The US should remove its troops and THAAD missiles from South Korea and move to Japan - this way SK can talk all it wants with NK and Japan will have added protection. I'm sure Mr Moon knows nothing can go wrong with diplomacy. he doesn't need the US obviously.
1
All the turbulence derived from Trump's non-sense statements benefit North Korea in various ways: first, it increases the fear from South Korea, whose capital is at less than an hour car drive from the enemy and who really feel a cold back sweat each time North Korea tests its weapons. The increase in fear has a positive correlation with South Korea to take losses and concessions with the North for the sake of peace. Second, it makes Kim Jon-un looks less crazy, and making look hostility as a reaction to belligerent rhetoric from the US President. Reduces the "political capital" required from a leader country to promote or push for more strict measures to counter NKs insults to global peace. Even with a real and clear threat from the North to any country, the Global Community will find difficult to back any drastic US military action with Trump's signature on it.
It's an historical and a ridiculous moment when an American President acts like a raging adolescent boy with no skills in diplomacy and communication with a very consequential part of the world. It's been almost 70 years since the United States supported and assisted South Korea to maintain a democratic government. Many American lives were sacrificed there for their cause. There's an American base their to enable S. Korea to remain a free nation as Japan is. Donald Trump is playing a very dangerous game with his juvenile, and threatening rhetoric. S. Korea's leader by being rational and logical is using diplomacy with the North to protect their own well being. Walking away from S. Korea or ratcheting up the threats with Kim Jung Un will not be in the long range best interest of the United States either. It would be unwise to let go of the US presence in the Korean Penentulia or to allow or even hasten a war between North and South Korea. It will be a big negative in economics and the loss of life will be a big red mark on Trump and his historical, strange anomoly of POTUS.
My guess is that Xi and Kim at some point are going to engage in a good cop/bad cop routine. Here in the US we are mesmerized by the constant flow from the White House of belligerent and incoherent chatter duly amplified by a corporate media energized by the profits from "all Trump, all the time" programming.
What the world in general and Xi in particular see and we don't is an American empire rapidly self-destructing. Understaffed diplomacy. No coherent policy. A leader who is an ignoramus subject to manipulation through flattery, surrounded by a court of squabbling fools, with a Congress engrossed in its own agenda of looting. In other words, China sees a historic opportunity to oust the US from a position of influence in Asia and the Pacific.
It seems unlikely that Kim is an autonomous player here. Xi has great leverage over North Korea and is likely orchestrating Kim to play a destabilizing role. North Korea is not going to be allowed to start a nuclear war, though Xi no doubt sees the benefit of using its threat to create a crisis.
Trump is being played by Xi. While Trump fiddles with his nuclear button, Rome burns.
4
Over the last 16 years I have unsuccessfully tried to explain to the US government that it’s impossible to change the foreign nations by the swords but only by a pen.
We change the people by improving their system of values. The system of values is tweaked by the words, not by the arms!
However, our leaders always opt out for deploying the troops once they fail in their job of persuading their counterparts to take a different course.
It’s the job of the presidents to explain to their colleagues what’s in the best interest on their nations.
If our leaders cannot understand those basics, they will saddle us with the unnecessary endless conflicts to protect their bruised egos and hurt feelings.
The countries don’t fight each other over their basic interests but over the foolishness of their leaders.
The smart nations achieve their objectives and secure their interests by dealing, compromising, negotiating and trading, not by waging the wars!
It’s just too expensive and destructive. The conflicts always cost far more than any achieved goal…
1
There's too much at stake for both Koreas to allow Trump to fuel a simmering standoff. For Trump, this is simply a platform by which he can posture, disregarding the biomechanics of nuclear Apocalypse. Ironically enough, Trump style diplomacy may have its value: he's forced the Korean Peninsula back into dialogue, he's forcing debate in Jerusalem. Is this talking loudly and carrying a big stick a kind of perverse genius, or is the world simply watching Trump and then doing the opposite of what he ponders? I opt for the latter, the former offers DJT far too much credit.
I can't help but think that Trump was really a godsend for Kim Jong-un. Kim desperately needed to establish himself as a leader in his rather young regime and Trump provided the opportunity. Now Kim can take a step back, engage South Korea at various fronts including sports, economic cooperation, humanitarian (split-family reunion), political and military, and (Kim) not seen as weak by his Generals. Kim will become accepted by other countries if he keeps up the diplomatic/peace gesture with South. The end result of this Trump-Kim dual now ended in Kim's clear victory because Trump helped Kim firmly establish himself domestically as the only leader for decades into the future with no chance for uprising from inside. So, who is the victor and who is the loser? North Korea will thank Trump for advancing their nuke program so fast so much and it wouldn't have been possible without Trump. But Trump will still think his predecessors failed but he didn't in solving North Korea Nuke problem.
Has anyone in the West actually asked Koreans what they want to do with Kim Jung Un? Several of the younger South Koreans I have met support re-unification. I have read where others support talks to move towards reunification.
The West seems to think that sanctions and excommunication from the "Civilized" world is the answer to every problem. If that doesn't seem to work, and it never works, then military action by the West to bring about regime change (new regime installed by the US). We have plenty of proof that a new path needs to be taken. Moon Jae In needs to take the lead and do what is best for Koreans. President Big Button and the rest of the world needs to step back.
Read Korean history and you will see many disasters created by foreign governments for centuries either through occupation or by colonization by an imperial power. Let Koreans chart their own path to the future.
1
Before deciding what to do on the Korean peninsula we should learn from the history.
Let’s remember that one of the bloodiest conflicts in the human past resulted from an assassination of a single politician.
The Great War better known as the WWI broke out over the terrorist attack on the heir to the Habsburg throne.
If everybody stayed calm and focused, it would have been so easy to arrest and bring to the trial a dozen conspirators and a few colonels that armed and trained them.
If we learned this crucial lesson about the WWI in the timely manner, there would be no ongoing wars in Afghanistan and Iraq.
We could have arrested in a little bit larger police action several hundred members of the Al Qaeda by cooperating with the Afghan government in a matter of few weeks.
It was in the best American interest not to get in the war with the Muslim world. It was in the best interest of the Afghans and the Arabs not to end up in the confrontation with America.
Can’t each country finally recognize what wrong moves their politicians and leaders made throughout history?
It’s the hatred that pushed all of us in the bloodsheds. If the people loved each other they would quickly find out the policies in everybody’s best interest.
We should use those principle to find a just and fair solution for the crisis on the Korean Peninsula. For God’s sake, those are the same people eager to live together and peacefully in the united homeland…
The editorial is right: In this messy dispute involving three parties, the only one who is behaving like an adult is President Moon Jae-in of South Korea. The task of easing the tension on the Korean Peninsula, which he has taken upon himself, will be too daunting because, while one of the other two parties behaves like “a child … having a tantrum,” the other one behaves like a paranoid schizophrenic.
Only a paranoid schizophrenic, one with a vulgar vocabulary to boot, would respond to an immature dictator's threat to use his nuclear weapon against his enemy in this manner: “I too have a Nuclear Button, but it is a much bigger & more powerful one than his, and my Button works!”
Thankfully, the South Korean president did not dismiss this as an exchange between two kids crying for attention. The kids, he knew, do possess nuclear weapons. He couldn't rule out the dangerous possibility of their using those weapons to show off.
Mr. Moon has always been for easing the seven-decade-long tensions on the Korean Peninsula through dialogue between North and South. It is heartening to know that, belatedly though, dictator Kim Jong-in of the North has signaled his openness to dialogue. Thanks to Mr. Moon, the dialogue could begin next week. All tensions-easing measures he has been suggesting could be adopted as a result of the dialogue.
Right now, the elephant in the room is Mr. Trump. He owes it to humanity not to tweet anything that may thwart this dialogue?
The entire world history should be comprehensively rewritten to be correctly understood.
Great Britain and Chamberlain did not declare the war on Germany to help either Poland or the Jews but to constrain Germany from ever becoming the most powerful nation in Europe.
London could have financially and economically helped both Poland, the Polish people and the Jews after the WWII but it didn’t.
Why? The declaration of war vas never about the others but self-serving!
Finally, if the WWI broke out today, whom would we blame from today’s perspective?
The Serbian government for orchestrating the assassination of “Vice-President” in the foreign country by organizing a secretive terrorist organization?! When the Habsburg Monarchy wanted to judicially investigate the deadly conspiracy, the Serbian government refused to cooperate so Vienna declared the war but London and Paris supported the villain…
If it happened just now, what side would America blame for the conflict?
That’s why the world history should be rewritten. It used to be presented by the winners. The winners weren’t necessarily the good side in the conflicts but the more powerful…
To finally stop the world wars we should compile the objective history books.
Just think how the American Revolution would have ended if Paris helped London in return for the identical assistance in quelling the rebellions in their own colonies…
Godspeed to South Korea. China will look on approvingly on any deal they can make with the north.
For our part, let’s all pretend NK now has a U.S. city killer ICBM capability, Kim can save face, announce victory and we all can go back to our corners and depend on our deterrent force to do what does best!
Time will tell how the relations between two Koreas
work out. Reaching out to the adversary produces
good results. Anwer Sadat reached out to Israel
and the situation has been quiet on their fronts for
the last 45 years. Nixon reached out to China
resulting in reasonable relations for the benefit of
both countries. It is a better approach than bombast
and threats. There are already too many conflicts, too
many deaths and too many refugees in the world.
We don't need more of it. wish them both good luck.
2
I presume South Korea would have lost their war with the North without outside help? That situation has not changed. What would have happened if they, like South Vietnam + the U.S., had lost? I think, like Vietnam, everyone would be better off. Maybe a failed intervention is better than one that gets left in an eternal standoff. Or even better, no intervention at all.
1
Those of us recklessly invoking Munich, Chamberlain and meek appeasement should understand that every comparison had two sides.
Didn’t exactly Hitler promise to make Germany great and rearmed again, repeatedly claiming that the Germans were the exceptional people destined to rule the world and the other nations, and was notorious for his fierce rhetoric and ability to inflame the masses into the blind obedience?
Finally, what Chamberlain was wrong here?
Anybody who read “Mein Kampf” should have understood that the Hitler’s Nazi regime was craving for the “Lebensraum” in the Ukrainian vast fields, so the invasion of Poland was just a step in that direction…
It could be equally argued that Chamberlain’s sudden change of course and the warmongering foolishness led to the conflict between the Great Britain and Nazi Germany and all the catastrophic suffering and destruction.
The historic lesson is that both Britain and Germany ended the WWII as the losing parties with the terrible losses and horrific havoc. The USA used the mutual self-destruction of the European superpowers to gain the title of the mightiest nation on the Earth.
Using the same analogy it could be easily concluded that the multi-decade-long conflict between America and the Muslim world and mutual destruction will open the field for the rise of the next superpower in the East called China.
