We've lived in VA, Maryland, DC, Philly, around Pittsburgh, in rural PA and now OR.
We've been here for a handful of election cycles and all over this state whether you're Red, Blue, Independent or Rainbow everyone votes the same way. Mail in ballots. The voting system here should be adopted across the country. A few weeks before elections you receive at your mailing address a brochure with all the candidates and ballot measures (with pros and cons submitted by supporters, non-supporters) Then you receive your mail in ballot. BTW - this year my wife's was missing - she looked online and address was incorrect? She contacted the office of elections and within a couple of days it was corrected and she received her ballot! Then all you have to do is fill in the dots with your choices and drop it off in the mail or at one of the many drop off boxes throughout the area. In addition if you so choose to do so you can get txt and email alerts along the process....."we've sent you your ballot", "we've received your ballot", "your vote has been processed"
You have to sign your ballot prior to sending in and as the link I will provide demonstrates it is supported by both the Republican and Democratic Secretaries of State that we've had the last few years. You can look through the ballot measures and even look up additional information if you want & it can't be hacked! https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/elections/you-can-t-hack-paper-how-oregon-fights-election-meddling-n930481
Here's a more detailed yet easy to understand account of what may have caused this situation in Broward County.
Design is destiny… especially ballot design.
The partisans and politicians should learn a simple lesson: keep the message simple and repeat it.
Not the laughable hyperbole that Trump spews.
Just simple reality that people can grasp.
Here, become the smartest person in the room.
https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/something-looks-weird-in-broward-county-heres-what-we-know-about-a-possible-florida-recount/
The irony here is that the man who stole millions from Medicare actually is governor of a state with some of the oldest people. Yet this time there is a slim margin of error. Ho much money did Bill Nelson steal from Medicare? People of Florida are really dumb voting for a crook.
'Rick Scott ‘oversaw the largest Medicare fraud in the nation’s history,’ Florida Democratic Party says'
https://www.miamiherald.com/news/politics-government/article1960993.html
2
Hey Bill Gates and Jeff Bezos and Tim Cook,
If you want to be truly innovative and if you care a dime about democracy, just use a few percentage of your billions and intelligence to create a new electronic voting process.
Just use any of your whatever-recognition apps (we all use every day to order pizza).
And as you guys know all of us better than anyone else - fraud would be impossible.
4
Vote recounts rarely change political outcomes. One famous flip did manage to seat the Emmy-winning comedy writer, Al Franken, in the U.S. Senate when it opened for business in 2009. The Harvard graduate resigned in 2017 amid accusations of sexual harassment.
Florida claims this century's poster status for election scrutiny. However, Washington State, Vermont, Minnesota, Virginia, Georgia, Arizona, and even presidential elections have stretched the voters’ will beyond election day.
So far, only three of over 30 recounts changed results.
Elections are the spawn of politics, which may explain the difficulty of arriving at “the Truth.” In the end, however, there should be no “Alternative Facts.” It is not a numbers game; it remains a confirmation of Democracy.
1
Time to look at Florida's hanging chads again?!?
No uncertainty here. Just the naked reality that our voting system is corrupt. We have suffered GWB and DT because Votes don't count, money counts. Americans are not as stupid as the Reds would like to believe. Apathetic and scared, yes. But 70% reject Trump's racist, treasonous agenda. Once the curse is broken... Gerrymandering, Electoral College, Jim Crow voter suppression, unhinged campaign financing, unequal distribution of polling places, hackable electronic voting machines, and corporate dominated media propaganda... progressive populism will prevail. Ha ha. It is a miracle that any decent politicians ever get elected in this country.
In America only those things function where a commercial interest is behind. Everything else is rotting (power supply, infrastructure, public health care, solidarity)
This and other pieces on the FL and GA races are short on facts. Left unsaid was why Scott took issue with the Democrats - it is because of late-arriving votes, noting that the number of ballots cast has increased by nearly 80,000 since Election Night in Broward County and approximately 15,000 in Palm Beach County. An explanantion is needed for finding such before unaccounted votes.
"They can't tell us where they came from, they can't tell us how they got there, there's no transparency," Scott said. "You have to assume the worst here. You have to assume that it's exactly what Marc Elias is saying: He's there to win the election."
The whole process should be transparent – the total number of votes cast should at least be known. If new votes are produced, a good explanation is needed. This will probably go to court, and judges will require explanation.
In this age of technology and the internet, it is unacceptable that election systems across the nation, Florida included, are relying on paper ballots. Massive reform is needed.
Election processes traditionally have been left to the states, even in the case of federal elections. As a result, every state has its own unique voting system and reporting problems.
There is a need for uniformity, simplicity, reliability and timeliness. We should never be in a situation where a week or more after an election, we are still counting ballots and there is still no clarity as to how many uncounted votes are outstanding. Almost nothing else does more to undermine the integrity of the democratic process and the results ultimately reported.
Here is a suggested outline for reform:
a). All in-person voting should be done electronically. The less human intervention, the better.
b). Early voting, too, should be done electronically. Where that is not feasible, paper ballots should be handled in the manner suggested below.
c). All electronic voting results should be automatically forwarded to an independent CPA firm and stored in an electronic data base. All absentee paper ballots should be sent directly to the CPA firm and entered into the same data base prior to Election Day.
d). The CPA firm should report the results on Election Day within two hours of the polls closing. The results for each election district should be made public immediately.
1
Ah... deja vu all over again... yet again... The Yog lives on forever.
The US is a matured democracy, economically affluent, technologically advanced, and has a population of about 325 million. Compare the US to India, a developing democracy with limited resources and a population of 1.2 billion! Recently, India completed a massive project. It digitized every Indian and gave each a digital card that carries a unique number and his/her personal data. Indians use this card as ID, for banking transactions, claim social benefits, etc. Cannot the US, with its vast economic and technological resources, do the same? This national ID card could be used, among others, for voting - either by using a PC, or at a polling booth, in which case it will be similar to a debit-card that people use at ATM’s. This would, besides standardizing the ballot procedures nationally, eliminate the need for paper ballots and their mailing, prevent fraudulent voting, and ensure legitimacy of election results.
1
““It’s inconceivable that 18 years after 2000, Florida still hasn’t developed competencies in terms of counting ballots in an orderly and timely manner,” said one former top Gore aide who did not want to be named for fear of stirring up old ghosts.”
This is probably the dumbest reason for not naming a source that I’ve ever seen. The Times has consistently said anonymous sources are used rarely and only when vital to the story: this puts the lie to that. Limit anonymous sources only to the truly consequential, please.
6
Here in Maine we are waiting for all votes to be counted and the outcome of our new ranked choice voting system. What’s the big deal Florida?
BTW If you don’t like democracy, why not establish a czar? Maybe he can rule from Mar-a-Lago.
7
I live in Broward. The incompetent and defiant Brenda Snipes should have been fired long ago. She has broken the law by not knowing the total vote count. Last night it was proved she added bad provisional ballots to the count. I can't say it was rigged but so poorly run it may as well have been.
9
When one party controls the three vital centers of state political power, the office of the governor, the state House, and the state Senate, it is called a "trifecta." Trifectas make it easier for the dominant party to pursue its agenda, and more difficult for opposition parties to challenge it. Republicans have had that trifecta since 1999. They have made no attempt to fix, what they call “ a broken election system” since the 2000 Bush-Gore fiasco. But somehow, it is now the fault of Democrats when the margins are razor thin. COUNT EVERY VOTE!!
7
Same thing year after year!
How does this corrupt Snipes woman Still have a job? Why isn't she under investigation?
Isn't it odd to anyone that it's the same state and the very same county that has an issue counting/ finding ballots each election cycle !
Investigate Brenda snipes and her team, now!
7
Isn’t it odd to everyone that Florida has never fixed its voting systems and all the republicans did was voter suppression and the red tide!
2
You fail to give resources to voting, put in charge old people at the poles, make complicated rules, and then complain it takes too long.
4
“But others warned against blaming Ms. Snipes and her staff in an election in which turnout was unusually high for a midterm election.”
If Ms. Snipes and her staff weren’t aware that there was going to be a high turnout for this election, they just weren’t paying attention.
6
The fact that the U.S. is often known to send representatives to other nations to "monitor" their elections to ensure their validity and fairness is irony of the highest order...
7
The fact that the U.S. often is known to send representatives to other nations to "monitor" their elections to ensure their validity and fairness is irony of the highest order...
In Florida, Republican candidates win even when they actually don't. The outcomes are rigged in their favor, as has been shown since the Supreme Court appointed Bush.
5
Joseph Stalin — 'Those who vote decide nothing. Those who count the vote decide everything.'
6
Imagine if Broward County had a Republican election supervisor who has been held liable for election fraud multiple times in the past. This newspaper would be up in arms about the unfairness and how the election is being stolen. Thanks, as always, for the objective coverage
5
Jake
How did you learn about the transgressions you infer unless it was by reading the times? What was unobjective about the coverage?
The not so great state of Florida has a history of ethnic sectarian cleansing violence and terrorism.
Beginning with enslaved Africans and the free Seminole. From the white race riots at Perry and Rosewood to the murders of Harry and Harriet Moore to the killings of Trayvon Martin and Jordan Davis by white terrorists, Florida is an ugly root of inhumane American state evil.
