I was a freelance artist who delivered my own work,and rode through Manhattan every day in the 1980's. You had to be good to survive then ; there were few bike lanes, but there was less of the self absorption that I see now, on the part of pedestrians, cyclists and automobile drivers. Delivery guys never make a sound to warn you when they are coming at you riding the wrong way on one way streets, riding on sidewalks, or zooming around through crowds of pedestrians on motorized bikes. Pedestrians cross the streets staring at their phones, with a peculiar sense of entitlement to take their own sweet time on a busy thoroughfare. Drivers,especially Uber cabs, drive like they just don't give a sh*t. Civilization works when we all cooperate and have an awareness of each other, and as a long time cyclist and pedestrian I don't see it happening. If bicycle delivery is going to become a bigger component of our lives, there have to be some rules and awareness enforced, for the safety of all.
10
Since my work takes me all over the city I rarely use delivery service. I always leave 10% when I pick up my order usually a dollar or two. Leaving no tip on a delivery is just asking for adulterated food on the next order.
3
Surely the real story here is exploitative child labor.
This boy should have been living at home with family, illegal alien or not, in school during the day, and doing his homework in the evening.
It is wilful greed to turn a blind eye to the migration of illegal aliens so that they may provide cheap labor for our businesses. The blame lies, too, not just with the authorities and American citizens, but also with families who are willing to farm out their children to do such jobs.
There is plenty of blame and moral turpitude to be shared.
4
I very much sympathize with this person and his family. But as a person who rides a regular leg powered bike in Park Slope every Day I am furious about these delivery people on electric bikes.
The bikes are driven at 25-35 miles per hour and are completely silent. When they want, they drive in the car lanes, when it's more convenient for them, they speed in the bike lane and burn thru the intersections.
The sooner these "bikes" are banned, the sooner people will stop being hurt. I'm sure Edwin was a wonderful person, but these high speed electric bikes are dangerous for themselves and everyone else.
As for the Austrian woman, all bike riders are in danger every day in N.Y. Most unlucky if a DUI driver is near them. Wear your helmet...
6
"New York’s Hispanic community, in Guatemala and among groups fighting to improve the working conditions of undocumented immigrants here."
Improve their working conditions? They aren't supposed to be working. In fact they aren't even supposed to be here.
Note too that they work off the books and thus pay no taxes disproving the claims of sympathizers that these people are assets who aren't costing us anything. To top it off they send money to the homeland which is of no value to us at all. The money they send home to Mexico is the number one addition to Mexico's GDP with oil sales from PEMEX Mexico's state owned oil company now second.
And spare us the semantic games. US law calls the "Illegal Aliens" not "undocumented immigrants".
14
Ow boo hoo. Millions of us have to walk or ride bikes in the city streets. And thanks to our morals, law enforcement, and immigration policies, we don't have to risk getting stabbed, kidnapped, or forced into sex trafficking on the way to work, like the countries these workers come from. Maybe if they took the time to follow our laws and not jaywalk, they wouldn't risk their lives. Even though for them its safer here on the street than a 5 star resort in their country.
1
Consider how people drive/ride in the countries from which these illegals came. Consider also that they are very young when we thought ourselves immortal. I live in Kalamazoo where 5 cyclists were killed by a drug crazed driver. And every time I drive around I encounter cyclists riding evry which way, how every the mood strikes them. And this city has bike lanes, not congested with traffic, and the county just passed a law requiring 5 ft distance for cars from bikes. No reference to need for the bike to be following laws. How do i keep the 5 ft when the cyclist is going against traffic then cutting across 3 lanes? I’ve riden in European cities. It is more dangerous here.
3
An Australian & Australian's perspective (though by all reason and logic, there should be little difference in agreement):
Bikes riders must adhere to all road rules including not riding on the pavement, going through red lights and (theoretically ) staying in lane (where no bike lane ) and not passing vehicles either from the right or left in the same lanbe they are in.
Helmets are mandatory or suffer a $300 fine if caught not wearing one.
If a motor vehicle is breaking the law ( such as speeding) and hits a cyclist injuring or incapacitating him/her...it is a crime to leave the scene before police arrive/are called, the driver will probably be tested for DUI and certainly charged if the law broken (speeding) led to a the greater possibility of death or severe injury if that were the result.
Australia isn't a tipping culture/country (we pay our retail staff much more than the U.S) BUT...when it comes to Home Delivery of any meal, it is common courtesy and the right thing to do to provide the delivery person with a Tip.
You won't find an illegal working at any job in Australia and be hard pressed to even find an illegal as our borders are Ocean (Australia is an island continent!)
This lack of illegal immigration/immigrants ensures that Australian wages and pay levels are not diluted or avoided by businesses or Employers hoping to gain at a person's expense. It also helps us to pay the highest minimum wage in the world ($18.93 hour) All people have free healthcare.
9
IMHO, there are two distinct categories of deliverymen... the food delivery guys, and 'bike messengers' (who typically work within Manhattan, and either usually either white or black men). I assume what we are talking about here are just the food delivery guys, typically latino (or Chinese men, if delivering for an asian restaurant).
I really feel for these food delivery guys... really I do. I see the way most people don't even look them in the eye, when accepting their food deliveries. I observe how people think nothing of ordering food delivery during torrential downpours...during blizzard conditions... and not having an iota of concern for the delivery guy's safety. People throw a few dollars into the guy's hands, instead of considering the difference it could make to that delivery guy to give him just 1, 2, 3, 10 more dollars??
These men work extremely hard, for every penny they earn. Their jobs are thankless. Their jobs are extremely dangerous.
However, that does not change the fact that many of these cyclists are dangerous to other cyclists and pedestrians. They do not obey traffic laws. Many now use E-bikes, making their illegal cycling patterns even more deadly. The restaurants that hire them, and Seamless, GrubHub etc. are all to blame for these behaviors, and, together with the DoT/police, must provide better regulation of them.
21
.......Looking forward hearing how illegals “pay taxes” with a sixth grade education, illiterate in both their new and native language and devoid of any skills that command anything beyomd poverty wages.
9
It may interest readers that one of the regulatory changes/proposed laws regarding increasing the penalties to any business employing illegal immigrants proposed by Congress /Trump...was dropped due to lobbying and pressure from interested parties , who benefit hugely from being able to hire illegals and not pay them the minimum wage as well as any other benefits /protections mandatory to Employees.(few that there are )
Obviously this keeps the pressure on wages for Americans down and in some areas, people expecting at least the Minimum wage for many jobs find that they will not get them unless they are willing to accept lower pay.
