Republicans have made it their trade mark to decide everything based on what is good for big business and big dollars. Its time that Democrats and other make it our trade mark to decide everything based on what is good for people, workers and families. If we did this more often then more people would realize that the environment, world peace, health, jobs, etc. would be better served by our values than by Republican values. President Obama talks about addressing poverty, but doesn't keep his causes and affects straight. International trade deals and big business interests favor low wages, slave labor with abuse and destruction of everything in the path to corporate and the .01% mega rich wealth.
9
This president has always been more concerned with Africa and Asia than he has been with America. This secret trade agreement has recommendations for much more immigration that American citizens don't need and don't want. American workers haven't recovered from NAFTA and Obama apparently learned nothing from that. It is very telling that his own party is fighting him so hard on this. Neither he, personally, nor the U.S., as a country, will have a friend left in the world by the time Obama leaves office.
4
"Senators Harry Reid of Nevada, the Democratic leader, and Chuck Schumer of New York, the No. 3 Democrat, have proposed a compromise to Republican leaders: First, hold a separate vote on legislation aimed at discouraging so-called currency manipulation by American trading partners, which could be vetoed by the president. Then, wrap the fast-track authority he is seeking with a more encompassing bill, including assistance for displaced workers, extension of an African trade accord and other trade enforcement measures."
This says it all. Congress, under Reid's manipulation for pork and inserting unrelated items into bills and then not letting anyone vote on it until he had made the maximum number of changes to it (i.e. no ammendments - pass it or don't) is the hallmark of Reid's obstruction. It has caused nothing to get done. It's not the Reps or the Dems, it's Reid.
If a bill cannot pass based on the merits of what the bill is supposed to be about, then it shouldn't be written in the first place. Too many people here do not understand what is going on. Reid deliberately puts things in bills that will not pass one party's approval and then says they are obstructionists.
Of course, Obama is worse and may have already contrived this practice early on with Reid. Pelosi just went along during the Dem controlled Congress days, but now it is time to produce bills that are limited to what they are supposed to be about. Demand this from your representatives!
This says it all. Congress, under Reid's manipulation for pork and inserting unrelated items into bills and then not letting anyone vote on it until he had made the maximum number of changes to it (i.e. no ammendments - pass it or don't) is the hallmark of Reid's obstruction. It has caused nothing to get done. It's not the Reps or the Dems, it's Reid.
If a bill cannot pass based on the merits of what the bill is supposed to be about, then it shouldn't be written in the first place. Too many people here do not understand what is going on. Reid deliberately puts things in bills that will not pass one party's approval and then says they are obstructionists.
Of course, Obama is worse and may have already contrived this practice early on with Reid. Pelosi just went along during the Dem controlled Congress days, but now it is time to produce bills that are limited to what they are supposed to be about. Demand this from your representatives!
3
Finally, some good news! Good work, Democrats! But shame on you, Jonathan Weisman, for using "Democrat" as an adjective.
4
I'm coming to the realization that trade deals have always been written for the benefit of traders (who could then be taxed by national governments). Benefits sometimes "trickled down" to workers as an afterthought.
With "free trade" the export and import taxes have been eliminated, again for the benefit of the traders. So guess who is left with paying for government services?
Somebody somewhere somehow show me where I'm wrong.
With "free trade" the export and import taxes have been eliminated, again for the benefit of the traders. So guess who is left with paying for government services?
Somebody somewhere somehow show me where I'm wrong.
6
Thank you 52! NO TPP now or later!
7
Joseph Stigliz, who has won a Pulitzer prize as economist, said that TPP, " is a very bad deal. " Why should we give away more jobs when all of the republican candidates have brought up the issue of inequality...their hypocrisy is astounding. All of the republicans are pushing TPP and sadly so is our President. Thank God for Elizabeth Warren, Bernie Sanders, and Sherrod Brown to speak for millions of Americans who no longer recognize our country. TPP is a declaration of war against American workers !
12
I am so grateful to the Democrats who stopped fast track! I hope they also stop the awful TPP.
15
I'm done with Elizabeth Warren and Bernie Sanders, and all the Dems who didn't back the President on this. Talk about short sighted and dim viewed. At least I know now that I don't want either of them in office as Commander in Chief, so that's a good thing. READY FOR HILLARY! At least she has a more circumspect view of world economics than these two, who are way too deep in the trenches to get the big picture. Such a disappointment.
This could cost Hillary the election. She won't be getting my vote. As a true Democrat I am done with the disastrous Neoliberal garbage that deregulates corporations and coddles the banks. We need reform not more of the same.
1
Not only is Hillary circumspect as you say, but she is also circumlocutory much like the Oracle of Delphi which answered questions two ways. When Croesus asked the oracle whether he would prevail against the Persians in battle, it answered that if he goes to battle with them, he would destroy a great kingdom. It didn't occur to him that it would be his own kingdom he would destroy. Likewise, Hillary's response to whether or not she supported TPP was equally ambiguous in giving hope to both sides. In fact, I already have a campaign slogan for her "Circumlocution you can believe in."
3
Yeah, right! Hillary will be great as long as there's a few million bucks in every deal for her and Bill.
3
I wouldn't say that the Democrat Senators were throwing the President under the bus, but that they were voting to give the people a chance to see what the government was committing the country to. I believe that it is called "democracy".
14
What exactly does TPP do to reduce the USA's trade deficit with the very same Pacific trading partners? What exactly does the double secret TPP do to create jobs here in the USA, Mr President? All I hear are crickets!
14
I must imagine that some of these multinational corporations are also paying bloggers and posters to boost public opinion for passing this nightmare legislation. Obviously, corporations are not satisfied of all the rights of US citizenship. They believe they are entitled to be corporate monarchs of the world bestowed by the lobbyist paid off representational democracies. It is absolute stupidity to believe more than 2-3 Senators and Representatives are not owned and operated by corporations.
14
The president's arrogance and absolute belief in his intellectual superiority was well exhibited when he criticized Sen. Elizabeth Warren and lost even more support. NAFTA has left a bitter taste in the mouths of people concerned about the enormous downside of the agreement GHW Bush and Clinton ramrodded through. It created a handful of extremely wealthy Mexicans while forcing some 20,000,000 Mexicans into heartbreaking poverty. Can we trust Mr. Obama more than other presidents? Apparently some Democrats are remaining quite skeptical.
16
More opponents of Obama, motivated primarily by racism, work to thwart our first black president. Oh, it was Democrats who opposed him this time? Never mind, thank God we have some principled politicians in Washington looking out for us.
2
reasonable people (dems, indep, and repubs) don't and shouldn't trust obama's judgement anymore on what's good for the public, especially the middle class.
"free trade" is great, in theory, but our trade deals in recent years have been terrible--increasing the debt, the trade deficit, reducing jobs, increasing income inequality, etc. etc. obama simply has been sold a bill of goods by the
multi-nationals, through his "trade team".
we vividly saw how he "negotiated" with and questioned the military regarding troops in afghanistan, and how he "negotiated" with republicans regarding budget deals. he has had no experience asking the tough questions, and seems to hear only what he's conditioned to hear.
some are now even questioning how quickly he adopted the heritage foundation's version of health care reform (romneycare) and torpedoed the public option. in short, we're waiting to hear what sen. sherrod brown and a select few other senators believe.
ideally, obama should find a university presidency and leave early.
"free trade" is great, in theory, but our trade deals in recent years have been terrible--increasing the debt, the trade deficit, reducing jobs, increasing income inequality, etc. etc. obama simply has been sold a bill of goods by the
multi-nationals, through his "trade team".
we vividly saw how he "negotiated" with and questioned the military regarding troops in afghanistan, and how he "negotiated" with republicans regarding budget deals. he has had no experience asking the tough questions, and seems to hear only what he's conditioned to hear.
some are now even questioning how quickly he adopted the heritage foundation's version of health care reform (romneycare) and torpedoed the public option. in short, we're waiting to hear what sen. sherrod brown and a select few other senators believe.
ideally, obama should find a university presidency and leave early.
6
Obama must never be the president of a university. University's are supposed to be about free thought and expression, even if there are mulitple sides and opinions. Obama accepts no opinion or policies but his own, and refuses to listen to any logic.
1
Michael B. Froman, the United States trade representative, who is negotiating for the United States, possibly unwittingly made the following statement, during another interview, a statement which essentially indicates the reason why the pact will benefit corporations, instead of American workers.
NY Times excerpt and link -
"Michael B. Froman, the United States trade representative, who is negotiating the deal, said in an interview. “We are already seeing that investors are deciding to move to TPP countries where they will have a stable labor system,” protections for intellectual property and the freedom to move data into and out of the country without government restraints, which are part of the deal being negotiated."
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/05/13/us/politics/as-obama-plays-china-card-...®ion=top-news&WT.nav=top-news
I don't see any indication that he has any consideration for the effect on the American workforce, nor do I see him speak of corporations moving to the United States, because of this trade pact.
NY Times excerpt and link -
"Michael B. Froman, the United States trade representative, who is negotiating the deal, said in an interview. “We are already seeing that investors are deciding to move to TPP countries where they will have a stable labor system,” protections for intellectual property and the freedom to move data into and out of the country without government restraints, which are part of the deal being negotiated."
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/05/13/us/politics/as-obama-plays-china-card-...®ion=top-news&WT.nav=top-news
I don't see any indication that he has any consideration for the effect on the American workforce, nor do I see him speak of corporations moving to the United States, because of this trade pact.
14
How can this man not be considered treasonous when he blatantly states what the intentions are and who it's mainly set up for...corporations .... at the expense of the American workers. Those pushing TPP seem to have the old plantation mentality.
2
If the TTP and TTIP are such great deals for the American people then release the trade accord documents so that We the People and our elected representatives can read them and debate them. No fast track for secret trade agreements!
13
Has anything in the U.S. ever been negotiated before where the American people were firmly left completely in the dark? Details of this deal, anyone? We have to believe that the reason is because we will not like what we find out about it.
2
TPPs and WMDs....Wolves seem to arrive in lambs of 3-letter lengths. Or, is the TPP simply a partially inflated pig(skin)-in-a-poke?
Even if it is "traditionally" true that trade deals and other treaties are negotiated in secrecy, it is time that the U.S. and its "true" allies/partners set a new standard for international accords by introducing transparency and openness as a key element leading to agreements like these.
The issues at stake are matters of principles, ideas that peoples of all nations involved need to share. If the terms of a "deal" cannot withstand public scrutiny, they are not likely worth the paper on which they are written -- nor are they likely to be durable or observed in fact and deed.
It's time to put the air back in the ball and play the game for real....no more deflate-gate in the game of international trade!
Even if it is "traditionally" true that trade deals and other treaties are negotiated in secrecy, it is time that the U.S. and its "true" allies/partners set a new standard for international accords by introducing transparency and openness as a key element leading to agreements like these.
The issues at stake are matters of principles, ideas that peoples of all nations involved need to share. If the terms of a "deal" cannot withstand public scrutiny, they are not likely worth the paper on which they are written -- nor are they likely to be durable or observed in fact and deed.
It's time to put the air back in the ball and play the game for real....no more deflate-gate in the game of international trade!
1
"Free Trade" was bad for working Americans when it was called NAFTA, and it's bad for working Americans now that it's called TPP. Ross Perot was right about it in 1993, and Elizabeth Warren is right about it now. All the window dressing looks nice, but it will kill manufacturing jobs and drive down wages even more, if that's possible.
16
Maybe the president will now listen to the people who elected him: working people, union members, progressives, believers in an American Dream that says we must ALL get ahead of the nation is to get ahead.
Like his predecessor Mr. Clinton, Mr. Obama is seduced and beguiled by the fantasy of an American Century redux in which our trade leads the world. Reality bites: trade is controlled by "corporations-are-people" transnationals who don't give a flying fig for American workers, American prosperity, or American values. They value one thing only: profit for themselves.
That's why they--through their minion Orrin Hatch--have ensured that no American courts will ever have a chance to rule on their behavior. Rather they have set up "international tribunals" to make rulings that govern American law--tribunals whose members THEY will name and whose members will, at various times, be members of the court or hired help for the corporations, as they themselves see fit.
What happens to the American Dream, and American democracy and American sovereignty? Gone along with the president's vision of a great legacy.
Listen to the people, Mr. President. If the TPP is so great for the American people, LET US READ IT AND REVIEW IT!
Like his predecessor Mr. Clinton, Mr. Obama is seduced and beguiled by the fantasy of an American Century redux in which our trade leads the world. Reality bites: trade is controlled by "corporations-are-people" transnationals who don't give a flying fig for American workers, American prosperity, or American values. They value one thing only: profit for themselves.
That's why they--through their minion Orrin Hatch--have ensured that no American courts will ever have a chance to rule on their behavior. Rather they have set up "international tribunals" to make rulings that govern American law--tribunals whose members THEY will name and whose members will, at various times, be members of the court or hired help for the corporations, as they themselves see fit.
What happens to the American Dream, and American democracy and American sovereignty? Gone along with the president's vision of a great legacy.
Listen to the people, Mr. President. If the TPP is so great for the American people, LET US READ IT AND REVIEW IT!
20
As I wrote to all my Congressional representatives this morning, "Under no circumstances give the president Fast Track authority for TPP nor approve any subsequent trade legislation that harms USA working people and seniors. I didn't vote for this kind of "change." If I wanted a Republican President I would have voted for Romney! And I will not forget who supports him on this issue."
18
One more comment -
We all need to be asking, loudly, why it is that "we the people", are prevented from seeing any part of what is in the agreement, while major corporations, not only get to review it, but advise as to what should and shouldn't be in it.
Excerpt and link from Intercept report -
"So who can read the text of the TPP? Not you, it’s classified. Even members of Congress can only look at it one section at a time in the Capitol’s basement, without most of their staff or the ability to keep notes.
But there’s an exception: if you’re part of one of 28 U.S. government-appointed trade advisory committees providing advice to the U.S. negotiators. The committees with the most access to what’s going on in the negotiations are 16 “Industry Trade Advisory Committees,” whose members include AT&T, General Electric, Apple, Dow Chemical, Nike, Walmart and the American Petroleum Institute."
https://firstlook.org/theintercept/2015/05/12/cant-read-tpp-heres-huge-c...
Beyond belief that the beneficiaries of the TPP get to design a trade agreement, that will guarantee them additional trillions of dollars in profit, from the blood, sweat, and tears, of the eternally suffering masses.
We all need to be asking, loudly, why it is that "we the people", are prevented from seeing any part of what is in the agreement, while major corporations, not only get to review it, but advise as to what should and shouldn't be in it.
Excerpt and link from Intercept report -
"So who can read the text of the TPP? Not you, it’s classified. Even members of Congress can only look at it one section at a time in the Capitol’s basement, without most of their staff or the ability to keep notes.
But there’s an exception: if you’re part of one of 28 U.S. government-appointed trade advisory committees providing advice to the U.S. negotiators. The committees with the most access to what’s going on in the negotiations are 16 “Industry Trade Advisory Committees,” whose members include AT&T, General Electric, Apple, Dow Chemical, Nike, Walmart and the American Petroleum Institute."
https://firstlook.org/theintercept/2015/05/12/cant-read-tpp-heres-huge-c...
Beyond belief that the beneficiaries of the TPP get to design a trade agreement, that will guarantee them additional trillions of dollars in profit, from the blood, sweat, and tears, of the eternally suffering masses.
20
Conservative voters keep warning about a New World Order. Well, it's their party that is bringing about the corporatizing of world governments with these so-called "free trade" treaties. That's the real New World Order.
11
Interesting again.......Now it is the Democrats that are being obstructive towards Obama. I thought it was only the Republicans who did that. Let's hope our next President can make deals with the opposition. Every leader since Jesus has had opposition. It is only the Obama's that fall back on the race card when they don't get what they want. They can't deal with someone saying no as they have lived a charmed life of people pandering to them and don't have the experience of having to compromise. Hillary should be a breath of fresh air if she can get by the liberal wing of the party.....
1
These give away jobs to lower paying nations only enriches the .01% and increases the dangerous inequity that is driving the 99.% into deeper pain.
16
Of course the TPP "will be back". As many times as it takes to give our corporate overlords exactly what they want.
20
When the US government acts in secrecy and President walks around in soft sole shoes to escape the people's representatives of the democracy
then the people lose their freedom or in this middle class loses. The winners here will be Wall Street, the top 5 %ers and world bankers, hedge managers. Obama made promises in 2012 and he will keep them.
He did not raise a $1 billion to retain power for the just himself. He now has to repaid all those moneygivers behind the shrubs fundraisers that he promised to protect. He really is such a disappointment to those who voted for him - twice.
then the people lose their freedom or in this middle class loses. The winners here will be Wall Street, the top 5 %ers and world bankers, hedge managers. Obama made promises in 2012 and he will keep them.
He did not raise a $1 billion to retain power for the just himself. He now has to repaid all those moneygivers behind the shrubs fundraisers that he promised to protect. He really is such a disappointment to those who voted for him - twice.
15
‘Fast Tracking’ sure is relative; this agreement is ten years in the making, was well reported on, and Senators have had access to its details for years. Yes, this free trade agreement will beat all others — representing 40 percent of the world's economy. But trade negotiations usually occur in private because parties won't have meaningful dialogue if their positions are publicly disclosed. Accordingly, TPP parties signed a confidentiality agreement requiring them to share proposals only with "government officials and individuals who are part of the government’s domestic trade advisory process." And it’s not like Senators can’t see what’s currently on the table; they can view its nuts and bolts if they just take the elevator downstairs.
It’s unclear exactly what Senator Warren’s real beef is, and why she couldn’t have made her concerns known along the normal process for such deals. The pros of this agreement seem to well outweigh the cons; similar arguments made about NAFTA didn’t seem to come to fruition. Maybe she wanted to help draft this treaty, maybe she's seeking more than a seat in the Senate, whatever. It’s a surprise she has such a following. She’s been a law professor almost her entire career, served only a little more than 2 years in the Senate (working on relatively low profile committees), never served in an elected capacity before the Senate, and never ran a business. Pretty savvy to be listened to by so many with such a thin resume.
It’s unclear exactly what Senator Warren’s real beef is, and why she couldn’t have made her concerns known along the normal process for such deals. The pros of this agreement seem to well outweigh the cons; similar arguments made about NAFTA didn’t seem to come to fruition. Maybe she wanted to help draft this treaty, maybe she's seeking more than a seat in the Senate, whatever. It’s a surprise she has such a following. She’s been a law professor almost her entire career, served only a little more than 2 years in the Senate (working on relatively low profile committees), never served in an elected capacity before the Senate, and never ran a business. Pretty savvy to be listened to by so many with such a thin resume.
3
It's confusing. I'vebeen hearing "the pros outweigh the cons" for decades and I only see a few fat cats benefitting from these give-a-ways. The middle class keeps melting and the "job creators" create their jobs in 3rd world countries and park their $ in offshore accounts .
9
Not one representative of labor or working people has ever been included in the development of this pact. Not one. Nor has Sen. Warren or any other senator had the opportunity to bring the text back to her office to study and review it at her leisure--or to share it with her staff, professionals, other outside experts.
Only the corporate leaders who will benefit by eliminating and weakening American laws, and by pitting American workers against those who earn pennies an hour, have had that luxury, and they wrote the pact in the first place.
The corporate right wing has self-serving transnational industrialists and banksters at its head; it has minions in "elected" offices at all levels to do its bidding; and it has ignorant, gullible dupes among the American public who swallow everything they, Faux "news" and the Wall Street Journal, tell them.
I can't help wondering, Ed, which group do you belong do?
Only the corporate leaders who will benefit by eliminating and weakening American laws, and by pitting American workers against those who earn pennies an hour, have had that luxury, and they wrote the pact in the first place.
The corporate right wing has self-serving transnational industrialists and banksters at its head; it has minions in "elected" offices at all levels to do its bidding; and it has ignorant, gullible dupes among the American public who swallow everything they, Faux "news" and the Wall Street Journal, tell them.
I can't help wondering, Ed, which group do you belong do?
6
Being from Washington DC, you must be firmly in the bubble. There is a reason the highest property value zip code immediately surrounds the Pentagon. Because the defense contractors buy multi-million dollar mansions to try to bribe the military leaders for contracts.
What benefits have we seen from NAFTA? We saw 60,000 American factories move overseas. We saw average wages decline 12%. We lost millions of manufacturing jobs. Our trade deficits increased $177 billion per year.
Who do these free trade agreements benefit? As a worker, I haven't seen any benefits. Maybe I need to move to Washington DC to get hooked up with some of the "trickle down" the rich must throw on the leadership class.
Free Trade just means workers lose and the rich win.
What benefits have we seen from NAFTA? We saw 60,000 American factories move overseas. We saw average wages decline 12%. We lost millions of manufacturing jobs. Our trade deficits increased $177 billion per year.
Who do these free trade agreements benefit? As a worker, I haven't seen any benefits. Maybe I need to move to Washington DC to get hooked up with some of the "trickle down" the rich must throw on the leadership class.
Free Trade just means workers lose and the rich win.
4
Voters in the USA have only just woken up to the threats to those in the USA posed by the TPP.
It's an invaluable exercise to learn about what ordinary folks have been protesting for at least the last couple of years about the proposed TPP in other countries such as Japan ~ http://tinyurl.com/o75zsbh
It's an invaluable exercise to learn about what ordinary folks have been protesting for at least the last couple of years about the proposed TPP in other countries such as Japan ~ http://tinyurl.com/o75zsbh
12
Sovereignty For International Investors (Trans-Pacific Partnership (TPP))
(the REAL issue, and the reason bushBAMA (no change) can't discuss)
Our big lessons-bushBAMA is totally discredited as "liberal" leader-having now lost all authority in head to head conflict with Elizabeth Warren-a fight he chose to personalize. He has completely destroyed credibility and authority.
Second: Hillary Clinton will AVOID TTP-TTIP, just as she has avoided position orientation to this point-leaving her candidacy very compromised. Hillary ("bought and sold") will likely assure wealthy contributors after elected, she will, with republican and bought and sold dem votes, push TTP-TTIP through.
This should be enough, if Americans continue to show issue orientation and observation she is untrustworthy, to derail Hillary already discredited campaign...
(the REAL issue, and the reason bushBAMA (no change) can't discuss)
Our big lessons-bushBAMA is totally discredited as "liberal" leader-having now lost all authority in head to head conflict with Elizabeth Warren-a fight he chose to personalize. He has completely destroyed credibility and authority.
Second: Hillary Clinton will AVOID TTP-TTIP, just as she has avoided position orientation to this point-leaving her candidacy very compromised. Hillary ("bought and sold") will likely assure wealthy contributors after elected, she will, with republican and bought and sold dem votes, push TTP-TTIP through.
This should be enough, if Americans continue to show issue orientation and observation she is untrustworthy, to derail Hillary already discredited campaign...
10
Seriously, not one word in this article about the fact that the actual proposed trade deal is *classified*? We're supposed to support a trade deal whose TERMS ARE SECRET?
Get a clue, Mr. President.
Get a clue, Mr. President.
13
You're from blue, blue Washington. You voted with the thrill up your leg.
Now you complain about something that was hiding in plain sight - a secretive, punitive, thin-skinned, academic know-it-all sociopath.
How does it feel to be totally fooled?
Now you complain about something that was hiding in plain sight - a secretive, punitive, thin-skinned, academic know-it-all sociopath.
How does it feel to be totally fooled?
5
You get a clue. This guy is and has been a willing puppet of the oligarchs from day 1. He got elected with votes of people like you by playing the cool black guy/leftist. You got suckered and apparently still are.
5
Jonathan and Bill Gilwood - The #1 priority for John Boehner and Mitch McConnell is the TPP and creating more Free Trade Agreements. Yes, voters were snookered by Obama's talk before the election about Free Trade. But, we now have a candidate who is truly against Free Trade in Bernie Sanders.
You didn't say whether you're for or against Free Trade. I would assume since you sound like Republicans, that you're for outsourcing all jobs from America just like John Boehner and Mtch McConnell.
The only thing these Free Trade Agreements get Americans is lower wages, lost jobs, and increased trade deficits. The leaders get $500k speaking fees for the rest of their lives and cush positions on "negotiating teams" for major banks.
You didn't say whether you're for or against Free Trade. I would assume since you sound like Republicans, that you're for outsourcing all jobs from America just like John Boehner and Mtch McConnell.
The only thing these Free Trade Agreements get Americans is lower wages, lost jobs, and increased trade deficits. The leaders get $500k speaking fees for the rest of their lives and cush positions on "negotiating teams" for major banks.
2
What happened to that US/Europe transatlantic trade agreement? I got kinda of psyched up about that -- a strong western bloc to counter China + the Orient.
2
The Investor-State Dispute Settlement, the segment of the TPP that is raising the most concern among citizen's grassroots protests, isn't even discussed in the article. The job loss that followed other "trade pacts" gets limited discussion.
Who in their right minds trusts the current assemblage of corporate-owned politicians in congress and the White House to "assist workers displaced by globalization"?
The American worker no longer has meaningful representation in Washington.
Who in their right minds trusts the current assemblage of corporate-owned politicians in congress and the White House to "assist workers displaced by globalization"?
The American worker no longer has meaningful representation in Washington.
19
And that last bit is thanks to your vote!!
Wake up!
Wake up!
1
I'm fully awake and my eyes are wide open, and all I see are two parties who have little concern for workers. Maybe you should take another look.
8
Finally, the Democrats are showing some real backbone just when we most need it! And then we have a sleazy betrayal by Schumer, who has never really been a Progressive on economic issues. His proposed compromise is just another way Wall Street can continue impoverishing the rest of us. If you still have any doubts about who Schumer really represents please see:
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/07/30/washington/30schumer.html?pagewanted=all
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/07/30/washington/30schumer.html?pagewanted=all
10
You will see that "backbone" disappear once they add a few meaningless "worker protections". The anti-democratic Investor-State Settlement Settlement provisions, not even mentioned in this article, will stay intact because that is the bonanza for the wealthy who pretty much wrote the TPP.
7
Maybe I'm just haven't been paying enough attention, but I can't understand why Obama is pushing for the TPP in the first place. What's his motivation? Can anyone enlighten me?
8
Yeah, you haven't been paying attention. So read up and do your own research and then vote, which is your right, but clearly you are uninformed.
Wake up!
Wake up!
1
thanks for the insight. You're clearly an enlightened and well informed citizen.
Maybe, secretly, Obama is glad that his mentors on Wall Street lost this one.
Nothing has been lost. The wealthy own our politicians and the wealthy really want this - it is basically an investors rights pact which allows the rights of corporations to pursue profit unencumbered by labor and environmental law. That's why the fine print has been kept so hush hush.
5
An unfortunate outcome. Trade with Asia, where the world's fastest and largest economic growth will occur over the next few decades, will proceed with or without a US trade deal. Loss of jobs, environmental degradation, whatever the concern, will also occur with or without a US signatory. The US is the world's largest and most powerful economy, but we are not big enough to control global trade nor the terms under which it occurs. Parochial fears and interests have torpedoed an important trade opportunity and we will suffer the consequences soon enough.
1
An intelligent post here.
The horse has left the barn.
The trade consequences are not as important, quite frankly, as the incredibly secretive nature of this charade. This makes Nancy Pelosi's statement about ObamaCare look like a naked lady running down the street. Where is the sunshine here? Where is the openness to the American people, much less the Congress.
To paraphrase, those who would trade transparency for trade deserve neither.
Wake up!
The horse has left the barn.
The trade consequences are not as important, quite frankly, as the incredibly secretive nature of this charade. This makes Nancy Pelosi's statement about ObamaCare look like a naked lady running down the street. Where is the sunshine here? Where is the openness to the American people, much less the Congress.
To paraphrase, those who would trade transparency for trade deserve neither.
Wake up!
6
This "engagement" with the rest of the world comes at an awful price to our manufacturing jobs and salaries. This opening up has been going on since the 70s and all I see are Americans with less jobs and lower pay. Forty years is a long time to wait for good results .
5
To Me46, concern over the further loss of jobs from yet another trade pact might be a "parochial fear", but to many of us - who aren't even allowed to read what's in the TPP - it is much, much more.
2
Can someone please explain to me how globalization benefits the average American? Why do lawmakers think it's a good idea to have American workers "compete" with Chinese workers in this way? I'm not talking about the markets, but asking about workers?
14
After our experience with NAFTA, the president should have known that any trade deal with the word, "secret," in it, was in trouble. Again, the achilles heel of this presidency is a lack of communication. What is so wrong with bringing in Senator Warren, et.al. laying the deal on the table and providing a detailed explanation of it. Maybe, as the President states, Warren is wrong on her trade deal claims, but, then to say, I can't show you why you are wrong until we do the deal---well, come on.
13
When it comes to trade deals, Obama brings the hammer down on America's biggest, most trusted partner, Canada, stopping the flow of oil from Alberta, even though America is crisscrossed with pipelines. Now he's giving Shell access to the Arctic, green President indeed, green as in greenbacks.
5
True. The pipeline is nothing (sorry Midwest) compared to the likely damage to the Artic and planet earth.
2
The whole point of a political process is to proposes things, discuss them , debate all sides and vote. We do so little of this anymore that a non party line vote, or not simply blocking something seems like news. We should be doing much more of this regardless of who wins each vote. Instead we have gotten use to stalling, waiting for election cycles, pandering to bases on TV, and suing the other side on everything until the courts decide. I see a vote, not as a win or loss, but as a sign of life in congress -- on both sides.
5
Interesting politics with this TPP. The Republicans are protecting us from China's market manipulations, thereby blocking more outsourcing. Hilary Clinton remains stuck between campaign marketing and representing the people, so she's taking a time out on this topic.
1
That is very funny. Let's give HRC a time out!!
I seriously doubt blocking currency manipulation would result in "blocking more outsourcing". Republicans give tax credits for businesses that outsource and offshore jobs. So, the desire to "protect American jobs" seems to be for sale to the highest transnational corporation.
We lost ground with NAFTA, GATT, CAFTA, Vietnam Free Trade Agreement, South Korea Free Trade Agreement, Permanent Normal Trade with China....
What possible benefit will this new, secret free trade agreement have for American workers? We already lost millions of jobs and increased our trade deficit by hundreds of billions per year. Our trade deficits have set records every year since NAFTA was signed.
We lost ground with NAFTA, GATT, CAFTA, Vietnam Free Trade Agreement, South Korea Free Trade Agreement, Permanent Normal Trade with China....
What possible benefit will this new, secret free trade agreement have for American workers? We already lost millions of jobs and increased our trade deficit by hundreds of billions per year. Our trade deficits have set records every year since NAFTA was signed.
2
The oligarchs are simultaneously negotiating the Transatlantic Trade and Investment Partnership, a proposed free trade agreement between the EU and the US. Proponents say the agreement would result in multilateral economic growth; critics say it would increase corporate power and make it more difficult for governments to regulate markets for public benefit. The US considers TTIP a companion agreement to the Trans-Pacific Partnership. After a proposed draft was leaked in March 2014, the European Commission launched a public consultation on a limited set of clauses and in January 2015 published parts of an overview. An agreement is not expected to be finalized before 2016. The Center for Economic and Policy Research observed that conventional trade barriers between the US and the EU are already low, the deal would focus on overriding national regulations regarding fracking, GMOs, finance and tightening laws on copyright. CEPR asserts that the economic benefits per household are mediocre. "If we apply the projected income gain of 0.21% to the projected median personal income in 2027, it comes to a bit more than $50 a year..less than 15 cents a day. Don't spend it all in one place". Tufts University indicates that there will be losses in terms of net exports and GDP, loss of labor income, job losses, reduction of the labor share, loss of government revenue and higher financial instability among European countries.
Americans need to wake up before it's too late.
Americans need to wake up before it's too late.
10
Oligarchs, what oligarchs? There are only entrepreneurs in a free market. Oh, look up! There goes another flying pig.
2
When King Henry II stated "when pigs have wings" to his wife Eleanor of Aquitaine nearly 900 years ago, she responded "There'll be pork in the trees come morning!"
3
Those "job creators" are so benevolent. That's why the middle class is so prosperous. But they sure walk and quack like a Koch, et al.
3
The case for TPP has been poorly made in broad generalities, while the details remain under impenetrable wraps.
Given the long view of NAFTA, no wonder an agreement of this kind and magnitude is a target for public and political skepticism. Sure consumers have benefited, but at the expense of a wounded American work force and the gutting of our national manufacturing capability.
Can anyone articulate our national strategy for thriving in the global economic revolution that is the harsh and pressing reality of the 21st Century?
As for the, “...legislative capstone of his (Obama’s) presidency,” there are many, many long standing, critical domestic issues that have been chronically deferred as a matter of pure political expediency that languished wanting for committed and sustained presidential effort.
Given the long view of NAFTA, no wonder an agreement of this kind and magnitude is a target for public and political skepticism. Sure consumers have benefited, but at the expense of a wounded American work force and the gutting of our national manufacturing capability.
Can anyone articulate our national strategy for thriving in the global economic revolution that is the harsh and pressing reality of the 21st Century?
As for the, “...legislative capstone of his (Obama’s) presidency,” there are many, many long standing, critical domestic issues that have been chronically deferred as a matter of pure political expediency that languished wanting for committed and sustained presidential effort.
9
It seems some want to declare the sundering of the Democratic Party over what is one aspect of international policy. Have we become so used to the GOP lockstep formula of voting that disagreement means dissolution? The Democratic Party I grew up with had liberal and conservative, hawkish and peace wings. It is only within this century that monolithism has become the norm
As Will Rogers reminded us, I am not a member of any organized political party. I am a Democrat.
As Will Rogers reminded us, I am not a member of any organized political party. I am a Democrat.
14
Show us the jobs Mr. Obama. Show us the industry benefits. Show us how middle class Americans and those who aspire to the middle class will benefit. Point to the map of the American cities that will build new manufacturing facilities. Show us the neighborhoods and communities that will build new factories and enlarge existing ones. Show us how our schools and colleges will be able to enroll more students and expand American research and training for jobs. Show us everything we will gain Mr. Obama. And then also tell us, truthfully, what will we lose. All you have done by keeping this trade agreement secret is foster mistrust and disbelief not only by the members of Congress but also within the general citizenry of the United States. We no longer trust you Mr. Obama. Show us the jobs. Show us the benefits. And show us what we will lose too. We have the right to know.
10
I'd really be happy with the Democrats if I didn't feel that this was a ploy to show opposition before they cave in and send tens of millions more jobs overseas.
9
Saving ourselves form ourselves. Thank You Democrats against the TTP.
8
People are confusing proposed fast track authority with the substance of the TPP, which is classified information. It may well be that the TPP turns out to be good for us, but having been burned by NAFTA, the American public is leery of a process that limits debate and imposes strict, short timelines for congressional action. Of further concern is that the proposed fast track legislation, if approved, will remain in effect for six years. Can you imagine what a Republican President and a Republican Congress, elected with limitless money from the 1%, might "fast track" upon the American people.
5
Then why don't the TPP advocates point out how it isn't like NAFTA?
President Obama says, "Just trust me." Sorry, but I do not.
Calling Democrats wrong on the TPP issue is not a smart thing to do, Mr. President. What happened to transparency? Show everyone the details of the trade agreement, let the Democrats and the American people review it, and then we will all see if they are right or wrong to oppose it.
"Just trust me" never works for me.
Calling Democrats wrong on the TPP issue is not a smart thing to do, Mr. President. What happened to transparency? Show everyone the details of the trade agreement, let the Democrats and the American people review it, and then we will all see if they are right or wrong to oppose it.
"Just trust me" never works for me.
16
Anytime our 'elected leader' start wrapping different agendas together, there trouble. Too much secrecy with this bill, what is Obama trying to hide.
6
Where has there been any meaningful discussion in the NYT or other media about the actual details of this bill? How can we tell if it's good or bad (and for whom) unless we know what it contains? Why does it have to be so secret that the voting public can't review it? And why is it necessary to have to accept a bill of this scope and importance in total without being able to negotiate?
7
Considering that the contents have been leaked for some time, you have to ask yourself why the mainstream media hasn't published it.
1
The details are classified. We can't be trusted to know them, although GE and many other multinational corporations can not only know the details, they've written them.
1
This article claims that Obama had no cooperation from congress since he has taken office. What happened to the first two years where the democrats had total control of all three branches. He accused the republicans as did the NYT's of stopping everything he tried to do. How could that be so those two years? Another lie???
1
Even before Barack Obama took the oath office, Republicans leaders, conservative think-tanks and right-wing pundits were calling for total obstruction of the new president's agenda. Bill Kristol, who helped block Bill Clinton's health care reform attempt in 1993, called for history to repeat on the Obama stimulus - and everything else. President Obama could count the votes he received from Congressional Republicans on the fingers (usually the middle one) of one hand. The expansion of the State Children's Health Insurance Program (S-CHIP) to four million more American kids earned the backing of a whopping eight GOP Senators. (One of them, Arlen Specter, later became a Democrat.) Badly needed Wall Street reform eventually overcame GOP filibusters to pass with the support of just three Republicans in the House and Senate, respectively. It took 50 days for President Obama to get past Republican filibusters of extended unemployment benefits and the Small Business Jobs Act. As for the DISCLOSE Act, legislation designed to limit the torrent of secret campaign cash unleashed by the Supreme Court's Citizens United ruling, in September Republican Senators prevented it from ever coming to a vote. Republican obstruction reigned supreme.
1
There are just a handful of dedicated public servants who really care about
the ideals of our republic...of a strong middle class ; fair wages; ....and
some who should be running for President in 2016..
Bernie Sanders is running....and telling the truth about the most unfair and
disastrous law our nation has ever had : Citizens United.
Elizabeth Warren should be running for President in 2016....
Our nation is now way behind China and other Asian Countries in Math & Science because the US standards for achievement are so low.
Our underfunded infrastructure is resulting in train crashes...and
dangerous highways and bridges.
Our lack of oversight and control of the sale of weapons is creating one
violent street confrontation after another.
Where are we going.....Down the road to a second-rate society...
which regardless of being liberal or conservative....will devolve into a
second-rate republic...we are going down this road quickly...thanks
to Citizens United where the fat cats pay to keep all their ill gotten gains
off shore their untaxable wealth...and use foreign labor to make themselves
even more grossly wealthy and revolting.
poor rating
the ideals of our republic...of a strong middle class ; fair wages; ....and
some who should be running for President in 2016..
Bernie Sanders is running....and telling the truth about the most unfair and
disastrous law our nation has ever had : Citizens United.
Elizabeth Warren should be running for President in 2016....
Our nation is now way behind China and other Asian Countries in Math & Science because the US standards for achievement are so low.
Our underfunded infrastructure is resulting in train crashes...and
dangerous highways and bridges.
Our lack of oversight and control of the sale of weapons is creating one
violent street confrontation after another.
Where are we going.....Down the road to a second-rate society...
which regardless of being liberal or conservative....will devolve into a
second-rate republic...we are going down this road quickly...thanks
to Citizens United where the fat cats pay to keep all their ill gotten gains
off shore their untaxable wealth...and use foreign labor to make themselves
even more grossly wealthy and revolting.
poor rating
9
Making issues, domestic or international, personal is typical of the White House and Obama. In Israel, it is Netanyahu who recently was reelected. In Egypt it was being for Morsi and against el-Sisi even though millions of Egyptians wanted Morsi out and subsequently elected Sisi as president. Egypt now turns to Russia. In Syria, it is Assad who isn't a threat to us or any of our alies but is fighting ISIS who Obama discounted, calling them a JV team. In Iraq It was al-Maliki that was his kicking boy until he resigned and ISIS continued to grow. There are others like Putin but now he attacks a specific person in his own party because his bill was blocked. What he doesn't do is to look the issues first to understand the objections rather than attack on a personal level. It didn't just take Walker to block his bill. Her objections, as well as others may be wrong but Obama becomes ineffective when he singles out one person to demean and attack and ignores trying ti find a solution. It is a shame that he reacts this way rather than seek common ground. It wastes the opportunity he was given when elected.
3
HRM, you nailed it. The President's judgment or pettiness or stubbornness, whatever, is responsible for a string of domestic and foreign policy failures. It seems he doesn't listen to advice that he receives/is receiving from Hillary, Reid, Warren, allies overseas. He is an intelligent man who has been brought down by all or some of the above traits and I should have added hubris.
2
I think I've finally figured out Obama's obsession with this awful trade idea: It's about his preoccupation with countering Chinese power. Men always have to have an enemy/rival. I don't like Hillary, but I believe we do need a woman president to stop this nonsense. Obama and his ilk will destroy the American economy in order to demonstrate supremacy over another world power. This is just the modern version of the imperialism that led to World War I, the Vietnam War and so many other atrocities, all of which ultimately damaged the imperialist powers--or at least, their citizens.
1
Our country cannot survive without middle class private sector jobs. This trade bill would not help that.
8
"Free trade" has always been 'free' for the United States and to their exclusive advantage, to the detriment and exploitation of its trading "partners".
The 1987 FTA between Canada and the US is a prime example, stripping Canadians of all protection against economic invasion. Unable to compete in the overpowering onslaught that followed, my own father-in-law lost his growing and prosperous trucking business to it.
The 1987 FTA between Canada and the US is a prime example, stripping Canadians of all protection against economic invasion. Unable to compete in the overpowering onslaught that followed, my own father-in-law lost his growing and prosperous trucking business to it.
2
It may be "free" for American millionaires, but it's been ruinously costly to all other Americans.
1
Our youth need look no further than our politicians to decide that Christianity is not for them. In the name of Jesus, they cut food stamps, deny medical care, destroy the environment, destroy our health, economies, and environments, engage in prejudice against LBGTs and women, and utterly disregard science/facts when it suits them. Compassion and empathy matter to our youth; Christianity, as practiced in the USA, actively scorns both as part of the Protestantism/Calvinist belief system predominant in the USA.
2
The article was about foreign trade...
2
These people are the opposites of Christians, if that means followers of Jesus Christ. They're hucksters and rubes, believing in a false ideology and calling it Christian.
It puts me in mind of Lincoln's old riddle: If you call a dog's tail a leg, how many legs does a dog have?
The answer is "It has four legs. Calling a tail a leg doesn't make it one." And calling these people "Christian" doesn't make them so, either.
It puts me in mind of Lincoln's old riddle: If you call a dog's tail a leg, how many legs does a dog have?
The answer is "It has four legs. Calling a tail a leg doesn't make it one." And calling these people "Christian" doesn't make them so, either.
1
The political leanings of Christians are all over the map. If you know nothing about a person except that he's a Christian, you know nothing about his politics. It baffles me that those who are normally skeptical about the mainstream media buy uncritically the media stereotype of the the Christian as a Bible-thumping reactionary.
If the Bible-thumping reactionaries want to consider themselves the only Christians, that's their problem.
Meanwhile, jb, as C.S. Lewis would say, I prefer to consider them bad Christians rather than non-Christians.
As for you, RichWa, you're being the leftish counterpart of someone who drags Obama into every conversation, regardless of relevance.
If the Bible-thumping reactionaries want to consider themselves the only Christians, that's their problem.
Meanwhile, jb, as C.S. Lewis would say, I prefer to consider them bad Christians rather than non-Christians.
As for you, RichWa, you're being the leftish counterpart of someone who drags Obama into every conversation, regardless of relevance.
What is most troubling in all of this is that, just as nature abhors a vacuum, so does politics and foreign policy. Our foreign policy and foreign affairs are in an incredible mess, and others are rushing in to fill the voids we are leaving by our multiple failures to act decisively, or, in some cases, at all.
