NAFTA has been a disaster for the American worker. To defend it is just another admittance of the NYT globalist, social justice, socialist agenda.
4
Funny how when Bernie Sanders spoke out against these unfair trade deals....the left adored & embraced his "wisdom"....but Trump says the same thing, and he's a monster, stupid, going to destroy the US economy, etc.
Both Bernie and Hillary campaigned on not passing the TPP (though we all know Hillary lied and lied)
NOTE: for those left behind and steamrollered by the changes in the US economy for the last 20-25 years....honestly, they don't care who it benefits or not. They want YOU to the feel the same pain they have been feeling all that time -- while you did not care, because your wealthy, privileged lefty lives in big blue urban centers went on unaffected.
4
The only thing I get out of this is that, apparently, Trump companies are not benefiting from NAFTA, therefore, it must go.
5
Let's forget the good or bad about NAFTA; instead, let's consider the method used by the president to get his own way. He flippantly declares it a bad deal and wants to make changes which would effectively alter its present makeup. Of course, as always, it must be his way or no way. He is like a nettle in one's shoe: irritating and painful at the same time.
1
Trump is taking us into rogue status....working hard to pull out of every possible agreement we have with any nation or nations. He wants isolation and independence from all other parts of the world so we won't have to depend on anyone but ourselves. Put up walls, secure the borders, fortify the war machine. When does that ever work in life? It is fear based, rigid and prone to collapse. We all need friends and allies to survive. When you are working that hard to stay on the top it's a long way down when you fall and inevitable that the cart will eventually come apart at the wheels.
5
Trump loves to talk about his election has driven the stock market higher and higher. Actually not true, but what would he know. When he kills Nafta watch the stock market drop through the floor, but then again it won't be his fault it will be Obama or some other nonsense and his followers will nod in agreement. Gee, no more cheap vegetables, or fruit, but then Americans can start to grow Victory Gardens again. Sadly, someone should read an article that appeared in the mid 90's everyone loves to go on about how great the 1950's were and how Trump is going to take us back to those days. What the article pointed out was it was a "one off". A point in time that will never come again. Reason the end of World War II and the need to produce consumer goods for the Baby Generation. The start of world trade which including rebuilding Germany and Japan. Yes, the 50's were great if you take out the Korean War, nuclear war, polo, TB and some other nasty things. It resulted in the terrible 60's with the Vietnam War and riots in America. Anyone who thinks knows as years pass they in our minds become some sort of Golden Age which in reality they were not. Jim Trautman
4
Hey, wait a minute. NAFTA isn't an Obama deal. The elder Bush inked that one. Has Trump run out of Obama stuff to destroy?
9
We are supposed to have three branches of government. Where are the other two when all this dismantling of our democracy is going on?
3
Mexico and Canada want NAFTA as is. That alone should tell you who really benefits from this deal. Meantime, we have cities and industries that remain devastated by it.
And yes, the jobs can and will return... see the auto industry, where most of our "foreign" badges are now made in the USA, primarily the South. This after so many pundits declared US auto manufacturing dead a couple of decades ago.
3
Trump seems to be totally incapable of foreseeing consequences. "Who knew this would happen? Did you know? I certainly didn't know. Nobody told me this wouldn't work."
3
Where is the Republican Congress? Why are they letting Trump ruin our country? Fascist pigs?
3
I can't imagine the damage that will be done to my country without NAFTA - I am sure it will be devastating - but part of me can't help but be happy at the prospect of being less beholden to your country led by gun-toting lunatic bullies. If it were just Trump that would be bad enough, but add in all of the GOP and 39% support from ignoramuses still fighting back the tears to insist that Democrats are just as bad and I just hope we can stay as little involved with you as possible.
6
Since Trump's corrupt election many intelligent educated Americans have considered leaving the country- and many have left already. Why not? If the Republican congress has no regard for Democracy we can move to countries where they do and leave America to a deserved third word turn-into chaos and civil war. I will not live under Trump fascism. Why hasn't the Republican removed Trump?
4
And the stock market won’t even notice this. Why is that?
I believe that NAFTA has only benefited the business class of both countries and deteriorated the living conditions and rights of the working class in both countries.
Employment loss and salary stagnation in United States and wages of hunger in Mexico that do not allow those individuals to buy American made goods.
NAFTA should be scrapped and renegotiated with the provision of pay equity in all three countries.
4
The archaic "local content" idea that Trump is promoting was once a favorite of developing countries struggling to attract local manufacturing.
Mexico abandoned local content because it protected inefficient businesses and ownership that prevented them from becoming the export powerhouse they are today.
Are we really that helpless that we need protectionist measures to defend our inefficiencies? The auto industry and Chamber of Commerce apparently don't think so because they are adamantly and vocally opposed to the Trump NAFTA proposals.
3
Sadly, we can't only blame Trump's ignorance for putting the largely beneficial and successful Nafta policy at risk. Plenty of "progressive" Democrats, including Sherrod Brown and, most notably, Bernie Sanders, have done more than their fair share of Nafta demonizing.
They, and the labor leaders who have developed a knee-jerk opposition to virtually all trade agreements, do have legitimate gripes about some aspects of these pacts. But Sanders et al. focus on attacking them because they don't really have any answers to the real threat to U.S. (and other) workers -- robotics and other forms of technological displacement.
More than a year ago, Ball State University’s Center for Business and Economic Research published a study that found trade accounted for just 13% of America's lost factory jobs. Robotics and other home-grown factors that reduced the need for human labor accounted for 88% of the jobs lost. That's why American factory production was able to more than double from 1979 to 2016, even though the factory worker population dropped by 7 million during that period.
How long do we have to pretend that trade agreements are the big killer of blue-color jobs, while ignoring the primary cause? Politicians on both the left and the right shouldn't be allowed to play this game. Instead, they should be forced to directly acknowledge -- and start addressing -- the threat that automation and, increasingly, artificial intelligence pose to all categories of workers.
6
"... a largely and beneficial and successful Nafta policy...". Are you joking? It's been a disaster for the last 24 years, that along with the China trade policy. Our debt is sky high, most good jobs vaporized, Mexico's poor and homeless increased not to mention our own, middle class has shrunk , wage and wealth disparity the greatest ever. You mean to tell me it's been a success? I see, your stock portfolio has netted a hefty return after these 20 years. Those "Greenbacks" are your blinders, i suggest you remove them and see reality.
5
There are some mighty nervous farmers in the US Corn Belt.
NAFTA demise might not be a game changer for the auto induatry in the short term as the devaluation of the peso has been greater than a modest increase to WTO tariff levels.
But corn and other ag exports to Mexico would likely disappear quickly if NAFTA goes away.
I hope you are pleased with the performance of the King of Bankruptcy you helped into office. (see "Atlantic City casinos")
8
Trump will probably wind up deducting the losses he causes the US pubic from his own taxes, just as he did with his investor's losses in his casinos.
2
From reading this, as usual with trade agreements, there are winners and losers. I read years ago that one reason we have so many illegal immigrants is that NAFTA resulted in the shutdown of many villages in Mexico, villages based on agriculture that could no longer compete. Many had no way to make a living as a result. Not sure if this is true or not.
Also, I understand that the Dems were not fans of this agreement as union members lost jobs that moved south of the border. Not sure how extensive that was/is. This article points out the impact on the Auto industry and how hard they fight to keep the agreement - assume that is the corporation, not the workers?
In the end, the US will lose any advantage they have globally for exports if this agreement (and others) start to unwind. That means that companies will struggle to pay high wages to workers and compete on the global market where China and other countries under-cut US product prices. Europe mitigates some of this through isolationist policies that prohibit or minimize the import of items made in the EU (e.g. cheese and wine and chocolate). Those protected industries are more a national pride. Not sure in the long run how that will be sustained.
If Mexico and other countries south of our border cannot be economically sustainable and compete in the global market, then things will not go well for anyone.
So many were against NAFTA and predicted the consequences we've seen; thoughts NYTs?
3
I'm really beginning to wonder about Trump's pattern of being in the news all the time . He creates chaos around a succession of vital issues, perhaps because his extreme narcissism demands it. Constantly being in the public eye, and doing and saying outrageous things seems to fuel him. It's frightening.
2
Nafta has been good for Canada and Mexico, big Ag in the US, big corporations like Lowes and McDonalds, the stock market, and most of all the 1%.
nafta has not been good to them, just ask the poor farmers in Mexico or small farmer in the U.S. and Canada. They beg to differ. You also might read the comments from readers in Canada.
4
How did this power grab happen? Do we have that many holes in our government structure to allow this twit to do this?
1
Maybe they could keep it in place and just rename it.
Northern Third-Southern Third-NO MIDDLE THIRD NAFTA
"including a requirement to make 85 percent of the value of automobiles and auto parts in North America, up from 62.5 percent currently, and an additional requirement for 50 percent of the value to come from the United States."
It would be great for the Times to do an analysis of the effect of these changes on car prices. I hope Trump supporters like the car they own right now because new ones are going to get much more expensive if NAFTA is killed and regulations such as this one go ahead. Is the administration going to push for higher wages and support unions because we sure have lots of "right to work" states now making cars where wages are far lower? Funny how Trump is pushing deregulation, but this new regulation would actually be the government telling automakers how to run their businesses.
Almost all the "policies" coming from Trump show a bumper sticker level of understanding from "repeal and replace" Obamacare to "tax reform" to the Iran nuclear agreement and even eliminating the Clean Power Plan - they propose killing something but don't offer a viable replacement or any replacement at all.
6
Trump will bring back the coal mining jobs , the buggy whip jobs , the steel making jobs and automation will replace them all because no one will be prepared or able to pay for the higher labour cost.
Canada is the USA`s largest customer as is the USA Canada`s largest customer. It seems like a good idea to smash this agreement because .... the dotard thinks so !
FYI : Canada has just signed a free trade agreement with the European Union (NAFTA style) and continues to be a member of the TPP that Trump withdrew the USA from.
America , are you really not better than the Trump-GOP regime ?
6
Putin must be jumping for joy at the many ways his puppet Trump is systematically destroying this country. Even he must be surprised by how thoroughly and how swiftly 45 has acted. Like I've said so many times, I'm way more afraid of the Republican enablers of 45 than I am of ISIS.
The more Trump bullies and bellows, the more he backs himself and America into destructive and dangerous corners. With so much bluster and negative posturing the stakes for producing a win at any cost progressively escalates.
This is the standard MO with the Donald at the national helm. Think ACA, immigration, the Iran deal, the edge of the precipice confrontation with North Korea.
At some point a grave misstep is almost certain — especially given the unwillingness of the GOP Congress to seriously push back on Trump’s delinquent antics.
The cumulative effect of the President wantonly running amok is putting the nation at grave risk.
5
Trump likes to rally his base by saying NAFTA killed the jobs. What he does not seem to see is that manufacturing has changed a lot in the past 30 years. I would suggest he take a page from our Prime Minister and Provincial govt and encourage people to go back to trade schools. Rather than waiting for the hey days manufacturing to return.
Otherwise his killing NAFTA will do several things. Dry up the tourism from Canadians who visit and spend money in the US every year. Drive the jobs to China, and expect an influx of immigrants from your southern border if he dries up the jobs.
Then ask him when his brand name is going to start manufacturing in the US.
3
Trump's idea of "negotiating" is: I want everything that I want, and you get nothing. Oh, and if we somehow reach an agreement, most likely I won't honor it anyway. This is how he conducted himself presiding over his sleazy real estate empire and he's brought this practice into the White House. Except the stakes are so much higher. The man is a menace to the planet on so many levels.
5
I really don't understand NAFTA. On the surface it seems that a company can hire cheaper labor in Mexico i.e. Bosch or the car companies which would seem like that would weaken our country and the workers who'd had those jobs originally. If someone could explain this situation in plain and simple language as if to a 4th grader I would really appreciate it. I don't want a pro-Trump or anti-Trump attitude. I just want facts. Thank you.
Americans are sitting on their hands while their house is being torched and burned by an ignorant, self-centered and egomaniac president.
It must be understood that in a capitalist global economy, one that the US champions, profit seeking companies have no patriotic allegiance. American jobs are being offshored due to labor costs and value of currency. The US government has largely failed to assist displaced workers so that they can be retrained for jobs with similar or better income.
Withdrawing from trade agreements will not bring the lost jobs back unless the US walled off itself from the global economy. Even then, the US economy will be in ruin, standard of living plummets. The scenario is too bleak to contemplate.
2
For a man who claims to be pro-business, Trump is aiming to harm American farmers, a large segment of our business community.
3
Thank goodness Canada began to look at other trading partners even the EU. Once Trump was elected it was known the US is not a good trading partner. My god the guy thinks because Wall Street is up the US deficit and debt is down. The man is stupid sorry and by the way IQ is never a measure of one's ability some of the people who score the highest on IQ tests in the real world have no clue like him. American unions were destroyed actually for all those Ronnie Reagan lovers during his eight years and then Bush. Try looking back like when the company that makes spark plugs crushed the union and used scab workers to replace higher paid union employees it was in the Ronnie years. I guess everyone forgot about the chaos when he fired all the air traffic controllers. I enjoy the scab workers who took the jobs of union workers they have now lost their jobs to lower paid workers. What a hoot to listen to the scabs scream now. Reason their wages became to high. Trump knows very little of economics or in the real world how business operates. Gee, a guy who American banks won't touch with a ten foot pole - casinos bankrupt four times and stiffed thousands out of their money. Gee, some of the same people voted for him. As the education system of the US has fallen so has the American intelligence. As for looking back to see how this all happened - did they make a reality tv show about it. If not who would know. America will soon discover the world does not depend on them. Jim Trautman
6
Every day it's another stomach churning proclamation, another twist to the definition of "America", another embarrassment broadcast to the world, another ride backwards in history with a (possibly) ill man at the wheel and a heavy foot on the gas pedal.
Is there no one no law that can be invoked NOW to reign him in or just make him STOP?
Silence from both sides of the aisle? They can't ALL be Russian props. Can they?
4
These generic statements about "American workers" losing their jobs or getting jobs, devoid of facts and specifics, are about creating political drama in the service of nationalism/isolationism. Does anyone really think that a "job coming back from" Mexico is going to pay a living wage?
12
As a Canadian, I'm asking my MPs and Mr. Trudeau to work as fast as they can to reduce the trade with the U.S. We have too many eggs in this basket, and it looks like America is dropping the basket.
As a businessman, I'm looking for alternative non-US suppliers, because I think there is a real chance that the U.S. economy will shatter.
The present track of the U.S. is going to result is a serious devaluation of the US dollar, which would ok, for importers like me, but which will mean that the large number of businesses that sell primarily into the U.S. will go down the tubes.
1
While I'm not a Trump supporter, I keep an eagle eye on the goings-on in this corporate owned American government, especially on the United States Chamber of Commerce, being intimately aware of its history and it's entirely business only representation, evidenced by the most obscene level of lobbying and billion dollar payouts ever seen in the history of the economic life of the United States.
"Spending as much as $300,000 a day on lobbying, more than any other group or company, the Chamber has opposed efforts to give shareholders more oversight of corporate pay, strengthen the independence of corporate auditors, and create the watchdog Consumer Financial Protection Agency. It’s trying to kill the Employee Free Choice Act (EFCA), which would make it easier for workers to unionize. It has run TV ads in 20 states warning that a public health care option would lead to “government control over your health.”"
http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2010/01/fact-checking-chamber-commer...
If the Chamber is for NAFTA, you can be 100% certain we should oppose it.
2
Imposing tariffs is not "draining the swamp." In the short run, the US sector likely to be hit hardest is farming, particularly corn production in Iowa and Nebraska. Do Trump voters in these states understand how badly their economies are likely to be hurt if Trump pulls the plug on NAFTA? We've gotten used to Trump talking a lot but accomplishing little. In this context, however, he can pull the plug on his own, without Congressional approval. If he does so, hold on to your wallets. The stock market is going to take a very wild ride.
This Nation began with the escape from one mad king and now we are going to watch it destroyed by another mad king. When did we become a dictatorship? Why are we allowing this destruction just so that 30% of our discomforted citizens can feel good about being racists?
7
It is quite clear the fellow, in his infinite ignorance and short-range comprehension, has never read the NAFTA or the Iran treaties. His attention span is condensed in a short “liddle” teweetie where the title of either accord does not fit (toooo long for his liddle brains). How much longer we have to tolerate this abomination depends on the speed of Mr. Mueller’s probe. C’mon, Mr. Mueller, hurry up the very existence of the planet is at stake.
In the past we counted on the Congress, but now with the bunch of useless Ryan GOPers the fate of the USA and world rest on you.
2
Leaving aside the political background of the negotiation talks, my concern is that without NAFTA, North American products will struggle to compete with the rest of the world, given how manufacturing and supply chains have been interweaved over the last 20 years in the region. It would have been great to see the agreement modernized as a result of these negotiations, but killing it just because you can will hurt the whole region.
2
Why doesn't this sick old man simply take to his bed? Bad for country!
1
We gotta impeach him. Pronto!
4
NAFTA was basically doomed from the minute Trump entered office. His so called bargaining position was so thoroughly laced with poison pills that there was no chance that either Canada or Mexico would accept it as it stood. But, Canada now has CETA and trade deals with China so the loss of NAFTA will not be the end of the world. Mexico has their own advantages and will not kowtow to Trump and Americans may have to get used to paying higher prices for some goods. The take away from this will be that you can’t treat sovereign nations like contractors and expect to getaway with it. So much for “The Art of the Deal”.
6
Well, when food costs more if it doesn't come from America, and cars get more expensive and parts become hard to get and you still don't get that great paying manufacturing job that Trump promises after getting rid of NAFTA, perhaps his base will join with those who are not: this man is destructive to this country.
5
In the private sector, Trump would have been fired long ago. His supporters wanted someone to run the country like a business? Let's start there.
4
I feel that, over the last thirty years or so, the United States entered into several treaties that were exploitative of its partners, rather than mutually-beneficial. The now-dead TPP treaty was in this respect a successor to NAFTA, and repeated many of its fundamental mistakes.
NAFTA had a lot of opposition in all three countries that were to be a party to it, but these objections were ignored and the treaty was rammed through. It has never lived up to its promises.
Fundamentally, I believe that the hallmark of "a good international treaty, one worth entering into and remaining a part of," is that from the point-of-view of each and every(!) participating country, it puts: "My_Country First!" There are very, very few such treaties on the books today. Thus, under the present trade agreements we see a "race to the bottom" that weakens the most-powerful parties (e.g. the United States), but without actually strengthening the weaker ones (e.g. Mexico).
Therefore, I think that we =should= re-negotiate NAFTA, or, if we cannot do so, do away with it. The three neighboring countries will of course continue to trade, but not under the present terms, which quite-frankly (IMHO) are exploitative by nature. All three countries can do better than this, and all three countries should settle for no less than what is "mutually best" for all of them.
If each country says, "(USA|Mexico|Canada First! And we expect you to do the same!", (ONLY) THEN will we get "a great treaty."
2
The trade with China is the problem, not NAFTA. That is the reason that cancelling TPP was such a big mistake. NAFTA alone could be easily updated, and this update was already incorporated in TPP, where Mexico and Canada are also participants. Why EU is different in their approach to trade agreements? They heavily invest in small businesses with grants and loans, evading these agreements, and allow them to prosper and grow under federal protection. We do not do that!
Without TPP China is firmly in control of Asian economies and their dominance in manufacturing will only go unabated.
Nafta destroyed farmers in Mexico which is the major driving force behind the immigration to the US. Remove Nafta and Mexican farmers don't need to compete with subsidized US agro giants.
10
Again the little guy will loose. If NAFTA is cancelled, Canada will shift its trade towards Europe (free trade in place) and China (free trade being negotiated). Once those channels are established they will not come back to the USA. Goods made completely in the USA means more expensive goods for the little guys who can ill afford the cost increase. Remember that trade barriers work both ways. Who would want more expensive goods from the USA especially if they also have duties "a la Boeing".
4
Terminating NAFTA will result in a loss of U.S. car export market-share; reduced taxable income and reduced income tax revenues.
I drive a Chevy made in the USA. I have leased or owned a U.S.-made vehicle since NAFTA. Do you think the majority of Canadians will automatically buy more expensive U.S.-made cars with zero Canadian content? Why not buy Korean, Japanese or German cars instead?
Canadians pay more for U.S.-made cars since I can remember. The premium is understood as partly foreign exchange and to pay for 'Canadian content value' in U.S. made vehicles sold in Canada.
Trade will follow value-price rules of business. As tariffs increase, product costs increase and, barring other value considerations, demand for a product will be reduced. Less vehicles sold results in lower sales and lower taxable income: lower government tax revenues. Duties collected at the border may or may not balance lost income taxes, due to reduced sales and profits.
Trade theorists consider the world as clusters of natural endowments - both material and human. IT firms import highly educated people - like the current CEO of Microsoft, for technology work in the USA. If import and visa rules change, what stops (say) Microsoft from doing an 'end-run' and developing "more" assets in India, instead of the U.S.?
If Canadian auto workers prove to offer good value in terms of cost-benefit compared to U.S. workers, who benefits by raising U.S. import duties? More expensive U.S. workers.
2
The quality of cars is 100% better on the foreign ones I come from a family that several worked in US car plants. I drive a Japanese car, American companies still make junk no matter what the tv ads say. Just like Trump run ads that are fake. The foreign car companies are way ahead of the US makers in alternative vehicles the wave of the future. I am sure with Trump and the crook that is the head of the EPA the US will continue to make gas guzzling junk. Americans are like the Brits who still have not caught on that the Sun sank on the Empire a long time ago. Also Americans believe trade is a one way street. Fine don't buy from China that makes Rubber Maid bins I guess Americans are going to be happy buying them American made at three times the price. Hate unions Americans yes, you will see your wages go up. Trump and his demented band are bringing in a new form of slavery - those Confederate states love living in 1860 and the Master/Slave relationship. Trump like always claims he knows so much, but did not know there was a 25th Amendment to the Constitution. Someone seen him carrying a Bible lately ask him to quote from it. His followers are stupid people who just love creating chaos. Next up the pact with Iran. Fine all the other countries are getting the business and Cuba other countries are dealing there. What is his IQ? Jim Trautman
1
Donald Trump styles himself as a deal-maker, but so far during his term in office, he has only been a deal-breaker: TPP, the Paris Accord etc. And now NAFTA and the Iranian nuclear weapons deal are teetering on the brink. We don't see on the horizon any actual deals to be made by him.
8
What uninformed elitist comments ... 70,000 factories closed in this country since NAFTA and and all those jobs with them. Stop thinking with your political ideology and start thinking about all the pain and misery this trade agreement caused your fellow citizens.
6
The problem is one of economics, not ideology. Jobs move off shore because the cost of production here in the US is much higher than in competing countries. Foreign goods come here and are sold to Americans at much lower prices than they could be sold if they were made domestically. So, some lose their manufacturing jobs, but many more benefit from low prices. If Trump dumps NAFTA, be ready to pay a LOT more for basic goods than you're paying now. What do you suppose would be the effect on our economy if the price of most of the products you now buy went up by 50-100%? It would be devastating. Trump simply does not understand the ramifications of his meddling, but the economists do, and they're predicting a disaster if he bails out on this trade agreement.
4
You might be referring to your own comment when it comes to uninformed. Moving jobs offshore has gone on for decades. Most of them actually went to China and other Asian countries. And it never occurs to those whining about trade agreements that a lot of people in the U.S. actually make good livings from trade...the import/export business is substantial.
Finally, there are NO jobs coming back. Never going to happen, and unilaterally pulling out of NAFTA will not create jobs in the U.S. The jobs in manufacturing that were lost over the last several decades don't even exist now. Labor has become a tiny fraction of the cost of manufacturing. If you were well-informed you'd know this.
Eclectic Pragmatism — http://eclectic-pragmatist.tumblr.com/
Eclectic Pragmatist — https://medium.com/eclectic-pragmatism
1
Ever hear of automation. Guess what they can build a car now with as little as two people. Did you think you get cheap cars because they still have long assembly lines. They put cars together like Lego blocks. As for housing the soft wood lumber comes from Canada not because we cheat, but because it is the type used in home construction. With the new duty and tariffs listen to home builders thousands are going to be added to the price of a house. What Trump and his supporters know about economics and the cost of things is amazing. They with their high school education need to take a course in economics. The highest cost of products is the labor and guess what products are cheap due to machines. More machines more product therefore the cost goes down. Go to a craft store and guess what that purse costs a lot more than one that comes out of a factory. Simple it is hand made and there the labor costs are high. In reality machines are doing more and more - trade agreements did not make the problem it was automation which is becoming more and more each day. Smart nations with leaders look ahead the US with Trump and his ilk don't have the grey matter for that task. Food cheap in the US guess why - try factory farms. The little farm is long gone. Jim Trautman
1
Hasn't 'he' leaned what happens in the wake of a revolution?
Is it 'broke'?
Try then Evolution first.
1
Here's a guy who, along with his daughter, have all products made offshore and who have made absolutely no move to bring them back to the U.S. to provide jobs for Americans. Whatever his base sees in this man is absolutely nonsense based upon this truth alone. Wake up!
12
Trump is a wrecking ball. Blow up NAFTA, dismantle the ACA, take away women's access to birth control and abortions, discredit the media and denigrate all who disagree with you.
These are just a few examples of his lack of governing and leadership. He is perverting the Constitution and trying to destroy our Democracy. How much longer will we have to endure his anger and impulsivity?
38
The private equity firms have cost more jobs than NAFTA. The tax incentives to perform a 'buyout' of a company, leverage it to the moon, earn huge fees for mismanagement or bankruptcy and then dump it on the public is a disgrace.
Bain, KKR, Blackstone, Carlyle, Apollo, Goldman Sachs (100's more) have decimated jobs across the US. It sickens me that a couple of hundred people can wipe out an economy without any scrutiny.
9
Trump continues his war against the world. He wants to please his base. Even those people, among he least-educated and least successful in this country, will wake up someday and turn their pitchforks on him.
5
Here comes another instance of Trump's heretic hearsay about abolishing everything Obama tried and crafted. Trump has feigned quite a few things, and ''toughness'' is just another cloak, he would like to hide beneath. In a nutshell, he ain't no astute statesman, and nor, even a pecksniffian politician. Rex would beat him in an IQ test neck and crop. His activities reek of rodomontade, coming from a ragtag ruffian. In essence, he so supremely qualifies to be a magnificent magpie.
Aside from NAFTA, his other favorite targets are Iran deal, DACA, ACA, climatic catastrophes, and tax reforms, all of which he would, for sure, love to muck around with. He seems to think politics is just a bagatelle, and as a result of his inchoate policy announcements, his base is facing a possible attrition. His arguments against anything, NAFTA in particular, stink of his analphabetic attitudes.
