Independents Approve of the Economy, but Will It Help Republicans in the Midterms?

Sep 18, 2018 · 41 comments
Mike Edwards (Providence, RI)
I think the lady in the picture is letting the world know that she has found one character who could a better job than the current occupant of the White House.
hdtvpete (Newark Airport)
@mike, here is one of those "old white folks" who voted Republican from the time I was first eligible until 2004, when the Bush/Cheney administration finally convinced me to change my registration to independent. I find plenty of things not to like about both parties. But the Repub's support of Trump and their silent approval (silence implies consent in this case) of his erratic, uninformed "from the hip" style of governance, along with his total lack of respect for institutions of government, has turned me against the GOP for good. But the Dems should stop and think about why we're in a position where a 2-vote Senate margin is now confirming judges for federal courts and the Supreme Court. It was the Democratic leader of the senate, Harry Reid, who first invoked the so-called "nuclear option" to bypass a 60-vote hurdle and confirm judges during the Obama administration. And yes, I know exactly why he did it - McConnell and company were stonewalling Obama's appointments on purpose. But it was said at the time that this move could ultimately backfire against the Dems, and it did with Gorsuch (and may yet happen with Kavanaugh). The chickens have come home to roost. Unless something drastic happens to Kavanaugh's nomination, we will have five conservatives on the Supreme Court, thanks to Harry Reid upending the filibuster and 60-vote requirement.
Crossing Overhead (In The Air)
my questions would be, who doesn’t approve of this economy? Everyone is employed, making money. Real estate and stock market are flying.....what’s not to love!!!!!
Cruzio (Monterey)
The economy is in a fast burn now. Tell me this, what happens when you don’t save money for repairs on your house, quit making deposits in the bank but spend more each day because prices are going up?
Chloe Hilton (NYC)
Do you want social security? Do you want healthcare? Or do you want another giant tax cut for really rich guys. Vote for a retirement that takes care of millennials. The GOP just passed a tax cut that takes care of their donors at our expense.
Ami (Portland, Oregon)
As an independent I don't blindly vote for my chosen party, instead I research the candidates & their platforms & vote for whoever is going to make life better. Do you have a plan for the issues that impact the local community & the country as a whole, & are you willing to compromise with the other side of the aisle to actually pass legislation. In essence I care about your ability to actually do the job you're being elected to, not tell me what you think I want to hear because I'm part of the base. We need leaders who work for the country, not just the party platform. Right now I won't vote for a single Republican at any level of government. I'm well aware that under bush we ended up in an unnecessary war because he lied about weapons of mass destruction, that his irresponsible tax cuts during wartime exploded the deficit that was being paid down under Clinton, & that under his leadership the economy took the worst nosedive since the depression. Obama was a little too cozy with corporate America to do everything he should have to hold those accountable for destroying the economy but it was Republicans who refused to work across the aisle after the midterms that made the recovery much more uneven than it needed to be. They chose gridlock over bipartisanship & now they are enabling Trump's every crazy whim as long as he gives them tax breaks, deregulation, & conservative judges. Independents do actually pay attention. We watch both parties. And vote accordingly.
Carsafrica (California)
Statistically the economy looks good thanks in good part to the recovery initiated by President Obama. Look beyond the numbers and you see another reality. Some 50 million Americans struggle to make ends meet, inflation particularly health care costs and education dilute the meager tax decrease received by the middle class. The reactionary tariffs imposed by Trump exacerbate the situation. Increases in Interest rates can be the nail in the coffin. The irresponsible tax decreases for the rich and corporations adds to our debt a burden to be thrust onto future generations. Add to that trillions in Student loans, their future is bleak. Even bleaker when you realize that our infrastructure is broken as is our education system and there is no money left to fix these critical problems to ensure we remain competitive in a global market. There will be a recession if severe we have no capacity to recover. The Debt situation will get worse as a our population ages and Health Care costs soar. The a Republican answer is to cut benefits the real answer is to reduce costs, eg prescription drugs. We need an economic agenda that does not veer right or left but propels the country forward. Independents need to listen to Michael Bloomberg
Jorge Rolon (New York)
@Carsafrica "an economic agenda that does not veer left or right but propels the country forward" Anybody surprised that Donald Trump is the president of this enlightened country? And the solution: "Michael Bloomberg". Nulla est redemptio. At least for now.
merc (east amherst, ny)
It's simply amazing to continually hear how Independents want to hang their hats on Trump's hat rack because of how well the economy is doing. Simple deductive reasoning points to the 'fact' Trump was handed a surging economy by means of attrition. He succeeded a president whose initiatives were the locomotive of that surging economy. Hello, Independents, President Barack Obama created something majical considering the disastourous eight year Republican debacle he followed. After eight years, the Bush-Cheney Administration accounted for a negative 500,000 joins. Eight years of a Obama/Biden Administration resulted in a positive 23 Million jobs. Yes, thats million jobs. And that figure is solely private sector jobs. It does not include Government jobs. Trump jumped into a race and was handed a baton from Obama and hasn't had to look over his shoulder for anything other than the steadily increasing pace of the Mueller Investigation. (And for good reason.)
