Amazon has unequalled power to make our country a better place. Educated, affluent people are concentrated on the coasts and the Great Lakes, an atavistic result from a time when water travel was the most efficient form of travel and communication. As a selfish consumer, I love Amazon, but as a concerned citizen of my country, I'm worried that Amazon made a decision not to spread education and affluence to the more rural parts of the U.S. Quite possibly, economists will tell me I am wrong. I would like to believe Amazon made the right decision.
Only folks that are threatened by the idea of progress and prosperity - including Rep Ocasio Cortez - would be opposed to this. NY is a city of ambition. Has been since its founding. It’s a place for ambitious and hard working people to grow and thrive.
1
Everyone seems to be forgetting all the companies moving out of NY to places like Nashville and Crystal City. HELLO! The city needs use more hi-tech jobs in high profile companies. Also, the neighborhoods in Queens around LIC do provide affordable housing. Is it enough, probably not, but it's something. The other thing everyone is forgetting is that most of those expensive condos didn't push a lot of people out of LIC it was a wasteland of abandoned warehouses and factories for the longest time. Haters gonna hate.
I've read that developing country education is partially driven by the ability of the few to emigrate to developed countries, while the others are left behind to help their own country. Similarly, praise for the best person of a team doesn't so much increase the recipient's motivation as that of everyone else that didn't receive praise. With Amazon coming to NYC - and we are not sure that this is a good thing - all the other cities might decide to 'up their game', although how they do so could be highly variable.
As usual, the naysayers and whiners from the cities Amazon did not select are voicing their bitter, sour grape comments about Amazon's move to DC and NYC. Perhaps if your state paid more attention to your public transportation infrastructure and commitment to quality education for all instead of implementing controversial policies that police the bathroom habits of transgenders, you too might have been selected.
1
"Amazon Chooses ... a Washington Suburb"
Suburb? Crystal City is to DC almost exactly what Long Island City is to Manhattan.
2
Hmm,so Amazon is investing Billions of dollars in NYC and DC over two decades without taking into account further technological changes such as A.I. and Robotics,which may directly impact the workforce it seeks!
Of course, there will be suffering along with the potential benefits. For all the new real estate development and beautiful buildings will come displacement, homelessness, congestion, and increased prices. It will be disruptive, but I hope that Amazon won't be quite so harmful that our government can reign in the excesses.
Although there will be positive, most of them will accrue to the affluent, and as for negatives, some other things, minimally mentioned:
- Homelessness, landlords illegally pushing out tenants
- Increased congestion at LaGuardia and JFK
- Racist incidents
- Complaints pointed as de Blasio, regardless of cause
- Even worse income inequality
- Complaints about the cost of tech workers, or their scarcity
- The real estate industry getting more clout
- RE industry making deals that cost us more than they are worth
Some of us might see pay increases - I work as a software developer - so although Amazon will be bringing in people, competition might increase, and the financial industry might both benefit but be harmed by the flux.
9
This is good news for the city of my birth. There will be lots of complaints about pressure on transportation and so on but the fact is that pressure forces action to improve the subways and the rest of the infrastructure. Dropping 25,000 jobs into the second most diverse city (and the most diverse borough of that city) in the country speaks to the economic viability of an ethnically rich work force.
My thanks to Mr. Bezos. I bet he enjoyed putting a finger in Mr. Trump's recently injured evil eye.
6
@greg said:
"There will be lots of complaints about pressure on transportation and so on but the fact is that pressure forces action to improve the subways and the rest of the infrastructure."
Hysterical. Pressure forces action? On what do you base this statement. Your powers of observation of how the Fed, state and local governments 'respond to such needs of their citizens'?
2
@Lisa I guess you know...the history of civilization as evidenced by things like the Roman aqueducts, the London underground, the Verrazano Narrows bridge, waste treatment facilities along the Hudson River....I guess there are a few others you could discover yourself if you got past the perspective you probably share with Grover Norquist and Rush Limbaugh.
This is unfortunate. At a time when middle America is struggling and holding on to coal and other dying jobs for dear life because those are the only options available in many towns, companies keep plopping business on the coasts. Then everyone in the big cities and mostly on the coasts don't understand why anyone would vote for Trump. When one does not have job opportunities, everything goes downhill from education to health to a connected community and they gravitate toward anyone who at least says, "I hear you. I understand you." Something the Democrats used to say to the middle class and somehow forgot in favor of catering to Silicon Valley and Wall Street. If you want to pull the center of the country back from their deep red state, find a way to put jobs in places that desperately need it to restore pride in those people and communities.
8
@ACJ, here is the inconvenient truth: a huge percentage of educated tech workers are immigrants, people of color and/or LGBT who are drawn to the diversity and freedom of the big city. Outside of Chicago, middle America is not very diverse and, honestly, is not particularly welcoming for LGBT, immigrants and people of color. Tech companies are located where the potential workforce is located, not the other way around.
The other inconvenient truth is the anti-government, anti-tax mentality in middle America that under-funds education and infrastructure, which are essential to attracting an educated workforce and, therefore, technology. Middle America needs to learn, the hard way, that government is not the enemy and that a good education is better than paying no taxes.
44
@ACJ Amazon would not consider coal country and why should they. Is the talent there to fill needed slots of employment? This is a headquarters not a distribution center. If all the help came from the outside, the wealthy new employees would push up housing costs pushing the already there people out. Jobs can be filled only when the talent is there to fill fill them. Amazon is not looking to educate Appalachia. Its not their job. 25,000 added employees, some who are already here, is a drop in the bucket as to the big picture. Hardly noticed. That's jobs for those already here and their kids down down the road who get the education to fill them.
12
@ACJ I understand your pain. I'm from New York, but I'v lived in Florida for the past 27 years, and while I wished the 2nd Amazon HQ would have chosen Miami I doubted that it would. for many years my adopted state has followed policies that would all but guarantee that it wouldn't.
