There's no doubt that for those in touch with the harsh reality, who have children, who have the means and qualify should emigrate.
This country has not only become a fascist dictatorship but, as reflected in the experience of the federal workers, the contractors, the minorities etc, is a downright dangerous entity and there is no one to rescue us.
3
This horrible man, disguised as President, exclusively listens to Ann Coulter, Rush Limbaugh and Sean Hannity who represent his hard-core followers. What about the majority of this country that is completely ignored?
Trump has created his own reality and his own narrative that are light years away from the story of all the sane people who want this nightmare to go away once and for all and not a day too soon.
When Congress finally sends him packing they should not forget to include Mitch McConnell, Lindsey Graham and a handful of other, ignominious and embarrassing fellow travelers.
12
My youngest works for a regional office of the DOT. Without fail, he and his colleagues are laughing at the panicky, clearly biased, lib media coverage of mythical suffering of the furloughed feds. They love the shutdown and pray it goes on thru the winter; it is a paid vacation for them ( true - with deferred pay). The contractors are a different matter altogether, and thatjis the saddest truth: they aren’t predominantly low(er) class and more likely Trump voters, so they are clearly being parishes by the Dems in the lower house... Pelosi and her clan ought to be ashamed.
2
Reality check. Federal workers have to know government shut downs are always a possibility. It is baked in the cake. It is assumption of risk, a trade off if you will for a cushy Federal job with benefits most of us never can obtain, Pension, 401K, medical, dental, life insurance, disability, and paid vacations. That means instead of going out to dinner or going on a cruise to Turks and Caicos you bank the money as an insurance policy in case obstructionist democrats like Schumer and Pelosi ever regain power. What matters now is keeping out the Mexican rapists, murderers and human traffickers, not whether Andrea missed her paycheck. Sorry.
2
Let's find a way to stop paying all elected officials...do they even know what a financial pinch feels like? Bet that will garner action
3
No group of people is less essential to the functioning of our government on a day to day basis than elected and appointed officials. They should be forced to work all day every day, and none of them should be paid for any of those days during all government shutdowns. Additionally, all their perks (drivers, congressional gyms, cafeterias, etc.) should be immediately shut down for the duration as well.
Maybe a bunch will resign as a result. Great, double bonus!
4
Two clear cut facts:
1. Trump said Mexico would pay for it—nothing more needs to be said about that.
2. McConnell could end this in a heart beat—he’s the real gutless culprit.
7
Trump says he can “relate” to the Feds and contractors affected by the shutdown. While he golfs at Mar-a Lago. While his Secret Service entourage goes unpaid.
6
If the Republicans want to save their party from extinction, they must override a Trump veto and re-start the government, quarantine Trump for the remainder of his term, and nominate an intelligent, rational, decent replacement for 2020.
Faint hope with McConnell in the driver's seat.
8
President Obama could have declared a "national emergency" on health care costs. Hindsight is 20/20 I suppose.
2
News flash readers! Regardless of who is affected and how, the root cause is a dysfunctional government that cares more about electing their party in the next election as a majority than you, me, or the government employee down the road. This is about pure politics and there is no getting around it. While the NYTimes want us to think it's about a wall, as does the Dem party, it's not. But most sadly of all, it would seem that the Dems don't want border security. I know most do, but seems that we'd rather keep a problem alive (closed government) even though the problem is self-inflicted, than do the boring job of agreeing on a budget and then actually doing some work this year. McConnell, Pelosi, Schumer, and the rest of the 'leadership' in Congress are bigger babies than Trump.
2
On the other hand, Pelosi and Company could agree to fund the wall which is strikingly similar to the one they agreed to in 2013, and which Obama was also supportive of, asMarc Thiessen notes in his WaPo editorial from Thursday.
4
My daughter is a contractor for a federal agency and has not been paid and most likely will not receive back pay. Living in DC is very expensive and while we can assist her for a while we cannot indefinitely. She is fortunate to have us; however, what about all those who do not have financial support. While some banks are accommodating people with mortgages I have yet to hear any landlord willing to accommodate renters. I have written to my Republican senator requesting his party start to act as a co-equal branch of government. An article in today's WSJ notes Mitch McConnell's absence in this debacle. If we want this problem solved we need to contact our representatives and tell them to start doing the job for which WE pay them. After all,THEY are all receiving paychecks.
9
It way past time that the Republican congressional leadership go to the White House and tell the president it's time quit.
7
We need 4 Republican Senators to announce they will become Independents because of McConnell refusing to allow items to proceed to a vote.
McConnell instantly loses Senate Leader slot if four Republicans defect to Independent.
If one or two Republicans will announce they are doing this, it may be enough to convince others.
And/or it might be enough of a power threat to McConnell that he just might cease abrogating his obligations.
The Senate MUST be allowed to function! It must be once again part of the Third Branch of Government checks and balance system.
12
Why is the Times giving the Republican Senate a free pass by continually referring to it as "Trump's shutdown?"
Constitutionally and legally Congress could stop this immediately. It is a choice Mitch McConnell and the Republican Senators are making by refusing to vote to end the shutdown, overriding a veto if necessary. By solely "crediting" Trump for the shutdown, the paper, as well as the media and most commenters in general, simply play into Trump's hand, encouraging the narrative that everything is about him.
As important, it let's off the hook the twenty-two Republican Senators up for re-election in 2020.
14
@Steve Fankuchen
Yes! This! There needs to be some naming and shaming going on. Furthermore, who's funding these people? Who helps their campaigns? Trump's other associates have been getting indicted left and right. It seems pretty odd that, as political creatures, the Republican leadership would be tying themselves so tightly to this sinking ship. What are they gaining or maybe avoiding? Are they compromised too or just utterly lacking in ethics and empathy? You'd think they would love to exercise the power they've worked so hard to capture, fix the situation for 800,000 potential voters, and stop looking like idiot lackeys with no clue about how the government is supposed to work according to the Constitution that they otherwise like to bandy about while calling themselves "patriots".
3
How great can any country be when missing one bi-weekly paycheck leads to economic devastation for many families? And if federal employees can't make ends meet during a shutdown, what will their lives be like when they retire, possibly with little savings? Can they count on pensions and social security? Let's not vote for someone who would cause such havoc next time.
6
The ripple effect of this shut down is having negative effects in the international fields as well.
The NY Times needs to look at what is happening at our Embassies around the globe with this ill-conceived, manipulative shut down our President is so "proud" to shoulder.
Federal employees, including military staff, their dependents, and any locally hired staff (required by many countries) are now having to deal with no budget to maintain security at the embassies and residential compounds. Furloughed federal employees and those working without pay are facing non-payment of their housing leases, and school tuition for their children will go unpaid once their funding runs out the end of January.
All this makes our reputation untrustworthy and our ability to govern equitably unstable in the eyes of the world.
6
This article, which I see is on the front page of today’s newspaper, illustrates the suffering from the longest government shutdown in American history. With no end in sight, it probably doesn’t hurt to express any ideas, even if unrealistic, since nobody else is solving the problem.
Maybe President Trump can donate the 5.7 billion dollars he is requesting for the wall? He has stated being worth over 10 billion dollars and this would be an even a bigger gift than fellow New York City billionaire, Michael Bloomberg, made when he recently donated 1.8 billion dollars to support student financial aid at Johns Hopkins University. It can be called the Trump Wall and it would be a monument to his presidency. Should it ever be felt to be unnecessary, like President Reagan said about an earlier one, we can “tear down this wall.”
8
What? The federal government is shut down? When did that happen? Is it going to start back up, or is it gone forever?
"But farmers affected by the tariffs are unable to apply for emergency aid; tenants who depend on federal housing subsidies to cover their rent are facing eviction; private contractors working for the federal government are not getting paid, and rural homeowners and businesses who need a mortgage extension or guarantee cannot get one."
The key word is "dependent." Depending on the federal government is risky. Even Social Security payments, which haven't stopped, and which some folks believe is their own money because they paid into SS, are at risk. Congress has the authority to end SS payments in a New York minute.
There are some people in America who depend entirely on God and the resources God gives them. They may be inspired by the words of Jesus in his Sermon on the Mount, recorded in the Gospel of Matthew, Ch. 6, verses 31-34:
So do not worry, saying, ‘What shall we eat?’ or ‘What shall we drink?’ or ‘What shall we wear?’ For the pagans run after all these things, and your heavenly Father knows that you need them. But seek first his kingdom and his righteousness, and all these things will be given to you as well. Therefore do not worry about tomorrow, for tomorrow will worry about itself. Each day has enough trouble of its own."
This government shut down may prove to be a blessing if more Americans put their faith in God rather than government.
5
I'm counting on my rabbit's foot and my horseshoe collection.
10
@Ned Netterville
So they should just tell their landlord they're paying with thoughts and prayers this month?
5
Ned, you sound just like the Ned on the Simpsons. That is not a compliment.
4
Those predicting catastrophic consequences from the partial government "shutdown" should explain how it became necessary to issue a Romaine lettuce recall during last years Thanksgiving/Christmas holiday season. Noteworthy is that the federal government was fully “functional” at the time. Nevertheless, not only did USDA and FDA “inspections” fail to detect the contaminated lettuce, it took them a month to identify which growing REGION the infected lettuce came from. Millions of Americans not only had to forego eating salads they were forced to throw out already purchased lettuce. Discarded lettuce aside, it is estimated that the outbreak cost the industry tens of millions of dollars.
Then there is the human toll.The CDC reports that 62 people in 16 states became sick, including 25 hospitalized during the latest outbreak. During ANOTHER E. coli outbreak linked to romaine lettuce from March through June of last year. Across 36 states, 210 people became ill, including almost 100 hospitalized, and five died. I suspect that millions of Americans have ceased eating salads as a result however I doubt USDA will issue a report assessing the resulting impact to the economy when they return to work. Certainly that wouldn’t advance them or their sister agencies at CDC and FDA beyond their non-essential status. Nor can we expect the press to interview the families affected by the outbreaks or discuss the toll they exacted much less attempt to explain governments failure
7
Most Americans like Ms. Gumpel, seem to have little knowledge of what government does that affects their individual lives. I am coming to believe the only way to educate people and hopefully to end the use of political shutdowns is to really shutdown the government - cut all services everywhere and for everyone. No exceptions!
5
Good suggestion, but the only way for your suggestion to be effective is for all federal government employees to be locked out of work during a government shutdown. The federal government has been circumventing the true effect of a government shutdown because employees still worked unpaid and restricted from using their own personal leave in order to still get paid during a government shutdown. This allowed the government to be open with limited services but not a complete shutdown of services. tRump's shutdown is the 1st of its kind because it involves three categories of employees who are either: 1) working and getting paid for their services; 2) working but not getting paid for their services; or 3) not working, locked out of their work/position. It's politicians (GOPers) playing with the livelihood of federal government employees. Since Clinton, GOPers owned more of the blame for all of the shutdowns since. More importantly, the #CovfefeDotard #45 said on record himself that he would be "proud to wear the mantle of a shutdown." Place the blame where it is due. Evidence suggests that this wall wasn't as much of a "national emergency" as the tax cut ✂ for the uber rich 1%. The tax cuts for the uber rich 1% was of greater importance nationally to the GOPers than border wall which is why: 1) it's their only achievement; and 2) they didn't fund the border wall themselves when they had total control of all three branches of government the past two years.
3
Why is Congress still getting paid? Talk about non-essential government employees!
12
Discussions of the Trump/McConnell government shutdown should more often use the right words:
blackmail, extortion, ransom and crime.
7
We have to give in to the extortion. Too many are suffering. Later the president will
either be removed or not reelected. In the meantime we have to limit the damage.
I am educated and have a good deal of wisdom but it is incomprehensible how the Congress can allow this to continue. Have they no compassion. They can't all be sadists.
4
I really, really, really had a good laugh at the person who works at the Department of Veterams Affairs working mandatory overtime to correct the horrendous backlog processing claims for Vets. Maybe he can get his furloughed brother to help out, so the guy can earn some money while president Trump fumes about his worthless wall. I understand there are 45 thousand plus vacancies at the agency. Maybe Don Jr., Eric and Ivanka can help out.
4
By his actions the responsibility for this partial stoppage falls on President Trump. Why not call it what it is, the Trump Shutdown? It looks like he is going for the all time longest shutdown ever. When did we ever “negotiate” with a hostage taker? We should never give in to this cruel and immoral man.
5
Amazing that we have 800,000 bureaucrats whose “work” is so unimportant that nobody notices that it’s stopped.
6
That comment ... that the wall is going straight through the USA andnot between us and Mexico ... captures these times perfectly, I think.
5
Just think of what could be done with all those billions instead of a wall!
The Mexicans were always smart enough to have thought that!
That's why Democrats should not cave--or compromise.
Besides a wall today means boat people tomorrow--unless quality life and politics improves in the Banana Republics.
7
The only ones who will be damaged more than the 800,000 federal workers will the enablers within the GOP that coddle DJT.
The cracks in the party are more obvious than ever and will grow wider and deeper with each passing day.
Maryland is home to a large portion of the federal work force and houses many of our federal agencies so many of my friends are impacted. But no Democrat or independent should give into DJT’s threats and whining.
DJT, mitch and the rest of the GOP bottom feeders had 2 years to act on this and as recently as December (last month) bipartisan support approved funding for border security but DJT changed his mind.
DJT, mitch and the koch brothers own this.
They own ALL of this.
Once again the Democratic Party will come in after a GOP created catastrophe and cleanup their mess!
Vote 2020
8
Of course many are oblivious. These are government employees. They don’t really do anything other than draw a check.
If these shutdowns teach us anything it is that the federal government is nothing but a massive jobs program.
Rather than pointing out the uselessness of hoards of slovenly workers who suckle at the taxpayer teat, we get anecdotes intended to elicit sympathy.
Sorry. Not buying.
Remember, these are notoriously the worst workers money can buy. They’re either too dumb or too lazy to work in the private sector or they are bilking taxpayers with bloated contracts.
We could lose more than half of them and not notice a difference.
5
But you will be the first to complain when your tax refund is late, when your roads are not plowed/maintained and/or when your national infrastructure is not up to first world standards.
The federal government is a massive machine and like any large workforce you will find marginal workers and agencies.
I would prefer working on minimizing the waste than demonize people who provide a valuable service to hundreds of millions of citizens.
And as a last resort you could always leave!
5
The longest Federal government shutdown in U.S. history and the highest U.S. debt in history ($22 trillion, which is 78% of 2018 GDP and rising according to the NYT) will be Trump's legacy. How fitting for a man who leads his life so sloppily and expresses himself so vulgarly. The Democrats should not give an inch. As bad as the pain is now, it will get worse if he gets his way.
4
This insanity needs to end. I think it’s clear Donald Trump and Mitch McConnell are not doing what is best for our country. Mike Pompeo is publicly humiliating himself while ignorantly parroting his craven master’s harmful words and actions.
4
"On Thursday, ICE agents led an investigation at Yarrabee Farms where Bahena-Rivera worked since 2014 when he was first hired using an alias ...
Eric Lang, one of the chief executives of Yarrabee Farms, is the brother of Craig Lang, who was the (former president of both the Iowa Farm Bureau Federation and the Iowa Board of Regents and a 2018 Republican candidate for state secretary of agriculture.) The Farm Bureau has chapters all over the United States, with the goal of increasing the number of low-skilled foreign workers, specifically those on H-2A visas, who are allowed to enter the country every year.
As reported, Eric Lang is also married to Nicole Schlinger, who runs the GOP fundraising firm Campaign Headquarters in Brooklyn, Iowa."
https://www.google.com/amp/s/claytoncaller.com/ice-raids-dairy-farm-where-illegal-alien-accused-of-killing-mollie-tibbetts-worked/15315/amp/
Iowa Republican Crime Family that hired and housed alleged killer of Mollie Tibbetts hasn't learned a thing. Oh wait, it's NOT a crime for employers. No wonder they're ONLY INTERESTED in a Wall. No wonder, Candidate Trump promised "big, fat, beautiful door" and already increased foreign work visas.
Republicans are defending "Fox/Trump/McConnell Shutdown" for an Emergency Wall Farce. SAD.
4
One way to look at this is Pres. Trump is crazy and throwing a tantrum. Another way to look at it is the so-called "Adults in the Room" (Nancy and Chuck) are blocking everything over $5 billion (which is nothing in the federal budget), over a physical barrier (wall, fence, whatever) that just a few years ago they and even Obama said was OK and necessary. They hate Trump so much that they'll do this to government employees; but you won't read that narrative in the Left-leaning media. There, it's all "Orange Man Bad" and coordinated narratives about "manufactured crises" by those who already live behind walls in gated communities. Who really is to blame for this?
2
Why would anyone ever take a job working for the federal government after this? Long-term employees may stay to get their pensions, but workers with only a few years service will have to quit and get other jobs before too long. The security of having a "government job" is no more. Who would take a job knowing that your employer can just stop paying you any time he wants?
1
The majority of Americans do not buy into the rot wing religion of Social Darwinism. The notion that this shut down exposes a binary of "devasted" and "oblivious" perpetuates the myth that we Americans all subscribe to an attitude of "if it doesn't affect my finances, I don't care." While Gumpel may not be directly affected, she states empathy for her neighbor--that is a powerful effect. But the corporate press seems to have an interest in foisting the myth of Social Darwinism on us and making it a reality.
The other idea that this article appears to want to perpetuate is the rot wing mythology that cause and effect are relative: they only happen when it is politically expedient. The majority of Americans understand inter-connectivity, we understand that when one segment of the population suffers, we are all affected. If we didn't understand that, there would have been no civil rights movement, no women's rights movement.
We need to recognize and be critical of the significant role that corporate news plays in creating division in our country.
3
First, It is a bad situation and I feel for the folks who are not getting paid, but most will eventually get paid. Not so for many citizens who do not work for the government - so maybe this is a good thing so that government employees know what the rest of the country has to deal with at times. Second, it is pure politics at play and I believe the Democrats are to blame. If you look at the past statements about border controal by many of the democratic party leaders, you will find that they mirror what President Trump is now stating. Why is it wrong now, but it was right just a few years back?
3
One single example would be nice. Dems are solid for border security. The wall maybe helpful here and there, but it’s not the best mileage for the money. It’s an adornment for trump who thinks the wall will be a monument for him for millennia to come like the Great Wall of China.
11
A way to end the shut down: some objective, credible, polling organization should investigate the furloughed works, find who voted for Donald and among them, who would vote for Donald now. If those polling results verifiably reveal Donald is losing support with his core, then Donald would declare Donald's Own National Emergency and shut down the shut down at once. Sadly, no one has explored this polling option.
Meanwhile, Donald's immoral cruelty extends from the Southern border where imprisoned immigrants, children and adults, suffer immoral separation from families, are dying, and still live in inhumane prison conditions, to American families who are getting a taste of how impoverished people transact their hard lives in America using food banks, hand outs and perhaps from the kindness of others--prayers don't pay the mortgage. Paycheck will inhibit the feelings of total impending loss verging desperation.
Donald's cruelty knows no limits. That cruelty is aggravated now that Donald's fight engages, mano a mano, a woman: Rep Pelosi. A battle a misogynist, Donald, cannot lose. Sadly Americans must endure a long shut down in the interest of Donald Political Theater. Any transactional means to achieve his 2020 ends at any costs to Americans is Donald's Way.
Someone, please, conduct that poll.
10
Not a leader amongst any of the warring factions. In this case, a true leader would ‘blink’ first and meaningfully compromise. A true leader would act on the merits of the cause and not the politics - as with those Democrats whom previously supported a wall to help maintain our nation’s sovereignty and now don’t because of politics. A true leader would comport himself and herself without the use of vulgarity, wanton accusations and unnecessary divisiveness.
A true leader is what we no longer can expect from those in power.
2
The Democrats did propose a solution that could reopen most of government and extend the border issue, did they not? That was rejected out of hand.
8
FYI: Republicans have controlled the Congress for the last TWO YEARS! Republicans passed a bloated Federal Budget just before Christmas! And Donald decided to throw a tantrum! Rejecting the spending bill Republicans had PASSED! WHY have Republicans NOT funded Donald's wall in the last TWO YEARS?! They had the power to give Donald all the money he needed but didn't!!!
6
The ripple effect will soon be felt by many more Americans. If nothing else, maybe the anti-government voters will finally realize how vital government is, and that they are not so ‘self-made’ as they believe themselves to be.
6
I feel sorry for these people but I never once saw an article about my predicament when I was laid off during a downturn in construction in the 90's and had to go on unemployment benefits for $230 a week which was approximately one third of my take home pay. We were also sent home without pay every time it rained or snowed or the city shut down the job, etc.
6
Sam, I also feel sorry for your lay-off experience in the 90's and having to be on unemployment. Luckily your unemployment "benefits" weren't shut off for pure hate politics by one or the other political party or both. I would have felt extra sorry for you, but not too sorry because surely you would have got your back pay unemployment benefits eventually, maybe or hopefully once the political system returned to working as designed.
Signed, Patrick NIchols, a retired USCG Officer with 28 years and 4 months of Service, that will not be getting a pension check at the end of the month.
4
@An Independent American I didn't get "back pay" or "retro pay" during any of my layoffs, some of which lasted six months to a year. When I did collect unemployment it worked out to about one third of my pay as a construction worker. And only about 8% of Americans even get a defined pension nowadays. At least you will be getting your pension check eventually. And union construction jobs are now going the way of the Dodo, after I was forced into retirement after 28 years due to the financial crisis the big contractors started hiring more and more contractors that use "undocumented workers" for less pay and no health benefits and certainly no 401K or a defined pension plan. I had to find a job in another field in my early fifties. The various politicians of NYC did not and still do not care. Plenty of my coworkers were forced out of the construction field with no pension and no health benefits, they ended up working at places like Home Depot and Lowe's.
Signed, a retired union construction worker now working in another field.
1
If you want a great example of Trump's business know how, deal making and how much he cares about working people, take a trip to Atlantic City and see the wreckage he left behind in that town and its financial impact on that community. Go talk to the people that live there.
The man cares not one iota about the middle class, or anybody else for that matter, except himself.
11
Seeing the large numbers of people affected gives me a sense of the proportion of the needless spending and waste that comes from the massive federal bureaucracy. Politicians decide that some cause is worthy of taking taxpayer's money (the equivalent of people's time and freedom). That cause grows ever larger, with little real oversight, and before you know it, it has a huge constituency and a life of its own. Millions of people are DEPENDENT. This nation owes more than $21 trillion, and we've recently resorted to PRINTING trillions of dollars from NOTHING to pay our bills. Cannot people see how this ends?
4
Yeah, way too many TSA Agents, meat inspectors, secrete service guarding trump at Mar a Lago etc., clearly don’t need these people...
5
It is time to end this shutdown and the people who can do it are the air traffic controllers and the airport inspectors. If they all refuse to work until they are paid, the the airports will have to close and, with air traffic shut down, the politicians on both sides will have no choice but to end it regardless of what they have to sacrifice.
