Benjamin Franklin, when asked what had been created, responded "A republic, if you can keep it". He also estimated that it might last 200 years. OK, so much for that; what do we do now? Trump is just a symptom of a much larger problem.
8
The line that screams for attention is that Trump is the first president never to have served a day in public service or the military. Trump is incapable of service of any kind unless it is directly beneficial to him. I am certain he considers career government officials to be losers and he has zero notion of what it means to serve in government for fifty years like William Taylor, a career diplomat who bravely came forward to accuse Trump of abusing his power to advance his personal political interests.
McKinley served his country for 40 years as a public servant before resigning after Yovanovitch was fired.
The whole point of this article is that these public servants, despised and degraded by Trump, are not the Deep State. The article personifies Trump as a paranoid maniac who wants to “weed out” career officials in the National Security Council because he believes they are spies out to destroy him. The article uses the word “purge” which sounds more akin to what Putin or Xi would do. That is what should frighten and concern us, not that the Times dared to use the words Deep State.
Trump’s obsession with the deep state should be written about over and over as the ravings of a lunatic. The exodus of government public servants is frightening and devastating to our national interest.
We owe the diplomatic corps gratitude for their integrity, honor and bravery in coming forward to give their depositions, qualities absent in a man in service only to himself.
17
If they agree with the premise of this article, how can Liberals object when, in the future, the CIA and the Pentagon decide they do not like the foreign policy of a President Biden or Warren--and refuse to carry out their Administration's orders? If you have already agreed to giving a veto power over foreign policy to a secret spy agency and the Generals? . . . We should defeat Trumpian fascism openly, by voting him out, not relying on secret plotting by elitist cabals.
Deep State describes the Despair so many of us have felt since 2016 when the Minority of American Voters began governing the Majority of American Voters !! It's been a Deep State of Despair since his Election !! What a disaster...Worst President in American History !!
13
Trump’s “deep state” is actually the stable state, aka our government, the one with knowledge, skill, education, professionalism, and competence. Trump is a hustler with none of those attributes and consequently cannot recognize them in others. Because he understands nothing of what is going on around him in anything other than the most primitive terms, he becomes paranoid.
9
Thugs. Bought and paid for thugs.
8
'“If it all works out, I will consider it one of the greatest things I’ve done,” Mr. Trump said. “I think with the destruction of the deep state, certainly I’ve done big damage,” he added. “They’ve come after me in so many different ways; it’s been such a disgrace. But I think it’ll be one of my great achievements.”'
And by "deep state," he means "the American government."
20
This has been Trump's fundamental fight from the beginning. The entrenched unelected career bureaucratic elite who essentially run the government--the Deep State--prevent any President from making serious changes. The DS is invested in a kind of status quo--and in its own power and in its own view of the way things should be. Trump pushes on this regularly, tries to flush it out, often has to backtrack, but this is his commitment: to restore to elected officials, esp. the President, the right to execute the powers of their office. The Dems are playing with the DS pretty effectively here. This is why DT will sometimes cry treason. Although that is Trumpean hyperbole, there a serious side to it. The DS is committing treason against our Democracy, but it is doing so, it believes, for the sake of the State.
4
They say—people are saying—that there’s one born every minute.
In my experience, it’s rather more often than that.
17
@Nathan
You can't argue with them, they will not even believe it when the Horowitz and Durham reports come out soon/
1
It’s becoming apparent that the exaggerated traits that often raise a person to the highest levels of wealth, celebrity, and power, are those which may ultimately cause that person to lose their sanity.
It’s going to become horrible as Trump’s selfishness progresses into paranoia and then rage. He will be manipulated by misanthropic counselors along the way. The security of the nation will be imperiled as constitutional failsafe’s are thwarted and mocked.
These are interesting times.
11
With malevolent characters such as Bill Barr and Mitch McConnel, natural tyrants like Trump and a woefully ignorant population which is ready to follow the primeval call to follow a leader, a song, a cross or a flag, we are unfortunately losing sight of our revolutionary past and our enlightened forefathers, slowly drifting towards an autocracy.
The fact that an American statesmen stand up and argue that the President cannot be questioned or charged, that he is effectively above the law, even if only for his time in office - should give us all pause. A century ago I think that such people would have taken to task, beaten for their Anti-American ideas, and many would have wanted to throw them in jail for proposing a form of insurrection against the House and Senate.
The phrase offered up by such authoritarian mindsets is "respect your president", which is meaningless. We can only respect presidents who respect their office.
Whatever the legal definition of "treason" is, I think we can safely argue from a cultural and philosophical - if not Constitutional - point of view, that Donald Trump and his mignons, especially Bill Barr, are guilty of Treason in spirit.
They should be figuratively tarred and feathered and symbolically ridden out of town on a rail.
58
@Tom . "Figuratively tarred and feathered"? I'd like to see it in a literal way.
"Symbolically ridden out of town"? I think Russia would be the place for them, specifically Siberia.
11
The alternative is a shallow state, which Trump and his supporters sure seem to think is the way to go. Shallow, cruel and pridefully uneducated.
44
Sorry I guess I don't follow politics closely enough . . . But when did we elect the Central Intelligence Agency to run the country?
6
@Red Allover
"We" did not elect the current occupant of the White House. A minority of "You" did.
Most Americans loathe Trump and everything he stands for. Have you ever considered why Trump is loathed? Have you ever cared about the opinions and needs of most of our citizenry?
15
Thank you civil servants. Much appreciated.
10
The “Deep State” is a fiction believed by conspiracy theorists and other profoundly stupid people.
It has no place in a NY Times article.
10
"Public Servant" makes it sound like they aren't paid and aren't scared of losing their paychecks... More like "Public Beneficiary" LOL
1
@Don Q
Spoken like a true Luddite, Don. It's clear you've never had the "pleasure" of working for the Government; a place where every single person thinks they magically "know" your job better than you....
2
"Once you realize that 'the deep state' is code for 'the rule of law,' you can translate their gibberish into something more like English." —David Frum, May 2017
17
The guy whose fanny sometimes warms a seat behind a desk in the Oval Office so anxiously fights the "deep state"... amusing, since he's probably never had a deep thought his entire life.
12
Trump IS the deep state.
8
Is whoever wrote this headline actively trying to give trumpers conspiracy talking points? I can hear it now. "Even the New York TIMES says the Deep State is trying to take him down. He must be doing something..."
Don't do their work for them.
Don't use their phrases.
Stop echoing their fraught speaking points.
Instead of using the words "Deep State" you could say "Career Government Professionals" or a different phrase that accurately describes public servants who perform the necessary duties of governance.
Irony does not work. Not anymore. By using trumpian or right-wing conspiracy language, even in satire, you keep their poisonous rhetoric in the zeitgeist, leading people to think, even on a subliminal level, that there is some "there" there.
There isn't. There is xenophobia, corruption, greed, racism and subterfuge. The right keeps power by making people feel afraid.
You are the New York Times. I shouldn't have to tell you that words matter. Don't add fuel to their fire. We are all getting burned.
17
Thank you! There have been many headlines lately that are hyperbole, not the thoughtful, intelligent content I expect when I pay for this content!
4
"Obama people" is a Trump code-word. It means "American, not Russian."
11
Oh NY Times, why do you reinforce the nutty idea of a "deep state"? **There is no deep state.** It's a conspiracy theory started by Trump and conservative nuts to claim that a secret cabal of liberals and elitists are running the country.
Understood that you feel you have to reference it in an article like this -- but in that case, you've got to make it extra clear that the "deep state" doesn't exist and is a phony conspiracy theory. Putting the term in quotes is not enough. On the contrary: millions of people just read this headline and this article and said to themselves, "See, the New York Times says the deep state exists!"
C'mon -- this shoudn't be *that* hard.
12
“the deep state has emerged from the shadows in the form of real live government officials, past and present...”
Why are you calling them the deep state, and not simply government officials?
Language plays a huge role in conditioning our thoughts. The nytimes should know this. Why are you using the language of propaganda and doublethink to describe patriotic Americans?
What’s going on at this newspaper? A wordsmith like Pete baker knows better.
13
The New York times does everyone a disservice by legitimizing the concept of a malevolent 'Deep State' by using this misleading and pejorative term in this article headline.
14
Putin, is the deep state. 45 works for Putin, hence, 45 is the deep state.
45 accuses people of what he is accused of.
“No Puppet, no puppet, you puppet. “
9
“You know what? They’re trying to destroy *potus Trump because they don’t like his policies.”
You know what, Mick? They don’t like Trump destroying the foundation of our law-based government and constantly ceding ground to thugs. There. Now it’s correct.
11
Just remember who nominated, supported, elected (with the traitorous help of their Russian friends) and enables this psychopathic miscreant in his quest to dismantle our government: REPUBLICANS.
Throw them out, each and every one of them on November 3, 2020.
And then: commissions, investigations, indictments, trials and JAIL for Republican criminals. All of them.
12
"In some ways" and many ways, the deep state Obama worshippers and Trump haters Brennan, Clapper, McCabe, Susan Rice, Shzrok and Comey's war on, set-up, and sabotage of Trump's candidacy and presidency is the real story that continues in the dark secret chambers of Schiff's witch hunt masquerading as an impeachment "inquiry". The NYT's slanting of this story assumes knowledge and "facts" that are allegedly secret except for Schiff's strategic leaks that the Times trumpets in its headlines! NYT's hornswogglering!
1
The term “deep state” shouldn’t be normalized. In paragraph 2, it appears without quotation marks - indicating a real or common term, rather than a marginalized conspiracy theory held by a minority of (powerful) political leaders.
Would the NYTimes use the term “fake news” without quotations to describe a hard hitting journalism piece?
10
Please, do not use this type of delusional, right wing, white nationalist terminology in your headlines! You're only feeding the fevered imaginations of the paranoid far right by using the term "deep state." Public servants who are doing their jobs do not comprise a "deep state," and telling the truth when you are asked is not equivalent to going to war agaInst your government. Please try and do better than this, NYT. You might try this as a litmus test: If the language you're considering using has ever come out of Steve Bannon's mouth or been seen more than once in a Trump tweet, then it is deranged propaganda bearing no relationship to reality and should not be propagated by a respectable news entity.
9
As I read the comments, I find I’m in agreement with this—commenters asking the NYT to stop using the same terms and language as djt and others to define those who are are attempting to give another perspective to this current situation. And to provide valuable insight into the workings of complicated agencies and what they observe as improper, perhaps even illegal.
It’s difficult to stand up and speak when half the country is disparaging you, a country being led by someone who is increasingly led by instincts and feelings.
Please. Stop. It.
It serves the other side to have their terms repeated over and over and over. Pretty soon everyone will believe there is a DS and just give up on any hope for truth. It’s will be us against them or them against us. An eye for an eye and everyone blind.
Pay attention, get some proofreaders in there who are hell bent on correcting your headlines so they read accurately without dichotomies and disparaging terms.
Be accurate, be concise, be clear. But be careful. We need more neutrality, not less.
10
The Deep State is Rudy Giuliani, the political dirt machine, so intent on trashing Trump's political opponents that he hijacked America's foreign policy to make it happen. It's Mick Mulvaney, the contradictory cover-up chief. It's Steven Miller and his hatred of non-whites who immigrate to America. Rick Perry, the guy more concerned with his hair than knowing the name of his own department. It was Scott Pruitt, the oil man turned EPA saboteur who milked his job for every dollar it was worth. It's Steven Mnuchin and his wife Marie Antoinette who's made it his government mission to help his fellow rich bankers earn big money. And it's the Republican Party that enables them and holds onto power despite it's minority status.
None of these liars, cheats, racists, and grifters were elected. And they were installed by a man a who lost in his own election by almost three million votes. That's a Deep State for ya.
12
To a criminal, the police are the deep state. Basically, any government institution that limits Trump's criminal efforts constitute the deep state. I am so tired of hearing about this. How stupid are we Americans?
6
Can’t we just keep repeating his comments in Pittsburgh Wednesday about building a border wall in Colorado until the whole country realizes we have an idiot for a president? Forget everything else, Trump is TOO STUPID to be president. Colorado is 500 miles from the Mexico border!
6
@JB Make no mistake Trump may be awful but he is not stupid, he's more cunning than stupid. He has been telegraphing who he thinks he is or wants to become. Why would he court and appease authoritarian leaders like PUTIN, KIM JONG UN, ORDAN, ERDOGAN, AL ASSAD...believe that he can do whatever he wants... ignore the laws...mock the Constitution...have his followers act like storm troopers...he wants to be one of these guys. and if Congress doesn't impeach him, I'm not sure that he won't become one of these guys.
6
Given the sudden deluge of pent-up disgust with the Administration over its abject depravity by current and former officials I would call this the #WeToo movement.
3
In this country we have laws that EVERYONE has to obey. Even the President (hear that Republicans). This is not a partisan issue. Our President coerced an ally country to investigate his political rival for his own political gain. Not in the interest of the United States, but for his own personal gain. He has used back channel unsanctioned diplomacy working with Russian mob connected individuals. That is against the law. And I don't care if you are a Republican or a Democrat. The law has to apply to everyone. If the Republicans fail to vote for impeachment then they have violated their oath to protect and defend the Constitution. You should be more concerned about doing what you KNOW is right for this country, instead of trying to keep your job.
6
Three years ago and about the same time Trump got elected POTUS I got diagnosed with cancer and since then I’ve been hardly alone in trying to live with it and fight it. The chemo, weakness and nausea have been nothing compared to what these last three years of obsessive daily investigation news coverage has been to have to endure. Lately when I feel sick I’m never quite sure exactly what it’s from. Taking a pain pill and turning off MSNBC both help.
3
Is it too late for my Send-Trump-A-Witch-Hat Halloween campaign?
2
It would have been nice by the New York Times to continuously use quotation marks when referring to the so-called "Deep State".
There is no such thing.
8
Here goes Republican hypocrisy again. They talk about transparency but never follow through with providing it! Their deep state rhetoric is as FAKE as Trump's leadership abilities! Americans deserve the truth, not Trump's mental midget brigade's theatrics...
7
I've worked in the private sector and the public sector.
The public sector has a lot of laws and regulations that define how processes will work in part to prevent people from doing unethical things.
Trump denies those laws and regulations exist, expects everyone to ignore them if they prevent his latest ideas from being achieved and then wants everyone to lie that any laws or regulations were broken after the fact.
The questions for America are do we want people in government to follow the laws and regulations, and do we want people in government to speak up when other people in government are not following the laws and regulations.
4
What we see consistently from this administration is the demonstration that from Trump on down (with a few exceptions) they are driven by the attitude that governing America is just like a football game, where the only thing that matters is to defeat the other team -- aka the Democrats. For while some Democrats are venal or incompetent, only the Republican Party has adopted this as its mantra: placing party loyalty above adherence to law and the Constitution.
2
I just hope that things don't become violent before the end of this Administration (hopefully before 2021).
4
pleeeze folks, Trump has simply torn off all pretenses of conservative views. Reagan and W placed people with NO experience in government for the purpose of doing so poorly the public would want to dismantle them. Remember.."great job Brownie"? Trump is the symptom. Conservatives's contempt for government and governing is the real problem.
6
What happens when the Agency and the Pentagon decide they do not like the foreign policy of President Warren and refuse to carry out her Administration's orders? . . Liberals will have no right to complain then . . . .
3
I'm concerned that a news source as august as the Times feels the need to create such a clickbait headline. The "Deep State" shtick is a Trump invention. These are just people doing their jobs, like meat inspectors making sure that we aren't killed by our chicken dinner. Responsible reporting is critical at this juncture. You are not David Pecker.
8
With all the facts coming out every day by witnesses, if Donald Trump survives this it only show the weakness of the Republican Party. Or to phrase it in a different way, the politicians, who vote against impeachment, only care about their jobs and not about serving the people of the country, that’s what they were elected for in the first place. Democracy is difficult and especially when the people being elected forget or ignore the purpose of their role. I still can’t see the impeachment being successful, on the contrary, I fear the whole process might help Trump being reelected. I still think it was the right move to start the impeachment process because the facts clearly show that Trump tried to take advantage of his position by threats the President of the Ukraine.
1
The fact that you're using his catch line in the title, says a lot about how media contributes to this discussion. It is fair that your newspaper should entitle this what it is. This is not a partisan political issue. It is a clear and present danger to free government and is a pursuit of power by any means necessary. These are the real issues here along with the ramifications of what these actions by trump and his ilk will burden us, all of us, with in years to come. I'm hoping that most Americans will be able to recognize fact from fiction when it comes to election time. However, I'm not holding my breath.
6
They will be making movies about the rise and fall of Trump for decades to come and the history books will be rewritten. One can only hope that there will be many lessons learned about what it means to serve your country and how easily the people are deceived.
6
Of course Trump detests the "Deep State."
Because the "Deep State" is made up of individuals who put the United States before not only politics but also before themselves. Instead of putting Trump before everything else.
Trump sees himself as still in the "hospitality business." But most importantly, Trump thinks he can run the country as if it was his business, as a wholly owned subsidiary of The Trump Organization (aka, "The Deep Trump State"). Private businesses are not democracies. Thus Trump's ultimate unsuitability for his job. He does not want to be President of a democracy, especially one with a Constitution. Trump wants to rule by fiat.
It doesn't not matter whether Trump gets the difference. It's up to the rest of us to understand the difference. No one else who thinks like Trump should be given the power of government. That includes monarchists who currently sit, or aspire to sit, in the Congress or the Supreme Court, as well as in the White House.
7
I am getting tired of commenting anything Mr. Trump is saying. I just can’t understand why so many people still follow him. For Mr. Trump to say he cares about the common people is, for me, the joke of the century. There are few people I have less respect for than him and not since he become the President of the USA. For me he is one of the three people in the world I can’t believe a single word. Besides all the lies he is telling on a daily basis, it amazes me how he tries personal advantages of his presidency and still have people who follow him.
8
To me this article is a very disheartening description of the current state of the federal government. In many ways it plays into the hands of an administration that seemingly has little reservations about dismantling the governmental bureaucracy.
If current efforts to remove Trump from office fail, as seems likely, it will surely strengthen his hand and his determination to weed out all the civil employees perceived as insufficiently loyal. To his supporters this is merely draining the swamp, to me this is a formula for establishing a partisan, potentially corrupt, and a less competent and reliable bureaucracy.
There are already numerous examples of increased corruption. They are likely to multiply if we proceed down this road.
3
The ship of state is titanic in size and if we are not careful will be titanic in result.
On one side there are those who deride the captain and his unilateral dictates on all things under Article II of the constitution. -- Of course, that is the captain's job for better or worse.
On the other side the devotees of the captain deride the mutinous deckhands that have their own agenda but are not accountable to the electorate.
1
A few years back, we had a crazy "conservative" Mayor. He promoted himself as a self-made businessman (who inherited his business from his father), vilified the press for pursuing him and calling it a left-wing conspiracy (they turned out to be correct in their reporting) made crude jokes in public about women, rose to the top of municipal politics under a ridiculously simple slogan which called to "stop the gravy train" and as things came to a head started screaming "witch hunt."
Sound familiar? Only difference.... our guy smoked crack. Thankfully, he was Mayor in a city where the Mayor only holds one vote in council, and must build a consensus to get anything significant done. I send America good, progressive, reformative justice vibes. It will survive this. But it won't escape unscathed.
6
There's no such thing as a "deep state" as described by the incompetent Trump. There is a "permanent state" of career officials who work for both liberal and conservative administrations. I don't believe they harbor any particularly negative tendencies toward our democracy but anyone with a brain should have some negative feelings about Trump.
3
Republicans have railed against the Deep State using two main arguments:
1. Malevolence - The people in government represent evil incarnate, constantly seeking ways to undermine the people they serve.
2. Incompetence - The government is staffed with people who could never make it in private enterprise.
For some reason, the logical contradiction of making both arguments doesn't ever seem to be a problem.
3
I have rarely heard these arguments. The argument is usually that the DS--unelected career officials well placed in the federal bureaucracy--assumes power that rightly lies in the hands of elected officials. It often does this secretly and in a conspiratorial way. It supports a globalist liberal state and economic order that does not always align neatly with American interests. It also bridges Republicans and Democrats who make up a kind of globally oriented moderate position on international and economic affairs.
2
Really disgusted by the headline. These individuals aren't "turning against" Trump, they are doing their jobs. Unhelpful for the newspaper of record to seemingly be validating Trump's paranoid take on professionalism, which many Americans are similarly adopting.
6
This is a story about federal employees, many of long time service, each one just doing their job, including upholding their oath of office prescribed under 5 U.S. Code §3331:
“An individual, except the President, elected or appointed to an office of honor or profit in the civil service or uniformed services, shall take the following oath: “I, ___ , do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; that I take this obligation freely, without any mental reservation or purpose of evasion; and that I will well and faithfully discharge the duties of the office on which I am about to enter. So help me God.””
One might wonder how well some of our recently elected and appointed federal employees adhere to this oath.
2
None of this is news. Crooks have always wanted to get rid of the cops. Most crooks wonder why the cops are cops when the big money is in being crooked.
Secondly, can we dispense with the term "Deep State." When the press uses that term it sounds like it actually means something. It doesn't. It is just a bogey man used to rile the mob.
5
Trump thought he could just keep kicking that old dog that is the US Government and it wouldn't bite him. William Taylor was first appointed by Reagan then made the Ukrainian Ambassador by Bush and then put into the same position by Mike Pompeo. Trump's disdain for government is shown by his incompetence in running it and now the GOP is grasping at straws trying to justify Trump's actions. If you can't argue facts you pound on the process. If you can't argue the process you pound on the facts. If you can't argue either one you pound the table. They see that blue wave coming.
2
"...From the small stone of one whistle blower has the crushing avalanche begun."
3
I think this headline misrepresents the basics of this story: Trump's pathological dishonesty, cruelty, narcissism, and the moral compromises he demands of anyone involved with him have turned on him - nothing more or less than that.
I also think there's a link between Republicans' and conservatives' decades-long hostility to the government and public servants - "government isn't the solution to our problems, government is the problem", "the nine scariest words are 'I'm from the government and I'm here to help'", "I don't want to kill the government, I just want to drown it in the bathtub" - and the recklessness of the current administration and its stewardship of the civil service. It's important to note that Trump's behavior is only the crudest and most easily-documented instance of something Republicans have doing for a long time.
94
@Joe This is hitting the nail on the head, Joe -- thanks.
8
@Joe it's hilarious that what starts off as Conspiracy is now praised as a group of hero's. There is a reason the Right distrusts the govt. To believe that unelected career politicians are all Hero's of democracy, and that there doing what's best for the people of the country is not only ignorant of history, but blind to the world.
1
Use of the phrase "deep state," much like "fake news," by Trump and his allies reveals a more fundamental goal: to undermine the institutions that allow our democracy to thrive. Whatever his underlying motives may be, it's abundantly clear that Trump does not understand that he serves our country, not the other way around. It's no wonder that patriots such as the anonymous whistleblower, Ambassador Yovanovitch and Ambassador Taylor are now speaking out about the corruption and lawlessness of Trump and his administration. May their numbers grow.
15
To the average person, lately by going along with their Fearless Leader's ceaseless pandering to the corporatists, crackpot populists and the anarchist minority in this country the GOP has finally managed to make themselves appear to be not only the enemies of the so-called Deep State, but enemies of the State.
Since low and behold, it seems that to the average person after they have managed to pull themselves away from the increasingly difficult day to day challenge of simply making a living long enough to think about it, we have started to realize that the Deep State is us. It's the government the people of this country over more than 80 years, a Great Depression, several major Wars, a Cold War and the rise to a prosperous and energetic country have managed to build-largely through our belief in a free and Democratic society.
No, the GOP seems to be trying to convince our people that we can have a free and prosperous country, an educated populace, good roads and transportation, clean water and blue sky, good and decent health care for all, and uphold our ideals and obligations across the world without a well run and efficient government, populated by dedicated and trustworthy men and women. And now we know that we can't.
So yes, we know after only 2 plus years of anarchy, chaos and disruption of the smooth mechanism of government, that when these GOP anarchists and Corporatists attack the 'Deep State', they are really simply attacking the Democratic system itself .
6
I find it curious that Donald Trump would seek to be elected to a position as the leader of a government he so obviously despises. Mr. Trump has become the equivalent of an autoimmune disease in his attempt to seemingly destroy the federal government from within. From his highly questionable and incompetent choices for cabinet secretaries, to his vilification of the intelligence community and its employees, he has done everything possible to cause lasting damage to the agencies he is responsible for. So, what’s Trump’s overall endgame here? I sincerely hope Congress will remove this man from office before we all find out.
5
Everything about Trump can be understood when one says “real estate developer.” He spent his entire career fighting government, city councils, building departments, zoning codes etc. All authority was the enemy because it tried to restrain his business. Another aspect is his “story telling.” What is more typical of a developer than exaggeration.
7
The only "Deep State" I see here is Trump and his accomplices, who work arduously to circumvent our Constitution and democratic norms. Right-wingers are not bothered by substance of Trump's efforts to use foreign aid to force the Ukraine to investigate his rival's son. They're main gripe is that Trump's abuse of power became public knowledge. Indeed, I suspect that the reason Trump is so hysterical about the impeachment inquiry despite the certainty that the Senate has already decided to acquit him, is that the Ukrainian scandal is merely the tip of the iceberg. No wonder Trump became unhinged when Pelosi opined, "All roads lead to Putin."
2
There is no deep state.
There are only witnesses to crimes and abuses of power.
10
Stephen Miller recently called the impeachment inquiry a product of the “deep state”, a conspiracy theory.
Literally this means a permanent faction of civil servants and security operatives within the government that seeks to thwart a democratically elected leader.
In the current case the US civil servants who oppose Trump are loyal to the Constitution, eager to protect the very institutions he and his lackey try to demolish.
Much of the deep state conspiracy theory in the US under Trump has been generated by the far-right Breitbart website, which Bannon ran before joining the 2016 Trump campaign and after his time in the White House.
But Bannon himself claimed the deep state conspiracy theory is “for nut cases”. He said “America isn’t Turkey or Egypt”.
He’s right, because in these countries, any pro-democracy group that actively seeks to subvert an autocratic regime is called the “fifth column.”
Miller has Trump’s ear, but his understanding of “deep state” is as shallow as Trump’s understanding of governance.
2
This headline is divisive and dangerous. If he is impeached, it will be because he broke the law and betrayed the country.
4
@laurie k
Agreed. I've written a similar comment. I expect better from NYT
1
Let's narrow this one down to essentials, shall we? The CIA is hip-deep in an active, highly orchestrated op to take down a president of the United States. Whatever you think about the Monster Trump, this is a far more serious, consequential and ominous development.
Spooks--operating behind the cloak of "national security" (and granted anonymity by the nation's leading news media!) have worked INSIDE the White House to leak hearsay. Why is the CIA working inside the US and spying on American citizens? Don't ask.