The truth is that the bloody wars make the warring parties weaker…
One issue usually ignored in this context, the start of World War II, is how Western powers, at the time of the Munich Agreement, saw Hitler's Germany as protection against the Soviet Union and socialism.
Around and around it goes, and where it stops nobody knows. We have two egomaniacs squared off against one another, and Mr. Moon sitting in the middle in the crosshairs. Kim Jong-un, with the mental capacity of a 12 year old, is pitted against an even less mature Donald Trump in a war of name-calling and threats that could go awry any moment. That leaves South Korea's Moon Jae-in watching these two idiots carry on, while 40 million of his people face death if either miscalculates. These ridiculous activities have no place in the 21st century.
See:
RevolutionOfReason.com
TheRogueRevolutionist.com
The hotter the rhetoric the more paranoid call for self defense, which would mean more defense outlays for South Korea and Japan, who are facing existential threat, the US does not face existential threat. South Korea main source of sophisticated weaponry is the US. It will reduce US trade imbalance with South Korea. Too bad those South Korea find a better solution that is peaceful and cost much less. This is a business failure for US strategy.
The fish did not bite the bait, smart fish or dumb fisherman.
1
What is an existential threat in this context? It is used a lot now. In my ignorance I do not understand it. I used to understand it in the context of Sartre's etre-pour-soi and freedom.
1
Who are the people the NYTs editorial board is referring to as fearful in this comment: "Some fear that as part of any dialogue, South Korea could make too many concessions, like agreeing to end military exercises with the United States or no longer participating in sanctions. Still, dialogue is a risk worth taking." Although couched in more subtle language, the inference in this editorial that South Korea is fundamentally a U.S. client state is much the same as the blatant assertion of this claim by Mark Landler in today's accompanying piece on the North Korea/South Korea opening, As Two Koreas Open Talks, U.S. Watches From the Sidelines.
Neither part of Korea will pay attention to a country that lets itself be ruled by a dotard. That is probably a good thing. Korea can solve its differences without the belligerence of the US. US involvement usually degenerates to invasions or bombing from a distance.
Sometimes the US prolongs a conflict such as when they armed Iraq against Iran and then when that conflict they invaded Iraq. The country is still in chaos after 15 years. Or when they backed the Islamists in Afghanistan against a secular government, and then after that government fell they started fighting the Islamist and that has persisted for 17 years,
Now a pattern seems to be developing now that US foreign policy is incapacitated. Recently Pakistan appears to be standing up to US bullying. They can better resolve their difference with Afghanistan on a bilateral basis. Recently Palestine has resisted being bullied into “peace talks”. They can gain their civil rights issues through international institutions.
That’s all fine and good but North Korea now has nuclear weapons capable of striking the US. Shame on Obama and Hillary for allowing that.
1
Of course, it's Obama's fault. What's new!
between the two of them, they created the common cold as well. everyone knows that.
moral: if you don't like it, it's the fault of that crooked Democrat woman and that illegal Democrat colored boy born in a foreign country.
if you like it, it's the work of God or one of his top shelf appointees like Trump.
How were they supposed to prevent a sovereign nation from developing the very arms we appear to take as “ our god given rights”?
Under Trump we have ceded all Leadership and Power in the rest of the world. We have been knocked off our pedestal of righteousness and morality. We are seen as just bullies. As an American I am very saddened but as a world citizen I understand why. Under this President, we have have been reduced to being just war-hungry, bludgeoning all our allies and enemies alike. If there is peace between the two Koreas with diplomacy, more power to them. Even if one of them has been a threatening Leader with nukes. Threatening because of us!
The very presence of US troops in south Korea is the root cause of the problem. Kim threatens USA because USA threatens North Korea. If US had left North Korea , both Koreas would have signed some kind of a peace treaty. As there is no territorial dispute between these two countries, they would have lived peacefully side by side, one country being a democracy and other a dictatorship. So what harm is there to the US if North Korea is a dictatorship. They have no qualms dealing with China, Vietnam, Saudi Arabia, Egypt and other countries that have monarchy, dictatorship and communists government, but for some reason North Korea and Cuba should not have communist government. If USA had left South Korea long back, I am sure North Korea would not have developed Nuclear arms.
4
Yes, there is reason to be wary of Mr. Kim's intentions. But Mr. Moon is doing the right thing, opening up a conversation with, although an adversary, a fellow Korean, a cultural brother. How many times has history shown us that diplomacy, negotiation, and, yes, compromise from both sides works?
At this point, both China and the US should and must encourage and enable peaceful progress. And this is where we fail as a country, unprecedented in recent history. At the helm, we have Kim's counterpart, an equally bombastic, unstable, egomaniac so to speak...Donald Trump. How stupid, how ignorant, how childish, how bullish, to provoke this North Korean dictator by a tweet reminding him that Trump's "button" is bigger and more powerful than Kim's.
This president is a clear and present danger, to use a well-used description, not only to us, the citizens of the US, but also to the world at large. This threatening foolishness must stop. But by whom - Congress, perhaps? - is anyone's guess.
12
Good lord, this is why the GOP is the party of foreign policy.
Our overarching goal, from the beginning and even when Obama was President, has been to get Kim to the negotiating table and to reduce his saber rattling, and now it’s finally happening. And look at how the left responds! As if things have worsened!
Trump applied pressure to China to pressure the DPRK, he put all military options on the table, and he ratcheted up sanctions. Furthermore, he kept all of this in the limelight by goading and drawing attention to Kim in a pretty unrelenting manner, via tweets and at the UN via Haley.
Since Kim is in fact a rational actor which has been an underlying assumption of Trump, McMaster and Tillerson, all of this pressure is starting to pay a dividend.
He’s coming to the negotiating table, and the provocations will subside.
This is a win, for all of us. Will this sink in on the left? And will folks on the left be able to spin the result to their favor and our nation’s disfavor? This is surely an attempt, albeit a pretty weak one.
But my guess is that Trump’s victory on this will go down the memory hole. My guess is that telling us we didn’t just get a big tax break, and telling us that the DOW hitting a new record today (25,000, baby!) is bad, not good, will be the new priorities for the always wrong elites on the left.
1
My goodness, have you drank the kool -aid. You give trump far, far too much credit. And, you will see soon enough that the tax cut was a multi generational give away ( at your expense, bubba...) to his mega rich peers.
A South Korean concession of "agreeing to end military exercises with the United States or no longer participating in sanctions," or both, would be well worth trying if accompanied by corresponding concessions from the North which will never be accomplished by exchanging juvenile insults. The status quo of belligerent threats, military posturing and nuclear build-up increases the odds for unspeakable, unmanageable catastrophe, leading nowhere constructive.
We know three things: One, prior agreements with North Korea have tended to unravel; Two, puerile posturing is a dead-end for diplomatic achievement. Three, nuclear war is unmitigated human disaster. Number Three is by far the worst.
1
If only we had as wise and calm a voice as that of Mr. Moon of South Korea. Not only north of the DMZ but in Washington as well. He cannot bring peace - or at least avoid catastrophe - all by himself but thank heaven someone is trying. We can't expect the reckless fool in the WH to seize this golden opportunity but our saner leaders, both Democrat and Republican, should. That's our only hope.
Negotiating with a megalomaniac is futile: negotiations between two of them are doubly futile.
1
Everyone knocks Trump for his incompetence, but where was all the other great talent of past Presidents and Democrats in both houses. Why were the great problems of the world not solved back then? Maybe its not as easy as electing the person that you personally admire to the White House. The problems of the world are always much greater then 1 man or woman in the office of president. People here that rant and rave about Trump being in office thinking that he is hurting the great USA so much are ridiculous. Things do not change that much just by the President in office! Change is always greater than one person, and it is supposed to be. That is why we do not live in a dictatorship. That is the real difference.
There is a reason everyone knocks trump for his incompetence. It is simple. He is incompetent.
I've seen this movie before. Donald plays Baby LeRoy and the world plays W.C. Fields: "Go away kid, you bother me."
So long as these 2 clowns just play at insulting each other's man parts, no harm, no foul.
But, when Trump inevitably builds his case for war, attempting to elevate his status from Chief Clown to Commander-in-Chief, will the Times Ed. Board et al, again approve insider news coups, all from "highly placed administrative sources", supporting more war?
Its easy to "resist" a Clown, but we are just one terrorist event away from "blood in the water".
Will we all just go along to get along, afraid to resist the rally around the flag mob mentality? "They must hate America" will be heard again.
Since the first Korean War 68 years ago, no presidential war plan has ever been subjected to genuine critical analysis by congress or the media before the shooting was tacitly approved.
I'm praying for a first, but I fear more hysteria, body bags and trillions lost.
Again.
Be careful. Moon's rhetoric is different from Moon's act.
People only request negotiations when their position has worsened or they see it worsening in the near future.
Tighter sanctions, China getting onboard and Trump's bellicosity has proved effective.
7
Or has Kim accomplisheded what his goal was. A nuclear state that can no longer be pressuredor threatened by a super power. They are after all Koreans, they are smart and industrius just like their brethen. If we want a safer more peaceful world the Koreans talking would be a good step in the right direection. And perhaps as in we Americans will realize what people in conflict can accomplish on their own. We all know what has been accomplished in the past fifty years between the Israelis and the Palestinoians under the our leadership - let's see what develops when those actually impacted by the conflict take charge of reducing tensions.
1
I can state how surprised i am to read from none other than the editorial board's praise of the newly elected president of the South Korea for his political overture to North Korea.
That's because:
1) He was in fact elected on this main issue, along other prominent 3 or 4
2) This very editorial board concluded he was too dovish, after vetting his electoral program, and encouraged the other candidate, who was more in line with an ongoing militaristic showing-off type of confrontation, which one could argue had the effect of accelerating the whole north korean effort of getting an interncontinental ballistic missile.
1
Kim is smarter than we thought and administers the ultimate putdown -- he elbows the dotard out of the way and seeks one-on-one talks with SK, and SK accepts without even consulting the US. Nothing represents better how the US's standing has fallen since Trump than this very incident.
2
The US is finally tightening the screws on SANCTIONS, and they are for the first time REALLY starting to bite. Things are just getting started. Just see how fast China stops ignoring the sanctions if the US hurts them on trade, and they WILL. This is really what's happening now, not the tweets that have everyone up in arms.
1
Let us all hope that the Korean's can solve their own problems.
The Korean War that the US engaged in was a proxy, that had very little to do with the Korean people.
If some external blowhard and some foreign minions do not blow the whole thing up in the meantime, my best wishes to the people of the Korean peninsula.
You have all had a hard 100 years. May you all be reunited with lost family members, and use the good skills that you have acquired in various ways for the benefit of you all.
People on the United States who cry "appeasement" from the comfort of being several thousand miles away from Korea, are not thinking about the safety of people who live just next door to the threat. What is the alternative to peace talks? Preemptive war? How did that work for the world in Iraq?