Then there was the farce of Bush v. Gore followed by voter deterrence and suppression focused on color aka race aka black and brown.
3
As Josef Stalin said, “Those who cast the votes decide nothing. Those who count the votes decide everything.”
4
Only in Florida, my God how hard is it?
3
@J Clark Correction. Only in Broward when anyone but a Democrat is leading in the vote
Russia hack?
2
May the lord protect us from anything like the Gore cop out where he let the election be stolen by a phony supreme court decision, rather than insist on an actually accurate vote count. Absolutely and abrogation of duty! (The Iraq war was a direct result of the retard who was 'elected' by the supreme court.) If you run for office you owe it to the electorate to insist on an accurate vote count. If you don't have the cojones to do this, don't run.
5
Here’s a question: how long was Scott the Governor of Florida? And what did he do in those years to fix the state’s ballot issues? Did he even attempt to fix the problems?
I call BS on the soon to be former governor....
8
It is pretty pathetic how a country like the U.S. cannot get as something as basic and vital as an election straight. O f course In Canada we do not bend over backwards trying to deny citizens the right to do so. Racism; in all it`s ugliness; is so obviously at work here. Can`t. win an election fair and square; invent a way to tilt it in your favor any way you can. The answer is mind numbingly simple. More polling stations; more clerks from both parties; to oversee what minor voting fraud may be commited; and if you must use damn machines rather than simply counting ballots; make sure the machines work. One can only conclude after the fiasco 18 years ago that Florida does not care if it gets it right or not. If this insanity happened in any other western nation; heads would roll. But the U.S. seems incapable of getting it right.
3
"The election that must not be named, the one that scarred Florida’s collective psyche 18 years ago..."?
"scarred Florida’s collective psyche"? HUH?
Don't you mean "stole the United States' presidential election in 2000"? As in Bush, Cheney, and their ruinous Iraq War?
And what about the irregularities in the 2012 presidential election in Florida, for that matter?
Willfully "rigable"
4
I was honestly a little confused as to how or why redhats latched on to a county election supervisor in Florida, or why they hate her so much, so I read the article.
I was still a little confused, until I got down to the picture. Ms. Snipes is black.
The GOP is the party of racism. It is the party of people angry the South lost their rebellion. It is the party of white supremacy, and it needs to be stopped.
5
@Randall “I don’t think there’s fraud. There’s incompetence” according to a Democrat. Is it racist also?
One would think after the Bush/Gore fiasco, Florida could get its stuff together. It appears not.
5
Florida the usual “ banana republic “ of the United States of America .
Every vote must be counted , serious fraud investigations must be carried out .
My personal impression about the voting machines , junk !
3
"Protesters, many of them carrying signs supportive of President Trump, gathered outside the office of the Broward County supervisor of elections in Lauderhill, Fla."
Remember Bush v. Gore 2000 when a Republican mob intimidate vote counters? Fascists operate through subversion of democracy. Where is Antifa when you need them?
6
Very fishy Broward County is taking so long to count the votes.
3
what I find 'fishy' is not wanting to count ALL votes, including those mailed in by the military and seniors who did not, or physically could not, wait in line for hours to vote and used the option to mail in their ballot. Furthermore, there were a high number of new, 1st time voters because of the survivors of the Parkland shooting who worked hard to get out the vote. FYI:Parkland is in Broward cty.
3
@FL Sunshine...Is Broward the only county in Florida in which military and seniors mailed in their ballots? Is Miami-Dade having problems counting their mail-in ballots? What about the northern counties? Is this a systemic or specific problem?
Count every vote! Even the fake ones! Democrats don't believe in democracy when they lose.
4
Much has been made of “matching signatures”. I am a new Florida voter and voted in person at an early-voting location, after showing my IDs and signing my name in an iPad like device. Leaning on the electronic surface screwed up and distorted my typical signature. The poll worker cleared it and said to elevate my hand unnaturally —- like signing for an electronic credit card. I said it was awkward and it clearly wouldn’t match. She said “No big deal,” it wasn’t an issue. I wonder if it was because I was white and voting in a deeply red county.
4
Investigate, charge and sentence Brenda Snipes with wanton voter fraud!
She is either corrupt or incompetent.....either way she should be fired at the very least....
1
When 96% of the vote was in, Broward and Dade counties were the two biggest populous counties with a sizable number of votes not in according to the networks.
I did the math (assuming current trends continued) and then saw that both but especially Nelson could beat their republican opponents.
Then all of a sudden, 99% of the vote came in and not much changed.
What happened?
2
This and other pieces on the FL and GA races are short on facts. These were close contests but we should expect that in races. Per the original results, the Senatorial and Gubernatorial races went slightly to the Republicans in FL, and the Gubernatorial race in GA also went slightly to the Republicans. The Democrats have an uphill battle if they think that they can reverse that. Redos of elections are not done in close cases but in cases when the threshhold is needed for victory and is not met, such as what happened in the MS Senatorial race, where neither party won at least 50% of the vote, and where a runoff will be done in 2 weeks. This is per MS law and both candidates are not contesting the rules in the least. In FL and GA, that is not the case. You have very close but still definitive results and one party does not like being so close but no cigar that they are trying to change the rules of the game mid-play. The Democrats should be able to request recounts where the margin of victory is very slim, but not redos. There is a big difference between a recount and a do-over.
1
Is it unreasonable to propose that the election results be thrown out, and that Florida be required to hold an election under international supervision, just like any other politically underdeveloped nation which is unused to the concept of democracy?
I've heard of places where the guy running the election is the guy running as in the incumbent, but never in an advanced, civilized nation. Well, China and Russia, but who would count them as politically advanced?
2
I note the ambiguity of the past elections results.
Happily as an Australian my views cannot change how or why or what Americans voted on.
Nor can I change the time the sun rises tomorrow. However I do know what I will be doing for one minute around 11am on Sunday.
Trump tends to make himself the focus and successfully so.
I quote Patrician of New York:
"Trump keeps complaining about every single seat the Republicans fear losing."
The take away from the US elections are ambiguous and frankly makes the US look like a third world country run by a corrupt despot.
The stench of corruption reeks over matters best left to Mr Mueller.
The author may consider the neutrality of the US prior to 1917.
Mr Trump tweeted:
President Macron of France has just suggested that Europe build its own military in order to protect itself from the U.S., China and Russia. Very insulting, but perhaps Europe should first pay its fair share of NATO, which the U.S. subsidizes greatly!
My read is that the quaint eccentricities of Mr Trump who agonises over popularity has a habit of losing friends.
Frankly Europe has had enough of the Bully in Chief.
I see a sad lonely old man in a bunker who missed a great chance.
Mr Trump could have been a contender on the New York Waterfront.
Measuring ice cream and sand scoops with senior staff in the middle of the night. "The Caine Mutiny".
The world is post Trumpian and has a new freedom.
Europe does not trust Trump.
No deal.
1
If your worst fear is that an election drags on, as opposed to that the candidate with fewer votes is declared winner just because it’s such a bother to count all votes correctly, then you are not understanding democracy. Of course it’s a very American thing: the Supreme Court endorsed this view in Bush vs Gore; it’s regularly asserted that the crucial thing in criminal law is “closure” for the victims no matter if the actual guilty party or a random African American have been fingered as the perpetrator; less importantly Americans can’t admit that 100 teams playing a dozen games each doesn’t allow for identifying a national college football champion.
1
The manner in which Florida manages its elections continues to be an embarrassment for the nation. It's time the state joined us in the 21st century and modernized its voting protocols so these types of fiascoes finally come to an end.
If Bush v. Gore (and this most recent presidential election) taught us nothing else it's that elections DO matter.
4
When other states, such as Washington state, have this figured out, it is hard to see why FL is still struggling.
First, eliminate altogether the election centers where people have to walk in and show their credentials. Why is this still around?
In WA, all ballots are mailed out weeks in advance to registered voters, who have already gone through "precheck" . Nobody votes in person on "election day."
Ballots are filled out at leisure and dropped off into secure drop boxes at convenient locations. Any drop box is as good as any other, so no bus trips to obscure voting booths.
Ballots must be signed, and a computerized system manned by humans compares the signatures with originals in the system.
ballots are screened by machine, and subject to final screened by humans if the computer kicks one out for rerview.
1
What’s up with Florida and elections? If there was ever a need for a federal investigation it’s would be for the Florida election process. Something is very wrong with its elections as time after time after time, now for decades, there are serious problems with Florida elections and their problems have serious consequences for the rest of America.
It’s bad enough the low population states have oversized impact in the U.S. Senate, but Florida simply can’t get an election right.
We need one set of election laws for all states!
4
@Don P....Right on, Don. Delaware, Vermont, Rhode Island, Hawaii and New Hampshire have way too much sway in the Senate.
Why is Snipes still holding an office --- elected or not --- for which she is woefully unfit and unqualified? This statement of facts is not questioned by anyone with either a D or an R attached to their name. Some corruption and incompetence is beyond partisanship.
