My predictions:
The weapon Gendry made was not for the Night King but for a dragon. Arya "Mary Sue" Stark discovers she can fly and drop kicks the last dragon while skewering it. She then yells, "Roadhouse!"
After that, Arya hopped up on Red Bull, slaps the Starbucks cup out of Dany's hand and kills her. She then flees north. She is found frozen solid with Needle in her hand fulfilling the first season promise of her dying by freezing with a needle in her hand.
Jon refuses crown, still knows nothing, takes the black again. Remember, "Once you take the Black, you never go back."
Tyrion who is still married to Sansa takes the Iron Throne.
They become King and Queen of the Seven Kingdoms. -Blah
The Onion Knight becomes the new Hand, Samwell Tarley becomes the new Meister. -Blah, blah
Bran becomes Warden of the North. Bankrupts it by bringing it up to ADA codes.
Tormund comforts Brienne in her grief. He wonders why their child cannot dunk.
Theon does not get reunited with his package in the afterlife. He burns while his Willy gets wings.
Ghost still does not get petted.
5
« Let it be fear ». What more do you need?
2
Will civilization be able to survive the end of Game of Thrones?
Gosh, I hope so.
4
I want plot lines and characters that make sense not a really bad Season 7(what a waste). And many questions will not be answered because they ran out of book.
I watched "Game of Thrones" several times at a friend's house. Sorry, but my opinion was that it is the equivalent to a daytime soap with a lot more blood.
3
Congratulations on your detailed knowledge of Game of Thrones, its various plots and prophecies. I believe you've gotten in too deep to enjoy the finale.
3
Ok, whatever happens, the final scene will be Sam (aka George RR Martin) recording the story for posterity.
1
I'm not sure anyone is going to sit on the Iron throne again. Didn't it melt?
4
I'm going to watch
2
There is just over one hour before the GOT finale, but if wishes came true, I'd wish for Sam to become the benevolent leader of the (democratized) Seven Kingdoms after he breaks up the stupid spiky throne. (And isn't that kind of what happened in Lord of the Rings, which is the inspiration for GOT? Sam survives and becomes a benevolent leader/sheriff in his Hobbit home.) It would be a new day. The wheel would be broken. Democracy and wisdom would rule! Too bad that can't come true for the U.S. Where's our (Uncle) Sam? I don't see one in the over-two-dozen candidates on offer, but the current person in our highest office is a male Cersei, definitely.
2
@Sonja Brisson Please scroll down to see my comment below. Great minds think alike.
I don't agree with the rhetoric here claiming that Dany is exactly who she's always been or that her character's behavior in the last episode makes perfect sense. It does not. Dany was certainly unyielding in her punishment of those who tried to sell and rape her, the immoral slave owners, those trying to chain her and her dragons, those refusing to surrender after a war has been one, Dothraki princes ready to destroy her, etc. But she has also been a goodhearted person taking Missandei as her confidante - not her slave - as Missandei points out more than once in the show. Same with Grey Worm. The Dany sitting on the steps talking to Tyrion after she makes him her hand (the fact that she even makes this Lannister her hand!); the Dany reaching out to the recalcitrant Sansa; the Dany sacrificing a dragon to save Jon & Co. on that ludicrous endeavor beyond the Wall. I don't see how any of this jives with the homicidal maniac slaughtering all those innocent people. She "snapped" - that's our motivation?
Had we had a build up to this mania - if we'd had a slow burn against Jon's rejection, the provincial nonsense in the North, the loss of yet another dragon, etc., it might leave you less incredulous.
I fear Dany will die tonight - but instead of that being a tragedy it will seem as merely her comeuppance. And that betrays the story, her riveting story, that's been told for so many years.
12
OOORRRRRRR........ Maybe Bran took control over the dragon and scorched the city. Maybe Bran is the Lord of Light. After all this is the Game of Thrones. If Bran did such a move, Starks would kill Danny, claim the throne, Bran would sabotage John and He would have stake. Think about it. Danny was headed right for the Red Keep. Then we never see a shot of her again. Both Danny and Bran had the same vision (foreshadow much?) and the Dragon has an obvious course.....
2
"Power resides where people believe it resides."
Riddle? Hmmm...
More like aphorism.
1
I find it very unfortunate that people who could never hope to approach the utter genius, the collaboration, the level of creative commitment or the overall quality of this extraordinary series feel as though their $14 a month paid to HBO entitles them to sit on their lazy bottoms and whine about minutiae. This country is pathetic.
2
We know why Dany snapped. It was those rude French knights.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eVyxnMM3ldc
1
I thought magic returned to the world when the dragons appeared. That was alluded to in season #2. If the last dragon dies, does it not go or sleep until the next dragons emerge?
With all the insanity happening in this country this show was a great escape.
Only hope that there is justice in the ending and appreciate the great show that it is.
4
The show doesn’t need to answer any of these questions
The uncertainty makes for a great show...why do you and others want absolute certainty?
5
Really? You're going to spoil our enjoyment of the series finale with your personal litmus test? I don't care if it answers your precious questions or not. I'm going to watch tonight and enjoy being part of the farewell party for one of the most important TV shows of all time, however imperfect. The fact that you're so vested in these questions testifies to the cultural and social impact it's had. For just one night, don't be a critic. Be a fan.
1
I'd love to see all these questions answered, but the show is just too sprawling to be wrapped up neatly at this point. This size and complexity are what I love about it, so I feel little justification in complaining now.
Looking back, many of the key storylines have ebbed and flowed logically--the Khaleesi title gave way to Dragon Queen, Dorne peaks and fades away. I was reading a data analysis of those script terms that mean most to the show and it shed an insightful light on some of these outstanding questions.
https://www.ceros.com/originals/game-of-thrones-script-analysis/
2
I appreciate being turned on to the music of Ramin Djawadi. The shows writing is excellent, but I don't know how impactful that writing would be without the soaring scores and perfect timing of much of the music.
Some can take away disappointment in what they perceive in the writing of this season. Others will take away new found experiences. Among others, I'm taking away Ramin Djawadi......what a talent!
5
I think the show has mainly been about what makes a hero. Ned Stark was loyal to his word, Jon works for the common good of the people, Arya learns to know who she really is, the Hound saves those who will save others because he is basically good-hearted under his rough exterior, the Red Woman, faces her own death, and is looking for a way to serve God, Bran's suffering brings the death of the Night King because he had a higher purpose for his life. The problem with Dany is that from the beginning she did everything for power and to be loved by the people. Even evil Cerceis gets a death with someone she loves because she did most of her bad deeds motivated by love for her children. Dany was motivated by power and it will be the end of her. She seduced the people she freed because she wanted the power of them following her. The first moment she is not the center of that attention and love she flips to her dark side. I think Sansa and Tyrion have shown good sense and made good decisions as the situation changed. My prediction is that Jon will not want to rule, Dany will die at both he and Arya's hand, Tyrion will set up a democratic counsel to rule. Tyrion is saved. Arya will take someones face who is close to Dany, probably the leader of her army. Jon will fly away on one of the Dragon's at the end while Sam is seen writing the story for future generations to read about.
9
There are so many mistakes in this article. I don't think the writer has been paying attention. First example, Bran does not see things in advance. Second example, Martha works in the kitchen, not with ravens. And there are many more.
4
@blockhead
Well, I don’t know about Bran—I thought he sees things but doesn’t necessarily know what they mean. But obviously Martha, kitchen worker or not, was doing Varys’s bidding.
8
I think a lot of the plot lines will remain unanswered at the end so that Martin can sell his books which reveal all. He held back the final books so that HBO could have the big reveal. Now it's his turn for payback. As for some characters that go nowhere, they are the traditional red herrings to keep us guessing. They may or may not be expanded upon and resolved in the books or the sequels and prequels.
I do have to say that I'm disappointed in the way that Martin approaches his character development. His idea that people really can't change their basic traits has many of the seemingly changed characters revert to evil or good at the end. People do change and grow in real life sometimes for better or worse. His point of view is depressing and wrong. And his view of women is warped.
4
I sort of like Arya becoming the Hand whomever winds up ruling. Alternatively I like Jon and Arya and maybe Tyrion just turning their backs on the whole mess and going home to an independent North. Maybe Tyrion and Sansa could make their marriage work.
The biggest problem facing everyone now is not magical monsters or tyrannical rulers, it is starvation.
Winter has just arrived and will last for many years. How will rulers and the nobility feed Westeros? The country has been a giant muddy battlefield all Fall. The farmers have not had the ability to plant, safely husband livestock, or store foods safely away.
6
Did it arrive (Winter) or did the defeat of the white walkers change the dynamic ? I don't believe that was answered except for the fact, it looked like there was some clearing going on.
2
It was actually Bran who projected his mind into Daenerys who destroyed Kings Landing. It happened sometime just after her last closeup.
Drogon now spent from all the excitement, lays a dragon egg on top of Winterfell and sleeps for the rest of the episode. Can't. Be. Bothered.
Arya decides to avenge the bbq'd commoners by killing Tyrian to steel his face, then as Tyrian kills Daenerys.
Grey Worm then kills 'Tyrian' but then it's revealed it's Arya and Jon Snow kills Grey Worm.
Sansa kills Jon Snow because he chose family over family... er... sigh.
Breanne dies trying to defend Sansa from Ser Bronn as she walks into the sea like Geraldine Page in Interiors.
Yara dies. Puck dies. Both in separate random accidents involving horses.
That creepy tree comes to life and eats Bran to restore balance to the universe.
The citadel reveals that somehow Davos is actually now the rightful heir to the Iron Throne. He declares it's "bowl of brown" day for all of Westeros, the people rejoice and all try to reproduce his accent to show their affections.
Sam Tarly is named his hand, Gilly the Master of Coin.
In a series ending cliff hanger moment we cut to Gendry who vows to see it all burn... again, someday.
