Why fight? International trade's purpose is to make money. China should just come up with new ways to make money. The Nov. 5-6 Import Fair, billed as the largest such trade shows in human history, will do good. More varieties of foreign sourced goods at better prices would nudge domestic consumption, and add to the GDP on the distribution side. In turn, the exporting countries would have more money to buy MIC (Made in China). Joy joy.
Any notions that Belt and Road are worse than past U.S. international interventions are based on short memories. How are the two countries now in endless war after 9/11 doing these days? Was Vietnam better? How about various interventions in Latin America going back to the Spanish American War?
And this is before the recent wave of trade wars against everyone and not just China. Is Canada, Mexcico, Europe or Japan feeling all warm and fuzzy after the past year?
China may ready for the fight but what China will gain from this senseless fight ? Trump enjoys fight with everybody. Xi Jinping should stay away from Trump. Let Trump fight with his White House staffs and cabinet members.
1
"Is China ready for the fight?" is the wrong question. We should be asking, "How should the US (and the many other countries concerned about intellectual property rights) convince China that it is no longer a poor nation but an up-and-coming nation that must act as a responsible citizen of the world.
Most historians will say the West has very little moral grounds to lecture China. Most economists will say, tariffs are not the right tool. Indeed "protecting infant domestic industry" is a strategy used by just about every country in the world--including the US, UK, France, Japan, etc.
But then, the Trump Administration has no grounding in history or economic theory. This shows and the whole world is watching and shaking their heads.
In my opinion, there is not one country in the world that wants the Trump administration to have a second term, except Russia. And that will color the remaining two years.
1
It's unfortunate that the trade conflict can be seen as a "win or lose" situation instead of a problem that could benefit both countries if spoken out about and compromised over. The need for allies also seems difficult due to China's rough past and America's questionable leader. Trump has a reason to go down hard on China due to it's prolonged tariffs, but what the real debate should be focused on is which country could be hurt more; and if it's even necessary to dig deeper.
2
Only a fool expects a prevailing hegemony would take no action on an usurping aspirant. President Xi is no fool. He understands the need for a new deal. However, the rhetoric and uncertainties from Donald Trump is so politically toxic that makes getting a deal all but impossible. The Chinese have no choice but to wait this out. No deal is always better than a bad deal.
In the meantime, a prolonged tariff on Chinese goods will cause inflation and interest rate to rise, putting an end to the sugar high stock prices in the US. It will hurt the US consumers more than the Chinese economy which has proven to be quite adaptive and competitive in the past 4 decades. It is very hard to see how the US tariff can destablise the Chinese socieity as suggested by this article. China is not Russia.
1
The Chinese government has our treasonous company Apple on their side so Trumps trade war should be ok. When you pay Chinese workers only 2.00 a day and no health benefits they are your friends for life. Those jobs should have been in America instead of China. All capitalists business men are traders too doing the above then over pricing their products in America. We need to stop selling example Apple products here at those inflated prices . With cheap labor why are those products so expensive?
China can afford to dump all of our debt they've been buying and it would be more manageable then going tit for tat in a trade war. The GOP is so concerned about taxing the 'middle class' that they sign in lockstep the rube Grover Norquist's "Taxpayer Protection Pledge" but they don't mind burying us peon's with higher priced goods made to be marketed to the middle class. The rich don't shop at strip mall's and Walmart, they go to designer stores and higher quality grocer's. Sure they can eat healthy and actually retire and never touch their precious principal. Ninety percent would be happy to have some principal. Socialism, they use to tar and feather us
progressives with, actually looks better and better each day.
2
If the pictures in the article corresponding to opening statement "The Chinese leader, wearing a dark Mao suit, and the American president, in a black tuxedo,", then what Xi is wearing is not Mao suit.
@JulieClick on the link. It will take you to a picture of Deng Hsiao Ping (in a Mao suit) standing next to Jimmy Carter (in a black tux)
1
A smarter way to counter China would have simply been to follow through with TPP. Someone should have convinced Trump the 'T' can stand for "Trump".
A couple of years ago, in the middle of a wave of concern for the impending "Chinese domination", I got curious and read a bit about the country.
Not much, but enough to see some of the same basic characteristics of Japan during its miracle years, as well as a glimpse of some of the same deficiencies that have, in the end, condemned the Japanese to endure more than twenty years of stagnation.