The silent spectators in the GOP might appear to feel besmirched by this person, who is blatantly benighted about many mundane issues. One can safely bet he may not even fully comprehend the intricacies of any previous bills, NAFTA in particular, which involves 2 important neighbors, Canada and Mexico. In short, Trump seems like an ardent fan of brinkmanship.
2
it is time we looked out for Americans whose jobs were sent to Mexico by the NAFTA agreement. It is immoral not to take care of your own folks whose deserve a paycheck and a sense of pride in their job. Welfare destroys people and families. NAFTA must be fair and Trump is 100% correct. America First!!!!
4
Immoral? Regardless of what you think about America first policies, in what religion or philosophical platform is it moral to care more about someone solely based on their citizenship. If you are Christian, I suggest you reread the Bible
3
I can already see it, a major trade agreement that's 25 years old and in need of an overhaul is called evil and should be done away with to save America. Enter Trump,the hero, who will destroy the evil pact... and replace it with a "new" renegotiated "nafta". Trump:Flim Flam man,The Music man,the three card monte guy. They're all the same guy. They want you money and respect.They deserve neither.
4
The drums for impeachment grow louder and louder every day. He leaves no doubt in anyone's mind that he is devoid of mental stability and must be removed, lest we find ourselves in a huge Constitutional crisis or even worse, a war where millions of people could potentially lose their lives. We cannot and should not send our soldiers to die in a war because we have a totally deranged lunatic living out his fantasy. This man is the worst in a human being, lacking even the basic care for human life. Everyday he perceives a new threat occurring only in his mind to his fragile ego. Those in power in government have a duty to protect America from any and all threats. Right now, this is our biggest threat to our security and survival as a nation. Do Your Job or will do our job in the elections as YOU serve us, not we serve you.
6
Hear, hear! Truth, well-said. I would add that all of these things were apparent since the beginning of the Evil Empire.
1
The best part of destroying NAFTA will be that the poor, rural Americans will pay the price in a big way. I'm done fighting for them.
9
If only the talk of scrapping Trump became reality...
1
Americans, you do know that you have an overall surplus in trade with Canada?
7
And we own a good percentage of Canadian exporters. Humpty Dumpty. . .
Now US and Canadian auto workers won't have to compete with $2/hr Mexican workers and their government "union." On the bright side, why not a new NAFTA, with the UK in it - North ATLANTIC Free Trade Area?
3
And the EU too.
Trump didn't mention that when he cleans out the swamp in Washington it would all come flooding into your communities. Fasten your seat belts America we are in for a rougher ride than you thought you voted for.
1
Trump said he is embarrassed by all these deals made by the Obama administration and berates them. We should all be embarrassed by this so called president, I know I am. He is bringing down this country and turning it into a laughing stock for the rest of the world, developed and not. He's not a deal maker, he's a deal destroyer. The US is going to lose out big time (or as he says, biggly) and let other countries fill in the voids he is creating. He is a loser and taking us down with him, as he did/does with his businesses. What are the people in power doing to stop him? And Putin loves watching it happen, or should I say, Putin loves helping it happen.
5
Trump is acting, and is probably crazy - check.
Trade deficits are bad for American jobs - check. Are you feeling any cognitive dissonance yet?
The big Kanuna, China - oops what happened to that one? As they buy up our companies and real estate, I'm reminded of the tale of the Indians who sold Manhattan for trinkets. I know that story is most likely untrue, but it is a cautionary tale, told to young people to prevent them from doing something stupid. Apparently someone didn't listen. I feel like the lone Indian out on the edge of the action, watching the chief and his sycophants oogle the trinkets while trading away our future.
Trump will do what Vladimir Putin wants him to do. Based on everything Trump has done so far, Putin wants the U.S. isolated, bitterly divided and bankrupt. I believe Trump and the Republican Congress can achieve that.
5
Don't believe it. The center of this issue is car production. Are we going to take it away from Mexico and Canada? Yes. Where is it going? Overseas.
We're desperate to lure the Middle and Far East over to capitalism aka US. Turkey has a brand spanking new car plant courtesy big money. The US knows we can wipe out decades of bombing and destroyed cities by 'rebuilding' with our favorite toy, the car.
This was all part of the long rang plan after winning a direct oil line from Iraq to the Med, that part of the dream failed to come true but the rebuilding is still planned on. We want to rob the Russia/China Silk Road Alliance of their chance to build the war crippled economies of the Middle East. But. first we have to remove ourselves from NAFTA. Nice to know nothing changes, that the US worker is still at the bottom of the list.
1
My instinct is to think if Trump wants to kill it, NAFTA must be a good thing and should not be killed.
But the economics is so complex, much as I read about this, I'm left confused and uncertain.
Where is the analysis of what it actually does, has done and will do for the variety of industries it affects?
Did NAFTA empty out all those Rust Belt factory towns?
If it were killed would all those towns grow back? Or would robots return in the place of human workers?
Who are/will be the winners and losers?
Your article is about the politics, who said what.
Where is Paul Solman when you need him?
2
NAFTA is, according to Noam Chomsky, not so much a trade agreement as it is an investor-protection agreement. Capital is allowed to slosh across the border at the whim of the Masters of the Universe while labor is, uh, not.
While I have no problem with investors wanting to protect themselves, their investments, and their capital, I do have a problem when those protections come at the *expense* of labor (which lost a lot of bargaining power through limits on the use of the courts to sue) and the environment (which the protection of investors in NAFTA precludes in ways that are transparently pro-investor, pro=capital, and anti-environment by also limiting the rights of people and institutions to use the courts to protect themselves and their children's futures).
That the auto industry has streamlined its supply chains throughout N. America has probably kept the cost of automobiles down for buyers across the continent could be a good thing, but each one of those automobiles is a polluter.
5
Just a reminder:
When NAFTA was being negotiated, workers (unions, etc.) fought tooth and nail against it as did many progressive Democrats.
Ross Perot talked about the "great sucking sound" as the US lost blue-collar jobs to Mexico. A prediction that has come true.
It was one of Bill Clinton's famous "triangulations" as he promoted himself as business friendly New Democrat.
7
Donald Trump. The Reality Show King. Making the Western World and America last, with the American worker left holding the bag. What a nightmare! What a disgrace! What a decline!
6
Apparently he takes great pleasure in seeing many Canadians as well as Mexicans suffer as well. We are all being held hostage by this senile old man who thinks cliff hangers are a way to run a nation.
Has it not become adequately apparent that this so-called president is a madman. In every sense of the term ...he angry mad, he is crazy mad, he is racist mad, he is rabid mad. Congress needs to reign him in until Mueller can get the keys for the GrayBar Hotel and put him away before he literally destroys this country and much of the world!
7
Another well combed (that is of contrary opinions) DNC pushed propaganda piece filled with moral righteousness and completely dismissing the thought that any but neo Nazi's might be against NAFTA (or Tip for that matter).
As though 'The Nation' the US's oldest Left Newspaper who have consistently along with many unions and human rights activists opposed this dreadful agreement; is Trumpian;
If one is too believe the Clinton clones here, everyone else is bad, especially those like Sanders who 'obviously' is part of the Putin/Trump team, along with anybody else who does not approve of NAFTA; a part of the post Reagan landscape that helped destroy our middle classes. By FAR the biggest reason for Trump's victory was this very MSM. The NYT is no longer an honest journalistic opposition but destructive and confrontational, like the GOP is now a totally controlled organization, that is so arrogant they think the DNC insiders are the US people who do not deserve to choose their candidate; 'the oligarchs know best'.
In the same way the Ukraine made its Russian ethnics into 2nd calls citizens by banning their language (and yes waving swastikas but hey they're OUR Nazis), the NYT have become manipulative of public opinion by ONLY publishing opinions consistent with neo liberalism; the same narrow blinkered arrogance that presented us with the most expensive 'perfect candidate' of all time who lost and then blamed the world.
The NYT is now the DNC's FOX, Forget fair and balanced!
5
Sorry, but US Presidential candidates have to win primary elections to run as their party’s choice.
You must be thinking of Russia.
4
As an American in Canada, I wonder how Trudeau controlled his face during the press conference. I applaud the control he had to not roll his eyes. Trump has complained about dairy and soft lumber, neither of which is covered by NAFTA. In the meantime, Canada has already negotiated a trade treaty with Europe and Asia. If he withdraws from NAFTA, the previous treaty and the Autopact goes back in effect . In the area where I live, cross border shopping will be affected and will hurt the economy in Buffalo and Niagara Falls. Will Canada be hurt by NAFTA collapsing, of course, but the US will be in worse shape because it doesn’t have the other treaties to fall back. I am just shaking my head.
12
What does it mean that it will send shock waves through the world? Does it mean that Canada and Mexico and the US would become enemies? Does it mean they will find a new, better, dare I suggest it - fairer one? I don't know. But I do know when agreements, treaties, associations, etc. end or negotiated, shock waves go through the press and they pull a chicken little.
This is a crazy idea - I know - but, can you imagine if instead of the press trying to sabotage the pres. (and he's president, whether you like him or not) and call him out on bluffs, or paint our country as the bad guy in every deal, the press just presented the news without the editorial section engulfing the front page? Like most news stories, this one is more editorial. I know that won't satsify the "resistance," but it would be refreshing.
I usually add, for the sake of those with TDS, I don't think much of him either, and wouldn't vote for him. But, better him than a member of the "resistance," if those are the options. And there should be better options.
1
Trump withdrew from TPP negotiated with 12 countries.
Now he is threatening to do the same with NAFTA. If
the president manages to complete his term, USA will
have no trade agreement, a weakened NATO and
possible start of a major war in Korean penninsula.Not
sure what his base perceived in him to put him into the
whitehouse. He is proving to be a disaster.
4
As far as I am concerned, the only two goods things Trump has done is to withdraw from the TPP and talk tough on NAFTA.
3
Trump loves a lose lose situation.
He wants to keep Mexicans from flooding into the US. But he wants to revoke the trade deal that helped Mexico grow it's economy, become another successful economic market for the US to sell into while slowing the immigration to the US. revoke NAFTA and see that tide reverse.
Canada meanwhile has a large trade deficit with the US buying much more from the US than it sells. All those primary resources Canada sends to the US for it to manufacture and resell - say good bye to trade and all those cheap resourse prices
Scuttle NAFTA and make America lose.
4
Let's support unions and not corporations. Unions are the way to the middle class. Nafta is union-busting.
3
This is similar to almost all Trump administration initiatives - tough talk that sounds good to his narrow political base, but absolutely impracticable in the real world.
The idea that it would somehow help our economy and American workers to try to return to pre-1994 trading arrangements is totally crazy. The world we're living in and planning for is 2017 and beyond, not 1993 and before. Globalization and complex supply chains are not going to vanish at our whim.
Other countries and businesses will not stop competing in the modern world just because we've decided we don't want to. The U.S. will simply be bypassed and fall further and further behind.
Furthermore, the whole ethos behind post-WWII trade agreements is keeping the peace between major countries through economic intertwining. It has worked. Undermining that philosophy is dangerous as well as counterproductive.
6
If you look at the world economies over the last 75 years the U S A has done rather well in the view of most economists.The problem is not Global Trade Agreements its what the government has allowed to occur ,while pandering to special interest groups ,which dramatically changed the distribution of wealth across society.Trump wants to continue this disaster at even a faster pace.His supporters will figure this out in a few years.When they are poorer than ever and Trump and his buddies are richer than ever.
6
Like he scuttled the Trans Pacific pact, Trump wants to do away with Nafta completely. He is anti-foreign trade, anti-climate, anti-most everything that is good, somehow believes we can survive being an island in the world.
6
Canada must continue to negotiate trade deals with China and far east countries, Europe and Latin America...we must diversify as much as possible to bring down are huge dependence on the US for trade.
6
Reaching new heights in irony, the NY Times comments section today is filled with letters supporting NAFTA and disparaging leftist ideals, U.S. labor unions, and American shift workers. With NAFTA gone, any hourly wage benefit to workers in the U.S. will be lost in their 401K balances as multinational company stocks retreat in response to hindered trade and tariffs. It is just funny to see readers criticize every Trump move even though removing NAFTA is consistent with leftist policy goals.
4
I'd feel a little less apprehensive about Trump's tough talk about NAFTA if I thought he even knew what NAFTA stood for.
5
Mexico has already negotiated with Argentina to buy billions in grain rather than buy from the US. I wonder how many farmers who voted for Trump will get hit where it hurts most? That inexpensive produce we can get from Mexico and Central America any time we want? Kiss that goodbye too. He has no clue what impact this will have on the US economy
41
I am sure his advisors know, but, hey, they're all gazillionaires. They could care less.
And therein lies the problem, he has no clue...
negotiation 101 is to have a strategy to walk away i.e. in this case dealing with each separately would gain enormous leverage for the usa
1
Yes , real wages have been stuck at 1972 levels, causing despair among blue collar and middle class workers. But during the same period corporate profits rose more than twentyfold. Maybe we should look at who was at the table when these deals were made. Join a union , an environmental group, a social club, and discuss these issues. Then make sure that people who really represent you are sitting at the table where decisions are made. Other wise , you will be letting the billionaire class make all the decisions in their own interests.
And by the way, Trump is more concerned with his business than with your welfare.
13
Now Trump's base will finally discover what they voted for. Those who think Trump was/is such a great businessman will finally see why he went through so many bankruptcy proceedings. It will take decades to make America great again after Trump destroys the economy and the environment. That is if he doesn't start a nuclear war and destroy the whole planet first.
12
The only thing that's bad for the US is Donald Trump.
9
Yes, there would be short-term chaos and consequences, but the overall benefits of leaving NAFTA to the American worker would be considerable.
The problem here is not Canada -- both the US and Canada benefit from free trade -- but Mexico.
Free trade with third world countries has been a disaster for the American worker, as factories have moved to low-wage countries and the labor movement rendered powerless.
Arguably, the fact that Donald Trump is now president of the United States is a consequence of the failed free-trade policies pushed by economists who didn't understand its effect on blue collar workers, macroeconomics, and social stability.
3
If I run a large company that sells products all over the world and the President of the US tells me that I can't produce in his country because the work force can't compete without tariffs in place, I'm moving the entire supply chain out.
People in this country don't understand that their are customers all over the world and in some cases there are more of them outside the US than inside the US. Nafta has integrated a highly sophisticated supply chain that is competitively priced that allowed companies like BMW, Toyota and Mercedes Benz to build cars at a very competitive price and export them all over the world.
If this agreement is scuttled and protective tariffs are put in place you can expect these companies to leave. The US will lose jobs and the cost of goods are likely to go up.
17
The article mentions business leaders becoming spooked (and rightfully so) however you wouldn't know it looking at the stock market. At some point, everyone must realize that the markets are becoming just as detached from reality as Trump and the Republican party. Talk of war against North Korea, the dismantling of trade, health care and security policies are not spooky enough as long as Trump delivers on the all mighty tax cut for corporations.
15
The US isn't the entire economic world any longer. There are more I-phones and cars sold in China. There is an emerging middle class in Asia and China that is approaching a Billion people. They don't just produce stuff, they buy stuff.
Mexico, which used to be just rich and poor has had an emerging middle class. They are producers and consumers. There are over a million US citizens who live in Mexico, many of them illegally because they can't get services in this country any longer.
I can see US young people knocking on the wall trying to get south in under a decade if this thinking isn't reversed and done quickly.
3
The boy king has decided all things built by those before him are BAD. He must destroy all these things because America before him was BAD. All the people who worked to negotiate NAFTA where stupid.
All the business development enabled by NAFTA must therefore be destroyed. All the billions spent and millions of jobs must be thrown to the wind.
He is beating the drums of war to destroy North Korea which will destroy South Korea. He is attacking the Iran deal which will likely lead to more war in the Middle East.
Trump the destroyer of the world. After, of course he destroys everything Obama did.
Are we getting tired of this?
Will the GOP clean up after their Russian dog.
20
You may very well marvel at how well he's done in the destroying stakes but he does have experience and form.
With little assistance from others, he managed to destroy 18 of his own businesses (from airline to steaks to water), 4 of his own companies; and his one public company. Amazingly, he is alone in the history of mankind in managing repeatedly to lose money in the gambling business in Atlantic city.
But try convincing his base of those acts.
1
Trump should be removed from office NOW before he does more damage to America and the world at large. Congress knows the man is ill. They should save our country from this demented leader. It is their patriotic duty.
14
What damage? I am years closer to retirement with the Dow almost at 23,000. Life is good. And there have been no real policy actions that affect the taxpayers in this country, which is another huge plus for those of us who work 60-70 hours per week.
1
I would suggest you cash out your investments today if you want to retire. The inevitable crash is coming.
3
So right watch once the King tears up the trade deals who will the US companies be trading with themselves. Remember the DOT COM crash, the housing crash, one thing about Wall Street it is just one large Ponzi scam the ride up and then the crash down. Like the raging weather that is happening that Trump denies anything changed the Wall Street crashes it seems come every ten years or so once the greed gets so great and the cooked books get revealed. The US is like the scene in the Wizard of Oz "Don't look behind the Curtain." Jim Trautman
1
If the US emerges from this GOP darkness still a republic then Trump will go down as its worst leader.
14
Well, I think survival of the republic or not, Trump will still go down as its worst leader.
Let NAFTA die then. At the very least the minority of Canadians who consider Trump being the actual Second Coming will get to experience first hand the disaster this American kakistocracy really is.
10
Should we tell Trump that Obama had nothing to do with NAFTA? (Obama was a civil rights attorney in Chicago at that time).
15
Why is the North American Free Trade Agreement acronym Nafta. Shouldn't it be NAFTA?
1
Is NAFTA a good or bad deal for America? That's an arguable, and really, not the right question to ask. It is important for leaders to ask the right question, and that question is, "where does America want to go next"? So far, Trump's approach has been to cancel programs and agreements without answering the important question of what comes next, and in the case of cancelling NAFTA, the results will be catastrophic for Canada and even worse for America. Canada is the #1 export customer for 31 states. Aside from oil, the balance of trade is greatly in your favour. Until you know what you want, please leave NAFTA alone.
5
Trump careens from one idiocy to the next. Let's see how our auto industry fares if trade with Canada and Mexico is blown up. Kind of hard to build a car if half its parts come from across our borders.
7
Sounds to me that the only losers would be big Ag and a bunch of farmers and ranchers. I do remember that when this agreement was first pushed by its backers one of the main points was how beneficial it would be to farmers. Except for Ross Perot, no one thought about the working class people.
Maybe Trump is doing working class people a favor. No one knows the final consequences until NAFTA is gone.
I am not a Trump support, but like many others in this country, I never did like it and never wanted it. It is business and farmers who wanted it and now they are the ones who want to keep it. That tells you how good it has been for US factory workers.
2
Farmers the real working class they would suffer most terribly as duty and tariffs on those kind of products can be highest 75% where automobile tariff would only be a few percent.
Every Commodity is different it is the small farmers and growers that would be hurt at the most!
The big automakers if this happens they will just move everything over to China this is a lose lose if he suddenly ends the complete North American trade that has been active and overwhelmingly successful consumers only look at some job losses they never take into account all the products that they get cheaper.... to!!!! With free trade,
1
While ignorance of the results may be a reason many people support leaving NAFTA, it's not a good enough reason to leave.
3
Now let's see...
Trump wages economic war on our friendly neighboring countries who have been in compliance with the NAFTA deal signed by the United States. The demise of NAFTA may lead to collapse of the US automobile industry and loss of manufacturing jobs in the auto parts supply chain.
So who may become the new trade partners of our sovereign neighbors? China? Russia? Brazil? All of Latin America?
And maybe the close and friendly country to our North may find trade across the melting Arctic icecap with Russia, Asia, and Northern Europe a more profitable and reliable way to export its abundant natural resources.
And what will America's agribusinesses do with all that high fructose corn syrup?
Four years of the Trump one man government show and America will be the "exceptional" country with no friends in the world. Can you spell "pariah?"
Putin grins, laughs and stands ready to make deals!
11
Trump can't risk a recession, financial crash, or weakened economy. I mean, forget the worker, forget America, it's all about him and his ratings.
4
Maybe NAFTA can be saved if Mexico agrees to pay for a wall, any wall, wherever.
1
Perhaps around the White House...?
2
Every time I hear Trump describe something as "as the worst in history," I can't help but smile just a little at the laughable notion that someone with the attention span of a gerbil could speak with authority about history.
Then the smile goes away when I think about the damage he is inflicting not just on the US, but on the world.
12
However, he may just become the worst President in US history.
Oh goody. Mexico only supplies almost half of our fresh produce. And California (provides another almost half) is on fire.
Hello expensive produce from Chile!!
6
Hello increased incentives for our domestic farmers!
2
Strange thing is that in the short time I've been in Mexico I've noticed that nearly every thing I've bought says Made in Mexico. Not made in China or made in USA. Trump might be on to something.
2
I believe the common thread of trade deals is that they favor the large company over the small business. Look at Mexico- they had flourishing small farms supplying local cafes with fresh food. Now their small farmers cannot compete again United States Big-Ag and the farms go under. And their local cafes are now McDonalds and KFC. And their people are suddenly obese. Trade is supposed to provide variety of products to different countries, but it really winds up giving the benefit to those that have large economies of scale.
Can NAFTA be rewritten to help the little guy?
6
Trump does not care who or how many people it hurts if he can fulfill one of his ill-conceived campaign promises. He continues to tell us what a disaster NAFTA is, but he never really says what he thinks is wrong with it. It is just another Trump action to destabilize our system.
7
Once Trump begins to make the buying and selling of American products overseas more difficult - either through irreversible damage to the American brand or through reckless, Fox-news-driven changes in policy - that is the time he needs to go. Of course we could wait to see how it all plays out, but by then it will be too late and the cause and effect surreality conservatives seem to live in will be firmly in place.
As someone who spends half of his time working overseas, the damage he is doing is starting to take hold. The more Trump fools around, trying really hard to be the "great negotiator," the more our allies, trading partners and collaborators will be looking hard at the Chinese, Russians, African countries, etc. for alternatives. This is not an acceptable scenario.
6
Dear Republican Party,
It is time for you to take care of this mess you created or we will all blame you for it. Trump is a menace to everyone as your Senator Corker made clear. When he doesn't have a bona fide crisis to address, you let him play with nuclear matches and sharp trade objects because he is not getting the spotlight. However, even the traditional business elements of the party should be terrified by his suggestion that we should essentially violate every important trade deal in the world. This can only end badly. While many American (largely in your party) are too small-minded to understand that the US is no longer as important to the world as it was after WW II, you need to take action before we as a nation become an economic basket case. The world can function without us and you will be ceding our markets to others because of Trump's actions
Who will want to trade with a partner whose word has no meaning? Who will want to make treaties with a nation who can't be trusted. We will soon be likened to other rogue states, which is frankly what we now resemble. The consequences if we fire a nuke at North Korea without showing a willingness to talk will be unbelievable - and American business will be rightly targeted by every country in the world. Frankly, tax reform seems like small potatoes next to this mess you've created.
Fortunately, there is a solution within your power: IMPEACHMENT. Now do it!
6
The only real question is which Trump cronies' pockets will be lined by dissolution of NAFTA..since we know that is the only real consideration - he cares nada about real people.....
4
I'm not thinking there are that many. I am pretty sure there were Clinton cronies who were quite happy with NAFTA, though.
2
The article says farmers have the most concern about lifting NAFTA but arent the great majority of USA farms corporate owned? I would like to see more granularity on exactly how much USA farmers are impacted ( and what kind of farmers) and if we are really talking about $$ and large corporations here. The article is not clear.
9
This, like nearly everything Trump does, is a base play. He fully understands the limited intellect of his primary supporters (and the greed of the wealthier ones). He tells the fools in West Virginia he will bring back coal mining jobs - he can't - so they support him. Meanwhile, China becomes a leader in electric cars and renewable energy technology. He declares NAFTA bad and he will repatriate jobs lost to Mexico - he won't - so the ignorant support him. We pull out of free trade agreements and Europe and Asia create larger trading blocks that leave us out.
Trump knows less about business and economics than he knows about foreign policy which seems an impossibility. But, the equally ignorant fools that support him know even less. What is truly pathetic is the spineless Republicans, who have been champions of free trade forever, do not have guts to stand up to Trump.
Trump needs to be removed from office before he destroys our economy and starts WWIII.
23
It is time for the WORLD to call this megalomaniac's bluff and band together with our own trade treaties against him and the policies he stands for - even if it means boycotting the USA. No-more can we stand back and be bullied this way.
14
When the president speaks to his campaign slogans, his lack of sophistication and knowledge of the issues becomes apparent.
10
Another establishment/media effort, failed. They're caving (pun) on The Wall. Conceding on NAFTA. They're realizing, that bellicosity can be a management style, but only if it is willing to bite. So, hollow rhetoric, as the establishment/media hoped The Donald was, he's not. They should've looked at has willingness to litigate, they could've learned a lot; and avoided making fools of themselves and loosing cred. I.e., "You can't bark down a biter". Even they (establishment/media) don't believe themselves, nor trust one another. And that, hopefully, is the beginning of America's renewal.
1
So, will cancelling NAFTA bring back the jobs that it supposedly destroyed? And what about the jobs that will be destroyed by cancelling the treaty? Surely, the 45th President, in his infinite wisdom, thanks to his high IQ, has already thought of that and has provided answers. Surely!
10
If the Chamber of Commerce is for it, it's bad for the worker.
Just because you don't like Trump, NAFTA is bad for the American worker.
5
Trump's actions have repeatedly told the world that you cannot trust the US. Why go into a deal with this country when another administration will just walk away from it?
12
So, Trump goes after NAFTA and Mexico reacts by electing a Lopez Obrador/Hugo Chavez/Fidel Castro look-alike.
This, in turn, craters the Mexican economy and further devalues the peso, which sends yet another generation of Mexicans across the border to earn money.
When they made up the word rube, they must have been anticipating the Donald.
6
Donald's enablers are rubes.
1
Huh. When he said he would scrap NAFTA while running for office, did you think he was kidding?
Kalidan
3
Even an idiot can be right occasionally. Trump was one of the first political leaders to recognize how bad trade deals destroyed the working class. But Nafta is not the biggest trade problem. Our trade with China and other Pacific export economies has done more damage to our working and middle class.
Wilbur Ross makes an excellent point about one of the contentious items on the table. China is exporting many auto electronic parts to Mexico that are being incorporated into products and imported to America under Nafta. Considering all of the trade barriers that China imposes on American manufacturing, this abuse should be addressed. Not all of the "non starter" items on the negotiating table are unreasonable.
3
Four years of controversy!
Scrap Nafta, scrap the Iranian deal, scrap the affordable care act, scrap birth control coverage, Paris Accord, and scrap every Obama accomplishment that can be found. This isn't about policy- it's about racism and appealing to a racist base while the world suffers the consequences. It's about a deranged thought process, a dim-witted grandiosity and the consequences of being able to act with impunity one's entire life.
