The writtermstory was totaly striking. This types of happen in the Hindu society. It has adventage as well as disadvantages.People gets disappointed when astrology tells something bad about them and eventualy, they lack self-motivation , which is compeletely disgusting.
1
Thank you. A charming story!
6
The author describes the confusing task of fusing the beliefs of your parents into contemporary America, specifically NYC (she probably lives somewhere trendy in Manhattan to the least). It's easy to say astrology and future telling is a crazy topic (wasn't some psychic just fined for hundreds of thousands in NYC lately?), but this is told through the lens of family practices and Indian culture--therefore it sounds more homegrown and rooted in tradition then hocus-pocus. Basically, great piece, fits the motive of this column, and shares a tale of awakening. Similar to the fiancee part, my close friend recently ended a relationship with someone he thought was perfect, "checked off every box," but now that a relationship with who he thought would be best didn't last--he has no idea who he's looking for. Also, my own parents have looked to the stars and wisdom of Buddhist monks to gain any advice for my love and career life. I would share them with you--but I hear it's bad luck.
4
I was diagnosed as manglik. i was depressed for many years. I still am. Now i am married but i keep struggling with relationships, health or unemployment. i have poor selfesteem and sense of purpose and meaning in this life. I am not sure if this is my fate and if it can be changed. most rational people will scold me but what do they know. we tend to believe in what we know and what sounds rational. but we are not aware of so much knowledge out there. in any case most people are just trying to live out this life the best they can. i still have a part of me which believes in this occult, yet i am fearful of admitting it myself because it sounds irrational. perhaps the matters of faith cannot be discovered or scientifically proven.
7
That's why astrology is not good. Typically parents in Indian families get janampatri (birth horoscope) made as soon as baby is born. But what if the horoscope predicts not a very smooth life, problems, and other not so rosy things, then instead of living in the present and enjoying the present such knowledge only brings worries and stress. There are many famous people in the west who are manglik (unfavorable position of planet mars in the birth chart) and they don't even know about it, and yet they have lived a good life. So can you. In this nice piece the writer does tell the reader about the whole series of rigmarole she had to undergo to remove the affliction in her chart. In Indian/Vedic astrology there is remedy for every problem, and you should try to find for yours. But mostly you must remember the problems you are facing in your life are not because of your chart or because of being a manglik. You should work on your self-esteem and go to a doctor/psychiatrist for treatment of depression.
11
Whatever beliefs help a person feel good and be good are great, whether they are based on science or not! I personally trust my horoscope but when it tells good things, and also believe there is a heaven, but no hell. May you have a happy life, Amisha!
3
Wonderful! Helps me have more insights into Hindu culture and parents. Thank you and congratulations!!
10
Think of astrologers like counselors. Life is hard and uncertain. There are painful moments when people feel sad and helpless.
In US - people talk to counselors / rich ones go to rehab
In India - people talk to astrologers - who provide hope. The prescribed rituals of prayer, worship and fasting take peoples mind off their trouble and assure them that improvement is just around the corner.
Different ways to accomplish the same thing. Let us not use science and math to judge these things and get all uptight.
Even Nancy Reagan consulted astrologer when President Reagan was shot.
In US - people talk to counselors / rich ones go to rehab
In India - people talk to astrologers - who provide hope. The prescribed rituals of prayer, worship and fasting take peoples mind off their trouble and assure them that improvement is just around the corner.
Different ways to accomplish the same thing. Let us not use science and math to judge these things and get all uptight.
Even Nancy Reagan consulted astrologer when President Reagan was shot.
15
What you say is true to some extent, but in India many a times innocent/vulnerable people are taken for a ride by such so called astrologers. Even in America as someone mentioned in one of the comments there was a recent case in New York where a man from Britain was cheated out of more than half a million dollars by couple of women who pretended to be psychics/astrologer and preyed on his vulnerability.
5
Hilarious! But not really funny if you are the first born generation in the U.S. I can relate to Amisha being a Hindu and all. I had thought I came from a very integrated family thoroughly melted in the melting pot which our country is. We observed everything from Christmas to Thanksgiving, from Diwali to Dusshera. I was a Hindu among Christians, Jews, Muslims, Buddhists. Imagine my surprise, when my parents reacted in a way that I did not think would happen. I brought home my handsome Jewish boyfriend of three years from NYC. He asked my father for my hand (old fashioned!!) although he had asked me to marry him way earlier. I'll give my parents this much credit. There was no melodramatic meltdown, only civility and friendliness but I could notice there was no welcome either ( after all both my parents were accomplished professionals ). The drama came later. Hurried, urgent phone calls to India, my 'janampatri' (horoscope or is it horrorscope?) frantically brandished by my relatives in India, scouring the American and Indian landscape for a suitable 'boy' for their daughter! When I got wind of all this activity and all my protestations and arguments were in vain, my boyfriend and I quietly got married. Seems his parents were also not keen about the match up. But credit must be given where it's due. Three months into our marriage we were given an extravagant surprise reception by my parents and his. Life is a fairy tale now especially with our first born on the way.
50
I'm a very practical person, but oddly enough, after reading
this, I'd like to have my horoscope done!
this, I'd like to have my horoscope done!
20
Potentially one of the best experiences you'll ever have, dependent upon the astrologer!
6
One of my favorite essays in this space so far, thank you! Your parents often PASSIONATELY want the best for you-- even moreso than you do. Humoring them is sometimes a kind thing to do, and may even prove helpful.
16
Wonderful and hopeful story. Thank you for sharing. And the author's ability to summarize the reasons the engagement broke off in just one paragraph (mosty) was masterful. I sincerely hope that her new love brings joy to all. Best of fates to you!
12
Very interesting story, with a happy ending. Thanks for sharing it with us!
7
Lovely article and a wonderful way of showing how traditional practices and modern life intersect.
16
Really love this line "as I slid into love with him".
9
Me, too! It's a phraseology I've never heard/seen before, and it connotes sooooo many things. It's in my vocab now.
I have studied Vedic Astrology, and find it to be an excellent source of information. Since I have also studied at Oxford University, I am unafraid to voice my respect for this Ancient method of analysis, despite the tremendous intellectual taboo placed upon it here in the West. Yes, there are many for who it becomes a superstition, and that is unfortunate, but their misappropriation does not render the whole subject worthless. It amazes me that people have no problem recognizing that the Sun and Moon have impacts on Humans both emotionally and physically, but those same folks will scoff at the notion that some planets and stars have similar impacts. I am amazed, that is, until I remember that Humans have developed instruments that can measure these impacts, and here in the West, we need empirical evidence for everything. Just wait, Ms. Patel, as soon as we develop the technology to measure the impacts of Mars and Venus, this helpful Knowledge from Indian culture will be vindicated.
11
I think it's OK to use astrology or I Ching for added insights when things are murky, but not as the sole decision-maker. All this "black magic" stuff - too over the top for me. Common sense is at least as old as any other cultural tradition. Why don't we use that instead?
