It's so sad to see the optimistic art exhibits, full of love and hope for the future, and to have this happen.
6
BLM! Within?
7
Now, tell me again why it is good to leave honest good people defenseless and let thugs run around with guns!
6
I have been a participant in Art All Night for years. My family, my friends, my granddaughter and I enjoyed this festival with out incident. Now two morons who decide to "shoot it out" at a public venu spark a conversation about gun control? How about no bail after, I don't know, the third, fourth, fifth arrest? I don't understand a state that is for the criminals rights more than it's citizens. More gun control will not stop criminals from shooting up an art festival. Keeping them in jail when they deserve to be there may stop them from continuing to commit crimes. No one wants a criminal on their block, no matter what ethnic background the criminal comes from.
13
Agreed. These people did not care about the laws in place about guns or anything else. People who kill people or hurt people or anything against the law are not controlled by more laws. I don't understand the logic.
5
Everyone is talking about gun control. But most of the guns in the criminal hands are illegal. How are you going to control that by legislation and laws and checks?
You will ban the guns and you naively think that it will illuminate all of them? People will get them illegally just like the criminals did before.
It will make less guns yes, but it will make less guns in hands of lawful and obedient people. I don't understand this outcry.
8
Making it more difficult for my mother in Kansas to purchase a handgun will do absolutely nothing to stop this kind of violence. Honest people will acknowledge that fact.
6
guns kill=more guns kill more, force our no nothing politicians to do something or VOTE them out of office!
4
There are TOO MANY GUNS.
There are too many guns at large in our communities. We must reclaim our churches, our schools, our concerts, our art shows. We are in the grip of a mass delusion. The NRA slogan "guns make us safer" is refuted by every international statistic, every scrap of public health data, it is refuted by our own eyes. It is refuted by my own experience. Join Moms Demand Action, meet with your local, state, and national representatives. Support red flag laws, mental health funding, successful gang intervention like that sponsored by Homeboy Industries in L.A. which offers jobs and counseling and direction. There are things we can do that are more compassionate and more sane than screaming: arm ministers, arm movie theater ushers, arm school secretaries. This is insanity and we need to change.
15
Sadly, the US is becoming numb to the many mass shootings going on. This numbness is mostly caused by the horrific media campaign by the NRA and far right politicians who declare that freedom to own guns without any restrictions, training, or oversight is more important than American lives.
7
Did you read the story? Convicted felon (murder), who can not legally possess a firearm, recently released (early) from prison, obtains an illegal weapon with an illegal extended magazine and uses it to illegally shoot a bunch of people. Explain to me how tougher gun laws will change that outcome? This has nothing to do with the NRA and everything to do with crime. Law abiding citizens are not the problem.
14
Country-wide tough gun laws will help. Right now , anyone can go to Virginia, North Carolina and other states and get a gun, cheap and easy. A hodge-podge of convoluted gun laws. That is the problem.
2
I hope that the follow-on marches by the usual suspects and the good 'Rev' are peaceful protests in the face of this tragic and preventable loss of life.
3
It's tragic when any of these mass shootings happen. But whats clear is the "beefs" lead to far more killings than people might expect. From 2014 to 2016 the nation saw an increase of 3000 homicides, according to the FBI Uniform Crime Report. It stood at around 17,250 total, and half the victims (and perpetrators) were African Americans, and often in poverty-stricken parts of the country. Compare that to the attention paid towards police, and the 250 black men shot and killed every year (less than 10% are unarmed, according to The Washington Post). That means for around every 30-35 homicides of blacks by other people, there's 1 by a cop. For white Americans, that's 9 killings by other people compared to 1 by a cop.
Who should have a greater fear for their safety from cops versus their fellow citizen?
12
"When guns are outlawed only outlaws will have guns." But guns are not outlawed and outlaws still have guns. The NRA and all its supporters in government and elsewhere are all responsible for every gun death in the United States.
7
If this were an act of terrorism, would it be more important? Require more coverage? Different remedies? Terrorism is a minuscule percentage of crime and deaths, but the NYT differentiates this in its summary.
Are we to rest assured this was not only not a terrorist or a madman in a Las Vegas hotel but just a dispute with guns that just happened to take place in an art fair in Trenton? The randomness is more explainable? Or is gun violence we can categorize less upsetting? Less likely that the reader would be subject to it?
You cannot "find" the roughly 90 people a day who are murdered by guns, accidentally shoot themselves or others, or commit suicide using guns in even a national paper.
Reporting informs and explains. The way we report on guns does too.