10
The Republicans can and should remove Trump from office. It is past time. The man is flaming crazy and a great danger to our country and the earth. Invoke the 25th amendment please.
10
How much chaos, uncertainty, bigotry, and confusion can this lunatic president sow in the world before either the sycophantic congress or his self-serving cabinet officers take the necessary steps to remove him from office? The man is dangerously ignorant of history, economics, international affairs, and the functions of government. His erratic behavior is increasingly suggesting to some observers that he is sliding from a crippling narcissism to an actual mental breakdown. What more do our elected officials need before they act?
5
If the Republican Party wants to survive it is time they invoke the 25th amendment and remove Trump from office. He is demented and a terrible danger to the world. He is not to be tolerated.
4
I wish one reporter would press this know-nothing oaf on what exactly he doesn't like about it. I expect her sputter and fine without being able to talk about it in the slightest detail.
7
Sherrod Brown has it right that any trade deal that makes multinational corporations nervous is probably good for workers.
The article fails to recognize support by the US Chamber of Commerce probably means it is is good for overpaid CEOs but bad for American worker wages.
The so called poison pills actually seem reasonable, lets revisit each decade or so, lets discourage outsourcing American manufacturing, and lets fine fine the legal accountability measures.
Hey, even proven pathological liar and cognitively challenged Trump might actually get something right.
8
Trump is not capable of being president. It's not just the policies are horrible & destroying the country.
It's that he has terrible intentions. He can't function normally & fulfill basic duties - like disaster relief in Puerto Rico.
If more is not done to save lives in Puerto Rico (Trump tweeted PR was a mess before the hurricane, FEMA can't stay forever) - that should be an impeachable offense. Not saving lives & rebuilding PR should be understood as Trump refusing to do his job - for which he must be impeached.
The other option is his cabinet could take a hard look at why Trump CAN'T deal with hurricane relief in Puerto Rico & decide he's not fit to remain in office. Invoke the 25th Amendment.
Trump can't leave millions of Americans to suffer & die because he can't find the resolve to provide food, water, electricity, reopen hospitals & clinics, rebuild roads. He can't ignore - or blame - people who may die of dysentery, cholera & other diseases of dirty water. This behavior is unconscionable.
The suffering in Puerto Rico, which Trump isn't interested in --- blaming the residents themselves -- should be seen as dereliction of duty. If Trump can't immediately provide all needed assistance, he must be forced out.
No more excuses. People are dying. Without food, water, medical supplies, electricity, many more Americans will die.
Trump's response is so destructive as to be pathological.
This is not what America does to our people.
Get him out of there.
7
I wish every Trump supporter could envision themselves in Puerto Rico where it is hot, there is no potable drinking water, you've eaten up all the food in your house two weeks ago and in order to get anywhere by car or run your generator you have to stand in line 4 hours to get jerry cans filled which you have to carry back to your house because the roads are impassable.
I would have liked long, substantive quotes from labor union representatives in the three countries to balance the long, substantive quotes from various pro-management sources.
(Not to mention the blatant editorializing: "The pact has allowed industries to reorganize their supply chains around the continent to take advantage of the three countries’ differing resources and strengths, lifting the continent’s economies..." That is NOT an objective view of the pact -- it is an opinion, masquerading as journalism.)
10
One thing is very clear since the beginning of this administration; there are no "policy goals". Don the Con has no idea what he is doing. Filing six bankruptcies over the years as a means to salvage his life style while devastating the economic lives of business suppliers is his working model for business acumen. So what's next?...kill all trade agreements, further reducing American employment, production and sales opportunities by his worse deals for the American people, causing the GDP take a major hit that will negatively affect our ability to meet the country's debt obligations while he goes off to hide in one of his off shore golf resorts? He and Bannon are pushing this country right down the polluted river to nowhere...the GOP deserves to disappear from the face of the Earth if its members sit by and do nothing.
1
The GOP is usually easily bought off by lobbyists. Why aren't the lobbyists being more forceful to shut this disaster down? Why is the GOP congress silent? Cowardice goes a long way in the GOP.
1
You know, calling the White House and your representatives in Congress these days we often get busy signals - PEOPLE are calling much more now. Maybe the lobbyists can't get through because the constituents are busy making themselves heard.
1
Shades of Brexit and other acts of self-inflicted economic "carnage." By the time he's finished making America great again, you'll be praying for WWIII just to get it over with.
1
Mr. Trump is destroying US credibility and politicians of all colours are just watching him do it. Actually he is just speeding up the obvious decline of the crumbling US empire. Good night US!
3
If NAFTA is ended, I hope our Canadian gov't kicks out all of the US retailers that operate in Canada. This does not get much press as people focus on goods, but it's the services that we can easily replace with Canadian owned small business.
Starbucks, Mcdonalds, Home Depot, Lowes, UPS, Fedex, Exxon, Nordstrom, GAP, Nike, Midus, and hundreds more should leave or have an extra punitive tax levied.
Even though i know most American's are good people and can't stand Trump, you get the leader you deserve. The blow back around the world is going to be considerable.
13
Reality: despite all the shock and horror of your presidents behaviour, despite the clear and obvious personality flaws, despite the utter self-obsession driven by an unchallenged ego, born of privilege and undeserved wealth, despite the fact that he is actually an appalling business manager who has lost much of what his inheritance might have delivered, despite the fact that every indication is that he does not have even a scintilla of the education, knowledge and intelligence necessary to fulfil the role of POTUS.... nothing will really happen, by any means, to remove him from office until Wall Street and the true power brokers suffer the consequences of his illiterate and chaotic ways. As the Dow and SMP continue to rise on speculation and hubris, and the world is distracted from simple economic analysis of inflated markets and concocted profits, as the very practices that delivered us the global financial meltdown continue unabated, as the greed and self entitlement of the already obscenely wealthy continues to destroy the very fabric of a once great and noble nation, nothing will happen to happen to remove this ugly and divisive excuse of a man who occupies your most elevated a respected office... UNTIL he creates a crisis of confidence that undermines the very (fragile) markets that sustain his circus of self obsession and the political sycophants that support him. Then, faster than you can imagine, the facade will collapse. Destroying NAFTA could do this. Think...!!!
3
"Never take a hostage (in negotiations) you wouldn't shoot."
Does anyone else see this as a general sign of something repulsive about this country? Does anyone see that perhaps our endless gun violence like Vegas and our endless sexism like Weinstein and Cosby is all linked to the culture of unfettered greed by our winner take all capitalism? Chasing massive profit promotes guns because (NRA) lobbyists rain cash on politicians. Weinstein and Cosby ran wild because of the cash they generated.
I am not religious but there is a reason why Greed is one of the 7 deadly sins. And does America have greed in spades.
6
NAFTA was a bad deal to begin with, kudos to the president for killing it. Obama should have done it.
5
The State of Texas does $3 billion of business DAILY thanks to NAFTA. Watch what you wish for.
4
“Don’t worry, he’ll be surrounded by adult thinkers”. Remember this thinking? Guess what?
3
In just April, Trump agreed with Canadian and Mexican to “proceed swiftly” with negotiations to update the deal, according to a statement from the White House.
With the implementation of NAFTA, our economy, has expanded, with the combined GDP for Canada, the U.S. and Mexico is well over an amazing $20.7 Trillion.
Now, according to *dt, it's "Blow it up".
Irrational, out of step, foolish actions; as he lurches from topic to topic. Seemingly unaware of the damage he is doing. *dt is an unbalanced person, bent on wrecking our economy with ill considered actions; his only seeming goal is to "look good" to his ever shrinking base of the uneducated Americans who buy into his bluster.
He is unfit for office.
5
We have a moronic loose cannon running the country. That's clear. It's been funny. Now it gets serious. The problem is the 38% of the country who support him, even when he has run the country into a ditch, will always believe he did not ro it.
His removal would give us President Pence, which is in many ways worse.
That this will not end well is clear, the only question is when does the fin start.
5
Rather odd, coming from a man, along with his daughter, who profits from cheap labor in every country except the U.S.
7
Trump is a deal breaker and definitely not a deal maker. It's as though eradicating anything Obama accomplished isn't enough and his goal is to undo everything everybody has done simply because any deal not done by him is a bad deal. He's prob'ly the best smartest deal makerest person ever.
If this continues he will not only change the face of America he will change the World. And we, the United States could begin the most spectacular fall from power in history. A fall not because of war or geographic overreach but because of the petulant, ignorant and narcissistic behaviors of a fool elected via a quirk in American election law, the Electoral College. Until the likes of Fox News accept their role as primary purveyors of news events and analysis that is based in truth rather than propaganda the movement within 'base' away from Trump will be difficult or impossible. The results could be problematic for the World at large and devastating for every American.
3
Trump talks like a big man with great ideas. He himself has no idea what he is doing now or in the past. Rather than drain the swamp he diverted sewage to it in the form of industry lobbyists in sheepskin clothing. Like all spoiled children he got his way by screaming and later bullying. He screams about nafta. He will not do a thing. In fact I triple dog dare him to. It is too entrenched and benefits too many American businesses. He claims as all republicans claim that democrats and their regulations hurt small businesses. What will scrapping nafta do? Exactly that. Hurt small business that are part of the supply chain. I hope he does try to scrap it. Sooner he does it will hasten the day when the the door hits him on his way out. Like all good republicans he and they whine about how bad things are. Then when they have power they are clueless as to how to really make this country great. Burn more coal. Shun our allies. Threaten adversary’s. All bluster all whine all the time. Accomplish nothing. Reduce our greatness into small and petty tweets.
3
Why would any country sign a treaty with the USA? Better save the paper and spare some trees. Or better choose a trustworthy partner like, say, Iran.
4
I realize there are many N.A.F.T.A. supporters among Times readers, due to the numbers of companies tech related with Mexico. Everyone is entitled to their opinion but the only one who really had it right was Ross Perot when he famously quipped about “the giant sucking sound of jobs headed south of the border during his debate with Clinton One in 1992. What he didn’t additionally foresee was the extent of Chinese factories now in Canada due to the millions of Chinese who immigrated there and were given deals for permanent visas similar to those we give out for starting businesses. So when you pick up that shirt or suit that says made in Canada remember it may very well be made in a Chinese sweat shop North of the border. Nafta has never been a good deal for American workers period.
5
Chinese sweat shops north of the border? I assume you have traveled extensively through Canada documenting these businesses. Surprising that no Canadians raise this issue. Immigration from China has inflated our housing
market, but not distorted our Labour practices. I would argue hat Canada has suffered as many negative consequences as the US through NAFTA. Employment in auto manufacturing is down significantly since the launch of the deal, with most of those jobs going to Mexico. Frankly we're tired of being bullied by the US in trade - softwood lumber, Boeing / Bombardier, etc. Our good neighbour to the South? Not seeing it.
3
In the US: #BuyAmerican
Outside the US: #boycottUSA
This is how world opinion is changing as a result of Trump.
4
Apparently the Americans haven't even staffed up the key trade negotiation jobs, making the American delegation appear unready and ill equipped. Seems to be a trend.
1
Only one more example of Trump's messin' just for the
sake of messin'.
The U.S. is now led by a very unwise individual using
a so-called base that's an illinformed minority as a
premise to just be a jerk.
3
United States, implosion much? Incessant war, rabid , nasty , paranoid anti-Russianism---which overlooks or candies your allies like Saudi Arabia---an obesity problem, identity problem, race problem, class problem, empire overreach problem, etc,etc,et al,et al.
2
Dear US: Go ahead, kill NAFTA with a poison pill.
Then wait and see how TTIP negotiations go.
1
Who is expecting TTIP to be resurrected any time soon?
2
Why not complete the lie and claim you're gonna replace NAFTA too with something Better, Bigger, Yuuuge,..and it'll cover everyone, and be cheaper.
Oh and have a Wall Built Around it.
And Paid for by the French.
4
America you are so broken. Just travel abroad and get the real scoop on how America is totally broken. Get rid of this buffoon asap, once he is gone he and his grifter family will be unaffected but the country will be broken for many years. Why is he intent on destroying everything he touches? You reep what you have sown, a half wit, blowhard, nitwit insecure Slitherin has been given free reign to destroy your magnificent democracy. SHAME on you.
7
We need to get rid of this destructive man.
4
Bravo - If Trump actually guts NAFTA and its phony free trade, job shifting, wage destroying provisions, I will just forgive his crazy narcissistic behaviour.
4
So one dimensional - everything according to him is the 'worst deal ever' and NAFTA joins the long queue, along with ACA, Paris, TTP, Iran, NATO and more besides. Such a negative disruptor and the incessant use of 'draining the swamp' as the excuse is demeaning.
Tell me how a 5x bankcrupt can be good at making deals? I'm confused, as one would view his record as unsuitable. Let him bin another treaty - the idiot needs to be held accountable and so far he's escaping all responsibilities. The sooner this joker is out of power the better and the world can fix the mess he's made.
A cabinet that seemingly does not collectively stand up to him, a Congress he emasculates, allies he disregards and foes he antagonizes. This is the record this twerp will leave behind, that is if he hasn't nuked the place in the meantime.
6
Is this really a governmental priority right now? New York Times why the limited coverage on the California Fires...this should continue to be headline news!
5
If we pull out of Nafta, prices for cars, produce, and numerous other items will rise. This will have the greatest impact on the poor and middle class. Then we can start complaining about inflation again.
1
Yes, Trump takes a strong negotiating stance, and that stance led him to numerous bankruptcies. Is that what he wants for America? Mexico is owed 60 billion, Canada 11 billion. So, instead of paying the debt, he declares bankruptcy. He is wanting to do that with PR as well instead of helping to rebuild.
6
So POTUS wants to cut off trade with Canada, the country that supplies us a vast amount of energy. And for us in the northern tier of the country, Canadian tourist trade is quite important to local economies. Also, let's not forget the importance of Mexican labor in our agriculture. Do he and his cronies ever think local or is it what can we do to make more money at the expense of the middle and lower income people in America?
6
If Chamber of Commerce is for NAFTA, than it's a pretty good bet that we should be against it. Progress!
4
"...take a look at the disappearance of the American middle class. The fact that the average man now earns less than he did in 1972 in adjusted dollars, with no wage increase for decades."
If people would only be clear about cause and effect, we might not be in this position, stuck with an irrational president with the emotional development level of a toddler. The fact that the average man earns less than he did in 1972 is due to the way companies are run.
First, it's not in the best interest of top level executives to pay the little guy a livable wage. The average CEO makes 400 times more than the average worker. Executive compensation is tied to their companies' stock price. That's one of the reasons we now work 2 or 3 jobs in order to keep the lights on in our homes.
Secondly, we now live in a digital age. Instead of whining about factory jobs that left the country, how about retraining for the 21st century? It's been said over and over the the blue collar jobs of today are database and programming. Teach kids to code in grade school and high school so they're prepared to apply for 21st century jobs instead of aspiring to be the floor manager at the Campbell Soup plant.
Ditto for all those coal jobs. Retrain for the 21st century and invest in facilities that should replace the jobs of the 19th century.
I can't wait for Trump to bring back the horse and carriage so we can begin making buggy whips again. And, let's not overlook those candlestick makers, either.
12
So, you have no respect whatsoever for people that do real work? Why is manufacturing bad?
Will people stop buying physical products in your world of the future? In the future, will people not like soup?
Make everyone a database programmer. Yeah, right.
2
why can "real work" only be defined by factory work? are you implying that coding, data design and analysis, database management is not real work? why does real work have to be dirty, manual labor? why can't people be trained in a new, more modern industry? everyone doesn't aspire to be Amish.
I want dotard gone too, but they said the sequester and Brexit would crash the global economy too, and that there was no housing bubble in 2006.
He's still has to go, but rejiggering NAFTA is something both Democrats were in favor of.
Soon, the Trump economy will go South as he does disastrous things like repealing NAFTA and starting a war with his fellow Republicans so the tax cut cannot be passed. What is keeping up Trump's popularity, as low as it is, is the good economy. As the economy starts to go South as a result of his horrendous economic policies, his existing support will fade. When Trump's support get down into the teens or twenties, impeachment and/or prosecution will be on the agenda.
6
NAFTA has to go. Another promise kept. Trump won. Get used to him. Over 7 years to go.
3
Pretty sure it's not gone yet. And I'm confused which other promises has he kept? We still have the ACA, there's no wall and no funding for it, dreamers are still here, and tax reform is pretty much dying because even republicans in congress see how bad it is. So I reiterate, that means repeat, sorry for the big words, what promises kept?
6
As President Trump seems to deliberately take the exact opposite view of all the best advice (NAFTA being just one example) even if it makes the world a much more dangerous place, diminishes the standing of the US in the world, antagonizes good neighbors like Canada and Mexico and has a very thin skin that stifles debate! Yet Congress, particularly the so called Republican leadership, refuses to show leadership and take it's Constitutional responsibilities seriously.
7
I guess Americans will have to wait until Trump DESTROYS this country before the Congress will act.
5
Is it so terrible if the dairy and meat industry takes a hit in the US? It´s an industry controlled by a handful of players whose lobbying efforts have ensured that the methods of production are cruel for animals and toxic for the environment - vastly more so than European production.
7
Product X made in Mexico $10 - Product Y made in USA $15
Which will the majority of the American public buy?
You can now only afford Product X. Can’t have your cake and eat it too...
Oversimplification I know, but it is basic public behavior.
1
Except those may be the cost of production, the retail costs remain the same or go even higher. The hapless American worker loses a job and the community suffers.
Why have policies that support corporate profit over constituents?
3
Why do your neighbors shop at Walmart rather than at the local independent retailer?
The Apprentice is drunk with his power. He is impulsive, not strategic in his actions. He has never articulated his disagreement(s) with NAFTA once. He will wreck many business connections for all three countries and of course, his solutions to NAFTA other than dismemberment are also unknown.
Re-working NAFTA is the most logical plan. What are we replacing NAFTA with other than chaos?
3
I'm actually shocked that people, including the media still believe the words that come out of Donald Trump's mouth. Do we really need more evidence presented to us that this man rarely speaks the truth or shows sincerity about anything?
It's better to take PM Trudeau's attitude that he expressed yesterday - simply acknowledge that America and Canada are still negotiating.
3
Canada does not have nukes for your Prime Minister to deploy on a whim. The United States has enough to destroy the entire population of the world many times over if Trump get that peculiar whim, which he has threatened to do. We have to pay attention, we have to worry that Trump might do what he is talking about.
How can anyone, even the most ardent Trump supporter, after watching Trump "in action" for even a couple of minutes, seeing his obvious lack of understanding about the world or any political policy ever made, be convinced that Trump is capable of "negotiating" anything of value, of "negotiating" anything except for bankruptcy and failure?
4
Trump is not going to negotiate anything. NAFTA negotiations require a knowledge of international trade law, tariffs, and other related bodies of knowledge, none of which is possessed by Trump himself. The very idea that the “deal maker” would sit at the table and negotiate is ludicrous on its face. Trump is never going to negotiate anything here, especially given the fact that he knows nothing about NAFTA. His opposition is just pandering to his base.
3
As always, the Trump administration is unable to see the whole picture. I am no NAFTA fan as it had hurt workers all around the world and had made immigration reform impossible, but this deal had been on the table for too many years to implode it without a replacement, without another deal. To withdraw from NAFTA with no alternative will reset an economy that has just pushed back from a recession. Is not the same to call the devil than looking at him coming. The dealmaker, so far, has been a fraud.
6
How can we hold these Republicans who voted for Trump responsible for causing so much danger to our country?
I read that even after Nixon resigned 25% of our country supporting him (my mother being one of them...I can remember her telling me in 1974 that she "felt sorry for Nixon).
it's very hard for me not to hate my Republicans friends yet hating them violates my own personal values and won't get me or them anywhere....what is the answer?
USA is in a crisis and headed towards Civil War. When will this stop?
7
Given Mr Trump's decisions since coming into office, it must be assumed that he is an agent of a foreign power bent on the total destruction of the United States.
6
Hmm. There is plenty of evidence that Russia interfered in our election. I wonder what they had in mind?
So this, this inability to even agree with each other within the GOP, the neutering of the RNC, the raw power grab by political outliers, the boasting with no really consequential legislation, and the failure to help unite the country while sewing seeds of division even within their own base.. this is the Republican governing model.
C'mon, this is like asking Americans to report for work only to get there to find the building completely engulfed in flame. Someone call the Democrats to put this fire out.
1
Trump wants to get rid of investor-state trade resolution (the ability of corporations to sue countries for money they would have made had democracy not imposed a regulation)? That would be awesome. I'll believe it when I see it.
While the U.S. Chamber of Commerce infuses its propaganda with the words "small business," almost all of its funding comes from global corporations, the biggest competitors, nastiest suppliers, and stingiest lenders too small business. Like the global corporations they represent, they have no loyalty to the US or it's people.
If Trump did get rid of investor dispute resolution it would be a good thing. But Trump would still be a walking constitutional crisis. And Democrats should be very careful about working with Trump. He is a pathological liar.
We need fair trade, not the current "race to the bottom" model that forces every government to cut taxes and protections for labor and the environment.
Trade is supposed to take advantage of actual advantages in skill and resources of the different countries, not competition to brutalize workers and the earth more efficiently. It's not the same.
Trump got elected because he saw the pain caused by "free trade" agreements, and promised the people to end it.
Democrats who push these kinds of deals helped make Trump possible.
Fight for fair trade.
3
The US has just slapped tariffs on Bombardier that add up to almost 300%, which may cause major job losses in the aerospace industry in both Canada and Ireland.
This is how America treats its friends and allies?
Thanks a whole bunch.
5
As long as you have a president who views the negotiation of an international trade deal between two G7 countries as being no different than negotiating a big real estate deal it's not likely that anything constructive will result. Dumping NAFTA will likely cripple Canada and Mexico but it will also badly hurt the U.S. causing one to wonder why would Trump adopt a policy where everybody loses, including himself.
3
We have a loose cannon that just wants to scare people by his wild, uneducated and impractical thoughts, but when it comes to any action he will not do it. If any of his NAFTA threats ever come to fruition, that would irrevocably hurt his erstwhile supporters too. A case in point is the US agriculture states or auto industry in Michigan where he won narrowly . Trump likes to think he is playing the game of chicken but by now people know that he is just a paper tiger. He will huff and puff and try to blow down the solid house called the US. All his bluster is just making him breathless.
1
FINALLY something I can possible get behind this disaster president with. NAFTA was NEVER a good idea as long as you leave this country w out a full supply chain and manufacturing base w in our boarders and American's fully employed and skilled to operate with fair LIVE-able wages. After global climate change, which we have horrible failed at, its Homeland Security Threat number #1, Its all connected and that is why we find ourselves with a societal mess we have today. Until American business which BTW is not American its GLOBAL and only in it for profit wherever it may find it, is held to real account nothing will change. All out incentives from business to politics to our justice system are backwards. STOP rewarding bad behavior and start punishing it. I'm tired of living in an upside down going backwards country! But Im not holding my breath for an real change that really matters to the American worker. Till now its all hot misguided distractive air.
3
Whatever Sandra issues may be, the movement just follows a pattern of frustration by Trump about his ability to accomplish anything.
After less than a year of his presidency, it really looks like he is already souring on his failures and the republican majority in chambers.
Sadly, this scenario brings closer at every step the scenario of the worst all the way to massive world crisis and war events.
All that for his tiny ego.
1
Let's hope that the US businesses and individuals who lose the most from the collapse of NAFTA are Trump supporters. They deserve it.
1
Maybe Americans who believe it is all so simple should read something on the UK which will soon be history. I found it so interesting that one the major campaigners for Roy Moore as senator in Alabama was Nigel Farge the main driver in the vote to leave the EU. Lets see he has made millions by making like he is so concerned about the middle class and little guy. He was a small time businessman before he began his campaign. Now, May has found simple to vote, but the nasty EU wants the billions that it is owed before the UK can leave. It also insists and she refuses to believe that there will not be a special trade deal since she won't be a member of the club. Try walking into one of Trump's fancy golf courses and say you want to play. The pound has fallen through the floor and the British economy never that great until the EU is now stumbling. Scotland will leave and maybe Northern Ireland. The polls now indicate that if a new vote was taken the vote would be overwhelming stay. Sold a bill of goods by Nigel who continues to make lots of money. I love how smart the people are and life is so simple. Face facts it is a global economy and living in Canada I am going to love how you will have cars, no seats, dashboards or electronics, but hey you will have a frame. Goods that are inexpensive now I can't wait. Americans seem to think you hold all the cards and once NAFTA is gone you will all become wealthy and own lots. Trade wars are a two way street. Jim Trautman
58
Thanks for bringing up Nigel Farage and his support (with Palin) of Moore. HIs game, like that of Bannon's, is to disrupt and demolish. And, hey, it's happening....in the UK and is/will happen in the USA. A human bomb he really should be on the no fly list.
Mr. Trautman, you are correct. I also have to add that Canada now has a "leg up" in trade due to the Trans Pacific Partnership and your deal with the European Community. I wonder how many of Tump's wealthier myopic supporters will be upset when the price on their Lexus RX350 jumps. Why? They are made in Cambridge, Ontario. There are thousands of other examples like this.
Also, Jeff Bezos is watching all this carefully. Why should he place his second headquarters in the U.S. with all our government's foreign sentiment and actions. Hello Toronto!
4
Thanks for the comment and they get richer and richer and will blame some thing as the problem. Jim Trautman
Many of the comments here are wiser than the President and his team. NAFTA has been in place for 30+ years and supply chains have grown to serve it. It's possible that a repudiation of NAFTA could cause recession; it won't bring back jobs but will cause pain. Trump will hopefully be in jail or at least retired to play golf before we have to suffer the long term effects.
7
It amazes me that we are still trying to discern some rationale strategy from this administration. How many times it's suggested that Trump's hardline position (take your pick here, North Korea, NAFTA, Iran) may be a strategy to gain concessions. The major flaw in this logic is that it assumes that Trump is using a rationale strategy towards some reasonably thought out end point. News flash here, He is not! He has shown himself to be completely disinterested and maybe incapable of thinking deeply about issues and complicated solutions. His strategy is about his ego and nothing else. The only hope for our country and the world is that others within his administration can reign him in enough to keep us from calamity. So far the signs do not look promising.
10
I don't know what will happen if Trump destroys NAFTA, but I do recall textile and clothing manufacturers abandoned the US Southeast in the early 90s, so quickly, it left towns devastated. You can still tour these half-empty remnants of life, today. People don't forget things like this when the hulk of the empty factories and homes remain as reminders.
I don't even know if the cause and effect was directly related to NAFTA, but that is certainly the assumption.
7
The great asset-stripping of the US began after Reagan's tax "reforms" cut marginal rates on astronomical incomes. It altered the motivations of corporate executives.
6
The final nail in US clothing manufacturers was the Andes Free Trade Agreement. The reason I can buy a pair of Levi’s for $20 is free trade. Sure start the mills in the US but be prepared for expensive clothing. Only hurts the poor.