An illiberal society with an obsession for hierarchy and seniority, a writing system that seems designed to destroy as much as possible creative instincts in the young, a cosy crony capitalism with banks and enterprises intertwined in dysfunctional ways, a market that is only as free as someone don't look at it too closely and an imploding demography.
To these, China added some problems of its own, like a more widely spread corruption - Japan's political class is as dirty as any, but at least the bureaucracy that handles Japanese day to day life is (was?) remarkably clean - a potential for internal ethnic strides and a massive male/female imbalance (30 millions more men than women... good luck keeping all those forced bachelors content and productive).
What finally convinced me that there are good chances that I may see China stagnate, before I die, was seeing the authoritarian instincts of Xi taking hold.
China needed another Deng - if at all possible even someone more clever - to navigate the maze of problems that lie ahead for the country.
It got a second rate Mao.
3
@DB
The smart money in China is probably hedging their bets and paying visits to Bo Xilai in Qincheng Prison.
1
@DB
contrary to what the corporate/mainstream media led you to believe. japan didn't stumble. we colonized japan after the end of ww2 to this day. we told the Japanese we saw their growing economy as a threat and asked them to commit economic suicide. they did. btw what other option a colony had?
Interesting. An article that dumps on Trump typically pulls hundreds or thousands of Comments. An article like this one that shows Trump is likely correct to go hard on China pulls only 64 comments ? This silence says a lot about reader objectivity. You do realize, don't you, that it's OK to acknowledge when he's correct ? You won't be ostracized if you do, -hopefully.
9
At least for now we are recreating the earlier 1950s when Mao and Stalin fueled the communist party doctrine that they should dominate the world. They did not think in their people. For that reason the Soviet Union and China lost the Cold War, in addition to the fact that they invested their scarce resources in arming guerrillas and fighting political enemies.
China is expanding its economic ties with poor nations as a way to obtain territorial dominance. But that nation does not have the freedom that inspires the creation of new products, new business ideas, or new ways to create wealth.
Taiwan and Cuba are clear opposite examples of success and failure. Who needs more Cubas? Nobody. We need more Taiwans. A few years ago Putin pardoned 30 billion dollars that the Castro's regime owed Russia. The blockade is an excuse, Cuba has the possibility of selling billions to many countries in Europe, Canada and Latin America. Entrepreneurs need freedom. No?
Instead of "Getting to know you" they prefer this song title: "My lord and master" Both here and in China.
Who wants to create a company if at the end of the day you can be visited by a bully saying: "We don't want you selling this product, because you are not aligned with the dogma of the party"
Alibaba and other companies in China are the creation of a group of mentally free persons inspired by America. Not anymore?
This is starting to look ugly. "Winning" this trade conflict is likely to take a toll on either party, no matter whether it's the US or China. (Russia won WWII and all it cost were 25 million dead.) The question for us molecules is how to protect ourselves.
"Teng Jianqun, director of American studies at the China Institute for International Studies, said “We should let our people fully know that this trade war is not a short-term contest,” he said, “but a contest that will determine the future of the Chinese nation.” "
There is nothing like an external threat to a nation to weld all the groups within to support the fight against that threat. Especially if the state controls the PR message.
Trump & the GOP on the other hand are divisive on all policies & usually terribly wrong. eg. Trashing the 1st step to affordable universal healthcare , passing an $800 billion tax cut for the 1% , leaving the Paris Climate Accord , walking away from the P5+1 Iran nuclear deal (to appease the Israel Lobby) , etc.
3
It’s the other way around. Any hostility is coming from China, be it with interfering with freedom of navigation, forcing airlines to list Taiwan as part of China, ethnic cleansing the Uighur minorities, stealing vast amounts of IP, and the list goes on.
4
Everyone seems to forget that China is a Communist country. We should never have given away this country to them. This will go down as the dumbest play in our history. Sort of like Nero playing his fiddle, our politicians have worried about remaining in DC - that is all that mattered to them.
The political elite of both parties have taken money from BIG MONEY for re-election and given MORE MONEY in return by subsidizing these same people/companies with low wage operations in China.
China is our enemy. 25% tariffs? Hahaha. 100% would be nearer to what is needed.
4
I am as anti-Trump as anyone. But on this specific policy point, I think he got one right (probably by accident or for all the wrong reasons - and who knows if he'll stick with it - but hey, for now it's ok).
It's time someone stood up to China for all of its IP theft and overbearing market participation rules. They've played American leadership's desire for 'peace' far too long almost exclusively to their advantage.
