Money and power attracts the same types of people everywhere. Retain the haughty airs and a few psychopathic traits, but substitute the cultish language of the prevailing business management model for Marxist mumbo-jumbo and voila, you have transformed an American CEO into a Communist Party high official.
1
One thing I wonder about our free press is why has there not been more investigative reporting on Trump's businesses. There were a few expose, but none to the level of the wall to wall coverage of his sex scandals or outrageous remarks about Mexicans and building a wall.
It seems all too little and too late reporting on Trump's shell companies now. I didn't even know he has shell companies. The word "shell" immediately conjures up in my mind tax evasion or some sort criminality.
The GOP raged against debt and deficit for Obama's 8 years, then the passed the gigantic tax cut bill that hugely increases our debt. They raged against Hillary's corruption in speaking fees from Wall Street and donations given to Clinton Foundation, now they turn a complete blind eyes to Trump's cabinets' various unethical spending, his family's use of WH to curry business investments and loans, and now possibly pay for play money directly to his personal lawyer and himself.
How is Trump's rating with the Republicans still in the 80s? What is wrong with these people? Are they such suckers for being cheated and conned?
4
OK - where to begin. I'm a Canadian who lives and works in China. I teach a high school prep program for students who want to study in North America. These are bright students and some of them will be future leaders in China. Last week one did an excellent presentation on why gay marriage should be legalized in China. Another student did one on the big problem of air pollution in China and he pulled no punches. Like I said, these students are bright and opinionated and aren't afraid to express themselves. There is an adoration for foreign products here. Half the cars on the street are foreign imports with many Buicks as they have a factory in my Chinese province.People here are getting rich and they can literally see improvement from year to year. This is a GREAT thing for the world, not a bad thing. When people have more money they can start to think about other things, like cleaning up the environment or improving human rights - just like my students sentiments in their presentations.There is no sense amongst many Chinese that the US is their enemy, unlike in the US where many Americans think exactly that. Here, education is highly valued and teachers are respected. Sorry America, you are behind the 8 ball on that one. China will kick you in the rear if you don't start spending more on public education. The China that I experience and live in bears little resemblance to what gets portrayed in western media. I'd be much more worried about Putin's Russia.
7
"But there is one difference: In China’s ruling Communist Party, it’s never safe to criticize the president. In America’s ruling Republican Party, you can criticize the president, or vote your conscience, if you’re dying, retiring or whispering."
This is a difference that Donald Trump has lamented. From complaining he couldn't sue New York Times for publishing critical articles and op-eds about him, to talking about jailing assorted "enemies of the people" at rallies, political freedoms survive in the United States despite, not because of, Trump and friends.
The jingoism of US and China are very similar. It's one of the reasons for the current tension. Arrogant jerks tend not to get along with each other.
1
A key difference between China and Trump-run America is that China is playing the long game. Trump is playing the 24-hour news cycle game, not without results in North Korea (which is releasing 3 hostages), but with most of the long-term wins likely going to China, North Korea's patron and guide.
3
Over the years Friedman accumulated many frequent flier mileage hopping to China. I am not aware that he lived in China for any significant length of time. Did he ever learn the Chinese language, read up on Chinese history or literature? My guess is none of the above, based on his superficial comparison of U.S. and China, or rather, Americans and Chinese. His comparison and conclusion continue to rely heavily on "opinions" instead of "facts". The title of this op-ed might be catchy, but an op-ed can never do justice to such a complex topic.
One way of comparison is to pick up on Kurt Andersen's observation that Americans are extremely religious. They hold strong faith on abstract ideologies such as a Creation God, the "infallible wisdom" of the founding fathers, Exceptionalism, the supremacy of Democracy, etc. Chinese have no such delusion. They are much more skeptical, they learned from the rise and fall of dynasties, they retain tiger-mom driven work ethics, etc. In summary, U.S. & China are not alike. No Way.
11
Speaking as a former long-time Republican, I have no idea why Republicans in Congress don't get rid of this dangerous jerk before he does something catastrophic.
5
The title of this piece is prescient as well: The US is a capitalist country that has moved in a socialist direction while China is a socialist country that has moved in a capitalist direction. As we become more alike, it will be interesting to see if the path makes a difference.
One thing I have noticed from my own travels, and even broader travels of friends and relatives who have recounted their experiences, is that people are mostly the same wherever you go. Once you get past the cultural differences, people tend to have the same motivations, virtues, and flaws.
That's why I think Friedman's points have some validity, because - wherever you go - authoritarianism has its appeal. While democracy looks messy and inefficient, authoritarianism looks orderly and can get things done. It is part of Trump's appeal. "I alone can fix it." That was one of his campaign mottos. It is the classic authoritarian narrative of a strong man, given power, will fix everything. Former Supreme Court Justice David Souter once said that the danger to American democracy is not a coup or foreign invasion, but simply because people will give it away to a guy who promises to fix everything.
The US isn't an authoritarian state like China, but it has authoritarian tendencies. Likewise, China isn't a democracy, but there is a rising, educated middle class who don't see why they shouldn't get to decide the country's future in elections, or why their leader should get to keep so many secrets from them. Democracy and authoritarianism aren't inherent to countries. Who knows? Maybe in a century, China will be a democracy, but the US will be an authoritarian state.
1
There a lot of people like Tom Friedman: as an American, he’s a critic of the president; as a Chinese, he’d be a defender of the president. The similarity is self-interest, but that’s the basis of our system, not theirs.
A lot of people.
3
This captures where the US now stands in the world. http://www.richmond.com/opinion/their-opinion/guest-columnists/k-ward-cu...
1
"One contrast, Chinese are ready to sacrifice to make China great again. Trump wants to make America great again without asking us to do anything hard — just cut taxes and regulations for rich people and corporations and keep pumping fossil fuels, and not invest in public goods like education and infrastructure, which have been the real engines of China’s resurgence."
republicans long ago created an almost Pavlovian conditioned response, When Americans hear the phrase :" Increase taxes." they immediately go on the attack. 'How dare we pay higher taxes'. And it worked. Voters will banish any politician who wants to raise taxes to pay for needed services-to the proverbial cornfield, never to be seen from again. the Chinese of course have no option in the matter, whatever the State wants it gets. It's the same thing here, in a way, except in America the rich and powerful had to take the long way around the problem. but systematic brainwashing has worked, which includes confusing socialism with communism. It's amazing how a few buzzwords can turn a free people into an easily controlled and manipulated Pavlovian dog.
4
No country is exceptional. All societies continue to evolve at different rates in the circumstances they find themselves. All are influenced by each other. In some societies, ruling elite are more dysfunctional than others, but it's not fixed. A snapshot in time today will give you a different picture than yesterday or tomorrow. Yes, America is more advanced today, but China was richer yesterday. And no one knows about tomorrow! The very factor that lead to success of some contain the seeds of failure in future. Be humble and hope humans can learn to live with each other and be respectful of each other.
4
It is almost an impossibility that there will be 67 Democratic senators in 2019, and almost all Republicans seem to have misplaced their consciences. The damage that can be done until the 2020 elections, even provided that Trump does not declare a national emergency so as to cancel them, is incalculable.
The United States we knew is gone.
12
When there is no longer rule of Law in California, it belies your entire premise.
1
What on earth are you talking about?
4
"What on earth are you talking about?"
I think he is referring to nonsense from Fox News that there is some kind of breakdown of law and order in California because the state refuses to play ball with the Trump administration. I am sitting in California, and rule of law is just fine. But naturally I am a libtard who wouldn't know, or perhaps a Deep State operative.
Of course, "Rule of law" is one of those right-wing code phrases that means something different from what it normally means. That's why Mike Pence praised Joe Arpaio, who just got out of jail for committing a felony thanks to a Trump pardon, for being a champion of "rule of law."
It seems, even in America, we have people who will believe anything the Ministry of Propaganda tells them. Of course, when we have our Ministry of Propaganda, it will be contracted to a private entity. That's the true uniquely American character: whatever the government does, we will always make sure a middle man profits.
1
A long, long time ago, I asked my Dad, an FSO, whether the US and USSR were really all that different. He grinned and said, "Well, over there Jimmy Hoffa is already president. Now you ask the same question. So, I grin and say, "Well, over here . . ." But you are right, over here we still can criticize our POTUS.