North Carolina probably took the biggest hit when it comes to lost jobs. As I travel around the state I'm amazed at all the old mill buildings that are still standing held together only by the Kudzu vines slowly removing them from our vision. You pass through some of the old towns and the mill houses are easy to spot with their cookie cutter construction. The mills owned them and used them as an incentive to maintain a force of loyal workers with subsidized rents. They're mostly rental houses today with few private owners.
We lost some of the biggest textile manufacturers in the country if not the world. Imagine the shock the first time one saw a Cannon towel or sheet manufactured in Mexico. Other plants produced nearly all the pantyhose sold in this country. We also had plants that assembled and sewed clothing for all seasons. One the largest suppliers of boots and textiles for the military no longer manufactures them here.
It may not have been NAFTA according to some but the rest of us saw it differently. The biggest part of our manufacturing base disappeared right after NAFTA was signed and for a few years after it was difficult to keep track of the plant closings. So yes, we do see a connection to it all.
6
"American farmers would see a 25 percent tariff on shipments of beef, 45 percent on turkey and some dairy products, and 75 percent on chicken, potatoes and high fructose corn syrup sent to Mexico."
Does Trump understand that many of these farmers will go out of business when their customers can no longer afford their products?
7
How much if our food is already unwelcome on the world market due to GMO that contains high trace levels of toxins, and our routine use of ammonia, bleach and antibiotics?
9
We have no need to eat chicken that's been processed and shipped back.
4
One of NAFTA's greatest failings is that it created a free market for the sale of goods between the US, Mexico and Canada but it has not created a correspondingly free market for labor. This failure to create a truly free trade pact was the primary economic impetus for the surge of undocumented workers that began shortly after NAFTA was implemented.
Put most simply, NAFTA allowed government-subsidized corn growers in the US with advanced agricultural technology to flood Mexico with cheap corn. As a result, many small scale low-tech corn growers in Mexico were driven out of business. The province of Oaxaca was one of the hardest hit. Desperate to survive, many of these farmers headed to El Norte to find work. This began a chain migration as the original corn farmers sent back money to their families. Relatives and others who were not corn growers soon followed.
In theory, NAFTA is a good idea. If US leaders had the courage and vision to allow the free exchange of labor, NAFTA would work as originally advertised. Indeed, a truly fair trade agreement would open job opportunities for US workers to go where their skills are needed. But this kind of vision is lost on Trump. He just wants to pander to the sense of victimization of his white working class base.
15
The two economies are skewed because they don't use the same currencies domestically. The different currencies sustain differences in costs of domestically produced goods and financial costs of business and living.
Trump produces a sense of victimization far outside the scope of his own sycophants.
With extensive damage in Puerto Rico most medical devices have to come from Mexico. If we withdraw from NAFTA you can expect a significant increase in costs. Withdrawal from trade agreements hurts different people differently and as always those need the most, the most, and those who need the least, the least.
5
Why can't the US make the medical devices we invented? Forcing American workers, who once had the highest standard of living in the world to compete directly with labor from low wage countries had been a net loss for the American worker. The value of t that lose can be measured by the record profits and cash holdings of global corporations and the global billionaires who own 75% of their shares.
Yes process are lower, but the price of labor has shrink more.
So global corporations, like Wal-Mart that replaced distinctive downtowns full of small businesses with step malls full of nearly identical box stores, staffed by former small business owners, got the benefits of "free trade," not the workers, who now live precarious lives facing the constant that of cut hours, voy benefits, or being replaced with robots.
What is the point of an economy? Do markets serve people, or do people serve markets?
5
Trump is just another example of all the failed Presidencies installed by the Republican party with only one objective in mind: Power at any cost. From Hoover to Nixon to Reagan and the Bushes and now Trump, those administrations have demonstrated their lack of concern for the well being of the USA and its citizenry, placing control above all facets of American life. From workplace to religion, from color of skin to marriage vows, from diplomacy all the way to the sporting world and the world of the arts and sciences.
I 'm not saying the Democrats have been pure as driven snow, far from it. But all we have to do is look at the economics of each successive administration and see for yourselves the end result in every case.
12
The objective appears to be unequal protection of law by 50 different states run without federal supervision or coordination.
Obama is the worst. He made tge US a thirld wirld country in 8 years with a 19 trillion dollar debt to boot.
3
When a Republican congress teams up with a Democratic president, the results are usually disastrous, and this is how we got NAFTA.
The Democratic love love affair with trade deals designed by for and of global corporations odd one of the main reasons Trump is president.
Go drive around Detroit and tell me NAFTA was good for American workers..
3
As the saying goes, "be careful what you wish for, it might just come true."
One doesn't need to look at Trump's tough talk to realize he is desperate for a win after so many pushbacks. Besides, it is not the tough talk that is Trump's signature, but his double talk. He called people "a good man" before firing them. He said he loves the DACA kids before dumping the responsibility to the do-nothing-good Congress knowing full well that the Republicans won't do anything. So he had high praise of Canada PM Trudeau yesterday. Draw your own conclusion.
But the joke may on the U.S. when that happens. Granted that there is exchange rate issues between the greenback (U.S. dollar) and the Canadian loon and Mexican peso - which should be addressed - NAFTA is not the real reason of the bubbles in the past 25 years. The burst of the telecom bubble accelerated the rise of tech in Asia. The real estate bubble and the financial bubble were self-inflicted and gave a cover for people to offshore outsourcing to both Asia and Eastern Europe.
Two of the reasons why housing cost is so high are 1) losing skilled labored when the trade people went back to their home country south of the border and 2) timber tariff against Canada. If people cannot afford buying homes now, just wait for the twin shocks of immigration and NAFTA demise. And inflation rears its ugly head. Then there is the tax cut (for the wealthy). People have seen the movie before
8
I think this is a welcome discussion.
No one doubts that in early stages of NAFTA - many US companies simply packed up and left for Mexico to take advantage of business advantages such as no import taxes etc. Who can blame them?
But perhaps, the pendulum went too far.
So, like many US laws including the Patriot Act that had a sunset provision forcing Congress to revisit this issue - why not, NAFTA.
As a main stream Republican, I support trade deals that enhances economic development globally. America is best served when we engage with the world. And while it may not be of consequence to some, I dare say that the world benefits too.
I cheered president Clinton's forceful defense of NAFTA in the Yellow Room. I still remember what the 41st said at that event.
Looking at his successor, Mr. Clinton, he said," Mr. President, what a powerful defense of the treaty I also support. Now, I know why I am outside the Oval office looking in."
So, let's revisit the treaty.
Lets be sure that this Congress is not let off the hook. They need to debate.
Either support changes or vote them down with sufficient margin to overcome a veto should they feel strongly.
As someone has famously said,"America is served best when the White House and the Congress are singing the same hymn."
1
Regardless of what happens to NAFTA, the ISDS, Investor State Dispute Settlement provision in all of our agreements needs to be altered and/or eliminated, no matter what Donohue of the Chamber of Commerce thinks. If Donohue thinks we need them, let him pay with the millions he earns.
For instance Canada sued us on Keystone for not authorizing construction to proceed. If Canada prevailed, we, the American public, would have had to pay for any damages, not Donohue's private sector clients. And the 99% of us would bear that tax burden, since the 1% would receive the bulk of the tax reduction's loopholes would exempt them.
Further, since Keystone is Canadian and not an American company, Canada would not be liable as a participant for any oil spills it caused in the US.
NAFTA doesn't have to be scuttled by Trump. However, the aforementioned liabilities have to be abated, so that the 315 million of us don't have to reimburse Canada or Mexico with our taxes for the private sector's actions which benefits only the private sector and not us individuals. We should be held harmless.
19
This is an important point and was one of the more unpalatable parts of TPP.
2
Perhaps it is time to take some influence away from big business.
Investor-State-Dispute-Settlement is a potentially dangerous mechanism which has allowed toxic industries to dispute new health regulations, for instance. Doing away with it might actually be an environmentally friendly thing to do, allowing the rule of locally-determined laws.
When profitable plants are sent to another country, that's loss of manufacturing jobs. We probably should maintain a manufacturing base, even if it is not the short-term economically efficient thing to do. Because all of these economic efficiencies essentially benefit a happy few.
Finally, this will weaken the US. But it will be a relief for other countries, the underdogs in any negotiation with the US, and on whom the US tends to force its legal system.
5
When WWII started the nation's factories were repurposed to make the weapons we needed to win the war. (Rommel quipped, one of our tanks can take out nine of your, but you always have a tenth).
A manufacturing base is a National security issue, as well as a worker issue.
2
So, what will the Congressional Republicans do now that they're candidate for president is running amok and will likely throw a big wrench into our economy if he blithely destroys NAFTA? They backed him, he's breaking the country and the Republican Party owns it.
19
The Republican Party does nothing but break the country. That is its function.
Oh yeah? The Republicans controlled come from '96 to '07 and the presidency from '01 to '08.
9 months after Bush was inaugurated, and after 9 months of Richard Clarke gave Condi Rice a 25 page plan to attack All Queda in Afghanistan to get their computers and find out what they were doing, 9 months of him being ignored while he called for an emergency meeting of the cabinet on terror, 9/11 happened.
In less then 24 hours, Cheney was already saying that it could be used to justify a war in Iraq, even though most of the terrorists and their funding came from Saudi Arabia, our ally. They proceeded to pull resources out of Afghanistan to fight a war based on lies, killing or wounding 45,000 American troops, and costing far more than a trillion dollars.
They also managed to cause the worst recession in 60 years, crashing government revenue, creating fruits for a decade.
Between these disasters and the Bush Tax cuts, they created massive debt.
Then they blamed Obama, who was not in office yet, and attacked everything he did to try to fix the problem.
Now they give us Trump, a pathological liar who is dismantling the government and attacking the constitution.
No government, no country. These people are traitors.
Good for Trump.
NAFTA Is a disaster.
12
Yup...Clinton's allowing for NAFTA was another jolt for the working class and a big kiss for the Investor class.
3
If only life were that simple. Everything is either a disaster or a non-disaster. Fix the disasters.
The disaster is Trump himself. He does not understand the net impact of NAFTA or trade imbalances or much of anything else.
Wrong person in powerhouse as a President, can cause havoc in millions of people's lives notably in his own country but in neighbouring countries and ripple effects all across the globe. Trade agreements are negotiated with a vision of far reaching implications. Mr. Trump, one man has the power to change, it would have more consequences for USA then its NAFTA Partners Canada and Mexico.
Isolation & protectionism is against the spirit of market economy, that is the bases of American Society with all it's development and evolution. Negating these principals by one man or a group of his cronies to walk out of treaties like NAFTA has far reaching consequences for the foundation of USA, it's society and economy. God Bless America and its People to have sanity.
15
The time to have objected and rescind NAFTA was at its inception - with the First President Bush, who created it. Clinton just waived it in.
Too much time and business have transpired to make repealing NAFTA workable.
Secondly, in case the President is awake at all, the Mexicans have traditionally provided hard core labor for all industries in the United States. They have made themselves available for construction work and they perform very well.
We in California are suffering a devastation of housing. We have lost hundreds of square miles of homes throughout California within a few days.
Take stock of the facts. We will rebuild in California though it be perilless and we need construction workers be they men or women, no matter where from.
15
Clinton didn't just "wave in" NAFTA.
There were not enough Republican votes to pass it, so he strong armed Democrats into voting for it.
Then, he SIGNED it.
"Centrist" Democrats keep allying with establishment Republicans to push these big fast track trade deals that leave workers with lower pay and global corporations with record profits
Hillary said TPP should be the gold standard for trade deals before she was pressured by Bernie into opposing it. (Then she lied about saying it and got caught. I saw the video.).
Fast Track is a shortcut that takes you where you don't want to go.
It takes a long time to do real trade deals for a reason. We need to invest the time it takes to create fair trade deals instead of secret deals written by corporate lawyers and pushed through congress without anyone understanding what they really mean. Fat Track is not democracy.
1
Each day I become more nauseated then the last at what is happening to our country and the world. I hope this doesn't cause the Dow to take a dive because our retirement savings would be affected, as I'm sure a lot of other people's would as well. If Trump had set out to destroy America and its people on purpose, he couldn't have done a better job.
39
I don't think Trump cares. He probably has at a couple of hundred million in cash with which he can escape to Switzerland if the spit really hits the fan. He'll be right, and if his experiment screws America, he'll still be right.
Why did anyone think that a lifelong millionaire and billionaire would have any empathy for the middle class? Does Trump know ANYTHING about how most Americans really live? No, he doesn’t. Neither do his senior advisors, Jared and Ivanka. Or the other billionaires in his cabinet. What a complete joke.
The last recession was caused by the global banks, owned by the global billionaires. They got out first, taking their profits, stole millions of homes through fraudulent foreclosures, then bought everything back at half price when small investors panicked.
According to the treasury, the Great Recession moved 40% of the wealth of the 99% to the 1%.
No one received any punishment for this.
The billionaires know this and want to do it again. Trump is the perfect excuse.
Trump's plan hurts America. The 20% tariff on Canada's softwood lumber will cost American contractors. Get it? The wood will cost you guys more. Trump and his pal Boeing want to slap a 300% tariff on Bombardier. Delta says it will not pay the tariff because Boeing doesn't even make a plane similar to Bombardier. Trumps protectionism looks good on him and his base but hits the consumer.
18
If the planes were built in the United States it would pay high wages to a lot of people.
We have traded good paying jobs for the ability to buy cheap junk from foreign countries with much lower pay scales. On balance it haed been bad for the people of this country.
The problem is not trade in general, but the particular way these deals have been negotiated.
Too bad Trump week only make it worse.
You know what? As a Canadian expat this doesn't affect me, but I hope that Trump does blow it up. It is the slap in the face the US electorate might need to regain its sanity. All the right wing vitriol and hatred that has been stirred up can see what its results are. All the businesses that supported Trump (and the US Chamber seems to have thrown more support to Republicans than Democrats) need a wake up call. Yes, Canada and Mexico will suffer. But we are seeing that the future of throwing in with the US, despite common interests, is to be seen as los - er - bargaining chips in Trump's confrontational brinkmanship. Time to let US voters in the border states - especially the Red border states that stretch across from Idaho to Wisconsin, with the exception of the New England States, Minnesota and Washington - feel what it is like when bullies run the show. Lots of employment in those states is generated by Canadian trade, and it will hurt them. The effect will be felt further south in Texas and Arizona and New Mexico too. Sad, but let's stop tiptoeing around the maniac in the White House and let's see what happens when Trump "wins".
29
Throwing millions of lives and businesses into turmoil to make a point is ridiculous.
Trump is simply another elected official, and a very poor one at that. Pressure needs to brought to bear on the congress. I can sign petitions all day long but in the long run and hopefully the shorter version, congress by way of businesses and banks and all those that are ALSO affected needs to be pressured into action. Trump is here for a VERY short time--presidents are permanent nor are they gods. We have a popor one who is ruining our world and when he is gone we will have to dig out. Let's not wit. Pressure congress to take action. THE FUTURE of the nation is most important, not a few million die-hard voters who have the intelligence of a caulliflower.
15
Don't be so sure that Trump won't start a war, declare martial law, and postpone elections indefinitely.
Many democracies have gone that way before, often with our government as the catalyst.
He doesn't care about the country or the people, only about himself.
The Trump Presidency will be remembered as the tipping point where China surpasses the USA as the global superpower.
33
Absolutely. Here in Australia more and more people are saying we should be getting much more cosy with China, because America is over.
1
Crooked lying Trump, a miserable miscreant desperate for attention, is a wrecking ball personalized. Except that the 'house' being leveled is fairly new and in working condition. What next, suspend the Constitution formally, now that it is being trampled in practice?
22
Still our POTUS has not weighed in on the 4 dead servicemen in Niger, the devastating fires in California, or other critical issues. Instead he is focused on issues that can stroke his ego. It is shameful for a POTUS to turn his back on the dead military men; even more shameful that his supporters continue to let him off the hook. No more can they say they support the troops.
35
of course Trump won't address the 4 dead solder or the devastating fires in (liberal, rich, anti-Trump) California, Orcabait! Why do you expect Trump to be a president of logical and strategic leadership much less integrity? He is incapable of doing so. And the sooner you start advocating (yelling in verbal and non-verbal ways) about Trump's incompetency, the sooner he will be removed (hopefully).
1
I am willing to forgo the social niceties that we had with the previous four presidents of both parties IF we also get to avoid -
- their willingness to buy votes with our money
- play stupid power games pitting groups of Americans against each other,
- and ignore our workers just to keep their contributors happy.
Yes, he is rude,
crude,
shoots his mouth off,
and looks and sounds upset all the time.
But I don't need the social niceties as much as a dynamic economy that could employ twenty million more workers in a short period of time.
Because he was elected without either political party's help, neither political party cares about those workers.
It's Washington, D.C. versus America these days.
1
Trump may dump NAFTA. Trump dumps TPP. Trump dumps Paris Accord. Trump nearly dumped NATO. Trump poisons relationships with European allies. Trump dumps U.S. environmental standards.
We have learned that Russia’s internet strategies - waged against more than twenty countries - is focused on destroying alliances, relationships, trade and political parties. And Trump is their agent.
Wake up Republicans. Wake up Democrats. Wake up world.
34
Oh stop, he's doing what we elected him to do.
1
This is another subject that trump knows little about. He is a bully and is trying to bully the world. While Nafta might not be the best of treaties you just don't throw the baby out with the bath water. This treaty should be modified not destroyed as trump would like to do.
14
God. Now we're going to need a wall along the northern border, too.
20
Have you not seen the YouTube video out there. The Canadians are already building it ehhh....
If this latest fiasco doesn't say I am Russia's puppet, so that I can destroy our economy well let me sell you some land in Siberia.
18
I am COUNTING THE DAYS til someone in the Cabinet with little bit of brain and a LOT of courage gets the requisite number of fellow cabinet members together to invoke the 25th Amendment - and has the men in white coats at the ready.
Heck, even Steve Bannon thinks there's a 70% chance 45 won't serve a full term. Let this be the ONE thing he is correct about!
22
I honestly think having Pence with a full blown conservative agenda base on white Christian values would be strategically worse.
What I find most alarming of all is that I have not the slightest doubt that Trump has even read Nafta -- not one sentence of it. No more than he understood what a 'nuclear triad' was. Rather, like a kid crying 'wolf,' he calls anything a 'bad deal' that was wrought by those predecessors of his -- Bill Clinton, Obama -- for whom he feels a bottomless well of spite. And he does so out of a chilling admix of ignorance and malignance.
25
Our North American economy is built on the free flow of goods and trade between the US, Canada and Mexico.
Imagine the strike to the head of Trump's working class supporters when they're faced with groceries that cost 3 times as much as they do today, automobiles they can't afford to buy or repair and all the other unimaginable economic consequences of choking off free trade. Imagine how angry they'll be when they can't afford to purchase a new water heater or furnace, or repair the old one. Unfortunately, I fear, they'll still blame all the wrong people.
20
in the meantime, the lack of jobs that afford a living in this country are drying up!
between the rapacious 'free market' and incipient loss of jobs to automated plants, no one will be buying anything like automobiles or water heaters down the line...so don't worry about it!
2
Mr. Businessman does not understand the global economy. He might as well fill his cabinet with members of his base picked at random.
12
Trump does not have the ability to analyze NAFTA, and really does not have a clue whether or not it is good or bad. He does not listen to smart advice, either. Yet, in the USA, this is our man in charge. What a fix we got ourselves into with the corrupted election system that has evolved over the decades.
10
NAFTA and the race to the bottom.
Using the Oreo cookie example - I can now pay more for cookies that are made in Mexico for lower labor cost than the less expensive Oreo cookies that used to be made in Chicago. I can spend money on them, but I won't.
Americans need the jobs that support their economy.
It never made sense for the US government to sign onto trade deals that enable corporations to destroy American jobs and setting up situations where idled American workers could learn to rely on government assistance.
10
How wrong is the GOP?
The Washington based International Monetary fund suggests that the GOP and Trump stand in total opposition to what needs to be done.
https://www.theguardian.com/business/2017/oct/11/imf-higher-taxes-rich-i...
The GOP's fiscal policy reminds me of medicine as practiced when barbers were the doctors. Bad humours all called for the same medicine bleeding.
Our society is anemic we need more spending and giving more money to invest to the investor class when there is little to invest in seems the solution of the wise men of Chelm.
4
Your alternative is following the IMF? Who funds the IMF?
1
Margo,
I would think that everyone is starting to realize that the USA is leading us over a cliff. It was in August of 1973 that Nixon put an end to Bretton Woods.
It is 2017 and the USA cannot be trusted. The article from the Guardian is political and points all of us outside your borders to a path 180 degrees in opposition to where the USA is going. That being said you are correct but the expression He who pays the piper calls the tune comes up against a tune that nobody wants to hear.
Democracy demands that we abandon the American coach and find a different way into the future, we will find the new path a little rough but it is better than your ride over the cliff.
1
NAFTA passed and China was given favored nation status in the 90's. Short-term boost for the economy followed by long-term pain and slow growth.
Americans got sold out. Just because Trump is the one pointing that out doesn't make the premise wrong.
7
Well David, I'm wondering just how well you understand economics. I, myself am no economist, so I know I can't really figure this stuff out from first principles.
From what I can tell pretty much all economists believe that trade, in general, benefits all countries unless one country is able to dominate another country, turning it into an economic colony.
Are the economists correct? I have read expositions of the basic concepts underlying their claim and it appears to make sense but I know that in the real world things are much more complicated than in the economic models.
It may be true that trade benefits all countries but it clearly doesn't benefit everyone inside those countries. Then we have the problem that the gains
are, to some extent, spread around quite broadly, while the damage tends to be concentrated.
Why do you believe that NAFTA gave a short-term boost to the economy? I see absolutely no reason to expect. Perhaps it props up your argument but that's not an acceptable reason to believe it. Think it through!
No question we've entered a slow growth period. The important question is why? The mere fact that one thing precedes another is no proof that it caused it. There are other things that preceded the slowing of growth. Have you looked at the actual timing of the slowing of growth?
We produce as much steel as we ever did as measured by the dollar value, adjusted for inflation. We use many fewer workers to do so. Automation.
I'll just mention inequality.
8
People will just have to learn the hard way about Trump. Just because he calls it a disaster, does not make it so. All three countries have developed complex trading patterns that will be painful to suddenly drop. Translation: The United States stands to lose a great deal without this trade. And don't plan on very many of those lost jobs to come back to the US.
18
Here comes the next recession, which will devastate rural Trump voters more than anyone else. So much winning.
28
I am no Trump supporter, but NAFTA was and is a bad deal for the average American, for American wages, communities and the national economy. It has been a bonanza for multinational companies that moved jobs from the US to Mexico but did not lower prices- vastly increasing the profit margins of their products.
These bad trade deals put American workers in direct competition with Mexico where there are not serious environmental or worker safety rules, Unions are toothless or non-existent and wages are low. The companies get cheap labor, and few rules, but consumers here do not get lower prices. When VW moved Golf production from high wage Germany to Puebla Mexico they did not decrease the price despite the vastly cheaper labor and loss of an import duty. The same is true when GM started bringing Mexican made Chevrolet and GMC Trucks into the US.
American manufacturing supports American communities- especially in the heartland.
11
"These bad trade deals put American workers in direct competition with Mexico where there are not serious environmental or worker safety rules, Unions are toothless or non-existent and wages are low. The companies get cheap labor, and few rules, but consumers here do not get lower prices."
You could be writing about America with the above statements.
1
This is a win-win for Democrats.
If NAFTA is scrapped, then Demorats, who have mostly been against NAFTA for some time, will be happy to have had Trump's help in achieving one of their policy goals. And the collapse of NAFTA would undermine the economy and exacerbate the ongoing GOP civil war between the establishment and populists.
If Trump decides to keep NAFTA, he will lose further credibility and support among the dwindling base of voters whom he needs.
6
NAFTA seems to be framed largely in terms of manufacturing jobs but one US economic sector certain to suffer from the dismantling of the agreement is agriculture. The biggest victims will be the farmers and ranchers who voted overwhelmingly for the man who will prove to be their undoing.
22
Hopefully
9
is there nothing we can do about this man--this accidental president? Every day it's something new. Something stupid. Something damaging to the majority.
17
Good.
1)Maybe the market will crash and go bac to normal PE ratios..
2)Maybe we can start to make things here again.. perhaps local --clothing, shoes , furniture,, rugs,, easy stuff., dishes.(of course the robots will continue to make the cars.. maybe we shall have google trucks...
3) Perhaps the Mexicans will drink less Cocacola -- and need less Metformin for type 2 Diabetes.
4) Perhaps it's time to form a United Countries of N. America.. above the equator with one currency and two languages.
4. Perhaps, we sill also grow our own.!
6
1) The market is high because savings account yields are low and money has nowhere else to go in order to grow. I heard a commentator speaking about this today.
2) Even if things are made here again, it will not be by people, but robots. More and more manufacturing is being automated. If you don't believe this will happen, you are not keeping up with what is going on in industry.
3) Whatever. But food is grown on both sides of the border and shipped back and forth. You don't have to be drinking Coca-Cola to be affected by this. By the way, guess what? Coca-Cola is made in Mexico with cane sugar rather than corn syrup, and bottled in recyclable glass bottles. It's very popular on this side of the border as well.
4) Three languages. I don't think Quebec will give upFrench.
8
Will the Iowans who will lose billions in sales of manufactured goods and crops exported to Mexico continue to see Trump as their savior?
14
They are already having trouble harvesting crops because of the lack of farm labor caused by other Trump policies. But, hey, Trump is MAGA.
7
Taking away NAFTA will not remedy the deep rooted problems America faces... The real causes of the decline in manufacturing begin here at home with robot technology. But this is only the prelude... A.I. is just around the corner if not here already....
9
He is a greedy, thoughtless person with no care for anyone but himself. No thoughts for those who are suffering nor anyone who is trying hard to improve their lives and those of their children. When I learn about the struggles of impoverished people outside the US and here in our own country, I grieve for the lack of any interest to end hardship on the part of this dotard. What would it take to have him even just begin to help end hunger and poverty and become a force for healing, comfort, and empowerment?
11
I hope all the Trumpers in Iowa feel the full effect of their idol's demolishing of NAFTA.
12
There is only one motivation in Trumps actions. Revenge. He was made fun of by Obama at a couple of "roasts" and he is out to destroy anything Obama did. If it hurts the country and its place in the world, so what. If it hurts Obama's legacy he will achieved his goal..
14
celedo: Not Obama's legacy anymore, if his (Obama's) deeds are now infected and twisted by Trump.
Largely true, but Obama didn't do NAFTA.
4
The art of breaking the deal. Trump hasn't heard of the idea that deals are made to be fulfilled, not to be broken. In international law, pacta sunt servanda. For people, our word is our bond, as it was for the Obamas.