The op was crafted with the assistance of the Democratic party and the chairman of the intelligence committee. Isn't that committee supposed to keep outfits like the CIA on a short leash, given the agency's long record of extra-legal interference with other governments--exactly the capital crime committed (or, more accurately, attempted) by Trump?
Now the impeachment hearings are being held behind closed-doors--but the leaks are plentiful and have an odor of choreography. Big media is on board, each east-coast outlet being spoon-fed (and played off each other).
That the beneficiary of this Op is Hillary Clinton--old friend of the spookocracy--is now beyond doubt. She is now on a road tour/campaign and muscling back into the race. Says so right here in this newspaper.
Anything else is just frosting on the cake. Distraction for the peasants while the real rulers of America tidy up a most unfortunate election.
3
@richard cheverton
A very elaborate pitch for a spy movie. You have included spooks, a demon, It's Hilllllaarrry!!!!!!, secret hearings, ok not a great secret because it's filled with 47 Republicans who could leak the evil plotting by the gang of dems but that is a minor complaint. It even has Q-anon blush with dastardly mustache twirling plotters who are the ones running our country behind the scenes. Add some server in Ukraine nonsense and you could be a script writer for Hannity.
One thing it doesn't have is any facts. Which if this was a movie script it would be fine. But since this is real life I will stick with actual facts rather then fever dreams.
2
I am a former civil servant. Please discontinue legitimizing words and phrases—ie “deep state”—adopted by those who possess dangerously inaccurate views of how the federal government operates. While I believe in constructive criticism and endorse skepticism, I wholeheartedly oppose criticism offered not in good faith but rooted in conspiracy theory. Adopting the term in a headline lends an air of credibility to a thoroughly inaccurate philosophy.
3
@Laura A
I agree. Very irresponsible wording - not only the headline but the first two paragraphs set it off badly as well.
"Mr. Trump first embraced the phrase “deep state” in June 2017 when he retweeted a post from Sean Hannity of Fox News and then used it himself for the first time on Twitter in November of that year, according to Bill Frischling of Factba.se, a service that analyzes data on Mr. Trump’s presidency."
More proof that Mr. Trump has never had an original thought. He is merely a funnel for Fox News talking heads.
2
@Bob Spears
And a good reason why NYT should not be using the phrase so carelessly.
1
Living only 7 miles from the White House in Maryland, we feel uneasy about this obviously deranged, unpredictable and unfit President. Trump’s behavior constitutes a clear and present danger to the country and he must be impeached and removed from office before he causes even more damage to our country than he already has.
3
“A house divided against itself, cannot stand. I believe this government cannot endure, permanently, half slave and half free. I do not expect the Union to be dissolved — I do not expect the house to fall — but I do expect it will cease to be divided. It will become all one thing or all the other. Either the opponents of slavery will arrest the further spread of it, and place it where the public mind shall rest in the belief that it is in the course of ultimate extinction; or its advocates will push it forward, till it shall become lawful in all the States, old as well as new — North as well as South”...Abraham Lincoln.
No matter the issue, what is different in the year 2019 between all Americans and between the 7.7 billion humans on earth???
1
Trump is no longer electable. My R buddies in Texas are already looking for a savior candidate who can push Tump aside.
1
so the deep state is making things up as pay back? i agree
2
The only deep state I see is Republicans trying to bypass laws and procedures in an effort to protect their corrupt and incompetent leader!
5
It’s funny how the twist on words that the Con uses in fact describes exactly what he and his minions are doing themselves. Trump and his administration and the GOP *are* the “Deep State”. They are executing textbook “Corruption”.
Just like the conspiracies he and Faux News spin, like It wasn’t Russia who interfered in 2016, it was Ukraine. The Mafioso man is a master at conning and creating reality TV. Then you have Faux News either initiating the lies and conspiracies or parroting the same, and you end up where we are with a dystopian alternative reality we are currently living.
Trump and his cronies are hollowing out the career public servants throughout the government and often replacing them with sycophants and it appears, criminals. They are literally executing a slow motion Coup d’etat right before our very eyes. When I see interviews with Pompeo, Pence, Miller, Giuliani, Graham, Gaetz, et.al. where they spin outright lies straight faced, I find it not only appalling but disgusting. None of them deserve their places in US government. They do not meet the standard for public servants representing the people and they are definitely not protecting the constitution.
Praying that this insanity doesn’t end up in civil war in the streets.
5
Because Congress has abdicated its responsibilities to make the President uphold our laws, civil servants are stepping in. You can call them Deep State or Concerned State or Alarmed State. DJT and his handpicked henchmen have no respect for our laws and constitution. That's why you have people like Mulvaney thinking that hosting G7 at Doral is wonderful idea. They are there to find the most creative ways to loot the treasury. Worse, they are pimping out the US military to preferred clients like Saudi Arabia (who have all the money in the world to buy their own forces to protect their oil) by pulling them away from more important causes like keeping ISIS at bay.
3
So Trump wanted Ukrainian President Zelenskyy to go on CNN? But I thought CNN was fake news?
To paraphrase an old Hollywood feud, everything that comes out of his mouth is a lie, including And and The.
2
The claim is unfounded. There's no evidence of a deep state's existence.
Yet more U.S. citizens believe that a so-called deep state exists than think it is a conspiracy theory. Belief in the deep state is bi-partisan, about the same percentage of Democrats and Republicans believe it exists. Young people are the most likely to believe that a deep state exists, probably the result of their social media usage. The elderly are the least likely to accept the claim.
However, the interests of career government officials are sometimes at odds with those of elected officials (as well as the voters). Career bureaucrats are committed to their agencies' programs, funding, and mission. They try to protect them even when such action runs counter to what elected representatives are advocating.
3
Trumpism vs Professionalism, which has the greater chance of success? Only a fool could think that Trump has any understanding of world history and the intelligence necessary to be a successful player on the world stage where so many other world leaders are so much more intelligent than Trump and do know world history. We have the class clown in charge of our foreign policy. All Americans including Republicans should be ashamed that Trump is our representative before the rest of the world.
100
@RLW
For the first ten thousand years of history, Trumpism ran rampant:
Do unto others before they do unto you.
The ends justify the means.
Greed is Good.
Everybody does it.
Somebody should beat that guy up.
What the "liberals" are too modern to understand is that the Right rejects the Enlightenment.
The Right doesn't just want to eliminate the Constitution. They want to eliminate the printing press.
They close libraries. They defund schools. Sometimes they burn books.
The Party of Trump is trying to eliminate all limits on Trump's power.
The Right is heavily armed. The Right talks like anarchists, hating the government, blah blah blah, but really they just want to be the military and the police and use that power to subjugate the rest of us, while waving the flag and singing the anthem.
If you think that is impossible, look around the world, and look at the first 10,000 years of history.
Dictators that call on supporters for violence, just like Trump, kill millions of people around the world.
Like a Right Wing Dictator, Trump accuses his critics being "treasonous," demands loyalty from citizens, claims he can take away birthright citizenship, calls for violence against citizens without due process, takes payments from foreign governments, allies with foreign powers against us, and governs by whim.
Comedy? The Constitution is not funny.
A country does not decline a little at a time for long. Then sands are shifting.
The Right is extreme.
The Left is moderate.
6
If Trump is impeached remains a big "IF" for the time being. I would not guess at this point. That old saying about counting chickens before they hatch may still hold some truth.
Only one side has been allowed to dominate the narrative for now. I trust that the American people will want to hear all sides and see all the actual facts, not only individual interpretations and beliefs. Americans have lives to lead, the DC theatre is not their main focus.
Then there is the Senate.
5
It shouldn't take anyone who is awake and sentient to know that Trump should be gone, he's certainly done enough damage to our country and the world, thus far. Why should he be given more time, or a deeper look? Oh, but I guess we should reserve some deeper thought and time to examine Hillary's emails again.
Contempt for professionalism is key for Trump, since he risks being exposed, every day, by people who have greater command of the issues, the history and protocol for running the business of government. Knowledge and understanding are his personal enemies in pursuing most of his disorganized political agenda. So: out with expertise.
To those who want to call these people the “deep state”, be aware that there are Democrats, Republicans and Independents throughout government service. There is not a dominant political ideology, though I see that historically the law enforcement agencies lean to the right. Trump’s obsession with Dems dominating the FBI and CIA is fantasy, pure and simple.
Most people don’t want to spend their days being subject to the thought police or bosses who believe they can’t do their work without declaring their political leaning. They go to work to do their work. They don’t go to work to “push” an agenda. Let’s hope the librarian makes all materials available to researchers, or that the diplomat understands existing laws and treaties, or that the scientist actually studied science and keeps up to date in her field.
19
It seems to me that Trump has created his own deep state by conducting foreign policy with the Ukraine, using the three amigos (Volker, Sundland and Perry) along with Rudy Guiliani and Mulvaney. They ran end-arounds our diplomatic corps to accomplish Trump's political ambitions. Why aren't the GOP House Members descending on the White House to stop Trump from ruining our country and abandoning our allies who fought along side us?
15
So far, this 'analysis' sounds more like wishful thinking than the actual state of things. Even for those who despise the Donald, I would suggest that you let the process play itself out, and we'll see what happens. Whether ours is a deep state, a shallow state in which the views of the vast majority 'the people' are rarely if ever genuinely represented by our elected officials, it is premature to know where the chips will fall. We'll find out in the next round of elections in November 2020.
3
I have always felt that he is the “Deep States” choice.
He couldn’t have behaved the way he has from day one in office if he wasn’t being protected from within.
The whole power structure looks the other way in whatever he says and does, no matter how crude or beneath the office.
That is the definition of a government within a government. The deep state.
5
@Thomas
He is only being protected by his appointees and the Congressional GOP. If that's your deep state, I'm with you. But if you think your average public servant is propping him up, you are waaaay off base.
It's sad that unelected bureaucrats are substituting their partisan beliefs for the duly elected authority of the President of the United States. They continue the same resistance campaign began before Trump was even elected, supported by the DNC and a complicit media. Bill Taylor is no hero. By his own words, his concerns didn't manifest until after the situation was already public. Now he is attempting to shoehorn himself into a dubious history. The lure of paid cable news pundit gigs seems tough for all of these resisters to resist. Bill Taylor is just the latest Sally Yates, Omarosa, Scaramucci or Comey.
6
After three years of watching the villains hold center stage and call the shots, it's a great relief to see decent, patriotic public servants stand up for what is right and proper. These people will be at the core of the revival of good governance which is now in the offing.
10
The acting Chief of Staff is quoted as saying, “What you’re seeing now, I believe, is a group of mostly career bureaucrats who are saying: I don’t like President Trump’s politics so I’m going to participate in this witch hunt they’re undertaking on the Hill.” These “career bureaucrats,” however, possess both an understanding of and commitment to the Constitution and the US role in the world. They’ve served their country with integrity spanning different executive administrations, demonstrating a constancy based in knowledge and a conviction based on the law, irrespective of politics.
DJT has surrounded himself with individuals like Mulvaney, perhaps because they’ve chosen to serve their politics/DJT instead of the Constitution. Operating from a philosophy of politics above all, Mulvaney here projects the action he’d take onto those he’s criticizing, never imagining there might be something critical to the survival of our democracy underlying the actions taken by those testifying.
6
Trump has chosen people like Mulvaney, Barr, Stephen Miller, Mnuchin and others specifically because they serve his political and personal aspirations before the Constitution. He doesn’t care for people who serve the Constitution unless it aligns with his purposes at the time.
Even people on the right of Democrats are gone if they were loyal to the country and rule of law before Trump. That includes Sessions, Mattis, Kelly and Bolton.
Karmic justice indeed. As a retired federal employee with over 3 decades of service, It is very entertaining to watch from outside the beltway the destruction of the Trump empire.
11
This is what happens when an administration is comprised of political paranoids.
They believe they are under attack so the attack. That creates resentment among those being harassed and eventually, as in this case, there is an opportunity to respond.
That confirms their suspicions and in the end, it strengthens their paranoia and the process continues.
This is not good for the nation.
5
The Vietnam War was a deep state enterprise based on ignorance, lies, complicity, and political expediency. It's basis was a lie from start to finish. So were the wars in Latin America designed to preserve corporate interests at all costs, again the primary goal of both parties. The US has destroyed many lives and trillions at home and abroad to support corporate interests that were integrated with calculated political interests. That was largely with the support of government institutions we now call the deep state.
9/11 happened because of a lackadaisical administration led by a removed puppet . The whole story has yet to be told as 9/11 families still struggle to get to court. The destruction and chaos created in the Middle East that continues to roll forward affecting millions is like a permanent scar that grows thinner and thinner as it spreads its consequences. China was a playland for American business until it surprisingly wasn't. There should have been no surprise but the responsible government agencies dodged again. As our public institutions have failed, we have been left to the singular efforts of rare people like Bradley Manning and Edward Snowden.
We are in deep trouble, the Deep State is real.
Is there a deep state...absolutely.
3
@Dave Yes, and there is a "swamp," too, but how you define "deep state" and "swamp" depends on your political ideology, doesn't it?
2
@abigail49
Identifying the continuous disasters and failures of American policy since the end of WW2 is a pretty objective business that yields a consistent analysis. It sums up a willingness to apply political means to achieve financial and corporate-centered interests by manipulating inherent and cultivated attitudes to those ends,regardless of facts. For instance, corporations have the rights of citizens and criminalizing actions of Daniel Ellsberg, Bradley Manning, and Edward Snowden instead of their superiors. These were all actors that revealed the failures of the Establishment now called the Deep State.
1
All this must sound familiar to veterans of Corporate America, which is also a "bureaucracy." Any highly educated or highly skilled and experienced employee of any private company faces the same headwinds as government employees when a new CEO takes the reins of a large company and has different goals than the last one. It takes a very astute CEO to keep morale and productivity high and turnover low while she enacts changes. What this analysis tells me is that CEO Donald Trump doesn't know how to do that. Aside from the corruption and probable criminality disclosed in the Ukraine affair, there is simply bad management. I haven't heard of any corporate CEO standing before an annual meeting of stockholders and lambasting the employees and blaming some of them, by name, for the poor performance of the company. He certainly wouldn't call them part of some "deep state" conspiracy to destroy the company. Corporations have whistleblowers too. They also have highly-skilled and experienced professionals who take pride in their life's work and abide by a code of professional ethics. Maybe Donald Trump doesn't know that because his experience has been with a family-owned company with only a handful of professional employees. Corruption and criminality aside, Donald Trump is just a failed manager.
5
This story unfortunately reinforces the notion of career government employees as some kind of cabal aimed at Trump. In the case of Ukraine, foreign service officers saw crimes being committed and are doing their civic duty to report them. When others have slow-walked Trump's decisions, they did so not to thwart his policies, but to avoid disaster. Now that Trump has figured out how to circumvent them, disasters are occurring on a regular basis. We need to be clear that is Trump who came to office with the objective of "destroying the administrative state," which translates into driving the nation off a cliff.
4
"Robert C. O’Brien, Mr. Trump’s national security adviser, plans to cut the National Security Council staff."
Well, since we can expect to have less national security, who needs a big staff to figure it out?
3
This is what happens when the president doesn't have a mandate (because he lost the popular vote) and when he fails to unify the country (by using divisive rhetoric). He is incapable of rallying the nation, thus he is incapable of rallying government behind him or his policies.
3
"“What you’re seeing now, I believe, is a group of mostly career bureaucrats who are saying: ‘You know what? I don’t like President Trump’s politics"
The GOP would like you to think that. However, the testimony shows that the so-called "deep state," i.e., federal employees, tried like heck to do what the President asked. They only balked when the President wanted them to break the law. Yes, conditioning aid to Ukraine, on investigating political rivals, breaks the law. Our Congress already had approved that aid, Democrats and Republicans, without conditions.
7
I lived in the Persian Gulf region for more than twenty years.
My own personal experience with the Department of State, and observations of the activities of their policy staffers, both point toward massive institutional inncompetence.
Everything that State touches turns to rubbish.
Their day to day service functions are awful - doing the minimum amout required to meet the minimum requirements for their activities.
Their mid level leaders are classic bureaucrats who, unfortunately, cannot be fired for incompetence or failure to act when required.
Anyone who takes over as SecState should be allowed to fire anyone they see fit, 5 levels down into management.
The institution has contributed greatly to some of the biggest foreign policy failuers this nation has seen, and has few - if any - successes to point at.
Having State turn against you, is a badge of honor.
3
@Objectivist
This is actually a great comment.
For all its supposed expertise, the D.C. "blob" has many more losses than wins.
2
Ronald Reagan wanted to shrink government down to a size that "you could drown it in the bathtub"! Aside from the gruesome imagery of death in the bathroom tub, it was ONLY and always a fiction. Ronald Reagan was not an Anarchist and any Libertarian tendencies were overrided by his (authoritarian) Republican side. Shooting protesters of the Vietnam War as a fantasy or destroying a Public sector union (Air Traffic Controllers) in reality.
Shrinking government or killing the Deep State are just arbitrary campaign slogans used to get the base fired up. I love Bernies "Revolution" but it is another pipedream. It might happen eventually but not in the lifetime of a almost 80 year old politician.
2
This article establishes two facts:
1. There is in fact a “deep state” of career bureaucrats.
2. This deep state is working to undermine an elected president.
So, Trump was right all along.
In particular, the D.C. deep state bureaucrats in military/intelligence/foreign policy positions are most active in undermining Trump, because he is a threat to the Pax Americana global system developed after the fall of the USSR. (Interestingly, it was a similar Soviet deep state apparatus that opposed Gorbachev’s efforts that led to the dissolution of the USSR.)
The D.C. deep state bureaucrats are honest and sincere. They believe that their sacred duty is to preserve a U.S.-dominated world order. They are not alone. They are supported by many politicians of both parties.
Trump is not even the first victim in recent times. Obama also promised to end endless wars, but thanks to the extremely poor choice of Hillary Clinton as SoS, he actually started more wars. In short, the “blob” won.
American citizens have now voted twice for non-interventionist policies. It’s time for the deep state bureaucrats to put aside their own sincere beliefs and execute the policies that voters are demanding.
6
"Let me tell you: You take on the intelligence community - they have six ways from Sunday at getting back at you, and that the then president -elect was being "really dumb" to do this." Those were the words of Sen. Schumer in response to a comment from Rachel Maddow on MSNBC, thus disqualifying our senior senator for inclusion in the next edition of "Profiles in Courage." Regardless of how one feels about President Trump. every American who cares about the future of this republic must take it upon himself to see that the warning of Sen. Schumer is not borne out in its role in the panicked flight forward to impeach President Trump, despite the absence of any wrongdoing, or even the appearance of any crime. Let the president of the United States be determined at the ballot box, not in the secret chambers of the intelligence community, which has brought us endless war.
7
@jdd
Yes.
Those were the most frightening words I've ever heard from a top elected official.
He basically acknowledged that the "deep state" has more power than voting citizens.
2
I do not think Trump is bright enough to understand what Deep State means. He is just parroting his base.
7
Unfortunately, the best fictional analogy to what Trump is doing to the government is found in Harry Potter and the Deathly Hollows where Voldemort and his Death Eaters take over the Ministry of Magic and pervert its duties to their cruel and genocidal ends. Meanwhile loyal Ministry of Magic employees do their best to dilute the worst of the horror and cruelty.
This analogy is useful on multiple levels. The Death Eaters were organized around their belief that the magical race was superior to non-magical people they labeled "mudbloods." This is what explains why some so many of them were willing to put power and privileges in Voldemort's corrupt hands.
The Trumpists are the same. The only thing that explains the loyalty of some members of his administration and why they'd stay is that Trump allows them to use the power of the government to forward the aims of white supremacy.
3
The uncomfortable truth for Trump opponents, including myself, is that there actually is an enormous national security apparatus that operates off the books with little-to-no oversight. It may not be the exact "deep state" that Trump describes. but its existence is a huge threat to our democracy. The other uncomfortable truth is that this secret bureaucracy burgeoned during the Obama era. Just read the remarkable book "Top Secret America" by the Washington Post's Pulitzer Prize winning reporter Dana Priest. Or turn off your judgment of Edward Snowden for a minute and consider the unlegislated domestic surveillance programs he exposed. The power of the intelligence apparatus is also evident in the fact that top Obama intelligence officials Brennan, Alexander and Clapper each unquestionably lied to Congress and yet were allowed to remain in the their jobs. And in a truly Orwellian development, the mendacious Brennan, who falsely claimed that drones had never killed a civilian, now is a hero to the MSNBC crowd because he opposes Trump.
We Democrats have to stop checking our memories and judgment at the door. Just because Trump is against something doesn't mean we should be for it.
6
There is no deep state but there is professionalism and expertise, things that upset Trump because these people simply know more than Trump. Thin-skinned and of fragile ego, while he has very little training in anything relevant to the office he holds, these skillful people must be crushed and routed out as befits the autocrat's preferences
3
The "Deep State" does not exist. It is simply a projection on liberals of exactly what trump et al are up to.
2
Where are the calls to impeach Pompeo and Barr this past week? It's pretty obvious they are accomplices.
2
Don't like this headline. Even though you put it in quotes - there is no deep state. Don't use his language in talking about these issues. Moreover - this is not a war. That is how he wants this characterized. It is civil servants doing their job.
4
I for one, am grateful for the career diplomats and others who have defied the Republican president’s command that they do not “honor a congressional subpoena” and testified FOR the good of America! Don McGahn (he should be disbarred for not obeying the subpoena) and other sycophants who have ignored the subpoenas should be ashamed!
The Ukrainian extortion is just one crime, by the Republican president! Robert Mueller’s report outlines at least a dozen occasions of obstruction of justice. Additionally, the impeachment inquiry should throw a wide net to include Pompeo, Barr, Rudy and others who colluded with the Republican president in the Ukraine extortion!
Thank you, Ambassador William Taylor, Ambassador Marie Yovonavich, and all others who are honorable men and women, as well as patriots in my eyes and in the eyes of the majority of Americans!
Thank you!
3
To a criminal, the police are the deep state.
6
Trump is merely paranoid because he's such a sloppy manager--he has to blame his failures on someone.
I seem to recall that Kennedy has problems leading the CIA--apparently they were answering to Nixon even though he lost the election.
2
“‘What you’re seeing now, I believe, is a group of mostly career bureaucrats who are saying: “You know what? I don’t like President Trump’s politics so I’m going to participate in this witch hunt that they’re undertaking on the Hill,”’ Mick Mulvaney, the acting White House chief of staff, told reporters last week.”
No. What we're seeing now is a bunch of dedicated and experienced people refusing to shut up when US foreign policy becomes dominated by political appointees who know (and care) nothing at all for what actually works to further US interests.
5
The true deep state is the WH and Trump.
5
Since Donnie is such a "phoney" president, let's call it the "real state"....
3
Trump, in fact, began a process of 'self-impeachment' even before he was selected by the Electoral College. "Russia, if you are listening....." Lord knows what sensitive, secret information he gave to his buddy Putin in Helsinki and the Russian ambassador in D.C. Trump keeps saying "No Collusion" He says he hasn't colluded with the Russians to weaken America around the world. But that is only because he is too ignorant and self-absorbed to realize just how he has unwittingly colluded. We have a man of mediocre intelligence, incredible ignorance of world history, and obvious psychopathology as POTUS interacting with world leaders of superior intelligence who are playing him like a puppet. Trump is too blindly ignorant and stupid to realize just how much of a fool he has been on the world stage. But what is worse are Republicans in Congress and around the country who continue to support his treasonous behavior while the foundations of America's reputation around the world crumble. Republicans' defense of Trump's traitorous dealings with foreign powers that want to see America diminished in stature and strength places them in the category of traitors to the Constitution and nation they swore to defend.
3
Trump vs. the "Deep State?" Yet one more lie foisted upon his blind followers. It goes right there along with "Lock her up!" and "Build a wall!" Angry words for people that don't want to think.
5
Exactly what Vladimir Putin wanted when he influenced our election. To hurt America...
3
“'What you’re seeing now, I believe, is a group of mostly career bureaucrats who are saying: "You know what? I don’t like President Trump’s politics so I’m going to participate in this witch hunt that they’re undertaking on the Hill,"' Mick Mulvaney, the acting White House chief of staff, told reporters last week."
And so what? If these people are telling the truth, what does it matter if they actually are part of some "deep state"? Truth isn't not truth because the teller has a beef with the one harmed by the truth.
All we need to worry about is, are these career officials accurate and revealing all of the facts, or not? Everything else is just smoke screens and smears.
As for Mulvaney, basically he's saying "You dirty rats!", to paraphrase James Cagney. Of course, the "rats" are a problem because their truth telling is perceived as betrayal, though these officials don't swear loyalty to Presidents; they swear loyalty to the Constitution of the United States, and work for its people.
2
Most people don’t realize that writing titles of articles to fit into the limited space available in a newspaper is a distinct job that is not done by the reporters who wrote the article, but a specific person (or persons) assigned that task.
If I wanted to slant the news in an otherwise good news source, I would go to that person and offer him or her a substantial subsidy to use specific language in headlines: ie instead of “career diplomats” , use the Trumpian terminology of “deep state”.
By that means, it’s possible to not only slant the news for subscribers, but more importantly, the millions more who only see the headlines.
Who is doing headlines for the NYT? Who is in charge of that person or persons?
Dear Liberal Media, tit for tat, extortion, this for that, quid pro quo doesn't need to be for there to be an impeachable offense. You're falling into the trap. Again.
Once again your headline is abysmal and an example of a false and misleadling trope initiated by the WH and perpetuated by the media. There is no "Deep State". Everyone who works in the U.S. gov't., including political appointees takes an oath to uphold the Constitution. Apparently though, the political appointees and senate and house members of the GOP in this administration do not take their constitutional oath seriously and believe bending to the whims of a corrupt and malignant administration is now part of the job description. Those who are exposing the corruption and criminality in this administration are not "deep state", they are patriotic Americans.
2
Geekdom attacks .. If Donald Trump is ousted the country
of the United States of America is done.. makes one wonder whether the Dems and akin are enemies of the state ..
plotting an action of overthrow and ultimate deem of treason..
Indictments should be forthcoming.. a Gordian knot you shall have
"Deep State"?
Is that where the fictional DNC server is hiding?
Is it being guarded by Baby Shark?
2
Career professionals in every bureaucracy work to keep the idiots at the top, who are often elected, in line. School Superintendents, Mayors, Governors, Sheriffs. The elected are a carousel of high climbers often, moving from election to election. It is the professionally trained and experienced budget analysts, teachers, fire fighters, police officers, transportation specialist, etc who actually keep the wheels on the bus.
1
Trump’s war against the ‘Deep State’ has turned not only against him (and his mindless Republican supporters), but ALSO against Fox News.
