980s without knowing any math more advanced than Algebra 1. Did they go to MIT? Nope. Did they go to community and state colleges and end up with perfectly fine jobs? Yep. Did they EVER have to take a "placement exam" that would have forced them to spend an extra year studying math (or perhaps more) in order to be "college and career ready"? Nope.
The more money your family has, the easier it is to attend a private school where you never have to bother with someone else telling you that you aren't "college ready". You don't even have to take the SATs anymore. And the private college that accepts you doesn't need any certification from you that you can do high level math or science. That is reserved for middle class, lower middle class, and low-income kids who need to be much smarter than the average rich kid to be "college ready".
116
What parallel universe are you living in? I can guarantee you that private school students must take advanced courses, and if their college requires it, the SAT or ACT. They also expect a 4 or 5 on the.AP exams. They not only do not get a break, their applications are read together with students of similar schools so their competition is tough.
6
Yes, but...
Knowledge and skills needed for today's workplace, college or no, are greater than they once were. Computer literacy for one (by which I mean being able to run a spreadsheet, not necessarily code, though we are rapidly getting to where coding will become a basic skill for many jobs that are considered good).
Everyone cannot and should not go to college. We tell a massive lie to most kids that college is the only way to the middle class when many of them cannot get there. The problem is that we lack the system of trade schools that Europe has; except for the military, college is the only option. This must be fixed.
Knowledge and skills needed for today's workplace, college or no, are greater than they once were. Computer literacy for one (by which I mean being able to run a spreadsheet, not necessarily code, though we are rapidly getting to where coding will become a basic skill for many jobs that are considered good).
Everyone cannot and should not go to college. We tell a massive lie to most kids that college is the only way to the middle class when many of them cannot get there. The problem is that we lack the system of trade schools that Europe has; except for the military, college is the only option. This must be fixed.
7
You may have noticed that the job market has changed since the early 1980s. Despite Cruzian fantasies, making a go of it in the trades is difficult, and you may want to have a word with the recent STEM bachelor's grads who can't find work. I hope you're sparing a thought for them and their future children as you get ready to cash those Social Security checks.
1
Well, of course, if you want higher rates of academic achievement by whatever standard, you can get it by lowering standards or by cheating. What else is there? Did you think someone was going to be able to start making some people smarter?
105
...or change our cultural patterns and environmental challenges.
1
The real travesty is that a lot of these people ARE smart, but through repetitive years of little education and less learning, they are given so poor a chance to compete with equally smart, but well-educated people.
Good teaching, in an environment where everyone in the school works together to support the students, and where teachers are expected to be experts in the material that they are teaching as well as know how to keep the students interested and motivated to learn, is theoretically possible. However it must be the rule, starting in kindergarten and continuing through high school, or the students (and/or teachers) will start cheating and accepting poor work and low standards to appear that the students are learning. Unfortunately this is now very rare. It is also something that is very hard to correct, as teaching (and school administration) is a very difficult job to do well and no longer attracts the quality of applicants it needs as it has a poor reputation (and low pay scale) in the U.S.
Is anyone really shocked here? Schools have been dumbing down curriculums for a long time. In order to leave no child behind you have to keep it simple. So both the smart kids and those who are less intellectually able are getting an education that is ultimately worth very little.
And it is not just in the poor inner city schools. Middle and upper class parents often place a great importance on their children's grades and teachers feel pressured not just to pass students but give more A's than B's, and B's than C's. But it used to be if your child was doing poorly you came to the teacher and tried to figure out what the problem was. Then came the rise of over protecting, enabling, and indulgent parenting. Now its the teachers fault if students fail. So everyone passes and no one really learns that much and society continues to produce workers that not only lack the skills but also the work ethic to compete in an irreversibly global economy.
And it is not just in the poor inner city schools. Middle and upper class parents often place a great importance on their children's grades and teachers feel pressured not just to pass students but give more A's than B's, and B's than C's. But it used to be if your child was doing poorly you came to the teacher and tried to figure out what the problem was. Then came the rise of over protecting, enabling, and indulgent parenting. Now its the teachers fault if students fail. So everyone passes and no one really learns that much and society continues to produce workers that not only lack the skills but also the work ethic to compete in an irreversibly global economy.
59
This is what happens when politicians and administrators prioritize the appearance of learning over the hard, repetitive work of actual educating, which involves failures, students held back, and standing up to angry overly-optimistic parents. This article precisely matches my experience teaching college freshmen. Many work at only a 6th or 8th grade level, cannot take notes, process and prioritize information, and have never written more than a few paragraphs at a time. They lack the years of hard work it takes to think through complex topics, plan a project and communicate the results. Yet somehow they were passed on year after year and handed a high school diploma with low or no actual skills - which is a travesty. Not surprising, in a world where an "insufficient" number of passing students results in a lowering of what passing means rather than keeping those students back to learn the material. As the media have finally found out, that is not learning, and it short-changes our students every day.
392
'...They lack the years of hard work it takes to think through complex topics, plan a project and communicate the results...'
Not just hard work, some people are simply stupid. Sending none-too-bright young people to college is not only a waste of time and money, but will destroy their lives, as they will not learn a skill that allows them to make a good living.
Being born smart is simply the luck of the draw, but a competent and hardworking plumber or electrician can make more money than many of us with our fancy college degrees.
Not just hard work, some people are simply stupid. Sending none-too-bright young people to college is not only a waste of time and money, but will destroy their lives, as they will not learn a skill that allows them to make a good living.
Being born smart is simply the luck of the draw, but a competent and hardworking plumber or electrician can make more money than many of us with our fancy college degrees.
1
Well, this isn't my experience. I have found that the students I teach are better trained and know more each year, on average. Surely the best 20% are better than I was at their age; maybe even the best 50%. They are also harder working.
I realize, of course, that I don't teach a representative sample. But I know several people who keep complaining about how the young don't measure up. I imagine that the cavemen claimed that the mammoths were smaller than in their youth. I understand that businesses wish their young employees had better skills. Ddon't we all? But one must face up to the fact that the skills demanded are much higher than they were 40 years ago.
I realize, of course, that I don't teach a representative sample. But I know several people who keep complaining about how the young don't measure up. I imagine that the cavemen claimed that the mammoths were smaller than in their youth. I understand that businesses wish their young employees had better skills. Ddon't we all? But one must face up to the fact that the skills demanded are much higher than they were 40 years ago.
1
It's been a while since I was working, but I met college "graduates" who could not write at all - not could they reason cogently, which meant it wasn't just "writing skills" but thinking skills missing. Some of them went on to "graduate school." There is a lot of BS sold( literally) as education. Some schools, colleges, etc, should not be accredited.
1
Death by a thousand cuts. That's the threat to teachers in low performing New York City schools if students don't graduate. As per state and city interpretations of Federal guidelines; graduation rate, credit accumulation and standardized test passing rates determine whether school live or die. Pass fewer than 80% of your students in a semester and you will be given poor evaluations which can force you out of your job. It's easy to game the system and pass kids in classes, but how do these kids pass those tricky state exams?
Students who repeatedly fail state tests are evaluated for special education services. Students sit for exams with a paraprofessional who reads questions to them (which is legal). This same person will often help (illegally) answer questions on the exam, the students' grade is often based on the literacy of the paraprofessional. Proctoring the tests is a joke, it's very hard to distinguish between reading questions and giving answers. We have had state regulators come in stop for a second, say high, and go on their merry way. Our passing rate for special ed. students is pretty good, but little improvement in actual literacy occurs.
We need to identify high need students and provide real services to them engaging trained educators in small groups. The way things work now employ many highly paid administrators , but do not educate students. Teachers are too afraid to speak out on these issues and it's very sad.
Students who repeatedly fail state tests are evaluated for special education services. Students sit for exams with a paraprofessional who reads questions to them (which is legal). This same person will often help (illegally) answer questions on the exam, the students' grade is often based on the literacy of the paraprofessional. Proctoring the tests is a joke, it's very hard to distinguish between reading questions and giving answers. We have had state regulators come in stop for a second, say high, and go on their merry way. Our passing rate for special ed. students is pretty good, but little improvement in actual literacy occurs.
We need to identify high need students and provide real services to them engaging trained educators in small groups. The way things work now employ many highly paid administrators , but do not educate students. Teachers are too afraid to speak out on these issues and it's very sad.
4
As someone working on bring back manufacturing to America, I like standardized testing on a nationwide basis Furthermore, I would like the manufactures to create and evaluate the test.
The schools could then be as nice as they want to parents, yet the students would be evaluated by the people who have to hire them.
How about a manufacturing high school diploma in addition to the useless school diploma? If you are capable of working on a shop floor the manufacturing diploma shouldn't be difficult, it just eliminates bad hires.
And yes, I do feel sorry for those that cannot make the grade. Yet if America is to resume the manufacturing mantel some will get left behind and I cannot help that and I apologize.
The schools could then be as nice as they want to parents, yet the students would be evaluated by the people who have to hire them.
How about a manufacturing high school diploma in addition to the useless school diploma? If you are capable of working on a shop floor the manufacturing diploma shouldn't be difficult, it just eliminates bad hires.
And yes, I do feel sorry for those that cannot make the grade. Yet if America is to resume the manufacturing mantel some will get left behind and I cannot help that and I apologize.
15
Yet as another story tell it, in NJ they want to "dumb down" the standards because the coddled teens are to stressed. Educational standards in this country are already too low. I find that supposedly well educated (MS, PhD MD) candidates that I interview have only limited knowledge outside of their fields.
9
My wife is an exception to this. That woman is so good, beyond her social sciences, she got seriously considered for a second PhD in planetary science and astrobiology. But then people mock people like that and say, "jack of all trades and master of none". There are masters of all trades (or many trades) and they are brilliant. Some engineers are very good in math or physics. Some chemists are excellent in IT. Some astrophysics are also good in bio-engineering. We do have jack of no trades (as the article reveals) and some masters of many trades or disciplines.
Well Gee when you focus on the results rather than an effective process well controlled bad things happen. No matter what you are talking about, and with these tests teachers cheat. They cheat by teaching the test, cooking the results, and ignoring educating their students. Just corrupt in every way.
3
ENOUGH about how poorly our students are doing; about how tests are too easy; about data that tells us our kids aren't performing! If it isn't already apparent, let me remind everyone that our failing schools are mostly (but not all) in high-poverty areas. Those children struggle with a variety of challenges that include drugs, gangs, homelessness, poor nutrition, poor supervision, poor study habits, poor role models, and segregation, etc.
We cannot continue to play "catch-up" when struggling students are leaving high school. We need 'big-picture" solutions. That includes living wage jobs; affordable nutritious foods; neighborhoods that are mixed and welcoming; neighborhoods that are safe, clean and affordable, etc. In other words, a level playing field so all children enter school ready to learn and all teachers can focus on the lesson rather than if a student has eaten/slept/finished homework the previous evening.
We cannot continue to play "catch-up" when struggling students are leaving high school. We need 'big-picture" solutions. That includes living wage jobs; affordable nutritious foods; neighborhoods that are mixed and welcoming; neighborhoods that are safe, clean and affordable, etc. In other words, a level playing field so all children enter school ready to learn and all teachers can focus on the lesson rather than if a student has eaten/slept/finished homework the previous evening.
13
Children whose parents do not value education will always be at a disadvantage in comparison to those whose parents do.
2
I think you missed the argument OP was trying to make. How can you expect a parent to actualize a "value education" when they are working two jobs, live in tough neighboorhoods, are incarcerated, don't have good access to good foods, grow up around lead, etc..
Please let me modify your question Charles W. to this;
"Children whose parents LIVE IN REALLY TOUGH SITUATIONS will always be at a disadvantage in comparison to those whose parents don't."
Big picture solutions really are needed.
Please let me modify your question Charles W. to this;
"Children whose parents LIVE IN REALLY TOUGH SITUATIONS will always be at a disadvantage in comparison to those whose parents don't."
Big picture solutions really are needed.
3
As a person who has taught at research-oriented universities for more than 40 years, I can report that what has happened in K-12 is happening in college. More degrees does not mean more educated, capable, prepared graduates.
41
But just wait until Bernie Sanders or Hillary Clinton make college free for all. Then we'll have smarter, better prepared college students. Just you wait.
2
I remember well one history class at a R1 university. After the first submission of papers, our poor professor was so distraught that he abandoned the planned lecture after about 5 minutes, and proceeded to inform the class of 500 of the differences between 'their', 'there' and 'they're', and a hundred other very basic things. This took up the entire class period. When you have to correct basic grammar on every page for half the papers, who can even begin to assess knowledge of subject matter?? You'll pass anyone who can write cogently enough.
59
The sad part is that the Institute for Education Science in the U.S. Department of Education was created to develop methods and programs at the experimental level of research to make teachers more effective.
IES and D Ed remain a mystery to the vast majority of school teachers and school administrators. If you give a teacher a program whether it is reading, math or science and it cannot demonstrate an effect size compared to the control group it is time to abolish schools of education and IES and the Department of Education.
D Education and IES have spent tens of billions of dollars on developing teaching methods that improve leaning in the same manner that experimental research guides medicine.
I do know that the Voyager Universal Learning Reading Program got billions of dollars from D Ed and Grover Whitehurst the IES administrator did not have the stones to test it.
He now works at Brookings pontificating about education.
IES and D Ed remain a mystery to the vast majority of school teachers and school administrators. If you give a teacher a program whether it is reading, math or science and it cannot demonstrate an effect size compared to the control group it is time to abolish schools of education and IES and the Department of Education.
D Education and IES have spent tens of billions of dollars on developing teaching methods that improve leaning in the same manner that experimental research guides medicine.
I do know that the Voyager Universal Learning Reading Program got billions of dollars from D Ed and Grover Whitehurst the IES administrator did not have the stones to test it.
He now works at Brookings pontificating about education.
2
What about Khan academy? Another smoke and mirrors, fed by political correctness and political influence? Or...is this great as it is marketed to be? And idiots in India, who cannot develop their own curriculum, suddenly want to import this. Talk about a colonized mind.
Judging schools on a phony measure like graduation rates and not linking that to standards attained by the "graduating" students leads to social promotion! Schools will then pressure teachers to pass students regardless of their performance. Kids don't have to strive to achieve much except show up. This dysfunctional system will then take care of everything else!
13
Not Mark...
Thanks RichCal. You have hit what I have been shouting for many years in research. The over emphasis on quantitative data, that can either be manipulated, become selective in what it reveals, skewed in what it describes ror profiles...and may even be irrelevant. We need a combination of quantitative and qualitative research. It is true that test scores help reveal how many students pass a specific kind of exam. But qualitative research has helped us know that doing well on tests and actual mastery of content are not always connected. And students can be coached or tutored to pass exams. Tests can lower standards. You pass, but have done so at a lower standard. Numbers do not reveal these processes, trends, changes and context. Qualitative research can.
Thanks RichCal. You have hit what I have been shouting for many years in research. The over emphasis on quantitative data, that can either be manipulated, become selective in what it reveals, skewed in what it describes ror profiles...and may even be irrelevant. We need a combination of quantitative and qualitative research. It is true that test scores help reveal how many students pass a specific kind of exam. But qualitative research has helped us know that doing well on tests and actual mastery of content are not always connected. And students can be coached or tutored to pass exams. Tests can lower standards. You pass, but have done so at a lower standard. Numbers do not reveal these processes, trends, changes and context. Qualitative research can.
The administrators are experts at gaming the system, including exerting subtle (and not so subtle) pressure on teachers to graduate students who have little to no academic capability at all. Tell you what - if you want to see a difference don't bother with standards for graduation - change the standards for college admissions so that unqualified students are not admitted, period. I think if that happens, elementary and high schools will improve dramatically.
20
@ Dennis Martin
It used to be that way but the growing number of colleges (particularly, but not limited to, for profit institutions like Phoenix U) vying for applicants has driven down admission standards.
It used to be that way but the growing number of colleges (particularly, but not limited to, for profit institutions like Phoenix U) vying for applicants has driven down admission standards.
1
The problem is one that K12-land desperately does not want to hear.
K12 teachers are trained, in ed colleges, to "deliver content". All learning, all knowledge, is reduced to "content"; those who know something are referred to, somewhat derisively, as "content experts", and are kept firmly away from the actual business of education.
I watch as my daughter and her friends are taught, in a blue-ribbon, self-celebratory school district, complete garbage by well-applauded teachers who just plain don't know very much and don't want to hear that they don't know enough to be teaching.
You get this scramble to do with standards because by and large the people who develop standards and write tests are either overeducated itinerants or professors who actually know something in their fields. The K12 teachers then scramble to pretend that they are meeting the standards, usually by buying and serving up, with terrible literalness and poor fidelity, some curriculum advertised as standards-meeting. The teachers themselves, for the most part, are not capable of generating curriculum on the fly that does meet the standards. They just don't know enough. Worse, they don't know when they're misinterpreting what they're reading and heading off into intellectual garbageland. The children, of course, are none the wiser, but do know they're supposed to pass the tests, so they stuff it all in, then let it fall out again.
It's not an educational system.
K12 teachers are trained, in ed colleges, to "deliver content". All learning, all knowledge, is reduced to "content"; those who know something are referred to, somewhat derisively, as "content experts", and are kept firmly away from the actual business of education.
I watch as my daughter and her friends are taught, in a blue-ribbon, self-celebratory school district, complete garbage by well-applauded teachers who just plain don't know very much and don't want to hear that they don't know enough to be teaching.
You get this scramble to do with standards because by and large the people who develop standards and write tests are either overeducated itinerants or professors who actually know something in their fields. The K12 teachers then scramble to pretend that they are meeting the standards, usually by buying and serving up, with terrible literalness and poor fidelity, some curriculum advertised as standards-meeting. The teachers themselves, for the most part, are not capable of generating curriculum on the fly that does meet the standards. They just don't know enough. Worse, they don't know when they're misinterpreting what they're reading and heading off into intellectual garbageland. The children, of course, are none the wiser, but do know they're supposed to pass the tests, so they stuff it all in, then let it fall out again.
It's not an educational system.
221
The real problem is that parents, even parents in blue-ribbon, self-celebratory school districts, don't actually know enough about education to judge the quality of teachers or instruction, but everyone from politicians to the media to other parents tells them they do.
The quality of our teachers (not TFA'ers or subs or emergency certified warm bodies hired to stand at the front of the room because the job is so unattractive that nobody wants it, but actual qualified teachers) is not now and has never been the problem. As a whole, with the usual number of exceptions you'd expect to find in any large group, they can do the job. They're just not allowed to.
The quality of our teachers (not TFA'ers or subs or emergency certified warm bodies hired to stand at the front of the room because the job is so unattractive that nobody wants it, but actual qualified teachers) is not now and has never been the problem. As a whole, with the usual number of exceptions you'd expect to find in any large group, they can do the job. They're just not allowed to.
3
Teachers are the backbone of the education system. we get what we pay.
This is nothing new. I graduated with my first degree in 1981, in Spanish, with a teaching certificate (this means I had at least 40 hours of Spanish and a minor in teaching). I was passed over for teachers who had a minor in Spanish (15 hours) who had majored in education. I went back to school for a nursing degree. At least the Spanish comes in handy there.
2
Please note that this dumb-down of high school standards is happening at a time when California has also begun decimating remedial courses in 2 year colleges. The plan is to not offer any at all. I predict one of two possible results:
1) college degrees replace high school diplomas in value
2) college degrees go to wealthy students who prepped at private high schools
1) college degrees replace high school diplomas in value
2) college degrees go to wealthy students who prepped at private high schools
5
Why does this not surprise me. Until teaching is considered as honorable job as as any profession and paid commeasurately for the time and skill it requires, until every student has an adequate computer and no guns or cell phones are allowed in the classroom, until the congress can agree that the destruction of the middle class is a bad idea and that corporations need supervision on their ethical decisions, and until we face the major problems of our society honestly, we can expect what you see reported in this article to only grow.