Currently , IF a business is caught having illegals as employees, (and the chances of being caught are low ) the penalties that apply are so weak, most employers will hire illegal the next day or whenever they need to be replaced following an inspection carried out.
Business always comes first before people in America...whether GOP or Democrat...(in this area anyways)
7
We cannot quickly change the system, but we can tip well for delivery.
12
While I would like to empathize with the family of Edwin, the truth is he was an illegal alien, hired illegally for deliveries, who was breaking the law on his bike and was killed by a motorist who was breaking the law by speeding.
Yes there is a problem with cars running into cyclists but frequently I see cyclists not riding their bikes like they are aware there are 2 ton objects out there to crush them.
Nonetheless, this whole situation stems from a congress and a bureaucracy that finds itself unable or unwilling to lower the cost of entry into the US citizenry. Once citizens, these people would be employed, insured, and represented.
Fiscal irresponsibility and immigration reform are the two biggest problems our government is facing.
10
So restaurant owners are using child labor. Interesting. Have there been any consequences to the businesses involved?
And of course, in employing undocumented immigrants, they are avoiding the various costs of employment such as contributions to social security, etc.
There's a word for this - exploitation.
17
600$ a week cash no tax
28,800 a year if he works 48 weeks, not all that bad for no education not speaking english...
4
@honeybluestar I think your figures are way, way high. Would you care to reveal your math and assumptions?
@gcRead the article..........$600 times 48 weeks........and if they are paid of the books, thats $28,000. tax free.
Delivery men take their lives in their own hands. I hope they are paid well.
He flagrantly flouted the traffic law, and died as a consequence. All the sad background does nothing to change that. The author's agenda, and so many others here, is no different than some of the repugnant scripts from the other side. Where do you find objective writing these days?
7
Attention all NYT readers , don’t support any restaurant that uses illegal electric bikes. Yeah right, you do as I say not as I do
7
Sorry, but I couldn't get past the fact that a 14 year old illegal immigrant was actually hired by some patently nefarious company who put profit over moral principal and righteousness. What?! Why didn't The Times interview them?
We are so very far adrift from being a civilized, caring, humane City. This 14 year old belonged in school!...IN GUATEMALA! Why does this article instead focus on the cheap melodramatic sentimentality of fellow illegal immigrants who somehow want to claim a mantle of oppressed hero-laborer risking their lives for rich gringos?
Our citizenry deserve better. A city FULL of illegal workers (and we are brimming here in NYC!) who cannot speak English and who do not wish to be identified speaks volumes about our lawlessness and our utter lack of imagination and dedication to our own future humanity.
Guess what? If there were no illegal immigrants to fill job vacancies, that would mean these companies would have to pay actual living wages to legal citizens. We would then rightfully be forced to live in a reality-based economy instead of the propped-up welfare state we've been inhabiting for decades now.
End illegal immigration! Support, Demand and Welcome legal immigration from all corners of the globe!
14
I’m shocked that more delivery men aren’t killed.
They use silent electric bikes (illegal) at high speeds, ride on sidewalks, ride the wrong way on one way streets, pass red lights, don’t use bike lanes, and don’t carry liability insurance.
But because they are illegal aliens we must allow this.
Are their employers abiding by all employment laws? Who cares?
9
Every time a delivery man who is breaking the law running red lights or riding in traffic gets hit, it raises the law abiding drivers of New York's auto insurance. We generally pay the highest insurance in the country. Often illegal immigrants, working illegally on our streets cause higher costs for law abiding American residents so that people too lazy to go out and pick up their food can sit at their desks. I guess if you register your car in New Jersey, Connecticut, or Pennsylvania that doesn't bother you as much. Commercial delivery riders should be required to have licenses and commercial insurance for all vehichles.
3
I've noticed, that the same people who demand that we have "open borders", seem to be the same people who order from restaurants using immigrants as slave delivery boys.
The author was unhappy that the driver wasn't charged with a crime. I'm unhappy that the restaurant owner wasn't charged with a crime.
If don't like slavery, don't patronize slavers.
14
"According to Brian O’Dwyer, a partner at the New York personal injury law firm O’Dwyer & Bernstien, if a deliveryman — regardless of citizenship — is injured or killed on the job, his sole recourse is workers’ compensation from his employer’s insurance."
This statement, if accurately quoted, is not true. New York is a no-fault insurance state providing medical coverage for pedestrians and cyclists hit by automobiles, regardless of fault.
Please do not misinform readers about their legal rights, discouraging them from seeking care. (Wasn't this fact checked?)
Crash victims must report the incidents within 5 days to the precinct (24 hours for a hit-and-run). They can receive medical care immediately using their crash report number (including if transported to hospital by ambulance). Hospitals must also provide care for anyone in trauma, under EMTALA.
The majority of crashes involve low, moderate to severe injury, and cyclists and pedestrians are entitled to medical care under No-Fault. Death benefits under No-Fault are low. But most people can be helped.
My not-for-profit Web site provides information on the law and filing a claim: NYC Car Crash Resources--NYCCarAccident.
NYC has many advocacy-minded attorneys who in cases of serious injury (fracture, etc) can help getting medical care and settlements.
Mr. O'Dwyer is apparently not among them. Just how does he conclude that most delivery cyclists are at fault in crashes? This view is biased and prejudicial.
6
The problem is not the deliveries on bikes but the tai-state kooks who rent Citibikes and think they know how to ride on the mean streets of NYC. Those folks could learn something from the experts. Cyclists obey traffic laws when their vehicles are recognized and included in city planning.
1
Two comments:
1) Fewer than half of the bicycles on the streets of NYC have front or rear lights. Reflectors aren't enough. Drivers of cars as well as pedestrians need to be able to see them coming. Why doesn't the mayor, with his "Vision Zero" program, mandate that all bicycles must have both front and rear lights installed by a certain date? This would be a sensible law that would be obeyed and would save lives and injuries to both pedestrians and bikers.
2) The anarchy that exists on the streets with bicycles is clearly the result of a police department that does nothing about it. There is zero enforcement.
4
Motorists are going to continue killing and maiming pedestrians and bicycle riders until they are held accountable for their actions. Until each and every crash is investigated as a felony nothing is going to change. Motorists think themselves entitled to 100% of the road. We, the public and legislators, have ceded the byways to drivers and all other legitimate users are instructed to beware. Unless a driver is drunk, drugged, or leaves the scene he/she does not get even a ticket for any infraction, including for running a red light, after killing someone. The NYPD automatically claims pedestrian or bicyclist error. Because of the way traffic laws are written and enforced the city and state are at least complicit in, if not encouraging of, motorist's assault on the non-motorized public. There is no will or courage in the city or state legislatures to rein in entitled drivers. How much slaughter before drivers are forced to change?