3
I have a feeling the ending of this series is going to be as crazy-making, dissatisfying, up-in-the-air-with-unanswered-questions, and brilliant as the end of the Sopranos (which still drives me crazy!).
5
Dear Terry,
Maybe I can help you come to terms with the Sopranos ending at least. Tony had irritated all the higher-ups in the mob, and was left with no real allies. The guy glaring at him in the diner was the man sent to kill him. The mob broke their own rule about assassinating someone in front of his family, and when the screen cuts to black, that's when Tony got shot in the back of the head.
4
Unless House Frey has re-invented itself as a matriarchy, Edmure is not controlled by it. Arya wiped out all its menfolk.
I am rooting for a scene where Dany has Drogon dracarys Jon Snow, excuse me, Aegon Targaryen, only to have him emerge unscathed from the flames because, hey, he's Aegon Targaryen.
4
Yeah...I don't think they're going to get through all that tonight.
5
The only question I’d like answered is “why did D&D insult the audience with such obviously lazy writing all season? “
Omniscient Bran only talks about marriages and wheelchairs
The Night King’s backstory is foreshadowed then ignored; winter comes and goes with no explanation
Dragons are fragile; dragons are unstoppable...
Dany saves the poor and fights to break the wheel; Dany kills more than the Night King, Cersei, and the Boltons combined...
Edgy Arya, killer of the Freys and the Night King, can’t be bothered to tell anyone she’s going to assassinate Cersei
11
Tyrion will be the King. That's my prediction. Let's see. The book's author said in some interview that most of the stories like Lord of the Rings don't consider what comes after the wars: ruling. I suspect Tyrion having been depicted as a good Hand serving Tywin will be the justification for him being the new King and a good ruler in peace times.
4
I really thought Dany was just going to destroy the castle with Cersei in it and not the whole of King's Landing? My other thought is wasn't the Iron Throne destroyed in the annihilation of the city? Who knows, maybe they will dig it out of the rubble in the finale tonight lol.
What a ride! DRACARYS forever!
7
Here’s how I would like it to end: The vision Dany had long ago of herself walking into a destroyed throne room and an Iron Throne covered in ash plays out as present reality. Soon thereafter, Arya assassinates Dany. Grey Worm is enraged at Arya killing Dany; then Jon kills him in a duel. The now leaderless Unsullied and Dothraki become brigands terrorizing the countryside until they are defeated by the combined forces of Westeros. The surviving Unsullied and Dothraki are deported back to Essos. The last dragon is somehow neutralized, perhaps by Jon taming it. Jon refuses the Iron Throne. He prevails upon Sam to take it. Sam’s first decree is that the Iron Throne be melted down into something else, anything else. Tyrion becomes Hand of the King to Sam, Jon and Sansa become Co-Wardens of the North, Brienne becomes commander of the royal guard, Bran becomes primary adviser to the king, and Arya and Gendry retire to a cottage. Sam’s great achievement as king is to establish a parliament representing the people.
6
@S. Richey
I’ve always thought that Sam and Tyrion had the best combination of moral compass plus brains. I’d take either one as the winner.
4
This is how it will end: In the penultimate scene, Dany and Jon marry after deciding to rule together as equals. then they recast the Throne out of a different substance. In the final scene, we see Dany wake up in bed, shake the morning fuzzies out of her head, then say to her bedmate, "Honey, wake up. You won't believe the dream I just had." The bedmate sits up, and it's Bob Newhart.
14
Some questions are better left unanswered.
3
"Is she too far gone to care? Someone (Tyrion? Jon? Grey Worm?) needs to talk to her about this."
The idea of Grey Worm advising Dany is laughable. He and his former bi-racial girlfriend have been limited to the role of soldier and servant. It would have been much more interesting if Grey Worm were the leader of a nation, ally or enemy, stand a soldier. It's unfortunate that they were never given the opportunity to lead or influence.
4
It should end like Blazing Saddles; with a large fight that busts through the walls of the set into the surrounding studio, finishing off with a climactic food fight in the studio lot commissary.
13
The show has already ended perfectly and yet we are still talking about the 'wheel' that has already been broken. Looking at all the decisions Danny made before e5, they were all justifiable. The stupidity of Sansa, Vary and Tyrion is stunning as they are trying to harm the one who is going to revenge for them from the tyranny who basically destroyed their own lives, and their reasoning is simply there is someone whose blood/sex better fits the throne. Consider what if Dany lost the battle ...
So most of us could not get over the fact that Danny suddenly 'changed' to be mad and started killing innocent people, assuming she just became another tyranny and deserve to be killed. We may well understand that human killing human is wrong, human loving human is right, but forget to ask: why? This show has clearly demonstrated to us what would happen if people act selfishly and be hostile to each other - some super power (e.g., God, Environment or Dragon) will come punish us, breaking our 'wheel' of vicious circle. It simply reminds us that we are insignificant, don't act like God, be nice to each other, especially don't try to kill those precious Dragons.
Now Dany has the largest army loyal only to her, and one dragon no one can kill. I can only imagine the total destroy of Westeros if she got assassinated. Don't forget the divine power behind, which can bring back righteous men like Jon, but also punish people in packs like stories in bible. So Dany's life is not for us to take.
This commenter makes the crucial point:
"Drogon is the last dragon..."
Let's face it -- Drogon won the Episode 5 "battle," not Danaerys. And as long as Drogon lives (and sides with Danaerys), Danaerys wins -- evil or not. Ergo, Drogon is toast, unless GOT illustrates the simple principle that "might makes right."
4
I believe that one of the enduring values of this series will be that it will serve as a comforting reminder that truly terrible things can happen to truly terrible people.
2
Is the "near-certainty" (at least among bettors) that Bran will play an important and lasting part really an acknowledgement that the Bran subplot was otherwise a waste of time?
Maybe Bran knew ahead of time that Arya would kill the Night King, but so what? The key fact remains that Arya killed the Night King, not Bran. If Bran has some major role to play, he hasn't played it yet. It's tonight or never. Since "never" wouldn't sit well with the audience (especially those who've thought GOT kept way too many subplots alive), it follows that Bran inevitably MUST play an important part. Other than that "inevitability" (which probably will be enough), I can't see any reason why Bran matters. I suspect he'll be MADE to matter by the writers, but that won't change the fact that Bran has been pretty much irrelevant for a very long time, and could safely have been cut out of the show several seasons back.
8
@Commenter I have my doubts so much has been left off I don't even care anymore
2
Maybe his sole purpose was to back up Sam’s story that Jon is the true heir?
1
Call me cynical, but somehow, I don't see this turning out as people expect it to; with Arya planting a dagger through Dany and Jon ascending a throne he did little to take himself.
No, I see this story ending the same way it began; with the sack of a city and the ascension of another tyrant (perhaps a more well-meaning one, but a tyrant all the same).
And you know what else? Nobody is going to do anything about it. Winter has come, and Westeros has been at war so long nobody can even remember the original cause, which let's face it, was really no more than a petty feud between two noble houses that escalated to engulf the entire realm, and which killed hundreds of thousands people well before Daenerys Stormborn arrived. And to what purpose, other than the final revenge of House Stark against House Lannister?
As horrible an injustice as the Burning of King's Landing was, it was precipitated by the machinations of people who sought to dethrone Daenerys Stormborn before she even had a chance to ascend the throne. Indeed, the truly horrible thing about last week's massacre was that it may not have been madness at all, but a calculated act of such astounding brutality as to put to bed any potential murmurings of dissent.
At this point, what will her death really solve? What do people think is going to happen when the biggest, baddest monster is dead, leaving all these little monster to finish what they started? This isn't a problem that one assassin can solve.
7
There must be something seriously wrong with me since I have never seen a single episode. But thank goodness it ends tonight because maybe just maybe I will understand more late night monologues that will no longer have references to this popular show.
My heart goes out to anyone who has invested 8 years into this series only to be greatly disappointment by the conclusion. Been there, done that with many, many shows through my life and it is always a lousy feeling.
1
I've wanted to know what happened to Edmure Tully since Arya killed all the adult Frey males at the end of season 6. Did his Frey wife let him out of the dungeons? Did Jaime send him to Casterly Rock as part of his deal in the taking of Riverrun?
In season 8 Gendry disappeared early in the Battle of Winterfell. Then he reappeared for three scenes at the feast in episode 4 and hasn't been seen since. He is emblematic of the arbitrary and capricious use of characters by the writers in season 8. He's almost reduced to a plot device.
Bran is another case of inconsistent and shallow writing of a character. Sometimes he serves the plot by magically filling in blanks for the other characters. Otherwise, he is a nearly pointless oracle given to elliptical pronouncements.
It doesn't matter what information Varys got out to the world. When Sansa and Sam hear that Daenerys scorched King's Landing, they will have all they need to send ravens from Winterfell telling of Jon's true identity and saying that Daenerys is an unstable foreigner who means no good for Westeros.
By now one thing is clear, the Iron Throne has given Westeros a succession of megalomaniacs (recent Targeryens), vile schemers (Cersei), drunks (Robert) and incompetent juveniles as rulers. Fighting over it has also led to years of ugly wars. It's high time to end it and devolve rule on a confederation of its kingdoms. But season 8 is so badly conceived and written that I have dim hopes for the finale.
9
Also Podrick. I don't understand the point of giving him magic sex powers. He never used them for anything important. It is the equivalent of introducing a gun in the first act of a play in which nobody gets shot.
4
Ahh Benjo,
Some things just are, and that’s enough.
Old Woman Who Knows Things
1
I've been more invested in this series than I care to admit - it's shown at times such brilliance, and the characters have been so compelling at points, that you keep with it in hopes that it will reach those heights again. Kind of like golfing. The only good thing about the penultimate episode, which I'd spent considerable time the week before nervously anticipating, but which I thought was a total cop-out in terms of the story, is that I'm finding myself relatively apathetic about the finale. They lazily decided to burn the whole thing to the ground, so there's a lot less to care about now (I mean in terms of who ends up where - obviously, I care about all those who were incinerated!). On the other hand, perhaps going in with low expectations is a good thing - I'd be happy to be surprised. Regardless, thanks for the memories! And thanks to the Times for its excellent coverage. It's been a fun run, in spite of - and sometimes because of - its ups and downs.