1
Amisha, many thanks for your touching story which I deeply appreciate. The Universe is an amazing place filled with wonder and mystery. It's not so much what we believe, but how we come to love. That you found love is most important. I am actually a Vedic Astrologer. One of the things I have learned from my practice is how vastly different each person is, with different beliefs, different paths and different opportunities. Those different components which flavour our lives are key to the overall experience that we each have. There is not one belief system appropriate for all. We are each different with a unique path to walk. Although astrology can be an amazing tool for prediction, especially the Vedic System, it is equally if not more amazing of a tool for self-understanding and self-improvement. I have done countless relationship compatibility sessions. I think key to the astrologer and therefore the client is that simply because compatibility may not match, it doesn't mean that the two individuals should not form a relationship with each other. We are all hear to learn and to hopefully grow as a result. There is something that we stand to benefit from in each experience. You had a broken relationship, but it led you to another. How absolutely wonderful to hear! Astrology is more scientific than people choose to see. I actually appreciate those people who are skeptical. Especially after they have experienced astrology! www.authenticastrology.com
8
Rahu a Ketu are not planets. They are mathematical points signifying the elliptical orbit of the Moon in its relationship with the Earth/Sun. In both Vedic and Tropical Astrology these "North and South Lunar Nodes" are very influential. When well-aspected, they confer good timing -- being appropriate to one's times. When in stressful aspect they confer power struggles, the best outcome of which is learning "when to hold'em, and when to fold'em." Astrology is a much better study after the fact -- when there's lots of life history to review. It does play with one's head when used for prediction. Astrology is a window into wisdom when used for wisdom. It is a self-defeating head-trip when used to gain advantage.
13
Astrology is a powerful, ancient science that has evolved with the times since it was first discovered thousands of years ago. Most "rational" people debunk it because they can't believe that planets can actually affect our destiny, but in fact the planets are merely representative of archetypal energies that govern reality in an orderly way. Believe it or not, you are not in charge, though you do have the freedom to express these energies in different ways. I discovered astrology when I found that my Ivy League education had its limits in explaining the workings of the cosmos to me, and I've never looked back. I'm glad to see the uber-rational Times publishing an article that gives credence to this venerable tradition.
8
I find it to be necessary to separate what I read (and enjoy) in these columns from any deep or serious examination. I am particularly pleased and relieved that the New York Times does not carry regular astrological columns and this essay reinforces that feeling. As has been pointed out many times in comments on other articles in other parts of the newspaper, modernity and reality are always the enemies of religion, and it doesn't really matter which religion. I hope Ms Patel finds happiness in life and when all else fails perhaps rationality might be tested.
5
If, as I believe to be true, we are working out in our lives things that started long before we were born, it makes sense to me that there are indications in advance of what these issues might be.
I've seen shamans use baskets of items in a slightly different way, in support of playing out for a deceased person part of their life that went unresolved -- kind of like a therapeutic memorial that somehow shifts something that needed to be shifted.
Trees are so wonderful in the way they connect between the sky and the earth, just as human beings I think can be conduits between sky and earth in their own way.
I enjoyed reading about this, not just for its own individual value, but also because it struck me as reflecting a piece of a much larger puzzle.
I've seen shamans use baskets of items in a slightly different way, in support of playing out for a deceased person part of their life that went unresolved -- kind of like a therapeutic memorial that somehow shifts something that needed to be shifted.
Trees are so wonderful in the way they connect between the sky and the earth, just as human beings I think can be conduits between sky and earth in their own way.
I enjoyed reading about this, not just for its own individual value, but also because it struck me as reflecting a piece of a much larger puzzle.
10
Oh, people, stop criticizing. People will believe what suits them best.....from religion to astrology. It's called freedom. Take all this for what it's worth.
Nowhere in this article did the author struggle to get you to believe - she was just telling a story. And stories are what All of our lives are about.
Chill! And be happy!
Nowhere in this article did the author struggle to get you to believe - she was just telling a story. And stories are what All of our lives are about.
Chill! And be happy!
36
Beautiful heartfelt report on your culture.
There is a lot to be said for many of the old beliefs.
Our fate, whether set by some force or other, in many ways is the result of our learned desire to observe our parents, and teachers, admonitions.
Life must be lived completely, to be truly fulfilling, something you are doing, thanks, in a large part, to those beautiful old beliefs.
There is a lot to be said for many of the old beliefs.
Our fate, whether set by some force or other, in many ways is the result of our learned desire to observe our parents, and teachers, admonitions.
Life must be lived completely, to be truly fulfilling, something you are doing, thanks, in a large part, to those beautiful old beliefs.
4
Interesting piece. There was a time when yoga was considered eastern fad with no basis in science. Some day we might prove that gravity of different planets and their positions impacts our thought process, heck if moon gravity can cause tides on earth then imagine what it does to you. Of course all this could be nonsense, but what a horrid way to live without the possibilities and mystery that astrology and palmistry brings.
5
Many years ago, an extremely eminent astrologer in India cast my horoscope for me. In response to my question, he told me that my mother would live to be 72. She used this as her basis for hope when she was diagnosed with a terminal illness at 56. She died at 57. Enough said.
Astrology can be entertaining (sort of, in the same way that Shakespearean tragedy can be entertaining). When it is a basis for avoiding individual responsibility, however, it can be pernicious, just as a Christian belief in predestination can be. If everything is indelibly written in the stars, or in some fate over which a deity presides, what's the use of doing anything?
Astrology can be entertaining (sort of, in the same way that Shakespearean tragedy can be entertaining). When it is a basis for avoiding individual responsibility, however, it can be pernicious, just as a Christian belief in predestination can be. If everything is indelibly written in the stars, or in some fate over which a deity presides, what's the use of doing anything?
4
Loved the cartoon
Essay was nice
Mindy project episode ?
What would be nice is a follow up to this
after time, marriage birth and deaths as it is easy to appear
open minded at this age.
Also do astrologers visit other astrologers for predictions. How do they conduct their life choices.
Essay was nice
Mindy project episode ?
What would be nice is a follow up to this
after time, marriage birth and deaths as it is easy to appear
open minded at this age.
Also do astrologers visit other astrologers for predictions. How do they conduct their life choices.
3
Horrorscope
Or happyscope
We pray
We calculate
Because to be alive
is to be condemned
to hope.
Or happyscope
We pray
We calculate
Because to be alive
is to be condemned
to hope.
8
and...... then what happened?
3
This family, and culture, showed a deep love and brilliance in helping someone let go of the, as she said "catatonic" grief of a perfect, but failed, relationship. The black basket ceremony at the end was a lovely nuanced metaphor for letting go, and not looking back. And I loved Ms. Ravishankar's comment above that the astrological prediction will help Ms Patel integrate her unconventional (I am assuming, for a Hindu family) matrimonial choice into her family. I wish to give Ms Patel my kindest hopes for future happiness, and to wish for her that she not be too upset by the judgments that love to come fast and thick in her birth culture.
11
I will throw the I Ching to decide how to read this article. Although. I already kinda know what the I Ching will say. Hmmm. Keeps me busy. Then there is an american take, John Prine, Dear Abby, http://youtu.be/b2ccC4aULow
5
This is a lovely story about the resiliency of the human heart. It doesn't matter if you believe in fate, horoscopes, karma or not. Sometimes in our darkest hours we just need something to pull us out and make us believe that things will get better.
