this is going to cause a nightmare for patients with aggresive CAD who need their LDL levels pushed very low
How can the natural production of a substance by the human body be wrong and bad for so many humans ?
Where did evolution (or God) go wrong ?
Familial hypercholesterolemia is a separate matter and deserves treatment.
Not altogether new. I found this association described in the literature some time ago when looking for information on the (un)desirability of traditional LDL and HDL control in connection with having had a light stroke several years ago. A 2016 meta-analysis already found that lower LDL levels increased the risk for people with a stroke history to have another stroke.
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For a very good 2018 review of the cholesterol problems see this link: https://doi.org/10.1080/17512433.2018.1519391
Don't miss this review. It is a statin stopper.
Here is the title:
LDL-C does not cause cardiovascular disease: a comprehensive review of the current literature
Uffe Ravnskov, Michel de Lorgeril, David M Diamond, Rokuro Hama, Tomohito Hamazaki, Björn Hammarskjöld, show all
Pages 959-970 | Received 11 Jan 2018, Accepted 31 Aug 2018, Accepted author version posted online: 10 Sep 2018, Published online: 11 Oct 2018
Download citation https://doi.org/10.1080/17512433.2018.1519391
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OMG! 9 years ago i had a hemorrhagic stroke at age 58, with no indicators for such a stroke, normal blood pressure, non-smoker, exerciser. (it happened while i was exercising). But I have had low triglycerides at 39-50 for years. No doctor has ever made that connection. Grateful to finally have some explanation for the cause of my stroke. But how can i raise my triglyceride level and to avoid another stroke?
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@Irene B
Don't let this observation paper mislead you. Instead, remember that while we exercise, blood pressure will go up. Sometimes way up. Not sure what you were doing when this happened but the risk of hemorrhagic stroke with high blood pressure is much much stronger than with even this poorly done observation paper would suggest.
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Gees, Louise! If it's too high, risk; if it's too low, risk. So, I suppose it has to be somehow "just right." How does one titrate that, pray tell?
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In a previous post, I asked the question "could it be that statins cause extra risk of hemorrhagic stroke?". Just looked it up in the medical literature. The studies go both ways, but it does seem that statins increase the risk of hemorrhagic stroke. I guess a title for the article, "Statins May Cause Increased Risk of Hemorrhagic Stroke" would have been a bit, um, unpopular.
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Bingo!
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@David Hughes The women in the study were not taking cholesterol-lowering drugs, which makes it interesting. Statin may not have an effect in causing hemorrhagic strokes.
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Perhaps a key factor is left out of this article: did the people in the study have low cholesterol because they were taking statins, or was it because they just "naturally" had low lipid levels? I'm interested in this point because my LDL is 60 and my triglycerides 40, no statins, just heredity, I guess. If the study cholesterol levels were statin-induced, could it be that statins cause extra risk of hemorrhagic stroke?
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Simplistic observational study. First of all we do not treat cholesterol or triglycerides values on their own; we treat a person in the context of their own risk assessment, the so-called 'personalized medicine'. Secondly, ischemic stroke is more common and related to LDL-cholesterol, hypertension etc. Thirdly, hemorrhagic stroke has multiple associations including hypertension, family history, cerebral atrophy, dementia, cerebral aneurysms and now seen more and more commonly is cerebral amyloid microangiopathy that develops with ageing. Not so simple after all.
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Very Low Cholesterol May Increase Hemorrhagic Stroke Risk
Let's not get carried away. Ischemic stroke is far more common than hemorrhagic stroke.
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@childofsol
Gosh, it's almost like there's some sort of homeostasis for the lipid system...
Do LDL particles have an adaptive purpose? Or do they only exist to give us heart disease and to provide a profitable target for medication?
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@childofsol Until you have one as I did, 9 years ago with lasting consequences. No indicators for it other than low triglycerides.