2
@Lee
Not six months ago a four-year-old and a one-year-old were run over by a car and dragged through an intersection, experiencing horrific terrifying deaths. The pregnant mother was also run over and lost her unborn child weeks later.
If that doesn't move us to take serious legislative action, nothing will. My blood boils every time I hear de Blasio spout off about his Vision-Zero charade.
Its nightmarish what we've become in America - who we are as Americans: we are a people who effectively did nothing after 20 first-graders were slaughtered with a machine gun at Sandy Hook. Because Wayne LaPierre said "NO!"
Its the new normal.
1
Anyone riding a bicycle, whether it be deliverymen or Citibikers, MUST stop at a red light. They not only risk injuring pedestrians, but themselves! R.I.P. Edwin Vicente Ajacalon.
4
Thank you NYT for highlighting the dangers faced by these individuals who provide a service that quite frankly is a LUXURY!
As the late Anthony Bourdain noted, the restaurant industry in this country would not function without the presence of often not seen, Latino laborers. But in reality, their presence is ubiquitous throughout ALL stages and areas of food production in the US: farming, dairy, meat and poultry. I often say to my husband, that if they wanted show us their true power, just stop working for a day. This country wouldn't EAT! As the filmmaker Boots Riley recently noted, work stoppages can be very effective.
I would not be offended if such a move were made. All of this talk in the current environment is beyond disgusting. Unite! SI SE PUEDE!!!
9
This is a very sad story. Especially since this child was allowed to stay under the radar. If the authorities had been made aware of him, it is highly likely he would have been paced in a foster home to keep him from ending up like this. THIS is why I do agree with immigration enforcement. Our LAWS could very well have saved this child's life.
4
I enjoyed this informative and really moving article. We see these young men working all the time, but seldom do we appreciate their difficult lives and the many dangers that they face. It was also interesting to learn how they have fun with their friends, their love of action movies, and career aspirations! I guy who goes to his private English classes every day after work, spending his scarce cash to do so, showed the immigrant spirit. I do understand their tendency to break traffic rules, but how much instruction and support do they get from the city or their employers? One thing that I was curious about, though, was the ethnic composition, because I have seen lots of Asian as well as Latino delivery boys, and the Asians were not even mentioned in the article. A topic for future research?
7
Using a two-wheeled vehicle around cars is very dangerous and I don’t understand why more is not said about the hundreds of people or are injured or killed in car/bike accidents each year. I use a car and bicycles have cut me off, I see bicyclists going the wrong way or through a light. In San Francisco, I’ve seen bicyclists get tickets for traffic infractions, but not in NY. When I make a turn, I try to block the bicycle lane so a bicycle doesn’t try to pass me in the turn. Do people on bicycles think they are immortal?
8
First, you should stop referring to these people as politically correct "undocumented" and use only the term illegals aliens that they are. Granted, US citizens don't take these jobs but that doesn't excuse distortion of the the illegals" status.
Second, I thoroughly agree with Ben K who correctly writes that these illegal delivery guys are a menace to vehicular traffic and not the other way around. Because I am disabled I use my private vehicle, daily, mostly in Manhattan. In addition to the traffic rules violations mentioned by him there is another serious act that delivery guys commit that can be fatal.
I refer to their passing a vehicle stopped for a red light on a one-way street, about to make a left turn. The reckless delivery man will squeeze between the turning vehicle and the parked vehicles on the right, barely missing being crushed.
Most drivers making right turns on one-way streets with parked vehicles close by on the right passenger side don't look in the right rear view mirror because it is not expected that a cyclist would pass on that side. I would like to see the statistics regarding injuries or death resulting from these reckless cycling acts.
15
@ECJM While I agree that delivery folks on bikes can be dangerous, you seem to lack a basic understanding of safe driving. Whenever you turn as a driver, you are supposed to look in your side mirror AND your blind spot. That is driving 101, and failing to do so put bike riders in jeopardy. Remember, the person going straight has the right of way, meaning that the bicycler who is not turning has the right of way when you are making a right turn in your car.
14
@KVS68 The problem is the way the bicycle lanes are laid out. If I’m making a right turn, I move to the right lane and I don’t expect anything to be on my right, but bicyclists (who are dead right) will charge in anyway. Bicycles and cars do not mix!
@ECJM You're probably the guy that chooses "no tip."
4
Tip. To insure promptness.
Tip these delivery people.
Not hard and means a lot.
As a former waitress who paid for school waiting tables ( and drunks), do the affluent not work menial jobs through school?
13
As a reader who associates with NYT more than a decade and an active participant in comments section,I would like to highlight the following observation in the picture of the caption photo.
Please note the proximity of the cyclist to the pedestrian in ash- grey suit walk over zebra crossing. In the same way one could see the proximity of the pedestrian to the rear end of the car (yellow colored). I am sure that pedestrian wants to reach the other end put his feet already on the zebra crossing before the green signal blinks for 'go' and the swiftness to cross the road while seeing the green signal is the cause for his about a foot width proximity to a cyclist. How we could make the pedestrian more safe and make an exclusive lane for cyclists as in European countries, if NY city is not having the facility on the street displayed in the picture?
2
Thank you NYT for this piece. I’ve often wondered about these delivery men in the city, so ubiquitous yet so nameless. For those wondering about tipping, if you can afford to use seamless you can afford to tip your delivery man in cash—$5 minimum.
10
As a daily rider in the bike lanes, I can say unequivocally that delivery guys routinely and perpetually ignore traffic rules. The worst violation that particularly galls me is going the wrong way, against the clearly marked arrows of traffic direction. Very dangerous to lawful bike traffic as it forces us to choose between head on collision or going out into car lanes. Also dangerous to pedestrians stepping out into the bike lanes as they cross the street. They are focused on avoiding traffic coming from the appropriate direction, not the opposite.
These arrows are understandable regardless of one's first language.
Rather than harvesting City Bikers for $190 tickets who are going in the lawful direction, I would like to see police vigorously step up enforcement of this egregious, dangerous one way traffic violation. Guaranteed, 98% of those cited will be delivery guys.
Cops, please continue to hide in doorways like you normally do to catch bikers, but face the other direction, and focus on those coming from the wrong way. That may not be a money maker but it is by far the greatest hazard.
While I have empathy for anyone struggling to make a living, I do not condone endangering others by flagrantly breaking the law to do it. The extra seconds to go a few hundred extra feet around a block are not going to make or break delivery guys financially. They are a true menace that needs to be addressed.