5
Republicans are sore losers even when they win. Yes, there will be recounts. No, they will not change the results in any significant way. They won't magically flip victory over to the Democrats. Now Republicans are weeping because officials are following State laws instead of turning the election into a Republican coronation. How dare they make sure the votes are counted correctly? That doesn't help Republicans one bit! It's fraud, I tell ya!
1
The only thing clear about Florida voting is that the right to free and fair elections applies only to those the incumbent ‘rulers’ designate. It’s the same in Georgia.
1
Reading the thread evokes a chuckle. Any election Democrats didn’t win was flawed. No stone will be left unturned until all avenues of reversing the “stolen” election are exhausted. When all else fails, scream, yell and protest until the next election. How about a clear agenda that suggests quality leadership?
3
It's almost as if Florida is two states, the upper panhandle with its mostly native, conservative Floridians, and the lower counties with it influx of more liberal northeasterners.
All recounts should be an open process, transparent, and visible to all.
5
Just keep Katherine Harris’s sticky fingers out of it! Same for the Kangaroo trump appointed Supreme Court! Bring in an outside arbiter.
2
Nothing that global warming and melting polar icecaps can't solve.
2
How can Rick Scott oversee and pressure election official to make him victorious even when there is vote counting in action- results of count must be respected similar to Al Gore v G. Bush.
2
Scott railing about how Democrat's are "stealing the election' is a little like Willie Sutton complaining that someone flched his lunch money.
4
Lenin said "it isn't who votes that counts, it's who counts the vote." All voting should be mail in.
2
Florida is turning out to be almost as big of an embarrassment to the country as Trump is. Rising seas can’t come soon enough, coincidently.
Dems can write the book on how to lose an election. As Roseanne Rosannadanna said, "It's ALWAYS somethin." Would be kind of funny (ha ha) if the country weren't going down the tubes. Now we're told that actually counting the votes amounts to stealing the election. I was stationed in Florida in the Air Force in 1972-an election year. Couldn't get out of there fast enough and have never been back.
1
Dear President Macron,
Please send US foreign aid,soon. We need funds to safeguard our elections. Instead of increasing your military budget, we could use your Euro dollars to up grade our voting hardware and to fight voter suppression in the courts. You will get a very good return on your investment without the next two years. The world will be safer and happier. Time is running out. Our children are getting gunned down in schools and our elders are getting massacred in their temples of worship. Restore the legacy of your country, particularly the shame of collaboration, and the world will thank you for generations to come. We have our own shame of collaboration and need help ASAP!
2
I can't understand why it is so difficult for Florida to conduct elections. In Allegheny County, which is home to more than a million people, election results are usually completed before midnight, certainly by the next day. I have voted in person and by absentee ballot since 1972 and have never experienced a problem. The election process here is completely devoid of drama. It can't be that hard to get this right.
7
I’ve always been astonished by how a rich and technologically mature country like the US could face so many irregularities and uncertainties about the polling process - this is what you would expect in Afghanistan or Iraq, not in a relatively stable democracy. Even in India which needs to clean up some aspects around booth access etc there are only rarely such controversies, and these would never be the topics in France or the UK. Perhaps the US needs to spend time in having a less messy and more modern independent electoral commission.
3
Is the problem there are too many absentee votes? Via U.S. mail? Or is the problem deliberate? By either party?
Or is the ballots too complex, especially in the land where there are a lot of older people?
All these are solvable after the 2000 hanging chad debacle.
I mean, I did my early voting here in MA. I went to the town hall the 1st day it was open for voting. A lady there said there is a lot to be read but I have already read the warrant the town sent out so I know who and what. If you take voting seriously, you do that, don't that?
If there are frauds, maybe they should have requested independent observers beforehand. Remember, mail fraud is felony. Anyone caught doing that should be dealt with with extreme prejudice. A couple in NH actually voted multiple times in different states! They should go to jail and have the voting right stripped.
Voting in America is sacred and everyone needs to make it so
5
The U.S. is a rich country. Highly educated. Technologically advanced. Why on earth can't this country figure out a reliable way to count votes accurately and spare us these post-election controversies? The answer, unfortunately, is political: In the eighteen years after the fiasco in Florida during the 2000 presidential election, the Republican Party has shown no willingness to make it easier for Americans to register to vote, or vote, or feel confident that their vote is counted accurately.
12
I voted in Palm Beach County. My primary vote was an absentee vote which got lost in the mail and I requested a second absentee vote which was arrived two days before it was due back. I sent it by by the fastest two day service possible. My general election absentee vote never arrived, however, I had arrived in Florida in time to vote at my poll with early voting. The first time I attempted to vote on an early day, the line was too long so I came back early the next day and finally voted in the general election. What is going on with my missing and lost absentee votes. No one seems to know where they went. True!
61
Perhaps the ballots found their way to election commissions "newly found" ballots.
2
@Phantom
When Trump was running for President he told his people in, I think, Colorado that if they sent in an absentee ballot, they should vote again in the general election. A woman in Texas was arrested for doing just that. I don’t know who you voted for, but what you are describing is basically election fraud, or in old school parlance, ‘stuffing the election box’.
1
And Rick Scott definitely doesn’t want to find out.
2
I'm surprised the SCOTUS hasn't already stepped in to stop the counting. I mean they already have the form. Just white out the date, and re-apply!
61
Trump keeps complaining about every single seat the Republicans fear losing.
This is corrupt intent, and abuse of power (after voter suppression and conflict of interest from Kemp in Georgia).
The Democrats should challenge every single seat the Republicans won, if Trump applies pressure.
Two can play this game. The Republicans have the gall to assume that every single close race should go in their favor. They pulled this off with the politically corrupt Supreme Court decision in 2000. No more.
We’ve learned to fight back.
30
I signed up for a mail-in ballot. It never arrived.
I received numerous texts asking for my mail-in ballot that was never sent.
The Florida Voter's Guide told me to vote "No" on multiple amendments. I didn't agree.
In sum, most people voted YES and amendements were passed.
100%Florida Voter Insanity!
9
Please provide specifics about how Democrats ‘cheat and are willing to commit fraud’.
7
@Don Well, Don, we show up to vote against the will of the reigning monarchy. So there's that.
3
"A judge also ruled that Snipes’ office violated state and federal laws by illegally destroying ballots."
So much for counting every vote.
12
@jaco Weren’t the so-called *destroyed* ballots from a previously counted election, not this one? Do I recall the claim was that the ballots had already been scanned and recounted? So, yes, some ofthe physical ballots were destroyed and that screwed up a late contest of a previous race. But readers seeing this may assume its THIS race.
Play hardball. Learn the lessons from 2000 and fight this one with nuclear weapons. Warren Christopher was a terrible choice. We needed someone like Jim Baker, a ruthless killer. Unfortunately, he was already spoken for.
No, I'm not going to take the high road here. We're in a fight to the death with people who are destroying our nation and 200-plus years of values that built our republic.
Don't give an inch.
24
Why is it that these voting issues continue in states run by Republicans?
17
What data is this fraud accusation based on? Did Scott pull this
out of his hat or somewhere else?
What we do have is hard evidence of voter suppression, restrictive voting laws, and invalidating new voter registrations (majority Democrat) in GA, ND and FL by Republicans. This is anti-democratic and should be ruled illegal.
Republicans want to tilt the scales so proportionately more of their votes counted. Why? Because there are significantly more Democrats in the country than Republicans. They can only win in populous states with diverse populations of voters (across all socioeconomic scales) by cheating ... aside from Texas, which is well, the great state of Texas.
12
This is exactly the same thing done by the GOP in 2000. Vote counters were threatened as they were doing their lawful jobs. See Robert Greenwald's 20004 documentary "Outfoxed".
14
There is something very disturbing about elections in Florida. This is the second time this millennium, where ballot counting has been an issue. This needs to change.
To make matters worse, poor Andrew Gillum, was the victim of racist robocalls and his opponent, is the guy responsible for counting votes.
This is a tragedy and a low down dirty shame. People have historically gone through so much, just to cast a vote. Floridians deserve better for their effort, and asserting their right to vote.
19
“Poor” Andrew Gillum?!? You have got to be kidding me. As a resident of Tallahassee, there is nothing poor about the lifestyle Mayor Gillum is leading. Interestingly this very nice lifestyle looks like it was supported, at least in part, by taxpayer money. And Ron DeSantis is not the one counting the votes.
3
The Secretaries of State , who are responsible for state elections, need to be nonpartisan. However, too many are party stooges trying to suppress the other parties turn out. Florida’s is one of the worst. Remember Kathleen Harris? In addition, what compounds the problem is Trump saying all elections are rigged where he loses. Undermining democracy is another of his autocratic tendencies. A good leader would support the process and shore up the weak areas like Florida to improve it. He is likely to cause violence with his recklessness. Support is what is needed. People need faith when many elections are so close to just above 50%. We are mostly a 51/49% nation. I hope when this administration ends, so does the autocratic streak in the GOP.
2
If only SCOTUS had allowed the true winner to take the WH in 2000. What a different world it would be.
17
Democrats need to do what is necessary to ensure ALL votes are counted. Republicans cheat, lie, are obnoxious and for all of their spouting have proven they do not care about national security, the welfare of the citizenry, the national debt, the truth, and their pro-life policies are pro-gestational only. Everything they say is corrupted speech. And now the GOP, the family of moral values, supports and protects as president a vile human being who will be remembered with the ilks and despots of history. The GOP is complicit, and then becomes his cannon fodder.