If they want to innovate their way onto the world stage, I'm fine with that. I'm not beholden to some past that America has to be number one at everything or even anything. But to steal and cheat their way to the top? Yeah no.
27
I think this discussion has already gone beyond what POTUS does with China. China has lost ground and cannot win the tariff war. In the past they would have picked the Korean card but that has weakened considerably. Not to say that China does not have considerable influence with N Korea, actually they still do! The problem is optics. Chinese people are viewing the following - their incomes are beginning to fall, China is spending huge amount of money in Africa, South America and Asia buying ports and building infrastructure etc(people that ordinary Chinese view as lazy and aid dependent) , and they see the great enemy leader Trump shaking hands with Kim with no Chinese leader around. Chinese leaders have become vulnerable - they need to show strength. Retaliatory tariffs were like pinpricks to US economy. So what is left to do? Attack Taiwan. That is very much in the cards. I don't think American is not ready for that but the Chinese are for sure. That is the future if this continues.
3
Both China and the US have 1 thing in common. Terrible leadership. The people on both sides of the Ocean will suffer. I suspect like all wars, arms dealers will profit.
2
There is a problem with China. But this like some much else this administration has done is poorly thought out, with no plan and no exit strategy. It's just like the Muslim ban, and the immigrant family detention plan. trump throws a tantrum demands that something be done and bang, a big mess. This will not accomplish *anything*!
3
Trump is right. China does not play fair. To access their markets, US companies have to enter into a 50/50 JV and hand over all our intellectual property and material. To sell in the US, all China has to do is fill container ships full of its stuff and ship them to Long Beach.
How is that fair?
17
I posted below on May 22, in response to Krugman's Why Trade War with China is not Easy To Win
"Is a trade war with China easy to win?
Yes because the Chinese position is much weaker than realized. Real unemployment is larger than reported officially. Chinese cities are filled with millions of rural migrants from the country side, without a hokuo (a permit required to live in the city that allows access to schools and social services). Largely unskilled, they see there jobs disappearing.
Why ?
Ethiopia is the new place for the factories of China. 741 acres are covered in Hawassa by mostly Chinese factories. Salaries in the Chinese owned textile plant shown are 30 Euros ($ 35) per month , 1/20 of those of China as the Chinese owner explains. That is 1/20 !!
What the proud Chinese owner does NOT explain is that he laid off his textile workers in China when he moving the factory to Ethiopia.
It is a race to the bottom. Stagnant wages by outsourcing production to those willing to work for least, has reached China.
Economists such as Krugman who promoted globalization (In Praise of Cheap Labor) failed to see that political unrest (e.g. Brexit, Trump ) follows.
It does, and that is becoming a headache for the Chinese leadership, who is well aware of it.
China can ill afford a trade war with the US, that would further accelerate that development "
-----
7
China is calling Trump's bluff. Is China ready for the fight? Yes. Americans like me are addicted to cheap Chinese merchandise, and frankly, I don't care where it comes from. All our junk will be made by robots before long anyway, so there is no point in trying to save factory jobs in the U.S.. Trump will lose because there are far more voters buying cheap junk than voters making cheap junk. Manufacturing workers will be thrown on the dust heap tomorrow just as steelworkers here in Pittsburgh were 40 years ago when Reagan killed the $1000/ton steel tariffs.
14
It doesn't matter how 'ready' China is. People don't seem to understand how tariffs work, or what an export deficit is. These are basic concepts that most of the American public (and people commenting here) are seemingly completely unaware of.
There is no Mutually Assured Destruction in a trade war where one side (America) has $375 billion more in goods to lay tariffs on. Just one way destruction.
China would also be foolish to sit back and wait. Trump might not be personally popular... his policies, however, most certainly are.
Any government can be overthrown by a horrible economy, but the chinese communist politburo faces something more dangerous to their health than a public shaming and a boot out of office, should that occur. They know it, too.
8
About the only thing that we export that is not involved with global supply chains are commodities and tariffs on commodities tend not to improve trade practices. Most of the high tech products sold by U.S. businesses are assembled from components made in foreign places with foreign labor, for example. We have no capacity to produce these components here and have these products remain profitable. Tariffs are not going to bring back industries that have been developed across the Earth. At best Trump hopes to intimidate countries into agreements using the American market as his leverage. He’s a man who never learned to see farther than his immediate objectives. The U.S. is 5% of all the people on Earth and not going to retain it’s share of the global market for much longer. It’s markets will not grow bigger while those in China, India, and across the rest of the world, will. Trump is just giving all of them real incentives to make it happen sooner. China is already seeking other sources for soybeans.