5
Education, in general, has been dumbed down. Every parents wants an honor student who can get an athletic scholarship. Not much different at universities. Witness students who protest over the ethnic diversity/authenticity of their cafeteria food choices, all while taking courses on the lyrics of Lady Gaga's music. We must stop emphasizing college for every child. Skilled tradesman are vital to our future and we are turning our backs on these professions as somehow unworthy.
15
I had just read that Stephen Colbert's ratings are tanking because he's too highbrow. I find this ironic, since thoughtful as he is, even he can't hold an meaningful conversation with an intelligent guest under the strictures demanded in late-night TV. You can't engage in a meaningful discourse with someone when it is limited to 5 minutes and you are contractually obligated to interject with something funny every 2.3 seconds. Watching some of Dick Cavett's interviews from the 70's on YouTube is an eye-opener. He actually kept his mouth shut and let his guests speak unrestrained, sometimes for minutes at a time! On the other hand, he also tanked for the same reasons.
This country does not prize education in any form, except as a means to make money, by deceit if necessary. Many of these high-schoolers know, at some level, that however hard they apply themselves, it will all be for naught and for many, there is no pot of gold at the end of the rainbow. There is no one in their family or community who is appreciated solely on the basis of their knowledge, only on their material trappings.
This country does not prize education in any form, except as a means to make money, by deceit if necessary. Many of these high-schoolers know, at some level, that however hard they apply themselves, it will all be for naught and for many, there is no pot of gold at the end of the rainbow. There is no one in their family or community who is appreciated solely on the basis of their knowledge, only on their material trappings.
13
Whenever I encounter the term "graduation rate", I always wonder how that rate is being determined. It requires a base number on which to calculate the percentage who do receive a diploma.
What is that base number? Is it the number of students in the first grade in that school district when this year's graduates started school? Or what is the base grade level used for the calculation? How are students accounted for who move in or out of the school district in the interim?
It strikes me as a meaningless "statistic" without a commonly recognized standard for its calculation. Therefore, it really is not possible to compare one school, school district, city, or state, or even one nation, to another in terms of graduation rates.
What is that base number? Is it the number of students in the first grade in that school district when this year's graduates started school? Or what is the base grade level used for the calculation? How are students accounted for who move in or out of the school district in the interim?
It strikes me as a meaningless "statistic" without a commonly recognized standard for its calculation. Therefore, it really is not possible to compare one school, school district, city, or state, or even one nation, to another in terms of graduation rates.
8
The Federal government requires graduation rates to be calculated based on 4-year ACGR data which is essentially based on the "average" number of students who enter 9th grade that, then, graduate four years later. It is not perfect but, gives a relatively accurate picture of the high school's performance.
Whether a graduation rate gives "a relatively accurate picture of the high school's performance" depends on how you define "high school." Are we talking about "performance" in terms of instructional quality, with the school defined as the system of delivering instruction? Graduation rates don't give an accurate picture of that at all, since the schools will generally be punished if they don't graduate most of the kids who attend regardless of how much they actually learn. If you define the school more as the students who attend than the adults who work there, graduation rates might tell you a bit more, but what they tell you for the most part is what percentage of families have refused to let their kids drop out
They're certainly useless for gauging instructional quality, which means most of the conclusions people make based on school graduation rates are unfounded.
They're certainly useless for gauging instructional quality, which means most of the conclusions people make based on school graduation rates are unfounded.
1
I agree Eric. I was only answering her query regarding the establishment of a "base" number for the mere statistical computation of graduation "rate". Performance educationally, is a different story.
Our local H.S. calculates their graduation rate based on the number of seniors enrolled for second semester. They divide that number into the actual seniors who get a diploma. Amazingly, our graduation rate is only about 93%. The community is so impressed with the number, but those of us who work in adult literacy realize that it is a fabrication. Exiting non-performing seniors before Christmas is not an honorable way to increase the graduation rate.
10
"Our local H.S. calculates their graduation rate based on the number of seniors enrolled for second semester. They divide that number into the actual seniors who get a diploma".........
Hmmmmm. And you're sure about that?
Hmmmmm. And you're sure about that?
My kids have gone to both public high school and public charter high schools. Unfortunately, all these schools have a significant number of kids who would rather not do any work. This is regardless of race or economic status. I believe parents have to be involved -not doing the kids' work, or hovering, but making rules that homework must be done before leisure activities, checking their children's work, attending parent teacher conferences whenever possible, and asking questions about what their kids are learning. However, in families where there is one parent, and that parent is stretched thin between work and home duties, parents who work 3 jobs and are thus not home, and parents who are otherwise absent, the kids suffer because these parents are not involved. Also, we have legislated the teeth out of discipline in schools. Kids cannot be made to do their work, or to respect the teachers. Besides over-testing, between lax parenting and lax school discipline we have a failing system.
25
I taught high school American history for 38 years. during that time, I was one of 500 teachers in Illinois designated a Master Teacher, spoke at national conventions, published in national journals and received a Fulbright to teach in England for a year. In my last year of teaching, I gave a girl a C who scored average on all of her objective exams. She was healthy but regularly missed one out of three days of school. Her parents hired a lawyer to get her grade changed. My school district also had to hire a lawyer to defend me. I won, but the whole story is insane. Grade inflation has become a real problem for high school and college students. Thank heaven I am retired.
78
You were lucky your school district backed you up. I usually hear about the administrators siding with the parents.
5
Was there ever a point in history where we graduated almost every student with an acceptable level of analytical writing and basic competency in Algebra II? Where most high school graduates were college ready?
When I was still in school, a kid with good spatial skills might be a mechanic, or a machinist. People who weren't stellar at advanced math could work in a factory, or as a dock worker. Or a receptionist, a telephone operator. They could work the family farm, or the family store.
What seems to have changed the most isn't that we have fewer college ready kids - it is that we have fewer jobs for those who are not academically oriented, and don't know how to solve that problem in our high schools.
We certainly have some really poor school systems and some endemic problems with grading, curricula, standards, testing, and so on. Bur we also have a fundamental Lake Wobegon problem: our children are not all well above average.
When I was still in school, a kid with good spatial skills might be a mechanic, or a machinist. People who weren't stellar at advanced math could work in a factory, or as a dock worker. Or a receptionist, a telephone operator. They could work the family farm, or the family store.
What seems to have changed the most isn't that we have fewer college ready kids - it is that we have fewer jobs for those who are not academically oriented, and don't know how to solve that problem in our high schools.
We certainly have some really poor school systems and some endemic problems with grading, curricula, standards, testing, and so on. Bur we also have a fundamental Lake Wobegon problem: our children are not all well above average.
71
Not Mark...
There is also the tendency to assume that the academe is always the center of all kinds of intelligence, and measures different types of intelligence reliably and accurately. Not true.
Ansel Adams was a hyper active kid who could not sit in class, follow instructions and fill in boxes. Because his father was rich and a bit of rebel himself he actually took Ansel out of his school, had him home schooled at his own pace and encouraged his son's interest in nature, outdoor life and photography. We now know Ansel Adams as a brilliant photographer whose works dominate the curriculum of many Departments of Photography, Design and Graphics. Similarly lot of painting, music, dance, etc..cannot be taught at an advanced level, except for its theories and foundations, even in a university. It has to come from experience, experimentation and the actual doing. Sometimes it is just brilliance within.
Our studies in neurology have not caught on with different types of intelligence very well. For example, how do you measure intuition? One of the brightest clinical social worker I knew in mental health was brilliant because she was so uniquely intuitive. She could tell what was ailing a client in few lines of their sharing.
Lot of research requires intuitive knowing, finding or filling in the gaps. What measure do we have for that?
We need to connect the academe, the art of learning and teaching, better with all kinds of intelligence and abilities. Not just some.
There is also the tendency to assume that the academe is always the center of all kinds of intelligence, and measures different types of intelligence reliably and accurately. Not true.
Ansel Adams was a hyper active kid who could not sit in class, follow instructions and fill in boxes. Because his father was rich and a bit of rebel himself he actually took Ansel out of his school, had him home schooled at his own pace and encouraged his son's interest in nature, outdoor life and photography. We now know Ansel Adams as a brilliant photographer whose works dominate the curriculum of many Departments of Photography, Design and Graphics. Similarly lot of painting, music, dance, etc..cannot be taught at an advanced level, except for its theories and foundations, even in a university. It has to come from experience, experimentation and the actual doing. Sometimes it is just brilliance within.
Our studies in neurology have not caught on with different types of intelligence very well. For example, how do you measure intuition? One of the brightest clinical social worker I knew in mental health was brilliant because she was so uniquely intuitive. She could tell what was ailing a client in few lines of their sharing.
Lot of research requires intuitive knowing, finding or filling in the gaps. What measure do we have for that?
We need to connect the academe, the art of learning and teaching, better with all kinds of intelligence and abilities. Not just some.
2
This is hardly new. When I was teaching college in the late Seventies, freshmen from upper middle class suburban high schools were often unable to parse a simple sentence, let alone a paragraph, a page, or a chapter of standard English prose. Their efforts at written work, 5-10 pp papers or essay exams were of very poor quality. And there was little or nothing I could do about it. I had no training in teaching remedial reading; I was supposed to be teaching freshman history. But it was too late. At the same time, those kids came from well to do families, and I'm sure they went on to become successful, or at least prosperous.
15
As a teacher at both the HS and college level for more than 30 years, I am wondering how anyone could be surprised to read that education has been harmed, not helped, in the past 15 years of the disastrous Race to Nowhere model given to us by Texas, but perpetuated, unforgivably, by the Obama administration. Children really have stopped learning--and who can blame them? Real learning takes place in an atmosphere of both joy and discipline, hard work motivated intrinsically as well as by extrinsics such as tests. Kids are burned out at age 10, but when they most need to be on fire with the eager pleasure of skill and knowledge. What a mess we have made, and no one listened to the teachers all along, not one of whom approved of this horrible "plan." It will take a generation to turn this juggernaut around.
18
Oh please, it was bad way before No Child. That was what brought it up in the first place. Terrible content, terrible teachers, ineffective educators, but no one ever gets fired. It will take a complete overhaul of the education colleges and teacher training before anything ever changes and I don't see that happening. Got my last kid into college this fall and he was shocked (shocked!) to find out that all those AP classes and academic courses weren't even close to college level (even after his two older siblings tried). But the school keeps telling the kids that all the time, they are so brilliant, etc. I don't know what they teach the kids in the regular classes, but it must be very, very easy.
3
This is shocking to no one inside of secondary education. Governments at the state and federal level penalize school districts for low graduation rates. Administrators lose their jobs over penalties. They know that they can either motivate the students to work harder or pressure teachers into passing students by penalizing the teachers who hold students accountable. Since the first option is impossible, the second option is the one that they choose. After being penalized or threatened with dismissal, the teachers simply stop trying to hold the line.
When I read the comments on here of people who just don't understand the dynamics of public education in the United States, people who are reading a (relatively) sophisticated publication, I just want to cry.
When I read the comments on here of people who just don't understand the dynamics of public education in the United States, people who are reading a (relatively) sophisticated publication, I just want to cry.
22
It is obvious that we cannot trust the states to set reasonable standards for content, classroom performance worthy of graduation, minimums for courses available to students and the proper credentialling of instructors.
The politics needs to be pushed out of the administration of schools, the preparation of texts, the standards for advancement and the list of complete tigons and achievements necessary to graduate. That is not going to happen with local control and highly politicized school boards controlling things.
We need uniform funding, universal standards for graduation, a national minimum standard for course offerings. I would propose the IB standard would be a proper mark for college bound students.
Children need to be plainly told to learn or leave and leaving is a path to poverty. When they are expected to learn and excuses are not tolerated, they will get the message.
Someone has to sweep streets and work on the garbage truck.
The politics needs to be pushed out of the administration of schools, the preparation of texts, the standards for advancement and the list of complete tigons and achievements necessary to graduate. That is not going to happen with local control and highly politicized school boards controlling things.
We need uniform funding, universal standards for graduation, a national minimum standard for course offerings. I would propose the IB standard would be a proper mark for college bound students.
Children need to be plainly told to learn or leave and leaving is a path to poverty. When they are expected to learn and excuses are not tolerated, they will get the message.
Someone has to sweep streets and work on the garbage truck.
9
Unfortunately, the facts presented in this article are an unsurprising consequence of countrywide academic standards not being enforced.
One is tempted to draw comparisons to the Indian and Chinese systems of education. While there are many areas where these systems fail, one thing is for certain: Chinese and Indian students who graduate at the top of their class, even in village schools, are prepared at the minimum to do decently well in their college entrance exams (say the Gaokao in China, or the HSC and IIT exams in India). While countrywide standards may lead to extreme competition, at the very least it ensures that your high school diploma doesn't become meaningless.
Education is supposed to be the key engine of social advancement, especially for poor but determined and bright students. Certainly that's the line touted by all our presidential candidates. But the very idea becomes farcical-- and a cruel joke on our neediest students-- when even the hardest workers in the graduating class are inadequately prepared for college.
One is tempted to draw comparisons to the Indian and Chinese systems of education. While there are many areas where these systems fail, one thing is for certain: Chinese and Indian students who graduate at the top of their class, even in village schools, are prepared at the minimum to do decently well in their college entrance exams (say the Gaokao in China, or the HSC and IIT exams in India). While countrywide standards may lead to extreme competition, at the very least it ensures that your high school diploma doesn't become meaningless.
Education is supposed to be the key engine of social advancement, especially for poor but determined and bright students. Certainly that's the line touted by all our presidential candidates. But the very idea becomes farcical-- and a cruel joke on our neediest students-- when even the hardest workers in the graduating class are inadequately prepared for college.
169
The hardest workers in nearly any class are well prepared for college. The problem is that in some districts, the difference between the hardest workers and the laziest students is not too much; those districts tend to be in affluent areas where the parents themselves are educated and value education, and they're doing a fine job. In other districts, however, the difference between the hardest workers and the laziest is a huge gulf, with the lazy kids who won't do any work at all comprising a sizable minority or even a majority of the students, and all our public policy insists that if those kids don't graduate at roughly the same rate as the kids in the districts where most of them actually try, it must be the teachers' fault and we should fire them all. So standards are lowered, and while the top kids are still prepared for colleges, lots of kids graduate who shouldn't.
But not to fear. Instead of bashing teachers for failing too many kids, we can bash them for passing as many kids as we've required them to pass. Either way, we get to bash teachers, and that's what's important.
But not to fear. Instead of bashing teachers for failing too many kids, we can bash them for passing as many kids as we've required them to pass. Either way, we get to bash teachers, and that's what's important.
2
China has 400,000,000 students of school age of whom 5,000,000 attend college -1.25%.
US has 74,000,000 students of school age of whom 20,000,000 attend college - 27%.
So who's which is better educating its kids????
US has 74,000,000 students of school age of whom 20,000,000 attend college - 27%.
So who's which is better educating its kids????
1
Ian - "But the very idea becomes farcical-- and a cruel joke on our neediest students-- when even the hardest workers in the graduating class are inadequately prepared for college."
We as a society need to concentrate on the causes [blame] of this inadequate preparation and see to it that they are removed.
We as a society need to concentrate on the causes [blame] of this inadequate preparation and see to it that they are removed.
I was educated in the Catholic schools of the Diocese of Brooklyn in the 1950s and 1960s. We had no special equipment, no learning aids, no assistant teachers and not even a gym. In eight years we went on three field trips. No bells and whistles here. We only had books and paper, pencils and pens and were taught discipline and respect.
Despite some of the the horror stories one hears about nuns and Catholic schools, I was never physically disciplined in 14 years. We ALL (and I do mean all) were above our grade level in reading. We memorized our multiplication tables and we diagrammed sentences. Any test score below 75% was considered a failure. The expectation was that we would be successful in learning and if a student could not master the work, they were not promoted until they could.
I have yet to meet a person educated in my time in the Catholic School system who was unprepared for a job or college. All of this was done without vast sums of money, computers or other.
Even today though not as good as they were in the past, Catholic schools still produce better educated students. They must be doing something right.
Despite some of the the horror stories one hears about nuns and Catholic schools, I was never physically disciplined in 14 years. We ALL (and I do mean all) were above our grade level in reading. We memorized our multiplication tables and we diagrammed sentences. Any test score below 75% was considered a failure. The expectation was that we would be successful in learning and if a student could not master the work, they were not promoted until they could.
I have yet to meet a person educated in my time in the Catholic School system who was unprepared for a job or college. All of this was done without vast sums of money, computers or other.
Even today though not as good as they were in the past, Catholic schools still produce better educated students. They must be doing something right.
31
I agree completely. One of the main reasons the public school system is a failure today is that there are fewer nuns around to alleviate the tax burden on cities that are now being forced to educate large numbers of students for whom the tax paying citizen has very little interest. The great infrastructure of the Catholic school system that educated large numbers of students from all walks of life has been largely diminished due to demographic and societal shifts that have only served to our detriment. Today, instead of these dedicated women we have McKinsey and Associates consultants running our schools into the ground, with the help of the political lackeys who do their bidding.
4
Although the nuns in your particular school may not have wielded rulers recklessly, I'm sure they didn't take any guff from the kids. Everyone was required to learn whether they liked it or not, and that made a big difference.
I've met some people who were educated at Catholic schools, who strike me as being of only average intelligence or slightly above, who are nevertheless very literate and capable. Those schools got results.
I've met some people who were educated at Catholic schools, who strike me as being of only average intelligence or slightly above, who are nevertheless very literate and capable. Those schools got results.
3
I've been working at the college level for quite a few years teaching a reading course and a course that introduces students at the community college level to the skills that they will need to work successfully in college-level content courses.
While a few of the students that I have taught are able to succeed in college-level work, the majority are either clearly not ready, or do not have the ability or motivation to work at the college level. What concerns me most as an instructor is the damage that has been done to learning, and an interest in learning, through the use of the superficial social networking that the Internet and "smart" phones provide. Students do not have the background knowledge to master college material. Their writing is often negatively affected by constant texting. In a job market with very specific requirements, these skill voids are a decided disadvantage.
While a few of the students that I have taught are able to succeed in college-level work, the majority are either clearly not ready, or do not have the ability or motivation to work at the college level. What concerns me most as an instructor is the damage that has been done to learning, and an interest in learning, through the use of the superficial social networking that the Internet and "smart" phones provide. Students do not have the background knowledge to master college material. Their writing is often negatively affected by constant texting. In a job market with very specific requirements, these skill voids are a decided disadvantage.
56
I'd point out that community college courses taught at the 100 level and above ARE college courses, and that texting is still writing, and that you're fantasizing about the good old days, and that the real issue is whether we're going to make good on the promise of public education, but let me recommend that you read Scholes "The Rise and Fall of English," and any of Mike Rose's books and call me in the morning.
2
Many people incorrectly believe that all children have equal abilities and all would have equal outcomes if given equal opportunity. As this is not the case, standards had to be lowered to the lowest level in order to have those equal outcomes. We need to follow the examples of other countries, like Japan, where children are put on the correct track and career path early in life.
47
WOW!!! &, remove all nurturing of natural interest in & developing academic skills through learning about things a young student is really CURIOUS about..
Successful careers, as I've observed & experience are built best when interest & passion blend together & continued curiosity keeps a person away from "burn out".
Successful careers, as I've observed & experience are built best when interest & passion blend together & continued curiosity keeps a person away from "burn out".