Fox is so blatantly and interminably ignorant, misguided, and careless in its fawning over (er, I mean coverage of) the sick, vile president, that one wonders what this Sham Network will report after Trump has been impeached -- and indicted.
Actually, what these halfwits will probably report, day after day, is this: "Trump was wronged! Victimized by the relentless smear campaign of partisan, Constitution-hating Liberals!"
Yeah, right.
Whatever Fox reports in the weeks and months after Trump's dismissal, it will be great entertainment. A laugh a minute.
1
Why does Trump rail against the so called "deep state.'? It's because these people are experts who actually have some knowledge that Trump does not have. And Trump hates not being the smartest person in the room. He hates people who tell him that Colorado is hundreds of miles away from the border and doesn't need a wall. He hates people who tell him that you can't impeach the Speaker of the House. He hates people who tell him that Putin is a liar who wants to destroy this country and is not strong. He hates people telling him it's illegal to ban people because of their religion. He hates people who tell him " No Mr. President, there are things you can not do, there are things that are against the law, even for a President. Trump wants to be surrounded by craven boot lickers who will tell him that every thought he has is brilliant.
1
Justice plays tricks on us sometimes. Just look at the cheater in-chief, Donald J, Trump, always self-congratulatory as to how smart a genius he is...in outsmarting others, now caught in his own labyrinth of perfidy...and the problem of lying when memory isn't helpful, at the end self-corroborating that he tried to fool us...by fooling himself at the end. Sad really. And justice is laughing now...all the way to the bank. The problem for his republican sycophants remains however, as Trump demands blind loyalty while they are useful idiots...and knowing they'll be thrown under the bus as soon as inconvenient to him. That is what happens when you go to bed with snakes, you end up being bitten...with little chance for survival, let alone for honorable discharge. Trump, with all his stupid bluffing , is his worst enemy.
An important distinction is in definition of the term "loyalty". In traditional times, the Civil Service would be expected to be loyal to the Office of the President, the Constitution and the Law. In today's world, DJT expects the Civil Service to be loyal to DJT, regardless of the Constitution or the Law. Those that put the Constitution or the Law ahead of DJT are now "the Deep State".
3
The ominous sounding term deep state, could actually apply to any large bureaucratic organization, such as a state university, wherein mid level life time employees run the show (the 'deep state'), while faculty are recruited (appointed), to do the teaching and research. Particularly apt as deep state-like are the department of Human resources and Offices of ethics, compliance and integrity, etc. Faculty can get in a lot of trouble for violating the policies and procedures set by the University system, and enforced by the deep state.
1
Any organization is stronger for having long term employees who know the system and how to manage it. I’d rather work with someone who knows what the rules and expectations are. Are you better at your job after three years of experience, or thirty?
1
Every good general knows that his army is only as good as the sergeant majors commanding the troops at the crucial part of command, that of the front lines. In other words good armies depend upon those sergeant majors who are career professionals and carry with them the institutional knowledge necessary to carry out the job needed for a professional and effective army. Businesses and governments are the same in this respect, institutional knowledge helps things run efficiently and for the most part should keep the grifters and corruption at bay. Trump's war on the government, and destruction of this institutional knowledge, will haunt us for years to come.
9
Excellent comment. Thanks! Especially from red Idaho!
he Walter Cronkite Republican notes that Mr. Trump is the second Republican of this century who came to power on a flawed election with a very narrow margin who then proceeded to rule as if he had won a large mandate. If one chooses to rule as a tyrant, one should not be surprised when one is treated as a tyrant. Mr. Trump's comments and behavior portray the reason we have previously enacted laws protecting whistle blowers. They are part of the checks and balances that protect us against tyrany.
16
President Trump won the fairly. Over 300 electoral votes means more states wanted Trump to be there president. I believe in the constitution. Do you?
1
Even if you have the idea that the federal government is this terribly inefficient bureaucracy, you must respect the career civil service employees integrity and professionalism. They are the keepers of our democracy on a daily basis. Thank goodness we have them.
13
Exactly!
Trump doesn't 'distrust' institutions. It is more accurate to characterize his relationship as that of a criminal vs the law.
19
"[Trump] never trusted [the intelligence agencies'] conclusion that Russia intervened in the 2016 election on his behalf."
I am tired of hearing this assessment. Trump knows full well that Russia intervened. He has to have seen the email to his son asserting exactly that, if nothing else. He doesn't deny Russian interference because he doesn't believe it. He denies because he doesn't want to admit it; it's bad for his brand.
What he doesn't trust is anyone who hasn't explicitly or implicitly sworn loyalty to him, personally. And even then, he's always waiting for the betrayal - because he himself doesn't give full loyalty to anyone and would betray anyone if it served himself.
Criminals don't like depending on honest people.
11
By now it should be blatantly obvious that Trump, with the help of his Republican enablers - Barr, Giuliani, McConnell, the members of his so-called cabinet, Republican members of Congress and others who have sworn loyalty to him rather than the Constitution or the country - is gradually taking the powers of all 3 branches of government into his own hands. We are watching a dictatorship in the making, something the Founders didn’t foresee, relying instead on the presidency being held by “good men” surrounded by others of principle. Meanwhile Republican voter suppression activities are on the rise and the Senate tables a bill to provide funding to the states for election security. If we aren’t a full-blown dictatorship by Election Day I will be very surprised, because even if Trump is impeached and the Senate votes to remove him a corrupt DOJ will fight tooth and nail to keep him. He will not go quietly, if at all.
10
True, I’m very concerned about this.
1
Of course Trump is going to get impeached and removed by the Senate.
Mitch McConnell has been getting millions from the Chinese for years (as reported here in the nyt) and it’s payback time. The Chinese want to show they can remove the guy who placed tariffs on them. It’s so obviously transparent.
And, I’m not saying he doesn’t deserve it, just saying follow the money....
3
Well, you don't have to believe in a deep state, to figure out why a president that has railed against the fourth estate to figure why so many patriotic civil servants are marching into Congress to testify about what is happening behind closed doors.
What journalists or even any freedom-loving American can forget: " The press is the enemy of the people!"
The day of reckoning is coming soon.
4
The Don insulted half the country and bragged about enjoying conflict, so now he's getting it in trainloads, boatloads. And from his long career of crime and stiffing people, there are trainloads and boatloads of witnesses who would like to see him face justice. This reality show is going to be way way better than Watergate, I just know it.
9
Donald "PUTIN" Trump has done exactly what he set out to do, repay Russia and Putin for their help in getting him elected and perhaps for other reasons"kompromat" .
He started his assault by discrediting and undermining all the agencies that would be able to track the Russian influence, FBI and CIA. He and his cohorts started calling the institutions that direct US policies and actually carry out our strategic interest the "Deep State" and have now with help of the republicans in congress actually attacked all the entities that make up our functioning government. It is interesting that the Republicans are now seemingly saying all government institutions are bad.
He has given the far right republicans all the domestic policies they wanted and appointed all the judges they could only dreamed of before. Except for the Syria debacle which caused them to chafe a little, clearly a point for Putin and Russia. Yet, they have decided to keep supporting him. A little treason or not.
Those places like The State Department, The Department of Justice and the others if not bending to his will and employing his policies... as unlawful and unconstitutional as some may be, he will harangue the directors and criticize the institutions as we have seen until they kowtow or the person at the top quits and then he can put in a sycophant. Barr at the Justice department or Perry at the Department of Energy all complicit and maybe even a party to the Ukrainian corruption the result.
4
Excellent comment! Yesterday a neighbor told me, that in a recent poll of Republicans, they have a great distrust for the FBI and our Intelligence services. I’m not surprised, since the beginning the Republican president has insulted and lied about our Intelligence services creating a serious mistrust in his followers.
Such an almost psychotic time in our national history. I guess we will get past this and Trump will pass into history as a really good example of how things can go terrible wrong. I can almost find it in me to forgive him (like a coyote who eats your puppy) but I don't know that I can forgive those who make any twist or turn possible to support this dark time in our national experience. Voters need to look into themselves and admit when a con man has tricked them before he takes everything, including our very soul. I am sorry to say that I think many Republicans in government are now just too far gone and will not be able to find a way to recover their honor.
4
Destruction of the Deep State is really destruction of the Constitution and the rule of law.
1
No, Mick Mulvaney, like so much else, you've got that wrong. You're not seeing " ... a group of mostly career bureaucrats who are saying: ‘You know what? I don’t like President Trump’s politics so I’m going to participate in this witch hunt that they’re undertaking on the Hill." What you're seeing are career public servants appalled at an administration with no regard for the law, ethics, or standing up for this country's obligations around the world, unless it suits the president's political purposes.
4
Trump is a simple personality. He craves pleasure and fears pain. End of his consideration of life.
The deep state is a nothing more than a way to describe a bureaucracy that operates independently of political influence being frustrating to those who abhor the laws and policies which it follows as expected by the majority of the people but not they.
Trump is a boob but he’s actually reconstructing the corruption and incompetence ridden and rotten patronage system that was common in government until the civil service system was adopted. Most Republicans think that this will serve them well but they will come to same conclusion as did the citizens of the late 19th century that it doesn’t.
3
Through all of this, the lying, the obfuscation, the deflections, I am reminded of Flannery O'Connor's comment:
“The truth does not change according to our ability to stomach it.”
1
“Deep State” = people I didn’t appoint. Or if I did, I don’t like them anymore.
2
I thought there wasn’t any, Deep State.” Did something change?
2
The second paragraph in the published Ambassador Taylor excerpts is telling- “The irregular policy channel was running contrary to the goals of longstanding U.S. policy.” Just who is running the show here, the State Dept. or our elected official, the President of the United States? The policy changed on November 9, 2016. The problem is, the ‘deep state’ cretins still can’t accept democratic rule in their own country, much less Ukraine.
1
When did the American voters elect the CIA to run the country?
2
This is not a theoretical concern. The purges of the US foreign service in the late 1940s and 1950s following the Communist revolution in China eliminated many who had grown up in Asia, often as children of American missionaries and business people, who understood the language, culture and politics.
Their replacements were easily manipulated by local elites into a misunderstanding of the nationalist desires of colonial subjects, leading to the nightmare of the Vietnam War and 3 million dead.
Before WWII, the western European US diplomatic corps were well connected wealthy Americans who threw great parties but spent less time trying to understand the turbulent politics of the 1930s. When William E. Dodd, a University of Chicago history professor became ambassador to Germany, he tried to alert the State Dept to the real ambitions of the Nazi Party and was largely ignored.
Now it is the former Soviet Republics, eastern Europe and the Middle East that is in upheaval and career US diplomats there are being replaced by wealthy campaign donors, while Putin schemes.
Kelly Craft as ambassador to the UN is the ultimate example of US diplomatic blundering.
2
Couldn’t have happened to a nicer or more principled family man!
4
Rep. Elijah Cummings. Lies in State in the old Capital space, when the country was smaller, only feet from where LIncoln had his desk.
Michael Higgenbothom; law professor said today,
That Elijah Cummings told him as he criticized Justice Thomas...I agree with you but stay true to your principles. They will be your North Star and you will never get lost.
2
I agree with the tone of the article in that there is a huge irony how things are turning out. Trump has offended so many that naturally people are less likely to feel loyal to him.
However I disagree with the premise of he article. Public servants are just trying t do their job, they are selflesly giving their all to this country. They are not trying to get back at Trump. They understand that it is the time to put the country first - even before ahead of themserves. Public servants deserve our gratitude!
ALL of this is down to Trump’s misconduct. He brought it ALL on to himself. It is his doing and his alone.
49
The Republicans know the rules. They have utilized them themselves over numerous investigations and a impeachment inquiry of their own. So disingenuous.
16
The "Deep State" is another projection by Trump. The inquiry is revealing a shadow foreign policy run by personal henchmen and abuses of the highest office of the land. The "Deep State" is Trump and his cabal, who have no commitment to the United States, but to Trump's interests. And Trump's interests are in conflict with US interests.
I applaud government employees who are exposing Donald Trump. They are our only chance to save our Republic.
26
Donald Trump and his cronies are the literal definition of the Deep State. If the deep state is a shadow parallel government then they fit the description perfectly. A parallel government working nefariously behind the scenes and running contrary to the aims of our democratic system. A group of shady individuals who do not abide by proper government channels working to further aims contrary to the American people and circumvent the Constitution. What a perfect description of the scheme they are trying to pull off.
20
Forget the republicans finding their soul, these “deep state” workers in gov. are our true heroes. People who believe in our country and our ethics are coming forth. As an anti-war activist during the Vietnam War I saw the CIA and FBI as a soulless tool of the war machine dangerous to our nation. Seeing republicans like Comey of the FBI and state Department officials stand up for what’s right at their own expense has caused me to re-evaluate my judgements. I find grudging respect for Sessions who showed ethical backbone as AG. I now see the value of bipartisanship in our “deep state”.
11
John Bolton. American Hero. Defender of the Constitution. I am officially gobsmacked.
1
Trump continuously and falsely accuses others of doing what he, in fact, is doing. His ‘deep state’ accusations fit this pattern.
WIth his personal lawyer leading the charge, Trump created an unofficial but quite real cabal to do Russia’s bidding in Ukraine. The ‘deep state’ is his personal tool to achieve unconscionable ends through secretive means.
15
How telling that Mr. Trump regards slaying a beast that doesn't exist to be one of his greatest accomplishments.
6
I much prefer the "deep state" professional to "shallow state" amateurs like Rudy Giuliani who have Trump's ear. Maybe Trump does not like to read "deep state" briefing books and prefers "shallow state" comic books!
4
I wish you wouldn't use the term "deep state" as a synonym for bureaucracy. It plays right into the hands of DJT's propaganda machine repeating specific terms to keep supporters brainwashed and up in arms.
9
When did the truth become payback?
8
For all of the Deep State conspiracy theorists: Isn't it possible that the real conspiracy is that Trump is just a naive and narcissistic pawn in a foreign cabal's collusion to undermine the strength of the US Government from within?
12
None of these people are part of any "deep state." They're bureaucrats and state officials, some of whom were appointed by the current administration. "Deep state," as I understand it, comes from conspiracy theories. You may want to stop using the phrase unless, of course, the New York Times wishes to perpetuate a very corrosive discourse.
9
Anyone who did not see this coming from the minute he won the election hasn't been paying attention
8
Very disingenuous. The Deep State was against the guy before he took office. The FBI officials and the woman from Justice admitted it in emails. I am sure that the CIA, NSA and the rest of those clowns must have been just as upset. Now, thanks to a CIA pr State Dept leaker, we have another waste of time ridiculous investigation. Hey, where were they before the war in Iraq? Where were these wonderful Deep State types? Out in McClean playing golf. Or, in Georgetown drinking wine. Come on, this Deep State is a cruel joke at the expense of the people.
4
Of course Taylor happens to be a West Point grad who joined the 101st, got a MA from Harvard, did tours in Vietnam where he was decorated for bravery, and then developed a long, very distinguished career in the State department that included tours in Afghanistan and Iraq before he was assigned to Ukraine years ago.
Anybody with a grain of sense would be proud to have a man like that in this country’s service. Feel free to compare his career and life to Donny’s.
Piece of advice, though: if you’re a Trumpist, NEVER mention golf. It reminds folks that your boy (and I do mean boy) has alreadyspent far more time playing GOLF than Obama ever did in eight years, and run up a $100-million plus tab doing it. We might even recall what he tried to pull with his Doral.
6
@Robert Tried to reply. Failed. Anyway, I am sure Mr Taylor is a great American. But, the leaker was a CIA or State Dept, Deep State tool, no? This “get Trump” charade has been organized and managed by the globalist, neo con, pro war, free trade, chicken hawks and their homies in the three letter agencies. Stevie Wonder can see that. I should add, the cheap labor, Merkel types.
All his life Donald Trump only cared about two things: money and long legged blondes, now he has discovered something he likes even more-watching people jump at his slightest command, when he says jump, they say : "how high." The fact that these people are powerful and successful in their own rights, many educated at this countries finest colleges, most smarted and classier than himself. They grovel to him now. Power is always very addictive and Trump after a long life avoiding alcohol and drugs has at long last become an addict at last. And like any addict he is the last to know.
7
Silliness. He won’t lose. He’s got a concrete base and we Dems are like cats seeing laser pointers.
4
Autocrats and Kelptocrats like Trump & his minions don't distrust a so-called Deep Bench (better concept; less pejorative) because it is composed of incompetents. On the contrary, a Deep Bench is composed of competent people who swore an oath to the Constitution. They get in the way of the pillaging & piracy Trump desires. Trump, et alia, wants flunkies, sycophants, kick-backers and loyalists who swore an oath to Him. Raging obeisance is the hallmark of any Trump replacement in his Administration: Mnuchin, Pence, Pompeo, Barr, Perry, Carso, Perdue.....shall I go on?
4
To put it simply Trump is a fool. He's lived an isolated world of grand privilege, and shady dealings, and had no idea what he was stepping into. Yeah, it's a deep state. A deep state of career professionals dedicated to the country, displaying commendable and honorable services. It is uplifting to see them shine light on his con, a depraved state supported by shadowy henchmen.
9
Just because it’s a witch-hunt doesn’t mean there isn’t a witch.
6
This article is interesting for its open recognition that there is a layer of the permanent government that actively works against elected officials to push their own agenda in foreign policy, and presumably other fields as well. The statement at the end that the "dissent" against the Trump administration has been going on since Day One, and that careerists "finally had a voice" seems to be oblivious to the fact that voters might actually disagree with the idea that the political program of their choice could be derailed by lifetime bureaucrats. I would be interested in hearing from those running for the Presidency now how they plan to corral the federal government into fulfilling the will of its elected representatives.
9
@David Godinez
Can you describe another option to replacing the entire, say, State Department after every election? I'm sure that would work well.
7
It is important to keep in mind that most people didn't vote for the abuse of federal funds and power for personal gain. I don't think standing against that and insisting on decency and professionalism requires them to be "coralled". Maybe the president and his henchmen should remember the oath they swore instead.
4
Professional civil servants are indoctrinated to be just that "professionals" who provide a civic service. They serve at the pleasure of the executive. This, however, does not mean that they are required to break the law or to ignore corruption. They are the non-elected branch of government that help uphold the law, regulations and ultimately the constitution. They are not the president's, or his cronies', hit people. We should be happy that they are whistle blowers and testifying against unlawful actions. They don't work for government for the pay as it is low compared to the private sector. They work in government because they believe they are providing a service to their country even though this usually goes unrecognized. Thanks to them, we have a chance of ending a corrupt presidential term and upholding our democracy.
15
Deep State is the bureaucracy within the government and as we see these people are guardians of the status quo. Trump wanted a free hand to do whatever he pleased. Guess again. Oh the payback for him will be horrendous. Impeachment is imminent if the Senate is smart and recognizes where the revolt is grounded.
6
If he's impeached, it will be because of his actions, not the people who were obligated by their consciences (and the law) to report those actions
15
In the late 1980s I took a seminar on French history with the eminent historian Ted Margadant. He insisted that in studying the French Revolution (writ large, from the 1780s through the Napoleonic era) we should maintain a clear distinction between "state" and "regime." Regimes come and go -- there were several between 1789 and 1797, but the state is ongoing.
So it is today, in the United States Trump's presidency is nothing more than a regime. The state, however, abides. Call it the "deep state." Call it, as did Bannon, the "administrative state." Call it whatever you want. It's not going away, we should hope.
Check out Tocqueville's "The Old Regime and the Revolution," in which this is all spelled out.
3
Deep State is a fictionalized way of describing a career civil service on which every good government relies. We need expertise, not obstruction but expertise which disagrees with whim and plundering policy is not deed in any nefarious way, but needed to protect that which is necessary for legality and the future. Trump is used to picking deep pockets so in some twisted way this had a ring to it that he liked.
7
Suggestion for your president; please read Wilson's speech to Congress in April 1917 just before America declared war on Germany. It epitomises what American should be - and is a notable contrast to the present state of things.
6
Donald and the GOP boast about their religious credentials and evangelical support. Yet many in this country still fear atheists.
4
References to the "deep state" show a lack of understanding about how the federal government is designed. Since our government leadership can change every four years, the civil service has evolved from the days of Jefferson Davis (father of the civil service) as a stabilizing force. Without regard to who the party in power is, the civil service acts to slow the rate-of-change, thereby maintaining a core center that resists destabilizing change in the course of a single administration. Trump is a change agent for better or worse (maybe a bull in a china shop), so a degree of conflict is predictable. However, what is happening now is undermining this balance and may result in long-term damage, which I fear could hurt every aspect of government, and even affect our democracy.
5
A good article poorly titled. This is not the revenge of the deep state. Its the actions of individuals to not stand by in the face of illegality,those willing to sacrifice themselves for the rule of law and, fundamentally, for our system of government. This, I think is real loyalty, not the fake, self-serving kind trump demands.
And, BTW, this isn't the "deep state." Trump's attorneys and friends out there operating outside the state...that's the rogue operation. These ambassadors and public servants took loyalty oaths...to the Constitution. What or who did Rudy take an oath to?
6
Shame on everyone for normalizing the use of “deep state.” Republicans started using this term to scare everyone that there are dark forces within our government. Republican abuse and manipulation of language has a long history and here again we see uncritical reporters and editors adopting a term which has no meaning in an American context.
5
Kudos to William B. Taylor for his testimony -- and to the two unsung heroes who counselled him before he went back to serve in the Ukraine: His wife, who urged him not to take the job, and the former senior Republican official, who told him "If your country asks you to do something, you do it -- if you can be effective."
There's the dilemma for the rest of us: If good people predictably are trashed by trying to serve our country under Trump -- becoming understandably unwilling to serve under him -- and only venal self-serving grifters hold sway in the White House, what becomes of our country? Of us?
3
Deep State isn’t politics. It’s protection and people to prevent moronic decisions from being made.
Sort of like one’s conscience. Well, when politicians had one.
3
The deep state is anti-democratic and unconstitutional in that it attempts to usurp executive authority, and effectively create law and policy.
Too me the deep state is defined by rejecting and countering the Constitution's delegation of executive authority to the President. A failure to accept that all in the executive branch have the Condtitutional role of carrying out the President's policies and not defining their own.
Our Constitution assigns powers in a manner where the power is in the hands of elected officials and the people if followed. Judges, and bureaucrats have no authority to make law or policy in my copy of the Constitution.
in short, by the text of the constitution the deep state has no rightful power to legislate of define high level executive policy for those powers are delegated fully to the congress and President as follow:
"All legislative Powers herein granted shall be vested in a Congress of the United States," ,
"The executive Power shall be vested in a President of the United States of America."
Many may like how the deep state has usurped power, but no one has elected any of them. All their usurpation of executive and legislative power are anti-dmocratic
2
The point of the term "Deep State" means that it is really bureaucrats who control the government, not the administration. So the headline "Trump's War Against the Deep State Turns Against Him." is a bit strange, at least before two cups of coffee. The Deep State was always in control, so how could ... Oh, I give up.
2
Interestingly, the most damming information has come from trumps appointees and himself
5
Connolly’s quote makes it sound like this IS opportunistic payback. It’s not. It’s civil servants standing up for what’s right, saying “enough,” saying “you’ve gone too far now.”
1
Trump is feeling the pressure and will continue his lying. Thankfully we have Americans who are patriots testifying who will eventually bring his reign to an end.
3
And his supporters shrug, vindicated in their paranoid Deep State delusion, happy that attrition of Federal employees is shrinking the government.
This level of empty positions in the Federal government is an anti-government conservative’s dream.
1
Per title of article: Trump "distrusted" or rather Purposely Maligned --as he did the Press, the CIA, FBI, etc, etc, ( in full dictator's playbook style), to train the public not to believe any and all of the inevitable charges brought against him by those dedicated to exposing the truth, upholding the law, and protecting the country.
If there is a deep state it is the trump administration and their paranoid behavior. Kudos to those who are coming forward to expose what trump and his cronies have been doing.
2
Fringe groups always want to 'blow up' established organizations, but they never seem to know how to do those organizations' jobs after their gone. OK, force every career foreign service employee out of the State Department, and replace them with people who made millions selling diet supplements online. Do these new 'diplomats' know which countries are Sunni and which are Shia, and why that matters? Who cares! They aren't part of the 'deep state,' and that's what's important!
The lack of respect for experience and professionalism is what ticks off this moderate.
2
He represents his constituency, who are incoherent blobs of anxious rage. His intense fear, projected on the screen of the career government, has been made manifest. Self-fulfilling prophesy.
3
How is a war “turned against” someone? It’s a war—it’s never *not* against the other side.
Please stop saying T "doesn't trust" career people.
He doesn't care what the truth is. He speaks to create a different "reality," the one he wants to be true. Truth would only get in the way.
He saw getting the presidency as being handed power. He's furious at anyone who interferes with that power.
Like dictators everywhere, he means to create an image for general consumption that hides his illegality and plundering.
He doesn't "trust" anyone. He relies on coercion, smears, and lies.
3
Just FYI: There is going to be a meeting of the Deep State this Saturday evening. We will be electing new committee leaders, welcoming new members, ratifying amendments to our Constitution (please don’t confuse it with the US Constitution) and going over the coming year’s agenda. Light refreshments will be served. Please contact me with time and location.
... I forgot to mention, dress is business casual.
Perhaps I'm the only one, but I never knew that a "Deep State" really even existed, much less was an implied conspiracy united in "revenge". My previous idea was a group of dedicated people owning responsibility to their bureaux for the quality of their work; and, for the most part, doing it extremely well. Since this is the NYT, I stand corrected. There is a "Deep State [conspiracy]" bent on "revenge".
1
The president is not the only person in the US to distrust governmental institutions! Many Americans are now seeing firsthand how manipulative and manipulated the system is.
3
Hold me! I’m scared!
I hate the term Deep State. But in this battle of Deep State vs Shadow State, I am siding with career civil servants who obey the law of this country and not kneel in fealty to a corrupt President.
2
" Nameless, faceless and voiceless, the C.I.A. officer who first triggered..."
This is one of the innumerable reasons why yesterday's stunt from the brats (no other word fit to print fits) who occupy the GOP should so deeply alarm us. What if the whistleblower --who has been threatened with death by the sycophants and "president' himself-- had been in that room being interviewed and had had his or her cover blown?
The word "secure" means something. We have to waste time and brain cells discussing a "deep state" precisely because we allowed a malign group of actors to sow their unhinged narratives. We let them become all powerful and continue to refuse to check criminal behavior like yesterday's stunt.
Intimidating a witness is no light manner. It is, in fact, a crime, as is compromising the security of a safe room.
So the only question that matters this morning is this: When are those involved going to be censured or arrested? We are in the greatest crisis our nation has faced since the Civil War because we continue to refuse to uphold norms of behavior, rule of law, and the actual law. They continue to break important rules precisely because they've never been stopped at any of the checkpoints along the way. Forget inches; we give them miles, so they take the world.