North Korea is already a nuclear power. The bull roar about what the United States will or will not allow fails to recognize this fact. South Korea is wise to talk with North Korea and exercise strategic patience. We ALL need to ignore Trump's ignorance until We the People elect a Congress controlled by the Democrats in order to put a check on the crazy coming from the White House.
It is sadly ironic this most important story which affects tens of millions of people only rates a single article and a lone editorial in this newspaper while the transparently staged theatrics from Donald Trump and Steve Bannon are the lead story with multiple articles and “analysis” pieces.
How about it New York Times, there has to be more to this story than the reopening of a hotline between North and Sputh Korea.
1
A responsible adult needs to walk on to the "playground" and tell these two blowhard bullies to take a time out or else no cake and ice cream for either one.
Now we only have one tantrum throwing child to deal with.
Which child are you talking about, the US or north Korea?
I've been very surprised by the way the American media has covered this recent development
The narrative they have nearly unanimously settled on is that South Korea is diffusing the tension and being responsible and Kim is shrewdly seizing an opportunity to divide South Korea and the USA.
The goal for the United States, Japan, South Korea and China has been to get Kim to the negotiating table.
The question was how?
It became clear that the US needed to do three things:
1. Get China to add more pressure (check)
2. Ratchet up the sanctions so Kim feels significant pain (check)
3. Make Kim believe the US/Trump was actually willing to attack (check).
Less than a year into his presidency and Trump and his team have gotten Kim to offer to negotiate.
This should be viewed as a significant foreign policy accomplishment.
3
The stated goal was to get N Korea to forget its nuclear ambitions, not to come to negotiate. They have nothing that we want except to disarm their nuke program.
So, what is the incentive for an athlete from North Korea to return to the North? I assume they will have people watching them the whole time, but wouldn't it be a good time for them to try to leave?
I would bet that their families, 10 generations deep, are kinda “ hostage”.
The world is turning away from us, and the world should turn away from us. We are in complete disarray.
Given that the United States has put a poorly, if at all, qualified and ineffective individual in the position of leadership of this country, I am at a loss to understand why the United States should be allowed to take the lead in the negotiation process between North and South Korea. At one time, when American voters took the role of electing a leader seriously, this would have been prudent. However, we have blundered badly by saddling our nation—and, consequently, the world—with a leader whose ego is entirely too large to consider the advice of wiser counsel and for whom diplomacy is antithetical to problem-solving. To have him involved in working on a strategy to bring forward a solution would be to assure failure from the start.
Carlin and Wit have determined that it is reasonable to move forward with negotiations. We should follow their advice, but our country should not be at the forefront of the process. We relinquished that right when we installed a hot-head with neither a history of, nor current proof of, a desire to act in the best interests of others into the powerful position of US President.
If any organization is to oversee this process, it should probably be the United Nations. Trump is a major disruption to governing our country. We can’t let him get involved in a process involving countries that are on far shakier ground. We should have known better to put him in charge here; let's not give him any more power.
2
Oh, please! The US is currently irrelevant to the dialogue in the Korean peninsula. This self-aggrandizing posture that the US must lead negotiations is a broken record, and increasingly irrelevant as the rest of the world had come to recognize. US interference has led to more problems, the only success being the restoration of Western Europe after the war. Everything else the US had touched has been a disaster. It's time we developed some much needed humility.
5
Why are we still in South Korea? 60 years ago we believed we were in danger of attack by the forces of Soviet/Maoist communism. The Soviets are gone. Mao is long gone. Communism has faded out. China is now a sometime ally in our stance against North Korea. Russia is struggling for its economic survival. Just as in Vietnam exiting becomes the problem. How do we now get out? I hope diplomatic economists will replace the purveyors of death and destruction.
2
Un had offered to freeze his program and negotiate bit his caveat was that we stop military exercises on his border. His offer was immediately rejected. Trump has laid down about 4 red lines for him and he has blown threw each one. He feels good about his program and now thinks he can talk to South Korea. Our adolescent leader will just continue to have tantrums.
As a Korean, I know the important thing is that South Korea has a direct hotline with North Korea after almost two year severance, which I hope might ease the tension, if any, in Korean Peninsula. Mr. Moon did well.
3
The basic problem with democracy is that the people unreasonably idolize it as some miraculous cure to everything. We treat it as the modern-day oil snake.
Allegedly and supposedly, democracy can fix anything and everything.
Not really, not at all! All our problems are multi-decade long.
The Cold War with Russia has been raging since 1945, the Korean War is unsolved since 1953, the Israeli-Palestinian war and by extension the conflict with the Muslim world since 1948, the ever-rising national debt since 1981, the chronic trade deficits since the late 90’s, and the wars in Afghanistan and Iraq since 2001…
The democracy has been unable to solve any of those chronic crises.
Why?
Democracy is dramatically and radically changing the social course every couple or four years by electing into the power the opposing world views.
It means democracy is meticulously dismantling whatever it constructed over the previous period. Whatever the laws we enact today will be dismissed by the new government once they grab the power while ignoring all those chronic problems that plagued us for decades and leaving them for the next administration to solve?!
Democracy has delivered the new crop of leaders looking for the quick looting of the social resources while ignoring all those structural problems.
Kim Yong Un and the Korean crisis have just spotlighted those chronic structural problems. Those should have been solved long before Kim and Trump ever gained the power…
Thanks to the ineptitude of prior administrations including 8 years of "Strategic Patience" the DPRNK has achieved its goal. It now has the weaponry in place to threaten SK and inflict massive casualties if they don't capitulate. They have now achieved weaponry which can reach the US heartland which they believe will hold the US at bay while they have their way on the peninsular and in the region. They are a threat not only to SK and the US but every other country in the Far East including Japan, China, the Philippines, Taiwan and others.
As always NK has feigned a willingness to negotiate when it held a winning hand only to undercut any agreement. Why is there any reason to believe that NK give up anything its worked to achieve? There is none and while the world can repeat the same drill pursued by Obama and others expecting a different outcome, we all know what psychiatrists call that mental illness.
2
The DPRNK, as you put it, achieved its goal of nuclearization under the George W. Bush administration, which is also accountable for 1+ million lives lost in a misguided war in Iraq.
So, now that you've established that nothing yet has worked to address this problem, what do you suggest besides your fruitless bashing of Obama?
No one exactly knows what Kim Jeung Un has in his mind, seeing his dialogue proposal to South Korea. But what I can say clearly is that he is now being pressed economically as the result of the sanctions headed by the Unisted States. Historically North Koea regime used to send an olive branch when they were in disadvantageous situations. I don't believe the issue of nuclear weapons and ballistic missiles of North Korea can be dealt with through dialogue. Why ? Kim Jeung Un himself announced many times he will never give up the nuclear weapons. Therefore, It is my opinion that the dialogue this time should be confined to the participation of North Korea's Olympic teams in Pyong Chang Winter Olympics. We were too often deceived by the Kim's family. South Korea government should be more cautious to cope with the proposal. Instead the government looks excited with the proposal itself. That's dangerous and unwise. Regardless of the dialogue propsal the global economic sanctions keep going until the North comes to the table with the issue of the nuclear weapons' abandment
1
much ado about very little. They are merely re-establishing the communication line that they have had all along with the North. What possible goal do people think the dictator of North Korea has other than propping himself up and trying to send out misinformation? I am astounded that many readers would rather bash the American government than the North Korean dictatorship. I can only hope that most of the off-the-wall comments are by fake posters pretending to be Americans.
1
Anyone who thinks dialogue will accomplish anything should go see "The Darkest Hour" and watch Winston Churchill rail against his cabinet about the folly of trying to do deals with a dictator. We should assume that Kim will violate any agreement, as the North Korean regime has done repeatedly in the past. That also applies to Putin.
1
South Korea is following Teddy Roosevelt's advice to "speak softly, but carry a big stick." While they are open to dialogue, at the same time they are interdicting ships illegally carrying oil to the North.
Continue the dialogue, but don't ease up on sanctions.
1
Watch the dotard in chief tweet something rude or insulting and try to stop this first step toward sanity.
In an attempt to try to bring the spotlight back where he believes it clearly belongs, on him, only him.
It's well past time the serious discussion about taking grandpa's car keys away should have begun.
I understand they have some outstanding convalescent facilities on the Black Sea.
American commentary is incredibly ill-informed and antiquated, still mired in stereotypes of the Cold War--"hermit" and "rogue" invariably appear. In fact, DPRK has been undergoing significant internal changes over the last 10-15 years, including incremental marketization and consumerization. Self-important assumptions about "sanctions" ignore the core principle of autarky, long a weapon to ensure economic sovereignty and to marginalize Western (mainly American) economic blackmail.
Trump's monumental incompetence actually has an upside: "Make America Hated Again" allows regional actors to operate rationally and to ignore the dictates from Washington. The United States, with its monster military budget (50% of what the entire globe spends), is the problem, not the solution.
The U.S. cannot and should not rule the world; it can only ruin it.
3
The rest of the world, even the few nations who remain our allies, are beginning to learn that the best way to conduct their foreign policy is to ignore Trump and go their own way. It's certainly good policy on a nuclear-armed Korean peninsula. Now if only the adult day care center in the White House can get the truculent child to shup up.
1
Fundamentally this is not our business, but the business of the Korean people, on both sides of the border between North and South.
As has often been observed, we have appointed ourselves the World’s Policeman, ready to intervene in Korean affairs, European affairs (if we aren’t ready to intervene, what are all those thousands of American troops doing there?), Middle Eastern affairs. Not surprisingly, not all the “beneficiaries” of our meddling are grateful. Also not grateful are those Americans at home who could use new infrastructure, support for the needy and attention to our very real problems here.
It is certainly conceivable that the US might become involved in a major war if our vital national interests were threatened. I just don’t see the status of the Korean Peninsula as relevant to our vital national interests.
10
How could it not be our business? Kim threatens the US and its allies with nuclear tipped missiles and it's not our business? I can't understand how someone can think that.
The worst national security threat to America is our own president with the nuclear button on his desk that is larger than the size of his intellectual power.
Those who know how to govern don’t tweet.
Those who obsessively tweet usually stick to the things they are doing the best – attempting to solve the world problems in 140 characters or less.
Where is that kind of addiction stemming from? If you have extremely volatile attention span, then you can master those short tweets without any problem.
Of course, Mr. Trump is not the problem. He is just a symptom of it. If there were no structural problems in America, he wouldn’t be sitting in the Oval Office…
What would the smart president do? He or she would ask how come that any world superpower has been incapable of reaching the peace treaty over the last 65 years. That intellectual laziness and incompetence are the sure signs of the critical structural problems.
North Korea is the best thing that ever happened to America. It serves as the mirror to us. It exposes all our faults. If the other side is equally incompetent like us, then there is no solution.