1. lack of spending on education. Tax dollars spent on education is a long term investment in the future that takes years to pay off. Florida doesn't spend the money on teachers and gives them little in the way of respect or support. Instead money for education is put into construction, books, computers, etc. These things put money into the pockets of companies with the idea that jobs will be created. Unfortunately the jobs that are created don't pay much, and the children the system educates graduate without the skills in critical thinking that are required in high tech fields.
2. Support for the arts and cultural centers. Cities that support the arts in a big way, are providing venues for the exchange of new, innovative ideas. Here in Miami a family of 4 would pay $80 to go to a museum for an afternoon. Prices like that mean the majority of the population cannot afford to go.
3. Public transportation. It's easy to walk to a bus or a train in NY or Washington and get where you want to go, quickly. The trains and buses run continuously and even in the dead of night you don't usually have to wait more that 20 minutes for one.
Florida hasn't invested in these things.
17
My last job in NY was in Long Island City. I did the "reverse commute" from Manhattan: There was always a seat on the subway; Bebe's Diner made any any variation of hard roll, egg, bacon, sausage and cheese or toasted bagel as fast as it could be paid for on the way in and served any one of a hundred fresh meals in time for a 45 minute lunch. The pizzeria down the block fired late working crews with calzone, pie and parmigiana crunching and dripping with pride, tradition and authenticity.
I wonder if it will be like that when Amazon gets done sprucing up the neighborhood? No, I suppose it will be better...
12
@Marc The way you describe Bebe's Diner and the pizzeria sounds positively charming and 'classic NYC' to me. What might therefore considered 'better', once Amazon and their minions move in... a Blue Bottle with robotic hipster baristas doing $6 pour-overs?....an acai bowl place for lunch?
1
The devil is in the details. NYC isn't a third rate city in the south that needs to beg for new non-union factory jobs. If Amazon wants to benefit from everything the city has to offer, it needs to be a good neighbor. LIC infrastructure is already being stressed by rapid development and is one of the areas in the City most vulnerable to climate change. Infrastructure, school and park improvement costs must be shared by Amazon. Imagine the good will if they were to pay for repairs at Woodbridge and Astoria Houses? I'm tired of privatized profits with socialized risk.
14
I've lived in Seattle for nearly 40 years. What was once a quiet, quirky West Coast city has become a megatropolis with terrible traffic, a horrible homeless situation, and ridiculous real estate prices. The city I loved has gone away--I never would have moved here under the current conditions. At least DC and NYC are already major urban hubs--they can absorb the impact better than places like Denver or Toronto. Really, the "losers" in this bidding war are the real winners.
20
@Thos Gryphon
I appreciate the point you made while adding thoughtful context. NYC and to a lesser extent DC already have horrendous traffic and real estate issues so "getting worse" won't be noticed as much.
I'd like to point out that all finalists are major urban hubs. Toronto is an Alpha global city, Washington an Alpha- global city, and Denver is a Beta- global city.
1
From Atlanta, one of the finalist cities: I’m relieved we weren’t chosen, for all the concerns commentators from NY and DC have stated: our housing costs are rising too quickly, our traffic situation is beyond abysmal, and we can’t afford to surrender more taxes to a huge corporate entity.
Amazon’s HQ search further illustrates the how and why the chasm has developed between large urban areas and more rural areas, and how we will continue to remain two very separate nations, culturally and politically, with this persistent dichotomy. Amazon’s main factor is finding skilled labor: One thing often overlooked in discussions of the rural-urban divide is the state of education in rural areas. When we think of substandard schools, we automatically think large urban districts, but schools in poor rural areas do little better. We need across the board investment in schools nationwide, and a cultural reawakening that values, rather than denigrates, education as elitist.
23
@EWood You're right. I work tangentially on economic development in ATL and am finding it difficult to convince outsiders that GA prioritizes investment in education. My wife is a schoolteacher in a metro ATL public school. I feel she is underpaid for what she does, and the incentives promised to Amazon to locate here probably would have taken money away from her future earning potential. For all the things going right in GA, we're behind on public education, in the rural areas and the metro ATL region.
5
I wish that amazon chose Ohio or Indiana as its next location to bring good paying jobs and more educated people who would vote in those states. We really need to spread the wealth-
Not make it more concentrated
26
@Deirdre, why would educated people choose to relocate to such a cultural, anti-intellectual desert?
14
@Deirdre
I trust Ohio voters way more than voters from other redder states!
Columbus has always been a top 10 or 15 city due to its strong ecomomy and Cincinnati has turned around and grown gotten a lot of travel accolades.Have you been to these parts of the country or does JFK not direct there so it isnt worth the time?
1
The question to ask, is how many industries has NYC lost over the past 30 years? This is not the time to kvetch over 25 K jobs. Remember the exciting "tents" that took over Bryant Park when NYC once had a thriving fashion industry? Gone. Remember book publishing, real actual Meat Packing and other industries that are now in the history books? Times change. This is an opportunity. Fears about housing and commuting are not new, and they have been around far longer than Amazon. A bit of good government might help. Lets see how Albany does with mass transit, taxes, real estate and other long standing problems, and be glad that NYC is still the place to be.
34
@et.al.nyc Yes, but it seems you are writing from Great Neck (and likely own?). This will negatively impact those in the immediate vicinity of LIC, and surrounding neighborhoods (and who for the most part, rent and commute by subway) far more than someone in Great NEck.
3
Many of us in Arlington Virginia are very concerned about the negative impact of another 25,000 Amazon employees on our community, but we are even more concerned that our local and state government will needlessly give away billions of dollars to Amazon. We welcome Amazon to Arlington but want it to pay taxes like we all do.
Our public school enrollment is at record highs and rising and so is the cost of building new schools and hiring teachers. Average rents are close to $2,000 a month and housing costs over $700,000. Metro rail is above capacity and facing costly repairs; traffic grid lock is routine. Affordable housing is mostly nonexistent. We need tax dollars for this and we cannot afford to allow Amazon to come here and not pay local and state taxes.