If we want to see our role in the world decline even more rapidly, then failing to implement the TPP is a perfect solution. China and others will be more than happy to move in and take over the role that we have abdicated.
Whether US jobs will suffer or not with the TPP is highly debatable. What is not debatable is that none of us will be very happy in a world where China writes the rules.
If we want to see our role in the world decline even more rapidly, then failing to implement the TPP is a perfect solution. China and others will be more than happy to move in and take over the role that we have abdicated.
Whether US jobs will suffer or not with the TPP is highly debatable. What is not debatable is that none of us will be very happy in a world where China writes the rules.
3
China already writes the rules, at least for this country. It is way past time that the U.S. levees broad and heavy tariffs against China.
2
You don't want to live in a world ruled by China and I don't want to live in a
world ruled by multi-national corporations. kudos to the Democrats that
stood up to Obama and his corporate masters. They're the real patriots.
world ruled by multi-national corporations. kudos to the Democrats that
stood up to Obama and his corporate masters. They're the real patriots.
3
..obviously, some have not done diligence to TTP-TTIP issue-this is no "trade deal"-yet that is way U.S. media is portraying-only 5 of 29 sections of TTP deal with "trade":
Sovereignty For International Investors (Trans-Pacific Partnership (TPP)):
http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2015/05/sovereignty-for-international-inv...
"ISDS [Investor-State Dispute Settlement] would allow foreign companies to challenge U.S. laws — and potentially to pick up huge payouts from taxpayers — without ever stepping foot in a U.S. court. Here’s how it would work. Imagine that the United States bans a toxic chemical that is often added to gasoline because of its health and environmental consequences. If a foreign company that makes the toxic chemical opposes the law, it would normally have to challenge it in a U.S. court. But with ISDS, the company could skip the U.S. courts and go before an international panel of arbitrators. If the company won, the ruling couldn’t be challenged in U.S. courts, and the arbitration panel could require American taxpayers to cough up millions — and even billions — of dollars in damages."
Sovereignty For International Investors (Trans-Pacific Partnership (TPP)):
http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2015/05/sovereignty-for-international-inv...
"ISDS [Investor-State Dispute Settlement] would allow foreign companies to challenge U.S. laws — and potentially to pick up huge payouts from taxpayers — without ever stepping foot in a U.S. court. Here’s how it would work. Imagine that the United States bans a toxic chemical that is often added to gasoline because of its health and environmental consequences. If a foreign company that makes the toxic chemical opposes the law, it would normally have to challenge it in a U.S. court. But with ISDS, the company could skip the U.S. courts and go before an international panel of arbitrators. If the company won, the ruling couldn’t be challenged in U.S. courts, and the arbitration panel could require American taxpayers to cough up millions — and even billions — of dollars in damages."
2
This is really bad news. China is jumping for joy today. I left the Republican Party because they went crazy. I can't join the Democratic Party because they can't get it right on trade. Where are the New Democrats?
2
We are independents. Todays Democrats are the Republicans of 25 years ago.
1
Yeah, that makes sense. We should be passing the trade bill because otherwise we "lose" to China.
You know what, Jay? As far as China goes, we've already lost. There's a reason why a huge swathe of Americans remain unemployed or under-employed, why we have a minimum wage that's insufficient to support normal costs of living, and why the major growth in jobs in America is in the service sectors and economy: We lost to China once we decided we should embrace them and have them join the WTO.
In what scenario do you see us "winning" against China? When _all_ this country is made up of a handful of tech and finance billionaires, and everyone else is handily employed to serve this moneyed nobility?
You know what, Jay? As far as China goes, we've already lost. There's a reason why a huge swathe of Americans remain unemployed or under-employed, why we have a minimum wage that's insufficient to support normal costs of living, and why the major growth in jobs in America is in the service sectors and economy: We lost to China once we decided we should embrace them and have them join the WTO.
In what scenario do you see us "winning" against China? When _all_ this country is made up of a handful of tech and finance billionaires, and everyone else is handily employed to serve this moneyed nobility?
2
We the American people have absolutely no input anymore. What we think and care about matter little or nothing at all even to the local reps we elect. It is all about business.
14
On this issue, close to the heart of American workers, the public should be able to view the trade bill in its entirety. Also, when this is endorsed any Republican based on their past record, I have serious doubts as to the benefits for the middle class and the working poor.
16
Writing here as a "consistent" if not always "dyed-in-the-wool" liberal, I'm satisfied President Obama appears to be having his lunch handed to him on this "trade deal", and where the whole "process" so far looks like something being planned and overseen by the CIA. Sadly, we are not that far-removed from where The Big Banks wrote a book on why American Capitalism cannot be trusted in leading a merry chase into economic chaos that spread around the world. What does the public know now that makes Monsanto or NIKE any different less than a decade later?
7
These "fair trade" deals stink. I'm about ready to become an isolationist. If we're going to look the other way when our trading "partners" manipulate their currencies, give sweetheart no interest loans to industries competing with ours and do all of the other junk that these crony capitalist economies do, then we should either do them too or, better yet, just walk away. The NAFTA deal stank and the result has been as the opponents predicted and think it would be the same with this one, too.
9
This is not about supporting or not supporting the President. This is about making the right decision for the people.
21
Maybe they may have listened to Fox news
The most disappointing part of this entire charade is the fact, that this deal, in spite of the efforts of millions, to get the details released for public review, actually got to the Senate for a vote.
This final American workforce destroying document was only eight (8) votes short of giving this President, millions of us supported, the wholly individual right to decide that it was the right thing to do, when even the most cursory of attempts to get a look at it, and only through leaks, clearly shows that it was, and likely still is, the latest attempt to further enrich the .01%ters, and their corporate allies, and beggar the rest of us.
Small wonder the 24/7/465 all-encompassing surveillance is critical to them; forewarned of our actions is tantamount to being forearmed.
This final American workforce destroying document was only eight (8) votes short of giving this President, millions of us supported, the wholly individual right to decide that it was the right thing to do, when even the most cursory of attempts to get a look at it, and only through leaks, clearly shows that it was, and likely still is, the latest attempt to further enrich the .01%ters, and their corporate allies, and beggar the rest of us.
Small wonder the 24/7/465 all-encompassing surveillance is critical to them; forewarned of our actions is tantamount to being forearmed.
24
Free Trade is probably a good thing. But most of our past trade deals were "Unfree Trade". Japan still refuses to import American products. South Korea has manipulated in order not to import American beef, autos and other products, even though S. Korean cars are everywhere on our roads. In China, American corporations must partner with Chinese corporations, which often steal American technology. Chinese government owned steel companies dump steel in America and compete unfairly with American companies.
Our national security has been imperiled by the loss of critical manufacturing. 80% of our pharmaceutical drugs are now made in India or China, where quality control is weak. We import all of our antibiotics. We no longer manufacture any large electrical transformers that are need to maintain our electrical grids.
The "Free Traders" don't seem to mind. When free trade was first sold to the American people, they were told that our workers would thrive in a new dynamic economy. It was a lie. The working class has been DEVASTATED and small cities across the country have lost their tax base by the loss of small manufacturing. Our government must listen to its working people, not just its corporations.
Our national security has been imperiled by the loss of critical manufacturing. 80% of our pharmaceutical drugs are now made in India or China, where quality control is weak. We import all of our antibiotics. We no longer manufacture any large electrical transformers that are need to maintain our electrical grids.
The "Free Traders" don't seem to mind. When free trade was first sold to the American people, they were told that our workers would thrive in a new dynamic economy. It was a lie. The working class has been DEVASTATED and small cities across the country have lost their tax base by the loss of small manufacturing. Our government must listen to its working people, not just its corporations.
45
OMG - spot on. succinct appraisal of a sad situation!
2
Hallowed Words of Yesterday Echoing The Truth of Today
At the dawn of our Republic hallowed words succinctly captured the essence which served as the foundation of our democracy.
Perhaps all the accusations, suspicions and rebuttals to TPP and President Obama's request for fast track authority should be summed up in a modern paraphrase to the immortal words given in a sermon in 1750;
No Authorization Without Public Examination.......
At the dawn of our Republic hallowed words succinctly captured the essence which served as the foundation of our democracy.
Perhaps all the accusations, suspicions and rebuttals to TPP and President Obama's request for fast track authority should be summed up in a modern paraphrase to the immortal words given in a sermon in 1750;
No Authorization Without Public Examination.......
20
It is just not plausible that large corporations and foreign governments have the best interests of the American people at heart. The lack of transparency is severely troubling ... that elected representatives can only view the agreement in a secure room and can not takes notes ... that alone should doom the agreement. There can not be informed public discussion and debate under these conditions.
Move this to a different venue ... would you, would anyone buy a car, sight unseen, selected by a group of people not known to have your best interests in mind, with the with the pictures, brochures, specifications all locked away in a secure room? I think not.
Move this to a different venue ... would you, would anyone buy a car, sight unseen, selected by a group of people not known to have your best interests in mind, with the with the pictures, brochures, specifications all locked away in a secure room? I think not.
24
Well done!
They keep this up and I may come back to the Democratic Party.
They keep this up and I may come back to the Democratic Party.
21
It's a shame to lose this agreement. He always blames someone else, now he eats his own - how sad. President Obama is an enigma when it comes down to relationships and negotiations with Congress and the Senate as a whole. He simply does not grasp what it takes to do deals - "compromise".
2
I voted for Obama twice. He apparently thinks his constituency is dumb. NAFTA and GATT were not good deals for the people of the United States. They cost huge numbers of jobs and provided no gains for our shrinking 'middle class'. President Obama hasn't studied that carefully; nor has he explained why Bill Clinton regrets, in his book, executing these deals. The TPP will only bring more woe to Americans. It's useful that the Senate Democrats understand that and will block him.
Plutocracy is not democracy. Obama is now a full-fledged plutocrat.
Plutocracy is not democracy. Obama is now a full-fledged plutocrat.
29
"He is now a full-fledged plutocrat"
True, except it requires a little qualification -
After being foolish enough, twice, to have been completely bamboozled by this character, I began to see, albeit too late, the original plan and reason why he was selected to be President.
One has to accept that in these "United" States, there are no independent political parties, instead there is the party of the .01%ters, who own and control it all.
But, critical to maintain the illusion, is the need to have the people (the masses) believe what they do, has some effect.
So, every few years, along comes their media mouthpieces, blitzing all of us with perception altering messages, contrived leaks, manufactured overseas conflict, divide and conquer tactics at home, ocassional wins in the inequality situation, engineered by the handlers of the next persona being selected, and on, and on, it continues.
To believe that the .01%ters would allow fate to interfere with their dominance is to believe in the tooth fairy.
Obama was selected, at precisely the right moment, to continue this brilliant charade.
True, except it requires a little qualification -
After being foolish enough, twice, to have been completely bamboozled by this character, I began to see, albeit too late, the original plan and reason why he was selected to be President.
One has to accept that in these "United" States, there are no independent political parties, instead there is the party of the .01%ters, who own and control it all.
But, critical to maintain the illusion, is the need to have the people (the masses) believe what they do, has some effect.
So, every few years, along comes their media mouthpieces, blitzing all of us with perception altering messages, contrived leaks, manufactured overseas conflict, divide and conquer tactics at home, ocassional wins in the inequality situation, engineered by the handlers of the next persona being selected, and on, and on, it continues.
To believe that the .01%ters would allow fate to interfere with their dominance is to believe in the tooth fairy.
Obama was selected, at precisely the right moment, to continue this brilliant charade.
3
You are too kind in your description of the president. He is a study of confusion.
1
So the man elected by "the People" has been foiled in his attempt to destroy the remaining brick and mortar jobs here. What a Wall Street stooge. We got through several hundred years as a nation without trade agreements. Enough is enough. The Asians will gladly enslave their people to help enslave ours. Meanwhile, the man, who in this case is a liberal, not some fat White Republican, laughs all the way to the bank. NAFTA, GATT, TPP, All pushed by Democrats. So give them your vote again, New York.
20
Actually, the U.S. has a long history of trade agreements, also known as treaties, since the Revolutionary period. The Treaty of Amity and Commerce between the United States and France was signed on February 6, 1778 and many others followed over the years.
1
Obama shows his true colors. This includes permission for Shell to drill in the Arctic.
Corporations rule.
Corporations rule.
32
The true colors of Reid and Schumer are not well known. Their actions against President Obama are pretty disgusting.
This is all about trust.
The Republicans have never trusted Obama and, now it seems, an increasing number of Democrats in and out of government do not trust him either.
Why the secrecy? If the TPP is such a great idea bring it out into the light of day.
To quote an old Russian proverb (and Ronald Reagan), trust but verify.
The Republicans have never trusted Obama and, now it seems, an increasing number of Democrats in and out of government do not trust him either.
Why the secrecy? If the TPP is such a great idea bring it out into the light of day.
To quote an old Russian proverb (and Ronald Reagan), trust but verify.
15
Face the truth, Dems: Barry just cannot govern!
7
And "under the bus" is where he belongs. In the entire article, there is not one statement about confusion over the basics of the TPP to which some Democrats object, which is the President's main argument. Hmmm! I guess calling Ms. Warren stupid was not the way to resolve things, and that looks more and more like his pattern. Mr. Brown seems correct when he says that the President has made this more personal than it need have been. Perhaps, Mr. Obama feels he owes more to Asia than to the USA.
15
Democracy is a messy business. 'Everyday Americans' -- the old middle class according to Hillary Clinton's newspeak -- are beginning to resist tailor made regional trade agreements. Updating Charles Erwin Wilson famous 50s quote about GM: what is good for corporations is no longer necessarily good for American workers.
18
What isn't getting enough coverage are the trade deal's behind the scenes defense department arrangements being made for US naval and air field military base locations in these countries. Our country gets to use these bases to support the neocon's chronic need to meddle in the affairs of other countries, those countries get manufacturing jobs for their people who are paid $3 a day, live in barracks and fed 4 bowls of rice a day, (which Romney thought was a good economic model during the last election) while American workers continue to lose good paying jobs.
And, every one of our presidents starting with Reagan has been paid millions of dollars once they got out of office by these same countries, with Clinton being the top payee at over 100 million.
And, every one of our presidents starting with Reagan has been paid millions of dollars once they got out of office by these same countries, with Clinton being the top payee at over 100 million.
22
I am a supporter of the President on most things, but not on this. The TPP needs to be an open process, with review and comment every step of the way.
Also, shame on Mr. Obama for his rude dismissal of Sen. Warren and other critics of this awful "trade" bill.
Also, shame on Mr. Obama for his rude dismissal of Sen. Warren and other critics of this awful "trade" bill.
31
As a nation with enough nuclear weaponry to remain free forever why are we maintaining the myth of bringing freedom to the world while our own citizens wallow in poverty?
This thought leads to isolationist consideration and while that is the implication is this an actual problem? Within the North and South American continents we have the natural resources, human talent and educational institutions to support us all. With no real need beyond the amorphous definition of "freedom" why must we police the world? While individual terrorists might, no nation or group of nations would ever consider an actual attack. With their nuclear weaponry no one considers an attack on North Korea or Pakistan. While the thought may be considered noble, bringing our concept of liberty might be better served by an intercontinental working example.
We can close all foreign military bases make trade agreements with our continental neighbors, stake out our borders and live in peace. If the rest of the world wants to have dust ups or emulate our model that is up to them.
Our incessant cycle of wars has not helped anyone anywhere and has only led to a drain on and diversion of our physical, mental and, odd for me to say it, spiritual resources. I think we have to stop what is clearly our thinly disguised bullying behavior, accept that others will have to evolve at their own pace and within reason provide a haven for those who wish to emigrate.
We are in an unmanageable position and have to change
This thought leads to isolationist consideration and while that is the implication is this an actual problem? Within the North and South American continents we have the natural resources, human talent and educational institutions to support us all. With no real need beyond the amorphous definition of "freedom" why must we police the world? While individual terrorists might, no nation or group of nations would ever consider an actual attack. With their nuclear weaponry no one considers an attack on North Korea or Pakistan. While the thought may be considered noble, bringing our concept of liberty might be better served by an intercontinental working example.
We can close all foreign military bases make trade agreements with our continental neighbors, stake out our borders and live in peace. If the rest of the world wants to have dust ups or emulate our model that is up to them.
Our incessant cycle of wars has not helped anyone anywhere and has only led to a drain on and diversion of our physical, mental and, odd for me to say it, spiritual resources. I think we have to stop what is clearly our thinly disguised bullying behavior, accept that others will have to evolve at their own pace and within reason provide a haven for those who wish to emigrate.
We are in an unmanageable position and have to change
19
How many more days before we can rid ourselves of this arrogant and duplicitous administration?
11
Look around. Globalization is hurting us. We don't have to exacerbate the system by giving other nations unfettered access to prized American markets without a quid pro quo protecting American labor and giving us unfettered access to foreign markets. We have been getting out lunch and dinner eaten regularly. NAFTA anyone? For once, I agree with Senator Warren. After WWII, the U.S. operated largely as an independent economy and did fine. Now, most of the products we purchase come from elsewhere.
40
I don't disagree with your sentiments and just want to point out that it is the same villain that is responsible for the issues and events affecting the American Workers conditions , Jobs and the effects of competition from cheaper markets with less costly labour.
The Corporation must be held responsible for most of it. Living in Australia we are very close to Asian markets and China and cannot compete at all in most manufacturing so have almost none, our big segments are Teaching IT Farming Mining...and heavily skewed to being a service economy. Our workers benefits, minimum wage, maternity sick leave free health care, make American working conditions, benefits and pay look like a 3rd world country and in the TPP zone you are NOT the top dog at all in most leading indicators as Australia, New Zealand, Singapore and Japan at least are far advanced and ahead of the U.S and is because your corporations control the rules, the pay ...so much..whereas in countries like Australia, New Zealand..the unions helped the worker and we enjoy a very healthy, happy and prosperous living down this way.But LAST THING WE WANT is your monster corporations trying to screw us in all the ways they can. So far we have told them what they must do to meet our standards...and they do (you guys should try it sometime!) minimum wage is A$22 (US$18 ) and casual Minimum wage is $22 +25% loading as casuals dont enjoy full time. Make them Pay, we do and they must and they still stay and make money...
The Corporation must be held responsible for most of it. Living in Australia we are very close to Asian markets and China and cannot compete at all in most manufacturing so have almost none, our big segments are Teaching IT Farming Mining...and heavily skewed to being a service economy. Our workers benefits, minimum wage, maternity sick leave free health care, make American working conditions, benefits and pay look like a 3rd world country and in the TPP zone you are NOT the top dog at all in most leading indicators as Australia, New Zealand, Singapore and Japan at least are far advanced and ahead of the U.S and is because your corporations control the rules, the pay ...so much..whereas in countries like Australia, New Zealand..the unions helped the worker and we enjoy a very healthy, happy and prosperous living down this way.But LAST THING WE WANT is your monster corporations trying to screw us in all the ways they can. So far we have told them what they must do to meet our standards...and they do (you guys should try it sometime!) minimum wage is A$22 (US$18 ) and casual Minimum wage is $22 +25% loading as casuals dont enjoy full time. Make them Pay, we do and they must and they still stay and make money...
1
Obama should have taken the high road with both AIIB and TPP. Instead, he tried to spoil China's AIIB party only to have it backfire. He should have stated his concerns about China's approach and left it to the free world to decide. Now, the United States looks like a pouting child abandoned by best friends. With TPP, it should have been all about trade, jobs and nothing more. He should have laid out factual arguments about how it improved our economy. Instead, he played the China card again and sold us fear. The TPP should never have been about poking China in the eye. Another consequence of this? It is now obvious that the "Pivot to Asia" is ALL about containing China. Stop with the rhetoric about all the Pacific is big enough for everyone to prosper when its just another disingenuous statement.
7
Great news, and congratulations to all the senators who voted against this abomination. Can it be that the Democrats have found their backbone?
And now to stop the TTIP in Europe!
And now to stop the TTIP in Europe!
19
Tired of secret agreements heralded as good for American "interests", without the support of real people . Maybe Hillary can do a better job explaining what these agreements really mean and what they would bring for ordinary Americans and their children: less and less jobs, less and less means to pay for education, less and less investments in infrastructure in America, less and less affordable housing. Is she in favor of more secrecy and more negotiations over our heads?
9
Obama's push on this TPP is almost as bad as trying to put Social Security on the table for his Grand Bargain with Republicans. Republicans were a little slow to pick up on that and this time the Dems actually came through. Almost hard to believe.
11
Obama doesn't seem to realize that Warren and Bernie Sanders are the two politicians today that people actually listen to respect. There's something about hearing the truth, esp against usual backdrop of posturing and partisan rhetoric, that reminds us truth is powerful even when whispered, also that we don't have to be sold up the river if we wake up to what's going on.
I'm so disappointed in Obama pushing this w/o answering serious questions. We can take the answers. Must we do it to stay in the game? Will we lose jobs, if so, how many and then what? Tell us the truth.
Hearing Mitch go to bat for the president was disorienting, but further proof this is a bad treaty. He's never backed Obama on even little things.
Pres.Obama--what will be your legacy? Drilling in the Arctic, TPP, US workers at lowest wages and no safety net? This is Republicans agenda.
You've lost your way. Corporations and the MIC have made a pod person out of you. Explain to us, the people, why on earth we should believe your "trust me" over Warren's specifics on this.
Your comment on her being "just a politician"....not only not smart, you should have been able to bring her on board if it's good treaty. She's a politican but not a crony capitalist, nor Bernie. The people know this hence the trust in them, but erodes it in you. Boo.
I'm so disappointed in Obama pushing this w/o answering serious questions. We can take the answers. Must we do it to stay in the game? Will we lose jobs, if so, how many and then what? Tell us the truth.
Hearing Mitch go to bat for the president was disorienting, but further proof this is a bad treaty. He's never backed Obama on even little things.
Pres.Obama--what will be your legacy? Drilling in the Arctic, TPP, US workers at lowest wages and no safety net? This is Republicans agenda.
You've lost your way. Corporations and the MIC have made a pod person out of you. Explain to us, the people, why on earth we should believe your "trust me" over Warren's specifics on this.
Your comment on her being "just a politician"....not only not smart, you should have been able to bring her on board if it's good treaty. She's a politican but not a crony capitalist, nor Bernie. The people know this hence the trust in them, but erodes it in you. Boo.
24
The GOP is unanimously for it, Elizabeth Warren is resolutely against it. Tells me all I need to know. I trust her and would bring an umbrella and galoshes if the Repubs swore up and down that it was sunny.
20
Both Sens. Elizabeth Warren (D-MA) and Jeff Sessions (R-AL) have called on Pres. Obama to allow the American Public to know what's in the bill. That speaks volumes. Why all the secrecy?
So once again, it's 'Just pass it already, so we can see what's in it!!' Oh wait, a different party controlled Congress then. Oops...
So once again, it's 'Just pass it already, so we can see what's in it!!' Oh wait, a different party controlled Congress then. Oops...
7
Just wait till the Iran deal comes to fruition,......
2
Constant references to the Affordable Care Act and any alleged secrecy are starting to get on my nerves. Absolutely anybody and everybody could know everything in the ACA down to the last jot and tittle long before it was voted on. There was no secrecy involved. Obama begged the Republicans to participate in "improving" this Republican inspired law. I gather that somewhere along the way somebody, maybe Nancy Pelosi, made the frequently quoted comment or something like it. If so she must have been quoted out of context or she was just flat out wrong. The TPP, on the other hand, is classified.
2
Jonathan Weisman wrote that President Obama has singled out "Senator Elizabeth Warren of Massachusetts for her role in opposing the accord." Indeed, as Paul Kane wrote in an article appearing in yesterdays' Washington Post,
"What began with a slight jab at Warren’s trade views — 'She’s wrong on this,' Obama told MSNBC three weeks ago — has escalated into a series of daily barbs and retorts carried out on cable TV and Internet interviews, on radio shows and from the official podium at the White House. Over the weekend, Obama used a rather harsh turn of phrase — “a politician like everybody else”
These provocative statements prompted a counterattack by Warren in the form of an interview in The Post in which the feisty senator gave a brilliant refutation of President Obama's claims about AFTA. In particular, she addressed the key issue of secrecy with the remark "The president has committed only to letting the public see this deal after Congress votes to authorize fast track. At that point it will be impossible for us to amend the agreement or to block any part of it without tanking the whole TPP."
Picking a fight with Elizabeth Warren was about the dumbest thing the White House could have done; she is not only the nations' most popular progressive, she can also present her views in a clear and compelling manner—a talent President Obama seems to have lost.
"What began with a slight jab at Warren’s trade views — 'She’s wrong on this,' Obama told MSNBC three weeks ago — has escalated into a series of daily barbs and retorts carried out on cable TV and Internet interviews, on radio shows and from the official podium at the White House. Over the weekend, Obama used a rather harsh turn of phrase — “a politician like everybody else”
These provocative statements prompted a counterattack by Warren in the form of an interview in The Post in which the feisty senator gave a brilliant refutation of President Obama's claims about AFTA. In particular, she addressed the key issue of secrecy with the remark "The president has committed only to letting the public see this deal after Congress votes to authorize fast track. At that point it will be impossible for us to amend the agreement or to block any part of it without tanking the whole TPP."
Picking a fight with Elizabeth Warren was about the dumbest thing the White House could have done; she is not only the nations' most popular progressive, she can also present her views in a clear and compelling manner—a talent President Obama seems to have lost.
16
Every pease read between the lines. The only reason President Obama is singling out and attacking Elizabeth Warren is she is the only qualified democratic contender that could pose problem to Hillary Clinton nomination for president in the primaries. His attacking Elizabeth Warren is political pay back by Obama forHillary supporting him in his last election. This clearly is the first preemptive strike by the Clintons via the president who in turn will mirror the Clunton with a new quasi Obama charitable foundation funded by China.
1
Rob, I know that Obama supports Hillary, but, if he is attacking Elizabeth Warren with the aim of helping Clinton, then he must be something dumber than dumb: The attacks have cast Senator Warren in the role as the champion in the fight against a retrograde and unpopular trade bill—if Warren is planning to run, she couldn't have asked for anything better than being attacked by the President on this issue.
3
A deal is good or bad, not because of whether the details are great or not, but when compared to the alternatives. Without a TPP, the status quo will either continue, or China will become an even greater force. None of the wish lists on the opponents' agenda will occur. This is quite similar to the Iran nuclear agreement. It is not whether the agreement on its own is great or not, but what are the alternatives.
I'm a big fan of Elizabeth Warren, but in this situation, her allies seem to have taken a page out of the Netanyahu / Cotton playbook. The obstruction may end up being the single most damaging action or non-action on future US trade.
In the Iran deal, the Republicans claimed they didn't trust this President. In the TPP, the Democrats are saying 'we don't trust our own President.'
You can't have it both ways.
I'm a big fan of Elizabeth Warren, but in this situation, her allies seem to have taken a page out of the Netanyahu / Cotton playbook. The obstruction may end up being the single most damaging action or non-action on future US trade.
In the Iran deal, the Republicans claimed they didn't trust this President. In the TPP, the Democrats are saying 'we don't trust our own President.'
You can't have it both ways.
2
Are you kidding me, a trade deal that is classified behind steel doors saying "no public or press beyond this point?"
Senator Warren says it's a bad deal for the American people. Given her research credentials I'm going with her.
President Obama, you are a huge disappointment.
Senator Warren says it's a bad deal for the American people. Given her research credentials I'm going with her.
President Obama, you are a huge disappointment.
15
Without China,there is no sense of existence for US. What a pity as a country and as her citizen.
1
"Trust me on this" just as I approve Shell Oil drilling in the Arctic? Sorry, you're going to have to do better than that, Mr. President.
11
This very complicated issue stinks of international mayhem.
You've got Republicans supporting "enhanced" trade superiority and Democrats complaining about the anti-socialist capitalism of it all. You also have the corporates shouting for deregulation of trade law so they can privately establish trade lines with minimal tax and tariff. We also have utility companies digging, drilling, fracking etc. in everybody's backyards' looking for anything of value. There are so many snakes you can hardly see the grass anymore. A major concern is China's labor force. China will continue to drive the labor bids down to near nothing and come out on top financially. If anyone hasn't noticed, China's currency is gaining value compared to the American dollar and Euro. The past 10 years have been the setup for a cliff-dive in superpower currency. Isn't it obvious that raising the minimum wage will only lead to a more diluted value of the dollar? Segue to printing money? Worst idea ever. This whole international commerce law needs completely formatted, thrown out, and rebuilt from the foundation up. Trade deals with countries should start over fresh and simple again; then adjust to work out the bugs of the system.
I digress, there should not be any focus on trade uniformity at the international level. This world is too diverse to waste money and time on the enigma machine. It's time to get back to the handshake folks. Cheers!
You've got Republicans supporting "enhanced" trade superiority and Democrats complaining about the anti-socialist capitalism of it all. You also have the corporates shouting for deregulation of trade law so they can privately establish trade lines with minimal tax and tariff. We also have utility companies digging, drilling, fracking etc. in everybody's backyards' looking for anything of value. There are so many snakes you can hardly see the grass anymore. A major concern is China's labor force. China will continue to drive the labor bids down to near nothing and come out on top financially. If anyone hasn't noticed, China's currency is gaining value compared to the American dollar and Euro. The past 10 years have been the setup for a cliff-dive in superpower currency. Isn't it obvious that raising the minimum wage will only lead to a more diluted value of the dollar? Segue to printing money? Worst idea ever. This whole international commerce law needs completely formatted, thrown out, and rebuilt from the foundation up. Trade deals with countries should start over fresh and simple again; then adjust to work out the bugs of the system.
I digress, there should not be any focus on trade uniformity at the international level. This world is too diverse to waste money and time on the enigma machine. It's time to get back to the handshake folks. Cheers!
Impeding the evolution of our economy, all in the name of "Progressive" politics. It is sad to see "Progressive" Democrats opposing free trade measures that will unleash the true economic power of the US.
NAFTA has made Mexico into one of our most important trading partners and has transformed them into an economic powerhouse. Were it not for NAFT all of those automobile manufactoring jobs would have gone to China, with no economic rewards coming back to the US.
What the"progressives" fail to recognize is that we will NEVER be able to compete with China, Vietnam or India for unskilled manufacoring jobs. In fact we should not be seeking increases in these types of jobs. The greatest value in global markets will come from jobs that create innovation. We need to do every thing possible to maintain the US' competitve advantage in iinnovation.
Once we begin loosing the creative jobs we will no longer be able to support our social welfare systems. Someone needs to take a good hard look at how much of our taxbase comesfrom the likes of Apple, Google, Microsoft and then figure out how to help them be more competitive.
The prospect of Bernie in the Whitehouse is truly freightening!
NAFTA has made Mexico into one of our most important trading partners and has transformed them into an economic powerhouse. Were it not for NAFT all of those automobile manufactoring jobs would have gone to China, with no economic rewards coming back to the US.
What the"progressives" fail to recognize is that we will NEVER be able to compete with China, Vietnam or India for unskilled manufacoring jobs. In fact we should not be seeking increases in these types of jobs. The greatest value in global markets will come from jobs that create innovation. We need to do every thing possible to maintain the US' competitve advantage in iinnovation.
Once we begin loosing the creative jobs we will no longer be able to support our social welfare systems. Someone needs to take a good hard look at how much of our taxbase comesfrom the likes of Apple, Google, Microsoft and then figure out how to help them be more competitive.
The prospect of Bernie in the Whitehouse is truly freightening!
3
Progressives are seriously misguided on trade. They think that by stopping it they will protect jobs. They fail to realize that there is not stopping it.
They are operating from fear and seek to turn back the clock with each new trade agreement. And Warren is playing off their fears like a demagogue. The worst of the worst. Now, democrats are running scared.
Unfortunately, President Obama, instead of using his "great gifts" to explain why this makes sense, does what he always does. He insults those who challenge him. Whatever was he thinking for failing to anticipate this backlash from the leftwing Warren?
They are operating from fear and seek to turn back the clock with each new trade agreement. And Warren is playing off their fears like a demagogue. The worst of the worst. Now, democrats are running scared.
Unfortunately, President Obama, instead of using his "great gifts" to explain why this makes sense, does what he always does. He insults those who challenge him. Whatever was he thinking for failing to anticipate this backlash from the leftwing Warren?
1
Why do you think we can't compete? Is it because the "Progressives" who run and fund Wall St. could care less about Americans? I think. The funny thing is, the wealthy bond traders and arbitragers from Chappaqua and Greenwich could care less about a single American job, just their own.
One can manufacture everything here, in Texas or any other state without "3 men in a room." Our stupid, ponderous tax scheme in NYS makes it impossible to compete, but not so in the South.
One can manufacture everything here, in Texas or any other state without "3 men in a room." Our stupid, ponderous tax scheme in NYS makes it impossible to compete, but not so in the South.
AACNY (and Rex), you are wrong when you say progressives want to protect low wage jobs. If you look at quotes from Warren, Sanders or Brown, they are saying that low wage workers need some protections (re-training, tuition support, relocation) when their jobs are outsourced due to these trade agreements.
And, corporations like Apple, Google, Microsoft, Amazon, IBM, whose intellectual property/patents will be better protected and more profitable as a result of PTT should pay some of the cost of outsourced jobs. Instead, we've let these corporations outsource their intellectual capital (really just the profits) to avoid paying US taxes. That's not fair to US taxpayers. And it will not be fair until the US law ratifying TPP contains provisions to help workers that lose their jobs with a reasonable transition into another job
And, corporations like Apple, Google, Microsoft, Amazon, IBM, whose intellectual property/patents will be better protected and more profitable as a result of PTT should pay some of the cost of outsourced jobs. Instead, we've let these corporations outsource their intellectual capital (really just the profits) to avoid paying US taxes. That's not fair to US taxpayers. And it will not be fair until the US law ratifying TPP contains provisions to help workers that lose their jobs with a reasonable transition into another job
It is difficult to understand why the TTP as well as the TTIP (Trans-Atlantic mirror agreement in negotiation) need be hidden from the public but for any other reason clear in my mind: the middle classes in the US and in Europe will pay the price to facilitate big business and multinationals in general.
It's all about optimizing the cost of labor with yet another frightening angle, if national and once sovereign policies infringe on business ability to effect that optimization the corporations will be able to sue the sovereign nation - so the corporation adds a "citizen" dimension after buying the polis with Citizens United.
It leads me to wonder if David Cameron's intention to advance the Brexit referendum is not a dovetail with the TTIP, for once enacted the UK has little need to be part of the European Union when the corporation reigns through trade agreements.
It's all about optimizing the cost of labor with yet another frightening angle, if national and once sovereign policies infringe on business ability to effect that optimization the corporations will be able to sue the sovereign nation - so the corporation adds a "citizen" dimension after buying the polis with Citizens United.
It leads me to wonder if David Cameron's intention to advance the Brexit referendum is not a dovetail with the TTIP, for once enacted the UK has little need to be part of the European Union when the corporation reigns through trade agreements.
9
Let's hope it doesn't end up being too good to be true.
The situation is simple. You don't buy a pig in a poke. The president should make public the TPP agreement before any vote on fast track.
His insulting response to Sen. Warren shows an ugly side of our president, a very ugly side.
As he is getting ready to leave the presidency the president is lining up with Big Money. This is all a long way from what the man pretended to be in 2008.
The situation is simple. You don't buy a pig in a poke. The president should make public the TPP agreement before any vote on fast track.
His insulting response to Sen. Warren shows an ugly side of our president, a very ugly side.
As he is getting ready to leave the presidency the president is lining up with Big Money. This is all a long way from what the man pretended to be in 2008.
17
You didn't watch the Obama v Romney debates? He was the same small, petty, mean spirited man then that he is today.
2
It is a great irony that a President who owes his office to the support of progressive Democrats should show such contempt for them and their policies.
13
Irony? Well... he's just a politician.
1
The Republicans said, join the military, innovate, be entrepreneurial, open a factory abroad. Because stuff built abroad costs us less. And we can use the savings to buy luxury goods from, well, yes, also abroad. Not to mention luxury goods made in the USA.
The Democrats said get a government job, go to school, get a teaching job, join the entitlement class, open a factory abroad. Because stuff built there costs us less. See also: what the Republicans have been doing.
Free trade has been sold by, and to, the ruling classes for decades. It has enriched the lives of trust fund babies, middle managers, senior executives, and anyone who knows what an investment portfolio means to a happy retirement.
The American working class got stiffed. The upward path to the American dream, often via union jobs, got hammered. The lower middle class simply became the lower class. Free trade meant world peace, and world profits, even if the average American worker wound up dead on the battlefield of good jobs with good pay.
Now the culprits, and the heirs to the original culprits, are jockeying for political advantage before the 2016 election. All except for the President.
He's jockeying for future donations to the Barack H. Obama Foundation.
The rest is just commentary. Nothing to see here. Move along.
The Democrats said get a government job, go to school, get a teaching job, join the entitlement class, open a factory abroad. Because stuff built there costs us less. See also: what the Republicans have been doing.
Free trade has been sold by, and to, the ruling classes for decades. It has enriched the lives of trust fund babies, middle managers, senior executives, and anyone who knows what an investment portfolio means to a happy retirement.
The American working class got stiffed. The upward path to the American dream, often via union jobs, got hammered. The lower middle class simply became the lower class. Free trade meant world peace, and world profits, even if the average American worker wound up dead on the battlefield of good jobs with good pay.
Now the culprits, and the heirs to the original culprits, are jockeying for political advantage before the 2016 election. All except for the President.
He's jockeying for future donations to the Barack H. Obama Foundation.
The rest is just commentary. Nothing to see here. Move along.
9
Thank God! For once the Democrats are looking after the interests of the middle class. I work in Asia - the land of cheap labor, no environmental laws, no workers comp laws - no nothing. In Vietnam, factor workers earn 76 USD per month. In the Philippines, the average wage is $300 per month. This trade deal would have reduced us to what Asia has - which is nothing.
13
If it's such a great deal why doesn't he go on the air to the people and explain it? Either it isn't or he would rather engage in his usual smear tactics. Currency manipulation is a bad thing. That would make the US non-competitive should another country devalue its currency to grab work.
2
Let's compare USA with Germany. What trade pacts have the Germans signed? They still manufacture most German goods and Chinese love to buy German products. Why should Chinese buy American brands if they are made by Chinese? They know what goes in and what comes out. And, you knew what happened with American manufacturing. Asia is a big region with lots of hardworking people. Why should anyone believe the Chinese will only open factories in China, instead of Vietnam or the Philippines? Just look at Africa and South America. If we lost the shirts on our back, it's because our big corporations are too greedy for maximal profit. Perhaps we should learn something from Germany. "GERMANY’S midsized manufacturers, collectively known as the Mittelstand, are often praised as a group for providing the backbone of the world’s fourth-largest economy." - Schumpeter, German lessons, the Economist
8
In one of many interviews President Obama gave touting this terrible agreement, he said (and I am paraphrasing) that we are no longer a manufacturing economy. He inferred that everyone needed college to get a better job.
I just want to know what on earth jobs he's talking about that we have left in this country in such abundance. Everyone from telemarketing sales people to engineers (yes, I know several who have lost out to engineers on the payroll of Chinese factories) to graphic artists (went with the marketing departments to places where the printers can do it cheaper) to customer service representatives has found their jobs outsourced along with the manufacturing jobs.
Have you tried selling your Nike sneakers and iNonsense to the people who produce them for slave wages? Didn't think so. Someone somewhere in government and big business needs to wake the heck up. People who can't make money can't buy your products. And Americans have been sinking into that group for decades now.
I just want to know what on earth jobs he's talking about that we have left in this country in such abundance. Everyone from telemarketing sales people to engineers (yes, I know several who have lost out to engineers on the payroll of Chinese factories) to graphic artists (went with the marketing departments to places where the printers can do it cheaper) to customer service representatives has found their jobs outsourced along with the manufacturing jobs.
Have you tried selling your Nike sneakers and iNonsense to the people who produce them for slave wages? Didn't think so. Someone somewhere in government and big business needs to wake the heck up. People who can't make money can't buy your products. And Americans have been sinking into that group for decades now.
13
That's right. It is not possible to produce goods paying Asian wages and sell them to people earning American wages forever -- if something can't go on forever, then eventually it will stop. The world will eventually move back towards balanced trade. I'm just afraid that making that inevitable adjustment may entail enormous economic disruption.
2
Having failed to share details of the trade deal with the Congress and his own party, particularly relating to the sensitive currency manipulation and environmental issues, on which the Congress members of both the parties seemed more concerned, President Obama himself has brought himself to this awkward situation where Congress refuses to consider the Pacific trade deal legislation.
18
“This is not a game. This is about trying to accomplish something important for the country that happens to be the president’s No. 1 domestic priority,” Senator Mitch McConnell, Republican of Kentucky and majority leader, said.
Senator John Thune of South Dakota, the Senate Republican conference chairman, said Democrats were “throwing their own president under the bus.”
They're both "dead" wrong. The Democrats' actions today are attempts to support the continued existence of the middle class. That should be the President's and Congress' No. 1 priority in light of increasing inequality in the US. That middle class elected Obama President, and made the .01% as wealthy as they are today.
Contrarily, Obama and the Republicans are trying to throw the middle class further under the bus, by enabling our own big biz, big banks, big pharma and big ag to do just that, by enhancing their own legal rights, profits and personal wealth exponentially, to the detriment of the legal rights of the middle and impoverished classes, and exponentially increasing inequality in the US even further.
The rest of America and the Americans deserve priority to be benefitted before the rest of the world and the .01%, with any TPA and the TPP!
Senator John Thune of South Dakota, the Senate Republican conference chairman, said Democrats were “throwing their own president under the bus.”
They're both "dead" wrong. The Democrats' actions today are attempts to support the continued existence of the middle class. That should be the President's and Congress' No. 1 priority in light of increasing inequality in the US. That middle class elected Obama President, and made the .01% as wealthy as they are today.
Contrarily, Obama and the Republicans are trying to throw the middle class further under the bus, by enabling our own big biz, big banks, big pharma and big ag to do just that, by enhancing their own legal rights, profits and personal wealth exponentially, to the detriment of the legal rights of the middle and impoverished classes, and exponentially increasing inequality in the US even further.
The rest of America and the Americans deserve priority to be benefitted before the rest of the world and the .01%, with any TPA and the TPP!
20
If Senator Warren is against it, I'm against it.
40
And if Mitch McConnell is for it I'm against it.
4
Reading these posts, I am reminded of the Chinese saying, “Three men make a tiger,” which is an example of the “bandwagon effect,” or argumentum ad populum. This logical fallacy is based on the principle that if many people believe a premise, that premise must be correct.
Now if there is a group of qualified people who know what they’re talking about, their opinion should not necessarily be ignored. Nevertheless, the appeal to authority, ad verecundiam, is the weakest form of argument according to Boethius.
Has any member of congress read the entire TPP as it now stands? Apparently not. What the public are hearing are dribs and drabs. Bad as the treaty may be, I am suspicious of remarks like “If X is opposed, so am I.” Even Homer sometimes nods.
Now if there is a group of qualified people who know what they’re talking about, their opinion should not necessarily be ignored. Nevertheless, the appeal to authority, ad verecundiam, is the weakest form of argument according to Boethius.
Has any member of congress read the entire TPP as it now stands? Apparently not. What the public are hearing are dribs and drabs. Bad as the treaty may be, I am suspicious of remarks like “If X is opposed, so am I.” Even Homer sometimes nods.