Single-party rule is a striking similarity. The GOP has been behaving nationally like they are the only party in power, even when they don't win the popular vote for House seats, and even when they don't hold the executive branch, e.g. the GOP Senate's refusal to even consider many Obama nominations to the federal bench, including the Supreme Court.
We know all about single-party, gerry-guaranteed rule and what it gets you in Ohio. That's why voters just overwhelmingly approved a new law for drawing election districts. Unless they take up more centrist stances and start playing fair, the House and Senate need to be cleansed of Republicans. Get registered, and in November, vote!
6
Very different in one key respect. Xi is an authoritarian leader with a vision to make China great again, concentrating his country's growing economic clout on clean energy, climate change, avionics and artificial intelligence. Trump is a would-be authoritarian without any vision other than self-aggrandizement and destroying all the accomplishments of his predecessor.
9
If you want non-stop government propaganda, you need go no further than the White House Facebook page. There you will find numerous curated postings daily, all lauding President Trump for the job he is doing. And, of course, trolls and bots, unfettered by Facebook, chime in with trite memes praising the wonders of Trump. Real people read this stuff, too, and many actually believe it.
3
Trump will not last 2 years.
2
"U.S. foreign policy, while it has always had its cynical, transactional side, particularly in the Cold War, has tended more toward, “Share our values and then we can be allies.”"
The big, glaring exception (and you know it Tom) is China. We never really tried hard to exact any real change out of China in exchange for trillions of $$ in FDI.
"Engagement", despite how it was sold to the US public as a change vehicle for China, was all carrot and zero stick.
Our corporate sector would love that we become more like China (more subservient, less questioning, fewer inalienable rights).
Then the world would really be "flat", right Tom?
2
Seems pathetic McCain could "vote his conscience without worry." Is that what it has come down to?
Sad.
3
"More Alike Than We'd Like".
This makes for a provocative title but is really just nonsense. I have worked with Chinese nationals in the US and they will be the first to tell you that our two countries are nothing alike.
1
Totally, agree!!! After living in China for 10 years; Shame on you Mr. Friedman.
2
In 1971 Richard Nixon foretold the subsequent rise of China on the Nixon Tapes in the excerpt from Doug Brinkley's book.
"Well, you can just stop and think of what could
happen if anybody with a decent system of govt.
got control of that mainland. Good God. There'd
no power in the world that could ever, I mean, you
put 800 million Chinese to work under a decent
system and they will be leaders of the world. The
Chinese they're all over Asia. I know. They've got
what it takes."
Yes, the Han Chinese and the White Euro-Americans are eerily similar in the belief of exceptionalism of their own systems and culture and though each may have a different system they operate through, the ultimate result remains the same, the accumulation of power and money to set the world agenda on their own terms.
3
“More alike than we would like”, we should be so lucky. China has been making the right moves vis a vis their five year programs. They have through “our” sacrifice lifted a billion people out of abject poverty and gotten them well on the way to middle class status. We on the other hand, managed to start and lose three major wars, turned our economy over to the Financial Industry, destroyed corporations thru their M. and A. activity, allowed the dismantling of America’s middle class as we ignored our own infrastructure needed to remain competitive, off shored jobs and gave away technology so that CEOs, and select industries, in particular the garment industry, could attain outsize paychecks and profits in the short term. This in direct contrast to what the Chinese have done: developed and refined one area of manufacturing after the other, created a middle class as ours disappeared, rather than the empty rhetoric “make America Great Again” the Chinese have made concerted moves guaranteed to advance their nation. Indeed Their China 2025 Program, should freeze the blood of American Capitalists, left in the dust as we have squandered our resources fighting other people’s wars and cut taxes for the rich as we ignore the rest. The Chinese quietly go about the business of building a nation and a middle class. To understand how our middle class was dismantled, read “Makers and Takers, The Rise of Finance The Fall of American Business”. By F.T. Columnist Rana Foroohar. Very disturbing!
5
It is funny that Mr. Friedman compare the once, still are, opposite political systems.
It made me think of a separated observation that we need thinks outside of the box, which is ideological box. Ever since the communist movement in early 20 century, the good and evil of the world, is judged by whether it is capitalism or communism, mostly the western countries demands everyone else to adopt their version of democracy. The post-World War II US international relations are dominated by this ideological believing, US Government based their foreign relations almost solely on this ideological believing instead of national interests. Truman will not recognize the Communist China because of it, US and China went into Korean War because the fear based on it, also the Cold War and Vietnam War, etc.
In 21st century, we finally realize, that a government system may differ from country to country, democracy may work very well here in the States and we are immensely proud of it, but it may not fits in other parts of the world. Ideological differences no longer a sharp weapon to deal with international relations; it may not benefit any one. In 21st century, we are faced with global issues, and they can only be dealt with global cooperation and tolerance.
2
I am a great admirer of Senator McCain and can only imagine his level of courage when he was a POW in Vietnam but his stating that now he's free to vote his conscience since he's not running again is the epitome of the problem with our elected officials. Even a man who has shown the ultimate courage is always looking over their shoulder when it comes to a vote and worrying about their re-election more than anything. Got forbid a politician votes their beliefs for an unpopular cause and it leads to them getting beaten at the ballot box. What are they going to do afterwards, go homeless or wander the streets? Of course not, they'll still end up with great positions at Universities, law firms, corporate America, think tanks or wherever. I just wish more of them would stick their neck out once in awhile, even cross party lines, and be the person their campaign said they were when they were running.
4
I have been thinking about differences between China and USA - We are a "new" country, the last continental landmass to be colonized - China's society is over 2000+ years old. Before that Europeans and Chinese evolved independently from each other for 20,000, or 40,000, years. Yes, we are different -
One thing we have in common is shared vulnerability to the immediate lacklash of the Internet - people everywhere now self-censor to avoid exposure from comments you can never walk back. Ironic that the technology that suddenly connects everyone is driving us apart.
Yes, Trump has not asked Americans to pay or to make sacrifices; nevertheless, we are. We are sacrificing our health and our public lands through environmental malfeasance; we are sacrificing our public education through defunding of the same; we are sacrificing our mental health through pushing everyone into a fight for survival by losing health care and jobs with decent salaries and retirement benefits; and most of all, we are sacrificing our vision that we Americans and Pax America can reach for the best of ourselves to make the Earth better for each of her inhabitants.
10
With this column, Mr. Friedman had an opportunity to review the loud warnings from Chinese history....but he missed it.
The parallels between China and USA are not between individuals seeking to use their positions to alter the future of their respective nations, Xi and Trump. No....and Mr. Friedman chose the superficial analysis, because he so desparately wants to rid our nation of Trump, the feared Shiva, who owes no allegiance to a Political Party or.....to the real parallel between China and USA.....a powerful, independent, omnipotent Bureaucracy. China's path thru history is set by its Bureaucracy, which answers to no one and can utterly destroy any who dare to challenge its authority.......China's Palace Eunuchs and Mandarins still rule China.......much as "appointed assistant deputies to the secretary of whatever" and their "consultants" rule the American Empire from WashDC(the walled forbidden city of the USA). A sobering lesson from history......in the early 1400s, when China's Empire was vast, almost world-wide...the Bureaucracy chose to end funding of the Chinese Navy and to destroy all records of the past...within 100 years, China decayed into a mindlessly corrupt, decadent world addicted to opium, while the "Western" world discovered New Worlds(earlier colonized by the Chinese)....Today, American Bureaucrats conspire to destroy the President, dismantle an aggressive foreign policy, while the Chinese re-assert their influence in 500 year old colonial ports.
Our freedoms are in such good shape that we can afford to take
a detour into phony authoritarianism if it could achieve certain
foreign policy objectives. Trump should be a hoot to us, not scary.
As I learn from this newspaper, to Asians he's the cat's pajamas.
That could be useful. And by the way, I read just yesterday that
Putin has told his countrymen that he's decided to concentrate
on domestic matters...
Wow, Friedman reads Dean Baker.
Friedman is only attracted to simplisms.
Much like our leader Trump, Friedman makes broad bold statements, with little or no understanding of complexity.