North Korea teaches us that we are incapable of abandoning the wrong course once we stray onto it.
It indicates that we will be incapable of abandoning the deficit spending and piling up the national debt over the next 65 years or till we go bankrupt, whatever comes first…
31
The NYT editorial board itself if being unrealistically partisan. To be sure, we should celebrate that North Korea and South Korea are talking. But are you quite sure that North Korea would talk without the threats from Trump? And some pressure from Xi, also caused by Trump?
You are taking it for granted that Trump is acting like an idiot. But in reality, Trump may or may not be an idiot, but his policy seems rational in the face of a difficult situation created by the inaction of previous presidents.
8
Long live the king! Long live Trump!
If I understood you correctly, the credit for whatever good happens goes to Trump. The blame whatever bad happens goes to the predecessors and everybody else.
That’s the very definition of the false idols…
Nothing kills more people than appeasement.
2
I don't blame the South Koreans. The carrot haired maniac plans to offer Seoul as the sacrificial lamb in nuclear war, and they see through his madness. Eventually they in turn will kick the American bases out
4
Kim may very well be trying to drive a wedge between the US and South Korea, but wedge driving is not difficult under our current electoral college winner. Theresa May did not try to drive a wedge of influence between the US and the US - Trump did. Merkle did not try to drive a wedge between Germany and the US - Trump did. It wasn't immigrants to the US who decided to drive a wedge between themselves and the rest of the American population - Trump did. It wasn't Judge Gonzalo Curiel who drove a wedge between the Mexican people and other Americans - that was Trump, too. Many of us can think of dozens of more instances where this divisive, bigoted Trump has driven a wedge between basic freedoms and a life of liberty and prosperity for all.
42
classic divide and conquer
Chamberlain vs Neville.
Trump is a petulant goofball, but still...don’t forget history, as it tends to repeat itself..
1
Isn't it time to shut down twitter as a threat to national security? I know it is difficult if not impossible to put the toothpaste back in the tube, but certain twits should simply no longer be able to tweet. It is a threat to hundreds of thousands if not millions of lives. We need to bring sanity back to the WH.
6
There is something intangible about our common view on North Korea. We seem to believe that their leaders want to destroy the United States with nuclear weapons just for the joy of it. We also seem to think that they want to conquer South Korea and bomb Japan among other vicious things. To make that plausible we must assume that those leaders are suicidal psychopaths with a wish to have their country pulverized.
If we instead assign North Korean leaders in the last half a century a minimum of intelligence there is a much more plausible picture. Almost seventy years after the war the United States still has a large military contingent in the South, performing military exercises together with South Korea aimed at the North, including simulated nuclear attacks.
Threats of violence against North Korea by US leaders have been open and unambiguous. It seems that a rational way for the North to defend against these threats, coming from an overwhelming power, is to develop nuclear weapons as a deterrent. And the only rational way to deal with the situation is by talks aiming at reduced threats by both sides.
What we should bother about is what the West's aggression is aiming at. What kind of North Korean surrender are we looking for? And what risks for a devastating war are we prepared to take?
If we think their political system is a disaster which give them miserable lives, why don't we just leave them to rot by themselves?
50
The premise of your statement is false. North Korea is not, as you seem to believe, the victim of US-South Korean aggression. Rather, it's the aggressor. North Korea claims that it is the legitimate sovereign of the entire Korean peninsula and thus has the right to use force to achieve reunification. Its leaders devote much of their wealth to building up a massive military their bankrupt state can ill afford, and propagate a cult of hate against outsiders, including South Korea's leadership.
Also, as is undeniable, US troops are in South Korea at the invitation of the South Korean government. It's rather easy to see why they want them there.
1
@Grouch
Let's repeat: if North Korea as much as load a missile with a nuclear warhead the whole country would instantly be turned into radioactive dust. Only if Kim and his generals are complete lunatics anything like that would happen. Nothing to bet on.
Everything indicates that their nukes are meant as a deterrent, not to be used (before Armageddon). A deterrent is thus a defensive weapon. North Korea has no latitude whatsoever to really perform military aggression, they would simply be obliterated.
As for the US troops, there are quite widespread popular opposition to them since the Gwangju massacre (which US approved of) and onward.
1
Excellent comment. Sometimes y wonder why so many people can believe the caricature the U.S. and other Western media presents of North Korea. It is as if they were not human but extra terrestrial.
2
Ridiculous that it took childish bombast from Trump and Kim to bring these countries to the table. Certainly decades of reasonable mature intelligent diplomacy did no good. What is wrong with the world that these displays were the tipping point?
North Korea is on notice. Trump has the nuclear codes and he will launch if provoked. Tread lightly rocket man. Obama out. Trump not bluffing. Stay tuned.
1
I'd like to apologise to the people of South Korea for the bumbling fool of a president my fellow citizens put in office. You are the hostages that North Korea holds in this childish game of chicken played by Trump and Kim. I would be worried too if my Fate was in the hands of Trump and Kim. I hope your President has success in turning down the volume and the craziness of the last year. Lord knows this is beyond the capabilities of our president.
4
There is no North nor South Korea. There is only one ethnic sectarian historical Korea divided by a socioeconomic political educational civil war cease fire armistice line. Backed up by their respective foreign power allies. Koreans can turn down the volume and control their future if the outside agitators on both sides stay out.
But comparing an ignorant, immature, incompetent, intemperate and insecure 71 year old man like Donald J. Trump to either Mr. Kim or Mr. Moon or to an infant, baby or child is simply ridiculously inaccurate and insulting to any juvenile.
That Trump is a lazy bigoted misogynist is no secret. Trump has been overtly corrupt, cowardly, dishonorable and unpatriotic. Trump has been open in his bloviating bullying buffoonery. Trump has been clear about his motivation for being President of the United States by hiding his personal and family income tax returns and business records.
The problem is that Trump is the only President that we have thanks to the votes of 63 million Americans plus Vladimir Putin, Benjamin Netanyahu, James Comey and Julian Assange who knew who he was.
5
Kim is a character out of "1984" but he is not stupid. It doesn't take experts to understand that Kim's interest in discussions with South Korea is "serious." Of course it is. Kim is a bully, and he's now been bullied by the Bully of Bullies. But he wants a couple of things. First, he wants to send his athletes to the Olympics. Second, he needs money. So what must he do? Make nice, for a while, with South Korea.
I fully expect to see North Korean athletes at the Olympics. President Moon would be thrilled with that result, and it won't hurt anybody if it happens. Will it bring Peace In Our Time? No way. Anyone who thinks the North and South will be holding hands and singing Kumbaya after the Olympics are over has another think coming.
As for the money Kim needs, well, there's not a whole lot President Moon can do about that. He doesn't control whether the sanctions are lifted or not. What he could do is reopen the joint factory near Panmunjeon that former President Park closed 2 years ago, which would give the North a wee bit of much-needed cash.
But with respect to North Korea's nuclear arsenal, Kim will do everything in his power to make sure it grows and grows. He will never give it up even if his people starve to death in the process. That arsenal forces the world to pay attention to Kim, and it is his ultimate bargaining chip.
17
That arsenal is North Korea's guarantee against an attack by the world's bully.
Improving relations with NK would be important to the safety of South Korea. Peace, of course, would not be good for the U.S. military industry.
Lots of worries, but the two parties at least are talking--not taunting and tweeting. Let's see what happens. Who knows maybe, just maybe, there's a real deal like trade in response to a denuclearized Korean peninsula along with a mutual non-aggression pact guaranteed by China and Russia and, if he's not too busy measuring the size of his "button" our own dealmaker-in-chief.
It is a blessing in disguise. Koreans need to sort out their problems themselves. No interference from any THIRD PARTY. Koreans destiny should be in their hands.
2
By all appearances, Kim opened the "hot line" only in an attempt to get participation in the Olympics.
1
Hey, NYT Editorial Board, I have a New Year's resolution idea for you - RELAX. The world is not going to end because Trump tweeted something that you found uncouth. If you've ever talked to someone knowledgeable on North Korean affairs, you would know that Trump and KJU are both playing games and that we're certainly not going to strike first, and KJU won't strike first either. It's a bunch of wannabe tough guys talking smack. If you're going to react this way every time Trump tweets something unsavory you're going to be in for a very long year.
2
I imagine that most world leaders realize that Trump will resign when
Mueller finds the case strong enough for impeachment. What sane
world leader do you suppose could take him seriously...
The sooner the leaders of our Congress state this FACT....that Trump
is mentally unbalanced; use the 25th Amendment : Section 4 of the
US Constitution...to get him out of office...then the sooner the entire
world will relax....
3
The two Koreas now have much to agree upon as a way of breaking the ice.
Donald Trump is mad and would incinerate them both to stay out of jail is an area of agreement.
Neither side would benefit from a war.
Our President's instability may actually incubate a necessary peace, if they can keep his hands off the button.
1
Obviously the US has become a dangerously inept and incendiary ally. With friends like us, enemies see an opening.
Trump isn’t making America Great. He’s making America dispensable.
This is probably wishful thinking but It would be a great moment to see the two Koreas sign a peace treaty with Trump’s bombast blowing in the wind.
But, of course, Trump will take all the credit. He’s our Greatest and Mightiest Ruler. Not!
1
Sabre rattling serves the political interests of both Kim and Trump. Both are using fear-mongering to divert attention away from their domestic failures.
Additionally, the armaments industries must be continually fed whether the nation is at war or not, but the USA has sustained a string of wars to feed that war machine with lucrative contracts throughout its history. The North Korean is just a detail in the larger picture of Perpetual War.
1
The Korean war started in 1950 when the US underestimated North Korea and removed troops from South Korea.
Do you seriously think that the Kim Dynasty is interested in a peaceful and prosperous Korea? No, they are trying to divide the US from its allies and make the US and South Korea less prepared.
President Trump is completely correct in tightening sanctions and no acquiescing. Have we forgotten the plight of the North Koreans themselves and the international crimes committed by Kim?
"The only way to know that is to test it, with the United States leading the way on a comprehensive strategy integrating sanctions, prudent statements and negotiations."
With Trump and his administration?
This will never happen in a million years.
It would require thinking adults, and we don't have any in the White House.
2
'...North Korea’s interest in discussions with South Korea is serious. The only way to know that is to test it, with the United States leading the way...'
NK is almost certainly interested in negotiations, but from a position of strength, and probably not in any meaningful way with the US under Trump's leadership. Trump has demonstrated his unreliability both as an ally and as a negotiating party. He's highly uninformed, temperamental, and easily provoked or placated. His words or promises mean nothing, and no one should trust him. Not NK, SK, China, or the American people. Not when his ego and personal gratification will be the driving force behind his actions.