1
There is no great mystery. Academic achievement is closely correlated with IQ. Without an IQ of at least 115, there is little hope a student will understand the complex and abstract concepts she will be expected to master in college.
See the paper, "Social Consequences of Group Differences in Cognitive Ability" by Linda Gottfredson of the University of Delaware College of Education.
See the paper, "Social Consequences of Group Differences in Cognitive Ability" by Linda Gottfredson of the University of Delaware College of Education.
33
Haven't you heard, Mike? The best teachers can now make silk purses out of sows' ears. They can lead the horses to water AND make them drink! The Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation have the statistics to prove it. And these teachers usually work in charter schools, of course. Go figure.
1
Is this really a problem? As long as these high schools turn out graduates who will vote for candidates like Donald Trump and Ted Cruz and who can get jobs as janitors, maids, and other service workers for the graduates of elite private schools and public schools in Palo Alto, Newtown Centre, East Asia and Europe, what's the big deal?
16
Don't you mean as long as they vote for democrats who promise them lots of "free stuff"?
3
Charles W. has no idea just how excellently he's illustrated Richard Grayson's point.
1
And you, Eric, have no idea just how excellently you have illustrated CHARLES W's point.
Teachers are under tremendous pressure to pass all students. If you fail a lot of students you will lose your job. I was called into the principals office once and told that I had failed too many students. How many had I failed? Less than 10% of the class and it was because they did nothing - absolutely nothing. I had a colleague who gave students points for coming into the classroom quietly, sitting down and doing bell work, having their supplies, staying seated when asked, etc. She failed no one. The principal loved her. She's still teaching in that school and is the head of the teacher's union. I quite teaching 10 years ago.
161
My 15 year old told us that in the local high school where she spent her freshman year, that they told the students they would pass if they showed up for class! She is now in a charter high school/early college program, (and loves it), but even there she takes college classes with some adults who do not do their work! My husband has a friend who teaches at University of New Mexico, and he says he too is under pressure to pass students. I am horrified that some of the best teachers out there are leaving the profession because of these issues. Thank you for all that you did!
3
You meant "quit" and ethical folks don't pass students when they have not done the job.
1
Ethical people also don't let their own families go hungry. And given a choice between failing students who deserve to fail or keeping their own jobs and their own ability to feed their kids, ethical teachers could reasonably end up on either side of that choice.
They shouldn't have to choose.
They shouldn't have to choose.
3
Forget high school students. I've met college graduates in the US who didn't know the history or geography of their own country, much less that of the rest of the world. I compare that to the 10 and 11 year-olds I meet in Europe who can comfortably discuss world history and recite the name of the US states.
70
Or grown up adults in a Fortune 5 company asking if my parents in India were Ok when the Iraq war started in early 2000s. They thought that India was in the Middle East. I appreciated their concern but I was dismayed at their ignorance.
Or compare that with senior executives in the same company confusing one homonym with another or spelling simple words incorrectly and taking inordinate and misplaced pride at their bad English as if poor diction is a mark of respect.
Or compare that with senior executives in the same company confusing one homonym with another or spelling simple words incorrectly and taking inordinate and misplaced pride at their bad English as if poor diction is a mark of respect.
3
If everybody is educated to the same level, that level *must* be low.
As far as feasible, teach everybody to their maximum level. Doing so demands dedication and resources. Doing so required individual assessment, rather than standardized testing, and that requires trust in educators and evaluators.
As far as feasible, teach everybody to their maximum level. Doing so demands dedication and resources. Doing so required individual assessment, rather than standardized testing, and that requires trust in educators and evaluators.
15
Well that depends on what "low" is. There is a certain minimum that is required, and that won't cut it at a real college. It should be good enough to work at other activities. Trusting in educators has gotten the unethical and corrupt activities that we see.
1
Also: less emphasis on sports. Open a book, not a hole in the secondary.
Vulcanalex, the issues this story is discussing result almost entirely from a LACK of trust in educators. You're blaming the problem on nearly the only group of people who've been fighting against it for years.
1
Heard the latest? Kids coming out of high school don't know much about history.
11
Agreed, but if emphasized and tested like math, english, and science they would! Hard to find a place for an "H" in STEM or STEAM.....maybe SHTEM or SHTEAM?
"Agreed, but if emphasized and tested like math, english..."
Didn't Santa say "those who forget history are condemned to repeatedly report it as news"?
...Andrew
Didn't Santa say "those who forget history are condemned to repeatedly report it as news"?
...Andrew
Also, don't know much biology.
1
Imagine if we attempted to build our Olympic team the same way we are trying to increase the number of college grads. We would tell our kids anyone can be on the team, open up participation to all, even if they have never participated in the sport and don't really like it. We would spend a fortune on the uncoordinated, the disinterested, the truculent, the downright hostile.
Doing well in school, doing well as an athlete, is hard, stressful work. There is no easy way. How did we get off into this make believe world -- that Sanders and Clinton seem determined to worsen -- where we throw money at college for the unprepared, thinking this helps this country or its citizens?! All we have done is allow all manner of "colleges" to mine the Federal Treasury, using students to do the pick and shovel work.
There are no do overs. The last time to get a good K-12 education is in K-12. After this, trying to use college to remediate, is just a waste of money.
Doing well in school, doing well as an athlete, is hard, stressful work. There is no easy way. How did we get off into this make believe world -- that Sanders and Clinton seem determined to worsen -- where we throw money at college for the unprepared, thinking this helps this country or its citizens?! All we have done is allow all manner of "colleges" to mine the Federal Treasury, using students to do the pick and shovel work.
There are no do overs. The last time to get a good K-12 education is in K-12. After this, trying to use college to remediate, is just a waste of money.
35
Quite correct and if you actually demand proper process we would be better off. Bad raw material never created good product, never!!!
2
"Doing well in school, doing well as an athlete, is hard, stressful work. "
As a parent that attends various Board of Ed and PTA meetings, I get to hear plenty of parents that don't believe kids should have to work hard or ever experience stress. "Childhood is for fun" is their mantra. Yet so many parents - often the same - speak of the character building nature of competitive sports.
It's an odd disconnect.
What seems oddest to me though is this fear that only as children can people have fun, and only without working hard can children have fun. Neither is true.
The grin that follows achievement of a difficult goal - by an adult or a child - is priceless.
...Andrew
As a parent that attends various Board of Ed and PTA meetings, I get to hear plenty of parents that don't believe kids should have to work hard or ever experience stress. "Childhood is for fun" is their mantra. Yet so many parents - often the same - speak of the character building nature of competitive sports.
It's an odd disconnect.
What seems oddest to me though is this fear that only as children can people have fun, and only without working hard can children have fun. Neither is true.
The grin that follows achievement of a difficult goal - by an adult or a child - is priceless.
...Andrew
3
Clinton and (to a greater degree, since Clinton seems mostly to be doing lip-service) Sanders seem to be suggesting that we're wasting a lot of our potential when we base decisions on who can go to college on whose family can pay rather than on who's intellectually qualified. College for everyone who qualifies is likely to make things better, not worse--but it would cost money. If you want "worse," you can find it on the other side of the aisle.
2
this is what happens when the best educated get paid disproportionately and forego childbearing for interest-bearing retirement programs, plus when they do reproduce, they can concentrate their earnings on fewer children than the lesser-educated who tend to pop kids with thinking of the households they're bringing them into. in large part b/c we refuse to encourage family planning anymore esp for the growing underclass. and then these kids of irresponsible parents go to school and in the 6 or 7 hours a day teachers have them, they're to reverse crummy households these kids spend the rest of their waking lives in. bad teachers! but thats OK, we'll let cops shoot you with impunity but you can reproduce at will, with our apologies. hillary says "the village" will help you raise your kid. just give us your taxes, school administrators will waste, I mean do, the rest. what they'll do is grade inflate to the point where all you have to do is drool and point and shazam!, yer a gradeate. and while its another response, not all kids need 4 years of math or english. my 3 years of english got me zero in life except an appreciation of russian novels. and while my masters in mech engineering did require 4 years of h/s math the only thing advanced calc ever got me was prereq for linear algebra and diff eq, the very little bit of math I use in my daily work life. advanced pure math is only for people who cant do it. some basic stats, basic biology and chemistry and you'll get along fine.
4
I've been teaching HS ELA in the NYC Public Schools for 13 years. Standards keep getting lower and lower. I've never heard of a teacher who passes 90% of their kids being pulled into an administrator's office to discuss their numbers, but drop below a 70% pass rate and watch how fast you're on the spot. And of course, thanks to years of "education reform" efforts, it's all the teacher's fault. A kid doesn't do homework? Teacher's fault for giving too much homework. Solution: adopt a No Homework policy as a means of achieving "social justice". A kid who lives in a shelter/ in poverty/ witnesses violence fails? Teacher's fault for not reaching out enough or providing enough "socio-emotional support". Kid can't pass a standardized test? Make the test easier and rate the teacher down. It goes on and on. It's all about profit, union breaking and moving money to consultants and charters. Teacher retention rates today are awful and teacher education programs are failing to enroll. School-to-prison pipeline in the news? Stop suspending and remove consequences for bad behavior. If chaos follows, blame teachers for poor classroom management. The smart kids can make the numbers so why bother with them? Focus on getting the lowest performing to reach minimums. Then everyone goes to college because everyone needs to be in debt forever. If kids show up most of the time and aren't too horribly behaved, they believe they should pass; that's what they've been taught. It's a mess alright.
402
Almost half of the school-age children in California do not speak English in their homes. The rates are comparable in other states. A huge number of students come to pre-Kindergarten or Kindergarten not speaking English.
2
"It's all about profit, union breaking and moving money to consultants and charters."
Yes, hardly a day goes by that I don't read of a teacher's union being broken.
Yes, hardly a day goes by that I don't read of a teacher's union being broken.
2
Yes of course a recipe for disaster. Reverse all these issues and some real progress might occur.
We are the richest industrial country on the planet by far, GDP / capita.
Yet we rank around 20 in education depending on the survey and year.
We have the biggest and most sophisticated military on the planet.
If we can do that, why can't we do better in education?
Of course, our military spending is as much as the next ten countries combined.
Yet we rank around 20 in education depending on the survey and year.
We have the biggest and most sophisticated military on the planet.
If we can do that, why can't we do better in education?
Of course, our military spending is as much as the next ten countries combined.
35
Wrong! We are nowhere near the top for GDP per capita, so please stop with the disinformation. Beyond that, median income is a better measure of how the average person lives, i.e., Bill Gates walks into a bar and on average everyone there becomes a millionaire.
5
Other countries that devote more resources to the military than the U.S. also do well when it comes to education: i.e. Israel, South Korea, Singapore. Jewish and Asian students also manage to thrive in this country. You need a new excuse.
1
@Independent: "We are the richest industrial country on the planet by far, GDP / capita."
Where do you get your data from? Because that simply isn't true. Not by far, actually.
Where do you get your data from? Because that simply isn't true. Not by far, actually.
2
In these situations, you get what you want. If success is measured by graduation rates, the schools will ensure that students graduate. If knowledge were the goal, the approach would be far different. Regardless, students make their choices. If they take shortcuts, they will suffer later. Hard work and sacrifice in school will generally lead to good jobs - the Asian community has proved this time and again.
55
Corrupt and unethical people will game the system, others will actually teach the material and take the results.
1
Under the current system, ethical teachers who just teach will be fired if they happen to work in low-income areas. Only the ones who game the system (or the ones whose administrators game it for them) will stay employed.
When that's true (and it is), it's the system that's the problem. Blaming the teachers, as you're doing, accomplishes nothing.
When that's true (and it is), it's the system that's the problem. Blaming the teachers, as you're doing, accomplishes nothing.
1
One can earn all C- grades and even Ds and still earn a diploma, remember that; for far too many students today, that's just fine, just enough to squeak by.
Another problem is the absolutely no problem attitude towards cheating, they do it constantly and as a result, learn little, then wonder why they can't pass the ACT. They determine, of course, that it's someone else's fault, they were cheated of their education; never mind they cheated and copied and plagiarized, they couldn't be responsible for it. The sense of entitlement is breathtaking, the idea that "the rules are for everyone but me" is rampant with this generation. Also, teachers are under tremendous pressure to pass students regardless of their proficiency, which of course is also blamed on them, regardless of the students efforts or lack there of.
Another problem is the absolutely no problem attitude towards cheating, they do it constantly and as a result, learn little, then wonder why they can't pass the ACT. They determine, of course, that it's someone else's fault, they were cheated of their education; never mind they cheated and copied and plagiarized, they couldn't be responsible for it. The sense of entitlement is breathtaking, the idea that "the rules are for everyone but me" is rampant with this generation. Also, teachers are under tremendous pressure to pass students regardless of their proficiency, which of course is also blamed on them, regardless of the students efforts or lack there of.
44
There's no surprise in this report. Saw the issues first hand.
Lower the standards, let any one pass, let any one graduate, let anyone go to college, and the operative word is either unprepared, or unqualified. And folks wonder why the rich get richer and the poor, unqualified, uneducated get poorer. It's good we have such a strong welfare system to make up for the ineffective public inner city educational system.
Lower the standards, let any one pass, let any one graduate, let anyone go to college, and the operative word is either unprepared, or unqualified. And folks wonder why the rich get richer and the poor, unqualified, uneducated get poorer. It's good we have such a strong welfare system to make up for the ineffective public inner city educational system.
12
Reference to a strong welfare system is a good joke. But the rest I agree with.
2
As a former teacher, I've seen this first hand. It's almost impossible for a student to fail. Teachers are intimidated to pass every student to ensure high graduation rates, and even those teachers who refuse to pass falling students can be undermined - after they submit grades, a principal or vp can "administratively change" a student's grade with no reason needed. At least that's how it worked in the 2 districts I worked at in VA.
62
That's how it works in Dallas ISD.
If more than 15% of a teacher's roster fail, the teacher is called on the carpet and hassled with detailed paperwork.
If you defend yourself by saying that the student didn't complete most or all of their classwork, you are told it's YOUR job to motivate them to do their classwork.
You are told your lessons need to be more "engaging" (fun) and more "rigorous" (no right/wrong answer paradigm--even in math).
If more than 15% of a teacher's roster fail, the teacher is called on the carpet and hassled with detailed paperwork.
If you defend yourself by saying that the student didn't complete most or all of their classwork, you are told it's YOUR job to motivate them to do their classwork.
You are told your lessons need to be more "engaging" (fun) and more "rigorous" (no right/wrong answer paradigm--even in math).
4
No amount of extra money or minor reforms will improve the quality of our public education system unless we first address the fundamental design flaw in that system: advancing students from grade to grade based on age and seat-time rather than proficiency in academic skills. That’s why so many high-school juniors who have been given a passing grade of D in Algebra 2 could not pass a test of 7th-grade story problems involving fractions, decimals, and percentages.
We fool ourselves into thinking we have provided equal educational opportunity by presenting a “one size fits none” curriculum to all students and “treating them all the same.” But students are not the same. What we should do is move students to the next grade with their age group, but individualize the content of the curriculum to match the current level of achievement for each student. This would require moving to an Adult Basic Education model of instruction, where students are in the same lab with an instructor but are working at many different levels. And students would only move on to the next level when they had reached a certain standard of mastery.
This would of course require a drastic overhaul of the status quo and would encounter resistance from school systems and parents and even many students. And it would be viewed as “too expensive” to implement, even though the hidden costs of the current dysfunctional system are enormous.
We fool ourselves into thinking we have provided equal educational opportunity by presenting a “one size fits none” curriculum to all students and “treating them all the same.” But students are not the same. What we should do is move students to the next grade with their age group, but individualize the content of the curriculum to match the current level of achievement for each student. This would require moving to an Adult Basic Education model of instruction, where students are in the same lab with an instructor but are working at many different levels. And students would only move on to the next level when they had reached a certain standard of mastery.
This would of course require a drastic overhaul of the status quo and would encounter resistance from school systems and parents and even many students. And it would be viewed as “too expensive” to implement, even though the hidden costs of the current dysfunctional system are enormous.
21
Not to mention better raw material which you really can't improve without massive control that is not legal in the US. You could stop wasting money trying to educate folks that either can't be or don't want to be (possibly both)!!
As a public HS counselor confronting these issues daily, I completely agree with your solution. It would take complex reform, but everyone suggesting higher pay for educators or mandating parent involvement are not going to see different results.
Educators are discouraged from discipline (parts of which I agree), pressured to pass all, and thus "college for everyone" really just compounds the problem by saddling kids with debt. Everyone needs communication and critical thinking skills, but not necessarily to the same level. Students willing to work longer to achieve standards should (if that means graduating at 21). If not, they'll ultimately be responsible to figure out how to support themselves. Industries wanting to prepare young folks not bound for college could potentially make our system a little more efficient and provide clearer incentives to those not being sold on working towards college.
Educators are discouraged from discipline (parts of which I agree), pressured to pass all, and thus "college for everyone" really just compounds the problem by saddling kids with debt. Everyone needs communication and critical thinking skills, but not necessarily to the same level. Students willing to work longer to achieve standards should (if that means graduating at 21). If not, they'll ultimately be responsible to figure out how to support themselves. Industries wanting to prepare young folks not bound for college could potentially make our system a little more efficient and provide clearer incentives to those not being sold on working towards college.
2
Grade inflation, "everyone is a winner" nonsense, over emphasis on "self-esteem" and worry about feelings, lack of discipline, lack of accountability and consequences, dropping formerly core subjects or dumbing them down...the list goes on and on. Again, we've no one to blame but ourselves, often for listening to the so-called "experts" on everything (and ignoring parents because they "just don't get it"), including, in this case, too many Education PHDs who have never set foot in a classroom but keep coming up with one new failed effort after another (with no consequence for same as failure). It's really not that hard to figure out.
29
I'm not at all convinced that education PhDs in general sign onto the bad ideas that are degrading our system; I think it far more likely that the politicians and the lobbyists pushing charter schools, vouchers, accountability schemes, and other bad ideas just search for the rare PhDs that will give them a veneer of legitimacy for those ideas.
3
I'm rather reminded of the Earth in Robert Heinlein's "Friday". In that world, there is a California whose legislature has heard there is discrimination against those lacking a high school diploma, and responds by passing legislation giving all residents a diploma. The law is so well received that they were (as of the narrative) considering extending it to bachelor's degrees ...
don't laugh. We're not far now.
don't laugh. We're not far now.
54
Yes you can learn a lot about what not to do from him. Try star ship troopers for a great example of what we have today with voters.
My wife is a Democrat and we will be support the Democrat whether or not my preferred choice Sanders is nominated. The Republican field of candidates reminds me of nothing so much as the leaders in Orwell's Dystopian novel 1984.
This week the Hillary campaign told us that its economic campaign was to bring back the economy of Bill Clinton. We cannot uncouple today's declining middle class and the lack of security felt by so many Americans from the Bill Clinton economy and the ensuing tragedy that many if not most Americans are unsuited for the 21st century economy. STEM education is patently unfair the skills and understanding that make good scientists and engineers are not widely distributed in our society. We need belief we need dogma and the intellectual; rigor to reexamine our beliefs every day are not what American schools were meant to be.
Everyday I confront those contributing their insight and knowledge in an elite forum called the NYT and everyday I am confounded by what people know to be true that just ain't so.
Every day doctors, lawyers and business executives tell me things that I know are just wrong. I have family members with advanced degrees telling me things that just don't compute in a world economy where mature economies must introduce negative interest to just hobble along.
We need a strong social safety net to just survive until we can adapt to the Clinton economy. Let our schools focus on how we can all get along until we decide where we are going.