13
Thank you for a wonderful essay, Amisha. As a Gujarati (though Jain) I relate deeply to your experience.
I wrote an essay after watching Slumdog Millionaire that speaks to this push and pull of will and destiny. I share it below because I hope it helps other readers and commenters to see how complicated these questions are for those of us who are hyphenated, Indian-Americans.
Here's an excerpt: " From the Western perspective, believing in fate appears a dangerous passivity, and a cruel, ‘you must have done something to deserve this’ karmic moralizing that cuts through the main artery of your will and bleeds you of your resolve. How many times and in how many voices has my mother repeated, reminded, scolded, consoled, chastised, revealed, and illustrated to me, in moments mundane and dramatic, ‘It is all written, beta (darling).’ Often with a glance to an open palm, guiding the eye to one of the physical locations of destiny. Destiny is not esoteric or vague. She is corporeal, precise, unique.
But the Indian will parry with the counterpoint - what is this infamous will? What calamities have befallen those who pound on the chest of willful ignorance, not seeing all around as maya - illusion? This grasping of the ego as real has led to folly upon folly, battle upon battle. For will and ego are brothers in arms, isolating you from the truth of the stars."
Link to full essay: http://www.hushsupperclub.com/slumdog-millionaire/
Cheers,
Geeta
www.hushsupperclub.com
I wrote an essay after watching Slumdog Millionaire that speaks to this push and pull of will and destiny. I share it below because I hope it helps other readers and commenters to see how complicated these questions are for those of us who are hyphenated, Indian-Americans.
Here's an excerpt: " From the Western perspective, believing in fate appears a dangerous passivity, and a cruel, ‘you must have done something to deserve this’ karmic moralizing that cuts through the main artery of your will and bleeds you of your resolve. How many times and in how many voices has my mother repeated, reminded, scolded, consoled, chastised, revealed, and illustrated to me, in moments mundane and dramatic, ‘It is all written, beta (darling).’ Often with a glance to an open palm, guiding the eye to one of the physical locations of destiny. Destiny is not esoteric or vague. She is corporeal, precise, unique.
But the Indian will parry with the counterpoint - what is this infamous will? What calamities have befallen those who pound on the chest of willful ignorance, not seeing all around as maya - illusion? This grasping of the ego as real has led to folly upon folly, battle upon battle. For will and ego are brothers in arms, isolating you from the truth of the stars."
Link to full essay: http://www.hushsupperclub.com/slumdog-millionaire/
Cheers,
Geeta
www.hushsupperclub.com
5
What's a social entrepreneur?
7
Perhaps when you choose to marry the Orthodox Jewish man three years younger than you, you completed your control of your faith by converting to Judaism?
3
I used to do this while a student at Bombay University so I could talk to girls. So, I told a few people that I read palms. Pretty soon, a few girls would open their palms; "tell me, how rich am I going to be?"
Here are the lines that worked well:
"I think there is something getting the way of you reaching full potential. There might be something going on in your family, that you may or may not know about."
Over time, I had a top 20 list. One of my favorite: "OF course you will be rich. There will be some hard work involved, but there are at least two points in your life, one about seven years from now, and one about 11 years, where things will become very easy. Money will flow in. Enemies will disappear."
Once when a particularly bitchy girl asked, who otherwise sneered at me because she had seen me work behind a counter at a shop, I told her that her first marriage would end in divorce because her husband would run away with her sister or cousin.
She had jerked her palm away and hissed off. Bet she thought about it for a while.
I later learned to ask a lot of questions, because the answers held a lot of clues into what they wanted to hear. It seemed like probability analysis, and prediction based on a rudimentary understanding of regression. India has documented predictive factors from 2000 years of history. It gets beyond the pale when remedies are suggested. Because that requires causal analysis - a wholly more complex calculation.
Kalidan
Here are the lines that worked well:
"I think there is something getting the way of you reaching full potential. There might be something going on in your family, that you may or may not know about."
Over time, I had a top 20 list. One of my favorite: "OF course you will be rich. There will be some hard work involved, but there are at least two points in your life, one about seven years from now, and one about 11 years, where things will become very easy. Money will flow in. Enemies will disappear."
Once when a particularly bitchy girl asked, who otherwise sneered at me because she had seen me work behind a counter at a shop, I told her that her first marriage would end in divorce because her husband would run away with her sister or cousin.
She had jerked her palm away and hissed off. Bet she thought about it for a while.
I later learned to ask a lot of questions, because the answers held a lot of clues into what they wanted to hear. It seemed like probability analysis, and prediction based on a rudimentary understanding of regression. India has documented predictive factors from 2000 years of history. It gets beyond the pale when remedies are suggested. Because that requires causal analysis - a wholly more complex calculation.
Kalidan
4
One of the great joys of life is not knowing how it will all pan out. Perhaps despite it, the best option is to simply do our best and be alive in the now.
7
ummm…. everyone,
you know this piece isn't really about astrology or the practice of it at all, right? it's just that the way we find love can be fitted into any model we wish it to.
fun read, reminds me of the hilarious movie, "Meet the Patels"
you know this piece isn't really about astrology or the practice of it at all, right? it's just that the way we find love can be fitted into any model we wish it to.
fun read, reminds me of the hilarious movie, "Meet the Patels"
24
Very curious, even a bit comical, that her mother alway new of a prediction that she would have a "broken reationship" at that time and that it wasn't a lack of love but suspicions of "black magic" by the feuding families that caused the brake. Sometimes predictions can be made to come true.
3
Very interesting piece and atypical for Modern Love. What the writer is describing is presented in a lighthearted and amusing style, but there's a depth to Vedic astrology that few people here in the U.S. can fathom. Historically astrology is interpreted as unscientific and quite possibly even taboo. Add to the fact that Linda Goodman, et al., have forever helped associate astrology with parlor game entertainment, it isn't surprising that so many comments expressed denounce her choice to follow Vedic wisdom.
9
After reading so many comments (pro and con) about the use of "Indian Astrologers" and how real Hindu families don't behave as Ms. Patel's family does, I want to emphasize that one possible way to look at this essay is that the love Ms. Patel is writing about is the love she shows her family by respecting (but not allowing to be controlled by) what her parents find comforting to provide for their children. My reaction to this essay was that it was about the love of family members for each other especially children and parents as children make journeys through the major milestones of life:education, careers, marriage. I think many families in many countries experience love in the same way as this family does through respect combined with adaptation.
46
“As above, so below.” After thousands of years, Astrology is still predicting the future. Why are so many so quick to doubt its veracity when this article clearly demonstrates its effectiveness? To their credit, Ms. Patel’s parents knew enough to contact a very skilled practitioner. All professions (including lawyers!) have their duds. Does this mean we doubt the profession itself? Absolutely not. Good luck Ms. Patel. I wish you future happiness and hope your marriage is a happy and enduring one.
8
My cousin had an arranged marriage and he met one girl he liked, but their horoscopes didn't match. Then he met another one and their horoscopes did match, and she turned out to be nuts and they got divorced. So you know, everything with a grain of salt.
19
Why is there so much backlash around this piece? I thought the story was lovely. Sometimes deep despair makes us grasp onto things outside of concrete reality, and so what? Isn't that better than drinking heavily and making destructive decisions? Holding out for hope that there was a bigger plan helped her recover from heartache and no one was hurt in the process, there was only healing.