So, no more playing nice in the sandbox. Democrats must recognize their opponents for who they are, stiffen their spines and not back down. Don’t be intimidated by loud mouths. Let the vote continue to be counted. An honest count is what we are entitled to.
18
When did Democrats play nice in anything?
1
Seems incompetence is replete in Florida voter registration--greater than even Chicago. Time for nature to wash the state out to sea.
10
Just count every vote. Of course Scott's lead shrank; Broward is largely a Democratic county.
12
This country is nothing but a banana republic until election laws are nationalized. Because of the senate and presidency, the elections in the abominable state of Florida (and worse, Georgia) affect MY LIFE in Oregon. This is most unfair. I demand fair elections in those perpetually po-dunk, historically (and currently) racist, states, and find it odd that in the 21st Century that there is seemingly no solution to their election shenanigans. It's not a game and it's not funny. People's lives are at stake. That these states' elections are Comedy Central fodder should horrify every American with any conscience, and it is NOT funny.
18
Elitist fools like you ensured Trump’s win.
2
To ensure that the American people’s faith is restored in voting and our electoral structures, these “too close to call” races should have a run off. Why not re-do these specific election races which are too close to call? In Austria this happened in the 2016 election, between the FPÖ candidate Norbert Hofer and the Green Party candidate Alexander Van der Bellen. Look it up.
Van der Bellen won in the rematch with 54%.
3
BTW, when will Florida’s Amendment 4 take effect (restoring 1.5 million voters to the roles)?
This new voting bloc WILL change the playing field, as its been shown that disenfranchised voters show strong Democratic preferences. “By removing those with Democratic preferences from the pool of eligible voters, felon disenfranchisement has provided a small but clear advantage to Republican candidates in every presidential and senatorial election from 1972 to 2000,” indicates one study by the ASA.
(http://as.nyu.edu/content/dam/nyu-as/faculty/documents/Democratic_Contraction.pdf)
Mistrust of the Broward elections office and their results is palatable again.
No surprise!
7
We knew back in 2000 that Florida's elections were a mess. We saw the same as in 2002 and we're seeing it again now. Wasn't Rick Scott the governor of Florida for eight years? He knew this problem existed and he did nothing because it favored Republicans and now that he favors Democrats he's crying foul. You should fix it when you had the chance Rick. You're going to lose deservedly so.
9
The GOP plan is always voter suppression on the front end and stop counting ballots while they are ahead on the back end. You didn't notice?
10
One of my most vivid memories from the disastrous 2000 election was the TV footage of a GOP mob — I'll repeat that, mob — storming an office in Florida where votes were being counted. It was a dark and disturbing preview of where the Republicans were heading, if it weren't clear from Newt Gingrich's tenure as Speaker.
Now, with Trump entrenched, we have abandoned all pretense of participatory democracy. Perhaps the U.N. should monitor U.S. elections, as it does those of other banana republics.
14
It’s Eternal Recurrence. The nightmare is real.
2
Why hasn't a federal court appointed a special referee to oversee Florida elections? The state is, obviously, incapable of running a reasonably fair election. Florida is a state ... not a fiefdom. If if can't run its elections, then federal courts should step in and operate the election process openly and fairly.
13
OK. My stupid take on this in Florida and wherever else this happens: change of venue. Hear me out (or not),it goes like this: both sides agree that all the ballots that should be counted are secured; then out of state citizens are brought in, instructed in what is/is not a legal ballot, and they conduct the recount according to the law. It is obvious that in-state counters are prejudiced one way or the other. I know this will take extra time, but an honest count/recount is worth the delay.
1
Why on earth wasn't it a top priority immediately after the 2000 elections, and in the 18 subsequent years, for the Florida legislature to make drastic improvements to ballot design, vote counting and many other mechanisms related to voting?
23
@Suzanne
Well, ask yourself WHO benefited in 2000, 2016, and is trying to benefit again this year from a dodgy voting system?
1
Ah, cuz the GOP leadership.
1
My suggestion is that the law be changed to codify Republicans’ belief that they get to choose when the counting of votes ceases in any particular election.
I envision a new system in which the R candidate stands next to a buzzer, and at the moment the Republican thinks he is in the lead, he punches the button to stop the count. It might happen just as the polls open, or days after the polls close, or never. The important thing is that there is literally voting and literally counting, so that it resembles a democratic process, but the winner can easily be the Republican even if fewer votes were cast for him.
Think of it as combining the results of the 2016 electoral college with a TV game show....perfect for the age of Trump vs Democracy.
15
Hey, I'm an editor in the newsroom's Reader Center. We'd like to hear from people who voted in Florida or Georgia during the midterm elections.
As the counting of ballots continues, I'm curious what the mood is there. How do you feel about the election process? Be sure to include what city and state you’re from. I may pass your information along to a reporter.
41
I retired to Florida in 2016, voted from Chicago last time. Nobody came to sign me up to vote. Democrats are not following the retirees to these sunshine States. Registration is non existent north of Tampa.
14
@Kelly Virella, Editor, Reader Center
My daughter and I vote in Broward, but live overseas. Our ballots have not been counted according to the Broward Election website. (and they are straight D).
27
@Kelly Virella, Editor, Reader Center Here from Duval (Blueval) County. I live in Springfield just north of Downtown.
I arrived at my polling location of 4 years shortly after polls opened. I voted at this location previously. I fall in line to check in. I provide as ID my driver's license that I've had for 6 years, but they can't find me in the system. I am told to fall into a different line where 1 other voter was unable to vote. After a few ways of searching for my voter record, I was located and given a ticket to bring to another table in exchange for a ballot.
This is the first year this major county provides the same ballot in Spanish as a result of a recent ruling.
10
Having a narrow lead, no wonder Scott wants to stop the count. If no more votes are counted, he wins for sure. If the count is completed he may lose.
As Stalin said, it's not who votes that matters; it's who counts the votes.
39
How can every part of the country figure out elections and how to count votes but Broward cannot?
22
@Ryan M
Meet Brenda Snipes
Shades of 2000. We couldn't possibly let the mechanisms work themselves out without the parties' involvement, could we now? Florida gave us the loser of the electoral vote in 2000 after the candidate's brother disenfranchised thousands of overwhelmingly democratic voters. But the post-election chaos was a total mess, too. The whole time of course Bush/Cheney were claiming they had won and Gore/Lieberman were trying to 'steal' the election.
Lost in the partisan jockeying is any notion that the victor should be the one with the most legitimate votes, not the one who wins the political framing battle. But it's Florida, and expectations are pretty low. Interesting, though, the Florida Governor tries to intercede on his own behalf, and the Georgia Sec. of State does the same to win the governor's race.
And republicans want to talk about entitlements . . .
101
@omartraore
If the Dems running the operations in these two voting districts weren't incompetent, breaking laws, and ignoring court orders, no one would need to step in. But they have proven themselves to be incompetent, and criminals, so it time to have the process run according to the regulations and laws.
4
@Steve Sorry , red tide rick had plenty of time to fix this, they did it on purpose, republicans create havoc so they have someone to blame. Count all votes.
4
@Steve You have proof that the DEMS are incompetent, breaking laws, and ignoring court orders? I note you live in LA which is what, about 2,800 miles from Miami. Please submit your proof so the rest of us can see it.
1
Reminds me of Trump’s claim that millions of people voted fraudulently in 2016- another tactic by the aristocracy to destroy democracy!
26
Nobody listened in 2000, when John Lewis, whose life was dedicated to the right to vote, said, "Count every vote", not simply the Supremes, and dump the issue whether the US must wait for a President, so what. This time get it right, count every vote.
35
The irresponsible and groundless rhetoric by the FL Republican candidate and the president are out of line and simply beyond the pale, in light of the president's lies about voter fraud and the Republican efforts throughout the SE to disenfranchise black and Latino voters. By contrast, Abrams, Gillum and Nelson have demonstrated the precisely the characteristics that we want in our public servants. We do not want the Trump Republican conspiracy theories, racism and fear. We want truth, love and courage.
45
Since Trump makes every election about himself, it's time for his impeachment for voter suppression and fomenting the collapse of the American government.
10
I vote in Broward. All ballots are paper and subject to recount. Scott's tantrum comes from Florida law: a difference of one quarter of one percent triggers an automatic manual recount of all ballots in all counties. If he has more votes, Scott has nothing to lose and everything to gain. On the other hand, if Nelson has more votes, that's the way the cookie crumbles. Scott apparently is quivering in his shoes.
59
Rick Scott has been in charge of the state for 8 years. Why didn't his administration bring FL and it's election system into the 21st century. If there are problems in the ballot box it's because the Republicans did not want a efficient and fair voting process.
61
@Greg
Scott knows how fraud is committed (at HCA), so he likely has brought his "business acumen" to Florida. Money or ballots, it's the same to his type.
5
@Greg H.
That, my friend is a very legitimate question. I am a Republican, and I suspect you are a Democrat, yet I support your comment. This entire country needs to look to right vs wrong before left vs. right. Blindly following any party is the true danger we face as a country. Neither party does or ever will get everything right; and we the people need to point out either side's performance regardless of political opinion. Clearly, accurate and unquestionable election results must trump political persuasion in all cases (no pun intended).