This week the Hillary campaign told us that its economic campaign was to bring back the economy of Bill Clinton. We cannot uncouple today's declining middle class and the lack of security felt by so many Americans from the Bill Clinton economy and the ensuing tragedy that many if not most Americans are unsuited for the 21st century economy. STEM education is patently unfair the skills and understanding that make good scientists and engineers are not widely distributed in our society. We need belief we need dogma and the intellectual; rigor to reexamine our beliefs every day are not what American schools were meant to be.
Everyday I confront those contributing their insight and knowledge in an elite forum called the NYT and everyday I am confounded by what people know to be true that just ain't so.
Every day doctors, lawyers and business executives tell me things that I know are just wrong. I have family members with advanced degrees telling me things that just don't compute in a world economy where mature economies must introduce negative interest to just hobble along.
We need a strong social safety net to just survive until we can adapt to the Clinton economy. Let our schools focus on how we can all get along until we decide where we are going.
6
I think a lot of factors can attribute to lower standards of students, but as a student, I see some students take school very haphazardly and leniently. At least in my highschool, not many prioritize math/reading schoolwork ,especially if they hate it. The sad thing is, i know they can get high scores, but they are more than satisfied with just a passing grade.
17
As a college instructor I am struck by the deficiencies in basic reading, writing, math and critical thinking skills I see in my students who have made it to college and are not classified as remedial. Their skills are lower than those of family in my parents' generation who were non-native English speakers with only a high school diploma. Some cannot write a grammatically correct English sentence that is not a fragment and with a subject and verb (when included) that agree in number. Their abilities to understand a text and to make inferences are also lower. Consequently I have to adjust my grading to avoid giving everyone C's and D's so that I stay in line with my department. These problems cut across ethnicities.
206
I have to think that some of the "dumbing down" in this country may be in part due to the vastness of inane television programming, time spent on social media sites discussing nothing in particular, and eating a diet of fast food and sugar. Add to this food and cosmetic additives, environmental pollutants, and we may be seeing the effects.
3
Yep, as a tenured professor at a four-year CUNY college and based on my experiences trying to teach in a dumbing-down atmosphere, I understand your need to stay in line with your department, which has to stay in line with your college, which has to stay in line with ...
1
The fact that you have to adjust your grading to avoid giving students the grades their work deserves is part of the problem. K-12 teachers have to do that, too, which is why you're seeing at your level.
2
The dumbing down of America continues unabated. Dont you folks get it by now they want the Americans dumb down to do the elite bidding and they are doing a great job right now.
9
Yes those many progressives want this so they can remain in power.
2
Having watched the Republican and Democratic presidential debates, I don't think it's the progressives that are appealing to the dumbed-down in the populace.
3
We had better start considering what education is for.
The enormous changes wrought by both the computer revolution and the wholesale export of jobs has polarized the workplace between a minority of high-skill jobs, and an increasing majority that demand little more than the levels of literacy and numeracy that have always been necessary to function, i.e. largely minimum wage jobs for those who can get them, with relatively little inbetween. This has skewed the income distribution, and the tax code has been deliberately engineered to skew it even further.
We pretend that education’s purpose is to provide specific skills for specific jobs, completely ignoring the reality that whole categories of work can now disappear between the freshman year and the graduation of any given student. As a scientist, I’m not saying that what are fashionably known as the STEM subjects should be ignored; but gearing education to jobs allows employers off the hook as far as on-the-job learning is concerned. Education should be to prepare students to function in society as citizens with some idea of history, philosophy, the natural sciences and literature. In such a society it would be difficult for anti-intellectual ignoramuses to enter and thrive in elected office.
The most important job of the future is to reclaim the shaping of society from those who shape it now in the interests of themselves and their peers.
The enormous changes wrought by both the computer revolution and the wholesale export of jobs has polarized the workplace between a minority of high-skill jobs, and an increasing majority that demand little more than the levels of literacy and numeracy that have always been necessary to function, i.e. largely minimum wage jobs for those who can get them, with relatively little inbetween. This has skewed the income distribution, and the tax code has been deliberately engineered to skew it even further.
We pretend that education’s purpose is to provide specific skills for specific jobs, completely ignoring the reality that whole categories of work can now disappear between the freshman year and the graduation of any given student. As a scientist, I’m not saying that what are fashionably known as the STEM subjects should be ignored; but gearing education to jobs allows employers off the hook as far as on-the-job learning is concerned. Education should be to prepare students to function in society as citizens with some idea of history, philosophy, the natural sciences and literature. In such a society it would be difficult for anti-intellectual ignoramuses to enter and thrive in elected office.
The most important job of the future is to reclaim the shaping of society from those who shape it now in the interests of themselves and their peers.
164
Yes force return of manufacturing and then stop passing folks for nothing.
1
Let's begin to pull back the veils that shroud our understanding of the educational marketplace Today. For about 100 years, we've used unionized advanced degreed teachers to facilitate the act of learning in traditional/nontraditional classrooms in public schools. For most of those years, we did an outstanding job preparing our nation's children to become productive, work ready adults. But Society Has Changed! The corporate, military, industrial and government power brokers, who control way too much of our lives, now want technology and standardized testing to replace middle class teachers in our classrooms. Too many other factors undermine success. Poverty, multi-cultural & language barriers, early drug abuse debilitating thinking skills, violence, the rise of internet gaming (call of duty) & the complimentary wasting of so many hours of potential learning time & loss of sleep by even our K-5 children, all these problems and more are slowly destroying our public schools. Private schools surely tend to have far, far LESS of all these problems. They can admit a child and they can easily dismiss that child. School systems in other countries, {Norway, Korea, Israel, Sweden, etc} operate with a mainstream, homogenous culture and language used in their schools. These countries all use their tax revenues to provide services to parents from early conception of their children thru their youth into adulthood. These are just a few of the variables hurting us. I'm a teacher 30+ years
2
In the spirit of your article the great Robert Bellah echoes your message. I am paraphrasing; instead of teaching the rigorous standards of moral and intellectual development the purpose of college is to provide for social mobility. These students are taught the art of cupidity in their curriculum. On another note our pundits today (Public Radio included) are amazed that a segment of our population favors candidates like Trump and Carson etc. I wonder how many of these potential voters have taken a Civics class, read any Political philosophy, or discussed these candidates in the framework of the Federalist Papers. Bellah feared the individualistic propensity in America; it is this propensity and lack of civic membership that gives this country its current crop of candidates.
2
All of us - even Black Lives Matter - need to focus on improving education. In my experience, children who are lower class (vs. poor) are disadvantaged. Too many are rasied by single mothers who have low incomes, or none at all. Their parents raise them like their mothers raised them, too often with no value on education and no understanding that there's a different, and attainable, life out there. They start school without language skills because no one has talked to them; they don't know the difference between a letter and a number because they watch cartoons & play video games instead of Sesame Street, etc. Their parents don't communicate with schools that go out of their way to encourage them to be part of the education experience. Their schools try to group students according to ability, encourage academic achievement, self-esteem, whatever is needed to prepare them for the future. This CANNOT be done without parental support. People in the communitites, and those who think know black lives matter - that all lives matter - need to address these issues. It takes a village - this includes the parents.
13
I agree that is the problem.
But I think about what it would take to solve it.
A lot of mentoring which costs money when people would rather pay less taxes than fix poverty.
But I think about what it would take to solve it.
A lot of mentoring which costs money when people would rather pay less taxes than fix poverty.
2
Seems kind of like the academic equivalent of every kid gets a trophy.
When we measure schools by their graduation rate, we encourage them to make graduation easier, which leads to less well prepared graduates and diplomas that do not inspire trust.
There clearly is some advantage to encouraging higher graduation. It also encourages more intervention for kids that are falling behind, and presumably it improves self-esteem. But self-esteem only goes so far when the graduate lacks the skills to back it up.
College may not be for everybody, but what these stats seem to be saying that while some graduates lack the math and reading levels to indicate readiness for college, they also lack the skills for most of the jobs that don't require college educations. That would be the more disturbing news.
When we measure schools by their graduation rate, we encourage them to make graduation easier, which leads to less well prepared graduates and diplomas that do not inspire trust.
There clearly is some advantage to encouraging higher graduation. It also encourages more intervention for kids that are falling behind, and presumably it improves self-esteem. But self-esteem only goes so far when the graduate lacks the skills to back it up.
College may not be for everybody, but what these stats seem to be saying that while some graduates lack the math and reading levels to indicate readiness for college, they also lack the skills for most of the jobs that don't require college educations. That would be the more disturbing news.
8
Self-esteem is created when a person works hard for something and sees the results of his or her efforts. Getting a black belt, winning a blue ribbon at the state fair, finishing a tough project and being told you did a nice job... these are the things that build self-esteem.
Awards for participation don't build self-esteem.
Awards for participation don't build self-esteem.
2
While I can't speak with any authority on the current status of Blue Ribbons, I can say that not all black belts are equal and the same goes for "being told you did a nice job." Not all praise is honest.
Self-esteem is created all sorts of ways and while the unearned praise has its drawbacks, so too does it have its use. Some kids need to hear what praise sounds like to acquire the need to earn it. That was the motivation behind the "self-esteem" movement. This approach has been wildly overused now to the point where standards have become meaningless, but still there is some usefulness to encouragement for its own sake.
Self-esteem is created all sorts of ways and while the unearned praise has its drawbacks, so too does it have its use. Some kids need to hear what praise sounds like to acquire the need to earn it. That was the motivation behind the "self-esteem" movement. This approach has been wildly overused now to the point where standards have become meaningless, but still there is some usefulness to encouragement for its own sake.
A bit like the old joke about the Soviet Union, we pretend to teach them and they pretend to learn. We happily issue credentials showing that they know something substantial, thinking this will convince employers who see no evidence of this. We institute exit exams to make sure that people learn something en route to gaining the formal credential, then get rid of them when it becomes clear quite a few people didn't, because that proves the tests must be unfair. We continue to try to educate them on the cheap by chasing out experienced teachers in favor of admittedly energetic teachers just out of fancy colleges and then burn them out as well in a few years by treating them just like we treated the experienced teachers they replaced. We firmly believe that education is the one field where good salaries are unnecessary to get good people, and toward this end we scapegoat teachers for not being "excellent" enough. The very title of the film "Waiting For Superman" reveals these bizarre expectations. We continue to fantasize that machines, this time around computers, and online instruction can do anywhere near as good a job as human teachers and enough of them. We pride ourselves on how many years of this subject and that subject we require in high school, but many college students do not know how to write a complete sentence in English, taught in third grade. I wonder why we have a problem!
7
In many states (NY, NJ, IL, MA, CT, among others), teachers start at over $50K a year -- that's at age 21 with zero experience -- and they get two raises a year (COLA and step) until they get up to around $80K a year. If they get a master's, which is easy (they give super easy summer courses that are tax deductible!), they get an automatic 20% increase. Also remember it is a six hour day, and only 8 months of the year, so teachers get 14 weeks paid vacation -- TO START.
That's fantastic money for such short hours. It is more than engineers earn -- or nurses -- or other similar fields (with a 4 year degree to start), on a PER HOUR WORKED BASIS.
How many of us would give up some of our pay, to get all summer off? or have 2-3 weeks off at Christmas for a nice long vacation? or a full week at Easter? or every Federal holiday?
A teacher recently told me there is not ONE SINGLE MONTH of the school year (8.5 months!) where they are mandated to work four full 5-day weeks -- NOT ONE!
For a part time job, this is incredible pay with incredible benefits. But it is harming our children very directly, and the tax money going to support this "Socialist Worker's Paradise" steals directly from our children's futures.
That's fantastic money for such short hours. It is more than engineers earn -- or nurses -- or other similar fields (with a 4 year degree to start), on a PER HOUR WORKED BASIS.
How many of us would give up some of our pay, to get all summer off? or have 2-3 weeks off at Christmas for a nice long vacation? or a full week at Easter? or every Federal holiday?
A teacher recently told me there is not ONE SINGLE MONTH of the school year (8.5 months!) where they are mandated to work four full 5-day weeks -- NOT ONE!
For a part time job, this is incredible pay with incredible benefits. But it is harming our children very directly, and the tax money going to support this "Socialist Worker's Paradise" steals directly from our children's futures.
If Concerned Citizen really believed the ridiculous myths he repeats about how well teachers are paid and how easy they have it, one suspects he'd be a teacher.
Heck, I certainly wish the stuff he's saying were true. But none of it is.
Heck, I certainly wish the stuff he's saying were true. But none of it is.
4
As a teacher whose career spanned several generations, I can attest to the fact that schools today are becoming less and less rigorous and more and more political. In wealthier districts, teachers are under pressure to mollify parents who want high grades with little effort. In districts where discipline is an issue, very little is done to aid teachers so that meaningful learning can take place. What we are offered is a low standard which of course leads to high school graduates who have not received an education that will benefit them.
We have politicians now suggesting free colleges for students who are unready. Since when is remediation part of a college education and the question becomes are we to pay for what is the equivalent of 13th grade? It is a true battle today given the push for higher graduation rates, lower standards and political correctness to really provide a strong and demanding curriculum. Unless we ask for more from our students themselves and simply say we are doing better when we are not, we will not fulfill our real obligations as far as educating the students who need it the most.
We have politicians now suggesting free colleges for students who are unready. Since when is remediation part of a college education and the question becomes are we to pay for what is the equivalent of 13th grade? It is a true battle today given the push for higher graduation rates, lower standards and political correctness to really provide a strong and demanding curriculum. Unless we ask for more from our students themselves and simply say we are doing better when we are not, we will not fulfill our real obligations as far as educating the students who need it the most.
23
If the students spent as much time on their studies as on their phones perhaps they would pass the exams. Electronic equipment takes up most of the time. So there is very little time left for anything else.
18
Whoever is shocked by this information hasn't been paying much attention. Over the past several decades the emphasis in education in the US has been placed on herding ever larger percentages of people through an ever increasing number of years of formal education so that now attaining a bachelor's degree has come to be viewed as essential. Neither the distribution of fundamental abilities in the population at large nor the inclinations of that population towards, or frequently against, formal education have substantially changed in that interval, presumably. So the only way to achieve the "more-more" goal is to have aqueous standards.
Things are valued in inverse proportion to their scarcity. That's no less true of education than it is of gold.
Things are valued in inverse proportion to their scarcity. That's no less true of education than it is of gold.
4
Like the other commentators here, I am disheartened at how easily children are being pushed through the system without their accomplishing the necessary requirements for the degree. However, not everyone is college material. Because our government facilitated in the moving of good paying middle income manufacturing jobs to other countries with tax benefits and where wages were much lower, eliminated jobs for those not academically ready to attend college. It is a crying shame that this was allowed to happen.
12
For a study in contrasts this article must be read along with another article in today's NYT about the "problem" that a NJ school district is facing: http://goo.gl/8xUFwX
1
It is all well and good to talk about improving education, but the hidden message being reinforced, is that US workers are becoming ever poorer because of a lack of education - misdirecting us from the true causes of ever worsening inequality.
Lack of education is not the reason why a single breadwinner can no longer support a family. It is also not the reason EPOP (Employment to population ratio) dropped from 63% in 2008 to below 59% in 2010, where it remains.
Why are Boeing, Volvo, and BMW locating their factories in places where they cannot find higher skilled workers? Cheap wages, that is why. Are they offering much higher wages for the skills they say they cannot find? No. The reality is that these "skill shortages" are just phantom excuses to import more H1B's, drive down wages further, and direct attention away from the real problem - a lack of demand in the economy, caused by low wages.
Where is the biggest job growth now? Low skilled jobs. Skill shortage is belied by lack of wage increases.
The system is breaking down. Across the world, workers are pitted against each other, driving wages below subsistence levels. French workers are taking pay cuts to compete with low wages in Poland. But those low wages in Poland are leading to political unrest - as here with Trump and Sanders.
Lack of demand and inequality are the big problems - not lack of education. And these have been caused by dismantling FDR's New Deal - not some unchangeable "globalization".
Lack of education is not the reason why a single breadwinner can no longer support a family. It is also not the reason EPOP (Employment to population ratio) dropped from 63% in 2008 to below 59% in 2010, where it remains.
Why are Boeing, Volvo, and BMW locating their factories in places where they cannot find higher skilled workers? Cheap wages, that is why. Are they offering much higher wages for the skills they say they cannot find? No. The reality is that these "skill shortages" are just phantom excuses to import more H1B's, drive down wages further, and direct attention away from the real problem - a lack of demand in the economy, caused by low wages.
Where is the biggest job growth now? Low skilled jobs. Skill shortage is belied by lack of wage increases.
The system is breaking down. Across the world, workers are pitted against each other, driving wages below subsistence levels. French workers are taking pay cuts to compete with low wages in Poland. But those low wages in Poland are leading to political unrest - as here with Trump and Sanders.
Lack of demand and inequality are the big problems - not lack of education. And these have been caused by dismantling FDR's New Deal - not some unchangeable "globalization".
32
"....fewer than 40 percent were ready for college level work."
Fifty years ago, that "40%" didn't go to college. Students went to college and enrolled in advanced placement and honors programs. They didn't go to college to learn how to read and write. However over the last fifty years, colleges have become nothing more than shakedown operations, giving enormous salaries to useless administrators, and foisting teaching on minimum wage "adjuncts." All in the name of money.
The vast majority of people in this country are fairly stupid. The parents are, and their children are, as well. Colleges can't make stupid people smart. Better to look to genetic engineering for that.
Football, anyone?
Fifty years ago, that "40%" didn't go to college. Students went to college and enrolled in advanced placement and honors programs. They didn't go to college to learn how to read and write. However over the last fifty years, colleges have become nothing more than shakedown operations, giving enormous salaries to useless administrators, and foisting teaching on minimum wage "adjuncts." All in the name of money.
The vast majority of people in this country are fairly stupid. The parents are, and their children are, as well. Colleges can't make stupid people smart. Better to look to genetic engineering for that.
Football, anyone?
79
Lol!! So true.
3
I suspect that one problem is that the standardized tests which now take up so much of the instructional time in high schools are geared toward measuring students' minimal competence to function in society, not their preparation for college. If a school's "grade" depends on arbitrarily chosen criteria like the graduation rate, doesn't it stand to reason that those are the things that the school will focus on?
2
Does anybody think this is a new problem? Haven't we been having crisis reports about our schools for at least the past 50 years? I submit that in the good old days (pick your decade, from 1900 on) standards were higher for SOME pupils in the more fortunate school districts. At no time did our high schools ever turn out a population that was 100% college ready. In my own high school days (1950's) I believe the expectation was that roughly the top 20% would go on to college.
12
Ah, but in the United States we had different high school tracks. Girls could take an academic, commercial, or general degree. Boys could graduate with an academic or technical or (I think) even a shop degree. As a result, some students headed straight off to college, and others got jobs. Of course, there were in those days jobs to be had.
And it didn't mean you couldn't take college courses or get a degree later.
The new problem is that our educators believe all students can become physicists if we only throw enough money at them. And that problem has grown worse in the last thirty or so years.
And it didn't mean you couldn't take college courses or get a degree later.
The new problem is that our educators believe all students can become physicists if we only throw enough money at them. And that problem has grown worse in the last thirty or so years.
3
Somewhere in our history we decided that everyone should be on the same path which, ultimately, should be college. We compare ourselves to other countries and criticize our public schools for not achieving similar results. But this comparison is akin to comparing fruit to vegetables. Other countries are smaller, give parents less 'choice' but offer students a huge choice when they hit their teens . They can go either on a path to university or they can be trained technologically for a career. As many students mature, they have the option to later on go to college or continue into an apprenticeship and career. There is no need for expensive for profit schools which have proliferated in the U.S. and enticed many low income earners into years of debt.