1
"Pay for our protection and we can be friends.” I too have watched this dance of who pays and who benefits for years. It is unclear just what kind of friends we have when some of the most prosperous nations in the world expect us to keep paying for their defense. When discussing this issue with a friend in one of those countries, I said perhaps we should be with drawing from this aspect of our alliance ((NATO)) since most of Europe wasn't carrying much of the load and cost. He railed against that notion saying, we really need you here to protect us. But at the same time we were discussing all of the benefits they have for free higher education and parents plugging for weekend paid nannies so couple with week time care could also take off weekends while their cost were covered. Great benefits but don't ask us to carry the defense against Russia load. Too bad, so Sad, your Dad. Things need to change. That isn't that we don't want or need friends. But moochers do not make great friends.
We do have the vote to change what we do not like here.
However, if people are struggling day to day, they do not have time to keep up with what is happening here or in the world.
If they are struggling and the politicians are not paying attention to their problems, but some guy comes along and promises to better their lot, he gets elected . In this case that guy is Trump. He was the beacon of hope for them. Despite his lack of knowledge regarding how the country functions for those in the trenches of the labor force.
And that is also how the Communist party took over China.
I hope we have learned our lesson, before that becomes our reality too.
1
I'm afraid your analysis of the Communist takeover in China is woefully inadequate. For one thing, you neglect the fact that Japan had seized large portions of China in the 1930's, and that what eventually became the Chinese civil war began first as an effort to fight foreign imperialists.
Also the comparison between American citizens and the Chinese peasantry in the 1930s and 1940s needs a bit more explication.
Finally, I see no similarities between Mao Tse-Tung, who lived among the peasantry for years ("The guerrilla must move amongst the people as a fish swims in the sea."), and a rich, coddled boy who grew up the beneficiary of his father's millions.
It appears that Mr. Friedman still inhabits that wonderful world that existed in upper middle class american society, circa 1968. A more stable, predictable time,,,,when American leadership was confident that USA was #1 and had unchallenged power, expertise, and ability to change the world. It was expected that high-minded upper society, Ivy League trained, simply project all the negatives onto those dreadful commoners that lived out there somewhere west of the Hudson river.....all the terrible things in the world led by Ivy-leaguers...was really the fault of "americans" that inhabit trailer parks on Sand Mtn, Alabama...or defense contractor employees in Torrance, CA(ughh). America needs to apologize for its prosperity.....having done everything the wrong way....look at 95% of the world doing it the "right way", they failed....but only because of the "ugly americans".....as Michelle Wolf paraphrased it for the upper middle class...."We're beautiful.....You're NOT"
2
Maybe Tom can explain in a future column how President Trump has managed to stay way above 40% approval ratings with 90% of news outlets reporting negatively on his Presidency.
2
"Way above" forty percent? Right now the two major polling compilers, HuffPost Pollster and FiveThirtyEight, put Trump's job-approval at 42,7 percent and 41.7 percent respectively.
Perhaps you're talking about the widely-discredited polls from Rasmussen Reports? The ones with a five-point pro-Trump bias compared to the consensus of other pollsters?
http://www.politicsbythenumbers.org/2017/10/27/technical-appendix-trends...
Those are the only polls Trump ever cites. Perhaps that should be a tip-off as to their accuracy?
Gallup is also at 42 percent today.
As Nate Silver observes, "For the past 66 days, Trump’s approval rating has been somewhere between 40.0 percent and 42.1 percent, according to our tracker. It’s been toward the higher end of that range recently — but that isn’t much of range."
https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/president-trumps-approval-rating-ha...
1
“Or, as a dying Senator John McCain observed in his new book: ‘This is my last term. … I’m freer than colleagues who will face the voters again. I can speak my mind without fearing the consequences much. And I can vote my conscience without worry.’”
In game theory “tit for tat” is a highly effective strategy in “the prisoner’s dilemma.” This game is a good model of cooperative behavior among egoists—people advancing their own self-interest. One important aspect of the game is that no one knows when it will end. If someone knows it’s the last round, behavior changes. Thus Obama famously remarked to a foreign dignitary that he will be much freer to act after he is elected for a second term. McCain is doing the same. Friedman seems to think that this is an example of a moral deficiency within the Republican Party when, in fact, it is the way almost all of us act. For example, now that I’m financially independent I feel free to tell people off.
1
Trump doesn’t want money and arms purchases. Macron immediately discerned that being respectful and flattering, but not obsequious, carries far more weight than any arms deal.
I would say that I am surprised at Mr. Friedman’s blindness, but everyone at the New York Times has been suffering from the “Trump can do no right” affliction.
And, yes, the US and China are that different.
1
Mr. Friedman, I have been a faithful reader of your comments for many years, but I did not enjoy this U.S. and China piece. The sweeping statements and poor observations have tarnished this op-ed. Perhaps you should spend more time in China and talking more with Chinese people in the country side, not just educated young people in the city. Xi is now powerful but he is also a transitional leader in China. We should wait until after 2050 and what happens in China at that time. Do not jump into conclusions. I am old but you and other young Americans will find out what China looks like in the second half of 21th century.
2
When asked during Nixon's trip to China about the impact of the French Revolution 200 years earlier, Premier Chou En Lai is reported to have said 'It is too early to say'
If this unknown Indian American were asked about the China's seemingly inexorable rise over America in past 20 years, I would say as well that
It is too early to say
The Metric System is likely to endure as long as civilization. Only the US holds out.
1
OK - where to begin. I'm a Canadian who lives and works in China. I teach a high school prep program for students who want to study in North America. These are bright students and some of them will be future leaders in China. Last week one did an excellent presentation on why gay marriage should be legalized in China. Another student did one on the big problem of air pollution in China and he pulled no punches. Like I said, these students are bright and opinionated and aren't afraid to express themselves. There is an adoration for foreign products here. Half the cars on the street are foreign imports with many Buicks as they have a factory in my Chinese province.People here are getting rich and they can literally see improvement from year to year. This is a GREAT thing for the world, not a bad thing. When people have more money they can start to think about other things, like cleaning up the environment or improving human rights - just like my students sentiments in their presentations.There is no sense amongst many Chinese that the US is their enemy, unlike in the US where many Americans think exactly that. Here, education is highly valued and teachers are respected. Sorry America, you are behind the 8 ball on that one. China will kick you in the rear if you don't start spending more on public education. The China that I experience and live in bears little resemblance to what gets portrayed in western media. I'd be much more worried about Putin's Russia.
24
Brian,
Most Americans don't know
2025
Is coming. You do.
1
What a contrast China is to the last holdout from the Metric System on the planet. Its people are eager to learn and they don't care from whom.
4
Yes, you are correct. There is no reason to doubt that the Chinese government and nation will achieve these goals. For those who don't know what China 2025 is - wikipedia is a good start...
Not only is the press feistier, so are the voters who have been leaping out of their hammocks of apathy in great numbers,becoming serious activists and participants in democracy.
In future elections it's almost possible to imagine candidates voted for based on policy and platforms rather than can I have a beer with her/him.
Are you listening mass media? You very much need this lesson too!
You can't have it both ways. Trump is a bold faced, unapologetic liar. So please stop cherry picking the stupidity he spews when it supports your cause.
4
Some years ago their was a news report in America that the Chinese had executed a bureaucrat for embezzling $200,000 of the people's money.
That seems like a distinct difference between China and the U.S.
7
And we have to believe that he really embezzled the money, and that’s why he was executed, not because he stepped on some big guy’s toes, because that’s what the reliable Chinese communist propaganda is telling us.
The difference between the US and China is that we can (still) write comments like this. But no problem, maybe Bernie gets elected and the Democrats will pass a law forbidding criticism of Communist propaganda.
1
America is 'exceptional' for one reason -- something James Madison said that spells it out -- Our Constitution is a 'charter of power granted by liberty'. In all other cases, even the best, governments are a 'charter of liberty granted by power.' The First Amendment, which comes First for a reason, is the cornerstone. Political correctness is a misguided attempt to overrule the First Amendment. Stop it. Being an American means you may hate what your neighbor says but will fight to the death for his right to say stupid, even mean things.
Aren't we supposed to love our enemies, not hate our neighbors?