To all those demanding that the President publish the agreement now, or claiming that our Republic is victorious today because it shot down a secretive bill, let me be (apparently) the first to tell you that the President cannot simply publish an international trade agreement in which nations with which our alliances are tenuous yet absolutely necessary (China) have skin in the game. It would be a terrible violation of international trade regulations and the basic trust between negotiating nations for him to do so before all agreements are in place. Secondly, the accusation that the President is withholding the bill is inherently incorrect anyway--fast track authority that Democrats absolutely should have given the President today would NOT have allowed him to pass an unseen bill. Instead, it would have given him the authority to complete negotiations and publish (and not sign into law) the bill BEFORE a vote by Congress. The President would have published the deal on the internet for anyone in the world to view, Congress would have had as long as it needed to debate the bill, and ONLY THEN, when it had been released and debated and passed, would the President have signed it into law.
I have to wonder why this has not been made clear in this article.
I have to wonder why this has not been made clear in this article.
14
The facts destroy your argument. You say that fast track just gives the President to complete negotiations. That is not all it does. Fast track requires the United States Congress to introduce and vote on the bill for implementing the TPP with minimal debate and no amendments, with the entire process taking no more than 90 days.
Get that: Minimal debate. NO amendments. NO more than 90 days. That is not democracy. It's the beginning of a new and toxic phase of corporate dominance of our democracy. It would be Obama's legacy. I don't want it!
Get that: Minimal debate. NO amendments. NO more than 90 days. That is not democracy. It's the beginning of a new and toxic phase of corporate dominance of our democracy. It would be Obama's legacy. I don't want it!
2
Perhaps this should have been made clear by our President or for that matter anyone else who had access to this information. The NYT is neither an arm of the government nor is Mr. Weisman an agent for it; or so I am led to believe.
While it appears our government may be fast approaching a benevolent dictatorship, and secrecy of the nature surrounding this not quite so free trade bill appears to qualify it for imposition of some government secrets act, we are fortunately not quite there yet. It may be that on occasion, in order to cut down the wait time in the unemployment line and the ongoing purchase of body bags, we could do with some good old fashioned American isolationism.
While it appears our government may be fast approaching a benevolent dictatorship, and secrecy of the nature surrounding this not quite so free trade bill appears to qualify it for imposition of some government secrets act, we are fortunately not quite there yet. It may be that on occasion, in order to cut down the wait time in the unemployment line and the ongoing purchase of body bags, we could do with some good old fashioned American isolationism.
1
Nice try, Gabe, but as a resident of an area that lost over 20,000 well-paying jobs when a President decided to make maquiladoras an English word that all of us in manufacturing knew well, you'll excuse me if everytime I hear fast-track and TPP I also hear NAFTA. And quite frankly, unless the details are released so I can see for myself how many more jobs are going to be shipped out-of-country, NAFTA is really all I need to know.
I saw Chris Matthews and Ed Rendell, two big-city Philly boys, trying to defend this fast-track on Hardball last night. Ed talked about "free trade" and just sneered at those who oppose TPP. Well, Ed, we are not opposed to trade; we know it's essential. But let's get straight on one thing: we want fair trade, we want it to be considered diligently. Free trade seems like an oxymoron to me anyway.
I saw Chris Matthews and Ed Rendell, two big-city Philly boys, trying to defend this fast-track on Hardball last night. Ed talked about "free trade" and just sneered at those who oppose TPP. Well, Ed, we are not opposed to trade; we know it's essential. But let's get straight on one thing: we want fair trade, we want it to be considered diligently. Free trade seems like an oxymoron to me anyway.
2
No examination, no deliberation, good on congress. As unilaterally focused on the corporations that drive the politics in this country as I suspect the TPP to be, I gotta give props to this vote, as surprised I am to say such a thing about this our current legislature. Governments, and their impact on our future should never be creating law that transfers regulatory power to corporate interests; and as well as I understand it, and why, the subjugation of American workers to the absolute of "market conditions". Regardless of the inevitability of that latter statement the citizens of a given country, sovereignty over laws and regulation, of any given participation country have no place in my acceptable understanding of how modern geopolitical macroeconomic policy should be adapted. I'm on board to the extent that I accept a changing and evolving globalized world, but I'll be dammed to be sued for the institutions, regulations and law my elected government puts in place. I get it, its a changing global landscape, but in this particular decision, and if only for their bruised egos, I happy the vote; for at least another minute, keeps the fox from running the hen house!
17
His foreign policy is an unmitigated disaster but at least Obama has some domestic success. Oh, wait, never mind. Jimmy Carter is smiling tonight, he knows he will no longer be considered the worst president in our lifetimes.
10
Only a delusional right wing ideologue thinks that Obama and Carter were our worst presidents.
1
Senator Thune should be aware the President is the Republican's President as well as the Democrat's. In fact he is considered by many, perhaps all, to be president of our whole nation. I just wish he was more aware of that fact when he springs up the steps of the Capitol.
2
Yet another in the incredibly long list of Obama betrayals of liberals and the promises that got him elected. As many have said, this secret, classified "trade" bill consolidates corporate power over whats left of our democracy.
28
Another Obama sellout to the multinationals and the one-percenters. Who'd have though this in 2008?
25
You are sadly missinformed as to what drives our economy. The tax dollars that fuel our social welfare programs don't come from the likes of General Motors or that clothing manufactorer in the South. Our real economic power comes from technological innovation and if we loose sight of that you will find that we can no longer support the social welfare programs upon which so many Americans depend........
1
In 2008 Obama was still a mystery to many. Of course, you might have learned something by 2012....
1
I did, and I wasn't the only one. Senator Obama showed his true colors when he supported the corporate revisions to the bankruptcy laws.
2
The democrats in the Senate are isolationists -- or perhaps racists. The TPP accord is with Asian allies we need to support and strengthen our ties with. Opposing it is a lost opportunity.
China will of course be grateful and relieved if TPP fails, as it will show the U.S. is incapable of supporting our friends in the region. China will gladly fill the void we leave open.
Stupid.
China will of course be grateful and relieved if TPP fails, as it will show the U.S. is incapable of supporting our friends in the region. China will gladly fill the void we leave open.
Stupid.
4
Wrong. In Communist China there is no differentiation between corporations and the government. As soon as this passes, China will do us in with currency manipulation, just for starters.
Opposing TPP is not stupid. What is stupid is sacrificing jobs and American health and welfare on the altar of multinational profits. So what if CEO's make bigger bucks on the back of outsourcing to Vietnam (eliminating American jobs)? So what if Big Pharma gets the ability to enforce its drug patents in some poor countries? Here's a tip. The fortunes of the top 1 tenth of one per cent that benefit from such globalization are no longer connected to the rest of the American economy, where most of us live. They do not have the right to keep shafting us with these welfare destroying trade pacts.
2
China will jump on this!
If we continue to sacrifice the global innovative advantages that Google, Apple, Microsoft, Exxon, GE, and many others have created for the sake of a few thousand unskilled labor jobs we will sink our economic prowess!
The populist rehtoric sounds great and it buys votes but at the end of the day it is Google, Apple and the other leaders in global innovation that are fueling our economy and paying for our social welfare programs.......
If we continue to sacrifice the global innovative advantages that Google, Apple, Microsoft, Exxon, GE, and many others have created for the sake of a few thousand unskilled labor jobs we will sink our economic prowess!
The populist rehtoric sounds great and it buys votes but at the end of the day it is Google, Apple and the other leaders in global innovation that are fueling our economy and paying for our social welfare programs.......
I'm opposed to any bill whose provisions are kept secret from the public. This is absolutely the wrong way for a democracy to work. I urge every senator to vote NO until the bill is published, and people have a chance to critique it.
17
I'm not a big fan of Obama myself but he is smart if nothing else. He understand the overwhelming economic advantages that will accrues to the US if we are able to compete on a level paying field and our intellectual rights are protected....
Rex: If the trade agreement is a good deal for the U.S. and our workers, that's fine. But I object to secret deals whose details are known by our trading partners (and adversaries) but which is kept secret from the American public. After 10 years of negotiating, it's time to reveal what it says.
This reminds me of the Obamacare bill where Pelosi said "We have to pass it to find out what's in it."
This reminds me of the Obamacare bill where Pelosi said "We have to pass it to find out what's in it."
1
Reality check its about time those who serve in office do so in good faith of people . Government spending has been out of control last 6 years mainly used to purchase imports like computors made in china cell phone an lap tops printers ect ect ect . All of which use to be made in usa with people who paid taxs to our government. Spending run up huge debt an cause trillion in obligation to entitlements for unemployed or under employed. With employment levels at pre depression levels with record number people with out job . 400000 people month retiring from jobs pay living wage gone unfilled every month replaced with miniumin wage jobs.No wonder we are indebted to china they now own us an are kids future
2
Who exactly did we elect, when we voted in Obama, because it certainly is not the man who sits in the White House now! Drilling in the Antarctic, drone strikes, bailing out banks, the Patriot Act, and now TPP, what progressives want any of this, NOT ME.
24
The Progressives would support protecting low paying manufactoring jobs while closing the Asian Markets to our high tech global leaders.... Terrible shortsighted.
Not often that I trust Obama to look after the economic interests of our country but this is one where he needs the power to negotiate!
Not often that I trust Obama to look after the economic interests of our country but this is one where he needs the power to negotiate!
I hope my Democratic Party's next presidential candidate runs on a message like this: "Let's try a president who's a real Democrat, not Democrat-lite, apologetic Democrat, sleight-of-hand Democrat or Demopublican."
25
If you run a candidate who's a "real Democrat," you will lose the election. You'll maintain your purity and your self-righteousness, but you'll lose the election.
Great! That should be every bit as successful as the Labour Party in the recent UK elections!
For those with a long memory, we tried that with McGovern and Dukakis and you see where that got us. Although I must agree I'd like to see a real progressive Democrat not a Clinton-like Republicrat.
Again no mention of investor state dispute settlement, ISDS. And we are supposed to take the NY Times seriously?
What American workers need is tariffs, the last thing multinationals would stand for. So it really is class war: American workers versus multinational corporations who are making a play to nullify American sovereignty itself.
What American workers need is tariffs, the last thing multinationals would stand for. So it really is class war: American workers versus multinational corporations who are making a play to nullify American sovereignty itself.
42
Bill, you aren't the only one with a green screen.
The proposed text of the TPP should not be classified; rather, the American people deserve a robust debate about this proposed pact. The American people have every right to read and question its every detail, given both its enormous scale and the disastrous consequences of earlier trade pacts such as NAFTA. NAFTA's legacy: Good-paying U.S. manufacturing jobs were shipped overseas, where the workers now suffer miserable wages and unsafe conditions that are sometimes tantamount to slavery.
29
Why is TPP classified like a military secret? TPP is not nuclear war, it's not spying. Maybe it's classified because Obama doesn't want workers to know that they can kiss their jobs goodbye if TPP goes through.
41
It is much too late to offset China's domination of world markets -- especially in its own backyard. In fifteen more years, the roles will be completely reversed with China as the leading economic and military power in the world and the USA as a third-world country with nukes.
12
The sad thing is, this was only a temporary setback for Obama. Fast track is still a strong possibility, and the majority in Congress -- including many of the Democrats who supported today's maneuver -- seem sold on TPP. Their talking points are stuck on compensating workers who lose their jobs, and addressing currency manipulation. That's it. Most seem to fine with the rest of this entire package, of which nothing will be made public until after it passes and is too late.
28
This bill is terrible. If I wanted to vote for a Republican, I would have voted for a Republican. Obama has turned his back on his constituency.
54
You voted for Obama? I can't believe it.
3
"This bill" wasn't put to a vote today: only the ability for the president to proceed with fast-track authority, with a final vote to occur when (now, if) TPP agreement was reached. Not quite the same thing, surely?
And when did it become the case that his constituency no longer includes workers producing exported goods?
And when did it become the case that his constituency no longer includes workers producing exported goods?
1
Did you think Romney was better, Elephant? I can't believe that.
3
Wow, I am truly surprised at the response to TPP. We gotta have skin in the game to play. But, I see that we are going for isolationist policies. We could be leaders but we are opting to continue to be customers and consumers of the world's products and to preserve our trade imbalance. You do know that China and Korea and Japan and Australia and Indonesia and every other country is cutting their own trade deals, right? And, our iphones, ipads, smartphones, tablets, computers, televisions, tires, photovoltaics, Samsungs, Panasonics, Sonys, most of that stuff is being made in other countries like China and Indonesia and India and imported to the US. And we think it's okay not to have a part in making up the trade rules and regulations, influence human rights, and export the environmental impacts of our consumption. And, no matter what it costs to produce in another country we will pay MSRP because we want it and can afford it and, by god, we deserve it. Wow, what a country.
7
I'll bet you also think that NAFTA was a big success too.
8
NAFTA was the trilateral trade agreement with Mexico and Canada signed by President Bill Clinton. While it did not achieve the expected increase in jobs that was used to promote the agreement effects on the economy for all three partners were enhanced. The Council on Foreign Relations report here: http://www.cfr.org/trade/naftas-economic-impact/p15790
1
That didn't work with NAFTA and it won't work this time either. Instead we have even more unneeded H1B workers in this country and even more slave workers overseas making poor quality stuff which is put on our store shelves for us to buy. They even want to make it impossible for a company to advertise that a product is made in the USA.
2
They have Obama's number, He is a closet corporatist as has been so obvious to all with eyes to see and ears to hear.
33
I have been surprised and dismayed by President Obama's unwarranted, angry tirades against Senator Elizabeth Warren, as well as other Americans who have serious questions, and reservations, about the TPP treaty. As a well educated lawyer and professor of constitutional law, he is well aware that we have a representative form of government and that U. S. Senators not only have the right, but the obligation, to speak out on issues which they see as important with respect to the well being of their constituents.
This is not an autocracy, Mr. President, as you are well aware. Start listening more and get off the infallibility kick; even the Pope seems to have.
This is not an autocracy, Mr. President, as you are well aware. Start listening more and get off the infallibility kick; even the Pope seems to have.
59
FYI Obama was never a professor of Constitutional law. An adjunct lecturer at best. He doesn't believe in the Constitution. He's goes by his own constitution which is way left.
1
Why s this fallacy of Obama as some "professor" of Constitutional law continuing to be spread? Obama was a "lecturer in Constitutional law," not a tenure track position, and fully separate from being an assistant prof, associate prof, or eventually a full prof. Obama's publication(s?) would not even gotten hm to the associate professor level.
2
Actually, President Obama is a graduate of Harvard Law School, where he was elected president of the Harvard Law Review. He worked as a civil rights attorney for a time and taught constitutional law at the University of Chicago from 1992 to 2004. He also served three terms in the Illinois State Senate, 1997 to 2004. He is obviously fully versed on the Constitution; I don't believe that it was ever his intention to have a career in academia.
Obama giving gifts to big corporations - TPP, drilling in the Arctic - is, in my opinion, his way of securing huge corporate donations to his post-Presidency Foundation or Library or whatever. I request the NYT to keep careful track of whom did what with TPP now and compare it to the future list of big donors to the future Obama Foundation, say by 2018.
28
This anti-corporatre rehtoric will come to bite Americans lest we recognize who it is that pays the salaries of most workers and who fuels our social welfare programs. IT IS NOT ANTI-AMERICAN to support US corporations..
China is salivating and we simply cannot afford to not be cooperating with the Asian marketplace.
It is ignorant to think that we can compete with India, Vietnam, and the rest of Asia for low value manufactoring jobs but we can compete when technology and innovation are involved. If we surrender intellectual property rights for the sake of some a few thousand low-skilled labor jobs we will find our country in dire straights 10 years from now, even worse than today.
How about we stop trying to get even with the corporations and help them create jobs and be more competitive in the global market place... Would that be such a horrible thing???
China is salivating and we simply cannot afford to not be cooperating with the Asian marketplace.
It is ignorant to think that we can compete with India, Vietnam, and the rest of Asia for low value manufactoring jobs but we can compete when technology and innovation are involved. If we surrender intellectual property rights for the sake of some a few thousand low-skilled labor jobs we will find our country in dire straights 10 years from now, even worse than today.
How about we stop trying to get even with the corporations and help them create jobs and be more competitive in the global market place... Would that be such a horrible thing???
1
Here's a Joe Stiglitz piece on the harm of TPP, posted in the NYT on March 15 of last year.
http://opinionator.blogs.nytimes.com/2014/03/15/on-the-wrong-side-of-glo...
http://opinionator.blogs.nytimes.com/2014/03/15/on-the-wrong-side-of-glo...
14
This is a very interesting read on this topic. I feel a little like there are a few assumptions being made that make it difficult for me to agree with the idea being posited.
1
Stiglitz, as befits a Nobel laureate, was just posturing himself ahead of the rest of the Democratic party before the 2016 election. This Senate action is just the Greek Chorus.
All together now: it's the Republican's Fault! Now, whisper: and Obama betrayed us...
All together now: it's the Republican's Fault! Now, whisper: and Obama betrayed us...
President Obama had this coming. He deserved this defeat.
Congress is now dominated by a Republican majority so this TPP Agreement, unfortunately, may still pass. Let's hope not.
Congress is now dominated by a Republican majority so this TPP Agreement, unfortunately, may still pass. Let's hope not.
17
If they do pass it they sign death to more jobs in usa we already lost 20 million manufacturing jobs paid living wage . By the way paid good taxs to our government we wont be indebt to china now trillions
2
Give a good listen to Elizabeth Warren's speaking her own words about this trade bill this morning. She makes her case, our case, quite clear:
http://www.npr.org/sections/itsallpolitics/2015/05/12/405950630/sen-warr...
well, said.
http://www.npr.org/sections/itsallpolitics/2015/05/12/405950630/sen-warr...
well, said.
22
Not the nest article to link to, it sounds a lot like positioning for a a presidential bid to these ears.
You know that Dems have gone over the deep-left-end when the Liberals rebuke even Socialist Obama for not being far left enough.
4
Obama is a corporation man. No bankster arrests. Approved article drilling. He's a Rockefeller Republican. He is a causation unreality though he plays one from time to time
1
Only a delusional ideologue in dire need of a real education believes President Obama is a socialist.
3
TPP is bad for American workers and will lower the standard of living here. But of course the 1% will get richer. Call me a socialist.
6
How can American factory workers compete with foreign workers making less than $1.00 per hour?
21
Automation.
3
No, they can't. But the treaty is not really about workers, it is a matter of foreign policy the tail wagging the dog. The condition of workers is secondary in the sense that foreign policy in this globalized world has immense economic consequences. Foreign policy needs to be brought under democratic control, not just when it affects workers.
3
What you don't realize is that world has evolved and continues to do so.... If we loose our competitve advantage in innovation and creativity we will be lost.
We are simply not able to compete for the unskilled manufactoring jobs and we should not sacrifice our high tech companies to protect jobs that are already lost forever. We need to prootect the intellectual property of the companies who are fueling the US economy... It is no longer the auto manufacroers or the coal mines, it is Google, Apple, Microsoft, IBM, Exxon, GE.......
We are simply not able to compete for the unskilled manufactoring jobs and we should not sacrifice our high tech companies to protect jobs that are already lost forever. We need to prootect the intellectual property of the companies who are fueling the US economy... It is no longer the auto manufacroers or the coal mines, it is Google, Apple, Microsoft, IBM, Exxon, GE.......
1
Why should the most important legislation of this term be buried, literally, in cloisters? The optics alone are unforgiving.
10
One person - one woman - can make a difference. Thank God for Elizabeth Warren. Shame on President Obama for lying when he accused her of lying about the TPP. There is an excellent analysis on Salon.com that supports Ms. Warren's views more than President Obama's.
It should also be pointed out that the TPP is so secret that we and the press would know nothing about it if it had not been leaked. It was leaked by Wikileaks first, if I am not mistaken. If we believe that American citizens deserve to know what their government is doing, which I think we do, then we should give credit where credit is due. Thank you Wikileaks.
It should also be pointed out that the TPP is so secret that we and the press would know nothing about it if it had not been leaked. It was leaked by Wikileaks first, if I am not mistaken. If we believe that American citizens deserve to know what their government is doing, which I think we do, then we should give credit where credit is due. Thank you Wikileaks.
39
Secret, secret, secret! What is with all of this hand wringing about government secrecy. It's a red-herring. Certainly this deal needs to more scrutiny, but really. Where are the comments about spying by our own government? Here we have a trade deal that could help us to cement some clout in a part of the world where we have a real problem with an economic might and yet, hand-wringing. Elizabath Warren needs to work harder at communicating her idea, because this liberal is not buying her opposition as anything more than positioning for a presidential run.
2
I don't believe that you are a liberal. And your idea that we could cement some clout is a statement of faith not rooted in reality.
For Verizon and AOL, Mobile Is a Magic Word
Senate Democrats Foil Obama on Asia Trade Deal
In this have-to-be-at-the-lead in the "social media" era does this tell us why ... well, most everything has to be "done" without doing anything?
Senate Democrats Foil Obama on Asia Trade Deal
In this have-to-be-at-the-lead in the "social media" era does this tell us why ... well, most everything has to be "done" without doing anything?
Hillary, where are you when the President needs you, and where do you stand among Democrats. Why are you not a force in shaping or repudiating this bill.
Are you too busy listening to polls rather than thinking, having a public opinion?
Are you too busy listening to polls rather than thinking, having a public opinion?
21
Ms. Clinton is caught between the proverbial rock of her claims being the Joan of Arc of "ordinary" Americans and the inconvenient hard truth that she and former President Bill Clinton's billion dollar private foundation and $100 million personal net worth are tribute from the same shadowy multinational corporation and foreign interests pushing for passage of TPP.
Like the Holy Bible admonishes, Ms. Clinton cannot be the servant of two masters.....
Like the Holy Bible admonishes, Ms. Clinton cannot be the servant of two masters.....
3
What is the definition of a trade deal? its process whereby we trade American jobs for profits which benifit billionaires.
33
Obama has created a healthcare for Pharma; expanded drone wars; millions lost their homes; Shell drills in the arctic; millions have been deported.
Why fast track?
[1] Local ownership is forbidden: "signatory countries renounce their right to favor the domestic ownership and control of the lands, waters, and other productive assets and services essential to the lives and well-being of their people."
[2]Corporations must be paid to stop polluting:"No Party may expropriate or nationalize a covered investment either directly or indirectly through measures equivalent to expropriation or nationalization (“expropriation”)
[3]A tribunal of corporate lawyers:"Unless the disputing parties otherwise agree, the tribunal shall comprise three arbitrators, one arbitrator appointed by each of the disputing parties and the third, who shall be the presiding arbitrator, appointed by agreement of the disputing parties.The arbitrators are private lawyers who are not accountable to any electorate."
[4] Speculative money must remain free.
[5] Corporate interests come before national ones
[6]Leaked draft texts of the agreement show that the IP chapter would have extensive negative ramifications for users’ freedom of speech, right to privacy and due process, and hinder peoples' abilities to innovate.
Obama is a FRAUD. He is the "CHANGE" that WALL STREET WANTED.
He wants Fast Track because he doesn't want the ordinary citizens to know that he is in the hands of the corporate lobbyists. WAKE UP USA
Why fast track?
[1] Local ownership is forbidden: "signatory countries renounce their right to favor the domestic ownership and control of the lands, waters, and other productive assets and services essential to the lives and well-being of their people."
[2]Corporations must be paid to stop polluting:"No Party may expropriate or nationalize a covered investment either directly or indirectly through measures equivalent to expropriation or nationalization (“expropriation”)
[3]A tribunal of corporate lawyers:"Unless the disputing parties otherwise agree, the tribunal shall comprise three arbitrators, one arbitrator appointed by each of the disputing parties and the third, who shall be the presiding arbitrator, appointed by agreement of the disputing parties.The arbitrators are private lawyers who are not accountable to any electorate."
[4] Speculative money must remain free.
[5] Corporate interests come before national ones
[6]Leaked draft texts of the agreement show that the IP chapter would have extensive negative ramifications for users’ freedom of speech, right to privacy and due process, and hinder peoples' abilities to innovate.
Obama is a FRAUD. He is the "CHANGE" that WALL STREET WANTED.
He wants Fast Track because he doesn't want the ordinary citizens to know that he is in the hands of the corporate lobbyists. WAKE UP USA
31
And I bet you are just longing for the good old days of unchecked deregulation, an unfettered military and obstacle-crammed health care coverage under Reagan and the two Bushes, right?
2
He's more likely longing for the good old days when one could distinguish the "Democratic" Party from the Republican Party. The logical fallacy that if someone criticizes a "Democrat" he or she must favor Republicans has facilitated the party's (and the country's) inexorable move to the right. This Administration's military budget, as just one example, is higher than any military budget since WWII. A proposed trade agreement that members of Congress cannot even take notes on much less debate, and which is hidden from the American people in its entirety (is this democracy?) is being pushed by a "Democratic" president. And an unelected group of corporate lawyers acting in secret would replace our Constitutional system of courts and be given the power to nullify laws passed by Congress -- much as the FISA court acting in secret has been given the power by Republicans and Democrats alike to eviscerate the Fourth Amendment. Is there no principle more sacred than a label?
1
As much as I love the Affordable Care Act, it was rammed through Congress without a chance for the public to actually read it. This came back to haunt the Democrats, because many people were outraged by what they considered surprises. If they had slowed down the process and given people a chance to digest the provisions, people would lose their misconceptions and the bill would withstand scrutiny.
As a result of some careless language, the ACA may turn to dust. It's a powerful lesson on the need to read before signing.
As a result of some careless language, the ACA may turn to dust. It's a powerful lesson on the need to read before signing.
8
"As a result of some careless language, the ACA may turn to dust."
Not careless language but a deliberate attempt to bribe states into setting up exchanges.
Not careless language but a deliberate attempt to bribe states into setting up exchanges.
4
it was rammed through and voted on without our reps reading what was in it.. Also, the "Single payer "mandate was withdrawn due to complaints from 2 conservative democratic Senators. That would have changed the whole ball game if it were included.
6
The ACA (aka Obamacare) is a GOP lead, driven originally by the Heritage Society, bipartisan program, already field tested (RomneyCare) and to have shown great success. The RomneyCare designers were even involved in the development of the ACA. The problems begin when the GOP make 151 changes which included leaving out the single payer, defund the logistical development of the program, manipulate a group of people which would become the TeaParty into believing the ACA would take away their guns, raise their taxes, make them socialist or was it communist or both and then in Red states refuse the Medicaid expansion which is now resulting in thirty something states (red states) crashing their budgets with the GOP refusing to tax the rich and corporate but instead close schools, stop feeding the poor and fail to take care of their infrastructure. This country is rated 37th in the world for health care. Our mortality rates for pregnant women is some of the worst in the world which is caused by poor medical care. I have traveled all over this world and believe me when I say this, we are the laughing stock of the world. So, if there was any "misconceptions" about the properly termed ACA, it was by GOP design, not bad PR by the administration.
2
Obama now has a political party in Congress that is doing all it can to support him - unfortunately, it is not his own party but is the Republican party whose Senate leader declared at the beginning of Obama's first term that the main objective of the Republicans was to make sure that Obama was a one-term president.
Having failed at that, the Republicans are today ready and eagerg to support this very same president by giving him total authority via the TPA - Fast Track - for the TPP. But this does not mean that they have changed their opinion of him - they are not willing to trust him to deal with Iran without having the final say on the agreement.
Beware of any legislation that Republicans overwhelmingly endorse but Democrats oppose - you can be sure that it will not serve the interests of the 98%, no matter what the president says. Obama may be starting to regret his attempt to demean Elizabeth Warren and others of his own party - but he's been tweaking the noses of progressives since he was elected, so perhaps he thinks that this too will pass. Let us hope that the Democrats in the Senate hold to their principles and continue to oppose Fast Track.
Having failed at that, the Republicans are today ready and eagerg to support this very same president by giving him total authority via the TPA - Fast Track - for the TPP. But this does not mean that they have changed their opinion of him - they are not willing to trust him to deal with Iran without having the final say on the agreement.
Beware of any legislation that Republicans overwhelmingly endorse but Democrats oppose - you can be sure that it will not serve the interests of the 98%, no matter what the president says. Obama may be starting to regret his attempt to demean Elizabeth Warren and others of his own party - but he's been tweaking the noses of progressives since he was elected, so perhaps he thinks that this too will pass. Let us hope that the Democrats in the Senate hold to their principles and continue to oppose Fast Track.
20
This issue alone should create a groundswell of support for Bernie Sanders.
6
The essence of Capitalism is Competition to create wealth.
How can we compete and create wealth if we export jobs, industry, and wealth that in turn competes against us from another nation?
How can we put forth free trade agreements that relax impediments between us and other nations?
We must compete in the world as a singular economy and ridicule "Globalization".
The Senate has rightly heard the American people and voted against the furtherance of the TPP. I am now heartened and have every confidence that this glimmer of Patriotism in Congress will take hold and grow.
America first.
How can we compete and create wealth if we export jobs, industry, and wealth that in turn competes against us from another nation?
How can we put forth free trade agreements that relax impediments between us and other nations?
We must compete in the world as a singular economy and ridicule "Globalization".
The Senate has rightly heard the American people and voted against the furtherance of the TPP. I am now heartened and have every confidence that this glimmer of Patriotism in Congress will take hold and grow.
America first.
14
for almost 8 years, President Obama has pursued a largely GOP economic policy; what is odd that is that the GOP has denounced Obama when he proposes to enact GOP ideas into law.
Finally, the Democrats in the Senate show some backbone
why you ask, did Obama pass PPACA ? I think it was entirely personal: his mom suffered, so Obama understood - like republican politicians who are antigay until a family member comes out.
Finally, the Democrats in the Senate show some backbone
why you ask, did Obama pass PPACA ? I think it was entirely personal: his mom suffered, so Obama understood - like republican politicians who are antigay until a family member comes out.
6
It is curious to think back to when the Republicans in Congress, in a political play to their base, stiffed Bush when he attempted to pursue immigration reform, a move that has burdened them since. I suspect the Democrats in Congress may come to have the same regrets if they stiff Obama on trade. For their part, the Republicans now can afford to shrug, say that they tried to be bi-partisan and work with the President...and then sit back and let the Democrats (and likely President Clinton) live with the awkward results of a failed trade deal in the coming years.
2
I wish I could trust the President on this one, but there's no transparency.
16
President Obama has done a good job of righting the sinking ship that Bush 43 left him, but he's also had some real stinkers. Like not pushing for a public option in the ACA, wasting too much of the stimulus in tax cuts that were the least productive way to boost the economy, allowing the Wall Street guys to avoid personal prosecution, going after whistleblowers instead of supporting them, not negotiating hard enough with the GOP when the Dems had some control in Congress and others. Clinton did a good job, but he had some stinkers too like DOMA and signing the GOP bill to end Glass-Steagal. So trust in Obama isn't nearly good enough when so much is at stake IMO.
13
he didn't "right" anything- he's made it worse- no accountability for the Wall St thugs, caving into the so-called "Free Traders" with TPP, opening up the Atlantic coast and Arctic for oil development, letting Russia run roughshod over Ukraine. Iraq, Afghanistan- were back in it those places again. Gitmo is still open.... and list goes on and on. Maybe baby Bush wasn't so bad after all?!! just joking.
6
the bill that ended glass-steagal was bipartisan, it passed the senate 90-8. Read about it
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gramm%E2%80%93Leach%E2%80%93Bliley_Act
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gramm%E2%80%93Leach%E2%80%93Bliley_Act
1
Why isn't trade deal posted on White House web site for all to read?
Why the secrecy?
Why the secrecy?
31
you can find out why under Section 1, paragraph 4, line 9; which states- "never mind what i said during my campaign, under no circumstance will there ever be any transparency."
3
Considering that supporters of the pact want to include, "assistance for displaced workers", it is obvious that the loss of American jobs is a foregone conclusion. This is NAFTA II....a perfect example of what happens to American workers when the White House does the bidding of multinational corporations. Didn't we learn our lesson once already? And isn't this a great example of what corporate money can buy given that there are virtually no controls on how they throw around enormous campaign contributions?
18
The deception of calling those who will lose their jobs "Displaced Workers" is indicative of the underhanded attitude of the administration.
10
I don't understand a President who sells us out at every opportunity. Obama has weakened our military. He's withdrawn American combat brigades from Europe and give incentive to Putin to take whatever he wants. He's allowed Assad to resume use of chemical weapons. China is building military bases on new islands it is developing across the Pacific. North Korea now has 20 nuclear war heads. Crimea is gone. Ukraine is next. Georgia is in trouble. Poland is shuddering as the Russian Bear looms ever larger. And now this foolish, foolish president wants to give away the store to Pacific Rim countries in the form of a free trade agreement that will strip away more American jobs and industry. What is wrong this man? What is clouding his vision? Why does he want to dismantle America? I can't wait for this man to leave office. I may even vote Republican if they will restore American power and prestige. I'd sooner vote for the ghost of Richard Nixon. The world took him at his word when he said American would respond. We need a real president. Not a trade agreement.
14
Good on Senate Dems for growing a spine.
Only one Democrat joined 51 Goopers. Figure it out, people.
This deal is about corporate profits and control, not jobs, trade, or any other nonsense we are being fed.
~
Only one Democrat joined 51 Goopers. Figure it out, people.
This deal is about corporate profits and control, not jobs, trade, or any other nonsense we are being fed.
~
26
Where can I read the provisions of this proposed agreement?
If I cannot, how can I know whether I support it or not?
If I cannot, how can I know whether I support it or not?
20
NAFTA sent millions of manufacturing jobs out of the USA permanently under Bill Clinton - many moved to Mexico. Now Obama wants another round. He cries "income inequality" and sends jobs offshore? Is the plan to put more Americans on welfare to encourage inequality and the Democratic Party agenda? I worked for a multinational and even Europe is a better place to manufacture than the USA - taxes and regulatory overhead are totally discouraging and Congress does nothing. Most Asian countries are a "no brainer" - everything is cheaper - and the cost of borrowing the same. If your job has not been sent overseas - don't worry - Obama and the Democrats are working on it.
13
That is great news.! The American people really need to know what this is all about and there can not be secrecy about this. Europeans are also protesting the transatlantic agreement TTIP that is being negotiated in secrecy. We know it's all about lowering labor and general safety standards for most people while mainly corporations will profit.
16
This entire process has been a total disgrace. First, for any trade agreement to pass the constitution requires a two-thirds vote in the Senate (Article 2, Section 2, Clause 2). At some point a previous congress, president, and the top one-percent they are doing the bidding for managed to conveniently get around this and make trade agreements with foreign governments far easier to pass. Second, fast-track authority should never be granted to a president. Especially when the public doesn't get to see the bill first. This agreement has been negotiated in secret and only members of congress have limited access to it. Third, our elected officials belong being able to amend the bill. That is their job. Fourth, trade bills don't belong being given a special exception to the Senate's filibuster rules. If the president gets fast-track authority the bill will only require a simple majority to pass. Everything that the president, congress, and their top one-percent masters could do to stack the deck in their favor on trade agreements they have done. It's disgraceful and this bill needs to be defeated. All members of congress who vote for it belong being thrown out of office the next election.
25
When a president diminishes the value associated with being a politician, as ours did in a commentary about Senator Warren, he is eroding his own political capital, his profession, and the value of his colleagues. He hasn’t grasped the essence of his job and doesn’t appreciate our vote. Not only did the president lack the political courage and personal integrity he could have displayed when Elizabeth Warren was aspiring to a job she deserved, he is now throwing low balls at her using a language that is inappropriate. If he is left so off-balance by a dispute on a trade agreement, if his stature cannot reach the presidential level in such a critical moment, can you imagine what kind of legacy he can leave? We need a leader more than we need a trade agreement Mr. President.
36
Lots going on here.
1. Fast track simply authorizes the president to reach an agreement in principle with the other signers. Congress will have the right to review and reject the deal. It won't have the right to amend or filibuster the deal.
2. The president presides. If we want TPP - I live in the Midwest and know the farmers out here will benefit from it -- Congress needs to be involved but the president needs to negotiate the deal.
2. Slow track isn't the end of TPP but it substantially changes the likelihood that the transaction will happen.
1. Fast track simply authorizes the president to reach an agreement in principle with the other signers. Congress will have the right to review and reject the deal. It won't have the right to amend or filibuster the deal.
2. The president presides. If we want TPP - I live in the Midwest and know the farmers out here will benefit from it -- Congress needs to be involved but the president needs to negotiate the deal.
2. Slow track isn't the end of TPP but it substantially changes the likelihood that the transaction will happen.
3
Thanks to the Senate Democrats for sticking together and standing strong against extreme pressure. For once, the good guys won one, although it's disconcerting to see the President standing on the other side. Maybe he will reconsider and seek to revamp our entire trade policy so that it will serve the interests of all Americans in seeking widely shared prosperity through trade.
10
My disillusionment with President Obama is complete. He promised "Change You Can Believe In." And then he gave us Mitt Romney's healthcare plan while unilaterally taking Single Payer off the table, unprecedented levels of NSA surveillance, Gitmo remains open, no/zero/zilch/nada banksters responsible for 2008 doing the perp walk, and then to top it all off he pushed for more opportunities for elites to shift jobs overseas while domestic standard of living races to the bottom. I don't believe in this sort of change and it is DEFINITELY NOT WHAT I VOTED FOR.
36
Jerry, you are obviously getting your "information" from Faux News. Get your facts right, then rant if you must but it will be directed at the GOP, not President Obama.
1
No, Mr. President, this is not a game. If this is so good, why can nobody see it? Why must congress members make an appointment to read it and if they take notes, they cannot take their notes with them? This smacks very much of the ACA that was passed before anybody read it. No more. No more.
14
"Secret", "Fast Track", two red flags. Frankly, I don't think the Trade Bill has been vetted sufficiently in the Press for the American public to know what is going on or to understand the issues. The last time there was an important trade negotiation up for discussion (in the 80's) we were told that NAFTA would level the playing field. That certainly didn't happen. At least we were informed at that time, but now Consumers are wary and worried and we're not informed.
The President must make his argument to us as well as to Congress.
The President must make his argument to us as well as to Congress.
12
Am I just imagining things, or was it just last year that there were scores of opinion pieces and comments thunderously expressing indignation at an institution where a super-majority was needed to pass any legislation?
Interesting, isn't it?
Interesting, isn't it?
5
The public would be far better off if the Senate filibuster were abolished (on average progress is better than gridlock), but I'll take a blow to the TPP however I can get it.
4
Obama's once promised "TRANSPARENCY" now comes home to roost!
W
W
13
The question should not be whether Obama has enough clout to influence Democratic votes, but rathe is dthis a fair agreement for workers and our economy and whether we are being sold a bill of goods with no means to judge it fairly.
14
We are not being asked to judge the deal fairly, sight unseen; we are being asked to accord the President the leeway to negotiate with foreign partners a deal that them must be considered and voted up or down by the full Congress, with whatever pressure its constituents bring to bear.
1
Where is the full-throated attack on Hillary from Bernie Saunders? It looks to me like Bernie is a Paper Tiger.
1
Good, stand firm, Democrats. TPP may have some fine things in it, but from what I have able to read from many sources it is loaded up with really bad ideas.
First, it is so secret that no one can be sure about this pig in a poke.
Second, more than half of the "chapters" have nothing to do with lowering tariffs. Instead, the rest includes things like an international court to extract funds for big companies from governments that pass laws and regulations that they claim costs them revenue. The intellectual property provisions seem to be way over the top, once again to benefit big companies.
Further, the fast-track is written to allow any president, for the next six years, to be able to use it. In the unlikely event of a Republican win in 2016, it is a hammer available to roll back some of the considerable gains that the Obama administration has made in curbing excesses in the "hidden banking" sector.
So, until TPP is a public draft and subject to inspection, debate and revision, it should never be approved.
First, it is so secret that no one can be sure about this pig in a poke.
Second, more than half of the "chapters" have nothing to do with lowering tariffs. Instead, the rest includes things like an international court to extract funds for big companies from governments that pass laws and regulations that they claim costs them revenue. The intellectual property provisions seem to be way over the top, once again to benefit big companies.
Further, the fast-track is written to allow any president, for the next six years, to be able to use it. In the unlikely event of a Republican win in 2016, it is a hammer available to roll back some of the considerable gains that the Obama administration has made in curbing excesses in the "hidden banking" sector.
So, until TPP is a public draft and subject to inspection, debate and revision, it should never be approved.
15
Thank god. Some of the best news out of our disfunctional congress in a long, long time. This TPP and fasttrack are bad news.
15
President Obama wasn't seeking approval of the pact. He was seeking executive leeway to negotiate beyond the crazy glare that the US Congress has, time and again, thrown on all public deliberation in recent memory.
Transparency, they cry? They'll see the bill before it's voted up or down. The question is, will they even bother to read it. As one famous banner-carrier of the GOP once said, "I'm a leader not a reader." It has turned out, in fact, that he is neither.
Transparency, they cry? They'll see the bill before it's voted up or down. The question is, will they even bother to read it. As one famous banner-carrier of the GOP once said, "I'm a leader not a reader." It has turned out, in fact, that he is neither.
5
I think the Obama comments about Warren indicate that he is sexist - he tries to hide it with rhetoric about contraception - which he seems to feel is more important that minority women having equal opportunity in work environments.
8
I didn't like the way Mr. Obama attacked Warren. He basically said she had no idea what she was talking about while giving her a backhanded complement of being a law professor. He should have found a way to work within his party rather than belittling those who raise valid objections.
The whole 'fast track' thing reminds me very much of the bail out during the financial crisis. If you remember, it had to be 'now,' 'immediately' quick quick quick, no discussion, just do it!
Then as now, the only reason you'd want to move superfast and without discussion or transparency, is because you have something to hide, and only rushing it through and creating an artificial inner circle of power, will give it enough momentum to be passed. This is not how a democracy runs.
The whole 'fast track' thing reminds me very much of the bail out during the financial crisis. If you remember, it had to be 'now,' 'immediately' quick quick quick, no discussion, just do it!
Then as now, the only reason you'd want to move superfast and without discussion or transparency, is because you have something to hide, and only rushing it through and creating an artificial inner circle of power, will give it enough momentum to be passed. This is not how a democracy runs.
28
I have seen nothing about this trade agreement that would benefit U.S. workers, no proof that it would create and keep jobs at home. Global economics has not favored our workers. It is time that our elected leaders look out for the people they represent instead of multinational corporations. I am a very liberal Democrat and an Obama supporter, but I want to know how this is going to benefit the working class of the U.S.A. Do we want to become a third world country?
15
I support fast track authority for the many reasons its supporters claim. That said, I understand the legitimate concerns of some of those that vited no today. The more interesting story is what the no vote says about Obama's relations with those of his own party, and his inability to sway their votes. For years, some Dems claimed that the inability of Obama to work with Reps was due to the other party's total unwillingness to work with him. Some truth to that no doubt. But how does one explain today? I think both Reagan and Clinton had more influence with friends and foes alike because they developed relationships, something Obama disdains. I believe that historians will view this as his greatest fault.
7
It's a secret trade deal. Doesn't sound like democracy to me.
15
What was Obama thinking ?
4
About the payoff he is going to get once he is out of office.
1
I'm sure Warren will be delighted when the Republicans get the presidency as well as both houses of congress; that will give her the soup-box opportunity to spout opinions she knows she will never have to put to the test -- just like the Tea Party now. The Democrats seem happy to look like flakes on this, and that will have an impact on the electorate in 2016.