98
What a fabulously interesting article!!!! Just love it!
3
This is a delightful story.. Enjoyed reading it. Thanks!
6
Linda Goodman's "Sun Signs" was a great read but I didn't reorient my life because of it.
1
Shakespeare got it right:
GLOUCESTER
These late eclipses in the sun and moon portend
no good to us: though the wisdom of nature can
reason it thus and thus, yet nature finds itself
scourged by the sequent effects: love cools,
friendship falls off, brothers divide: in
cities, mutinies; in countries, discord; in
palaces, treason; and the bond cracked 'twixt son
and father...
EDMUND
This is the excellent foppery of the world, that,
when we are sick in fortune,--often the surfeit
of our own behavior,--we make guilty of our
disasters the sun, the moon, and the stars: as
if we were villains by necessity; fools by
heavenly compulsion; knaves, thieves, and
treachers, by spherical predominance; drunkards,
liars, and adulterers, by an enforced obedience of
planetary influence; and all that we are evil in,
by a divine thrusting on: an admirable evasion
of whoremaster man, to lay his goatish
disposition to the charge of a star!
King Lear, Act I, Scene II
GLOUCESTER
These late eclipses in the sun and moon portend
no good to us: though the wisdom of nature can
reason it thus and thus, yet nature finds itself
scourged by the sequent effects: love cools,
friendship falls off, brothers divide: in
cities, mutinies; in countries, discord; in
palaces, treason; and the bond cracked 'twixt son
and father...
EDMUND
This is the excellent foppery of the world, that,
when we are sick in fortune,--often the surfeit
of our own behavior,--we make guilty of our
disasters the sun, the moon, and the stars: as
if we were villains by necessity; fools by
heavenly compulsion; knaves, thieves, and
treachers, by spherical predominance; drunkards,
liars, and adulterers, by an enforced obedience of
planetary influence; and all that we are evil in,
by a divine thrusting on: an admirable evasion
of whoremaster man, to lay his goatish
disposition to the charge of a star!
King Lear, Act I, Scene II
4
Thank you. (Shakespeare pretty much always gets it right).
1
Come on, she has to be kidding. Her next prospect is an orthodox Jew, three years younger? I don't think so.
7
This was a fun read. I loved the way she ended it. unless you read it with a open mind and understand the pun intended in 3rd last paragraph, knowing that her parents are typical Gujrati Parents from NJ.
Those who think she is advocating astrology, they really did not get it. She is not. She is just using it to get what she wants. And my guess is, her parents are not going to be thrilled she found a non-Hindu-Desi to fall in love with. and my guess is, she is going to use astrology to justify it....Brilliant...
Those who think she is advocating astrology, they really did not get it. She is not. She is just using it to get what she wants. And my guess is, her parents are not going to be thrilled she found a non-Hindu-Desi to fall in love with. and my guess is, she is going to use astrology to justify it....Brilliant...
35
I really wish the Modern Love will pick my story which I sent numerous times. It is not about horoscopes but has some serious significant cultural overtones...much more relate-table.
About the horoscope and predictability. It is like dreams. You really have to be just conscious and intuitive about life. You have to be extremely self aware to know what is in your future and direct it the way you want with your thoughts.
However, for all the non-believers, I will leave you with this. The universe we live in is in order and follows a logical order day in and day out. Chaos is rare (it happens but it is rare)...so if gravity and the universe have an order and direction, why is it hard to believe that we, mere little mortals, are also on a path that has been ordered at the beginning of our time just like the universe was put to motion at big bang moment?
It is absurd to believe one has 100% control over one's life too...I am not advocating horoscopes at all but this author put certain intentions and thoughts into motion and that is why she got out of the fog of her break up. She took action (whether ordered from horoscope or not does not matter) and found way out of her predicament.
About the horoscope and predictability. It is like dreams. You really have to be just conscious and intuitive about life. You have to be extremely self aware to know what is in your future and direct it the way you want with your thoughts.
However, for all the non-believers, I will leave you with this. The universe we live in is in order and follows a logical order day in and day out. Chaos is rare (it happens but it is rare)...so if gravity and the universe have an order and direction, why is it hard to believe that we, mere little mortals, are also on a path that has been ordered at the beginning of our time just like the universe was put to motion at big bang moment?
It is absurd to believe one has 100% control over one's life too...I am not advocating horoscopes at all but this author put certain intentions and thoughts into motion and that is why she got out of the fog of her break up. She took action (whether ordered from horoscope or not does not matter) and found way out of her predicament.
5
"luckily my parents always have some [Ganges water] in the refrigerator"
as one does.
as one does.
1
The author charmingly describes how a series of soothing rituals drew her focus away from her pain towards her future. In doing so, she gently and knowingly puts her finger on exactly what makes astrology tick.
A wonderfully layered essay.
A wonderfully layered essay.
11
i surely wouldn't want this woman as my lawyer.
5
I have read a few essays in this column and I find this the most interesting so far, not only from the openness of the writer in sharing a cultural practice/belief but also her entertaining and delightful story-telling style. Of course, the topic may not be a cup of tea to those imbued with "rational minds" --- the non-believers of fate but it's still a story worth-sharing in this "love" section. What I find very surprising among the comments though is that many of the negative ones are coming from readers with Asian Indian names. Why?
Anyway, Atty Patel, your story deserves a Bollywood ending. I am looking forward to a follow-up essay on the outcome of your latest romance. He may truly turn out to be your sanjog (? Spelling) or your kismet! Not to mention your positive karma.
Anyway, Atty Patel, your story deserves a Bollywood ending. I am looking forward to a follow-up essay on the outcome of your latest romance. He may truly turn out to be your sanjog (? Spelling) or your kismet! Not to mention your positive karma.
5
Do the astrologers ever say that if you never marry, you can still be happy as a lark? Cute story, though.
2
I have had experiences where someone who had said she was psychic said something which made no sense unless she did have psychic powers.
For instance she referred to my daughter by her middle name, even though she had been introduced by her first name and hardly anyone knew the middle name.
Westerners to whom I told this story came up with implausible explanations. E.g. that she must have looked up the middle name in the phone book. But my daughter did not HAVE a phone and phone books don't usually list middle names.
Indians to whom I told the same story were quite willing to give it credence and even tell similar stories of their own. E.g. when my mother fell down when getting on a train, her half sister sitting 300 miles away told people that my mother had fallen down from the train and they should do something.
Chance? Maybe. But as a person who has written several papers on probability, and on conditionals, I feel that many do not believe in miracles because they idea that there MIGHT be miracles is a bit scary.
As Hamlet said,
To die, to sleep--
To sleep--perchance to dream: ay, there's the rub,
For in that sleep of death what dreams may come
When we have shuffled off this mortal coil,
Must give us pause.
The idea that death ends all and there are no nightmares after death must be comforting to atheists just as the thought, "Jesus will save me" is comforting to Christians.
"The undiscovered country, from whose bourn no traveller returns,"
is scary!
For instance she referred to my daughter by her middle name, even though she had been introduced by her first name and hardly anyone knew the middle name.