Will the Sergeant at Arms be stationed at the door and instructed to call in the police from this point on? He'd better be. Obstructing a monumentally important investigation cannot stand.
4
I think the deep state is in Area 51.
1
On the one hand, there’s a great deal of evidence that trump abused his office. On the other hand, trump says it’s a witch hunt and that the deep state is out to get him. NYT: Lets go ahead and frame this as a personal battle between trump and “the deep state”.
2
There’s no need for NYT to use the term ‘Deep State’ just because Trump uses it, even if it’s qualified by single quotes. It normalizes a term which would have been unacceptable in 2015.
2
Oh God, not another battle of “good versus evil”. People’s morality gets as insufferably tedious and annoying to put up with as their egos.
1
There are, thank goodness, nameless gov employees who have basic integrity and want to follow the law, democratic norms and do the right thing. Not all of them, but most of them.
Simply put, they want to do their jobs the right way, at least honestly try.
This however is a battle between an ignorant, criminal egomaniac & his sycophants ... and the rule of law and the constitution.
In the end trump will lose, but the damage will take a long time to repair.
Thank goodness for the competent servants with integrity, something clearly foreign to trump and the repubs. Truly incomprehensible.
1
Can we not have headlines that suppose that such a ridiculous thing as a “deep state” exists?
2
Well, this is an accurate assertion: the "deep" state (I'm not sure what is actually deep, except privilege, entitlement and co-option) is indeed turning against the executive office, but the article casts the story in partisan, rather than constitutional and larger law bases. The president's instincts are savvy; however to say he merely "derided" State, for example, is not terribly informative: he rather sought--and seeks rightly--to challenge the practices, economics and culture of the institution, among others. A good chief executive, or leader, or "boss" if you prefer, always makes her organization feel a bit off-center, uncomfortable, and introspective. That is how you grow, adapt and succeed.
26
@Matt Andersson adapt to corruption and unlawfulness?
105
@Matt Andersson This would be true if Trump cared about any of what you give him credit for. He cares about one thing: his fragile ego. Every attack on deep state or any one else is only in service of that.
122
@Matt Andersson When the president selects incompetent "leadership" to head the departments of government, are we supposed to believe that people in those positions know a thing about "growth and success"?
111
As a retired Foreign Service Officer, I deplore the politicization of Trump’s State Department. I served under Ronald Reagan, George H.W. Bush, and Bill Clinton. I never could have pretended under those presidents that clear conflicts of interest (or the perception of them) would be tolerated. There was a rigorous wall between our official government actions and any political agenda. Yet, here we are. Tillerson was the most inefficient, inept Secretary in history, and Pompeo is compromised by blind allegiance to Donald Trump, the bully-in-chief, that reduces U.S. Foreign Policy to merely an extension of the Trump brand. Ukraine will turn out to be just one example of the politicization of the State Department. Many more are going to be revealed and the Foreign Service will have reduced itself to a shell of its former apolitical self.
303
@Michael V.
The difference is George W, Bush and Ronald Reagan, actually put the country before themselves.
Listen to Trump's words
" There will be Civil War if I am removed from office"
"If you don't re-elect me, they are guaranteed to take your guns".
Trump's whole career has shown , he is only in this Presidency for himself.
Me...Me...Me....
37
@Michael V.
I know a couple of people in State and they have all said similar things. The way life-time public servants have been treated since trump took office is stomach-turning. Some of these people served in Afghanistan and Iraq - these are not all cushy jobs. That right wing media and the Russians have us looking at these people with contempt boils my blood.
42
@Michael V.
"Pompeo is compromised by blind allegiance to Donald Trump, "
As long as the President acts within the Constitution, where should his allegiance be? With the idelogy he personally agree with. The Constitution vests all executive authority to the President's and subordinate members are the executive branch are to carry out his policies and plans.
When you served did you put your own objectives ahead of the President's the people elected? Above the laws our elected representatives wrote? If you were not elected like your role was to carry out the Constitutional objectives of those who were, not to impede them.
We have had so many deceptive and incredible leaks that in the end served to impede the effective this of those, "We the people", elected to represent us.
1
Reading the bios of the this story's authors is as illuminating as the story. I am very grateful The Times' writers bring this level of experience, history and intelligence to such a story. As long as Mr. Baker, Ms. Jakes, et al, keep reporting and writing, I feel like the Republic has a fighting chance in the years ahead. Thank you.
4
Mr Trump and his minions are now learning that the true definition of "deep state" is that our government in the United States is comprised "of the people" who are deeply courageous, deeply honorable, and deeply committed to the preservation of our state of representative democracy.
52
@RiverLily9: I think the US is in this mess because of the distortions of representation built into a system contorted to accommodate state by state liberty to enslave.
1
The idea of a "Deep State" exists not only in the federal government but in state and local governments, the private sector etc. for as long as such organizations existed. In this case, however, we have a president who is not only openly and brazenly corrupt but is so out of his depth and in so way over his head that he is a clear and present danger to our nation and the world at large. Finally, the constant use of the word "conservative" suggesting that Trump is engaged in an ideological battle with his opponents gives him a cloak of respectability and the opportunity to attack the Democrats and their current and former leaders both personally, socially and ideologically. Of course Trump's only ideology is the satisfaction of his own personal self interest. In short, having Donald Trump as President of the United States is like asking a house painter to repaint the Sistine Chapel.
24
@Elliott Jacobson
Good point about the use of the word conservative. The existential danger Trump presents has nothing to do with political ideology. It is about corruption, pure and simple.
2
You just called the establishment the deep state. Thank you. Many have felt that way for a long time.
7
Actually, they didn’t.
6
Trump has no moral compass and has spent his entire life engaging in activities that are unethical, immoral and often illegal. He’s been taught how to get away with such behavior, which is the only information he’s learned from others. A major aspect of that involves personal loyalty to him. This is incredibly important because he has no boundaries and does not believe that he should be held accountable for anything. When Trump speaks of "a deep state," he is referring to laws and regulations (boundaries) and those responsible for enacting, interpreting and enforcing those boundaries in a manner that limits him and holds him accountable.
33
One of the job requirements of a chief executive in any organization is to understand that there is (and will always be) bureaucratic inertia. Overcoming it is often the difference between success and failure. A skillful CEO uses deft maneuvering, persuasion, pressure, and even circumnavigation when appropriate.
An incompetent CEO ignores institutional history and competence, is intemperant and makes enemies in the wrong places, and does end-arounds with fellow incompetents that often end of dashed on the rocks.
Hence Mr. Trump's present difficulties.
18
What difficulties? Nothing has gone wrong for him. Nothing will. He could shoot someone
2
@Rachelle Lane
everyone knows, and people will say, they deserved it -- and it's fake news anyway :)
Sure, there are always long term staff that disagree with the current president and his directives, That goes back to the beginning of the republic, But refusal to implement policy or slowing the implementation down is subject to review,
The difference with Trump is that he actually is building his own private agency subject to no review but his own, nor subject to the knowledge of congress or the American people
This actual deep state or should I say parallel universe state makes every negotiation or relationship with foreign entities subject to the worst corruption and deception, And as in the case of Syria, always appeals to and appeases dictators or those tending in that direction, No accident Erdogan and Putin both felt that had received green lights from the US because the president privately made that possible.
What is more alarming is the very strong likelihood that other private phone conversations and help from Don's goons led to other tacit understandings that only HE knows about, Once he stated to reporters who asked about private deals he simply stated "None of your Business".,
That is what he believes in his delusional world,
Stay woke, America!
16
For this citizen, who watches the permanent "victim" drama of an elected official whose ego is far bigger than his brain , I am grateful for that "Deep State" of true PATRIOTS, who endeavor to keep us safe.
Knowledge is power and Mr. Trump does not read his briefing books and governs by his instincts, which are not ruled by anything but his own opinions and those that come from people quite capable of manipulating him to their will with flattery and false praise.
Governing is complicated work..Attending political rallies to cheering crowds is not.
He has proven what his preference are over the last, almost three years.
Thumbs up to those who will protect us first with steady regard for our Constitution and those who believe it matters more than ANY President.
"Deep State" to me means competent patriots. And give me competence over lies and needy drama every single day.
12
"The deep state"? Another way of putting it would be "our democratic institutions."
Thank goodness for these unelected, career bureaucrats.
19
We are a democracy. POTUS does not have 'Divine Right' to break the law. It is clearly stated that asking something of value from a foreign state to help in US election is illegal. Civil servants are bound by oath to report illegal behavior. It can be by the President no less. That distinguishes us from an autocracy. DJT is not a king,
11
It took Deep Throat to bring down Richard Nixon in the Watergate era, and it may well turn out to be Deep State that dethrones a sitting president in the Trump Tower era. But the truly satisfying irony here is that Donald Trump will have been done in by the thing he railed against the most: a "fake news" story.
5
This isn’t a “war with the deep state”. This is trump being held accountable for criminal behavior. He’s not waging war against a bureaucracy, he’s committing crimes against the American people
19
Remember, the "deep state" is NOT just the shadow government. It is the elected and shadow government PLUS organized crime. I don't care what Mike Lofgren and other former government officials say. They are just wrong. The term is Turkish in origin and it is important to be precise.
2
Don’t have an enemy to rally the base against? Create one. Don’t have a problem that you can solve? Create one. Who says Trump has no imagination?
8
What this article doesn't say explicitly is why Donald Trump doesn't trust the career officials of the State Department and the Intelligence Agencies. It is because they are patriotic Americans who have devoted their lives to serving our country, and can't be corrupted. This is why Trump circumvents the usual channels t conduct foreign policy one-on-one with heads of state: so there are few witnesses and no one to refuse to carry out corrupt or criminal orders. Trump's method is the method of mob bosses, not the method of leaders of democracies, and is why he prefers the most corrupt tyrants in the world like Vladimir Putin. Trump being concerned about corruption in Ukraine is laughable. Trump's only concern is whether Zelensky is corrupt enough to play ball, Trump-style.
12
What does Putin have on Trump?
2
What's the definition of Deep State? It's trumpian bannonified paranoid conspiracy theories cooked up in the melted mind of the president. To talk about only serves the trump.
The articles and conversation should be about the loyal federal employees doing their jobs, versus the greedy grifters, numbingly ill-informed suckups and destructive cabinet members who use trump's reign as a chance to grab, smash and devour the foundation of our country.
11
There is a huge difference between the imaginary deep state that people like Steve Bannon and Sebastian Gorka rave about and the career public servants who are bravely testifying. The Times does a public disservice by legitimizing that vernacular in this conversation, even parenthetically.
15
Puppeteer Putin realizes his Agent Traitor Trump's days as President are coming to a swift end.
Therefore, all the craziness that Trump is pursuing and implementing are at the behest of Putin.
Ukraine, Turkey, Kurds, NATO, etc, etc are all actions Putin has wanted accomplished for a very long time.
All that Trump does from here on out needs to be overlaid with the Question: "How does this action by Trump help Putin"
The truth should help set Trumpsters Free.
7
It's important to look at the sources of the deep state conspiracy and other conspiracies theories that have gained so much force and traction recently among right wing factions in our society.
One of the primary sources is loose cannon Steve Bannon. Mr Bannon, while running Brietbart brought many of these nutty ideas to the fore, helping to popularize them among the less stable members of the right. Brietbart itself was funded by the billionaire Mercer family, without whom none of it would have been possible.
Another source was Roger Ailes, the now deceased former head of Fox News. Roger was a believer in conspiracy theories, to the point that he had a sound proof safe room in his own home, paranoid that the Obama administration was spying on him. It's little wonder that Fox News has been engaged in spreading conspiracy theories when the leader of the organization itself was a true believer. Fox News is brought to us by another right wing billionaire family, the Murdochs.
Russian intelligence is the likely creator of many of the conspiracy theories, certainly the one that claims that Ukraine and not Russia was responsible for tampering with the 2016 US elections. Disinformation campaigns aimed at Western countries have been very effective in sowing discord and division in society and politics, turning out to be a sound investment for Russian intelligence.
7
Anyone not see this coming back to bite him? His lies have held up for a while, but eventually the some of the truth will come out. And when you throw in suspicious and unpopular actions such as releasing ISIS fighters, turning your back on your allies and supporting the policies of Russia and Iran, people are not so forgiving.
4
Wow. This article sounds like the NYTimes thinks Trump is the victim here, of a bureaucratic cadre of people who are, gasp, democracy minded and who prefer to uphold the law instead of violating it. In reality government employees are doing their best to mitigate the mud bath swamp Trump has created. How many people in his campaign and administration have pled guilty of, were found guilty of or have been indicted for crimes? Why is that data not included in this article? This article would seem to support the notion that poor Paul Manafort was treated unfairly when convicted of multiple crimes because he was a "good person" in Trump's opinion. This is the most corrupt and lawless administration in perhaps all history, the people trying to contain his destruction of our democracy deserve better than a Times article that seems to argue that they are somehow in the wrong.
4
This article depicts what I’ve found all along. Most of the testifiers are disgruntled bureaucrats who dislike(hate) trump for upsetting the diplomatic applecart. Trump, Crude, rude and erratic he is the president of the United States and his foreign policies are no worse, and some far better than his predecessors. The deep state is alive and well, as I’m sure the IG report will confirm.
6
These career government workers have in many cases been there for decades serving under Presidents both Democrat and Republican. They are professionals. for you to imply that after 30 or 40 years they've gone rogue because Trump is both ludicrous and an insult to the patriotic, brave professionals who have served our country. Trump has never served anyone but himself. Now though he is doing it at our expense rather than his workers, partners, and banks.
3
There was a Republican, what was his name? Lincoln or something. He sourced the comment "Government of the People, By the People, For the People". Maybe Moscow Mitch should mentor his party regarding its roots. Just saying.
1
Since the moment we inaugurated an obviously compromised President Trump, his consciousness of guilt has been driving each and every thing he utters, tweets, rage-tweets or does.
He has had every opportunity to reveal the truth about his relationship with Putin and the Russian hackers. He's had every opportunity to come clean about his tax filings, relationships with women, consensual or not, and his business dealings while in office.
He has chosen the Roy Cohn playbook, a cavalcade of lies and attempts at obfuscation and lawsuits. I have absolutely no pity for the man who has chosen this path while playing golf incessantly at taxpayer expense.
The truth, and the citizens of our great country are coming for him. The endgame is upon him.
7
President Zelensky readily agreed to President Trump’s request he look into alleged 2016 election interference and Hunter Biden’s dealings with Burisma during a July 25 phone call. The U.S. Justice Department investigated the conversation and determined “there was no campaign finance violation and that no further action was warranted.”
Earlier this week, Acting Ambassador Taylor testified that other diplomats told him that President Trump insisted that Zelensky make a public statement that he was “opening investigations of Biden and 2016 election interference” before agreeing to an Oval Office meeting with Zelensky. Taylor said Ambassador Sondland told him on September 8 that he talked to President Zelensky and told him that “although this is nor a quid pro quo, if President Zelensky did not ‘‘clear things’ up in public, we would be at a ‘stalemate.” Taylor said,”I understood a ‘stalemate’ to mean that Ukraine would no receive the much-needed military assistance.” Taylor said that Ambassador Sondland told him that Zelensky agreed to make public statement in an interview with CNN.
Since the president make an Oval Office meeting contingent on Zelensky’s agreement to make a public statement, most people would understand that Zelensky would have been denied an oval office meeting, not “much-needed military assistance, of he had refused.
Hopes that Congress will remove the president from office because he placed a condition on an Oval Office visit are delusional.
1
Actually, the Justice Department “declined to investigate,” that phone call at all. Not at all the same as investigating and clearing, any more than “I’m not sure I can go to court and convict Trump what I have,” is the same exonerating anybody.
I’ll skip the rest of “your,” tangle of facutal errors, half-truths, what-aboutisms, and accusations of TDS. Thing is, your boy’s almost certainly gonna get impeached, whatever little stunts you lot pull.
and if I were you, I wouldn’t bank on him beating the rap. Your guy’s a considerable loud-mouthed fool, you know.
Why is NYT helping Trump's false narrative? Trump is shredding the constitution and all the norms. Trump loyalists don't see it that way. For them this is all unfair collusion between "Deep State" and "Democrats" trying to bring down a democratically elected president. This is a carefully crafted message that Trump is feeding his base. Why is NYT feeding that narrative by calling this a Trump vs. Deep State battle? The battle is between democratic norms vs lawlessness. What Trump calls Deep State is all the institutions and norms that are entrusted by constitution to protect itself from this lawless president.
8
Mr. Trump brays, "I think with the destruction of the deep state, certainly I've done big damage . . . But I think it'll be one of my great achievements." What codswallop! There are no "great achievements," and there is no "deep state." What there is is the sound of increasingly desperate cries from a malignant narcissist as the quicksand gradually swallows him. It's happening, and it isn't simply payback. It's the system curing itself of a tumor.
3
The problem with Trumpism is that it is more than Trump himself.
Trump is the head of the snake. The body of the snake are the Republican Congress and unscrupulous media personalities.
2
Let us say this article is a reasonably accurate recounting of the current situation and the President’s mind set, supported by some facts. If that’s so, what portrait of the President does it paint? Does he come off as a reasonable person or does he sound delusional and insane? This is not the only telling of this sorry tale; President Trump himself adds a chapter every few hours- in fact, in almost his every public utterance and paranoid tweet. It is time to take a deep national breath and face the situation: we have wound up with an unbalanced lunatic in the White House and it is time to remove him from office under Article 25. Trump is a clear and ever present national danger. We would all be much better off without him than with him. Except Putin.
5
This article is careless in its use of the term “Deep State”. Career public servants deserve better.
4
Nobody could have predicted! He really isn't that bright.
1
Testifiers 60 seconds of Fame and a book deal! The new American way!
3
What a silly article! We, the citizens of this country, do not need to have a prominent member of the medial fostering the notion that the public servants of this country are engaged in warfare with the president of the United States.
1
POTUS has been unethical, unprofessional, unqualified and undignified from the minute to took office. Donald Trump has been an unmitigated disaster and a traitor to the country and the oath of office. November 2020 can’t come soon enough.
5
Another Trump-abetting headline. Trump’s lawlessness, rotten abuse of power and shameful lies have turned against him. Not a maverick ‘war against the deep state’.
4
Inside his abused subconscious, Trump is desperately afraid he's not wonderful and powerful, or good enough for his daddy's praise.
He cannot bear criticism of any sort, even constructive. To save face, he must destroy anyone who challenges that truth. He is a true sociopath.
8
If this ex- employers love our Country they should now speak up and tell the American people what's really going on with this fake President in the WH.
We need to know how incompetent he really is.
Speak up.
1
"Election has consequences," some political sage once observed, but only for the political establishment, it seems. Unless you are a sycophant of the U.S. Chamber of Crypto-Fascist, Crony-Commerce winning the presidency, the deep-state rules.
2
I really with the NYT would not legitimize use of the term "deep state" in their news articles.
5
Trump "cut and ran" in Syria, with disastrous effect. He wants to "cut and run" in Ukraine so Rudi can make a buck. Had Dems done this there would be no end to the GOP screaming "traitor". So where DO you stand on traitors, GOP? With them or impeaching them? We already know who the "Real Americans" are: what conservatives call the "Deep State", upholding their oaths to the Constitution, testifying to the criminal acts of a criminal administration and it's traitorous president. We also know who the traitors are: anyone with an "R" after their name.
2
Witches, Witches, everywhere.
The “Deep State” is Trump’s “Deep Throat.”
2
The Times should not adopt the assumptions and rhetoric of the right wing. “Deep state” is an ideologically weighted term. The motivation of federal employees should not be denigrated as petty resentment and wounded pride. The motives for resistance to political manipulation will vary among individuals, of course, but the common thread is a desire for government agencies to function honestly, consistently and responsibly.
13
Exactly: don’t use rhetorical terms selected by your opposition, or you cede the argument.
2
The founders built separation of powers into the structure of our government, based on the idea that competing interests among the three branches would work to restrain overreach by any one of them. The legislative branch didn't acquit itself very well until after the 2018 midterm elections gave Democrats a majority in the House, but the federal court system has presented active opposition to specific Trump policies since the Muslim ban enacted shortly after his election.
Most interesting perhaps is the opposition to Trump polices within the executive branch--the FBI, CIA, State Department, and all the other federal agencies are of course directly under Trump's leadership, yet whistle blowers and others have taken career-ending risks to oppose illegal and immoral executive branch policies. Like the existence of political parties, this is a feature of our government that the founders did not anticipate, but which may in fact save the republic.
8
I understand that for the most part our institutions are guided by first, the law, and second by rules and regulations that exist within each of their organizations, and then perhaps, finally by the implicit understandings about how things are done. If a president, now or in the future, doesn't like the law or the rules they have an obligation to try and change them, not just eviscerate the organization or try and bypass them. So Donald J. Trump, if you happen to survive your impeachment, get used to it.
The Times should not adopt the language and assumptions of right-wing radicals. “Deep state” is an ideologically weighted term. The motivation of federal employees, loyal to the country, should not be distorted into a shallow defense of turf or reputation, resentment or wounded pride. Motives for resistance to political manipulation must vary among individuals, of course, but the common thread is a desire for government agencies to carry out their missions honestly, consistently and responsibly.
11
It's a good example of self fulfilling prophecy.
Call someone the enemy repeatedly enough for long enough and they start developing a grudge... Go figure, it seems beyond the comprehension of our stable genius.
The deep state I worry about is not the bureaucrats. They have power but not that much power, if they did they would have done a better job at protecting themselves from this kind of abuse and they would have better pay.
However, I am worry about the lobbyist pushing stack of papers in front of legislators for them to turn into law. Lets call that "shadow" state. That is why we still do not have universal healthcare as any other rich country (in per capita GDP), that is why we do spend more money on defence that any other country, that is why our immigration system ran more like a means to keep some people as cheap labor rather than integrating them with some dignity, lets not forget oil addiction and utter lack of efficient public transportation in large area of the country.
The swamp is clearly winning, but they know they are being exposed and the gig may be running out hence the creasy tax cut. [saved about 10k in taxes, still I know it is wrong].
12
Amazing how Republicans, who use "weak on communism" and "naive on foreign policy" as a constant duffel against Democrats, have sat by idly while Trump personally turns the free world over to Russia, policy by traitorous policy. It is clear now that he has been working for Putin from the beginning, from the hiring of Manafort and the change in the GOP platform about Ukraine BEFORE the election to hiring Giuliani and his cabal of Russian oligarchs. Every foreign policy decision he has made benefits Putin. Had Obama turned Syria and Ukraine over to the Russians every lying hypocritical Republican in the country would be calling for his head, literally. Now the lying hypocrites, lead by Lindsey Graham, defend their "soft on communism" president. The GOP used to claim it was in favor of strong US foreign policy. They told us Russia was still our greatest threat in the world scene. Now they let Russia hack our elections, invade Ukraine, annex Syria, and poison social media with impunity. Every member of the GOP is a lying hypocrite. They must all be removed from office before Putin is our President-for-life.
17
This doesn't sound like an impeachment. It sounds like a vendetta.
9
Wait for the results of the impeachment investigation. Then you can proudly proclaim all but Trump to be fake.
2
Sure, in the same way jail would be a vendetta for a crime.
5
@rcrigazio
Then you obviously don't know what an impeachment "sounds like," not to mention that this isn't an impeachment, it's an impeachment inquiry. The Senate has to vote in order for the actual impeachment to begin. It's not a "vendetta"; it's gathering evidence in order to build a case, which, by the way, is standard legal procedure.
I've lived through two impeachments - what the House committees are doing is standard procedure and outlined in the Constitution. Republicans did the same thing with Clinton in 1998. Just because you don't like it now doesn't make it not so.
6
Trump has problems with the deep state alright. He's in a deep state of doo-doo.
Trump's (short) transcript evidenced his violation of election law (USC 52 32101). Even though not a legal requirement, Chief of Staff Mulvaney admitted Trump's quid pro quo of withholding Congressional issued military aid. William Taylor corroborated all of it under oath in his testimony.
Game. Set. Impeachment.
Additional pressure is likely from House subpeona's, witness testimony coming PLUS a federal judge ordered the full Zelensky phone call transcript released within 30 days.
Expect the president to run away this weekend to one of his properties to play his 105th day of golf in less than three years. Speaking of resorts, Trump's flagrant attempt to violate the Emoluments Clause by hosting the G-7 at his Doral facility could have been an article of impeachment. Considering the 2nd District federal appeals court is revisiting a lower court set aside ruling of Emolument Clause violation, maybe that Constitutional violation will become another article of impeachment?
Trump's impeachment defense is falling apart faster than fast food is eaten in the Oval Office. We The People can't wait for this tyrant to be removed from office. The World is also eager for that outcome, except of course Putin and other dictators who've manipulated Trump.
10
" If Mr Trump is impeached ...it will be... because of some of the same career professionals he has derided...".
Really? One would have thought that he would be impeached because of the crimes and treason he has committed. This is not a personal matter between two groups, it is merely the justice system catching and locking up traitors and criminals. To characterize it as career people against him just plays into his laughable assertions that they are out to get him, which is absurd!
16
Just because the average working career diplomat is not a shallow, narcissistic blowhard doesn’t mean they are acting outside the bounds of our hard won, precious and yes, fragile constitutional democracy. That dishonor belongs to Trump and and his deep and deeply corrupt cronies.
8
thank goodness for civil servants.
9
@ak, to think that it was only just yesterday that those same working for ICE were baby snatching public enemy #1 throwing women and children in cages. It’s amazing how our own personal political perspective changes everything.
Kudos to the New York Times for confirming, at long last, not only the existence of the Deep State but providing a glowing defense of those trying to overturn an election for their own base purposes. Perfect time to stumble ahead of the damning IG report.
7
Deep State, AKA loyalty to the Constitution and the Oath thereto, above loyalty to a corrupt “Stable Genius.”
@Susan
We share a concern about the Deep State. The Deep State under DJT that we need to be investigating is made up of the Russian and Ukrainian oligarchs (who financed Manafort, Bannon, probably Trump himself), Putin. Then there’s the cabal of billionaires behind DJT: the Mercers, Kochs, Adelson, Murdoch, DeVos, Wilbur Ross, and then there’s the shadow deep state foreign policy gang led by Giuliani. Then we can move on to investigating the corruption of high level Trump officials such as Elaine Chao....
Most of us who have ever worked with The United States of America as our employer have not taken lightly the oath we swore to as a condition of our employment. I believe that I am in very good company with the notion of this being sacred. What is so blatantly profane is the leader at the top who has an oath only to himself and The Constitution be damned.
11
Dems can impeach all they want. President Trump will win in the Senate. Republicans hold 53 Senate seats. Democrats hold 47. Dems once again are pursuing a course of action that will ultimately fail. The Democratic Party continues to waste the nation’s time and resources. Meanwhile more and more centrist Democrats quietly plan to vote for President Trump on November 3, 2020.