The difference between us and China now is that they are the world's biggest creditor, we are the biggest debtor. When Reaganomics began, the good shoe was on our foot. The problem with this condition is that the Chinese now have the whip hand, as we did in 1956 when Ike told the Brits and to back off the Suez Canal; he did that because they were broke and because he hated war. War heroes hate war; cowards extol it. The next 'Suez Moment' may not be far away, probably in Iran. What will China do, since they still need Persian Gulf oil more than we do, when the shooting starts there? So hedge your long Treasuries and dollars.
On a final note, since it is Our Government, and the Constitution starts with these 3 words: We the people . . . I say unto you, it's our government -- love it or leave it. Representation without taxation isn't un-American, it's anti-American.
11
Cool article. Sorry to learn we are becoming like them. Maybe Trump will not be president for life, but I do believe the republicans will line up to supplicate, and beg him to let the country choose one of his children for our next president. Such a shining beacon of hope that he is for their hurt ethnic nationalistic, religious pride. The supplication by republicans to Trump is a new one for America, and is rather just like China.
1
I think even these Republicans who are shamefully quiet would not allow Trump to be president for life :-)
And I saw Fox News and the Wall St. Journal take a few shots at Trump's obvious lies about the $130,000.
Maybe Trump is crossing the line for Rupert Murdoch?
The writers of science fiction tell us again and again that the utopias which are the stuff of their stories disintegrate because each constituent part is interested only in its own affairs and has no concern for the total society.
It is easy to go too far and to suppose that because all governments are fallen, all governments, whether democratic or totalitarian, are equal.
Let us not take for granted, or undervalue, what has become ours at great cost. We have much to make us penitent, and there are periods and episodes in our history of which we are properly ashamed. They will keep us from being puffed up. Yet, though far from perfect, unlike China, our country is free, and stands as a symbol of freedom to all who are in bondage. So long as there is a free and vigorous press there is hope.
1
China has nothing like the ethnic diversity of the US. The vast majority of people are Han.
1
The slogan 'Make America Great Again' has always made me a bit uncomfortable.
The term 'American Exceptionalism' resides in a similar place in my brain...right next to the 'Dominionist' notion that Sarah Palin and her ilk believe that their Bible contains.
In this column, in a way, Mr. Friedman gives lie to all three of these ideas.
Thanks for writing.
There is a difference between building infrastructure and dealing arms. The value of our system is it outproduces a State run economy and produces more wealth, food, shelter, health care and education for it's people.
The values of our system come from transparency, ethical behavior that's codified in law and a justice system that is second to none that the public has rock solid trust in.
The Chinese don't have it we do but it's under attack by the President and his office and like our bridges and tunnels it's starting to crumble.
Are you kidding? China has built dozens of cities on the scale of New York over the past few decades.
1
One truly major difference; Xi is doing this for the greatness of China. He genuinely believes he will restore China to the great global power it once was and should be. Trump is doing this out of a perverse need to satisfy his narcissistic personality with no thought of benefiting anyone but himself.
1
Sorry, Doug, but China has never been a global power. Ever. They presently aspire to be a global power, but are going about it with a win-lose approach that tries to put China first in everything.
As the saying goes, when it’s you against the world, bet on the world. Neither Xi nor China will long be with us. They have already peaked and are on the downswing.
have you been there? It's pretty impressive. Shanghi dwarfs New York City and has infrastructure we can only dream of.
Such a superficial article! Why is this guy a columnist at NYT again? I live in China. It is silly to compare USA to China to make a political point aimed at a domestic audience. China had a leader who was responsible for the death of tens of millions of people and enormous suffering of countless more. Does USA or any liberal democracy have that? Chinese elite may always believe their system is superior too democracy, (both for self interest and for propaganda) - what does it prove? China's per-capita income is still lower than even Thailand and it is nearly half of Malaysia's. Really, NYT - please have some standards and fire this columnist. Remember his gushing articles about India after few billionaires invited him to a golf course?
1
“Share our values and then we can be allies.” I know many people who think this thought is 'namby pamby' soft liberal talk with no real implications. I suspect many readers will share that view. But there are real implications ..... they are usually longer term implications .. and, therefore, less emotionally satisfying. Allow me to illustrate: From the world of consumer products .. all companies try to sell their products. The more successful ones tend to be those that build enduring brands that deliver a seemingly unending stream of profits. These brands align with and influence consumers values and beliefs and build a strong foundation. Then there are other companies that may have a product with superior technical specifications but are sold on the basis of their 'attributes' without making any emotional connection with the consumer. They usually deliver profits for a few years before dying out. 'Share our values' is similar to making such an emotional connection. It gives us leverage. It gives us power. And it is something we have distinctive core competence in. China doesn't have it. Russia doesn't have it. Germany doesn't have it. Iran doesn't have it. N.Korea doesn't have it. Even Japan doesn't have it. We have it and we are wasting it.
What values? That God bestows blessings in the form of guns and gold?
TF writes --
"U.S. foreign policy, while it has always had its cynical, transactional side, particularly in the Cold War, has tended more toward, “Share our values and then we can be allies.”
Yes, indeed, Saudi Arabia, the Gulf absolute monarchies, the corrupt dictatorships in LA, Asia and Africa -- were our allies because they shared our values.
Aime Cezaire -- "A civilization that uses its principles for trickery and deceit is a dying civilization."
1
Give the people what they want. Trump was elected, Xi was not. Sorrythe US electorate doesn't comport with the policies of the NYT and its columnists.
1
Xi was elected by the members of the only legal political party in China. The Republicans are doing their best to make the Democratic Party illegal here.
1
China is a giant fascist corporate dictatorship where a tiny handful of unelected executives run the entire country and economy with no interference from the citizens. No bothersome human right to worry about. No bothersome health, safety or environmental laws. China is exactly the type of country Wall Street and U.S. Republicans want to convert the U.S. into. Sure, unlike China, we will be allowed to have guns so we can entertain ourselves by slaughtering each other. But otherwise, Making America Great Again is actually Making America into China. Of course, in the end we all lose, capitalists and communists, because as Edward Abbey commented on our economy, "Growth for the sake of growth is the ideology of a cancer cell."
Seriously? I suspect the bulk of folks hoping 'none of them show up' are on the left. The right is far more tolerant of expressions of opposing opinions these days than the newly self-righteous and prudish left.
1
Your opinions are all the same disingenuous cant. China enjoys an enormous advantage over the US, relatively free of guns and God as it is.
John McCain was free to vote his conscious.
Still, he voted for the tax bill that will increase deficits and give us and our children at least $10 Trillion of debt over the next ten years.
That is $67,000 per tax payer. I suspect when the numbers are in, it will be more.
Where was Mr. McCain's conscious?
Maybe thinking of his children's inheritance and getting rid of the estate tax?
1
I find myself increasingly in agreement with your Chinese seminar experts about the superiority of their "top-down, one-party, state-directed capitalism". The inescapable fact is that we Americans (unlike the French) have shown ourselves incapable of critical thinking, too many of us anyway, and unwilling to do the hard work of maintaining our democracy through diligence and discretion in selecting our news sources and attention to the details of legislation and legislators' votes. When polls consistently show that a solid majority of voters supports positions in direct contradiction to enacted legislation, and contrary to the stated positions of their elected representatives, we cannot honestly call this a functioning democracy. Too many have fully succumbed to demagoguery. If China has the good fortune of benevolent, visionary leadership it will surpass the US, and assume the leadership position the world desperately needs.
14
oh. did you think freedom would be free? get off the wagon and start pushing then.
Oh, please. Mr Thomas "moral equivalence' Freidman thinks the US and China are essentially the same, with the exception of the small detail of Freedom of the Press.
Well many he'd be willing to add the the rest of the First Amendment, and if he thought about it some more, maybe he`d add the Bill of Rights, and if he really spent some brain cells, he'd add the Rule of Law. But, clearly he didn't bother putting much thinking into this piece.
3
So, Mr. Friedman, only if you are a Republican congressman or Senator you have to toe the party line and be afraid of extremist challenges in the next primary ? Nothing like that happens in the Democratic Party, who supposedly values moderates ? If you’re an elected Democrat who wants to be not centrist, but at least pragmatic, you don’t get crushed by the fire-breathing extreme leftists that are now so fashionable in the Democratic Party ?