Westerners to whom I told this story came up with implausible explanations. E.g. that she must have looked up the middle name in the phone book. But my daughter did not HAVE a phone and phone books don't usually list middle names.
Indians to whom I told the same story were quite willing to give it credence and even tell similar stories of their own. E.g. when my mother fell down when getting on a train, her half sister sitting 300 miles away told people that my mother had fallen down from the train and they should do something.
Chance? Maybe. But as a person who has written several papers on probability, and on conditionals, I feel that many do not believe in miracles because they idea that there MIGHT be miracles is a bit scary.
As Hamlet said,
To die, to sleep--
To sleep--perchance to dream: ay, there's the rub,
For in that sleep of death what dreams may come
When we have shuffled off this mortal coil,
Must give us pause.
The idea that death ends all and there are no nightmares after death must be comforting to atheists just as the thought, "Jesus will save me" is comforting to Christians.
"The undiscovered country, from whose bourn no traveller returns,"
is scary!
3
I believe the only thing that is certain is that we do not know everything. I am sure there are more forces at work in the universe than we understand and know how to measure. I love the blend of rational thought, belief, tradition and love in this story.
27
We are a very strange species. We have evolved enormous and powerful brains which allow us to analyze and think rationally and yet we persist in imprisoning ourselves with religious superstitions designed to control, manipulate, coerce. A very strange species indeed.
4
Those rational, analytic brains are not the heart, though. When has love ever been rational? When has friendship been rational, even? What you call religious superstitions are just someone else's way of making sense of all that our brains cannot do. Whatever works.
3
Einstein said that there are two things that are infinite. The Uniiverse and the Stupidity of people and that he was not sure about the Universe. This story once again proves the professor correct.
6
“It's tough to make predictions, especially about the future.”
― Yogi Berra
― Yogi Berra
108
A very similar thing happened with me. There was no lack of love but the comedy of errors including the 'black magic' thing. I once read, Reham Khan, Imran' Khan's wife accusing Black Magic for her divorce and I felt, "oh ! It could be used for better reasons than divorce'.
I love my husband to an unimaginable extent. I have agreed to each of his demands and forgiven him for things which were really very hurtful for me. But, these things actually drove him to mistrust my family. That day, I became joined the school of Karma instead of Religion.
But the errors had already played their role. The mistrust moved from family to me and he became unforgiving to me as well. It was really painful and embarrassing to beg your husband to trust you/family and forgive you/family almost all the time.
I love my husband to an unimaginable extent. I have agreed to each of his demands and forgiven him for things which were really very hurtful for me. But, these things actually drove him to mistrust my family. That day, I became joined the school of Karma instead of Religion.
But the errors had already played their role. The mistrust moved from family to me and he became unforgiving to me as well. It was really painful and embarrassing to beg your husband to trust you/family and forgive you/family almost all the time.
3
That's a good story and such a story is part of every Indian's life. Actually, whatever we cannot explain by our theories of modern science, we undoubtedly call it blackmagic. Whatever happens in Hinduism (which is basically culture not religion as West defines it), most of them doesn't make sense. An important reason behind it is that because there was a culture of inheritance of knowledge orally plus rampant Brahminsim ( where a dedicate intellectual conducts the rituals for you), throughout generations we have lacked the urge to pursue or understand a reason behind a ritual. Hence today whatever sounds reasonable we call it religion else is dogmatic irrational behaviour. Example: Hindus since thousands of years apply 'tilak' - a red/organge mark on the forehead, reason? we don't know it exactly, but now research talks about stimulation of pituitory gland associated with Hindu ritual of applying Tilak.
Yet I advocate reason and a quest for reason even in rituals in place of outrightly condemning and mocking attributes of an ancient lifestyle, because there must be some reason behind such a rich and vibrant culture and civilizations.
Yet I advocate reason and a quest for reason even in rituals in place of outrightly condemning and mocking attributes of an ancient lifestyle, because there must be some reason behind such a rich and vibrant culture and civilizations.
2
If only there were more people like you in Mr. Modi's party.
A telling weakness of this whole woo-woo voodoo is her dad's comment that some astrologers are better than others at predicting. What? In a determined fatalistic world, things move on despite incantations and rituals that people go through, because if things didn't work that way, it wouldn't be fate, predetermined by the planets (real and imagined).
To have uncertainty rule our lives and lack of critical thinking skills or just being plain skeptical in a good way, separates people from their money and worse leads them down trails that are dangerous (e.g. astrologers in the Reagan White House).
I'm not sure if the author's last few sentences were meant to be tongue in cheek or not, but certainly true believers will grasp to her words as carrying proof of their beliefs and have them chart even more.
Sadly she did not debunk her experience as an example for all to see the shallowness of this whole practice.
To have uncertainty rule our lives and lack of critical thinking skills or just being plain skeptical in a good way, separates people from their money and worse leads them down trails that are dangerous (e.g. astrologers in the Reagan White House).
I'm not sure if the author's last few sentences were meant to be tongue in cheek or not, but certainly true believers will grasp to her words as carrying proof of their beliefs and have them chart even more.
Sadly she did not debunk her experience as an example for all to see the shallowness of this whole practice.
14
Sometimes it is easier to keep the peace and not alienate your family.
It is a charming story, why is everyone so upset? Good luck with the new amour - just make sure you pick an auspicious date for the wedding ceremony.
P.S. My father was an astrologer...
P.S. My father was an astrologer...
44
Raised in the same culture. only. where I come from, Tamil Nadu, there are also prayers one can recite to mitigate the effects of unfavorable planetary configuration in one's horoscope. Google "Kolaru Padigam". No need for a priest/astrologer. For every genuine, talented (or visionary/intuitive) astrologer, there are 9999 quacks. Don't seek that kind of help. The classic tale is a of a 20 something guy goes to an astrologer seeking help and is told "you will be miserable until you are thirty". Encouraged, the guy asks," will things better then?" The astrologer responds "No, you will just get used to it". The idea is to look at the situation in a different way in order to find a resolution.
9
I don't wish to be unkind; I really don't. I know we all try to find ways to understand the uncontrollable, careening ride life Subjects us to. Most of the time it seems there's no one at the wheel.
So I won't judge the ways Ms. Patel attempts to bring order and meaning to the unexplainable. I don't know if her story is tongue in cheek, or if the beliefs she describes are deeply held. If they bring her some manner of comfort, I'm not going to point my finger and say she's wrong.
I could use some comfort myself, and there's precious little to be found.
So I won't judge the ways Ms. Patel attempts to bring order and meaning to the unexplainable. I don't know if her story is tongue in cheek, or if the beliefs she describes are deeply held. If they bring her some manner of comfort, I'm not going to point my finger and say she's wrong.
I could use some comfort myself, and there's precious little to be found.
7
Go and find yourself some expensive and rare moonstone and some cheap trinkets to throw in a basket which you should abandon atop a tree without looking back at it.
Alternatively, some moonshine.
Alternatively, some moonshine.
2
Re. your broken engagement, as usual, overbearing families make life miserable for 2 people who should be able to live peacefully, respectfully and kindly. I wish you well with your Orthodox Jewish man. Hopefully, your respective families will keep their noses out of your business. As you remind us, families can be incredibly supportive or not. Once the damage is done, it is done.