5
Hmmm. If a Pritzker is against the currency manipulation provision - that enough is a reason to be totally for it.
4
Without the provisions of the Trade Bill available for public scrutiny how are we supposed to know what is going on? Secrecy is used to protect National Security or to save embarrassment for someone. If the concern is embarrassment it must be a bad deal for someone.
13
Are we truly a Capitalist nation?
I view Capitalism as a free market economy with limited regulation to assure order and fairness while working for maximum profit to attain a better life for ourselves and our future generations through fair, and honest competition.
If the leaders of our economy view the world as a homogenous economy while exporting our industry and wealth, then we are not truly competing with other nations, but against our own nation.
Capitalism is degrading to a shortsighted unthoughtful existence in which our economy is slowly collapsing.
We must once again view our nation as a singular economy that really competes in the world to absorb as much wealth as we can to build our nation and our population. Corporations offshoring industry is simply working against our best interests. It lacks patriotism and loses wealth.
A movement to recover industry back to our nation must begin to assure the future health of our nations economy and future.
Globalization must be shuned as an excuse by those who compete against our own people by building foreign business that drains our wealth instead of creating it here in America.
Just remember..............."America First", in industry, wealth, and health of the economy.
I care for other nations as others do, but charity begins at home so we can then be charitable to others.
You can attain free trade once industry has returned to America.
America First!
I view Capitalism as a free market economy with limited regulation to assure order and fairness while working for maximum profit to attain a better life for ourselves and our future generations through fair, and honest competition.
If the leaders of our economy view the world as a homogenous economy while exporting our industry and wealth, then we are not truly competing with other nations, but against our own nation.
Capitalism is degrading to a shortsighted unthoughtful existence in which our economy is slowly collapsing.
We must once again view our nation as a singular economy that really competes in the world to absorb as much wealth as we can to build our nation and our population. Corporations offshoring industry is simply working against our best interests. It lacks patriotism and loses wealth.
A movement to recover industry back to our nation must begin to assure the future health of our nations economy and future.
Globalization must be shuned as an excuse by those who compete against our own people by building foreign business that drains our wealth instead of creating it here in America.
Just remember..............."America First", in industry, wealth, and health of the economy.
I care for other nations as others do, but charity begins at home so we can then be charitable to others.
You can attain free trade once industry has returned to America.
America First!
14
About time somebody put a stop to these secret shenanigans.....
16
absolutely right
1
Would NYT rerun some videos of Obama's 2008 and 2012 campaigns? I'm pretty sure he used the words outsourcing of jobs, wall street greed, working for long hours with getting less pay etc. It was music to my ears then, but boy, was I naive.
23
Never expected Obama to do it, did you? It seems like there was a lot of naivety when people where in the ballot box voting for Obama.
1
Re the "right" of corporations to sue governments for passing laws that "harm their profits": It is wrong, absolutely wrong to hold this as a right, or for our government representatives to agree to it.
We do NOT owe corporations a profit. We do not have to make laws that guarantee them a profit. We are the rulers of our own land, not the corporations. That hasn't changed yet, and I pray to God it never does. We have the right to make laws to protect our air, land, and water. We have the right to make laws to refuse human exploitation. And the right to make such other laws as we see fit.
It is up to the corporations to abide by our laws--and not up to us to fork them over whatever they want in order to make money for their private persons. It is absolutely incredible, and unacceptable, that provisions to elevate corporate profits over our self-rule would be in this treaty--and they are--or that our president or any of our representative would seek to make it law.
We do NOT owe corporations a profit. We do not have to make laws that guarantee them a profit. We are the rulers of our own land, not the corporations. That hasn't changed yet, and I pray to God it never does. We have the right to make laws to protect our air, land, and water. We have the right to make laws to refuse human exploitation. And the right to make such other laws as we see fit.
It is up to the corporations to abide by our laws--and not up to us to fork them over whatever they want in order to make money for their private persons. It is absolutely incredible, and unacceptable, that provisions to elevate corporate profits over our self-rule would be in this treaty--and they are--or that our president or any of our representative would seek to make it law.
21
Which one is the party of "No"? I am completely confused now.
5
Why confused? "Party of NO" doesn't mean that the other party can never, ever say No to anything. It means that a party -- Democrats, in this case -- can say No sometimes and Yes at other times, which it has done. This is different from the Republicans, who have basically said No to everything Obama proposes, even when it does things they want and would support.
4
so, let's do the math.
1. Obama has major setback on his Asian trade deal.
2. The Saudi's don't trust him/us any more due to our moving forward with Iran.
3. Obama dislikes the Israels/Netanyahu who is only trying to defend his country against maniacs.
4. Obama and DiBlasio work toward the same progessive agenda.
Yup, just like I thought. Everything is coming up, roses.
1. Obama has major setback on his Asian trade deal.
2. The Saudi's don't trust him/us any more due to our moving forward with Iran.
3. Obama dislikes the Israels/Netanyahu who is only trying to defend his country against maniacs.
4. Obama and DiBlasio work toward the same progessive agenda.
Yup, just like I thought. Everything is coming up, roses.
4
What Mr. Obama is pushing is a Trans Pacific Corporate Partnership, and most definitely not a Trans Pacific People's Partnership. What we need, of course, is a TPPP. Now may be a TPPP can't be attained because the interests of the various parties are too divergent, but a TPCP is going be be a disaster for the people. We should not willingly allow the corporations to shaft us.
So today's developments are a good thing. Well done, Senator Warren.
So today's developments are a good thing. Well done, Senator Warren.
14
What's up with the President? Trying to push through "secret" trade deals and allowing Shell to drill the Arctic ? This clearly is not the same man that we voted for.
16
When did President Obama do something against the working or middle class of America? Please, don't answer with the stock Tea Party or Republican Party shtick or for that matter, the phony, Progressive agenda! Senator Warren will not get my vote, that's for sure. She should have found a harder target in which to make her political name. Instead, she takes cheap shots at a President that has done his utmost to further equality and fairness in the marketplace and the classroom. Shame on those weak-kneed Democrats that couldn't trust our Democrat President, even though he has fought for Democratic ideas and ideals his entire term!!
6
When he bailed out the banks no string attached, when he handed the ACA to the healthindustry...just to name a few things that were clearily not working out in favor to the middle class.
3
Ha, "Shame on those weak-kneed Democrats that couldn't trust our Democrat President," You have not noticed that trust might just be the reason that the Congress is no longer Democratic?
2
When the president, for whom I voted, made a health care act that catered to and enriched insurance corporations, using tax money and mandates to do it, and his base asked why he didn't keep his promise to "insist on a public option, to keep the insurance companies honest"--he called those sincere people "sanctimonious purists". With a contempt he has seldom shown his political rivals, actually. And much that he has done in other aspects of governing has followed that pattern. I'm sorry to say it, sorry indeed, but I think that our president has been too fond of belonging to the club of power and wealth all along. And this TPP is another gift to them, from the details we've been able to ferret out despite the secrecy that has enwrapped it--a clear sign of yet another betrayal.
20
Remember Ralph Nader!
1
spot on
No amount of amendments to this deal will make it acceptable. The Senate must excise the International arbitration panel and make it clear that our sovereignty is not for sale! There is no reason to move forward with this deal in any form. It will destroy what is left of our economy for the profit of multinationals. Fright TPP?
16
Democracy Now! We want to vote on everything, not have money voting for money.
8
This is not a set back but more like a set-up
3
Consider this. It was a rich businessman, Ross Perot, who had the courage to challenge the NAFTA express train in 1992. And, apparently, there was a consensus of democrats who thought that Al Gore won the debate with Ross Perot. And then over the next 20 years during the extended unfolding of "free trade" with Mexico and China and others, there has come a sober realization of its implications.
The strength of a protectionist society is that it says to its citizens, we value you and your contribution. Because every nation state's economy resides at a different price level, a society focused on trading within its borders allows a significant number of its citizens to participate in the economic pie.
My thought is that we as a nation need to seriously reassess our view of "free trade", when our primary obligation should be to our fellow citizens. That was the way it was in past times. And there is no reason why we as a society cannot take steps toward the same approach again.
It is in my mind that this is not an issue which concerns only the progressive minded, but that it also resonates with rank and file working class people with more conservative views, who are also disturbed by the growing income inequality, tied to taking advantage of "free trade" to employ people in other countries which have significantly lower pay.
The strength of a protectionist society is that it says to its citizens, we value you and your contribution. Because every nation state's economy resides at a different price level, a society focused on trading within its borders allows a significant number of its citizens to participate in the economic pie.
My thought is that we as a nation need to seriously reassess our view of "free trade", when our primary obligation should be to our fellow citizens. That was the way it was in past times. And there is no reason why we as a society cannot take steps toward the same approach again.
It is in my mind that this is not an issue which concerns only the progressive minded, but that it also resonates with rank and file working class people with more conservative views, who are also disturbed by the growing income inequality, tied to taking advantage of "free trade" to employ people in other countries which have significantly lower pay.
19
...other than the United States both imports substantial numbers of resources that simply *aren't* within United States territory, and it benefits enormously from exporting its goods and services and from having the leverage to push other nations to move away from industrial-scale slave labor in de-facto toxic waste dumps.
Perhaps the recent Baltimore riots would not have happened if millions of jobs had not been sent overseas as a result of NAFTA. High welfare rates do not make for a healthy society and creating more "Detroits" as we de-industrialize will make matters worse.
3
I agree. Globalization is not always good and should not be regarded as inevitable, especially at high speed.
7
Wasn't the last President who said "Trust me" (other than the one who did NOT have SEX with that WOMAN) known as Tricky Dick in 1972? While Obama has none of the paranoia, he makes the secrecy of Nixon's Watergate tapes look like child's play compared to his secretive administration, prosecutions of whistle-blowers, and refusal to disclose the terms of the anti-American jobs TPP. I trust Putin more than the Big O at this point.
6
GOOD! TPP is NAFTA on steroids. A secret treaty that "We the people. . ." aren't allowed to see. A secret treaty that our representatives in both houses can only look at in a locked room and not make copies. A secret treaty that benefits all countries other than ours and sends jobs overseas and not bring them home. Bubba got the GOP to pass NAFTA and we took a small surplus with Mexico to a large deficit. B.O. is in the pocket of Wall Street, the NAM and those that would make America more of a Third World nation relative to the disparity between the rich and the non-rich. Obama is Bubba lite and GOP lite. A disappointment to many of we independents and liberals. The secret nature of TPP smacks of an authoritarian regime where "We the People. . ." have no say and cannot even write our representative (Senators and Representatives) in a meaningful way because we aren't allowed to see the bill.
15
Just vote for it and read it afterward? Sounds familiar.
1
Currency manipulation, a monster and I suppose this benefits everyone as well as the US?
...and in 4 more years China will have their Nicaragua canal up and running. I wonder just how those CSCL Globe ships will change things.
...and in 4 more years China will have their Nicaragua canal up and running. I wonder just how those CSCL Globe ships will change things.
1
If we had a GOP president and Congress, this would have passed. Why? Because it would have been good for business, the oligarchs and the wealthy. It would have been bad fro the American worker and those enterprises which resist off-shoring jobs and manufacturing.
The GOP blocked this to add another indignity to the Obama Administration. An administration which has been beset with partisan politics and gridlock since January, 2009. And it has been an ugly 6 years 5 moths with another 1 year 7 months to go.
I was not for this bill, considering the current employment and salary climate. The so called "recovery" still has not trickled down to working class Americans. Passage of this bill will have slowed the trickle even further. Though, I do not like that the reason this bill failed, was not for the good of the working Americans, but to stoke the egos of the GOP.
This is not what government is suppose to be. Bills should pass or fail because they are good or bad bills, not because of spite and obstructionism. This is another great example of how our government has lost its way, it being broken and divided as ever.
What is so bad about this is that this trade agreement will come up again, and it will pass. Regardless who is in the White House or political makeup of Washington. Even though the people don't want it; they are going to get it anyway. Between now and then the GOP will campaign on saving American jobs, and protecting American workers, until they sign it into law.
The GOP blocked this to add another indignity to the Obama Administration. An administration which has been beset with partisan politics and gridlock since January, 2009. And it has been an ugly 6 years 5 moths with another 1 year 7 months to go.
I was not for this bill, considering the current employment and salary climate. The so called "recovery" still has not trickled down to working class Americans. Passage of this bill will have slowed the trickle even further. Though, I do not like that the reason this bill failed, was not for the good of the working Americans, but to stoke the egos of the GOP.
This is not what government is suppose to be. Bills should pass or fail because they are good or bad bills, not because of spite and obstructionism. This is another great example of how our government has lost its way, it being broken and divided as ever.
What is so bad about this is that this trade agreement will come up again, and it will pass. Regardless who is in the White House or political makeup of Washington. Even though the people don't want it; they are going to get it anyway. Between now and then the GOP will campaign on saving American jobs, and protecting American workers, until they sign it into law.
8
NAFTA was Bill Clinton - a Democrat. Both parties do not have the interests of the working American anymore. If your job was not outsourced under NAFTA someone can work on it under Obama's "free trade" policy and you can try to compete against someone in Indonesia making a few dollars a day. Democrats will then yack about income inequality when they create more unemployed. Both parties figure the voters are too stupid to realize they were sold down the river.
3
And people also forget that it was Bill Clinton who gutted Glass-Steagall, with a rubber stamp of Democrats and Republicans, that set the ground work for the Great Recession. And, not to mention, accelerated income inequity. And I agree that both parties are in it for themselves and do not care one iota about anyone but the 1% and themselves. Finally, the parties divided and conquer strategy has been very successful.
1
Comments about the administration's lack of full transparency puzzle me. Do these fine people really want us show our hand at the table? My take on this mess is that my favorite legislators, who happen to be Democrats, are showing political courage equal to their Republican colleagues. Once again legislators cave and the nation loses.
3
gc,if this Administration wasn't trying to be so divisive while ignoring our laws and Constitution,they wouldn't have to worry about being transparent!!!! They should be working with Congress.
1
In today's world the only "honest politician" is one who stays bought. You are idealistically naïve. Hillary Clinton received at least $48 million to the "Clinton Foundation" that bought influence but her emails became "transparent" as well and were erased. The only check and balance is the two parties arguing - they actually have the best outcome when nothing is done because in reality who needs more laws and regulations beyond the multitude we have already. They really just pass "pork" projects most of the time. NO VALUE ADDED.
Currency manipulation, a monster and I suppose this benefits everyone as well as the US?
Thank you Senate Democrats! What kind of bubble is our President living in at this point?? Or is he perhaps doing this to ensure Wall Street support for Hillary in 2016? They should both change their party affiliation at this point!
16
Obama said to trust him on TPP. Why? When did he become an expert on international trade or have any better advisers than those opposing it? Trust him like we did with ACA and you can keep your doctor and plans? Sorry O. Fool me once, shame on me...no more.
14
Most good Democrats know Obama's run out of good ideas for quite a while.
Sad!
Sad!
10
John, the real point here is that for all you right wingers who call him a socialist/communist now you see that he is really a good capitalist!
3
Insisting on cramming Fast Track down voters' throats is where Obama and Republicans have gone wrong. Their lobbyists have had access to, and influence over, all of the details for years. Now the proponents want Fast Track to hide the dirty details. That's just wrong. Full and open debate in the House and Senate over all of the provisions of the TPP, with normal-bill opportunity to strip out the sneaky, soverign-defeating and otherwise disadvantageous multinational-friendly provisions, is the only acceptable procedure. Without that, Obama and the Republicans can forget any TPP approval.
15
jay26,just where do you get that the Rep. are trying to push Fast Tracks down voters throats????The bill is going to be presented and the Dem will get the opportunity to amend it!!! "Senator Mitch McConnell, Republican of Kentucky 'and the majority leader, promised Democrats the chance to amend the legislation."
And you believe him.
President Obama is trampling on a dying middle class by pushing the TPP which is nothing but a trade to give corporations more power to prosecute piracy. TPP isn't good for America and very much less for the poor.
16
The President was warned more than 3 month ago, by Senator Schumer, a powerful Democrat, not to push this trough:
"I’m going to see things through the prism I’m trying to get our entire caucus to look through, and I think just about everyone agrees: Does it help the middle class?"
"I told some business leaders, even if your trade agreement raises GDP and raises corporate profits, if it doesn’t help middle-class incomes, don’t count on us."
"We may have to oppose the president on parts of his trade agenda, but it will be middle-class focused and that will be very, very good for us,"
The President, to his detriment, did not listen.
http://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/6518212
"I’m going to see things through the prism I’m trying to get our entire caucus to look through, and I think just about everyone agrees: Does it help the middle class?"
"I told some business leaders, even if your trade agreement raises GDP and raises corporate profits, if it doesn’t help middle-class incomes, don’t count on us."
"We may have to oppose the president on parts of his trade agenda, but it will be middle-class focused and that will be very, very good for us,"
The President, to his detriment, did not listen.
http://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/6518212
16
Fast track process sounds like a form of bate and switch - make the treaty law before people know what is in it.
Something this big, this important, shouldn't it be thoroughly debated?
Shouldn't we see what's in it first?
If it turns out to be a security agreement dressed up as a trade agreement, shouldn't we know that too? Shouldn't we debat that too?
After American capitalist spending the last 40 years arming China's economy, now they want ordinary Americans to sign up to contain China too?
Maybe oridinary Americans don't want to expand America's security (imperial) interest.
Anyway there's nothing inherently wrong with a debate and everything inherently good.
So, lets have a debate. A thorough and transparent one.
What's wrong with that?
Something this big, this important, shouldn't it be thoroughly debated?
Shouldn't we see what's in it first?
If it turns out to be a security agreement dressed up as a trade agreement, shouldn't we know that too? Shouldn't we debat that too?
After American capitalist spending the last 40 years arming China's economy, now they want ordinary Americans to sign up to contain China too?
Maybe oridinary Americans don't want to expand America's security (imperial) interest.
Anyway there's nothing inherently wrong with a debate and everything inherently good.
So, lets have a debate. A thorough and transparent one.
What's wrong with that?
8
Fast-track doesn't remove the the ability for the Senate to read and vote up or down.
It does, however, prevent them from adding an extra hundred negotiators after-the-fact proposing amendments that they know full well would kill the treaty.
It does, however, prevent them from adding an extra hundred negotiators after-the-fact proposing amendments that they know full well would kill the treaty.
The President has experienced a painful but necessary lesson today.
America belongs to its people, and the people must have a say in the negotiation of any trade agreement that will likely have a profound on them.
As of today, neither Congress nor organized labor has had much of a role in the negotiation of this treaty.
If organized labor had been given as much of a role in the TPP negotiations as was corporate counsel, I doubt that there would have been much opposition to it - at least on the left.
As for President Obama's criticism of Elizabeth Warren, citing her opposition as those of "a politician", Mr. President, do you know something we don't know? Is Warren planning to run for President?
If Warren has no plan to run for higher office between now and the end of her current Senate term, then I would argue that Warren's actions were those of a patriot, not a politician.
America belongs to its people, and the people must have a say in the negotiation of any trade agreement that will likely have a profound on them.
As of today, neither Congress nor organized labor has had much of a role in the negotiation of this treaty.
If organized labor had been given as much of a role in the TPP negotiations as was corporate counsel, I doubt that there would have been much opposition to it - at least on the left.
As for President Obama's criticism of Elizabeth Warren, citing her opposition as those of "a politician", Mr. President, do you know something we don't know? Is Warren planning to run for President?
If Warren has no plan to run for higher office between now and the end of her current Senate term, then I would argue that Warren's actions were those of a patriot, not a politician.
25
Not a word, whether in the Times coverage, the Senate debate, or the administration rationale, on the import of the Trans-Pacific Partnership: it is merely the economic complement for the military alliance system designed to isolate and encircle China, thereby ensuring American hegemony in the Far East.
TPP is merely the ratcheting up of a New Cold War, the Obama Pivot, backed y the sustained placement of battle carrier groups and other "assets" in the region. Why else the deployment of forces if not integrally related to the trade push? Why else the unified package if not to force a confrontation, itself part of the global strategy of Containment?
Congress prattles about fast track, Democrats unctuously invoke labor rights, as meanwhile American multinationals reach the zenith of their power under this arrangement. If defeat should come, it will be for all of the wrong reasons, lack of sophistication on how best expand US capitalism.
TPP is merely the ratcheting up of a New Cold War, the Obama Pivot, backed y the sustained placement of battle carrier groups and other "assets" in the region. Why else the deployment of forces if not integrally related to the trade push? Why else the unified package if not to force a confrontation, itself part of the global strategy of Containment?
Congress prattles about fast track, Democrats unctuously invoke labor rights, as meanwhile American multinationals reach the zenith of their power under this arrangement. If defeat should come, it will be for all of the wrong reasons, lack of sophistication on how best expand US capitalism.
6
What makes labor rights "unctuous?" I guess you are against safe workplaces and decent wages. Just say so.
8
I believe Mr. Pollock is referring to Democrats as unctuous (and I agree with him), not labor rights.
President Obama has abandoned us Democrats who voted for him to become then remain president. Who knew I was voting for a Democrat snuggled somewhere between Dwight Eisenhower and Mitch McConnell?
30
President Obama has done more for you under impossible odds than you can ever begin to imagine. Whom would you have better voted for? On the TPP, you don't agree with him, and he evidently doesn't agree with you. The difference? He is President. If he seems arrogant, he's earned it in spades.
1
Jim,
Exactly. Obama is left. (of Milton Friedman)
Exactly. Obama is left. (of Milton Friedman)
1
No problem, after all you both are just as much a democrat as each other.
TPP presents an pained insight into a very flawed president. Imperious and aloof, Obama's intellectual arrogance (well perhaps just arrogance) have ultimately alienated friends and foes alike. When you get to the point when you are telling liberal Democrats they are idiots who just don't understand you know the President has hit rock bottom.
And - wait for it folks - when it is widely known that the killing of bin Laden was a total fabrication, well there goes the legacy. Not to keep you in suspense, the evidence is mounting (as reported by Seymour Hersh) that bin Laden was (1) already a prisoner of the Pakistanis. (2) was sold out by a Pakistani intelligence officer on the condition that bin Laden not survive the raid, (3) the raid was coordinated with the pakistani military, (4) bin Laden was unarmed and was taken into a room and cut to pieces by automatic fire. (5) there was no burial at sea, part of his body was scattered from a helicopter and the head etc sent to afghanistan and (6) the Obama press release on the subject was a purely political lie that betrayed agreements with Pakistan. Obama got reelected as the man bold enough to kill Obama. LOL
I will be forever grateful for Obamacare (if it ultimately works), but that may end up to be Obama's only legacy. Not chopped liver but not FDR either.
And - wait for it folks - when it is widely known that the killing of bin Laden was a total fabrication, well there goes the legacy. Not to keep you in suspense, the evidence is mounting (as reported by Seymour Hersh) that bin Laden was (1) already a prisoner of the Pakistanis. (2) was sold out by a Pakistani intelligence officer on the condition that bin Laden not survive the raid, (3) the raid was coordinated with the pakistani military, (4) bin Laden was unarmed and was taken into a room and cut to pieces by automatic fire. (5) there was no burial at sea, part of his body was scattered from a helicopter and the head etc sent to afghanistan and (6) the Obama press release on the subject was a purely political lie that betrayed agreements with Pakistan. Obama got reelected as the man bold enough to kill Obama. LOL
I will be forever grateful for Obamacare (if it ultimately works), but that may end up to be Obama's only legacy. Not chopped liver but not FDR either.
10
FDR was a failure, too. Just good and leading hype.
Although this has nothing to do with the subject of the article, I'm curious why Jonathan Weisman, the writer, kept referring to Barack Obama as "Mr." instead of President.
It's hard to imagine that big corporations are going to accept this defeat. They rule the entire world. Why would they allow this to stop them? It's too late for Americans to stop corporate America from destroying this country, they are too pervasive and powerful. But perhaps, if enough Americans unite, the tide may be turned, for a while.
It's hard to imagine that big corporations are going to accept this defeat. They rule the entire world. Why would they allow this to stop them? It's too late for Americans to stop corporate America from destroying this country, they are too pervasive and powerful. But perhaps, if enough Americans unite, the tide may be turned, for a while.
12
I want to say that I appreciate your comment regarding addressing our President as President Obama. It was nice to hear someone else mention this, too. All too often, I don't even hear or read the "Mr.," especially when Republican lawmakers are referring to him -- It's just "Obama." Totally disrespectful and also has the undercurrent of continuing pervasive racism, in my opinion.
2
"Although this has nothing to do with the subject of the article, I'm curious why Jonathan Weisman, the writer, kept referring to Barack Obama as "Mr." instead of President. "
Standard NYT practice is to cite the title the first time, Mr. in following instances. This goes back many, many years, and despite what commenters often suggest, is no slight to Pres. Obama.
Standard NYT practice is to cite the title the first time, Mr. in following instances. This goes back many, many years, and despite what commenters often suggest, is no slight to Pres. Obama.
2
This is long-established usage from the New York Times Style Book (now available electronically), and hardly began with this president. (AP, by the way, often refers to presidents, candidates and other politicians on second and subsequent references with only the last name; thus, "Obama" or "Romney" with no disrespect to be found.)
Nothing to be irate about here, no matter how hard you may wish otherwise.
Nothing to be irate about here, no matter how hard you may wish otherwise.
2
This ultra-secret draft international agreement is to be one of Obama's "signature" pieces. I commend those Dems who demand a better deal for Americans and are willing to go toe to toe with the president. However, I note the irony that when Repubs went against the president, particularly after the 2010 and 2014 shellackings, they were called racists and obstructionists. We need a president who is not in the pocket of Wall Street or the MIC. Obama, like his predecessors, clearly is.
25
@SW
It should be pretty obvious. This is a defeat by Democrats on a very specific issue: a secret trade bill. There is no 'irony' when comparing it to the GOtP going 'against' the president on everything and anything coming out of his mouth after 2010. The House voting 57 (or was it 58?) times 'against' Obamacare, which was THEIR idea before Obama embraced it; or shutting down the entire government in an attempt to blackmail the Executive into destroying his own bill, doesn't possess ANY equivalency to this defeat of a procedural vote on the TPP.
It should be pretty obvious. This is a defeat by Democrats on a very specific issue: a secret trade bill. There is no 'irony' when comparing it to the GOtP going 'against' the president on everything and anything coming out of his mouth after 2010. The House voting 57 (or was it 58?) times 'against' Obamacare, which was THEIR idea before Obama embraced it; or shutting down the entire government in an attempt to blackmail the Executive into destroying his own bill, doesn't possess ANY equivalency to this defeat of a procedural vote on the TPP.
3
"Ultra-secret"? The draft is available to every member of Congress. Bizarre characterization, but in tune with all the other misinformation being thrown about in the comments here.
I listened to Elizabeth Warren's explanation for why she is not supporting TPP, and I wonder what the h-e-double-hockey-sticks Obama is thinking. Is it true that other country's will be able to sue us if we increase the level of regulation in certain areas? Is it true that disputes will not be arbitrated in the courts, but instead will be decided by lawyers hired by companies involved? If so, then I reiterate: what is Obama thinking? I can only think that he is thinking only of his legacy. But why kind of legacy is it when he may be seen as responsible for delivering the death-knell to the middle class?
I'm convinced TPP is a bad deal overall. Supporters indicate that our products will finally be exported to overseas markets, but experience dictates that our exports are a drop in the bucket compared to the imports coming into this country. So why do we believe the people trying to push TPP? Moreover, how can they expect our support when the details are being kept from the public (you can see the details, but only if you are a member of congress and only can see the details in a secure room near the senate chamber, and no cameras or writing implements can be brought in). I understand that 85% of the entities involved in these negotiations are corporate representatives. As Sen. Warren said this morning, such tilted representation can only yield tilted results. We need to kill this disease we call TPP before it further degrades workers' quality of life.
I'm convinced TPP is a bad deal overall. Supporters indicate that our products will finally be exported to overseas markets, but experience dictates that our exports are a drop in the bucket compared to the imports coming into this country. So why do we believe the people trying to push TPP? Moreover, how can they expect our support when the details are being kept from the public (you can see the details, but only if you are a member of congress and only can see the details in a secure room near the senate chamber, and no cameras or writing implements can be brought in). I understand that 85% of the entities involved in these negotiations are corporate representatives. As Sen. Warren said this morning, such tilted representation can only yield tilted results. We need to kill this disease we call TPP before it further degrades workers' quality of life.
52
Obama has nothing but distain for the middle class. He has paid for obamacare on the backs of middle class taxpayers instead of the rich and also stole $740 billion from Medicare recipients to fund his program since he didn't want to hit his fellow 1%ers with that bill.
Watch what Obama does and not what he says if you wish to size him up.
Watch what Obama does and not what he says if you wish to size him up.
5
Have you or anybody seen the final draft of the agreement? If not, then why all the noise? Join the Tea Party, then you would make more sense. You and Ms Warren!!
Tommy,
I think the problem is that nearly 8 years of GOPer propaganda has convinced a lot of people that Obama is a lefty, liberal, enviro, socialist. He is not any of those things. He is a centrist company man.
I think the problem is that nearly 8 years of GOPer propaganda has convinced a lot of people that Obama is a lefty, liberal, enviro, socialist. He is not any of those things. He is a centrist company man.
4
On the breakdown of votes, it shows Mitch McConnell as the one Republican who voted NO. What's up with that??
Under Senate rules, the majority leader has to vote No in order to bring up the motion again later.
If you knew Senate procedures, you wouldn't be in the dark!! That No vote, allows him to recall the motion to debate.
Tell Senator Schumer he's losing my vote.
7
When the Ds lost big time in '10 and '12 they should have turned over their entire leadership. New faces, energy, ideas. Instead the kept Reid, Pill, Schu and others. Big mistake. Now they face '16 with the same stable of losers. We need Warren and others in leadership. Not the same old apparatchiks.
3
Bearing in mind this was a vote on a 'Procedural Motion' by the Senate.Though a set back for a later time, the Administration and Micheal Froman and Orin Hatch and Wyden ect. are not done.
Japan and Malaysia and currency manipulation:I do not specifically understand why Japan is against this and Malaysia has other issues/concerns that would pertain to them in this trade act.It's difficult when all is kept secret.Perhaps America could see the trade agreement?
And what about China and 'Currency Manipulation'?What if they decide to join in the future?Will they manipulate their currency still?or will we 'concession'it out for them?
Orin Hatch;"But on this bill we just can't have it on there.",his reference to 'currency manipulation'.Why is this Senator Hatch?Let us know!
TAA is really not a very beneficial piece of negotiating by the Republicans-it's small to them;it's not a very cost effective program in republicans eyes. Democrats,they should be asking and getting more especially down the road.
Senator McConnell the Keystone Pipeline was also a #1 Priority,and funny we use the same language for it's passage.The same for the TPP.
It is not true President Obama that TPP cannot be completed without TPA-So why do you need it?I know other Nations in the TPP would like to have it and have said that without TPA they would not agree but it seems as of today none have backed out ...Yet.....
These two trade deals are just way to secretive for most in congress and America.
Japan and Malaysia and currency manipulation:I do not specifically understand why Japan is against this and Malaysia has other issues/concerns that would pertain to them in this trade act.It's difficult when all is kept secret.Perhaps America could see the trade agreement?
And what about China and 'Currency Manipulation'?What if they decide to join in the future?Will they manipulate their currency still?or will we 'concession'it out for them?
Orin Hatch;"But on this bill we just can't have it on there.",his reference to 'currency manipulation'.Why is this Senator Hatch?Let us know!
TAA is really not a very beneficial piece of negotiating by the Republicans-it's small to them;it's not a very cost effective program in republicans eyes. Democrats,they should be asking and getting more especially down the road.
Senator McConnell the Keystone Pipeline was also a #1 Priority,and funny we use the same language for it's passage.The same for the TPP.
It is not true President Obama that TPP cannot be completed without TPA-So why do you need it?I know other Nations in the TPP would like to have it and have said that without TPA they would not agree but it seems as of today none have backed out ...Yet.....
These two trade deals are just way to secretive for most in congress and America.
2
Why won't the Senators hold a debate on the floor of these issues so that Americans can hear what is being proposed? This is looking more and more like a potential bait and switch with the swindlers hiding their intent. Kudos to the Democrats who are hold up the train.
10
My fellow Democrats seem to have forgotten that Americans are not only workers; they're also consumers. And it's not as though the trade deal is being rammed down anyone's throat. Congress will get a vote, albeit an up or down one. The Dems blew it this time.
9
The Fastrak method is "ramming down electorates" throat I am afraid. Furthermore, good paying American wages/income are more important than consumption. Enough said.
3
Stu you are so wrong.
3
They are also entitled to a debate on the trade agreement and fast-tracking.
3
Want to know why something happened? Explore the origin.
-What is TPP?
TPP is a trade agreement covering intellectual-property rights and financial regulations between the U.S. and 11 other nations: Australia, Brunei, Canada, Chile, Japan, Malaysia, Mexico, New Zealand, Peru, Singapore and Vietnam.
-What's the goal of TPP?
TPP is designed to challenge China’s dominance in the Asia-pacific region. China, as the world's most powerful and important trade nation, is slowly replacing the U.S.' position in global trade. U.S. allies, often bend to China's will in defiance to Washington because Washington can only offer military protection while China can offer prosperity. TPP purposely excluded China because it aims to tie those Chinese trade partners closer to the U.S.
-How would those nations be convinced to trade with U.S. more than China?
Lots and lots of pork. Like NAFTA, TPP will allow more jobs to be ship oversea and more items imported. The U.S. have to make it worthwhile for those nation to trade with U.S. and that's the only way. Most of the nations covered have an export based economy and selling more to the U.S. is the only thing they want.
-Who is benefiting from TPP?
Banks and large corporations that want to move more jobs oversea and import the goods back and jingoist factions that want the U.S. to challenge China's economic dominance.
-What is TPP?
TPP is a trade agreement covering intellectual-property rights and financial regulations between the U.S. and 11 other nations: Australia, Brunei, Canada, Chile, Japan, Malaysia, Mexico, New Zealand, Peru, Singapore and Vietnam.
-What's the goal of TPP?
TPP is designed to challenge China’s dominance in the Asia-pacific region. China, as the world's most powerful and important trade nation, is slowly replacing the U.S.' position in global trade. U.S. allies, often bend to China's will in defiance to Washington because Washington can only offer military protection while China can offer prosperity. TPP purposely excluded China because it aims to tie those Chinese trade partners closer to the U.S.
-How would those nations be convinced to trade with U.S. more than China?
Lots and lots of pork. Like NAFTA, TPP will allow more jobs to be ship oversea and more items imported. The U.S. have to make it worthwhile for those nation to trade with U.S. and that's the only way. Most of the nations covered have an export based economy and selling more to the U.S. is the only thing they want.
-Who is benefiting from TPP?
Banks and large corporations that want to move more jobs oversea and import the goods back and jingoist factions that want the U.S. to challenge China's economic dominance.
36
I might add that China and Japan own our "rear end" with all the U.S. Treasury notes and bonds that they hold. We don't get tough on China because we are afraid that they will dump our Treasury notes and bonds. Think about that as well. Japan is livid over the fact that the currency manipulation bill was tied in. Why? Because they want to manipulate the Yen relative to the dollar to hurt us financially.
2
"Washington can only offer military protection while China can offer prosperity." What a sad reality that is. I grew up in the most prosperous country on earth, we all did. Maybe it is time we got back to it.
3
Much ado about little. This is just the opening salvo in a long-term battle. Clearly a compromise will be achieved, probably to the benefit of displaced U. S. workers. Win-win.
TPP is not just a trade deal. It also is a vigorous response to Chinese-style lawlessness and economic bullying. Some people do not see a difference between the TPP nations and China in terms of workers' rights, enforcement of contracts, currency supports, environmental policy, and overall fairness on the playing field of commerce. Those people who do not see the obvious differences are denying simple reality.
TPP is not just a trade deal. It also is a vigorous response to Chinese-style lawlessness and economic bullying. Some people do not see a difference between the TPP nations and China in terms of workers' rights, enforcement of contracts, currency supports, environmental policy, and overall fairness on the playing field of commerce. Those people who do not see the obvious differences are denying simple reality.
2
No gloating please. This is but one step in which the check on power of the executive was exercised by the legislature. The future outcome of the TPP is as unpredictable as people. No gloating please, thanks.
5
President Obama justifiably lost all but one of his Democratic Senators in attempting to ram through "fast track" authority for the TPP. There were many reasons raised for Democrats uniting against their own President, but foremost among them was the lack of "transparency" in asking them to approve a document that is still incomplete, and classified as "secret." Given the sorry history of all previous trade deals for working Americans, it was simply unreasonable for the President to insist that his party which stands for good-paying, middle-class jobs to just "trust" him, but not "verify" until later. No responsible person should be asked to sign such a contract without knowing what's in it. The TPP may be a good deal, but let us see the fine print first. Then we can all decide if it's "Change we can believe in."
24
Except that no, this wasn't a vote to approve TPP. This was a vote for authority to take an up-or-down vote, no amendments, no filibusters; said Democrats would still have the ability to vote no on the actual treaty.
2
Spot on assessment. The President has not been transparent. The Devil is in the details...
1
Right On!!! We've got to know what's in TPP before it is passed.
1
The war isn't over. The TPP and TTIP not only needed to be derailed from the fast tracking they need to be thrown out all together. Shame on all of those involved in negotiating trade deals in secret. Obama has been a major disappointment.
Einstein's definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result. How has sending Democrats and Republicans to the hill worked out for us? They have both been at the helm and we are sinking.
Both parties work to put in place the agendas of their campaign financiers. Wouldn't you like to see a critical thinker in office?
Put your Congressional Members contact information into your phone. With this information at your fingertips you can contact all three in 6-8 minutes. Call/email every week and DEMAND CAMPAIGN FINANCE REFORM.
This is the most patriotic thing you can do. If you care about your country you will DEMAND CAMPAIGN FINANCE REFORM.
As a bonus imagine how crazy this will make the NSA. How can they target activists if we all are? Apathy is out- Activism is the new sexy.
DEMAND CAMPAIGN FINANCE REFORM.
Einstein's definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result. How has sending Democrats and Republicans to the hill worked out for us? They have both been at the helm and we are sinking.
Both parties work to put in place the agendas of their campaign financiers. Wouldn't you like to see a critical thinker in office?
Put your Congressional Members contact information into your phone. With this information at your fingertips you can contact all three in 6-8 minutes. Call/email every week and DEMAND CAMPAIGN FINANCE REFORM.
This is the most patriotic thing you can do. If you care about your country you will DEMAND CAMPAIGN FINANCE REFORM.
As a bonus imagine how crazy this will make the NSA. How can they target activists if we all are? Apathy is out- Activism is the new sexy.
DEMAND CAMPAIGN FINANCE REFORM.
18
How about we do what our Founding Fathers wanted us to do: have regular people go serve for a few years and then return to their lives to live under the same laws they passed for everybody else? How about no more careers in government? That would go a lot further than campaign finance reform.
If there need to be reviews of agreements, why does there have to be such secrecy. In Germany the opposition to a similar such trade pact with the US is immense!
8
Might the President be trying to provide cover for Democrats, especially Hillary, in guaranteeing a fair share of WS money in the 2016 election? It would also help guarantee the President that the economy would go out on a high note, with a hope and a prayer that po folks would be dragged along - no guarantee on this back end though.
1
With friends like his own party, who needs enemies
The Republican's make the world a more dangerous place
The Democrats are just plain incompetent
Mr Bloomberg, it really is time for a new radical center
The Republican's make the world a more dangerous place
The Democrats are just plain incompetent
Mr Bloomberg, it really is time for a new radical center
5
Why the necessity for fast track status? Why limit the debate process and the amendment procedures in Congress; isn't that what congress was created to do? If this is such a positive development, why not fast track EVERY bill that comes before Congress, have a simple up or down vote without debate and without amendments, and have the President agree beforehand to sign whatever bill comes to his desk following this process?
Considering how the democratic process in this country is supposed to work, it is all absurd!
Considering how the democratic process in this country is supposed to work, it is all absurd!
12
Warren won the war of words. It is good to let the President know that there are other viable alternatives in the interest of the nation and Warren could be a good alternative to presumed democratic nominee for 2016, Sec. Clinton. The senate vote has great significance on the future politics of the democratic party.
15
When will everybody realize Presidents are chosen, not elected....and they're not chosen by the people. Whether it be Obama, Bush,. democrat or republican, corporations run this country now, and have for a long time. Why do you think people like Ron Paul, Bernie Sanders and the like are always portrayed as crack pots.... because they go against the statue quo and offer real solutions to our problems. People think for yourselves!!
18
It really is true, the fix is in. The mainstream media won't even mention Bernie Sanders except to demean and belittle him. The party machine basically did in Howard Dean because he told the truth and they couldn't have that. They made him look crazy and we know they manipulated the sound so only his yell sounded above his young audience's voices. Chris Matthews is the worst for trying to marginalize and demean a good and honest leader like Elizabeth Warren or Bernie Sanders. Apparently, he is in on the fix for the next election.
5
Full disclosure - I am a lib, a Dem and a Progressive. But I don't understand why the Dems are eating other over the TPP. Some well-minded Dems are actually against trading with foreign countries. Good luck with that plan! Pun intended but that ship has sailed. No such thing as a self-sufficient country. Others are fighting TPP because they say there is not enough transparency. Not sure how that works with 12 countries negotiating every detail over the internet or in town hall forums. Complex legislation and treaties have to be discussed in a controlled environment if there is any hope to get to a workable framework. Every issue is arcane and complex and there are competing factions within and among each country. So we can have open public square discussions on things like patent rights and ISDS and monetary manipulation and best labor practices and on and on but we will either exhaust ourselves or we'll end up appointing a committee to negotiate on our behalf. Then have the committee present us a draft that we will read and vote on. Duh!
Too many red herrings being thrown up like there's no voice for labor. But as part of the TPP structure there is a labor committee of about 30 reps from various unions. Recommend reading the detailed TPP information at:
https://ustr.gov/trade-agreements/free-trade-agreements/trans-pacific-pa...
Let's not put our head in the sand.
Too many red herrings being thrown up like there's no voice for labor. But as part of the TPP structure there is a labor committee of about 30 reps from various unions. Recommend reading the detailed TPP information at:
https://ustr.gov/trade-agreements/free-trade-agreements/trans-pacific-pa...
Let's not put our head in the sand.
4
Do the labor representatives have any real power or are they just for show? Once fast track is approved, if it is, only the President will have power. Then the vote, up or down, will be the only choice. Why is there secrecy surrounding the proposal? Why should we buy a pig in a poke? NAFTA hasn't worked out well for us. Losses of U.S. jobs have been greater than gains. You probably say it would've happened anyway, but please prove that if you can. I no longer trust this process and I am quickly becoming disenamored of Obama after having voted for him.
5
Liberals out-republicaning republicans today... never would I have thought our party would seriously block lifting environmental standards in the developing world.
What a shame.
What a shame.
7
This is karma from 2008 and earlier for wrecking the economy and then not doing any correction. We still need to restore the incomes of the middle class and poor. Probably a basic income is the only solution. But you have to know the karma is REALLY bad if even the Democratic Senators feel the heat.
3
Why is it all our presidents, left and right, drink the "free trade cool aid" which clearly has eroded our "everyday" American lifestyle?
19
We need fair trade, free trade has been one big lie and has harmed us and our deficits are to the moon and back. We have lost 70,000 jobs with the recent Korean trade deal. Why is it good that we should continue to lose American jobs with bad trade deals ?