7
@Greg H.
The Broward County elected Democrat is conducting the count.
1
Whatever else happens in these elections, if observers from both parties are not allowed to be in the rooms where the recounts are happening, there will be shouts of fraud. There will probably be shouts of fraud anyway but at least representatives from both parties will be there to see the counts and it might dull some of the more histrionic rhetoric.
In NJ, challengers, as we call observers, are there at every step of the voting process. It does make a difference.
15
The Democrats are so desperate to win that they are willing to cheat and commit fraud. Why don't they just admit they lost their races and concede gracefully. Any recounting of ballots will prove that the Republicans clearly won their contests. The Democrats will eventually have to admit their defeat. It is better to do it sooner than later and save face.
8
Clairvoyance is a rare skill. Congratulations on having it.
7
@WPLMMT
Better yet, why don't the Republicans declare victory before the votes are counted at all? Saves even more time and money.
7
@WPLMMT:
Uh, why not just count all the votes, carefully and with due deliberation, and *then* decide who won?
I mean, if you're so sure about the results of a recount, why wouldn't you want to see one?
12
All votes have yet to be counted. Reasonable people want all of the votes counted to determine who actually won in Florida.
Then, there are the Republicans, who will not wait for all votes to be counted, but instead will attempt to bully the country into accepting this while cutting short the counting of votes. Democrats will likely remain calm and simply press to have all votes counted - sadly this will probably lead to the usual steamrolling.
Remember, BY LAW there must be a re-count if the margin is less than 0.5%. Republicans are now hellbent on making sure that if they lose said re-count, they can simply de-legitimize the outcome, and thus de-legitimize voting, democracy, Bill Nelson and elections themselves. They really don't seem to understand the great damage they do to the nation when they constantly play with fire by intentionally undermine voting and elections with no evidence.
47
@Frank Roseavelt,
You write...”The Republicans don’t seem to understand the damage they are doing to our democracy...”
They most certainly understand; they just don’t give a damn.
1
Doesn't anyone question the fact that proposition 4 passed by 4 million votes (2,000,000 over votes against) and Scott was against it. If anyone should be questioned it is Scott.
And certainly Kemps behavior before the election should be questioned. It is my understanding that he knew of the amount of ballots not counted and refused to tell Abrams
Both of these guys are questionable and with trump supporting them, makes them more questionable.
39
Trump cries fraud when things aren't going the way he'd like. I fear this is a what will happen in 2020, should the Presidential election go to the Democrat. Trump will make a thinly veiled call for unrest. Some, and it wan't take many, of Trump's followers will quickly respond to the call and take matters into their own hands. I fear the outcome.
18
The only reason I wouldn't double check my work is if I wanted it to end up wrong. I used to be proud of my country.
13
Is it going to be the Brooks Brothers riot all over again? Political types bussed in to keep the Florida vote from being counted. Political types who by and large went to work for the Koch Brothers or an affiliated organization afterwards. I hope someone in the press is taking pictures and matching up faces.
26
Another case study in which “elected” officials aren’t always the best. Time for a new process...no wonder people don’t vote they can’t be sure who is counting or if anyone is counting their votes.
5
This proves it, the US can no longer hold fair elections. It’s time to get UN inspectors in to monitor elections.
31
@JER.
That would be guaranteed wins for Democrats. It's not as if UN inspectors would be neutral. Hillary would have paid the $40 billion per year global warming tithe that Obama promised.
1
I don't have a dog in the Florida fight. But, the Governor should have State Troopers seize all ballots and deliver them under guard to the State Attorney General. I may be a Republican but I value an Honest election outcome more than party loyalty.
13
@Old Sarge,
The same Florida Attorney General, Bondi, who took campaign money from Trump and later drop charges against his fraudulent University.
2
Just like in 2000 I expect Republican operative "protestors" to descend on these offices and cause as much chaos as possible. When they declare they are defending democracy from fraud, it's completely the opposite.
22
Will the U.S. Supreme Court have the stomach to stop another history-making recount?
I cannot imagine living in any Southern state; they truly do not seem to be part of America.
19
@Candlewick
There is no need for SCOTUS intervention. It's no problem if it takes months to name a Senator, it just means that Florida will only have one Senator until they get the situation resolved. It took eight month for the Democrats in Minnesota to fabricate enough vote to elect Al Franken.
1
Bet if investigated most of the elections in a Florida were fake. Remember Bush and Gore. This time the Republicans got caught. The election system is failing probably in more then one state.
13
FRAUD!!"
Right, and it's most likely on the Republican side.
I will give Mr. DeSantes the benefit of the doubt, but not Mr. Scott nor his Attorney General, Ms. Bondi.
But everyone beware, the fraud is not in Miami-
Dade, Broward nor Palm Beach Counties and it's not fraud perpetrated by voters. It is more likely a coordinated effort by the State Attorney's, Governor's Office and some County elections officials.
What should happen is a thorough audit and complete recount of all precincts. Difficult, yes, impossible, hardly.
In the past, here in Florida, the Republicans have been very successful at misdirecting the Democrats attention away from the location of the their illegal efforts.
I applaud protests on both sides, it's time that VOTERS, not politicians, determine our own future.
24
It’s about the numbers.
Plain and simple.
Rick Scott’s claims of fraud are petty and reveal his fear about finding the truth.
(I hope Scott loses)
28
As a lifelong Republican, I am appalled at the behavior of some of my own party's candidates and their inability to win with dignity. Scott and DeSantis won their elections because their policy proposals are more popular with the citizens of Florida, period. When they accuse state officials of fraud and resort to these tired old Kennedy-era tactics, they undermine the legitimacy of their own victory. Absentee and provisional ballots get counted last because it isn't practical to count them first. Scott would have us believe that they dug these votes up in a cemetery somewhere. But all the mail-in ballots and recounts in the world aren't going to flip this race. Like Trump's insistence that he somehow secretly won the popular vote, Scott's fairy-tale accusations are an attack on the legitimacy of representative democracy. He doesn't want to represent the half of Florida that didn't vote for him. As far as he's concerned, those people don't exist. So he says he didn't just win, but the people who voted against him aren't real people. With 100% of the vote, he has a real Republican mandate. Meanwhile Trump doesn't want to accept that he won the presidency one state at a time. He has to make us believe that he won a sweeping majority of the entire American population. When he says that, he's undermining the system that the Founding Fathers created to protect State Rights from majoritarian tyranny. He's saying America doesn't need it. That's going to hurt him in the end.
11
@Alan Beauregard,
And yet you still support them and belong to this disingenuous party called the GOP.
1
@Alan Beauregard Florida resident here, and De Santis had policies? In all the blizzard of ads, I couldn't find one. In the primary, the only message was he loved Trump more than anyone. After that, Trump not mentioned at all, just the usual vague Republican pap (guns, fetuses,etc.) and of course the dystopian horror that would ensue if the black guy was elected.
And Scott's I'm-just-the-benign-grampy-of-six-grandsons-diggin-in-the-yard-for-bugs schtick was truly nauseating. He's showing his true nature now with the vicious, baseless attacks.
The Army is tied up repelling an invasion crowd walking without weapons through Mexico. And Afghanistan, of course.
So send in the Navy to sort the ballots in Florida. They've got one heck of a coastline, and amusement parks galore. Each ship has more computing power than the entire state bureaucracy--and they can even patrol the Everglades.
The Air Force...well, they could throw in a few flyovers on the way to their NFL appearances.
8
It won't be long before Trump's thugs show up to storm the recount. It'll be made to look like local citizens got fed up and took things into their own hands. Democratic and Progressive Independents must stand up and not allow this to happen! Rick Scott needs to sit down and let the count finish.
17
Just another example of how the greatest threat to Freedom and Democracy in our country remains the republican party and its president.
18
Oh, the sweet IRONY! Now if only the Republican candidates lose because of "voting irregularities", Ms. Karma will be satisfied.
7
@Kingfish52
The Republicans are going to win, and the Democrats are positioning themselves to claim it is because of voting irregularities.
the problem with provisional ballots is that the voter has a week to report to the election board with an explanation and documentation to address the reason for the provisional ballot.
1
Sigh..... the great evidence-free GOP "voter fraud" fraud continues.
“I just felt that it’s very unfortunate that some of the highest elected officials in our country are trying to disrupt our democracy because they don’t like the demographics of our voters,”
Well, you know what they say (in the halls of Republican power): if you can't stop 'em from voting, you can stop their votes from being counted.
14
Oh please. Rick Scott is a snotty rich guy who thinks he can buy anything he wants, especially public elective office. It must just sizzle him that he can't simply pay and go. Broward County, where I grew up, is indeed heavily democratic, always has been. Given that, plus the huge increase in turnout, will slow up the vote tally. Every vote should be counted and by law, a certain margin will require a re-count. If the situation was reversed, Scott would be screaming for a re-count. The vote in Florida, in fact, is coming out just as the polls said -- a dead heat for the U.S. Senate and Governor. Scott needs to cool is jets, his money can't buy everything. And Gaetz needs to shut up an sit down.