3
China coined the name "Paper Tiger" about the U.S. in the 60's. They've laid claim and literally land and taken over whole swaths of the South China Sea based on land created by dredges. We did nothing. There was no material response whatsoever. It didn't need to be military, but it did need to be clearly called out and condemned internationally. The U.S. was looked to to lead that and we did nothing. That name appears to be quite apt these days.
3
@AnObserver More specifically, Obama did nothing.
6
https://www.smh.com.au/world/asia/china-accuses-trump-administration-of-...
The above article is well worth reading and has some interesting insights.
When it comes to technology, remember that China has, for years, been sending students to the USA to get an education, so don't blame China if they see themselves as competitors for USA world dominance in the technology industry. USA has been giving them the skills & charging for that.
The problem with China and Russia is that they both want to be superpowers like the USA and as Iran is a friend of both nations I think what I saw on NZ TV news last evening, tells me that a world with both Russia, China and Iran as superpowers would end democracy in the world as we know it, and all the freedoms that go with it. It would be more of a communist dictatorship pseudo-democracy.
I saw a news clip on tv news last night of Iran parading it's nuclear arsenal & written on the side of vehicles carrying the nukes were these words, 'down with the USA'. That's about it folks! China and Russia are more diplomatic; whereas Iran just reflects and echoes China and Russian sentiments.
I've seen these military parades on tv before & never realised what the writing said, but our news put a caption underneath the writing translated into English. Maybe your news media needs to do the same, so the public know how Iran feels about the USA.
6
@CK Spot on. And, add to it that Obama appeased Iran, and China for that matter, at every turn. Plus he only talked semi-tough on Russia.
4
Whatever the US does or doesn't do about China it would have been easier if they had their allies to help. You won't beat them alone and Russia is going to play one side against the other just for fun.
China for all the wishful thinking is used to being criticised and exploited by the west in equal measure. This will not phase them, in fact, it has been expected. They will wait till Trump's term ends and see what the new Presidency will bring.
Slowly, slowly, catchy monkey:-)
3
You had me until the racist pidgin English at the end.
@Lee Mac. And "phase" used instead of "faze."
I am disturbed by many comments here that self-righteously suggest, in lock step with Yellow Peril propaganda, that IP theft, cheating, stealing, deception, and treachery are uniquely Chinese behaviors. If anything, they learned how to do all of those things from Western powers, especially America and the British. Enough of the sanctimony and hypocrisy.
10
@Sarah Johnson
That is a mighty broad statement about America and Britain, backed with absolutely no substance. In clear contrast, "IP theft, cheating, stealing, deception, and treachery" are the Chinese Communists state policies.
There is no sanctimony and hypocrisy, only annoyance and impatience with the insolent, infantile behavior of China's rulers. The Chinese people feel the same way about their rulers, but may only express their true feelings at their Peril.
9
@Sarah Johnson you sound like someone that hasn’t lost their job to unfair Chinese business practices.
2
Let us look beyond trade war which is simply part of "containment of China" policy. China really needs to reflect on the failure that both parties in USA can even stand together behind this policy. How can you allow this to happen in the first place?
“Personality matters in this relationship,” said Wu Xinbo, the director of the American Studies Center at Fudan University. “The biggest problem is Trump’s credibility.”
Trump has good reason to be confident that he has the backing of his country: 63 million Americans voted to make him president for four years; no Chinese voted to make Xi Jinping Chairman for life.
8
they always say we are forced to turn over technology.. but how is this actually done. does apple have to give away apple technology? if so why isnt their other apples? they never explain exactly why "american companies are forced to give away technology"..
as far as I know, this must be the requirement that all Chinese businesses are at least 50 percent Chinese owned. I have heard of this requirement. thus if apple wants to make iPhones in china.. it opens a subsidiary that is 50% owned by Apple and 50% by Chinese thus form a joint venture.. this doesnt necessarily mean china owns apple tech..