2
New Jersey has one of the toughest gun laws in the country and this happens. In other words there is at best a tenuous connection between gun control and gun violence. Instead of blaming lax gun laws we need to blame the thugs who do the shooting. A rather simple formulation that even the left can grasp.
17
It would be interesting to know where the shooters obtained there guns. They purchased them illegally (or borrowed or stole them) but did they purchase them , steal or borrow them in New Jersey, or in another state with lax gun laws?
1
Gun rights are a civil rights issue, as, in 1963 Birmingham, Alabama, as black churchgoers had to take up arms to deter local state instigated racist violence against them. So the Court needs to address whether someone under a state or federal gun restriction can yet take up a firearm for the legal right of self-defense.
Given the diverse self-defense needs of 350-million+ American citizens, some rural, some urban, who, then, ought to own a gun for legal self-defense of life, limb, and property? If we exclude the right of self-defense to millions of citizens, aren’t we creating second-class citizens? Attempts to restrict 2nd Amendment right of many law-abiding citizens in states like New Jersey, also may well expose the state’s liability for injuries or death resulting from the gun-restricted person’s inability, legally, to defend the person’s life with a gun.
1
Such a shame that violent losers had to ruin what has always been a peaceful and happy celebration in Trenton. Art All Night is generally packed with a hugely diverse group of relaxed people enjoying art, great music, food, and people-watching. I've been going for years with family and friends, and luckily most of us left before the violence started on Saturday. My heart aches for the good people who live in Trenton and the hardworking volunteers at Artworks.
11
If it's really gang related, registering owners and mental health evaluations aren't going to do anything. Guys like this buy a gun from someone's trunk, or steal it, they don't want into a licensed dealer and use their ID to buy a gun.
13
Well.
Except for the fact that less guns in circulation=less guns available in back of cars. A buy-back program has been very effective in other countries.
Further.
Most of the estimated 30,000 deaths in America are suicides so all of the other things you mention would save those lives.
...... I mean, AC, let me ask you something.
Don't you want to go to the movies without having to jump at every loud noise?
Don't you want to go to the mall without looking for the exits.
Don't you want to go to concerts without scanning the perimeter?
Don't you want your kids to go to school without the specter you are going to have to reunite with them under some blanket in a field out back if they are lucky enough not to get shot?
Don't you want a better country?
5
Another mass shooting in America, just another day. Sadly.
1
How sad that the gang mentality of hopelessness and life by the sword would make an exhibit of Trenton artistic pride a target of its hatred.
2
The folks that granted parole should also be arrested. They are just as much at fault as the shooters. Come on liberals. Say something.
13
The NRA shibboleth: "the only way to stop a bad person with a gun, is a good person with a gun".
US citizens need more guns, and more people with permits to carry consealed guns
One attacker was killed, big deal...in the US 96 people die every day by gunfire (crime, suicide, accidental discharge...)
1
So now we have MULTIPLE shooters. We are graduating from single crazies to many crazies acting in concert. There are many diverse, innovative solutions to America's gun violence, but none of them will be implemented as long as there is a racist psychopath in charge.
4
It is time to acknowledge that this kind of horror is not the exclusive province of young white males, or of so-called white privilege.
7
>>It is time to acknowledge that this kind of horror is not the exclusive province of young white males, or of so-called white privilege.
Considering that the shooting was gang-related and that these types of shootings have been fairly common in our inner city (although not to the same scale), where is the failure to acknowledge. Even if we set that aside, is the idea that any race is capable of mass murder somehow supposed to make anyone feel any better?
2
I did not remotely suggest that anyone should "feel better" because of the race of these perpetrators.
I too realize that very many of the young white male shoot-ups appear to be purely nihilistic, i.e. without the purpose supposed by gang shoot-ups or Islamic terrorist shoot-ups. But to reverse your question: is anyone supposed to feel better that those killings tend toward some discernible purpose? Everyone is just as dead.
(And, there are exceptions even to that. I have no knowledge that the Washington Navy Yard shooter, who was black, was acting out of any purpose other than his own delusion and anger.)
Courtesy of the gun industry, the NRA and the Republican party, ongoing gun violence.
2
My elderly mother was at the Trenton train station on Friday coming back from her granddaughter's high school graduation in Manhattan.
She called me after the shooting, said she will never go to Trenton again, simply doesn't feel safe there. This is how cities die.
17
Get guns off the streets of OUR United States of America.
WE THE PEOPLE must DEMAND that EVERY gun in the U.S. and it's territories and other properties be:
REGISTERED on a national database, state LICENSED and FULLY INSURED FOR LIABILITY.