28
With her history of deeply questionable not just mistakes but *incompetence* that runs counter to the very definition of her job, what was Brenda Snipes still doing in that election supervisory position and on the taxpayer dole at all?
5
@Maggie
Apparently, they approved of her destruction of ballots in 2016, and re-elected her.
2
Maybe "Republican politicians stage protest to stop votes from being counted." Where did the "dozens" of protestors come from? Did they really "erupt" Were they on a bus with the Republican rep? Did we already forget the staged riots when the repubs stole the election from Gore?
10
So, supporters of Trump don't want all the ballots counted correctly?
Sounds about right.
20
I lived in Broward County for 17 years, and, unlike the out of state commentators, know the incompetence of this election supervisor first hand. To not know, or post, the number of votes cast days after the election clearly gives rise to suspicion. Scott’s lawsuit was well founded.
18
@Richard
An argument from authority (type of logical fallacy):
" I know what you don't. I have no proof, you simply should trust me because I know."
11
What’s your opinion on Kemp overseeing his own election?
1
@Richard maybe it's just incompetence and got nothing to do with fraud. I heard the election supervisor was appointed by a Republican governor.
2
An alarming replay of 2000 election being played out. The Florida ballot was piled up with 13 Constitutional amendments and countless other local resolutions, in some counties with bi or tri lingual ballots the ballot stretched for many pages.
Let the counties take the time to count every vote. That is the correct constitutional way.
I'm highly skeptical of the initially reported under votes for Nelson in Broward... a Democratic stronghold.
If all the votes are allowed to be counted, Senator Nelson will likely prevail.
Trump and Scott as principals in the outcome should have no say until all votes are counted and recounted.
25
@JL
It does not take any longer to run the ballots through the scanner because they are printed in more than one language. Although that may very well be the reason that some Democrats didn't fill in all of the bubbles.
What poor reporting. Judge Philips' ruling cited a violation of the Florida state constitution and a statute that requires disclosure of the numbers of all ballots immediately after polls close. Whether there is any sort of tampering remains to be seen, but the elections supervisor is way out of compliance and the Republicans have ample grounds for concern.
20
@HMI
Yes. Absolutely that angle should have been reported, and absolutely, yes, investigate. But I'm sure there are ample grounds for concern on BOTH sides. As a former college registrar, I can tell you that there are rules about how the counting of things (be they ballots or course registrations) is supposed to happen and when it is supposed to finish, but there's often a disconnect between those rules and the adequacy of budgeting and staffing of the operation that must do the counting. And then often unpredictable complications occur as well. Out of compliance or not, I retain enormous respect and appreciation for those who bear the brunt of the job of counting. Investigate away, but I'm putting my money the integrity of the counters.
43
@HMI
Get a grip. Given the history of voter suppression and voter intimidation and poll purges and documented election fraud by the last three Republican governors of Florida(and their stooges), are you really contending that the problem here is that the people democratically elected to carry out this election are trying to carry out their responsibilities. Try to see this for what it is. An all-hands, no-holds-barred effort to stop the count before Scott lose his lead. If all the valid ballots are counted, Scott loses.
Scott knows that Broward will put Nelson over the top.
11
@Paul Dobbs
If the election clerk knew that it would take days, not hours, to deal with the ballots they already had piled up, then at a bare minimum it should have been announced. Properly, it should have been addressed in advance of the election. On no count should the elections office have simply stonewalled, which is one of the things the judge took them to task for—violation of the state open records rules. And for elections, I don't want your money on the putative integrity of the counters; I want transparency so I don't have to wonder about their integrity in the first place.
2
DEMOCRATS! Don't let the new Florida elections be stolen like the Gore election. Every Floridian who voted for Sen. Nelson needs to get out to the streets immediately to make certain that every legal vote is counted. Trump supporters are a far more aggressive protest group than the rest of the population and this is a perfect fight for them. They won't give in without massive protests by Nelson supporters insisting that all their votes count. Right wing extremists have years of practice suppressing the votes of minorities. Now we've got to fight back with every legal weapon at our disposal.
This is a "Break The Glass" moment. Trump is quickly making the Rule of Law irrelevant. We can only resist through thousands of supporters in the streets of Florida and hundreds of thousands across the nation. This is a turning point in the history of our democracy and democracies throughout the world.
Start marching and calling your legislators!
107
@Rita Tamerius
The resistance has been protesting for two years. Trump supporters have nothing to protest about.
4
We don't need the Russians to create doubts about our election process. Our own politicians are doing a fine job of that. We've seen it in Georgia. We've seen it many other states. We are now seeing it in Florida.
We need to come up with one uniform system that addresses voter eligibility, verification, methodology, and dispute resolution. It should be secure against tampering and it should have an audit feature built in.
For our democracy to work, be they Republicans, Democrats, Independents or whatever, people have to believe the system is fair.
Until the system is fixed, politicians like Trump should keep their big mouths shut when it comes to disparaging the process in place as a means to seek advantage.
29
the republican party is openly acknowledging it doesnt want eery vote counted. just let that sink in...
128
It's very funny, because it reminds me of the news story from last year about how the Russians had hacked DNC email and then handed damaging info to Wikileaks, an organization that was both progressive and pro trump (strange, but true). To signal their friendship, Wikileaks got in touch with Donald Trump Junior, and he responded by promoting their content.
They also, I believe, advised DJTJr. to cry fraud whenever it looked like Trump might lose.
So, Trump and Scott are pretty much just following the Russian playbook in an attempt to destabilize our elections. Pretty sad for all of us, if you think about it.
71
@Elinor
Let's be clear. You refer to how the Russians "hacked DNC email and then handed damaging info to Wikileaks." That "damaging info," of course, was actual emails, written by actual DNC staffers & leaders (including Podesta, Wasserman-Schultz, and Brazile, among others), about other DNC staff, and candidates like HRC & Bernie.
So, Yes, the Dems were harmed by people finally learning what the DNC leaders were saying and doing.
1
@Elinor, not sad; immoral, evil, and possibly illegal.
It is totally inappropriate for Trump to be commenting on any election recounts.
If he is so worried about voting problems he should look at what's happened in Georgia, where the corrupt Republican gubernatorial candidate wouldn't recuse himself as the secretary of state during the election and has a record suppressing votes.
98
@L I agree with you 100%. A President should not comment on vote counts... or trials while they are in progress, or investigations that are underway, or... But THIS "President" has no sense of restraint or of what's appropriate and what's not. And he has certainly not spent a millisecond thinking about what it might mean to act as President of ALL Americans, not just his narrow base.
10
Everyone knows they are not counting votes in Broward County, they are FINDING them. When they lose, dems will delegitimize the result. A disgrace, but we are, thanks to Democrats, a third world country...
11
Skyfinder: right now they are processing ballots sent in by military personnel overseas, and seniors who chose to vote by mail instead of standing in a line for hours to vote. What's so wrong with that? If you oppose that, I feel sorry for you.
20
There is no voter fraud, but there is voter suppression. That is what needs to be investigated.
157
The Feds need to stay out of this and let the State do it's own auditing.
When all is said and done then if they can show cause then they can do an investigation.
The protesters need to back off and let the state people do their job.
18
@BTO
We are in a classic Catch-22 moment in our nation regarding the vote
Counts in Florida and Georgia.
We can’t trust the state actors and we can’t trust the federal government.
Some years ago my mother went to South Africa to serve as an election observer after the fall of apartheid.
We need election observers right here in America.
7
We shall never be a unified nation with this president. Every event becomes a reason for him to declare war between his “we” and the rest of us.
It is time for the media to report nothing that comes out of his mouth, but only to report his actions. His babbling is completely unworthy of adult discussion. And rather quickly, we will come to notice that that is all that he ever was.
56
He doesn't have any "better" lawyers who want to work for him. Lawyers like to get paid.
16
It is clear that the only way the USA can conduct a fair election is under UN supervision and international monitors.
53
Rick Scott at the head of Columbia/HCA was responsible for the biggest Medicare/ Medicaid fraud in US history. By all means let's let him do it again in Fla.
46
@John MD
He already has as exposed by Bill Nelson. He made hundreds of millions of dollars during his tenure as Gorvernor. He bought his election as governor and has tried to buy an election as Senator. I hope Bill Nelson wins this as at some point, good needs to triumph over bad.
9
@John MD
If I remember correctly he was able to “ get “ just about 600 millions dollars from Medicare ...that was many years ago , worth much more in today’s $
6
@John MD -- Really. How ironic Rick Scott is crying fraud!
9
Notice how the Republicans always prefer their villains to be black, or women, or both?
55
@Corbin
In many local municipalities, that's who is most often a government employee.
1
@Corbin No the Republicans prefer that the villain be the person who is responsible and in the case it is the supervisor of elections. If more than a week after the elections several TRUCK loads of ballots suddenly show up it is a major problem for democracy. This is a bipartisan problem. By casting aspersions on Republicans in this case you trivialize the problem and turn your head away from finding a solution.
1
No one involved in any way with any campaign should be using the word "fraud" except in a legal filing supported with appropriate evidence. These inflammatory comments damage our democracy itself. Be responsible!