can anyone explain how giving away technology is done.. I'm guessing
2
I am highly skeptical about this interpretation of China's situation. I agree with the critics in the article who argue that Xi overreached and that China's aggressive pursuit of influence (it's "coming out", if you will) was highly premature. It would have been better for all if China had continued developing while biding its time. However, that is also water under the bridge and the reality is that we are where we are today. There is no going back. It is worth noting that it is unclear how much these sanctions will really hurt China. It may be that Americans will simply end up paying more for a great many consumer goods, including electronics. More importantly, however, is that this article completely fails to mention "the century of humiliation." In 1842, the British (sidebar: the British Empire has its fingers in most of the political catastrophes haunting us today) staged the Opium War, that forced China to accept drugs pushed by the East India company, cede territory, and sign unequal treaties. In 1856, Britain did it again. For 100 years, China was beaten down and humiliated by Western imperialists. The idea that the Chinese are going to back down to the US, given this history and its importance in modern Chinese nationalism, is a fantasy. Nationalism is the single most powerful force in the modern world. I'm pretty sure that the Chinese govt will use the US attack as a way to rally its people and further crush dissent.
48
@Shaun Narine. Why could the UK (and others dont forget) do that? Because China was continually at war with itself and had little direct control over the borders it claimed. (Why is the SCS claim so weak? Because the Chinese government never controlled the coast at all, it was virtually pirate territory for millennia)
And of course, you fail to mention what the British (and others) brought that benefited China greatly, railways, public transport, gas and electricity systems, etc.
10
@John, How about opium? Many
westerners enriched themseleves
by selling opium to Chinese. How
about forcing China to cede Hong Kongfor 99 years. China didn't do that
voluntarily. This is the problem with
imperial powers, they exploit the
internal divisions or create chaos
as they are doing in Middle East.
China is too strong to bend to US
pressure. Much smaller and poorer
Cuba didn't.
1
@John This is the usual argument that imperialists make - the same strange justification has been used to rationalize British occupation in India. I suspect that most Chinese would not agree that the humiliation and degradation of their country that accompanied the Opium War (along with the millions of people addicted to Opium, the reason China acted in the first place) was worth the trade-off of the technological advances you mention. And, of course, much of the West's technology originated in China (gunpowder is the obvious and most consequential of these). Those technologies were also introduced solely for the benefit of the colonial powers, not the locals. The British did what they did because they -and other Western states (along with Japan, later) were a predatory power, preying on a weak state -that is not an excuse for their actions, it is a comment on how depraved they were. The important point is that the Chinese people have been fed a steady diet of what the West did to their ancient, proud country for about a century. This is a depiction of reality that is close enough to the historical truth to drive a lot of resistance and a willingness to suffer and sacrifice in the name of national pride. No government of China, communist or not, is going to forget that.
2
Jane Perlez simply has no sense as yet of just how stable China is. This is not Brazil or South Africa or even India, to look at other BRICS countries. China is different, a country that has grown in real per capita terms at an average of 8,5% yearly these last 40 years. There will be stability and China will continue to grow rapidly since China has been making plans for years to diversify growth sources.
2
However, China’s progress completely depends on exports and no country not one trusts or likes China!
7
If their economy falters, everything can change. They now have people who are used to certain market access and change could really disrupt. The Chinese are no longer the same totally obedient (at least outwardly) to government ignorant minions. Can’t close that Pandora’s box!
3
What Trump is doing now should have been done 10 years ago. We also have let our military decay far too much. Its time to sustain increased military spending. The Chinese play the long game and only recognize strength.
12
The smart bet is that the Chinese masses are much MORE nationalistic than the Trump base. The Chinese are a lot more used to the idea of "eating bitterness" for the good of China than the American masses are used to sacrificing for Trump. The Chinese know they hold this huge cultural ace in the hole.
3
That may be true for older generations. However, current generation in China has seen wealth and addicted to it like never before. Chinese are ultra competitive and would not stop at anything (even overthrowing their officials) if they come in the way of their prosperity!
16
"On Monday, the United States will begin taxing $200 billion in imports from China, the biggest round of tariffs to take effect yet in an escalating trade war. President Trump says the measures are necessary to fight an economic model that requires American companies to hand over technology in exchange for market access and provides state subsidies to Chinese competitors."
Bahahahahahaha. This is China we're talking about. Why "require" the handing over of something, when, according to just about every story I heard from a foreigner/ex-pat, stealing it seems to be the more typical M.O.. There is nothing the Chinese won't steal or fake. (And I say this after spending the most horrific 1.5 years IN China and Hong Kong, trying to protect my elderly mother from her elder abusing son (my 100% blood brother), who also stole my inheritance and who violently assaulted me three times while the police refused to do anything, so don't even try to claim the Chinese are an honest people when I saw and experienced what I did.)