13
Next time Republicans try to reduce unemployment or welfare benefits, remember that Trump’s actions are causing people to need those benefits to survive.
11
It is not just 800,000 federal employees impacted. Think of the meals, coffees, and goods, and services; right down to baby sitting and day care furloughed employees do not purchase and the impact on those businesses; who then must lay off staff, or cut back on their own spending.
Think about the farmer, who cannot sell his soybeans because of Trump's trade war with China and who now will not receive the federal assistance promised to compensate for the impact of lost soybean sales. Every rural business will be impacted, from grocery stores to machinery dealership if farmers do not have cash to pay their bills.
Think about the tourists who will not come to the US because federal monuments and parks are closed and the impact on businesses that rely on tourist dollars.
And to think this is all over Trump's temper tantrum that Congress will not fund his vanity wall which he promised Americans would not have to pay for. Trump has started a economic crisis that is snowballing with each and every passing minute and is a lot bigger national crisis than the imaginary national crisis he claims his wall will correct.
17
There are so many commenters here scoffing "why don't they have savings?"
Look, folks, you don't get it. We have a wealth gap in this country worthy of a third world dictatorship. For all the scoffing that goes on for increasingly more people, scraping up a bit of empathy and walking a mile in another person's shoes would go a long way to starting to change the reality that "the working poor" is not an expression: it refers to many of our federal workers, many of our service workers, many people you see every day who can't make ends meet even though they are working hard, often at multiple jobs.
Our homeless shelters are full of working people (I say this as someone who worked for years in shelters). Parents are strapped (I say this as a parent). Federal workers are demoralized (I say this as a parent of a federal worker). And if you are so fortunate not to be living paycheck to paycheck: stop pointing the finger at "the other"--at immigrants, people of lower socioeconomic status, people whose skin is a different color than yours--and scoffing at them.
Stop pointing the finger at federal workers and saying "Hey, what's wrong with them, why can't they work without pay???" Why are we asking them to? My son is a federal worker and I put him on a plane to Mexico this morning.This is his second federal shut down in his young adult life and each time he's left the country to try his luck elsewhere. Is this how we nurture the next generation of leaders in public service?
24
@ML Yes people can be judgmental about one having some savings to ride out the loss of a paycheck but the media has used very poor examples in my opinion. Last night on I believe the CBS news they interviewed a furloughed Fed employee who stated she did not have the money to buy a cup of coffee that morning. This in my opinion is extreme. Yesterday was the first day people missed a paycheck. As to your Federal employee son going to Mexico to look for better opportunities please. I realize some Fed employees are gonna have a tough time all because the government is run by clowns. There are also Federal employees who are Veterans collecting a retirement check and a 140K salary who are on a paid vacation. Like life in general, there are all different types working for the government.
3
Maybe the government should do what the courts and corporations have done: require it to go to mediation.
Each party in each house gets to appoint by majority vote a representative who is most skilled at reaching across the aisle and negotiation. Then on day one of the shutdown, those individuals sit down with a mediator and resolve it within a designated time period.
Seems like common sense, right? But, alas, that's probably the problem.
2
After only two weeks -assuming an average yearly salary of $35,000 - the back pay appropriately owed to government workers, forced to be either working without pay or non-productive, is approximately $107,000,000. How many more border patrol agents, drones, electronic detection devices, etc., could have been hired/purchased for that amount? Yet, the FOX/Trump shutdown continues. So much for fiscal Conservatives.
6
boil it down: the native racism of white, Christian "conservatives" trumps their supposed fiscal restraint every time. why does the freedom caucus fulminate for a terrifically expensive wall only the most deluded believe will be effective in any way, and not against the titanic waste of money this Trump symbol actually represents? is it merely coincidence the stirred up fears on the right just happen to be directed at people from Central America and not the Norwegians President Trump said he would welcome with open arms? this is not our America!
2
We are all “devastated” by the scourge of illegal immigration.
Build the wall and Make America Great Again!!!
God Bless the USA!!!
4
Our biggest problem remains the hideous enslavement of innocent question marks, thrown into their deaths on the front lines in lieu of knowledge, thought, or reason.
2
Every day, this country and its standing in the world is devastated by Trump’s ignorance, selfishness and lies. Immigrants are not our greatest threat, Trump and his complete inability to put the country above himself, his family and his finances will harm us for decades.
3
@BC..."We are all devastated" Um, no. Besides, what are your contributions to our country? I am retired Navy and now I teach elementary school. I support illegal immigration why? These are people looking for a better life and our country will always be that light on the hill for those who seek refuge. As long as I'm here? Immigrants stay. #OneEarth.
Can't these folks just ask Trump's dad for money?
11
“ I never said that Mexico was going to directly pay for the wall.“
— America’s Truth-Teller
10
"Biggest shutdown ever. It's beautiful. Past Presidents wish they had my shut down. Losers. Lyin' Ted or Low Energy Jeb couldnt have had such a fantastic shutdown."
12
republican states now might recognize their dependantcy on government handouts.
13
And who's gonna pay for the wall?
America first!!!
5
Witnessing the government shutdown from my present cushy country, Denmark, I am stunned at the suffering my fellow Americans are forced to endure under our sham president. Why aren't Americans flocking to the streets in droves from Alaska to Florida to protest? As Americans wither and agonize I am reminded of the apocalyptic paintings of Hieronymus Bosch. It is so sad to see and there is nothing I can do other than vote and write (meaningless) comments in NYT.
14
@Margare
"Why aren't Americans flocking to the streets in droves?"
Because the relentless and partisan cherry-picking of hard-luck stories is perceived by many Americans as biased and hyperbolic? Because those same Americans know that Trump is just one actor in this drama and that his opponents in the House and Senate are equally obstinate and inflexible?
3
"I don't want to sound unfeeling but as adults, with families, shouldn't they have 1-2 moths worth of emergency funding aside? I mean.....cmon."
Yes, you would think so, but -everyone has their own story, their own circumstances. So don't be so quick to judge others.
And yes, surely some jobs ARE unnecessary. But who is going to judge ? You ? Sounds like you would.
Then again try having a kid who , in their 30's still doesn't have 1 week of pay put away, despite making excellent wages. How do you get through to someone who refuses to plan for even the tiniest issues ? You don't. And eventually you just through up your hands in frustration.
3
I’m curious as to just who it is that honestly believes Trump has ever, for any reason, planned ahead in any way whatsoever.
3
I'm in the “what shutdown?” camp though I feel for my former colleagues in the federal space. Once Trump got elected I successfully got out of the federal space altogether and never looked back.
2
Americans have become so insensitive.
Okay, so you are missing a pay check because of Mad Donnie and Monstrous Mitch.
It's painful.
But how can it compare to the pain of losing a child to a murderous illegal immigrant?
Building a wall is the only way of bringing these dead people back to life.
Why would all Americans sacrifice to make that happen.
Because of the crazy Democrats, these people will stay dead.
Now if all the land owners along the 1154 miles of the Texas border will just sacrifice their land rights for the Slats of Steel,
the dead will rise again.
Believe me........
5
Ouch! Another weekend that Trump will have to spend at the White House instead of golfing at Mar-a-Lago. Bad optics to be seen on the links when shut-out federal workers are missing mortgage payments
Another "poor me" tweet is imminent.
Ironically, The Great Protector, busy fighting off those Hispanic invaders down south, will probably miss being served by his Hispanic servants at his Florida mansion.
However, one can rest assured that this guy has never spent much time contemplating the ironies of life.
12
Never; ever forget: Pelosi is trying to open the Govt; Trump is stopping her. Blame Trump . Ray Sipe
15
@Ray Sipe
McConnell is the most to blame. All he has to do is bring the House bills to the Floor and this mess would be over.
1
Do the editors of the New York Times not know that before this story was even posted Congress had passed a bill -- and Trump had said he would sign it -- guaranteeing that all the federal workers would be paid in full for NOT working?
I guess it would have taken some of the drama out of this hyperbolic propaganda piece to note that the "victims" were all on a tax-payer funded paid holiday.
7
That is some consolation, but it doesn't help with the groceries, rent, utilities, or other bills that are due today. These families will be incurring late charges, possibly overdraft fees, etc. And it doesn't help the retailers who depend on the spending of federal workers.
5
Are you aware that there are hundreds of thousands of federal government contractors (including myself) who are also out of work, and will NOT receive back pay?
7
@Gigi
I believe that Senators Kaine, Warner, and Brown and Representative Breyer have introduced legislation to get contractors back pay. Fingers crossed for you and all contractors that it works.
2
I feel tremendous empathy for the Black and poor White folks living from paycheck to paycheck on the Federal Payroll. I have no sympathy whatsoever for the Prison Guards, Border Patrol, Farmers or any other Trump Supporters. They voted for this guy.....they will most definitely suffer from his maniacal policies.
8
Yes oh well. Just glad I live in a high tax state that provides for its citizens. Boo boo to you low state tax inhabitants who are so used to collecting NY federal tax dollars. Wise up and move to the modern world where EVERYONE matters.
5
According to Trump they are all Democrats so it doesn't matter.
6
ain't it the truth, ain't it the truth ? - Cowardly Lion
the President swore an oath to protect and uphold, to be the president of all Americans. he's so clearly broken it for all to see, the question now is, did he do it on purpose or can't he even tell the difference... and therein lies the best case to get rid of him.
Do I feel sorry for the workers and the contractors? Yes.
Do I feel for someone who might suffer a life threatening situation because the FDA is shut down or food inspections don’t occur or because of some other agency is closed? Yes.
Do I feel sorry for someone like a farmer that voted for Trump can get a loan because the government can’t process a loan? No.
Trump supporters voted for a person with an incredible lack of skills to perform the job and one the has no moral center. You get what you voted for. Live with it.
16
Here's how to get everybody's attention in a hurry: Air traffic controllers should stage a two-day nationwide work stoppage. Bringing air travel to a complete standstill and demanding an end to the shutdown would do it. What would the government do? Fire every air traffic controller? Who would replace all of them?
8
@Mark Worked for Reagan.
1
That's exactly what Reagan did in the 1980s.
May be a good time to see how necessary these 80,000 workers really are. Surely there must be some redundancies that can be trimmed.
Government workers have many more benefits than private sector workers. They should also have at least SOME money set aside for emergencies as well.
I don't want to sound unfeeling but as adults, with families, shouldn't they have 1-2 moths worth of emergency funding aside?
I mean.....cmon.
5
Maybe they do have emergency funding set aside. Why should it be drained for a fake emergency created by the president solely for bad political reasons? Until everything the government does comes to a screeching halt during shutdowns, politicians who care more about reelection than doing their jobs will keep threatening and implementing them. No payments should be made - not Social Security, not tax refunds, not Medicare reimbursement. No air traffic should be permitted. No salaries paid to anyone, including Congress or White House staff. If that were the case, we would never see another shutdown again. It’s crazy that the burden should not be borne by all of us and that only some must deal with the uncertainty and anxiety.
13
You may not want to sound unfeeling, but you do. Most Americans these days cannot put aside two months of emergency savings, especially single parents. And while their jobs may have good benefits, those are usually in exchange for lower pay. (By the way, I am a teacher and everyone thinks we have "good benefits" until they hear about our health insurance premiums.)
9
Count among the oblivious the Senators and Representatives who are getting paid and are home for the weekend.
Why aren't they in session 7 days a week while this is going on?
Where is the pressure on them?
10
Trump has been chipping away at democracy, indirectly, through support of authoritarian governments and leaders, and by positions against allies and the institutions of western democratic alliance; and directly, by attacking intel and enforcement persons and agencies, the press which, under constitutional mandate, arbitrates truth and purpose, and more significantly, the courts which fulfill the necessary checks and balances of a separate but equal government branch. Trump has all along been after power—to appropriate and consolidate it to his ends.
This longest shutdown represents the most significant attempt, yet, by Trump to assert his vision of personal superiority and empowered authority over government—to flex muscle and exercise expanded power. Trump, with his “my way…” stand on a wall, has hijacked government and holds it hostage as blackmail, not for his wall, but actually to prevail over Congress, bypassing legislative process as an authoritarian. If Congress caves, whether to demand or abuse of emergency powers, it surrenders its enumerated power to legislate policy and direct funds as an equal branch of democratic government and Trump is permitted to step into the exercise of the dark power of an autocrat.
The consequences of the shutdown are serious, for all. But the consequences to democracy, the exercise of power and the enhanced prevalence for its abuse by Trump or any future despot, is the overriding issue, the value of which is too high a price to bargain.
8
It may be time to rethink how we close down government. I work at SSA and have been through countless shutdowns.
The pain is often targeted. When my agency experienced shutdowns, we were left open without pay while the well off could sit and discuss future "options". At the same time, the poor were told we could not verify their income for desperately needed services. It is a class based punishment. Very few expressed concern for our pay situation. They want what they want, complaining about their waits or more difficult access, while voting for the guys that give them less government. Somehow with millions of voters someone else should be paying the price for government or its loss.
I suppose this is inevitable when Reagan started us down the road of demeaning government. Older white Tea Party survivors actually believe they deserve government, but nobody else does based on a decade old study. Class narcissism.
So perhaps the problem is that the rules are made so that during shutdowns the pain is targeted toward isolatable groups and the powerless. The same as when government, corrupted by private money, now does when it is open.
Perhaps when government closes we could stop making the majority of America oblivious by stopping entitlement payments and shutting down the airports. In a democracy, the pain should be shared by all. E pluribus unum. And God bless America.
13
NYT: Are the healthcare policies of federal workers in arrears now? What happens to families that have a healthcare emergency now?
1
I feel like I am writing the same obvious thing every time--to the Times: 1. Everything Trump says is a lie. 2. Everything Trump does is for himself--ergo corrupt. 3. Trump does not care about anything or anyone, but himself. I guess the country needs more Trump and more pain and more apathy and more corruption to get this through some very, very thick skulls.
11
Republican politics is not bean bags. It's serious, tough stuff. - Colin Powell (updated)
1
Amazing how many people are on the government dole. No wonder our taxes are so high. Time to get a real job now and stop devouring all of our tax money.
4
I know, right! Who needs food inspectors or medical research?
7
@MassMom
Did your food inspectors catch the latest E. coli outbreak? The answer is no. In fact, they never do until people have gotten sick. If this is "inspection," maybe we can live without it. Or, god forbid, hire private companies who can do it better and cheaper. I know, I know, the sky will fall.
1
@Mons
TRump and every politician in D.C is on the dole. OUr tax dollars pay for their salaries and healthcare.
So why are they being paid now?
1
This shouldn't be allowed and it is shameful that it is happening because an-about-to-be-impeached president didn't get his way.
3
I know Trump would NOT ever show up for work knowing he would not be paid.........yet he expects others to. Typical.
3
Exactly. And don't forget his go to tactic - Stiff the sucker !
3
I feel quite sure that President Trump (though I do not support him generally) takes no pay or paycheck.
1
@John Ramey: He does receive pay, as do his family members whom he has employed.
Potential mutineers.
1
When you hire out of touch GOP who have off shore bank accounts who don't pay taxes they don't care about the working poor or poor. Lock Trump up and the failed policies they follow. Today Mcllelan Texas mayor said we have no Mexican crime wave and Barnsvile Texas said that too.
4
Ms. Gumpel might notice the government shutdown the next time she eats shellfish that have not been inspected by the USDA.
4
Yes - pretty soon you will hear a very different story from some of these smug commenters here. Once the E coli and others things start, they will not respect political opinions or boundary lines
4
Contrast all those who voted against Hillary in favor of the man who's made their life miserable. Maybe she wasn't as dreadful as she was made out to be. She wouldn't have shut down the gov for a wall.
5
The only American who is oblivious is Dangerous Donald, and his terrorist Republican enablers in Congress don’t care.
3
If Ms.Caviedes is looking to Trump for understanding or empathy she will be very disappointed. One cannot forget Atlantic City where so many ordinary people were impoverished by Trump’s self-serving bankruptcies. And Trump has the gall to suggest that these struggling Federal employees support the shut down.Outrageous!!
4
What's clear is this smoldering feud between the President and Pelosi is totally unreasonable, insensitive and further divisive, an insult to all of us whether impacted personally or not. The adults in the room won't agree to negotiate or compromise, and resort to behaving like petulant, stubborn and selfish children. It's on us to take it seriously and decide whether we should be complacent and endure the consequences, or if we're ready to make demands to end it.
Americans are a selfish lot. We only wake up when we’re inconvenienced by hardship. If you have a friend affected by the furlough and you’re gloating about your good luck, then try this instead: buy their weekly groceries, pay their mortgage, pay one or two utility bills. And when the government reopens, don’t ask for a reimbursement. Barring that, call your congressperson.
8
Wonder what trump has on mcconnell that keeps old Mitch. It must be something very juicy that keeps mcconnell from bringing floor votes that would probably end this ridiculous travesty,
12
Incompetence and malice define the disgusting band of Republican kleptocrats destroying our government and harming yet more innocents. 2020 can’t come too soon. We who value good governance won’t forget each Republican Senator who stood by and allowed Mitch McConnell to lick Trump’s boots for no reasons other than power, ego and spite.
6
Walgreens and Walmart aren't likely to hire federal workers, because those employers know that as soon as Trump's shutdown ends, the federal workers will go back to their jobs.
Trump got what he wanted but refused to sign the bill because Coulter told him not to. That's why we're here. Shame on Ms. Gumpel for adpting the logic that she doesn't have a problem, so there isn't one to be had. Shame on her for being so willfully ignornat of what's going on in her own nation's government.
4
So what was the result of the investigation? Is it ongoing?
Why is there so much hostility and resentment of federal or state employees by people in the private sector?
I get that the private sector may have less job security but regardless, when your fellow Americans are used as political pawns needlessly and wind up bearing the emotional and financial costs of craven politicians, are the snide and dismissive comments really necessary to add salt to their wounds?
There are many people in this nation with hollow souls and cold hearts.
10
@Issy My best guess is that many of the more inflammatory posts denigrating federal workers are Russian trolls. The wording in the comments (several threads, different names) I've read seem remarkably similar to each other.
Resolving this shutdown is a look at how Mr Art of the Deal operates in the real world. He’s inept. Unfortunately, he’s president.
3
OVER FOUR HUNDRED THOUSAND GOVERNMENT EMPLOYEES ARE BEING FORCED TO WORK WITHOUT PAY. Imagine if it were GM or Amazon--the entire nation would be screaming for blood. Why is this any different? These are American workers, with families and mortgages just like everybody else. Why are we all so heartless?
9
This shutdown is a disgrace and an outrage. Trump - and Mitch McConnell - own this mess. My heart goes out to all the people suffering real distress right now.
7
This is a fluff piece! While some couples with working spouses may be be fine many are not and the economy is suffering. More closures like Miami’s airport will affect business and tourism. The ripple effect from absent paychecks affects landlords, local stores, restaurants, movie theaters, and entertainment. Trump lives in his germ free bubble, his rose colored glasses see only the golf clubs he calls home. Write your Senator to press McConnell to act as a leader, not hide from his responsibilities to the American people. Checks and balances Mitch!
7
I would like to see the Democrats continue to put forward additional support and funding for alternative border security methods, including personnel to deal appropriately with asylum seekers. Trump isn’t really concerned about the issue as much as saving face with his foolish wall. If he wants to hold these government employees hostage, let’s at least show him as the poor leader that he is, and hopefully gain some more votes for Democrats in the process.
2
Anyone who voted for conservatives (not just trump) deserves every ounce of pain they experience. The connection between conservatives and catastrophic policy for all Americans was well know to intelligent people long before trump took office. These 'victims' literally voted for their own demise.
4
No offense to the good one out there but he's got a touch of landlord in him, don't he?
3
Apparently, the shutdown now has cost us more than the wall.
So all that money that Mexico supposedly paid us through that fantastic trade deal?
It's gone!
2
This is the conservatives dream. Destroy the federal government, cut all social services, next unpaid HUD and other government program providers will terminate their contracts so no more social services. Conservatives are ecstatic. The GOP believes everyone getting any help is just lazy and they want to show their version of christianity- slavery is good for the lazy.
1
If every government service was privatised, this couldn't happen!
I'm wondering how long it will be before this is suggested as a positive outcome for the shutdown.
1
This wall is "Trump's Folly."
3
All for Trump's sick vanity. How long must we put up with this evil excuse for a human being.
4
Some deal maker. Using people, "he relates to" as pawns to make a stupid deal.
Is there an agency for donations for these wonderful people?
1
For the thousands furloughed, the work piles up substantially in their absence. The longer this shutdown lasts, the higher the piles will be upon their return. I don’t envy them in the least.
This is as much a problem made by the GOP as it is the president. Contact your senators and let them know how you feel about paying taxes for undelivered services. Especially if you live in Kentucky.
6
Does the following number have any relevance: .00125 ?
This number represents the percentage the “ border wall” would be of the Federal budget.
If there is anything the freshman class of Congress should pursue, would be to present a bill that the Federal government can never be shutdown.
But the likelihood of this happening is equal to the percentage mentioned above.
3
I agree. I don’t like Trump, I don’t like the wall, but this appropriation is bug dust in the federal budget. The harm being imposed on 800,000 federal workers is unconscionable, and at this point, both parties own it. Chuck and Nancy, as well as Donald.
1
Nice try. But this a trump shutdown. Pure and simple
5
You’re forgetting Mitch McConnell, someone who could end this shutdown right now.
1
"Others oblivious"
Yes, most Americans are oblivious; blissfully ignorant in their self-absorbed Facebook/Instagram world where they only see information that supports their limited worldview. We are largely dumb, fat, and lazy, and don't understand the responsibilities of citizenship or even agree that education and knowledge of facts matter.
Instead, we are concerned only about our own immediate selfish needs and desires, wanting just to have more of whatever it is that keeps us blissfully ignorant so we don't actually have to think about the effects the issues have on *others*.
This is why the Russians were so easily able to influence our 2016 election. We're stupid, gullible, selfish, and ignorant of our shortcomings, all the while thinking 'Murica is the greatest place on earth. And we'll bomb anyone who doesn't agree.
We deserve everything we're getting as a nation. We asked for this shutdown, we asked for the trade war, we asked for the Russian interference, and we asked for the colluding, brainless, selfish oaf in the White House. We asked to have neo-nazis identified as "good people" and re-elected traitorous Republicans (and we'll re-elect even more in 2020). We support the perfidious attempts at creating an autocratic president while rendering the other two branches of government impotent.
Right now, we're just a terrible, terrible country full of terrible, terrible people.
12
It is impacting my family - if not my household. My son is a Federal law enforcement officer who has worked - and who shall continue to work (the nature of his job demands it) for however long this shutdown continues. He has now experienced (either yesterday or today) his first "theoretical pay day", which is to say a pay day on the calendar but not in his bank account.