Welcome Amazon, but don't expect that to get tax free entry. Amazon the most valuable corporation in the world can pay its own way.
80
@john, I would say that state/local income taxes from 25K new workers earning an average of $100K would help put a big dent in the local coffers, no?
1
@Ed
These workers will not likely live in Arlington (or nearby Alexandria).
They'll gentrify Anacostia, Ivy City, etc.
@john
How long have you lived in Arlington?
Surely you have heard of "the Arlington Way?"
Isn’t better that it is close to you so you can get your packages way quicker
This was all a publicity stunt; NYC was already chosen from the get go.
1
See! Democrats are like Republicans when it comes to using tax money to incentivize companies right? This is an Amazon corporate tax cut to probably zero for many years! Wow it was always the cry of Democrats to say GOP tax cuts are for the wealthy only etc. Cuomo and De Blasio are giving a tax cut to Bezos the richest guy in the world! Btw i guess even Dems see taxes as a hinderance to jobs?
Too big for anybody’s good. That is Amazon. Amazon is doing to commerce what Walmart did in the 1990,s which was to gut Main Street shopping and upend lives and is direct linkage to the trump nightmare. Walmart got in bed with China inc. early and the Walton families are among America’s wealthy elite because of. Jeff Bezos seems to have eclipsed even them. It matters not where amazon sets up camp. The jobs will pay little and then will sometime soon be replaced by artificial intelligence, mechanical robots, drones and likely self driving delivery. Wake up! This is not what your children’s future should look like.
1
This is horrible. Their growth has wrecked Seattle’s affordability - let’s hope the city council & activism forces them to abandon the LIC plans. *For any less densely populated and built area*.
This is a tasteless and selfish decision from Bezos & co. Probably mostly Bezos.
Under no circumstances should Amazon be given any tax incentives. "Amazon Cuomo" should be asking for Amazon to pay for the privilege of locating thousands of jobs in NYC. I would specifically target mass transit and schools.
I say this as a tech worker which should benefit from having more potential employers in the city. Tax incentives are a race to the bottom.
2
I love how the headline says 'Amazon has chosen' (vs 'NYC has accepted'). Guess that shows who rules the world, eh?
Looks like I'll have to start more seriously figuring out where I might move to, should my current home and neighborhood near LIC become even more gentrified, expensive and crowded (which now seems extremely likely).
4
The congested roads and lovely airports in out of NYC and DC are only going to get worse. Ouch.
Amazon may be ruthless, but no one has ever accused them of being stupid.
Their decision to split their new headquarters between two of the most culturally diverse, inclusive and attractive cities in the country speaks volumes to how prized human capital is.
These are both metro areas young people clamor to, and in the end this was apparently worth the premium in housing, rent, etc. Amazon will pay.
Red states take note. If you want to attract top talent, gutting education, infrastructure and celebrating intolerance is not the way to go.
5
Jeff Bezos is one of the richest people who ever lived. There have been multiple articles about the terrible treatment of Amazon warehouse workers. The spectacle of 20 cities trying to outbid each with tax cuts and perks for his business was disgusting.
4
I could not be happier!
2
Really, Amazon? East-Coast heavy picks, one in a city where truck drivers hate going, and the other in the land of high taxes?
Pyrrhic victory
2
CNBC is reporting NYC residents are “ outraged” over Amazons decision with concerns of rapid rent increases in the area and s on....Pittsburgh, Pa. was the right fit, Jeff!
1
Thank God they did not put it where I live. What a nightmare. It's worse than the Olympics, because it's permanent - until they leave for better tax breaks elsewhere.
If Jeff Bezos actually wanted to do some good for the world, he should have put the new HQ in a red state to flip it back to American blue.
3
As a taxpayer in Montgomery County, Maryland, I am taking a sigh of relief. In response to a FOIA request regarding the tax incentives thrown at Amazon, we were presented with 10 pages in which every single word was redacted. The obfuscation of these concessions does not bode well for the taxpayers in NYC and Arlington, in particular those who are not homeowners.
5
The 2 locations would be at the bottom of any intelligent person's list. The team analyzing the locations were enamored perhaps by the tax incentives combined with a hazy ideas of the local demographics and where talent resides and how they commute to work. First Long Island City 1. Constrained by one already overpacked train line - 7 - over half the workforce commutes from New Jersey going past Newark, one of the other choices for Amazon but ignored, 2. The fact Amazon chose LIC instead of Manhattan means it is going cheap but has some delusion that its employees would commute from Manhattan - very poor thinking, 3. the area around LICchokes with traffic and potholes, 4. And the nearest airport is the ultimate joke - La Guardia. Next Crystal City - at the nerve center of one of the worst urban traffic grids - here too, delusional thinking comes into play - that people from DC, which has zero resident tech talent, will commute across the river to Crystal City. In reality, there is abundant tech talent in the several towns near Dulles 20 miles away - to commute from there to Crystal City is a 1 hour nightmare drive unless one does it at 5:30 in the morning. Overall, the choices made are the result of Jeff Bezos' delusional grandeur combined with paying for cheap deputies. Amazon is squeezing every tax incentive while property values, taxes and infrastructure will worsen for everyone else - daylight robbery at its finest.
5
@Venkatesh LIC is close to LGA and JFK, and most people working there would live in Long Island, Manhattan or even NJ commuter towns like Fort Lee, Jersey City, etc. In contrast I would never see people commuting from any of the NY locations to NJ neck of the woods like Newark...
@Venkatesh, there are eight subway lines in LIC, plus LIRR, ferries, buses and a potential light rail line. Few places have such transit riches.