21
The Red Arrow Bonded Messenger Corporation opened its NYC office in 1934. The messengers filed a void for same day deliveries and were neat, courteous, wore dove-grey uniforms and caps. In Manhattan even into the 1950's, a purchaser at a major department store could have the items delivered by "Red Arrow" that day. The messenger had a bicycle with a large box on wheels attached in front of him. It was most likely a Worksman Front Loader and it is still sold today at a hefty price of $1,629. Many Red Arrow workers ended up at the rapidly growing Untied Parcel Service company. Some had started riding bicycles for Red Arrow including Harold Oberkotter, Chairman and CEO: 1974-1980. In many ways, the quality of life in Manhattan was much better decades ago. And Red Arrow messengers were respected and greatly appreciated by the customers and the company's management.
11
Because the entire economy surrounding bike deliveries is corrupt, I just don't use them. And I've seen delivery guys ride straight into unsuspecting pedestrians crossing the streets and keep going. Because it's so bad I figure, what makes it so hard to simply allocate your own time to pick up your own food?
13
I probably sound pretty cold hearted but I'm not that concerned with the well being of the delivery men. Almost universally, delivery men are breaking the law and endangering the lives and property of law abiding New Yorkers. They do not follow traffic laws including riding illegal electric bicycles, running red lights, driving the wrong way in traffic, riding in lanes of traffic, and riding on the sidewalk. They are reckless. Often accidents occur and pedestrians are injured. If they have a collision with a motor vehicle, it is the law abiding driver who must prove it was impossible to avoid the accident. The city should require all delivery vehicles be commercially insured for liability and hospitalization and enforce traffic laws against them. Cheap delivery is paid for with pedestrian injuries and higher auto insurance premiums. My assumption is that the City does not crack down on them is because many delivery men are illegal immigrants. Mayor Di Blasio believes in a sanctuary city.
21
Do ever get anything delivered, Mike? Lunch when it's rainy out, dry cleaning, an Amazon package? What about those working shifts or schedules who can't leave their workplace for a meal? I don't think it's that hard to find some compassion for people working a job that most people don't want, but won't do themselves. All bikers should obey traffic laws, but we should also push for policy changes that prioritize the safety of humans over the speed of traffic.
13
Mike, As for the law abiding driver who must prove it was impossible to avoid the accident, the impression I've gotten from many news stories over years is that drivers almost always face no criminal liability for killing, much less injuring, cyclists, regardless of circumstances. A driver may be ticketed for running a red light or making an illegal turn, but the cyclist who was killed as a result is usually ignored. On the other hand, delivery men do create hazards and sometimes injuries to pedestrians and other cyclists by ignoring laws and riding recklessly.
3
@Mike electric bikes are illegal in N.Y ? what was the reasoning for that?
I just returned from London where I was working for 8 weeks. I do this every summer. Cyclists almost ALWAYS obey the traffic laws. Never run red lights and travel in the right direction on the streets. I can't say for sure, but cars and trucks seem to be more civil when it comes to dealing with cyclists. I welcome comments from cyclists in London.
10
@TobeTV i'll tell you what's a thrill..crossing the street for the first time in london, and automatically looking in the wrong direction for traffic. it's all too easy to see how one could get clipped by a bicycle going in the wrong direction.
1
While I greatly appreciate the dangers ALL bicyclists face riding the city streets, there is not one mention of the danger the delivery cyclists pose to pedestrians in NYC. A little over two years ago, my sister was hit blindly by a delivery cyclist going the wrong way on a one way street attempting to cross 7th Ave to jump a light change. At the same moment she stepped off the curb for a Walk sign, she was hit and thrown in the air, landing on her backside. The cyclist was thrown off his bike but unhurt (a co-worker snapped his picture on his cell phone). He hung around for a few moments but after realizing that an ambulance was called he fled. As a result of the hit, she broke her pelvis in two places. We were all thankful she did not land on her head, but recovery required months of rehabilitation and the inability to go to her job. We filed a police report but knew we would never know or catch the culprit. The fact is, this city is way too crowded and moving vehicles of all types fight for space. Something must be done, either to limit cars or cyclists or both. NYC is primarily a walking city and pedestrians must take priority.
43
1. When they drive fast down sidewalks, it is completely dangerous and illegal. So fast you cannot see them especially when they come from behind. They get away with it though so they keep doing it.
2. Tipping them nothing is evil. I may loath these kids as a pedestrian but I would never dream of grabbing the bag and walking away.
25
I concur with both the hard working delivery people who ride so fast because they want to get back to pick up more orders, cutting time by riding unsafely.
But mostly I concur with the readers who find
fault with the rider’s dangerous habits. This in a residential neighborhood. Sidewalks are teaming with strollers, kids coming from local schools, and the added curse of clueless kids on their scooters, parents included.
My daughter, pregnant yet, was hit by a delivery person. She knew she was wrong to cross in the middle of the block, but not before being certain it was safe to do so, checking if a car wasn’t coming from the correct direction. Then hit by a delivery guy riding like a bullet from the wrong direction. Aside from being in tears worrying about her injury, she felt so guilty that perhaps the police would come and arrest him for being an illegal. When a passerby wanted to alert the police she begged him not to do so. The guy was so remorseful, but he to realize that what he did was wrong. I see it all the time. The pizza store is on the corner of our residential block, parked bikes block the narrow sidewalk, adding yet another threat. The drivers seem to think they own they own the space
14
@bcm Maybe they should have to be licensed and insured like car drivers. Then it will mean something to lose their license or have to pay more for insurance.
2
as a fellow immigrant and bike rider I feel their pain. however, many delivery guys (most are male) don't wear helmets, use lights - the city gives these things out for free. but most annoyingly is the fact that many ride in the wrong bike lane, instead of going to the next avenue that goes the other direction.
18
@bl,
Look every driver in all places at all times is responsible for the vehicle they operate. Even a bike. That said bicycles colliding with bicycles is one thing, cars and trucks are another. Yes it is hard to drive in the city. too much for you don't. But you cannot say it is not murder to kill someone when you are the driver. Accidental fine but that means you still murdered someone
1
@joe "But you cannot say it is not murder to kill someone when you are the driver."
The law can:
Murder is the unlawful killing of another human without justification or valid excuse, especially the unlawful killing of another human being with malice aforethought.
The man speeding the youth running a red light. Both broke a "law" which offense was was the worst?
WE all speed one time or another I bet most of us don't consider running a red light due toe the extreme ramifications by doing so.