His chosen career is one that is inherently stressful without this being added into the equation. Neither he nor his family (my daughter-in-law and infant granddaughter) needs it.
4
Insurance companies should offer insurance against the interruption of the payment of salaries to government employees.
Insurance companies have been years of decline for failing to contribute to the welfare of society.
5
Surely a round of tax cuts for the rich and corporations will resolve this mess. It cures all ills according to the GOP.
13
Why has no one in the “mainstream media” pointed out the fact that Congress can end this charade tomorrow? It’s called an override of a Presidential veto! All that’s required is that our elected representatives stand up for America and their oath of office. Senator Graham, do you have the integrity to rally your colleagues to do that? I’m betting not.
15
Trump claims that this shutdown is all about national security.
How are we secure when the Department of Homeland Security is closed.
How are we safer when TSA agents and air traffic controllers are not being paid.
He was willing to sign legislation that passed the Senate and the House until Limbaugh and Coulter started complaining.
How many miles of wall will 5.6 billion dollars build. Surely not the whole thing.
So how does this keep us safer?
It doesn’t. Just a waste of money but to Trump he could point to it and say “ here’s my wall, I kept my campaign promise”
When Trump and Pence say that this isn’t political, that it’s all about security that just fly’s in the face of the facts.
The ironic part is that I’m guessing many of the furloughed and unpaid workers voted for Trump.
Ouch.
11
There hasn't been a single day of peace nor stability since Donald Trump took office. I hope that the Democrats will not take the bait every time the President suggests another argument or fiasco.
It's time to deal with this man simply and effectively. Americans are assumed to be gutsy and forthright people, but their acceptance of the behavior of President Trump and his Republican devotees is frightening indeed. In the end, it's the people that allow this madness to continue. Lineups voicing their concern at their representatives home offices would be a start.
12
Ms. Pelosi should stay consequent in not giving the kid his expensive toy, which he would loose interest in, once it would be under the christmas tree. In parallel she should announce an initiative that would make it impossible to shut down government services because of open budget approvals, as soon as they are in power of both houses. Not happening in the rest of the western world, why in the US?
19
@Ralf
Excellent suggestion.
I was a federal employee during the Clinton era and was furloughed along with my colleagues at the Commerce Department. The hardship that many federal workers are experiencing is real, but what I don’t think is fully appreciated is that these employees will receive all of their back pay. I even accrued vacation time while cooling my heels waiting for the government to reopen. The waste of our tax dollars is appalling.
21
Many news reports and commentators are focusing on the plight of unpaid federal employees. Good luck with that. Their financial worries do not concern this president or Mitch McConnell and congressional Republicans in general. They are never on the side of any workers, public or private. If it were politically possible, they would write a budget that eliminates half the non-military federal workforce and turn almost every government function over to business interests to make a profit. They view our government as the servant of capitalists, not the common people who work for paychecks.
23
@abigail49
Nancy Pelosi doesn't give a rats behind about the dire straits some federal workers are in. Sadly, we had 3 petulant toddlers in charge of our government. But this is the government the people asked for. Hope they are enjoying every second of it. It won't get better until the likes of Schumer, Pelosi, McConnell, and all the rest who have been in office for decades are gone.
And how disgusting that Dems are not leading the way by standing with these government employees and stopping their paychecks. Most are taking the attitude of I am getting my paycheck, sorry, well not sorry, yours isn't coming fool.
2
Where are the Democrats? Oh, they left town to enjoy their holiday weekend. I guess they do not have as much compassion as they claim they do. If I was a union worker I sure would be asking my union reps questions, too. Ask steel workers and other private sector employees what happens to them when they are laid off. I bet many of them did not get full back pay upon their return to work.
7
@Mary A Davis
The Dems hate union workers just as much as the GOP. The Dems stopped helping union workers back in 1981. They did nothing to stop the exportation of millions of US jobs. They orchestrated and support unfair trade deals.
People, we knew the GOP hates the poor, low wage and union workers. They are honest about that. Dems however claim they want to help but keep stabbing us in the back. Many Dems just keep thank you ma'am may I have another stab.
Our government is broken and needs to be dissolved, every current office holder barred from running in the new elections.
The real question is where is McConnell. This shutdown would be over if he called for a vote.
3
It seems to me that Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell’s name should accompany House Speaker Nancy Pelosi’s name and Trump’s during any discussion of the shutdown. Up until now McConnell has been spared criticism from the media, but it is clear that he holds the power to bring House passed legislation to the floor but refuses to do so maybe because he fears that it just might pass. That would make Trump “very” unhappy!
24
Air travel is at risk. Government employees are refusing to work without pay. Food inspection is scaled-back. National security is compromised. Irony of ironies, border security is weakened.
All of this is unfolding in the service of Mitch McConnell playing the role of presidential toady. As Paul Krugman so aotly put it several years ago, when a society hates all government, it will always have bad governance.
Worse than this is what we have now; no governance at all.
189
@John lebaron
National security is not at risk. The pentagon is funded via a separate measure that was pr enviously passed.
2
Congress, the president, and his cabinet are all getting paid during the shutdown while staffers receive nothing as their bills accumulate and their savings deplete. What kind of society and leaders do we have where they avoid the pain that they are better placed to endure on average while regular workers have to suffer? What sorts of leaders do we have that don’t set a good example because they cannot find solutions while they insist that unpaid workers continue to do their jobs? It’s disgraceful and is a paradigm underscoring the reason why government favorability polls are historically and deservedly so low.
123
@SS-Some 21 Trump staffers are paid $179,700. These include the fact challenged Sarah Huckabee Sanders; lie amplifier attack dog Kellyanne E. Conway who speaks in "alternative" facts; Stephen Miller responsible for Trump's xenophobic anti-immigrant policies; and Dan Scavino, Trump's former golf caddy and now Twitter insult ghostwriter. Trump senior advisors and political appointees were to receive an automatic $10K bonus this month, until WaPo outed this news.
https://www.cnbc.com/2018/06/29/these-are-the-21-highest-paid-staffers-in-the-white-house.html
https://www.thedailybeast.com/senior-trump-officials-will-get-dollar10000-raises-while-federal-employees-stay-furloughed-wapo
47
Though there have been shutdowns before, I can't help but think part of this is yet another twisted action on Trump's part to show his disdain for certain classes of people. He hates the federal government. Every person he appointed to a cabinet position had disdain for the core mission of their agency. They are not public servants.
The "jobs" president, it seems, would rather 800,000 people, not to mention contractors like myself, not be working and contributing to the economy.
132
I remember when a contractor who worked on DP's Atlantic City casino said he was not paid. He went into debt to pay his workers because they had families. DP said he made money.
A.C. used to be a wonderful place to visit wih my family. What happened to it was sad. What will happen to the U.S.
11
Have Trump’s barber and hair colorist been furloughed? That could be the reason for getting closer to declaring that National emergency.
19
Loss or deferment of income is devastating to most, but maybe 200,000 must be pleased with the paid time off, even if the pay will be deferred a bit. Those who pick up interim work will end up with both incomes. They're keeping quiet. Also quiet is the fact that the taxpayers are paying hundred of thousands of their employees to do nothing.
7
@Tom Riordan We'd rather be doing our jobs.
33
Just remember that this isn’t the fault of your employees - the fault lies with their employer. That would be our elected officials and, by extension, you.
3
@Tom Riordan Those people cannot be pleased with having time off when it means that they are unable to pay their rent or mortgage, their utilities or their children’s tuition. And small businesses that rely on their patronage will likewise suffer. All of these people are not having any fun at all, especially since Trump is using them as pawns of his sick power game.
4
If they don’t pay workers for not showing up to work, the government will save many times the amount that Democrats don’t want to spend to better secure the borders.
1
@Robert Winchester so force people to stay home against their will without pay? Yeah, sounds like you have a Republican heart all right. No wonder Trump was elected when so many Americans are so callous.
4
Ridiculous. As if they're choosing not to get paid; as if they're choosing not to be allowed to go to work. Quit equating a physical ineffective border wall with border security. Educate yourself on border security instead of parroting propaganda and nonsense.
5
Eventually these employees will get all of their back pay. They could just as well have been getting paid and working in the meantime, and contributing to the economy.
9
Why don't you buy a ticket and fly somewhere and see how comfortable you feel with reduced TSA airport security.
1
I am a fed. I work hard, and y’all get good value from my efforts. I also support local businesses, at least when I have a paycheck.
Probably one day I will get paid, but do you know who won’t? All the craftsmen I had planned to hire this January and am now not hiring. My old house needs some repairs - replaced windows, repairs to the back deck, insulation... not small stuff. We had planned to start this work in the new year.
Alas, we will not.
40
Why not?
You know you will be paid for taking time off. Enjoy it. Or, do the work yourself....
The inequities of suffering due to the closure is not unlike so many other challenges/issues many Americans face everyday. Troublesome to our future, though, is the growing level of everyday insensitivities toward those going through these issues, particularly minorities. It’s akin to driving past a highway accident and expressing relief that it involved someone else.
The undeniable truth is that the more selfish we become will prevent us from attacking challenges we can only address as a group, a country, like the life-ending effects of global warming.
20
If Mr. Trump is as smart as he thinks he is and as mendacious as we know he is, he would tweet that his wall has been funded and construction has begun. Details to follow in a couple of weeks. He could also claim credit for reopening the government. The only people who care about "the wall" are the same people who believe everything Mr. Trump says/tweets. The only thing that could mess up this plan is if a child visits our southern border at some point and exclaims, "The president has no wall."
21
The Democratic Party is making a big mistake fighting against Trump's useless and wasteful wall. We should let him get his cake. It will cost a few billions and knowing how inept is this president at running business (remember: he essentially squandered the fortune inherited from his dad) this initially will ultimately become a liability, pleasing only a small group of his most fanatic supporters. This will ultimately be his failure in the face of the American people, who have already witnessed this spoiled kid being ready to sacrifice the well being of all federal workers and the operation of our own government for satisfying his wishes. On the contrary, by letting go on the wall the Democrats will demonstrate that they care for the workers and for the insuring the operation of our government. Once Trump is defeated at the next elections, we can recover the image of a welcoming and caring country.
3
"Let him" - terrible precedent to set.
1
What about next week when he holds the government hostage over some other issue?
2
The Dems have voted EVERY day to reopen the government. This is the work of one man and his stooge of a party.
3
Clearly this shutdown is going to drag on.
But, the Democrats are doing a TERRIBLE job of getting the facts and solution out!
Every single Democrat with a voice should be beating the drum "Fund the government, THEN fight about the wall"!
The only solution to the impasse is, Senate passes a funding bill, Trump vetoes it, then Congress overrides the veto.
That will only happen if the Dems do a MUCH better job of presenting the solution and they aren't getting the job done!
Somebody tell the Democratic leadership to take the gloves off and get the message out!
At this point most people think there is no solution when there is!
It is the Dems responsibility to get the word out and it's NOT happening!
14
@Stan Tell that to Mitch McConnell. He won't bring up the bill in the Senate. It's already passed the House.
39
Pelosi said that Democrats have a secret plan to better secure the border. I wonder why they are keeping it a secret.
1
@Stan In my viewing online, I hear Democrats saying that repeatedly. The problem is Mitch McConnell, the Trump enabler in the Senate, and cowardly GOP senators who will stand up to neither Trump nor McConnell.
2
To our CG team: I know that the last few weeks have not been easy, and I recognize the hardship this shutdown places on you and your families. At this time, it is becoming likely that all CG members (active, reserve, and civilian) will not receive their next paycheck. As this situation continues to evolve, we will provide regular updates. Thank you for your continued dedicated service to our Nation.
The real self inflicted humanitarian crisis completely created by the elected leaders on its on people. Where. North Korea? No, the United States of America.
7
This shutdown isn't bothering me at all. As far as I'm concerned most of these government workers are a waste of money. They can go home and stay home. Illegal immigrants don't take government jobs. They take private sector jobs. I have always earned my paycheck in the private sector. A few years ago, I turned down a job as an IT contractor at the VA, because it was so corrupt that I was offered the job without the manager even seeing my resume.
12
How are you enjoying all those public roads over which you drive?
2
@Mark:
Who will inspect your food? Ensure a safe flight? Keep national parks clean and vandal-fee? Etc. And those checks you've earned in the private sector? Well, that private sector couldn't exist without the hard, dedicated work of government employees.
Even the notion that "most of these government workers are a waste of money" is so laughably disconnected from reality as to be pathetic. It's like you people think your creature comforts materialize unto themselves. Here's the reality: it's those who make $35,000 annually that keep you safe and healthy.
Time to go outside, for once.
3
Yeah, they take private sector jobs. The ones American’s don’t want or refuse to do.
1
Since empathy isn’t a Trump voters strong suit, this shutdown will last until those same voters feel enough pain to finally call their Republican senators demanding an end to this nonsense: so please people, don’t hold your breath.
14
Now that The TImes has broken the story of Trump being a Russian asset and, consequently, a palpable threat to national security, this renders the partial government shutdown old news, even moot. There will be no wall, the partial shutdown will end, and so will Trump’s presidency. He will resign in disgrace within eight weeks. Oh, and there’s the Mueller report. How sweet it is!
10
One word - karma.
Or if you prefer the biblical verse - ...Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap...
A large segment sadly voted for this psychotic (though not the majority) and now they are getting what they wanted; let's hope our constitutional republic is not destroyed by a relic of the past - the electoral college.
11
Every time I see Trump do something extremely hurtful to people I see the shadow of Stephen Miller behind it. He's the Darth Vader of this 'administration '.
14
If we want to talk about uneven.........!
Apparently the WH is willing to open up the parts of government that the banks would like open, and pay the workers who give tours of the old clock tower in his Washington Hotel, so that he won't lose any money.
"After an intense lobbying campaign by the mortgage industry, the Treasury Department this week restarted a program that had been sidelined by the partial government shutdown, allowing hundreds of Internal Revenue Service clerks to collect paychecks as they process forms vital to the lending industry."
-Washington Post
12
Ms. Gumpel says “it hasn’t affected me at all. You kind of push it aside and figure it will pass, that it’s just political bickering.” Apathy is the death null for democracy, Ms. Gumpel. If this behavior is accepted, everyone of us will eventually be impacted personally. Anyone who cares about this nation should contact their representative and demand impeachment.
24
Exactly. As Elie Weisel said, "Indifference is the epitome of evil."
How do you shelve an emergency?
8
Many federal employees are affected by a withheld paycheck. While Congress voted in favor of supporting "back pay" for federal employees if the shutdown ends, I cannot believe that 7 GOP members voted against the bill with a "No".
These 7 GOP members should have their pay withheld. The "no" votes came from Reps. Justin Amash (Mich.), Andy Biggs (Ariz.), Paul Gosar (Ariz.), Glen Grothman (Wis.), Thomas Massie (Ky.), Chip Roy (Texas) and Ted Yoho (Fla.).
23
@Gilber20
All of congress should have their pay withheld and no back pay either.
1
Try living from paycheck to the next paycheck, a stark reality that many dedicated federal workers are now forced to do because of the wanton, self-serving and destructive actions of a petty and incompetent President (and I choke on those words) who is incapable of understanding how his infantile prattle, propaganda and rigid stance about a wall he could care less about other than to, once again, use in an attempt to rally support from his cowardly political party and his mindless base. Simply disgraceful and unnecessary, with the ultimate fault here starting and ending with POTUS.
137
@Horseshoe Crab- Worth noting that taxpayers are footing the bill for 21 Trump staffers are get paid $179,700 annually. These include Sarah Huckabee Sanders (lie prevaricator), Kellyanne Conway (alternative facts), Stephen Miller (immigration architect), and Dan Scavino, (former Trump golf caddy and Twitter insult ghostwriter). Trump senior advisors and political appointees were to receive an automatic $10K bonus this month, until WaPo pointed this out.
https://www.cnbc.com/2018/06/29/these-are-the-21-highest-paid-staffers-in-the-white-house.html
https://www.thedailybeast.com/senior-trump-officials-will-get-dollar10000-raises-while-federal-employees-stay-furloughed-wapo
22
@Horseshoe Crab
No one ever mentions the hit to these people’s personal credit ratings from missing mortgage and credit card payments which last for years and jacks up the price of future borrowing.
22
@DAVID SINGER
Nobody gives a rat's behind about private sector workers getting laid off and not being able to pay bills, getting evicted, and having their credit ruined. Why would anyone be foolish enough to think they would care about laid off government workers?
9
The comment regarding university researchers being 'unaffected' by the shutdown attributed to the CIRES Director at UC Boulder by the authors of this news article is unhelpful at best and irresponsible at worst. The chance that any university researcher, who is dependent on contract and grant (C&G) funding from parts of the federal government that are shutdown (e.g., NASA, NOAA, NSF), is negatively impacted by the shutdown goes up measurably every day it goes on. An extended shutdown will negatively affect some university researchers, including scientists, professors and graduate students. When C&G dollars run out from shuttered federal agencies, then what are the contingencies to pay research staff or fund faculty and graduate student research salaries? The negative impacts will begin to domino across the university research enterprise if the shutdown continues for more weeks and months ahead. Conversations regarding contingencies for an extended shutdown are already happening at many research labs across the country. Research related hours, salaries, travel, purchasing and hiring will be reduced or eliminated, even impacting graduate student recruitment for next year. It's important to make both current and potential impacts of an extended shutdown clear to both university employees and the general public. Let's get the story straight please!
10
Judging by the tone and distribution of the media coverage, this temporary shutdown of 20% of the federal workforce seems to have hit Democrats inordinately hard. Why is that? Because they are the party of big government? Mr. Trump quipped that most federal workers are Democrats. Is it possible that he was right? Lastly, if the shutdown hit Republicans harder than Democrats, would the Times and its readers care quite as deeply? I tend to doubt it.
5
You’re wrong. There a ton of republican voters the work for the Feds.
1
@Ed L.
Why should anyone feel sorry for the crowd that hates government and then whines when government isn't there to deliver?
Besides, red states typically take more from the federal trough than what they contribute, demand federal governance over women's bodies and who can marry who, constantly deliver tax cuts to the obscenely wealthy at the expense of the middle class, and have produced multiple cabinet heads who've resigned because they are under investigation for fattening their pockets courtesy of the federal government. As such, it's silly for Republicans to call anyone else a "party of big government."
So no, no one should feel an ounce of sympathy for supposed big goverment haters.
2
Republicans voted for this unqualified oaf of a “president,” who claimed he was “proud” to own any shutdown (before he ran like a coward from his words), so they brought whatever hardship they’re experiencing on themselves. They don’t deserve the concern of “the Times and it’s readers.”
What’s far more weird, and disturbing, and indicative of a sick mindset, is the apparent glee Republicans take in seeing hardworking Americans whom all of us rely on suffer, because they’re presumed to be Democrats. These people tried with their votes to prevent this.
You can’t go wrong expecting the worst from Trump followers though.
1
There should be an answer as to whether Trump may declare a national emergency, can he use the military to build a wall around the town i live in, and does he have the power to declare martial law?
1
There are plenty of Americans who are plain oblivious to just about everything going on in the world around them.
Has anyone ever seen the segment of Jimmy Kimmel's show where they stop and ask people on the street about non-existent things, people or events? It's similar to Leno's Jaywalking.
Americans are not the sharpest knives in the cutlery drawer and basically could care less about politics, civics, history, 'sciencey' stuff or basically anything related to book learning.
Other people's problems are exactly that to them too.
Compassion is in short supply these days.
37
Get over the fact that these people are not essential to the operation of our government. If one is not essential then he is not needed. Many of us have had personal experience of dealing with government employees at all levels of government and wonder how they could be keeping their jobs due to their lack of customer service, knowledge about their job and general attitude. TSA agents are currently showing what I mean by calling in sick and still expecting to keep their jobs. Maybe the current TSA experience will help us get that agency under control or maybe we may just find we do not need lower class, overweight agents who in many cases we cannot understand telling us to take our shoes off.
6
@Chaps Non-essential only applies to personnel who aren't operationally required. That doesn't mean they aren't needed, just that they aren't needed right now.
Over time, the effects of non-essential personnel being off the job will pile up. My spouse and I are furloughed from the Coast Guard. Our offices are empty which means transfer orders are suspended, officer command assignment and promotion boards aren't being held, and families with special needs aren't receiving assistance.
This is on top of the fact that the Coast Guard, an active military service branch, is not being paid. However, if you call for help on the water, they will still save you from peril, regardless of how essential you think they are.
30
@Chaps:
> lower class, overweight agents
And thus is the crux of the grumbling about TSA agents, although I'd wager "lower class" is code for brown skin.
Meanwhile, calm down about the agents calling in sick. Sick days are part of their compensation. I'm glad they're using it to send a message to those who call them overweight and lower class.
6
Getting any employee “under control” probably starts with paying them regularly, don’t you think?
2
Trump was quoted that he felt the pain by the working and furloughed government workers who were not receiving any compensation. Trump feeling pain for other than himself is an absurdity. Likely the only "pain" he ever felt was from alleged bone spurs that conveniently kept him from service during the Vietnam war.
17
Certainly it's easy to be oblivious to the plight of these workers while sitting in the comfort of the White House with Stephen Miller and plotting further ways to divide Americans.
And playing with a cell phone, tweeting lie after lie after lie.
21
This is not a Trump shutdown.
It is a Trump-Republican Party shutdown.
McConnell can end this any time he wants. He refuses to do so. He refuses to even discuss doing so. The senate Republicans strongly support him. The House Republicans do as well. They support this shutdown and Trump could not cause or continue it without them, period.
The media should be focusing on those Republicans and their role in this needless, harmful and wasteful shutdown instead of giving them a pass for their shameful partnering with and enabling of Trump in his tantrum.
71
Politicians are well cushioned and well oiled persons. They can easily afford to forego their perquisites for a long time if they are forced to undergo but not the public servants. What fault have they committed ? Have they gone on strike on their own ? Why are they taken for a ride time and again that too in a country like America ? American people should take these politicians to task.
If necessary mass protests should be arranged ? If need be politicians should be dragged to court and should be made to do their jobs for which they are elected. If not let them quit once for all. It’s the time for action and not meant for keeping quiet.
12
Typical of other autocrats losing their grip on power, Trump seems intent on inflicting as much pain as possible on the people he is supposed to serve. He has crossed the Rubicon but instead of Rome waiting for him there is a fractured Senate and millions of people harmed by his cruel recklessness.
21
A nationwide day of protest next Saturday is hereby proposed - in honor of the spirit of MLK Day, and in solidarity with the growing number of our fellow Americans who've been harmed by this travesty.
If it grows into a strike on Tuesday, so much the better. It's time, folks, to speak-out LOUDLY with our voices - and feet!
16
How long do you think a government shutdown would last if Social Security checks weren't mailed? If there were no flights because there were no air controllers? No Medicare payments were made? No one was working at the Justice Department or the Center for Disease Control? etc.