79
@James Hanson
The destruction of King's Landing was so thoroughly telegraphed throughout the series that I actually thought (for a minute) they may not actually go through with it.
The game of thrones cannot be won. King's Landing had to go. And, perhaps (as I've written elsewhere) so does everything else.
12
@Christopher My initial disgust at the episode has definitely been tempered by the thoughtful analyses of the complexity of Dany's character - we invested way too much in her role as liberator, which blinded many of us to her darker sides. (I've wondered if many of us were willing to do that because of her lily whiteness - another essay, perhaps.) The most compelling "justification" is her realization that she had to go with fear because she knew she could never be loved like Jon, and these "innocent" commoners would never accept her. It's clear, especially in retrospect, that her lust for power and sense of entitlement to the throne became the overwhelming driving force for her actions. And that does seem to be Martin's point about power and human nature. Maybe it still feels over the top to me simply because I wanted it to end differently; but something about it still feels gratuitous, and a shortcut to get to the ending in the allotted episodes.
6
@James Hanson
It is the desire and acquisition of absolute power that is inherently corrupting (and deranging, if there is such a word). Submitting to the notion that an individual can handle that kind of power (as do Jon and Tyrion) is naive and equally devastating.
There are two basic resolutions:
1. Someone wins the game of thrones.
2. The game of thrones cannot be won.
Neither ending is entirely satisfying, but I kind of like that. The problem with this season is the writers seem to be in a rush to tie everything off with a nice neat bow (I guess they're already onto Star Wars).
But it's all great entertainment, as far as I'm concerned, and, like you, I'm rather philosophical about how it all ends (esp. as hardly anyone else like the kinds of endings I do: ambiguous!).
Tonight I will be eating popcorn with my feet up ready to travel to imagined worlds for an hour and a half (or so)!
7
Dany is the same as she has been since the beginning.
Here's an equation that will help you watch the finale tonight without losing your mind:
The Iron Throne:Song of Ice and Fire :: The Ring of Power:The Lord of the Rings.
Bu there is one highly consequential difference.
The fact that the Ring of Power could not be safely wielded by anyone, and must therefore be destroyed, is the starting and foundational premise of the The Lord of the Rings trilogy.
That the Iron Throne cannot be safely occupied, especially not by a charismatic figure with an absolute will to power, is the hard-won conclusion of A Song of Ice and Fire.
That basic structural fact of the narrative puts fans still rooting for someone or other to occupy the Iron Throne in sort of an awkward position?
I mean would you really have wanted Frodo, say, to claim the Ring of Power for himself?
That would mean you have completely missed the story. Same thing here. Except this story demands more work of you than Tolkien's story did ... since he laid it out for you. And George Martin has not.
79
@Kenneth I really liked your comparison. This is something I've tried to convey to my own friends when discussing the possible endings. Many of them root for their favorite character sitting on the throne, while I stubbornly remind them that Dany said she had set out to "break the wheel".
Drogon melting the throne down as a symbol for this would be a great scene!
23
@Kenneth
Logically the story is about the end of the Iron Throne, as you say.
The overarching story of Game of Thrones is that one day the Stark family was living in peace and relative happiness in the North when a drunken king, his miserable wife and sociopath son, among others, arrived at their home in Winterfell. From that point, they were injured, split up and eventually embroiled in conspiracy, war, strife, death and suffering. Years later with half their family dead, the surviving Stark children emerge changed and determined to take back their home and keep it. Tyrion and Jon's stories are the humane threading of a path through a swamp of scheming, fighting, violent abuse, noble house rivalries and the threat of an annihilating Night King. But what SHOULD happen is the end of the Iron Throne founded by the Targareyns, with the Starks ruling a sovereign North. A panorama of the surviving Starks in the North should close out the series. It is that restoration of a peaceful North, free from the cursed Iron Throne, that brings the story full circle to its conclusion.
21
@Former NBS student Why does your post make me think that Brexit will lead to Scottish independence?
6
Thanks for the very thorough analysis of the numerous questions and loose threads. Obviously too many to clean up with just a single episode remaining, so it would seem that substantial frustration is inevitable. I must confess my discomfort with the near universal condemnation of Daenerys, given her essential role in saving all of Westros from the Army of the Dead, freeing the 200,000 slaves at Mereene, the slaves at Yunkei and Asterpol, etc. She accepted incredible danger every time she flew Drogon into battle. Her courage in the face of massed archers and spear throwers, Scorpion harpoons, Ice lances thrown by the Night King and the massed assault on Drogon by his zombie infantry were decisive in every battle she fought. At some point, the fact that every living man, woman & child survived because of her courage and ability as a warrior has to weigh heavily in any judgement regarding Kings Landing. If the Unsullied, the Dothraki and the Northman had hesitated in continuing the sacking of King's Landing, perhaps Daenerys could have been condemned as unhinged. But they acted on the same violent impulses that Daenerys & Drogon displayed. No doubt Sansa the Seamstress will be an enthusiastic war crimes prosecutor but she will have to condemn every knight & soldier that carried a weapon into Kings Landing. That is not how a functional society reacts to the successful defense of its civilization, as horrific as the war may have been. Am I the only one willing to defend my Queen!
53
@mike4vfr
The writers messed up Daenerys, to the audience's great frustration. She endured mistreatment, hardship, reversals, attacks and betrayal for six seasons without breaking. She made mistakes, but on balance stayed good. Her sudden switch to Daenerys the Destroyer of King's Landing is probably the biggest complaint viewers have. The change in her lacks credibility. There was some foreshadowing of her punitive streak, but not enough to justify her volte face. This is the great weakness of season 8.
17
@mike4vfr Your messianic Queen, Mother of Dragons, Breaker of Chains, Subjugator of the Human World, is the fire of a Song of Ice and Fire, one of the two elemental forces that threaten to consume the human world.
Fire and Ice
Some say the world will end in fire,
Some say in ice.
From what I’ve tasted of desire
I hold with those who favor fire.
But if it had to perish twice,
I think I know enough of hate
To say that for destruction ice
Is also great
And would suffice.
We have witness the victory over Ice. The Question that remains to be answered is whether Fire can also be defeated.
That Ice was a threat was clear and obvious. It was a threat from outside the human world. But the threat of Fire was a threat from within the human world, but a threat to the human world all the same, a more insidious threat precisely because the enemy is us and not the alien other who cares nothing for us.
Again, Queen Dany is the Fire.
She must be defeated or the world will burn!
The real question for tonight's episode is whether Dany will be defeated, and that at the apex of her power, or will the world burn?
Do you really want to defend her?
5
Hey, let's not forget that other TV icon that has ended a 12-year uber-successful run - The Big Bang Theory.
I, as one of millions, will seriously miss that also. It made me laugh a lot and reflect as much as "Seinfeld".
3
Scientific American has a great piece of how the story shifted in season 8 - from sociological to psychological, and how limiting the standard Hollywood writing orientation is when trying to address institutions and societies. The focus is on the larger structures, not the individuals and when we shift to individuals (hello USA) we lose vision.
9
The real explanation for Dany snapped and destroyed everying is found in the ill effects of time travel. The first clue was in the first episode of this season when we were shown the Starbucks cup.
Alternate explanation: Still Starbucks but the poison was in the coffee. :-)
gk
64
@Nicole Kaplan
I believe it was confirmed to be a craft services cup, not Starbucks, though SB certainly got more promotional value from this than money an buy.
1
@Nicole Kaplan
That's either an "Easter Egg" or a goof; intentional or not. Regardless, who cares?
What would Stanley Kubrick (the greatest director of the 20th Century) think of this drivel? I'll answer myself: He would hate it, and the rightly.
In fact, I shouldn't even mention his name on the same page as this. Forgive me, Mrs. (Christiane) Kubrick. Please know, I love and own all 13 of his feature length films, plus 1 short. I don't have his first 2 film shorts: "Day of the Fight" & "The Flying Padre"; made when he was 22 years old. He has 33 Director's Trademarks on the IMDB Website. This is far more than any other director in history. All of his films have dark humor; especially, "Dr. Strangelove" (1964).
I love this one: Known for his exorbitant shooting ratio and endless takes, he reportedly exposed an incredible 1.3 million feet of film while shooting "The Shining" (1980), the release print of which runs for 142 minutes. Thus, he used less than 1% of the exposed film stock, making his shooting ratio an indulgent 102:1 when a ratio of 5 or 10:1 is considered the norm.
I loved & miss him, dearly. So does almost everyone who's a fan, or worked for him.
He was the "Director's Director". Almost all who indeed work for him became a star or a bigger star.
1
@Nicole Kaplan
I see the coffee cup as an end note left in honor of the thousands of AMAZING CREW MEMBERS of this great show. Like the purposeful 'mistake' the weaver puts into their 'perfect' rug-- because only god is perfect-- the Crew of GoT left the coffee cup on the table, because only god, or anything like god, is perfect. The cup is perfect!
3
I hope the final episode resists the temptation to answer questions like these. The desire to tie everything up with a bow is exactly what has caused the last two seasons to be such duds. Instead, give the audience something more to think about, something that resonates in the real world.
56
You know what? at this point I no longer care. Never ever have seen an otherwise brilliant show getting ruined so quickly, in a matter of two weeks, with season 8 episodes 4 and 5.
Guess Benioff and Weiss just want to get it over with and move on to Star Wars.
83
@Avi
I stopped caring after Jon dissed Ghost and the second dragon was killed. The animals were my only interest.
4
@Avi
I couldn't agree more! Enough already. Get a life, people.
