Outlaw the infield shift so that yu have two players on both sides of 2nd base
Wow! Actual scientific evidence and proof that a team cheated and hacked another team.
Too bad it's not the same for the "guilty until proven innocent" attitude of the Times' in the Tom Brady case.
Too bad it's not the same for the "guilty until proven innocent" attitude of the Times' in the Tom Brady case.
It was only a matter of time until the world of sports espionage moved into the digital age. The St. Louis Cardinals just happened to be the first—well, the first to get caught, at least.
1
you boys just don't get it, do you? sigh.
1
It seems to me that hiring computer whizzes straight out of college is exactly the right thing to do. The younger they are and the more recently educated in this field, the better they will be at their jobs -- and maybe as hackers. Just like baseball, it's not a game for old men.
2
To quite the article: "Along with suspending or banishing the front-office personnel who may have been behind the intrusion, he would most likely seek to punish the team and could order it to provide financial compensation to the Astros."
Is this statement based on an interview or is this opinion? If its the writer's opinion, then its bogus journalism. Report the facts, not what the writer wants or thinks will happen.
Is this statement based on an interview or is this opinion? If its the writer's opinion, then its bogus journalism. Report the facts, not what the writer wants or thinks will happen.
2
This story eerily close to "Silicon Valley" storyline, I wonder if Astros GM wrote his acct info on a post it....so that his coworkers just logged in as using it.....
Who would have thought that a storied franchise like The St. Louis Cardinals would steal information to gain an advantage on the field? The culture of cheating that envelops the New England Patriots has now been embraced by the Cardinals. Another blow for professional sports in America.
1
ATT was just fined 100Mil by the gov for cheating it's customers. My "favorite"
Some years ago a BIG name baby food company was selling baby apple juice.
IT WAS SUGAR WATER.
Today all US companies "cheat" the customers or anyone else that will benefit them.
We are surrounded by vultures
Some years ago a BIG name baby food company was selling baby apple juice.
IT WAS SUGAR WATER.
Today all US companies "cheat" the customers or anyone else that will benefit them.
We are surrounded by vultures
Article has been up for more than a few hours and has generated not hundreds and not even dozens of responses. That should seriously close the case. Boys will be boys. Change thy passwords or lose thy information. Next.
1
Oh, baloney. This is not the Astros' fault for being lax on password security. We are supposed to be careful with our passwords in order to protect ourselves from criminals. Carelessness on the part of a victim does not excuse a perpetrator's criminal activity.
I'm a Cards fan, for the record. I'm not enjoying this episode at all. But I refuse to make excuses for the organization, should the allegations be proven.
I'm a Cards fan, for the record. I'm not enjoying this episode at all. But I refuse to make excuses for the organization, should the allegations be proven.
2
This is news? Corporate espionage? A baseball team swiping info from another team? (That goes back at least to the signal stealing in the '51 playoff between the Dodgers and the Giants.) And Pete Rose is banned for betting on -- not against -- himself and his team. And Bonds, convicted of nothing, is kept out of the Hall of Fame.
I love baseball, still have my stubs from Ebbets Field. But we are not talking about the great game of baseball here; we are talking about one member of a corporate cartel picking on another member of the cartel.
I expect this ruckus will end up like Wall Street crimes: perhaps a low level plea deal with no meaningful punishment of the team, let alone individuals at the top.
Better the Feds should use their tech investigative skills to figure out how to prevent foreign countries from hacking into our government's computers.
I love baseball, still have my stubs from Ebbets Field. But we are not talking about the great game of baseball here; we are talking about one member of a corporate cartel picking on another member of the cartel.
I expect this ruckus will end up like Wall Street crimes: perhaps a low level plea deal with no meaningful punishment of the team, let alone individuals at the top.
Better the Feds should use their tech investigative skills to figure out how to prevent foreign countries from hacking into our government's computers.
5
Yeah... this is interesting in that it should tell us that we should heed advice to change passwords frequently. And it is interesting how teams and personnel try to get a one up.
But I have much more concern for the millions of federal employees and perhaps retirees and those who applied for clearances. Their data is out there. Congress has cut federal agency budgets relentlessly. It seems analysts are trying to figure out the big picture of the Chinese hack--that it was to obtAin info about key people, those with foreign contacts, with negative info in their files. But now that the Chinese hAve all this info, they have much more. These employees have kids, spouses etc. All of their info is in these files. Even if the federal employee is not key to something their child might be. And just because analysts do not believe the info was intended to be used for sham credit transactions and access to accounts, that doesn't mean that will not happen. This is not a good thing...
But I have much more concern for the millions of federal employees and perhaps retirees and those who applied for clearances. Their data is out there. Congress has cut federal agency budgets relentlessly. It seems analysts are trying to figure out the big picture of the Chinese hack--that it was to obtAin info about key people, those with foreign contacts, with negative info in their files. But now that the Chinese hAve all this info, they have much more. These employees have kids, spouses etc. All of their info is in these files. Even if the federal employee is not key to something their child might be. And just because analysts do not believe the info was intended to be used for sham credit transactions and access to accounts, that doesn't mean that will not happen. This is not a good thing...
Well Pete Rose did bet against his team...when he did not bet for them. It amounts to the same thing. And show me a baseball fan who isn't certain that Barry Bond used PED's and I'll show you a make-believe baseball fan.
3
Steve's words were, "And Bonds, convicted of nothing." He made no statement about any baseball fan's beliefs.
Thank you for correcting the article and articulating the correction at the bottom.
I am puzzled, however, that you chose not to publish my comment querying the original version, nor make any attribution crediting my bringing it to your attention. I had been waiting for my comment to appear, but I guess it never will.