25
Sound like cooler heads need to prevail. This is in lawyer land now. It is times like this we can always count on the President to do the right thing and pour gasoline on the flames.
18
"Deja vu all over again."
15
Eighteen years ago, the GOP pulled the same stunt -- the "Brooks Brothers Riot" to steal an election.
The Times lectured us on decorum, reproduced the GOP's lies, as yesterday is quoted without comment Scott's Spokesman's claim that the democrats were trying to steal an election.
Will the Times now keep a steady light on this behavior or allow democracy to die in darkness?
33
These people need tin-foil hats. Anytime their rule is threatened by Democrats, it must be "VOTER FRAUD!" Such a bunch of sore losers. Could it just be that the electorate is tired of sending crooked Republicans to office?
33
What a laugh!
Call me by your name indeed!
So, Crooked Rick and the REPUBs who ran Florida (into the ground) all these years never managed to get the elections right...but "What me worry" when REPUBs kept getting elected.
Now that that changed, now we worry and call you crooked...which is really our name.
And should the standards the REPUBs want for themselves in Florida also be applied to Georgia?
Ha! Ha! Let's talk out of both sides of our crooked mouths...LOCK THEM UP INDEED!
13
"“Don’t worry, Florida — I am sending much better lawyers to expose the FRAUD!” Mr. Trump wrote."
Like Mr. Cohen?
24
Fight like our lives depend on it, FL Democrats.
31
Photographer Scott McIntyre deserves a Pulitzer Prize for the photo accompanying this story. The skepticism in the eyes of the two people of color, and the restraint and resolve in their gestures: bravo! They sum up the strength that we all have to muster if the democracy that America has always promised is going to come to fruition. My skin is pretty white, but I can tell you that, in my heart, I know that those two are my people! God bless them!
45
Pretty rich, Rick Scott crying fraud. Waiting for the Brooks Brothers Riot 2.0
98
Here we go again. Another Florida recount coup d'etat by Republicans. In 2000, it happened with a GOP mob at the Miami-Dade courthouse. In 2018, it's happening in Broward County with another GOP mob. As the song goes, they're sending "lawyers, guns, and money" to steal power, as they did in 2000. Have they no sense of decency?
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@Voter "Have they no sense of decency?" Rhetorical question, no?
3
@Voter The Broward County elections supervisor has a history of shady polling procedures and has been admonished before. The NYTimes didn't tell you but you can easily Google it up. She is either incompetent or criminal.
We're right, your wrong. Wah, Wah, Wah. why would anyone be afraid of a recount if they have observers. Oy vey.
55
There's more than a whiff of desperation here - a fight to prevent a recount when the margins are so tight? Finish the count and then bring in the forensic scrutineers - the results could benefit either party. If there is no re-tallying in a razor's edge finish uncertainty can be the only certain outcome, something we could well do without in this pivotal juncture in US politics.
28
@Tom Storm They are doing the count in private, ergo the lawsuit. They won't let Republicans in to see what they are doing. This is so unfair and the American people see it.
Republican don't like when people vote. And if they vote anyway, they don't like when their votes are counted.
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Interesting. Whenever the vote count in a state that bleeds red gets too close for the GOP comfort, Republicans cry fraud. It's like 2000 all over again.
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How can the culture of corruption GOP still be bringing in the votes when they support the shooters and massacres 307 in 311 days in America and won't help the Dems stop this violence. I support the military and police now only to have the right to get the bullets. The American people have abused this right and it has to be taken away . No more bullet sales to the public. California has the toughest gun laws and every state needs the exact same laws.
14
@D.j.j.k. California has the toughest gun laws yet mass shootings happen in California. Texas has lax gun laws. When was the last mass shooting in Texas?
@joe,
Last mass shooting in Texas occurred this year. Don’t recall the name of city, but the shooter opened fire on a church congregation.
Republicans can only win by cheating :
Gerrymandering, removing voters names from rolls.
What was Kemp doing? In charge of elections while running for office at the same time?
Does no one think that is the height of corruption?
In many states it is easier to buy a gun than vote.
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@Carla. Thats Rick Scott,not Kemp, and he is only in charge of state matters. These votes are at the county level and the county heads are on charge of their county, like Snipes in Broward. In this day and age of computerized ballots, every county has results almost immediately. How is that Broward is still counting four days later, when every other county was done Tuesday night? How is it that all the newly counted votes are all for Nelson when on Tuesday night, with 99% of all votes counted, Scott had a 60,000 vote lead? This smells rotten and the American people see it.
Why can't we have one trustworthy election system for the whole country, I wonder.
30
If he wants to ensure his victory, Rick Scott should talk to W's team members. They are very experienced in all this.
12
I find it pretty rich that republicans continually accuse democrats of trying to turn the US into Venezuela while simultaneously promoting incarceration of political dissidents.
30
America, this is lunacy. Does anyone not remember Bush v. Gore, 2000? Does anyone not recall the crazy Republican operatives who actively disrupted the ballot counting process?
Does anyone not notice which political party was in control of Florida for the past 4 years (Rick Scott) and who is Secretary of State (Republican Ken Detzner). Florida Republicans, and Donald Trump in particular, the voters of Florida are playing by YOUR rules. And that means ALL of those vote-by-mail and provisional ballots cast MUST be counted.
My suggestion. ANYONE who DISRUPTS the legal counting and recording of votes cast in Florida ought to be arrested by the County Sheriff and forcibly removed from the premises. Let the orderly process begin and fully work its path throughout the counting of votes. To Gov. Rick Scott, this means you MUST uphold your solemn oath to protect the rights of ALL FLORIDA VOTERS.
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It does appear more than coincidental that Republicans, who are so effective at legislating to make it harder for folks to vote, and to gerrymander districts in their favor, are also now suddenly expanding their area of interestto include challenging government officials who count votes. I'm not sure that Andy Borowitz's latest satirical column in the New Yorker is a laughing matter or a painfully true assessment of the situation:
Rick Scott Accuses Democrats of Trying to Thwart G.O.P.’s Successful Voter Suppression
“They are literally finding votes by people we are a hundred per cent sure we had scared away from the voting booths,” the outgoing Florida governor said. “This will not stand.”
By Andy Borowitz
40
Why would Trump even have standing to sue? Even sending his lawyers would be little more than election interference by outside agitators.
16
@Patrick Overturning an election with votes "found" three days later, thereby postulating an anti-senator to serve as Senator, affects the entire American people and the Federal Government. Why wouldn't the President have standing?
@Joe
You are postulating your own conclusion. Joe thinks certain ballots are illegitimate because they were “found three days latter”. Therefore Joe is sending his lawyer to Florida to straighten the whole mess out? Again I ask why does Trump even have standing? That stuff about affecting the entire American people and the Federal Government is pure nonsense. Why not just declare that people from NYS can no longer vote because they always elect Democratd?.
GOP now opposes counting all Florida and Georgia ballots when in previous elections they insisted all ballots be counted. What changed? Could it be a different RACE?
19
@Frank Jay. They are not opposing anything other than being shut out of the counting. How is it fair for one party to count all the "new" votes and not let the other party in to see the counting?
Listening to the radio at noon today in Florida it was reported that 3 more TRUCKS of ballots were brought to the supervisor of elections. This is in addition to all the found ballots they were already working on. Dr. Snipes is either incredibly incompetent or guilty of single handily changing the outcome of elections. The Democrats who run the county should have gotten rid of her long ago. There are 12 different instances in which she has seriously screwed up elections in only 15 years and yet she remains on the job. This is an attack on our democracy and you should hate it no matter what party you call home. When you vote you expect your vote to be counted. If you live in Broward County, Florida it is no slam dunk.
12
@Al Galli. It's not just Broward. Through Broward, they intend to disenfranchise every other voter in Florida, overturn two elections and thereby affect the U.S. Senate, thereby disenfranchising every voter in America. These are acts of traitors, subversives or 5th columnists. Every American should reject these scammers.
1
A lot of the protestors who objected to the recount in 2000 weren't even from Florida. And this one consisting of Trump's "loyalists" appears to be even worse while they chant, "Lock her up" and threaten people.
They are protesting democracy.
67
Remember the Brooks Brothers Riot during the 2000 Florida recount? Here we go again. After suppressing the vote of thousands of Florida citizens (and thousands in Georgia, I might add), I guess it's time to protest that the votes that escaped your voter suppression actually be counted...
17
Florida and legitimate voting seem to mix like oil and water.
7
What's with the State of Florida? They can't seem to get it right when it comes to the election process and counting votes.
4
LOL I'm from FLA and Scott is a crook and thief .. did you really expect them to play by the rules. He should have been in prison for defrauding Medicare not our governor.
16
1. Trump needs to stay out of state politics
2. Disallow any ballot with a postmark originating in Russia
21
Every election there's big problems in Florida. It's third world. I'd say the Feds should step in, but that would be just adding to the corruption with the current crew. Many states have problems but Florida is beyond the pale. People of good conscience should be ashamed ....
And speaking of that, they are playing it down now, but New York City had many problems which is really a disgrace. The big time city of the world can't get it's voting in order. And I'll tell you something, the Mayor, even though it's not directly his problem, once again did not take responsibility and blamed everybody else, like he always does.