Most of all, the extreme de-saturation of color in this show is old and tired.Therefore, we will (hopefully) see more color film in use; instead of the extreme de-saturation of color in movies to lower the "MPAA" Rating from "NC-17" to "R", or "R" to "PG-13".
This was Gamer's versions of the increase in violence. For example, "Dungeons & Dragons"; "Alien vs Predator"; "Grand Theft Auto"; and finally "Mortal Kombat"; Interesting, to dangerous, to graphic violence to pure gore. Arghhh.
2
@EGreen
Agreed. Not sure I will watch tonight in case Drogon is killed
1
For all of Jon Snow's many flaws in the show - I'll never understand why they dumbed him down from a much more interesting character in the book - he has already earned his return to life: by forcing an uncomfortable alliance between people who did not want to be allied and forcing people South of the wall to pay attention to the army of the dead when they were too busy fighting each other. Without his intervention the zombie army would have never been stopped at Winterfell but would have swept right over it to devastate the more populous South. No doubt in doing so he already saved as many people from that horrible fate than Dany killed in the torching of King's Landing. Commentators have often pointed out how he makes mistakes and has to be rescued by others. Sure. But he is the stubborn, if limited person who got most if not all of those others in the right place at the right time.
87
I’m not as down on the writers of the show. I’m also a huge fan of the books including the current prequels. I think the writers are going to tie the ending up easily. Either Dany and Jon rule or Dany is killed by Arya and then either Jon rules or it’s split up to the Great Council. The show deviated from the books a few seasons back so while the book backbone is there, this season has shown me that the writers don’t have the writing / plot complexity of the books and that’s ok. It will end gloriously and if you want more , start reading
97
@Eric Exactly correct!
Taking what might be a wider view of "Fire & Ice":
The 'Ice' of Winter is Death and climate change. Brought about by humans trampling over the Children of the Forest, and over Gaia.
The 'Fire' of the Dragons is human Passion gone awry, the destruction wrecked by human anger, revenge, the quest for power, fear, and the lack of Love & Connection (Dany!!).
Kings Landing laid to waste resembled nothing other than the destruction of Hiroshima, an event of human passion gone awry, all balance lost, the impersonal destroying the personal.
3
@black
and I forgot to include human ignorance (Jon!!)
"You know nothing Jon Snow."
1
Has anyone mentioned that Jon Snow, then, took the oath of the Black Watch where he forever gave up all titles and claims etc. Even though he considers that is death means that he is no longer in the BW it does not change the fact that he gave it all up. Same with Sam and his claim to his fathers title.
2
Good questions, and here's what I think the answers will turn out to be, not because I want them this way, but because this is how the show has been going.
1) We won't find out why Daenerys made her decision, except with some mysterious claim about mercy for later generations or something. She won't live through the episode.
2) Opposing her will be easy for anyone who can sneak up behind her with a knife. Arya, Tyrion, Jon, any of them could handle it. Jon will die tragically, as is his habit, and I'm betting Gendry will wind up on the throne.
3) Arya will probably use one last face to nail Dany, but if she doesn't, she won't use any faces ever again.
4) If Tyrion does go on trial, it'll mean his death, as he really doesn't have a defense this time.
5) Nobody will break the wheel. Tyranny is all this empire knows, democracy is not going to evolve out of nowhere.
6) It doesn't matter what the peasants think. One thing the show has been clear on from the start is that the peasants are too ignorant to have a say in governance, and this is fairly accurate. They're powerless too, no dragons or army, so their opinion makes no difference. Only one player in the game ever cared about them, Margaery, and she got incinerated.
Maybe this is bleak, but after this season, I think it's best not to get our hopes up. We're probably just going to have to assume people like Yara, Tormund, Sam, and so on, are fine. But it should be an entertaining finale anyhow.
1
Why does burning the city make Daenerys "mad"?
Just look at history. Armies have done that in the real world repeatedly, including us.
9
Please. Stop. Way too much reporting on this show. You want Game of Thrones? Read Robert Caro’s presidential biographies on Lyndon Johnson.
3
Better yet, Shakespeare’s history plays, plus King Lear
3
When the writers are this sloppy, https://youtu.be/LHN_gPSxJng
I have very little hope any longer for a satisfying ending.
Arya killing Dany is not satisying; she's had almost no relationship with Dany. Plus, she killed the Night King! Arya, the saver of humanity, twice in four weeks? A more interesting ending is Tyrion or Jon turning on her, but since the show has made a hard turn away from interesting, it probably will be Arya. If Jon doesn't kill Dany himself, maybe the best option is that he kills Drogon. This would have some emotion to it, as Drogon is the last dragon, and Jon the last of two Targaryens.
I hope the Iron Throne is destroyed (like others have said with the LOTR comparisons). In that way, Dany's actions will have broken the wheel of power--just not in the way she and her supporters believed.
One last loose end I would like addressed: why did Tyrion become so indefensibly stupid (his only job is strategic advising)? Is his storyline really going to end without any last brilliant moves? Disappointing, indeed.
2
Ultimate awesome ending (with a nod to Newhart):
Ned Stark wakes up as Boromir.
7
It's simple. Snow will betray Daenerys on principle, and others will follow. Daenerys will attempt to execute him with dragon fire. He is a Targaryen, thus immune to fire (or Drogon refuses order). All hail King Aegon. At this point all the baddies are off the map, so peaceful kingdom save aunty. Being a good guy, Snow won't kill Daenerys. But little sis doesn't have that problem.
1
Indeed, the magic is gone. HBO's corporate hacks have destroyed everything they and GRRM built with a mediocre string of brainless, lowest-common-denominator action sequences. Shame!
5
Daenerys will be killed off. Moral retribution and all that stuff. Boring.
3
Screw all that. What happens to Bron?!
5
I actually hope that most of the questions aren't resolved. The best finales are those that wrap up the key element(s) but leave the rest to be interpreted by fans. People were angry with the last two seasons of Lost (and hated the finale); hated the finales of Seinfeld, The Sopranos (cut to black - whaaat?), and other shows that had quit before becoming lame.
When the fandom is happy with everything, then it ceases to exist. How lucky we are to have fanfic! The characters you love can do what you want them to. Jaime could have the happy ending. Arya could be saved by Gendry. Whatever.
All I want to see is... something good. I'd like to know who sits on the throne. I don't care about the lesser houses. I'd like the Starks to come together, and I hope they "win." I loved the way they turned on Littlefinger. And though I love Jon and Dany in a perfect world sort of way, she made her choice for power a long time ago. She didn't snap - she just committed to win at any cost.
I don't expect to see secondary characters again like Sam & Gilly. They had their goodbyes, that was clear. I think a brief "finale" and then an epilogue would be great, especially since I doubt GRRM will ever write his last two books. I love the show. I love the books (though they are too long). I love Tyrion, and would love some snark. I love him with Sansa, and how sweet he is with her. But this is GOT - there are no happy endings.
20
Oh I ran out of room, but for the last two questions, how much did Bran know? We'll never know, because he refuses to tell anyone anything useful. He's going to stare off into the distance and mumble something about the memory of the world, and be as utterly useless as he's been for the last few seasons.
And do prophecy and magic even matter? Basically, no. Some prophecies have been fairly accurate, some have been ignored, but none foretold exactly who would wind up on the throne at the end, and that's what the whole Game is about. There's very little magic going on, Melisandre's was pretty worthless in the battle, and she mysteriously killed herself for no plausible reason. Bran's been completely useless, his magic has been used for nice aerial drone footage but nothing else. Arya stopped using her face-changing magic, inexplicably. I think there won't be anything particularly magical this episode, except for that last dragon of course.
13
@Dan Stackhouse I actually loved that the prophesies really didn't matter much (sword of fire, Prince Who Was Promised, etc.). How many mistakes, how many people died because of them? Maybe that's one of the points, beyond that power corrupts, standing up for values has a dear price, and innocents are often hurt ("Little girls are hurt everywhere in the world"). How do you wrap up something that is so expansive? We'll see soon.
6
@Dan Stackhouse
Melisandre killed herself (or rather let herself die) beause her mission was completed - her mission to stave off the everlasting night of the Night King. She didn't care who sat on the throne of Westeros.
5
Dear Julia Scott,
I totally agree, it's a valid point that we shouldn't base our actions entirely upon nebulous prophecies. And innocents definitely always get hurt.
Dear AP,
That explanation makes sense, but still doesn't explain it. Sure, she completed her mission, or rather stood around and watched it get completed by others, but that doesn't mean she'd have to let herself die.
2
Keep focusing on GT while your reproductive freedom is being stolen out from under you. It's called the Power of Distraction.
16
@nsafir
Most people are able to walk and chew gum at the same time. Certainly, being amused by mere amusements need not distract one from real life concerns.
13
@nsafir Escapism is important. I cannot stand more bad news these days. Seeing a city torched though does put things in perspective a bit.
2
GOT should have ended after season 6 and left the rest to the viewers' imagination.
Having read the comments below, comments on past episodes, and a lot of fan fiction between seasons 7 and 8, I saw excellent story lines, character development and conclusions. In contrast, the showrunners, D&D, dismissed storylines and assassinated characters in order to provoke visceral reactions of sharp disgust, shock and anger.
D&D succeeded, but not necessarily as planned. The reactions they provoked were directed at themselves.
1
Being a bit of a closet nihilist, I've always felt the most satisfying end would be one that probably would be exactly the opposite to most: that there is no resolution. We mortals claim agency, free will, and noble objectives, etc., but -in the end- all our efforts are for nought.
The wheel cannot be broken by those trapped within it.
In the face of a system that is inherently unjust, Bran, the keeper of history, may have to erase it all and start again.
Of course, if the writers did that, fans would lose their minds.
4
@Christopher Bran is just a big history book. All he has is memory. He has no power to take any action, other than choosing whether to reveal details of the past.
1
@GKR You forgot, Bran changed Hodor.