Closing only parts of the government gives uniformed voters (Republicans?) the impression that a "shutdown" isn't a big deal. Change the law so that shutdown really is a shutdown and we will be done with this foolishness.
32
Should be required that if there is a shutdown, all members of Congress, every cabinet member, and all of the White House administration go without their pay. No Air Force One. No loopholes allowed.
Don’t imagine they would be suffering like us “common” folk, but no one likes to go without a paycheck.
28
In so many ways, this continues to be a microcosm of how America works these days. You will notice that people on the right rarely have any empathy for any issues unless it affects them directly.
They dont care about healthcare for all, unless they fall sick. They dont care about LGBT issues, unless their kids are affected. They dont care about the environment, unless the air or water in their town or city is polluted. They claim to want "small government", unless its some money that they need to receive from the government.
The shutdown is only important if it affects them personally - otherwise they just dont care.
43
@newton
You seem to be implying that most government workers are Democrats, and that empathy is a partisan issue. I wonder how much you empathize with residents in areas of natural disasters which happened to vote Republican in the last two elections.
3
@Ed L.
>I wonder how much you empathize with residents in areas of natural disasters which happened to vote Republican in the last two elections.
Why should those who claim to hate big government be shown sympathy? If they don't like big government, then they should reject FEMA handouts.
1
@newton Ed L. I think newton is correct. The US has never developed what a country really needs in order to be strong - a sense of "us", of commonality and responsibility for the other. People who voted Republican and for Trump are way complicit in this. Good citizens care about victims of natural disasters without looking at their political leanings or how they voted or even what they like to do in their spare time. Its a basic agreement that all lives are valuable and when in any disaster we attempt to help each other. There are many factors which mitigate against commonality in the US - we need to get rid of the foolish bootstrap myth - never been true. Need to understand the realities of who has undercut migration reform and why - its not difficult to grasp - the owner class always wants cheap controllable labor. We need to understand how societies work - darwinian capitalism has nothing to do with democracy. It is robbing from the poor and middle class to siphon all the wealth to the rich. This attitude and acceptance, obliviousness, has killed the potential the US had post WWII. Anybody who thinks the US is still respected internationally is foolish or doesn´t travel much. Its a dying nation, was a shooting star. Its a suicidal nation for its unwillingness to develop a sense of community.
2
According to the NYTimes Jan 9's report of the attempted meeting between Trump, Schumer and Pelosi:
“You are using people as leverage; why won’t you open the government and stop hurting people?” Senator Chuck Schumer of New York, the Democratic leader, asked Mr. Trump at one point during the meeting, according to Democratic congressional officials and a White House official familiar with the exchange.
“Then you won’t give me what I want,” Mr. Trump replied, the congressional officials said.
Democrats should cut with these quotes, run it everyday, tweet it every day, so that the American public can fully understand what a morally bankrupt president was elected. He is without a conscience, a true sociopath.
His behavior is morally reprehensible and, to use Trump's favorite adjective, disgraceful.
And by the way, why is congress still being paid? Republicans are complicit in this disgrace. They had 2 years to pass a bill with the money. They should pass the bill to open the government and override Trump's veto. They could muster the votes if they really wanted to.
18
The connection between 5 billion for a border wall, and the lay off (or unpaid work) for 800,000 federal employees is a puzzle to me. Why is it that our president is allowed to hold the government hostage over a minor budget request? The Congress (both houses at different times) has passed budget bills that cover all but Mr. Trump's wall. Why is he allowed to shut down the government over a campaign promise? This is both silly and harmful. Republicans ought to be ashamed.
18
@Patrick StevensIf Republicans cared about the wall they would have passed funding while they controlled the House and the Senate.
13
Last year the Senate Democrats prevented a vote by using a filibuster. Yes the House had passed a bill funding the government and the wall. When Democrats allow funding border security the government will reopen.
@Robert Winchester:
Nope. A bipartisan bill was sent to Don, and he was set to sign it, until Ann Coulter told him not to, and he listened.
There. Fixed for ya.
4
isn't that the very embodiment of the country?
that's, unfortunately, perhaps, the most defining characteristic of the Untied States!!
we know only a tiny portion of the population bear the brunt of the wars, for instance.
we know the country is defined by a zeitgeist of everybody for themselves. government and the public good are often derided as "socialism" or "communism" or "taking" from those who have earned.
as Romney summed it up, many of us are "takers" and a few of us "makers?"
public education is derided. public transport is poor etc etc.
so, perhaps, its only fitting that even the government shutdown reflects this element of the country
everybody for themselves. God for us all, perhaps.
5
It reminds me of the War in Iraq. Those without connections to people deployed let it roll on. Shame on us then and now.
15
While it is shameful that Democrats who once supported and voted for border wall funding are holding these folks hostage. That said, I find it hard to believe that government workers who make at least $ 50,000 annually are now finding it hard if not impossible to pay their rent or mortgage or put food on the family table after missing only 1 paycheck. No savings for a rainy day? Quite irresponsible.
5
@MCH "At least $50,000" ? Who are you talking about?
7
Seriously? You are going to lecture people on how to save money? After taxes,rent or a mortgage payment, health insurance, utilities, food, maybe tuition, car loans, clothing, gas, etc. how much is left over? Life is not cheap and $50,000 is not a lot of money especially if it is supporting a family.
11
Dems have voted to reopen the government, they didn’t close in the first place, EVERYDAY. Nice try - this is on the president and his gop toadies. PERIOD! The government does NOT have to be CLOSED to negotiate.
1
#NoPayNoTSA Wait until next week when there's a county-wide TSA work stoppage an the airlines cancel 3/4 of their flights. It's about to get very ugly.
14
@OnTheInside
One has to ask what took them so long. One also must ask if they will get support from John and Jane Q Public. How many will walk out of their jobs in solidarity. Won't be many.
We can learn a lesson from France on this...but we won't.
When did people become so self-centered and selfish that they can't identify with the pain and suffering of others? And when did people become so willingly ignorant that they don't know that hundreds of thousands are furloughed?
Perhaps there isn't cleaving of the country so much as a dearth of curiosity, empathy and compassion that just re-sorts the populace by interest. And our generous character more than our military strength was our strength, and now is our weakness.
24
@DianaID
To answer your question, when our government aided and encouraged the exportation of jobs, when the Dems abandoned blue collar workers, when being poor and/or homeless became a crime, when we stopped valuing education. Pick a day, any day, between Jan. 1980 and today and that is the day.
1
I would like to know if Trump voters elect a president, or a side show?
10
3-ring circus.
Everything decision and action this president takes is chaotic and disruptive. This must be the way he runs his family business - how utterly exhausting, frustrating, and confusing it must be to work for the Trump organization.
9
It is the way he ran his businesses. He also bankrupted contractors that did work for him and got other people to take the fall. He is a monumental failure of a man.
Welcome to Schadenfreudistan!
It’s not just ironic that this German term says so much, like in prewar Germany, about a deeply polarized society. A charismatic force , both times, found a way to turn up the volume on hate, and turn it down on empathy and reason. In this case, for my money, I blame the Russians for amplifing our divisions to a dog whistle screech that too many of us have listened to.
21
Trump and the Republicans have one singular method when they don't get their way; Shut down the government regardless of the effects and pain they inflict on others.
The Republicans have done this before and received severe criticism but to no avail. They don't get the message about the pain they cause anyone else. They seem to believe that no matter how often this tactic fails it needs to be imposed again and again.
All of us feel terrible for those whose lives are turned upside down by Trump and the Republican's callous indifference.
What I don't understand is why the American people continue to allow this outrageous behavior by Republicans to continue time and time again.
What is more disgusting is that so few Republicans are willing to stand up for ordinary hard working citizens. This is just mental illness. It's depravity.
Republicans told us that if they were elected they could and would govern our nation. Between their extreme right wing ultra conservatives, their anti-immigration, anti-abortion and anti-tax the wealthy programs and all their efforts to undo Obama care, so far they have shown that they are incapable of doing anything.
Republicans are bitter, angry, ultra-conservative and unable to face the truth.
Donald Trump does not belong in the White House. A juvenile detention facility would be more appropriate. A spoiled child is throwing a fit and there is not one adult in the Republican Party.
Where are Republican adults? Are there any?
20
I wonder if tRump is cashing his government check. How about Pence? I wonder if the Senators and Representatives are cashing theirs. I'd wager they are members of the "oblivious" group mentioned in the article. How come they don't feel the crunch the way ordinary people do? As usual, hardworking men and women are paying the price of our "leaders'" folly.
11
In 15 minutes Nancy and Chuck could solve the problem by approving the barrier that the border patrol say they want and need. When Pelosi requests billions for foreign country abortions and won't vote for 5 billion for American's safety, it is really sad and the voters will show it at the ballot box.
5
This is The Trump-Mcconnell shutdown! They alone can fix it!
1
@Tony J Mann
More U.S. citizens are killed by guns used by fellow citizens than are killed by illegals. If you are worried about the safety of Americans, start there. Then move to the opioid epidemic started by American company Perdue Pharma. But illegals? Far down on the list. Remember, the 9/11 hijackers came through airports on business, tourist and (one) on a student visa, most from Saudi Arabia. They weren't coming north from Mexico, my friend.
You weren’t supposed to notice that the bill House Democrats passed included billions for foreign abortions. The news media has tried to keep it a secret.
1
Asking people to work for a wage less than the Federal minimum wage of $7.25 per hour is a crime. Several hundred thousand “essential” employees are currently being required to work and they aren’t being paid. Trump (and those that support him – Mitch McConnell) have sunk to a new low by requiring forced labor on a valued workforce without pay. Shame on all of them.
12
Exactly how Trump ran his businesses and how he treated contractors who did work for him, bankrupting many of them by refusing to pay them and threatening to sue them into long, protracted, expensive legal battles if they tried to get paid.
1
What about a general strike from federal employees still working, being paid or not. Solidarity anyone? Air traffic controllers would stop the entire nation from moving from point A to point B. Great.
Quite sure the Grifter would react in a very positive way so too the Republican clowns disguised as politicians.
And what about the the leader of the clowns? He goes by the name of McConnell who refuses to do his job.
10
Trump went on and on about term limits for members of Congress throughout his campaign. If Trump had kept that promise, we wouldn't be dealing with McConnell.
Just FYI, the credit union that all federal employees use is offering 0% loans for up to 6 months. This means just about any federal employee can take out a loan and pay it back, without interest, when the shut down ends and they get all of their back pay. Not widely reported because it doesn't meet the hysterical media narrative.
5
@Rich That's not true. Some banks and credit unions affiliated with certain government agencies are doing this, but not all of them are.
One large bank that caters to military veterans is being criticized (and rightfully so) for changing their rules regarding shutdown loans. When DOD was being affected, the loans were 0% interest. Now that it's the Coast Guard, they are charging interest, and it's become well known in the Coastie community that you need at least a credit score of 750. Loans are capped at $2,500 as well.
Additionally, Coast Guard Mutual Assistance is only able to provide limited support because their income normally comes from payroll donations.
http://www.cgmahq.org/shutDown/clients.html
Finally, the Thrift Savings Plan is not allowing loans from accounts because members are in a non-pay status, a Catch-22 that would be comical if it weren't so cruel.
19
The federal credit union that all federal employees use? What a completely absurd statement. Please name the federal credit union. Is that one of those alternative facts? Well, here is the fake news version. I am a one of those federal employees and classified as a non essential that you loath. We DO NOT all belong to that one federal credit union. I belong to none. When Kelly-Ann Conway gets fired by the big boss, maybe you should apply for her job in order to keeps the facts coming. You could also use the that federal credit union that you allure too.
What is hysterical is Trump's histrionic nonsense of a non-crisis at the border while he creates a real and oervasuce. insudious crisis rippling throughout the country with his bureaucratic genocide.
1
Why aren't Americans protesting in mass? Why isn't the senate majority leader met with protests 24/7 wherever he may be? Why is Individual #1 still in the White House? Why aren't Americans fighting for their priorities and instead allowing the oligarchy and their flunkies in Congress set them? All I see is a failed republic.
16
I no longer feel any pride in saying that I am American. I know I am lucky to live here but I am ashamed of us. The people of France have shown the way but most Americans probably don't even know what's happening there since they don't know what's happening in their own country. The Founding Fathers must be turning over in their graves.
14
Tragically, many Americans are too indifferent to their fellow citizens and many laws have been changed where peaceful protesters are arrested.
3
@jmc
Americans tend to be less excitable (and harder working) than the French, who seem to riot and strike at the drop of a baguette.
1
The only pathway for ' the wall ' is to receive approval from both chambers of Congress.
With no other avenue to pursue , Trump has chosen to use extortion and blackmail to push a project that has been thrust upon us by radio talk show flame throwers that get paid huge salaries to spread hatred and bigotry over the air waves.
The situation is intolerable , but we cannot accede to what amounts to criminal extortion. To open that door would just enable the fascists to have their way.
It has been one of America's firmest dictates. Never , ever , give in to blackmail.
And now it is time more than ever , for that resolution to be firmly upheld.
11
It is amazing how selfish Americans are nowadays. If it doesn't affect them directly, they don't care--so this is what needs to happen I suppose. Let everyone feel the pain as many voted for Trump, so enjoy your "win."
11
For a change, Trump wasn’t lying when he said he’d be happy to let this shutdown go on for “months or even years”. Shutting things down is what he’s always been about. Whenever his businesses failed, he just declared bankruptcy and shut he operation down. The collateral damage were the employees and contractors who got stuck with bills they couldn’t pay. Sound familiar?
Since he came into office he’s been shutting down treaties, agreements, regulations, programs and distinguished careers right and left. So this is the ultimate joy ride for him, one with lots of “upside”: He’s 1) constantly in the news; 2) showing his base what a “fighter” he is; 3) shutting down his biggest thing ever; 4) stiffing hundreds of thousands of federal workers; 5) keeping our minds off Mueller and 6) unleashing chaos across the land, from sea to shining sea.
By following his “base instincts”, Trump is staging his own downfall. He knows this, sees no way out, and is determined to take us all down with him.
11
Have to wonder how much thought was put in by the White House into what to shut down and what not to. Did they have the liberty to pick and choose. Like, not the VA but ok homeland security. And not too great a number of those locked out otherwise it looks too bad. Also, I am shocked that so many of my Trump supporting friends and others are ok with people and families facing financial crisis when they are not impacted. These Republicans have no heart. Could Pelosi end it? sure...but the worst thing you can do is give in to a bully like Trump because if you do you know the first thing he will do is rub it in your face and say the Dems caved to him and what a great leader he is. So no, stand strong Dems.
11
I’m so mad at Trump. He doesn’t care about anyone but himself. He’s a spoiled child in a grown man suit. People that voted for him are heartless and have no compassion for what ordinary citizens are going thru. The Democrats, the Republicans had a bipartisan deal months ago so this didn’t have to happen. Trump and his spoiled temper tantrum ways has frozen the government. The people that are suffering are the common folk who work real jobs. Trump is not suffering. Nor McConnell. Their children aren’t suffering. Each has a roof over his head that he doesn’t have to pay for because I pay for it, you pay for it. They have food on the table. They know where the next meal is coming from & know that the electricity is going to stay on. This wall issue is simply nonsense. Those of us that live in Texas can tell you for a fact there is no crisis at the border! NONE. The only crisis is in the homes of our federal workers and farmers. They can’t make their car payment or daycare pmt. They’re having garage sales to put food on the table next week! My friend can’t make her car payment on Monday, the bank was like “sorry”. Her landlady let her pay half rent but she’s got to come up more rent soon. But our president and the media that supports him DO NOT CARE. I had hope that he would make a difference. But people are much worse off than they were two years ago. I will never again vote for another Republican. They don’t care about our country. 2020 cannot get here soon enough.
20
Next up, bread and soup lines.
6
No President who loves the average citizen would hurt >800,000 of them this way.
9
Why is Donald Trump accused so often of lying? It's either because he is telling too much truth for some people's taste, or he's the biggest and best liar in the history of the world.
1
With the most oblivious being Trump himself. What color is the sky in his bizzarro world of lies upon lies upon lies? He hurts American taxpayers in a tantrum without acknowledging the people have spoken and elected a democratic house—he lost biggly. Our great national shame in voting him into office continues unabated by any Republican in Congress. The very definition of cowardice—party and power before country.
3
I’m sure the Kremlin will provide low-interest loans to those federal employees furloughed during the partial government shut down. Now that the U.S. is officially a subsidiary of Russia, it only makes sense.
5
Where is the front page large type headline "PRESIDENT IS LYING !" Should be a constant every day presence until this nightmare begins to conclude. Without a constant public relations campaign to change minds, this madness is not going to end.
5
And yet others are more concerned with the sovereignty of the United States. Without borders, American doesn't exist. Without American, we don't need federal employees. Build the Wall. It's a start.
4
@Joshua
The minority said, "We want $30 Trill in corporate tax cuts, now!" After the tax breaks they said, "Now build us a wall and make Mexico pay for it, now!".
The majority responded in November and said, "Fund health care, infrastructure and common sense programs! And while you are at it, please control the baby in the room!!!".
6
Having worked as a federal contractor with several agencies, I can say that there's a significant portion of civil "servants" that are in it solely for the paycheck. These are folks who could care less about taxpayers and more so putting in effort to do their work, leaving much of their duties to consultants and contractors. So, my feeling is it's these people who are suffering now because for them to find other work in the private sector means they would have to actually get off their seats and actually work.
I should emphasize that this does not describe everyone who is currently affected by the furlough. I've also been honored to meet some fine men and women in federal service who I truly feel bad for right now.
8
@Dr. MB I've spent almost 30 years in combined military and federal service, and worked in the civilian sector in retail, food service, and field work in agriculture.
Accusing federal employees of being "in it solely for the paycheck" is funny because that would also describe most of the civilian sector as well. People need money to survive in almost every economic form. Remember, 49% of any group is below average, so there are poor performers in both the civilian and government sector.
About a third of government employees are veterans. Many veterans have skills that don't readily transfer to the civilian sector, or don't have a degree. The civil service sector recognizes experience over education like no other employer. This is critical for our veterans and our economy.
Lastly, many people rightly point out that it's difficult to fire poor performing government employees. That's right--and it's for good reason. Before work protection laws for government employees, they would be fired just for political reasons. Incoming administrations would pad the civil service with loyal donors and campaign personnel to reward them for a successful election. Our current system isn't perfect, but it's the better one, and I've seen it work many times in the past.
14
@Dr. MB
That could be said of anyone at any job.
1
Is the entire country living pay check to pay check? Don't people have emergency savings?
7
@Beyond Repair Pretty much. Almost 80% are in this situation.
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/jul/29/us-economy-workers-paycheck-robert-reich
I receive a military pension, disability compensation for my service injuries and illnesses, and have a good paying government job. My spouse is also a government employee and we don't have any kids. However, we only recently paid off almost $50,000 in debt from when my father was diagnosed with cancer. I helped with his expenses including medical insurance up until his death, while traveling back and forth from Alaska to visit. My entire back payment of disability went to paying credit card bills.
Our economic safety net consists of a piece of gauze on a toothpick.
13
@Beyond Repair your lack of empathy indicates a conservative mind, so, let me offer a way to look at this in a way you may be able to relate to: Why not protect our Southern border the way we protect our schools? You know, with thoughts and prayers? Why do we need more than that?
2
@Beyond Repair:
This is what capitalism ultimately results in:
https://money.cnn.com/2018/05/22/pf/emergency-expenses-household-finances/index.html
1
Donald Trump has forced the federal government into a bad situation. He is insisting that an independently elected branch of government do as he says, and if it doesn’t he will prevent the government of which he is chief executive from functioning.
If Congress, and Congressional Democrats in particular, cave to his demand it will mean that their independent election means nothing. He’s not entitled to force separately elected representatives to violate their promises to their constituents with a gun to their heads.
There is really no choice here but to wait him out or overrride his veto. That is the constitutional remedy. When the Senate will call a halt to this is anyone’s guess. When enough of their constituents feel the pain, it will end. My read is that Republicans depend more on government functioning than Democrats, so when farmers and aid recipients and their business friends can’t get the gears unstuck they will end this reality show.
9
@Jazz Paw
I agree with you in general. I hold Mitch McConnell responsible for preventing the Senate from exercising its constitutional responsibilities. However, what Congress' constituents want is anybody's guess, since our concerns don't seem to enter the picture. Have we been asked -- no. Maybe Mitch McConnell thinks he's representing his constituents in Kentucky. What he and the others may want to remind themselves of is that when they're in Congress, they're supposed to represent the interests of the country as a whole, not a single state or district, as their votes affect us all. If you try to call a member of Congress, you are directed to only those whose zip code matches your voting district. I live in DC, and have no voting representation in Congress. Yet, although I am a furloughed employee, no one in Congress wants to hear from me because I am not in his/her district. My tax dollars help pay the salaries of members of Congress, and will also help pay for a wall, if one is built, and for the $1.3 trillion defense spending bill that was passed for FY2019, an amount that is $160 more than that of the previous two years. Congress doesn't care what I think of that, either. Do you seriously think members of Congress are doing what their constituents want -- or did you mean to say "donors.?"
8
@N I meant to say, the defense spending bill was $160 billion more than that of the two preceding years (not $160).
2
@N,
Either their constituents or their donors, it doesn’t matter. Of course, I’d prefer constituents, but the point is that Congress is not subordinate to the executive branch, so nothing gets done without negotiating, or overriding if Trump won’t offer a reasonable compromise.
I suppose if I were not being paid this would be academic, but I’m fed up with this childish autocrat, so I’m not supportive of caving in to his antics. If that means more disfunction and hardship, so be it. It is part of the process of reigning him in. Too bad innocents are caught in the maw, but his election brought this ill wind. It is citizens responsibility to force elected officials to behave or remove them from office.
4
"Others Oblivious." Yes, for billionaires, too. Supposing that the average monthly paycheck for those government employees is $5K, it's $4B in total for 0.8M of them. That is less than 3% of $137B of Jeff Bezos.
4
There are a lot of smug people posting here who are either enjoying this drama or who are simply unconcerned about what is going on. We have chaos by design going on here. Did not Steven Bannon say that the Trump administration's chief goal was to dismantle the state? It's working.
Here is one example of how you will eventually be hurt by this. Airline pilots cannot renew their medical certs because the FAA office that processes these is closed. Within six months, many commercial airline pilots will be grounded. Add in the loss of air traffic controllers, safety inspectors and security and we will see a major transportation and commerce hub slow down to third world levels. And this is not by accident.
31
What shutdown? Count me as one of those who hasn’t noticed. It is sort of sad and pathetic that I pay a ridiculous amount in taxes and don’t even notice the government shutdown. What does that tell you? That my government doesn’t work for me. The irony is that security at LGA was a breeze this past Wed. because those TSA agents who showed up didn’t care (despite stories to the contrary). I don’t get a refund for taxes so I could care less that the IRS is basically closed. Yes, it is a country of 2 totally different stories.