Charlesbalpha (Atlanta)
I am an independent voter, and I think people who attach themselves to political parties are often blinded by partisanship, while independents can see things more clearly. I thought Trump was an idiot the first time I heard him give a speech , and my opinion of him has only gone lower since then. This November I intend to vote against any Republican who has helped him ruin the country, but that does not mean I've turned Democrat. They've made stupid errors too, just not as serious.
merc (east amherst, ny)
@Charlesbalpha George Bush/Dick Cheney Administratiuon brought the 'world economy' to its knees. Barack Obama/Joe Biden Administration got us-and the world-on our feet again. Their initiatives, and may I point out the Democrats did it with zero help from the Republican Party, became the locomotive of the recovery and continue to be the bedrock of what we're witnessing today.
Mr. Slater (Brooklyn, NY)
This Independent cares more about the condition of my local public schools, crime, gentrification, affordable housing, etc....
Gino G (Palm Desert, CA)
This column is the first place I have read the insightful but rarely acknowledged fact about the uselessness of certain approval polls in the modern hyper-partisan age. For example, saying that Trump's approval rating is 40 % is meaningless. The math is purely partisan. The 40% results from no Democrats approving of Mr. Trump and a substantial number of Republicans approving. I once predicted that it was mathematically impossible for Trump to ever exceed 44%, which at rare times he has barely approached. Reason is simple. Zero Democrat support, always, and 85%-90% Republican support. Factor in independents and it becomes clear that Trump will never exceed 44%. Doesn't matter what he does or how successful he may be, he is never budging the 44% ceiling. Historically, polls gave us a good cross section of the citizenry's opinion. No more. there is no cross section. Just diametrically opposed camps which will never veer from their viewpoint. The only things that matter are the intensity by which the opposing camps are committed to their positions, and the marginal difference which might be made by non partisan voters, if such a breed even exists anymore.
Ma (Atl)
Democrats - please give us someone to vote for that is NOT a progressive liberal. Extremes are not attractive to thinking independents that have no 'loyalty' to a party.
Moe Def (Elizabethtown, Pa.)
@Ma Agree. The radical left is making great inroads today with the DNC, and moderates are being pushed aside. I do think that some of the Olde fossils in the party need to step aside for younger democrats though, or the party, in general, will lose again...
mike (nola)
one of the main problems with asking "how the economy is doing" is the generic nature of the question itself. If the person is the type that thinks they should not pay taxes, then any time a tax cut occurs they reflexively claim the economy is doing better. They cling to the false idea of trickle down economics put forth by Reagan. If that same person has unvoiced racial biases, nothing Obama did was good, so anything Trump does to undo his policies means the economy is doing better, no matter the action or facts involved. Many people, mainly old white folks refuse to admit that Bush and the R's tanked the economy and Obama with NO HELP from the R's in Congress put it on the recovery path. These are the same people people who see no problem with McConnell not giving Merrick Garland a hearing for 14 months but approve of him ramming Kavanaugh through without his full record being made public or the accusations against him investigated by the FBI. Ask them how they would react if Obama did that and if they answer truthfully, they would be foaming at the mouth over it.
Charlesbalpha (Atlanta)
@mike "Old white folks"? Please don't deal in stereotypes, or "identity politics" as it's known nowadays. I'm white and 63 years old, and it's obvious to me that the second Bush wrecked the country with his torture scandals, his putting a crony in charge of disaster control, and his illegal war in the Middle East. And to paraphrase a famous Frenchman, "The Republicans have learned nothing and understood nothing" since then.
Sam (Jacksonville, FL)
@mike Can we keep the perjorative “old” out of our discussions, please? Not all of us blindly follow the GOP path or are unable to think critically.
krnewman (rural MI)
As an Independent I would merely like to mention, since no one ever asks, that what I really don't like, and I agree with 88% of Americans on this, is elected politicians who don't do their job. That more than anything. In that sense I cannot fault one party over the other as they are both utterly abysmal at simply doing the job they were elected to do and instead offering us lame bread and circuses and partisan nonsense. A plague on both houses, Congress and Senate.