Attention gun owners: WE do not want your guns. WE want your guns to stop killing and terrorizing us. Don't you?
28
Criminals don't register. Insurance never pays for criminal acts. I'm for better gun laws, but this wild swinging is not helpful, just . . . dumb.
17
Yep, I'm sure these two gentlemen and all of their gang-member friends would be happy to hand over their illegally obtained handguns to be properly licensed and registered by the government.
19
Our Republican-dominated all 3 wings of the federal government will do nothing, nothing, to further restrict gun ownership.
So, with that, all we can expect is increased screening for weapons, at all public congregations. Start with festivals. Already we have such practices at airports and courthouses, and it is getting more so with schools. What next? Libraries, grocery stores, post offices, train stations, subway stations? Will the cost and inconvenience be acceptable?
Or otherwise, the American populace will simply shrug and accept that mass shootings are the American way of life.
Is this really necessary?
4
I will shrug, accept reality as it is, and strap on my 9mm when I leave the house.
Every weekend,I go to the indoor range if it is raining, or shoot steel plate targets in my back yard.
1000 rounds of practice a month is my goal.
Sunday was 250.
Living in the woods an hour out of town has its advantages. It also has a 15 minute response time from LEO, so you are on your own if you have something happen. My self defense needs and philosophy is different than yours. I am not trying to force anyone to own a gun. We just want to be left alone. Your city , your laws. Keep them within your jurisdiction and don't force them on other cultures in other States.
Typical local public library circa 2018: after school free babysitting service amongst idling working age men flopping.
2
Guns don’t kill people. American’s do. Americans have killed more Americans than in all the continuous wars committed by the US. Omaha beach doesn’t even equal a months butcher bill in the US. In other news, teachers and counsellors are now guarding the prisoners. In a country that has more incarcerated citizens than any country in the world. And closed schools; with no access to proper health care. It is not the NRA, it is the basic premise of a country that is coming to a reckoning with its core concepts of controlled enfranchisement, greed is good, and dominance through weaponry.
13
I get the point. I disagree. When weaponry is removed, the large amount of killings go away. We have the science experiments of Japan and Australia as simple evidence. Americans died on Omaha beach fighting for the freedom of nations that were not their own. Yes, we have problems, but we've been there for others more than most....all of the time. So be careful with your simplistic associations. They undercut your point.
21
Two points, each already made but worth repeating.
One: with threats of violence followed by acts of violence, there is a prima facie case to label this an act of terrorism with guns.
Two: "gun control" cries do not necessarily mean "let us have more laws", but as NRA and others have said, "gun laws have not been enforced"; let us fund and administer gun laws with modern tools (eg, digital data base and funding for adequate staffing of federal and regional and local positions to support them).
9
A "quick fix" for this particular event is tighter security with metal detectors at the entrances.
Yes, its sad that a community arts festival might need to take such measures but it should help to protect the attendees celebrating the community.
9
Agree. Start instituting airport like checks at all events, schools, restaurants. Surely the business and municipal communities will erupt at this expense and pressure the correct action to be taken. Strict enforcement of guns. The end of Gun shows. Long waiting periods, insurance, training, re training, yearly registration and mental health checks for owners. You know, common sense things that people who have not had a loved one killed....think are too extreme.
7
I agree. Clear, stringent and specific requirements to buy/own a gun. If you want one, you need to prove your ability to be responsible with one. It will not guarantee that a gun owner doesn't go haywire with it, but it is a step in the right direction. Having the right to a gun means proof of responsibility to exert that right.
Uh, New Jersey already has that.
2
This is a familiar American story isn't it. The Roebling factory was once on the cutting edge of technology creating wire rope for John A. Roebling's new suspension bridges like the one in Brooklyn. But times change and industries move on and those left behind can suffer and cause suffering for generations.
Its difficult for us to picture the day when the end of a business comes, but it almost always does. Today just try to imagine an art festival held at the closed, vacant headquarters of Apple, Google, Microsoft or Amazon where a shooting breaks out and you get the idea of the impermanence of business in America because those days will surely come to pass too.
The question is; will we ever attempt to find even a partial solution to a devastating social problem that endlessly repeats itself across this country?
16
Yeah, education.
You know the system the GOP really wants to destroy.
If you knew better, you could do better.
4
I guess the phrase “an act of terrorism” has become a politicized term of art to mean “terrorist attack by Islamist extremists,” because by normal definitions this was obviously an act of terrorism.