4
I have renewed optimism of the Senate, especially now that Senate Democrats blocked another takeover of our country by Corporate America.
15
A lot of commenters are missing the point. This vote didn't reject the TPP. All this does is tell the President that Congress reserves the right to amend or filibuster the final TPP agreement (which doesn't exist yet). Even if the trade promotion authority eventually passes, TPP can still be defeated on a straight up-or-down vote.
4
No, people are not missing that. It is exactly the "fast track" authority that is at issue. I think the agreement might be a good thing if we can have protections for OUR workers, OUR environment, OUR currency, OUR laws and OUR borders. If fast track authority is given, yes and up or down vote is the next step. By that time, a whole new group of representatives may be in the House and who knows how that vote will go even if the trade agreement is odious? Instead of negotiating a bad agreement let's make sure our Representatives have a say beforehand as to what is essential to US. Let's not give Obama the farm to negotiate away, and I say this as a Democrat who voted for him.
3
Maybe President Obama should cast aside his current party affiliation and become a member of the Independents. With this kind of loyalty he might be able to juggle legislation to garner votes .
1
Kill this bill. Put a stake in its heart and bury it for good. These free trade agreements have brought wealth to the 1% at the expense of the 99%. The promises Bill Clinton made over NAFTA turned up to be false. Why Obama is determined to make the same mistake baffles me; it shows how close he is to Wall Street and how out of touch with mainstream America. Maybe Hilary Clinton, with Elizabeth Warren and Bernie Sanders to urge her on, will not be so wrongheaded.
12
Hillary "We left the White House dead broke" is not out of touch with mainstream American?
1
Thank you Democrats for standing up to the President and the Republicans who are pushing for this partnership. Elizabeth Warren is the conscience of the Senate. As much as I would like to see her throw her hat in the ring; she's much more effective serving the American pubic in the Senate. She defeated Scott Brown without benefit of PAC donations. I was happy to donate to her campaign in 2012 and still send donations her way.
13
So who are the obstructionists in Congress now?
2
When something needs to be prevented, it is good to obstruct, as you call it.
2
One person's obstructionist is another person's freedom fighter.
"This is about trying to accomplish something important for the country that happens to be the president’s No. 1 domestic priority,” Mr. McConnell said."
There's 100 better things to focus on than this trade agreement. I am against it and I am against the impulses that got it going and put the various bad provisions in it (rumored only, of course, since we can't see the bill) that will do nothing for American workers but will do much against them.
Somebody better wake up and realize that the people out here are all sick of the elite of any and all parties and persuasions and we are really sick and tired of them using the government to direct money into their pockets and jobs and wages away from ours.
There's 100 better things to focus on than this trade agreement. I am against it and I am against the impulses that got it going and put the various bad provisions in it (rumored only, of course, since we can't see the bill) that will do nothing for American workers but will do much against them.
Somebody better wake up and realize that the people out here are all sick of the elite of any and all parties and persuasions and we are really sick and tired of them using the government to direct money into their pockets and jobs and wages away from ours.
12
So, you oppose something based on rumors, and not only that, you oppose it to the extent that an up-or-down vote isn't good enough?
I've never voted for a GOP candidate in my life. The Dems just lost my vote for 16 on this issue. I've become increasingly sick of the fringe of the Dems setting the tone. We have the POTUS and all we need to do is not be radical. Yet, the party does stupid things like oppose trade. I may not vote GOP in 16, probably will not due to their bigoted and hate filled rhetoric and candidates but I will not vote Dem now.
2
This isn't about "opposing trade." It's about giving away the Congress' power to oversea anything except up or down on TPP. NAFTA has come back to bite us. Free trade may be great but let's see what exactly is being proposed and have OPEN debates about how it will effect United States citizens for a change. Then, let the President know what will be acceptable in our negotiations. Is it an ego thing for these Presidents to have free rein on these trade deals? If you want to go over the the Republicans because some Senate Democrats developed some spine, go for it. I think you are missing the point here.
3
Glad to hear that, because WE don't need ignorant voters.
1
What does that leave.
Rep. Grayson called the TPP a punch in the gut to the middle class. Today that punch was blocked. But we must keep defending.
13
It is normal for us all to live for the moment. Consider whether our descendants will have a good life with a good job as we did. Do you care about your offspring and theirs? Keep industry here in America. America first!
10
You mean: "Keep trade barriers high so that nobody will buy our extravagantly priced goods and services, and avoid pushing other countries to enforce intellectual property law and instead continue to blatantly rip off our patents and copyrights".
1
This president doesn't have the political capital, or the stamina for any legislative fight. If he thought he could count on Democrats in congress, whom he has ignored for the last seven years, he has a rude awakening.
8
Correction regarding Senate democrats: Obama is not "their president". He's our president and therefore accountable to all of us. But I'm nitpicking; and curious...why protect American workers now at this late date? Trying to revive a rotting corpse is generally a futile endeavor. I say go for it and ram the knife in that last inch. The American middle class and most blue collar jobs - those with wages above poverty levels - are doomed. Let the billionaires reap the whirlwind. They'll find a way no matter what.
2
Cheer up, Zoot.
So much for the meme that Republicans automatically oppose anything the president is for, and would do anything to diminish his legacy.
“This is not a game. This is about trying to accomplish something important for the country that happens to be the president’s No. 1 domestic priority,” Mr. McConnell said.
“This is not a game. This is about trying to accomplish something important for the country that happens to be the president’s No. 1 domestic priority,” Mr. McConnell said.
3
Perhaps the Senate Democrats are having the genuine desire to fight for the identity of their political franchise.
6
This is not the last vote on the the TPP. Those of us opposed need to keep up the pressure by letting our Senators know how we feel. I just did. I thanked one and told the other how sorry I was that she voted for it. We need to hold these people accountable. It's more than voting every two to six years.
10
Why does the article not name the Democrats who voted against the president?
3
Here you go.
http://www.senate.gov/legislative/LIS/roll_call_lists/roll_call_vote_cfm...
The NYT practically never posts the roll call numbers, or, for that matter, bill references -- let alone provide links to the official record. It's as if they don't quite realize that hyperlinks are possible on the WWW.
http://www.senate.gov/legislative/LIS/roll_call_lists/roll_call_vote_cfm...
The NYT practically never posts the roll call numbers, or, for that matter, bill references -- let alone provide links to the official record. It's as if they don't quite realize that hyperlinks are possible on the WWW.
3
Why isn't there a complete vote total shown? I want to know who is either bought already or too dumb not to vote against it.
1
Because it was all of them except one (Senator Carper of Delaware). But, Mark, you're on to something when you ask about the astonishing spectacle of virtually every Democrat voting against a Democratic president on an issue dear to him. I know the reasons given for their vote and I heard the president say they are all wrong although the barb was directed at Elizabeth Warren. He's either brilliant and far-sighted or, just maybe, exhibiting poor judgment and stubbornness.
2
I really didn’t know what side to take until now.
“At the heart of Democrats’ demands is a measure that would force the government to respond when trading partners artificially depress the value of their currency to make their exports cheaper and United States exports more expensive.” WE LOSE!
“But if Democrats successfully force Mr. McConnell to include that currency measure in the trade promotion bill, the negotiations could collapse.” So we must exclude the currency measure to insure that WE LOSE!
“At the heart of Democrats’ demands is a measure that would force the government to respond when trading partners artificially depress the value of their currency to make their exports cheaper and United States exports more expensive.” WE LOSE!
“But if Democrats successfully force Mr. McConnell to include that currency measure in the trade promotion bill, the negotiations could collapse.” So we must exclude the currency measure to insure that WE LOSE!
3
Some time ago I read an excellent book written by renowned academics, which names I cannot now recall (if someone can refresh me I would be appreciative), the inescapable conclusion of which is that, throughout history, governments that lose the faith of the governed soon fall. While none of us wish that for our beloved country, I think we would be well served to study history. Whether TPP would, in fact, represent a net positive for signatory nations cannot be determined in the context of such secrecy, and the secrecy itself has given rise to a palpable loss of faith. The zeitgeist hints at change which, if it comes, will have come none too soon.
12
EArly in Obama's first term, I saw him described as a "corporatist". I felt Obama was our last best hope for a roll back of corporate power, and did not think the definition fit.
I have changed my mind.
The problem is, that since the advent of the "free market economy" by the Reaganites, we have been led to believe that wealth would trickle down and that tax breaks, less regulation etc would be a tide that lifts all boats.
But the middle class continues to sink, and unfortunately our President is continuing the process.
The ultimate end game of all this deregulation, and corporatist government, will, of course, be environmental Armageddon.
Then the 1%ers will be sunk too.
I have changed my mind.
The problem is, that since the advent of the "free market economy" by the Reaganites, we have been led to believe that wealth would trickle down and that tax breaks, less regulation etc would be a tide that lifts all boats.
But the middle class continues to sink, and unfortunately our President is continuing the process.
The ultimate end game of all this deregulation, and corporatist government, will, of course, be environmental Armageddon.
Then the 1%ers will be sunk too.
4
More proof that Corporations are not People.
They have far more power and influence.
They have far more power and influence.
22
How ironic. Some Senators are complaining about currency manipulation when really the only thing the Bank of Japan is doing is the same exact thing the Federal Reserve is doing. Quantitative Easing: the practice of stimulating domestic demand by depressing the value of currency. Inflation is worryingly low in advanced economies around the world and QE is needed everywhere. I hope the Democrats come to their senses and stop pretending that by opposing the TPP, they're being heroes of the middle class.
5
But there are many more countries than just Japan involved.
1
NAFTA was sold to us as necessary response to the formation of the European Union. Maybe NAFTA did help Ford and GM compete with Daimler-Benz and Volkswagen, but the net loss of American factory jobs and Mexican farm jobs wasn't worth it. But here's the thing... for every job we lost to Mexico since NAFTA, we lost three to Asia. We ignore China at our peril.
TPP is simply too dangerous to allow. But we really need to be talking about alternatives to TPP, maybe a "people's trade agreement" one that can show the American people and Congress that it is possible to promote and regulate trade for the benefit of the many, and not the few.
TPP is simply too dangerous to allow. But we really need to be talking about alternatives to TPP, maybe a "people's trade agreement" one that can show the American people and Congress that it is possible to promote and regulate trade for the benefit of the many, and not the few.
15
The 'peoples trade agreement" is called tariffs.
1
Wow! This is great news. Obama of all people, a lawyer no less, wants this country to sign on the dotted line without reading the document. Would he advise a client to do this? It would be attorney malpractice. Who is he shilling for? All the talk about the middle class and working class that issues from the White House seems to be just hot air. How about standing up to the corporations and the plutocrats? I am not an isolationist by any means, but anyone with eyes, or for that matter even the vision impaired for that matter, can see the devastation wrought by the likes of Nafta and the other so-called "free trade" agreements. At this point, tariffs on most goods are already practically non-existent. The TPP doesn't lower tariffs significantly. Rather it takes the already much degraded control of matters such as regulation, environment, etc. away from Americans and hands it over to the corporations.
Oh yes! I forgot of course. Corporations are people too! (I'll believe that line when Texas starts executing corporations!)
That said, Obama is dead wrong on Fast Track. I voted for him, but am overjoyed that he is humiliated on this count.
Thank you Senator Warren. Thank you Senator Brown. You did yourselves proud today. As for President Obama, shame on you.
Oh yes! I forgot of course. Corporations are people too! (I'll believe that line when Texas starts executing corporations!)
That said, Obama is dead wrong on Fast Track. I voted for him, but am overjoyed that he is humiliated on this count.
Thank you Senator Warren. Thank you Senator Brown. You did yourselves proud today. As for President Obama, shame on you.
27
"Without reading the document?" That's a falsehood. The full text of the agreement is available to any member of Congress. There may be good arguments against passage, but secrecy is not one of them.
"devastation wrought by the likes of Nafta"
Didn't happen, but feel free to continue your reflexive fearmongering. Then read up on Smoot-Hawley.
https://fas.org/sgp/crs/row/R42965.pdf
--
Studies by the U.S. International Trade Commission (USITC) on the effects of NAFTA pointed out the difficulty in isolating the agreement’s effects from other factors. Although the effects of NAFTA are not easily measured, the USITC provided some estimates over the years. A 2003 study estimated that U.S. GDP could experience an increase between 0.1% and 0.5% upon full
implementation of the agreement. Another USITC study that was congressionally mandated in 1997 offered a comprehensive assessment of the operation and effects of NAFTA after three years. The report estimated that NAFTA had a small, but positive, effect on the overall U.S. economy. Some of the findings include the following: data inadequacies at the industry level made it difficult to isolate the effects of NAFTA on absolute trade flows; U.S. trade with NAFTA partners increased more rapidly than U.S. trade with the rest of the world; the share of U.S. exports in the Mexican market increased by a higher percentage than the share of total imports from other countries; industries such as autos, chemicals, textiles, and electronics benefitted by achieving synergies across the North American market.
Didn't happen, but feel free to continue your reflexive fearmongering. Then read up on Smoot-Hawley.
https://fas.org/sgp/crs/row/R42965.pdf
--
Studies by the U.S. International Trade Commission (USITC) on the effects of NAFTA pointed out the difficulty in isolating the agreement’s effects from other factors. Although the effects of NAFTA are not easily measured, the USITC provided some estimates over the years. A 2003 study estimated that U.S. GDP could experience an increase between 0.1% and 0.5% upon full
implementation of the agreement. Another USITC study that was congressionally mandated in 1997 offered a comprehensive assessment of the operation and effects of NAFTA after three years. The report estimated that NAFTA had a small, but positive, effect on the overall U.S. economy. Some of the findings include the following: data inadequacies at the industry level made it difficult to isolate the effects of NAFTA on absolute trade flows; U.S. trade with NAFTA partners increased more rapidly than U.S. trade with the rest of the world; the share of U.S. exports in the Mexican market increased by a higher percentage than the share of total imports from other countries; industries such as autos, chemicals, textiles, and electronics benefitted by achieving synergies across the North American market.
The owners of the businesses benefitted. Not the workers.
1
By declaring Elizabeth Warren to be "absolutely wrong" on her comments about TPP, Mr. Obama demonstrated a level of passion uncharacteristic for him. Publicly expressing such strong feeling and yet revealing so little about TPP should make people very uneasy and demand to know what it contains. We must learn a lot more about how the American worker will benefit. Is there benefit? It will need to be tangible, not trickle-down.
23
I trusted the POTUS on most issues over the years. He is a snake in the grass on this one, though. We need to kill that deal. Dead. Burn it. Bury it. And never forget so this snake oil can never be perpetrated again.
3
Anytime Obama starts scolding Americans or legislators we hold in high esteem, we should be on high alert.
3
The concern appears to be that what little manufacturing base we have left in this country will be eroded by the TPP. Obama blew it when he picked up a pubic fight with Warren and repeatedly called her wrong. In a recent interview, he even said that he must be 'stupid' to do what Warren alleges will happen to Dodd-Frank bill, thereby implying that the senator was stupid to make that charge.
Obama cannot get people on board with his 'my way or highway' posturing.
It must hurt to be lonely in your lameduck years.
Obama cannot get people on board with his 'my way or highway' posturing.
It must hurt to be lonely in your lameduck years.
16
In his inspiring State of the Union Address, President Obama promised he would use the full powers of his office and his administration to advance economic justice and environmental health. He instead immediately abandoned this promise and put all his political capital behind pushing through the TPP corporate rights agreement designed to accelerate the concentration of wealth and the rape of nature. I am so grateful to the Democratic Senators who saw through Obama's deception and stood up for democracy and working people.
The battle is far from over. Hopefully this may be a first step toward reversing the insanity of corporate rights agreements like NAFTA and TPP that transfer the sovereignty of people and nations to transnational corporations. There is much work ahead to craft international agreements that strengthen corporate responsibilities rather than corporate rights and that support democracy, living people, living Earth, and the right of every person everywhere to a full, meaningful, and prosperous life.
The battle is far from over. Hopefully this may be a first step toward reversing the insanity of corporate rights agreements like NAFTA and TPP that transfer the sovereignty of people and nations to transnational corporations. There is much work ahead to craft international agreements that strengthen corporate responsibilities rather than corporate rights and that support democracy, living people, living Earth, and the right of every person everywhere to a full, meaningful, and prosperous life.
16
It's the secrecy. If it is so darn good for the people, why is it kept so secret from the people? "Trust me" from the government and the business world doesn't fly anymore. Moneyed interests are not looking out for the people of the world.
"Fool me once, shame on you - fool me twice, shame on me".
"Fool me once, shame on you - fool me twice, shame on me".
18
Funny. I seem to recall the accusations of treason and other denunciations as others questioned the opacity of Pres. Obama's negotiations with Iran.
Or, as GW Bush once said, "Fool me once, shame on you - fool me twice.... well, just don't fool me again."
Another little battle between those wanting a society focused on people and those promoting corporations as people.
Obama is preparing for his time after the presidency, which includes getting donations for an after-presidency foundation (or something similar) from the same sources of the campaign-financing feeding trough, corporations and the wealthy. These are most rich wealthy conservatives and corporate executives receiving compensation not related to performance, and political hacks similar to those that populate the Supreme Court as well as wannabee conservative voters.
You have to love Warren. She is exactly where she should be.
Obama is preparing for his time after the presidency, which includes getting donations for an after-presidency foundation (or something similar) from the same sources of the campaign-financing feeding trough, corporations and the wealthy. These are most rich wealthy conservatives and corporate executives receiving compensation not related to performance, and political hacks similar to those that populate the Supreme Court as well as wannabee conservative voters.
You have to love Warren. She is exactly where she should be.
20
"You have to love Warren. She is exactly where she should be."
Writing almost no legislation of import, passing nothing of significance?
Writing almost no legislation of import, passing nothing of significance?
Secret courts, rubber stamp search warrants, secret recordings and analyses of every communication by Beltway firms serving billionaire investors, classified trade talks, more prosecutions of journalists by Obama than every previous president combined, the list goes on. Do you even recognize the country anymore? This deal is just the burnishing of the president's credentials for his next act as a corporate board member and provider of six-figure speeches to industry. Like CAFTA, the TPP is highly unlikely to deliver a single claimed benefit.
13
Hooray ! We have to stay on our guard because even if they put in some of these provisions to try and pass it....they won't be enforced ! We can't enforce anything in communist Vietnam...just look at Nike and the lack of real change with human rights in Vietnam. There is no way to compete with 56 cents an hour such as those wages in Vietnam.
We have lost 60 ,000 manufacturing plants and millions of American jobs with all those trade agreements we were sold on by our former Presidents. The recent trade agreement with Japan has caused 40,000 jobs to be lost in Pennsylvania alone, just think about the rest of the country's lost jobs. You can't talk about inequality and then cause more job losses by passing a trade agreement. TPP was written by global corporations and their lobbyists while simultaneously keeping it secret from the American public. We know why...it would hand over government power to corporations from the American people...that's when you lose democracy. Hillary can't afford to dance around anymore on where she stands on TPP, this is a huge issue for American workers. If she says it needs to have enforcements, well, they said the same thing about the other trade agreements and guess what....it didn't happen ! There is no way to enforce, it never happens ! And by the way, Baltimore had thousands of good paying steel jobs and guess what .... trade deals gave all those good American jobs to Asia. Bernie Sanders has my vote !
We have lost 60 ,000 manufacturing plants and millions of American jobs with all those trade agreements we were sold on by our former Presidents. The recent trade agreement with Japan has caused 40,000 jobs to be lost in Pennsylvania alone, just think about the rest of the country's lost jobs. You can't talk about inequality and then cause more job losses by passing a trade agreement. TPP was written by global corporations and their lobbyists while simultaneously keeping it secret from the American public. We know why...it would hand over government power to corporations from the American people...that's when you lose democracy. Hillary can't afford to dance around anymore on where she stands on TPP, this is a huge issue for American workers. If she says it needs to have enforcements, well, they said the same thing about the other trade agreements and guess what....it didn't happen ! There is no way to enforce, it never happens ! And by the way, Baltimore had thousands of good paying steel jobs and guess what .... trade deals gave all those good American jobs to Asia. Bernie Sanders has my vote !
12
As it is, we cannot buy American Catfish in our supermarkets anymore - that industry destroyed by cheap, imported Vietnamese Swahi. With TPP, what next?
3
GOOD!
He has lost me completely. FISA, Snowden, TPP, drilling in the Artic, and free pass for illegals.
What next!
He has lost me completely. FISA, Snowden, TPP, drilling in the Artic, and free pass for illegals.
What next!
11
C'mon folks. Let's give our president credit. He's been an enormous ally, a loyal friend, a devoted advocate...
To corporations.
To quote Rick Perry: the Zeitgeist among Obama voters has become "oops."
To corporations.
To quote Rick Perry: the Zeitgeist among Obama voters has become "oops."
6
I'll still take him any day over anything resembling the policies of Rick Perry. Republicans are a nightmare and it's lights out for this country if they control all branches of government. It's not "oops", but more like "I wish our country's corporations didn't have so much influence in this country that they are actually controlling not only republican politicians, but democrat politicans as well".
2
Obama is the one who is plain wrong on this and here's a good indication. Name calling is the last refuge of a person who doesn't have a good argument. Calling Elizabeth Warren a "politician" as if that's a pejorative, the President seems to forget that he too is a politician. If we're supposed to dismiss her reasoned argument that the ISDS (INVESTOR_STATE- DISPUTE SETTLEMENT) --one letter way from ISIS, btw--is a serious threat to US jobs and health, safety regulations, because she's a politician, why not dismiss his politician's argument that says only "this will be good for you. Trust me." I don't. He's a politician, after all.
12
Obama has sunk to a new low. Now his own party is against him.
9
It's worse then you think: now the Republicans are for him :-)
3
Only on this issue. Take it from me - a lifelong democrat. Obama is right on most issues, but he is dead-wrong on this one.
2
I can't believe how shortsighted all these naysayers are. The attacks on President Obama are equally shocking. Many people seem to have made up their minds based solely on our NAFTA experience but most of its weaknesses have been addressed in this pact. If our faith in free markets is genuine and if we realize how serious the Chinese are about toppling US from world markets -even our value added products in Technology and Medicine are in peril, we have no choice but to bite the bullet and go forward with the treaty. For our part, each one of us should value products made in the U.S. and buy them instead of cravenly buying foreign goods. And, let labor prove that it's artisans are as good and skilled as the foreign ones.
3
The president refuses to release the whole text of the agreement so that those who represent us can understand what the deal is. My Senator, Elizabeth Warren is a smart as a whip and knows her way around economics and deals etc. She voted against it. If the text not available to those who represent our interests how are we to know what's going on.
Of course, trade is good. Asia is important. What's the president hiding? What promises has he made he doesn't want us to know about?
Of course, trade is good. Asia is important. What's the president hiding? What promises has he made he doesn't want us to know about?
5
One of the biggest problems with the US approach to the TPP is that the US sees it as an anti China organisation and that approach is doomed to failure as already many of the countries wanting to form the TPP have free trade agreements with China and all of them say that despite what the US wants to do that China is going to have to be brought into the TPP at some time in the future. Also the worlds biggest currency manipulator is actually the US not China.
1
President Obama's "Trust Me" position on this "Secret Treaty" is beyond ludicrous and just plain frightening . It wouldn't be accepted as a plot for a grade "B" movie . Something is very wrong here and defies logic . Add to his eerie rationale the support by McConnell, Orin Hatch, John Cornyn and even Chuck Schumer and Ron Wyden and the word "Conspiracy" comes immediately to mind . Is this the planned final "death knell" for working Americans and our Democracy ? Convince yourself and me that I am wrong . Do you really trust any of the aforementioned so-called "leaders" !!??
10
My response to your last question is a big fat NO!
2
When Barak Obama and Scott Walker are on the same side of an issue, Barak Obama should be ashamed of himself.
12
Good job Senate Democrats for stopping this unholy alliance of GOP (big business) and the unilateral president. You have earned your salary for today. There is absolutely no need to fast track this without public scrutiny. Even Ross Perot would be proud of you.
9
GOOD. Fast-tracking ANYTHING out of the full light of day is suspicious and antithetical to Obama's promise of transparency in government. Let the details be known by one and all and real debate made on the issue.
13
I would vote for Warren That woman could actually do the job.
Free trade deals don't help Americans in a world where China does not play by the same standards.
There is no such thing as a Free trade agreement.
Free trade deals don't help Americans in a world where China does not play by the same standards.
There is no such thing as a Free trade agreement.
10
If Sen. Warren were actually doing her job, she'd be writing far more legislation than press conference speeches.
By speaking in such disparaging tones about Elizabeth Warren, Obama sounded like your average bought and paid for GOP Senator Wachovia or Senator Bank of America of North Carolina. It was appalling to realize what I was hearing. The governor of North Carolina (Pat McCrory) is a former energy executive content to see residents in his state breathe and effectively drink coal ash a la residents of China's ruined and degraded environmental landscape. Obama was absolutely mistaken to put himself in such company.
Perhaps it's too early to say so, but the Democratic Party may have a new leader who is female. And her name is not Clinton, but rather Warren.
Perhaps it's too early to say so, but the Democratic Party may have a new leader who is female. And her name is not Clinton, but rather Warren.
42
As a progressive, the outcome of this vote makes me very happy. Now we have arctic drilling; next comes a complete capitulation in our efforts to care for those here at home. Let multinationals pay their taxes first; abolish child labor. Let all workers earn a reasonable wage and living conditions. Only then should we discuss any such "trade" agreements.
3
This not one party against the other. This is the legislature against the executive.
7
And amazingly, it's the legislature that's in the right this time. Let's hope they don't back down.
4
Rather the executive against the people. No enforcement means allowing the foreign countries to cheat (that is assuming the agreement has provisions for environmental controls, occupational safety requirements, and against using child and/or forced labor, etc.) This allows foreign countries to circumvent US laws and sovereignty. Currency manipulation cannot compensate for the labor rates of about $1/hr in developing countries like India and Viet Nam. Apparently, Obama has sold himself to the multinational corporations. He has proved that he cares only for himself (e.g. the $500,000 speeches after his presidency) and has no regard to America, its constitution, nor its citizens.
4
@ronbow1961: Nobody's perfect, especially President.
- owldog[1948].
- owldog[1948].
Elizabeth Warren put an arrow through the heart of this deal. I believe Obama took his caucus for granted, and was caught by total surprise.
24
If Corporations are People, why were Corporations allowed to negotiate, draft, and approve the contents of this "Secret" agreement, and We The People were not even allowed to see it?
Answer: Corporations are not People. In the eyes of OUR government, they are superior.
Answer: Corporations are not People. In the eyes of OUR government, they are superior.
42
"If Corporations are People, why were Corporations allowed to negotiate, draft, and approve the contents of this "Secret" agreement, and We The People were not even allowed to see it?"
Absolutely! This question should be brought before SCOTUS.
Absolutely! This question should be brought before SCOTUS.
Hopefully the 3 senators who missed the vote will be named.
5
Why would the U. S. want a trade deal where the trading partners can deliberately cheat?
14
Because corporations, never lose, only citizens like us always lose..
4
It is not a matter of the president lacking clout with his own party, it is the president being in a situation where half the country and more than half the Congress fear that they are being sold a pig in a poke. The public worries that America is being asked to step into a room where the light is dim and once inside the door locks behind us and we cannot get out and we don’t know where the air is coming from.
People fear that fast track may become a nightmare. The TPP may be good for America or it may become NAFTA on steroids. There is no good reason why it cannot be examined, debated and made public before we are dragged into it rather than afterward when nothing can be done. The TPP has been negotiated by corporations and banks. Who represented American workers? Obama is no friend of labor unions the unions complain, yet Obama is urging fast track of a TPP which is marked Top Secret.
Simply put Obama has the burden of proof on convincing the Congress and the public that fast track is in the interest of America. In my opinion that burden has not been met, although I am a Democrat and an Obama supporter; I just don’t buy it and the Senate does not either.
People fear that fast track may become a nightmare. The TPP may be good for America or it may become NAFTA on steroids. There is no good reason why it cannot be examined, debated and made public before we are dragged into it rather than afterward when nothing can be done. The TPP has been negotiated by corporations and banks. Who represented American workers? Obama is no friend of labor unions the unions complain, yet Obama is urging fast track of a TPP which is marked Top Secret.
Simply put Obama has the burden of proof on convincing the Congress and the public that fast track is in the interest of America. In my opinion that burden has not been met, although I am a Democrat and an Obama supporter; I just don’t buy it and the Senate does not either.
20
The light isn't dim. We have NAFTA. How's that workin' for us?
2
Fast-track authority doesn't prevent making it public or debating it. It only prohibits amendments and filibustering.
President Obama has nobody but himself to blame for this defeat. By cloaking the Trans-Pacific Partnership in a veil of secrecy without revealing the contents of the bill and then trying to "fast track" it with "we know what's best for you...just trust us" position he gave the appearance (justified or not) of trying to pull the wool over our eyes. ("Pay no attention to that man behind the curtain!") And my suspicions were doubled by Republican's support for the bill! It must have had some sweet corporate giveaways if THEY were behind it those who would do anything to deny Obama any victory. Next time, let's have some transparency and public debate.
19
David, Yes, Transparency and public debate... just like we also didn't have with Obamacare legislation, either. Americans' are sick of this President forcing "secret" things to our American throats.
2
Do you feel about global inequality? How do you feel about creating an opportunity for developing countries to grow and close part of the gap with the developed world? If you think about it you can't be for those things and against free trade.
Maybe your view is - the rest of the world be damned, i just care about American jobs. That's not my view but I am not fit to judge anyone's opinions. But in that case you should just keep in mind that trade doesn't simply mean American imports more and exports less. It is is both. Of course free trade means there is a change in the mixture of things that American workers do. Perhaps less manufacturing, perhaps more high skill work. But unless you want to prop those industries up indefinitely with government money then that change is going to happen eventually. The moral imperative is to help re-train people to help them transition to other work. Everybody has a right to a job and an opportunity to take care of their family. Nobody has a right to decide exactly which sector or industry they are going to work in and demand to be protected against changes in the world economy.
Ask yourself - would Wisconsin be better off if it just shut its borders and stopped trading with every other state? What about the zip code you live in? You would have to compete with more workers but there would be more opportunities and you'd benefit from all the things you could import. Nothing magical is different when you talk about international trade.
Maybe your view is - the rest of the world be damned, i just care about American jobs. That's not my view but I am not fit to judge anyone's opinions. But in that case you should just keep in mind that trade doesn't simply mean American imports more and exports less. It is is both. Of course free trade means there is a change in the mixture of things that American workers do. Perhaps less manufacturing, perhaps more high skill work. But unless you want to prop those industries up indefinitely with government money then that change is going to happen eventually. The moral imperative is to help re-train people to help them transition to other work. Everybody has a right to a job and an opportunity to take care of their family. Nobody has a right to decide exactly which sector or industry they are going to work in and demand to be protected against changes in the world economy.
Ask yourself - would Wisconsin be better off if it just shut its borders and stopped trading with every other state? What about the zip code you live in? You would have to compete with more workers but there would be more opportunities and you'd benefit from all the things you could import. Nothing magical is different when you talk about international trade.
2
You obviously don't slum down at the level of the American working class. It has nothing to do with insensitivity towards the developing world anymore than concerns about vast numbers of illegal immigrants taking jobs in the construction trades is racism. It has to do with dignity, hope and the right to survive. It might be nice to see the burden shared across the social economic spectrum but its not even close. The middle class and working class worker in America has been repeatedly made to pay the price of so called globalisation in gross disproportion to the rest of the working population. Enough is enough.
Are you really that naive? You sound like a typical corporate talking head.
1
Nation building of low-wage developing countries would require that the products produced in that country be sold to the citizens of that country so that they can "enjoy the fruits of their labor". When products are produced in a low-wage country and sold in developed countries, where they command a much higher price (and obscene corporate profits), it amounts to exploitation of the developing country's labor. The situation in most low-wage countries is that the workers are not paid sufficient wages to afford the products they produce.
1
I don't really know that much about the details of this plan, and I've heard that most of it is secret anyway, but if Elizabeth Warren is adamantly opposed, and Hatch and McConnel are for it, that pretty much is all I need to know. As for Mitch, I remember him declaring his number one goal on Obama's first inauguration day, and he has never let up. Really, how can Obama keep laying down for these guys? Pete McGuire, Atlanta
15
“This is not a game. This is about trying to accomplish something important for the country that happens to be the president’s No. 1 domestic priority,” Mr. McConnell said."
When Obama's No. 1 domestic priority is to follow the Republicans to destroy jobs of the 99%, give foreign corporate control over our legal system, destroy the environment, etc., then it is up to the real Democrats, and others, to oppose him. But coming from McConnell, who spent the last 6 years playing his own game of obstructing Obama at every opportunity, his comment is both hypocritical, and hilarious.
When Obama's No. 1 domestic priority is to follow the Republicans to destroy jobs of the 99%, give foreign corporate control over our legal system, destroy the environment, etc., then it is up to the real Democrats, and others, to oppose him. But coming from McConnell, who spent the last 6 years playing his own game of obstructing Obama at every opportunity, his comment is both hypocritical, and hilarious.
14
Dear Mr. President,
Part of your inability to fully grasp the TPP situation probably is because you are a University of Chicago free markets guy and have great faith in free enterprise. That's fine; that's part of why I voted for you and went to your inauguration. But even the U of C's Judge Posner gave "free markets" a major re-think and recanted to some notable degree. You might think do the same.
Then there is the secrecy part of the TPP. Like Pres. Reagan (who I almost never applaud), I like to trust AND VERIFY. No one can verify as to TPP; it's all (almost all) a secret. That's nuts.
Why am I'm troubled by TPP? Big business loves money. More revenues means higher pay for the C-suite. The TPP is a lever from which big companies and their senior people can make more money doing "stuff" that is not good. Big tobacco can use the TPP to slow or block the efforts of other countries to slow the sale of death sticks. The TPP will help pesticide companies to continue to pollute the commons in other countries. Ditto for big carbon.
In short, lots of us well-to-do people are becoming "peasants with pitchforks." Liz Warren gets it. Most days, you get it. But you are NOT getting it as to TPP. The choice is simple. Make all terms public and then vote a year later. Do not ask for trust for big business. You are offering your credibility to the wrong group. Please focus your energy on other topics; big business can take care of itself. You focus is needed elsewhere.
Part of your inability to fully grasp the TPP situation probably is because you are a University of Chicago free markets guy and have great faith in free enterprise. That's fine; that's part of why I voted for you and went to your inauguration. But even the U of C's Judge Posner gave "free markets" a major re-think and recanted to some notable degree. You might think do the same.
Then there is the secrecy part of the TPP. Like Pres. Reagan (who I almost never applaud), I like to trust AND VERIFY. No one can verify as to TPP; it's all (almost all) a secret. That's nuts.
Why am I'm troubled by TPP? Big business loves money. More revenues means higher pay for the C-suite. The TPP is a lever from which big companies and their senior people can make more money doing "stuff" that is not good. Big tobacco can use the TPP to slow or block the efforts of other countries to slow the sale of death sticks. The TPP will help pesticide companies to continue to pollute the commons in other countries. Ditto for big carbon.
In short, lots of us well-to-do people are becoming "peasants with pitchforks." Liz Warren gets it. Most days, you get it. But you are NOT getting it as to TPP. The choice is simple. Make all terms public and then vote a year later. Do not ask for trust for big business. You are offering your credibility to the wrong group. Please focus your energy on other topics; big business can take care of itself. You focus is needed elsewhere.
13
Senate Democrats have now given political cover to the 2016 candidates who were between a rock and a hard place with either going against the President or backing an iffy move.
1
Whew! Thank god...this stunk from the beginning, and so glad the President won't get this fast-tracked. The details are too important to blindly sign away our trade future.
12
I haven't reviewed all the comments here.
But I'm amazed from what I have reviewed, and from reading the article itself, that no one has zeroed in on the main point.
This agreement from the American side is basically about enforcing patents and copyrights, and opening up markets for the Vampires of Wall Street. The American side could give a blue whatever whether tractors are manufactured in Chengdu or Moline.
Unless you understand this, you have missed what this is all about.
So what it comes don to, almost literally, is that from the American side this is a trade agreement to protect Mickey Mouse, and the rest of the Disney menagerie and other entertainment providers, pharmaceutical products, and Lloyd Blankfein and Jamie Dimon when they go romping in foreign climes.
If you think that's a good thing, you're for the agreement.
If you think that's a Mickey Mouse agreement, well ... call your senator accordingly.
Mickey Mouse, plus Pfizer, plus Jamie Dimon.
That is what this agreement is about. Everything else is window dressing.
It's not about jobs in the Heartland, which may suffer. But the authors of the PTT, and the lobbies behind them, could care less about those s-o-o-o-o 20th century jobs.
But I'm amazed from what I have reviewed, and from reading the article itself, that no one has zeroed in on the main point.
This agreement from the American side is basically about enforcing patents and copyrights, and opening up markets for the Vampires of Wall Street. The American side could give a blue whatever whether tractors are manufactured in Chengdu or Moline.
Unless you understand this, you have missed what this is all about.
So what it comes don to, almost literally, is that from the American side this is a trade agreement to protect Mickey Mouse, and the rest of the Disney menagerie and other entertainment providers, pharmaceutical products, and Lloyd Blankfein and Jamie Dimon when they go romping in foreign climes.
If you think that's a good thing, you're for the agreement.
If you think that's a Mickey Mouse agreement, well ... call your senator accordingly.
Mickey Mouse, plus Pfizer, plus Jamie Dimon.
That is what this agreement is about. Everything else is window dressing.
It's not about jobs in the Heartland, which may suffer. But the authors of the PTT, and the lobbies behind them, could care less about those s-o-o-o-o 20th century jobs.
11
Indeed, I want a moat around America, the one that kept us safe for centuries, the oceans and the friendly nations on our borders, as we are the leading nation in the Western Hemisphere able to defend ourselves, and friends, with others in this hemisphere at peace with them. Let's keep it that way.
A strong defense isn't sending troops to Asia. It isn't policing the world. It's having that moat as we have at times, been attacked and should now appreciate the value of that moat.
Now you can negotiate a trade agreement in public view that levels the trade field in which our technological advantage will make us competitive, not Corporations and investment people building industries in other nations that compete with ourselves. After all, how stupid is that?
A strong defense isn't sending troops to Asia. It isn't policing the world. It's having that moat as we have at times, been attacked and should now appreciate the value of that moat.
Now you can negotiate a trade agreement in public view that levels the trade field in which our technological advantage will make us competitive, not Corporations and investment people building industries in other nations that compete with ourselves. After all, how stupid is that?
9
We're supposed to sign off on a deal we're not allowed to see, Mr. President? Sorry. This isn't the iTunes User Agreement.
22
The opponents of the TPP have been labelled ill informed, against trade, and unwilling to recognize how the world has changed.
But when my Senator Elizabeth Warren complained loud and clear that the devil was certainly in the details (my language, not here) that she and others were kept ignorant of I'm sure that she's right. She's the most knowledgeable person on economics and finance in either house of Congress.
Of course, as a general matter trade is good. But when very smart people like Senator Warren are skeptical of the TPP, all those of us who are not in the 1% of income or wealth, can be thankful that she's concerned about the people and not just the corporations and banks.
But when my Senator Elizabeth Warren complained loud and clear that the devil was certainly in the details (my language, not here) that she and others were kept ignorant of I'm sure that she's right. She's the most knowledgeable person on economics and finance in either house of Congress.
Of course, as a general matter trade is good. But when very smart people like Senator Warren are skeptical of the TPP, all those of us who are not in the 1% of income or wealth, can be thankful that she's concerned about the people and not just the corporations and banks.
18
A trade agreement allowing currency manipulation does not make sense and neither does one that does not provide opportunities for unskilled workers whose jobs are put in jeopardy as a result of such an agreement.
Instead of labor unions blocking a trade agreement with 10 other nations of the world, the unions should look for ways to empower our workers. The best way to do this is through education and President Obama had a good idea in his recent state of the union address. Provide the first two years of college free to any citizen who qualifies. This provides an opportunity for the 99% who are being left behind. By doing this everyone wins except maybe union management. Unions will need to find a different role in an educated world.
There is much discussion concerning the wisdom of the United States entering into the Trans-Pacific Partnership Agreement (TPP) with nations in South America and Asia. Labor unions are at the forefront of the opposition. Their message is TPP will put the working class and the unemployed here at home at a competitive disadvantage to their counterparts in Asia who work for much lower wages. As a result the multinational companies will continue to transfer less skilled, lower paying jobs from the United States and put added pressure on the need to keep wages low at home. This kind of thinking resulted in China's "Lost Century" ( http://lstrn.us/1w6etLa ) from 1850 until 1950..... http://lstrn.us/1H1FzoI
Instead of labor unions blocking a trade agreement with 10 other nations of the world, the unions should look for ways to empower our workers. The best way to do this is through education and President Obama had a good idea in his recent state of the union address. Provide the first two years of college free to any citizen who qualifies. This provides an opportunity for the 99% who are being left behind. By doing this everyone wins except maybe union management. Unions will need to find a different role in an educated world.
There is much discussion concerning the wisdom of the United States entering into the Trans-Pacific Partnership Agreement (TPP) with nations in South America and Asia. Labor unions are at the forefront of the opposition. Their message is TPP will put the working class and the unemployed here at home at a competitive disadvantage to their counterparts in Asia who work for much lower wages. As a result the multinational companies will continue to transfer less skilled, lower paying jobs from the United States and put added pressure on the need to keep wages low at home. This kind of thinking resulted in China's "Lost Century" ( http://lstrn.us/1w6etLa ) from 1850 until 1950..... http://lstrn.us/1H1FzoI
To Banicki I read your blog which you've repeated above. You seem to have turned against your Flint Michigan roots. Unions have been decimated since the Reagan era with the result that wages for working people have stagnated. To believe with Obama that education can in any way solve this is heartless fallacy. See the current indebtedness of student loans for starters. If everyone goes to college that BA will get you a job flipping burgers. The TPP is another job and wealth transfer from the middle and lower classes to the wealthy. Obama is dead wrong on this as he's been on health care and on failure to face up to torture or to stop our misadventures in the Middle East. The TPP is bad for workers, bad for the US. By the way you are wrong about China's failures. See Henry Kissinger's book. Those guys play the long game. This will be China's century and the TPP will only help them.
2
Thank you Elizabeth Warren for your vehement efforts to defeat this terrible piece of legislation.
22
This is great news for Middle America.
A huge Thank You to the Democrats who stood their ground on this vote—we desperately need more Democrats like you.
Let’s now move toward trade agreements that take care of workers while promoting true competition. A fair-for-everybody (but the greedy) trade agreement would include:
• Global wage price parity
• Global throughput price parity
• Global environmental cost parity (pollution parity)
• Don’t tax value-added (innovation, labor)
• Executive pay capped at 15 times the parity minimum wage for each country
• Increases in shareholder dividends tied to match percentage increases in the wage price parity for each country.
This would allow plenty of wealth to be generated, but tie it to the plight of the wage earner. The better the wage earner does, the better the shareholder and executive fairs. Firms will seek the more skilled employee as they can add more value to the company and thus more value to the shareholder and the executive. Low-skill employees will have a huge incentive to improve their skills and productivity as it will not be taxed, only the throughput would be taxed. Throughput becomes more expensive, spurring innovation and reducing the environmental impact of production.
It’s a positive, non-exploitive view of business and trade we desperately need to address climate change and income inequality.