There has never been any good evidence supporting the association between high LDL and heart disease, or between saturated fat consumption and heart disease. People can have LDL that ranges far, far above what medical charts consider the top of normal - this is typical for many very lean people who follow a low carb or ketogenic diet. People who reverse diabetes on keto diets tend to experience improved biomarkers in every single measurement except LDL, which tends to go up. This suggests that our interpretation of LDL is just wrong, and that perhaps low LDL is not in fact especially healthy. (Maybe it's not unhealthy either. Maybe we don't need to worry about it. Though there are a number of studies showing highest mortality rates at the lowest cholesterol levels, so ymmv.) And we shouldn't be surprised if "science" that (A) got "solidified" in the 20th century and (B) was largely supported by the statin industry proves to be incorrect, as has been the case with so many things that used to be held out as truth but have now been refuted. (E.G., hormone replacement therapy.)
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There are plenty of studies that show an association between high LDL and stroke. This study examined the question of what effects unusually low cholesterol might have. This is interesting information. To all the readers who get incensed when they don't find a simple black/white answer to complex health issues: stop reading these articles! You will never be happy so go back to reading a comic book or whatever makes you feel safe. Reporting on studies like this is why I get the NYT.
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@JEM
These medical studies are 'Pro This' one year and 'Anti-This', a year or two down the line, involving the same issues. Fiber, Sugar, Salt, Fats (Saturated and UnSaturated), Alcohol consumption, Cholesterol levels are too High, no wait, there too Low. It goes on to infinity because in the end everyone dies, everything is temporary. Yet a great deal of people think that eating or doing specific things will greatly increase their life-spans. Only to be told basically, 'Remember what we said about this 10 years ago, well, forget it, THIS NEW THING is better!' Because it involves mortality, some readers really 'get hooked' on these articles, and the writers of these articles just eventually move on to other departments or other newspapers or wind up writing for The Enquirer or hosting the local 6:00 O'Clock News. All of this is, in the end, essentially like reading your Daily Horoscope.
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Several years ago, an article was published about low LDL's by
Francisco Lopez-Jimenez, M.D. from the Mayo Clinic.
He found that low LDLs were associated with hemorrhagic stroke, depression and cancer. Other research, at that time, showed that men with low LDLS had high rates of suicide.
Nathan Pritikin, who proposed lowering LDLs with low fat diets
did what he preached. He was highly regarded in his field. Unfortunately, he developed leukemia and at the age of 69 committed suicide.
I was amazed that all this information suddenly disappeared and always felt that the demand for statins, to dramatically lower LDLs, had something to do about that.
Stephen Z. Wolner, DDS
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These 'studies' reported by The Times, always take me back to that 1973 Woody Allen film, 'SLEEPER'. (For those of you who've seen it, this will make you smile.) Allen is revived hundreds of years in the future from his frozen state of suspended animation. His new Doctors of this new era are looking over what he used to eat in the 1970's, 'Wheat Germ', Alfalfa Sprouts, 'tigers milk'. And are amazed. They say to one another: 'You mean he didn't know about the healthy attributes of Steak, no Deep-Fat, Cream Pies or Hot-Fudge'? Amazing!'
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More depressing revelations all the time. Gimme a cigarette, a fatty steak and a bourbon! Just kidding!
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@Sally
I'm with you Sally! At 65 years of age, my doctor advised me in January that my cholesterol could go down a bit, with effort by...me. That being my only medical problem, 'I'll have a Steak and a Vodka-rocks with Lime, please!'
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The association between cholesterol and cardiovascular disease appears to be less understood than ever.
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This study was of women, not men. The results, however, may be similar for men. Many patients who are taking statins to lower their LDL cholesterol levels in order to prevent a heart attack may be at increased risk for a hemorrhagic stroke. Cardiologists say that to reduce the risk of a heart attack, the lower the LDL level the better. Medications are a trade-off. I accept the risk and will continue to take a statin and a baby aspirin.
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It will probably take another 5-10 years for non-biologists to realize that cholesterol is one of the most valuable nutrients for life, plant and animal. Notice how the author (and the study authors in their conclusion) failed to note that high cholesterol is not a danger for stroke. Eventually, they will have to reclassify bad cholesterol as "bad-good", and good cholesterol as "good-bad". Of course, this study is just associations anyway, which means that cholesterol haters can ignore it, and cholesterol lovers can cite it. Sheesh!
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The article leaves much to be desired. The quote at the end was completely useless because the article did not discuss risk for stroke associated with risk factors other than cholesterol. But heaven forbid someone would go on record and question the notion that low cholesterol may be unhealthy.
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