Good luck to you and your partner/husband.
Good luck to you and your partner/husband.
39
i do not know whether to pity or to laugh at those who gamble and those who believe astrology. a fool and her money are soon parted.
maybe even i am foolish for having clicked on this article.
maybe even i am foolish for having clicked on this article.
14
I don't gamble because I find that my winnings are consistently LESS than probability would tell me. I concluded that God (or fate) does not want me to gamble and I took the message to heart (smile).
By contrast I had an Afghan friend whose tendency was to win at the slot machine at the beginning but then continue and gamble his winnings away. My job was to pull him away from the machine when I felt he had won enough.
He was a peaceful man, or trusting, and allowed me to pull him away when I said, "OK, you have won enough, now stop."
By contrast I had an Afghan friend whose tendency was to win at the slot machine at the beginning but then continue and gamble his winnings away. My job was to pull him away from the machine when I felt he had won enough.
He was a peaceful man, or trusting, and allowed me to pull him away when I said, "OK, you have won enough, now stop."
1
Out of the hundreds of submissions each week I don't know why this essay was printed. Perhaps it was fated in the stars...
63
It is what we believe in which makes us. Astrology posed as a possible support for a breaking life. We all need to find meaning in life and astrology gave hope in terms of stones and "fixed destiny". After all, we all like to know what the plans are, before acting upon it.
Whatever floats one's boat; but doesn't deflate others'.
Whatever floats one's boat; but doesn't deflate others'.
5
Im sorry but this is highly stupid article from an educated lawyer n interestingly on here the word lawyer contradicts with your article itself
13
I suspect that this story embarrasses you, as a fellow Indian. None of us likes our cultural/religious foibles shown to outsiders.
1
Years ago I had a lovely Asian dentist, she was young and we chitchatted after I asked what her sunsign was. I ask everyone I meet as a matter of course, I am an astrology analyst, and enjoy knowing something about those I deal with even at the general level. There is a lot involved in astrology, but some generalities can be gained by knowing a person's sunsign. She told me she had two birth dates. Her original date was on a day that was inauspicious, according to the family astrologer (the Han Chinese use astrologers probably as much as East Indians do). In conjunction with the family astrologer they picked a later date for her, a second birth date. The dentist gave me both birthdays, and I learned something about her culture. It makes sense to me, some times are deeply difficult for any number of reasons, and knowing when those times are in the present, future (or past) tells us a great deal about what is possible, trends, harmonies or disharmonies, individually and even collectively as a nation, country etc. A wise man rules his stars, but it takes years to learn the fundamentals, like the stock market and fishing for fish, if you know what the trends are and have been or are going to be, one is in a better position to let us say, negotiate with the future as it unfolds, and avoid many difficulties. I admire the Asian people and the East Indian people their ancient traditions, so very different than the ones we have here in the USA. I enjoy this fascinating article.Thanks!
4
This is why David Hume "On Miracles" should be required reading. And why atheists never understand the psychological power of ritual.
2
David Hume was also a racist and believed that there are no moral laws.
He also said that there is no such thing as causality.
I admire him, but just because he said something does not mean it is true.
He also said that there is no such thing as causality.
I admire him, but just because he said something does not mean it is true.
8
"Atheists never ..." Well, blimey, another absolutist! We atheists left that behind decades ago. (All of us.)
By the way, I think Aruna must be mistaken about Hume. I don't know his work enough to say, but it's not consistent with what I've read about his generous personality [I hope I remember correctly] that he should disbelieve in morality.
By the way, I think Aruna must be mistaken about Hume. I don't know his work enough to say, but it's not consistent with what I've read about his generous personality [I hope I remember correctly] that he should disbelieve in morality.
1
Punditji, of what David Hume and miracles you are reading? As Aruna correctly says the bugger was a racist. He was also an empiricist, who in "Of (sic) miracles" debunks miracles and religious beliefs in them. As they say in Paris, voilà!
Any trained attorney that harbors these kinds of medieval beliefs should have themselves checked out for split personality disorders.
12
Einstein famously said that God does not play dice. He also said that there is no such thing as action at a distance (something which Newton had said before him).
Recent experiments proved them both wrong.
Of course the fact that Einstein was wrong does not justify astrology. But it is true that many of us still believe in the 19th century clockwork universe. With Quantum mechanics and Relativity, the clockwork universe is dead, except in our minds.
The Physics which we believe in is innate in babies and to a large extent in animals. But it isn't how the world is. That baby Physics only applies to medium size objects moving at small speeds.
Recent experiments proved them both wrong.
Of course the fact that Einstein was wrong does not justify astrology. But it is true that many of us still believe in the 19th century clockwork universe. With Quantum mechanics and Relativity, the clockwork universe is dead, except in our minds.
The Physics which we believe in is innate in babies and to a large extent in animals. But it isn't how the world is. That baby Physics only applies to medium size objects moving at small speeds.
3
Mothers, dogs and chocolate bars all obey the baby Physics. But electrons and photons don't and neither do massive objects like black holes.
beautiful story
thank you
thank you
7
According to my venerable Hindu astrologer, I will never have success until I change my name. Such a conundrum.
7
Well, CL is rather odd as a name.
These comments are clearly divided along cultural lines. People of obviously Indian origin have a "what nonsense, this is 2015, stop letting these con-men take you for a ride" attitude, while folks of western origins are responding with a "who can tell, best to stay open to possibilities, what a lovely peak into Hindu culture"! While astrology continues to be common in India, among the younger generation, fewer people are using it, when they need guidance.
9
Our destiny is written and will not be changed. However, we have been given the power to reason and we can choose, between good and evil deeds.
4
It's puzzling that anyone can claim to know anything about anything. Who dares to say something is or isn't true. Once I saw a woman I work with identify in one try, and in uninterrupted succession, eight of her coworkers' (our coworkers') sun signs. That's a one in 429 million probability (I think), which is less than of your chance than winning the lottery. It convinced me that there's something to it all and that it's WAY more complex than to be understandable by me.
30
I actually did something similar with members of a board I served on. Got one person wrong - thought this guy was a Cancer when he was actually a Leo, but I suspect he has a lot of Cancer in his chart. It's really not that hard to do with people you spend a lot of time with, if you're attuned to the basic sun sign characteristics.
3
I've seen a few unexplainable things in my life, but I do believe that your destiny can only include what you're open to.
In that your horoscope was a healing process that opened you to new possibilities... it worked like a charm. And I think that's your message, isn't it?
In that your horoscope was a healing process that opened you to new possibilities... it worked like a charm. And I think that's your message, isn't it?
8
Still believe like signs belong with each other....
1
No, you're wrong. It's complementary signs that go together. I read it on the paper place mat at the Chinese restaurant. Who you gonna believe, me or ...?
2
Charming essay....
I have had enough truly specific coincidences to wonder. Like you, I value rational thought but some of the "things that have happened to me" are so unbelievably on point, specific, that one cannot help but wonder what else it at play.
It with that perspective, that I say, I am not sure about horoscopes per se, but I do wonder if the possibility exists that we somehow have left ourselves "easter eggs of sorts" ahead of our lives. Oh yes, I know that sounds nuts, but how else to explain certain mysteries?
