GOP & don the con can do nothing but LIE about health care.
never willing to improve ACA
not a single proposal for something better than ACA (which would actually cover the needs of Americans)
LIES about superior health care around the world
when will "the base" understand that the TRUTH about don the con & GOP's plan is that if you're unhealthy you can go broke or drop dead
1
There's that saying Bush mangled "Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me." Trump-lovers and GOP constituents seem very comfortable being fooled again, and again, and again. Since the entire nation suffers from their tomfoolery, shame on them.
4
I have a serious pre-existing condition and buy comprehensive health insurance through the ACA. The last two years have caused me more stress than anyone could possibly know. Cruel, selfish, lying Republicans.
13
It’s a sad fact that those of us on Medicare really have a Democratic President to thank from eighty years ago, FDR, who started the few social programs we have today. The lying Republicans narrative is swallowed completely by the Trump base given twenty-four seven by Fox propaganda. The fact that they don’t want to vote in their own self interest is fine, but do they have to drag the rest of the country with them? The blue states subsidize the red anyway, it costs them nothing. There should be a nationwide boycott of products advertised on Fox, we need to starve them into the truth.
14
The American experiment had failed. Let’s build a country, not a loose conglomerate of “me first, you maybe’s”. Vote democrat/independent Nov 6.
11
How about preserving - creating - an affordable health care system that cuts insurance companies out the loop somewhat. You can require them to offer insurance to everyone, regardless of your health history, but unless you offer a system run like Medicare the price of premiums will eliminate a lot of people. Blue Cross Blue Shield charged me 500 a month two years ago, a 1000 last year, 1600 this year and they want me to pay $2500 per month in 2019. In Virginia they offer only a few plans, unlike DC. Without government control health care will be too costly for most people, including me.
13
It’s beyond question that as a whole Republicans have not supported coverage for pre-existing conditions, despite what they say now. But what Ms Sanger-Katz fails to discuss is the fact that while majorities of Americans — both Republicans and Democrats — want coverage that protects against pre-existing conditions, they don’t want to have to pay the premium that will guarantee this. The basic premise of insurance is pooled risk, which means that some of us will never get our money’s worth from the premiums we pay because we are fortunate to be healthy. Others will draw heavily on the monies paid by healthy policy holders. That’s the simple reason why the individual mandate was put in place: it compels every person to be compassionate and prudent even when it is not economically beneficial to them personally. Republicans are reacting to the sizeable population who still think that they want to game the system by avoiding insurance altogether or taking only skimpy policies because they are reasonably healthy. That others need their help simply doesn’t mean very much to them. That mentality has always been around, but the selfishness of sizable segments of Americans increased dramatically in the 1980s when Reagan and Wall Street convinced them that greed was good and no one was responsible for others. In 1984 Mondale ran on a platform of empathy for all Americans and was trounced. Since then Dems and Republicans alike have made empathy the third rail of politics.
15
I am using this article to finally comment on the so called “fact checking “ practice of the paper. A policy of fac t checking should be equal opportunity. Yet, whenever I read the fact check column by Linds Qiu, and I do regularly, it appears to me that there are few if any fact checks done on Democratic leaders. Yet, for example, Nancy Peloisi’s warning that “ milions will die” if the Republicans changed Obamacare is as absurd as Trump’s claim that the caravan is an invasion.Both are at best conscious extreme exaggerations designed to instil fear in voters. But I rarely see both sides called out for their equally ridiculous demagoguery.
To be honest, Ms. Qiu’s assigned mission by all appearances seems to be to exhaustively comb through every statement by Trump to detect even the most minute examples of so called innacuracies.
I say so called because the fact checkers do not only compare statements to objective truth. That’s easy. But they often conflate not so clearly objective “facts” and in some cases even their own subjective opinion, with true objective facts. By acting as if subjective opinions were the same as objective facts, they render fact checking useless as an intellectually honest endeavor.