The cyclist gave himself the right of way when it was clearly not . the same law he broke entering this country illegally
I understand the perils outlined in the article. But woe to the pedestrian, minding his own business on the sidewalk, who gets hit by one of these delivery people. They come silently from behind. A dog was killed in my neighborhood, ON THE SIDEWALK, by one of these people and my next door neighbor was also hit from behind by a delivery person riding on the sidewalk, and ended up in the hospital for three months.
None of them has the required signage any more. Calling 311 to complain gets nowhere and calling the restaurant, if you're fortunate enough to have that information gets a hang up. Regulate them, fine them for riding on the sidewalk. PLEASE!
31
And no insurance , it’s a utter free for all,
2
I tip well knowing that these delivery guys live for tips!
15
I am more afraid of the crazy citibike riders going the wrong way on one way streets in midtown, not wearing helmets, wearing ear phones and ignoring traffic lights. I fear that they will take me out. These young men are literally risking their lives to bring me my grilled cheese!
16
They're illegal, yet they were hired. To get a handle on the immigration issue, the employers need to be fined. Do they pay taxes, or is this more cash under the table?
What about an employer hiring a fourteen year old kid from Guatemala? We do have laws about mandatory school attendance, beyond the aspect of hiring illegals. Would the story be any less heinous if Edwin was a legal American 14 year old high school dropout whose family had been here for generations? It's one thing for a high school student to have a part-time job after school hours, another one entirely to be working when everyone else is in the classroom.
28
@drdeanster Nobody wants to stop illegal immigration, they just want to whine about it and scare migrant labor into being eager to please. To a gilded age mentality, they're ideal employees who won't sue or organize, who can be fired at will for no reason, who get no workman's comp, and can't complain about anything. Give us more "illegals" just make sure they're plenty scared.
4
It is a mean, mean city, always has been. If it hasn't been mean to you, mazel tov.
5
Central American machismo culture that does not encourage birth control still stubbornly views innocent spouses/mates & offspring as pack mules & cash cows to live off of!
That is what led the 14 yr old Guatemalan deliverero Edwin into being an unaccompanied minor & eventual speeding BMW collision victim, as he worked here.
That is also why the presently 21 yr old Mexican deliverero Fabian saw $8K (plus possibly some usurious interest too!) of his dangerously earned deliverero cash (from the time he arrived here as a 16 yr old eager to reunite w/ his migrant dad) disappear into his dad's pockets - as repayment for the smuggling fee his dad fronted!
It turns out Fabian's dad is a bigamist alrdy living w/ a US green card holder or citizen spouse & their anchor kids!
The guy likely got tired of setting aside secret cash aid to Fabian & his mom, so he tricks the boy into "reunification".
Upon arrival, though, dad then says Fabian cannot live w/ him & his new US family that dad likely sponges off of (i.e. fraudulently gained earned income tax credit & tax refunds from fake/made up SS# as household head; free public school, health care, access to family housing stock & wife's credit, food stamps, etc.), but hey, at least Fabian can now be a "real man" remitting his own under-the-table cash to his mom, right?
Pls. require E-Verify for all US jobs now, so poor overseas teens don't get used/duped by short-sighted parents into becoming uneducated, underpaid, at-risk US slaves!
23
@FairXchange
While what you say it utterly politically taboo ~ you have completely nailed it!
Those of us who live day-in and day-out submerged in the horrific cultural calamity of illegal immigration and residency know all too well that you are speaking far more realistically than this article does.
Thank you.
12
@FairXchange
For everything after "likely," you made that up, right?
I applied for food stamps during the recession. They required more documentation than a bank loan. I had to find my birth certificate, get photographed, and fingerprinted. I decided that it was more trouble than it was worth.
I could explain point by point why the rest of your comment is wrong, but Brandolini's Law makes that impractical.
1
Please don’t bust the ballon of the elitist readers and their unrealistic world view that it’s a lovely place to live in and woman’s rights are respected in those lovely places where they come from
1
As a frequent food delivery customer, I'd be happy to wait a bit longer for my food if it meant that delivery bicyclists would follow the rules of the road. Slow down and keep yourselves (and drivers and pedestrians) safe. Of course bicyclists don't bear the blame for all of the accidents that involve them, but my observation is that they engage in reckless behavior more frequently than either pedestrians or drivers do.
13
I am wondering where the information about lack of tipping comes from. Who is reporting this? I am very skeptical of these numbers.
Do the restaurant owners actually pay out the full tips on the apps? I would be very, very surprised if they do, since even in upscale restaurants management has been known to take a percentage of the tips (which is illegal). I don't know if the delivery companies need to report the tips in any way, but I see some big loopholes that less than honest restaurant owners can exploit.
I'm sure there are lots of folks who aren't from Metro NYC and are sure that the delivery man is getting a tip when they use apps, thus the 0 tip. Or they just don't understand the financial aspects of restaurants in NYC.
5
@m.pipik I always tip 20% on the apps, and I see my friends and family doing the same whenever we order food together, so that part of the story took me by surprise too. Maybe the NYT needs to do a follow-up on restaurants withholding tips from the delivery people.
10
@m.pipik, Lack of tipping is real. There are a lot of cultures - most of them, really - where the kind of tipping we do in the US does not exist. The most that happens is a rounding out of the bill, which is not necessary in an age when cash is rarely used to pay it anymore. It is not every non-tipping culture is cruel and exploitative - in many European countries for example, waitstaff, deliverymen, etc., earn, by law, a living wage with benefits. In some countries, tipping has very negative associations going back to the days when servants were barely paid and lived off tips. And then there are countries where fair tipping doesn't happen due to snobbery and entitlement.
So it can be confusing when foreigners, or even first gen, are confronted with our tipping culture and it is less and less common for workers like deliverymen to get fair tips, if any, more so in places like NY and the tech centers where there are more people living, and ordering take out , who did not grow up tipping like that.
2
@Maureen Basedow
Sorry, but you don't seem to know about NY culture. Tipping 15% and more is in our blood for restaurants and taxis. We have been doing it for ages (at least since WWII) and the people who are ordering delivery are residents not tourists. It's something people learn about very early in their stay in NY.
1
Seems the problem and danger here will never be solved/ended... as long as people use delivery service/apps, and want their food asap (rightfully so). It's customer-driven... ultimately just business as usual.
3
@Rob G
The problem will never be solved because we have a complete lack of true leadership in our City. Politicians do not cater to our citizenry, they cater to their moneyed patrons.
The utter absence of political will and backbone is what ensures a status quo of highly expendable, underpaid, illegal immigrants.