It’s so disappointing - an article that starts by lamenting how, sadly, we don’t talk to each other anymore, only to quickly go to boilerplate denounciations of the other side being the bad guys, responsable for all the evils.
Twenty years ago Mr. Friedman was one of the authors that I valued most. Unfortunately, this is one more step down the ladder, into boring and predictable partisanship.
2
Lazy citizens in both, but ours have more chances for change, so I guess I'd say we're worse as citizens.
Americans of the right-wing, conservative, Republican, evangelical, billionaire-media 'Party' are ruining America and the planet's health. This self-proclaimed 'moral majority' is actually the angry, greedy, immoral minority (with control of both Houses and Presidency due to electoral colleges and antiquated voting representation). our President is more vile and narcissistic than China's, but Xi Jinping is certainly as destructive, due to his country being four times the size of ours, with basic slaves doing the work for the benefit of the few rich at the top. Shameful both countries are.
There is great shame in the world today, with China and America and Russia leading the way.
It's nice to have a home to go home to but in the process there are many homes in the 21st Century unlike those in the 1950's. I think to myself I want to ho home. My birthplace and growing up there until 19 years of age in Detroit, Michigan. Like in the 1939 movie "The Wizard of Oz" and the 1939 movie "Gone with the Wind" both in color film. One place where you ultimately you never leave in the former and the latter where you have no choice but to leave because of the Civil War. Kind of ironic that what is happening on the southern border of the United States it is happening as the latter but not because of terrorism but because of economics and the illegal drug cartels. And in the Middle East the same as the latter but because of war and ISIL. Is there a place now in the 21st Century as that in the former? Yes, in the United States where naturally you never leave even if it's wanting to go home. And Canada can be home too. As for China well that can be too because we're a country here in the U.S. that does not discriminate because of religion, not yet, and because of atheism. Communism like that in Asia in the 1970's and 1972 when President Richard Nixon was the first sitting U.S. President to visit there officially. Maybe that is one reason I voted him at 18 years of age despite what came afterward with "Watergate". And maybe the same reason I did not vote for President Donald J. Trump in 2016 at 62 years of age because of the latter.
I have read your comment three times and I'm still shaking my head. What, exactly, were you trying to say?
China is a Communist country. Not all the people there are Communists. I am Catholic. Not all the people in the United States are Catholic. Yet we are not a Communist country. The Red Scare and McCarthyism decades ago in the 1950's sought out those who were. I'm not sure if China does to those who believe in God now.
When did our elected officials stop carrying the US Constitution in their pockets? Republicans, and to a lesser extent Democrats, obviously don't take the 1st Amendment seriously. Freedom of expression is key. It means our Senators and Representatives are free to represent their constituents, not their party. Oh, heck, party loyalty is a cheaper and easier way to keep the job.
Mr. Friedman, you forgot to mention the shared current negative attitude toward outsiders/foreigners in both countries.
The similarities you pointedly show between China's dictatorship and U,S,' Trump wannabe despotism are indeed striking. And yet, China can be more efficient economically as 1) Xi knows what he is doing, and 2) can dispose of resources (and humans are just another commodity, human rights notwithstanding) at will. Whereas Trump is incompetent, an inveterate liar with no credibility (except by his adoring base, for whom Trump's fictions are the dogma truth) and as corrupt as they come, and who thinks the presidency gives him carte blanche to enrich himself at our expense. For Trump, the watching eye of a free press, and the rule of law, are just a nuisance to be swatted at. Both are transactional. And no chance for friendship nor the recognition that it doesn't have to be a zero sum game (where one is the winner, so the other has to be a loser). If we remain complacent about demagogue Trump's abuses, day in and day out, perhaps we deserve him. Now, ought we not be talking about the republican complicity in this mafia, McCain's case getting a pass...maybe?
The USA is rapidly becoming a rogue nation. China has an opportunity to replace us.
This is one of Friedman's more insightful efforts. Or maybe it's just that China's bristling self-confidence has become so hard to miss. The Chinese are no longer trying to hide it. America's surprising path of self-immolation under Trump has removed the last major obstacle. The goal is in sight. China is joyfully primed to lead the world. Fortune is smiling.
The Chinese rightly ask: of what use is democracy if it is incapable of operating the ship of state, of getting essential social tasks accomplished? We are nominally free to debate and argue and say the most outrageous things. But only if we tamely consent to be manipulated into ineffectiveness. At best we only have a limited power to say no to the initiatives of others, who in turn can say no to us. Meanwhile, behind the scenes, countless influential hands are plunging greedily into the cookie jar.
Xi may be a dictator, but he has the power to get things done. And his agenda is not obviously unreasonable. If you travel about China by train as I did recently, you see infrastructure projects everywhere -- new apartments, office buildings, roads, bridges, train stations and airports. And he has publicly committed to tackle the resulting environmental problems. Ordinary Chinese happily regard all this as positive. Some may indeed rue the lack of political discourse, but watching America gag on an excessive indulgence in its vaunted freedoms makes the medicine of top-down authoritarianism a little easier to swallow.
1
the first sort of big difference, well a little difference is that their lackey columnists write in Chinese, Friedman writes in english, a big difference is that China is a rising ancient imperial state, the US is a failing, relatively young imperial state. Another big difference is that no one in China would ever be ever to run that country having the hair color and complexion of Trump, just would not happen, never ever.
1
Is China different from the US? Yes, US Foreign Policy relies on the US Army invading and destroying all of the countries main infrastructure and killing the local population by hundreds of thousands and displacing those it does not kill to Europe and America via diaspora. China's policy is to build infrastructure, preserve the lives of the people born in the country, and, build peaceful partnership without the massive destruction, killing and diaspora sponsored by US Policy. Very different indeed.
There must be a reason why corporations don't switch CEOs every four years.
Before you blame Trump for our extraordinary national debt, perhaps you should look at the facts and consider how much debt was added in the 8 years preceding his term.
1
Especially if you see exactly where that money went.
"more Chinese do not think that we are as “exceptional” a nation as we think we are "
Ever since Donald Trump became president of this country, it is not only Chinese but no nation thinks America is "exceptional". We have become a banana republic and the laughing stock of the world. Ask Americans what other countries think of the U.S. Even many Republicans and right leaners would admit that the US has less respect than in the past. Very few countries in Asia or Europe have the confidence in Trump to do the right thing regarding world affairs. America is not considered trustworthy anymore.
3
I will take a pin-wheeling chaotic Republic style democracy over an imperial top-down one party ruling system any day, though it does not surprise me that China likes such a system. Look at their ~2K years of history. Above all else they prize stability, though they call it "social harmony." At least their leadership caste does. They have always been this way. It suits them. It does not suit us.
As for which system to trust...well...consider it this way. They cohort and chortle that they never went thru the kind of 2008 economic breakdown the West did. This is true. But conversely, the West has never gone through the 1958 - 1962 "Tombstone (The Great Chinese Famine)" period, either. A period in their history where approximately 36 million Chinese men, women and children died by starvation due solely to the ineptitude of that one party system.
When push comes to shove our system will look after its citizens while theirs monitors them in police state fashion.
John~
American Net'Zen
8
The dysfunction and uncertainty introduced by Trump has certainly worked in China's favor and has probably swayed many to consider them and their system a better bet for the future. On a purely practical basis, I wonder how much productivity has been lost in this country by a populace consumed by monitoring Trump's tics and pivots minute by minute? We expect a President to be a caretaker, competent enough so that we can confidently go about our lives without having to worry like we're babysitting a five year old who's just eaten a whole bag of donuts and is running around with scissors.
11
Some parallels between China and Trump’s USA have been mentioned. But there is one big difference: China has a long-term plan for advancing its influence and is pursuing it. Trump has no ability to plan and wouldn’t know if it was being followed if there were one.
Possibly the Mercers and Kochs and Wilks etc have a plan and are using Trump as their puppet. But whatever they think of the narrow-minded “Christian” Theocracy they favor, it ain’t gonna make America great again.
21
"their system never put up a leader as undisciplined, dishonest and unstable as Donald Trump (at least not since Mao)." Parenthetically characterizing Mao as undisciplined, dishonest and unstable is both shoddy journalism and Trumpian misdirection.