4
Time to flee the stock market.
10
Just like his North Korea red line threat ...
Trump is using the dismissal of Mexico from Nafta as an empty threat to force Mexico to pay for his 'amazing and fabulous' wall.
4
Trash NAFTA? Can you say recession? Watch the DOW go way down.
5
I think Canada has picked up correct tone by considering Australian planes over Hornets. And now I am more than sure that whatever dramas #donaldtrump do - Justin T. is able to manage the show.
Although very polite and low key but it seems to me that Canada has made its mind / plans and strategy to handle a maniac !
9
Call me crazy - but I bet - Trump is going to hold NAFTA hostage until Mexico pays for the wall.......
3
Can we be honest? Trump only wants to dump the Mexican part of NAFTA.
8
So this is yet more from the Manchurian Candidate
7
Are we winning yet??
4
Too bad our politicians have been selling the American workers to the lowest denominator.
NAFTA and what was going to be TPP are one of the major reasons for the rise of the Trumpeters and Berniecrats.
Any deal that has same provisions for Canada and Mexico, completely different economies is not a thoughtful deal.
Lets find better deals with Canada and Mexico according to the needs of all three countries!
7
America is in a tight embrace with the world as far as trade goes, at times it can be as marvelous as a Fred Astaire-Ginger Rogers duet
in other instances, entire communities are sacrificed just so the rest of America can have cheaper dancing shoes.
Like any jury trial there are certainly enough experts on both sides of the issue to either convict or exonerate. A famous liberal, professor and former Clinton era, Secretary of Labor, Robert Reich chronicled this NAFTA debate---obviously, he was pro-NAFTA. Is it fair to say that even intellectuals like Reich got it wrong? Apparently many Trump supporters think so. How else to explain how Trump, a billionaire who imports labor to work at lower wages at his little isles of luxury can spout enough lies and with nothing to show for all of his bombast at this point, he can still carry their support? Perhaps the collective malaise of some of Trump's supporters has some merit---maybe all of that pro NAFTA talk and supposed job training for NAFTA's victims lacked substance?
4
Good union jobs were fleeing the country long before NAFTA. I grew up in a town in Michigan in which 60% of the workforce was employed in manufacturing in the early fifties. By comparison, manufacturing employment was 25% in the rest of the country. By the late sixties, when I graduated from high school, manufacturers were relocating to non-union Southern states to find cheaper labor. They continued that pursuit in Mexico and then Asia. Mexico and China didn't "steal our jobs," as Trump likes to say. American companies gave them away. Now, globalization is a fact of life. I wasn't a fan of NAFTA 30 years ago because it hit the lowest paid workers the hardest, but scrapping the agreement now, rather than updating it, seems like closing the barn doors after the horses have escaped.
30
"American companies gave them away." That is so true. It's not just manufacturing, but outsourcing all sorts of jobs such as call centers, engineering, etc. I can remember being an architect in the 1980's and there were firms in India who would do computerized drafting overnight and send the files back to America the next day, leaving American drafters without a job. If it can happen in architecture, it can happen in just about any area you can name.
9
It's more like burning down the barn because the horses have escaped. And also because people in Mexico are brown, which to Trump's supporters is a terrible offense.
Listen closely; hear that silence?
That's the sound of the pursed lips of Republican senators and congressmen and governors who privilege party over country. They'll watch NAFTA go down the tubes and do nothing about it -despite the damage its revocation will cause to this country's economy.
They're so intimidated by Trump and the GOP whips that they'll hurt their own electorate, lie to them outright, before they grow a spine to protect them. Every day adds a new dimension to the adjective "deplorable."
16
The reporter stating that the failure of NAFTA negotiations would "inflict damage throughout the global economy" has no place in an objective news article. Anyone who has studied the effects of NAFTA in detail knows there are compelling arguments from highly regarded economsirs on both sides of this issue, and such a claim should not be stated here as if it were an objective scientific truth. Moreover, it implies that international labor unions and others opposed to NAFTA would willingly inflict catastrophic damage on the workers they represent, which is both ludicrous and frankly offensive to those who have dedicated their lives fighting for workers' rights.
12
I fully agree with your statement here that it's wrong for the author of this article, who should be reporting facts and not judgments here, to make an assertion that the failure of the negotiations WILL resort in the infliction of damage throughout the global economy. There is no such premise here as you rightly state -- indeed there are arguments on both sides that staying with the treaty or leaving it are valid outcomes and both can be with merit.
6
Ms. Swanson is correct on her assertion about the repeal of NAFTA and the damage it would inflict on the global economy. the Economic Policy Institue points out that:
" Fourth, and ultimately most important, NAFTA was the template for rules of the emerging global economy, in which the benefits would flow to capital and the costs to labor. The U.S. governing class—in alliance with the financial elites of its trading partners—applied NAFTA’s principles to the World Trade Organization, to the policies of the World Bank and IMF, and to the deal under which employers of China’s huge supply of low-wage workers were allowed access to U.S. markets in exchange for allowing American multinational corporations the right to invest there."
http://www.epi.org/blog/naftas-impact-workers/
2
Lowest I.Q. " President " ever!!!! Believe me. Bigly.
7
Many Democrats favor scrapping NAFTA, and to make this more exciting, guess what states they represent? Yes, the ones Democrats thought they would win (without campaigning) but lost nonetheless. Don't blame Comey either, that would be a fatal error.
Is this a donor class conundrum? You bet!
Then, you have most mildly liberal/donor class newspapers who totally support NAFTA, TTP and more and more "free trade" agreements. This is an issue. They run doom and gloom headlines while many Democrats on the ground, in Ohio, Pennsylvania and elsewhere campaign against NAFTA and more free trade agreements.
We have a serious disconnect. The Republicans have a similar problem, but their insurgency is definitely not afraid of the old donor class, they're raising tons of new money and winning elections. Democrats aren't. The insurgency on the Left has mostly been quashed, there's little competition at the primary level, no national leader calling for primary battles "for the heart of the party" and the Wall Street donor class of the Democrats is wining, to many liberals detriment.
Their narrative is almost purely anti-Trump. On the other side, their narrative is economic nationalism and they're even willing to buck their own president. And boy do they come out to vote now. They're enthused. You have to give them the advantage over the next few years.
Democrats need an answer besides more free trade agreements.
8
Democrats need a candidate more charismatic than Trump. Mighty tall order.
We love in an interrelated world; no country is an island economically. For this reason, what is good for Mexico is good for the United States. Mexico is the second most important market for the US, after Canada. American productos are popular in mexico, more than any other country. Nationalism is based on hate of other countries, patriotism is based on love of own country.
Trump knows nothing of economics.
American companies benefit because they can sale their products internationally due to Mexican labor.
2
NAFTA destroyed Mexican farming by flooding it with subsidized US goods, and manufacturing, by flooding it with cheap made in China commodities from the US. So ending it seems like a win for Mexico.
7
The biggest problem with trade deals is that they confer benefits on some industries, some regions, and some workers while damaging others. The governments of Canada and the U.S. have failed to redirect a reasonable share of those gains back to those most adversely impacted.
That doesn't mean propping up dirty, dying industries like coal but investing heavily in new industrial sectors along with the infrastructure and training to support them. The absence of mandatory offsets and transitional funding in trade agreements has exacerbated the gap between rich and poor, and created regional resentments that are easily exploited by political fraudsters.
Ironically, the people who comprise Trump's base are the most vulnerable to free trade dislocations, and at the same time the least likely to benefit from Trump policies designed for the rich and powerful.
10
President Trump may have a high IQ (according to Trump), but does he know anything? If he has no facts or if he only has facts that are wrong, how can he make a good decision, no matter how high his IQ is?
People with high IQs generally write well, unless they are extremely dyslexic. The saying is "writing is thinking." Trump can't write his way out of a paper bag. Slightly above average IQ at best.
1
Under Trumps presidency the stock market is just loving his presidency. Money loves Trump. Growth loves Trump. Has any president had so much growth in the first months of presidency? No Trump is way in the lead. Call him a moron but when it comes to numbers he is way in the lead. Unless the economy tanks Trump will be president for another four years. By then the economy will be so big that the democrats will look like sniveling morons.
You can see the plan by the left now. They know the economy is going to be amazing come Trumps second term so they are just in press make believe
land. It almost look like fake news. Or maybe it is fake.
2
The Dow will fall 20% in next 12 months.
3
Yes the stock market has risen since trump got elected -- the reason is simple and has nothing to do with some innate financial mastery/wizardry from trump: He promised to totally deregulate the market, the banks, and support manufacturing by hurting unionization even further. It is the same game played by all gop's and it always results in an economic implosion and eventual tax payer funded bailouts for which the democrats will have to oversee. And trump and the gop will beat their drums saying the dems are bailing out the bad banks and bad wall street and the bad corps...... The dems will also oversee the reinstition of much needed regualtations to ensure that the banks and wall street and big business never again play loosy goosy with the economy.... and then americans will get angry and want change and forget all that happened and they will then vote in a person like trump who promises everything but can only succeed in dismantling and tearing down what the dems produced.....
Wash, rinse, repeat.....
Remember 2008? Well trump is setting up the next crash but this time it will be worse since his cuts and deregulation go far deeper than bush. The banks and wall street are having a hay day and they cant wait for the next bailout so they can cash out twice once again!
5
Trumps the head of the GOP destroying the United States world day by day. He is inept and clung to by the merry band GOP stars Pence, Ryan and all. Have no confusion about this. The GOP is drowning but on the way down flailing bout doing destruction to this country.
6
Former labor secretary nominee Andrew Puzder, beloved of Trump, will be very disappointed if NAFTA is scrapped. How can an employee in a hamburger factory afford a car unless it's made in Mexico by people making 8 to 10 dollars an hour? Everyone knows that labor costs are THE determining factor in the retail price of a car, right, right? Riiight.
The USSR featured a hammer & sickle on their banner. After Trump dispenses with this charade of withdrawal, maybe ours will become the spatula & pickle.
3
NYT: "The sky is falling, the sky is falling!"
Seriously, the fallout from scrapping trade agreements is likely to be much more benign than many would have you believe.
Just because an agreement is scrapped, doesn't mean nations will instantly put huge tariffs in place. Will Mexico put huge tariffs in place that will cause local food prices to soar? Hmm. Could be a problem for politicians getting reelected, if they were to do that.
The 1%'ers who influence which viewpoints get included in editorials, want to head off any discussions of policy which might interfere with a global race to the bottom on wages.
http://cepr.net/blogs/beat-the-press/nyt-gets-trumpian-in-support-of-nafta
8
He just seems to have to smash things up, as a splashy gimmick to please with base of supporters, who don't understand what's at risk.
8
mmm... break this, destroy that, rollback anything good does by someone else... and blame everyone else. So far, trump has accomplished nothing. and every will.
But a small word of warning trump and trump supporters, we will not forgive, we will not forget.
6
Hey - I just read that Trump's tax plan will give the middle class four thousand dollars...
That's terrific I can now get a hot dog with a beer at the hockey game.
Thanks a big, fat lot Trump. Some more GOP work and it's nacho time.
2
Let's see, the plan is to destroy unions, break healthcare, destroy Nafta, eliminate environmental safety regulations. Trump wants to rebuild those factories in the US, where the workers can make low wages and work forever, since Social Security and Medicare are next up. Soon we'll have our own polluting, low paying factories supplying junk for Walmart.
6
I can hardly wait. NAFTA has been bad, bad, bad, for the future of the United States.....interestingly, another cartoonish character who ran for the US presidency was prescient in his predictions: H. Ross Perot.
Yes, there will be some hardship for a small number of people but nothing compared to the devastation wrought by the effects of NAFTA upon the fabric of this nation.
It will be great for Mexico too, at least the peasantry, which still make up a significant percentage of the population.
Did you know that before NAFTA Mexico was a net exporter of ag. products but since NAFTA it is a net importer???? Yup, blame NAFTA.
I could write chapters on the ill effects of NAFTA but those of you who are not willfully blind, negligently ignorant or blithely unaware, already know the truth.
7
Frankly, the "I am a deal maker.," is only in 45's imagination.
4
Retiree, here. Time to move money out of my modest 401K and park it where it can't be decimated. No words to adequately express the disgust with the deplorables who inflicted this menace on our country. My horror grows daily.
9
NYT, in order to fully understand what is at stake, I wish you could give us an article that states exactly what are the "poison pills" and "non starters" that the US is requiring from its Mexican and Canadian partners.
4
Let it happen. Then we will pick up the pieces of this failing administration.
2
if he does scrap NAFTA, who Trump will blame when the stock market and the economy take a dive?
6
My guess would be either Obama or Hillary. Or maybe Corker or the Congress. Or McConnell or McCain or the NFL. Possibly ESPN or NBC. But not Russia. Definitely not Russia.
3
I can't wait to see who the Trump voters blame when they get a load of what the prices will be when they go to the store.
5
If ignorance is bliss ... President Trump is very blissful about most everything.
4
The latest news has it that the Trump administration is thinking about making a deal with Canada only, with Mexico left out in the cold.
Now, we reeeally need that wall folks!
As I had said from the begging, 45 is not in it to govern, in it for $$$$.
The wall will be built, if 45 serves his term in office. Wall means $$$.
1
The "great negotiator" is about to destroy beneficial trade relations with our two most important agricultural export markets Canada and Mexico. I hope those U.S. farmers out in Trump country who voted for this "moron" (not my words) wake up soon. The man is an absolute disaster to the fundamental basis for almost 1/4 of U.S. farm income which comes from exports. By the way, breaking hard won trade agreements like NAFTA with our partners invites retaliation. Great strategy Donnie. You really do have such an enormous IQ.
6
Retiree of the Detroit American auto industry here: many years ago whey NAFTA was negotiated, like many in my industry, I was dead-set against it. And, I still fume today over all of the jobs sent out of the country. But, now, it is what it is, water over the dam. You are not bringing those jobs back. Trump is beating a dead horse.
Maybe, just maybe, if Trump encouraged all of his uber-rich old white buddies to invest more money in American projects including research and development and educating a workforce to staff those specific projects, we wouldn't be dealing with the older-type jobs NAFTA facilitates.
NAFTA is policy between a lot of nations... nuking it would be a very bad idea, which seems increasingly "par for the course" for Trump.
8
I like your way of how you see this.
Create incentives, to bring them home. But, that requires focus, understanding of how the world works, etc. In other words, things that are utterly foreign to this administration.
2
Sorry, free, those old jobs aren't coming home. As I said, water over the dam. And in many cars, we don't want those old jobs anyway, because technology is going to render them low profit, low pay, low demand. No, I want new technology that comes from heavy investment from rich guys doing what they should be doing... putting that money to worki in investment in technology, not investment in the stock market.
Those old jobs have a home now, elsewhere. America should be the home of the new, not the old.
4
Business makes investment for one reason only: they see markets for the products of those investments. Capital for investment is in abundance today and interest rates are low. The domestic and world economies are awash in money. There is essentially NOTHING government can do to bigly make industry create jobs. No politician dares say this but it is true.
1
Canada is by far the largest customer for everything the US sells, especially when you look at the key swing states such as Ohio and Florida, along with the states that sell the food products that are all over our supermarkets. Overall, the US has a slight ($12 B) deficit in goods (mostly from oil), but a larger ($24 B) surplus in services, where trade is expanding rapidly. Wages in Canada are equal to and often higher than in the US, and environmental protections are stronger than in the US, so it's a level playing field.
We're confident that the facts, and the benefits, will speak for themselves. This may not save NAFTA, where we are mixed in with Mexico – but if NAFTA goes down, then we revert to the pre-existing Canada-US trade agreement. If Trump then tries to mess around with that one, he will have tremendous blowback from Congress, especially the senators and representatives from the key swing states that will determine who is the next president.
It is also good to remember that Canada is a close ally of the USA and has helped out in places like Afghanistan, so please keep that in mind. Foreign policy would be very difficult and much more expensive if the US loses its allies, or (same thing) if they lose the will to help out because they are not really being treated like allies.
5
Curiously, among those who've benefitted the most from NAFTA, and, thus, are subject to suffer the most from its demise, are those very mid-western farming communities that went all in for Trump in the election, despite all of his anti NAFTA (and TPP, for that matter) rhetoric.
Talk about voting against one's own interests.
I'll remember that the next time I hear some "sad" story about how family farmers in the mid-west are loosing solvency and going under.
7
BUT, if the tax overhaul bill passes and 45 signs it, they won't have to worry about the Death Tax.
Waite a minute, it might not matter after all.
Oh well.
1
It would be interesting to see if anyone is looking into Trump's investments during his presidency. These sorts of announcements have immediate stock market effects and Trump is in the ultimate insider position to capitalize.
3
If Trump succeeds in vitiating NAFATA, Mexico and the US will be hurt. Canada will probably do just fine.
Of course, it will be a while before all those states in the southwest realize how badly they're hurt, since they've also got stuff like a hurricane.
"The president has been very clear, that NAFTA has been a disaster". Based on what, the fact he repeated that baseless claim throughout his campaign, and now he has to fulfill his promise to destroy it even though doing so would be detrimental to all parties, including the US of A. Sad.
6
"“Any trade proposal that makes multinational corporations nervous is a good sign that it’s moving in the right direction for workers,” said Senator Sherrod Brown, Democrat of Ohio."
Not at all. Who do you think employs those workers? What might they do if they're forced to relocate?
2
Start their own businesses and employ each other at fair wages. It's called trickle up economics. It's real and it actually makes sense.
3
How much longer are we going to tolerate this behavior?
7
New flash to NY Times: Trump's economic and trade plans have already sent "shock waves" through the financial markets. The stock market is up 20% since Trump was elected! Trump has enriched millions of American's 401k plans.
(I remember fondly the piece that Paul Krugman had to pull after he wrote feverishly into the night of Nov. 8 that the stock markets were basically crashing in reaction to Trump's election. I guess the lesson is, if you want accurate prognostication, in either election results or financial futures, get it from the NY Times - in opposites!)
2
You have heard of bubbles, I assume? They are shiny, they float, they pop. When the stock market is involved, massive amounts of wealth gets transferred from pension funds, 401k's and small investors into the pockets of short-selling inside traders.
4
How rich of you to boast of your win fall. However, for the majority of Trump's voters--this will not be their reality. BTW the jobs for September are the lowest in 5 years--I think the Trump bump which was an anomaly is fading fast. Sad.
1
The delusion that Trump, and many of his supporters, have of him as a master negotiator is about to get a rude awakening.
it can not be stated enough: Trump was not and is not a skilled negotiator. His "skill", such as it is, is duping gullible or weak people, not negotiating with powerful and knowledgeable counter-parties.
Myth, meet reality.
9
And, he is not as rich as he says he is.
Con-man? Yes!
3
President in a free fall.
Earlier this year, President Nieto logged an approval rating of 12%. This was after he expressly stated that Mexico will not pay for the wall that President Trump wants to build on the Mexican-American border. Now he appears to be digging his heels in by not wanting to offer trading concessions to the US.
Nieto has a lot more to lose than Trump. Hopefully, he is mindful of this as the negotiations progress.
Though I'm not a fan of Peña Nieto, I respectfully disagree with Mr. Edwards that Mexico's President has more to lose than Mr. Trump. One of the causes, if not the chief reason, his approval ratings tanked a year ago, was due to the fact he invited then candidate Trump to Mexico City (a big, huge, gigantic mistake, to say the least).
I cannot imagine him wanting to inflict further damage to himself and his political party when we're less than a year away from our own Presidential elections. Indeed, the price to pay for any unreasonable "concessions" may very well be losing next year's Presidency, which, with the help of Mr. Trump, will most likely be an antagonistic, nationalist populist -- "Dios los hace, y ellos se juntan", or rather, "birds of a feather, flock together".
Free Trade Agreements provide the same sort of con jobs that trickle down economics has. All over the world FTA's have only ever served to transfer well paying jobs to lowly paid jobs in less developed economies while leaving the bulk of the profits in the hands of the 1%. For the middle classes of the developed world to regain what has been snatched from them we will have to get rid of the FTA's, trickle down and the 1%, and the sooner we do it the better.
9
Tell me then, why has their been an extraordinary increase in tbe standatrds of living for the world's most impoverishe people during this same time period.
It's true, the wealthy have a disproportionate share of gains. And the middle class is treading water. But the third world has made sustained progress.
I am not dismissing the negatives, but fairer distribution of goods and profits is so much more complicated than blaming billuonaires and millionaires.
2
FTA's may very well have all the problems you have enumerated, but the most important thing you forgot to mention. Globalization is inevitable whether you like it or not. If someone somewhere in the world can do the same job, produce a higher quality product, and at a lower price, in the end that is what will happen. You might as well try to make water run up hill. The better solution, in fact the only solution, is to make sure workers who will be displaced have a secure safety net and are educated and retrained to take advantage of new opportunities. Playing ostrich, burying your head in the sand and pretending if you don't look globalization will somehow go away, is an invitation to disaster.
4
I never thought of NAFTA as a method to improve the economy of the US. It made no sense-- as the high per unit cost producer in many areas, clearly the net result would be an export of jobs. The main benefit seemed to be political, to bind the North American countries (see also: TPP, although TPP was also festooned with secret special interest baubles effectively making TPP a non-starter). NAFTA would also increase productivity by weeding out many poorly run American businesses, and there were many many of those.
What NAFTA lacked was a degree of gradualism; and as recognized relatively recently by dismal scientists, a way to help those whose jobs are impacted to transition to alternative employment. If the employment shock grew too large, introduction of elements of the agreement would further slow.
Having said that, NAFTA is old news. Undoing NAFTA after all the damage is done isn't going to unwind the clock and unleash a font of middle class jobs or invigorate the wasteland of tiny towns and the countryside that are now barely floating on entitlement incomes. Undoing NAFTA now would cause a moderate product price spike (happy news for the Fed pro-inflation cheerleaders) and slightly later a wave of automated production. What jobs?
7
The teaser for the article says NAFTA is a punching bag for Trump. The problem with Trump and his administration is that everything is a punching bag for Trump. He runs the country on hate and misunderstanding. He dislikes anything that he doesn't understand and he understands very little. If someone doesn't adore him, Trump treats that person as an enemy and tweets out juvenile nicknames. Is this anyway to run a country, hating everything and everybody?
20
Seriously? He's that stupid?
11
OMG, how did we all get along before NAFTA? Quite well actually. Typical NYT overstatement, the sky is falling. Again! ...this is getting very very old.
8
Trump's motto is the reverse of the Hippocratic oath:
"Do as much harm as you can", to as many people as possible, including to the best friends of the country you are supposed lead, but have actually succeeded in turning into a terrifying international laughing stock. The worst damage he has inflicted so far is on America itself, its image, its economic and social prospects, and above all its standing in the world. That Americans have not yet stirred to forcefully remove him from an office he as soiled to an incredible degree is... incredible!
13
No, the incredible part is that there are so many people who still support him. The scary part is that we have so many people in our country who are that dumb. Want kind of proof do they need that he is a total incompetent . As a country we face many difficulties and challenges. How can we possible hope to solve them when we have to deal with an electorate that is hopelessly stupid.
5
It is truly a sign of how upside-down things are in America of 2017 when the President and his supporters say there are "some very fine people" among KKK and Nazis, but true unified moral outrage is reserved for trade agreements like NAFTA. People are saying "kill NAFTA" as if it were a dragon. NAFTA is not perfect and should be revisited, but trade treaties are practical issues to be dealt with rationally. This country has lost its collective mind when it can summon up more knee-jerk moral certainty over trade than over Nazis and KKK.
18
Fascism will kill you, NAFTA will just make you hungry.
1
Trump is likely a foreign controlled agent so his agenda is to undermine America. He also thinks he's an awesome negotiator and he thinks threats work best...... If he pulls out I'd say his foreign pull is stronger, and if he stays in, despite all his bellicose rhetoric, it just shows he's just the moron as Tillerson told us he is... Either way, he's the most useless lump of flesh to fill any government spot.
6
It’s hatred of all things that say Obama
6
Trump the immoral narcissist will scrap the United States if that inflates his ego. This isn`t surprising, it is what psychopathic narcissists do when given the chance. Hitler almost managed to scrap Germany off the map, for example. The tragedy about Trump is that it is the American People who gave him the means to scrap their country. Not even Hitler enjoyed this advantage - unlike Trump, who was ushered to the White House by masses of ignorant and racist whites, Hitler had to get rid of a large number of decent people to take full control of the German government. God spare the US, Americans have no idea what is coming their way.
6
The way to run the asylum.
2
How's that Trump presidency working out for you?
Can't say we didn't tell you he was unfit for the job.
9
Our wracked Trump..
What has he or for that matter GOP has done constructive over past 20 years?
3
When is NAFTA going to benefit workers? Why haven't wages risen to US levels when workers do the same work as US workers use to do? Mexico should be forced to raise minimum wages and allow unions
6
Mexico should allow unions? Why when we are effectively destroying our own unions and with them the middle class.
3
Trump and the entire GOP are the list destructive force to this nation!
It’s the nightmare that keeps on giving. The question is now that the US has become insane in the worlds eyes, will we and the world survive this cretin? Bat - crazy, Trump, Pence, Ryan and the entire sinking GOP are destroying us. No equilibrium. Except for Kelly and the generals. They know how crazy these guys are. They know any Democrat yes I really hate to say even Hillary Clinton would have been better for the US and the world. The world is mourning the former US leadership.
Even enemies are perplexed by the insanity. For the States that gave the electoral vote and bought into the Russian collusion with Trump all I say is payback will happen not by Trump like resentment but by the course of his insane decisions. Bon appetit.
5
Trump is a destroyer not a builder. He's a contract breaker not a dealmaker.
9
Is there any evidence that the "great negotiator" has ever successfully negotiated anything?
3
As usual Trump operates on the basis of rhetoric that appeals to a certain poorly educated and uninformed mentality, but has no basis in fact. The US exports more to Canada than it exports to China, Japan and the United Kingdom COMBINED. The US is running a 35 billion dollar trade SURPLUS with Canada. Ten border States depend heavily on trade with Canada. Only a moron would rip this up. Such an outcome would cost the US dearly, while Canada would re-orient its economic and political interests more broadly, as it should have done decades ago - too many cards in one basket. And there is more than trade at stake in this. Fortunately Canada is demonstrating level-headed leadership and goodwill in its approach to these talks; however, there are bottom lines that must be respected for the deal to survive. But this is negotiations and it's not over till it's over.
18
Turning over leadership in the PacRim economy was a bad idea if the intent was to make American middle class lives better. The best thing about America is our leadership and control over world events. What leadership Trump hasn't managed to hand over to others, he seems determined to destroy in any way he can. I don't get what his "base" is getting out of it.