Of course, for businesses that just can't help themselves, salivating greedily over all the money opening that huge, vast market, perhaps they get what they deserve.
12
"President Trump says the measures are necessary to fight an economic model that requires American companies to hand over technology in exchange for market access and provides state subsidies to Chinese competitors."
Let's be clear: that is not just President Trump saying that -- it is the global consensus and it is established fact.
18
Raising tariffs is not "hostile", its just common sense and fair. And rejecting Climate Change "science" is also common sense.
6
Nope. Climate Change is based on rigorous science. Common sense is based on flighty human decisions about situations. Common sense tells you what you want it to tell you. Science tells you the hard truth about the world.
Tariffs aren’t common sense. The cents involved in tariffs are the big bucks this idiotic war will cost the American consumer.
4
Silly positions. Examine the evidence and your assertions are simply not reasonable conclusions. Climate change greatly affected by human activities is what the sound study of nature is revealing. Tariffs interfere with trade and they have caused recessions and hurt businesses that rely upon international markets and sources. Our economy is integrated into the global economy, trying to undo this is not a feasible possibility. Considering that you might only seek inclusion in some group that believes in these unrealistic convictions and your ‘common sense’ makes some sense.
6
@Llewis Climate change is based on rigorous political science.
Somehow Larry Kudlow has to find a way out of this dilemma for the President by helping the Chinese save face! China has been getting away with stealing our proprietary secrets for a long time now, and imposing restrictions on our businessmen that they themselves enjoy here! Plus imposing tariffs on our products too. Art Laffler, Laffler Curve, says China is in a fragile state due to poor management and overreaching business deals that cannot be fulfilled, Etc. If right, then China may capitulate soon. Saving face is the key though.
6
There are two major sources of wealth that support a middle class: resource extraction and manufacturing. That's it, that's all. Resource extraction is the least desirable because it depletes your resources, and the wealth doesn't spread well.
In the current paradigm, you either win at manufacturing or you lose your middle class.
Then there's automation. It doesn't spread wealth to the middle class very much either, and winning a trade war won't fix it.
The immediate problem for America is the trade war with China, to claim back the jobs lost to their cheap labor and their government policies designed to support their middle class.
The long-term problem is to redefine what it takes to have a middle class, given the fact that the world won't need that many people to build stuff. What will people do, and who will pay them to do it? This will require fundamental changes to how we think of labor, how we distribute wealth, and how we support a comfortable lifestyle without stripping the planet bare like a plague of locusts.
The second task will be harder than winning a trade war.
10
It’s really scary....
I’m only 33, the World will only be more complicated & have more unrest in next 50 years!
If Climate changes get worse with new Ice Caps melting....... all bets are off! That’s what Obama said too!
1
China was the most advanced and happiest human civilization while Europe was struggling through the Middle Ages and right up to the 19th century. It would not accept nearly all goods in trade for it’s own, only gold. The Europeans relied upon technologies invented in China to modernize.
But one day in the 19th century Great Britain sailed into China and effectively took control along with other industrialized countries and China began a long century and a half of humiliation and failure to restore it’s power and wealth. That experience is not forgotten and should not be forgotten by anyone who needs to deal with China.
It’s one thing to address their bullying in trade and state control of their economy and their attempts to take control of international waters crucial to world trade, these are problems that create other problems, big and serious ones. But to remind them of their humiliation is to play with outrage and people who feel outraged are going to let their feelings not their rational self interest to guide their behavior.
2
@Casual Observer
"That experience is not forgotten and should not be forgotten by anyone who needs to deal with China."
Boo-hoo for Chinese sensibilities (AKA Chinese Communist Propaganda). Imagined feelings of revenge and humiliation are simply manifestations of a petty and infantile government seeking to distract the poor creatures living under its corrupt and morally bankrupt dominion.
5
You do not understand. The Chinese were unable to free themselves from foreign domination no matter what they tried including trying to integrate Western ways. They could not achieve wealth and power until the end of the Twentieth century. It is an experience that no Chinese person can forget.
I think China-USA trade war no benefits for world. USA lost his control to stop china trade and their development. Day by Day china makes new trade market outside of Asia, Africa, Middle east, that really bad news for trump administration. I think we should work together for better peaceful world.
9
@Ivana KinsleyI doubt if anyone wants to stop China trade or develop. But you cannot have a country laughing all the way to the bank, exporting at virtually any price it can get, while building trade barriers and tariffs to keep out all but essential imports.