The U.S. political system "put up" Trump. Revolution led by Mao "put up" the People's Republic of China (simultaneous to U.S. "putting up" the undisciplined, dishonest and intellectually challenged Truman.
While we lurched from Truman to Trump, China's system continues to evolve.
1
I wonder if Mr. Friedman has ever been to China. There is no public criticism of Secretary Xi in China. Not on We-Chat or on any other online forum, not in the press, not on TV, nowhere, none, zip, zilch. But if you come to the US, you'll find the media - TV, cable, newspapers, Twitter, Facebook, blogs - filled to the brim with venomous, vituperous criticism of President Trump. Seems like kinda a big difference to me. I wonder how Mr. Friedman could have missed it.
3
What you missed is the enormous number of non-critical thinking Americans who depend entirely on FOX for their "news." It's the same as China's non-critical format.
1
Yes, but will it really result in the change we need. In my seventies, now, I have serious doubts. I've been complaining for decades, but the tax structures of America just become ever more regressive - favoring the wealthy (in case you don't know what regressive means). Republican have been lying through their eye teeth for decades about it, Trump has just taken it to a level that I hope more people could finally see. But, Trump is a Republican, Republican, Republican.
Heaven knows, we don’t CEASE talking AT each other for five minutes. But one side supports Trump and the other despises him, so these aren’t dialogues but competing shouting matches that accomplish very little.
ONLY “3001 false or misleading claims”? Tom obviously didn’t ask MELANIA to count those made to her about spankings and porn queens. But Tom almost sounds as if he’d rather live under Xi than under The Donald. After all, Xi probably issues fewer lies on any given day than Trump does. Shouldn’t that count for something? Unless, perhaps, you’re in a Chinese gulag being “re-educated’.
And I might stress, as Tom admits, that while Fox fawns over Trump, here Fox has plenty of competition (including Tom) that does the opposite; and, last time I looked, all of THOSE worthies aren’t in a Chinese gulag, being “re-educated”.
China is nothing like us, which is not to say that China is not right for the Chinese. But Louisiana is NOT equivalent to Guangdong and Guangzhou provinces, from which China exports the weirdest and most questionable “culinary delicacies” that appear to be offering every one of the potential pandemics to threaten the world in the last forty years.
I’ll take the U.S.A., with or without Trump.
6
Between China and the US, I'll take the US.
I lived in South America and had a factory for 13 years.
I know the US is better than the second world countries.
But we have been going in their direction for the last 35 years with the trickle-down Reaganomics, cut taxes for the wealthy and social programs for the rest.
So I don't want to just be able to say we are better than China.
I want to look at countries like Denmark and say we can have universal healthcare and we don't have to have poverty and we can have good schools for the working class and poor.
And they consistently out rank the US on the Forbes Best Countries for Business list.
We have parts of the US with infant mortality rates the same as Botswana.
Germany has faced the same globalization we have. They are known for manufacturing. They train their workers for the trades and high-tech manufacturing.
After 35 years of Reaganomics, we got an opioid crisis.
I grew up blue collar but went to state university and into high-tech and am now one of those terrible "liberal elite." I will be retiring to Europe.
3
"China is nothing like us."
Given your bizarre comments about Guandong (a province) and Guanzhou (not a province, but a city,) I don't think you really know enough about China to say whether or not it is like the US.
The big difference -- the only important difference -- is that we can get rid of our leaders if we want to. They can't.
35
One of the greatest innovations of America at its founding is the idea that the state is a possession, through democracy, of the people and, in turn, the people are not the subjects of the state. This was reaffirmed by Abraham Lincoln in his many eloquent speeches and writings, one of the great gifts he gave to us in addition to saving our difficult and often fractious union.
I am not at all sure that most people understand what this means and its importance. It is both profound and simple. The state, here, cannot tell us what to do, where to live or how to live. Aside from attending school through the minimal required age and the (suspended) military draft, we cannot be ordered about. We are free to create whatever triumphs or disasters our brains can imagine and our circumstances and fortunes allow.
We have had stunningly mediocre presidents, but very few buffoons. Since we have seen them close up and had time to measure weaknesses, we realize that we haven't been doing all that well in the last 50 yrs. or so in picking presidents, but earlier times had serious problems, too.
Our democracy and our entitlement of freedom look very messy right now, but we have built the richest large nation on earth which has sustained a level of prosperity for more people than any in the history of the world. We might yet crash and burn. If we do, it will be because we have been ripped of decency and respect for each other and, instead, become committed to eternal battle over cooperation
18
Abraham Lincoln also said: "you can fool some of the people all the time." Who knew that would amount to a third of the American population? The lack of decency and respect, Terry complains of, emanates from the Churches of the Republican Way who regularly crucify the Christ as they vote, through the GOP, for war, incarceration, environmental destruction, and increasing poverty in the richest country. America will be great if and only if Americans start realizing how great is presently is not - and all due to republicanism.
1
The main difference between the two countries arises from the relative strength of their political institutions and culture. Trump has striven to weaken the independence of Congress by his attacks on its leaders and appeals to his "base." Ryan and McConnell have defended him, but their support remains contingent on his willingness to endorse their agenda. He has no ability to strip Congress of its autonomy.
With respect to the courts, he can nominate judges he considers friendly to his outlook, but he cannot intimidate jurists with his pep rallies and tweetstorms. He cannot threaten the autonomy of the judiciary.
Xi Jinping, on the other hand, confronts no independent institutions which challenge his power. His colleagues certainly have the power to overthrow him, but only through ad hoc methods that might destabilize their system of succession. Xi might well serve as president for live, but Trump will not last beyond 2025.
The two countries are not quite as similar as Friedman suggests.
6
I don't think they are similar either, except I'm not as confident that Americans are so much in control. For decades have been promoting the demise of our government in exchange for tax cuts. Anti-governmental-ism and aversion to politics seems endemic keeping Americans so ignorant that hundreds of millions of them regularity shoot themselves and the rest of the 99.9% in the foot economically by buying into the Republican anti-governmental world view.
The Chinese Communist Party has taken steps to adapt their official line to include selected elements of Confucianism.
The country with "In God We Trust" on their money seems to be quickly abandoning all the "core beliefs" that, in 1956, were said to justify putting those words there.
These and other internal historical contradictions are, by definition, leading to unforeseeable, indeed, even unthinkable outcomes. Change is inexorable.
8
Indeed the majority practitioners of our national religion routinely vote to crucify the Christ as they support the GOP, its war-mongering, its jail-stuffing, its weapons proliferation, its poverty-inducing capitulation to the wealthy, and now its destruction of the Garden of Eden, the thin film of life on a lonely planet that is really our everything. Our religion is unworthy.
2
Actually, we're on different trajectories, and we're just reaching a crossover point where it looks like we're "alike".
China's like America used to be.
Optimistic about the future, self-confident, with a growing middle class, and multinationals salivating at the money to be made in the consumer market. Soon we'll be hearing "Never bet against the Chinese consumer".
And America's like China used to be.
Pessimistic about the future, fearful, with a shrinking middle class, and shunned by the multinationals as consumers. We get the bonus of being abandoned by them as employees, too.
And it's all because of globalization.
It had to be tough to swallow, seeing the self-confidence of the Chinese and their entirely justifiable belittlement of capitalism and democracy.
When Wall Street is more concerned about the lack of pensions of Chinese workers, which causes them to save too much and reduces their disposable income, than it is about pensions for the American middle class, then capitalism deserves to be belittled.
And they're right. Democracy is failing, just about everywhere, in developing and developed countries alike.
Xi's recent moves have changed the dynamics, and it's TBD whether they will alter either trajectory, as the 21st century race of the AI ecosystems commences.
But globalization has been a spectacular failure, and has placed humanity in a very dangerous position, just when it's about to be challenged by the digital revolution in unprecedented ways.
18
What is your alternative to globalization, and how do you propose to stop it?
@W. Fulp
More globalization. Not less.
Done right this time. Bottom-up, not top-down.
There will be a revolution. It is simply inevitable at this point.
The only question is whether it will be peaceful or violent.
But a revolution, there will be.
Globalization is inevitable. Each country has to find its path and make smart choices.