@GKR
Remember the Knight King was trying to kill Bran in order to end "human history" (at, least according to Bran).
Believe me, I have zero expectation that this is how they will end the series.
In the real world life goes on and nothing is really ever resolved. GOT is a snapshot in something that went on long before and will continue long after. I now realize and will accept that many questions won’t be answered and I’m ok with this.
6
The whole point of fiction is that is not the real world and instead imposes narrative structure onto chaos.
4
I've never been a fan of Medieval fiction, war epics, Dungeons and Dragons, or science fiction for that matter. I didn't watch GOT when it started because of that. Somehow, the hype got to me. I also found the "I've never watched" crowd to be really annoying, and I have to admit, I didn't want to be pop-culturally illiterate around the water cooler, so to speak, so I watched the whole series and just finished up a few weeks before Season 8. I've enjoyed it. Very much. I don't know what the outcome will be, and I don't have an outcome wish list. The sets and costuming are spectacular. The casting is great. Technically, it's fabulous.Yes, I loved 'The Long Night' and could see it just fine. I've enjoyed the various story arcs of the characters, and I'm OK with problems with that due to ending the series now. I won't be able to watch it live tonight, but I'll be staying up really late when I get home, and am ready for whatever the finale brings.
13
@Michelle Could not agree more! That said, I love the lore, the characters, the back story, and have been fascinated by the depth of this world that GRRM created. I never thought I'd like a show with dragons and zombies, but I love it and will miss it. Sharing the hype with my kids and a limited extent my husband (who never watched before this season) has been enormously fun.
4
I stopped watching after the first season since I felt it was too misogynistic. Otherwise it's an okay show. I prefer sci-fi over fantasy even though this has sci-fi elements.
@RamS You’re not wrong, although I watched all way, using the fast-forward button as needed.
My prediction is this all ends in a cliffhanger and a suggestion that we are not done yet. This season will all turn out to be a long dream sequence. New writers will get hired and close out the show properly next season.
2
@Budley we can hope but leaks show it's more of a nightmare.
Prefer PBS' Mapp & Lucia myself --- that was the REAL game of thrones.
@Bill I loved 'Mapp and Lucia' and I love GOT. It's possible.
1
The show has really been hot mess for at least two seasons now. It seems that once the show-runners passed Martin's progress in the books, they opted for quick and easy plot devices instead of letting the story unfold. They will have some quick solution ready for this last episode, that won't really tie up the threads because they decided to be done.
7
Huh? Arya brought a bag full of faces with her, Sansa found it under her bed.
4
Thank goodness it’s over...
5
We just done want GOT to end.....no ending or tying up of plot twits will make us happy.
3
Perhaps there's so much controversy about the last season and possible endings because no-one really wants it to end?
All good things...
But I'll miss all of them, the heroes and villains.
11
It is interesting to see how erroneous information becomes conventional wisdom. In this article and in most other GoT commentary the snow depicted in the ruined throne rooms of Dany and Bran’s visions is described as ash. There is a compulsion to fit the image to apparent reality in spite of clear visual evidence of ice and cold, melting snow.
8
@Daniel Lee I thought the same thing. It is snowing during the vision.
1
@Daniel Lee I totally agree - it could still be snow - winter is coming, after all. That's a plot point that's receded, but it may reappear to fundamentally shape the ending.
2
@Daniel Lee And it is the Song of Fire and Ice. I don't think that the Ice was just the Night King. I think it is Jon and the Starks.
Since I never figured out what was the Aquitaine in Lion in Winter, from reading many of the comments here I gotta figure Game of Thrones may not necessarily be my thing either. Alas, yet another cultural touchstone to pass me by.
1
@John Doe When you watch with an open mind, skip most of the Theon-torture stuff and some of the unnecessary brothel scenes in S01 & S02, it gets really, really good. Toss in the audiobooks of at least the first two, and it's an engaging, interesting universe that actually has very little to do with much of what's detailed in this article. It's not overwhelming, like Lord of the Rings is, because the structure of the GoT universe phases in as needed (rather like Star Wars in that respect). It's good. Very good. And fun.
1
Melisandre was wrong about Beric too. Beric wasn’t brought back to save Arya. He was brought back to save the Hound. The Hound was the Lord of Light’s servant. He was touched by fire as a young child, it was he who immediately saw the vision in the fire without any training to do so, and it was he who protected Arya throughout their journey together in Westeros and he who literally carried her away from the wights at Winterfell. And again, it was The Hound who turned Arya back at the red keep. All along he was the one unwittingly doing the Lord of Light’s bidding and Beric was protecting him.
60
@AW. Interesting! That had never occurred to me.
2
Arya wants and needs to kill Dany and since Jon Snow can be counted on to make the wrong move, she will have to kill him, again, when he tries to defend his aunt. Sansa can then negotiate her way to the top and Arya can then retire to a quiet inn on the North Rd and she and Hot Pie can live happily ever after, until a TARDIS shows up outside the door.
4
@John Smith No spoilers!
> Theoretically, Sansa’s uncle Edmure, as Lord Paramount of the Trident, could return the Riverlands to Tully control; his status is unclear, however — is he still being held prisoner by House Frey?
Wasn't House Frey more or less wiped out in a mass poisoning by Arya?
9
The women of House Frey were spared, perhaps they're in charge now.
@Adam And wasn't Edmure already freed by Jaime in return for convincing his [i.e., the Blackfish's] castle to lower its drawbridge and allow the Lannister army to march in and take over?
@Adam @JD - yes, Edmure was freed and left as the Lord of Riverrun, but then "gave" Riverrun to the Freys who were killed off. The women were not seemingly of the sort who would run things, but you never know - Frey referred to them as such, but he was a rotten fiend.
More importantly, who cares about what's going on in Meereen, or in Sunspear, the Reach, the Riverlands, the Stormlands? It doesn't matter. Let's just narrow ourselves back to the core stories of those who haven't yet said goodbye. Brienne said goodbye but may be back. Sam is gone, Tormund and all of the dire wolves (despite the fact that I was sure Nymeria would come back with her pack to save Arya/Winterfell) are gone.
It's down to the Starks, Tyrion, and Dany. The others are dead and/or gone. The Night King is dead. Song of Fire & Ice = Targaryen & Stark. And maybe, just maybe, Tyrion will get his snark back and advise Jon on some sly move to oust Dany. Or not. We were promised one thing - and that was
"not a happy ending."
4
One possibility not mentioned is that Drogon will turn on Dany either by refusing to kill Jon Snow or actually 'bending the knee" to him because he will recognize him as a Targaryen and the true king, next in line after Prince Rhaegel
18
@robert bend the wing?
1
@robertOh gosh this would be so depressing. The dragon loves his mother nit some man-made king thing.
3
I guess it seems like the one major plot device that hasn’t been used to its fullest extent is Arya and her faces of death. I mean they spent nearly a whole season on it (and I found that particular part pretty boring). And since she was the big focus of the end of the penultimate (and also, she’s the one who ended the whole White Walker thing), it would make sense to use this for the finale. But then, there have certainly been other plot devices that petered out along the way. Heck, since Cersei thought her children were the rightful heirs to the throne (well, maybe not rightful, exactly), and they did that big purge of Robert’s natural children, I always thought Gendry would figure much more in the show. I kept asking, what ever happened to that Baratheon goldsmith kid—so what do I know?
4
@Kally I agree. And she had the faces, so that's still a thread that's possible. Given that Dany doesn't trust anyone, it's hard to see who Arya could use.
Except, perhaps Grey Worm. Arya could kill him, use his face, and then repeat sort of the start of Robert's Rebellion - the trusted guard of the King (Queen) killing them with a knife in the back after the King (Queen) kills the heads of the Stark family (Ned's father & brother/Jon & Sansa).
There is an element of coming full circle that wouldn't be happy, but would be somewhat satisfying.
I am completely prepared to be utterly disappointed.
11
GOT is no LOTR, that's for sure.
9
I stopped watching once it began deviating from the books.
1
@DL So no Sept of Baylor, Hardhome, Journey North of the Wall, Ice Dragon (or Night King, for that matter), or Turning the Tables on Littlefinger for you? That's too bad. There was some really good stuff outside of the books, especially S06 & S07.
4
Such an epic show that comes along every few years or so...
With so many amazing and talented directors out there, it would have been incredible to have let another talented team of directors continue to evolve GOT and let the current directors go do whatever else they wanted.
The current speed of the past two seasons has been a disservice to the show that had been built up over the years.
12
A very tall order to explain indeed. We have only mere hours left to find out. Kudos!
2
Hubris, defined by Britannica as "overweening presumption that leads a person to disregard the divinely fixed limits on human action in an ordered cosmos," particularly in connection with presuming to understand (or control) a prophecy is a Sopheclean theme that exists throughout the show.- Everyone who thinks they can force fate's hand (Stannis, Vyserion, Euron, Dany, The Sand Snakes, Melisandre-even Bran with Hodor) are instead handed their fate most disappointingly. But Beric Dondarrion's essential humility about the purpose behind his own serial resurrections may serve Jon Snow better- we don't know why and can't know how, and in GRRM's world, there's little likelihood of joy along the way. From a storytelling perspective, I hope to see this theme brought firmly home, particularly when so little else feels well-rooted this
2
According to Friday's Wall Street Journal a Spanish doctor has leaked details of the finale, and his track record to date has been spot on. He is the only leaker that HBO has previously taken legal action to stop, indicating he has a reliable inside source. No spoilers here, but if it plays out as he says I will be more than a bit disappointed.
5
My prediction (possible spoilers): In the final episode, Daenerys will TURN INTO a dragon. She will meet John Paper, the young son of a Dornish cobbler and an enthusiast of string and string-related detritus. Together they will escape to Esteros, to the land of Honahlee, where beatnik goatees and bowl cuts are the prevailing male style. Winter will not reach them there, only autumn mists. Dany will inspire fear and love in the natives. The kid will grow old and die inside -- but songs about them will be sung for what feels like forever.