NK's long term interest is reunification of the peninsula under KJU's dictatorial leadership. To that end he'll need to drive a wedge between SK and the US. Trump, with his threat of preemptive war, is more liability than reliable partner. SK will gladly engage with NK to tamp down tensions, but the North will drive a hard bargain, requiring concessions on sanctions and military exercises plus protection payments for good behavior.
SK understands the threat posed by NK and has needed the US as a guarantor of the peace. But the election of Donald Trump has cast a pall over world affairs wherever we operate. All our former allies are rethinking their strategic positions, and in the western Pacific the tide may turn noticeably towards the Chinese.
That's no way to make America great again.
1
For sure, talk. But the objectives of talks need be clear at the get go. And so far one crucial objective is not at all clear.
Like most analytical articles about dealing with NK WMDs, this one fails to address exactly how to block Kim's regime clandestinely selling its WMDs to the abundant supply of Kim wannabes and terrorist groups wanting to buy them and use them. Yet containment and neutralization of exactly this threat is essential to prevent WMD proliferation and war.
So after everybody is talking, then what? Exactly what effective concrete measures can and should the US, SK, Japan, China, Russia, and the rest of the international community negotiate with NK that will actually stop NK selling WMDs to the creeps who will use them against us?
1
What is it all about ?
As simply put as possible it all started with an American denunciation of some others actions ,which do not accept America’s old , perennial declared desire to dominate the world , with a made up, PR friendly, presumed opposition of other nations endeavors to acquire modern technology including nuclear technology.
Thence Iran and North Korea unwillingness to tow the line led to an American attitude and declarations under the false premise of USA intent to reduce nuclear proliferation to stand for a real American desire to limit others’ access to nuclear technology that America plans to keep as an American monopoly !
When Pakistan was not openly hostile to the USA started its own, prescient, project of acquiring nuclear technology none of that false presumption was voiced by America!
I agree will everythng in this editorial except the last sentence. any further talks to deescalate tension on the Korean Peninsula should be tri lateral after the 2 Koreas come up with a formula for the content of discussions.
The editorial and many of the comments assume the reality of a US "stance" on North Korea, as if we had one. Trump's words don't constitute a "stance." There is no US "stance" at the moment. What Trumps says about Kim is not the product of any informed, calibrated strategy on his part. It's "Trump being Trump," as his Republican backers say in dismissing the prospect of doing anything about him. Or is the point really that Trump is a marionette, his strings being pulled by some savvy cadre of real adults behind the scenes? That's certainly reassuring, isn't it? The only thing that's clear to me is this: If Trump starts a nuclear war with North Korea, the Republican Party will be guilty of millions of counts of involuntary manslaughter for recklessly doing nothing to remove an ignorant, incompetent, and extraordinarily dangerous Donald Trump from the Oval Office.
1
Kim and his predecessors have been at this far longer than Trump or Moon. If the U.S. attacks North Korea, massive numbers of North Korean people will be killed as will a huge number of South Koreans as well as thousands of Americans.. And if, in desperation, the North uses it's nuclear weapons, it will be, using Trump's words, a disaster. That is the alternative to letting the North keep its weapons and negotiating with them. So do people see a devastating, highly likely nuclear, war as an inevitability that we just need to "get out of the way" so we can move on? Or do we try every conceivable means to avoid that, even if we come away looking a bit less like a winner? Are the lives of perhaps millions worth that? Or is the most important thing to avoid bruising Trump's ego? Most would accept that trade-off. Trump and his followers will not. For he may have the bigger button and the bigger hands. But he clearly doesn't have a bigger heart and soul.
I can't believe some of the star gazers on this thread think that Trump is the reason why Kim wants to talk to the south. I'd say the recent dialogue between South Korea and China and some back channel talks might have had something to do with it. How about reading and listening to other news organizations to find out what's going on on the world instead of believing how big your buttons are.
1
It's time to let the two Korea's settle their differences themselves. Trump"s bombast may actually be a positive factor.
1
Who's afraid of Donald Trump? Most certainly not Kim Jong Un. Then why the sudden thawing of the Cold War polemics? North Korea is collapsing from within. Kim Jong Un is afraid of what's coming next after the North regime's collapse. Even its highest social class, the military and its soldiers, have lost all hope and are abandoning ship, as evidenced by the recent dramatic cross-border escapes into the South by the highly trusted (and vetted--they don't just send any soldier to patrol the border; only the most loyal ones get to do it) border patrol guards of the North. Since Kim has killed off its highest ranking officers, who can he trust--or who has a known track record of predictability--to run his military? The answer is not easily fathomable--for Kim or for anyone. More so than Trump and his comical "tough talk" it is Kim's instincts for his own survival that is most likely the impetus for the gesture of reconciliation. As Kim Jong Un is losing his tight grip of control on the now brittle social order founded on the sorely outdated "cult of personality" rhetoric of his grandfather created over half a century ago, it would be foolish indeed for South Korea and Moon Jae In to facilitate an opening for Kim Jong Un to crawl out from his uncomfortable situation squeezed in between the proverbial rock and a hard place. Just stand tough, lock down all the escape hatches, and watch it all collapse on top of him.
13
China won't let the Kim regime completely collapse, they don't want a humanitarian crisis on their border and they certainly don't want a Korean peninsula dominated by America.
1
It's frightening to see some readers praising Trump as the great facilitator of a possible dialogue between North and South Korea. What is really happening, of course, is something analysts have been predicting for a while: the USA is going to be sidelined more and more often in the global order, as an increasing number of nations will realize that inviting us to mediate whatever contentious issue would be -- in the very least -- a waste of time.
Neither negotiations nor sanctions will force the North Koreans to de-nuclearize. But they don't need to demonstrate the ability to hit the US with a warhead in order to arrive at a "victory" which is actually more of a face saving freeze in the current situation. Kim's latest claim is an indication that this might be enough for them. Just claim you have the full capability and keep working without long range missile tests or above ground nuclear tests. That way, they'll never know for sure what capability they really have, nor will we know. Trump, for all the noise he and his surrogates are making, will accept this, and boast (with some justifications) that he stopped the North Koreans
In a funny way, Trump is changing the dynamic of the US leading or shall I say interfering with the world. It probably isn't a bad approach to have local regions handle their own affairs, and in taking a me first and only me attitude more of this will happen. Perhaps PAX AMERICA is already over?
The danger of this is, of course, the simple fact that as small storms brew around the world and grow larger, we will have less influence or impact where it might have been helpful for us to assist. China and EU are already preparing to supplant us as they see fit,
My father fought in the Korean war before I was born and I'm now Social Security age. That's a long time for the U.S. to show that it's solutions are ineffective. Unfortunately, now we have a 'leader' who wants to ignite a war rather than find a resolution. It's time for the U.S. to stop leading the way and let the two Koreas engage in direct negotiation, while their allies continue support in myriad ways. War is not the answer, nor is who's button is bigger.
1
No way any of this necessary and potentially fruitful interaction between North and South happens without the most recent sanctions. These sanctions surely would not have happened without a big US push. Let's give credit where credit is due.
1
Seems that some would prefer Neville Chamberlain. Remember how well that worked out?
We have been appeasing NK and their nuclear program since Bill Clinton. The problem was not ben resolved, the can was merely kicked down the road. That strategy did not serve us very well, and the problem has only snowballed. Time for a different tact.
I know this is a simplistic representation of the what's happening here but I'd like to think that there's a bit of "good cop, bad cop" going on here. The POTUS emulates the bad one, Mr. Moon takes the good role. I doubt it's been thought through in that fashion, much less coordinated as such, but none the less it appears to be working out that way. So great, they're setting up to talk. This can't be considered a bad thing. Now...what the U.S. needs to do, as the bad "tiger" in the room, is leave it. Let the two neighbors set about working things out. It's their home turf, after all. They know what's best for them both better than we (or China) do.
Additionally, if I was Mr. Moon, in the privacy of that room I'd be saying something to the effect..."Good...we're alone...can we talk? See my patron? You realize he's crazy, right? So can we come to mutually agreeable terms here before things get out of hand? Because I cannot guarantee where this goes should he feel he's got to come back into this room!"
Like I said; good cop, bad cop. Let's see what happens next.
John~
American Net'Zen
There is only one person who behaves in a rational way among the six leaders concerned with North Korea. Whether Xi and Putin want to rein in Kim in a way that pleases the US is not clear and Abe (of Japan) flatteringly follows Trump as if nothing else matters. Kim and Trump verbally compete for center world stage; and they have the ability at least to usher Armageddon into the Far East. (I can understand why Kim does because he is negligible even with missiles and nuclear bombs. But why Trump?) I think we should at least help Moon negotiate with Kim; do not obstruct him!
Finally, South Korea is behaving like a sovereign country. They need to control their destiny. Trump does not act on the South Korea's interest. Solving the Koreas' problem is not Trump's priority. The US does not even have an ambassador in South Korea almost a year after the inauguration!
1
There is very little said about China in this situation. Seems they are being very quiet and yet the outcome will potentially effect them greatly. What are they up to ???
Clearly the best way to manage the recent Korean tension is for both Korean governments to completely ignore the United States, and deal with the matter directly. Tuning out Trump is the best solution for every problem.
1
I agree that the only way to know whether North Korea is serious about discussions with South Korea is to test it with the U.S. leading the way.
But I fear that a puerile and egocentric Trump will try to put the kibosh on the plan because he had nothing to do with it. He wouldn't be able to bask in the glory of success or even partial success.
This editorial is a very nice tactical view of the Korean situation that ignores Kim's strategic objectives; a Korea absent US power, which will please China and ensure his survival if not dominance on the peninsula.
How does this end? America will lose interest because with each year you have less skin in the game and an increasing threat cost (LA for Tokyo). Or put another way, they live there and you don't (Vietnam? Hello?).
1
"the United States, which defended South Korea in the Korean War and has nearly 30,000 troops on the Korean Peninsula, is also central to any solution, and needs to closely coordinate with its ally."
A polite play with words that validates the North Korean belief that Seoul is a "US Lackey."
Let the people who live there sort it out. Yankee go home!
These negotiations will prove neither fruitful nor lasting, despite the champagne wishes and caviar dreams of this editorial board and the liberal coastal elite who take their cue from them. The oft-repeated calls for negotiations, dialogue, peaceful co-existence, etc (mostly on these same editorial pages) for the last 25 years have given us a situation with a nuclear-armed North Korea on the brink of perfecting a weapon that can hit the United States. Bravo, guys and gals!
After making the same mistake for a generation or more, most people would take stock and think about what they're advocating. Not these clowns. As far as the NYT is concerned, any madman with a credible threat deserves a seat at the negotiating table. What these particular Liberals will never understand (until perhaps it's too late) is that there are some people you just can't talk to and some situations that require deadly force to resolve.
Does anyone here really believe for 1 minute that NK will give up its nukes peacefully? Of course not. So what's the alternative? You have to take them away. Advocating for anything else is advocating for acceptance of a nuclear-armed North Korea capable of attacking the U.S. If that's OK with this editorial board, I wish they'd be honest enough to say so. Just don't count on it.