China appears to be overextended in some respects. Its investment in development in countries with economies that are emerging or trying to emerge is a gamble.
Trump's efforts to pull back in global trade is at odds with the longer term aims of US businesses, and is clearing the field for China and others to be assertive. Trump's trending toward a military based foreign policy seems consistent with his bully mentality and at odds with any sensible approach to deal-making.
The problem isn't globalization. It's the lack of forward-looking governmental policies that are reality-based.
If globalization is the problem, what is your solution? Do we close our borders, stop trade, and let the world go on without us?
1
The Chinese are fully aware they are consuming official propaganda when they read Xinhua and watch CCTV.
It is hard for us to imagine but the Chinese online forums are rife with criticism and debate. There's alot more independent thought and free thinking than we realize. It is only when someone takes the extra step to organize movements against the Communist Party where things escalate with consequences.
Conversely, a loyal FOX News or MSNBC consumer would rarely acknowledge they were consuming any kind of political bias. I myself am guilty of existing in my own Facebook political echo chamber.
Both countries censor, that they do have in common. But their approach differs.
15
Only you have grasped the truth. There are two personalities for most us, the Chinese people inside establishment:
One is loyal to authority and the leader, with firm believe in Marx-Leninism, and another one is critical, independent and cherishes individual freedom not any less than a normal American person.
One is used for work, to earn salary, to keep running the state engine that is crucial for the country to fulfill tasks of building up the country's economy and lift more people to the living standards of developed countries in shortest time, and another one is prepared and preserved for one day in the future to enjoy the life you the fortunate people living in a developed country are enjoying, once China is well-developed not only in terms of economy but also in terms of society, of human.
We know no less than American people, either our propaganda, our personal cult, our sacrifice of individual freedom and that we have to appear like them --- despite we don't in fact. However, we choose to accept it at the moment for the sake of keeping the momentum to get most of us to developed level.
Please cherish what you own now in your country -- your principle, your check and balance system, and your society that provides maximum space for individual. You are lucky than us.
1
I think you are still enthralled with the false hope that the Internet is "free". If there is any opinion expressed on Chinese web-sites that differs from PartyLine, you had best bet the Bureaucracy allows it...simply because it helps Big Brother identify future Enemies of the State.
You would be wise to realize the same thing can very easily happen in the USA. Big Brother is watching.
2
“Share our values and then we can be allies.” Just what those US "values" were and are has always been the sticking point. There is a lot of self-delusion packed into Friedman's phrase. Must we keep saying during the Cold War and after the US put in place/propped up an endless array of dictators to prevent an understandable manifestation of popular support for a socialist forms of government or just to remove a foreign leader who was not compliant enough to US interests? This behaviour in Central and South America has much to do with the fact the US presence is barely tolerated these days in the Organization of American States and the US continues to do this around the world. What "shared values" does the medieval gender apartheid practicing democracy protestor beheading terrorist producing theocracy of Saudi Arabia - America's great ally and partner in war crimes in Yemen - share with the US? Please spare us the hypocrisy about "values". The pursuit of US national interests which essentially equalled US commerical interests, including the military industrial complex above all, are the US "values" the rest of the world has seen since WWII and sees today. Spare us the constant rejoinder, the US "meant well". People around the world watch what is done not what is said. So where are we now? These days the Chinese offer infrastructure and development while the US brings weapons systems, forever wars and destruction. Whose "values" would you want in your neighborhood?
69
Often those on the right use false equivalence to criticize the left. There's some false equivalence going on here too. Yes, the US supported right wing dictators in the cold war, generally when the opposing choice was a leader beholden to the USSR. But the US did provide some constraint to that leader, and facilitated transition to a democracy in many cases. I contrast North and South Korea, and Cuba vs. Chile or Argentina. The US-supported despot was a bad series of men in each case, but it was much better than the corresponding communist alternative, with long-standing implications that last to today. Yes, it is wrong to characterize US policies now and in the cold war as being altruistic and morally upright. It may only be a distant second best that the US choice was better than the alternative communist choice, but more often than not it was. In that end that difference matters. A similar difference exists between the US and China today.
.
There are millions of educated Chinese who understand the nature of the US and China, and would gladly leave China to become a US citizen tomorrow. There are vanishingly few Americans who understand the two systems who would choose the Chinese system. If you want to judge how people really feel, watch what the do, not what they say. This is a case of people voting with their feet for the American system, with all of its many flaws.
3
Though I don't disagree with your reading of US "soft power" (though we did try to promote capitalism over communism during the Cold War, FWIW) let's not get too dewy-eyed about what the Chinese are offering.
When they come in to "country X" to altruistically build infrastructure, there are all kinds of strings attached. From using Chinese workers to build it to getting sweetheart deals for commodities in exchange. It's just a different brand of control.
2
I have no illustions with regard to Chinese foreign policy being any less self interested than any other country. I also recognize the strength of the US with regard to rule of law and a relatively free press (with Chomsky caveats re self censorship well recognised). I also recognise that the US despite these strengths has morphed into a militaristic plutocracy looking for new enemies to feed the monster that is their miltary industrial complex. That monster feeds on conflict and increasing tensions and US neo cons attempts to demonise China - a still developing country that has done a terrific job of taking care of its people and doing so with a 90 percent (PEW) approval rate is part of that process. I don't want to feed the monster. Let the Chinese people decide how they want to live as they develop. They present no threat to the wider world. In fact they are doing a great job of taking care of their 20% of the planet's population. Would that the rest of the world was doing as well. The US needs to focus on fixing its own problems soon or the plutocracy and the military industrial complex having already hacked the democracy elment of the US system will be going after the nation's rule of law and relatively free press as well but my sense is they are already doing this in a way the population tuned into the Khardashians, the latest water skiing squirrel on their cell phones or transgender bathroom debates simply wont notice - proverbial frogs in the slowly boiling pot.
3
When talking to ordinary Chinese, you find that Xi, unlike Trump is perceived to do the right things for China.
Partly that is, as one formulated to me: "For thousands of years China has dreamed of having a powerful emperor"
Unsaid : China had been humiliated by the UK (the Opium War) , the Western Powers (Boxer Rebellion), the Japanese (The rape of Nanjing) etc .... It needs a powerful leader to stop the humilation dished out by Western barbarians.
As to corruption : One told me , what happened in November in Zhengzhou when she lost her hukou (the permit to stay in a City). With trepidation she went to the local office to apply for a replacement. Last time it happened to her, some years ago, it took 3 month and a bribe to get one.
Ms X to official : " I made a mistake . I was careless. Please fell free to punish me. "
"Please feel free to punish me" is Chinese for "would you like a bribe?"
To her utter astonishment , there was no bribe, and she had her hokou in 2 weeks.
With astounding speed, Mr. Xi 's fight against corruption has reached the lowest levels and improved the life of ordinary Chinese.
18
Hukou transfers to cities has been loosened up due to shortages in certain industries.
Meanwhile our major parties, especially the GOP, promote corruption. In fact its built in. You want to represent the American people? You have to represent the wealthy just to get the chance. So every tax structure in America has become regressive. Before Reagan we had progressive tax structures. It built the middle class.
2
"While Xi has cowed his news media, Trump, despite all his efforts to discredit our free press, has actually ended up invigorating it. "
Yes, he has. Take it not from me but from the CEO of the NY TIMES
"May 3, 2017 ... The company reported that quarterly circulation revenue increased by 11.2 percent. ... Trump has been 'rocket fuel' for NYT digital subscriptions, CEO says ... On CNBC's "Power Lunch," New York Times CEO Mark Thompson said "there is no question we have got some rocket fuel in the subscription ..."
https://www.cnbc.com/.../shares-of-new-york-times-surge-after-subscriber- growth.html
Like every Newspaper, the NY Times needs to print what its base likes. An analysis of the demographics of its readership showed.
"Donald Trump remains the key area of focus for NY Times readers, who are 226% more likely than the average person to search for “trump” and 116% more likely to search for “trump news.” The Times’ investment in covering Trump appears to be paying off: in spite of the president’s vocal disdain for the publication, their paid subscriptions have actually risen since the election."
http://www.hitwise.com/articles/ny-times/
7
I don't think the Times has a "base."