Now I fully understand that the fact checkers are simply doing the job they are instructed to do. That’s the problem.
2
The words “Republicans” and “vow” do not belong in the same statement.
To take a vow implies that the ones vowing are speaking truthfully and sincerely, and intend to keep the promise they make in the vow.
Such behavior among Republicans is extinct.
Headline should read: “Republicans pretend to vow that.....”
7
I would suggest to EVERYONE who have critical thinking skills, go to Robert Reich's website, "Inequality For All", and view one of his latest commentaries, THIRTY PROMISES Trump made in the primaries that not only did he NOT KEEP, but, often acted totally opposite of what he promised to his supporters.
Healthcare is just one of them.
8
Can we now please secede from the New Confederacy. Let them do whatever they want, I want no part of it, the Rebels are not my countrymen.
11
We ALL have a pre-existing condition, if you LOOK close enough. They are often found only on Autopsy. If any of these folks want to discover their own, I’m available.
Seriously.
7
In the bill that Republicans tried to pass last year, insurers would have been allowed to charge more to insure those with pre-existing conditions. It is important to remember that the bill allowed certain individuals to be exempt from this loss of protection - among them members of Congress and their staff! If this was such a great plan, why did the Republicans have to exempt themselves from it? The level of dishonesty boggles the mind!
14
Fox News-Trump at rally today --I.C.E. captured 120,000 illegal alien criminals this year alone--The HIll says- Almost 120,000 undocumented immigrants were arrested this year but where is it documented they are criminals? This "criminal" condition didn't predate the arrest.Trump then states 48,000 have assault records and 12,000 sex crimes. So yeah, you want to believe this Administration won't lie about Health Care--just watch Fox News--then google..all lies..........
7
Don't believe these false promises from Republicans; they are the Party of Death and represent government AGAINST the people. Of course they'll remove pre-existing conditions if given half a chance; then they'll go on to reducing Medicare and Social Security, eliminating all environmental protections, and making it even easier for civilians to purchase military-style kill toys. The Party of Death, seeking to shorten your life, every day in every way.
12
Without the Democrats winning the Congress, our future is an oligarchy with Trump as our dictator!
Watch what you ask for Republicans ... You will be squashed like bugs from your own party after 2020 by the same group you voted in...
They don't care about you, just your wealth which they will strip from you. No bank; no 401k, no stocks, no real estate, no pensions, no investments, no havens, no unions, nothing will save your savings!
Democrats get your passports ready, have your reservations in hand, be ready to fly out of here on election day 2020, while all the greedy oligarchs are busy celebrating...
7
Lie, Cheat and Steal. The GOP Trinity Of “ Winning “ Elections.
ANY election. Very experienced, shameless and hypocritical.
VOTE.
10
You all missed what they really said. They said that they would "protect people with preexisting conditions". They did not tell you or them from what. They meant they would protect them from the brown menace "caravan" approaching the south border, not that they would keep people with preexisting conditions insured. They didn't lie, they just tricked the press and the democrats. Ask them what they are protecting people with preexisting conditions from.
14
Here’s how Republicans will cover preexisting conditions. Charge an astronomical, impossible price and say “well, you’re covered”, sell plans that say they cover them but don’t (lie) or find tricky ways to say you’re disqualified.
12
Any politician who claims that they can both protect those with existing conditions, and repeal the ACA had better be prepared with a detailed plan that explains exactly how they are going to achieve this. The business realities of the health insurance business cannot support 'protecting those with existing conditions' in the absence of significant other changes... most of which exist in the ACA. Where is this magical, fabled, legendary Republican Trump health insurance plan - the "wonderful" "better and cheaper" plan of promise? Where is this plan, and where are the details - the 'how' behind all these promises?