32
@Mike L-The work of good government may not entirely be visible or evident for the very reason that dedicated professionals are doing their jobs. Caring and committed federal employees and contractors (maybe unseen to you) but serving your well-being, preserving your and fellow citizens' safety, security, basic needs, and quality of life. Even under the best of circumstances, TSA agents have to put up with a lot of stupid, thoughtless, self-centered people. I guess we know what story applies to you.
64
I hope that you are lucky enough not to get any unsafe food or medicine, since those inspections are drastically reduced. I hope you don't have to fly anywhere and that this situation is resolved before flying becomes really unsafe or just shuts down. It hasn't touched you yet, but if you live in this country it will. Not every American is as indifferent to other people as you seem to be; I don't wish any hard times on you, but you might want to look at yourself in the mirror and see if you like what is there. You might want to inform yourself about what the consequences will be down the road where it will touch you and yours if this shutdown continues. The shutdown is already costing our country billions of dollars and could help take this robust economy down but that wouldn't affect you would it? I'm guessing that you're a billionaire or at least a millionaire? /s Just sayin'.
71
@Mike L
You are truely a lucky person if the government "doesn't work" for you. No doubt you have made it on your own.
I have always been amazed at the number of friends who attended public school, got here riding a school bus on a public highway, went to a public university or college, paid for part of their post secondary education with a guaranteed student loan backed by the government, then got a job and wondered why people "can't make it on their own."
As for the federal government, some of them wish it would disappear...that is until their parents need Social Security , Medicare or Medicaid. They don't want an EPA..... until their groundwater is contaminated. No need of the CDC either....unless there is an outbreak. FEMA means nothing to them, until there is a natural disaster. Food inspection is also invisible to them as are many other services that go on behind the scene.
But again....you're fortunate not to need government ... but I wouldn't count on that always being the case.
111
Just about every report anywhere about the shutdown is making a huge deal over the fact that workers are not getting their paychecks and have no money for basic things such as food. However they all fail to mention that all these workers will receive back pay, and congress even passed a bill to guarantee this.
Therefore the actual number of federal workers who do not know anyone who would lend them a few hundred dollars based on their paycheck that they will get are very few. There is a whole industry of payday lenders who lend money based on a paycheck that will be coming due and all they require is a pay stub from a past paycheck.
So all the stories we read and are highlighted on the news of federal workers pawning their jewelry and going to foodbanks are not because they are representative of what is happening in the lives of 800,000 people. Rather it is because they are sensational, and it is those types of stories that those tasked with coming up with newsworthy stories to tell us day and day out need to come up with so we keep coming back for more.
4
@Michael Stavsen:
Yes, of course, no one is really suffering. This is all about driving up subscriptions. You've got it all figured out for us.
/s.
1
So not true.
1
@Michael Stavsen: You wrote: "Therefore the actual number of federal workers who do not know anyone who would lend them a few hundred dollars based on their paycheck that they will get are very few. There is a whole industry of payday lenders who lend money based on a paycheck that will be coming due and all they require is a pay stub from a past paycheck." ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Payday_loan) with a 371% beginning interest rate. It is an upside-down world when it is expected that fed employees bum off their friends/folks (if they've any that CAN loan to them) or rely on usurious loans in order to survive. There simply HAS to be a better solution...we can try re-opening our government, for a start.
1
The Delusional One not paying federal employees harkens back to his business practice.
He couldn't care less about the 99%.
He wouldn't pay contractors, drew out lawsuits with contractors and bankrupted those who couldn't afford protracted lawsuits or those who just gave up.
His psychosis is affecting nearly one million people.
Going forward it'd be great to see the President, WH staff, members of the Senate and Congress receive no pay when there is a shutdown.
Additionally, all would be barred from travel outside of DC during a shutdown.
All would have to stay in DC and work until a resolution to reopen the government is reached.
22
I hate Trump too. But I wonder about the editors of the Times; we keep hearing about how this is affecting the federal employees. We need to be very clear that the purpose of the federal government is not to be a jobs program for its employees -- it's to serve the taxpayers.
11
@Jamie Unlikely that anyone will want to serve the taxpayers if they no longer can put food on their table for their kids.
If I were one of these employees, I would never work for the federal government again. But perhaps that's what most of the Republicans want.
25
@Jamie
Well let's see how far you get when you can't fly anywhere. It's not just the TSA walking out. The airline pilots cannot renew their aviation medical certs. Do you understand the ramifications of this?
18
The employees affected include border security agents, corrections officers for jails, TSA agents (for planes), and food safety inspectors. Even in a very libertarian government, most of the above would be needed!
That is not a “jobs program.” That is the basic function of government.
These people devote their time to public service, and likely gave up higher paychecks elsewhere to do so. And this is how we repay them.
22
Why is the Times giving the Republican Senate a free pass by continually referring to it as "Trump's shutdown?"
Constitutionally and legally Congress could stop this immediately. It is a choice Mitch McConnell and the Republican Senators are making. By solely "crediting" Trump for the shutdown, it simply plays into his hand, encouraging the narrative that everything is about him. As well, it let's the Republican Senators off the hook come election time in 2020.
42
Both parties have presented multiple options to Trump that he continually shoots down. There was a deal last month that he changed his mind on after Limbaugh gave him a tongue lashing. IT IS HIS SHUTDOWN.
7
@Steve Fankuchen
It's the smart thing to do. If you think about it you will understand why it's important they don't hit republicans hard. This is not about politics. It's about protecting us all.
This shutting down the government simply has to stop. Not just this one, but all of them. I do not know the mechanism that would bring this about, but shutting down the government over policy differences is wrong and incredibly irresponsible.
People directly employed by the government are negatively impacted; contractors will never get back pay. Critically, services funded by the government simply stop. Food inspections, park maintenance, scientific work. Who will die because the Coast Guard is not working? This is simply nuts. This country is rapidly becoming dysfunctional.
37
@Elaine. The Coast Guard is working. And what “scientific work” gets done in two weeks?
3
@Jackson
Apparently you are not a scientist. Many studies are time sensitive. Being forced to quit unexpectedly can irreparably ruin the data, wasting all the time, effort, and money that was already invested. The Coast Guard is working without being paid. How long would you be willing to do that?
18
@Jackson Science and fisheries voyages do, and at least two are on hold. Like to eat fish? Permits will be placed on hold soon.
9
Losing personal income, either permanently if you’re a federal contract worker or for weeks if not months if you’re a federal employee: that’s an emergency.
21
We are a comfortable two-income family. Both of us are public servants working for the government. My husband is furloughed, I am not. Thankfully, we have my salary to pay the mortgage and other hard expenses, but we will have to rely on savings and credit cards for everything else, like groceries, gas, and child care (which we don’t need at the moment, but have committed to pay). We should not be in this position. The government has a responsibility to its employees as any company has to its employees. This is not a bankruptcy or national crisis that might otherwise justify such actions; this is a policy fight and our politicians are putting our skin — not their own — in the game. They need to find a solution where they are accountable, not us.
43
@Liz
They evidence to impeach a dangerous criminal is what they need. How do we handle hostage negotiations? Send in the SWAT team but we can't do that here can we.
1
If the government saves a lot of money not paying all these workers, and work is not done that we paid for, do we get part of our federal taxes back?
2
@Told you so
These shut downs cost money, they don't save any.
In my state of Wisconsin, there is only the slightest federal presence. Most federal services require a trip to Illinois. We have only one federal park (the Apostles) which is closed in the winter. All those great federal jobs? Elsewhere. We send money to Washington for these jobs but it does not come back.
Maybe if there was a more fair distribution of federal employment you’d see more universal outcry.
2
@Quickbeam—not much “federal presence” in Wisconsin? No food inspections? No medical (eg: HIV support services) services from the Feds? No DV hotline supported by federal funds? No airports with traffic controllers or TSA agents? No Agricultural programs? No Fed court house?
I am amazed by the number of routine services that are beginning to be impacted. No “private prisons” in Wisconsin—guards and other employees are contracted by the Federal Government and who will NEVER be paid? No subsidized housing—owned by “private” interests, who will NOT receive the federal funds that at least HELP, if not fully fund, those subsidies? Medicaid payments for very low seniors in nursing homes which will not be made?
All that economic activity goes to local tax bases and local businesses. Everyone will be impacted, to varying degrees of repairability, in every state. Don’t ask “for whom the bell tolls.” It’s a big country with the requisite connections and we will ALL feel the disruption. It tolls for us ALL.
11
@Quickbeam Hang on...you have airports, highways, coasts and waterways, food inspectors, veterans, post offices, and many other agencies and services in Wisconsin.
I count almost 30,000 federal employees in your state.
http://www.governing.com/gov-data/federal-employees-workforce-numbers-by-state.html
8
More “America” values from where is it again ?
I called the Republican Senators and asked them to work with the Democrats and end this shutdown. Also call out Mcconnell to call for votes.
I hope more people flood the phones.
39
@janice b
Try Pelosi and Schumer.
They are the ones refusing to negotiate.
Good luck
@janice b. Did you tell Pelosi to compromise? Or Chuck?
Federal workers, especially those affected, must flood their congressional members, all three members regardless of party, with phone calls and letters demanding an end to the shutdown. Those in the DC area should try to meet their members face to face to express their concerns over the shutdown. Their family members should also contact Congress and demand an end.
A large number of Federal workers' basic needs are in danger of not being met, and this should be their main point so they are not accused of playing politics.
Call Congress at 202-224-3121.
7
@RB Is anybody manning the phones?
“It’s very frustrating,” Ms. Rasmussen said, “that wall is going straight through the country, not between us and Mexico.” This is the GOP strategy -- they couldn't conquer, so now they divide.
39
They learned it from Obama.
The is disheartening to see. I know some federal workers who have been furloughed. I wanted to help them but they tell me I cannot give them more than $20. That will not get them far. If congress and POTUS cannot come to grips to passing a budget in a timely manner at least let us change the law that in such circumstances such as these government shut downs that ordinary citizens would be allowed to help federal workers.
3
so maybe a silver lining? there is that about Really Bad Times that brings out the best in some people. Today (the first day of no paychecks for many many government employees) my town -Bar Harbor Maine- has a Facebook page filled with offers of free groceries for Feds in Need, unlimited coffee tabs, just plain no-strings practical help. It is probably no accident that our new Governor has just announced that she is replacing the "open for business" signs at the border with new ones that just say "Welcome Home" . May you all live in states that are "the way life should be".
22
@John Anderson. So your governor wants open borders? Then she is the problem.
2
I want to see interviews with senators and representatives stating why they will not vote in favor of overriding a Presidential veto to open the government. If Mitch McConnell will not do it, why aren’t Republican senators pushing for new leadership?
73
OK...it might be a fine time for all of any Americans with any intelligence at all, any conscience, any morals, any ethics, any religion, any sense of decency, any "values," any patriotism, any life - to shut down.
Hasn't this "President" and the leader of the Senate made it clear that all that matters is their personal choices.
America means nothing to Trump and the GOP - except power and money.
The lives of Americans mean nothing to these men.
All is ideology, power, and money.
Welcome to 2019 - it isn't going to get any better than 2018.
48
I'm furloughed and have been trying for weeks to apply for unemployment. My current state say I have to apply in my last state of employment (as a fed I move around a lot). But my previous state says I have to apply in my current state. I qualify for zero dollars from both, and can't get anyone on the phone to help me sort things out. I have already drained my emergency fund to pay my bills for this month. What happens next? I have already started looking for new employment outside of the government even though I love my agency and job.
Thank you Trump. You are hands down, the worst president ever.
294
I am so sorry you are going through this. You don’t deserve it. I wish I could do something to help you.
23
My spouse and I are both US Coast Guard government employees. I’m also a military retiree from the Coast Guard.
Some additional things to keep in mind:
We are eligible for unemployment, but must pay it all back if retroactive pay is confirmed.
We can’t use aid programs within our agency because they are only providing small loans to the most junior personnel.
We can’t take a loan from our Thrift Savi
ngs Plan (401K) because we are in a non-income status.
We can’t take second jobs because our HR department doesn’t have anyone on staff right now to approve the request.
We can’t go too far out of town because we have to be available for work.
My military retirement will not be paid because that comes from Coast Guard funding. Our sole source of income is my VA disability.
Some government employees are setting up fundraisers to help. By law, they can’t accept any donation over $20 or anything from anyone who does business with their agency.
Some banks are offering zero interest loans to military personnel, retirees, and veteran civil service employees. Other banks are only doing interest loans for clients with a credit score higher than 750, and capping them at $2,500. That's less than a month of rent for Coasties in places like New York, Boston, LA, Honolulu, Anchorage, Washington DC, and the Bay Area.
Continued...
85
@Josh B.
For active duty Coast Guard, military pay will not go out on the January 15.
Active duty military personnel will be without pay.
We could have homeless Coasties by the end of the month. The Coast Guard divested most of its housing property over the last 10 years to save money. Coasties almost always live "on the economy."
Contractors will most likely not get paid at all. They never have in the past.
Almost one-third of government employees are veterans. There is a genuine fear that suicides will skyrocket if the shutdown goes on much longer. Economic insecurity is often a contributing factor among military and veteran suicides.
20 veterans commit suicide every day.
If you know a veteran who is affected by the shutdown, talk to them and make sure they are okay.
If you or someone you know is in crisis, support is available 24/7. The National Suicide Prevention Lifeline is available to all at 1-800-273-8255.
Veterans, service members, and their families and friends can call the Veterans and Military Crisis Line at 1-800-273-8255 and Press 1, chat online at VeteransCrisisLine.net/Chat, or text to 838255.
39
@Josh B. As the spouse of a vet who is currently a furloughed government employee, I thank you for writing this. I wish you the best.
7
@Josh B.
My wife and I are so sorry for what you are going through and wish there was something more we could do to help. If you were our neighbors, we'd pay your rent this month.
5
I wonder whether there could be a class-action lawsuit on behalf of furloughed workers to block credit reporting agencies (TRW, Equifax etc.) from lowering the credit ratings of people temporarily unable to make loan payments or pay bills on time due to the shutdown. When they finally go back to work they will be owed back pay, so they should be able to catch up on the bills then, but their credit scores could be lowered due to missed payments right now. That is totally unfair since this problem is not in any way their fault.
52
Why is the Times giving the Republican Senate a free pass by continually referring to it as "Trump's shutdown?"
Constitutionally and legally Congress could stop this immediately. It is a choice Mitch McConnell and the Republican Senators are making. By solely "crediting" Trump for the shutdown, it simply plays into his hand, encouraging the narrative that everything is about him.
118
As a former federal public servant of 40 years I feel for my US brothers and sisters and hope the shutdown ends soon so they can get on with their lives. We had a similar crisis here in 1975 when the Government was denied budget funding by the Opposition. The impasse was broken only by going to a federal election. The Opposition won, thereby achieving their political objective ... through political bastardry! The negative consequences of blocking budget funding was so profound that it has never happened again.
16
I just heard that members of Congress and their many thousands of staffers are exempt from the shutdown. They’re still getting paid. Not surprising, but outrageous. Hah. That’s something that needs to change. Bet if they had to suffer the effects of their malpractice we’d have to endure less of it.
43
@Mountain American It's a partial shutdown, I've heard it only impacts somewhere between 13%-20% of non-military government workers.
1
@Mike The US Coast Guard is most definitely a military service branch, and their funding has been suspended. Active duty military personnel and retirees from the Coast Guard are NOT getting paid.
19
@Mike. 'It ONLY impacts between 13-20%' ?
So it doesn't really matter then?
Great choice of words mate!
26
No other serious country that I know of has the ability to shut down government when political parties can’t agree on something. The debt ceiling and the government funding mechanisms in the US are insane: contractual commitments taken by a democratically-elected government (to their employees, to their suppliers) should be binding, period. There must be a national debate in the US now about changing this.
51
I feel helpless and hopeless as a federal employee. How long this shutdown is going to last? I worked for the federal government for more than 30 years and I still a paycheck every two weeks. I have to pay my rent and grocery bills. No end in sight. What are we going to do? Too old to join the army.
29
I hope some of these friends and family members are willing to help their siblings and friends in need. I am not surprised that some Americans are clueless as to the shutdown and who it affects, but just don't say "I am sorry for you" but help. And, be angry too, for these people who are out of work due to a grown man throwing a temper tantrum due to not getting his funding for his border wall is completely clueless to how most Americans live: paycheck to paycheck. We don't need a border wall. We need Americans back at work. I am sick that the Republican controlled senate has ignored the house bill that can give people their jobs back. I say Congress needs to have their pay stopped too and their health insurance.
33
This will amount to a paid vacation for the furloughed workers....not exactly the calamity that’s portrayed. Some don’t make too much or have unexpected expenses and that is understandable....but the vast majority should be able to save 2 or 3 paychecks.
8
@Andrew W
That might be true if their creditors are willing to wait for payment until they finally get their delayed checks. If the creditors aren't willing to wait, people who aren't being paid now might have their utilities cut off, go into arrears on their mortgages, have interest pile up on their credit cards, have their credit ratings suffer, etc. even though they eventually will be able to pay their bills once the shutdown ends. Remember that 50% of Americans would struggle to cover a $400 unanticipated expense; not many have thousands of dollars in the bank to tide them over two months out of work.
54
@Andrew W How would you like a "vacation" with no money, no access to your 401K, possible loss of home, and no food?
Don't forget, this is also affecting active duty military personnel in the US Coast Guard. Military retirees from that service as well.
Also, one third of government employees are veterans. I'm sure they'd love to hear your comments about their employment status.
76
@Andrew W What a HEARTLESS thing to say! Already, many have been informed by their landlords and mortgage companies that legal action WILL BE TAKEN AGAINST THEM if rents and mortgage payments are not made in full within the next 30 days.
Some great vacation. . .impending homelessness is so very relaxing!
56
As a primary breadwinner with young kids who has experienced a temporary lapse in employment before, I really empathize with the affected federal workers and the stress they must be feeling. I don’t know what’s worse: this lapse caused by our mercurial president and a crisis he has manufactured to serve his ego, or all the people who continue to enable him. It is beyond insane. I don’t expect our president to care about others. We see him for the narcissist he his. But does no one else in his administration or the Republican leadership (talking to you, Mr. McConnell) care about their fellow Americans?
65
NYT: Please look into whether the clinic on premises of US Congress is open during this shutdown. Are those nurses and docs who treat the Representatives and Senators getting paid?
Also:
As long as the healthcare premiums of federal employees are not getting paid, I do not believe the premiums should be paid, either, for ultra deluxe healthcare special healthcare policies of members of Congress.
13
What most News organization have failed to register is that the democratic majority was sworn in January 3, 2019. The government has been shut down for 30 days. The last congress voted for a bill, then turned the lights off and went on Winter Break. That means the Government was effectively shut down before this CURRENT congress ever voted for a single bill. They can vote for as many bills as they want, nothing is being taken up in the Senate. WHY? That should have been the real story.
45
@Dr. Girl
Yes. They preach to the rest of us that all we need is to work harder, but they get salaries and benefits beyond what most of us will ever see, while ignoring their responsibilities and working on average 2/3 of the year. Bastille Day is looking better all the time.
15
When a child has a tantrum the surest way to insure that he will do it again is to give in to his coercion. The Democrats have passed bills to reopen Government, the Republicans are refusing to vote on them. They are enabling the Presidents childish behavior and insuring that we will see more of it. They along with the President are solely responsible for the suffering of Federal employees and need to open the Government now.
58
@J W
Republicans are standing on the sideline hoping that the crossfire takes them out. They are all about tactics and could care less about the criminal in the White House.
1
Does anyone know how to make a donation to those who are furloughed?
8
@Seth You can't make a donation greater than $20 to any specific employee due to ethics laws. Also, you cannot make a donation to anyone in an agency with which you conduct any business, no matter how minor.
8
Grocery store chains and drugstores should set up such a donation system.
7
@Seth
You may not be able to do so directly, but you can donate to your local food pantry, emergency heat programs in your area, and other charities affected people may draw upon for help. Personally, I haven't got too much money to spare but I've been inviting affected friends over for dinner -- one less meal they have to pay for, and a chance to feel less isolated.
22
A San Diego TSA worker makes about $38,000 a year. The average rent in San Diego is $2044 a month. So rent takes $24,528 a year. That leaves $13,472 a year to live on. Oh, my. After food, transportation, clothes, insurance and healthcare, it’s hard not to go into debt each month, much less put aside money for savings.
Yes, everyone should save. But people who earn little find it very hard to save because they don’t have enough money for essential items. We are talking about people who cut their insulin dose in half or skip meals just to make it to the end of each month. And these are people who are working full-time jobs!
It is such a shame that so many Americans (our President included) don’t know what it is like to be fully employed and poor.
I’m continually awed by how hard many Americans work; I know one man who works two jobs (one full-time 40 hours a week and one part-time 35 hours a week) and one woman who works three part-time jobs for about 70 hours—and both of these people barely make ends meet because all of these work hours only add up to an annual salary of about $30,000 a year for each of them.
173
And $38k is year is pre-taxes, making the situation even worse.
13
@Heather I have no idea why more people do not just walk out. The lack of a decent taxpayer funded health care system is unconscionable in the US. What happened - our grandparents and great grandparents fought for workers´ rights then since 1980 the republicans have taken away any possibility for any but the rich to survive and thrive. Yet people accept it in the US. Its brainwashing on a large national scale. There is no reason for the US to be so disfunctional. Trump is the result of 40 plus years of right wing corruption, not the cause. Its time to fix the US.
12
@Heather, most people in Houston homeless shelters have jobs--and children. Agreed, a travesty.
5
Some commenters believe Federal Government workers are all making high six-figure salaries.
According to Good Jobs Nation;
"The federal government is effectively the nation’s largest employer of low-wage workers: It funds 4.5 million contractor jobs that pay less than $15 an hour."
An Obama Executive Order ( 13658), boosted Federal Contract Worker's minimum wage to $10.10 which still keeps millions in poverty. So, the fantasy of high-rolling government workers simply isn't accurate.
46
@Candlewick
Unless I misunderstood (would not be the first time), the workers you refer to are not "Federal Government" (why the caps?) employees, but employees of government contractors (or contractors themselves?). Yes, $10.10 an hour is paltry, but I suspect a good many working for contractors such as Boeing may be doing somewhat a bit better than that.
@Mark Shyres You'd be surprised that contractors don't make as much as you think. We had one at our agency who was funded nearly $1 million annually, but the person only brought home about $50,000 per year. In DC, that's barely above the poverty line. The rest of the funding went to the contracting company to pay for training, travel, and equipment.
12
@Mark Shyres
Boeing is but one of hundreds or thousands of contractors. Our government utilizes contract employees from janitorial to office personnel to cooks. Using Boeing as an example does make your case, but a good percentage of contractors are not deep-pocked like a Boeing, or McDonnell Douglas. (Didn't realize that using a capital "F" or "G" was an offensive- if was used more for emphasis to distinguish government from contract employees. Does that help you).