Maybe people are just looking for a dependable source of news in these "interesting" times. A source that has strong fact-checking departments, issues corrections and retractions when they get it wrong, and pays their journalists pretty well.
1
Trumpism has definitely led to a rebirth of investigative journalism and good reportage. Also, the other biggest difference between Trump and Xi is that we have an independent council who is truly independent. Imagine if Xi had an independent investigator, protected by an independent judiciary....
4
Staffing the federal judiciary with drones is Trump's prime objective.
I think the main difference is that the US is in the post-truth era while China still seems pretty reality-based. In his speech at the party congress, Zhi pointed out three challenges: poverty, the environment and financial instability. Not a bad list for the US as well (if by financial instability you mean growing piles of debt). The Republican response to these three would be: 1) lower taxes lift all boats and the poor are lazy, 2) it's all a liberal lie and 3) lower taxes will cause growth to soar and take care of the debt.
The problem for both China and western liberals (in the classical free-trade sense) is that the rise in living standards in China and the stagnation of ours truly came about to a large degree from the rigging of the global trading system through currency manipulation (trillions in currency reserves) and intellectual property piracy. The instincts of Trump and his base are completely right here and those of Ricardian-based academics and their fellow traveler editorial-writers are utterly mistaken.That the messenger is grotesque does not make the message wrong.
Trump is the natural outcome of these mistaken beliefs. The first step in our national healing program is to admit the truth here. Only then can we move to the restoration of our Democracy. If Trump runs against a candidate with a Bob Rubin-style approach telling us that we're better off when the jobs move away, we're doomed.
3
Yes, best comment ever!
Problem is: who do we vote for?
First, our economy is not stagnant anymore. Republican anti-regulation trashed the world economy and the last administration restored it to health by bailing out the banks with tax-payer money. What is stagnant is wages. We have been busy making billionaires and homeless people. Republican tax cutting has been fundamental to that stagnation.
If we survive his term, Donald Trump may be the best thing that has happened to this country in a long time. With his elections, the Republicans have been fully exposed for totally lacking in character and convictions. The religious right is neither, and will find their final resting place in a special place. In November, we will have the chance to remove Republicans from office in mass, and then extinguish their last breath in 2020. With an election of Hillary Clinton, we would have had four more years of governing on the edges with ongoing gridlock. We started viewing as normal Republicans' screaming about budget deficits, Obamacare, 2nd amendments rights, judicial overreach, etc. You know the drill. The Dowd's, Brooke's, Will's, and other Republicans are aware of Trump's rotten core, but can't seem to grasp how we got here. Our kids get it and surprised us again showing us they were listening despite all of their technology distractions.
47
It's a mistake to think that the defeat of Trump, if and when that happens, will bring the end to populist politics of the right, or for that matter of the left. Trump is a dangerous populist, yes, but what is really dangerous is that he has shown others what can be accomplished politically through populism. Trump is not simply a stupid man unqualified to be president. He may well signal the beginning of a new era of American politics. The next populist may be a lot smarter than Trump -- think about the dangers that lie in that possible future.
3
Sure, Trump can be President for Life. In Prison.
7
What happened to the days when Americans went overseas and didn't speak badly of their government?
Mr Friedman takes a swing through China and comes back to tell us how our democratically elected president -- whom I don't particularly like, by the way -- is somehow comparable to the president of China. Oh, but the president of China lies less.
Shameful. Try this -- the government of China is a bunch of unelected dictators, so their whole existence is dishonest. Unless you like that kind of thing. They have no public accountability or process, so comparing Xi's # of lies to Trump's is risible. Have you read Mao's memoirs? Zhou's? Deng's? Jiang's?
You get the point. You haven't read anything from any of the leaders of these hard core dictatorships because they don't talk to the people. It's none of history's business what they did to seize and stay in power - kill millions of their own.
Or we're told how Fox is somehow like Xinhua. As if the Times is the impartial arbiter of the news anymore...
The Times, with its relentless barrage of Trump hate coloring its reporting, has damaged its standing and impartiality beyond repair. Trump will be gone soon enough, thanks to our democracy, but the Times will still be here, an institution that damaged itself and is no longer trusted.
China benefits more from what has happened to the "news" in the US than from one bad president.
To paraphrase the temporary resident of the White House: Sad.
4
Make like a prairie dog West Coaster. Come out of your burrow, stand up, and look around. Trump has got to go and with him the entire Republican Party. Period. Check it out! Human rights abusing China, with four times the population of the U.S. incarcerates fewer people in total than we do. We put more people in jail than anyone. We are also the most financially unequal of nations - even though America is the richest nation by far. Every tax structure in America favors the wealthy because, in America, money talks. How much freedom is there without opportunity?
Of course China and the U.S. are alike -- the Chinese are simply following our lead in defining "progress" as a prioritization of economic output over human happiness. The United States is the current reigning superpower because it has refused to recognize basic human rights such as healthcare and a living wage, and unlike its European neighbors, has maintained its capitalist system, ruling like one of the robber barons of old. Never mind that its system has failed a great swath of its citizens. While other countries have recognized that socialism is the most humane way to go rather than forcing people to sell themselves in an unforgiving market, the United States prides itself on its "Protestant work ethic," i.e. you will play by the rules and become a wage-slave, or you will not eat. Now, China is beating us at our own game, paying workers even less and churning out even cheaper products. My only hope is that, with its unsustainable growth rate, China wears out capitalism, accelerating its inevitable demise and ushering in a new era.
3
"Other countries have recognized that socialism is the most humane way to go rather than forcing people to sell themselves in an unforgiving market"?
Not really. Most of those other countries (i.e., those that have succeeded) have opted for social democracy, not socialism -- that is, for capitalism with ameliorative reforms (to make the market more "forgiving"). That makes all the difference in the world!
31
Yes, that's worked really well in Venezuela.
2
One important difference: while Beijing uses its news media, the news media is (as noted) cowed, and can at least be understood as a megaphone for the State's talking points. By contrast, Trump has personally taken on the task of destabilizing and delegitimizing our news media--a task that Beijing and other authoritarian regimes around the world have gladly cheered on.
4
"While Xi has cowed his news media, Trump, despite all his efforts to discredit our free press, has actually ended up invigorating it. "
Trump and his sycophants have in fact been very successful at discrediting the free press, and they have also accomplished something even more significant - they have "cowed" the American intellect, and in doing so have gone a long way towards the destruction of independent thought. Polls show that the percentage of Americans that actually believe the free press is only only a slight majority. Trumps lies and hypocrisies may be obvious to most of us, but lets not forget that 30-40 percent of Americans have already made the decision that being members of the Trump cult is better than reality. These same people agree with him that the press is the enemy of the American people, and would be just fine with the third reich style dictatorship that Trump and his brand of "Republicans" really want. The issue is not that we've "forgotten how to talk to one another." The issue is that we fail to accurately see the struggle we are in as what it really is. Trump and his followers are a perversion of basic decency. Yet people like Mr. Friedman continually try to placate them by giving credence to their perverted world view. If we keep trying to understand these people we will fall into the pit with them.
37
As I had commented in another column, that just one person can simply make a decision such as rejecting the Iran deal says a lot about "democracy" in the US. You may have all the horse and buggy show about campaigning and elections. After that, you basically end up with a dictator for the next four years. At least in a parliamentary system, a prime minister making foolish decisions could lose the support of his MPs and have to leave office. A second related point is that elected politicians invariably failed to understand that they are elected to office, *NOT* to do things their way, but to represent his/her constituency and work to improve their lives. Is it therefore surprising that "democracies fail"? Aside from the horse and buggy show of elections, what difference is it from a non-benevolent dictatorship when an elected official thinks that he is there to do things his/her way?
In this column, Dr Friedman seems to have joined in the sport of China bashing. But at least, can you not recognize that Xi looks after his country?
9
"After that, you basically end up with a dictator for the next four years."
There are certainly a lot of disturbing authoritarian trends in the United States, but if you think the office US President has dictatorial powers, you don't know what a real dictator looks like.
Xi has essentially maneuvered himself to become China's king. Trump dreams of becoming America's king, but it is not only highly doubtful he will get a second term, evidence seems to be mounting that may lead to his imprisonment.
By my thinking, the men are on opposite trajectories.
One hopes.
6