The property values goes up, but it means nothing to me. I need a place to live, and my property taxes goes up. There will be more traffic, more noise, more pollution and quality of life goes down. The government employees finds it hard to buy a home. Why the companies in a vast country with modern technology locate them in congested area? States should not give any special incentives to attract them. I would like to see why Amazon choose these two places and why they divided HQ2?
5
Employees would go where the jobs are. Queens of all places? Does not seem that Amazon cares about the housing and transportation impact in an area of NYC that has become unaffordable and a transportation system already in crisis. How do I know? I leave 24 years in metropolitan NYC.
Why not upstate NY? a middle west state where they would have brought hope and progress where is really need it! After all, they do get some snow up there too!
Yes, we buy lots of stuff in Amazon. Wish I could convince my husband to look some place else. It is all about what is good for business.
I think it’s good for New York State and good for the area around LI City as well.
We used to have factories within NYC and in LI City with great jobs and auxiliary businesses built around them. Subways, busses and rail transport were built around them as well - they can be upgraded to accommodate the new needs.
This is a challenge but fantastic benefits for the entire state.
4
As a New Yorker, I don't see how this can be considered positive for New York. This will mean even more insanely overpriced real estate, a more boring rich homogeneous population, more commuters squeezing onto an already collapsing transit system, more clogged roads. And a city that is even more expensive, boring, and soulless than ever.
5
This is great news, for BOTH places. Congratulations. And the real winner here is Seattle, MY happy place. See you soon.
1
Where did you see $100,000 wages? A friend of mine makes $13/hour. Wait, maybe she works 7600 hours per year, I didn't ask the details.
1
Hmm. Is having one of the largest monopolies in NYC, a democratic stronghold, a move for political influence?
1
I know this goes against the grain of having to accept progress, but I am so happy that I am far away from these mega cities and living the good life in solid blue NM.
1
@Bella Hopefully you can parlay some of your progressive bona fides into improving the abysmal education in poverty-ravaged areas outside Santa Fe and Albuquerque.
WOW..I see nothing but downer comments. THIS IS GOOD! And they didn't choose a Right-To- Work state! Welcome Jeff & company! We'll polish up the Big Apple!
7
@Mark
VA is a right to work state.
Just what we need--more demand for housing, commuting options and tech workers. Because we have such a surplus.
Adding insult to injury, Amazon solicited bribes for such a "boon".
Why not go to some Midwestern city, with cheap housing and less clogged roads and train your tech workforce, a place where Amazon would be the best place to work. A workforce who could be paid less because you're not competing with the financial industry.
No one wins with this selection, not the community, not Amazon, not even the future employees sitting on aging subway cars.
9
On the contrary- everyone wins. Better transportation, more housing, more tax revenue. Win-win-win.
1
Be careful where you locate, Amazon. New York city and state have a way of getting their pound of flesh in the form of taxes sooner or later, no matter how large your initial tax breaks. That's why we have experienced a net loss of corporations and people during the Cuomo years. Just take a drive north to Albany, Syracuse or Buffalo and see all the abandoned factories.
Gloomy Gus will always have to see the negative instead of seeing opportunities and challenges. This is good! Amazon was smart in picking this area.
1
So many cynical comments here! 25,000 jobs earning more than $100,000 apiece on average is a boon.
I see people complaining about tax breaks, but they don't seem to be considering what those 25,000 workers will be paying in taxes or the jobs that they in turn will create, many of them among the poorer residents of the region. The City and State would have been insane not to want to attract these jobs.
What's more, this has the potential to create a high tech nexus in the City, as talent attracts talent. Companies come to where the high tech workers are, high tech workers come to where the companies are. That's how cities thrive.
And one thing I haven't seen mentioned: the outer boroughs suffered as manufacturing and service jobs left for low cost areas. This headquarters isn't located in Midtown or downtown, but rather in Queens, in an area that isn't exactly a commercial powerhouse.
If we care about the poorest residents of the City, we will recognize that their future depends on economic activity. This is true whether it's a question of employment, or of government assistance.
14
Atlantic City residents were promised a vote for legalized gambling would help the poor of the city. This would have been in the mid 1970’s.
I guess at least Amazon didn’t bother purporting that canard.
5
This isn’t gambling which brings in con men like Donald Trump (who used his casinos as cash cows and left everyone else holding the bag when he went bankrupt).
Amazon is a known quantity with proven success. There will be high-tech jobs at Amazon and opportunities for those outside the high-tech area in the auxiliary business that will grow up around Amazon.
4
What did NYC or NYS offer them to come here? The articles don't say.
If they came for what NY anyway offers, I say welcome.
If they got special tax deals and other perks, then I'm against it.
A global race to the bottom that demands every government give special deals to global corporations, at the expense of local residents, small businesses, workers, and consumers is slowly destroying the world economy, and quickly corrupting our governments, to the point that politicians think that corporations are citizens, but humans are just labor waiting to be replaced by a machine. And replacing labor with machines is a speciality of Amazon.
5
The robots are coming, the robots are coming. Their going to take your jobs.
The people of Long Island and Northern Virginia mistakenly believe that Amazon's announcement will somehow profit them personally and somehow contribute to an increase in their wealth and standard of living. Such misguided beliefs are not uncommon with high profile deals and moves by large corporations.
But I'd caution people against unbridled euphoria and advise them to read the fine print in this instance. After all, the devil is in the details.
1
@loco73
It will increase my wealth, as I own property nearby zoned for the "right' high school.
I agree with you that the devil will live in the details, and it is not certain that this increase in wealth won't be paid for in other ways.
1
Time to break up tech giants like Amazon, Google, Facebook, ad nauseum.
8
Perhaps you could expand your post with providing your rationale. I'm not necessarily saying you're wrong, but....why?
1
@KellyNYC
I’m concerned about the concentration of power, the ability to dictate pricing for products and advertising, the ability to stifle speech, and — specifically in the case of Jeff Bezos, Amazon, and the Washington Post — the ability to spike stories that may reflect negatively on the parent company.