18
In addition the education you describe, those other countries also don't have poverty like we do.
They don't have people working two part-time jobs, below the poverty line and without health care.
And their health care is as good or better and costs 40% less.
But Americans don't know these things.
They don't have people working two part-time jobs, below the poverty line and without health care.
And their health care is as good or better and costs 40% less.
But Americans don't know these things.
3
Other countries are also much more homogeneous. We have disadvantaged students here in America who are by and large not white. They are segregated into schools where everyone else is poor too. Many do not even speak the primary language of our country at home. What do we expect?
4
We have gone from "equality of opportunity" to "equality of outcome", and the result is the obvious failure seen across the country. There is no way that bureaucrats will ever accept that "all people are NOT equal", but we can not say that.
25
desert dweller, yours is a myth repeated so often that it's accepted as truth. Nobody in public life that I know of has ever advocated for equality of outcome. All the while, the political right does its darnedest to deny even equality of opportunity.
6
You are exactly right. And the less raw material a person has, the more it costs to pretend that equal outcomes are possible. If all students had to run a six minute mile to graduate and schools were told to maximize graduation rates, schools would spend the most time and effort trying to get the slowest kids running faster. The only difference is that schools can shorten the length of the mile and how long a minute is to reach their targets.
2
Education policy for the last fifteen years, under Bush and Obama, has been based on the conviction that student test scores and graduation rates are indicative of instructional quality, not the students' ability or effort. That's "equality of outcome," and both Republicans and Democrats have backed that farce.
3
A friend just retired from teaching at a private school for 40+ years. The school keeps samples of SAT tests, locked away, going back for many decades.
She has told me that there is small comparison in terms of difficulty and complexity of the questions asked then and what has been asked since the 1990s or so. The tests have been watered down so much in order to be "inclusive" largely as a result of judicial rulings brought on by change in pedagogical philosophies of what is education for.
She has told me that there is small comparison in terms of difficulty and complexity of the questions asked then and what has been asked since the 1990s or so. The tests have been watered down so much in order to be "inclusive" largely as a result of judicial rulings brought on by change in pedagogical philosophies of what is education for.
23
If the market for workers with a higher level of education is so tight, one would expect employers to increase wages to better attract able employees. Yet this is not happening; wages are flat (even when profits are up). So I find such claims suspect.
Similarly, most states have adopted new standards that sold to the public as creating "college and career-ready" graduates. These standards have been accompanied with new tests that are expensive to develop and require expensive hardware. One might expect significant new expenditure in curricula, teacher training, and class-size reduction so that these new standards can be met. Yet despite these new standards and requirements, education funding remains flat or is falling in many states.
In all, there's a disconnect between what business leaders and education reformers warn us about and what they propose to do about it. I think these contradictions deserve more attention than these claims (which themselves are largely unchanged since the 1960s).
Similarly, most states have adopted new standards that sold to the public as creating "college and career-ready" graduates. These standards have been accompanied with new tests that are expensive to develop and require expensive hardware. One might expect significant new expenditure in curricula, teacher training, and class-size reduction so that these new standards can be met. Yet despite these new standards and requirements, education funding remains flat or is falling in many states.
In all, there's a disconnect between what business leaders and education reformers warn us about and what they propose to do about it. I think these contradictions deserve more attention than these claims (which themselves are largely unchanged since the 1960s).
12
It actually the other way around. A tight market in which many people compete for a few jobs leads to lower wages. There's a deluge of people applying, so working conditions fall. This is why more than half of all university professors in the US and Canada are part-timers with no benefits, no job stability and low wages. There are far too many of us applying for openings. For instance, a friend with a full-time university job told me the hiring committee she was on was embarrassed when it received 500+ applications from highly qualified Ph.D. for a measly one year post-doc position.
4
The claim being made in the article is that jobs are going unfilled because schools aren't providing adequately educated workers. If this is true, one would expect these employers to increase wages, which might entice workers to change jobs or obtain the necessary skills. That's not happening. It's not the same situation as the one you are describing, which is also a problematic one.
2
There are several statements in this article that make the argument that the purpose of education is to prepare students for jobs and/or college. This attitude is a devolution of the original intent. " I know no safe depositary of the ultimate powers of the society but the people themselves; and if we think them not enlightened enough to exercise their control with a wholesome discretion, the remedy is not to take it from them, but to inform their discretion by education. This is the true corrective of abuses of constitutional power." --Thomas Jefferson to William C. Jarvis, 1820. ME 15:278
Considering the original intent of public education by the primary author of the Constitution, it becomes clear that standardized tests do not prepare our children to perform the job of oversight, but the job of turning our children into worker bees.
Human beings learn when they are presented with personally meaningful content no matter what the experts say or demand. If a student is turned off by meaningless content little will be learned. This is why Algebra I and II, and Geometry score poorly. Most students see no connection to them or their futures no matter the exhortations of teachers, parents, politicians or other pontificators. Therefore, measuring the value of a high school diploma needs an entirely different metric than a standardized test or college success.
Considering the original intent of public education by the primary author of the Constitution, it becomes clear that standardized tests do not prepare our children to perform the job of oversight, but the job of turning our children into worker bees.
Human beings learn when they are presented with personally meaningful content no matter what the experts say or demand. If a student is turned off by meaningless content little will be learned. This is why Algebra I and II, and Geometry score poorly. Most students see no connection to them or their futures no matter the exhortations of teachers, parents, politicians or other pontificators. Therefore, measuring the value of a high school diploma needs an entirely different metric than a standardized test or college success.
11
Before you trot out Thomas Jefferson to justify your argument, consider that in his age it was largely only white males over the age of 21 who owned property that could vote. This was therefore his target population of who should be educated and what that education should consist of. And perhaps you meant to credit Jefferson as the primary author of the Declaration of Independence rather than the Constitution.
3
"Most students see no connection to them or their futures no matter the exhortations of teachers, parents, politicians or other pontificators."
If students are learning math only because it is "connected" to what they already know of life, then what of history or science or literature or art or anything else outside their limited experience? Given its natural beauty and elegance, not to mention its role as the basis of all scientific knowledge, someone has to work hard to keep kids from falling in love.
But with "math is hard" dolls, early age teachers afraid of math and the questions excited students naturally ask, parents that boast of their own innumeracy, and so on, it seems that society is making that effort. I've sat through meetings in which parents (and one board of ed member) complained about their inability to solve elementary math problems as if it were the problems at fault.
...Andrew
If students are learning math only because it is "connected" to what they already know of life, then what of history or science or literature or art or anything else outside their limited experience? Given its natural beauty and elegance, not to mention its role as the basis of all scientific knowledge, someone has to work hard to keep kids from falling in love.
But with "math is hard" dolls, early age teachers afraid of math and the questions excited students naturally ask, parents that boast of their own innumeracy, and so on, it seems that society is making that effort. I've sat through meetings in which parents (and one board of ed member) complained about their inability to solve elementary math problems as if it were the problems at fault.
...Andrew
1
Really? Algebra and Geometry students fare poorly because students fail to perceive the "relevance" of these subjects? The surest path to a life of ignorance is to believe oneself the ultimate judge of what's "worth" knowing.
It all starts with "Good Job" regardless of how good that job is. Aside from the fact that there a no across-the-board standards since far too many have chosen the path of "local control", no one fails since that would forever "bruise their self-image". Passing a subject is far too subjective. e.g. It is possible in NY State to pass the Algebra I regents with an actual grade of 37. This is not education by any standard of even minimal "excellence".
Education is rigorous and demanding, and achievement should be rewarded. But the operative word is achievement, which precludes simply occupying time and space in a classroom.
To many it is not "fun" but then again neither is true life or, for that matter, anything really "worth it" is worth the effort.
So we can continue to debate. Parents and teachers can continue to resist initiatives such as Common Core and decry the fact that their over-scheduled children may have to give up their iPhones and Internet time. But the situation will not change until changes are indeed made and "educators" take up arms against a sea of ignorance and actually insist on educating.
Education is rigorous and demanding, and achievement should be rewarded. But the operative word is achievement, which precludes simply occupying time and space in a classroom.
To many it is not "fun" but then again neither is true life or, for that matter, anything really "worth it" is worth the effort.
So we can continue to debate. Parents and teachers can continue to resist initiatives such as Common Core and decry the fact that their over-scheduled children may have to give up their iPhones and Internet time. But the situation will not change until changes are indeed made and "educators" take up arms against a sea of ignorance and actually insist on educating.
4
Anyone who says that a score of 37 should never be passing, without any consideration of the test being discussed, is demonstrating his own ignorance and nothing more. Even assuming that's a percentage rather than a numerical score (conceivably out of 37 possible), whether it represents high, low, or adequate achievement depends entirely on the difficulty of the test.
Educators (the scare quotes are another thing that suggests you don't know what you're talking about) have tried to insist on educating. They're usually overruled.
Educators (the scare quotes are another thing that suggests you don't know what you're talking about) have tried to insist on educating. They're usually overruled.
1
In the 1920s we had the Lost Generation of Americans. Now we have the Dumb Generation.
Face it, this is the stupidest generation of students in our history. Yeah there are exceptions to the rule (Asians mostly), but in general they're dumb as dirt. Go on, rationalize it all you want; then observe all the dumbing down signs right in front of your nose, from abysmal high school graduation rates compared to other industrial nation (this AFTER requirements for HS diplomas were watered down), to the diminishing numbers of college degrees in math, engineering, and the sciences in general.
Face it, this is the stupidest generation of students in our history. Yeah there are exceptions to the rule (Asians mostly), but in general they're dumb as dirt. Go on, rationalize it all you want; then observe all the dumbing down signs right in front of your nose, from abysmal high school graduation rates compared to other industrial nation (this AFTER requirements for HS diplomas were watered down), to the diminishing numbers of college degrees in math, engineering, and the sciences in general.
24
What this article fails to mention is that this remains the state of affairs even after a decade and a half of No Child Left Behind, which should--like we needed more evidence--put to rest the notion of high stakes testing and accountability policy as panacea to low standards. I suspect it won't.
2
It is not just poor students or the schools in the South. Before retiring I taught engineering at a major NY university. At one point we noticed that entering students seemed to lack the necessary math skills and decided to test all entering students. The idea was to give remedial training to those found lacking.
To our surprise we found that almost half the students with poor basic skills (Algebra, Trig) had been AP honor math students in well rated high schools. We came to the conclusion that the high schools were skipping or skimming the basics so that the student could move on to resume building AP Calculus courses. This is part of a general trend where the high schools want to offer college courses to their students and as a result superficially cover the important basic courses that are needed as a foundation for college success.
To our surprise we found that almost half the students with poor basic skills (Algebra, Trig) had been AP honor math students in well rated high schools. We came to the conclusion that the high schools were skipping or skimming the basics so that the student could move on to resume building AP Calculus courses. This is part of a general trend where the high schools want to offer college courses to their students and as a result superficially cover the important basic courses that are needed as a foundation for college success.
53
In schools in wealthy public school systems or private schools the parents have too much power. Strict teachers who do not give all students high grades will not last. The parents will cook up all kinds of reasons to get rid of them. One time I had to sit through a parent-teacher-principal conference in which a parent complained that I was somehow not treating her kid, who was getting a C, fairly when the kid had done little or no work. Why hadn't she done any work? Well, she had a job and had to work late! When the principal and I suggested maybe the student should cut back on her hours on the job, the parent insisted she was a "night person" and could handle it. Well, by the end of the school year the girl was pregnant, she had been staying late to have sex in her car in the parking lot with the night manager.
12
Actually it is possible to do well in AP calculus with very little knowledge of trig. However, I don't see how it's possible without a solid foundation in algebra.
2
This is an astute observation. My son took the AP Calculus sequence in high school, and he struggled mightily a few years later when he had to do proofs in Real Analysis. He would have been better served by a fundamentals course with more writing and less bubble testing.
1
It is interesting that the first budget item to go in shools are courses which stress creativity; writing, poetry, music, art, theater, etc. even wood and metal shops. These are the disciplines where kids learn how to deal with a changing world also where kids can find self worth, confidence and satisfaction without success in the traditional academic world of math, science, and business. In the end in a capitalist world there may not be enough "work" for all and these future citizens and they will have no idea of how to occupy themselves or even to be able to create what will be the future without the skills of creativity.
9
A science degree without the writing skills to articulate one's findings is worthless.
Also, writing, art, and music teach the importance of structure, balance, and harmony in a way that not only carries over into other disciplines but that is valuable in and of itself. Disordered writing is symptomatic of disordered thinking. Lazy art is symptomatic of lazy thinking. Careless music is symptomatic of careless thinking.
Also, writing, art, and music teach the importance of structure, balance, and harmony in a way that not only carries over into other disciplines but that is valuable in and of itself. Disordered writing is symptomatic of disordered thinking. Lazy art is symptomatic of lazy thinking. Careless music is symptomatic of careless thinking.
5
And it's worse in colleges and universities where now anyone can get a PhD.
5
That's a ridiculous claim. Back it up.
2
Duh?
2
I taught at Berea High School in the late 70s. I had four preparations: French I, II, III, and 10th-grade English. I met five classes daily and supervised a study hall; and hall-patrol duty often consumed my 35-minute lunch hour. Having just finished my MS in linguistics, I was thrilled to earn almost $12 000. Most of my students were incredibly fine people and I wish I had had more time to devote to them.
3
“Students and their families rely on and trust the high school diploma as a signal of readiness,”
Yet, heaven forbid, you tell them that their children are not up to snuff.
And, if you think this rise through, you have to conclude the only way to have made it happen is to have relaxed standards. In the period time cited, the competence of the teachers cannot have improved as dramatically as the graduation rates. Nor have the resources increased at a similar rate. Instead, it is just easier for school boards and the communities they represent to demand that students graduate, independent of what the children know. The evidence is the number of holders of high school diplomas who cannot pass high school level mathematics courses taught in post-secondary institutions, even when the students have equivalent work on their high school transcripts. At my institution, roughly 2/3 of new students have four years of high school mathematics or more, yet 75% of these same students repeat courses in mathematics at the level of 11th grade or lower with pass rates in the range of 65%.
Yet, heaven forbid, you tell them that their children are not up to snuff.
And, if you think this rise through, you have to conclude the only way to have made it happen is to have relaxed standards. In the period time cited, the competence of the teachers cannot have improved as dramatically as the graduation rates. Nor have the resources increased at a similar rate. Instead, it is just easier for school boards and the communities they represent to demand that students graduate, independent of what the children know. The evidence is the number of holders of high school diplomas who cannot pass high school level mathematics courses taught in post-secondary institutions, even when the students have equivalent work on their high school transcripts. At my institution, roughly 2/3 of new students have four years of high school mathematics or more, yet 75% of these same students repeat courses in mathematics at the level of 11th grade or lower with pass rates in the range of 65%.
7
Based on what I see in my college classrooms, I can say with great certainty that American education has failed its children. No Child Left Behind has bred an entire generation of students completely unable to think for themselves; they have grown accustomed to being spoon fed information to be regurgitated upon tests. K-12 teachers live their lives in fear of reprisal if too many students fail. Administrators game the system to make themselves look like heroes and secure additional funding for their districts.
Making matters worse is the completely out-of-control "everyone gets a trophy" culture. If students don't get an "A" in a class, parents call and complain. They are spending money, therefore their child should get the highest grade possible for minimal effort. What passes for "A" work these days would have earned me a "C" or "D" when I was in college during the 1990s. A "C" is defined as average, but nowadays it may as well be a failing grade, even though reality tells us that most people are, in fact, average. And yes, I get pressure from administrators to "make them happy," and inflate grades rather than teach and challenge my students. After 8 years of this, I believe it may be time for me to move on to something different.
The inmates are truly running the asylum at this point. Good job, America.
Making matters worse is the completely out-of-control "everyone gets a trophy" culture. If students don't get an "A" in a class, parents call and complain. They are spending money, therefore their child should get the highest grade possible for minimal effort. What passes for "A" work these days would have earned me a "C" or "D" when I was in college during the 1990s. A "C" is defined as average, but nowadays it may as well be a failing grade, even though reality tells us that most people are, in fact, average. And yes, I get pressure from administrators to "make them happy," and inflate grades rather than teach and challenge my students. After 8 years of this, I believe it may be time for me to move on to something different.
The inmates are truly running the asylum at this point. Good job, America.
47
"After he failed chemistry his junior year, his counselor reminded him that he would need the course to qualify for a college program in his chosen fields. He is retaking it this semester. This time, he is getting an A."
Wow, that's quite a jump. I'm guessing that, if the A is legitimate, that he either landed in the lap of a magically gifted new teacher or, more likely, failed to attend class and do the required work the first time around. Aptitude wasn't the problem. What a waste of time.
It's ironic that this article appears on the same day as one about a school in Jersey that has parents worrying about student stress and unrealistic standards. I teach at a better-than-average public university and my challenge is students who are tragically stress-free and graduation rates, at any level, won't improve without a rise in anxiety.
Wow, that's quite a jump. I'm guessing that, if the A is legitimate, that he either landed in the lap of a magically gifted new teacher or, more likely, failed to attend class and do the required work the first time around. Aptitude wasn't the problem. What a waste of time.
It's ironic that this article appears on the same day as one about a school in Jersey that has parents worrying about student stress and unrealistic standards. I teach at a better-than-average public university and my challenge is students who are tragically stress-free and graduation rates, at any level, won't improve without a rise in anxiety.
4
It is a jump. My guess is that the first time the student encountered the material, it was all new to him, and he learned some of it but couldn't retain it because the information lacked context for him. It's hard to learn something entirely new, when you don't have a matrix, so to speak, to fit it into. When he went through it a second time, he had absorbed enough from his first attempt that it fell into place. It's a reason not to skip over the basics, as another commenter said about rushing forward to get to AP classes.
2
Keep in mind, there's enormous pressure on schools from the states to graduate every kid. Often, kids who fail are placed in a "repeater section" or a "credit recovery" course that has the same class title as the one they've failed but vastly lower expectations. His current "A" might be the result of the same level of effort and understanding that earned him an "F" last time, because most of our current education policy is based on the misconception that student failure is the fault of the school, not the student.
4
In this culture of striving to make everyone feel good about themselves, the result is the wholesale dumbing down of America. We get what we deserve.
9
Although my college discipline if English, I spend a considerable amount of time coaching the young people in my classrooms on how to become students. Most of them have poor study habits, read at a rudimentary level, and struggle to think critically. Nonetheless, they expect to earn high grades. When they don't, they adjust their opinions of their professors, convinced that is where the problem lies.
20
The lowering of standards for a college degree is nothing new.
Ever since a bachelors started to become an abstract requirement for jobs that did not use any skills from a college education — maybe 50 years ago — more and more bachelors degrees have inevitably signified less and less actual learning.
Ever since a bachelors started to become an abstract requirement for jobs that did not use any skills from a college education — maybe 50 years ago — more and more bachelors degrees have inevitably signified less and less actual learning.
8
High school graduation rates have risen so much because they have become one of many metrics used to rank and sort teachers and schools. Without high graduation rates, schools are punished under No Child Left Behind and Race to the Top. That metric has created a perverse incentive to seek 100% student graduation. Also, public schools are legally required to educate everybody who walks through the door, so students who don't read or write English or who are classified as special ed get modified grades that satisfy graduation requirements, but don't reflect the ability to do classroom work.