3
I always feel empathy towards the delivery folks. Rain, snow, freeze, heat, night, they are out there serving the needs of New Yorkers who want their food and beverages delivered in a matter of minutes. However, especially with the advent of motorized bikes, the delivery folks regularly fail to abide the City’s driving laws. They disregard red lights, stop and yield signs. They drive the wrong way down one way streets. They swerve in and out of traffic on busy city avenues.
Somewhere there needs to be a medium: Just compensation for a desired service and the recognition and acceptance of universal traffic laws. But the immigration status of the delivery men will probably ensure that they will remain strangely invisible to a City that demands their services.
23
When we had the snow storm a couple months ago, I wanted to get delivery - although the restaurant was open and could delivery I didn’t do it mainly because of the conditions on the road I didn’t want someone risking it all just so I can eat some chicken vindaloo.
1
As a daily commuting cyclist and amateur competitor I can see fault very clearly on both sides here. Drivers in general need to be much more aware of their surroundings just when they have multiple distractions vying for attention. Cyclist, in general, need to ratchet down on the attitude and start obeying the rules of the road the same as drivers have to. As far as the working conditions of delivery workers in the city go, well that's just straight up unconscionable. But that most likely won't change because it might cost you a few extra pennies on your delivery food. Seriously, just snatching the bag out of a person's hand and running away without paying them? You can't be much of a human to pull that off.
18
So many broken laws. Illegal immigration, child labor, child living without family, speeding and recklessness. The only villain cited was the BMW, but it sounds like a lot of city agencies dropped the ball, too. I guess restaurants can’t hire legal adults to do this dangerous work, but how else will we get delivery meals?
9
"Forty-Cent Tip" - A worthwhile photo essay book about immigrant food workers. Published about 10 years ago.
2
As a retired cycle messenger I can see both sides of the argument. Low pay and deadlines creates an environment where speed is important. On the other side though, some people are aggravated by being made to feel scared on the street by these hard working folk.
This has been going on for decades and relatively few people die, and those that do may well have died in the same spot had they been a pedestrian, scooter dude, or wheelchair commuter. Point being? All folks need to slow down to a safe point, make hasty moves only for safety, and learn to love one another. If you love someone, how could you possibly swoosh by them within inches of their (car or bicycle)?
13
Unenforced speed limit is still too high: 22mph enforced -- the actual speed needed to make the synced lights in Manhattan.
Bikes are dangerous: hard to see cyclists and hard to stop a bike.
I don't understand why motorists are not getting at least fined .. and points on license except in a few cases and why the victims are not compensated for medical expenses at least.
Also interesting that few legals/citizens -- black/white/ brown, etc. have these jobs!!! (??)
PS I had a bike in the city in my time!
PS Why we need single payer!! More and more I detest lawyers.
7
@Make America Sane
Yes, let's all pay taxes so a person in this country illegally working illegally for cash and paying no taxes can have free medical care.
You can't possibly believe that's fair to the taxpayers.
2
While I’m sympathetic to the difficulties these workers face, I almost was seriously injured this week after a cyclist sped past me going the wrong way in the bike lane and ignoring a red light. It seems to happen frequently. We need cyclists policed by police on scooters so they obey traffic laws like everyone else.
32
@Ira Kaufman Just 2 weeks I was seriously injured when a pedestrian stepped out right in front of bicycle without looking. I did a quick avoidance and did not hit him but went down, injuring my knee and shoulder. If I wasn't a good cyclist and aware of my surroundings, that pedestrian would have been seriously injured or possibly dead. As it was, he was unharmed but because of his negligence I am the injured one. Yet, I do not make blanket statements about pedestrians and how they need to be policed (oh yeah - police on scooters are really what we need <sarcasm>).
14
@Steve
Front braking. Not rear-braking. Brake front and push your body(weight) backward. When I rode and braked only with my front, my bike stopped immediately.
A very experienced city cyclist sees everything 30-40 ft ahead and has learned enough about body language to predict people's movements.
In a city, pedestrians always have the right of way. Cars and bikes are for outside the city. I LOVE to drive. I log 1500 purely recreational miles a month. None in the city.
1
@Steve
It's YOUR responsibility as the operator of any vehicle to avoid pedestrians. Perhaps you were going too fast for conditions and/or your skill level, or you allowed your attention to wander if you had to react that fast and crashed. What may be more accurate to say is that cyclists have EXACTLY the same responsibilities as motorists concerning pedestrians. And that a motorist in the same position would have been just as at fault as you were. BTW-This comes from a committed cyclist, both daily commuter and amateur competitor. If we don't respect the rules of the road, we can't expect them to respect us.
There should be no job in this country that can't be filled by a legal worker. As soon as you read an article about a business that mostly hires undocumented, more precisely illegal, workers, you should read this as a job that is so hard, so dangerous, so dirty, and so low paying that legal workers won't do it. Why can't "progressives" understand the damage done by illegal "immigration"?
17
@Kurfco I do not understand your point. Are you saying that these hard, dangerous, dirty and low-paying jobs exist because of illegal immigration? Or are you saying that the jobs would magically become easy, safe, clean and well-paying if the illegal immigrants weren't there to fill them? The truth is, we do have jobs in this country that our citizens are reluctant to fill and we are not willing to spend the money to make them more attractive to citizens. Do you have any solutions?
21
@Steve
Both points are correct. Illegal 'immigrants" enable the creation of lousy, low paying jobs and the jobs will stay lousy and low paying as long as desperate illegal "immigrants" are readily available to do them. If we didn't enforce child labor laws, jobs would pop up to make use of those easily exploited kids with nimble fingers.
My solution is simple: rigorously enforce immigration and labor laws and force the economy to adjust to using legal workers. Costs will go up. Employers will have more drama from using less reliable workers. Working hours will change. Break lengths will change. Pay and benefits will change. Some businesses that can only exist using illegal workers may well disappear. As they should.
1
@Kurfco
Again, well said Kurfco!
In short, a reality-based economy where the rights and responsibilities of both workers and employers are equally valid, respected and enforced.
This article was very informative about the jobs of these "deliverios." It was hard not to become angry while reading this. Until I read this article, I didn't realize how difficult this job is. These men do not get enough credit for it, and they aren't even treated well. I was disgusted by the story about the man who dislocated his shoulder, and the man at the restaurant says its just part of the job. There are so many injuries and deaths while delivering on bicycles and the delivery men should be given health insurance, or something to help cover their medical bills because of how often they get injured. I was also surprised to see the lack of tips given. The "deliverios" should be given a lot more respect, privileges, and pay for the strenuous work they do to meet the needs of their bosses.
11
@Madeline Rosen
Almost every point you raised exists because of illegal immigration.