1
What a surprise---I never would have thought NYC and Washington DC would be selected---that Jeff Bezos is a genius---
3
Welcome to Crystal City....your move is much appreciated.
As are your tax dollars and Jobs.
7
NY and DC can have them. This nonsense of multi-billion dollar corporations needing so much welfare from a city just to open their doors is insane.
President Obama was right, they're bringing these businesses in on roads that were paid for by someone else, and they're hiring people whose education was paid for by someone else. They exist in a community that is paid to be perpetuated by someone else, and let's face it, they couldn't exist if the community didn't exist.
That fact that they bring in a few jobs is not a good enough reason to give them a free ride.
21
@Colorado
I agree. If they located to the Tech Center, near DIA, Interlochen or the old StorageTek c=facility, in Louisville, that would have added 50,000 more people into the mix. It would have seen, already rising house prices, accelerate. If they did locate to Broomfield/Boulder County, Longmont, which at the edge of not being affordable, will no longer be, nor would areas around Mead, Dacono, Frederick, Firestone or Erie.
Also, we, the Colorado taxpayer, would be picking up the tab to add road capacity and the tax incentives.
So, in the end, they moved to two of the most congested, and expensive, markets in the country. But, New York City will love the extra commuter tax. And, the state will not do anything to improve the commuting infrastructure. Good luc Amazon, you are going to need it.
1
So, how much did New York State, and New York City, give in tax abatements to pull this off? Also, Just how thousands of new workers suppose to get to Long Island City? The various highways cannot handle the traffic as it is. Of course there is the LIRR and subway, but even those will not be able to handle the major influx.
Now, comes the fun part, "gentrification". No one in their right mind will want to drive the 30 or so miles from Smithtown to Long Island City everyday, nor get on a train that takes them to Manhattan and a subway that takes them to Long Island City. So, they will want to live close to work.
The public housing complex next door, will be one of the targets. Of course, what was "affordable" in Long Island City, will quickly become a real estate hot spot. Over night home prices will shoot up, not only in Queens, but also Nassau and western Suffolk County. And, with it, property taxes. At least New York State and New York City will get their tax abatement back.
Meanwhile, the roads will remain over capacity, the LIRR a joke and the subway falling apart. Oh yeah, all those low income people displaced to who knows where.
One consolation to Amazon, at the right time, it is not a bad drive to Kennedy Airport. And, when LaGuardia is finished, it will be great.
Now, for the stupid question. If they really wanted to be in New York, why din't they locate to Suffolk County, where many high tech workers live?
4
It appears that we are assuming the low income people in the projects won't be willing to work there. Another reader mentioned $100,000/year jobs. If, those projects are like the ones I used to live near, they'll step up to the plate and make sure that those $100,000 workers, have a place to buy any vice they might desire, from drugs to ladies of the night. It sounds like it will benefit those projects after all.
1
@Nick Metrowsky, why would they move to Suffolk, as opposed to LIC, which is in the region's core, thus offering transit access to talent from four states?
@Osito
If I were a tech worker living in Nassau or western Suffolk County, and Amazon was located somewhere close to the LIE between exits 50 and 60; it is an easier commute. Most people live within 5 - 7 miles from the LIE. And if you lived west, of the Amazon location, you will be having a far faster commute than going west into Long Island City.
Smothtown Village si 50 miles from Manhattan, and 40 or so miles from Long Island City. It is also 5 miles north of the LIE.
Missed opportunity in that they could have located to the old Central Islip Hospital Site, leveled it and put up a new campus, just yards from the LIE. The same goes for Pilgrim State Hospital site. Or, have the campus just south of SUNY Stony Brook, on NY 347. And, there was even opportnity near Brookhaven Laboratory.
Finally, you would not have to pay the New York City income tax. Not to mention, commercial flights fro m MacArthur Airport.
Another example of professional jobs ending up in New York City, and not where people live.
So glad it is not Boston. Our Governor has done nothing to improve our terrible transit system. Besides that we have no room for more people.
2
Newark is not that much farther from Manhattan than L.I. City. Have to wonder if NJ Transit's failures and the potential for long-term rail connection severance without new tunnels and a new portal bridge cost Newark it's chance. It has everything else, office space, NJIT, Rutgers, an airport 15 minutes away, frequent all class Amtrak service, an east-west and north-south highway network, a vibrant new cultural scene, an excessive pack of incentives from the State of N.J., sophisticated developers to work with Amazon.
What does it not have? A present useful and permanent future guaranteed rail and commuter link to Manhattan, notwithstanding the PATH.
6
I agree. Amazon probably factored in the likelihood of a tunnel failure....which is a very real thing.
1
Looking at this picture of Long Island City in Queens i feel sorry for the Amazon workers there. That place has no personality.
Welcome to Northern Virginia, Amazon.
Your new base here will be in a county known for its high taxes and machine politics (a/k/a "the Arlington Way").
Housing in Arlington is limited and expensive.
Those relocating to this area would do well to consider other sections of the DMV as it is unfortunately tabbed.
Now about the renaming of Route 1 (Jefferson Davis Highway) . . .
3
@jbartelloni
It's interesting that none of the articles mention that Crystal City is next to the NSA (the U.S. electronic surveillance agency) and it's packed with NSA and Pentagon subcontractors.
1
I understand the NIMB reactions. Displacement or the fear of it is real. How will those fears be addressed?
1
Same as always. They will be completely ignored, and there will be dollar signs in people's eyes. A few people anyway.
Many of the comments here, and the implied attitude from the NYT editorial board (Zephyr Teachout's recent call to reject Amazon, and the accompanying Critic's Notebook column, "What's In It for New York City") are grossly myopic. I'm happy to hear that we're getting 25k good paying jobs and that the city's economy is diversifying. I'll take the problems with modern, high paying jobs any day over being left behind. This is good news for NYC!
11
@B
25k jobs is awesome, as long as the jobs actually materialize, and as long as the circuitry isn't paying millions of dollars per job in tax cuts.