Collective eye roll aside, let me say this, why not believe?
I have had enough truly specific coincidences to wonder. Like you, I value rational thought but some of the "things that have happened to me" are so unbelievably on point, specific, that one cannot help but wonder what else it at play.
It with that perspective, that I say, I am not sure about horoscopes per se, but I do wonder if the possibility exists that we somehow have left ourselves "easter eggs of sorts" ahead of our lives. Oh yes, I know that sounds nuts, but how else to explain certain mysteries?
Collective eye roll aside, let me say this, why not believe?
22
Why not believe? Well, unlike you who realizes that astrology doesn't work or at least you imply it, there will be some who actually believe that strongly enough to ignore much more concrete guidance with career choices, friendships, and even marriage choices.
Just as some enjoy going to a movie or reading a well written novel to suspend rational disbelief and enjoy it, if you want to read your horoscope or have a psychic reading once in awhile for entertainment purposes and have the money to do so, well go ahead. But when you slip over the line to actually using that information, pulled out of a hat, then the danger does exist.
Oh, in college one of the floor mates in my dorm was employed by the little newspaper back home, and rather than buy syndicated horoscopes to publish in the entertainment section he and another intern went to coffee and made up each day's horoscope in a half hour or less.
The editor frequently got letters of praise from the readers on how wonderful and accurate their horoscope provider was and to never let them go off staff. Goes to show, for me at least.
Just as some enjoy going to a movie or reading a well written novel to suspend rational disbelief and enjoy it, if you want to read your horoscope or have a psychic reading once in awhile for entertainment purposes and have the money to do so, well go ahead. But when you slip over the line to actually using that information, pulled out of a hat, then the danger does exist.
Oh, in college one of the floor mates in my dorm was employed by the little newspaper back home, and rather than buy syndicated horoscopes to publish in the entertainment section he and another intern went to coffee and made up each day's horoscope in a half hour or less.
The editor frequently got letters of praise from the readers on how wonderful and accurate their horoscope provider was and to never let them go off staff. Goes to show, for me at least.
8
I love this idea of leaving ourselves "easter eggs." I know that as a writer I often write in things that seem incidental at the time and then by the end of the story are the key to the whole thing. Some part of my mind seems to have already known the whole story--but it took weeks for the rest of my brain to catch on.
Maybe that floor mate who wrote horoscopes for the newspaper had some psychic ability that he or she was too cynical to acknowledge. One never knows.
Let's hear it for improbable matches!
34
It has always puzzled me of why women, and not men are attracted to astrologers. One example of that is horoscopes that you find in most women's magazines, but none in men's magazines. I once had a spouse that had a 'reader', which I understand had a lot to do with are getting married. The marriage was quite unsuccessfully. Our 'stars' never aligned, but I was never told. Do I believe that there is a 'plan' for me? Of course, but only that it can not be 'divined' by a human being, since it was created by The Creator. The 'plan' is solely under my control, given I have free will to enact it, or not. Some say this a proof of a 'black hole', my black hole, only to be revealed as my life unfolds.
I saw that more men than women are attracted to astrology in India, but my sample size is not scientific.
2
Take a look at the recent Times article where a man gave a fortune teller hundreds of thousands of dollars, and then tell us again that women are more gullible than men.
13
How glad I am that people from so many countries and so many cultures are willing to be part of the country my family choose as well. This essay revealed--at least to me--interesting, previously unknown aspects of being a Hindu family in the US. While I did know about the readings taken at birth, I was unaware that comprehensive readings from different astrologers were taken throughout ones' life. That Ms. Patel's mother hid some passages from her until she needed to hear them seemed such protective maternal gesture of love.
I really enjoyed Ms. Patel telling how she and her siblings would go through their parents' luggage to look for "new clothing or things from the bazaar" and then gather in the kitchen to hear new predictions translated by their mother. Reading those sentences was a reminder to me how immigrant families in my own heritage would hear letters and newspapers translated when needed from other languages by our grandparents. So many common things families do that make us families no matter which countries our ancestors call home.
Thank you for another wonderful essay in the Modern Love series.
I really enjoyed Ms. Patel telling how she and her siblings would go through their parents' luggage to look for "new clothing or things from the bazaar" and then gather in the kitchen to hear new predictions translated by their mother. Reading those sentences was a reminder to me how immigrant families in my own heritage would hear letters and newspapers translated when needed from other languages by our grandparents. So many common things families do that make us families no matter which countries our ancestors call home.
Thank you for another wonderful essay in the Modern Love series.
54
One Hindu family in USA can be entirely different from another. This is not at all representative of how Hindu people live. I was brought up with Hindu beliefs and I often say "if there are 10 Hindus in a room, there will be 11 opinions on how to live your life".
For what it is worth, at my birth an astrologer predicted that I will move to a foreign country (check), have two major accidents (check), travel the world (check), become an engineer (check) and not marry a woman (I am gay). But he also predicted that I will find the love of my life when I turn 33 (nope - still single), and be super rich by 34 (lol - lets say I am rich at heart, and I have 10 more months to prove him right). Coincidence or astrology ?
For what it is worth, at my birth an astrologer predicted that I will move to a foreign country (check), have two major accidents (check), travel the world (check), become an engineer (check) and not marry a woman (I am gay). But he also predicted that I will find the love of my life when I turn 33 (nope - still single), and be super rich by 34 (lol - lets say I am rich at heart, and I have 10 more months to prove him right). Coincidence or astrology ?
11
Please don't make the mistake of thinking this article is representative of Hindu families in the US. Most of us have never had our readings taken and refuse to spend money on fraudulent astrologers.
13
".....that I will find the love of my life when I turn 33 (nope - still single)......" You never know, tomorrow may be the day. On ne sait jamais, as they say it in French.
3
When I saw the headline, a thought came to my head that I am going to see someone slapped the superstition away. And after reading the article, I felt that that slap was for me and I am so shocked. Although I am not inclined to argue much on such issues, like predetermined fate, horoscope, astrology, black magic and this kind of things, but this article seems to me a purely enchanting and witty advertisement for the business that takes advantage of human' sufferings, create fear, plays with them, and makes money.
51
A moonstone (very expensive one) fetches you a Jewish man.....You better protect this relationship. Otherwise your Jewish man is going to accuse you of moonstone based black magic.
2
Your moonstone has adularescence, "a bluish billowing glow from within" ( from the GIA texts ).....Sometimes the gem and it's properties match it's purpose in your life
2
Wouldn't it have been better for your parents to have been supportive when you were engaged and in love? Wanting to be supportive after the fact and ascribing to a pseudoscience that defies logic may have made them (and you) feel better later but it doesn't take away from the fact that they contributed to two years of what must have been hell. I'm sure that one astrologer out of a series who had predicted that you'd have a "broken relationship" made them feel like your breakup was less the consequences of their actions (and yours) and let them accept less responsibility.
We live in the year 2015. It's time to let the accusations of "black magic" rest and try to support your kid's happiness because love doesn't come around every day.
We live in the year 2015. It's time to let the accusations of "black magic" rest and try to support your kid's happiness because love doesn't come around every day.