4
this is a dictatorship
every day a new attack upon what the majority wants and believes in.
we have to find a way to get America back
6
Sorry, but Trump won the election according to the terms defined in our Constitution for over 200 years. Did you know that Bill Clinton was elected with only 43% of the vote in 1992 (most Americans voted against him). And although most Americans voted against Trump, most also voted against Hillary (Bill's wife) - i.e. they voted for Trump or one of the third party candidates. So, if you are looking for what the majority wants, it is not so simple.
3
Clinton, Trump, at least Reagan's dead and only his economics keep us poor now.
Impede the president's agenda? The agenda of a sociopathic Putin puppet, on a thin financial string to money laundered "oligarch" funding. An agenda to cater to the LCD of ignorant deplorables, who do not get the GOP & Trump's demolition derby to destroy the public good which could easily take down our economic bubble with it. Negotiations involve compromise and an understanding of the opposite side, as well as an appreciation for what happens when an asteroid is hurled into the middle of a shallow pond. Or the plug is pulled. Perhaps the U.S. could go into the branding business, and license the Presidential seal? Trump's idea of economics is to build the glitziest casino on the boardwalk to compete with his other 2 casinos. Perhaps the real goal is to reduce the American auto business into a pile of rubles, oops rubble, and then import Russian made cars like the Yugo; which was termed, "the worst car in history." NAFTA may not be perfect, but it is better than pulling the plug. Does Trump know what happens in a bath tube? The real question is what does Putin have to gain? Trump needs to go: www.citizensfortruth.net
7
Donald the Destroyer. Of everything he touches. Thanks, GOP.
13
Time for Congress ti step in and invoke the 25th Amendment. We cannot let a madman bring the world economy down...
7
I would really like, just one Trump supporter, to tell me if these actions..the ending of NAFTA, the roll back of the EPA regulations on oil, auto and coal fired power plant emissions, along with the ending of gov'mnt grants to study climate change, the reopening of federal lands to oil, coal exploration and timber harvesting abandoning the Paris Climate Accords, the decision to under staff our State Dept. and that is a very, very short list. Tell me..no tell us all if these are the things you voted for.
9
Yes.
It is what they voted for because FOX News has been telling them for years that these things are bad. It's part of the "if Obama did/liked it then we don't" agenda.
3
At least Trump isn't from the party of "No", just the party of "blow it up".
3
Everyone agrees to the fact NAFTA has been advantageous to our neighbors more than us. At least in the case of Mexico, may be it's OK because Mexico is an underdeveloped country and we can feel good about ourselves feeding others. What is the need to go soft with Canada though? NYT's reasoning seems to be that Trump is not caring enough about Canada and Mexico's concerns (Obama was more concerned about other countries and look where it got us). And you still wonder why Trump won the election to be President of the United States? Are you really that dense?
3
Obama's concern for other countries opened markets and created jobs. Trump's obsession with undoing everything President Obama did will result in severe jobs losses. Midwestern farmers are constantly being quoted that the are worried about how they will sell their corn if NAFTA changes. Mexico is a huge market for Midwestern farmers. I'm sure they won't mind plowing under their crops for the good of ... remind me again how this helps Midwestern farmers?
9
I'll tell you where Obama got us. Out of a major recession and the stock market climbing during his admin. And whats wrong with helping to feed others. Have a little compassion and empathy, will you?
3
you speak for everyone - how exciting
1
Is Trump acting on Putin's behalf?
5
I don't like Trump but I also don't like to see jobs that Americans had, and which provided them with good wages, shipped off to Mexico. Like it or not that is what happened, and keeps on happening. No wonder these voters chose Trump, because the elites keep insisting how great a deal like NAFTA is, but they don't have to cope with the reality of unemployment or a lower standard of living . Fact.
7
Daisy....My grandfather farmed with a horse and made a pretty good living.
And how many American workers would be happy making $5.00 or less $ an hour?
You want $9.00 sneakers etc etc...
Can"t have your cake and eat it too.
He cannot build therefore he shall destroy.
11
I much wish that spokespeople for a national administration that might easily rank as the most corrupt in American history would stop using the simple-minded "draining the swamp" analogy. What this administration has done is to create a cesspool. Do the American people prefer a cesspool to a swamp?
The president's NAFTA epithet maligning it "as the worst [deal] in history" puzzles me. I thought that the honor had already been bestowed on the Iran nuclear agreement. Perhaps any and all deals not negotiated by president are "the worst in history." At any given moment, which one selected would be the one occupying the very limited space between his ears.
7
The difference countries like USA and say China is the way they deal with Trade and Foreign policies. Which shows the growth rate of Asian countries are faster then US, the reason the leadership approach, I for one was a fan of Prez. Bush, his foreign policies were logical and totally in favor of the country's growth. When will Ministries, People, and everyone else start thinking of growing as a person and a responsible country. There is outrage for every decision being made - we should think logically and check the pros and cons.
Best regards,
Sandy from team - goo.gl/hZVTiU
Is this the greed is good approach???
Republicans are intellectually bankrupt. Trump is not a singular figure from Republican party, he is the culmination of their greed and narrow minded, hypocritical approach to politics. Now that they control White House and both Chambers of Congress, I dare them to do what they have been saying on healthcare, economy and foreign trade. Trump has delivered only on one thing he promised to his base, a conservative justice to the SCOTUS on a seat robbed by Mitch McConnel from President Obama.
9
All abrogating NAFTA would do, aside from increasing rates of undocumented immigration, would be to usher in our next recession.
4
Why do these so-called free market conservatives worldwide know so little about trade? Brexit, the other master coma of conservative politics, involves re-negotiation of hundreds, perhaps thousands, of trade agreements. This will simply trash everything, with no negotiations and no options, at the expense of North American businesses. You'd get more business sense out of a piece of broccoli than the mentality that cane up with this mess.
4
Er... "came" up with this mess... Why is it whenever it's anything to do with the economy, Sigmund Freud comes to mind?
Even as a leftist I agree nafta and how it benefits the US is worth addressing, I would just prefer it not receive it from a toddler wearing a paper mache crown.
5
"I- Donald Trump was elected to entertain all people like me in keeping them amused 24 by 7 and anything else is beyond my qualification and people like me knew it before my election. My prior career experiences were dedicated to chasing skirts, hosting the beauty pageant, getting rich by going thru chap11 bankruptcy court, selling unscrupulous Trump brands to consumers including real estate coupled with US citizenship and overpriced condo bearing my name, hosting make-believe reality show Apprenticeship and etc. Despite my expensive education, I have not learned much from it as demonstrated my limited vocabulary. With a resume like this, it is not surprising I neither understand nor solve any complicated problems such as health care, immigration, N Korea, international trades, taxes and etc., beyond my mastery cheap talk, bombastic tweet and lowly insult."
4
It may take tanking the stock market before those who have the power to remove him from office actually start to take the threat he poses seriously. When their portfolios lose 30-40% perhaps they`ll wake up. More likely, though, they`ll take a short position and bet against the future of the country.
8
I so agree with this .When they feel in their pocket books they will start to listen but until then as long as the market keeps rising they will look the other way.
1
So far, I have gained 20%. Also, if you like your plan, you can keep your plan.
1
Trump will cause a recession in Canada and maybe in USA also.Investors are more and more concerned about the direct and indirect impacts of this move.....So the guy will have to make a move to distract thee people from this economic. disaster; it will be a war, a good republican war ....with who NK is not the good way to go because it would be to costly so the best choice should be Iran IMO.But he will start a war mark my word.
4
Once again no specifics, for example...
"president has been clear that Nafta has been a disaster for many Americans..."
What does that mean? What numbers back-up his inch deep rhetoric?
10
On the bright side, I'd much rather see Canada aligning its economy with like -minded-environmentally-sustainable partners.
Coming from the food industry, I'd love to see Canada aligning itself more towards the European Union and getting away from the US as much as possible . Laws and regulations in the US food industry are meant to protect big business and not consumers and this is hurting Canada's access to the European market.
Plus, as an ordinary citizen I really don't see any benefit from NAFTA. I can not buy $20 online worth of stupid things from the US without being charged a ridiculous amount of tax by Customs Canada and "broker" fees.
5
In essence Trump is bluffing for ends he has zero knowledge about; this is not good. Perhaps folks in Mexico will have better diabetes outcomes.
4
All threats all the time, such is this administration, and I am truly unnerved by it all. We have conducting ourselves is a way that undermines every idealist tradition we may worked toward all these past years. I am afraid of an administration that is all threats.
4
Does the president have the authority to end a treaty on his own? The article does not explain the legal process for ending Nafta, says nothing about any Congressional role. We need more information.
4
As usual, bluster + would've/could've/should've statements from a man clearly not yet filling the shoes of the president.
Typical breaking news:
--Trump's NAFTA demands increase fears across the U.S.
--Trudeau fights to save NAFTA Deal but Trump offers little hope.
--Trump's NAFTA proposals have poison pills, says U.S. Chamber of Commerce.
--7 hours ago, Trump says "We'll see" on NAFTA.
He's literally exhausting.
4
As a Canadian I have to wonder out our friends the Americans.
From our point of view - with friends like these, who need enemies?
From the US point of view - if you treat your friends like this, expect to have nothing but enemies.
5
The majority of us in Canada opposed NAFTA from the start. Our Prime Minister Mulroney and your Reagan pushed it down our throat. America needs our lumber we don't need your chickens and your cheese. If you threaten high tariffs we should (if Trudeau has the guts) simply raise our prices to a level equal to your tariff proposal. No more paying countervailing tariffs.
4
Don't worry, he will pursue separate treaties with Canada and Mexico. The White people's treaty with Canada will be fair. But he will let those uppidity Mexicans know who's boss.
3
Navigator, Trump is slapping huge tariffs on goods Canada ships to the USA. It may be a White people treaty but every American of every colour will be paying more because of these tariffs.
1
If NAFTA collapses, the Trump Administration will drag us into a recession or worse.
3
If Trump is such a great businessman and negotiator, why do all the Trump Organization's loans come from foreign banks?
18
"But Mr. Murphy and others in the business community cautioned that such an approach would probably be ill-fated. In both Canada and Mexico, Mr. Trump is unpopular, and caving to his demands could have devastating consequences for local politicians. Mexican government officials have repeatedly said they would not negotiate with a gun to the head."
Ah yes. That's the point ... of MAGA. Under Trump perhaps WE will
be equally adamant. WHY should we be different?
Why should we be the patsy? In the long run this will be to
our benefit.
1
This is all Trump knows how to do - walk away. He's been doing it all his life. He walked away from his two marriages, he walks away from friends on a twitter daily basis, and he walked away from the failure of all his businesses. He walked away from TPP, Paris Climate Accord, and now he's planning on walking away from the Iran deal and NAFTA. And he'll run the USA into the ground and then - walk away.
11
Why are so many people on here supporting NAFTA?
NAFTA was a sell-out of the American middle class to corporate interests. Wall Street benefited by moving American factories to Mexico to cut labor costs so they could boost profits. They sold this betrayal to us by promising us more jobs at better pay. It didn't happen. Instead, we got service jobs at minimum wage while shareholders got champagne and caviar. To make matters worse, we got flooded with illegal aliens who put further downward pressure on American wages, even driving out Americans from whole industries.
Go and listen to Al Gore debate Ross Perot about NAFTA back in 1993. The debate is online. Everything Gore said back then turned out to be false while everything Perot said turned out to be true. But the media told us that Gore won the debate and Perot was crazy. Now the media is telling us Trump is crazy for trying to get rid of an agreement that's been killing the working people in this country.
8
The middle class is doing terrific, it's the uneducated working class that's hurting. The middle class is the affluent class that owns all those shares of stock.
3
The move from unionization is killing the working class.
???? The middle class is shrinking, that is why people like Trump are attractive to so many, including many people who use to be middle class and previously voted for Obama hoping for an improvement in their lot. Democrats. The profound incompetence of Democrats is why Trump is in office. And it has been playing out for a decade. The supposedly better educated party has lost again, and again, and again. And there is no sign of improvement.
1
A real estate developer would never have a clue as to what cross border trade entails. Little wonder Trump wants to dump this agreement since it would not impact his business.
Follow the money to know this president's motivations.
5
"many workers have lost their jobs as manufacturing plants relocated to Mexico or Canada"
I don't know where you get this idea. Manufacturing jobs have disappeared from Canada and reappeared in Mexico at cut-rate labour costs ever since NAFTA began.
2
NAFTA was negotiated and signed by Bush 41 (after he lost the election to Clinton). Clinton supported its passage through congress. In the House, NAFTA passed 234-200; 132 Republicans and 102 Democrats voted in favor of it. The Senate approved NAFTA 61-38, with the backing of 34 Republicans and 27 Democrats. Perhaps someone should mention these things to the President so he stops making up excuses for why and how NAFTA passed and puts the majority of the responsibility on his own party. Yet recent history has shown us not to expect rationality or simple facts to prevail.
4
Trump wants America to return to the 1950's.
My father has told me much about the 50's. He often describes how a shoe salesman at the local department store could make a solid, middle class wage; enough to support his stay-at-home wife and his 3 children. A tight double windsor was required at dinner. Things were perfect. And, of course, white.
Those days are long gone however. Wages did in fact peak in the 70's. But, miraculously rose again to near peak levels AFTER nafta went into effect. Today, more than 50% of earnings from Fortune 500 companies come from abroad. America benefits from this.
NAFTA didn't kill The Beaver Cleaver. Nor did Latinos or Integration. Global competition stemming from post war recovery killed the 50's.
I for one am happy for it. I hate wearing my tie at dinner...
7
Record levels of income and wealth inequality are the result, helped along by both parties. The middle class is shrinking. If you're happy about that then you'll need to accept everything that comes with it.
1
John....The problem is that we need to use some of the increased corporate profits to improve our infrastructure, make quality education readily available, and invest in basic research. When we use some of the profits to improve our standard of living, everyone benefits. When we refuse to invest in the future, everyone eventually loses.
" In both Canada & Mexico Trump is unpopular " .... oh yea and he's just sitting on top of the world here. Please .. other than a few hillbillies where is his support? He doesn't know what's in this deal. He can't even begin to understand the repercussions of pulling out. These pacts take many years to negotiate, by people with great minds. There's good and bad about it. But overall I believe NAFTA is a good thing for everyone involved. All he knows how to do is destroy. John Murphy in the article is absolutely right, the administration's proposals had "no identifiable constituency backing them" .. " a remarkable degree of unity in their rejection " Amen to that ...
Orange, NJ
5
Trump is a small town hotelier and a performer on local cheesecake TV. His grasp of the economics of the nation, the hemisphere and the world. Everything he knows is limited by his ignorance of events outside of a small portion of Manhattan , Queens and Brooklyn. Basically, he is a winner of lotto and he is using his clever guessing ability and his father's great wealth as a replacement for experience . Allowing Trump to control the reins of the US economy is like Phaeton asking to take the reins of the Sun car from his dad, Apollo, and almost wrecking the planet.
For those who want to see how a President's actions affect the economy , look at the wild swings in the gold market during Lincoln's first administration, as Union armies were constantly losing major battles and the Capitol seemed surely about to have to move to Philadelphia or somewhere in NY.
Back in its infancy, NAFTA was a terrible deal for Canada despite the enthusiasm of our then prime minister, Brian Mulroney. Public protests were about as extreme as they can become in our country: Mulroney's government branded 'a passel of rogues,' just for starters.
Several decades later, through the leadership of business leaders, corporations, government officials and ordinary citizens, we've found a way to live and prosper with it. There were some bad times.
Now that equality of 'free' trade has been achieved, Mr. Trump wants to turn back the clock to Day One. I don't think our Star Wars' socks Prime Minister will allow that to happen. Mr. Trudeau has been working hard to expand our economic ties with China to much quiet Canadian applause.
In fact, we may be much better off if Trump writes us off. Maud Barlow - an under-recognized Canadian - campaigned throughout the 90s against NAFTA on many grounds. One was the fact that NAFTA requires that, in the event of a catastrophe, Canada must send its water to the US before providing for its own citizens.
Go Trump, go! Trash NAFTA and we'll be back on an even play field.
4
A small thinking group of people could not adjust to a changing world, including global economy and immigrants or "people not like us" and so we have to witness the dismantling of all the progress this country has made and likely our position as world leader. Mr. Trump will no longer be leader of the free world but of the country that used to be important. China is already soaring on solar power, meaning the high cost of energy will cut their costs further while we continue to damage our environment and our ability to draw the top talent.
Even so, far worse than our tantrum-in-chief is all the enablers around him. To keep their do-nothing, overly compensated jobs they act as if it's all good. They are the real enemies of the state.
4
If you are one of those writing comments in favor of preserving NAFTA under its present terms then you're not from one of the thousands of communities that have been negatively affected - factory closings and tens of thousands of jobs lost. NAFTA has enriched multinational corporations and has severely hurt the working class. It has decimated middle class America.
5
It is naïve to think that NAFTA is the reason people lost factory jobs. It's a complex problem that doesn't have a simple "get rid of NAFTA" answer.
2
$2.25/hr to Build a $40,000 Vehicle
by Wolf Richter • Sep 29, 2017
Mexico’s wage repression scheme creates Nirvana for global automakers.
A system of wage repression in auto manufacturing that has long undermined the Mexican labor market, has dragged on the local economy, and has spread downward wage pressures to US autoworkers has been revealed by an AP story in the Detroit News. And this is for factories that manufacture expensive products, even luxury products, in demand in the US and elsewhere. This isn’t about manufacturing T-shirts. But that system of wage repression has been working wonders for global automakers setting up shop in Mexico.
Most of the workers at the new Audi factory in the state of Puebla, inaugurated in 2016 and assembling the Audi Q4 SUV, which carries a sticker price in the US of over $40,000 for base versions, make $2.25 an hour, according to the Union.
Volkswagen, which owns Audi, started building Beetles in Puebla in 1967 and has since created a vast manufacturing empire in Mexico, with vehicles built for consumers in Mexico, the US, Canada, and Latin American markets.
Volkswagen, Ford, GM, or any of the global automakers, which can manufacture just about anywhere in the world, always search for cheap labor to maximize the bottom line.
3
Silver lining, Times readers. Gun enthusiasts may no longer have access to low priced, high quality Mexican made ammunition now being sold in the US market.
6
NYT quote “Everyone knows that much of what is being proposed in key areas are, in effect, non-starters, which begs the question as to what, exactly, the administration is trying to achieve.”
The article is short on the specific topics being negotiated. For example, what kind of 'non-starter' proposals are being asked by the Trump administration?
The areas and sectors covered by the original NAFTA agreement were totally controlled by the winners of that treaty i.e., US multinationals corporations and specific lobbying groups, particularly farming.
6
President Trump
It is very easy to solve NAFTA and many other trade issues with other countries without these complex negotiations or tearing apart supply chains, or creating fear and uncertainity or by imposing so called anti dumping duties . It is a very simple principle of adhering to conditional reciprocity.
In fact this deal can be further expanded to include other Latin American countries and we can become the largest trading block in the world.
Insist on free trade but equal/balanced trade. If any of these countries has a trade surplus, they will have to pay countervailing duties of let us say 50% only on the surplus portion of the trade.
So in the case of NAFTA, if Mexico exports to us say 500 billion dollars duty free and we export to them 450 Billion dollars duty free, Mexico has a trade surplus of 50 Billion dollars. So we will impose a countervailing duty of 50% on the surplus of 50 billion dollars- that will be 25 billion dollars. Mexico can spread this 25 billion on its entire exports of 450 Billion effectively paying 5.5% on all its exports. However if the import export figure is same then Mexico/Mexican exporters pays zero countervailing duties.
This principle should be applied to all free trade deals. Same principle can be effectively applied to our outrageous trade imbalance with China and India. America should never retreat from the world but insist on free and balanced trade.
NAFTA can be renamed as FABTA- Free And Balanced Trade Agreement.
6
You can’t compare trade parity between two countries on dollar vs. dollar basis. America’s GDP and consumption is many times more than Mexico’s the one can’t except Mexico to import same amount from America as they export.
You are okay then with the USA paying such a duty to the trading partners we have a surplus with then?
You are okay then with the USA paying duty then to the trading partners we have a surplus with then?
The biggest factor for the loss of manufacturing jobs in the U.S. is automation and not NAFTA. In fact, roughly 1 in 3 jobs in America is at risk of automation, which is not being discussed with any level of seriousness by the media. Under NAFTA, trade between the U.S. and Mexico has roughly doubled to around half a trillion dollars in trade. Under NAFTA, around 40% of all products imported into the U.S. from Mexico contains U.S. parts in comparison to around 4% for Chinese imports. Also, the provision of services by American companies in Mexico is not counted in the import/export figures and considering this fact, the overall trade between the U.S. and Mexico is roughly even. This does not even consider the amount of capital that is returned to the U.S. by American companies doing business in the NAFTA countries.
If Trump walks away from NAFTA, this will cause severe economic damage to all countries involved. As for the U.S., Red States like Iowa and Nebraska will particularly suffer because Mexico will retaliate with high tariffs and replace these agricultural products from other countries like Brazil and Argentina. The best thing to do is update NAFTA on subjects like services, technology, and labor and not destroy a relationship that has been beneficial for all three countries involved.
28
You've fallen for propaganda. Automation has been an issue since the start of the Industrial Revolution. It's not something new.
Ford and GM didn't move their factories to Mexico because they have better robots than we do. The factories have moved because labor and environmental standards are lower there. If automation was replacing jobs then products would still say "Made in the USA" and not "Hecho in Mexico" or "Made in China".
If we want to have a middle class, we need to get rid of trade agreements like NAFTA that increase corporate profits by eliminating American workers and sending jobs to where labor standards are lower.
Don't believe the corporate lies about the world ending if NAFTA is repealed. Go back and listen to the debates about NAFTA in 1994. It was all sold on lies. None of the promises made to American workers came true, but Wall Street got rich getting rid of middle class American jobs.
5
Companies also moved factories because they want to open those markets. Countries are not interested in selling products that are imported from the US. If you want to do business in any country, the government will expect some jobs to be created in their country. It is important to stop pretending that NAFTA is the only reason for decreased factory jobs. It is automation. It is because companies want to open markets. It is because materials changed so instead of needing four people to attach an iron car bumper, you only need one person and a robot to attach a plastic bumper. It is It is a complicated issue. Simply blaming NAFTA is not helpful if you really want to understand the changes.
4
"Cut off the nose to save the Face"...this is an ill conceived ploy to gain a destructive short term "optic" to serve a one family brand to destroy the goodwill of an entire "Greatest Generation" brand. Free trade, first with Canada (1987) and later Mexico (1994) helped the USA grow during a period where the USA's international competitiveness was falling versus Japan/Germany. When the US wanted to increase the regional market through open markets, this had a detrimental effect on Canada and Mexico as US companies closed "branch" operations in Canada and Mexico to attain economies of scale in the US. Eventually Canada benefited as better health, education, crime rate and other social advantages provided a superior investment opportunity for US and foreign investors. Mexico fared worse as labor saving (poor health and education investments) were "Trumped" by poor governance chaos. It is sad to see the USA embrace a 3rd world economic policy of personal enrichment as they strive to compete against China. When the US model of increasingly disenfranchised citizens and likely poor future socail/health outcomes - investment heads to safer havens - hence the falling dollar. If you don't like the outcome changing the game or knocking over the checker (chess) board if you hate to lose is a child's option - but if you want to win (as opposed to not losing) - real tactics and strategy are the only answer - Mexico and Canada are not the trade problem.
9
Free trade doesn’t mean the same thing as no trade, no doubt that will certainly continue. I’ll still be able to buy anything I want, maybe just have to think a little more carefully about whether it’s worth it or not. That’s not really that bad a thing, actually.
1
Putin must be positively giddy. His plans are succeeding beyond his wildest dreams. Trump isn't satisfied with undermining American influence and dismantling our government. He's now intent on destroying our economy. Well played.
28
I thought NAFTA stood for:
No American For Trump Agreement ....
3
Good luck USA. Will you be included among the nations of influence 10 years from now? Or left to twist in the wind of your own doing?
10
The United States and Canada have been fiends in peace and allies in war for over 100 years. Your comment will not deter my affection and respect for the Canadian civilians I have met, nor the Canadian military I have served with.
Trump is not a business man. This bit of inane stupidity will cost money, cost, jobs, throw a monkey wrench into the auto motive industry a mile wide and ten miles deep.
This is not conservative. And was not NAFTA passed by Congress? Is it not Congress that must undo it?
10
Trump is not a consevative, other than by self-proclamation.
3
Like others here I remember the arguments that we had in passing NAFTA. I was against it wondering how American workers could compete against Mexicans (who make on average $4 a day, today). My best friend said then we would be swamped by Mexicans looking for jobs if we didn't join it. Well we did lose jobs. My sister's factory in Mississippi closed fifteen years ago and went to Mexico. She is doing fine now on retirement but those jobs in Mississippi are gone for good. And it seems to me, just to me, mind you, that ten to twenty million Mexicans and Central Americans have swamped every region of the United States in the twenty five years since the Clintons brought us into NAFTA. Ross Perot was right about the sucking sound of American jobs disappearing. But I don't think anyone realized that a folk wandering had also begun in which tens of millions of Spanish speaking Catholics would move north into the United States. (Have I committed a faux pas by mentioning the obvious?) I don't have a clue what un-doing NAFTA would do to us or Mexico economically. I do know we were lied to at the time. And the disaster that is Trump in so many ways is right when it comes to the fact that globalizing the economy has been no favor to American workers. But you have to be old enough to remember before the tern "Rust Belt" was invented to really recognize the truth in that.
7
Trump is out to destroy everything.
9
He is a bitter contrarian. But what is he bitter about? Being elected to the presidency of the US, a role for which he is unsuitable in every conceivable way? Is he bitter about the great wealth he claims to have? Is he bitter about stealing taxpayer money to visit his golf courses and the dreadful Mar-A-Lago?
1
As a well-wisher of the democratic nations of North America, I hope and pray that this is just a play from 'The Art of the Deal' - one of the really terrible chapters.
I don't know whether your president is really bent on scrapping this treaty and I have no idea what exactly happens when you pull the plug on some half a trillion dollars of trade. However, one thing appears certain if NAFTA hafta go. While Canada will still get by, Mexico will desperately need another business partner, on almost any terms. Sadly for the cause of world peace, such a flend exists and is all too leady to lend a hand.
5
And that new partner for Mexico - wait--- wait ---- wait
CHINA.
3
NAFTA is a great deal if your a Mexican or a Canadian. Trump is fighting for American workers which is why he won the election. End of story.
7
Then why are his own products made overseas and not here?
And automation is what killed American jobs, not NAFTA.
5
Tell that to Iowa Nebraska farmers.
1
Trump's voters were relatively well off. The notion that he won because he was fighting for American workers is a myth. The most important motivator for his voters was racial resentment.
Alan Jennerich wrote:
"NAFTA is a great deal if your a Mexican or a Canadian. Trump is fighting for American workers which is why he won the election. End of story."