I just don't understand how Mr. Trump/GOP thinks he can cut taxes during prosperous times and spend, spend, spend. Do you think the federal employees not receiving a pay check are out buying their vacation home, NO! Also, where is the cost-benefit analysis? What kind of improvements to our declining education system or the opioid crisis, etc can 6 billion buy and how great are the long term effects? Also, the humanitarian crisis that Mr. Trump is suddenly pretending to pay attention too is partially his fault. Remember separating innocent children from their parents?
19
@JB
Trump hates government as much as his Fox news buddies right wing radio gods. What is the best way to disable the government? Shake hands with everyone who was our enemy. Alienate our allies. And increase the debt to cause the system to self destruct. He has setup a time bomb. The wall is just a tool to keep him in office longer and keep the American people divided.
1
Hello America. Trump is the guy who declared four business bankruptcies and was forced to sell many of his assets. He stiffed his contractors and employees in the process. And now he is stiffing the American worker. Our people go hungry, enable to pay their mortgages or utility bills, while Nero stalks around the White House at midnight in his silk bathrobe, eating burgers and fries. Why should he care about the average Joe or Jane? His history speaks for itself.
The farmers, loan officers, prison guards, TSA agents, janitors who are suffering must put pressure on Republican lawmakers who can end this crisis. They are equally the culprits. Time to turn up the heat, folks.
114
There should be a requirement that if one house of Congress passes a bill, that the other house must vote on it. McConnell won't call a vote on the bills passed by the House, because he knows that the bills will pass. The reason we don't have comprehensive immigration reform is that House Speaker Boehner refused to bring the bill passed by the Senate to a vote. Again, because he knew it would pass. One person should not have such power.
78
I shudder every time I need to interact with a government employee - state, local, or federal. I was a Civil Service employee for 10 years so I know how things work. Most of my co-workers were awful. There was rampant absenteeism, widespread inefficiency, and hostility to any suggestion of workplace improvements. I cannot tell you how I dreaded having to interact with my colleagues. Whenever I suggested to my co-workers to sign up for savings plans and IRAs, I was met with resistance. Anyone, and I mean anyone, that doesn't have at least one month of savings is a fool. I have no pity for those that spend their very last penny on sneakers.
8
You are making an assumption that there are funds remaining after paying for basic necessities. The average workers wages have not kept up with inflation. The tax cut benefited the wealthy, not the working poor.
21
@Carey Olson Don't know where you worked but it was not representative of Federal employees. I know hundreds of Federal employees and they are dedicated to their jobs and the missions of their respective agencies. The kind of employees you are talking about are outliers, the exception rather than the rule. I suspect your broad brush of negativity may be a case of projection.
24
@Jiminy - I do not project. I worked for the City and County of San Francisco. I interacted with all level of government agencies. The inefficiency is astounding. Just try getting your driver's licence renewed in CA. It's a nightmare.
1
As an Australian, it's utterly wild to us that the government can just down tools like that when it's not getting the results it wants, strangling the country. How did this even come to be something that can happen? That's not rhetorical, I'm genuinely struggling to understand why it's allowed. And on the say so of one person! If nothing else, I think Trump has highlighted that the office of the president has FAR too much power - when you've got a 'good guy' in the role, it's fine, but you can't count on that always being the case.
Our political system down under has its flaws to be sure, but if parliament grinds to a halt because it can't pass bills, boom, double dissolution and we head to the polls. Good incentive for everyone to try and keep things working. The Prime Minister here is just the leader of the party in power. They get a nicer office and a higher salary but they're not a king.
142
@Cat King
It's a bizarre system to be sure. That along with the Electoral College.
20
The Presidential institution in the US is a relic from the 1700s. Back then, the only mofel for the Presidency was a monarch, except it was elected every once in a while.
Far from the modern democratic norms of having a prime minister who's really in charge of the Cabinet. The whole US political system is antiquated and inadequate, hence all the failures and scandals.
However, it's also past peaceful reform.
11
@Cat King
I’m an expat American who now lives in Australia. Australian government not perfect but it surpasses the American system by bounds. I don’t understand this shut down either or why this man is their President. I remember him in the 90’s & he was a despicable person then. I’m still amazed about Americans short memories in regard to his past.
By the way, there is no such thing as the best country but Australia comes close.
10
I have always followed American politics since I was a young man and have been fascinated as it has always been far more interesting than Australian politics; ever since I was mystified by this unknown peanut farmer suddenly became president in 1976.
Perhaps someone could enlighten me about an even greater American mystery. Please indulge me as an interested and sympathetic outsider and explain something about all this as to have been inconceivably mysterious to me and its a question Americans don't seem to ask:
Why SHOULD Mexico pay for the wall? Aren't they the ones having to cater to people entering Mexico in order to get to the promised land? Please excuse my profound obtuseness. BTW don't get me wrong; I do love America- incredible country.
16
@Bob Guthrie Mexico should not have to pay for the wall - it's just that Trump claimed that he would make them pay if a wall was built. And anyway no wall is necessary - check out the newspapers closer to the southern border (San Antonio, TX, for one) and you will see in-depth stories with photos that show how foolish a wall would be and how unlikely it would ever get built.
I live close to the northern border with Canada, where the border is very porous (we went across two weeks ago without any security) and where many many more "terrorists" have attempted/succeeded in crossing. But I'm not afraid of immigrants. Studies show we're more likely to be killed in the U.S. by home-grown (Trump-loving) terrorists who have unlimited access to guns than we are to be hurt (much less killed) by an undocumented immigrant.
54
@Bob Guthrie I love Australia. Incredible country. Been there many times.
You’ve hit the nail on the head. Mexico would never pay for a wall. As you so eloquently state, why would they?
However, the mob heard the “Mexico will pay for it” sound bite and said “Yeah! Mexico will pay for it!” They never got further than that in their analysis that it was just as plausible that Martians would pay for a wall as it was Mexicans would.
Ridiculous on face.
3
@Bob Guthrie Many of us don't know why Mexico should pay either. Other than the proclamations, our leader never enlightened us on that yet. Irrespective of that, we just learned that our stable genius negotiated something regarding USMCA that is filling our coffers with billons of $s in tariff payments from Mexico. It's all part of the “Art of the Deal” that only a select few in the Trump base can understand.
1
Someone within the GOP needs to learn how to speak truth to power. Otherwise, the United States is in for a dismal future.
16
In addition to the furloughed workers mot getting paid, anyone receiving child support from a furloughed worker will not get paid. Child support is automatically withheld from the worker's pay. Children will suffer Not only will the furloughed worker unable to make rent or mortgage payments, the parent receiving support will be put into the same bind.
46
@Susan Murray I guarantee furloughed workers are paying their bookie...
@Susan Murray
Better yet, you don't pay your child support, you can go to jail.
1) House Democrats should pass a bill that ensures that no one in Congress gets paid during a shutdown. Let the lawmakers feel the pain that they inflict on others.
2) If the government is shut down and federal workers are not getting paid, shut it down. How are "essential employees" forced to work for no pay? This should be unconstitutional. No secret service for anyone. No TSA. Shut down all flights. Let the Gumpels et al. feel the pain.
3) I read somewhere that the White House is not able to pay its water bill. Shut the water down. No showers, no flushing toilets, no running water in the White House. No cleaning, no security, no taking the trash out. Let him have a taste of what he's forcing on the country.
Finally - NEVER give in to a terrorist throwing a temper tantrum and holding 800,000 employees hostage.
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@SYJ
Unfortunately, Trump, McConnell, and the others who are responsible for this cannot be made to feel much pain, since they are already wealthy. Trump can afford private transportation to Mar a Lago or the Trump Tower if he wishes, so if the White House has no water he'll just leave. Same for McConnell et. al. -- they are not living paycheck to paycheck. They will be fine, that's why they don't care.
11
@SYJ
Shut the electricity to the WH down too so the tanning bed no longer operates.
3
I feel bad that these people are suffering only so Trump can have a sound bite during the next election.
24
It's a shame, the "Commander in chief" has resulted to such childish and mundane tactics in order to get a wall. The Toddler in charge will yell, cry, scream and fold his arms when things don't go his way and everyone is suffering.
10
Hyp-o-crite [HIP-uh-krit] noun
1.) an individual in power who loves money and demands payment for licensing his name, but expects critical employees to work without wages
2.) any governmental official who publicly fans the flames of a non-existent crisis, and claims the necessity of a 1900-mile long physical wall, yet knows that none of it is true (i.e., a person who acts in contradiction to his or her stated beliefs or feelings)
14
I’m appalled by the actions of Trump, Mitch, and the lackey GOP legislators. The idiocy of this whole wall thing is beyond belief. But more troubling to me is the tone deaf comments of many on this post. The lack of empathy for one’s fellow man seems to extend well beyond Trump. I’m astounded that some use the “blame the victim” line of reasoning. But then again, why am I surprised at anything anymore. We are losing our humanity, one post, one Twitter, one rant at a time.
29
You can work by not nursing on the tax payers! Find a job that doesn’t require “a government “. we save our money. you would maje more money. and we would avoid all these bellyaching.
@Pilot
Soldier, fire fighter, police officer, social worker, special education teacher, highway engineer, correctional officer, border patrol agent, librarian, congressional representative, science researcher, doctor, astronaut, …
The above are just a few of many government jobs.
Do you really think that all these jobs are unnecessary in a civilized society? Don't you understand that we all chip in via our taxes so that we don't have to pay for these services by ourselves?
Would you like to personally pay for soldiers to guard this nation with no guarantee that your fellow Americans would chip in to cover the cost of military defense?
25
@Pilot Active duty military personnel (US Coast Guard) are currently not being funded. Should they all quit? Should they let people drown because they aren't being paid?
11
@Pilot
Fine. But next time there's potholes in your road, don't call the city/county public works, 'cause it won't be there. House on fire? Get out your hose! When lenders decide your mortgage should carry 25% interest, grin and bear it! And when the anarchists come for your possessions, defend your own "castle".
3
Trump gets a chance to stiff 800,000 people at once! He's beside himself with glee. It's the crowning achievement of his sad, sorry, and miserable life.
43
This man lies so much how could anyone ever think that the subjects under discussion or valid?
He could be shutting down the government because he knows Bob Muller has the evidence and he’s trying to put a squeeze on!
Get that man out of office before he delivers the US over to Putin.
11
Jared: "Dad, I'm losing money on my Section 8 properties. I've got to evict. Could you at least approve HUD funding?"
Trump: "Not until the wall is funded."
Stick a pin in this!
6
Ms. Caviedes, you need to pick better friends. As a country we are all in this together. Your friend sounds like a few to many Americans, "its all about me and my little world".
7
Hey Kids !!!
Since Mr. Trump owns this shut down of the American Government,
send him the bill for any Federal worker's food, housing, car payments and medical expenses,
and have the Secretary of the Treasury issue the checks this weekend!
9
@Steven of the Rockies
Also the bills for any small businesses that go under because federal workers are no longer spending money there, and the court fees for bankruptcy filings when those unpaid workers get too far under water.
4
A few days ago, a Florida Trump supporter suffering the effects of the Trump—“I’ll wear the mantle”—shutdown, said, “He’s not hurting the people he’s supposed to be hurting”. Those ten words—the notion that the President of the United States should be hurting anyone—tell you all you need to know about the craven and evil intent of Individual-1 and his enablers.
186
America in two sentences:
I don't care because it doesn't affect me.
I care because nobody should have to go through this.
27
In reading these comments, I’m stunned — but shouldn’t be at this point, I guess — by the comments along the lines of it hasn’t affected me, so whatever. Is that really where we are? It’s heartbreaking and frustrating. Who are these people?
6
Having a two party system that represents the will of the people and allows for opposing ideas to be debated is crucial to our democracy. Nether party should be allowed to declare "national emergencies" or hold the American people hostage as a means to achieve what they could not get done through the legislative process. We cannot normalize or accept this kind of behavior because you don't have to look very far down the road to see where this will lead if we do not stand up and stop it now.
11
@HG Wells
Well said!
1
Please highlight the banks, credit card companies, public utilities, pharmacies and others who have responded humanely to the mindless suggestion from the White House brain trust that those who are suffering from the shutdown need only ask those who are owed money to be compassionate and wait a few weeks.
9
"Some Americans Are Devastated, Others Oblivious"
Pretty much sums up the decadent, callous, and corrupt state of the dis-United States since Trump's Reign of Error began. Hey GOPers, get a bloody clue, this vile monster would rather see this once-great county go down in flames rather than EVER give one inch towards admitting he's a totally incompetent disaster and the greatest internal threat to the U.S. since the Civil War.
20
Judging by the comments here, Trump has implemented a new slogan succcessfully- Make America Hate Again.
16
The climbing toll of this shutdown for my (struggling) fellow Americans barely registers on the president’s 30%-40% “base” approval rating. He means to make a point and it matters not how many faceless citizens are harmed by this impetuous mean-spirited man.
It’s hard for me to read about people with severely challenged children and utility bills due and needed groceries to buy while trying to reconcile the saliva-spraying, braying president natter on about the “invasion of our borders.”
Let me know if I’m wrong but the less-than-100 presidential oath demands that the office-holder swears “...to preserve, protect and defend...”the citizens of the United States. He’s a liar when he goes on about “border security” and the like. We are not under attack.
To put innocent civilians on the line as both a weapon and a shield to shore up a campaign promise that was someone else’s idea is to throw them under the bus. Workers now being laid off, furlough, let go, fired—put it any way you want—will damage their credit long-term and their self-esteem for even longer. You’re never over losing a job—something that this president and his co-conspirator-in-chief, Mitch McConnell, have never worried about.
But here’s the thing: the dateline for this story is St. Louis. Missouri went heavily for Donald Trump in 2016 and the Show Me state, by and large, is still Trump country. They wanted him; why are they stunned by his bizarre behavior?
11
What really makes me angry is that trump is enjoying this. He loves to put people down, make people suffer, and gleefully goes along ruining our country more every day. And, the worst part of all this is that there doesn't seem to be a way to stop him. The republicans have doomed themselves; they will be left holding the bag when our vengeful leader finds a way to walk away scot free. And, if we ever return to some sense of normalcy, we must enact laws to prevent a narscisstic idiot from being allowed to savage our country again.
6
I'm not devastated. But I'm not oblivious. This is a ridiculous, incompetent, childish way to run a government. Congress needs to step in.
11
@Jim
Well, the House tried...
Count me oblivious.
3
Riddle me this.
Say I’m a “Constitutional Conservative” “Strict Constructionist” “Originalist / Textualist.”
I scour the entirety of the Constitution multiple times and find not one word nor phrase setting forth procedure for “shutting down the government.”
Now, Article I, Section 5 authorizes both Houses of Congress to set their own rules of procedure. So, I search out the current pdf copies of those, and, again, not one word nor phrase explicating shutdown processes.
The Constitution, consequently, seems to assume 24/7/365.25 operation. Just as — a good bit more explicitly — “the validity of the public debt shall not be questioned” (Amendment XIV, Section 4).
(Tangentially, neither is there any language in the Constitution for dissolving the government.” Does that require an Amendment?)
Not that I’ve checked, but I’m fairly confident that such shutdown-procedure language exists in the statutes governing operations of various federal departments and agencies — but those cannot map back to explicit Constitutional authority (recall, I’m channeling Scalia).
Just strikes me as odd. You have to do a lot of “penumbral, emanating” “construe-ing” to get there, ‘eh?
5
@Bobby Gladd
Section 9, Article 7 of the Constitution expressly provides:
"No Money shall be drawn from the Treasury, but in Consequence of Appropriations made by Law; and a regular Statement and Account of the Receipts and Expenditures of all public Money shall be published from time to time."
No appropriations = no money available to run Agencies.
2
There but the grace go God go I.......
4
... recommend, even if a bit garbled. :)
Well, the WH comment line is closed for the duration. So is the DO NOT CALL Complaint website.
I can still call my elected representatives and tell them what I want them to do. Especially when they are not voting correctly.
I encourage everyone to do the same.
8
Bravo! That is exactly what citizens should do.
I was very annoyed 2 weeks ago to discover what you know: Trump severed all communications of public direct to White House.
He only cares what Fox staff think.
1
Come on, reducing the size of the federal government has been a top item on the GOP-Libertarian-Tea Party wish list for decades. Small (or no) government is their rallying cry. Government shutdowns are boon to them, not only because it grinds into gear a major ideological achievement, but their base--many of the very people affected by said shutdown through paychecks, aid, or taxpayer funded services--believe that all this harm is being inflicted on them by Nancy Pelosi. It's a win-win for the GOP when government services, jobs, and oversight are diminished and, they hope, eventually eliminated. They don't care about anything or anyone beyond that.
5
unmentioned here are millions of rural and urban low skilled folks whose jobs have been undercut by low skilled low paid illegal immigrants.
Unemployment numbers are low but don't reflect the 25 % or so who stopped looking for work. Many of our disabled/handicapped folks potential value would increase IF things were done legally also.
Going without a government check surely makes it difficult for many.
Staunching the flow of low skilled illegal workers important. Millions of honest Americans have been hurt by it for too long with depressed wages.
5
@Lane
How does a shutdown address the (very real) issues that you raise? How does a wall?
Why don't you stop blaming immigrants, because they work the jobs you don't want to!
The corporations pocketed all that money from the tax cut. That's why there is no wage growth, even though they can't even fill their job openings anymore.
Mexicans aren't the problem, GREED is.
"As of the end of October, the Labor Department measured some 7.08 million job openings, about 1 million more than the number of unemployed people who are without a job and actively searching for work.......
.....The jobs that aren’t attracting applicants would appear to reflect the ongoing shift toward a service economy. The industries currently in the greatest need of labor include accommodation and food services, healthcare and social assistance, retail and business services."
BUT...
"Corporations have primarily opted to shower the benefits of the 2017 tax cuts on shareholders, not workers, as share buybacks cleared $1 trillion in 2018. And with markets falling and a recession potentially looming in the not-so-distant future, it seems at least possible that workers could see this historic labor market come and go without the sort of real wage growth many have been waiting on."
https://finance.yahoo.com/news/open-jobs-outnumber-unemployed-employers-190004725.html
@Lane
Show us the evidence. (FYI, Breitbart, Newsmax, and the pronouncements of anyone named Trump are not evidence.)
A divided country, now divided further, depending on what part of the federal government one works for. Also, divided, because most people do not even notice a government shutdown. Just more splintering, because of the GOP.
As for Boulder, CIRES is just one of several joint research institutes, at the University of Colorado There is JILA (Quantum Physics working with NIST), LASP (Space Research/ satellite operations; NASA). There are others, as well.
Also, there is NOAA, US Geologic Survey, and NIST (Atomic Clock). In Down in Golden NREL and USGS Seismic Monitoring Lab (earthquake).
Here, in Longmont, the main FAA Air Traffic Control center.
There are a number of people affected just within 15 miles of where live.
The good thing , if there is any, Colorado pays $600 a week in unemployment insurance, if one makes/made more than $1200/week. That lasts fro six months, with a two week waiting period.
This whole episode is partisan politics run amok. I do not blame the Democrats for this, as Trump, and the GOP, had ample opportunity to fund the government, and the wall, before Democrats took over the house. It was not funded, because fiscal conservatives did not want to spend the money.
Trump said he will shutdown the government and he will own it. He now owns this and its consequences.
All, I know is traffic is very light between Longmont and Boulder these days, as several thousand people are out of work and important research has ground to a halt.
12
@Nick Metrowsky
But they are not unemployed. How would that work?
@Mathew
Similar to when an auto factory shuts down fro retooling, the work force is put on leave. During that time, they can collect unemployment insurance. This falls under temporary layoff.
They reported here that affected federal worker can apply fro unemployment benefits. I am not sure if they have to do job search requirements or have to do a one week wait period, like one woudl do if they were permanently laid off from a job.
Forcing Federal employees to work without pay, which masks the impact the shutdown to people like Ms. Gumpel, should not be allowed. It minimizes the importance of Government in our lives and shields the people causing the shutdown (the GOP) from major political backlash. This would have been resolved a long time ago if every single National Park had shut its door, ail mail not delivered, etc... Can you imagine if all US air travel had been interrupted? Instead we are relying on Federal employees goodwill/sense of duty to get going. They should just all strike until they are paid.
12
It is totally cockamamie that the leader of our nation wants to shut the government down!
Understand President Trump is the expert on how to go bankrupt, but he is not happy with that, he has to drag good hard working people down with him. He has proven himself the Emperor of cruelty and his Republican Senators have no clothes. They all must go.
8
So Trump said give me the money for my wall (5.7 billion for border security) or I will shut down the government. And the Democrats’ response was ‘then a shut down there will be.’
Really? Why? Agree or not with Trump we aren’t asking why he’s doing this: he wants 5.7 billion towards his wall. But why would the Democrats say ‘Okay, uh, no. Go ahead and shut down the government.’
Over 5.7 billion? Come on. In Fiscal Year 2019, the federal budget will be $4.407 trillion. 5.7 billion is not an amount the Democrats of this or any other era would go on record as taking the other side in a 20-plus day government shut down over.
Is it the policy? What, border security? Quibble with how the money is spent on a ‘smart’ border or a concrete wall, but work that out and get concessions and items you want like a more humanitarian response for migrants etc.
You just don’t take the other side in a government shut down over this. I’m a progressive and lifelong Democrat. Maybe it’s been too lifelong. But this is an unexplainable move on the part of Democrats, one the media is allowing them to skate on.
What motivated the Democratic Party to shut down the government before allotting 5.7 billion to Trump for border security?We’ve been told nobody cares about illegal immigration in this country. Who cares THAT much?
OK. Point belabored. I just can’t abide shutting down the gov to protect your standing with a political base. It took 2 to tango here. Spread the blame accordingly.
3
@jammer uh, Many democrats were sworn in January. Shall I repeat that? Notice that republicans actually shut it down before democrats were sworn in. This is a man made crisis to get attention and prevent progression. Their little trick worked well. You re asking the wrong questions. Republicans never wanted the wall.
10
@jammer
If the Republicans wanted the wall, they've had 2 years of complete control to make it happen. If Trump was concerned about border security, he'd have spent the billions of dollars that have already been authorized for non-wall security measures. There is no good reason to believe the wall will stop illegal border crossings, not one shred of evidence. And there is no crisis -- illegal immigration has been dropping for nearly 20 years. There's a lot more to building Trump's wall than there would be in, say, putting a fence around the golf course. Don't oversimplify this issue, and don't take our current status out of context.