Please tell me, exactly, why this system would not work.
Michael Bain
Glorieta, New Mexico
A huge Thank You to the Democrats who stood their ground on this vote—we desperately need more Democrats like you.
Let’s now move toward trade agreements that take care of workers while promoting true competition. A fair-for-everybody (but the greedy) trade agreement would include:
• Global wage price parity
• Global throughput price parity
• Global environmental cost parity (pollution parity)
• Don’t tax value-added (innovation, labor)
• Executive pay capped at 15 times the parity minimum wage for each country
• Increases in shareholder dividends tied to match percentage increases in the wage price parity for each country.
This would allow plenty of wealth to be generated, but tie it to the plight of the wage earner. The better the wage earner does, the better the shareholder and executive fairs. Firms will seek the more skilled employee as they can add more value to the company and thus more value to the shareholder and the executive. Low-skill employees will have a huge incentive to improve their skills and productivity as it will not be taxed, only the throughput would be taxed. Throughput becomes more expensive, spurring innovation and reducing the environmental impact of production.
It’s a positive, non-exploitive view of business and trade we desperately need to address climate change and income inequality.
Please tell me, exactly, why this system would not work.
Michael Bain
Glorieta, New Mexico
9
Thank you Senate Patriots for the representational governing that is our birthright. This vote is historical.
9
How is this a set-back for "Obama"?
Isn't G.W. Bush still in the White House? With Shell Oil executives in the Lincoln Bedroom? Cheney in the Oval Office? And Rumsfeld running the Pentagon?
Isn't G.W. Bush still in the White House? With Shell Oil executives in the Lincoln Bedroom? Cheney in the Oval Office? And Rumsfeld running the Pentagon?
3
For some inexplicable reason other than he's getting terribly bad advice, Obama has gone off the rails in his cow towing to the demands of Big Bid'ness late in his second term. What with this trade deal imbroglio and, exponentially more alarmingly, allowing drilling for oil in terribly hostile Arctic waters where mankind has no business being. A spill in those waters would make the BP tragedy look like a cake walk.
11
"“This is the most transparent administration in history”
President Obama, March 2013
From the NY Times, April 14, 2015:
"National security secrecy may be appropriate to protect us from our enemies; it should not be used to protect our politicians from us. For an administration that paints itself as dedicated to transparency and public input, the insistence on extensive secrecy in trade is disappointing and disingenuous. And the secrecy of trade negotiations does not just hide information from the public. It creates a funnel where powerful interests congregate, absent the checks, balances and necessary hurdles of the democratic process."
President Obama, March 2013
From the NY Times, April 14, 2015:
"National security secrecy may be appropriate to protect us from our enemies; it should not be used to protect our politicians from us. For an administration that paints itself as dedicated to transparency and public input, the insistence on extensive secrecy in trade is disappointing and disingenuous. And the secrecy of trade negotiations does not just hide information from the public. It creates a funnel where powerful interests congregate, absent the checks, balances and necessary hurdles of the democratic process."
11
I fail to understand what Obama is thinking...his rationale, we'll sell more Fords in Japan. The last American car I drove has imprinted itself on my now grown up kid's memories. They spent hours waiting at the side of the road for a tow truck. It wasn't made in America, it was made in Mexico, because of NAFTA. Let's get it straight, American products are only superior if they are made here. You like those China products that last for 25 seconds, go to Wal-Mart...frankly I want a choice when it comes to plumbing, pharmaceuticals and food. I'll pay more and buy less. And maybe the president should listen to the message, I don't want a Korean manicure, a Mexican roofer, or anyone else that will work for less to live here. I want someone who obeys laws. Thank you to the lawmakers who are finally doing their job and enforcing our laws. I don't want to live in a third world country, with a third world economy, and third world laws that allow marginalized workers to be hurt and live in substandard condition. I like plumbing, running water and a government that works!
12
I'm a liberal, no make that very liberal Democrat, and on this I am with the president. It's a big, interconnected world, one in which China is doing little good for anyone or anything, not even for the people of China, and this trade agreement is one way to check China's otherwise unmitigated plundering of the planet. This is not NAFTA and it involves virtually every nation of economic consequence in Asia and on the Asian rim, which by the way includes Mexico, Canada, New Zealand and Australia as well as Maylaysia, the Philipines, Japan We leave ourselves out at our own peril.
And for all those Democrats now so in love with Elizabeth Warren,did you know she was one and voted Republican well into her late 40s.Where was she politically most of her life? Unconscious? Stupid?
Well it was nowhere politically where I am and where very much most Democrats have always been on virtually everything and anything that Democrats believe in. She really has a lot to explain, a whole lot to someone like me who has vote always for progress, fairness and common sense management of U.S.interests and international relations when she was registered to vote for a party that votes for the opposite.
She is the one who needs to explain why she supported and voted an uninformed political set of beliefs and background most of her adult life. Now, like so many converts, she is a zealot and you know where zealots get you? They get you to oblivion, into trouble, into losing elections.
And for all those Democrats now so in love with Elizabeth Warren,did you know she was one and voted Republican well into her late 40s.Where was she politically most of her life? Unconscious? Stupid?
Well it was nowhere politically where I am and where very much most Democrats have always been on virtually everything and anything that Democrats believe in. She really has a lot to explain, a whole lot to someone like me who has vote always for progress, fairness and common sense management of U.S.interests and international relations when she was registered to vote for a party that votes for the opposite.
She is the one who needs to explain why she supported and voted an uninformed political set of beliefs and background most of her adult life. Now, like so many converts, she is a zealot and you know where zealots get you? They get you to oblivion, into trouble, into losing elections.
You are not a liberal nor a democrat, you're a repub trying to malign Elizabeth Warren because she is actually winning by telling the truth. Unlike you, Warren has a lot of real courage that everyone who cares for this country needs.
1
You are right about China but unfortunately it is too late. China has been at undeclared war with the US and the entire Western world for some time. Economic war. They are Communists and they have not forgotten that the Capitalist will sell them the rope with which to hang him. This is what has happened, with the blithe support of the Free Trade True Believers. China isn't going to wage nuclear war against the USA and the West and destroy the planet that their "superior" Han people live on. They are going to destroy the economic infrastructure we need to support our military strength.
You can read a thousand corporate annual reports and never find a word about executive compensation even tenuously tied to the lot of American or trade partner workers. When the Central American Free Trade Act (CAFTA) was being sold in 2004, it promised increased prosperity and stability for both American workers and Central American workers. It failed to deliver either, effectively exporting US jobs while Central America has collapsed by nearly every measure—just witness the tens of thousands of refugees fleeing from some of the world's poorest, most corrupt, and most violent failed countries.
9
I'm quite sure the GOP could not care less about American workers. But if they cared, they and the democrats could protect American workers who lose their jobs by creating and funding lifetime accounts for education, job training and re-training for every citizen. If every American were granted $100K to spend over their lifetime on education and job training, workers displaced from the job market for any reason beyond his or her control would be able to re-train for new jobs. It would enable workers to keep up with changes in the market such that they remain employed, and business would have a steady supply of qualified workers, something they claim not to have now.
6
I know Americans who have been training and retraining their entire lives on their own nickle to keep up with the changes in their occupation. They don't get the raises and advancement that used to come with so much effort. At best they get to keep their job, work harder and for longer hours, surrounded by cheaper poorly trained imported workers or cheaper workers overseas whom they are expected to train and help out, with the idea being that eventually these folks will take over the American's job.
"Free" Trade over the past 30 years has left millions of American manufacturing workers "free to pursue other opportunities", such as part time, benefit free, low paid service work. The meat was sucked out of our pay & benefit packages long ago, and sent up the hill to fatten up the "job creators." Just the facts.
Maybe our cries were finally heard in the Senate, but since we couldn't use our NAFTA job training crumbs to bootstrap ourselves into becoming 501c3 Founder's Club type folk, I sincerely doubt we were heard at all.
Maybe our cries were finally heard in the Senate, but since we couldn't use our NAFTA job training crumbs to bootstrap ourselves into becoming 501c3 Founder's Club type folk, I sincerely doubt we were heard at all.
15
We can hope that senators understand that, unlike Obama, they have to run for re-election.
1
Finally - a rejection of the mentality that has guided trade policy in this country for several generations - the "they sell, we buy" axiom, which has served to gut whole industries, destroy millions of jobs, and to produce a permanent trade deficit in the USA.
This time the American people are saying: no deal, Mr. President, both to cheap Asian goods and your shady trade deals.
This time the American people are saying: no deal, Mr. President, both to cheap Asian goods and your shady trade deals.
17
One can argue from an empirical standpoint that Democratic complaints about the pending trade deal have little to do with the actual terms that are being negotiated, but it's hard to make that argument if all that we have to rely upon is the president's assurances that this is a good deal for America.
The issues that Democrats are angry about, corporations transferring jobs overseas and unjustifiable tax breaks, among numerous others, would not be the subject of a multinational, multilateral trade deal. Nonetheless, there is sufficient bad feeling over the residual effects of the 1993 NAFTA deal to give opponents a lot to complain about.
NAFTA did boost trade with our trading partners, Mexico and Canada, and consumers largely benefited. Not so much low-wage workers who saw their jobs fleeing to Mexico. The flawed assumption was that raising Mexico's standard of living by making jobs more plentiful there and raising Mexican wages would somehow lessen the incentive for American companies to relocate to Mexico. That was the thought, anyway. Things didn't work out that way; the marginal difference between producing comparable goods in Mexico and in the United States could never reach parity. NAFTA simply made it easier to import Mexican goods into the United States, goods that might formerly have been produced here.
Is there any wonder, then, why people are suspicious about the TPP deal being negotiated?
The issues that Democrats are angry about, corporations transferring jobs overseas and unjustifiable tax breaks, among numerous others, would not be the subject of a multinational, multilateral trade deal. Nonetheless, there is sufficient bad feeling over the residual effects of the 1993 NAFTA deal to give opponents a lot to complain about.
NAFTA did boost trade with our trading partners, Mexico and Canada, and consumers largely benefited. Not so much low-wage workers who saw their jobs fleeing to Mexico. The flawed assumption was that raising Mexico's standard of living by making jobs more plentiful there and raising Mexican wages would somehow lessen the incentive for American companies to relocate to Mexico. That was the thought, anyway. Things didn't work out that way; the marginal difference between producing comparable goods in Mexico and in the United States could never reach parity. NAFTA simply made it easier to import Mexican goods into the United States, goods that might formerly have been produced here.
Is there any wonder, then, why people are suspicious about the TPP deal being negotiated?
21
It's a little more complicated than that. Nafta was and is very harmful to agricultural producers in Mexico and has fed illegal immigration. Also, consumers are also workers, so if the prices of products go down because goods are manufactured overseas but you lose your job, it doesn't really help you all that much. I haven't noticed a lowering of prices in the places I shop. Mostly, I suspect, the savings from lowering the costs of production went to profits and not to lower prices.
1
I disagree on one point; that of 'low-wage workers who saw their jobs fleeing....'. I would contend it was largely a skilled labor pool (automobile, textiles, other light manufacturing such as electronics) that has seen the worse damage since 1993.
1
I am against the TPP because of the potential harm it may do to labor and environmental laws around the world and here in the U.S. I am also concerned that intellectual property provisions will make it more difficult for developing nations to provide adequate health care to their citizens.
It is ironic, though, that the currency provision that is actually holding this up is something I also think is a horrible idea. That such a regressive eye-for-an-eye policy should be the only thing standing in the way is concerning, since it suggests that the neither Democrats, progressive or conservative, nor Republicans, right-wing or far-right-wing, nor President Obama has a sensible and fair trade policy.
It is ironic, though, that the currency provision that is actually holding this up is something I also think is a horrible idea. That such a regressive eye-for-an-eye policy should be the only thing standing in the way is concerning, since it suggests that the neither Democrats, progressive or conservative, nor Republicans, right-wing or far-right-wing, nor President Obama has a sensible and fair trade policy.
11
We don't need trade; with our strong military, we can just pillage our way to prosperity.
3
Please, no more talk of Warren running for President. She's far too valuable doing what she does now.
Let's not risk her being coopted by the White House and have her also going over to the dark side.
Let's not risk her being coopted by the White House and have her also going over to the dark side.
19
I think Obama is very naive when it comes to Japan. He talks about not seeing American cars in Japan. You do not see any foreign cars in Japan. A trip down any Motomachi shopping district in any Japanese city would have revealed that very few foreign products are for sale. It's not called Japan, Inc. for nothing. They do not let anything in. It is their business plan. If Obama thinks he can open up Japan to our exports, he better resurrect Adm. Perry with his gunboats to do it.
21
With that last trade deal with Japan, Pennsylvania lost 40,000 jobs, consider the loss for the rest of our country. You're right about what it would take and Adm. Perry and gun boats to do it !
1
This agreement is nothing more than an easy way for US corporations to maximize profits without being penalized for any missteps. This bill will leave Americans paying for those mistakes for 6 years to come. This first step by Dems will give Americans more time to see this bad and sad deal.
Obama must be looking to his future, joining Corporate America.
Obama must be looking to his future, joining Corporate America.
18
Politically, free trade can be an awfully tough sell.
Both potential and real job losses are visible, and anxious workers, businesses and any other organizations act accordingly and exert political pressure.
The jobs that are not created, the businesses and industries that do not grow, never appear, and remain invisible.
Tough sell, no question.
I commend the President for his leadership on this issue.
Both potential and real job losses are visible, and anxious workers, businesses and any other organizations act accordingly and exert political pressure.
The jobs that are not created, the businesses and industries that do not grow, never appear, and remain invisible.
Tough sell, no question.
I commend the President for his leadership on this issue.
2
It is not free trade...it is corrupt trade. Paying 56 cents an hour with no regulations for Vietnam or enforcement of human rights is corrupt and there is no way American workers should have to compete with that. All of the other countries protect their manufacturing base but America and just look at our growing economic inequality problems back here in America. Too many imports with astronomical growing trade deficits which means more American job losses. TPP would increase those trade deficits even more.
1
I am disappointed to the core, by Barack Obama's insistence that "people should trust him just because he is "well intentioned."
He saved GM, he saved the giant Insurance company AIG, he saved adventurous and crooked bankers, who make fifty-thousand dollars per hour, and took risk as though there was no tomorrow.
But Barack Obama is uninformed enough to know the trade deals have taken out the inside workings of American Economy. And it is futile to expect salvation from junior colleges: the students will learn, dental hygiene, and medical billing and save America?
America's economic power in the fifties and Sixties surged from innovation and manufacturing; we can use other nation's cheap labor to make us cheap gadgets, but in the long run we will lose technology, craftsmanship, and the tradition of both.
The change we cannot believe in is the change in Barack Obama, he is publicly denouncing Elizabeth Warren as, "another politician".
Tell us Barack what you are! I confess we misjudged you!
He saved GM, he saved the giant Insurance company AIG, he saved adventurous and crooked bankers, who make fifty-thousand dollars per hour, and took risk as though there was no tomorrow.
But Barack Obama is uninformed enough to know the trade deals have taken out the inside workings of American Economy. And it is futile to expect salvation from junior colleges: the students will learn, dental hygiene, and medical billing and save America?
America's economic power in the fifties and Sixties surged from innovation and manufacturing; we can use other nation's cheap labor to make us cheap gadgets, but in the long run we will lose technology, craftsmanship, and the tradition of both.
The change we cannot believe in is the change in Barack Obama, he is publicly denouncing Elizabeth Warren as, "another politician".
Tell us Barack what you are! I confess we misjudged you!
29
As with healthcare reform, President Obama should have made the case for this trade deal directly to the populace. He has to know that others will not perceive moves the way he does and Congress will not make his arguments for him. For all his speakers' skills, President Obama does not put them to use consistently when it comes to public persuasion.
6
He did - the day before the vote.
I suggest Obama read the book "Factory Man" by Beth Macy to see what happens when a nation targets an industry, in this case furniture. For example, while American workers had to be protected from the sprays used to apply furniture finish, Chinese workers worked without protection and apparently just were replaced when they got sick. This is unfair competition and we don't need more of it.
27
Near the end of the Clinton term, some serious mistakes were made, eg. the "rule" that made credit default swaps (remember those) completely unregulated.
I am strongly opposed to what is happening with our economy. We need stronger and better unions and we need more to keep jobs here even if that means we are less efficient and if we pay more. What is the point? If you go to a mall, most everything is not made here. Sure, there are jobs. But they are not great jobs. A way to navigate the difficulties is to be more like Germany, modern post war Germany.
I am strongly opposed to what is happening with our economy. We need stronger and better unions and we need more to keep jobs here even if that means we are less efficient and if we pay more. What is the point? If you go to a mall, most everything is not made here. Sure, there are jobs. But they are not great jobs. A way to navigate the difficulties is to be more like Germany, modern post war Germany.
22
Maybe a little transparency would be in order. This thing has been veiled too long. People don't know what all of the implications are about. It's not just "I'll sell you this, if you sell me that." The legal implications are treacherous. Glad this has been blocked for now. And I'm glad I exercised my right to contact my two senators and give my opposition to this TPP. And I must say that the information supplied by Robert Reich and Bernie Sanders on the web was most helpful in making my decision to oppose this legislation. If we didn't have the internet, we would have blindly followed the suggestions of the NY Times and the Wall Street Journal, and lost lots of jobs overseas.
45
If Warren feels this strongly, she should run for President. It is one thing to articulate a political goal and another to chart a path to achieve it. It's the person who can do both who is a real progressive. Roosevelt fit the bill but does Warren? Maybe, maybe not. I don't know.
5
The Senate is a separate but equal branch of government. Senator is doing precisely what a Senator should do -- advocate the policy position she believes is best for the nation. We need more like her.
13
We have a President who was able to put bank reform under the guidance of advisers like Geithner and Summers and now is able to roll with the big business Republicans on a trade agreement built by and for international corporations. Those giants who want to export more US jobs and avoid environmental and product safety regulation can join under Obama's "Big Tent" those banks who are too big to fail. These are major flaws of governance for which Obama must take personal responsibility.
17
Rare Good News! A rare win for us little people. This is but one battle won in a long war that has to be fought inch by inch, tooth and nail. Hold these guys feet to the fire. Don't let them weasel. More money will be offered to them even more frenetically.
And, "Senator Orrin Hatch of Utah, the main author of the trade bill" - imagine, this is the one bill Obama has pushed most passionately. I tried to warn everybody about this guy.
And, "Senator Orrin Hatch of Utah, the main author of the trade bill" - imagine, this is the one bill Obama has pushed most passionately. I tried to warn everybody about this guy.
22
#1 - I lost my innocence a long time ago and it's not coming back. I like you Barack, but blind trust is a non-starter. You say it's a great agreement. Great, show me and prove it.
#2 - It looks like virtually every Republican supports this. They never, ever pass up an opportunity to sell out the American worker to big money interests. BIG red flag.
#3 - The only two politicians I still trust - Bernie and Elizabeth - don't support fast tracking. Another BIG red flag.
No.
#2 - It looks like virtually every Republican supports this. They never, ever pass up an opportunity to sell out the American worker to big money interests. BIG red flag.
#3 - The only two politicians I still trust - Bernie and Elizabeth - don't support fast tracking. Another BIG red flag.
No.
101
BRAVO - Some Senators finally found their spine.
55
It’s nice to see that the scare tactics (China is rising! Isolationism will kill us!) didn’t win the day, at least not this particular one.
44
The Republicans fell for it. They are easily led by fear, but the Democrats stood strong.
1
Rather the contrary, considering the aspersions cast on the TPP and the FEAR FEAR FEAR Warren and ilk are selling.
We could take a lesson from what happened when NAFTA was passed. Where did the jobs go? Where did the companies build? What was the net benefit/deficit to American workers?
74
Yes. I voted for President Obama twice...shame on him the first time, shame on me the second time ! It's obvious he sold us out, I should have realized when no criminal bankers went to jail over our 2007 financial crash...nada one ! That was the writing on the wall, but none of the republican candidates were trustworthy either. And the same problem today. Hillary is beholden to this trade agreement along with the republicans. Bernie Sanders has been up front all along where he stands, I need a trustworthy candidate who has the American people's back. Hillary is playing games, I won't be fooled twice.
1
Economists tell us that trade deals have winners and losers; the goal is to create a deal in which the U.S. winners far outnumber the losers. The President clearly feels this goal will be accomplished. Expanding trade helps our economy evolve into the future, rather than becoming stuck in old ways of producing. While painful for a few, this evolution will make us stronger and better-off in the long run.
2
Yes, there will be 'winners' and 'losers', but the big question is, who are they? If the winners are the ones who already 'outnumber' the losers - in dollar bills - then no, it doesn't help our economy at all. If it doesn't help get more money in circulation HERE, it doesn't help our economy. I suggest you read a few of Krugman's books, if you want to have an economist to refer to.
If you are speaking about the corporations and not the workers.
I am still waiting to see definitive proof that NAFTA was good for Americans -- all Americans, not just corporations who wanted a means to shift production to cheaper countries. If NAFTA, in fact, benefitted us the way that we were told it would when it was adopted, there should be some way to demonstrate it. Absent proof, I see no reason to assume it was a benefit. TPP's acceptance should require such proof.
36
There is no proof it was good because it wasn't. The loss of manufacturing jobs and good middle class pay I obvious proof we lost. Even Obama now says its the global economy he wants to strengthen not the US economy. The only people who benefit from the global economy he refers to are the multinationals and the billionaires.
7
Elizabeth Warren was correct to question this trade agreement.
The general economic trend troubling America is that the economic bottom is being pulled away.
These trade agreements benefit the people at the apex of the economy: i.e. those who control the wealth & investment, decide where to manufacture the products, those who are fortunate to be highly talented or educated enough to stay competitive in the global job market, etc...
Low paying service sector jobs that can't be relocated may benefit, but who is going to buy services from them, if the bottom 50% can't compete at a global wage price point?
Other nations may benefit from globalization either because: average wages and the cost of living are cheap, or at the higher end (i.e.: Europe) -- there are social safety nets, affordable higher education, and nationalized health care and other benefits. The US doesn't have these ameliorating factors to cushion and soften the negative impacts of globalization. Globalization and social safety nets should be a package deal.
The general economic trend troubling America is that the economic bottom is being pulled away.
These trade agreements benefit the people at the apex of the economy: i.e. those who control the wealth & investment, decide where to manufacture the products, those who are fortunate to be highly talented or educated enough to stay competitive in the global job market, etc...
Low paying service sector jobs that can't be relocated may benefit, but who is going to buy services from them, if the bottom 50% can't compete at a global wage price point?
Other nations may benefit from globalization either because: average wages and the cost of living are cheap, or at the higher end (i.e.: Europe) -- there are social safety nets, affordable higher education, and nationalized health care and other benefits. The US doesn't have these ameliorating factors to cushion and soften the negative impacts of globalization. Globalization and social safety nets should be a package deal.
61
Thank God and Greyhound, the TPP is gone! At least for now and hopefully for good. What positives come from deals that are secret to the general public but open to corporations? Between the TPP and now drilling in the arctic, Obama has reinforced his status as a human fillet, no spine no nothing.
54
There are several pivotal lessons President Obama, Republican and the executives, board members and shareholders of large multinational corporations should take away from this defeat.
First, as the majority of comments here have expressed, ordinary, working / middle class, whatever label you wish to use to identify the 98% of Americans, are no longer taking tax reform bills, international trade agreements, bailouts or settlements purportedly providing jobs, livable wages, economic progress or substantial justice on a "field of dreams" patronizing promises and ad hoc projections.
Presuming large multinational corporations their 1% owners and sympathizers have the credibility or trust to continue profiting at the collective expense of millions of working class citizens is tragically misinformed. Nor are we swayed by allegations of future domination of international markets by China abroad when we are presently being driven down the road of serfdom by Nike and other predatory job outsourcers at home.
Second, Americans do not put their futures or those of their families at the mercy of foreign governments and unidentified global corporate interests on agreements negotiated in secret and offered on a take it or leave it basis. If public candor and transparency is too high a price for access to the largest, safest advanced economy on earth its their loss not America's.
And, lastly all politics are local and you're better off dancing with the ones who brung you.
First, as the majority of comments here have expressed, ordinary, working / middle class, whatever label you wish to use to identify the 98% of Americans, are no longer taking tax reform bills, international trade agreements, bailouts or settlements purportedly providing jobs, livable wages, economic progress or substantial justice on a "field of dreams" patronizing promises and ad hoc projections.
Presuming large multinational corporations their 1% owners and sympathizers have the credibility or trust to continue profiting at the collective expense of millions of working class citizens is tragically misinformed. Nor are we swayed by allegations of future domination of international markets by China abroad when we are presently being driven down the road of serfdom by Nike and other predatory job outsourcers at home.
Second, Americans do not put their futures or those of their families at the mercy of foreign governments and unidentified global corporate interests on agreements negotiated in secret and offered on a take it or leave it basis. If public candor and transparency is too high a price for access to the largest, safest advanced economy on earth its their loss not America's.
And, lastly all politics are local and you're better off dancing with the ones who brung you.
41
The People's Communist Republic of China would like to thank the Democratic Senators for blocking this attempt of the U.S to counter their rising trade influence over much of Asia.
Japan, the third largest economy, can't do it alone against China, it would need to help of the US, the largest economy in the world to counter China's dangerous military, trade and rising influence over much of Asia.
This is not about jobs loss in the US, it's about US dominance of free trade over this part of the world while we still can muster it before it is too late from China's iron grip
Japan, the third largest economy, can't do it alone against China, it would need to help of the US, the largest economy in the world to counter China's dangerous military, trade and rising influence over much of Asia.
This is not about jobs loss in the US, it's about US dominance of free trade over this part of the world while we still can muster it before it is too late from China's iron grip
5
Well then the President and his Republican friends should "sell" the American worker on that. Then there is the issue with "selling" this to the Democratic Senate all of whom have had access to this vision called the TPP.
When access to the draft of a trade bill that will supposedly benefit Americans is controlled as though it were the blueprints for the hydrogen bomb, you know something--as Miss Clavel would say--is not right...
I wasn't so thrilled with the contents of the ACA being, you know, not known until it was passed. And now we know the signature legislative achievement of the President I voted for twice (I am not a troll, this is a true statement) was just a big present to the insurance industry. And families served by the major teaching hospital in my area are now experiencing Simon Legree-like collections tactics because the hospital must make up, where it can, the shortfall in revenues caused by serving the poor...
Can we start a betting pool now? Object: Name the top five corporate boards President Obama will join, after leaving the White House...
I wasn't so thrilled with the contents of the ACA being, you know, not known until it was passed. And now we know the signature legislative achievement of the President I voted for twice (I am not a troll, this is a true statement) was just a big present to the insurance industry. And families served by the major teaching hospital in my area are now experiencing Simon Legree-like collections tactics because the hospital must make up, where it can, the shortfall in revenues caused by serving the poor...
Can we start a betting pool now? Object: Name the top five corporate boards President Obama will join, after leaving the White House...
27
Reading between the lines, it is pretty obvious that with a little bit of tinkering, TPP is going to be jammed down the throat of America, just as Obamacare was. The Democrats are putting on a show and making a few superficial demands, but this is probably just to help them in the next election. At the end of the day, TPP, and who knows what it actually is, is going to get through this Congress.
We now know what Obama meant by "the audacity of hope". One day, and that day is upon us, Obama hoped that he and McConnell could come out of the closet and stop pretending that they are different from each other.
And you know what? Most of the American people will still either buy ideas shaped like Donkeys or ideas shaped like Elephants, but not both. Perhaps they are just beaten down by the oppression and hypocrisy; or perhaps they have been effectively brainwashed.
We now know what Obama meant by "the audacity of hope". One day, and that day is upon us, Obama hoped that he and McConnell could come out of the closet and stop pretending that they are different from each other.
And you know what? Most of the American people will still either buy ideas shaped like Donkeys or ideas shaped like Elephants, but not both. Perhaps they are just beaten down by the oppression and hypocrisy; or perhaps they have been effectively brainwashed.
9
@ H.Torbet - " At the end of the day, TPP, and who knows what it actually is, is going to get through this Congress."
They have to pass it for us to know what's in it!
They have to pass it for us to know what's in it!
If the TPP is 'rammed down our throats', it will be because of Republicans. If we all voted to keep Republicans out of office, no Democrats in office would think they had to 'put on a show', because they would not have the problem of competing in the next election against the Republican financial behemoths. If you want decent ideas, then, do something to support decent candidates. Not Republicans.
@ John Dabrowski - So true, if there were only ONE party what a wonderful country we would have!
The President must now know what a huge mistake he made trying to first ignore, then blow off and finally belittle and attack the integrity of politicians that otherwise support him. Most Democrats think Elizabeth Warren, Bernie Sanders, Sherrod Brown, etc. are straight shooters that stand up for average Americans.
Perhaps now the President will step back, mend some fences and then see what he can do to address at least the major issues they raised, especially displaced workers, child labor, the suspicion that international corporations would be able to leverage a country or play countries off against each other, unfair trade practices, etc. The currency manipulation may doom it. But critics may accept that if they get other key changes they consider improvements.
Perhaps now the President will step back, mend some fences and then see what he can do to address at least the major issues they raised, especially displaced workers, child labor, the suspicion that international corporations would be able to leverage a country or play countries off against each other, unfair trade practices, etc. The currency manipulation may doom it. But critics may accept that if they get other key changes they consider improvements.
20
He could start with explaining to the people of Ferguson MO, Baltimore MD and Detroit MI why he thought he should support people in Southeast Asia instead of them.
1
As a laid off steelworker, I along with thousands of unemployed steelworkers applaud this action. Low oil prices have decimated our industry. Compounding low prices with tpp and other agreements will put our industry and its workers in grave peril.
35
"But if Democrats successfully force Mr. McConnell to include that currency measure in the trade promotion bill, the negotiations could collapse."
This is probably the purpose of this requirement, and collapse of the negotiations would be the best possible outcome. Let's hope the TPP (and TTIP along with it) are scrapped altogether.
This is probably the purpose of this requirement, and collapse of the negotiations would be the best possible outcome. Let's hope the TPP (and TTIP along with it) are scrapped altogether.
32
Sorry, Mr. President. I care about American workers, not Chinese workers. China isn't sending their products here on the cheap. Why should we send ours there, benefiting only "corporations are persons?" When President Clinton signed NAFTA in 1995, I knew it was a bad deal. If Republicans are for it, I'm against it. They're in business to serve their shadow masters. Another side benefit to this defeat is that is smokes Mitch McConnell out from cover. His promise to "govern" looks awfully shaky, and that's a good day for all of us. He's probably on the line in a panic with the Koch Brothers, Sheldon Adelson, and ALEC.
35
Senator Warren specializes in outrage, but it's not at all clear to me where her outrage will carry us. If it's to erect more trade barriers, that certainly won't help us better the position of American workers or raise the salaries. It will simply put another brake on the economy.
While I deplore the Republican tendency to lower progressive taxes (thus depriving us of much needed services and infrastructure) and to break the power of unions, I don't think the left wing of the Democratic party has much to offer either. And if that wing pushes too hard during the next election, the Democrats may lose the White House too, something devoutly to be avoided.
While I deplore the Republican tendency to lower progressive taxes (thus depriving us of much needed services and infrastructure) and to break the power of unions, I don't think the left wing of the Democratic party has much to offer either. And if that wing pushes too hard during the next election, the Democrats may lose the White House too, something devoutly to be avoided.
4
Senator Warren's outrage is not born out of an aversion to all trade deals, just those she's not permitted to read and where she suspects that corporations and other big players have influenced the drafting. Frankly, as stated above by TheUnSaid, there would be little to no opposition to this trade deal if Americans had a solid social safety net. We don't.
1
You are the poster boy for how the 2 party system is destroying America,
This is the best news in a long time. This bill will hopefully be
defeated by today's actions. there are many reasons to oppose
it but one of the important other than loss of American jobs again
is that :
Foreign tribunals will give multinational corporations the right to sue a government if domestic laws reduce their ‘future’ profits. Lawyers will rotate acting as judges and representing corporations.
defeated by today's actions. there are many reasons to oppose
it but one of the important other than loss of American jobs again
is that :
Foreign tribunals will give multinational corporations the right to sue a government if domestic laws reduce their ‘future’ profits. Lawyers will rotate acting as judges and representing corporations.
32
You are right - that's one of the most chilling aspects of the prospective agreement. We could say goodbye to our environmental safety laws. Clean Water Act, Clean Air Act, Endangered Species Act, and on and on, not to mention regional and local regulations meant to protect us - all could be superceded by the almighty trade courts controlled by the biggest corporations. We _cannot_ give them power over out democratic rights!
America's economy has not fully recovered. Optimism is still marred by the financial crisis and high unemployment. This TPP raises concern about working- and middle-class jobs. Many Americans have had a hard time to cope with globalisation, which inspired manufacturers to outsource jobs to lower-cost countries. Since then the rich had become immensely rich, while others had to struggle to make ends meet. Many now fear that trade liberalisation would only see an influx of cheap imports onto the American market, threatening domestic production. Many Japanese feel the same! The real mourners are those countries, that benefit from the TPP.
4
If TPP can be improved, then it should. But TPP cannot be the perfect agreement in which all sides, both in Congress, and in the Asia Pacific, get exactly what they want. TPP serves a bigger strategic purpose. At its minimum, TTP reinforces and contributes to a baseline of rules and norms that are different from a trade model potentially offered by China. It ultimately contributes to relationship building in the region, which over time, leads to influence.
The changes taking place in the Asia Pacific are significant and they will impact the world to an ever stronger degree with the passage of time. The United States needs to be in a position to maximize its ability to shape that change.
The changes taking place in the Asia Pacific are significant and they will impact the world to an ever stronger degree with the passage of time. The United States needs to be in a position to maximize its ability to shape that change.
40
This is an assault on the sovereignty of the US, what difference will it make over time if the US cannot maintain control of its own laws?
18
Maximizing our ability to shape the change in the Asia Pacific should never mean subverting our sovereignty to transnational corporations, who authored the TPP, and who will derive the most benefit if it passes as written. These same corporations do not pay taxes in our country, indeed some actually receive net tax benefits, due to the flawed tax laws we "enjoy".
Coupled with the glaring omission of restrictions on currency manipulation, the TPP appears to be a bad deal for Americans, the people who have been denied access to the contents, yet who have been bullied to "trust" the main advocate of its passage. This is not due diligence, not responsible trade negotiation and not representative democratic participation.
Coupled with the glaring omission of restrictions on currency manipulation, the TPP appears to be a bad deal for Americans, the people who have been denied access to the contents, yet who have been bullied to "trust" the main advocate of its passage. This is not due diligence, not responsible trade negotiation and not representative democratic participation.
3
I hear a lot of jargon about how we must "shape that change". Where can we read the text? Based on what has been leaked, this is a deal that gives big multinational corporations additional rights, and workers and governments fewer rights. It has nothing to do with outmaneuvering the Chinese--as if this were even possible in their own backyard.
3
“This is not a game. This is about trying to accomplish something important for the country that happens to be the president’s No. 1 domestic priority,” Mr. McConnell said."
Since when has Mitch been on the President's side? Never! Thus, the very fact he spoke those words makes me think this would be the worst deal under the sun. He must really really want to pay back his donors if he is showing support for the President for the very first time.
President Obama has badly miscalculated the impact of secrecy on a Congress and an American public that is fed up with being given the shaft due to bad trade deals.
Since when has Mitch been on the President's side? Never! Thus, the very fact he spoke those words makes me think this would be the worst deal under the sun. He must really really want to pay back his donors if he is showing support for the President for the very first time.
President Obama has badly miscalculated the impact of secrecy on a Congress and an American public that is fed up with being given the shaft due to bad trade deals.
129
Right on! If McConnell and Paul Ryan are for it, I know it's not going to help the working people.
"President Obama has badly miscalculated the impact of secrecy on a Congress and an American public "
Maybe but there is one thing that is good.
He now has your attention. Now all the President needs to do is publish the TPP so we all can see what is really in it. The hope is now you will take the time to read it.
We all know the Republicans in Congress will not read it. They just know it is good for business.
So now we need to make sure it is also good for the world workers.
Maybe but there is one thing that is good.
He now has your attention. Now all the President needs to do is publish the TPP so we all can see what is really in it. The hope is now you will take the time to read it.
We all know the Republicans in Congress will not read it. They just know it is good for business.
So now we need to make sure it is also good for the world workers.
1
If We the People can't get a look at TPP without our reps going into a locked room, I'm against it. Obama, fast- track that.
49
YAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAY!
Put a fork in it. No secret deals for corporations, they own the world already. The Democrats finally grew a spine!
Put a fork in it. No secret deals for corporations, they own the world already. The Democrats finally grew a spine!
47
Don't mess with Elizabeth. She's serious.
24
"'This is not a game. This is about trying to accomplish something important for the country that happens to be the president’s No. 1 domestic priority,' Mr. McConnell said."
I'm touched that McConnell is so concerned about President Obama's priorities, for once. These awful democracy-killing bills are international corporatism's No. 1 domestic priority as well--perhaps that has something to do with it.
I'm touched that McConnell is so concerned about President Obama's priorities, for once. These awful democracy-killing bills are international corporatism's No. 1 domestic priority as well--perhaps that has something to do with it.
22
What is the Faustian bargain between the President and the GOP that causes him to fight so hard for TPP?
37
Follow the money.
The Faustisn bargain here is the one Elizabeth Warren did to position herself against Hillary, backstabbing the President in the process.
1
The president bemoans the lack of jobs and opportunities in America yet pushes for trade agreements that send jobs overseas. He is out of touch with most working Americans. Given the choice, I believe Americans would not hesitate to spend a few dollars more for products made in the USA.
45
I certainly wouldn't be willing to spend more money to buy a General Motors car or a Chrysler rather than an Toyota or Volkswagen. Before the auto market became truly global, we paid for shoddily-built cars that fell apart at 50,000 miles.
5
I'd like to believe that but then I'm faced with Walmart's success inside the U.S. and that tells the opposite story.
1
Some things are better, some things are worse. Japanese cars are definitely better than American cars. However, many things now are made to fall apart after a few years anyway, 'forced obsolescence', so it doesn't really matter where things are made. I have a sewing/embroidery machine that belonged to my mother, over 20 years old, still going strong, made in Europe. The same company now makes sure they only last 5 years or so. Then you have to buy a new one. Of course, a lot of stuff coming out of China is junk, I would also pay more for American made.
Now begins the decline of the U.S.'s economic power and its standard of living. When will we ever learn.
6
You are about thirty years too late with that comment. America's economic decline began with the first trade deal. This is a good day for America. if the trade deal is so good for us, what harm will come of letting the public know about its details?
16
sorry, David, it began 20+ years ago, we're WAY down the slippery slope in a race to the bottom.
David Garretson..."Now begins the decline of the U.S.'s economic power and its standard of living"
Where have you been for the last 30-40 years? The beginning of the decline? Please!
Where have you been for the last 30-40 years? The beginning of the decline? Please!
The President deserves the power to negotiate these deals and Congress rightly has the power to up/down vote it. But America won today. The fast track program was going to reduce the number of votes needed to pass the trade accord and was being requested while refusing to be open about what was being negotiated within the trade accord. That's a terrible executive strategy on trade, nuclear arms , or any other negotiation.
While this publicly lessens the President's power on a global stage, which is painful, it sets a much more effective tone to what makes our Republic great. An executive, backed by elected representatives, is the only way our country sets long-lasting policy.
While this publicly lessens the President's power on a global stage, which is painful, it sets a much more effective tone to what makes our Republic great. An executive, backed by elected representatives, is the only way our country sets long-lasting policy.
161
No, China won today. America lost - defeating itself.
When every country in Asia, Latin America and EMEA have 'special status', then who really has special status? What's the point of granting this status to us and to our real trading partners.
Interesting that it was opposed by both Democrats (Warren) and Republicans.
Interesting that it was opposed by both Democrats (Warren) and Republicans.
4
Except the Republicans tended to vote for it. Contrary to my expressed wishes, I believe that included my states senators. I will have to get out the pickets before the actual TPP goes any further.
President Obama: “The truth of the matter is that Elizabeth is, you know, a politician like everybody else,”
This remark reveal the least appealing aspect of a President I twice voted for: the double standard in his response to those who criticize him. Were Mr. Obama a feisty "give'em hell" Harry Truman type, I'd have no objection to the harshness of his remarks on Senator's Warren's opposition to his trade bill. But Mr. Obama is anything but that. When some of his rightwing critics attack him personally as some kind of closet jihadist who's anyway not really an American citizen, or politically, as a dyed- in-the-wool socialist, the President takes this like a lamb, hoping beyond any reality that playing nice on a personal level will win over these critics. Yet when someone on the left attacks not him personally, but some aspect of his policy, she gets the somewhat demeaning put down cited above. Some coincidence: the President has no qualms about playing to the left (or what passes as left in the US) to get elected, but ignores many of the left's concerns once in office.
At least he's not, you know, a politician like everybody else - he panders to those who despise him.
This remark reveal the least appealing aspect of a President I twice voted for: the double standard in his response to those who criticize him. Were Mr. Obama a feisty "give'em hell" Harry Truman type, I'd have no objection to the harshness of his remarks on Senator's Warren's opposition to his trade bill. But Mr. Obama is anything but that. When some of his rightwing critics attack him personally as some kind of closet jihadist who's anyway not really an American citizen, or politically, as a dyed- in-the-wool socialist, the President takes this like a lamb, hoping beyond any reality that playing nice on a personal level will win over these critics. Yet when someone on the left attacks not him personally, but some aspect of his policy, she gets the somewhat demeaning put down cited above. Some coincidence: the President has no qualms about playing to the left (or what passes as left in the US) to get elected, but ignores many of the left's concerns once in office.
At least he's not, you know, a politician like everybody else - he panders to those who despise him.
37
The most on- the- mark comment in the entire thread. Like you, I really resented that cheap shot he took at Sen. Warren the other day. It was in his speech at Nike, wasn't it? Of course, he has it completely backwards. He's the politician, and she's the patriot. To paraphrase Justice Stewart, it's not always easy to define a leader, but I know one when I see one. Thank you. Pete McGuire
Good, good, good.
Corporate lobbyists pre-packaging their secretly negotiated deal is undemocratic and not in the interests of Americans. We've ceded enough power to them since NAFTA (and Citizens United). No to TPP fast-track and the corporate misbehavior it would enable.
Corporate lobbyists pre-packaging their secretly negotiated deal is undemocratic and not in the interests of Americans. We've ceded enough power to them since NAFTA (and Citizens United). No to TPP fast-track and the corporate misbehavior it would enable.
25
It doesn't matter to labor and environmental interests how progressive and protective Obama claims the TPP is. The problem is enforcement. As we've witnessed time and time again our government is toothless when it comes to enforcement. We didn't put the hammer down on corporations hiring illegals in the US. We didn't force the telecoms to make good on their promises to expand broad band coast to coast in exchange for mergers. We didn't put a halt to Wall Street 3 card Monty until it was too late or did we punish them in any meaningful way. The FCC admitted the other day that it is surrendering to dark money and cannot enforce the laws. We continue to hire contractors that have been caught defrauding the taxpayers. Why would anyone in his right mind believe this government, bought and paid for by the authors of the TTP would do right by its people?
39
We dodged the bullet for now thanks to those Democrats who wouldn't be bullied (Elizabeth Warren) and wouldn't trade their sense of what's right for the country for a promise of support from the President and his money machine in the next election.