Could it be that those promises are empty? Hollow? Lies? Could it be that Republican candidates promises "to protect those with preexisting conditions" fall into the same category as Trump's "pay for themselves" tax cuts, and his "not a trade war" world-wide tariff assault on the existing international business order? Could it be all a lie - just before an election, to be forgotten right after the votes are tallied? In a word - yes. All a lie, all a scam by the Con-Man-in-Chief and his lackeys... empty electioneering lies, designed to fool the gullible, without substance, reality, or endurance. Forgotten right after the vote.
19
How did we get to be so bitter and cruel? I think back to my youth: When did I first hear the unusual term 'pre-existing condition'? I thought that you were born, therefore, you exist. In a country that is so wealthy, it is obscene and destructive that healthcare has to be earned via work -- but that's not even a guarantee. And we remain fixated on the myth of individualism. Most for-profit healthcare is sucking the life, happiness, and well-being out of us. Between anxieties over (not) having healthcare and stingy vacation/time-off allotments, it's little wonder we are so unwell. The ACA is the best attempt so far at equity and improving it (again and again) should be the goal.
13
This is very simply the Republican recognition that for the most part their base is basically uninformed and ignorant of the true facts. It's very sad that one of our major parties must rely on deceit to attempt to regain control.
13
@Karn Griffen
In recent decades, while the rest of the developed world moved forward on this issue, America continues to haggle about healthcare and it has been doing it since the days of Harry Truman and STILL without any real meaningful resolution!
The reasons are quite clear and when the healthcare industry, overall, is now, by dollar amount, the largest lobbyist in Washington, all done to maintain the "status quo", the politicians will NOT have the political will to make the necessary meaningful changes.
The solution is clear, if Americans want to see a better system, STOP electing those politicians who you know will do nothing and START electing those whom, when unencumbered by lobbyist "bribery", will have the commitment and political will to do something about it!
7
We have the perfect storm: a news network willing to deceive; 45% of the country that accepts being deceived; and a political party that is ok taking office as a result of those layers of lies. I really don’t know how to get out of this loop.
10
@Djt
VOTE - November 6
5
Republicans do not want the "undeserving" (read: non-wealthy) to have healthcare. This is a fact they have reiterated time and time again.
I was recently struck by an incident which made me lose my last shred of hope in the "reasonable" Republicans out there ever coming around to the idea that treating sick Americans is a good thing - unless those sick people are wealthy, and therefore deemed "deserving" enough.
On "The View", the topic of Medicare for All came up, and Meghan McCain was not having any of it.
She shouted-down her co-hosts and yelled about not wanting to "turn the country into Venezuela". The rest of the panel tried to counter with examples like Norway, Sweden, etc. - basically all the other nations in the Western hemisphere - but were met with more shouting designed to cut-off any debate. It was dreadful to watch. Not just because of Ms. McCain's debate tactics, but her hypocrisy and cruelty.
Meghan knows first-hand why healthcare is absolutely vital to families, and what it's like to face a healthcare crisis. She knows what it's like to have the government pay for that healthcare. But she very clearly doesn't want it for you or me.
Somehow, we do not discuss the GOP willingly condemning the "undeserving" sick to their fates as the act of utter barbarity is so plainly is. Instead, this kind of spitefulness is normalized and sold to us as the "moderate" viewpoint. "Extremist" is reserved for those who want everyone - McCain or not - to receive care.
15
"President Trump has gone the furthest, saying not only that he will ensure protections for the previously ill, but also pledging that his party will do so more effectively than Democrats."
Sure he will. In 2016, candidate Trump promised that he would guarantee better health care policy than the ACA, and that his would be much cheaper. Sounds good, what is it?So, here we are, two years later, still waiting to hear about Trump Care.
The Republicans tried dozens of times to "Repeal and Replace" so called Obama Care. So glad they failed. The Repeal part was clear, but somehow the Replace part was never explained.
How anyone would believe them now is beyond me. Who are these people who believe this stuff?
21
dou·ble·speak
/ˈdəbəlˌspēk/
deliberately euphemistic, ambiguous, or obscure language.