5
@jammer
This is not a tango. This is a solo turn by DJT. There was an agreement to pass funding for everything but the wall in DECEMBER. Before the Democrats became the majority in the House. When Republicans ran both chambers of Congress. The bill was passed by voice vote in the Senate, so by overwhelming majority. What happened? Why, DJT heard Ann Coulter and Rush Limbaugh say mean things about him. Immediately he switched positions and demanded several billion dollars specifically for the wall. This shutdown is due to DJT and DJT alone. He is the one who changed his position at the last minute. The shut down is continuing because Mitch McConnell knows the current House bill would pass the Senate. DJT, being a coward with the attention span of a gnat, would probably sign it (he probably would find it a relief!). Then Mitch would be the fall guy, subject to abuse and complaint from DJT, who never takes responsibility for anything. Mitch therefore will not let the Senate vote. The blame falls entirely on DJT and Mitch McConnell. Good for Speaker Pelosi, standing up to those selfish, vindictive, miserable men.
1
I wonder if all those who are affected the most care about illegal immigration. I know Trump is supposed to be the bad guy in this narrative, but the US spends almost a trillion on defense (including NATO) and yet the government couldn't care to fund 5 billion more for domestic security?
The GOP is what it is, few ever expect fair and rational human policies to come from this group, but the so-called democratic party seems to care just as little about the people considering I've never seen anyone from the left actually fight to keep their promises the way Trump is for his base. Teachers shouldn't have to strike to make education an important aspect of American growth, yet the left only seems to fight for foreign interest, such as immigrants being able to get into the country, and remain poor enough to believe the Democrats will help you rise above.
I don't care who the GOP has, I'll never vote Democrat again after Obama's failures basically handed Trump the presidency. Obama was supposed to be a new hope for change, yet he killed hope for anyone not an immigrant or gay.
Hopefully the green party gains a greater base as voting Republican or Democrat is a vote for foreign interest over American interest.
5
@Adam
Thank you for sharing. I agree with you on a lot of this. While I do not support the wall and think it is a stupid hill to die on, intelligent immigration reform is needed. It is really too bad that urgent need is being obfuscated by Trump's insistence on the wall because a lot of what he's saying about immigration is otherwise spot on and not too dissimilar to what the Democrats were saying just a few years ago.
Also appreciate that you make the important distinction between the Green and Democrat parties. It is baffling how so many people think those parties are interchangeable and that if the Greens can't win, the Democrats are the next best thing. It is so sadly, painfully wrong. The Democrats & Republicans are too scarily similar- one is not better than the other even if a few small details differ in practice. After all this turmoil, I hope that new politics and new parties emerge giving this country a real choice and fighting chance.
3
@Adam Socal You are seriously misinformed. Voting for a third party now when electoral college is in place when areas are close in totals from each party guarantees an outcome opposite to what you might hope...
@irish
Neither Red nor Blue party are ever the lesser of two evils anymore. I'm convinced now that for a very long time both of those parties have been working together for their personal interest under the guise of democracy as representatives of the people. I can't say I've ever felt represented in my government. Worse, that is because I can't afford to buy my government.
It's not democracy if you have to buy airtime to have a voice.
Who wants to babysit or hold a garage sale?
Not only are the federal workers being stiffed of their hard-earned money, they are also being insulted.
And remember, McConnell is getting paid, his staff is getting paid. This, with their daily stipend, too.
So much winning!
8
@Opinioned!
If Congress wasn't getting paid during this shutdown, I doubt this shutdown would be going on as long as it has - or at all!
8
Trump had the luxury of Republican Senate and House majorities his first two years in office. Why didn’t he tell McConnell and Ryan to send him a bill to sign for his “beautiful wall” that he promised his supporters.
Trump knew Mexico wouldn’t pay for the wall, but his gullible base gobbled up every one of his lies like candy during the 2016 campaign, as they do now without fail.
Trump, the republican leadership of McConnell and McCarthy, and all complicit republicans are solely responsible for the Shutdown. Let’s hope their downfall will come in 2020 at the voting booth.
11
Thank you NY Times for a balanced story on this topic! The media pundits in the past 2 days have been painting a picture of people everywhere facing financial ruin. This is misleading to say the least. The average Federal salary is $85,000/yr. If you can't make it for a month without a paycheck you're doing something terribly wrong.
Those who are suffering are the likes of TSA workers who only make $30,000/yr..
So it's a very mixed bag on the level of hardship but the media paints a picture of disaster everywhere. Their are a few to be sure but it's not widespread.
8
Does anyone truly believe that Mr. Trump or anyone who associates with him gives a whit about the lives of the people they are playing with?
10
Isn’t Trump’s use of a government shutdown in order to get government funding for a wall extortion? And isn’t extortion a criminal offence?
8
The shutdown has had almost no effect. If anything it's made life better, I interact with a few agencies FAA, ATF, NFS and across the board service has improved!
Turnaround for requests & filings seem to have shortened & the people I interact with are friendlier & more professional. It's like the few people there are actually working!
This shutdown has shown the government is way too bloated & would do better with fewer employees. Fortunately for the workers are out of a job in one of the best job markets ever, so getting a better private sector job should be easy!
2
While I have an income and have been affected very little financially by the shutdown (so far), I am hardly oblivious. Not only do I feel for the workers who have gone without pay, I'm outraged that my "elected" representatives have shirked their duty. Republican senators should be knocking McConnell's door off its hinges. I've complained repeatedly to my two senators (more useless public servants one can't imagine), and everybody else should complain to theirs, especially the Republican ones. The root of "Republican" is "res publica," the public business (loosely translated), and we're the public. I don't think Republicans are doing their jobs. Give them heck now and fire them come 2020.
10
Why does the US even fund the government this way? If it requires a constitutional amendment to stop this method then so be it. The (once) most powerful country in the world and its leaders just look like a bunch of buffoons allowing this to happen on a regular basis.
3
I declare a national emergency already exists. One quarter of the American government is shut down. 400,000 workers are without paychecks. Millions of Americans are feeling the effect of the president's intransigence. Invoke the 25th amendment and rid the country of this wheels and walls fanatic.
7
"An eye for an eye leaves everyone blind"...or something similar.
This is just awful to even read. The childish people in charge are out to prove how much more childish they can get--but still collect their paychecks.
What is really needed is a law to prevent this from happening.
5
Tragic, mean, and unnecessary. I do think the Dems (of which I proudly count myself) blew it here too.
A superb opportunity for horse trading and immediately ending the government shut-down was lost. The Dems should have traded $5.7 billion for comprehensive immigration reform and a path to citizenship for the Dreamers. For about $570 a person, illegals would have become legal, employers would keep their employees, landlords their tenants, and Dreamers their future.
That WAS the deal on the table before Nancy too quickly said a blanket "no" and Trump stormed out of the room.
And now our federal employees continue to pay the price, along with Dreamers, families, employers, and the overall economy.
A missed opportunity.
6
@Michael I disagree. Nancy and Chuck have to make it clear that they will not negotiate in bad faith. Remember, the republican-controlled senate and congress approved $1.6 billion. But then Trump got scared his base would bolt on him, and reneged.
Now, he's trying to claim a wall is needed to address a "crisis" and "emergency." But clearly a wall of this magnitude would take years if not decades to build -- meaning it is inherently inappropriate and ineffective for a crisis (assuming one really existed).
Moreover, in trying to lay out his case for the wall, he distorts facts (also known as lying). Case in point: conflating U.S. drug deaths with border refugees when most of these deaths are due to Rx drugs made by US companies and fentanyl smuggled from China.
You don't negotiate with people like that. The Dems in charge of Congress have to set the tone clearly now about how they will play ball going forward. They have to make it clear that you have to work with us in good faith -- or we're not playing.
Its like dealing with a petulant spoiled child. The parent has to keep saying no until he gets it. Like Pelosi with Trump.
5
@Wendy
Actually, under any normal circumstances (and I negotiate contracts for a living) I would agree with you. The only reason I don't in this case is because the man is not normal, never will be, is only getting worse, and isn't going to learn anything about the other's good faith, etc. My god, he calls Rex Tillerson "dumb as a rock"; his own former Secretary of State. (But I digress....)
In this situation, Wendy, I think if there was even an instant that the Dems could have pulled off the deal I suggested in my original post, they should have tried for it. He needed a win. He would have had it. They would have got immigration reform! They would have claimed that TOGETHER they ended the shut-down and democracy works and now we're going to eat marshmellows and sing kumbaya...
I totally agree with you on the $1.6 Billion, distortion, his base, a pretend crisis of his own fabrication. But on seizing that moment to actually horse trade, we must agree to disagree.
1
Why should we be amazed that millions of our fellow Americans are oblivious to the shutdown? As long as Americans believe the only people impacted are "way off in D.C." rather than their own cities; they simply do not care. Offices around the nation like SBA , HUD, USDA-,EPA all have locals, now out of work.
We have a president who wants us to view his government shutdown like a "Strike". And now, one of his Economic Advisers-Kevin Hassett likens the forced-out-of-work Americans to "being on vacation."
“A huge share of government workers were going to take vacation days, say, between Christmas and New Year’s. And then we have a shutdown, and so they can’t go to work, and so then they have the vacation, but they don’t have to use their vacation days. And then they come back, and then they get their back pay. Then they’re — in some sense, they’re better off.”
(PBS-News Hour interview-1/10/19).
3
Trump doesn't care.
He takes care of coal country because that's symbolic Americana for his base.
Upstate New Yorkers in depressed areas?
He tells them to abandon their homes and move to Milwaukee because he thinks the FoxConn con was good for the country.
Remember when Macy's made huge job cuts during his first campaign and he gloated about how great that was -- all because they removed Ivanka's product from their shelves.
He's a tiny, tiny, little man for whom it's:
Trump First
Party Second
America Last
8
@D.A.Oh
NIPSCO in Indiana (Pence's home state) is CLOSING five coal generation plants, on an accelerated schedule.
Parent company is NiSource.
Pence and Trump are LYING about the coal industry. coming back. But there are a lot of gullible people out there.
1
Does anyone remember the movie "Wag The Dog"?
The basic plot was creating an international crisis to divert the country's attention away from a presidential sex scandal.
Is this movie one of Trump's (and his advisers) favorites?
To quote a "Yogi-ism", it feels like deja vu all over again....
4
All federal law enforcement needs to walk out . Enough is enough , they don’t appreciate you
3
This story seems so obvious, but yet the title encapsulates everything perfectly. Americans do micro empathy so well (thousands of GoFundMe dollars raised for all sorts of personal tragedies), but do macro empathy so poorly (800k federal employees are a bunch of faceless bureaucrats). It's strange that to many of us, familiar individuals are people, but groups of unfamiliar individuals are only concepts in our brains.
2
It's hard for me to grasp why anyone should be so surprised that Trump shut down essential government services while devastating the livelihood of thousands of American workers. I expected this kind of action from Trump which points to a childish egomaniac who would do anything to be noticed. To all those unemployed federal workers who gave Trump their vote, I hope you'll be more logical next time.
2
Of course the president and congress continue to get paid. Imagine how quickly this ridiculous mess would be resolved if _their_ pay was suspended.
5
The best definition of middle class is the ability to go six months without any income or employment insurance benefit & pay all the bills.... Anything less is working poor paycheck to paycheck. It is a gross understatement to say that most Americans live beyond their means and don't save enough.
3
It shouldn't have to take being personally touched by this shutdown to see it as deeply obscene. How much more immoral does something have to be than people being forced to work without pay, and being fired if they refuse, before we're outraged?
... Never mind how it affects you and me directly!
4
Be careful what you wish for. Be even more careful in what you VOTE for.
Lesson learned ??? I sincerely hope so. We'll see in 2020.
5
If we give Republicans the wall; it’s a slippery slope to them demanding a return to “Whites Only” accommodations.
This battle isn’t about “border security.” It is about the all white largely Southern GOP desire that the US be a country where only white Christians have rights.
8
“It’s very frustrating,” Ms. Rasmussen said, “that wall is going straight through the country, not between us and Mexico.”
This is what happens when you elect a President who had/has no interest in governing a "United" States--he's only interested in pandering to the segment of the country that feeds his overblown ego.
Every President before him that I can recall has made an effort (with varying success) after the election to pivot from the campaign trail in order to become the president of the entire country. Trump on the other hand continues to act, 2 years into his presidency, like every event he attends is a campaign rally whether it's a meet and greet with the press, visit to our troops overseas, or a stop to meet with hurricane victims.
The only segment of the population that this abomination of a president is interested in serving is the ultra-rich to whom he very quickly gave tax breaks to after he was elected and that's only because he's part of that group. Everyone else will need to find a way to survive the chaos he intentionally creates because being president is nothing but a game to him. Whether or not you voted for this man, he literally could not care less what happens to you.
8
What about indigenous people? Native Americans whose healthcare is dependent on support from the government. They are left high and dry.
7
They should stop work in all airports used by the people who are the problem - Trump and McConnell, and all Republican senators who are not pushing for a vote to reopen the government. The people who are the problem should feel the pain.
And yeah, if I were TSA in Washington DC, I think I'd be feeling nauseous - could be due to the politicians, but might be the flu, better call in sick!
1
Reading the headlines that fill the news from every source 2 things are clear.
Trump is incompetent and creating havoc at every turn.
He is a slow release weapon of mass destruction installed by Putin.
I'll add one more, the GOP are complicit war profiteers.
4
Trump seems to be dragging out the "national emergency" declaration, and I doubt he would end the shutdown even if he got the 5.7b, which, of course, would be a small down payment on his monstrosity. I really think he is trying to kill off large numbers of federal jobs by forcing the "deep state" out of work. He wants to strip down the federal government until it only contains "men with guns," presumably under his control. I would say under his direction, but he doesn't have a direction.
3
"The Art of the Deal" = Criminal abuse of power: Hurt Americans until Americans give one man, afforded power by a minority of people and a corrupt party, what he wants -- whether what he wants is viable or not, matters not in the least.
Trump and the Republicans had two years of unbridled power to get money for Trump's great conceit, his wall. They did not then think it was viable or necessary. But suddenly now they do? Hypocrites, every one of them. And despicable, too, for willing to further hurt the American people for the sake of politics.
The only emergency this country faces is the one at the head of this government.
2
Senate Republicans are just as responsible for this shutdown as Trump is -- especially Mitch McConnell, who refuses to bring to the Senate floor any measure that's supported by Democrats and which proposes to re-open the government, for the sole reason that he knows Trump wouldn't approve it. Republican Senators like McConnell are failing to uphold their oath to provide a check on trump's out-of-control presidency. Start calling the Senate switchboard at (202) 224-3121 to demand that Mitch McConnell bring back to the floor the bill that the Senate passed unanimously on December 18 that funded the government without funding a wall. Phone numbers for Mitch McConnell's other offices are as follows:
Washington, DC Phone: (202) 224-2541 Louisville, KY Phone: (502) 582-6304 Lexington, KY 40503 Phone: (859) 224-8286 Fort Wright, KY 41011 Phone: (859) 578-0188 London, KY 40741 Phone: (606) 864-2026
4
Senate Republicans are just as responsible for this shutdown as Trump is. Especially Mitch McConnell, who refuses to bring to the Senate floor any measure that's supported by Democrats and which proposes to re-open the government, for the sole reason that he knows Trump wouldn't approve it. Republican Senators like McConnell are failing to uphold their oath to provide a check on trump's out-of-control presidency. Start calling the Senate switchboard at (202) 224-3121 to demand that Mitch McConnell bring back to the floor the bill that the Senate passed unanimously on December 18 that funded the government without funding a wall. Phone numbers for Mitch McConnell's other offices are as follows:
Washington, DC Phone: (202) 224-2541 Louisville, KY Phone: (502) 582-6304 Lexington, KY 40503 Phone: (859) 224-8286 Fort Wright, KY 41011 Phone: (859) 578-0188 London, KY 40741 Phone: (606) 864-2026
4
I don't take pleasure in anyone being out of work and struggling, but these are government employees, this will turn into a paid vacation. They're going to collect their back-pay for the time they were off.
Also, not for nothing...government employees. Do you know how much time they've stolen from people (from you!) through lacksadaisical, bureaucratic time-waste?
They'll be fine.
2
Every effort and every action this president supports weakens the US and it’s citizens. A president who loves his country wouldn’t punish his citizens
That’s just not how a republic works
5
Any fed employee should have seen this by last March. Pres said he was gonna shut down the government if he didn’t get his wall during the previous funding fiasco where Schumer started the weekend shutdown.
Following that fiasco I paid off my credit cards and saved as much as I could. Skipped vacation and lived frugally. Managed to get a few months savings in anticipation of the next shutdown which eventually materialized though he said he would do it in September. As a non appropriated employee I do NOT receive back pay should my agency exhaust reserves.
Folks I know it’s not easy to save because life happens however do what you can. Live frugally sell stuff if need be.
Because there will be another shutdown...
4
Trump is worried about impeachment and wants to change the conversation. It is better to be impeached because he is a valiant warrior against the evils of illegal immigration than for a tawdry affair with Stormy Daniels. So if the government shutdown lasts beyond the Congressional testimony of Michael Cohen on Trump's hush money payments, maybe Trump can keep our attention on the shutdown.
The sad fact is that Trump started from a position that had a kernel of truth. It is in fact true that US population has increased by 86 million people since 1986, when Congress passed an Immigration Reform Bill which was largely ignored. Since birth rates were at about replacement level, the increase is mostly due to immigration.
Many on the right feel that Democrats lied when they argued that illegal immigration is a net benefit to the economy. Democrats try to reason from authority, failing to mention that macroeconomics itself does not have models with predictive value, making it easy to argue opposite sides of the question.
I believe that immigration has caused states like California to shift funding from universities to K12 sending tuition rates higher and decreasing the number of physicians trained, the result being higher medical costs. But I am not an expert, and many would disagree.
Poor whites go to the emergency room for medical care and wait behind Spanish-speaking families with many children. They don't believe the New York Times editorials or the experts cited.
2
@Jake Wagner
ER care is triaged with those most in need of care being attended to first. Are you suggesting that whites should be attended to first regardless of the extent of their illness or injuries? I don't agree with that and btw I oppose illegal immigration.
Sen. Mitch McConnell refuses to be just the majority leader of the Senate, a body of independently elected senators each including him having only one vote. Instead McConnell has opted to become the Only Federally Elected Senator of the U.S., claiming its President will not sign a Bill reopening our government because he said so. Yet hasn’t officially done so in writing; which is the constitutionally mandated act of rejecting a Bill. Which in turn could be overridden by a 2/3 majority of the Senate & House.
If Sen. McConnell followed his Oath of Office and did his Constitutional duty; the Public and federal workers will at the very least have all their elected representatives on the record and thus answerable to them. Forcing ‘each’ voting official to express their decisions with others as public stewards not sheep. The one person-one vote rule is authority
Legislator’s who inhibit others from Law Making have breached their fiduciary duties as public officials. A fully operating ‘open’ government is our quintessential social apparatus within which public democracy and our Republic exist at taxpayers’ expense! Negotiations like other activities are incidental to governance not the government itself. Who knows, Trump may forget to take timely action on a Bill and then it automatically becomes law. Then further steps in that regard may proceed and McConnell knows this! Completed Bills are by negotiations and I hope the Media hammers him to move things along!
1
This is on Trump, and he will rue the day.
8
Trump hasnt got what it takes to rue anything. That should be obvious.
I have an idea. How about saving for a rainy day? Work to get six months worth of savings in your account so when these situations unfold you can handle it.
What are the mathematical odds of tens of millions of people spending EXACTLY the amount of money, down to the dime, that he/she has worked for over several decades? Manage your money so when the inevitable rains come you can weather the storm.
I am a small-business owner and I understand this. Too many American do not, unfortunately.
6
@James - That sounds simple, but since most people live from paycheck to paycheck, saving for a 'rainy day' is not an easy task. Even if they manage to put some money aside, acquiring six months of savings, even three months would be quite difficult, especially when you consider those small unexpected things that come up and you have to dip into it.
11
@james..as a small businessman you understand this? You sound as out of touch as Trump. There are millions of workers living pay cheque to pay cheque who would love to earn enough to save for a rainy day...unfortunately rent, utilities, clothing, food needs get in the way.
12
Yes, one would hope that everyone has the foresight and the necessary extra income that allows them to put aside 6 months in an emergency fund. You understand that and it sounds as though you have not been burdened by low wages, increased cost of living and health insurance, student loans and raising a family in this economy. I have raised fiscally conservative children, all who have emergency funds. But if any of them worked for the Federal Government and were currently furloughed, I would highly and rightly resent them having to use those funds to cover expenses generated because they are political pawns in the Presidents game of “who blinks first”. And that is all this is; he created the crisis, the Republicans in the House and Senate could have avoided this while they were in the majority, yet made the choice not to address and pass legislation for immigration reform and are co-conspirators in this debacle. Please don’t blame the victims in this one, place it where it belongs; The Oval Office.
15
Oblivious to Other's concerns. Isn't that what the "O" in GOP stands for. Whether it's fighting real wars overseas or imaginary ones at our borders, the GOP are oblivious to cost, economic effects, lives lost, reputations lost and now generals, experts and diplomats being ignored. This wouldn't hurt so much if it weren't for the fact that Oblivious is also what the "O" in DON stands for.
8
The solution is simple, demand Speaker Pelosi and Senator Schumer allocate 5 billion in next year's federal budget to include a physical barrier at the southern border.
There, problem solved.
3
@F1Driver
Why didn't our president "demand" Paul Ryan and Mitch McConnell allocate the money in the 2017 budget and/or 2018 budget when the GOP controlled both chambers of Congress? You also realize the 'barrier' will cost an estimated $25-28 billion dollars not $5 billion?
8
@F1Driver Or the president admits this is one of the goofiest ideas he's ever had and drops his demand for a wall.
There, problem solved.
6
@F1Driver Nope. The problem only worsens if Democrats give into trump's juvenile demands to fund what would be a monument to trump's vanity, nothing more. The U.S. doesn't negotiate with hostage takers like trump.
6
A great lesson for all (especially those with good jobs like every one in the federal government) you must have a 3 - 6 months emergency fund. That way if you have bills and are out of work for whatever reason you have time to adjust. If you don't have this do whatever you can to have it. Now poor people probably can't do this.
10
Most jobs in the fed government are average like the rest of the economy either way I get your point about saving for a rainy day
3
@vulcanalex
Not sure if your are being serious or extremely condescending. Millions (even Government Workers) live at or just above the poverty line for their communities. Hundreds of thousands of Federal Jobs are not GS rated; many are low level entry jobs and many thousands are sub-contracted out at just-above Federal minimum wage.
9
The uncertainty really adds to the stress for affected people.
It's one thing to know that a paycheck will be delayed for X number of days; it's another to hear the President say that he is happy to keep the shutdown going for "months or years".
I really sympathize. I remember waiting for a delayed paycheck one year when the CA legislature was at a budget impasse.
And I know what it's like to scramble to find a job after a disaster--in my case, the Northridge earthquake--which forced me to find a new job because my place of employment was badly damaged, and I didn't know how long it would take for the job site to re-open.
It is no fun--and Congress should take steps to end the shutdown fast and write legislation to prohibit it from happening again.
6
So you're calling Pelosi to push for a better compromise?