68
Hi Priya - My parents were supportive when I was engaged and have been supportive of all of my choices, from leaving my lucrative career as a corporate lawyer to dating a younger Jewish man. My parents' role in the end of my engagement was minimal and had to do with typical wedding planning issues. My fiance's parents are another story. In the aftermath, my mother was heartbroken for me and wanted to find a way to help. She did it the way she knew how. My parents also felt guilty or somehow responsible for not having done a pooja the astrologers had told them to do when I was a kid. I think the ritual helped all of us heal.
44
Hi Priya - My parents were supportive when I was engaged and have been supportive of all of my choices, from leaving my lucrative career as a corporate lawyer to dating a younger Jewish man. My parents' role in the end of my engagement was minimal and had to do with typical wedding planning issues. My fiance's parents are another story. In the aftermath, my mother was heartbroken for me and wanted to find a way to help. She did it the way she knew how. My parents also felt guilty or somehow responsible for not having done a pooja the astrologers had told them to do when I was a kid. I think the ritual helped all of us heal.
1
It seems like you're close to your family. I'm inspired (and feel a little guilty about myself) at how you've been able to embrace your parents culture while growing up in New Jersey and now having a career that probably only existed in this decade (not exactly sure what a social entrepreneur is). Or was there some angst and conflict that you felt at times? I would be interested in reading your take on the mixing of cultures with your new, Orthodox Jewish partner--next essay perhaps?!
omg. such superstitions and rubbish to lead our lives by.
61
"The lady doth protest too much, methinks!"
Very cute. And a total misrepresentation of how this all works. A "Hindu" (whatever that is) does not believe in "fate" (whatever that is). It's karma (destiny) that we accept, assuming that we fulfill our dharma (duty). Karma is created by our actions, and the actions of others—it's an outcome, not a prediction. Fate is for "believers," which Hindus are decidedly not.
38
Totall Agree. Bravo!
1
An amazing story. The world is a mysterious place, and love is even more puzzling. Who knows what forces affect us? Best wishes for happiness in your new relationship.
48
I came out to my very traditional parents some years ago. Desolate, my father consulted an astrologist who changed my lunar birthday (not sure how) and gave me deity trinket to keep by my bed (sure, I'll play along) to put me back "on the right path".
I'll let him know when I yearn for the touch of a woman (wouldn't hold my breath).
I'll let him know when I yearn for the touch of a woman (wouldn't hold my breath).
60
There's no reason to believe that one's future can or cannot be predicted. So who knows? Some of these astrologers may have gotten some things right. After all, we are able to predict the weather and get it right sometimes. And the only argument skeptics have against things like these is that it sounds preposterous. Well, one's inability to accept something has nothing to do with whether that thing is legitimate.
What is funny, is that you think all these predictions apply to you. There is a body in this world and it goes through some experiences and then dies. The mistake lies in your believing that you are this body and then associating yourself with everything it experiences.
Nothing you can point at can be you, obviously, because you are pointing at it. This goes for your body, your mind, your identity and everything outside. So, who are you then?
Find the answer to that and all this running around trying to figure out why things are happening and then worrying about them will completely stop.
What is funny, is that you think all these predictions apply to you. There is a body in this world and it goes through some experiences and then dies. The mistake lies in your believing that you are this body and then associating yourself with everything it experiences.
Nothing you can point at can be you, obviously, because you are pointing at it. This goes for your body, your mind, your identity and everything outside. So, who are you then?
Find the answer to that and all this running around trying to figure out why things are happening and then worrying about them will completely stop.
1
Ms Patel is doing a great disservice to not only herself but others who are hoodwinked by the astrologers. She is reporting an extremely credulous account that is at deep odds with her training as a lawyer.
I wish children of immigrants were not this gullible and willing to provide testimonials to charlatans from their "home" country.
I wish children of immigrants were not this gullible and willing to provide testimonials to charlatans from their "home" country.
86
How American of you to make judgments and assumptions about matters you appear to have limited knowledge of, at best. While many people are hoodwinked every day - though in this country by the prevailing naive ideology of mechanistic science - many people around the world from virtually all cultures rely on divination techniques that often have been used sine ancient times. I am a 64 year old lawyer and have found many transformative insights through the analysis of my dreams, through astrological readings and the iChing. Modern astrology and other divination techniques rarely make concrete predictions - there is much that can affect our "destiny," including having some knowledge of your fate that might help you work with and accept those many things in life our conscious will cannot know or control. C.G. Jung has written extensively on this subject - as well as many acclaimed scientists and physicists
31
Could this be reaction formation on your part, Mr/Ms Kumar?
Hi Neel - I did not intend for my essay to endorse astrologers or charlatans at all. And I am far from an unsophisticated, gullible "victim" however I have always envied those with either deep religious faith or frankly, even those superstitious sports fans who can self-soothe themselves when faced with the uncertainty inherent in all of our lives. I do believe that there are certain things that defy logic -- and we don't have to look to the farfetched. For me, my logic couldn't explain my emotions. And I needed to find a way around my belief system to move forward from my broken heart.
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I’m old enough (64) to feel I’ll never fully understand the strangeness of this thing called life, so who can tell? We like to think it can all be controlled through will, but as I look back, so many of the richest and most wonderful moments came from what seemed to be happenstance. One just must remain open enough to recognize and receive them.
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Interesting story. I must have some downright evil planets.
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No, I am sure you haven't those downright evil planets, instead, be blessed by God. :)
Beautiful story, and a beautiful peek into Hindu culture. Thank you for sharing.
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Hinduism is a religion - not a culture. Hinduism does not advocate astrology. That is a figment of Indian culture. What she described is Indian culture.
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Sridhar,
and yet you have others on this thread say Hinduism is not a religion but rather that it is indeed a culture. What gives? Who is right? Can both be right?
and yet you have others on this thread say Hinduism is not a religion but rather that it is indeed a culture. What gives? Who is right? Can both be right?
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yes we can both be right - because that is how Hinduism is - it does not stipulates any particular way - cause everything is predetermined by your karma - you may do what you want - and Hinduism accepts everyone and everything. We have thousands of Gods and I am sure one of them will say culture while another might say religion. Everything goes!
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Children of and raised by immigrants--I am one--know all too well that our parents and relatives arrive in this country not as clean or fresh slates, but rather as humans colorfully marked by familial traditions, culture-specific superstitions, ethnic tongues, and unique religious practices, among so many other markings. However illogical, I find that some of the most beautiful occurrences in my life--my grandmother, in the ICU, beating an illness when doctors had given her just 48 hrs to live; my boyfriend surviving a horrific motorcycle accident; falling in love with that man, in the first place--are not at all reasonably explainable and sometimes feel more like the outcomes of prayers to appropriate Saints; shutting close an open drawer; eating grapes on New Years; and taking a shower after having received from a stranger the "dirty eye."
It's less about the true effectiveness of superstitious, religious, and/or ethnic rituals and more about the irony faced by first-generation children who balance our American-taught values and education--for which many times our parents, on our behalf, moved here--and the traditions that our parents carry across oceans and over man-made borders to share with us in a new and different home with its own sometimes contradictory ideals.