Yes, sometimes it is tempting to believe stories start on 'chapter two' and that anything prior is unimportant or invalid. But by ignoring 'chapter one' you are ignoring the bigger picture, i.e., making an argument while wearing blinders.
3
I love cycling....so don't get me wrong when I say that when you take the job of being a bicycle delivery person you should be aware of and be prepared to accept a certain level of risk. The streets are dangerous....for cars, cyclist and pedestrians. This does not mean that drivers should have the right to hit and kill a cyclist but if you take the job described in the article....in a rough and tumble place like New York... you must accept a higher level of risk. As for the 14 year old that was killed....that is really tragic..I'm sorry for his family....the loss of his potential is heartbreaking.... but he (a minor) should not have been working as a delivery person...not in dangerous place like New York
9
Undocumented an excuse for not understanding simple traffic laws? Not buying it.
10
This article again buries the lede. Cars routinely murder bicyclists in NYC without any charges filed. Until drivers are actually held responsible for their actions, no cyclist is safe, delivery drive ror not.
25
@Clark
Some people think that the solution to all problems is to make it a crime and find somebody guilty for it.
Drivers rarely go out with the intent of killing a bicyclist, so they don't have that element of guilt. At most it's a degree of negligence. Most traffic fatalities are the result of several factors, so it's not fair to put all the blame on the driver. Juries won't convict. And what good is it going to do? It won't bring the cyclist back to life, and it won't stop future fatalities.
Vox recently had a story about a town in New Jersey that was handing out a huge number of jaywalking tickets to black people. The police piously claimed that it was a safety issue, but Vox talked to a traffic safety expert who said that jaywalking tickets don't reduce accidents -- but if they really wanted to reduce accidents, they should install paved sidewalks.
I got hit by a deliveryman on a bicycle earlier this summer. I wasn't badly hurt; just banged up (with an attractive tire-shaped bruise running up my leg, among other injuries). The kid ran a stop sign and through a cross walk that I was negotiating (which was illegally packed with cars as well, btw). I was really lucky that he wasn't going faster or on a heavier bike. Less fortunate people have been badly injured or even killed.
I wish conditions were better for delivery people generally. I sincerely doubt they are getting those "delivery fees" charged by restaurants. And if you don't want to tip your delivery person/waiter/waitress/bartender, then don't order food/go out.
But I really wish they would obey traffic rules and pay attention to pedestrians.
48
@Doc
And if you don't want to tip your delivery person/waiter/waitress/bartender, then don't order food/go out.
In order for waiters and delivereroes to have jobs, a restaurant must stay in business. Many places are empty most nights. For all involved, it's better to buy food and not tip than not to buy food. If people don't buy food, the restaurants will go out of business and EVERYBODY will lose their job. That's Sanders supporter logic: Vot efor Sanders or don't vote at all.
2
At age 21 i was an adventurous young white all-American athletic female bike messenger in SF and I was hit. Likely my fault, though i was too unconscious to remember. My white all-American husband was a bike messenger in SF for 12 years - and he has been hit and banged up (to put it mildly). I still have an affinity for these guys (and gals), and am glad to see them alive and pedaling.
But honestly, if you don't follow or even know the rules of the road you are a critical part of the problem - and as much the cause as anyone you may try to blame. It doesn't matter where you came from or hard your story's been - the rules of the road are to protect everyone on the road (and the sidewalk - where you don't belong on a bike)
41
Cyclists in general and delivery cyclists in particular pay no attention to traffic signals, go the wrong way on one way streets, fail to yield to pedestrians, and ride on the sidewalk.
They should be summonsed until they follow the traffic rules.
I have no pity for any of them.
14
@Al Pedestrians in general, and commuters in particular pay no attention to traffic signals, cross the street regardless of the light, fail to yield to cars or bicyclists, and cross in the middle of the street. They should be summonsed until they follow the rules. I have no pity for any of them.
4
@Steve
Just now, in lower Manhattan in under 10 minutes I observed 6 cyclists going through red lights and going the wrong direction, nearly hitting various people including elderly people. And one causing a car to swerve, a potential serious accident.
All the cyclists appeared to be "regular" people in their 20s-30s. Several on Citibike. Not delivery people.
Delivery people work hard under difficult conditions - they are exploited IMO.
But there are too many "regular" NYC cyclists who routinely disregard lights, pedestrians, other traffic in general. Not cool.
3
@LS And how many pedestrians did the same thing during that time period? I'm sure many more. Both groups should be summonsed but to complain only about the group you're not part of makes you look more than a little biased and your point pretty much worthless.
2
I appreciate the guys who deliver in my neighborhood. I usually see the same ones over and over. I have almost never heard a negative response to my query "are you delivering tonight?" I tip *at least* 20% and sometimes more. they have brought me Chinese food, or pizza, or diner food in all kinds of situations, bad weather, busy nights, and walk up the stairs to my 4th floor apartment to deliver it. I love these guys and wish them well. it's a tough way to make a living to make life easier for us.
64
I was a bicycle messenger in Manhattan one summer in the mid-80s so can relate to some of this (e.g. my messenger friend was hit by a car which broke his leg - he was out of commission for 4+ months)
Yes the job is dangerous; yes, everyone on the street - including fellow cyclists don't like you (you are in their way and slow them down).
The more packages I delivered the more $$ I made - this resulted in dangerous behavior on my behalf.
The larger question which no one is able to answer - Why are many countries south of the United States unable to provide their citizens a quality of life which would preclude them from moving here, risking their life, for a life many U.S. citizens could not imagine?
20
@Jake
In answer to your question, any time one of those countries elects a government that tries to make life better for ordinary workers, the U.S. organizes or supports a coup to replace that government with one more willing to prostitute itself to U.S. corporations. Think Allende in Chile, Arbenz in Guatemala, Zelaya in Honduras, etc.
20
@Jake
I don't think faster delivery results in more or bigger tips/income. Most people tip what they always tip. Tipping is rarely service dependent. Also, restaurants get a finite number of orders. My understanding of package delivery is that there's always a backlog of packages, but I don't think taht's true with orders. Walking along Greenwich St at non lunch/dinner hours, I routinely see delivery guys standing around or having a smoke. A bike messenger could stay busy 24 hrs a day. Food delivery guys can deliver only as much food as is ordered. They can't deliver orders not placed. The reality is that no customer will cease to order from a sushi place because the food is sometimes late. My very personal belief is that the aggressive riding one sees among delivereros isn't about making more money. Rather, it's class rage. That's my deep dark secret belief. I think they want to scare people.
3
@Martha Shelley
Thanks.
Why aren’t Costa Rica, Chile, Panama, Argentina or Uruguay a constant mess?