I contacted both the Republicans and Democrats who represent my state, and said that I absolutely expect them to get the government opened again, pronto. End the hostage taking of 800,000 federal workers, plus federal contractors.
2
I recall Trump was already to sign a budget extension until republican pundits (e.g. Coulter, Limbaugh, etc.) called him out on it. Trump quickly folded and shut down the government.
32
But it's all part of the Bannon-Trump war to deconstruct the "Administrative State." That's what 63 million people voted for. That's what the House of Representatives/Electoral College voted for. Some people have changed their minds. Many of those people are now victims of the rotten decision they made. They feel the punishment that comes with having made foolish choices. That's what democracy is all about, people.
46
@Max & Max
Excuse me; this is not what deconstruction means. It does not mean destruction.
1
@Sheila Teahan Well, tell that to Trump. You gave him your vote. How he accomplishes this is no longer in your hands.
1
@Sheila Teahan
Um, what part of "drown in a bathtub" did you not understand?
YES, they WERE talking about the vital services that you and people like you NEEDED. You just weren't listening. You thought they didn't mean you. You thought they meant bad people, not like you. You're deserving. They weren't going to take your candy--only that government other (poor, brown, undeserving) people needed.
SMH.
They're taking EVERYONE'S government, whether we need it or not.
Come on, guys. Federal employees are not hurting. Congress has already passed legislation guaranteeing they will get paid, eventually, so it's free money for the banks.
4
@batazoid
Not everyone has a great deal of savings in the bank, many people live paycheck to paycheck. So I think people are hurting. For people with little or no savings, they will not be able to pay rent or make a mortgage payment. If you have money saved for emergencies, you are in a fortunate place. Not everyone is in the same place. People are hurting.
36
@Lily Any adult should know better than to get into the situation of working paycheck-to-paycheck. We all need to save for the inevitable rainy days.
I am a small-business owner and understand this very well. Too many Americans spend every single dime every month, and wait for the next check to come. This is absolutely juvenile and I have zero sympathy for a federal workers, who get paid relatively well, has great benefits, etc., moaning that they cannot make their bills.
How about creating a rainy-day fund?!
3
@James
I agree that everyone should save for a rainy day. I am fortunate that I am in that position, and so are you. But not everyone is.
I agree too that people spend too much on unnecessary things and lack budgeting skills and foresight.
I can depend on my employer depositing my pay into my account and these people thought they could rely on their employer to do the same. Now their employer is not doing that. That is the part that is unfair.
Not everyone is affluent enough to have extra money in a rainy day fund. Not everyone is so privileged.
We should all be compassionate towards other people. Even if we don't agree with their choices, we should recognize they are hurting and be sympathetic to their plight.
10
The fact the some people are completely oblivious about the shutdown astounds me.
Those who are not bothered or don't care will eventually feel the effects at some point if the shutdown lasts long enough.
22
@cl I don't care. I work for myself and don't expect the government to pay me.
This is all just a big silly circus that could be avoided if more of us were adults and actually created a rainy-day fund to weather such inevitable storms.
I have little sympathy for these cash-strapped federal workers. They have shown financial irresponsibility by getting themselves into the paycheck-to-paycheck death spiral. They make a good wage, no excuses for this.
1
@James 1) You know ideah what people's salaries are. You are assuming since they are an EMPLOYEE of the government they make an above average salary. 2) These people are EMPLOYEES they aren't people waiting for some handout. They deserve to be paid for their work. 3) Whats with all the judging? the average Americans can afford an unexpected $500 emergency, much less missing an entire check.
8
@James
You tell 'em!!!
Now explain that to farmers who need loans and bailouts for everything they do..
Why aren't THEY saving for the rainy day?
Why do I have to pay for soybeans?
4
This will probably get lost in the sea of political hot takes, but I’m wondering how I can help. What sort of things can an every day person like me do to help these families? I’m sure there are many other people wondering the same thing...
22
@Ginger Adams You can send them your paycheck, pay their rent/mortgage, buy them groceries?
Or better yet, let this be a learning moment for them, and hopefully they will learn to save for these rainy days.
1
Would the NYT consider accepting contributions and distributing them to the desperate people who are caught in this Trump federal shutdown debacle? I would contribute.
3
It’s difficult to say on the individual level, but the biggest help for now are the backs and companies that are willing to postpone payment deadlines until workers get paid.
2
Has everyone forgotten the President's habit of not paying individuals who have contracted for him and ignoring their pain and trials as a result? He was indifferent to them when it was his own money; why would he even consider federal workers' pain when he has no economic horse in this race at all?
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@Keith West
People seem to think his scorn is only for FEDERAL workers (which for some reason makes it okay?). But it's only a matter of time before he starts gunning for everyone else...
2
@J B That, and the fact that his goal is for
'smaller' government speaks volumes. So whenever I hear another office is understaffed and positions are not being filled it tells me they are fulfilling their goal.
I don't usually have much sympathy for people who choose to work for an unreliable employer. However, in their defense, their employer was fairly reliable for a couple hundred years before 11/6/17.
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I wouldn't count on Trump's supporters feeling the pinch. Most of the government workers lean toward the Democrats and Trump's supporters, like their leader, couldn't care less about human suffering. As long as it is not their own.
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@Mysticelder
Read the NYT article about hardships in farm country:
they are feeling the pinch. But at least for some of them it doesn't seem to diminish their support for Trump.
That, and Mitch McConnell, are the heart of the problem.
14
Democrats need to keep the focus on Senate Republicans. There is no point in trying to guilt Trump into backing down because he doesn't give one iota for the hardship this is causing many Americans.
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@Nomad Many??? today was the first missed paycheck, and all these folks should have an emergency fund. They might get jobs as well.
1
I don't understand the point of this story. People have been laid off, their lives turned upside down, and are suffering. Everyone should have known that this is the result of shutting the government down, that it is a terrible thing to do to people innocently doing a job that actually helps fellow Americans. Either Fox News and the President didn't know that this would be the result or they didn't care. My vote is for the latter - they don't care that innocent people are being harmed because this is all just a power game to them.
That is the only story concerning the shutdown that you should be reporting. There are no two sides to this debate - one side wanted the shutdown (Trump proudly stated that he would take the responsibility) and the other side wants to return to Constitutionally designated processes. In doing the latter the one side loses an advantage and that advantage is harming innocents in order to get what they want. They don't care about innocents, they don't care about government, they don't care about damage - they care about winning.
The reality is Fox and Trump have never suffered the consequences of their actions. Sadly it is Main Stream Media that could call for consequences but they are too cowed, too beaten, too beholden to the rules set by the Right (the need to be fair and balanced) to actually report the truth and facts without fear. How many more stories about suffering before you do what needs to be done and declare loudly the truth?
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@Lucas Lynch
The point of this article is not about attributing blame. I don't see that at all.
The article is about varying nature of the shutdown.
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@cl I understand that this story is not about attributing blame and it is about actual people and their suffering. But if someone was pouring boiling oil on someone else's head, is it enough just to report the damage being done? Everyone should already know that boiling oil shouldn't be poured on another's head because it causes great damage.
People shouldn't be suffering. This isn't a natural disaster or act of God. They didn't put themselves in danger and did nothing wrong - just the contrary they are doing jobs that benefit fellow Americans. They are suffering because of one man who listened to others who don't care if innocent people are harmed.
Trump's authority is derived through the Constitution. He should know full well that there is a process for funding government projects that is set forth in the Constitution. Because one man wants to circumvent this process and defy the Constitutional order and causes people harm by his actions then that man is wholly responsible for the damage done. It is just this simple but nobody with authority or clout has the strength to say it.
8
Have ask yourself who really kept Federal Worker without Paychecks.
Yes, Senator Mitch McConnell of Great State Kentucky with Pop. 4.5 millions. He really scare of Donald Trump, his wife work from his cabinet and got her check and McConnell .
All Fed. Worker all ran down to Kentucky protest around Mc Connell house. And tell how feel without paychecks.
34
Solution to the mess: make sure house and senate members and White House workers don’t get paid during any government shutdown going forward. Watch how quick it ceases to be political.
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@Anna, unfortunately, many of them are independently wealthy millionaires. They couldn't care less if they don't get a government paycheck for a while.
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@Anna I agree but a better solution for the future is to get the budget passed months before the previous one runs out and to compromise somewhat. Add in all of congress staff as well.
1
But they DO care about their exceptionally generous healthcare benefits!! Are THOSE being affected?
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By the time Greece was informed by the EU that there would be no more loans, something like 51% of the public was hired by the central government. Same situation for entities like the Palestinian Authority and Gaza; central government jobs are more of a make work program than a use of tax money to provide services. I really hate to say this, but this shutdown may be symptomatic of the federal government realizing that there is a deficit, and we need to decide to either spend less or tax more. And another suggestion: I've had decades of hearing that government jobs are not real jobs, you can't fire federal workers, both of which propositions I disagree with violently. How many hard working, diligent regulators are prevented from doing their jobs well by decades of understaffing and overwork? As we reassemble the federal work force, can we think about, oh, just a few examples, having enough federal regulators to check a more reasonable number of boats sailing into our ports? Visiting drug manufacturers in China at more than once every ten years? Actually looking at trucks coming over our border at some rate that gives you a reasonable chance of discovering drugs? If you've suddenly decided how much you value federal workers, help them do their jobs.
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@Mary
I thought you were going somewhere, and then got to "we need to decide to either spend less or tax more." Well, maybe so, but the shutdown has nothing to do with spending less. Federal workers will get back pay after the shutdown ends... even if they were not at work. And when they do return, those hard-working, diligent workers will have an even larger work backlog.
1
Mitch McConnell has too much power. No man, alone, should have the power over the livelihood of 800k federal employees and even more government contractors. McConnell's refusal to allow a vote or consideration of any funding bill passed by the House, especially bills that can withstand a Trump veto, is an insult to our representative form of government.
We have not one dictator-in-chief; we have two: McConnell and Trump. This can not stand!
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@Andrew Bermant No bill without border security funding can overcome a veto so it is just a waste of time, sort of how compromise with some is as well.
@Andrew Bermant The Senate can choose a new majority leader at any time, it just takes a majority. So the Republicans could elect another of their own or 4 could defect to the Democrats. Yes McConnell is holding the government hostage, but only because the other Republican senators allow him.
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@vulcanalexThe Democratic bill has REAL border security (not lying campaign propaganda fantasy border security) funding in it.
If brought up for a senate vote it will pass.
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Elections have consequences. Remember this travesty in 2020. Remember this mess for the rest of your lives. This was predictable in 2016. Blame for this is easily assigned and it is not on people who voted for Clinton. It is not on people who voted for democrats. Please remember who is hurting the country, be honest about it, and vote accordingly. Otherwise this will continue to happen.
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@arusso Greens. Basically, you are blaming Greens. For voting for their Green Party canditate. Give it a rest already, Democrats need to take responsibility for failing to earn voters' support!
@CP
What it looks like to me is that Democrats are way better than Republicans, healthcare, budget deficits, education, the environment, EPA, keeping an eye on Wall St., and the list goes on.
But people then complain for Democrats doing a quarter of the bad things Republicans do and then vote for Republicans.
9
@CP
Democrats need not take responsibility for those who weren't willing to compromise and didn't do what was best for the country. Hillary won the majority vote. People in purple states such as mine, and I know one personally, who refused to vote and even threatened to vote for Trump that helped him get elected. Give it up. Let's move on and work together willing to understand that compromise is necessary and everything can't be accomplished immediately.
1
"Some Americans Are Devastated, Others Oblivious"
In addition to the shutdown's effects, this headline captures our response to the crisis of climate change, administrative corruption, the disturbing resurgence of hate groups, and the alarming decline of our democracy, generally, since Trump surfaced.
A democratic nation cannot function when a good portion of the electorate is accurately labeled "oblivious."
The fact-adverse and those who take advantage of them are well on their way to destroying the common good.
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@C. Whiting, what a perfect assessment.
Well, Trump, the "brilliant businessman", is running the government the way he ran his businesses. Getting people to do the work and then not paying.
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@Richie by
Followed by declaring bankruptcy.
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@Richie by-Except for Trump's staff who ARE getting paid by us taxpayers. There are 21 White House employees paid $179,700. Partial list: Stephen Miller, Sarah Huckabee Sanders, Kellyanne E. Conway, John Bolton, Daniel J. Scavino (who also writes a lot of Trump's tweets). Moreover, senior Trump admin staff and political appointees were to get automatic $10K raises this month.
https://www.thedailybeast.com/senior-trump-officials-will-get-dollar10000-raises-while-federal-employees-stay-furloughed-wapo
https://www.cnbc.com/2018/06/29/these-are-the-21-highest-paid-staffers-in-the-white-house.html
14
@Richie by Who in Congress has done the work. The country, regardless of their political beliefs, should be outraged at this do nothing Congress. I know everyone here pretty much hates Trump and I am no fan, but do you want your country to function or would you rather see it go down as long as you take Trump out of office? Seriously, I'm asking as I want to know.
This whole thing is about trump not being able to be presidential. Because if he was the government would not be shut down for a fence. If the vote is taken by both houses to reopen the government and sent to the president to sign into law and he vetoes it what is the next step? If there are enough votes to override the veto the bill to open the government becomes law. So why is the republican leader of the senate not bring the bill to the floor for a vote?
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@Wade
Because probably he is counting on the Democrats taking the blame. It is too much to expect McConnell to do anything that is in our best interests.
14
The news stated that today, Friday, is the first missed paycheck and that everyone will be reimbursed when the shutdown ends.
I feel very sorry for the stress that people are feeling and dealing with- mortgage payments, car payments, and everything else.
Hopefully, this shutdown ends soon and the banks and other companies that are owed money have kind consideration of those on furlough.
The takeaway for me, going forward, is that everyone should try and save a minimum of 3 months of living expenses for any future layoff, illness, car trouble or other possibility. Relying on family or friends to help out is not always an option.
5
@mainesummers retroactive pay for furloughed personnel (as opposed to those working unpaid) is not guaranteed at this time. It requires passage of special legislation by Congress.
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@Working Mama thankfully the Senate this week passed a bill approving backpay, and I believe the House passed it today as well. Just Trump needs to sign it. Now if they could only do the same about the appropriations themselves...
5
@mainesummers That's assuming that people make enough money to be able to save, which isn't the case for many workers. The Times' article on TSA workers stated that they generally make around $35,000 per year. It very hard to save money when you're living paycheck to paycheck.
15
One of the attributes that, up until now, has made the US a functional and successful country is a non-politicized civil service that attracted, on the whole, well-qualified workers, some of whom gave up opportunities for more lucrative careers either for the stability of working for the government or from a sense of civic duty. Losing the guarantee of a regular paycheck will cost the government good workers as people get fed up and leave, or don't consider working for the government in the first place. I'm afraid that the long term consequence of failing to pay these workers, even if it is just short term, will be a less competent civil service, and poorer ability for our government to continue the current conditions that have allowed scientific research, innovation and new businesses to thrive in the US. Once again, Trump and the GOP support a policy that goes against the long term interests of the USA.
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@MRW
Has anyone considered that that Trump is working for the Russians. He may not be directly doing it, but he's into them for a great deal of money. He seemed willing to throw NATO overboard. He is, with the help of republicans who according the Dallas News also took Russian money, weakening America.
7
This is the dichotomy that faces us. If the problem doesn't affect us in an immediate way, should we ignore it? We'd better decide. There is no crystal ball when trouble strikes and "we need a little help from our friends."
16
The House passed a bill today requiring that all government workers receive retroactive pay after the partial shutdown ends. The Senate approved the bill unanimously and the president is expected to sign the legislation.
Given the payments will be made retroactively, what is the rational for continued shutdown? Does McConnel has any moral ground on why he is still blocking bills for opening the respective agencies that have nothing to do with wall funding. This seems mostly theatrics now.
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@NMT
And 7 House members voted against.
Those names should be broadcast for all the world to pity.
12
I hope every local news or talk station, tv and radio, airs stories about local people suffering from this shutdown. There will eventually be a universal outcry to stop this madness.
74
We talk too little about the people whole really lose income because of the shutdown: the federal contract workers and the businesses that depend on an open government. They will not recuperate their losses when the shutdown is over. The actual federal workers is likely going to be paid retroactively making the shutdown more of an inconvenience than a threat to their livelihood.
28
Republicans always said they believe in a "trickle down economy".
And now, with the shutdown, it is here.
It is disgraceful that members of Congress are accepting pay while the shutdown continues.
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@Jean
Agrees, but It is shameful only for shutdown supporting Republican members of congress to accept their pay while their shutdown continues.
6
@Jean: Many members of Congress have voluntarily forgone their pay until the shutdown ends, either by requesting that it be withheld or donating it. The last count I saw was 71 members.
@Louise Big deal. An interruption in their pay could go on for years before they feel it.
I am a parent. I have friends with kids in public school. I can say in all honesty that the federal shutdown has not affected us at all. Not one bit. It makes one wonder what in the Federal budget could be safely axed, such as the $68 billion budget of the Department of Education. Education is a state and local function, after all. The money could be used to improve border security -- a wall, eVerify, and national ID cards like the ones issued by nearly all the EU countries, with $50 billion left over. States and localities that want to can raise taxes to add money to their school budgets.
11
Observer of the Zeitgeist,
That money pays for a number of public school programs that states and local governments get from federal funding. Let me see head start, programs that feed children in public school just to name a few. You may want to do a little more researcher. You make want to look at what federal agency has the largest budget and work from there.
47
@Observer of the Zeitgeist Public schools receive 8-10% of their funding from the Federal Government. Sorry, but that's not nothing.
43
@Observer of the Zeitgeist I've been told school lunch programs that are federally subsidized will start feeling the hit by Feb. 1 if the government isn't reopened. Some programs are funded quarterly, monthly, etc. Impact isn't all at once. Some things will just keep giving after the shutdown is over. For example, if seed subsidies are blocked until after normal crop sowing time, we may have increased prices this year for certain commodities.
18
I'm sorry if this sounds harsh, but government employees are subject to the same kind of uncertainty and job security as everybody else. The sad reality is that most seemed to have gotten so comfortable with it that they tend to think otherwise, to the point where they do not even have enough saved to last a month without pay.
20
@Josh
Would continue to show up for work if you didn't get paid? Are you prohibited by law from striking against your employer (by the Taft-Hartley Act of 1947), even if not being paid? They're not being laid off or downsized, which would afford them the ability to find other employment. The sad reality is that they are being used as pawns.
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@Josh "they do not even have enough saved to last a month without pay." This reality for most Americans has been all over the news the last year or so. Perhaps you missed it. People who are paid low wages or a salary compared to the high cost of living, have an extremely hard time saving any money each month. People who have done well (and good for them), don't have children or are dependents of parents or spouses, or perhaps have inherited wealth sometimes don't understand the reality of most Americans, whether they be federal workers or not.
38
@Josh, I would sign up for a government job for which I was qualified if it were on a one-year renewable contract. It's more job security than most people in the private sector have, and the benefits/pensions are far better, too.
1
The idea that the government can shutdown federal employees from being paid infuriates me! why is it that the little person is victim to the politics in Washington? Let the Senators & Congress work without pay!
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@Codie The are mostly millionaires so it would only make them self proclaimed martyrs.
6
@Codie
Let htem work period.
They work for US, not for the president. He is not thier boss.
And, Trump is the President of ALL Americans, not just the GOP.
I think all the COngress needs to go. They are sent to Washington by vote to do what's best for the country, not to curry favor with this madman.
It's only going to get worse.
I think those of us that disagree with Trump should stomp our feet, stick out our lower lips and NOT pay taxes. I don't want my tax dollars spent on a wall. If you do, then YOU pay for it.
Trump is a criminal.
Thank you NY Times for FINALLY running an article about how many times Trump said Mexico would pay. I guess there are no comments on that piece becuase the comment board would break!!!!
Please keep the article on the front page over the weekend. Thank you!
13
Some days it seems that being terrible to each other is the primary US attribute.
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@Scott
"Some days," you wrote, "it seems that being terrible to each other is the primary US attribute."
Your comment, because it is true, is one of the most biting remarks I have ever read in the NYT comment section. We ARE terrible to each other. Maybe we have always been so, but our current *president* seems to bring the worst out in us. If things are this bad in the US "family," think how unbearable life must be inside the Trump home.
20
That is mostly a one way street. Only recently have the abused started pushing back.
9
It appears that for Trump,the primary objective is cruelty.
8
Trump sure wants everyone jumping and dancing to his insanity. He wants to fight and then he wants to give a little hope and then take it all away. This is his entertainment and it doesn't matter who gets hurt or who loses their home or income or what child loses his or her life or is torn away from their mother. This is all just a game to him. I have but one question. Why is he still the president?
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@Wally Wolf
"Why is he still the president?"
I would suggest a simple reasons: becauseTrump is the expression of Americans who have decided to abandon their dignity, freedom, justice and the right to know the truth.
23
@Wally Wolf. He is still pres because McConnell says so.
5
Implying there is some fake equivalency between the 800,000 federal workers, a majority of whom are making more money than the average American and who at worst are now one paycheck behind, and the 330,200,000 who are mostly unaffected by the shutdown is dishonest.
Also dishonest: Pretending not to know what every government worker knows: This will ultimately amount to a paid holiday. Every shutdown in history has been promptly followed by a routine measure passed to pay everyone what they would have earned.
Acting like this is some Dickensian tragedy forcing people out into the howling winds with a tin cup and starving children is laughable.
23
@Philboyd, just thinking, what if the shutdown goes on for 60 additional days? How many of those out of work have the savings to continue to pay for the basics of life?
My guess, probably under 10% of those that are sitting at home or working a part time job.
The "pawns" can be swept away when #45 decides he will never compromise.
What a disaster...
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@Broz "The great negotiator" is trying what worked in many of his business deals. Surprise.....the government is not a private business though he and his kids treat it as such.
Millions more people are about to " hit the financial wall" whether in government or not. It will only get uglier. Can "France like" demonstrations be far behind?
53
Dear Sir or Madame:
You are correct. It might be a while longer before they are begging with tin cup in hand. But isn’t Trump doing the same thing: making a political campaign promise into a national emergency? Or will you now tell us that it is a matter of political perspective?
Signed
Suggest you apply for a federal job instead of covering thy neighbor’s
18
The president claims that all Americans, especially those who support him, stand with him during this impasse. They don’t mind missing mortgage, rent or bill payments. They’re even willing to go without meals for security on the southwest border, to hear him tell it.
He’s still getting paid and so are his high salaried staffers, like Stephen Miller. Miller probably told the president that if he doesn’t get his wall, federal workers can go hungry. Cutting off America’s nose to spite its face is one thing but his own supporters are feeling the pinch as well.
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@silver vibes Well, good for them. They voted for him! Let them eat cake!
10
@silver vibes
As they darn well should.
9
@silver vibes, yes but will they wise up?
6