13
Those who claim that Dany has gone rogue seem blind to the context and her legitimate need to react to provocation and restore deterrence against all who would resist her. Burning an enemy's capital is a statement (not a proportional response to a violent provocation) about what happens to those who resist or attack her directly or indirectly. Wars are won and prevented by messaging actual and would be opponents that violent opposition is certain suicide. Discipline and control can only be maintained by crushing the urge to rebel. Certainly the destruction of Kings Landings sends a message to Sansa, Snow, and everyone else about the fate of those who choose to challenge and resist. In this sense, the "nuclear option" (the show's metaphorical Hiroshima and Nagasaki) is intended to defeat the will to resist unification and end conflict. The question of whether the ends justify the means is irrelevant as winners always write history and the morality of war is ambiguous even in the best case of a purely defensive war for self-survival. In this sense the show accurately portrays the PTSD and senseless slaughter and mass terror which is what War is, an unrestrained orgy of murder and destruction without purpose other than to bring it all to a merciful end through the application of ruthlessly efficient mass terror which can crush the opponent's will to resist.
18
@American Akita Team
exactly. Daenerys is absolute will to power, that will brook no resistance.
Always has been, always will be. The burning question is whether others can muster the will to defeat her. Either she is defeated by or the world will burn.
But what people are truly upset about is that George Martin portrays this absolute will to power as deeply enthralling and supremely charismatic right up until the very last minute.
When the darkness of it is fully revealed, those taken in by the enthralling charisma of it, feel implicated in the crimes. They want to displace blame for their felt sense of implication onto the writers.
They can't even countenance the thought that they too may have been seduced by the enthralling charisma of a tyrant.
13
@American Akita Team
Just watched season 1 - I had forgotten the pleasure she took in burning the old witch to death. Seems very consistent.
5
@Ananya Sansa took pleasure in feeding Ramsey to his dogs and so did Arya when she fed Frey his sons. Gross but understandable revenge. Are they all crazy or just flawed by their struggles and losses? And how does this lead to genocide exactly?
8
As long as Bronn survives, gets his castle, lives a natural life, I'm satisfied. He's been true to his sell sword character and deserves as happy an ending as this series can give.
Other than that- Sansa on the throne, Jon as warden of the North or off adventuring with Tormund; Arya sailing west and returning to be part of Sansa's Star Chamber as part Cecil/Walsingham, along with Tyrion, Jon, Davos, and Brienne.
10
The details of the last episode have already been leaked, for those who wish to see them. I won't give spoilers, but I suspect quite a few will be disappointed.
4
@Captain Bathrobe
disappointed you felt the need to mention it actually.
you think "quite a few will be disappointed" isn't a spoiler in itself? Like my idiot brother during almost any movie -- "i just gotta tell you this one thing, it won't ruin the story"
5
Seems like a parable for the war fighting strategy of World War II. While certain empires were more culpable than others, in the end the people incinerated in the Nagasaki and Hiroshima died for the sake of teaching the lesson that further resistance is futile is suicidal. In many battles on the Eastern Front on Russia or over the skies of Japan, there was no desire to take prisoners or accept offers of quarter as the goal was to terrorize the opponent to the point where the will to resist was no more. The series in that respect accurately displays the nature of unrestrained total war wherein the relative moral superiority of the victor over the vanquished is a matter of perspective and culpability for initiating conflict.
10
It has been a great run. Congratulations to this brilliant group of writers, cast and crew. And to the artistic community of Northern Ireland.
41
Here’s what I predict:
All of the remaining Starks & Targaryens are meeting Tyrion at a diner in Braavos. Tyrion puts a coin in the jukebox to play Rains of Castamere. Heightened tension as Arya arrives late and tries to parallel park. Unsullied in a Members Only jacket heads to restroom. Close up of Tyrion’s face. Abrupt cut to black. 8 seconds of silence. Credits roll.
96
this is like the 100th time I've seen this joke
5
@Cynthia And maybe Dany will spell out GOODBYE in dragonfire, and Jon, Arya, Sansa, and Bran wind up on trial by all of the people they wronged and it will be overseen by Tyrion.
2
These are all good questions, but after what we’ve seen the past five weeks, I doubt any of them will be answered.
24
There was a period in reading the books years ago (maybe Book 4 or 5) and watching the series in which it seems as if Martin was incapable of winding up the series. The plot just kept expanding its scope with new worlds and new characters and got bigger and wilder. Then HBO made the decision to end the series. I think it’s time, but to do so in only six episodes will leave a huge number of issues unresolved and would seem to make many of the detailed sojourns by the author a completely unnecessary distraction. Still it was all good fun.
35
Well said.
HBO has to end the series, its not really a choice: the actors have already committed 8 years of their lives to it and need to move on in the interest of their careers, plus some - much like the actors in the Marvel and Harry Potter films - are simply aging out of pace with their character.
Finishing 6 years of work in two shortened seasons, however, seems to definitely be a choice, and one that hasn't panned out well. After so much time spent on story detail and character development, everything now feels rushed, and too often the people we've grown to know seem to make out-of-character decisions simply to push the story forward as fast as possible.
It's a shame, really. This has been one of the best series produced for the 'small screen'. It would have been so nice for it to go out on a high note like Breaking Bad or The Wire.
4
Isn’t the way these things are usually resolved one of:
1. One of the minor characters wakes up hung over in a fancy New York City apartment and realizes this is all really really really really bad dream.
2. The protagonist suddenly leaps to his or her feet announces “I have a plan that will solve everything” and then they fall over dead.
3. The camera zooms back to reveal that all of this is taking place inside in elaborate snow globe with plastic dragons.
33
I've watched maybe 60%, and the intricacies of the competing families/thrones has not been my focus. Rather, it is upon why the series is so popular, running now for the length of two presidential terms.
We live in an "age" which has trouble naming itself, which might be a clue as to why the Game of Thrones is so popular.
We live, variously, in the Anthropocene, the Age of Climate Disruption, Globalization, Market Utopianism, Neoliberalism, or as Daniel Rogers summed up well enough to win the Bancroft Prize in history, in the Age of Fracture.
Perhaps we have to go back to a time seemingly far removed from the actual structure of power of our age, which again, might be called the Age of Inequality, of the Internet/IT/AI, even as scholars tell us in Dissent magazine that the humanities are in deep trouble in our colleges. So we revert to Hobbesian, conservative periods where the institutions built by the New Deal, social democracy, here and in Europe, which are failing, us are irrelevant: so we look to the Middle Ages as interpreted by a Bayonne, NJ writer, a child of the 1960's.
The best answer I have found is here, by Fintan O'Toole:
https://www.irishtimes.com/culture/tv-radio-web/game-of-thrones-is-an-epic-for-our-times-by-fintan-o-toole-1.3835156
He writes "at the most basic level, Game of Thrones is a far-right fantasia." Fitting, for the Age of Fracture.
But please, there's much more in his view, on culture, gender, and power.
And he's right.
8
@William Neil
Thanks for link to a terrific article, easily one of the best pieces of analysis of GOT I've read.
5
@William Neil. Fascinating take. Definitely worth reading. Almost makes me want to watch the whole thing again.
3
@William Neil
It's the Beckett angle I've always found most compelling: the senseless affliction of the weak by the powerful, the endless wait for some kind of saviour and, in the end the inability to conjure some kind of meaning from it all...
I've always felt the most satisfying end would be one that probably would be exactly the opposite to most: that there is no resolution. We claim agency, free will, and noble objectives, but -in the end- all our efforts are for nought.
In the face of a system that is inherently unjust, Bran, the keeper of history, may have to erase it all and start again.
Of course, if the writers did that fans would lose their minds.
2
What a work of art, that has so many interesting questions open with one episode left to resolve them! So many interesting characters, so many interconnected plots, what a ride this show and books have been.
Author George R.R. Martin can now go any direction he likes with his books; it would be great marketing (and a lot of fun) if he goes a different direction.
My question is this: Why has Bran been around for all these seasons, as he is essentially a useless character, unless he has a profound impact in this episode? Taking over Drogon for instance? Don't think Bran is useless? The flashback to Jon's birth could have been told through documents with Sam Tarly reading them and adding the visual and letting Jon know. He's provided no helpful guidance (i.e., he should have told Jon to keep quiet as Dany did).
13
Some thoughts on this and several of the other comments:
1. How often did anyone consult the three eyed raven before Bran took on that role?
2. How often do we in fact consult history before making our own decisions? What about our world leaders? When they/we do, to which history do we look, to which event, for each decision? Who asks? What matters? Is it not a values judgment in itself to have access to all of history and to determine which story to tell? Do we not have this access in modern society with libraries and the Internets...?
3. Bran as Jon’s family member has a motivation to reveal to his brother that he’s sleeping with another family member, and that he has a “right” previously unknown. Seems unfair to ask him to tell history all the time. What do many of us find ourselves doing when our elders/the talking heads babble about history all the time? Lalaladidada
4. Bran is new in his role, and still young. He didn’t get full training before taking on his role... Should we expect more from him?
5. I like the imperfections of this season. I see them not as a failure of the writers but as a reflection of societies — when have we as people done everything just right? And how long has that lasted?
4
@David Doney I would LOVE for Bran to actually DO something in the finale, to have some purpose for the Three-Eyed Raven. I'd also love some Tyrion snark & wit. Other than that, whatever they have for us, I'm good. Ups and downs, brothels and beheadings, it's been a wonderful show. I'm sad to see it end, but I look forward to seeing what the fandom creates after it does end.
I would like to understand who the horse rider at the start of the book series was/is? As I recall, he was a Stark. He reappeared briefly. What happened to him and who was he really?
@It’s News Here It could be Arya, she leaves King's Landing on a white horse after the massacre of the city.