"Like an adult trying to converse while a child is having a tantrum, South Korea tries to resume engagement with the North as Mr. Trump tweets."
It's really not clear that treating Mr Kim "like an adult" is appropriate. The is little argument that Mr Kim killed his brother, his aunt, and his uncle (this is appalling in any country but especially so in Korea which has strong Confucian family values). What's more, Mr Kim has proven highly erratic. He has a loaded gun and he's running around like mad claiming that he will start WWIII.
This blip in the NK problem will only serve to confirm what the rest of the world, in particular the US, the UN, China, and NK already know: South Korea has no role to play in this crisis other than hide behind the US skirt and do the US’s bidding while the US tames NK into submission.
Hopefully, Moon is simply faking an act to see his Winter Olympics through. If he continues, however, it would signal he is amenable to reunification with NK, setting then the wheels in motion for his undermining and eventual removal. Democratically, of course, but with enthusiastic US support.
Why wait? Pack him off already. We don’t need no ski-jumpin’ Moon.
1
And why shouldn't N. Korea have the right to nuclear weapons and threaten its neighbors with them? Israel introduced nuclear weapons of mass destruction into the Middle East, and the US has supported that nation with more than $38 billion in military aid. The US has many thousands of such weapons aimed straight at N. Korea today.
Now, I am not arguing for anyone having those nightmare weapons, I just wish the non-nuclear UN members would walk out and start their own UN in Geneva, and make it a policy that no nation gets veto power, and no nation can have a full vote if they are not seriously working for the abolition of nuclear weapons. That UN could have a real world court, where all nations are subject to the same laws, and all world leaders are subject to being brought in to face charges...leaders like Netanyahu or George W. Bush or leaders of business who refuse to pay taxes...
Such a dream...but the last, holding the world's business to reasonable laws, that would be the most difficult.
Hugh Massengill, Eugene Oregon
Editorial Board. What a bunch of the usual Trump Delirium Syndrome. Why do you think Kim has suddenly made overtures to the South? It would make no sense for him to do so while he was being coddled by Clinton, Bush, and Obama. Do you not have the perception to understand that his rapprochement is due ENTIRELY to the pragmatic stance Trump has taken against him?
Sometimes there are no good solutions. There are merely a range of options that run from less ideal to catastrophic. Our goal should be to keep Mr. Kim contained to "less ideal."
We won't make him go away.
Trump likes to posture that he can subdue others, threaten them, use our bully power to keep them in place, But when someone calls his bluff he has nothing. Trump supporters like the big talk, the "America is finally doing something" part of the Trump Show.
Trump is spending all of our political global capital on stupid ideas that hit him at 3 int he morning. If they backfire, oh well. If they don't he is a genius. Two small men of big ambition having a ware of words over the size of their buttons.
Meanwhile, we are ceding trade to China and political influence to South Korea. That is not the way to remain a super-power. If that were our policy - to cede our global power to others, close the borders and ignore the rest of the world, well then, it is working.
36
There is no other way than negotiation betweens the Koreas. Peace on the peninsula is essential and negotiation offers the hope for peace.
11
Perhaps having the US lead the way is the wrong approach. We've been doing this for decades to little effect. There is a tantalizing idea in the text though. What if the world, instead of supporting sanctions, said that South Korea was the only country that could have direct interaction including trade with the North? Then the North's actions become strictly a matter for the two Koreas to deal with? A neighbor to neighbor thing that makes any disagreements more concrete for all.
5
"The only way to know that is to test it, with the United States leading the way on a comprehensive strategy integrating sanctions, prudent statements and negotiations."
For sure. Unfortunately we have that needy child in the White House who has no clue about sensitive situations and is incapable of keeping his mouth shut when provoked or even shown an opportunity for one-ups-man-ship. Kim seems to be a mirror image of Trump. Since Trump's handlers can manage to keep him adult for only nanoseconds at a time, it will be nothing short of a miracle of all of this ultimately turns out well.
9
Whatever the motivation behind the Kim-Moon dialogue initiative or the risk involved in negotiations, the benefits of talks certainly outweigh the heavy cost involved in the Korean peninsula remaining a dangerous nuclear flash point threatening peace in the region and beyond. No one could deny that the US has provided the much needed security umbrella to the South Korea during all these post-war years. But there comes a time when the South Korea would have to come out of the US shadow and find its own existence as a sovereign nation responsible for its own security and autonomous decision making. Some day it will have to resolve the contentious issues with its Northern part and ensure border peace - borders that were artificially created under the imperial power play in the post-war period.
32
All borders are artificially created.
"The Trump Administration should open up a high-level bilateral dialogue that maps out a path to get Kim focussed on economic development, rather than missile tests. It can start with an agreement for the North Koreans to halt further development on their weapons program and the U.S. and R.O.K....to tone down or, in part, suspend joint military exercises." --John Delury, North Korea expert at Yonsei University. Hopefully the smarter adults will provide the diplomacy bridges and incentives to prevail.
https://www.newyorker.com/news/daily-comment/bitter-pill-north-korea-mos...
7
Unfortunately, there are no smarter adults to make those decisions. Yes, we do have those Generals, people who actually understand the cost of war, but they can only give advice, they don't make the decisions.
Excellent point, but does the Trump administration have the capacity to open high-level bilateral dialogue? The president would need to step back from the process and let his secretary of state proceed with the dialogue that he attempted to initiate on December 13, which was countered by the W.H.
If the goal remains denuclearization of the DPRK it is unlikely to succeed. The reasons why the DPRK has pursued a nuclear deterrent at such great cost need to be addressed. Additionally, if its significant technical achievements would be recognized and further development encouraged in productive ways the technical capacity that has been built up could be used to develop the DPRK as a contributing member of the world community. It is highly possible that Kim Jong Un would prefer to send a spaceship to the Moon rather than to target a missile at Washington.
Note that we had a "smart adult" in the White House between 2008 and 2016. What exactly did he achieve? Eight years in the most powerful position on the planet should have been enough to put the North Korean nuclear program to a grinding halt. Instead Obama concentrated on destabilizing LIbya and Ukraine and attempting to destabilize Syria.
Whether someone is a good politician or a bad one is to be decided on the basis of results and not on the basis of how much the New York Times likes you.
1
As a Korean I see no other way but a peaceful dialogue to solve the North Korean crisis.
As many experts testified there is no military way to disarm North Korea’s nuclear weapons without risking massive deaths in Korea.
Peaceful trade and economic exchange might be the key to disarm North Korean regime. See why the Soviet regime fell in the 1990s. The regime fell because citizens of the Soviet Russia realized that capitalist system makes possible sumptuous consumption.Not a single missile left its launch sites before the Soviet regime met its demise.
North Korean regime can be dismantle this way. Time and patience might be needed for the solution. However this is a superbly better solution than the war mongering between Kim Jung un in North Korea and the other guy in the US.
53
North Korea has no intention of being dismantled through trade. It does not want to become the East Germany of the 2000s. Its pursuit of nuclear weapons is intended to ensure that the regime can never collapse like other communist states, but will instead be in a position to blackmail South Korea and other neighbours into submission.
3
Why does this editorial sound suspiciously like a call to emulate Obama’s cave on his Syrian red-line? Because Kim Jong-un has a nuke or two and Assad merely had poison gas? Or … because there is something inherently foolish in the genes of humans who yearn for serial Munichs, insensitive to how catastrophically they all turn out? Is the ideal solution to a belligerent North Korea some form of cave that lets them kick the can yet again, while poisoning the global well and blackmailing nations to keep (barely) fed a near-starving people governed by a cadre of global pirates committed to their survival regardless of the price paid by their people or by anyone else? Jefferson knew how to deal with pirates.
When will South Korea learn its lesson? When Kim Jong-Un’s hacksters disable their technology grid and exact a regular tithe of global nations through fraudulent hacking schemes? When their nuclear arsenal becomes TRULY formidable and capable of threatening the entire planet?
Lest some still doubt it, this isn’t going to end well, one way or another. SOMEONE needs to point out that the only adult in the room, surprise-surprise, is Donald Trump. He understands that you can’t negotiate with a desperate man who has nothing to offer society, is up against the wall with nothing to lose and with a loaded gun in his hand. The only solution may be to let SWAT put one between his eyes.
But it’s not an easy thing to do when our allies are chanting “Munich … Munich … Munich”.
18
The only ones chanting "Munich" are war mongers who use the term (along with "appeasement") to lambast anyone arguing against war. Kim Jong-un is not Hitler, whose ambition to dominate the world by force became apparent after 1938. North Korea is not a re-armed Germany (not by a long shot). South Korea isn't Czechoslovakia. The US isn't Great Britain. And Donald Trump sure as hell isn't Winston Churchill, despite what Mike Huckabee might say.
28
NK developed nuclear weapons and the means to deliver them so they could effectively negotiate with the West. Maybe it's not "checkmate...but it is certainly a "draw"at the moment. This is the result of decades of NK maneuvering under harsh International sanctions. There is no "adult in the room." Only the complex long-term geopolitical agendas of Russia, China and the US...with literally, millions of lives at stake. This is not some "Chuck Norris Movie;" but a very complex situation that has been ongoing since the Japanese occupation of the Korean Peninsula. Dialogue between both Koreas is a welcome development vs. war and death...which it appears you are calling for...so easy for you to do...from the comfort of your home thousands and thousands of miles away from all the action.
3
'My button is bigger than your button' is someone's idea of 'the adult in the room'?
That certainly explains a lot. And no, I don't mean that in a good way.
2
Well, someone needs to be the adult. Can’t be Trump, so guess it’s South Korea.
90
I do not understand this obsession of being an adult. Children have some wonderful qualities. In school activities, especially sports, the adults are the cause of most problems, not the children.
With a nuclear deterrent of their own South Koreans could walk softly while carrying a big stick!
1
Right now, buried "below the fold" on page one of the internet edition, The NY Times is reporting: "North Korea Reopens Border Hotline for Dialogue With South." Ho-hum. The day before, and I recall it was "above the fold," Trump responded harshly to Kim's New Year's Day greeting and threat of sending nukes to American soil. That's an interesting turn of events. However, liberals are stuck on yesterday's news (Trump's response), and they simply cannot help themselves from getting their knickers in a knot over Twitter Tweets. All they do is react and stay fixated on style vs. substance issues.
10
You may hate Trump, but do you think Kim would even be talking with SK if he didn't feel threatened? How much diplomacy can be offered to someone detonating hydrogen bombs and lobbing ICBMs over Japan?
23
What makes you think this is down to Trump?
2
Kim is seeking diplomacy in order to buy time for his weapons' development. Only a blind fool would ever believe he'd negotiate away his nukes.