Amazon is a specialist in fully automated processes that require almost no workers.
Why are the details of the plan not in the articles?
1
Wait. So let me get this straight. They spent a year dangling a big carrot in front of over 200 American cities (all of whom basically offering free rent and practically *paying Amazon* for the privilege of extorting them) only to decide on...
New York and Washington, D.C.?
Wow. That's just so unambiguously cynical and boring.
7
@BothSides
High tax, high standard of living cities are engines of growth, no matter what rural Republicans keep telling you.
1
It’s not 25000 coming straight away, it’s a few thousand a year. Frankly I doubt people will notice. Does anyone notice the hordes of google workers?
2
There goes the neighborhood. A big thank you to our sycophant politicians who used the biggest sort of corporate welfare to get Amazon.
Why couldn't Amazon have chosen another American city that actually needed more people and jobs and an infusion of investment, maybe like Philadelphia, which is right between DC and NYC, or even Detroit or lots of other Rust Belt cities. Now every other city is realizing how stupid they were in desperately trying to attract Amazon. They were never going to choose you. Instead they chose the financial and political capitals of the nation.
This is just more of our politicians not actually working for us.
12
We couldn’t be happier for you, James.
2
As an LIC resident I have to say, this does not make me happy.
6
They could have chosen places where the economy needs a boost, instead of creating all sorts of new problems for places already saturated. Corporate mentality hasn't changed that much, I guess.
16
So glad NYC 'won'. You deserve it, and may God help you.
6
What a wasted opportunity. These areas are already affluent and over crowded.
Amazon missed a vital chance to spread economic development to formerly thriving areas of this country hollowed out by the same globalization they have benefitted from.
They could have helped level the playing field through jobs, skills and industry and chose to enrich the already wealthy. Shame.
11
@CNNNNC
Agree wholeheartedly. But what seemed odd to me, why would Amazon choose an area that is land locked, so to speak, for shipping purposes.
You can't go far to the east.
A more central location would have been more beneficial logistically.
2
America’s second biggest port, Port Newark Container Terminal is less than an hour away from Long Island City.
1
@Alexander
They're not building a warehouse or a fulfillment center. These our office jobs.
3
So now that they've turned Seattle into one of the most expensive cities to live in, they are branching out into the two metro areas that are already the most expensive? This seems a bit short sighted. Plenty of talent and people who would gladly move to a cheaper city like Atlanta or Philly or Nashville. I'm sure they will make the already rich even richer but from a social/economic standpoint for everyone else I think the news is disappointing.
12
Not that this was ever on the table, but Jersey City would maybe have been an interesting option, and certainly better than Newark. JC is already a tech hub or at least a tech back office, where many corporations house their IT staff. It has scads of open space, water views, a direct drive to Newark Airport, and easy commutes into Manhattan via ferry and the PATH.
@James Igoe Jersey City is a remote outpost due to limited avenues to enter the city. Almost impossible to cross the bridges at rush hour and NJ transit is in taters. Also Bayonne where I grew up has one of the highest rates of disability claims in the cointry.
2
There are two subway lines and multiple ferries, Jersey City applied, but New Jersey chose to back the Newark option.
1
@James Igoe
NJ was never a contender due to NJ Transit and the potential of an out-of-service tunnel to Manhattan.
1
Queens? Hope Amazon pays a lot. Rent is expensive.
Amazon HQ2 presence in NYC - Queens, yes of course a good thing. At all costs to get them here by Gov. Cuomo or Mayor DeBlasio, I hope not! Knowing Gov. Coumo give away programs in Buffalo for example was a disaster. NYC always has had more than any other city in the world to offer, yet alone in the states. I just hope the Gov. didn't give away the store, keep in mind existing businesses will extract a pound of flesh to stay here (think huge banking and media industry operations) from the City or else leave for cheaper taxes and low wages elsewhere. I welcome Amazon to Queens however, where they will find the best proximity to excellent housing, public and highway transportation. Of course the talent is already here, the schools, universities are already the best in the nation. Governor, make NYS the best by lowering all taxes across the board and grow out state!
2
Wow. Folks kvetching about job creation. I don't get it... I thought right or left that is what we want: jobs. And these are high paying jobs.
Will home prices and rents rise? Yes. Will public transportation and roads be overwhelmed? Yes. Will schools be overburdened? Yes.
But the response to that is not too chase away companies that are bringing jobs. It is to vote in government leaders that will provide the services citizens need. In this case affordable housing for those who do not directly benefit from Amazon's hiring; better roads, infrastructure and public transportation; and more and better-funded schools.
I am glad that Amazon is coming to my area and bringing jobs!
13
They aren’t high paying jobs.
2
@Zejee average salaries at the new headquarters are reported to be in the $100K range. These are high-tech jobs, not warehouse jobs.
https://armonk.dailyvoice.com/business/amazon-reveals-average-salary-number-of-jobs-it-will-add-at-hq2/731393/
1
Something for Trump and his supporters to ponder. Why is it that a place like Queens, perhaps the most diverse area of the entire country - filled with immigrants from practically every place on earth, here legally and illegally, in one of the most liberal and tolerant and creative places in the country, in a place with very high taxes and many social services (as close to socialism as you can find in the US) manages to out compete every other city and region of the country except for the DC area in winning the Amazon prize? We New Yorkers are not surprised of course as we’ve been out competing cities like Boston and Philly since the early 19th Century. And it all starts with the Dutch and their extraordinary culture of tolerance. Congrats Queens!
40
There could be a silver lining NY and VA. Here in Atlanta there were tax incentives to draw in the film industry, and it is now flourishing with lots of local jobs. The best part though, Georgia State University has made a significant investment in film, it is now a major and young people are graduating with excellent jobs. We're growing our own film industry now.
Good luck NY and VA.