5
As a college professor for 25 years, I often wondered what kids were learning in High-School. They can't name the 3 branches of American Government, the name of the state's Governor, nor some of the most basic facts of the world. Forget trying to find any one of them that can tell you about the UN or the EU. They can't define a "Liberal" or a "Conservative" and just like the rest of the country they have no clue as to Socialism other than it is "bad". They can't define "Capitalism" either. They are ignorant of so much knowledge, the High-School diploma means nothing.
None of these hand-wringing articles ever go to the core of the problem and that is the culture of the United States. It is anti-intellectual to such an extreme extent, that so many students have no interest in their world outside of sports and entertainment. Rigorous study, such as outlining a textbook to truly lean the material is out of the question. Reading for entertainment..... forget it!
We have a crisis in this country with our culture and Donald Trump is the manifestation of the deep cultural rot.
None of these hand-wringing articles ever go to the core of the problem and that is the culture of the United States. It is anti-intellectual to such an extreme extent, that so many students have no interest in their world outside of sports and entertainment. Rigorous study, such as outlining a textbook to truly lean the material is out of the question. Reading for entertainment..... forget it!
We have a crisis in this country with our culture and Donald Trump is the manifestation of the deep cultural rot.
374
They have been taught these things, but they have only been taught to memorize them to get a good grade on a test. They then forget the information in a few days. There is no push to deep learning, true understanding and critical thinking about anything.
6
So true. And its not only the children and young adults. Try having an intellectual conversation (politics, art, history, etc.) in adult company in the US, and you're met with stares, sarcastic and demeaning remarks, and overall rudeness - and I live in New York City. I can only imagine what it's like in the rest of the country! With the exception of my wonderful American Jewish friends who thrive on stimulating conversation (sorry to generalize, but that's my experience), it's come to the point where I just keep to myself or hang out with with my foreign educated and/or born friends.
3
You were spot on in your comments until your last paragraph. What does Trump have to do with anything? One does not have to agree with what he says in order to acknowledge that he knows what the EU and the UN are, and is also superbly well-educated. (And he's also the perfect foil to the real know-nothings, Rubio and Cruz.).
2
Let's face it, compared to much of the rest of the world our kids are math and science deficient. Why? Because they are lazy!
10
And parents too busy to care how the TV is raising their offspring.
3
The grade inflation outlined in the article isn't surprising.
The pact with our once dynamic and vaunted middle class hinged partially on long term job security. High schools in America offered multi track curriculum to satisfy a variety of needs and going to college was considered a choice - not the "only" choice. Emphasis on industrial arts for a large student constituency was underwritten by the institutional need for massive amounts of skilled and semi-skilled workers.
In the absence of those industries and jobs, the struggle to educate our students for new murky job prospects isn't surprising and the solutions will require ambitious thinking. We're sweeping too much under the rug.
The pact with our once dynamic and vaunted middle class hinged partially on long term job security. High schools in America offered multi track curriculum to satisfy a variety of needs and going to college was considered a choice - not the "only" choice. Emphasis on industrial arts for a large student constituency was underwritten by the institutional need for massive amounts of skilled and semi-skilled workers.
In the absence of those industries and jobs, the struggle to educate our students for new murky job prospects isn't surprising and the solutions will require ambitious thinking. We're sweeping too much under the rug.
7
Call it what it is: an attendance certificate.
27
I wish it was even that. I'm pretty confident some students pass courses who have barely set their foot in the door (at least at the community college/college level).
1
Totally expected. No child left behind, alright. Everybody "deserves" to succeed. Just like minimum wages, we have and will see minimum grades because "everyone is good enough, works hard enough, and doggone it, everybody likes each other".
5
...except that a livable minimum wage worked in the past and makes sense now, whereas awarding students credit without learning has never worked and makes no sense. You're imagining an analogous relationship that doesn't exist.
1
When educational administers cave in to student demands about trigger warnings, safe spaces, pc acceptable Halloween costumes and whether or not we can name anything after that hateful former president Woodrow Wilson, things that really matter like a sound education fall by the way side. SAT scores continue to fall and yet the solution seems to be to make things even easier so parents won't be upset and administrators can keep their jobs. Eduction, when it's done right, isn't easy or efficient or cost free, and sometimes it even makes students uncomfortable. Until we're ready as a nation to re-experience such things, it will only get worse.
16
My kids went to a very diverse primary school. All kids got pre-k and while there were differences in success levels, most of the kids passed into middle school. In middle school, the kids were separated into different levels of competence based on a single IQ test. It was there I discovered there were actually four schools, the high achievers were placed in high honors classes, then there was regular honors, then there were all the rest and finally there were the low achievers were placed in special classes if they had social problems. I knew this, because my kid had not done well on one section of the IQ test and was placed in the third group, and we had to fight to get him in high honors, despite never having less than an A. By high school these four groups had distinctly different educations. It was also around then that I noted that the kids began to self segregate. The black kids that had attended the same primary and pre K programs, started speaking differently and stopped hanging out with the white kids. It was more important to be cool than brainy. The white and Asian kids moved into the advanced placement classes, the Hispanics and blacks stayed in the regular classes. It was clear to me that they were receiving a distinctly less rigorous curriculum and were not prepared for college and were graduating with an inferior education, but graduating none the less.
18
The schools in my district have self-segregated this way. They got the MONEY TO DO THIS from Bill Gates and his small schools initiative.
They broke the high school up into four small schools, which ended up segregated with the white kids all in the gifted & talented programs, and the black kids all in the remedial courses. The schools had names like "The PRIDE School" which tell you right off, it is about academic failure.
They did this, for the most part, to retain white students. The white parents had been moving out of the district at a pretty brisk clip, not wanting their precious white children to associate with black kids, and pick up "attitude", black expressions, or listen to hip hop music.
The district is majority black, so retaining white students was a HUGE priority.
Needless to say, the "small schools initiative" has failed and our schools are doing worse than ever. We are in the bottom 5 in the entire STATE. (We do have the honor of paying the highest tax rate in the state for this "privilege".)
So to deal with this, the district passed a HUGE bond issue which we the taxpayers will have to pay for, over 30 years -- to build a NEW high school. Now they figure a fancy new building with computer labs will "make kids proud, and want to learn".
This will fail also.
They broke the high school up into four small schools, which ended up segregated with the white kids all in the gifted & talented programs, and the black kids all in the remedial courses. The schools had names like "The PRIDE School" which tell you right off, it is about academic failure.
They did this, for the most part, to retain white students. The white parents had been moving out of the district at a pretty brisk clip, not wanting their precious white children to associate with black kids, and pick up "attitude", black expressions, or listen to hip hop music.
The district is majority black, so retaining white students was a HUGE priority.
Needless to say, the "small schools initiative" has failed and our schools are doing worse than ever. We are in the bottom 5 in the entire STATE. (We do have the honor of paying the highest tax rate in the state for this "privilege".)
So to deal with this, the district passed a HUGE bond issue which we the taxpayers will have to pay for, over 30 years -- to build a NEW high school. Now they figure a fancy new building with computer labs will "make kids proud, and want to learn".
This will fail also.
1
As a teacher, this comes as no surprise. It's been going on for years. The subtle pressure to pass students. The quarterly reports to show percentages of who is passing and who isn't. The call in to the Assistant Principal to explain why in one class I have more failures than the others. A program where I target students and give them extra attention in order to help them pass. The weekly call home to either the frustrated or apathetic parent that I'm still giving your child a chance to pass.The truth is that there are no deadlines anymore. Give them more time to hand in work. More time to get that passing average up. I'm not sure if we are actually helping the students or enabling them. So it is no surprise when colleges say high school graduates are not ready, because it's the system that has created this problem. Shame, shame, shame.
35
The simple truth is that not all students will ever be "college ready" because not all students come to school with the same intellectual ability or academic support from home. Students who know they will never be want or be able to go to college are being poorly served by the college or nothing approach.
If you want a numerical measure of how well schools are doing, the state created assessments are the best measure because they attempt to measure how well a student has mastered the basic skills and knowledge represented by a high school diploma. There always will be a difference between those numbers and the numbers of students who are "college ready". If those numbers don't represent a similar number of students who are career ready then perhaps we need to reassess the skills we are teaching.
About twenty years ago schools began ditching vocational programs in favor of college prep. Those vocational programs not only helped high school students learn real world job skills, but they helped students maintain an interest in school. Vocational programs are making a come back and they should restore balance to public education.
I am not saying that all students don't need to acquire reading comprehension, algebraic problem solving skills, biology, chemistry, American history etc, but they don't all need to have mastered those skills at the college entrance level. Our educational goal should be to create productive, employable graduates, not just college freshmen.
If you want a numerical measure of how well schools are doing, the state created assessments are the best measure because they attempt to measure how well a student has mastered the basic skills and knowledge represented by a high school diploma. There always will be a difference between those numbers and the numbers of students who are "college ready". If those numbers don't represent a similar number of students who are career ready then perhaps we need to reassess the skills we are teaching.
About twenty years ago schools began ditching vocational programs in favor of college prep. Those vocational programs not only helped high school students learn real world job skills, but they helped students maintain an interest in school. Vocational programs are making a come back and they should restore balance to public education.
I am not saying that all students don't need to acquire reading comprehension, algebraic problem solving skills, biology, chemistry, American history etc, but they don't all need to have mastered those skills at the college entrance level. Our educational goal should be to create productive, employable graduates, not just college freshmen.
21
In your first paragraph, you point out that there will always be a difference in outcomes because students' out-of-school experiences differ so much. In your second, you say that state standardized assessments are a good indication of how well schools are doing their jobs.
Those statements contradict each other, and only the first is right. What those tests reflect is mostly the out-of-school factors the schools can't influence. They're not useful for evaluating instruction.
Those statements contradict each other, and only the first is right. What those tests reflect is mostly the out-of-school factors the schools can't influence. They're not useful for evaluating instruction.
2
No surprise that the lousy education correlates with a solidly conservative state.
9
Generally that's true, but Obama has been every bit as horrible for education as Bush was, and both Clinton and Sanders have voiced support (Clinton just recently) for continuing to hold educators, not students, responsible for test scores that depend mostly on student and parent factors.
Yes, Republicans have done more damage to our education system historically, but give the Democrats time. They're catching up.
Yes, Republicans have done more damage to our education system historically, but give the Democrats time. They're catching up.
2
I thoroughly concur that much/most of the problem is lousy parenting, and a culture of overly permissive home life and lack of accountability for today's youth.
That being said, ignorance is more deeply manifest in red states than blue, and cycles through generation after generation.
That being said, ignorance is more deeply manifest in red states than blue, and cycles through generation after generation.
1
No matter how smart an American citizen is, corporations won't hire them as long as they can move their businesses overseas or import slave labor with H1B visas.
American kids can't compete with people who will work for free in exchange for a dorm bed and 2 meals a day in a company compound.
Once Gates and Buffet and the Waltons and the Broads have completely destroyed public schools and used bogus tests to label every American as "too stupid," they will go in for the kill and import millions of Asians/Indians/Eastern Europeans who will work for almost nothing, thus maximizing their own profits and making them ever richer.
Watch and see.
American kids can't compete with people who will work for free in exchange for a dorm bed and 2 meals a day in a company compound.
Once Gates and Buffet and the Waltons and the Broads have completely destroyed public schools and used bogus tests to label every American as "too stupid," they will go in for the kill and import millions of Asians/Indians/Eastern Europeans who will work for almost nothing, thus maximizing their own profits and making them ever richer.
Watch and see.
14
Part of the reasons corporations turn to H1Bs is that Americans who are well-educated enough to do these jobs are so scarce that they command very high salaries.
If there were squads of recent college grads who were able to do this work, and do it well for a modest starting salary, corporations would not be doing this.
If there were squads of recent college grads who were able to do this work, and do it well for a modest starting salary, corporations would not be doing this.
Why do they need "recent college grads"? Look at which workers gets laid off at large corporate entities: it's anyone over 45 and/or anyone who has enough experience to command a decent salary and benefits. And then they are replaced by H1B employees - not because of their vastly better education and capabilities, but for their vastly lower salaries.
3
Too often we ignore the role that self-motivation plays in the academic success of a high school student. Where does that motivation come from? Teenagers are facing an all-consuming uphill battle in LIFE. This is confirmed every day by what they see and experience. To motivate themselves to work harder and do better in school, they need to feel that the associated benefits are real. Given what they face in life, just hearing about these benefits, in theory, isn't enough. The tangible and emotional reward for "studying and getting good grades" needs to be much more immediate. How do we create that? For a teenager who has never held down a job and whose family cannot afford to send them to college, the emotional investment and motivational effort it takes to get them to work harder, do better and graduate just doesn't appear to be worth it. Statistics can motivate parents and teachers, but they don't motivate students. Get the think-tankers working on the human and motivational side of education....
2
Barry,
Would it help if students saw people in their communities whose devotion to getting a real education had paid off by an increase in both happiness and material wealth?
Are there enough examples of that in ordinary middle/lower middle/ poor neighbourhoods (the vast majority of people)? Unless there are, that devotion to education leads to only a theoretical outcome for both the student and their parents.
Until there is a return of real upward mobility based on merit, until there are real opportunities, I can't see that happening.
I think that is one of the origins of the problem that many commenters here have made about the lack of motivation displayed by students and parents.
Would it help if students saw people in their communities whose devotion to getting a real education had paid off by an increase in both happiness and material wealth?
Are there enough examples of that in ordinary middle/lower middle/ poor neighbourhoods (the vast majority of people)? Unless there are, that devotion to education leads to only a theoretical outcome for both the student and their parents.
Until there is a return of real upward mobility based on merit, until there are real opportunities, I can't see that happening.
I think that is one of the origins of the problem that many commenters here have made about the lack of motivation displayed by students and parents.
3
Pop culture's professionally designed and targeted suctioning up of young people's time, the death of the habit of reading real books, the generally underpaid profession of teaching and lowering of the prestige of the intellectual orientation, the PC insistence on constantly lowering the knowledge bar so that the most unwilling learners feel good about their token efforts. I would not expect good things to happen given these trends.
Imagine a culture in which you could read ad campaign for learning with inanities asking for instance, "How do we make science less boring?" When science, the single most amazing field in human endeavor, can be claimed to be boring, you know that the society has turned down a very bad path.
We'd do right raising every learning bar. 10% of grades should be an "A." Students should be flunked for a low "D." Tests should be intimidating. Written English should be severely criticized. Stop letting the inmates run the asylum.
Imagine a culture in which you could read ad campaign for learning with inanities asking for instance, "How do we make science less boring?" When science, the single most amazing field in human endeavor, can be claimed to be boring, you know that the society has turned down a very bad path.
We'd do right raising every learning bar. 10% of grades should be an "A." Students should be flunked for a low "D." Tests should be intimidating. Written English should be severely criticized. Stop letting the inmates run the asylum.
68
“It’s a push and pull between rigorous standards that are harder to meet,” said Russell W. Rumberger, a professor of education at the University of California, Santa Barbara, “and less rigorous standards that are easier to meet ..." Rumberger is right on. That said, more rigorous standards and corresponding assessments are the cheapest and easiest parts of the puzzle. Excellent instruction, facilities, instructional materials, and more time on task are more expensive and harder to implement - and yet, these are certainly more important for good results.
1
I teach at a four-year university in a poor community in South Texas, and am often appalled by their general lack of readiness for college. It isn't just literacy and numeracy skills they are lacking. They also lack a basic understanding of economics, government, and social dynamics.
Yet I also find them eager to learn. This points to some of the problems with an education system too focused on quantitative metrics, where students are reduced to objects in a production process. But this only reflects a society in which the value of a person is often based on their relative position in the job market, which is derived from their capacity to produce profit for their employer.
In general the problem is not with teachers, who are themselves under-valued and forced to make do with inadequate resources. Sure, some teachers don't belong in the classroom, but just as our education system fails to challenge its students, so it distrusts and fails to challenge its teachers. Themselves confined to narrow boxes, what else can they do but teach students to fit into their own?
Yet I also find them eager to learn. This points to some of the problems with an education system too focused on quantitative metrics, where students are reduced to objects in a production process. But this only reflects a society in which the value of a person is often based on their relative position in the job market, which is derived from their capacity to produce profit for their employer.
In general the problem is not with teachers, who are themselves under-valued and forced to make do with inadequate resources. Sure, some teachers don't belong in the classroom, but just as our education system fails to challenge its students, so it distrusts and fails to challenge its teachers. Themselves confined to narrow boxes, what else can they do but teach students to fit into their own?
11
Your comment reflects my experience as a TA at a fairly well-regarded state college. My students were so eager to learn, but found many of them lacked the basic math skills to succeed in the class, which was General Chemistry II. I didn't have time to teach them years of high school math, and I felt bad for them because they really wanted to learn the course material. They had "done well" in school, only to discover they lacked the skills to excel or even pass at the college level. I did my best and hope I helped some of them, but I felt they'd been swindled.
5
As a college instructor, I see this every semester. Students will try to do anything to get out of reading, think reading ten pages is way too much, and their ability to comprehend what they are reading is astonishingly low. Many of them have no idea about history beyond their lifetime and even then it is relegated to popular culture. Their writing is horrendous.
The international students I teach are much more prepared and often have a greater command of the English language than native speakers. It is no wonder that Michio Kaku has pointed out the incredible amount of brain drain occurring in the US. Something must be done at the elementary and high school levels because college instructors find it difficult to teach advanced concepts and subjects to students who are about as educated as a third-grader was in 1950.
The international students I teach are much more prepared and often have a greater command of the English language than native speakers. It is no wonder that Michio Kaku has pointed out the incredible amount of brain drain occurring in the US. Something must be done at the elementary and high school levels because college instructors find it difficult to teach advanced concepts and subjects to students who are about as educated as a third-grader was in 1950.
189
Chris, you hit the root cause of a great majority of the problems we face in the US. While in the US Air Force we found it necessary to write our technical orders for some of the highest technology in the world at the 5th grade reading level so our young enlistees could understand what they were required to do. All our enlisted were high school graduates. We wrote the technical orders for the officer corps at the 11th grade level to meet the average capability. All our officers are college graduates. As long as we do not teach our children to read and comprehend what they read they will be unable to learn to the required level. I went to schools in Germany and the Netherlands where I found that one reason their students perform better than US students...they teach them to read and COMPREHEND what they read. If the student doesn't learn they are not allowed to advance.
5
Chris in Memphis wrote, "The international students I teach are much more prepared" and "college instructors find it difficult to teach advanced concepts and subjects to students who are about as educated as a third-grader was in 1950."
I agree with your praise of international students, Chris. But even the young college instructors who graduated from U.S. schools are deficient in education. Working as a part-time faculty associate at Arizona State University recently and being put in an office shared with numerous others, I heard one undergraduate from China correct her instructor and explain that Henry James was not British but an American who lived mostly in England, and another Chinese first-year English as a Second Language student sit silently as his instructor told him, incorrectly, that his sentence, "I like fishing," was grammatically wrong because he was using the progressive tense with a verb other than "to be" -- pure nonsense.
It's too late now. The poorly-prepared graduates are now our younger high school teachers and college instructors, passing down their ignorance and unable to recognize their own role as victims of lowered standards.
I agree with your praise of international students, Chris. But even the young college instructors who graduated from U.S. schools are deficient in education. Working as a part-time faculty associate at Arizona State University recently and being put in an office shared with numerous others, I heard one undergraduate from China correct her instructor and explain that Henry James was not British but an American who lived mostly in England, and another Chinese first-year English as a Second Language student sit silently as his instructor told him, incorrectly, that his sentence, "I like fishing," was grammatically wrong because he was using the progressive tense with a verb other than "to be" -- pure nonsense.
It's too late now. The poorly-prepared graduates are now our younger high school teachers and college instructors, passing down their ignorance and unable to recognize their own role as victims of lowered standards.