This is the face of New York: slave labor, advertising agencies selling lies about how happy everyone is getting their food delivered, real estate speculators throwing people out of their apartments to make room for the next mediocre restaurant, and $4000 a month closet for the next group of swells who think the City is the greatest place on earth.
34
When I used to live in NYC I never experienced this new hazard: delivery bicycles. Now, when I visit NYC is very scary to have them everywhere and coming from everywhere, cutting you off and totally rude, regardless of rules, traffic lights, stop signs, sidewalks, etc. And total disregard or courtesy to pedestrians. The New York Times increasingly keeps writing articles that are not objective or that fail to cover all perspectives. These delivery cyclists create conditions that harm themselves and others.
53
@ART I commute by bike and ride for fitness. I only do what I believe is safe, regardless of the rules. I see drivers double parking, speeding, making illegal u-turns and running red lights every day. Pedestrians cross whenever and wherever they like. Why the hell should I follow the rules when no one else does?
8
You very rarely see people walking in the middle of the road against traffic in Manhattan or cars driving on the sidewalk or down a one way in the wrong direction. These delivery drivers do that stuff all the time. I have a lot of sympathy for the plight of these guys but it's hard to make an argument for them when so many people see them disregard the rules of the road and put themselves and others in danger on a daily basis.
17
@Rob
Thanks for going out of your way to exemplify bad cycling etiquette. Ever hear that you're responsible for your own race, not the other guy's? Your attitude gives all of us a bad name. Daily commuter and amateur competitor here btw.
This was an extremely upsetting case and there is much to do when it comes to making the city safer for all cyclists. I cycle every day in the city and constantly observe delivery messengers and food delivery guys doing things that put them - and everyone around them - in danger: cycling in the wrong direction in bike lanes, not signalling when they turn, using motorized bicycles that are illegal in the city, cycling with headphones on, texting or looking at maps while they cycle - so while this accident was a tragic one, it is also the responsibility of every cyclist and driver - regardless of extenuating circumstances in their lives, to ride responsibly and safely.
43
@Paul
I'm more concerned about making the city safe for pedestrians. Night before last I was almost run down by a bicyclist from behind on the sidewalk.
Maybe that's why so many people order in, the delivery people are making the sidewalks unsafe. And they usually don't have lights, so even crossing the street you can't see them.
11
Loved this article - thank you for spotlighting not just the difficulties faced by 'delivereros' but also for portraying a fuller spectrum of their lives. We often hear about the hardships of undocumented workers but it's important to remember that we all end up loving New York for the same reasons: concerts, soccer games, cocktails with friends, and the endless possibilities the city offers.
12
The thing is they ride so haphazardly and they don't follow traffic direction. I also was run down in the street because the deliverero was going the wrong way up the street.
33
@Kingsley Arthur Rowe
The delivery guys are the menace. Not the other way around. They ride motorized bikes on the sidewalk. Bike messengers are dare devils, but they follow road etiquette (if not laws). Food delivery guys act like other human lives are expendable.
12
@Kingsley Arthur Rowe
Yes, and they usually don't have lights. Not that that would help when they overtake you, because most of us don't have eyes in the back of our head.
The police really need to clamp down on them.
7
What kind of heartless people don't tip their delivery people? My fellow New Yorkers are shameful. I'm going to go ahead and blame millenials. So there.
30
@van hoodoynck
Restaurants have started to add delivery fees. So, if you tip, you're paying a tip plus a delivery fee. I've stopped ordering from places that add a delivery fee. Most restaurants make their money on wine, which is marked up 5 times. When you order take out, you don't order (glass after glass) of (overpriced) wine.
5
@van hoodoynck Actually, I'd blame the Boomer bosses for not paying them a living wage to begin with.
7
@Tatum I'm Gen X so I'm happy to blame both.
2
Really important and long overdue article about the difficulties faced by these workers.
This article focuses mostly on the traffic-related dangers - though does include brief mention of low wages and that people do not pay tips.
Sadly not surprising about the lack of tips. Continually unbelievable that so many young and affluent New Yorkers are so oblivious and callous to workers who provide "instant gratification" services.
There are other important issues that warrant mention:
long hours; working at night: long commutes home late at night and more possibility of being robbed; being forced to work on a holiday or when it is snowing and everyone else gets to stay home; being unable to be with your family or children because you are working. Etc.
The cheap food and instant "on-demand" food favored by millennials is predicated on the exploitation of others.
Maybe the NY Times should do a followup article with the affluent people who order - and see if they have any concern about the people who "serve" them?
79
@LS
What if they are an hour late? What if there's a delivery fee added by the restaurant? I think many people don't want to pay 2.50 for delivery and a tip in addition to that mysterious fee.
Sometimes, Seamless doesn't work. So, I place my order by phone. Often, there's nobody working the phone who understands English. So, when I say, "apartment 5 M. M like mustard" or "apartment 5m. M like money" or "apartment 5M. M like Morrissey," I still receive a phone call 40 mins later asking me to give them my address again, because they are lost. It's the restaurant's job to get the order and address right.
2
@richguy
So richguy can afford to live in New York and order take out, but the $2.50 delivery fee is breaking you?
And you know that doesn't go to the guy handing you the food.
I bet you're the guy in the suit from this story that didn't tip Fabián.
10
@Monique
Did I say I personally don't tip? I was explaining the delivery fee issue. I almost never order take out. I go out for 40 dollar steaks. My point is that the restaurants have instituted a mystery fee that curbs tipping.
Usually, if and when I order out, it's because I don't want to drink, and I feel strange ordering food without ordering wine. That's just how I feel. I can drink. I just prefer not to drink that often. When I don't order wine, people assume I'm in recovery or medicated. Neither is true. (I tend to be a little too fanatical about my body and control my alcohol consumption.)
NYT commenters in Oregon seem to think I should give all my money to the poor and join the order of St Francis. Oregon is the anti-Manhattan, I think.
I understand we live in a "tipping culture," but the best way to improve the financial security of delivery people (and other tip oriented jobs) is just to pay them more. Uber and other apps could easily charge more, and pass the earnings on to the workers. Likewise, restaurants could pay employees more and even do away with tips - some restaurants have experimented with this idea.
34
@Tim but that's not the world we live in right now, so people need to tip. If you can't afford to tip, you can't afford the service.
26
@Tim Danny Meyer's Union Square Hospitality Group has eliminated tipping in at least some of its restaurants and I like the experience. Perhaps he will start a trend.
4
@Tim but delivery people are not counted as "restaurant workers". they extra money that eliminating tips affords the inside workers does not apply to them.
2