I don’t think so. The rider in the first scene of the book series was an adult male and was north of The Wall I believe. Arya at the time was just a child. I think the rider reappears in a scene when the Night’s Watch has a foray north of The Wall. But I can’t remember much beyond that.
@It’s News Here Haven't read the books, but was it Benjen, Ned's brother? He is the one who took Jon off to Night's Watch at the beginning of the television series.
1
I am not holding my breath for much catharsis after the last 2 episodes. The writers may have "kind of forgotten" how to resolve anything; they sure forgot about character traits developed over the previous seasons.
35
While hypothesizing re this character & that character, this possible plot development or that possible conclusion, I try to remember: so many of our personages are not simply human-- they are often much more. Dany has lived thru two huge fires. Jon was brought back from the dead. Bran is more Three Eyed Raven than a human being. Most importantly: Why does everyone always seem to forget the Children of the Forest? They are a very powerful force in this world. They created the Night King. What influence will the Children bring to our conclusion?
7
Excellent questions that will likely go unanswered. I can't help but feel like GOT's hasty retreat this season is based more on talent fees (Million per episode for some) than any considerations of story. I get it - if you're paying 15 or 20 million dollars before you've even started a very pricey production.....it adds up to an unsustainable business model. What better way to resolve that than to reboot with young, less expensive talent in the form of a prequel (and whatever else is coming) Unfortunatly - like so many fantasies in life - we actually end up living with expedience.
21
@Noel McCarthy HBO wanted more episodes and even another season. They would have given them as much money as they needed. The writers made this decision.
2
@John My guess is they cut a deal with Martin: he gives them the outline and they give him something dashed off that the books can easily upstage, with second acts and better lighting.
2
@Jennifer Vineyard: Thanks for this insightful, exciting article and the fantastic trip down memory lane. I had forgotten what I had forgotten. I believe your nuanced insights will add to my appreciation of tonight's finale.
7
In GRR Martin’s world, those who most want power can’t keep it, so it’s unlikely Dany’s meant to get that throne. Also, she didn’t snap - she’s always been bloodthirsty even as a 14-year old girl. In Season 1 alone, she gloats at the gruesome death of her brother at Drogo’s hands; strategically learns how to seduce Khal Drogo from her handmaiden so he can win her the Iron Throne; has no problem with having her would-be assassin dragged to death by a horse; all but swoons in rapture as Drogo brags that he will rape all the women of Westeros when he gets there, etc.
Tyrion is clearly the Targaryen heir, Aerys’s son with Joanna: Targaryen babies (including Dany’s lost baby) are described as ‘twisted’, and make for difficult births such as the one that killed Joanna Lannister. Sansa tells Tyrion she USED to think he was smart - so what does smart Tyrion not see that’s right in front of him? He’s Aerys’s son - it’s unclear how this will be revealed since Sam Tarly and Bran are far away. Some interaction with the dragon?
10
@Ananya I don't think they have time to reveal a Tyrion plot line like that in one episode, but I wish your theory had been true. Tyrion used to be one of the most interesting characters on the show...
28
@Ananya I really hope they are done with the "Bet you didn't see that coming!" twists like the one you describe. Secret parentage plots are tired. This story spent seven seasons developing Jon Snow's, and, to be fair, it was well-executed, but it is time to wind this story down with strong storytelling mechanics.
Twists can be fun, but over-reliance on them leads to lazy writing. The best stories (the Godfather, Casablanca, Breaking Bad, most of Shakespeare, as some examples) lead you where you generally expect them to go, but do so in a satisfying and consistent way. I just want this show to end the same way.
4
@Ananya
So are you saying this was revealed in Martin’s books? Or are you just making this up? If wasn’t in the books, this is just a copy of Jon’s plot. If it was in the books, then we got ripped off of a big plot twist!
2
Doesn’t Bran have the ability to control animals? Maybe he’ll take control of the last dragon left and incinerate Dany.
25
@Tony S, I believe that all of the Starks are skin-changers. This series has somehow forgotten this interesting fact.
@Tony S
I don't think fire can hurt the mother of dragons, which is why she has deliberately incinerated herself twice. The first in the ritual to hatch the three dragon eggs and the second when she was captured by the dothraki and put in the widows hut forcing her to torch the council of elders tent and reclaim her role as Khaleesi.
I think the show will either end with a lame assassination of Daenerys by Arya Stark OR maybe Daenerys decides there will never be love for her in the Seven Kingdoms as long as Jon is alive and she takes her (The Unsullied and Dothraki) back to the warmer climates where she can live as the breaker of chains and Khaleesi free of all the intrigues of who gets the iron throne.
there is gonna be serious withdrawal to deal with after tonite's final episode.
28
@G. Stoya, Not to worry. The new season of "Outlander" starts soon.
Here are two of the visuals used this season one for a poster and one shows the Throne in the opener. This thorne shows is transformed and we now see only five cross like swords. There are only two sigils shown in the Drogon visual one looks like the Tully Sigil the other I cannot identify but it looks like an ancient cross symbol as well. Perhaps this new thorne is how the Iron Thorne will eventually end up - five kingdoms with Winterfell and Dorne or another house independent with The Crownlands dispersed to surrounding lands.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/nmcil/47803482031/
https://www.flickr.com/photos/nmcil/33926622348/
2
I’ve wondered about the new representation of the Iron Throne too. If Daenerys takes the throne after so much violence, perhaps that’s saying the the wheel can’t be broken and can only change position. She could rule over five kingdoms instead of seven and still have to cope with potential usurpers—and very little will have changed. Afterthought: Jon seems to fall for women who want him dead.
Whaa? I guess I won't start watching now.
1
Wait, what? Do I smell a prequel?
2
"They must do this, they must do that." As stated in an earlier post, this is a fantasy novel, it's not real, they can end it any way they want. It could have a traditional Hollywood happy ending, it could lean into a dark ending. How about waiting till it's over and then pass judgement. And if you don't like it write your own ending. This is a good yarn, it's not Proust, it should not be taken so seriously.
20
Must? You don’t remember “Lost”.
5
Dany went overboard because when Jon kills her, audience wont consider him a villain.
7
When Cersei gave Missandei her last words, Missandei replied with one: "dracarys". That is why Danerys triggered the inferno!
15
@Xuuya
Yeah—I was thinking, Missandei was the last left of all the people Dany held dear—except Jon Snow, and he didn’t pass the make-out test—so dracarys it was. She’s been set up for this by many previous examples of blood thirstiness.
3
@Kally never, ever against innocents. Totally out of character. Thus, lack of character development means bad writing. Too bad.
3
@S Mira
Hmmm—really? You don’t bend the knee and you’re dracarysed posthaste? Pretty harsh. She’s had to be tempered by her advisers all through the show.
1
The show must tie up all the loose ends. Why? Look at the Sopranos. This is one of the most critically acclaimed multi episode T.V. series of all time and the ending left nothing but loose ends and it was applauded for doing so. GOT is not the Sopranos, it's a roller coaster thrill ride and it doesn't have to make sense, it doesn't have to have a deeper meaning, it's should not be reviewed as great art, it is simply an adult fairy tale. Is it fun or is it boring. Those are the only questions that should be asked.
10
Maybe the books, if they're ever completed, will answer these questions.
Meantime, the HBO series has been splashing around in the ever-more- shallow end. The scriptwriters gave up on plot and character sometime during the Battle of Winterfell.
It's all action-movie simplemindedness now. My expectation for the finale is very low.
19
@Iatrogenia Yes, Yes! I think highly choreographed battles are easier to produce than episodes of plot, character development and dialogue. That makes the writers work, and they don't have to pay actors for actually acting. They have bowed to an audience that worships comic book super heroes. After leaving GRRM's book the show took a slow dive. Where did Tyrion's clever, sarcastic remarks go?
Yes, this season has moved at a fast clip, and I suspect GRRM did tell the writers how the series ends.
That said, the show did edit out some of GRRM's wandering plot lines and elaborate discussions of food which was an improvement.
Regardless this still some of the best television of the day.
5
“Winter is coming”
Did it?
5
Yes, it showed up in episode three, and then Arya stabbed it in the pancreas, dispatching the problem.
2
I fear we're in store for a Soprano's type ending with the screen cutting to black as Dany takes the Throne with the never-ending threat of a usurper breathing down her neck.
5
WHO CARES?!
The life we LIVE is more dire, desperate and challenging, more interesting, adventurous, mysterious, more absolutely everything than anything TV concocts for our consumption.
6
According to the internet, Dany has lost the common people. That is without having fire and destruction falling upon their heads.
Arya simply needs to kill someone known to Dany to take their face, see Walder Grey on that one. Should Arya kill Dany, that would be Regicide, and Jon being an honorable man, would need to carry out the death sentence. This would then fulfill story that the Prince who was Promised would kill their love. In this case his cousin, who was a sister to him.
3
@Chef Dave No, Jon is going to kill Dany.
1
Why couldn’t Jon and Dani just get married... they loved each other, could have shared the throne, jealousy would have been avoided and the people Kings Landing would have been spared.
Seems overkill to kill the innocent people and have the good soldiers become savages.
My interpretation was the producers wanted to eliminate all the kingdoms to end the emotional connection with an ending of an epic show. I get it and it brought me out of the show. Guess I was just rooting for the good guy, Jon.
2
I think we all need to take it easy on the "must answer" type stuff. It's just setup for huge disappointment in my opinion. This is a television show, not a novel, and the goal is for HBO to sell subscriptions and build hype (not go into intricate details and wrap up loose ends). Expect explosions, love scenes, last minute twists, and most of all to say "is that it?" when the credits show. It'll be a great popular culture moment though, so just enjoy!
12
The only question I want to ask is where are the British boys going.
Bran reminds me of a typical millennial. Except he's not drinking cinnamon coffee.
13
I am sooooo glad this is over, maybe people can start to lead real lives after this. Weird obsession with a TV show, use that energy for bettering the real world.