China should be mature enough to play fair. Reciprocate tariffs and barriers and there is absolutely no argument.
9
Yes!
We Americans were the Chinese of the day stealing all the British technology starting off with railroads, bad debts & patent issues!!!! Amazing to think of it.... but such a true similar pattern upto the 1870s.
NOW
China, the 1990s are OVER! Act like the member of the UN Security Council that you are!
And WTO!
Frankly, I would rather see a trade ruckus with China than ever greater complicity by US corporations in China's suppression of civil and human rights -- for example, as currently contemplated by Google.
7
@M. Casey
do you not care about the right to live of the Iraqis? the Libyans? the Syrians?
Hostility in Washington? There is hostility to China's trade practises everywhere! In UK, in SE Asia and in Europe. Trump is bashing the drum, but he is doing it for more than just the US.
17
Trump does not lead, he orders. He abhors constraints of any kind and he does not work with others to accomplish anything with any team efforts. He says what he wants and expects others to figure out how to do it and bring him what he wants.
Alliances and partnerships require accommodating others, he sees every human interaction as a zero sum transaction, he does not trust allies nor partners, he expects them to take unfair advantage or to fail to perform if they do not see any advantage from fulfilling their obligations. His own behavior in business shows exactly this kind of behavior. So he thinks that unilateralism is the only way to assure that the U.S. will not somehow be the loser.
5
@John
I won't call that hostility at all. perhaps our ruling elites simply cannot face the truth that usa in the not too distant future will no longer be the sole superpower and they have neither the answer or the honesty to inform the public the truth.
a multipolar world will be safer for us all. I think the Iraqis, Libyans, and Syrians would agree.
I loathe Trump, but someone needed to do something. The amount of IP theft has been historic.
The Chinese are very well organized, and they will retaliate in a highly coordinated way using interwoven public and private sector pressure we won’t easily discern, much less emulate.
They will feign submission, and then quietly slice our ankles (economically speaking..).
But in my experience of almost a decade in a Chinese city: in the end they will respect a hard bargainer.
25
@James Ozark
apple sued Samsung for copyright/patent infringement and won in u.s. court.
show me where and when u.s. company sued Chinese company for ip theft and won? source?
please don't perpetuate myth.
Remember that "Power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely". How can both nations have a corrupt power issue at the same time? Xi is sitting on a gold mine but seems to think that the press reports are more important than real economic choices. The people there are smart and based simply on numbers and access to the world their nation will end up dominating the world economy within the decade that is unless Xi wants the power of Mao and as a result squashes real change in China where they become totally entrenched in their borders and not inside the competitive world. The US has periodically shown that an open border and a competitive focus gives them the lead in real economic growth. However, like Great Briton the US is on the road down as the government continues to spend far more that it has where the Federal Reserve could end up having to have the Feds declare bankruptcy when the national debt reaches 150% of the GDP. Where are the commonsense leaders in both nations today? Are they domestic ostriches with their heads in the false reporting nationalistic focus sand?
7
There is a need to confront Chinese for long. China is taking all advantages from its joining WTO, but not following some of the basic rules of open market. And that became easier for this communist country as its government has no obligation to seek public opinion and face elections. I think trump administration could have taken our European and other allies while confronting China.
12
@Bonku The Trump administration is the process of attacking and trying to destroy the WTO. It is implementing illegal tariffs against many of its allies. It has made it clear that it has absolute contempt for international law. Do you really think that it is the best ambassador for "cheating" and the rule of law given its own dispositions and its record?
3
If China wants to have open access to American markets we should insist that they move toward developing democratic institutions and freedom of speech and the press. Also, economically they should be required to live by the same rules they impose on others including the United States. The explosion of international trade over the last 40 years has devastated the American middle class. Like heroine, the allure of cheap manufactured goods by impoverished people in third world countries with no environmental laws feels good but is a deadly and moral trap.
7
@Mike
the u.s. sure has open market? Obama insinuated Huawei has built in backdoor without presenting any evidence? trump administration took the same tack. that to me is sabotage the competitor's brand and protecting American brand's market share at the same time.
Huawei simply has a better product at cheaper price.
It is naive to image US and China could coexist without competition and struggle. The trade war is a way for US to use its influence. Would China back down on it? I don't think so. Would two side reach a deal in the near future? I don't think so. Is there a truce after struggling for long time? I think so.
6