9
I am seriously considering having a UN watchdog come in and monitor Florida's elections from here on out, because this is absurd.
14
"No rag-tag group of liberal activists or lawyers from DC will be allowed to steal this election from the voters in the state of Florida."
Sure, Gov Scott, only you can steal elections, right?
"Lock him up" chants are certainly in order for Gov Medicare Fraudster.
33
Florida, you had 18 years to learn your lesson and get it together... geez. Perhaps leaving the system as it was benefited the Republicans and helped them disenfranchise Democrats. Now that they are losing ground in their own rigged system, its fraud.
11
I count a total of six people in the photo with this story. A scary mob if they're all protesters.
3
Where is the deep reporting on voter suppression in Florida and Georgia ? Why does trump get headlines with claims of voter fraud and suppression falls off the news pages?
21
For Martha and Rick:
Slip Slidin' Away
Paul Simon
Slip slidin' away
Slip slidin' away
You know the nearer your destination
The more you're slip slidin' away
6
Does " Florida Man " Control Florida VOTING ??? Is it something in the water, OR the culture ??? Seriously.
2
The possible changing of election day results in Florida and Arizona does not in itself suggest fraud.
The big story of election night coverage is absentee ballots. The media, left and right, is completely asleep on the increase in absentee ballots and its implications.
As a Republican, it pains me greatly to see the apparent wins in Florida and Arizona possibly evaporate, but the numbers are simply the numbers.
Think of Arizona, where McSally led Sinema by about 15,000 votes on election day. But the number of outstanding ballots was estimated at about 650,000. If that 650,000 split just 52% to 48% in favor of Sinema, then Sinema would pick up about 25,000 votes, giving her the victory with 10,000 votes to spare. The same math, on a larger scale is playing out in Florida.
I’m not saying that voter fraud didn’t/won’t occur, because I have no idea. This will be investigated and judgment passed by the courts. I’m only saying that this kind of vote shift is easily possible without any fraud.
The moral of the story is that election night media coverage is essentially meaningless for close races. This will extend to more races in the future if more people choose to vote by absentee ballot, which seems likely.
The good news is that people can skip election night media coverage and binge watch their favorite Netflix series instead. It will be much more enjoyable.
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@John
Thanks for saying this. Truly heartening to hear a reasonable voice.
28
@John. So basically, you make a case for 'No Absentee Ballots'. I agree. You can't possibly know who is voting absentee. And once it arrives from our non-stainable, non-corruptible, unblemished, diligent beyond imperfection U.S. Postal Service, well someone takes them and puts them in the county 'absentee ballot room'... I'm sure one trusted official from each party takes them there and they stand guard all night and day until the counting begins. But even then, why, when we have electronic scanner voting machines, are we finding ballots 3 days later?
2
@John
Well said. Just because they are slow counting absentee ballots and the extremely close vote is getting even closer (as expected in heavily Democratic Broward County) doesn't imply fraud. They may be slow, even disorganized, but the truth will come out if allowed. This is the largest county in Florida - not a rural county with a total of 6,000 votes.
17
Here you go: https://www.newyorker.com/humor/borowitz-report/rick-scott-accuses-democrats-of-trying-to-thwart-gops-successful-voter-suppression - all quote ->
Rick Scott Accuses Democrats of Trying to Thwart GOP’s Successful Voter Suppression
TALLAHASSEE, FLORIDA (The Borowitz Report)—In a hastily called press conference on Thursday evening, Florida Governor Rick Scott accused Democrats of nefariously plotting to undo the Republican Party’s highly successful voter-suppression effort.
“As Republicans, we have worked tirelessly to intimidate, discourage, and otherwise disenfranchise millions of Florida voters,” a visibly enraged Scott said. “We are not about to let Democrats swoop in at the last minute and ruin all of that fine work.”
Scott angrily singled out the Broward County and Palm Beach County supervisors for their “rampant enforcement of the right to vote.”
“They are literally finding votes by people we are a hundred per cent sure we had scared away from the voting booths,” he said. “This will not stand.”
The Florida governor said that if Democrats think that they can undermine the Republicans’ arduous and painstaking efforts to suppress votes in Florida, “they better think again.”
“I will not sit idly by while every vote is counted,” Scott said. “This is Florida, goddammit.”
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Brilliant!
13
Are you serious? Yes, the Democrats are pulling out all stops to manufacture votes. Remember Mayor Daily in Chicago? Some how, just enough votes are always 'found' to elect the Democrat. (see Washington state).
3
@Susan Anderson
You realize some number of readers will take this as Gospel.
5
Absolutely unacceptable in 2018 that this is still happening. The problem can be solved low-tech (paper ballots that can be recounted and verified) or high-tech (reliable electronic voting with verifiable, instant results including a printed vote confirmation). This is the kind of technology that accurately and reliably processes millions of bank and credit card transactions every day.
There is no explanation for this except that someone has an interest in keeping voting as unreliable and unaccountable as possible. Now who might that be?
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@Pat
Democrats demanded computer voting in Florida after 2000. Look it up.
2
@Pat. Obviously the party that is losing and wants to win.
1
@Pat
No technology or process will be reliable or trustworthy in the hands of Brenda Snipes.
1
We've been through a version of this before in Florida, in 2000. It should not be allowed to happen again.
In 2000, Republican lawyers succeeded in stopping the Florida presidential vote recount, ensuring that Mr. Bush officially carried Florida by 537 votes. This was a colossal injustice, subverting our most precious right, the right to vote.
Subsequent surveys, one on behalf of the Washington Post and the other for the Palm Beach Post, found that Mr. Gore had a nearly three-to-one majority among 56,000 Florida voters whose ballots were discounted because they contained more than one punched hole. The Post survey determined that Mr. Gore had a majority of 682 votes among the discounted, so-called “dimpled “ballots in Palm Beach county.
Had all of Florida’s presidential votes been counted, Mr. Gore would have won Florida's 21 electoral college votes by a narrow majority and he, not Mr. Bush, would have been president. The rest is history.
Trump and his Republican allies should let the current recount be completed, without interruption, limitation, or tampering. Our right to have our votes counted must be kept inviolate, not vulnerable to partisan sabotage, as it was eighteen years ago in Florida.
183
Gee, I guess you are new to the Times. After the 2000 election the NYTimes and USAToday together ran every conceivable recount scenario for Florida and except for the most extreme case Bush won!
6
@Mark Hugh Miller. But Gore did not win the lousy eight electoral votes of his home state. Had he done so, he wins. The people who knew him best wanted nothing to do with him as President.
1
@Donna Gray. Right, Donna, more fake news from the Failing New York Times. SAD!
1
So now both sides are heaving charges of voter fraud and vote manipulation. Neither with much evidence except they don't like the result of the election.
2
@c harris
no. There is plentiful evidence of Republican voter suppression and other forms of cheating, and having the Secretary of State eliminate hundreds of thousands of voters on trivial grounds so he can win an election is only one of many.
Republican accusations are an illustration of the old adage:
The best defense is a good offense. But the proof is not there, while there is plentiful proof of voter suppression and cheating in a wide range of red states. They've even ignored court orders.
67
@c harris. I guess you didn’t get to the part where there were uncounted votes?
5
@Susan Anderson. So you mean to say that a county that cannot, 3 days after an election, tell us according to law, how many ballots there are to count, is legitimate? They are not counting, they are looking to produce, ballots according to how many they need. It is purely ridiculous to posit otherwise! AND YOU KNOW IT
1
Other developed countries manage to hold elections and count the votes without this drama. Why is the U.S. again such an outlier, in a bad way?
146
@abo
The Glaringly Odious Party
a/k/a our GOP
n/k/a Trump's "Loyalists".
8
@abo The US is not an outlier. It is South Florida that is the problem and it has been for all 15 years of Dr Snipes tenure.
6
@abo Because of the GOP!
6
Whenever I receive my banking statements, they invariably are correct. There's more money flowing through those calculations than the number of votes. Maybe banks need to oversee Florida's and Georgia's elections? Or, an independent commission needs to devise an accurate system in which every eligible voter gets to cast a ballot, to approve it, and to duly and truthfully get it counted. That doesn't seem like rocket science.
32
@Eleanor N. Funny my bank (now former bank) double billed me fore a check they put through twice. Charged me bank fees in a second account for having below the minimum; even though they were supposed to take both my accounts into consideration. So maybe your bank is better but then who is to say it will be a better system than before. I would hope so but American history has proven that is not always the case.
7
@Eleanor N. My bank promised 12 month CD rate at 2.25% I signed up and when I got my bank statement they were paying me 1.75%.
6
Many banks are too big to JAIL.
5
I'm happy to judge the Scott and Nelson campaigns on the records of their respective candidates. On that basis, the wild accusations by Scott campaign aides and Trump ought to be laughed out of town.
174
@Thomas Zaslavsky -
"...ought to be laughed out of town." Which town? Lauderhill, FL, where the ballots are? Or thousands of miles away, in Binghamton?
2
@Imaginary Friend, I didn't say anything that was relevant to Brenda Snipes, but since you changed the subject to her, in my opinion it has been obvious for a long time that she has no business running an election.
@Connecticut Yankee, thanks for the chuckle from Conn.
2