“There is reason to be wary of Mr. Kim’s intentions, given his history of ruthlessness and threats to launch a weapon against the United States, including the rant that preceded Mr. Trump’s belligerent tweet.”
Let the north and south talk, but by all means be very wary of Kim. He has proven himself to be a very dangerous actor who should not be readily trusted. South Korea should proceed with extreme caution, and negotiate with restraint.
10
Among the leaders of the United States, South Korea and North Korea, the most unstable, least predictable and, I would argue, the most dangerous, at this moment in history is Trump. North Korea's Kim is acting as he, his father and his grandfather have always acted. Kim is a ruthless dictator who murders his relatives and allows his own people to starve, but he is not a madman or a maniac. South Korea's Moon is no appeaser. He is calmly but diligently seeking dialogue in addition to economic sanctions. Trump is the ignorant one who could stumble his way into war. I continue to be amazed by Americans who think the United States should launch a pre-emptive strike against North Korea regardless of the inevitable loss of Korean lives that would bring. American lives are worth no more than Korean lives. Yes, the United States defended South Korea in the Korea War, and South Korea sent 300,000 soldiers to Vietnam to support the disastrous U.S. war there.
70
I have to agree that Trump from a world perspective has the potential to be the most dangerous man on the planet. And take away language and uniform and Trump is pretty close to a Kim in many respects, in fact, amazingly so!
1
What's so amazing about being able to see a threat for what it is? While you may be "amazed" by Americans who want to protect their nation from a "ruthless dictator who murders his relatives and allows his own people to starve" (he intentionally starves them too, FYI) and who has repeatedly threatened to rain fire and death on us and our allies, I'm truly befuddled by those Americans who essentially advocate we give Kim more time to perfect his rockets and miniaturize his nukes. Because he'll NEVER give them up willingly.
Understand now?
At one time the Korean War might have been a conflict between Capitalism and Communism, or between China and the USA, but today it is primarily the business of North and South Korea. If they can work it out, God bless them. It has nothing to do with China and the USA really, at this point. North Korea badly needs economic aid, and South Korea is perfectly situated to help them, if there is an earnest desire for cooperation. "And I am Marie of Romania" as the limerick goes.
12
So NYT, how many times must the DPRK (aka Lucy) pull away the football before you stop trying to kick it (negotiate with a tyrant)?
3
Some Republican Presidents taking a tough guy stance seem to garner diplomatic progress: Nixon In China and Reagan in Berlin.
Trump may be effecting such progress in Korea.
Are Democrats engaging in histrionics about nuclear war?
7
Seriously, what makes you think it's Trump?
Trump and diplomacy is an oxymoron.
He is even at war with his erstwhile Ally Bannon. The man-child-maroon has no loyalty or regard to anyone but himself.
1
President Trump's belligerent tweets are like Nero playing violin while Rome is
burning. Solution: Democrats will take back Congress, state by state.
We will end this madness!
14
Of course, conversations leading to a real dialogue to bridge differences must be welcomed. Just do not recommend the United States as the intermediary, having lost all credibility towards diplomacy, under the stupid tweeting of 'our' vulgar bully in chief. Childish temper tantrums need not apply.
24
I cannot believe that any foreign leader takes Donald Trump's inane threats
seriously; the leaders of the free world are just as anxious to see Trump
leave office as we are.....and most likely Kim listens only to China, South
Korea and Japan....Most diplomats are becoming 'deaf to Trump's idiotic tweets'
16
"The only way to know that is to test it, with the United States leading the way on a comprehensive strategy integrating sanctions, prudent statements and negotiations."
And who would that be, "leading the way?" Donald Trump has already stated multiple times he considers diplomacy a joke and that the DRNK must abandon its weapons before any talks can begin.
When Kim Jong-Un made his initiative to the south, I thought it was somewhat of a ruse. I didn't know that Moon had been pressing the north for some time to send a delegation to the winter games. The speed with which the hotline was reinstated was also good.
Yes, the Board is right to be cautious. But again, there are 3 parties here and only two--albeit, the ones most directly affected should war break out--are actually communicating.
It's a golden opportunity for the president, if he could tear himself away from anger over a tell-all book or appointing interim federal prosecutors he interviewed, who just happen to work at his pal Rudy Giuliani's law firm, in all-important jurisdictions of NYC.
8
It's a pretty frightening new low when Kim Jong Un and Steve Bannon start looking like adults in the room.
President Moon has been the perfect diplomat, standing for peace and seemingly on the way to achieving peace. I do admire President Moon, who also has the support of President Xi of China.
19
Keep the volume blasting. Thank you President Trump. North Korea will back down in the face of certain destruction. That is the only language they understand.
14
If it is a question of fighting a war with North Korea and winning it, the sooner the strike, the better the chance winning with less casualties.
4
Threats of waging war (or otherwise) against North Korea are the very thing that's escalating the threat. Many experts are studied this challenge with long experience in diplomacy--let's give them a chance to prevail with South Korea leading the way.
7
If history is any guide, Kim will end this talk just as abruptly as it started. Kim is once again in the driver's seat.
Remember the North's main goal is to ensure the regime's survival. Everything else is simply means, including nuclear power and of course this negotiation posture. Ask ourselves, "What does Kim wants from this 'negotiations'?" Non nuclear peace? 60 years of on and off negotiations led to nothing but disappointments.
9
Kim Jong-un is known to admire Western culture including cowboy movies. Surely the case can be made that he would rather be a respected economic power on the world stage, with a happy and well-nourished population, than the leader of a failing state. Many diplomatic quivers to try and surely less expensive that war and mayhem.
5
what would make anyone think the United States can lead the way?
that's absurd!
10
Who can be against "coordinating" with South Korea?
But two observations.
1. Coordinating is a two-way street. South Korea's Moon has shown himself to be a spineless appeaser who can't be trusted not to give the store away to one of the most evil men in the world. Did Moon "coordinate" with us when he scrapped further deployment of THAAD (defensive) missiles? That was utterlyy contemptible act. Note that those missiles would have protected 30,000 US troops -- ion South Korea for its defense -- as well as South Koreans.
2. This is no longer a Korean matter. It is out of Moon's hands. He must understand that Times Square and the White House may now be within the range of Kim's ICBMs. Trump must do what is right for the United States. To be sure, he must consult with our Korean and Japanese allies, but if Moon chooses to make his country a vassal of the odious Kim, then he should count us out.
9
Perhaps Moon has realised that being a vassal state for the US with an unhinged POTUS is not the way forward.
"With a child." It just goes to show history was written for fools to ignore.
I'd be willing to add an obscure winter sport in which a North Korean athlete gets a gold medal if it would avoid nuclear war.
6
More wishful thinking by the South. Let's not forget that the Times applauded the 1938 Munich Deal in the same editorial page.
This regime is just stalling until they perfect their arsenal. Their goal is the reunification of Korea by force.
14
Right, Kim has turned into a dove and peace maker. Baloney. The one thing that is for sure is that when things start to get messy, it will be the US called in to protect South Korea.
10
.
The Iranian people have taken to the streets, long overdue.
It's time for the North Korean people, and their army, to do the same, and overthrow their deranged and kleptomaniacal 'government'.
Seemingly not possible. But so was the wall coming down.
It's time. Now.
2
It is time US citizens took to the streets and removed the aberration that resulted from the last election.
I congratulate South Korea on its decision to pursue negotiations with the North.
I would encourage South Korea to inform the United States that it will oppose any military solution to the current crisis that does not involve President Trump personally directing the attack from US military headquarters in Seoul.
Of all the men and women who would be at risk in a military operation, Trump is clearly the most expendable.
12
In the current faceoff between President Trump and Kim Jong Un, it appears that the North Korean leader just played his “Trump” card, which is one that looks like “the art of the deal” is about to be struck.
By suggesting he was “open to dialogue” with his South Korean counterpart, Mr. Kim side-stepped President Trump and defused tensions with his southern neighbor. South Korean president, Mr. Moon, in turn, quickly pounced on the opportunity by “proposing that high-level negotiators meet next Tuesday at the village of Panmunjom at the demilitarized zone on the border.”
In this high stakes game, akin to Russian roulette, it appears like President Trump has been left with his much bigger button in hand unable to pull the trigger, while the two Koreans may soon be engaged in a dialogue that could conceivably end the stalemate in the Korean peninsula. It could turn out to be a peaceful win-win, if Trump’s ego won’t get in the way of the deal.
3
Jack:
Wake up. This isn't 1998 or 2008, it's 2018. It is no longer about the Korean peninsula. It's about ICBMs that may already be able to take out Maryland. South Korea's Moon isn't going to be able to resolve that. Only Trump can do that. Wish him luck.
7
With Trump at the wheel, there is no way the United States [will be] leading the way on a comprehensive strategy integrating sanctions, prudent statements and negotiations. To even suggest it requires at best, a dark sense of humor.
History may, in its blindness, give Trump some credit if North and South Korea find common ground in the weeks and months to come. Hopefully, those who write it will realize it was Trump's inane blundering that frightened both sides to the bargaining table, that made their differences pale in comparison to his dangerous lunacy.
11
The North's latest overture is only another art of procrastination for the sake of its full-fledged nuclear capability. Pro-Pyongyang President Moon will be fooled (again). Worse, unequivocal or sneaky South Korea may end up being abandoned by the US, its soil devastated through military conflicts.
6
As the decades-long boycott of Cuba attest, sanctions lead to the precise opposite of what is intended. There are other more creative carrot-and-stick means to achieve the desired results, and for worse or better, it begins with overtures to have genuine dialogue. Donald Trump has not the slightest notion of what that is, lacking as he is in all insight, humility, and perspicuity. Luckily South Korea's new president will do his utmost to lead the way out of this latest Trumpian-inflicted morass.
4
This is beginning to look like a Saturday Night Live skit with President Trump saying he has a button on his desk bigger than Kim Jung Un's button. Didn't Trump say in the campaign he had bigger hands alluding to other parts of his body that must be larger also? Meanwhile, we would never have predicted a month or two ago, North Korea would begin, along with South Korea, to be the adults in the room. I hope Lorne Michaels is taking notes. We'll see on Saturday Night.
5
Let us hope that the South Koreans now will proceed quickly to develop their own credible nuclear deterrent that they can announce quietly to the world in an adult manner -- following which US forces politely and quietly can be requested to exit South Korea. There is no reason why South Korea cannot provide for its own defense. They vastly outweigh North Korea in technical ability, industrial capacity and military aged manpower. With just a little help on the QT, as happened in North Korea, they would have that nuclear deterrent within a matter of months. Tit for tat!
9
I think the Times fails to grasp what may be going on here.
Why does the Times think that Kim Jong-un is all of a sudden behaving like an adult? Is it because his adversaries have displayed "patience and humility" and so he is reciprocating? If the Times believes that, next the Times will be buying a bridge across the Korean DMZ from Kim. The Times's gullibility is endless -- for decades the Times been seeing phantom "glimmers of hope," because it just doesn't understand evil.