It's more important that you made the correction. But I am disappointed that you chose to do it surreptitiously, rather than acknowledging that the error was brought to your attention by a reader.
I am puzzled, however, that you chose not to publish my comment querying the original version, nor make any attribution crediting my bringing it to your attention. I had been waiting for my comment to appear, but I guess it never will.
It's more important that you made the correction. But I am disappointed that you chose to do it surreptitiously, rather than acknowledging that the error was brought to your attention by a reader.
4
If this breach of the Astros security information was indeed carried out by members of the Cardinal organization, a hefty fine along with a loss of draft picks seems to be a fitting consequence. An example must be set here. The club must be responsible for the actions of its employees, who have sought to gain benefit for the club, their employer.
3
Sports mirrors society. The New England Patriots and St. Louis Cardinals, both stored franchises, now have a permanent stain on their brand as "cheaters".
3
Intent hasn't been proven yet. I see three possible motives: a) steal info to gain an edge (aka cheat); b) get back at Lunhow and embarrass the Astros for personal revenge (nothing organizationally directed); c) attempt to find any evidence of Lunhow having taken Intellectual Property with him to the Astros (as the FBI seems to believe at this point).
Of the three, I find (b) most compelling due to the documents being leaked to Gawker / Deadspin. There is no longer a competitive edge if you leak it / make it public knowledge!
Of the three, I find (b) most compelling due to the documents being leaked to Gawker / Deadspin. There is no longer a competitive edge if you leak it / make it public knowledge!
A low level Cardinal employee hacking a former employee's computer hardly compares with spy gate. That help the Pats win the Super Bowl. There is little comparison between the two.
1
Tide, a low level employee may have done the back. But it was not likely that employee was the only one planning to use the info. The key questions are at whose behest was it done, how far up in the organization this goes and how the info was to be (has been) used. The significance of this has yet t o be determined.
1
To my simple mind the Q is why? The Astros are not even in the same league as the Cardinals so, what exactly were they looking for. The answer that occurs is they were looking to determine if Jeff Lunhow or Sig Mejdal took any proprietary Cardinals data, software, programs, algos, etc; though developed while they were there are the property of the Cardinals as they were in their employ at the time. If that is the answer as to why then the directive to do so would have 'more probably than not' come from upstairs.
4
Len, either your theory or, fr more likely, Jeff Luhnow is simply better at analyzing talent than the fellows still with St. Louis. Luhnow was in charge of scouting and player development. (He also wanted the GM job when Jocketty left but didn't get the gig. Mozeliak did).
The players who have come up since 2007 or so that allowed St Louis to use the "next one up" philosophy that has been lauded by sportswriters were players Luhnow scouted, selected and developed. Now that he's gone, his eye is gone with him. How good is his eye? Look at what he has done in Houston in just a few years. His eye is very good.
If mine wasn't as good as his is, I'd want to steal his notes too.
The intellectual property you propose the Cards were cheating to make sure he didn't take with him was intellectual property he created. He didn't have to take it with him. It was already in his head.
The players who have come up since 2007 or so that allowed St Louis to use the "next one up" philosophy that has been lauded by sportswriters were players Luhnow scouted, selected and developed. Now that he's gone, his eye is gone with him. How good is his eye? Look at what he has done in Houston in just a few years. His eye is very good.
If mine wasn't as good as his is, I'd want to steal his notes too.
The intellectual property you propose the Cards were cheating to make sure he didn't take with him was intellectual property he created. He didn't have to take it with him. It was already in his head.
5
I know the buck has to stop somewhere, but it is obvious that majority owner Bill DeWitt, neither had any knowledge of this, nor did he approve of it in any way. He is a very ethical man and would never "wink" at such doings.
Clearly, the front office personnel should be fired, and someone with at least a tiny bit of computer security savvy should insist on a change of passwords on a regular basis. Obviously, the Astros should do the same - madness to keep the same passwords they used when they were with the Cardinals.
This in no way excuses what these front-office people did, but it should not have been possible for it to happen - one must make sure that info on computers is secure, whether or not they trust their employees. Unfortunately, we have see a string of such incidences, which leaves one to believe that many young tech savvy people have very few scruples.
Yes, the people involved must go. Yes, the Cardinals should probably be fined. But it should stop there. To punish the players and the entire franchise is overkill. When that happens, people forget who actually did do something wrong and then express righteous indignation over the entire event.
As an old lady, it concerns me greatly that many of today's youth believe if one CAN do something (due to poor security standards employed, then it's okay to do it. Personal morals are at an all-time low these days and that is deeply concerning.
Clearly, the front office personnel should be fired, and someone with at least a tiny bit of computer security savvy should insist on a change of passwords on a regular basis. Obviously, the Astros should do the same - madness to keep the same passwords they used when they were with the Cardinals.
This in no way excuses what these front-office people did, but it should not have been possible for it to happen - one must make sure that info on computers is secure, whether or not they trust their employees. Unfortunately, we have see a string of such incidences, which leaves one to believe that many young tech savvy people have very few scruples.
Yes, the people involved must go. Yes, the Cardinals should probably be fined. But it should stop there. To punish the players and the entire franchise is overkill. When that happens, people forget who actually did do something wrong and then express righteous indignation over the entire event.
As an old lady, it concerns me greatly that many of today's youth believe if one CAN do something (due to poor security standards employed, then it's okay to do it. Personal morals are at an all-time low these days and that is deeply concerning.
4
I don't know anything about the owner so cannot say whether I think you are right about his lack of involvement. But as far as youth--maybe we should find out who was using the information. It likely was not the "kids" hired right out of college, even if they did the hacking. After all, the "kids" don't make the baseball decisions, presumably the adults and older adults do. That is what should dictate who gets punished and how high and wide the punishment should go.