5
@John Murray - and just wait for the payback. when the dems win the presidency the bleating by them and the MSM will be deafening!!! It's deja vu all over again with dems...
McConnel pulled a "Merick" but it was Biden and Schumer who conceived it.
McConnel got rid of the 60 vote minimum for SC, but it was Reid who came up with the idea.
The dems always touch the third rail, then just cry and cry about it, when it comes back to bite them.
1
A word on Craft, former US ambassador to Canada. Her husband is a coal baron that financed the Republican party and Trump.
She has no known other qualifications to become the representative of an important country. She flew in and out of Ottawa 128 times, she was absent for more than half the time.
For her great work, she was appointed US ambassador to the United Nations.
3
There was never any need for the Democrats to rely on "nameless, faceless" CIA agents and other witnesses testifying behind closed doors in order to impeach Donald Trump. The evidence for his massive self-dealing and conflicts of interest, which dwarf that of any other President and are of a magnitude the Founding Fathers could have never imagined, are all right out in the open like ripe low-hanging fruit waiting to be picked. Open hearings testimony could have fleshed out those crimes and greatly turned up the political heat on Republicans trying to depict such naked corruption as business as usual.
The charges the Democrats have chosen to highlight, however, are cloaked in secrecy, dependant upon Adam Schiff's spin and the testimony of the very "deep state" operatives that Democrats themselves have historically warned against. Instead of building consensus, this strategy only divides, makes actual conviction and removal from office even more unlikely and, if anything, bolsters Trump's re-election prospects. It would be a bitter irony if Democrats, in their zeal to establish a narrative that 2016 was merely an aberration caused by foreign interference rather than by trends decades in the making, instead ensures Trump's second term.
3
We’ll take our chances on Trump not surviving. As for secrecy in this investigation there is ample precedent for it at this “Grand Jury” stage. Nixon and Clinton had this phase completed in secret by outside special prosecutors, with the evidence then turned over to congress. Gowdey had the same closed session with his lengthy Benghazi investigation, even threw a Republican congressman not entitled to be present out on his ear. Those who have a burning desire to cross examine, to refute the evidence will be able to scrutinize transcripts of the recent testimonies by witnesses, perhaps will even hear some pre-trial public testimonies. And the real Republican day in court will come in the senate trial provided MCConnell permits it to last more than five minutes before the vote is taken.
When I was growing up, I was told what made our country different and better than other lands was that America was a Democracy--that, as my immigrant mother would proudly put it, "here the people are the boss!" . . . . But now Republicans celebrate the 18th century, anti-democratic Electoral College (which gave power to candidates rejected by the voters, Bush and Trump)-- while Democrats openly advocate that the bureaucrats who run the government should secretly subvert the orders of the elected President and, instead, answer to a secret elite of CIA spies and military . . . . It is truly shocking how both capitalist parties have openly abandoned democracy. But there is one real hope. Young voters are beginning to understand that genuine popular rule must include economic democracy, that is, Socialism.
I wish you hadn’t phrased it this way. It is not the ‘deep state’: it is what is required for a government to run. And thank goodness there are still so many people who understand right and wrong and care about what is the right thing to do.
6
More years ago than I care to remember I had the privilege of taking a college course called "Political Change and Political Order" taught by the great (conservative) professor Samuel Huntington. At this fairly early in his distinguished career he had developed criteria for evaluating the maturity and stability of the governments of nation-states. The main measure was what he called "institutionalism"-the process by which leaders acquired leadership, made decisions, had their decisions respected and carried out, and ceded power in due course in accordance with long-established customs and precedents that were universally embraced and respected by the citizenry. These were the criteria that separated the developed world from the world of tin-pot dictators.
President Trump's so-called war against the so-called Deep State strikes at the very heart of this learning. He envies tin-pot dictators; he sees no reason why he himself should not be one; those who resist his whims are the sworn enemy. There is no limit to the danger he can inflict unless his enablers acknowledge and start to deal with this. I'm not talking about the 40% of Tea Party voters. They have always been with us and always will be. I'm talking about Lindsay Graham and Pence and the Chief Justice and their ilk. And where's Colin Powell when we again need him? Far from being traitors, those coming forward are the true Americans.
6
I seems to me that had this remained secret and Ukraine actually did open an investigation against Biden, wouldn’t it seem very odd and suspicious that a foreign Goverment opens an investigation four years after the fact and potentially upsetting powerful people for no good reason?
President Trump, Rudy and others never thought this through in my opinion. Where else are they using such poor judgement?
3
Those folks are not "coming out of the shadows." Most of them are sworn federal officers walking in the noon day sun. And they are not engaged in "payback." They are doing the work they are sworn to do.
I know opinion writers need color to pop their stories, but let's describe these professionals in the proper framework -- people who know what they're doing, doing it.
9
It's most likly a topic highlighted in comments already, but I always get a kick out of Trump's description of the "deep state"; career diplomats and unelected officials, which to me describes Giulinani, Sondland, Pompeo, Barr, Miller etc, working in concert for Trumps personal interests only and against the national interest and security, perfectly. I wish the MM would point this out to the public. Even more amusing is when the engage in this rhetoric themselves.
3
There is no "Deep State" what we have are Americans who take their oath of office and loyalty to the constitution and laws seriously.
Trump comes from, and believes he is still in, a world of personal loyalties the surpass all other loyalties. He spoke the words at his inauguration but I doubt that he really meant them. They are just words after all. Trump's primary loyalty is to himself. Such is the way of the sociopath.
His huge problem is that the combined weight of his actions are pulling him ever closer to a charge of "giving aid an comfort to the enemy."
The core problem though is more dangerous, people who accept the idea that a single person can do whatever he wants simply because he is president and therefore untouchable. Yes, some Republicans follow the team effort but the vast majority of We-the-People take our loyalty to country more seriously than Trump can consider comfortable.
Those of us who served in the military learned about the duty to respond to an illegal order by saying: "Sir, no sir!" and reporting the infractions to the proper authorities. A lesson that Trump doesn't understand or respect.
Trump continues to kow-tow to those who would see the USA crumble in exchange for something he thinks is more important - probably himself.
5
Strange how DT sees the world. He projects his weird reality. The Deep State is DT, undermining our great country. The only thing that will preserve our nation is speaking the truth, as the diplomats and generals are doing. They're courageous and patriotic.
5
We have met the enemy, and they are the senate.
Our government was wisely designed with 3 branches to check and balance each other to prevent the rise of a monarch who could, without oversight, shoot someone on 5th Avenue or pollute our waters or personally profit from being king, at the expense of his subjects' taxes.
The 3rd branch is refusing to provide oversight. They should all be held to account.
7
Holistically, Trump's ironclad solipsism negates the very notion of public service.
And yet, he is our public servant-in-chief.
Accordingly, any act of actual public service -- to betray or disrupt Trump's mandate -- is somehow an act against the public.
It's "I am Spartacus!" through a broken mirror. Or, really, in Trump's mind, "NO! NO! I AM Spartacus!"
Consequently, I hope, Taylor's testimony (et al.) is a reason for hope, or a hope for reason.
Remember hope?
3
If Mr. Trump is impeached, it will be because of his behaviors and actions, his disregard for the rule of law, and his belief that rules don't apply to him; it won't be just because people who happen to be trained and dedicated career civil servants who witnessed those actions are testifying. The true cause of this situation is decisions and unlawful actions by POTUS himself.
5
First, I wish to state that I did not vote for Donnie in 2016 or believe a word he says. I will not vote for him in 2020 either.
With that said, I enjoyed the article until the last "vein of thought"! I am extremely worried about the dismantling of our alliance with the world. But, I don't think it is correct for State Dept. people, the Pentagon, etc to run an end around POTUS
If our citizens don't like the way our country is being run, let your Congressperson know! It is time to curtail POTUS's power through proper channels. Not backstabbing & subversion. They are no better than he
3
Truth is the enemy of Trump and his Administration. That has been true his entire life. Looks like it’s true of many Republican legislators as well.
Trump said they HAD to stand up for him. So, like sheep, they lined up to disrupt legal Congressman committee investigations. Who do they work for?
BTW Republicans in those committees WERE in the room and able to ask as many questions as Democrats. That’s how it works and the Trump-shills know that.
2
There is no doubt he will be impeached, removed? well thats a different story. You cannot get away with deriding people forever, they will turn on you at some point. Saw this time and time again in the corporate world when people turned against their bosses and the boss was gone.
1
Are Trump and his minions honestly oblivious to the plain and simple fact that it was the so called Deep State that put Trump in the WH? Hard to believe that Trump has yet to award James Comey with the Medal of Freedom - because he doesn't win in 2016 without Comey's help.
2
People who know the difference between truth and lies are exposing Mr Trump's paranoia. Those who rush to defend him, such as those who stormed the impeachment hearings, may feel safe by staying on the side of a dictator. But they had better think again, because any of them are likely to be trashed next.
Bravo to all those who participate in this inquiry and bring back truth.
Perhaps we are starting to see that "the system works" given enough time.
Once this man is impeached or voted out of office there will be much work to do to reverse his many odious dictates.
Maybe we need to limit presidential power now that we know the danger of another such person holding that office!
Thanks to trump we're getting the government the GOP hates but wants.
Finally, the people's state fights back against the Pearl Harbor style attack on our democracy in 2016. Ironic that civil servants turn out to be an additional check on all branches of our government.
Republicans have a long history of hating our government yet do everything to make it worse, thereby validating their hatred to their base. We're seeing the depravity they're willing to go to inflict dysfunction and pro-corruption on our government and institutions. Frankly, had Americans not voted the Democrats back into control of the House we'd all be doomed - especially citizen-public-servants and our military turned into a mercenary force for tyrants. I'll take a deep state defending the Constitution over a deeply corrupted state infested with klepto-elites and foreign dark money with astronomical giveaways of society's wealth to the richest at the top.
Like all criminals, they hate doing the time when caught and really hate law enforcement for interfering with their criminal activities - hence the GOP behavior.
The GOP willfully decimated our counter-intelligence capabilities leaving us unprotected for GOP-Russian nefariousness in 2020. They're even perverted our DOJ into a crime enabling institution for Republicans. That's why the People's reps in the House have to take on that job to investigate and enforce our laws defending us from the Deep Corruption & Crimes inflicted on our nation by the GOP.
1
The actual "deep state" consists of GOP legislators and their enablers who put partisan advantage over everything else. Their actions include refusing to allow a properly elected president to fill a vacancy on the Supreme Court because they don't like his party affiliation, ignoring gross violations of the constitution by another president because they like his affiliation, and pandering to racist demagoguery ever since the inception of the "Southern Strategy" in an effort to get votes.
1
Junior high school politics look better than whatever the paranoid scofflaws in the Trump administration are doing to suppress intelligent back and forth. GOP just don’t like our government or democracy and chafe under rule of law and separation of powers. They will thrive in Russia, it seems.
1
All cultures evolve, and American culture is no exception.
Conservative Republicans have always tried, unsuccessfully, to halt the advance of America.
If it were up to Republicans, there would be no child labor laws.
What the Alt Right calls the Deep State is simply the current American culture, and the Republicans refuse to deal with it.
3
What deep state ?
Federal employees are in the main good Americans doing their best to serve their employer , the American people.
My limited experience is that Federal employees go out of their way to avoid any sign of impropriety to the extent of refusing a free soft drink.
Trumps conspiracy theories are destructive to our Country , our lasting values. As are his lies.
Sadly many Americans cheer his every word, question nothing , even building a wall to protect Colorado from NewMexico.
This on the same day as Republicans stormed the Impeachment hearings. What thugs, what a terrible example to our kids.
How low can this Country go
3
All it takes is one hero to expose a fraud.
3
Donald Trump's opposition to the so-called "deep state" owes nothing to any kind of small government philosophy or a serious commitment to hare-brained conspiracy theories.
Increasingly, we're seeing that he's nothing but a cheap crook who doesn't want to get caught in the act.
1
Republicans can rail against the so called 'deep state' all they want. As far as I am concerned the damage to our country's credibility, rule of law, and world standing has been irreparably damaged by Trumps 'creep state' cronies.
3
There's a difference between a career politician, and a "Professional", as you mention. Career politicians are very skilled at lying, blowing smoke up you, "Professionals" don't need to lie to you, they just do a good job. I'll take a Pro any day over a politician.
2
Whether or not they dislike Trump does not change the facts. The man is corrupt.
3
Congress and Supreme Court are a checks on President...NOT CIA, FBI and all other agencies...they are executive branch an should be under direct supervision of a President...i.e. working for him...they are not independent...they are administration...and the President should feel free to fire anybody he does not like...and then...if Congress considers that wrong...they can move to impeach the President...it can't be other way around...btw I have no sympathy for CIA/FBI long time employees who feel they can change the will of american people any time they want (regardless what I think of current president, he was elected)...and as an MD I know for sure that Doctors are getting fired on regular basis if they disagree with hospitals/ management policies...
2
Being thoughtful for the sake of decisions to foster the good often demands critical assessment and, given sad experience, being suspicious of ill intent in order to deny naïveté goes with this. Being paranoid is not the same as this. Nor is using this to justify a context that serves one’s vested, self-serving interests. Trump is clearly wrapped up in one of these last two categories, ie, either mentally sick or a lying scoundrel. It’s about that simple.
11
@wak
He's both.
They should all be given awards for their bravery and patriotism. After we dismantle this regime, we MUST pay closer attention to corruption, from both the Republicrooks
AND Democrats. The press should do some deep self-reflection and be the integral part of this effort that it is their responsibility to be.
12
Unless the constant flood of right-wing propaganda media is drastically countered, the fear- and conspiracy-driven support for the Republican party that they generate will only bring more demagogues. The U.S. House is already full of them, in the person of Jim Jordan and his ilk. To people who get their opinions and "facts" from Fox, Limbaugh and the wacko Web, such people look and sound righteous. What a way to make your billions ...
14
The nervousness is showing.
Trump is delusional, we are told.
He could not possibly have been targeted by corrupt politicians, corrupt unelected bureaucrats in high positions and their minions, and a corrupt media all at the same time, as they attempted to rig an election and attempt a coup, could he have been?
Both before and after his election?
Surely, we must not believe such a thing.
He must be removed before he asks too many questions.
Yet, the questions are already being asked.
And the American people will be outraged at the answers.
Secret hearings with hand picked witnesses representing one opinion where one side controls the questions and the transcripts and what is leaked to the media are a desperate attempt to prevent the inevitable.
Democrats are in for a rough ride and what we learn about how politicians of both parties corrupt the system to enrich themselves and their friends will shock us.
4
Trump is a pathological liar, and projects his motives onto whoever opposes him. The “Deep State” is a Trumpian projection, a Tory aristocracy/theocracy that wants to take the USA back to 1775, when the king and his lords and priests were the law of the land. That’s why we had 1776, the Declaration of Independence, and the Constitution, to ensure government “by, for, and of the People”!
6
@Robert M. Koretsky: But the US really has government by the states and corporations.
Tsun Tsu says ‘know your enemy’. The Democrats failed to read their enemy, the common people who hates and distrusts the government, who is sure there is a Deep State that controls their lives.
By working so hard to impeaching him, the Democrats walked themselves right into the sight of the sniper, then sat down to have lunch.
Is there a deep state, a collection of rich folk who tell politicians what to do and the politicos who do as told? ? Probably yes.
But true or not Trump has been saying for years that he is rebelling against such a Deep State who hates regular folk. Now he will go to every rally and show the Democrats doing these actions as proof of his words. He will tell to any one who will listen that this is the Deep State trying to take out the people’s guy, and the Democrats are their patsies.
And they will even more solidly run to his side, with even more campaign money to his coffers.
Democrats have gifted him re-election. How did you guys blow this turkey shot?
2
@AutumnLeaf: The enemy is the most profound ignorance prevailing in an ostensibly modern nation.
It is wrong to call these people the deep state. They should be called Patriots and Trump a traitor.
10
“Deep State” is what malicious characters call healthy institutional ballast. And when those characters go further and attack those institutions for venal purposes, a sort of institutional immune system kicks in to fight the invading germs. Everything about trump*s own Derp State mirrors a terrible infection of our government. Hopefully the fever is about to break.
9
@Mike Pod
One of the stranger manifestations of so-called Trump "resistance" is the spectacle of Democrats defending the FBI, CIA and the rest of intelligence community as if they were created by the Constitution to protect our democracy! The Constitution doesn't mention them! The FBI has been a politicized agency that has lied to the American people since its very creation; as early as 1908, it was accused by members of Congress of becoming a secret police in its zeal to monitor and round up anarchists. More recently, it was heavily involved in the McCarthyite red scare of the 1950's, and operated its COINTELPRO program in the '60's and '70's aimed at surveilling, infiltrating, discrediting, and disrupting domestic political organizations, often in blatant violation of the Constitution. The examples of the CIA's overthrow of foreign governments and spying on domestic citizens are far too numerous to recount here. The full extent of the NSA's surveillance of domestic phone calls is only starting to be revealed. These institutions don't "protect" democracy; they are antithetical to the very notion of democracy and government by the people. That Trump is a bad actor is beyond all argument, but the precedents we are setting now can be easily used against a Democratic President in the future, or ahgainst any President these agencies perceive as blocking their own agendas of expansion abroad and manufactured consent at home.
1
The “anonymous” can’t put his/her name on his/her works?
5
You have plenty of people with names testifying right now.
2
He or she will. Be patient.
1
“turns against him”. That sounds similar to what gleeful Dems were saying about two weeks before the election. Editorial writers have short memories.
2
What are the ends of a particular "deep state"? Some "deep states" are devoted to opacity, violation of the Constitution, amoral power, and the Daddy transferences of their followers. Others are devoted to transparency, upholding the Constitution, moral accountability, and the welfare of the nation.
Only a sophist or a fool throws around a term like "deep state" without specifying its meaning.
5
Excellent point. Equally frustrating is the use of the term “socialists” to describe anyone who supports government programs that help the needy. This is even more dangerous as it suggests a radical make over of our society. No candidate of any consequence is advocating that.
2
@Andrew
The notion that the FBI, CIA, NSA and other national security agencies have been a government unto themselves, at odds more often than not with the one elected by us, is hardly the invention of hard core Trumpists and conspiracy theorists -- both Democrats and Republicans have warned about them since at least the end of World War II. In his 1964 best-selling book “The Invisible Government,” written with journalist Thomas B. Ross, the late David Wise wrote about the excesses of intelligence agencies, including the CIA and its role in orchestrated coups in Iran and Guatemala in the 1950s. “We felt very strongly that there were two governments in the United States: one in the civics texts and the other in the real world,” Mr. Wise told the Times in 1988. “We thought the intelligence agencies were important to our security. But we were troubled about a system based on the consent of the governed when the governed didn’t know to what they have consented.”
Democrats today, by asserting that we should accept at face value the assessments of the intelligence community with no proof, as if they were created by the Constitution to protect our democracy, are being hypocritical and cynical in the extreme for short term partisan gain and to protect their left flank from progressives who are calling them on their myriad failures that made a President Trump possible.
3
Can a surgeon who hates surgery operate?
Can a teacher who hates education teach?
Can a POTUS who hates government govern?
13
So trump only wants people in the government who are loyal to him and only him, none of that silly nonsense about loyalty to one country! God help us all including his supporters!
2
Setting up conflict between "the people" and the government that serves them is the truest mark of fascism.
7
The idea of a deep state is a paranoid superstition. There is no deep state. The dehumanisation of anybody on the left is real (though). People on the left are still people; they are still Americans. It is with great respect, a kind of only in America anti-left bigotry. The socialist boogeyman... blah blah yet they don't mind Sideshow Donald being in love with another paranoid Autocrat on the extreme left.
Moderate socialism is nothing to be afraid of. What are you afraid of? Everybody getting health care? Come on. You can afford it. Every other industrialised country affords it. There really is an American bubble- I love you guys but you are really ethnocentric in a funny way. But then so are we over here. Your insurance companies are plundering your pockets; it would be better run by the government who would not be profiteering from your ailments.
7
Career diplomats and the like who have worked for many administrations have probably had to implement policies that they personally did not approve of many times. That is why they were career people - they implement policy - not make it.
The current round of career people who have resigned or come forward to testify are not saying they disagree with what is happening in the Trump cabal - they are saying it is unlawful.
There is a huge difference.
15
Standing up for the Constitution is a huge difference from Trump and his appointees, who violate the Constitution daily for their own gain. How can claimed conservatives not see the conservatism in that?
1
I was a member of the Federal Senior Executive Service in the 1980s and 1990s. One of the most memorable events during that time was when George H.W. Bush invited the career SES members to a meeting at Constitution Hall. At the meeting, he shared his appreciation for the work we all did, and really did a marvelous job of convincing us that we were part of the same team serving the American people. Trump's disdain for the career civil service just reinforces what we all know about his lack of experience and aptitude to lead the federal government. Without the civil service, the government does not work. This is illustrated on many occasions when Trump rolls out his ideas without consultation with those who do the work. The lack of planning and coordination has doomed many of his initiatives. His leadership skills earn a solid F.
13
“Deep State” - people who have committed themselves to a life of low non-union but relatively secure jobs, exchanging profits for their dedication to serving the people of the US.
Especially those who believe patriotic service does not necessarily mean carrying guns.
Everybody from spymasters to secretaries, people who predict the weather and others who clean up the damage.
The people who make our government work efficiently, better work and lower costs than private for-profit businesses which must make a profit by cutting corners or overcharging us all.
9
There is no Deep State. Only "The State." The State is a workforce of employees paid by our tax money. They are loyal to our country, and to our laws. We expect them to report bad behavior by ANY of our elected officials, as well as the misuse of our tax money. Of course, "The State" runs "deep." Thank Goodness!
8
Turns out the "deep state" is career government employees who believe in the importance of doing their jobs, because they know what public service means.
13
A democracy is as functional and productive as its people are. The veracity of laws and a book called constitution is only as good as people who are making it (politicians), interpret it (judiciary), and enforce it (executive branch officials). There seems to be a systematic effort to undermine all of these branches for sometime now, notably since Reagan era, which ultimately culminated into Trump Presidency.
Veracity of truth and logic were distorted to suit personal religious superstitions and/or financial interest.
Gradually American foreign policy became subservient to American corporate interest which basically translates into personal financial interest of a tiny section of rich elites, that include people like Trump. That rotting effort actually started with our education system to breed blind loyalty (political, religious, & corporate) and to supply cheaper, more obedient servants for our corporate elites
We need to encourage young students & professionals from science & technology, who generally have a better perception about scientifically/factually valid reality or truth, and less influenced by religious superstitions to opt for public service in any of those 3 branches of the Govt., besides attracting quality people from the minorities.
In fact, Trump presidency helped tremendously to provoke many such people, e.g. career scientists and minorities, to join politics. Few to take up public service in Executive branch even in this challenging situation.
3
"The impeachment inquiry is in some ways the culmination of a battle between the president and the government institutions he distrusted and disparaged."
Huh, funny how that works sometimes.
3
It is not always easy to tell the plain truth. Trump is so much hated not only by democrats, but also many republicans because of one major factor: He has not been a politician. If a business man like him can serve as a good president, why do we need politicians? Trump is doomed to be fiercely attacked by all politicians with little qualification to be anything else. From the way he is so much smeared by the mean stream media you can see how people in the MMS are commanded to do so. Sorry I have little respect to people who have to bark at the will of their boss. On the other hand if AOC can be a congress woman, what qualification do we need to be a politician? She does not even understand elementary school math, and as a student majoring international relations at Boston University, she did not even know the relationship between Israel and Palestine.
4
AOC is in Congress for the exact same reason Trump is in the White House. People VOTED for them. Of course, in the Trump’s case the majority did NOT vote for him.
But he’s President and he performs that job the same way as he performed as businessman - very poorly. Five bankruptcies are not the sign of a good businessman. He’s a conman and he’s brought those skills to the White House.
I grew up when people viewed public service as an honorable career while America emerged from WW II. Joseph McCarthy and Roy Cohen built careers on deceit and hatred of the public enterprise. Reagan rode into the governorship to codify segregation in California, so only white people would get stuck in Lodi again. Reagan furthered the myth that government was the problem not the solution, as though health insurers wanted geezers and Americans wanted to sell off public power, parks, roads, schools, and hospitals. Trump ran to drain the swamp, and like the charlatan he's always been, hoodwinked his supporters, while he dismantles the administrative state that's helped create one of the most vibrant civilizations in modern history.
6
In other recent news designed by Trump to deflect from his mounting problems, he, the stable genius, proclaimed loudly there is a grand wall, a tall wall that cannot be scaled or tunneled under is under construction in, wait for it, here it comes, Colorado.
This is real news spoken by the savior of many, the chief in charge of abandoning our allies, the errand boy of Putin and Erdogan, who brays the impeachment proceedings are a witch hunt.
Yup. The person with the unmatched wisdom is clueless about where to find Colorado on a map.
5
One would think ANY American and ALL American news outlets like the NYT would love to finally have a president who is fighting to weed out the "deep state". As most know, the "deep state" is nothing but career politicians, employees, and elected officials who serve for their own glory instead of the voters. They use their power and influence to push government actions in ways they (or the ones paying them under the table) desire.
We (all of America regardless of party) don't need people in DC directing the course of events in our government just to line their pockets or satisfy their own personal beliefs. It's way past time for a tough president to fight against these people and that is exactly what Trump is doing. This is the main reason he is attacked at every angle no matter what he does. He could cure cancer and the "deep state" would declare it was a bad thing to do.
The current division in America will close when we see the MSM finally opening their eyes and ears to tell the truth and support this president. When writing articles, show the "deep state" as the bad guys like really are. Instead the only help the "deep state" with articles like this.
3
The "Deep State" is an invention of the Alt-Right to advance their no-tax, no-regulation, no-government Libertarian dystopia. Period. Conscientious government employees working to defend the Constitution are the enemies of Trump, conservatives, and the Alt-Right who make their policies for them. Trump supporters are now the enemies of the Real State - the Constitution and the Rule of Law.
4
Trump called The Press the enemy of the people. He and Bannon declared war on the Deep State and it is the Press and the Deep State that will ultimately bring him down. Trump started the fight and they will finish it.
God bless a Free Press long live the Deep State.
4
This article, including the headline, frames the fight as between Trump and the deep state. The proper framing is that Trump has done illegal things, and violated his oath of office, and therefore should be impeached. This article reads like proof of one of Bannon's talking points, about how the dangers of the deep state.
6
Trump and his sycophants in the Congress had declared war on some of the finest career government people who'd served this country well for decades. It's not the deep state but the nations finest and most dedicated. For them now, to come out and help bring him is perhaps their finest hour.
3
Why is the word treason being ignored? Russia has profited from many of Trump’s acts.
7
Sometimes paranoia becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy.