5
Can't tell if Arlington won or lost yet, but I wish I could read the agreement and know what we paid for this privilege.
Will the MIL rate go down around here (it should)? I bet my assessment will go up, but there is no reason my taxes should.
Unfortunately, the blue wave washed away Vihstadt, an independent and sensible voice on the county board. He was the only one I trusted not to give away the house.
2
@Lydia
Given that the buildings they plan to use are Vacant (and therefore, producing NO tax revenue), and in dire need of Upgrading (hence jobs for tradesmen), I fail to see a real downside here.
2
@Paul P.
I agree there's a lot of vacant space down there, and perhaps this can be good.
However,
The same politicians struck this deal as the ones who struck the deal a decade ago with Shooshan and the DARPA building, trading height for a park. The park is still unbuilt.
If Bezos started helping fund the metro improvements his workers will use, I'd be surprised.
It is reasonable to ask what's in it for me.
1
Crystal City is pretty built up. I wonder who Amazon will be displacing with 25,000 additional employees to what is now a crowded space.
4
@Frank J Haydn
Crystal City is built up, but there are many vacancies in its technologically obsolete buildings.
They will be demolished and a new Crystal City will arise.
3
@Frank J Haydn
Clearly you haven't been down on Crystal Drive lately. All those buildings? Most are vacant due to the Pentagon pulling out a few years ago.
5
Thank God it wasn't Boston, which has a couple of severe problems. Number one is housing. Try to buy an affordable house or rent an affordable apartment, well good luck to you. Number two is transportation. Which is worse, the MBTA, or the roads? I'd have to rate both terrible and a nightmare.
3
Given how annoyed the Times seems about the prospect of HQ1.5 coming to NYC (What’s In It For New York City?) Amazon may want to reconsider. Does it really want such a hostile reception with unending extortionate demands soon to follow? Plenty of other cities, including Boston, would welcome Amazon. Think about it, Jeff!
Yeah. We already have low wage jobs in New York
@Zejee these jobs are not low-wage, this is not a distribution warehouse. These will be high-tech and business jobs.
1
@Beantownah Hostility has never stopped Amazon, and likely only excites Bezos all the more.
As a former resident of Sunnyside, Queens, let me say this: "There goes the neighborhood."
17
@Doug Tarnopol yeah, scary. We have enough Brooklynites already. Hopefully most of the employees will live in midtown just across the river and ignore the quaint quiet neighborhoods of Queens
2
Being "chosen" by Jeff Bezos now seems to be a lot like being chosen by the International Olympic Committee, aka the kiss of death. The rich people who view houses and apartments as "investments" rather than places where non-rich people ought to be able to live for an affordable price are literally the ONLY people in metro New York and Washington who are happy to hear about this.
9
All I can say is - thank goodness they didn't pick Philadelphia.
Perhaps now, the Philadelphia government can use a scaled down version of their pitch to Amazon in order to bring in several smaller businesses, none of which will require the same perverse tax incentives and sweetness as Amazon, one of the most profitable companies in the world.
20
For all the talk that jobs are moving south, this is an interesting decision. Perhaps Amazon understands that a state with good schools, good social services and great urban areas is the place that will attract higher quality workers. You get what you pay for and good businesses understand that.
29
@Joe
His workers won't be able to afford Arlington. These are good jobs coming, but not the kind that buy what our houses are worth.
5
@Lydia
The brave ones will move to Anacostia and expedite its gentrification.
2
@Lydia
$21.00 an hour isn't "high enough" for you???
This facile argument that "gosh, it's too expensive here in (Arlington) or (LIC) is foolish.
2
I work at LaGuardia Community College in Long Island City, where 78% of the student body come from households earning under $25,000 a year, and where the number one reason students don’t graduate, regardless of GPA, is financial stress. Even with student aid paying tuition, most of them work or have to care for family members while someone else works. Most are immigrants or children of immigrants, and all are incredibly hard working, curious people searching for their American Dream.
There is profound irony that they’re attempting an education in a city and state that can’t pay for their failing tax-payer public transportation, keeps hiking their tax-payer funded tuition, and keeps cutting our tax-payer budgets (even in a roaring economy our Writing Center budget just got cut).
There is irony because a city and state led by purportedly progressive Democrats are likely now giving away tax dollars to a trillion dollar company whose job won’t go to these students, whose presence will raise their cost of living, and whose workers will overwhelm a failing public transport system. This is going to exacerbate, not ameliorate, the profound inequality in Long Island City and New York City.
For us working to make the dream real for the those working their way up, seeing Amazon come in with folks mindlessly clapping is sand in the face. The City needs to remember that every New Yorker deserves a shot at the dream, not just those already ready to move behind the next glass tower.
102
@Jrc This is one of the most eloquent and cogent statements regarding inciine inequality I've had the opportunity to read. Thank you for putting in words the frustration that good hardworking people go through every day.
I truly don't envy any of these cities that chose to have an Amazon presence in their community, the rise of Amazon in Seattle has seen many problems for it's citizens with increased prices for housing, taxes to pay for all the road/infrastructure improvements, food and a pronounced homelessness crisis.
If you ask around the area here you'll find a plethora of people are leaving Seattle due to the Amazon effect.
5
Yup. I moved out of seattle this summer. I lived close to amazon and my neighborhood became unlivable. Crowded, congested, my rent doubled, and small neighborhood businesses priced out. Plus the amazonion drivers are the worst I’ve ever seen. They made driving a contact sport.
Good luck to the “winning” cities and their communities. You’re going to need it!
4
@Jrc
While well intended, I don't think you're calculating the effect of 25,000 jobs earning over $100,000 each on the local economy and tax revenues. Each of those employees will be spending money in the area, paying taxes in the region. Each will create support jobs (as will Amazon's operation itself) that will employ the less able.
You're thinking here with your heart, rather than putting your green eyeshades on and thinking with your actuarial head!
1
I was hoping that Amazon could have helped the poor rural areas of the US for job opportunities.