I hope that as the campaign continues Democrats refuse to be bought off with band aids like retraining workers. Good jobs are getting scarcer and TPP is unlikely to create any here. The main goal for corporations is to preserve and extend their main sources of profit: patents, market access, and cheap labor. There is also the issue of enforcement. The process of enforcement under TPP supposedly uses it's own "courts" and "judges" and can override regulatory laws in participating countries if they reduce anticipated(!) profit. This sounds like a corporate dream and a nightmare for the environment, not like making the plague of piracy easier to prosecute. The US patent system has been twisted so Entertainment companies can retain what would have reverted to the public domain as part of their brand, and drug companies can make minor changes to drugs (like combining 2) and delay the production of generic versions. What wonderful things to export to poorer countries!
Looking forward to reading about what all theses secret negotiations produced.
I hope that as the campaign continues Democrats refuse to be bought off with band aids like retraining workers. Good jobs are getting scarcer and TPP is unlikely to create any here. The main goal for corporations is to preserve and extend their main sources of profit: patents, market access, and cheap labor. There is also the issue of enforcement. The process of enforcement under TPP supposedly uses it's own "courts" and "judges" and can override regulatory laws in participating countries if they reduce anticipated(!) profit. This sounds like a corporate dream and a nightmare for the environment, not like making the plague of piracy easier to prosecute. The US patent system has been twisted so Entertainment companies can retain what would have reverted to the public domain as part of their brand, and drug companies can make minor changes to drugs (like combining 2) and delay the production of generic versions. What wonderful things to export to poorer countries!
Looking forward to reading about what all theses secret negotiations produced.
27
Those "no" votes are only cosmetic because, as I read it, the "no" voters can apparently be mollified with three amendment that sound to me like weasily things that won't actually do anything to stop the "great sucking sound" of job loss.
But on the other hand, I'm sure these pacts create jobs -- just not jobs for the folks being laid off. And maybe it's great policy to take one group of Americans and flush them down the toilet.
But wait! There's a for-profit college waiting in the wings to provide new opportunities through phony degrees with high tuitions backed by Govt. loans. And on and on.
But on the other hand, I'm sure these pacts create jobs -- just not jobs for the folks being laid off. And maybe it's great policy to take one group of Americans and flush them down the toilet.
But wait! There's a for-profit college waiting in the wings to provide new opportunities through phony degrees with high tuitions backed by Govt. loans. And on and on.
21
We've won a battle, not the war. We must keep the pressure on. We must destroy the entitled mentality that leads politicians of both parties to take for granted their right to destroy jobs and the Main Street economy for their pet international causes. Hillary take note.
49
Now President Obama, it is time to publish the agreement.
Understand I have been on the fence about this whole thing. That said, I trust President Obama over the Republicans hands down. But I find it scary that only 500 Companies and Corporations along with a hand full of Country leaders have put this thing together in secret.
If this is such a great agreement why is it Unions around the world that represent workers were not in on the talks? Why is it the very people that will have to do the work were left out of the talks?
Why is it only the rich and powerful are dictating how the rest of us will live?
Why is it the Corporations across America along with the Supreme Court have gone after Unions? I do not think it was just that the Unions donate to Democrats since a lot of them also donate to Republicans.
I think it is time workers around the world get to see how the rich, corporations and powerful have divided up the spoils and where we all really stand in this so call new "global economy".
Understand I have been on the fence about this whole thing. That said, I trust President Obama over the Republicans hands down. But I find it scary that only 500 Companies and Corporations along with a hand full of Country leaders have put this thing together in secret.
If this is such a great agreement why is it Unions around the world that represent workers were not in on the talks? Why is it the very people that will have to do the work were left out of the talks?
Why is it only the rich and powerful are dictating how the rest of us will live?
Why is it the Corporations across America along with the Supreme Court have gone after Unions? I do not think it was just that the Unions donate to Democrats since a lot of them also donate to Republicans.
I think it is time workers around the world get to see how the rich, corporations and powerful have divided up the spoils and where we all really stand in this so call new "global economy".
383
Sheila... all the problems you list are undermining the whole reason we even have voting in the 1st place. The whole purpose of democracy is nullified. The Court blesses corporations directing our govt policy, and setting up the party choices of which we pick from at the voting booth. Obama shows that no matter which we pick the corporations win either way.
You are so wrong about "500 companies putting this thing together". We have all had an opportunity to take part in it through the open comment process and through lobbying.
Where has this rhetoric been? It is the wealthy. We must, as a duty to our children, take to a verbal if not spiritual battle against them. Spit in their food, their drink, their eye. Treat their children with disdain. Make them uncomfortable to walk the streets amongst US. Launch every verbal threat we can think of. Maybe they will hear? Arab Spring is a last resort....but they are pushing US to that end. We have had a revolution before over less.
Just why do you think the Damned thing is secret! It's primary purpose is to continue sacrificing the American living standard by funneling wealth to multinational corporations; a portion of which will reappear on "K" Street to further national decline. NAFTA was opposed by the majority of U.S. citizens, Mexicans and Canadians. It has been a disaster for both the U.S. and Mexico, yet there is no discussion of retraction. This nation's sovereignty was further sacrificed by Clinton by ramming through the WTO. This is just a continuation. The Civil Rights At is of no value unless it increases economic gains. Multinational Corporations have effectively invalidated it through offshoring and have through in the American middle class for good measure.
9
If this deal is so great for the middle class and other working Americans, why can't we see the detail?
Why does members of Congress can only view it in secret?
The main beneficiaries of this deal are the multinationals and the bankers. From what I read, this trade pact is the worst that came down the pipe in years. It would give companies the right to sue a local government for banning its products. But rather than the suit being heard in an American court, it will be heard in a trade tribunal.
Why is the president selling out this country to the bankers and the 1%. Is this their reward for getting him in office twice in a row?
Why does members of Congress can only view it in secret?
The main beneficiaries of this deal are the multinationals and the bankers. From what I read, this trade pact is the worst that came down the pipe in years. It would give companies the right to sue a local government for banning its products. But rather than the suit being heard in an American court, it will be heard in a trade tribunal.
Why is the president selling out this country to the bankers and the 1%. Is this their reward for getting him in office twice in a row?
12
United we stand. Divided we fall. We continue to yell and scream at each other knowing only what some ambitious politicians tell us. This has been going on for too many years. Pogo said it best. We see the enemy. It is us.
Putting a spike in the hear of FastTrack will kill any reasonable trade deal. Now we will have a herd of wandering senators tearing apart the draft of a 10,000 page technical doc that few of them will ever read. Years ago these agreements took many years to make it thru congress., Everyone wanted a piece of the action. Result: bad deals. Congress today is totally dysfunctional. Does anyone really think a complex agreement will happen in an election year or even the first year of a new administration? That is why FastTrack was designed. To avoid a long delay. American negotiating teams have worked with multiple countries for several years to forge agreements. Now all that hard work and expertise will be wasted.
We are a trading nation. Millions have been persuaded to believe that trade agreements always destroy jobs. They do not. The more we sell abroad, the more jobs will be created. Some will disappear too. But that is inherent to the process. Certainly letting this fester in a contentious legislature for years while China, Europe, Brazil, and India form regional trade alliances and begin to import from those in their alliance, will cost American tens of thousands of jobs.
Putting a spike in the hear of FastTrack will kill any reasonable trade deal. Now we will have a herd of wandering senators tearing apart the draft of a 10,000 page technical doc that few of them will ever read. Years ago these agreements took many years to make it thru congress., Everyone wanted a piece of the action. Result: bad deals. Congress today is totally dysfunctional. Does anyone really think a complex agreement will happen in an election year or even the first year of a new administration? That is why FastTrack was designed. To avoid a long delay. American negotiating teams have worked with multiple countries for several years to forge agreements. Now all that hard work and expertise will be wasted.
We are a trading nation. Millions have been persuaded to believe that trade agreements always destroy jobs. They do not. The more we sell abroad, the more jobs will be created. Some will disappear too. But that is inherent to the process. Certainly letting this fester in a contentious legislature for years while China, Europe, Brazil, and India form regional trade alliances and begin to import from those in their alliance, will cost American tens of thousands of jobs.
1
This is wrong. These trade agreements are nothing but a race to the bottom caused by the greed of big businesses. It is a zero sum game. Workers in wealthy Western countries lose their well paying manufacturing jobs to peon and coolie labor in the Third World where health, safety and environmental laws and rules are few or non-existent and wages are dirt cheap. The U.S. has basically de-industrialized due to the WTO, NAFTA, and CAFTA, etc. and sadly Europe seems bent on following the same "highway to hell" to please the super rich oligarchs who own the trans-national companies. Meanwhile in places like India and China people toil for 18 hour six day work weeks in hellish conditions for pennies an hour and pollution chokes the air, land and water. Can anyone say say with a straight face that these people are better off living in urban slums than they were hunting, fishing, and farming in the pastoral countryside? I don't think so! This is a lose-lose equation for workers in the First World losing jobs and workers in the Third World "gaining" them. The only ones who "win" are the billionaire bankers and crapitalists whose insatiable greed for ever more money they can never spend and ever more power over the politicians has become a devouring monster!
While as a capitalist I'm in favor of free trade, as a former worker I'm not; I've seen enough good jobs go overseas and heard enough rich politicians tell me how wonderful the economics of this new globalized world are, and yet all the good jobs have gone away and those rich politicians now build their mausoleums I mean libraries and continue to make more money reading one teleprompter speech (written by a temp. speechwriter) than all those workers would've made in 10 years on a good union job... if that job hadn't left long ago. So I'm actually not unhappy here.
9
It's easy to understand the need for fast tracking this agreement. Otherwise, Congress would subject it to a death by a thousand, parochial cuts. However, it's hard to understand why the administration is being so secretive about what's in it. Certainly, they have to realize that Americans have little trust in the their government. Americans need to know what's in this agreement, and they need to know why it's in their best interest. President Obama needs to tell them, but, as was the case with the ACA, he either won't or can't.
6
But doth the president protest too much? A cynical take on this is that while the legislation will eventually pass in some form, some theatrical displays that are beneficial to various incumbents up for election in 2016 have to played out first.
5
Senator Cornyn asked, "Does the President of the United States have enough clout with members of his own political party?" The question is not about clout, but instead about legislative numbers, which are clearly not on his side. The writing is on the wall for Obama's luck with the 114th Congress, so many Democrats don't see the benefit to joining a losing battle.
Starting with NAFTA, these agreements have all contained clauses said to protect workers and the environment. Enforcement of these provisions has proven to be weak to non-existent. If putting effective language with teeth to deal with abuses of workers rights and pollution into these agreements is a deal-killer, then they should die. The wealthy have gotten what they wanted from them, the average worker has basically nothing to show n-- or if they're really unlucky, even less than the nothing they started with.
21
This is pure politics. Any Democrat who voted for it would be vulnerable in a Democratic primary. To turn a phrase whenever someone says this is not about politics it's the principle I know it's the politics. Defeated and rebuffed by Republicans for four years now it's his own party denying him the legacy he is so intent on leaving. Almost time to say goodbye, Mr. President.
2
I believe that this defeat points up the President's most serious weakness as a politician. He believes that if the substance of his proposals is sound, that is enough and that he should not have to correct misperceptions on the part of those who disagree with him. But most of us have neither the time nor the inclination to become experts on matters of public policy. If Obama believes that the progressive wing of the Democratic Party, or anyone else, fundamentally misunderstands the purpose and effect of the pending legislation, then let him use his bully pulpit, address the country from the White House, and explain, in terms that the average American can understand, why the TPP is a good idea.
After President Clinton's brilliant nominating speech at the 2012 Democratic convention, President Obama joked that Clinton should be "the Secretary of Explaining Things." But that's Obama's job now.
After President Clinton's brilliant nominating speech at the 2012 Democratic convention, President Obama joked that Clinton should be "the Secretary of Explaining Things." But that's Obama's job now.
6
The President and his advisers surely must realize that a trade deal that is negotiated in secret, with no opportunity for Congressional or public input, is an example of poor "optics" -- inside the Beltway lingo for how something is perceived, rather than what it really is.
9
Obama and Hatch don't want to talk about NET exports (exports - imports) and trade deficits. Domestic manufacturers are increasingly opposed. If past trade deals gave us trade surpluses, then fast track would win the votes. But past deals deepened our trade deficit. Obama/Hatch/et al only talk about "export opportunities" and "export supported jobs", ignoring the other side of the equation. Our trade deficit with Korea worsened over 50% since the March 2012 implementation of that "free trade" agreement. They talk about tariffs as if we were still in the year 1906. But they won't deal with new mercantilism like currency manipulation, foreign border taxes and foreign industrial subsidies that eviscerate any theoretical NET benefit of these trade deals.
13
The mere fact that most Republicans supported the free trade agreement was enough reason for me to oppose it.
16
Who would be hurt the most if the TPP doesn't fly? Look at the trade versus GDP figures. In 2014 . . .
Exports to Japan: $67 billion. Imports from Japan: $134 billion
GDP of US: $17.5 trillion. Japan: $4.6 trillion
Japan is far more dependent upon exports than is the US. The effect on the countries' economies of the same percentage export fall-off would be eight times greater upon Japan than the US.
The TPP is in Japan's interest -- not ours.
Exports to Japan: $67 billion. Imports from Japan: $134 billion
GDP of US: $17.5 trillion. Japan: $4.6 trillion
Japan is far more dependent upon exports than is the US. The effect on the countries' economies of the same percentage export fall-off would be eight times greater upon Japan than the US.
The TPP is in Japan's interest -- not ours.
19
I'm also dependent on the Japanese - to produce a better quality of automobile than the General Motors cars I drove during the 1990s.
Elizabeth Warren has every right to oppose this deal, and I hope more lawmakers and average Americans start paying attention to the woman.
There were voices of reason against NAFTA when it was passed as well. Then McAllen, Texas became a boom town as manufacturers and industrialists flocked their operations just south of the border to slash their labor costs while keeping homes just barely within the United States.
Americans should be able to view the language of the agreement in full, and should be given an honest explanation of how this will affect them today and years from now.
The just do as I say argument should not hold water.
There were voices of reason against NAFTA when it was passed as well. Then McAllen, Texas became a boom town as manufacturers and industrialists flocked their operations just south of the border to slash their labor costs while keeping homes just barely within the United States.
Americans should be able to view the language of the agreement in full, and should be given an honest explanation of how this will affect them today and years from now.
The just do as I say argument should not hold water.
24
If you have not called your Senators and rep. opposing this secret trade agreement, do so today. Even if you generally support Obama, don't let him ram this down your throat without seeing it. Believe me, if it was a good deal, there would be complete transparency. The fact this is being negotiated in secret by industry reps. (who are given complete transparency) tells you all you need to know.
Thank you Sen. Warren for trying to save the Pres. from himself. Shame on you Mr. Pres. for criticizing Sen. Warren for trying to tell the people the truth about the TPP.
Thank you Sen. Warren for trying to save the Pres. from himself. Shame on you Mr. Pres. for criticizing Sen. Warren for trying to tell the people the truth about the TPP.
24
After what happened with NAFTA I think we should be cautious. Employees in this country have few protections as it is. Not that this would have been stopped if the business world had lobbied hard enough for it, but it would be nice if our needs for a steady job that pays a decent wage were taken into account just once. I speak as someone who has lived through more than my share of unemployment, lousy wages, and who has listened to the tripe many politicians spout about how lazy every unemployed person in this country is because they think there are plenty of jobs that pay quite well out here. I've known too many people who have lost jobs, then lost their homes and their health because of how we treat people in America. It needs to stop if we want to continue to be a country worth living in and caring about.
14
I think the President's attack on Elizabeth Warren really backfired and, based on some research I've done today on the TPP, I've concluded many of her points and those of other Democrats are on the mark.
Another tone deaf mistake for President Obama was choosing Nike as his backdrop. Nike is a company dedicated to overseas manufacturing at the lowest wage- $1 per hour - and their promise to create several thousand jobs when they sent millions of jobs overseas falls flat.
But the problems with TPP lie in the agreement itself, misrepresentations about it such as the idea it will expand export markets, and the failure to address currency manipulation.
It's another job loser for Americans. And, that's acknowledged in the fast track legislation that plans to cut Medicare by $700 million to pay for health benefits for the Americans predicted to lose their jobs, no doubt high paying jobs unlike the wealth of fast food and other minimum wage jobs we have created over the past 5 years.
Do we need fast track on the TPP? Absolutely not. Thank you Harry Reid, Elizabeth Warren and the other Democrats who voted no.
Another tone deaf mistake for President Obama was choosing Nike as his backdrop. Nike is a company dedicated to overseas manufacturing at the lowest wage- $1 per hour - and their promise to create several thousand jobs when they sent millions of jobs overseas falls flat.
But the problems with TPP lie in the agreement itself, misrepresentations about it such as the idea it will expand export markets, and the failure to address currency manipulation.
It's another job loser for Americans. And, that's acknowledged in the fast track legislation that plans to cut Medicare by $700 million to pay for health benefits for the Americans predicted to lose their jobs, no doubt high paying jobs unlike the wealth of fast food and other minimum wage jobs we have created over the past 5 years.
Do we need fast track on the TPP? Absolutely not. Thank you Harry Reid, Elizabeth Warren and the other Democrats who voted no.
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That appearance of Obama at Nike HQ sent us a very nasty message. Had to be deliberate--these things are planned to the last detail. Tone deaf and hypocritical Obama, an understatement. With friends like this....
Elizabeth Warren backfired because she has lost the support of the New Democrat wing of the Democratic Party. I'll never vote for her - even though I like most of her domestic agenda. She knows nothing about international affairs or trade.
“I’ve been devoted to helping the middle class”: a) see Richard Nixon-“Trust me...I’m not a crook” or b) “but now I’m throwing a bone to my CEO friends.”
"your internet privileges and freedoms will be protected": you'll be FREE to PAY to do things you now do for nothing.
"International corporate courts won't be used to overrule U.S. laws," (as they have done in Mexico and Canada*): Good luck-- 600 corporate advisers aren't helping us write this treaty for nothing.
"We need to give patent protection for our innovative drug industry": They need more billions in profits, and 12 years’ trademark protection isn't enough; how about if you die before you are able to buy a cheaper generic drug?
The one stat that can’t be played with---America’s $722 billion (2014) trade deficit; The USA can’t afford to ship 3/4 trillion dollars a year overseas and preserve its standard of living. With the start of the free trade era in 1980, America went from being a creditor nation to a debtor nation, and the real income for 99% of Americans has not increased.
Fool us once with NAFTA, shame on you. Fool us with CAFTA, CTPA, the WTO, and more, and now the TPP, shame on us.
Tons of info on the TPP on the internet and Youtube.
"your internet privileges and freedoms will be protected": you'll be FREE to PAY to do things you now do for nothing.
"International corporate courts won't be used to overrule U.S. laws," (as they have done in Mexico and Canada*): Good luck-- 600 corporate advisers aren't helping us write this treaty for nothing.
"We need to give patent protection for our innovative drug industry": They need more billions in profits, and 12 years’ trademark protection isn't enough; how about if you die before you are able to buy a cheaper generic drug?
The one stat that can’t be played with---America’s $722 billion (2014) trade deficit; The USA can’t afford to ship 3/4 trillion dollars a year overseas and preserve its standard of living. With the start of the free trade era in 1980, America went from being a creditor nation to a debtor nation, and the real income for 99% of Americans has not increased.
Fool us once with NAFTA, shame on you. Fool us with CAFTA, CTPA, the WTO, and more, and now the TPP, shame on us.
Tons of info on the TPP on the internet and Youtube.
Public opinion has reached the point in America where most people believe that every defeat for the advocates of more international "free" trade is a victory for ordinary people. It will take a massive, overwhelming sea change in thinking for the status quo to be overturned.
Just look at who pushes for passage of TPP: Inside-the-Beltway think tankers, Republican politicians, TED talk attendees, corporate shills, and rather disturbingly President Obama as well. I was never foolish enough to ever think that a man willing to retain George W. Bush's Secretary of Defense (Robert Gates) as his own for 2-plus years and bring people like Timothy Geithner and Lawrence "Let's Dump Toxic Waste in West Africa" Summers back into government was a leftist or even left-of-center Democrat (Obama is neither; he is a right-of-center Democrat), but I have to admit to being shocked by the sight of Obama taking the side of Mitch McConnell and attempting to paint Elizabeth Warren in such a negative light.
For the umpteenth time to the clueless out there blinded by Obama Derangement Syndrome: Dennis Kucinich was the liberal among Democratic presidential nominees in 2008. Obama was not and never was. Seven years later, do you get it?
Just look at who pushes for passage of TPP: Inside-the-Beltway think tankers, Republican politicians, TED talk attendees, corporate shills, and rather disturbingly President Obama as well. I was never foolish enough to ever think that a man willing to retain George W. Bush's Secretary of Defense (Robert Gates) as his own for 2-plus years and bring people like Timothy Geithner and Lawrence "Let's Dump Toxic Waste in West Africa" Summers back into government was a leftist or even left-of-center Democrat (Obama is neither; he is a right-of-center Democrat), but I have to admit to being shocked by the sight of Obama taking the side of Mitch McConnell and attempting to paint Elizabeth Warren in such a negative light.
For the umpteenth time to the clueless out there blinded by Obama Derangement Syndrome: Dennis Kucinich was the liberal among Democratic presidential nominees in 2008. Obama was not and never was. Seven years later, do you get it?
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I think I am beginning to get it. Thanks AR from Virginia.
2
Have to start somewhere, somehow.
This vote is good news, but it is worrying to read the vote had 52 for, when 8 against are "pro-trade" and liable to switch sides on the next vote. That would make a filibuster-proof 60. Who are these 8?
34
Carper voted yes. Wyden, Bennet, Cantwell, Feinstein, McCaskill, Murray, Nelson, Warner and Schumer are on record as open to a deal in which fast track would be granted in exchange for a promised vote on pre-approved (read: likely symbolic) amendments.
3
Dear Congress people. Whatever you do now will determine our path for our children and their children, in the future. Remember America can not and does not operate in isolation. It is fully inter dependent upon on nations of this earth which it shares with all humanity. Kindly remember this as you do your daily business. Think of our children, our planet and humanity in its entirety.
8
I am interested in the environmental issues and laws addressed in the TPP.
Is it true that many of the USA environmental regulatory rules would be tossed
out the window? People really do need to understand what the accord says.
Can anyone explain?
Is it true that many of the USA environmental regulatory rules would be tossed
out the window? People really do need to understand what the accord says.
Can anyone explain?
17
Our economy is presently Gulliver on a Lilliputian beach being hamstrung by OCD regulators who must jusitify their salaries by churning out ever more burdensome rules every single year.
1
Thank God. I am an Obama supporter and I am not adverse to a trade agreement, but:
--the terms must be in the open for everyone to see
--any agreement that allows a corporation to sue a country over packaging (TPP would allow Marlboro to sue a country if that country requires specific packaging of tobacco products) is unacceptable. Corporate sovereignty can never supersede national sovereignty.
Wouldn't be such a big deal if Obama wasn't trying so hard to hide the terms...
--the terms must be in the open for everyone to see
--any agreement that allows a corporation to sue a country over packaging (TPP would allow Marlboro to sue a country if that country requires specific packaging of tobacco products) is unacceptable. Corporate sovereignty can never supersede national sovereignty.
Wouldn't be such a big deal if Obama wasn't trying so hard to hide the terms...
35
And what is hidden COULD DEFINITELY be a big deal.
1
Mexico just won a WTO ruling against the US for labeling tuna as dolphin safe. This process is already ongoing. TPP would just give the option to more companies and countries.
http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/04/14/us-usa-mexico-tuna-idUSKBN0N51...
http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/04/14/us-usa-mexico-tuna-idUSKBN0N51...
Certain they are very well pleased in Beijing. China does not like the TPP as it will undermine their strategy of economic domination in southeast Asia and the Pacific rim.
As to the currency manipulation bit it would be a deal breaker here and even if not rather useless as the most egregious practitioner of currency manipulation for the past decade and a half has been China and they are not a party to the TPP.
As to the currency manipulation bit it would be a deal breaker here and even if not rather useless as the most egregious practitioner of currency manipulation for the past decade and a half has been China and they are not a party to the TPP.
4
President Obama justifiably lost all but one of his Democratic Senators in attempting to ram through "fast track" authority for the TPP. There were many reasons raised for Democrats uniting against their own President, but foremost among them was the lack of "transparency" in asking them to approve a document that is still incomplete, and classified as "secret." Given the sorry history of all previous trade deals for working Americans, it was simply unreasonable for the President to insist that his party which stands for good-paying, middle-class jobs to just "trust" him, but not "verify" until later. No responsible person should be asked to sign such a contract without knowing what's in it. The TPP may be a good deal, but let us see the fine print first. Then we can all decide if it's "Change we can believe in."
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Sorry, but this is utter nonsense. Granting fast-track authority is not the same thing as approval of the TPP. Permitting such authority would have produced an agreement with all provisions made public, and a proposal which would have been subject to an up/down vote. All the pretense otherwise in these comments amounts to either obfuscation or deep misunderstanding.
At least now we can listen to the choreographed cheers from those who believe something more has been accomplished than the future loss of jobs in those US industries which created over 1.5 -trillion- dollars of exports in 2014. Perhaps for the duration of the celebration the "winners" ought to consider searching for something and someone else to blame for this effect than today's actions by the Senate.
At least now we can listen to the choreographed cheers from those who believe something more has been accomplished than the future loss of jobs in those US industries which created over 1.5 -trillion- dollars of exports in 2014. Perhaps for the duration of the celebration the "winners" ought to consider searching for something and someone else to blame for this effect than today's actions by the Senate.
The president should not be the sole decider of trade agreements.
This is good news.
This is good news.
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In 2014 exports from America amounted to US$1.623 trillion, up 27.1% since 2010. United States top 10 exports accounted for 68.3% of the overall value of its global shipments.
The following export product groups represent the highest dollar value in American global shipments during 2014. Also shown is the percentage share each export category represents in terms of US overall exports.
1) Machines, engines, pumps: US$219,566,232,000 (13.5% of total exports)
2)Electronic equipment: $171,966,197,000 (10.6%)
3)Oil: $157,213,437,000 (9.7%)
4) Vehicles: $135,797,903,000 (8.4%)
5)Aircraft, spacecraft: $124,831,567,000 (7.7%)
6)Medical, technical equipment: $84,879,104,000 (5.2%)
7)Gems, precious metals, coins: $65,522,480,000 (4.0%)
8) Plastics: $63,025,216,000 (3.9%)
9)Pharmaceuticals: $43,967,977,000 (2.7%)
10) Organic chemicals: $42,255,264,000 (2.6%
See: http://www.worldstopexports.com/united-states-top-10-exports/2001
America workers in these export sectors may be hurt without new trade agreements. About 52% of our total imports in 2014 where in four ares:oil,machinery,electronic equipment and vehicles.We have to remember that while we are the largest importer, we are also the second largest exporter, and those facts must be considered by the people who profess concern for American workers.
.
The following export product groups represent the highest dollar value in American global shipments during 2014. Also shown is the percentage share each export category represents in terms of US overall exports.
1) Machines, engines, pumps: US$219,566,232,000 (13.5% of total exports)
2)Electronic equipment: $171,966,197,000 (10.6%)
3)Oil: $157,213,437,000 (9.7%)
4) Vehicles: $135,797,903,000 (8.4%)
5)Aircraft, spacecraft: $124,831,567,000 (7.7%)
6)Medical, technical equipment: $84,879,104,000 (5.2%)
7)Gems, precious metals, coins: $65,522,480,000 (4.0%)
8) Plastics: $63,025,216,000 (3.9%)
9)Pharmaceuticals: $43,967,977,000 (2.7%)
10) Organic chemicals: $42,255,264,000 (2.6%
See: http://www.worldstopexports.com/united-states-top-10-exports/2001
America workers in these export sectors may be hurt without new trade agreements. About 52% of our total imports in 2014 where in four ares:oil,machinery,electronic equipment and vehicles.We have to remember that while we are the largest importer, we are also the second largest exporter, and those facts must be considered by the people who profess concern for American workers.
.
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I don't know if you've noticed, but we have a climate crisis on our hands...
This trade agreement encourages the opposite of what we need to be doing, and that is living locally. We don't need to be transporting things from the other side of the world, burning carbon for "stuff" we most likely don't need anyways. Even the manufacturing of that stuff uses fossil fuels. Enough consumerism, especially when it comes from the other side of the World. I'm sorry, but internationalism has come about mostly since the fossil fuel age. We need to think local and act local for the sake of the climate.
This trade agreement encourages the opposite of what we need to be doing, and that is living locally. We don't need to be transporting things from the other side of the world, burning carbon for "stuff" we most likely don't need anyways. Even the manufacturing of that stuff uses fossil fuels. Enough consumerism, especially when it comes from the other side of the World. I'm sorry, but internationalism has come about mostly since the fossil fuel age. We need to think local and act local for the sake of the climate.
4
Okay. Even so, allow the American people to read the TPP and to weigh in. You might find that many come around to the position you just promoted.
3
Simple fact - we have a $500 billion trade deficit. Free trade isn't working for America. Ultimately, the growth in exports simply doesn't outweigh the overall losses free trade continues to cause.
Also, if you believe the traditional rhetoric around free trade, the manufacturing industries which remain in the United States make advanced goods like air planes and rely on our robust education system, high quality of life, and investments in infrastructure and innovation. In other words, they're industries which depend on advantages which can't be easily replicated. Those exporters are not likely to be drastically impaired by curbing cheap imports.
Also, if you believe the traditional rhetoric around free trade, the manufacturing industries which remain in the United States make advanced goods like air planes and rely on our robust education system, high quality of life, and investments in infrastructure and innovation. In other words, they're industries which depend on advantages which can't be easily replicated. Those exporters are not likely to be drastically impaired by curbing cheap imports.
Apparently implying that your political opponents are either lying or stupid is not the best way to win them over to your side.
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So you should lie like they do, or just ignore their false statements? Perhaps it's better to stand for truth in the face of hysteria and dishonesty. That's called integrity and it's more important than undermining the political process even more with false logic and misleading statements without foundation in order to "win."
5
Walter,
For the last eight years the Republicans have created what may become a permanent totally dysfunctional Congress deeply divided by ideology, party power politics and bitterness. Calling opponents to your initiative liars or stupid (Senator Warren certainly is none of these) does not help bridge the irrational divide or create a receptive audience among your opponents willing to even listen – let alone maintain an open mind to change based on rational statements or explanation.
For the last eight years the Republicans have created what may become a permanent totally dysfunctional Congress deeply divided by ideology, party power politics and bitterness. Calling opponents to your initiative liars or stupid (Senator Warren certainly is none of these) does not help bridge the irrational divide or create a receptive audience among your opponents willing to even listen – let alone maintain an open mind to change based on rational statements or explanation.
5
With Democratic friends like these (including apparently most of the posters here), who needs Republican enemies?
11
With democratic friends like Obama, who needs republican enemies?
1
I fear the following is only the tip of the iceberg. I want President Obama to prove to me that such a thing like this will never happen under TPP.
"Uruguay had received accolades from the World Health Organization and from anti-smoking activists for its anti-smoking campaign."
From Wikipedia:
"The Philip Morris v. Uruguay case started on 19 February 2010, when the multinational tobacco company Philip Morris International filed a complaint against Uruguay. The company complains that Uruguay's anti-smoking legislation devalues its cigarette trademarks and investments in the country and is suing Uruguay for compensation under the bilateral investment treaty between Switzerland and Uruguay. (Philip Morris is headquartered in Lausanne.) The treaty provides that disputes are settled by binding arbitration before the International Centre for Settlement of Investment Disputes."
Note, too: Philip Morris is headquartered, no longer in the US, but in Lausanne!!!!!
Uruguay has little money to defend itself from the international conglomerate's lawsuits. Michael Bloomberg is helping provide funds for Uruguay's defense.
"Uruguay had received accolades from the World Health Organization and from anti-smoking activists for its anti-smoking campaign."
From Wikipedia:
"The Philip Morris v. Uruguay case started on 19 February 2010, when the multinational tobacco company Philip Morris International filed a complaint against Uruguay. The company complains that Uruguay's anti-smoking legislation devalues its cigarette trademarks and investments in the country and is suing Uruguay for compensation under the bilateral investment treaty between Switzerland and Uruguay. (Philip Morris is headquartered in Lausanne.) The treaty provides that disputes are settled by binding arbitration before the International Centre for Settlement of Investment Disputes."
Note, too: Philip Morris is headquartered, no longer in the US, but in Lausanne!!!!!
Uruguay has little money to defend itself from the international conglomerate's lawsuits. Michael Bloomberg is helping provide funds for Uruguay's defense.
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Australia is also being sued by a tobacco company for " diminished profits". In an attempt to reduce disease and death from smoking Australia had a plain wrapper requirement.
7
Alaska has a population that is less then 10% of N.Y. state but it gets the same amount of Senators as N.Y. does. The Democrats get 1 million more votes for congress then Republicans do but the Republicans get more seats in the Congress then Democrats do. Al Gore receives 1/2 million more votes then G.W. Bush gets but Bush gets to be President. 50 plus votes have been available to this President for every major piece of legislation he has promoted since his inauguration but he is stymied every step of the way, in these highly partisan times, by a 60 vote filibuster bar. I'm surprised we get anything done, I'm surprised people think we have a representative government and I'm surprised people think that the rest of the world will sit still waiting for this dysfunctional government to move forward on a trade deal. The world will move on without us and we will have no one to blame but ourselves.
4
Because we are a REPUBLIC - each "state" is actually an individual country, WHY there is equal representation in the Senate. And the huge votes of liberal "taking" Democrats on the coast are great for their STATE majority, but not enough to overwhelm the desires of the other states. Why this country was structured the intelligent way it is.
1
Rick Gage: did you sleep through US Government class? Can you be THIS ignorant of how our government works? OF COURSE the Senate is apportioned by 2 Senators per state -- it's part of the Constitution. We would not be the "United States" of America if we did not grant each state an equal standing SOMEWHERE.
It is the House of Representatives where POPULATION is represented, and your beloved blue states dominate. For that matter, until last November, the SENATE was dominated by DEMOCRATS.
Democrats get more votes simply because they dominate in high population areas. But votes (except for POTUS) are local, so it doesn't really matter. Or do you suggest that voters in California and New York tell voters in Arkansas and Kentucky who their Congressman should be?
It is the House of Representatives where POPULATION is represented, and your beloved blue states dominate. For that matter, until last November, the SENATE was dominated by DEMOCRATS.
Democrats get more votes simply because they dominate in high population areas. But votes (except for POTUS) are local, so it doesn't really matter. Or do you suggest that voters in California and New York tell voters in Arkansas and Kentucky who their Congressman should be?
Hip, hip Horray! One for the good guys. Unfortunately, Obama is restless and ruthless when it comes to his pro corproate agenda. We need to continue to fight TPP like our lives depend on it because they do!
42
Distrust goes a lot deeper than just the issue of whether this "Agreement" is being withheld from public scrutiny. The President promised a doubling of U.S. exports...and we aren't even close. He said the free trade agreement with Korea would increase U.S. exports by $13 billion...instead, Korean exports to the U.S. have just about reached that growth level, while our exports have increased by, maybe a quarter of that amount. The President makes promises, claims benefits for all Americans...and just hasn't delivered.
25
Good. Democrats are finally remembering what they supposedly stand for. The very notion of pairing up with Republicans on this issue is disgusting especially when the Republicans never support the Democrats on liberal issues. Let's hope the entire deal is caput/finished and that the Democrats are not merely trying to maneuver for some cosmetic, face-saving amendment which will give them political cover.
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President Obama should have used his considerable orator's skills to explain the benefits of this agreement, beyond the initial "pivot to Asia." It was also too simplistic to rebut Elizabeth Warren as "a politician" and "wrong." Everyone concerned is a politician and right/wrong is subjective, so please, fill us in on the specifics; otherwise, legislators and constituents won't get behind a plan.
19
Yes! I've been signing email petitions from every conceivable advocacy group opposing the fast track don't analyze just trust me TPP for the last three months.
25
Now you tell me! I voted for Obama, both presidential terms. Turns out he's an Orrin Hatch Democrat.
23
I'm sure that bloviating globalist/futurist types (think Parag & Ayesha Khanna, the self-proclaimed Alvin & Heidi Toffler of Generation X) will bemoan today's Senate vote, but I doubt most others will. There is deep suspicion surrounding TPP, and its supporters like those below who express their shock at how "misinformed" people are about the agreement...will not be convincing too many people anytime soon that they are correct.
21
How can one be "misinformed" about something that is top secret?
Earth to President Obama: Americans have had it with these "Corporations Are People" trade agreements that produce jobs in other countries.
The Transnational Pure Profits agreement is just more economic plutonium to impoverish the American worker.
The Transnational Pure Profits agreement is just more economic plutonium to impoverish the American worker.
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Obama needs to only look in the rear view mirror for an accurate recoed of his lack of performance in thid area during his term in office on these issues....failure on behalf of all working AmericanS!
Warren in action once again. Funny how when she makes a point about something, people tend to listen. Perhaps it's because she uses well reasoned arguments, not 'trust me.'
50
She's proven again her wisdom in declining to run for President. She can accomplish so much good for our country in the Senate.
1
Serves him right for trying to pull a fast one on the whole country. And to try to do it with the support of the GOP who never grant Obama the authority to do anything. You have to wonder what is in that TPP and why Obama is supporting it.
29
Hatch is the main leader of this abomination?? One wonders what kind of favorable nutritional supplement section he put in the TTP.
14
Watching President Obama give his speech at Nike last week, I was more than a little taken aback by his approach of "Trust me, I know best what's good for you, you ignorant, stupid, liberal common folk." The fact that he thought that anyone would or should trust a politician in this day and age, is being tone deaf in the extreme.
90
Great from the land of Nike. (not a fan of Phil Knight and his redo of the U. of Oregon) Stop this trade thing. NOW
1
" Trust me, I know best what's good for you, you ignorant, stupid, liberal common folk."
Funny you should say this since all we have heard from Republicans these last 40 years is they know what is best for the Country and see where that has gotten the Country.
Granted President Obama is a politician but take a long look around. Tell us what the Republicans have done to clean up the mess they have made and what the Democrats have done.
Fact is we elect politicians to work for the common good. I have yet to see a Republican work for anyone but the rich and far right wing. Example what right thinking person would pass a law that would say it is "OK" for a doctor to use a probe to exam a woman. They did this to get the far right religious wing vote. Tell me what decent man or woman would do such a thing? I do not remember seeing any Democrats vote for such a thing.
Funny you should say this since all we have heard from Republicans these last 40 years is they know what is best for the Country and see where that has gotten the Country.
Granted President Obama is a politician but take a long look around. Tell us what the Republicans have done to clean up the mess they have made and what the Democrats have done.
Fact is we elect politicians to work for the common good. I have yet to see a Republican work for anyone but the rich and far right wing. Example what right thinking person would pass a law that would say it is "OK" for a doctor to use a probe to exam a woman. They did this to get the far right religious wing vote. Tell me what decent man or woman would do such a thing? I do not remember seeing any Democrats vote for such a thing.
Well, considering the "ignorant, stupid, liberal common folk" elected him twice, he may be forgiven for expecting them to once again follow in lockstep.
1
This may save Hillary a difficult and defining moment.
6
I feel as though I am in Russia. Senators voting on a "secret bill"? Citizens being denied access to reading the bill? I never thought I would see such a travesty in my life time. And that doesn't even take into account the NSA spying on every U.S. citizen's cell phone calls and Internet use like the KGB. Seriously, what has happened to Obama?
102
Nothing we were all sold a bill of goods. Its appalling.
8
First the spying was in place long before President Obama.
Remember you elected twice the very President that give it to us.
Agreed President Obama let some of it stay in place but the Republicans in Congress and the pass Republicans Administration give us the spying. So put the blame where it really belongs.
Remember it was Republicans that voted in the Party of "No" to obstruct any changes. If you voted them in you are just as responsible for the spying as they are.
Remember you elected twice the very President that give it to us.
Agreed President Obama let some of it stay in place but the Republicans in Congress and the pass Republicans Administration give us the spying. So put the blame where it really belongs.
Remember it was Republicans that voted in the Party of "No" to obstruct any changes. If you voted them in you are just as responsible for the spying as they are.
" Senators voting on a "secret bill"? Citizens being denied access to reading the bill? I never thought I would see such a travesty in my life time."
You have already seen it with "we have to pass this bill to know what is in it" obamacare.
You have already seen it with "we have to pass this bill to know what is in it" obamacare.
1
We should small a rat, especially (1) with all this rush to fast track approval of the TPP asap when (2) technically we don't even know what is in the agreement, except for some leaks--such as corporations can sue governments for interfering with a corporation doing business and its profits.
The corporations seem very happy about the TPP and are pushing mightily for it, which should be a red flag right there for working Americans.
First things first! We need to see the proposed agreement, then we need to know how this trade agreement won't be another NAFTA, and will help rather than hurt middle- and working class Americans.
I am grateful for those senators from both the Republican and Democratic parties for standing up, slowing down the TPP, and refusing to go lock step with the corporations or with President Obama.
Obama has been very disappointing on the TPP and appears to have abandoned the middle class he so claimed to want to help, in favor of joining all the many politicians in the wealthy plutocrats' circle.
You can count on the fingers of one hand the politicians who actually care about everyday working Americans.
The corporations seem very happy about the TPP and are pushing mightily for it, which should be a red flag right there for working Americans.
First things first! We need to see the proposed agreement, then we need to know how this trade agreement won't be another NAFTA, and will help rather than hurt middle- and working class Americans.
I am grateful for those senators from both the Republican and Democratic parties for standing up, slowing down the TPP, and refusing to go lock step with the corporations or with President Obama.
Obama has been very disappointing on the TPP and appears to have abandoned the middle class he so claimed to want to help, in favor of joining all the many politicians in the wealthy plutocrats' circle.
You can count on the fingers of one hand the politicians who actually care about everyday working Americans.
98
"I am grateful for those senators from both the Republican and Democratic parties for standing up, slowing down the TPP"
What Republicans? It was all the Democrats in the Senate.
What Republicans? It was all the Democrats in the Senate.
9
One finger, maybe two.
1
Not sure what President Obama is up to.
But after seeing what the Republicans have in store for this Country with their far right wing members and their agenda. I know for a fact that the Republican Corporate Party abandon this Country and it's people a long time ago.
But after seeing what the Republicans have in store for this Country with their far right wing members and their agenda. I know for a fact that the Republican Corporate Party abandon this Country and it's people a long time ago.
4
Everyone like Trade, but most people want Fair Trade. Americans want Corporations to be succesfull. Yet they've also learned in the past few decades that Corporate America success doesn't always trickele down to US workers. So this is a good news, and I hope Democrats keep fighting the President on this.
I've heard that the TPP will allow Corporations to adopt children in poor countries to work for free( sarcasm, after all Corporations are people thanks to the Robert's court). Am I making this up as the president said people are. Yes I'm.The reason I'm making this us is simple: the TPP is being negotiated in secret. Make it public and people will stop making things up.
For Democrats to support TPP, more conditions have too be attached;
1. Profits made from the TPP should be brought back to the US and taxed at minimum 20%. This money should be put in a specific Fund and used to help workers and communities around the country that will suffer from the trade agreement.
Corporations should not be allowed to use Tax scheme to keep their future profits in Off Shore countries.