John (Nebraska)
@krnewman As a supporter of President Obama from 2008-16, I watched the GOP attempt to thwart (and be successful most of the time) any legislative successes that would make Obama and Democrats appear in positive lighting. At the age of 62, I can look back and say that Democrats practiced the same behavior, though never with the same rabid behavior that the GOP did to Obama. If this is the new landscape of polictis, then our system is essentially compromised and broken, not by Russian hackers or illegal immigrants... but by Americans who expect their elected officials to treat their political opposition like adversaries in all things. Denying/blocking/dilluting legislative issues based on how much success they will bring the opposing party rather than on how much good they will do Americans (Corporations not included) is the real problem. And I am not sure how you fix that.
Jorge Rolon (New York)
@krnewman Most politicians from both parties do their job: the one those who finance their campaigns pay them to do.
Ted (Portland)
This is one independent, former life long Democrat, who doesn’t believe the economy is doing well. Yes the employment numbers are low but those numbers are so malleable as to render them useless, yes there are good numbers on job creation but stuffing boxes for Amazon in a State that has given away its tax base to secure these jobs, which as we speak are on their way to being made absolute, is the most idiotic move these States could make, it’s a guaranteed acceleration in our race to the bottom. The tax cuts to corporations and high net worth individuals gave the economy yet one more sugar high but in the long run that like Q.E. Forever is a losers game. Raising taxes, controlling immigration, spending big on infrastructure and education, a single payer health plan before the nation is completely bankrupt and perhaps most importantly extricating ourselves from the M.E. Quagmire and spending those trillions on rebuilding America and equipping our citizens to compete in this new globalized economy are the only steps left that might save this nation from slipping into oligarchy followed by anarchy. The idea of throwing in the towel and a Universal Basic Income proposed by the boys at Davos would at best be a bandaid that would ultimately lead to a further dumbing down and brainwashing of the electorate, we know how well that turns out from recent events and the lunge toward the right by formerly Democratic leaning societies. We have one more chance let’s not blow it.
Charlesbalpha (Atlanta)
@Ted I learned in college economist class that it's possible for a party to temporary inflate the economy when an election is drawing near, so I'm very skeptical about the Republican's economic message. For some reason, this economic fact is rarely mentioned in the media.
W. J. Wieland (Albertville, MN)
I am not so sure about that statement that Independents are less engaged. That said, as an Independent, I do the best I can to stay informed and have at least a rudimentary understanding of how things work. Assigning credit to the current administration for any economic gains simply is not supported by the numbers one can find at places like Bureau of Labor Statistics and similar. As usual, when the midterms role around, I will vote for those who are able to work across the aisle (or at least seem intent on doing so if they have no history), those that lean toward center (regardless of party), and those who appear to have some clue about what it means to represent their individual constituents as compared to special interests. This administration is chaotic and disruptive, unconcerned about anyone middle or lower income, and clearly and willfully does not understand how the government is designed to function. This congress seems to be in the same mindset. That is what will drive my mid-term voting. Not the economy.
Deirdre (New Jersey)
Just because I can get a service job at $10/hour doesn’t mean I can replace the job I have at even half the salary Employment numbers mean little when fifty year olds are unemployable at even 50% of their prior salary
European American (Midwest)
It's not the economy, it's Congressional gridlock, the tax cut for the rich and Trump's unending mismanagement and malfeasance empowered by worthless elected officials failing in their oaths.
William Carlson (Massachusetts)
It is how they felt when the crash came in 08 so I suggest they go back to leaning the history of failure of the Republican Party's idea that they present, hoping it work this time.
David (California)
Why should it, is there really anyone willing to state what Trump did to spur the economy???? Given what is known of his capabilities (or lack thereof) is there anyone believing he can stimulate an economy by funding tax cuts via deficits??? If such a person exists - point them my way, I have a bridge I’ve been trying to sell in Brooklyn. You may have heard of it.
Bruce Maier (Shoreham, BY)
@David I recommend changing the line to: I have a Trump Tower to sell you in Manhattan.
David (California)
@Bruce Maier Yeah, that's a good point. About the only thing he's EVER done right was being "born" into a rich family. I wonder, "how did he pull that off???"