2
The New York Times should be framing any story emanating from Adam Schiff’s committee as a selective leak meant to harm President Trump. These stories may or may not be true, but Times readers should be presented with all of testimony before passing judgement. If not, stories should clearly identified as speculation. Sadly, this is not happening and Time’s readers are getting deluged with stories based on leaks, anonymous sources and political agendas. We deserve better.
3
“What you’re seeing now, I believe, is a group of mostly career bureaucrats who are saying: ‘You know what? I don’t like President Trump’s politics so I’m going to participate in this witch hunt that they’re undertaking on the Hill,’” Mick Mulvaney, the acting White House chief of staff, told reporters last week.
No Micky, what we are seeing is deeply patriotic individuals standing up to defend this country against the likes of Trump and his cohorts, like yourself from destroying anymore of this country's reputation abroad.
3
Donald Trump rules the Trump Organization. There is no Board of Directors that he has to answer to. Trump wants to rule the United States in the exact same way.
Donald Trump has always prioritized loyalty TO HIM. Why? Because he is fundamentally a crook and he needs people to keep his secrets. This makes him a paranoid person. Trump carries this dysfunction into the White House and his functioning as POTUS.
And this framework of mob style rule simply does not work in our government mostly because there are just too many moving parts to try and control.
Trump and Bannon can label these professionals whatever they want. Trump still faces his daily problem of trying to control who knows what he has done and keeping them silent. This is because it never occurred to this con man to work openly and honestly. As long as he continues to cut corners, bribe, extort, bully or threaten, Trump will have the problem of having to silence those around him. It is his eternal struggle since he refuses to change his ways.
5
When you say “deep state”, NYT, you perpetuate “trump’s” narrative of some nefarious, oppositional army. Please stop.
There is no such thing.
There are career professionals that have a duty and responsibility to the republic to testify on crimes. Crimes that are putting all of us at risk.
What is more astonishing to me is the highly disciplined restraint these career professionals have displayed. 3 years into this MESS. I can only imagine the pressure-cooker they’ve been living in, biting their tongues not to just run out screaming and ringing alarm bells.
3
And what other American assets will Trump give away to his good buddies Putin and Erdogan before he heads out the door?
3
A successful impeachment will only remove our President from the Washington scene. Boycotting everything and anything to do with Trump properties and products will do far more. It will remove him from the scene permanently. Hit where it hurts most. In the pocketbook.
43
Kind of difficult when those currying his favor from around the world insist on paying premium prices at Trump (TM) properties.
Any reason folks can’t do both?
2
@Raggedy Annie Absolutely. Can do both things at once. If the Democrats (and non democrats for that matter) are so outraged then show it with your pocketbook. Stop visiting or joining Trump properties. Even if his base is strong enough to vote him back in for a second term, Trump et all will be too busy fighting off bankruptcies with the reduced cash flow. This is another way to " "cast your vote in the next election". A safeguard measure.
looks like it will take longer than four years for President Trump to clean up the corruption in Washington
we'll need him to continue reviling these bad players over the next four years
the resistance is strong and we have the right person working for the American people
7
We sure do - Nancy Pelosi.
1
What people do not understand about Government Service is that most of the people that do it are dedicated to the country in a way many of their fellow citizens simply don’t understand. You do not get rich in public service and the benefits are not lavish. There is a sense of devotion to duty and integrity in the civil service that is incredible. There is also a culture of speaking up and saying something when there is something wrong. This is why Trump’s first attacks were on the civil service and attempting to take away their protections, freeze their pay, etc. In this case, the professional civil service may save America, and the people should never forget that. They’re not “the deep state,” and they’re not “bureaucrats” as rotten Fox News likes to call them. They are our professional civil service and public servants.
39
@Todd: The need to lawyer-up at personal expense is just another Republican scheme to drive good people in government posts nuts.
1
Taylor is described as an outstanding "patriot", former soldier, etc. Some or all of these glowing adjectives were also employed with Mueller, Comey, Brennan, Paige, Strzok, Clapper, et al. We all know how those turned out. The Deep State is at work and are using Taylor as their pawn.
6
I feel sorry for anyone who doesn’t realize what a good job Mr. Mueller did for this nation.
5
Trump spent his entire business career running an organization that let us say was never deep on talent---And there was good reason why Trump ran the entire operation this way. Fundamentally, what he was doing always bordered on the illegal and from a practical standpoint, his sons and daughter, or brother in law---the bench was thin. Running the US government is an entirely different animal. Those large granite buildings surrounding the White House are filled with very smart men and women who have worked their jobs for decades---they run the systems that run our country. As a manager, I learned the hard way, that disrupting these bureaucratic structures is high risk/little reward undertakings. I should add, that all of Trump's supposed deregulation executive orders, are just that supposed---yes, they make the front page, but in reality someone, somewhere in the deep state must implement those policies---the exact people Trump disparages on a daily basis.
14
Of course the deep state is turning against him. They have much to hide and more to protect.
8
Please do not hurl rocks at judges, secretaries, office cleaners, the motor pool - that’s your “deep government”.
Now, what are our dedicated underpaid social servants “hiding” - the ones coming forward now are those who goy tired of covering for Trump’s crimes, lies and subversion of justice.
3
Trump is bright enough to know that there are negative things in his past as well as current unethical and/or illegal conduct that would surface over time. Trump has set up a scenario from the very beginning to protect himself from any accusations of wrong doing. He knows that possible accusations would come from - political opponents - “Never Trumpers”, dedicated civil servants - “the deep state”’ and journalists - “fake news”. Anyone that states anything negative can easily be put into one of the above the categories even if they were appointed by Trump. His base is made largely of aggrieved believers, as well as who those who benefit directly from his power.
5
Bringing up comparisons of Obama, Clinton or Bush is like a parent bringing up drinking at a high school party to an established 30 year during a Thanksgiving Day meal when the here and now is is more relevant. Historically the 2016 election was conducted with the main objective of being disruptive, a free for all of opportunists who abused their Cabinet positions, questionable and unqualified advisors like Steve Bannon, Miller, Gorka, Kushner, Ivanka their personal agendas taking precedence over US policy. Think about it, those cast of characters held the fate of
320, 000,000 million in their incompetent, greedy hands some of them replaced by others with no grasp between personal and what was in the best interest of the nation. Those Republicans who continue to support the Trump circus possess the same mentality, lack of ethics, condoning and participating in obstruction even when smacked in the face by it.
8
Using the term "deep state" only validates the conspiracy theorists who coined that nonsense term. My Trump-to-English thesaurus reminds me that a better term for "deep state" is "rule of law".
20
Poetic justice. But let's just settle for simple justice, something we haven't experienced since Donald Trump declared himself above the law and we've let him get away with it. Time's up.
10
There are several commenters having some difficulty articulating Fox talking points. Here are some suggestions:
Unelected deep state bureaucrats.
Trump did a great thing to get us out of a Ukraine civil war we had no part of.
We hired these bureaucrats to do the President's bidding, no matter what it was. They don't do it? They're fired!
This is the first president in American history who is fulfilling all his campaign promises.
And why should we help the Kurds when they refused to help George Washington take over the airports?
***
You're welcome.
4
Label it what you will. What I’m seeing are career professionals holding up their commitment to protect and defend the Constitution and the interests of the United States from a President hell bent on promoting his personal and financial interests.
22
I think with the destruction of the deep state, certainly I’ve done big damage. Trump
Another gift for Putin
6
"The Deep State" is Trump and his partners in crime.
"The Swamp" is Trump and his partners in crime.
15
Let us keep in mind that conspiracy theories are borne of paranoid stupidity, noisily exhaled, and little else. In Donald Trump, the "theorists" have their man in the Oval Office, "theorizing" garnished with a large and unhealthy dose of self-dealing.
8
The man child in charge, with no under standing of the laws & constitution he is getting exactly what he created. With the senate republicans & their chief criminal McConnell impeachment probably will not pass no mater the offense. Personally; lets be sure to get out the vote so we can end this horrible stain on our country and then maybe we will see DJT in an orange jumpsuit.
5
"But over the last three weeks, the deep state has emerged from the shadows in the form of real live government officials..."
Why is the NYT legitimizing this term in this way? There is no deep state, and it's irresponsible to suggest that there is.
It's like telling a kid the boogie man won't get you, when you should be telling them that there is no boogie man, only fears created in the mind.
15
@Nathan Alas, they have been lying to you, but the jig is up.
Turns out during the WB testimony is 4th hand info. This is why this needs to be done public, refused less of the party being impeached. Any one can play this game. A 4th hand testimony could have been given about Obama, but actually he prosecuted WB’s as leakers in a very aggressive manner. Double standards.
5
Trump admitted his guilt in the "transcript" of the phone call. First-hand observers are now testifying that Trump ran foreign policy as an arm of his re-election campaign. The WB is irrelevant now. Try and keep up.
2
You’re right. That conversation we’ve all seen the transcript of never happened...
2
The NYT does deep injustice to the bureaucrats who’ve dedicated their lives to our country by confounding them with the right wing conspiracy of a “deep state,” an imaginary entity that acts as singular force.
11
Dear Republicans, You folks talk a lot about transparency but fail to provide It! Tell Trump and WH officials to turn over requested documentations and allow subpoenaed officials to testify in the inquiry. Those who have nothing to hide- cooperate! Those who have something to hide- obstruct! Americans are increasingly growing impatient with all your bullying, lying, and outright attempts to intimidate anyone who speaks up to tell the truth about what the WH administration!
11
This is an irresponsible headline. The phrase "deep state" should always have a stronger qualifier than quotes, since it does not exist.
6
I, ______, do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; that I take this obligation freely, without any mental reservation or purpose of evasion; and that I will well and faithfully discharge the duties of the office on which I am about to enter. So help me God.
A federal employee takes that oath. Nowhere in the oath does it state an employee is bound to follow illegal orders from a leader.
5 U.S. Code § 3331. Oath of office
15
I always thought it was rather ironic that a guy with such a shallow brain who assumes the "deep state" would take him down will ultimately be taken down by his own ineptness, arrogance, and actions.
13
You could say the spirits of the China Hands like John Service and the auxiliaries like Theodore White are still haunting the halls of the State Department. Call them technocrats if you like but the diplomatic corp is a professional organization with people steeped in other cultures and current affairs. America may have certain preferences but she will undermine her own professionals at her own peril, no matter the administration.
Then you throw in Trump, Bannon et al, who rose to power by undermining America a la Joe McCarthy and Roy Cohn.
Fool me once, shame on you; fool me twice, shame on me. America, you are at a crossroad, if you let Trump and his cronies get away with this, America, you are the one bearing the blame
8
I don't understand: Isn't this preliminary investigation supposed to be secret? How come the NYTimes always gets the" right" information?
3
How about "trump's War on Patriots Turns Against Him."
3
So now are we all agreeing the Deep State Does exist?
3
We should use the proper term for the Deep State: America.
3
As a registered Democrat who voted Third Party in 2016 what really concerns me about the so-called 'Deep State' is the 'appearance' of so many FBI, CIA, and other Intelligence agencies being involved in an 'appearance' of attempting to overturn the election results of the 2016 presidential election.
I'm surprised the major news media outlets like the NYT don't see the larger danger of supporting this for future presidents that these agencies don't like. Does this 'look' like a witch hunt? Well, yes it does if one looks at all the news items since the 2016 election that either haven't come out as 100% true or worse, the news media outlets have had to retract what they said or wrote about President Trump.
I don't feel sorry for the President because of all the leaks in his administration, because as Judge Judy Sheindelin says usually to women on her show Judge Judy "You Picked Him!"
Well he picked the people in his inner circle!
3
“Abusing his power by advancing his own political interests”? Let’s break this down:
President Trump was elected on a promise to drain the swamp. Draining the swamp would include exposing political corruption wherever it exists. If in the process it might also advance his own political interests so be it! Who cares! I certainly do not. What the Biden’s did is the most egregious example I have ever seen of government corruption: bribing a foreign government to employ the son of a Vice President, somebody who has no business being in Ukraine and has no apparent credentials. So let’s call it by it’s real name: back door corruption. If the Times and these so called government officials can wink at this Ukraine example, what else are they winking at. Might it be that this is only the tip of the iceberg for Democrats? Maybe each Democrat is wondering if they might be next. Is this the basis for their inquiry? Skeletons that they do not want exposed? Keep up the good work Mr. President. This is why you were elected. We might not always like your approach but we like your results.
7
The President sets policy, not the bureaucrats. This kind of resistance needs to be met with immediate termination and forfeiture of pensions. In essence, these bureaucrats are committing treason by using their positions to undermine US policy.
5
trump IS the deep state! Projection, anyone? He does this every time, accuses his enemies of engaging in corrupt behavior that HE is engaging in. Just one more deception from the grand master of deceit.
One wonders how much damage the republicans will allow this dangerous administration to do to our country and our rule of law before they say enough. So far there seems to be no bottom.
All are despicable as the "president" they protect and support. They should at minimum be turned from office and shunned, or better yet, thrown in jail for trying to usurp the Constitutional duty to perform oversight of the government of the United States.
4
The "deep state" is just another dishonest, fictional trope concocted by Trump and his lawless Republican enablers, and should always be called out as such. It's really just honest, ethical, empathetic people who care about the well-being of our democracy, our country, and the people in it.
5
Marching deep state operatives struggling to carry out the left's progressive agenda against him won't solve the problem just embolden the people trying to stop it.
3
Having utter contempt and zero respect for the highest office cuts both ways.
2
With Trump acting this way in office since he was President-Elect, I can't believe he didn't do time in prison for his business practices, which we all know are so shady the sun never sees the ground under them.
Release the tax returns. And release what should be hundreds of transcripts of him and his team's calls with Putin and other Russians. Release everything about this person.
6
One thing to remember is that as a psychopath Trump is great at accusing others of what he is actually doing. Trump has created a deep state of unelected loyalists who do his bidding by circumventing the usual channels.
5
That Trump is a vile narcissist who is a disaster is beyond dispute. Yet, as Edgar Snowden said, the « deep state » exists and Sen Schumer gave the recipe for how intel services would go after Trump (six ways till Sunday). In other vocabularies the deep state is the national security state or the permanent government. It is neither healthy nor democratic for intel services to determine who should be in power. The double or permanent government made Obama toe the line in Afghanistan. I would like to see Trump soundly defeated at the poll but not see his demise organized by untrustworthy intel services. Brennan or Clapper are certified liars too.
1
It’s truly unfortunate that you chose to frame your reporting as “playback,” implying revenge and, as others note here, thus giving credence to the absurd conspiracy theory, one among the many that have been fostered by this inept, corrupt, ignorant administration.
And since it has become quite evident that many of its supporters are equally ignorant, they will remain unpersuaded that the squatter in the White House and his minions have wrought great harm to the national infrastructure and its professionals who help run this country. Bureaucracies are not immune to issues or critique, but at the national level, they do represent a storehouse of necessary skills, experience, and expertise required to fulfill crucial state functions. This administration, in its ongoing campaigning to retain power for its own self-interest and corrupt gains, feeds into ignorant stereotypes its followers hold as they seem to assume that all and every bureaucrat is just some lazy, inefficient slob at the local DMV or post office.
5
Fabulous journalism New York Times. This newspaper is to Donald Trump what the Washington Post was to Richard M. Nixon. Thank you for standing up to Trump's tyranny and reporting the news.
3
The impeachment inquiry is NOT "the culmination of a battle between the president and the government institutions he distrusted and disparaged."
The impeachment inquiry IS, quite simply, the most recent public attack by the democrats and the democrat-controlled mainstream media to circumvent the 2016 election.
Since Day 1 of the Trump presidency, the democrats and media have been going to extremes to tarnish, delay and ultimately oust Trump - but it hasn't worked. The Steele Dossier, the Russia Collusion Hoax, the concerted efforts of the CIA and FBI, the "whistleblower"...
Yet Joe Biden did EXACTLY what they accuse Trump of doing - he even brags about it on video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UXA--dj2-CY . But corrupt democrats don't care, and the corrupt mainstream media buries it.
6
It seems that this all began when Trump refused to buy 100% of the intelligence services mantra that “the Russians did it” when it concerned the 2016 election. And now the payback has arrived! No one remembers the many times our intelligence services lied to a president, Congress and the American people? Bay of pigs. Vietnam war. And the war in iraq where they said it was a slam dunk that Saddam had weapons of mass distraction and a nuclear program and that we would be greeted as liberators. I believe Trump was correct to be skeptical
5
great story.
adding to the irony is that trump is creating his own "deep state" by delegating foreign policy to back-channel unprofessionals like giuliani, sondland, and patel.
3
The “deep state” was originally defined as a corrupt bureaucracy that resisted reforms from elected politicians. The NYT seems to have redefined it to mean patriots who are attempting to refuse illegal actions ordered by corrupt politicians.
5
I hate the fact that "deep state" (and the stupid, conspiracy theory that gave rise to the phrase, compliments of Steve Bannon) has become part of the national discourse. At the very least, it should be enclosed in quotes, lest the media inadvertently legitimize the idea.
5
History is littered with fools who thought they could single-handedly vanquish vast bureaucracies. You can now add Donald Trump to their numbers.
4
As a lifelong federal employee who has served under three administrations I have never seen anything close to resembling a "deep state," and find the term itself to be offensive. Once policy is set and the full weight of the government falls behind it, it takes years to shift course. Policy is enacted slowly and meticulously to ensure correct steps are being taken and adjustments can be made. Trump won in 2016, but he did not win the popular vote and has made no attempt to build a coalition once in office. Many of his policies have been divisive, and the fact he has not reached across the isle to enact them inevitably means some policies will receive pushback. Not from nefarious actors, but from lawyers, scientists, diplomats, etc., who are trying to align Trump's actions with the reality on the ground.
As far as government "pushing back" against Trump, I do not see it. Government employees are by and large scientists and lawyers who spend years on a single project, or work in teams to draft a single page document. The point of this is to make sure our policy makers are well informed. When a new administration says raising taxes will or won't hurt the economy, this is an issue that can be debated. When a visible sharpie line contradicts a supercomputer generated storm path, this is a blatant lie. I would think US citizens would appreciate a false statement being called out, but sadly a large group of American's would rather believe what they want over reality.
10
@Mash: Believing and preaching the preposterous in life is widely believed to pay off big-time and forever after death.
The ‘deep state’ started the war by opening a counterintelligence investigation on Trump campaign. It did not inform Congress as it is supposed to. There were FISA abuses and the information about its information source was concealed. The FBI Director refused to investigate the Democratic nominee in the email problem and declared her not guilty.
Since elections, the deep state wants the President to run the country as it wants. The leaks, the resistance, the whistles, the ex intel chiefs going on CNN and calling for Trump dismissal.
If Trump has lost, none would have surfaced. This is how the state has become politicized by the administration before Trump, the Democrat propaganda machine aka mainstream media, and the special interests.
Trump is playing a defense with his Twitter account and media statements. Even if you do not like Trump, the deep state actions undermine the Democracy in the USA. This is how they operate in the third world countries by politicizing state officials and judiciary. Wake up my fellow citizens.
5
Hiliary Clinton was investigated 2x at least by the FBI that we know of and by the Republican controlled Congress 8 times. I personally watched the congressional hearings lead by Trey Gowdy. There was just a review of state department emails by AG and DOJ that were previously cleared and are now declared ok under Trump administration. She did a stupid thing with those thirty thousand emails, but nothing criminal. We have wasted enough money and time on this. And it doesnt appear to have changed behavior, ie Trump talking on unsecured phones at Mar-a-Largo, others like Kushner using personal unsecured phones for messages to foreign leaders, Guiliani, Sondeland, Taylor and Volker using WhatsApp for messages. If we were smart we would set policy and provide secure equipment, and punish those who dont follow it.
It's not that they disagreed with the polcies per se -- it's that Trump keeps directing them to do things that are illegal or without proper foundations in law, legal process, and regulation. Trump would take the powerful apparatus of the executive branch and turn it into an extension of his will. Not law. Not democracy. What Trump wants. The people who come forth about this aren't seeking payback their defending us .
6
I am very grateful for government employees who take pride in their jobs and country. Right from the get go, this administration has sought to disassemble democracy and allied itself with governments who had an investment in changing the world order. Russias investment in Trump has restructured the middle east. Many understand that this is a mere beginning in changes to come as each day is some kind of upping the ante and subsequent spin. At what point will it be ok to eliminate persons who threaten their interests as does Russia and Saudi Arabia. How many Americans died in the takeover of American bases? We have a Saudi journalist, multiples of Russian disappearances and the Jeffrey Epstein mystery. Is the Republican investment worth it? I don't think my Republican Dad would have thought so.
5
A really troubling article that does not bode well for anyone. Political leadership that is too impatient/frustrated to wait for/convince congress to enact laws creating their political platform, distrusting the career SES class that is so 'expert' they pursue their own judgment of good policy and departmental goals. Both sets of "leaders" increasingly micromanaging (because they don't trust their underlings to follow unclear and conflicting directives/goals) the large mass of government employees who are just trying to do their jobs as qualified public servants and getting hated-on by everyone, trying to embed "their own" people (qualified or not) to have the "real" power.
We are actually treading very dangerous ground. Trump could have easily been accepted by the intelligence and military industrial community.
But once a number of former intelligence and military people endorsed Clinton, Trump began seeing them as his enemy.
In reality they are no ones enemy, but neither are they the honest public servants that they claim to be.
While terms like "deep state" are derided, we forget that long before these debates President Eisenhower warned how the military industrial complex had achieved such a level of power in government that they could override our democratic institutions.
Disaster after disaster from Vietnam to Iraq, to Libya and now Syria has shown his prediction to be true.
Even now very smart ex military people say we have no coherent mission in Iraq or Syria, other than to spend billions of dollars. What is offered as a mission changes on a monthly basis simply because we don't know how to withdraw.
How can it be that these well trained minds revert to the emotional state of a schoolyard boys in a face down when dealing with the fate of millions of lives?
Trump's real crime is his erratic nature, his ego and his refusal to follow the grand strategic plan that has been in place for decades. He was instructed to block Russia, pivot to China. But he's reversed this plan and that's a no, no. too much money is on the table.
Trump may be paranoid, but it's for a good reason and neither he nor his adversaries bod well for the country.
1
By their own admission the bureaucracy intended to stifle DT policies. Why anyone would expect he would allow that to stand us quite naive. If you are anti trump the bureaucracy are dedicated and noble civil servants. If you believe in the change that voters elected Trump to affect, they are the deep state. Both narratives have some elements of truth
It is not bureaucratic payback that has brought the Republic to its current sorry pass; it is the president's execrable behavior since before the day of his inauguration, nothing more and nothing less.
6
I once read where Nixon said that there are a few entities that a president has no control over. He mentioned the Industrial Complex, Wall Street, the Federal Reserve. Surprisingly he mentioned the CIA. One would thing the president has control over the CIA? I think this is the best example of poetic justice. Trump believes Putin over the CIA. He disparaged the agency leading to low morale. Now the chickens have come home to roost.
2
The Constitution says "The House" will investigate possible impeachment. Not one party, not the Speaker of the House, the House. All 435 members, who represent the American people. All of the American people.
The way this "investigation" is being done, by just one party, in secret behind closed doors, with the other half of the House, and thus America, denied the ability to subpoena and cross-examine witnesses, or present evidence, is a classic Star Chamber, the home of all dictators. This drive to deny an accused any ability at defense is grossly un-Constitutional and anti-American.
It is certainly not the America of the open, public gathering of evidence and open, public trials where the accused can confront the accusers. It takes America back to before Peter Zenger, when the "Divine Right" of the potentate was all that was needed to convict anyone of anything.
We fought free of that. So far, we have also avoided the George Orwellian world of politically "wrong" defendants convicted on no evidence, and then history re-written to prove them "guilty." Hopefully, we will survive this one.
5
Please, the Republican party members are in the room asking questions that belong to the committees involved. It was Trey Gowdy who changed the rules to committee members only during the Benghazi investigations. The committees are investigating, if nothing comes of it, they won't pursue. The whole House votes on impeachment. Then the Senate holds a public trial where witnesses are called and questioned again. The rest of the House is still running with their different committees to get work done. If only the Senate would take up and debate, approve it send back to house and then to president for signature, override veto if needed, then things would change. Not just be executive orders. This is the way it is supposed to work.
2
The "impeachment inquiry" is sounding more and more like a partisan coup attempt. Time to open the doors and let the light in. The facts should speak for themselves. But this cloak and dagger business is going to back fire miserably if it does not appear impartial and bi-partisan.
5
please read the article and stop watching one sided news, it is bipartisan. The republican members of the committees are in the room asking questions and they have been the whole time. Yesterdays stunt was an attempt to turn things into a circus and stop witnesses from giving testimony. It didnt work.
1
This article describes efforts to subvert the instructions or intent of the White House (not just Trump's) which is the very essence of the deep state.
3
An excellent turn of events. There had been no ‘deep state’ until the industrialists started owning former protected lands, etc, etc. a cause became widespread, reason ruled, and a ‘deep state’ now sorta exists. Only to attempt to short-circuit illegitimacy at the peak.
Notice how many times “career” is used in this article? Why do we have unelected career employees and positions protected that are allowed to slow walk new policies, or ignore them? The same problem exist in the Pentagon. Failure to achieve success gets you fired in the real world. Not being able to accept change or enact change gets you fired. When a company or corporation changes its management, it is assumed department leaders will work to enact changes the new management demands. Every failing company in the world would be destine for failure if their leader couldn’t replace people unable to change. Voters decide who runs our government, and enact changes, just like shareholders do corporations. There is no room in corporate America, or in government for career employees to ignore their elected leaders. In the real world, anyone who isn’t part of the team gets fired. Protecting positions that don’t enact the policies of the president is irresponsible. People in positions that don’t support new policies determined by the president should be fired, not offered the protection to obstruct without consequences, like the rest of the real world.
2
They are not required to perform illegal or criminal orders. That is why the former Ukrainian ambassador was pushed out, for asking about inconsistencies about the formal Trump administration policy and things she saw going on with Guiliani, Sondeland and Volker and why Trump was operating a shadow group for his personal Ukraine policy. He and they knew it was wrong. Even Barr did, he was quick to say he didnt know what Trump was talking about in phone transcript that Trump provided saying the Ukrainians should work out details of investigation of Bidens with Guiliani and the attorney general.
@@irish No, they are not. They shouldn’t have any authority to determine foreign policy, or job protection either. If a drug company tells its sales force they are not allowed to recommend the prolonged use of an opioid, should they be fired, or given bonuses for increasing the sales? Anytime a subordinate is told of a policy change that isn’t illegal refuses to act diligently to support the legal changes they are told to accomplish, they should quit, or be fired. Protection until they think a law has been broken is unacceptable. Undermining their leader until they think they can oust him is not the way to successfully seek change. No job should be protected, none. Diplomacy is not a union job.