"the art of political doublespeak"
synonyms: equivocating, evasion, dodging, beating about the bush, pussyfooting (around); jargon, double-talk, gibberish, gobbledygook; informal-speak, -ese, -babble
"they throw in just enough doublespeak to make you forget that they're trying to sell you something you don't really need"*
* Courtesy Wikipedia
But in Trump and the Republicans, it's just plain lying and downright mean!
6
Republicans are planning for the reduction or elimination of Social Security, Medicare, and Medicaid...WHY would they claim to protect pre-existing conditions when it is CLEAR they mean to rip from 99% of us what little remains of the social safety net? The answer is, just to win this election...just to get into power in order to be able to take away from "we the people" that which would make possible "life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness."
19
Hypocrisy, your name is the Republican Party, or any party that wants to stay in power without taking in account the will of the people.
17
They know they are lying. Their supporters know they are lying. Anyone with a pre-existing condition knows they are lying. But vote for them because, e-mails.
5
@Bailey T Dog i don't know if their supporters know their lying bc Fox News and Rush Limbaugh don't talk about the negative aspects of the Repubs.
5
@Bailey T Dog
And Benghazi !
4
@ari
That is why the Times and other news media such as WaPo need to make it headline news reporting! This very article was somewhat subdued as a second column article!
2
At this point, anyone willing to take anything said by Republicans about protecting people is only engaging in the most extreme self-deception.
8
Under the ACA "All plans have to cover the same benefits, so it is not possible for a plan to offer coverage to a cancer patient but exclude cancer coverage, as some plans did in the years before the Affordable Care Act."
Precisely. Under pressure from their local constituents during election times, GOP politicians might indeed preserve the right of everyone, including those with "pre-existing conditions" like, oh , say pregnancy, IBS or juvenile onset diabetes, to PURCHASE health insurance. However, I have never heard a single GOP politician guarantee that 1)the insurance companies who offer health insurance to those with "pre-existing conditions" will be required to pay for the actual medical treatment of those conditions or 2)even if the insurance company pays for necessary treatment, the cost of the policies they offer to those with "pre-existing conditions" will be even remotely affordable.
11
@Jane That is the heart of the situation. If only the Democrats would have explained it to voters. But I have yet to see a media message explaining what are major-league loopholes in their claims, or better yet, ridiculing Republican claims to be "protecting" coverage for pre-existing conditions.
2
This is why the Republicans have been desperate to destroy the ACA - because they knew it would be helpful and popular with people. They don't care about how anything benefits people. They care about how it benefits their industry friends and donors.
It's fascinating to see these ads in which Republicans, who have spent the past 8 years trying to destroy these protections, are suddenly the champions of all that is good and right. Think about what this says about what they know about their followers.
30
"After last week's latest attempt to remove provisions of Obamacare ended with Sen. John McCain’s dramatic "no" vote effectively keeping it alive along with two other senators, Newsweek has found at least 70 Republican-led attempts to repeal, modify or otherwise curb the Affordable Care Act since its inception as law on March 23, 2010." - Newsweek, July 29, 2017.
https://www.newsweek.com/gop-health-care-bill-repeal-and-replace-70-failed-attempts-643832
Why are we not seeing in the NY Times coverage (or from many MSM sources, or even candidates, this info? (Reported in July 2017!) This was widely covered last year, the fact that at least 70 times Republicans led efforts against the ACA. Surely this is critical information to include in the current pushbacks against Republican lies re: their lies about the Republican party being the party that will protect healthcare for all?
I have been shocked by the recent omission of these facts, well-reported last year. It feels like there is a Twilight Zone-like collective amnesia. Why?
48
The GOP plans cover pre existing conditions but the GOP plans charge those with pre existing conditions higher premiums.
The ACA does not allow these higher premiums.
The higher premiums would make insurance unaffordable for those with pre existing conditions
30
@david - The GOP plan allows states to come up with innovative ways to get more of their residents insured. That might mean offering affordable options to healthy people who can't afford Obamacare. It seems to me the Democrats don't want to offer options to people who can't afford Obamacare, because in their minds, giving a healthy person an affordable option automatically translates into charging a sick person more, even if the sick person's Obamacare premium doesn't change from what it currently is.