D Priest (Outlander)
“...because independents are often the most persuadable voters.” I would call them clueless and uninformed.
krnewman (rural MI)
@D Priest Which is why we are not so eager to vote the way you order us to.
b fagan (chicago)
@D Priest - You call us clueless and uninformed - why? Because considering candidates from different parties during each election somehow takes less thought and effort than just robotically filling in a party-line ticket? Please explain how that works. I'm currently boycotting the Republican party at the state and national level, because I think that their national leadership is currently ignoring or exacerbating problems on a variety of fronts, but as recently as 2008 I was considering McCain as well as Obama (until McCain's choice for VP became better known). Why was I thinking McCain? His history of working across party lines on climate, campaign finance, immigration. Also, he was an ethical guy who had deep understanding of how our government works, and he didn't buy into the Reaganite/Tea Party view of the federal government as the enemy of the people. I didn't agree with many of his views, but he didn't tend to push for his way or no way. Then we got Obama but also increasingly partisan obstructionism from the Koched up Republicans in Congress (bad). I'm an independent because I don't think either party is automatically right all the time, or that either party always nominates a better person. I never voted often for Republicans, but I'm pretty furious at them nowadays for taking that choice away for high-level elections. I want collaborative legislating back.
Charlesbalpha (Atlanta)
@D Priest If independents are so persuadable, why have they resisted the blandishments of both parties? The real reason political pundits hate independents is that they have to work harder to get their support.
Hrao (NY)
This economic boom is temporary - the deficit and the lack of infrastructure improvements will drag the economy down. It is surprising that no one sees this. The kids of these "satisfied" voters will be burdened with paying down the deficit and lack of government services. It is amazing that some folks are not able to see beyond their noses. Trump and his cronies are ripping off the younger generation and their kids yet to be born and strangely stealing from yet to be born taxpayers. Gees.
Jim (WDC)
Why is there a preponderance of news about a president and the economy? The president, in general, has very little to do with the state of the economy, as if he/she can make corporations hire more people or get them to pay them more instead of lining their own pockets. Trump had nothing to do with the current state of the economy—outside of the tax breaks for the rich—which alone is dubious as to impact. Presidents can only have an impact during a period of peril, such as the Great Recession of ten years ago, or the Great Depression. The President can only propose unless he/she acts by executive order. Congress has to enact with any bill signed by the sitting president. However, it is no surprise that Republicans want to take credit for the state of the economy, resurrected under Obama, at a point in time their is a Republican in the White House when it was mostly their irresponsible policies that put us in that precarious position with unregulated financial institutions. Let this be understood—there is no constant in the state of the economy other than it is a roller coaster ride throughout one's life. Things may be good, now, for most people, but given the trillion dollar national debt the GOP has brought to our doorstep, it won't be this way forever. But, then, they will, blame the Democrats. Par for the course.
Charlesbalpha (Atlanta)
@Jim I am old enough to remember Republicans claiming (during a prosperous Democratic administration) that the President has little power over the economy. Of course they changed their minds once they won the next election and started claiming credit for everything.
b fagan (chicago)
"Independents Approve of the Economy, but Will It Help Republicans in the Midterms?" Not with a single vote from this independent. The Republicans have been far too extreme for me for a few decades, but particularly since Obama won his first term and since the Supreme Court bungled Citizens United, allowing some extremely wealthy, loony families to push ever more money to (almost entirely) GOP candidates. I'll vote for Republicans again when they do the following: - stop pretending we don't need to get off of fossil fuels quickly - stop lying about voter fraud to disenfranchise groups who tend to not like your party's behavior towards them - stop trying to take access to healthcare and insurance and birth control away again - listen to the polls and work with Democrats on a) sensible gun laws; b) rational immigration reform; c) real campaign-finance reform. I sometimes voted for Republicans in the past, when their candidate seemed better than the Democrat. But that was back when the Republican party was actually conservative, before the radicals took it over and decided the Federal government should be badly run, rather than just smaller. The GOP I preferred would think deficit-boosting tax plans were what the other party did. I want participation from Republicans on the real issues of the day. Instead we get voter fraud hoaxes, climate denial, pandering to exactly one religious viewpoint and general disdain for a properly-functioning central government.
Mike Edwards (Providence, RI)
@b fagan Small "c" conservatism disappeared after Barry Goldwater's defeat in 1964. The nation's debt to GDP ratio rose from 32.5% in 1980 to 66.1% in 1992 - and off we went, culminating in today's "deficit-boosting tax plans".
S B (Ventura)
Trump has VERY little to do with our economic rebound, and he is doing everything he can to sabotage it. Tariffs and tax breaks for Billionaires are going to do nothing but damage the economy. What Trump did was use the tax payers credit card to give away money to his Billionaire buddies and big corporations. He also is letting big corporations pollute, a lot. Which, in the short term may seem like it helps make us more productive, but in the long term our health and environment suffer. The clean up and health costs from the increased pollution are much larger than what little increased production is seen. Trump is BAD for the economy.
HighPlainsScribe (Cheyenne WY)
I imagine that there are those who have supported trump for economic reasons who may figure that they've gotten what they can out of him, and would like a check on trump from this point on. Trump gives them motivation to desire checks with moves like these additional tariffs and the general chaos he wreaks.