The under breath mantra of the brave, hard-working federal employees is "we be" - meaning "we be" here when a new administration comes, and "we be" here when it leaves. These are the folks providing continuity of services and who make sure your social security distributions, medicare payments, veterans benefits, emergency aid, etc etc etc are made on time. Even the grand incompetence of the Trump administration would have to work much much harder to destroy that architecture. However, he has picked away at it and it will need mending after he and his looneys are kicked out. International affairs is another matter and he succeeded too well in destroying our credibility and disadvantaging this country for many many generations. He should be jailed!
4
Trump and GOP leaders constantly using intentionally vague terms like "witch hunt" and "deep state" are such a red flag.
It's just so bizarre that anybody buys their "explanations" as they defy plausibility and logic.
If anyone said this in their own professional lives, they'd be fired.
3
What most Republicans fail to understand is that the much of the strength of the U.S. government comes from the ability of its employees to do their jobs unfettered by petty political concerns. Trump dreams of an authoritarian-style arrangement where everyone does his bidding, no matter how corrupt it may be. But this authoritarian model is inherently weak, as the people willing to do those government jobs are either corrupt themselves, or don't take the job seriously, since they know that the good of the country is not the ultimate goal. As we see in many third world nations, this frequently leads to a weak and unstable government, as bureaucrats take bribes and loot the public coffers at every level.
If Trump succeeds in purging the government of dedicated public officials, it will severely weaken the U.S., and may take years to rebuild. This should frighten everyone, regardless of their political persuasion.
3
This is the problem. The forefathers never envisions and in fact discouraged “life-time” government employees and especially politicians.
1
This article could more clearly focus on the most important political point. By smearing journalists, our national security agencies and congress, let’s call him “barely elected Trump" has waged a campaign to circumvent the checks and balances that differentiate our form of government from the dictatorships and cleptocracies he publicly admires. His self-aggrandizing behavior (bid to host the G7 summit at Mar-A-Lago; lodging of foreign diplomats at his Washington, DC hotel) and innuendo (suggesting we do away with presidential terms limits) signify exactly the type of government Trump wants to run. His personal political ambition has obviously (Republicans: you must realize this, don't you?) violated our national interests by a quid pro quo to Ukraine ---no military aid to fend off Russia unless you help get me re-elected. The most important point is that civil servants are risking their careers by calling out Trump and his personal lawyer for side stepping official channels of international diplomacy. Now is not the time to remain silent and follow orders.
2
Mulvaney is disingenuous saying the bureaucrats don't like Trump's policies. He conveniently ignores the fact that Trump believes laws don't apply to him, or is completely ignorant of them, and has acted accordingly. Bring on the Karmic justice and a self-pitying resignation tweet.
2
Thankfully, there are loyal Americans who are acting out and speaking out against a president bent on doing Russia's bidding to disrupt the United States and the free world.
3
Whoa, whoa, WHOA!
DO NOT write about this conspiracy theory "Deep State" garbage without first announcing it as the conspiracy theory that it is.
People who work for our government are CIVIL SERVANTS working for all of us.
They are not all intertwined in a dark web of nefarious power.
They are the Constitution in action.
7
@D.A.Oh
They are the constitution in action. Come on not this rotten to the core GOP Trump and senate. It is all for the rich and my way or the highway. You are probably a Republican you were embarrassed to tell with the chaos Trump is causing in our world. If you are You are not honorable for the GOP is destroying our planet with coal and fossil fuels.
If Trump is impeached, which he surely will be, it will be solely because failure to impeach him will ensure that Democratic voters will be furious and stay home in 2020. The efforts to impeach Trump began the instant Democrats were stunned on election night that the anointed one had lost. Being a lousy president is not a High Crime. As sure as night follows day this impeachment, which is a certainty, will cement the precedent that Presidents is of the opposite party will be impeached by the House. It guarantees division and bitterness in the future body politic and the nation. It began with Clinton, whose impeachment was a disgrace. Yes,the Constitution does provide for impeachment but it also provides for elections. There is one coming up in one year. Are Democrats just afraid they will lose?
@alan brown: Trump is a stress test of liberty to enslave. So far, the US is handling it like Chernobyl.
There was no talk of impeaching W, despite him also winning under dubious circumstances and being equally lousy in measurable results.
And that was on the heels of Clinton's impeachment, when the wounds were fresh and payback would have been more likely.
The fact is, Trump has made himself above the law and is continually abusing the power of his office, so the only way to hold this corrupt man accountable is impeachment. Checks and balances.
Make Donald Indictable Again.
Accepting the far right-Trump concept of a "deep state" as this piece does, in its language and framing, is an appalling bit of sycophancy wrapped in the appearance of reporting. The headline here should be this administration's politicization of everything.
The reaction of mid-level federal officials to corruption and incompetence at the highest levels is not the same as a "deep state" getting payback. It's a lot more Deep Throat than deep state, and your columnists and editors have really failed on this one.
1
Trump is an opportunist he does not believe the deep state story he spreads or distrust the people in govt it just fits his narrative to get what he wants.
Stop calling it the “Deep State” - you are just perpetuating memes from the GOP war on government they’ve used to cripple and pervert it.
What we are seeing as these brave men and women come forward is government of the people, government by the people, and government for the people.
Trump and the GOP are showing us what a kleptocratic oligarchy looks like - government by looters and thieves in the service of the rich.
4
As Trump is circling the drains that empty into his fetid and foul swamp will Graham and McConnell follow Trump into the swamp or attempt to redeem themselves?
Alas, there is no redemption for the Trump apologists, enablers and defenders of the traitorous Trump.
I do applaud the "deep state" career employees who have come forward to testify. Perhaps there are a few employees left who understand the oaths they spoke when becoming a federal employee was to the country and constitution and not a president.
1
Stop babbling about the "deep state." There is no deep state. It is simply the state, loyal public servants who're tired of seeing our system of government, our democratic institutions, our free press and our intellligence agencies, justice department and defense establishment corrupted by a criminal president.
3
It's a false narrative to refer to the fact that at times prior presidents had disagreements with members of the government bureaucracy in any manner that attempts to compare it with the public disparagement that Trump has heaped on the FBI, CIA, and State and Justice officials who adhere to the law while he trashes them and the law at any opportunity.
Presidents will never "love" every member of the bureaucracy but until Trump, none of them attempted to destroy them with lies and removal and marginalization.
The fact is that Trump is now and always has been a criminal -- in his dealings with his wives, his businesses, etc. and now he's faced with an entire brigade of people who see and know him for the criminal that he is and therefore he lashes out at them for seeing him as the lowlife that he is.
1
Trump has finally met his match with the House of Congress. He nor his GOP gang of supporters can stop these hearings, that will most likely lead to his being impeached. The House is controlled by the Democrats, with 235 members, and to Impeach they need only 218 democrats to vote yes. Yep not one single Republican vote neefed. The democrats will show the Republicans how having the majority works. In the first two years of trumps rule they had the majority, and couldnt give trump his wall money, or give Americans better cheaper health care. Republicans you had your chance, you failed to do your jobs, part of which is holding trump accountable. Impeachment is coming, your vote, just not NEEDED.!!
The two articles sitting cheek to jowl on these pages are this one about the "deep state" and the one on Bannon's "war room." Clowns to the left of us, clowns to the right. But these clowns were always juggling live ammo.
We are living the fallout of allowing patently unhinged men to have unfettered power. Worse, we blew them up large by giving them the world's largest podium and biggest mics.
A free speech absolutist, I want to know what the criminal element thinks and plans. But there is a world of difference between free speech and consequence-free speech. DJT's braying about the "deep state" has had deep and often deadly consequences for legions of people. Daily, he voices the ranting and raving of a profoundly unhinged person, one held hostage, not to the "deep state" but to his own broken mind and ruptured morality.
Bannon's threat to "blow the whole thing up" ended up being a promise kept. Both men were allowed to make obscene, immoral, illegal threats without being checked. Both men send crystal clear dog-whistles to racists and xenophobes. Nowhere is it written that the press must cover the ranting and raving of lunatics. If it does choose to, it should be made to fact-check every lie, counter every threat, and use its awesome power as a call for accountability.
These men made enemies of those who now have the power to make them eat their words. That is our only consolation... if, and only if, they are finally held accountable.
3
Thank goodness 'the real live government officials' are not like the real live Republican Senators and thank goodness that there are stills some people who think that loyalty to country and one's Oath of Office is more important than feathering one's nest.
1
Really not helpful when you repeat the false and inflammatory label of Deep State. This is public servants doing their job and their civic duty.
19
Thank you
1
I have tremendous faith in the people of the United States and the hard working civil servants who work for us.
The idea of the so-called "deep state" is something that the conspiracy theorists want citizens to believe. I encourage everyone to read legitimate news publications for their news and not to rely on Bannon, Gorka, Breitbart, Carlson, Hannity et all for their information.
The "white wing" media wants to turn back the clock. They are afraid that they are losing influence to younger and more diverse (women, young people and people of color) population. This is their desperate attempt to take over and destroy the institutions of government and quash all dissent.
It seems that this administration wants Federal employees to be an arm of the president's campaign and to support him no matter what. That is not the way it is supposed to work. Employees work for the people, not for the president.
The pathetic attempt of republicans to stop the investigation of the incompetent and corrupt president will not succeed unless the citizens sit back and do nothing.
Our country was great before this president was elected. We will have to work hard to undo all of the damage that he and his cowardly enablers have done and restore faith in our institutions that are the foundation of our country.
9
Yes the deep state does exist and they don't like Donald disturbing the apple card. They're mad at Donald for not accepting their advice which was the same group that was 100% accurate that Saddam Hussein had nuclear weapons. Now that accuracy not only cost some 4800 US fatalities but close to a million Iraqi casualties. That was only 16 years ago and even though we haven't seen any direct evidence besides some questionable facebook activity we must accept their accuracy that Russia tried to disturb our vaunted Democracy. Don't upset the deep state or they'll get you - eventually even Donald.
1
There is no “Deep State”. It is an alt right manufactured term used to shape a convenient strawman for vilifying government professionals who know the rules and follow the law. It is a term used by dictators around the world to justify their own corruption. Just like “The Swamp” it is projection on Trump’s part to shape his image as a victim and crusader for good while he destroys us with his incompetence, lines his own pockets and Makes Putin Great Again. I shudder to think that without this one brave Whistleblower and Inspector General who paved the way for those coming forward to uphold ethical standards and the rule of law, how much further down the path to destruction of our democracy we would be today.
9
Democracy in America is under attack, and these brave civil servants are fighting back. They are not plotters, they are the resistance to fascism and corruption. They are not spies or plotters, they are patriots. Many US soldiers sacrificed themselves 75 years ago for the same ideas. From a European culture it's very painful to watch the disarray of a nation which culture we have admired on so many aspects
11
There are Americans, and there are ungrateful leeches on America who happen to have been born here. Trump is one of the latter, someone who has benefited tremendously from the stability, competence, and professionalism that career public servants have provided since before he was born on a par unsurpassed in world history, but who doesn't understand or care about that and would rather chuck it than pay the taxes -- membership fees -- that make it possible. Without that competent federal government he most likely never would have been wealthy. Autocracies don't generate anywhere near the level of wealth or the number of millionaires that intelligently regulated free states do.
9
Trump was/is a corrupt "business man" and spent a lifetime pushing the limits of the law and many times crossing that line and is no different as the president. In fact he now realizes just how much power he has and is exploiting every once of it. He has turned this government on it's head and pushed the Republican party deeper into his corrupt world more than they have ever been. Not that it took all that much effort.
The Democrats and truly patriot Republicans must come to the aid of our democratic republic and back the impeachment proceedings.
If Trump is not rebuked then he and the Republican party have irreparably damaged our form of government that may never be repaired.
7
Having career professionals is part and parcel of having a nation of laws in which there is continuity and expertise in carrying out those laws. Career professionals must follow the law, not contrary whims of the next Chief Executive elected. That is what it is like living in a real republic that is a nation governed by duly constituted laws and not despotic fiat.
20
The loss of career government employees in general is not productive for the many aspects of government that directly impact the lives of American--clean water, air and possibly affordable housing policies come to mind. However, there can also be devastating national security/foreign policy implications. The McCarthy era purge of the " Communists" in the State Dept.is a good example. When Eisenhower, Kennedy and Johnson were forming policy for Vietnam, the ranks of the State Dept. were void of those with years of knowledge and experience in dealing Communists in Southeast Asia---and look what that got us.
10
What is President Trump's problem with the so-called "Deep State"? It is made up of career Professionals that put Our Country ahead of Party Politics.
8
Exactly. The welfare of the USA above profits? partisanship? How dare they??!
1
Trump also thinks that “The Swamp” is made up of career civil servants who impede his efforts to become a dictator, not corrupt self-dealers.
1
This is the ultimate battle to save our Constitution. It consists of previously nameless and faceless people who've dedicated their lives to public service to that foundational document and its rule of law against those who've sold out to the private service of Donald Trump who has engaged with them in a massive criminal conspiracy to break those laws and openly challenge them. For the majority of Americans (now 55 percent) who can discern the truth and desire that "government of the people, by the people, and for the people" shall endure Marie Yovanovitch, George P. Kent, Michael McKinley and William Taylor Jr. are us--those who want to save the Union from the cruel rule of Trump so it "shall not perish for the earth."
16
Please stop using the term “deep state” to describe the normal, above-board operations, expertise, and oversight that comprise the very heart of a healthy government and nation.
The so-called “deep state” is a conspiracy-laden alt-right construct. By promulgating and legitimizing this specious construct, you do a disservice to the tens of thousands of government employees and contractors who support our nation, and who go about their daily jobs with honesty and integrity.
Are there bad players in government? Of course. For examples, just look at the current POTUS, AG, and Senate leader. But I believe that it is wrong to project the bad behavior and motivations of a relative few onto the vast majority of good and decent people.
19
@Scott Fordin
I have written a similar comment. I'm rather horrified with the way the NYT published this. I've never seen anything so shoddy on their lead front page.
2
Yes, the bedeviling Deep State actually does exist, but it's better known by its more pedestrian name, the Civil Service, first instituted by the Pendleton Civil Service Reform Act of 1883 and expanded thereafter, under the demonically inspired notion that federal government positions ought to be had and held by merit rather than political patronage. Tragically, it also did away with the kickback bribes, known as "assessments," that political "spoils" appointees paid to political parties for their positions. Oh, Trump would have loved the good old days of institutionalized political corruption, top to bottom. If only every federal employee were a Sondland, contributing a million to an Inauguration slush fund, their loyalty might be better assured. Perhaps that's what's meant by Make America Great Again.
11
It would be helpful when a new leader is selected that they be given a test on the Constitution. . It pays to read the document you swore to protect. Thanks to those who know the laws that support our country. And apparently, it might help if some Congressmen would realize that using your cell phones in a restricted area is the worst kind of breach. Can you imagine the information that can be extracted by foreign entities from those cell phones? Read the rules GOP Congress.
7
They knew the rules, especially Steve Scalise. Like this particular lot of Republicans, they dont like the rules, especially when things arent going their way. They dont mind ignoring them or overturning them to get what they want (yes you too Moscow Mitch McConnell). As far as I know it is actually illegal to bring a cell phone into a SCIF due to potential for security compromise, they are supposed to lock them up before they get in the room. All the cell phones were confiscated. There were apparently other sensitive meetings going on for which they did not care to be concerned about protecting our national security.They should be charged and censured.
2
Karmic justice indeed. Those who believe that Trumpism is sustainable needs to read Emerson's "Essay on Compensation."
2
When all of this is over, hopefully Trump will be out of office, and in the custody of public servants working for the bureau of Prisons.
24
When using the term “witch hunt”, we would do well to remember that medieval witch hunts didn’t find actual witches. Rather, they were mostly used against vulnerable people who were seen as inconvenient and/or troublesome. People who were non-Christians particularly Jews or any kind of “other” like someone from a foreign country were swept up in the net. In particular, women who didn’t have a strong protector were seen as easy victims.
An added benefit was that whatever property the accused “heretic” owned was split between the Church and the local authorities.
Witch hunts were a means of social control back then and Trump is using the same method now to try to rid himself of anyone he finds inconvenient or whom he feels threatens his sense of supremacy. In that sense, they are very similar to medieval witch hunts except the convicted are not now literally burned at the stake. But then, we’re still very much at the beginning of this process. One hopes that this time it doesn’t take 300 years to stop it.
9
So Mr. Baker is admitting there is a Deep State and that the Deep State is at war..and winning that war.
That should give any U.S. Citizen chills knowing that our Government isn't run by people we elect to Congress and the White House, but by a bunch of no-name faceless bureacrats/aristocrats...90% of whom donate and vote for Democrat candidates.
7
Professionals who have served both Republican and Democratic administrations are public servants.
These professionals provide expertise and stability to the U.S. government, assuring that programs and statutes are administered fairly. In addition, they report to political appointees, who ensure that the president’s priorities are being pursued.
As other commenters have pointed out, the concept of a “Deep State” is a recent construct used by conservatives to sow mistrust in the federal civil service.
The New York Times is wrong to characterize civil service professionals as members of a “Deep State.”
4
please read the real meaning of the word "deep state" and note word in headline is in quotes for that reason. The deep state is supposed to mean a shadow govt, made up of people and their friends who typically thrive under autocrats, who subvert the machinery of the state for their own and autocrats gain, to procure favors, money, land, power. Just like the term "witch hunt" which was supposed to mean unfounded charges against a weak and vulnerable person with few or no means of support, Trump has subverted these terms to mean something else. The regular govt employee is not a deep state. And most of the govt employees who have testified to the facts so far have been republicans, though also some democrats. But to a one they have put country over party, our democracy and constitution first. Trump is the first president this country has known in a very long time to openly deride and deny those who did not vote for him, who has not tried to pull the country together once he was elected. And of the things he promised, he has only managed to get tax cuts for the rich, and bail out farmers in trouble due to his tariffs. No improvements in health care and drug costs, no infrastructure etc.
5
@Erica Smythe: Conspiracy theories don’t cut it anymore. The NYT put “Deep State” in parentheses for a reason: it doesn’t exist. It’s news to me that 90% of the FBI votes for Democrats, but they might be tempted to after Trump disparaged them on every occasion...
3
Democrats need to own the term “deep state”. The deep state are non-partisan lifetime career professionals who put their country first. Trump appointees all seem to be more interested in lining their own pockets.
13
@Elaine Landes: Yes, let’s make it a “Nom de Gueux”, wearing pins and t-shirts with “Proud member of the Deep State”! on them.
@jaco: They are partisan to the Constitution they have sworn to serve, not to a treasonous president.
we're career professionals - not some "deep state". don't buy into their language and characterization. we are the people who keep the government functioning.
44
Thank you. Our America and the future of this planet depends more on you today than ever before. We are so appreciative.
6
@n
And most are patriots, unlike the GOP politicians.
1
I would prefer not to use the term 'article of faith', I think 'perception' is more relevant.
One perception that evidently landed Donald Trump in office was that the government as a whole was stepping on a lot of people in favor of others.
Another perception is that much weight should be given to the view that the President's every move is to further his own personal gain. This might imply that the best course is disinterest. Or that there are those who know how good they are and how much good they can do for others.
If the President believes he can shoot someone in broad daylight and get away with it, I believe he is wrong (Jacksonian dueling is out).
People speak of tearing the country apart. I don't know if such a thing as a clean break is possible. I seem to recall this was the Russian hope for the United States at one time and might still be.
Seems more likely though that the break could be no cleaner than the one attempted in the Civil War.
National unity is off the table, apparently. And not much evidence of considerations that go beyond cherished beliefs.
The Deep State is another term for patriots and Constitutionalists. That some happen to be in government service is beside the point. We have a POTUS who calls parts of our Constitution “phony”, and who regularly and publicly violates his oath of office. It is no surprise that some government employees are calling him on it. Most of us would do the same. Taking that oath to protect and defend the Constitution is done with reverence by the majority of Americans are sworn in. I know my own raised hand shook, because of the awesome gravity of those words. Trump does not understand this kind of patriotism. It is not in his DNA, and I very much doubt that he has read the Constitution in it’s glorious entirety.
18
@Judy Sullivan
no, the deep state is a phony conspiracy theory
If Trump is impeached it would be nothing else but a successful conclusion of Deep State's war on Trump. And nothing less than a proof that Trump was right about the Deep State out to get him all along.
6
Trump was elected by a minority. The opposition he is experiencing, whatever you choose to call it, should have been anticipated. It amounts to the disenfranchised majority fighting back.
8
@David
We have now reached the point where Trump’s personal delusions have taken on an independent validity based not on fact but on volume. There is no deep state shadow government save for the tiny team he made of Giuliani and Barr. Order and law will prevail over bluster and twitter. Perception is still merely tantamount to reality, especially as regards the constitution.
6
@David
He's utterly unqualified for office and a dangerous lunatic consumed with vindictive rage. Getting rid of him would be like the body using reverse peristalsis to get rid of some toxic substance it ingested, that is, vomiting it back up, hopefully into a basin or toilet. And make no mistake, the body that needs to eject the poison to keep from dying isn't the "Deep State" or the Federal government, it's the United States itself.
Of course, there is no such thing as a "Deep State," just individual professionals committed to careers in public service. Many of them are horrified by Trump's endless betrayals of American national interests and values, as are most Americans in general.
3
The Republicans need to just chill. The House may impeach but McConnell will block a conviction. And if the economy holds steady Trump will be re-elected.
1
Thank you, Thank you, government workers for doing the right thing. It’s honorable and good. I think that more people would do the right thing if they weren’t afraid of losing their jobs and hurting their families. We all struggle with this and so we stay and quietly know we are good. We just want honesty, is that too much to ask. Thank you for your bravery!
21
Witch hunt? Trump and his backers can call it that if they want. But the people participating in this impeachment inquiry are providing evidence of the broom and pointy hat.
59
@Tonyp152 How do you know that? Are you basing it on the selective leaks?
2
@Jackson Did you read the Mueller report, or just Barr’s selective interpretation of it?
3
What leaks? Info is coming from openning public written statements provided by witnesses. Mr Taylor's was 15 pages long. Read them. All members of committees I've seen interviewed on TV say they cannot discuss specifics and they don't. The investigation is a process, the one allowed by the constitution. Let it play out. I understand the findings are upsetting but facts are facts. And Trump, after first saying he didnt do it, has acknowledged it. Does not think it is illegal. That is also why the top player won't talk, why it was done in shadow, because they knew it was illegal and corrupt. Not just to involve a foreign govt in our elections again, but funnel large amounts of foreign money to Republican candidates, and possibly make Guliani and Perry richer and who knows who else by having a stake in Ukrainian gas companies.
4
This isn’t the deep state. Deep state is a conspiracy theory. Stop it.
What is happening here are actual qualified, experienced government employees upholding American values and laws.
When will the media wise up about Trumpism and their role in enabling all of this?
221
Couldn’t agree more!
6
@JM Deep state is a term invented by non patriots. It is sad that many Americans are so uneducated they don't understand how government works and are conned by the term "Deep State".
Those believers in deep state don't understand that employees are hired during both, republican or democratic leadership. They don't have an allegiance toward party. They just have a job that requires an allegiance to our constitution. I know you already know this, but I said it again.
7
And all this time I considered Watergate deep state. And Iran Contra deep state.
You know, that illegal stuff the GOP did.
So now people doing the right thing based on the law and on patriotism are the deep state?
Who knew?
99
Thanks for your reporting. About halfway through the article, you cover the idea of what a “deep state” actually refers to (that is admittedly good). Yet, although your first paragraph puts “deep state” in scare quotes (or perhaps you are quoting Trump?), in subsequent paragraphs it loses these markers of skepticism.
You need to foreground that this is not objective terminology but rather right-wing rhetoric and conspiracy belief. I worry that by uncritically embracing Trump’s language here in the crucial opening paragraphs you risk lending legitimacy to a partisan accusation that has no basis in fact.
I propose that if you mean “professional bureaucracy” you should use those or similar words rather than ones which imply an organized conspiracy. In your effort to speak the snappy language of today’s politics, please be careful about how such phrases represent false and dangerous ideas and, if used frequently enough, can gain currency (thus, legitimacy) and become part of everyday discourse.
74
This isn’t about payback, it’s about duty. I think this headline is misleading and gives credence to Trump’s deep state conspiracy theory. Trump tried to force the Ukraine into interfering in a US election. Witnesses are being compelled to testify and are complying. That’s not personal revenge, that’s obeying the law and duty to the country.
72
@Jane Doe How was investigating quid pro Joe interfering in the 2016 election?
Duty — what a concept. “A moral or legal obligation; a responsibility” for those in office who have forgotten what it means. Heartfelt thanks to those who have not.
Keep the focus where it should be, New York Times: on the testimony before the House concerning U.S. policy toward Ukraine, the Trump administration’s call for Ukrainian investigations, and the withholding of $391 million in military aid.
The courageous foreign service and intelligence officers who have testified to Congress are professionals doing their jobs.
Framing this in the context of a so-called “deep state” does a disservice to these public servants.
45
@ANetliner
Watch Joe Biden brag about withholding $1 Billion from the Ukraine until the president fires the prosecutor investigating Hunter Biden's company.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UXA--dj2-CY
1
Despite the drama this and other media accounts seek to generate, there is no “threat” to Trump’s presidency in this impeachment game. There would only be a threat if he faced any real possibility of removal from office, and it’s quite clear that he does not. Even his re-election now seems assured, thanks to the railroading tactics of the House in what was meant to be an exercise in democracy. So please, get on with the impeachment vote and either the dismissal or the acquittal, so we can get back to the election. Thank you very much.
10
@Guapoboy
Yours is a fairly typical reaction: get it over with.
The problem is that complex problems require more work, and more investigation.
What "railroading" are you referring to? Subpoenaing people who were direct witnesses to some transaction? Seeking actual records to review? There is no way to skip these steps.
There are no guarantees that when an effort of this sort this begins, it will be "successful," however that may be defined. But it may be b necessary to do this as a reflection, in this instance, of the House's responsibility for oversight, and the President's refusal to abide by rules.
What short cuts do you think there are?
6
It has become clearer why President Trump's two most common targets are the Press the "Deep State" -- because their jobs are -- to tell the truth.
36
Republicans have been engaged in a confederate war against the government of the United States for decades, with megatons of anti-government propaganda avalanching media and cultural channels for decades.
It is only with the rise of Trump that this effort has been widely exposed for what it is.
Even so, it is shockingly unclear at this point whether our country will repudiate it in the 2020 election.
The masses who have been duped into Republican ideology are formidable.
27
What does the President do all day besides watch Fox news and yell at people? He ran his businesses into the ground and he is doing the same with our country. As entertaining as all this has been, it's time for him to go.
50
Donald came to office saying, and probably believing, the most cynical things about the United States and our government.