4
One thing I haven't read in any commentary: that Cersei set up the people of King's Landing for a torching after the "Shame" episode a few seasons back. Her ultimate revenge.
21
Everyone is assuming that Cersei and Jamie are dead. But I don't think they are. Would death by collapsed roof be the punishment for one of the cruelest characters on the show?
10
@Anderson
I kinda wondered too, though with only one episode left, I do think they’re dead.
1
The rest is silence.
3
Why these pointless speculations? The Game ended with the destruction of King's Landing, as surely as Romeo and Juliet ends with the death of the lovers. The last episode will be no more than denouement, the appointment of its own Escalus to wrap things up by pointing a finger. And to what will it point? To the climax already past. To brutality and horror, to the capacity of humans to slaughter one another, which has after all always been a hallmark of the show. Now it is on full display. And while prior savagery has been positioned as an inevitable part of the pursuit of power, how does unleashing a technology of mass slaughter as Dany has done -- on such a scale, and of the most powerless and helpless -- allow us to take comfort any longer in even the most cynical extenuations of the contest for power. Utopias and magic are not, as they promise, a way of escaping politics, any more than they are a way of escaping ourselves. If the Free Folk were smart, why would start rebuilding the wall.
4
I’m expecting a surprise survival from one of last week’s deaths. And a Dracarys moment for Jon and Tyrion - and expect both to emerge from the flames unscathed. Tyrion, now shown to be a Targaryen, supersedes, legitimacy aside, Jon and Dany’s claim to the throne.
But what I’d really like to see is somehow Dany being “rescued” from her madness. Sorry if that means that a man has to do it, but she was a hero for so long that her turn last week felt untrue and results-oriented.
And some final bit of business from Ser Bronn. Perhaps the series concludes with he and Tyrion walking off into the mist and talking about beautiful friendship.
4
@Improv
concludes with HIM... not he
1
@Improv
Even if Tyrion is a Targ, he would not be legitimate, so his claim would not trump Jon's.
@Improv
Okay—you’re the second commenter—when did we ever hear Tyrion was a Targaryen? I mean, okay, I’ll finally accept that Rick Deckard was a Replicant, but I never caught on to the Tyrion plot.
4
I came late to the party to the Game of Thrones series but have enjoyed every minute of it since I began binge watching it weeks ago and I am sure that regardless of who "wins" I will enjoy every minute of the last episode tonight.
33
There has never been a show as fantastic as GOT. Filmed in multiple countries with outstanding sets and costumes. The attention to every last detail, right down to the cups of earthenware and pewter. The dragons from little eggs to huge flying fire breathing weapons. This type of show has never interested me in the past. I think I started watching in Season 2. I savor every" blink and its gone" episode in season 8. Imagine the amount of people employed in how many countries to bring such an epic series to the screen. I personally have no complaints for such a fabulous ride. However it ends tonight I will be sitting in pure enjoyment for such superb entertainment. Thank you every last person who helped put GOT together. If I was working on this show I would feel so proud and sad all at once.
146
For the first time since The Sopranos - I have an appointment to watch something on live TV (outside of sports). And I’m already feeling nostalgic about it being over. I guess that should be celebrated. Kudos to HBO and the staff of GOT for bringing these masterpieces of literature (yes they should be considered as such) into our living room and not disappointing us.
64
@Jason - Many are saying that GoT will be the last "appointment" TV series, watched by a mass audience around the world at a designated time on a weekly basis. I know that we bought our first smart TV to watch shows on-demand when we realized all of the good shows were on Sundays, with nothing worth watching the rest of the week. Then we pretty much left regular TV for On-Demand streaming via our cable provider, plus Netflix and Amazon because binge-watching is really the best way to watch a series.
8
9. What are we going to do with all the otherwise rational friends and colleagues who will be wandering around in a fugue state deeper than the one that followed the ending of "Lost"?
And how will we keep a straight face?
9
The fact that Jon Snow is actually a member of the Targaryen clan gives him the ability to ride dragons with Dany Targaryen. By this logic, that only Targaryens can ride dragons, the Night King is/was also a Targaryen or is perhaps the original father of all Targaryen dragon-riders in the world. The Targaryens have dragon dreams that contain elements of prophecy. In this regard, they seem to intersect with Bran/ the three-eyed-crow. These are the mysteries that will most likely be the focus of GRRM's prequel series, which I understand will be a future HBO series (much like the prequel, Young Sheldon that is a hit on CBS, following the conclusion of The Big Bang Theory.)
3
@mjpezzi -- Perhaps the least-explored of the characters is Bran, the time-traveling Three-Eyed Raven. I hope the prequel series has more of the magic that surrounds Bran.
1
I've quite enjoyed the ride, no matter where ends.
61
I will enjoy the finale, flaws and all, and then wait for the books to answer these questions and more.
13
I think they did set us up for Dany's breakdown over the past two seasons, subtle as it was. Maybe if they hadn't skipped a year, they could have tied up more lose ends. I think I have forgotten some of them anyway. I am prepared for a little disappointment. But, I will probably go to the movie, if I am not dead first.
2
I no longer care. I will not even watch the final episode.
2
@JG - oh the bitterness after season upon season of completely changing the game of what makes a show excellent and what fandom can be. All the bitter people, you're playing the perfect part in the show's psychological profile of human character, LOL. Hilarious how fans have turned so fickle when things don't go their way - human nature... Hmmm, guess Dany & Drogon apparently knew that human nature would cause a turn against them eventually, justifying their "burn it all down" tactic.
8
@JG
You say that now, but eventually you will give in
2
I see tonight’s episode ending in the perfect place to justify the Game of Thrones movie which will be released in the next few years. Btw I don’t have any facts to back this up other than HBO loves money and this is too valuable of a property to let it simply end.
Sansa v. Dany 2022
39
The whole show is one big loose end, painstakingly set up for almost a decade only to hastily sprint towards a finish. I'm not sure it is possible to have a satisfying conclusion to this show, given how the past two seasons have gone down.
71
I wonder if the key consideration was always to break the wheel. If my instinct is correct, and it never has been on GoT, Danny has to destroy everything including herself to begin again. But if that happens it will be all for not because it’s all about power and absolute power corrupts absolutely. I haven’t read the books but I plan to soon. I just kept wondering if the White Walkers were symbolic of a pandemic problem of human doing that made self destruction inevitable? Sansa concerns me. Is she about protecting the Starks at all costs given what she’s been through or is she about power and always has been? My gut tells me Jon is last man standing and will rule because he is just and doesn’t want it. He has always been reluctant but always does the right thing. He is naturally Ned Stark. On second thought...
9
@Patrick Lovell - I hate Sansa. She's been a little schemer since day one. Let's not forget her eagerness to abandon her family for what would be power. Dany has been pretty much open about who she is from the start - not all hearts and flowers. The only two arcs I've hated in this whole story by Martin are - Zombies (just generally stupid and might I add a bit of a hyped sell out in story telling - thus those revering Martin over the show writers, come on...) and the arc I've hated is any cruelty to the best characters on the show - the Direwolves and the Dragons :)
7
@socal60
I have a hard time taking these claims about the dragons and the direwolves seriously. Sure, nobody wants to see cruelty to animals, but in terms of personality, character traits, agency, or any of the other attributes of literary characters there is no reasonable way to consider them characters.
Well, I don't know about you, but I'm going to get a bowl of popcorn, sit back and enjoy the last episode. A big thanks to the people who put it all together. It's been fun.
249
@Michael Kennedy That's the way to watch it!
7
@Michael Kennedy. I’m putting on my House Stark sox, opening a good bottle of red wine, and pouring it into our “I Drink and I Know Things” glasses. Keeping a box of tissues handy ‘cause it hurts to say goodbye.
6
For many seasons we have known that "winter is coming" and it doesn't mean the Night King's army. In the end ALL the forces of all the lands will be defeated by Mother Nature. It is inevitable.
11
@Ken Golden I understood "winter is coming" to be a major theme, a near-disastrous continental climate oscillation. It looks like the plot's abandoned it. King's Landing is not in the midst of winter. Nobody seems to be worried about it.
7
@Ken Golden Are you referring to GOT or global warming?
2
@M.B. Plot won't matter when the seven kingdoms are under a mile of ice. Winter is coming!
This is an extreme example of taking a movie review too far. It’s a made-up story about fictional people, zombies and dragons. There doesn’t have to be any western morality, logical solution, or tying up of loose ends. After all, those endings don’t happen in real life anyway.
92
@Abe M
But those endings *do* generally happen in a long-form dramatic narrative, because that’s the type of conclusion most people find satisfying, enjoyable, and not a complete waste of their time. Art isn’t life. And this isn’t a movie review.
30
@Abe M No? You mean you won't have relationships, lovers, and family members with whom you will travel through time and whose stories will develop, change, and then end? The Syria War will never have a conclusion? World War II didn't have a beginning, middle and end? What about the glory that was Rome? I could go on...
11
Good luck with that last one--it deserves a season all its own.
7
I believe that we will have to wait for GRRM to finish the books for most of these questions to be answered.
58
@Dorothy N. Gray the show follows the plot that was laid out by GRRM for the show runners. The show will have the same answers or lack thereof as the eventual book.
3
@Stefan
You're really saying that GRRM will deliver two thousand-page page books, one that took over eight years to write, that won't tie up any loose ends? No. He's already stated that he gave the showrunners "broad strokes" to work with and that secondary characters will likely have different endings.
40
@Dorothy N. Gray
At this point, we may be waiting for Martin's estate to hire Brandon Sanderson to finish "A Song of Ice and Fire."
8
The extremely disappointing writing in Season 8 suggests that most of these essential questions will go unanswered.
111
@JM Do there need to be questions and answers? It is meant for entertainment; not a philosophy class or debate club. Almost everyone in the show is now or has been evil and the misogyny and sexual violence towards women solicitous. I recommend American Gods for a substitute
3