I've heard that the TPP will allow Corporations to adopt children in poor countries to work for free( sarcasm, after all Corporations are people thanks to the Robert's court). Am I making this up as the president said people are. Yes I'm.The reason I'm making this us is simple: the TPP is being negotiated in secret. Make it public and people will stop making things up.
For Democrats to support TPP, more conditions have too be attached;
1. Profits made from the TPP should be brought back to the US and taxed at minimum 20%. This money should be put in a specific Fund and used to help workers and communities around the country that will suffer from the trade agreement.
Corporations should not be allowed to use Tax scheme to keep their future profits in Off Shore countries.
36
'when trading partners artificially depress the value of their currency to make their exports cheaper and United States exports more expensive'
Obama, why did you ever do this?
Obama, why did you ever do this?
32
Obama isn't MAKING anybody depress their currency. Rather the agreement as written just would not prevent countries from doing so. It's a normal Keynesian tactic; a country prints money allowing short-term inflation, boosting jobs, and lowering the real cost of paying off debt. But fear not - it isn't sustainable and wouldn't continue for long. A country that maintains a depressed currency will eventually find all its corporations owned by overseas investors.
And assuming we modify the agreement to disallow manipulation HOW would we respond to a country breaking the rules? By depressing OUR currency? What reasonable reaction wouldn't hurt us at least as much as the offending nation?
The advantages of making our trading partners abide by our environmental regulations FAR exceeds the little bit of risk from currency manipulation by the relatively small economies we are negotiating with.
And assuming we modify the agreement to disallow manipulation HOW would we respond to a country breaking the rules? By depressing OUR currency? What reasonable reaction wouldn't hurt us at least as much as the offending nation?
The advantages of making our trading partners abide by our environmental regulations FAR exceeds the little bit of risk from currency manipulation by the relatively small economies we are negotiating with.
As if pulling $2,000,000,000,000 out of thin air and calling it "Quantitative Easing" (for the banks) were not currency manipulation.
1
We might be able to figure out why once we see what corporations are involved in the secret discussions...
2
This situation has similarity with the Iran discussion. "Fast-track" doesn't mean the Senate signs a blank check. It merely means the Senate can only have an up or down vote on the final deal. Without fast-track, the Senate can bog down the negotiation by all kinds of horse-trading, similar to how AG Lynch's nomination was held up for some contraceptive clause unrelated to law enforcement.
I was against Senator Cotton's self-insertion into the Iran negotiation. I'm also against Senate's self-insertion into the TPP negotiation. Congress can always pass a law to void the result of a negotiation, but at least minimize the meddling during the negotiation.
I was against Senator Cotton's self-insertion into the Iran negotiation. I'm also against Senate's self-insertion into the TPP negotiation. Congress can always pass a law to void the result of a negotiation, but at least minimize the meddling during the negotiation.
39
The problem is as much about citizens who no longer trust a process that closes them out of any direct or indirect participation. We remember NAFTA. It's in our faces every single day.
9
As everyone can see, TPP backers have at least 52 votes. If the Senate were to approve fast track TPP passes.
2
The requirement of an up-or-down vote simply allows the bill's supporters to bludgeon its critics into submission. The Senate being able to "bog down" the negotiation is precisely the kind of sausage making we want when something this important and complex is being decided.
2
I'm not against fair trade. I am against secret, classified, clandestine trade negotiations that create a sense of urgency that requires a "fast-track." That's a red flag on the package that says this wouldn't pass muster in an open and transparent deliberative process. Congress has a constitutional duty to represent my (our) interests and the fine print matters.
48
Regardless of the pros and cons (and there are some pros) in global trade, I think that one message that Democrats at least got from the public - finally - was that we are sick to death of being talked down to by our representatives in Congress and especially in the White House about these sweeping agreements and about their negotiation over our heads and behind our backs. We are not fools and were not fooled.
People are also sick of the country's political class, with a few exceptions, e.g., Warren, Sanders, and Alan Grayson, coming clean with the country and fully disclosing what these agreements have done to us and who really benefits. Hopefully, this will mark a historical turning point, one that will produce a major reconsideration and rethinking of the Washington Consensus and neoliberalism in general.
As Congressman Alan Grayson (FL-09) has stated, the continuing goal of the big money boys and the global corporations is, at bottom, to reduce the United States to a nation of "low wage workers and debt slaves."
I am fighting for my grandchildren.
People are also sick of the country's political class, with a few exceptions, e.g., Warren, Sanders, and Alan Grayson, coming clean with the country and fully disclosing what these agreements have done to us and who really benefits. Hopefully, this will mark a historical turning point, one that will produce a major reconsideration and rethinking of the Washington Consensus and neoliberalism in general.
As Congressman Alan Grayson (FL-09) has stated, the continuing goal of the big money boys and the global corporations is, at bottom, to reduce the United States to a nation of "low wage workers and debt slaves."
I am fighting for my grandchildren.
86
Amen. I'm also sick and tired of the corporate media class, selling us horse malarky and shaping our political narratives, leading us to ruin with a plastic smile and a soundbite. I am fighting for the world my parents and grandparents made and for my future children and the quality of their lives.
6
I meant to write that people are fed up with the country's political class NOT coming clean with them about what these agreements really do and who really benefits. But, as has been observed by others, the one lasting political lesson that Jimmy Carter taught those who came after him was never to tell the American public an unpleasant truth (Al Gore apparently did not get the memo). So we get mountains of half-truths, misleading statements and outright fabrication. Just so tired of it.
3
I'm shocked at how misinformed the comment are on the issue. Fast track does not pass the bill - it simply gives the executives room to negotiate - no deal has been agreed to, which is why there is nothing public. It is not "secret", it has not been worked out yet. And then, when there is something to show, it will be made public and put to an up or down vote in congress. There is nothing to "trust" the president on.
And the fact that senators see this as their opportunity to pile on all sorts of wish list items such as currency manipulation prevention (which none of those countries would ever agree to - we manipulate our own currency at times) is the exact reason why fast track is needed. Because you can't negotiate a treaty only to have it go through congress and be larded up with every amendment under the sun.
I shocked at how misinformed, antagonistic, and protectionist the reaction is on free trade - with no regard to the facts. Free trade is by far a net positive. We can either move forward with the rest of the world or get left behind. We need the jobs of the future; the jobs of the past are long gone.
And the fact that senators see this as their opportunity to pile on all sorts of wish list items such as currency manipulation prevention (which none of those countries would ever agree to - we manipulate our own currency at times) is the exact reason why fast track is needed. Because you can't negotiate a treaty only to have it go through congress and be larded up with every amendment under the sun.
I shocked at how misinformed, antagonistic, and protectionist the reaction is on free trade - with no regard to the facts. Free trade is by far a net positive. We can either move forward with the rest of the world or get left behind. We need the jobs of the future; the jobs of the past are long gone.
14
"We can either move forward with the rest of the world or get left behind." What about leading the rest of the world to a better life for all people? Free trade is good for capitalists not workers who are one of the "inefficiencies" that get removed. Anyway TPP is mostly not about free trade but rather about giving corporations quasi-governmental powers.
1
Funny, whenever I hear someone mention the "jobs of the future", they become strangely silent when asked to name a few, yet they remain certain beyond all doubt they exist - and in abundance.
6
These trade deals have not created jobs, they have seen to the offshoring of American jobs to places where corporations can profit from lower wages and lax worker and environmental policies. It's not reactionary to notice factory after factory closed in the years after NAFTA and GAA. We have leaders, and their acolytes, like you, who are willing to sellout their fellow citizens for a few shekels of additional profit. We've heard this nonsense for 25 years and year after year fewer and fewer manufacturing MIDDLE CLASS jobs are available. I guess the plan is for all of us to be burger flippers or government employees or on welfare. I don't like the plan, and dislike the people who support it even more. Take your globalist nonsense and your feigned shock elsewhere.
3
Trade taxation of the 2 trillion these corporations are hiding overseas and a huge infrastructure program for the trade bill.
22
I like the infrastructure idea but how do you intend to tax the 2 trillion? It's already subject to tax. That's why it's overseas. What law could you pass to get that money that wouldn't result in most large American companies simply moving their headquarters offshore?
Somehow punching imaginary hippies to push through the agreement didn't make Obama a tough guy this time.
There is a change for the better.
Time for some more anonymous whispers to the NYT about the secret agreement.
There is a change for the better.
Time for some more anonymous whispers to the NYT about the secret agreement.
29
In 2011 President Obama championed the South Korea trade agreement.
Republicans, Democrats and The US Chamber of Commerce applauded.
The deal went through. Since then, U.S. exports to Korea have fallen, U.S. imports have risen 80 percent, and we ran a $25 billion trade deficit in 2014. Peter Morici, chief economist in the early Clinton years at the U.S. International Trade Commission, says the Korean deal alone, and the import surge that followed, cost America 100,000 jobs.
In 2015 President Obama championed theTPP trade agreement.
Republicans and The US Chamber of Commerce applauded.
Democrats woke from their slumber.
Republicans, Democrats and The US Chamber of Commerce applauded.
The deal went through. Since then, U.S. exports to Korea have fallen, U.S. imports have risen 80 percent, and we ran a $25 billion trade deficit in 2014. Peter Morici, chief economist in the early Clinton years at the U.S. International Trade Commission, says the Korean deal alone, and the import surge that followed, cost America 100,000 jobs.
In 2015 President Obama championed theTPP trade agreement.
Republicans and The US Chamber of Commerce applauded.
Democrats woke from their slumber.
90
We are sick of not being listened to and having choices we would not make being metaphorically shoved down our collective throat.
Our jobs went overseas 30 years ago, and the ones that took their place pay half as much, if that.
Scientists have been warning that the poles would melt for 30 years if we didn't stop using fossil fuels, and now they are, and Obama is allowing more coal mining and has opened the arctic for drilling although the conditions are still harsh and here is no certainty that the inevitable "spill" can ever be cleaned - this is suicide!
Our jobs went overseas 30 years ago, and the ones that took their place pay half as much, if that.
Scientists have been warning that the poles would melt for 30 years if we didn't stop using fossil fuels, and now they are, and Obama is allowing more coal mining and has opened the arctic for drilling although the conditions are still harsh and here is no certainty that the inevitable "spill" can ever be cleaned - this is suicide!
79
The "I got mine" times are upon us.
1
It wasn't your job! You are not entitled to that job. You are free to work hard and get an education so that you can get ahead. Instead, you want low-skilled jobs for high wages that are protected from the big bad free market by your nanny the government. You want business owners to have to choose between running a business in their home country and making profits. You want to cling to the economy of the past and not build the economy of the future. There are words for this mentality -- "backwards" and "protectionist" are two that come to mind.
President Obama is right to emphasize education and trade as two cornerstones of building a modern economy. Now his party is deserting him to suck up to the unions. It's a tragedy.
President Obama is right to emphasize education and trade as two cornerstones of building a modern economy. Now his party is deserting him to suck up to the unions. It's a tragedy.
All you really need to know about the TPP is that those in favor of it A) are keeping it secret from us, B) want to push it through without any changes or oversight, and C keep telling us "It won't be like those previous trade deals" - which were all supposed to be so great for America.
The President's support for this is right up there with letting Shell drill for oil in the arctic. It's the wrong policy at the wrong time - haven't we learned anything?
The President's support for this is right up there with letting Shell drill for oil in the arctic. It's the wrong policy at the wrong time - haven't we learned anything?
125
It is amazing how these trade deals get fast tracked. Legislation that affects hundreds of millions of Americans should not be fast tracked. Where are the congressional oversights to determine whether prior trade deals were effective? Why do so many of our senators and congressmen engage in the willful blindness? Why are they only attentive on matters that are important to their big donors? If China is eager to make a bad trade deal with these Asian nations, let them go first. There have been too many times that the administrations dove into this type of deal head first.
44
Every time these free trade deals come up, we're told that they'll create countless jobs and ensure our prosperity, while politicians, economists, analysts and even journalists breathlessly promote them and denounce critics as protectionists.
So here's the question promoters of free trade need to answer: Where are the jobs? Furthermore, to the extent those jobs have materialized, how much do they pay? What benefits do they offer? What percentage of workers who have lost their jobs die to free trade deals have been rehired at comparable or better pay and benefits than before, and how quickly have they been rehired?
These are the questions that go unanswered every time we hear the latest sequel to NAFTA being promoted, yet are greeted with the same "giant sucking sound" predicted by Ross Perot.
After tens of thousands of closed factories, millions of lost manufacturing jobs and ceded leadership in countless industries from apparel to shipbuilding, we deserve answers, and certainly better than fast-track voting on a secret bill.
If high-income countries like Japan, Germany, France and South Korea are able to keep their manufacturing industries while we lose ours, then we're doing something very, very wrong, and future Americans in a country reduced to a land of subsidiaries of foreign companies will wonder how we could be so stupid.
So here's the question promoters of free trade need to answer: Where are the jobs? Furthermore, to the extent those jobs have materialized, how much do they pay? What benefits do they offer? What percentage of workers who have lost their jobs die to free trade deals have been rehired at comparable or better pay and benefits than before, and how quickly have they been rehired?
These are the questions that go unanswered every time we hear the latest sequel to NAFTA being promoted, yet are greeted with the same "giant sucking sound" predicted by Ross Perot.
After tens of thousands of closed factories, millions of lost manufacturing jobs and ceded leadership in countless industries from apparel to shipbuilding, we deserve answers, and certainly better than fast-track voting on a secret bill.
If high-income countries like Japan, Germany, France and South Korea are able to keep their manufacturing industries while we lose ours, then we're doing something very, very wrong, and future Americans in a country reduced to a land of subsidiaries of foreign companies will wonder how we could be so stupid.
200
Remember Reagan famously and quite proudly touting the introduction of America's new "service sector economy"? I still feel the pain from it.
11
High-income countries like South Korea, Japan and Germany are also high-trade countries. They have liberalized vast swathes of their economy and it's well-known and well-documented that trade with the west is what built the wealthy economies of South Korea and Japan.
These countries invest in education, research and job training in ways that the US doesn't. They're also much more homogeneous and less prone to the kinds of large scale internal conflicts that the US is so constantly mired in. These are the reasons why the US has lost its edge in high-tech jobs. Trade has nothing to do with it.
These countries invest in education, research and job training in ways that the US doesn't. They're also much more homogeneous and less prone to the kinds of large scale internal conflicts that the US is so constantly mired in. These are the reasons why the US has lost its edge in high-tech jobs. Trade has nothing to do with it.
3
When the President and senate Republicans are working together but senate Democrats vote against the legislations, something is terribly wrong. Maybe the President needs to have a sit down with those senators who voted against their own President. It looks really bad for the President and for Democrats.
15
On the contrary, it looks really good for the Democrats who finally, FINALLY found a spine.
80
Really, it's not about politics...not for the citizens. I don't care one hoot about perceptions in the political sphere. This is about real-world implications for hundreds of millions of people who are not being treated with the respect to which they are entitled...and that is to be given a voice and that can't happen until they are given full knowledge about the specifics of this proposed deal.
42
"...those senators who voted against their own President"...their president? Last time I looked he was president of the entire US, and is not due or owed anything, good, bad or indifferent, simply because of party affiliation. Frankly it's refreshing to finally see some of these Senators remember that their role is not to be the Obama pep squad!
11
So glad the Dems had the nerve and strength of their convictions to do this. I for one am desperately tired of this administration and their "trust us, we know better than you" attitude. All Obama has to do is let this be openly debated and read. Why isn't that happening? But good to see that the trust in this least transparent administration can't help them surmount all of the secrecy and deceit involved in getting "fast track" authority for an agreement the American people don't want.
60
The public has lost trust in the fast-track process; it's time has passed. President Obama lost this vote because he failed to recognize that the sands have shifted.
Polls show that a majority of Americans support the idea of trade deals – but only after they have been vetted by the American public, and approved by Congress. They no longer can merely be vehicles for corporate advantage.
It appears from press reports that voters in all eleven of the other countries party to the negotiations have similar reservations. If true, it certainly weakens Obama's argument that changes proposed in the Senate would scuttle the pact.
As an aside, it is certainly thrilling finally to see an issue fought out in Congress on its merits, rather than strictly on party lines.
Polls show that a majority of Americans support the idea of trade deals – but only after they have been vetted by the American public, and approved by Congress. They no longer can merely be vehicles for corporate advantage.
It appears from press reports that voters in all eleven of the other countries party to the negotiations have similar reservations. If true, it certainly weakens Obama's argument that changes proposed in the Senate would scuttle the pact.
As an aside, it is certainly thrilling finally to see an issue fought out in Congress on its merits, rather than strictly on party lines.
74
You've made a great point. There were several Republican Senators who were just as opposed. Americans are tired of 'secret' legislation or proposals.
Heartfelt thanks from American workers to the courageous Democrats who blocked this "NAFTA sequel"...to sell out middle class people who need jobs HERE. Why is President Obama so secretive about the details? His corporate donors care a lot more about moving jobs to Asia than building up manufacturing jobs in communities in Ohio, Michigan and elsewhere.
THANK YOU SENATE!
THANK YOU SENATE!
107
Good! I and I think most Democrats are sick of being sold out by President Obama, for whom I voted to become then remain president. He played me.
85
Good job. Stand firm. Keep contacting your Senators and Representatives to make sure this is gone for good. We know who got the benefits and who got the harm from prior trade deals and there is absolutely no reason to send American workers down that road again.
52
I second this. Everyone who is posting here needs to contact your rep and senators on this.
Finally something I can agree with Democrats on. This is the first time in a long time that I fully support the few Democrats who are willing to stand up for what's right.
41
Thank you. I'm a progressive, but there have been a lot of conservatives (the ones that aren't bought) fighting with us on this.
President Obama has never widely distributed the bill for people to see, yet at the same time wants fast track approval of a bill he's apparently embarrassed to show the public. I could be wrong, but I also remember reading that a member of Congress has to trot over to a special room in an executive branch building if they want to view the bill. Give me a break.
Someone forgot that members of Congress represent constituents who vote for them. Congress forgets it all the time; and this time around it seems like the President has joined them in having a foggy memory of who is actually at the bottom line supposed to be the boss. All the public hears are vague one liners about the bill like its "NAFTA on steroids."
Besides, what's the rush? Anything that could even remotely displace more American jobs needs to be summarized for the general public, and a copy of the entire agreement needs to be given to each member of the Senate. Then, we need to have a thoughtful, slow deliberation of something this important; especially when there are allegations of lost American jobs, watered down environmental regulations, and higher drug prices in the nation that pays the highest prescription prices in the world.
Someone forgot that members of Congress represent constituents who vote for them. Congress forgets it all the time; and this time around it seems like the President has joined them in having a foggy memory of who is actually at the bottom line supposed to be the boss. All the public hears are vague one liners about the bill like its "NAFTA on steroids."
Besides, what's the rush? Anything that could even remotely displace more American jobs needs to be summarized for the general public, and a copy of the entire agreement needs to be given to each member of the Senate. Then, we need to have a thoughtful, slow deliberation of something this important; especially when there are allegations of lost American jobs, watered down environmental regulations, and higher drug prices in the nation that pays the highest prescription prices in the world.
50
Obama unwillingness to make Wall Street executives under the Law with real investigations, indictments, and convictions when they clearly caused massive damage to the lives of most Americans with their unethical casino practices which became evident to the World in 2008 showed his cards.
36
The President is not a part of the Judicial Branch of the federal government. The President is the Executive Branch of the federal government. Separate powers and responsibilities.
3
But the Justice Department is. And it did exceedingly little about bad actors on Wall Street. It was left to state attorneys general. Obama and his allies in the Democratic Party are simply too close to Wall Street (and Wall Street money) to do the heavy lifting that was needed.
1
The President is in charge of the executive brand and it was his AG who put in place the too big to fail too big to jail policy.
2
I involuntarily audibly exhaled when I read the headline. My first through was "dodged a bullet." Thank you Dems for having a backbone on this issue at least.
69
This ends the dictatorial nature of the fast track authority, but now we move on to consideration of the trade agreement with the learned complicity of Congress, and that's how it should be, public, and in the light of day, subject to the intercourse of "The People" and the Congress to best arrive at consensus of the entire population. I call it the wisdom of the masses.
23
How can the U. S. possibly enforce labor and environmental standards in places like Malaysia and Vietnam when we can't even enforce them here?
212
The U.S. wouldn't be the enforcer. Presumably, there is a tribunal with enforcement powers mandated in the trade deal, but of course no one knows, because the language is secret.
All Elizabeth Warren wants, like tens of millions of other Americans, is for the entire text to be made public. THEN and ONLY then can we have an intelligent discussion about this. But when, as reported, corporate lobbyists have had the biggest influence in writing the deal, it's no wonder our corporate masters and their government puppets of both parties want to keep it secret.
All Elizabeth Warren wants, like tens of millions of other Americans, is for the entire text to be made public. THEN and ONLY then can we have an intelligent discussion about this. But when, as reported, corporate lobbyists have had the biggest influence in writing the deal, it's no wonder our corporate masters and their government puppets of both parties want to keep it secret.
12
The Senate is being short sighted. The trade agreement will connect us economically to a large part of Asia. This is important if we are to counter China's rise as the regional power and its rise as a super power. It is a part of the Asia pivot.
47
It's pretty obvious they are going to let China in on the deal later on. The big corporations are aware it's a bridge too far right now.
15
How much do we counter China - as a country that already has a lot of money in the US?
8
We are already "economically connected" to Asia, and we have ample history of China's not playing by the rules, e.g., dumping goods at dirt cheap prices in the U.S. to destroy sectors of our economy and the use of currency manipulation to undercut U.S. goods. There's nothing in this agreement that benefits U.S. workers. Thankfully, Senate Democrats finally grew a spine and rejected another NAFTA.
41
The bottom line is that I, like most people I would imagine, actually do realize that we're living in a different world now that is interconnected and shares in a global economy. I understand that the dynamics behind trade policies and agreements are different than they were 40 years ago. I understand the compromise is a necessary mechanism for engaging in such policies and agreements with the greater world. Just the same and particularly because this will have a direct impact on me and every other citizen of this nation, I have a right and I demand to be given the opportunity to at least read the TPP and to weigh in where and when I can and before it becomes the law of the land.
60
I hope this trade deal never passes. I believe it will be a disaster for the American middle class just as previous trade deals have been. As a huge fan and supporter of President Obama, I believe he is wrong on this and Elizabeth Warren is right. I am disappointed at how vehemently he went after her on this. If nothing else, the secretive nature of the deal and the complete lack of transparency is deeply disturbing. Like many other NYT readers, I was very surprised and disappointed by the NYT editorial promoting it.
356
I'm afraid he is not simply 'wrong'. He's in thrall to special interests. Why, we must wait until after his presidency to find out. I'm betting there are some lucrative deals awaiting him.
And the Tea Party element of the Democratic party rears its ugly head. TPP is a smart deal that will expand the economy and create jobs. The left wing of the Democratic party and big labor can no more turn back to the clock to the industrial economy of the 1950s than the right wing of the GOP can turn back the clock to the social and demographic environment of the 1950s. They're both equally delusional.
As Democrats we need to pull our heads out of the dammed sand and start talking about shaping the FUTURE of the American economy instead of desperately trying to preserve the last shreds of its PAST.
As Democrats we need to pull our heads out of the dammed sand and start talking about shaping the FUTURE of the American economy instead of desperately trying to preserve the last shreds of its PAST.
15
So then you've had the benefit that I have not and you have a full copy of the TPP and have read it in it's entirety?
76
Obviously you never had IBM send your job to India after you were forced to train your replacement. If Obama fought this hard for health care we would have a single payer today.
115
I've benefited from cheaper consumer products and expanded economic opportunity derived from free trade, just like every other American. And no, I have not read the TPP anymore than I read all 2,000 pages of the Affordable Care Act or Dodd-Frank. I also highly doubt that many members of Congress actually bothered to read either of those bills before voting on them either.
7
I never thought I'd hear myself say this but I am thrilled to see Democrats step up to the plate and give Obama the resounding rejection he deserved to legislation that was cloaked in secrecy. No president, no matter the party, should be given such unilateral power. America dodged a bullet. Phew.
280
Well it wasn't a power grab or he'd not have put it before Congress. But the lack of transparency to the citizens is a problem and the President, a Democrat, and the GOP members of the Senate don't seem to think that's a problem.
9
The bottom line - largely undiscussed in the media - is that TPP is not about free trade at all. Tariffs are largely a thing of the past. TPP is about creating a "level" legal and regulatory framework amongst signatories at the lowest common denominator. It is an assault on democracy, the environment, wages and, as much as I hate to use this much abused word, freedom. No thank you Mr. President.
720
Take the entire world's population of working citizens and put them essentially on the same level. This would allows corporations to set up shop literally anywhere in the world and reap the same benefits. No more having to shop around for the cheapest labor to exploit or the nation that has no environmental protections in place. All gains for corporations and the entire loss is borne by the people. Nice gig if you can get it.
18
I beg to differ, Mr. Reichard. Tariffs (import duties) exist. Certain origin requirements must be met before goods produced in countries that have free trade agreements with the U.S. may enter this country duty-free (e.g., rules of origin). Goods from trade-agreements that don't meet these requirements are dutiable. Thus, "free" trade is conditional.
3
Stephen....If TPP is an assault on democracy, environment, wages, and freedom itself, yet Obama is pushing it harder than any other cause, it must mean he is one of the most hypocritical presidents in history.
Think of all his speeches about jobs, the middle/working classes, wages, health care, justice, the environment, infrastructure. He plays the part of the defender of the American Dream, the foe of the entrenched Gop Right Wing, while TPP may usher in our American nightmare.
I truly can't figure him. Obama I'm sad to say, may be a politician who is just an actor. After his term, he could go to Hollywood and do a reverse Reagan career move--president to screen star.
We can't always defend Obama, just because of the extreme and irrational Gop attacks on him. Let's just hope the next Dem president is an improvement over Obama and Bill Clinton, re TPP and Nafta.
A few Senate Democrats are our last defense.
Think of all his speeches about jobs, the middle/working classes, wages, health care, justice, the environment, infrastructure. He plays the part of the defender of the American Dream, the foe of the entrenched Gop Right Wing, while TPP may usher in our American nightmare.
I truly can't figure him. Obama I'm sad to say, may be a politician who is just an actor. After his term, he could go to Hollywood and do a reverse Reagan career move--president to screen star.
We can't always defend Obama, just because of the extreme and irrational Gop attacks on him. Let's just hope the next Dem president is an improvement over Obama and Bill Clinton, re TPP and Nafta.
A few Senate Democrats are our last defense.
3
Thank you Elizabeth Warren - please throw your hat in the ring!
244
She's more valuable to this country right where she is.
6
Thank you Senator Warren, but please now throw your support behind Senator Sanders in his run for the Presidency.
2
Good but unfortunately there are enough corporate votes to pass fast track if eight of the Dem senators who are fake-demanding phony amendments ultimately back the deal. (Democratic voters should take a good look at who those Senators are because they are not representing you.) There is yet another good take-down of this lemon in Salon today: http://www.salon.com/2015/05/12/the_10_biggest_lies_youve_been_told_abou...
22
Free trade with Asia seems to be a one way street where Asian products are imported into the US with little duty while few American products are exported, except agricultural items. Meanwhile, China has denied access to any American internet companies (Facebook, twitter..), Japan blocks certain agricultural products, and Korea manipulates its markets to promote domestic companies. We should stop being a doormat for these countries and stop exporting jobs and money.
60
Hooray!! Really hopeful that this will kill the TPP or at least remove some of its worst components, especially the giveaways to drug companies that will deny access to drugs - including lifesaving HIV medications - to millions of people around the world.
41
The US trade deficit was “$785 billion” in 2011; the number one importer was Germany ($220 billion). Anyone that tells you that these trade agreements are good for American workers is not telling the truth. Does anyone believe that competing with workers in Vietnam who make 56 cents an hours makes sense?
If the TPP was a good deal supporters would not be pushing for fast track. And it would not be negotiated in secret, while allowing more than 500 big business executives and lobbyists to write corporate-friendly policy.
The TPP will undermine US sovereignty. Foreign tribunals will give multinationals the right to sue a government if domestic laws reduce their future profits. Lawyers will rotate acting as judges and representing corporations.
It will benefit corporate America at the expense of workers, consumers, and the environment. Leaked chapters reveal it will (1) weaken health, food safety, labor, environmental, and financial regulations, (2) undermine internet freedom, and (3) increase the outsourcing of jobs and ban Buy American policies.
For more on the TPP go to Public Citizen's website:
http://www.citizen.org/TPP
Hillary Clinton called the TPP the “gold standard in trade agreements.” Bernie Sanders vehemently opposes this agreement. Bernie in 2016!
If the TPP was a good deal supporters would not be pushing for fast track. And it would not be negotiated in secret, while allowing more than 500 big business executives and lobbyists to write corporate-friendly policy.
The TPP will undermine US sovereignty. Foreign tribunals will give multinationals the right to sue a government if domestic laws reduce their future profits. Lawyers will rotate acting as judges and representing corporations.
It will benefit corporate America at the expense of workers, consumers, and the environment. Leaked chapters reveal it will (1) weaken health, food safety, labor, environmental, and financial regulations, (2) undermine internet freedom, and (3) increase the outsourcing of jobs and ban Buy American policies.
For more on the TPP go to Public Citizen's website:
http://www.citizen.org/TPP
Hillary Clinton called the TPP the “gold standard in trade agreements.” Bernie Sanders vehemently opposes this agreement. Bernie in 2016!
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Yippee! People 1: Corporations 0. At least on this one. At least for now.
68
Detroit exists as it does because unskilled jobs were moved, first to the anti-union south and then overseas. The move overseas was done by policy; policy driven by businesses desire to drive down labor costs.
We can all bemoan the lack of merit in those who loose their jobs overseas and can't compete in labor markets left on shore, but they are are still Americans. Policy created their circumstance and policy can create tens of millions more of them.
It should not be all about counting up campaign donations.
We can all bemoan the lack of merit in those who loose their jobs overseas and can't compete in labor markets left on shore, but they are are still Americans. Policy created their circumstance and policy can create tens of millions more of them.
It should not be all about counting up campaign donations.
47
The furniture building industry in North Carolina experienced a similar fate to that of Detroit. The outsourcing and offshoring takes all victims and doesn't discriminate.
4
PUL-EEZ -- Detroit was the auto industry. Much of it is still there. When it was off-shored, it went to Mexico and CANADA (check it out!). Do you think Detroit had a furniture industry? or the textiles industry? That stuff was in the NORTHEAST (the textile mills of Massachusetts) before it went South.
There is some auto industry in the South, but nothing like Detroit in its prime.
This really is not a Blue vs. Red issue. EVERY state has lost jobs to third world manufacturing, which can pay a few cents an hour.
There is some auto industry in the South, but nothing like Detroit in its prime.
This really is not a Blue vs. Red issue. EVERY state has lost jobs to third world manufacturing, which can pay a few cents an hour.
Export more jobs and give giant corporations more power: bad news; good vote!
54
I am glad there were a few senators with a spine strong enough to stand up against the oligarchs who want complete control over the life of average Americans.
Thanks to Warren, Bernie Sanders, and a few others.
Thanks to Warren, Bernie Sanders, and a few others.
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Warren's general popularity across the political spectrum is what gave the Dems the spine to oppose this. Without her voice, it would probably be a done deal.
3
Thank you Senate Democrats for doing the people's work responsibly by blocking this bill.
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Thank you, Senator Warren and all others who voted NO in the Senate today.
109
A candle in the darkness.
37
So now can we read it?
If we could read it, we could tell our representatives what we want them to do.
I really want to read it.
How about a summary?
Maybe a Powerpoint presentation.
Major highlights?
If we could read it, we could tell our representatives what we want them to do.
I really want to read it.
How about a summary?
Maybe a Powerpoint presentation.
Major highlights?
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I agree...I want to read it, word for word. Even a summary can be misleading, though.
4
We should read it ALL. Every single word.
4
I'm sorry President Obama but the American public has seen this movie before and a simple "trust me" is what helped hollow out the middle class in this country. Let us see the details, we all know the Republicans will knee jerk reject it unless it benefits their friends, but the rest of us would like to make up our own minds.
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Aaah, Aussiebat, it was the DEMOCRATS who knee-jerk rejected it. Ha!
14
Right - because the Republicans love the giveaways TTP has for corporations. Obama is just wrong on this one.
12
I have no more faith in democrats' decision-making than in republicans'.
It is they who passed the Affordable Care Act without having a clue what was in it. It is they who might be equally clueless about this and now voting purely on purely political calculations (ex., their own interests versus what is in the US' long-term interests).
The fact that people are cheering tells me this is a political maneuver to appease their base.
It is they who passed the Affordable Care Act without having a clue what was in it. It is they who might be equally clueless about this and now voting purely on purely political calculations (ex., their own interests versus what is in the US' long-term interests).
The fact that people are cheering tells me this is a political maneuver to appease their base.
7
The GOP is latgely on board and supporting the President on the TPP deal. If that doesn't get one's Spidey Senses tingling , I don't know what will.
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And this is exactly why after more than 30 years of voting Democratic in every election imaginable I will not be supporting the Democrats any longer ... First the votes on IRAN after the GOP sends "the" letter .. And now this.... I'm curious if they have even read the bill - bottom line "i'm out"
11
Who will you support? The GOP? That would be a leap from Purgatory right into the hottest pit in Hades.
16
Green party. That's where I am going.
8
Okay. Fair enough. But it's a spoiler vote that could put 1 or even 2 more hard conservatives on the Supreme Court of the United States.
7
Let the American people read the TPP for themselves. Why the secrecy and why the push to fast track it?
This is one of the times when I must respectfully disagree with my President. Until and unless I'm treating like an intelligent, educated adult that can read and comprehend the details of such an agreement, then I can't throw my support behind it or anyone that thinks so little of me.
This is one of the times when I must respectfully disagree with my President. Until and unless I'm treating like an intelligent, educated adult that can read and comprehend the details of such an agreement, then I can't throw my support behind it or anyone that thinks so little of me.
84
President Obama, when all of the Republican Senators are agreeing with you, you should be afraid, very afraid.
253
What do you mean afraid? He's gonna make a lot of money after his term is over. Don't you get it? He's on the same payroll. I think he secretly always wanted to be a Republican, country club and all, but knew he could rise only as a Democrat, with all those awful leftists (losers!).
6
Or secretly very, very happy. #TrueColors
4
A temporary victory for the people against the plutocrats.
300
Let's make it permanent.
25
I want to thank all the Democrats who voted NO. I don't like corporations having authority over nations' laws; I want the public in all nations to be able to read the entire bill before it is voted on.
623
This fast track authority would not have prevented the treaty to be read and debated before being voted on. It allowed 4 months of debate on the treaty once the treaty was finalized.
It wasn't just Democrats who voted against it. Thank whoever you want, but TPP is too secret much like ACA was.
1
VERY PLEASED, thank you Senate!
207
Thank you Democrats in the Senate.
2
Sometimes an legislative impasse is the best policy. There are reasons to believe that President Obama like Bill Clinton before him has embraced too much of the Republican "business interests über alles" agenda. So good riddance to bad rubbish, as the saying goes.
191
Because so many of these trade bills in the past have cost US jobs, today TPA was defeated. I am glad, Without major amendments there is no chance for TPA.
Also the fact that TPP was made so secret that no one could talk about, the American people were not allowed to see it, also make TPA hard to pass.
Obama's desire to extreme secrecy on TPP doomed TPA.
Also the fact that TPP was made so secret that no one could talk about, the American people were not allowed to see it, also make TPA hard to pass.
Obama's desire to extreme secrecy on TPP doomed TPA.
87
Obama campaigned on "open government...." and gave us the most prosecutions of leakers than all previous administrations combined.
His secrecy has finally caught up with him!
His secrecy has finally caught up with him!
13
So American democracy stirs from its zombie like state. Here in France there are very few foods made in China. Things cost more, but not much more, and they're built by workers who are respected and live with dignity.
450
Yeah, I am sure your French iPad and French iPhone were built in France, by French union workers.
Or don't you use any modern electronics? or know where they come from?
Or don't you use any modern electronics? or know where they come from?
1
France and much of Europe can afford to pay extra. The US has been providing Europe's defense for a century - WWI, WWII, the Marshall Plan and the cold war.
1
Vive la France! -- at least on this issue.
3
Good job democrats for sticking together for the common good keep up the fight. Obama if you want democratic support bring a bill to repeal NAFTA and you will have full support from the Americans.
112
I'm glad the democrats finally stood up for something. It's a shame President Obama considers this his signature achievement. The final nail in the coffin of working Americans would be a signature achievement, all right. Call us what you want, Mr. President. We're just working people who used to be middle class who've been pushed around and marginalized for more than 30 years. Every job lost represents a life thrown into turmoil, and possibly destroyed for good. We are in the Summer of our Discontent.
219
Obama's "signature achievement" was to be the ACA. I am afraid it will be drilling in the Arctic. He can be the president that put the final nail in the coffin of reduced carbon emissions, the person who assured that climate change would not only not be stopped but actually accelerated. Way to go, dude.
5
Since the Democrats lost the Senate majority in November, stalemates like this seemed inevitable. Democratic party ties are less meaningful as legislators become ever-more powerful.
1
Why the rush to fast track this? Why can't we, the voters, see what's in this agreement? Why are the details secret? A full transparent discussion of the whole thing should be conducted before signing on to such legislation. Who will make money and who will lose money? Americans deserve to know what exactly is in this trade deal. It is not as though we don't have good reason to be suspicious about this.
645
I agree with the ridiculous and unnecessary secrecy, but we all know who's going to make the money and lose the money. That's the reason for the secrecy.
27
There are things that masses have not the expertise to simply understand. Democracy is good, but it's imperfect. If people want to have a word on everything, have their voice heard like they were on twitter or facebook, then they should run for office. That's how government works. People are called to elect a few people to an office. If you don't trust the people you vote for, you should do something for that. If you don't vote, then you should not even bother arguing.
Why all the secrecy, is this bill another obamacare where we have to pass it to know what is in it?
3
So where are the benefits for American workers ? Who has forgotten Nafta and Cafta ? Thousands of American households wrecked from those policies. I'm not supporting the prez on this one.
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It's a lot easier to see and hear from the thousands of wrecked American households than it is to see and hear from the billions of dollars in extra production created, but spread thinly across the globe.
You'll hear, loud and clear, about the one widget factory that closed up in Small Town, USA because some company outsourced production to a country with cheaper labor. You probably won't hear about how that company saved five cents in production costs on each of the hundreds of millions of widgets it produces because of that move. You definitely won't connect that savings to a few pennies unknowingly saved when buying that widget, or a few new job openings in different areas of that company, or a new capital investment creating growth for the company, or a slightly higher dividend, etc. Multiply those widespread, fractional gains times however many companies pursue cost-cutting measures due to free trade agreements, and you get the reason why most economists preach free trade.
Don't misunderstand me, though. I'm not saying there aren't very obvious negative consequences of free trade agreements. I'm saying it's almost impossible to quantify the gains created by such agreements, so the net effect of those agreements is very difficult to judge.
My general take is that unless you're one of the workers whose factory got closed up, or one of those workers was supporting you and your family, you're probably better off. You just don't know it.
You'll hear, loud and clear, about the one widget factory that closed up in Small Town, USA because some company outsourced production to a country with cheaper labor. You probably won't hear about how that company saved five cents in production costs on each of the hundreds of millions of widgets it produces because of that move. You definitely won't connect that savings to a few pennies unknowingly saved when buying that widget, or a few new job openings in different areas of that company, or a new capital investment creating growth for the company, or a slightly higher dividend, etc. Multiply those widespread, fractional gains times however many companies pursue cost-cutting measures due to free trade agreements, and you get the reason why most economists preach free trade.
Don't misunderstand me, though. I'm not saying there aren't very obvious negative consequences of free trade agreements. I'm saying it's almost impossible to quantify the gains created by such agreements, so the net effect of those agreements is very difficult to judge.
My general take is that unless you're one of the workers whose factory got closed up, or one of those workers was supporting you and your family, you're probably better off. You just don't know it.
1
Why is this so hard to understand for the President? Publish the trade agreement and allow scrutiny and discussion; once we are sure this is a good deal we will support it. But if President Obama believes that we--or anybody--should take him by his word: sorry, with politics as usual in Washington, this is not going to happen. He is a lawyer; would he really advise one of his clients to sign a document without reading it???????
501
From Hope and Change to Hide and Deceive. Sad.
4
It's not hard for the President to understand at all. That's what he was trying to do. Negotiate a deal and then, once that deal was negotiated with ELEVEN other countries, put it up for review for four months followed by ratification by the Senate.
Instead, fast track is not approved, meaning that legislators as dumb as Ted Cruz can attach poison riders to the agreement scuttling what took years for the U.S. and ELEVEN other countries to negotiate. Basically this kills the deal before anyone can even read it.
Instead, fast track is not approved, meaning that legislators as dumb as Ted Cruz can attach poison riders to the agreement scuttling what took years for the U.S. and ELEVEN other countries to negotiate. Basically this kills the deal before anyone can even read it.
HHmm so your saying we should pass it so we can understand it? Wow didn't we learn our lesson from that one?
8
Elizabeth Warren's dispute with President Obama on the trade deal seemed like the death knell. Senator Warren has tapped into a sentiment and reserve of momentum not seen since Obama himself was a 2008 candidate.
566
The difference between Obama's "momentum" and Warren's is that his was built on disgust with the Bush administration. All anyone had to do was tap in to that and the nation was enraptured. Warren has tapped in to our disgust with the continuation of the status quo by Obama. He never was anything other than right of center. He talks some social issues and has made some minor improvements while deporting thousands of undocumented immigrants, but when the chips are down, he is Wall Street's man. He has a cabinet full of CitiBank and Goldman Sachs former (and future) employees.
Warren, she's the real deal. She has been walking the walk for a very long time as an expert on bankruptcy. Obama probably rues the day he appointed her to the Congressional Oversight Panel created to oversee the Troubled Asset Relief Program (TARP). That gave her the national recognition needed for her senate campaign. She is not the "politician" as he put; he is.
Warren, she's the real deal. She has been walking the walk for a very long time as an expert on bankruptcy. Obama probably rues the day he appointed her to the Congressional Oversight Panel created to oversee the Troubled Asset Relief Program (TARP). That gave her the national recognition needed for her senate campaign. She is not the "politician" as he put; he is.
12
And Warren has the bona fides, a life spent trying to help middle-class and working people (see her early books, for example, long before a political career was on her horizon). She is not likely to change to suit the powerful, or to make secret deals while making pretty speeches. She's a straight-shooter, and she's on our side.
5
Obama's castigation of Senator Warren was a bad move and its backfiring on him. He continues to maintain a shroud of secrecy over the TPP negotiations. What happened to candidate Obama and his pledge of transparency in government? As many have said, if its so good for us (that is, U.S) then let's see what's it in. Warren and Bernie are the fresh voices of conscience in a bleak American political landscape. She won't run for president in 2016, but in four more years. Or how about Sanders/Warren in '16??
4
I'm sorry the President had to be disappointed, but this is a great day for America and the vast majority of her citizens. President Obama should go back and look at how our entire approach and trade policy should be revised to benefit all Americans, not just a small group of already obscenely rich individuals.
378
Vietnam min wage is 31 cents / hr
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_minimum_wages_by_country
Now you know why the bill is being negotiated in secret?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_minimum_wages_by_country
Now you know why the bill is being negotiated in secret?
3