19
Here come the usual gun nuts and racists with their veiled and not-so-veiled comments. You know and I know they cannot resist a chance to parrot their NRA and white supremacy talking points.
They will say Trenton (Or Newark) are nasty places; always have been (left unsaid "It's because black people live there") and they will crow about the illegality of the weapons involved (as if that negates the need for more sensible gun laws).
It's always the same. The same people come out of the woodwork to spew their bile and further corrupt the body politic with their brain dead comments. It's even worse over at the Washington Post where the comments are not censored by humans, and rarely moderated even when the vituperation is reported. I thought I believed in free speech.
20
What is racist about the truth staring you in the face?
A paroled felon uses a gun to shoot people, the gun no doubt was stolen. The perps ARE African American. There are plenty of unsafe nabes all over the world, Trenton being one of them. Please explain how this is racist. And btw have never been a member of the nra. Nor a republican.
18
Are you really saying that Newark and Trenton are actually very safe and are only given a bad rap by white people?
You are right it is always the same, at least in the comment section of the NY TImes. Some people will go out of their way to excuse bad behavior by certain groups and seek to blame everyone but the criminals
15
From the article:
..."New Jersey was ranked by the Giffords Law Center to Prevent Gun Violence as second to California in having the country’s most stringent gun restrictions. ".....
...."a handgun with an “extended capacity magazine” that could hold more ammunition than permitted under state law."... was removed at the scene.
In this particular case, tough gun laws apparently had little affect on the possession of or use of these weapons, including the illegal magazine.
There is a difference between this shooting and others where individuals used legally owned weapons (or used legally owned weapons taken from family members). This was apparently gang related violence carried out by paroled criminals. This was not another bullied kid taking revenge or mentally warped white guy murdering church goers.
All the gun control in the world isn't going to affect criminals who have illegal channels for obtaining weapons. That's law enforcement's job and they deserve our support in this.
As my Father was fond of saying, "locks only keep honest people out".
12
When someone on parole kills someone, those that are responsible for granting parole should be arrested and held as an accessory to the crime. This way, we have accountability.
14
So your point is that there should never ever be parole? The parole officer didn't commit the crime, but punish them anyway.
So lets apply the same logic to gun dealers. A gun might be used to commit a crime. The dealer didn't commit the crime, but punish them anyway.
You sure you really favor unjust punishment?
7
Someone should tell Trump to start replacing the correctional officers he has let go to balance the federal budget after his tax give away. Traditional right wing tactics. Gut a government’s capacity to administer, then say government doesn’ t do it’s job. The tactic depends on an ignorant citizenry, thus the first cuts are always to education.
5
They have a hard job and do the best they can.
Whatever happened to the idea that "The Media" would refrain from publicizing (glorifying ??) the names and pics of mass shooters? Is that something that is done "sometimes" but not at other times?
9
Once again, it is Americans terrorizing and killing other Americans, yet the government insists that who we have to fear are foreigners. And, even though at least one of the shooters was a felon, he was able to obtain a gun. But, the lie about America becoming great again continues.
28
It's amazing the article failed to mention the gunman's serious violent criminal history and the fact he was let out early.
70
isn't that great, murderers run free and roam our streets and others in prison with no violent history remain locked most of their life. our system is so backwards, it's a disgrace.
9
I find it ironic that the telling of this tragic events leads to championing for tighter gun restrictions. The shooter, who was killed, was a convicted felon and could not obtain guns legally. Outlaws with ill intent, will always have guns.
46
I don't want tighter gun restrictions. I want your guns. All of them. Repeal the Second Amendment. This is not what the Founding Fathers wanted. The Supreme Court was wrong. I know, how surprising.
1
Except in Japan, for reasons not to be investigated so that your point can remain forever valid.
1
Yeah, outlaws don't obey the laws. So let's rescind all laws. Then we won't need congress. All they do is to make new ones, anyway.
Outlaws with ill intent, will always break the laws.
I retired 12 years ago and moved out of NJ' lived there over 30 years. Newark was never considered a "safe" place to be on a weekend in the middle of the night. I see nothing has changed.
16
This didn't happen in Newark,
18
Quick question, Bill. While in NJ were you ever part of the solution? Artists and advocates have toiled for 50 years to bring life back to the city. What role did you play?
4
Wells, the shooter who was killed, was released years early from his sentence of aggravated manslaughter--he shot and killed a 22 year old previously. While in prison, he was also convicted of racketeering, and sentenced to an additional six years for running a gang. Why was he let out early?
122
And a 3rd and 4th chance?