No, Kim's about-face is more likely a result of ... well, Trump's bombast. Wouldn't it be a supreme ironic if Trump's bombast accomplishes a diplomatic triumph that has eluded five or six previous Presidents and all their "pompous diplomats in striped pants," well-meaning intermediaries like Jimmy Carter, and hand-wringing editorial writers?
But, if the past is prologue, Kim's actions are likely the same old opportunism that has manipulated the rest of the world time and again. At the Times's urging, other Presidents have talked -- and talked and talked, with nothing to show for it.
Talk is cheap. That is why it is essential that Trump should keep up unrelenting pressure on Kim and hold China accountable for its promises. This is no time to go wobbly on the embargo and trade sanctions and, if Kim uses the breathing space to pursue his nuclear ambitions, the threat of military action.
The Times would have us shower concessions on Kim. That is exactly what got us to the present crisis.
9
I could not have said it better.
6
North Korea is not going to give up nukes no matter what. Period. So Trump is not going to get what he wants. There will be some kind of de-facto freeze without Kim knowing whether he can really hit the US or not, and with us not knowing either. Works for me and should work for any sensible observer. Trump can claim credit for that and probably will, while Kim will still have his nukes and an unprovable claim.
1
Trump is a convulsive outshouter
An unbeatable big lie spouter
A schoolyard bully
Not literate fully,
Intent always on talking louder.
9
Where did all the adults in the Clinton, Bush, and Obama administrations get us with North Korea?
20
If you really need an answer.... Not so ramped up that people legitimately wonder if a nuclear war is imminent. Not so embarrassed at the complete asinine, juvenile provocations of a man whose outbursts are motivated by nothing greater than what he heard last, on Fox. Not so shunned by our allies as to be standing with 3rd world, war torn nations on important issues affecting us all.
You think we can accomplish anything from the position that's been dug by the most easily manipulated president in the history of our country, you've got another thing coming.
102
Well, not for nothing, we are still alive.
13
At least not into a nuclear war. At least not into two world "leaders" hurling insults at each other. Bring back Bush.
2
I'll take any form of diplomacy that excludes Trump and his Twitter account.
110
Jeff,
"I'll take any form of diplomacy that excludes Trump and his Twitter account."
Was tried for decades and led us exactly to the current conundrum. I personally blame this failure on the lack of sense of humor in the previous administrations.
5
Meanwhile we in the U.S. are in the hands of reckless accidental president. Trump cuts the budget for diplomacy and foreign aid by more than 30 percent, cuts $285 million to the United Nations (the body with responsibility for improving the world's shared peace-keeping mission), shuts down or nullifies proven and longstanding diplomatic and aid programs, and makes irresponsible and reckless tweets at every turn. Time for intelligent and wiser leaders to prevail.
2
Einstein definition of insanity: “to try the same thing over and over and expect a different result.” Perhaps is time to try something different with North Korea.
1
This is their region, and their countries. The two Korean nations should be setting the direction, not the US.
The US does not own South Korea. Why is US ire more important than the lives of millions on both sides of the border, where all the fighting and dying would be happening in any war? The original Korean conflict was international in nature: why is it on the US to keep the peace - or be the chief foreign power to be appeased by either side? It is as if: the world wants peace, the Koreans want peace, but the US is pushing for war - so War is virtually inevitable. This should not be the case, ever!
Since when is the US the drum-beater of war? This is why the DPRK is so focused on getting a nuclear deterrence. They want to survive... us.
83
Have you heard the saying "If you break it, you own it" ? We broke Korea into two parts--to appease the USSR--after World War II. We went to war to defend the South. Afterward we guaranteed their defense. Indeed we do "own" South Korea. Read some history.
5
And they can kick us out and ally with China any time they want. Take a look at a map.
I don't think the US can lead the way now, too much vitriol and hatred has been engendered there, although I understand why you would phrase it this way. The idea of stepping back and letting other countries make crucial decisions without this nation's vetting or approval would win instant scorn and alarm from US citizens, including politicians needing to show themselves tough. A world in which we at least seem to function as an empire is hard to forgo, even as it is too expensive and complex to maintain, even as we can see other nations no more wanting our control than we'd want theirs. Perhaps most, even as our leadership is too wild and incompetent to lead one nation, much less those a world away. But we need to step back when pushing in could cost millions of lives and serve no interest of anyone at all.
1
Well said! Let the games begin. May the good of mankind be the ultimate 'winner'. Peace on earth, good will to men.
3
"...with the United States leading the way on a comprehensive strategy integrating sanctions, prudent statements and negotiations."
Yes, when pigs fly. Or when a puerile president is wearing an orange jumpsuit.
Trump is incapable of such a measured approach. His ignorant provocations are so dangerous that the 25th amendment should be invoked. The fact that venal, corrupt congressional Republicans won't even consider it is a sure sign that American leadership is severely, and possibly irreparably, damaged.
Even though it doesn't even exist, he refers to "my button" as though the nuclear arsenal was his own personal plaything. Clinton could not have been more prescient when she said that a man you can bait with a tweet should not have the nuclear codes.
61
China is also baiting Trump and may have a strong chance of succeeding while Republicans in the U.S. stand aside from their Constitutional duties in favor of self-enrichment.
"Making China Great Again"
https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2018/01/08/making-china-great-again
"As U.S. Retreats From World Stage, China Moves To Fill The Void" - interview with journalist Evan Osnos
https://www.npr.org/programs/fresh-air/
1
Disarmament of the North, bar a mutual START-style treaty that also cuts the US's numbers, won't happen; there's too many mountains and friendly shipping routes with China and Russia to check for nukes to cut off, and Kim's seen Libya and won't let its leader's fate befall him. The South's post-Park government wants a more peaceful approach, as Moon has promised, and starting any war will make Kim drop his anvil of border missiles on Seoul anyway.
So the best that can happen now is for both to defuse the heat between them, and for the South to accept that the North's a (relatively minor) nuclear power and to hope that unhinged covfefe stays back[1] until they gel a stronger armistice or treaty. Then the Sword of Damocles of a US strike would be less of a two-Koreas peace threat, while actually deterring Kim from any crazy that breaks the peace again.
[1] Or better yet, gets impeached to make America great again. We're trying, Moon, we're trying.
2
South Korea, my very best wishes. Please continue to act as the Adults, and in your own best interests. We have bumbling, moronic child " in charge" AND a GOP Congress of useless Collaborators. So, unfortunately,
You are on your own. I sincerely apologize.
172
If they really wanted to act like adults, they could tell the US that they can defend themselves and we are not needed.
But no.
5
I think it would be very helpful if north korean athletes were able to participate in the Olympics. We know Kim Jon Un has proved his love of sports and so perhaps this would be a first step in the road to peace between the north and the south.My best wishes to south korea also.
They can do well enough on their own, best yet if they are shrewd enough to develop their own nuclear deterrent and not depend on the US for protection.
2
Mr. Trump, can you admit mistake? Do you not kneel at the foot of the Cross. Have you no shame. Not for righteousness sake, but for thine own, should you ask yourself.
1
Fake President. He just doesn't have it, doesn't get it, doesn't have the chops, the brains, the integrity. Fake news? Consider the real source: fake president.
48
Having acquired fresh military muscle, N.K is now carrying a big stick but talking softly--to South Korea where it matters most. Old Teddy Roosevelt would have been proud of him, but he would have been appalled at the ignorant man-child in the White House who carries one bludgeon each in his unsteady hands and his loose lips .
5
"appalled at the ignorant man-child in the White House..."
As opposed to the great Pyongyang intellectual aka rocket man??
2
Are you serious?
Kim having adult conversation!?
Didn't we have it for last couple of years!?
Your hatred of Trump deteriorated you so far down
Let us remember this editorial when adult Kim makes his next move
Really disappointing!!
10
"Some fear that as part of any dialogue, South Korea could make too many concessions, like agreeing to end military exercises with the United States or no longer participating in sanctions. Still, dialogue is a risk worth taking."
Hey, all South Korea has to do is publicly request that US troops leave Korean soil. You'll hear a resounding "Amen" from the US.
So talk on, Koreas, maybe you can hold the peace talks in Paris. Hopefully someone in the Senate and Congress will introduce bills to prohibit any sort of military aid to South Korea. That'll put things in proper perspective.
8
How can it be possible that, when it comes to dealing with dictators, monarchs, strongmen or madmen, the United States is the one considered to be the wild card? I can't say if the Korea's will ever find common ground but I can guarantee, if they do, Trump will take credit for it.
4
"I can't say if the Korea's will ever find common ground but I can guarantee, if they do, Trump will take credit for it."
And rightly so. He's upended the stalemate created by previous administrations. He's an outside of the box guy.
3
"He's an outside of the box guy."
Outta the cracker box!
4
Comprehensive strategy, prudent statements and negotiations? From Trump??? Better that South and North Korea leave The Donald out of the loop for now. We certainly have a vested interest, given our support for South Korea, but delicate negotiations which allow each side to save face is not something Trump either understands nor for which he has any talent. Good luck, Mr. Moon.
4
"but delicate negotiations which allow each side to save face is not something Trump either understands nor for which he has any talent."
The previous administrations in both the US and S. Korea helped save N. Korean face all the way to the A bomb. Obama did the same for Iran in a delayed action way; his now infamous leading from behind of the behind strategy.
2
Of course South Koreans are being cool headed- they would be amidst the "fire and fury," should things heat up.
And while Kim Jung On is unpredictable, South Korea has as good a view as anyone about their neighbor, through surveillance, proximity and information gleaned from defectors.
But leave it to Trump to play nuclear-level chicken.
18
He has a bunker, you know.
1
"South Korea could make too many concessions.. like agreeing to end military exercises...or no longer participating in sanctions... dialogue is a risk worth taking."
I ask myself, who has the most to lose if a military conflict erupts? Clearly North and South Korea. So leave them be. No harm in dialogue. Concessions made are a miniscule cost to armed conflict.
The Trump Administration has and will continue to be a diplomatic dysfunctional nightmare. They have only exacerbated the problem and need to just leave the Koreans alone. Kim Jong-un is a tyrant, but he is also a Korean. Mr. Moon is in the best position politically and culturally to deal with him.
The way we were headed with our Administration reminded of the days when I was a kid. We had emergency drills in school, and took cover under our desks in case of nuclear attack. Not a nice memory!
24
"The Trump Administration has and will continue to be a diplomatic dysfunctional nightmare. They have only exacerbated the problem..."
You must be kidding, cherrylog.
Several previous administrations let the problem fester, until Trump injected a measure of humorous bravado, upsetting the status quo and sending the rocket man scrambling for some face saving diplomacy.
Good job, Mr. President! Iran, however is a far tougher nut to crack.
5