2
The US government has imposed absurd tarrifs on Bombardier planes. This is considered an act of commercial war. You will find it quite annoying to fight your last friends.
Maybe you guys should try to find some history books.
6
Please invade us. The sanity would be welcome.
6
I would not like an invasion but I would happily go for a merge with your state, anytime.....California think a lot like us .Let's make a deal, you get Trudeau as a premium LOL
One of the little known provisions of NAFTA is that Canada, with its abundance of natural resources ( oil, natural gas, water), is required to sell those resources to the United States and Mexico in proportion to population. If there is a shortage, Canada cannot keep resources for itself. Since our Northern Neighbour has most of the world's fresh water, it would be idiocy for us to pull out of this deal. We need Canada more than it needs us. But then, we have an idiot running the country...
11
Many of these comments are the sorts of thing that given one to wonder whether rightists or leftists are crazier and less interested in facts.
Is it time for impeachment yet? How much more of this must we endure?
5
I wish Trump's decisions harmed only those who voted for him
9
So sad that these United States, under the dementia-influenced unleadership of President Trump, is sliding down the slope to destruction. I used to be very proud of my country and my government. No more. Now I'm embarrased.
11
It’s so easy to destroy; it’s much more difficult to create. From trade deals to healthcare to the environment to security agreements, it seems that Trump, the GOP, and their supporters are only interested in destruction. If NAFTA is so bad, why not fix it rather than razing it? Ditto for the TPP, the ACA, the EPA and NATO. “Shaking things up” is one thing; simply breaking stuff is quite another, especially when you haven’t a clue what you’re talking about nor any plans for replacing what you’ve wrecked.
17
It's almost as if Trump is acting as an agent of Putin.
10
He's an arsonist. He rates his performance on what he burns down.
9
well that won't help anybody.
Trump is not a builder. Building agreements between nations or getting census nationally are arduous, difficult and time consuming business. Because he has no ability or temperament for this hard and sophisticated work, he simply demolishes what others have built. The really galling part is he has zero comprehension of what he is demolishing with his glib, brainless pronouncements.
10
james griffen * AMEN
Manufacturing jobs declined steadily since ww2, hardly a bump for NAFTA and China, Japan. It's automation, not globalization killing jobs. This will do nothing but cause a recession.
4
At last, a way to compete with Brexit!
7
You mean in the race to stupidity and isolationism.
3
This will be BREXIT all over again.
American agribusiness suffers.
Multinational businesses suffer.
Mexican oligarchs suffer.
Mexican farmers prosper.
American workers prosper.
The environment benefits.
So what's the problem?
2
Millions of American jobs will be lost. And the ones NAFTA originally hurt have been replaced by automation. Oh, and the economy will crash.
Evidence of same please?
America was for a century a beacon of global leadership and sensibility. Now, Trump and the Republican Party are going to burn it all down for no sensible reason. They seem to still believe that the world is as it was in the 1980's, but that world moved on. For some inexplicable reason, a large swath of the middle of the country thinks they can roll back time and everything will be amazing again - boy, are they ever in for a shock when all of their safety nets are yanked out from beneath them, all because they believed the siren songs of an snake oil salesman and his loyal band of blind-faith sycophants.
10
NAFTA is a 25 year old agreement, so it seems only natural that it be updated to reflect current realities and future opportunities and challenges for each of the countries. But, to throw the baby out with the bathwater seems reckless, and will probably end up affect Trump's constituents more than he understands. Anything is possible with this President, though.
1
Put Trump in the daycare center and let the grownups work things out.
I realize that ad persona doesn't get much done, but locking this overblown persona away somewhere could allow mature, honorable and knowledgeable people to try to keep the world intact.
2
NAFTA allows professionals from Canada to work in the USA (and vice-versa). Did you know there are 350,000 Canadians working in Silicon Valley ? If the NAFTA is jettisioned those 350,000 hi-tech workers will have to return to Canada. There will be a sudden and critical shortage of hi-tech workers in the USA. Silicon Valley may crash and burn.
1
NAFTA has been an absolute disaster for middle class America.
Manufacturers fled south across the border for lower wages and less environmental regulation. With no manufacturing jobs, many high school grads were left with a life flipping burgers. And then came the flow of meth and opiates across the border under the guise of legitimate trucking deliveries. Enough is enough.
6
I am amazed it took Trump this long to do that which would crash the economy.
1
When Trump says that NAFTA must go,
He thinks that the old status quo
Of tariffs was fine
To keep those in line
Who wanted to help Mexico.
2
To blame NAFTA for the disappearance of manufacturing in the U.S. is inaccurate. Most lost manufacturing jobs in the U.S. are the result of cheap manufacturing from Asia - primarily China. Economists who have studied NAFTA know that this free trade agreement has benefited the U.S. in many and diverse ways as it has also benefited both Mexico and Canada; and that is the objective of a free trade agreement - to benefit all countries involved. To scrap this agreement because of the ignorance of Trump and his administration would be great folly and would do great harm to the economies of all three countries.
5
NAFTA has decimated the US automotive supply chain. Many tier 1-4 suppliers who prior to NAFTA operated their factories in smaller towns in the US dismantled their US operations and moved to Mexico. Over the years, the automobiles, unlike electronics, have not become cheaper. So NAFTA has not benefited the consumers. Ever since NAFTA, millions of US workers lost their livelihoods. The CEOs of Chrysler and GM, and Tier 1 suppliers Delphi & Visteon, despite their out-sized compensations, led their companies to bankruptcy. Many investors lost their investments in automotive companies.
Democrats have ignored the plight of working class, and rightfully lost their support in 2016 elections. The Chamber of Commerce is openly hostile to workers' interests. For the sake of hardworking American workers, it is time to renegotiate NAFTA.
8
Do you really think those jobs ate coming back? Will you pay $2000 more for a car?
With a judicious combination of automation, and efficient US based supply chain, and fair wages (not the outrageous reported $60/hr of total compensation by UAW workers), the costs can be contained. Will I pay $2000 more? No, but will certainly pay $500 more knowing that the money will circulate within the several strata of our society which will keep many families well above the poverty level, and that the next generation may not have to live in their parents basements.
2
NAFTA is the worst trade agreement in history. The Iran agreement was a terrible deal for the United States. He knows more about Iraq and Afghanistan than all the generals. He is going to repeal Obamacare on day one and replace it with something that is beautiful. His inauguration crowd was the largest ever. The tax reform will give everybody a tax break and the economy will expand at more than 4%. He has a bigger IQ then anyone in Washington. Some of the NAZI protesters in Charlottesville were very fine people. He can't get a fair hearing because the judge has Mexican ancestors. You are going to win so often you are going to get tired of winning. I'm going to build a beautiful wall and Mexico is going to pay for it. He should be in Albuquerque this week . Maybe he could help. Maybe he could finally accomplish something.They're having the hot air balloon festival.
21
ONE (two three four) singular sensation.....
Every American job and industry sector helped by curtailing free trade is helped only at the expense of other Americans. You can't help any part of the economy without doing even more harm to other parts of it.
American consumers pay more when tariffs are imposed, or when production is based on location instead of price. Every dollar that goes to "save" one job is a dollar that's not available to create or pay for a different job.
Nothing is free and nothing is available in unlimited quantities ... except human desires. But desires do not create reality. Wishing problems away doesn't make them go away. At most they can hide them so they come out in a different area, usually not as easily seen, but just as real. Whether the question is minimum wages or Canadian lumber tariffs, the result is the same. The net result is always negative. The overall American economy is always, *always* smaller than it would have been otherwise.
4
I would have agreed with some of the positions the Trump people are taking if we were living in 1994, but we are not. They have no idea of what will happen if we simply depart NAFTA.
11
Like it or not, international trade is going to happen. NAFTA and the TPP, however imperfect, are efforts to control its terms--to protect the environment and labor rights. Does anyone actually trust Trump to negotiate trade agreements that will protect labor and the environment?
25
TPP is already history. No such thing anymore. Nafta is soon to follow- Praise the lord!!!!
2
Even the NYT (in an accompanying article) continues to cite bilateral trade balances as if they have some relevance.
It is not just that the measure may be sometimes misleading. It has no meaning at all as an indicator of economic health. It also has no meaning as an indicator as to "who is winning" at trade, which itself is a WEIRD way to think about trade.
An oversimplified but valid analogy:
If I buy something at Wal-Mart, did I win or did the store win? Probably we both won. Otherwise, either I would not have been willing to buy at the price charged or they would not have been willing to sell. It is not meaningful to say who "won".
Certainly I did not lose just because Wal-Mart did not buy anything from me.
Adding more complicated realities to the example just makes bilateral trade balance an even sillier measure. Foreign investment in the U.S. makes even a global (not bilateral) trade balance more a useful datum for econometric models than an indicator of economic health. The role of the dollar as a reserve currency also confuses things.
It would be BAD if everyone started buying more goods from the U.S. because they either no longer think the dollar is stable or no longer thought of the U.S. as a good place to invest.
Also foreign goods do directly help U.S. businesses. Some foreign goods are used to produce more goods and services. Other foreign goods allow a given paycheck to buy more--thus increasing real wages.
6
In a global economy of unlimited free trade, jobs migrate to those willing to work for the least amount of money.
That lifts workers in third world country out of poverty, and but reduces the wages of those in first world countries over the long run to the global average. On the positive side, it increases corporate earnings, further enriching the owners of capital
Economist have advertised that forever as a good thing, but overlooked that third world citizens can not vote in first world countries' election
1
Below are several quotes from CNN article by Sen. Elizabeth Warren: “Canada's wake-up call to the US on NAFTA” -- Oct 1, 2017
“Even Canada can see that "right to work" laws in the US undercut US workers.
Canadian negotiators are urging the US to roll back state "right to work" laws that undercut worker power. I'm glad we're renegotiating NAFTA because it has been a raw deal for our workers. But the Canadians are giving America a wake-up call.
NAFTA renegotiations need to add a repeal to the provision that allows states to enact them at the expense of workers' wages, health care and pensions,” she writes
As we renegotiate NAFTA, we shouldn't allow corporations to exploit workers in Canada and Mexico, either. And above all, not let them exploit our own workers here at home.”
Trump has signed several laws that directly undermine the wages, benefits, health and safety of American workers.
For decades, armies of corporate lawyers and lobbyists pressed our federal and state governments to maximize profits at the expense of the health, safety, and financial security of their workers.
Now, instead of looking to America for the example of workers who enjoy the best pay, benefits, and working conditions in the world, our trading partners are complaining about working conditions in America that are falling below their own standards.”
End of quotes
Warren is blunt. Our media must give all views on free trade's effects to do its duty of informing the public.
8
So NAFTA supersedes the Constitution? Regardless of the outcome, the government has no place telling anyone that they must make political and charitable contributions to anyone. The employee-employer relationship should be whatever the two individual parties agree it to be, written or implied.
NAFTA sells out our nations jobs and factories to foreigners and only makes the rich more wealthy. We need to get industries back within our own borders and make us independent again. Close our borders and build a wall if thats what it takes to stop this mass illegal immigration that Obama started.
6
There is a net negative immigration from Mexico, that is, more people are leaving the US to go to Mexico than coming in. A trade agreement reduces the cost of goods so more wealth stays in the country. Manufacturers moved out of the country because it costs more to manufacture goods in the US. Even then, unemployment is down to 5%, essentially, in our system, that is full employment. With a trade agreement tariffs are reduced so, ah, ah, uh, never mind, live long and prosper, my friend.
actually deportation increased under Obama and illegal immigration decreased. Don't blame Obama for those things. Walls Never worked. Time to use one's brains in dealing with those problems. Getting out of Nafta is the first good thing being done. save the $25 billion designated for the border wall and spend it on the homeless problem, job training, health care and mass transit, fund the EPA fully, and conservation programs.
Illegal immigration was significantly reduced over the Obama years. Saying otherwise doesn't make it so.
1
Let's see what happens in the rural areas that are Trumps strong holds once they figure out that they cannot sell their corn for the price they hoped. How much corn exports to Mexico, those very people we have blamed for all things lacking in our own personal lives? Let's see how rural America feels about even lower wages and the lack of jobs if trump destroys NAFTA. American businesses will go further offshore. These trump backers haven't a clue the damage this horrible person is causing this country here and abroad. Then let's see how his rural base feels when trump decides to hit the nuke buttons of no return. We have certainly turned into a country of imbeciles to have actually elected this horrible excuse of a man and for him to continue to enjoy a base, we may deserve what we get! On the other hand, he may just destroy the GOP, help the DEMs get single payer down the road and the power to reverse all things trump unless the next elections turn into what we see in dictator countries. CHEATING as what I believe was done all along!!!!!!
17
Canadian GM worker will be happy
NY TImes 9/18/2017
— Workers at a General Motors assembly plant in Ontario went on strike late Sunday as union leaders reported an impasse in talks to keep Canadian jobs from moving to Mexico. It is the first strike at a Canadian auto assembly plant in 21 years.
Globalization enriches the global elite. Not workers
13
Trade is even more complicated than healthcare.
Repeal and replace failed because this crew found they couldn't move beyond rhetoric to actually developing sensible policy.
Same will happen here - lots of talk and no action.
2
If you support Nafta you are not from one of thousands of towns closed up ,jobs gone from factories and industry moved out. Where you have murder and drugs now there were jobs and educations.Theres no solution until Nafta is gone.
8
Automation and computer technology have had the greater consequence than off shoring.
But remember all of Ivanka's companies clothes, Trump's ties, etc. are made in Asia, and certainly Trump offshored much of his business.
12
Alan those jobs are not coming back
5
Unless you live in one of the tows in Kentucky, South Carolina, Alabama, Tennessee, and many others where new auto manufacturing plants have been built most of which depend on NAFTA. It's not that simple.
1
The Buffoon has no clue what the impacts will be on the economy. His supporters won't be able to get cheap stuff at Walmart anymore- and there goes the new pick-up.
11
History will name Trump 'The Destroyer'. He thinks ripping down and tearing apart is administrating. He thinks not allowing and stopping advancements in the sciences is smart. Elimination, demolition, and ruination are his own particular abilities. He improves nothing. He Builds nothing. Destroying is his only skill, and America's destruction his legacy.
7
"The collapse of the 1994 trade deal would send shock waves throughout the global economy, inflicting damage far beyond Mexico, Canada and the United States."
So-called "free trade" has stimulated economic growth by lower wages around the world while weakening health, safety and environmental standards around the world.
However, obviously Trump's decision to simply scrap "free trade" with our neighbor WILL harm a lot of people. Perhaps this is the wake-up call that Trump voters need...and we'll all have to suffer with them for their stupid decisions to elect Trump.
3
So many comments from the Wall St/big corporation elites and their supporters many of whom were former liberals , liberals, and green.. "Doomsday if Nafta is gone", they say. No, it's a victory for the working poor and middle class who's liveyhood were signed away with Nafta's ratification. Good for the poor Mexican farmers who saw their livehoods disappear due to American farmers flooding their markets with cheaper goods. So many sellout fools, greedy ones at that in support of Nafta.
14
Let's hear from Bill Clinton on NAFTA. Maybe he could write an OP-Ed defending the agreement his administration negotiated more than two decades ago.
6
Can he do this by himself? Where is Congress on this thing?
4
President Trump seems determined to win it all by bullying - leaders, nations, football players, secretaries of state......
It is not a good idea for him to take down Mexico or Canada.
Would someone please apprise him of this.
3
Odds are Trump knows nothing at all about NAFTA. He's just repeating whatever he thinks will get the red-capped dupes to cheer him at his rallies.
10
My father in law and I discussed Trump and the chaos in US government and foreign policy recently. A man of few wasted words, he said, "Barry, empires rise and then they fall."
12
Trump's the punching bag and mainstream media is the boxer.
1
and the nightmare continues until his denouement.
6
I don't know, while I am no economist ....if both Bernie Sanders and Trump think NAFTA is a bad thing......then clearly it is not the best trade agreement for the United States.
9
This guy has no idea what he's doing. Cancel TPP, drop out of the climate accord, do your best to offend NATO allies, step away from NAFTA. In four years time we should be completely and perfectly isolated from the rest of the world with nary an ally in sight.
7
More shock waves . . . .how boring. How many times are we going to hear it predicted the sky's going to fall before we stop looking up any more?
1
Another classic from Trump, who couldn't tell you the first thing about the substance of NAFTA if his life depended on it. While NAFTA wasn't attributable to Obama, the fact that it's attributable to Bill Clinton is nearly as bad from Trump's perspective. If Trump ditches NAFTA, it'll be interesting to see how his "administration" spins the terrible economic consequences to all those Red State farmers and manufacturers who will suddenly find no market for their products. I just hope they all voted for Trump so they can reap the consequences of what they have sowed.
5
I am sure our President has analyzed this from all sides with fairness and compassion towards the welfare of all Americans regardless of social status, race or voting preference.
Wait, I thought we were talking about Obama. Never mind.
3
So as Trump destroys the country and most of the world we'll just keep commenting and feel good about the job we're doing.
1
With Trump the only thing you can count on is that things will continue to get worse. Hoping for rational behavior from him is a waste of time.
3
Any chance Americans can get a Mulligan with the presidential election? Democrats should have never nominated Hillary. At the very least party elders shouldn't have rigged it against Sanders. We are living in interesting times.
5
The Trump administration lacks the credibility to end NAFTA and get away with it.
You'd like to think that a couple of thousand panicked business people descending on their Congressmen and Senators would counteract this one man's horrendous decision. But that only happens in democracies.
3
Not so fast. While I doubt Trump is negotiating on behalf of anything but his own self-interest, here are some problems with NAFTA that should be addressed first. (1) Mexico must enforce labor and environmental standards so American makers and suppliers will stop outsourcing to Mexico; (2) Negotiate NAFTA sector by sector to avoid pitting one industry against another within the USA; (3) Disclose trade proposals before and after each round of negotiation, making the process more transparent.
Editors please get Sen. Sherrod Brown of Ohio on the phone and get us the whole picture on my NAFTA doesn't merit automatic renewal with no ifs, ands or buts.
10
States don't want us to withdraw from the agreement. Sure, every business sector wants a tweak or two, but our states pretty universally favor keeping Nafta in place.
http://www.governing.com/topics/finance/sl-nafta-states-trump-trade.html
This is just another example of Trump doing a little performance art for his base. Throw in a little "Nafta is a disaster" and "drain the swamp" and they're all cheering again.
This is all getting a little too predictable.
4
If American builders and manufacturers don't need Canadian softwoods, natural resources, etc I'm sure there are markets to the East. Maybe the President knows how to make American manufacturing jobs out of thin air.
4
Better be prepared to spend a lot more for all sorts of items if this goes through. The president's style of tough, brinksmanship negotiations might work in the high end real estate market, but it's gonna be murder on agriculture and manufacturing.
2
What a mistake! For once he should ask for the "real facts." I get more fearful for our democracy each tweet that is produced on his phone. We need divine intervention and we need it now!
3
To say that Trump is unpopular in Canada is a tremendous understatement. Anything associated with him is taboo. For us, Trump is no longer the POTUS, but the MOTUS (the first initial "M" stands for the term that Secretary Tillerson used to describe Trump).
12
NAFTA has also been attacked by progressive Democrats like Bernie Sanders as causing the loss of high-paying manufacturing jobs to low-wage Mexico. The issue concerns workers and yet labor once again does not seem to have a voice here. With an anti-union Republican President and party it seems as if there's only a very crude deal (of 50 percent of autos and parts being made in the U.S,) on the table. Instead, I'd like a more pro--worker, pro-union agenda that requires uniformity in rules about workers right to organize, bargain collectively, and their benefits. But, that is not on the table.
13
Here are a couple of articles profiling Canada's negotiating platform re progressive efforts to protect workers and unions. So, I think it is on the table?
https://beta.theglobeandmail.com/news/world/canada-demands-us-end-right-...
and
http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/nafta-labour-dias-union-1.4307099
The occupant of the Oval Office has negated, deconstructed, threatened, and imperiled so much - large and small - and on a near-daily basis, and all, apparently, for the non-stop media attention it gets him. None of this is leading anywhere but to banner headlines. On and on and on. What will he do when he runs out of big, can't-miss targets for his wrecking ball? I try not to think about that at 2 am.
What of real, enduring value is he improving or raising, or building? Certainly not the quality of our national discourse or physical infrastructure, nor America's productive participation, beneficial contributions, or good reputation in global matters -- much less our "greatness," in any commonly understood sense of what that could, or should, be.
10
As far as certain aspects of the deal, I would like to see it go as well.
The wars that are going to be fought in the near future are going to be over water. They are already happening right now, and the U:S: was being belligerent over said water, soft lumber and other trade aspects.
Right now under NAFTA, if Canada exports a certain amount of water to the U.S:, then the U.S: gets first dibs to that amount in every year following after ( even if there is a severe drought ). With droughts\climate change and bottling water companies increasing\expanding every year, municipalities across the border ( especially in Ontario ) are already feeling the pinch.
At any rate, anything proposed must get through Congress and right now under republican control it is an absolute mess.
We shall see.
5
Monsanto and NAFTA
Whenever a city tries to ban the use of a dangerous chemical, like 2,4,D, because it adversely affects the entire community, Monsanto pulls out these free trade agreements, like NAFTA, and uses them to strike down any democratic movement or legislative initiative to ban their product. They use free trade agreements to usurp, overrule and supplant local law.
No longer are we a "laboratory of states, instead these so-called free trade agreements have preempted almost every possible restriction or regulation a community might want to pass against any multinational slinging toxic products.
Wall Street uses so-called "free trade agreements" to usurp of local regulations and your ability to express yourself democratically on the local level. You can't clean up your state or your city anymore unless NAFTA or the various treaty-style agreements let you.
15
Scrapping NAFTA isn't going to improve job creation, work conditions, pay, or anything else for American workers. Improving or updating NAFTA, eliminating some of the loopholes that manufacturers and corporations used to move jobs out of America would help. It's too bad that the only thing Trump and his incompetent band of brown nosers are capable of doing is destroying agreements and America at the same time.
18
Let’s not forget that NAFTA provides US goods and services with a competitive advantage (through reduced tariffs) in Canada and Mexico. Without the benefits of NAFTA, China (and others) become more competitive in the US’s two biggest export markets (around $600bn annually - and five times US exports to China). Without NAFTA, Canada and Mexico will look to the EU, China and others for improved trade deals, worsening US competitiveness. Those American jobs...?
30
American jobs are gone. And I hope the unemployment rolls in the midwest are double digit as punishment for voting for trump. MAGA really means Make All Goods in ASIA.
I’m confused. The US unemployment rate is an enviable 4.3%. For all practical purposes, that’s full employment. Laverne and Shirley and Happy Days-era manufacturing jobs have certainly gone. They’ve gone from Canada too. At least most of that loss is due to automation. Also Chinese, Bangladeshi, Indian and other countries’ wages are a fraction of US wage rates and the productivity gap has been reduced - only the most egregious tariffs would artificially level that playing field. So, in my view, those manufacturing jobs are gone forever, NAFTA or no NAFTA. In spite of those losses, the US unemployment rate is 4.3%... My conclusion is that the US would be better off investing in retraining (and setting new expectations) for those people in the mid-west who graduated high school and expected to be paid $25/hr forever in low-skill manufacturing jobs. Tariffs just make life more expensive for everyone, ultimately reduce US export competitiveness, and will ultimately result in more losses. NAFTA has undeniably helped the North American economies grow overall. Little comfort for those in industrial Ontario or Michigan. The best policy is to figure out how to offer the affected populations new opportunities through education, direct incentives or other policies. That’s good government. Trying to put the Humpty Dumpty of manufacturing jobs back together again by revoking NAFTA and raising tariffs in the vain hope of recreating bygone era jobs is delusional.
Trump took Michigan and Michigan will get its just desserts if Nafta is abrogated. The automotive industry will tank as will the substantial trade with Ontario. Detroit and Grand Rapids will take a hit and what will happen with the agricultural sector of the state is unthinkable.
Justice manifests itself in suffering.
10
Go Canada Go!
If it is so damaging to so many then we should be able to get a much better deal. After all when you have leverage you should get the best end of the deal. Unlike today where we trade jobs for cheap stuff. Not to mention all the economic activity that goes with having those jobs.
2
George Bush I negotiated NAFTA. In other words, your guy. Take it up with him.
no - Bill Clinton negotiated Nafta- he sold himself out Blame him
1
“There’s an old adage in negotiations, never take a hostage you wouldn’t shoot,” Mr. Murphy said. In this case, Trump shoots the hostage, everybody else, then himself!
8
If only he would start with the latter...
3
This is excellent news. Hopefully NAFTA will be repealed.
12
... I that does happen, then we hope you'll enjoy all the price increases that you'll experience on your next Walmart shopping excursion. Have fun with that increased cost of living, friend.
I guess that means you're ready to pay more for gasoline and oil and food.
An elephant in a glass boutique?
4
You know what would have “updated NAFTA for the 21st century”? The TPP.
Too bad Sanders and Trump tag-teamed to take it down.
14
All of those manufacturing jobs TRUMP is "protecting"? Down the tubes. They had no idea the incompetence and ignorance of this man when they cast their ballot. They wanted change? They are getting it.
23
For years, more Mexicans have been returning to Mexico than the other way around (most of the illegal immigration today comes from Central America), partly due to NAFTA.
The irony of killing NAFTA is that it would achieve one of the things that Trump wants to avoid: bring more Mexicans. He would be turning the clock twenty years, bringing a new generation of illegal immigrants.
Those unemployed, poor, hungry, desperate Mexicans will not be stopped by a wall, moving far away from their families, and competing for jobs in the USA.
NAFTA must be revisited to level the field, ensuring that environmental, legal, and work conditions are more uniform and allow healthy competition.
Killing it out of spite would be a no-win for somebody that wants so much winning.
203
I've heard of US workers trying to sneak across the border so they could keep their job but were caught and deported.
1
Revise, in good faith! Unfortunately, that is not this man's way!
He is leading the way to alienating the U.S. from the rest of the world.
Doesn't realize that he is leading a country, not a single business.
That's totally bogus. NAFTA destroyed much of the agrarian economy in Mexico by dumping crops produced in industrialized American farms onto small farmers. They came fleeing to the U.S. throughout the '90s and '00s as a result. The manufacturing jobs produced in Mexico near the border pay so poorly the workers cannot afford the products they make. Mexican labor and environmental laws are a joke.
The reason the Mexicans have stopped flooding into America is because Obama enforced the border which didn't happen under Bush and Clinton, both of whom favored the ability of business to exploit desperate undocumented immigrants.
1
In his 2005 book The Collapse of Globalism and the Reinvention of the World Canadian historian, philosopher and Press freedom advocate John Ralston Saul anticipates this moment. We are a satellite economy and there will be much economic pain as we leave the USA orbit.