2
Ever hear a teacher say to an auditorium full of students, "I will tell you when to applause"? And then turn around and see some of the brighter students looking really worried?
Our younger teachers went through their school days in the 1990s and even later. And they are not necessarily our brightest, either, although they're certainly full of good intentions. They have gone through colleges of education that stress "methods" over content; they think that correcting papers is a waste of time and that books that challenge students take the joy out of learning. Maybe they didn't like being challenged themselves.
Ask some young English teachers what they're reading, and you might find that they're leafing through a "how to write a paragraph" booklet. Not promising.
We are in trouble.
Our younger teachers went through their school days in the 1990s and even later. And they are not necessarily our brightest, either, although they're certainly full of good intentions. They have gone through colleges of education that stress "methods" over content; they think that correcting papers is a waste of time and that books that challenge students take the joy out of learning. Maybe they didn't like being challenged themselves.
Ask some young English teachers what they're reading, and you might find that they're leafing through a "how to write a paragraph" booklet. Not promising.
We are in trouble.
1
I suspect this is a concern at all levels of education. Various professions rely on licensing exams to confirm having a minimally acceptable level of competence. In many other situations there is a great reluctance to try to determine competence either because it may not really matter or it may be very difficult to do or it may lead to bad feelings or it may not lead to the results we demand or it may not accurately reflect how our society wishes to distribute rewards.
1
The dumbing down of our written and spoken language continues on its slow and inexorable path. Here are just a few examples, reflecting the abandonment of basic grammatical and mathematical principles no longer given significant (if any) weight in our educational institutions:
-ignorance of nominative case (use of "between she and I," which is a further erosion of the incorrect "between you and I"
-misspelling of the word "its"
-incorrect use of the "$" and "¢"signs in two increasingly common situations:
(1) signing something that costs fifty cents as ".50¢" (which is actually half a cent) instead of the correct "50¢" or "$.50"
(2) writing "$3 million dollars" instead of "$3 million
I cite these examples because, in my observation, they occur in the majority of cases. Many people subscribe to the (reactive) view that rules of grammar and spelling are needlessly complex, and language always evolves; I see this more as a weakening of education and just plain sloppiness. However, math is a precise science, and its increasing avoidance in school does not bode well for our future.
-ignorance of nominative case (use of "between she and I," which is a further erosion of the incorrect "between you and I"
-misspelling of the word "its"
-incorrect use of the "$" and "¢"signs in two increasingly common situations:
(1) signing something that costs fifty cents as ".50¢" (which is actually half a cent) instead of the correct "50¢" or "$.50"
(2) writing "$3 million dollars" instead of "$3 million
I cite these examples because, in my observation, they occur in the majority of cases. Many people subscribe to the (reactive) view that rules of grammar and spelling are needlessly complex, and language always evolves; I see this more as a weakening of education and just plain sloppiness. However, math is a precise science, and its increasing avoidance in school does not bode well for our future.
12
I question how much texting and messaging has done to cause this. I am retired 7 years but clearly remember seeing "2", for too or to, on writing assignments from students several years before I retired. They don't check spelling because spell checker does this for them.
They also can't find their way anywhere unless they "punch it into their GPS".
Many have decried the dumbing down but wonderful technology is aiding and abetting. As long as you know how to operate a smart phone you are good to go.
They also can't find their way anywhere unless they "punch it into their GPS".
Many have decried the dumbing down but wonderful technology is aiding and abetting. As long as you know how to operate a smart phone you are good to go.
1
You have cited two significant examples of how things that supposedly make decisions easier actually erode brain power. Spellcheck works against homophones; I imagine it won't be long until the differences between "affect" and "effect" become irrelevant. And I get a kick out of GPS: I always wonder what happens if it dies suddenly.
Duh?! Our 1% and their greedy political class criminals jam our schools with 10's of millions of children of illiterate immigrants that come from macho "might makes right societies", then they are 'taught' by semi-literate immigrant adults in "bilingual programs" that knowledgeable parents evade by sending their children to religious/private schools ... and Hispanic advocates on California NPR whine that they need more HELP because 40% of Hispanic college entrants need remedial classes. But the "experts" and we are supposed to so surprised. Sensationally shocked despite the fact that it is common knowledge that high school and college teachers don't even dare to give "home work" or reading assignments anymore for fear of being viewed as "intolerant" of the diverse cultures habits of sloth that we have imported into our "salad bowl" in recent decades? It's only by dumbing most citizens down to something like a 3rd world ignorant mob that our oligarchy of CEO's and political plutocrats can justify treating us like medieval serfs. Remember how violently resistant elites throughout history have been against educating the masses of citizens.
8
There is no shortage of white native born illiterate idiots in this country. As it is, your comment would fail as a high school writing assignment. Check in the mirror next time you're wondering what's wrong with this country, Winthrop.
7
A child entering fourth grade who cannot read at grade level also enters a high risk group that will struggle academically, drop out of high school, and commit crimes. A poor child hears 3 million fewer words by age three than a middle class child. A poor child hears more negative words than positive words. Educators cannot effectively be both parent & teacher. Addressing the dumbing down of high school coursework and the resulting college/career issues must begin the day the baby is born.
13
This is very messy and misleading for the students themselves.
It also hurts the colleges they are admitted to as well as the organizations that hire them.
Ugh. Sounds like reasonable Federal standards are in order.
It also hurts the colleges they are admitted to as well as the organizations that hire them.
Ugh. Sounds like reasonable Federal standards are in order.
5
I was a community college history professor for twenty two years,crediting in 2013. My students came from two of NJ's wealthiest counties. By various measures, the preparedness of my students declined sharply over these 22 years. What I found astonishing was that 68 per cent of high school graduates had to take remedial classes in English and/or math. An increasing number of my students were clearly unable to read or write at a college level. When I used graphs or charts, the numeric illiteracy ws appalling. I had earlier run two businesses. At the end of a semester with 34 students, often I would identify 3. Or 4 students who I would have considered hiring.
I am not impressed by the increase in high school graduation rates. Nationwide over 65 percent of high school graduates going to public colleges are required to take remedial courses and a large number of these students fail to graduate. I would how schools can award degrees to so many students who do not meet 10th grade English and/or math requirements.
I am not impressed by the increase in high school graduation rates. Nationwide over 65 percent of high school graduates going to public colleges are required to take remedial courses and a large number of these students fail to graduate. I would how schools can award degrees to so many students who do not meet 10th grade English and/or math requirements.
16
In most cases college is a baby sitting service.
1
I am afraid that is even more true of middle school and high school.
1
There's a chain email that's been circulating for years that points out, very accurately, that teachers are paid considerably less on a per-child basis than are babysitters. With more and more college instructors being non-tenured adjuncts, that's probably even more true at the university level.
The reality is that nearly all those teachers do a MUCH better job than we pay them for. And they'd probably do a better job yet, if we actually gave them the authority to do so.
The reality is that nearly all those teachers do a MUCH better job than we pay them for. And they'd probably do a better job yet, if we actually gave them the authority to do so.
2
I taught in the public schools of Florida for 10 years. A high school diploma, at least in this state, is meaningless. Young people are "graduating" that are illiterate, innumerate, and with little or no work ethic. I was constantly pressured/hassled by administrators to pass or give higher grades to students to "get the graduation rate up" . I repeatedly told the administrators to send me kids on grade level that would do even 15 minutes of homework a night in my course and the grades would improve and no one would fail -- but throughout my career in the Florida public schools I was sent large numbers of kids below grade level that refused to do any homework.
42
Same thing in VA! - and probably the other 48 states.
3
When I worked at a highly-regarded liberal arts college five years ago, I was shocked to discover how unprepared a large number of the incoming freshmen were; it was horrifying. Educators are lowering standards every year, but it's nothing new- America has been "dumbing" itself down for decades, from well before the turn of the century.
After all, America elected George W. Bush to be its President- and only idiots could have done that.
After all, America elected George W. Bush to be its President- and only idiots could have done that.
41
I went to a top liberal arts college myself, class of 1975.
When we entered, the freshman intro courses were a bit of a challenge, but most of the students did pretty well. I typed terms papers to make money, and the analysis of Plato's philosophy by lacrosse jocks from Ohio was up to a pretty high standard. Guys had to hit the books a few hours a day, but they also had time to have plenty of fun. The average entering SATs at this school were about 650/650.
By the time I was a senior, it was a different story. The entering freshman were completely befuddled by the same freshman courses. They really struggled with level of intellectual argument they were expected to understand, and had to spend almost all their time studying to do well.
I suspect the difference was when TV sets appeared in households. Most of my class had lived the first 5 or 6 years of their lives largely TV-free. It might also have been the secondary schools, too, as a lot of stuff was tossed out as old-fashioned in the late 60s and early 70s.
When we entered, the freshman intro courses were a bit of a challenge, but most of the students did pretty well. I typed terms papers to make money, and the analysis of Plato's philosophy by lacrosse jocks from Ohio was up to a pretty high standard. Guys had to hit the books a few hours a day, but they also had time to have plenty of fun. The average entering SATs at this school were about 650/650.
By the time I was a senior, it was a different story. The entering freshman were completely befuddled by the same freshman courses. They really struggled with level of intellectual argument they were expected to understand, and had to spend almost all their time studying to do well.
I suspect the difference was when TV sets appeared in households. Most of my class had lived the first 5 or 6 years of their lives largely TV-free. It might also have been the secondary schools, too, as a lot of stuff was tossed out as old-fashioned in the late 60s and early 70s.
4
Agreed, and even more so considering they elected him the second time.
2
Actually, the majority of us DIDN'T elect him--he and his unscrupulous cronies stole the election in 2000, you may recall. That was just before he "kept us safe" on 9/11 (!) and started "No Child Left-Untested," his disastrous Federal over-reach, which Obama, shockingly and sadly, has persisted in maintaining.
Disappointing.
Disappointing.
3
As an adjunct professor, I can attest to the fact that getting a university education is not what it used to be. At many universities, instructors feel we must "dumb down" courses when faced with students who are not equipped for what used be considered university-level work. In essence, it's a vicious cycle: lower high school standards leads to lower university standards. Getting a diploma at both levels (hs and university) may look good on paper, but I often wonder what will happen when young people enter the real world.
22
They major in English & become book editors. Just look at the vast bulk of what's published since large corporation took over US publishers, reducing the total to 5 (five), 2 of which are German owned, 1 French owned.
1
Is it at all clear that people need to understand imaginary numbers and matrices in order to be productive members of society? I'm not sure what is covered these days in Algebra II; perhaps it has been dumbed down. Even if solving quadratic equations and factoring polynomials has been moved from Algebra I to Algebra II, how many NY Times readers use those skills on the job or in other activities? I wonder whether the author of the article does. (A very basic understanding of the uses and misuses of statistics, and of the difference between causation and correlation, is perhaps a different matter.)
There is no question but that the ability to reason in a rigorous way is important; is math the only way to learn that skill? I'm not a technophobe; I took two years of major-level calculus and physics and think that we undervalue the STEM fields. Nevertheless, it seems to me that an insistence that all students take math at the Algebra II level to earn a high school diploma is misguided.
There is no question but that the ability to reason in a rigorous way is important; is math the only way to learn that skill? I'm not a technophobe; I took two years of major-level calculus and physics and think that we undervalue the STEM fields. Nevertheless, it seems to me that an insistence that all students take math at the Algebra II level to earn a high school diploma is misguided.
14
Real education is not job training.
I've never used matrices at work, but I've never used Latin, "The Scarlet Letter," the Cuban Missile Crisis, or swimming either. I still had to take them in high school, and I'm a better person for it.
I've never used matrices at work, but I've never used Latin, "The Scarlet Letter," the Cuban Missile Crisis, or swimming either. I still had to take them in high school, and I'm a better person for it.
5
@Mark
You are so right about math. I had advanced calculus classes in college because had intended to go into a hard science. I ended up in accounting. What sort of math (as opposed to arithmetic) do I use? First year algebra and a bit of statistics. In my personal life, like everyone else these days, I need to know the basics of geometry, statistics and probability. And all those subjects are still better learned when first taught as practical applications, not theory. The theory will come later.
You are so right about math. I had advanced calculus classes in college because had intended to go into a hard science. I ended up in accounting. What sort of math (as opposed to arithmetic) do I use? First year algebra and a bit of statistics. In my personal life, like everyone else these days, I need to know the basics of geometry, statistics and probability. And all those subjects are still better learned when first taught as practical applications, not theory. The theory will come later.
There may be a data problem here. The Bureau of Labor Statistics has reported that the high school graduation rate has declined from 90.3% in 2010 to 83.3% by 2014.
6
Standards will continue to decline so long as teachers and schools are the ones who bear the most responsibility for students' success. Students know the burden is on the schools not to fail them and not for them to succeed and the less motivated students will do less work knowing that the schools will do all they must do to help them succeed.
7
Ah - here in Arizona we are preparing to lead the nation in education:
From an Arizona Republic article on the person just appointed to lead the (State) Senate Education Committee
Sylvia "Allen is best known for her controversial public comments over the years. During a legislative hearing in 2009, she said the Earth is 6,000 years old, a belief held by "Young Earth" biblical creationists. In 2013, a Facebook post about chem-trail conspiracies gained widespread media attention, as did a March comment suggesting mandatory church attendance."
As a nation we need real education - building a future generation that knows math, science, history, how to think, learn, and act.
As we face more and more complicated problems and uncertainty we need more not less education and thinking.
From an Arizona Republic article on the person just appointed to lead the (State) Senate Education Committee
Sylvia "Allen is best known for her controversial public comments over the years. During a legislative hearing in 2009, she said the Earth is 6,000 years old, a belief held by "Young Earth" biblical creationists. In 2013, a Facebook post about chem-trail conspiracies gained widespread media attention, as did a March comment suggesting mandatory church attendance."
As a nation we need real education - building a future generation that knows math, science, history, how to think, learn, and act.
As we face more and more complicated problems and uncertainty we need more not less education and thinking.
6
Why are we lowering standards?
2
Because we've got it into our collective heads that when students fail, it's the teachers' fault, not the students'. They're lowering standards because we've demanded that they do so.
4
Too much of education these days is focused on top down solutions, too much administration and not enough quality classroom teaching. Administrators are going to do whatever is needed to get the statistics where they need to be. This does not mean the students are where they should be. Lure better teachers into the profession: ones that know subject matter and pedagogy. This will mean higher pay and a more professional work environment or the quality people will go elsewhere. Fix the problem from the bottom up.
3
We don't need better teachers. The teachers we have now are more than capable of teaching. We just have to let them. Stop telling them their jobs depend on EVERY student passing and the problem of students passing without earning it will be solved.
4
The key are ACT (or SAT) results. If there's no improvement in readiness for college on these tests, then improvement in graduation rates are illusory and rather meaningless wrt to desired readiness for post-high school education/training. The improvement in graduation rates then only means that high schools are better able to retain more students for four years some of which students would ordinarily drop out in previous times.
3
I heard an account of a recent study that found, among other things, that American children had no idea that french fries were made from potatoes.
I mean really, if there are any standards that still exist in a meaningful way, is actually possible for them to get any lower?
I mean really, if there are any standards that still exist in a meaningful way, is actually possible for them to get any lower?
8
The situation in education is somewhat analogous to that of medical care (see "When Hospital Paperwork Crowds Out Hospital Care" in the Dec 19 issue of NYT). Just as required documentation for medical insurance payments can be seen to be interfering with medical care, so are standardized testing requirements (read documented scores) interfering with real learning. Documentation = $$ and educational institutions, like everyone else, are following the money.
3
"Even on simpler tests of the cognitive skills needed for many jobs, fewer than two-thirds of South Carolina 11th graders could show sufficient skills in both math and reading."
Math and reading are certainly valuable skills but, in a sense, they are but pathways to an even more important skill -- the ability to think logically, analytically, critically.
Critical thinking can be as mundane as deciding whether a TV ad makes sense or skeptically reading a political flyer received in the mail. It's about making an informed judgement.
I fear many have never acquired that skill and, if not acquired early, it may never be.
Math and reading are certainly valuable skills but, in a sense, they are but pathways to an even more important skill -- the ability to think logically, analytically, critically.
Critical thinking can be as mundane as deciding whether a TV ad makes sense or skeptically reading a political flyer received in the mail. It's about making an informed judgement.
I fear many have never acquired that skill and, if not acquired early, it may never be.
43
Can't help but wonder how many teachers could pass subject matter tests for the subject they teach.
The world needs cooks, factory workers, and poets just as much or more than it needs mathematicians and engineers. Americans need to let go of the insane idea that everyone 'has' to do good in math and reading or they will lead miserable lives because they'll never be rich. Life is not about being rich; it is about living out your own personal goals, no matter how small. The simple truth is, not everyone is cut out to get straight As (or even Bs or Cs) in math. Not everyone will ace English lit. Perhaps if we instead gave students more choice in high school, allowing them to pursue their personal interests, then we would do better. Forget about training students for jobs. Our education system is abysmal in that regard. Instead, focus on teaching them to think critically and formulate their own goals. Let them find out their interests and follow them. Let them drop English if they don't like it and would rather spend more time learning chemistry. In other words, maybe we'd do better if high school were a little more like college.
4
Do you dream and hope that your children will become cooks, factor workers or better still garbage collectors?. I've hear your argument for forty years, and it was irrational when I heard it first, and it's irrational now. How will the factory worker purchase a house or pay for higher education for their children on the income they will receive for their skills.
Please, don't speak unless you've walked the road of the poor, and experienced the difficulties of their lives. As an immigrant, we sacrificed everything so that our children could have a great education, and believe me it was the best thing we ever did. A doctor, a lawyer, a principal and a teacher, with the last child studying nuclear science with the hope to enter med school in two years. Lastly, they are all bilingual. Above all, no late night calls from the Police saying my child was in trouble. So please, think clearly about the implications of your ideas before suggesting that others follow your suggestions.
Please, don't speak unless you've walked the road of the poor, and experienced the difficulties of their lives. As an immigrant, we sacrificed everything so that our children could have a great education, and believe me it was the best thing we ever did. A doctor, a lawyer, a principal and a teacher, with the last child studying nuclear science with the hope to enter med school in two years. Lastly, they are all bilingual. Above all, no late night calls from the Police saying my child was in trouble. So please, think clearly about the implications of your ideas before suggesting that others follow your suggestions.
3
An implicit goal of US education has been to educate the citizenry so that they can be useful and participating citizens involving the questions of the day. In this we have failed. Yet more diversity at the secondary level makes that goal impossible to achieve--without literacy, numeracy and critical thinking the student is not prepared to be a citizen. Teaching those things has to take up most of the four years of a high school curriculum.
Use secondary school for giving people a shared set of realities; use tertiary education for diversification.
Use secondary school for giving people a shared set of realities; use tertiary education for diversification.
3
Reply to dardenlinux Texas: You don't believe everyone needs to be a good reader? There is nothing about reading that takes a high IQ, or special skill. It's simply a matter of putting in the time. You basically suggest youngsters be allowed to skip the most fundamentally important skill kids learn.
You suggest people be trained, "... to think critically and formulate their own goals," but you disdain reading & math, both absolute requirements of critical thinking and goal decisions, you make no sense.
You suggest people be trained, "... to think critically and formulate their own goals," but you disdain reading & math, both absolute requirements of critical thinking and goal decisions, you make no sense.
3
Lower class sizes, invest more money per student, keep spending public and transparent. That's what always works.
Nursing bizarre fantasies about evil teachers, tenure systems, and unions. Viewing lower income students as an obstacle to, rather than an opportunity for, making good on the promise of a quality public education for all. That's what never works.