@Mark
No healthy person stays healthy forever. That means healthy people who purchase 'innovative' and 'affordable' healthcare plans are up the creek without a paddle when they do get sick. Also "giving a healthy person an affordable option automatically translates into charging a sick person more" is a true statement. United we stand, divided we fall...
14
What happens to the healthy person who buys a policy with limited coverage who develops a serious illness that his policy does not cover.
Do we refuse to treat.
No.
He goes to the ER and the ER passes cost of the treatment on to others with full insurance.
Since this person with limited policy has de facto insurance he should pay for that coverage up front by buying a full coverage policy.
7
Do any NYT readers trust these people?
After the years of whining and claims of socialism, trust went into the circular file when trump took the office after losing by more than 2.5 million votes.
5
Some of this is nonsense. Over 30+ years, I have held various corporate positions, and also been self employed. When I left a job, prior to starting a new one, I simply used COBRA to extend my insurance. When I began a new job, my continuous coverage made the pre-existing condition matter a non issue. When the ACA came in to play, if someone used the exchange to obtain insurance, they had coverage for pre-existing matters. I know that for a fact. My daughter left her job, while pregnant, due to health issues. Her husband's new plan at work wouldn't take effect for them for another 3 months. She bought insurance through the exchange, to keep herself covered until the new insurance took effect. Her rate was based on household income. When I was a kid, my Dad took off, so Mom obtained help through Medicaid for our health/dental care, while she finished college. My brother & I were 3-5, & our household was at poverty level. I believe the 'poorest of the poor' have access to Medicaid, just like we did. Also, I remember when the ACA was passed, former President Obama said that part of the plan was to allow people to purchase insurance for just such employment gaps. Now, my recurring insurance premiums have doubled, to subsidize lower income Americans. No one should be without continuous insurance, under the ACA. Government can't dictate what any private business/industry does, in totality. Otherwise, we become Socialists. I agree with those who suggest this issue is a red herring.
Who helped pay for the Medicaid protection that your family needed?
17
@Cynthia
How wonderful that your "corporate positions" allowed you to afford the expensive COBRA insurance out of your pocket. The overwhelming majority of people are neither as well off as you nor the "poorest of the poor." They're people who make too much money to get assistance but not enough to pay their bills. But thank you for your wonderful empathy.
I don't want government to dictate what businesses do with insurance. I want it to take insurance out of their hands altogether, like the rest of the world does, and put it in our hands where it belongs. If it's socialism to have insurance that is fiscally efficient and actually covers all medical care, instead of insurance that is run by profit-seeking industry executives, give me that good ol' socialism any time.
31
Good question!!
A brother-in-law, now deceased but would have been an ardent Trump supporter, used to rant and rail against Medicaid and Medicare. There was no convincing him of the utility of those programs.
He would ignore the point that his daughter and her children were on Medicaid for years, and that he had lengthy illnesses, including serious alcoholism, for which Medicare paid a lot for several hospitalizations.
The hypocrisy and blatant lying by Trump, his administration ( especially those running DHHS), and the GOP drive me as nuts as did BinL years ago.
5
Anything said by Republicans, as Paul Krugman points out in his editorial today, is likely a lie. But it doesn't matter to the base. They will hear on Fox that the Republicans are going to protect them and expand Medicare but the Democrats want to destroy the programs. And just like everything else, they will believe it.
38
How does the GOP propose to protect pre-existing conditions?
Seems simple. Require all insurance companies to provide coverage at whatever rates they calculate will give them a profit over the term of the individual policy to all each applicant with a “pre-rusting condition”. These companies will know beforehand what the cost will likely be. They can charge that amount. Sort of defies any definition of insurance? More like “prepayment”
I would like to see more information on what “coverage for pre-existing conditions” means in each plan. I think this entire discussion is a ploy.