Donald in response to Putin critics mysteriously dying ... "There are a lot of killers. You think our country's so innocent?"
He came into office and acted on that belief - didn't release his tax returns as promised, skirted if not violated the emoluments clause, withheld public funds to coerce Ukraine to investigate a hoax (with added pressure to come to the Donald's preferred conclusion about Biden and the 2016 elections), etc
But our country was and still is better than that. We already were great. Public servants and the government, while imprefect and needing oversight, were never the worst versions Donald thought they were.
And now public servants are pushing back. They resent being a part of his cynical and corrupt plots. Good for them and great for America.
I hope and pray the next administration understands the essential goodness of our country and behaves accordingly.
26
Someone once said: “Elections have consequences, and at the end of the day, I won. So I think on that one I trump you.”
1
How does John Bolton fit into this mix? Is he new school or old school? Most people would have guessed that he was a new school Trumper, but Ms. Hill’s testimony crediting him with the most quotable quotes puts him with the seasoned diplomats. “I am not part of whatever drug deal Sondland and Mulvaney are cooking up,” “Giuliani’s a hand grenade who’s going to blow everybody up,”
When the impeachment hearings are made public, the committees should call Bolton, his testimony regarding the inner workings of the Trump White House, will do more to enlighten the Trump base than anyone else.
6
Love him or loathe him, Mr Bolton has always been a man of integrity, which is why he got the boot from the Trump administration.
1
Just want to point out that Clinton fired the White House Travel Office not because he feared their loyalty to G.W. Bush (because really how does that even affect their job performance) but because he wanted to reward people from his campaign.
5
"DEEP STATE" What a misnomer and insult to the thousands of public servants and career employees of our Nation. They are under more observation and oversight than any in private enterprises. Rather than relying upon the people who could help his administration the President is seeking to cut the legs out from the underpinnings of the system. In his quest for absolute control he is creating absolute chaos.
19
The way that the term "deep state" is used in this article just gives the purveyors of that theory some very quotable language that they can use. I know that you are actually trying to debunk the theory, but the way you go about it is too subtle and just gives them fuel for their fire.
8
Yes, the deep state exists and these unelected bureaucrats are seeking to vindicate their judgment for those of our elected leaders. Bad times for the United States and our republic. The ballot box is where political differences should be settled.
Not a statesman in the gaggle of Democrats to stand up to their party and state “Enough”. Offhand, the first of the a Democrat presidential contenders who did so would be rewarded with support of the less left-wing nutty members of the party, arguably a larger cohort than the progressives.
6
@Truthbeknown: The Electoral College is the most insulting travesty of democracy pandered to any people by any nation.
1
@Truthbeknown: Do you really think that the IT Department employees of, let’s say, the Social Security Administration, should all be elected instead of appointed based on their IT skills? I have a bridge to sell you...
My hero. Not afraid to tell the truth. If only our politicians followed his code.
4
I dont like bureaucracy: is slow, it gets in the way, sometimes, and much is seen by many to the same results. However, at the top of the State Dept and foreign policy, this bureaucracy is the one with the memory muscle to guide any administration through the cultural complexities of diplomacy. The Trump administration-coming from the president himself- disregard for any historical, political and social concerns is whom have triggered discomfort and uneasiness. There are ways to isolate the nation, as he wants, that are still under diplomatic agreements, but this administration is happy to break and then do not want to see the consequences. I really hope more of the bureaucracy comes out and exposed the ignorance and blatant lack of education of this president and his cronies.
3
The so called impeachment process is a farce. Closed hearings with no cross examination and selective leaks by the Democrats to show Trump in the worst possible light. No actual transcripts being released. Impeachment is supposed to be serious bipartisan non political event which is the opposite of what is going on. It is ultimately going nowhere and will backfire big time on the Democrats
7
This isn’t an impeachment yet dummy. Just an investigation, conducted in the same process as every other investigation. Are grand jury testimonies done in public? No. Don’t worry, once the impeachment begins it will be in public and Trump’s crimes will be exposed for all to see. And seriously, you think there’s some way any of this can be explained away?
19
@Harry
All hearings for Impeachment are closed--as were the Republican ones in the past. And there is cross examination--there are Republicans in the committees who ask questions. And the transcripts will be released, but they have to be checked for national security first, and any proper legal process makes sure they hear from all witnesses before releasing testimony, so that witnesses don't influence each other.
Clinton's impeachment was hardly bi-partisan. I'm not sure where you get your news or ideas, but most of what you wrote is not accurate, including (in my opinion) your conclusion.
7
This is not yet an impeachment proceeding: it is a preliminary inquiry to determine if there is sufficient evidence to undertake an impeachment proceeding.
The legal equivalent: an investigation by a district attorney or a U.S. attorney to determine if a grand jury should be convened. Such investigations are not public.
2
Trump does NOT believe in conspiracies; he does believe that they are effective when relating to his base and to distract the rest of us.
2
President Trump was elected in part to drain "The Swamp" and in the process fight "The Deep State". Only Trump has the wherewithal and tenacity to get it done and that is why he deserves four more years to continue the process.
6
@KR
It's curious then that so many of his own appointees have had to quit or have been investigated and found guilty.
3
Thanks, comrade, but Trump is the biggest swamp critter of them all and the deep state is actually our loyal public servants doing their job to protect our constitution.
In 5 or ten years time, when people look back they will view the Steele dossier as the just the tip of the iceberg and a warning of things to come.
7
He would be more believable if he'd begun by pushing to dismantle the 'deep state' Electoral College that elected him.
7
Just to pay attention to the phrasing: To write that Trump "never trusted" the intelligence agencies' "conclusion that Russia intervened in the 2016 election on his behalf" makes it appear as an issue of trust or as an indication of a state of paranoia. But if Trump knew that Russia intervened - and he had even invited them - then would be misleading to write of "never trusting"; it would be more accurate to say that Trump "dismisses" the intelligence agency's conclusions.
5
@CSH: Trump publicly called for the Russians to hack the Democrats, and they did.
1
When the very people who are elected to uphold, implement and honor the law, break the law, there should be severe consequences.
I'm a physician and once I defied the court order, an arrest warrant was issued and I had to explain to the judge the reason for my disobedience. I was respectfully told by the judge that I could have done that by going in front of him and explained to him in person.
The White House and cabinet members many of them lawyers, could have gone in front of the perspective committee and taken the 5th. That would have been perfectly legal.
This administration, starting from the top, is not only breaking the laws but trying to change the laws very unlawfully and for that they should be punished.
The impeachment should be in order.
3
I don’t think this article offers a fair assessment. Our nation’s civil servants and military personnel are doing their jobs and implementing policy as accorded by law, whether they agree with it or not.
What we’re seeing in Congress, however, are law-abiding civil servants complying with subpoenas and testifying to violations of the law which they witnessed. They are correctly disobeying the President’s illegal directive to ignore the subpoenas — doing so would be contempt of Congress. This isn’t a “Deep State” conspiracy, or an anti-Trump rebellion.
I don’t envy their position. They’re stuck in-between the possibility of being fired and being jailed for contempt. But they are demonstrating that their loyalty is not to the President, but to the laws and the people of the United States, and I am grateful to them for that.
10
@Marshall: Every person dragged into this faces steep legal bills that could bankrupt them.
Kudos to these honorable governmental employees who have the courage to take a stand against the current administration. They will be the ones that history looks upon as having acted in the best interests of our nation.
25
The race is on: Will Trump destroy the United States government, before the United States government destroys Trump.
I wish the answer were obvious, but it is not.
20
His own ego personality is destroying himself making one to wonder if he just wants out for he is fighting himself in his debt to Putin. He may be in the verge of sharing our security files with Putin.
5
I think this is a wrong way to phrase this and especially make it a headline. The foxers will run with it and say "We told you so!"
3
Mr. President, you've distrusted and battled nearly ceaselessly with our nations most respected government institutions of investigation and law enforcement. You've belittled, embarrassed and mocked many of their leaders as well as the rank-and-file. How can you be surprised that these same professionals are investigating you as they would any person suspected of foul play. And on a simply human level, have you forgotten that what goes around comes around?
11
Sorry George if I am wrong: but I venture Kelly Conway is the infamous anonymous.
5
A very troubling article.
For career civil servants, especially those working in the White House or at the highest level of agencies, especially in the foreign service and military, to take issue with following policy direction from the President and duly appointed Cabinet heads means they have a choice - get over it or get out.
Serving civil servants have many roles, with very few at the level of working with leadership and implementing the President's policies. Those working in those roles, unlike the mass of bureaucrats tending to the day-to-day of running the government, have a higher duty and fine line to walk. Yet, to think their concepts of the proper policy direction should override that of our elected leaders is the very embodiment of 'deep state'.
The reporters, and too many of the commenters, seem to have a weak, even warped, understanding of the above concepts of how the government runs. And this is mostly driven by the obvious bias against the Trump Administration.
7
Sorry Common Sense, your argument does not make sense. Upon your assertions, these “duly elected and appointed” officials should have the right to run rough shod over the US Constitution because they “know best.” These career civil servants are watching the very institutions they have worked for erode from inside due to the policies made by this admin. So, they might need to get out, as you said, but that does not mean they shouldn’t speak up. They are doing what our Congress has failed to do: telling the truth.
6
Barely elected Trump has smeared every check and balance against Presidential power possible: journalists, our national security agencies and even congress. His campaign to circumvent obstacles to absolute power
2
@Amy D
There is a difference between disagree with policy direction and being directed to 'break the law'. My reference to go along or get out was to the former.
In cases of the latter, all government agencies have an Investigator General where allegations of wrongdoing or corruption are required to be reported.
Most, if not all, of the allegations against Trump and his appointees have not been taking the route of reporting allegations to their IG's. They've been played out with Congress, in the press and in the public sphere. To me and many others, that stinks more of people following a partisan vendetta than doing their job.
1
This is the very battle between Good vs Evil that George Orwell imagined was lost in 1984.
Fiction is reality reimagined. These heroic stewards of our Democracy along with those of us who oppose Trump are fighting for the other reality (ending) Orwell hoped for when he wrote 1984.
2
The "Deep State", that mythic place where all thriller-diller, movies arise has occupied the minds of many Americans for much of the post World War ll period. Sadly, this reveals a complete collapse of our public libraries and library instruction in our public schools. All Americans need to understand that, for the most part through out our history, public servants, served the public good by following the law and carrying out their jobs under the watchful eye of the bureaucracy. There is no cadre of upstart revolutionaries working to turn American into a communist camp, or to take over Fort Knox. Those actions are made up. They are called "fictional". In a library, fiction books are listed alphabetically by the author's last name. Non-fiction is list by subject under categories like "history" or "crime". Now that you know that, maybe it will clarify some of the thinking out there.
6
Trump will not go down without taking everyone and everything he can with him.
The “deep state” is not a thing. It is simply a moniker the far right has adopted to put gloss on their destruction of the components of government people actually need. Paul Ryan already made clear their intention to destroy social security, Medicare, food stamps, education assistance . . . All but the military, because of course that is sacrosanct and definitely not socialist (unlike all other government services).
Run them all out of town on a rail. Liars and thieves, the entire bloviated lot of them.
But there is always the possibility the generals will back of Trump. The image of them sitting with Trump in their MAGA hats at his 4th of July extravaganza was truly the most disturbing image from the entire sordid period.
24
The US differs from my native Norway in many ways. One difference is that in the US a much larger share of the top bureaucrats is replaced when there is a change in government. I am not claiming that the "Norwegian way" is better than the "US way" – the US is the world's most powerful country, while Norway with 5+ million citizens is far from that. Fortunately, many would rightfully remark.
However, retaining a larger share of top bureaucrats has its merits. First, it adds consistency to policy. Second, it helps to provide counterarguments to proposed actions. The latter is more important than many may believe. For example, if Mr. Trump had not decided to withdraw US troops from where the Kurdish live along the Turkey-Syria border, Mr. Erdogan may not have chosen to invade – an invasion with massive costs to the people living in the area, and with possible large negative impacts on how the rest of the world trusts the US. Bluntly put, the next time somebody chooses to support democracy and human rights in a regional conflict, they are likely to think twice.
Even powerful countries need friends they can trust. Too often, Mr. Trump's rash actions reduce trust. If Mr. Trump in stead had chosen to listen to the counter arguments from public servants with massive foreign policy experience, trust could have been higher. This requires that the US political leadership views internal disagreement as healthy rather than as disobedience.
If we cannot trust the US, who can we trust?
11
Trump is the deep state. As is typical of a deep state, Trump functions on intimidation, distortion and denial of truth that through brainwashing turns lies into truth, suppression of free press and free thought, and creates a system of power that through the cooperation of self serving corrupt ideologues fearful of their own insignificance, maintains its dictatorial power over the masses. Trump is a tragedy, so insecurely narcissist that he is incapable of any self-reflection, other than his own narcissist delusions about his imagined importance and imagined powers. His tragedy can become the even greater tragedy of all of humanity should his deep state succeed, and therein follows a setback failure of progress and enlightenment in western and worldwide civilization. Let us pray Trump and his deep state does not succeed.
20
Whether it’s factual or not, we truly should stop referring to this psychotic clown and unhinged madman as anything other than what he is: a psychiatric patient who belongs in a padded cell under observation.
After this insanity comes to an end - and mercifully it will - I am still counting on the outcome of all petty tyrants in history whose clocks run out, even for Iron-fisted dictatorships (see Stalin, et. al) Mr. Trump must be studied by mental health professionals and social scientists to unravel the baffling series of events that ushered in this reign of terror.
We owe it to the coming generations - that we carefully study how this absolute bedlam befell us and how we can best ensure no human being of his grossly dysfunctional and disordered mental make up ever gets to call himself President, except during a severely delusional psychotic break, receiving psychotherapy on an analyst’s couch.
17
Well reasoned and well said.
4
Mr. Mulvaney stated to reporters last week that all this testimony coming forward is from "people who don't like Trump's politics". These 'politics" in other words include obstruction of justice and abuse of power. This is nothing short of the sheer arrogance that permeates the White House from the top down. This administration considers the rest of the American people as fools. Well you can fool some of the people some of the time but not all the people all the time. Time's up, folks. A visit to crowbar hotel will do some good to most of these folks. It has become increasingly difficult for the rest of us to just "get over it". It's time they "get over it".
12
It is with 100 percent known consensus among the masses that the Deepest State of Bias we are going thru has Big Media as its caretaker.....there will be Zero Trust until A.I. with self awareness comes into play!
1
And who will be in charge of A.I. ?
@Joseph Corcoran ..it will be a truth in itself and We will all be a part of it as its Prime directive will be Love , Peace , and the Pursuit of Happiness.-
This is obvious, a truism. You will get more cooperation if you add sugar to the medicine, etc, so many sayings just like this one. I did not elect government employees to run foreign policy of this country. Half the students in private schools want to work in the Dept. of State. They want to go into the most "lucrative" part of the government. Soon the pharmaceutical companies will rear their ugly head as well. The Trump administration has fast tracked approval for generic drugs, 3000 approvals in one year. Big Pharma is not happy when costs for drugs goes down. Call it what you want, but the vested interests of the unelected government employees run counter to a strong President who wants to put the U.S. interests before those of foreign governments. Trump probably views the government as a company that adheres to the CEO,s directive. This everyone knows is not true for the gov't. and that is why the government operates under a 23 trillion dollar deficeit. It is completely inefficient.
2
"I’ve done big damage", says Trump.
Correction: that should be "I’ve done bigly damage", and not to the public service either.
He has done hugest bigly damage to the power of the U.S., both hard and soft.
5
The article is right on point!
The simple Truth is that this is the battle of good moral people who truly and selflessly care about our Nation against a corrupt and immoral man who seeks to create a Deep State made up of immoral and corrupt people like himself who care not one bit for the Nation that helped them produce their wealth.
This is the Good vs. Evil battle George Orwell imagined was lost in 1984.
I am so very grateful that these good people who care so deeply about our Country are now fighting against the Deep State - a real Evil empire lead by nefarious souls like Putin, Trump, Netanyahu, MBS, Orban, Duterte, and Kim.
Here’s a Truth: Fiction is generally a result of Reality imagined a different way.
Let us work toward the ending Orwell imagined didn’t happen.
5
This article as written supports Trump efforts to frame federal civil servants as "the deep state." In truth, this is a workforce that pays attention to executing ethical government. However, this article suggests the Federal civil service is picking a fight with Trump because of his disregard and disparagement of their expertise. Federal employees take an oath to the Constitution, not to a President. They also subscribe to a code of conduct to be faithful stewards of taxpayer funds. They are experienced in expecting to shift priorities when new administrations come into power. But rules against lying, corruption, misuse of taxpayer funds, abuse of power, doing no harm don't change with each administration. This current regime is a criminal regime with no loyalty to the United States and its values. Thank goodness for the federal workforce that has been the only stable factor in this nightmare.
20
The professional civil service is one of the pillars of U.S. competitiveness. Weaken the pillar and U.S. strength becomes less balanced and lacks the capacity to respond to the extraordinary complexity of challenges facing the U.S. Bannon's goal of destroying the administrative state (deep state) is an attack on U.S. competitiveness to the benefit of enemies of the country.
Reforms of government bureaucracies are necessary in an ever changing world. That is one benefit of the U.S. system that opens the presidency to people with no prior experience. However Trump's attack on the deep state is not an attempt at reform to improve the system, but more in the spirit of Bannon who said he was a Leninist, a Bolshevik who believes in revolution and not reforms.
The U.S. has demonstrated extraordinary capacity for self-renewal during its tumultuous history. Trump will be gone leaving very serious damage. However, his actions have also had a positive effect. Thousands of new people have made a commitment to public service to counter what Trump stands for. The process of renewal is well underway. The awakening of the professional civil service is part of the process.
1
Adoption of the 'deep state' moniker without quotation marks in the body of this article is a sort of victory for proponents of the concept that tries to imply federal government people are part of a nefarious cabal with its own agenda.
13
Trump always knew he would come up against what he calls the deep state.He has probably always been coming up against rules and regulations all his life. He wants to do what he wants, he pays no attention to the rights of others,he has no empathy for the plight of others,he thinks you are strong if you always win. He sues everyone when they sue him. He is a wrecking ball in life. Of course he hates the deep state. But this time he has gone too far. He is not above the law, like he wants to claim. He will find this out, and if he breaks more laws when he seeks to distract,they will only be more fuel for his impeachment.
9
Here’s the Deep State: Make a list of who sits on the boards of the top 500 corporations in the U.S. Then collate those names to see how many sit on multiple boards, and examine the families of those board members to see how many corporate boards those family members sit on. The resultant list will give you about 200 families who control a vast percentage of wealth in the U.S., and the power that goes along with it. That is the Deep State.
54
A counter model to these paid tools of the swamptocracy is Adam Schiff, a first-class exhibit of the High State, the finest treasure trove of public servants to be found, embracing and dedicating themselves with high urgency of high duty to the high road and a high bar of high morals, high values, a high work ethic, high quality, high-level determination, resilience, stamina, patience, and perseverance, a high output and outpouring of high dividends to society, as well as (to) a higher cause, a higher love, and a higher loyalty than to a perfidious tyrant or a bigoted, whimsical, and vindictive projection of the primitive understandings that tribal religion has planted in us.
It's a Deep State too: a State of Deep Connecting and Union!
Schiff is the unrelenting, secure, precise, prudent, determined, and surgically perceptive investigator and prosecutor we need to represent us the American people and to take on and tackle an entire admin and complicit helper's helper gang of crime suspects subordinate to the main suspect known as Individual One, in turn a tool of Oligarch One of the Kremlin.
No surprise this makes the unmatched wisdom in the head of the stable subversius explode to self-pitying pieces on a daily basis.
Thank you, Adam Schiff! I hope your wife didn't originate from a rib of yours, as you need them all in view of what you got to shoulder. Make America the vulnerable and imperfect but beautiful paradise again that we came from and sail us to greatness again!
4
Regarding a Deep State, in the last few months of the Dubya Admin there was a major effort to place people in senior civil service positions who would be able to impede the Obama Admin.
Democrats saw it happening, and objected at the time. There were stories on it in the mainstream media.
To some degree, it may have worked. Certainly Obama was frustrated to an amazing degree, and it may be that more Republicans than only those elected had a hand in that.
I'd like to see real study of how Obama was blocked and frustrated by the planned Deep State activities at the end of the Dubya Admin.
Then this starts to look like payback.
It also starts to look like the breakdown of our original conception of civil service, breaking down under the weight of bad behavior of our recent past crop of politicians.
Oh, but Democrats would not do that? Ask Tulsi about some (not all) of those Democrats, and what they did and still do. “You, the queen of warmongers, embodiment of corruption, and personification of the rot that has sickened the Democratic Party for so long."
If corruption were a problem on only one side, then the fix would be much easier. Our problem is that for the Trump of Republicans there was the Hillary of Democrats, and they won't even see it in their self righteous blinding Outrage.
8
@Mark Thomason Both major parties have failed in their mandate to represent the citizens of America, yet neither one owns up to their failing.
5
@Ronn -- True.
Speaking of it that way all the time is taken by many to be an excuse. "They both do it" is seen to offer an excuse for whichever one was mentioned first.
It isn't, of course. But that is the conversational constant to be dealt with here.
1
I’m sorry, but implying that professional civil servants are acting out of anything other than patriotism requires way more evidence than you are presenting here.
2
I have casually talked to people in a mental institution for treatment. Each one who talked to me told me why they were there. It was never about them,it was always some other person who put them there or they got there by mistake, or because of some unlikely incident. It was never about them. I guess if they could have seen why they were there, they would not have needed to be there.
When Trump always blames someone else for things he himself has instigated, lashing out wildly at them,calling them belittling names and so forth, I see what appears to be mental problems. Trump cannot see the results of his own actions. No one would deliberately act this way if they could see themselves in the mirror of the aware mind. The Republicans feel trapped in a cage of their own making. Some of them have actually made themselves believe what Trump says and they have taken on his anger and his words. These people should be able to think outside the box, but they cannot.
Some of them are using him for their own agendas.
Humans are fallible brings. Can we manage to collectively sort this out before we as a country collapse into either anarchy or dictatorship? I sincerely hope so.
17
Of course 'the deep state' is the United States.
The billionaires who support Trump are all better described as oligarchs, whether they are American or foreign.
At this point the chance the Senate removes him for office for high crimes and misdemeanors (high crimes like treason and obstruction of justice, misdemeanors like self-dealing) are at best 50-50.
That means there's at least a 50-50 chance our country is about to be demolished. These state department patriots just want to make sure we understand that.
18
And, in other news, Trump says that his US retreat from Syria was a "bog success" and that everyone who is anyone has called him and told him that this betrayal of our Kurdish allies showed that he remains the same stable genius that he thinks he is.
4
Ukraine is just the pretext/sideshow here. Deep state is coming after Trump because he has threatened to shut down US involvement in the Middle East (Syria/Saudi/Yemen/Turkey/Iraq/Iran) and global hot and cold war machine. He'll be lucky if impeachment and conviction is all that is in store for him, vs. what happened to JFK when he crossed the Deep state and tried to withdraw from Vietnam. It's no coincidence, by the way, that you are now seeing stories to the effect "Democratic donors wonder if there are other candidates out there". These 'donors' [aka military industrial complex] are concerned that none of the current Democratic candidates are sufficiently committed to the endless wars on which their profits depend.
8
I do not think any American administration in history have ever done so much to further Russian geo-political interests and shrink American influence as this one. The State Department employees charged with implementing these new policies must be finding the situation baffling and frustrating.
The President is well within his rights to promulgate a "Trump doctrine" of foreign policy. People can live with a policy that is reasonable even if it differs with with long-standing policies in some respects. However the current "seat of the pants" style of foreign policy is deeply unsettling.
7
Seems like all a lot of these people really needed was an opportunity to tell their story. And now they are. And hopefully we as a nation will be the better for it.
15
Using the phrase “deep state” gives credibility to ludicrously paranoid conspiracy theories. The phrase “deep state” is an insult to loyal, committed public servants - be they officials, advisers, or service personnel - who have sworn to uphold the Constitution. Any suggestion that they are enjoying an opportunity for ‘karmic revenge’ when they come forward to identify breaches of the Constitution or other illegal acts diminishes readers’ appreciation of their commitment to their duty.
15
This comes as a proof that the public officials serving national interests are as much a guarantee of stability, freedom and order built into the institutions after WWII as any politician or president. The institutions need to work even if the political process is thwarted and if you get rid of them and replace them with self serving people or serving only the interests of the president you get very quickly on the level of dysfunction evident in Russia or even Ukraine.
5
The Party of Trump’s strategy has finally reached its zenith of ideology above reality. The only problem is, as we are now seeing things play out, when ideology trumps fact-based reality, conflict isn’t just a possibility; it’s inevitable. The bedrock of democracy is having a shared reality among the citizenry, which proves the point that Trump and his supporters really don’t care about democracy; for them, it’s win at all costs. As a career civil servant myself, I applaud these patriots who are standing up for the rule of law and the Constitution. Carry on.
6
I do not have exact statistics, but I would venture to guess that next to the CIA, FBI, and the NSA, the State Dept has suffered more deliberate cuts as well as loss of personnel under the Trump Administration than most other departments because Hillary Clinton had been the Secretary of State. I hope the next President will restore and increase the hiring of full time Federal employees and reduce the use of contractors and political appointees ( unless they have the proper experience and credential)
3
The whole deep state business is nonsense. The U.S. government runs a large bureaucracy, because the federal government has a lot to deal with. Organization, education, systems, good record-keeping, and protocol are important in keeping such a huge bureaucracy running efficiently. For that you need the expertise and experience of people who've been on the job. People who know what the laws are, and who respect them above their own party preferences. These people serve us, they protect us, and they are loyal to the rule of law and the Constitution, not a particular president or leader. They are our employees, and we trust them to do the right thing.
92
@Allison
There is much truth in what you write, but I can attest from personal experience over many decades, serving in the executive branch, that there are indeed people in the USG, many at quite senior levels, who will not hesitate to take action to sabotage or delay administration policies with which they disagree. And that includes dozens of American diplomats who serve in the US foreign service.
@David H : If they are disagreeing with policies that undermine Congressional directives or the rule of law, then good for them. No one should be forced into unethical behavior just because the boss wants it. If, on the other hand, they are acting in their own private interests, as the current president appears to be, and not in the interests of the greater good, then shame on them. At this juncture, I would be asking what motivates public servants to delay or sabotage the executive branch.
1
In countries like India career civil servants have to do gymnastics with third rate politicians elected by illiterates and thugs. But some civil servants are extremely corrupt, crooked and cronyistic. Good ones in the system can do great good in a quiet nuanced way. Bad ones are incompetent or corrupt or both. Civil servants are not perfect, nor angels , nor all bad. There is a whole lot of mix there.
2