NYC is already crowded and developed.
21
Not going to find many college educated tech workers in a rural area. Better to choose a major city where there are several universities pumping out workers.
6
@Waleed Khalid are you kidding? The SUNY system is located, for the most part, in small cities across the state that are surrounded by rural areas. Cornell, RIT, RPI, etc. all in small struggling cities. We have loads of small cities across the state that are dying due to the loss of manufacturing jobs. And if people need to move to those places, there’s plenty of room for them. Amazon belongs there, not here. We have enough jobs in NYC and we certainly don’t need more people coming here, which is what this will cause. Horrible decision by Amazon. Clueless, actually.
1
@GC. Couldn't disagree more. Yes, it would be good for New York State to have Amazon revive one or more of upstate's small cities, but how would Amazon ever attract young, highly educated workers to go to those places? They wouldn't. Young people with many choices just won't go to backwaters.
Amazon chose NYC and DC because they are very attractive to young workers. That's why they're willing to pay such a premium to be there. In the end, Amazon is not going to focus on what's best for NYS, but what's best for themselves.
3
Sigh of relief Boston wasn’t chosen. Those lobbying for Amazon to establish a headquarters here have police as drivers and assigned parking. Less is More (when it comes to quality of life.)
3
Will Amazon's HQ2 in New York turn out to be the Kudzu of corporate America? Maybe a horror flick, "The Corporation That Ate New York."
6
25,000 represents .3% of NYC’s population and .1% of the population of the metro area. I’m not a huge fan of Amazon’s management practices. However, most of Amazon’s future NYC employees already live in the area. So cool it with the ludicrous hyperbole.
Arlington on the other hand? I fear for the independence of that city’s leadership once Amazon moves in.
4
After all that.
They could’ve really done some good in places like Detroit, instead of further clogging up the East Coast.
39
@Borage They would have trouble attracting high-tech talent to Detroit.
The best way to mitigate the impact on the regions effected is for the Federal government to disperse it's huge footprint of agencies into the Midwest. I never understood why the USDA would be in D.C. rather than Des Moines or Omaha. I also advocate that 'Wall St." move it's back office operations to a large city ( by geography and not yet people) that has a great core. For any listeners. Cleveland is available for either or both.
8
@Mark
Because the highly educated workers in the head quarters have spouses with independent careers. If my husband had a great job offer in Des Moines, am I supposed to just abandon my career?
5
Because you can't find the same level of educated talent in those areas. Those are just the hard numbers. Also it s a good idea for the **central** government offices to be **centralized** in one location. Say the same location where the legislature is. Or one location where everybody can find it easy to attend interagency meetings.
1
@Mark
"I never understood why the USDA would be in D.C. rather than Des Moines or Omaha."
You wouldn't say that if you knew what the USDA does.. It's not all meat inspection and farm assistance. Not even close.
3
Maybe all these new jobs and tax revenue from Amazon will help pay for what has been a glaring hole in New York's infrastructure: a rail link to La Guardia Airport and better rail access to JFK, like every other major global city has.
How does one currently take public transport to LGA? Taxis, cars, a ridiculously long local bus through Queens... it's really ridiculous and embarrassing. I'm sure all these new senior level executives can apply pressure to the MTA and other authorities to make plans for this?
30
In probably any other state that absolutely would be the case but NYC is a special place of back room deals that never seem to benefit the people in the end. Sadly MTA is a place where transit dreams seem to go to die. Now if you have some cash to donate.....
2
@Dr. Seuss Right. Because all we need to do is throw money at the MTA, or exert 'pressure' on them, and all the MTA's woes will magically be resolved.
Publicizing a nationwide “search” for a second headquarters and then picking NYC and DC is unethical. They could have at least saved all of the cities who made proposals time and money by being upfront about the type of place they were looking for. This story started focused around how amazon would help people and ended in a display of corporate greed. I was thinking of investing in stock but it isn’t worth it. The developers in LIC that can’t rent out their luxury units will be happy. Not sure who else.
67
@T
Exactly. A publicity stunt that wasted taxpayer dollars.
How about reimbursing them, Amazon?!
4
@T, Amazon has a treasure trove of most valuable information for their expansion at a zero cost...
9
As someone who lives near Washington, D.C., I don't appreciate Bezos choosing Arlington, VA as a second headquarters. Housing is already expensive, the roads congested and the infrastructure inadequate for current residents. I can only imagine more than 100,000 people now in the DC metro area will further clog the roads and skyrocket housing. Plus, D.C. is already one of the most expensive areas to live. Now don't get me started on how Bezos race to the bottom his second headquarters bid was.
19
How does this bode for the people of Queens? To lure Amazon what did Cuomo give up? Sure it going to be boom for real estate and landlords? Will jobs and training be offered to those living in the largest public housing in America? Traffic on Queens roadways have been terrible since I was a child. How will this impact travel to the airports? People living in the vicinity of the new headquarters know their rents are going to force them to move. Is it a Boom for the well heeled and a Bust for the working guy?
33
@Steven McCain - The working guy has never really lived in Long Island City. It's not been gentrified, it was an industrial wasteland until it was developed into luxury housing and amenities. Higher rents aren't going to cause anyone living in a waterfront apartment there to have to move. Google is expected to hire 12,000 more employees in NYC, too, so maybe the huge influx of commuters will finally get Cuomo around to updating the subway system.
7
@brooklyn I guess the people who live in Queens housing are all on public assisstance and don't work? I went to Steinway J.H.S. and a lot of my classmates lived in L.I.C. There are working folks in the vicinity who are about to get the short end of the stick. To tell folks there was nothing there but closed factories is not th facts.
14
Vicinity - that includes neighborhoods of Astoria and Sunnyside. Plenty of working class people there who will be forced to move. And doubt Cuomo will fix the system. He'll probably spend plenty of money to make the stations pretty but nothing to make trains run better.