5
I'm grateful that I live in Canada, particularly in Ontario. We don't have perfect health care coverage but it's close to being perfect. As someone who has a "pre-existing" condition I'd be denied the coverage that literally keeps me alive and out of bankruptcy. I can't understand the US system of health care coverage, just going to a hospital could bust your bank account. That's never been a worry in my life.
41
"Several Republican senators have co-sponsored a bill that would ensure that people with pre-existing illnesses could buy insurance at standard prices if Obamacare were repealed or overturned. But that bill includes a large loophole: Insurers would not have to cover any care related to that condition. That bill is not scheduled for a vote, and the president has not endorsed it."
A quick read of the bill linked in the article (at "co-sponsored a bill") seems to have another loophole. It was listing protections for the insured, specifying that it included group health plans and individual. Then they got to the part about genetic testing and suddenly the mention of individual plans disappeared.
So looks like insurers would be allowed to base coverage for individuals on genetic tests, as well as offer you coverage for everything BUT what you most need coverage for.
People need to consider, as we're in a time when rural areas and cities alike are dealing with an opioid addiction crisis, that people dealing with addiction:
1 - need medical help
2 - have trouble staying employed, so need individual coverage
3 - need coverage that includes treating addiction
4 - addiction would likely flag as a pre-existing condition
Why doesn't the Republican Party do the responsible, caring thing and just work with Democrats on improving the existing program? I know, very wealthy donors are furious because they got a small tax hike to help cover fellow citizens, but please...
25
Europeans, who enjoy cradle to grave medical coverage, are laughing their rear-ends off as the world's most powerful nation treats its citizens like they live in the middle of Africa. But then again, America's rich elite wouldn't be able to buy the world if they had to pay taxes in any meaningful amount. Decadence and money are dropping the U.S. into an early grave because of it's pre-existing condition of widespread mindless greed.
85
@Dave I'm currently back in the States on a temporary work assignment after having lived in Italy for a number of years. I'm looking forward to returning to a country where, despite all its other problems, citizens are committed to health care for everyone. People don't go bankrupt in Europe because of medical bills like the do here in the States. They also don't live with constant fear of losing coverage. Critics would say that they can offer this because Europeans aren't paying their fair share to NATO. This is utter rubbish. We all pay, ourselves, into the system.
8
Republicans used to soley try and change the topic when they were hit by a Democratic campaign message that hit home. Now, they are also deceitfully co-opting the Dem message itself: "We're the ones protecting pre-existing conditions." All that Trump lying is leaching into the GOP bloodstream.
47
There should be split screen TV campaign commercials of the boldfaced republican liars' actual votes vs their lies run non-stop until the polls close on Nov.6th.
38
There is an old idiom, death is the great leveler.
In the US, we all still face death -- but unless you have access to medical care without risk of bankruptcy, the misery of illness and death hover much closer.
24
It is hard to imagine that the United States would want to be a country where people with cancer could be denied affordable care, a country where there is clearly a price associated with the value of a life. America will never be great if someone can lose their home and everything they've worked for just because they get sick. We are a very wealthy country and should aspire to so much more than this. Democrats seem to be the only party willing to work towards real solutions, not just leaving millions of Americans uninsured. The Affordable Care Act needs improvements, but it is far better than where we were before, its pre-existing condition protections are critical in a rapidly aging society.
67
Just when you think the lying and hypocrisy can't get any worse.... Trump has a larger-than-life persona, the power of his office, no conscience, and years of developing his lying and hustling skills. Other republicans have assumed that they can get away with whatever just like the boss, but regularly find that they don't have the gravitas to pull it off. Something they can count on when they get in a jam -their man won't be there to bail them out.
52
@HighPlainsScribe
Of all the characteristics I might attribute to Trump, gravitas is most certainly not one of them.
6
@HighPlainsScribe
"Gravitas"? I think you mean Vanitas!
3