Nursing bizarre fantasies about evil teachers, tenure systems, and unions. Viewing lower income students as an obstacle to, rather than an opportunity for, making good on the promise of a quality public education for all. That's what never works.
32
Right, because teachers who essentially can't be fired no matter how incompetent they are are nothing more than a "bizarre fantasy". Teacher's unions who protect their members at all costs. students be (censored), are nothing more than a "bizarre fantasy". Throwing more money at the system, whether or not the system works, is the solution. There's a bizarre fantasy here, all right, and it's your post.
1
Yes, the idea that incompetent teachers cannot be fired is a "bizarre fantasy. " Teachers are not hired with tenure; they have to earn it after a trial period of several years, when they may be fired for any reason whatsoever. And unlike college faculty, after getting tenure, schoolteachers can still be fired for cause; all tenure gives a schoolteacher is a guarantee of due process.
If you insist that tenure and unions protect incompetent teachers, you must explain how it is that these incompetent teachers earned tenure in the first place. The "bizarre fantasy" is that teachers are competent enough to make it through the tenure process, but become incompetent as they gain experience.
If you insist that tenure and unions protect incompetent teachers, you must explain how it is that these incompetent teachers earned tenure in the first place. The "bizarre fantasy" is that teachers are competent enough to make it through the tenure process, but become incompetent as they gain experience.
4
"If you insist that tenure and unions protect incompetent teachers, you must explain how it is that these incompetent teachers earned tenure in the first place."
I watched a 3rd grade teacher, both innumerate and illiterate, win tenure despite numerous parents' complaints to the principal. I often wonder why this was permitted myself.
That I cannot explain it doesn't mean it didn't occur (unfortunately).
...Andrew
I watched a 3rd grade teacher, both innumerate and illiterate, win tenure despite numerous parents' complaints to the principal. I often wonder why this was permitted myself.
That I cannot explain it doesn't mean it didn't occur (unfortunately).
...Andrew
4
There is much in the popular culture which denigrates education. The business subculture would, of course, make consuming automatons of us all. There is a strong poplar conception that education is impractical. We have powerful stereotypes of the absent minded professor and the "ivory tower" intellectual who is likely to be run over crossing the street. To be well spoken and well read is thought to be arrogant and to display presumptions of superiority. Some subcultures of class, race, and ethnicity scorn members who achieve educationally and intellectually. Study is considered to be boring, not fun. To be sure there are problems with instruction and materials that reinforce the latter conceptions, but they also receive powerful reinforcement from the popular culture, and the response often is to dummy down to where the majority of students are and prefer to stay. Some among the latter rationalize that Asian and Jewish students are more highly endowed intellectually, but in fact they work harder, the difference being the parental and peer influence that values education.
121
It will never happen in the USA, but property taxes should be de-coupled from public school budgets. There so many levels of public school inequity that stems from that one issue across the USA.
124
@K Henderson:
Here in the Land of Enchantment, public school funding is determined at the state level in order to circumvent the inequity that you speak of.
It doesn't work.
Our HS graduation rate is only 68.5%. The stupid and/or underachieving students still do poorly, and the bright and/or hardworking students still do well.
Here in the Land of Enchantment, public school funding is determined at the state level in order to circumvent the inequity that you speak of.
It doesn't work.
Our HS graduation rate is only 68.5%. The stupid and/or underachieving students still do poorly, and the bright and/or hardworking students still do well.
2
Again, let's blame everybody else but the parents who send these undisciplined and unprepared kids without good working habits to schools and then expect miracles. No amount of money will help nor it should
For decades I have recommended that Colorado declare the whole state to be one district for valuation purposes. Throughout the nation the disparity in student achievement is mostly based on socioeconomic status. Having school district financing based on local taxes and district boundaries to purposely discriminate are a major problem. As income and wealth inequality expand the difference in school building equity and opportunity becomes even more telling.
It makes a difference which womb you are born from, and then again which neighborhood in which you live and go to school. This is why there is far more social mobility in Europe now than the USA.
It makes a difference which womb you are born from, and then again which neighborhood in which you live and go to school. This is why there is far more social mobility in Europe now than the USA.
2
Education bureaucrats will manipulate metrics to show whatever result one desires. The education bureaucrats who most likely were lousy teachers, will then have a great career moving from job to job in the educational industrial complex. Add a doctorate in education and a collection of bow ties and you are golden.
1
Actually having taught is usually enough to disqualify you from an important leadership position in education. We'll let people who actually know what they're talking about be building principals. Maybe even superintendents, in relatively small districts. But if you want to be a Michelle Rhee or a Joel Klein or an Arne Duncan, knowing anything about education will rule you out. The only way to get those sorts of positions after having taught is to have taught as badly and as briefly (and as unqualified-ly) as Rhee did.
4
Parents of students with disabilities led the push for an elimination of the exit exam? For shame. So we have to lower standards now in a PC attempt to pacify parents with struggling students? It's an insult to students with disability whose parents insist that they DO push themselves (I was one of them, back in the 1980s) and unfair to everyone else.
27
And this is (at least partly) why we have an increasingly "dumbed down" electorate, and why so many people can support a blatant proto-fascist like Donald Trump. And we can blame (at least partly) the Texas Board of Education, which determines a lot of what makes it to middle and high school textbooks, and has been creating "revisionist history" by "downplaying" many important REAL historical facts and "inserting" many bogus "facts," not least the completely debunked assertion that the U.S. was founded as a "Christian nation."
6
The only way to close the gap is to lower standards as much as possible.
3
These children spend 4 years in high school learning Spanish and they can't have a simple conversation talking to you about the days events. What's the point?
3
Where have these so-called "experts" been over the last couple decades? I have taught college for 30 years and have witnessed a steady and significant decline in academic preparation and expectation in students.
A real-life example: In a class I taught this last semester, not a single student knew that 36 inches equal 1 yard.
A real-life example: In a class I taught this last semester, not a single student knew that 36 inches equal 1 yard.
28
Measurement is not on the standardized tests, so kids can't measure.
And it's not the teachers' fault. If your job depended on a single, flawed metric that you had very limited power to influence (the in-school factors account for maybe 10% of the variance in student test scores; parenting and student ability are the main factors), you'd do your best to maximize the small impact you can have.
We've got a bunch of people who'll insist we need to hold teachers accountable in order to fix this problem... which was caused, mostly, by attempts to hold teachers accountable.
And it's not the teachers' fault. If your job depended on a single, flawed metric that you had very limited power to influence (the in-school factors account for maybe 10% of the variance in student test scores; parenting and student ability are the main factors), you'd do your best to maximize the small impact you can have.
We've got a bunch of people who'll insist we need to hold teachers accountable in order to fix this problem... which was caused, mostly, by attempts to hold teachers accountable.
3
Every semester I think half the students (perhaps more at the beginning of the semester) should be in a good voc-ed program. But that doesn't have any status like a degree to a white-collar professional position (which are fewer and fewer for those with 4-year degrees), so these Voc-Ed avenues go unexplored. Everyone does not need a 4-year academic degree to be a valued, capable, respected member of society. We need to have a cultural change in values where young people are honored and channelled into areas where they can make a valuable contribution. Until then we'll keep hitting the "brick wall."
71
There's no shame in blue-collar work.
1
@KGM1: there certain IS shame.... if you are a white collar TEACHER (with a public union job you can never be fired from, and only work 6 hour days, 180 days a year and retire at 52 with a huge pension).
It is TEACHERS who think that blue collar work is awful and a failure, and discourage students from even considering such careers. They push push push every kid -- even those who have no interest in further schooling -- to attend a 4 year college, and major in an academic field like English Literature or the current "fav" -- Engineering or "STEM" -- and NOTHING ELSE is acceptable or considered a success. If a teacher produced a student who went on to (say) go into the military, get technical training and then to a job in industry -- even at good pay and benefits -- that teacher would consider it a "failure" compared to producing a student who spends 10 years getting a MFA in Tibetan Basket Weaving, with a minor in French Medieval Poetry (and then a "job" at The Gap, folding jeans).
It is TEACHERS who think that blue collar work is awful and a failure, and discourage students from even considering such careers. They push push push every kid -- even those who have no interest in further schooling -- to attend a 4 year college, and major in an academic field like English Literature or the current "fav" -- Engineering or "STEM" -- and NOTHING ELSE is acceptable or considered a success. If a teacher produced a student who went on to (say) go into the military, get technical training and then to a job in industry -- even at good pay and benefits -- that teacher would consider it a "failure" compared to producing a student who spends 10 years getting a MFA in Tibetan Basket Weaving, with a minor in French Medieval Poetry (and then a "job" at The Gap, folding jeans).
Should everyone graduating high school be ready for college level work? I am not so certain.
8
Perhaps not, but even a BA/BS has been dumber down so much high school graduations a few generations ago actually seemed to know more than modern students.
1
Once upon a time, an academic high school diploma required more effort and meant more than an undergraduate degree today, and now a student must pay a six figure fee for the latter. A high school teacher nowadays asking for that much work would be castigated by parents and school districts alike; a college professor insisting on college level work receives a poor evaluation.
89
Over forty years ago, I was teaching first-year college writing in New York City. My grandparents took a car trip to Canada, and my grandfather, born in 1903 and an eighth-grade dropout from New York City schools, wrote me a letter from their motel stop, in Fort Ticonderoga. I took a break from grading papers to read it and realized that he, a man of average intelligence who rarely read anything but tabloid newspapers and magazines, wrote far better than the high school graduates of the 1970s.
Evidently the public schools of New York City, and I assume, much of the United States (even the segregated, barely-funded all-black schools of the South staffed by dedicated African-American teachers -- at least according to former colleagues who graduated such institutions), did a much better job educating students for life and the economy 70, 80, and 90 years ago than we do now.
Evidently the public schools of New York City, and I assume, much of the United States (even the segregated, barely-funded all-black schools of the South staffed by dedicated African-American teachers -- at least according to former colleagues who graduated such institutions), did a much better job educating students for life and the economy 70, 80, and 90 years ago than we do now.
5
Even 30 years ago, in the mandatory liberal arts courses that I took every summer to fast track my BA, I got an A in every course simply because few of the rest of young solidly middle class students did much work and what they did do was rushed, sloppy, and indifferent.
I recall one student, during a final class, hurriedly scribbling, in blue ball point pen on loose leaf paper, the ten page term paper that had to be turned in at the end of the class.
I was a young widow with two small children, a three hour commute to college, an old typewriter and a bottle of White Out, and I remember thinking that if this was my competition, I was going to do quite well in job market.
I did, as ambitious and hungry beats lazy and entitled in almost every profession.
I recall one student, during a final class, hurriedly scribbling, in blue ball point pen on loose leaf paper, the ten page term paper that had to be turned in at the end of the class.
I was a young widow with two small children, a three hour commute to college, an old typewriter and a bottle of White Out, and I remember thinking that if this was my competition, I was going to do quite well in job market.
I did, as ambitious and hungry beats lazy and entitled in almost every profession.
4
I don't understand this - kids today in high school, especially the more elite schools, get so much more homework and are under so much more pressure than past generations. This whole article is a class issue and no one is talking about that.
Participation trophies for all!!
And college for all, "paid for" by student grants and loans. This country has lost its mind.
We would be much better off with more kids graduating with a solid K-12 education and never going to college, than having so many "graduate" from K-12, poorly prepared for college, yet seduced into playing debt fueled make believe at a "college" of some sort.
And college for all, "paid for" by student grants and loans. This country has lost its mind.
We would be much better off with more kids graduating with a solid K-12 education and never going to college, than having so many "graduate" from K-12, poorly prepared for college, yet seduced into playing debt fueled make believe at a "college" of some sort.
83
But if students do not go on to college, who will cheer for the football teams on Saturday afternoon? How will the local liquor stores and other businesses dependent on fraternity and sorority fun survive? What if administrators at our nation's universities are thrown out of work? What will people aged 18-23 do with all their free time?
You're wrong. Our society depends upon getting more young people into colleges.
You're wrong. Our society depends upon getting more young people into colleges.
4
Make the school district guarantee the diploma. Over 25 years ago when I was on the Colorado State Board of Education I urged that we insure the quality of high school diplomas by making a school district stand behind their product.
If a student gets a high school diploma and then enters college and needs remedial courses make the school district pay the cost of those remedial courses. Increasing numbers of students entering college cannot read, write or do math at even the college entry level. Yet it is reported that founding father Thomas Jefferson urged school for all in order for democracy to work. His standard was that every 12 year old should be able to read anything they wanted to read, write and talk to people with skills, and do their numbers.
More than half of American 18 year olds cannot do this, let alone doing it by 12. Perhaps because we should start school for kids of 3 years and graduate them literate by 16. Do not permit social promotion, and use technology and active student learning which has proven to get students interested and learning. We adults just have to get out of their way. Children are born learning machines and keep asking why until adults get frustrated and answer, "because, shut up". Think of how smart our children would be if we kept helping them answer every 'why'?
If a student gets a high school diploma and then enters college and needs remedial courses make the school district pay the cost of those remedial courses. Increasing numbers of students entering college cannot read, write or do math at even the college entry level. Yet it is reported that founding father Thomas Jefferson urged school for all in order for democracy to work. His standard was that every 12 year old should be able to read anything they wanted to read, write and talk to people with skills, and do their numbers.
More than half of American 18 year olds cannot do this, let alone doing it by 12. Perhaps because we should start school for kids of 3 years and graduate them literate by 16. Do not permit social promotion, and use technology and active student learning which has proven to get students interested and learning. We adults just have to get out of their way. Children are born learning machines and keep asking why until adults get frustrated and answer, "because, shut up". Think of how smart our children would be if we kept helping them answer every 'why'?
10
The schools didn't create social promotion. It was forced on them. The schools didn't demand hare-brained "accountability" schemes that punished school staff when students were so lazy they failed. That was forced on them. We told the educators "Every student must graduate, or we'll close the school and fire the teachers." Now we're shocked that they did what we told them to do.
(The schools also didn't demand all the technology that ignorant people believe is the key to a 21st century education; that was mostly a marketing push by tech companies, and it certainly fooled a lot of easily-fooled people.)
Punishing the schools by reducing their already-low funding for graduating kids we've basically forced them to graduate is the opposite of what we should be doing. We should increase their funding and tell them their jobs are secure and that they should pass the kids who've earned it and fail the ones who deserve it.
(The schools also didn't demand all the technology that ignorant people believe is the key to a 21st century education; that was mostly a marketing push by tech companies, and it certainly fooled a lot of easily-fooled people.)
Punishing the schools by reducing their already-low funding for graduating kids we've basically forced them to graduate is the opposite of what we should be doing. We should increase their funding and tell them their jobs are secure and that they should pass the kids who've earned it and fail the ones who deserve it.
4
Here in NM, I agree with little that Governor Martinez does or says. However, her position that a kid who cannot read by the end of the third grade should be held back makes sense. I wonder how can the dear, ego-unbruised child learn anything at all in that condition. This change has been stymied by the legislature for some time now.
4
In Finland, which nearly everyone recognizes as having the BEST public education system in the world, school starts at....second grade, age 7.
Why? because before that, children need play time and to be with their parents, not the rigid environment of school. They are not read to read and sit still to learn before age 7.
Of course, Finnish school does not end at 18, but goes on an additional 2 years so that children graduate at about age 19 or 20.
Even more importantly: Finland pays their teachers FAIRLY and in keeping with what other Finnish citizens earn with a similar education. That means an average of $35,000 a year (for Finnish teachers WITH a master's degree. In the US, the average is $55,000 for an American teacher WITHOUT a master's degree. Importantly, note that ALL teaching jobs are part time jobs, because school does not run full time, all year, as all other jobs do. For a part time job, this is more than adequate pay. Paying more money does not make teachers better -- it makes them spoiled and whinging.
We know what works. We refuse to do it. Why? Because education in this nation is entirely run by an immensely powerful union, which BENEFITS from the way things are.....they love love love it. They make huge money for little work, retire early and get billions in dues with which they bribe politicians to keep things just as they are.
Why? because before that, children need play time and to be with their parents, not the rigid environment of school. They are not read to read and sit still to learn before age 7.
Of course, Finnish school does not end at 18, but goes on an additional 2 years so that children graduate at about age 19 or 20.
Even more importantly: Finland pays their teachers FAIRLY and in keeping with what other Finnish citizens earn with a similar education. That means an average of $35,000 a year (for Finnish teachers WITH a master's degree. In the US, the average is $55,000 for an American teacher WITHOUT a master's degree. Importantly, note that ALL teaching jobs are part time jobs, because school does not run full time, all year, as all other jobs do. For a part time job, this is more than adequate pay. Paying more money does not make teachers better -- it makes them spoiled and whinging.
We know what works. We refuse to do it. Why? Because education in this nation is entirely run by an immensely powerful union, which BENEFITS from the way things are.....they love love love it. They make huge money for little work, retire early and get billions in dues with which they bribe politicians to keep things just as they are.
STOP, already, with the metrics !!!
These are different times.... In fact, much of what is offered in high schools today was offered ONLY in colleges in the past....
But these are VERY different times... and blithe comparisons based on conveniently selective metrics are bogus bogus!
Yes, diplomas come up short for many occupations and as training for citizenship, but that has always been the case. And the many specialized skills required for high end jobs were rarely the responsibility of high schools, which can only do so much.
Yes education is a mess, and the reasons are manifold, but simplistic comparisons with inflammatory headlines just add to the clutter.
Do we have the ability, in our fouled and mendacious politic, to have meaningful and constructive discussions ??
Perhaps the real problems lie there, and no one seems to have an answer to that....
These are different times.... In fact, much of what is offered in high schools today was offered ONLY in colleges in the past....
But these are VERY different times... and blithe comparisons based on conveniently selective metrics are bogus bogus!
Yes, diplomas come up short for many occupations and as training for citizenship, but that has always been the case. And the many specialized skills required for high end jobs were rarely the responsibility of high schools, which can only do so much.
Yes education is a mess, and the reasons are manifold, but simplistic comparisons with inflammatory headlines just add to the clutter.
Do we have the ability, in our fouled and mendacious politic, to have meaningful and constructive discussions ??
Perhaps the real problems lie there, and no one seems to have an answer to that....
4
"Failure Is Not an Option. You Will Pass. You Will Learn. You Will Succeed.”
Complete and utter nonsense. You cannot - ever - "make" someone learn. Out recent history is full of politicized ideas, laws and spending that will "make" kids learn. The only thing that will work is IF those students WANT to learn.
We've redrafted curriculum and changed standards and tests countless times. Most recently we have common core and parch to get kids to "think". But when it showed that it was too hard then we are now throwi those ideas out as we speak.
No society in the history of mankind has ever succeeded in making everyone equal. Whether in learning, knowledge, wealth or occupation. Everyone is different so having some new standards just proves one point.....
That our leaders - striving to improve education - have no knowledge of history. Therefore, they simply repeat all the wasted efforts of the past over and again.
And we allow it.
Complete and utter nonsense. You cannot - ever - "make" someone learn. Out recent history is full of politicized ideas, laws and spending that will "make" kids learn. The only thing that will work is IF those students WANT to learn.
We've redrafted curriculum and changed standards and tests countless times. Most recently we have common core and parch to get kids to "think". But when it showed that it was too hard then we are now throwi those ideas out as we speak.
No society in the history of mankind has ever succeeded in making everyone equal. Whether in learning, knowledge, wealth or occupation. Everyone is different so having some new standards just proves one point.....
That our leaders - striving to improve education - have no knowledge of history. Therefore, they simply repeat all the wasted efforts of the past over and again.
And we allow it.
16