Without a Bretton Woods agreement we were an accident waiting to happen even if our government economists saved us from 2008 until Reagan is complete gone and is as well known as Chester Arthur America might as well build walls and post a No Visitors signs.
America is a pariah state and a danger to the world.
I have been reading about this moment every day in the Toronto Star since November. I am not a liberal nor a conservative but when our American loving Conservative party resurrected its 19th century slogan "No Truck No Trade with the Yankees" I knew we were due to be America's new Cuba for a couple of years.
We will struggle for a while but we are educated, we are healthy and we are very rich and we will find our way into a better tomorrow if America doesn't blow up the planet.
18
The vast majority of Americans want:
1.Clean air
2. Freedom of the press
3. Civil rights including abortion and contraception and Freedom of sexual choice, voting rights for all of any color.
4. Immigration rights for Dream Americans
5. NAFTA
6. The Paris accord
7. Religious freedom for all---not only Christians.
Since we Are the majority these democratic demands of ours should be met by our government and respected by our president. If not it is time that these who don't respect our democracy be voted out of office.
38
Since we Are the majority these democratic demands of ours should be met by our government and respected by our president
"Our president"? Not my president, never will be.
3
CD-R , you left out the most important "want" of the US majority, ie "Freedom from Trump & the GOP" based on the popular vote.
I can't even bear to read this article. Every day I look at the paper there is some agreement, plan, regulation, national relationship, entire government agency (State Department, EPA), or even the entire world order, that took years or decades to develop but Trump is dismantling without a thought of how it developed or what will take its place. I loathe this administration and its thoughtlessness with a visceral passion.
59
Add the ACA and Unesco to the list and that was just in one day.
There's tough and there pug- headed. If real business leaders are for NAFTA - then why does Trump want to can it? Another Bannon effort to bring down the government? Perhaps Canada and Mexico will sign their own treaty - leaving the US to the whims of Trump. Trump has little time for real governance with his spats with Cabinet members and Congress as well as the cat fights among the wives. only time will tell wether we will be great or down the grate.
1
As awful as Trump is (and has always been), in a very sad sense, he is what the country deserves and needs.
How so?
This is basic middle schools civics. For a democracy to function, the citizens have monitor what government is doing in their name and then vote accordingly based on their interests and beliefs.
Americans are failing in this regard. They don't know the issues (admittedly there is an abundance of misinformation deliberated injected into the stream of news to confuse them), they care and they don't vote.
However, even if Washington seems remote, what happens there does matter.
Trump highlghts this nobody else could. But he is the logical consequence of an electorate on auto-pilot. Americans just assume that all of their rights, protections, services, etc. will be there and they don't have to do anything to protect them.
21
Well said. I wholeheartedly agree that there's been a massive collapse in the understanding of basic American civics.
Caveat/confession: I voted Hilary but told my friends, after the election, 'Give Trump a chance. Quit whining.'
Opps... Trade deals are one piece in a mosaic of foreign policy. Just like rational behavior and predictability and patience are pieces in the mosaic of personality. Keeping track of each piece is difficult because each is balanced by the whole. Sometimes a situation calls for more patience, sometimes not.
In foreign affairs one deal can not be measured without considering the entire relationship.
Caveat #2: I don't know enough abut the the NAFTA deal to measure it good or bad. But I do know good neighbors don't begin a conversation by shouting. Is Mexico a good neighbor? I'd hope so. We share 2000 miles of border.
Trump is shouting at Mexico--about who will pay for "the Wall", about trade, about immigration. Shouting is a piece of the mosaic also--the mosaics of both personality and foreign policy,
I think the difference between myself and Mr Trump is he doesn't see the whole--the whole relationship. He enters every room anticipating rabid negotiation--even with friends. (or...maybe he has no friends)
I am not afraid of Mexicans, or Mexico. I grew up in California where too many people to count with Mexican surnames befriended me. I would never shout at them. I would be embarrassed to do that.
Mr Trump never seems embarrassed. Too bad. When he gets something wrong sometime he should admit to it. His distrust of Mexico is a good place to start.
11
Trump has only one policy goal. Create Chaos.
16
NAFTA is not perfect and should be revisited. However, taking a sledgehammer to it is not the answer. If this disrupts the existing integrated supply chains within North America, what will replace them? What's preventing them from being replaced with supply chains from, say, China? Just because you increase cost of imports from Mexico and Canada does not mean the new cost-effective option is domestic. It may simply be from elsewhere.
Also, what is the solution for those American agricultural exports that will now face high tariffs? Has the Trump administration worked out projections on negative impact to the US economy, such as to the auto industry? Or are we proceeding on blind faith that a sledgehammer will Make America Great Again?
I suspect, as it always goes with such knee-jerk decisions, in five years the very people cheering Trump on will cry, "whose terrible idea was it to smash NAFTA?"
10
It’s almost like Trump is an agent for China or Russia. If you get rid of NAFTA many American companies will no longer be competitive while even more will simply lose huge customers in Mexico and Canada. A terrible idea on both counts. If you want to see some factory towns really dry up, get rid of NAFTA. It will be the inverse of what Bannon predicts; the Republican Party will be OUT of power for the next 50 years. It’s nauseating that we are letting this idiotic TV host decide the fate of so many hard working Americans. Ridiculous and insane.
27
Trump is an embarrassment and a disgrace. Come to think of it so are all the congressmen and senators who put up with egregious assault on our institutions and international reputation.
33
Well, Mexico is not paying for the wall, a health plan did not exist, nor did one materialize after Trump threw a beer party on the lawn encouraging republicans to think of something, anything.
The Trump administration has employed private servers, everyone is ether gone or under investigation, everything Trump complained about before the election of every person who ever ran for office the Trump administration is guilty of. Zero for zero, NAFTA is now his new toy in the playpen. Nothing will happen, he'll just fondle it like an ape with a mirror.
11
With so much at stake, the ACA, the Iran treaty, the EPA, the Educational system and a host of other critical national priorities - could someone please explain why Hillary Clinton’s campaign focused on “Donald the unfit misogynist”, transgender potties, Confederate flags and equal pay for equal work?
3
The answer to your question: how about “arrogance” coupled with “stupidity”?
4
If I am Delta, I would just purchase the Bombadiers using overseas cash. Skip the stupid tariff and utilize the overseas cash horde,
Have them delivered to Ireland. Outfitted there and then title them in an overseas financial entity.
3
The destruction of Nafta will severely harm the economies of many red states since their main export market is Mexico. Other countries will fill the vacuum that is created by destructive isolationist policies.
Putin's man baby in the White House could not be destroying America's global standing, economy, environment, and principles more thoroughly.
Trump is a fast acting poison. His deep bigotry against Hispanics is on view from his immigration policy to his treatment of an enormous disaster in the American territory of Puerto Rico to Nafta as well as various beauty queens, a judge,a reporter, and other individuals. One wonders what caused this. Is it just an extension of his usual racism or does he nurse a special animus against Mexico and Latin America? It is the depth of a mental disorder.
11
To belabor and old saw, "Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large numbers". Who knows, though? Maybe this will help Billy Bob get his manufacturing foreman job back. Or maybe not.
4
Trump is ignorant about trade and just panders to his base to disrupt the world because they are not happy 55 and unemployed white and yearning for coal jobs. Trump may go down in flames but sadly will take a lot of us with him.
4
How many of these fools backed trump, thinking he would grow, change, pivot, develop, or what ever?
1
Trump never had wide backing. Polls show that 58% of people who voted for Trump only did it to stop Clinton. That's the hand we got dealt.
https://emcphd.wordpress.com
2
Yeah - how dare we have a competent President that actually knows what she's doing... sigh.
How's that 58% feeling right about now?
Since you asked, BrainThink - just fine. Polls show that they would do it again. For the record, the same polls show that 51% of Clinton voters did it only to stop Trump. Meaning either way, we were doomed to a president with a popularity rating in the 40s.
What a hideous choice we had!
https://emcphd.wordpress.com
1
What does Putin want? What does Bannon want? Who does Trump want to please?
There, now you don't need to wonder where this is heading or why!
3
Good let Nafta collapse. what happens price of chinese junk assembled in Mexico is going to go up so be it!
6
Where do you think that keyboard you're typing on was made?
If you let US companies send jobs to cheaper countries like China or Mexico, Unions and workers get undercut, period. Trade agreements that only benefit the owners and shareholders while selling out the workers should end, plain and simple. Sure goods will become more expensive, but their will be more folks to buy them, because more folks would be employed HERE, not in some cheap labor country.
13
First, some irony. NAFTA made it possible for government-subsidized American corn to flood Mexican markets, undercutting small farmers, many of whom then joined the exodus north to jobs in the United States. In January Mexico was on track to be the #1 importer of US corn but now Mexico is looking for suppliers in Brazil and Ukraine instead. So after provoking illegal immigration the US will damage the industrial supply chains linking the US and Mexico, provoking another wave of migration. Farm-belt states can watch a major prop to their economies disappear.
Second, NAFTA was a trade agreement in name only. In reality it was a cynical arrangement to take advantage of cheap labor and weak regulation for opportunistic American firms seeking access to the American market without paying American costs. It is really a transnational alliance of investors and executives against labor and defenders of the environment. Yet today it is questionable whether Trump can convince the business class to give up the advantages it has gained over two decades; more likely there will be a further push toward automation. Democrats should insist any legislation addressing NAFTA include anti-automation legislation to keep jobs from disappearing. In reality Trump expects that he can win concessions in one-on-one negotiations he cannot gain in multilateral agreements. Tearing up NAFTA guarantees election of a left-wing government in Mexico next year and a Canadian treaty with China; isolating USA.
8
Agree except with anti automation comment. Firms need automation to be competitive and there are some tasks better performed by machine for reasons of ergonomics and health.
great post!!! Please read my posts below. It's seems those sellout Democrats and psuedo-progressives won't listen. Their greed and stock dividends are glogging their ears. It's amazing what 25 years and wads of cash, via stock portfolio will do to supposed liberals and progressives, not forgetting of course Bill and Hillary Clinton.
1
Scrapping NAFTA will be a boon for the EU and China. It will weaken our economy and shift geopolitical power and influence to Asia.
Average Americans will pay more out-of-pocket for goods, causing their spendable income to drop substantially. The income divide will increase dramatically.
12
You know who was also against NAFTA?
https://www.democracynow.org/2009/8/11/obama_reverses_campaign_pledge_to...
Yes Obama was! Then changed mind.
Trump against NAFTA, keeps promises. Is it any wonder why Trump won Michigan, Ohio, Texas, and Florida? Really?
Democrats, if you want to win, you should start by listening to your voters and keeping your promises. That's a good place to start for any leader, yes?
10
I bet there was a logical, economic reason why Obama changed his mind. We’ll find out why, I guess, once Trump “keeps” his promise. You and the rest of America may not want to experience that reason.
3
who cares - this country is now toast - now all those lost auto jobs will teach the rust belt a lesson.
1
" Is it any wonder why Trump won Michigan, Ohio, Texas, and Florida? Really? "
Yes, it's a complete wonder, it's an enigma to the majority of the USA.
Maybe because the majority of the USA did not vote for Trump.
Donald Trump: Making America Great Again one Disaster at a Time.
37
When will citizens of the United States begin to demand the impeachment of the incompetent, mentally unbalanced man-child holding the office of the President of the United States? Every day he opens his mouth and proves he does not belong in the position to which he was elected (elected by a total of 77,000 votes). The man needs to be removed before his destruction of the United States is completed. Call the person representing you in the House of Representatives demanding impeachment. Call the people representing you in the Senate and demand voting for removal.
27
Agreed, though Sec 4 of the 25th amendment could be a lot quicker...
1
Bit by bit, this President and his henchmen/women are destroying this country, collapsing it from within. Whose commands is he obeying? Think it's the guy from Russia who bought the Facebook and Twitter ads, who wanted him to become President?
10
Will someone from the auto industry please try to knock some sense into Mr. Trump before he destroys the global economy.
21
"The collapse of the 1994 trade deal would send shock waves throughout the global economy..."
It strikes me that that is exactly what Trump wants. He couldn't care less about the details. He just wants to enjoy, in his own self-congratulatory manner, the shock waves he creates. "I created shock waves and everyone's talking about me. Aren't I great?"
Let's hope his lust for shock waves doesn't get the better of him in his infantile war of words with that other nuclear-powered lunatic...
12
Trump the wrecking ball is out of control.
If the GOP can't contain him, vote it out.
5
Hey, Trump is the Chamber of Commerce’s boy. And farmers voted for him 2-1. What goes around comes around. I feel not one iota of compassion for anyone who is going to be hurt by this if they voted for him. It’s time for ramifications .
9
I hope we pull out of NAFTA and all those farmers who voted for Trump reap what they sowed.
5
If they were the only ones to suffer its ill effects, perhaps... but in reality, as the article explains, the "shock waves" would be felt far and wide. No mechanism exists, I imagine, to focus them on the deplorables...
5
So Mexico won't import diabetes, obesity or death into their country?
Sounds like Mexico wins from pulling out of NAFTA to me.
2
The world is changing and so you can adjust and ride along or get left in the dust. You cannot stop it. Wanting the old days back will get you --- dust! My focus is to ride along and avoid the damage that the stupids (can't be fixed) cause.
2
Good time to start planning for the Trump's recession that will follow this ego trip of his
O
1
Trump wants pretty much to destroy everything that came before him so he can name everything from now on after himself. We all know now what he is and it's pretty disgusting, but what's most disgusting is that short of senators Corker and Rand and Collins and a couple of others the rest of the Republicans are even slimier than Trump himself because they know what he is and they are still willing to eat his offal to protect themselves while in their naivety they think their safe.
11
They say a phoenix rises from the ashes, but I have to wonder what will be left once Trump and his wrecking crew are are done.
4
Does Trump even know what NAFTA is?
I've yet to hear what he thinks is so awful about it.
Typical.
7
Trump wasn't elected solely by his base of self-entitled, self-pitying and self-destructive white supremacists. Fortunately there aren't enough of them outside regional zones of native fascism. Trump was elected by a cynical, calculating fifth column of myopic opportunists eager for tax cuts and diminished federal regulatory restraint against grievous public harm and injury, whether financial, economic, health or quality of life measured by fairness, freedom and equality.
Losing NAFTA is just desserts for the commercial interests who enabled Trump in eager anticipation of windfall profits from a restoration of greed-gorging glory days.
They should feel all the pain with no gain.
22
To let it come to this. The perception of many Mexicans is that Trump is out for revenge against Mexico (and Canada as well, guilty of having a more charming and popular leader). This is a nation that has learned to trust, like and welcome gringos over the last 30 years.
So what can we do here? We have a saying that says "No hay mal que dure 100 años". It means that Mexico can wait for Trump to end his presidency and rot in his tower to return to the negotiation table. This can take from 3 to 7 years. Fortunately, nations are stronger than their leaders (as Mexico has, unfortunately, shown in the last 80 years) and the Trump maladie fortunately has a known expiration date.
23
When will the poor shlubs who keep hoping Trump will make great deals get it through their heads that Trump never makes ANY deals? His primary interest is in wrecking things simply because he didn't make the deal in the first place and then he fantasizes that countries will come back, begging him to fix things. They won't.
12
Trump’s team is negotiating in bad faith. It’s pretty evident that the objective was to kill NAFTA and use the Canadians’ and Mexicans’ reluctance to agree to non-starter demands as the reason that talks fell apart.
NAFTA’s revocation will be a big step backward for North America and cost as many American jobs as Trump tells everyone it will create.
Too bad. It will also likely kick off a global retreat from open trade, if not trade wars. That’ll hurt America (and everyone else) too. Another Brexit-style self-inflicted wound. Daft.
310
everything Trump does is without faith...with a sociopath's disregard for victims.
3
You are spot on. Trump wants to be seen as "the tough guy." We'll all suffer as businesses adapt. However, the US will suffer the most because Canada and Mexico will have realized that the US is not a reliable trading partner and we will seek trading relationships with reliable partners, who understand the mutual advantage of trade.
yes but what are the russian sponsored troll farms that support killing nafta and abetting trump saying about all this? what has putin, our actual head of state, got to say about this topic?
I despise Trump. But I've got to say, as I was reading my way through this article I was slowly forming an idea which I hadn't quite articulated when -- bingo! -- it was suddenly said for me at the article's very end, sort of like a punch line:
" 'Any trade proposal that makes multinational corporations nervous is a good sign that it’s moving in the right direction for workers,' said Senator Sherrod Brown, Democrat of Ohio." So why, exactly, does the NYT bury this comment -- from a working class rather than a capitalist's perspective -- at the very end of this piece? Could the answer be that here in miniature is precisely where liberals lost the 2016 election: their refusal to feel the pain of all the workers whose jobs NAFTA sent abroad? The photos that accompany this article kind of say it all politically: those are Mexicans doing these jobs, not Americans. I'm a lawyer. NAFTA didn't send my job to Mexico (not yet). But if I worked one of those jobs shown in the photos, this article would infuriate me.
17
The article also suggested that in the end auto manufacturers might be tempted to make whole cars out of the country. This isn't a "win." Anyone remember when textiles were made in the country? It's been a while. No amount of griping by garment workers saved the industry.
A "woke" Democrat! Hurray!
2
The NYT led the article with a photo of Mexican workers in a Bosch factory. Also, earlier in the article, it's stated that unions and some Democrats gave some support to the idea of the pact's demise. I'd hardly call that burying it.
If you think back to the campaign, Trump liked to talk about the Carrier workers whose jobs went to Mexico. The Times did quite a lot of coverage of the Carrier situation even before Trump glommed onto it. Worker pay and wages is a spreadsheet line item for every business in America, and if they can get a better deal on labor, they're outta here.
As a Democrat, I've always been upset about that aspect of Nafta. Free trade is great, but only if workers' livelihoods are protected. Both Republicans and Democrats dropped the ball on that, big time. Bernie Sanders, if you noticed, brought this issue up constantly in the campaign.
Where Clinton failed was in not adopting enough of Sanders' attitude on workers' livelihoods. Her head was stuck back in the days when a "rising tide would raise all boats" once we engaged in free trade agreements. Bernie noticed that only the yachts got lifted, and wasn't shy about saying so.
The problem is that, after so many years, scrapping the whole deal would be a major economic upheaval. Most states just want to see "tweaking" that benefits their industries. They don't want the entire agreement scrapped. I'd like to see a really big "tweak" that protects wages and American jobs.
1
Trump postures about killing an international trade deal that would have financial repercussions across the globe, because he really really likes to negotiate and needs people to know that. He would know as much about this actual agreement and its broad implications as he does 'Two Corinthians'. An inmate has not taken over the asylum as much as a clown running the circus. The carnivores have escaped into the streets, the clown keeps performing. There was a reason why Nero introduced weekly spectacles at the Forum. In the meantime Rome was going broke with the barbarians approaching the gates.
7
So if the DJIA drops 30% and the US goes into a deep recession as a result of a NAFTA collapse, then Mr. Trump totally owns that economic mess.
Trump would then have no one to blame but himself.
3
and then?
Is Trump ready to own the stock market crash after he dumps NAFTA? That would be his real effect on the market and not all of his bragging about what a great market it is since he took office. Looks like he doesn't really care about the dairy farmers of Wisconsin if he's ready to lat tariffs sink their import market. As a deal maker, all Trump has is BAD deals!
5
Let's be honest, scrapping NAFTA will hurt some and help others.
This isn't about Trump. Hammering trade deals was popular before Trump, especially on the Left. The Left started it, then the Left and Right targeted TPP together, all long before Trump. Working class Americans, especially in the Rust Belt, just don't trust newspapers, globalists, Wall Street, and the two parties when they predict "doom" over canceling free trade deals.
These Americans have already experienced doom, frankly, over the last 20 years. Now, it seems, they only have Steve Bannon and occasionally Sherrod Brown on the national level, because most so-called liberal newspapers are shills for the Free Trade regime. But, liberals and economic nationalists have been attacking the free trade regime for years, so long as median wages have been stagnant or falling.
6
For all those who trust Trump on NAFTA, read this:
https://www.thebalance.com/advantages-of-nafta-3306271
NAFTA has had HUGE economic benefits for the US. Canada and Mexico are the U.S.'s top two export markets. Any more questions?
3
douglas lowenthatl.....there was a piece in the toronto star a few days ago that the usa has a $34,000,000,000 trade surplus with canada on manufactured goods. trump--and many americans believe this to be true--the usa should have trade surpluses with each and every one of the other 200 or so other countries on the planet.
if not, it's because poor, helpless america as the only free trader--evidence to the contrary notwithstanding--is being taken advantage of by those nasty brutes.
3
Every deal, every treaty, every act of law, can stand improvement. It took 5 plus years to negotiate NAFTA. It takes Trump less than a minute to tweet out he is going to kill it for all the world to see.
That is the problem with DJT. There is no inclination to have a discussion about how to improve a law or a treaty without throwing it away. Like tossing out the baby with the bath water. The same approach he uses with the Iran nuclear treaty and the Affordable Care Act. "No good! Throw them out." No thought of negotiating to improve them.
As a Canadian I believe the Oregon Treaty of 1846 was unfair to Canada. It gave away most of the states of Washington and Oregon which I consider to be (still) part of Canada. Lets throw out that treaty. No more discussion. Just dump it and reestablish the border along the Columbia river... the way it used to be before this "totally unfair, worst treaty ever signed" was ratified.
10
Trump has a tendency to defensiveness on a personal level and as President, he is pulling in our borders--the first treaty he scuttled was the Trans Pacific Partnership. He fired all the ambassadors as of January 20, many of whom have not been replaced. His America First slogan betrays a discomfort with foreign anything.
It's like he is projecting his own fearful defensiveness onto the body politic.
i saw some video of trump and trudeau sitting together. after reading this piece, i'm wondering if the canadian PM wasn't trudeau but a mannequin. didn't seem to actually say anything.
2
I don't think that eliminating Bill Clinton's Baby is going to cause the world economy to grind to a halt. It will, however, put the world on notice that our workers and their jobs are non-negotiable.
7
bold statement - to a halt? how about a deep recession.
But the world is moving on from you...haven't you realized that yet?
Yeah, who wouldn't be pleased if the global economy collapsed? That's what Trump was elected to do, destabilize the world economy, right?
Nice going Donald.
4
If you haven't noticed, Trump's agenda is to sell this country out to China. This is just another step in the process.
4
Nearly the only bright spot in this presidency at the moment is that the stock market is up since the election. Now is a good time to point out that correlation does not equal causation, but that won't stop Trump from taking credit for the gains.
I think he will not be killing NAFTA, knowing that if and when the stock market tanks he will have very little to brag about. If he does try to kill NAFTA he is even more incompetent than I thought. Which is saying something.
3
Only Trudeau is smiling! A huge oppty for Canada to join the EU, oh, and they will.
5
When the tectonic plates move it to over to Europe?
2
Once again, I hope Trump follows through. The more he destroys the country the more he'll destroy the Republican platform. There will always be people gullible enough to vote for him, but the majority will wise up when it hurts their paycheck or 401k.
4
Unfortunately Republican voters will blame Obama.
1
Bring jobs back ! Can't you just hear the applause.
Well, good luck with those $4:00/hour maquiladora jobs that Trump wants to bring back here as a personal thank you to his supporters for their vote.
btw: He said jobs, he didn't say what kind of jobs or how much they would pay.
True, NAFTA has its problems, and the worst negatively affect the lives of workers here and in Mexico. So fix them so they can thrive, have autonomy and bargaining power and not just barely survive, because there are also benefits to NAFTA that I am sure people will not want to see disappear along with possibly millions of jobs and money too. c.f. Brexit
Once again this is all about Trump, he just wants to hear his base roar.
Hey! base, $4:00 an hour, really!
5
Everything Trump is doing (or undoing) now has been on his hit-list for some time. Everything. He has been very clear about what he wants. It does not matter to him at all if it leads to wide-spread collateral damage. It does not matter if those around him counsel him to to be cautious. He is determined to do everything he has previously expressed a desire to do, no matter the consequences.
So...unless something is done very soon on a bipartisan basis, there will be thermonuclear war on the Korean peninsula...and beyond.
4
Then NAFTA wouldn't matter.
I don't know how Canada and Mexico are the bad boys in Nafta. I for one think that we got shafted under Mulroney (the then Prime Minister). As for America, Trump wants to shovel American products into Canada, and that will not happen if Canada and Mexico are thrown out of the agreement. What will happen, as if it hasn't already, is that everyone will simply buy Chinese products directly, and avoid the middle man (America).
10
Finally, when Nafta is finished, Yellen will be happy when the inflation rate soars.
So much for Trump's tax plan to 'help' the middle class.
2
If Trump does pull us out of NAFTA, American's who supported either Sanders or Trump will be thrilled. It won't get them their promised jobs. It won't bring back promised jobs. It won't raise their wages. What it will do is create higher costs for many products we import from Canada and Mexico. It will raise unemployment levels, as there are many jobs in this country dependent on trade (import and export) between the three trading partners of NAFTA.
Economic isolationism in the 21st century is irrational. Is Trump really that irrational?
8
Need you ask?
Ross Perot warned about NAFTA before it was adopted.
The Establishment, both Democrats and Republicans, adopted it anyway.
As predicted by Perot, disaster followed.
Trump is trying to correct the mistake.
The Establishment hates him for it.
12
He has no idea what NAFTA is, contains, or does. Prediction: Mr "I alone can fix this" will, true to form, punt and leave it to Congress to decide. But not without a lot of "we'll see" and "calm before the storm" guessing games first.
5
This past September, Canada signed the Canada-European Union Comprehensive Economic and Trade Agreement (CETA), is moving forward with negotiations for the Trans-Pacific Partnership (TPP11, now that the Americans have withdrawn, and in which Canada will be the second largest economy), and is in early stages of negotiating a free-trade agreement with China. The United States is in decline, appears to be on the cusp of significant social upheaval, is proving to be an unreliable ally (see the Iran nuclear agreement), and behaves erratically and unpredictably in international affairs. We are establishing other markets for our raw materials - particularly energy, and for our manufactured goods. An increasing number of Canadians look at recent events in the US and conclude that the fewer ties we have to the Americans the better off we will be.
18
The problem isn't NAFTA; it is China. The only country that will benefit from scrapping NAFTA will be China, as Canada and Mexico align themselves more with China. And that will not work out in Canada and Mexico's favor.
3
The NAFTA deal was handed us by the elites and globalists who never cared one bit about the American worker. American workers are the only reason this country survived all the wars and became the best place on the planet to live.
NAFTA was just another progressive idea that never worked out in the real world. Get ready to see some factories OPENING instead of closing in America. Thank you, President Trump.
8
How exactly is that going to happen? Is every American going to stop buying at Walmart? Please link some evidence or fact to demonstrate that leaving NAFTA will bring manufacturing jobs back to the US. And link evidence to show that Americans are prepared to pay for the increased cost of those oh-so-cheap Walmart goods...