The problem isn't gun control. I would bet that the handguns in use at the festival were illegal.
33
How do you know the problem isn't gun control. The whole point of gun control is to prevent guns from falling into the wrong hands. Why did these felons have guns? If the guns were traced back from the time they were manufactured, somewhere along the line laws were broken that enabled them to fall into the hands of these guys. No one can say for sure whether better gun control would have prevented that, and we won't even try to find that out because all efforts to do that are stymied. So you can't say with any certainty that the problem isn't gun control. We assume criminals will always be able to find guns and gun control won't work, but we won't ever know if that's true, because we won't allow any gun control to take place and we don't enforce the laws we already have.
35
I am sure that you are correct, Barbara, that these were probably illegal guns but you know the more legal guns that are available, the easier it becomes for some of them to be stolen which turns them into illegal guns. Reducing the number of legal guns will in turn reduce the number of illegal guns.
30
Duh... YEAH, the problem IS gun control!
Signed: Sleazy Democrat
(November can't come fast enough).
I'm just waiting for the "if more people had guns, this wouldn't have happened" comments.
How many more, NRA?
33
how many of the guns used were obtained legally?
11
The people in the Walmart parking lot in Washington State would probably disagree with the sarcastic sentiment you are attempting to convey.
2
NJ has some of the strictest gun laws in the country, particularly with respect to handguns. While we will never know, might one or more persons carrying legally have deterred the perps or possibly stopped them?
Um, is there any reason why the arts festival cannot end at midnight or earlier? Why is this place still open at 2:30 a.m.? At that time of night, it’s no longer an arts festival but rather a night club. Proper permits and the appropriate licenses are required.
72
This is an annual event that runs for 24 hours from 3PM Saturday to 3PM Sunday. It's actually called "Art All NIght".
Being open at 2:30 AM is part of the experience. And it has been a peaceful and well-loved one for 12 years. Until now.
44
All Night Art is the name. ALL NIGHT. It’s a 24 hour event. Maybe not your thing, but for others it is. Some things aren’t meant to fit into the M-F 9-5 bracket.
2
Um, is there any reason why the arts festival cannot end at midnight or earlier? Why is this place still open at 2:30 a.m.? At that time of night it’s no longer an arts festival but rather a night club. Proper permits and the appropriate licenses are required.
8
You might note the name of the festival is "Art All Night"? It has been a local tradition for more than 10 years. Whatever else, it had permits and police presence.
19
Although it’s the state capital, Trenton’s unemployment rate is nearly twice the national average, with government workers fleeing the city’s downtown at 5. Art All Night was (is!) an opportunity for any member of a deeply impoverished community to see their art exhibited in a public space, a food, music, film and art festival that anyone can enjoy for free, within walking distance of some of the poorest neighborhoods in the city. It’s also an opportunity for wealthier white suburbanites to see the poverty and the possibility of Trenton up close on what may be the one time of the year they venture in. Were the shooters art lovers? Community organizers determined to better their community? Probably not. But chances are they are the product of decades of poverty. Is the answer metal detectors or an end to the “all night” portion of the overall equation? Whatever the answer, I hope the organizers, the community and the public make it together – and that Art All Night continues. After 12 years of certified success as a true community happening, it’s too important not to.
35
I suspect very few wealthy suburbanites were planning to visit the festivities at 3 in the morning. And try telling the 22 people who got shot that it was a "certified success" for 12 years. I'm sure it will lift their moods.
It's unfortunate that a festival like Art All Night was marred by this. It's a fun idea. But I think it clearly needs to be re-conceived. As I tell my teenagers who all have strict curfews, nothing good can happen at 3 in the morning.
7
I just want to say that poverty is not solely to blame; the men who shot the guns are to blame. They made that choice. And they chose a place of joy and fun and art. Why? To ruin the beauty that their own community put together? There are many who attended the Arts festival who likely have lived a life of economic poverty, but would never, ever pull the trigger of a gun on their community, especially at an event that elevates them. Who are these men's fathers? A big part of our gun problem (not just the NRA, although I abhor that group) lies with the utter fraying of family cohesion and support. Truth.
10
Whether the shooters were "art lovers, community organizers or the product of decades of poverty" is of less import than the fact that they were morally culpable for these heinous acts. When the offending shooter is a white cop, no one asks about his upbringing or suggests other excuses for his behavior. Black people are just as capable of having moral standards and impulse control as white people. They have agency, despite what a lot of ultra Leftists think. Let's promote higher expectations and maybe they'll be realized.
5